[blindkid] computers as school credit

Mary Donahue braille at satx.rr.com
Sun Sep 16 14:39:56 UTC 2012


Hello Pat and everyone,

	I agree both with my husband and Arielle that discovery and learning
from a mentor are some of the best ways to learn when it comes to access
technology. Here are some cases in point:

	Back in 1984, I learned to use BrailleEdit and an apple computer by
going through the BrailleEdit instruction manual, which I transcribed myself
with the help of a co-worker and a Dictaphone machine. My supervisor at the
time was tech-savvy, but was going through kidney dialysis three times a
week, but could still be reached by phone even though he was off site.

	In 1987, I took a computer course at St. Edwards University in
Austin, Texas. We did not have a computer, so I did all of my assignments at
the Texas Library for the Blind. There were two technology instructors there
who helped out, but encouraged me to figure things out on my own, too.

	In 1993, I started using a Braille 'n' Speak 640, and also mainly
taught myself by studying the instruction manual although at that year's NFB
convention, I went to a Braille ''n' Speak seminar sponsored by the NFB in
Computer Science Division, which also helped out.

	In 1998, when my husband got a new computer, I used his old one when
I could, which wasn't much. However, in 1999, I received another computer,
which I started using by going through some of the programs on my own. I
also studied JAWS tutorials and Windows manuals every chance I could.
Luckily, I had a tech-savvy husband who is more so than I am, and who
encouraged me to discover. 

	I did not actually start going online until 2005, but made myself do
it it if I wanted to find out anything new. Most of our documents at work
are online through an Intranet portal, and I am still learning new things
about the portal, too. One example is our weekly newsletter. If I want to
keep up with what is going on at work, I have to go on the online portal.
The leave requests are filled out through the portal, and thanks to my help,
a couple of technology personnel were able to adjust the leave requests so I
could read them and fill them out accurately with JAWS.

	Lasst fall, I had to get a new computer that had Windows 7. I am
still learning Windows 7, but am getting used to it, but it's coming along.
I am also currently using a Pac Mate with a 40-cell Braille display. I am
not perfect with the Pac Mate, but know enough to be comfortable to use what
I want to use.

	Need I say more? All I can say through encouragement is do what you
can to encourage your blind child to discover on his/her own. These examples
I provided are not to put down anyone.

	All the best for a great day!

Mary Donahue


-----Original Message-----
From: blindkid-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindkid-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
Behalf Of Pat Renfranz
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2012 8:29 PM
To: NFBnet Blind Kid Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindkid] computers as school credit

I regret falling to temptation, but I am indeed offended, Mr. Donohue. You
have no right to imply that I have not taught my blind child.

Do you and Ms. Silverman think our utilizing the IEP to achieve special
education goals is inappropriate? What do you know about my child? Believe
me, we did pull in blind tech users to help with training and there's been a
computer at home with JAWS, and all the other bells and whistles, that she
was not interested in using. And perhaps you don't realize that there are
families that don't have computers with JAWS at home and have poorly-trained
TVIs who have no idea how to get that blind child on the computer, so our
pushing the system a bit might help with another child.

This thread was starting by a parent whose very bright child is failing a
tech course. Something needs to be done now, and, in my opinion, not by
throwing him in a pool and telling him to swim.

Sometimes, I think the NFB has a very bad attitude towards parents. Sorry,
but that's my 2.
pat




On 9/15/12 5:02 PM, "Peter Donahue" <pdonahue2 at satx.rr.com> wrote:

> Hello everyone,
> 
> For Arielle Silverman amen, amen, and amen. Parents are a sighted 
> child's first teacher. it needs to be the same way for blind children.
> 
> Peter Donahue
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Traci Wilkerson" <traci.renee27 at gmail.com>
> To: "Blind Kid Mailing List,(for parents of blind children)"
> <blindkid at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2012 4:37 PM
> Subject: Re: [blindkid] computers as school credit
> 
> 
> I understand your question Arielle, but I know my kids are young and 
> we already experience time crunch now at 5 and 7 after school, by the 
> time we get home, let the kids chill and play for a bit, do homework 
> (which can take sometimes an hour if its a battle), make dinner and its
then bedtime.
> I'm sure older kids may have some more time but I'm sure homework also 
> takes longer.  I would love to do more tech with my kids but I also 
> want them to enjoy being kids.  They have computer lab time at school, 
> so in my eyes the school needs to be teaching them the skills they 
> need at that time.  They shouldn't be sitting there letting someone 
> click through screens "pretending" my child is doing something on 
> their own.  Yes, we have already had this.  So if they are in the 
> class, yes! the school should be teaching it in a way relevant to what 
> they need.  No excuses for them not too.
> 
> Traci
> On Sep 15, 2012 5:26 PM, "Arielle Silverman" <arielle71 at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> Hi all,
>> Forgive me for beating a dead horse, but I  just don't understand why 
>> we are waiting on school personnel who aren't very tech-savvy to 
>> teach blind kids JAWS when the JAWS program has excellent user 
>> documentation, enabling any blind student to learn JAWS on their own?
>> Why are blind kids having to do a boring tech tutorial at school when 
>> they could be playing online games, using Facebook or looking up cool 
>> things on the Internet at home, like their sighted peers are?
>> I believe that the way a sighted child first learns to use the 
>> computer is by sitting down in front of it and looking around the 
>> screen, eventually learning to identify the different icons, the 
>> start menu, programs on the desktop, etc. A blind child can learn the 
>> exact same way. Turn on JAWS, have them sit down and press the tab 
>> key, or arrow around the desktop, so they can hear all the different 
>> programs that are available to them. Have them open up a program like 
>> Word, tell them to press the Alt key and they will be able to hear 
>> all the different options located in the menus or ribbons.
>> JAWS is not much more complicated than using Windows as a sighted 
>> person. If a sighted person wants to move around the screen, they use 
>> the mouse; the JAWS user presses Tab or the arrow keys. If the 
>> sighted person wants to click something, they click the mouse; the 
>> blind person presses the Enter key. There are more advanced keyboard 
>> commands that a blind computer user can eventually memorize so they 
>> don't have to go looking all around the screen, but these more 
>> advanced commands aren't necessary for basic computer use. A blind 
>> student who has basic computer knowledge, gained from exploration, 
>> should be able to learn the more advanced commands independently from 
>> a tutorial.
>> I learned JAWS twenty years ago when computers still used command 
>> prompts and were much less user-friendly than they are today. Plus, 
>> there wasn't much funn stuff to be done on the computer then, like 
>> there is today. With all  the free screen reader options out 
>> nowadays, I just don't understand why any blind child is not 
>> technology-literate. Why wait for a student to fail a computer course 
>> when so many self-teaching opportunities exist at home?
>> Perhaps there are some kids who don't have the motivation or 
>> attention span to self-teach technology, but I suspect that will be a 
>> minority of students. Why not have them start on their own, and then 
>> ask the school to help if they get stuck?
>> If there is something I am missing please let me know. I do not 
>> intend to offend anyone, but I really just want to better understand 
>> what the issue is and why parents aren't able to address it on their own.
>> Best,
>> Arielle
>> 
>> On 9/15/12, Pat Renfranz <dblair2525 at msn.com> wrote:
>>> Hi Rosina,
>>> My daughter was in a similar boat: sluggish tech training, required 
>>> computer tech class, etc. One thing we did to force the issue was to 
>>> use the
>> course
>>> requirements to lay out what had to be done by the TVI during the 
>>> year,
>> and
>>> put those as goals in the IEP. The goals were very specific. The 
>>> tech teacher was great at making sure the TVI knew the material and 
>>> knew what needed to be taught. The district, knowing the TVI did not 
>>> have the
>> skills,
>>> purchased training materials to lead the TVI step by step; the 
>>> materials were from a company called DeWitt and Associates. I have 
>>> no idea if this
>> is
>>> the best stuff out there (probably not!) and it was boring as heck 
>>> for my daughter, but it got her through the class. Because working 
>>> through this took some time (why should anything be worked out 
>>> before the school year start?), the teacher allowed my daughter to 
>>> work on the class into the
>> next
>>> semester.
>>> pat
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On 9/13/12 3:56 PM, "Rosina Solano" <colemangirly at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Okay, so I just got a notice that my 9th grader is failing computer 
>>>> applications and it is a required course.  WOW, possibly because 
>>>> they haven't taught him ANY computer or tech skills at all.  And 
>>>> here is the
>> clincher,
>>>> if
>>>> he does fail it, he has to repeat it next year.  Gee, if they don't 
>>>> give him the education to use JAWS and such I don't think it will 
>>>> matter how many times he repeats it.
>>>> 
>>>> Maybe this will be the sign that I am not the only one who knows 
>>>> that they should be teaching him technology. Sigh
>>>> 
>>>> Rosina Foster
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
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