[Artists-making-art] Artists-making-art Digest, Vol 16, Issue 5

Lynda Lambert llambert at zoominternet.net
Sat Feb 8 21:30:27 UTC 2014


Yes, Laurie, you are most definitely in the arts category from everything I 
know about what you do and in so many areas of your own creative life.  I 
agree that there is a lot of very good energy here, too! I feel the same, 
and I have not been here very often at all.  I just happened to have a 
question and thought I would ask it and I really got the help I needed.
Nice to see you here. Lynda
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Laurie Porter" <free.spirit1 at live.com>
To: <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2014 3:03 PM
Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] Artists-making-art Digest, Vol 16, Issue 5


> Linda:
>
> thanks so much for this definition of the difference between art and 
> craft. I think I am now truly where I belong, and given this explanation, 
> I know now why I have never been satisfied with just finishing a crafting 
> project. I've always found it to be decidedly limiting in imagination, 
> creativity and origionality. .
>
> I have been so impressed with the messages I've read on this  list so far. 
> It sounds like there is some wonderful energy on this listand am looking 
> forward  read ing more.
>
>
> -----Original Message----- 
> From: artists-making-art-request at nfbnet.org
> Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2014 6:00 AM
> To: artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
> Subject: Artists-making-art Digest, Vol 16, Issue 5
>
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> Today's Topics:
>
>   1. Re: arts or crafts new member (Lynda Lambert)
>   2. Re: arts or crafts new member (Ann at acunningham.com)
>   3. Re: arts or crafts new member (Jewel)
>   4. Re: arts or crafts new member (Lynda Lambert)
>   5. Re: arts or crafts new member (Lynda Lambert)
>   6. Re: arts or crafts new member (Patricia C. Estes)
>   7. Re: arts or crafts new member (Lynda Lambert)
>   8. Re: arts or crafts new member (Patricia C. Estes)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2014 08:03:18 -0500
> From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
> Message-ID: <6FA5C73038C44B4D9FE3E40F647EF6C7 at Lambert>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Hi Laurie,
> So nice to see you here.  I did not start this group though, I am like 
> you, I just came on to ask a question about something I needed to know and 
> was so glad to meet Ann who helped me with my question.  I am furiously 
> working right now (oops, split that infinitive!) getting work done for the 
> opening of a two-person exhibition at a museum - the show is called 
> _Vision and Revision:  Two artists with limited sight, not limited vision_ 
> It is my pottery and mixed-media fiber works, and a legally blind painter. 
> It opens one month from today, and if I stop to think about what else has 
> to be done yet, I'll get nervous. So, I won't do that, but just will keep 
> on working on the details. The show will appear at two locations this year 
> and will have a video that plays in the gallery with the art works, 
> Braille labeling, and artist's talks. I will even be teaching in the 
> gallery one afternoon, for the Women in the Arts course at Geneva College. 
> That is where I taught when I was a professor of fine arts and humanities, 
> before I retired. I'll be lecturing on the historical context of my work 
> and where the ideas have come from when creating it.
>
> To make matters even more difficult, I am scheduled to speak at a 
> conference at Slippery Rock University of PA for two sessions, the day 
> before we hang our show. So, I have those presentations to be working on 
> every day now, too.  I officially retired from teaching 5 1/2 years ago, 
> but I am still very much involved in everything but being in the 
> classroom.
>
> Here is my response to the question you have asked. The gap between an 
> artist and a crafter is like crossing the ocean, it is that wide. Some 
> basic things may be similar between the two, but most things are very far 
> apart philisophically.
>
> Both work with the hands, and both love working with the hands and most 
> have done it all their life.
> Both love the materials, and the handling of them, and the satisfaction of 
> the finished product that comes out of it.
>
> While the crafter will usually be satisfied with beginning something and 
> knowing where the end will be, the artist begins with no notion of where 
> the end will be or even if it will be.  the crafter has a clearly defined 
> path to the finished product. The artist has only some inklings of 
> possible outcomes, but has to find them as she works.
>
> The other very big thing I see as a difference between them is that the 
> crafter has 'rules" to follow and seldom will ever deviate from those 
> rules, as they are set in stone in her mind. On the other hand, the mature 
> artist has learned that there are no rules at all.  They may begin in the 
> early stages by learning techniques, but eventually with the years of 
> working, the light comes on in her brain when she discovers one day - she 
> is free of all rules when making art. Everything can be challenged, 
> everything can be changed, and everything is fair game, for the artist. Is 
> there any other profession in this world where there are no rules? It's 
> the most exhilerating feeling to know that there are absolutely no rules 
> whatsoever for me. Wow, makes me take a deep breath just to say it. Free, 
> free, free, at last!
>
> Laurie, the biggest difference between art and a craft is where the person 
> eventually takes the techniques, I think.
>
> A crafter seldom takes things to a different level but is usually content 
> to learn something then duplicate it endlessly, then moves on to learn 
> something else and does that again with it. The artist can take crafts 
> materials (which is what you and I both do) and techniques, and then take 
> them far beyond because they will combine their techniques and materials 
> with the imagination.  If you can teach it, it is usually a craft. If you 
> cannot teach it, it is normally art.  Art can begin by learning some 
> techniques, or using craft materials, but then the person begins to ask 
> the "what if" questions, and takes lots of risks, failures, and bends in 
> the road on the way to it becoming a work of art. It is a "mind set" that 
> is never satisfied with just the learning of something new, but one that 
> constantly questions, experiments, and never knows where the "end" will 
> be, or even if it will be.  A "crafter" will never understand what I have 
> just said and will most likely be huffing and puffing and angry with it. 
> An "artist" is standing and applauding what I have said. It is that 
> simple, and that complex.  The artist thrives on change and making new 
> discoveries and each work leads to other querstions and more change and 
> more new discoveries.
>
> One can see the difference when you look at work in types of environments. 
> One will be setting at a craft show with a table full of things that are 
> basically all the same while the other will have work  on display in a 
> gallery or museum.  Each has decided where they "fit" and each is very 
> happy with where they are. They are different animals, with different 
> ideas, and different end results and outcomes. Each one has decided their 
> own path and each one is comfortable with the decision she has made.
>
> Lynda
>
> Lynda
>
>
>  ----- Original Message ----- 
>  From: Laurie Porter
>  To: Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>  Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2014 7:26 PM
>  Subject: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>
>
>  Hi Folks:
>
>  I?d like to introduce myself. I?m a blind person from wisconsin who is a 
> fledgling and budding beginner artist. my medium is beadwork. I make 
> pictures and tapestries out of tiny little seed beads  sewn together with 
> thread. but most of my work is in making jewlry, but I have always looked 
> upon my beadwork as an art form.
>
>  so, I have a basic question. What is the difference between an art and a 
> craft? I do believe that all crafts are forms of art  but are all arts 
> considered crafts? Thanks linda and all of you for getting this list going 
> as it is something I?ve always dreamed of seeing in our efforts to bring 
> blind people together who love to both create and appreciate the visual 
> arts.
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>  _______________________________________________
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>  Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>  http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>  To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
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> 
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>
> Message: 2
> Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2014 07:08:33 -0700
> From: <Ann at acunningham.com>
> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2014 11:23:35 -0500
> From: Jewel <herekittykat2 at gmail.com>
> To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
> Message-ID:
> <CABORmNtm3Wu6C=MnMC68NHdt1eSgDN2T1hyq7dvCWkbROEPn8A at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> I absolutely loved this explanation of arts versus crafts. I was also
> wondering the difference, so this really makes it clear to me. I do
> polymer clay. While I start with an expectation that it will be some
> sort of elephant or a horse or whatever, who knows what twists and
> turns will happen along the way. By the way, I'm currently working on
> a Harry Potter style house elf holding a tray that can hold business
> ccards. The house elf is done, but the tray still needs to be
> finished.
> Jewel
>
> On 2/7/14, Ann at acunningham.com <Ann at acunningham.com> wrote:
>> Lynda, Nice answer to craft and art. If someone who is reading this is 
>> still
>> torn I wouldn't be surprised though since there are all sorts of shades 
>> in
>> the continuum.
>>
>> I was talking to my daughter and a friend one day. I went off on a 
>> tangent
>> tangling all sorts of events together rather randomly. They started 
>> laughing
>> and saying something akin to how do you make it from day to day. And I 
>> said
>> you guys are pilots and for you to be a good pilot you know and follow
>> rules. That is what they pay you for. I am an artist and I am paid to 
>> break
>> the rules. No one wants to hear from me if it has already been done.
>>
>> What did you teach before you retired? Ann
>>
>> Ann Cunningham
>> Tactile Art - a creative way to see the world!
>> 303 238 4760
>> ann at acunningham.com
>> http://www.acunningham.com
>> http://www.sensationalbooks.com
>>
>>
>>> -------- Original Message --------
>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>> From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>>> Date: Fri, February 07, 2014 6:03 am
>>> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>>> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi Laurie,
>>> So nice to see you here.  I did not start this group though, I am like
>>> you, I just came on to ask a question about something I needed to know 
>>> and
>>> was so glad to meet Ann who helped me with my question.  I am furiously
>>> working right now (oops, split that infinitive!) getting work done for 
>>> the
>>> opening of a two-person exhibition at a museum - the show is called
>>> _Vision and Revision:  Two artists with limited sight, not limited
>>> vision_  It is my pottery and mixed-media fiber works, and a legally 
>>> blind
>>> painter. It opens one month from today, and if I stop to think about 
>>> what
>>> else has to be done yet, I'll get nervous. So, I won't do that, but just
>>> will keep on working on the details. The show will appear at two 
>>> locations
>>> this year and will have a video that plays in the gallery with the art
>>> works, Braille labeling, and artist's talks. I will even be teaching in
>>> the gallery one afternoon, for the Women in the Arts course at Geneva
>>> College. That is where I taught when I was a professor of fine arts and
>>> humanities, before I retired. I'll be lecturing on the historical 
>>> context
>>> of my work and where the ideas have come from when creating it.
>>>
>>> To make matters even more difficult, I am scheduled to speak at a
>>> conference at Slippery Rock University of PA for two sessions, the day
>>> before we hang our show. So, I have those presentations to be working on
>>> every day now, too.  I officially retired from teaching 5 1/2 years ago,
>>> but I am still very much involved in everything but being in the
>>> classroom.
>>>
>>> Here is my response to the question you have asked. The gap between an
>>> artist and a crafter is like crossing the ocean, it is that wide. Some
>>> basic things may be similar between the two, but most things are very 
>>> far
>>> apart philisophically.
>>>
>>> Both work with the hands, and both love working with the hands and most
>>> have done it all their life.
>>> Both love the materials, and the handling of them, and the satisfaction 
>>> of
>>> the finished product that comes out of it.
>>>
>>> While the crafter will usually be satisfied with beginning something and
>>> knowing where the end will be, the artist begins with no notion of where
>>> the end will be or even if it will be.  the crafter has a clearly 
>>> defined
>>> path to the finished product. The artist has only some inklings of
>>> possible outcomes, but has to find them as she works.
>>>
>>> The other very big thing I see as a difference between them is that the
>>> crafter has 'rules" to follow and seldom will ever deviate from those
>>> rules, as they are set in stone in her mind. On the other hand, the 
>>> mature
>>> artist has learned that there are no rules at all.  They may begin in 
>>> the
>>> early stages by learning techniques, but eventually with the years of
>>> working, the light comes on in her brain when she discovers one day
>>> - she is free of all rules when making art. Everything can be 
>>> challenged,
>>> everything can be changed, and everything is fair game, for the artist. 
>>> Is
>>> there any other profession in this world where there are no rules? It's
>>> the most exhilerating feeling to know that there are absolutely no rules
>>> whatsoever for me. Wow, makes me take a deep breath just to say it. 
>>> Free,
>>> free, free, at last!
>>>
>>> Laurie, the biggest difference between art and a craft is where the 
>>> person
>>> eventually takes the techniques, I think.
>>>
>>> A crafter seldom takes things to a different level but is usually 
>>> content
>>> to learn something then duplicate it endlessly, then moves on to learn
>>> something else and does that again with it. The artist can take crafts
>>> materials (which is what you and I both do) and techniques, and then 
>>> take
>>> them far beyond because they will combine their techniques and materials
>>> with the imagination.  If you can teach it, it is usually a craft. If 
>>> you
>>> cannot teach it, it is normally art.  Art can begin by learning some
>>> techniques, or using craft materials, but then the person begins to ask
>>> the "what if" questions, and takes lots of risks, failures, and bends in
>>> the road on the way to it becoming a work of art. It is a "mind set" 
>>> that
>>> is never satisfied with just the learning of something new, but one that
>>> constantly questions, experiments, and never knows where the "end" will
>>> be, or even if it will be.  A "crafter" will never understand what I 
>>> have
>>> just said and will most likely be huffing and puffing and angry with it.
>>>  An "artist" is standing and applauding what I have said. It is that
>>> simple, and that complex.  The artist thrives on change and making new
>>> discoveries and each work leads to other querstions and more change and
>>> more new discoveries.
>>>
>>> One can see the difference when you look at work in types of
>>> environments.  One will be setting at a craft show with a table full of
>>> things that are basically all the same while the other will have work 
>>> on
>>> display in a gallery or museum.  Each has decided where they "fit" and
>>> each is very happy with where they are. They are different animals, with
>>> different ideas, and different end results and outcomes. Each one has
>>> decided their own path and each one is comfortable with the decision she
>>> has made.
>>>
>>> Lynda
>>>
>>> Lynda
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: Laurie Porter
>>>> To: Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>> Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2014 7:26 PM
>>>> Subject: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>
>>>> Hi Folks:
>>>>
>>>> I'd like to introduce myself. I'm a blind person from wisconsin who is 
>>>> a
>>>> fledgling and budding beginner artist. my medium is beadwork. I make
>>>> pictures and tapestries out of tiny little seed beads  sewn together 
>>>> with
>>>> thread. but most of my work is in making jewlry, but I have always 
>>>> looked
>>>> upon my beadwork as an art form.
>>>>
>>>> so, I have a basic question. What is the difference between an art and 
>>>> a
>>>> craft? I do believe that all crafts are forms of art  but are all arts
>>>> considered crafts? Thanks linda and all of you for getting this list
>>>> going as it is something I've always dreamed of seeing in our efforts 
>>>> to
>>>> bring blind people together who love to both create and appreciate the
>>>> visual arts.
>>>> ________________________________
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>> Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> Artists-making-art:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>
>>> ________________________________
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Artists-making-art mailing list
>>> Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> Artists-making-art:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/ann%40acunningham.com
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2014 11:44:39 -0500
> From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
> Message-ID: <00EE5DF7276148B7B8D3EE072C8258A0 at Lambert>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Well, this is an outrageous conversation, I know. lol   I better get back 
> to the studio before I cause a riot, but this should be a good place for a 
> discussion like this.
>
> That is great, Ann! So true. There is really not a fine line between the 
> two, it is very clear and distinct. And artist or a crafter can take the 
> exact same materials, but the mind that works with them is quite different 
> and the results are quite different. It's really about "ideas" and 
> "concepts" and what we are thinking about as we work, and where we go with 
> the materials in our process of working.  In Pittsburgh, PA there is a 
> very fine museum/gallery called the Society of Contemporary Crafts - now, 
> what is done there, and shown there is high art. So there is crafts and 
> there is CRAFT, too.  There is the "crafter" and there is the "Craftsman." 
> very distinct differences between them - and as a sculptor you would be 
> very aware of this, too.
>
> I was so fortunate to teach in a small private college (Geneva College, in 
> western PA)  where I was free to teach across disciplines, as I have my 
> MFA in painting/printmaking, and my MA in English Literature.  Because of 
> this background, I was very marketable for a good position.  I was able to 
> create multi-discipline courses - alway a combination of literature and 
> art, as well as studio courses in painting, fiber arts, printmaking, 
> drawing. It was a dream of a job, working in interdisciplinary studies and 
> doing so many projects with profs in other disciplines.  I was very active 
> in conferences on interdisciplinary studies.   I created an European 
> experience for art and literature students and we lived in Austria every 
> summer and then traveled to other countries. I even had an art exhibition 
> in Austria for my students every summer.  They worked so hard in the 
> studio and out on location every day, and at the end of the month they had 
> a show - so much fun.  I also did this with Puerto Rico, and students came 
> to PR with me each spring as part of their course in Puerto Rico Culture - 
> which I have continued to visit every March even though I am now retired. 
> It bacame how we spent our spring time.
>
> OK, back to my studio where I am working my tail off to get a piece done 
> today!
> Lynda
>  ----- Original Message ----- 
>  From: Ann at acunningham.com
>  To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>  Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 9:08 AM
>  Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>
>
>  Lynda, Nice answer to craft and art. If someone who is reading this is 
> still torn I wouldn't be surprised though since there are all sorts of 
> shades in the continuum.
>
>
>  I was talking to my daughter and a friend one day. I went off on a 
> tangent tangling all sorts of events together rather randomly. They 
> started laughing and saying something akin to how do you make it from day 
> to day. And I said you guys are pilots and for you to be a good pilot you 
> know and follow rules. That is what they pay you for. I am an artist and I 
> am paid to break the rules. No one wants to hear from me if it has already 
> been done.
>
>
>  What did you teach before you retired? Ann
>
>
>  Ann Cunningham
>  Tactile Art - a creative way to see the world!
>  303 238 4760
>  ann at acunningham.com
>  http://www.acunningham.com
>  http://www.sensationalbooks.com
>
>
>
>    -------- Original Message --------
>    Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>    From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>    Date: Fri, February 07, 2014 6:03 am
>    To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>    <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>
>    ?
>    Hi Laurie,
>    So nice to see you here.  I did not start this group though, I am like 
> you, I just came on to ask a question about something I needed to know and 
> was so glad to meet Ann who helped me with my question.  I am furiously 
> working right now (oops, split that infinitive!) getting work done for the 
> opening of a two-person exhibition at a museum - the show is called 
> _Vision and Revision:  Two artists with limited sight, not limited vision_ 
> It is my pottery and mixed-media fiber works, and a legally blind painter. 
> It opens one month from today, and if I stop to think about what else has 
> to be done yet, I'll get nervous. So, I won't do that, but just will keep 
> on working on the details. The show will appear at two locations this year 
> and will have a video that plays in the gallery with the art works, 
> Braille labeling, and artist's talks. I will even be teaching in the 
> gallery one afternoon, for the Women in the Arts course at Geneva College. 
> That is where I taught when I was a professor of fine arts and humanities, 
> before I retired. I'll be lecturing on the historical context of my work 
> and where the ideas have come from when creating it.
>
>    To make matters even more difficult, I am scheduled to speak at a 
> conference at Slippery Rock University of PA for two sessions, the day 
> before we hang our show. So, I have those presentations to be working on 
> every day now, too.  I officially retired from teaching 5 1/2 years ago, 
> but I am still very much involved in everything but being in the 
> classroom.
>
>    Here is my response to the question you have asked. The gap between an 
> artist and a crafter is like crossing the ocean, it is that wide. Some 
> basic things may be similar between the two, but most things are very far 
> apart philisophically.
>
>    Both work with the hands, and both love working with the hands and most 
> have done it all their life.
>    Both love the materials, and the handling of them, and the satisfaction 
> of the finished product that comes out of it.
>
>    While the crafter will usually be satisfied with beginning something 
> and knowing where the end will be, the artist begins with no notion of 
> where the end will be or even if it will be.  the crafter has a clearly 
> defined path to the finished product. The artist has only some inklings of 
> possible outcomes, but has to find them as she works.
>
>    The other very big thing I see as a difference between them is that the 
> crafter has 'rules" to follow and seldom will ever deviate from those 
> rules, as they are set in stone in her mind. On the other hand, the mature 
> artist has learned that there are no rules at all.  They may begin in the 
> early stages by learning techniques, but eventually with the years of 
> working, the light comes on in her brain when she discovers one day - she 
> is free of all rules when making art. Everything can be challenged, 
> everything can be changed, and everything is fair game, for the artist. Is 
> there any other profession in this world where there are no rules? It's 
> the most exhilerating feeling to know that there are absolutely no rules 
> whatsoever for me. Wow, makes me take a deep breath just to say it. Free, 
> free, free, at last!
>
>    Laurie, the biggest difference between art and a craft is where the 
> person eventually takes the techniques, I think.
>
>    A crafter seldom takes things to a different level but is usually 
> content to learn something then duplicate it endlessly, then moves on to 
> learn something else and does that again with it. The artist can take 
> crafts materials (which is what you and I both do) and techniques, and 
> then take them far beyond because they will combine their techniques and 
> materials with the imagination.  If you can teach it, it is usually a 
> craft. If you cannot teach it, it is normally art.  Art can begin by 
> learning some techniques, or using craft materials, but then the person 
> begins to ask the "what if" questions, and takes lots of risks, failures, 
> and bends in the road on the way to it becoming a work of art. It is a 
> "mind set" that is never satisfied with just the learning of something 
> new, but one that constantly questions, experiments, and never knows where 
> the "end" will be, or even if it will be.  A "crafter" will never 
> understand what I have just said and will most likely be huffing and 
> puffing and angry with it.  An "artist" is standing and applauding what I 
> have said. It is that simple, and that complex.  The artist thrives on 
> change and making new discoveries and each work leads to other querstions 
> and more change and more new discoveries.
>
>    One can see the difference when you look at work in types of 
> environments.  One will be setting at a craft show with a table full of 
> things that are basically all the same while the other will have work  on 
> display in a gallery or museum.  Each has decided where they "fit" and 
> each is very happy with where they are. They are different animals, with 
> different ideas, and different end results and outcomes. Each one has 
> decided their own path and each one is comfortable with the decision she 
> has made.
>
>    Lynda
>
>    Lynda
>
>
>      ----- Original Message ----- 
>      From: Laurie Porter
>      To: Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>      Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2014 7:26 PM
>      Subject: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>
>
>      Hi Folks:
>
>      I?d like to introduce myself. I?m a blind person from wisconsin who 
> is a fledgling and budding beginner artist. my medium is beadwork. I make 
> pictures and tapestries out of tiny little seed beads  sewn together with 
> thread. but most of my work is in making jewlry, but I have always looked 
> upon my beadwork as an art form.
>
>      so, I have a basic question. What is the difference between an art 
> and a craft? I do believe that all crafts are forms of art  but are all 
> arts considered crafts? Thanks linda and all of you for getting this list 
> going as it is something I?ve always dreamed of seeing in our efforts to 
> bring blind people together who love to both create and appreciate the 
> visual arts.
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>      _______________________________________________
>      Artists-making-art mailing list
>      Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>      http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>      To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> Artists-making-art:
> 
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>
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> 
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>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2014 11:47:54 -0500
> From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
> Message-ID: <687BD2626016484AB96E97E715BA11BD at Lambert>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
> Yes, Jewell, the material does not matter - we can go any way we want to
> with it.  It is the ideas we work with that determine what will happen 
> along
> the way, plus allowing the medium to lead us - finding that "life of it's
> own" that is there for us - a surprise or two along the way. Your project
> sounds wonderful.  Lynda
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Jewel" <herekittykat2 at gmail.com>
> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 11:23 AM
> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>
>
>>I absolutely loved this explanation of arts versus crafts. I was also
>> wondering the difference, so this really makes it clear to me. I do
>> polymer clay. While I start with an expectation that it will be some
>> sort of elephant or a horse or whatever, who knows what twists and
>> turns will happen along the way. By the way, I'm currently working on
>> a Harry Potter style house elf holding a tray that can hold business
>> ccards. The house elf is done, but the tray still needs to be
>> finished.
>> Jewel
>>
>> On 2/7/14, Ann at acunningham.com <Ann at acunningham.com> wrote:
>>> Lynda, Nice answer to craft and art. If someone who is reading this is
>>> still
>>> torn I wouldn't be surprised though since there are all sorts of shades
>>> in
>>> the continuum.
>>>
>>> I was talking to my daughter and a friend one day. I went off on a
>>> tangent
>>> tangling all sorts of events together rather randomly. They started
>>> laughing
>>> and saying something akin to how do you make it from day to day. And I
>>> said
>>> you guys are pilots and for you to be a good pilot you know and follow
>>> rules. That is what they pay you for. I am an artist and I am paid to
>>> break
>>> the rules. No one wants to hear from me if it has already been done.
>>>
>>> What did you teach before you retired? Ann
>>>
>>> Ann Cunningham
>>> Tactile Art - a creative way to see the world!
>>> 303 238 4760
>>> ann at acunningham.com
>>> http://www.acunningham.com
>>> http://www.sensationalbooks.com
>>>
>>>
>>>> -------- Original Message --------
>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>> From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>>>> Date: Fri, February 07, 2014 6:03 am
>>>> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>>>> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Hi Laurie,
>>>> So nice to see you here.  I did not start this group though, I am like
>>>> you, I just came on to ask a question about something I needed to know
>>>> and
>>>> was so glad to meet Ann who helped me with my question.  I am furiously
>>>> working right now (oops, split that infinitive!) getting work done for
>>>> the
>>>> opening of a two-person exhibition at a museum - the show is called
>>>> _Vision and Revision:  Two artists with limited sight, not limited
>>>> vision_  It is my pottery and mixed-media fiber works, and a legally
>>>> blind
>>>> painter. It opens one month from today, and if I stop to think about
>>>> what
>>>> else has to be done yet, I'll get nervous. So, I won't do that, but 
>>>> just
>>>> will keep on working on the details. The show will appear at two
>>>> locations
>>>> this year and will have a video that plays in the gallery with the art
>>>> works, Braille labeling, and artist's talks. I will even be teaching in
>>>> the gallery one afternoon, for the Women in the Arts course at Geneva
>>>> College. That is where I taught when I was a professor of fine arts and
>>>> humanities, before I retired. I'll be lecturing on the historical
>>>> context
>>>> of my work and where the ideas have come from when creating it.
>>>>
>>>> To make matters even more difficult, I am scheduled to speak at a
>>>> conference at Slippery Rock University of PA for two sessions, the day
>>>> before we hang our show. So, I have those presentations to be working 
>>>> on
>>>> every day now, too.  I officially retired from teaching 5 1/2 years 
>>>> ago,
>>>> but I am still very much involved in everything but being in the
>>>> classroom.
>>>>
>>>> Here is my response to the question you have asked. The gap between an
>>>> artist and a crafter is like crossing the ocean, it is that wide. Some
>>>> basic things may be similar between the two, but most things are very
>>>> far
>>>> apart philisophically.
>>>>
>>>> Both work with the hands, and both love working with the hands and most
>>>> have done it all their life.
>>>> Both love the materials, and the handling of them, and the satisfaction
>>>> of
>>>> the finished product that comes out of it.
>>>>
>>>> While the crafter will usually be satisfied with beginning something 
>>>> and
>>>> knowing where the end will be, the artist begins with no notion of 
>>>> where
>>>> the end will be or even if it will be.  the crafter has a clearly
>>>> defined
>>>> path to the finished product. The artist has only some inklings of
>>>> possible outcomes, but has to find them as she works.
>>>>
>>>> The other very big thing I see as a difference between them is that the
>>>> crafter has 'rules" to follow and seldom will ever deviate from those
>>>> rules, as they are set in stone in her mind. On the other hand, the
>>>> mature
>>>> artist has learned that there are no rules at all.  They may begin in
>>>> the
>>>> early stages by learning techniques, but eventually with the years of
>>>> working, the light comes on in her brain when she discovers one day
>>>> - she is free of all rules when making art. Everything can be
>>>> challenged,
>>>> everything can be changed, and everything is fair game, for the artist.
>>>> Is
>>>> there any other profession in this world where there are no rules? It's
>>>> the most exhilerating feeling to know that there are absolutely no 
>>>> rules
>>>> whatsoever for me. Wow, makes me take a deep breath just to say it.
>>>> Free,
>>>> free, free, at last!
>>>>
>>>> Laurie, the biggest difference between art and a craft is where the
>>>> person
>>>> eventually takes the techniques, I think.
>>>>
>>>> A crafter seldom takes things to a different level but is usually
>>>> content
>>>> to learn something then duplicate it endlessly, then moves on to learn
>>>> something else and does that again with it. The artist can take crafts
>>>> materials (which is what you and I both do) and techniques, and then
>>>> take
>>>> them far beyond because they will combine their techniques and 
>>>> materials
>>>> with the imagination.  If you can teach it, it is usually a craft. If
>>>> you
>>>> cannot teach it, it is normally art.  Art can begin by learning some
>>>> techniques, or using craft materials, but then the person begins to ask
>>>> the "what if" questions, and takes lots of risks, failures, and bends 
>>>> in
>>>> the road on the way to it becoming a work of art. It is a "mind set"
>>>> that
>>>> is never satisfied with just the learning of something new, but one 
>>>> that
>>>> constantly questions, experiments, and never knows where the "end" will
>>>> be, or even if it will be.  A "crafter" will never understand what I
>>>> have
>>>> just said and will most likely be huffing and puffing and angry with 
>>>> it.
>>>>  An "artist" is standing and applauding what I have said. It is that
>>>> simple, and that complex.  The artist thrives on change and making new
>>>> discoveries and each work leads to other querstions and more change and
>>>> more new discoveries.
>>>>
>>>> One can see the difference when you look at work in types of
>>>> environments.  One will be setting at a craft show with a table full of
>>>> things that are basically all the same while the other will have work
>>>> on
>>>> display in a gallery or museum.  Each has decided where they "fit" and
>>>> each is very happy with where they are. They are different animals, 
>>>> with
>>>> different ideas, and different end results and outcomes. Each one has
>>>> decided their own path and each one is comfortable with the decision 
>>>> she
>>>> has made.
>>>>
>>>> Lynda
>>>>
>>>> Lynda
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: Laurie Porter
>>>>> To: Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>> Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2014 7:26 PM
>>>>> Subject: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi Folks:
>>>>>
>>>>> I'd like to introduce myself. I'm a blind person from wisconsin who is
>>>>> a
>>>>> fledgling and budding beginner artist. my medium is beadwork. I make
>>>>> pictures and tapestries out of tiny little seed beads  sewn together
>>>>> with
>>>>> thread. but most of my work is in making jewlry, but I have always
>>>>> looked
>>>>> upon my beadwork as an art form.
>>>>>
>>>>> so, I have a basic question. What is the difference between an art and
>>>>> a
>>>>> craft? I do believe that all crafts are forms of art  but are all arts
>>>>> considered crafts? Thanks linda and all of you for getting this list
>>>>> going as it is something I've always dreamed of seeing in our efforts
>>>>> to
>>>>> bring blind people together who love to both create and appreciate the
>>>>> visual arts.
>>>>> ________________________________
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>> Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>> Artists-making-art:
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>
>>>> ________________________________
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>> Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> Artists-making-art:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/ann%40acunningham.com
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Artists-making-art mailing list
>> Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> Artists-making-art:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2014 13:26:55 -0500
> From: "Patricia C. Estes" <pece03 at gmail.com>
> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
> Message-ID: <95E84F42EA7F4ADFA9DF888A9D45EA90 at Wellness>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Hooray for "outrageous and for all of you for taking the time to 
> articulate these distinctions.
> I absolutely agree and have been an artist and crafter simultaneously. I 
> am back to my art and love the discovery of it-but I will admit, my left 
> brain does like rules and instructions-but my Girl Brain is winning! (no 
> put down to Boy Brains, just a family joke).
>
> Right on! Right on, Linda!
> pece out
>  ----- Original Message ----- 
>  From: Lynda Lambert
>  To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>  Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 11:44 AM
>  Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>
>
>  Well, this is an outrageous conversation, I know. lol   I better get back 
> to the studio before I cause a riot, but this should be a good place for a 
> discussion like this.
>
>  That is great, Ann! So true. There is really not a fine line between the 
> two, it is very clear and distinct. And artist or a crafter can take the 
> exact same materials, but the mind that works with them is quite different 
> and the results are quite different. It's really about "ideas" and 
> "concepts" and what we are thinking about as we work, and where we go with 
> the materials in our process of working.  In Pittsburgh, PA there is a 
> very fine museum/gallery called the Society of Contemporary Crafts - now, 
> what is done there, and shown there is high art. So there is crafts and 
> there is CRAFT, too.  There is the "crafter" and there is the "Craftsman." 
> very distinct differences between them - and as a sculptor you would be 
> very aware of this, too.
>
>  I was so fortunate to teach in a small private college (Geneva College, 
> in western PA)  where I was free to teach across disciplines, as I have my 
> MFA in painting/printmaking, and my MA in English Literature.  Because of 
> this background, I was very marketable for a good position.  I was able to 
> create multi-discipline courses - alway a combination of literature and 
> art, as well as studio courses in painting, fiber arts, printmaking, 
> drawing. It was a dream of a job, working in interdisciplinary studies and 
> doing so many projects with profs in other disciplines.  I was very active 
> in conferences on interdisciplinary studies.   I created an European 
> experience for art and literature students and we lived in Austria every 
> summer and then traveled to other countries. I even had an art exhibition 
> in Austria for my students every summer.  They worked so hard in the 
> studio and out on location every day, and at the end of the month they had 
> a show - so much fun.  I also did this with Puerto Rico, and students came 
> to PR with me each spring as part of their course in Puerto Rico Culture - 
> which I have continued to visit every March even though I am now retired. 
> It bacame how we spent our spring time.
>
>  OK, back to my studio where I am working my tail off to get a piece done 
> today!
>  Lynda
>    ----- Original Message ----- 
>    From: Ann at acunningham.com
>    To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>    Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 9:08 AM
>    Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>
>
>    Lynda, Nice answer to craft and art. If someone who is reading this is 
> still torn I wouldn't be surprised though since there are all sorts of 
> shades in the continuum.
>
>
>    I was talking to my daughter and a friend one day. I went off on a 
> tangent tangling all sorts of events together rather randomly. They 
> started laughing and saying something akin to how do you make it from day 
> to day. And I said you guys are pilots and for you to be a good pilot you 
> know and follow rules. That is what they pay you for. I am an artist and I 
> am paid to break the rules. No one wants to hear from me if it has already 
> been done.
>
>
>    What did you teach before you retired? Ann
>
>
>    Ann Cunningham
>    Tactile Art - a creative way to see the world!
>    303 238 4760
>    ann at acunningham.com
>    http://www.acunningham.com
>    http://www.sensationalbooks.com
>
>
>
>      -------- Original Message --------
>      Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>      From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>      Date: Fri, February 07, 2014 6:03 am
>      To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>      <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>
>      ?
>      Hi Laurie,
>      So nice to see you here.  I did not start this group though, I am 
> like you, I just came on to ask a question about something I needed to 
> know and was so glad to meet Ann who helped me with my question.  I am 
> furiously working right now (oops, split that infinitive!) getting work 
> done for the opening of a two-person exhibition at a museum - the show is 
> called _Vision and Revision:  Two artists with limited sight, not limited 
> vision_  It is my pottery and mixed-media fiber works, and a legally blind 
> painter. It opens one month from today, and if I stop to think about what 
> else has to be done yet, I'll get nervous. So, I won't do that, but just 
> will keep on working on the details. The show will appear at two locations 
> this year and will have a video that plays in the gallery with the art 
> works, Braille labeling, and artist's talks. I will even be teaching in 
> the gallery one afternoon, for the Women in the Arts course at Geneva 
> College. That is where I taught when I was a professor of fine arts and 
> humanities, before I retired. I'll be lecturing on the historical context 
> of my work and where the ideas have come from when creating it.
>
>      To make matters even more difficult, I am scheduled to speak at a 
> conference at Slippery Rock University of PA for two sessions, the day 
> before we hang our show. So, I have those presentations to be working on 
> every day now, too.  I officially retired from teaching 5 1/2 years ago, 
> but I am still very much involved in everything but being in the 
> classroom.
>
>      Here is my response to the question you have asked. The gap between 
> an artist and a crafter is like crossing the ocean, it is that wide. Some 
> basic things may be similar between the two, but most things are very far 
> apart philisophically.
>
>      Both work with the hands, and both love working with the hands and 
> most have done it all their life.
>      Both love the materials, and the handling of them, and the 
> satisfaction of the finished product that comes out of it.
>
>      While the crafter will usually be satisfied with beginning something 
> and knowing where the end will be, the artist begins with no notion of 
> where the end will be or even if it will be.  the crafter has a clearly 
> defined path to the finished product. The artist has only some inklings of 
> possible outcomes, but has to find them as she works.
>
>      The other very big thing I see as a difference between them is that 
> the crafter has 'rules" to follow and seldom will ever deviate from those 
> rules, as they are set in stone in her mind. On the other hand, the mature 
> artist has learned that there are no rules at all.  They may begin in the 
> early stages by learning techniques, but eventually with the years of 
> working, the light comes on in her brain when she discovers one day - she 
> is free of all rules when making art. Everything can be challenged, 
> everything can be changed, and everything is fair game, for the artist. Is 
> there any other profession in this world where there are no rules? It's 
> the most exhilerating feeling to know that there are absolutely no rules 
> whatsoever for me. Wow, makes me take a deep breath just to say it. Free, 
> free, free, at last!
>
>      Laurie, the biggest difference between art and a craft is where the 
> person eventually takes the techniques, I think.
>
>      A crafter seldom takes things to a different level but is usually 
> content to learn something then duplicate it endlessly, then moves on to 
> learn something else and does that again with it. The artist can take 
> crafts materials (which is what you and I both do) and techniques, and 
> then take them far beyond because they will combine their techniques and 
> materials with the imagination.  If you can teach it, it is usually a 
> craft. If you cannot teach it, it is normally art.  Art can begin by 
> learning some techniques, or using craft materials, but then the person 
> begins to ask the "what if" questions, and takes lots of risks, failures, 
> and bends in the road on the way to it becoming a work of art. It is a 
> "mind set" that is never satisfied with just the learning of something 
> new, but one that constantly questions, experiments, and never knows where 
> the "end" will be, or even if it will be.  A "crafter" will never 
> understand what I have just said and will most likely be huffing and 
> puffing and angry with it.  An "artist" is standing and applauding what I 
> have said. It is that simple, and that complex.  The artist thrives on 
> change and making new discoveries and each work leads to other querstions 
> and more change and more new discoveries.
>
>      One can see the difference when you look at work in types of 
> environments.  One will be setting at a craft show with a table full of 
> things that are basically all the same while the other will have work  on 
> display in a gallery or museum.  Each has decided where they "fit" and 
> each is very happy with where they are. They are different animals, with 
> different ideas, and different end results and outcomes. Each one has 
> decided their own path and each one is comfortable with the decision she 
> has made.
>
>      Lynda
>
>      Lynda
>
>
>        ----- Original Message ----- 
>        From: Laurie Porter
>        To: Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>        Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2014 7:26 PM
>        Subject: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>
>
>        Hi Folks:
>
>        I?d like to introduce myself. I?m a blind person from wisconsin who 
> is a fledgling and budding beginner artist. my medium is beadwork. I make 
> pictures and tapestries out of tiny little seed beads  sewn together with 
> thread. but most of my work is in making jewlry, but I have always looked 
> upon my beadwork as an art form.
>
>        so, I have a basic question. What is the difference between an art 
> and a craft? I do believe that all crafts are forms of art  but are all 
> arts considered crafts? Thanks linda and all of you for getting this list 
> going as it is something I?ve always dreamed of seeing in our efforts to 
> bring blind people together who love to both create and appreciate the 
> visual arts.
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>        _______________________________________________
>        Artists-making-art mailing list
>        Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>        http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>        To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
> for Artists-making-art:
> 
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
>      _______________________________________________
>      Artists-making-art mailing list
>      Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>      http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>      To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> Artists-making-art:
> 
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/ann%40acunningham.com
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>    _______________________________________________
>    Artists-making-art mailing list
>    Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>    http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>    To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> Artists-making-art:
> 
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>  _______________________________________________
>  Artists-making-art mailing list
>  Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>  http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>  To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> Artists-making-art:
> 
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2014 13:48:48 -0500
> From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
> Message-ID: <0C82603A06C14829A1FDF9CA9822F0BB at Lambert>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Patricia, I just finished reading the book "The Female Brain" by Luann 
> Brizendine, and OH, HOw I wish I had this wonderful information a long 
> time ago. Raising my brood of children would have been so much easier if I 
> had known these things about the differences between male and female 
> brains. And, my goodness, I would have been a much better teacher, too. I 
> would have a better understanding of my fellow human beings - but at least 
> I do understand a lot more about it now since reading this book. It was so 
> enlightening to me and I was telling my husband all about it as we would 
> ride along in the truck. One day he said to me, "I guess it is like this 
> conversation we are having right now in this truck."  This was his insight 
> as I was rapidly sharing so much information as he sat quietly 
> listening...lol  I said, "Yes, now I understand this conversation here in 
> this truck so much better."  We laughed.
>
> Of course we are both crafters and artists - one feeds into the other. We 
> all begin somewhere - and for me, it begins with my mother taking an 
> afternoon to teach me how to do some embroidery stitches and to creat a 
> picture on a linen tea towel - I was probably 8 years old. Then, it 
> continues on with my precious neighbor taking an hour each morning, one 
> summer, to teach me how to read a pattern and how to sew a blouse, skirt, 
> and then an entire outfit - I was about 10. We learn from those around us, 
> and how lucky we were to have them in our life. What I do today, is an 
> homage to those women in my life so long ago. I celebrate them with  every 
> stitch  I make in my art these days. And, I say "thank you" to them for 
> giving me the beginnings of who I am today, and who I am becoming with 
> each new day and each new idea I work with.
>
> Lynda
>
> http://www.amazon.com/Louann-Brizendine/e/B001H6RZB8/ref=sr_ntt_srch_lnk_1?qid=1391798400&sr=1-1
>  ----- Original Message ----- 
>  From: Patricia C. Estes
>  To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>  Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 1:26 PM
>  Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>
>
>  Hooray for "outrageous and for all of you for taking the time to 
> articulate these distinctions.
>  I absolutely agree and have been an artist and crafter simultaneously. I 
> am back to my art and love the discovery of it-but I will admit, my left 
> brain does like rules and instructions-but my Girl Brain is winning! (no 
> put down to Boy Brains, just a family joke).
>
>  Right on! Right on, Linda!
>  pece out
>    ----- Original Message ----- 
>    From: Lynda Lambert
>    To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>    Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 11:44 AM
>    Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>
>
>    Well, this is an outrageous conversation, I know. lol   I better get 
> back to the studio before I cause a riot, but this should be a good place 
> for a discussion like this.
>
>    That is great, Ann! So true. There is really not a fine line between 
> the two, it is very clear and distinct. And artist or a crafter can take 
> the exact same materials, but the mind that works with them is quite 
> different and the results are quite different. It's really about "ideas" 
> and "concepts" and what we are thinking about as we work, and where we go 
> with the materials in our process of working.  In Pittsburgh, PA there is 
> a very fine museum/gallery called the Society of Contemporary Crafts - 
> now, what is done there, and shown there is high art. So there is crafts 
> and there is CRAFT, too.  There is the "crafter" and there is the 
> "Craftsman."  very distinct differences between them - and as a sculptor 
> you would be very aware of this, too.
>
>    I was so fortunate to teach in a small private college (Geneva College, 
> in western PA)  where I was free to teach across disciplines, as I have my 
> MFA in painting/printmaking, and my MA in English Literature.  Because of 
> this background, I was very marketable for a good position.  I was able to 
> create multi-discipline courses - alway a combination of literature and 
> art, as well as studio courses in painting, fiber arts, printmaking, 
> drawing. It was a dream of a job, working in interdisciplinary studies and 
> doing so many projects with profs in other disciplines.  I was very active 
> in conferences on interdisciplinary studies.   I created an European 
> experience for art and literature students and we lived in Austria every 
> summer and then traveled to other countries. I even had an art exhibition 
> in Austria for my students every summer.  They worked so hard in the 
> studio and out on location every day, and at the end of the month they had 
> a show - so much fun.  I also did this with Puerto Rico, and students came 
> to PR with me each spring as part of their course in Puerto Rico Culture - 
> which I have continued to visit every March even though I am now retired. 
> It bacame how we spent our spring time.
>
>    OK, back to my studio where I am working my tail off to get a piece 
> done today!
>    Lynda
>      ----- Original Message ----- 
>      From: Ann at acunningham.com
>      To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>      Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 9:08 AM
>      Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>
>
>      Lynda, Nice answer to craft and art. If someone who is reading this 
> is still torn I wouldn't be surprised though since there are all sorts of 
> shades in the continuum.
>
>
>      I was talking to my daughter and a friend one day. I went off on a 
> tangent tangling all sorts of events together rather randomly. They 
> started laughing and saying something akin to how do you make it from day 
> to day. And I said you guys are pilots and for you to be a good pilot you 
> know and follow rules. That is what they pay you for. I am an artist and I 
> am paid to break the rules. No one wants to hear from me if it has already 
> been done.
>
>
>      What did you teach before you retired? Ann
>
>
>      Ann Cunningham
>      Tactile Art - a creative way to see the world!
>      303 238 4760
>      ann at acunningham.com
>      http://www.acunningham.com
>      http://www.sensationalbooks.com
>
>
>
>        -------- Original Message --------
>        Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>        From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>        Date: Fri, February 07, 2014 6:03 am
>        To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>        <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>
>        ?
>        Hi Laurie,
>        So nice to see you here.  I did not start this group though, I am 
> like you, I just came on to ask a question about something I needed to 
> know and was so glad to meet Ann who helped me with my question.  I am 
> furiously working right now (oops, split that infinitive!) getting work 
> done for the opening of a two-person exhibition at a museum - the show is 
> called _Vision and Revision:  Two artists with limited sight, not limited 
> vision_  It is my pottery and mixed-media fiber works, and a legally blind 
> painter. It opens one month from today, and if I stop to think about what 
> else has to be done yet, I'll get nervous. So, I won't do that, but just 
> will keep on working on the details. The show will appear at two locations 
> this year and will have a video that plays in the gallery with the art 
> works, Braille labeling, and artist's talks. I will even be teaching in 
> the gallery one afternoon, for the Women in the Arts course at Geneva 
> College. That is where I taught when I was a professor of fine arts and 
> humanities, before I retired. I'll be lecturing on the historical context 
> of my work and where the ideas have come from when creating it.
>
>        To make matters even more difficult, I am scheduled to speak at a 
> conference at Slippery Rock University of PA for two sessions, the day 
> before we hang our show. So, I have those presentations to be working on 
> every day now, too.  I officially retired from teaching 5 1/2 years ago, 
> but I am still very much involved in everything but being in the 
> classroom.
>
>        Here is my response to the question you have asked. The gap between 
> an artist and a crafter is like crossing the ocean, it is that wide. Some 
> basic things may be similar between the two, but most things are very far 
> apart philisophically.
>
>        Both work with the hands, and both love working with the hands and 
> most have done it all their life.
>        Both love the materials, and the handling of them, and the 
> satisfaction of the finished product that comes out of it.
>
>        While the crafter will usually be satisfied with beginning 
> something and knowing where the end will be, the artist begins with no 
> notion of where the end will be or even if it will be.  the crafter has a 
> clearly defined path to the finished product. The artist has only some 
> inklings of possible outcomes, but has to find them as she works.
>
>        The other very big thing I see as a difference between them is that 
> the crafter has 'rules" to follow and seldom will ever deviate from those 
> rules, as they are set in stone in her mind. On the other hand, the mature 
> artist has learned that there are no rules at all.  They may begin in the 
> early stages by learning techniques, but eventually with the years of 
> working, the light comes on in her brain when she discovers one day - she 
> is free of all rules when making art. Everything can be challenged, 
> everything can be changed, and everything is fair game, for the artist. Is 
> there any other profession in this world where there are no rules? It's 
> the most exhilerating feeling to know that there are absolutely no rules 
> whatsoever for me. Wow, makes me take a deep breath just to say it. Free, 
> free, free, at last!
>
>        Laurie, the biggest difference between art and a craft is where the 
> person eventually takes the techniques, I think.
>
>        A crafter seldom takes things to a different level but is usually 
> content to learn something then duplicate it endlessly, then moves on to 
> learn something else and does that again with it. The artist can take 
> crafts materials (which is what you and I both do) and techniques, and 
> then take them far beyond because they will combine their techniques and 
> materials with the imagination.  If you can teach it, it is usually a 
> craft. If you cannot teach it, it is normally art.  Art can begin by 
> learning some techniques, or using craft materials, but then the person 
> begins to ask the "what if" questions, and takes lots of risks, failures, 
> and bends in the road on the way to it becoming a work of art. It is a 
> "mind set" that is never satisfied with just the learning of something 
> new, but one that constantly questions, experiments, and never knows where 
> the "end" will be, or even if it will be.  A "crafter" will never 
> understand what I have just said and will most likely be huffing and 
> puffing and angry with it.  An "artist" is standing and applauding what I 
> have said. It is that simple, and that complex.  The artist thrives on 
> change and making new discoveries and each work leads to other querstions 
> and more change and more new discoveries.
>
>        One can see the difference when you look at work in types of 
> environments.  One will be setting at a craft show with a table full of 
> things that are basically all the same while the other will have work  on 
> display in a gallery or museum.  Each has decided where they "fit" and 
> each is very happy with where they are. They are different animals, with 
> different ideas, and different end results and outcomes. Each one has 
> decided their own path and each one is comfortable with the decision she 
> has made.
>
>        Lynda
>
>        Lynda
>
>
>          ----- Original Message ----- 
>          From: Laurie Porter
>          To: Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>          Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2014 7:26 PM
>          Subject: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>
>
>          Hi Folks:
>
>          I?d like to introduce myself. I?m a blind person from wisconsin 
> who is a fledgling and budding beginner artist. my medium is beadwork. I 
> make pictures and tapestries out of tiny little seed beads  sewn together 
> with thread. but most of my work is in making jewlry, but I have always 
> looked upon my beadwork as an art form.
>
>          so, I have a basic question. What is the difference between an 
> art and a craft? I do believe that all crafts are forms of art  but are 
> all arts considered crafts? Thanks linda and all of you for getting this 
> list going as it is something I?ve always dreamed of seeing in our efforts 
> to bring blind people together who love to both create and appreciate the 
> visual arts.
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>          _______________________________________________
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> 
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2014 20:54:43 -0500
> From: "Patricia C. Estes" <pece03 at gmail.com>
> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
> Message-ID: <35AF1D7D30354C14A11963A2A17E797B at Wellness>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Linda, the brain is so fascinating-or is it the mind?? My first real 
> understanding of it (before I studied holistic psychology and energy 
> medicine) was when our youngest was caught doing something or other that 
> five year olds do, and he burst into tears and managed to blurt out 
> emphatically, "My girl brain made me do it!"
> Yes, Luke, I know what you mean! But he didn't go to school, yet, and we 
> didn't have a TV...I think he just *knew*.
> Dr. Christian Northrop teaches about the female brain, too. Her example is 
> that she and her, then, husband were flying somewhere and she noticed that 
> she was reading "Enriching the Mother/Daughter Relationship" and he was 
> reading "How to get the most out of your Band Saw."
> To bring art into this, I am sure you are familiar with the book,"Drawing 
> on the Right side of the Brain." Pretty fascinating, if one has time to 
> complicate one's life by experimenting with drawing things upside down.
> Energetically, if you want to engage both hemispheres, Brain Gym says to 
> "think of an X." And to relax the mind, think of two parallel lines.
>
> OK, I'm taking my parallel lines and heading to bed,
> Patty
>  ----- Original Message ----- 
>  From: Lynda Lambert
>  To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>  Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 1:48 PM
>  Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>
>
>  Patricia, I just finished reading the book "The Female Brain" by Luann 
> Brizendine, and OH, HOw I wish I had this wonderful information a long 
> time ago. Raising my brood of children would have been so much easier if I 
> had known these things about the differences between male and female 
> brains. And, my goodness, I would have been a much better teacher, too. I 
> would have a better understanding of my fellow human beings - but at least 
> I do understand a lot more about it now since reading this book. It was so 
> enlightening to me and I was telling my husband all about it as we would 
> ride along in the truck. One day he said to me, "I guess it is like this 
> conversation we are having right now in this truck."  This was his insight 
> as I was rapidly sharing so much information as he sat quietly 
> listening...lol  I said, "Yes, now I understand this conversation here in 
> this truck so much better."  We laughed.
>
>  Of course we are both crafters and artists - one feeds into the other. We 
> all begin somewhere - and for me, it begins with my mother taking an 
> afternoon to teach me how to do some embroidery stitches and to creat a 
> picture on a linen tea towel - I was probably 8 years old. Then, it 
> continues on with my precious neighbor taking an hour each morning, one 
> summer, to teach me how to read a pattern and how to sew a blouse, skirt, 
> and then an entire outfit - I was about 10. We learn from those around us, 
> and how lucky we were to have them in our life. What I do today, is an 
> homage to those women in my life so long ago. I celebrate them with  every 
> stitch  I make in my art these days. And, I say "thank you" to them for 
> giving me the beginnings of who I am today, and who I am becoming with 
> each new day and each new idea I work with.
>
>  Lynda
>
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Louann-Brizendine/e/B001H6RZB8/ref=sr_ntt_srch_lnk_1?qid=1391798400&sr=1-1
>    ----- Original Message ----- 
>    From: Patricia C. Estes
>    To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>    Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 1:26 PM
>    Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>
>
>    Hooray for "outrageous and for all of you for taking the time to 
> articulate these distinctions.
>    I absolutely agree and have been an artist and crafter simultaneously. 
> I am back to my art and love the discovery of it-but I will admit, my left 
> brain does like rules and instructions-but my Girl Brain is winning! (no 
> put down to Boy Brains, just a family joke).
>
>    Right on! Right on, Linda!
>    pece out
>      ----- Original Message ----- 
>      From: Lynda Lambert
>      To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>      Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 11:44 AM
>      Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>
>
>      Well, this is an outrageous conversation, I know. lol   I better get 
> back to the studio before I cause a riot, but this should be a good place 
> for a discussion like this.
>
>      That is great, Ann! So true. There is really not a fine line between 
> the two, it is very clear and distinct. And artist or a crafter can take 
> the exact same materials, but the mind that works with them is quite 
> different and the results are quite different. It's really about "ideas" 
> and "concepts" and what we are thinking about as we work, and where we go 
> with the materials in our process of working.  In Pittsburgh, PA there is 
> a very fine museum/gallery called the Society of Contemporary Crafts - 
> now, what is done there, and shown there is high art. So there is crafts 
> and there is CRAFT, too.  There is the "crafter" and there is the 
> "Craftsman."  very distinct differences between them - and as a sculptor 
> you would be very aware of this, too.
>
>      I was so fortunate to teach in a small private college (Geneva 
> College, in western PA)  where I was free to teach across disciplines, as 
> I have my MFA in painting/printmaking, and my MA in English Literature. 
> Because of this background, I was very marketable for a good position.  I 
> was able to create multi-discipline courses - alway a combination of 
> literature and art, as well as studio courses in painting, fiber arts, 
> printmaking, drawing. It was a dream of a job, working in 
> interdisciplinary studies and doing so many projects with profs in other 
> disciplines.  I was very active in conferences on interdisciplinary 
> studies.   I created an European experience for art and literature 
> students and we lived in Austria every summer and then traveled to other 
> countries. I even had an art exhibition in Austria for my students every 
> summer.  They worked so hard in the studio and out on location every day, 
> and at the end of the month they had a show - so much fun.  I also did 
> this with Puerto Rico, and students came to PR with me each spring as part 
> of their course in Puerto Rico Culture - which I have continued to visit 
> every March even though I am now retired. It bacame how we spent our 
> spring time.
>
>      OK, back to my studio where I am working my tail off to get a piece 
> done today!
>      Lynda
>        ----- Original Message ----- 
>        From: Ann at acunningham.com
>        To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>        Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 9:08 AM
>        Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>
>
>        Lynda, Nice answer to craft and art. If someone who is reading this 
> is still torn I wouldn't be surprised though since there are all sorts of 
> shades in the continuum.
>
>
>        I was talking to my daughter and a friend one day. I went off on a 
> tangent tangling all sorts of events together rather randomly. They 
> started laughing and saying something akin to how do you make it from day 
> to day. And I said you guys are pilots and for you to be a good pilot you 
> know and follow rules. That is what they pay you for. I am an artist and I 
> am paid to break the rules. No one wants to hear from me if it has already 
> been done.
>
>
>        What did you teach before you retired? Ann
>
>
>        Ann Cunningham
>        Tactile Art - a creative way to see the world!
>        303 238 4760
>        ann at acunningham.com
>        http://www.acunningham.com
>        http://www.sensationalbooks.com
>
>
>
>          -------- Original Message --------
>          Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>          From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>          Date: Fri, February 07, 2014 6:03 am
>          To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>          <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>
>          ?
>          Hi Laurie,
>          So nice to see you here.  I did not start this group though, I am 
> like you, I just came on to ask a question about something I needed to 
> know and was so glad to meet Ann who helped me with my question.  I am 
> furiously working right now (oops, split that infinitive!) getting work 
> done for the opening of a two-person exhibition at a museum - the show is 
> called _Vision and Revision:  Two artists with limited sight, not limited 
> vision_  It is my pottery and mixed-media fiber works, and a legally blind 
> painter. It opens one month from today, and if I stop to think about what 
> else has to be done yet, I'll get nervous. So, I won't do that, but just 
> will keep on working on the details. The show will appear at two locations 
> this year and will have a video that plays in the gallery with the art 
> works, Braille labeling, and artist's talks. I will even be teaching in 
> the gallery one afternoon, for the Women in the Arts course at Geneva 
> College. That is where I taught when I was a professor of fine arts and 
> humanities, before I retired. I'll be lecturing on the historical context 
> of my work and where the ideas have come from when creating it.
>
>          To make matters even more difficult, I am scheduled to speak at a 
> conference at Slippery Rock University of PA for two sessions, the day 
> before we hang our show. So, I have those presentations to be working on 
> every day now, too.  I officially retired from teaching 5 1/2 years ago, 
> but I am still very much involved in everything but being in the 
> classroom.
>
>          Here is my response to the question you have asked. The gap 
> between an artist and a crafter is like crossing the ocean, it is that 
> wide. Some basic things may be similar between the two, but most things 
> are very far apart philisophically.
>
>          Both work with the hands, and both love working with the hands 
> and most have done it all their life.
>          Both love the materials, and the handling of them, and the 
> satisfaction of the finished product that comes out of it.
>
>          While the crafter will usually be satisfied with beginning 
> something and knowing where the end will be, the artist begins with no 
> notion of where the end will be or even if it will be.  the crafter has a 
> clearly defined path to the finished product. The artist has only some 
> inklings of possible outcomes, but has to find them as she works.
>
>          The other very big thing I see as a difference between them is 
> that the crafter has 'rules" to follow and seldom will ever deviate from 
> those rules, as they are set in stone in her mind. On the other hand, the 
> mature artist has learned that there are no rules at all.  They may begin 
> in the early stages by learning techniques, but eventually with the years 
> of working, the light comes on in her brain when she discovers one day - 
> she is free of all rules when making art. Everything can be challenged, 
> everything can be changed, and everything is fair game, for the artist. Is 
> there any other profession in this world where there are no rules? It's 
> the most exhilerating feeling to know that there are absolutely no rules 
> whatsoever for me. Wow, makes me take a deep breath just to say it. Free, 
> free, free, at last!
>
>          Laurie, the biggest difference between art and a craft is where 
> the person eventually takes the techniques, I think.
>
>          A crafter seldom takes things to a different level but is usually 
> content to learn something then duplicate it endlessly, then moves on to 
> learn something else and does that again with it. The artist can take 
> crafts materials (which is what you and I both do) and techniques, and 
> then take them far beyond because they will combine their techniques and 
> materials with the imagination.  If you can teach it, it is usually a 
> craft. If you cannot teach it, it is normally art.  Art can begin by 
> learning some techniques, or using craft materials, but then the person 
> begins to ask the "what if" questions, and takes lots of risks, failures, 
> and bends in the road on the way to it becoming a work of art. It is a 
> "mind set" that is never satisfied with just the learning of something 
> new, but one that constantly questions, experiments, and never knows where 
> the "end" will be, or even if it will be.  A "crafter" will never 
> understand what I have just said and will most likely be huffing and 
> puffing and angry with it.  An "artist" is standing and applauding what I 
> have said. It is that simple, and that complex.  The artist thrives on 
> change and making new discoveries and each work leads to other querstions 
> and more change and more new discoveries.
>
>          One can see the difference when you look at work in types of 
> environments.  One will be setting at a craft show with a table full of 
> things that are basically all the same while the other will have work  on 
> display in a gallery or museum.  Each has decided where they "fit" and 
> each is very happy with where they are. They are different animals, with 
> different ideas, and different end results and outcomes. Each one has 
> decided their own path and each one is comfortable with the decision she 
> has made.
>
>          Lynda
>
>          Lynda
>
>
>            ----- Original Message ----- 
>            From: Laurie Porter
>            To: Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>            Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2014 7:26 PM
>            Subject: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>
>
>            Hi Folks:
>
>            I?d like to introduce myself. I?m a blind person from wisconsin 
> who is a fledgling and budding beginner artist. my medium is beadwork. I 
> make pictures and tapestries out of tiny little seed beads  sewn together 
> with thread. but most of my work is in making jewlry, but I have always 
> looked upon my beadwork as an art form.
>
>            so, I have a basic question. What is the difference between an 
> art and a craft? I do believe that all crafts are forms of art  but are 
> all arts considered crafts? Thanks linda and all of you for getting this 
> list going as it is something I?ve always dreamed of seeing in our efforts 
> to bring blind people together who love to both create and appreciate the 
> visual arts.
>
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