[blindlaw] ADA and Air Travel

Steve P. Deeley stevep.deeley at insightbb.com
Thu Dec 3 02:26:32 UTC 2009


Yeah, I would talk with the executives of that particular airline and let 
them know that if you can't come to some of agreement, you will litigate. 
Maybe some free trips would be nice or, at least, an apology!!

Steve
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "James Weisberg" <jimi-law at dc.rr.com>
To: "'NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List'" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 8:28 PM
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] ADA and Air Travel


> This incident was NOTHING.  With my first dog I was asked after taking my
> seat if my dog had a "license" to be on the plane.  Of course I knew this
> was absurd.  The stew in this particular case was Asian and it was 
> apparent
> to me (still had some vision at the time) she had some cultural issues 
> going
> on.  Anyways, same situation;  I ask to speak with the supervisor who 
> comes
> over and backs up his staff.  I tell him to blow off (keep in mind I am
> litigating in civil court all the time).  A short while passes when 
> several
> people obviously from the airline ask me to exit my seat (which by the way
> was a bulkhead seat, i.e., in front of all the passengers)and come with
> them.  They removed me from the plane and took me with my Guide Dog out 
> into
> the breezeway where the airline biggie took out a manual and found a
> regulation to show me indicating if I was asked for identification the
> service animal was indeed a service animal I was required to produce it.
> Unfortunately, once again the staff was untrained and after producing the
> "card" issued me by Guide Dogs was let back on the plane to my seat. 
> Asked
> for a license but only really needed to show proof of the fact the dog was 
> a
> service animal.  Pathetic.  Didn't sue then but vowed I wouldn't be pushed
> around in the future.
>
> James W. Weisberg, Esq.
>
> Law Office of J. William Weisberg
>
> 299 South Patencio Road #3
>
> Palm Springs, California  92262
>
> V:  916.425.1010
>
> F:  916.374.7667
>
> E-Mail:  jimi-law at dc.rr.com
>
> Admitted in Wisconsin
>
> Nationwide Practice Limited to Immigration Removal Defense & Civil Rights
> Advocacy for Children with Diabetes
>
> This message contains information which may be confidential and 
> privileged.
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> Weisberg
> expects the recipient will independently evaluate this information in
> accordance with this disclaimer.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of WB
> Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 3:14 PM
> To: 'NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] ADA and Air Travel
>
> After reading this detail, the earlier e-mails you sent now make sense to
> me.
>
> That's very sad that those attendants were not in line with whatever
> training they received.  I'm sure they had to have had some and from what
> you say, it doesn't seem like they put any of it into practice.
>
> Has the airline powers that be turned their noses up to your requests for
> information on their training program or requests for some type of being
> made whole?
>
> I'm curious as I've never experienced anything to the level of which you
> speak.
>
> Thanks for sharing.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of James Weisberg
> Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 5:09 PM
> To: 'NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] ADA and Air Travel
>
> In retrospect it's actually kind of funny although at the time it wasn't. 
> I
> travel with a Guide Dog.  So, as it was discussed in this thread, I made
> advance arrangements to be seated in the "bulkhead" seat which affords 
> more
> foot space so the dog can be in a position whereby she is not entirely on 
> my
> feet nor the feet of the person next to me.  No problem.  When I get to 
> the
> airport to check in I get assistance to the gate since the dog has yet to
> learn to read much to my consternation.  When I get to the gate I check in
> and inform the attendant about the Guide Dog and confirm the placement in
> the bulkhead seat.  At this time I also inquire if the plane is full,
> sometimes it is not, as in this instance.  I inform the attendant they may
> wish to juggle the passengers around and leave the seat next to me empty 
> so
> they do not have a paying passenger with a dog on their legs for the 
> entire
> trip.  Never had a problem when put in these terms.  I also inform them 
> the
> window seat is necessary to keep the dog from sticking into the isle.  So 
> a
> window, bulkhead seat with and empty seat next to me is ideal for me, the
> dog, and the passenger who would otherwise be seated next to me.
>
> Get on the plane and in my window bulk head seat which has been assigned 
> to
> me along with leaving the seat next to me empty which was arranged at the
> gate.  I am traveling with a cat in a container which I have paid to bring
> on the plane and immediately after taking my seat I place the cat 
> container
> in the seat next to me to get "situated."  As soon as I am seated I am
> confronted by a stew who says I will have to change seats to another row;
> non bulkhead.  I think it was the cat container b/c the rules I believe 
> are
> it has to be placed under the seat in front of you and a bulkhead seat has
> no seat in front of it so . . .   On my travels the other way with the cat
> six months earlier the container was taken and moved to an appropriate 
> place
> on the plane to the entertainment of the other passengers.  Anyways, I
> politely inform the stew I cannot move to another row and attempt to 
> explain
> my particular circumstances which make this so.  He interrupts me and 
> starts
> to berate me, and here comes the funny part, he actually says to me, "we
> have disabled passengers who have paid for these seats (the two next to
> me)."  Keep in mind I am sitting there with a dog in harness that says
> "Guide Dogs for the Blind."  This guy is a real genius.  I just tell him
> after that to het his supervisor.  The sup shows and gives me the same
> routine stating there is an entire empty row in the rear of the plane 
> (where
> of course only I would be inconvenienced without a place for MY feet).  So
> instead of moving the passengers across the isle in the bulkhead row to 
> the
> empty row of seats and allowing the other disabled passengers to take the
> bulk head across the row from me they instead stuck a nice old woman and 
> her
> daughter next to me (nobody disabled) and this nice woman took it in 
> stride
> with grace and dealt with a dog on her feet for four plus hours.
>
> The humiliation comes from, if not obvious, having my disability pointed 
> out
> to all on the plane who hadn't already noticed in a demeaning manner 
> (which
> would not have occurred but for the disability)thereafter followed up by
> their non accommodating my request to me indicates indifference to the 
> needs
> of those similarly situated as I when traveling.  Seems like the airline I
> refer is in need of some modification to their training.  I think I may 
> help
> them out toward that end.
>
> James W. Weisberg, Esq.
>
> Law Office of J. William Weisberg
>
> 299 South Patencio Road #3
>
> Palm Springs, California  92262
>
> V:  916.425.1010
>
> F:  916.374.7667
>
> E-Mail:  jimi-law at dc.rr.com
>
> Admitted in Wisconsin
>
> Nationwide Practice Limited to Immigration Removal Defense & Civil Rights
> Advocacy for Children with Diabetes
>
> This message contains information which may be confidential and 
> privileged.
> Unless you are the addressee (or authorized to receive for the addressee),
> you may not use, copy or disclose to anyone the message or any information
> contained in this message. If you have received this message in error,
> please advise the sender by reply e-mail and delete the message from your
> system.
>
> This exchange of information does not create an attorney-client 
> relationship
> nor does it constitute legal advice.  The Law Office of J. William 
> Weisberg
> expects the recipient will independently evaluate this information in
> accordance with this disclaimer.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of WB
> Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 1:06 PM
> To: 'NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] ADA and Air Travel
>
> Well, exactly how wer you marginalized is what the question is I think.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of James Weisberg
> Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 2:40 PM
> To: 'NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] ADA and Air Travel
>
> being marginalized because of something (my case disability)in front of a
> plane full of passengers is humiliating.  No?
>
> James W. Weisberg, Esq.
>
> Law Office of J. William Weisberg
>
> 299 South Patencio Road #3
>
> Palm Springs, California  92262
>
> V:  916.425.1010
>
> F:  916.374.7667
>
> E-Mail:  jimi-law at dc.rr.com
>
> Admitted in Wisconsin
>
> Nationwide Practice Limited to Immigration Removal Defense & Civil Rights
> Advocacy for Children with Diabetes
>
> This message contains information which may be confidential and 
> privileged.
> Unless you are the addressee (or authorized to receive for the addressee),
> you may not use, copy or disclose to anyone the message or any information
> contained in this message. If you have received this message in error,
> please advise the sender by reply e-mail and delete the message from your
> system.
>
> This exchange of information does not create an attorney-client 
> relationship
> nor does it constitute legal advice.  The Law Office of J. William 
> Weisberg
> expects the recipient will independently evaluate this information in
> accordance with this disclaimer.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of Steve P. Deeley
> Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 11:19 AM
> To: NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] ADA and Air Travel
>
> In your opinion, how were you humiliated?
> Steve
> Steve
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "James Weisberg" <jimi-law at dc.rr.com>
> To: "'NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List'" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 1:01 PM
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] ADA and Air Travel
>
>
>> As the original poster of this thread I wanted to point out the reason 
>> for
>> my inquiry was not related to accommodations but rather being publicly
>> humiliated by air carrier staff (stew) which of course is a common 
>> carrier
>> and that's a big "no no."  Since the humiliation was based upon the
>> presence
>> of a guide dog the ADA first came to mind.
>>
>>
>>
>> Finally, Ben you rock dude!!
>>
>>
>> James W. Weisberg, Esq.
>>
>> Law Office of J. William Weisberg
>>
>> 299 South Patencio Road #3
>>
>> Palm Springs, California  92262
>>
>> V:  916.425.1010
>>
>> F:  916.374.7667
>>
>> E-Mail:  jimi-law at dc.rr.com
>>
>> Admitted in Wisconsin
>>
>> Nationwide Practice Limited to Immigration Removal Defense & Civil Rights
>> Advocacy for Children with Diabetes
>>
>> This message contains information which may be confidential and
>> privileged.
>> Unless you are the addressee (or authorized to receive for the 
>> addressee),
>> you may not use, copy or disclose to anyone the message or any 
>> information
>> contained in this message. If you have received this message in error,
>> please advise the sender by reply e-mail and delete the message from your
>> system.
>>
>> This exchange of information does not create an attorney-client
>> relationship
>> nor does it constitute legal advice.  The Law Office of J. William
>> Weisberg
>> expects the recipient will independently evaluate this information in
>> accordance with this disclaimer.
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>> Behalf Of stiehm.law
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 01, 2009 12:58 PM
>> To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
>> Cc: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
>> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] ADA and Air Travel
>>
>> In addition to the airlines, I have recently become curious as to what if
>> any, accommodations for the TSA makes with respect to disabled people
>> going through security and being picked up by somebody at the gate at the
>> terminal at the other end of the flight. For example, do they permit a
>> blind person who is traveling alone to be accompanied through security,
>> down to the airline check-in counter at the gate by a non-ticketed
>> person.
>>
>> At the other end, is a non-ticketed person permitted through security to
>> go to the gate to meet a blind person flying alone?
>>
>> If TSA does not provide for such accommodations do the airlines take it
>> on themselves to provide this service?
>>
>> Has anybody had any experience in this regard? Is the accommodation, if
>> any, voluntary on the part of the TSA and/or the airlines or is it
>> governed by regulation?
>>
>> Patrick H. Stiehm
>> Stiehm Law Office
>> Alexandria, VA 22309
>> 703-360-1089 (Voice)
>> 703-935-8266 (Fax)
>>
>>
>>
>> Tue, 1 Dec 2009 11:30:37 -0800 "Russell J. Thomas, Jr."
>> <rthomas at rjtlawfirm.com> writes:
>>> Off the top of my head, and without any new research, the only case
>>> I
>>> remember is a case challenging the accessibility of airline websites
>>> with
>>> respect to attempting to make reservations and ordering tickets on
>>> line.
>>>
>>> I also think that there are regulations on the subject, especially
>>> dealing
>>> with how disabled passengers are to be treated (or perhaps on some
>>> occasions
>>> mistreated).
>>>
>>> I often thought it would be a good idea for the NFB to put together
>>> a short
>>> guide book concerning travel, including air travel, based upon
>>> experiences
>>> of NFB members, to be used as a reference guide for blind people who
>>> use air
>>> travel.  Certainly things have changed since 911--some changes for
>>> the good,
>>> and others not so good.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Respectfully,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Russell J. Thomas, Jr.
>>>
>>> THOMAS & ASSOCIATES
>>>
>>> www.californiaemployersattorneys.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Orange County Office
>>>
>>> 4121 Westerly Place, Suite 101
>>>
>>> Newport Beach, California 92660
>>>
>>> T: (949) 752-0101
>>>
>>> F: (949) 257-4756
>>>
>>> M: (949) 466-7238
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Beverly Hills Office
>>>
>>> 9107 Wilshire Boulevard, Suite 450
>>>
>>> Beverly Hills, California 90210
>>>
>>> T: (310) 461-3561
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>> [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>> Behalf Of James Weisberg
>>> Sent: Tuesday, December 01, 2009 10:01 AM
>>> To: 'NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List'
>>> Subject: [blindlaw] ADA and Air Travel
>>>
>>> Hi Folks:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Anyone on the lists have experience or knowledge regarding the ADA
>>> and suits
>>> against air carriers for violations available for quick consult?
>>> Thanks.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> James W. Weisberg, Esq.
>>>
>>> Law Office of J. William Weisberg
>>>
>>> 299 South Patencio Road #3
>>>
>>> Palm Springs, California  92262
>>>
>>> V:  916.425.1010
>>>
>>> F:  916.374.7667
>>>
>>> E-Mail:  jimi-law at dc.rr.com
>>>
>>> Admitted in Wisconsin
>>>
>>> Nationwide Practice Limited to Immigration Removal Defense & Civil
>>> Rights
>>> Advocacy for Children with Diabetes
>>>
>>> This message contains information which may be confidential and
>>> privileged.
>>> Unless you are the addressee (or authorized to receive for the
>>> addressee),
>>> you may not use, copy or disclose to anyone the message or any
>>> information
>>> contained in this message. If you have received this message in
>>> error,
>>> please advise the sender by reply e-mail and delete the message from
>>> your
>>> system.
>>>
>>> This exchange of information does not create an attorney-client
>>> relationship
>>> nor does it constitute legal advice.  The Law Office of J. William
>>> Weisberg
>>> expects the recipient will independently evaluate this information
>>> in
>>> accordance with this disclaimer.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
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>>
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