[Blindmath] A query about accessibility through a screen reader of mathematical content

Wed Apr 13 01:51:09 UTC 2016

I do know a couple, but the one I think of first couldn't do it if that 3d line image was put onto a 2d medium like a tactile image on a piece of paper as sighted people would use for things like technical drawings. This is an Electrical Engineering graduate here in NZ I'm thinking of.
Jonathan

-----Original Message-----
From: Blindmath [mailto:blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Amanda Lacy via Blindmath
Sent: Wednesday, 13 April 2016 1:35 p.m.
To: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics
Cc: Amanda Lacy
Subject: Re: [Blindmath] A query about accessibility through a screen reader of mathematical content

Sabra, I don't think I know a single congenitally blind person who understands 3D drawings.

On 4/12/16, Pranav Lal via Blindmath <blindmath at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Hi Sabra,
>
> I have the same problem. The reason for this is that many blind people 
> are not used to sighted graphics conventions.
>
> Pranav
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Blindmath [mailto:blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of 
> Sabra Ewing via Blindmath
> Sent: Tuesday, April 12, 2016 8:54 PM
> To: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics 
> <blindmath at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: Sabra Ewing <sabra1023 at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Blindmath] A query about accessibility through a screen 
> reader of mathematical content
>
> They have that in America to, but for some reason, I can't read them 
> unless the pictures were very simple like a very simple graph. For 
> complicated images, I can only understand three-dimensional things. 
> For example, if you gave me a tactile picture of a dog, I would have 
> no idea what it was, but if you gave me a plastic model of a dog, I 
> would know what it was. Other blind people seem to be fine with the 
> tactile pictures though, but I don't know why.
>
> Sabra Ewing
>
>> On Apr 12, 2016, at 1:21 AM, Niels Luithardt via Blindmath
> <blindmath at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Sabra,
>>
>> i have a question:
>>
>> what about Fuser .  tactile Modells with special paper. In Germany we 
>> often use it.
>>
>> Niels
>>
>> 2016-04-12 5:10 GMT+02:00, Sabra Ewing via Blindmath
>> <blindmath at nfbnet.org>:
>>> I think most blind people just read it before they compiled. After 
>>> they compiled, it is for a sighted person so they don't care if they 
>>> can read
> it.
>>> As for a screen reader that would read math the best, I would 
>>> suggest NVDA.
>>> It is free. Also, there is the Pearson equation editor, which is 
>>> designed for braille users. It is much more natural to use and you 
>>> don't have to deal with constant errors from trying to compile, but 
>>> fullscreen reduce port isn't here for that yet. I believe that 
>>> braille support is the most important, especially for higher-level 
>>> math, so I am glad they started with that. If you are fine with 
>>> reading in braille and using a screen reader doesn't matter as much, 
>>> you could try that. Sighted people like their math so different then 
>>> the way we like ours that it is really hard to have something where 
>>> you can read and write in the same format. To get in the way sighted 
>>> people like it, the program has to convert it to a different format 
>>> or you have to do that by compiling something. If you just want to 
>>> read equations for your own use, you can just write them The normal 
>>> way that they always are. Well, I suppose for us it is the normal 
>>> way and for sighted people is the abnormal way. Computers like our 
>>> way better anyways, so it really makes more sense just to leave them 
>>> if you are writing them for yourself. Maybe there is a way for a 
>>> program to convert what you wrote into an object and then put 
>>> alternative text in the object so that you can read what you have 
>>> written and sighted people think it is the way they like it, But 
>>> now, we have just reached the stage where you no longer have to 
>>> write in computer braille. You can do your math in the way that you 
>>> learned to read it, andyou can make it look good for sighted 
>>> colleagues and professors, but yet at the stage where it translates 
>>> back and forth so seamlessly that you feel like you can read it all 
>>> the time and sighted people feel like it looks good all the time. 
>>> Now you can at least produce correctly formatted equations without 
>>> having to know a programming language though. I don't know what has 
>>> happened because we haven't had any math or science technology apart 
>>> from a tactile drawing board for blind people for like 50 years and 
>>> now all the sudden, things are taking off, so what you want will probably exist in the near future.
>>> So you can wait for that while I wait for more seamless 3-D printing 
>>> technology. I had to specifically avoid a biology class that 
>>> involved identifying plant cells and other things with a microscope. 
>>> I had thought we could simply order some three dimensional models 
>>> and I can just use those, but they don't exist and they have so many 
>>> details that they are too hard to make by hand. What you want is 
>>> probably coming before my pocket sized, Affordable 3-D printer with 
>>> accessible image capturing technology though. Then, I could just 
>>> bring it to class, take a picture of the plant cell, and a little 
>>> drawer with the
> three-dimensional image inside would pop up in a few seconds later. 
> Sorry, I'm getting way off topic. That is all I have though. There 
> could be something else I don't know about.
>>>
>>> Sabra Ewing
>>>
>>>> On Apr 11, 2016, at 9:35 AM, Saaqib Mahmuud via Blindmath 
>>>> <blindmath at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hello to everyone at the BlindMath mailing list.
>>>>
>>>> I have the following query.
>>>>
>>>> These days, I'm using WinEdit 9.1 and MikeTex 2.9.5845 for 
>>>> typesetting mathematical documents.
>>>>
>>>> After typing in my content, I press Alt + A to go to the 
>>>> Accessories menu, followed by ENTER to activate the Compile menu 
>>>> item. I've just learnt that the desired keystroke is F9.
>>>>
>>>> The above procedure produces a PDF file with the mathematical 
>>>> content with the formatting I'd done using the LATEX commands.
>>>>
>>>> Now my question is, is the mathematical content of this PDF file 
>>>> going to be accessible (and, if so, to what extent?) to a blind 
>>>> user through a screen reading program such as JAWS, NVDA, or WinEyes?
>>>>
>>>> Would this PDF file emboss correctly into braille if I emboss it 
>>>> directly using a braille embosser such as the Index Braille's 
>>>> Everest-D V4 braille embosser?
>>>>
>>>> Which screen reader does the best job of making the mathematical 
>>>> content thus created accessible to a blind person?
>>>> Please be sure to reply to the above questions in a thorough enough 
>>>> manner as your input will help make maths accessible for the blind 
>>>> of an under-developed region!
>>>>
>>>> Regards.
>>>>
>>>> Sincerely,
>>>> Saaqib Mahmood,
>>>> Lecturer in Mathematics,
>>>> Govt. Postgrad. College (GPGC) No. 1, Abbottabad, PAKISTAN Kund 
>>>> Malyaar, Muhallah Musa Zai, Nawan Shehr, Abbottabad, PAKISTAN
>>>> Phone: +92-346-952-7638 (mobile), +92-334-541-7958 (mobile + 
>>>> WhatsApp +
>>>> Viber)
>>>> Skype: saaqib.mahmood
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
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