[blindkid] Guide dogs for twelve year olds?
Richard Holloway
rholloway at gopbc.org
Thu Jan 21 07:09:00 UTC 2010
Now you are on entirely different subject matter. This may be a case
of very poor execution of a potentially good idea. That aspect of this
story sounds tragic indeed; I am sorry to hear these details, but that
doesn't mean that some kids under 16 could not benefit from similar
but properly handled placements in certain situations.
If there is a successful program of this (or some similar) nature in
Montreal, this would tend to underscore the possibility of this being
potentially successful. I have no doubt that given the right
opportunity and situation, there are some teens (of whatever
reasonable age and maturity level and leaving that subject to future
debate) being well served by such guide dogs.
Does anyone have more information about the program in Montreal? I'd
love to read more about it.
Thanks,
Richard
On Jan 20, 2010, at 10:18 PM, Heather wrote:
> What is frustrating is that the school in question has a poor track
> record of placing successful adult teams, and now they want to give
> dogs to twelve year olds? They place dogs who have been returned
> for medical reasons with new handlers. They give dogs to sixty year
> old women who have others play with and relieve their dogs for them,
> who cannot control their dogs and never walk further than from their
> front door to the door of a waiting car. They place dogs riddled
> with cancer with handlers, only to have the dogs die months later,
> and they are going to start placing with children? I really hope
> not. Now, there is a program, I don't know too much about in
> Montreal that places guides with young teens, but that is a far
> different situation in terms of the culture, the insane trafic, the
> public transit, and therefore the need is different and greater, for
> blind teens to have dogs in that situation.
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter Donahue" <pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net
> >
> To: "NFBnet Blind Kid Mailing List,(for parents of blind children)" <blindkid at nfbnet.org
> >
> Sent: Wednesday, January 20, 2010 5:10 PM
> Subject: Re: [blindkid] Guide dogs for twelve year olds?
>
>
>> Hello again everyone,
>>
>> These are issues with fixes. One of my biggest complaints with
>> our guide
>> dog programs is their failure to connect new teams with successful
>> graduates
>> or guide dog handlers in the person's home community. Any guide dog
>> program
>> wanting to provide dogs to blind children must insist on family
>> involvement.
>> This could include required workshops for the families of children
>> pared
>> with guide dogs. Like adult guide dog users blind children and their
>> families would benefit by being connected with other parents with
>> blind
>> children who use guide dogs to facilitate mentoring and help foster
>> a better
>> understanding of the role of the child and the parents where
>> responsibilities associated with the care and use of such dogs is
>> concerned.
>> The NOPBC has promoted mentorship among its members, parents, and
>> educators
>> of blind children to address other aspects of raising and educating
>> a blind
>> child. Any guide dog program created to provide dogs to blind
>> children and
>> teens would do well to adopt this model and require all families to
>> participate. This is another reason why I would like to see such a
>> program
>> operated by guide dog users for guide dog users and their families.
>>
>> Peter Donahue
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Heather" <craney07 at rochester.rr.com
>> >
>> To: "NFBnet Blind Kid Mailing List,(for parents of blind children)"
>> <blindkid at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Wednesday, January 20, 2010 12:46 PM
>> Subject: Re: [blindkid] Guide dogs for twelve year olds?
>>
>>
>> It is all well and good to go with your dog and your mommy to the
>> vet's
>> office, but to be the one to make all medical decissions about the
>> dog must
>> be the responsibility of the handler. You sound very knowledgable
>> about
>> dogs, but what of the twelve year old who has to defy his parents
>> and refuse
>> a vaccine and insist on a tyder, or who must tell his parents that
>> they are
>> not allowed to give it table scraps, when they keep doing that? Do
>> you
>> really think the parents will listen? Hell no. I know blind
>> adults who
>> have to limit their parents' or family's interactions with their
>> dog or move
>> out, because they can not respect the guide dog handler
>> relationship. Also,
>> it is so much more than feeding, it is selecting a human grade dog
>> food,.
>> It is more than brushing the dog, it is improvising a make-shift
>> water-proof
>> bandage out of a scrunchy, a sock and a condom, for a severely
>> gushing cut
>> paw on the street. It is not just picking up poop, it is being
>> mature
>> enough to notice and keep track of the consistancy and odor of
>> stool, to be
>> aware of potential illness, , or having the wherewithall to clean
>> up an
>> accident without help, in a public place. It is not about doing
>> simple
>> obediants, it is about being able to defend your dog when ignorant
>> people
>> think you are abusing the dog for giving it a leash correction, or
>> that it
>> is misbehaving by taking you across a lawn, when the side walk is
>> blocked.
>> It is about being able to diplomatically gain access to an Indian
>> restaurant
>> when the owners are upset by the dog's presence. It is about being
>> able to
>> scream right back at an ignorant cabbie and call the police on your
>> cell
>> phone and refuse to move, while you wait for them, even when the
>> cabbie is
>> pushing on your bags and yelling at you to get out of their cab.
>> It is so
>> much more than raising a goat for 4H, or taking your show dog through
>> adjility or confirmation trials.
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Doreen Frappier" <dcfrappier at yahoo.com
>> >
>> To: " (for parents of blind children)NFBnet Blind Kid Mailing List"
>> <blindkid at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Wednesday, January 20, 2010 9:40 AM
>> Subject: Re: [blindkid] Guide dogs for twelve year olds?
>>
>>
>> I am not opposed to having responsible 12 year olds own and care
>> for a guide
>> dog. I believe that children mature at different rates. For
>> example, 4-H
>> children own and care for animals (on their own) at very young
>> ages. They
>> are responsible for feeding and caring for that animal. One of my
>> children,
>> (sighted) is 13, and has been the sole trainer of a dog since she
>> was 9
>> years old. She has won many awards and competitions with her dog,
>> including
>> adult dog shows. She is responsible for feeding and caring for that
>> dog.
>> When the dog gets her check ups at the vet, she comes to the vets
>> office.
>> It's true, a young person can not take care of the expenses of a
>> guide dog,
>> but I am all for training teaching blind children to be independent
>> as early
>> as possible. I think each situation is different. I am not aware of
>> everything that goes into caring for and owning a guide dog, but I
>> think
>> some children are capable and should not be excluded because of
>> age.
>>
>> Doreen
>>
>> --- On Wed, 1/20/10, Heather <craney07 at rochester.rr.com> wrote:
>>
>> From: Heather <craney07 at rochester.rr.com>
>> Subject: [blindkid] Guide dogs for twelve year olds?
>> To: "NFBnet Blind Kid Mailing List, (for parents of blind children)"
>> <blindkid at nfbnet.org>
>> Date: Wednesday, January 20, 2010, 7:22 AM
>>
>> I just wanted to get some feedback on this from some parents of blind
>> children and teens. I, personally, was absolutely apalled to hear
>> that a
>> local guide dog school, not mentioning names *coughs* Freedom guide
>> Dogs
>> *Coughs* has preposed a program to place guide dogs with twelve
>> year olds.
>> All of the other schools in the US accept teens no younger than
>> sixteen or
>> eighteen years of age, depending on the school, but twelve? I am
>> happy to
>> note that at present, no O and M instructors, parents or twelve
>> year olds
>> have contacted the school to enquire about this program, but I am
>> dreading
>> the day. This makes a mockery of those exceptional blind teens who
>> are, at
>> sixteen or seventeen, responsible enough, committed enough and have
>> demanding enough schedules to properly care for, utalize and
>> actually need a
>> guide dog. At what age would you consider supporting your teen in
>> researching guide dog schools? At what age would you support them
>> actually
>> submitting applications? How old would you want your teen to be
>> before
>> actually being placed with a guide dog? Do you think that you would
>> have the
>> blunt honesty to deny your support of your child getting a dog
>> guide, if
>> they were not emotionally, mentally, etc capable of utalizing a
>> guide dog,
>> at that time in their life? Do you think that you could restrain
>> yourself
>> from taking care of the dog, interacting with the dog, or doing
>> things that
>> would undermine the ownership of the dog by your blind teen,
>> acknowledging
>> their sole ownership and responsibility for the dog, even if you,
>> as their
>> mother or father still have all other rule-making power in the
>> house-hold?
>> Finally, would you ever, honestly let your twelve year old apply
>> for a guide
>> dog? I just felt this should be brought to the list's attention.
>> Just me
>> personally, I would not encourage my blind teen to start
>> researching guide
>> dog schools until age fourteen or fifteen, and I would not
>> allow them to apply to schools until they were at least fifteen,
>> and that
>> is assuming that they are emotionally ready to deal with the
>> demands of a
>> guide dog, such as handeling an emergency vet situation, mentally
>> able to
>> care for the dog, such as, researching and selecting safe toys,
>> effective
>> medications and appropriate foods, mature enough to deal with the
>> social
>> implications, such as access issues, and that they actually had a
>> need, not
>> just a want for a guide dog, due to a challenging travel area or
>> complex and
>> demanding schedule of activities and classes. Please share your
>> thoughts.
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>>
>>
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