[BlindTlk] The Unemployment Rate of The Blind

Wed Jan 16 01:36:59 UTC 2019

The accredited ones, for sure.

Judy

-----Original Message-----
From: BlindTlk [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ericka via BlindTlk
Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2019 3:23 PM
To: Blind Talk Mailing List
Cc: Ericka
Subject: Re: [BlindTlk] The Unemployment Rate of The Blind

I think people are safer if they attend a state run vocational tech school rather than one of those fly-by-night operations you were speaking of.

I never considered using placement offices so you writing to say bring your counselor seems kind of odd. But then I also haven’t had a decent counselor that would fight for me anyhow.  I’ve never heard of a counselor driving from their office to go to a placement office over a college or tech school with a student.  

Ericka Nelson

> On Jan 15, 2019, at 4:36 PM, Jude DaShiell via BlindTlk <blindtlk at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> The problem has been and to some extent remains that many votech schools
> were no more than fraud operations for whoever spent money and attended.
> The veterans administration was ripped of mercilessly by these
> operations and under the last administration before 2017 serious crack
> down efforts were underway.  This may to some extent justify preference
> for college and universities for higher education by vocational
> rehabilitation.
> Once anybody who is blind or partially sighted and especially those who
> are totally blind graduates and is thinking about visiting the placement
> office, do not do so alone.  That's one day on which you need your
> vocational rehabilitation counsellor with you and both of you walk into
> the job placement office together for your appointment.  The vocational
> counsellor ought to refuse to leave if asked to do so as well, so
> whatever happens perhaps may be getting recorded by your counsellor
> whether or not you know it at the time.
> There are certain interviews best done with witnesses on your side
> present or best not done at all!
> 
>> On Tue, 15 Jan 2019, Gary Wunder via BlindTlk wrote:
>> 
>> Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2019 17:21:55
>> From: Gary Wunder via BlindTlk <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
>> To: 'Blind Talk Mailing List' <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
>> Cc: Gary Wunder <GWunder at earthlink.net>
>> Subject: Re: [BlindTlk] The Unemployment Rate of The Blind
>> 
>> You and I agree, friend.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: BlindTlk [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Judy Jones
>> via BlindTlk
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2019 3:37 PM
>> To: 'Blind Talk Mailing List'
>> Cc: Judy Jones
>> Subject: Re: [BlindTlk] The Unemployment Rate of The Blind
>> 
>> Yes, I would say a university education can be valuable, and there are those
>> that want and need to go through an academic study for their field of
>> choice.  What I am objecting to is the thinking that the colleges are the
>> only way to go, and those counselors who fail to consider vo tech schools as
>> options.
>> 
>> Judy
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: BlindTlk [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Gary Wunder
>> via BlindTlk
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2019 1:14 PM
>> To: 'Blind Talk Mailing List'
>> Cc: Gary Wunder
>> Subject: Re: [BlindTlk] The Unemployment Rate of The Blind
>> 
>> I don't think there is any clear answer as to whether a person should go to
>> a vocational technical school or a college or university. My wife and I talk
>> about this all the time. I got so much more from my education than a
>> bachelor's degree. I got a lot of practice writing. That wasn't my goal, but
>> it was part of the curriculum. Of course it serves me now is the editor of
>> the Braille Monitor, but it served me well as a computer programmer because
>> I was seen as a positive communicator bridging the gap between technical and
>> not so technical people.
>> 
>> At the risk of offending people, I have to say that when I went to college,
>> I had a pretty narrow perspective on the world. I thought Midwesterners were
>> superior to people who lived on the coasts. I came from a racist family, and
>> although I knew what not to say, I had never read anything of significance
>> by a black person until forced to do so. I had no idea that such inequality
>> existed in our country, but when a black person wrote and spoke as well as
>> any of the white people I was accustomed to reading, much of the foolishness
>> I believed that perpetuated racism simply collapsed.
>> 
>> But it wasn't just racial stuff. I had no idea what it was like for the
>> people working in the coal mines of America. I went around singing that song
>> about owing my soul to the company store, but all I really knew was that it
>> had a slick tune and that it was sung by Tennessee Ernie Ford.
>> 
>> Until I took a few political science courses, I functioned under the fiction
>> that it took no training to be a politician. Until I took some education
>> courses, I figured that just anybody could be a teacher as long as he or she
>> knew their subject. I didn't realize there was a methodology to education,
>> and while I may have significant disagreements from time to time with the
>> people who educate our children, I do know that knowing a subject doesn't
>> ensure that one can teach it.
>> 
>> I used to love the saying that poor folks have poor ways. Until I read some
>> sociology, I don't think I really knew what that meant. I was content to
>> believe that poor people were poor because of the way they behaved. I had no
>> idea how much more it costs to purchase food if you live in a poor
>> neighborhood. I had no idea how advantaged I was when my parents could help
>> with an occasional infusion of money so that what I needed to purchase did
>> not come from the rent to own store. Although I have never been able to
>> drive, I had no idea how disadvantaged a person was if they lived in an
>> impoverished area and wanted a more well-paying job closer to the suburbs.
>> 
>> I know there are a lot of people who become self-educated through reading,
>> but I believe that in no small part I was forced out of my comfort zone
>> because readings were assigned. Going to college did not create an
>> enlightened being, and it certainly did not cause me to reject all of the
>> values that were so formative in my upbringing. But the experience was
>> transformative for me, and I have a much easier time relating to people that
>> I used to think of as "those others."
>> 
>> So is it the job of rehabilitation to grow people up and give them a broader
>> perspective? I think it is if that enables them to do jobs that they
>> wouldn't otherwise be able to do. Is it the job of colleges and universities
>> to do more than job training? I think so. I think they should not try to
>> tell us what to think but should give us a lot of information that causes us
>> to realize that we don't have all the answers and that people who seem
>> different from us are still people who have value, who have values, and who
>> face challenges some of us can never understand unless we come to meet those
>> people, read what they say, and go out of our way to really listen when they
>> speak.
>> 
>> I think all of this relates to the NFB in two ways. We have to admit that
>> not everyone wants or needs a four year degree or something beyond it. On
>> the other hand, I think we ought to reject the rehabilitation agency
>> argument that technical schools are cheaper and therefore the agency is
>> obligated to send us to community colleges or vocational technical training
>> simply based on the economics. I think that is blind people we need every
>> advantage we can muster, and I am not willing to let the allure of a
>> short-term investment derail a real chance at employment.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> BlindTlk mailing list
>> BlindTlk at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> BlindTlk:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/sonshines59%40gmail.co
>> m
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> BlindTlk mailing list
>> BlindTlk at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> BlindTlk:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/gwunder%40earthlink.ne
>> t
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> BlindTlk mailing list
>> BlindTlk at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for BlindTlk:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/jdashiel%40panix.com
>> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> BlindTlk mailing list
> BlindTlk at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for BlindTlk:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/dotwriter1%40gmail.com
_______________________________________________
BlindTlk mailing list
BlindTlk at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for BlindTlk:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/sonshines59%40gmail.com