[nabs-l] Job seekers- disclosing disability

Sat Apr 18 22:29:08 UTC 2009

Jedi,

That's exactly right. Someone, I believe it was kenneth Jernigan, called it 
the hierarchy of sight.

Dezman
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jedi" <loneblindjedi at samobile.net>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, April 18, 2009 2:17 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Job seekers- disclosing disability

> Sarah,
>
> In regard to your question about being expected to act as a sighted 
> person, I often find that sighted persons tend to expect me to use vision 
> if they think I have enough of it rather than let me use the techniques 
> that work for me. For example, my mother freaked out when I started 
> wearing dark glasses because she feared they would compromise my already 
> impaired vision. If indeed they do, I doubt there's much of a practical 
> difference in 5.0 percent in my better eye versus 4.99999 percent in the 
> same eye with dark glasses. My step dad didn't want me to use blindness 
> techniques while watching my niece because he felt my low vision was far 
> superior. So he forbad me to wear dark glasses (which I use for light 
> sensativity) and turned up the lights as high as they could go so I could 
> presumably see my niece better. If this were an employment situation, I 
> probably could have sued. As another example, a job agency wanted to 
> introduce me to employers as visually impaired and not blind (since they 
> knew I have some vision) so as to increase my chances of getting hired. 
> The only problem is that the employer might expect me to see more than I 
> can, and I have no desire to educate on that level. So, simply saying that 
> I use blindness techniques gives me a little more control over how I'll do 
> things at any given time. Making such a statement also makes it clear that 
> the amount of vision one has is not directly related to have much a person 
> can do. I think that's why we blind people are often asked about visual 
> acuity in the first place. The more sight you have, the more you can do 
> and the less different from the sighted you are. You know what I mean?
> Original message:
>
>
>> Hi Jedi,
>> I really like these suggestions. I'm just confused by what you mean
>> when you say "I also don't want
>> them to expect me to act as a sighted person when I'm not." I'm in the
>> process of looking for a summer job so I'll definitely take your great
>> ideas to heart.
>> Sarah
>> Quoting Jedi <loneblindjedi at samobile.net>:
>
>>> Hi.
>
>>> The article provided regards Brittish laws surrounding disability which
>>> are a little different from American laws. The ADA does specify that
>>> employers cannot ask you about your disabilities at any point in the
>>> process. or rather, that they should not. Unfortunately, they often do.
>>> Here's my philosophy on disclosure.
>
>>> There are some of us whose blindness will be more obvious depending on
>>> the job we're asking to fill, our past experience, and any schools we
>>> attended. for example, if you worked at Random City Society for the
>>> Blind, and your job experience at RCSB makes you qualified for the job
>>> you're applying for, it makes sense to mention it. If you attended
>>> Random State School for the Blind and it's relevant to your resume,
>>> then mention it. I often add my participation at the Louisiana Center
>>> for the Blind for two reasons. first, it points to my educational
>>> experiences. Second, it offers a perfect shoe-in to discuss how I'll do
>>> the job as a blind person. All this said, it's certainly not a good
>>> idea to make blindness the central focus of your resume unless it makes
>>> sense to do so such as in cases where you might be applying to fill the
>>> post at Random City Society for the Blind.
>
>>> At the interview. I personally don't find it helpful when employers ask
>>> how much I can see. I find that the focus moves in a negative direction
>>> when this happens. They may be curious, but they're also subconsciously
>>> equating sight with ability. I also don't want them to expect me to act
>>> as a sighted person when I'm not. I want to make it clear that I am
>>> indeed a blind person with some residual vision who uses blindness
>>> techniques, not visual ones. i also want to make it clear that my use
>>> of blindness techniques will not hamper me. I also personally feel that
>>> first meetings are not the appropriate time and place to discuss the
>>> inner workings of a medical condition. so, when an employer asks me,
>>> "How much can you see?" I  have a few responses ready. If the vibe is
>>> good, I may ask why they're interested in knowing. Then, I can figure
>>> out what their real questions are. A lot of the time, the question is,
>>> "How are you going to do X?" so, I tell them how i'll do X. If the vibe
>>> is bad, it's probably not going to work out anyway. But, if I'm stuck
>>> having to educate, I'll simply say something like "just enough to get
>>> me into trouble, but not enough to get me out." Then, I'll launch into
>>> a brief explanation about how I'll do the job as a blind person.
>
>>> I have a strong preference for self acommodation where possible. For
>>> those of us who use Braille note takers, it's a good idea to pack it
>>> along in case you're required to do a writing test. If an internet
>>> connection is available, use it to e-mail the perspective boss the
>>> writing sample while you're still there. Hopefully, the boss will smile
>>> upon this arrangement. This is also a great way to show how you will
>>> solve accessibility problems. Also, for those with reading machines,
>>> particularly the KNFB Reader Mobile, bring it along since it has
>>> internet capability that will let you e-mail word attachments uploaded
>>> from your note taker and since it can read print and help you convert
>>> anything you may have to read out loud into Braille. If you're good
>>> with your technology, this process can be really efficient. If you
>>> don't have said technology, then it may prompt you to disclose your
>>> disability sooner so you can get appropriate acommodations. Otherwise,
>>> it may be useful to list your acommodations in your cover letter in
>>> case the employer wants you to do something at the interview.
>
>>> A word on blindness skills. I personally think it's a great idea to
>>> know braille in case one has to read out loud (which can happen). I
>>> also recommend being comfortable with a cane or guide dog because
>>> confident travelers look good to employers. My next bit of advice may
>>> be controversial, but I would not recommend taking paratransit to an
>>> interview. This arrangement may be just fine when you get the job, but
>>> I'd start out with a cab or driver to avoid stereotypes. If weather is
>>> poor, I would also recommend a cab or driver if you ordinarily take the
>>> bus. That way, you look fresh and nice at the interview. Taking cabs
>>> may also reduce personal stress. I don't know about you, but I'm a poor
>>> traveler when I experience anxiety (I get distracted), and I'd hate to
>>> be late for getting lost. By the way, I also recommend you feel
>>> comfortable with cooking and serving if you're getting a job in food
>>> service. again, travel skills are helpful.
>
>>> A word on appearances. I would highly recommend brushing your dog well
>>> before an interview and/or making sure your cane doesn't look like hell
>>> when you show up. Battle scars on canes are great for convention
>>> stories, but not for job interviews. Wear the best you have provided
>>> that it's appropriate. I personally don't have a problem with piercings
>>> and hair dye or tatoos. Unfortunately, others might. It's not a bad
>>> idea to scope out the place before sending in an application to see if
>>> your personal style is or isn't going to be a problem. I personally
>>> think it would suck if you like to wear piercings but can't.
>
>>> I did some research on job applications and interview practices
>>> regarding people with disabilities. here are some signs that might
>>> reduce your chances of discrimination. first, don't set your heart on
>>> jobs that ask about disabilities or health conditions on their
>>> applications. Chances are, they're looking at possible insurance
>>> issues, and they may mistakingly think that you're a liability. Second,
>>> go for small businesses run by people you have some network with; based
>>> on my research, don't go for small business owners you don't know or
>>> haven't got a network with since they're likely to discriminate and
>>> there isn't much you can do about it. The better bet in general is to
>>> go for large corperations and institutions with plenty of public
>>> accountability. They're less likely to discriminate and will receive
>>> public pressure if they do.
>
>>> Naturally, much of this is my own opinion. Feel free to agree or
>>> disagree. This has been a product of my experiences thus far. Any
>>> additional info would be most welcome.
>>> Original message:
>>>> I was under the impression that employers were required to provide
>>>> 'reasonable' accomidations.  This article seems to imply that they are 
>>>> not
>>>> obligated if they did not know about your disability when they hired 
>>>> you.
>>>> the law does not allow for employers to use your disibility at all in 
>>>> their
>>>> selection process.  In OR i believe that employers aren't even allowed 
>>>> to
>>>> ask about disabilities.  I imagine that one can extend the law to not 
>>>> allow
>>>> for preference to be given to disabled applicants either since you 
>>>> would be
>>>> choosing on non-relevant baseies.  Unfortunatly those of us with 
>>>> physical
>>>> disabilities have less choice about disclosure then other potentionally
>>>> disabled applicants.  Joseph has said to me that employers will be more
>>>> likely to hire you if they can see how you would be able to forfill the
>>>> position.  Convincing the employer of this can be hard.  It would seem 
>>>> that
>>>> an interview would be a good place to discuss this, but you would much
>>>> prefer that the interview focused on your own skills and not details 
>>>> that
>>>> should not effect their desision.
>>>> Just my two cents,
>>>> Bill VP
>>>> Oregon Association of Blind Students
>>>> 503-768-8982
>>>> cassonw at gmail.com
>
>>>> On Wed, Apr 15, 2009 at 1:24 PM, Jim Reed <jim275_2 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>>>> Hey all,
>
>>>>> As the summer-job seeking season is upon us, and as the economy forces
>>>>> others out of work, I thought the following would be useful to some of
>>>>> you. It deals with how/when to disclose your blindness to an employer.
>
>
>
>
>>>>> http://www.rnib.org.uk/xpedio/groups/public/documents/PublicWebsite/public_jsdisc.hcsp
>
>>>>> I Hope some find it useful. I have an interview tomarrow with Montana 
>>>>> Fish,
>>>>> Wildlife, and Parks. I guess I will see how it works then.
>
>
>
>>>>> Thanks,
>
>>>>> Jim
>
>
>>>>> "Ignorance killed the cat; curiosity was framed."
>
>
>
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>
>>> --
>>> REspectfully,
>>> Jedi
>
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>
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>
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> -- 
> REspectfully,
> Jedi
>
> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.  Visit 
> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.
>
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