[Faith-Talk] South Carolina avenue, Christ in Truth

Thu Dec 19 18:19:14 UTC 2019

Hello Mostafa.

First I want you to know that I am not going to answer all your questions. I can tell you’ve thought things through and you have good questions. However some of your statements seem to assume things. There are many many Christians who get up early in the morning before they go to work and have what they call “quiet time with God“. While it isn’t like Islam in the fact that everyone knew matter where they are turns to ward A certain place simultaneously to pray, many many Christians do spend time reading their Bibles and praying. And many families also have devotionals in the early morning before the kids go off to school and the parents go to work. Many Christian denominations also as a family practice or personal practice go back into the Scriptures, pray, and read devotions before they go to bed.

As to your question about why we engage in pagan-based rituals during the holidays I can only speak for myself. Not everyone is aware of their origins. The purpose my husband and I send out Christmas cards or decorate a Christmas tree is because it brings some joy to our hearts. Christmas cards are way of sharing or Faith because we usually send out religious message cards and keep in touch with those far away that are special to us. Most years there’s a note or a Christmas letter En losed.  We’re letting people we love know that we love them and so does the Trinity. As for a Christmas tree, it is just something pretty to decorate the house for the most part. Ornaments are usually on our tree anyhow things that were given to us from those we love or we made as children. It’s more of a reflective time when you’re decorating the tree. Santa really has no place in our house. Santa was not high priority in my family growing up either. We went to church, came home to a simple supper and everyone was allowed to pick one gift from the tree underneath to open Christmas Eve. It symbolized The Christ child who came into our lives so many years ago. We also had a nativity scene to remind us of why we were celebrating this holiday and every day we move the getting a little bit closer and the baby Jesus was not put in the manger until Christmas Eve.

From what I have read the origins of the Christmas tree for example were to show the pagans that they didn’t have to give up everything to become Christians. The lights on the tree how many times a star on top remind us of The Christ child in the light who brings to darkness. Darkness being an emptiness and unconnected spiritual  something  that they cannot find. Many times it leads them to do things that are not pleasing either in society or to God. A.k.a. sin. 

I hope this helps you some. I’m sorry that my day does not permit me to Terri on the list. 

May you have a good day Mustafa. Oh it just came to my mind that my pharmacist has the same name as you and is indeed Muslim. So you can’t say that Christians and Muslims don’t get along here.  

Ericka Nelson

> On Dec 19, 2019, at 10:08 AM, Mustafa Almahdy via Faith-Talk <faith-talk at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Well, Joy, I haven’t brought these biblical quotes out of my own. This
> is the text of the book which you allegedly hold up to. What does it
> mean, when in Mark 1:35, it says,  “In the early morning, while it was
> still dark, Jesus got up, left the house, and went away to a secluded
> place, and was praying there.” Why would God implore in a solitary
> region? Incidentally, do you know who nowadays pray regularly at dawn?
> They’re Muslims. Why do you consider engaging with me to be somewhat
> hazardous? Aren’t you sufficiently confident of what you believe? I
> firmly have entered into descisive debates with haters of Islam. I
> have done so because my faith is quite significant for me. Faith
> resembles a major factor of my everyday life. Nonetheless, it seems
> that at the faith talk discussion board, blindness is more
> substantial. I have included in the blind carbon copy field contact
> information of various pastors. I’d like to ask them, what made the
> Church tolerant with  celebrating  the birthday of Mithra, a Romanic
> idol as the one of Christ? As everyone knows, Christmas origin dates
> to pagan tradition. Thence, within the historical process, Christmas
> tree, cake, cards, carols and so on have gradually been embraced as an
> essential part of this controversial occasion. I thence demand an
> answer to this critical concern. I have the right to sternly take up
> this stance. Jesus is one of the mightiest apostles of Islam. I
> therefore have the right to robustly interrogate those who intently
> alter the genuine Nativity tale. It is wholly narrated in the sacred
> scripture of the Koran called Mary. Allah has willingly created Jesus
> in the womb of virgin Mary, without any masculine intervention. Isn’t
> He glory be to Him indeed capable of all things? Islam is the religion
> of Jesus and Christendom is just the one about him. Why do you feel
> offended as the truth speaks out? Well, it’s already there, in the
> Bible that you swear in with, so, watch out.
> 
>> On 12/17/19, BRUCE&JOY BRESLAUER via Faith-Talk <faith-talk at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> Why are you on this list?
>> 
>> You are speaking the truth as you see it.  We Christians speak the truth as
>> we
>> see it.  Each of us thinks we have been given our information from God.  You
>> 
>> think we are wrong.  We think you are wrong.  There will be no meeting of
>> the
>> minds, especially if you persist in your warped perception of Christianity.
>> 
>> Anyway, as you have been told many times, this is not the place to discuss
>> it.
>> 
>> I urge you to stop.  I thought at one time I might be able to engage you in
>> 
>> some meaningful dialogue with short responses to your questions, but I have
>> 
>> changed my mind.  No one on this list will risk dialogue with you because
>> this
>> is not the list on which to do it.
>> 
>> If blindness is not your thing, then find another list.  Joy
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Faith-Talk <faith-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Mustafa
>> Almahdy
>> via Faith-Talk
>> Sent: Monday, December 16, 2019 4:59 PM
>> To: Faith-talk, for the discussion of Blindness in faith and religion
>> <faith-talk at nfbnet.org>
>> Cc: Mustafa Almahdy <against.trump2001 at gmail.com>
>> Subject: Re: [Faith-Talk] South Carolina avenue, Christ in Truth
>> 
>> I'd like to make it clear to everyone here, that I am not suppose to talk
>> about
>> blindness unless I have proper motive to do so. For me, before being blind,
>> I
>> am a theologist who knows about both, Islam and Christianity. I'd like to
>> add
>> some points to my previous rebuttal.
>> Although the story of Adam and Eve is mentioned in Genesis, the current
>> concept
>> of Original Sin as known by Christians has been later developed by Saul of
>> Tarsus whom Christians today refer to as, Saint Paul. This concept is
>> basically
>> the backbone of Christian faith as we know it today. Unlike the Koran, the
>> Bible is thought to be divided to Old and New Testaments. In the Old
>> Testament,
>> God is clearly one and such concepts of Jesus being divine, the Trinity etc,
>> 
>> haven't been mentioned there. True, Christian apologists unsuccessfully
>> attempt
>> to strangely interpret things like, let's make man in our immage and so on,
>> 
>> still, that doesn't explicitly speak of what has been later inserted by Paul
>> 
>> and other authors. There are 29 verse of Jesus praying throughout the
>> parables.
>> I just don't know folks, where could I go with Luke 6:12 as it says: "It was
>> at
>> this time that He went off to the mountain to pray, and He spent the whole
>> night in prayer to God." How could he be divine afterward? How are you folks
>> 
>> able to intently dispose of such plain evidence and falsely  stick to what
>> is
>> implicitly construed? It is quite odd for me to be deceitful of myself as
>> such.
>> Jesus has been plainly portrayed as someone who devotes himself to submit in
>> 
>> full recognition and obeisance to Allah glory be to Him. Had he been divine,
>> he
>> would have not demanded to implore onto the most High. At his time of
>> cataclysm, he prayed onto his Lord to help him. In Matthew 26:39, Jesus
>> says:
>> "And He went a little beyond them, and fell on His face and prayed, saying,
>> "My
>> Father, if it is possible, let this cup pass from Me; yet not as I will, but
>> as
>> You will." Is this the disposal of an exalted being? Muslims therefore
>> believe,
>> that Jesus, peace be upon him was sent to people by God to deliver His
>> message
>> to them. That was the same mission of Moses, David, Solomon, John,
>> Zechariah,
>> Noah, Abraham, Isaac, Ishmael, Jacob and so on. Implicit in that, Islam is
>> the
>> religion of all those prophets, as they have been sealed by Muhammad, peace
>> and
>> blessings be upon him. In Islam, God doesn't need someone to die on the
>> Cross
>> to forgive us. He glory be to Him is providentially Omnipotent  and
>> eminently
>> Self-sufficient to do so. The Christian concept of redemption is
>> intellectually
>> purblind. As plainly stated in the parables, Jesus has unappeasably implored
>> to
>> God in seclusion. That's the common temperament of the pious. He thence
>> couldn't
>> be worshipping and being worshipped simultaneously. I urge you folks to seek
>> 
>> the truth and deferentially comply to it. Despite the consequences, truth is
>> 
>> loud and worthy to be unconditionally consecrated. Let us just be impartial
>> as
>> we view such critical matters.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On 12/15/19, Mustafa Almahdy via Faith-Talk <faith-talk at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>> Well, blindness doesn't resemble a major element of my life. I am not
>>> used to speak, blindness blindness. Faith is rather a crucial factor
>>> of my life.
>>> 
>>> On 12/15/19, David Andrews via Faith-Talk <faith-talk at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>> The key words there are faith and blindness -- not just faith.
>>>> 
>>>> Dave
>>>> 
>>>> At 11:21 PM 12/14/2019, you wrote:
>>>>> Well, David, the threat of removing me for speaking briefly about my
>>>>> religion is not delineated in the listâ?Ts major guidelines. On the
>>>>> listâ?Ts info page, it says this:
>>>>> â?oFaith-talk is a list where people can discuss matters related to
>>>>> faith and/or blindness.
>>>>> Persons of all faiths are welcome.â?  It never conditioned specific
>>>>> subjects not to be discussed as long as they fit in these two main
>>>>> categories, faith, and, blindness. So, donâ?Tt threaten me with
>>>>> removing me, just do it if you want to. I simply donâ?Tt appreciate
>>>>> such tone, clear? Well again, Jesus said, I am the way to the Father.
>>>>> He also said, I and the Father are one. Both mean the same thing my
>>>>> dear. Did he ever say, I and the Father are the same. Jesus is the
>>>>> only way to the Father, and so, is Muhammad, Moses, David, Solomon,
>>>>> Noah, Abraham, Lot etc etc. They all came to us with the same
>>>>> message, calling people to worship God alone. In Islam, God is
>>>>> providentially Omnipotent. He thence is able to forgive us, without
>>>>> the need to formulate this dramatic scenario. People are not expected
>>>>> to be perfect. They just need to do their best to get morally
>>>>> elicited and to spiritually be elevated, gradually bit by bit until
>>>>> they reach up to the celestial realm. I urge you once again, to make
>>>>> sure that you type the name of prophet Muhammad correctly. Youâ?Tve
>>>>> misspelled it twice and I dislike to assume that of being somewhat
>>>>> deliberate. So, based on what Jesus said and did, in the Bible you
>>>>> wholly hold up to, he simply cannot be God. Thatâ?Ts why, Christians
>>>>> constantly demand to methodologically palter as it comes to this
>>>>> critical concern. How could we explain then my dear, Jesus implores
>>>>> to God, on multiple occasions throughout the parables. Well, here are
>>>>> some quotes of that.
>>>>> Hebrews 5:7, â?oIn the days of His flesh, He offered up both prayers
>>>>> and supplications with loud crying and tears to the One able to save
>>>>> Him from death, and He was heard because of His piety.â?  Three
>>>>> questions here, first, if he is truly divine, why was he praying
>>>>> then? Second, How could he be described as pious if he is divine?
>>>>> Third, if he is divine indeed, why was
>>>>> he yelling for redemption?    Well, here is
>>>>> another quote: â?oMatthew 14:23, â?oAfter He had sent the crowds
>>>>> away, He went up on the mountain by Himself to pray; and when it was
>>>>> evening, He was there alone.â?  Well, my question here is, does God
>>>>> need to unfeignedly implore in seclusion? Just call it a day folks,
>>>>> itâ?Ts either black or white. Jesus cannot be human and divine at the
>>>>> same time. That just cannot be discerned. You will tell me then,
>>>>> well, God can do whatever he wants eh? Well, can he die? Can God die?
>>>>> According to you, yes. But, if he is fully capable of doing anything,
>>>>> why couldnâ?Tt he just forgive us? In Islam, when Adam and Eve
>>>>> sinned, God taught them how to repent and they have been forgiven,
>>>>> simple, easy and straightforward. God is all wise and he doesnâ?Tt do
>>>>> things that are quite illogical and meaningless. Can God oppress
>>>>> someone? According to your eccentric narrative of the tale, he
>>>>> actuallly has done. When he sacrificed the innocent on the behalf of
>>>>> the guilty. He thence ordains us of maintaining justice. How is that
>>>>> possibly conciliated? As you guys can see, the matter here
>>>>> exacerbates. I genuinely do not destine to provoke or offend anyone
>>>>> here. I just urge people to ponder in the light of what the scripture
>>>>> has actually taught. Lastly, kindly, if Iâ?Tll be unsubscribed for
>>>>> whatever motive, just keep me noticed in advanced, thank you. On
>>>>> 12/15/19, David Moore via Faith-Talk <faith-talk at nfbnet.org> wrote: >
>>>>> What about Jesus saying in John 14 where Jesus says, > â?oI am the
>>>>> way, the truth, and the life. No man comes to the Father but by > me!
>>>>>> That sure sounds like Jesus is God himself to me! > What does that
>>>>> mean to you? > How this in Acts chapter 4; > Salvation is found in
>>>>> nobody else, for there is no other name under Heaven, > given to man
>>>>> by which one must be saved! > What does that mean to you? > Next, did
>>>>> Muhamad rise from the dead for you to be your advocate in heaven >
>>>>> between you and the Father? > Do you believe you need to be perfect
>>>>> to enter Heaven! > Scripture says that none of us our perfect. > That
>>>>> is why we need a savior to forgive all of our sins! > We need every
>>>>> sin forgiven, scripture says, to enter heaven! > Islam just does not
>>>>> jive with these scriptures, show me how it does! > David Moore > >
>>>>> Sent from Mail for Windows 10 > >
>>>>> From: Mustafa Almahdy via Faith-Talk > Sent:
>>>>> Saturday, December 14, 2019 7:24 AM > To:
>>>>> debbiedrylie at gmail.com; moore at donaldmoore.org; >
>>>>> dlgoza at jeffersonbaptist.org; erickelly at bellsouth.net;
>>>>> a.bentson at comcast.net; > vance.jenkins at bsumc.com;
>>>>> beverly.clapp at bsumc.com; joyce.ford at bsumc.com; >
>>>>> robpowl306 at gmail.com; chris.malaska at bsumc.com;
>>>>> stacy.phillips at bsumc.com; > debbie.friddle at bsumc.com;
>>>>> faithfreedom2 at gmail.com; faith-talk at nfbnet.org; >
>>>>> kbaggett at brainerdbaptist.org; adooley at ebcjackson.org; >
>>>>> amanda.poff at nashvillefirst.org;
>>>>> tom.crow at nashvillefirst.org; >
>>>>> kelly.ablaza at longhollow.com;
>>>>> mike.anthony at longhollow.com; >
>>>>> onecrowsnest at gmail.com; josh.hrbc at gmail.com; hrbcmusic at gmail.com; >
>>>>> wandawiles at charter.net; lee3066 at bellsouth.net > Cc: Mustafa Almahdy >
>>>>> Subject: [Faith-Talk] South Carolina avenue, Christ in Truth > > On
>>>>> each and every Sunday, Christians around the world gather at >
>>>>> Churches to glorify Christ. They consider him deified.
>>>>> Nonetheless, he > never expressed that about himself explicitly. It
>>>>> is immensely > perilous to lay Christians to dig into the Bible
>>>>> themselves because > it's most unlikely that they'll find Jesus
>>>>> enjoining people to worship > him. There are two main set of
>>>>> statements regarding Jesus's > phraseology in the scripture. Explicit
>>>>> and implicit statements.
>>>>> What > is an explicit statement? It is what has been stated plainly,
>>>>> readily > observable, leaving nothing to implication. Such as Jesus
>>>>> saying in > John 3:17:; "Now this is eternal life, that they know
>>>>> you, the only > true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent." So
>>>>> here, Jesus > clearly acknowledges divinity and monotheism to the One
>>>>> and true God > and declares himself being sent by Him to convey His
>>>>> message to > people. Then, we have implicit statements, whereas some
>>>>> of them are > allegedly attributed to Jesus or possibly misconstrued
>>>>> by some > apologists for essentially systematic theology motives.
>>>>> Such as Jesus > saying in John 10:30; "I and the Father are one".
>>>>> Christian apologists > assert he has meant they are one in entity
>>>>> while the text > presumptively entails they are one in identity.
>>>>> Another instance, > where Jesus explicitly distinguishes between
>>>>> himself and God. Jesus > says in John 8:40; "As it is, you are
>>>>> looking for a way to kill me, a > man who has told you the truth that
>>>>> I heard from God." According to > the Bible you wholly hold up to,
>>>>> this was Jesus speaking to the Jews. > This particular passage has
>>>>> three crucial messages to catch. First > off, Jesus declared that
>>>>> Jews attempted to kill him. Thence, I > actually don't fathom the
>>>>> awkward relationship today between those who > allegedly are the
>>>>> followers of Jesus and those who, according to > scripture, were
>>>>> sternly hostile to him. Second, Jesus unambiguously > stated that he
>>>>> is a man who heard the word of God and destined to pass > it through
>>>>> to people. He didn't say I am God in man incarnate or any > of that.
>>>>> So, the personification of the divine in the character of > Jesus is
>>>>> a later developed doctrine called the Hypostatic union. It is >
>>>>> interesting to note, that historically, this particular doctrine has
>>>>>> only been prefaced at the Council of Chalcedon in the year (451). >
>>>>> Consequently, it is demonstratively fallacious to embrace such tenet
>>>>>> as it has been decisively probed to be absolutely mendacious. >
>>>>> Moreover, according to your own version of the Bible, in English, the
>>>>>> description of Jesus's mission precisely befits the definition of >
>>>>> prophethood in Islam. Third, Jesus says he heard the truth from God.
>>>>>> So, what is it? It is the message that he plainly stated in John
>>>>> 3:17 > as quoted above.
>>>>> Furthermore, Jesus spoke the truth as he delivered > the message to a
>>>>> tremendous croud as he uttered a magnanimous speech > known
>>>>> biblically as sermon on the mount. In this major discourse, he >
>>>>> taught the public what is biblically known as the Lord's prayer. If >
>>>>> you Read this, while parallelly citing the opening of the Koran >
>>>>> translated into English, you will discover a gravely unexpected >
>>>>> similarity. I won't be taken aback, because it is yet the same
>>>>> message > of Monotheism. Jesus implored to God.
>>>>> If he was himself God, it would > have been quite irrational of Jesus
>>>>> praying to himself. I urge > pastoral staff and their loyally fellow
>>>>> congregants, to unfeignedly > seek the truth regarding Jesus's solely
>>>>> spoken word in the Gospel. > Trust me, after I read the Bible many
>>>>> times, my faith and conviction > of Islam being the true pathway to
>>>>> the celestial realm has > strengthened leastwise two fold. I do hope
>>>>> that you find this message > to you encouraging not frustrating. It
>>>>> is not my nature to deride or > marginalise someone's belief. Please,
>>>>> read the whole gospel and > earnestly seek to find what Jesus says in
>>>>> it. I do not recognise the > words spoken by Paul or others about
>>>>> Jesus. I only care about what was > directly spoken by Jesus.
>>>>> The essence of this message is quite plain. > Find the truth and
>>>>> stick to it. I wholeheartedly say to you, If I knew > that
>>>>> Christianity is indeed the truth and only path to salvation, I >
>>>>> would have unhesitatingly embraced it. This is not a joke nor it
>>>>> bears > to be. > > _______________________________________________ >
>>>>> Faith-Talk mailing list > Faith-Talk at nfbnet.org >
>>>> 
>>>> 
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>>> 
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>> 
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> 
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