From gerard.sadlier at gmail.com  Tue Dec  2 18:10:34 2014
From: gerard.sadlier at gmail.com (Gerard Sadlier)
Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2014 18:10:34 +0000
Subject: [blindlaw] Urgent: Using Relativity e Discovery Platform
Message-ID: <CAGZitzJTbaRh-FWPG3YpRZyYSbRaK9Fw3v1QrfEmoLLb1-FxfQ@mail.gmail.com>

Dear all

I would be really grateful if anyone with experience using the
Relativity e Discovery platform with JAWS or NVDA could please get in
touch with me and let me know what your experience was?

Is the platform accessible?

Many thanks

Ger


From dmanners at jd16.law.harvard.edu  Tue Dec  2 18:29:20 2014
From: dmanners at jd16.law.harvard.edu (Derek Manners)
Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2014 13:29:20 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Urgent: Using Relativity e Discovery Platform
In-Reply-To: <CAGZitzJTbaRh-FWPG3YpRZyYSbRaK9Fw3v1QrfEmoLLb1-FxfQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGZitzJTbaRh-FWPG3YpRZyYSbRaK9Fw3v1QrfEmoLLb1-FxfQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <41D29CA6-F914-47B8-BCE1-C1A343A7DF6C@jd16.law.harvard.edu>

Take this with a huge grain of salt since I'm not a screen reader user but am a zoom text user. I wouldn't think it would work that well given that most of the documents I've ever seen produced in relativity have been picture files rather than text files. That said, it should be accessible so long as the buttons are coded etc. 

Best wishes
Derek

Sent from my iPhone

> On Dec 2, 2014, at 1:10 PM, Gerard Sadlier via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Dear all
> 
> I would be really grateful if anyone with experience using the
> Relativity e Discovery platform with JAWS or NVDA could please get in
> touch with me and let me know what your experience was?
> 
> Is the platform accessible?
> 
> Many thanks
> 
> Ger
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/dmanners%40jd16.law.harvard.edu


From gerard.sadlier at gmail.com  Tue Dec  2 18:48:12 2014
From: gerard.sadlier at gmail.com (Gerard Sadlier)
Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2014 18:48:12 +0000
Subject: [blindlaw] Urgent: Using Relativity e Discovery Platform
In-Reply-To: <41D29CA6-F914-47B8-BCE1-C1A343A7DF6C@jd16.law.harvard.edu>
References: <CAGZitzJTbaRh-FWPG3YpRZyYSbRaK9Fw3v1QrfEmoLLb1-FxfQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<41D29CA6-F914-47B8-BCE1-C1A343A7DF6C@jd16.law.harvard.edu>
Message-ID: <CAGZitzL3Mxic=W49fkXZ8vrwuAuRypMS6xfp-uS0TT_mxdFmCQ@mail.gmail.com>

Derek,

Thanks for coming back to me on this.

Usually there is a text view in these applications. (After all, these
programmes only work by doing OCR on the documents in the first
place.) It should also be possible to download documents from the
system (assuming it's accessible).

I'd be grateful for any additional comments.

Best wishes

Ger

On 12/2/14, Derek Manners <dmanners at jd16.law.harvard.edu> wrote:
> Take this with a huge grain of salt since I'm not a screen reader user but
> am a zoom text user. I wouldn't think it would work that well given that
> most of the documents I've ever seen produced in relativity have been
> picture files rather than text files. That said, it should be accessible so
> long as the buttons are coded etc.
>
> Best wishes
> Derek
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Dec 2, 2014, at 1:10 PM, Gerard Sadlier via blindlaw
>> <blindlaw at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>
>> Dear all
>>
>> I would be really grateful if anyone with experience using the
>> Relativity e Discovery platform with JAWS or NVDA could please get in
>> touch with me and let me know what your experience was?
>>
>> Is the platform accessible?
>>
>> Many thanks
>>
>> Ger
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> blindlaw mailing list
>> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> blindlaw:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/dmanners%40jd16.law.harvard.edu
>


From Attorney at alcidonislaw.com  Wed Dec  3 22:00:43 2014
From: Attorney at alcidonislaw.com (Rod Alcidonis, Esquire)
Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2014 17:00:43 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Google is moving away from the ubiquitous blurry text
	system for spotting online robots - Dec. 3, 2014
Message-ID: <2392771082B54B9394C1F639CD26D7AA@RodTHINK>


http://money.cnn.com/2014/12/03/technology/security/google-blurry-text-security/index.html?hpt=hp_t2

From awildheir at gmail.com  Wed Dec  3 22:17:37 2014
From: awildheir at gmail.com (Aimee Harwood)
Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2014 17:17:37 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] LSAT accommodations question
Message-ID: <9D33C8CF-5EA5-4A81-AC1E-D71D55CD7D35@gmail.com>

Okay folks. I have a bit of a quandary. I received my accommodations letter around 17 November. All of the accommodations that I requested were granted except scratch paper in two day testing. I am taking the electronic form of the test and am using a scribe. I'm also using my brailliant braille display to read and input braille. I also have the use of my Beecher Mirage monnocular. I called LSAC to inquire about no scratch paper as soon as I got the letter because I would not be able to complete the logic games and reading comp without it. I was told that my scribe would have paper. Upon talking to the supervisor at the testing locations hat has been moved an hour and a half away, I found out that they are not going to allow me to have scratch paper. I have sent an email to LSAC alerting them of their oversight reminding them that there is no way I can do the logic games and reading, without scratch paper or some way to take down the information. They informed me that there's nothing they can do because it is past the deadline. I understand that, however, I can't imagine that they would send out an accommodation that had requested paper or some means of performing logic games and passage maps for reading, with no additional such accommodation. Leaving that out would surely set the test taker up for failure if they were to proceed with taking the test. I have been granted the use of my computer for the test and writing sample. Also note that the wording of the accommodations letter states that I can use my brailliant display for reading and input of braille. Does this mean I can use some other part of my computer to take down the information for the sections? What are the implications of me attempting to use text editor or something of that nature to input braille? It did say in the letter I can use the braille display to input braille. I am scheduled to take the test this Saturday.

Any and all suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Aimee

Sent from my iPhone

From kelbycarlson at gmail.com  Wed Dec  3 22:47:46 2014
From: kelbycarlson at gmail.com (Kelby Carlson)
Date: Wed, 03 Dec 2014 16:47:46 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] LSAT accommodations question
Message-ID: <547f9341.4540e00a.5655.7f28@mx.google.com>

I hate to say it, but there may be nothing you can do at this 
point.  I've had similar troubles with the LSAC.  Oddly, for my 
upcoming test I was not grantheed an electronic version; I'm 
using straight braille (which is better in some ways.) I'm also 
waiting back to hear from them about the use of my laptop for 
logic, since that workasn't specifically stated in my letter.  I 
actually think there could be warrant for some kind of civil 
complaint against the LSAC, based on how many testimonies I have 
heard like this.

K.



 ----- Original Message -----
From: Aimee Harwood via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
To: Blind Law Mailing List <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Date sent: Wed, 3 Dec 2014 17:17:37 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] LSAT accommodations question

Okay folks.  I have a bit of a quandary.  I received my 
accommodations letter around 17 November.  All of the 
accommodations that I requested were granted except scratch paper 
in two day testing.  I am taking the electronic form of the test 
and am using a scribe.  I'm also using my brailliant braille 
display to read and input braille.  I also have the use of my 
Beecher Mirage monnocular.  I called LSAC to inquire about no 
scratch paper as soon as I got the letter because I would not be 
able to complete the logic games and reading comp without it.  I 
was told that my scribe would have paper.  Upon talking to the 
supervisor at the testing locations hat has been moved an hour 
and a half away, I found out that they are not going to allow me 
to have scratch paper.  I have sent an email to LSAC alerting 
them of their oversight reminding them that there is no way I can 
do the logic games and reading, without scratch paper or some way 
to take down the information.  They informed me that there's 
nothing they can do because it is past the deadline.  I 
understand that, however, I can't imagine that they would send 
out an accommodation that had requested paper or some means of 
performing logic games and passage maps for reading, with no 
additional such accommodation.  Leaving that out would surely set 
the test taker up for failure if they were to proceed with taking 
the test.  I have been granted the use of my computer for the 
test and writing sample.  Also note that the wording of the 
accommodations letter states that I can use my brailliant display 
for reading and input of braille.  Does this mean I can use some 
other part of my computer to take down the information for the 
sections? What are the implications of me attempting to use text 
editor or something of that nature to input braille? It did say 
in the letter I can use the braille display to input braille.  I 
am scheduled to take the test this Saturday.

Any and all suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Aimee

Sent from my iPhone
_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
for blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/kelbycarlso
n%40gmail.com


From jtfetter at yahoo.com  Wed Dec  3 23:08:37 2014
From: jtfetter at yahoo.com (James Fetter)
Date: Wed, 03 Dec 2014 18:08:37 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT
Message-ID: <547F97F5.5060608@yahoo.com>

Dear all,
I hope this finds you all well and having had a good Thanksgiving. I am 
finding that, although I can do logic games on LSAT practice tests with 
a very high degree of accuracy with Excel, I'm having trouble getting 
the logic games section done in the allotted time, which for me is 70 
minutes (I requested and received double time for each section). If 
anyone knows of any time efficient methods of diagramming with Excel or 
some other accessible product, please let me know. Please also feel free 
to write me directly at jtfetter at yahoo.com. I apologize if this question 
has been asked and answered before. Thanks.
All Best,
James


From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Wed Dec  3 23:12:35 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2014 18:12:35 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] LSAT accommodations question
In-Reply-To: <9D33C8CF-5EA5-4A81-AC1E-D71D55CD7D35@gmail.com>
References: <9D33C8CF-5EA5-4A81-AC1E-D71D55CD7D35@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <057b01d00f4e$a0a3a7d0$e1eaf770$@gmail.com>

Dear Aimee:

Bummer! It appears to me that this is an oversight on the part of LSAC. 

You probably don't want to hear this, but It is so close to Saturday that I
think that you should postpone your test. If you don't do well, the score
will be held against you 



Do you have it in writing that the scribe would have scratch paper so that
you can show that the LSAC representative gave you faulty information? If
not, it is time to start writing, not talking, so that you can have evidence
of what you are being told.

I would send an email, Fax the email, and mail the email to LSAC. The
information is at this link:
http://www.lsac.org/jd/lsat/policies/test-center-problem-policies.

In the body of the email I would make my case regarding how you asked for a
certain test location, instead, your location was moved to a faraway,
inconvenient location; the scratch paper accommodation was denied;  when you
followed up,  you were told that the scribe would have scratch paper (this
false impression may be why you were denied having scratch paper), the
falsity of that statement, the negative impact to you of not having scratch
paper; and ask for LSAC to either give you a full refund, apply your payment
to another future LSAT test date, or waive the fee. Even if you are told no,
you at least have proof that you requested it in case of a future class
action lawsuit

If you decide to go forward with the test on Saturday, I would still send in
the complaint. If things don't go well at the test, cancel the score so that
your score will not harm you.

I hope my suggestions help.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aimee
Harwood via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 5:18 PM
To: Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: [blindlaw] LSAT accommodations question

Okay folks. I have a bit of a quandary. I received my accommodations letter
around 17 November. All of the accommodations that I requested were granted
except scratch paper in two day testing. I am taking the electronic form of
the test and am using a scribe. I'm also using my brailliant braille display
to read and input braille. I also have the use of my Beecher Mirage
monnocular. I called LSAC to inquire about no scratch paper as soon as I got
the letter because I would not be able to complete the logic games and
reading comp without it. I was told that my scribe would have paper. Upon
talking to the supervisor at the testing locations hat has been moved an
hour and a half away, I found out that they are not going to allow me to
have scratch paper. I have sent an email to LSAC alerting them of their
oversight reminding them that there is no way I can do the logic games and
reading, without scratch paper or some way to take down the information.
They informed me that there's nothing they can do because it is past the
deadline. I understand that, however, I can't imagine that they would send
out an accommodation that had requested paper or some means of performing
logic games and passage maps for reading, with no additional such
accommodation. Leaving that out would surely set the test taker up for
failure if they were to proceed with taking the test. I have been granted
the use of my computer for the test and writing sample. Also note that the
wording of the accommodations letter states that I can use my brailliant
display for reading and input of braille. Does this mean I can use some
other part of my computer to take down the information for the sections?
What are the implications of me attempting to use text editor or something
of that nature to input braille? It did say in the letter I can use the
braille display to input braille. I am scheduled to take the test this
Saturday.

Any and all suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Aimee

Sent from my iPhone
_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/anitakeithfoust%40gmai
l.com



From kelbycarlson at gmail.com  Wed Dec  3 23:14:20 2014
From: kelbycarlson at gmail.com (Kelby Carlson)
Date: Wed, 03 Dec 2014 17:14:20 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT
Message-ID: <547f997b.0214e00a.1b3d.ffffb76e@mx.google.com>

This would be helpful for me as well.  I can use Excel, but I 
haven't found a method that I really like.

K.



 ----- Original Message -----
From: James Fetter via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Date sent: Wed, 03 Dec 2014 18:08:37 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Dear all,
I hope this finds you all well and having had a good 
Thanksgiving.  I am
finding that, although I can do logic games on LSAT practice 
tests with
a very high degree of accuracy with Excel, I'm having trouble 
getting
the logic games section done in the allotted time, which for me 
is 70
minutes (I requested and received double time for each section).  
If
anyone knows of any time efficient methods of diagramming with 
Excel or
some other accessible product, please let me know.  Please also 
feel free
to write me directly at jtfetter at yahoo.com.  I apologize if this 
question
has been asked and answered before.  Thanks.
All Best,
James

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
for blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/kelbycarlso
n%40gmail.com


From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Wed Dec  3 23:15:58 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2014 18:15:58 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT
In-Reply-To: <547F97F5.5060608@yahoo.com>
References: <547F97F5.5060608@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <057d01d00f4f$19fabc40$4df034c0$@gmail.com>

Please share. 

I would also like to know the answer to this question.

Thank you.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of James
Fetter via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:09 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Dear all,
I hope this finds you all well and having had a good Thanksgiving. I am
finding that, although I can do logic games on LSAT practice tests with a
very high degree of accuracy with Excel, I'm having trouble getting the
logic games section done in the allotted time, which for me is 70 minutes (I
requested and received double time for each section). If anyone knows of any
time efficient methods of diagramming with Excel or some other accessible
product, please let me know. Please also feel free to write me directly at
jtfetter at yahoo.com. I apologize if this question has been asked and answered
before. Thanks.
All Best,
James

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/anitakeithfoust%40gmai
l.com



From mnowicki4 at icloud.com  Wed Dec  3 23:34:26 2014
From: mnowicki4 at icloud.com (Michal Nowicki)
Date: Wed, 03 Dec 2014 17:34:26 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT
In-Reply-To: <057d01d00f4f$19fabc40$4df034c0$@gmail.com>
References: <547F97F5.5060608@yahoo.com>
	<057d01d00f4f$19fabc40$4df034c0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <000001d00f51$ad872ff0$08958fd0$@icloud.com>

Hi all,

First, I would suggest sticking with Excel, as it offers the greatest
flexibility when it comes to manipulating elements.  To save time on the
logic games section, I recommend taking full advantage of the copy/paste
feature.  Specifically, you should be easily able to copy your master sketch
for hypothetical questions.  Depending on whether you prefer the horizontal
or vertical approach, you can select an entire column by pressing "Control"
plus the spacebar, or entire row by pressing "Shift" plus the spacebar, and
you can then extend the selection to adjacent cells by pressing "Shift" plus
the arrow key that corresponds to the direction in which you want to extend
the selection.  After that, you can perform copy and paste commands just as
you would in any other program.  I hope this helps.

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 5:16 PM
To: 'James Fetter'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Please share. 

I would also like to know the answer to this question.

Thank you.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of James
Fetter via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:09 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Dear all,
I hope this finds you all well and having had a good Thanksgiving. I am
finding that, although I can do logic games on LSAT practice tests with a
very high degree of accuracy with Excel, I'm having trouble getting the
logic games section done in the allotted time, which for me is 70 minutes (I
requested and received double time for each section). If anyone knows of any
time efficient methods of diagramming with Excel or some other accessible
product, please let me know. Please also feel free to write me directly at
jtfetter at yahoo.com. I apologize if this question has been asked and answered
before. Thanks.
All Best,
James

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/anitakeithfoust%40gmai
l.com


_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40icloud.com



From laura.wolk at gmail.com  Wed Dec  3 23:39:20 2014
From: laura.wolk at gmail.com (Laura Wolk)
Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2014 18:39:20 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] lsat stuff
Message-ID: <CAHG6wD44vBmH6xeNhytjz4yoWQ=NprnSwOJS2Jcm0=PX16ao9w@mail.gmail.com>

James,

I just saw your email on the blindlaw mailing list. I am assuming you
are the same James who was at ND? If so, I didn't know you were
planning on coming back to law school. I did not use excel on the lsat
so I can't help you there, but if you do want someone to talk things
through with, you can always hsoot me an email.

Good luck!

Laura


From laura.wolk at gmail.com  Wed Dec  3 23:40:41 2014
From: laura.wolk at gmail.com (Laura Wolk)
Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2014 18:40:41 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] lsat stuff
In-Reply-To: <CAHG6wD44vBmH6xeNhytjz4yoWQ=NprnSwOJS2Jcm0=PX16ao9w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHG6wD44vBmH6xeNhytjz4yoWQ=NprnSwOJS2Jcm0=PX16ao9w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAHG6wD4onSJan2vzBC--xWW8b0Y+G+2EqRHhxd6pgp0uD=jjGQ@mail.gmail.com>

right and, I clearly lack competency when it comes to sending email
from my phone. sorry, all.

On 12/3/14, Laura Wolk <laura.wolk at gmail.com> wrote:
> James,
>
> I just saw your email on the blindlaw mailing list. I am assuming you
> are the same James who was at ND? If so, I didn't know you were
> planning on coming back to law school. I did not use excel on the lsat
> so I can't help you there, but if you do want someone to talk things
> through with, you can always hsoot me an email.
>
> Good luck!
>
> Laura
>


-- 
Laura Wolk
Notre Dame Law Review
J.D. Candidate, 2016, Notre Dame Law School
(484) 695-8234


From dennis at dgclark.net  Thu Dec  4 00:29:47 2014
From: dennis at dgclark.net (Dennis Clark)
Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2014 16:29:47 -0800
Subject: [blindlaw] LSAT problem
Message-ID: <33EF745B0AEB44D6B785EAB94F8F15E0@C1>

Hello Aimee,
I'm writing to you off list. Your situation is quite typical when working with the LSAC. I realize you didn't ask for law school advice, but here goes. As you undoubtedly know, getting into a good law school is difficult, and getting into a great law school is extremely difficult. For this reason, your law school application needs to be as perfect as is humanly possible, and this means that your LSAT score needs to be as high as you are capable of scoring. Obviously you can take the test a second time to improve an unfortunate score, but the people who get into the best law schools get it right the first time. I can also tell you, that you must go to the highest ranked law school to which you are admitted. Its very strange in a way, but in the legal profession, where one went to law school continues to remain important throughout one's career. I always look up where opposing counsel went to law school, just to get a feel for who I am going to be dealing with, and rarely has this given me a wrong steer. This does not mean that a great lawyer cannot come from a lower ranked school, but if they went to a top five school, I know that I'm going to have to be at the top of my game all the time. For this reason, its important that you not shoot yourself in the foot by taking the LSAT before you are fully prepared, or until the LSAC has given you everything you need to deliver a score which represents your true ability, and not an unlevel playing field. I know this is a hard decision, because you have been preparing and gearing up to take the LSAT now, and get it behind you, but you will not be able to put a low score behind you. As I mentioned in my last email, I can't help you legally since I'm not licensed in Pennsylvania, but I am happy to provide advice in your journey to go through law school. I look forward to hearing from you if there is anything I can do to help. 
All the best,
Dennis

From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Thu Dec  4 00:32:05 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2014 19:32:05 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT
In-Reply-To: <000001d00f51$ad872ff0$08958fd0$@icloud.com>
References: <547F97F5.5060608@yahoo.com>
	<057d01d00f4f$19fabc40$4df034c0$@gmail.com>
	<000001d00f51$ad872ff0$08958fd0$@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <058501d00f59$bbb60a80$33221f80$@gmail.com>

Terrific! Those shortcuts help a lot.

Thank you.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978


-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michal
Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:34 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Hi all,

First, I would suggest sticking with Excel, as it offers the greatest
flexibility when it comes to manipulating elements.  To save time on the
logic games section, I recommend taking full advantage of the copy/paste
feature.  Specifically, you should be easily able to copy your master sketch
for hypothetical questions.  Depending on whether you prefer the horizontal
or vertical approach, you can select an entire column by pressing "Control"
plus the spacebar, or entire row by pressing "Shift" plus the spacebar, and
you can then extend the selection to adjacent cells by pressing "Shift" plus
the arrow key that corresponds to the direction in which you want to extend
the selection.  After that, you can perform copy and paste commands just as
you would in any other program.  I hope this helps.

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 5:16 PM
To: 'James Fetter'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Please share. 

I would also like to know the answer to this question.

Thank you.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of James
Fetter via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:09 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Dear all,
I hope this finds you all well and having had a good Thanksgiving. I am
finding that, although I can do logic games on LSAT practice tests with a
very high degree of accuracy with Excel, I'm having trouble getting the
logic games section done in the allotted time, which for me is 70 minutes (I
requested and received double time for each section). If anyone knows of any
time efficient methods of diagramming with Excel or some other accessible
product, please let me know. Please also feel free to write me directly at
jtfetter at yahoo.com. I apologize if this question has been asked and answered
before. Thanks.
All Best,
James

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
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From kelbycarlson at gmail.com  Thu Dec  4 00:51:39 2014
From: kelbycarlson at gmail.com (Kelby Carlson)
Date: Wed, 03 Dec 2014 18:51:39 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT
Message-ID: <547fb04a.ca80e00a.0d3a.ffff8a37@mx.google.com>

I know I may have the minority opinion, but I actually think the 
rules method can work quite well.

K.



 ----- Original Message -----
From: Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
To: "'James Fetter'" <jtfetter at yahoo.com>,"'Blind Law Mailing 
List'" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Date sent: Wed, 3 Dec 2014 18:15:58 -0500
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Please share.

I would also like to know the answer to this question.

Thank you.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of 
James
Fetter via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:09 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Dear all,
I hope this finds you all well and having had a good 
Thanksgiving.  I am
finding that, although I can do logic games on LSAT practice 
tests with a
very high degree of accuracy with Excel, I'm having trouble 
getting the
logic games section done in the allotted time, which for me is 70 
minutes (I
requested and received double time for each section).  If anyone 
knows of any
time efficient methods of diagramming with Excel or some other 
accessible
product, please let me know.  Please also feel free to write me 
directly at
jtfetter at yahoo.com.  I apologize if this question has been asked 
and answered
before.  Thanks.
All Best,
James

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
for
blindlaw:
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oust%40gmai
l.com


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n%40gmail.com


From kelbycarlson at gmail.com  Thu Dec  4 00:54:12 2014
From: kelbycarlson at gmail.com (Kelby Carlson)
Date: Wed, 03 Dec 2014 18:54:12 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT
Message-ID: <547fb0eb.d4248c0a.3162.ffffd55f@mx.google.com>

When you say "master sketch", what exactly do you have in mind?

K.



 ----- Original Message -----
From: Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
To: "'Michal Nowicki'" <mnowicki4 at icloud.com>,"'Blind Law Mailing 
List'" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Date sent: Wed, 3 Dec 2014 19:32:05 -0500
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Terrific! Those shortcuts help a lot.

Thank you.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978


-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of 
Michal
Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:34 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Hi all,

First, I would suggest sticking with Excel, as it offers the 
greatest
flexibility when it comes to manipulating elements.  To save time 
on the
logic games section, I recommend taking full advantage of the 
copy/paste
feature.  Specifically, you should be easily able to copy your 
master sketch
for hypothetical questions.  Depending on whether you prefer the 
horizontal
or vertical approach, you can select an entire column by pressing 
"Control"
plus the spacebar, or entire row by pressing "Shift" plus the 
spacebar, and
you can then extend the selection to adjacent cells by pressing 
"Shift" plus
the arrow key that corresponds to the direction in which you want 
to extend
the selection.  After that, you can perform copy and paste 
commands just as
you would in any other program.  I hope this helps.

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of 
Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 5:16 PM
To: 'James Fetter'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Please share.

I would also like to know the answer to this question.

Thank you.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of 
James
Fetter via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:09 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Dear all,
I hope this finds you all well and having had a good 
Thanksgiving.  I am
finding that, although I can do logic games on LSAT practice 
tests with a
very high degree of accuracy with Excel, I'm having trouble 
getting the
logic games section done in the allotted time, which for me is 70 
minutes (I
requested and received double time for each section).  If anyone 
knows of any
time efficient methods of diagramming with Excel or some other 
accessible
product, please let me know.  Please also feel free to write me 
directly at
jtfetter at yahoo.com.  I apologize if this question has been asked 
and answered
before.  Thanks.
All Best,
James

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/anitakeithf
oust%40gmai
l.com


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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
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blindlaw:
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oust%40gmai
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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
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n%40gmail.com


From kelbycarlson at gmail.com  Thu Dec  4 01:12:14 2014
From: kelbycarlson at gmail.com (Kelby Carlson)
Date: Wed, 03 Dec 2014 19:12:14 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] LSAT problem
Message-ID: <547fb51e.46598c0a.4035.ffffad9a@mx.google.com>

Speaking as someone going into law school (hopefully), I'd like 
to go to the school ranked the highest of my choices; but 
ultimately what I'm concerned with is long term stability, so I 
won't do that if it means going into serious debt.

K.



 ----- Original Message -----
From: Dennis Clark via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
To: "Aimee Harwood via blindlaw" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Date sent: Wed, 3 Dec 2014 16:29:47 -0800
Subject: [blindlaw] LSAT problem

Hello Aimee,
I'm writing to you off list.  Your situation is quite typical 
when working with the LSAC.  I realize you didn't ask for law 
school advice, but here goes.  As you undoubtedly know, getting 
into a good law school is difficult, and getting into a great law 
school is extremely difficult.  For this reason, your law school 
application needs to be as perfect as is humanly possible, and 
this means that your LSAT score needs to be as high as you are 
capable of scoring.  Obviously you can take the test a second 
time to improve an unfortunate score, but the people who get into 
the best law schools get it right the first time.  I can also 
tell you, that you must go to the highest ranked law school to 
which you are admitted.  Its very strange in a way, but in the 
legal profession, where one went to law school continues to 
remain important throughout one's career.  I always look up where 
opposing counsel went to law school, just to get a feel for who I 
am going to be dealing with, and rarely has this given me a wrong 
steer.  This does not mean that a great lawyer cannot come from a 
lower ranked school, but if they went to a top five school, I 
know that I'm going to have to be at the top of my game all the 
time.  For this reason, its important that you not shoot yourself 
in the foot by taking the LSAT before you are fully prepared, or 
until the LSAC has given you everything you need to deliver a 
score which represents your true ability, and not an unlevel 
playing field.  I know this is a hard decision, because you have 
been preparing and gearing up to take the LSAT now, and get it 
behind you, but you will not be able to put a low score behind 
you.  As I mentioned in my last email, I can't help you legally 
since I'm not licensed in Pennsylvania, but I am happy to provide 
advice in your journey to go through law school.  I look forward 
to hearing from you if there is anything I can do to help.
All the best,
Dennis
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n%40gmail.com


From mnowicki4 at icloud.com  Thu Dec  4 01:42:46 2014
From: mnowicki4 at icloud.com (Michal Nowicki)
Date: Wed, 03 Dec 2014 19:42:46 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT
In-Reply-To: <547fb0eb.d4248c0a.3162.ffffd55f@mx.google.com>
References: <547fb0eb.d4248c0a.3162.ffffd55f@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <000501d00f63$9b8c8180$d2a58480$@icloud.com>

By "master sketch", I mean the diagram that applies to an entire game, not
just to a specific question within a game.  For example, "Which of the
following must be true?" is a question that must be answered from the master
sketch because it doesn't introduce any new conditions.  However, a question
like "If John performs immediately after Mary, who cannot perform last?"
requires the creation of a new sketch from the master sketch that
incorporates the new rule that applies only to that question.  Does this
make sense?

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kelby
Carlson via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:54 PM
To: Anita Keith-Foust; Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

When you say "master sketch", what exactly do you have in mind?

K.



 ----- Original Message -----
From: Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
To: "'Michal Nowicki'" <mnowicki4 at icloud.com>,"'Blind Law Mailing List'"
<blindlaw at nfbnet.org Date sent: Wed, 3 Dec 2014 19:32:05 -0500
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Terrific! Those shortcuts help a lot.

Thank you.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978


-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michal
Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:34 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Hi all,

First, I would suggest sticking with Excel, as it offers the greatest
flexibility when it comes to manipulating elements.  To save time on the
logic games section, I recommend taking full advantage of the copy/paste
feature.  Specifically, you should be easily able to copy your master sketch
for hypothetical questions.  Depending on whether you prefer the horizontal
or vertical approach, you can select an entire column by pressing "Control"
plus the spacebar, or entire row by pressing "Shift" plus the spacebar, and
you can then extend the selection to adjacent cells by pressing "Shift" plus
the arrow key that corresponds to the direction in which you want to extend
the selection.  After that, you can perform copy and paste commands just as
you would in any other program.  I hope this helps.

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 5:16 PM
To: 'James Fetter'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Please share.

I would also like to know the answer to this question.

Thank you.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of James
Fetter via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:09 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Dear all,
I hope this finds you all well and having had a good Thanksgiving.  I am
finding that, although I can do logic games on LSAT practice tests with a
very high degree of accuracy with Excel, I'm having trouble getting the
logic games section done in the allotted time, which for me is 70 minutes (I
requested and received double time for each section).  If anyone knows of
any time efficient methods of diagramming with Excel or some other
accessible product, please let me know.  Please also feel free to write me
directly at jtfetter at yahoo.com.  I apologize if this question has been asked
and answered before.  Thanks.
All Best,
James

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/anitakeithf
oust%40gmai
l.com


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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%4
0icloud.com


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blindlaw:
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oust%40gmai
l.com


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n%40gmail.com

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From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Thu Dec  4 01:54:42 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2014 20:54:42 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT
In-Reply-To: <000501d00f63$9b8c8180$d2a58480$@icloud.com>
References: <547fb0eb.d4248c0a.3162.ffffd55f@mx.google.com>
	<000501d00f63$9b8c8180$d2a58480$@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <059401d00f65$46bd77c0$d4386740$@gmail.com>

Yes.

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michal
Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 8:43 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

By "master sketch", I mean the diagram that applies to an entire game, not
just to a specific question within a game.  For example, "Which of the
following must be true?" is a question that must be answered from the master
sketch because it doesn't introduce any new conditions.  However, a question
like "If John performs immediately after Mary, who cannot perform last?"
requires the creation of a new sketch from the master sketch that
incorporates the new rule that applies only to that question.  Does this
make sense?

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kelby
Carlson via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:54 PM
To: Anita Keith-Foust; Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

When you say "master sketch", what exactly do you have in mind?

K.



 ----- Original Message -----
From: Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
To: "'Michal Nowicki'" <mnowicki4 at icloud.com>,"'Blind Law Mailing List'"
<blindlaw at nfbnet.org Date sent: Wed, 3 Dec 2014 19:32:05 -0500
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Terrific! Those shortcuts help a lot.

Thank you.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978


-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michal
Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:34 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Hi all,

First, I would suggest sticking with Excel, as it offers the greatest
flexibility when it comes to manipulating elements.  To save time on the
logic games section, I recommend taking full advantage of the copy/paste
feature.  Specifically, you should be easily able to copy your master sketch
for hypothetical questions.  Depending on whether you prefer the horizontal
or vertical approach, you can select an entire column by pressing "Control"
plus the spacebar, or entire row by pressing "Shift" plus the spacebar, and
you can then extend the selection to adjacent cells by pressing "Shift" plus
the arrow key that corresponds to the direction in which you want to extend
the selection.  After that, you can perform copy and paste commands just as
you would in any other program.  I hope this helps.

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 5:16 PM
To: 'James Fetter'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Please share.

I would also like to know the answer to this question.

Thank you.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of James
Fetter via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:09 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Dear all,
I hope this finds you all well and having had a good Thanksgiving.  I am
finding that, although I can do logic games on LSAT practice tests with a
very high degree of accuracy with Excel, I'm having trouble getting the
logic games section done in the allotted time, which for me is 70 minutes (I
requested and received double time for each section).  If anyone knows of
any time efficient methods of diagramming with Excel or some other
accessible product, please let me know.  Please also feel free to write me
directly at jtfetter at yahoo.com.  I apologize if this question has been asked
and answered before.  Thanks.
All Best,
James

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/anitakeithf
oust%40gmai
l.com


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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
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0icloud.com


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blindlaw:
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oust%40gmai
l.com


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l.com



From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Thu Dec  4 02:19:27 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2014 21:19:27 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT
In-Reply-To: <547fb04a.ca80e00a.0d3a.ffff8a37@mx.google.com>
References: <547fb04a.ca80e00a.0d3a.ffff8a37@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <059601d00f68$bbeea8e0$33cbfaa0$@gmail.com>

K:

I am no expert, but here is my stab at it.

The rules method does work in some scenarios such as a grab a rule question
(the correct answer is a complete solution).

I still put the correct answer in a grid because it may help me with some of
the other questions .

Example: 
There are six students in gym class. 
The order in which the students in the classroom must be consistent with:

Then there are a list of rules.

Which of the following could be the order in which the students enter the
classroom?

Then there is a list with the student names scrambled and only one of the
options fit the rules. These are considered "grab a rule."

Are there any other question types that you have found that you can rely on
the rules method?

Thanks.


Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: Kelby Carlson [mailto:kelbycarlson at gmail.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 7:52 PM
To: Anita Keith-Foust; Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

I know I may have the minority opinion, but I actually think the rules
method can work quite well.

K.



 ----- Original Message -----
From: Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
To: "'James Fetter'" <jtfetter at yahoo.com>,"'Blind Law Mailing List'"
<blindlaw at nfbnet.org Date sent: Wed, 3 Dec 2014 18:15:58 -0500
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Please share.

I would also like to know the answer to this question.

Thank you.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of James
Fetter via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:09 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Dear all,
I hope this finds you all well and having had a good Thanksgiving.  I am
finding that, although I can do logic games on LSAT practice tests with a
very high degree of accuracy with Excel, I'm having trouble getting the
logic games section done in the allotted time, which for me is 70 minutes (I
requested and received double time for each section).  If anyone knows of
any time efficient methods of diagramming with Excel or some other
accessible product, please let me know.  Please also feel free to write me
directly at jtfetter at yahoo.com.  I apologize if this question has been asked
and answered before.  Thanks.
All Best,
James

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
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oust%40gmai
l.com


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From kelbycarlson at gmail.com  Thu Dec  4 02:18:45 2014
From: kelbycarlson at gmail.com (Kelby Carlson)
Date: Wed, 03 Dec 2014 20:18:45 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT
Message-ID: <547fc4b5.46598c0a.4035.ffffba25@mx.google.com>

Yes.  What does a "master sketch" look like, exactly? This is 
what I'm having trouble with.

K.



 ----- Original Message -----
From: Michal Nowicki via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List' <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Date sent: Wed, 03 Dec 2014 19:42:46 -0600
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

By "master sketch", I mean the diagram that applies to an entire 
game, not
just to a specific question within a game.  For example, "Which 
of the
following must be true?" is a question that must be answered from 
the master
sketch because it doesn't introduce any new conditions.  However, 
a question
like "If John performs immediately after Mary, who cannot perform 
last?"
requires the creation of a new sketch from the master sketch that
incorporates the new rule that applies only to that question.  
Does this
make sense?

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of 
Kelby
Carlson via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:54 PM
To: Anita Keith-Foust; Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

When you say "master sketch", what exactly do you have in mind?

K.



 ----- Original Message -----
From: Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
To: "'Michal Nowicki'" <mnowicki4 at icloud.com>,"'Blind Law Mailing 
List'"
<blindlaw at nfbnet.org Date sent: Wed, 3 Dec 2014 19:32:05 -0500
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Terrific! Those shortcuts help a lot.

Thank you.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978


-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of 
Michal
Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:34 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Hi all,

First, I would suggest sticking with Excel, as it offers the 
greatest
flexibility when it comes to manipulating elements.  To save time 
on the
logic games section, I recommend taking full advantage of the 
copy/paste
feature.  Specifically, you should be easily able to copy your 
master sketch
for hypothetical questions.  Depending on whether you prefer the 
horizontal
or vertical approach, you can select an entire column by pressing 
"Control"
plus the spacebar, or entire row by pressing "Shift" plus the 
spacebar, and
you can then extend the selection to adjacent cells by pressing 
"Shift" plus
the arrow key that corresponds to the direction in which you want 
to extend
the selection.  After that, you can perform copy and paste 
commands just as
you would in any other program.  I hope this helps.

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of 
Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 5:16 PM
To: 'James Fetter'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Please share.

I would also like to know the answer to this question.

Thank you.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of 
James
Fetter via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:09 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Dear all,
I hope this finds you all well and having had a good 
Thanksgiving.  I am
finding that, although I can do logic games on LSAT practice 
tests with a
very high degree of accuracy with Excel, I'm having trouble 
getting the
logic games section done in the allotted time, which for me is 70 
minutes (I
requested and received double time for each section).  If anyone 
knows of
any time efficient methods of diagramming with Excel or some 
other
accessible product, please let me know.  Please also feel free to 
write me
directly at jtfetter at yahoo.com.  I apologize if this question has 
been asked
and answered before.  Thanks.
All Best,
James

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
for
blindlaw:
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oust%40gmai
l.com


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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
for
blindlaw:
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0icloud.com


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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
for
blindlaw:
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oust%40gmai
l.com


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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
for blindlaw:
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n%40gmail.com

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blindlaw:
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From awildheir at gmail.com  Thu Dec  4 03:27:06 2014
From: awildheir at gmail.com (Aimee Harwood)
Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2014 22:27:06 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] LSAT problem
In-Reply-To: <547fb51e.46598c0a.4035.ffffad9a@mx.google.com>
References: <547fb51e.46598c0a.4035.ffffad9a@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <CABD1405-8DB6-408B-AC48-D9543848C27C@gmail.com>

That sounds like a wise plan. :-) thanks so much for the info. I will be canceling my test tomorrow.

Aimee

Sent from my iPhone

> On Dec 3, 2014, at 8:12 PM, Kelby Carlson via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Speaking as someone going into law school (hopefully), I'd like to go to the school ranked the highest of my choices; but ultimately what I'm concerned with is long term stability, so I won't do that if it means going into serious debt.
> 
> K.
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Dennis Clark via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> To: "Aimee Harwood via blindlaw" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> Date sent: Wed, 3 Dec 2014 16:29:47 -0800
> Subject: [blindlaw] LSAT problem
> 
> Hello Aimee,
> I'm writing to you off list.  Your situation is quite typical when working with the LSAC.  I realize you didn't ask for law school advice, but here goes.  As you undoubtedly know, getting into a good law school is difficult, and getting into a great law school is extremely difficult.  For this reason, your law school application needs to be as perfect as is humanly possible, and this means that your LSAT score needs to be as high as you are capable of scoring.  Obviously you can take the test a second time to improve an unfortunate score, but the people who get into the best law schools get it right the first time.  I can also tell you, that you must go to the highest ranked law school to which you are admitted.  Its very strange in a way, but in the legal profession, where one went to law school continues to remain important throughout one's career.  I always look up where opposing counsel went to law school, just to get a feel for who I am going to be dealing with, and rarely has this given me a wrong steer.  This does not mean that a great lawyer cannot come from a lower ranked school, but if they went to a top five school, I know that I'm going to have to be at the top of my game all the time.  For this reason, its important that you not shoot yourself in the foot by taking the LSAT before you are fully prepared, or until the LSAC has given you everything you need to deliver a score which represents your true ability, and not an unlevel playing field.  I know this is a hard decision, because you have been preparing and gearing up to take the LSAT now, and get it behind you, but you will not be able to put a low score behind you.  As I mentioned in my last email, I can't help you legally since I'm not licensed in Pennsylvania, but I am happy to provide advice in your journey to go through law school.  I look forward to hearing from you if there is anything I can do to help.
> All the best,
> Dennis
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/kelbycarlso
> n%40gmail.com
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/awildheir%40gmail.com


From kelbycarlson at gmail.com  Thu Dec  4 16:19:42 2014
From: kelbycarlson at gmail.com (Kelby Carlson)
Date: Thu, 04 Dec 2014 10:19:42 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT
Message-ID: <548089ce.49318c0a.8a83.ffff81d7@mx.google.com>

Michal,

Could you provide me with an example of a master sketch so I can 
have a concrete idea of what you mean when you describe it?

K.



 ----- Original Message -----
From: Michal Nowicki via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List' <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Date sent: Wed, 03 Dec 2014 17:34:26 -0600
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Hi all,

First, I would suggest sticking with Excel, as it offers the 
greatest
flexibility when it comes to manipulating elements.  To save time 
on the
logic games section, I recommend taking full advantage of the 
copy/paste
feature.  Specifically, you should be easily able to copy your 
master sketch
for hypothetical questions.  Depending on whether you prefer the 
horizontal
or vertical approach, you can select an entire column by pressing 
"Control"
plus the spacebar, or entire row by pressing "Shift" plus the 
spacebar, and
you can then extend the selection to adjacent cells by pressing 
"Shift" plus
the arrow key that corresponds to the direction in which you want 
to extend
the selection.  After that, you can perform copy and paste 
commands just as
you would in any other program.  I hope this helps.

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of 
Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 5:16 PM
To: 'James Fetter'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Please share.

I would also like to know the answer to this question.

Thank you.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of 
James
Fetter via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:09 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Dear all,
I hope this finds you all well and having had a good 
Thanksgiving.  I am
finding that, although I can do logic games on LSAT practice 
tests with a
very high degree of accuracy with Excel, I'm having trouble 
getting the
logic games section done in the allotted time, which for me is 70 
minutes (I
requested and received double time for each section).  If anyone 
knows of any
time efficient methods of diagramming with Excel or some other 
accessible
product, please let me know.  Please also feel free to write me 
directly at
jtfetter at yahoo.com.  I apologize if this question has been asked 
and answered
before.  Thanks.
All Best,
James

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/anitakeithf
oust%40gmai
l.com


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blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%4
0icloud.com


_______________________________________________
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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
for blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/kelbycarlso
n%40gmail.com


From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Thu Dec  4 16:27:04 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2014 11:27:04 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT
In-Reply-To: <548089ce.49318c0a.8a83.ffff81d7@mx.google.com>
References: <548089ce.49318c0a.8a83.ffff81d7@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <063001d00fdf$252108f0$6f631ad0$@gmail.com>

Michal:

I want to see it too.

Thanks.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kelby
Carlson via blindlaw
Sent: Thursday, December 4, 2014 11:20 AM
To: Michal Nowicki; Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Michal,

Could you provide me with an example of a master sketch so I can have a
concrete idea of what you mean when you describe it?

K.



 ----- Original Message -----
From: Michal Nowicki via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List' <blindlaw at nfbnet.org Date sent: Wed, 03 Dec
2014 17:34:26 -0600
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Hi all,

First, I would suggest sticking with Excel, as it offers the greatest
flexibility when it comes to manipulating elements.  To save time on the
logic games section, I recommend taking full advantage of the copy/paste
feature.  Specifically, you should be easily able to copy your master sketch
for hypothetical questions.  Depending on whether you prefer the horizontal
or vertical approach, you can select an entire column by pressing "Control"
plus the spacebar, or entire row by pressing "Shift" plus the spacebar, and
you can then extend the selection to adjacent cells by pressing "Shift" plus
the arrow key that corresponds to the direction in which you want to extend
the selection.  After that, you can perform copy and paste commands just as
you would in any other program.  I hope this helps.

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 5:16 PM
To: 'James Fetter'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Please share.

I would also like to know the answer to this question.

Thank you.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of James
Fetter via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:09 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Dear all,
I hope this finds you all well and having had a good Thanksgiving.  I am
finding that, although I can do logic games on LSAT practice tests with a
very high degree of accuracy with Excel, I'm having trouble getting the
logic games section done in the allotted time, which for me is 70 minutes (I
requested and received double time for each section).  If anyone knows of
any time efficient methods of diagramming with Excel or some other
accessible product, please let me know.  Please also feel free to write me
directly at jtfetter at yahoo.com.  I apologize if this question has been asked
and answered before.  Thanks.
All Best,
James

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/anitakeithf
oust%40gmai
l.com


_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%4
0icloud.com


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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
for blindlaw:
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n%40gmail.com

_______________________________________________
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blindlaw:
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l.com



From mnowicki4 at icloud.com  Thu Dec  4 17:57:41 2014
From: mnowicki4 at icloud.com (Michal Nowicki)
Date: Thu, 04 Dec 2014 11:57:41 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT
In-Reply-To: <063001d00fdf$252108f0$6f631ad0$@gmail.com>
References: <548089ce.49318c0a.8a83.ffff81d7@mx.google.com>
	<063001d00fdf$252108f0$6f631ad0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <000801d00feb$cd22b740$676825c0$@icloud.com>

There is no "universal" master sketch that works for all games.  Instead,
the type of master sketch you need depends on the type of games you are
dealing with.  There are 4 basic types of logic games that appear on the
LSAT:  sequencing, matching, distribution, and selection.

Sequencing games are the most common on the LSAT.  In fact, you are pretty
much guaranteed to get at least 1 (and sometimes as many as 3) sequencing
games of some kind in every logic games section you encounter.  In these
games, your task is to put elements in a specific order (for example,
arrange 6 horses in a straight line for the start of a race, schedule 7
auditions, rank 8 schools, etc.) For this game type, I recommend a master
sketch consisting of 2 rows.  The top row should contain the slot headings,
while the bottom row should be reserved for entities that can be built
directly into the sketch.  For instance, in a game where you must determine
the order in which 6 singers will perform, create slots 1-6 in the top row
of the sketch, using 1 column for each slot, and if you are given a concrete
rule like "John must always perform second," fill in "J" in the row under
the number "2".

Selection games are the next most common type.  In these games, you are
asked to choose a smaller group from a larger pool (e.g.  4 out of 7 summer
classes, or at least 2, but no more than 5, out of 9 students).  The sketch
for these games is quite straight forward.  All you need is an "in" column
for the items that are selected, and an "out" column for the ones that are
rejected.

Matching and distribution games are similar enough that you can solve them
by using the same master sketch for both.  In both types of games, you are
given at least 2  sets of entities.  In a matching game, you must assign
features to specific entities (e.g.  match cars with available interior
designs).  In distribution games, however, you need to divide entities into
groups (e.g.  assign 9 athletes to 3 teams of 3).  In short, the difference
between matching and distribution games is that in the former, entities may
be reused, whereas in the latter, each entity may be used only once in a
given arrangement.  As far as the sketch, use columns for groups, and put
the members of each group under the corresponding group heading.

Unfortunately, the LSAT also contains hybrid games, which combine the
actions described above in various ways.  For example, a game may first ask
you to pick 6 out of 10 musicians (selection) and then to determine the
order in which they can or must perform (sequencing).  For such games, your
master sketch should be built around the most stable action, which, in the
above example, would be sequencing.

I would be happy to send out sample diagrams, but I don't want to create any
unnecessary confusion.  Therefore, please let me know for which type(s) of
game(s) a spreadsheet with specific examples would be most useful.

-----Original Message-----
From: Anita Keith-Foust [mailto:anitakeithfoust at gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, December 4, 2014 10:27 AM
To: 'Kelby Carlson'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'; 'Michal Nowicki'
Cc: AnitaKeithFoust at gmail.com
Subject: RE: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Michal:

I want to see it too.

Thanks.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kelby
Carlson via blindlaw
Sent: Thursday, December 4, 2014 11:20 AM
To: Michal Nowicki; Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Michal,

Could you provide me with an example of a master sketch so I can have a
concrete idea of what you mean when you describe it?

K.



 ----- Original Message -----
From: Michal Nowicki via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List' <blindlaw at nfbnet.org Date sent: Wed, 03 Dec
2014 17:34:26 -0600
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Hi all,

First, I would suggest sticking with Excel, as it offers the greatest
flexibility when it comes to manipulating elements.  To save time on the
logic games section, I recommend taking full advantage of the copy/paste
feature.  Specifically, you should be easily able to copy your master sketch
for hypothetical questions.  Depending on whether you prefer the horizontal
or vertical approach, you can select an entire column by pressing "Control"
plus the spacebar, or entire row by pressing "Shift" plus the spacebar, and
you can then extend the selection to adjacent cells by pressing "Shift" plus
the arrow key that corresponds to the direction in which you want to extend
the selection.  After that, you can perform copy and paste commands just as
you would in any other program.  I hope this helps.

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 5:16 PM
To: 'James Fetter'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Please share.

I would also like to know the answer to this question.

Thank you.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of James
Fetter via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:09 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Dear all,
I hope this finds you all well and having had a good Thanksgiving.  I am
finding that, although I can do logic games on LSAT practice tests with a
very high degree of accuracy with Excel, I'm having trouble getting the
logic games section done in the allotted time, which for me is 70 minutes (I
requested and received double time for each section).  If anyone knows of
any time efficient methods of diagramming with Excel or some other
accessible product, please let me know.  Please also feel free to write me
directly at jtfetter at yahoo.com.  I apologize if this question has been asked
and answered before.  Thanks.
All Best,
James

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From kelbycarlson at gmail.com  Thu Dec  4 18:02:29 2014
From: kelbycarlson at gmail.com (Kelby Carlson)
Date: Thu, 04 Dec 2014 12:02:29 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT
Message-ID: <5480a1e6.83abe00a.7b7f.55ca@mx.google.com>

This is incredibly helpful, and the descriptions are totally 
understandable.  I should be able to make sample diagrams with 
your descriptions at hand.  As I said, I have had a lot of 
success with the rules method and I'm going to have to use it on 
this iteration of the test; but if I take it again in February I 
will make use of this.

K.



 ----- Original Message -----
From: Michal Nowicki via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List' <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Date sent: Thu, 04 Dec 2014 11:57:41 -0600
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

There is no "universal" master sketch that works for all games.  
Instead,
the type of master sketch you need depends on the type of games 
you are
dealing with.  There are 4 basic types of logic games that appear 
on the
LSAT:  sequencing, matching, distribution, and selection.

Sequencing games are the most common on the LSAT.  In fact, you 
are pretty
much guaranteed to get at least 1 (and sometimes as many as 3) 
sequencing
games of some kind in every logic games section you encounter.  
In these
games, your task is to put elements in a specific order (for 
example,
arrange 6 horses in a straight line for the start of a race, 
schedule 7
auditions, rank 8 schools, etc.) For this game type, I recommend 
a master
sketch consisting of 2 rows.  The top row should contain the slot 
headings,
while the bottom row should be reserved for entities that can be 
built
directly into the sketch.  For instance, in a game where you must 
determine
the order in which 6 singers will perform, create slots 1-6 in 
the top row
of the sketch, using 1 column for each slot, and if you are given 
a concrete
rule like "John must always perform second," fill in "J" in the 
row under
the number "2".

Selection games are the next most common type.  In these games, 
you are
asked to choose a smaller group from a larger pool (e.g.  4 out 
of 7 summer
classes, or at least 2, but no more than 5, out of 9 students).  
The sketch
for these games is quite straight forward.  All you need is an 
"in" column
for the items that are selected, and an "out" column for the ones 
that are
rejected.

Matching and distribution games are similar enough that you can 
solve them
by using the same master sketch for both.  In both types of 
games, you are
given at least 2  sets of entities.  In a matching game, you must 
assign
features to specific entities (e.g.  match cars with available 
interior
designs).  In distribution games, however, you need to divide 
entities into
groups (e.g.  assign 9 athletes to 3 teams of 3).  In short, the 
difference
between matching and distribution games is that in the former, 
entities may
be reused, whereas in the latter, each entity may be used only 
once in a
given arrangement.  As far as the sketch, use columns for groups, 
and put
the members of each group under the corresponding group heading.

Unfortunately, the LSAT also contains hybrid games, which combine 
the
actions described above in various ways.  For example, a game may 
first ask
you to pick 6 out of 10 musicians (selection) and then to 
determine the
order in which they can or must perform (sequencing).  For such 
games, your
master sketch should be built around the most stable action, 
which, in the
above example, would be sequencing.

I would be happy to send out sample diagrams, but I don't want to 
create any
unnecessary confusion.  Therefore, please let me know for which 
type(s) of
game(s) a spreadsheet with specific examples would be most 
useful.

-----Original Message-----
From: Anita Keith-Foust [mailto:anitakeithfoust at gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, December 4, 2014 10:27 AM
To: 'Kelby Carlson'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'; 'Michal Nowicki'
Cc: AnitaKeithFoust at gmail.com
Subject: RE: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Michal:

I want to see it too.

Thanks.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of 
Kelby
Carlson via blindlaw
Sent: Thursday, December 4, 2014 11:20 AM
To: Michal Nowicki; Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Michal,

Could you provide me with an example of a master sketch so I can 
have a
concrete idea of what you mean when you describe it?

K.



 ----- Original Message -----
From: Michal Nowicki via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List' <blindlaw at nfbnet.org Date sent: Wed, 
03 Dec
2014 17:34:26 -0600
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Hi all,

First, I would suggest sticking with Excel, as it offers the 
greatest
flexibility when it comes to manipulating elements.  To save time 
on the
logic games section, I recommend taking full advantage of the 
copy/paste
feature.  Specifically, you should be easily able to copy your 
master sketch
for hypothetical questions.  Depending on whether you prefer the 
horizontal
or vertical approach, you can select an entire column by pressing 
"Control"
plus the spacebar, or entire row by pressing "Shift" plus the 
spacebar, and
you can then extend the selection to adjacent cells by pressing 
"Shift" plus
the arrow key that corresponds to the direction in which you want 
to extend
the selection.  After that, you can perform copy and paste 
commands just as
you would in any other program.  I hope this helps.

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of 
Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 5:16 PM
To: 'James Fetter'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Please share.

I would also like to know the answer to this question.

Thank you.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of 
James
Fetter via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:09 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT

Dear all,
I hope this finds you all well and having had a good 
Thanksgiving.  I am
finding that, although I can do logic games on LSAT practice 
tests with a
very high degree of accuracy with Excel, I'm having trouble 
getting the
logic games section done in the allotted time, which for me is 70 
minutes (I
requested and received double time for each section).  If anyone 
knows of
any time efficient methods of diagramming with Excel or some 
other
accessible product, please let me know.  Please also feel free to 
write me
directly at jtfetter at yahoo.com.  I apologize if this question has 
been asked
and answered before.  Thanks.
All Best,
James

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From trw562 at yahoo.com  Fri Dec  5 16:45:31 2014
From: trw562 at yahoo.com (Motorhome Man)
Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2014 16:45:31 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [blindlaw] Legal Help In Nevada For A service dog not being allowed
 in a building
Message-ID: <22933696.3465408.1417797931568.JavaMail.yahoo@jws100203.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>

I need a probono attorney to represent me in an issue regardind a service dog not be allowed in a building in Reno, Nv

From darlene.olsen at gmail.com  Fri Dec  5 17:27:24 2014
From: darlene.olsen at gmail.com (Darlene Olsen)
Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2014 09:27:24 -0800
Subject: [blindlaw] Legal Help In Nevada For A service dog not being
 allowed in a building
In-Reply-To: <22933696.3465408.1417797931568.JavaMail.yahoo@jws100203.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
References: <22933696.3465408.1417797931568.JavaMail.yahoo@jws100203.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CAJCurQKHNKSJicX2PRPsXh0uTGn3=L3YP_=xpxdp6HP6Lwm_gQ@mail.gmail.com>

On 12/5/14, Motorhome Man via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> I need a probono attorney to represent me in an issue regardind a service
> dog not be allowed in a building in Reno, Nv
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/darlene.olsen%40gmail.com
>
Please offer contact information, like email address or telephone number
Respectfully,
D. Olsen
Benicia, California
Darlene.Olsen at gmail.com


From Noel.Nightingale at ed.gov  Fri Dec  5 17:34:47 2014
From: Noel.Nightingale at ed.gov (Nightingale, Noel)
Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2014 11:34:47 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Paralegal position EPA Seattle
Message-ID: <04F1893C93758F4AA7CB436BB26750660136CCA1EBDB@EDUPTCEXMB02.ed.gov>



From: <notifications at usajobs.gov> [DO NOT REPLY] [mailto:notifications at usajobs.gov]
Sent: Friday, December 05, 2014 4:41 AM
To: Nightingale, Noel
Subject: USAJOBS Daily Saved Search Results for Seattle social science, legal, education for 12/5/2014

Paralegal Specialist, GS-0950-11/12<http://www.usajobs.gov/GetJob/ViewDetails/387710500>

Agency: Environmental Protection Agency
Number of Job Opportunities & Location(s): 1 vacancies - Seattle, Washington
Salary: $61,867.00 to $96,398.00 / Per Year
Series and Grade: GS-0950-11/12
Open Period: Thursday, December 4, 2014 to Wednesday, December 17, 2014
Position Information: Permanent - Full-Time
Who May Apply: Any U.S. citizen may apply.


To view the complete list of results on the USAJOBS web site, please click View All Opportunities<http://www.usajobs.gov/JobSearch/Search/GetSavedSearchResults/1941887>.

You received this email because you opted-in to receive customized job search results from USAJOBS. You can make changes or create additional saved searches via the Saved Searches section of your USAJOBS account. This area is located by logging into your USAJOBS account and clicking Saved Searches. Your Search(es) will have an option to modify the criteria. Simply click the Edit hyperlink under the name of the Saved Search to make changes.

This saved search shall expire on 12/6/2014.

Thank you for using USAJOBS!
Sincerely,

The USAJOBS Team
U.S. Office of Personnel Management
1900 E Street NW. Washington, DC 20415

Add 'notifications at usajobs.gov' to your address book to ensure delivery of USAJOBS emails. If you doubt the authenticity of a USAJOBS email, please visit USAJOBS<https://www.usajobs.gov> using your web browser. From there, you can log in to your account if an activity is being requested or email us directly to inquire about the authenticity of the email by using our contact us<https://www.usajobs.gov/home/contactus> page

Please do not reply to this message. Replies to this message are routed to an unmonitored mailbox. If you have questions or comments please go to our contact us<https://www.usajobs.gov/home/contactus> page.

From Noel.Nightingale at ed.gov  Fri Dec  5 17:56:56 2014
From: Noel.Nightingale at ed.gov (Nightingale, Noel)
Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2014 11:56:56 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Legal Help In Nevada For A service dog not being
 allowed in a building
In-Reply-To: <22933696.3465408.1417797931568.JavaMail.yahoo@jws100203.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
References: <22933696.3465408.1417797931568.JavaMail.yahoo@jws100203.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <04F1893C93758F4AA7CB436BB26750660136CCA1EBF2@EDUPTCEXMB02.ed.gov>

If the issue is as simple as being refused entry to a building, you could file a complaint yourself with U.S. Department of Justice or the relevant federal or state civil rights agency.

Please feel free to call me to discuss.  (206) 607-1632.

Noel Nightingale


-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Motorhome Man via blindlaw
Sent: Friday, December 05, 2014 8:46 AM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Legal Help In Nevada For A service dog not being allowed in a building

I need a probono attorney to represent me in an issue regardind a service dog not be allowed in a building in Reno, Nv _______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
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From ckrugman at sbcglobal.net  Sat Dec  6 03:33:52 2014
From: ckrugman at sbcglobal.net (Charles Krugman)
Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2014 19:33:52 -0800
Subject: [blindlaw] Legal Help In Nevada For A service dog not being
	allowed in a building
In-Reply-To: <22933696.3465408.1417797931568.JavaMail.yahoo@jws100203.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
References: <22933696.3465408.1417797931568.JavaMail.yahoo@jws100203.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <BDF3CEBD19B84B25B01120B3CC48FC11@Spike>

    Have you been in contact with the NFB affiliate in Nevada to determine 
what legal resources they might have?
Chuck Krugman, MSW Paralegal
1237 P Street
Fresno ca 93721
559-266-9237

-----Original Message----- 
From: Motorhome Man via blindlaw
Sent: Friday, December 5, 2014 8:45 AM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Legal Help In Nevada For A service dog not being allowed 
in a building

I need a probono attorney to represent me in an issue regardind a service 
dog not be allowed in a building in Reno, Nv
_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
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blindlaw:
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From trw562 at yahoo.com  Sun Dec  7 21:04:44 2014
From: trw562 at yahoo.com (Motorhome Man)
Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2014 21:04:44 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [blindlaw] Service Dog Issue
Message-ID: <765007746.3900542.1417986284308.JavaMail.yahoo@jws100100.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>

Dear Charles (my name to),
  My good friend was 86ed from a private club in Reno that hosts AQA meetings because they don't believe her dog is a service animal. She cannot afford a lawyer to fight them. In addition the Reno police will not enforce state or federal laws. 

Charlie775-440-8789

From awebb2168 at gmail.com  Mon Dec  8 00:29:07 2014
From: awebb2168 at gmail.com (Andrew Webb)
Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2014 18:29:07 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Service Dog Issue
In-Reply-To: <765007746.3900542.1417986284308.JavaMail.yahoo@jws100100.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
References: <765007746.3900542.1417986284308.JavaMail.yahoo@jws100100.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <017f01d0127d$faff9450$f0febcf0$@com>

Hello,

I believe I may this suggestion to you directly some time ago when you first posted your question, but if you or your friend have not already done so, I would suggest contacting the Nevada Disability Advocacy & Law Center.  It is a privately-run not-for-profit organization dedicated to protecting the rights of persons with disabilities across the state.  I do not know what assistance they would provide in this case, but potentially they could be quite helpful to you.  Below is the contact information for their Reno office:






Reno_Office1875 Plumas Street #1
 Reno, NV 89509
 Phone: 775-333-7878
 Toll-Free: 1-800-992-5715
 Nevada Relay: 711   Fax: 775-786-2520
Website: www.ndalc.org
Email: reno at ndalc.org
Se Habla Español

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Motorhome Man via blindlaw
Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2014 3:05 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Service Dog Issue

Dear Charles (my name to),
  My good friend was 86ed from a private club in Reno that hosts AQA meetings because they don't believe her dog is a service animal. She cannot afford a lawyer to fight them. In addition the Reno police will not enforce state or federal laws. 

Charlie775-440-8789
_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
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From mnowicki4 at icloud.com  Mon Dec  8 16:57:55 2014
From: mnowicki4 at icloud.com (Michal Nowicki)
Date: Mon, 08 Dec 2014 10:57:55 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Preparing for Law School
Message-ID: <000401d01308$1d672730$58357590$@icloud.com>

Dear List Members:

 

I hope this e-mail finds you all well.  As some of you already know, I took
the LSAT last June, and I submitted all my law school applications for fall
2015.  Assuming that I get accepted to at least 1 of my reach/target
schools, I would like to be as prepared as possible for the challenge when
classes begin.  That being said, I spoke with two attorneys who recommend
that I read a book on how to study for law school exams so that I get the
highest grades I am capable of earning.  Does anyone have recommendations as
to specific titles that could be helpful and that are available in an
accessible format through Bookshare, LearningAlly, or any other source?

 

Second, I would like to start familiarizing myself with reading and
analyzing cases.  I know that all first-year students take the same core
classes like Criminal Law, Torts, Civil Procedure, Contracts, etc.,
regardless of where they go to law school.  I further realize that each
professor most likely uses different textbooks, but do all 1Ls generally
study the same cases?  In other words, is predicting the cases I am likely
to encounter as a 1L and familiarizing myself with them ahead of time in
order to make the first year (or even the first quarter/semester) more
manageable a feasible goal?  If so, please send me some suggestions as to
specific case books and where I could acquire them.  Thank you in advance
for your help.

 

All the Best,

 

Michal


From dmanners at jd16.law.harvard.edu  Mon Dec  8 17:12:16 2014
From: dmanners at jd16.law.harvard.edu (Derek Manners)
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2014 12:12:16 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Preparing for Law School
In-Reply-To: <000401d01308$1d672730$58357590$@icloud.com>
References: <000401d01308$1d672730$58357590$@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <EAC7B7A9-B753-4E07-A1CF-75035A0F1134@jd16.law.harvard.edu>

Hello, congrats on finishing the LSAT. I don't know about specific case books but there are a few cases that every professor will have you read in each of those cases you just listed. 

In Civ pro you will almost certainly Marbury v. Maddison (and again in con law).  You will also read Erie_Railroad_v._Tompkins. 

In criminal law and torts, there aren't too many watershed cases. 

In property, you'll almost certainly read a case about eminent domain and the most common one is Kelo versus city of new London. 

Those are the full cases. Case books cut the cases down to smaller chunks. But you can get the full cases online or if you get a textbook, they will almost certainly be in them. 

If you'd like, once you get any textbook, I can let you know what cases we went through in my courses here at Harvard. Learning how to read like a lawyer is by far the most important thing to learn 1L year. 

Best wishes
Derek Manners

Sent from my iPhone

> On Dec 8, 2014, at 11:57 AM, Michal Nowicki via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Dear List Members:
> 
> 
> 
> I hope this e-mail finds you all well.  As some of you already know, I took
> the LSAT last June, and I submitted all my law school applications for fall
> 2015.  Assuming that I get accepted to at least 1 of my reach/target
> schools, I would like to be as prepared as possible for the challenge when
> classes begin.  That being said, I spoke with two attorneys who recommend
> that I read a book on how to study for law school exams so that I get the
> highest grades I am capable of earning.  Does anyone have recommendations as
> to specific titles that could be helpful and that are available in an
> accessible format through Bookshare, LearningAlly, or any other source?
> 
> 
> 
> Second, I would like to start familiarizing myself with reading and
> analyzing cases.  I know that all first-year students take the same core
> classes like Criminal Law, Torts, Civil Procedure, Contracts, etc.,
> regardless of where they go to law school.  I further realize that each
> professor most likely uses different textbooks, but do all 1Ls generally
> study the same cases?  In other words, is predicting the cases I am likely
> to encounter as a 1L and familiarizing myself with them ahead of time in
> order to make the first year (or even the first quarter/semester) more
> manageable a feasible goal?  If so, please send me some suggestions as to
> specific case books and where I could acquire them.  Thank you in advance
> for your help.
> 
> 
> 
> All the Best,
> 
> 
> 
> Michal
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/dmanners%40jd16.law.harvard.edu

From dmanners at jd16.law.harvard.edu  Mon Dec  8 17:14:55 2014
From: dmanners at jd16.law.harvard.edu (Derek Manners)
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2014 12:14:55 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Preparing for Law School
In-Reply-To: <000401d01308$1d672730$58357590$@icloud.com>
References: <000401d01308$1d672730$58357590$@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <537B9613-6031-42E8-9F6F-6E80072D4720@jd16.law.harvard.edu>

I'd also say, if there's any particular interest you have such as disability law, federal securities law, or whatever else you might have gone to school hoping to learn more about, now is a good time to sort of explore different case law and see what keeps you excited and what puts you to sleep. 

Oh, and another trick might be too see if there are any treatises on a subject you are interested in. The treatises will have lots of cases cited to back up the authors' viewpoint about what the law is. This would be a good way to have guidance while reading cases. 

Best
Derek

Sent from my iPhone

> On Dec 8, 2014, at 11:57 AM, Michal Nowicki via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Dear List Members:
> 
> 
> 
> I hope this e-mail finds you all well.  As some of you already know, I took
> the LSAT last June, and I submitted all my law school applications for fall
> 2015.  Assuming that I get accepted to at least 1 of my reach/target
> schools, I would like to be as prepared as possible for the challenge when
> classes begin.  That being said, I spoke with two attorneys who recommend
> that I read a book on how to study for law school exams so that I get the
> highest grades I am capable of earning.  Does anyone have recommendations as
> to specific titles that could be helpful and that are available in an
> accessible format through Bookshare, LearningAlly, or any other source?
> 
> 
> 
> Second, I would like to start familiarizing myself with reading and
> analyzing cases.  I know that all first-year students take the same core
> classes like Criminal Law, Torts, Civil Procedure, Contracts, etc.,
> regardless of where they go to law school.  I further realize that each
> professor most likely uses different textbooks, but do all 1Ls generally
> study the same cases?  In other words, is predicting the cases I am likely
> to encounter as a 1L and familiarizing myself with them ahead of time in
> order to make the first year (or even the first quarter/semester) more
> manageable a feasible goal?  If so, please send me some suggestions as to
> specific case books and where I could acquire them.  Thank you in advance
> for your help.
> 
> 
> 
> All the Best,
> 
> 
> 
> Michal
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/dmanners%40jd16.law.harvard.edu


From chris.stewart at uky.edu  Mon Dec  8 17:28:14 2014
From: chris.stewart at uky.edu (Stewart, Christopher K)
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2014 12:28:14 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Yet Another Service Dog Issue
Message-ID: <CAAyF1PAejGXm+_o0cmz7P15vt6wnZS=Ghy_bfQF+eRCXh7mXMg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi List,

I'm a second-year law student, and I work part time as a clerk in a
downtown firm here in Lexington. Because of the public transportation
system, in order to make a quick, smooth trip from school to work and
back, I use taxi cabs.

After my first few trips, they put in the notes on my call that I have
a guide dog. Afterwards, I started getting the auto-generated messages
that cabs were in route, then 15 minutes later another cab would be in
route, then pretty soon I'm an hour late to work. A company employee
told me specifically that these repeated calls were due to people's
unwillingness to accommodate my dog. Once, a driver showed up, saw my
dog, and left. I called his cell, and he said "I no will take dog."

So, I have company employees, on record, telling me that their drivers
are refusing to take passengers with guide dogs.

I am in Kentucky, and as a law student, I'm obviously busy. However,
I'd love to pursue this. One of the employees even said that it was
terrible of the drivers, and she would do anything to help change it
if she could. Moreover, the general manager wants to work the
situation out. But, the real problem are the owners and the cab
drivers.

 Sorry to go on, but if anyone knows a disability rights attorney in
Lexington, or Louisville, Kentucky, I'd appreciate a reference.

Best,
Chris


-- 
Chris K. Stewart
University of Kentucky College of Law, J.D. Candidate, 2016
Staff Editor, Kentucky Law Journal
Co-President, American Constitution Society
California Institute of the Arts, B.F.A. 2010
Ph:
(502)457-1757


From ckrugman at sbcglobal.net  Mon Dec  8 18:35:24 2014
From: ckrugman at sbcglobal.net (Charles Krugman)
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2014 10:35:24 -0800
Subject: [blindlaw] Yet Another Service Dog Issue
In-Reply-To: <CAAyF1PAejGXm+_o0cmz7P15vt6wnZS=Ghy_bfQF+eRCXh7mXMg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAAyF1PAejGXm+_o0cmz7P15vt6wnZS=Ghy_bfQF+eRCXh7mXMg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <50047F1B543642CBA72C9D51AD44A507@Spike>

Why aren't the NFB state affiliates becoming involved in addressing and 
attempting to resolve these issues? As we are NFB members and support the 
organization that would seem to be a logical progression here.
Chuck

-----Original Message----- 
From: Stewart, Christopher K via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 9:28 AM
To: blindlaw
Subject: [blindlaw] Yet Another Service Dog Issue

Hi List,

I'm a second-year law student, and I work part time as a clerk in a
downtown firm here in Lexington. Because of the public transportation
system, in order to make a quick, smooth trip from school to work and
back, I use taxi cabs.

After my first few trips, they put in the notes on my call that I have
a guide dog. Afterwards, I started getting the auto-generated messages
that cabs were in route, then 15 minutes later another cab would be in
route, then pretty soon I'm an hour late to work. A company employee
told me specifically that these repeated calls were due to people's
unwillingness to accommodate my dog. Once, a driver showed up, saw my
dog, and left. I called his cell, and he said "I no will take dog."

So, I have company employees, on record, telling me that their drivers
are refusing to take passengers with guide dogs.

I am in Kentucky, and as a law student, I'm obviously busy. However,
I'd love to pursue this. One of the employees even said that it was
terrible of the drivers, and she would do anything to help change it
if she could. Moreover, the general manager wants to work the
situation out. But, the real problem are the owners and the cab
drivers.

Sorry to go on, but if anyone knows a disability rights attorney in
Lexington, or Louisville, Kentucky, I'd appreciate a reference.

Best,
Chris


-- 
Chris K. Stewart
University of Kentucky College of Law, J.D. Candidate, 2016
Staff Editor, Kentucky Law Journal
Co-President, American Constitution Society
California Institute of the Arts, B.F.A. 2010
Ph:
(502)457-1757

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/ckrugman%40sbcglobal.net 



From al.elia at aol.com  Mon Dec  8 18:41:24 2014
From: al.elia at aol.com (ALBERT ELIA)
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2014 13:41:24 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Yet Another Service Dog Issue
In-Reply-To: <CAAyF1PAejGXm+_o0cmz7P15vt6wnZS=Ghy_bfQF+eRCXh7mXMg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAAyF1PAejGXm+_o0cmz7P15vt6wnZS=Ghy_bfQF+eRCXh7mXMg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <25AE305E-1483-4EF7-B799-CE3CA4DED788@aol.com>

Call Cathy Jackson. She's the president of NFB KY. Her number is (502)366-2317, or you can email her at president at nfbofky.org


On Dec 8, 2014, at 12:28 PM, Stewart, Christopher K via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org> wrote:

> Hi List,
> 
> I'm a second-year law student, and I work part time as a clerk in a
> downtown firm here in Lexington. Because of the public transportation
> system, in order to make a quick, smooth trip from school to work and
> back, I use taxi cabs.
> 
> After my first few trips, they put in the notes on my call that I have
> a guide dog. Afterwards, I started getting the auto-generated messages
> that cabs were in route, then 15 minutes later another cab would be in
> route, then pretty soon I'm an hour late to work. A company employee
> told me specifically that these repeated calls were due to people's
> unwillingness to accommodate my dog. Once, a driver showed up, saw my
> dog, and left. I called his cell, and he said "I no will take dog."
> 
> So, I have company employees, on record, telling me that their drivers
> are refusing to take passengers with guide dogs.
> 
> I am in Kentucky, and as a law student, I'm obviously busy. However,
> I'd love to pursue this. One of the employees even said that it was
> terrible of the drivers, and she would do anything to help change it
> if she could. Moreover, the general manager wants to work the
> situation out. But, the real problem are the owners and the cab
> drivers.
> 
> Sorry to go on, but if anyone knows a disability rights attorney in
> Lexington, or Louisville, Kentucky, I'd appreciate a reference.
> 
> Best,
> Chris
> 
> 
> -- 
> Chris K. Stewart
> University of Kentucky College of Law, J.D. Candidate, 2016
> Staff Editor, Kentucky Law Journal
> Co-President, American Constitution Society
> California Institute of the Arts, B.F.A. 2010
> Ph:
> (502)457-1757
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/al.elia%40aol.com



From cannona at fireantproductions.com  Mon Dec  8 19:15:49 2014
From: cannona at fireantproductions.com (Aaron Cannon)
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2014 13:15:49 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Yet Another Service Dog Issue
In-Reply-To: <50047F1B543642CBA72C9D51AD44A507@Spike>
References: <CAAyF1PAejGXm+_o0cmz7P15vt6wnZS=Ghy_bfQF+eRCXh7mXMg@mail.gmail.com>
	<50047F1B543642CBA72C9D51AD44A507@Spike>
Message-ID: <CAERFoOgvqGNn8rrY8C4M7oEcPXK3Vb1VziJYtTwvuDhyqOp4zg@mail.gmail.com>

NAGDU (The National Association of Guide Dog Users), an NFB affiliate
has been very active in dealing with these issues.  When folks
encounter issues such as these, they might consider reaching out to
NAGDU.  The best way to do so is either through the NAGDU information
and advocacy hotline, at 1-888-NAGDU-411 (1-888-624-3841).  Or, you
can contact us via the IOS app (just search the app store for
"nagdu").  Or you can just email the president at president at nagdu.org.

The president is not an attorney, but does have a great deal of
experience with all sorts of access issues, including situations which
are exactly like the one described here.

Best of luck.

Aaron

 On 12/8/14, Charles Krugman via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Why aren't the NFB state affiliates becoming involved in addressing and
> attempting to resolve these issues? As we are NFB members and support the
> organization that would seem to be a logical progression here.
> Chuck
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Stewart, Christopher K via blindlaw
> Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 9:28 AM
> To: blindlaw
> Subject: [blindlaw] Yet Another Service Dog Issue
>
> Hi List,
>
> I'm a second-year law student, and I work part time as a clerk in a
> downtown firm here in Lexington. Because of the public transportation
> system, in order to make a quick, smooth trip from school to work and
> back, I use taxi cabs.
>
> After my first few trips, they put in the notes on my call that I have
> a guide dog. Afterwards, I started getting the auto-generated messages
> that cabs were in route, then 15 minutes later another cab would be in
> route, then pretty soon I'm an hour late to work. A company employee
> told me specifically that these repeated calls were due to people's
> unwillingness to accommodate my dog. Once, a driver showed up, saw my
> dog, and left. I called his cell, and he said "I no will take dog."
>
> So, I have company employees, on record, telling me that their drivers
> are refusing to take passengers with guide dogs.
>
> I am in Kentucky, and as a law student, I'm obviously busy. However,
> I'd love to pursue this. One of the employees even said that it was
> terrible of the drivers, and she would do anything to help change it
> if she could. Moreover, the general manager wants to work the
> situation out. But, the real problem are the owners and the cab
> drivers.
>
> Sorry to go on, but if anyone knows a disability rights attorney in
> Lexington, or Louisville, Kentucky, I'd appreciate a reference.
>
> Best,
> Chris
>
>
> --
> Chris K. Stewart
> University of Kentucky College of Law, J.D. Candidate, 2016
> Staff Editor, Kentucky Law Journal
> Co-President, American Constitution Society
> California Institute of the Arts, B.F.A. 2010
> Ph:
> (502)457-1757
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/ckrugman%40sbcglobal.net
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/cannona%40fireantproductions.com
>


From taiablas at gmail.com  Mon Dec  8 19:16:06 2014
From: taiablas at gmail.com (Tai Tomasi)
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2014 13:16:06 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Yet Another Service Dog Issue
In-Reply-To: <CAAyF1PAejGXm+_o0cmz7P15vt6wnZS=Ghy_bfQF+eRCXh7mXMg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAAyF1PAejGXm+_o0cmz7P15vt6wnZS=Ghy_bfQF+eRCXh7mXMg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <042d01d0131b$6acf7550$406e5ff0$@gmail.com>

In addition to contacting Kathy Jackson, your NFB state president, you
should also contact the Kentucky Commission on Human Rights. Their website
is http://www.kchr.ky.gov.

Tai


-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Stewart,
Christopher K via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 08, 2014 11:28 AM
To: blindlaw
Subject: [blindlaw] Yet Another Service Dog Issue

Hi List,

I'm a second-year law student, and I work part time as a clerk in a downtown
firm here in Lexington. Because of the public transportation system, in
order to make a quick, smooth trip from school to work and back, I use taxi
cabs.

After my first few trips, they put in the notes on my call that I have a
guide dog. Afterwards, I started getting the auto-generated messages that
cabs were in route, then 15 minutes later another cab would be in route,
then pretty soon I'm an hour late to work. A company employee told me
specifically that these repeated calls were due to people's unwillingness to
accommodate my dog. Once, a driver showed up, saw my dog, and left. I called
his cell, and he said "I no will take dog."

So, I have company employees, on record, telling me that their drivers are
refusing to take passengers with guide dogs.

I am in Kentucky, and as a law student, I'm obviously busy. However, I'd
love to pursue this. One of the employees even said that it was terrible of
the drivers, and she would do anything to help change it if she could.
Moreover, the general manager wants to work the situation out. But, the real
problem are the owners and the cab drivers.

 Sorry to go on, but if anyone knows a disability rights attorney in
Lexington, or Louisville, Kentucky, I'd appreciate a reference.

Best,
Chris


--
Chris K. Stewart
University of Kentucky College of Law, J.D. Candidate, 2016 Staff Editor,
Kentucky Law Journal Co-President, American Constitution Society California
Institute of the Arts, B.F.A. 2010
Ph:
(502)457-1757

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/taiablas%40gmail.com



From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Tue Dec  9 01:35:48 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2014 20:35:48 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
Message-ID: <018301d01350$76bf3be0$643db3a0$@gmail.com>

Dear All:

 

Has anyone had problems with Blackboard and ZoomText or ZoomText with
Speech?

 

I have had problems for years and the Blackboard technical support team has
not tried to rectify it. They just say that Blackboard is compatible with
JAWS.

 

I have contacted the CEO and Blackboard's legal department because I finally
had to draw the line. I was enrolled in the PowerScore Online LSAT course,
but had to withdraw because of compatibility issues. Also, because
Blackboard is used by a large amount of colleges and universities, this will
probably be an ongoing challenge as I move to graduate school.

 

Ai Squared (the makers of ZoomText) has tried to work with Blackboard for
years and it seems that the ball is in Blackboard's court. I hope that
others will contribute their experiences so that Blackboard will see that
this is a consistent problem.

 

I look forward to your responses.

 

Thank you.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978


From mnowicki4 at icloud.com  Tue Dec  9 03:14:00 2014
From: mnowicki4 at icloud.com (Michal Nowicki)
Date: Mon, 08 Dec 2014 21:14:00 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
In-Reply-To: <018301d01350$76bf3be0$643db3a0$@gmail.com>
References: <018301d01350$76bf3be0$643db3a0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <000001d0135e$2ebfa6f0$8c3ef4d0$@icloud.com>

Hi, Anita,

I'm sorry to hear that you have not been able to access Blackboard with
ZoomText.  I am somewhat surprised that you are experiencing this problem,
given that I successfully used Blackboard with JAWS in my undergrad years
and always thought it was fully compatible with assistive technology.

Since I am a screen reader user, I can't give you any ZoomText-related tips.
However, Windows does have a built-in screen magnifier.  I don't know how it
compares to ZoomText (though I suspect it to be much more basic since it is
a free product), but if it does what you need it to do, perhaps you can
useit to access Blackboard without accessibility barriers at least until the
issue with ZoomText compatibility is resolved.  Good luck.

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 7:36 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Dear All:

 

Has anyone had problems with Blackboard and ZoomText or ZoomText with
Speech?

 

I have had problems for years and the Blackboard technical support team has
not tried to rectify it. They just say that Blackboard is compatible with
JAWS.

 

I have contacted the CEO and Blackboard's legal department because I finally
had to draw the line. I was enrolled in the PowerScore Online LSAT course,
but had to withdraw because of compatibility issues. Also, because
Blackboard is used by a large amount of colleges and universities, this will
probably be an ongoing challenge as I move to graduate school.

 

Ai Squared (the makers of ZoomText) has tried to work with Blackboard for
years and it seems that the ball is in Blackboard's court. I hope that
others will contribute their experiences so that Blackboard will see that
this is a consistent problem.

 

I look forward to your responses.

 

Thank you.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40icloud.com



From mnowicki4 at icloud.com  Tue Dec  9 03:17:16 2014
From: mnowicki4 at icloud.com (Michal Nowicki)
Date: Mon, 08 Dec 2014 21:17:16 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
In-Reply-To: <018301d01350$76bf3be0$643db3a0$@gmail.com>
References: <018301d01350$76bf3be0$643db3a0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <000201d0135e$a2c66930$e8533b90$@icloud.com>

Also, if you need speech, I suggest downloading the free screen reader NVDA.
I haven't personally used it with Blackboard, but if JAWS works fine, I
expect NVDA to pass the test as well.

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 7:36 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Dear All:

 

Has anyone had problems with Blackboard and ZoomText or ZoomText with
Speech?

 

I have had problems for years and the Blackboard technical support team has
not tried to rectify it. They just say that Blackboard is compatible with
JAWS.

 

I have contacted the CEO and Blackboard's legal department because I finally
had to draw the line. I was enrolled in the PowerScore Online LSAT course,
but had to withdraw because of compatibility issues. Also, because
Blackboard is used by a large amount of colleges and universities, this will
probably be an ongoing challenge as I move to graduate school.

 

Ai Squared (the makers of ZoomText) has tried to work with Blackboard for
years and it seems that the ball is in Blackboard's court. I hope that
others will contribute their experiences so that Blackboard will see that
this is a consistent problem.

 

I look forward to your responses.

 

Thank you.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40icloud.com



From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Tue Dec  9 03:24:17 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2014 22:24:17 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
In-Reply-To: <000001d0135e$2ebfa6f0$8c3ef4d0$@icloud.com>
References: <018301d01350$76bf3be0$643db3a0$@gmail.com>
	<000001d0135e$2ebfa6f0$8c3ef4d0$@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <01b401d0135f$9e754210$db5fc630$@gmail.com>

Dear Michal:

I appreciate your concern.

If the text has few words, such as a PowerPoint slide, magnification will
work.

However, if it is a page similar to a textbook page, I need to you the
reader (AppReader) tool in ZoomText. I use ZoomText with speech. 

The PowerScore technical support representative and I experimented with
canned lessons and so, I was able to determine ahead of time that I
definitely would need speech during the lessons.

Thank you.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michal
Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 10:14 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Hi, Anita,

I'm sorry to hear that you have not been able to access Blackboard with
ZoomText.  I am somewhat surprised that you are experiencing this problem,
given that I successfully used Blackboard with JAWS in my undergrad years
and always thought it was fully compatible with assistive technology.

Since I am a screen reader user, I can't give you any ZoomText-related tips.
However, Windows does have a built-in screen magnifier.  I don't know how it
compares to ZoomText (though I suspect it to be much more basic since it is
a free product), but if it does what you need it to do, perhaps you can
useit to access Blackboard without accessibility barriers at least until the
issue with ZoomText compatibility is resolved.  Good luck.

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 7:36 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Dear All:

 

Has anyone had problems with Blackboard and ZoomText or ZoomText with
Speech?

 

I have had problems for years and the Blackboard technical support team has
not tried to rectify it. They just say that Blackboard is compatible with
JAWS.

 

I have contacted the CEO and Blackboard's legal department because I finally
had to draw the line. I was enrolled in the PowerScore Online LSAT course,
but had to withdraw because of compatibility issues. Also, because
Blackboard is used by a large amount of colleges and universities, this will
probably be an ongoing challenge as I move to graduate school.

 

Ai Squared (the makers of ZoomText) has tried to work with Blackboard for
years and it seems that the ball is in Blackboard's court. I hope that
others will contribute their experiences so that Blackboard will see that
this is a consistent problem.

 

I look forward to your responses.

 

Thank you.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40icloud.com


_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/anitakeithfoust%40gmai
l.com



From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Tue Dec  9 03:25:26 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2014 22:25:26 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
In-Reply-To: <000201d0135e$a2c66930$e8533b90$@icloud.com>
References: <018301d01350$76bf3be0$643db3a0$@gmail.com>
	<000201d0135e$a2c66930$e8533b90$@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <01b601d0135f$c7ddb100$57991300$@gmail.com>

Dear Michal:

I will try it.

Thanks.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michal
Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 10:17 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText





From chrisgriggs0 at gmail.com  Tue Dec  9 03:27:25 2014
From: chrisgriggs0 at gmail.com (Chris Griggs)
Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2014 21:27:25 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
In-Reply-To: <000201d0135e$a2c66930$e8533b90$@icloud.com>
References: <018301d01350$76bf3be0$643db3a0$@gmail.com>
	<000201d0135e$a2c66930$e8533b90$@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <CAEu=ibTA74--z2en1ER-u2S8qvNh9+Z5Ha0x2G0+2+E=kK=hVQ@mail.gmail.com>

I only use blackboard for one of my classes and have not experienced any
difficulties in conjunction with ZoomText 10.  One issue that I did have
though, that might be relevant, was after market hardware that caused
problems with YouTube type items.  I bring it up because the software
people were only looking at their aspect of the problem and not my total
system, it took forever for someone to figure out that all the software was
working correctly, until it hit my aftermarket hardware.  I hope it helps.
Good luck.

On Mon, Dec 8, 2014 at 9:17 PM, Michal Nowicki via blindlaw <
blindlaw at nfbnet.org> wrote:

> Also, if you need speech, I suggest downloading the free screen reader
> NVDA.
> I haven't personally used it with Blackboard, but if JAWS works fine, I
> expect NVDA to pass the test as well.
>
> Michal
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
> Keith-Foust via blindlaw
> Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 7:36 PM
> To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
>
> Dear All:
>
>
>
> Has anyone had problems with Blackboard and ZoomText or ZoomText with
> Speech?
>
>
>
> I have had problems for years and the Blackboard technical support team has
> not tried to rectify it. They just say that Blackboard is compatible with
> JAWS.
>
>
>
> I have contacted the CEO and Blackboard's legal department because I
> finally
> had to draw the line. I was enrolled in the PowerScore Online LSAT course,
> but had to withdraw because of compatibility issues. Also, because
> Blackboard is used by a large amount of colleges and universities, this
> will
> probably be an ongoing challenge as I move to graduate school.
>
>
>
> Ai Squared (the makers of ZoomText) has tried to work with Blackboard for
> years and it seems that the ball is in Blackboard's court. I hope that
> others will contribute their experiences so that Blackboard will see that
> this is a consistent problem.
>
>
>
> I look forward to your responses.
>
>
>
> Thank you.
>
>
>
> Anita Keith-Foust
>
> 919-430-1978
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40icloud.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/chrisgriggs0%40gmail.com
>



-- 
Chris Griggs

From mnowicki4 at icloud.com  Tue Dec  9 05:17:50 2014
From: mnowicki4 at icloud.com (Michal Nowicki)
Date: Mon, 08 Dec 2014 23:17:50 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Accessibility of LSAT Prep Course Materials: Action
	Required
Message-ID: <001f01d0136f$7abf2830$703d7890$@icloud.com>

Dear Aimee, Anita, Bruce and Everyone Else interested in improving the
accessibility of LSAT prep class materials:

 

As I expected, Kaplan's ADA coordinator is not responding to my inquiries
about the accessibility of Kaplan textbooks and online resources; I've sent
him two e-mails but have not heard from him at all.  This leads me to
believe that the company has no plans to address this problem, or at least
not in the near future.  Of course, the issue isn't just with Kaplan; the
Princeton Review seems to be out of compliance as well.

 

As a result, it's time for us to take charge.  Before we do anything,
though, I suggest that we set up a phone conference in order to explore
potential options and, hopefully, to come up with a plan of action.  If you
are interested in joining this iniciative, please contact me off list at
mnowicki4 at iCloud.com <mailto:mnowicki4 at iCloud.com>  so that I have an idea
as to who and how many people are willing to participate.  Obviously, the
more people we get, the better our chances of winning this battle.  Thank
you in advance for your support.

 

Best Wishes,

 

Michal


From melaniepeskoe at gmail.com  Tue Dec  9 11:13:26 2014
From: melaniepeskoe at gmail.com (Melanie Peskoe)
Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2014 06:13:26 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
In-Reply-To: <018301d01350$76bf3be0$643db3a0$@gmail.com>
References: <018301d01350$76bf3be0$643db3a0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2FC4B990-AE16-4D82-AFC7-89B3EDC3AF34@gmail.com>

Anita, I'm sorry to hear you are having such troubles. Can you download Window Eyes for speech? I'm in the same situation in that I use both magnification and speech and this is the combination that works for me. I'm starting a PowerScore class today and so far the accessibly testing I've done with their preview material checks out okay. 

Melanie 



> On Dec 8, 2014, at 8:35 PM, Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Dear All:
> 
> 
> 
> Has anyone had problems with Blackboard and ZoomText or ZoomText with
> Speech?
> 
> 
> 
> I have had problems for years and the Blackboard technical support team has
> not tried to rectify it. They just say that Blackboard is compatible with
> JAWS.
> 
> 
> 
> I have contacted the CEO and Blackboard's legal department because I finally
> had to draw the line. I was enrolled in the PowerScore Online LSAT course,
> but had to withdraw because of compatibility issues. Also, because
> Blackboard is used by a large amount of colleges and universities, this will
> probably be an ongoing challenge as I move to graduate school.
> 
> 
> 
> Ai Squared (the makers of ZoomText) has tried to work with Blackboard for
> years and it seems that the ball is in Blackboard's court. I hope that
> others will contribute their experiences so that Blackboard will see that
> this is a consistent problem.
> 
> 
> 
> I look forward to your responses.
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> 
> 
> Anita Keith-Foust
> 
> 919-430-1978
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/melaniepeskoe%40gmail.com


From melaniepeskoe at gmail.com  Tue Dec  9 11:30:39 2014
From: melaniepeskoe at gmail.com (Melanie Peskoe)
Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2014 06:30:39 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] LSAT Accommodations issue
Message-ID: <D48A1A6D-54A3-4560-BF04-4DD2944F1F81@gmail.com>

I have registered to take the LSAT in February. In anticipation of issues related to the accommodations review process I submitted my request very early in November. As indicated by LSAC I waited two weeks before inquiring about the status of my request and was told that it was probably being held for review until after the December administration of the LSAT.  Yesterday I received email notification that more documentation and information is needed before they can make a decision about my accommodations. I have until January 7 to get all supplementary documentation into their office. I am emailing some of the supplementary information today, but other information will have to be obtained from my ophthalmologist. 

My concern is that It may prove difficult to get everything in by the deadline, which is why I submitted my request in early November. I am not too concerned just yet, but the delay from LSAC might pose a problem in my ability to meet their January 7 deadline. Has anyone else ran into a similar situation?

Melanie 




From kelbycarlson at gmail.com  Tue Dec  9 11:49:29 2014
From: kelbycarlson at gmail.com (Kelby Carlson)
Date: Tue, 09 Dec 2014 05:49:29 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] LSAT Accommodations issue
Message-ID: <5486e202.0361e00a.7c67.4848@mx.google.com>

Yes; this was what prevented me from taking the September test 
(although I didn't get my information in as early as you.) This 
seems to be a recurring problem with the LSAC (along with other 
accommodation issues discussed here recently.)

K.



 ----- Original Message -----
From: Melanie Peskoe via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
To: "blindlaw at nfbnet.org" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Date sent: Tue, 9 Dec 2014 06:30:39 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] LSAT Accommodations issue

I have registered to take the LSAT in February.  In anticipation 
of issues related to the accommodations review process I 
submitted my request very early in November.  As indicated by 
LSAC I waited two weeks before inquiring about the status of my 
request and was told that it was probably being held for review 
until after the December administration of the LSAT.  Yesterday I 
received email notification that more documentation and 
information is needed before they can make a decision about my 
accommodations.  I have until January 7 to get all supplementary 
documentation into their office.  I am emailing some of the 
supplementary information today, but other information will have 
to be obtained from my ophthalmologist.

My concern is that It may prove difficult to get everything in by 
the deadline, which is why I submitted my request in early 
November.  I am not too concerned just yet, but the delay from 
LSAC might pose a problem in my ability to meet their January 7 
deadline.  Has anyone else ran into a similar situation?

Melanie



_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
for blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/kelbycarlso
n%40gmail.com


From Susan.Kelly at pima.gov  Tue Dec  9 15:01:35 2014
From: Susan.Kelly at pima.gov (Susan Kelly)
Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2014 15:01:35 +0000
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
In-Reply-To: <000001d0135e$2ebfa6f0$8c3ef4d0$@icloud.com>
References: <018301d01350$76bf3be0$643db3a0$@gmail.com>
	<000001d0135e$2ebfa6f0$8c3ef4d0$@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <BE4C4D55ED9DAD44AF21164D4915BF7244028D0B@SPEXCHMB01.central.pima.gov>

>From past experience with the Windows magnification, from before I had to move on to more powerful magnification and JAWS  / Voice Over for computer use, I personally would not rely on the Windows magnification for anything.  A major problem is that it tends to cut off otherwise viewable portions of the screen, and permit the user to manipulate the image to allow the entire screen to be seen.  This may not be a problem if the user is only magnify small portions of the screen, rather than the entire view, but I suspect that any of us who also need speech would not be able to benefit from anything less than total screen magnification.

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michal Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 08, 2014 8:14 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Hi, Anita,

I'm sorry to hear that you have not been able to access Blackboard with ZoomText.  I am somewhat surprised that you are experiencing this problem, given that I successfully used Blackboard with JAWS in my undergrad years and always thought it was fully compatible with assistive technology.

Since I am a screen reader user, I can't give you any ZoomText-related tips.
However, Windows does have a built-in screen magnifier.  I don't know how it compares to ZoomText (though I suspect it to be much more basic since it is a free product), but if it does what you need it to do, perhaps you can useit to access Blackboard without accessibility barriers at least until the issue with ZoomText compatibility is resolved.  Good luck.

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 7:36 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Dear All:

 

Has anyone had problems with Blackboard and ZoomText or ZoomText with Speech?

 

I have had problems for years and the Blackboard technical support team has not tried to rectify it. They just say that Blackboard is compatible with JAWS.

 

I have contacted the CEO and Blackboard's legal department because I finally had to draw the line. I was enrolled in the PowerScore Online LSAT course, but had to withdraw because of compatibility issues. Also, because Blackboard is used by a large amount of colleges and universities, this will probably be an ongoing challenge as I move to graduate school.

 

Ai Squared (the makers of ZoomText) has tried to work with Blackboard for years and it seems that the ball is in Blackboard's court. I hope that others will contribute their experiences so that Blackboard will see that this is a consistent problem.

 

I look forward to your responses.

 

Thank you.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40icloud.com


_______________________________________________
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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for blindlaw:
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From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Tue Dec  9 15:07:43 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2014 10:07:43 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
In-Reply-To: <2FC4B990-AE16-4D82-AFC7-89B3EDC3AF34@gmail.com>
References: <018301d01350$76bf3be0$643db3a0$@gmail.com>
	<2FC4B990-AE16-4D82-AFC7-89B3EDC3AF34@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <020501d013c1$e3225bc0$a9671340$@gmail.com>

Dear Melanie:

As long as the print was the size of the syllabus, I was fine. But, as the
lesson went forward and the size of the print became smaller and more
textbook like is when I ran into a problem.

I can see 72 size font (as compared to 12 and 18 size font) which takes up
too much space. So, it is the same when I have to magnify text to
accommodate my vision. This slows reading down to almost a halt. In those
situations, I use the AppReader tool on ZoomText with Speech. I can then
speed up the reader to a fast pace.

It is an established fact that BlackBoard is incompatible with ZoomText.
Also, sometimes images appear as text, ZoomText cannot read images.

I am downloading Windows Eyes right now.

Thank you for the tip. I will let you know how it works out.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: Melanie Peskoe [mailto:melaniepeskoe at gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 6:13 AM
To: Anita Keith-Foust; Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Anita, I'm sorry to hear you are having such troubles. Can you download
Window Eyes for speech? I'm in the same situation in that I use both
magnification and speech and this is the combination that works for me. I'm
starting a PowerScore class today and so far the accessibly testing I've
done with their preview material checks out okay. 

Melanie 



> On Dec 8, 2014, at 8:35 PM, Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw
<blindlaw at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Dear All:
> 
> 
> 
> Has anyone had problems with Blackboard and ZoomText or ZoomText with 
> Speech?
> 
> 
> 
> I have had problems for years and the Blackboard technical support 
> team has not tried to rectify it. They just say that Blackboard is 
> compatible with JAWS.
> 
> 
> 
> I have contacted the CEO and Blackboard's legal department because I 
> finally had to draw the line. I was enrolled in the PowerScore Online 
> LSAT course, but had to withdraw because of compatibility issues. 
> Also, because Blackboard is used by a large amount of colleges and 
> universities, this will probably be an ongoing challenge as I move to
graduate school.
> 
> 
> 
> Ai Squared (the makers of ZoomText) has tried to work with Blackboard 
> for years and it seems that the ball is in Blackboard's court. I hope 
> that others will contribute their experiences so that Blackboard will 
> see that this is a consistent problem.
> 
> 
> 
> I look forward to your responses.
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> 
> 
> Anita Keith-Foust
> 
> 919-430-1978
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/melaniepeskoe%40
> gmail.com



From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Tue Dec  9 15:30:17 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2014 10:30:17 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] LSAT Accommodations issue
In-Reply-To: <D48A1A6D-54A3-4560-BF04-4DD2944F1F81@gmail.com>
References: <D48A1A6D-54A3-4560-BF04-4DD2944F1F81@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <020d01d013c5$09fb17c0$1df14740$@gmail.com>

Dear Melanie:

You are running against the holiday schedule. I suggest that, today, you let
your ophthalmologist know that you need this by the end of this week for the
reasons you have already stated, and email  and Fax it the day you get it. I
am sure that the doctor will understand. 

Good luck!

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978




-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Melanie
Peskoe via blindlaw
Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 6:31 AM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] LSAT Accommodations issue

I have registered to take the LSAT in February. In anticipation of issues
related to the accommodations review process I submitted my request very
early in November. As indicated by LSAC I waited two weeks before inquiring
about the status of my request and was told that it was probably being held
for review until after the December administration of the LSAT.  Yesterday I
received email notification that more documentation and information is
needed before they can make a decision about my accommodations. I have until
January 7 to get all supplementary documentation into their office. I am
emailing some of the supplementary information today, but other information
will have to be obtained from my ophthalmologist. 

My concern is that It may prove difficult to get everything in by the
deadline, which is why I submitted my request in early November. I am not
too concerned just yet, but the delay from LSAC might pose a problem in my
ability to meet their January 7 deadline. Has anyone else ran into a similar
situation?

Melanie 



_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/anitakeithfoust%40gmai
l.com



From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Tue Dec  9 15:35:54 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2014 10:35:54 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
In-Reply-To: <BE4C4D55ED9DAD44AF21164D4915BF7244028D0B@SPEXCHMB01.central.pima.gov>
References: <018301d01350$76bf3be0$643db3a0$@gmail.com>
	<000001d0135e$2ebfa6f0$8c3ef4d0$@icloud.com>
	<BE4C4D55ED9DAD44AF21164D4915BF7244028D0B@SPEXCHMB01.central.pima.gov>
Message-ID: <020f01d013c5$d33eaed0$79bc0c70$@gmail.com>

Dear Melanie and Susan:

So, is Windows Eyes a reader or just magnification?

I need a reader that will work with Blackboard and ZoomText. 

Note: JAWS is expensive, so that is not in the cards as a purchase to use
Blackboard. Blackboard has got to step up.

Thanks.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978 

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Susan Kelly
via blindlaw
Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 10:02 AM
To: 'Michal Nowicki'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

>From past experience with the Windows magnification, from before I had to
move on to more powerful magnification and JAWS  / Voice Over for computer
use, I personally would not rely on the Windows magnification for anything.
A major problem is that it tends to cut off otherwise viewable portions of
the screen, and permit the user to manipulate the image to allow the entire
screen to be seen.  This may not be a problem if the user is only magnify
small portions of the screen, rather than the entire view, but I suspect
that any of us who also need speech would not be able to benefit from
anything less than total screen magnification.

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michal
Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 08, 2014 8:14 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Hi, Anita,

I'm sorry to hear that you have not been able to access Blackboard with
ZoomText.  I am somewhat surprised that you are experiencing this problem,
given that I successfully used Blackboard with JAWS in my undergrad years
and always thought it was fully compatible with assistive technology.

Since I am a screen reader user, I can't give you any ZoomText-related tips.
However, Windows does have a built-in screen magnifier.  I don't know how it
compares to ZoomText (though I suspect it to be much more basic since it is
a free product), but if it does what you need it to do, perhaps you can
useit to access Blackboard without accessibility barriers at least until the
issue with ZoomText compatibility is resolved.  Good luck.

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 7:36 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Dear All:

 

Has anyone had problems with Blackboard and ZoomText or ZoomText with
Speech?

 

I have had problems for years and the Blackboard technical support team has
not tried to rectify it. They just say that Blackboard is compatible with
JAWS.

 

I have contacted the CEO and Blackboard's legal department because I finally
had to draw the line. I was enrolled in the PowerScore Online LSAT course,
but had to withdraw because of compatibility issues. Also, because
Blackboard is used by a large amount of colleges and universities, this will
probably be an ongoing challenge as I move to graduate school.

 

Ai Squared (the makers of ZoomText) has tried to work with Blackboard for
years and it seems that the ball is in Blackboard's court. I hope that
others will contribute their experiences so that Blackboard will see that
this is a consistent problem.

 

I look forward to your responses.

 

Thank you.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40icloud.com


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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/susan.kelly%40pima.gov

_______________________________________________
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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
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l.com



From Susan.Kelly at pima.gov  Tue Dec  9 15:55:03 2014
From: Susan.Kelly at pima.gov (Susan Kelly)
Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2014 15:55:03 +0000
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
In-Reply-To: <020f01d013c5$d33eaed0$79bc0c70$@gmail.com>
References: <018301d01350$76bf3be0$643db3a0$@gmail.com>
	<000001d0135e$2ebfa6f0$8c3ef4d0$@icloud.com>
	<BE4C4D55ED9DAD44AF21164D4915BF7244028D0B@SPEXCHMB01.central.pima.gov>
	<020f01d013c5$d33eaed0$79bc0c70$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BE4C4D55ED9DAD44AF21164D4915BF7244028E29@SPEXCHMB01.central.pima.gov>

I'm not really sure about Window Eyes - the resident magnification program in Windows is what I was first using.  I think they are separate.  I currently use JAWS and MAGic at work, and Voice Over at home.  If you have access to an iPad or Mac, Voice Over is pre-loaded and seems to handle almost everything - but I agree - countless companies with countless different computer apps / programs need to learn and follow the law.


-----Original Message-----
From: Anita Keith-Foust [mailto:anitakeithfoust at gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2014 8:36 AM
To: Susan Kelly; 'Blind Law Mailing List'; 'Michal Nowicki'
Cc: AnitaKeithFoust at gmail.com
Subject: RE: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Dear Melanie and Susan:

So, is Windows Eyes a reader or just magnification?

I need a reader that will work with Blackboard and ZoomText. 

Note: JAWS is expensive, so that is not in the cards as a purchase to use Blackboard. Blackboard has got to step up.

Thanks.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978 

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Susan Kelly via blindlaw
Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 10:02 AM
To: 'Michal Nowicki'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

>From past experience with the Windows magnification, from before I had to move on to more powerful magnification and JAWS  / Voice Over for computer use, I personally would not rely on the Windows magnification for anything.
A major problem is that it tends to cut off otherwise viewable portions of the screen, and permit the user to manipulate the image to allow the entire screen to be seen.  This may not be a problem if the user is only magnify small portions of the screen, rather than the entire view, but I suspect that any of us who also need speech would not be able to benefit from anything less than total screen magnification.

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michal Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 08, 2014 8:14 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Hi, Anita,

I'm sorry to hear that you have not been able to access Blackboard with ZoomText.  I am somewhat surprised that you are experiencing this problem, given that I successfully used Blackboard with JAWS in my undergrad years and always thought it was fully compatible with assistive technology.

Since I am a screen reader user, I can't give you any ZoomText-related tips.
However, Windows does have a built-in screen magnifier.  I don't know how it compares to ZoomText (though I suspect it to be much more basic since it is a free product), but if it does what you need it to do, perhaps you can useit to access Blackboard without accessibility barriers at least until the issue with ZoomText compatibility is resolved.  Good luck.

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 7:36 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Dear All:

 

Has anyone had problems with Blackboard and ZoomText or ZoomText with Speech?

 

I have had problems for years and the Blackboard technical support team has not tried to rectify it. They just say that Blackboard is compatible with JAWS.

 

I have contacted the CEO and Blackboard's legal department because I finally had to draw the line. I was enrolled in the PowerScore Online LSAT course, but had to withdraw because of compatibility issues. Also, because Blackboard is used by a large amount of colleges and universities, this will probably be an ongoing challenge as I move to graduate school.

 

Ai Squared (the makers of ZoomText) has tried to work with Blackboard for years and it seems that the ball is in Blackboard's court. I hope that others will contribute their experiences so that Blackboard will see that this is a consistent problem.

 

I look forward to your responses.

 

Thank you.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40icloud.com


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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/susan.kelly%40pima.gov

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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
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l.com



From samarositz at gmail.com  Tue Dec  9 16:37:31 2014
From: samarositz at gmail.com (Stephen Alexander Marositz)
Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2014 08:37:31 -0800
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
In-Reply-To: <BE4C4D55ED9DAD44AF21164D4915BF7244028E29@SPEXCHMB01.central.pima.gov>
References: <018301d01350$76bf3be0$643db3a0$@gmail.com>	<000001d0135e$2ebfa6f0$8c3ef4d0$@icloud.com>	<BE4C4D55ED9DAD44AF21164D4915BF7244028D0B@SPEXCHMB01.central.pima.gov>	<020f01d013c5$d33eaed0$79bc0c70$@gmail.com>
	<BE4C4D55ED9DAD44AF21164D4915BF7244028E29@SPEXCHMB01.central.pima.gov>
Message-ID: <003101d013ce$6ddc4fd0$4994ef70$@gmail.com>

Anita and All 

Can you be specific as to what difficulties you are having?  One thing to
consider is that it may not be Blackboard itself that is presenting you with
the accessibility problems you are facing.  In terms of learning management
system (LMS) accessibility, there are "3 Cs" to keep in mind, containor,
content and capability.  Blackboard, the containor, is fairly accessible as
compared to the other competing LMSs.  It has no control over the content
put in to it by your institution nor does it control what your institution
does with it though.  PerhapsWhile you are working with Blackboard, you
should also involve your institution, faculty, administrators, disability
service provider and information technology to be sure it is not the content
itself that is inaccessible to you.  

I hope this helps.  

Alex
-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Susan Kelly
via blindlaw
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2014 7:55 AM
To: 'Anita Keith-Foust'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'; 'Michal Nowicki'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

I'm not really sure about Window Eyes - the resident magnification program
in Windows is what I was first using.  I think they are separate.  I
currently use JAWS and MAGic at work, and Voice Over at home.  If you have
access to an iPad or Mac, Voice Over is pre-loaded and seems to handle
almost everything - but I agree - countless companies with countless
different computer apps / programs need to learn and follow the law.


-----Original Message-----
From: Anita Keith-Foust [mailto:anitakeithfoust at gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2014 8:36 AM
To: Susan Kelly; 'Blind Law Mailing List'; 'Michal Nowicki'
Cc: AnitaKeithFoust at gmail.com
Subject: RE: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Dear Melanie and Susan:

So, is Windows Eyes a reader or just magnification?

I need a reader that will work with Blackboard and ZoomText. 

Note: JAWS is expensive, so that is not in the cards as a purchase to use
Blackboard. Blackboard has got to step up.

Thanks.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978 

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Susan Kelly
via blindlaw
Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 10:02 AM
To: 'Michal Nowicki'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

>From past experience with the Windows magnification, from before I had to
move on to more powerful magnification and JAWS  / Voice Over for computer
use, I personally would not rely on the Windows magnification for anything.
A major problem is that it tends to cut off otherwise viewable portions of
the screen, and permit the user to manipulate the image to allow the entire
screen to be seen.  This may not be a problem if the user is only magnify
small portions of the screen, rather than the entire view, but I suspect
that any of us who also need speech would not be able to benefit from
anything less than total screen magnification.

-----Original Message-----
From: blind law [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michal
Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 08, 2014 8:14 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Hi, Anita,

I'm sorry to hear that you have not been able to access Blackboard with
ZoomText.  I am somewhat surprised that you are experiencing this problem,
given that I successfully used Blackboard with JAWS in my undergrad years
and always thought it was fully compatible with assistive technology.

Since I am a screen reader user, I can't give you any ZoomText-related tips.
However, Windows does have a built-in screen magnifier.  I don't know how it
compares to ZoomText (though I suspect it to be much more basic since it is
a free product), but if it does what you need it to do, perhaps you can
useit to access Blackboard without accessibility barriers at least until the
issue with ZoomText compatibility is resolved.  Good luck.

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 7:36 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Dear All:

 

Has anyone had problems with Blackboard and ZoomText or ZoomText with
Speech?

 

I have had problems for years and the Blackboard technical support team has
not tried to rectify it. They just say that Blackboard is compatible with
JAWS.

 

I have contacted the CEO and Blackboard's legal department because I finally
had to draw the line. I was enrolled in the PowerScore Online LSAT course,
but had to withdraw because of compatibility issues. Also, because
Blackboard is used by a large amount of colleges and universities, this will
probably be an ongoing challenge as I move to graduate school.

 

Ai Squared (the makers of ZoomText) has tried to work with Blackboard for
years and it seems that the ball is in Blackboard's court. I hope that
others will contribute their experiences so that Blackboard will see that
this is a consistent problem.

 

I look forward to your responses.

 

Thank you.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40icloud.com


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blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/susan.kelly%40pima.gov

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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/anitakeithfoust%40gmai
l.com


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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/samarositz%40gmail.com



From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Tue Dec  9 16:40:22 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2014 11:40:22 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
In-Reply-To: <BE4C4D55ED9DAD44AF21164D4915BF7244028E29@SPEXCHMB01.central.pima.gov>
References: <018301d01350$76bf3be0$643db3a0$@gmail.com>
	<000001d0135e$2ebfa6f0$8c3ef4d0$@icloud.com>
	<BE4C4D55ED9DAD44AF21164D4915BF7244028D0B@SPEXCHMB01.central.pima.gov>
	<020f01d013c5$d33eaed0$79bc0c70$@gmail.com>
	<BE4C4D55ED9DAD44AF21164D4915BF7244028E29@SPEXCHMB01.central.pima.gov>
Message-ID: <022c01d013ce$d4c2eec0$7e48cc40$@gmail.com>

Dear Susan and Melanie:

I installed Windows Eyes and ZoomText stopped working. Because my vision is
so low, I cannot see anything without the magnification.

So, I called Ai Squared (the maker of ZoomText and cooperative with Windows
for Windows Eyes) and Dave of technical support said that they do not work
together. Bummer!

Blackboard has got to step up.

Thanks.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978


-----Original Message-----
From: Susan Kelly [mailto:Susan.Kelly at pima.gov] 
Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 10:55 AM
To: 'Anita Keith-Foust'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'; 'Michal Nowicki'
Subject: RE: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

I'm not really sure about Window Eyes - the resident magnification program
in Windows is what I was first using.  I think they are separate.  I
currently use JAWS and MAGic at work, and Voice Over at home.  If you have
access to an iPad or Mac, Voice Over is pre-loaded and seems to handle
almost everything - but I agree - countless companies with countless
different computer apps / programs need to learn and follow the law.


-----Original Message-----
From: Anita Keith-Foust [mailto:anitakeithfoust at gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2014 8:36 AM
To: Susan Kelly; 'Blind Law Mailing List'; 'Michal Nowicki'
Cc: AnitaKeithFoust at gmail.com
Subject: RE: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Dear Melanie and Susan:

So, is Windows Eyes a reader or just magnification?

I need a reader that will work with Blackboard and ZoomText. 

Note: JAWS is expensive, so that is not in the cards as a purchase to use
Blackboard. Blackboard has got to step up.

Thanks.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978 

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Susan Kelly
via blindlaw
Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 10:02 AM
To: 'Michal Nowicki'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

>From past experience with the Windows magnification, from before I had to
move on to more powerful magnification and JAWS  / Voice Over for computer
use, I personally would not rely on the Windows magnification for anything.
A major problem is that it tends to cut off otherwise viewable portions of
the screen, and permit the user to manipulate the image to allow the entire
screen to be seen.  This may not be a problem if the user is only magnify
small portions of the screen, rather than the entire view, but I suspect
that any of us who also need speech would not be able to benefit from
anything less than total screen magnification.

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michal
Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 08, 2014 8:14 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Hi, Anita,

I'm sorry to hear that you have not been able to access Blackboard with
ZoomText.  I am somewhat surprised that you are experiencing this problem,
given that I successfully used Blackboard with JAWS in my undergrad years
and always thought it was fully compatible with assistive technology.

Since I am a screen reader user, I can't give you any ZoomText-related tips.
However, Windows does have a built-in screen magnifier.  I don't know how it
compares to ZoomText (though I suspect it to be much more basic since it is
a free product), but if it does what you need it to do, perhaps you can
useit to access Blackboard without accessibility barriers at least until the
issue with ZoomText compatibility is resolved.  Good luck.

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 7:36 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Dear All:

 

Has anyone had problems with Blackboard and ZoomText or ZoomText with
Speech?

 

I have had problems for years and the Blackboard technical support team has
not tried to rectify it. They just say that Blackboard is compatible with
JAWS.

 

I have contacted the CEO and Blackboard's legal department because I finally
had to draw the line. I was enrolled in the PowerScore Online LSAT course,
but had to withdraw because of compatibility issues. Also, because
Blackboard is used by a large amount of colleges and universities, this will
probably be an ongoing challenge as I move to graduate school.

 

Ai Squared (the makers of ZoomText) has tried to work with Blackboard for
years and it seems that the ball is in Blackboard's court. I hope that
others will contribute their experiences so that Blackboard will see that
this is a consistent problem.

 

I look forward to your responses.

 

Thank you.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40icloud.com


_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/susan.kelly%40pima.gov

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/anitakeithfoust%40gmai
l.com




From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Tue Dec  9 16:50:58 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2014 11:50:58 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Helpful Technical Command Shortcut
Message-ID: <023401d013d0$4fd09760$ef71c620$@gmail.com>

Dear All:

 

Windows 8.1 users can easily uninstall programs by: 

 

Holding down the Windows key and the x key together. This will bring up a
menu, you will see programs and features at the top, click on programs, and
all of the programs on your computer will come up; double click on the
program you want to uninstall; and follow the prompts. 

 

Chris at Ai Squared customer support shared this nifty command.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978 


From sbg at sbgaal.com  Tue Dec  9 17:00:38 2014
From: sbg at sbgaal.com (Shannon)
Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2014 11:00:38 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Helpful Technical Command Shortcut
In-Reply-To: <023401d013d0$4fd09760$ef71c620$@gmail.com>
References: <023401d013d0$4fd09760$ef71c620$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <008d01d013d1$aa7dd410$ff797c30$@sbgaal.com>

How do you clikc with Jaws other than hitting the enter key or is that what
you are saying?

Sincerely,

Shannon Geihsler
Law Office of Shannon Brady Geihsler, PLLC
1001 Main Street, Suite 803
Lubbock, Texas 79423
Phone: (806) 763-3999
Mobile:  (806) 781-9296
Fax:  (806) 749-3752
E-Mail:  sbg at sbgaal.com

This email may contain material that is confidential, privileged and/or
attorney work product for the sole use of the intended recipient. Any
review, reliance or distribution by others or forwarding without express
permission is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient,
please contact the sender and delete all copies.


-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2014 10:51 AM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Helpful Technical Command Shortcut

Dear All:

 

Windows 8.1 users can easily uninstall programs by: 

 

Holding down the Windows key and the x key together. This will bring up a
menu, you will see programs and features at the top, click on programs, and
all of the programs on your computer will come up; double click on the
program you want to uninstall; and follow the prompts. 

 

Chris at Ai Squared customer support shared this nifty command.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978 

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/sbg%40sbgaal.com



From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Tue Dec  9 18:19:23 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2014 13:19:23 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
In-Reply-To: <003101d013ce$6ddc4fd0$4994ef70$@gmail.com>
References: <018301d01350$76bf3be0$643db3a0$@gmail.com>	<000001d0135e$2ebfa6f0$8c3ef4d0$@icloud.com>	<BE4C4D55ED9DAD44AF21164D4915BF7244028D0B@SPEXCHMB01.central.pima.gov>	<020f01d013c5$d33eaed0$79bc0c70$@gmail.com>
	<BE4C4D55ED9DAD44AF21164D4915BF7244028E29@SPEXCHMB01.central.pima.gov>
	<003101d013ce$6ddc4fd0$4994ef70$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <028701d013dc$a937e590$fba7b0b0$@gmail.com>

Dear Alex:

I agree. Here is the response that I received from PowerScore on Friday,
December 5th when I asked about changing the images to pdf:
	"I am not aware of a way to convert the Blackboard slides into a PDF
format, but I am looking into it. I am afraid, even if it is possible to
create a PDF of the slide, that the content may still appear as an image
rather than text. I will keep you posted if I find out anything further."

I am following up, but the class starts tonight and the problem has not been
fixed. If they ever get it into pdf, I will be able to use Adobe Acrobat to
convert the images to text..

The other problem is that Blackboard would freeze and stop working. The PC
would have to be rebooted.

I agree that some professors may not know that they cannot post images of
text, so their content would cause issues. The PowerScore course works to a
degree, except the AppReader tool cannot be used on the materials that
probably are images. 

It has been my experience that Blackboard's technical support personnel,
that my professor and I contacted, absolutely made no efforts to solve the
issue by contacting Ai Squared (the makers of ZoomText). They recommended
JAWS. That is not resolving a compatibility issue that Blackboard has with
ZoomText

Thanks.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Stephen
Alexander Marositz via blindlaw
Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 11:38 AM
To: 'Susan Kelly'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Anita and All 

Can you be specific as to what difficulties you are having?  One thing to
consider is that it may not be Blackboard itself that is presenting you with
the accessibility problems you are facing.  In terms of learning management
system (LMS) accessibility, there are "3 Cs" to keep in mind, containor,
content and capability.  Blackboard, the containor, is fairly accessible as
compared to the other competing LMSs.  It has no control over the content
put in to it by your institution nor does it control what your institution
does with it though.  PerhapsWhile you are working with Blackboard, you
should also involve your institution, faculty, administrators, disability
service provider and information technology to be sure it is not the content
itself that is inaccessible to you.  

I hope this helps.  

Alex
-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Susan Kelly
via blindlaw
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2014 7:55 AM
To: 'Anita Keith-Foust'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'; 'Michal Nowicki'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

I'm not really sure about Window Eyes - the resident magnification program
in Windows is what I was first using.  I think they are separate.  I
currently use JAWS and MAGic at work, and Voice Over at home.  If you have
access to an iPad or Mac, Voice Over is pre-loaded and seems to handle
almost everything - but I agree - countless companies with countless
different computer apps / programs need to learn and follow the law.


-----Original Message-----
From: Anita Keith-Foust [mailto:anitakeithfoust at gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2014 8:36 AM
To: Susan Kelly; 'Blind Law Mailing List'; 'Michal Nowicki'
Cc: AnitaKeithFoust at gmail.com
Subject: RE: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Dear Melanie and Susan:

So, is Windows Eyes a reader or just magnification?

I need a reader that will work with Blackboard and ZoomText. 

Note: JAWS is expensive, so that is not in the cards as a purchase to use
Blackboard. Blackboard has got to step up.

Thanks.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978 

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Susan Kelly
via blindlaw
Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 10:02 AM
To: 'Michal Nowicki'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

>From past experience with the Windows magnification, from before I had to
move on to more powerful magnification and JAWS  / Voice Over for computer
use, I personally would not rely on the Windows magnification for anything.
A major problem is that it tends to cut off otherwise viewable portions of
the screen, and permit the user to manipulate the image to allow the entire
screen to be seen.  This may not be a problem if the user is only magnify
small portions of the screen, rather than the entire view, but I suspect
that any of us who also need speech would not be able to benefit from
anything less than total screen magnification.

-----Original Message-----
From: blind law [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michal
Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 08, 2014 8:14 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Hi, Anita,

I'm sorry to hear that you have not been able to access Blackboard with
ZoomText.  I am somewhat surprised that you are experiencing this problem,
given that I successfully used Blackboard with JAWS in my undergrad years
and always thought it was fully compatible with assistive technology.

Since I am a screen reader user, I can't give you any ZoomText-related tips.
However, Windows does have a built-in screen magnifier.  I don't know how it
compares to ZoomText (though I suspect it to be much more basic since it is
a free product), but if it does what you need it to do, perhaps you can
useit to access Blackboard without accessibility barriers at least until the
issue with ZoomText compatibility is resolved.  Good luck.

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 7:36 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Dear All:

 

Has anyone had problems with Blackboard and ZoomText or ZoomText with
Speech?

 

I have had problems for years and the Blackboard technical support team has
not tried to rectify it. They just say that Blackboard is compatible with
JAWS.

 

I have contacted the CEO and Blackboard's legal department because I finally
had to draw the line. I was enrolled in the PowerScore Online LSAT course,
but had to withdraw because of compatibility issues. Also, because
Blackboard is used by a large amount of colleges and universities, this will
probably be an ongoing challenge as I move to graduate school.

 

Ai Squared (the makers of ZoomText) has tried to work with Blackboard for
years and it seems that the ball is in Blackboard's court. I hope that
others will contribute their experiences so that Blackboard will see that
this is a consistent problem.

 

I look forward to your responses.

 

Thank you.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978

_______________________________________________
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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
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l.com



From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Tue Dec  9 18:24:18 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2014 13:24:18 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Helpful Technical Command Shortcut
In-Reply-To: <008d01d013d1$aa7dd410$ff797c30$@sbgaal.com>
References: <023401d013d0$4fd09760$ef71c620$@gmail.com>
	<008d01d013d1$aa7dd410$ff797c30$@sbgaal.com>
Message-ID: <028901d013dd$59bd9040$0d38b0c0$@gmail.com>

Dear Shannon:

I am not clear about how JAWS works. If you cannot see the menu, I am
guessing that JAWS reads the menu to you and there is some way to indicate
which item that you want to click. So, yes, you would click. 

I am sorry that I cannot help you with how it works with JAWS.

Thank you.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: Shannon [mailto:sbg at sbgaal.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 12:01 PM
To: 'Anita Keith-Foust'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: RE: [blindlaw] Helpful Technical Command Shortcut

How do you clikc with Jaws other than hitting the enter key or is that what
you are saying?

Sincerely,

Shannon Geihsler
Law Office of Shannon Brady Geihsler, PLLC
1001 Main Street, Suite 803
Lubbock, Texas 79423
Phone: (806) 763-3999
Mobile:  (806) 781-9296
Fax:  (806) 749-3752
E-Mail:  sbg at sbgaal.com

This email may contain material that is confidential, privileged and/or
attorney work product for the sole use of the intended recipient. Any
review, reliance or distribution by others or forwarding without express
permission is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient,
please contact the sender and delete all copies.


-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2014 10:51 AM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Helpful Technical Command Shortcut

Dear All:

 

Windows 8.1 users can easily uninstall programs by: 

 

Holding down the Windows key and the x key together. This will bring up a
menu, you will see programs and features at the top, click on programs, and
all of the programs on your computer will come up; double click on the
program you want to uninstall; and follow the prompts. 

 

Chris at Ai Squared customer support shared this nifty command.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978 

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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
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From helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com  Tue Dec  9 20:32:45 2014
From: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com (Helga Schreiber)
Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2014 15:32:45 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
In-Reply-To: <022c01d013ce$d4c2eec0$7e48cc40$@gmail.com>
References: <018301d01350$76bf3be0$643db3a0$@gmail.com>
	<000001d0135e$2ebfa6f0$8c3ef4d0$@icloud.com>
	<BE4C4D55ED9DAD44AF21164D4915BF7244028D0B@SPEXCHMB01.central.pima.gov>
	<020f01d013c5$d33eaed0$79bc0c70$@gmail.com>
	<BE4C4D55ED9DAD44AF21164D4915BF7244028E29@SPEXCHMB01.central.pima.gov>
	<022c01d013ce$d4c2eec0$7e48cc40$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9C459369-747D-4744-BB3B-72779518E39C@gmail.com>

Hi Ms. Anita, this is Helga. How are you? I understand what you mean about Blackboard. I'm actually a JAWS user, and for me sometimes is not so easy to go around it. But perhaps you are better tthan I am And I also understand that you are taking your class tonight, since I'm actually taking a blackboard class, which is online at my college right now.  In fact, I'm actually using JAWS version 14, and I' actually have the other versions of JAWS wiht me. However, I need to find it  first. Would you like me to send you JAWS 12 or 13 in order for you to try it wiht Blackboard? I'm just wondering. If you would like,  can you tell me where  you live?  And if  you would like to reach me, feel free to do  so. My contact information is located below in my email signature. Hope to hear from you soon. Thanks so much and have a nice day. God bless! 

Helga Schreiber

Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter.
Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of Blind Students.
Member of the International Networkers Team (INT).
Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research.
Phone:  (561) 706-5950 
Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com 
Skype: helga.schreiber26 
4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx 
INT Website: http://int4life.com/ 

"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16 
Sent from my iPhone 

> On Dec 9, 2014, at 11:40 AM, Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Dear Susan and Melanie:
> 
> I installed Windows Eyes and ZoomText stopped working. Because my vision is
> so low, I cannot see anything without the magnification.
> 
> So, I called Ai Squared (the maker of ZoomText and cooperative with Windows
> for Windows Eyes) and Dave of technical support said that they do not work
> together. Bummer!
> 
> Blackboard has got to step up.
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> Anita Keith-Foust
> 919-430-1978
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Susan Kelly [mailto:Susan.Kelly at pima.gov] 
> Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 10:55 AM
> To: 'Anita Keith-Foust'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'; 'Michal Nowicki'
> Subject: RE: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
> 
> I'm not really sure about Window Eyes - the resident magnification program
> in Windows is what I was first using.  I think they are separate.  I
> currently use JAWS and MAGic at work, and Voice Over at home.  If you have
> access to an iPad or Mac, Voice Over is pre-loaded and seems to handle
> almost everything - but I agree - countless companies with countless
> different computer apps / programs need to learn and follow the law.
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Anita Keith-Foust [mailto:anitakeithfoust at gmail.com] 
> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2014 8:36 AM
> To: Susan Kelly; 'Blind Law Mailing List'; 'Michal Nowicki'
> Cc: AnitaKeithFoust at gmail.com
> Subject: RE: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
> 
> Dear Melanie and Susan:
> 
> So, is Windows Eyes a reader or just magnification?
> 
> I need a reader that will work with Blackboard and ZoomText. 
> 
> Note: JAWS is expensive, so that is not in the cards as a purchase to use
> Blackboard. Blackboard has got to step up.
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> Anita Keith-Foust
> 919-430-1978 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Susan Kelly
> via blindlaw
> Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 10:02 AM
> To: 'Michal Nowicki'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
> 
> From past experience with the Windows magnification, from before I had to
> move on to more powerful magnification and JAWS  / Voice Over for computer
> use, I personally would not rely on the Windows magnification for anything.
> A major problem is that it tends to cut off otherwise viewable portions of
> the screen, and permit the user to manipulate the image to allow the entire
> screen to be seen.  This may not be a problem if the user is only magnify
> small portions of the screen, rather than the entire view, but I suspect
> that any of us who also need speech would not be able to benefit from
> anything less than total screen magnification.
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michal
> Nowicki via blindlaw
> Sent: Monday, December 08, 2014 8:14 PM
> To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
> 
> Hi, Anita,
> 
> I'm sorry to hear that you have not been able to access Blackboard with
> ZoomText.  I am somewhat surprised that you are experiencing this problem,
> given that I successfully used Blackboard with JAWS in my undergrad years
> and always thought it was fully compatible with assistive technology.
> 
> Since I am a screen reader user, I can't give you any ZoomText-related tips.
> However, Windows does have a built-in screen magnifier.  I don't know how it
> compares to ZoomText (though I suspect it to be much more basic since it is
> a free product), but if it does what you need it to do, perhaps you can
> useit to access Blackboard without accessibility barriers at least until the
> issue with ZoomText compatibility is resolved.  Good luck.
> 
> Michal
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
> Keith-Foust via blindlaw
> Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 7:36 PM
> To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
> 
> Dear All:
> 
> 
> 
> Has anyone had problems with Blackboard and ZoomText or ZoomText with
> Speech?
> 
> 
> 
> I have had problems for years and the Blackboard technical support team has
> not tried to rectify it. They just say that Blackboard is compatible with
> JAWS.
> 
> 
> 
> I have contacted the CEO and Blackboard's legal department because I finally
> had to draw the line. I was enrolled in the PowerScore Online LSAT course,
> but had to withdraw because of compatibility issues. Also, because
> Blackboard is used by a large amount of colleges and universities, this will
> probably be an ongoing challenge as I move to graduate school.
> 
> 
> 
> Ai Squared (the makers of ZoomText) has tried to work with Blackboard for
> years and it seems that the ball is in Blackboard's court. I hope that
> others will contribute their experiences so that Blackboard will see that
> this is a consistent problem.
> 
> 
> 
> I look forward to your responses.
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> 
> 
> Anita Keith-Foust
> 
> 919-430-1978
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40icloud.com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/susan.kelly%40pima.gov
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/anitakeithfoust%40gmai
> l.com
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/helga.schreiber26%40gmail.com

From Noel.Nightingale at ed.gov  Tue Dec  9 22:18:15 2014
From: Noel.Nightingale at ed.gov (Nightingale, Noel)
Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2014 16:18:15 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
In-Reply-To: <028701d013dc$a937e590$fba7b0b0$@gmail.com>
References: <018301d01350$76bf3be0$643db3a0$@gmail.com>
	<000001d0135e$2ebfa6f0$8c3ef4d0$@icloud.com>
	<BE4C4D55ED9DAD44AF21164D4915BF7244028D0B@SPEXCHMB01.central.pima.gov>
	<020f01d013c5$d33eaed0$79bc0c70$@gmail.com>
	<BE4C4D55ED9DAD44AF21164D4915BF7244028E29@SPEXCHMB01.central.pima.gov>
	<003101d013ce$6ddc4fd0$4994ef70$@gmail.com>
	<028701d013dc$a937e590$fba7b0b0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <04F1893C93758F4AA7CB436BB26750660136CCA1EF2C@EDUPTCEXMB02.ed.gov>

Anita,

If you believe you are being denied access to a college on-line program, you have the right to file a discrimination complaint with the U.S. Department of Education's Office for Civil Rights.  The complaint may be filed on-line at www.ed.gov.  

If you believe you are being denied access to a program of a place of public accommodation that is a private entity, you may file a complaint with the U.S. Department of Justice at www.ada.gov.

Please call me if you think I can help.  My work # is 206-607-1632.

Noel Nightingale



-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2014 10:19 AM
To: 'Stephen Alexander Marositz'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'; 'Susan Kelly'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Dear Alex:

I agree. Here is the response that I received from PowerScore on Friday, December 5th when I asked about changing the images to pdf:
	"I am not aware of a way to convert the Blackboard slides into a PDF format, but I am looking into it. I am afraid, even if it is possible to create a PDF of the slide, that the content may still appear as an image rather than text. I will keep you posted if I find out anything further."

I am following up, but the class starts tonight and the problem has not been fixed. If they ever get it into pdf, I will be able to use Adobe Acrobat to convert the images to text..

The other problem is that Blackboard would freeze and stop working. The PC would have to be rebooted.

I agree that some professors may not know that they cannot post images of text, so their content would cause issues. The PowerScore course works to a degree, except the AppReader tool cannot be used on the materials that probably are images. 

It has been my experience that Blackboard's technical support personnel, that my professor and I contacted, absolutely made no efforts to solve the issue by contacting Ai Squared (the makers of ZoomText). They recommended JAWS. That is not resolving a compatibility issue that Blackboard has with ZoomText

Thanks.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Stephen Alexander Marositz via blindlaw
Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 11:38 AM
To: 'Susan Kelly'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Anita and All 

Can you be specific as to what difficulties you are having?  One thing to consider is that it may not be Blackboard itself that is presenting you with the accessibility problems you are facing.  In terms of learning management system (LMS) accessibility, there are "3 Cs" to keep in mind, containor, content and capability.  Blackboard, the containor, is fairly accessible as compared to the other competing LMSs.  It has no control over the content put in to it by your institution nor does it control what your institution does with it though.  PerhapsWhile you are working with Blackboard, you should also involve your institution, faculty, administrators, disability service provider and information technology to be sure it is not the content itself that is inaccessible to you.  

I hope this helps.  

Alex
-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Susan Kelly via blindlaw
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2014 7:55 AM
To: 'Anita Keith-Foust'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'; 'Michal Nowicki'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

I'm not really sure about Window Eyes - the resident magnification program in Windows is what I was first using.  I think they are separate.  I currently use JAWS and MAGic at work, and Voice Over at home.  If you have access to an iPad or Mac, Voice Over is pre-loaded and seems to handle almost everything - but I agree - countless companies with countless different computer apps / programs need to learn and follow the law.


-----Original Message-----
From: Anita Keith-Foust [mailto:anitakeithfoust at gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2014 8:36 AM
To: Susan Kelly; 'Blind Law Mailing List'; 'Michal Nowicki'
Cc: AnitaKeithFoust at gmail.com
Subject: RE: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Dear Melanie and Susan:

So, is Windows Eyes a reader or just magnification?

I need a reader that will work with Blackboard and ZoomText. 

Note: JAWS is expensive, so that is not in the cards as a purchase to use Blackboard. Blackboard has got to step up.

Thanks.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978 

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Susan Kelly via blindlaw
Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 10:02 AM
To: 'Michal Nowicki'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

>From past experience with the Windows magnification, from before I had to move on to more powerful magnification and JAWS  / Voice Over for computer use, I personally would not rely on the Windows magnification for anything.
A major problem is that it tends to cut off otherwise viewable portions of the screen, and permit the user to manipulate the image to allow the entire screen to be seen.  This may not be a problem if the user is only magnify small portions of the screen, rather than the entire view, but I suspect that any of us who also need speech would not be able to benefit from anything less than total screen magnification.

-----Original Message-----
From: blind law [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michal Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 08, 2014 8:14 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Hi, Anita,

I'm sorry to hear that you have not been able to access Blackboard with ZoomText.  I am somewhat surprised that you are experiencing this problem, given that I successfully used Blackboard with JAWS in my undergrad years and always thought it was fully compatible with assistive technology.

Since I am a screen reader user, I can't give you any ZoomText-related tips.
However, Windows does have a built-in screen magnifier.  I don't know how it compares to ZoomText (though I suspect it to be much more basic since it is a free product), but if it does what you need it to do, perhaps you can useit to access Blackboard without accessibility barriers at least until the issue with ZoomText compatibility is resolved.  Good luck.

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 7:36 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Dear All:

 

Has anyone had problems with Blackboard and ZoomText or ZoomText with Speech?

 

I have had problems for years and the Blackboard technical support team has not tried to rectify it. They just say that Blackboard is compatible with JAWS.

 

I have contacted the CEO and Blackboard's legal department because I finally had to draw the line. I was enrolled in the PowerScore Online LSAT course, but had to withdraw because of compatibility issues. Also, because Blackboard is used by a large amount of colleges and universities, this will probably be an ongoing challenge as I move to graduate school.

 

Ai Squared (the makers of ZoomText) has tried to work with Blackboard for years and it seems that the ball is in Blackboard's court. I hope that others will contribute their experiences so that Blackboard will see that this is a consistent problem.

 

I look forward to your responses.

 

Thank you.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40icloud.com


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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/susan.kelly%40pima.gov

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blindlaw mailing list
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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
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l.com


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blindlaw:
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l.com


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From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Wed Dec 10 01:09:27 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2014 20:09:27 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText
In-Reply-To: <04F1893C93758F4AA7CB436BB26750660136CCA1EF2C@EDUPTCEXMB02.ed.gov>
References: <018301d01350$76bf3be0$643db3a0$@gmail.com>
	<000001d0135e$2ebfa6f0$8c3ef4d0$@icloud.com>
	<BE4C4D55ED9DAD44AF21164D4915BF7244028D0B@SPEXCHMB01.central.pima.gov>
	<020f01d013c5$d33eaed0$79bc0c70$@gmail.com>
	<BE4C4D55ED9DAD44AF21164D4915BF7244028E29@SPEXCHMB01.central.pima.gov>
	<003101d013ce$6ddc4fd0$4994ef70$@gmail.com>
	<028701d013dc$a937e590$fba7b0b0$@gmail.com>
	<04F1893C93758F4AA7CB436BB26750660136CCA1EF2C@EDUPTCEXMB02.ed.gov>
Message-ID: <035c01d01415$f29b7f10$d7d27d30$@gmail.com>

Thanks. What time is best to call you?

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: Nightingale, Noel [mailto:Noel.Nightingale at ed.gov] 
Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 5:18 PM
To: Anita Keith-Foust; Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: RE: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Anita,

If you believe you are being denied access to a college on-line program, you
have the right to file a discrimination complaint with the U.S. Department
of Education's Office for Civil Rights.  The complaint may be filed on-line
at www.ed.gov.  

If you believe you are being denied access to a program of a place of public
accommodation that is a private entity, you may file a complaint with the
U.S. Department of Justice at www.ada.gov.

Please call me if you think I can help.  My work # is 206-607-1632.

Noel Nightingale



-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2014 10:19 AM
To: 'Stephen Alexander Marositz'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'; 'Susan Kelly'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Dear Alex:

I agree. Here is the response that I received from PowerScore on Friday,
December 5th when I asked about changing the images to pdf:
	"I am not aware of a way to convert the Blackboard slides into a PDF
format, but I am looking into it. I am afraid, even if it is possible to
create a PDF of the slide, that the content may still appear as an image
rather than text. I will keep you posted if I find out anything further."

I am following up, but the class starts tonight and the problem has not been
fixed. If they ever get it into pdf, I will be able to use Adobe Acrobat to
convert the images to text..

The other problem is that Blackboard would freeze and stop working. The PC
would have to be rebooted.

I agree that some professors may not know that they cannot post images of
text, so their content would cause issues. The PowerScore course works to a
degree, except the AppReader tool cannot be used on the materials that
probably are images. 

It has been my experience that Blackboard's technical support personnel,
that my professor and I contacted, absolutely made no efforts to solve the
issue by contacting Ai Squared (the makers of ZoomText). They recommended
JAWS. That is not resolving a compatibility issue that Blackboard has with
ZoomText

Thanks.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Stephen
Alexander Marositz via blindlaw
Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 11:38 AM
To: 'Susan Kelly'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Anita and All 

Can you be specific as to what difficulties you are having?  One thing to
consider is that it may not be Blackboard itself that is presenting you with
the accessibility problems you are facing.  In terms of learning management
system (LMS) accessibility, there are "3 Cs" to keep in mind, containor,
content and capability.  Blackboard, the containor, is fairly accessible as
compared to the other competing LMSs.  It has no control over the content
put in to it by your institution nor does it control what your institution
does with it though.  PerhapsWhile you are working with Blackboard, you
should also involve your institution, faculty, administrators, disability
service provider and information technology to be sure it is not the content
itself that is inaccessible to you.  

I hope this helps.  

Alex
-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Susan Kelly
via blindlaw
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2014 7:55 AM
To: 'Anita Keith-Foust'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'; 'Michal Nowicki'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

I'm not really sure about Window Eyes - the resident magnification program
in Windows is what I was first using.  I think they are separate.  I
currently use JAWS and MAGic at work, and Voice Over at home.  If you have
access to an iPad or Mac, Voice Over is pre-loaded and seems to handle
almost everything - but I agree - countless companies with countless
different computer apps / programs need to learn and follow the law.


-----Original Message-----
From: Anita Keith-Foust [mailto:anitakeithfoust at gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2014 8:36 AM
To: Susan Kelly; 'Blind Law Mailing List'; 'Michal Nowicki'
Cc: AnitaKeithFoust at gmail.com
Subject: RE: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Dear Melanie and Susan:

So, is Windows Eyes a reader or just magnification?

I need a reader that will work with Blackboard and ZoomText. 

Note: JAWS is expensive, so that is not in the cards as a purchase to use
Blackboard. Blackboard has got to step up.

Thanks.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978 

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Susan Kelly
via blindlaw
Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 10:02 AM
To: 'Michal Nowicki'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

>From past experience with the Windows magnification, from before I had to
move on to more powerful magnification and JAWS  / Voice Over for computer
use, I personally would not rely on the Windows magnification for anything.
A major problem is that it tends to cut off otherwise viewable portions of
the screen, and permit the user to manipulate the image to allow the entire
screen to be seen.  This may not be a problem if the user is only magnify
small portions of the screen, rather than the entire view, but I suspect
that any of us who also need speech would not be able to benefit from
anything less than total screen magnification.

-----Original Message-----
From: blind law [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michal
Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 08, 2014 8:14 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Hi, Anita,

I'm sorry to hear that you have not been able to access Blackboard with
ZoomText.  I am somewhat surprised that you are experiencing this problem,
given that I successfully used Blackboard with JAWS in my undergrad years
and always thought it was fully compatible with assistive technology.

Since I am a screen reader user, I can't give you any ZoomText-related tips.
However, Windows does have a built-in screen magnifier.  I don't know how it
compares to ZoomText (though I suspect it to be much more basic since it is
a free product), but if it does what you need it to do, perhaps you can
useit to access Blackboard without accessibility barriers at least until the
issue with ZoomText compatibility is resolved.  Good luck.

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 7:36 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] Blackbard Compatibility Issues with ZoomText

Dear All:

 

Has anyone had problems with Blackboard and ZoomText or ZoomText with
Speech?

 

I have had problems for years and the Blackboard technical support team has
not tried to rectify it. They just say that Blackboard is compatible with
JAWS.

 

I have contacted the CEO and Blackboard's legal department because I finally
had to draw the line. I was enrolled in the PowerScore Online LSAT course,
but had to withdraw because of compatibility issues. Also, because
Blackboard is used by a large amount of colleges and universities, this will
probably be an ongoing challenge as I move to graduate school.

 

Ai Squared (the makers of ZoomText) has tried to work with Blackboard for
years and it seems that the ball is in Blackboard's court. I hope that
others will contribute their experiences so that Blackboard will see that
this is a consistent problem.

 

I look forward to your responses.

 

Thank you.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
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gov



From dandrews at visi.com  Wed Dec 10 02:11:38 2014
From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews)
Date: Tue, 09 Dec 2014 20:11:38 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Yet Another Service Dog Issue
In-Reply-To: <50047F1B543642CBA72C9D51AD44A507@Spike>
References: <CAAyF1PAejGXm+_o0cmz7P15vt6wnZS=Ghy_bfQF+eRCXh7mXMg@mail.gmail.com>
	<50047F1B543642CBA72C9D51AD44A507@Spike>
Message-ID: <auto-000008912445@mailfront2.g2host.com>

How do you know they are not?

I would contact NAGDU, and my state affiliate to pursue this.

Dave

At 12:35 PM 12/8/2014, you wrote:
>Why aren't the NFB state affiliates becoming involved in addressing 
>and attempting to resolve these issues? As we are NFB members and 
>support the organization that would seem to be a logical progression here.
>Chuck
>
>-----Original Message----- From: Stewart, Christopher K via blindlaw
>Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 9:28 AM
>To: blindlaw
>Subject: [blindlaw] Yet Another Service Dog Issue
>
>Hi List,
>
>I'm a second-year law student, and I work part time as a clerk in a
>downtown firm here in Lexington. Because of the public transportation
>system, in order to make a quick, smooth trip from school to work and
>back, I use taxi cabs.
>
>After my first few trips, they put in the notes on my call that I have
>a guide dog. Afterwards, I started getting the auto-generated messages
>that cabs were in route, then 15 minutes later another cab would be in
>route, then pretty soon I'm an hour late to work. A company employee
>told me specifically that these repeated calls were due to people's
>unwillingness to accommodate my dog. Once, a driver showed up, saw my
>dog, and left. I called his cell, and he said "I no will take dog."
>
>So, I have company employees, on record, telling me that their drivers
>are refusing to take passengers with guide dogs.
>
>I am in Kentucky, and as a law student, I'm obviously busy. However,
>I'd love to pursue this. One of the employees even said that it was
>terrible of the drivers, and she would do anything to help change it
>if she could. Moreover, the general manager wants to work the
>situation out. But, the real problem are the owners and the cab
>drivers.
>
>Sorry to go on, but if anyone knows a disability rights attorney in
>Lexington, or Louisville, Kentucky, I'd appreciate a reference.
>
>Best,
>Chris
>
>
>--
>Chris K. Stewart
>University of Kentucky College of Law, J.D. Candidate, 2016
>Staff Editor, Kentucky Law Journal
>Co-President, American Constitution Society
>California Institute of the Arts, B.F.A. 2010
>Ph:
>(502)457-1757

         David Andrews and long white cane Harry.
E-Mail:  dandrews at visi.com or david.andrews at nfbnet.org



From philosopher25 at gmail.com  Wed Dec 10 06:10:40 2014
From: philosopher25 at gmail.com (philosopher25 at gmail.com)
Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2014 21:10:40 -0900
Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT
In-Reply-To: <000801d00feb$cd22b740$676825c0$@icloud.com>
References: <548089ce.49318c0a.8a83.ffff81d7@mx.google.com>
	<063001d00fdf$252108f0$6f631ad0$@gmail.com>
	<000801d00feb$cd22b740$676825c0$@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <701EBC61-3CFA-4947-AB7C-08E50D1900ED@gmail.com>

Hello,

The method you described is the same that I use in Excel. Were you able to get through all four games using this method?If so, how long did you study the games section before you took the test?

Thanks,
Bruce



> On Dec 4, 2014, at 8:57 AM, Michal Nowicki via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> There is no "universal" master sketch that works for all games.  Instead,
> the type of master sketch you need depends on the type of games you are
> dealing with.  There are 4 basic types of logic games that appear on the
> LSAT:  sequencing, matching, distribution, and selection.
> 
> Sequencing games are the most common on the LSAT.  In fact, you are pretty
> much guaranteed to get at least 1 (and sometimes as many as 3) sequencing
> games of some kind in every logic games section you encounter.  In these
> games, your task is to put elements in a specific order (for example,
> arrange 6 horses in a straight line for the start of a race, schedule 7
> auditions, rank 8 schools, etc.) For this game type, I recommend a master
> sketch consisting of 2 rows.  The top row should contain the slot headings,
> while the bottom row should be reserved for entities that can be built
> directly into the sketch.  For instance, in a game where you must determine
> the order in which 6 singers will perform, create slots 1-6 in the top row
> of the sketch, using 1 column for each slot, and if you are given a concrete
> rule like "John must always perform second," fill in "J" in the row under
> the number "2".
> 
> Selection games are the next most common type.  In these games, you are
> asked to choose a smaller group from a larger pool (e.g.  4 out of 7 summer
> classes, or at least 2, but no more than 5, out of 9 students).  The sketch
> for these games is quite straight forward.  All you need is an "in" column
> for the items that are selected, and an "out" column for the ones that are
> rejected.
> 
> Matching and distribution games are similar enough that you can solve them
> by using the same master sketch for both.  In both types of games, you are
> given at least 2  sets of entities.  In a matching game, you must assign
> features to specific entities (e.g.  match cars with available interior
> designs).  In distribution games, however, you need to divide entities into
> groups (e.g.  assign 9 athletes to 3 teams of 3).  In short, the difference
> between matching and distribution games is that in the former, entities may
> be reused, whereas in the latter, each entity may be used only once in a
> given arrangement.  As far as the sketch, use columns for groups, and put
> the members of each group under the corresponding group heading.
> 
> Unfortunately, the LSAT also contains hybrid games, which combine the
> actions described above in various ways.  For example, a game may first ask
> you to pick 6 out of 10 musicians (selection) and then to determine the
> order in which they can or must perform (sequencing).  For such games, your
> master sketch should be built around the most stable action, which, in the
> above example, would be sequencing.
> 
> I would be happy to send out sample diagrams, but I don't want to create any
> unnecessary confusion.  Therefore, please let me know for which type(s) of
> game(s) a spreadsheet with specific examples would be most useful.
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Anita Keith-Foust [mailto:anitakeithfoust at gmail.com] 
> Sent: Thursday, December 4, 2014 10:27 AM
> To: 'Kelby Carlson'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'; 'Michal Nowicki'
> Cc: AnitaKeithFoust at gmail.com
> Subject: RE: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT
> 
> Michal:
> 
> I want to see it too.
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> Anita Keith-Foust
> 919-430-1978
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kelby
> Carlson via blindlaw
> Sent: Thursday, December 4, 2014 11:20 AM
> To: Michal Nowicki; Blind Law Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT
> 
> Michal,
> 
> Could you provide me with an example of a master sketch so I can have a
> concrete idea of what you mean when you describe it?
> 
> K.
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Michal Nowicki via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> To: 'Blind Law Mailing List' <blindlaw at nfbnet.org Date sent: Wed, 03 Dec
> 2014 17:34:26 -0600
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> First, I would suggest sticking with Excel, as it offers the greatest
> flexibility when it comes to manipulating elements.  To save time on the
> logic games section, I recommend taking full advantage of the copy/paste
> feature.  Specifically, you should be easily able to copy your master sketch
> for hypothetical questions.  Depending on whether you prefer the horizontal
> or vertical approach, you can select an entire column by pressing "Control"
> plus the spacebar, or entire row by pressing "Shift" plus the spacebar, and
> you can then extend the selection to adjacent cells by pressing "Shift" plus
> the arrow key that corresponds to the direction in which you want to extend
> the selection.  After that, you can perform copy and paste commands just as
> you would in any other program.  I hope this helps.
> 
> Michal
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
> Keith-Foust via blindlaw
> Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 5:16 PM
> To: 'James Fetter'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT
> 
> Please share.
> 
> I would also like to know the answer to this question.
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> Anita Keith-Foust
> 919-430-1978
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of James
> Fetter via blindlaw
> Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2014 6:09 PM
> To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> Subject: [blindlaw] Doing Logic Games Efficiently on LSAT
> 
> Dear all,
> I hope this finds you all well and having had a good Thanksgiving.  I am
> finding that, although I can do logic games on LSAT practice tests with a
> very high degree of accuracy with Excel, I'm having trouble getting the
> logic games section done in the allotted time, which for me is 70 minutes (I
> requested and received double time for each section).  If anyone knows of
> any time efficient methods of diagramming with Excel or some other
> accessible product, please let me know.  Please also feel free to write me
> directly at jtfetter at yahoo.com.  I apologize if this question has been asked
> and answered before.  Thanks.
> All Best,
> James
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/anitakeithf
> oust%40gmai
> l.com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%4
> 0icloud.com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
> for blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/kelbycarlso
> n%40gmail.com
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
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> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
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> l.com
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
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> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/philosopher25%40gmail.com


From Noel.Nightingale at ed.gov  Wed Dec 10 23:28:01 2014
From: Noel.Nightingale at ed.gov (Nightingale, Noel)
Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2014 17:28:01 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] U.S. Department of Labor wage & hour trial attorney
	position
Message-ID: <04F1893C93758F4AA7CB436BB26750660136CCA1F0A9@EDUPTCEXMB02.ed.gov>



From: Brown, Bruce L- SOL [mailto:Brown.Bruce.L at DOL.GOV]
Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2014 3:19 PM
To: Nightingale, Noel
Subject: job posting for WADA

Good afternoon. Attached is an announcement concerning a job opening with the U.S. Dept. of Labor. Please distribute to your membership as you see fit.

Thanks,

Bruce


Bruce L. Brown
Associate Regional Solicitor
300 Fifth Ave., Suite 1120
Seattle, WA 98104
206-757-6762
206-757-6761 (fax)

This message may contain information that is privileged or otherwise exempt from disclosure under applicable law. Do not disclose without consulting the Office of the Solicitor. If you think you received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately.

-------------- next part --------------
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From wmodnl at hotmail.com  Thu Dec 11 02:52:59 2014
From: wmodnl at hotmail.com (wmodnl wmodnl)
Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2014 21:52:59 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Yet Another Service Dog Issue
In-Reply-To: <50047F1B543642CBA72C9D51AD44A507@Spike>
References: <CAAyF1PAejGXm+_o0cmz7P15vt6wnZS=Ghy_bfQF+eRCXh7mXMg@mail.gmail.com>
	<50047F1B543642CBA72C9D51AD44A507@Spike>
Message-ID: <SNT407-EAS240F6C5F37A929B57459652DC630@phx.gbl>

Same reason why they can not solve other systematic ones like denial of jobs/housing:
lack of resources in the nonprofitt sector...
How about taking a Uber! Then you have all needed info on drivers such as vehicle and their name, etc. They are quite accommodating. I know many in New England who use them with and without service animals. Some drivers have asked me why I do not travel with a guide dog; b/c, they are always welcome. Have a good evening.


Sent from my iPad

> On Dec 8, 2014, at 1:36 PM, Charles Krugman via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Why aren't the NFB state affiliates becoming involved in addressing and attempting to resolve these issues? As we are NFB members and support the organization that would seem to be a logical progression here.
> Chuck
> 
> -----Original Message----- From: Stewart, Christopher K via blindlaw
> Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 9:28 AM
> To: blindlaw
> Subject: [blindlaw] Yet Another Service Dog Issue
> 
> Hi List,
> 
> I'm a second-year law student, and I work part time as a clerk in a
> downtown firm here in Lexington. Because of the public transportation
> system, in order to make a quick, smooth trip from school to work and
> back, I use taxi cabs.
> 
> After my first few trips, they put in the notes on my call that I have
> a guide dog. Afterwards, I started getting the auto-generated messages
> that cabs were in route, then 15 minutes later another cab would be in
> route, then pretty soon I'm an hour late to work. A company employee
> told me specifically that these repeated calls were due to people's
> unwillingness to accommodate my dog. Once, a driver showed up, saw my
> dog, and left. I called his cell, and he said "I no will take dog."
> 
> So, I have company employees, on record, telling me that their drivers
> are refusing to take passengers with guide dogs.
> 
> I am in Kentucky, and as a law student, I'm obviously busy. However,
> I'd love to pursue this. One of the employees even said that it was
> terrible of the drivers, and she would do anything to help change it
> if she could. Moreover, the general manager wants to work the
> situation out. But, the real problem are the owners and the cab
> drivers.
> 
> Sorry to go on, but if anyone knows a disability rights attorney in
> Lexington, or Louisville, Kentucky, I'd appreciate a reference.
> 
> Best,
> Chris
> 
> 
> -- 
> Chris K. Stewart
> University of Kentucky College of Law, J.D. Candidate, 2016
> Staff Editor, Kentucky Law Journal
> Co-President, American Constitution Society
> California Institute of the Arts, B.F.A. 2010
> Ph:
> (502)457-1757
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/ckrugman%40sbcglobal.net 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/wmodnl%40hotmail.com


From taiablas at gmail.com  Thu Dec 11 03:01:15 2014
From: taiablas at gmail.com (Tai Tomasi)
Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2014 21:01:15 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Yet Another Service Dog Issue
In-Reply-To: <SNT407-EAS240F6C5F37A929B57459652DC630@phx.gbl>
References: <CAAyF1PAejGXm+_o0cmz7P15vt6wnZS=Ghy_bfQF+eRCXh7mXMg@mail.gmail.com>
	<50047F1B543642CBA72C9D51AD44A507@Spike>
	<SNT407-EAS240F6C5F37A929B57459652DC630@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <002a01d014ee$bb06a050$3113e0f0$@gmail.com>

This is not accurate in all Uber markets.  Several cases have been initiated
against Uber in various states regarding denial of access to dog guide
users.

Tai


-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of wmodnl
wmodnl via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2014 8:53 PM
To: Charles Krugman; Blind Law Mailing List
Cc: Stewart, Christopher K
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Yet Another Service Dog Issue

Same reason why they can not solve other systematic ones like denial of
jobs/housing:
lack of resources in the nonprofitt sector...
How about taking a Uber! Then you have all needed info on drivers such as
vehicle and their name, etc. They are quite accommodating. I know many in
New England who use them with and without service animals. Some drivers have
asked me why I do not travel with a guide dog; b/c, they are always welcome.
Have a good evening.


Sent from my iPad

> On Dec 8, 2014, at 1:36 PM, Charles Krugman via blindlaw
<blindlaw at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Why aren't the NFB state affiliates becoming involved in addressing and
attempting to resolve these issues? As we are NFB members and support the
organization that would seem to be a logical progression here.
> Chuck
> 
> -----Original Message----- From: Stewart, Christopher K via blindlaw
> Sent: Monday, December 8, 2014 9:28 AM
> To: blindlaw
> Subject: [blindlaw] Yet Another Service Dog Issue
> 
> Hi List,
> 
> I'm a second-year law student, and I work part time as a clerk in a 
> downtown firm here in Lexington. Because of the public transportation 
> system, in order to make a quick, smooth trip from school to work and 
> back, I use taxi cabs.
> 
> After my first few trips, they put in the notes on my call that I have 
> a guide dog. Afterwards, I started getting the auto-generated messages 
> that cabs were in route, then 15 minutes later another cab would be in 
> route, then pretty soon I'm an hour late to work. A company employee 
> told me specifically that these repeated calls were due to people's 
> unwillingness to accommodate my dog. Once, a driver showed up, saw my 
> dog, and left. I called his cell, and he said "I no will take dog."
> 
> So, I have company employees, on record, telling me that their drivers 
> are refusing to take passengers with guide dogs.
> 
> I am in Kentucky, and as a law student, I'm obviously busy. However, 
> I'd love to pursue this. One of the employees even said that it was 
> terrible of the drivers, and she would do anything to help change it 
> if she could. Moreover, the general manager wants to work the 
> situation out. But, the real problem are the owners and the cab 
> drivers.
> 
> Sorry to go on, but if anyone knows a disability rights attorney in 
> Lexington, or Louisville, Kentucky, I'd appreciate a reference.
> 
> Best,
> Chris
> 
> 
> --
> Chris K. Stewart
> University of Kentucky College of Law, J.D. Candidate, 2016 Staff 
> Editor, Kentucky Law Journal Co-President, American Constitution 
> Society California Institute of the Arts, B.F.A. 2010
> Ph:
> (502)457-1757
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/ckrugman%40sbcgl
> obal.net
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/wmodnl%40hotmail
> .com

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/taiablas%40gmail.com



From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Fri Dec 12 00:20:36 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2014 19:20:36 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] The NFB Blind Driver Challenge and Graduated Driver's
	Licenses
Message-ID: <052201d015a1$74a82940$5df87bc0$@gmail.com>

Dear All:

 

Is there anyone on the list involved in the NFB Blind Driver Challenge? 

 

I also am interested in lobbying my state legislators to improve the
driver's license laws to include graduated licensing similar to the State of
Indiana.

Please let me know how to become involved in the challenge.

 

Thank you.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978

 

 


From gerard.sadlier at gmail.com  Mon Dec 15 11:31:43 2014
From: gerard.sadlier at gmail.com (Gerard Sadlier)
Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2014 11:31:43 +0000
Subject: [blindlaw] E Discovery Platforms Again
Message-ID: <CAGZitzJhotVvqPZYS8UqSOrucBpw3xPzay7Q2V4dKGE+jzhTFQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all,

I am writing regarding the accessibility of E Discovery platforms. I'd
be really grateful for any information on the accessibility of E
Discovery platforms which any of you may have and any experiences
which you may be able to share.

In particular, have any of you found particular platforms accessible.

As I think I noted previously, I have found several which are not. I
am a JAWS/NVDA user.

Separately, I wonder whether there is anything which can be done in
terms of lobbying the manufacturers of such platforms to improve
accessibility, where possible.

Kind regards

Ger


From LBlake at nfb.org  Mon Dec 15 14:18:30 2014
From: LBlake at nfb.org (Blake, Lou Ann)
Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2014 14:18:30 +0000
Subject: [blindlaw] {Disarmed} Registration is now open for the 2015 Jacobus
 tenBroek Disability Law Symposium!
Message-ID: <DM2PR0701MB764E2046A4D70F1D5865F6EC96F0@DM2PR0701MB764.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>

Registration is Now Open!

for the

2015 Jacobus tenBroek Disability Law Symposium

The ADA at Fifty: The Future of Disability Law and the Right to Live in the World

March 26-27, 2015
at the
National Federation of the Blind Jernigan Institute
Baltimore, Maryland

Join leading disability rights advocates from throughout the United States in celebration of the Americans with Disabilities Act by looking ahead to the next twenty-five years. The 2015 Jacobus tenBroek Disability Law Symposium will consist of plenary sessions and workshops facilitated by distinguished law professors, practitioners, and advocates who will discuss topics such as: the future of disability, how to enable the participation of people with disabilities in court proceedings, the unique challenges faced by criminal suspects and offenders with intellectual and developmental disabilities, and a vision for the next twenty-five years to improve and augment the ADA, Rehabilitation Act, and IDEA. Presenters include:

  *   Judge Richard S. Brown, Wisconsin Court of Appeals
  *   Leigh Ann Davis, program manager, Justice Initiatives, The Arc
  *   Robert Dinerstein, professor of law, American University Washington College of Law
  *   David Ferleger, Esquire, Law Office of David Ferleger
  *   Beverly Frantz, criminal justice project director, Institute on Disabilities, Temple University
  *   Daniel F. Goldstein, partner, Brown, Goldstein and Levy
  *   Christine M. Griffin, executive director, Disability Law Center of Massachusetts
  *   Arlene S. Kanter; Bond, Schoeneck, and King Distinguished Professor; Syracuse University College of Law
  *   Marc Maurer, immediate past president, National Federation of the Blind
  *   Arlene B. Mayerson, directing attorney, Disability Rights Education and Defense Fund
  *   Ari Ne'eman, co-founder and president, Autistic Self Advocacy Network
  *   Laurence Paradis, executive director and co-director of litigation, Disability Rights Advocates
  *   Mark Riccobono, president[N1] , National Federation of the Blind
  *   Howard A. Rosenblum, chief executive officer, National Association of the Deaf
  *   Fredric K. Schroeder, research professor, San Diego State University; first vice president, World Blind Union
  *   Anita Silvers, professor and chair of Philosophy, San Francisco State University
  *   Michael Ashley Stein, visiting professor of law, Harvard Law School; co-founder and executive director, Harvard Law School Project on Disability; professor of law, William and Mary Law School
  *   Judge Richard B. Teitelman, Supreme Court of Missouri
  *   Kathryn Walker, criminal justice fellow, The Arc
  *   Michael Waterstone, visiting professor of law, Northwestern University School of Law; J. Howard Ziemann Fellow and professor of law, Loyola Law School Los Angeles

Documentation for CLE credits will be provided.

Registration fee: $175
Student registration fee: $25

For more information about the symposium, hotel accommodations, and symposium sponsorship opportunities, please visit https://nfb.org/law-symposium.

You can register online by going to: https://nfb.org/civicrm/event/register?reset=1&id=49.

You may also download from the symposium website a registration form to mail or fax.

For additional information, contact:

Lou Ann Blake, JD
Law Symposium Coordinator
Jernigan Institute
National Federation of the Blind
200 East Wells Street
at Jernigan Place
Baltimore, Maryland 21230
Telephone: 410-659-9314, ext. 2221
Email: lblake at nfb.org<mailto:lblake at nfb.org>



Lou Ann Blake, J.D.
HAVA Project Manager and Law Symposium Coordinator
Jernigan Institute
NATIONAL FEDERATION OF THE BLIND
200 East Wells Street
    at Jernigan Place
Baltimore, MD 21230
Telephone: (410) 659-9314, ext. 2221
Fax: (410) 659-5129
E-mail: lblake at nfb.org<mailto:lblake at nfb.org>
Web site: www.nfb.org<http://www.nfb.org/>

The National Federation of the Blind knows that blindness is not the characteristic that defines you or your future. Every day we raise the expectations of blind people, because low expectations create obstacles between blind people and our dreams. You can have the life you want; blindness is not what holds you back.

To make a donation to the National Federation of the Blind Imagination Fund campaign, please visit www.nfb.org/ImaginingOurFuture<http://www.nfb.org/ImaginingOurFuture>.




________________________________

 [N1]I've made a couple changes to make this section consistent in capitalization, but to avoid any flak you may get for this President deal, you may opt to capitalize everyone's title. Just a suggestion.

From slabarre at labarrelaw.com  Mon Dec 15 16:57:13 2014
From: slabarre at labarrelaw.com (Scott C. LaBarre)
Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2014 09:57:13 -0700
Subject: [blindlaw] FW: Attorney Vacancies at the U.S. Department of Justice
In-Reply-To: <A2C9FB40BD72F846A5E5CF700AEFDB5D1CDA0133@DPRC-EXCH-P01.JCONMAIL.doj.gov>
References: <A2C9FB40BD72F846A5E5CF700AEFDB5D4A9D06@DPRC-EXCH-B01.JCONMAIL.doj.gov>
	<A2C9FB40BD72F846A5E5CF700AEFDB5D1CDA0133@DPRC-EXCH-P01.JCONMAIL.doj.gov>
Message-ID: <012b01d01888$2d3bd860$87b38920$@labarrelaw.com>

fyi

 

From: DOJlawjobs (JMD) [mailto:DOJlawjobs at usdoj.gov] 
Sent: Friday, December 12, 2014 12:03 PM
To: Undisclosed recipients:
Subject: Attorney Vacancies at the U.S. Department of Justice

 

The U.S. Department of Justice, Office of Attorney Recruitment and
Management is updating our outreach list for the distribution of attorney
vacancy announcements.  If you would like to continue receiving vacancy
announcements and other recruitment related information from the Department
of Justice please take the time to reply with  the following information:

 

 

SCHOOL OR ORGANIZATION: 

NAME:                   

TITLE:  

PHONE:  

EMAIL:  

WEBSITE:        

 

Below is a list of current attorney vacancies at the United States
Department of Justice. We encourage all interested applicants to apply;

 

To learn more about Justice and our legal careers, please visit our website:
www.justice.gov/careers/legal/ <http://www.justice.gov/careers/legal/> . 

In addition, every year over 1,800 volunteer legal interns serve in DOJ
components and U.S. Attorneys' Offices throughout the country. If you know
any law students who may be interested in a DOJ volunteer internship, please
encourage them to review the many opportunities featured at
www.justice.gov/careers/legal/volunteer-intern.html
<http://www.justice.gov/careers/legal/volunteer-intern.html> .  

 

 


Office of the Inspector General (OIG) 

 <http://www.justice.gov/legal-careers/job/senior-counsel-inspector-general>
Senior Counsel to the Inspector General 

DC 

12/11/2014 


Criminal Division (CRM) 

 <http://www.justice.gov/legal-careers/job/trial-attorney-35> Trial Attorney


DC 

12/10/2014 


Criminal Division (CRM) 

 <http://www.justice.gov/legal-careers/job/resident-legal-advisor-jamaica>
Resident Legal Advisor- Jamaica 

	12/09/2014 


National Security Division (NSD) 

 <http://www.justice.gov/legal-careers/job/deputy-chief-cyber-gs-905-15-0>
Deputy Chief (Cyber), GS-905-15 

DC 

12/09/2014 


Executive Office for United States Attorneys (EOUSA) 

 <http://www.justice.gov/legal-careers/job/assistant-us-attorney-11>
Assistant United States Attorney 

NJ 

12/08/2014 


Criminal Division (CRM) 

 <http://www.justice.gov/legal-careers/job/resident-legal-advisor-nigeria>
Resident Legal Advisor - Nigeria 

	12/08/2014 


USAO District of Oregon 

 
<http://www.justice.gov/legal-careers/job/assistant-united-states-attorney-9
7> Assistant United States Attorney 

OR 

12/08/2014 


USAO Northern District of Indiana 

 <http://www.justice.gov/legal-careers/job/attorney-0> Attorney 

IN 

12/08/2014 

 


From Noel.Nightingale at ed.gov  Mon Dec 15 17:25:59 2014
From: Noel.Nightingale at ed.gov (Nightingale, Noel)
Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2014 11:25:59 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] FW: Disability.gov Update: Education Department Settles
 with University over Accessibility of Its Websites
In-Reply-To: <17018372.67155@service.govdelivery.com>
References: <17018372.67155@service.govdelivery.com>
Message-ID: <04F1893C93758F4AA7CB436BB26750660136CCA1F441@EDUPTCEXMB02.ed.gov>



From: Disability.gov [mailto:disability.gov at service.govdelivery.com]
Sent: Monday, December 15, 2014 6:25 AM
To: Nightingale, Noel
Subject: Disability.gov Update: Education Department Settles with University over Accessibility of Its Websites


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Education Department Settles with University over Accessibility of Its Websites<http://links.govdelivery.com:80/track?type=click&enid=ZWFzPTEmbWFpbGluZ2lkPTIwMTQxMjE1LjM5MzYyNzExJm1lc3NhZ2VpZD1NREItUFJELUJVTC0yMDE0MTIxNS4zOTM2MjcxMSZkYXRhYmFzZWlkPTEwMDEmc2VyaWFsPTE3MDE4MzcyJmVtYWlsaWQ9bm9lbC5uaWdodGluZ2FsZUBlZC5nb3YmdXNlcmlkPW5vZWwubmlnaHRpbmdhbGVAZWQuZ292JmZsPSZleHRyYT1NdWx0aXZhcmlhdGVJZD0mJiY=&&&101&&&http://www.ed.gov/news/press-releases/us-education-department-reaches-agreement-youngstown-state-university-ensure-equ>

The U.S. Department of Education has reached an agreement<http://links.govdelivery.com:80/track?type=click&enid=ZWFzPTEmbWFpbGluZ2lkPTIwMTQxMjE1LjM5MzYyNzExJm1lc3NhZ2VpZD1NREItUFJELUJVTC0yMDE0MTIxNS4zOTM2MjcxMSZkYXRhYmFzZWlkPTEwMDEmc2VyaWFsPTE3MDE4MzcyJmVtYWlsaWQ9bm9lbC5uaWdodGluZ2FsZUBlZC5nb3YmdXNlcmlkPW5vZWwubmlnaHRpbmdhbGVAZWQuZ292JmZsPSZleHRyYT1NdWx0aXZhcmlhdGVJZD0mJiY=&&&102&&&http://www2.ed.gov/documents/press-releases/youngstown-state-university-agreement.pdf> with Youngstown State University in Ohio to make sure that the school's websites are accessible to persons with disabilities, including students, prospective students, employees and visitors. Under the agreement, the University also committed to providing equal access to educational opportunities for students with disabilities. Learn about civil rights laws<http://links.govdelivery.com:80/track?type=click&enid=ZWFzPTEmbWFpbGluZ2lkPTIwMTQxMjE1LjM5MzYyNzExJm1lc3NhZ2VpZD1NREItUFJELUJVTC0yMDE0MTIxNS4zOTM2MjcxMSZkYXRhYmFzZWlkPTEwMDEmc2VyaWFsPTE3MDE4MzcyJmVtYWlsaWQ9bm9lbC5uaWdodGluZ2FsZUBlZC5nb3YmdXNlcmlkPW5vZWwubmlnaHRpbmdhbGVAZWQuZ292JmZsPSZleHRyYT1NdWx0aXZhcmlhdGVJZD0mJiY=&&&103&&&http://www2.ed.gov/policy/rights/guid/ocr/disability.html> prohibiting disability discrimination and how to file a disability complaint<http://links.govdelivery.com:80/track?type=click&enid=ZWFzPTEmbWFpbGluZ2lkPTIwMTQxMjE1LjM5MzYyNzExJm1lc3NhZ2VpZD1NREItUFJELUJVTC0yMDE0MTIxNS4zOTM2MjcxMSZkYXRhYmFzZWlkPTEwMDEmc2VyaWFsPTE3MDE4MzcyJmVtYWlsaWQ9bm9lbC5uaWdodGluZ2FsZUBlZC5nb3YmdXNlcmlkPW5vZWwubmlnaHRpbmdhbGVAZWQuZ292JmZsPSZleHRyYT1NdWx0aXZhcmlhdGVJZD0mJiY=&&&104&&&http://www2.ed.gov/about/offices/list/ocr/docs/howto.html?src=rt> with the U.S. Department of Education.

For more information about laws that protect the rights of people with disabilities check out Disability.gov's Guide to Disability Rights Laws<http://links.govdelivery.com:80/track?type=click&enid=ZWFzPTEmbWFpbGluZ2lkPTIwMTQxMjE1LjM5MzYyNzExJm1lc3NhZ2VpZD1NREItUFJELUJVTC0yMDE0MTIxNS4zOTM2MjcxMSZkYXRhYmFzZWlkPTEwMDEmc2VyaWFsPTE3MDE4MzcyJmVtYWlsaWQ9bm9lbC5uaWdodGluZ2FsZUBlZC5nb3YmdXNlcmlkPW5vZWwubmlnaHRpbmdhbGVAZWQuZ292JmZsPSZleHRyYT1NdWx0aXZhcmlhdGVJZD0mJiY=&&&105&&&https://www.disability.gov/resource/disability-govs-guide-disability-rights-laws/>.

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Having trouble viewing this email? View it as a Web page<http://links.govdelivery.com:80/track?type=click&enid=ZWFzPTEmbWFpbGluZ2lkPTIwMTQxMjE1LjM5MzYyNzExJm1lc3NhZ2VpZD1NREItUFJELUJVTC0yMDE0MTIxNS4zOTM2MjcxMSZkYXRhYmFzZWlkPTEwMDEmc2VyaWFsPTE3MDE4MzcyJmVtYWlsaWQ9bm9lbC5uaWdodGluZ2FsZUBlZC5nb3YmdXNlcmlkPW5vZWwubmlnaHRpbmdhbGVAZWQuZ292JmZsPSZleHRyYT1NdWx0aXZhcmlhdGVJZD0mJiY=&&&107&&&http://content.govdelivery.com/accounts/USODEP/bulletins/e32bb1>.

________________________________

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STAY CONNECTED:

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From Noel.Nightingale at ed.gov  Mon Dec 15 17:38:26 2014
From: Noel.Nightingale at ed.gov (Nightingale, Noel)
Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2014 11:38:26 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] 2015 Prudential Internship Job Posting
In-Reply-To: <BL2PR03MB209B39E4522C6BC409A879DC1610@BL2PR03MB209.namprd03.prod.outlook.com>
References: <EE173AA7EFB6D0489E671413D686964D018360E3@EXCH-MB-02.aba.ad.abanet.org>
	<BL2PR03MB209B39E4522C6BC409A879DC1610@BL2PR03MB209.namprd03.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <04F1893C93758F4AA7CB436BB26750660136CCA1F44C@EDUPTCEXMB02.ed.gov>



From: Commission on Disability Rights (Full) [mailto:CDR-FULL at MAIL.AMERICANBAR.ORG] On Behalf Of Miller, Tovah
Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2014 1:04 PM
To: CDR-FULL at MAIL.AMERICANBAR.ORG
Subject: 2015 Prudential Internship Job Posting

Good Afternoon,

I apologize for cross posting but it is that time of year again.  As most of you know, every year the ABA Commission on Disability Rights partners with Prudential Financial, Inc. to sponsor a first-year law student intern with a disability in Prudential’s New York/New Jersey office. I have attached the internship posting with all of the pertinent information.  Please pass this along to any interested contacts (law students, law schools, etc) and let me know if there are any questions.

Thank you for your help.
Best,
Tovah Miller


M. Tovah Miller, J.D., M.S.
Program Specialist
Commission on Disability Rights (CDR) - Mail Stop 11.0 American Bar Association (ABA)
1050 Connecticut Avenue, NW  Suite 400
Washington, DC 20036
T:  202-662-1572
F:  202-442-3439
Tovah.Miller at americanbar.org<mailto:Tovah.Miller at americanbar.org>
http://www.americanbar.org/groups/disabilityrights.html


______________________________________
Thank you for your continued interest in this list. A summary of your discussion list subscriptions, including CDR-FULL, can be found at http://apps.americanbar.org/elistserv/home.cfm . This new List Subscription Page allows you to manage your lists - unsubscribe from existing or join others.

If you have any issues you may either contact the list owner via email: CDR-FULL-request at mail.americanbar.org<mailto:CDR-FULL-request at mail.americanbar.org> , or the ABA Service Center at phone: 1-800-285-2221 or email: service at americanbar.org<mailto:service at americanbar.org> .
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From Noel.Nightingale at ed.gov  Wed Dec 17 21:59:47 2014
From: Noel.Nightingale at ed.gov (Nightingale, Noel)
Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2014 15:59:47 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Regional director of U.S. Department of Education's
 Office for Civil Rights in Seattle
Message-ID: <04F1893C93758F4AA7CB436BB26750660136CCADB1C7@EDUPTCEXMB02.ed.gov>

Please see the link below for the position announcement that closes December 31, for the Regional Director of the U.S. Department of Education's Office for Civil Rights.

https://www.usajobs.gov/GetJob/ViewDetails/389379400#

From pattischang at gmail.com  Sun Dec 21 22:24:41 2014
From: pattischang at gmail.com (Gregory Chang Patti)
Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2014 16:24:41 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Holiday Wishes
Message-ID: <46CD20F5-71E5-45FD-A29E-600F00693867@gmail.com>

Dear Friends and Family:

2014 has been a busy year for all of us.

Travel topped the list of activities in 2014 with a trip to Puerto Vallerta  in January for Francisco and Patti with Patti’s mom and Frank and a whole lot of contractors.  Julia trained off to New York over Thanksgiving.  We all travelled to Michigan in August.  Patti continues to travel for the National Federation of the Blind.  Sometimes Francisco joins her.  Baltimore, Portland, Flint, and Orlando were on the agenda for 2014.

Francisco has found a job he really likes which requires less lifting and no wearing of lead weights.  He is nursing for people who are taking stress tests and the like.  He is also a trustee in the church. 

sPatti serves on the disability law committee for the Illinois State Bar Association now and is hoping to be reappointed to Administrative Law in the Summer.  Work has been insane for the last four months or so but promises to slow down now.  THANK YOU!

Johnathon moved back to Chicago to study information technology in July and is doing well.  The restaurant where he worked is now out of business so he will probably concentrate on school for next semester and concentrate on finding a job in his field for next Summer.  He continues to be an avid gamer.

Julia performs well at U of I.  She is active in PHI Sigma Rho engineering sorority. Work takes up some of her time.  She is selling computers at Tech Zone.  First Semester of Junior year she plans to study abroad in London.  

In closing let us ask each and everyone of you to please help visually and blind people live the lives we want by contributing to the National Federation of the Blind of Illinois.  Patti now serves as treasurer and donations can be made online at www.nfbofillinois.org or mailed to NFBI Patti Gregory-Chang, Treasurer 6919 W. Berwyn Ave. Chicago, IL 60656. 

Sorry this is out so late.  Thanks to you for enriching our lives. 

Love Francisco, Patti, Johnathon and Julia








"Every day we raise the expectations of blind people in the National Federation of the Blind.  Live the Life You Want."

Patti Gregory Chang
National Federation of the Blind of Illinois, Treasurer
NFB Scholarship Committee Chair 
pattischang at gmail.com
NFB of IL: www.nfbofillinois.org
NFB: www.nfb.org

"Every day we raise the expectations of blind people in the National Federation of the Blind.  Live the Life You Want."

Patti Gregory Chang
National Federation of the Blind of Illinois, Treasurer
NFB Scholarship Committee Chair 
pattischang at gmail.com
NFB of IL: www.nfbofillinois.org
NFB: www.nfb.org


From rwayne1 at nyc.rr.com  Sun Dec 21 22:59:30 2014
From: rwayne1 at nyc.rr.com (Ray Wayne)
Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2014 17:59:30 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] Holiday Wishes
In-Reply-To: <46CD20F5-71E5-45FD-A29E-600F00693867@gmail.com>
References: <46CD20F5-71E5-45FD-A29E-600F00693867@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <FF4A0FD9F32A468EB0BE9B57D7220D2C@RayWaynePC>

Hi Patti:
Merry Christmas to you and yours!
Ray Wayne

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Gregory Chang Patti via blindlaw" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
To: "Blind List Law Mailing" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2014 5:24 PM
Subject: [blindlaw] Holiday Wishes


Dear Friends and Family:

2014 has been a busy year for all of us.

Travel topped the list of activities in 2014 with a trip to Puerto Vallerta 
in January for Francisco and Patti with PattiÂ’s mom and Frank and a whole 
lot of contractors.  Julia trained off to New York over Thanksgiving.  We 
all travelled to Michigan in August.  Patti continues to travel for the 
National Federation of the Blind.  Sometimes Francisco joins her. 
Baltimore, Portland, Flint, and Orlando were on the agenda for 2014.

Francisco has found a job he really likes which requires less lifting and no 
wearing of lead weights.  He is nursing for people who are taking stress 
tests and the like.  He is also a trustee in the church.

sPatti serves on the disability law committee for the Illinois State Bar 
Association now and is hoping to be reappointed to Administrative Law in the 
Summer.  Work has been insane for the last four months or so but promises to 
slow down now.  THANK YOU!

Johnathon moved back to Chicago to study information technology in July and 
is doing well.  The restaurant where he worked is now out of business so he 
will probably concentrate on school for next semester and concentrate on 
finding a job in his field for next Summer.  He continues to be an avid 
gamer.

Julia performs well at U of I.  She is active in PHI Sigma Rho engineering 
sorority. Work takes up some of her time.  She is selling computers at Tech 
Zone.  First Semester of Junior year she plans to study abroad in London.

In closing let us ask each and everyone of you to please help visually and 
blind people live the lives we want by contributing to the National 
Federation of the Blind of Illinois.  Patti now serves as treasurer and 
donations can be made online at www.nfbofillinois.org or mailed to NFBI 
Patti Gregory-Chang, Treasurer 6919 W. Berwyn Ave. Chicago, IL 60656.

Sorry this is out so late.  Thanks to you for enriching our lives.

Love Francisco, Patti, Johnathon and Julia








"Every day we raise the expectations of blind people in the National 
Federation of the Blind.  Live the Life You Want."

Patti Gregory Chang
National Federation of the Blind of Illinois, Treasurer
NFB Scholarship Committee Chair
pattischang at gmail.com
NFB of IL: www.nfbofillinois.org
NFB: www.nfb.org

"Every day we raise the expectations of blind people in the National 
Federation of the Blind.  Live the Life You Want."

Patti Gregory Chang
National Federation of the Blind of Illinois, Treasurer
NFB Scholarship Committee Chair
pattischang at gmail.com
NFB of IL: www.nfbofillinois.org
NFB: www.nfb.org

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/rwayne1%40nyc.rr.com 



From rfarber at jw.com  Mon Dec 22 04:40:58 2014
From: rfarber at jw.com (Farber, Randy)
Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2014 04:40:58 +0000
Subject: [blindlaw] Holiday Wishes
In-Reply-To: <46CD20F5-71E5-45FD-A29E-600F00693867@gmail.com>
References: <46CD20F5-71E5-45FD-A29E-600F00693867@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <31F2EE3645B8CB43A190156AB388DF130E8151E9@pdc-exch02.jwllp.com>

Happy Holidays.

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Gregory Chang Patti via blindlaw
Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2014 4:27 PM
To: Blind List Law Mailing
Subject: [blindlaw] Holiday Wishes

Dear Friends and Family:

2014 has been a busy year for all of us.

Travel topped the list of activities in 2014 with a trip to Puerto Vallerta  in January for Francisco and Patti with Patti's mom and Frank and a whole lot of contractors.  Julia trained off to New York over Thanksgiving.  We all travelled to Michigan in August.  Patti continues to travel for the National Federation of the Blind.  Sometimes Francisco joins her.  Baltimore, Portland, Flint, and Orlando were on the agenda for 2014.

Francisco has found a job he really likes which requires less lifting and no wearing of lead weights.  He is nursing for people who are taking stress tests and the like.  He is also a trustee in the church. 

sPatti serves on the disability law committee for the Illinois State Bar Association now and is hoping to be reappointed to Administrative Law in the Summer.  Work has been insane for the last four months or so but promises to slow down now.  THANK YOU!

Johnathon moved back to Chicago to study information technology in July and is doing well.  The restaurant where he worked is now out of business so he will probably concentrate on school for next semester and concentrate on finding a job in his field for next Summer.  He continues to be an avid gamer.

Julia performs well at U of I.  She is active in PHI Sigma Rho engineering sorority. Work takes up some of her time.  She is selling computers at Tech Zone.  First Semester of Junior year she plans to study abroad in London.  

In closing let us ask each and everyone of you to please help visually and blind people live the lives we want by contributing to the National Federation of the Blind of Illinois.  Patti now serves as treasurer and donations can be made online at www.nfbofillinois.org or mailed to NFBI Patti Gregory-Chang, Treasurer 6919 W. Berwyn Ave. Chicago, IL 60656. 

Sorry this is out so late.  Thanks to you for enriching our lives. 

Love Francisco, Patti, Johnathon and Julia








"Every day we raise the expectations of blind people in the National Federation of the Blind.  Live the Life You Want."

Patti Gregory Chang
National Federation of the Blind of Illinois, Treasurer NFB Scholarship Committee Chair pattischang at gmail.com NFB of IL: www.nfbofillinois.org
NFB: www.nfb.org

"Every day we raise the expectations of blind people in the National Federation of the Blind.  Live the Life You Want."

Patti Gregory Chang
National Federation of the Blind of Illinois, Treasurer NFB Scholarship Committee Chair pattischang at gmail.com NFB of IL: www.nfbofillinois.org
NFB: www.nfb.org

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/rfarber%40jw.com



From mnowicki4 at icloud.com  Mon Dec 22 19:15:03 2014
From: mnowicki4 at icloud.com (Michal Nowicki)
Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2014 13:15:03 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Happy Holidays
Message-ID: <005d01d01e1b$972e2b40$c58a81c0$@icloud.com>

Dear Federationists,

 

I wanted to take this opportunity to wish each and everyone of you a fun and
relaxing holiday season.  I know that many of you are very busy with
work/school, so hopefully, you can take a break from all of that by spending
time with friends and family.  Finally, I wish you all the best in 2015.

 

Michal


From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Wed Dec 24 23:30:07 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2014 18:30:07 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean and
	Professors
Message-ID: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>

Happy Holidays Everyone!

 

I have recently come across information that a particular law school's dean
and other faculty members secretly conspired to "encourage" a visually
impaired student not to complete law school. They actually put the
conspiracy in writing among themselves via email! 

 

They do not come straight out to the visually impaired student and say that
they are going to violate the Americans with Disability Act. Nor do they say
they will intentionally ignore the agreed upon accommodations. The tactics
they used include making it difficult by refusing to put the documents in
the right format, not giving the documents (PowerPoints, etc.) in a timely
fashion, and generally refusing to follow the accommodations agreed upon. By
the time the visually impaired student documents and files complaints, they
are behind in class. That is part of the plan to convince the student that
law school is not for them.

 

Have you encountered this problem? If so, how did you deal with it?

 

I also would like to know about the experiences of visually impaired and
blind students who successfully completed law school. For example, did the
professors follow the agreed upon accommodations? Where your classes
stationary, i.e., in the same classroom all day? 

 

I would like to know how blind and low vision law students cope with the
first year of law school when sabotage is  the plan of the deans and
professors.

 

What have your experiences been like?

 

Thank you.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978

 


From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Wed Dec 24 23:42:11 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2014 18:42:11 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean and
	Professors
In-Reply-To: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <014c01d01fd3$3df68130$b9e38390$@gmail.com>

Happy Holidays Everyone:

 

Please give me any suggestions.

 

Thank you.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978

 

From: Anita Keith-Foust [mailto:anitakeithfoust at gmail.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 6:30 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Cc: AnitaKeithFoust at gmail.com
Subject: How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean and Professors

 

Happy Holidays Everyone!

 

I have recently come across information that a particular law school's dean
and other faculty members secretly conspired to "encourage" a visually
impaired student not to complete law school. They actually put the
conspiracy in writing among themselves via email! 

 

They do not come straight out to the visually impaired student and say that
they are going to violate the Americans with Disability Act. Nor do they say
they will intentionally ignore the agreed upon accommodations. The tactics
they used include making it difficult by refusing to put the documents in
the right format, not giving the documents (PowerPoints, etc.) in a timely
fashion, and generally refusing to follow the accommodations agreed upon. By
the time the visually impaired student documents and files complaints, they
are behind in class. That is part of the plan to convince the student that
law school is not for them.

 

Have you encountered this problem? If so, how did you deal with it?

 

I also would like to know about the experiences of visually impaired and
blind students who successfully completed law school. For example, did the
professors follow the agreed upon accommodations? Where your classes
stationary, i.e., in the same classroom all day? 

 

I would like to know how blind and low vision law students cope with the
first year of law school when sabotage is  the plan of the deans and
professors.

 

What have your experiences been like?

 

Thank you.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978

 


From helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com  Thu Dec 25 00:16:34 2014
From: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com (helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com)
Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2014 19:16:34 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
	andProfessors
In-Reply-To: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <83130F93EB9B4145B753ACBB67CBB302@Helga>

Hi Ms. Anita, How are you? I have not any experience in Law school yet, but 
when in my college I have these issues that they don't give me my materials 
in time, I usually go to the Student Services Dean. However, since this Law 
student has been sabotaged by the Dean of the school and the Professors by 
telling him or her that he or she should not do Law school because it is to 
hard, I recommend for the student to go see the Probost of the school, or 
even the Vice President and tell them his situation! This is actually what I 
do when I have problem with my Advisor in getting me my materials in Braille 
in time, but not only that, also other issues as well! I think this is 
incredible that this still happens in Law school.  And I also think he or 
she should also should fight for his or her rights! Also, just to let you 
know, one time my adviser told me that I should not take a math class 
because she thought it was so hard for me since I am blind, but I told her 
that I will do it! And in the end Ii I ended up taking Intermediate Algebra, 
College Algebra, and Pre-Calculus! Hope this suggestions helps! I know that 
I'm not a Law student yet.  Hope to hear from you soon. Thanks so much and 
have a nice day!



Helga Schreiber

Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter
Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of Blind 
Students
Member of The International Networkers Team (INT)
Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research

Phone: (561) 706-5950
Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com
Skype: helga.schreiber26
4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx
INT Website: http://int4life.com/

"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever 
believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16
-----Original Message----- 
From: Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 6:30 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean 
andProfessors

Happy Holidays Everyone!



I have recently come across information that a particular law school's dean
and other faculty members secretly conspired to "encourage" a visually
impaired student not to complete law school. They actually put the
conspiracy in writing among themselves via email!



They do not come straight out to the visually impaired student and say that
they are going to violate the Americans with Disability Act. Nor do they say
they will intentionally ignore the agreed upon accommodations. The tactics
they used include making it difficult by refusing to put the documents in
the right format, not giving the documents (PowerPoints, etc.) in a timely
fashion, and generally refusing to follow the accommodations agreed upon. By
the time the visually impaired student documents and files complaints, they
are behind in class. That is part of the plan to convince the student that
law school is not for them.



Have you encountered this problem? If so, how did you deal with it?



I also would like to know about the experiences of visually impaired and
blind students who successfully completed law school. For example, did the
professors follow the agreed upon accommodations? Where your classes
stationary, i.e., in the same classroom all day?



I would like to know how blind and low vision law students cope with the
first year of law school when sabotage is  the plan of the deans and
professors.



What have your experiences been like?



Thank you.



Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978



_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/helga.schreiber26%40gmail.com 



From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Thu Dec 25 00:30:46 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2014 19:30:46 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
	andProfessors
In-Reply-To: <83130F93EB9B4145B753ACBB67CBB302@Helga>
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
	<83130F93EB9B4145B753ACBB67CBB302@Helga>
Message-ID: <018001d01fda$07bd9160$1738b420$@gmail.com>

Thanks for the suggestions, Helga.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com [mailto:helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 7:17 PM
To: Anita Keith-Foust; blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
andProfessors

Hi Ms. Anita, How are you? I have not any experience in Law school yet, but
when in my college I have these issues that they don't give me my materials
in time, I usually go to the Student Services Dean. However, since this Law
student has been sabotaged by the Dean of the school and the Professors by
telling him or her that he or she should not do Law school because it is to
hard, I recommend for the student to go see the Probost of the school, or
even the Vice President and tell them his situation! This is actually what I
do when I have problem with my Advisor in getting me my materials in Braille
in time, but not only that, also other issues as well! I think this is
incredible that this still happens in Law school.  And I also think he or
she should also should fight for his or her rights! Also, just to let you
know, one time my adviser told me that I should not take a math class
because she thought it was so hard for me since I am blind, but I told her
that I will do it! And in the end Ii I ended up taking Intermediate Algebra,
College Algebra, and Pre-Calculus! Hope this suggestions helps! I know that
I'm not a Law student yet.  Hope to hear from you soon. Thanks so much and
have a nice day!



Helga Schreiber

Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter Member
of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of Blind
Students Member of The International Networkers Team (INT) Independent
Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research

Phone: (561) 706-5950
Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com
Skype: helga.schreiber26
4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx
INT Website: http://int4life.com/

"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever
believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16
-----Original Message-----
From: Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 6:30 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
andProfessors

Happy Holidays Everyone!



I have recently come across information that a particular law school's dean
and other faculty members secretly conspired to "encourage" a visually
impaired student not to complete law school. They actually put the
conspiracy in writing among themselves via email!



They do not come straight out to the visually impaired student and say that
they are going to violate the Americans with Disability Act. Nor do they say
they will intentionally ignore the agreed upon accommodations. The tactics
they used include making it difficult by refusing to put the documents in
the right format, not giving the documents (PowerPoints, etc.) in a timely
fashion, and generally refusing to follow the accommodations agreed upon. By
the time the visually impaired student documents and files complaints, they
are behind in class. That is part of the plan to convince the student that
law school is not for them.



Have you encountered this problem? If so, how did you deal with it?



I also would like to know about the experiences of visually impaired and
blind students who successfully completed law school. For example, did the
professors follow the agreed upon accommodations? Where your classes
stationary, i.e., in the same classroom all day?



I would like to know how blind and low vision law students cope with the
first year of law school when sabotage is  the plan of the deans and
professors.



What have your experiences been like?



Thank you.



Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978



_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/helga.schreiber26%40gm
ail.com 




From mnowicki4 at icloud.com  Thu Dec 25 00:55:19 2014
From: mnowicki4 at icloud.com (Michal Nowicki)
Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2014 18:55:19 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
	and	Professors
In-Reply-To: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <000201d01fdd$74e320e0$5ea962a0$@icloud.com>

Anita,

Where did this take place?  Are you sure it really happened?  I am shocked
that a post-secondary institution would do something like this.  I am
particularly surprised that it was a law school, where employees surely know
that such action clearly violates the ADA and could thus bring about serious
legal consequences.

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 5:30 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean and
Professors

Happy Holidays Everyone!

 

I have recently come across information that a particular law school's dean
and other faculty members secretly conspired to "encourage" a visually
impaired student not to complete law school. They actually put the
conspiracy in writing among themselves via email! 

 

They do not come straight out to the visually impaired student and say that
they are going to violate the Americans with Disability Act. Nor do they say
they will intentionally ignore the agreed upon accommodations. The tactics
they used include making it difficult by refusing to put the documents in
the right format, not giving the documents (PowerPoints, etc.) in a timely
fashion, and generally refusing to follow the accommodations agreed upon. By
the time the visually impaired student documents and files complaints, they
are behind in class. That is part of the plan to convince the student that
law school is not for them.

 

Have you encountered this problem? If so, how did you deal with it?

 

I also would like to know about the experiences of visually impaired and
blind students who successfully completed law school. For example, did the
professors follow the agreed upon accommodations? Where your classes
stationary, i.e., in the same classroom all day? 

 

I would like to know how blind and low vision law students cope with the
first year of law school when sabotage is  the plan of the deans and
professors.

 

What have your experiences been like?

 

Thank you.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978

 

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40icloud.com



From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Thu Dec 25 01:49:48 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2014 20:49:48 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
	and	Professors
In-Reply-To: <000201d01fdd$74e320e0$5ea962a0$@icloud.com>
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
	<000201d01fdd$74e320e0$5ea962a0$@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <018801d01fe5$12449240$36cdb6c0$@gmail.com>

Dear Michal:

Yes, it happened. I have a copy of the email.

How can we work around these types of saboteurs? They were not up front
about it. They did it amongst themselves. They did not think that email
would be found.

Just imagine, after all of the hard work of getting to the law school, and
while they are grinning in your face, behind your back they are discussing
how not to follow the agreed upon accommodations. They are teaching the law
and violating it at the same time.

How can a student deal with that (documenting and filing complaints) and
successfully study?

Please let me know. Others may run into similar problems.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978 

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michal
Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 7:55 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean and
Professors

Anita,

Where did this take place?  Are you sure it really happened?  I am shocked
that a post-secondary institution would do something like this.  I am
particularly surprised that it was a law school, where employees surely know
that such action clearly violates the ADA and could thus bring about serious
legal consequences.

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 5:30 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean and
Professors

Happy Holidays Everyone!

 

I have recently come across information that a particular law school's dean
and other faculty members secretly conspired to "encourage" a visually
impaired student not to complete law school. They actually put the
conspiracy in writing among themselves via email! 

 

They do not come straight out to the visually impaired student and say that
they are going to violate the Americans with Disability Act. Nor do they say
they will intentionally ignore the agreed upon accommodations. The tactics
they used include making it difficult by refusing to put the documents in
the right format, not giving the documents (PowerPoints, etc.) in a timely
fashion, and generally refusing to follow the accommodations agreed upon. By
the time the visually impaired student documents and files complaints, they
are behind in class. That is part of the plan to convince the student that
law school is not for them.

 

Have you encountered this problem? If so, how did you deal with it?

 

I also would like to know about the experiences of visually impaired and
blind students who successfully completed law school. For example, did the
professors follow the agreed upon accommodations? Where your classes
stationary, i.e., in the same classroom all day? 

 

I would like to know how blind and low vision law students cope with the
first year of law school when sabotage is  the plan of the deans and
professors.

 

What have your experiences been like?

 

Thank you.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978

 

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40icloud.com


_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/anitakeithfoust%40gmai
l.com



From b.schulz at sbcglobal.net  Thu Dec 25 04:05:22 2014
From: b.schulz at sbcglobal.net (Bryan Schulz)
Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2014 22:05:22 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
	andProfessors
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <54858DFC50B64787927B6EE1C87ED563@HP8730notebook>

hi,

Your question is not limited to law.
In Missouri, the supervisor of a district rehabilitation office forced one 
adaptive computing contractor out of business and forced another contractor 
to return to Florida when clients were assigned to her favored contractor 
that was twice as expensive and doesn't even reside in Missouri.
The result was loss of income and the first contractor is now seeking other 
computer related employment.
Bryan Schulz

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
To: <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 5:30 PM
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean 
andProfessors


> Happy Holidays Everyone!
>
>
>
> I have recently come across information that a particular law school's 
> dean
> and other faculty members secretly conspired to "encourage" a visually
> impaired student not to complete law school. They actually put the
> conspiracy in writing among themselves via email!
>
>
>
> They do not come straight out to the visually impaired student and say 
> that
> they are going to violate the Americans with Disability Act. Nor do they 
> say
> they will intentionally ignore the agreed upon accommodations. The tactics
> they used include making it difficult by refusing to put the documents in
> the right format, not giving the documents (PowerPoints, etc.) in a timely
> fashion, and generally refusing to follow the accommodations agreed upon. 
> By
> the time the visually impaired student documents and files complaints, 
> they
> are behind in class. That is part of the plan to convince the student that
> law school is not for them.
>
>
>
> Have you encountered this problem? If so, how did you deal with it?
>
>
>
> I also would like to know about the experiences of visually impaired and
> blind students who successfully completed law school. For example, did the
> professors follow the agreed upon accommodations? Where your classes
> stationary, i.e., in the same classroom all day?
>
>
>
> I would like to know how blind and low vision law students cope with the
> first year of law school when sabotage is  the plan of the deans and
> professors.
>
>
>
> What have your experiences been like?
>
>
>
> Thank you.
>
>
>
> Anita Keith-Foust
>
> 919-430-1978
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/b.schulz%40sbcglobal.net 



From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Thu Dec 25 04:26:22 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2014 23:26:22 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
	andProfessors
In-Reply-To: <54858DFC50B64787927B6EE1C87ED563@HP8730notebook>
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
	<54858DFC50B64787927B6EE1C87ED563@HP8730notebook>
Message-ID: <000001d01ffa$f14aa370$d3dfea50$@gmail.com>

Wow!

-----Original Message-----
From: Bryan Schulz [mailto:b.schulz at sbcglobal.net] 
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:05 PM
To: Anita Keith-Foust; Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
andProfessors

hi,

Your question is not limited to law.
In Missouri, the supervisor of a district rehabilitation office forced one
adaptive computing contractor out of business and forced another contractor
to return to Florida when clients were assigned to her favored contractor
that was twice as expensive and doesn't even reside in Missouri.
The result was loss of income and the first contractor is now seeking other
computer related employment.
Bryan Schulz

----- Original Message -----
From: "Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
To: <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 5:30 PM
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
andProfessors


> Happy Holidays Everyone!
>
>
>
> I have recently come across information that a particular law school's 
> dean and other faculty members secretly conspired to "encourage" a 
> visually impaired student not to complete law school. They actually 
> put the conspiracy in writing among themselves via email!
>
>
>
> They do not come straight out to the visually impaired student and say 
> that they are going to violate the Americans with Disability Act. Nor 
> do they say they will intentionally ignore the agreed upon 
> accommodations. The tactics they used include making it difficult by 
> refusing to put the documents in the right format, not giving the 
> documents (PowerPoints, etc.) in a timely fashion, and generally 
> refusing to follow the accommodations agreed upon.
> By
> the time the visually impaired student documents and files complaints, 
> they are behind in class. That is part of the plan to convince the 
> student that law school is not for them.
>
>
>
> Have you encountered this problem? If so, how did you deal with it?
>
>
>
> I also would like to know about the experiences of visually impaired 
> and blind students who successfully completed law school. For example, 
> did the professors follow the agreed upon accommodations? Where your 
> classes stationary, i.e., in the same classroom all day?
>
>
>
> I would like to know how blind and low vision law students cope with 
> the first year of law school when sabotage is  the plan of the deans 
> and professors.
>
>
>
> What have your experiences been like?
>
>
>
> Thank you.
>
>
>
> Anita Keith-Foust
>
> 919-430-1978
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/b.schulz%40sbcgl
> obal.net




From ckrugman at sbcglobal.net  Thu Dec 25 04:52:54 2014
From: ckrugman at sbcglobal.net (Charles Krugman)
Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2014 20:52:54 -0800
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
	DeanandProfessors
In-Reply-To: <000001d01ffa$f14aa370$d3dfea50$@gmail.com>
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com><54858DFC50B64787927B6EE1C87ED563@HP8730notebook>
	<000001d01ffa$f14aa370$d3dfea50$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <EF4CA8A70610465C9B287272EC532464@Spike>

Anita, what seems to have happened to you is very unfortunate but it happens 
to students in all disciplines of advanced study. I went to college and 
graduate school at a time before the ADA and my success depended only on 
what I did or didn't do. In the sixties and seventies as a student I had to 
make sure that materials that I needed were readily available and if they 
weren't I had to make sure that readers were hired to record them or get 
them recorded by volunteers. Later when I made a career change about 15 
years ago and became a paralegal upon leaving the field of Social work when 
attending a community college I saw several students that were weeded out of 
the program in various ways. Law school especially does things to not only 
mold students in to certain roles but weeds out those who they feel might 
not make it in the profession. I have discussed with many sighted law 
students and lawyers the types of things that occurred in law school that 
could be considered to mold the individual in to a certain role. In some 
cases where I observed this taking place some of the people perhaps should 
for various reasons not have been in a particular academic program and 
others were the victims of harassment or discrimination.
Not knowing the specific circumstances of what was done I can only say that 
now that you know what was being done you can only assess the facts of the 
situation as well as how this impacts your desire to continue to study law. 
You may want to consider transferring to another law school and you may also 
want to consider the legal remedies that are open to you to address what was 
done to you. This is not an easy situation for someone to be in because if 
they use legal remedies that are open and continue to study in the 
particular school in question there could be additional difficulties that 
may occur as a result of taking action. Whatever happens you will need to be 
very strong through this period and ask for much support from people who are 
around you and who are sympathetic. I hope this helps.
Chuck Krugman, MSW Paralegal
1237 P Street
Fresno ca 93721
559-266-9237

-----Original Message----- 
From: Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 8:26 PM
To: 'Bryan Schulz' ; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by 
DeanandProfessors

Wow!

-----Original Message-----
From: Bryan Schulz [mailto:b.schulz at sbcglobal.net]
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:05 PM
To: Anita Keith-Foust; Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
andProfessors

hi,

Your question is not limited to law.
In Missouri, the supervisor of a district rehabilitation office forced one
adaptive computing contractor out of business and forced another contractor
to return to Florida when clients were assigned to her favored contractor
that was twice as expensive and doesn't even reside in Missouri.
The result was loss of income and the first contractor is now seeking other
computer related employment.
Bryan Schulz

----- Original Message -----
From: "Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
To: <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 5:30 PM
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
andProfessors


> Happy Holidays Everyone!
>
>
>
> I have recently come across information that a particular law school's
> dean and other faculty members secretly conspired to "encourage" a
> visually impaired student not to complete law school. They actually
> put the conspiracy in writing among themselves via email!
>
>
>
> They do not come straight out to the visually impaired student and say
> that they are going to violate the Americans with Disability Act. Nor
> do they say they will intentionally ignore the agreed upon
> accommodations. The tactics they used include making it difficult by
> refusing to put the documents in the right format, not giving the
> documents (PowerPoints, etc.) in a timely fashion, and generally
> refusing to follow the accommodations agreed upon.
> By
> the time the visually impaired student documents and files complaints,
> they are behind in class. That is part of the plan to convince the
> student that law school is not for them.
>
>
>
> Have you encountered this problem? If so, how did you deal with it?
>
>
>
> I also would like to know about the experiences of visually impaired
> and blind students who successfully completed law school. For example,
> did the professors follow the agreed upon accommodations? Where your
> classes stationary, i.e., in the same classroom all day?
>
>
>
> I would like to know how blind and low vision law students cope with
> the first year of law school when sabotage is  the plan of the deans
> and professors.
>
>
>
> What have your experiences been like?
>
>
>
> Thank you.
>
>
>
> Anita Keith-Foust
>
> 919-430-1978
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/b.schulz%40sbcgl
> obal.net



_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/ckrugman%40sbcglobal.net 



From schorschj at comcast.net  Thu Dec 25 06:37:45 2014
From: schorschj at comcast.net (Jon Schorsch)
Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2014 22:37:45 -0800
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
	and	Professors
In-Reply-To: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <005c01d0200d$4b3ce4d0$e1b6ae70$@comcast.net>

Dear Anita,

I am sorry to hear about this situation.  I recently graduated from law
school and never experienced anything like this.  I would suggest doing what
Helga wrote in her earlier email and then contacting the U.S. Department of
Education - Office for Civil rights for guidance.


Jon Schorsch 
J.D. 2014, Seattle University School of Law  



-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 3:30 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean and
Professors

Happy Holidays Everyone!

 

I have recently come across information that a particular law school's dean
and other faculty members secretly conspired to "encourage" a visually
impaired student not to complete law school. They actually put the
conspiracy in writing among themselves via email! 

 

They do not come straight out to the visually impaired student and say that
they are going to violate the Americans with Disability Act. Nor do they say
they will intentionally ignore the agreed upon accommodations. The tactics
they used include making it difficult by refusing to put the documents in
the right format, not giving the documents (PowerPoints, etc.) in a timely
fashion, and generally refusing to follow the accommodations agreed upon. By
the time the visually impaired student documents and files complaints, they
are behind in class. That is part of the plan to convince the student that
law school is not for them.

 

Have you encountered this problem? If so, how did you deal with it?

 

I also would like to know about the experiences of visually impaired and
blind students who successfully completed law school. For example, did the
professors follow the agreed upon accommodations? Where your classes
stationary, i.e., in the same classroom all day? 

 

I would like to know how blind and low vision law students cope with the
first year of law school when sabotage is  the plan of the deans and
professors.

 

What have your experiences been like?

 

Thank you.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978

 

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/schorschj%40comcast.ne
t



From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Thu Dec 25 17:42:47 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2014 12:42:47 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
	and	Professors
In-Reply-To: <005c01d0200d$4b3ce4d0$e1b6ae70$@comcast.net>
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
	<005c01d0200d$4b3ce4d0$e1b6ae70$@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <001801d0206a$3364f160$9a2ed420$@gmail.com>

Thanks Jon.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: Jon Schorsch [mailto:schorschj at comcast.net] 
Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2014 1:38 AM
To: 'Anita Keith-Foust'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: RE: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean and
Professors

Dear Anita,

I am sorry to hear about this situation.  I recently graduated from law
school and never experienced anything like this.  I would suggest doing what
Helga wrote in her earlier email and then contacting the U.S. Department of
Education - Office for Civil rights for guidance.


Jon Schorsch
J.D. 2014, Seattle University School of Law  



-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 3:30 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean and
Professors

Happy Holidays Everyone!

 

I have recently come across information that a particular law school's dean
and other faculty members secretly conspired to "encourage" a visually
impaired student not to complete law school. They actually put the
conspiracy in writing among themselves via email! 

 

They do not come straight out to the visually impaired student and say that
they are going to violate the Americans with Disability Act. Nor do they say
they will intentionally ignore the agreed upon accommodations. The tactics
they used include making it difficult by refusing to put the documents in
the right format, not giving the documents (PowerPoints, etc.) in a timely
fashion, and generally refusing to follow the accommodations agreed upon. By
the time the visually impaired student documents and files complaints, they
are behind in class. That is part of the plan to convince the student that
law school is not for them.

 

Have you encountered this problem? If so, how did you deal with it?

 

I also would like to know about the experiences of visually impaired and
blind students who successfully completed law school. For example, did the
professors follow the agreed upon accommodations? Where your classes
stationary, i.e., in the same classroom all day? 

 

I would like to know how blind and low vision law students cope with the
first year of law school when sabotage is  the plan of the deans and
professors.

 

What have your experiences been like?

 

Thank you.

 

Anita Keith-Foust

919-430-1978

 

_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/schorschj%40comcast.ne
t




From mnowicki4 at icloud.com  Thu Dec 25 21:03:18 2014
From: mnowicki4 at icloud.com (Michal Nowicki)
Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2014 15:03:18 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged
	by	DeanandProfessors
In-Reply-To: <EF4CA8A70610465C9B287272EC532464@Spike>
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
	<54858DFC50B64787927B6EE1C87ED563@HP8730notebook>
	<000001d01ffa$f14aa370$d3dfea50$@gmail.com>
	<EF4CA8A70610465C9B287272EC532464@Spike>
Message-ID: <000601d02086$360750e0$a215f2a0$@icloud.com>

Dear Mr.  Krugman and anyone else who has answers to my questions,

I sincerely apologize for sending out this e-mail on Christmas Day, when
everyone wants to spend time with family and get away from the hustle and
bustle of everyday life.  The potential gravity of this issue, however, has
compelled me to waste no time.

Mr.  Krugman, could you be more specific about some of the ways in which
graduate schools try to "mold" certain students into specific roles while
"weeding out" others?  For instance, do they force students to take certain
classes, and if so, what methods do they employ to achieve their objectives?

I would also like to know if anyone on this list is aware of any patterns
that trigger/drive such behavior.  For example, does the rank of the
program/school affect the likelihood that such incidents will occur?  If so,
should we watch out more for top-ranked universities or lower-ranked once?
What about public vs.  private schools?

Finally, please tell me how frequently blind graduate students encounter
such obstacles.  Are these problems considerably rare, or do they arise
frequently enough that I should be legitimately concerned about them in
choosing which law school to attend?

Thank you in advance for your responses, and once again, I apologize if I
disrupted your holidays.

Cordially,

Michal Nowicki

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Charles
Krugman via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 10:53 PM
To: Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
DeanandProfessors

Anita, what seems to have happened to you is very unfortunate but it happens
to students in all disciplines of advanced study. I went to college and
graduate school at a time before the ADA and my success depended only on
what I did or didn't do. In the sixties and seventies as a student I had to
make sure that materials that I needed were readily available and if they
weren't I had to make sure that readers were hired to record them or get
them recorded by volunteers. Later when I made a career change about 15
years ago and became a paralegal upon leaving the field of Social work when
attending a community college I saw several students that were weeded out of
the program in various ways. Law school especially does things to not only
mold students in to certain roles but weeds out those who they feel might
not make it in the profession. I have discussed with many sighted law
students and lawyers the types of things that occurred in law school that
could be considered to mold the individual in to a certain role. In some
cases where I observed this taking place some of the people perhaps should
for various reasons not have been in a particular academic program and
others were the victims of harassment or discrimination.
Not knowing the specific circumstances of what was done I can only say that
now that you know what was being done you can only assess the facts of the
situation as well as how this impacts your desire to continue to study law. 
You may want to consider transferring to another law school and you may also
want to consider the legal remedies that are open to you to address what was
done to you. This is not an easy situation for someone to be in because if
they use legal remedies that are open and continue to study in the
particular school in question there could be additional difficulties that
may occur as a result of taking action. Whatever happens you will need to be
very strong through this period and ask for much support from people who are
around you and who are sympathetic. I hope this helps.
Chuck Krugman, MSW Paralegal
1237 P Street
Fresno ca 93721
559-266-9237

-----Original Message-----
From: Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 8:26 PM
To: 'Bryan Schulz' ; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
DeanandProfessors

Wow!

-----Original Message-----
From: Bryan Schulz [mailto:b.schulz at sbcglobal.net]
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:05 PM
To: Anita Keith-Foust; Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
andProfessors

hi,

Your question is not limited to law.
In Missouri, the supervisor of a district rehabilitation office forced one
adaptive computing contractor out of business and forced another contractor
to return to Florida when clients were assigned to her favored contractor
that was twice as expensive and doesn't even reside in Missouri.
The result was loss of income and the first contractor is now seeking other
computer related employment.
Bryan Schulz

----- Original Message -----
From: "Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
To: <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 5:30 PM
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
andProfessors


> Happy Holidays Everyone!
>
>
>
> I have recently come across information that a particular law school's 
> dean and other faculty members secretly conspired to "encourage" a 
> visually impaired student not to complete law school. They actually 
> put the conspiracy in writing among themselves via email!
>
>
>
> They do not come straight out to the visually impaired student and say 
> that they are going to violate the Americans with Disability Act. Nor 
> do they say they will intentionally ignore the agreed upon 
> accommodations. The tactics they used include making it difficult by 
> refusing to put the documents in the right format, not giving the 
> documents (PowerPoints, etc.) in a timely fashion, and generally 
> refusing to follow the accommodations agreed upon.
> By
> the time the visually impaired student documents and files complaints, 
> they are behind in class. That is part of the plan to convince the 
> student that law school is not for them.
>
>
>
> Have you encountered this problem? If so, how did you deal with it?
>
>
>
> I also would like to know about the experiences of visually impaired 
> and blind students who successfully completed law school. For example, 
> did the professors follow the agreed upon accommodations? Where your 
> classes stationary, i.e., in the same classroom all day?
>
>
>
> I would like to know how blind and low vision law students cope with 
> the first year of law school when sabotage is  the plan of the deans 
> and professors.
>
>
>
> What have your experiences been like?
>
>
>
> Thank you.
>
>
>
> Anita Keith-Foust
>
> 919-430-1978
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/b.schulz%40sbcgl
> obal.net



_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/ckrugman%40sbcglobal.n
et 


_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40icloud.com



From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Thu Dec 25 23:15:29 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2014 18:15:29 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged
	by	DeanandProfessors
In-Reply-To: <000601d02086$360750e0$a215f2a0$@icloud.com>
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
	<54858DFC50B64787927B6EE1C87ED563@HP8730notebook>
	<000001d01ffa$f14aa370$d3dfea50$@gmail.com>
	<EF4CA8A70610465C9B287272EC532464@Spike>
	<000601d02086$360750e0$a215f2a0$@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <002701d02098$ae08bb30$0a1a3190$@gmail.com>

Dear Michal:

Those are excellent questions.

The school that is the topic of my inquiry is a historically African
American university, North Carolina Central University (NCCU). It is not top
ranked like Yale, Harvard, or Duke.

The fact that it is a historically African American university would make me
think that the faculty would be sensitive enough to not discriminate and
follow the law. 

As I think about the dilemma that we all face as blind and visually impaired
students, we probably need to start a database of substantiated instances of
discrimination at all colleges and universities. There is more than one
instance of visually challenged students not being accommodated at NCCU.
Right now, I feel like I am extremely vulnerable to saboteurs because I am
not informed as to which schools have a substantiated history of
discriminating against visually challenged students.

I am to the point that, although I am preparing for the LSAT, I am
considering Concord Law School. Concord is an online law school. The reason
that I am considering this school, although it is not ABA approved, is that
I can work from the comfort of my home with the proper software and
equipment. This means that I will be accommodated. Also, they do have a
department that deals with accessibility issues. I have already submitted my
documentation for accommodations, extended time and etc., and they have
agreed to these accommodations.  I only need to take their entrance exam.
Since I preparing for the June LSAT, I will take their entrance exam after
June. One concern that I have about Concord is, I can only sit for the
California Bar.

Concord does have a link that shows one of their graduates, who passed the
California Bar, challenging the bar in the state he lives in to sit for that
bar. He won his case and was able to sit for his state's bar.

At any rate, I am eager to hear answers to your questions.

Sincerely,

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michal
Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2014 4:03 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
DeanandProfessors

Dear Mr.  Krugman and anyone else who has answers to my questions,

I sincerely apologize for sending out this e-mail on Christmas Day, when
everyone wants to spend time with family and get away from the hustle and
bustle of everyday life.  The potential gravity of this issue, however, has
compelled me to waste no time.

Mr.  Krugman, could you be more specific about some of the ways in which
graduate schools try to "mold" certain students into specific roles while
"weeding out" others?  For instance, do they force students to take certain
classes, and if so, what methods do they employ to achieve their objectives?

I would also like to know if anyone on this list is aware of any patterns
that trigger/drive such behavior.  For example, does the rank of the
program/school affect the likelihood that such incidents will occur?  If so,
should we watch out more for top-ranked universities or lower-ranked once?
What about public vs.  private schools?

Finally, please tell me how frequently blind graduate students encounter
such obstacles.  Are these problems considerably rare, or do they arise
frequently enough that I should be legitimately concerned about them in
choosing which law school to attend?

Thank you in advance for your responses, and once again, I apologize if I
disrupted your holidays.

Cordially,

Michal Nowicki

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Charles
Krugman via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 10:53 PM
To: Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
DeanandProfessors

Anita, what seems to have happened to you is very unfortunate but it happens
to students in all disciplines of advanced study. I went to college and
graduate school at a time before the ADA and my success depended only on
what I did or didn't do. In the sixties and seventies as a student I had to
make sure that materials that I needed were readily available and if they
weren't I had to make sure that readers were hired to record them or get
them recorded by volunteers. Later when I made a career change about 15
years ago and became a paralegal upon leaving the field of Social work when
attending a community college I saw several students that were weeded out of
the program in various ways. Law school especially does things to not only
mold students in to certain roles but weeds out those who they feel might
not make it in the profession. I have discussed with many sighted law
students and lawyers the types of things that occurred in law school that
could be considered to mold the individual in to a certain role. In some
cases where I observed this taking place some of the people perhaps should
for various reasons not have been in a particular academic program and
others were the victims of harassment or discrimination.
Not knowing the specific circumstances of what was done I can only say that
now that you know what was being done you can only assess the facts of the
situation as well as how this impacts your desire to continue to study law. 
You may want to consider transferring to another law school and you may also
want to consider the legal remedies that are open to you to address what was
done to you. This is not an easy situation for someone to be in because if
they use legal remedies that are open and continue to study in the
particular school in question there could be additional difficulties that
may occur as a result of taking action. Whatever happens you will need to be
very strong through this period and ask for much support from people who are
around you and who are sympathetic. I hope this helps.
Chuck Krugman, MSW Paralegal
1237 P Street
Fresno ca 93721
559-266-9237

-----Original Message-----
From: Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 8:26 PM
To: 'Bryan Schulz' ; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
DeanandProfessors

Wow!

-----Original Message-----
From: Bryan Schulz [mailto:b.schulz at sbcglobal.net]
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:05 PM
To: Anita Keith-Foust; Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
andProfessors

hi,

Your question is not limited to law.
In Missouri, the supervisor of a district rehabilitation office forced one
adaptive computing contractor out of business and forced another contractor
to return to Florida when clients were assigned to her favored contractor
that was twice as expensive and doesn't even reside in Missouri.
The result was loss of income and the first contractor is now seeking other
computer related employment.
Bryan Schulz

----- Original Message -----
From: "Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
To: <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 5:30 PM
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
andProfessors


> Happy Holidays Everyone!
>
>
>
> I have recently come across information that a particular law school's 
> dean and other faculty members secretly conspired to "encourage" a 
> visually impaired student not to complete law school. They actually 
> put the conspiracy in writing among themselves via email!
>
>
>
> They do not come straight out to the visually impaired student and say 
> that they are going to violate the Americans with Disability Act. Nor 
> do they say they will intentionally ignore the agreed upon 
> accommodations. The tactics they used include making it difficult by 
> refusing to put the documents in the right format, not giving the 
> documents (PowerPoints, etc.) in a timely fashion, and generally 
> refusing to follow the accommodations agreed upon.
> By
> the time the visually impaired student documents and files complaints, 
> they are behind in class. That is part of the plan to convince the 
> student that law school is not for them.
>
>
>
> Have you encountered this problem? If so, how did you deal with it?
>
>
>
> I also would like to know about the experiences of visually impaired 
> and blind students who successfully completed law school. For example, 
> did the professors follow the agreed upon accommodations? Where your 
> classes stationary, i.e., in the same classroom all day?
>
>
>
> I would like to know how blind and low vision law students cope with 
> the first year of law school when sabotage is  the plan of the deans 
> and professors.
>
>
>
> What have your experiences been like?
>
>
>
> Thank you.
>
>
>
> Anita Keith-Foust
>
> 919-430-1978
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/b.schulz%40sbcgl
> obal.net



_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/ckrugman%40sbcglobal.n
et 


_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40icloud.com


_______________________________________________
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From ckrugman at sbcglobal.net  Thu Dec 25 23:33:21 2014
From: ckrugman at sbcglobal.net (Charles Krugman)
Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2014 15:33:21 -0800
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student
	Sabotagedby	DeanandProfessors
In-Reply-To: <000601d02086$360750e0$a215f2a0$@icloud.com>
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com><54858DFC50B64787927B6EE1C87ED563@HP8730notebook><000001d01ffa$f14aa370$d3dfea50$@gmail.com><EF4CA8A70610465C9B287272EC532464@Spike>
	<000601d02086$360750e0$a215f2a0$@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <94F0C77A2F5E49E8A4E86EC693D21E3B@Spike>

Hi Mitchell,
I don't have detailed statistics but perhaps others who have experiences 
with dealing with graduate or law schools can respond. In my experience 
based on what I've observed the process is more subtle and I don't think 
that it is of systemic proportions. In many instances it seems to occur 
where a faculty member or in cases where a dissertation is required that a 
review committee chair has biases or dislikes against a certain candidate. I 
would not be overly concerned but I think that the best way to potentially 
remedy a potential problem is for any student to take a proactive approach 
in dealing with how they solve problems that may arise. While accommodations 
may be provided by a law school as a result of Section 504 or the ADA be 
prepared to have a contingency plan if something falls through. Consider 
that eventually as an attorney especially if in private practice or working 
for a small firm that you might not have the degree of support services 
available to you to remediate assistance that you will need as a result of a 
disability. While other students in most cases be willing to be helpful 
don't abuse the offers of help by taking them for granted and expecting them 
to always be forthcoming. Law school as in many advanced degree programs is 
highly competitive and unfortunately there are some people that will carry 
this to an excess. I hope this helps.
Chuck Krugman, MSW Paralegal
1237 P Street
Fresno ca 93721
559-266-9237

-----Original Message----- 
From: Michal Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2014 1:03 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotagedby 
DeanandProfessors

Dear Mr.  Krugman and anyone else who has answers to my questions,

I sincerely apologize for sending out this e-mail on Christmas Day, when
everyone wants to spend time with family and get away from the hustle and
bustle of everyday life.  The potential gravity of this issue, however, has
compelled me to waste no time.

Mr.  Krugman, could you be more specific about some of the ways in which
graduate schools try to "mold" certain students into specific roles while
"weeding out" others?  For instance, do they force students to take certain
classes, and if so, what methods do they employ to achieve their objectives?

I would also like to know if anyone on this list is aware of any patterns
that trigger/drive such behavior.  For example, does the rank of the
program/school affect the likelihood that such incidents will occur?  If so,
should we watch out more for top-ranked universities or lower-ranked once?
What about public vs.  private schools?

Finally, please tell me how frequently blind graduate students encounter
such obstacles.  Are these problems considerably rare, or do they arise
frequently enough that I should be legitimately concerned about them in
choosing which law school to attend?

Thank you in advance for your responses, and once again, I apologize if I
disrupted your holidays.

Cordially,

Michal Nowicki

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Charles
Krugman via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 10:53 PM
To: Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
DeanandProfessors

Anita, what seems to have happened to you is very unfortunate but it happens
to students in all disciplines of advanced study. I went to college and
graduate school at a time before the ADA and my success depended only on
what I did or didn't do. In the sixties and seventies as a student I had to
make sure that materials that I needed were readily available and if they
weren't I had to make sure that readers were hired to record them or get
them recorded by volunteers. Later when I made a career change about 15
years ago and became a paralegal upon leaving the field of Social work when
attending a community college I saw several students that were weeded out of
the program in various ways. Law school especially does things to not only
mold students in to certain roles but weeds out those who they feel might
not make it in the profession. I have discussed with many sighted law
students and lawyers the types of things that occurred in law school that
could be considered to mold the individual in to a certain role. In some
cases where I observed this taking place some of the people perhaps should
for various reasons not have been in a particular academic program and
others were the victims of harassment or discrimination.
Not knowing the specific circumstances of what was done I can only say that
now that you know what was being done you can only assess the facts of the
situation as well as how this impacts your desire to continue to study law.
You may want to consider transferring to another law school and you may also
want to consider the legal remedies that are open to you to address what was
done to you. This is not an easy situation for someone to be in because if
they use legal remedies that are open and continue to study in the
particular school in question there could be additional difficulties that
may occur as a result of taking action. Whatever happens you will need to be
very strong through this period and ask for much support from people who are
around you and who are sympathetic. I hope this helps.
Chuck Krugman, MSW Paralegal
1237 P Street
Fresno ca 93721
559-266-9237

-----Original Message-----
From: Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 8:26 PM
To: 'Bryan Schulz' ; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
DeanandProfessors

Wow!

-----Original Message-----
From: Bryan Schulz [mailto:b.schulz at sbcglobal.net]
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:05 PM
To: Anita Keith-Foust; Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
andProfessors

hi,

Your question is not limited to law.
In Missouri, the supervisor of a district rehabilitation office forced one
adaptive computing contractor out of business and forced another contractor
to return to Florida when clients were assigned to her favored contractor
that was twice as expensive and doesn't even reside in Missouri.
The result was loss of income and the first contractor is now seeking other
computer related employment.
Bryan Schulz

----- Original Message -----
From: "Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
To: <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 5:30 PM
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
andProfessors


> Happy Holidays Everyone!
>
>
>
> I have recently come across information that a particular law school's
> dean and other faculty members secretly conspired to "encourage" a
> visually impaired student not to complete law school. They actually
> put the conspiracy in writing among themselves via email!
>
>
>
> They do not come straight out to the visually impaired student and say
> that they are going to violate the Americans with Disability Act. Nor
> do they say they will intentionally ignore the agreed upon
> accommodations. The tactics they used include making it difficult by
> refusing to put the documents in the right format, not giving the
> documents (PowerPoints, etc.) in a timely fashion, and generally
> refusing to follow the accommodations agreed upon.
> By
> the time the visually impaired student documents and files complaints,
> they are behind in class. That is part of the plan to convince the
> student that law school is not for them.
>
>
>
> Have you encountered this problem? If so, how did you deal with it?
>
>
>
> I also would like to know about the experiences of visually impaired
> and blind students who successfully completed law school. For example,
> did the professors follow the agreed upon accommodations? Where your
> classes stationary, i.e., in the same classroom all day?
>
>
>
> I would like to know how blind and low vision law students cope with
> the first year of law school when sabotage is  the plan of the deans
> and professors.
>
>
>
> What have your experiences been like?
>
>
>
> Thank you.
>
>
>
> Anita Keith-Foust
>
> 919-430-1978
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/b.schulz%40sbcgl
> obal.net



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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/ckrugman%40sbcglobal.n
et


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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/ckrugman%40sbcglobal.net 



From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Fri Dec 26 00:04:23 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2014 19:04:23 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student
	Sabotagedby	DeanandProfessors
In-Reply-To: <94F0C77A2F5E49E8A4E86EC693D21E3B@Spike>
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com><54858DFC50B64787927B6EE1C87ED563@HP8730notebook><000001d01ffa$f14aa370$d3dfea50$@gmail.com><EF4CA8A70610465C9B287272EC532464@Spike>
	<000601d02086$360750e0$a215f2a0$@icloud.com>
	<94F0C77A2F5E49E8A4E86EC693D21E3B@Spike>
Message-ID: <002f01d0209f$823c4060$86b4c120$@gmail.com>

Dear Michal:

I guess I am looking at this from the perspective of sabotage by the dean
and professors.

There is no contingency plan that you can have with the tactics that I have
been informed about.

If it is substantiated that the dean and professors at a particular law
school have conspired to not accommodate and decide to discourage blind and
visually impaired students to choose another path BEFORE they even come to
class, the only contingency plan is to go to another law school until the
U.S. Department of Justice and other agencies penalize and monitor them.
This takes time for many reasons.

I think having a database of undergraduate, graduate, and law schools who
have substantiated instances of discrimination against visually challenged
students will be a great contingency plan.

I hope that the database becomes a reality. I am willing to do my part and
surely will use it.

Sincerely,

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Charles
Krugman via blindlaw
Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2014 6:33 PM
To: Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotagedby
DeanandProfessors

Hi Mitchell,
I don't have detailed statistics but perhaps others who have experiences
with dealing with graduate or law schools can respond. In my experience
based on what I've observed the process is more subtle and I don't think
that it is of systemic proportions. In many instances it seems to occur
where a faculty member or in cases where a dissertation is required that a
review committee chair has biases or dislikes against a certain candidate. I
would not be overly concerned but I think that the best way to potentially
remedy a potential problem is for any student to take a proactive approach
in dealing with how they solve problems that may arise. While accommodations
may be provided by a law school as a result of Section 504 or the ADA be
prepared to have a contingency plan if something falls through. Consider
that eventually as an attorney especially if in private practice or working
for a small firm that you might not have the degree of support services
available to you to remediate assistance that you will need as a result of a
disability. While other students in most cases be willing to be helpful
don't abuse the offers of help by taking them for granted and expecting them
to always be forthcoming. Law school as in many advanced degree programs is
highly competitive and unfortunately there are some people that will carry
this to an excess. I hope this helps.
Chuck Krugman, MSW Paralegal
1237 P Street
Fresno ca 93721
559-266-9237

-----Original Message-----
From: Michal Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2014 1:03 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotagedby
DeanandProfessors

Dear Mr.  Krugman and anyone else who has answers to my questions,

I sincerely apologize for sending out this e-mail on Christmas Day, when
everyone wants to spend time with family and get away from the hustle and
bustle of everyday life.  The potential gravity of this issue, however, has
compelled me to waste no time.

Mr.  Krugman, could you be more specific about some of the ways in which
graduate schools try to "mold" certain students into specific roles while
"weeding out" others?  For instance, do they force students to take certain
classes, and if so, what methods do they employ to achieve their objectives?

I would also like to know if anyone on this list is aware of any patterns
that trigger/drive such behavior.  For example, does the rank of the
program/school affect the likelihood that such incidents will occur?  If so,
should we watch out more for top-ranked universities or lower-ranked once?
What about public vs.  private schools?

Finally, please tell me how frequently blind graduate students encounter
such obstacles.  Are these problems considerably rare, or do they arise
frequently enough that I should be legitimately concerned about them in
choosing which law school to attend?

Thank you in advance for your responses, and once again, I apologize if I
disrupted your holidays.

Cordially,

Michal Nowicki

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Charles
Krugman via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 10:53 PM
To: Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
DeanandProfessors

Anita, what seems to have happened to you is very unfortunate but it happens
to students in all disciplines of advanced study. I went to college and
graduate school at a time before the ADA and my success depended only on
what I did or didn't do. In the sixties and seventies as a student I had to
make sure that materials that I needed were readily available and if they
weren't I had to make sure that readers were hired to record them or get
them recorded by volunteers. Later when I made a career change about 15
years ago and became a paralegal upon leaving the field of Social work when
attending a community college I saw several students that were weeded out of
the program in various ways. Law school especially does things to not only
mold students in to certain roles but weeds out those who they feel might
not make it in the profession. I have discussed with many sighted law
students and lawyers the types of things that occurred in law school that
could be considered to mold the individual in to a certain role. In some
cases where I observed this taking place some of the people perhaps should
for various reasons not have been in a particular academic program and
others were the victims of harassment or discrimination.
Not knowing the specific circumstances of what was done I can only say that
now that you know what was being done you can only assess the facts of the
situation as well as how this impacts your desire to continue to study law.
You may want to consider transferring to another law school and you may also
want to consider the legal remedies that are open to you to address what was
done to you. This is not an easy situation for someone to be in because if
they use legal remedies that are open and continue to study in the
particular school in question there could be additional difficulties that
may occur as a result of taking action. Whatever happens you will need to be
very strong through this period and ask for much support from people who are
around you and who are sympathetic. I hope this helps.
Chuck Krugman, MSW Paralegal
1237 P Street
Fresno ca 93721
559-266-9237

-----Original Message-----
From: Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 8:26 PM
To: 'Bryan Schulz' ; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
DeanandProfessors

Wow!

-----Original Message-----
From: Bryan Schulz [mailto:b.schulz at sbcglobal.net]
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:05 PM
To: Anita Keith-Foust; Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
andProfessors

hi,

Your question is not limited to law.
In Missouri, the supervisor of a district rehabilitation office forced one
adaptive computing contractor out of business and forced another contractor
to return to Florida when clients were assigned to her favored contractor
that was twice as expensive and doesn't even reside in Missouri.
The result was loss of income and the first contractor is now seeking other
computer related employment.
Bryan Schulz

----- Original Message -----
From: "Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
To: <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 5:30 PM
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
andProfessors


> Happy Holidays Everyone!
>
>
>
> I have recently come across information that a particular law school's 
> dean and other faculty members secretly conspired to "encourage" a 
> visually impaired student not to complete law school. They actually 
> put the conspiracy in writing among themselves via email!
>
>
>
> They do not come straight out to the visually impaired student and say 
> that they are going to violate the Americans with Disability Act. Nor 
> do they say they will intentionally ignore the agreed upon 
> accommodations. The tactics they used include making it difficult by 
> refusing to put the documents in the right format, not giving the 
> documents (PowerPoints, etc.) in a timely fashion, and generally 
> refusing to follow the accommodations agreed upon.
> By
> the time the visually impaired student documents and files complaints, 
> they are behind in class. That is part of the plan to convince the 
> student that law school is not for them.
>
>
>
> Have you encountered this problem? If so, how did you deal with it?
>
>
>
> I also would like to know about the experiences of visually impaired 
> and blind students who successfully completed law school. For example, 
> did the professors follow the agreed upon accommodations? Where your 
> classes stationary, i.e., in the same classroom all day?
>
>
>
> I would like to know how blind and low vision law students cope with 
> the first year of law school when sabotage is  the plan of the deans 
> and professors.
>
>
>
> What have your experiences been like?
>
>
>
> Thank you.
>
>
>
> Anita Keith-Foust
>
> 919-430-1978
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/b.schulz%40sbcgl
> obal.net



_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/ckrugman%40sbcglobal.n
et


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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40icloud.com


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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/ckrugman%40sbcglobal.n
et 


_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
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l.com



From cjdavis9193 at gmail.com  Fri Dec 26 00:26:21 2014
From: cjdavis9193 at gmail.com (Cody J. Davis)
Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2014 19:26:21 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
	DeanandProfessors
In-Reply-To: <002701d02098$ae08bb30$0a1a3190$@gmail.com>
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
	<54858DFC50B64787927B6EE1C87ED563@HP8730notebook>
	<000001d01ffa$f14aa370$d3dfea50$@gmail.com>
	<EF4CA8A70610465C9B287272EC532464@Spike>
	<000601d02086$360750e0$a215f2a0$@icloud.com>
	<002701d02098$ae08bb30$0a1a3190$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <FFEE6C46-231D-4526-B0FA-650048A8878C@gmail.com>

Anita, 

I apologize if my suggestions seem a bit off topic, but I've only caught pieces of the conversation. 

I'm a 1L student in Raleigh, NC. I'm quite surprised that NCCU is causing such problems. I'd like to think this is a rare occurrance. It sound like the USDOE and USDOJ should be informed. 

If like to let you know that there is a lovely little law school in downtown Raleigh that is ranked and accredited.  I'm sure you've heard of it. They've been nothing short of excellent in working me and my fellow VI classmate. As a matter of fact, the reference librarian who is working with me one on one to learn how to access legal research tools is the one who showed me this list serve. All faculty have been wonderful and so incredibly willing to work with me. 

I'd be glad to help you out in any way as you begin applying to law school. I'd be happy to tell you more about Campbell Law as well. 

Feel free to email/call me. 

Cody J. Davis
cjdavis9193 at gmail.com
336.823.0283

Sent from my iPhone

> On Dec 25, 2014, at 6:15 PM, Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Dear Michal:
> 
> Those are excellent questions.
> 
> The school that is the topic of my inquiry is a historically African
> American university, North Carolina Central University (NCCU). It is not top
> ranked like Yale, Harvard, or Duke.
> 
> The fact that it is a historically African American university would make me
> think that the faculty would be sensitive enough to not discriminate and
> follow the law. 
> 
> As I think about the dilemma that we all face as blind and visually impaired
> students, we probably need to start a database of substantiated instances of
> discrimination at all colleges and universities. There is more than one
> instance of visually challenged students not being accommodated at NCCU.
> Right now, I feel like I am extremely vulnerable to saboteurs because I am
> not informed as to which schools have a substantiated history of
> discriminating against visually challenged students.
> 
> I am to the point that, although I am preparing for the LSAT, I am
> considering Concord Law School. Concord is an online law school. The reason
> that I am considering this school, although it is not ABA approved, is that
> I can work from the comfort of my home with the proper software and
> equipment. This means that I will be accommodated. Also, they do have a
> department that deals with accessibility issues. I have already submitted my
> documentation for accommodations, extended time and etc., and they have
> agreed to these accommodations.  I only need to take their entrance exam.
> Since I preparing for the June LSAT, I will take their entrance exam after
> June. One concern that I have about Concord is, I can only sit for the
> California Bar.
> 
> Concord does have a link that shows one of their graduates, who passed the
> California Bar, challenging the bar in the state he lives in to sit for that
> bar. He won his case and was able to sit for his state's bar.
> 
> At any rate, I am eager to hear answers to your questions.
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> Anita Keith-Foust
> 919-430-1978
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michal
> Nowicki via blindlaw
> Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2014 4:03 PM
> To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
> DeanandProfessors
> 
> Dear Mr.  Krugman and anyone else who has answers to my questions,
> 
> I sincerely apologize for sending out this e-mail on Christmas Day, when
> everyone wants to spend time with family and get away from the hustle and
> bustle of everyday life.  The potential gravity of this issue, however, has
> compelled me to waste no time.
> 
> Mr.  Krugman, could you be more specific about some of the ways in which
> graduate schools try to "mold" certain students into specific roles while
> "weeding out" others?  For instance, do they force students to take certain
> classes, and if so, what methods do they employ to achieve their objectives?
> 
> I would also like to know if anyone on this list is aware of any patterns
> that trigger/drive such behavior.  For example, does the rank of the
> program/school affect the likelihood that such incidents will occur?  If so,
> should we watch out more for top-ranked universities or lower-ranked once?
> What about public vs.  private schools?
> 
> Finally, please tell me how frequently blind graduate students encounter
> such obstacles.  Are these problems considerably rare, or do they arise
> frequently enough that I should be legitimately concerned about them in
> choosing which law school to attend?
> 
> Thank you in advance for your responses, and once again, I apologize if I
> disrupted your holidays.
> 
> Cordially,
> 
> Michal Nowicki
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Charles
> Krugman via blindlaw
> Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 10:53 PM
> To: Blind Law Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
> DeanandProfessors
> 
> Anita, what seems to have happened to you is very unfortunate but it happens
> to students in all disciplines of advanced study. I went to college and
> graduate school at a time before the ADA and my success depended only on
> what I did or didn't do. In the sixties and seventies as a student I had to
> make sure that materials that I needed were readily available and if they
> weren't I had to make sure that readers were hired to record them or get
> them recorded by volunteers. Later when I made a career change about 15
> years ago and became a paralegal upon leaving the field of Social work when
> attending a community college I saw several students that were weeded out of
> the program in various ways. Law school especially does things to not only
> mold students in to certain roles but weeds out those who they feel might
> not make it in the profession. I have discussed with many sighted law
> students and lawyers the types of things that occurred in law school that
> could be considered to mold the individual in to a certain role. In some
> cases where I observed this taking place some of the people perhaps should
> for various reasons not have been in a particular academic program and
> others were the victims of harassment or discrimination.
> Not knowing the specific circumstances of what was done I can only say that
> now that you know what was being done you can only assess the facts of the
> situation as well as how this impacts your desire to continue to study law. 
> You may want to consider transferring to another law school and you may also
> want to consider the legal remedies that are open to you to address what was
> done to you. This is not an easy situation for someone to be in because if
> they use legal remedies that are open and continue to study in the
> particular school in question there could be additional difficulties that
> may occur as a result of taking action. Whatever happens you will need to be
> very strong through this period and ask for much support from people who are
> around you and who are sympathetic. I hope this helps.
> Chuck Krugman, MSW Paralegal
> 1237 P Street
> Fresno ca 93721
> 559-266-9237
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw
> Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 8:26 PM
> To: 'Bryan Schulz' ; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
> DeanandProfessors
> 
> Wow!
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bryan Schulz [mailto:b.schulz at sbcglobal.net]
> Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:05 PM
> To: Anita Keith-Foust; Blind Law Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
> andProfessors
> 
> hi,
> 
> Your question is not limited to law.
> In Missouri, the supervisor of a district rehabilitation office forced one
> adaptive computing contractor out of business and forced another contractor
> to return to Florida when clients were assigned to her favored contractor
> that was twice as expensive and doesn't even reside in Missouri.
> The result was loss of income and the first contractor is now seeking other
> computer related employment.
> Bryan Schulz
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
> To: <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 5:30 PM
> Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
> andProfessors
> 
> 
>> Happy Holidays Everyone!
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> I have recently come across information that a particular law school's 
>> dean and other faculty members secretly conspired to "encourage" a 
>> visually impaired student not to complete law school. They actually 
>> put the conspiracy in writing among themselves via email!
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> They do not come straight out to the visually impaired student and say 
>> that they are going to violate the Americans with Disability Act. Nor 
>> do they say they will intentionally ignore the agreed upon 
>> accommodations. The tactics they used include making it difficult by 
>> refusing to put the documents in the right format, not giving the 
>> documents (PowerPoints, etc.) in a timely fashion, and generally 
>> refusing to follow the accommodations agreed upon.
>> By
>> the time the visually impaired student documents and files complaints, 
>> they are behind in class. That is part of the plan to convince the 
>> student that law school is not for them.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Have you encountered this problem? If so, how did you deal with it?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> I also would like to know about the experiences of visually impaired 
>> and blind students who successfully completed law school. For example, 
>> did the professors follow the agreed upon accommodations? Where your 
>> classes stationary, i.e., in the same classroom all day?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> I would like to know how blind and low vision law students cope with 
>> the first year of law school when sabotage is  the plan of the deans 
>> and professors.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> What have your experiences been like?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Thank you.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Anita Keith-Foust
>> 
>> 919-430-1978
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> blindlaw mailing list
>> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> blindlaw:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/b.schulz%40sbcgl
>> obal.net
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/ckrugman%40sbcglobal.n
> et 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40icloud.com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/anitakeithfoust%40gmai
> l.com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/cjdavis9193%40gmail.com


From ckrugman at sbcglobal.net  Fri Dec 26 00:49:32 2014
From: ckrugman at sbcglobal.net (Charles Krugman)
Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2014 16:49:32 -0800
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student
	Sabotagedby	DeanandProfessors
In-Reply-To: <002701d02098$ae08bb30$0a1a3190$@gmail.com>
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com><54858DFC50B64787927B6EE1C87ED563@HP8730notebook><000001d01ffa$f14aa370$d3dfea50$@gmail.com><EF4CA8A70610465C9B287272EC532464@Spike><000601d02086$360750e0$a215f2a0$@icloud.com>
	<002701d02098$ae08bb30$0a1a3190$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <0DEF0ADC85FD4CA69FFDC6E60EAAF0BC@Spike>

Concord Law School has had other blind or visually impaired students 
involved with their program and other members of this list may be able to 
respond about specifics experiences that they have had. The    issue to 
consider with an on line degree is what you want to do with it upon 
completion. It is probably fine if you want to work independently but it may 
not be considered by many law firms when hiring. Another school here in 
California that is on line is N    northwestern California University School 
of law in Sacramento.Their web site is

www.nwculaw.com. In California law students who attend law schools that are 
not ABA or California accredited have to take an exam after completion of 
the first year that is known as the "baby bar." I know that for paralegals 
the job market is still flooded and those who have attended on line programs 
or the short term vocational programs have difficulty finding employment. 
Chuck Krugman, MSW Paralegal
1237 P Street
Fresno ca 93721
559-266-9237

-----Original Message----- 
From: Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2014 3:15 PM
To: 'Michal Nowicki' ; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotagedby 
DeanandProfessors

Dear Michal:

Those are excellent questions.

The school that is the topic of my inquiry is a historically African
American university, North Carolina Central University (NCCU). It is not top
ranked like Yale, Harvard, or Duke.

The fact that it is a historically African American university would make me
think that the faculty would be sensitive enough to not discriminate and
follow the law.

As I think about the dilemma that we all face as blind and visually impaired
students, we probably need to start a database of substantiated instances of
discrimination at all colleges and universities. There is more than one
instance of visually challenged students not being accommodated at NCCU.
Right now, I feel like I am extremely vulnerable to saboteurs because I am
not informed as to which schools have a substantiated history of
discriminating against visually challenged students.

I am to the point that, although I am preparing for the LSAT, I am
considering Concord Law School. Concord is an online law school. The reason
that I am considering this school, although it is not ABA approved, is that
I can work from the comfort of my home with the proper software and
equipment. This means that I will be accommodated. Also, they do have a
department that deals with accessibility issues. I have already submitted my
documentation for accommodations, extended time and etc., and they have
agreed to these accommodations.  I only need to take their entrance exam.
Since I preparing for the June LSAT, I will take their entrance exam after
June. One concern that I have about Concord is, I can only sit for the
California Bar.

Concord does have a link that shows one of their graduates, who passed the
California Bar, challenging the bar in the state he lives in to sit for that
bar. He won his case and was able to sit for his state's bar.

At any rate, I am eager to hear answers to your questions.

Sincerely,

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michal
Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2014 4:03 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
DeanandProfessors

Dear Mr.  Krugman and anyone else who has answers to my questions,

I sincerely apologize for sending out this e-mail on Christmas Day, when
everyone wants to spend time with family and get away from the hustle and
bustle of everyday life.  The potential gravity of this issue, however, has
compelled me to waste no time.

Mr.  Krugman, could you be more specific about some of the ways in which
graduate schools try to "mold" certain students into specific roles while
"weeding out" others?  For instance, do they force students to take certain
classes, and if so, what methods do they employ to achieve their objectives?

I would also like to know if anyone on this list is aware of any patterns
that trigger/drive such behavior.  For example, does the rank of the
program/school affect the likelihood that such incidents will occur?  If so,
should we watch out more for top-ranked universities or lower-ranked once?
What about public vs.  private schools?

Finally, please tell me how frequently blind graduate students encounter
such obstacles.  Are these problems considerably rare, or do they arise
frequently enough that I should be legitimately concerned about them in
choosing which law school to attend?

Thank you in advance for your responses, and once again, I apologize if I
disrupted your holidays.

Cordially,

Michal Nowicki

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Charles
Krugman via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 10:53 PM
To: Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
DeanandProfessors

Anita, what seems to have happened to you is very unfortunate but it happens
to students in all disciplines of advanced study. I went to college and
graduate school at a time before the ADA and my success depended only on
what I did or didn't do. In the sixties and seventies as a student I had to
make sure that materials that I needed were readily available and if they
weren't I had to make sure that readers were hired to record them or get
them recorded by volunteers. Later when I made a career change about 15
years ago and became a paralegal upon leaving the field of Social work when
attending a community college I saw several students that were weeded out of
the program in various ways. Law school especially does things to not only
mold students in to certain roles but weeds out those who they feel might
not make it in the profession. I have discussed with many sighted law
students and lawyers the types of things that occurred in law school that
could be considered to mold the individual in to a certain role. In some
cases where I observed this taking place some of the people perhaps should
for various reasons not have been in a particular academic program and
others were the victims of harassment or discrimination.
Not knowing the specific circumstances of what was done I can only say that
now that you know what was being done you can only assess the facts of the
situation as well as how this impacts your desire to continue to study law.
You may want to consider transferring to another law school and you may also
want to consider the legal remedies that are open to you to address what was
done to you. This is not an easy situation for someone to be in because if
they use legal remedies that are open and continue to study in the
particular school in question there could be additional difficulties that
may occur as a result of taking action. Whatever happens you will need to be
very strong through this period and ask for much support from people who are
around you and who are sympathetic. I hope this helps.
Chuck Krugman, MSW Paralegal
1237 P Street
Fresno ca 93721
559-266-9237

-----Original Message-----
From: Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 8:26 PM
To: 'Bryan Schulz' ; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
DeanandProfessors

Wow!

-----Original Message-----
From: Bryan Schulz [mailto:b.schulz at sbcglobal.net]
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:05 PM
To: Anita Keith-Foust; Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
andProfessors

hi,

Your question is not limited to law.
In Missouri, the supervisor of a district rehabilitation office forced one
adaptive computing contractor out of business and forced another contractor
to return to Florida when clients were assigned to her favored contractor
that was twice as expensive and doesn't even reside in Missouri.
The result was loss of income and the first contractor is now seeking other
computer related employment.
Bryan Schulz

----- Original Message -----
From: "Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
To: <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 5:30 PM
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
andProfessors


> Happy Holidays Everyone!
>
>
>
> I have recently come across information that a particular law school's
> dean and other faculty members secretly conspired to "encourage" a
> visually impaired student not to complete law school. They actually
> put the conspiracy in writing among themselves via email!
>
>
>
> They do not come straight out to the visually impaired student and say
> that they are going to violate the Americans with Disability Act. Nor
> do they say they will intentionally ignore the agreed upon
> accommodations. The tactics they used include making it difficult by
> refusing to put the documents in the right format, not giving the
> documents (PowerPoints, etc.) in a timely fashion, and generally
> refusing to follow the accommodations agreed upon.
> By
> the time the visually impaired student documents and files complaints,
> they are behind in class. That is part of the plan to convince the
> student that law school is not for them.
>
>
>
> Have you encountered this problem? If so, how did you deal with it?
>
>
>
> I also would like to know about the experiences of visually impaired
> and blind students who successfully completed law school. For example,
> did the professors follow the agreed upon accommodations? Where your
> classes stationary, i.e., in the same classroom all day?
>
>
>
> I would like to know how blind and low vision law students cope with
> the first year of law school when sabotage is  the plan of the deans
> and professors.
>
>
>
> What have your experiences been like?
>
>
>
> Thank you.
>
>
>
> Anita Keith-Foust
>
> 919-430-1978
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/b.schulz%40sbcgl
> obal.net



_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/ckrugman%40sbcglobal.n
et


_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40icloud.com


_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/anitakeithfoust%40gmai
l.com


_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/ckrugman%40sbcglobal.net 



From garysherwig at hotmail.com  Fri Dec 26 00:51:04 2014
From: garysherwig at hotmail.com (=?utf-8?B?Z2FyeXNoZXJ3aWdAaG90bWFpbC5jb20=?=)
Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2014 00:51:04 +0000
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student
	Sabotagedby	DeanandProfessors
Message-ID: <BLU436-SMTP46D8236A8620B342054FD8B7520@phx.gbl>







    too much folks it's Christmas Day
Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Smartphone



------ Original message------From: Charles Krugman via blindlawDate: Thu, Dec 25, 2014 6:33 PMTo: Blind Law Mailing List;Subject:Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotagedby	DeanandProfessors
Hi Mitchell,I don't have detailed statistics but perhaps others who have experiences with dealing with graduate or law schools can respond. In my experience based on what I've observed the process is more subtle and I don't think that it is of systemic proportions. In many instances it seems to occur where a faculty member or in cases where a dissertation is required that a review committee chair has biases or dislikes against a certain candidate. I would not be overly concerned but I think that the best way to potentially remedy a potential problem is for any student to take a proactive approach in dealing with how they solve problems that may arise. While accommodations may be provided by a law school as a result of Section 504 or the ADA be prepared to have a contingency plan if something falls through. Consider that eventually as an attorney especially if in private practice or working for a small firm that you might not have the degree of support services available to you to remediate assistance that you will need as a result of a disability. While other students in most cases be willing to be helpful don't abuse the offers of help by taking them for granted and expecting them to always be forthcoming. Law school as in many advanced degree programs is highly competitive and unfortunately there are some people that will carry this to an excess. I hope this helps.Chuck Krugman, MSW Paralegal1237 P StreetFresno ca 93721559-266-9237-----Original Message----- From: Michal Nowicki via blindlawSent: Thursday, December 25, 2014 1:03 PMTo: 'Blind Law Mailing List'Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotagedby DeanandProfessorsDear Mr.  Krugman and anyone else who has answers to my questions,I sincerely apologize for sending out this e-mail on Christmas Day, wheneveryone wants to spend time with family and get away from the hustle andbustle of everyday life.  The potential gravity of this issue, however, hascompelled me to waste no time.Mr.  Krugman, could you be more specific about some of the ways in whichgraduate schools try to "mold" certain students into specific roles while"weeding out" others?  For instance, do they force students to take certainclasses, and if so, what methods do they employ to achieve their objectives?I would also like to know if anyone on this list is aware of any patternsthat trigger/drive such behavior.  For example, does the rank of theprogram/school affect the likelihood that such incidents will occur?  If so,should we watch out more for top-ranked universities or lower-ranked once?What about public vs.  private schools?Finally, please tell me how frequently blind graduate students encountersuch obstacles.  Are these problems considerably rare, or do they arisefrequently enough that I should be legitimately concerned about them inchoosing which law school to attend?Thank you in advance for your responses, and once again, I apologize if Idisrupted your holidays.Cordially,Michal Nowicki-----Original Message-----From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of CharlesKrugman via blindlawSent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 10:53 PMTo: Blind Law Mailing ListSubject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged byDeanandProfessorsAnita, what seems to have happened to you is very unfortunate but it happensto students in all disciplines of advanced study. I went to college andgraduate school at a time before the ADA and my success depended only onwhat I did or didn't do. In the sixties and seventies as a student I had tomake sure that materials that I needed were readily available and if theyweren't I had to make sure that readers were hired to record them or getthem recorded by volunteers. Later when I made a career change about 15years ago and became a paralegal upon leaving the field of Social work whenattending a community college I saw several students that were weeded out ofthe program in various ways. Law school especially does things to not onlymold students in to certain roles but weeds out those who they feel mightnot make it in the profession. I have discussed with many sighted lawstudents and lawyers the types of things that occurred in law school thatcould be considered to mold the individual in to a certain role. In somecases where I observed this taking place some of the people perhaps shouldfor various reasons not have been in a particular academic program andothers were the victims of harassment or discrimination.Not knowing the specific circumstances of what was done I can only say thatnow that you know what was being done you can only assess the facts of thesituation as well as how this impacts your desire to continue to study law.You may want to consider transferring to another law school and you may alsowant to consider the legal remedies that are open to you to address what wasdone to you. This is not an easy situation for someone to be in because ifthey use legal remedies that are open and continue to study in theparticular school in question there could be additional difficulties thatmay occur as a result of taking action. Whatever happens you will need to bevery strong through this period and ask for much support from people who arearound you and who are sympathetic. I hope this helps.Chuck Krugman, MSW Paralegal1237 P StreetFresno ca 93721559-266-9237-----Original Message-----From: Anita Keith-Foust via blindlawSent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 8:26 PMTo: 'Bryan Schulz' ; 'Blind Law Mailing List'Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged byDeanandProfessorsWow!-----Original Message-----From: Bryan Schulz [mailto:b.schulz at sbcglobal.net]Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:05 PMTo: Anita Keith-Foust; Blind Law Mailing ListSubject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by DeanandProfessorshi,Your question is not limited to law.In Missouri, the supervisor of a district rehabilitation office forced oneadaptive computing contractor out of business and forced another contractorto return to Florida when clients were assigned to her favored contractorthat was twice as expensive and doesn't even reside in Missouri.The result was loss of income and the first contractor is now seeking othercomputer related employment.Bryan Schulz----- Original Message -----From: "Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw" To: Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 5:30 PMSubject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by DeanandProfessors> Happy Holidays Everyone!>>>> I have recently come across information that a particular law school's> dean and other faculty members secretly conspired to "encourage" a> visually impaired student not to complete law school. They actually> put the conspiracy in writing among themselves via email!>>>> They do not come straight out to the visually impaired student and say> that they are going to violate the Americans with Disability Act. Nor> do they say they will intentionally ignore the agreed upon> accommodations. The tactics they used include making it difficult by> refusing to put the documents in the right format, not giving the> documents (PowerPoints, etc.) in a timely fashion, and generally> refusing to follow the accommodations agreed upon.> By> the time the visually impaired student documents and files complaints,> they are behind in class. That is part of the plan to convince the> student that law school is not for them.>>>> Have you encountered this problem? If so, how did you deal with it?>>>> I also would like to know about the experiences of visually impaired> and blind students who successfully completed law school. For example,> did the professors follow the agreed upon accommodations? Where your> classes stationary, i.e., in the same classroom all day?>>>> I would like to know how blind and low vision law students cope with> the first year of law school when sabotage is  the plan of the deans> and professors.>>>> What have your experiences been like?>>>> Thank you.>>>> Anita Keith-Foust>> 919-430-1978>>>> _______________________________________________> blindlaw mailing list> blindlaw at nfbnet.org> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for> blindlaw:> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/b.schulz%40sbcgl> obal.net_______________________________________________blindlaw mailing listblindlaw at nfbnet.orghttp://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.orgTo unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info forblindlaw:http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/ckrugman%40sbcglobal.net_______________________________________________blindlaw mailing listblindlaw at nfbnet.orghttp://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.orgTo unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info forblindlaw:http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40icloud.com_______________________________________________blindlaw mailing listblindlaw at nfbnet.orghttp://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.orgTo unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for blindlaw:http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/ckrugman%40sbcglobal.net _______________________________________________blindlaw mailing listblindlaw at nfbnet.orghttp://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.orgTo unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for blindlaw:http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/garysherwig%40hotmail.com


From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Fri Dec 26 00:51:45 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2014 19:51:45 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
	DeanandProfessors
In-Reply-To: <FFEE6C46-231D-4526-B0FA-650048A8878C@gmail.com>
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
	<54858DFC50B64787927B6EE1C87ED563@HP8730notebook>
	<000001d01ffa$f14aa370$d3dfea50$@gmail.com>
	<EF4CA8A70610465C9B287272EC532464@Spike>
	<000601d02086$360750e0$a215f2a0$@icloud.com>
	<002701d02098$ae08bb30$0a1a3190$@gmail.com>
	<FFEE6C46-231D-4526-B0FA-650048A8878C@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <005301d020a6$20370100$60a50300$@gmail.com>

Dear Cody:

I definitely will take you up on your offer.

I want to be sure that everyone knows that this is not the only occurrence.
I have substantiated that another visually impaired student filed an OCR
complaint against NCCU for refusing to accommodate. As the investigation
goes further, more information is coming forth.

I look forward to getting more information from you about Campbell. It
sounds great.

Thank you

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: Cody J. Davis [mailto:cjdavis9193 at gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2014 7:26 PM
To: Anita Keith-Foust; Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
DeanandProfessors

Anita, 

I apologize if my suggestions seem a bit off topic, but I've only caught
pieces of the conversation. 

I'm a 1L student in Raleigh, NC. I'm quite surprised that NCCU is causing
such problems. I'd like to think this is a rare occurrance. It sound like
the USDOE and USDOJ should be informed. 

If like to let you know that there is a lovely little law school in downtown
Raleigh that is ranked and accredited.  I'm sure you've heard of it. They've
been nothing short of excellent in working me and my fellow VI classmate. As
a matter of fact, the reference librarian who is working with me one on one
to learn how to access legal research tools is the one who showed me this
list serve. All faculty have been wonderful and so incredibly willing to
work with me. 

I'd be glad to help you out in any way as you begin applying to law school.
I'd be happy to tell you more about Campbell Law as well. 

Feel free to email/call me. 

Cody J. Davis
cjdavis9193 at gmail.com
336.823.0283

Sent from my iPhone

> On Dec 25, 2014, at 6:15 PM, Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw
<blindlaw at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Dear Michal:
> 
> Those are excellent questions.
> 
> The school that is the topic of my inquiry is a historically African 
> American university, North Carolina Central University (NCCU). It is 
> not top ranked like Yale, Harvard, or Duke.
> 
> The fact that it is a historically African American university would 
> make me think that the faculty would be sensitive enough to not 
> discriminate and follow the law.
> 
> As I think about the dilemma that we all face as blind and visually 
> impaired students, we probably need to start a database of 
> substantiated instances of discrimination at all colleges and 
> universities. There is more than one instance of visually challenged
students not being accommodated at NCCU.
> Right now, I feel like I am extremely vulnerable to saboteurs because 
> I am not informed as to which schools have a substantiated history of 
> discriminating against visually challenged students.
> 
> I am to the point that, although I am preparing for the LSAT, I am 
> considering Concord Law School. Concord is an online law school. The 
> reason that I am considering this school, although it is not ABA 
> approved, is that I can work from the comfort of my home with the 
> proper software and equipment. This means that I will be accommodated. 
> Also, they do have a department that deals with accessibility issues. 
> I have already submitted my documentation for accommodations, extended 
> time and etc., and they have agreed to these accommodations.  I only need
to take their entrance exam.
> Since I preparing for the June LSAT, I will take their entrance exam 
> after June. One concern that I have about Concord is, I can only sit 
> for the California Bar.
> 
> Concord does have a link that shows one of their graduates, who passed 
> the California Bar, challenging the bar in the state he lives in to 
> sit for that bar. He won his case and was able to sit for his state's bar.
> 
> At any rate, I am eager to hear answers to your questions.
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> Anita Keith-Foust
> 919-430-1978
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of 
> Michal Nowicki via blindlaw
> Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2014 4:03 PM
> To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by 
> DeanandProfessors
> 
> Dear Mr.  Krugman and anyone else who has answers to my questions,
> 
> I sincerely apologize for sending out this e-mail on Christmas Day, 
> when everyone wants to spend time with family and get away from the 
> hustle and bustle of everyday life.  The potential gravity of this 
> issue, however, has compelled me to waste no time.
> 
> Mr.  Krugman, could you be more specific about some of the ways in 
> which graduate schools try to "mold" certain students into specific 
> roles while "weeding out" others?  For instance, do they force 
> students to take certain classes, and if so, what methods do they employ
to achieve their objectives?
> 
> I would also like to know if anyone on this list is aware of any 
> patterns that trigger/drive such behavior.  For example, does the rank 
> of the program/school affect the likelihood that such incidents will 
> occur?  If so, should we watch out more for top-ranked universities or
lower-ranked once?
> What about public vs.  private schools?
> 
> Finally, please tell me how frequently blind graduate students 
> encounter such obstacles.  Are these problems considerably rare, or do 
> they arise frequently enough that I should be legitimately concerned 
> about them in choosing which law school to attend?
> 
> Thank you in advance for your responses, and once again, I apologize 
> if I disrupted your holidays.
> 
> Cordially,
> 
> Michal Nowicki
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of 
> Charles Krugman via blindlaw
> Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 10:53 PM
> To: Blind Law Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by 
> DeanandProfessors
> 
> Anita, what seems to have happened to you is very unfortunate but it 
> happens to students in all disciplines of advanced study. I went to 
> college and graduate school at a time before the ADA and my success 
> depended only on what I did or didn't do. In the sixties and seventies 
> as a student I had to make sure that materials that I needed were 
> readily available and if they weren't I had to make sure that readers 
> were hired to record them or get them recorded by volunteers. Later 
> when I made a career change about 15 years ago and became a paralegal 
> upon leaving the field of Social work when attending a community 
> college I saw several students that were weeded out of the program in 
> various ways. Law school especially does things to not only mold 
> students in to certain roles but weeds out those who they feel might 
> not make it in the profession. I have discussed with many sighted law 
> students and lawyers the types of things that occurred in law school 
> that could be considered to mold the individual in to a certain role. 
> In some cases where I observed this taking place some of the people 
> perhaps should for various reasons not have been in a particular academic
program and others were the victims of harassment or discrimination.
> Not knowing the specific circumstances of what was done I can only say 
> that now that you know what was being done you can only assess the 
> facts of the situation as well as how this impacts your desire to continue
to study law.
> You may want to consider transferring to another law school and you 
> may also want to consider the legal remedies that are open to you to 
> address what was done to you. This is not an easy situation for 
> someone to be in because if they use legal remedies that are open and 
> continue to study in the particular school in question there could be 
> additional difficulties that may occur as a result of taking action. 
> Whatever happens you will need to be very strong through this period 
> and ask for much support from people who are around you and who are
sympathetic. I hope this helps.
> Chuck Krugman, MSW Paralegal
> 1237 P Street
> Fresno ca 93721
> 559-266-9237
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw
> Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 8:26 PM
> To: 'Bryan Schulz' ; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by 
> DeanandProfessors
> 
> Wow!
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bryan Schulz [mailto:b.schulz at sbcglobal.net]
> Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:05 PM
> To: Anita Keith-Foust; Blind Law Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean 
> andProfessors
> 
> hi,
> 
> Your question is not limited to law.
> In Missouri, the supervisor of a district rehabilitation office forced 
> one adaptive computing contractor out of business and forced another 
> contractor to return to Florida when clients were assigned to her 
> favored contractor that was twice as expensive and doesn't even reside in
Missouri.
> The result was loss of income and the first contractor is now seeking 
> other computer related employment.
> Bryan Schulz
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
> To: <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 5:30 PM
> Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean 
> andProfessors
> 
> 
>> Happy Holidays Everyone!
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> I have recently come across information that a particular law 
>> school's dean and other faculty members secretly conspired to 
>> "encourage" a visually impaired student not to complete law school. 
>> They actually put the conspiracy in writing among themselves via email!
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> They do not come straight out to the visually impaired student and 
>> say that they are going to violate the Americans with Disability Act. 
>> Nor do they say they will intentionally ignore the agreed upon 
>> accommodations. The tactics they used include making it difficult by 
>> refusing to put the documents in the right format, not giving the 
>> documents (PowerPoints, etc.) in a timely fashion, and generally 
>> refusing to follow the accommodations agreed upon.
>> By
>> the time the visually impaired student documents and files 
>> complaints, they are behind in class. That is part of the plan to 
>> convince the student that law school is not for them.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Have you encountered this problem? If so, how did you deal with it?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> I also would like to know about the experiences of visually impaired 
>> and blind students who successfully completed law school. For 
>> example, did the professors follow the agreed upon accommodations? 
>> Where your classes stationary, i.e., in the same classroom all day?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> I would like to know how blind and low vision law students cope with 
>> the first year of law school when sabotage is  the plan of the deans 
>> and professors.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> What have your experiences been like?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Thank you.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Anita Keith-Foust
>> 
>> 919-430-1978
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> blindlaw mailing list
>> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> blindlaw:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/b.schulz%40sbcg
>> l
>> obal.net
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/ckrugman%40sbcgl
> obal.n
> et
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40iclo
> ud.com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/anitakeithfoust%
> 40gmai
> l.com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/cjdavis9193%40gm
> ail.com



From mnowicki4 at icloud.com  Fri Dec 26 00:58:35 2014
From: mnowicki4 at icloud.com (Michal Nowicki)
Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2014 18:58:35 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law
	Student	Sabotagedby	DeanandProfessors
In-Reply-To: <002f01d0209f$823c4060$86b4c120$@gmail.com>
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
	<54858DFC50B64787927B6EE1C87ED563@HP8730notebook>
	<000001d01ffa$f14aa370$d3dfea50$@gmail.com>
	<EF4CA8A70610465C9B287272EC532464@Spike>
	<000601d02086$360750e0$a215f2a0$@icloud.com>
	<94F0C77A2F5E49E8A4E86EC693D21E3B@Spike>
	<002f01d0209f$823c4060$86b4c120$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <000301d020a7$14625400$3d26fc00$@icloud.com>

Hi, Anita,

I fully support your idea of developing a database of schools that are known
for discriminating not just against the blind and visually impaired, but
against students with all types of disabilities.  I am particularly
sympathetic with this proposal because it is difficult to get a good idea of
a given school's attitude towards accommodating students with disabilities
before actually requesting accommodations from that school.  Of course, the
website of every university contains policies and information on ADA
accommodations, but these sources aren't completely objective.  After all,
schools want to attract students, so they often intentionally hide potential
flaws in their educational programs, such as their inability to provide
certain types of accommodations.

Because of the above-mentioned problems, I never rely exclusively on the
information posted on a school's disability office's website in evaluating
its services for students with disabilities.  Instead, I meet with a
disability specialist either in person or over the phone in order to discuss
the specific accommodations I need and to ask basic, but important
questions, such as:
1.  How many people work for your office?  This gives me an idea of the
office's resources, which in turn allows me to estimate how long it may take
to obtain accessible materials, regardless of what I'm actually told.  The
more people, the better the services because the work is divided into
document conversion, assistive technology, setting up accommodations,
proctoring exams, sign language interpreting for the deaf, etc.
2.  How many blind students have you served?  This question gives me a sense
of the office's experience serving visually challenged students.
3.  Do you offer exam proctoring?

Anyway, as Mr.  Krugman pointed out, issues like the one you brought up
yesterday are fortunately far from the norm.  Therefore, I don't advise you
to enroll at an online law school that is not approved by the ABA just
because you know that you will be properly accommodated at such an
institution, unless you are absolutely sure that you want to practice law in
the state in which you will be eligible to sit for the Bar exam upon
graduation (in the case of Concord, California).  Even if you are sure when
you apply, though, you may change your mind in your second or third year,
but at that point, it will be too late.  Consequently, I strongly suggest
that you apply to ABA approved law schools.

Finally, I have observed that public universities often provide superior
accommodations to those offered at private schools.  Perhaps this is because
as state institutions, they are monitored more closely and because they have
a better understanding of the unique needs of students with disabilities.

I hope this helps.

Michal

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anita
Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2014 6:04 PM
To: 'Charles Krugman'; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotagedby
DeanandProfessors

Dear Michal:

I guess I am looking at this from the perspective of sabotage by the dean
and professors.

There is no contingency plan that you can have with the tactics that I have
been informed about.

If it is substantiated that the dean and professors at a particular law
school have conspired to not accommodate and decide to discourage blind and
visually impaired students to choose another path BEFORE they even come to
class, the only contingency plan is to go to another law school until the
U.S. Department of Justice and other agencies penalize and monitor them.
This takes time for many reasons.

I think having a database of undergraduate, graduate, and law schools who
have substantiated instances of discrimination against visually challenged
students will be a great contingency plan.

I hope that the database becomes a reality. I am willing to do my part and
surely will use it.

Sincerely,

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Charles
Krugman via blindlaw
Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2014 6:33 PM
To: Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotagedby
DeanandProfessors

Hi Mitchell,
I don't have detailed statistics but perhaps others who have experiences
with dealing with graduate or law schools can respond. In my experience
based on what I've observed the process is more subtle and I don't think
that it is of systemic proportions. In many instances it seems to occur
where a faculty member or in cases where a dissertation is required that a
review committee chair has biases or dislikes against a certain candidate. I
would not be overly concerned but I think that the best way to potentially
remedy a potential problem is for any student to take a proactive approach
in dealing with how they solve problems that may arise. While accommodations
may be provided by a law school as a result of Section 504 or the ADA be
prepared to have a contingency plan if something falls through. Consider
that eventually as an attorney especially if in private practice or working
for a small firm that you might not have the degree of support services
available to you to remediate assistance that you will need as a result of a
disability. While other students in most cases be willing to be helpful
don't abuse the offers of help by taking them for granted and expecting them
to always be forthcoming. Law school as in many advanced degree programs is
highly competitive and unfortunately there are some people that will carry
this to an excess. I hope this helps.
Chuck Krugman, MSW Paralegal
1237 P Street
Fresno ca 93721
559-266-9237

-----Original Message-----
From: Michal Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2014 1:03 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotagedby
DeanandProfessors

Dear Mr.  Krugman and anyone else who has answers to my questions,

I sincerely apologize for sending out this e-mail on Christmas Day, when
everyone wants to spend time with family and get away from the hustle and
bustle of everyday life.  The potential gravity of this issue, however, has
compelled me to waste no time.

Mr.  Krugman, could you be more specific about some of the ways in which
graduate schools try to "mold" certain students into specific roles while
"weeding out" others?  For instance, do they force students to take certain
classes, and if so, what methods do they employ to achieve their objectives?

I would also like to know if anyone on this list is aware of any patterns
that trigger/drive such behavior.  For example, does the rank of the
program/school affect the likelihood that such incidents will occur?  If so,
should we watch out more for top-ranked universities or lower-ranked once?
What about public vs.  private schools?

Finally, please tell me how frequently blind graduate students encounter
such obstacles.  Are these problems considerably rare, or do they arise
frequently enough that I should be legitimately concerned about them in
choosing which law school to attend?

Thank you in advance for your responses, and once again, I apologize if I
disrupted your holidays.

Cordially,

Michal Nowicki

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Charles
Krugman via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 10:53 PM
To: Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
DeanandProfessors

Anita, what seems to have happened to you is very unfortunate but it happens
to students in all disciplines of advanced study. I went to college and
graduate school at a time before the ADA and my success depended only on
what I did or didn't do. In the sixties and seventies as a student I had to
make sure that materials that I needed were readily available and if they
weren't I had to make sure that readers were hired to record them or get
them recorded by volunteers. Later when I made a career change about 15
years ago and became a paralegal upon leaving the field of Social work when
attending a community college I saw several students that were weeded out of
the program in various ways. Law school especially does things to not only
mold students in to certain roles but weeds out those who they feel might
not make it in the profession. I have discussed with many sighted law
students and lawyers the types of things that occurred in law school that
could be considered to mold the individual in to a certain role. In some
cases where I observed this taking place some of the people perhaps should
for various reasons not have been in a particular academic program and
others were the victims of harassment or discrimination.
Not knowing the specific circumstances of what was done I can only say that
now that you know what was being done you can only assess the facts of the
situation as well as how this impacts your desire to continue to study law.
You may want to consider transferring to another law school and you may also
want to consider the legal remedies that are open to you to address what was
done to you. This is not an easy situation for someone to be in because if
they use legal remedies that are open and continue to study in the
particular school in question there could be additional difficulties that
may occur as a result of taking action. Whatever happens you will need to be
very strong through this period and ask for much support from people who are
around you and who are sympathetic. I hope this helps.
Chuck Krugman, MSW Paralegal
1237 P Street
Fresno ca 93721
559-266-9237

-----Original Message-----
From: Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 8:26 PM
To: 'Bryan Schulz' ; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
DeanandProfessors

Wow!

-----Original Message-----
From: Bryan Schulz [mailto:b.schulz at sbcglobal.net]
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:05 PM
To: Anita Keith-Foust; Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
andProfessors

hi,

Your question is not limited to law.
In Missouri, the supervisor of a district rehabilitation office forced one
adaptive computing contractor out of business and forced another contractor
to return to Florida when clients were assigned to her favored contractor
that was twice as expensive and doesn't even reside in Missouri.
The result was loss of income and the first contractor is now seeking other
computer related employment.
Bryan Schulz

----- Original Message -----
From: "Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
To: <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 5:30 PM
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
andProfessors


> Happy Holidays Everyone!
>
>
>
> I have recently come across information that a particular law school's 
> dean and other faculty members secretly conspired to "encourage" a 
> visually impaired student not to complete law school. They actually 
> put the conspiracy in writing among themselves via email!
>
>
>
> They do not come straight out to the visually impaired student and say 
> that they are going to violate the Americans with Disability Act. Nor 
> do they say they will intentionally ignore the agreed upon 
> accommodations. The tactics they used include making it difficult by 
> refusing to put the documents in the right format, not giving the 
> documents (PowerPoints, etc.) in a timely fashion, and generally 
> refusing to follow the accommodations agreed upon.
> By
> the time the visually impaired student documents and files complaints, 
> they are behind in class. That is part of the plan to convince the 
> student that law school is not for them.
>
>
>
> Have you encountered this problem? If so, how did you deal with it?
>
>
>
> I also would like to know about the experiences of visually impaired 
> and blind students who successfully completed law school. For example, 
> did the professors follow the agreed upon accommodations? Where your 
> classes stationary, i.e., in the same classroom all day?
>
>
>
> I would like to know how blind and low vision law students cope with 
> the first year of law school when sabotage is  the plan of the deans 
> and professors.
>
>
>
> What have your experiences been like?
>
>
>
> Thank you.
>
>
>
> Anita Keith-Foust
>
> 919-430-1978
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/b.schulz%40sbcgl
> obal.net



_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/ckrugman%40sbcglobal.n
et


_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40icloud.com


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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/ckrugman%40sbcglobal.n
et 


_______________________________________________
blindlaw mailing list
blindlaw at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/anitakeithfoust%40gmai
l.com


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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
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From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Fri Dec 26 01:18:50 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2014 20:18:50 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law
	Student	Sabotagedby	DeanandProfessors
In-Reply-To: <000301d020a7$14625400$3d26fc00$@icloud.com>
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
	<54858DFC50B64787927B6EE1C87ED563@HP8730notebook>
	<000001d01ffa$f14aa370$d3dfea50$@gmail.com>
	<EF4CA8A70610465C9B287272EC532464@Spike>
	<000601d02086$360750e0$a215f2a0$@icloud.com>
	<94F0C77A2F5E49E8A4E86EC693D21E3B@Spike>
	<002f01d0209f$823c4060$86b4c120$@gmail.com>
	<000301d020a7$14625400$3d26fc00$@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <005501d020a9$e92f08c0$bb8d1a40$@gmail.com>

Dear Michal:

That is great advice and the questions are right on the spot! If it is okay,
I will start building the database in Excel for right now. Maybe there are
fancier database programs, but I think they all accept Excel files. I think
that the headers should contain the questions that you suggested, such as
the number of staff members in the student disability services office. 

NCCU is a public university and obviously, they are not monitored, yet.

I believe that Campbell University is private. I am going to research them.
What Cody stated in his email sounds great. The other student that filed the
OCR lives in Raleigh. I am going to pass the information about Campbell to
him too.

This kind of networking is really what I was looking for when I first went
blind. I want to thank all of you for this. 

Sincerely,

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michal
Nowicki via blindlaw
Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2014 7:59 PM
To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotagedby
DeanandProfessors





From cjdavis9193 at gmail.com  Fri Dec 26 01:30:01 2014
From: cjdavis9193 at gmail.com (Cody J. Davis)
Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2014 20:30:01 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student	Sabotagedby
	DeanandProfessors
In-Reply-To: <005501d020a9$e92f08c0$bb8d1a40$@gmail.com>
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
	<54858DFC50B64787927B6EE1C87ED563@HP8730notebook>
	<000001d01ffa$f14aa370$d3dfea50$@gmail.com>
	<EF4CA8A70610465C9B287272EC532464@Spike>
	<000601d02086$360750e0$a215f2a0$@icloud.com>
	<94F0C77A2F5E49E8A4E86EC693D21E3B@Spike>
	<002f01d0209f$823c4060$86b4c120$@gmail.com>
	<000301d020a7$14625400$3d26fc00$@icloud.com>
	<005501d020a9$e92f08c0$bb8d1a40$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <C9B5066F-1722-42B0-9C34-4B215BE4A8F7@gmail.com>

Anita, 

I really think there should be a field that reflects blind or visually impaired students past experiences with the institution, be a positive or negative. I think a schos history of accommodating is very important. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Dec 25, 2014, at 8:18 PM, Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Dear Michal:
> 
> That is great advice and the questions are right on the spot! If it is okay,
> I will start building the database in Excel for right now. Maybe there are
> fancier database programs, but I think they all accept Excel files. I think
> that the headers should contain the questions that you suggested, such as
> the number of staff members in the student disability services office. 
> 
> NCCU is a public university and obviously, they are not monitored, yet.
> 
> I believe that Campbell University is private. I am going to research them.
> What Cody stated in his email sounds great. The other student that filed the
> OCR lives in Raleigh. I am going to pass the information about Campbell to
> him too.
> 
> This kind of networking is really what I was looking for when I first went
> blind. I want to thank all of you for this. 
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> Anita Keith-Foust
> 919-430-1978
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michal
> Nowicki via blindlaw
> Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2014 7:59 PM
> To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotagedby
> DeanandProfessors
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/cjdavis9193%40gmail.com


From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Fri Dec 26 01:50:32 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2014 20:50:32 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student	Sabotagedby
	DeanandProfessors
In-Reply-To: <C9B5066F-1722-42B0-9C34-4B215BE4A8F7@gmail.com>
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
	<54858DFC50B64787927B6EE1C87ED563@HP8730notebook>
	<000001d01ffa$f14aa370$d3dfea50$@gmail.com>
	<EF4CA8A70610465C9B287272EC532464@Spike>
	<000601d02086$360750e0$a215f2a0$@icloud.com>
	<94F0C77A2F5E49E8A4E86EC693D21E3B@Spike>
	<002f01d0209f$823c4060$86b4c120$@gmail.com>
	<000301d020a7$14625400$3d26fc00$@icloud.com>
	<005501d020a9$e92f08c0$bb8d1a40$@gmail.com>
	<C9B5066F-1722-42B0-9C34-4B215BE4A8F7@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <005b01d020ae$567dd5b0$03798110$@gmail.com>

Dear Cody:

I agree and will include all as headers.

I have done a little bit of brain storming and think that the Freedom of
Information Act (FOI) will be a good source to substantiate the history of
OCR filings against the schools. According to what I have read, the OCR will
provide the information while keeping the students' identity protected. Of
course, anyone who wants to come forward with their opinion is great too. I
just want to be able to document so that the database will be reliable.

Thank you.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: Cody J. Davis [mailto:cjdavis9193 at gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2014 8:30 PM
To: Anita Keith-Foust; Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotagedby
DeanandProfessors

Anita, 

I really think there should be a field that reflects blind or visually
impaired students past experiences with the institution, be a positive or
negative. I think a schos history of accommodating is very important. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Dec 25, 2014, at 8:18 PM, Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw
<blindlaw at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Dear Michal:
> 
> That is great advice and the questions are right on the spot! If it is 
> okay, I will start building the database in Excel for right now. Maybe 
> there are fancier database programs, but I think they all accept Excel 
> files. I think that the headers should contain the questions that you 
> suggested, such as the number of staff members in the student disability
services office.
> 
> NCCU is a public university and obviously, they are not monitored, yet.
> 
> I believe that Campbell University is private. I am going to research
them.
> What Cody stated in his email sounds great. The other student that 
> filed the OCR lives in Raleigh. I am going to pass the information 
> about Campbell to him too.
> 
> This kind of networking is really what I was looking for when I first 
> went blind. I want to thank all of you for this.
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> Anita Keith-Foust
> 919-430-1978
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of 
> Michal Nowicki via blindlaw
> Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2014 7:59 PM
> To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotagedby 
> DeanandProfessors
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/cjdavis9193%40gm
> ail.com



From angie.matney at gmail.com  Fri Dec 26 04:02:02 2014
From: angie.matney at gmail.com (Angie Matney)
Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2014 23:02:02 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
	DeanandProfessors
In-Reply-To: <002701d02098$ae08bb30$0a1a3190$@gmail.com>
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
	<54858DFC50B64787927B6EE1C87ED563@HP8730notebook>
	<000001d01ffa$f14aa370$d3dfea50$@gmail.com>
	<EF4CA8A70610465C9B287272EC532464@Spike>
	<000601d02086$360750e0$a215f2a0$@icloud.com>
	<002701d02098$ae08bb30$0a1a3190$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7E216DD4-CFC7-4345-A41C-D4A51D555044@gmail.com>

Anita:

I can't speak to how common incidents like this are, but I would strongly urge you to reconsider letting this instance of discrimination lead you to choose to attend a non-ABA accredited school. The reality is that the school you attend will impact your job prospects, and as a member of a group with a 70% unemployment rate, it is important to do all that you can do to maximize your employability. Even if you pass the bar, employers may eliminate you from consideration based on your school. I know of firms that do not consider students from some ABA-accredited schools. Of course, you may not wish to work in a firm, and every situation is different. But ultimately, as a blind person, you may wish to consider attending the highest-ranked school you possibly can.

Best of luck to you and to the other student.

Angie



Sent from my iPhone

> On Dec 25, 2014, at 6:15 PM, Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw <blindlaw at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Dear Michal:
> 
> Those are excellent questions.
> 
> The school that is the topic of my inquiry is a historically African
> American university, North Carolina Central University (NCCU). It is not top
> ranked like Yale, Harvard, or Duke.
> 
> The fact that it is a historically African American university would make me
> think that the faculty would be sensitive enough to not discriminate and
> follow the law. 
> 
> As I think about the dilemma that we all face as blind and visually impaired
> students, we probably need to start a database of substantiated instances of
> discrimination at all colleges and universities. There is more than one
> instance of visually challenged students not being accommodated at NCCU.
> Right now, I feel like I am extremely vulnerable to saboteurs because I am
> not informed as to which schools have a substantiated history of
> discriminating against visually challenged students.
> 
> I am to the point that, although I am preparing for the LSAT, I am
> considering Concord Law School. Concord is an online law school. The reason
> that I am considering this school, although it is not ABA approved, is that
> I can work from the comfort of my home with the proper software and
> equipment. This means that I will be accommodated. Also, they do have a
> department that deals with accessibility issues. I have already submitted my
> documentation for accommodations, extended time and etc., and they have
> agreed to these accommodations.  I only need to take their entrance exam.
> Since I preparing for the June LSAT, I will take their entrance exam after
> June. One concern that I have about Concord is, I can only sit for the
> California Bar.
> 
> Concord does have a link that shows one of their graduates, who passed the
> California Bar, challenging the bar in the state he lives in to sit for that
> bar. He won his case and was able to sit for his state's bar.
> 
> At any rate, I am eager to hear answers to your questions.
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> Anita Keith-Foust
> 919-430-1978
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michal
> Nowicki via blindlaw
> Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2014 4:03 PM
> To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
> DeanandProfessors
> 
> Dear Mr.  Krugman and anyone else who has answers to my questions,
> 
> I sincerely apologize for sending out this e-mail on Christmas Day, when
> everyone wants to spend time with family and get away from the hustle and
> bustle of everyday life.  The potential gravity of this issue, however, has
> compelled me to waste no time.
> 
> Mr.  Krugman, could you be more specific about some of the ways in which
> graduate schools try to "mold" certain students into specific roles while
> "weeding out" others?  For instance, do they force students to take certain
> classes, and if so, what methods do they employ to achieve their objectives?
> 
> I would also like to know if anyone on this list is aware of any patterns
> that trigger/drive such behavior.  For example, does the rank of the
> program/school affect the likelihood that such incidents will occur?  If so,
> should we watch out more for top-ranked universities or lower-ranked once?
> What about public vs.  private schools?
> 
> Finally, please tell me how frequently blind graduate students encounter
> such obstacles.  Are these problems considerably rare, or do they arise
> frequently enough that I should be legitimately concerned about them in
> choosing which law school to attend?
> 
> Thank you in advance for your responses, and once again, I apologize if I
> disrupted your holidays.
> 
> Cordially,
> 
> Michal Nowicki
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Charles
> Krugman via blindlaw
> Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 10:53 PM
> To: Blind Law Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
> DeanandProfessors
> 
> Anita, what seems to have happened to you is very unfortunate but it happens
> to students in all disciplines of advanced study. I went to college and
> graduate school at a time before the ADA and my success depended only on
> what I did or didn't do. In the sixties and seventies as a student I had to
> make sure that materials that I needed were readily available and if they
> weren't I had to make sure that readers were hired to record them or get
> them recorded by volunteers. Later when I made a career change about 15
> years ago and became a paralegal upon leaving the field of Social work when
> attending a community college I saw several students that were weeded out of
> the program in various ways. Law school especially does things to not only
> mold students in to certain roles but weeds out those who they feel might
> not make it in the profession. I have discussed with many sighted law
> students and lawyers the types of things that occurred in law school that
> could be considered to mold the individual in to a certain role. In some
> cases where I observed this taking place some of the people perhaps should
> for various reasons not have been in a particular academic program and
> others were the victims of harassment or discrimination.
> Not knowing the specific circumstances of what was done I can only say that
> now that you know what was being done you can only assess the facts of the
> situation as well as how this impacts your desire to continue to study law. 
> You may want to consider transferring to another law school and you may also
> want to consider the legal remedies that are open to you to address what was
> done to you. This is not an easy situation for someone to be in because if
> they use legal remedies that are open and continue to study in the
> particular school in question there could be additional difficulties that
> may occur as a result of taking action. Whatever happens you will need to be
> very strong through this period and ask for much support from people who are
> around you and who are sympathetic. I hope this helps.
> Chuck Krugman, MSW Paralegal
> 1237 P Street
> Fresno ca 93721
> 559-266-9237
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw
> Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 8:26 PM
> To: 'Bryan Schulz' ; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
> DeanandProfessors
> 
> Wow!
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bryan Schulz [mailto:b.schulz at sbcglobal.net]
> Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:05 PM
> To: Anita Keith-Foust; Blind Law Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
> andProfessors
> 
> hi,
> 
> Your question is not limited to law.
> In Missouri, the supervisor of a district rehabilitation office forced one
> adaptive computing contractor out of business and forced another contractor
> to return to Florida when clients were assigned to her favored contractor
> that was twice as expensive and doesn't even reside in Missouri.
> The result was loss of income and the first contractor is now seeking other
> computer related employment.
> Bryan Schulz
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
> To: <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 5:30 PM
> Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean
> andProfessors
> 
> 
>> Happy Holidays Everyone!
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> I have recently come across information that a particular law school's 
>> dean and other faculty members secretly conspired to "encourage" a 
>> visually impaired student not to complete law school. They actually 
>> put the conspiracy in writing among themselves via email!
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> They do not come straight out to the visually impaired student and say 
>> that they are going to violate the Americans with Disability Act. Nor 
>> do they say they will intentionally ignore the agreed upon 
>> accommodations. The tactics they used include making it difficult by 
>> refusing to put the documents in the right format, not giving the 
>> documents (PowerPoints, etc.) in a timely fashion, and generally 
>> refusing to follow the accommodations agreed upon.
>> By
>> the time the visually impaired student documents and files complaints, 
>> they are behind in class. That is part of the plan to convince the 
>> student that law school is not for them.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Have you encountered this problem? If so, how did you deal with it?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> I also would like to know about the experiences of visually impaired 
>> and blind students who successfully completed law school. For example, 
>> did the professors follow the agreed upon accommodations? Where your 
>> classes stationary, i.e., in the same classroom all day?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> I would like to know how blind and low vision law students cope with 
>> the first year of law school when sabotage is  the plan of the deans 
>> and professors.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> What have your experiences been like?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Thank you.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Anita Keith-Foust
>> 
>> 919-430-1978
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> blindlaw mailing list
>> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> blindlaw:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/b.schulz%40sbcgl
>> obal.net
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/ckrugman%40sbcglobal.n
> et 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40icloud.com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/anitakeithfoust%40gmai
> l.com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/angie.matney%40gmail.com


From anitakeithfoust at gmail.com  Fri Dec 26 17:22:02 2014
From: anitakeithfoust at gmail.com (Anita Keith-Foust)
Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2014 12:22:02 -0500
Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
	DeanandProfessors
In-Reply-To: <7E216DD4-CFC7-4345-A41C-D4A51D555044@gmail.com>
References: <013c01d01fd1$8e943d50$abbcb7f0$@gmail.com>
	<54858DFC50B64787927B6EE1C87ED563@HP8730notebook>
	<000001d01ffa$f14aa370$d3dfea50$@gmail.com>
	<EF4CA8A70610465C9B287272EC532464@Spike>
	<000601d02086$360750e0$a215f2a0$@icloud.com>
	<002701d02098$ae08bb30$0a1a3190$@gmail.com>
	<7E216DD4-CFC7-4345-A41C-D4A51D555044@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <00a301d02130$777b23d0$66716b70$@gmail.com>

Thank you for the advice, Angie.

Anita Keith-Foust
919-430-1978

-----Original Message-----
From: Angie Matney [mailto:angie.matney at gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2014 11:02 PM
To: Anita Keith-Foust; Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by
DeanandProfessors

Anita:

I can't speak to how common incidents like this are, but I would strongly
urge you to reconsider letting this instance of discrimination lead you to
choose to attend a non-ABA accredited school. The reality is that the school
you attend will impact your job prospects, and as a member of a group with a
70% unemployment rate, it is important to do all that you can do to maximize
your employability. Even if you pass the bar, employers may eliminate you
from consideration based on your school. I know of firms that do not
consider students from some ABA-accredited schools. Of course, you may not
wish to work in a firm, and every situation is different. But ultimately, as
a blind person, you may wish to consider attending the highest-ranked school
you possibly can.

Best of luck to you and to the other student.

Angie



Sent from my iPhone

> On Dec 25, 2014, at 6:15 PM, Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw
<blindlaw at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Dear Michal:
> 
> Those are excellent questions.
> 
> The school that is the topic of my inquiry is a historically African 
> American university, North Carolina Central University (NCCU). It is 
> not top ranked like Yale, Harvard, or Duke.
> 
> The fact that it is a historically African American university would 
> make me think that the faculty would be sensitive enough to not 
> discriminate and follow the law.
> 
> As I think about the dilemma that we all face as blind and visually 
> impaired students, we probably need to start a database of 
> substantiated instances of discrimination at all colleges and 
> universities. There is more than one instance of visually challenged
students not being accommodated at NCCU.
> Right now, I feel like I am extremely vulnerable to saboteurs because 
> I am not informed as to which schools have a substantiated history of 
> discriminating against visually challenged students.
> 
> I am to the point that, although I am preparing for the LSAT, I am 
> considering Concord Law School. Concord is an online law school. The 
> reason that I am considering this school, although it is not ABA 
> approved, is that I can work from the comfort of my home with the 
> proper software and equipment. This means that I will be accommodated. 
> Also, they do have a department that deals with accessibility issues. 
> I have already submitted my documentation for accommodations, extended 
> time and etc., and they have agreed to these accommodations.  I only need
to take their entrance exam.
> Since I preparing for the June LSAT, I will take their entrance exam 
> after June. One concern that I have about Concord is, I can only sit 
> for the California Bar.
> 
> Concord does have a link that shows one of their graduates, who passed 
> the California Bar, challenging the bar in the state he lives in to 
> sit for that bar. He won his case and was able to sit for his state's bar.
> 
> At any rate, I am eager to hear answers to your questions.
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> Anita Keith-Foust
> 919-430-1978
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of 
> Michal Nowicki via blindlaw
> Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2014 4:03 PM
> To: 'Blind Law Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by 
> DeanandProfessors
> 
> Dear Mr.  Krugman and anyone else who has answers to my questions,
> 
> I sincerely apologize for sending out this e-mail on Christmas Day, 
> when everyone wants to spend time with family and get away from the 
> hustle and bustle of everyday life.  The potential gravity of this 
> issue, however, has compelled me to waste no time.
> 
> Mr.  Krugman, could you be more specific about some of the ways in 
> which graduate schools try to "mold" certain students into specific 
> roles while "weeding out" others?  For instance, do they force 
> students to take certain classes, and if so, what methods do they employ
to achieve their objectives?
> 
> I would also like to know if anyone on this list is aware of any 
> patterns that trigger/drive such behavior.  For example, does the rank 
> of the program/school affect the likelihood that such incidents will 
> occur?  If so, should we watch out more for top-ranked universities or
lower-ranked once?
> What about public vs.  private schools?
> 
> Finally, please tell me how frequently blind graduate students 
> encounter such obstacles.  Are these problems considerably rare, or do 
> they arise frequently enough that I should be legitimately concerned 
> about them in choosing which law school to attend?
> 
> Thank you in advance for your responses, and once again, I apologize 
> if I disrupted your holidays.
> 
> Cordially,
> 
> Michal Nowicki
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of 
> Charles Krugman via blindlaw
> Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 10:53 PM
> To: Blind Law Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by 
> DeanandProfessors
> 
> Anita, what seems to have happened to you is very unfortunate but it 
> happens to students in all disciplines of advanced study. I went to 
> college and graduate school at a time before the ADA and my success 
> depended only on what I did or didn't do. In the sixties and seventies 
> as a student I had to make sure that materials that I needed were 
> readily available and if they weren't I had to make sure that readers 
> were hired to record them or get them recorded by volunteers. Later 
> when I made a career change about 15 years ago and became a paralegal 
> upon leaving the field of Social work when attending a community 
> college I saw several students that were weeded out of the program in 
> various ways. Law school especially does things to not only mold 
> students in to certain roles but weeds out those who they feel might 
> not make it in the profession. I have discussed with many sighted law 
> students and lawyers the types of things that occurred in law school 
> that could be considered to mold the individual in to a certain role. 
> In some cases where I observed this taking place some of the people 
> perhaps should for various reasons not have been in a particular academic
program and others were the victims of harassment or discrimination.
> Not knowing the specific circumstances of what was done I can only say 
> that now that you know what was being done you can only assess the 
> facts of the situation as well as how this impacts your desire to continue
to study law.
> You may want to consider transferring to another law school and you 
> may also want to consider the legal remedies that are open to you to 
> address what was done to you. This is not an easy situation for 
> someone to be in because if they use legal remedies that are open and 
> continue to study in the particular school in question there could be 
> additional difficulties that may occur as a result of taking action. 
> Whatever happens you will need to be very strong through this period 
> and ask for much support from people who are around you and who are
sympathetic. I hope this helps.
> Chuck Krugman, MSW Paralegal
> 1237 P Street
> Fresno ca 93721
> 559-266-9237
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw
> Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 8:26 PM
> To: 'Bryan Schulz' ; 'Blind Law Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by 
> DeanandProfessors
> 
> Wow!
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bryan Schulz [mailto:b.schulz at sbcglobal.net]
> Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:05 PM
> To: Anita Keith-Foust; Blind Law Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean 
> andProfessors
> 
> hi,
> 
> Your question is not limited to law.
> In Missouri, the supervisor of a district rehabilitation office forced 
> one adaptive computing contractor out of business and forced another 
> contractor to return to Florida when clients were assigned to her 
> favored contractor that was twice as expensive and doesn't even reside in
Missouri.
> The result was loss of income and the first contractor is now seeking 
> other computer related employment.
> Bryan Schulz
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Anita Keith-Foust via blindlaw" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
> To: <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 5:30 PM
> Subject: [blindlaw] How to Cope? - Law Student Sabotaged by Dean 
> andProfessors
> 
> 
>> Happy Holidays Everyone!
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> I have recently come across information that a particular law 
>> school's dean and other faculty members secretly conspired to 
>> "encourage" a visually impaired student not to complete law school. 
>> They actually put the conspiracy in writing among themselves via email!
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> They do not come straight out to the visually impaired student and 
>> say that they are going to violate the Americans with Disability Act. 
>> Nor do they say they will intentionally ignore the agreed upon 
>> accommodations. The tactics they used include making it difficult by 
>> refusing to put the documents in the right format, not giving the 
>> documents (PowerPoints, etc.) in a timely fashion, and generally 
>> refusing to follow the accommodations agreed upon.
>> By
>> the time the visually impaired student documents and files 
>> complaints, they are behind in class. That is part of the plan to 
>> convince the student that law school is not for them.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Have you encountered this problem? If so, how did you deal with it?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> I also would like to know about the experiences of visually impaired 
>> and blind students who successfully completed law school. For 
>> example, did the professors follow the agreed upon accommodations? 
>> Where your classes stationary, i.e., in the same classroom all day?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> I would like to know how blind and low vision law students cope with 
>> the first year of law school when sabotage is  the plan of the deans 
>> and professors.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> What have your experiences been like?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Thank you.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Anita Keith-Foust
>> 
>> 919-430-1978
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> blindlaw mailing list
>> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> blindlaw:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/b.schulz%40sbcg
>> l
>> obal.net
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/ckrugman%40sbcgl
> obal.n
> et
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mnowicki4%40iclo
> ud.com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/anitakeithfoust%
> 40gmai
> l.com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
blindlaw:
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> mail.com



From Noel.Nightingale at ed.gov  Mon Dec 29 23:39:25 2014
From: Noel.Nightingale at ed.gov (Nightingale, Noel)
Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2014 17:39:25 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] FW: Disability.gov Update: Bank of America to Pay $110,
 000 to Resolve Disability Discrimination Lawsuit
In-Reply-To: <17032183.84447@service.govdelivery.com>
References: <17032183.84447@service.govdelivery.com>
Message-ID: <04F1893C93758F4AA7CB436BB26750660136CCADB826@EDUPTCEXMB02.ed.gov>



From: Disability.gov [mailto:disability.gov at service.govdelivery.com]
Sent: Monday, December 29, 2014 3:32 PM
To: Nightingale, Noel
Subject: Disability.gov Update: Bank of America to Pay $110,000 to Resolve Disability Discrimination Lawsuit


[cid:image001.jpg at 01D0237D.A02185A0]<http://links.govdelivery.com:80/track?type=click&enid=ZWFzPTEmbWFpbGluZ2lkPTIwMTQxMjI5LjM5Nzg5MTUxJm1lc3NhZ2VpZD1NREItUFJELUJVTC0yMDE0MTIyOS4zOTc4OTE1MSZkYXRhYmFzZWlkPTEwMDEmc2VyaWFsPTE3MDMyMTgzJmVtYWlsaWQ9bm9lbC5uaWdodGluZ2FsZUBlZC5nb3YmdXNlcmlkPW5vZWwubmlnaHRpbmdhbGVAZWQuZ292JmZsPSZleHRyYT1NdWx0aXZhcmlhdGVJZD0mJiY=&&&100&&&https://www.disability.gov/>

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The U.S. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) has settled a disability discrimination<http://links.govdelivery.com:80/track?type=click&enid=ZWFzPTEmbWFpbGluZ2lkPTIwMTQxMjI5LjM5Nzg5MTUxJm1lc3NhZ2VpZD1NREItUFJELUJVTC0yMDE0MTIyOS4zOTc4OTE1MSZkYXRhYmFzZWlkPTEwMDEmc2VyaWFsPTE3MDMyMTgzJmVtYWlsaWQ9bm9lbC5uaWdodGluZ2FsZUBlZC5nb3YmdXNlcmlkPW5vZWwubmlnaHRpbmdhbGVAZWQuZ292JmZsPSZleHRyYT1NdWx0aXZhcmlhdGVJZD0mJiY=&&&102&&&http://www.eeoc.gov/laws/types/disability.cfm> lawsuit against Bank of America. A bank branch in downtown Chicago allegedly violated the Americans with Disabilities Act<http://links.govdelivery.com:80/track?type=click&enid=ZWFzPTEmbWFpbGluZ2lkPTIwMTQxMjI5LjM5Nzg5MTUxJm1lc3NhZ2VpZD1NREItUFJELUJVTC0yMDE0MTIyOS4zOTc4OTE1MSZkYXRhYmFzZWlkPTEwMDEmc2VyaWFsPTE3MDMyMTgzJmVtYWlsaWQ9bm9lbC5uaWdodGluZ2FsZUBlZC5nb3YmdXNlcmlkPW5vZWwubmlnaHRpbmdhbGVAZWQuZ292JmZsPSZleHRyYT1NdWx0aXZhcmlhdGVJZD0mJiY=&&&103&&&http://www.ada.gov/ada_title_I.htm> (ADA) when it refused to accommodate, and then fired, a temporary worker who has a visual impairment<http://links.govdelivery.com:80/track?type=click&enid=ZWFzPTEmbWFpbGluZ2lkPTIwMTQxMjI5LjM5Nzg5MTUxJm1lc3NhZ2VpZD1NREItUFJELUJVTC0yMDE0MTIyOS4zOTc4OTE1MSZkYXRhYmFzZWlkPTEwMDEmc2VyaWFsPTE3MDMyMTgzJmVtYWlsaWQ9bm9lbC5uaWdodGluZ2FsZUBlZC5nb3YmdXNlcmlkPW5vZWwubmlnaHRpbmdhbGVAZWQuZ292JmZsPSZleHRyYT1NdWx0aXZhcmlhdGVJZD0mJiY=&&&104&&&http://www.eeoc.gov/eeoc/publications/qa_vision.cfm>. Under the ADA, employers must provide reasonable accommodations<http://links.govdelivery.com:80/track?type=click&enid=ZWFzPTEmbWFpbGluZ2lkPTIwMTQxMjI5LjM5Nzg5MTUxJm1lc3NhZ2VpZD1NREItUFJELUJVTC0yMDE0MTIyOS4zOTc4OTE1MSZkYXRhYmFzZWlkPTEwMDEmc2VyaWFsPTE3MDMyMTgzJmVtYWlsaWQ9bm9lbC5uaWdodGluZ2FsZUBlZC5nb3YmdXNlcmlkPW5vZWwubmlnaHRpbmdhbGVAZWQuZ292JmZsPSZleHRyYT1NdWx0aXZhcmlhdGVJZD0mJiY=&&&105&&&http://askjan.org/Erguide/Three.htm>, for example screen magnifying software, for employees with disabilities.

For more information about the ADA and other laws that protect the rights of people with disabilities read Disability.gov's Guide to Disability Rights Laws<http://links.govdelivery.com:80/track?type=click&enid=ZWFzPTEmbWFpbGluZ2lkPTIwMTQxMjI5LjM5Nzg5MTUxJm1lc3NhZ2VpZD1NREItUFJELUJVTC0yMDE0MTIyOS4zOTc4OTE1MSZkYXRhYmFzZWlkPTEwMDEmc2VyaWFsPTE3MDMyMTgzJmVtYWlsaWQ9bm9lbC5uaWdodGluZ2FsZUBlZC5nb3YmdXNlcmlkPW5vZWwubmlnaHRpbmdhbGVAZWQuZ292JmZsPSZleHRyYT1NdWx0aXZhcmlhdGVJZD0mJiY=&&&106&&&https://www.disability.gov/resource/disability-govs-guide-disability-rights-laws/>.

Guides on other important topics<http://links.govdelivery.com:80/track?type=click&enid=ZWFzPTEmbWFpbGluZ2lkPTIwMTQxMjI5LjM5Nzg5MTUxJm1lc3NhZ2VpZD1NREItUFJELUJVTC0yMDE0MTIyOS4zOTc4OTE1MSZkYXRhYmFzZWlkPTEwMDEmc2VyaWFsPTE3MDMyMTgzJmVtYWlsaWQ9bm9lbC5uaWdodGluZ2FsZUBlZC5nb3YmdXNlcmlkPW5vZWwubmlnaHRpbmdhbGVAZWQuZ292JmZsPSZleHRyYT1NdWx0aXZhcmlhdGVJZD0mJiY=&&&107&&&https://www.disability.gov/disability-govs-guides-to-information/> are also available.



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From gerard.sadlier at gmail.com  Tue Dec 30 20:50:15 2014
From: gerard.sadlier at gmail.com (Gerard Sadlier)
Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2014 20:50:15 +0000
Subject: [blindlaw] Fwd: Relativity Follow-up - JAWS Compatibility
In-Reply-To: <BL2PR01MB371E29E71AD6D04DF4C5D52AC5E0@BL2PR01MB371.prod.exchangelabs.com>
References: <BL2PR01MB371E29E71AD6D04DF4C5D52AC5E0@BL2PR01MB371.prod.exchangelabs.com>
Message-ID: <CAGZitzJ6sjZZ74Z5oHHbJOnR08HmQBzyWL=JPV4hh3dayz4-3g@mail.gmail.com>

Dear all,

As I noted previously on the list I am anxious to find an e Discovery
platform (and preferably platforms) which are accessible using JAWS or
another screen reader.

I emailed Relativity earlier today to query its accessibility and
received the following response. On first reading, this seems
encouraging because:
1. They have conducted some testing using JAWS and seem (on this
showing at least) to be willing to make improvements.
2. The difficulties identified do not sound too problematic.

I would be grateful for any comments which others may have about this
programme or indeed other e Discovery programmes.
wever, I am convinced that e Discovery represents a major opportunity
for visually impaired lawyers and that the accessibility of such
platforms ought to be a priority both for visually impaired lawyers as
individuals and indeed for organizations of visually impaired lawyers.

Comments welcome.

Finally, I would like to take this opportunity to wish you and yours a
happy 2015.

Kind regards

Ger

Apologies for the repeated postings on this point. Ho

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Jason Jaroch <jjaroch at kcura.com>
Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2014 18:51:51 +0000
Subject: Relativity Follow-up - JAWS Compatibility
To: "gerard.sadlier at gmail.com" <gerard.sadlier at gmail.com>

Hi Gerard,

Thanks for reaching out and inquiring about the use of JAWS with Relativity.

We've conducted some testing in this area, and continue to make
improvements, but there are a handful of issues that users may
encounter when using JAWS with Relativity. Please see below.


1)      Viewer

a.       Actual Viewer - May not be accessible, no controls recognized

b.      Related Items Pane - May not be accessible

2)      No Skip Navigation

3)      Browser pane in the document list - Not fully accessible.

I've reached out to our Product Management team to gather additional
insight on the improvements we've included in our most recent release
(Relativity 9.0).

As soon as I hear back from the team, I'll be sure to follow-up with
more information.

In the meantime, please let me know if any other questions arise.

Thanks,

Jason Jaroch | kCura
231 South LaSalle Street
8th Floor
Chicago, IL 60604
office: (312) 870-5579
mobile: (312) 771-8348
fax: (312) 263-4351
jjaroch at kcura.com<mailto:jjaroch at kcura.com>
www.kcura.com<http://www.kcura.com/>
ref:_00D5072uY._50050Z0NSQ:ref


From Noel.Nightingale at ed.gov  Tue Dec 30 23:49:11 2014
From: Noel.Nightingale at ed.gov (Nightingale, Noel)
Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2014 17:49:11 -0600
Subject: [blindlaw] Fwd: Relativity Follow-up - JAWS Compatibility
In-Reply-To: <CAGZitzJ6sjZZ74Z5oHHbJOnR08HmQBzyWL=JPV4hh3dayz4-3g@mail.gmail.com>
References: <BL2PR01MB371E29E71AD6D04DF4C5D52AC5E0@BL2PR01MB371.prod.exchangelabs.com>
	<CAGZitzJ6sjZZ74Z5oHHbJOnR08HmQBzyWL=JPV4hh3dayz4-3g@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <04F1893C93758F4AA7CB436BB26750660136CCADB90E@EDUPTCEXMB02.ed.gov>

Jer,

I use a document management program that includes a viewer function and three panes.  I just turned off the viewer function, and, as long as documents are given adequate file names, it works fine for me with JAWS.  The panes don't pose much of a problem for me.

I am glad you are pursuing this issue as we definitely need to see progress in the area of accessibility of case management systems for blind lawyers.

Noel

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Gerard Sadlier via blindlaw
Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 2014 12:50 PM
To: blindlaw
Cc: soviluk
Subject: [blindlaw] Fwd: Relativity Follow-up - JAWS Compatibility

Dear all,

As I noted previously on the list I am anxious to find an e Discovery
platform (and preferably platforms) which are accessible using JAWS or
another screen reader.

I emailed Relativity earlier today to query its accessibility and
received the following response. On first reading, this seems
encouraging because:
1. They have conducted some testing using JAWS and seem (on this
showing at least) to be willing to make improvements.
2. The difficulties identified do not sound too problematic.

I would be grateful for any comments which others may have about this
programme or indeed other e Discovery programmes.
wever, I am convinced that e Discovery represents a major opportunity
for visually impaired lawyers and that the accessibility of such
platforms ought to be a priority both for visually impaired lawyers as
individuals and indeed for organizations of visually impaired lawyers.

Comments welcome.

Finally, I would like to take this opportunity to wish you and yours a
happy 2015.

Kind regards

Ger

Apologies for the repeated postings on this point. Ho

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Jason Jaroch <jjaroch at kcura.com>
Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2014 18:51:51 +0000
Subject: Relativity Follow-up - JAWS Compatibility
To: "gerard.sadlier at gmail.com" <gerard.sadlier at gmail.com>

Hi Gerard,

Thanks for reaching out and inquiring about the use of JAWS with Relativity.

We've conducted some testing in this area, and continue to make
improvements, but there are a handful of issues that users may
encounter when using JAWS with Relativity. Please see below.


1)      Viewer

a.       Actual Viewer - May not be accessible, no controls recognized

b.      Related Items Pane - May not be accessible

2)      No Skip Navigation

3)      Browser pane in the document list - Not fully accessible.

I've reached out to our Product Management team to gather additional
insight on the improvements we've included in our most recent release
(Relativity 9.0).

As soon as I hear back from the team, I'll be sure to follow-up with
more information.

In the meantime, please let me know if any other questions arise.

Thanks,

Jason Jaroch | kCura
231 South LaSalle Street
8th Floor
Chicago, IL 60604
office: (312) 870-5579
mobile: (312) 771-8348
fax: (312) 263-4351
jjaroch at kcura.com<mailto:jjaroch at kcura.com>
www.kcura.com<http://www.kcura.com/>
ref:_00D5072uY._50050Z0NSQ:ref

_______________________________________________
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http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for blindlaw:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/noel.nightingale%40ed.gov


From gerard.sadlier at gmail.com  Wed Dec 31 11:19:45 2014
From: gerard.sadlier at gmail.com (Gerard Sadlier)
Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2014 11:19:45 +0000
Subject: [blindlaw] Fwd: Relativity Follow-up - JAWS Compatibility
In-Reply-To: <04F1893C93758F4AA7CB436BB26750660136CCADB90E@EDUPTCEXMB02.ed.gov>
References: <BL2PR01MB371E29E71AD6D04DF4C5D52AC5E0@BL2PR01MB371.prod.exchangelabs.com>
	<CAGZitzJ6sjZZ74Z5oHHbJOnR08HmQBzyWL=JPV4hh3dayz4-3g@mail.gmail.com>
	<04F1893C93758F4AA7CB436BB26750660136CCADB90E@EDUPTCEXMB02.ed.gov>
Message-ID: <CAGZitz+4NQRXf9+GzMhqoc=HQoqXSamfbt3iw3bBKR0kZkEvrQ@mail.gmail.com>

Noel,

Do you mind my asking what programme you use and what its e Discovery
functionality is like? (Feel free to respond off list, if
appropriate.)

We use a document management programme in the firm for which I work
and I find it reasonably accessible. Thus far however, I have not
found an e Discovery platform accessible using JAWS which allows the
searching and categorization of large volumes of client's documents
and ultimately the production of those documents which are relevant to
the case, for exchange with the other side.

I will do my best to pursue this matter but I do wonder whether there
is an organization which could do more than I can do as an individual
- especially as many of the manufacturers of these products seem to be
US based and I am not.

At the risk of repetition, I firmly believe that e Discovery presents
major opportunities for blind/visually impaired lawyers.

Before the development of e Discovery, those documents would have been
largely paper based. Reviewing thousands of paper documents physically
was and is a massive and tedious undertaking for anyone. All the more
so, if that person is blind or visually impaired.

E Discovery works on documents which have already been scanned and
converted to text using OCR. Indeed, it works only because the OCR on
such documents is pretty accurate (since otherwise search
functionality, predictive coding etc. would not be effective).

So, we have the documents in a format which JAWS or another screen
reader could in principle read, somewhere within the programme and the
problems seem to be issues with the design of the software in
question.

That said, the response which I sent through yesterday is much more
positive than that which I received from Summation for example. I will
keep the list updated regarding any solutions I do find or indeed the
lack of a satisfactory solution.

With best wishes for 2015.

Kind regards

Ger

On 12/30/14, Nightingale, Noel <Noel.Nightingale at ed.gov> wrote:
> Jer,
>
> I use a document management program that includes a viewer function and
> three panes.  I just turned off the viewer function, and, as long as
> documents are given adequate file names, it works fine for me with JAWS.
> The panes don't pose much of a problem for me.
>
> I am glad you are pursuing this issue as we definitely need to see progress
> in the area of accessibility of case management systems for blind lawyers.
>
> Noel
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Gerard
> Sadlier via blindlaw
> Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 2014 12:50 PM
> To: blindlaw
> Cc: soviluk
> Subject: [blindlaw] Fwd: Relativity Follow-up - JAWS Compatibility
>
> Dear all,
>
> As I noted previously on the list I am anxious to find an e Discovery
> platform (and preferably platforms) which are accessible using JAWS or
> another screen reader.
>
> I emailed Relativity earlier today to query its accessibility and
> received the following response. On first reading, this seems
> encouraging because:
> 1. They have conducted some testing using JAWS and seem (on this
> showing at least) to be willing to make improvements.
> 2. The difficulties identified do not sound too problematic.
>
> I would be grateful for any comments which others may have about this
> programme or indeed other e Discovery programmes.
> wever, I am convinced that e Discovery represents a major opportunity
> for visually impaired lawyers and that the accessibility of such
> platforms ought to be a priority both for visually impaired lawyers as
> individuals and indeed for organizations of visually impaired lawyers.
>
> Comments welcome.
>
> Finally, I would like to take this opportunity to wish you and yours a
> happy 2015.
>
> Kind regards
>
> Ger
>
> Apologies for the repeated postings on this point. Ho
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Jason Jaroch <jjaroch at kcura.com>
> Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2014 18:51:51 +0000
> Subject: Relativity Follow-up - JAWS Compatibility
> To: "gerard.sadlier at gmail.com" <gerard.sadlier at gmail.com>
>
> Hi Gerard,
>
> Thanks for reaching out and inquiring about the use of JAWS with
> Relativity.
>
> We've conducted some testing in this area, and continue to make
> improvements, but there are a handful of issues that users may
> encounter when using JAWS with Relativity. Please see below.
>
>
> 1)      Viewer
>
> a.       Actual Viewer - May not be accessible, no controls recognized
>
> b.      Related Items Pane - May not be accessible
>
> 2)      No Skip Navigation
>
> 3)      Browser pane in the document list - Not fully accessible.
>
> I've reached out to our Product Management team to gather additional
> insight on the improvements we've included in our most recent release
> (Relativity 9.0).
>
> As soon as I hear back from the team, I'll be sure to follow-up with
> more information.
>
> In the meantime, please let me know if any other questions arise.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jason Jaroch | kCura
> 231 South LaSalle Street
> 8th Floor
> Chicago, IL 60604
> office: (312) 870-5579
> mobile: (312) 771-8348
> fax: (312) 263-4351
> jjaroch at kcura.com<mailto:jjaroch at kcura.com>
> www.kcura.com<http://www.kcura.com/>
> ref:_00D5072uY._50050Z0NSQ:ref
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindlaw mailing list
> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindlaw:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/noel.nightingale%40ed.gov
>


From gerard.sadlier at gmail.com  Wed Dec 31 17:23:56 2014
From: gerard.sadlier at gmail.com (Gerard Sadlier)
Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2014 17:23:56 +0000
Subject: [blindlaw] Eclipse Response Re: JAWS Accessibility - Fwd: Ticket
 #29920 - "Contact Us" Message from Solicitor Law Firm (ISSUE=29920 PROJ=3)
Message-ID: <CAGZitzLT-KiF6bxiUSikyitwTaydoegCXiauS6qyG2ynZBvodQ@mail.gmail.com>

All

Please see response concerning the accessibility of Eclipse using JAWS
below. In short, Eclipse doesn't officially support JAWS or any other
screen reader but their technical support think it may work with such
programmes - it all sounds a little uncertain.

Not sure if anyone has experience using this software and if so, what
that experience was like.

Would be very interested in any comments.

Kind regards

Ger

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Ipro Customer Support <support at iprotech.com>
Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2014 09:59:10 -0700
Subject: Ticket #29920 - "Contact Us" Message from Solicitor Law Firm
(ISSUE=29920 PROJ=3)
To: gerard.sadlier at gmail.com

Notification of Service Request Escalation

Workspace: Customer Support
Service Request: "Contact Us" Message from Solicitor Law Firm
Service Request Number: 29920

Priority: Medium              Status: Closed
Date: 2014-12-31              Time: 09:59:05
Creation Date: 2014-12-30     Creation Time: 10:52:03

View Service Request in Browser:
http://support.iprotech.com/MRcgi/MRlogin.pl?DL=29920DC3

Description:

Entered on 12/31/2014 at 09:59:05 MST (GMT-0700) by Dustin Snyder:
Good Day Gerard,

I've just heard back from the Eclipse product manager and he's
indicated Eclipse does not officially support any accessibility
software such as JAWS or HAL. However, we encourage you to try JAWS
out with Eclipse,  as many of the accessibility applications out there
operate on commonly used elements like those found in Eclipse.

Please let me know if I can provide any additional information.


Warmest Regards for the new year!

Dustin

Entered on 12/30/2014 at 15:09:56 MST (GMT-0700) by gerard.sadlier at gmail.com:

Dustin,

Thank you very much.

I look forward to hearing from you.

Kind regards

Ger

On 12/30/14, Ipro Customer Support <support at iprotech.com> wrote:
> [Duplicate message snipped]

Entered on 12/30/2014 at 14:44:51 MST (GMT-0700) by Dustin Snyder:
Thanks Gerard.  I've passed your inquiry along to our Solutions team
and should have some additional information for you soon.


All the best,
Dustin Snyder

Entered on 12/30/2014 at 13:54:21 MST (GMT-0700) by gerard.sadlier at gmail.com:

Dear Dustin,

Apologies I should have specified that we use Eclipse.

Kind regards

Ger

On 12/30/14, Ipro Customer Support <support at iprotech.com> wrote:
> [Duplicate message snipped]

Entered on 12/30/2014 at 11:46:25 MST (GMT-0700) by Dustin Snyder:
Good Evening Gerard,

Thank you for contacting Ipro Technical Support. I'm engaging our
Solutions department to help determine accessability. In particular,
which Ipro products does your firm use?  This will help us to focus
our research.

Please let me know at your earliest convenience.
Warmest Regards,
Dustin Snyder
Technical Support

Entered on 12/30/2014 at 10:52:03 MST (GMT-0700) by gerard.sadlier at gmail.com:

 From: Gerard Sadlier <gerard.sadlier at gmail.com>

Message Body:
Dear Sirs,

I am a solicitor. I practice in Dublin, Ireland.

The firm for which I work uses a number of eDiscovery platforms,
including yours.

I need to use these platforms, as part of my work. I am blind and use
a screen reading programme, JAWS for Windows, to read text which
appears on screen.

I need to clarify if your software is accessible, using JAWS for
Windows or can be made accessible using a screen reader and I would be
most grateful for any information you may have on the accessibility of
your programme or any assistance you can give me in rendering your
software accessible.

I look forward to hearing from you.

Many thanks

Gerard Sadlier

--
This e-mail was sent from a contact form on Ipro Tech (http://localhost:21007)

Current Assignees: T1, Dustin Snyder

Service Request Information:

Request Type: Request for Information

No Pending Deadline: Off

Product: Eclipse

Version Number: 2014.1.2

Resolution: Entered on 2014-12-31 at 09:59:06 by Dustin Snyder :

I've just heard back from the Eclipse product manager and he's
indicated Eclipse does not officially support any accessibility
software such as JAWS or HAL. However, we encourage you to try JAWS
out with Eclipse,  as many of the accessibility applications out there
operate on commonly used elements like those found in Eclipse.


Contact Information:

Email Address: gerard.sadlier at gmail.com

Opt Out Hour Notifications: Off