[blindkid] Subject: Original Sin

Sat Jul 22 15:16:16 UTC 2017

SPAM!! Admin needs to remove

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jul 22, 2017, at 9:39 AM, Bill Dengler via blindkid <blindkid at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> +1
> 
>> On Jul 22, 2017, at 1:17 PM, Penny Duffy via blindkid <blindkid at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> 
>> I am thinking this was posted in error as it's not on topic.
>> 
>> On Sat, Jul 22, 2017, 9:05 AM Bob Evans via blindkid <blindkid at nfbnet.org>
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> Hello, thank you for your response. I just would like to append
>>> further assertions. Based on your stark reluctance to tackle any of my
>>> theological challenges, it is considered an implicit defeatism for
>>> your camp. Protestants are not more than mere servants to Zionism. And
>>> as for your Christology devotion, it is considerably undistinguished.
>>> Your endorsement to the apartheid Zionist state is intrinsically
>>> inalienable. Thence, our duty is to incessantly engage with you in
>>> relentless combat missions until your party is perfectly discomfited.
>>> Your ministry doesn’t base its tenets on nothing but an oblique hope
>>> of a theoretical scheme of salvation. The assumption that someone
>>> could have died for your sin is substantially Laputan and
>>> consequently, it is unlikely to be rectifiable. In Trump’s damnable
>>> era, your state of dismay has just started. Americanisation is quite
>>> fragile and its global leadership is about to diminish. Your oval
>>> office is  rotten to the core. Jews have constantly been dominating
>>> your denomination since Martin Luther era and even earlier to that
>>> time. There are many Muslims whom I knew have abandoned Islam to
>>> Christianity. Nevertheless, I never fathomed the relationship between
>>> becoming Christian, residing in the States and endorsing Zionists. I
>>> wish you have got sufficient courage to tackle this challenge in the
>>> slightest. I urge you to ponder properly on what I proposed. If you
>>> ever perceived the demand to clarify what might be vague to you,
>>> kindly, keep me notified. Best wishes, Bob
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On 7/21/17, Marty Purvis <wuas at wake-up.org> wrote:
>>>> Hello Mostafa:
>>>> 
>>>> Thank you for your email.
>>>> 
>>>> Our views on religious matters are very far apart.
>>>> So far, that further discussion would most likely be fruitless.
>>>> 
>>>> Sincerely,
>>>> Larry Wilson
>>>> 
>>>> On Thu, Jul 20, 2017 at 4:21 PM, Contact Page Message <
>>>> postmaster at wake-up.org> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> From: Mostafa, technically Bob <ebob824 at gmail.com>
>>>>> Subject: Original Sin
>>>>> 
>>>>> Visitor's Message:
>>>>> Hello. I am Mostafa Almahdy. Bob Evans is just a technical name. I used
>>>>> to
>>>>> be called so when I worked at an American call centre here in Cairo. So,
>>>>> it
>>>>> is still my name. In the subsequent segment, I’ll present the Christian
>>>>> narrative of Original Sin in addition to posing crucial queries and
>>>>> denotative rebuttals. What is Original Sin in Christianity? It is a sin
>>>>> said to be inherited by all descendants of Adam. When Adam and Eve
>>>>> sinned,
>>>>> death entered to the world. Thence, God demanded to be paid to redeem
>>>>> humanity. He then sacrificed his only begotten son to ransom us. This
>>>>> account may ostensibly seem to be reasonable. Be that as it may, it
>>>>> contains major defects. First of which, it portrays the divine with
>>>>> imperfection. It doesn’t recognise his omnipotence. Why? Because
>>>>> according
>>>>> to this theology, he demanded to be paid in order to redeem. At its
>>>>> inception, I have couple of questions for clergy. First, has Adam been
>>>>> destined to be eternal in Eden? Second, when he committed his ever first
>>>>> sin, why hasn’t he been given one chance to repent? Third, when Adam ate
>>>>> from the tree of knowing good and evil, he became like God according to
>>>>> Genesis. A question here, has he been punished because he became aware
>>> of
>>>>> good and evil? It is assumed that he didn’t know good and evil until he
>>>>> ate
>>>>> from the tree of knowing good and evil. So, how could God punish an
>>>>> innocent? And as for sin inheritance, if a man and a woman committed
>>>>> adultery, could we possibly hold their child accountable for what they
>>>>> have
>>>>> done? This is the precise logic exploited in Christian concept of
>>>>> Original
>>>>> Sin. And as for redemption and forfeiture, if God was paid to redeem,
>>> how
>>>>> could he still forgive? If I supposedly wounded someone, does he has the
>>>>> right to retaliate? Yes, he certainly does. And, if he wanted to forgive
>>>>> me, could he still retaliate? No, he surely couldn’t. It’s either
>>>>> forgiveness or retaliation, it couldn’t be both. And as for Christ, how
>>>>> could an innocent bear the guilty’s iniquity? According to traditional
>>>>> Christian theology, death entered to the world when Adam and Eve sinned.
>>>>> Therefore, someone had to die for this. He had to be impeccant and, he
>>>>> had
>>>>> to die forever. Christians preach that Jesus is the one who paid for
>>>>> this.
>>>>> The question is, did he die forever? According to Christian story, he
>>>>> died
>>>>> for three days. Well actually, he died for less than that if you think
>>> of
>>>>> it a bit. Jesus’s date of Crucifixion and resurrection differs from
>>>>> gospel
>>>>> to another. Please, don’t take my word for this. I urge you to just
>>> check
>>>>> John nineteen and Mark fifteen. Most Christians today believe that Jesus
>>>>> died on a Friday afternoon and risen on a fine Easter Sunday morning. As
>>>>> for Adventists, they do not believe in this. They even have their
>>> Sabbath
>>>>> held on Saturday. Christian innovation of Original Sin is remarkably
>>>>> exposed. I urge southern laity and their associates to genuinely ponder
>>>>> on
>>>>> the scenario encountered in Christian theology. If Adam sinned and we
>>>>> were
>>>>> contagiously destined to be anathematised eternally, why didn’t Jesus
>>> die
>>>>> forever then? I believe that my points are critical and thus, they
>>>>> deserve
>>>>> thorough attention. It is a bit odd to just rely on the thought that
>>>>> someone theoretically died for my sins and then, go do whatever I want.
>>>>> We
>>>>> bear witness western Christians who basically don’t care about what they
>>>>> do. They eat explicitly prohibited cattle, they vastly consume alcoholic
>>>>> beverages and they carelessly engage in illicit wedlock. Where is your
>>>>> devotional consignment? Religious life is the last thing a lay western
>>>>> Christian wants to think of. I respectfully ask you to ponder on your
>>>>> religious responsibility. As a Muslim, what prevents me from having a
>>>>> girlfriend? Well, nothing but my religion which holds me fully
>>>>> accountable
>>>>> for either righteous or vicious deeds. Why Christian tradition is so
>>>>> tolerant with the culture of boyfriend and girlfriend illicit
>>>>> relationships? As you can see, despite the concept’s fraudulently
>>>>> emotional
>>>>> prettification, it is besieged with numerously irreconcilable
>>>>> discrepancies. This is the primary tenet upon which your whole faith is
>>>>> based, this is indeed the backbone of Christianity. If someone disagrees
>>>>> with this statement,  well, tell me then, how could the account of
>>>>> Crucifixion and Redemption be presented without basing it on the
>>>>> Christian
>>>>> concept of Original Sin? I seriously attempt to fathom. I do not intend
>>>>> to
>>>>> deride or ridicule. I am totally convinced that Christians have absolute
>>>>> right to broadly proselytize, to keenly call for their faith. Yes, they
>>>>> have the right to do so on one condition. I urge them to refrain from
>>>>> using
>>>>> fallacious rhetoric in their dialog. It just makes their stance quite
>>>>> attenuated and thus, susceptible  to easily crumble under critical
>>>>> scrutiny. I am prepared to be christened if someone convinced me with
>>>>> plain
>>>>> reasonableness that what you believe is the truth. I do not give credit
>>>>> to
>>>>> Christian portraiture of original sin. Now, if you want to convince
>>>>> someone
>>>>> to become Christian, you have got to explain this mystery to him. For
>>>>> some
>>>>> reason, it seems to be unexplainable to me. It looks like as if someone
>>>>> worked it out or made it up. So basically, I feel it is quite perturbing
>>>>> to  conjointly destine our whole human species to hell for no fault of
>>>>> its
>>>>> own. However, some pastors tend to baffle between holding the innocent
>>>>> versus the guilty accountable, either instigants or actual actors.
>>> Pastor
>>>>> Jacob of Michigan believes that instigants are not to be held
>>>>> accountable.
>>>>> Who is an instigant?                      An instigant is someone who
>>>>> deliberately foments trouble. So, if hateful pastors provoked mass
>>> Muslim
>>>>> offence that led to broad outrage, they are basically held accountable
>>>>> for
>>>>> any casualty or fatality rate. Similarly, if Muslim clerics caused hate
>>>>> because of their radical speech, they are wholly held accountable for
>>> any
>>>>> erupted tension  in the community. So, statutorily, instigants are
>>>>> equally
>>>>> held accountable just as actual actors. So, if a girl who is absolutely
>>>>> gorgeous wore a staggeringly provocative outfit to purposely beguile
>>> men,
>>>>> she is partly held accountable for the lust she consciously instigated.
>>>>> It
>>>>> seems that    fibbers and  chisellers are not willing to address the
>>>>> subject of Original Sin fairly. They tend to breach with decisive facts.
>>>>> Therefore, their theology is incessantly subjected to critical
>>> criticism.
>>>>> Some of them even asked me, whether we as Muslims are sure we are going
>>>>> to
>>>>> heaven. I wouldn’t ever assure I am going to heaven unless with
>>>>> providential amnesty. I would say it is unjustified pride if I ever
>>>>> thought I am absolutely going to heaven. It just contradicts with
>>>>> enjoined
>>>>> humility. Islam teaches us to be pious and to devote ourselves to doing
>>>>> good deeds. I on multiple occasions attempted to establish a mutually
>>>>> deferential dialog with southern pastors. Nevertheless, they failed to
>>>>> comply to this. Their level of timidity did not match with my
>>>>> expectations.
>>>>> I tell them, if you ever wanted to learn about Islam, it is not an
>>>>> encouraging motive to obliviously quote oriental literature. First off,
>>>>> you
>>>>> desperately demand to develop proper command of Arabic. Moreover, your
>>>>> prejudicial notion doesn’t do more than substantiating your
>>> unprecedented
>>>>> nescience. If Original Sin wasn’t the fundamental belief of
>>> Christianity,
>>>>> it would have not been used to constitute its doctrinal tenets. I
>>> civilly
>>>>> postulate this theological conversation because I am quite interested in
>>>>> comparative theology. For each faith, there are fundamental tenets. I
>>>>> challengingly assert that without Original Sin, Christianity would have
>>>>> not
>>>>> ever existed. For emotional motives, the idea that someone died in the
>>>>> cause of your salvation is quite appealing. However, as we saw, it has
>>>>> many
>>>>> defects if it is to be illustrated in moderately rational disposal. I
>>>>> await
>>>>> to hear pastoral response. But please, we do not need to either
>>>>> equivocate
>>>>> nor unconscionably philosophise the matter. It rather has to be
>>>>> simplified
>>>>> in a rationally straightforward manner. Beating around the bush has
>>>>> intemperately fell at the first hurdle. Thank you for reading, Mostafa,
>>>>> technically Bob Evans.
>>>>> 
>>>>> --
>>>>> This e-mail was sent from the "Contact US" page on Wake Up America
>>>>> Seminars
>>>>> (https://www.wake-up.org/contact-us/)
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
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