[Blindmath] {Spam?} Re: Reintroducing myself and beta test opportunity for new STEM accessibility service.

Aqil Sajjad aqilsajjad at gmail.com
Wed Feb 8 22:50:38 UTC 2017 

Another alternative is to convert LaTex to word in the Math Type format, 
which can then be read by NVDA. There are at least 2 conversion tools out 
there for this purpose. I recommend the one by Grind eq:
http://grindeq.com/index.php?p=latex2word

There is another one by a company called Chikri. But with that, the 
references and bibliography don't seem to come through properly, unless I am 
missing how to make it happen. Still, here is the URL:
http://word2tex.com/

MathML is also a good option. Whether you want to convert to MathML or to 
word for reading purpose is essentially a matter of preference.

On a different note, are there any tools for converting MathML to Math Type 
word or vice versa?

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Łukasz Grabowski via Blindmath" <blindmath at nfbnet.org>
To: <blindmath at nfbnet.org>
Cc: "Łukasz Grabowski" <graboluk at gmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, February 08, 2017 4:27 PM
Subject: Re: [Blindmath] {Spam?} Re: Reintroducing myself and beta test 
opportunity for new STEM accessibility service.


> Let me add that In addition to LaTeX Access, or perhaps instead of it,
> it is very convenient to use latexml which converts LaTeX to HTML with
> MathML, and this can be then read by NVDA.
>
> Best,
> Łukasz
>
> On Wed, 8 Feb 2017 21:22:11 +0000
> Dániel Hajas via Blindmath <blindmath at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>
>> Hi Russell,
>>
>> Let me start with XML as Jason covered it rather well. The point is,
>> that as long as you can convert the xml format into html including
>> MathML, it can be read by screen readers given they support MathML.
>> For instance JFW and Voice Over does. This case both speech and
>> braille should be rendered fine, disregarding minor issues that are
>> inevitable in software development. You would typically open these
>> documents in a web browser. However editing these documents are more
>> difficult due to the nature of xml tags. Also, I am not aware of too
>> many xml to html+MathML convertors that are easy to use out of the
>> box.
>>
>> Now LaTeX is just an other markup language. Normally this is the
>> preferred language for writing publications, books, as it is easy to
>> edit and also can be compiled into pdf files with chosen style
>> sheets. It is more likely that authors that wrote their books after
>> the 90s, will have done that in LaTeX. It is usually the publisher
>> who transforms LaTeX sources into XML for further processing, e.g.
>> Daisy, or ePub.
>>
>> Also, even though authors with books written after the 90s can have a
>> personal LaTeX copy, they might be hesitant to share these source
>> code files, as in theory it could be edited and re published. In my
>> case, we managed to get books from kind authors one of our faculty
>> member knew as a friend or colleague and personally guaranteed that
>> the copy won’t be distributed or misused.
>>
>> These LaTeX source codes can be opened in a text editor. Using
>> auxiliary software such as, the LaTeX Access the following LaTeX
>> code: \frac{2}{x} would be translated into speech and read out as “2
>> over x”. As long as LaTeX Access is configured correctly, this can be
>> achieved using JAWS, NVDA as well, both in speech and braille.
>>
>> For speech translation I am not aware of any other translation tools,
>> but for braille there are solutions like the Duxbury.
>>
>> Hope this answers some of your questions. Don’t worry, there are
>> never too many questions, just too little answers. So feel free to
>> ask more.
>>
>> Daniel
>> > On 8 Feb 2017, at 17:25, Russell Solowoniuk via Blindmath
>> > <blindmath at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> >
>> > Hi Dániel,
>> >
>> > I'm curious about your comment regarding obtaining a textbook from
>> > the author in LaTeX or xml formats. If an author is able to provide
>> > his text in either of these formats, would a student using Jaws or
>> > VoiceOver be able to read the textbook and understand all the math
>> > content within? I'm not at all familiar with LaTeX, so am not quite
>> > sure how this would work. What would be needed if a LaTeX of the
>> > text could be obtained? Math Player? Another software program? Do
>> > most authors of STEM textbooks have a LaTeX or xml format of their
>> > textbooks? Would an xml format be able to be read using a screen
>> > reader?
>> >
>> > Lots of questions, I know, but, thanks for any information you can
>> > provide.
>> >
>> > Russell
>> >
>> > Russell Solowoniuk
>> > AT Educational Assistant, Services to Students with Disabilities
>> > MacEwan University
>> > 7-198 D4, 10700-104 Ave.
>> > Edmonton, AB  T5J 4S2
>> > E: solowoniukr at macewan.ca
>> > T:  780-497-5826
>> > F:  780-497-4018
>> > macewan.ca
>> > This communication is intended for the use of the recipient to whom
>> > it is addressed and may contain confidential, personal, and/or
>> > privileged information.  Please contact me immediately if you are
>> > not the intended recipient of this communication, and do not copy,
>> > distribute, or take action relying on it.  Any communication
>> > received in error, or subsequent reply, should be deleted or
>> > destroyed. Please consider the environment before printing this
>> > email.
>> >
>> >
>> >>>> Dániel Hajas via Blindmath <blindmath at nfbnet.org> 2017-02-07
>> >>>> 4:07
>> > AM >>>
>> > Dear Lukasz,
>> >
>> > Excellent question. This is a topic that can not be fully explored
>> > within an e-mail but let me perhaps give a few key points that
>> > worked for me:
>> > * First and foremost, let*s establish that screen magnification and
>> > screen reading have very different requirements, which of course can
>> > often complement each other.
>> > * For writing, reading and editing mathematical content, let it be
>> > lecture notes, assessments and so on, I believe it is inevitable to
>> > be familiar the LaTeX markup language, and for screen reading
>> > purposes use for instance the LaTeX Access Project under Windows,
>> > which I am most people from this list are familiar with. It is good
>> > practise to provide lecture notes in LaTeX for this reason, which I
>> > know some UK Maths and Physics departments do.
>> > * I think it is also very important to have a basic understanding of
>> > how for instance JAWS for Windows and Voice Over can read MathML
>> > content, or other screen readers using products like MathPlayer by
>> > Design Science; and be aware of online resources such as, DLMF
>> > (Digital Library of Mathematical Functions) developed by NIST,
>> > which provide high-level content both in LaTeX and MathML formats.
>> > * Finding accessible mathematics books is a different chapter, often
>> > very difficult. Approaching authors, perhaps instead of publishers
>> > might speed up and increase chances of finding alternative formats
>> > of eBooks such as, LaTeX or XML instead of PDF. Daisy with MathML
>> > is an option, but I haven*t seen many examples for that yet.
>> > * It is good practise to have a high-standard calculator, e.g. the
>> > APH + Orbit Research developed Orion Texas Instrument audio-graphing
>> > display calculator. Equally, it is important to do these sort of
>> > computations or graph sketching on non GUI programmes, such as
>> > Python. The audio graphing calculator or alternative sonification
>> > software such as the vOICe can help students visualise the shape
>> > and trends of curves, functions, limits. While using Python or
>> > other interpreted languages enable students to sketch their own
>> > graphs fairly easily and have higher control over the output, than
>> > for instance Ms Excel, which on occasions might be a little
>> > inconvenient for this purpose.
>> > * Tactile Graphics embossers such as View+ Technologies provides can
>> > also help in the students understanding of graphs; however, this is
>> > something that needs practise and a fair amount of time to learn to
>> > use.
>> > * Obviously, not only the technical but the human support element is
>> > also rather relevant to be successful as a vision impaired maths or
>> > STEM student. Standards such as extra time for exams, assessments,
>> > additional office hours or someone who can help with taking notes
>> > from the blackboard if appropriate and necessary. We can not ignore
>> > the fact, that no matter how fluent someone is in using any of the
>> > above technical solutions, it will always take longer to view, or
>> > read, write a markup language, a graph etc.
>> >
>> > There are additional software solutions and accessibility concerns
>> > for instance with regards to the Infty Project to OCR mathematical
>> > documents in order to access further resources, or the often quoted
>> > accessibility questions around mathematical software such as
>> > MatLab, Wolfram Mathematica  etc. How efficient these technologies
>> > are always a question one needs to evaluate.
>> >
>> > As I said this is just scraping the top of the ice-mountain, and
>> > there are many details, other options; but I hope this is a good
>> > overview for a starter and can trigger some further questions,
>> > conversations.  The above are my practises, experiences from the
>> > few years of being a blind scientist and I am sure, as many
>> > students, teachers, educators, support workers there are concerned
>> > in this field, there are just as many, slightly different ways of
>> > approaching the same challenge.
>> >
>> > Daniel
>> >> On 6 Feb 2017, at 23:00, *ukasz Grabowski via Blindmath
>> > <blindmath at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Dear Daniel,
>> >>
>> >> This is not directly related to your email to blindmath email
>> >> group.
>> > I'm
>> >> a maths lecturer at Lancaster university (sighted). I was
>> >> wondering
>> > if
>> >> you could tell me how do you learn advanced, university level,
>> > maths?
>> >>
>> >> I'm preparing some accessible lecture notes for a visually impaired
>> >> student at my institution. She currently reads the lecture notes
>> >> on
>> > a
>> >> very high zoom level, but I'd be very keen to hear from succesful
>> > maths
>> >> students how do they cope, in order to potentially improve our
>> >> approach.
>> >>
>> >> Best,
>> >> Lukasz
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Mon, 6 Feb 2017 22:25:25 +0000
>> >> Dániel Hajas via Blindmath <blindmath at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> Hi Lucas, Zach,
>> >>>
>> >>> Lucas, thanks for your quick introduction. I don*t see why you
>> >>> wouldn*t be able to help as an undergraduate, especially with the
>> >>> great qualifications and skills you have been gathering during
>> >>> your degree. In fact, I would be happy if you could help with
>> >>> trying out IRIS and letting the Grapheel team know if you think
>> >>> it would
>> > assist
>> >>> you during your science learning, and if not, how it could be
>> > changed
>> >>> to be more useful. It*s great you*ve done physics and chemistry.
>> > IRIS
>> >>> currently supports maths, physics, and to a lower extent biology
>> > and
>> >>> chemistry. However, in the near future, computer science and
>> > finances
>> >>> support should be added.
>> >>>
>> >>> If you are happy to try IRIS, either let me know, or even better
>> >>> if you drop a line to contact at grapheel.com
>> >>> <mailto:contact at grapheel.com>, and I am sure the IRIS developers
>> > will
>> >>> get back to you soon with details.
>> >>>
>> >>> You really don*t need to thank me for proposing the initiative, I
>> >>> simply encountered challenges that I believe still need solutions,
>> >>> and we try to create these solutions in the best way we can.
>> >>>
>> >>> Zach, thanks for the enthusiastic reply, I*ll get back to you on
>> > that
>> >>> in a private message, to save the list members some irrelevant
>> >>> reading. If you don*t hear from me in the next 1-2 days, please
>> > send
>> >>> me a reminder in a private mail.
>> >>>
>> >>> Best wishes,
>> >>> Daniel
>> >>>
>> >>>> On 6 Feb 2017, at 16:11, Lucas Nadolskis via Blindmath
>> >>>> <blindmath at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Hello Dr. Hajas.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> I am currently a student of computer  science at the University
>> >>>> of Minnesota. I needed to take physics, and calculus   courses
>> >>>> last year and I am currently taking chemistry and linear
>> >>>> algebra. I encountered numerous issues either on the past and on
>> >>>> the current semester on accessibility on  this area of study.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> So first I want to thank you for this idea of making the study of
>> >>>> science and engineering  more accessible for blind students. If
>> > you
>> >>>> think that me as a undergraduate student may help on the project
>> >>>> I would be extremely glade to help in any ways that i can.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Thank you again.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Best regards.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Lucas Nadolskis.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> On Feb 6, 2017, at 8:04 AM, Dániel Hajas via Blindmath
>> >>>>> <blindmath at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Dear All,
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Let me reintroduce myself, as probably the memory of my person
>> >>>>> faded on this list, since I have to confess, I haven*t been
>> >>>>> posting or regularly reading the conversation going on between
>> > the
>> >>>>> BlindMath list members, even though I am signed up for a
>> >>>>> number
>> > of
>> >>>>> years and always found the knowledge exchange of the list very
>> >>>>> valuable, supportive and a friendly place. Personal and work
>> >>>>> related pressure prevented me from participating in this
>> > community
>> >>>>> in the past year, year and a half, which I wish to change now
>> >>>>> and catch up with all the unread e-mails, contribute with
>> >>>>> anything I can to new topics. As part of my reintroduction,
>> >>>>> please also
>> > allow
>> >>>>> me to bring your attention to a new STEM accessibility service.
>> >>>>> You can read more about it as well, and if you wish to
>> > participate
>> >>>>> and help shaping the service  with your feedback and insights,
>> >>>>> please let the developer team or myself know about it.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Now to the point:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> I am Daniel Hajas, a blind theoretical physicist at the
>> > University
>> >>>>> of Sussex, England; and founder of Grapheel, (www.grapheel.com)
>> >>>>> which is a initiative to enhance accessibility of science
>> >>>>> education for people with special needs, using a set of online
>> >>>>> services, hardware products and public engagement activities,
>> >>>>> partnering with other organisations to make scientific content
>> >>>>> more accessible.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> As part of the Grapheel initiative, me and a small team are
>> >>>>> designing an online, science community based image description
>> >>>>> service (called IRIS) to enhance the study experience of blind
>> > and
>> >>>>> visually impaired students in their education. Initially we
>> >>>>> would like to focus on STEM (Science, Technology, Engineering,
>> >>>>> Mathematics) education, but later expand to subjects at arts and
>> >>>>> humanities and support image descriptions of financial graphs,
>> >>>>> or wave form visualisations in music editing.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> As we are at a very early stage of development, we would highly
>> >>>>> appreciate insights and feedback from the blind community
>> > familiar
>> >>>>> with accessibility considerations and state-of-the-art products
>> >>>>> and services. In particular, I would be grateful if  members of
>> >>>>> this community could test and advise us on how to improve the
>> >>>>> service (please read more about it below). We have a feature
>> >>>>> incomplete test version, which we run in closed beta but before
>> >>>>> adding newer and new features we believe could be useful, we
>> >>>>> wish to start engaging with experienced, early adapter users,
>> >>>>> such
>> > that
>> >>>>> we can essentially build IRIS together from ground up.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> The service is very similar to initiatives such as, Be my eyes,
>> >>>>> Bespecular, TapTapSee and other; however, our service aims to
>> >>>>> focus specifically on educational needs, with a pool of
>> >>>>> volunteering experts at given academic disciplines.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> How does IRIS work?
>> >>>>> * blind or visually impaired (BVI) students upload an image of
>> >>>>> scientific content, graphs, diagrams. * BVI students select a
>> >>>>> field of study (tag) e.g. physics, maths, chemistry etc. and a
>> >>>>> level of difficulty. * BVI students can ask a specific question
>> >>>>> they would like to know about the figure. * A pool of sighted
>> >>>>> volunteers with the necessary knowledge are assigned to groups
>> >>>>> of chosen disciplines based on their user settings of
>> >>>>> competency.
>> > *
>> >>>>> When an image request is sent by a BVI student, the figure
>> > appears
>> >>>>> in a queue that all volunteers of a specific discipline can view
>> >>>>> and describe. * If a request is accepted, the volunteer should
>> >>>>> give a description of the image based on provided guidelines. *
>> >>>>> The recipient of the description can either accept the response,
>> >>>>> or ask for further clarification.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> What will I need to do as a tester?
>> >>>>> All you need to do is to log in whenever you can, upload a
>> >>>>> figure of scientific content, wait for the description and let
>> >>>>> us know what are the things you like, don*t like and suggest us
>> >>>>> new features you believe would be useful or could be done in a
>> >>>>> better way.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> If you feel you would be happy and able to help us, please let
>> >>>>> us know by getting in touch on contact at grapheel.com. Then we
>> >>>>> will send you a URL to access the service, your username,
>> >>>>> password and a *How to get started* instruction.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Best wishes,
>> >>>>> Daniel
>> >>>>> _______________________________________________
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>> >
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>> >>>>
>> >>>>
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