[Blindmath] Extracting bitmap images from pdf files
Jamal Mazrui
empower at smart.net
Mon Jan 30 00:02:03 UTC 2012
Hi Dick,
Sorry my prior message was not clear about this. After copying the new
pdf2images.exe into the directory you used for PDF2Parts, you would then
run pdf2images.exe, passing it the file name of the PDF to analyze. I
suspect that you instead ran pdf2parts.exe again, which would, indeed,
produce the same result as before.
I just tried this pdf2images.exe with a book that is 873 pages in size.
It appeared to create a .TIF for each page.
For just converting PDFs to text, let me suggest my older, PDF2TXT
program, based on the same PDF library. It can convert batches of PDF
with a simple GUI dialog. It can also do OCR on image-only PDFs using
the free, open source Tesseract utility from Google. That OCR is not
high quality by today's standards.
PDF2TXT is available as a Windows installer at
http://EmpowermentZone.com/p2tsetup.exe
Its full documentation may be browsed at
http://empowermentzone.com/pdf2txt.htm
Jamal
On 1/29/2012 6:42 PM, Richard Baldwin wrote:
> Hi Jamal,
> The output from this version is not much different from the previous
version. The program still crashed on page 17 of the small pdf file. I
also noticed that it skipped page 13.
> I tried a larger pdf file and it crashed on page 6 of that file.
> I don't believe the tiff files were actually created at 300 dpi. The
width of those files is 1275 pixels, which matches 8.5 inches at 150 dpi.
> I did discover one thing that may be different. Although I was unable
to successfully open the jpg files in Lview Pro, which is the image
editor program that I have used for years, I was able to successfully
open them in Windows Paint and also in a program named Paint.net that I
occasionally use. That was probably also true for the earlier version. I
simply didn't try it. Curiously, the jpg files seemed to be in reverse
video when opened in those paint programs.
> Don't spend time worrying about the jpg files. They add very little
benefit to the overall result. As far as I am concerned, you could
suppress the output of images from the individual pages, because they
are of little value.
> Amanda might be happy with the .txt files that appear to contain the
text from the pdf file in a plain text format on a page by page basis.
> Dick Baldwin
>
> On Sun, Jan 29, 2012 at 4:54 PM, Jamal Mazrui <empower at smart.net> wrote:
>
> Hi Dick,
> With the PDF library I have, I do not see a way of adjusting the
format of JPG output, other than the DPI setting, unfortunately.
Perhaps the free Image Magick software could transform those files into
something more useful -- not sure.
>
> I think I may have found a way, however, to improve the
reliability of simply producing a TIF file for each whole page of the
PDF. The library has a function call for this that processes all pages
at once. Memory seems to be managed better than when iterating through
each page of the PDF separately, which I suspect is causing the crashes
with PDFs that are not relatively small in size.
>
> I just posted a utility that only does that task at 300 DPI. It
has the original PDF2Images name and is available at
>
> http://EmpowermentZone.com/pdf2images.zip
>
> Just unzip it to the same directory as PDF2Parts (it uses the
same PDF2Parts.dll).
>
> A minor annoyance is that this technique does not right justify
page numbers (the single function call mostly handles the names of
individual .tif files). So, the output files do not sort correctly in
an alphabetical directory listing. If files are sorted by time,
however, the right order is attained.
>
> Can you let me know how well this utility works? If I get it
working adequately, I will incorporate it into a single, coherent package.
>
> Jamal
>
>
>
> On 1/29/2012 4:47 PM, Richard Baldwin wrote:
>> Hi Jamal,
>> I ran the new version of the program for a relatively small pdf
file, which was one of the smallest chapters in the physics textbook.
The program stopped with an error on page 17 of about 24 pages. However,
it did produce a lot of output before stopping.
>> The tiff files that represent individual pages look good. If
possible, I would like to see if conversion to 300 dpi as opposed to 150
dpi would provide improved image quality.
>> The bmp and jpg files for the individual images on each page
suffer from the same problem discussed in previous posts. Mostly small
pieces of larger images. In addition, the jpg files appear to be
corrupt. They appear to suffer from some sort of synchronization problem
that causes them to consist mainly of vertical bars. However, it was
possible for me to correlate one of them to an actual image in the book.
I suspect that these are the images from the pdf file that are stored as
raster images in the pdf file.
>> Once you get the program to handle complete pdf files, I will
consider it superior to online conversion of pdf files to bitmap pages.
If you can fix the problem with the jpg files, that would be useful
because they contain images that a sighted assistant won't need to crop
out of the larger page images.
>> Thanks,
>> Dick Baldwin
>>
>> On Sun, Jan 29, 2012 at 11:21 AM, Jamal Mazrui
<empower at smart.net> wrote:
>>
>> Dick,
>> I just posted a revised and renamed version of my program,
which extracts both text and images. PDF2Parts is available at
>> http://EmpowermentZone.com/pdf2parts.zip
>>
>> Currently, it creates a .tif version of each PDF page at 150
DPI. Alternatively, I could make it save as .bmp or .jpg, and vary the
resolution. Would another image format or DPI work better for what you
are trying to do?
>>
>> Jamal
>>
>> P.S. The program seems to hang on large PDFs sometimes. I
have not figured out the pattern and debugged that yet.
>>
>>
>> On 1/28/2012 2:29 PM, Richard Baldwin wrote:
>>
>> I will be responding to questions and comments from
several different
>> individuals in this post, so I will refer to each person
by name.
>>
>> Maureen: I will be happy to send some files off list for
you to emboss and
>> evaluate if you would be interested in doing that. I
would be interested in
>> your feed back.
>>
>> Jamal: You wrote "In reviewing the documentation for the
PDF library I'm
>> using, I notice there is also the ability to save each
page as an image.
>> Would that be helpful?"
>>
>> That would be very helpful. I have generally concluded
(more on this in a
>> separate post) that the most practical way for a sighted
person to extract
>> images from a pdf file for a blind student is to deal
with each page as an
>> image file, crop, cut, copy, and paste. I have
identified a free website
>> that will convert a pdf file to a set of image files,
but the less often I
>> am required to download files from strange websites, the
happier I am. I
>> never know what may be riding those files into my
computer. Your
>> stand-alone command-line based program would make it
possible to make the
>> conversion locally. Please provide more information.
>>
>> Ben: You wrote "I have a question -- are you using the
most popular
>> university Physics textbook, whatever that may be?"
>>
>> Actually, I teach Computer Science and not physics.
Amanda is a Computer
>> Science student, and I am helping her in a required
physics course. Her
>> physics book is the only one that I know anything about.
However, I believe
>> this pdf-image issue applies to many college-level
textbooks, because many
>> blind college students probably receive their electronic
textbooks in pdf
>> format. Once again, however, the only one that I have
any personal
>> knowledge about is Amanda's physics book.
>>
>> I will send you a pdf file of one of the chapters from
the textbook off
>> list later today.
>>
>> Bente: You wrote "If we could stick with a text for more
than two years it
>> would be so helpful."
>>
>> I will simply say a loud AMEN to that. In my 18 years of
teaching, I have
>> never understood why community colleg instructors insist
on changing
>> textbooks so frequently, causing much more work for
themselves in the
>> process. I have gotten to the point that I tell my
students that the
>> textbook is for reference purposes only and the material
for the course is
>> published at http://www.dickbaldwin.com.
>>
>> Dick Baldwin
>>
>> On Sat, Jan 28, 2012 at 1:01 PM, Bente
Casile<bente at casilenc.com> wrote:
>>
>> Ben,
>>
>> My greatest wish for all the blind students out
there is that we in the
>> college system could have a repository of tactile
graphics for science and
>> math classes. If we could stick with a text for
more than two years it
>> would be so helpful. As someone who makes math
tactile graphics for our
>> students, I would love to see that happen. It would
allow us to get ahead
>> for students to benefit directly from the hard work
of others and not to
>> have to "re-invent" the wheel every time a new text
is adopted.
>>
>> Oh, and PS .. Austin is very nice..smiles
>>
>> Bente
>> Bente J. Casile
>> Math Learning Specialist
>> Wake Tech Community College
>> Raleigh NC
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org
[mailto:blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>> On
>> Behalf Of Ben Humphreys
>> Sent: Saturday, January 28, 2012 11:17 AM
>> To: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics
>> Subject: Re: [Blindmath] Extracting bitmap images
from pdf files
>>
>> Hi Richard,
>>
>> As best I recall, it was a Microsoft Word file which
we typically
>> "saved as" HTML in order to get the graphics
extracted out in an
>> automated way. Some came out as GIF, others JPEG,
leading me to
>> believe that Word preserves the original file
intact. These were
>> .DOC, not .DOCX, so I don't believe they were really
ZIP files in
>> DOCX clothing.
>>
>> As my instructor routinely"pasted" in JPGs, GIFs,
etc from all around
>> the world into her Microsoft Word files, it's
anyone's guess why a
>> few got all broken up like that. Most remained intact.
>>
>> Part way through the class, I ended up having my
assistant extract by
>> hand the images as the automated way was too
difficult to distinguish
>> the garbage (i.e. little arrows and such) from the
meaningful calculus
>> graphs.
>>
>> I have a question -- are you using the most popular
university
>> Physics textbook, whatever that may be? If so, and
we get to the
>> bottom of this, we could conceivably have a
repository of labeled
>> graphics files so others wouldn't have to repeat
this step, and joy
>> of joys, I could take physics without moving to
Austin, :) This of
>> course is not to say Austin isn't a great place,
it's just that I
>> might have to move again when I want to take biology
or chemestry.
>>
>> As always, thanks for your continued enthusiasm.
>>
>> And as I said, you're welcome to send me a file or
two and we'll
>> throw our Acrobat Pro strategy at it, maybe even
consider how it
>> might be automated.
>>
>> Ben
>>
>> At 08:59 AM 1/28/2012, you wrote:
>>
>> But, no, I do not believe we were dealing with PDFs
in this case.
>>
>> Typically, when we have a PDF with a graphic, my
assistant draws a
>> box around it I think and saves it out separately.
I'm not clear on
>> the process but he did say it required Acrobat Pro
and once it's
>> extracted, it's easy to blow it up to fill the page
for easier
>> tactile understanding.
>>
>>
>> Hi Ben,
>>
>> I appreciate your frustration.
>>
>> Were the "30 itty bitty graphics files" that
apparently were small parts
>> of two actual graphs produced using Acrobat Pro,
or were you using some
>> different image extraction software during that
lost weekend?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Dick Baldwin
>>
>> On Sat, Jan 28, 2012 at 5:55 AM, Ben Humphreys
>> <brh at opticinspiration.org>wrote:
>>
>> I suppose this procedure could work.
>>
>> But when it's this much effort to get to the
starting gate, while other
>> students are already moving forward and
you're falling behind, it's no
>>
>> fun,
>>
>> and the added time and complexity and
brainpower just takes all the
>> motivation out of you.
>>
>> I remember losing a whole weekend to the
issue of 30 itty bitty
>>
>> graphics
>>
>> files in a Calculus PDF. Having embossed
them, they were all told to
>>
>> "fit
>>
>> to page" and were thusly huge. I was
thinking they were all graphs and
>> problems to be interpreted and worked on and
understood, only to be
>>
>> told
>>
>> later that there were only two graphs and
having the benefit of a
>>
>> sighted
>>
>> person on Monday morning to finally tell me
that they were bits and
>>
>> pieces
>>
>> of the two relatively simple graphs.
>>
>> It's enough to make you want to be a Steve
Jobs and exit school
>> prematurely.
>>
>> Prof Baldwin, this is certainly not to say I
don't appreciate all your
>> effforts. In fact, if and when I ever need
to take physics, I am
>>
>> seriously
>>
>> considering relocating to Austin for a semester.
>>
>> P.S. I do have Acrobat pro so if you can
send me the single page PDF in
>> question, we can attempt to extract as a
single image.
>>
>> Ben
>>
>>
>> At 02:56 PM 1/27/2012, you wrote:
>>
>> In a previous post I wrote:
>>
>> "By the way, I don't know how a blind
person would carry out the
>>
>> second
>> of
>>
>> the following two steps in John's procedure:
>>
>> * import the PDF into IVEO Creator Pro.
>> * Check the PDF to find which pages have
images of interest and emboss
>> those
>> pages.
>>
>> It seems that checking the pdf to find
which pages have images would
>>
>> be
>>
>> similar to checking a screen shot of a
page to find and crop the
>>
>> image.
>> It
>>
>> seems that you would need to be able to
see the pdf on the IVEO screen
>>
>> to
>>
>> know if it contains an image. I am
working with pdf files containing
>> anywhere between 30 and 80 pages.
Embossing every page in order to
>> identify
>> the pages that contain images would not
be practical."
>>
>> I have learned how a blind person could
find the pages containing the
>> images in a pdf file without having to
see the screen. Here is one
>> procedure for doing that.
>>
>> When you import a pdf file into Creator
Pro, a set of SVG files is
>> automatically created in the folder than
contains the pdf file. There
>>
>> is
>>
>> one SVG file for each page in the pdf
file. The file names indicate
>>
>> the
>>
>> pdf
>> page number except that pages in a pdf
file are typically numbered
>> beginning with 1 while the file numbers
produced by Creator Pro begin
>>
>> with
>>
>> 0. Thus, file number 0 will probably
correspond to page 1 in the pdf
>> document.
>>
>> Read the pdf file in your preferred pdf
file reader. If from the pdf
>>
>> text,
>>
>> you can determine which pages in the pdf
file contain images of
>>
>> interest,
>>
>> you can record those page numbers using
whatever method you use to
>>
>> record
>>
>> information of that sort.
>>
>> Then you can import the pdf file into
Creator Pro, producing the set
>>
>> of
>>
>> SVG
>> files described above. Then you can open
the SVG files that contain
>> interesting images in your IVEO viewer
software, emboss the pages, and
>> proceed as John explained in an earlier
post.
>>
>> Dick Baldwin
>>
>> On Fri, Jan 27, 2012 at 12:47 PM,
Richard Baldwin
>> <baldwin at dickbaldwin.com>**wrote:
>>
>> Michael wrote " There is one option
I am aware of for a blind person
>>
>> to
>>
>> do this independently, IVEO like
John suggested,"
>>
>> I may be wrong, but I didn't get the
idea that John's solution will
>> produce an output bitmap file - only
an embossed image.
>>
>> I may be wrong again, but as near as
I can tell, IVEO doesn't do any
>>
>> image
>>
>> enhancement prior to embossing the
image. If I am wrong on these
>>
>> points,
>>
>> John will probably come online and
set the record straight.
>>
>> IVEO seems to simply convert the
bitmap image to gray scale and
>>
>> emboss
>>
>> the
>>
>> gray scale. While gray scale
embossing is okay for some images
>>
>> (especially
>>
>> blank and white images), it is
definitely not the best option for
>>
>> many
>>
>> images. After all, if you convert 16
million colors to four levels
>>
>> of
>>
>> gray
>>
>> scale, each level of gray scale
represents 4 million different
>>
>> colors.
>>
>> Pixels belonging to each set of 4
million colors will not be
>> distinguishable in the gray scale
representation.
>>
>> My objective is to gain access to
full-color bitmap images so that I
>>
>> can
>>
>> enhance the image for embossing
prior to throwing away all of the
>>
>> color
>>
>> information.
>>
>> Embossed versions of bitmap images
are often very difficult to
>>
>> understand,
>>
>> even with a decent description. I
believe we need to do everything
>> reasonable to improve the
understandability of embossed bitmap
>>
>> images.
>>
>> In
>>
>> some cases, image enhancement
techniques at the full-color stage can
>>
>> be
>>
>> used to provide those improvements.
>>
>> So, my quest continues, hopefully
without having to pay $445.00 for
>> Acrobat Pro, just to get access to
the images.
>>
>> The fallback position, of course, is
to use screen shots and an
>>
>> image
>>
>> editor program to crop out the
individual images, but that approach
>>
>> is
>>
>> not
>>
>> possible for a blind person to use.
You can't crop an image out of a
>>
>> screen
>>
>> shot unless you can see the image.
>>
>> By the way, I don't know how a blind
person would carry out the
>>
>> second
>>
>> of
>>
>> the following two steps in John's
procedure:
>>
>> * import the PDF into IVEO Creator Pro.
>> * Check the PDF to find which pages
have images of interest and
>>
>> emboss
>>
>> those
>> pages.
>>
>> It seems that checking the pdf to
find which pages have images would
>>
>> be
>>
>> similar to checking a screen shot of
a page to find and crop the
>>
>> image.
>>
>> It
>>
>> seems that you would need to be able
to see the pdf on the IVEO
>>
>> screen
>>
>> to
>>
>> know if it contains an image. I am
working with pdf files containing
>> anywhere between 30 and 80 pages.
Embossing every page in order to
>>
>> identify
>>
>> the pages that contain images would
not be practical.
>>
>> Dick Baldwin
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Jan 27, 2012 at 11:48 AM,
Richard Baldwin<
>>
>> baldwin at dickbaldwin.com
>>
>> wrote:
>> Amanda and others,
>>
>> I have contacted Adobe technical
support. There solution to the
>>
>> problem
>>
>> is to purchase Acrobat Pro for
$445.00. The tech support rep told
>>
>> me
>>
>> that
>>
>> their program will extract the
pictures intact as separate bitmap
>>
>> files.
>>
>> Dick Baldwin
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Jan 27, 2012 at 10:44
AM, Michael Whapples
>>
>> <mwhapples at aim.com
>>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hello,
>> From what you are
describing, my feeling is that the
>>
>> diagrams/images
>>
>> in
>>
>> the PDF in question are
created from a number of drawing elements
>>
>> rather
>>
>> than a single image object.
I'm not an expert on PDF, but I think
>>
>> you
>>
>> could
>>
>> think of it like the
difference of a bitmap being a single element
>>
>> (I
>>
>> think
>>
>> PDF has a way to specify the
start of a stream object like a
>>
>> bitmap)
>>
>> and an
>>
>> SVG being formed from lots
of elements like lines and shapes (I
>>
>> think
>>
>> in
>>
>> PDF the lines and such like
can be created with basic PDF drawing
>> facilities so are not in a
separate object). When the image is
>>
>> formed
>>
>> from
>>
>> lots of elements then it may
be hard for the software to know what
>>
>> makes up
>>
>> a given diagram in the
book/document, it just lays it out as
>>
>> specified and
>>
>> you work out what's related.
I think one way to tell whether you
>>
>> have
>>
>> this
>>
>> sort of image is to see if
NVDA will read some of the text labels
>>
>> of
>>
>> the
>>
>> image, if it does then its
not a pure bitmap (you probably could
>>
>> use
>>
>> the
>>
>> read out lout function of
adobe reader as well). Therefore I
>>
>> imagine
>>
>> that
>>
>> without clever recognition
algorithms you are unlikely to get
>>
>> something
>>
>> which will extract it as you
want.
>>
>> There is one option I am
aware of for a blind person to do this
>> independently, IVEO like
John suggested, however IVEO isn't a
>>
>> cheap
>>
>> option
>>
>> and depending on how much is
to be done would determine whether
>>
>> its
>>
>> worth
>>
>> the money if providing
accessible diagrams from PDF was its only
>>
>> use.
>>
>> IVEO
>>
>> does not require a tiger
printer, swell paper would work, other
>>
>> embossers
>>
>> may (the outputting from
IVEO is the question as I think it may
>>
>> only
>>
>> output
>>
>> to devices appearing as
standard printers). Interesting, the IVEO
>>
>> route
>>
>> again is requiring a human
to make the decision on what forms the
>>
>> diagram.
>>
>> Michael Whapples
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
From: Richard Baldwin
>> Sent: Friday, January 27,
2012 3:28 PM
>> To: Jamal Mazrui
>> Cc: Blind Math list for
those interested in mathematics
>> Subject: Re: [Blindmath]
Extracting bitmap images from pdf files
>>
>>
>> Hi Jamal,
>>
>> It is a great program, easy
to use, and probably totally
>>
>> accessible. I
>>
>> particularly like the fact
that the program doesn't require a
>>
>> windows
>>
>> installation. The output
data is well organized and including the
>>
>> page
>>
>> numbers in the bmp file
names is a great help in analyzing them.
>>
>> Unfortunately, the output
produced by the program suffers from the
>>
>> same
>>
>> issues that I have
encountered with all of the other image
>>
>> extractor
>>
>> programs that I have tried.
A few of the images come out intact.
>>
>> Most
>>
>> of
>>
>> the images don't come out
intact.
>>
>> For example, page three of
one of the pdf files that I tested has
>>
>> a
>>
>> single
>> image of a battery. It is
the same image that I enhanced and
>>
>> posted
>>
>> in an
>>
>> earlier post. Your program
produced 54 bmp files for that page. A
>>
>> few
>>
>> of
>>
>> them were icons such as
arrows exclamation marks, etc. The
>>
>> remaining
>>
>> bmp
>>
>> files appear to be a very
small pieces of the image of the
>>
>> battery.
>> By
>>
>> the
>> way, I got the earlier image
of the battery by taking a screen
>>
>> shot
>> of
>>
>> the
>> page and using an image
editing program to crop out the battery
>>
>> image.
>>
>> None
>> of the image extraction
programs that I have tested extract the
>>
>> image
>>
>> intact.
>>
>> I don't know anything at all
about the internal structure of pdf
>>
>> files,
>>
>> and
>> this behavior of breaking an
image into many small pieces may
>>
>> depend
>>
>> on
>>
>> how
>> the file is constructed in
the first place. In any event, my
>>
>> immediate
>>
>> problem has to do with a
specific set of pdf files that are the
>>
>> chapters
>>
>> from a specific physics
book, so this program doesn't solve my
>>
>> problem.
>>
>> Thanks for offering the program.
>> Dick Baldwin
>>
>> On Fri, Jan 27, 2012 at 5:18
AM, Jamal Mazrui<empower at smart.net>
>>
>> wrote:
>>
>> In an attempt to facilitate
a free, non-web dependent solution, I
>>
>> have
>>
>> written a Windows
console-mode utility called PDF2Images, built
>>
>> with
>>
>> PowerBASIC and a PDF
library. The distribution archive,
>>
>> including
>>
>> documentation and source
code, is available at
>>
>>
>> http://empowermentzone.com/******pdf2images.zip<
>> http://empowermentzone.com/*
>> ***pdf2images.zip>
>> <http://**empowermentzone.com/****pdf2images.zip<
>> http://empowermentzone.com/
>> **pdf2images.zip>
>> <http://**empowermentzone.com/****pdf2images.zip<
>> http://empowermentzone.com/
>> **pdf2images.zip>
>> <http://**empowermentzone.com/**pdf2images.zip<
>> http://empowermentzone.com/pd
>> f2images.zip>
>>
>>
>> I am interested in any
feedback on how well it works compared to
>>
>> other
>>
>> approaches.
>>
>> Jamal
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Richard G. Baldwin (Dick
Baldwin)
>> Home of Baldwin's on-line
Java Tutorials
>> http://www.DickBaldwin.com
>>
>> Professor of Computer
Information Technology
>> Austin Community College
>> (512) 223-4758
>> mailto:Baldwin at DickBaldwin.com
>>
>>
http://www.austincc.edu/****baldwin/<http://www.austincc.edu/**baldwin/
>> <
>>
>>
http://www.austincc.edu/**baldwin/<http://www.austincc.edu/baldwin/
>>
>>
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>> Richard G. Baldwin (Dick Baldwin)
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>> --
>> Richard G. Baldwin (Dick Baldwin)
>> Home of Baldwin's on-line Java Tutorials
>> http://www.DickBaldwin.com
>>
>> Professor of Computer Information
Technology
>> Austin Community College
>> (512) 223-4758
>> mailto:Baldwin at DickBaldwin.com
>> http://www.austincc.edu/**baldwin/<
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>> --
>> Richard G. Baldwin (Dick Baldwin)
>> Home of Baldwin's on-line Java Tutorials
>> http://www.DickBaldwin.com
>>
>> Professor of Computer Information Technology
>> Austin Community College
>> (512) 223-4758
>> mailto:Baldwin at DickBaldwin.com
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>> --
>> Richard G. Baldwin (Dick Baldwin)
>> Home of Baldwin's on-line Java Tutorials
>> http://www.DickBaldwin.com
>>
>> Professor of Computer Information Technology
>> Austin Community College
>> (512) 223-4758
>> mailto:Baldwin at DickBaldwin.com
>> http://www.austincc.edu/baldwin/
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>> --
>> Richard G. Baldwin (Dick Baldwin)
>> Home of Baldwin's on-line Java Tutorials
>> http://www.DickBaldwin.com
>>
>> Professor of Computer Information Technology
>> Austin Community College
>> (512) 223-4758
>> mailto:Baldwin at DickBaldwin.com
>> http://www.austincc.edu/baldwin/
>
>
>
> --
> Richard G. Baldwin (Dick Baldwin)
> Home of Baldwin's on-line Java Tutorials
> http://www.DickBaldwin.com
>
> Professor of Computer Information Technology
> Austin Community College
> (512) 223-4758
> mailto:Baldwin at DickBaldwin.com
> http://www.austincc.edu/baldwin/
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