[blindLaw] Navigating non-uniform tables in Word with JAWS

Sat Sep 9 02:21:50 UTC 2023

I see. The Alt+Windows+Arrows keystrokes are JAWS-specific so I guess
they're subject to JAWS limitations.

I should point out, if you're particularly interested in the exact
dimensions of cells spanning multiple rows or columns, that information
does come through in Excel with JAWS. If you're on a cell that is three
columns wide, JAWS will call it something like "F5:H5". I don't know of
anything else  that will do this. If the table is particularly complicated,
JAWS and Excel might give you the most precise information.

Graham

On Sep 2, 2023, at 3:38 PM, Matney, Angela R. <AMatney at reedsmith.com> wrote:

Absolutely!

By the way, the Alt+Windows+Arrow commands speak for me, but in one
document, I get the message from JAWS that “The table is nonuniform, so you
cannot read the current column.” Oh well. I really didn’t want to hear the
entire row/column at once anyway. I want to quickly move between entries in
a particular row or column and know when I’m passing by one of these
multi-cell entries. I may try viewing it as a webpage.

And yes, JAWS is great in general, but these hiccups can be frustrating.

*Angela R. Matney, CIPP/US (Angie)*

*Counsel*

D: +1 202-414-9343

Preferred pronouns: she/her

amatney at reedsmith.com

Bio <https://www.reedsmith.com/en/professionals/m/matney-angela>|vCard
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1301 K Street, NW, Suite 1000

Washington, DC 20005

ReedSmith

*From:* graham.hardy at gmail.com <graham.hardy at gmail.com>
*Sent:* Friday, September 1, 2023 5:16 PM
*To:* Matney, Angela R. <AMatney at reedsmith.com>; 'Blind Law Mailing List' <
blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
*Subject:* RE: [blindLaw] Navigating non-uniform tables in Word with JAWS

EXTERNAL E-MAIL - From graham.hardy at gmail.com

I used to be at a firm with lots of customisations that caused crashes,
too. I even remember using the prompt creator to try and re-label dialog
controls only to discover that it acted like it was working but it never
actually changed the labels in those add-ons. Let’s just say there are
countless edge cases in JAWS that aren’t well tested. JAWS is great, but it
just wasn’t designed by lawyers, I think we can agree on that!

External Signed

*From:* Matney, Angela R. <AMatney at reedsmith.com>
*Sent:* Friday, September 1, 2023 2:04 PM
*To:* Blind Law Mailing List <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
*Cc:* graham.hardy at gmail.com
*Subject:* RE: [blindLaw] Navigating non-uniform tables in Word with JAWS

Thanks, Graham, some good ideas here.

I find that sometimes using tab and shift+tab causes JAWS to crash. I think
this has to do with some integrations that my firm has with Office. I
generally have to restart JAWS manually when this occurs. But I do
appreciate you sending this list of suggestions. I might be able to have a
review copy open in one window and another editable copy open elsewhere.

Best,

Angie

*Angela R. Matney, CIPP/US (Angie)*

*Counsel*

D: +1 202-414-9343

Preferred pronouns: she/her

amatney at reedsmith.com

Bio <https://www.reedsmith.com/en/professionals/m/matney-angela>|vCard
<https://www.reedsmith.com/en/professionals/m/matney-angela?format=vcard>|
E-Mail| <%20amatney at reedsmith.com>ReedSmith.com <http://www.reedsmith.com/>

1301 K Street, NW, Suite 1000

Washington, DC 20005

ReedSmith

*From:* BlindLaw <blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org> *On Behalf Of *Graham Hardy
via BlindLaw
*Sent:* Friday, September 1, 2023 4:51 PM
*To:* 'Blind Law Mailing List' <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
*Cc:* graham.hardy at gmail.com
*Subject:* Re: [blindLaw] Navigating non-uniform tables in Word with JAWS

EXTERNAL E-MAIL - From blindlaw at nfbnet.org

There are a couple of commands I use to navigate tables, some of which are
more efficient than others. I've been known to copy a table from Word and
paste it in Excel. When all else fails, I sometimes get a web page preview
by invoking the WebPagePreview command from within the macro/command
launcher invoked with Alt+F8. This brings up a page in your default web
browser from which you can of course view, but not edit, the table, enough
to get acquainted with it.

* Tab and Shift+Tab move from one cell to the next. This sometimes does
better in non-uniform tables but is a bit slow. It also adds a row if you
press it at the bottom, which can be undone if it's a mistake.

* Ctrl+Up and Ctrl+Down similarly move among cells and among paragraphs
within each. Sometimes this is better. Other times it gets stuck in a
non-uniform row.

* Alt+Windows+arrow keys are JAWS commands that are supposed to move to the
next or previous row or column and read the entire row or column. This is
supposed to allow you to get an entire row read at once with each press of
Alt+Windows+Down. This used to be the best way for dealing with non-uniform
rows but recently ithas stopped speaking. I've been meaning to call
technical support but haven't gotten around to it.

Also, if headings are properly tagged, you can navigate to them with
regular heading commands in the JAWSKey+Z layer.

External Signed

-----Original Message-----
From: BlindLaw <blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Matney, Angela R.
via BlindLaw
Sent: Friday, September 1, 2023 12:34 PM
To: Blind Law Mailing List <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
Cc: Matney, Angela R. <AMatney at reedsmith.com>
Subject: [blindLaw] Navigating non-uniform tables in Word with JAWS

Hello everyone,

I need to edit and review Word documents that contain tables with
non-uniform layouts. For example, most rows of a table in the document I’m
currently working on contain three columns. But some rows are used as
headings, and the heading spans all three columns, though it’s a single
cell in the table. The problem is that if I use control-alt-down to
navigate to the next row, JAWS will skip over these “heading” rows unless I
am in the first column. This is somewhat annoying, as the first column
basically contains nothing but numbers, and I would prefer to “skim” the
table by staying on the second column, which contains the substantive
entries. But I would like JAWS to announce the headings and not simply skip
to the next row containing three columns.

I’ve also experienced this with tables where the columns do not have the
same number of rows. (And, in one mind-altering instance, with a table that
had both of these going on!)

I’ve searched (OK, maybe it was a fairly cursory search…) for JAWS settings
that might impact this behavior, but I haven’t yet found anything. Does
anyone have any suggestions?

Angie (AKA Vexed in Virginia)

Angela R. Matney, CIPP/US (Angie)
Counsel
D: +1 202-414-9343
Preferred pronouns: she/her
amatney at reedsmith.com<mailto:amatney at reedsmith.com>

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