[Blindtlk] What is Federationism?

[David Andrews]

Generally, the double message thing happens because people do a 
"reply-all" instead of simple reply.  Then you get one from the list, 
and one sent directly to you.

Dave

At 09:45 AM 5/8/2011, you wrote:

>Dear Chris,
>
>I do not understand the two messages thing.
>Be careful as I only sent the message once.
>I have been getting double messages from some people also and they 
>have not sent them.
>I am goign th run a virus check right away, maybe you should too.
>
>David Evans, NFBF and GD Jack.
>----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Nusbaum" <dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com>
>To: "Blind Talk Mailing List" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
>Sent: Saturday, May 07, 2011 9:39 PM
>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] What is Federationism?
>
>
>>Thank you, David, for that wonderful explanation!!! * Smile! No 
>>really, it was a great history lesson and one that makes me 
>>understand a lot more about the NFB philosophy.  I, too, identify 
>>with the positive philosophy of the Federation and I have now 
>>decided, from yours and other responses to my "what is 
>>Federationism" question, that I'm proud to be a Federationist and 
>>will try to be as active as I can with my age and other 
>>circumstances in the Federation! Unfortunately, I will not be able 
>>to come to the Orlando Convention because I'm going on a family 
>>vacation in North Carolina.  I know, Orlando's a tourist site, too, 
>>and one where we could take a vacation.  But I don't think some of 
>>my family members would be as excited as me about going to the NFB 
>>Convention.  They're all sighted! But I'll be sure to listen to the 
>>live stream on nfb.org.  And yes, my two friends (Nathan Clark and 
>>Jason Polansky, both from Maryland, please tell them I said hi if 
>>you see them please) are going to call me and totally rub it 
>>in.  "I'm at the national Convention in Orlando, where are you? 
>>It's so fun here!" * Smile!
>>P.S.  FYI, I got this message twice, one
>>with no subject line and from an anonemous sender with no return 
>>email address, but your signature at the end, and then a second 
>>time with your name and email.  What are you trying to do, keep 
>>secrets from me? Just kidding, * smile!
>>
>>Chris Nusbaum
>>
>>"A loss of sight, never a loss of vision!" (Camp Abilities motto)
>>
>>--- Sent from my Braille-Note
>>
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: "David Evans" <drevans at bellsouth.net
>>To: "Blind Talk Mailing List" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>Date sent: Fri, 6 May 2011 13:22:42 -0400
>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] What is Federationism?
>>
>>
>>Dear Chris,
>>
>>You are not the first person to feel this way and I would say that you
>>always need to take everything with a grain of salt in any organization.
>>There are people with extreme views in every organization and you can be
>>turned off by the wrong people if you think they really represent the whole
>>organization.
>>The war between the ACB and NFB goes back to the 1950's.    You can read
>>"Walking Alone and Marching Together" to learn more.  .
>>There was a split at that point because of a couple of issues.
>>The NFB had come out on the issue of equal pay for equal work in the
>>sheltered workshops that
>>was opposed by the (AFB) American Foundation for the Blind and the
>>Lighthouses for the Blind, who operated about 2,000 sheltered work shops
>>across the nation.
>>They had got a law passed in 1933 that let them pay Blind workers less than
>>minimum wage and much less than the other disabled workers.  They were
>>raking in the money at the Blind's expense.
>>This made the NFB the enemy of both of these organizations because the NFB
>>was trying to take away their little thiefdoms and effect their bottom line.
>>Now , in the late 50's and early 60's the NFB came out for equal rights for
>>Blacks and supported their Civil Rights.
>>There were those with in the NFB that were opposed to equal rights, mostly
>>in the southern states, but others too,  for Blacks and the AFB and
>>lighthouses tried to use this to drive a wedge through the NFB.
>>There were big fights at the National Convention.  There were those State
>>Affiliates and Chapters who were opposed to Blacks and Jews being members
>>and serving on Boards of Directors.
>>There was also accusations of people in some affiliates and chapters taking
>>money from the AFB and Lighthouses to oppose NFB's efforts to over turn the
>>wages law.
>>There was a split at the convention and a number of members who were against
>>Black's civil Rights and being supported by the AFB left the Convention and
>>marched down the street to another hotel and formed a new organization
>>called the American Council of the Blind.
>>For many years and still today, the Lighthouses still support the ACB and
>>provide them with a place to meet and money support in some cases.
>>Now the AFB and Lighthouses had this organization to trot out to oppose the
>>NFB's efforts to get equal pay for the Blind and to prevent Blacks and Jews
>>from being members and serving on Boards of Directors.
>>For many years Blacks and Jews were prevented from being members of the ACB
>>until the Civil Rights Movement in the mid     1960's took hold.
>>They have since dropped the prohibition to Blacks and Jews and they rarely
>>talk about the wages issue anymore, but the hate is still there.
>>They mostly argue over philosophy and stuff.
>>The NFB believes that blindness can be overcome by the use of good training
>>and a positive philosophy and that we , using these skills can cope with the
>>world as it is.
>>The ACB philosophy, on the other hand, seems to feel that the world should
>>be made safer for Blind people by changes in the environment and by law.
>>I am sure that there is some middle ground there somewhere.
>>I personally like the positive philosophy of the NFB and that is why I am a
>>member.  I know that I can not count on the World being re-made just so poor
>>little Blind people will not stub their toe on cracks in the sidewalk.
>>I made arrangements years ago to go to a ACB National Convention in San
>>Francisco until I read some of the information that was sent to me.
>>I noted that "No members would be allowed to leave the hotel without an
>>escort to walk them down the street to where the Exhibition Hall was in
>>another building.  What! I can not go out on my own if I want to?
>>I found that there were as many or more sighted volunteers there to do
>>everything for you and who were persistent in and insistent that could do it
>>for you and faster and easier.  They were a pest.
>>I did not like the feeling I got from the experience and the custodial
>>attitudes I ran into.
>>I have gone to another ACB State convention and ran into much the same thing
>>as well.
>>I like attending the NFB conventions, which are much larger and really do
>>something.
>>The NFB is the organization I identify with and I will stay there.
>>I am looking forward to the National Convention in Orlando Florida this
>>year.  I hope to see you there.
>>I will be the maniac blowing the bugle in the Florida Section.
>>
>>David Evans, NFBF and GD Jack.f
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: "Nikki Wunderlich" <nikki0222 at gmail.com
>>To: "'Blind Talk Mailing List'" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>Sent: Friday, May 06, 2011 10:35 AM
>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] What is Federationism?
>>
>>
>>I am not a registered NFB or ACB person.  I don't really belong to either
>>organization.  I just help where I can.  I've only been to one NFB
>>convention,
>>and and I've never been to an ACB convention.  I would like to learn more
>>about both agencies before steadfastly joining one or the other.  But as it
>>stands I am on lists for both groups, because I'm not sure which group
>>fits
>>me and my beliefs better.
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>Behalf Of Chris Nusbaum
>>Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2011 5:15 PM
>>To: Blind Talk Mailing List
>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] What is Federationism?
>>
>>I agree, Eric.  I don't understand all this political bickering between
>>NFB
>>and ACB, as if one organization is working to promote the independence of
>>the blind and the other isn't.  In fact one of the NFB songs tells ACB to
>>go
>>straight to...  well, you get the point.  All the ACB is is another
>>organization working for the common good of the blind.  They may have some
>>different ideas, but neither is good nor bad.  I have always been kind of
>>a
>>reluctant member of the Federation.  By the way, I'm an at-large member of
>>NFB-MD.  I completely agreed with the NFB's work for independence, but I
>>didn't really like the dogmatic approach some Federationists take to
>>issues:
>>my way (the NFB way) is the only way, and ACB...  well, they're just
>>wrong.
>>No, no, no! For a long time, I thought that this approach was part of the
>>NFB philosophy, and therefore was reluctant to really be active in the
>>Federation.  I didn't want to support that one-size-fits-all view of all
>>things blindness.  Now that I've spent much time on the NFB site,
>>listening
>>to Dr.  Maurer and Dr.  Jernigan's words, I know this is not the real NFB
>>philosophy, but only an extreme interpretation of it that some members
>>take.
>>That's really why I want to become more active, now that I know that by
>>doing so, I wouldn't also be supporting a one-size-fits-all, narrow-minded
>>approach to everything related to blindness.  When I joined this list, I
>>was
>>a little afraid to talk about these opinions of the NFB approach to some
>>issues, and their arguing with the ACB and AFB, being that this is an NFB
>>list which supports the NFB philosophy, which I thought might mean the
>>list
>>members supported this dogmatic approach as well.  But I'm glad most of
>>you
>>have open minds and feel the same as me.  Now that I've said all of this,
>>I
>>wonder if this email will ever really get posted to the list, being that
>>we're a monitored list, monitored by the NFB higher-ups.  So, do you
>>approve
>>this one...  huh, Dave? * Smile!
>>
>>Chris Nusbaum
>>
>>"A loss of sight, never a loss of vision!" (Camp Abilities motto)
>>
>>--- Sent from my Braille-Note
>>
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: Eric Calhoun <eric at pmpmail.com
>>To: blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>Date sent: Wed, 4 May 2011 14:08:32 -0500
>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] What is Federationism?
>>
>>Chris, like you, I have never been that active in the Federation, but I
>>can
>>tell you some things I've learned:
>>
>>** If you believe in a cause, try and collaborate in others, who share it.
>>
>>** Put your money, where your mouth is.  If you don't have a Chapter in
>>your
>>area, please consider joining one.  If you do not have a Chapter in your
>>area, please consider (1) founding one, or (2) being an at-large member.
>>
>>** Membership has its privileges.  When I joined the San Fernando Valley
>>Chapter, I was able to interact with other Federationists, some of whom
>>are
>>close friends of mine.  My privileges were: selling cookies, going to
>>White
>>Cane Safety Day functions, and acquiring a First-Timers'
>>scholarship to the
>>1997 New Orleans Convention.
>>
>>Finally,
>>
>>** It is okay to disagree with someone, but disagree agreeably.
>>In my
>>struggles with NFB, I, myself, do agree, with the Federation on issues
>>like
>>braille literacy, independence, and being an advocate for oneself.  But do
>>I
>>need an NFB Training Center to further my skills?  No, I am capable with
>>the
>>skills I have.
>>
>>I, soon, will be an at-large member of my NFB-Calif.  affiliate, sometime
>>as
>>early as June or July.  Do I think Federationism is bad?  No.
>>Do I
>>think NFB and ACB can still work together?  Yes.