[Blindmath] books in accessible format (was: Typing in Nemeth Braille)

Ken Perry kperry at blinksoft.com
Mon Sep 16 13:43:55 UTC 2013 

Actually this is what APH does.  There are probably other companies but APH is a non profit company that does exactly this.

Ken

-----Original Message-----
From: Blindmath [mailto:blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of John G. Heim
Sent: Monday, September 16, 2013 9:26 AM
To: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics
Subject: [Blindmath] books in accessible format (was: Typing in Nemeth Braille)

Do you know about Learning Ally and Bookshare? The company you describe doesn't sound very different from Learning Ally and some of what Bookshare does would overlap as well. I let my Learning Ally membership expire 20 years ago. It was calledRFBD back then. But they used to send me textbooks in a digital format on diskette.  So they might have worked out the whole mathematical symbol thing by now. But I wouldn't know. 
Bookshare operates under an exception in United States copyright law. So they don't have everything and not everything they have is available internationally. Even so, it would probably be a lot easier to with one of these organizations to tweak their existing infrastructure rather than start from scratch on your own.


On 09/16/13 03:38, I. C. Bray wrote:
> Michael,
>
> Is there any means by which NFB members could join together and form a 
> publishing company whereby we accept materials and products and 
> produce the accessible materials for the originating manufacturers?
> As an example,  Say NFB-Media were to either hire or contract 
> organizations who already produce accessible materials specifically 
> for the blind and would be paid by the Manufacturers for doing it for them?
> This way, we the blind consumers are directly producing what we need.  
> Our own standards of accessability are met, Companies are given 
> proven, accessible materials to distribute as needed, and the 
> NFB-Publishing are granted royalty for the distribution of said 
> working / proven materials, and Manufacturers  are able to concentrate 
> on the functionality while we make sure to communicate it appropriately.
>
> I mean, perhaps I am dreaming here, but is that really too much to manage?
>
> Rather than constantly be inopposition, be an active means to a solution.
>
> Ok... now... discuss.
>
> Respectfully,
> Ian  C. Bray
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Michael Whapples" <mwhapples at aim.com>
> To: "Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics"
> <blindmath at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Monday, September 16, 2013 3:45 AM
> Subject: Re: [Blindmath] Typing in Nemeth Braille
>
>
> :I am not sure I want to encourage just debate about why, after all
> : action would be better.
> :
> : One thing which is slightly shocking, certainly concerning is that 
> the
> : Coalition of e-reader manufacturers have sought a waiver from the 
> FCC to
> : be exempt from the accessibility requirements of the Communications 
> and
> : Video Accessibility Act (http://techpolicy.acm.org/blog/?p=3177). I
> : think we can all draw conclusions from this...
> :
> : I understand various organisations, including the NFB, have provided
> : comments to the FCC.
> :
> : We all need to appreciate that math accessibility for the blind is
> : normally only a small concern out of many for any individual company
> : involved in making technical documents accessible and that for a 
> good
> : solution it will require multiple companies to cooperate. As an 
> example,
> : just to read a PDF on your computer, it requires the PDF reader (eg.
> : Adobe reader) to be made accessible, but that will require suitable
> : support in the accessibility API of the platform it is run on (most
> : likely Windows, so some support from Microsoft), and then the screen
> : reader would need to support the math accessibility, and then this 
> all
> : will only work if the provider of the PDF document actually bothers 
> to
> : tag the document suitably. This is not to say math accessibility is 
> not
> : important, but rather its not necessarily at the top of their lists 
> of
> : priorities and we all probably have a responsibility to remind them 
> that
> : math accessibility is important and that it might be a deciding 
> factor
> : in your purchasing of software.
> :
> : May be as individuals we might have little affect, but if colleges 
> and
> : universities are faced with needing to make their courses accessible 
> to
> : us as individuals, then their purchasing decisions may be affected 
> and
> : then that might be something significant to some of these
> : manufacturers/publishers.
> :
> : Michael Whapples
> : On 16/09/2013 00:06, sabra1023 wrote:
> : > These books can be made accessible in a digital format for a lot 
> cheaper then a hardcopy transcription, and maybe the publishers even 
> have it the books and an accessible format. However, if you try to get 
> the book digitally from them, they will give you a PDF, which you 
> cannot fully access. I think that we are having these access issues 
> because a big portion of the cited population believes that blind 
> people have no right to expect success and Matt. I keep hearing all 
> the time that math is just too visual and that the best blind people 
> can expect is to learn basic algebra, but my experience with Matt has 
> shown me that math and itself isn't visual. Sighted people might feel 
> the most comfortable with a visual representation, but that in no way 
> means the subject itself is visual. Also, I've known plenty of blind 
> people who went way past calculus and use their skills in engineering 
> and computer science. If publishers thought about accessibility from 
> the beginning, it wouldn't be extremely difficult or costly to make 
> sure that blind people as well as other populations can have access to math electronic text.
> : >
> : > On Sep 15, 2013, at 11:49 AM, Mike Jolls <mrspock56 at hotmail.com> wrote:
> : >
> : >> Does your software also back-translate it from Nemeth back to 
> standard English so that a teacher can get the completed homework from 
> the student, open it up inWord or some other standard application, and 
> read it in symbols they understand as a sighted person?
> : >>
> : >>
> : >>> From: pmw at mega-data.com
> : >>> To: blindmath at nfbnet.org
> : >>> Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2013 12:20:59 -0400
> : >>> Subject: Re: [Blindmath] Typing in Nemeth Braille
> : >>>
> : >>> Getting the diagrams in tactile form (using encapsulated "swell"
> paper) is a great help in math.  I have prepared tactile diagrams for 
> several VI students that I work with, and they have found the diagrams 
> to be extremely helpful.  I put a small amount of Braille on the 
> diagrams (just enough to be able to create a separate legend with more 
> information about the diagram).
> : >>>
> : >>> Re writing your math homework:  I am currently working on some 
> software that would allow you to create and edit your math homework in 
> Nemeth Braille.  It's not quite ready for testing yet, however.  I 
> will make an announcement when it is ready, because I will be looking 
> for students in math or math-intensive science courses to test this software.
> : >>>
> : >>>
> : >>> -----Original Message-----
> : >>> From: sabra1023 [mailto:sabra1023 at gmail.com]
> : >>> Sent: Sunday, September 15, 2013 2:18 AM
> : >>> To: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics
> : >>> Cc: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics
> : >>> Subject: Re: [Blindmath] Typing in Nemeth Braille
> : >>>
> : >>> All I know is that I write my math homework in Microsoft Word. I 
> have to be reading with a braille display, and everything needs to be 
> linear, not multidimensional. Also, my brain can't think correctly if 
> I have to work from right to left. I don't know if those math needs 
> are common among blind people, but you could try them to see if it 
> helps. Oh, and another thing is that it might help to get text 
> descriptions of diagrams and represent things algebraically rather then graphically as much as possible.
> : >>>
> : >>> On Sep 15, 2013, at 1:03 AM, "I. C. Bray" <i.c.bray at win.net> wrote:
> : >>>
> : >>>> Neil,
> : >>>> Well, I am going to need to use something, and I have been 
> putting off
> : >>>> deciding until I get some idea what's out there and what makes 
> sence for me.
> : >>>> I don't want to have to learn 5 new programs and try to keep 
> the
> : >>>> command & control sets seperate...
> : >>>> I've been reading the BlindMath ListServ and hearing the 
> difficulties
> : >>>> and am just hoping I collect enough info and various ways to 
> approach
> : >>>> my own Math, Science, and Teaching needs now that I'm blind.
> : >>>>
> : >>>> OH, Side note question.
> : >>>> Is the Blind Science listserv not active??  I Joined the list, 
> and do
> : >>>> not think I got any replies...
> : >>>>
> : >>>> Ian
> : >>>> ----- Original Message -----
> : >>>> From: "Neil Soiffer" <NeilS at dessci.com>
> : >>>> To: "Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics"
> : >>>> <blindmath at nfbnet.org>
> : >>>> Sent: Sunday, September 15, 2013 1:52 AM
> : >>>> Subject: Re: [Blindmath] Typing in Nemeth Braille
> : >>>>
> : >>>>
> : >>>> : You can also use MathType with Word and then use Duxbury to
> : >>>> translate to
> : >>>> : Nemeth.  Like Scientific notebook, with MathType you just 
> type the
> : >>>> math in
> : >>>> : using an easy math editor. If you are a familiar with Word, 
> it is
> : >>>> probably
> : >>>> : a better option than getting Scientific Notebook and having 
> to learn that.
> : >>>> : MathType is just a math editor and so is a lot cheaper than
> : >>>> Scientific
> : >>>> : notebook.  Your school might already have a site license 
> [full
> disclosure:
> : >>>> : my company makes MathType]
> : >>>> :
> : >>>> : Neil Soiffer
> : >>>> : Senior Scientist
> : >>>> : Design Science, Inc.
> : >>>> : www.dessci.com
> : >>>> : ~ Makers of MathType, MathFlow, MathPlayer, MathDaisy, 
> Equation
> : >>>> Editor ~
> : >>>> :
> : >>>> :
> : >>>> :
> : >>>> : On Sat, Sep 14, 2013 at 5:46 PM, Allan Mesoga
> : >>>> <allan.mesoga at gmail.com>wrote:
> : >>>> :
> : >>>> : > You can also use scientific notebook and save it as latex 
> and open
> : >>>> it
> : >>>> : > using duxbury then translate.
> : >>>> : >
> : >>>> : > On 9/10/13, Sharon O'Neill <soneill1 at haverford.edu> wrote:
> : >>>> : > > Hi Gabriela:  were you able to find an answer to the 
> Nemeth
> : >>>> Braille
> : >>>> : > > software question?  I see they directed you to the fellow 
> that
> : >>>> has
> : >>>> : > revamped
> : >>>> : > > the nfbnet list for blindmath.  Were you able to contact him?
> : >>>> : > >
> : >>>> : > > I would be very interested in what he suggested.
> : >>>> : > >
> : >>>> : > > Regards,
> : >>>> : > >
> : >>>> : > > Sheri
> : >>>> : > >
> : >>>> : > >
> : >>>> : > > On Fri, Aug 2, 2013 at 4:25 PM, Gabriela Moats
> : >>>> <gmoats at haverford.edu>
> : >>>> : > > wrote:
> : >>>> : > >
> : >>>> : > >> Hi all,
> : >>>> : > >> I need to make raised tactile images that contain labels 
> with
> : >>>> math
> : >>>> : > >> symbols for a blind student and he would like them to be 
> typed
> : >>>> in Nemeth
> : >>>> : > >> Braille. Usually I just type them in SimBraille font and 
> then
> : >>>> feed it
> : >>>> : > >> through an embosser so that the dots become raised 
> Braille, but
> : >>>> I need
> : >>>> : > to
> : >>>> : > >> be able to type in Nemeth Braille for this science course.
> Does
> : >>>> anyone
> : >>>> : > >> know
> : >>>> : > >> of a software program or font I can download that would 
> allow
> : >>>> me to do
> : >>>> : > >> this?
> : >>>> : > >>
> : >>>> : > >> Thank you,
> : >>>> : > >>
> : >>>> : > >> Gabriela
> : >>>> : > >>
> : >>>> : > >> --
> : >>>> : > >> Gabriela Echavarría Moats
> : >>>> : > >> Special Assignment Coordinator of Accommodations
> : >>>> : > >> Office of Disabilities Services
> : >>>> : > >> Haverford College
> : >>>> : > >> Stokes Hall 118F
> : >>>> : > >> gmoats at haverford.edu
> : >>>> : > >> _______________________________________________
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--
---
John G. Heim, 608-263-4189, jheim at math.wisc.edu

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