[Blindtlk] non 24
Carly Mihalakis
carlymih at comcast.net
Fri Jan 8 15:37:57 UTC 2016
Good morning, Mike, and everyone,
The belief of us falling asleep at work is not,
is not, gonna damage us additionally to the lot
in life for blind people in which this culture
has cassed us. After all, this culture tends to
experience us as helpless at best and
incompetent at worst. The prevaling belief, as
you all know, is fundamentally removed from a
question of whether or not we nod off during the day!!
Car.O.B. I mean, is there something of which I
remain blissfully unseeling, or something? Speak
up, if, in fact, this is the case.06:35 PM
1/7/2016, Mike Freeman via blindtlk wrote:
>Bob: Certainly an employer who actually admitted
>that he/she didn't hire someone because he/she
>was blind and therefore had the potential to
>sleep the workday away would be guilty of
>discriminatory hiring practices. Presumably,
>though, an employer who was prejudiced against
>the blind would not be so foolish as to admit
>such prejudice and leave himself/herself open to
>such charges. I'm rather thinking of just the
>implication of the ad itself and the whisper of
>doubt it could potentially put in the mind of a
>potential employer. This would be akin to the
>old stereotype of African-american people as
>lazy or shiftless. Actually, a friend commented
>that he thinks Vanda is ultimately aiming to
>sell hetlioz as an antidote to jetlag. Who
>knows? Mike -----Original Message----- From:
>blindtlk [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>Behalf Of Bob Hachey via blindtlk Sent:
>Thursday, January 07, 2016 2:00 PM To: 'Blind
>Talk Mailing List' Cc: Bob Hachey Subject: Re:
>[Blindtlk] non 24 Hi Mike, I agree with you
>about how Vanda seems to have put a lot into
>marketing to a very small population. Could it
>be that maybe Vanda is, in this case, putting
>altruism above profits? That would be an oddity
>for sure in the Corporate States of America. But
>I do disagree with your second point. Why should
>we be horrified that there's a blindness-related
>condition that could cause one to fall asleep at
>work, at home or anywhere else? Frankly, I’m
>much more horrified that it's possible an
>employer would refuse to hire us just because he
>or she saw a Vanda add for non 24 sufferers.
>That's immoral in my view and ought to be
>illegal. Instead of pointing the finger at
>Vanda, we ought to be pointing the finger at any
>employer who would use this or any other of a
>number of excuses not to hire us. Bob Hachey
>-----Original Message----- From: blindtlk
>[mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
>Of Mike Freeman via blindtlk Sent: Wednesday,
>January 06, 2016 4:07 PM To: Blind Talk Mailing
>List Cc: Mike Freeman Subject: Re: [Blindtlk]
>non 24 Steve: I completely agree with you. I
>find it somewhat odd that the pharmaceutical
>firm put so much effort into advertising and
>marketing to such a small population.
>Additionally, I find it horrifying when I hear
>ads purporting to come from blind people which
>say that a blindness relatted illness causes
>them to fall asleep at work. What an example of
>the capability of the blind!!! Mike Freeman > On
>Jan 6, 2016, at 11:49, Steve Jacobson via
>blindtlk <blindtlk at nfbnet.org> wrote: > >
>Gary, > > For a long time, I've had a very
>negative reaction to sleep study > conclusions
>that involve blind people. In the past, there
>has been a > history of even educated people
>thinking of blindness as living in the > dark
>and feeling that there must be negative effects
>of constant > darkness. It seemed sometimes
>that they would go to great lengths to > prove
>what they already knew just had to be
>true. Over the years, I > have had to adjust my
>original position some partly because people I >
>trust, such as yourself, have felt that there
>may be a connection > between blindness and
>sleep irregularities. Still, I read
>statements > even in this current discussion
>that raise red flags to me, and there > are
>issues with the ad campaigns that really puzzle
>me. Perhaps some > of the questions I have are
>answered somewhere and I just have not gotten to
>them. Here are some examples. > > There always
>seems to be a few people who use the logic "I am
>blind, I > have a sleep problem, therefore blind
>people have a sleep problem." > It isn't put
>that simply or directly, but there is often a
>sense that > any sleep problem we have must be
>connected to blindness. I find > myself
>wondering if there is really an understanding of
>the depths of > sleep problems that exist among
>sighted people. I find that more than > once
>when the subject comes up that persons who are
>sighted > acknowledge sleep difficulties. I
>know of sighted people who have > fallen asleep
>at their desks, for example. When one looks at
>the > marketing of sleeping aids, clearly sleep
>is a fairly widespread > problem. Of course, I
>am not claiming that this disproves Non 24, but
>it means we need to keep what we experience in
>perspective. > > It is my understanding that non
>24 can apparently be diagnosed by the > presence
>of a chemical in one's blood. Therefore, I
>accept that this > condition exists and can be
>diagnosed accurately. However, given that >
>sleep problems are encountered by sighted
>people, and given that it is > likely that many
>of them do not have non 24, how can it be
>assumed > that if a blind person has non-24 that
>it is the only sleep issue? Do > we know that
>the Vanda drug might not be correcting other
>issues, > issues that sighted people might have,
>for example? In other words, > whether the
>Vanda drug works or not, how do we know that Non
>24 is > playing the major role that is being
>publicized? > > We know that each of us can
>react differently to many things. If we > have
>non-24, how is it determined whether the
>symptoms justify > treatment? Many Gary, > >
>For a long time, I've had a very negative
>reaction to sleep study > conclusions that
>involve blind people. In the past, there has
>been a > history of even educated people
>thinking of blindness as living in the > dark
>and feeling that there must be negative effects
>of constant > darkness. It seemed sometimes
>that they would go to great lengths to > prove
>what they already knew just had to be
>true. Over the years, I > have had to adjust my
>original position some partly because people I >
>trust, such as yourself, have felt that there
>may be a connection > between blindness and
>sleep irregularities. Still, I read
>statements > even in this current discussion
>that raise red flags to me, and there > are
>issues with the ad campaigns that really puzzle
>me. Perhaps some > of the questions I have are
>answered somewhere and I just have not gotten to
>them. Here are some examples. > > There always
>seems to be a few people who use the logic "I am
>blind, I > have a sleep problem, therefore blind
>people have a sleep problem." > It isn't put
>that simply or directly, but there is often a
>sense that > any sleep problem we have must be
>connected to blindness. I find > myself
>wondering if there is really an understanding of
>the depths of > sleep problems that exist among
>sighted people. I find that more than > once
>when the subject comes up that persons who are
>sighted > acknowledge sleep difficulties. I
>know of sighted people who have > fallen asleep
>at their desks, for example. When one looks at
>the > marketing of sleeping aids, clearly sleep
>is a fairly widespread > problem. Of course, I
>am not claiming that this disproves Non 24, but
>it means we need to keep what we experience in
>perspective. > > It is my understanding that non
>24 can apparently be diagnosed by the > presence
>of a chemical in one's blood. Therefore, I
>accept that this > condition exists and can be
>diagnosed accurately. However, given that >
>sleep problems are encountered by sighted
>people, and given that it is > likely that many
>of them do not have non 24, how can it be
>assumed > that if a blind person has non-24 that
>it is the only sleep issue? Do > we know that
>the Vanda drug might not be correcting other
>issues, > issues that sighted people might have,
>for example? In other words, > whether the
>Vanda drug works or not, how do we know that Non
>24 is > playing the major role that is being
>publicized? > > We know that each of us can
>react differently to many things. If we > have
>non-24, how is it determined whether the
>symptoms justify > treatment? Many people have
>sleep difficulties that they address >
>successfully through various means, and it would
>seem reasonable to > assume that in some cases
>other approaches might be adequate. How is this
>accommodated? > > We have become polarized to
>some degree around this issue. Those of > us
>who are somewhat skeptical are often seen as
>clearly not having a > problem and therefore not
>understanding that others may not be so >
>fortunate. The questions we raise are
>discounted. Well, I don't > raise questions to
>prove that anyone does not have a sleep
>problem. I > also do not maintain that the
>Vanda drug may not help some people, > maybe
>even many people. What concerns me is that an
>environment is > being created that more or less
>funnels people into this particular > solution
>when there are valid questions. Also, the
>picture painted by > the ad campaign is pretty
>bleak. I just don't see 70% of us > struggling
>to stay awake at our desks even though some of
>us do from > time to time. I just think we need
>more answers than we have, and > they need to
>come from objective sources that don't stand to
>gain or loose depending upon the answers. > > To
>those who have found the Vanda solution to be
>the answer and can > afford it, I am sincerely
>glad it has worked out. Nothing said here > is
>meant to deny the fact that this drug may be a
>welcome solution in > some or even many
>cases. It just seems to me that there are >
>unanswered questions, and a tendency to jump on
>the bandwagon while > remaining silent about the
>ad campaign. > > Best regards, > > Steve
>Jacobson > > -----Original Message----- > From:
>blindtlk [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>Behalf Of Gary > Wunder via blindtlk > Sent:
>Tuesday, January 05, 2016 5:36 PM > To: 'Blind
>Talk Mailing List' <blindtlk at nfbnet.org> > Cc:
>Gary Wunder <gwunder at earthlink.net> > Subject:
>Re: [Blindtlk] non 24 > > I have enjoyed reading
>the comments about non-24, and when I 1st
>heard > about the efforts of a pharmaceutical
>company to market to blind > people, I was
>suspicious. I think I was also a bit defensive,
>assuming > that the worst would happen. > > I
>suspect that I suffer from non-24. There are
>times when I have to > work very hard to stay
>awake, even when I find things around me to be >
>interesting and thought-provoking. There are
>times when at 4 o'clock > in the morning I am
>totally wide-awake and mad about it. Then I
>will > be walking through a store or working at
>my desk or even exercising, > and I find that I
>am exceedingly tired. This suggests to me that I
>do > have a body clock and that periodically
>that body clock gets off. > > I relate to the
>comments about being embarrassed while at work
>and > unintentionally falling asleep. It does
>not reflect well on any > employee when this
>happens, and I admit that more than once I
>have > been embarrassed about nodding off at
>times when I was paid to be > awake. I have
>developed a number of strategies for combating
>this, but > I can't claim that they work 100% of
>the time. If I catch myself in > time, I can
>always stand up, pace, do toe touches, or engage
>in other > activities that I can blame on
>needing to stretch my legs or my sore > back.
>Sometimes they too require attention, but it is
>more likely that I am trying to ensure that I
>stay awake. > > I don't know that this adds
>anything, but I do believe that the > subject is
>important enough that I am likely to put it on
>our > convention agenda here in Missouri. If
>non-24 is real, we should not > try to run from
>it. If the marketing is not what it should be,
>we should not run from that either. > > > >
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