[blparent] BlParent Digest, Vol 142, Issue 15
Bernadette Jacobs
bernienfb75 at gmail.com
Wed Mar 30 12:55:58 UTC 2016
Judy and Joe, thank you for your rational posts. I, too, only use a spanking as a very, very last resort. I could just about count how many times I have spank both children on the fingers of one hand. I do not do it just anytime. As a matter of fact, I can't remember the last time I actually did it. Usually, it takes one experience with something they really like being taken away or forbidden for a while. That usually will work. Depending on the situation, of course. The key, here is, parenting itself takes a lot of thought and consideration. What will be best for your child. This also is true with disciplinary matters. Usually as a parent, we think about it, then consider what will work best. We never disciplined in anger. That's the big key. Take some time to think then do not do this in anger. Whether it be spanking or any other form of discipline. Keep anger out of it.
Bernie
Sent from my iPhone
> On Mar 29, 2016, at 8:00 AM, blparent-request at nfbnet.org wrote:
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> 1. Re: BlParent Digest, Vol 142, Issue 14 (Bernadette Jacobs)
> 2. spanking and physical punishments (Julie J.)
> 3. Re: spanking and physical punishments (Michelle Creedy )
> 4. Re: spanking and physical punishments (Judy Jones)
> 5. Re: spanking and physical punishments (Dianna)
> 6. Re: spanking and physical punishments (Dianna)
> 7. Re: spanking and physical punishments (Judy Jones)
> 8. Re: spanking and physical punishments (Jo Elizabeth Pinto)
> 9. Re: spanking and physical punishments (Judy Jones)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2016 15:35:03 -0400
> From: Bernadette Jacobs <bernienfb75 at gmail.com>
> To: blparent at nfbnet.org
> Subject: Re: [blparent] BlParent Digest, Vol 142, Issue 14
> Message-ID: <B2213A7C-6F71-4928-8B5A-E3A4F346F631 at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Mar 28, 2016, at 8:00 AM, blparent-request at nfbnet.org wrote:
>>
>> Send BlParent mailing list submissions to
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>> Today's Topics:
>>
>> 1. Re: behavior problems with our 4 year old (Star Gazer)
>> 2. Re: behavior problems with our 4 year old (Jessica Bartenbach)
>> 3. Re: behavior problems with our 4 year old (Judy Jones)
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Sun, 27 Mar 2016 11:09:26 -0400
>> From: "Star Gazer" <pickrellrebecca at gmail.com>
>> To: "'Blind Parents Mailing List'" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
>> Subject: Re: [blparent] behavior problems with our 4 year old
>> Message-ID: <1b7101d1883a$a7aa4690$f6fed3b0$@gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>
>> I ask this in all seriousness, what does she care
>> about? An hour is a very long time, even for adults.
>> Has she told you why she's dumping the food on the floor? It sounds to me
>> like she may be trying to replicate preschool i.e. they play with dry pasta
>> and the like at preschool, might that be what she's thinking of?
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: BlParent [mailto:blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris
>> Reagan via BlParent
>> Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2016 11:25 AM
>> To: blparent at nfbnet.org
>> Cc: Chris Reagan <Christopher_reagan at comcast.net>
>> Subject: [blparent] behavior problems with our 4 year old
>>
>> Good morning all:
>> We're having a serious behavior problem with our 4 year old child and we'd
>> like to know if there's anything anyone can suggest on how to get this issue
>> under control. We've tried just about everything we can think of to deal
>> with this and It's almost like she doesn't care. I'll give some examples as
>> to what she's done and what we've tried. She likes to take foodand dump it,
>> we finally got the locks that will keep her out of the cabinets. She's taken
>> the drawers out of her dresser. In response we've put locks on them which
>> she got around. Here's something that I wrote for what happened this
>> morning, and this is also a common occurrence.
>> Okay, so our child does something wrong, we put her in timeout. She doesn't
>> stay still in timeout, so she is sent to her room for an hour.
>> Mind you, that because of her behavior, we've taken all her toys away so her
>> room isn't a very enjoyible place right now. So she opens the window and
>> starts talking to people in general which we don't want her to do because of
>> housing rules regarding the windows being open when the temps are below 50
>> and because we don't know who she's talking too.
>> So I go in and close the window and she decides to get out of her room, run
>> in to the living room and run from us and hide in plain sight. I catch her
>> and put her back in. in the attempt to keep her in there for the time that
>> we've set, she takes my phone runs to her bed with it, and tosses it behind
>> her bed, thank god for outerbox cases. I normally don't spank, but that
>> deserved a spanking and that's what she got. Now she's a very bright kid,
>> very smart, does well in head start. She loves to draw and help people and
>> we're happy to have her in our lives!. But, her behavior is getting to the
>> point where she's wearing us down. Now, spanking is something we don't like
>> to do and we don't enjoy it at all.
>> Plus, I believe that it only causes more problems. We've taken away tv
>> privoleges and I've also resorted to taking away her toys as I previously
>> stated including the stuffed animals that she likes to sleep and play with.
>> When we want to go somewhere, we can't, because her grandparents won't baby
>> sit anymore because of her behavior, plus when we take her places, we insist
>> she hold mommy and daddy's hand, but does she, no and she knows how to
>> remove the leashes. So if there's anything that we've missed or haven't done
>> to curve her behavior, please don't hesitate to speak up. We love her dearly
>> and we only want the best for her in the end.
>> Take Care all:
>> Chris
>>
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>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 2
>> Date: Sun, 27 Mar 2016 15:09:06 -0600
>> From: Jessica Bartenbach <jlbartenbach at gmail.com>
>> To: blparent at nfbnet.org
>> Subject: Re: [blparent] behavior problems with our 4 year old
>> Message-ID: <A8B0757F-E571-4D60-885B-A0B086B60DB0 at gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>>
>> Hi Chris,
>> I have not gone through behavior problems as severe as what you are describing, but I have read some very helpful books by Dr. Kevin Leman. One is called ?Making Children Mind Without Losing Yours? and the other is ?Parenthood Without Hassles (Well, Almost).? He was a guest speaker on Focus on the Family, so he is a Christian-based counselor.
>>
>> My 3-year-old went through a picky eating phase several months ago. We tried everything to get him to eat. If he was not given a choice of what to eat for a meal, he would cry and throw a tantrum. Putting him in time out was not effective, nor was keeping him at the table until he ate his food. Dr. Leman made some suggestions in his book which I decided to implement, and after a few days we saw an improvement.
>>
>> What I did is I gave a warning time before dinner so he could have a transition. Then I called him to the table and put food in front of him. If he started to cry, I calmly picked him up and carried him to his room. I told him he could come out when he was ready to eat. The point Dr. Leman made was that he has a right to his feelings, but he does not have a right to make the rest of the family suffer while he works those feelings out. By doing this, I let him know that he was still loved and respected, but that I found his behavior unacceptable and would not tolerate it at the table. If he came out of his room and was still crying or refusing to eat, I carried him back to his room and repeated that he could come out when he was ready to eat. Usually I had to only do this a couple of times before he got lonely and decided it was more fun to be with the family.
>>
>> He decided once or twice that he did not want to eat what was served, and I allowed him to make this decision, but I let him know there would be no snacks until he finished his dinner. This meant one time he had his dinner for breakfast the next day. If he asked for food, I would offer him his dinner. In this way I did not feel like I was depriving him of food. Rather he was depriving himself of food because he was choosing not to eat.
>>
>> I?m happy to say we don?t have an eating problem with him anymore. Maybe once every couple of months I will have to pick him up and take him to his room to calm down, but he comes out on his own within a minute or two and decides to eat at that time.
>>
>> I hope this helps.
>>
>> Jessica
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 3
>> Date: Sun, 27 Mar 2016 16:17:16 -0600
>> From: "Judy Jones" <sonshines59 at gmail.com>
>> To: "Blind Parents Mailing List" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
>> Subject: Re: [blparent] behavior problems with our 4 year old
>> Message-ID: <534362A91EA34C0B964D23E955C9188A at DESKTOPJOF2B70>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8";
>> reply-type=original
>>
>> I had forgotten about Kevin's books, they are fantastic.
>>
>> Judy
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Jessica Bartenbach via BlParent
>> Sent: Sunday, March 27, 2016 3:09 PM
>> To: blparent at nfbnet.org
>> Cc: Jessica Bartenbach
>> Subject: Re: [blparent] behavior problems with our 4 year old
>>
>> Hi Chris,
>> I have not gone through behavior problems as severe as what you are
>> describing, but I have read some very helpful books by Dr. Kevin Leman. One
>> is called ?Making Children Mind Without Losing Yours? and the other is
>> ?Parenthood Without Hassles (Well, Almost).? He was a guest speaker on Focus
>> on the Family, so he is a Christian-based counselor.
>>
>> My 3-year-old went through a picky eating phase several months ago. We tried
>> everything to get him to eat. If he was not given a choice of what to eat
>> for a meal, he would cry and throw a tantrum. Putting him in time out was
>> not effective, nor was keeping him at the table until he ate his food. Dr.
>> Leman made some suggestions in his book which I decided to implement, and
>> after a few days we saw an improvement.
>>
>> What I did is I gave a warning time before dinner so he could have a
>> transition. Then I called him to the table and put food in front of him. If
>> he started to cry, I calmly picked him up and carried him to his room. I
>> told him he could come out when he was ready to eat. The point Dr. Leman
>> made was that he has a right to his feelings, but he does not have a right
>> to make the rest of the family suffer while he works those feelings out. By
>> doing this, I let him know that he was still loved and respected, but that I
>> found his behavior unacceptable and would not tolerate it at the table. If
>> he came out of his room and was still crying or refusing to eat, I carried
>> him back to his room and repeated that he could come out when he was ready
>> to eat. Usually I had to only do this a couple of times before he got lonely
>> and decided it was more fun to be with the family.
>>
>> He decided once or twice that he did not want to eat what was served, and I
>> allowed him to make this decision, but I let him know there would be no
>> snacks until he finished his dinner. This meant one time he had his dinner
>> for breakfast the next day. If he asked for food, I would offer him his
>> dinner. In this way I did not feel like I was depriving him of food. Rather
>> he was depriving himself of food because he was choosing not to eat.
>>
>> I?m happy to say we don?t have an eating problem with him anymore. Maybe
>> once every couple of months I will have to pick him up and take him to his
>> room to calm down, but he comes out on his own within a minute or two and
>> decides to eat at that time.
>>
>> I hope this helps.
>>
>> Jessica
>> _______________________________________________
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>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Subject: Digest Footer
>>
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>> ------------------------------
>>
>> End of BlParent Digest, Vol 142, Issue 14
>> ***************************************** firstly, and our is far, far, far too long for any kind of timeout for a child. They have no concept of time whether it's a minute or an hour. I think, being that she is four years old, four minutes should be the very limit. Use however many minutes her age is. I think that's plenty sufficient. On the other hand The world, in general has the wrong idea about spankings. Many of us from the old school have been spanked as children. Wow!! Was still alive!! Glory be!! We live through it!! And you know what, she will too. Now, one thing I have found that works, if she refuses to stand in the corner or sit in her timeout chair, what I do, is stand right there with them. Because, as long as you were away from them. They think they can get away. However, if you are holding their hands behind their back's and holding onto them to make sure that they are in their time out chairs or stand behind them in their corners, they can't get away from you. He'll get away if you let them. Same with holding the hands. If they want to go somewhere and do not hold your hand, then they just don't go. Do they? I have heard of people saying give them rewards for good behavior catch them doing something right. I haven't seen it work yet. But, I don't have patience for nonsense either. But, you can try it, for what it's worth. I agree. Take a privilege or something away from them that they would be so upset that they couldn't just stand it. But only take it for a while. Take it for one day. Take it for one hour. Maybe 20 minutes. But don't take it for a week, unless it's really, really bad. My daughter loses her eye pad for being disrespectful or defiant. But only dad. She loses it for a day or two and then gets back. Do you give her candy or anything sugar? Take it all away. And take it away for a long time. Let her earn it piece by piece. If she does something good, then reboard to her. Left her on each reward piece by piece but tell her it can be taken away as quickly as sheets got it. I think nothing of standing with my children in the corner behind them so that they get the idea or standing with them holding their hands behind their back's in the timeout chair. Like I say. If you walk away from them, of course you're only giving them liberty to do whatever they feel like. There was one child in Wisconsin I used to take care of. He thought it was very cool to hide from his babysitter because she was blind. Well, he only did it once. He hid from me. Couldn't find them. Couldn't find them. Couldn't find them. Then, I decided to pick up the sleeping baby out of her crib and I quietly hid both of us from him. I took her way down in the corner of the basement. She had no clue. He had no clue. She slept through the whole thing in my arms. Her mother came home and I could hear her so I signaled to her at the window I showed her Christina in my arms then she unlocked the door of the house and came in. By this time, the little boy was absolutely hysterical. Couldn't find his baby sister. Couldn't find his babysitter. We were gone. Simply disappeared into thin air. His mother, of course knew better. So she asked him what he did. She said, are you ever going to hide from Miss Bernie again? He was so hysterical he could not talk. He could barely breathe. That was the last time he ever hid from me. He never believed I could hide from him. But, I did. He was looking and looking and looking around for me. Never thought we'd head for the basement and when Christina was gone??? His baby sister??? He just couldn't imagine. His heart nearly broke. But, I tell you it's never happened since. Now those children are in their late 20s and early 30s. And you know, at Christmas time he and his mother still talk about it. And of course, he was the one who brought it up. Funny. Isn't it?
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2016 15:16:20 -0500
> From: "Julie J." <julielj at neb.rr.com>
> To: "Blind Parents Mailing List" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: [blparent] spanking and physical punishments
> Message-ID: <4F54294A7DCD46789839CB8AC03EB038 at JuliePC>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> I?ve noticed that a lot of the recent messages are pretty pushy about spanking and other physical punishments. I?m not judging, parent however you see fit. The thing is though that the repercussions for spanking and the like these days are very, very different than from the 70?s when a lot of us were growing up.
>
> Now if your kid tells his teacher his parents spank, the teacher will be reporting this to the powers that be. If you spank your kid in the grocery store, you could very well end up explaining your action to the police. If your child has a mark on him, even if it?s from a tumble off his bike, you are going to be answering a lot of questions from people in positions to make your life very, very miserable. Add in the fact that every one of us is blind and like it or not there is already some preconceived ideas at least by some professionals. Start with doubt, add in your child?s rendition of what happened, stir in a healthy dose of societal implications of spanking and what you have is a recipe for misery.
>
> I?ve been teaching parenting classes for 6 years or so now. I?ve worked with parents from abusive homes, parents who left abusive spouses, parents with kids with diagnosed behavior problems, parents with kids in the criminal justice system and your regular Ozzy and Harriet type of parents. There are effective alternatives to spanking. Alternatives that won?t create more problems for you. Also if you want the support of teachers, social workers, family doctor and mental health professionals you are going to have to pick a strategy that doesn?t involve physical punishments because no professional these days is going to promote that approach.
>
> As has been said before, spanking is considered abuse in some places. It?s also common for parents who have divorced or separated because of a adult abuse situation to have a court order that no physical punishment can be used with the children.
>
> I have no idea what the situation is with the original poster. I do absolutely know that spanking, although it may very well work, is not an easy answer to a difficult situation. I would hope that people would be supportive of all parents no matter what their parenting approach or life situation.
>
> Julie
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2016 13:27:55 -0700
> From: "Michelle Creedy " <michelle.creedy at gmail.com>
> To: "'Blind Parents Mailing List'" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [blparent] spanking and physical punishments
> Message-ID: <000401d18930$4fd01ed0$ef705c70$@gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Very well said Julie! One thing to consider is the question of what are we teaching kids about conflict and problem-solving by spanking? We're teaching them that violence is the way to solve problems. I work with teens and many of them choose to solve problems with violence because of their backgrounds and trying to explain that this is not a viable option is very hard when that is all they have experienced.
>
> Michelle
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: BlParent [mailto:blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Julie J. via BlParent
> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2016 1:16 PM
> To: Blind Parents Mailing List
> Cc: Julie J.
> Subject: [blparent] spanking and physical punishments
>
> I?ve noticed that a lot of the recent messages are pretty pushy about spanking and other physical punishments. I?m not judging, parent however you see fit. The thing is though that the repercussions for spanking and the like these days are very, very different than from the 70?s when a lot of us were growing up.
>
> Now if your kid tells his teacher his parents spank, the teacher will be reporting this to the powers that be. If you spank your kid in the grocery store, you could very well end up explaining your action to the police. If your child has a mark on him, even if it?s from a tumble off his bike, you are going to be answering a lot of questions from people in positions to make your life very, very miserable. Add in the fact that every one of us is blind and like it or not there is already some preconceived ideas at least by some professionals. Start with doubt, add in your child?s rendition of what happened, stir in a healthy dose of societal implications of spanking and what you have is a recipe for misery.
>
> I?ve been teaching parenting classes for 6 years or so now. I?ve worked with parents from abusive homes, parents who left abusive spouses, parents with kids with diagnosed behavior problems, parents with kids in the criminal justice system and your regular Ozzy and Harriet type of parents. There are effective alternatives to spanking. Alternatives that won?t create more problems for you. Also if you want the support of teachers, social workers, family doctor and mental health professionals you are going to have to pick a strategy that doesn?t involve physical punishments because no professional these days is going to promote that approach.
>
> As has been said before, spanking is considered abuse in some places. It?s also common for parents who have divorced or separated because of a adult abuse situation to have a court order that no physical punishment can be used with the children.
>
> I have no idea what the situation is with the original poster. I do absolutely know that spanking, although it may very well work, is not an easy answer to a difficult situation. I would hope that people would be supportive of all parents no matter what their parenting approach or life situation.
>
> Julie
> _______________________________________________
> BlParent mailing list
> BlParent at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blparent_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for BlParent:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blparent_nfbnet.org/michelle.creedy%40gmail.com
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2016 20:36:36 +0000
> From: Judy Jones <Judy.Jones at icbvi.idaho.gov>
> To: Blind Parents Mailing List <blparent at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [blparent] spanking and physical punishments
> Message-ID:
> <d7c2ed3943424debb492f6496f15ff76 at ICSDAGVP01.ics.idaho.gov>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> And that's the confusion right there.
>
> Judy
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: BlParent [mailto:blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michelle Creedy via BlParent
> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2016 2:28 PM
> To: 'Blind Parents Mailing List'
> Cc: Michelle Creedy
> Subject: Re: [blparent] spanking and physical punishments
>
> Very well said Julie! One thing to consider is the question of what are we teaching kids about conflict and problem-solving by spanking? We're teaching them that violence is the way to solve problems. I work with teens and many of them choose to solve problems with violence because of their backgrounds and trying to explain that this is not a viable option is very hard when that is all they have experienced.
>
> Michelle
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: BlParent [mailto:blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Julie J. via BlParent
> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2016 1:16 PM
> To: Blind Parents Mailing List
> Cc: Julie J.
> Subject: [blparent] spanking and physical punishments
>
> I?ve noticed that a lot of the recent messages are pretty pushy about spanking and other physical punishments. I?m not judging, parent however you see fit. The thing is though that the repercussions for spanking and the like these days are very, very different than from the 70?s when a lot of us were growing up.
>
> Now if your kid tells his teacher his parents spank, the teacher will be reporting this to the powers that be. If you spank your kid in the grocery store, you could very well end up explaining your action to the police. If your child has a mark on him, even if it?s from a tumble off his bike, you are going to be answering a lot of questions from people in positions to make your life very, very miserable. Add in the fact that every one of us is blind and like it or not there is already some preconceived ideas at least by some professionals. Start with doubt, add in your child?s rendition of what happened, stir in a healthy dose of societal implications of spanking and what you have is a recipe for misery.
>
> I?ve been teaching parenting classes for 6 years or so now. I?ve worked with parents from abusive homes, parents who left abusive spouses, parents with kids with diagnosed behavior problems, parents with kids in the criminal justice system and your regular Ozzy and Harriet type of parents. There are effective alternatives to spanking. Alternatives that won?t create more problems for you. Also if you want the support of teachers, social workers, family doctor and mental health professionals you are going to have to pick a strategy that doesn?t involve physical punishments because no professional these days is going to promote that approach.
>
> As has been said before, spanking is considered abuse in some places. It?s also common for parents who have divorced or separated because of a adult abuse situation to have a court order that no physical punishment can be used with the children.
>
> I have no idea what the situation is with the original poster. I do absolutely know that spanking, although it may very well work, is not an easy answer to a difficult situation. I would hope that people would be supportive of all parents no matter what their parenting approach or life situation.
>
> Julie
> _______________________________________________
> BlParent mailing list
> BlParent at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blparent_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for BlParent:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blparent_nfbnet.org/michelle.creedy%40gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2016 15:47:56 -0500
> From: "Dianna" <dianna24 at earthlink.net>
> To: "'Blind Parents Mailing List'" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [blparent] spanking and physical punishments
> Message-ID: <001201d18933$1b6b9db0$5242d910$@earthlink.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> Well I ain't worried about the powers at because if I wish to spank my child I will, but I find other ways just because I have an issue when it is ok to hit children in the name of spanking but if you hit an adult you go to jail. These are little people but yet it is ok to hit them. I don't understand that theory myself.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: BlParent [mailto:blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michelle Creedy via BlParent
> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2016 3:28 PM
> To: 'Blind Parents Mailing List' <blparent at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: Michelle Creedy <michelle.creedy at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [blparent] spanking and physical punishments
>
> Very well said Julie! One thing to consider is the question of what are we teaching kids about conflict and problem-solving by spanking? We're teaching them that violence is the way to solve problems. I work with teens and many of them choose to solve problems with violence because of their backgrounds and trying to explain that this is not a viable option is very hard when that is all they have experienced.
>
> Michelle
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: BlParent [mailto:blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Julie J. via BlParent
> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2016 1:16 PM
> To: Blind Parents Mailing List
> Cc: Julie J.
> Subject: [blparent] spanking and physical punishments
>
> I?ve noticed that a lot of the recent messages are pretty pushy about spanking and other physical punishments. I?m not judging, parent however you see fit. The thing is though that the repercussions for spanking and the like these days are very, very different than from the 70?s when a lot of us were growing up.
>
> Now if your kid tells his teacher his parents spank, the teacher will be reporting this to the powers that be. If you spank your kid in the grocery store, you could very well end up explaining your action to the police. If your child has a mark on him, even if it?s from a tumble off his bike, you are going to be answering a lot of questions from people in positions to make your life very, very miserable. Add in the fact that every one of us is blind and like it or not there is already some preconceived ideas at least by some professionals. Start with doubt, add in your child?s rendition of what happened, stir in a healthy dose of societal implications of spanking and what you have is a recipe for misery.
>
> I?ve been teaching parenting classes for 6 years or so now. I?ve worked with parents from abusive homes, parents who left abusive spouses, parents with kids with diagnosed behavior problems, parents with kids in the criminal justice system and your regular Ozzy and Harriet type of parents. There are effective alternatives to spanking. Alternatives that won?t create more problems for you. Also if you want the support of teachers, social workers, family doctor and mental health professionals you are going to have to pick a strategy that doesn?t involve physical punishments because no professional these days is going to promote that approach.
>
> As has been said before, spanking is considered abuse in some places. It?s also common for parents who have divorced or separated because of a adult abuse situation to have a court order that no physical punishment can be used with the children.
>
> I have no idea what the situation is with the original poster. I do absolutely know that spanking, although it may very well work, is not an easy answer to a difficult situation. I would hope that people would be supportive of all parents no matter what their parenting approach or life situation.
>
> Julie
> _______________________________________________
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>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2016 15:49:38 -0500
> From: "Dianna" <dianna24 at earthlink.net>
> To: "'Blind Parents Mailing List'" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [blparent] spanking and physical punishments
> Message-ID: <001301d18933$58727ad0$09577070$@earthlink.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> It is not abuse to spank your child, but professionals will tell you it is if you do not know your rights. You can't do it in public which I don't think you should do anyway if you are going to use it for your child.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: BlParent [mailto:blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Michelle Creedy via BlParent
> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2016 3:28 PM
> To: 'Blind Parents Mailing List' <blparent at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: Michelle Creedy <michelle.creedy at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [blparent] spanking and physical punishments
>
> Very well said Julie! One thing to consider is the question of what are we teaching kids about conflict and problem-solving by spanking? We're teaching them that violence is the way to solve problems. I work with teens and many of them choose to solve problems with violence because of their backgrounds and trying to explain that this is not a viable option is very hard when that is all they have experienced.
>
> Michelle
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: BlParent [mailto:blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Julie J. via BlParent
> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2016 1:16 PM
> To: Blind Parents Mailing List
> Cc: Julie J.
> Subject: [blparent] spanking and physical punishments
>
> I?ve noticed that a lot of the recent messages are pretty pushy about spanking and other physical punishments. I?m not judging, parent however you see fit. The thing is though that the repercussions for spanking and the like these days are very, very different than from the 70?s when a lot of us were growing up.
>
> Now if your kid tells his teacher his parents spank, the teacher will be reporting this to the powers that be. If you spank your kid in the grocery store, you could very well end up explaining your action to the police. If your child has a mark on him, even if it?s from a tumble off his bike, you are going to be answering a lot of questions from people in positions to make your life very, very miserable. Add in the fact that every one of us is blind and like it or not there is already some preconceived ideas at least by some professionals. Start with doubt, add in your child?s rendition of what happened, stir in a healthy dose of societal implications of spanking and what you have is a recipe for misery.
>
> I?ve been teaching parenting classes for 6 years or so now. I?ve worked with parents from abusive homes, parents who left abusive spouses, parents with kids with diagnosed behavior problems, parents with kids in the criminal justice system and your regular Ozzy and Harriet type of parents. There are effective alternatives to spanking. Alternatives that won?t create more problems for you. Also if you want the support of teachers, social workers, family doctor and mental health professionals you are going to have to pick a strategy that doesn?t involve physical punishments because no professional these days is going to promote that approach.
>
> As has been said before, spanking is considered abuse in some places. It?s also common for parents who have divorced or separated because of a adult abuse situation to have a court order that no physical punishment can be used with the children.
>
> I have no idea what the situation is with the original poster. I do absolutely know that spanking, although it may very well work, is not an easy answer to a difficult situation. I would hope that people would be supportive of all parents no matter what their parenting approach or life situation.
>
> Julie
> _______________________________________________
> BlParent mailing list
> BlParent at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blparent_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for BlParent:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blparent_nfbnet.org/michelle.creedy%40gmail.com
>
>
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>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2016 20:35:27 +0000
> From: Judy Jones <Judy.Jones at icbvi.idaho.gov>
> To: Blind Parents Mailing List <blparent at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [blparent] spanking and physical punishments
> Message-ID:
> <c2876290f5964cd9a6595479f1e13b42 at ICSDAGVP01.ics.idaho.gov>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> I understand where you are coming from. We have a very confused society that is going to be rearing some very confused kids, but it is what it is, and it's too bad that the powers that be can't recognize the difference between child abuse and correction. Of course, I believe spanking should be the very last resort. There are numerous ways of gentle and positive discipline that work for more situations than not. My kids were born in the 80s, the rare instances of spanking worked for them, and they would tell you so. The real concern is that state and/or federal government is encroaching more and more on the home. In child abuse cases, this is a good thing, but otherwise not. If a child has an inkling that the parent does not have the control they should, he will take advantage of that. Too bad. The climate we live in shuns guidelines of many kinds, and we have yet to reap the reward.
>
> Judy
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: BlParent [mailto:blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Julie J. via BlParent
> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2016 2:16 PM
> To: Blind Parents Mailing List
> Cc: Julie J.
> Subject: [blparent] spanking and physical punishments
>
> I?ve noticed that a lot of the recent messages are pretty pushy about spanking and other physical punishments. I?m not judging, parent however you see fit. The thing is though that the repercussions for spanking and the like these days are very, very different than from the 70?s when a lot of us were growing up.
>
> Now if your kid tells his teacher his parents spank, the teacher will be reporting this to the powers that be. If you spank your kid in the grocery store, you could very well end up explaining your action to the police. If your child has a mark on him, even if it?s from a tumble off his bike, you are going to be answering a lot of questions from people in positions to make your life very, very miserable. Add in the fact that every one of us is blind and like it or not there is already some preconceived ideas at least by some professionals. Start with doubt, add in your child?s rendition of what happened, stir in a healthy dose of societal implications of spanking and what you have is a recipe for misery.
>
> I?ve been teaching parenting classes for 6 years or so now. I?ve worked with parents from abusive homes, parents who left abusive spouses, parents with kids with diagnosed behavior problems, parents with kids in the criminal justice system and your regular Ozzy and Harriet type of parents. There are effective alternatives to spanking. Alternatives that won?t create more problems for you. Also if you want the support of teachers, social workers, family doctor and mental health professionals you are going to have to pick a strategy that doesn?t involve physical punishments because no professional these days is going to promote that approach.
>
> As has been said before, spanking is considered abuse in some places. It?s also common for parents who have divorced or separated because of a adult abuse situation to have a court order that no physical punishment can be used with the children.
>
> I have no idea what the situation is with the original poster. I do absolutely know that spanking, although it may very well work, is not an easy answer to a difficult situation. I would hope that people would be supportive of all parents no matter what their parenting approach or life situation.
>
> Julie
> _______________________________________________
> BlParent mailing list
> BlParent at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blparent_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for BlParent:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blparent_nfbnet.org/judy.jones%40icbvi.idaho.gov
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2016 15:48:49 -0600
> From: Jo Elizabeth Pinto <jopinto at msn.com>
> To: "Blind Parents Mailing List" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [blparent] spanking and physical punishments
> Message-ID: <BLU172-DS15BA54BB31C790ECB9AA9BAC860 at phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8";
> reply-type=original
>
> I agree with you, Judy. What's really too bad is that in the seventies and
> eighties, many times the local and state governments didn't intervene in
> true cases of child abuse when intervention was actually necessary.
> Sometimes intervention still doesn't happen when it should, but all too many
> times it happens when it shouldn't.
>
> Jo Elizabeth
>
> "The Bright Side of Darkness"
> is my newly published novel,
> available in Kindle, audio, and paperback formats at Amazon.com.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Judy Jones via BlParent
> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2016 2:35 PM
> To: Blind Parents Mailing List
> Cc: Judy Jones
> Subject: Re: [blparent] spanking and physical punishments
>
> I understand where you are coming from. We have a very confused society
> that is going to be rearing some very confused kids, but it is what it is,
> and it's too bad that the powers that be can't recognize the difference
> between child abuse and correction. Of course, I believe spanking should be
> the very last resort. There are numerous ways of gentle and positive
> discipline that work for more situations than not. My kids were born in the
> 80s, the rare instances of spanking worked for them, and they would tell you
> so. The real concern is that state and/or federal government is encroaching
> more and more on the home. In child abuse cases, this is a good thing, but
> otherwise not. If a child has an inkling that the parent does not have the
> control they should, he will take advantage of that. Too bad. The climate
> we live in shuns guidelines of many kinds, and we have yet to reap the
> reward.
>
> Judy
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: BlParent [mailto:blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Julie J.
> via BlParent
> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2016 2:16 PM
> To: Blind Parents Mailing List
> Cc: Julie J.
> Subject: [blparent] spanking and physical punishments
>
> I?ve noticed that a lot of the recent messages are pretty pushy about
> spanking and other physical punishments. I?m not judging, parent however
> you see fit. The thing is though that the repercussions for spanking and
> the like these days are very, very different than from the 70?s when a lot
> of us were growing up.
>
> Now if your kid tells his teacher his parents spank, the teacher will be
> reporting this to the powers that be. If you spank your kid in the grocery
> store, you could very well end up explaining your action to the police. If
> your child has a mark on him, even if it?s from a tumble off his bike, you
> are going to be answering a lot of questions from people in positions to
> make your life very, very miserable. Add in the fact that every one of us
> is blind and like it or not there is already some preconceived ideas at
> least by some professionals. Start with doubt, add in your child?s
> rendition of what happened, stir in a healthy dose of societal implications
> of spanking and what you have is a recipe for misery.
>
> I?ve been teaching parenting classes for 6 years or so now. I?ve worked
> with parents from abusive homes, parents who left abusive spouses, parents
> with kids with diagnosed behavior problems, parents with kids in the
> criminal justice system and your regular Ozzy and Harriet type of parents.
> There are effective alternatives to spanking. Alternatives that won?t
> create more problems for you. Also if you want the support of teachers,
> social workers, family doctor and mental health professionals you are going
> to have to pick a strategy that doesn?t involve physical punishments because
> no professional these days is going to promote that approach.
>
> As has been said before, spanking is considered abuse in some places. It?s
> also common for parents who have divorced or separated because of a adult
> abuse situation to have a court order that no physical punishment can be
> used with the children.
>
> I have no idea what the situation is with the original poster. I do
> absolutely know that spanking, although it may very well work, is not an
> easy answer to a difficult situation. I would hope that people would be
> supportive of all parents no matter what their parenting approach or life
> situation.
>
> Julie
> _______________________________________________
> BlParent mailing list
> BlParent at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blparent_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> BlParent:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blparent_nfbnet.org/judy.jones%40icbvi.idaho.gov
> _______________________________________________
> BlParent mailing list
> BlParent at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blparent_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> BlParent:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blparent_nfbnet.org/jopinto%40msn.com
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2016 21:53:06 +0000
> From: Judy Jones <Judy.Jones at icbvi.idaho.gov>
> To: Blind Parents Mailing List <blparent at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [blparent] spanking and physical punishments
> Message-ID:
> <23f8cbee4e374d4fac784063001d91e6 at ICSDAGVP01.ics.idaho.gov>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> You got that right. Beople are getting very confused over these issues, and the kids will grow up to be confused as well. Kids are looking for guidelines, as we all are in our own way. I expect clear guidelines on the job from my supervisor, and if I were to hear one thing from my supervisor, yet another from her boss, everyone would be confused.
>
> Judy
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: BlParent [mailto:blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jo Elizabeth Pinto via BlParent
> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2016 3:49 PM
> To: Blind Parents Mailing List
> Cc: Jo Elizabeth Pinto
> Subject: Re: [blparent] spanking and physical punishments
>
> I agree with you, Judy. What's really too bad is that in the seventies and eighties, many times the local and state governments didn't intervene in true cases of child abuse when intervention was actually necessary.
> Sometimes intervention still doesn't happen when it should, but all too many times it happens when it shouldn't.
>
> Jo Elizabeth
>
> "The Bright Side of Darkness"
> is my newly published novel,
> available in Kindle, audio, and paperback formats at Amazon.com.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Judy Jones via BlParent
> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2016 2:35 PM
> To: Blind Parents Mailing List
> Cc: Judy Jones
> Subject: Re: [blparent] spanking and physical punishments
>
> I understand where you are coming from. We have a very confused society that is going to be rearing some very confused kids, but it is what it is, and it's too bad that the powers that be can't recognize the difference between child abuse and correction. Of course, I believe spanking should be the very last resort. There are numerous ways of gentle and positive discipline that work for more situations than not. My kids were born in the 80s, the rare instances of spanking worked for them, and they would tell you so. The real concern is that state and/or federal government is encroaching more and more on the home. In child abuse cases, this is a good thing, but otherwise not. If a child has an inkling that the parent does not have the control they should, he will take advantage of that. Too bad. The climate we live in shuns guidelines of many kinds, and we have yet to reap the reward.
>
> Judy
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: BlParent [mailto:blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Julie J.
> via BlParent
> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2016 2:16 PM
> To: Blind Parents Mailing List
> Cc: Julie J.
> Subject: [blparent] spanking and physical punishments
>
> I?ve noticed that a lot of the recent messages are pretty pushy about spanking and other physical punishments. I?m not judging, parent however you see fit. The thing is though that the repercussions for spanking and the like these days are very, very different than from the 70?s when a lot of us were growing up.
>
> Now if your kid tells his teacher his parents spank, the teacher will be reporting this to the powers that be. If you spank your kid in the grocery
> store, you could very well end up explaining your action to the police. If
> your child has a mark on him, even if it?s from a tumble off his bike, you are going to be answering a lot of questions from people in positions to make your life very, very miserable. Add in the fact that every one of us is blind and like it or not there is already some preconceived ideas at least by some professionals. Start with doubt, add in your child?s rendition of what happened, stir in a healthy dose of societal implications of spanking and what you have is a recipe for misery.
>
> I?ve been teaching parenting classes for 6 years or so now. I?ve worked with parents from abusive homes, parents who left abusive spouses, parents with kids with diagnosed behavior problems, parents with kids in the criminal justice system and your regular Ozzy and Harriet type of parents.
> There are effective alternatives to spanking. Alternatives that won?t create more problems for you. Also if you want the support of teachers, social workers, family doctor and mental health professionals you are going to have to pick a strategy that doesn?t involve physical punishments because no professional these days is going to promote that approach.
>
> As has been said before, spanking is considered abuse in some places. It?s also common for parents who have divorced or separated because of a adult abuse situation to have a court order that no physical punishment can be used with the children.
>
> I have no idea what the situation is with the original poster. I do absolutely know that spanking, although it may very well work, is not an easy answer to a difficult situation. I would hope that people would be supportive of all parents no matter what their parenting approach or life situation.
>
> Julie
> _______________________________________________
> BlParent mailing list
> BlParent at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blparent_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> BlParent:
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> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> BlParent:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blparent_nfbnet.org/jopinto%40msn.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
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>
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