[Blindtlk] non 24

[Jude DaShiell]

Viagra doesn't but Low T commercials focus on struggling to get through 
the whole day.

On Tue, 19 Jan 2016, Mark Tardif via blindtlk wrote:

> Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 22:13:00
> From: Mark Tardif via blindtlk <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: Mark Tardif <markspark at roadrunner.com>
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] non 24
> 
> Because they don't need to do so and it would be so preposterous that people 
> would laugh or turn away in disgust.  I mean most guys, unless you are a true 
> sex addict, don't think the whole day about how to struggle to achieve the 
> next, well, whatever you want to call it, I won't use the terms in polite 
> company.  While sex is an important part of life, it is not nearly as 
> important as maintaining employment, and that, you do need to think about all 
> day long.  And even if not employed, but doing other productive things, it is 
> really true that people with various sleep disorders do "struggle to get 
> through the day."
>
>
>
> Mark Tardif
> Nuclear arms will not hold you.
> -----Original Message----- From: Bryan Schulz via blindtlk
> Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2016 6:10 PM
> To: 'S L Johnson' ; 'Blind Talk Mailing List'
> Cc: Bryan Schulz
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] non 24
>
> Sandra,
>
> The difference is the Viagra commercials don't say the guy struggles to get
> through the day and their work suffers without the pill.
> Bryan
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindtlk [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of S L Johnson
> via blindtlk
> Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2016 3:22 PM
> To: Blind Talk Mailing List
> Cc: S L Johnson
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] non 24
>
> Hello:
>
> Before starting any drug, your doctor and/or pharmacist can carefully go
> over the individual components of the drug to be sure you have not reacted
> to anything in the past.  Unfortunately you sometimes don't know until you
> try a particular drug.  If you get some kind of reaction then, you discuss
> it with your doctor.  In my case, it became obvious that the Vanda drug
> Hetlios was causing severe headaches.  Once we stopped the drug, the
> headaches gradually diminished.  Whenever considering any new drug, it is
> important to discuss it with all your doctors to be sure it is suitable for
> your particular situation.  As for the Vanda advertising, they are doing the
>
> same as all the other drug companies and that is trying to sell their drug
> to as many people as possible.  Hopefully as time goes on other drug
> companies will also develop similar drugs that may help treat circadian
> rhythm disorders.  You can already get melatonin over the counter and for
> some people it works quite well.  If you will notice, most drug advertising
> makes it seem like that drug is a miracle cure.
>
> Sandra
>
> -----Original Message----- From: Jude DaShiell via blindtlk
> Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2016 2:30 PM
> To: Mike Freeman via blindtlk
> Cc: Jude DaShiell ; Mike Freeman ; 'David Andrews'
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] non 24
>
> With regard and without any respect to all of this pharmaceutical
> advertising, how is anyone supposed to know what components of a new
> drug or vaccine they are allergic to without having first been tested
> for such allergies?
>
> On Tue, 19 Jan 2016, Mike Freeman via blindtlk wrote:
>
>> Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 12:52:51
>> From: Mike Freeman via blindtlk <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
>> To: 'Blind Talk Mailing List' <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
>> Cc: Mike Freeman <k7uij at panix.com>, 'David Andrews' <dandrews at visi.com>
>> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] non 24
>> 
>> Dave et al:
>> 
>> I'm not saying Non-24 doesn't exist although I admit that I am skeptical
>> as
>> to how widespread it is. Leaving aside, though, the question of the
>> existence or frequency of the syndrome, I consider the Vanda ad campaign
>> reprehensible. If the ads simply said: "Call 800-bla-bla if you think you
>> fit criteria for using hetlioz.", I wouldn't object. But advertisers seem
>> incapable of conveying a simple message without sensationalizing the
>> message.
>> 
>> Mike Freeman
>> 
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: blindtlk [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of David
>> Andrews via blindtlk
>> Sent: Monday, January 18, 2016 8:15 PM
>> To: Blind Talk Mailing List; Blind Talk Mailing List
>> Cc: David Andrews
>> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] non 24
>> 
>> Steve and Mike:
>> 
>> I know I am behind on this, ... but nevertheless,
>> I would like to say a couple things.  First I was
>> skeptical too.  However, after talking to a
>> couple people in the study, who took the drug, I
>> think non-24-hour is real, and some blind people
>> have it.  I think that Vanda concentrated on us,
>> because we are a "pure play" for the condition
>> without lots of other variables.  I read
>> somewhere that they think that the condition may
>> impact seniors too, so I think this is their
>> ultimate goal.  That is a much larger market than
>> blind people, hence the willingness to spend
>> money on us to prove the condition and the cure.
>> 
>> Dave
>> 
>> At 03:06 PM 1/6/2016, Mike Freeman via blindtlk wrote:
>>> Steve: I completely agree with you. I find it
>>> somewhat odd that the pharmaceutical firm put so
>>> much effort into advertising and marketing to
>>> such a small population. Additionally, I find it
>>> horrifying when I hear ads purporting to come
>>> from blind people which say that a blindness -"
>>> related illness causes them to fall asleep at
>>> work. What an example of the capability of the
>>> blind!!! Mike Freeman > On Jan 6, 2016, at
>>> 11:49, Steve Jacobson via blindtlk
>>> <blindtlk at nfbnet.org> wrote: > > Gary, > > For a
>>> long time, I've had a very negative reaction to
>>> sleep study > conclusions that involve blind
>>> people.  In the past, there has been a > history
>>> of even educated people thinking of blindness as
>>> living in the dark > and feeling that there must
>>> be negative effects of constant darkness.  It >
>>> seemed sometimes that they would go to great
>>> lengths to prove what they > already knew just
>>> had to be true.  Over the years, I have had to
>>> adjust my > original position some partly
>>> because people I trust, such as yourself, have >
>>> felt that there may be a connection between
>>> blindness and sleep > irregularities.  Still, I
>>> read statements even in this current
>>> discussion > that raise red flags to me, and
>>> there are issues with the ad campaigns that >
>>> really puzzle me.  Perhaps some of the questions
>>> I have are answered > somewhere and I just have
>>> not gotten to them.  Here are some examples. > >
>>> There always seems to be a few people who use
>>> the logic "I am blind, I have > a sleep problem,
>>> therefore blind people have a sleep
>>> problem."  It isn't put > that simply or
>>> directly, but there is often a sense that any
>>> sleep problem > we have must be connected to
>>> blindness.  I find myself wondering if there
>>> is > really an understanding of the depths of
>>> sleep problems that exist among > sighted
>>> people.  I find that more than once when the
>>> subject comes up that > persons who are sighted
>>> acknowledge sleep difficulties.  I know of
>>> sighted > people who have fallen asleep at their
>>> desks, for example.  When one looks > at the
>>> marketing of sleeping aids, clearly sleep is a
>>> fairly widespread > problem.  Of course, I am
>>> not claiming that this disproves Non 24, but
>>> it > means we need to keep what we experience in
>>> perspective.  > > It is my understanding that
>>> non 24 can apparently be diagnosed by the >
>>> presence of a chemical in one's
>>> blood.  Therefore, I accept that this >
>>> condition exists and can be diagnosed
>>> accurately.  However, given that sleep >
>>> problems are encountered by sighted people, and
>>> given that it is likely that > many of them do
>>> not have non 24, how can it be assumed that if a
>>> blind > person has non-24 that it is the only
>>> sleep issue?  Do we know that the > Vanda drug
>>> might not be correcting other issues, issues
>>> that sighted people > might have, for
>>> example?  In other words, whether the Vanda drug
>>> works or > not, how do we know that Non 24 is
>>> playing the major role that is being >
>>> publicized? > > We know that each of us can
>>> react differently to many things.  If we have >
>>> non-24, how is it determined whether the
>>> symptoms justify treatment?  Many > Gary, > >
>>> For a long time, I've had a very negative
>>> reaction to sleep study > conclusions that
>>> involve blind people.  In the past, there has
>>> been a > history of even educated people
>>> thinking of blindness as living in the dark >
>>> and feeling that there must be negative effects
>>> of constant darkness.  It > seemed sometimes
>>> that they would go to great lengths to prove
>>> what they > already knew just had to be
>>> true.  Over the years, I have had to adjust my >
>>> original position some partly because people I
>>> trust, such as yourself, have > felt that there
>>> may be a connection between blindness and
>>> sleep > irregularities.  Still, I read
>>> statements even in this current discussion >
>>> that raise red flags to me, and there are issues
>>> with the ad campaigns that > really puzzle
>>> me.  Perhaps some of the questions I have are
>>> answered > somewhere and I just have not gotten
>>> to them.  Here are some examples. > > There
>>> always seems to be a few people who use the
>>> logic "I am blind, I have > a sleep problem,
>>> therefore blind people have a sleep
>>> problem."  It isn't put > that simply or
>>> directly, but there is often a sense that any
>>> sleep problem > we have must be connected to
>>> blindness.  I find myself wondering if there
>>> is > really an understanding of the depths of
>>> sleep problems that exist among > sighted
>>> people.  I find that more than once when the
>>> subject comes up that > persons who are sighted
>>> acknowledge sleep difficulties.  I know of
>>> sighted > people who have fallen asleep at their
>>> desks, for example.  When one looks > at the
>>> marketing of sleeping aids, clearly sleep is a
>>> fairly widespread > problem.  Of course, I am
>>> not claiming that this disproves Non 24, but
>>> it > means we need to keep what we experience in
>>> perspective.  > > It is my understanding that
>>> non 24 can apparently be diagnosed by the >
>>> presence of a chemical in one's
>>> blood.  Therefore, I accept that this >
>>> condition exists and can be diagnosed
>>> accurately.  However, given that sleep >
>>> problems are encountered by sighted people, and
>>> given that it is likely that > many of them do
>>> not have non 24, how can it be assumed that if a
>>> blind > person has non-24 that it is the only
>>> sleep issue?  Do we know that the > Vanda drug
>>> might not be correcting other issues, issues
>>> that sighted people > might have, for
>>> example?  In other words, whether the Vanda drug
>>> works or > not, how do we know that Non 24 is
>>> playing the major role that is being >
>>> publicized? > > We know that each of us can
>>> react differently to many things.  If we have >
>>> non-24, how is it determined whether the
>>> symptoms justify treatment?  Many > people have
>>> sleep difficulties that they address
>>> successfully through > various means, and it
>>> would seem reasonable to assume that in some
>>> cases > other approaches might be adequate.  How
>>> is this accommodated? > > We have become
>>> polarized to some degree around this
>>> issue.  Those of us who > are somewhat skeptical
>>> are often seen as clearly not having a problem
>>> and > therefore not understanding that others
>>> may not be so fortunate.  The > questions we
>>> raise are discounted.  Well, I don't raise
>>> questions to prove > that anyone does not have a
>>> sleep problem.  I also do not maintain that
>>> the > Vanda drug may not help some people, maybe
>>> even many people.  What concerns > me is that an
>>> environment is being created that more or less
>>> funnels people > into this particular solution
>>> when there are valid questions.  Also, the >
>>> picture painted by the ad campaign is pretty
>>> bleak.  I just don't see 70% of > us struggling
>>> to stay awake at our desks even though some of
>>> us do from time > to time.  I just think we need
>>> more answers than we have, and they need to >
>>> come from objective sources that don't stand to
>>> gain or loose depending upon > the answers. > >
>>> To those who have found the Vanda solution to be
>>> the answer and can afford > it, I am sincerely
>>> glad it has worked out.  Nothing said here is
>>> meant to > deny the fact that this drug may be a
>>> welcome solution in some or even many >
>>> cases.  It just seems to me that there are
>>> unanswered questions, and a > tendency to jump
>>> on the bandwagon while remaining silent about
>>> the ad > campaign. > > Best regards, > > Steve
>>> Jacobson > > -----Original Message----- > From:
>>> blindtlk [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>> Behalf Of Gary Wunder > via blindtlk > Sent:
>>> Tuesday, January 05, 2016 5:36 PM > To: 'Blind
>>> Talk Mailing List' <blindtlk at nfbnet.org> > Cc:
>>> Gary Wunder <gwunder at earthlink.net> > Subject:
>>> Re: [Blindtlk] non 24 > > I have enjoyed reading
>>> the comments about non-24, and when I 1st heard
>>> about > the efforts of a pharmaceutical company
>>> to market to blind people, I was > suspicious. I
>>> think I was also a bit defensive, assuming that
>>> the worst > would happen. > > I suspect that I
>>> suffer from non-24. There are times when I have
>>> to work > very hard to stay awake, even when I
>>> find things around me to be interesting > and
>>> thought-provoking. There are times when at 4
>>> o'clock in the morning I am > totally wide-awake
>>> and mad about it. Then I will be walking through
>>> a store > or working at my desk or even
>>> exercising, and I find that I am exceedingly >
>>> tired. This suggests to me that I do have a body
>>> clock and that periodically > that body clock
>>> gets off. > > I relate to the comments about
>>> being embarrassed while at work and >
>>> unintentionally falling asleep. It does not
>>> reflect well on any employee > when this
>>> happens, and I admit that more than once I have
>>> been embarrassed > about nodding off at times
>>> when I was paid to be awake. I have developed
>>> a > number of strategies for combating this, but
>>> I can't claim that they work > 100% of the time.
>>> If I catch myself in time, I can always stand
>>> up, pace, do > toe touches, or engage in other
>>> activities that I can blame on needing to >
>>> stretch my legs or my sore back. Sometimes they
>>> too require attention, but > it is more likely
>>> that I am trying to ensure that I stay
>>> awake. > > I don't know that this adds anything,
>>> but I do believe that the subject is > important
>>> enough that I am likely to put it on our
>>> convention agenda here in > Missouri. If non-24
>>> is real, we should not try to run from it. If
>>> the > marketing is not what it should be, we
>>> should not run from that either. > > > >
>>> _______________________________________________ >
>>>  blindtlk mailing list > blindtlk at nfbnet.org >
>>
>>         David Andrews and long white cane Harry.
>> E-Mail:  dandrews at visi.com or david.andrews at nfbnet.org
>> 
>> 
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>> 
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>
>

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