[blindlaw] nfb v. target

[Bill Spiry]

The world is unfortunately full of slow learners.


-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
Behalf Of James Pepper
Sent: Saturday, March 14, 2009 11:41 PM
To: NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] nfb v. target

Scott:

What I do not get is why these companies are willing to go to court and
spend all this money and put themselves into so much risk, when the
solutions to these problems are actually just a matter of rolling up the
sleeves and rebuilding the website.  For instance I just took a look at the
Target website.  Right now as I type this it has 940 errors in its HTML code
and 109 warnings according to the World Wide Web Consortium which sets the
international standards the codes used to write websites.  This is
appalling!

Their CSS errors are 38 errors, and 335 warnings.  This means that they are
not even up to the international standards for writing code properly. There
is no excuse for this!

The LSAT is using the wrong program to make their PDF files.  They are using
a program that fragments the content into such tiny pieces that the text
cannot be put back together again.  It is all gibberish.  But this can be
fixed!

What I do not get is why this is such a problem for people to make their
websites accessible? Why are they willing to fight in court, spend millions
of dollars in settlement when the solutions are right in front of them!

I am just amazed at the waste!

James Pepper



On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 9:19 PM, Scott C. LaBarre
<slabarre at labarrelaw.com>wrote:

> The standards used are those of WCAG and Sec. 508.  I did not work
directly
> on Target and cannot tell you exactly the access barriers.  I can tell you
> that with respect to filing applications to law schools through LSAC on
> their website, it is impossible to fill those applications out
independently
> using screen reading softaware.  Let me also assure list members that we
> don't simply jump on a website, encounter difficulty, and then sue them
the
> next day.  A lawsuit is the last resort when the entity is not willing to
> deal with us otherwise.  Just because we are a small minority does not
mean
> that our right to the mainstream of society must always be subservient to
> the majority's unwillingness to consider us due to our small numbers.
>  Unless someone has a new point to be made on this topic, I respectfully
> suggest that we move onto different discussions.  Let's also agree to
> disagree on certain points.
> Scott C. LaBarre, Esq.
>
> LaBarre Law Offices P.C.
> 1660 South Albion Street, Ste. 918
> Denver, Colorado 80222
> 303 504-5979 (voice)
> 303 757-3640 (fax)
> slabarre at labarrelaw.com (e-mail)
> www.labarrelaw.com (website)
>
> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This message may contain confidential and
> privileged information. If you are not the designated recipient, you may
not
> read, copy, distribute or retain this message. If you received this
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> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe Orozco" <jsorozco at gmail.com>
> To: "'NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List'" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Saturday, March 14, 2009 8:52 AM
>
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] nfb v. target
>
>
> What troubles me is that my question of accessibility standards has not
> been
> answered on the other case against the LSAC.  The same question is
> applicable here.  What standard was used to conclude that the web site was
> not accessible?  I do not claim to be a genius at manipulating technology
> to
> serve my needs, but I did not have to try hard at all to make Target give
> me
> what I needed between 2005 and 2008.  So is the problem the web site
> layout,
> or is it our own technology training?  Rather than chase every entity with
> features a few people deem inaccessible, would it not be prudent to take
> our
> standards, whatever those may be, to the classroom, to the software
> developers, the relevant associations raising the performance standards of
> its students and members?  This method of engineering change gives us the
> perception of a watchdog group.  If this is what we have become, and given
> the small margin of the population we represent, I would rather trigger
> change at the source rather than at the output.
>
> Joe Orozco
>
> "A man who wants to lead the orchestra must turn his back on the
> crowd."--Max Lucado
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org
> [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Steve P. Deeley
> Sent: Saturday, March 14, 2009 9:24 AM
> To: NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] nfb v. target
>
> That should not result in you receiving damages of almost $4,000.00.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <ckrugman at sbcglobal.net>
> To: "NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Saturday, March 14, 2009 4:35 AM
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] nfb v. target
>
>
> As an individual I am insulted and damaged each time I am
> discriminated by a
> business not accommodating my ability to access their products
> and services,
> especially on the Internet when I have made sure that I have
> accommodated
> myself with the most up-to-date software to mitigate my needs as a blind
> person. I should not have to rely on sighted assistance to use
> a product or
> do without because the greedy corporations has chosen the most expedient
> road to sell their products. I am also insulted that you are
> posting this
> question. I have in my life time been sold out by too many
> blind people that
> thought they knew what I needed and I hope more companies will
> have to pay
> damages in these types of cases. Perhaps they will then learn
> how to meet
> the needs of all their customers. Fortunately here in California we have
> some laws with some teeth in them that are
> enforceable--although these teeth
> still need a good sharpening.
> Chuck
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve P. Deeley" <
> stevep.deeley at insightbb.com>
> To: "NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Friday, March 13, 2009 6:22 PM
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] nfb v. target
>
>
> That is a lawyer talking who makes his living in rediculous
> situations like
> this one.  Again, you show me how an individual was damaged and out
> $4,000.00.
> Steve
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott C. LaBarre" <
> slabarre at labarrelaw.com>
> To: "NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Friday, March 13, 2009 5:38 PM
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] nfb v. target
>
>
> Violation of civil rights has long been recognized as a form of
> compensible
> legal damage as well it should be.
> Scott C. LaBarre, Esq.
>
> LaBarre Law Offices P.C.
> 1660 South Albion Street, Ste. 918
> Denver, Colorado 80222
> 303 504-5979 (voice)
> 303 757-3640 (fax)
> slabarre at labarrelaw.com (e-mail)
> www.labarrelaw.com (website)
>
> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This message may contain confidential
> and privileged
> information. If you are not the designated recipient, you may not read,
> copy, distribute or retain this message. If you received this message in
> error, please notify the sender at 303) 504-5979 or
> slabarre at labarrelaw.com,
> and destroy and delete it from your system. This message and
> any attachments
> are covered by the Electronic
> Communications Privacy Act, 18 U.S.C. §§ 2510-2521.
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve P. Deeley" <
> stevep.deeley at insightbb.com>
> To: "NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Friday, March 13, 2009 2:31 PM
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] nfb v. target
>
>
> This is ridiculous!  How were these people damaged?
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mehgan Sidhu" <ms at browngold.com>
>> To: <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Friday, March 13, 2009 3:20 PM
>> Subject: [blindlaw] nfb v. target
>>
>>
>> To answer the recent questions posted about the Target case,
>>>
>> the final
>
>> settlement hearing took place on March 9th.  I understand from our
>>> counsel in California, Larry Paradis of DRA and Josh
>>>
>> Konecky, that there
>
>> were no objectors and the Judge was pleased with the
>>>
>> resolution of the
>
>> case.   The settlement is not fully "final" until the time for any
>>> appeals has run - which is about 30 days.  Given there were
>>>
>> no objectors,
>
>> it is highly unlikely that any appeals will be filed.  The
>>>
>> judge has not
>
>> yet made a ruling on attorneys fees, but that will not hold up
>>> enforcement of the settlement.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> As for disbursements, assuming there are no appeals, the claims
>>> administer has 45 days from the final approval date to
>>>
>> disburse funds to
>
>> claimants. I do not know the final tally of approved
>>>
>> claimants, though I
>
>> think there were several hundred.  I will pass that information along
>>> when I have it.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> We will now be working on enforcing the settlement commitments that
>>> Target made with respect to the accessibility of the website.
>>>
>>>
>>> Mehgan Sidhu
>>> Brown, Goldstein & Levy, LLP
>>> 120 East Baltimore Street, Suite 1700
>>> Baltimore, Maryland 21202
>>> 410-962-1030 x1324
>>> 410-385-0869 (fax)
>>> ms at browngold.com<mailto:ms at browngold.com>
>>> www.browngold.com<http://www.browngold.com/>
>>>
>>> Confidentiality Notice
>>>
>>> This e-mail may contain confidential information that may
>>>
>> also be legally
>
>> privileged and that is intended only for the use of the addressee(s)
>>> named above.  If you are not the intended recipient or an authorized
>>> agent of the recipient, please be advised that any dissemination or
>>> copying of this e-mail, or taking of any action in reliance on the
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>>>
>> by use of the
>
>> reply button, and then delete the e-mail from your system.
>>>
>> Thank you!
>
>>
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