[Blindtlk] NFB Guide Dog School

Fri Mar 22 12:09:52 UTC 2013

Kelby,
    I appreciate your input and asking the question. The challenge is that, 
without ownership, we have few rights to protect ourselves. AS NAGDU 
president, I have witnessed some very despicable behavior from training 
programs that do not transfer ownership upon completion of training. 
Furthermore, failure to transfer ownership sends a message that blind people 
are not capable of caring for and making decisions about their dogs. There 
are community provisions already in place that protect the interests of the 
training programs and the dogs, so retention of ownership is nothing more 
than paternalism at its worst.

Fraternally yours,
Marion Gwizdala


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Kelby Carlson" <kelbycarlson at gmail.com>
To: "Blind Talk Mailing List" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 1:34 PM
Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] NFB Guide Dog School


> Seriously, what is the big deal? Perhaps I haven't been a guide dog user 
> long enough, but I see no problem (and actually some advantage) in at 
> least a period of ownership retension.  This is as much practical as it is 
> "paternalistic".  And do you seriously want blind people to picket guide 
> dog schools over this? That will certainly help the NFB's image among the 
> blind community.
>
> Kelby
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Peter Donahue" <pdonahue2 at satx.rr.com
> To: "Blind Talk Mailing List" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
> Date sent: Thu, 21 Mar 2013 12:29:09 -0500
> Subject: [Blindtlk] NFB Guide Dog School
>
> Hello Cheryl and everyone,
>
>    I've discussed this with Marion privately and suggested that an item
> concerning the creation of an NFB-run guide dog program be put on the 
> NAGDU
> agenda to no avail.  I was at last year's NAGDU Meeting and was very
> disgusted with the reaction of the audience when Marion addressed the 
> group
> concerning the continued practice of ownership retention by guide dog
> programs.  Few if anyone applauded his remarks and there was hardly any 
> call
> for a more aggressive response to ending this practice.  If things have
> changed when I see picket lines go up in front of the grounds of guide dog
> schools that still retain ownership of the dogs it places with its blind
> students than I'll know there is a new spirit of concerted action within
> NAGDU.  I'll be watching the Braille Monitor for this year's NAGDU Agenda 
> to
> see what new item will be included or if it's going to be the
> same-old-same-old!
>
> Peter Donahue
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "cheryl echevarria" <cherylandmaxx at hotmail.com
> To: "Blind Talk Mailing List" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 11:05 AM
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Canes and Dogs, the In-House Checkup
>
>
> The only way any of this is going to happen is to come to national
> convention and come to the NAGDU meeting and work on it together.  We are 
> an
> organization, and we should all work together, and if that doesn't work 
> then
> you get the people in that division that will do it.
>
> Disabled Entrepreneur of the Year 2012 of NY State
> Leading the Way in Independent Travel!SNG Certified - Accessible Travel
> Advocate!Cheryl Echevarria,
> Ownerhttp://www.echevarriatravel.com631-456-5394reservations@eche
> varriatravel.comhttp://www.echevarriatravel.wordpress.com2012
> Norwegian Cruise Line University Advisory Board Member.
> Affiliated as an independent contractor with Montrose TravelCST -
> #1018299-10Echevarria Travel and proud member of the National Federation 
> of
> the Blind will be holding a year round fundraiser for the
> http://www.NFBNY.org after Hurricane Sandy and other resources.  Any 
> vacation
> package booked between November 6 2012-November 6, 2013 and vacation must 
> be
> traveled no later than 12/30/2014 a percentage of my earnings will go to 
> the
> affiliate.  Also is you book a Sandals for couples or Beaches for families
> and friends resorts vacation, $100.00 per booking will go to the affiliate
> as well.  You do not need to be a member of the NFB.org, just book through
> us.
>
>
> From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com
> To: blindtlk at nfbnet.org
> Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2013 12:04:07 -0400
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Canes and Dogs, the In-House Checkup
>
> No, pamper the dogs.  They work hard and they deserve it.  I like the
> other
> stuff you said though.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindtlk [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Julie J.
> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 9:08 AM
> To: Blind Talk Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Canes and Dogs, the In-House Checkup
>
> I think the answer to protecting the dogs is two fold.  First I would
> like to see a more in depth background investigation of the blind
> applicant.  Do a criminal background check, require more references, ask
> the neighbors...whatever it takes.  Adoption agencies place children
> into homes surely we can figure out a way to more accurately know what
> sort of situation the dog will be placed into.  Secondly, I think there
> are already agencies in place for dealing with animal abuse, the police
> and animal control.  I don't see any reason why these agencies can't be
> used in cases of neglect or abuse.
>
> In regard to cost and the blind applicant absorbing the cost of the dog
> in order to own the dog outright is an extremely valid point.  We have
> to stop expecting everything for nothing.  I like the Seeing Eye's
> concept of charging the student.  I do wish that the cost had increased
> over the years with the cost of living.  It has been $150 since the
> beginning of the school in 1928.  I think that's the right year.  $150
> was a very different sum of money then and now.
>
> I also think that guide dogs can be raised and trained for substantially
> lower sums of money than $60,000.  If you look at the various guide dog
> programs and how much each claims it costs to train a dog, the numbers
> vary widely.  All those buildings, fancy food, excessive equipment and
> other niceties cost money.
>
> Julie
>
>
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