[Blindtlk] Greetings; Behaviors in adults blind

Marty James blindamp at q.com
Thu May 28 18:31:38 UTC 2009 

I grew up with perfect sight until I was almost 40 and I guess I am just 
different, I am a touchy person. When I talk to anyone, now or before I went 
blind, I enjoy a light touch from anyone. I am also of the mindset that 
touching another while conversing shows you are giving them your total 
concentration and even to show emotion.
Marty

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Sarah Baughn" <sarahb006 at comcast.net>
To: "NFBnet Blind Talk Mailing List" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Thursday, May 28, 2009 12:14 PM
Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Greetings; Behaviors in adults blind


>I don't know where that stereotype came from that totally blind people 
>cling to people when they talk to them, but I really resent that, because I 
>don't cling.  I really try not even to touch people unless I am close to 
>them, because I know how some people hate to be touched, and even if they 
>don't mind being touched, they don't like to be touched for a long time.
> Sarah
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "trishs" <slosser at metrocast.net>
> To: "NFBnet Blind Talk Mailing List" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, May 26, 2009 4:25 PM
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Greetings; Behaviors in adults blind
>
>
>> For my contribution, a light touch is acceptable, preferably on the 
>> elbow, as apposed to the hand or shoulder.  After all parties are 
>> introduced, just speaking the blind person's name, if necessary, is 
>> sufficient.
>> Think of it as if we were talking on the phone.  As soon as I know 
>> someone is calling, the interaction begins.  It's done effectively and 
>> successfully, lacking the visuals of facial expressions, which I can 
>> perceive any way, at least, to a degree that I can have relationships 
>> with family and friends, all-be-it with adaptations.
>> I wanted to mention that personally, it's more stressful for me, the 
>> blind person, to initiate the first contact, knowing that sighted people 
>> require, and are LOST without, eye contact.  If you're not able to see it 
>> being done, or if you're unable to roll your eyes in a direction 
>> indicating "Come with me, that way," you're immediately at a 
>> disadvantage.
>> Regarding the totally blind people clinging, I have no experience.  My 
>> only advice is do not allow yourself to feel vulnerable, insecure, or 
>> uncomfortable with others actions.
>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>From: "Weingartner, Paul" <PWeingartner at ag.org
>>>To: "NFBnet Blind Talk Mailing List" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>Date sent: Tue, 26 May 2009 09:01:44 -0500
>>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Greetings; Behaviors in adults blind
>>
>>> This is an interesting topic that is very helpful because of the
>>>candidness of the respondents.  Because of that I would like to
>> ask a
>>>question.
>>>Sighted people use eye contact to initiate communication.
>> Obviously,
>>>that does not work for initiating communication with a person who
>> is
>>>blind.  That is why it is awkward for a waitress in a restaurant
>> or for
>>>a stranger in a mall to make first contact in a way to know the
>> speaker
>>>is addressing the person who is blind.
>>>A number of totally blind friends recommend a light quick touch
>> to let
>>>them know they are the person being addressed, so that is what I
>>>recommend.  I was wondering what some or you think.
>>>Also, many people who are totally blind like to hold and cling
>> during a
>>>conversation.  That can get pretty awkward and down right
>> embarrassing a
>>>times.
>>>I would appreciate your thoughts.
>>
>>
>>>Paul Weingartner
>>>Making the Cross Accessible
>>>Center for the Blind of the Assemblies of God
>>>P 417.831.1964   F 417.862.5120
>>>www.blind.ag.org
>>>www.blindonline.ag.org
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>> [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>>On Behalf Of Steve P.  Deeley
>>>Sent: Tuesday, May 26, 2009 7:47 AM
>>>To: NFBnet Blind Talk Mailing List
>>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Greetings; Behaviors in adults blind
>>
>>>It has nothing to do with blindness in my case.  I just hate
>> being
>>>touched.
>>
>>>Steve
>>>----- Original Message -----
>>>From: "dewey bradley" <dewey.bradley at gmail.com
>>>To: "NFBnet Blind Talk Mailing List" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>Sent: Monday, May 25, 2009 8:40 PM
>>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Greetings; Behaviors in adults blind
>>
>>
>>>> Allot of sighted people think that they can't talk to us without
>>>putting
>>>> there hands on us.
>>>> The thing is allot of people like my self really hate to be
>> touched,
>>>When
>>>> we
>>>> ask them to please take there hands off, they get mad.
>>>> I guess there is no across the board answer for things like
>> this.
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Steve P.  Deeley" <stevep.deeley at insightbb.com
>>>> To: "NFBnet Blind Talk Mailing List" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>> Sent: Monday, May 25, 2009 10:42 AM
>>>> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Greetings; Behaviors in adults blind
>>
>>
>>>>> This is a very complicated topic.  There are those, like me, who
>>>don't
>>>>> like being touched during conversations with individuals I
>> really
>>>don't
>>>>> know very well.  I'm wondering if blind individuals understand
>>>spacial
>>>>> concepts during conversations.  You don't want to be too close
>> during
>>>a
>>>>> conversation or too far away.  I suspect most of us who
>> understand
>>>this
>>>>> art have had some coaching from sighted individuals whom they
>> trust.
>>>>> \
>>>>> Steve
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "trishs" <slosser at metrocast.net
>>>>> To: "NFBnet Blind Talk Mailing List" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>>> Sent: Sunday, May 24, 2009 10:46 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Greetings; Behaviors in adults blind
>>
>>
>>>>>>I was raised giving and receiving warm hand shakes, or in some
>>>>>> situations, embraces and or kisses, all of which seem to me to
>> be
>>>>>> quite germ spreading!  I like the bowing idea a lot!
>>
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>>From: Joel Zimba <jzimba at cavtel.net
>>>>>>>To: NFBnet Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>Date sent: Sat, 23 May 2009 17:08:35 -0400
>>>>>>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Greetings; Behaviors in adults blind
>>
>>>>>>>Hi,
>>
>>>>>>>I love these kinds of topics.  I believe the issue of blind or
>>>>>> sighted
>>>>>>>is mostly meaningless when it comes to whether you should touch
>>>>>> someone
>>>>>>>or not.  It comes down more to how comfortable you are with what
>>>>>> you are
>>>>>>>doing and your motivation for it.
>>
>>>>>>>The examples of folks talking with their hands is a great one.
>>>>>> It's not
>>>>>>>so much that they talk with their hands, but that touching is a
>>>>>> means of
>>>>>>>communication.  In fact, if you are comfortable enough with
>>>>>> yurself to
>>>>>>>touch someone else while speaking to them, you'll pull them into
>>>>>> your
>>>>>>>paradigm.  This is common wisdom in the sales world.
>>
>>>>>>>For the blind among us, (myself included) this is most easily
>>>>>> donw with
>>>>>>>the back of the hand and making solid contact.
>>
>>>>>>>When it comes to shaking hands, I decided to take the initiative
>>>>>> early
>>>>>>>and often.  When someone doesn't take my hand, I leave it out
>>>>>> there and
>>>>>>>then eventually start snapping my fingers.  This calls attention
>>>>>> to the
>>>>>>>fact that the other people are not playing the social game.  I
>>>>>> was
>>>>>>>taught that it is not obligatory for women to shake hands.  Long
>>>>>> ago I
>>>>>>>decided that if women want equal rights, they can do the glad
>>>>>> handing as
>>>>>>>well, so I expect them to shake and I do the snapping as well.  I
>>>>>>>sometimes let the elderly off the hook, though oddly, the older
>>>>>> someone
>>>>>>>is, the more likely they are to initiate or take my hand.  Proper
>>>>>>>conduct seems to not always be taught to the younger generation.
>>>>>> Maybe
>>>>>>>we all need to go back to finishing school.
>>
>>>>>>>Now, if someone could explain the bowing protocol to me so that
>>>>>> my Asian
>>>>>>>friends would be surprised and pleased by my manners, I would be
>>>>>> very
>>>>>>>greatful.
>>
>>>>>>>Joel
>>
>>>>>>>On 5/23/2009 12:40 PM, Jeffrey Schwartz wrote:
>>>>>>>> Hi Gerardo,
>>>>>>>> I am also blind as a result of RP and a clinical psychologist.
>>>>>> My vision
>>>>>>>> deteriorated at a different pace.  I drove a car until I was 27
>>>>>> and did not
>>>>>>>> require adaptive technology to read and write until I was about
>>>>>> 40.  Now, at
>>>>>>>> 61, I have little more than light perception.  When younger, I
>>>>>> was often
>>>>>>>> embarrassed when my wife kindly noted that someone was reaching
>>>>>> out to shake
>>>>>>>> my hand and I was not noticing.  Eventually, I learned to avoid
>>>>>> this problem
>>>>>>>> by taking the initiative.  On occasion I reach out to discover
>>>>>> that the
>>>>>>>> person has quickly turned their back or departed, no big deal.
>>>>>> I have had
>>>>>>>> no experience with the touching.  There are cultural differences
>>>>>> in such
>>>>>>>> nonverbal behaviors.  For example, cultures vary in terms of
>>>>>> what is
>>>>>>>> regarded as personal space.  Groups vary in terms of how close
>>>>>> they stand to
>>>>>>>> each other when speaking, and also with regard to touching which
>>>>>> is common
>>>>>>>> in some cultures and taboo in others.  Perhaps your blindness
>>>>>> has led you to
>>>>>>>> exceed what is common in your culture or your parents may have
>>>>>> felt bad for
>>>>>>>> you when they saw you reach out to touch someone and the person
>>>>>> had
>>>>>>>> departed.  There are also a group of behaviors known as
>>>>>> blindisms.  We all
>>>>>>>> conduct little rituals of personal hygiene when alone which we
>>>>>> would not do
>>>>>>>> in front of others.  There is a tendency, particularly if one
>>>>>> loses their
>>>>>>>> vision gradually to assume that others see as we do.  I am often
>>>>>> surprised
>>>>>>>> by what others can see.  We assume that if we can't see
>>>>>> something others can
>>>>>>>> not either.  This can lead us to embarrass ourselves by
>>>>>> performing these
>>>>>>>> grooming rituals in public.  Recently, I have noticed that when
>>>>>> I am walking
>>>>>>>> and thinking about a conversation which I had or will have with
>>>>>> someone, I
>>>>>>>> am moving my lips as if I were speaking.  I am working on
>>>>>> suppressing this
>>>>>>>> behavior as I am certain that the sighted would see it as
>>>>>> strange.  Behavior
>>>>>>>> is so ritualized, and blindness can lead us to engage in some
>>>>>> peculiar ones.
>>>>>>>> As professionals, in particular, we don't want to be seen as odd
>>>>>> or
>>>>>>>> idiosyncratic.
>>>>>>>> Jeff
>>
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>>>>>>> Behalf Of Cindy Handel
>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2009 9:55 AM
>>>>>>>> To: NFBnet Blind Talk Mailing List
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Greetings;Behaviors in adults blind
>>
>>>>>>>> Gerardo,
>>
>>>>>>>> Most of the time, when I would like to shake the hand of a
>>>>>> sighted person, I
>>
>>>>>>>> just extend my hand and they grasp it and we shake hands.
>>
>>>>>>>> As far as touching the arm of people, I've never done this.
>>>>>> When do you do
>>>>>>>> this?  If you're talking with someone, it shouldn't be
>>>>>> necessary, since
>>>>>>>> they're participating in the conversation.  I think we've all
>>>>>> experienced a
>>>>>>>> time when we're talking to someone and learn that they walked
>>>>>> away.  Now, if
>>
>>>>>>>> you're referring to touching a person's arm to make sure they're
>>>>>> still there
>>
>>>>>>>> as a way to insure that you still have their attention, that's
>>>>>> something
>>>>>>>> different.  I have met sighted people who talk with their hands
>>>>>> and touch my
>>
>>>>>>>> arm or shoulder, for emphasis.  So, that might not be so
>>>>>> unusual.
>>
>>>>>>>> Cindy
>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>>> From: "Gerardo Corripio"<gera1027 at prodigy.net.mx
>>>>>>>> To: "Blind-Talk"<blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, May 22, 2009 11:35 PM
>>>>>>>> Subject: [Blindtlk] Greetings;Behaviors in adults blind
>>
>>
>>>>>>>> Hi listers:
>>>>>>>> I'm Gerardo from Mexico; 31 years old and a Psychologist working
>>>>>> on my own
>>>>>>>> in my private practice.
>>>>>>>> Hopefully I'll be able to learn lots of great things from you
>>>>>> guys,
>>>>>>>> especially of the NFB way of viewing and living with blindness.
>>>>>>>> Now for my debut question: I've been blind all my life due to
>>>>>> RP; since I
>>>>>>>> was a teenager I remember developing a habbit of touching the
>>>>>> arm of the
>>>>>>>> people constanly to be sure he/she was still there.  I continued
>>>>>> to do this
>>>>>>>> into adulthood until my family made the observation that this
>>>>>> behavior isn't
>>>>>>>> seen well by the sighted only a few days ago.  I'm still shocked
>>>>>> by this
>>>>>>>> observation to the point that now how to know if the person is
>>>>>> still there?
>>>>>>>> Yes, the voice gives feedback but when people talk it feels as
>>>>>> if they're
>>>>>>>> there but aren't there.  How have you coped with this situation
>>>>>> in that you
>>>>>>>> have to get rid of the habbit before-mentioned? Surely it has
>>>>>> happened to
>>>>>>>> some of you?
>>>>>>>> also when shaking hands with sighted people how to find the hand
>>>>>> to shake if
>>>>>>>> the sighted person doesn't take the initiative?
>>>>>>>> As you can see I've still have lots of tips and tricks to learn
>>>>>> about
>>>>>>>> blindness, thus my interest in joining the list.
>>>>>>>> Gerardo
>>
>>
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>>
>>
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