[Job-Discussions] introduction and two questions.

Fri Jan 14 15:18:13 UTC 2022

Hi all,

What an interesting thread. I'm not sure Melissa envisioned her
question turning into this discussion.

I agree with Karen in a way. Throughout the pandemic, I have been
asking myself how we can market ourselves to employers who are
desperate for workers. It seems tragic to me that we are left out of
the labor market in general, but at a time like this, it's just so
unnecessary. But we must target our campaigns like Dick suggests. It's
not all about advertising and hoping for the best. Unfortunately,
employers need more than that.

Accessibility is an even larger barrier than many of us probably
realize. The gap between the development of technology and the amount
of that technology we can access is ever increasing. I took a job this
summer, and I actually needed a reader just to do simple tasks, like
helping me fill out a time sheet and make online documents accessible.
And this was with an employer who did everything they could to
accommodate. The tendency is to believe that work from home jobs are
the solution, but my experience working from home has been that
employers are more difficult to get a hold of when there are issues,
and the time spent waiting for responses and fixes is much longer than
it would be in person.

Ok, so my complaining session is over. These are just my observations.
I think the employment committee has done a lot in the last several
years. But I also think that it takes a village to raise an employer.
Maybe I shouldn't sound so flip, but even the most open of employers
need educating. So it's not an advertising campaign we need, it's
people who are willing to sit down and educate potential employers.
And that's the tough part. We have to convince them that once they are
properly educated, they will get talented employees out of the
bargain. In some cases, we have to convince them that literally
overhalling their inaccessible systems is worth it. And sadly, for
some employers, it won't be.

However... We should definitely engage in those training efforts where
we can. We need to engage the best minds in accessibility to tackle
those barriers, and we should have them team up with those who have
the power to change attitudes about blindness. The truth is that
Robert is right. Most sighted people have never even met a blind
person, and they don't know how we do the most basic of life tasks.

Perhaps this is what the employment committee is already doing. I
don't know the details. But as someone who has been and will be in the
job market sooner than I would like, I have been pondering possible
strategies for improving the employment outcomes for blind people. I
wish every affiliate could have an employment specialist to work on
local employment issues. I wish, like Dick said, chapters would have
an employment focus time at every meeting or separate from meetings.
The employment focus time could also include info about volunteer and
educational as well as advancement opportunities for those who may not
be looking for work for whatever reason.

Getting blind people employed has to be a coordinated team effort. I
love that so many of us on this list are willing to help. I am also
passionate about this topic and will be glad to help in any way I can.
The key for blind people is to not give up, to keep moving/seeking in
whatever ways we can, and to stick together. If employers don't want
to hire us, then we must try to motivate and inspire one another so
that we have the courage to keep trying, keep approaching, and
continue working together to educate them.

Good luck, Melissa. Hopefully you find some promising opportunities at
the job fair coming up soon.

Julie

On 1/13/22, Justin Williams via Job-Discussions
<job-discussions at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> True.
>
> You've put forth a yeomen's effort.
>
> Justin
>
>
>
>
>
> From: Job-Discussions [mailto:job-discussions-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
> Of Ericka via Job-Discussions
> Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2022 3:09 PM
> To: Job Discussions internet Mailing List <job-discussions at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: Ericka <dotwriter1 at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Job-Discussions] introduction and two questions.
>
>
>
> I agree Justin. There isn’t much here though. One independent living center
> and Wisconsin does things very differently from another. And nothing in the
> state of Wisconsin required to fill out or websites mind you is accessible.
> It’s a fight we have been fighting and are still losing it. The staff on the
> ground knows that things aren’t accessible. The upper echelon who makes the
> decisions doesn’t care. You can get anything from the state of Wisconsin in
> a different language. Rail in large print is not one of them. They build an
> app that isn’t accessible so the letters that you could read  are still not
> accessible. I can’t do it alone. I’m trying to do my best.
>
>
>
> I wish we had the amount of NFB members in Wisconsin that we used to.
>
> Ericka Nelson
>
>
>
>
>
> On Jan 13, 2022, at 9:11 AM, Justin Williams via Job-Discussions
> <job-discussions at nfbnet.org <mailto:job-discussions at nfbnet.org> > wrote:
>
> 
>
> Joining network after work for some of you might be good on the meet up
> list.
>
>
>
> Using mainstreme community resources in combination with what we are doing
> will be good.
>
>
>
> Justin
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> From: Job-Discussions [mailto:job-discussions-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
> Of Ericka via Job-Discussions
> Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2022 9:18 AM
> To: Job Discussions internet Mailing List <job-discussions at nfbnet.org
> <mailto:job-discussions at nfbnet.org> >
> Cc: Ericka <dotwriter1 at gmail.com <mailto:dotwriter1 at gmail.com> >
> Subject: Re: [Job-Discussions] introduction and two questions.
>
>
>
> Exactly what I was trying to say. This is what I want to have happen. If
> they can put that much energy into automatic cars which I don’t trust they
> can put this much energy into educating employers. Problem with the career
> fair is that most of the people out there are tech companies which doesn’t
> go well with my social work skills. Plus at my age I don’t want to move out
> of the area just for a minimum wage job because I haven’t had a lot of
> direct experience. What you’re doing will help the 18 and 19-year-olds, but
> not us who have probably another good 20 years to work. I didn’t get any
> training in how to advocate for reasonable accommodations when I was at
> BLIND Inc.. I asked but nobody would talk to me. I have experience in the
> political arena but not good experiences with employers. They don’t take
> blind people seriously one on one . That’s my experience. The amount of
> education needed I can’t provide the entire city of Janesville for example.
> And not all of us my age are text savvy enough.
>
> Ericka Nelson
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Jan 12, 2022, at 9:00 PM, Karen Rose via Job-Discussions
> <job-discussions at nfbnet.org <mailto:job-discussions at nfbnet.org> > wrote:
>
> Are there people with the NFB marketing team who could flush out this type
> of plan? I am not trained in marketing but rather in career coaching and in
> psychotherapy, and I know we have others much better qualified to manage and
> to budget for any type of marketing campaign. It is difficult to target
> specific individual employers locally, as most small businesses at least are
> struggling just to stay open. I know that there are many blind people with
> excellent education and training, who would love to be working now and
> filling some of their needs. Many have already gone through  training in
> interview skills and in how to request reasonable accommodations. I am
> thrilled to see that and if P is working on projects to match blind people
> with specific employers. I would love to be helpful in this if I can. Please
> let me know if there is anything I can do to be helpful. :-)
>
> Karen Rose MFT/LPCC www.career-therapy.net <http://www.career-therapy.net>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Jan 12, 2022, at 2:51 PM, Richard Davis via Job-Discussions
> <job-discussions at nfbnet.org <mailto:job-discussions at nfbnet.org> > wrote:
>
> 
>
> Hi Karen and Ericka,
>
>
>
> Employers are experiencing labor shortages and are working with us in the
> NFB to hire blind people. They realize that blind people can fill their
> needs. We are currently working with lots of them, and with the expansion of
> our website coming in the next year, we will have many tools to offer them.
> Right now, we are running into these problems:
>
>
>
> Lack of accessibility to employer systems, which often requires system
> redesign.
>
> Lack of understanding about reasonable accommodations, which in the case of
> Amazon, is not a trivial matter, as some of their job functions are not and
> probably cannot be made accessible, in which case we are looking at
> selective job placement and work-arounds.
>
> Lack of decent education, rehabilitation, career planning, and career
> training for blind people, who sometimes lack the most basic interview
> skills.
>
>
>
> Having a national ad campaign is expensive and probably doesn't go deep
> enough to address the above problems.  I am not averse to sharing your idea
> with the Employment Committee, but in order tor me to do so, it needs to
> arrive in the form of a fully fleshed out plan with a budget, media to be
> targeted, and planned employer penetration rate.  Also a fundraising plan.
>
>
>
> Let me suggest some alternatives:
>
>
>
> Got local employers? Go talk to them, and see if they are interested in
> working with us.
>
> Hold training sessions for local chapter members on job seeking skills.
>
> Work with your state rehab agency to make sure blind people are getting good
> training for real jobs.
>
> Go to the NFB website, access the Self-Advocacy Employment Toolkit and teach
> people how to use it:
> https://nfb.org/programs-services/advocacy/advocacy-resources/self-advocacy-employment-toolkit
>
> The NFB legal program has other resources for job seekers and employers.
> Please explore and use these valuable tools.
>
>
>
> I don't mean to discourage any of you, but we are far beyond the point where
> PSA's are going to work. We need face to face contacts.
>
>
>
> I think talking to local colleges with business programs is an excellent
> idea. Why don't you all come up with a plan to do that and carry it out?
> Everything helps.
>
>
>
> Best,
>
> Dick Davis
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 12, 2022 at 4:13 PM Karen Rose via Job-Discussions
> <job-discussions at nfbnet.org <mailto:job-discussions at nfbnet.org> > wrote:
>
> Is this something that the employment committee might be interested in? If
> so I would love to work with them :-)
>
> Karen Rose MFT/LPCC www.career-therapy.net <http://www.career-therapy.net>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Jan 12, 2022, at 12:29 PM, Ericka via Job-Discussions
> <job-discussions at nfbnet.org <mailto:job-discussions at nfbnet.org> > wrote:
>
> I agree with you Karen. Dick why don’t you take notes and let’s get a video
> PSA on TV and a radio campaign. You can’t tell me that there aren’t talented
> people at headquarters or in the NFB that can’t make this happen. These
> videos can be put on LinkedIn as well.
>
> Ericka Nelson
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Jan 12, 2022, at 11:55 AM, Karen Rose via Job-Discussions
> <job-discussions at nfbnet.org <mailto:job-discussions at nfbnet.org> > wrote:
>
> But wouldn’t this be an excellent time for us to run a marketing campaign
> to employers and recruiters letting them know how available we are, how
> willing we are to work and to show up, and that we are here, ready and able
> to fill their open positions, thus allowing their businesses to remain open?
> Many businesses are closing for periods of time due to lack of staffing. We
> could be the people who allow them to remain open. Right now there are more
> jobs open than there are people wanting to work.
>
> Karen Rose MFT/LPCC www.career-therapy.net <http://www.career-therapy.net>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Jan 12, 2022, at 9:21 AM, Robert Sollars via Job-Discussions
> <job-discussions at nfbnet.org <mailto:job-discussions at nfbnet.org> > wrote:
>
> 
>
> Having on that side of the business for most of my career, half at least,
> it’s very simple;
>
> The less they hire disabled, of any kind, individuals the less paperwork
> they have to do and the less they have to worry about with properly
> implementing all of the laws, rules, regulations, and pitfalls of hiring
> someone like that.
>
> I’m in the process of developing a evacuation, generalized of course, for
> employers to follow with disabled employees so that they can better relate
> to and plan for us.
>
> Robert
>
>
>
> From: Job-Discussions <job-discussions-bounces at nfbnet.org
> <mailto:job-discussions-bounces at nfbnet.org> > On Behalf Of Brian Hatgelakas
> via Job-Discussions
> Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2022 9:24 AM
> To: Job Discussions internet Mailing List <job-discussions at nfbnet.org
> <mailto:job-discussions at nfbnet.org> >
> Cc: Brian Hatgelakas <bhatgelakas at gmail.com <mailto:bhatgelakas at gmail.com>
>>
> Subject: Re: [Job-Discussions] introduction and two questions.
>
>
>
> why do people in HR act like that?
>
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 12, 2022 at 11:21 AM Robert Sollars via Job-Discussions
> <job-discussions at nfbnet.org <mailto:job-discussions at nfbnet.org> > wrote:
>
> iT is unfortunately, but someones first impression is what gives the leeway
> for dismissing or not offering the job…because they do’t understand or wish
> to limit their liability because of a disabled person in the
> organization…trust me, I seen it many times when I was sighted
>
> Robert
>
>
>
> From: Job-Discussions <job-discussions-bounces at nfbnet.org
> <mailto:job-discussions-bounces at nfbnet.org> > On Behalf Of Brian Hatgelakas
> via Job-Discussions
> Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2022 9:09 AM
> To: Job Discussions internet Mailing List <job-discussions at nfbnet.org
> <mailto:job-discussions at nfbnet.org> >
> Cc: Brian Hatgelakas <bhatgelakas at gmail.com <mailto:bhatgelakas at gmail.com>
>>
> Subject: Re: [Job-Discussions] introduction and two questions.
>
>
>
> Yes they can be?   because why would I waste time going to an interview to
> be turned away   doing this is this in my opinion is the same as turning
> away a regular bodied african american bassed soley on their skin color.
>
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 12, 2022 at 10:53 AM Ericka via Job-Discussions
> <job-discussions at nfbnet.org <mailto:job-discussions at nfbnet.org> > wrote:
>
> Yeah that’s true. But then when they shorten up an interview you know some
> thing is “not right“ with them. You can hear it in their voice especially
> when you walk in and they see the cane. It’s either too quiet or some other
> thing. My husbands had the experience where you went to the interview, the
> receptionist saw him with his cane being totally blind and reported that to
> the person they were supposed to speak to. Then the receptionist came back
> and said that the person was busy and couldn’t meet with him. That’s the
> signal for we’re freaking out here and if we don’t interview you and pass
> you up then we can’t be held responsible for being discriminatory.
>
> Ericka Nelson
>
>
>
> On Jan 11, 2022, at 4:03 PM, Melissa R Green via Job-Discussions
> <job-discussions at nfbnet.org <mailto:job-discussions at nfbnet.org> > wrote:
>
> 
>
> Oh my goodness. That is so true. You have to go through many rejections.
> And, you do know who is interested in hiring you and who is just going
> through the motions.
>
> Those people are usually freaking out. But you don’t know it because they
> can still go through the interview.
>
>
>
> Best!Melissa R Green and PJ
>
> Scentsy consultant readerlissa.scentsy.us <http://readerlissa.scentsy.us>
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
>
> On Jan 10, 2022, at 2:43 PM, Ericka Nelson via Job-Discussions
> <job-discussions at nfbnet.org <mailto:job-discussions at nfbnet.org> > wrote:
>
> Oh Robert you bomb! You have to have 50% optimism and 50% realism to look
> for a job. The trick is to figure out who is most sincere about hiring you
> had a job interview and who is just going through the motions.
>
> Ericka J. Nelson
>
> 1927 Green Valley Dr.
>
> Janesville WI 53546
>
> H: 608-754-8671
>
> C: 262-434-0817
>
>
>
> On Jan 10, 2022, at 12:06 PM, Robert Sollars via Job-Discussions
> <job-discussions at nfbnet.org <mailto:job-discussions at nfbnet.org> > wrote:
>
> 
>
> Good idea, but the biased that most employers will have against hiring a
> disabled person, blind or just in a wheelchair is something that must be
> over come first. Most employers won’t see us as a fit or being able to do
> the job, just an annoyance that has to be dealt with because of federal
> law.
>
> Robert
>
>
>
> From: Job-Discussions <job-discussions-bounces at nfbnet.org
> <mailto:job-discussions-bounces at nfbnet.org> > On Behalf Of Karen Rose via
> Job-Discussions
> Sent: Monday, January 10, 2022 10:54 AM
> To: Job Discussions internet Mailing List <job-discussions at nfbnet.org
> <mailto:job-discussions at nfbnet.org> >
> Cc: Karen Rose <rosekm at earthlink.net <mailto:rosekm at earthlink.net> >
> Subject: Re: [Job-Discussions] introduction and two questions.
>
>
>
> Hi. Given the extreme shortage of workers and the fact that businesses are
> closing for periods of time because of lack of staffing, is there something
> we can do, possibly nationally, to advertise to employers and recruiters
> that blind people are here, available to work, and excited for the
> opportunity? It seems like this could be a fantastic time to market blind
> people to desperate employers. Any thoughts?
>
> Karen Rose MFT/LPCC www.career-therapy.net <http://www.career-therapy.net>
>
>
>
> On Jan 10, 2022, at 9:14 AM, Ericka via Job-Discussions
> <job-discussions at nfbnet.org <mailto:job-discussions at nfbnet.org> > wrote:
>
> I’m at a crossroads myself. Can’t go back to being on my feet working with
> seniors because of foot issues and leg problems. Waiting for vocational
> rehab assessment to be done and trying to discern myself where are my next
> move out to be. Thought you were working with kids before.
>
> Ericka Nelson
>
>
>
> On Jan 10, 2022, at 10:45 AM, Melissa R. Green via Job-Discussions
> <job-discussions at nfbnet.org <mailto:job-discussions at nfbnet.org> > wrote:
>
> Hi.
> Thank you so much Ericka.
> It is very helpful. Wibbb pat Pj for you.
>
>
>
> Have a good day.
> Best!
> Melissa R. Green and Pj
> Scentsy consultant www.readerlissa.scentsy.com
> <http://www.readerlissa.scentsy.com>
> Contact me at: graduateenff%juno_com for more  information and host and book
> a party and or explanation of products.
> Facebook: Melissa R. Green Goodreads: Melissa R. Green
> A home is nothing without the people you love inside of it.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Ericka via Job-Discussions  <job-discussions at nfbnet.org
> <mailto:job-discussions at nfbnet.org> >
> To: Job Discussions internet Mailing List  <job-discussions at nfbnet.org
> <mailto:job-discussions at nfbnet.org> >
> Date: 01/10/2022 9:09 am
> Subject: Re: [Job-Discussions] introduction and two questions.
>
>
>
>
>
> I am aware that there are jobs with spectrum/charter that are call center
> related. The process is kind of interesting. The skills inventory or
> whatever it is you take to help you determine which jobs to apply for is
> accessible. My husband did it on his iPhone with very little frustration
> which is very unusual.
>
>
>
>
>
> Melissa I totally get it about not wanting to do cold calls or beg for
> charities. I wouldn't want to do that either. Sometimes communities have an
> app helping connect employers and perspective clients/workers. Janesville
> Wisconsin has such. A lot of times it's things like what you're looking for
> and then sometimes it's all factory work or house cleaning jobs.. Give PJ a
> pat for me!
>
>
>
>
>
> Hope I've been a little bit a help. You just have to kind of go to company
> websites and check the career listing sometimes.
>
>
>
>
>
> Ericka Nelson
>
>
>
>
>
> On Jan 7, 2022, at 7:59 PM, Melissa R. Green via Job-Discussions
> <job-discussions at nfbnet.org <mailto:job-discussions at nfbnet.org> > wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> "Hi abbl.
>
> My is melissa. I am in colorado.
>
> I am still looking for work. To us I have been doing research on jobs that I
> would be interested in and may be someone this list can assist me.
>
> How does someone become a reader advisor for the library for the blind?
>
> I received a job offer from TTEC. But they could not get their client to
> approve my acomodations, has anyone else gotten hired by TTEC? I am
> wondering if I should appy again with them?
>
> Lastly, where can I find crisis hotline jobs, tutoring and hditing paper
> jobs, or out bound or no sales jobs?
>
> Don't want to call for any kind of sales, or requesting money.
>
>
>
> Have a good day.
>
> Best!
>
> Melissa R. Green and Pj
>
> Scentsy consultant www.readerlissa.scentsy.com
> <http://www.readerlissa.scentsy.com>
>
> Contact me at: graduateenff%juno_com for more  information and host and book
> a party and or explanation of products.
>
> Facebook: Melissa R. Green Goodreads: Melissa R. Green
>
> A home is nothing without the people you love inside of it.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
> --
>
> Brian P. Hatgelakas |
>
> 318 Washington Road, #212, Pittsburg, PA 15216
>
> C: 412.862.8644  I E: bhatgelakas at gmail.com <mailto:bhatgelakas at gmail.com>
>
>
>
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> _______________________________________________
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>
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Brian P. Hatgelakas |
>
> 318 Washington Road, #212, Pittsburg, PA 15216
>
> C: 412.862.8644  I E: bhatgelakas at gmail.com <mailto:bhatgelakas at gmail.com>
>
>
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-- 
Julie A. McGinnity
MM Vocal Performance, 2015; American University Washington College of
Law, JD Candidate 2023