[Blindmath] braille code changes and nemeth

Sun Mar 22 03:08:09 UTC 2015

That is what I was saying. But they were all saying that no one is going to use it and that they don't want to use it, so they can just decide not to. 2016. That's what I thought, but I wasn't sure if it was 2016 or 2018. I haven't learned yet, but other people are saying it isn't that hard. They're also saying that math will stay the same. I think in Texas vision teachers are being trained to use it too.

Sabra Ewing

> On Mar 21, 2015, at 3:34 PM, David Andrews via Blindmath <blindmath at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Why are you folks debating something that is a done deal.  The publishers in North America will start using UEB.  In Minnesota, where I live, transcribers are being trained in UEB as are teachers of the blind and visually impaired. We will require transcribers to use it, starting in 2016, actually, I think they will start using it this fall.
> 
> Dave\
> 
> At 01:34 PM 3/20/2015, you wrote:
>> The last point, regarding the lack of authority for the Braille
>> Authority is interesting--I didn't know that.
>> I for one would be happy to disregard the new rules and just stick to
>> the original ones, which is what I will continue to do.
>> I wonder though how many publishers will really pay attention to the
>> Braille Authority?
>> I mean any change will take years and if it makes life more
>> complicated for the transcribers, I can guarantee that most publishers
>> will be happy enough to stick to the original system, no matter how
>> much some individuals or organizations might insist that the UEB is
>> better--which I don't think it is.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On 3/20/15, Sean Tikkun via Blindmath <blindmath at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> > I think your friend brings up good point, but I have more concern with
>> > representations of operation. Numbers as a raised or lowered dot is not that
>> > complex to adjust to. The different symbols in terms of operations however
>> > are a much larger change.
>> >
>> > Sean
>> >
>> >> On Mar 20, 2015, at 9:31 AM, HPS via Blindmath <blindmath at nfbnet.org>
>> >> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Hi, I like to pick anyones brain on the proposed changes to the braille
>> >> code. I do not read braille but my daughter does, so in her behalf I'm
>> >> trying to get involved in finding out the pros and cons on this issue. I
>> >> have an acquaintance that has some good points and I'm sharing her take on
>> >> it below.
>> >> Thanks
>> >> Heidi
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Regarding the braille code changes
>> >> and  math, I think that several things
>> >> are going on that are causing people
>> >> not to react much. For one thing, the
>> >> Braille Authority of North America seems
>> >> to be good and reassuring people
>> >> that the Nemeth Code will be retained, and so
>> >> they have nothing to worry
>> >> about. What they are not saying in the same breath,
>> >> though, is that the
>> >> plan is for the Nemeth codeto be mixed in with Unified
>> >> English Braille.
>> >> Right now, when students encounter a math book, they will
>> >> find that the
>> >> entire book is transcribed using the Nemeth code, meaning that
>> >> numbers,
>> >> operation signs  such as the plus sign, and such look the same
>> >> throughout
>> >> the book, whether they appear in mathematical expressions or in the
>> >> text
>> >> surrounding those expressions. What is being proposed now is that the
>> >>
>> >> Nemeth code only be used for mathematical terms/expressions in those
>> >> books,
>> >> while Unified English Braille will be used for the rest of the
>> >> material in the
>> >> book. Since Nemeth and UEB have very different
>> >> representations for
>> >> mathematical symbols,  and even numbers are not the
>> >> same in the two codes, it
>> >> seems like this will create a much more
>> >> complicated system for students to
>> >> wait through or for transcribers to
>> >> create. Furthermore, there will have to be
>> >> an extra braille
>> >> character or two every time there is a switch between UEB and
>> >>
>> >> Nemeth. Imagine, for example,
>> >>
>> >> Let x be the number of nuts in the bowl.
>> >> After Jerry eats 1/4 of the
>> >> nuts, there are 15 nuts left. How many nuts did
>> >> Jerry eat?
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> In this kind of work problem, the terms x, 1/4, and 15 BE
>> >> considered
>> >> mathematical and would appear in mathematical expressions that are
>> >> used to
>> >> solve the problem. According to the guidance asked
>> >>
>> >> http://www.brailleauthority.org/ueb/nemeth-provisional/guidance.pdf, the
>> >>
>> >> fraction 1/4 in this problem will need to be written in Nemeth code,,
>> >>
>> >> preceded and followed by the appropriate indicators, while the number 15
>> >>
>> >> will be written in UEB.
>> >>
>> >> Another issue is that people seem to think that
>> >> braille code changes are
>> >> inevitable, not knowing that the Braille Authority
>> >> does not actually have
>> >> legal authority. They simply represent the consensus of
>> >> representatives
>> >> from a number of consumer, transcriber, and braille production
>> >>
>> >> organizations or companies. So, they have power only as long as the
>> >> masses
>> >>
>> >> agree to follow them.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
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>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
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>> >
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> Thank you.
> 
>        David Andrews and long white cane Harry.
> E-Mail:  dandrews at visi.com or david.andrews at nfbnet.org
> 
> 
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