[blindLaw] SOS --Need for Testing Beta 2020 and Microsoft 2016

Mon Nov 4 22:13:38 UTC 2019

Great!  I just forwarded it along.  I will keep everyone updated.

On 11/4/19, Angela Matney <amatney at loeb.com> wrote:
> Laura, I will do my best to replicate the reply comment issue in a document
> that I can send out. It is causing me some difficulty these days.
>
> I have also had the experience that if I use the comment list and navigate
> to a particular comment, I have to left-arrow once to be able to edit or
> delete that comment. This has not always been the case, though I’m sorry to
> say I don’t remember when the issue started.
>
> Angie
>
>
>
>
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> From: BlindLaw <blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Laura Wolk via
> BlindLaw
> Sent: Sunday, November 3, 2019 9:45 AM
> To: Blind Law Mailing List <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: Laura Wolk <laura.wolk at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [blindLaw] SOS --Need for Testing Beta 2020 and Microsoft 2016
>
>
>
> All,
>
> The issue regarding Jaws reading both old and new text in a track
> change document is now fixed in 2020, thanks to Vispero. They tell me
> it will be fixed in 2019 in the December release. The issue with
> crashing when encountering format bubbles has also been "fixed,"
> though Vispero has provided me with the following information to make
> the experience more stable:
>
> "It is important for JAWS that “Reviewer’s comments and format only in
> balloon option” is checked rather than either of the other options:
>
> 1. From the Reviewer’s ribbon, go to Show Markup.
>
> 2. Alt+DownArrow to open the split button; then arrow through
> the options. Ensure Comments, Format, Track Changes … are all checked.
>
> 3. Continue arrowing down to the “in Balloon” submenu and
> RightArrow to open it.
>
> 4. Arrow down and ensure that the last option is checked, not
> either of the first two."
>
> Again, this is thanks to Vispero. Microsoft is flatly refusing, once
> again, to do any work with regard to 2016. In fact, after another
> lawyer using 2016 and I reported separate crashing issues to them,
> they alleged they were working on it, only to report back 6 weeks
> later that they had fixed it... in 365. They then alleged that they
> would make the fix available in a cumulative update to 2016 and 2019.
> When I pressed them on when that would be, I eventually got a response
> from a **lawyer** yes, you read that correctly, they are now routing
> my questions to a **lawyer** saying that the particular line of code
> causing the problem in 365 isn't present in 2016 and 2019, so there is
> no need to release a cumulative update to fix it. Which, you might
> not be surprised, leads me to wonder what exactly they were doing to
> assist me and the other lawyer in the intervening six weeks when they
> were claiming to be working on fixing the 2016 issue, and where I
> would be if Vispero hadn't stepped in in the meantime to fix it alone.
> I also find it odd, to say the very least, that basic consumer
> questions about a product are being routed to in-house counsel. But
> that is an issue for another day.
>
> I have raised the issue regarding Jaws not reliably reading reply
> comment text with Vispero and plan to speak with them about it on
> Tuesday. Angie and others, if you happen to have a test doc
> replicating this problem that I can pass along, please let me know.
>
> Laura
>
>
> On 10/11/19, Laura Wolk <laura.wolk at gmail.com<mailto:laura.wolk at gmail.com>>
> wrote:
>> Thank you so much, Angie! And I totally agree. If Vispero wants to
>> use us as product developpers/testers, then they should pay us for it.
>> I really appreciate the help, and for everyone's willingness to listen
>> to my rant.
>>
>> On 10/11/19, Angie Matney via BlindLaw
>> <blindlaw at nfbnet.org<mailto:blindlaw at nfbnet.org>> wrote:
>>>> Laura, James is right—you are not alone. I have yet to send a document
>>>> to
>>>> Vispero, precisely for the reason that you identify: It takes so much
>>>> time
>>>> to come up with something that isn't full of sensitive information. I
>>>> am
>>>> a
>>>> single parent with a big job, and I also don't have time to devote
>>>> hours
>>>> and hours to this. Having said that, I will do my best to come up with
>>>> something I can send in the next few days. I do have one that
>>>> illustrates
>>>> problems with checkboxes in tables. I will send that too.
>>>> Angie
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>
>>>> On Oct 11, 2019, at 3:07 PM, James T. Fetter via BlindLaw
>>>> <blindlaw at nfbnet.org<mailto:blindlaw at nfbnet.org>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> First of all, I'm just sick hearing about this and very sorry that you
>>>> have to deal with all of this all over again. I also agree that
>>>> Microsoft
>>>> and Vespero should?? have their feet held to the fire, up to and
>>>> including
>>>> being uninvited from national conventions, if they continue to
>>>> demonstrate
>>>> this level of indifference toward our ability to do our jobs.
>>>>
>>>> Just a few questions:
>>>>
>>>> 1. What version of Office are you running? You mentioned 2016, so I
>>>> assume
>>>> you have that rather than 365.
>>>>
>>>> 2. I'd be happy to test the 2020 beta, but I'm running 365. I'm not
>>>> sure
>>>> how helpful that would be.
>>>>
>>>> 3. Have you tried NVDA? I have experienced fewer stability issues, but
>>>> reviewing track changes is a more laborious process. I could be
>>>> mistaken,
>>>> but I do not know of any way to list all changes in NVDA, as is at
>>>> least
>>>> theoretically possible in Jaws.
>>>>
>>>> Again, I am very sorry that you are dealing with this. You are not
>>>> alone
>>>> in this struggle. We will get there somehow.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 10/11/2019 2:45 PM, Laura Wolk via BlindLaw wrote:
>>>> All,
>>>>
>>>> The nightmarish scenario of Jaws reading all material,both old and
>>>> new, in a track changed document seems to have arisen with a vengeance
>>>> as of the late September release. I have tried restarting jaws,
>>>> restarting the computer, refreshing the screen, and switching to no
>>>> markup. Nothing works.
>>>>
>>>> My ability to work quickly and reliably has just been ground to a
>>>> screeching halt. Why not simply migrate back to an earlier update,
>>>> you might ask? Well, my friends, it's because **that** update was
>>>> causing heavily track changed documents to crash as soon as the
>>>> document was opened. And how did Vispero come to know that fact?
>>>> Because they tested it and identified hhe problem and committed
>>>> themselves to fixing it as soon as possible? No, of course not.
>>>> Because my coworkers and I spent hours, literally hours, isolating the
>>>> problem, creating a test document with nonsensitive information that
>>>> replicated it, and sending it to them. I am truly at my whits end. I
>>>> am a fully-employed person with a disability working at one of the
>>>> most stressful and time consuming jobs in our profession. And yet,
>>>> here I am, using my work time to literally sit on the phone and
>>>> **explain**, yes, **EXPLAIN, step-by-step, to Vispero employees how to
>>>> **TURN ON Track CHANGES**, because they are so unfamiliar with this
>>>> concept that they don't even know how to do it. I do not have the
>>>> time to take on a second full-time job just so I can do my first one.
>>>> None of us do. This is utterly unacceptable. We need our leadership
>>>> to step in now. Stop bringing Microsoft to national conventions to
>>>> wax eloquent about how much they care about accessibility if in fact
>>>> they don't. If in fact they are committed to not assisting at all
>>>> with products that people still pay them to suppor, products that the
>>>> entire federal government uses, products that just ask the blind to
>>>> deal with it or risk losing their jobs. Stop touting Jaws as if it's
>>>> the best thing since sliced bread if, one week into the Supreme Court
>>>> term, I now effectively cannot do my job, no, not have a harder time
>>>> doing my job, but cannot do my job, because no one is testing this
>>>> stuff before updates are released. I am just incensed.
>>>>
>>>> I also need someone to test whether this problem is occurring on Beta
>>>> 2020 with Word 2016. I cannot get beta 2020 installed on my computer
>>>> here. But I need to verify whether it's fixed in that release. I
>>>> swear, if they try making me wait until December to fix this, I'm
>>>> going to need some major reinforcements.
>>>>
>>>> Now please excuse me while I quickly go angry cry in the bathroom, put
>>>> on my nice happy brave face again, and resign myself to spending
>>>> thrice as much time on my work as I needed to spend yesterday. Your
>>>> prayers are appreciated.
>>>>
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>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
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