[Electronics-Talk] Android-based braille notetakers

Wed Apr 6 21:16:33 UTC 2016

While I haven't seen the device yet, it is my understanding, from reading, and listening to podcasts that the refresh rate, and the way it refreshes are somewhat different than what we are used to. You don't get something for nothing, so tradeoffs had to be made. Time will tell what the price/performance balance is that people want and will accept.

Dave

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-----Original Message-----
From: Electronics-Talk [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jim McCarthy via Electronics-Talk
Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2016 4:01 PM
To: 'Discussion of accessible home electronics and appliances' <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
Cc: Jim McCarthy <jmccarthy at mdtap.org>
Subject: Re: [Electronics-Talk] Android-based braille notetakers

Tina,
I hear similar figures for the price of the device. It is doubtful that the cost will be less than $500 but even in such a case, that is considerably less money than any 20 cell display available today, half the price of the least expensive display about which I am aware. The Braille Pen 12 is, I think about $1,000 and it only has 12 cells. My point is that the group has certainly achieved the goal of reducing the cost of braille displays.
Jim McCarthy

-----Original Message-----
From: Electronics-Talk [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of tina sohl via Electronics-Talk
Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2016 4:56 PM
To: electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
Cc: tina sohl
Subject: Re: [Electronics-Talk] Android-based braille notetakers

Hi. I've heatrd it might be on  sale  by november  and be about 500$s, lets hope that's the case or less.
Original message:
> The effort is referred to as Transforming Braille, I think. The 
> project has a manufacturer and I am not really sure how it will be 
> distributed. It sounds to me like one will be able to buy a 20 cell 
> unit perhaps by September, though I am not completely certain about 
> that either. It also appears that cost will be considerably less than 
> the braille display products we all are used to seeing but I do not 
> know the probable cost to purchase one.
> Jim McCarthy

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Electronics-Talk [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
> Behalf Of Lauren Merryfield via Electronics-Talk
> Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2016 11:15 AM
> To: 'Discussion of accessible home electronics and appliances'
> Cc: Lauren Merryfield
> Subject: Re: [Electronics-Talk] Android-based braille notetakers

> Hi,
> What is the device the NFB is involved in? Where can we find out more 
> about it? I guess I've missed that one.
> Thanks,
> Lauren

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> -----Original Message-----
> From: Electronics-Talk [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
> Behalf Of Jim Barbour via Electronics-Talk
> Sent: Tuesday, April 5, 2016 7:12 AM
> To: Discussion of accessible home electronics and appliances 
> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: Jim Barbour <jbar at barcore.com>
> Subject: Re: [Electronics-Talk] Android-based braille notetakers

> I am assuming that you two are talking about the Braille note touch, 
> I've not heard of the apex touch.

> It definitely has a one line Braille display.

> It also comes with a touchscreen tablet that you can Braille into much 
> like the iPhone's braille input utility. It also comes with a case 
> that has traditional braille keys on it.

> Another android-based note taker that was introduced is the low cost 
> Braille display that the NFB has been involved in.  It definitely has 
> drawbacks, but will cost under $500 which will be interesting to some.

> Hope this helps,

> Jim

> Written While on the Move

>> On Apr 5, 2016, at 6:51 AM, Brad Hodges via Electronics-Talk
> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org> wrote:

>> Greetings:

>> I have had a brief audition of the Touch, and it includes a braille 
>> display. If it is a consideration, I'm sure if you contact humanware 
>> you can arrange an in-person audition. I don't know what plans the 
>> other manufacturers have for demonstrations.

>> My direct e-mail is brad.hodges at outlook.com, if you would like to 
>> communicate directly.

>> Brad

>>> On 4/5/2016 9:26 AM, Tracy Carcione via Electronics-Talk wrote:
>>> Thanks Brad.
>>> I looked at the ad for the Humanware Touch, but it does not appear 
>>> to have a braille display, which for me is a deal-breaker.
>>> Looking at the FS ad, it appears that the ElBraille will not be 
>>> available until at least convention.  Since my current notetaker 
>>> died suddenly and I'm now using my good old slate for notes, I'm not 
>>> sure I'm willing to wait that long.
>>> Your questions are certainly things worth thinking about.
>>> Both the NeoBraille and B2G say they can have cellular connectivity, 
>>> but don't specifically say one could use them for phone calls.
>>> Tracy

>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Electronics-Talk [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>> On Behalf Of Brad Hodges via Electronics-Talk
>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2016 9:02 AM
>>> To: Discussion of accessible home electronics and appliances
>>> Cc: Brad Hodges
>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-Talk] Android-based braille notetakers

>>> Tracy:

>>> While I was not at CSUN, I have had an opportunity to follow the 
>>> arrival of Android-based notetakers. In addition to the 2 you 
>>> mention, the Apex Touch, from Humanware is also available. Of the 3, 
>>> I would say that the Touch is the most available for immediate purchase.

>>> That having been said, in my opinion there are some very important 
>>> considerations created by the switch to the Android operating system 
>>> for our notetaker technology. Your questions illuminate several of 
>>> these. I also believe there is more that we don't know yet which we 
>>> should know in order to evaluate Android as a notetaker operating
system.

>>> Rather than relating my understanding of the 2 you mention, and 
>>> relate my very brief experience with the Touch, last week-end, I 
>>> would encourage you to formulate a comprehensive set of evaluation 
>>> criteria to use as you have the opportunity to audition each of the
>>> 3
> candidates.
>>> Additionally, don't discount Freedom Scientific's L-Braille, which 
>>> is based on Windows 10 and integrates one of the companies existing 
>>> braille displays with a module containing the processor.

>>> I strongly suggest that those interested in a new notetaker hold off 
>>> until the candidates have made their actual arrival and are ready 
>>> for
> purchase.

>>> This question might also be something which we may want to address 
>>> at Convention. Perhaps a panel organized by one of our De visions.

>>> Here are a few of the questions which come to my mind so far.

>>> Since they are using an operating system which is intended to 
>>> support a mobile device does the notetaker include the ability to 
>>> use cellular
> data?
>>> Will it support phone calls? How important is this to you?

>>> Which is more important, the availability of phone-like connectivity 
>>> and other exclusive features provided by Android, or an updated 
>>> experience with a familiar menu structure and existing  set of features?

>>> We are accustom to a very fast and responsive interface on legacy 
>>> devices, is the notetaker equally as responsive?

>>> How quickly can the notetaker be activated for immediate input, such 
>>> as capturing a note or appointment? Is there both a sleep mode and 
>>> power down mode? If so what is the difference?

>>> Is the interface logical and easy to follow?

>>> Since this is an Android device, what is the relationship between 
>>> the interface and apps provided by the manufacturer and those apps 
>>> available through the Play Store?

>>> Can Talkback, the Android screen reader be used? If so how does that 
>>> experience contrast with built in menus etc?

>>> How does the notetaker feel while in use? Is the form factor convenient?
>>> Are keys convenient and responsive? If a touch screen is used how do 
>>> your hands feel after an extended period of use?

>>> How do the braille cells feel? Do they meet your expectations if you 
>>> are experienced with notetaker or refreshable braille?

>>>   How important is the ability of the notetaker to become part of 
>>> your personal echo system, allowing contacts, calendars, documents 
>>> and such to be shared across all your devices and phone? Does the 
>>> notetaker facilitate this if it is of importance?

>>> At the time of product announcements, in mid-March, 3 different 
>>> versions of Android were used, 1 each on the 3 devices. What is the 
>>> significance, if any, of the version of Android used in the 
>>> notetaker
> when purchased?
>>> What is the impact of update availability, and who controls update
> releases?

>>> Those are just a few quick thoughts which have been running around 
>>> in my mind. I hope that they may be of some use. It has been my 
>>> experience that careful planning and a consistent record of your 
>>> experience can help you make a choice with which you will be very
> pleased.

>>> Brad

>>>> On 4/5/2016 7:16 AM, Tracy Carcione via Electronics-Talk wrote:
>>>> 2 new braille notetakers were announced at CSUN, the NeoBraille and 
>>>> the Braille2Go.  Both are based on android phones.

>>>> Did anyone happen to go to CSUN and actually use one of these new 
>>>> notetakers?

>>>> I'm in the market for a new braille notetaker, and I'd like to know 
>>>> what the interface for either of these is like.  Does one have to 
>>>> swipe around, or does one enter a command from the keyboard to 
>>>> bring up an app?  If I need to quickly scribble a note, does the 
>>>> device come on quickly, or do I have to mess around with unlocking 
>>>> it, then starting
>>> some app?
>>>> I know it's a long shot, but I'd love to hear from anyone who's 
>>>> actually had hands on one of these new devices.

>>>> Tracy