[Faith-talk] accessibility of church service material

Tue May 1 17:16:07 UTC 2012

Oh I probably took something the wrong way too.  

I know those kind of entitlement people as well.  

Yes, everything that is studied and more is available on a part of the LDS.org site in the accessibility link.  either mp3, PDF, daisy, talking book, or braille.  

I can't tell you how wonderful it is to be a part of the class instead of a listening only with no idea how to participate because they can't study the material ahead of time.

As I've said before, I've studied and participated in many, many denominations and finding accessible materials is difficult at best.

I thank Heavenly Father every day for such a wonderful church.

Jenny
On May 1, 2012, at 11:25 AM, Jeanette wrote:

> no,  thought you were talking about materials that others paid for, i sincerely appoligize Jenny, i in no way meant to hurt your feelings or offend you.  i guess my issue is this, i have known many blind folks who think that because they are blind they deserve free everything in regard to church and such, you obviously are not that way, i think that we deserve equal access to materials in any way we can get it, i think that if the church will work with us we should do what we can to get everything in accessable format and it sounds like you are blessed to have a great church that works to get it in that format for you. many of the smaller churches that are not of a major denomination have a problem with this, fortunately the LDS church is a big organization and has the resources to do all kinds of things that some others do not.
> i live right down the street from one of the biggest LDS churches here in town, it is twoblocks from the high school where my kids go, the members of this church are really involved with the school and community and a true blessing to us all, i particularly enjoy the Easter and Christmas performances their quiors have.  i assume that all materials are available in an accessable format, there is a lot of stuff provided for the congregation on the computer and if it is on the computer then blind folks can access,.
> again, i sincerely appoligize for anything i said that offended you or hurt your feelings, i think we had a missunderstanding about tithing and i am sorry. jeanette
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jenny Keller" <jlperdue3 at gmail.com>
> To: "Faith-talk,for the discussion of faith and religion" <faith-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2012 9:43 AM
> Subject: Re: [Faith-talk] accessibility of church service material
> 
> 
> I understand that, I know what the definition of tithing is.
> 
> I also know though, that no one else has to pay for their materials for any of the services or classes that are studied or participated in, so are you saying that because I am blind, and obviously in need of more assistance, and make less money than they do, that I should have to pay when no one else does.
> 
> That is unequal treatment, and I thought the NFB was all about equality.
> 
> I'm confused.
> 
> Jenny
> On May 1, 2012, at 10:34 AM, Jeanette wrote:
> 
>> if you read the Bible the purpose of tithing is not to pay for materials or anything like that at your church, it is not a payment plan for materials and such, tithing has to do with supporting your church in it's mission to reach the lost and needy, jeanette
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jenny Keller" <jlperdue3 at gmail.com>
>> To: "Faith-talk,for the discussion of faith and religion" <faith-talk at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2012 8:43 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Faith-talk] accessibility of church service material
>> 
>> 
>> No, I don't think the church should have to provide the braille materials for free.
>> 
>> However, I tithe every month to my church, and that should cover accessible material.  Some of us do not have a note taker either.
>> 
>> I'm not aware of any hymnal that has PDF formatting in any church, but I'm probably wrong in some cases.
>> 
>> I just feel that if the hymnal and study materials are provided free of church to everyone else, and the church is interested in our participation, and I pay tithes each month, which puts me in a difficult situation from the get go each month, I deserve a little help.  That's, in my opinion, not charity.
>> 
>> Jenny
>> On Apr 30, 2012, at 10:14 PM, Jeanette wrote:
>> 
>>> i think it is great that your church provides your materials to you, if a church can i think they  should, they provide the materials for sighted folks, i just find it amazing that blind folks think all the hymnals and such need to be put in braille and that is outrageously expensive and if you want them in braille get someone to put it in pdf or something  so you can write it down, i never have, i just listen and memorize on my own. i have a friend who thinks because she is blind she deserves everything provided to her because she is poor, i'm poor too, my software and scanner is something i've had for a long time because i homeschooled my kids for 7 years and my ex husband bought it for me back then, i am single now so money is truly tight.
>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jenny Keller" <jlperdue3 at gmail.com>
>>> To: "Faith-talk,for the discussion of faith and religion" <faith-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Monday, April 30, 2012 7:31 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [Faith-talk] accessibility of church service material
>>> 
>>> 
>>> I see your point.  But some of us don't have the money for OSR software or scanners.
>>> 
>>> As far as buying study materials, I'm not asking that they put it in Braille, but PDF, or audio format isn't that much to ask, I'd willing pay for that.
>>> 
>>> Fortunately in my church, all of our study materials are given to us free of charge.
>>> 
>>> That's what our tithing and donations pay for.
>>> 
>>> Jenny
>>> On Apr 30, 2012, at 7:43 PM, Jeanette wrote:
>>> 
>>>> i kind of look at it this way, sighted folks have to buy their materials, i do not think that because i am blind i need to be some kind of charity case and get some poor person to put it in an accessable format for me, i have Kurzweil so i can read just about anything that comes out, i do all the Beth Moore Bible studies using my Kurzweil scanner, also i feel like we all need to understand how expensive t is to produce braille or how expensive it is to buy the equipment to produce braille, if all things could be provided in a computer format then that would be nice but i do not think we as blind folks should expect it to be free for us, then we are acting like blind beggars instead of equal folks in the world, just my opinion. i am a single mom so i am not saying this because i have tons of money, i just want to be treated like everyone else and theya re expected to pay for the books and journals and such so i should too.
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Debbie Brown" <63characters at comcast.net>
>>>> To: "Faith-talk,for the discussion of faith and religion" <faith-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Sent: Monday, April 30, 2012 6:35 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [Faith-talk] accessibility of church service material
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> When most of us were growing up, most church materials were inaccessible,
>>>> and there wasn't much we could do about it.  These days, because most
>>>> printed material is produced on a computer, this situation seems to me to be
>>>> less acceptable.  I receive my church bulletin in accessible PDF, which is
>>>> actually better than the Word document (some techie may know why).
>>>> 
>>>> It is disturbing to me how much material for seminars and classes is
>>>> inaccessible.  While some ministries are working on a shoestring budget,
>>>> others are charging churches a lot of money for their materials, and in that
>>>> case I find inaccessibility unacceptable.  Some of these people seem more
>>>> worried about protecting their copyright than spreading the gospel, and I
>>>> have to wonder whether they are serving God or Mammon.
>>>> 
>>>> I have been able to get Lifeways Ministries to provide some of Beth Moore's
>>>> Bible courses, but it is more of a hassle than it should be, and I have to
>>>> go through this application every time.
>>>> 
>>>> I receive a journal in audio format called "Does God Exist," about the Bible
>>>> and science.  The editor of the journal, John Clayton, reads it himself, and
>>>> a blind guy duplicates it on CD for him.  He really is working on a
>>>> shoestring budget, but he has a blind son, so he gets accessibility.
>>>> 
>>>> Some teachers are very good at getting their class materials to me in time
>>>> for class.  One of the best at my church is a retired college professor, so
>>>> he knows how to make outlines and study guides.  Some of the worst are
>>>> actually professional preachers, because they have trouble using their
>>>> computers.  Older ones seem to have more trouble than younger ones.
>>>> 
>>>> I make it a point to ask, and I am trying to make it a policy not to buy
>>>> study materials for seminars that are not accessible.  We had one recently
>>>> at which nothing was accessible, and this person is supposed to be a college
>>>> professor at an online university.  I hope no blind guy wants to take his
>>>> classes, or he may find himself at the wrong end of a lawsuit.
>>>> 
>>>> I think we are not being unreasonable to ask for accessible materials, but
>>>> we ought to show some loving consideration for the particular individuals we
>>>> may be dealing with at church.
>>>> 
>>>> Debbie Brown
>>>> 
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jenny Keller" <jlperdue3 at gmail.com>
>>>> To: "Faith-talk,for the discussion of faith and religion"
>>>> <faith-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Sent: Monday, April 30, 2012 7:40 AM
>>>> Subject: Re: [Faith-talk] accessibility of church service material
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> I am a member of the LDS church.
>>>> 
>>>> the hymnals a two volume bound braille volumes and the Sunday School
>>>> material and Relief Society, which is our women's group materials are
>>>> available on the website via just reading it on the site and being aboe to
>>>> click on the scripture references, or audio that you can download or just
>>>> listen to in mp3 format.
>>>> 
>>>> the bulletins and such are not accessable.  But I'm sure if I asked them to
>>>> email me the contents they would.  I just never thought to do so.
>>>> 
>>>> Jenny
>>>> On Apr 29, 2012, at 11:36 PM, Ashley Bramlett wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>> I said I’d post something to generate discussion rather than the traffic about forwards or debate on what to post. IMO, if you have a question about posting a topic, ask the moderator off list.
>>>>> This sounds better to me than debating what topic is on topic for the list.
>>>>> We go through that ocasionally on other lists I’m on too; its annoying since the debate about the list just generates endless traffic with no answer.
>>>>> My topic here.
>>>>> For those of you going to church regularly, how is the accessibility of the material? I’ll speak to my methodist church growing up.
>>>>> They had a large braille hymnal of like 7 volumes for me. Other than that, the print wasn’t accessible. The schedule, bulletin, inserts of songs within the bulletin, etc was not accessible.  So I just listened to some songs and the other stuff read in the bulletin. For instance, we have to respond as a congregation to readings; I think its called the call to worship or something.
>>>>> I stood and listened to that. Everyone else reads from their sheet.
>>>>> I got a lot out of church since everyone hears the announcements, sermon, etc, but do not feel I was able to fully participate.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Ashley
>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>> 
>>>> 
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>> 
>> 
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> 
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