[Blindtlk] Echolocation: How it Works

[Larry Wayland]

, ambient sounds bounce off objects and alert you to their presents. This
sound can be generated from your feet, cane, cars passing by or any other
sound being made.  Sometimes objects can block sounds which works very well
for locating objects as well. I know while walking along a curb in the
street where there is no sidewalk I can often detect a car parked on the
side of the street by sound bouncing off the car, or sound being block by
the car, or both.  A good way to see how this works really well is while
riding in a car put your window down. You will be able to tell every time
you pass a object. Sometimes these objects are mail boxes, sometimes they
are cars. This works best while traveling through residential neighborhoods.
It is still the same thing as echoLocation. I just don't think it is
appropriate to go around clucking like a chicken. Just sounds too weird.
Also have you all noticed this capability varies depending on the
atmospheric conditions?



-----Original Message-----
From: blindtlk [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Judy Jones
via blindtlk
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2014 5:56 PM
To: Steve Jacobson; Blind Talk Mailing List
Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Echolocation: How it Works

Sometimes, I can detect a set of steps up i.e. stairs, but not down.  Also
sometimes when coming to an up curb.

Judy


-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Jacobson via blindtlk
Sent: Monday, September 8, 2014 1:43 PM
To: Larry Wayland via blindtlk
Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Echolocation: How it Works

I could detect poles when I was younger and still can sometimes as well as
objects sitting in the middle of a sidewalk. I'm not advocating not using a
cane, though, just trying to contribute to the understanding of the
technique.  There may be people who can detect steps down but I can't say I
was ever good at it.  Although there is nothing for sound to bounce off of,
one can here the constant surface of a sidewalk or floor.  Therefore, if one
can detect the absence of that surface in front of them, one might deduce
that there was a step down.  One might be able to tell that the surface is
lower in front of them thus indicating a step down.  It is hard to explain,
but you hear more than you would think, but one's ability to hear such
things can be affected by the noise that is around them, so it does not
replace a cane in my opinion.

Best regards,

Steve Jacobson

On Mon, 8 Sep 2014 12:10:23 -0500, Larry Wayland via blindtlk wrote:

>No, there would be nothing for the sound to bounce off of.


>-----Original Message-----
>From: blindtlk [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Sherri 
>via blindtlk
>Sent: Monday, September 08, 2014 7:52 AM
>To: Cindy Ray; Blind Talk Mailing List
>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Echolocation: How it Works

>I don't see how anyone can echolocate down-going curbs, objects, holes, 
>etc.
>without a cane. Can anyone do that?
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Cindy Ray via blindtlk" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
>To: "Robin" <robin-melvin at comcast.net>; "Blind Talk Mailing List"
><blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
>Sent: Monday, September 08, 2014 8:21 AM
>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Echolocation: How it Works


>Well, I have used finger snapping, clicking of the tongue sometimes, the
>cane, whatever. But I canâ¬"t see how you can use this echo location 
>without a
>cane or something. I donâ¬"t think you can travel as quickly, you are less
>likely to know until too late that you are stepping off of an edged
>sidewalk, and if there is construction or lawn mowers going echo location
>does not work. I used to not use a cane at school, and they used to edge 
>the
>sidewalks.

>Cindy

>On Sep 8, 2014, at 7:15 AM, Robin via blindtlk <blindtlk at nfbnet.org> wrote:

>> Regarding the instruction of EchoLocation (i.e., FlashSonar), 2 of the
>> people I hear who train people in its use are Justin Louchart and Daniel
>> Kish.
>>
>> Daniel Kish is probably the individual, who demonstrated cycling using
>> EchoLocation (i.e., FlashSonar).
>>
>> I've heard he has established a NonProfit Organization in Southern
>> California (World Access for the Blind), and frequently travels the world
>> teaching its use. He is also the individual, who taught Ben Underwood, 
>> who
>> Passed Away.
>>
>> What is more "socially acceptable" a White Cane or a GuideDog, a White
>> Cane or "Tongue Clicking, Tongue Clicking or a GuideDog? I say whatever
>> works although it would greatly enhance an individual's repitoire if
>> he/she possessed at least 2 of the 3 Mobility skills to rely on. This is
>> just my personal opinion. I don't really care if it is "socially
>> acceptable" or not
>>
>> At 04:01 AM 9/8/2014, you wrote:
>>> They make clickers that are mechanical.   they aren't electronic, just a
>>> piece of metal bent in such a way that when you push it, it makes a 
>>> click
>>> sound.  they cost about $1 and can be found in any pet store.  they were
>>> first used in dolphin training, but are now used in all sorts of animal
>>> training. I'm not sure that it's much more socially acceptable to go
>>> around clicking one of these things than it would be to do the tongue
>>> click though. Probably a bit, but I still think you'd look odd unless 
>>> you
>>> had a dog along that you were training. I'd also like to add a note 
>>> about
>>> the concept of socially acceptable.   the cane is considered socially
>>> acceptable because we, blind folks, have made it so.  If, instead many
>>> moons ago, ancient blind folks decided that the click noise was the way
>>> to go and used that and educated sighted folks on that, then the clicks
>>> would be what is socially acceptable.  It's all in the history and the
>>> perception.  There is nothing more or less weird about the clicking.
>>> It's just not what we are used to.  If all blind people everywhere
>>> decided to use exclusively echolocation and use clicking, it would soon
>>> become the norm and socially acceptable. Just sayin' Julie -----Original
>>> Message----- From: Steve Jacobson via blindtlk Sent: Sunday, September
>>> 07, 2014 9:25 PM To: Christine Olivares via blindtlk Subject: Re:
>>> [Blindtlk] Echolocation: How it Works Part of the challenge is that one
>>> feels a little conspicuous clicking sometimes as that is sometimes
>>> associated with other developmental disabilities.  It is too bad in a 
>>> way
>>> because it is effective.  I have found that I can get some of the same
>>> information, though, from the tapping of my cane, snapping my fingers,
>>> and from rattling keys.  I have sometimes thought that some sort of
>>> electronic sound source could be developed that could be even more
>>> effective and also more socially acceptable. Best regards, Steve 
>>> Jacobson
>>> On Sun, 7 Sep 2014 20:23:10 -0400, Christine Olivares via blindtlk 
>>> wrote:
>>>  >Hello all, >I have a totally blind friend who uses echo location but 
>>> he
>>> does not click. >He will use his foot and stamp on the ground or floor.
>>> On the other hand, >my husband is also blind and he doesnââ> wrote: 
>>>  >>>> >>>>> HI >>>>> Since when does not
>>> having a cane mean that you aren't >>>> blind.  Very very judgmental.
>>>  >>>>> >>>>> Marsha >>>>> >>>>>
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