[Blindmath] I'm Dying Here

Tue May 20 07:51:48 UTC 2014

I absolutely agree, just what I wanted to say. Things have their names, and
those names were chosen way back in time for a good reason.
Besides when writing a scientific report or something of the same sort, then
may be not in all but in some cases students are assessed on scientific
language. Therefore, it is probably a good idea to teach students for this
manner of speaking (regardless of blind or sighted) and not invent new
phrases.
I don't mind pointing at things if the lecturer prefers that and finds it
useful for most students until proper language is used.

Bests,
Dan

-----Original Message-----
From: Blindmath [mailto:blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Lewicki,
Maureen via Blindmath
Sent: Monday, May 19, 2014 2:19 PM
To: 'sabra1023'; 'Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics'
Subject: Re: [Blindmath] I'm Dying Here

Things have names, and we should use them for everyone's benefit; integer,
divisor, quotient, can all be referred to as 'this.' It might seem to slow
things down, but perhaps it would clarify the concepts. Clarity is what
educators strive for.

Maureen Murphy Lewicki
Maureen Murphy Lewicki
 Teacher of Visually Impaired
Bethlehem Central School
332 Kenwood AvenueDelmar, NY 12054
http://bethlehemschools.org
(518) 439-7460
Fax (518) 475-0092
"The real problem of blindness is not the loss of eyesight.  The real
problem is the misunderstanding and lack of education that exists.  If a
blind person has the proper training and opportunity, blindness can be
reduced to a mere physical nuisance."Kenneth Jernigan

-----Original Message-----
From: Blindmath [mailto:blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of sabra1023
via Blindmath
Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2014 3:44 PM
To: Jon Yaggie
Cc: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics
Subject: Re: [Blindmath] I'm Dying Here

I'm not suggesting that pointing should be eliminated, and people can
actually understand things without pointing. Cited people just think they
need Poyning for everything. Not everybody learns math the same way, and to
say that the majority of math classes are doing this, so we should stick
with it, is wrong. Americans actually don't rank very highly in math at all,
so that should tell us we should be doing something different, not with the
majority is doing.

> On May 18, 2014, at 4:37 AM, Jon Yaggie <jyaggi2 at uic.edu> wrote:
> 
> While i agree articulation is important, in math classes a vast majority
of students could not understand a clearly articulated instruction without
pointing.  I do not think this is a fault of the student or teacher but some
thing more systematic in math education.  Also there is not a difference in
learning to think as a mathematician and doing math.  Learning procedure
solely will never be sufficient to sustain one very far.  The thought
process is essential and includes but is not limited to being able to solve
the problems on a test.  After all ideally you will be able to apply these
concepts when you are faced with problems not in your textbook.  
> 
> Jon Yaggie
> EYH Volunteer Coordinator
> UIC Mathematics
> 
>> On May 17, 2014, at 23:10, sabra1023 via Blindmath <blindmath at nfbnet.org>
wrote:
>> 
>> I'm sorry Andrew. I agree with John on this one. I don't think it's 
>> likely that people come to your class to learn how you think as a 
>> mathematician. They're there to learn math. Maybe they're just taking 
>> a required course. Further, I think that clear articulation helps 
>> sighted people understand what you're talking about. There have been 
>> some totally blind mathematicians also, and that proves you don't 
>> have to think visually to be one. Additionally, if you talk about 
>> what you're going to do before you actually do the problem, you can 
>> help your students more easily identify if they're missing background 
>> knowledge that they need to understand the problem. For example, if 
>> you first explain that you will use the quadratic formula instead of 
>> factoring to solving equation, that tells your students that by now, 
>> they should know what factoring is and they should know with the 
>> quadratic formula is. If they don't, there is a problem. Now, let's 
>> say that you dive into the problem with
 out
>> being clear about what you're doing. Some of your students might know
that they don't understand, but they might not know why. Do they not
understand the current material? Or do they not understand because they're
missing something they shouldn't previously had? Also, if you're clear about
what you're doing, students will recognize exactly when they don't
understand. Textbooks usually don't verbalize or explain the steps that they
do either, so your students are depending on you to do this.
>> 
>>> On May 17, 2014, at 9:42 PM, John Gardner via Blindmath
<blindmath at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Andrew you say: " Not only do I think it good pedagogically but as a 
>>> mathematician then it's how I think so why would I want to deprive 
>>> the students of that insight?"
>>> JAG: First of all Andrew, you are incorrect that it is good
pedagogically.
>>> A large minority, sometimes estimated at 40% of the population are 
>>> primarily audio learners.  So while your pedagogy is good for 60% of 
>>> your class, it is bad for the rest.  I presume you want to use good 
>>> pedagogy for the whole class. If you are following maureen's advice, 
>>> you are making your lecture accessible to both visual and audio 
>>> learners.  And while this may be the way you think as a 
>>> mathematician, not all mathematicians think alike (God knows!). I 
>>> suspect that there are even mathematicians who do not instantly grasp
everything visually.
>>> 
>>> In my experience since losing my sight, I can easily distinguish 
>>> excellent lecturers from the others.  The excellent lecturers 
>>> unconsciously make the lecture accessible to everybody.
>>> 
>>> Except for visual jokes.  
>>> 
>>> Just trying to help.
>>> 
>>> John
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Blindmath [mailto:blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of 
>>> Andrew Stacey via Blindmath
>>> Sent: Saturday, May 17, 2014 11:38 AM
>>> To: Blindmath
>>> Subject: Re: [Blindmath] I'm Dying Here
>>> 
>>>> On Sat, May 17, 2014 at 06:16:27AM +0100, Blindmath wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Just could not miss a comment on what Maureen said with regards the 
>>>> communication. I seriously can not stand when some of the lecturers 
>>>> are saying especially my favourite 'You move this guy here 
>>>> upstairs.'. I
>>> mean...
>>>> come on!
>>>> If you are a researcher you could really put the effort in saying 
>>>> substitute the variable x, y into the expression in the numerator...
>>> 
>>> I'm not letting that go!
>>> 
>>> I will accept the point that if there is a blind person in the 
>>> lecture hall then I should be more careful about explicitly naming 
>>> things.  But if there isn't, then I'm going to thump the board and 
>>> say things like "Now take this <thump> and put it there <thump> and 
>>> see what happens".  Not only do I think it good pedagogically but as 
>>> a mathematician then it's how I think so why would I want to deprive the
students of that insight?
>>> 
>>> Andrew
>>> 
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>> 
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