From sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca  Wed Jul  1 00:16:17 2009
From: sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca (sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca)
Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 20:16:17 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] question
In-Reply-To: <002e01c9f82f$033fbd30$0501a8c0@Serene>
References: <b83069fe0906271121l2533ac53lf9740dffa0b655b6@mail.gmail.com>
	<5DB6DB01F31C448398363E1313AB059B@sacomputer>
	<002e01c9f82f$033fbd30$0501a8c0@Serene>
Message-ID: <20090630201617.3xtvd9z1oo04k848@webmail.utoronto.ca>



In my limitted experience, schools will give you whatever you tell  
them you need, as long as you realize that with Braille you'll have to  
find the print versions of texts to be Brailled 4-6 months before your  
classes start. I am a math major so felt I would require Braille for  
many of my courses, but I found electronic files (usually pdf files)  
worked fine with JAWS for readings for my non-math courses.


Quoting Serena <serenacucco at verizon.net>:

> Generally speaking, you don't really get Braille in college, except for
> an occasional novel from your library for the blind.  The universities
> usually have nothing to do with getting Braille.  I didn't take Math in
> college cuz I wasn't required to for my major.  If it is required for
> yours or if you just wanna take it, using a reader can work well if
> you're experienced using readers.  One of my friends from my college
> (not on this list) used a reader and he did all right in Math.  The
> reader just happened to be a friend of his, so I think that helped in
> his case.
>
> Serena
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sarah Alawami" <marrie12 at gmail.com>
> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 3:19 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] question
>
>
>> Good luck  when it comes to braille as for me it took 6-8 weeks to get
>> everything  brailled and I gave it toi the  DRC and sometimes they took for
>> ever getting the music or the books to me. It sucked!
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
>> Of Lindsay Upschulte
>> Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2009 11:22 AM
>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>> Subject: [nabs-l] question
>>
>> i will be a junior in high school this year, but i had a question about
>> college.  how much braille is available in college?  does it just depend
>> what university you go to?  one university i had in mind is the university
>> of maryland, college park.  i've heard many thins, so in your expierence,
>> how mucdh braille is available?  i think it would be almost impossible to do
>> math verbally.  with everything else icould get used to doing it verbally
>> but i would prefer braille.
>>
>> thanks!
>> -Lindsay
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info   
>> for nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizon.net
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40utoronto.ca





From lavar.phillips at hotmail.com  Wed Jul  1 01:38:07 2009
From: lavar.phillips at hotmail.com (Lavar Phillips)
Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 21:38:07 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] non-credit meditation class
In-Reply-To: <BCE5B3466C8D493EBC9C8B1A3BAD1884@Jess>
References: <BCE5B3466C8D493EBC9C8B1A3BAD1884@Jess>
Message-ID: <BLU0-SMTP788D783BD0812A32C8B6F8922E0@phx.gbl>

Hello Jessica medation can be visual. but you can ask the teacher to  
speak his or her every move out loud.

On Jun 30, 2009, at 5:25 PM, "Jessica" <jw927 at comcast.net> wrote:

> Hi everyone.  I hope everyone is having a nice summer.  Ok, I am  
> considering taking a non-credit meditation class in July.  My  
> questions are:  is meditation visual?  Meaning are the meditation  
> techniques visual?  If so, how should I go about taking the class?   
> Please help me because I am wanting to take this class to hopefully  
> reduce my stress level.  thank you
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info  
> for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lavar.phillips%40hotmail.com
>


From latinanewschic at hotmail.com  Wed Jul  1 02:32:19 2009
From: latinanewschic at hotmail.com (Martha Harris)
Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 22:32:19 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] review of the movie blindness
Message-ID: <BAY136-DS470B4887AD8B51D48B4A2DE2E0@phx.gbl>

Hi Everyone,
I have found the nfb press release and the FAQ about the movie Blindness that came out last year. However, I thought Ryan Strunk or a current NABS board member did a review and commentary, and I would like to find it if anyone knows where it is. I am doing a sociology project, and I'm studying disability in the media.

Thanks,
Martha

From christellablue at gmail.com  Wed Jul  1 02:48:09 2009
From: christellablue at gmail.com (Christella Garcia)
Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 21:48:09 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Sports and Recreation Events
Message-ID: <auto-000105608877@mailfront1.g2host.com>

Hi,  convention is fast approaching and the 
Sports and Recreation division is excited to 
bring three exciting events to all of 
you.  However, we need to get some logistics out 
of the way so we can enjoy the fun.  Therefore, I 
am attaching the liability waver which will need 
to be signed by anyone who wants to participate 
in any of our exciting events.  Please note, you 
must sign a waver for each event.  For example, 
if a person wants to participate in the swimming 
and judo events then they will need to sign a 
separate waver for each event.  If you have 
difficulty accessing the form or if you have any 
other questions please email me off list at: 
<mailto:christellablue at gmail.com>christellablue at gmail.com 
or call me on my cell (916) 208-3213.  and I will 
do my best to assist you.  Below you will find 
the time and place for each event.  The wavers 
will also be available at each event.  Parents 
please sign a waver for any child under age 
eighteen. Thanks, and let the games begin.
Christella Garcia Sports and recreation division vice president.


Friday, July 3, 2009

1:00 - 4:00 pm—SWIM CLINIC: SPORTS & REC DIVISION

Pool, Courtyard Marriott

Annie Sawicki, part of the AdapTap team (that 
designed an award-winning device for blind 
swimmers), is conducting a swimming workshop. 
Take a break with a cool dip in the pool.



Sunday, July 5, 2009

12:30 - 5:00 pm—SPORTS AND RECREATION DIVISION

Skyline A Room, Courtyard Marriott

    12:30 pm – Registration; 1:00 pm – Meeting begins

Wear your sweats and come ready for hands-on 
presentations in yoga and much more!  Lisamaria Martinez, President



Sunday, July 5, 2009

5:00 - 8:00 pm—JUDO WORKSHOP; SPORTS & REC DIVISION

Skyline B Room, Courtyard Marriott

Join USA Judo Paralympic bronze medal winner Greg 
DeWall to learn about judo from people involved 
in the sport.  See you on the mat!



Monday, July 6, 2009

6:00 - 9:00 pm—INDOOR ROWING; SPORTS & REC DIVISION

Skyline A and B Rooms, Courtyard Marriott

Row your way into fitness and maintain a healthy 
lifestyle using an accessible rowing machine.  Prizes plus plenty of fun!

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From dandrews at visi.com  Wed Jul  1 02:44:45 2009
From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews)
Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 21:44:45 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] 2009 Motor City March Info Packet
Message-ID: <auto-000105608884@mailfront1.g2host.com>



The 2009 Motor City March for Independence:


NFB in the D







Before the March






·        An information session for Marchers will 
be held on Saturday, July 4, at 6:45 p.m. in the Greco Room on Level 4.


·        The ambassador briefing sessions will be 
held on Sunday, July 5, from 7:00 to 10:00 p.m. 
in Brulé B Room on Level 5. Those Federationists 
wanting to serve as ambassadors or wanting to 
familiarize themselves with the March and rally, 
can drop in any time during the three hour 
briefing session. The March route and tasks will be covered in detail.


·        Marchers can register for the March, 
turn in donations, and pick up their March items 
(such as t-shirts and medallions) at the 
Imagination Fund table in the Renaissance Foyer 
on Level 4 near the Convention registration table during registration times.






March Gathering Places and Times­Be  Ready to Chant and Cheer






·        Ambassadors and other March volunteers 
need to report at the Wintergarden entrance on 
Atwater Street by 6:00 a.m. on Monday, July 6.


·        Appointed sign and banner carriers need 
to gather 100 yards to the left of the 
Wintergarden entrance by 6:30 a.m. to pick up their banners/signs.


·        Torchbearers need to gather toward the 
front of the procession, at least 100 yards to 
the right of the Wintergarden entrance at 6:30 a.m.


·        Rally coordinators and stagers need to 
report to Rivard Plaza by 6:30 a.m.


·        Marchers need to gather at least 100 
yards to the right of the Wintergarden entrance by 6:45 a.m.






What will happen at the March


At 6:45 a.m. the March for Independence will 
begin with opening remarks by Dr. Maurer.  The 
Torch of Freedom will be lit and the March will 
begin by 7:00 a.m.!  Around 7:30 a.m., as we are 
heading back toward the Renaissance Center, the 
“mini-Marchers” will join the procession and 
we'll all march together toward the rally site at 
Rivard Plaza.  By 8:00 a.m. we will reach Rivard 
Plaza and the rally will begin.






Route description


1.      Gather at the Wintergarden entrance on 
Atwater Street.  Walk west on the south side of 
Atwater Street toward Renaissance Drive West.  Be 
aware of potential traffic on the north side of the street.
2.      Just after Bates Street (on your right), 
take a left back onto the RiverWalk.
3.      Follow the RiverWalk until passing Hart 
Plaza (on your right) and the Detroit Princess Riverboat (on your left).
4.      Return back to Atwater Street, which 
becomes Civic Center Drive.  Follow Civic Center Drive to Joe Louis Arena.
5.      At the intersection of 3rd Street and 
Civic Center Drive (with Joe Louis Arena on the 
right) make a left back onto the RiverWalk, and 
follow it back toward Hart Plaza.
6.      Take the cobblestone path that leads up to Hart Plaza.
7.      Go through Hart Plaza, past the fountain, 
and toward East Jefferson Avenue.
8.      Just before East Jefferson Avenue, follow 
the large concrete path to the right that crosses 
a dead-end street (to the Ford Auditorium on the 
right) and leads to Bates Street.
9.      Turn right onto Bates Street and continue southeast to Atwater Street.
Make a left back onto Atwater Street and follow 
it east, back toward the Renaissance Center.  We 
will then take the ramp to the RiverWalk.
10.  Continue east along the RiverWalk the short 
distance to Rivard Plaza for the rally.
11.  Join the rally at Rivard Plaza!





The Mini-March


For those who cannot walk the full 4 kilometer 
route (1 kilometer less than last year), there is 
a shorter route of approximately four 
blocks.  This mini-March will join the main 
procession as it passes back by the Renaissance 
Center on the way to the rally site.  To join the 
mini-March, please gather at 7:15 a.m. at the 
Wintergarden exit of the Renaissance Center.  We 
will take the ramp down to the RiverWalk.  If you 
choose to use the steps instead of the ramp to 
the RiverWalk, please note these steps are 
especially deep.  There will be ambassadors on 
hand to make sure mini-Marchers connect with the 
main procession at the right time.





The Rally Program


The rally will begin at approximately 8:00 a.m. 
at Rivard Plaza.  Water will be available at the 
rally site for all participants.  The rally 
program will include speeches by Dr. Maurer, 
Senator Carl Levin of Michigan, and Dave McCurdy 
of the Alliance of Automobile 
Manufacturers.  Three outstanding Imagination 
Fund grant programs will be featured, and be 
ready to dance in the streets when Martha Reeves 
performs some of her Motown hits. At about 8:45 
a.m., Dr. Maurer and other VIPs will lead the 
procession out of the plaza back to the 
Wintergarden.  Marchers should make their way to 
the opening of General Session in the Renaissance 
Ballroom on Level 4 by 9:30 a.m.  Be sure to stay 
for the entire rally­there are bound to be lots 
of surprises throughout the morning!





Transportation


Those with wheelchairs or special transportation 
needs should come to the Imagination Fund table 
during registration times to make sure their needs are met.

From queen.marsha.lindsey at gmail.com  Wed Jul  1 04:54:21 2009
From: queen.marsha.lindsey at gmail.com (Marsha)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:54:21 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] international roaming and your Cell Phones atConvention
In-Reply-To: <E73F3D741743430B892BF853D48F1BB6@your0d10610b06>
References: <auto-000018436404@mailback1.g2host.com><DF4AEC4C8976440D96B51562402B35E6@nbp2.local><4a44d98f.1420720a.1696.ffffe3fd@mx.google.com><e37a61680906261117l75a81039yd249d9437c33c247@mail.gmail.com>
	<E73F3D741743430B892BF853D48F1BB6@your0d10610b06>
Message-ID: <6C04A4C98B6F4E05A5FF132F035E008F@Cptr233>

My international roaming for TMobile was on automatically. But When I called
to have it turned off, they were happy to fill my request.
Marsha 


-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Janice
Sent: Monday, June 29, 2009 3:58 AM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] international roaming and your Cell Phones
atConvention

I was under the assumption, and I only know this for T-Mobile for certain...

but that international roaming is not turned on by default. it is something 
that needs to be requested...
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Brice Smith" <brsmith2424 at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 1:17 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] international roaming and your Cell Phones 
atConvention


>I was told the same thing by at&t. When I explained my concerns, they
> brushed them off and said that the signal would not be impacted and
> that as long as I do not cross into Canada I had nothing to worry
> about.
>
> I'm considering leaving my computer at home and only carrying my cell
> with me, so I hope that I will have strong at&t coverage. I expect I
> will.
>
> Brice
> On 6/26/09, Liz Bottner <liz.bottner at gmail.com> wrote:
>> I was told by AT&T that as long as I'm not physically in Canada, I 
>> shouldn't
>> be charged. I wasn't told anything about needing to turn off roaming.
>>
>> Liz
>>
>> email:
>> liz.bottner at gmail.com
>> Visit my livejournal:
>> http://unsilenceddream.livejournal.com
>> Follow me on Twitter:
>> http://twitter.com/lizbot
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brsmith2424%40gmail.
com
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/snowball07%40gmail.c
om 


_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/queen.marsha.lindsey
%40gmail.com
 

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database 4202 (20090630) __________

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From raniaismail04 at gmail.com  Wed Jul  1 13:09:01 2009
From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 09:09:01 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] facebook applications
References: <8C6B68D0330C4A6184311191355505CF@Jess>
	<A94134DEAC794C55A08329FCC07B83E3@Jessica>
Message-ID: <00e701c9fa4d$1ae65be0$2801a8c0@DHQ5QJF1>

I have found farm town and things like that to be accessible.
Rania,
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jess" <jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, June 29, 2009 7:13 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] facebook applications


> Jessica,
> For the most part all the applications are highly visual more the most 
> part. The only things that I believe are accessible are all the quizzes.
> Jess
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Jessica" <jw927 at comcast.net>
> To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2009 9:16 PM
> Subject: [nabs-l] facebook applications
>
>
>> Hi all, this is for everyone who uses facebook. I am wondering if any 
>> other totally blind people on this list have been able to successfully 
>> use any of the facebook applications? I think being able to use the 
>> applications just like sighted people would be cool. Any help would be 
>> greatly appreciated. thank you
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan%40gmail.com
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmail.com 



From raniaismail04 at gmail.com  Wed Jul  1 14:04:29 2009
From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:04:29 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] non-credit meditation class
References: <BCE5B3466C8D493EBC9C8B1A3BAD1884@Jess>
Message-ID: <003501c9fa54$daec83e0$2801a8c0@DHQ5QJF1>

Hi Jessica, meditation  can have a visual component to it but it doesn't 
have to. Some use sound to focus. While others use sensation especially of 
the breath.
Rania,
Rania,
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jessica" <jw927 at comcast.net>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 5:25 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] non-credit meditation class


> Hi everyone.  I hope everyone is having a nice summer.  Ok, I am 
> considering taking a non-credit meditation class in July.  My questions 
> are:  is meditation visual?  Meaning are the meditation techniques visual? 
> If so, how should I go about taking the class?  Please help me because I 
> am wanting to take this class to hopefully reduce my stress level.  thank 
> you
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmail.com 



From gymnastdave at sbcglobal.net  Wed Jul  1 14:16:45 2009
From: gymnastdave at sbcglobal.net (Dave Wright)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 09:16:45 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] It's Convention season again
Message-ID: <32346B9AE598481A9E5EC86D0FFB301D@dwrigh6>

Hi all,

Handy Tech North America will be exhibiting at both the NFB and ACB
conventions this year and in addition to great summer specials, we have some
accessories at prices that are sure to keep you cool.  

- Real imitation leather Netbook cases.  It may just be pleather but it's a
classy little Black case with a handle and fits your standard 10.2 inch
Netbook and it's power supply beautifully.
Cost $20.00

- Executive Products Leather Case.  There's nothing imitation about this
little case that fits your Nokia N82 like a glove and gives access to all of
the buttons and connectors enabling you to use the device while still in the
case.
$25.00

- Standard and extended batteries for the Nokia N82 mobile phone/K-NFB
Reader Mobile
Standard $20.00
Extended $30.00

- 8 GB SD Micro cards with two adaptors to convert to SD minni and standard
SD sizes
$40.00

- Samsung Cd/DVD RW USB drive.  The perfect companion for your netbook
$99.00

- The new BookSense from GW Micro standard and XT versions
Call or stop by the handy Tech booth for special pricing

- Handy Tech North America has a limited quantity of new Nokia N95 GSM cell
phones with leather case and your choice of Code Factory's Mobile speak or
Nuance Talks screen reader:
Regularly:  $799.
Summer convention special:  $650.00.

- K-NFB Reader Mobile installed to Nokia 6220 classic:
Regularly:  $1,395.00.
Summer convention special:  $1,295.00.

- K-NFB Reader Mobile installed to Nokia N82 cell phone:
Regularly:  $1495.00.
Summer convention price:  $1,395.00.

- K-NFB Reader Mobile With choice of Talks or Mobile Speak screen reader:
Regularly:  $1,795.00.
Summer convention price:  $1,695.00.

- K-NFB Reader Mobile based on Nokia 6220 Classic cell phone, choice of
Talks or MobileSpeak screen reader and Way Finder Access GPS navigation
software bundle:
Regularly:  $1,895.00.
Summer convention special:  $1,795.00.

- K-NFB Reader Mobile based on Nokia N82 Classic cell phone, choice of Talks
or MobileSpeak screen reader and Way Finder Access GPS navigation software
bundle:
Regularly:  $1,995.00.
Summer convention special:  $1,895.00.

Purchase the new Handy Tech Easy Braille with HID (Human Interface Driver)
support 40 cell Braille display and get a Samsung N110 netbook for free!
Note that the Easy Braille with HID support have started shipping, but due
to overwhelming response to this product it is on back order so it may take
a few weeks for order fulfillment and will likely not be available for
delivery at convention.

For more information about these and other adaptive technology products,
please call:

651-636-5184

e-mail:  sales at handytech.us
or visit our web site at:  

http://www.handytech.us


Best Regards:
Dave Wright
Work Phone: 651-636-5184 X803
Email:
dwrigh6 at gmail.com
WebPage:
http://www.knfbreader.com

From arielle71 at gmail.com  Wed Jul  1 16:43:53 2009
From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 02:43:53 +1000
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Convention Help Needed
Message-ID: <b6b933030907010943k17b08619s867fc04cefb31ba@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all,

It's that time of year again! At this year's NFB convention in Detroit
we will be having our customary NABS business meeting and Monte Carlo
Night fund-raiser. We'll also be hosting a table in the exhibit hall
for the first  time, where we'll be selling raffle tickets for a
computer and other goodies.

We need your help to make our NABS activities this year a success!
Assisting with these events is a great way to get involved in NABS,
and to learn how things run behind the scenes.

Specifically we need help with the following:

(1) We need exhibit hall table workers  on Sunday, July 5, to work a
2-3-hour shift selling items and talking to visitors about NABS.
2. We need people to help deal poker, blackjack, or other casino-style
card games during Monte Carlo Night, either from 8:00-10:00 or
10:00-11:30.

If you'd like to help with either of these tasks please email me at
arielle71 at gmail.com
or call
602-502-2255
See you in Detroit!
Arielle Silverman
First Vice-President, National Association of Blind Students


From LPovinelli at aol.com  Wed Jul  1 17:07:46 2009
From: LPovinelli at aol.com (LPovinelli at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 13:07:46 EDT
Subject: [nabs-l] Our own 2009 NFB tenBroek Scholarship Winner reports on
	NPR's Marketplace
Message-ID: <c4c.44a8950e.377cf1e2@aol.com>

 
 (http://marketplace.publicradio.org/display/web/2009/07/01/am_ca_budget/)  
(http://marketplace.publicradio.org/display/web/2009/07/01/am_scotus_ruling/
) 
 
_Ruling  may change campaign finance_ 
(http://marketplace.publicradio.org/display/web/2009/07/01/am_scotus_ruling/) 
The Supreme Court issued formal opinions for all but one case this term. 
The  decision on that case could have big implications for how election 
campaigns are  financed. Corbb O'Connor reports.

**************It's raining cats and dogs -- Come to PawNation, a place 
where pets rule! (http://www.pawnation.com/?ncid=emlcntnew00000008)

From LPovinelli at aol.com  Wed Jul  1 19:24:02 2009
From: LPovinelli at aol.com (LPovinelli at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 15:24:02 EDT
Subject: [nabs-l] National Association of Blind Lawyers 12th Annual Mock
	Trial - July 4 - 4:30 PM
Message-ID: <d11.52249797.377d11d2@aol.com>

From: Scott C. LaBarre 
Presenting the 12th Annual Mock Trial

PRESENTING THE 12TH ANNUAL MOCK TRIAL
NATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF BLIND  LAWYERS
Saturday, July 4, 4:30 PM
Ambassador 1 Ballroom - Level  3 
Marriott Renaissance Center

The National Association of Blind  Lawyers is pleased to present the 12TH 
Annual Mock Trial featuring the case of  Malus v. Malus in the District Court 
for the State of Federation, County of  Whoseit, the Honorable Charles S. 
Brown, Presiding.  This case pits a  sighted father against a blind mother 
who are getting divorced and fighting over  their three children.  Randy 
Malus, the sighted father, alleges that the  blind are incapable of safely taking 
care of young children.  Angela Malus,  the sighted mother, counter alleges 
that Randy is a dead beat dad who is  incredibly irresponsible and that the 
children are far better off with  her.  Shockingly, Angela's own mother, 
Melissa Love Joy, intends to testify  on behalf of Randy Malus.  John 
Goodfellow, Angela's sighted neighbor,  intends to tell the Court what a wonderful 
mom Angela is.  Experts on both  sides will tell the Court with whom the 
children should be placed.  You the  audience are the jury and will need to 
decide who is more competent to have  custody of these three lovely children, 
ages 2, 4, and 7.  All you have to  do is pay your juror registration fee of 
$5.00 and you can help decide this  important case.     

Scott C. LaBarre, Esq.
President, NABL
LaBarre Law Offices  P.C.
1660 South Albion Street, Ste. 918
Denver, Colorado 80222
303  504-5979 (voice)
303 757-3640 (fax)
_slabarre at labarrelaw.com_ (mailto:slabarre at labarrelaw.com)  
_www.labarrelaw.com_ (http://www.labarrelaw.com) 
**************It's raining cats and dogs -- Come to PawNation, a place 
where pets rule! (http://www.pawnation.com/?ncid=emlcntnew00000008)

From dandrews at visi.com  Wed Jul  1 19:37:03 2009
From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews)
Date: Wed, 01 Jul 2009 14:37:03 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] See and Win Orator for Blackberry Smartphones at NFB
	Convention
Message-ID: <auto-000108706958@mailfront2.g2host.com>




Introducing Orator for BlackBerry Smartphones



New screen reader software application provides blind and visually 
impaired customers with a solution to access BlackBerry smartphones

With The National Federation of the Blind conference just around the 
corner, HumanWare is pleased to introduce its newest software 
solution called "Orator for BlackBerry for BlackBerry Smartphones" to 
the NFB members. Access to information through mobile devices is key 
in today's business world and the use of smartphones have become the 
predominant way of communication for business professionals and 
management.  With over 21 million subscribers in 150 countries the 
BlackBerry Smartphones have grown in popularity to become the 
smartphone of choice to stay in touch with work, family and friends 
and important information while on the go. Orator for BlackBerry 
Smartphones is a innovative screen reader software that enables 
visually impaired users to access and operate BlackBerry Smartphones

Issue from a joint collaboration with Code Factory, the leading 
provider of screen reader technology and maker of Mobile Speak, and 
Research In Motion (RIM), the maker of the award winning portfolio of 
BlackBerry products and solutions, Orator for BlackBerry Smartphones 
is design to convert the information visually display on the device 
screen into a voice output enabling people who are visually impaired 
to use BlackBerry smartphones to increase independence and 
productivity in today's competitive world.

Available for the new QWERTY BlackBerry smartphones, Orator for 
BlackBerry Smartphones will provide you with greater freedom to 
manage your daily activities in the way that is most convenient for 
you with the ability to stay connected anytime, anywhere.

If you are attending the National Federation of the Blind conference 
come visit us at the HumanWare booth to be amongst the first to get 
your hands on a personal demonstration and have a sneak peak at this 
coming solution for BlackBerry smartphones.

Whether you are attending the conference or not don't miss the chance 
to win one of 4 BlackBerry smartphones with Orator software package. 
To register your name you must log on at 
<http://www.orator4bb.com/draw>www.orator4bb.com\draw and fill out 
the form. This will automatically enter your name in the draw. 
Winners will be announced on the HumanWare site on July 31

If you are interested in learning more on the Orator for BlackBerry 
Smartphones solution and find out why BlackBerry devices are so 
popular, be sure to attend the product presentation.



Orator for BlackBerry Smartphones: blind access solution for 
BlackBerry Smartphones

When: Friday July 3rd, 2009

Time: 4h00 to 4h50 PM

Where: LaSalle A and B Room, Level 5

Speakers: Michel Pepin, Orator for BlackBerry Smartphones Product 
Manager, HumanWare

 From this session you will learn the features and benefits of this 
screen reader solution and find out more on the BlackBerry device 
applications that will be supported

For those of you that will not be available to attend this 
presentation, be sure to visit us in the exhibit hall at the 
HumanWare booth during the following exhibit hours:

Saturday July 4th, 9:00 a.m. to 5:00 p.m.

Sunday July 5th, 8:30 a.m. to 5:00 p.m.

Monday July 6th, 12:00 p.m. to 1:45 p.m.

Tuesday July 7th, 12:00 p.m. to 1:45 p.m. and 7:00 p.m. to 10:00 p.m.

Come and discover if Orator for BlackBerry Smartphone is the solution 
for you to stay connected with what is important in your life.

Visit our web site at www.orator4 bb.com   to find out more about 
this unique mobile solution



About HumanWare

HumanWare (<http://www.humanware.com/>http://www.humanware.com/) is 
the global leader in assistive technologies for the print disabled. 
HumanWare provides products to people who are blind and have low 
vision and students with learning disabilities. HumanWare offers a 
collection of innovative products include BrailleNote, the leading 
productivity device for the blind in education, business and for 
personal use; the Victor Reader product line, the world's leading 
digital audiobook players, and SmartView Xtend, the first fully 
modular and upgradeable CCTV-based video magnifier.




David Andrews and white cane Harry.

From loneblindjedi at samobile.net  Wed Jul  1 19:37:15 2009
From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi)
Date: Wed, 01 Jul 2009 15:37:15 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] review of the movie blindness
Message-ID: <20090701193715.2020.74405@web2.serotek.com>

Hi.

The movie "Blindness" is an interesting one. However, I would consider 
it in a much larger context of overall attitudes concerning blindness 
dating back centuries. may I suggest a book entitled Blindness: The 
History of an Image in Western Thought by Moche Barasche> I think 
you'll find it interesting and will provide some interesting insight 
into disability in the media, as well as the movie itself. Also, I've 
done some academic studies on the film. E-mail me privately if you're 
interested.

Respectfully,
Jedi


Original message:
> Hi Everyone,
> I have found the nfb press release and the FAQ about the movie 
> Blindness that came out last year. However, I thought Ryan Strunk or a 
> current NABS board member did a review and commentary, and I would like 
> to find it if anyone knows where it is. I am doing a sociology project, 
> and I'm studying disability in the media.

> Thanks,
> Martha
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net

-- 
Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.  Visit 
www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.


From jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com  Wed Jul  1 21:22:42 2009
From: jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com (Jess)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 17:22:42 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Our own 2009 NFB tenBroek Scholarship Winner reports
	onNPR's Marketplace
In-Reply-To: <c4c.44a8950e.377cf1e2@aol.com>
References: <c4c.44a8950e.377cf1e2@aol.com>
Message-ID: <B901347E0F754201B91EDBE16A43938B@Jessica>

Corbb,
Congratulations on your news report on Marketplace.
Jessica
----- Original Message ----- 
From: <LPovinelli at aol.com>
To: "undisclosed-recipients:"
Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 1:07 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] Our own 2009 NFB tenBroek Scholarship Winner reports 
onNPR's Marketplace


>
> (http://marketplace.publicradio.org/display/web/2009/07/01/am_ca_budget/)
> (http://marketplace.publicradio.org/display/web/2009/07/01/am_scotus_ruling/
> )
>
> _Ruling  may change campaign finance_
> (http://marketplace.publicradio.org/display/web/2009/07/01/am_scotus_ruling/)
> The Supreme Court issued formal opinions for all but one case this term.
> The  decision on that case could have big implications for how election
> campaigns are  financed. Corbb O'Connor reports.
>
> **************It's raining cats and dogs -- Come to PawNation, a place
> where pets rule! (http://www.pawnation.com/?ncid=emlcntnew00000008)
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan%40gmail.com 




From jmassay1 at cox.net  Wed Jul  1 23:58:30 2009
From: jmassay1 at cox.net (JMassay)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:58:30 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Non-credit Meditation Class
Message-ID: <B451129E11574E6BBE31A8F488DDC6BD@MERLIN>

Hi all .  Most meditation classes are actually primarily non-visual. They
tend to focus on inner thought and relaxation of breath. Practicing most
meditation will drastically reduce your stress level. I wish you peace.

 

Jeannie 


From jw927 at comcast.net  Thu Jul  2 02:04:48 2009
From: jw927 at comcast.net (Jessica)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 22:04:48 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] registered for meditation classes
Message-ID: <273BB250FD1643CAB0816907D7511735@Jess>

Hi everyone.  I just registered for the meditation classes.  I am nervous because I have never taken any college classes before.

From marrie12 at gmail.com  Thu Jul  2 04:37:37 2009
From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 21:37:37 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] international roaming and your Cell Phones atConvention
In-Reply-To: <6C04A4C98B6F4E05A5FF132F035E008F@Cptr233>
References: <auto-000018436404@mailback1.g2host.com><DF4AEC4C8976440D96B51562402B35E6@nbp2.local><4a44d98f.1420720a.1696.ffffe3fd@mx.google.com><e37a61680906261117l75a81039yd249d9437c33c247@mail.gmail.com><E73F3D741743430B892BF853D48F1BB6@your0d10610b06>
	<6C04A4C98B6F4E05A5FF132F035E008F@Cptr233>
Message-ID: <88C509ABCB2343AE83113C4E373DBCA0@sacomputer>

Hmm.   They told me that I didn't have to worry about it.


-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Marsha
Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 9:54 PM
To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] international roaming and your Cell Phones
atConvention

My international roaming for TMobile was on automatically. But When I called
to have it turned off, they were happy to fill my request.
Marsha 


-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Janice
Sent: Monday, June 29, 2009 3:58 AM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] international roaming and your Cell Phones
atConvention

I was under the assumption, and I only know this for T-Mobile for certain...

but that international roaming is not turned on by default. it is something
that needs to be requested...
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brice Smith" <brsmith2424 at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 1:17 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] international roaming and your Cell Phones
atConvention


>I was told the same thing by at&t. When I explained my concerns, they  
>brushed them off and said that the signal would not be impacted and  
>that as long as I do not cross into Canada I had nothing to worry  
>about.
>
> I'm considering leaving my computer at home and only carrying my cell 
> with me, so I hope that I will have strong at&t coverage. I expect I 
> will.
>
> Brice
> On 6/26/09, Liz Bottner <liz.bottner at gmail.com> wrote:
>> I was told by AT&T that as long as I'm not physically in Canada, I 
>> shouldn't be charged. I wasn't told anything about needing to turn 
>> off roaming.
>>
>> Liz
>>
>> email:
>> liz.bottner at gmail.com
>> Visit my livejournal:
>> http://unsilenceddream.livejournal.com
>> Follow me on Twitter:
>> http://twitter.com/lizbot
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brsmith2424%40gmail.
com
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/snowball07%40gmail.c
om 


_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/queen.marsha.lindsey
%40gmail.com
 

__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
database 4202 (20090630) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com
 
 

__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
database 4202 (20090630) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com
 


_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com



From jsorozco at gmail.com  Thu Jul  2 05:58:56 2009
From: jsorozco at gmail.com (Joe Orozco)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 01:58:56 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] FW: [TABS] SOUTHERN STRUMS 2009
Message-ID: <9D4607FF996D4C5E89F22885B55BCDE5@Rufus>

From: tabs_students at googlegroups.com [mailto:tabs_students at googlegroups.com]
On Behalf Of Jose Martinez
Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 12:51 AM
To: Members at nfb-texas.org; tabs_students at googlegroups.com
Subject: [TABS] SOUTHERN STRUMS 2009


Repost! Repost! Repost! Repost!


Southern Strums is fast approaching, and we wish to invite you to join us on
Monday July 6 at Seldom Blues. One of the Premier restaurants in all of
Detroit. The show starts at 6:00 pm, and it goes till 10:00.
Come out and enjoy the pleasant sounds of Parnell Digs, Chris Danielsen, as
well as a special guest appearance from Detroit's own, Brandy Faye Hawkins,
and much much more live entertainment. All for just a 5 dollar donation.

Make sure to get your presale tickets with a TABS representative. We look
forward in seeing you out there!

And to all, a great convention!
THE TABS PROMOTIONS TEAM!

http://www.myspace.com/tabstudent

http://www.nfb-texas.org/tabs.html

--~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~
The Texas Association of Blind Students
Web Site:
www.nfb-texas.org/tabs.html
 

__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
database 4206 (20090701) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com
 



From iamantonio at cox.net  Thu Jul  2 07:10:47 2009
From: iamantonio at cox.net (Antonio M. Guimaraes)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 03:10:47 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] international roaming and your Cell Phones atConvention
References: <auto-000018436404@mailback1.g2host.com><DF4AEC4C8976440D96B51562402B35E6@nbp2.local><4a44d98f.1420720a.1696.ffffe3fd@mx.google.com><e37a61680906261117l75a81039yd249d9437c33c247@mail.gmail.com>
	<E73F3D741743430B892BF853D48F1BB6@your0d10610b06>
	<SNT101-W31013CE22E034269D9A874B2310@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <C7BC6885E734484CA2FE956821B6B498@userf9b4fa60eb>

I really don't get it.

Why would AT 'n T log your concerns, instead of making absolutely sure you 
get no roaming charges by blocking it?

They blocked mine, and I am glad I don't have to trust that they have logged 
my concerns, and hope for the best.

We are consumers, and one simple request to block the roaming charges is not 
that difficult to honor.

I hope you guys who for some reason won't insist roaming be blocked have no 
surprises next week when convention is all said and done.

I don't know why even insist with you guys. Just don't come crying after you 
end up paying unnecessary phone charges because AT 'n T said they would 
"note your concerns." How do you even know they've done so?

Antonio Guimaraes

If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup 
trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of 
highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary 
works in Braille.

Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you.
http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169
Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Brice Smith" <brsmith24 at hotmail.com>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 5:11 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] international roaming and your Cell Phones 
atConvention



AT&T international roaming will automatically activate If you leave any AT&T 
coverage area.

 If you frequently travel internationally, you can pay extra to roam 
internationally at reduced rates. I know AT&T offers packages for frequent 
travelers to Canada and perhaps Mexico, but you must sign up for these 
discounts or you will be charged at standard rates for international 
roaming.

I called customer service today, And while they again reassured me that I 
shouldn't have any problems, they logged my concerns and said they would 
credit me back any international roaming charges as long as I stayed in 
Detroit.



A couple quick Google searches on the subject note the same thing, that you 
*can* receive cell signals from Canada in the Metro, but that AT&T usually 
will remove those charges in the unlikely event they become a problem. Most 
posts from internet forum users who work at the Marriott don't have 
problems.


I'm glad that this topic was brought to our attention, for it's something 
most of us would probably overlook. But I wouldn't worry too much.


Brice
> From: snowball07 at gmail.com
> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 02:57:30 -0500
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] international roaming and your Cell Phones 
> atConvention
>
> I was under the assumption, and I only know this for T-Mobile for 
> certain...
> but that international roaming is not turned on by default. it is 
> something
> that needs to be requested...
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Brice Smith" <brsmith2424 at gmail.com>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 1:17 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] international roaming and your Cell Phones
> atConvention
>
>
> >I was told the same thing by at&t. When I explained my concerns, they
> > brushed them off and said that the signal would not be impacted and
> > that as long as I do not cross into Canada I had nothing to worry
> > about.
> >
> > I'm considering leaving my computer at home and only carrying my cell
> > with me, so I hope that I will have strong at&t coverage. I expect I
> > will.
> >
> > Brice
> > On 6/26/09, Liz Bottner <liz.bottner at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> I was told by AT&T that as long as I'm not physically in Canada, I
> >> shouldn't
> >> be charged. I wasn't told anything about needing to turn off roaming.
> >>
> >> Liz
> >>
> >> email:
> >> liz.bottner at gmail.com
> >> Visit my livejournal:
> >> http://unsilenceddream.livejournal.com
> >> Follow me on Twitter:
> >> http://twitter.com/lizbot
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> nabs-l mailing list
> >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> >> nabs-l:
> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brsmith2424%40gmail.com
> >>
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > nabs-l mailing list
> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> > nabs-l:
> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/snowball07%40gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brsmith24%40hotmail.com

_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live™ SkyDrive™: Get 25 GB of free online storage.
http://windowslive.com/online/skydrive?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_SD_25GB_062009
_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net 



From raniaismail04 at gmail.com  Thu Jul  2 10:13:56 2009
From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 06:13:56 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] registered for meditation classes
References: <273BB250FD1643CAB0816907D7511735@Jess>
Message-ID: <002701c9fafd$cfdd0c50$2801a8c0@DHQ5QJF1>

That's normal but I'm sure you will do great.
Rania,
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jessica" <jw927 at comcast.net>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 10:04 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] registered for meditation classes


> Hi everyone.  I just registered for the meditation classes.  I am nervous 
> because I have never taken any college classes before.
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmail.com 



From slabarre at labarrelaw.com  Thu Jul  2 10:32:39 2009
From: slabarre at labarrelaw.com (Scott C. LaBarre)
Date: Thu, 02 Jul 2009 05:32:39 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Presenting the 12TH Annual Mock Trial
Message-ID: <auto-000105823185@mailfront1.g2host.com>

PRESENTING THE 12TH ANNUAL MOCK TRIAL
NATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF BLIND LAWYERS
Saturday, July 4th
Ambassador 1 Ballroom, level 3,
Marriott Renaissance Center
  4:30--6:00 p.m.

The National Association of Blind Lawyers is pleased to present the 
12TH Annual Mock Trial featuring the case of Malus v. Malus in the 
District Court for the State of Federation, County of Whoseit, the 
Honorable Charles S. Brown, Presiding.  This case pits a sighted 
father against a blind mother who are getting divorced and fighting 
over their three children.  Randy Malus, the sighted father, alleges 
that the blind are incapable of safely taking care of young 
children.  Angela Malus, the sighted mother, counter alleges that 
Randy is a dead beat dad who is incredibly irresponsible and that the 
children are far better off with her.  Shockingly, Angela's own 
mother, Melissa Love Joy, intends to testify on behalf of Randy 
Malus.  John Goodfellow, Angela's sighted neighbor, intends to tell 
the Court what a wonderful mom Angela is.  Experts on both sides will 
tell the Court with whom the children should be placed.  You the 
audience are the jury and will need to decide who is more competent 
to have custody of these three lovely children, ages 2, 4, and 
7.  All you have to do is pay your juror registration fee of $5.00 
and you can help decide this important case.
Scott C. LaBarre, Esq.
President, NABL
LaBarre Law Offices P.C.
1660 South Albion Street, Ste. 918
Denver, Colorado 80222
303 504-5979 (voice)
303 757-3640 (fax)
<mailto:slabarre at labarrelaw.com>slabarre at labarrelaw.com (e-mail)
<http://www.labarrelaw.com>www.labarrelaw.com (website)

From LPovinelli at aol.com  Thu Jul  2 10:35:12 2009
From: LPovinelli at aol.com (by way of David Andrews <dandrews@visi.com>)
Date: Thu, 02 Jul 2009 05:35:12 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Our own 2009 NFB tenBroek Scholarship Winner reports on
 NPR's Marketplace
Message-ID: <auto-000105823845@mailfront1.g2host.com>

          <http://marketplace.publicradio.org/display/web/2009/07/01/am_scotus_ruling/>
U.S. Supreme Court building



<http://marketplace.publicradio.org/display/web/2009/07/01/am_scotus_ruling/>Ruling 
may change campaign finance

The Supreme Court issued formal opinions for all but one case this 
term. The decision on that case could have big implications for how 
election campaigns are financed. Corbb O'Connor reports.

----------
It's raining cats and dogs -- Come to 
<http://www.pawnation.com/?ncid=emlcntnew00000008>PawNation, a place 
where pets rule!


__________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus 
signature database 4206 (20090701) __________

The message was checked by ESET Smart Security.

<http://www.eset.com>http://www.eset.com

From mgoalball at gmail.com  Thu Jul  2 10:42:43 2009
From: mgoalball at gmail.com (Matt McCubbin)
Date: Thu, 02 Jul 2009 05:42:43 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Win your choice of Sendero GPS packages from the Michigan
 Association of Blind Students and Sendero Group!
Message-ID: <auto-000105823848@mailfront1.g2host.com>



The Michigan Association of Blind Students is 
raffling off one copy of a Sendero GPS package. 
Tickets cost $5 each, or five for $20.

Once selected, the winner has the choice of one 
copy of the following Sendero GPS software packages:

1.      Sendero GPS for the Braille Note

2.      Sense Nav for the Braille Sense and Voice Sense

3.      Mobile Geo for Windows Mobile devices

4.      StreetTalk™ VIP for the PAC Mate Omni (When released)

<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

Tickets will be sold throughout convention. Look 
for a MABS member to buy yours. Drawing will be 
at noon on Wednesday, July 8. Winner need not be present to win.



If you wish to buy tickets in advance or are not 
attending convention, you may do so using Paypal.



Please email Matt McCubbin at

<mailto:MGoalball at gmail.com>MGoalball at gmail.com

If you have questions or wish to purchase advance tickets.



A portion of the proceeds will help to start a 
scholarship fund for blind students in Michigan. 
Thanks in advance for your support, and good luck.
Best regards,
Matt McCubbin
President, Michigan Association of Blind Students
National Federation of the Blind


From liz.bottner at gmail.com  Thu Jul  2 11:55:18 2009
From: liz.bottner at gmail.com (Liz Bottner)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 07:55:18 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] international roaming and your Cell Phones at
	Convention
In-Reply-To: <C7BC6885E734484CA2FE956821B6B498@userf9b4fa60eb>
References: <auto-000018436404@mailback1.g2host.com><DF4AEC4C8976440D96B51562402B35E6@nbp2.local><4a44d98f.1420720a.1696.ffffe3fd@mx.google.com><e37a61680906261117l75a81039yd249d9437c33c247@mail.gmail.com>	<E73F3D741743430B892BF853D48F1BB6@your0d10610b06>	<SNT101-W31013CE22E034269D9A874B2310@phx.gbl>
	<C7BC6885E734484CA2FE956821B6B498@userf9b4fa60eb>
Message-ID: <4a4ca012.86c3f10a.3c33.ffffee11@mx.google.com>

There isn't anything to turn off. That's what two representatives told me.
I'm honestly not that worried. 

Liz 

email: 
liz.bottner at gmail.com 
Visit my livejournal: 
http://unsilenceddream.livejournal.com 
Follow me on Twitter: 
http://twitter.com/lizbot 




From djdrocks4ever at gmail.com  Thu Jul  2 13:36:17 2009
From: djdrocks4ever at gmail.com (David Dunphy)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 08:36:17 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] is it too late to register for the student meeting online?
Message-ID: <4DF1756FE6B3478485AC0FC66F5358E2@thedjdinvasion>

Well the subject states it all. Was wondering if I can still go to the nabs web site and register for the convention meeting, and if it isn't too late, if someone could send the link, that would rock, thank you.
>From David

*****
If you're tired of hearing the same old songs on your local radio station, and if you can't find the variety you've always wanted, then check out the station that I own and operate with a great group of broadcasters called Radio360. You'll hear all types of music and programming, plus you're able to control what you hear through requests, interaction with the djs, and more!
To find out more about the station, visit us on the web at
http://www.radio360.us
Follow us on twitter at
http://www.twitter.com/radio360usa
or add us to your MySpace at
http://www.myspace.com/radio360usa
Come check us out, you won't be disappointed!!!

From jsorozco at gmail.com  Thu Jul  2 14:58:29 2009
From: jsorozco at gmail.com (Joe Orozco)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:58:29 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] is it too late to register for the student meeting
	online?
In-Reply-To: <4DF1756FE6B3478485AC0FC66F5358E2@thedjdinvasion>
Message-ID: <B709EBB4599442669FABB387F78861F2@Rufus>

The smart ass in me cries to tell you  it's easy enough to go to the web
site and find out, but as it is, no, it is not too late.  In fact, I won't
be forwarding the list of registered students to the board until this
evening.  If you have not yet registered, please do so at the following
link:

http://www.nabslink.org/members/membership_registration.shtml

Joe Orozco

"A man who wants to lead the orchestra must turn his back on the
crowd."--Max Lucado 

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org 
[mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of David Dunphy
Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 9:36 AM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: [nabs-l] is it too late to register for the student 
meeting online?

Well the subject states it all. Was wondering if I can still go 
to the nabs web site and register for the convention meeting, 
and if it isn't too late, if someone could send the link, that 
would rock, thank you.
>From David

*****
If you're tired of hearing the same old songs on your local 
radio station, and if you can't find the variety you've always 
wanted, then check out the station that I own and operate with 
a great group of broadcasters called Radio360. You'll hear all 
types of music and programming, plus you're able to control 
what you hear through requests, interaction with the djs, and more!
To find out more about the station, visit us on the web at 
http://www.radio360.us Follow us on twitter at 
http://www.twitter.com/radio360usa
or add us to your MySpace at
http://www.myspace.com/radio360usa
Come check us out, you won't be disappointed!!!
_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
info for nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco
%40gmail.com
 

__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of 
virus signature database 4206 (20090701) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com
 
 

__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
database 4206 (20090701) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com
 



From djdrocks4ever at gmail.com  Thu Jul  2 17:43:58 2009
From: djdrocks4ever at gmail.com (David Dunphy)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 12:43:58 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] is it too late to register for the student
	meetingonline?
References: <B709EBB4599442669FABB387F78861F2@Rufus>
Message-ID: <24D295F82F9B4213B1A3B130095C64C9@thedjdinvasion>

Thanks for not being a smart ass, see you at convention.

*****
If you're tired of hearing the same old songs on your local radio station, 
and if you can't find the variety you've always wanted, then check out the 
station that I own and operate with a great group of broadcasters called 
Radio360. You'll hear all types of music and programming, plus you're able 
to control what you hear through requests, interaction with the djs, and 
more!
To find out more about the station, visit us on the web at
http://www.radio360.us
Follow us on twitter at
http://www.twitter.com/radio360usa
or add us to your MySpace at
http://www.myspace.com/radio360usa
Come check us out, you won't be disappointed!!! 



From marrie12 at gmail.com  Thu Jul  2 23:34:13 2009
From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 16:34:13 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: [NFBAffiliatePresidents] Ground
	transportationservice from the airport (DTW) to the Detroit
	Marriott andCourtyard Marriott hotels at the Renaissance
	Center and vise-versa.
In-Reply-To: <a0d584a0906081746p5414aa57qc6ba8734881b0dbd@mail.gmail.com>
References: <auto-000100710001@mailfront1.g2host.com>
	<a0d584a0906081746p5414aa57qc6ba8734881b0dbd@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <39CDDA19956048E39F00C911DB8CF1DF@sacomputer>

I'm replying late but my flight is at the  Detroit Wayne  airport. I guess
the shuttle service won't work there. Is there another form of
transportation I can take? Walking is so not an option. Lol!

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Terri Rupp
Sent: Monday, June 08, 2009 5:47 PM
To: NABS list serve
Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: [NFBAffiliatePresidents] Ground transportationservice
from the airport (DTW) to the Detroit Marriott andCourtyard Marriott hotels
at the Renaissance Center and vise-versa.

Don't know if everyone has gotten this email already, but it couldn't hurt
to send it again.
See you all in Detroit.
Terri Rupp

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Fred Wurtzel <f.wurtzel at comcast.net>
Date: Wed, May 27, 2009 at 1:50 PM
Subject: [NFBAffiliatePresidents] Ground transportation service from the
airport (DTW) to the Detroit Marriott and Courtyard Marriott hotels at the
Renaissance Center and vise-versa.
To: david.andrews at nfbnet.org


May 26, 2009

From: Mr. Fred Wurtzel, NFB of Michigan affiliate president
To: NFB members attending the 2009 National Convention in Detroit

RE: Ground transportation service from the airport (DTW) to the Detroit
Marriott and Courtyard Marriott hotels at the Renaissance Center and
vise-versa.

We are pleased to share information on a service being made available to NFB
members through Enjoi Transportation, prior to, during, and after our
convention taking place in Detroit, from July 3rd- July 8th.

Enjoi Transportation will offer a range of transportation vehicles from
mini-vans to mini-buses, up to 46 passenger motor coaches. All vehicles are
air-conditioned.

Enjoi Transportation will provide round-trip ground transportation from
Detroit Metro Airport (McNamara and North terminals) to the Detroit Marriot
at the Renaissance Center to attendees for the round-trip discounted rate of
$45.00 per person.  Upon arrival at Detroit Metro Airport, attendees will be
met by greeters in the baggage claim sections of both terminals who will
assist arrivals to the registration table(s) and then onto awaiting shuttles
for transport of members and luggage to the hotel(s).  Ground transportation
service will be available on a 24-hour basis throughout the convention
dates.  Those interested in this service are encouraged to make reservations
at least 48 hours before arrival; however, ground transportation will also
be available to attendees upon arrival to Detroit Metro Airport.  (Single
direction service is also available at $22.50 per person)

Reservations can be made starting immediately via phone by using the
information stated below.  Credit card payments will be accepted.  Please
note that members who make a reservation, then change their plans and do not
cancel their reservation within 48 hours of their scheduled arrival will be
charged a one-way trip fee, of $22.50.

Please consider this opportunity to save on the cost of transportation while
in Detroit.  There is no regular shuttle service from the airport terminals
to hotels as we have had in other cities.  Airport taxi and sedan service is
available, but charges are approximately $50 EACH WAY per person.

If you are interested in obtaining more information or making a reservation
prior to your arrival in Detroit, please contact Enjoi Transportation at one
of the following numbers:  1(877) ENJOI-US, 1(877) 365-6487, (313) 758-1000,
via fax at (313) 758-1001, or via email at <mailto:glynn at enjoitrans.com>
glynn at enjoitrans.com.

SPECIAL NOTE: Please be aware the neither the National Federation of the
Blind (NFB) nor the NFB of Michigan is responsible for this service in any
way.

_______________________________________________
NFBAffiliatePresidents mailing list
NFBAffiliatePresidents at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbaffiliatepresidents_nfbnet.org



From jp100 at earthlink.net  Sat Jul  4 02:53:52 2009
From: jp100 at earthlink.net (Jim)
Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 19:53:52 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Nokia n82 with Talks
Message-ID: <004701c9fc52$aac14340$0043c9c0$@net>

Howdy,

 

I'm sure several people will be able to help me out here.

 

I've been playing with the KNFB reader, and I think I have a lot of that
down now.

However, I've also turned it into my all in one cell phone since it has
talks on it.

I'm trying to learn as I go, but I'm going to need some help with it.

I've gotten some settings down, but if people know about some good Nokia and
talks tutorials, I'd appreciate that.

I have the KNFB reader tutorials on my stream and am following those.  Jim
Gashel does a great job of describing everything.

 

Here's an immediate question.  How on earth does one text using the Nokia
and Talks?  I'm not getting this!

 

Thanks.

 

Jim Portillo


From singinggirl017 at hotmail.com  Sat Jul  4 13:06:17 2009
From: singinggirl017 at hotmail.com (Macy McClain)
Date: Sat, 4 Jul 2009 09:06:17 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] face book applications
In-Reply-To: <4a4a4024.1aba720a.4199.1e9b@mx.google.com>
References: <8C6B68D0330C4A6184311191355505CF@Jess>
	<4a4a4024.1aba720a.4199.1e9b@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <BAY102-W40509BE50E1F47D7A8855A9A2D0@phx.gbl>


Hi Jessica,

I am also totally blind, and I've been able to use Facebook since I got it. It took some time, but it's worth getting used to. I find that some of the applications that I have right now are really easy to navigate and use. If you have any questions, don't hesitate to email me off-list.

Thanks,

Macy


 
> From: alberto.2500 at gmail.com
> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:41:05 -0600
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] face book applications
> 
> Jessica I am completely blind and I have both a my space page, and Face
> book. Out of the two I've been able to use everything on face book. I've
> tried lots of different applications, and they are very accessible.
> If you have any other questions email me at alberto.2500 at gmail.com.
> I'll be glad to answer any questions you might have.
> Alberto
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
> Of Jessica
> Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2009 7:17 PM
> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> Subject: [nabs-l] facebook applications
> 
> Hi all, this is for everyone who uses facebook. I am wondering if any other
> totally blind people on this list have been able to successfully use any of
> the facebook applications? I think being able to use the applications just
> like sighted people would be cool. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
> thank you
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail
> .com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/singinggirl017%40hotmail.com

_________________________________________________________________
Hotmail® has ever-growing storage! Don’t worry about storage limits. 
http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/Storage?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial_Storage_062009

From armckenzie at fsu.edu  Sat Jul  4 16:42:06 2009
From: armckenzie at fsu.edu (Amy McKenzie)
Date: Sat, 04 Jul 2009 11:42:06 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Online Survey Recruitment
Message-ID: <auto-000106084907@mailfront1.g2host.com>

I have been asked to circulate the following:

Dave


Recruitment Message:
Drs. Amy McKenzie and Susan Smedema of Florida State University are
conducting an online survey social support and life satisfaction in persons
with visual impairment.

You are invited to participate in this survey if you are 18 years of age or
older, and have a diagnosed visual impairment.

Participation in the survey will take approximately 30 minutes.  There are
no anticipated risks beyond those encountered in daily living to completing
the survey.

Please click on the following link if you wish to participate:
http://www.survey.coe.fsu.edu/TakeSurvey.aspx?SurveyID=n40Ln62

You may also email Dr. McKenzie at armckenzie at fsu.edu to have this link
emailed to you directly or to receive a hard copy of the survey in regular
print, large print, or braille.

Thank you very much!

Amy R. McKenzie, Ed.D.
Assistant Professor
Program in Visual Impairment

and

Susan M. Smedema, Ph.D.
Assistant Professor
Rehabilitation Counseling and Services



-----Original Message-----
From: David Andrews [mailto:dandrews at visi.com]
Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2009 2:03 PM
To: Amy McKenzie
Subject: Re: Online Survey Recruitment

It is ok with me.  You can either write me some sort of announcement,
that I will circulate, or I can draw from what you sent me.

Dave

At 12:13 PM 6/27/2009, you wrote:
 >Dear Mr. Andrews,
 >
 >My name is Amy McKenzie and I am an Assistant Professor in the
 >Program in Visual Impairments at Florida State University. Along
 >with my colleague, Susan Smedema, I am preparing to recruit for an
 >online survey regarding the relationship between social supports and
 >life satisfaction in adults with visual impairments. Dr. Smedema is
 >an Assistant Professors in the Rehabilitation Counseling Program at
 >FSU. We have received human subjects approval to conduct this study
 >through the Florida State University Office of Research.
 >
 >We would like to post recruitment messages in some format to the NFB
 >listservs and/or message boards due to its strong consumer
 >membership. We believe that we can reach the broadest group of
 >participants through your organization. Electronic recruitment
 >methods are being used since this is an online study.
 >
 >I have attached the proposed recruitment letter and consent letter
 >to this e-mail. Please let me know your thoughts!
 >
 >Sincerely,
 >Amy R. McKenzie
 >
 >Amy R. McKenzie, Ed.D.
 >Assistant Professor
 >Program in Visual Impairment
 >College of Education, Florida State University
 >850-645-6588



From bookwormahb at earthlink.net  Sun Jul  5 22:12:11 2009
From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley  Bramlett)
Date: Sun, 5 Jul 2009 18:12:11 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] non-credit meditation class
References: <BCE5B3466C8D493EBC9C8B1A3BAD1884@Jess>
Message-ID: <95CD18EAF97C4EDA8CD966A1207EF325@Ashley>

Hi Jessica,

I took meditation twice at my local recreation center.  Each time was a 
three month period, about the same length as a semester.
Yes meditation techniques can be visual.  It can have a visual component but 
doesn't have to; it depends on the instructor.  Talk to them before class 
and find out their teaching style.
Most meditation techniques involve nonvisual mental concentration such as 
breathing slowly, thinking or saying a word called a mantra, chanting, 
stretching, and generally focus on inner relaxation.
I have some tunnel vision so have seen images and if I had trouble I 
substituted another sense.  The visual
component was when we did imagery.  You were  supposed to visualize an image 
that the instructor told you.  It was to simulate a mental trip.  Even this 
imagery incorporated other senses but it was pretty visual.  You were asked 
to imagine walking through woods or forests or taking a tour of someplace 
remote and envision a guide.

But as someone else said its primarily nonvisual.  The instructor will 
likely play soothing music while you relax.
Practicing meditation should reduce stress.  Since you can't see the 
instructor, my advice is to sit in the first row near the instructor.  Ask 
him/her to describe any motions they do.  I hope you are comfortable being 
hands on.  The instructor may show you moves with your permission; they 
usually don't touch participants.  There are a few simple hand moves they 
can show you if they are not described adaquately.  After the instructor 
demonstrates they can come over and show you if needed.  These motions are 
simple if used at all so nothing to worry about.
For instance one involved making hand circles. Another was placing your 
hands above your head to do something.  The stretching was usually at the 
beginning and involved things like shoulder shruggs, rotating your upper 
torso to stretch the spine, butterfly stretch for the inner thighs, flexing 
the back and more.
Your instructor may even be generous and show you some things before class.
Meditation varies widely from instructor to instructor.  My instructor did 
various things so I imagine a different instructor can even do more.
Once you find out the teaching style and some techniques they do you may 
have more questions.

There is a particular position borrowed from yoga you will sit in most of 
the class.  Its a crossed leg position like you probably did in kindergarten 
called easy pose.  Ask the instructor to show you and describe this. 
Typically you sit this way still and only your hands or upper torso move.  I 
hope sitting still is relaxing for you because meditation involves sitting 
still and quiet.

I hope you enjoy the class.  Just talk to the instructor before hand.  Wear 
loose comfortable clothes to class.
Don't wear jewelry since this may be distracting.  Try to come sort of 
relaxed already.
Your throat may get dry from all the breathing so you may want to bring a 
water bottle.  My instructor recommends drinking water after class.

Everyone has a first class sometime so don't be too nervous.  I bet a 
majority of the class will be new and not have done meditation before.

Good luck.
Ashley


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jessica" <jw927 at comcast.net>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 5:25 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] non-credit meditation class


> Hi everyone.  I hope everyone is having a nice summer.  Ok, I am 
> considering taking a non-credit meditation class in July.  My questions 
> are:  is meditation visual?  Meaning are the meditation techniques visual? 
> If so, how should I go about taking the class?  Please help me because I 
> am wanting to take this class to hopefully reduce my stress level.  thank 
> you
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net
>
> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus 
> signature database 4202 (20090630) __________
>
> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>
> http://www.eset.com
>
>
> 



From bookwormahb at earthlink.net  Sun Jul  5 22:21:19 2009
From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley  Bramlett)
Date: Sun, 5 Jul 2009 18:21:19 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] non-credit meditation class
References: <BCE5B3466C8D493EBC9C8B1A3BAD1884@Jess>
Message-ID: <B9EA165F67084643AFC0D3868E62D97A@Ashley>

Jessica,
Do you know what type of meditation it is?  There are several styles.
The one I took was general and had a fusion of techniques and types.
Two styles are transendental and zen meditation.  Either way it shouldn't be 
too visual.  Just ask the instructor to describe movements since you can't 
see them and for visual  exercises you can find an alternative like focusing 
on what you might hear instead.

Ashley
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jessica" <jw927 at comcast.net>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 5:25 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] non-credit meditation class


> Hi everyone.  I hope everyone is having a nice summer.  Ok, I am 
> considering taking a non-credit meditation class in July.  My questions 
> are:  is meditation visual?  Meaning are the meditation techniques visual? 
> If so, how should I go about taking the class?  Please help me because I 
> am wanting to take this class to hopefully reduce my stress level.  thank 
> you
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net
>
> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus 
> signature database 4202 (20090630) __________
>
> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>
> http://www.eset.com
>
>
> 



From dandrews at visi.com  Mon Jul  6 15:02:02 2009
From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews)
Date: Mon, 06 Jul 2009 10:02:02 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Convention Stream Available
Message-ID: <auto-000109162336@mailfront2.g2host.com>

Many of you have asked about watching and/or listening to a stream of 
the NFB national convention, now going on in Detroit.  There is a 
audio/video stream that is available when general sessions of the 
convention are in session.  I presume that it will also be available 
for the banquet.  The address is:

http://www.vbossengage.com/Engage/NFB/Index.aspx



David Andrews and white cane Harry.




From dandrews at visi.com  Mon Jul  6 16:39:02 2009
From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews)
Date: Mon, 06 Jul 2009 11:39:02 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Updated Link for NFB Convention Stream
Message-ID: <auto-000106265668@mailfront1.g2host.com>

Earlier today I posted a link to listen/watch a live stream of the 
NFB convention, now going on in Detroit.  The link used an embedded 
Silverlight player that may not be accessible to all.

Below is a new link that uses your default media player.  We 
apologize for any problems that this has caused anybody.

http://vbricksys.edgeboss.net/wmedia-live/vbricksys/58969/300_vbricksys-nfb_30241_090615.asx


Dave



David Andrews and white cane Harry.




From jsorozco at gmail.com  Tue Jul  7 22:42:33 2009
From: jsorozco at gmail.com (Joe Orozco)
Date: Tue, 7 Jul 2009 18:42:33 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Vote Organizing Job Opening
Message-ID: <A44B6298C9274BC2BEB8D423586723C5@Rufus>

Subject: Vote Organizing Job Opening



 
<http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?et=1102633275540&s=525&e=0018WwVOxLs5htNopCOZNBi17gzs
DokMOnYqSWDLYhJ2k-SH2ArKLIIFhnxeEjRvi9rMXNdEt2f3w_ZGVZtO3WYUrcqavOpOKXB4Y-Zs
0Fyl5BqSqi8Ty8HegdOUDhnHJgJWfWgkKX9Tcey4n0XjPkTng==> DVP Logo	


JUST VOTE ARIZONA DISABILITY COALITION 
Looking for a Vote Organizer
	
	
	



JUST VOTE ARIZONA DISABILITY COALITION:
Looking for a Vote Organizer


 
<http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?et=1102633275540&s=525&e=0018WwVOxLs5hthJN1b-AVHw-AyM
POt3N1sJFT5sGc0x211eqry3MWgYi0uv_LZ4h5HAevx6qh3QBIka6CIhZuiq_QdnmsOYu_LAj3VK
Lh_6d4=> AAPD logoJOB DESCRIPTION
COMMUNITY ORGANIZER 

I    Project Description: 
The purpose of the Just Vote Arizona! (JVA) - Disability Coalition is to
promote and support equal access, and individual and system advocacy, in
order to maximize opportunities for the inclusion of individuals with
disabilities into the electoral process.

Just Vote Arizona believes that people with all types of disabilities should
have the same civil rights as people without disabilities.  JVA, therefore,
works to change societal attitudes about people with disabilities away from
a patronizing, pitying medical model towards empowerment, independence, and
integration as fully contributing and voting members of their communities.

The Just Vote Arizona! Disability Coalition is composed of various
disabilities related organizations that seek to increase the number people
with disabilities in Arizona who are registered to vote and turnout to vote.
Additionally, the coalition seeks to promote and assess the implementation
of the Help America Vote Act.

II    Position Description
The primary focus of the community organizer position is to assist with
coordinating, promoting, and supporting the goals of the Disability
Coalition as directed by the JVA Coordinator.

This position is part time - 20 hours weekly, with flexible scheduling and
some working remotely possible.

III    Key Functions and Responsibilities include: 

1.    Assist with organizing and mobilizing a grassroots network in Arizona.

2.    Implement actions steps that support voter registration drives and
"Get out the Vote (GOTV) campaigns

3.    Perform administrative and communications tasks necessary to
grassroots organizing, such as, maintaining a database of contacts, creating
and administering listservs, sending action alerts, and overseeing the
project's website.

4.    Assist with coordinating and integrating JVA activities with other
disability related advocacy groups.

5.    Develop contact lists for key reporters related to print and
electronic media; plan and execute regular media hits

6.    Write educational material, op ed and press materials for voter
registration drives and GOTV campaigns.

7.    Research project related issues in order to develop appropriate
messaging in written materials and for public presentations.

8.    Provide periodic written progress reports to the JVA Coordinator
related to the completion of the JVA goals and objectives and other assigned
activities.

9.    Carry out the key functions and responsibilities of the position in
compliance with federal state and local laws and ordinances.

10.    And other duties as may be assigned.

IV    Position Requirements:

1.    Bachelor's degree or sufficient related experience.

2.    Proficient computer skills and experience working with MS Office
software, in particular with database programs.

3.    Good verbal and written communication skills with experience in
presenting ideas clearly and persuasively.

4.    Ability to exercise discretion and initiative in organizing and
implementing multiple tasks with minimal supervision.

5.    Demonstrated ability and commitment to work with diverse and
multicultural populations.

6.    Ability and willingness to travel around the state as needed.

V    Desired Attributes: 

1.    Knowledge of Help America Vote Act, the Voters Registration Act,
American with Disabilities Act, the Rehab Act and/or other state and
national laws regarding the rights of people with disabilities.

2.    Personal experience with a disability and/or the disability community
and a demonstrated knowledge and understanding of the philosophy and goals
of the disability rights movement.


3.    Creativity, leadership and initiative in carrying out assigned tasks
and ability to exercise independent judgment.

4.    Bilingual ability - English/Spanish

VI    Salary: $18,000 - 22,000 commensurate with experience.  

VII    Term: This position is currently funded for one year only. Continued
employment is contingent upon future funding

VIII    To Apply Please Submit:
1.    A cover letter with a narrative description of your interest and
experience,
2.    Your resume and
3.    Three professional references.  

Send your materials:
Email    tony at azsilc.org
Mail    Arizona Statewide Independent Living Council
The Disability Empowerment Center
5025 E Washington Street, Suite 214
        Phoenix, AZ 85034

Persons with disabilities & minorities are encouraged to apply.

Submissions are due by 5:00 p.m. on July 31, 2009.  The position will remain
open until filled.


About the Disability Vote Project
DVP works in a non-partisan manner to eliminate the barriers to voting and,
in close collaboration with coalition partners in states around the country,
to increase political participation for individuals with disabilities. DVP
aims to get people with disabilities registered to vote; strives to educate
them on how to get to their polling places and what their rights are at the
polling places; and works to make polling places accessible to voters with
all disabilities. 

 
About AAPD 
The American Association of People with Disabilities (AAPD) is the largest
national nonprofit cross-disability member organization in the United
States. It organizes the disability community to be a powerful force for
change - politically, economically, and socially - and recognizes the value
of working in broad coalitions to foster unity, leadership and impact.  AAPD
is dedicated to achieving total equality for and full participation of
people with disabilities in all aspects of society, recognizing that this is
the social justice issue of our time. 
	


AAPD
<http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?et=1102633275540&s=525&e=0018WwVOxLs5hthJN1b-AVHw-AyM
POt3N1sJFT5sGc0x211eqry3MWgYi0uv_LZ4h5HAevx6qh3QBIka6CIhZuiq_QdnmsOYu_LAj3VK
Lh_6d4=>  

James  <mailto:vote at aapd.com> Dickson 
Vice President,  Government Affairs

 
<http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?et=1102633275540&s=525&e=0018WwVOxLs5hu080lusXGeLoyoX
10ffDble837Lq3dz_HvAay_ofzGYEQHwn-yXaOR-ZX8fWIyyfUxfTTlD0gdmpDAbPzZ3JX3LzAcX
sL44LQ=> AAPD logo
	
	

Forward email
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__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
database 4222 (20090707) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com


From nijat1989 at gmail.com  Fri Jul 10 15:26:40 2009
From: nijat1989 at gmail.com (Nijat Worley)
Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 09:26:40 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Nokia n82 with Talks
References: <004701c9fc52$aac14340$0043c9c0$@net>
Message-ID: <78D7FFD6B9D849E19969C1ACE5DC41C2@Nijatash>

Greetings Jim,
   You press the talks key twice from the main window of your phone. This 
will take you to the main menu. You arrow to the right or left until you get 
to messaging. Press ok on it, and arrow down until you hear new message. 
Type in the phone number of the person in the To box, and arrow down until 
it says message. This is when you start writing your message using the usual 
phone typing setup. Once you are done press soft key one, and arrow down 
until you hear send message. I hope this helps. Soft key one is a good key 
to always use, since that is the options key. It is pretty self-explanatory 
from there on. Good luck.
   Nijat

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jim" <jp100 at earthlink.net>
To: "'Blind Talk Mailing List'" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>; "'National 
Association of Blind Students mailing list'" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>; "'Kurzweil 
National Federation of the Blind Reader user list'" 
<reader-users at nfbnet.org>; "'NFBnet NFBCS Mailing List'" <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 03, 2009 8:53 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] Nokia n82 with Talks


> Howdy,
>
>
>
> I'm sure several people will be able to help me out here.
>
>
>
> I've been playing with the KNFB reader, and I think I have a lot of that
> down now.
>
> However, I've also turned it into my all in one cell phone since it has
> talks on it.
>
> I'm trying to learn as I go, but I'm going to need some help with it.
>
> I've gotten some settings down, but if people know about some good Nokia 
> and
> talks tutorials, I'd appreciate that.
>
> I have the KNFB reader tutorials on my stream and am following those.  Jim
> Gashel does a great job of describing everything.
>
>
>
> Here's an immediate question.  How on earth does one text using the Nokia
> and Talks?  I'm not getting this!
>
>
>
> Thanks.
>
>
>
> Jim Portillo
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nijat1989%40gmail.com 



From nabs.president at gmail.com  Sat Jul 11 00:11:42 2009
From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman)
Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 10:11:42 +1000
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
Message-ID: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com>

Hello NABS members:

	Last weekend the National Association of Blind Students held our
annual business meeting in conjunction with the NFB convention in
Detroit. At this year’s business meeting we heard from several of our
former presidents and they taught us a lot about the history and
legacy of our organization and about how we can continue that legacy.
We also got some updated information from RFB, BookShare and about
recent developments regarding the Kindle DX issue. Finally, we
conducted elections and I was elected to serve as the next president
of NABS. I am deeply honored to continue serving this organization and
to join the ranks of those who have come before me, and I would like
to thank all of you for your support  and for your assistance with
making the business meeting and Monte Carlo Night fund-raiser run as
smoothly as possible.

Several others joined our NABS board for the first time. The complete
list of officers and board members is:
President: Arielle Silverman
First Vice-President: Karen Anderson
Second Vice-President: Sean Whalen
Secretary: Janice Jeang
Treasurer: Nijat Worley
Board Member 1: Isaiah Wilcox
Board Member 2: Meghan Whalen
Board Member 3: Domonique Lawless
Board Member 4: Darian Smith
Congratulations to all who were elected. Additionally, we had several
other NABS members who sought election to the board, and consequently
ended up with more interested persons than we could include on the
board. I see this as a good sign that we have a substantial group of
students who care about NABS and helping us to achieve our goals. If
you ran for a board position but were not elected or even if you
didn’t run for a board position but still want to make a contribution
to NABS, there is plenty of work to go around. Stay tuned for an
announcement in the next week or two about NABS committees and  how to
join them. I would also like to set up some telephone focus groups in
the next few months to get your feedback on how we can improve
specific aspects of NABS such as the Student Slate, Website,
convention activities, state division outreach and election policies.
If you want  your voice to be heard, stay tuned  for more details
about these conference calls.

Also, from now on please direct all NABS inquiries to
Nabs.president at gmail.com
The official email address shown on our Website,
president at nabslink.org
also works, but email from both addresses will go to the same place. I
will check this organizational email address daily, and I or another
NABS board member will reply to your query within three days of
receiving it. You can also call me with any questions or  concerns at
602-502-2255
And again, someone will return all phone messages within three days.

I will be sending out a president’s bulletin to the NABS listserv and
the state division lists during the first week of each month. This
bulletin will contain updates about NABS activities as well as other
announcements of interest such as information about state and regional
student division events and news from the NFB Jernigan Institute, RFB,
BookShare, etc. If you  have an announcement that  you would like to
appear in the next president’s bulletin, please send it to me before
the first of the month at noon.

Finally, if you are currently president of a state student division,
please email me off-list with your state, phone number, email address
and whether or not you’re subscribed to  the NABS-Presidents listserv.
I want to be sure the Website and my master state contact list is
updated and that everyone gets on the Presidents list who should be on
it. If you are in a state that doesn’t have a student division yet and
you want to serve as the student contact for your state, also send me
this information.

I’m looking forward to an exciting and productive two years with NABS,
and hope all  of you will join me in making NABS as strong as it can
be!


-- 
Arielle Silverman
President, National Association of Blind Students
Phone:  602-502-2255
Email:
nabs.president at gmail.com
Website:
www.nabslink.org


From jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com  Sat Jul 11 01:29:03 2009
From: jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com (Jess)
Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 21:29:03 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2B0274AB59E447ABA962C0149DEDCC95@Jessica>

Arielle,
Congratulations to you and all that were elected to the NABS board.
Jessica
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Arielle Silverman" <nabs.president at gmail.com>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 10, 2009 8:11 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update


Hello NABS members:

Last weekend the National Association of Blind Students held our
annual business meeting in conjunction with the NFB convention in
Detroit. At this year�s business meeting we heard from several of our
former presidents and they taught us a lot about the history and
legacy of our organization and about how we can continue that legacy.
We also got some updated information from RFB, BookShare and about
recent developments regarding the Kindle DX issue. Finally, we
conducted elections and I was elected to serve as the next president
of NABS. I am deeply honored to continue serving this organization and
to join the ranks of those who have come before me, and I would like
to thank all of you for your support  and for your assistance with
making the business meeting and Monte Carlo Night fund-raiser run as
smoothly as possible.

Several others joined our NABS board for the first time. The complete
list of officers and board members is:
President: Arielle Silverman
First Vice-President: Karen Anderson
Second Vice-President: Sean Whalen
Secretary: Janice Jeang
Treasurer: Nijat Worley
Board Member 1: Isaiah Wilcox
Board Member 2: Meghan Whalen
Board Member 3: Domonique Lawless
Board Member 4: Darian Smith
Congratulations to all who were elected. Additionally, we had several
other NABS members who sought election to the board, and consequently
ended up with more interested persons than we could include on the
board. I see this as a good sign that we have a substantial group of
students who care about NABS and helping us to achieve our goals. If
you ran for a board position but were not elected or even if you
didn�t run for a board position but still want to make a contribution
to NABS, there is plenty of work to go around. Stay tuned for an
announcement in the next week or two about NABS committees and  how to
join them. I would also like to set up some telephone focus groups in
the next few months to get your feedback on how we can improve
specific aspects of NABS such as the Student Slate, Website,
convention activities, state division outreach and election policies.
If you want  your voice to be heard, stay tuned  for more details
about these conference calls.

Also, from now on please direct all NABS inquiries to
Nabs.president at gmail.com
The official email address shown on our Website,
president at nabslink.org
also works, but email from both addresses will go to the same place. I
will check this organizational email address daily, and I or another
NABS board member will reply to your query within three days of
receiving it. You can also call me with any questions or  concerns at
602-502-2255
And again, someone will return all phone messages within three days.

I will be sending out a president�s bulletin to the NABS listserv and
the state division lists during the first week of each month. This
bulletin will contain updates about NABS activities as well as other
announcements of interest such as information about state and regional
student division events and news from the NFB Jernigan Institute, RFB,
BookShare, etc. If you  have an announcement that  you would like to
appear in the next president�s bulletin, please send it to me before
the first of the month at noon.

Finally, if you are currently president of a state student division,
please email me off-list with your state, phone number, email address
and whether or not you�re subscribed to  the NABS-Presidents listserv.
I want to be sure the Website and my master state contact list is
updated and that everyone gets on the Presidents list who should be on
it. If you are in a state that doesn�t have a student division yet and
you want to serve as the student contact for your state, also send me
this information.

I�m looking forward to an exciting and productive two years with NABS,
and hope all  of you will join me in making NABS as strong as it can
be!


-- 
Arielle Silverman
President, National Association of Blind Students
Phone:  602-502-2255
Email:
nabs.president at gmail.com
Website:
www.nabslink.org

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan%40gmail.com 




From raniaismail04 at gmail.com  Sat Jul 11 03:23:46 2009
From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania)
Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 23:23:46 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com>
	<2B0274AB59E447ABA962C0149DEDCC95@Jessica>
Message-ID: <001e01ca01d7$00baa9b0$2801a8c0@DHQ5QJF1>

Ariel congradulations to you and everyone else.
Rania,
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jess" <jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 10, 2009 9:29 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update


> Arielle,
> Congratulations to you and all that were elected to the NABS board.
> Jessica
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Arielle Silverman" <nabs.president at gmail.com>
> To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Friday, July 10, 2009 8:11 PM
> Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
>
>
> Hello NABS members:
>
> Last weekend the National Association of Blind Students held our
> annual business meeting in conjunction with the NFB convention in
> Detroit. At this year's business meeting we heard from several of our
> former presidents and they taught us a lot about the history and
> legacy of our organization and about how we can continue that legacy.
> We also got some updated information from RFB, BookShare and about
> recent developments regarding the Kindle DX issue. Finally, we
> conducted elections and I was elected to serve as the next president
> of NABS. I am deeply honored to continue serving this organization and
> to join the ranks of those who have come before me, and I would like
> to thank all of you for your support  and for your assistance with
> making the business meeting and Monte Carlo Night fund-raiser run as
> smoothly as possible.
>
> Several others joined our NABS board for the first time. The complete
> list of officers and board members is:
> President: Arielle Silverman
> First Vice-President: Karen Anderson
> Second Vice-President: Sean Whalen
> Secretary: Janice Jeang
> Treasurer: Nijat Worley
> Board Member 1: Isaiah Wilcox
> Board Member 2: Meghan Whalen
> Board Member 3: Domonique Lawless
> Board Member 4: Darian Smith
> Congratulations to all who were elected. Additionally, we had several
> other NABS members who sought election to the board, and consequently
> ended up with more interested persons than we could include on the
> board. I see this as a good sign that we have a substantial group of
> students who care about NABS and helping us to achieve our goals. If
> you ran for a board position but were not elected or even if you
> didn't run for a board position but still want to make a contribution
> to NABS, there is plenty of work to go around. Stay tuned for an
> announcement in the next week or two about NABS committees and  how to
> join them. I would also like to set up some telephone focus groups in
> the next few months to get your feedback on how we can improve
> specific aspects of NABS such as the Student Slate, Website,
> convention activities, state division outreach and election policies.
> If you want  your voice to be heard, stay tuned  for more details
> about these conference calls.
>
> Also, from now on please direct all NABS inquiries to
> Nabs.president at gmail.com
> The official email address shown on our Website,
> president at nabslink.org
> also works, but email from both addresses will go to the same place. I
> will check this organizational email address daily, and I or another
> NABS board member will reply to your query within three days of
> receiving it. You can also call me with any questions or  concerns at
> 602-502-2255
> And again, someone will return all phone messages within three days.
>
> I will be sending out a president's bulletin to the NABS listserv and
> the state division lists during the first week of each month. This
> bulletin will contain updates about NABS activities as well as other
> announcements of interest such as information about state and regional
> student division events and news from the NFB Jernigan Institute, RFB,
> BookShare, etc. If you  have an announcement that  you would like to
> appear in the next president's bulletin, please send it to me before
> the first of the month at noon.
>
> Finally, if you are currently president of a state student division,
> please email me off-list with your state, phone number, email address
> and whether or not you're subscribed to  the NABS-Presidents listserv.
> I want to be sure the Website and my master state contact list is
> updated and that everyone gets on the Presidents list who should be on
> it. If you are in a state that doesn't have a student division yet and
> you want to serve as the student contact for your state, also send me
> this information.
>
> I'm looking forward to an exciting and productive two years with NABS,
> and hope all  of you will join me in making NABS as strong as it can
> be!
>
>
> -- 
> Arielle Silverman
> President, National Association of Blind Students
> Phone:  602-502-2255
> Email:
> nabs.president at gmail.com
> Website:
> www.nabslink.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan%40gmail.com
>
>
>


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmail.com
> 



From carter.tjoseph at gmail.com  Sat Jul 11 18:36:17 2009
From: carter.tjoseph at gmail.com (T. Joseph Carter)
Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 11:36:17 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20090711183617.GF39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>

Arielle and all of NABS,

I've heard more than a few rumblings about it already, and I am not 
sure the board should try to address them:  The NABS election was a 
complete and total fiasco lacking even the appearance of integrity.  
A number of people are really unhappy about it, and some are talking 
about taking action.

I feel a need to say, "Don't do it, please."  I know some of you to 
be good students and good advocates both fro this organization and 
for the blind in general.  If those of you I don't know are of the 
same caliber, then you may turn fiasco into tragedy.  Think about the 
possible outcomes first.

Either you will find widespread support, or you will not.  If the 
latter, you face marginalization and feelings of disenfranchisement 
greater than you already feel.  That will drive you away from the 
organization for certain.  Perhaps I am being a bit selfish here, but 
NABS and the NFB need _you_, and I'd rather not have you fall away 
over something as transitory as a single problematic election.

If you do garner widespread support, the tragedy will be larger 
still: The organization would faction into those who support the 
incoming board and those who oppose the process that elected them, 
with a lot of people who want to do both feeling caught in the 
middle.  There's no faster way to ensure more controversial elections 
than to go down this road.

So .. what do you do?  I made my decision before the election was 
even over: I'm going to support the incoming board, and I'm going to 
encourage (read: make a pain in the rear end of myself) the board to 
act boldly and with integrity on behalf of blind students.

I also intend to similarly encourage (read the same way) that only 
registered members vote, and that each registrant gets one vote.  I 
can't claim to have a simple and brilliant solution here yet because 
I can't figure out how to handle runoff elections quickly and cleanly 
yet.  The curious know my email address.  *smile*

Joseph

P.S. I considered suggesting the Condorcet method, but I decided not 
to propose anything that required calculating a square root to figure 
out who wins the election.



From carter.tjoseph at gmail.com  Sat Jul 11 19:04:31 2009
From: carter.tjoseph at gmail.com (T. Joseph Carter)
Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 12:04:31 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Free NFB cane
In-Reply-To: <20090625121232.GB44166@yumi.bluecherry.net>
References: <397852.71300.qm@web65704.mail.ac4.yahoo.com>
	<20090625121232.GB44166@yumi.bluecherry.net>
Message-ID: <20090711190431.GG39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>

Following up, while at convention I raised the point about NFB's free 
cane program not including the larger sizes for us tall folks.  The 
response was that this was a good point, and it's going to be 
addressed.  Glad to hear it!

Joseph


On Thu, Jun 25, 2009 at 05:12:32AM -0700, T. Joseph Carter wrote:
> Jim,
>
> We generally recommend nose-high canes.  A few use canes taller than  
> they are, but only a few.  *grin*
>
> I second your bafflement at the limitation in cane lengths.  It should go 
> as high as 69" at least.  A lot of guys fall in the 65 and 67 range, and 
> more than a few into the 69.
>
> I'd go straight for carbon fiber myself, which the NFB doesn't give away 
> for free.  They're light and they're strong.  I might be concerned about 
> a graphite/carbon cane in the frigid winter (can become more brittle), 
> but the straight canes seem to be tough enough at least for Denver.
>
> Joseph
>
>
> On Wed, Jun 24, 2009 at 11:10:58AM -0700, Jim Reed wrote:
>> Hey all, 
>>
>> I'm wondering why the free NFB canes are so short? I mean, I'm only 6 
>> foot 4, and an NFB cane isn't long enough for me. I could understand 
>> the NFB not having a long enough cane for me if I was like 7 foot tall, 
>> but I am not that tall, and I am certianly not that far out of the norm 
>> for the average height of American males,  
>>
>> I find the 63 inch limit particularly odd since the NFB (or at least 
>> nost NFB members) all seem to recomend canes that are at least as tall, 
>> if not taller, than the person using it. This means (based on NFB 
>> recomendations) that a 63 inch cane should not be used by anyone taller 
>> than 5 foot 3. As far as I can tell, nearly all American men, and most 
>> American women and teenagers are going to be taller than 5 foot 3, so 
>> why won't the NFB offer a free cane that is large enough for most of 
>> society to benifit? I'm sure their is a legitimate and rational 
>> (probably economic) reason as to why the NFB has choosen to not offer 
>> canes longer than 63 inches, and I'd be curious to find out what that 
>> reason is. 
>>
>>
>> Thanks, 
>>
>> Jim
>>
>> "From compromise and things half done, Keep me with stern and stubborn 
>> pride,
>> And when at last the fight is won, ... Keep me still unsatisfied." 
>> --Louis Untermeyer
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carter.tjoseph%40gmail.com


From djdrocks4ever at gmail.com  Sat Jul 11 19:10:04 2009
From: djdrocks4ever at gmail.com (David Dunphy)
Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 14:10:04 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com>
	<20090711183617.GF39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
Message-ID: <1432A6F9C7BD43A18ECECA1C8F178155@thedjdinvasion>

Did you win any board positions Joseph?

*****
If you're tired of hearing the same old songs on your local radio station, 
and if you can't find the variety you've always wanted, then check out the 
station that I own and operate with a great group of broadcasters called 
Radio360. You'll hear all types of music and programming, plus you're able 
to control what you hear through requests, interaction with the djs, and 
more!
To find out more about the station, visit us on the web at
http://www.radio360.us
Follow us on twitter at
http://www.twitter.com/radio360usa
or add us to your MySpace at
http://www.myspace.com/radio360usa
Come check us out, you won't be disappointed!!! 



From brsmith24 at hotmail.com  Sat Jul 11 20:12:37 2009
From: brsmith24 at hotmail.com (Brice Smith)
Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 16:12:37 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <1432A6F9C7BD43A18ECECA1C8F178155@thedjdinvasion>
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com>
	<20090711183617.GF39692@yumi.bluecherry.net> 
	<1432A6F9C7BD43A18ECECA1C8F178155@thedjdinvasion>
Message-ID: <SNT101-W3474F7B68895E688EA58B0B2240@phx.gbl>


Either you're trying to start something here, or you didn't see the message from Arielle that said:

":
list of officers and board members is:
President: Arielle Silverman
First Vice-President: Karen Anderson
Second Vice-President: Sean Whalen
Secretary: Janice Jeang
Treasurer: Nijat Worley
Board Member 1: Isaiah Wilcox
Board Member 2: Meghan Whalen
Board Member 3: Domonique Lawless
Board Member 4: Darian Smith"

 Brice
> From: djdrocks4ever at gmail.com
> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 14:10:04 -0500
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
> 
> Did you win any board positions Joseph?
> 
> *****
> If you're tired of hearing the same old songs on your local radio station, 
> and if you can't find the variety you've always wanted, then check out the 
> station that I own and operate with a great group of broadcasters called 
> Radio360. You'll hear all types of music and programming, plus you're able 
> to control what you hear through requests, interaction with the djs, and 
> more!
> To find out more about the station, visit us on the web at
> http://www.radio360.us
> Follow us on twitter at
> http://www.twitter.com/radio360usa
> or add us to your MySpace at
> http://www.myspace.com/radio360usa
> Come check us out, you won't be disappointed!!! 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brsmith24%40hotmail.com

_________________________________________________________________
Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that’s right for you.
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/choosepc/?ocid=ftp_val_wl_290

From djdrocks4ever at gmail.com  Sat Jul 11 21:29:06 2009
From: djdrocks4ever at gmail.com (David Dunphy)
Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 16:29:06 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com><20090711183617.GF39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
	<1432A6F9C7BD43A18ECECA1C8F178155@thedjdinvasion>
	<SNT101-W3474F7B68895E688EA58B0B2240@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <06ED14354A2D430584A8674CE08C7849@thedjdinvasion>

I missed it, sorry.

*****
If you're tired of hearing the same old songs on your local radio station, 
and if you can't find the variety you've always wanted, then check out the 
station that I own and operate with a great group of broadcasters called 
Radio360. You'll hear all types of music and programming, plus you're able 
to control what you hear through requests, interaction with the djs, and 
more!
To find out more about the station, visit us on the web at
http://www.radio360.us
Follow us on twitter at
http://www.twitter.com/radio360usa
or add us to your MySpace at
http://www.myspace.com/radio360usa
Come check us out, you won't be disappointed!!! 



From nijat1989 at gmail.com  Sat Jul 11 22:05:04 2009
From: nijat1989 at gmail.com (Nijat Worley)
Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 16:05:04 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com>
	<20090711183617.GF39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
Message-ID: <A24D3BF1F427487BA7865DB3E9412B06@Nijatash>

Greetings Joseph,
   I believe that there is little doubt about the legitimacy of the current 
NABS board and the process by which they were elected. Those who are angry, 
and those who want to grumble about it, and still those who want to take 
action about it, have little ground to do so. Besides, what kind of action 
would be appropriate at this point? The former board and Terri did their 
best to make sure that the elections were fair. They did almost every vote 
by a hand count at your request. I am utterly surprised that you are still 
dissatisfied about the outcome of the elections. I understand there were 
some mistakes made in the election process, and the board has made note of 
them. We will take proper action to make sure that those mistakes don't 
happen again. I do agree with you that to try to do anything  that might 
divide the organization at this point would only counter your intentions. 
NABS is an ever changing and evolving organization simply because of the 
fact that many of its members both on the board and off the board come and 
go so quickly. Nobody stays in NABS forever. We are all new to this 
organization, and we all make mistakes. I appreciate you expressing your 
concerns and telling folks to stay united, because only united, can we make 
change and strengthen this organization for the benefit of all. I always 
tell our members both at the state and national level that one does not have 
to be on the board to help out the organization and to be a leader. I think 
Arielle intends to get everybody involved in the development and growth of 
NABS. I am very pleased to say that I saw many of you at the Monty Carlo 
night helping us put it together and wrap it up at the end. We couldn't have 
done it without you. Thanks to B. J. Sexton, Caron Anderson, Willie Black, 
Jim, Jedi, and many others for staying and helping with Monty Carlo Night. 
Let us put behind us any hard feelings that may be in our chests and move on 
to bigger and better things for the sake of NABS if for nothing else.
   At your service,
   Nijat

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "T. Joseph Carter" <carter.tjoseph at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 12:36 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update


> Arielle and all of NABS,
>
> I've heard more than a few rumblings about it already, and I am not sure 
> the board should try to address them:  The NABS election was a complete 
> and total fiasco lacking even the appearance of integrity.  A number of 
> people are really unhappy about it, and some are talking about taking 
> action.
>
> I feel a need to say, "Don't do it, please."  I know some of you to be 
> good students and good advocates both fro this organization and for the 
> blind in general.  If those of you I don't know are of the same caliber, 
> then you may turn fiasco into tragedy.  Think about the possible outcomes 
> first.
>
> Either you will find widespread support, or you will not.  If the latter, 
> you face marginalization and feelings of disenfranchisement greater than 
> you already feel.  That will drive you away from the organization for 
> certain.  Perhaps I am being a bit selfish here, but NABS and the NFB need 
> _you_, and I'd rather not have you fall away over something as transitory 
> as a single problematic election.
>
> If you do garner widespread support, the tragedy will be larger still: The 
> organization would faction into those who support the incoming board and 
> those who oppose the process that elected them, with a lot of people who 
> want to do both feeling caught in the middle.  There's no faster way to 
> ensure more controversial elections than to go down this road.
>
> So .. what do you do?  I made my decision before the election was even 
> over: I'm going to support the incoming board, and I'm going to encourage 
> (read: make a pain in the rear end of myself) the board to act boldly and 
> with integrity on behalf of blind students.
>
> I also intend to similarly encourage (read the same way) that only 
> registered members vote, and that each registrant gets one vote.  I can't 
> claim to have a simple and brilliant solution here yet because I can't 
> figure out how to handle runoff elections quickly and cleanly yet.  The 
> curious know my email address.  *smile*
>
> Joseph
>
> P.S. I considered suggesting the Condorcet method, but I decided not to 
> propose anything that required calculating a square root to figure out who 
> wins the election.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nijat1989%40gmail.com 



From carter.tjoseph at gmail.com  Sun Jul 12 00:10:23 2009
From: carter.tjoseph at gmail.com (T. Joseph Carter)
Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 17:10:23 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <1432A6F9C7BD43A18ECECA1C8F178155@thedjdinvasion>
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com>
	<20090711183617.GF39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
	<1432A6F9C7BD43A18ECECA1C8F178155@thedjdinvasion>
Message-ID: <20090712001023.GH39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>

David,

I did not.  If I had, I'd be in the same position as the incoming 
board right now—if they speak on the issue, it looks like they're 
trying to quiet dissent.  An outsider is the only one who can do it 
under the circumstances.

If anyone ought to be crying foul about the election, it probably 
ought to be me, for multiple reasons.  And yet that's exactly why I 
need to be the first to say that it's time to move on.  We have a new 
board, and they cannot be faulted.

The only responsibility the incoming board has is to do better.

Joseph


On Sat, Jul 11, 2009 at 02:10:04PM -0500, David Dunphy wrote:
> Did you win any board positions Joseph?
>
> *****
> If you're tired of hearing the same old songs on your local radio 
> station, and if you can't find the variety you've always wanted, then 
> check out the station that I own and operate with a great group of 
> broadcasters called Radio360. You'll hear all types of music and 
> programming, plus you're able to control what you hear through requests, 
> interaction with the djs, and more!
> To find out more about the station, visit us on the web at
> http://www.radio360.us
> Follow us on twitter at
> http://www.twitter.com/radio360usa
> or add us to your MySpace at
> http://www.myspace.com/radio360usa
> Come check us out, you won't be disappointed!!! 


From nabs.president at gmail.com  Sun Jul 12 02:28:12 2009
From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 12:28:12 +1000
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <20090712001023.GH39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com>
	<20090711183617.GF39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
	<1432A6F9C7BD43A18ECECA1C8F178155@thedjdinvasion>
	<20090712001023.GH39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
Message-ID: <85ff10070907111928xcce0313od29a9372471b3eee@mail.gmail.com>

Dear Joseph and all:

	I am aware that some of  our members were disappointed in the way
that elections and the passing of a constitutional amendment were
handled at the NABS business meeting. While in the end all procedures
were followed according to proper NABS protocol, there was some
confusion initially among those running the election about how to
handle these issues. I’d like to apologize personally for this and as
NABS president I will make every effort to ensure that future
elections are followed according to proper procedure. The good thing
about making mistakes is that once they are made and recognized, care
can be taken to keep them from happening again.

	It’s important to keep two things in mind when contemplating the
elections. The first is that this is not the first time these issues
have come up in NABS. For years we have been debating about how to
count votes. This is the first time we required voters to display a
card proving paid member status when voting. In the past we used
standing votes and trusted that all voters were paid members. This
policy led to its own set of complaints and chaos which is why we
switched to the vote cards. Using the vote cards was an experiment,
and if the members feel it was a mistake, we won’t do it again.
Similarly, we have frequently had long elections with several people
running for each position. There has been much debate about whether or
not NABS should appoint a nominating committee. That is still an open
question, and one I’d like the membership to think about before we
make a decision. So, these are tricky issues with no easy answers and
ones we’ve been struggling with for years.

The second point I’d like to make is that our constitution is very
vague. It doesn’t tell us how to count votes. It only specifies that a
candidate needs a majority of the votes to win, and that if no
candidate gets a majority, the one with the least votes is dropped.
So, again, a lot of this is open to debate and there is no one way to
fix it.

	Before our next election I’d like to have a couple of focus groups
with NABS members about the best and fairest way to handle
vote-counting, etc. For those of you who were feeling disappointed,
I’d ask you to cease “grumbiling” and instead come to me with clear
suggestions for improvement. What specifically did you find
problematic? If you were the one running things how would you have
done it differently? We can’t take everyone’s suggestions, of course,
but we need concrete feedback in order to make changes. Though I can’t
speak for anyone else, as NABS president I would never want to “quiet
dissent”. Those of you who knew me in the early days of my NFB
involvement know that I frequently asked questions and expressed
opinions contrary to the so-called NFB party line. I do, however, ask
that complaints and suggestions be voiced respectfully and that they
be specific to what you thought was wrong or unfair. Just saying “it
was chaos” doesn’t help us figure out how to make things better in the
future. If you were disappointed, I also hope that you can still work
with us and move forward. Elections only happen once a year, but the
mentoring and collective action that happens in NABS happens all year
long.

	Finally, I will say this: Whatever procedure we decide to use for
conducting the election and counting votes, when I run the next NABS
election I’ll be sure to spell out the procedures ahead of time before
we start the election, and I will also make sure the vote counters
have been chosen and instructed prior to the election. I suspect a lot
of the trouble came from the fact that people didn’t know what to
expect and that some of the rules changed throughout the course of the
election. Again, I apologize for this and I can say with certainty
that this won’t happen again.

P.S. For your reference: The NABS constitution (not yet amended) is attached.

On 7/12/09, T. Joseph Carter <carter.tjoseph at gmail.com> wrote:
> David,
>
> I did not.  If I had, I'd be in the same position as the incoming
> board right now—if they speak on the issue, it looks like they're
> trying to quiet dissent.  An outsider is the only one who can do it
> under the circumstances.
>
> If anyone ought to be crying foul about the election, it probably
> ought to be me, for multiple reasons.  And yet that's exactly why I
> need to be the first to say that it's time to move on.  We have a new
> board, and they cannot be faulted.
>
> The only responsibility the incoming board has is to do better.
>
> Joseph
>
>
> On Sat, Jul 11, 2009 at 02:10:04PM -0500, David Dunphy wrote:
>> Did you win any board positions Joseph?
>>
>> *****
>> If you're tired of hearing the same old songs on your local radio
>> station, and if you can't find the variety you've always wanted, then
>> check out the station that I own and operate with a great group of
>> broadcasters called Radio360. You'll hear all types of music and
>> programming, plus you're able to control what you hear through requests,
>> interaction with the djs, and more!
>> To find out more about the station, visit us on the web at
>> http://www.radio360.us
>> Follow us on twitter at
>> http://www.twitter.com/radio360usa
>> or add us to your MySpace at
>> http://www.myspace.com/radio360usa
>> Come check us out, you won't be disappointed!!!
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com
>


-- 
Arielle Silverman
President, National Association of Blind Students
Phone:  602-502-2255
Email:
nabs.president at gmail.com
Website:
www.nabslink.org
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From bookwormahb at earthlink.net  Sun Jul 12 03:22:36 2009
From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley  Bramlett)
Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 23:22:36 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com><20090711183617.GF39692@yumi.bluecherry.net><1432A6F9C7BD43A18ECECA1C8F178155@thedjdinvasion>
	<20090712001023.GH39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
Message-ID: <0D784C4EBA2B409CA3D71DF9E9DBBDDD@Ashley>

Hi Joeseph,

Did you run for an office?  You seem unhappy.
Most of us on this list were not at convention; I think nabs-l has 200 plus 
subscribers, one of the larger nfb lists.  therefore many of us don't know 
what this fued is about.  You may wish to respond off list.  My email is 
bookwormahb at earthlink.net.

Nijat says there was a hand count for almost all votes.  I was not there and 
so don't know the full story but if a hand count was done upon request for 
any position, it seems legitimate.  I've seen many elections held at my 
local chapter and one nabs election.
Are nominations taken from the floor?  Have all positions been nominated at 
time of election?  At chapter meetings they have a nominating comittee but 
will also take nominations from the floor as long as the person is present 
to accept or decline.
Its my understanding
the process is something like this in nabs.
1. Those running speak for a few minutes why they feel they should hold the 
office.
2. A voice vote is conducted.
3. Hand counts are done if its a close count or a tie.

Was the whole board up for election and how many years are their term?
I don't know what you meant by this:

"The NABS election was a
complete and total fiasco lacking even the appearance of integrity."

That's a strong statement and I wonder why you felt this way?  Did you run 
for a position and lose?  Maybe the position  was a close tie?

If anyone wants to explain what happened that would be good.  Be careful in 
responding on list as not to mix facts up.  Feel free to respond off list 
too if you were there.  all I gather as an outsider that several people ran 
for a given position, were not elected, and therefore the election was 
unfair.

Enjoy the summer.
Ashley



From bookwormahb at earthlink.net  Sun Jul 12 03:40:53 2009
From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley  Bramlett)
Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 23:40:53 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com><20090711183617.GF39692@yumi.bluecherry.net><1432A6F9C7BD43A18ECECA1C8F178155@thedjdinvasion>
	<20090712001023.GH39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
Message-ID: <9BA10B735C6A458B956FF3F5CF583172@Ashley>

Joeseph,

Are you the president of your student division in Oregon?  I thought so or 
at least you had a board position there.  If so, you can be a leader in your 
state and serve on nabs focus groups if you wanted to do something national.

Arielle has partly answered my question on what the fued is about and why 
some might be angry.

She said
"In the past we used
standing votes and trusted that all voters were paid members."
This year you required a card proving you were a member to vote.  This is an 
interesting experiment.  All nfb elections I seen at the local and state 
level do voice and standing votes.  Another way is raising hands to count 
them by someone who can see.  We don't require proof of membership; never 
been an issue.  We do have visitors often to the meetings and not everyone 
attends meetings consistently; so I lose track of who is a member and a 
guest!  Anyway I hope you move forward united.

Ashley




From minesm at me.com  Sun Jul 12 03:44:12 2009
From: minesm at me.com (Maurice Mines)
Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 21:44:12 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <20090712001023.GH39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com>
	<20090711183617.GF39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
	<1432A6F9C7BD43A18ECECA1C8F178155@thedjdinvasion>
	<20090712001023.GH39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
Message-ID: <63274120-C297-4F4F-BD9B-B9063A4CFDA3@me.com>

hi as my late grandmother offen told me let sleeping dougs lay or in  
this case go to sleep. it's over please lets move on?
On Jul 11, 2009, at 6:10 PM, T. Joseph Carter wrote:

> David,
>
> I did not.  If I had, I'd be in the same position as the incoming  
> board right now—if they speak on the issue, it looks like they're  
> trying to quiet dissent.  An outsider is the only one who can do it  
> under the circumstances.
>
> If anyone ought to be crying foul about the election, it probably  
> ought to be me, for multiple reasons.  And yet that's exactly why I  
> need to be the first to say that it's time to move on.  We have a  
> new board, and they cannot be faulted.
>
> The only responsibility the incoming board has is to do better.
>
> Joseph
>
>
> On Sat, Jul 11, 2009 at 02:10:04PM -0500, David Dunphy wrote:
>> Did you win any board positions Joseph?
>>
>> *****
>> If you're tired of hearing the same old songs on your local radio  
>> station, and if you can't find the variety you've always wanted,  
>> then check out the station that I own and operate with a great  
>> group of broadcasters called Radio360. You'll hear all types of  
>> music and programming, plus you're able to control what you hear  
>> through requests, interaction with the djs, and more!
>> To find out more about the station, visit us on the web at
>> http://www.radio360.us
>> Follow us on twitter at
>> http://www.twitter.com/radio360usa
>> or add us to your MySpace at
>> http://www.myspace.com/radio360usa
>> Come check us out, you won't be disappointed!!!
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info  
> for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/minesm 
> %40me.com



From carter.tjoseph at gmail.com  Sun Jul 12 05:33:25 2009
From: carter.tjoseph at gmail.com (T. Joseph Carter)
Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 22:33:25 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <A24D3BF1F427487BA7865DB3E9412B06@Nijatash>
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com>
	<20090711183617.GF39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
	<A24D3BF1F427487BA7865DB3E9412B06@Nijatash>
Message-ID: <20090712053325.GJ39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>

Nijat,

One look at the vote counts—so conveniently all multiples of 
ten—calls their accuracy into question.  That students in the room 
report different counts isn't surprising, until you note that their 
reports indicate higher counts for losers than were reported to us in 
a few races, including your runoff, actually.

Personally, I decided not to participate after that point.  We don't 
have 100% agreement on the counts, but there's enough discrepancy 
often enough to call the whole thing into question.  I'm not saying I 
won any of those elections, but I am saying I'm not quite sure in a 
few cases who should have.  I am honestly not sure how many people 
were getting involved trying to do something about it, but there was 
more than three or four.

There are only two things I am sure of: First, no good is likely to 
come of any effort that group might make.  Second, a member of the 
board telling us not to worry our pretty little heads ... just isn't 
going to make things better.  Both sound disastrous to me.

This isn't about who did or did not win an election.  It's about the 
membership of this organization believing a real election actually 
took place.  If even a significant minority doubt that, then it is 
bad for NABS, even if you assume every one of them will age-out of 
NABS in a few years.  We reflect the NFB as a whole, and we should 
reflect it well.

I serve the organization, not the board.  I will yet see two boards 
serve while I remain a student.  It is in the organization's interest 
to make sure what we saw last Saturday does not happen again.  I have 
a solution, but it's not a complete solution yet.  It does result in 
a paper trail, or at least a box full of index cards.  Still working 
out how to handle runoff elections.

Joseph


On Sat, Jul 11, 2009 at 04:05:04PM -0600, Nijat Worley wrote:
> Greetings Joseph,
>   I believe that there is little doubt about the legitimacy of the 
> current NABS board and the process by which they were elected. Those who 
> are angry, and those who want to grumble about it, and still those who 
> want to take action about it, have little ground to do so. Besides, what 
> kind of action would be appropriate at this point? The former board and 
> Terri did their best to make sure that the elections were fair. They did 
> almost every vote by a hand count at your request. I am utterly surprised 
> that you are still dissatisfied about the outcome of the elections. I 
> understand there were some mistakes made in the election process, and the 
> board has made note of them. We will take proper action to make sure that 
> those mistakes don't happen again. I do agree with you that to try to do 
> anything  that might divide the organization at this point would only 
> counter your intentions. NABS is an ever changing and evolving 
> organization simply because of the fact that many of its members both on 
> the board and off the board come and go so quickly. Nobody stays in NABS 
> forever. We are all new to this organization, and we all make mistakes. I 
> appreciate you expressing your concerns and telling folks to stay united, 
> because only united, can we make change and strengthen this organization 
> for the benefit of all. I always tell our members both at the state and 
> national level that one does not have to be on the board to help out the 
> organization and to be a leader. I think Arielle intends to get everybody 
> involved in the development and growth of NABS. I am very pleased to say 
> that I saw many of you at the Monty Carlo night helping us put it 
> together and wrap it up at the end. We couldn't have done it without you. 
> Thanks to B. J. Sexton, Caron Anderson, Willie Black, Jim, Jedi, and many 
> others for staying and helping with Monty Carlo Night. Let us put behind 
> us any hard feelings that may be in our chests and move on to bigger and 
> better things for the sake of NABS if for nothing else.
>   At your service,
>   Nijat


From carter.tjoseph at gmail.com  Sun Jul 12 05:53:17 2009
From: carter.tjoseph at gmail.com (T. Joseph Carter)
Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 22:53:17 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <0D784C4EBA2B409CA3D71DF9E9DBBDDD@Ashley>
References: <20090712001023.GH39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
	<0D784C4EBA2B409CA3D71DF9E9DBBDDD@Ashley>
Message-ID: <20090712055317.GK39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>

Ashley,

I'm not the one planning who knows what to interfere with the new 
board.  I did run.  I didn't win, and I don't contest that.  There 
were larger issues, though.  Those who have spoken so far seem to 
want to pretend that nothing out of the ordinary happened.

I won't pretend it was a clean and proper election, because it 
wasn't.  The people who actually are angry about it deserve the 
dignity of having their genuine feelings of disenfranchisement 
respected and accepted under the circumstance.

If they are intent upon doing something about it, I am offering them 
a suggestion to do something constructive: Find a way to make sure 
the next election cannot be a repeat of what we saw last Saturday.

Joseph

On Sat, Jul 11, 2009 at 11:22:36PM -0400, Ashley  Bramlett wrote:
> Hi Joeseph,
>
> Did you run for an office?  You seem unhappy.
> Most of us on this list were not at convention; I think nabs-l has 200 
> plus subscribers, one of the larger nfb lists.  therefore many of us 
> don't know what this fued is about.  You may wish to respond off list.  
> My email is bookwormahb at earthlink.net.
>
> Nijat says there was a hand count for almost all votes.  I was not there 
> and so don't know the full story but if a hand count was done upon 
> request for any position, it seems legitimate.  I've seen many elections 
> held at my local chapter and one nabs election.
> Are nominations taken from the floor?  Have all positions been nominated 
> at time of election?  At chapter meetings they have a nominating comittee 
> but will also take nominations from the floor as long as the person is 
> present to accept or decline.
> Its my understanding
> the process is something like this in nabs.
> 1. Those running speak for a few minutes why they feel they should hold 
> the office.
> 2. A voice vote is conducted.
> 3. Hand counts are done if its a close count or a tie.
>
> Was the whole board up for election and how many years are their term?
> I don't know what you meant by this:
>
> "The NABS election was a
> complete and total fiasco lacking even the appearance of integrity."
>
> That's a strong statement and I wonder why you felt this way?  Did you 
> run for a position and lose?  Maybe the position  was a close tie?
>
> If anyone wants to explain what happened that would be good.  Be careful 
> in responding on list as not to mix facts up.  Feel free to respond off 
> list too if you were there.  all I gather as an outsider that several 
> people ran for a given position, were not elected, and therefore the 
> election was unfair.
>
> Enjoy the summer.
> Ashley
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carter.tjoseph%40gmail.com


From jessicac.kostiw at gmail.com  Sun Jul 12 15:06:06 2009
From: jessicac.kostiw at gmail.com (Jessica Kostiw)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 10:06:06 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com><20090711183617.GF39692@yumi.bluecherry.net><1432A6F9C7BD43A18ECECA1C8F178155@thedjdinvasion><20090712001023.GH39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
	<85ff10070907111928xcce0313od29a9372471b3eee@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <00f701ca0302$49acf4d0$9b4ea962@Jessica>

Congratulations Arielle and to the rest of the board,
I know most of you personally and I am excited to see what the next year 
holds!

I was not able to make convention this year, but have read the posts 
concerning issues of the election.  Arielle, I think you have addressed the 
concerns more then adequately.  This is certainly not the first time that 
NABS elections have been contested, and it will not be the last.

Again, sincere congratulations to all!!  You earned it!!
Jessica Kostiw
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Arielle Silverman" <nabs.president at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 9:28 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update


Dear Joseph and all:

I am aware that some of  our members were disappointed in the way
that elections and the passing of a constitutional amendment were
handled at the NABS business meeting. While in the end all procedures
were followed according to proper NABS protocol, there was some
confusion initially among those running the election about how to
handle these issues. I’d like to apologize personally for this and as
NABS president I will make every effort to ensure that future
elections are followed according to proper procedure. The good thing
about making mistakes is that once they are made and recognized, care
can be taken to keep them from happening again.

It’s important to keep two things in mind when contemplating the
elections. The first is that this is not the first time these issues
have come up in NABS. For years we have been debating about how to
count votes. This is the first time we required voters to display a
card proving paid member status when voting. In the past we used
standing votes and trusted that all voters were paid members. This
policy led to its own set of complaints and chaos which is why we
switched to the vote cards. Using the vote cards was an experiment,
and if the members feel it was a mistake, we won’t do it again.
Similarly, we have frequently had long elections with several people
running for each position. There has been much debate about whether or
not NABS should appoint a nominating committee. That is still an open
question, and one I’d like the membership to think about before we
make a decision. So, these are tricky issues with no easy answers and
ones we’ve been struggling with for years.

The second point I’d like to make is that our constitution is very
vague. It doesn’t tell us how to count votes. It only specifies that a
candidate needs a majority of the votes to win, and that if no
candidate gets a majority, the one with the least votes is dropped.
So, again, a lot of this is open to debate and there is no one way to
fix it.

Before our next election I’d like to have a couple of focus groups
with NABS members about the best and fairest way to handle
vote-counting, etc. For those of you who were feeling disappointed,
I’d ask you to cease “grumbiling” and instead come to me with clear
suggestions for improvement. What specifically did you find
problematic? If you were the one running things how would you have
done it differently? We can’t take everyone’s suggestions, of course,
but we need concrete feedback in order to make changes. Though I can’t
speak for anyone else, as NABS president I would never want to “quiet
dissent”. Those of you who knew me in the early days of my NFB
involvement know that I frequently asked questions and expressed
opinions contrary to the so-called NFB party line. I do, however, ask
that complaints and suggestions be voiced respectfully and that they
be specific to what you thought was wrong or unfair. Just saying “it
was chaos” doesn’t help us figure out how to make things better in the
future. If you were disappointed, I also hope that you can still work
with us and move forward. Elections only happen once a year, but the
mentoring and collective action that happens in NABS happens all year
long.

Finally, I will say this: Whatever procedure we decide to use for
conducting the election and counting votes, when I run the next NABS
election I’ll be sure to spell out the procedures ahead of time before
we start the election, and I will also make sure the vote counters
have been chosen and instructed prior to the election. I suspect a lot
of the trouble came from the fact that people didn’t know what to
expect and that some of the rules changed throughout the course of the
election. Again, I apologize for this and I can say with certainty
that this won’t happen again.

P.S. For your reference: The NABS constitution (not yet amended) is 
attached.

On 7/12/09, T. Joseph Carter <carter.tjoseph at gmail.com> wrote:
> David,
>
> I did not.  If I had, I'd be in the same position as the incoming
> board right now—if they speak on the issue, it looks like they're
> trying to quiet dissent.  An outsider is the only one who can do it
> under the circumstances.
>
> If anyone ought to be crying foul about the election, it probably
> ought to be me, for multiple reasons.  And yet that's exactly why I
> need to be the first to say that it's time to move on.  We have a new
> board, and they cannot be faulted.
>
> The only responsibility the incoming board has is to do better.
>
> Joseph
>
>
> On Sat, Jul 11, 2009 at 02:10:04PM -0500, David Dunphy wrote:
>> Did you win any board positions Joseph?
>>
>> *****
>> If you're tired of hearing the same old songs on your local radio
>> station, and if you can't find the variety you've always wanted, then
>> check out the station that I own and operate with a great group of
>> broadcasters called Radio360. You'll hear all types of music and
>> programming, plus you're able to control what you hear through requests,
>> interaction with the djs, and more!
>> To find out more about the station, visit us on the web at
>> http://www.radio360.us
>> Follow us on twitter at
>> http://www.twitter.com/radio360usa
>> or add us to your MySpace at
>> http://www.myspace.com/radio360usa
>> Come check us out, you won't be disappointed!!!
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com
>


-- 
Arielle Silverman
President, National Association of Blind Students
Phone:  602-502-2255
Email:
nabs.president at gmail.com
Website:
www.nabslink.org



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessicac.kostiw%40gmail.com
> 



From nabs.president at gmail.com  Sun Jul 12 16:45:41 2009
From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman)
Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 02:45:41 +1000
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <00f701ca0302$49acf4d0$9b4ea962@Jessica>
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com>
	<20090711183617.GF39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
	<1432A6F9C7BD43A18ECECA1C8F178155@thedjdinvasion>
	<20090712001023.GH39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
	<85ff10070907111928xcce0313od29a9372471b3eee@mail.gmail.com>
	<00f701ca0302$49acf4d0$9b4ea962@Jessica>
Message-ID: <85ff10070907120945l3b3c8ba1h30040c441889bceb@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Joseph and all,

I am aware that many of the vote counts reported were multiples of 10.
>From my position at the podium, it appears to me that any counting
discrepancies can be attributed to a lack of training of the vote
counters, a problem that can be easily avoided in the future by
carefully selecting and training the  counters beforehand. However, to
be fair, this is the first I've heard about the reported counts
differing from those observed by other students in the room. Had a
discrepancy in a particular race been reported to us, we would have
entertained a recount.

Keep in mind also that some people choose to vote in some races but
not others, leading to different counts. This is a situation we've
seen in the past. In fact, in my recollection when we did standing
votes, the number of people voting differed significantly from one
race to the next.

I do acknowledge that even the suspicion of inaccurate counting is a
serious problem, and one we need to correct in the future with proper
training of the vote counters, and perhaps a paper trail or some other
method of verification. Joseph, if you  or others have suggestions for
solutions by all means present them to the board. We will consider all
suggestions and implement those that we deem best. We will also
consult with NFB national leaders and past NABS presidents before
making any decisions on this matter.

Anyone  who feels angered or upset by the election process, please
feel free to share your concerns with me or another member of the NABS
board. You also have the right as a member of this organization to
speak with someone at the national office. Again, I ask that you
couple your concerns with concrete suggestions for change or at least
specific  examples of what you found  offensive, as Joseph  has done.

I think we can say that we in NABS all have a common goal to make the
organization as strong as possible. Let's keep that overarching goal
in mind when we discuss this issue.

Arielle


On 7/13/09, Jessica Kostiw <jessicac.kostiw at gmail.com> wrote:
> Congratulations Arielle and to the rest of the board,
> I know most of you personally and I am excited to see what the next year
> holds!
>
> I was not able to make convention this year, but have read the posts
> concerning issues of the election.  Arielle, I think you have addressed the
> concerns more then adequately.  This is certainly not the first time that
> NABS elections have been contested, and it will not be the last.
>
> Again, sincere congratulations to all!!  You earned it!!
> Jessica Kostiw
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Arielle Silverman" <nabs.president at gmail.com>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 9:28 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
>
>
> Dear Joseph and all:
>
> I am aware that some of  our members were disappointed in the way
> that elections and the passing of a constitutional amendment were
> handled at the NABS business meeting. While in the end all procedures
> were followed according to proper NABS protocol, there was some
> confusion initially among those running the election about how to
> handle these issues. I’d like to apologize personally for this and as
> NABS president I will make every effort to ensure that future
> elections are followed according to proper procedure. The good thing
> about making mistakes is that once they are made and recognized, care
> can be taken to keep them from happening again.
>
> It’s important to keep two things in mind when contemplating the
> elections. The first is that this is not the first time these issues
> have come up in NABS. For years we have been debating about how to
> count votes. This is the first time we required voters to display a
> card proving paid member status when voting. In the past we used
> standing votes and trusted that all voters were paid members. This
> policy led to its own set of complaints and chaos which is why we
> switched to the vote cards. Using the vote cards was an experiment,
> and if the members feel it was a mistake, we won’t do it again.
> Similarly, we have frequently had long elections with several people
> running for each position. There has been much debate about whether or
> not NABS should appoint a nominating committee. That is still an open
> question, and one I’d like the membership to think about before we
> make a decision. So, these are tricky issues with no easy answers and
> ones we’ve been struggling with for years.
>
> The second point I’d like to make is that our constitution is very
> vague. It doesn’t tell us how to count votes. It only specifies that a
> candidate needs a majority of the votes to win, and that if no
> candidate gets a majority, the one with the least votes is dropped.
> So, again, a lot of this is open to debate and there is no one way to
> fix it.
>
> Before our next election I’d like to have a couple of focus groups
> with NABS members about the best and fairest way to handle
> vote-counting, etc. For those of you who were feeling disappointed,
> I’d ask you to cease “grumbiling” and instead come to me with clear
> suggestions for improvement. What specifically did you find
> problematic? If you were the one running things how would you have
> done it differently? We can’t take everyone’s suggestions, of course,
> but we need concrete feedback in order to make changes. Though I can’t
> speak for anyone else, as NABS president I would never want to “quiet
> dissent”. Those of you who knew me in the early days of my NFB
> involvement know that I frequently asked questions and expressed
> opinions contrary to the so-called NFB party line. I do, however, ask
> that complaints and suggestions be voiced respectfully and that they
> be specific to what you thought was wrong or unfair. Just saying “it
> was chaos” doesn’t help us figure out how to make things better in the
> future. If you were disappointed, I also hope that you can still work
> with us and move forward. Elections only happen once a year, but the
> mentoring and collective action that happens in NABS happens all year
> long.
>
> Finally, I will say this: Whatever procedure we decide to use for
> conducting the election and counting votes, when I run the next NABS
> election I’ll be sure to spell out the procedures ahead of time before
> we start the election, and I will also make sure the vote counters
> have been chosen and instructed prior to the election. I suspect a lot
> of the trouble came from the fact that people didn’t know what to
> expect and that some of the rules changed throughout the course of the
> election. Again, I apologize for this and I can say with certainty
> that this won’t happen again.
>
> P.S. For your reference: The NABS constitution (not yet amended) is
> attached.
>
> On 7/12/09, T. Joseph Carter <carter.tjoseph at gmail.com> wrote:
>> David,
>>
>> I did not.  If I had, I'd be in the same position as the incoming
>> board right now—if they speak on the issue, it looks like they're
>> trying to quiet dissent.  An outsider is the only one who can do it
>> under the circumstances.
>>
>> If anyone ought to be crying foul about the election, it probably
>> ought to be me, for multiple reasons.  And yet that's exactly why I
>> need to be the first to say that it's time to move on.  We have a new
>> board, and they cannot be faulted.
>>
>> The only responsibility the incoming board has is to do better.
>>
>> Joseph
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Jul 11, 2009 at 02:10:04PM -0500, David Dunphy wrote:
>>> Did you win any board positions Joseph?
>>>
>>> *****
>>> If you're tired of hearing the same old songs on your local radio
>>> station, and if you can't find the variety you've always wanted, then
>>> check out the station that I own and operate with a great group of
>>> broadcasters called Radio360. You'll hear all types of music and
>>> programming, plus you're able to control what you hear through requests,
>>> interaction with the djs, and more!
>>> To find out more about the station, visit us on the web at
>>> http://www.radio360.us
>>> Follow us on twitter at
>>> http://www.twitter.com/radio360usa
>>> or add us to your MySpace at
>>> http://www.myspace.com/radio360usa
>>> Come check us out, you won't be disappointed!!!
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com
>>
>
>
> --
> Arielle Silverman
> President, National Association of Blind Students
> Phone:  602-502-2255
> Email:
> nabs.president at gmail.com
> Website:
> www.nabslink.org
>
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessicac.kostiw%40gmail.com
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com
>


-- 
Arielle Silverman
President, National Association of Blind Students
Phone:  602-502-2255
Email:
nabs.president at gmail.com
Website:
www.nabslink.org


From tmm326 at gmail.com  Sun Jul 12 19:31:57 2009
From: tmm326 at gmail.com (Tiffany Audrey Medina)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 12:31:57 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] EndNote
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com><20090711183617.GF39692@yumi.bluecherry.net><1432A6F9C7BD43A18ECECA1C8F178155@thedjdinvasion><20090712001023.GH39692@yumi.bluecherry.net><85ff10070907111928xcce0313od29a9372471b3eee@mail.gmail.com><00f701ca0302$49acf4d0$9b4ea962@Jessica>
	<85ff10070907120945l3b3c8ba1h30040c441889bceb@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A8AA27B0AF146C2B0BC48B347C3BFCC@DC4V3PD1>

Hi All,

I hope everyone had fun at the convention.  I am writing to ask if anyone 
has tried using EndNote Software with JAWS?  I plan to check out the online 
versions, but I know there's also software to purchase as well.  I'd be 
curious to hear about people's experiences.

Thanks very much,

Tiffany/Audrey

T. Audrey Medina, M.S.
Executive Board, AccessABILITY Student Union (aability at uoregon.edu)
Summer Intern, Mobility International USA
Doctoral Student, Counseling Psychology
University of Oregon
medina at uoregon.edu 



From jmassay1 at cox.net  Sun Jul 12 20:11:35 2009
From: jmassay1 at cox.net (JMassay)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 15:11:35 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Behavior of Membership
Message-ID: <0ACE90B480AD4F58AB7CC5EB78BB312F@MERLIN>

Arielle and all,

 

While others contest and are apparently upset by the election process, I am
appalled and very disappointed by the rude and unruly behavior exhibited by
many of my fellow students during the election and while our speakers were
presenting.  For me, a way to put it in to perspective was to parallel our
election to that of the National board election for the NFB. Anyone who was
at general session during the elections would have been embarrassed should
anyone on the national board or within the membership have acted the way
that our student division did the previous Saturday at convention.
Elections aren't, and never should be popularity contests. I, for one, feel
that a nominating committee is the way to go. Each state student division
could have representation without those states with many in attendance
overwhelming a voice vote. Other nominations could be made from the floor
but I think there need to be guidelines for doing so. While everyone indeed
does have a right to their voice among the membership, divisiveness,
contention and bad feelings are no way for any organization to accomplish
anything. In the end, our accomplishments and the work we do together as an
organization will measure our ability to change what it means to be blind. 

 

Respectfully,

 

Jeannie 


From monika_r_r at hotmail.com  Sun Jul 12 20:50:31 2009
From: monika_r_r at hotmail.com (Monika Reinholz)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 14:50:31 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <85ff10070907120945l3b3c8ba1h30040c441889bceb@mail.gmail.com>
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com>
	<20090711183617.GF39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
	<1432A6F9C7BD43A18ECECA1C8F178155@thedjdinvasion>
	<20090712001023.GH39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
	<85ff10070907111928xcce0313od29a9372471b3eee@mail.gmail.com>
	<00f701ca0302$49acf4d0$9b4ea962@Jessica> 
	<85ff10070907120945l3b3c8ba1h30040c441889bceb@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <COL111-W48498830B24A7E9B39965EC0250@phx.gbl>


Hi all,

If I may pipe in here with a possible suggestion for future elections. Why not do a vote the way our US Congress does it...in a way. At the beginning of the meeting, have a list of all people at said meeting. Use the list to do a voice vote, one by one. It may be tedious and long (depending on the amount of people) but it gets the job done and correctly. If a voice vote isnt desired, you could use the head nod for yes/head shake for no version.

Also, it may be going out on a limb, but maybe the eventual use of a voting system like the clickers that go to a computer program to obtain the vote info. The UCCS Student Government has used such system for a while now and I still have contact there that I could look into it for you all.


I wish I would have been able to make national convention, but hoping that maybe next year I will be able to go.

Just my 2 pennies,
Monika Reinholz


 
> Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 02:45:41 +1000
> From: nabs.president at gmail.com
> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
> 
> Hi Joseph and all,
> 
> I am aware that many of the vote counts reported were multiples of 10.
> >From my position at the podium, it appears to me that any counting
> discrepancies can be attributed to a lack of training of the vote
> counters, a problem that can be easily avoided in the future by
> carefully selecting and training the counters beforehand. However, to
> be fair, this is the first I've heard about the reported counts
> differing from those observed by other students in the room. Had a
> discrepancy in a particular race been reported to us, we would have
> entertained a recount.
> 
> Keep in mind also that some people choose to vote in some races but
> not others, leading to different counts. This is a situation we've
> seen in the past. In fact, in my recollection when we did standing
> votes, the number of people voting differed significantly from one
> race to the next.
> 
> I do acknowledge that even the suspicion of inaccurate counting is a
> serious problem, and one we need to correct in the future with proper
> training of the vote counters, and perhaps a paper trail or some other
> method of verification. Joseph, if you or others have suggestions for
> solutions by all means present them to the board. We will consider all
> suggestions and implement those that we deem best. We will also
> consult with NFB national leaders and past NABS presidents before
> making any decisions on this matter.
> 
> Anyone who feels angered or upset by the election process, please
> feel free to share your concerns with me or another member of the NABS
> board. You also have the right as a member of this organization to
> speak with someone at the national office. Again, I ask that you
> couple your concerns with concrete suggestions for change or at least
> specific examples of what you found offensive, as Joseph has done.
> 
> I think we can say that we in NABS all have a common goal to make the
> organization as strong as possible. Let's keep that overarching goal
> in mind when we discuss this issue.
> 
> Arielle
> 
> 
> On 7/13/09, Jessica Kostiw <jessicac.kostiw at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Congratulations Arielle and to the rest of the board,
> > I know most of you personally and I am excited to see what the next year
> > holds!
> >
> > I was not able to make convention this year, but have read the posts
> > concerning issues of the election. Arielle, I think you have addressed the
> > concerns more then adequately. This is certainly not the first time that
> > NABS elections have been contested, and it will not be the last.
> >
> > Again, sincere congratulations to all!! You earned it!!
> > Jessica Kostiw
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Arielle Silverman" <nabs.president at gmail.com>
> > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
> > <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> > Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 9:28 PM
> > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
> >
> >
> > Dear Joseph and all:
> >
> > I am aware that some of our members were disappointed in the way
> > that elections and the passing of a constitutional amendment were
> > handled at the NABS business meeting. While in the end all procedures
> > were followed according to proper NABS protocol, there was some
> > confusion initially among those running the election about how to
> > handle these issues. I’d like to apologize personally for this and as
> > NABS president I will make every effort to ensure that future
> > elections are followed according to proper procedure. The good thing
> > about making mistakes is that once they are made and recognized, care
> > can be taken to keep them from happening again.
> >
> > It’s important to keep two things in mind when contemplating the
> > elections. The first is that this is not the first time these issues
> > have come up in NABS. For years we have been debating about how to
> > count votes. This is the first time we required voters to display a
> > card proving paid member status when voting. In the past we used
> > standing votes and trusted that all voters were paid members. This
> > policy led to its own set of complaints and chaos which is why we
> > switched to the vote cards. Using the vote cards was an experiment,
> > and if the members feel it was a mistake, we won’t do it again.
> > Similarly, we have frequently had long elections with several people
> > running for each position. There has been much debate about whether or
> > not NABS should appoint a nominating committee. That is still an open
> > question, and one I’d like the membership to think about before we
> > make a decision. So, these are tricky issues with no easy answers and
> > ones we’ve been struggling with for years.
> >
> > The second point I’d like to make is that our constitution is very
> > vague. It doesn’t tell us how to count votes. It only specifies that a
> > candidate needs a majority of the votes to win, and that if no
> > candidate gets a majority, the one with the least votes is dropped.
> > So, again, a lot of this is open to debate and there is no one way to
> > fix it.
> >
> > Before our next election I’d like to have a couple of focus groups
> > with NABS members about the best and fairest way to handle
> > vote-counting, etc. For those of you who were feeling disappointed,
> > I’d ask you to cease “grumbiling” and instead come to me with clear
> > suggestions for improvement. What specifically did you find
> > problematic? If you were the one running things how would you have
> > done it differently? We can’t take everyone’s suggestions, of course,
> > but we need concrete feedback in order to make changes. Though I can’t
> > speak for anyone else, as NABS president I would never want to “quiet
> > dissent”. Those of you who knew me in the early days of my NFB
> > involvement know that I frequently asked questions and expressed
> > opinions contrary to the so-called NFB party line. I do, however, ask
> > that complaints and suggestions be voiced respectfully and that they
> > be specific to what you thought was wrong or unfair. Just saying “it
> > was chaos” doesn’t help us figure out how to make things better in the
> > future. If you were disappointed, I also hope that you can still work
> > with us and move forward. Elections only happen once a year, but the
> > mentoring and collective action that happens in NABS happens all year
> > long.
> >
> > Finally, I will say this: Whatever procedure we decide to use for
> > conducting the election and counting votes, when I run the next NABS
> > election I’ll be sure to spell out the procedures ahead of time before
> > we start the election, and I will also make sure the vote counters
> > have been chosen and instructed prior to the election. I suspect a lot
> > of the trouble came from the fact that people didn’t know what to
> > expect and that some of the rules changed throughout the course of the
> > election. Again, I apologize for this and I can say with certainty
> > that this won’t happen again.
> >
> > P.S. For your reference: The NABS constitution (not yet amended) is
> > attached.
> >
> > On 7/12/09, T. Joseph Carter <carter.tjoseph at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> David,
> >>
> >> I did not. If I had, I'd be in the same position as the incoming
> >> board right now—if they speak on the issue, it looks like they're
> >> trying to quiet dissent. An outsider is the only one who can do it
> >> under the circumstances.
> >>
> >> If anyone ought to be crying foul about the election, it probably
> >> ought to be me, for multiple reasons. And yet that's exactly why I
> >> need to be the first to say that it's time to move on. We have a new
> >> board, and they cannot be faulted.
> >>
> >> The only responsibility the incoming board has is to do better.
> >>
> >> Joseph
> >>
> >>
> >> On Sat, Jul 11, 2009 at 02:10:04PM -0500, David Dunphy wrote:
> >>> Did you win any board positions Joseph?
> >>>
> >>> *****
> >>> If you're tired of hearing the same old songs on your local radio
> >>> station, and if you can't find the variety you've always wanted, then
> >>> check out the station that I own and operate with a great group of
> >>> broadcasters called Radio360. You'll hear all types of music and
> >>> programming, plus you're able to control what you hear through requests,
> >>> interaction with the djs, and more!
> >>> To find out more about the station, visit us on the web at
> >>> http://www.radio360.us
> >>> Follow us on twitter at
> >>> http://www.twitter.com/radio360usa
> >>> or add us to your MySpace at
> >>> http://www.myspace.com/radio360usa
> >>> Come check us out, you won't be disappointed!!!
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> nabs-l mailing list
> >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> >> nabs-l:
> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com
> >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > Arielle Silverman
> > President, National Association of Blind Students
> > Phone: 602-502-2255
> > Email:
> > nabs.president at gmail.com
> > Website:
> > www.nabslink.org
> >
> >
> >
> > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> nabs-l mailing list
> >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> >> nabs-l:
> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessicac.kostiw%40gmail.com
> >>
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > nabs-l mailing list
> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> > nabs-l:
> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com
> >
> 
> 
> -- 
> Arielle Silverman
> President, National Association of Blind Students
> Phone: 602-502-2255
> Email:
> nabs.president at gmail.com
> Website:
> www.nabslink.org
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/monika_r_r%40hotmail.com

From iamantonio at cox.net  Sun Jul 12 22:01:16 2009
From: iamantonio at cox.net (Antonio M. Guimaraes)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 18:01:16 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com><20090711183617.GF39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
	<A24D3BF1F427487BA7865DB3E9412B06@Nijatash>
Message-ID: <62B01264D4664A2F8564287DFCCA9B87@userf9b4fa60eb>

        Nejit,

You say in your post that those who are angry... have little grounds to feel 
this way.

While I agree that we need to move forward and stay positive, I also see no 
value in slipping the durt under the rug. Most people present had very valid 
concerns about the way the meeting and elections, mostly the elections were 
conducted.

First, when the amendment to the constitution was passed, discussion shut 
off by the president, and people not given a chance to voice their concerns, 
the entire membership should have been concerned that something was wrong. 
The meeting would have gone on till god know when and god knows how if one 
of our members, yours truly, didn't plea for reason, and bring up the 
constitution matter back to the forthfront, where it belonged.

I sought  to run for a board position, and was nominated for treasurer, so 
that I could have a voice, access to people's ears, and I saw this as the 
only way to bring up the constitution concern up for debate again. I 
withdrew my candidacy, and some discussion was had, and the amendment voted 
on again.

The meeting was full of interesting twists, one board member running for a 
board position clearly on his popularity, and a voice mail message. He 
wasn't present at the meeting, and a voice message most could not understand 
was played for the room.

People run and win because others like them, so winning on popularity is why 
people win elections. You are more popular than I am, and so forth. The 
proof of the value of sheer popularity will be in the results the NABS board 
can accomplish in the time ahead.

Do I not have the right to be at least a little angry when someone gets to a 
mic, and proceeds to tell the room that

she can sense some animocity in the room, she is an elementary school 
teacher, and we all need to take a little brake, and sit back, relax, and 
count to 3?

I do not know who pulled off that performance, but I tell you this. I did 
not see, hear, or otherwise detect the presence of a 3-year-old in the room, 
even when most could agree that many, leaders and meeting attendees acted 
like one.

I don't appreciate being likened to a child, not am I susseptible to any 
kind of hypnotic techniques.

That I don't know who said this goes to tell you that, even in a meeting 
full of blind people, some neglected to identify themselves by name whether 
or not they were recognized.

I challenge anyone who was at the meeting to tell me they would be proud if 
the thing had been streamed on the web, or recorded.

Not too angry anymore,

Sincerely yours,

Antonio Guimaraes

If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup 
trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of 
highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary 
works in Braille.

Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you.
http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169
Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Nijat Worley" <nijat1989 at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 6:05 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update


> Greetings Joseph,
>   I believe that there is little doubt about the legitimacy of the current 
> NABS board and the process by which they were elected. Those who are 
> angry, and those who want to grumble about it, and still those who want to 
> take action about it, have little ground to do so. Besides, what kind of 
> action would be appropriate at this point? The former board and Terri did 
> their best to make sure that the elections were fair. They did almost 
> every vote by a hand count at your request. I am utterly surprised that 
> you are still dissatisfied about the outcome of the elections. I 
> understand there were some mistakes made in the election process, and the 
> board has made note of them. We will take proper action to make sure that 
> those mistakes don't happen again. I do agree with you that to try to do 
> anything  that might divide the organization at this point would only 
> counter your intentions. NABS is an ever changing and evolving 
> organization simply because of the fact that many of its members both on 
> the board and off the board come and go so quickly. Nobody stays in NABS 
> forever. We are all new to this organization, and we all make mistakes. I 
> appreciate you expressing your concerns and telling folks to stay united, 
> because only united, can we make change and strengthen this organization 
> for the benefit of all. I always tell our members both at the state and 
> national level that one does not have to be on the board to help out the 
> organization and to be a leader. I think Arielle intends to get everybody 
> involved in the development and growth of NABS. I am very pleased to say 
> that I saw many of you at the Monty Carlo night helping us put it together 
> and wrap it up at the end. We couldn't have done it without you. Thanks to 
> B. J. Sexton, Caron Anderson, Willie Black, Jim, Jedi, and many others for 
> staying and helping with Monty Carlo Night. Let us put behind us any hard 
> feelings that may be in our chests and move on to bigger and better things 
> for the sake of NABS if for nothing else.
>   At your service,
>   Nijat
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "T. Joseph Carter" <carter.tjoseph at gmail.com>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 12:36 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
>
>
>> Arielle and all of NABS,
>>
>> I've heard more than a few rumblings about it already, and I am not sure 
>> the board should try to address them:  The NABS election was a complete 
>> and total fiasco lacking even the appearance of integrity.  A number of 
>> people are really unhappy about it, and some are talking about taking 
>> action.
>>
>> I feel a need to say, "Don't do it, please."  I know some of you to be 
>> good students and good advocates both fro this organization and for the 
>> blind in general.  If those of you I don't know are of the same caliber, 
>> then you may turn fiasco into tragedy.  Think about the possible outcomes 
>> first.
>>
>> Either you will find widespread support, or you will not.  If the latter, 
>> you face marginalization and feelings of disenfranchisement greater than 
>> you already feel.  That will drive you away from the organization for 
>> certain.  Perhaps I am being a bit selfish here, but NABS and the NFB 
>> need _you_, and I'd rather not have you fall away over something as 
>> transitory as a single problematic election.
>>
>> If you do garner widespread support, the tragedy will be larger still: 
>> The organization would faction into those who support the incoming board 
>> and those who oppose the process that elected them, with a lot of people 
>> who want to do both feeling caught in the middle.  There's no faster way 
>> to ensure more controversial elections than to go down this road.
>>
>> So .. what do you do?  I made my decision before the election was even 
>> over: I'm going to support the incoming board, and I'm going to encourage 
>> (read: make a pain in the rear end of myself) the board to act boldly and 
>> with integrity on behalf of blind students.
>>
>> I also intend to similarly encourage (read the same way) that only 
>> registered members vote, and that each registrant gets one vote.  I can't 
>> claim to have a simple and brilliant solution here yet because I can't 
>> figure out how to handle runoff elections quickly and cleanly yet.  The 
>> curious know my email address.  *smile*
>>
>> Joseph
>>
>> P.S. I considered suggesting the Condorcet method, but I decided not to 
>> propose anything that required calculating a square root to figure out 
>> who wins the election.
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nijat1989%40gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net 



From djdrocks4ever at gmail.com  Sun Jul 12 22:14:01 2009
From: djdrocks4ever at gmail.com (David Dunphy)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 17:14:01 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Hear Tracks From The New Daughtry Album At A Special Time
	On Tonight's Djd Invasion
Message-ID: <1C537BE2BBFE4FA29C92F90525B591F4@thedjdinvasion>

Hi All!
The Djd Invasion will be airing tonight at 8 PM eastern instead of the usual 7 PM eastern. This is just for this evening.
Tonight's Djd Invasion show will feature
A nice blend of old and new pop country and maybe some rock
Jon Matte as a guest host
And, we'll be reviewing the brand new Daughtry album "Leave This Town" for those curious about what it sounds like
And as always, your comments/calls/requests are welcome by email, msn messenger, or aol instant messenger at the address
live at radio360.us
or when we're on the mic, we can be reached by skkype at
radio360usa
or by phone at
516-717-4425
So to listen to The Djd Invasion at its special time, save this email, and at 8 PM eastern, go to
http://www.radio360.us/players/playerselection.html
to be connected to the program. I hope to see you all there!
Best regards,
David Dunphy, station manager of Radio360 and host of The Djd Invasion
http://www.radio360.us

From nabs.president at gmail.com  Sun Jul 12 22:42:42 2009
From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman)
Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 08:42:42 +1000
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <62B01264D4664A2F8564287DFCCA9B87@userf9b4fa60eb>
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com>
	<20090711183617.GF39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
	<A24D3BF1F427487BA7865DB3E9412B06@Nijatash>
	<62B01264D4664A2F8564287DFCCA9B87@userf9b4fa60eb>
Message-ID: <85ff10070907121542m5a72e643rf9fea95ea3545849@mail.gmail.com>

Dear Antonio and all,

The woman of whom you speak was Angela Wolf, who served as president
of NABS from 2001-2005. She spoke up after alerting Terri and I that
we had made an error in not entertaining discussion of the amendment.
The fact that we did not do so is one of the mistakes I spoke of
earlier, and one that will not be repeated in future business
meetings.

I think we have made clear at this point that the NABS leadership, and
the process by which we are elected, is not perfect. We need  you to
keep us  on our toes, as you have done. We can't undo mistakes that we
have made in the past; we can, however, learn from them. We can and
should also use this energy to do what we can to strengthen the other
parts of this organization.

Respectfully,
Arielle Silverman
President, National Association of Blind Students



On 7/13/09, Antonio M. Guimaraes <iamantonio at cox.net> wrote:
>         Nejit,
>
> You say in your post that those who are angry... have little grounds to feel
> this way.
>
> While I agree that we need to move forward and stay positive, I also see no
> value in slipping the durt under the rug. Most people present had very valid
> concerns about the way the meeting and elections, mostly the elections were
> conducted.
>
> First, when the amendment to the constitution was passed, discussion shut
> off by the president, and people not given a chance to voice their concerns,
> the entire membership should have been concerned that something was wrong.
> The meeting would have gone on till god know when and god knows how if one
> of our members, yours truly, didn't plea for reason, and bring up the
> constitution matter back to the forthfront, where it belonged.
>
> I sought  to run for a board position, and was nominated for treasurer, so
> that I could have a voice, access to people's ears, and I saw this as the
> only way to bring up the constitution concern up for debate again. I
> withdrew my candidacy, and some discussion was had, and the amendment voted
> on again.
>
> The meeting was full of interesting twists, one board member running for a
> board position clearly on his popularity, and a voice mail message. He
> wasn't present at the meeting, and a voice message most could not understand
> was played for the room.
>
> People run and win because others like them, so winning on popularity is why
> people win elections. You are more popular than I am, and so forth. The
> proof of the value of sheer popularity will be in the results the NABS board
> can accomplish in the time ahead.
>
> Do I not have the right to be at least a little angry when someone gets to a
> mic, and proceeds to tell the room that
>
> she can sense some animocity in the room, she is an elementary school
> teacher, and we all need to take a little brake, and sit back, relax, and
> count to 3?
>
> I do not know who pulled off that performance, but I tell you this. I did
> not see, hear, or otherwise detect the presence of a 3-year-old in the room,
> even when most could agree that many, leaders and meeting attendees acted
> like one.
>
> I don't appreciate being likened to a child, not am I susseptible to any
> kind of hypnotic techniques.
>
> That I don't know who said this goes to tell you that, even in a meeting
> full of blind people, some neglected to identify themselves by name whether
> or not they were recognized.
>
> I challenge anyone who was at the meeting to tell me they would be proud if
> the thing had been streamed on the web, or recorded.
>
> Not too angry anymore,
>
> Sincerely yours,
>
> Antonio Guimaraes
>
> If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup
> trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of
> highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary
> works in Braille.
>
> Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you.
> http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169
> Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Nijat Worley" <nijat1989 at gmail.com>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 6:05 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
>
>
>> Greetings Joseph,
>>   I believe that there is little doubt about the legitimacy of the current
>>
>> NABS board and the process by which they were elected. Those who are
>> angry, and those who want to grumble about it, and still those who want to
>>
>> take action about it, have little ground to do so. Besides, what kind of
>> action would be appropriate at this point? The former board and Terri did
>> their best to make sure that the elections were fair. They did almost
>> every vote by a hand count at your request. I am utterly surprised that
>> you are still dissatisfied about the outcome of the elections. I
>> understand there were some mistakes made in the election process, and the
>> board has made note of them. We will take proper action to make sure that
>> those mistakes don't happen again. I do agree with you that to try to do
>> anything  that might divide the organization at this point would only
>> counter your intentions. NABS is an ever changing and evolving
>> organization simply because of the fact that many of its members both on
>> the board and off the board come and go so quickly. Nobody stays in NABS
>> forever. We are all new to this organization, and we all make mistakes. I
>> appreciate you expressing your concerns and telling folks to stay united,
>> because only united, can we make change and strengthen this organization
>> for the benefit of all. I always tell our members both at the state and
>> national level that one does not have to be on the board to help out the
>> organization and to be a leader. I think Arielle intends to get everybody
>> involved in the development and growth of NABS. I am very pleased to say
>> that I saw many of you at the Monty Carlo night helping us put it together
>>
>> and wrap it up at the end. We couldn't have done it without you. Thanks to
>>
>> B. J. Sexton, Caron Anderson, Willie Black, Jim, Jedi, and many others for
>>
>> staying and helping with Monty Carlo Night. Let us put behind us any hard
>> feelings that may be in our chests and move on to bigger and better things
>>
>> for the sake of NABS if for nothing else.
>>   At your service,
>>   Nijat
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "T. Joseph Carter" <carter.tjoseph at gmail.com>
>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 12:36 PM
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
>>
>>
>>> Arielle and all of NABS,
>>>
>>> I've heard more than a few rumblings about it already, and I am not sure
>>> the board should try to address them:  The NABS election was a complete
>>> and total fiasco lacking even the appearance of integrity.  A number of
>>> people are really unhappy about it, and some are talking about taking
>>> action.
>>>
>>> I feel a need to say, "Don't do it, please."  I know some of you to be
>>> good students and good advocates both fro this organization and for the
>>> blind in general.  If those of you I don't know are of the same caliber,
>>> then you may turn fiasco into tragedy.  Think about the possible outcomes
>>>
>>> first.
>>>
>>> Either you will find widespread support, or you will not.  If the latter,
>>>
>>> you face marginalization and feelings of disenfranchisement greater than
>>> you already feel.  That will drive you away from the organization for
>>> certain.  Perhaps I am being a bit selfish here, but NABS and the NFB
>>> need _you_, and I'd rather not have you fall away over something as
>>> transitory as a single problematic election.
>>>
>>> If you do garner widespread support, the tragedy will be larger still:
>>> The organization would faction into those who support the incoming board
>>> and those who oppose the process that elected them, with a lot of people
>>> who want to do both feeling caught in the middle.  There's no faster way
>>> to ensure more controversial elections than to go down this road.
>>>
>>> So .. what do you do?  I made my decision before the election was even
>>> over: I'm going to support the incoming board, and I'm going to encourage
>>>
>>> (read: make a pain in the rear end of myself) the board to act boldly and
>>>
>>> with integrity on behalf of blind students.
>>>
>>> I also intend to similarly encourage (read the same way) that only
>>> registered members vote, and that each registrant gets one vote.  I can't
>>>
>>> claim to have a simple and brilliant solution here yet because I can't
>>> figure out how to handle runoff elections quickly and cleanly yet.  The
>>> curious know my email address.  *smile*
>>>
>>> Joseph
>>>
>>> P.S. I considered suggesting the Condorcet method, but I decided not to
>>> propose anything that required calculating a square root to figure out
>>> who wins the election.
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nijat1989%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com
>


-- 
Arielle Silverman
President, National Association of Blind Students
Phone:  602-502-2255
Email:
nabs.president at gmail.com
Website:
www.nabslink.org


From jsorozco at gmail.com  Sun Jul 12 22:49:24 2009
From: jsorozco at gmail.com (Joe Orozco)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 18:49:24 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Thank You Peter
Message-ID: <947C96F4184B443AA0BE919FE1434EB4@Rufus>

Hello all,

I just want to thank Peter Donahue for recording the student meeting and all
the other meetings he covered during convention.  He's real generous to
volunteer his time, and such service should not go unappreciated.  By the
sound of it, no pun intended, it seems as though those of us not at the
meeting will have a lot to look forward to.

Regards,

Joe Orozco

"A man who wants to lead the orchestra must turn his back on the
crowd."--Max Lucado
 

__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
database 4237 (20090712) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com
 



From bookwormahb at earthlink.net  Sun Jul 12 23:36:50 2009
From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley  Bramlett)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 19:36:50 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Behavior of Membership
References: <0ACE90B480AD4F58AB7CC5EB78BB312F@MERLIN>
Message-ID: <A7CE9A7F783A42359126D6319AF6506F@Ashley>

Jeanie,

Were you running in the election?  What was your role if any?
I was not at convention so this is news to me.  Its unfortunate that 
students were rude not only in the election but while speakers were 
presenting.  What happened?
Were they speaking and having side conversations?

One thing that bothers me about NFB conventions is the behavior of the 
members.  So this isn't just a nabs thing.  Audience members have side 
conversations while speakers present.  Cell phones go off and this disrupts 
the presentation.  In discussions sometimes people have been cut off by each 
other.  I don't know what the rude and unruly behavior was you refer to. 
Let's just hope though that they learn from their mistakes and behave in a 
more curteous way next time.  Any one can walk into the meeting and it 
should present a positive image of us acting respectfully and carrying out 
things in an age appropriate manner.

Ashley 



From carter.tjoseph at gmail.com  Sun Jul 12 23:49:54 2009
From: carter.tjoseph at gmail.com (T. Joseph Carter)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 16:49:54 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Behavior of Membership
In-Reply-To: <0ACE90B480AD4F58AB7CC5EB78BB312F@MERLIN>
References: <0ACE90B480AD4F58AB7CC5EB78BB312F@MERLIN>
Message-ID: <20090712234954.GN39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>

Jeannie,

Jedi has been trying to convince me of this.  I'm not sold on the 
idea, because I think it sounds like election-stacking, even if with 
the most qualified people the committee can find.

Popularity contests are unfortunate, but they're the nature of 
popular election, the hallmark of democracy.

The issue I had was one of vote fidelity:  One person, one vote.  
Unregistered people should not get a vote, and registered people 
should have only one.  The notion that we elect people by seeing 
which group can scream the loudest ... is ludicrous.

We were told this is the only right way to run an election among the 
blind (untrue) and that the NABS constitution requires it (also 
untrue).  Add rude and embarrassing behavior in with that and a clear 
intent to halt discussion and you've got something that could never 
be considered "clear".

I also don't think it was wise to evoke the polarity response of a 
group of people who have grown up responding to "You can't" with 
"Just watch me!" by telling them that they have little recourse or 
appeal.  That kind of attitude can only make things really bad, 
really quickly.  To offer that in response to someone trying to calm 
the flames a bit was inconceivable.  I can't fathom the motivation 
behind it, honestly.

Joseph


On Sun, Jul 12, 2009 at 03:11:35PM -0500, JMassay wrote:
>Arielle and all,
>
> 
>
>While others contest and are apparently upset by the election process, I am
>appalled and very disappointed by the rude and unruly behavior exhibited by
>many of my fellow students during the election and while our speakers were
>presenting.  For me, a way to put it in to perspective was to parallel our
>election to that of the National board election for the NFB. Anyone who was
>at general session during the elections would have been embarrassed should
>anyone on the national board or within the membership have acted the way
>that our student division did the previous Saturday at convention.
>Elections aren't, and never should be popularity contests. I, for one, feel
>that a nominating committee is the way to go. Each state student division
>could have representation without those states with many in attendance
>overwhelming a voice vote. Other nominations could be made from the floor
>but I think there need to be guidelines for doing so. While everyone indeed
>does have a right to their voice among the membership, divisiveness,
>contention and bad feelings are no way for any organization to accomplish
>anything. In the end, our accomplishments and the work we do together as an
>organization will measure our ability to change what it means to be blind. 
>
> 
>
>Respectfully,
>
> 
>
>Jeannie 


From djdrocks4ever at gmail.com  Sun Jul 12 23:55:41 2009
From: djdrocks4ever at gmail.com (David Dunphy)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 18:55:41 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Thank You Peter
References: <947C96F4184B443AA0BE919FE1434EB4@Rufus>
Message-ID: <42C3EC15A8A84C95823EAEC774FE7B4D@thedjdinvasion>

Is there any way to hear the meeting or to listen to the recording of it?

*****
If you're tired of hearing the same old songs on your local radio station, 
and if you can't find the variety you've always wanted, then check out the 
station that I own and operate with a great group of broadcasters called 
Radio360. You'll hear all types of music and programming, plus you're able 
to control what you hear through requests, interaction with the djs, and 
more!
To find out more about the station, visit us on the web at
http://www.radio360.us
Follow us on twitter at
http://www.twitter.com/radio360usa
or add us to your MySpace at
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Come check us out, you won't be disappointed!!! 



From loneblindjedi at samobile.net  Mon Jul 13 00:30:43 2009
From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 20:30:43 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
Message-ID: <20090713003043.31412.21991@web3.serotek.com>

Joseph and all:

I was present at the election and even made a go for an office or two. 
In my opinion, the election did have integrity simply because those 
running it tried to make it as fair as they knew how. Elections are 
tough especially if you've never run one before. I rmember trying to 
arrange Washington State's constitution. Arielle was there. Arielle 
well remembers how chaotic that was and how unhappy some folks were. 
Hell, some members even got upset because they said the presence of Dr. 
maurer swayed the vote over whether or not we should vote members into 
our organization or just let them in once they've paid their dues. In 
fact, didn't we have to redo that one twice just to make everyone 
happy? I remember that day and how stressed everyone was. This last 
election at the national level reminds me of that chaos.

I guess the reality is that there will always be those who wished the 
election happened in their favor. Take, for example, all those who 
grumbled when Barack Obama won this last year's U.S. presidency. And 
don't forget the fiasco over Bush vs. Gore in 2001. In other words, our 
craziness last Saturday isn't unique to NABS, the NFB, or to blind 
guys. It's just what happens sometimes. But as Arielle said, there are 
ways we can curb the craziness a bit. I have also given some thought to 
how we might smooth the process for future NABS participants and their 
officers. And like you, joseph, i'm trying to work it out in my own 
mind. Having focus groups is a great idea, and I hope to be informed as 
to when they occur.

Respectfully,
Jedi
Original message:
> Nijat,

> One look at the vote counts—so conveniently all multiples of
> ten—calls their accuracy into question.  That students in the room
> report different counts isn't surprising, until you note that their
> reports indicate higher counts for losers than were reported to us in
> a few races, including your runoff, actually.

> Personally, I decided not to participate after that point.  We don't
> have 100% agreement on the counts, but there's enough discrepancy
> often enough to call the whole thing into question.  I'm not saying I
> won any of those elections, but I am saying I'm not quite sure in a
> few cases who should have.  I am honestly not sure how many people
> were getting involved trying to do something about it, but there was
> more than three or four.

> There are only two things I am sure of: First, no good is likely to
> come of any effort that group might make.  Second, a member of the
> board telling us not to worry our pretty little heads ... just isn't
> going to make things better.  Both sound disastrous to me.

> This isn't about who did or did not win an election.  It's about the
> membership of this organization believing a real election actually
> took place.  If even a significant minority doubt that, then it is
> bad for NABS, even if you assume every one of them will age-out of
> NABS in a few years.  We reflect the NFB as a whole, and we should
> reflect it well.

> I serve the organization, not the board.  I will yet see two boards
> serve while I remain a student.  It is in the organization's interest
> to make sure what we saw last Saturday does not happen again.  I have
> a solution, but it's not a complete solution yet.  It does result in
> a paper trail, or at least a box full of index cards.  Still working
> out how to handle runoff elections.

> Joseph


> On Sat, Jul 11, 2009 at 04:05:04PM -0600, Nijat Worley wrote:
>> Greetings Joseph,
>>   I believe that there is little doubt about the legitimacy of the
>> current NABS board and the process by which they were elected. Those who
>> are angry, and those who want to grumble about it, and still those who
>> want to take action about it, have little ground to do so. Besides, what
>> kind of action would be appropriate at this point? The former board and
>> Terri did their best to make sure that the elections were fair. They did
>> almost every vote by a hand count at your request. I am utterly surprised
>> that you are still dissatisfied about the outcome of the elections. I
>> understand there were some mistakes made in the election process, and the
>> board has made note of them. We will take proper action to make sure that
>> those mistakes don't happen again. I do agree with you that to try to do
>> anything  that might divide the organization at this point would only
>> counter your intentions. NABS is an ever changing and evolving
>> organization simply because of the fact that many of its members both on
>> the board and off the board come and go so quickly. Nobody stays in NABS
>> forever. We are all new to this organization, and we all make mistakes. I
>> appreciate you expressing your concerns and telling folks to stay united,
>> because only united, can we make change and strengthen this organization
>> for the benefit of all. I always tell our members both at the state and
>> national level that one does not have to be on the board to help out the
>> organization and to be a leader. I think Arielle intends to get everybody
>> involved in the development and growth of NABS. I am very pleased to say
>> that I saw many of you at the Monty Carlo night helping us put it
>> together and wrap it up at the end. We couldn't have done it without you.
>> Thanks to B. J. Sexton, Caron Anderson, Willie Black, Jim, Jedi, and many
>> others for staying and helping with Monty Carlo Night. Let us put behind
>> us any hard feelings that may be in our chests and move on to bigger and
>> better things for the sake of NABS if for nothing else.
>>   At your service,
>>   Nijat

> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net

-- 
Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.  Visit 
www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.

From loneblindjedi at samobile.net  Mon Jul 13 00:53:25 2009
From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 20:53:25 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
Message-ID: <20090713005325.31412.38914@web3.serotek.com>

Well Antonio, if it makes you feel better, I began to think of the 
whole thing as a big fat joke toward the end.. in fact, it got to the 
point where some of the elected losers and I laughed about how pathetic 
our own speeches were and how easily we were voted out by the crowd. 
Yes, it was chaos, but some of me thought it was kind of funny toward 
the end. And yes, it did begin to feel like a popularity contest after 
a while, especially once we started to fill in numbered board 
positions. But you know what? If those elected can help us make our 
division stronger, then who cares why they were elected (popularity or 
otherwise)? Their own demonstration of competence will tell us if we 
chose the right people in the end. And I hate to tell you this, but the 
meeting was recorded for all generations to hear. Oh well. If we learn 
something from it, that's what matters. As for me, I'm with Arielle in 
that we should use this experience as a learning and growing experience 
both as a division and as individual NFB members. You're probably right 
that Dr. Maurer and all them would have been slightly mortified at our 
performance, but he (and they) would also recognize that they've been 
there before and would understand that NABS is a training ground for 
future success.

Respectfully Submitted


Original message:
>         Nejit,

> You say in your post that those who are angry... have little grounds to feel
> this way.

> While I agree that we need to move forward and stay positive, I also see no
> value in slipping the durt under the rug. Most people present had very valid
> concerns about the way the meeting and elections, mostly the elections were
> conducted.

> First, when the amendment to the constitution was passed, discussion shut
> off by the president, and people not given a chance to voice their concerns,
> the entire membership should have been concerned that something was wrong.
> The meeting would have gone on till god know when and god knows how if one
> of our members, yours truly, didn't plea for reason, and bring up the
> constitution matter back to the forthfront, where it belonged.

> I sought  to run for a board position, and was nominated for treasurer, so
> that I could have a voice, access to people's ears, and I saw this as the
> only way to bring up the constitution concern up for debate again. I
> withdrew my candidacy, and some discussion was had, and the amendment voted
> on again.

> The meeting was full of interesting twists, one board member running for a
> board position clearly on his popularity, and a voice mail message. He
> wasn't present at the meeting, and a voice message most could not understand
> was played for the room.

> People run and win because others like them, so winning on popularity is why
> people win elections. You are more popular than I am, and so forth. The
> proof of the value of sheer popularity will be in the results the NABS board
> can accomplish in the time ahead.

> Do I not have the right to be at least a little angry when someone gets to a
> mic, and proceeds to tell the room that

> she can sense some animocity in the room, she is an elementary school
> teacher, and we all need to take a little brake, and sit back, relax, and
> count to 3?

> I do not know who pulled off that performance, but I tell you this. I did
> not see, hear, or otherwise detect the presence of a 3-year-old in the room,
> even when most could agree that many, leaders and meeting attendees acted
> like one.

> I don't appreciate being likened to a child, not am I susseptible to any
> kind of hypnotic techniques.

> That I don't know who said this goes to tell you that, even in a meeting
> full of blind people, some neglected to identify themselves by name whether
> or not they were recognized.

> I challenge anyone who was at the meeting to tell me they would be proud if
> the thing had been streamed on the web, or recorded.

> Not too angry anymore,

> Sincerely yours,

> Antonio Guimaraes

> If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup
> trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of
> highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary
> works in Braille.

> Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you.
> http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169
> Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Nijat Worley" <nijat1989 at gmail.com>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 6:05 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update


>> Greetings Joseph,
>>   I believe that there is little doubt about the legitimacy of the current
>> NABS board and the process by which they were elected. Those who are
>> angry, and those who want to grumble about it, and still those who want to
>> take action about it, have little ground to do so. Besides, what kind of
>> action would be appropriate at this point? The former board and Terri did
>> their best to make sure that the elections were fair. They did almost
>> every vote by a hand count at your request. I am utterly surprised that
>> you are still dissatisfied about the outcome of the elections. I
>> understand there were some mistakes made in the election process, and the
>> board has made note of them. We will take proper action to make sure that
>> those mistakes don't happen again. I do agree with you that to try to do
>> anything  that might divide the organization at this point would only
>> counter your intentions. NABS is an ever changing and evolving
>> organization simply because of the fact that many of its members both on
>> the board and off the board come and go so quickly. Nobody stays in NABS
>> forever. We are all new to this organization, and we all make mistakes. I
>> appreciate you expressing your concerns and telling folks to stay united,
>> because only united, can we make change and strengthen this organization
>> for the benefit of all. I always tell our members both at the state and
>> national level that one does not have to be on the board to help out the
>> organization and to be a leader. I think Arielle intends to get everybody
>> involved in the development and growth of NABS. I am very pleased to say
>> that I saw many of you at the Monty Carlo night helping us put it together
>> and wrap it up at the end. We couldn't have done it without you. Thanks to
>> B. J. Sexton, Caron Anderson, Willie Black, Jim, Jedi, and many others for
>> staying and helping with Monty Carlo Night. Let us put behind us any hard
>> feelings that may be in our chests and move on to bigger and better things
>> for the sake of NABS if for nothing else.
>>   At your service,
>>   Nijat

>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "T. Joseph Carter" <carter.tjoseph at gmail.com>
>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 12:36 PM
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update


>>> Arielle and all of NABS,

>>> I've heard more than a few rumblings about it already, and I am not sure
>>> the board should try to address them:  The NABS election was a complete
>>> and total fiasco lacking even the appearance of integrity.  A number of
>>> people are really unhappy about it, and some are talking about taking
>>> action.

>>> I feel a need to say, "Don't do it, please."  I know some of you to be
>>> good students and good advocates both fro this organization and for the
>>> blind in general.  If those of you I don't know are of the same caliber,
>>> then you may turn fiasco into tragedy.  Think about the possible outcomes
>>> first.

>>> Either you will find widespread support, or you will not.  If the latter,
>>> you face marginalization and feelings of disenfranchisement greater than
>>> you already feel.  That will drive you away from the organization for
>>> certain.  Perhaps I am being a bit selfish here, but NABS and the NFB
>>> need _you_, and I'd rather not have you fall away over something as
>>> transitory as a single problematic election.

>>> If you do garner widespread support, the tragedy will be larger still:
>>> The organization would faction into those who support the incoming board
>>> and those who oppose the process that elected them, with a lot of people
>>> who want to do both feeling caught in the middle.  There's no faster way
>>> to ensure more controversial elections than to go down this road.

>>> So .. what do you do?  I made my decision before the election was even
>>> over: I'm going to support the incoming board, and I'm going to encourage
>>> (read: make a pain in the rear end of myself) the board to act boldly and
>>> with integrity on behalf of blind students.

>>> I also intend to similarly encourage (read the same way) that only
>>> registered members vote, and that each registrant gets one vote.  I can't
>>> claim to have a simple and brilliant solution here yet because I can't
>>> figure out how to handle runoff elections quickly and cleanly yet.  The
>>> curious know my email address.  *smile*

>>> Joseph

>>> P.S. I considered suggesting the Condorcet method, but I decided not to
>>> propose anything that required calculating a square root to figure out
>>> who wins the election.


>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nijat1989%40gmail.com


>> _______________________________________________
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>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
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From nabs.president at gmail.com  Mon Jul 13 00:54:32 2009
From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman)
Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 10:54:32 +1000
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <20090713003043.31412.21991@web3.serotek.com>
References: <20090713003043.31412.21991@web3.serotek.com>
Message-ID: <85ff10070907121754j25721495mf7c1f550e21e8b4e@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Joseph and all,

	While this was explained at the meeting, I’ll reiterate for those who
weren’t at convention. The voice vote, in which people say “I” if they
support a particular candidate, is used only as a preliminary voting
method. The voice vote determines the election outcome only when one
candidate receives an overwhelming majority of the vote. If the voice
vote sounds at all inconclusive, the election leader will call for a
hand count and the candidate receiving more than half of the votes
wins. Even if the election leader believes the voice vote is
conclusive, a candidate who disagrees can always call for a hand
count. We have these protections in place to prevent races from being
decided by “which group screams the loudest”. Any candidate who
garners a significant amount of support will receive enough “I’s” to
render a hand count necessary, and again, the candidate always has the
right to ask for a hand count regardless of what the election leader
decides. In fact, last weekend, almost every contest was ultimately
decided by a hand count, even though we started off with a voice vote.

	You are right that the NABS constitution says nothing about voice
voting. I need to find out if there is a national policy that
overrides our constitution, making voice voting necessary. There are
definite advantages and disadvantages to starting off with a voice
vote before preceding to a hand count.

Arielle Silverman
President, National Association of Blind Students


On 7/13/09, Jedi <loneblindjedi at samobile.net> wrote:
> Joseph and all:
>
> I was present at the election and even made a go for an office or two.
> In my opinion, the election did have integrity simply because those
> running it tried to make it as fair as they knew how. Elections are
> tough especially if you've never run one before. I rmember trying to
> arrange Washington State's constitution. Arielle was there. Arielle
> well remembers how chaotic that was and how unhappy some folks were.
> Hell, some members even got upset because they said the presence of Dr.
> maurer swayed the vote over whether or not we should vote members into
> our organization or just let them in once they've paid their dues. In
> fact, didn't we have to redo that one twice just to make everyone
> happy? I remember that day and how stressed everyone was. This last
> election at the national level reminds me of that chaos.
>
> I guess the reality is that there will always be those who wished the
> election happened in their favor. Take, for example, all those who
> grumbled when Barack Obama won this last year's U.S. presidency. And
> don't forget the fiasco over Bush vs. Gore in 2001. In other words, our
> craziness last Saturday isn't unique to NABS, the NFB, or to blind
> guys. It's just what happens sometimes. But as Arielle said, there are
> ways we can curb the craziness a bit. I have also given some thought to
> how we might smooth the process for future NABS participants and their
> officers. And like you, joseph, i'm trying to work it out in my own
> mind. Having focus groups is a great idea, and I hope to be informed as
> to when they occur.
>
> Respectfully,
> Jedi
> Original message:
>> Nijat,
>
>> One look at the vote counts—so conveniently all multiples of
>> ten—calls their accuracy into question.  That students in the room
>> report different counts isn't surprising, until you note that their
>> reports indicate higher counts for losers than were reported to us in
>> a few races, including your runoff, actually.
>
>> Personally, I decided not to participate after that point.  We don't
>> have 100% agreement on the counts, but there's enough discrepancy
>> often enough to call the whole thing into question.  I'm not saying I
>> won any of those elections, but I am saying I'm not quite sure in a
>> few cases who should have.  I am honestly not sure how many people
>> were getting involved trying to do something about it, but there was
>> more than three or four.
>
>> There are only two things I am sure of: First, no good is likely to
>> come of any effort that group might make.  Second, a member of the
>> board telling us not to worry our pretty little heads ... just isn't
>> going to make things better.  Both sound disastrous to me.
>
>> This isn't about who did or did not win an election.  It's about the
>> membership of this organization believing a real election actually
>> took place.  If even a significant minority doubt that, then it is
>> bad for NABS, even if you assume every one of them will age-out of
>> NABS in a few years.  We reflect the NFB as a whole, and we should
>> reflect it well.
>
>> I serve the organization, not the board.  I will yet see two boards
>> serve while I remain a student.  It is in the organization's interest
>> to make sure what we saw last Saturday does not happen again.  I have
>> a solution, but it's not a complete solution yet.  It does result in
>> a paper trail, or at least a box full of index cards.  Still working
>> out how to handle runoff elections.
>
>> Joseph
>
>
>> On Sat, Jul 11, 2009 at 04:05:04PM -0600, Nijat Worley wrote:
>>> Greetings Joseph,
>>>   I believe that there is little doubt about the legitimacy of the
>>> current NABS board and the process by which they were elected. Those who
>>> are angry, and those who want to grumble about it, and still those who
>>> want to take action about it, have little ground to do so. Besides, what
>>> kind of action would be appropriate at this point? The former board and
>>> Terri did their best to make sure that the elections were fair. They did
>>> almost every vote by a hand count at your request. I am utterly surprised
>>> that you are still dissatisfied about the outcome of the elections. I
>>> understand there were some mistakes made in the election process, and the
>>> board has made note of them. We will take proper action to make sure that
>>> those mistakes don't happen again. I do agree with you that to try to do
>>> anything  that might divide the organization at this point would only
>>> counter your intentions. NABS is an ever changing and evolving
>>> organization simply because of the fact that many of its members both on
>>> the board and off the board come and go so quickly. Nobody stays in NABS
>>> forever. We are all new to this organization, and we all make mistakes. I
>>> appreciate you expressing your concerns and telling folks to stay united,
>>> because only united, can we make change and strengthen this organization
>>> for the benefit of all. I always tell our members both at the state and
>>> national level that one does not have to be on the board to help out the
>>> organization and to be a leader. I think Arielle intends to get everybody
>>> involved in the development and growth of NABS. I am very pleased to say
>>> that I saw many of you at the Monty Carlo night helping us put it
>>> together and wrap it up at the end. We couldn't have done it without you.
>>> Thanks to B. J. Sexton, Caron Anderson, Willie Black, Jim, Jedi, and many
>>> others for staying and helping with Monty Carlo Night. Let us put behind
>>> us any hard feelings that may be in our chests and move on to bigger and
>>> better things for the sake of NABS if for nothing else.
>>>   At your service,
>>>   Nijat
>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net
>
> --
> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.  Visit
> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
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>


-- 
Arielle Silverman
President, National Association of Blind Students
Phone:  602-502-2255
Email:
nabs.president at gmail.com
Website:
www.nabslink.org


From loneblindjedi at samobile.net  Mon Jul 13 00:54:57 2009
From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 20:54:57 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Thank You Peter
Message-ID: <20090713005457.1608.8482@web3.serotek.com>

Three Cheers for Peter!

Respectfully Submitted


Original message:
> Hello all,

> I just want to thank Peter Donahue for recording the student meeting and all
> the other meetings he covered during convention.  He's real generous to
> volunteer his time, and such service should not go unappreciated.  By the
> sound of it, no pun intended, it seems as though those of us not at the
> meeting will have a lot to look forward to.

> Regards,

> Joe Orozco

> "A man who wants to lead the orchestra must turn his back on the
> crowd."--Max Lucado


> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
> database 4237 (20090712) __________

> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

> http://www.eset.com



> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
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From blackbyrdfly at gmail.com  Mon Jul 13 01:04:57 2009
From: blackbyrdfly at gmail.com (Jamie Principato)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 21:04:57 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Behavior of Membership
In-Reply-To: <A7CE9A7F783A42359126D6319AF6506F@Ashley>
References: <0ACE90B480AD4F58AB7CC5EB78BB312F@MERLIN>
	<A7CE9A7F783A42359126D6319AF6506F@Ashley>
Message-ID: <63af025c0907121804l269aeea0g65d60d819ab5543e@mail.gmail.com>

Would anyone mind poking me off-list and filling me in on what happened? I
couldn't make it to convention this year due to a move that took longer than
expected and a severe lack of funds, and I don't have all o the messages
that appeared about it.
Thanks,

Jamie

On Sun, Jul 12, 2009 at 7:36 PM, Ashley Bramlett
<bookwormahb at earthlink.net>wrote:

> Jeanie,
>
> Were you running in the election?  What was your role if any?
> I was not at convention so this is news to me.  Its unfortunate that
> students were rude not only in the election but while speakers were
> presenting.  What happened?
> Were they speaking and having side conversations?
>
> One thing that bothers me about NFB conventions is the behavior of the
> members.  So this isn't just a nabs thing.  Audience members have side
> conversations while speakers present.  Cell phones go off and this disrupts
> the presentation.  In discussions sometimes people have been cut off by each
> other.  I don't know what the rude and unruly behavior was you refer to.
> Let's just hope though that they learn from their mistakes and behave in a
> more curteous way next time.  Any one can walk into the meeting and it
> should present a positive image of us acting respectfully and carrying out
> things in an age appropriate manner.
>
> Ashley
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com
>

From loneblindjedi at samobile.net  Mon Jul 13 01:21:09 2009
From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 21:21:09 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
Message-ID: <20090713012109.2732.51348@web3.serotek.com>

Listers:

As far as vote counting goes, I'd really like to see a method that can 
be run completely by blind people since we're a blindness organization. 
In most cases, voice voting works well enough provided that the 
membership is mature enough to use it correctly. I'd be willing to use 
a balloting system if it can be handled efficiently.

Respectfully,
Jedi


Original message:
> Hi Joseph and all,

>         While this was explained at the meeting, I’ll reiterate for those who
> weren’t at convention. The voice vote, in which people say “I” if they
> support a particular candidate, is used only as a preliminary voting
> method. The voice vote determines the election outcome only when one
> candidate receives an overwhelming majority of the vote. If the voice
> vote sounds at all inconclusive, the election leader will call for a
> hand count and the candidate receiving more than half of the votes
> wins. Even if the election leader believes the voice vote is
> conclusive, a candidate who disagrees can always call for a hand
> count. We have these protections in place to prevent races from being
> decided by “which group screams the loudest”. Any candidate who
> garners a significant amount of support will receive enough “I’s” to
> render a hand count necessary, and again, the candidate always has the
> right to ask for a hand count regardless of what the election leader
> decides. In fact, last weekend, almost every contest was ultimately
> decided by a hand count, even though we started off with a voice vote.

>         You are right that the NABS constitution says nothing about voice
> voting. I need to find out if there is a national policy that
> overrides our constitution, making voice voting necessary. There are
> definite advantages and disadvantages to starting off with a voice
> vote before preceding to a hand count.

> Arielle Silverman
> President, National Association of Blind Students


> On 7/13/09, Jedi <loneblindjedi at samobile.net> wrote:
>> Joseph and all:

>> I was present at the election and even made a go for an office or two.
>> In my opinion, the election did have integrity simply because those
>> running it tried to make it as fair as they knew how. Elections are
>> tough especially if you've never run one before. I rmember trying to
>> arrange Washington State's constitution. Arielle was there. Arielle
>> well remembers how chaotic that was and how unhappy some folks were.
>> Hell, some members even got upset because they said the presence of Dr.
>> maurer swayed the vote over whether or not we should vote members into
>> our organization or just let them in once they've paid their dues. In
>> fact, didn't we have to redo that one twice just to make everyone
>> happy? I remember that day and how stressed everyone was. This last
>> election at the national level reminds me of that chaos.

>> I guess the reality is that there will always be those who wished the
>> election happened in their favor. Take, for example, all those who
>> grumbled when Barack Obama won this last year's U.S. presidency. And
>> don't forget the fiasco over Bush vs. Gore in 2001. In other words, our
>> craziness last Saturday isn't unique to NABS, the NFB, or to blind
>> guys. It's just what happens sometimes. But as Arielle said, there are
>> ways we can curb the craziness a bit. I have also given some thought to
>> how we might smooth the process for future NABS participants and their
>> officers. And like you, joseph, i'm trying to work it out in my own
>> mind. Having focus groups is a great idea, and I hope to be informed as
>> to when they occur.

>> Respectfully,
>> Jedi
>> Original message:
>>> Nijat,

>>> One look at the vote counts—so conveniently all multiples of
>>> ten—calls their accuracy into question.  That students in the room
>>> report different counts isn't surprising, until you note that their
>>> reports indicate higher counts for losers than were reported to us in
>>> a few races, including your runoff, actually.

>>> Personally, I decided not to participate after that point.  We don't
>>> have 100% agreement on the counts, but there's enough discrepancy
>>> often enough to call the whole thing into question.  I'm not saying I
>>> won any of those elections, but I am saying I'm not quite sure in a
>>> few cases who should have.  I am honestly not sure how many people
>>> were getting involved trying to do something about it, but there was
>>> more than three or four.

>>> There are only two things I am sure of: First, no good is likely to
>>> come of any effort that group might make.  Second, a member of the
>>> board telling us not to worry our pretty little heads ... just isn't
>>> going to make things better.  Both sound disastrous to me.

>>> This isn't about who did or did not win an election.  It's about the
>>> membership of this organization believing a real election actually
>>> took place.  If even a significant minority doubt that, then it is
>>> bad for NABS, even if you assume every one of them will age-out of
>>> NABS in a few years.  We reflect the NFB as a whole, and we should
>>> reflect it well.

>>> I serve the organization, not the board.  I will yet see two boards
>>> serve while I remain a student.  It is in the organization's interest
>>> to make sure what we saw last Saturday does not happen again.  I have
>>> a solution, but it's not a complete solution yet.  It does result in
>>> a paper trail, or at least a box full of index cards.  Still working
>>> out how to handle runoff elections.

>>> Joseph


>>> On Sat, Jul 11, 2009 at 04:05:04PM -0600, Nijat Worley wrote:
>>>> Greetings Joseph,
>>>>   I believe that there is little doubt about the legitimacy of the
>>>> current NABS board and the process by which they were elected. Those who
>>>> are angry, and those who want to grumble about it, and still those who
>>>> want to take action about it, have little ground to do so. Besides, what
>>>> kind of action would be appropriate at this point? The former board and
>>>> Terri did their best to make sure that the elections were fair. They did
>>>> almost every vote by a hand count at your request. I am utterly surprised
>>>> that you are still dissatisfied about the outcome of the elections. I
>>>> understand there were some mistakes made in the election process, and the
>>>> board has made note of them. We will take proper action to make sure that
>>>> those mistakes don't happen again. I do agree with you that to try to do
>>>> anything  that might divide the organization at this point would only
>>>> counter your intentions. NABS is an ever changing and evolving
>>>> organization simply because of the fact that many of its members both on
>>>> the board and off the board come and go so quickly. Nobody stays in NABS
>>>> forever. We are all new to this organization, and we all make mistakes. I
>>>> appreciate you expressing your concerns and telling folks to stay united,
>>>> because only united, can we make change and strengthen this organization
>>>> for the benefit of all. I always tell our members both at the state and
>>>> national level that one does not have to be on the board to help out the
>>>> organization and to be a leader. I think Arielle intends to get everybody
>>>> involved in the development and growth of NABS. I am very pleased to say
>>>> that I saw many of you at the Monty Carlo night helping us put it
>>>> together and wrap it up at the end. We couldn't have done it without you.
>>>> Thanks to B. J. Sexton, Caron Anderson, Willie Black, Jim, Jedi, and many
>>>> others for staying and helping with Monty Carlo Night. Let us put behind
>>>> us any hard feelings that may be in our chests and move on to bigger and
>>>> better things for the sake of NABS if for nothing else.
>>>>   At your service,
>>>>   Nijat

>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net

>> --
>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.  Visit
>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.
>> _______________________________________________
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>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
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>> nabs-l:
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> --
> Arielle Silverman
> President, National Association of Blind Students
> Phone:  602-502-2255
> Email:
> nabs.president at gmail.com
> Website:
> www.nabslink.org

> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net

-- 
Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.  Visit 
www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.

From brileyp at gmail.com  Mon Jul 13 02:19:37 2009
From: brileyp at gmail.com (Briley Pollard)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 21:19:37 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Behavior of Membership
In-Reply-To: <63af025c0907121804l269aeea0g65d60d819ab5543e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <0ACE90B480AD4F58AB7CC5EB78BB312F@MERLIN>
	<A7CE9A7F783A42359126D6319AF6506F@Ashley>
	<63af025c0907121804l269aeea0g65d60d819ab5543e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <12790a9a0907121919l788da3dan399e538d37053b28@mail.gmail.com>

Hello all,

While I do not disagree with the idea of a nominating committee, lets
all remember that the institution of one would not decrease the
popularity aspect of the elections. Elections by their very nature are
popularity contests, and while perhaps the fear of "stacking the
board" is legitimate on some levels, the behavior of many people last
weekend did not speak highly of the divisions ability to hold fully
democratic elections. New students atend these business meetings every
year, and I know for a fact that many are driven away by the chaos
that surrounds the elections.

As for the behavior  of the students during the other presentations, I
was likewise embarrassed. It is a business meeting, and the presenters
deserved respect that they were not given the majority of the time.


I would like to note, however, that the meeting did not get off to a
very good start. The process for entry was chaotic, to put it mildly,
and did not set a good tone for the meeting. It was very disorganized,
and there was no reason it should have been so. Busy perhaps, but
nothing like that.

On a positive note, the program was interesting, and hearing from past
presidents was very motivating.

-Briley

On Sun, Jul 12, 2009 at 8:04 PM, Jamie Principato<blackbyrdfly at gmail.com> wrote:
> Would anyone mind poking me off-list and filling me in on what happened? I
> couldn't make it to convention this year due to a move that took longer than
> expected and a severe lack of funds, and I don't have all o the messages
> that appeared about it.
> Thanks,
>
> Jamie
>
> On Sun, Jul 12, 2009 at 7:36 PM, Ashley Bramlett
> <bookwormahb at earthlink.net>wrote:
>
>> Jeanie,
>>
>> Were you running in the election?  What was your role if any?
>> I was not at convention so this is news to me.  Its unfortunate that
>> students were rude not only in the election but while speakers were
>> presenting.  What happened?
>> Were they speaking and having side conversations?
>>
>> One thing that bothers me about NFB conventions is the behavior of the
>> members.  So this isn't just a nabs thing.  Audience members have side
>> conversations while speakers present.  Cell phones go off and this disrupts
>> the presentation.  In discussions sometimes people have been cut off by each
>> other.  I don't know what the rude and unruly behavior was you refer to.
>> Let's just hope though that they learn from their mistakes and behave in a
>> more curteous way next time.  Any one can walk into the meeting and it
>> should present a positive image of us acting respectfully and carrying out
>> things in an age appropriate manner.
>>
>> Ashley
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com
>>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com
>


From graduate56 at juno.com  Mon Jul 13 02:30:52 2009
From: graduate56 at juno.com (Melissa Green)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 20:30:52 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7F89239488FF48BFBC4808FBE171FEEB@melissa>

Congratulations to all of the board.
As Mr. Freeman stated in his remarks when elected to the national board of
directors. "There are no losers in this election.
IMHPO, the same goes for NABS.
Many times we can lead without a title.

Melissa Green
Limitations live only in our minds. But if we use our imaginations, our
possibilities become limitless
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Arielle Silverman" <nabs.president at gmail.com>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 10, 2009 6:11 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update


Hello NABS members:

Last weekend the National Association of Blind Students held our
annual business meeting in conjunction with the NFB convention in
Detroit. At this year’s business meeting we heard from several of our
former presidents and they taught us a lot about the history and
legacy of our organization and about how we can continue that legacy.
We also got some updated information from RFB, BookShare and about
recent developments regarding the Kindle DX issue. Finally, we
conducted elections and I was elected to serve as the next president
of NABS. I am deeply honored to continue serving this organization and
to join the ranks of those who have come before me, and I would like
to thank all of you for your support  and for your assistance with
making the business meeting and Monte Carlo Night fund-raiser run as
smoothly as possible.

Several others joined our NABS board for the first time. The complete
list of officers and board members is:
President: Arielle Silverman
First Vice-President: Karen Anderson
Second Vice-President: Sean Whalen
Secretary: Janice Jeang
Treasurer: Nijat Worley
Board Member 1: Isaiah Wilcox
Board Member 2: Meghan Whalen
Board Member 3: Domonique Lawless
Board Member 4: Darian Smith
Congratulations to all who were elected. Additionally, we had several
other NABS members who sought election to the board, and consequently
ended up with more interested persons than we could include on the
board. I see this as a good sign that we have a substantial group of
students who care about NABS and helping us to achieve our goals. If
you ran for a board position but were not elected or even if you
didn’t run for a board position but still want to make a contribution
to NABS, there is plenty of work to go around. Stay tuned for an
announcement in the next week or two about NABS committees and  how to
join them. I would also like to set up some telephone focus groups in
the next few months to get your feedback on how we can improve
specific aspects of NABS such as the Student Slate, Website,
convention activities, state division outreach and election policies.
If you want  your voice to be heard, stay tuned  for more details
about these conference calls.

Also, from now on please direct all NABS inquiries to
Nabs.president at gmail.com
The official email address shown on our Website,
president at nabslink.org
also works, but email from both addresses will go to the same place. I
will check this organizational email address daily, and I or another
NABS board member will reply to your query within three days of
receiving it. You can also call me with any questions or  concerns at
602-502-2255
And again, someone will return all phone messages within three days.

I will be sending out a president’s bulletin to the NABS listserv and
the state division lists during the first week of each month. This
bulletin will contain updates about NABS activities as well as other
announcements of interest such as information about state and regional
student division events and news from the NFB Jernigan Institute, RFB,
BookShare, etc. If you  have an announcement that  you would like to
appear in the next president’s bulletin, please send it to me before
the first of the month at noon.

Finally, if you are currently president of a state student division,
please email me off-list with your state, phone number, email address
and whether or not you’re subscribed to  the NABS-Presidents listserv.
I want to be sure the Website and my master state contact list is
updated and that everyone gets on the Presidents list who should be on
it. If you are in a state that doesn’t have a student division yet and
you want to serve as the student contact for your state, also send me
this information.

I’m looking forward to an exciting and productive two years with NABS,
and hope all  of you will join me in making NABS as strong as it can
be!


-- 
Arielle Silverman
President, National Association of Blind Students
Phone:  602-502-2255
Email:
nabs.president at gmail.com
Website:
www.nabslink.org

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/graduate56%40juno.com

____________________________________________________________
Click for an affordable Health Insurance plan that fits your needs.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/BLSrjpTIn7IPnObgesVMGPzxamEejcyeHQmokV9Pcp1kQDRZRDPHFjnOiMw/


From nabs.president at gmail.com  Mon Jul 13 03:54:01 2009
From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman)
Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:54:01 +1000
Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: [Mabs] Fw: [Blindtlk] Fw: REFERENCE POINTS:
	Opportunities for Youth
In-Reply-To: <D4BBB935403A47E698655B82764E8931@umh.edu>
References: <D4BBB935403A47E698655B82764E8931@umh.edu>
Message-ID: <85ff10070907122054w763c9cddg7a1e5ddf4ac19779@mail.gmail.com>

For info about the Fulbright scholarship program:


---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Gary Wunder <gwunder at earthlink.net>
Date: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 17:14:44 -0500
Subject: [Mabs] Fw: [Blindtlk] Fw: REFERENCE POINTS: Opportunities for Youth
To: mabs <mabs at nfbnet.org>

> FYI
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <referencepoints at pacer.org>
> To: <tatra at pacer.org>
> Sent: Friday, July 10, 2009 8:23 AM
> Subject: REFERENCE POINTS: Opportunities for Youth
>
>
>> REFERENCE POINTS is an activity of TATRA, a project of PACER Center
>>
>>
>> REFERENCE POINTS:  Opportunities for Youth
>>
>> INTERNATIONAL FULBRIGHT OPPORTUNITIES
>> The National Clearinghouse on Disability and Exchange and the Fulbright
>> Program, sponsored by the U.S. Department of State, strongly encourages
>> more people with disabilities to apply for Fulbright scholarships for
>> study, research, or teaching abroad.  The Fulbright program promotes
>> communication and respect between the people of the United States and
>> other countries around the world through mutual understanding.   The
>> Fulbright Program selects participants based on their academic merit and
>> leadership potential, and will provide disability-related accommodations
>> as needed. Annual application deadlines occur late summer to early fall
>> for travel the following year. For more information on Fulbright Programs
>> and the application process, visit: http://fulbright.state.gov/.
>>
>> ADOBE YOUTH VOICES/WHAT KIDS CAN DO: INTERNATIONAL PHOTO COMPETITION
>> Adobe Youth Voices and What Kids Can Do invite youth around the world to
>> submit photographs based on the theme of "Crisis and Hope," expressing
>> themselves on both what is challenging and what gives hope in today's
>> difficult world. Maximum award: Winning photographs will be showcased
>> online, in a traveling exhibit, and in a book. Eligibility: all young
>> people -- anywhere in the world -- between the ages of 12 and 19. For
>> more information go to
>> http://www.whatkidscando.org/AYV_Photo_Competition/Home_.html
>> Deadline: July 31, 2009.
>>
>> YOUTH VOICES: GLOBAL ESSAY CONTEST
>> The World Youth Movement for Democracy has launched its 6th annual Global
>> Essay Contest! If you or someone you know is between the ages of 18 and
>> 30, why not make your voice heard. Questions include: What democratic
>> spaces exist for young people in your society? Why is youth involvement
>> in democracy important and how can it connect diverse cultures? Fifteen
>> regional winners will participate in the 6th Assembly of the World
>> Movement for Democracy in Jakarta, Indonesia. For more information go to
>> http://voize.my/contests/youth-speak-out-engaging-in-democracy-and-grasping-opportunity
>> Deadline: September 15, 2009
>>
>> CAMPAIGN FOR DISABILITY EMPLOYMENT ANNOUNCES ONLINE VIDEO CONTEST
>> Attention aspiring filmmakers!  The Campaign for Disability Employment, a
>> newly-formed collaborative of leading disability organizations, is
>> sponsoring the What Can YOU Do? online video contest to promote the
>> talent and skills that people with disabilities bring to America's
>> workforce and economy.  The contest is an opportunity for young - and
>> young-at-heart - filmmakers to promote positive change by illustrating
>> that at work, it's what people CAN do that matters. The Campaign is
>> looking for creative, fun, compelling video public service announcements,
>> of all genres, that will create positive images of people with
>> disabilities at work and help viewers re-think their assumptions about
>> people with disabilities and employment.  Contest entries must be 60
>> seconds or less and reflect one or more of the campaign's key themes.
>> The winner will receive a prize worth $1,500.  Several selected videos
>> may also be showcased on the campaign's Web site.  For more information
>> go to http://www.jan.wvu.edu/videocontest/
>> Deadline for entry:  July 15, 2009
>>
>> DO SOMETHING DISASTER GRANTS FOR YOUNG PEOPLE
>> Do Something and the Dunkin' Brands Community Foundation have teamed up
>> to offer $500 Disaster Grants to young people across the US and Canada.
>> Are you building houses down in New Orleans, planning an emergency coat
>> drive for families in crisis this winter, or collecting toys for kids
>> who've been through a natural disaster? Then they want to hear from you!
>> Each week in 2009 they are giving out $500 to an awesome person with a
>> project idea around the themes of disaster preparedness and emergency
>> response. They want to recognize YOU for what you're doing in your
>> community. For more information, visit:
>> http://www.dosomething.org/grants/disaster
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
>>
>> REFERENCE POINTS is administered by PACER Center http://www.PACER.org as
>> a technical assistance activity of the TATRA Project. The TATRA Project
>> is funded by the Rehabilitation Services Administration.
>>
>> To SUBSCRIBE to REFERENCE POINTS go to
>> http://www.pacer.org/tatra/list/index.asp
>>
>> To UNSUBSCRIBE, please go directly to
>> http://www.pacer.org/tatra/list/maildel.asp
>>
>> Readers are invited to send information about new resources on secondary
>> education, transition and vocational rehabilitation topics to
>> tatra at pacer.org.
>>
>> Reference Points received initial support from the National Center on
>> Secondary Education and Transition http://www.ncset.org/. Visit their web
>> site for a wealth of information related to secondary education and
>> transition for youth with disabilities.
>>
>> Note: There are no copyright restrictions on this document. However,
>> please credit the source and support of federal funds when copying all or
>> part of this material.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindtlk mailing list
> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindtlk:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/gwunder%40earthlink.net


_______________________________________________
Mabs mailing list
Mabs at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/mabs_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for Mabs:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/mabs_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com



-- 
Arielle Silverman
President, National Association of Blind Students
Phone:  602-502-2255
Email:
nabs.president at gmail.com
Website:
www.nabslink.org


From monika_r_r at hotmail.com  Mon Jul 13 04:40:59 2009
From: monika_r_r at hotmail.com (Monika Reinholz)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 22:40:59 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <7F89239488FF48BFBC4808FBE171FEEB@melissa>
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com>
	<7F89239488FF48BFBC4808FBE171FEEB@melissa>
Message-ID: <COL111-W10AA6CE03C915ED0C2F6D1C0220@phx.gbl>


Here here... I must second that. Thanks Melissa.
Monika

 
> From: graduate56 at juno.com
> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 20:30:52 -0600
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
> 
> Congratulations to all of the board.
> As Mr. Freeman stated in his remarks when elected to the national board of
> directors. "There are no losers in this election.
> IMHPO, the same goes for NABS.
> Many times we can lead without a title.
> 
> Melissa Green
> Limitations live only in our minds. But if we use our imaginations, our
> possibilities become limitless
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Arielle Silverman" <nabs.president at gmail.com>
> To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Friday, July 10, 2009 6:11 PM
> Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
> 
> 
> Hello NABS members:
> 
> Last weekend the National Association of Blind Students held our
> annual business meeting in conjunction with the NFB convention in
> Detroit. At this year’s business meeting we heard from several of our
> former presidents and they taught us a lot about the history and
> legacy of our organization and about how we can continue that legacy.
> We also got some updated information from RFB, BookShare and about
> recent developments regarding the Kindle DX issue. Finally, we
> conducted elections and I was elected to serve as the next president
> of NABS. I am deeply honored to continue serving this organization and
> to join the ranks of those who have come before me, and I would like
> to thank all of you for your support and for your assistance with
> making the business meeting and Monte Carlo Night fund-raiser run as
> smoothly as possible.
> 
> Several others joined our NABS board for the first time. The complete
> list of officers and board members is:
> President: Arielle Silverman
> First Vice-President: Karen Anderson
> Second Vice-President: Sean Whalen
> Secretary: Janice Jeang
> Treasurer: Nijat Worley
> Board Member 1: Isaiah Wilcox
> Board Member 2: Meghan Whalen
> Board Member 3: Domonique Lawless
> Board Member 4: Darian Smith
> Congratulations to all who were elected. Additionally, we had several
> other NABS members who sought election to the board, and consequently
> ended up with more interested persons than we could include on the
> board. I see this as a good sign that we have a substantial group of
> students who care about NABS and helping us to achieve our goals. If
> you ran for a board position but were not elected or even if you
> didn’t run for a board position but still want to make a contribution
> to NABS, there is plenty of work to go around. Stay tuned for an
> announcement in the next week or two about NABS committees and how to
> join them. I would also like to set up some telephone focus groups in
> the next few months to get your feedback on how we can improve
> specific aspects of NABS such as the Student Slate, Website,
> convention activities, state division outreach and election policies.
> If you want your voice to be heard, stay tuned for more details
> about these conference calls.
> 
> Also, from now on please direct all NABS inquiries to
> Nabs.president at gmail.com
> The official email address shown on our Website,
> president at nabslink.org
> also works, but email from both addresses will go to the same place. I
> will check this organizational email address daily, and I or another
> NABS board member will reply to your query within three days of
> receiving it. You can also call me with any questions or concerns at
> 602-502-2255
> And again, someone will return all phone messages within three days.
> 
> I will be sending out a president’s bulletin to the NABS listserv and
> the state division lists during the first week of each month. This
> bulletin will contain updates about NABS activities as well as other
> announcements of interest such as information about state and regional
> student division events and news from the NFB Jernigan Institute, RFB,
> BookShare, etc. If you have an announcement that you would like to
> appear in the next president’s bulletin, please send it to me before
> the first of the month at noon.
> 
> Finally, if you are currently president of a state student division,
> please email me off-list with your state, phone number, email address
> and whether or not you’re subscribed to the NABS-Presidents listserv.
> I want to be sure the Website and my master state contact list is
> updated and that everyone gets on the Presidents list who should be on
> it. If you are in a state that doesn’t have a student division yet and
> you want to serve as the student contact for your state, also send me
> this information.
> 
> I’m looking forward to an exciting and productive two years with NABS,
> and hope all of you will join me in making NABS as strong as it can
> be!
> 
> 
> -- 
> Arielle Silverman
> President, National Association of Blind Students
> Phone: 602-502-2255
> Email:
> nabs.president at gmail.com
> Website:
> www.nabslink.org
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/graduate56%40juno.com
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Click for an affordable Health Insurance plan that fits your needs.
> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/BLSrjpTIn7IPnObgesVMGPzxamEejcyeHQmokV9Pcp1kQDRZRDPHFjnOiMw/
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/monika_r_r%40hotmail.com

From carter.tjoseph at gmail.com  Mon Jul 13 05:23:35 2009
From: carter.tjoseph at gmail.com (T. Joseph Carter)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 22:23:35 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <85ff10070907120945l3b3c8ba1h30040c441889bceb@mail.gmail.com>
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com>
	<20090711183617.GF39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
	<1432A6F9C7BD43A18ECECA1C8F178155@thedjdinvasion>
	<20090712001023.GH39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
	<85ff10070907111928xcce0313od29a9372471b3eee@mail.gmail.com>
	<00f701ca0302$49acf4d0$9b4ea962@Jessica>
	<85ff10070907120945l3b3c8ba1h30040c441889bceb@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20090713052335.GP39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>

Arielle,

For the record, I attempted to do so and was denied the opportunity 
to speak.  On two occasions.

Joseph


On Mon, Jul 13, 2009 at 02:45:41AM +1000, Arielle Silverman wrote:
>Hi Joseph and all,
>
>I am aware that many of the vote counts reported were multiples of 10.
>>From my position at the podium, it appears to me that any counting
>discrepancies can be attributed to a lack of training of the vote
>counters, a problem that can be easily avoided in the future by
>carefully selecting and training the  counters beforehand. However, to
>be fair, this is the first I've heard about the reported counts
>differing from those observed by other students in the room. Had a
>discrepancy in a particular race been reported to us, we would have
>entertained a recount.
>
>Keep in mind also that some people choose to vote in some races but
>not others, leading to different counts. This is a situation we've
>seen in the past. In fact, in my recollection when we did standing
>votes, the number of people voting differed significantly from one
>race to the next.
>
>I do acknowledge that even the suspicion of inaccurate counting is a
>serious problem, and one we need to correct in the future with proper
>training of the vote counters, and perhaps a paper trail or some other
>method of verification. Joseph, if you  or others have suggestions for
>solutions by all means present them to the board. We will consider all
>suggestions and implement those that we deem best. We will also
>consult with NFB national leaders and past NABS presidents before
>making any decisions on this matter.
>
>Anyone  who feels angered or upset by the election process, please
>feel free to share your concerns with me or another member of the NABS
>board. You also have the right as a member of this organization to
>speak with someone at the national office. Again, I ask that you
>couple your concerns with concrete suggestions for change or at least
>specific  examples of what you found  offensive, as Joseph  has done.
>
>I think we can say that we in NABS all have a common goal to make the
>organization as strong as possible. Let's keep that overarching goal
>in mind when we discuss this issue.
>
>Arielle


From carter.tjoseph at gmail.com  Mon Jul 13 05:25:49 2009
From: carter.tjoseph at gmail.com (T. Joseph Carter)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 22:25:49 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <COL111-W48498830B24A7E9B39965EC0250@phx.gbl>
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com>
	<20090711183617.GF39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
	<1432A6F9C7BD43A18ECECA1C8F178155@thedjdinvasion>
	<20090712001023.GH39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
	<85ff10070907111928xcce0313od29a9372471b3eee@mail.gmail.com>
	<00f701ca0302$49acf4d0$9b4ea962@Jessica>
	<85ff10070907120945l3b3c8ba1h30040c441889bceb@mail.gmail.com>
	<COL111-W48498830B24A7E9B39965EC0250@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <20090713052549.GQ39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>

Monika,

The technology solution would be great if we had the funding for it.  
A lower tech solution with index cards works for initial votes, but I 
haven't got a brilliant solution for runoff elections.

Joseph


On Sun, Jul 12, 2009 at 02:50:31PM -0600, Monika Reinholz wrote:
>
>Hi all,
>
>If I may pipe in here with a possible suggestion for future elections. Why not do a vote the way our US Congress does it...in a way. At the beginning of the meeting, have a list of all people at said meeting. Use the list to do a voice vote, one by one. It may be tedious and long (depending on the amount of people) but it gets the job done and correctly. If a voice vote isnt desired, you could use the head nod for yes/head shake for no version.
>
>Also, it may be going out on a limb, but maybe the eventual use of a voting system like the clickers that go to a computer program to obtain the vote info. The UCCS Student Government has used such system for a while now and I still have contact there that I could look into it for you all.
>
>
>I wish I would have been able to make national convention, but hoping that maybe next year I will be able to go.
>
>Just my 2 pennies,
>Monika Reinholz


From carter.tjoseph at gmail.com  Mon Jul 13 05:28:34 2009
From: carter.tjoseph at gmail.com (T. Joseph Carter)
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 22:28:34 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <20090713003043.31412.21991@web3.serotek.com>
References: <20090713003043.31412.21991@web3.serotek.com>
Message-ID: <20090713052834.GR39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>

Jedi,

I am more concerned with the fact that having been there, I don't 
know who won in an honest count of votes.  I know that some of those 
who have objections have candidates they wanted to see win, and for a 
couple I was that candidate.  It's not my concern though.

Joseph


On Sun, Jul 12, 2009 at 08:30:43PM -0400, Jedi wrote:
> Joseph and all:
>
> I was present at the election and even made a go for an office or two.  
> In my opinion, the election did have integrity simply because those  
> running it tried to make it as fair as they knew how. Elections are  
> tough especially if you've never run one before. I rmember trying to  
> arrange Washington State's constitution. Arielle was there. Arielle well 
> remembers how chaotic that was and how unhappy some folks were. Hell, 
> some members even got upset because they said the presence of Dr. maurer 
> swayed the vote over whether or not we should vote members into our 
> organization or just let them in once they've paid their dues. In fact, 
> didn't we have to redo that one twice just to make everyone happy? I 
> remember that day and how stressed everyone was. This last election at 
> the national level reminds me of that chaos.
>
> I guess the reality is that there will always be those who wished the  
> election happened in their favor. Take, for example, all those who  
> grumbled when Barack Obama won this last year's U.S. presidency. And  
> don't forget the fiasco over Bush vs. Gore in 2001. In other words, our  
> craziness last Saturday isn't unique to NABS, the NFB, or to blind guys. 
> It's just what happens sometimes. But as Arielle said, there are ways we 
> can curb the craziness a bit. I have also given some thought to how we 
> might smooth the process for future NABS participants and their  
> officers. And like you, joseph, i'm trying to work it out in my own  
> mind. Having focus groups is a great idea, and I hope to be informed as  
> to when they occur.
>
> Respectfully,
> Jedi


From blackbyrdfly at gmail.com  Mon Jul 13 06:06:41 2009
From: blackbyrdfly at gmail.com (Jamie Principato)
Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 02:06:41 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <20090713012109.2732.51348@web3.serotek.com>
References: <20090713012109.2732.51348@web3.serotek.com>
Message-ID: <63af025c0907122306i50b41045pb4d915a3d8b4de2@mail.gmail.com>

You could hand out print and braille ballots at the start of convention, or
at the very least as people enter the business meeting. You'll just then
need a print reader and a braille reader willing to count them.
Another reasonable option would be to bypass the more traditional methods
altogether and do it via the internet. If you do it this way, you could kill
two birds with one stone and get someone to write a system to make sure a
voter is a registered member before allowing them to vote.

On Sun, Jul 12, 2009 at 9:21 PM, Jedi <loneblindjedi at samobile.net> wrote:

> Listers:
>
> As far as vote counting goes, I'd really like to see a method that can be
> run completely by blind people since we're a blindness organization. In most
> cases, voice voting works well enough provided that the membership is mature
> enough to use it correctly. I'd be willing to use a balloting system if it
> can be handled efficiently.
>
> Respectfully,
> Jedi
>
>
> Original message:
>
>  Hi Joseph and all,
>>
>
>         While this was explained at the meeting, I’ll reiterate for those
>> who
>> weren’t at convention. The voice vote, in which people say “I” if they
>> support a particular candidate, is used only as a preliminary voting
>> method. The voice vote determines the election outcome only when one
>> candidate receives an overwhelming majority of the vote. If the voice
>> vote sounds at all inconclusive, the election leader will call for a
>> hand count and the candidate receiving more than half of the votes
>> wins. Even if the election leader believes the voice vote is
>> conclusive, a candidate who disagrees can always call for a hand
>> count. We have these protections in place to prevent races from being
>> decided by “which group screams the loudest”. Any candidate who
>> garners a significant amount of support will receive enough “I’s” to
>> render a hand count necessary, and again, the candidate always has the
>> right to ask for a hand count regardless of what the election leader
>> decides. In fact, last weekend, almost every contest was ultimately
>> decided by a hand count, even though we started off with a voice vote.
>>
>
>         You are right that the NABS constitution says nothing about voice
>> voting. I need to find out if there is a national policy that
>> overrides our constitution, making voice voting necessary. There are
>> definite advantages and disadvantages to starting off with a voice
>> vote before preceding to a hand count.
>>
>
>  Arielle Silverman
>> President, National Association of Blind Students
>>
>
>
>  On 7/13/09, Jedi <loneblindjedi at samobile.net> wrote:
>>
>>> Joseph and all:
>>>
>>
>  I was present at the election and even made a go for an office or two.
>>> In my opinion, the election did have integrity simply because those
>>> running it tried to make it as fair as they knew how. Elections are
>>> tough especially if you've never run one before. I rmember trying to
>>> arrange Washington State's constitution. Arielle was there. Arielle
>>> well remembers how chaotic that was and how unhappy some folks were.
>>> Hell, some members even got upset because they said the presence of Dr.
>>> maurer swayed the vote over whether or not we should vote members into
>>> our organization or just let them in once they've paid their dues. In
>>> fact, didn't we have to redo that one twice just to make everyone
>>> happy? I remember that day and how stressed everyone was. This last
>>> election at the national level reminds me of that chaos.
>>>
>>
>  I guess the reality is that there will always be those who wished the
>>> election happened in their favor. Take, for example, all those who
>>> grumbled when Barack Obama won this last year's U.S. presidency. And
>>> don't forget the fiasco over Bush vs. Gore in 2001. In other words, our
>>> craziness last Saturday isn't unique to NABS, the NFB, or to blind
>>> guys. It's just what happens sometimes. But as Arielle said, there are
>>> ways we can curb the craziness a bit. I have also given some thought to
>>> how we might smooth the process for future NABS participants and their
>>> officers. And like you, joseph, i'm trying to work it out in my own
>>> mind. Having focus groups is a great idea, and I hope to be informed as
>>> to when they occur.
>>>
>>
>  Respectfully,
>>> Jedi
>>> Original message:
>>>
>>>> Nijat,
>>>>
>>>
>  One look at the vote counts—so conveniently all multiples of
>>>> ten—calls their accuracy into question.  That students in the room
>>>> report different counts isn't surprising, until you note that their
>>>> reports indicate higher counts for losers than were reported to us in
>>>> a few races, including your runoff, actually.
>>>>
>>>
>  Personally, I decided not to participate after that point.  We don't
>>>> have 100% agreement on the counts, but there's enough discrepancy
>>>> often enough to call the whole thing into question.  I'm not saying I
>>>> won any of those elections, but I am saying I'm not quite sure in a
>>>> few cases who should have.  I am honestly not sure how many people
>>>> were getting involved trying to do something about it, but there was
>>>> more than three or four.
>>>>
>>>
>  There are only two things I am sure of: First, no good is likely to
>>>> come of any effort that group might make.  Second, a member of the
>>>> board telling us not to worry our pretty little heads ... just isn't
>>>> going to make things better.  Both sound disastrous to me.
>>>>
>>>
>  This isn't about who did or did not win an election.  It's about the
>>>> membership of this organization believing a real election actually
>>>> took place.  If even a significant minority doubt that, then it is
>>>> bad for NABS, even if you assume every one of them will age-out of
>>>> NABS in a few years.  We reflect the NFB as a whole, and we should
>>>> reflect it well.
>>>>
>>>
>  I serve the organization, not the board.  I will yet see two boards
>>>> serve while I remain a student.  It is in the organization's interest
>>>> to make sure what we saw last Saturday does not happen again.  I have
>>>> a solution, but it's not a complete solution yet.  It does result in
>>>> a paper trail, or at least a box full of index cards.  Still working
>>>> out how to handle runoff elections.
>>>>
>>>
>  Joseph
>>>>
>>>
>
>  On Sat, Jul 11, 2009 at 04:05:04PM -0600, Nijat Worley wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Greetings Joseph,
>>>>>  I believe that there is little doubt about the legitimacy of the
>>>>> current NABS board and the process by which they were elected. Those
>>>>> who
>>>>> are angry, and those who want to grumble about it, and still those who
>>>>> want to take action about it, have little ground to do so. Besides,
>>>>> what
>>>>> kind of action would be appropriate at this point? The former board and
>>>>> Terri did their best to make sure that the elections were fair. They
>>>>> did
>>>>> almost every vote by a hand count at your request. I am utterly
>>>>> surprised
>>>>> that you are still dissatisfied about the outcome of the elections. I
>>>>> understand there were some mistakes made in the election process, and
>>>>> the
>>>>> board has made note of them. We will take proper action to make sure
>>>>> that
>>>>> those mistakes don't happen again. I do agree with you that to try to
>>>>> do
>>>>> anything  that might divide the organization at this point would only
>>>>> counter your intentions. NABS is an ever changing and evolving
>>>>> organization simply because of the fact that many of its members both
>>>>> on
>>>>> the board and off the board come and go so quickly. Nobody stays in
>>>>> NABS
>>>>> forever. We are all new to this organization, and we all make mistakes.
>>>>> I
>>>>> appreciate you expressing your concerns and telling folks to stay
>>>>> united,
>>>>> because only united, can we make change and strengthen this
>>>>> organization
>>>>> for the benefit of all. I always tell our members both at the state and
>>>>> national level that one does not have to be on the board to help out
>>>>> the
>>>>> organization and to be a leader. I think Arielle intends to get
>>>>> everybody
>>>>> involved in the development and growth of NABS. I am very pleased to
>>>>> say
>>>>> that I saw many of you at the Monty Carlo night helping us put it
>>>>> together and wrap it up at the end. We couldn't have done it without
>>>>> you.
>>>>> Thanks to B. J. Sexton, Caron Anderson, Willie Black, Jim, Jedi, and
>>>>> many
>>>>> others for staying and helping with Monty Carlo Night. Let us put
>>>>> behind
>>>>> us any hard feelings that may be in our chests and move on to bigger
>>>>> and
>>>>> better things for the sake of NABS if for nothing else.
>>>>>  At your service,
>>>>>  Nijat
>>>>>
>>>>
>  _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net
>>>>
>>>
>  --
>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.  Visit
>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>>
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com
>>>
>>
>
>
>  --
>> Arielle Silverman
>> President, National Association of Blind Students
>> Phone:  602-502-2255
>> Email:
>> nabs.president at gmail.com
>> Website:
>> www.nabslink.org
>>
>
>  _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net
>>
>
> --
> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.  Visit
> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com
>

From blackbyrdfly at gmail.com  Mon Jul 13 06:17:17 2009
From: blackbyrdfly at gmail.com (Jamie Principato)
Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 02:17:17 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <63af025c0907122306i50b41045pb4d915a3d8b4de2@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20090713012109.2732.51348@web3.serotek.com>
	<63af025c0907122306i50b41045pb4d915a3d8b4de2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <63af025c0907122317v2aa847bo609b62565f0494bc@mail.gmail.com>

An internet-based voting system would not have to be expensive at all. If
there isn't a competent and confident enough computer science major in NABS
who would be willing to do it, one can be found for so simple a project on
websites like RentACoder.com. A system like this would kill multiple birds
with one small stone.

On Mon, Jul 13, 2009 at 2:06 AM, Jamie Principato <blackbyrdfly at gmail.com>wrote:

> You could hand out print and braille ballots at the start of convention, or
> at the very least as people enter the business meeting. You'll just then
> need a print reader and a braille reader willing to count them.
> Another reasonable option would be to bypass the more traditional methods
> altogether and do it via the internet. If you do it this way, you could kill
> two birds with one stone and get someone to write a system to make sure a
> voter is a registered member before allowing them to vote.
>
> On Sun, Jul 12, 2009 at 9:21 PM, Jedi <loneblindjedi at samobile.net> wrote:
>
>> Listers:
>>
>> As far as vote counting goes, I'd really like to see a method that can be
>> run completely by blind people since we're a blindness organization. In most
>> cases, voice voting works well enough provided that the membership is mature
>> enough to use it correctly. I'd be willing to use a balloting system if it
>> can be handled efficiently.
>>
>> Respectfully,
>> Jedi
>>
>>
>> Original message:
>>
>>  Hi Joseph and all,
>>>
>>
>>         While this was explained at the meeting, I’ll reiterate for those
>>> who
>>> weren’t at convention. The voice vote, in which people say “I” if they
>>> support a particular candidate, is used only as a preliminary voting
>>> method. The voice vote determines the election outcome only when one
>>> candidate receives an overwhelming majority of the vote. If the voice
>>> vote sounds at all inconclusive, the election leader will call for a
>>> hand count and the candidate receiving more than half of the votes
>>> wins. Even if the election leader believes the voice vote is
>>> conclusive, a candidate who disagrees can always call for a hand
>>> count. We have these protections in place to prevent races from being
>>> decided by “which group screams the loudest”. Any candidate who
>>> garners a significant amount of support will receive enough “I’s” to
>>> render a hand count necessary, and again, the candidate always has the
>>> right to ask for a hand count regardless of what the election leader
>>> decides. In fact, last weekend, almost every contest was ultimately
>>> decided by a hand count, even though we started off with a voice vote.
>>>
>>
>>         You are right that the NABS constitution says nothing about voice
>>> voting. I need to find out if there is a national policy that
>>> overrides our constitution, making voice voting necessary. There are
>>> definite advantages and disadvantages to starting off with a voice
>>> vote before preceding to a hand count.
>>>
>>
>>  Arielle Silverman
>>> President, National Association of Blind Students
>>>
>>
>>
>>  On 7/13/09, Jedi <loneblindjedi at samobile.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Joseph and all:
>>>>
>>>
>>  I was present at the election and even made a go for an office or two.
>>>> In my opinion, the election did have integrity simply because those
>>>> running it tried to make it as fair as they knew how. Elections are
>>>> tough especially if you've never run one before. I rmember trying to
>>>> arrange Washington State's constitution. Arielle was there. Arielle
>>>> well remembers how chaotic that was and how unhappy some folks were.
>>>> Hell, some members even got upset because they said the presence of Dr.
>>>> maurer swayed the vote over whether or not we should vote members into
>>>> our organization or just let them in once they've paid their dues. In
>>>> fact, didn't we have to redo that one twice just to make everyone
>>>> happy? I remember that day and how stressed everyone was. This last
>>>> election at the national level reminds me of that chaos.
>>>>
>>>
>>  I guess the reality is that there will always be those who wished the
>>>> election happened in their favor. Take, for example, all those who
>>>> grumbled when Barack Obama won this last year's U.S. presidency. And
>>>> don't forget the fiasco over Bush vs. Gore in 2001. In other words, our
>>>> craziness last Saturday isn't unique to NABS, the NFB, or to blind
>>>> guys. It's just what happens sometimes. But as Arielle said, there are
>>>> ways we can curb the craziness a bit. I have also given some thought to
>>>> how we might smooth the process for future NABS participants and their
>>>> officers. And like you, joseph, i'm trying to work it out in my own
>>>> mind. Having focus groups is a great idea, and I hope to be informed as
>>>> to when they occur.
>>>>
>>>
>>  Respectfully,
>>>> Jedi
>>>> Original message:
>>>>
>>>>> Nijat,
>>>>>
>>>>
>>  One look at the vote counts—so conveniently all multiples of
>>>>> ten—calls their accuracy into question.  That students in the room
>>>>> report different counts isn't surprising, until you note that their
>>>>> reports indicate higher counts for losers than were reported to us in
>>>>> a few races, including your runoff, actually.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>  Personally, I decided not to participate after that point.  We don't
>>>>> have 100% agreement on the counts, but there's enough discrepancy
>>>>> often enough to call the whole thing into question.  I'm not saying I
>>>>> won any of those elections, but I am saying I'm not quite sure in a
>>>>> few cases who should have.  I am honestly not sure how many people
>>>>> were getting involved trying to do something about it, but there was
>>>>> more than three or four.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>  There are only two things I am sure of: First, no good is likely to
>>>>> come of any effort that group might make.  Second, a member of the
>>>>> board telling us not to worry our pretty little heads ... just isn't
>>>>> going to make things better.  Both sound disastrous to me.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>  This isn't about who did or did not win an election.  It's about the
>>>>> membership of this organization believing a real election actually
>>>>> took place.  If even a significant minority doubt that, then it is
>>>>> bad for NABS, even if you assume every one of them will age-out of
>>>>> NABS in a few years.  We reflect the NFB as a whole, and we should
>>>>> reflect it well.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>  I serve the organization, not the board.  I will yet see two boards
>>>>> serve while I remain a student.  It is in the organization's interest
>>>>> to make sure what we saw last Saturday does not happen again.  I have
>>>>> a solution, but it's not a complete solution yet.  It does result in
>>>>> a paper trail, or at least a box full of index cards.  Still working
>>>>> out how to handle runoff elections.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>  Joseph
>>>>>
>>>>
>>
>>  On Sat, Jul 11, 2009 at 04:05:04PM -0600, Nijat Worley wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Greetings Joseph,
>>>>>>  I believe that there is little doubt about the legitimacy of the
>>>>>> current NABS board and the process by which they were elected. Those
>>>>>> who
>>>>>> are angry, and those who want to grumble about it, and still those who
>>>>>> want to take action about it, have little ground to do so. Besides,
>>>>>> what
>>>>>> kind of action would be appropriate at this point? The former board
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> Terri did their best to make sure that the elections were fair. They
>>>>>> did
>>>>>> almost every vote by a hand count at your request. I am utterly
>>>>>> surprised
>>>>>> that you are still dissatisfied about the outcome of the elections. I
>>>>>> understand there were some mistakes made in the election process, and
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> board has made note of them. We will take proper action to make sure
>>>>>> that
>>>>>> those mistakes don't happen again. I do agree with you that to try to
>>>>>> do
>>>>>> anything  that might divide the organization at this point would only
>>>>>> counter your intentions. NABS is an ever changing and evolving
>>>>>> organization simply because of the fact that many of its members both
>>>>>> on
>>>>>> the board and off the board come and go so quickly. Nobody stays in
>>>>>> NABS
>>>>>> forever. We are all new to this organization, and we all make
>>>>>> mistakes. I
>>>>>> appreciate you expressing your concerns and telling folks to stay
>>>>>> united,
>>>>>> because only united, can we make change and strengthen this
>>>>>> organization
>>>>>> for the benefit of all. I always tell our members both at the state
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> national level that one does not have to be on the board to help out
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> organization and to be a leader. I think Arielle intends to get
>>>>>> everybody
>>>>>> involved in the development and growth of NABS. I am very pleased to
>>>>>> say
>>>>>> that I saw many of you at the Monty Carlo night helping us put it
>>>>>> together and wrap it up at the end. We couldn't have done it without
>>>>>> you.
>>>>>> Thanks to B. J. Sexton, Caron Anderson, Willie Black, Jim, Jedi, and
>>>>>> many
>>>>>> others for staying and helping with Monty Carlo Night. Let us put
>>>>>> behind
>>>>>> us any hard feelings that may be in our chests and move on to bigger
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> better things for the sake of NABS if for nothing else.
>>>>>>  At your service,
>>>>>>  Nijat
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>  _______________________________________________
>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net
>>>>>
>>>>
>>  --
>>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.  Visit
>>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>  --
>>> Arielle Silverman
>>> President, National Association of Blind Students
>>> Phone:  602-502-2255
>>> Email:
>>> nabs.president at gmail.com
>>> Website:
>>> www.nabslink.org
>>>
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>>
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net
>>>
>>
>> --
>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.  Visit
>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com
>>
>
>

From iamantonio at cox.net  Mon Jul 13 08:31:51 2009
From: iamantonio at cox.net (Antonio M. Guimaraes)
Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 04:31:51 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
References: <20090713012109.2732.51348@web3.serotek.com>
Message-ID: <CD4CBEB355254DDC91282D740958A2C9@userf9b4fa60eb>

Hello,

There is no reasonable way at present to run an election completely 
independently as an organization of blind people.

As it was, people saying I to a candidate had to do so, while raising their 
vote card. So I wonder, what really counted, the voice vote I, or the raised 
vote cards?

And, what was so special about the vote cards except for whatever color it 
was? Anyone could have fassioned a card of the same color and size, and 
called it a vote card.

I would rather have an honest and dignified election than an independent, 
chaotic, and questionable one.

Votes for the national organization is done first by voice vote, then by 
state delegation. NABS does not sit by delegation, and is not organized well 
enough to call for this method.

We know there was a problem with voting, but I think the biggest problem 
this year was the willingness to, and the energy spent in shutting people 
up. Heck, if it weren't so, I wouldn't have had to run for office to sneek 
in a statement about the way things were being run.

Think about it, and please, don't let it happen again.

Antonio Guimaraes

If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup 
trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of 
highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary 
works in Braille.

Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you.
http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169
Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jedi" <loneblindjedi at samobile.net>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2009 9:21 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update


> Listers:
>
> As far as vote counting goes, I'd really like to see a method that can be 
> run completely by blind people since we're a blindness organization. In 
> most cases, voice voting works well enough provided that the membership is 
> mature enough to use it correctly. I'd be willing to use a balloting 
> system if it can be handled efficiently.
>
> Respectfully,
> Jedi
>
>
> Original message:
>> Hi Joseph and all,
>
>>         While this was explained at the meeting, I’ll reiterate for those 
>> who
>> weren’t at convention. The voice vote, in which people say “I” if they
>> support a particular candidate, is used only as a preliminary voting
>> method. The voice vote determines the election outcome only when one
>> candidate receives an overwhelming majority of the vote. If the voice
>> vote sounds at all inconclusive, the election leader will call for a
>> hand count and the candidate receiving more than half of the votes
>> wins. Even if the election leader believes the voice vote is
>> conclusive, a candidate who disagrees can always call for a hand
>> count. We have these protections in place to prevent races from being
>> decided by “which group screams the loudest”. Any candidate who
>> garners a significant amount of support will receive enough “I’s” to
>> render a hand count necessary, and again, the candidate always has the
>> right to ask for a hand count regardless of what the election leader
>> decides. In fact, last weekend, almost every contest was ultimately
>> decided by a hand count, even though we started off with a voice vote.
>
>>         You are right that the NABS constitution says nothing about voice
>> voting. I need to find out if there is a national policy that
>> overrides our constitution, making voice voting necessary. There are
>> definite advantages and disadvantages to starting off with a voice
>> vote before preceding to a hand count.
>
>> Arielle Silverman
>> President, National Association of Blind Students
>
>
>> On 7/13/09, Jedi <loneblindjedi at samobile.net> wrote:
>>> Joseph and all:
>
>>> I was present at the election and even made a go for an office or two.
>>> In my opinion, the election did have integrity simply because those
>>> running it tried to make it as fair as they knew how. Elections are
>>> tough especially if you've never run one before. I rmember trying to
>>> arrange Washington State's constitution. Arielle was there. Arielle
>>> well remembers how chaotic that was and how unhappy some folks were.
>>> Hell, some members even got upset because they said the presence of Dr.
>>> maurer swayed the vote over whether or not we should vote members into
>>> our organization or just let them in once they've paid their dues. In
>>> fact, didn't we have to redo that one twice just to make everyone
>>> happy? I remember that day and how stressed everyone was. This last
>>> election at the national level reminds me of that chaos.
>
>>> I guess the reality is that there will always be those who wished the
>>> election happened in their favor. Take, for example, all those who
>>> grumbled when Barack Obama won this last year's U.S. presidency. And
>>> don't forget the fiasco over Bush vs. Gore in 2001. In other words, our
>>> craziness last Saturday isn't unique to NABS, the NFB, or to blind
>>> guys. It's just what happens sometimes. But as Arielle said, there are
>>> ways we can curb the craziness a bit. I have also given some thought to
>>> how we might smooth the process for future NABS participants and their
>>> officers. And like you, joseph, i'm trying to work it out in my own
>>> mind. Having focus groups is a great idea, and I hope to be informed as
>>> to when they occur.
>
>>> Respectfully,
>>> Jedi
>>> Original message:
>>>> Nijat,
>
>>>> One look at the vote counts—so conveniently all multiples of
>>>> ten—calls their accuracy into question.  That students in the room
>>>> report different counts isn't surprising, until you note that their
>>>> reports indicate higher counts for losers than were reported to us in
>>>> a few races, including your runoff, actually.
>
>>>> Personally, I decided not to participate after that point.  We don't
>>>> have 100% agreement on the counts, but there's enough discrepancy
>>>> often enough to call the whole thing into question.  I'm not saying I
>>>> won any of those elections, but I am saying I'm not quite sure in a
>>>> few cases who should have.  I am honestly not sure how many people
>>>> were getting involved trying to do something about it, but there was
>>>> more than three or four.
>
>>>> There are only two things I am sure of: First, no good is likely to
>>>> come of any effort that group might make.  Second, a member of the
>>>> board telling us not to worry our pretty little heads ... just isn't
>>>> going to make things better.  Both sound disastrous to me.
>
>>>> This isn't about who did or did not win an election.  It's about the
>>>> membership of this organization believing a real election actually
>>>> took place.  If even a significant minority doubt that, then it is
>>>> bad for NABS, even if you assume every one of them will age-out of
>>>> NABS in a few years.  We reflect the NFB as a whole, and we should
>>>> reflect it well.
>
>>>> I serve the organization, not the board.  I will yet see two boards
>>>> serve while I remain a student.  It is in the organization's interest
>>>> to make sure what we saw last Saturday does not happen again.  I have
>>>> a solution, but it's not a complete solution yet.  It does result in
>>>> a paper trail, or at least a box full of index cards.  Still working
>>>> out how to handle runoff elections.
>
>>>> Joseph
>
>
>>>> On Sat, Jul 11, 2009 at 04:05:04PM -0600, Nijat Worley wrote:
>>>>> Greetings Joseph,
>>>>>   I believe that there is little doubt about the legitimacy of the
>>>>> current NABS board and the process by which they were elected. Those 
>>>>> who
>>>>> are angry, and those who want to grumble about it, and still those who
>>>>> want to take action about it, have little ground to do so. Besides, 
>>>>> what
>>>>> kind of action would be appropriate at this point? The former board 
>>>>> and
>>>>> Terri did their best to make sure that the elections were fair. They 
>>>>> did
>>>>> almost every vote by a hand count at your request. I am utterly 
>>>>> surprised
>>>>> that you are still dissatisfied about the outcome of the elections. I
>>>>> understand there were some mistakes made in the election process, and 
>>>>> the
>>>>> board has made note of them. We will take proper action to make sure 
>>>>> that
>>>>> those mistakes don't happen again. I do agree with you that to try to 
>>>>> do
>>>>> anything  that might divide the organization at this point would only
>>>>> counter your intentions. NABS is an ever changing and evolving
>>>>> organization simply because of the fact that many of its members both 
>>>>> on
>>>>> the board and off the board come and go so quickly. Nobody stays in 
>>>>> NABS
>>>>> forever. We are all new to this organization, and we all make 
>>>>> mistakes. I
>>>>> appreciate you expressing your concerns and telling folks to stay 
>>>>> united,
>>>>> because only united, can we make change and strengthen this 
>>>>> organization
>>>>> for the benefit of all. I always tell our members both at the state 
>>>>> and
>>>>> national level that one does not have to be on the board to help out 
>>>>> the
>>>>> organization and to be a leader. I think Arielle intends to get 
>>>>> everybody
>>>>> involved in the development and growth of NABS. I am very pleased to 
>>>>> say
>>>>> that I saw many of you at the Monty Carlo night helping us put it
>>>>> together and wrap it up at the end. We couldn't have done it without 
>>>>> you.
>>>>> Thanks to B. J. Sexton, Caron Anderson, Willie Black, Jim, Jedi, and 
>>>>> many
>>>>> others for staying and helping with Monty Carlo Night. Let us put 
>>>>> behind
>>>>> us any hard feelings that may be in our chests and move on to bigger 
>>>>> and
>>>>> better things for the sake of NABS if for nothing else.
>>>>>   At your service,
>>>>>   Nijat
>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net
>
>>> --
>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.  Visit
>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.
>>> _______________________________________________
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>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com
>
>
>
>> --
>> Arielle Silverman
>> President, National Association of Blind Students
>> Phone:  602-502-2255
>> Email:
>> nabs.president at gmail.com
>> Website:
>> www.nabslink.org
>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> nabs-l:
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>
> -- 
> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.  Visit 
> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.
> _______________________________________________
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> 



From jackson.dezman at gmail.com  Mon Jul 13 08:47:00 2009
From: jackson.dezman at gmail.com (Dezman Jackson)
Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 03:47:00 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Thank You Peter
References: <947C96F4184B443AA0BE919FE1434EB4@Rufus>
Message-ID: <80466DBAA281470D810511195D818072@Dezman>

Peter,
Thanks so much for this much needed service.

Dezman
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Joe Orozco" <jsorozco at gmail.com>
To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2009 5:49 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] Thank You Peter


> Hello all,
>
> I just want to thank Peter Donahue for recording the student meeting and 
> all
> the other meetings he covered during convention.  He's real generous to
> volunteer his time, and such service should not go unappreciated.  By the
> sound of it, no pun intended, it seems as though those of us not at the
> meeting will have a lot to look forward to.
>
> Regards,
>
> Joe Orozco
>
> "A man who wants to lead the orchestra must turn his back on the
> crowd."--Max Lucado
>
>
> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus 
> signature
> database 4237 (20090712) __________
>
> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>
> http://www.eset.com
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jackson.dezman%40gmail.com
> 



From jackson.dezman at gmail.com  Mon Jul 13 09:39:27 2009
From: jackson.dezman at gmail.com (Dezman Jackson)
Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 04:39:27 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com>
	<7F89239488FF48BFBC4808FBE171FEEB@melissa>
Message-ID: <DDFF472ECC2B4117BE94135AE6EDECF8@Dezman>

I agree,

There are no losers and we'd do well to remember that we're all brothers and 
sisters fighting more or less for the same opportunities so that hopefully 
the next generation will have it a little easier than we do.  Let's stick 
together and build and improve on what our past great leaders have done. 
Congradulations to the newly elected and remaining board.  I am very much 
looking forward to what's in store for NABS in the coming months.

Dezman
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Melissa Green" <graduate56 at juno.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2009 9:30 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update


Congratulations to all of the board.
As Mr. Freeman stated in his remarks when elected to the national board of
directors. "There are no losers in this election.
IMHPO, the same goes for NABS.
Many times we can lead without a title.

Melissa Green
Limitations live only in our minds. But if we use our imaginations, our
possibilities become limitless
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Arielle Silverman" <nabs.president at gmail.com>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 10, 2009 6:11 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update


Hello NABS members:

Last weekend the National Association of Blind Students held our
annual business meeting in conjunction with the NFB convention in
Detroit. At this year’s business meeting we heard from several of our
former presidents and they taught us a lot about the history and
legacy of our organization and about how we can continue that legacy.
We also got some updated information from RFB, BookShare and about
recent developments regarding the Kindle DX issue. Finally, we
conducted elections and I was elected to serve as the next president
of NABS. I am deeply honored to continue serving this organization and
to join the ranks of those who have come before me, and I would like
to thank all of you for your support  and for your assistance with
making the business meeting and Monte Carlo Night fund-raiser run as
smoothly as possible.

Several others joined our NABS board for the first time. The complete
list of officers and board members is:
President: Arielle Silverman
First Vice-President: Karen Anderson
Second Vice-President: Sean Whalen
Secretary: Janice Jeang
Treasurer: Nijat Worley
Board Member 1: Isaiah Wilcox
Board Member 2: Meghan Whalen
Board Member 3: Domonique Lawless
Board Member 4: Darian Smith
Congratulations to all who were elected. Additionally, we had several
other NABS members who sought election to the board, and consequently
ended up with more interested persons than we could include on the
board. I see this as a good sign that we have a substantial group of
students who care about NABS and helping us to achieve our goals. If
you ran for a board position but were not elected or even if you
didn’t run for a board position but still want to make a contribution
to NABS, there is plenty of work to go around. Stay tuned for an
announcement in the next week or two about NABS committees and  how to
join them. I would also like to set up some telephone focus groups in
the next few months to get your feedback on how we can improve
specific aspects of NABS such as the Student Slate, Website,
convention activities, state division outreach and election policies.
If you want  your voice to be heard, stay tuned  for more details
about these conference calls.

Also, from now on please direct all NABS inquiries to
Nabs.president at gmail.com
The official email address shown on our Website,
president at nabslink.org
also works, but email from both addresses will go to the same place. I
will check this organizational email address daily, and I or another
NABS board member will reply to your query within three days of
receiving it. You can also call me with any questions or  concerns at
602-502-2255
And again, someone will return all phone messages within three days.

I will be sending out a president’s bulletin to the NABS listserv and
the state division lists during the first week of each month. This
bulletin will contain updates about NABS activities as well as other
announcements of interest such as information about state and regional
student division events and news from the NFB Jernigan Institute, RFB,
BookShare, etc. If you  have an announcement that  you would like to
appear in the next president’s bulletin, please send it to me before
the first of the month at noon.

Finally, if you are currently president of a state student division,
please email me off-list with your state, phone number, email address
and whether or not you’re subscribed to  the NABS-Presidents listserv.
I want to be sure the Website and my master state contact list is
updated and that everyone gets on the Presidents list who should be on
it. If you are in a state that doesn’t have a student division yet and
you want to serve as the student contact for your state, also send me
this information.

I’m looking forward to an exciting and productive two years with NABS,
and hope all  of you will join me in making NABS as strong as it can
be!


-- 
Arielle Silverman
President, National Association of Blind Students
Phone:  602-502-2255
Email:
nabs.president at gmail.com
Website:
www.nabslink.org

_______________________________________________
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From daydreamingncolor at gmail.com  Mon Jul 13 18:32:56 2009
From: daydreamingncolor at gmail.com (Aziza C)
Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 12:32:56 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Free NFB cane
In-Reply-To: <20090711190431.GG39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
References: <397852.71300.qm@web65704.mail.ac4.yahoo.com>
	<20090625121232.GB44166@yumi.bluecherry.net>
	<20090711190431.GG39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
Message-ID: <632092010907131132j7bb8a1b3o90cdf600052912dd@mail.gmail.com>

Good job Joesiph!

On 7/11/09, T. Joseph Carter <carter.tjoseph at gmail.com> wrote:
> Following up, while at convention I raised the point about NFB's free
> cane program not including the larger sizes for us tall folks.  The
> response was that this was a good point, and it's going to be
> addressed.  Glad to hear it!
>
> Joseph
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 25, 2009 at 05:12:32AM -0700, T. Joseph Carter wrote:
>> Jim,
>>
>> We generally recommend nose-high canes.  A few use canes taller than
>> they are, but only a few.  *grin*
>>
>> I second your bafflement at the limitation in cane lengths.  It should go
>> as high as 69" at least.  A lot of guys fall in the 65 and 67 range, and
>> more than a few into the 69.
>>
>> I'd go straight for carbon fiber myself, which the NFB doesn't give away
>> for free.  They're light and they're strong.  I might be concerned about
>> a graphite/carbon cane in the frigid winter (can become more brittle),
>> but the straight canes seem to be tough enough at least for Denver.
>>
>> Joseph
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Jun 24, 2009 at 11:10:58AM -0700, Jim Reed wrote:
>>> Hey all,
>>>
>>> I'm wondering why the free NFB canes are so short? I mean, I'm only 6
>>> foot 4, and an NFB cane isn't long enough for me. I could understand
>>> the NFB not having a long enough cane for me if I was like 7 foot tall,
>>> but I am not that tall, and I am certianly not that far out of the norm
>>> for the average height of American males,
>>>
>>> I find the 63 inch limit particularly odd since the NFB (or at least
>>> nost NFB members) all seem to recomend canes that are at least as tall,
>>> if not taller, than the person using it. This means (based on NFB
>>> recomendations) that a 63 inch cane should not be used by anyone taller
>>> than 5 foot 3. As far as I can tell, nearly all American men, and most
>>> American women and teenagers are going to be taller than 5 foot 3, so
>>> why won't the NFB offer a free cane that is large enough for most of
>>> society to benifit? I'm sure their is a legitimate and rational
>>> (probably economic) reason as to why the NFB has choosen to not offer
>>> canes longer than 63 inches, and I'd be curious to find out what that
>>> reason is.
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> Jim
>>>
>>> "From compromise and things half done, Keep me with stern and stubborn
>>> pride,
>>> And when at last the fight is won, ... Keep me still unsatisfied."
>>> --Louis Untermeyer
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carter.tjoseph%40gmail.com
>
> _______________________________________________
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> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
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> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
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>


From lawnmower84 at hotmail.com  Mon Jul 13 20:28:27 2009
From: lawnmower84 at hotmail.com (Jacob Struiksma)
Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:28:27 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Free NFB cane
In-Reply-To: <632092010907131132j7bb8a1b3o90cdf600052912dd@mail.gmail.com>
References: <397852.71300.qm@web65704.mail.ac4.yahoo.com><20090625121232.GB44166@yumi.bluecherry.net><20090711190431.GG39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
	<632092010907131132j7bb8a1b3o90cdf600052912dd@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <COL0-DAV14AF27323A287C579E3C97B5220@phx.gbl>

When is this mater going to be taken care of?  I am tall man and need 69
length cane.  I would like to be able to get free cane but at this time they
only offering the shorter canes
From
Jacob Struiksma
 

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Aziza C
Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 12:33 PM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Free NFB cane

Good job Joesiph!

On 7/11/09, T. Joseph Carter <carter.tjoseph at gmail.com> wrote:
> Following up, while at convention I raised the point about NFB's free 
> cane program not including the larger sizes for us tall folks.  The 
> response was that this was a good point, and it's going to be 
> addressed.  Glad to hear it!
>
> Joseph
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 25, 2009 at 05:12:32AM -0700, T. Joseph Carter wrote:
>> Jim,
>>
>> We generally recommend nose-high canes.  A few use canes taller than 
>> they are, but only a few.  *grin*
>>
>> I second your bafflement at the limitation in cane lengths.  It 
>> should go as high as 69" at least.  A lot of guys fall in the 65 and 
>> 67 range, and more than a few into the 69.
>>
>> I'd go straight for carbon fiber myself, which the NFB doesn't give 
>> away for free.  They're light and they're strong.  I might be 
>> concerned about a graphite/carbon cane in the frigid winter (can 
>> become more brittle), but the straight canes seem to be tough enough at
least for Denver.
>>
>> Joseph
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Jun 24, 2009 at 11:10:58AM -0700, Jim Reed wrote:
>>> Hey all,
>>>
>>> I'm wondering why the free NFB canes are so short? I mean, I'm only 
>>> 6 foot 4, and an NFB cane isn't long enough for me. I could 
>>> understand the NFB not having a long enough cane for me if I was 
>>> like 7 foot tall, but I am not that tall, and I am certianly not 
>>> that far out of the norm for the average height of American males,
>>>
>>> I find the 63 inch limit particularly odd since the NFB (or at least 
>>> nost NFB members) all seem to recomend canes that are at least as 
>>> tall, if not taller, than the person using it. This means (based on 
>>> NFB
>>> recomendations) that a 63 inch cane should not be used by anyone 
>>> taller than 5 foot 3. As far as I can tell, nearly all American men, 
>>> and most American women and teenagers are going to be taller than 5 
>>> foot 3, so why won't the NFB offer a free cane that is large enough 
>>> for most of society to benifit? I'm sure their is a legitimate and 
>>> rational (probably economic) reason as to why the NFB has choosen to 
>>> not offer canes longer than 63 inches, and I'd be curious to find 
>>> out what that reason is.
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> Jim
>>>
>>> "From compromise and things half done, Keep me with stern and 
>>> stubborn pride, And when at last the fight is won, ... Keep me still 
>>> unsatisfied."
>>> --Louis Untermeyer
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carter.tjosep
>> h%40gmail.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
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> lor%40gmail.com
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From jmassay1 at cox.net  Mon Jul 13 20:59:14 2009
From: jmassay1 at cox.net (JMassay)
Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 15:59:14 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Behavior...
Message-ID: <98D652FC82664219B8EE4962A11009A5@MERLIN>

Ashley,

 

Hello. I was not running the election. I ran, once, for a numbered board
position and didn't win. That is not a problem for me., Additionally, I do
feel that everyone has a right to their voice but many of the voices at the
NABS meeting and election could not be heard above the din of others. Many
people were carrying on side conversations, others were just plain rude:
booing and talking very loudly. I strongly feel that we need to show an
elevated level of class and decorum. I agree with whoever else mentioned the
fact that anyone new could have been scared off and put off by the display
of our membership. 

 

So.that being said. We do need to speak with a unified voice.  There is
unity in diversity. Everyone is allowed to have a voice and everyone
deserves to be treated with dignity. We have a lot of work to do and
regardless of whether you have, or don't, a title with regard to the
organization, if you are a part of the blind movement, you are a part of the
blind movement and will rise above to change what it means to be blind. 

 

Jeannie 


From mohnked at hotmail.com  Mon Jul 13 23:15:05 2009
From: mohnked at hotmail.com (Diana Mohnke)
Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 19:15:05 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <62B01264D4664A2F8564287DFCCA9B87@userf9b4fa60eb>
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com><20090711183617.GF39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
	<A24D3BF1F427487BA7865DB3E9412B06@Nijatash> 
	<62B01264D4664A2F8564287DFCCA9B87@userf9b4fa60eb>
Message-ID: <SNT105-W504B67A1E09F177B6E91ACA1220@phx.gbl>


Antonio and others,
 
It was Angela Wolf, former president of NABS that stood up and had us step back, take a breathe and relax.  I believe she had the right to do this because the atmosphere of the room was getting hasty and I believe we needed to do this.  While it is important and valuable to hear what everyone has to say, having everyone try and talk at once does not work.  It was sad to see some students not respect our president or other speakers while they were talking.  This made it very difficult during elections.  It may be that you have not seen some of your friends since last convention or Washington Seminar, you need to remember you are sitting in a meeting.  If you want to catch up or hold a conversation you should be polite to others and go in the hallway and talk.  And if you go in the hallway, do not just stand by the doors, step away and hold your conversation.  This year each ballroom in the hotel had a large foyer area in which conversations such as this could take place.  
 
As for the elections, I felt the vote cards did help some.  This helped in knowing who had registered and who had not.  I feel it would help if the person in charge of running elections to brush up on Robert’s Rules and give out instructions before elections begin.  I also think it is the responsibility of the person in charge of the elections to be the person deciding when to cut off someone who is speaking who is running.  Giving them a warning before there time is up could allow that person to finish his thoughts instead of stopping mid air.  It seemed that people in the audience felt they had the authority to yell out time to a nominee who was speaking.  It might be helpful to assign one person to keep time if the person running elections needs assistance and to not have just several people yell time.  
 
As for learning how elections run, just look at how elections were conducted during national convention.  Or take note of how it is done within your own state during state convention.  Elections are always going on during a state convention.  
 
With all of the side conversations going on during elections, it was confusing as to who was speaking after being nominated.  It may be helpful that even if the person running elections not only says the nominee’s name but the nominee restate their name so there is no confusion.  Many times I had to ask around me who was speaking.  
 
I am sure there are many other ways in which to improve the election process but these are my thoughts.  I do believe that not holding side conversations can be the number one thing that can improve the process immensely.  Then the person running the elections does not have to be challenged by those talking in the audience.  
 
Diana Mohnke 
 

> From: iamantonio at cox.net
> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 18:01:16 -0400
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
> 
> Nejit,
> 
> You say in your post that those who are angry... have little grounds to feel 
> this way.
> 
> While I agree that we need to move forward and stay positive, I also see no 
> value in slipping the durt under the rug. Most people present had very valid 
> concerns about the way the meeting and elections, mostly the elections were 
> conducted.
> 
> First, when the amendment to the constitution was passed, discussion shut 
> off by the president, and people not given a chance to voice their concerns, 
> the entire membership should have been concerned that something was wrong. 
> The meeting would have gone on till god know when and god knows how if one 
> of our members, yours truly, didn't plea for reason, and bring up the 
> constitution matter back to the forthfront, where it belonged.
> 
> I sought to run for a board position, and was nominated for treasurer, so 
> that I could have a voice, access to people's ears, and I saw this as the 
> only way to bring up the constitution concern up for debate again. I 
> withdrew my candidacy, and some discussion was had, and the amendment voted 
> on again.
> 
> The meeting was full of interesting twists, one board member running for a 
> board position clearly on his popularity, and a voice mail message. He 
> wasn't present at the meeting, and a voice message most could not understand 
> was played for the room.
> 
> People run and win because others like them, so winning on popularity is why 
> people win elections. You are more popular than I am, and so forth. The 
> proof of the value of sheer popularity will be in the results the NABS board 
> can accomplish in the time ahead.
> 
> Do I not have the right to be at least a little angry when someone gets to a 
> mic, and proceeds to tell the room that
> 
> she can sense some animocity in the room, she is an elementary school 
> teacher, and we all need to take a little brake, and sit back, relax, and 
> count to 3?
> 
> I do not know who pulled off that performance, but I tell you this. I did 
> not see, hear, or otherwise detect the presence of a 3-year-old in the room, 
> even when most could agree that many, leaders and meeting attendees acted 
> like one.
> 
> I don't appreciate being likened to a child, not am I susseptible to any 
> kind of hypnotic techniques.
> 
> That I don't know who said this goes to tell you that, even in a meeting 
> full of blind people, some neglected to identify themselves by name whether 
> or not they were recognized.
> 
> I challenge anyone who was at the meeting to tell me they would be proud if 
> the thing had been streamed on the web, or recorded.
> 
> Not too angry anymore,
> 
> Sincerely yours,
> 
> Antonio Guimaraes
> 
> If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup 
> trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of 
> highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary 
> works in Braille.
> 
> Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you.
> http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169
> Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Nijat Worley" <nijat1989 at gmail.com>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 6:05 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
> 
> 
> > Greetings Joseph,
> > I believe that there is little doubt about the legitimacy of the current 
> > NABS board and the process by which they were elected. Those who are 
> > angry, and those who want to grumble about it, and still those who want to 
> > take action about it, have little ground to do so. Besides, what kind of 
> > action would be appropriate at this point? The former board and Terri did 
> > their best to make sure that the elections were fair. They did almost 
> > every vote by a hand count at your request. I am utterly surprised that 
> > you are still dissatisfied about the outcome of the elections. I 
> > understand there were some mistakes made in the election process, and the 
> > board has made note of them. We will take proper action to make sure that 
> > those mistakes don't happen again. I do agree with you that to try to do 
> > anything that might divide the organization at this point would only 
> > counter your intentions. NABS is an ever changing and evolving 
> > organization simply because of the fact that many of its members both on 
> > the board and off the board come and go so quickly. Nobody stays in NABS 
> > forever. We are all new to this organization, and we all make mistakes. I 
> > appreciate you expressing your concerns and telling folks to stay united, 
> > because only united, can we make change and strengthen this organization 
> > for the benefit of all. I always tell our members both at the state and 
> > national level that one does not have to be on the board to help out the 
> > organization and to be a leader. I think Arielle intends to get everybody 
> > involved in the development and growth of NABS. I am very pleased to say 
> > that I saw many of you at the Monty Carlo night helping us put it together 
> > and wrap it up at the end. We couldn't have done it without you. Thanks to 
> > B. J. Sexton, Caron Anderson, Willie Black, Jim, Jedi, and many others for 
> > staying and helping with Monty Carlo Night. Let us put behind us any hard 
> > feelings that may be in our chests and move on to bigger and better things 
> > for the sake of NABS if for nothing else.
> > At your service,
> > Nijat
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----- 
> > From: "T. Joseph Carter" <carter.tjoseph at gmail.com>
> > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
> > <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> > Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 12:36 PM
> > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
> >
> >
> >> Arielle and all of NABS,
> >>
> >> I've heard more than a few rumblings about it already, and I am not sure 
> >> the board should try to address them: The NABS election was a complete 
> >> and total fiasco lacking even the appearance of integrity. A number of 
> >> people are really unhappy about it, and some are talking about taking 
> >> action.
> >>
> >> I feel a need to say, "Don't do it, please." I know some of you to be 
> >> good students and good advocates both fro this organization and for the 
> >> blind in general. If those of you I don't know are of the same caliber, 
> >> then you may turn fiasco into tragedy. Think about the possible outcomes 
> >> first.
> >>
> >> Either you will find widespread support, or you will not. If the latter, 
> >> you face marginalization and feelings of disenfranchisement greater than 
> >> you already feel. That will drive you away from the organization for 
> >> certain. Perhaps I am being a bit selfish here, but NABS and the NFB 
> >> need _you_, and I'd rather not have you fall away over something as 
> >> transitory as a single problematic election.
> >>
> >> If you do garner widespread support, the tragedy will be larger still: 
> >> The organization would faction into those who support the incoming board 
> >> and those who oppose the process that elected them, with a lot of people 
> >> who want to do both feeling caught in the middle. There's no faster way 
> >> to ensure more controversial elections than to go down this road.
> >>
> >> So .. what do you do? I made my decision before the election was even 
> >> over: I'm going to support the incoming board, and I'm going to encourage 
> >> (read: make a pain in the rear end of myself) the board to act boldly and 
> >> with integrity on behalf of blind students.
> >>
> >> I also intend to similarly encourage (read the same way) that only 
> >> registered members vote, and that each registrant gets one vote. I can't 
> >> claim to have a simple and brilliant solution here yet because I can't 
> >> figure out how to handle runoff elections quickly and cleanly yet. The 
> >> curious know my email address. *smile*
> >>
> >> Joseph
> >>
> >> P.S. I considered suggesting the Condorcet method, but I decided not to 
> >> propose anything that required calculating a square root to figure out 
> >> who wins the election.
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> nabs-l mailing list
> >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> >> nabs-l:
> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nijat1989%40gmail.com
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > nabs-l mailing list
> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> > nabs-l:
> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mohnked%40hotmail.com


_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live™ Photos: it's easy to store and manage your photos online. See how.
http://windowslive.com/Online/Photos?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_CS_PH_store_manage_072009

From carter.tjoseph at gmail.com  Tue Jul 14 00:48:46 2009
From: carter.tjoseph at gmail.com (T. Joseph Carter)
Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 17:48:46 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Behavior...
In-Reply-To: <98D652FC82664219B8EE4962A11009A5@MERLIN>
References: <98D652FC82664219B8EE4962A11009A5@MERLIN>
Message-ID: <20090714004846.GT39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>

Jeannie,

Unfortunately, it's starting to look like certain people are not 
welcome to contribute unless they sit down and shut up.  That's 
funny, since the number one complaint about the election is an 
attempt to silence dissent.

Those who are not silent about what happened (including those who 
call for looking forward) are being attacked and disregarded by the 
new board.

There will be no going forward as long as the new board perpetuates 
the very actions they would never allow.  I tried to stop this before 
it got started, but the board has shaken even my faith.  I do not 
believe Arielle genuinely wants to fix anything for next time, 
because she emphatically denies there is anything to fix this time.  
Nijat went further in telling those that believe the election was 
mishandled that there's nothing they could do about it anyway.

The arrogance of the new board is appalling and they've been in 
office less than two weeks.  I can no longer advocate moving forward 
with this board with a clear conscience because thus far it seems to 
have no conscience of its own.  Neither can I advocate the measures I 
tried to prevent, because I still think they may only do harm.

In a nutshell: Have fun, everyone.  I'm sitting this one out until I 
see some evidence that our board has enough integrity to admit that 
there were serious issues in our last election that warrant careful 
consideration for the future.  In the meantime, I have nothing else 
to say, except that I am ashamed of NABS and its board.

Joseph


On Mon, Jul 13, 2009 at 03:59:14PM -0500, JMassay wrote:
>Ashley,
>
> 
>
>Hello. I was not running the election. I ran, once, for a numbered board
>position and didn't win. That is not a problem for me., Additionally, I do
>feel that everyone has a right to their voice but many of the voices at the
>NABS meeting and election could not be heard above the din of others. Many
>people were carrying on side conversations, others were just plain rude:
>booing and talking very loudly. I strongly feel that we need to show an
>elevated level of class and decorum. I agree with whoever else mentioned the
>fact that anyone new could have been scared off and put off by the display
>of our membership. 
>
> 
>
>So.that being said. We do need to speak with a unified voice.  There is
>unity in diversity. Everyone is allowed to have a voice and everyone
>deserves to be treated with dignity. We have a lot of work to do and
>regardless of whether you have, or don't, a title with regard to the
>organization, if you are a part of the blind movement, you are a part of the
>blind movement and will rise above to change what it means to be blind. 
>
> 
>
>Jeannie 


From carter.tjoseph at gmail.com  Tue Jul 14 01:00:34 2009
From: carter.tjoseph at gmail.com (T. Joseph Carter)
Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 18:00:34 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Free NFB cane
In-Reply-To: <D9881ACC468F49E78EDC2A788B91AFD3@MARINERS>
References: <632092010907131132j7bb8a1b3o90cdf600052912dd@mail.gmail.com>
	<D9881ACC468F49E78EDC2A788B91AFD3@MARINERS>
Message-ID: <20090714010034.GW39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>

I don't have details, but will attempt to follow up this week.

Joseph


On Mon, Jul 13, 2009 at 02:28:27PM -0600, Jacob Struiksma wrote:
>When is this mater going to be taken care of?  I am tall man and need 69
>length cane.  I would like to be able to get free cane but at this time they
>only offering the shorter canes
>From
>Jacob Struiksma



From nabs.president at gmail.com  Tue Jul 14 01:19:38 2009
From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman)
Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 11:19:38 +1000
Subject: [nabs-l] Behavior...
In-Reply-To: <20090714004846.GT39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
References: <98D652FC82664219B8EE4962A11009A5@MERLIN>
	<20090714004846.GT39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
Message-ID: <85ff10070907131819n15abd5cbp5d368ea8d180d9c4@mail.gmail.com>

Dear Joseph and all:

	I have now posted four replies  to this thread, and in each reply I
have apologized on behalf of NABS for any ill will that was created by
the elections. However, for the record, I will  apologize one more
time. It was never my intention to come across as arrogant or as
denying the validity of anyone’s complaints. In fact, if you reread my
posts (as I just did), you will discover that I have repeatedly stated
my commitment to make the elections process run as smoothly and fairly
as possible. I have admitted to specific mistakes we made and proposed
specific suggestions for improvement, such as making sure to allow
adequate discussion of constitutional changes,  properly selecting and
training vote counters, and perhaps incorporating a paper trail into
the voting process. I’ve also offered to set up some focus groups so
the members can give us suggestions on how to improve the election
process. In all of this, I am failing to find any evidence for your
allegations that I “emphatically denied that anything was wrong” or
that the board is unwilling to give these issues “careful
consideration”.

	The NABS board will be meeting by phone on Thursday, and we will
decide what the best method is for soliciting member feedback about
the elections, and will let all of you know immediately what we
decide. Again, we are willing to open all channels of communication so
that respectful, honest dialogue can occur. I’ve also stated that all
of you are free and welcome to engage in conversation about this with
national NFB leaders if you so desire. So in all of this, I’m failing
to see in what way we are “silencing dissent”.

	Joseph, I know you have been in the organization for about as long as
I have. I have talked with you on the NABS list for years and I know
that you are passionate about changing what it means to be blind and
fighting discrimination against blind students. I sincerely hope that
you can direct this energy into solving these problems with us,
instead of making heated and unsubstantiated accusations against the
NABS leadership. If you can find specific evidence from what we’ve
written or said to back up your claims, then I’d be glad to have a
respectful discussion about it, and come to a compromise. Otherwise, I
am going to remove myself from this discussion for now so we can focus
on growing our organization and doing the work that happens between
elections. Once we’ve set up a forum for all NABS members to voice
their opinions about specific solutions, we’ll make that forum widely
available so dialogue can continue in a mature, productive and
respectful way.

Arielle Silverman
President, National Association of Blind Students


On 7/14/09, T. Joseph Carter <carter.tjoseph at gmail.com> wrote:
> Jeannie,
>
> Unfortunately, it's starting to look like certain people are not
> welcome to contribute unless they sit down and shut up.  That's
> funny, since the number one complaint about the election is an
> attempt to silence dissent.
>
> Those who are not silent about what happened (including those who
> call for looking forward) are being attacked and disregarded by the
> new board.
>
> There will be no going forward as long as the new board perpetuates
> the very actions they would never allow.  I tried to stop this before
> it got started, but the board has shaken even my faith.  I do not
> believe Arielle genuinely wants to fix anything for next time,
> because she emphatically denies there is anything to fix this time.
> Nijat went further in telling those that believe the election was
> mishandled that there's nothing they could do about it anyway.
>
> The arrogance of the new board is appalling and they've been in
> office less than two weeks.  I can no longer advocate moving forward
> with this board with a clear conscience because thus far it seems to
> have no conscience of its own.  Neither can I advocate the measures I
> tried to prevent, because I still think they may only do harm.
>
> In a nutshell: Have fun, everyone.  I'm sitting this one out until I
> see some evidence that our board has enough integrity to admit that
> there were serious issues in our last election that warrant careful
> consideration for the future.  In the meantime, I have nothing else
> to say, except that I am ashamed of NABS and its board.
>
> Joseph
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 13, 2009 at 03:59:14PM -0500, JMassay wrote:
>>Ashley,
>>
>>
>>
>>Hello. I was not running the election. I ran, once, for a numbered board
>>position and didn't win. That is not a problem for me., Additionally, I do
>>feel that everyone has a right to their voice but many of the voices at the
>>NABS meeting and election could not be heard above the din of others. Many
>>people were carrying on side conversations, others were just plain rude:
>>booing and talking very loudly. I strongly feel that we need to show an
>>elevated level of class and decorum. I agree with whoever else mentioned
>> the
>>fact that anyone new could have been scared off and put off by the display
>>of our membership.
>>
>>
>>
>>So.that being said. We do need to speak with a unified voice.  There is
>>unity in diversity. Everyone is allowed to have a voice and everyone
>>deserves to be treated with dignity. We have a lot of work to do and
>>regardless of whether you have, or don't, a title with regard to the
>>organization, if you are a part of the blind movement, you are a part of
>> the
>>blind movement and will rise above to change what it means to be blind.
>>
>>
>>
>>Jeannie
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com
>


-- 
Arielle Silverman
President, National Association of Blind Students
Phone:  602-502-2255
Email:
nabs.president at gmail.com
Website:
www.nabslink.org


From JFreeh at nfb.org  Tue Jul 14 02:48:00 2009
From: JFreeh at nfb.org (Freeh,
	Jessica)
Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 21:48:00 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] National Federation of the Blind Awards $50,000
Message-ID: <auto-000107377738@mailfront1.g2host.com>


FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE<?xml:namespace prefix = o 
ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />



CONTACT:

Chris Danielsen

Director of Public Relations

National Federation of the Blind
(410) 659-9314, extension 2330
(410) 262-1281(Cell)
<mailto:cdanielsen at nfb.org>cdanielsen at nfb.org


National Federation of the Blind Awards $50,000




Second Annual Dr. Jacob Bolotin Awards Presented at 2009 Convention

Baltimore, Maryland (July 13, 2009): The National 
Federation of the Blind presented $50,000 in cash 
awards to individuals and organizations that have 
made outstanding contributions toward achieving 
the full integration of the blind into society on 
a basis of equality.  The second annual Dr. Jacob 
Bolotin Awards honored eight innovators in the 
blindness field at the National Federation of the 
Blind annual convention in <?xml:namespace prefix 
= st1 ns = 
"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" />Detroit on Wednesday, July 8.



Awards in the amount of $10,000 were given to 
Opportunities Unlimited for the Blind and Diane 
Croft.  A joint award of $10,000 was also given 
to the National Organization of Parents of Blind 
Children (NOPBC) and the National Association to 
Promote the Use of Braille (NAPUB) for their 
Braille Readers Are Leaders contest.  Abe Nemeth, 
John Andrew English, the Princeton Braillists, 
and the American Action Fund for Blind Children 
and Adults were each awarded $5,000.



Dr. Jacob Bolotin––the namesake of the award 
program––was a blind physician who lived and 
practiced in Chicago in the early twentieth 
century.  He was widely known and respected in 
Chicago and throughout the Midwest during his 
career, which spanned the period from 1912 until 
his untimely death at the age of thirty-six in 
1924.  He was particularly recognized for his 
expertise on diseases of the heart and 
lungs.  Bolotin used his many public speaking 
engagements to advocate for the employment of the 
blind and their full integration into society.



Dr. Marc Maurer, President of the National 
Federation of the Blind, said: “Dr. Jacob Bolotin 
was a pioneer who overcame low expectations and 
discrimination to become a renowned member of the 
medical profession without the benefit of the 
support services and civil rights protections 
available to blind people today.  The National 
Federation of the Blind is proud to honor the 
memory and spirit of Dr. Bolotin by recognizing 
and financially supporting those who are doing 
exceptional work to help achieve the shared dream 
of Dr. Bolotin and the National Federation of the 
Blind––a society where the blind are treated as 
productive, independent, and equal citizens.”



The Dr. Jacob Bolotin Award Program is funded 
through the generosity of Dr. Bolotin’s nephew 
and niece, Alfred and Rosalind Perlman.  The late 
Mrs. Perlman established the Alfred and Rosalind 
Perlman Trust to endow the award.  Income from 
the trust is distributed to the National 
Federation of the Blind and the Santa Barbara 
Foundation for the purpose of administering the 
Dr. Jacob Bolotin Award Program.  Mrs. Perlman 
also wrote The Blind Doctor: The Jacob Bolotin 
Story.  The book was published by Blue Point 
Books and is available through the National 
Federation of the Blind.  A portion of the 
proceeds from book sales will also benefit the 
award program.  For more information about the 
Dr. Jacob Bolotin Award Program, including more 
information about this year’s winners, as well as 
eligibility criteria and application procedures, 
visit <http://www.nfb.org/>www.nfb.org.



###

From kim at senderogroup.com  Tue Jul 14 02:59:32 2009
From: kim at senderogroup.com (Kim Casey)
Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2009 21:59:32 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Announcing Sendero GPS 6.0 for BrailleNote Products!
Message-ID: <auto-000107378685@mailfront1.g2host.com>

Raising independent travel to a whole new level

Version 6.0 is Sendero's eleventh version since our laptop GPS in 
2000. It has been 14 years since we began working on the first 
prototypes. There are 25 improvements in version 6. There is over 
11GB of new map and POI data compared with 10GB in the last release.

Instead of one map country with your new GPS product, you now have 
your choice of 3 map bundles, North America, Western Europe or Asia.

Along with new maps and POIs, Sendero has added simplicity in several 
ways. The address searching module has been completely revamped, 
making it easier to find addresses.  Even search using zip/postal 
codes in some countries.

Sendero still has five to ten times the commercial and User Points of 
Interest data as other GPS products and there are more ways to filter 
the POI data so you can find and hear what you want, when you want, 
with Sendero's unique LookAround mode.

For even more precise directional information, we added something we 
call "sailing mode." Turn 10 degrees to the left, 22 degrees to the 
right and so on. Think of it as left/right mode on steroids.

To see all 25 changes from v5 to v6, visit 
http://www.SenderoGroup.com/v60changes.htm

For those of you who already have an upgrade on an mPower, PK or 
VoiceNote and GPS, your upgrade is eagerly awaiting you at 
http://www.MySendero.com

If you don't have a GPS product yet, call toll free, 1-888-757-6810

Visit http://www.SenderoGroup.com and we will extend the summer show 
special one week in honor of this release.



Contact Sendero Group:
http://www.senderogroup.com
Toll free phone (US and Canada): 1-888-757-6810
Direct phone: +1 530 757-6800



From blindamp at q.com  Tue Jul 14 05:49:17 2009
From: blindamp at q.com (Marty James)
Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 00:49:17 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Behavior...
References: <98D652FC82664219B8EE4962A11009A5@MERLIN>
	<20090714004846.GT39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
Message-ID: <BLU0-SMTP365E9C702A9249E341CE05D5230@phx.gbl>

You really promise?? No more sore loser stuff from you??
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "T. Joseph Carter" <carter.tjoseph at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 7:48 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Behavior...


> Jeannie,
>
> Unfortunately, it's starting to look like certain people are not welcome 
> to contribute unless they sit down and shut up.  That's funny, since the 
> number one complaint about the election is an attempt to silence dissent.
>
> Those who are not silent about what happened (including those who call for 
> looking forward) are being attacked and disregarded by the new board.
>
> There will be no going forward as long as the new board perpetuates the 
> very actions they would never allow.  I tried to stop this before it got 
> started, but the board has shaken even my faith.  I do not believe Arielle 
> genuinely wants to fix anything for next time, because she emphatically 
> denies there is anything to fix this time.  Nijat went further in telling 
> those that believe the election was mishandled that there's nothing they 
> could do about it anyway.
>
> The arrogance of the new board is appalling and they've been in office 
> less than two weeks.  I can no longer advocate moving forward with this 
> board with a clear conscience because thus far it seems to have no 
> conscience of its own.  Neither can I advocate the measures I tried to 
> prevent, because I still think they may only do harm.
>
> In a nutshell: Have fun, everyone.  I'm sitting this one out until I see 
> some evidence that our board has enough integrity to admit that there were 
> serious issues in our last election that warrant careful consideration for 
> the future.  In the meantime, I have nothing else to say, except that I am 
> ashamed of NABS and its board.
>
> Joseph
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 13, 2009 at 03:59:14PM -0500, JMassay wrote:
>>Ashley,
>>
>>
>>Hello. I was not running the election. I ran, once, for a numbered board
>>position and didn't win. That is not a problem for me., Additionally, I do
>>feel that everyone has a right to their voice but many of the voices at 
>>the
>>NABS meeting and election could not be heard above the din of others. Many
>>people were carrying on side conversations, others were just plain rude:
>>booing and talking very loudly. I strongly feel that we need to show an
>>elevated level of class and decorum. I agree with whoever else mentioned 
>>the
>>fact that anyone new could have been scared off and put off by the display
>>of our membership.
>>
>>So.that being said. We do need to speak with a unified voice.  There is
>>unity in diversity. Everyone is allowed to have a voice and everyone
>>deserves to be treated with dignity. We have a lot of work to do and
>>regardless of whether you have, or don't, a title with regard to the
>>organization, if you are a part of the blind movement, you are a part of 
>>the
>>blind movement and will rise above to change what it means to be blind.
>>
>>Jeannie
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindamp%40q.com
> 



From bookwormahb at earthlink.net  Tue Jul 14 12:26:21 2009
From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley  Bramlett)
Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 08:26:21 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Behavior...
References: <98D652FC82664219B8EE4962A11009A5@MERLIN>
	<20090714004846.GT39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
Message-ID: <B7C4F9323A9C4633A25EDFA5DE7BF9A0@Ashley>

Hi Joeseph,
As I read Arielle's posts its the opposite.  You're jumping to conclusions.
She clearly stated there were mistakes and said it will improve next time.
An excerpt:

"we had made an error in not entertaining discussion of the amendment.
The fact that we did not do so is one of the mistakes I spoke of
earlier, and one that will not be repeated in future business meetings.
We can't undo mistakes that we have made in the past; we can, however, learn
from them. We can and
should also use this energy to do what we can to strengthen the other
parts of this organization."


Jeanie's point is valid though too; that people were rude and booing. 
Multiple people complained so its true I'm sure.  You need to respect each 
other even in elections.
Ashley


I think we have made clear at this point that the NABS leadership, and
the process by which we are elected, is not perfect.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "T. Joseph Carter" <carter.tjoseph at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 8:48 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Behavior...


> Jeannie,
>
> Unfortunately, it's starting to look like certain people are not welcome
> to contribute unless they sit down and shut up.  That's funny, since the
> number one complaint about the election is an attempt to silence dissent.
>
> Those who are not silent about what happened (including those who call for
> looking forward) are being attacked and disregarded by the new board.
>
> There will be no going forward as long as the new board perpetuates the
> very actions they would never allow.  I tried to stop this before it got
> started, but the board has shaken even my faith.  I do not believe Arielle
> genuinely wants to fix anything for next time, because she emphatically
> denies there is anything to fix this time.  Nijat went further in telling
> those that believe the election was mishandled that there's nothing they
> could do about it anyway.
>
> The arrogance of the new board is appalling and they've been in office
> less than two weeks.  I can no longer advocate moving forward with this
> board with a clear conscience because thus far it seems to have no
> conscience of its own.  Neither can I advocate the measures I tried to
> prevent, because I still think they may only do harm.
>
> In a nutshell: Have fun, everyone.  I'm sitting this one out until I see
> some evidence that our board has enough integrity to admit that there were
> serious issues in our last election that warrant careful consideration for
> the future.  In the meantime, I have nothing else to say, except that I am
> ashamed of NABS and its board.
>
> Joseph
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 13, 2009 at 03:59:14PM -0500, JMassay wrote:
>>Ashley,
>>
>>
>>Hello. I was not running the election. I ran, once, for a numbered board
>>position and didn't win. That is not a problem for me., Additionally, I do
>>feel that everyone has a right to their voice but many of the voices at
>>the
>>NABS meeting and election could not be heard above the din of others. Many
>>people were carrying on side conversations, others were just plain rude:
>>booing and talking very loudly. I strongly feel that we need to show an
>>elevated level of class and decorum. I agree with whoever else mentioned
>>the
>>fact that anyone new could have been scared off and put off by the display
>>of our membership.
>>
>>So.that being said. We do need to speak with a unified voice.  There is
>>unity in diversity. Everyone is allowed to have a voice and everyone
>>deserves to be treated with dignity. We have a lot of work to do and
>>regardless of whether you have, or don't, a title with regard to the
>>organization, if you are a part of the blind movement, you are a part of
>>the
>>blind movement and will rise above to change what it means to be blind.
>>
>>Jeannie
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net
>
> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus
> signature database 4240 (20090713) __________
>
> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>
> http://www.eset.com
>
>
>



From corbbo at gmail.com  Tue Jul 14 14:15:10 2009
From: corbbo at gmail.com (Corbb O'Connor)
Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 10:15:10 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: MEAFLink: CVS Caremark Community Grants Funding
	Opportunity
In-Reply-To: <4397BAE4D075B04B942AD75DF3DAE7AC062A9D41@cyexc00.meus.corp>
References: <4397BAE4D075B04B942AD75DF3DAE7AC062A9D41@cyexc00.meus.corp>
Message-ID: <4ed9a39a0907140715h5a4ec6c4ia25b8bd34b302746@mail.gmail.com>

See the following grant opportunity from the Mitsubishi Electric
America Foundation. (No, not the car people. The electronics, TVs, and
big sign people!)


---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Berg, Allison <Allison.Berg at meus.mea.com>
Date: Tue, Jul 14, 2009 at 9:46 AM
Subject: MEAFLink: CVS Caremark Community Grants Funding Opportunity
To:


Thank you to Marvin Laster of the Boys & Girls Clubs of America for
forwarding this announcement.
________________________________

CVS Caremark Community Grants Program Accepting Grant Applications for
Programs Serving Children With Disabilities and the Uninsured
Grants of up to $5,000 will be awarded to nonprofits and schools
working to provide disabled children and youth under age 21 with
health and rehabilitation programs and active play opportunities
alongside their non-disabled peers....
Deadline: October 31, 2009
Posted: July 12, 2009

For more information check out the link below:

http://foundationcenter.org/pnd/rfp/rfp_item.jhtml?id=257400013




* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

You received this email because you indicated interest in getting
information from the Mitsubishi Electric America Foundation (MEAF).
MEAFlink is designed to share information and news for and about young
people with disabilities.  Information circulated does not necessarily
express the views of MEAF.  MEAF does not verify the accuracy of the
information or content of messages posted on MEAFlink, and MEAF
expressly disclaims all responsibility for any errors or omissions.
MEAF reserves the right to exclude postings that contain
inappropriate, unlawful or offensive content.  To be removed from this
list, please email meaflink at meus.mea.com and write “unsubscribe” in
the subject line.


From dandrews at visi.com  Tue Jul 14 16:10:06 2009
From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews)
Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 11:10:06 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Making Music with the Mac
Message-ID: <auto-000110230279@mailfront2.g2host.com>


 >>> Earle Harrison <
earle at handytech.us
 > 7/14/2009 9:36 AM >>>
Tuesday, July 14, 2009
For Immediate Distribution

Sales contact:
Earle Harrison
651-636-5184
earle at handytech.us

Making Music with the Mac

When: Thursday, August 13 & Friday, August 14, 2009,
each day from 9:00 AM - 4:00 PM.

Where: Handy Tech North America, 3989 Central Avenue NE., Suite 402, 
Columbia Heights, MN 55421

Telephone: 651-636-5184

Email:
info at handytech.us

Web: Handy Tech North America - Making Music with the Mac:
http://www.handytech.us/new.html#musicmac

Registration: To register, fill out our Online Registration Form:
http://www.handytech.us/musicmac.html.
Registration will close August 5.

Overview

World acclaimed singer song writer Ginny Owens in partnership with 
Handy Tech North America are pleased to offer a two-day workshop on 
musical composition,
recording, and production with the use of Apple's Macintosh and its 
built-in screen reader, VoiceOver.

Topics covered will include the fundamentals of writing great songs 
and getting them published, basic recording techniques for capturing 
live instruments
and vocals, and creating multi-track projects using Apple's vast 
instrument library. An overview of several recording and editing 
programs for the Mac
platform including Garage Band, Logic Pro, Amadeus Pro, and Sound 
Studio, will be provided.

Each attendee will receive hands-on training on an Apple computer, 
experience using microphones and other recording devices, and 
evaluations/critiques
of his/her original compositions.

Cost per registrant is $500 and a special group rate is available at 
the nearby Livinn Suites hotel. Shuttle service to and from the 
training center will
also be provided at no additional charge.

Space is limited, so please join Ginny Owens and Handy Tech North 
America for what is sure to be a fun, informative and inspiring time 
by following the
below link to sign-up today:
www.handytech.us/musicmac.html
. Registration will close August 5.

About Ginny Owens

Making Music with the Mac will be led and facilitated by 
award-winning singer/songwriter Ginny Owens. Owens' critically 
acclaimed records have garnered
sales nearing 1 million units, multiple Top Ten radio hits, slots on 
numerous television shows, and performances at Lilith Fair, the 
Sundance Film Festival,
and The White House.

About Handy Tech North America

Handy Tech North America is a Minneapolis-based company that is owned 
and operated by business professionals with visual impairments. In 
addition to our
own innovative and cost-effective low vision solutions, we distribute 
cutting-edge products for some of the best-known companies in the 
assistive technology
industry. Handy Tech North America also offers customized assistive 
technology training and consulting services to organizations and
individuals throughout the United States and Canada.

Forward email
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This email was sent to
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David Andrews and white cane Harry.




From ds94124 at aol.com  Tue Jul 14 16:15:49 2009
From: ds94124 at aol.com (Darian Smith)
Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 12:15:49 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief
Message-ID: <8CBD2B57C37189E-988-1085@MBLK-M01.sysops.aol.com>

Hey all,
  What a convention, huh? I actually don't know if this has taken place 
yet, but I am interested to hear people's thoughts on convention.  I 
would like to hear about what Highlights people took from this 
convention an, and  if you are a "rookie" what your first impressions 
were of this year's  installment of the grand event.
 Would you do it again, "Rookies"?

 have an  awsome day!
 Darian



From RCarranza at nfb.org  Tue Jul 14 18:05:14 2009
From: RCarranza at nfb.org (Carranza, Rosy)
Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 14:05:14 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Great Opportunity, Don't Pass this Up!!
Message-ID: <7638A85981599142811F69FBB9508B6B0113E44A@FPNTEXCBE01.services.local>

If you are a motivated college student looking to learn more about
internship and employment opportunities through the U.S. Department of
State, then this message is for you!

The U.S. Department of State is hosting a unique mentoring opportunity
for students to learn about the variety of internship and employment
options available through their network. We are helping them identify
undergraduate or graduate students to participate in their day-long
mentoring program on Wednesday, October 21, 2009. Spots are very
limited, and interested students should email Rosy Carranza at
rcarranza at nfb.org by Thursday, July 16, 2009. This event will expose
students to a variety of Department professionals with and without
disabilities, to the Department's history/mission, to careers in
civil/foreign service, and to intern, hiring, and recruitment programs
in the Department. 
All participants must be U.S. citizens, full-time undergraduate or
graduate/law students with at least a 3.0 G.P.A. on a 4.0 scale, and
have a targeted disability. All participants will need to arrange and
pay for their own transportation to and from the Department.  However,
lunch is expected to be provided to student participants. While the
Department's mission is one of foreign affairs, the Department's
workforce consists of thousands of employees in either the Civil Service
(CS) or in the Foreign Service (FS), and these employees' educations and
professions vary widely.   Accordingly, student participants who are
interested in or pursuing any of a variety of  studies or professions
are welcome, including but not limited to the following: Business
Management, Economics, Finance, Human Resource Management, Information
Technology/Computer Science, International Affairs/Relations, Law,
Physics, Political  Science, Psychology, Public Affairs, Public
Diplomacy, Social Work.  More information should be available off of
http://careers.state.gov.
If you wish to be considered for this opportunity, please contact Rosy
Carranza at (410) 659-9314, ext. 2283 or via email at
rcarranza at nfb.org. You will need to send Joanne your most recent CV or
resume, and a brief (no more than one-page) statement outlining why you
want to participate in this event by Thursday, July 16. We are only able
to select four students; therefore, we will review your information, and
will forward your materials to our contacts at the Department by July
23. You should hear something from the Department by late August.

Good luck, and don't pass up this outstanding opportunity!

Rosy Carranza


From guitargirl89 at windstream.net  Tue Jul 14 18:30:55 2009
From: guitargirl89 at windstream.net (stacy timberlake)
Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 14:30:55 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Math Trax
In-Reply-To: <COL0-DAV14AF27323A287C579E3C97B5220@phx.gbl>
References: <397852.71300.qm@web65704.mail.ac4.yahoo.com><20090625121232.GB44166@yumi.bluecherry.net><20090711190431.GG39692@yumi.bluecherry.net><632092010907131132j7bb8a1b3o90cdf600052912dd@mail.gmail.com>
	<COL0-DAV14AF27323A287C579E3C97B5220@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <E63820F8D6C24D7D92EFCDBBF78F71D7@StacyPC>

Hey Everyone,
I was  wondering if anybody has used the program Math Trax as a talking 
graphing calculator.  I have downloaded it but am having some trouble 
figuring it out.  Any tips/hints would be greatly appreachiated

Thanks,
Stacy. 



From pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net  Tue Jul 14 19:08:17 2009
From: pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net (Peter Donahue)
Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 14:08:17 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
References: <20090713012109.2732.51348@web3.serotek.com>
Message-ID: <07a001ca04b6$7292c220$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn>

Good afternoon everyone,

        Having personally witnessed and reading many of the posts concerning 
the NABS Election all I can say is whoosh!!

    The first question I'm inclined to ask is Why reinvent the wheel?Voice 
votes and hand counts work extremely well in chapter and division meetings, 
state and national convention general sessions. Make them work for NABS. The 
above methods work fine for tallying votes in these gatherings so why not 
keep things simple when there is so much more to be done instead of spending 
valuable time fighting over election procedures?Sticking with the tried and 
true is far better than using election methods, (Showing cards and creating 
paper trails) that are cumbersome, and slow down the election process. I've 
heard elections in a few states where similar methods have been employed and 
observed what happened. For God sakes stay with the tried and true and get 
on with the business of bettering the lives of blind students!

    Much was made over the fact that persons were voting that hadn't 
registered. Does such paranoia occur during the elections held during our 
general sessions? What happened to trust? I have yet to walk in to a state 
or national convention general session where attendees were asked to show 
cards when voting to show proof of registration. I thought that's why we are 
encouraged to wear our name tags to be identified as registered convention 
attendees?This method has worked for many, many years so why reinvent it? 
The old adage, "If it's not broke don't fix it" need to apply to the NABS 
elections.

    Just my observations from a former student division member and a very 
tired sound tech technician  who has replayed these elections several times 
over. All the best for a great year ahead and please let's get on with the 
business of improving education opportunities for blind students.

Peter Donahue



   ----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jedi" <loneblindjedi at samobile.net>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2009 8:21 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update


Listers:

As far as vote counting goes, I'd really like to see a method that can
be run completely by blind people since we're a blindness organization.
In most cases, voice voting works well enough provided that the
membership is mature enough to use it correctly. I'd be willing to use
a balloting system if it can be handled efficiently.

Respectfully,
Jedi


Original message:
> Hi Joseph and all,

>         While this was explained at the meeting, I’ll reiterate for those 
> who
> weren’t at convention. The voice vote, in which people say “I” if they
> support a particular candidate, is used only as a preliminary voting
> method. The voice vote determines the election outcome only when one
> candidate receives an overwhelming majority of the vote. If the voice
> vote sounds at all inconclusive, the election leader will call for a
> hand count and the candidate receiving more than half of the votes
> wins. Even if the election leader believes the voice vote is
> conclusive, a candidate who disagrees can always call for a hand
> count. We have these protections in place to prevent races from being
> decided by “which group screams the loudest”. Any candidate who
> garners a significant amount of support will receive enough “I’s” to
> render a hand count necessary, and again, the candidate always has the
> right to ask for a hand count regardless of what the election leader
> decides. In fact, last weekend, almost every contest was ultimately
> decided by a hand count, even though we started off with a voice vote.

>         You are right that the NABS constitution says nothing about voice
> voting. I need to find out if there is a national policy that
> overrides our constitution, making voice voting necessary. There are
> definite advantages and disadvantages to starting off with a voice
> vote before preceding to a hand count.

> Arielle Silverman
> President, National Association of Blind Students


> On 7/13/09, Jedi <loneblindjedi at samobile.net> wrote:
>> Joseph and all:

>> I was present at the election and even made a go for an office or two.
>> In my opinion, the election did have integrity simply because those
>> running it tried to make it as fair as they knew how. Elections are
>> tough especially if you've never run one before. I rmember trying to
>> arrange Washington State's constitution. Arielle was there. Arielle
>> well remembers how chaotic that was and how unhappy some folks were.
>> Hell, some members even got upset because they said the presence of Dr.
>> maurer swayed the vote over whether or not we should vote members into
>> our organization or just let them in once they've paid their dues. In
>> fact, didn't we have to redo that one twice just to make everyone
>> happy? I remember that day and how stressed everyone was. This last
>> election at the national level reminds me of that chaos.

>> I guess the reality is that there will always be those who wished the
>> election happened in their favor. Take, for example, all those who
>> grumbled when Barack Obama won this last year's U.S. presidency. And
>> don't forget the fiasco over Bush vs. Gore in 2001. In other words, our
>> craziness last Saturday isn't unique to NABS, the NFB, or to blind
>> guys. It's just what happens sometimes. But as Arielle said, there are
>> ways we can curb the craziness a bit. I have also given some thought to
>> how we might smooth the process for future NABS participants and their
>> officers. And like you, joseph, i'm trying to work it out in my own
>> mind. Having focus groups is a great idea, and I hope to be informed as
>> to when they occur.

>> Respectfully,
>> Jedi
>> Original message:
>>> Nijat,

>>> One look at the vote counts—so conveniently all multiples of
>>> ten—calls their accuracy into question.  That students in the room
>>> report different counts isn't surprising, until you note that their
>>> reports indicate higher counts for losers than were reported to us in
>>> a few races, including your runoff, actually.

>>> Personally, I decided not to participate after that point.  We don't
>>> have 100% agreement on the counts, but there's enough discrepancy
>>> often enough to call the whole thing into question.  I'm not saying I
>>> won any of those elections, but I am saying I'm not quite sure in a
>>> few cases who should have.  I am honestly not sure how many people
>>> were getting involved trying to do something about it, but there was
>>> more than three or four.

>>> There are only two things I am sure of: First, no good is likely to
>>> come of any effort that group might make.  Second, a member of the
>>> board telling us not to worry our pretty little heads ... just isn't
>>> going to make things better.  Both sound disastrous to me.

>>> This isn't about who did or did not win an election.  It's about the
>>> membership of this organization believing a real election actually
>>> took place.  If even a significant minority doubt that, then it is
>>> bad for NABS, even if you assume every one of them will age-out of
>>> NABS in a few years.  We reflect the NFB as a whole, and we should
>>> reflect it well.

>>> I serve the organization, not the board.  I will yet see two boards
>>> serve while I remain a student.  It is in the organization's interest
>>> to make sure what we saw last Saturday does not happen again.  I have
>>> a solution, but it's not a complete solution yet.  It does result in
>>> a paper trail, or at least a box full of index cards.  Still working
>>> out how to handle runoff elections.

>>> Joseph


>>> On Sat, Jul 11, 2009 at 04:05:04PM -0600, Nijat Worley wrote:
>>>> Greetings Joseph,
>>>>   I believe that there is little doubt about the legitimacy of the
>>>> current NABS board and the process by which they were elected. Those 
>>>> who
>>>> are angry, and those who want to grumble about it, and still those who
>>>> want to take action about it, have little ground to do so. Besides, 
>>>> what
>>>> kind of action would be appropriate at this point? The former board and
>>>> Terri did their best to make sure that the elections were fair. They 
>>>> did
>>>> almost every vote by a hand count at your request. I am utterly 
>>>> surprised
>>>> that you are still dissatisfied about the outcome of the elections. I
>>>> understand there were some mistakes made in the election process, and 
>>>> the
>>>> board has made note of them. We will take proper action to make sure 
>>>> that
>>>> those mistakes don't happen again. I do agree with you that to try to 
>>>> do
>>>> anything  that might divide the organization at this point would only
>>>> counter your intentions. NABS is an ever changing and evolving
>>>> organization simply because of the fact that many of its members both 
>>>> on
>>>> the board and off the board come and go so quickly. Nobody stays in 
>>>> NABS
>>>> forever. We are all new to this organization, and we all make mistakes. 
>>>> I
>>>> appreciate you expressing your concerns and telling folks to stay 
>>>> united,
>>>> because only united, can we make change and strengthen this 
>>>> organization
>>>> for the benefit of all. I always tell our members both at the state and
>>>> national level that one does not have to be on the board to help out 
>>>> the
>>>> organization and to be a leader. I think Arielle intends to get 
>>>> everybody
>>>> involved in the development and growth of NABS. I am very pleased to 
>>>> say
>>>> that I saw many of you at the Monty Carlo night helping us put it
>>>> together and wrap it up at the end. We couldn't have done it without 
>>>> you.
>>>> Thanks to B. J. Sexton, Caron Anderson, Willie Black, Jim, Jedi, and 
>>>> many
>>>> others for staying and helping with Monty Carlo Night. Let us put 
>>>> behind
>>>> us any hard feelings that may be in our chests and move on to bigger 
>>>> and
>>>> better things for the sake of NABS if for nothing else.
>>>>   At your service,
>>>>   Nijat

>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
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> --
> Arielle Silverman
> President, National Association of Blind Students
> Phone:  602-502-2255
> Email:
> nabs.president at gmail.com
> Website:
> www.nabslink.org

> _______________________________________________
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From graduate56 at juno.com  Tue Jul 14 20:45:39 2009
From: graduate56 at juno.com (Melissa Green)
Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 14:45:39 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com><20090711183617.GF39692@yumi.bluecherry.net><A24D3BF1F427487BA7865DB3E9412B06@Nijatash><62B01264D4664A2F8564287DFCCA9B87@userf9b4fa60eb>
	<85ff10070907121542m5a72e643rf9fea95ea3545849@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <32CCBD38FEC4412DA1786FF25EA994B8@melissa>

Well said!
Melissa Green
Limitations live only in our minds. But if we use our imaginations, our
possibilities become limitless
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Arielle Silverman" <nabs.president at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2009 4:42 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update


> Dear Antonio and all,
>
> The woman of whom you speak was Angela Wolf, who served as president
> of NABS from 2001-2005. She spoke up after alerting Terri and I that
> we had made an error in not entertaining discussion of the amendment.
> The fact that we did not do so is one of the mistakes I spoke of
> earlier, and one that will not be repeated in future business
> meetings.
>
> I think we have made clear at this point that the NABS leadership, and
> the process by which we are elected, is not perfect. We need  you to
> keep us  on our toes, as you have done. We can't undo mistakes that we
> have made in the past; we can, however, learn from them. We can and
> should also use this energy to do what we can to strengthen the other
> parts of this organization.
>
> Respectfully,
> Arielle Silverman
> President, National Association of Blind Students
>
>
>
> On 7/13/09, Antonio M. Guimaraes <iamantonio at cox.net> wrote:
>>         Nejit,
>>
>> You say in your post that those who are angry... have little grounds to
>> feel
>> this way.
>>
>> While I agree that we need to move forward and stay positive, I also see
>> no
>> value in slipping the durt under the rug. Most people present had very
>> valid
>> concerns about the way the meeting and elections, mostly the elections
>> were
>> conducted.
>>
>> First, when the amendment to the constitution was passed, discussion shut
>> off by the president, and people not given a chance to voice their
>> concerns,
>> the entire membership should have been concerned that something was
>> wrong.
>> The meeting would have gone on till god know when and god knows how if
>> one
>> of our members, yours truly, didn't plea for reason, and bring up the
>> constitution matter back to the forthfront, where it belonged.
>>
>> I sought  to run for a board position, and was nominated for treasurer,
>> so
>> that I could have a voice, access to people's ears, and I saw this as the
>> only way to bring up the constitution concern up for debate again. I
>> withdrew my candidacy, and some discussion was had, and the amendment
>> voted
>> on again.
>>
>> The meeting was full of interesting twists, one board member running for
>> a
>> board position clearly on his popularity, and a voice mail message. He
>> wasn't present at the meeting, and a voice message most could not
>> understand
>> was played for the room.
>>
>> People run and win because others like them, so winning on popularity is
>> why
>> people win elections. You are more popular than I am, and so forth. The
>> proof of the value of sheer popularity will be in the results the NABS
>> board
>> can accomplish in the time ahead.
>>
>> Do I not have the right to be at least a little angry when someone gets
>> to a
>> mic, and proceeds to tell the room that
>>
>> she can sense some animocity in the room, she is an elementary school
>> teacher, and we all need to take a little brake, and sit back, relax, and
>> count to 3?
>>
>> I do not know who pulled off that performance, but I tell you this. I did
>> not see, hear, or otherwise detect the presence of a 3-year-old in the
>> room,
>> even when most could agree that many, leaders and meeting attendees acted
>> like one.
>>
>> I don't appreciate being likened to a child, not am I susseptible to any
>> kind of hypnotic techniques.
>>
>> That I don't know who said this goes to tell you that, even in a meeting
>> full of blind people, some neglected to identify themselves by name
>> whether
>> or not they were recognized.
>>
>> I challenge anyone who was at the meeting to tell me they would be proud
>> if
>> the thing had been streamed on the web, or recorded.
>>
>> Not too angry anymore,
>>
>> Sincerely yours,
>>
>> Antonio Guimaraes
>>
>> If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup
>> trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of
>> highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great
>> literary
>> works in Braille.
>>
>> Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you.
>> http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169
>> Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Nijat Worley" <nijat1989 at gmail.com>
>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 6:05 PM
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
>>
>>
>>> Greetings Joseph,
>>>   I believe that there is little doubt about the legitimacy of the
>>> current
>>>
>>> NABS board and the process by which they were elected. Those who are
>>> angry, and those who want to grumble about it, and still those who want
>>> to
>>>
>>> take action about it, have little ground to do so. Besides, what kind of
>>> action would be appropriate at this point? The former board and Terri
>>> did
>>> their best to make sure that the elections were fair. They did almost
>>> every vote by a hand count at your request. I am utterly surprised that
>>> you are still dissatisfied about the outcome of the elections. I
>>> understand there were some mistakes made in the election process, and
>>> the
>>> board has made note of them. We will take proper action to make sure
>>> that
>>> those mistakes don't happen again. I do agree with you that to try to do
>>> anything  that might divide the organization at this point would only
>>> counter your intentions. NABS is an ever changing and evolving
>>> organization simply because of the fact that many of its members both on
>>> the board and off the board come and go so quickly. Nobody stays in NABS
>>> forever. We are all new to this organization, and we all make mistakes.
>>> I
>>> appreciate you expressing your concerns and telling folks to stay
>>> united,
>>> because only united, can we make change and strengthen this organization
>>> for the benefit of all. I always tell our members both at the state and
>>> national level that one does not have to be on the board to help out the
>>> organization and to be a leader. I think Arielle intends to get
>>> everybody
>>> involved in the development and growth of NABS. I am very pleased to say
>>> that I saw many of you at the Monty Carlo night helping us put it
>>> together
>>>
>>> and wrap it up at the end. We couldn't have done it without you. Thanks
>>> to
>>>
>>> B. J. Sexton, Caron Anderson, Willie Black, Jim, Jedi, and many others
>>> for
>>>
>>> staying and helping with Monty Carlo Night. Let us put behind us any
>>> hard
>>> feelings that may be in our chests and move on to bigger and better
>>> things
>>>
>>> for the sake of NABS if for nothing else.
>>>   At your service,
>>>   Nijat
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "T. Joseph Carter" <carter.tjoseph at gmail.com>
>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 12:36 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
>>>
>>>
>>>> Arielle and all of NABS,
>>>>
>>>> I've heard more than a few rumblings about it already, and I am not
>>>> sure
>>>> the board should try to address them:  The NABS election was a complete
>>>> and total fiasco lacking even the appearance of integrity.  A number of
>>>> people are really unhappy about it, and some are talking about taking
>>>> action.
>>>>
>>>> I feel a need to say, "Don't do it, please."  I know some of you to be
>>>> good students and good advocates both fro this organization and for the
>>>> blind in general.  If those of you I don't know are of the same
>>>> caliber,
>>>> then you may turn fiasco into tragedy.  Think about the possible
>>>> outcomes
>>>>
>>>> first.
>>>>
>>>> Either you will find widespread support, or you will not.  If the
>>>> latter,
>>>>
>>>> you face marginalization and feelings of disenfranchisement greater
>>>> than
>>>> you already feel.  That will drive you away from the organization for
>>>> certain.  Perhaps I am being a bit selfish here, but NABS and the NFB
>>>> need _you_, and I'd rather not have you fall away over something as
>>>> transitory as a single problematic election.
>>>>
>>>> If you do garner widespread support, the tragedy will be larger still:
>>>> The organization would faction into those who support the incoming
>>>> board
>>>> and those who oppose the process that elected them, with a lot of
>>>> people
>>>> who want to do both feeling caught in the middle.  There's no faster
>>>> way
>>>> to ensure more controversial elections than to go down this road.
>>>>
>>>> So .. what do you do?  I made my decision before the election was even
>>>> over: I'm going to support the incoming board, and I'm going to
>>>> encourage
>>>>
>>>> (read: make a pain in the rear end of myself) the board to act boldly
>>>> and
>>>>
>>>> with integrity on behalf of blind students.
>>>>
>>>> I also intend to similarly encourage (read the same way) that only
>>>> registered members vote, and that each registrant gets one vote.  I
>>>> can't
>>>>
>>>> claim to have a simple and brilliant solution here yet because I can't
>>>> figure out how to handle runoff elections quickly and cleanly yet.  The
>>>> curious know my email address.  *smile*
>>>>
>>>> Joseph
>>>>
>>>> P.S. I considered suggesting the Condorcet method, but I decided not to
>>>> propose anything that required calculating a square root to figure out
>>>> who wins the election.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nijat1989%40gmail.com
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
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>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com
>>
>
>
> -- 
> Arielle Silverman
> President, National Association of Blind Students
> Phone:  602-502-2255
> Email:
> nabs.president at gmail.com
> Website:
> www.nabslink.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
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>

____________________________________________________________
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From graduate56 at juno.com  Tue Jul 14 20:45:57 2009
From: graduate56 at juno.com (Melissa Green)
Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 14:45:57 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
References: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com><20090711183617.GF39692@yumi.bluecherry.net><1432A6F9C7BD43A18ECECA1C8F178155@thedjdinvasion><20090712001023.GH39692@yumi.bluecherry.net>
	<85ff10070907111928xcce0313od29a9372471b3eee@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <807587E4B1A9454F9628C8B5D80A18FD@melissa>

Arielle.
Those are really good points and questions that you have posed.

Melissa Green
Limitations live only in our minds. But if we use our imaginations, our
possibilities become limitless
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Arielle Silverman" <nabs.president at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 8:28 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update


Dear Joseph and all:

I am aware that some of  our members were disappointed in the way
that elections and the passing of a constitutional amendment were
handled at the NABS business meeting. While in the end all procedures
were followed according to proper NABS protocol, there was some
confusion initially among those running the election about how to
handle these issues. I’d like to apologize personally for this and as
NABS president I will make every effort to ensure that future
elections are followed according to proper procedure. The good thing
about making mistakes is that once they are made and recognized, care
can be taken to keep them from happening again.

It’s important to keep two things in mind when contemplating the
elections. The first is that this is not the first time these issues
have come up in NABS. For years we have been debating about how to
count votes. This is the first time we required voters to display a
card proving paid member status when voting. In the past we used
standing votes and trusted that all voters were paid members. This
policy led to its own set of complaints and chaos which is why we
switched to the vote cards. Using the vote cards was an experiment,
and if the members feel it was a mistake, we won’t do it again.
Similarly, we have frequently had long elections with several people
running for each position. There has been much debate about whether or
not NABS should appoint a nominating committee. That is still an open
question, and one I’d like the membership to think about before we
make a decision. So, these are tricky issues with no easy answers and
ones we’ve been struggling with for years.

The second point I’d like to make is that our constitution is very
vague. It doesn’t tell us how to count votes. It only specifies that a
candidate needs a majority of the votes to win, and that if no
candidate gets a majority, the one with the least votes is dropped.
So, again, a lot of this is open to debate and there is no one way to
fix it.

Before our next election I’d like to have a couple of focus groups
with NABS members about the best and fairest way to handle
vote-counting, etc. For those of you who were feeling disappointed,
I’d ask you to cease “grumbiling” and instead come to me with clear
suggestions for improvement. What specifically did you find
problematic? If you were the one running things how would you have
done it differently? We can’t take everyone’s suggestions, of course,
but we need concrete feedback in order to make changes. Though I can’t
speak for anyone else, as NABS president I would never want to “quiet
dissent”. Those of you who knew me in the early days of my NFB
involvement know that I frequently asked questions and expressed
opinions contrary to the so-called NFB party line. I do, however, ask
that complaints and suggestions be voiced respectfully and that they
be specific to what you thought was wrong or unfair. Just saying “it
was chaos” doesn’t help us figure out how to make things better in the
future. If you were disappointed, I also hope that you can still work
with us and move forward. Elections only happen once a year, but the
mentoring and collective action that happens in NABS happens all year
long.

Finally, I will say this: Whatever procedure we decide to use for
conducting the election and counting votes, when I run the next NABS
election I’ll be sure to spell out the procedures ahead of time before
we start the election, and I will also make sure the vote counters
have been chosen and instructed prior to the election. I suspect a lot
of the trouble came from the fact that people didn’t know what to
expect and that some of the rules changed throughout the course of the
election. Again, I apologize for this and I can say with certainty
that this won’t happen again.

P.S. For your reference: The NABS constitution (not yet amended) is
attached.

On 7/12/09, T. Joseph Carter <carter.tjoseph at gmail.com> wrote:
> David,
>
> I did not.  If I had, I'd be in the same position as the incoming
> board right now—if they speak on the issue, it looks like they're
> trying to quiet dissent.  An outsider is the only one who can do it
> under the circumstances.
>
> If anyone ought to be crying foul about the election, it probably
> ought to be me, for multiple reasons.  And yet that's exactly why I
> need to be the first to say that it's time to move on.  We have a new
> board, and they cannot be faulted.
>
> The only responsibility the incoming board has is to do better.
>
> Joseph
>
>
> On Sat, Jul 11, 2009 at 02:10:04PM -0500, David Dunphy wrote:
>> Did you win any board positions Joseph?
>>
>> *****
>> If you're tired of hearing the same old songs on your local radio
>> station, and if you can't find the variety you've always wanted, then
>> check out the station that I own and operate with a great group of
>> broadcasters called Radio360. You'll hear all types of music and
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>> interaction with the djs, and more!
>> To find out more about the station, visit us on the web at
>> http://www.radio360.us
>> Follow us on twitter at
>> http://www.twitter.com/radio360usa
>> or add us to your MySpace at
>> http://www.myspace.com/radio360usa
>> Come check us out, you won't be disappointed!!!
>
> _______________________________________________
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> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
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> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
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>


-- 
Arielle Silverman
President, National Association of Blind Students
Phone:  602-502-2255
Email:
nabs.president at gmail.com
Website:
www.nabslink.org



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


> _______________________________________________
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> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
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From graduate56 at juno.com  Tue Jul 14 23:25:26 2009
From: graduate56 at juno.com (Melissa Green)
Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 17:25:26 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Cabs mentoring program
Message-ID: <AF5C440EC4794BD0AF89DCC052F471C6@melissa>

I sent this message out before convention.
So here it is again.
Please post on relevant websites.  Feel free to distribute to other lists and interested parties.


The Colorado association of blind students

CABS

Is looking for a few good men and women to become Mentors for young blind students.  

Mentors should be:

Legally blind;

High school graduate

Reside, attend school, or training in the state of Colorado 

Interested in working with blind youth or young adults

Attend mentor training sessions and other related activities

Communicate with both the mentee and other mentors 

Good listener

Encouraging 

Supportive

Patient 

Flexible

Dependable

Committed

Possess a positive attitude about blindness

Demonstrate good blindness skills 

and, be:

Tolerant and respectful of individual differences

If you are interested in becoming a mentor and influencing the lives of blind students.  Complete the application below. 

Submit completed application by August 3.

Email completed applications to the following address.  

Melissa Green

Graduate56 at juno.com

P.S.
The application is also attached.

 


Cabs Mentor application

 

Name:

Address:

Home Phone:

School Phone:

Cell Phone:

Email address:

What is your course of study in school?

List your hobbies, and interests.

Why do you want to be a mentor for blind students?

Have you ever been a mentor?

Have you ever had a mentor or mentors in your life?  if so, how would you describe their impact on your life?

Do you have any mentors in your life right now?

What do you believe the role of a mentor is?

Do you understand the commitment that being a mentor requires?

Do you believe that you can make this commitment?

Do you have volunteer/ work experience?

Do you have experience working with blind children or youth?

Cordially, 
Melissa
"A dream is your creative vision for your life in the future. You must break out of your current comfort zone and become comfortable with the unfamiliar and the unknown."
____________________________________________________________
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-------------- next part --------------
The Colorado association of blind students
CABS
Is looking for a few good men and women to become Mentors for young blind students.  
Mentors should be:
Legally blind;
High school graduate
Reside, attend school, or training in the state of Colorado 
Interested in working with blind youth or young adults
Attend mentor training sessions and other related activities
Communicate with both the mentee and other mentors 
Good listener
Encouraging 
Supportive
Patient 
Flexible
Dependable
Committed
Possess a positive attitude about blindness
Demonstrate good blindness skills 
and, be:
Tolerant and respectful of individual differences
If you are interested in becoming a mentor and influencing the lives of blind students.  Complete the application below.
Submit completed application by August 3.
Email completed applications to the following address.  
Melissa Green
Graduate56 at juno.com

Cabs Mentor application

Name:
Address:
Home Phone:
School Phone:
Cell Phone:
Email address:
What is your course of study in school?
List your hobbies, and interests.
Why do you want to be a mentor for blind students?
Have you ever been a mentor?
Have you ever had a mentor or mentors in your life?  if so, how would you describe their impact on your life?
Do you have any mentors in your life right now?
What do you believe the role of a mentor is?
Do you understand the commitment that being a mentor requires?
Do you believe that you can make this commitment?
Do you have volunteer/ work experience?
Do you have experience working with blind children or youth?

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From merisa.musemic at gmail.com  Wed Jul 15 00:01:01 2009
From: merisa.musemic at gmail.com (Merisa Musemic)
Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 20:01:01 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief
In-Reply-To: <8CBD2B57C37189E-988-1085@MBLK-M01.sysops.aol.com>
References: <8CBD2B57C37189E-988-1085@MBLK-M01.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <df5bac6d0907141701w99bdd7ag99072c2f2d949def@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Darian! This is Merisa one of the rookies. I enjoyed this year's
convention. I lived in one of the suburbs of Detroit , so I commuted
to the hotel. UnforI wished I had joined the NFB earlier.
Unfortunately, I was missinformed about the NFB. I was told that the
NFB is that radical organization with zelous members. First of all,
I'm glad to have learned about the NFB. I love the fact, that this
organization advocates for braille literacy among the blind, as well
as numerous other thing that the NFB is advocating for. I joined the
NFB last January and I'm proud to be a federationist.
Merisa
On 7/14/09, Darian Smith <ds94124 at aol.com> wrote:
> Hey all,
>   What a convention, huh? I actually don't know if this has taken place
> yet, but I am interested to hear people's thoughts on convention.  I
> would like to hear about what Highlights people took from this
> convention an, and  if you are a "rookie" what your first impressions
> were of this year's  installment of the grand event.
>  Would you do it again, "Rookies"?
>
>  have an  awsome day!
>  Darian
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/merisa.musemic%40gmail.com
>


From corbbo at gmail.com  Wed Jul 15 01:22:51 2009
From: corbbo at gmail.com (Corbb O'Connor)
Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 21:22:51 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <07a001ca04b6$7292c220$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn>
References: <20090713012109.2732.51348@web3.serotek.com>
	<07a001ca04b6$7292c220$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn>
Message-ID: <E164113D-2601-41C3-BC15-171485CA260C@gmail.com>

Peter,

I have a different idea on one of your foundational asserations. You  
say that voice votes and hand counts work well at the state at  
national level. Voice votes do not work, as was seen during the  
Freeman/Sayer election of 2009. To resolve that election, delegations  
were given one vote each. Those votes were then tallied to settle the  
election. As Jeannie Massay proposed, NABS ought adopt delegation  
voting. If, after a voice vote, no candidate appears to have received  
a majority of the votes, each state whose delegate or alternate is in  
the room would have one vote each. That would be accountable,  
equitable, and decorous.

Oh, and by the way, that's a system that could be run completely by  
blind people without sighted assistance.

Corbb

On Jul 14, 2009, at 3:08 PM, Peter Donahue wrote:

Good afternoon everyone,

        Having personally witnessed and reading many of the posts  
concerning
the NABS Election all I can say is whoosh!!

    The first question I'm inclined to ask is Why reinvent the wheel? 
Voice
votes and hand counts work extremely well in chapter and division  
meetings,
state and national convention general sessions. Make them work for  
NABS. The
above methods work fine for tallying votes in these gatherings so why  
not
keep things simple when there is so much more to be done instead of  
spending
valuable time fighting over election procedures?Sticking with the  
tried and
true is far better than using election methods, (Showing cards and  
creating
paper trails) that are cumbersome, and slow down the election process.  
I've
heard elections in a few states where similar methods have been  
employed and
observed what happened. For God sakes stay with the tried and true and  
get
on with the business of bettering the lives of blind students!

    Much was made over the fact that persons were voting that hadn't
registered. Does such paranoia occur during the elections held during  
our
general sessions? What happened to trust? I have yet to walk in to a  
state
or national convention general session where attendees were asked to  
show
cards when voting to show proof of registration. I thought that's why  
we are
encouraged to wear our name tags to be identified as registered  
convention
attendees?This method has worked for many, many years so why reinvent  
it?
The old adage, "If it's not broke don't fix it" need to apply to the  
NABS
elections.

    Just my observations from a former student division member and a  
very
tired sound tech technician  who has replayed these elections several  
times
over. All the best for a great year ahead and please let's get on with  
the
business of improving education opportunities for blind students.

Peter Donahue



   ----- Original Message -----
From: "Jedi" <loneblindjedi at samobile.net>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2009 8:21 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update


Listers:

As far as vote counting goes, I'd really like to see a method that can
be run completely by blind people since we're a blindness organization.
In most cases, voice voting works well enough provided that the
membership is mature enough to use it correctly. I'd be willing to use
a balloting system if it can be handled efficiently.

Respectfully,
Jedi


Original message:
> Hi Joseph and all,

>        While this was explained at the meeting, I’ll reiterate for  
> those
> who
> weren’t at convention. The voice vote, in which people say “I” if they
> support a particular candidate, is used only as a preliminary voting
> method. The voice vote determines the election outcome only when one
> candidate receives an overwhelming majority of the vote. If the voice
> vote sounds at all inconclusive, the election leader will call for a
> hand count and the candidate receiving more than half of the votes
> wins. Even if the election leader believes the voice vote is
> conclusive, a candidate who disagrees can always call for a hand
> count. We have these protections in place to prevent races from being
> decided by “which group screams the loudest”. Any candidate who
> garners a significant amount of support will receive enough “I’s” to
> render a hand count necessary, and again, the candidate always has the
> right to ask for a hand count regardless of what the election leader
> decides. In fact, last weekend, almost every contest was ultimately
> decided by a hand count, even though we started off with a voice vote.

>        You are right that the NABS constitution says nothing about  
> voice
> voting. I need to find out if there is a national policy that
> overrides our constitution, making voice voting necessary. There are
> definite advantages and disadvantages to starting off with a voice
> vote before preceding to a hand count.

> Arielle Silverman
> President, National Association of Blind Students


> On 7/13/09, Jedi <loneblindjedi at samobile.net> wrote:
>> Joseph and all:

>> I was present at the election and even made a go for an office or  
>> two.
>> In my opinion, the election did have integrity simply because those
>> running it tried to make it as fair as they knew how. Elections are
>> tough especially if you've never run one before. I rmember trying to
>> arrange Washington State's constitution. Arielle was there. Arielle
>> well remembers how chaotic that was and how unhappy some folks were.
>> Hell, some members even got upset because they said the presence of  
>> Dr.
>> maurer swayed the vote over whether or not we should vote members  
>> into
>> our organization or just let them in once they've paid their dues. In
>> fact, didn't we have to redo that one twice just to make everyone
>> happy? I remember that day and how stressed everyone was. This last
>> election at the national level reminds me of that chaos.

>> I guess the reality is that there will always be those who wished the
>> election happened in their favor. Take, for example, all those who
>> grumbled when Barack Obama won this last year's U.S. presidency. And
>> don't forget the fiasco over Bush vs. Gore in 2001. In other words,  
>> our
>> craziness last Saturday isn't unique to NABS, the NFB, or to blind
>> guys. It's just what happens sometimes. But as Arielle said, there  
>> are
>> ways we can curb the craziness a bit. I have also given some  
>> thought to
>> how we might smooth the process for future NABS participants and  
>> their
>> officers. And like you, joseph, i'm trying to work it out in my own
>> mind. Having focus groups is a great idea, and I hope to be  
>> informed as
>> to when they occur.

>> Respectfully,
>> Jedi
>> Original message:
>>> Nijat,

>>> One look at the vote counts—so conveniently all multiples of
>>> ten—calls their accuracy into question.  That students in the room
>>> report different counts isn't surprising, until you note that their
>>> reports indicate higher counts for losers than were reported to us  
>>> in
>>> a few races, including your runoff, actually.

>>> Personally, I decided not to participate after that point.  We don't
>>> have 100% agreement on the counts, but there's enough discrepancy
>>> often enough to call the whole thing into question.  I'm not  
>>> saying I
>>> won any of those elections, but I am saying I'm not quite sure in a
>>> few cases who should have.  I am honestly not sure how many people
>>> were getting involved trying to do something about it, but there was
>>> more than three or four.

>>> There are only two things I am sure of: First, no good is likely to
>>> come of any effort that group might make.  Second, a member of the
>>> board telling us not to worry our pretty little heads ... just isn't
>>> going to make things better.  Both sound disastrous to me.

>>> This isn't about who did or did not win an election.  It's about the
>>> membership of this organization believing a real election actually
>>> took place.  If even a significant minority doubt that, then it is
>>> bad for NABS, even if you assume every one of them will age-out of
>>> NABS in a few years.  We reflect the NFB as a whole, and we should
>>> reflect it well.

>>> I serve the organization, not the board.  I will yet see two boards
>>> serve while I remain a student.  It is in the organization's  
>>> interest
>>> to make sure what we saw last Saturday does not happen again.  I  
>>> have
>>> a solution, but it's not a complete solution yet.  It does result in
>>> a paper trail, or at least a box full of index cards.  Still working
>>> out how to handle runoff elections.

>>> Joseph


>>> On Sat, Jul 11, 2009 at 04:05:04PM -0600, Nijat Worley wrote:
>>>> Greetings Joseph,
>>>>  I believe that there is little doubt about the legitimacy of the
>>>> current NABS board and the process by which they were elected.  
>>>> Those
>>>> who
>>>> are angry, and those who want to grumble about it, and still  
>>>> those who
>>>> want to take action about it, have little ground to do so. Besides,
>>>> what
>>>> kind of action would be appropriate at this point? The former  
>>>> board and
>>>> Terri did their best to make sure that the elections were fair.  
>>>> They
>>>> did
>>>> almost every vote by a hand count at your request. I am utterly
>>>> surprised
>>>> that you are still dissatisfied about the outcome of the  
>>>> elections. I
>>>> understand there were some mistakes made in the election process,  
>>>> and
>>>> the
>>>> board has made note of them. We will take proper action to make  
>>>> sure
>>>> that
>>>> those mistakes don't happen again. I do agree with you that to  
>>>> try to
>>>> do
>>>> anything  that might divide the organization at this point would  
>>>> only
>>>> counter your intentions. NABS is an ever changing and evolving
>>>> organization simply because of the fact that many of its members  
>>>> both
>>>> on
>>>> the board and off the board come and go so quickly. Nobody stays in
>>>> NABS
>>>> forever. We are all new to this organization, and we all make  
>>>> mistakes.
>>>> I
>>>> appreciate you expressing your concerns and telling folks to stay
>>>> united,
>>>> because only united, can we make change and strengthen this
>>>> organization
>>>> for the benefit of all. I always tell our members both at the  
>>>> state and
>>>> national level that one does not have to be on the board to help  
>>>> out
>>>> the
>>>> organization and to be a leader. I think Arielle intends to get
>>>> everybody
>>>> involved in the development and growth of NABS. I am very pleased  
>>>> to
>>>> say
>>>> that I saw many of you at the Monty Carlo night helping us put it
>>>> together and wrap it up at the end. We couldn't have done it  
>>>> without
>>>> you.
>>>> Thanks to B. J. Sexton, Caron Anderson, Willie Black, Jim, Jedi,  
>>>> and
>>>> many
>>>> others for staying and helping with Monty Carlo Night. Let us put
>>>> behind
>>>> us any hard feelings that may be in our chests and move on to  
>>>> bigger
>>>> and
>>>> better things for the sake of NABS if for nothing else.
>>>>  At your service,
>>>>  Nijat

>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info  
>>> for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net

>> --
>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.  Visit
>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.
>> _______________________________________________
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>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com



> --
> Arielle Silverman
> President, National Association of Blind Students
> Phone:  602-502-2255
> Email:
> nabs.president at gmail.com
> Website:
> www.nabslink.org

> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net

-- 
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www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.
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From serenacucco at verizon.net  Wed Jul 15 01:50:00 2009
From: serenacucco at verizon.net (Serena)
Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 21:50:00 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief
References: <8CBD2B57C37189E-988-1085@MBLK-M01.sysops.aol.com>
	<df5bac6d0907141701w99bdd7ag99072c2f2d949def@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <004601ca04ee$910aeba0$0201a8c0@Serene>

Way to go, Marisa!

Serena


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Merisa Musemic" <merisa.musemic at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 8:01 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief


> Hi Darian! This is Merisa one of the rookies. I enjoyed this year's
> convention. I lived in one of the suburbs of Detroit , so I commuted
> to the hotel. UnforI wished I had joined the NFB earlier.
> Unfortunately, I was missinformed about the NFB. I was told that the
> NFB is that radical organization with zelous members. First of all,
> I'm glad to have learned about the NFB. I love the fact, that this
> organization advocates for braille literacy among the blind, as well
> as numerous other thing that the NFB is advocating for. I joined the
> NFB last January and I'm proud to be a federationist.
> Merisa
> On 7/14/09, Darian Smith <ds94124 at aol.com> wrote:
>> Hey all,
>>   What a convention, huh? I actually don't know if this has taken place
>> yet, but I am interested to hear people's thoughts on convention.  I
>> would like to hear about what Highlights people took from this
>> convention an, and  if you are a "rookie" what your first impressions
>> were of this year's  installment of the grand event.
>>  Would you do it again, "Rookies"?
>>
>>  have an  awsome day!
>>  Darian
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/merisa.musemic%40gmail.com
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizon.net 



From marty.rahn at juno.com  Wed Jul 15 04:07:17 2009
From: marty.rahn at juno.com (Marty Rahn)
Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 22:07:17 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief
References: <8CBD2B57C37189E-988-1085@MBLK-M01.sysops.aol.com>
	<df5bac6d0907141701w99bdd7ag99072c2f2d949def@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <D16FB03D163D4979B5382C86EF7017E6@MRAHN>

Merisa,
I'm very glad to hear that you have finally learned the truth about the NFB. 
There is nothing more detramental to the blindness movement than people who 
continue to be misinformed and to propigate false information...  Congrats 
on becoming a Proud Federationist!
Sincerely,
Marty Rahn,
President, colorado Association of Blind Students
Proud Leader Dog Graduate with Monty... Class 0812

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Merisa Musemic" <merisa.musemic at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 6:01 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief


> Hi Darian! This is Merisa one of the rookies. I enjoyed this year's
> convention. I lived in one of the suburbs of Detroit , so I commuted
> to the hotel. UnforI wished I had joined the NFB earlier.
> Unfortunately, I was missinformed about the NFB. I was told that the
> NFB is that radical organization with zelous members. First of all,
> I'm glad to have learned about the NFB. I love the fact, that this
> organization advocates for braille literacy among the blind, as well
> as numerous other thing that the NFB is advocating for. I joined the
> NFB last January and I'm proud to be a federationist.
> Merisa
> On 7/14/09, Darian Smith <ds94124 at aol.com> wrote:
>> Hey all,
>>   What a convention, huh? I actually don't know if this has taken place
>> yet, but I am interested to hear people's thoughts on convention.  I
>> would like to hear about what Highlights people took from this
>> convention an, and  if you are a "rookie" what your first impressions
>> were of this year's  installment of the grand event.
>>  Would you do it again, "Rookies"?
>>
>>  have an  awsome day!
>>  Darian
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/merisa.musemic%40gmail.com
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marty.rahn%40juno.com
> 

____________________________________________________________
Digital Photography - Click Now.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/BLSrjpTDvmTrP0FVx8cleorhOV67CZvOvkPa0XdNZfCNjhrWra6JZzFEJuo/


From graduate56 at juno.com  Wed Jul 15 04:57:13 2009
From: graduate56 at juno.com (Melissa Green)
Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 22:57:13 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief
References: <8CBD2B57C37189E-988-1085@MBLK-M01.sysops.aol.com><df5bac6d0907141701w99bdd7ag99072c2f2d949def@mail.gmail.com>
	<D16FB03D163D4979B5382C86EF7017E6@MRAHN>
Message-ID: <88DFF59A66014EBAB7F4125FFF4F6573@melissa>

Good point Marty.
I second everything that you wrote.

Melissa
"A dream is your creative vision for your life in the future. You must break 
out of your current comfort zone and become comfortable with the unfamiliar 
and the unknown."

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Marty Rahn" <marty.rahn at juno.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 10:07 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief


> Merisa,
> I'm very glad to hear that you have finally learned the truth about the 
> NFB. There is nothing more detramental to the blindness movement than 
> people who continue to be misinformed and to propigate false 
> information...  Congrats on becoming a Proud Federationist!
> Sincerely,
> Marty Rahn,
> President, colorado Association of Blind Students
> Proud Leader Dog Graduate with Monty... Class 0812
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Merisa Musemic" <merisa.musemic at gmail.com>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 6:01 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief
>
>
>> Hi Darian! This is Merisa one of the rookies. I enjoyed this year's
>> convention. I lived in one of the suburbs of Detroit , so I commuted
>> to the hotel. UnforI wished I had joined the NFB earlier.
>> Unfortunately, I was missinformed about the NFB. I was told that the
>> NFB is that radical organization with zelous members. First of all,
>> I'm glad to have learned about the NFB. I love the fact, that this
>> organization advocates for braille literacy among the blind, as well
>> as numerous other thing that the NFB is advocating for. I joined the
>> NFB last January and I'm proud to be a federationist.
>> Merisa
>> On 7/14/09, Darian Smith <ds94124 at aol.com> wrote:
>>> Hey all,
>>>   What a convention, huh? I actually don't know if this has taken place
>>> yet, but I am interested to hear people's thoughts on convention.  I
>>> would like to hear about what Highlights people took from this
>>> convention an, and  if you are a "rookie" what your first impressions
>>> were of this year's  installment of the grand event.
>>>  Would you do it again, "Rookies"?
>>>
>>>  have an  awsome day!
>>>  Darian
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/merisa.musemic%40gmail.com
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marty.rahn%40juno.com
>>
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Digital Photography - Click Now.
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From aguimaraes at nbp.org  Wed Jul 15 12:39:49 2009
From: aguimaraes at nbp.org (Antonio Guimaraes)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 08:39:49 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
References: <20090713012109.2732.51348@web3.serotek.com><07a001ca04b6$7292c220$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn>
	<E164113D-2601-41C3-BC15-171485CA260C@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4E1571D031E64BC3A8A43B39C67EDEA7@nbp2.local>

Corbb,

what happens if a state that has no formal NABS presence, but still has 
registered paying voting members to the NABS meeting? Do they then lose the 
opportunity to vote, because there may or may not be a delegate from their 
state?

Do people now sit at NABS meetings by state if we adopt your idea, since a 
delegate may want to vote according to the will of the majority in their 
state? Does the delegate now become effectively the voice of their state, 
thus gaining more power than they really should have, being able to cast the 
one and only vote from their state?

I like the idea. Thanks for putting it out there. I don't see how it would 
work unless we decided to sit alphabetically by state.

If we can't even figure out marsheling to guide people towards the 
preregistered lines before a nabs meeting, I don't see how we can sit by 
state in alphabetical order. Too many letters in the alphabet to keep track 
of, grin.

Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Corbb O'Connor" <corbbo at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 9:22 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update


Peter,

I have a different idea on one of your foundational asserations. You
say that voice votes and hand counts work well at the state at
national level. Voice votes do not work, as was seen during the
Freeman/Sayer election of 2009. To resolve that election, delegations
were given one vote each. Those votes were then tallied to settle the
election. As Jeannie Massay proposed, NABS ought adopt delegation
voting. If, after a voice vote, no candidate appears to have received
a majority of the votes, each state whose delegate or alternate is in
the room would have one vote each. That would be accountable,
equitable, and decorous.

Oh, and by the way, that's a system that could be run completely by
blind people without sighted assistance.

Corbb

On Jul 14, 2009, at 3:08 PM, Peter Donahue wrote:

Good afternoon everyone,

        Having personally witnessed and reading many of the posts
concerning
the NABS Election all I can say is whoosh!!

    The first question I'm inclined to ask is Why reinvent the wheel?
Voice
votes and hand counts work extremely well in chapter and division
meetings,
state and national convention general sessions. Make them work for
NABS. The
above methods work fine for tallying votes in these gatherings so why
not
keep things simple when there is so much more to be done instead of
spending
valuable time fighting over election procedures?Sticking with the
tried and
true is far better than using election methods, (Showing cards and
creating
paper trails) that are cumbersome, and slow down the election process.
I've
heard elections in a few states where similar methods have been
employed and
observed what happened. For God sakes stay with the tried and true and
get
on with the business of bettering the lives of blind students!

    Much was made over the fact that persons were voting that hadn't
registered. Does such paranoia occur during the elections held during
our
general sessions? What happened to trust? I have yet to walk in to a
state
or national convention general session where attendees were asked to
show
cards when voting to show proof of registration. I thought that's why
we are
encouraged to wear our name tags to be identified as registered
convention
attendees?This method has worked for many, many years so why reinvent
it?
The old adage, "If it's not broke don't fix it" need to apply to the
NABS
elections.

    Just my observations from a former student division member and a
very
tired sound tech technician  who has replayed these elections several
times
over. All the best for a great year ahead and please let's get on with
the
business of improving education opportunities for blind students.

Peter Donahue



   ----- Original Message -----
From: "Jedi" <loneblindjedi at samobile.net>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2009 8:21 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update


Listers:

As far as vote counting goes, I'd really like to see a method that can
be run completely by blind people since we're a blindness organization.
In most cases, voice voting works well enough provided that the
membership is mature enough to use it correctly. I'd be willing to use
a balloting system if it can be handled efficiently.

Respectfully,
Jedi


Original message:
> Hi Joseph and all,

>        While this was explained at the meeting, I’ll reiterate for  those
> who
> weren’t at convention. The voice vote, in which people say “I” if they
> support a particular candidate, is used only as a preliminary voting
> method. The voice vote determines the election outcome only when one
> candidate receives an overwhelming majority of the vote. If the voice
> vote sounds at all inconclusive, the election leader will call for a
> hand count and the candidate receiving more than half of the votes
> wins. Even if the election leader believes the voice vote is
> conclusive, a candidate who disagrees can always call for a hand
> count. We have these protections in place to prevent races from being
> decided by “which group screams the loudest”. Any candidate who
> garners a significant amount of support will receive enough “I’s” to
> render a hand count necessary, and again, the candidate always has the
> right to ask for a hand count regardless of what the election leader
> decides. In fact, last weekend, almost every contest was ultimately
> decided by a hand count, even though we started off with a voice vote.

>        You are right that the NABS constitution says nothing about  voice
> voting. I need to find out if there is a national policy that
> overrides our constitution, making voice voting necessary. There are
> definite advantages and disadvantages to starting off with a voice
> vote before preceding to a hand count.

> Arielle Silverman
> President, National Association of Blind Students


> On 7/13/09, Jedi <loneblindjedi at samobile.net> wrote:
>> Joseph and all:

>> I was present at the election and even made a go for an office or  two.
>> In my opinion, the election did have integrity simply because those
>> running it tried to make it as fair as they knew how. Elections are
>> tough especially if you've never run one before. I rmember trying to
>> arrange Washington State's constitution. Arielle was there. Arielle
>> well remembers how chaotic that was and how unhappy some folks were.
>> Hell, some members even got upset because they said the presence of  Dr.
>> maurer swayed the vote over whether or not we should vote members  into
>> our organization or just let them in once they've paid their dues. In
>> fact, didn't we have to redo that one twice just to make everyone
>> happy? I remember that day and how stressed everyone was. This last
>> election at the national level reminds me of that chaos.

>> I guess the reality is that there will always be those who wished the
>> election happened in their favor. Take, for example, all those who
>> grumbled when Barack Obama won this last year's U.S. presidency. And
>> don't forget the fiasco over Bush vs. Gore in 2001. In other words,  our
>> craziness last Saturday isn't unique to NABS, the NFB, or to blind
>> guys. It's just what happens sometimes. But as Arielle said, there  are
>> ways we can curb the craziness a bit. I have also given some  thought to
>> how we might smooth the process for future NABS participants and  their
>> officers. And like you, joseph, i'm trying to work it out in my own
>> mind. Having focus groups is a great idea, and I hope to be  informed as
>> to when they occur.

>> Respectfully,
>> Jedi
>> Original message:
>>> Nijat,

>>> One look at the vote counts—so conveniently all multiples of
>>> ten—calls their accuracy into question.  That students in the room
>>> report different counts isn't surprising, until you note that their
>>> reports indicate higher counts for losers than were reported to us  in
>>> a few races, including your runoff, actually.

>>> Personally, I decided not to participate after that point.  We don't
>>> have 100% agreement on the counts, but there's enough discrepancy
>>> often enough to call the whole thing into question.  I'm not  saying I
>>> won any of those elections, but I am saying I'm not quite sure in a
>>> few cases who should have.  I am honestly not sure how many people
>>> were getting involved trying to do something about it, but there was
>>> more than three or four.

>>> There are only two things I am sure of: First, no good is likely to
>>> come of any effort that group might make.  Second, a member of the
>>> board telling us not to worry our pretty little heads ... just isn't
>>> going to make things better.  Both sound disastrous to me.

>>> This isn't about who did or did not win an election.  It's about the
>>> membership of this organization believing a real election actually
>>> took place.  If even a significant minority doubt that, then it is
>>> bad for NABS, even if you assume every one of them will age-out of
>>> NABS in a few years.  We reflect the NFB as a whole, and we should
>>> reflect it well.

>>> I serve the organization, not the board.  I will yet see two boards
>>> serve while I remain a student.  It is in the organization's  interest
>>> to make sure what we saw last Saturday does not happen again.  I  have
>>> a solution, but it's not a complete solution yet.  It does result in
>>> a paper trail, or at least a box full of index cards.  Still working
>>> out how to handle runoff elections.

>>> Joseph


>>> On Sat, Jul 11, 2009 at 04:05:04PM -0600, Nijat Worley wrote:
>>>> Greetings Joseph,
>>>>  I believe that there is little doubt about the legitimacy of the
>>>> current NABS board and the process by which they were elected.  Those
>>>> who
>>>> are angry, and those who want to grumble about it, and still  those who
>>>> want to take action about it, have little ground to do so. Besides,
>>>> what
>>>> kind of action would be appropriate at this point? The former  board 
>>>> and
>>>> Terri did their best to make sure that the elections were fair.  They
>>>> did
>>>> almost every vote by a hand count at your request. I am utterly
>>>> surprised
>>>> that you are still dissatisfied about the outcome of the  elections. I
>>>> understand there were some mistakes made in the election process,  and
>>>> the
>>>> board has made note of them. We will take proper action to make  sure
>>>> that
>>>> those mistakes don't happen again. I do agree with you that to  try to
>>>> do
>>>> anything  that might divide the organization at this point would  only
>>>> counter your intentions. NABS is an ever changing and evolving
>>>> organization simply because of the fact that many of its members  both
>>>> on
>>>> the board and off the board come and go so quickly. Nobody stays in
>>>> NABS
>>>> forever. We are all new to this organization, and we all make 
>>>> mistakes.
>>>> I
>>>> appreciate you expressing your concerns and telling folks to stay
>>>> united,
>>>> because only united, can we make change and strengthen this
>>>> organization
>>>> for the benefit of all. I always tell our members both at the  state 
>>>> and
>>>> national level that one does not have to be on the board to help  out
>>>> the
>>>> organization and to be a leader. I think Arielle intends to get
>>>> everybody
>>>> involved in the development and growth of NABS. I am very pleased  to
>>>> say
>>>> that I saw many of you at the Monty Carlo night helping us put it
>>>> together and wrap it up at the end. We couldn't have done it  without
>>>> you.
>>>> Thanks to B. J. Sexton, Caron Anderson, Willie Black, Jim, Jedi,  and
>>>> many
>>>> others for staying and helping with Monty Carlo Night. Let us put
>>>> behind
>>>> us any hard feelings that may be in our chests and move on to  bigger
>>>> and
>>>> better things for the sake of NABS if for nothing else.
>>>>  At your service,
>>>>  Nijat

>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info  for
>>> nabs-l:
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> --
> Arielle Silverman
> President, National Association of Blind Students
> Phone:  602-502-2255
> Email:
> nabs.president at gmail.com
> Website:
> www.nabslink.org

> _______________________________________________
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From brileyp at gmail.com  Wed Jul 15 13:40:11 2009
From: brileyp at gmail.com (Briley Pollard)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 08:40:11 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <4E1571D031E64BC3A8A43B39C67EDEA7@nbp2.local>
References: <20090713012109.2732.51348@web3.serotek.com>
	<07a001ca04b6$7292c220$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn>
	<E164113D-2601-41C3-BC15-171485CA260C@gmail.com>
	<4E1571D031E64BC3A8A43B39C67EDEA7@nbp2.local>
Message-ID: <12790a9a0907150640m17965f2am73d7a5177ca1fad6@mail.gmail.com>

Corbb,

I agree that this is a way for the blind to independantly run an
election, but there is the issue of representation. What insures that
the representative from each state speaks for the majority? I know in
Tn during the bored election in general session, our rep didn't ask us
who we wanted in the position. He picked who he wanted without
consulting the membership. As for sitting with our state, that isn't a
bad idea. Maybe sit with our region? This would probably make things a
little more organized, which is my eternal hope for NABS.

-Briley


From dianefilipe at peoplepc.com  Wed Jul 15 14:32:53 2009
From: dianefilipe at peoplepc.com (Diane)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 08:32:53 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief
In-Reply-To: <D16FB03D163D4979B5382C86EF7017E6@MRAHN>
References: <8CBD2B57C37189E-988-1085@MBLK-M01.sysops.aol.com><df5bac6d0907141701w99bdd7ag99072c2f2d949def@mail.gmail.com>
	<D16FB03D163D4979B5382C86EF7017E6@MRAHN>
Message-ID: <3B68BE669D6C4540B63774809F022935@DianePC>

Yep Marisa,
You'll learn to love us!
it's nice to know that someone is looking out for us!
Diane
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Marty Rahn" <marty.rahn at juno.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 10:07 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief


> Merisa,
> I'm very glad to hear that you have finally learned the truth about the 
> NFB. There is nothing more detramental to the blindness movement than 
> people who continue to be misinformed and to propigate false 
> information...  Congrats on becoming a Proud Federationist!
> Sincerely,
> Marty Rahn,
> President, colorado Association of Blind Students
> Proud Leader Dog Graduate with Monty... Class 0812
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Merisa Musemic" <merisa.musemic at gmail.com>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 6:01 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief
>
>
>> Hi Darian! This is Merisa one of the rookies. I enjoyed this year's
>> convention. I lived in one of the suburbs of Detroit , so I commuted
>> to the hotel. UnforI wished I had joined the NFB earlier.
>> Unfortunately, I was missinformed about the NFB. I was told that the
>> NFB is that radical organization with zelous members. First of all,
>> I'm glad to have learned about the NFB. I love the fact, that this
>> organization advocates for braille literacy among the blind, as well
>> as numerous other thing that the NFB is advocating for. I joined the
>> NFB last January and I'm proud to be a federationist.
>> Merisa
>> On 7/14/09, Darian Smith <ds94124 at aol.com> wrote:
>>> Hey all,
>>>   What a convention, huh? I actually don't know if this has taken place
>>> yet, but I am interested to hear people's thoughts on convention.  I
>>> would like to hear about what Highlights people took from this
>>> convention an, and  if you are a "rookie" what your first impressions
>>> were of this year's  installment of the grand event.
>>>  Would you do it again, "Rookies"?
>>>
>>>  have an  awsome day!
>>>  Darian
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/merisa.musemic%40gmail.com
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
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>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> nabs-l:
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>
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> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/BLSrjpTDvmTrP0FVx8cleorhOV67CZvOvkPa0XdNZfCNjhrWra6JZzFEJuo/
>
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From corbbo at gmail.com  Wed Jul 15 15:25:54 2009
From: corbbo at gmail.com (Corbb O'Connor)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 11:25:54 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <12790a9a0907150640m17965f2am73d7a5177ca1fad6@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20090713012109.2732.51348@web3.serotek.com>
	<07a001ca04b6$7292c220$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn>
	<E164113D-2601-41C3-BC15-171485CA260C@gmail.com>
	<4E1571D031E64BC3A8A43B39C67EDEA7@nbp2.local>
	<12790a9a0907150640m17965f2am73d7a5177ca1fad6@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4ed9a39a0907150825n1cd8d6eelce1ead92960501f2@mail.gmail.com>

Thank you for your comments on the idea of delegation voting. One
misconception that is worth righting: most state presidents will agree that
the delegate's vote is NOT intended to be democratically chosen. As one
state president told me after the Freeman/Sayer election, the delegates on
the convention floor have more inside knowledge than the general membership.
State presidents -- in the NFB and in NABS -- are chosen because of their
leadership, past experience, and beliefs on what is best for the division.
It therefore makes sense that their vote have more influence in a runoff
election. As for what ensures that each state has a voice at the NABS
meeting, this is easier than you might think. Before convention, state
presidents send in the names of their state's delegate and alternate who
will be in attendance at the NABS meeting. That list is assembled, and those
people are called on if there is a runoff election at the NABS business
meeting. Would sitting by state require some work? Probably. Is it
essential? Not really. If a state president wanted to do a quick vote within
their delegation before voting, a simple: "Those of you from New Jersey, who
favors...and who favors..." with a voice vote would do the trick. Of course
that requires that decorum at NABS meetings be improved from what we saw
this year.

Corbb
President, Virginia Students Division

On Wed, Jul 15, 2009 at 9:40 AM, Briley Pollard <brileyp at gmail.com> wrote:

> Corbb,
>
> I agree that this is a way for the blind to independantly run an
> election, but there is the issue of representation. What insures that
> the representative from each state speaks for the majority? I know in
> Tn during the bored election in general session, our rep didn't ask us
> who we wanted in the position. He picked who he wanted without
> consulting the membership. As for sitting with our state, that isn't a
> bad idea. Maybe sit with our region? This would probably make things a
> little more organized, which is my eternal hope for NABS.
>
> -Briley
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/corbbo%40gmail.com
>

From riss287 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 15 17:32:59 2009
From: riss287 at yahoo.com (Marissa Slaughter)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 10:32:59 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [nabs-l] nabs-l Digest, Vol 33, Issue 12
In-Reply-To: <mailman.18.1247677202.25592.nabs-l_nfbnet.org@nfbnet.org>
Message-ID: <823104.23951.qm@web32604.mail.mud.yahoo.com>


Although I agree that having a state delegate would provide for a more organized and decorous NABS election, I believe that sitting with ones state would be essential. Granted, if the delegate did not wish to ask the opinion of the other members of her or his state, there would be no reason to sit with that group. However, if a delegate were interested in the opinions of the other members, the way to ensure that those opinions were heard would be to sit according to states. I agree that it would be simple to ask, "Who is in favor of...", but sitting by states would be essential for that to work. 

Furthermore, I am personally not in favor of state delegates because I believe that each person's figurative voice should be heard. Majority would rule with a state delegate system, but we all know that sometimes the majority does not take into consideration the views, thoughts, or feelings of the minority. On the other hand, I do understand the merits of a state delegates system, especially considering the problems we had at this past meeting. 

Marissa


------------------------------

Message: 15
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 11:25:54 -0400
From: "Corbb O'Connor" <corbbo at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
    <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Message-ID:
    <4ed9a39a0907150825n1cd8d6eelce1ead92960501f2 at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

Thank you for your comments on the idea of delegation voting. One
misconception that is worth righting: most state presidents will agree that
the delegate's vote is NOT intended to be democratically chosen. As one
state president told me after the Freeman/Sayer election, the delegates on
the convention floor have more inside knowledge than the general membership.
State presidents -- in the NFB and in NABS -- are chosen because of their
leadership, past experience, and beliefs on what is best for the division.
It therefore makes sense that their vote have more influence in a runoff
election. As for what ensures that each state has a voice at the NABS
meeting, this is easier than you might think. Before convention, state
presidents send in the names of their state's delegate and alternate who
will be in attendance at the NABS meeting. That list is assembled, and those
people are called on if there is a runoff election at the NABS business
meeting. Would sitting by state require some work? Probably. Is it
essential? Not really. If a state president wanted to do a quick vote within
their delegation before voting, a simple: "Those of you from New Jersey, who
favors...and who favors..." with a voice vote would do the trick. Of course
that requires that decorum at NABS meetings be improved from what we saw
this year.

Corbb
President, Virginia Students Division

On Wed, Jul 15, 2009 at 9:40 AM, Briley Pollard <brileyp at gmail.com> wrote:

> Corbb,
>
> I agree that this is a way for the blind to independantly run an
> election, but there is the issue of representation. What insures that
> the representative from each state speaks for the majority? I know in
> Tn during the bored election in general session, our rep didn't ask us
> who we wanted in the position. He picked who he wanted without
> consulting the membership. As for sitting with our state, that isn't a
> bad idea. Maybe sit with our region? This would probably make things a
> little more organized, which is my eternal hope for NABS.
>
> -Briley
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/corbbo%40gmail.com
>


------------------------------

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nabs-l at nfbnet.org
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End of nabs-l Digest, Vol 33, Issue 12
**************************************



      

From brownbears at mchsi.com  Wed Jul 15 18:03:19 2009
From: brownbears at mchsi.com (Miranda brown)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 13:03:19 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Victor Reader Stream
Message-ID: <B40C8B60AC004103A84E20E2D0714E59@MIRANDA>

Hi,
 
My victor reader stream will not turn on, I tried the hard reset and that
did not work.  Any suggestions? I have only had it for about a month. 
 
Miranda 
 

From nijat1989 at gmail.com  Wed Jul 15 19:25:29 2009
From: nijat1989 at gmail.com (Nijat Worley)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 19:25:29 -0000
Subject: [nabs-l] Victor Reader Stream
References: <B40C8B60AC004103A84E20E2D0714E59@MIRANDA>
Message-ID: <BDC461F4455D4FDDACCF6727840D2D9A@Nijatash>

Take out the battery and wait for about thirty seconds, and then replace it. 
If that doesn't fix it, then I don't know what is wrong with it.
   Nijat

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Miranda brown" <brownbears at mchsi.com>
To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, July 15, 2009 12:03 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] Victor Reader Stream


> Hi,
>
> My victor reader stream will not turn on, I tried the hard reset and that
> did not work.  Any suggestions? I have only had it for about a month.
>
> Miranda
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nijat1989%40gmail.com 



From lizmohnke at hotmail.com  Wed Jul 15 19:46:22 2009
From: lizmohnke at hotmail.com (Elizabeth)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 15:46:22 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <4ed9a39a0907150825n1cd8d6eelce1ead92960501f2@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20090713012109.2732.51348@web3.serotek.com>
	<07a001ca04b6$7292c220$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn>
	<E164113D-2601-41C3-BC15-171485CA260C@gmail.com>
	<4E1571D031E64BC3A8A43B39C67EDEA7@nbp2.local>
	<12790a9a0907150640m17965f2am73d7a5177ca1fad6@mail.gmail.com> 
	<4ed9a39a0907150825n1cd8d6eelce1ead92960501f2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <COL118-W4629FBF1DB72EB02E2D1B3BA200@phx.gbl>


Hello List,
 
Perhaps I am wrong, but isn’t the purpose of having a state delegate suppose to be a representation of the opinion of the affiliate they are representing? It is sad that not all affiliates poll the members present as a way to decide how to vote in a stand off election. I know that is what we do in our state, and it is disappointing to hear that not all state delegates vote for the majority opinion of their affiliate.
 
Although this system appears to work well for the general assembly for national convention, I am not in favor of seeing this system being adopted by the student division. I believe sitting by delegation would only be distracting for those who are in charge of organizing the meeting. I would rather see the leadership of the division concentrate on holding an effective meeting rather than be bogged down by focusing on seating arrangements. With convention as busy and hectic as it is, why add something else to it that really isn’t necessary?
 
Even if you were to adopt a delegation system, there is no guarantee that everyone would sit in their assigned delegation. I’ve noticed that the student division is sometimes prone to form cliques, and I would be concerned about how these exclusive groups would affect the results of the election. If such a clique existed within a state delegation, then how would the voice of someone who is not a part of this exclusive group be heard? I understand these kinds of groups exist at all stages of life, but I think they are more common and more exclusive within the age group that makes up the majority of the student division.
 
It seems to me that the most important thing in holding elections is organization, and from what I’ve heard, it appears as though it was lacking a bit this year. I applaud the present leadership step up and admit some things that went wrong and the willingness to learn from these mistakes so they do not happen again in the future.
 
Elizabeth
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live™: Keep your life in sync. 
http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009

From brownbears at mchsi.com  Wed Jul 15 21:27:50 2009
From: brownbears at mchsi.com (Miranda brown)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 16:27:50 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Victor Reader Stream
In-Reply-To: <BDC461F4455D4FDDACCF6727840D2D9A@Nijatash>
References: <B40C8B60AC004103A84E20E2D0714E59@MIRANDA>
	<BDC461F4455D4FDDACCF6727840D2D9A@Nijatash>
Message-ID: <9120E330CE3148ABA575EDFF3EAB7B86@MIRANDA>

Yes, I already tried taking out the battery.  

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Nijat Worley
Sent: Wednesday, April 29, 2009 2:22 AM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Victor Reader Stream

Take out the battery and wait for about thirty seconds, and then replace it.

If that doesn't fix it, then I don't know what is wrong with it.
   Nijat

----- Original Message -----
From: "Miranda brown" <brownbears at mchsi.com>
To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, July 15, 2009 12:03 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] Victor Reader Stream


> Hi,
>
> My victor reader stream will not turn on, I tried the hard reset and that
> did not work.  Any suggestions? I have only had it for about a month.
>
> Miranda
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nijat1989%40gmail.co
m 


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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brownbears%40mchsi.c
om
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 
Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.15/2239 - Release Date: 07/15/09
06:07:00



From jmassay1 at cox.net  Wed Jul 15 22:44:41 2009
From: jmassay1 at cox.net (JMassay)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 17:44:41 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS-L Leadership Update
Message-ID: <EF1F677B94094827BFA0193D99AAB008@MERLIN>

Antonio,

 

First of all, hello!

 

With regard to the suggestion of division delegates, yes, each state or
division, regardless of whether or not they have a formally organized
division, could have representation. In the General Session National
elections, the one delegate vote was a survey of the people within each
state. I think that we can figure out how to change the registration and
seating in order to have a business meeting that is orderly. I mean, come
on, second graders can get in and stay in line. This having been my first
actual NABS meeting; surely we can figure something out. Have things been
different in the past? Just curious. 

 

Also, thanks to the first timer, Marisa, for speaking up. We do belong to an
incredible organization. 

 

Respectfully, 

 

Jeannie 


From ginisd at sbcglobal.net  Wed Jul 15 22:55:33 2009
From: ginisd at sbcglobal.net (V Nork)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 15:55:33 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Fw: [real-eyes] Fw: Accessible World presents An
	introduction to Facebook, Tek Talk, Juoly 20
Message-ID: <044345307A854769B77F5ECDDF9FE46C@windows4c0ed96>

Hello all, This looks like a great resource, I think someone on this list 
was asking about face book.  I have been listening to these tech talks, as 
they are called, for about two years, and it has been incredibly helpful 
with  lots of aspects of adaptive technology.  Many times, I cannot hear the 
talk in real time, so I go to the archives, Ginnie
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Reginald George" <sgeorge at kc.rr.com>
To: <real-eyes at freelists.org>
Sent: Wednesday, July 15, 2009 6:55 AM
Subject: [real-eyes] Fw: Accessible World presents An introduction to 
Facebook, Tek Talk, Juoly 20


> News Wire
>
>
> On Monday July 20th, JoAnn Becker will present an introduction to 
> Facebook, one of the world's largest social networks. She will discuss the 
> myriad ways in which people are using this social utility to communicate 
> with one another. Users can join networks organized by city, workplace, 
> school, and region to connect and interact with people. They can also add 
> friends and send them messages, and update their personal profiles to 
> inform friends about themselves.
>
>
>
> During this presentation JoAnn will demonstrate:* how to register and 
> create an account;* how to build a personal profile; *how to add friends; 
> * how to upload photos; * how to explore settings.
>
>
>
> If there are classmates, colleagues, friends with whom you wish to 
> reconnect, Facebook may be able to help.
>
>
>
> Date:  Monday, July 20 2009.
>
>
>
> Time:  5:00 p.m. PDT, 6:00 p.m. MDT, 7:00 p.m. CDT, and 8:00 p.m. EDT
>
>           And elsewhere in the world Tuesday 0:00 GMT
>
>
>
> Approximately 15 minutes prior to the event start time; go to The Pat 
> Price Tek Talk Training Room at:
>
>
>
>
> http://conference321.com/masteradmin/room.asp?id=rsc9613dc89eb2
>
>
>
> Or, alternatively.
>
>
>
> Select The Pat Price Tek Talk Training Room at: 
> http://www.accessibleworld.org. Enter your first and last names on the 
> sign-in screen.
>
>
>
> All Tek Talk training events are recorded so if you are unable to 
> participate live at the above times then you may download the presentation 
> or podcast from the Tek Talk archives on our website at 
> http://www.accessibleworld.org
>
>
>
> All online interactive programs require no password, are free of charge, 
> and open to anyone worldwide having an Internet connection, a computer, 
> speakers, and a sound card. Those with microphones can interact audibly 
> with the presenters and others in the virtual audience or text chat with 
> the attendees. To speak to us, hold down the control key and talk; then 
> let up to listen.
>
>
> If you are a first-time user of the Talking Communities online 
> conferencing software, there is a small, safe software program that you 
> need to download and then run. A link to the software is available on 
> every entry screen to the Accessible World online rooms.
>
>
>
> Sign up information for all Accessible World News Wires and discussion 
> lists are also available at our website http://www.accessibleworld.org.
>
>
>
> Accessible World Contacts:
>
>
>
> Robert Acosta, Chair
>
> Accessible World
>
> 818-998-0044
>
> Email: boacosta at pacbell.net
>
> Web: http://www.helpinghands4theblind.org
>
>
>
> Joann Becker, Events Coordinator
>
> Accessible World
>
> 617-969-1213
>
> Email: joannbecker at pcomcast.net
>
>
>
> George Buys, CEO
>
> Talking Communities
>
> Email: buys at talkingcommunities.com
>
>
>
> The Accessible World, a division of Helping Hands For The Blind, a 501(c) 
> (3) not-for-profit organization, seeks to educate the general public, the 
> disabled community and the professionals who serve them by providing 
> highly relevant information about new products, services, and training 
> opportunities designed specifically to eliminate geographic and access 
> barriers that adversely affect them.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus 
> signature database 4243 (20090714) __________
>
> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>
> http://www.eset.com
>
> To subscribe or to leave the list, or to set other subscription options, 
> go to www.freelists.org/list/real-eyes
>
> 



From oceanrls at hotmail.com  Thu Jul 16 23:04:36 2009
From: oceanrls at hotmail.com (Rachel Jacobs)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 19:04:36 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief
References: <8CBD2B57C37189E-988-1085@MBLK-M01.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <BLU0-SMTP55A76C132830FC4C222266C4200@phx.gbl>

Hey everybody. My name is Rachel Jacobs, and this was my first convention. I 
was one of the scholarship winners this year. I had an absolutely amazing 
time. I was not sure what to expect, but this convention was above and 
beyond what I could have expected. I learned so much, and met so many 
amazing individuals. I definitely plan on going to next years convention in 
Texas. I left the convention feeling very empowered, and found myself 
already looking forward to next year. It was great meeting many of you, and 
if we didn't meet hopefully we will all meet next year.
Rachel
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Darian Smith" <ds94124 at aol.com>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 12:15 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief


> Hey all,
>  What a convention, huh? I actually don't know if this has taken place 
> yet, but I am interested to hear people's thoughts on convention.  I would 
> like to hear about what Highlights people took from this convention an, 
> and  if you are a "rookie" what your first impressions were of this year's 
> installment of the grand event.
> Would you do it again, "Rookies"?
>
> have an  awsome day!
> Darian
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/oceanrls%40hotmail.com
> 



From eduffy at pobox.com  Thu Jul 16 01:38:03 2009
From: eduffy at pobox.com (eduffy)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 20:38:03 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Items for Sale
Message-ID: <auto-000110480730@mailfront2.g2host.com>

I have several items for sale.

1. Braille Connect Twelve. Beginning asking price $1200.

VoiceNote QT $895.

Blazie Disk drives for notetakers both models.

Please make offers on these two items.

I am willing to consider all reasonable offers for any of these items.

Please contact me off list or by calling (614) 562-5524.

Eric Duffy
eduffy at pobox.com



From nijat1989 at gmail.com  Thu Jul 16 02:36:30 2009
From: nijat1989 at gmail.com (Nijat Worley)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 02:36:30 -0000
Subject: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief
References: <8CBD2B57C37189E-988-1085@MBLK-M01.sysops.aol.com>
	<BLU0-SMTP55A76C132830FC4C222266C4200@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <51761A158B244975A8C5829AFC4F7321@Nijatash>

Greetings Rachel,
   Welcome to the National Federation of the Blind and I am glad you enjoyed 
your first convention. I hope you will continue to take advantage of the 
opportunities this organization provides, and get involved in our 
activities. Many of us are involved in this organization because of the 
inspiration and empowerment that it provides, and I hope that you can 
benefit from this organization just as much as we have. Anyway, from the 
sound of it, you have already connected with the NFB and for what it stands. 
As time goes on, and as you get more involved in the organization, you will 
have a better understanding of the NFB and its philosophy. I would encourage 
you to join your local NFB chapter and your student division in your state, 
if you have one. This will help keep you in the NFB mode, and it will give 
you the opportunity to continue to be a part of the organization. First 
convention is always the best. Anyway, please feel free to ask any questions 
that you may have in the future. That is what the NABS list is for. Once 
again, welcome aboard, and we are pleased to have you along. Also 
congratulations on your scholarship. That is just one of the benefits of 
being a part of this organization, but certainly not the most important 
reason for being a part of it. It is the true empowering philosophy of this 
organization that really matters in the long run.
   Yours,
   Nijat

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Rachel Jacobs" <oceanrls at hotmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 5:04 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief


> Hey everybody. My name is Rachel Jacobs, and this was my first convention. 
> I was one of the scholarship winners this year. I had an absolutely 
> amazing time. I was not sure what to expect, but this convention was above 
> and beyond what I could have expected. I learned so much, and met so many 
> amazing individuals. I definitely plan on going to next years convention 
> in Texas. I left the convention feeling very empowered, and found myself 
> already looking forward to next year. It was great meeting many of you, 
> and if we didn't meet hopefully we will all meet next year.
> Rachel
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Darian Smith" <ds94124 at aol.com>
> To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 12:15 PM
> Subject: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief
>
>
>> Hey all,
>>  What a convention, huh? I actually don't know if this has taken place 
>> yet, but I am interested to hear people's thoughts on convention.  I 
>> would like to hear about what Highlights people took from this convention 
>> an, and  if you are a "rookie" what your first impressions were of this 
>> year's installment of the grand event.
>> Would you do it again, "Rookies"?
>>
>> have an  awsome day!
>> Darian
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/oceanrls%40hotmail.com
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nijat1989%40gmail.com 



From graduate56 at juno.com  Thu Jul 16 04:20:24 2009
From: graduate56 at juno.com (Melissa Green)
Date: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 22:20:24 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief
References: <8CBD2B57C37189E-988-1085@MBLK-M01.sysops.aol.com>
	<BLU0-SMTP55A76C132830FC4C222266C4200@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <00B2F51B02994752905425FB1DF3C518@melissa>

Congrats!
It was nice to meet you with rick and laurel brown.
Glad that you enjoyed the convention.

Melissa
"At the center of your being you have the answer; you know who you are and 
you know what you want."

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Rachel Jacobs" <oceanrls at hotmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 5:04 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief


> Hey everybody. My name is Rachel Jacobs, and this was my first convention. 
> I was one of the scholarship winners this year. I had an absolutely 
> amazing time. I was not sure what to expect, but this convention was above 
> and beyond what I could have expected. I learned so much, and met so many 
> amazing individuals. I definitely plan on going to next years convention 
> in Texas. I left the convention feeling very empowered, and found myself 
> already looking forward to next year. It was great meeting many of you, 
> and if we didn't meet hopefully we will all meet next year.
> Rachel
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Darian Smith" <ds94124 at aol.com>
> To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 12:15 PM
> Subject: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief
>
>
>> Hey all,
>>  What a convention, huh? I actually don't know if this has taken place 
>> yet, but I am interested to hear people's thoughts on convention.  I 
>> would like to hear about what Highlights people took from this convention 
>> an, and  if you are a "rookie" what your first impressions were of this 
>> year's installment of the grand event.
>> Would you do it again, "Rookies"?
>>
>> have an  awsome day!
>> Darian
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/oceanrls%40hotmail.com
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/graduate56%40juno.com
> 

____________________________________________________________
Digital Photography - Click Now.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/BLSrjpTDvmSjxswvoX6M8vTIf32ru7Slir46rODOUwoA7l2vTQIh8FDZf6w/


From corbbo at gmail.com  Thu Jul 16 04:27:07 2009
From: corbbo at gmail.com (Corbb O'Connor)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 00:27:07 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Victor Reader Stream
In-Reply-To: <9120E330CE3148ABA575EDFF3EAB7B86@MIRANDA>
References: <B40C8B60AC004103A84E20E2D0714E59@MIRANDA>
	<BDC461F4455D4FDDACCF6727840D2D9A@Nijatash>
	<9120E330CE3148ABA575EDFF3EAB7B86@MIRANDA>
Message-ID: <C6C1A5F1-164E-4860-B2AA-C0569A3DB828@gmail.com>

Silly question: but be sure the charging mechanism is actually  
charging the unit. Not having a Stream, I'm not sure if it uses AA or  
lithium batteries...if it's AA, try new batteries; if it's lithium,  
plug something else in that outlet and be sure there's current flowing.

On Jul 15, 2009, at 5:27 PM, Miranda brown wrote:

Yes, I already tried taking out the battery.

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On  
Behalf
Of Nijat Worley
Sent: Wednesday, April 29, 2009 2:22 AM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Victor Reader Stream

Take out the battery and wait for about thirty seconds, and then  
replace it.

If that doesn't fix it, then I don't know what is wrong with it.
   Nijat

----- Original Message -----
From: "Miranda brown" <brownbears at mchsi.com>
To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, July 15, 2009 12:03 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] Victor Reader Stream


> Hi,
>
> My victor reader stream will not turn on, I tried the hard reset and  
> that
> did not work.  Any suggestions? I have only had it for about a month.
>
> Miranda
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nijat1989%40gmail.co
m


_______________________________________________
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http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brownbears%40mchsi.c
om
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.15/2239 - Release Date:  
07/15/09
06:07:00


_______________________________________________
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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for  
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From loneblindjedi at samobile.net  Thu Jul 16 06:36:36 2009
From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 02:36:36 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
Message-ID: <20090716063636.13728.17180@web1.serotek.com>

Corbb,

I don't know what state you come from, but in Washington, the delegate 
votes according to the will of the majority vote in our affiliate. When 
Washingtonians choose our delegates at our fall convention, it's 
expected that they will do their job admirably and in good faith and 
conscience (I.E. following the will of the state and representing us 
with grace and decorum). We vote for our delegates to convention 
(delegate and first/second alternates) just as we do any other office. 
If it's one thing my affiliate leadership values (especially Mike 
Freeman), it's democracy, and I've seen nothing in my affiliate that 
would suggest otherwise even if the leadership thinks it knows better.

Respectfully,
Jedi
Original message:
> Thank you for your comments on the idea of delegation voting. One
> misconception that is worth righting: most state presidents will agree that
> the delegate's vote is NOT intended to be democratically chosen. As one
> state president told me after the Freeman/Sayer election, the delegates on
> the convention floor have more inside knowledge than the general membership.
> State presidents -- in the NFB and in NABS -- are chosen because of their
> leadership, past experience, and beliefs on what is best for the division.
> It therefore makes sense that their vote have more influence in a runoff
> election. As for what ensures that each state has a voice at the NABS
> meeting, this is easier than you might think. Before convention, state
> presidents send in the names of their state's delegate and alternate who
> will be in attendance at the NABS meeting. That list is assembled, and those
> people are called on if there is a runoff election at the NABS business
> meeting. Would sitting by state require some work? Probably. Is it
> essential? Not really. If a state president wanted to do a quick vote within
> their delegation before voting, a simple: "Those of you from New Jersey, who
> favors...and who favors..." with a voice vote would do the trick. Of course
> that requires that decorum at NABS meetings be improved from what we saw
> this year.

> Corbb
> President, Virginia Students Division

> On Wed, Jul 15, 2009 at 9:40 AM, Briley Pollard <brileyp at gmail.com> wrote:

>> Corbb,

>> I agree that this is a way for the blind to independantly run an
>> election, but there is the issue of representation. What insures that
>> the representative from each state speaks for the majority? I know in
>> Tn during the bored election in general session, our rep didn't ask us
>> who we wanted in the position. He picked who he wanted without
>> consulting the membership. As for sitting with our state, that isn't a
>> bad idea. Maybe sit with our region? This would probably make things a
>> little more organized, which is my eternal hope for NABS.

>> -Briley

>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/corbbo%40gmail.com

> _______________________________________________
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> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net

-- 
Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.  Visit 
www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.


From jackson.dezman at gmail.com  Thu Jul 16 11:33:01 2009
From: jackson.dezman at gmail.com (Dezman Jackson)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 06:33:01 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Victor Reader Stream
References: <B40C8B60AC004103A84E20E2D0714E59@MIRANDA>
Message-ID: <8551BFD0E79048E68DDC74A46861F784@Dezman>

Try a factory reset by holding down the bookmark key, which is the 
diamond-shaped key in the top right corner of the keypad, and the number 5 
together while turning on the unit.

Dezman
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Miranda brown" <brownbears at mchsi.com>
To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, July 15, 2009 1:03 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] Victor Reader Stream


> Hi,
>
> My victor reader stream will not turn on, I tried the hard reset and that
> did not work.  Any suggestions? I have only had it for about a month.
>
> Miranda
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jackson.dezman%40gmail.com
> 



From rjaquiss at earthlink.net  Thu Jul 16 12:36:02 2009
From: rjaquiss at earthlink.net (Robert Jaquiss)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 07:36:02 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Introduction: Robert Jaquiss
Message-ID: <761578B8765A4C6FBCE0FCC9788E1FBA@D3DTZP41>

Hello:

     I am writing to introduce myself. I am Robert Jaquiss, a soon to be student at Louisiana Technical College (LTC). I intend to study computer network support. I am a returning student having been employed for about 27 years. I have a background in computer programming, adaptive technology and tactile graphics. Have a great day.

Regards,

Robert Jaquiss, President
Greater Ouachita Chapter
National Federation of the Blind
Email: rjaquiss at earthlink.net

From raniaismail04 at gmail.com  Thu Jul 16 13:02:17 2009
From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 09:02:17 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Introduction: Robert Jaquiss
References: <761578B8765A4C6FBCE0FCC9788E1FBA@D3DTZP41>
Message-ID: <000501ca0615$a60f7070$2801a8c0@DHQ5QJF1>

Hi welcome to the list. My name is Rania, feel free to jump in.
Rania,
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Robert Jaquiss" <rjaquiss at earthlink.net>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 8:36 AM
Subject: [nabs-l] Introduction: Robert Jaquiss


> Hello:
>
>     I am writing to introduce myself. I am Robert Jaquiss, a soon to be 
> student at Louisiana Technical College (LTC). I intend to study computer 
> network support. I am a returning student having been employed for about 
> 27 years. I have a background in computer programming, adaptive technology 
> and tactile graphics. Have a great day.
>
> Regards,
>
> Robert Jaquiss, President
> Greater Ouachita Chapter
> National Federation of the Blind
> Email: rjaquiss at earthlink.net
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmail.com 



From merisa.musemic at gmail.com  Thu Jul 16 15:05:55 2009
From: merisa.musemic at gmail.com (Merisa Musemic)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 11:05:55 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Introduction: Robert Jaquiss
In-Reply-To: <761578B8765A4C6FBCE0FCC9788E1FBA@D3DTZP41>
References: <761578B8765A4C6FBCE0FCC9788E1FBA@D3DTZP41>
Message-ID: <df5bac6d0907160805p6f0fea30l82f47cda22d9e6dd@mail.gmail.com>

Hello Robert! I'm Merisa Musemic. I'm currently a graduate student
studying rehabilitation counseling at Wayne State University.
Welcome to the list!
Merisa

On 7/16/09, Robert Jaquiss <rjaquiss at earthlink.net> wrote:
> Hello:
>
>      I am writing to introduce myself. I am Robert Jaquiss, a soon to be
> student at Louisiana Technical College (LTC). I intend to study computer
> network support. I am a returning student having been employed for about 27
> years. I have a background in computer programming, adaptive technology and
> tactile graphics. Have a great day.
>
> Regards,
>
> Robert Jaquiss, President
> Greater Ouachita Chapter
> National Federation of the Blind
> Email: rjaquiss at earthlink.net
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/merisa.musemic%40gmail.com
>


From oceanrls at hotmail.com  Fri Jul 17 15:42:43 2009
From: oceanrls at hotmail.com (Rachel Jacobs)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 11:42:43 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief
References: <8CBD2B57C37189E-988-1085@MBLK-M01.sysops.aol.com><BLU0-SMTP55A76C132830FC4C222266C4200@phx.gbl>
	<00B2F51B02994752905425FB1DF3C518@melissa>
Message-ID: <BLU0-SMTP326B3F991A2A9764E9A3D7C4210@phx.gbl>

Nice meeting you as well.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Melissa Green" <graduate56 at juno.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 12:20 AM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief


> Congrats!
> It was nice to meet you with rick and laurel brown.
> Glad that you enjoyed the convention.
>
> Melissa
> "At the center of your being you have the answer; you know who you are and 
> you know what you want."
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Rachel Jacobs" <oceanrls at hotmail.com>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 5:04 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief
>
>
>> Hey everybody. My name is Rachel Jacobs, and this was my first 
>> convention. I was one of the scholarship winners this year. I had an 
>> absolutely amazing time. I was not sure what to expect, but this 
>> convention was above and beyond what I could have expected. I learned so 
>> much, and met so many amazing individuals. I definitely plan on going to 
>> next years convention in Texas. I left the convention feeling very 
>> empowered, and found myself already looking forward to next year. It was 
>> great meeting many of you, and if we didn't meet hopefully we will all 
>> meet next year.
>> Rachel
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Darian Smith" <ds94124 at aol.com>
>> To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 12:15 PM
>> Subject: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief
>>
>>
>>> Hey all,
>>>  What a convention, huh? I actually don't know if this has taken place 
>>> yet, but I am interested to hear people's thoughts on convention.  I 
>>> would like to hear about what Highlights people took from this 
>>> convention an, and  if you are a "rookie" what your first impressions 
>>> were of this year's installment of the grand event.
>>> Would you do it again, "Rookies"?
>>>
>>> have an  awsome day!
>>> Darian
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/oceanrls%40hotmail.com
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/graduate56%40juno.com
>>
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Digital Photography - Click Now.
> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/BLSrjpTDvmSjxswvoX6M8vTIf32ru7Slir46rODOUwoA7l2vTQIh8FDZf6w/
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/oceanrls%40hotmail.com
> 



From commanderlumpy2003 at earthlink.net  Thu Jul 16 15:55:09 2009
From: commanderlumpy2003 at earthlink.net (Kevin Wassmer)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 09:55:09 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Introduction: Robert Jaquiss
References: <761578B8765A4C6FBCE0FCC9788E1FBA@D3DTZP41>
Message-ID: <055BD2F6C20C4CF796FC18C5B15972D2@usore540475a8f>

Robert, I don't know if you remember me. I am Kevin Wassmer. I met you at 
the Washington Seminar in 2005. We had a long conversation about blindness 
in the delly of the hotell. One of the reasons aside from your great 
philosiphy of blindness was because you are from Oregon. I told you about 
the summer camps in Salem. BTW, I hope your 1 and only honey Lory is doing 
well. I remember her at LCB. I will talk to you later.


Cause its been 18 days
Since I first held you
But to me it feels just like
It feels like a lifetime
I'm trying hard to re-arrange
Some say its the hardest thing to do
But that's another 18 days
Without you..
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Robert Jaquiss" <rjaquiss at earthlink.net>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 6:36 AM
Subject: [nabs-l] Introduction: Robert Jaquiss


> Hello:
>
>     I am writing to introduce myself. I am Robert Jaquiss, a soon to be 
> student at Louisiana Technical College (LTC). I intend to study computer 
> network support. I am a returning student having been employed for about 
> 27 years. I have a background in computer programming, adaptive technology 
> and tactile graphics. Have a great day.
>
> Regards,
>
> Robert Jaquiss, President
> Greater Ouachita Chapter
> National Federation of the Blind
> Email: rjaquiss at earthlink.net
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/commanderlumpy2003%40earthlink.net
> 



From dandrews at visi.com  Thu Jul 16 19:26:16 2009
From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 14:26:16 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Minnesota State Services for the Blind Director's Job Open,
 St. Paul
Message-ID: <auto-000107861682@mailfront1.g2host.com>

The job of Director of Minnesota State Services for the Blind is now 
open.  You can apply on line, and the closing date is July 27th.  You 
can view the job, and apply at:

https://statejobs.doer.state.mn.us/JobPosting/1ecf38fe20f55e017024b29a0573cc76/View

Please circulate, as we need to get somebody good into the position

David Andrews

State of Minnesota Job Posting: View
Banner image with the text 'Employment, Opening Worlds of 
Possibilities, My State Job Search'


DIRECTOR SERVICES FOR THE BLIND
$ 32.42-$ 46.56 hourly, $ 67,693-$ 97,217 annually

Date Posted:
07/16/2009
Closing Date:
07/27/2009
Hiring Agency:
Employment & Econ Development Dept
Division/Bureau:
SSB
Location:
St. Paul
Who May Apply:
Open to all qualified job seekers
Posting Number:
09DEED000128
Employment Conditions:
Permanent, Full-time
Work Shift:
Day Shift
Days of Work:
Monday-Friday
Travel Required:
yes
Job Grouping:
General Administration
Classified Status:
Classified

Job Description:

The Director is responsible for leadership in developing and managing 
State Services for the Blind's (SSB) State Plans and programs for 
federal Vocational
Rehabilitation (including Assistive Technology) and Independent 
Living, its Independent Living-Older Blind program and 
Randolph-Sheppard vending facilities
program, and the Communication Center.

It is the Director's responsibility to provide fiscal leadership, 
secure resources, manage the preparation of financial plans and SSB 
program budgets and
to manage the disbursement, accounting, and reporting of federal and 
state appropriations for the blind and including grants and gift 
funds so that all
resources are utilized effectively and in accord with both federal 
and state regulations.

Provide leadership, initiative and management in the design and 
implementation of new developments and technologies, ideas, and 
directions as well as effective
strategies for research, program evaluation and quality assurance.

The Director creates a clear focus on the unique character of the 
work of SSB and its role in the Minnesota Workforce Center System. 
The position supervises
(directly and indirectly) 110 staff members including Program 
Directors for: Workforce Development (Vocational Rehabilitation); the 
Communication Center
and Senior Services; Technology; Administrative Services. SSB has a 
central office in St. Paul and at 12 Workforce Centers across the state.
Minimum Qualifications:
3 years experience as a manager or administrator responsible for a 
program providing vocational rehabilitation services (or employment 
and training services),
AND you must possess a graduate degree in Rehabilitation, Public or 
Business Administration, Education, Psychology or a closely related area.


Preferred Qualifications:
Applicants who meet the experience and educational requirement will 
be further evaluated on their qualifications (education/training, 
paid or volunteer
work/life experience, and accomplishments/achievements) for this 
position as demonstrated in the areas listed below. Preference will 
be given to applicants
with experience working in rehabilitation for persons who are 
blind/visually impaired.

Please use the Job Specific Questions Section to respond to each of 
these four areas:

1) Rehabilitation
a) Knowledge of rehabilitation programs and services - including 
vocational rehabilitation, independent living rehabilitation, special 
education and the
One-Stop (Workforce Center) system of the Workforce Investment Act;
b) Experience in rehabilitation programs for persons who are blind 
and visually impaired;
c) Knowledge of State and Federal laws and regulations governing the 
provision of rehabilitation services to persons who are blind and 
visually impaired.


2) Management
a) Managerial, supervisory and related administrative roles and functions;
b) Planning and development of program policies and procedures. 
Include here a description of achievements/accomplishments which 
demonstrate the highest
level of: 1) leadership and initiative; and 2) problem solving and creativity;
c) Quality assurance (e.g., case reviews, compliance, auditing, etc), 
program evaluation (e.g., vendor effectiveness studies, etc.), 
cost/benefit studies,
and forecasting future resource needs and service demands.

3) Budget development and fiscal management. Please include the 
approximate amounts of dollars controlled.

4) Experience in making presentations to and working with policy 
making bodies (e.g., legislative committees) and with professional, 
consumer and provider
groups and councils.
Selection Process:
The selection process is a resume-based, skill-matching process. Your 
resume will be entered into a database. The software program matches 
your skills with
the skills needed to perform the duties of the position. If your 
skills match the required skills for this position, the department 
may contact you.

If you have already submitted a resume to this database within the 
last 12 months that clearly identifies your knowledge, skills, 
abilities, and experience,
you do not need to submit another.

How to Apply:
You are strongly encouraged to submit your resume through the online 
Resume Builder at <
https://statejobs.doer.state.mn.us/ResumeBuilder
 >. You may copy and paste in your existing resume or let the 
software create a resume for you. You may edit your resume later 
should your contact information
or experience change. The Resume Builder also collects your work 
preference information so we can match you with future job openings 
that meet your interests.


Current State Employees: Please note that employment provisions 
(including but not limited to seniority and leave accrual) vary among 
the three branches
of Minnesota State government. When considering a job with another 
branch of state government, you are highly encouraged to explore 
these differences.
For assistance, please direct questions to both your current and 
anticipated Human Resources offices.

If you wish to apply with a paper copy, submit your resume AND a 
completed State of Minnesota Employment Application form to: 
Minnesota Management & Budget
(MMB), 200 Centennial Office Building, 658 Cedar Street, St. Paul, MN 
55155. Be sure to indicate the posting number of this job on your 
application. The
paper application is available on the State Employment Web and MMB 
web sites, at any state agency HR office, or by calling 651-259-3637.

Contact for More Information:
Sue Zeches, 651/259-7107/sue.zeches at state.mn.us.
table end


David Andrews and white cane Harry.

From brileyp at gmail.com  Thu Jul 16 19:30:46 2009
From: brileyp at gmail.com (Briley Pollard)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 14:30:46 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Introduction: Robert Jaquiss
In-Reply-To: <055BD2F6C20C4CF796FC18C5B15972D2@usore540475a8f>
References: <761578B8765A4C6FBCE0FCC9788E1FBA@D3DTZP41>
	<055BD2F6C20C4CF796FC18C5B15972D2@usore540475a8f>
Message-ID: <12790a9a0907161230g7c818d80vbf57cd55c827f86d@mail.gmail.com>

Welcome to the list. I am Briley, a music student in Nashville
Tennessee. Good luck with your program.

-Briley

On Thu, Jul 16, 2009 at 10:55 AM, Kevin
Wassmer<commanderlumpy2003 at earthlink.net> wrote:
> Robert, I don't know if you remember me. I am Kevin Wassmer. I met you at
> the Washington Seminar in 2005. We had a long conversation about blindness
> in the delly of the hotell. One of the reasons aside from your great
> philosiphy of blindness was because you are from Oregon. I told you about
> the summer camps in Salem. BTW, I hope your 1 and only honey Lory is doing
> well. I remember her at LCB. I will talk to you later.
>
>
> Cause its been 18 days
> Since I first held you
> But to me it feels just like
> It feels like a lifetime
> I'm trying hard to re-arrange
> Some say its the hardest thing to do
> But that's another 18 days
> Without you..
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Jaquiss" <rjaquiss at earthlink.net>
> To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 6:36 AM
> Subject: [nabs-l] Introduction: Robert Jaquiss
>
>
>> Hello:
>>
>>    I am writing to introduce myself. I am Robert Jaquiss, a soon to be
>> student at Louisiana Technical College (LTC). I intend to study computer
>> network support. I am a returning student having been employed for about 27
>> years. I have a background in computer programming, adaptive technology and
>> tactile graphics. Have a great day.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Robert Jaquiss, President
>> Greater Ouachita Chapter
>> National Federation of the Blind
>> Email: rjaquiss at earthlink.net
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/commanderlumpy2003%40earthlink.net
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com
>


From jsorozco at gmail.com  Thu Jul 16 22:02:59 2009
From: jsorozco at gmail.com (Joe Orozco)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 18:02:59 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] FW: AmeriCorps Alumni Sought for Prestigious Eli Segal
	Fellowship
Message-ID: <05AF1D06541942B5AECAAB8E68DB235C@Rufus>

Subject: AmeriCorps Alumni Sought for Prestigious Eli Segal Fellowship

AmeriCorps Alumni Sought for Prestigious Eli Segal Fellowship

CONTACT: April Durrant
Phone: 801-524-5411 x3
Email: elisegalfellowship at cns.gov

Washington, DC - The Corporation for National and Community Service is
seeking applications from former AmeriCorps members who are interested in
serving as the 2009-2010 Eli Segal Fellow, a year-long leadership
opportunity to help advance national service policy, operations, and
strategy from the Office of the CEO at Corporation headquarters. 

This prestigious fellowship was created in 2006 to honor the legacy of Eli
Segal, who was a key architect of the 1993 national service legislation and
served as the first CEO of the Corporation from 1993 to 1995. Segal died in
February 2006.

The fellowship is open to AmeriCorps alumni who have demonstrated
exceptional leadership, drive, and commitment to national service, and who
are committed to advancing the mission and goals of the Corporation. The
duties of the selected fellow will include helping to advance the mission of
national service and the strategic goals of the Corporation while working
closely with the CEO on projects that benefit the national service field. 

The 2009-2010 fellow will serve at moment of strong momentum for the
Corporation and the larger service and volunteering movement. President
Obama has made service a central cause of the Presidency and has called on
all Americans to make service a part of their daily lives. The President's
strong focus has resulted in several early achievements, including record
turnout on the Martin Luther King Day of Service, Recovery Act funding to
support 13,000 new AmeriCorps members, passage of the landmark Edward M.
Kennedy Serve America Act, and the launch of the United We Serve initiative.


The fellowship offers the opportunity for career development and gaining a
first-hand understanding of national service and the workings of a Federal
agency. The fellowship will last for a term of not more than 13 months
beginning in September 2009 and includes a $27,000 salary, plus benefits. 

Eligible applicants for the fellowship include all AmeriCorps alums who
served full-time in the past three years. Exceptions to the three-year limit
may be made for candidates who have been in school full-time since serving
in AmeriCorps, or who have been in military or other national service such
as the Peace Corps. The Segal family will be represented in the selection
process.

The deadline to apply for the Eli Segal Fellowship is July 31. For further
information, application instructions, and frequently asked questions,
please visit: www.nationalservice.gov/pdf/09_0713_eli_segal.htm. For
questions, please email elisegalfellowship at cns.gov. Visit
https://applicationmanager.gov/Login.aspx?VacancyID=263049 to apply online.

Also, on July 23, 2009, there will be a conference call dedicated to
answering questions about the fellowship from 4 PM to 5 PM Eastern Time.

Call Date: July 23, 2009
Call Time:  4:00pm Eastern Time
Duration:  1 hour
Toll Free Number:  888-769-9419
Pass Code:  9527552

The Corporation for National and Community Service is a federal agency that
improves lives, strengthens communities, and fosters civic engagement
through service and volunteering. Each year, the Corporation engages four
million Americans of all ages and backgrounds through its Senior Corps,
AmeriCorps, and Learn and Serve America programs. For more information,
visit NationalService.gov.

###
 

__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
database 4251 (20090716) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com
 



From rjaquiss at earthlink.net  Fri Jul 17 02:04:46 2009
From: rjaquiss at earthlink.net (Robert Jaquiss)
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 21:04:46 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Fw: [AERNet] Accessible Car
Message-ID: <C6BA4C11FC204F598B1E1F9C8FD37381@D3DTZP41>

Hello List:

     I saw the following item and thought some of you might find it of interest.

Regards,

Robert Jaquiss, President
Greater Ouachita Chapter
National Federation of the Blind
Email: rjaquiss at earthlink.net
----- Original Message ----- 
From: Ike Presley 
To: AERNET 
Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 3:18 PM
Subject: [AERNet] Accessible Car


Check this out. I had heard about this project, but I didn't realize that they had gotten this far.

a.. Drivers who cannot see can drive talking vehicle
Students at Virginia Tech have upgraded a dirt buggy with laser range finders, an interface for voice commands and other equipment to enable drivers with visual impairments to drive. Instead of using technology to drive itself, the buggy senses its surroundings and offers drivers who cannot see information so that they can make decisions about braking, speed and steering. TG Daily (7/16)  
Here's the link to the article.
http://www.tgdaily.com/content/view/43264/181/
Ike
Ike Presley
National Project Manager
American Foundation for the Blind
100 Peachtree St., Suite 620
Atlanta, GA 30303
404-525-2303
presley at afb.net
www.afb.org





--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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Save the Dates!

AER Regional Meeting
Featuring COMA's O&M Conference Within a Conference
November 13-15, 2009 in Cleveland, Ohio USA

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July 20-25, 2010 in Little Rock, Arkansas USA



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From nabs.president at gmail.com  Fri Jul 17 04:46:35 2009
From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 14:46:35 +1000
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Conference Call Forum
Message-ID: <85ff10070907162146g6b3757f5oe9ba17bbedeab805@mail.gmail.com>

Hello NABS members:

	Tonight the National Association of Blind Students board met and,
among other things, we talked about some of the issues surrounding
NABS elections. We would very much like to hold a discussion with all
of you and get your opinions about how the election process can be
improved. To start this process, we would like to hold a conference
call, open to all NABS members, sometime between August 5 and August
13.

	If you’d be interested in participating in the conference call,
please email Janice Jeang, NABS secretary, at
Janice.jeang at gmail.com
And tell her what day of the week between August 5 and August 13 would
work best for you.

Thanks and hope many of you will participate in the dialogue!

Arielle


-- 
Arielle Silverman
President, National Association of Blind Students
Phone:  602-502-2255
Email:
nabs.president at gmail.com
Website:
www.nabslink.org


From marrie12 at gmail.com  Fri Jul 17 08:07:50 2009
From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 01:07:50 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
Message-ID: <A51FC018DF074D7C9E108C2FE48D9574@sacomputer>

I did voat against this in 2007 and I still do. Are you surprised?

 

 

Begin msg

 

Mark Riccobono, executive director of the National Federation of the Blind's
Jernigan Institute, drives the Virginia Tech Blind Driver Challenge  vehicle
through an obstacle course of traffic cones on a campus  parking lot. In the
passenger seat is Greg Jannaman, who led the  student team within the
mechanical engineering department during the  past year, and is monitoring
the software of the vehicle. Credit:

 Steven Mackay, Virginia Tech

 

 A student team in the Virginia Tech College of Engineering is  providing
the blind with an opportunity many never thought possible:

 The opportunity to drive.

 

 A retrofitted four-wheel dirt buggy developed by the Blind Driver
Challenge team (http://www.me.vt.edu/blinddriver/) from Virginia  Tech's
Robotics and Mechanisms Laboratory uses laser range finders, an  instant
voice command interface and a host of other innovative,  cutting-edge
technology to guide blind drivers as they steer, brake, and accelerate.

 Although in the early testing stage, the National Federation of the  Blind
-- which spurred the project -- considers the vehicle a major  breakthrough
for independent living of the visually impaired.

 

 "It was great!" said Wes Majerus, of Baltimore, the first blind person  to
drive the buggy on a closed course at the Virginia Tech campus this  summer.
Majerus is an access technology specialist with the National  Federation of
the Blind's Jernigan Institute in Baltimore, a research  and training
institute dedicated to developing technologies and  services to help the
blind achieve independence.

 

 Majerus called his drive a liberating experience, adding that he drove
before on Nebraska farm roads with his father as a guide in the  passenger
seat.

 

 Sitting inside the vehicle, a blind driver can turn the steering  wheel,
stop and accelerate by following data from a computing unit  that uses
sensory information from the laser range finder serving as  the 'eyes' of
the driver, in addition to a combination of voice  commands and a vibrating
vest as guides. A member of the Virginia Tech  student team sat next to
Majerus in the passenger seat to monitor the system's software operations.

 

 "It's a great first step," Majerus added. "As far as the differences
between human instructions and those given by the voice in the Blind  Driver
Challenge car, the car's instructions are very precise. You use  the
technology to act on the environment -- the driving course -- in a  very
orderly manner. In some cases, the human passenger will be vague,  "turn
left" -- does that mean just a small turn to the left, or are we  going for
large amounts of turn?"

 

 Also driving the vehicle was Mark Riccobono, also of Baltimore, the
executive director of the Jernigan Institute, who also is blind. He  called
his test drive historic. "This is sort of our going to the moon project,"

 he said

 

 In 2004 Jernigan Institute challenged university research teams to  develop
a vehicle that would one day allow the blind to drive.

 Virginia Tech was the only university in the nation to accept the
nonprofit's call two years later, said Dennis Hong, director of the
Robotics and Mechanisms Laboratory, part of the Virginia Tech mechanical
engineering department.

 The National Federation of the Blind provided a $3,000 grant to launch  the
project.

 

 "I thought it would be a very rewarding project, helping the blind,"

 said Hong, the current faculty adviser on the project. "We are not  only
excited about the vehicle itself, but more than that, we are  excited about
the potential of the many spin-off technologies from  this project that can
be used for helping the blind in so many ways."

 

 The team will bring the Blind Driver Challenge vehicle to the National
Federation of the Blind's Youth Slam summer camp event held July 26  through
Aug. 1 in College Park, Md. There, the team hopes to have  teenagers who
would be obtaining their driver's licenses, but cannot  because of their
blindness, drive the buggy.

 

 Wesley Majerus, an access technology specialist with the National
Federation of the Blind's Jernigan Institute, finishes driving the  Virginia
Tech Blind Driver Challenge vehicle around a roped-off  driving course on a
campus parking lot. The experience, he said, was liberating.

 

 Youth participants also are expected to remote control drive miniature
cars. Additionally, the car is expected to ride in a National  Federation of
the Blind-sponsored parade in Washington D.C.

 

 "I most look forward to learning as much as I can from these bright  young
students," said Greg Jannaman, who led the Virginia Tech student  team in
his senior year and graduated in May with a bachelor's degree  in mechanical
engineering. "Blind students from across the nation  apply to be selected to
attend this summer camp. While we are there to  provide an educational
experience for them, I can only imagine the  invaluable feedback and fresh
new ideas that they will provide in return."

 

 Jannaman is excited about the vehicle's success. "There wasn't a  moment's
hesitation with any of our blind drivers, whereas  blind-folded sighted
drivers weren't as quick to let go of their  preconceptions," said Jannaman
of Hendersonville, Tenn. "The blind  drivers actually performed better than
their sighted counterparts. An  overwhelming sense of accomplishment
overcame me as I simply rode  along while Wes and Mark successfully
navigated the driving course without my assistance."

 

 Early models of the Blind Driver Challenge vehicle relied more on
technologies for fully autonomous vehicles, previously developed by
Virginia Tech mechanical engineering students as part of the DARPA  Urban
Challenge. The student team redesigned the vehicle so that the  blind
motorist has complete control of the driving process, as any  sighted driver
would.

 

 This change in approach led to new challenges, including how to
effectively convey the high bandwidth of information from the laser  sensors
scanning the vehicle's surrounding environment to the driver  fast enough
and accurate enough to allow safe driving. As a result,  the team developed
non-visual interface technologies, including a  vibrating vest for feedback
on speed, a click counter steering wheel  with audio cues, spoken commands
for directional feedback, and a  unique tactile map interface that utilizes
compressed air to provide  information about the road and obstacles
surrounding the vehicle.

 

 Riccobono knows of mock ups and non-working "blind driver car" set-ups
from the past, but says this is the first working vehicle to put the  blind
and visually impaired in control of the steering wheel. "Blind  people have
brains, the capacity to make decisions," he said. "Blind  people want to
live independent lives, why would they not want to drive?"

 

 Even once the technology is perfected, laws now barring the blind from
driving and public perception must be changed, Riccobono said. "This  is the
piece that we know will be the most difficult," said Riccobono,  adding that
the car must be near-perfected before the National  Federation of the Blind
can truly push the car to law-makers and the  general public. He said this
effort will take millions of dollars in development.

 

 The 2009-10 student team already is planning major changes to the
technology, including replacing the dirt buggy vehicle with a fully
electric car commonly used by traffic officers in downtown city centers.

 The all-electric vehicle would reduce the vibration which can cause
problems to the laser sensor, and it will provide clean electric power  for
the computing units and that is better for the environment.

 

 Source: Virginia Tech (news : web)

 

 

Sarah Alawami

msn: chellist at hotmail.com

website: http://www.marrie.org

twitter: http://twitter.com/marrie1

 


From pajohns1 at vt.edu  Fri Jul 17 10:47:49 2009
From: pajohns1 at vt.edu (pajohns1 at vt.edu)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 06:47:49 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
References: <A51FC018DF074D7C9E108C2FE48D9574@sacomputer>
Message-ID: <93C9A06630074664BCD154F67C6D408C@useripvq7z5u3t>


        If these two were the first blind people to drive the vehicle then I 
am probably the first "blindstudent" to drive the vehicle.  I hope the NFB 
doesn't over hype the car because while I agree it was liberating to drive 
on a closed-circuit there is still an incredible amount of work that needs 
to be done before real world testing can begin.

        That said, I had a blast behind the wheel,

Patrick
@Virginia Tech

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Sarah Alawami" <marrie12 at gmail.com>
To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 4:07 AM
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle


>I did voat against this in 2007 and I still do. Are you surprised?
>
>
>
>
>
> Begin msg
>
>
>
> Mark Riccobono, executive director of the National Federation of the 
> Blind's
> Jernigan Institute, drives the Virginia Tech Blind Driver Challenge 
> vehicle
> through an obstacle course of traffic cones on a campus  parking lot. In 
> the
> passenger seat is Greg Jannaman, who led the  student team within the
> mechanical engineering department during the  past year, and is monitoring
> the software of the vehicle. Credit:
>
> Steven Mackay, Virginia Tech
>
>
>
> A student team in the Virginia Tech College of Engineering is  providing
> the blind with an opportunity many never thought possible:
>
> The opportunity to drive.
>
>
>
> A retrofitted four-wheel dirt buggy developed by the Blind Driver
> Challenge team (http://www.me.vt.edu/blinddriver/) from Virginia  Tech's
> Robotics and Mechanisms Laboratory uses laser range finders, an  instant
> voice command interface and a host of other innovative,  cutting-edge
> technology to guide blind drivers as they steer, brake, and accelerate.
>
> Although in the early testing stage, the National Federation of the  Blind
> -- which spurred the project -- considers the vehicle a major 
> breakthrough
> for independent living of the visually impaired.
>
>
>
> "It was great!" said Wes Majerus, of Baltimore, the first blind person  to
> drive the buggy on a closed course at the Virginia Tech campus this 
> summer.
> Majerus is an access technology specialist with the National  Federation 
> of
> the Blind's Jernigan Institute in Baltimore, a research  and training
> institute dedicated to developing technologies and  services to help the
> blind achieve independence.
>
>
>
> Majerus called his drive a liberating experience, adding that he drove
> before on Nebraska farm roads with his father as a guide in the  passenger
> seat.
>
>
>
> Sitting inside the vehicle, a blind driver can turn the steering  wheel,
> stop and accelerate by following data from a computing unit  that uses
> sensory information from the laser range finder serving as  the 'eyes' of
> the driver, in addition to a combination of voice  commands and a 
> vibrating
> vest as guides. A member of the Virginia Tech  student team sat next to
> Majerus in the passenger seat to monitor the system's software operations.
>
>
>
> "It's a great first step," Majerus added. "As far as the differences
> between human instructions and those given by the voice in the Blind 
> Driver
> Challenge car, the car's instructions are very precise. You use  the
> technology to act on the environment -- the driving course -- in a  very
> orderly manner. In some cases, the human passenger will be vague,  "turn
> left" -- does that mean just a small turn to the left, or are we  going 
> for
> large amounts of turn?"
>
>
>
> Also driving the vehicle was Mark Riccobono, also of Baltimore, the
> executive director of the Jernigan Institute, who also is blind. He 
> called
> his test drive historic. "This is sort of our going to the moon project,"
>
> he said
>
>
>
> In 2004 Jernigan Institute challenged university research teams to 
> develop
> a vehicle that would one day allow the blind to drive.
>
> Virginia Tech was the only university in the nation to accept the
> nonprofit's call two years later, said Dennis Hong, director of the
> Robotics and Mechanisms Laboratory, part of the Virginia Tech mechanical
> engineering department.
>
> The National Federation of the Blind provided a $3,000 grant to launch 
> the
> project.
>
>
>
> "I thought it would be a very rewarding project, helping the blind,"
>
> said Hong, the current faculty adviser on the project. "We are not  only
> excited about the vehicle itself, but more than that, we are  excited 
> about
> the potential of the many spin-off technologies from  this project that 
> can
> be used for helping the blind in so many ways."
>
>
>
> The team will bring the Blind Driver Challenge vehicle to the National
> Federation of the Blind's Youth Slam summer camp event held July 26 
> through
> Aug. 1 in College Park, Md. There, the team hopes to have  teenagers who
> would be obtaining their driver's licenses, but cannot  because of their
> blindness, drive the buggy.
>
>
>
> Wesley Majerus, an access technology specialist with the National
> Federation of the Blind's Jernigan Institute, finishes driving the 
> Virginia
> Tech Blind Driver Challenge vehicle around a roped-off  driving course on 
> a
> campus parking lot. The experience, he said, was liberating.
>
>
>
> Youth participants also are expected to remote control drive miniature
> cars. Additionally, the car is expected to ride in a National  Federation 
> of
> the Blind-sponsored parade in Washington D.C.
>
>
>
> "I most look forward to learning as much as I can from these bright  young
> students," said Greg Jannaman, who led the Virginia Tech student  team in
> his senior year and graduated in May with a bachelor's degree  in 
> mechanical
> engineering. "Blind students from across the nation  apply to be selected 
> to
> attend this summer camp. While we are there to  provide an educational
> experience for them, I can only imagine the  invaluable feedback and fresh
> new ideas that they will provide in return."
>
>
>
> Jannaman is excited about the vehicle's success. "There wasn't a  moment's
> hesitation with any of our blind drivers, whereas  blind-folded sighted
> drivers weren't as quick to let go of their  preconceptions," said 
> Jannaman
> of Hendersonville, Tenn. "The blind  drivers actually performed better 
> than
> their sighted counterparts. An  overwhelming sense of accomplishment
> overcame me as I simply rode  along while Wes and Mark successfully
> navigated the driving course without my assistance."
>
>
>
> Early models of the Blind Driver Challenge vehicle relied more on
> technologies for fully autonomous vehicles, previously developed by
> Virginia Tech mechanical engineering students as part of the DARPA  Urban
> Challenge. The student team redesigned the vehicle so that the  blind
> motorist has complete control of the driving process, as any  sighted 
> driver
> would.
>
>
>
> This change in approach led to new challenges, including how to
> effectively convey the high bandwidth of information from the laser 
> sensors
> scanning the vehicle's surrounding environment to the driver  fast enough
> and accurate enough to allow safe driving. As a result,  the team 
> developed
> non-visual interface technologies, including a  vibrating vest for 
> feedback
> on speed, a click counter steering wheel  with audio cues, spoken commands
> for directional feedback, and a  unique tactile map interface that 
> utilizes
> compressed air to provide  information about the road and obstacles
> surrounding the vehicle.
>
>
>
> Riccobono knows of mock ups and non-working "blind driver car" set-ups
> from the past, but says this is the first working vehicle to put the 
> blind
> and visually impaired in control of the steering wheel. "Blind  people 
> have
> brains, the capacity to make decisions," he said. "Blind  people want to
> live independent lives, why would they not want to drive?"
>
>
>
> Even once the technology is perfected, laws now barring the blind from
> driving and public perception must be changed, Riccobono said. "This  is 
> the
> piece that we know will be the most difficult," said Riccobono,  adding 
> that
> the car must be near-perfected before the National  Federation of the 
> Blind
> can truly push the car to law-makers and the  general public. He said this
> effort will take millions of dollars in development.
>
>
>
> The 2009-10 student team already is planning major changes to the
> technology, including replacing the dirt buggy vehicle with a fully
> electric car commonly used by traffic officers in downtown city centers.
>
> The all-electric vehicle would reduce the vibration which can cause
> problems to the laser sensor, and it will provide clean electric power 
> for
> the computing units and that is better for the environment.
>
>
>
> Source: Virginia Tech (news : web)
>
>
>
>
>
> Sarah Alawami
>
> msn: chellist at hotmail.com
>
> website: http://www.marrie.org
>
> twitter: http://twitter.com/marrie1
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pajohns1%40vt.edu 



From aguimaraes at nbp.org  Fri Jul 17 15:16:28 2009
From: aguimaraes at nbp.org (Antonio Guimaraes)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 11:16:28 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
References: <A51FC018DF074D7C9E108C2FE48D9574@sacomputer>
Message-ID: <2DC4995A9D63452C909B533D9C3F8602@nbp2.local>

Sarah,

I am not surprised about people voting down the 2007 resolution to put 
effort and funding behing a car the blind can drive. I would have voted 
against it myself.

It is very good to stimulate and promote innovative research into this type 
of thing, but there are more tangible things to be concerned with, so the 
resolution didn't pass, if I remember correctly.

I can't emphasize enough that this kind of research and development is 
exciting, and important.

Skepticism will always come up about these things though, because we don't 
know what the future could hold for a car the blind can drive.

I don't understand how blind people expect to drive safely, sure we know we 
are capable of deciding this and that, and of taking control and making 
driving decisions. But aren't we now fighting to be able to cross streets 
safely? Hybrid cars should be making noise so we know what to do as 
pedestrians, but I wonder how much noise things will need to make for us to 
drive safely.

If cars can have sensord to detect all things on the road for a blind 
driver, why not work on a similar thing for blind pedestrians to cross 
safely?

I don't expect an answer on that question, since I am being a bit of a 
devil's advocate. Pedestrian safety should rest with car manufacturers, but 
if we are fighting this battle with hybrids today, and keep on with a 
mission for a blind driver car, we will be questioned, if not ridiculed.

Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Sarah Alawami" <marrie12 at gmail.com>
To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 4:07 AM
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle


>I did voat against this in 2007 and I still do. Are you surprised?
>
>
>
>
>
> Begin msg
>
>
>
> Mark Riccobono, executive director of the National Federation of the 
> Blind's
> Jernigan Institute, drives the Virginia Tech Blind Driver Challenge 
> vehicle
> through an obstacle course of traffic cones on a campus  parking lot. In 
> the
> passenger seat is Greg Jannaman, who led the  student team within the
> mechanical engineering department during the  past year, and is monitoring
> the software of the vehicle. Credit:
>
> Steven Mackay, Virginia Tech
>
>
>
> A student team in the Virginia Tech College of Engineering is  providing
> the blind with an opportunity many never thought possible:
>
> The opportunity to drive.
>
>
>
> A retrofitted four-wheel dirt buggy developed by the Blind Driver
> Challenge team (http://www.me.vt.edu/blinddriver/) from Virginia  Tech's
> Robotics and Mechanisms Laboratory uses laser range finders, an  instant
> voice command interface and a host of other innovative,  cutting-edge
> technology to guide blind drivers as they steer, brake, and accelerate.
>
> Although in the early testing stage, the National Federation of the  Blind
> -- which spurred the project -- considers the vehicle a major 
> breakthrough
> for independent living of the visually impaired.
>
>
>
> "It was great!" said Wes Majerus, of Baltimore, the first blind person  to
> drive the buggy on a closed course at the Virginia Tech campus this 
> summer.
> Majerus is an access technology specialist with the National  Federation 
> of
> the Blind's Jernigan Institute in Baltimore, a research  and training
> institute dedicated to developing technologies and  services to help the
> blind achieve independence.
>
>
>
> Majerus called his drive a liberating experience, adding that he drove
> before on Nebraska farm roads with his father as a guide in the  passenger
> seat.
>
>
>
> Sitting inside the vehicle, a blind driver can turn the steering  wheel,
> stop and accelerate by following data from a computing unit  that uses
> sensory information from the laser range finder serving as  the 'eyes' of
> the driver, in addition to a combination of voice  commands and a 
> vibrating
> vest as guides. A member of the Virginia Tech  student team sat next to
> Majerus in the passenger seat to monitor the system's software operations.
>
>
>
> "It's a great first step," Majerus added. "As far as the differences
> between human instructions and those given by the voice in the Blind 
> Driver
> Challenge car, the car's instructions are very precise. You use  the
> technology to act on the environment -- the driving course -- in a  very
> orderly manner. In some cases, the human passenger will be vague,  "turn
> left" -- does that mean just a small turn to the left, or are we  going 
> for
> large amounts of turn?"
>
>
>
> Also driving the vehicle was Mark Riccobono, also of Baltimore, the
> executive director of the Jernigan Institute, who also is blind. He 
> called
> his test drive historic. "This is sort of our going to the moon project,"
>
> he said
>
>
>
> In 2004 Jernigan Institute challenged university research teams to 
> develop
> a vehicle that would one day allow the blind to drive.
>
> Virginia Tech was the only university in the nation to accept the
> nonprofit's call two years later, said Dennis Hong, director of the
> Robotics and Mechanisms Laboratory, part of the Virginia Tech mechanical
> engineering department.
>
> The National Federation of the Blind provided a $3,000 grant to launch 
> the
> project.
>
>
>
> "I thought it would be a very rewarding project, helping the blind,"
>
> said Hong, the current faculty adviser on the project. "We are not  only
> excited about the vehicle itself, but more than that, we are  excited 
> about
> the potential of the many spin-off technologies from  this project that 
> can
> be used for helping the blind in so many ways."
>
>
>
> The team will bring the Blind Driver Challenge vehicle to the National
> Federation of the Blind's Youth Slam summer camp event held July 26 
> through
> Aug. 1 in College Park, Md. There, the team hopes to have  teenagers who
> would be obtaining their driver's licenses, but cannot  because of their
> blindness, drive the buggy.
>
>
>
> Wesley Majerus, an access technology specialist with the National
> Federation of the Blind's Jernigan Institute, finishes driving the 
> Virginia
> Tech Blind Driver Challenge vehicle around a roped-off  driving course on 
> a
> campus parking lot. The experience, he said, was liberating.
>
>
>
> Youth participants also are expected to remote control drive miniature
> cars. Additionally, the car is expected to ride in a National  Federation 
> of
> the Blind-sponsored parade in Washington D.C.
>
>
>
> "I most look forward to learning as much as I can from these bright  young
> students," said Greg Jannaman, who led the Virginia Tech student  team in
> his senior year and graduated in May with a bachelor's degree  in 
> mechanical
> engineering. "Blind students from across the nation  apply to be selected 
> to
> attend this summer camp. While we are there to  provide an educational
> experience for them, I can only imagine the  invaluable feedback and fresh
> new ideas that they will provide in return."
>
>
>
> Jannaman is excited about the vehicle's success. "There wasn't a  moment's
> hesitation with any of our blind drivers, whereas  blind-folded sighted
> drivers weren't as quick to let go of their  preconceptions," said 
> Jannaman
> of Hendersonville, Tenn. "The blind  drivers actually performed better 
> than
> their sighted counterparts. An  overwhelming sense of accomplishment
> overcame me as I simply rode  along while Wes and Mark successfully
> navigated the driving course without my assistance."
>
>
>
> Early models of the Blind Driver Challenge vehicle relied more on
> technologies for fully autonomous vehicles, previously developed by
> Virginia Tech mechanical engineering students as part of the DARPA  Urban
> Challenge. The student team redesigned the vehicle so that the  blind
> motorist has complete control of the driving process, as any  sighted 
> driver
> would.
>
>
>
> This change in approach led to new challenges, including how to
> effectively convey the high bandwidth of information from the laser 
> sensors
> scanning the vehicle's surrounding environment to the driver  fast enough
> and accurate enough to allow safe driving. As a result,  the team 
> developed
> non-visual interface technologies, including a  vibrating vest for 
> feedback
> on speed, a click counter steering wheel  with audio cues, spoken commands
> for directional feedback, and a  unique tactile map interface that 
> utilizes
> compressed air to provide  information about the road and obstacles
> surrounding the vehicle.
>
>
>
> Riccobono knows of mock ups and non-working "blind driver car" set-ups
> from the past, but says this is the first working vehicle to put the 
> blind
> and visually impaired in control of the steering wheel. "Blind  people 
> have
> brains, the capacity to make decisions," he said. "Blind  people want to
> live independent lives, why would they not want to drive?"
>
>
>
> Even once the technology is perfected, laws now barring the blind from
> driving and public perception must be changed, Riccobono said. "This  is 
> the
> piece that we know will be the most difficult," said Riccobono,  adding 
> that
> the car must be near-perfected before the National  Federation of the 
> Blind
> can truly push the car to law-makers and the  general public. He said this
> effort will take millions of dollars in development.
>
>
>
> The 2009-10 student team already is planning major changes to the
> technology, including replacing the dirt buggy vehicle with a fully
> electric car commonly used by traffic officers in downtown city centers.
>
> The all-electric vehicle would reduce the vibration which can cause
> problems to the laser sensor, and it will provide clean electric power 
> for
> the computing units and that is better for the environment.
>
>
>
> Source: Virginia Tech (news : web)
>
>
>
>
>
> Sarah Alawami
>
> msn: chellist at hotmail.com
>
> website: http://www.marrie.org
>
> twitter: http://twitter.com/marrie1
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/aguimaraes%40nbp.org
> 




From rjaquiss at earthlink.net  Fri Jul 17 15:56:09 2009
From: rjaquiss at earthlink.net (Robert Jaquiss)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 10:56:09 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
References: <A51FC018DF074D7C9E108C2FE48D9574@sacomputer>
	<2DC4995A9D63452C909B533D9C3F8602@nbp2.local>
Message-ID: <00FF78D7E6BD4BB2827B821206791426@D3DTZP41>

Hello:

     In response to the comments regarding a car drivable by a blind person; 
As a member of the Committee on Research and Development, I believe this is 
important research. It is important that we the NFB are involved with this 
sort of project. Efforts are underway to create autonomous vehicles. Two 
such efforts were the DARPA (Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency) 
Grand Challenges of 2005 and 2007. The 2007 challenge showed that it was 
possible to build a vehicle that could navigate in an urban setting. In the 
coming years, I am confident that there will be vehicles that will drive 
themselves. These vehicles will use a variety of technologies including GPS. 
One thing that will be needed is a way for an operator to get his/her 
vehicle onto a road or maneuver in a parking lot. These activities could I 
think be done by a blind person given the appropriate adaptations. Being 
involved with those doing this sort of research helps ensure that are needs 
are considered when developing new technologies. As an organization, we must 
be proactive and get involved with product developments, so we can continue 
to effectively function in society.

     In the past, it was possible for us to create alternative techniques in 
response to technological developments. With the rapid changes in our world, 
we must be more involved, so we can for example have appliances that we can 
use, computer operating systems that are accessible, accessible cell phones 
etc. A personal vehicle would be of great help in getting to work, school or 
wherever else we want to go.

     The technologies described in the article could also benefit those in 
wheelchairs. Like it or not, we have an aging population. Wheelchair 
mobility is difficult and users must take great care not to roll down steps 
etc. Some sensors might mike their lives easier.

Regards,

Robert Jaquiss



From alberto.2500 at gmail.com  Fri Jul 17 16:48:52 2009
From: alberto.2500 at gmail.com (alberto arreola)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 10:48:52 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
In-Reply-To: <00FF78D7E6BD4BB2827B821206791426@D3DTZP41>
References: <A51FC018DF074D7C9E108C2FE48D9574@sacomputer>	<2DC4995A9D63452C909B533D9C3F8602@nbp2.local>
	<00FF78D7E6BD4BB2827B821206791426@D3DTZP41>
Message-ID: <4a60ab76.1437720a.7274.0f29@mx.google.com>

I know that some of you guys are not very excited about a car that can be
used by a blind person, but I personally think that this is a great thing,
and this wouldn't only benefit blind people that might want one, it would
also benefit people with other disabilities as well.
I'm never against anything new even a car because even though some of you
are against it one day if this car ever comes to be you might change your
minds and be willing to try it out and might like the experience.
Alberto

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Robert Jaquiss
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 9:56 AM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle

Hello:

     In response to the comments regarding a car drivable by a blind person;

As a member of the Committee on Research and Development, I believe this is 
important research. It is important that we the NFB are involved with this 
sort of project. Efforts are underway to create autonomous vehicles. Two 
such efforts were the DARPA (Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency) 
Grand Challenges of 2005 and 2007. The 2007 challenge showed that it was 
possible to build a vehicle that could navigate in an urban setting. In the 
coming years, I am confident that there will be vehicles that will drive 
themselves. These vehicles will use a variety of technologies including GPS.

One thing that will be needed is a way for an operator to get his/her 
vehicle onto a road or maneuver in a parking lot. These activities could I 
think be done by a blind person given the appropriate adaptations. Being 
involved with those doing this sort of research helps ensure that are needs 
are considered when developing new technologies. As an organization, we must

be proactive and get involved with product developments, so we can continue 
to effectively function in society.

     In the past, it was possible for us to create alternative techniques in

response to technological developments. With the rapid changes in our world,

we must be more involved, so we can for example have appliances that we can 
use, computer operating systems that are accessible, accessible cell phones 
etc. A personal vehicle would be of great help in getting to work, school or

wherever else we want to go.

     The technologies described in the article could also benefit those in 
wheelchairs. Like it or not, we have an aging population. Wheelchair 
mobility is difficult and users must take great care not to roll down steps 
etc. Some sensors might mike their lives easier.

Regards,

Robert Jaquiss


_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail
.com



From pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net  Fri Jul 17 17:41:07 2009
From: pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net (Peter Donahue)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 12:41:07 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
References: <A51FC018DF074D7C9E108C2FE48D9574@sacomputer>
	<2DC4995A9D63452C909B533D9C3F8602@nbp2.local>
Message-ID: <000f01ca0705$c4fac480$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn>

Hello Antonio and listers,

    Then how about getting on board with it and supporting future 
resolutions and efforts to make such a vehicle a reality. Remember this the 
next time paratransit is late, fails to show up, or busses don't run in a 
particular community you wish to visit or live  causing you to be confined 
to the urban environment, miss an important test or worse lose a job 
opportunity due to the unavailability of public transportation. How 
different it would be if you could jump in the car and drive yourself there 
rather than relying on public transit.

    This is just scratching the surface. Being able to live where one wants 
to live, go when one wants to go without being restricted by the 
availability or lack of public transportation in one's community is not just 
awesome, it's empowering!!!

Peter Donahue

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Antonio Guimaraes" <aguimaraes at nbp.org>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 10:16 AM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle


Sarah,

I am not surprised about people voting down the 2007 resolution to put
effort and funding behing a car the blind can drive. I would have voted
against it myself.

It is very good to stimulate and promote innovative research into this type
of thing, but there are more tangible things to be concerned with, so the
resolution didn't pass, if I remember correctly.

I can't emphasize enough that this kind of research and development is
exciting, and important.

Skepticism will always come up about these things though, because we don't
know what the future could hold for a car the blind can drive.

I don't understand how blind people expect to drive safely, sure we know we
are capable of deciding this and that, and of taking control and making
driving decisions. But aren't we now fighting to be able to cross streets
safely? Hybrid cars should be making noise so we know what to do as
pedestrians, but I wonder how much noise things will need to make for us to
drive safely.

If cars can have sensord to detect all things on the road for a blind
driver, why not work on a similar thing for blind pedestrians to cross
safely?

I don't expect an answer on that question, since I am being a bit of a
devil's advocate. Pedestrian safety should rest with car manufacturers, but
if we are fighting this battle with hybrids today, and keep on with a
mission for a blind driver car, we will be questioned, if not ridiculed.

Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Sarah Alawami" <marrie12 at gmail.com>
To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 4:07 AM
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle


>I did voat against this in 2007 and I still do. Are you surprised?
>
>
>
>
>
> Begin msg
>
>
>
> Mark Riccobono, executive director of the National Federation of the
> Blind's
> Jernigan Institute, drives the Virginia Tech Blind Driver Challenge
> vehicle
> through an obstacle course of traffic cones on a campus  parking lot. In
> the
> passenger seat is Greg Jannaman, who led the  student team within the
> mechanical engineering department during the  past year, and is monitoring
> the software of the vehicle. Credit:
>
> Steven Mackay, Virginia Tech
>
>
>
> A student team in the Virginia Tech College of Engineering is  providing
> the blind with an opportunity many never thought possible:
>
> The opportunity to drive.
>
>
>
> A retrofitted four-wheel dirt buggy developed by the Blind Driver
> Challenge team (http://www.me.vt.edu/blinddriver/) from Virginia  Tech's
> Robotics and Mechanisms Laboratory uses laser range finders, an  instant
> voice command interface and a host of other innovative,  cutting-edge
> technology to guide blind drivers as they steer, brake, and accelerate.
>
> Although in the early testing stage, the National Federation of the  Blind
> -- which spurred the project -- considers the vehicle a major
> breakthrough
> for independent living of the visually impaired.
>
>
>
> "It was great!" said Wes Majerus, of Baltimore, the first blind person  to
> drive the buggy on a closed course at the Virginia Tech campus this
> summer.
> Majerus is an access technology specialist with the National  Federation
> of
> the Blind's Jernigan Institute in Baltimore, a research  and training
> institute dedicated to developing technologies and  services to help the
> blind achieve independence.
>
>
>
> Majerus called his drive a liberating experience, adding that he drove
> before on Nebraska farm roads with his father as a guide in the  passenger
> seat.
>
>
>
> Sitting inside the vehicle, a blind driver can turn the steering  wheel,
> stop and accelerate by following data from a computing unit  that uses
> sensory information from the laser range finder serving as  the 'eyes' of
> the driver, in addition to a combination of voice  commands and a
> vibrating
> vest as guides. A member of the Virginia Tech  student team sat next to
> Majerus in the passenger seat to monitor the system's software operations.
>
>
>
> "It's a great first step," Majerus added. "As far as the differences
> between human instructions and those given by the voice in the Blind
> Driver
> Challenge car, the car's instructions are very precise. You use  the
> technology to act on the environment -- the driving course -- in a  very
> orderly manner. In some cases, the human passenger will be vague,  "turn
> left" -- does that mean just a small turn to the left, or are we  going
> for
> large amounts of turn?"
>
>
>
> Also driving the vehicle was Mark Riccobono, also of Baltimore, the
> executive director of the Jernigan Institute, who also is blind. He
> called
> his test drive historic. "This is sort of our going to the moon project,"
>
> he said
>
>
>
> In 2004 Jernigan Institute challenged university research teams to
> develop
> a vehicle that would one day allow the blind to drive.
>
> Virginia Tech was the only university in the nation to accept the
> nonprofit's call two years later, said Dennis Hong, director of the
> Robotics and Mechanisms Laboratory, part of the Virginia Tech mechanical
> engineering department.
>
> The National Federation of the Blind provided a $3,000 grant to launch
> the
> project.
>
>
>
> "I thought it would be a very rewarding project, helping the blind,"
>
> said Hong, the current faculty adviser on the project. "We are not  only
> excited about the vehicle itself, but more than that, we are  excited
> about
> the potential of the many spin-off technologies from  this project that
> can
> be used for helping the blind in so many ways."
>
>
>
> The team will bring the Blind Driver Challenge vehicle to the National
> Federation of the Blind's Youth Slam summer camp event held July 26
> through
> Aug. 1 in College Park, Md. There, the team hopes to have  teenagers who
> would be obtaining their driver's licenses, but cannot  because of their
> blindness, drive the buggy.
>
>
>
> Wesley Majerus, an access technology specialist with the National
> Federation of the Blind's Jernigan Institute, finishes driving the
> Virginia
> Tech Blind Driver Challenge vehicle around a roped-off  driving course on
> a
> campus parking lot. The experience, he said, was liberating.
>
>
>
> Youth participants also are expected to remote control drive miniature
> cars. Additionally, the car is expected to ride in a National  Federation
> of
> the Blind-sponsored parade in Washington D.C.
>
>
>
> "I most look forward to learning as much as I can from these bright  young
> students," said Greg Jannaman, who led the Virginia Tech student  team in
> his senior year and graduated in May with a bachelor's degree  in
> mechanical
> engineering. "Blind students from across the nation  apply to be selected
> to
> attend this summer camp. While we are there to  provide an educational
> experience for them, I can only imagine the  invaluable feedback and fresh
> new ideas that they will provide in return."
>
>
>
> Jannaman is excited about the vehicle's success. "There wasn't a  moment's
> hesitation with any of our blind drivers, whereas  blind-folded sighted
> drivers weren't as quick to let go of their  preconceptions," said
> Jannaman
> of Hendersonville, Tenn. "The blind  drivers actually performed better
> than
> their sighted counterparts. An  overwhelming sense of accomplishment
> overcame me as I simply rode  along while Wes and Mark successfully
> navigated the driving course without my assistance."
>
>
>
> Early models of the Blind Driver Challenge vehicle relied more on
> technologies for fully autonomous vehicles, previously developed by
> Virginia Tech mechanical engineering students as part of the DARPA  Urban
> Challenge. The student team redesigned the vehicle so that the  blind
> motorist has complete control of the driving process, as any  sighted
> driver
> would.
>
>
>
> This change in approach led to new challenges, including how to
> effectively convey the high bandwidth of information from the laser
> sensors
> scanning the vehicle's surrounding environment to the driver  fast enough
> and accurate enough to allow safe driving. As a result,  the team
> developed
> non-visual interface technologies, including a  vibrating vest for
> feedback
> on speed, a click counter steering wheel  with audio cues, spoken commands
> for directional feedback, and a  unique tactile map interface that
> utilizes
> compressed air to provide  information about the road and obstacles
> surrounding the vehicle.
>
>
>
> Riccobono knows of mock ups and non-working "blind driver car" set-ups
> from the past, but says this is the first working vehicle to put the
> blind
> and visually impaired in control of the steering wheel. "Blind  people
> have
> brains, the capacity to make decisions," he said. "Blind  people want to
> live independent lives, why would they not want to drive?"
>
>
>
> Even once the technology is perfected, laws now barring the blind from
> driving and public perception must be changed, Riccobono said. "This  is
> the
> piece that we know will be the most difficult," said Riccobono,  adding
> that
> the car must be near-perfected before the National  Federation of the
> Blind
> can truly push the car to law-makers and the  general public. He said this
> effort will take millions of dollars in development.
>
>
>
> The 2009-10 student team already is planning major changes to the
> technology, including replacing the dirt buggy vehicle with a fully
> electric car commonly used by traffic officers in downtown city centers.
>
> The all-electric vehicle would reduce the vibration which can cause
> problems to the laser sensor, and it will provide clean electric power
> for
> the computing units and that is better for the environment.
>
>
>
> Source: Virginia Tech (news : web)
>
>
>
>
>
> Sarah Alawami
>
> msn: chellist at hotmail.com
>
> website: http://www.marrie.org
>
> twitter: http://twitter.com/marrie1
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/aguimaraes%40nbp.org
>



_______________________________________________
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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
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From aguimaraes at nbp.org  Fri Jul 17 17:50:59 2009
From: aguimaraes at nbp.org (Antonio Guimaraes)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 13:50:59 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Can a blind person win a nobel prise? a video
Message-ID: <C771689A54C945D3A6825CEF6FFF0B60@nbp2.local>

Hi all, 

Here is a youtube video from Marc Maurer talking about how you stimulate a blind student. 

Follow the link, and check it out.

Antonio guimaraes

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h1BviHWCX0s&feature=related

From raniaismail04 at gmail.com  Fri Jul 17 18:24:21 2009
From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 14:24:21 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
References: <A51FC018DF074D7C9E108C2FE48D9574@sacomputer>	<2DC4995A9D63452C909B533D9C3F8602@nbp2.local><00FF78D7E6BD4BB2827B821206791426@D3DTZP41>
	<4a60ab76.1437720a.7274.0f29@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <008101ca070b$cf9c6b90$2801a8c0@DHQ5QJF1>

I am hoping this comes about because I would like to be able to go whare 
ever I want too independently with out having to wait for a bus cab or hav 
to depend on someone to get me to school or any place I want to go.
Rania,
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "alberto arreola" <alberto.2500 at gmail.com>
To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 12:48 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle


>I know that some of you guys are not very excited about a car that can be
> used by a blind person, but I personally think that this is a great thing,
> and this wouldn't only benefit blind people that might want one, it would
> also benefit people with other disabilities as well.
> I'm never against anything new even a car because even though some of you
> are against it one day if this car ever comes to be you might change your
> minds and be willing to try it out and might like the experience.
> Alberto
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
> Behalf
> Of Robert Jaquiss
> Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 9:56 AM
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
>
> Hello:
>
>     In response to the comments regarding a car drivable by a blind 
> person;
>
> As a member of the Committee on Research and Development, I believe this 
> is
> important research. It is important that we the NFB are involved with this
> sort of project. Efforts are underway to create autonomous vehicles. Two
> such efforts were the DARPA (Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency)
> Grand Challenges of 2005 and 2007. The 2007 challenge showed that it was
> possible to build a vehicle that could navigate in an urban setting. In 
> the
> coming years, I am confident that there will be vehicles that will drive
> themselves. These vehicles will use a variety of technologies including 
> GPS.
>
> One thing that will be needed is a way for an operator to get his/her
> vehicle onto a road or maneuver in a parking lot. These activities could I
> think be done by a blind person given the appropriate adaptations. Being
> involved with those doing this sort of research helps ensure that are 
> needs
> are considered when developing new technologies. As an organization, we 
> must
>
> be proactive and get involved with product developments, so we can 
> continue
> to effectively function in society.
>
>     In the past, it was possible for us to create alternative techniques 
> in
>
> response to technological developments. With the rapid changes in our 
> world,
>
> we must be more involved, so we can for example have appliances that we 
> can
> use, computer operating systems that are accessible, accessible cell 
> phones
> etc. A personal vehicle would be of great help in getting to work, school 
> or
>
> wherever else we want to go.
>
>     The technologies described in the article could also benefit those in
> wheelchairs. Like it or not, we have an aging population. Wheelchair
> mobility is difficult and users must take great care not to roll down 
> steps
> etc. Some sensors might mike their lives easier.
>
> Regards,
>
> Robert Jaquiss
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
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> .com
>
>
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From aguimaraes at nbp.org  Fri Jul 17 18:33:26 2009
From: aguimaraes at nbp.org (Antonio Guimaraes)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 14:33:26 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
References: <A51FC018DF074D7C9E108C2FE48D9574@sacomputer><2DC4995A9D63452C909B533D9C3F8602@nbp2.local>
	<000f01ca0705$c4fac480$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn>
Message-ID: <77EDDEC69CCC4B4FA4C5C01881956133@nbp2.local>

Pete,

It is too expensive, uncertain, and risky to put so much money and effort 
into a project like that.

I certainly think we aught to be involved, very involved in making it 
happen, but there is just not enough money to go around.

We have too many coins to sell, too many people to teach braille to, and too 
many new jobs to make available to blind people, and I don't see us tying 
the $500000 or so from the imagination fund into such a tremendously 
humungously enormous project like a car we will drive.

I love the concept, want it to happen, and want to see it through, but not 
enough to put all other projects on the back burner.

I've heard of autonomous vehicles for some time, projects and things that 
have been done in the past to tighten up traffic on highways and drastically 
improve the transportation system, and the way we travel, but nothing 
serious ever came from these interesting outbursts of research and dreaming.

I am all for the thing, but don't see how we could consciously fund it and 
feel it to be effective and good investment.

Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Peter Donahue" <pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 1:41 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle


> Hello Antonio and listers,
>
>    Then how about getting on board with it and supporting future
> resolutions and efforts to make such a vehicle a reality. Remember this 
> the
> next time paratransit is late, fails to show up, or busses don't run in a
> particular community you wish to visit or live  causing you to be confined
> to the urban environment, miss an important test or worse lose a job
> opportunity due to the unavailability of public transportation. How
> different it would be if you could jump in the car and drive yourself 
> there
> rather than relying on public transit.
>
>    This is just scratching the surface. Being able to live where one wants
> to live, go when one wants to go without being restricted by the
> availability or lack of public transportation in one's community is not 
> just
> awesome, it's empowering!!!
>
> Peter Donahue
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Antonio Guimaraes" <aguimaraes at nbp.org>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 10:16 AM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
>
>
> Sarah,
>
> I am not surprised about people voting down the 2007 resolution to put
> effort and funding behing a car the blind can drive. I would have voted
> against it myself.
>
> It is very good to stimulate and promote innovative research into this 
> type
> of thing, but there are more tangible things to be concerned with, so the
> resolution didn't pass, if I remember correctly.
>
> I can't emphasize enough that this kind of research and development is
> exciting, and important.
>
> Skepticism will always come up about these things though, because we don't
> know what the future could hold for a car the blind can drive.
>
> I don't understand how blind people expect to drive safely, sure we know 
> we
> are capable of deciding this and that, and of taking control and making
> driving decisions. But aren't we now fighting to be able to cross streets
> safely? Hybrid cars should be making noise so we know what to do as
> pedestrians, but I wonder how much noise things will need to make for us 
> to
> drive safely.
>
> If cars can have sensord to detect all things on the road for a blind
> driver, why not work on a similar thing for blind pedestrians to cross
> safely?
>
> I don't expect an answer on that question, since I am being a bit of a
> devil's advocate. Pedestrian safety should rest with car manufacturers, 
> but
> if we are fighting this battle with hybrids today, and keep on with a
> mission for a blind driver car, we will be questioned, if not ridiculed.
>
> Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr.
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Sarah Alawami" <marrie12 at gmail.com>
> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 4:07 AM
> Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
>
>
>>I did voat against this in 2007 and I still do. Are you surprised?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Begin msg
>>
>>
>>
>> Mark Riccobono, executive director of the National Federation of the
>> Blind's
>> Jernigan Institute, drives the Virginia Tech Blind Driver Challenge
>> vehicle
>> through an obstacle course of traffic cones on a campus  parking lot. In
>> the
>> passenger seat is Greg Jannaman, who led the  student team within the
>> mechanical engineering department during the  past year, and is 
>> monitoring
>> the software of the vehicle. Credit:
>>
>> Steven Mackay, Virginia Tech
>>
>>
>>
>> A student team in the Virginia Tech College of Engineering is  providing
>> the blind with an opportunity many never thought possible:
>>
>> The opportunity to drive.
>>
>>
>>
>> A retrofitted four-wheel dirt buggy developed by the Blind Driver
>> Challenge team (http://www.me.vt.edu/blinddriver/) from Virginia  Tech's
>> Robotics and Mechanisms Laboratory uses laser range finders, an  instant
>> voice command interface and a host of other innovative,  cutting-edge
>> technology to guide blind drivers as they steer, brake, and accelerate.
>>
>> Although in the early testing stage, the National Federation of the 
>> Blind
>> -- which spurred the project -- considers the vehicle a major
>> breakthrough
>> for independent living of the visually impaired.
>>
>>
>>
>> "It was great!" said Wes Majerus, of Baltimore, the first blind person 
>> to
>> drive the buggy on a closed course at the Virginia Tech campus this
>> summer.
>> Majerus is an access technology specialist with the National  Federation
>> of
>> the Blind's Jernigan Institute in Baltimore, a research  and training
>> institute dedicated to developing technologies and  services to help the
>> blind achieve independence.
>>
>>
>>
>> Majerus called his drive a liberating experience, adding that he drove
>> before on Nebraska farm roads with his father as a guide in the 
>> passenger
>> seat.
>>
>>
>>
>> Sitting inside the vehicle, a blind driver can turn the steering  wheel,
>> stop and accelerate by following data from a computing unit  that uses
>> sensory information from the laser range finder serving as  the 'eyes' of
>> the driver, in addition to a combination of voice  commands and a
>> vibrating
>> vest as guides. A member of the Virginia Tech  student team sat next to
>> Majerus in the passenger seat to monitor the system's software 
>> operations.
>>
>>
>>
>> "It's a great first step," Majerus added. "As far as the differences
>> between human instructions and those given by the voice in the Blind
>> Driver
>> Challenge car, the car's instructions are very precise. You use  the
>> technology to act on the environment -- the driving course -- in a  very
>> orderly manner. In some cases, the human passenger will be vague,  "turn
>> left" -- does that mean just a small turn to the left, or are we  going
>> for
>> large amounts of turn?"
>>
>>
>>
>> Also driving the vehicle was Mark Riccobono, also of Baltimore, the
>> executive director of the Jernigan Institute, who also is blind. He
>> called
>> his test drive historic. "This is sort of our going to the moon project,"
>>
>> he said
>>
>>
>>
>> In 2004 Jernigan Institute challenged university research teams to
>> develop
>> a vehicle that would one day allow the blind to drive.
>>
>> Virginia Tech was the only university in the nation to accept the
>> nonprofit's call two years later, said Dennis Hong, director of the
>> Robotics and Mechanisms Laboratory, part of the Virginia Tech mechanical
>> engineering department.
>>
>> The National Federation of the Blind provided a $3,000 grant to launch
>> the
>> project.
>>
>>
>>
>> "I thought it would be a very rewarding project, helping the blind,"
>>
>> said Hong, the current faculty adviser on the project. "We are not  only
>> excited about the vehicle itself, but more than that, we are  excited
>> about
>> the potential of the many spin-off technologies from  this project that
>> can
>> be used for helping the blind in so many ways."
>>
>>
>>
>> The team will bring the Blind Driver Challenge vehicle to the National
>> Federation of the Blind's Youth Slam summer camp event held July 26
>> through
>> Aug. 1 in College Park, Md. There, the team hopes to have  teenagers who
>> would be obtaining their driver's licenses, but cannot  because of their
>> blindness, drive the buggy.
>>
>>
>>
>> Wesley Majerus, an access technology specialist with the National
>> Federation of the Blind's Jernigan Institute, finishes driving the
>> Virginia
>> Tech Blind Driver Challenge vehicle around a roped-off  driving course on
>> a
>> campus parking lot. The experience, he said, was liberating.
>>
>>
>>
>> Youth participants also are expected to remote control drive miniature
>> cars. Additionally, the car is expected to ride in a National  Federation
>> of
>> the Blind-sponsored parade in Washington D.C.
>>
>>
>>
>> "I most look forward to learning as much as I can from these bright 
>> young
>> students," said Greg Jannaman, who led the Virginia Tech student  team in
>> his senior year and graduated in May with a bachelor's degree  in
>> mechanical
>> engineering. "Blind students from across the nation  apply to be selected
>> to
>> attend this summer camp. While we are there to  provide an educational
>> experience for them, I can only imagine the  invaluable feedback and 
>> fresh
>> new ideas that they will provide in return."
>>
>>
>>
>> Jannaman is excited about the vehicle's success. "There wasn't a 
>> moment's
>> hesitation with any of our blind drivers, whereas  blind-folded sighted
>> drivers weren't as quick to let go of their  preconceptions," said
>> Jannaman
>> of Hendersonville, Tenn. "The blind  drivers actually performed better
>> than
>> their sighted counterparts. An  overwhelming sense of accomplishment
>> overcame me as I simply rode  along while Wes and Mark successfully
>> navigated the driving course without my assistance."
>>
>>
>>
>> Early models of the Blind Driver Challenge vehicle relied more on
>> technologies for fully autonomous vehicles, previously developed by
>> Virginia Tech mechanical engineering students as part of the DARPA  Urban
>> Challenge. The student team redesigned the vehicle so that the  blind
>> motorist has complete control of the driving process, as any  sighted
>> driver
>> would.
>>
>>
>>
>> This change in approach led to new challenges, including how to
>> effectively convey the high bandwidth of information from the laser
>> sensors
>> scanning the vehicle's surrounding environment to the driver  fast enough
>> and accurate enough to allow safe driving. As a result,  the team
>> developed
>> non-visual interface technologies, including a  vibrating vest for
>> feedback
>> on speed, a click counter steering wheel  with audio cues, spoken 
>> commands
>> for directional feedback, and a  unique tactile map interface that
>> utilizes
>> compressed air to provide  information about the road and obstacles
>> surrounding the vehicle.
>>
>>
>>
>> Riccobono knows of mock ups and non-working "blind driver car" set-ups
>> from the past, but says this is the first working vehicle to put the
>> blind
>> and visually impaired in control of the steering wheel. "Blind  people
>> have
>> brains, the capacity to make decisions," he said. "Blind  people want to
>> live independent lives, why would they not want to drive?"
>>
>>
>>
>> Even once the technology is perfected, laws now barring the blind from
>> driving and public perception must be changed, Riccobono said. "This  is
>> the
>> piece that we know will be the most difficult," said Riccobono,  adding
>> that
>> the car must be near-perfected before the National  Federation of the
>> Blind
>> can truly push the car to law-makers and the  general public. He said 
>> this
>> effort will take millions of dollars in development.
>>
>>
>>
>> The 2009-10 student team already is planning major changes to the
>> technology, including replacing the dirt buggy vehicle with a fully
>> electric car commonly used by traffic officers in downtown city centers.
>>
>> The all-electric vehicle would reduce the vibration which can cause
>> problems to the laser sensor, and it will provide clean electric power
>> for
>> the computing units and that is better for the environment.
>>
>>
>>
>> Source: Virginia Tech (news : web)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sarah Alawami
>>
>> msn: chellist at hotmail.com
>>
>> website: http://www.marrie.org
>>
>> twitter: http://twitter.com/marrie1
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/aguimaraes%40nbp.org
>>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
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> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
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>
>
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> 




From pajohns1 at vt.edu  Fri Jul 17 18:44:59 2009
From: pajohns1 at vt.edu (pajohns1 at vt.edu)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 14:44:59 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
References: <A51FC018DF074D7C9E108C2FE48D9574@sacomputer>
	<2DC4995A9D63452C909B533D9C3F8602@nbp2.local>
	<00FF78D7E6BD4BB2827B821206791426@D3DTZP41>
	<4a60ab76.1437720a.7274.0f29@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <8691E406313E4ED8B7723B9E4E5AC9D9@useripvq7z5u3t>


        So folks don't misunderstand my earlier post.  I think the blind 
driver challenge and the hybrid vehicle sound warning system (both projects 
being pursued here at Virginia Tech) are great projects and I hope to 
continue assisting with both projects.  My point about the blind getting 
behind the wheel is that the news pieces posted the last two days painted 
what I consider to be an overly rosey picture of the technology.

        From my perspective the technology in Virginia Tech's vehicle is 
like a toddler learning to walk, a little unstable, still learning to 
control his or her arms and legs and having the response times to reflect 
this.  Given funding and time to conduct further research, perform a ton 
more testing the toddler will eventually learn to walk, talk, and chew gum. 
At that time the vehicle may be ready to move from an interesting research 
project to a product ready for the commerical market.

        The NFB should support forward looking projects, but balance the 
expectations with accurate prose and realistic descriptions of where the 
technology is at.

Patrick
@Virginia Tech 



From riss287 at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 17 19:06:49 2009
From: riss287 at yahoo.com (Marissa Slaughter)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 12:06:49 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
In-Reply-To: <008101ca070b$cf9c6b90$2801a8c0@DHQ5QJF1>
Message-ID: <407100.91596.qm@web32604.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I agree with you, Rania. I absolutely hate to be late, but it seems that cabs, buses, family members and friends do not feel the need to be on time to anything. Being able to drive would be an immense help to me. On the other hand, I think it will be quite a while before this technology is perfected. 
 
Marissa

--- On Fri, 7/17/09, Rania <raniaismail04 at gmail.com> wrote:


From: Rania <raniaismail04 at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Date: Friday, July 17, 2009, 2:24 PM


I am hoping this comes about because I would like to be able to go whare ever I want too independently with out having to wait for a bus cab or hav to depend on someone to get me to school or any place I want to go.
Rania,
----- Original Message ----- From: "alberto arreola" <alberto.2500 at gmail.com>
To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 12:48 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle


> I know that some of you guys are not very excited about a car that can be
> used by a blind person, but I personally think that this is a great thing,
> and this wouldn't only benefit blind people that might want one, it would
> also benefit people with other disabilities as well.
> I'm never against anything new even a car because even though some of you
> are against it one day if this car ever comes to be you might change your
> minds and be willing to try it out and might like the experience.
> Alberto
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
> Of Robert Jaquiss
> Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 9:56 AM
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
> 
> Hello:
> 
>     In response to the comments regarding a car drivable by a blind person;
> 
> As a member of the Committee on Research and Development, I believe this is
> important research. It is important that we the NFB are involved with this
> sort of project. Efforts are underway to create autonomous vehicles. Two
> such efforts were the DARPA (Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency)
> Grand Challenges of 2005 and 2007. The 2007 challenge showed that it was
> possible to build a vehicle that could navigate in an urban setting. In the
> coming years, I am confident that there will be vehicles that will drive
> themselves. These vehicles will use a variety of technologies including GPS.
> 
> One thing that will be needed is a way for an operator to get his/her
> vehicle onto a road or maneuver in a parking lot. These activities could I
> think be done by a blind person given the appropriate adaptations. Being
> involved with those doing this sort of research helps ensure that are needs
> are considered when developing new technologies. As an organization, we must
> 
> be proactive and get involved with product developments, so we can continue
> to effectively function in society.
> 
>     In the past, it was possible for us to create alternative techniques in
> 
> response to technological developments. With the rapid changes in our world,
> 
> we must be more involved, so we can for example have appliances that we can
> use, computer operating systems that are accessible, accessible cell phones
> etc. A personal vehicle would be of great help in getting to work, school or
> 
> wherever else we want to go.
> 
>     The technologies described in the article could also benefit those in
> wheelchairs. Like it or not, we have an aging population. Wheelchair
> mobility is difficult and users must take great care not to roll down steps
> etc. Some sensors might mike their lives easier.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Robert Jaquiss
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail
> .com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmail.com 


_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
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From loneblindjedi at samobile.net  Fri Jul 17 19:19:21 2009
From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 15:19:21 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
Message-ID: <20090717191921.17416.94103@web3.serotek.com>

Hi.

Personally, I would like a vehicle where I have an autopilot option 
where the car drives for me, or I can choose to drive myself with its 
instructions. And perhaps, I can assign certain functions to the 
computer and do the rest myself. That's just me. Really though, I've 
always dreamed of hiring an artificial intelligence, especially if it 
has a body of its own such as an android or something. I've always been 
fascinated with aritifical intelligences. I'd love to interview one and 
see what I come out with. In fact, it's a lifetime of mine to do so. My 
other lifetime goal is to meet an honest to goodness person from 
somewhere other than Earth. Any guesses which will happen first?

Respectfully,
Jedi


Original message:
> Hello:

>      In response to the comments regarding a car drivable by a blind person;
> As a member of the Committee on Research and Development, I believe this is
> important research. It is important that we the NFB are involved with this
> sort of project. Efforts are underway to create autonomous vehicles. Two
> such efforts were the DARPA (Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency)
> Grand Challenges of 2005 and 2007. The 2007 challenge showed that it was
> possible to build a vehicle that could navigate in an urban setting. In the
> coming years, I am confident that there will be vehicles that will drive
> themselves. These vehicles will use a variety of technologies including GPS.
> One thing that will be needed is a way for an operator to get his/her
> vehicle onto a road or maneuver in a parking lot. These activities could I
> think be done by a blind person given the appropriate adaptations. Being
> involved with those doing this sort of research helps ensure that are needs
> are considered when developing new technologies. As an organization, we must
> be proactive and get involved with product developments, so we can continue
> to effectively function in society.

>      In the past, it was possible for us to create alternative techniques in
> response to technological developments. With the rapid changes in our world,
> we must be more involved, so we can for example have appliances that we can
> use, computer operating systems that are accessible, accessible cell phones
> etc. A personal vehicle would be of great help in getting to work, school or
> wherever else we want to go.

>      The technologies described in the article could also benefit those in
> wheelchairs. Like it or not, we have an aging population. Wheelchair
> mobility is difficult and users must take great care not to roll down steps
> etc. Some sensors might mike their lives easier.

> Regards,

> Robert Jaquiss


> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net

-- 
Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.  Visit 
www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.


From loneblindjedi at samobile.net  Fri Jul 17 19:25:24 2009
From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 15:25:24 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
Message-ID: <20090717192524.17412.75892@web3.serotek.com>

Antonio,

The reason why we'd need extra guidence in a car is because we don't 
have direct contact with our environment the same way we do when we're 
pedestrians (either on foot in or a wheelchair). Also, cars go much 
faster than humans can, so that guidence is necessary because light 
travels fast enough to allow the sighted to use it via their eyeballs. 
Since we don't have a working equivillent, we need a bit of extra help. 
I don't think that deserves ridicule at all. And yes, I also voted 
against the resolution in '07 because I also thought we had bigger fish 
to fry. We still do, but I also agree that offering consultation to 
those building these things is a good idea. Otherwise, they'll build 
stuff based on perceived needs rather than real ones.

Respectfully Submitted
Original message:
> Hello Antonio and listers,

>     Then how about getting on board with it and supporting future
> resolutions and efforts to make such a vehicle a reality. Remember this the
> next time paratransit is late, fails to show up, or busses don't run in a
> particular community you wish to visit or live  causing you to be confined
> to the urban environment, miss an important test or worse lose a job
> opportunity due to the unavailability of public transportation. How
> different it would be if you could jump in the car and drive yourself there
> rather than relying on public transit.

>     This is just scratching the surface. Being able to live where one wants
> to live, go when one wants to go without being restricted by the
> availability or lack of public transportation in one's community is not just
> awesome, it's empowering!!!

> Peter Donahue

> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Antonio Guimaraes" <aguimaraes at nbp.org>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 10:16 AM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle


> Sarah,

> I am not surprised about people voting down the 2007 resolution to put
> effort and funding behing a car the blind can drive. I would have voted
> against it myself.

> It is very good to stimulate and promote innovative research into this type
> of thing, but there are more tangible things to be concerned with, so the
> resolution didn't pass, if I remember correctly.

> I can't emphasize enough that this kind of research and development is
> exciting, and important.

> Skepticism will always come up about these things though, because we don't
> know what the future could hold for a car the blind can drive.

> I don't understand how blind people expect to drive safely, sure we know we
> are capable of deciding this and that, and of taking control and making
> driving decisions. But aren't we now fighting to be able to cross streets
> safely? Hybrid cars should be making noise so we know what to do as
> pedestrians, but I wonder how much noise things will need to make for us to
> drive safely.

> If cars can have sensord to detect all things on the road for a blind
> driver, why not work on a similar thing for blind pedestrians to cross
> safely?

> I don't expect an answer on that question, since I am being a bit of a
> devil's advocate. Pedestrian safety should rest with car manufacturers, but
> if we are fighting this battle with hybrids today, and keep on with a
> mission for a blind driver car, we will be questioned, if not ridiculed.

> Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr.

> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Sarah Alawami" <marrie12 at gmail.com>
> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 4:07 AM
> Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle


>> I did voat against this in 2007 and I still do. Are you surprised?





>> Begin msg



>> Mark Riccobono, executive director of the National Federation of the
>> Blind's
>> Jernigan Institute, drives the Virginia Tech Blind Driver Challenge
>> vehicle
>> through an obstacle course of traffic cones on a campus  parking lot. In
>> the
>> passenger seat is Greg Jannaman, who led the  student team within the
>> mechanical engineering department during the  past year, and is monitoring
>> the software of the vehicle. Credit:

>> Steven Mackay, Virginia Tech



>> A student team in the Virginia Tech College of Engineering is  providing
>> the blind with an opportunity many never thought possible:

>> The opportunity to drive.



>> A retrofitted four-wheel dirt buggy developed by the Blind Driver
>> Challenge team (http://www.me.vt.edu/blinddriver/) from Virginia  Tech's
>> Robotics and Mechanisms Laboratory uses laser range finders, an  instant
>> voice command interface and a host of other innovative,  cutting-edge
>> technology to guide blind drivers as they steer, brake, and accelerate.

>> Although in the early testing stage, the National Federation of the  Blind
>> -- which spurred the project -- considers the vehicle a major
>> breakthrough
>> for independent living of the visually impaired.



>> "It was great!" said Wes Majerus, of Baltimore, the first blind person  to
>> drive the buggy on a closed course at the Virginia Tech campus this
>> summer.
>> Majerus is an access technology specialist with the National  Federation
>> of
>> the Blind's Jernigan Institute in Baltimore, a research  and training
>> institute dedicated to developing technologies and  services to help the
>> blind achieve independence.



>> Majerus called his drive a liberating experience, adding that he drove
>> before on Nebraska farm roads with his father as a guide in the  passenger
>> seat.



>> Sitting inside the vehicle, a blind driver can turn the steering  wheel,
>> stop and accelerate by following data from a computing unit  that uses
>> sensory information from the laser range finder serving as  the 'eyes' of
>> the driver, in addition to a combination of voice  commands and a
>> vibrating
>> vest as guides. A member of the Virginia Tech  student team sat next to
>> Majerus in the passenger seat to monitor the system's software operations.



>> "It's a great first step," Majerus added. "As far as the differences
>> between human instructions and those given by the voice in the Blind
>> Driver
>> Challenge car, the car's instructions are very precise. You use  the
>> technology to act on the environment -- the driving course -- in a  very
>> orderly manner. In some cases, the human passenger will be vague,  "turn
>> left" -- does that mean just a small turn to the left, or are we  going
>> for
>> large amounts of turn?"



>> Also driving the vehicle was Mark Riccobono, also of Baltimore, the
>> executive director of the Jernigan Institute, who also is blind. He
>> called
>> his test drive historic. "This is sort of our going to the moon project,"

>> he said



>> In 2004 Jernigan Institute challenged university research teams to
>> develop
>> a vehicle that would one day allow the blind to drive.

>> Virginia Tech was the only university in the nation to accept the
>> nonprofit's call two years later, said Dennis Hong, director of the
>> Robotics and Mechanisms Laboratory, part of the Virginia Tech mechanical
>> engineering department.

>> The National Federation of the Blind provided a $3,000 grant to launch
>> the
>> project.



>> "I thought it would be a very rewarding project, helping the blind,"

>> said Hong, the current faculty adviser on the project. "We are not  only
>> excited about the vehicle itself, but more than that, we are  excited
>> about
>> the potential of the many spin-off technologies from  this project that
>> can
>> be used for helping the blind in so many ways."



>> The team will bring the Blind Driver Challenge vehicle to the National
>> Federation of the Blind's Youth Slam summer camp event held July 26
>> through
>> Aug. 1 in College Park, Md. There, the team hopes to have  teenagers who
>> would be obtaining their driver's licenses, but cannot  because of their
>> blindness, drive the buggy.



>> Wesley Majerus, an access technology specialist with the National
>> Federation of the Blind's Jernigan Institute, finishes driving the
>> Virginia
>> Tech Blind Driver Challenge vehicle around a roped-off  driving course on
>> a
>> campus parking lot. The experience, he said, was liberating.



>> Youth participants also are expected to remote control drive miniature
>> cars. Additionally, the car is expected to ride in a National  Federation
>> of
>> the Blind-sponsored parade in Washington D.C.



>> "I most look forward to learning as much as I can from these bright  young
>> students," said Greg Jannaman, who led the Virginia Tech student  team in
>> his senior year and graduated in May with a bachelor's degree  in
>> mechanical
>> engineering. "Blind students from across the nation  apply to be selected
>> to
>> attend this summer camp. While we are there to  provide an educational
>> experience for them, I can only imagine the  invaluable feedback and fresh
>> new ideas that they will provide in return."



>> Jannaman is excited about the vehicle's success. "There wasn't a  moment's
>> hesitation with any of our blind drivers, whereas  blind-folded sighted
>> drivers weren't as quick to let go of their  preconceptions," said
>> Jannaman
>> of Hendersonville, Tenn. "The blind  drivers actually performed better
>> than
>> their sighted counterparts. An  overwhelming sense of accomplishment
>> overcame me as I simply rode  along while Wes and Mark successfully
>> navigated the driving course without my assistance."



>> Early models of the Blind Driver Challenge vehicle relied more on
>> technologies for fully autonomous vehicles, previously developed by
>> Virginia Tech mechanical engineering students as part of the DARPA  Urban
>> Challenge. The student team redesigned the vehicle so that the  blind
>> motorist has complete control of the driving process, as any  sighted
>> driver
>> would.



>> This change in approach led to new challenges, including how to
>> effectively convey the high bandwidth of information from the laser
>> sensors
>> scanning the vehicle's surrounding environment to the driver  fast enough
>> and accurate enough to allow safe driving. As a result,  the team
>> developed
>> non-visual interface technologies, including a  vibrating vest for
>> feedback
>> on speed, a click counter steering wheel  with audio cues, spoken commands
>> for directional feedback, and a  unique tactile map interface that
>> utilizes
>> compressed air to provide  information about the road and obstacles
>> surrounding the vehicle.



>> Riccobono knows of mock ups and non-working "blind driver car" set-ups
>> from the past, but says this is the first working vehicle to put the
>> blind
>> and visually impaired in control of the steering wheel. "Blind  people
>> have
>> brains, the capacity to make decisions," he said. "Blind  people want to
>> live independent lives, why would they not want to drive?"



>> Even once the technology is perfected, laws now barring the blind from
>> driving and public perception must be changed, Riccobono said. "This  is
>> the
>> piece that we know will be the most difficult," said Riccobono,  adding
>> that
>> the car must be near-perfected before the National  Federation of the
>> Blind
>> can truly push the car to law-makers and the  general public. He said this
>> effort will take millions of dollars in development.



>> The 2009-10 student team already is planning major changes to the
>> technology, including replacing the dirt buggy vehicle with a fully
>> electric car commonly used by traffic officers in downtown city centers.

>> The all-electric vehicle would reduce the vibration which can cause
>> problems to the laser sensor, and it will provide clean electric power
>> for
>> the computing units and that is better for the environment.



>> Source: Virginia Tech (news : web)





>> Sarah Alawami

>> msn: chellist at hotmail.com

>> website: http://www.marrie.org

>> twitter: http://twitter.com/marrie1



>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/aguimaraes%40nbp.org




> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pdonahue1%40sbcglobal.net


> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net

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From loneblindjedi at samobile.net  Fri Jul 17 19:31:47 2009
From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 15:31:47 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
Message-ID: <20090717193147.17411.49567@web3.serotek.com>

Antonio,

I also voted against the resolution for the same reasons you probably 
did if you were present then. You're right that we have a low literacy 
rate and high unemployment rate to take care of. But you know 
something? One of the reasons it's hard for us to get employed is 
because so many businesses require drivers' licenses and personal 
vehicles. Sure, the job may not actually require that, but businesses 
often think that such jobs do. For example, some agencies won't hire 
mobility instructors who can't drive. Now, we know that there might be 
historical discrimination built in there. But still, just think how 
many options will be opened to us once we can drive? I once applied to 
work for a payday loan place. I couldn't get the job because I can't 
drive. They wanted someone who could personally transport money to the 
bank and someone who could go to customers' house to collect payments 
if need be. That's one opportunity lost because I can't drive. Sure I 
wouldn't want to work there forever, but it's a job.

Respectfully Submitted
Original message:
> Pete,

> It is too expensive, uncertain, and risky to put so much money and effort
> into a project like that.

> I certainly think we aught to be involved, very involved in making it
> happen, but there is just not enough money to go around.

> We have too many coins to sell, too many people to teach braille to, and too
> many new jobs to make available to blind people, and I don't see us tying
> the $500000 or so from the imagination fund into such a tremendously
> humungously enormous project like a car we will drive.

> I love the concept, want it to happen, and want to see it through, but not
> enough to put all other projects on the back burner.

> I've heard of autonomous vehicles for some time, projects and things that
> have been done in the past to tighten up traffic on highways and drastically
> improve the transportation system, and the way we travel, but nothing
> serious ever came from these interesting outbursts of research and dreaming.

> I am all for the thing, but don't see how we could consciously fund it and
> feel it to be effective and good investment.

> Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr.

> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Peter Donahue" <pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 1:41 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle


>> Hello Antonio and listers,

>>    Then how about getting on board with it and supporting future
>> resolutions and efforts to make such a vehicle a reality. Remember this
>> the
>> next time paratransit is late, fails to show up, or busses don't run in a
>> particular community you wish to visit or live  causing you to be confined
>> to the urban environment, miss an important test or worse lose a job
>> opportunity due to the unavailability of public transportation. How
>> different it would be if you could jump in the car and drive yourself
>> there
>> rather than relying on public transit.

>>    This is just scratching the surface. Being able to live where one wants
>> to live, go when one wants to go without being restricted by the
>> availability or lack of public transportation in one's community is not
>> just
>> awesome, it's empowering!!!

>> Peter Donahue

>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Antonio Guimaraes" <aguimaraes at nbp.org>
>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 10:16 AM
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle


>> Sarah,

>> I am not surprised about people voting down the 2007 resolution to put
>> effort and funding behing a car the blind can drive. I would have voted
>> against it myself.

>> It is very good to stimulate and promote innovative research into this
>> type
>> of thing, but there are more tangible things to be concerned with, so the
>> resolution didn't pass, if I remember correctly.

>> I can't emphasize enough that this kind of research and development is
>> exciting, and important.

>> Skepticism will always come up about these things though, because we don't
>> know what the future could hold for a car the blind can drive.

>> I don't understand how blind people expect to drive safely, sure we know
>> we
>> are capable of deciding this and that, and of taking control and making
>> driving decisions. But aren't we now fighting to be able to cross streets
>> safely? Hybrid cars should be making noise so we know what to do as
>> pedestrians, but I wonder how much noise things will need to make for us
>> to
>> drive safely.

>> If cars can have sensord to detect all things on the road for a blind
>> driver, why not work on a similar thing for blind pedestrians to cross
>> safely?

>> I don't expect an answer on that question, since I am being a bit of a
>> devil's advocate. Pedestrian safety should rest with car manufacturers,
>> but
>> if we are fighting this battle with hybrids today, and keep on with a
>> mission for a blind driver car, we will be questioned, if not ridiculed.

>> Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr.

>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Sarah Alawami" <marrie12 at gmail.com>
>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 4:07 AM
>> Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle


>>> I did voat against this in 2007 and I still do. Are you surprised?





>>> Begin msg



>>> Mark Riccobono, executive director of the National Federation of the
>>> Blind's
>>> Jernigan Institute, drives the Virginia Tech Blind Driver Challenge
>>> vehicle
>>> through an obstacle course of traffic cones on a campus  parking lot. In
>>> the
>>> passenger seat is Greg Jannaman, who led the  student team within the
>>> mechanical engineering department during the  past year, and is
>>> monitoring
>>> the software of the vehicle. Credit:

>>> Steven Mackay, Virginia Tech



>>> A student team in the Virginia Tech College of Engineering is  providing
>>> the blind with an opportunity many never thought possible:

>>> The opportunity to drive.



>>> A retrofitted four-wheel dirt buggy developed by the Blind Driver
>>> Challenge team (http://www.me.vt.edu/blinddriver/) from Virginia  Tech's
>>> Robotics and Mechanisms Laboratory uses laser range finders, an  instant
>>> voice command interface and a host of other innovative,  cutting-edge
>>> technology to guide blind drivers as they steer, brake, and accelerate.

>>> Although in the early testing stage, the National Federation of the
>>> Blind
>>> -- which spurred the project -- considers the vehicle a major
>>> breakthrough
>>> for independent living of the visually impaired.



>>> "It was great!" said Wes Majerus, of Baltimore, the first blind person
>>> to
>>> drive the buggy on a closed course at the Virginia Tech campus this
>>> summer.
>>> Majerus is an access technology specialist with the National  Federation
>>> of
>>> the Blind's Jernigan Institute in Baltimore, a research  and training
>>> institute dedicated to developing technologies and  services to help the
>>> blind achieve independence.



>>> Majerus called his drive a liberating experience, adding that he drove
>>> before on Nebraska farm roads with his father as a guide in the
>>> passenger
>>> seat.



>>> Sitting inside the vehicle, a blind driver can turn the steering  wheel,
>>> stop and accelerate by following data from a computing unit  that uses
>>> sensory information from the laser range finder serving as  the 'eyes' of
>>> the driver, in addition to a combination of voice  commands and a
>>> vibrating
>>> vest as guides. A member of the Virginia Tech  student team sat next to
>>> Majerus in the passenger seat to monitor the system's software
>>> operations.



>>> "It's a great first step," Majerus added. "As far as the differences
>>> between human instructions and those given by the voice in the Blind
>>> Driver
>>> Challenge car, the car's instructions are very precise. You use  the
>>> technology to act on the environment -- the driving course -- in a  very
>>> orderly manner. In some cases, the human passenger will be vague,  "turn
>>> left" -- does that mean just a small turn to the left, or are we  going
>>> for
>>> large amounts of turn?"



>>> Also driving the vehicle was Mark Riccobono, also of Baltimore, the
>>> executive director of the Jernigan Institute, who also is blind. He
>>> called
>>> his test drive historic. "This is sort of our going to the moon project,"

>>> he said



>>> In 2004 Jernigan Institute challenged university research teams to
>>> develop
>>> a vehicle that would one day allow the blind to drive.

>>> Virginia Tech was the only university in the nation to accept the
>>> nonprofit's call two years later, said Dennis Hong, director of the
>>> Robotics and Mechanisms Laboratory, part of the Virginia Tech mechanical
>>> engineering department.

>>> The National Federation of the Blind provided a $3,000 grant to launch
>>> the
>>> project.



>>> "I thought it would be a very rewarding project, helping the blind,"

>>> said Hong, the current faculty adviser on the project. "We are not  only
>>> excited about the vehicle itself, but more than that, we are  excited
>>> about
>>> the potential of the many spin-off technologies from  this project that
>>> can
>>> be used for helping the blind in so many ways."



>>> The team will bring the Blind Driver Challenge vehicle to the National
>>> Federation of the Blind's Youth Slam summer camp event held July 26
>>> through
>>> Aug. 1 in College Park, Md. There, the team hopes to have  teenagers who
>>> would be obtaining their driver's licenses, but cannot  because of their
>>> blindness, drive the buggy.



>>> Wesley Majerus, an access technology specialist with the National
>>> Federation of the Blind's Jernigan Institute, finishes driving the
>>> Virginia
>>> Tech Blind Driver Challenge vehicle around a roped-off  driving course on
>>> a
>>> campus parking lot. The experience, he said, was liberating.



>>> Youth participants also are expected to remote control drive miniature
>>> cars. Additionally, the car is expected to ride in a National  Federation
>>> of
>>> the Blind-sponsored parade in Washington D.C.



>>> "I most look forward to learning as much as I can from these bright
>>> young
>>> students," said Greg Jannaman, who led the Virginia Tech student  team in
>>> his senior year and graduated in May with a bachelor's degree  in
>>> mechanical
>>> engineering. "Blind students from across the nation  apply to be selected
>>> to
>>> attend this summer camp. While we are there to  provide an educational
>>> experience for them, I can only imagine the  invaluable feedback and
>>> fresh
>>> new ideas that they will provide in return."



>>> Jannaman is excited about the vehicle's success. "There wasn't a
>>> moment's
>>> hesitation with any of our blind drivers, whereas  blind-folded sighted
>>> drivers weren't as quick to let go of their  preconceptions," said
>>> Jannaman
>>> of Hendersonville, Tenn. "The blind  drivers actually performed better
>>> than
>>> their sighted counterparts. An  overwhelming sense of accomplishment
>>> overcame me as I simply rode  along while Wes and Mark successfully
>>> navigated the driving course without my assistance."



>>> Early models of the Blind Driver Challenge vehicle relied more on
>>> technologies for fully autonomous vehicles, previously developed by
>>> Virginia Tech mechanical engineering students as part of the DARPA  Urban
>>> Challenge. The student team redesigned the vehicle so that the  blind
>>> motorist has complete control of the driving process, as any  sighted
>>> driver
>>> would.



>>> This change in approach led to new challenges, including how to
>>> effectively convey the high bandwidth of information from the laser
>>> sensors
>>> scanning the vehicle's surrounding environment to the driver  fast enough
>>> and accurate enough to allow safe driving. As a result,  the team
>>> developed
>>> non-visual interface technologies, including a  vibrating vest for
>>> feedback
>>> on speed, a click counter steering wheel  with audio cues, spoken
>>> commands
>>> for directional feedback, and a  unique tactile map interface that
>>> utilizes
>>> compressed air to provide  information about the road and obstacles
>>> surrounding the vehicle.



>>> Riccobono knows of mock ups and non-working "blind driver car" set-ups
>>> from the past, but says this is the first working vehicle to put the
>>> blind
>>> and visually impaired in control of the steering wheel. "Blind  people
>>> have
>>> brains, the capacity to make decisions," he said. "Blind  people want to
>>> live independent lives, why would they not want to drive?"



>>> Even once the technology is perfected, laws now barring the blind from
>>> driving and public perception must be changed, Riccobono said. "This  is
>>> the
>>> piece that we know will be the most difficult," said Riccobono,  adding
>>> that
>>> the car must be near-perfected before the National  Federation of the
>>> Blind
>>> can truly push the car to law-makers and the  general public. He said
>>> this
>>> effort will take millions of dollars in development.



>>> The 2009-10 student team already is planning major changes to the
>>> technology, including replacing the dirt buggy vehicle with a fully
>>> electric car commonly used by traffic officers in downtown city centers.

>>> The all-electric vehicle would reduce the vibration which can cause
>>> problems to the laser sensor, and it will provide clean electric power
>>> for
>>> the computing units and that is better for the environment.



>>> Source: Virginia Tech (news : web)





>>> Sarah Alawami

>>> msn: chellist at hotmail.com

>>> website: http://www.marrie.org

>>> twitter: http://twitter.com/marrie1



>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/aguimaraes%40nbp.org




>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pdonahue1%40sbcglobal.net


>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/aguimaraes%40nbp.org




> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
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From gymnastdave at sbcglobal.net  Fri Jul 17 22:02:56 2009
From: gymnastdave at sbcglobal.net (Dave Wright)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 17:02:56 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] KNFBReader Mobile Bundle for sale
Message-ID: <27DD3BCF070642F4B6315377380D9C62@dwrigh6>

Good afternoon all, 
HandyTech North America has a used KNFBReader Mobile Bundle for $1199.99. This package has only been used for 3 months and still has warranty left on it. The package includes the Nokia N82 loaded with the latest version of the Talks software along with the latest version of the KNFBReader software. Anyone interested should feel free to shoot me an email off-list, or give me a call any time at the number below. 


Best Regards:
Dave Wright
Work Phone: 347-422-7085
Email:
dwrigh6 at gmail.com
WebPage:
http://www.knfbreader.com

From lizmohnke at hotmail.com  Sat Jul 18 02:49:56 2009
From: lizmohnke at hotmail.com (Elizabeth)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 22:49:56 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
In-Reply-To: <85ff10070907162146g6b3757f5oe9ba17bbedeab805@mail.gmail.com>
References: <85ff10070907162146g6b3757f5oe9ba17bbedeab805@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <COL118-W305BE6D7FB556E5221E68BA1F0@phx.gbl>


Hello List,
 
I have been looking over the requirements of a particular degree I am interested in obtaining and noticed that it has a foreign language requirement. I’m not as afraid about how to take a foreign language class as a blind student as much as I am about how to go about deciding which language I should take. Back when I went to high school, there were only two foreign languages to choose from, and since I enjoyed my art and journalism electives, I chose to take neither of them. 
 
However, in today’s college environment it appears as though it is no longer a simple choice between French or Spanish. The community college I am currently attending has French, Spanish, German, Japanese, and Vietnamese. In addition, the four year college I would like to transfer into offers courses in Arabic, Chinese, Greek, Hebrew, Latin, Italian, Portuguese, Russian, Swahili, and Ojibwa. So with all these options, does anyone have any advice on how I could go about picking the right one for me? I have a few ideas in mind, but I am interested in hearing how other students have gone about making this decision.
 
Thanks,
Elizabeth
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live™: Keep your life in sync. 
http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009

From oceanrls at hotmail.com  Sun Jul 19 03:28:53 2009
From: oceanrls at hotmail.com (Rachel Jacobs)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 23:28:53 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
References: <85ff10070907162146g6b3757f5oe9ba17bbedeab805@mail.gmail.com>
	<COL118-W305BE6D7FB556E5221E68BA1F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <BLU0-SMTP626326C99BFC5429BEE1B1C41F0@phx.gbl>

Hey Elizabeth. I also had to take a foreign language for my undergraduat 
degree. I really did not like this, so for me I wanted to take the easiest 
one. I think if you are looking for the easiest, it is probably spanish. I 
had no problem learning spanish, and I did very  well in all of the classes. 
Good luck!
Rachel Jacobs
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Elizabeth" <lizmohnke at hotmail.com>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 10:49 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language



Hello List,

I have been looking over the requirements of a particular degree I am 
interested in obtaining and noticed that it has a foreign language 
requirement. I’m not as afraid about how to take a foreign language class as 
a blind student as much as I am about how to go about deciding which 
language I should take. Back when I went to high school, there were only two 
foreign languages to choose from, and since I enjoyed my art and journalism 
electives, I chose to take neither of them.

However, in today’s college environment it appears as though it is no longer 
a simple choice between French or Spanish. The community college I am 
currently attending has French, Spanish, German, Japanese, and Vietnamese. 
In addition, the four year college I would like to transfer into offers 
courses in Arabic, Chinese, Greek, Hebrew, Latin, Italian, Portuguese, 
Russian, Swahili, and Ojibwa. So with all these options, does anyone have 
any advice on how I could go about picking the right one for me? I have a 
few ideas in mind, but I am interested in hearing how other students have 
gone about making this decision.

Thanks,
Elizabeth
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live™: Keep your life in sync.
http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009
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From riss287 at yahoo.com  Sat Jul 18 03:26:43 2009
From: riss287 at yahoo.com (Marissa Slaughter)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 20:26:43 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
In-Reply-To: <COL118-W305BE6D7FB556E5221E68BA1F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <450490.37392.qm@web32603.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Elizabeth,

What career path are you thinking about? And what is your major? I took Spanish in high school and college, but I may end up having to learn German because part of what I am focusing on in my field has to do with Germany, and having at least a little knowledge of the language would be a great help. Originally, I chose Spanish because of its relevance in today's society. I would advise you to take a language that will have some sort of practical use in your life and career. I know there are many languages offered that you might want to learn, but since you're paying for the classes, I would take something for which you can find a use. There's always time to learn a language for fun later, if you'd like. 

Anyway, that's how I would go about deciding. The choice is completely up to you. 

Good luck!

Marissa

--- On Fri, 7/17/09, Elizabeth <lizmohnke at hotmail.com> wrote:

From: Elizabeth <lizmohnke at hotmail.com>
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
Date: Friday, July 17, 2009, 10:49 PM


Hello List,
 
I have been looking over the requirements of a particular degree I am interested in obtaining and noticed that it has a foreign language requirement. I’m not as afraid about how to take a foreign language class as a blind student as much as I am about how to go about deciding which language I should take. Back when I went to high school, there were only two foreign languages to choose from, and since I enjoyed my art and journalism electives, I chose to take neither of them. 
 
However, in today’s college environment it appears as though it is no longer a simple choice between French or Spanish. The community college I am currently attending has French, Spanish, German, Japanese, and Vietnamese. In addition, the four year college I would like to transfer into offers courses in Arabic, Chinese, Greek, Hebrew, Latin, Italian, Portuguese, Russian, Swahili, and Ojibwa. So with all these options, does anyone have any advice on how I could go about picking the right one for me? I have a few ideas in mind, but I am interested in hearing how other students have gone about making this decision.
 
Thanks,
Elizabeth
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live™: Keep your life in sync. 
http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009
_______________________________________________
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From monika_r_r at hotmail.com  Sat Jul 18 03:40:51 2009
From: monika_r_r at hotmail.com (Monika Reinholz)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 21:40:51 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
In-Reply-To: <COL118-W305BE6D7FB556E5221E68BA1F0@phx.gbl>
References: <85ff10070907162146g6b3757f5oe9ba17bbedeab805@mail.gmail.com>
	<COL118-W305BE6D7FB556E5221E68BA1F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <COL111-W435918EEFAA3A8E14A8875C01F0@phx.gbl>


Elizabeth,

First of all, Spanish is basically essential in this day and age no matter your field of study. So that would be a good one to go with. Also, you should look at what your major is/will be and what you intend to do with it. Some languages would be better served in certain fields...for example something to do with computers might be helpful to take Japanese or Swahili. 
I, for one, am going into the healthcare sector so Spanish and ASL would highly valuable for me. Of course, I'm not sure how much more difficult some languages would be to learn than others for someone who is blind. Not saying its impossible, just might have to work around some things more.

But that would be my advice at least. I hope I was of some help.
Monika


 
> From: lizmohnke at hotmail.com
> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 22:49:56 -0400
> Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
> 
> 
> Hello List,
> 
> I have been looking over the requirements of a particular degree I am interested in obtaining and noticed that it has a foreign language requirement. I’m not as afraid about how to take a foreign language class as a blind student as much as I am about how to go about deciding which language I should take. Back when I went to high school, there were only two foreign languages to choose from, and since I enjoyed my art and journalism electives, I chose to take neither of them. 
> 
> However, in today’s college environment it appears as though it is no longer a simple choice between French or Spanish. The community college I am currently attending has French, Spanish, German, Japanese, and Vietnamese. In addition, the four year college I would like to transfer into offers courses in Arabic, Chinese, Greek, Hebrew, Latin, Italian, Portuguese, Russian, Swahili, and Ojibwa. So with all these options, does anyone have any advice on how I could go about picking the right one for me? I have a few ideas in mind, but I am interested in hearing how other students have gone about making this decision.
> 
> Thanks,
> Elizabeth
> _________________________________________________________________
> Windows Live™: Keep your life in sync. 
> http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/monika_r_r%40hotmail.com

From alberto.2500 at gmail.com  Sat Jul 18 03:47:35 2009
From: alberto.2500 at gmail.com (alberto arreola)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 21:47:35 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
In-Reply-To: <000f01ca0705$c4fac480$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn>
References: <A51FC018DF074D7C9E108C2FE48D9574@sacomputer>	<2DC4995A9D63452C909B533D9C3F8602@nbp2.local>
	<000f01ca0705$c4fac480$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn>
Message-ID: <4a6145d8.22bd720a.4baf.6ba7@mx.google.com>

Peter:
I would be willing to get on board with this and even giving my opinions on
the product if I were asked to.  I've always had a great interest in cars
even though I'm blind I always like to go check them out, and ask stuff
about them.  I know this project will take a lot of time, and money to make
good for use, but if we all put an effert it can happen.  Some of us have to
lose our fear of trying this out, and think positively of it and think of
all the options that could be open to us if it comes to be.

Alberto

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Peter Donahue
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 11:41 AM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle

Hello Antonio and listers,

    Then how about getting on board with it and supporting future 
resolutions and efforts to make such a vehicle a reality. Remember this the 
next time paratransit	 is late, fails to show up, or busses don't run in a

particular community you wish to visit or live  causing you to be confined 
to the urban environment, miss an important test or worse lose a job 
opportunity due to the unavailability of public transportation. How 
different it would be if you could jump in the car and drive yourself there 
rather than relying on public transit.

    This is just scratching the surface. Being able to live where one wants 
to live, go when one wants to go without being restricted by the 
availability or lack of public transportation in one's community is not just

awesome, it's empowering!!!

Peter Donahue

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Antonio Guimaraes" <aguimaraes at nbp.org>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 10:16 AM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle


Sarah,

I am not surprised about people voting down the 2007 resolution to put
effort and funding behing a car the blind can drive. I would have voted
against it myself.

It is very good to stimulate and promote innovative research into this type
of thing, but there are more tangible things to be concerned with, so the
resolution didn't pass, if I remember correctly.

I can't emphasize enough that this kind of research and development is
exciting, and important.

Skepticism will always come up about these things though, because we don't
know what the future could hold for a car the blind can drive.

I don't understand how blind people expect to drive safely, sure we know we
are capable of deciding this and that, and of taking control and making
driving decisions. But aren't we now fighting to be able to cross streets
safely? Hybrid cars should be making noise so we know what to do as
pedestrians, but I wonder how much noise things will need to make for us to
drive safely.

If cars can have sensord to detect all things on the road for a blind
driver, why not work on a similar thing for blind pedestrians to cross
safely?

I don't expect an answer on that question, since I am being a bit of a
devil's advocate. Pedestrian safety should rest with car manufacturers, but
if we are fighting this battle with hybrids today, and keep on with a
mission for a blind driver car, we will be questioned, if not ridiculed.

Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Sarah Alawami" <marrie12 at gmail.com>
To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 4:07 AM
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle


>I did voat against this in 2007 and I still do. Are you surprised?
>
>
>
>
>
> Begin msg
>
>
>
> Mark Riccobono, executive director of the National Federation of the
> Blind's
> Jernigan Institute, drives the Virginia Tech Blind Driver Challenge
> vehicle
> through an obstacle course of traffic cones on a campus  parking lot. In
> the
> passenger seat is Greg Jannaman, who led the  student team within the
> mechanical engineering department during the  past year, and is monitoring
> the software of the vehicle. Credit:
>
> Steven Mackay, Virginia Tech
>
>
>
> A student team in the Virginia Tech College of Engineering is  providing
> the blind with an opportunity many never thought possible:
>
> The opportunity to drive.
>
>
>
> A retrofitted four-wheel dirt buggy developed by the Blind Driver
> Challenge team (http://www.me.vt.edu/blinddriver/) from Virginia  Tech's
> Robotics and Mechanisms Laboratory uses laser range finders, an  instant
> voice command interface and a host of other innovative,  cutting-edge
> technology to guide blind drivers as they steer, brake, and accelerate.
>
> Although in the early testing stage, the National Federation of the  Blind
> -- which spurred the project -- considers the vehicle a major
> breakthrough
> for independent living of the visually impaired.
>
>
>
> "It was great!" said Wes Majerus, of Baltimore, the first blind person  to
> drive the buggy on a closed course at the Virginia Tech campus this
> summer.
> Majerus is an access technology specialist with the National  Federation
> of
> the Blind's Jernigan Institute in Baltimore, a research  and training
> institute dedicated to developing technologies and  services to help the
> blind achieve independence.
>
>
>
> Majerus called his drive a liberating experience, adding that he drove
> before on Nebraska farm roads with his father as a guide in the  passenger
> seat.
>
>
>
> Sitting inside the vehicle, a blind driver can turn the steering  wheel,
> stop and accelerate by following data from a computing unit  that uses
> sensory information from the laser range finder serving as  the 'eyes' of
> the driver, in addition to a combination of voice  commands and a
> vibrating
> vest as guides. A member of the Virginia Tech  student team sat next to
> Majerus in the passenger seat to monitor the system's software operations.
>
>
>
> "It's a great first step," Majerus added. "As far as the differences
> between human instructions and those given by the voice in the Blind
> Driver
> Challenge car, the car's instructions are very precise. You use  the
> technology to act on the environment -- the driving course -- in a  very
> orderly manner. In some cases, the human passenger will be vague,  "turn
> left" -- does that mean just a small turn to the left, or are we  going
> for
> large amounts of turn?"
>
>
>
> Also driving the vehicle was Mark Riccobono, also of Baltimore, the
> executive director of the Jernigan Institute, who also is blind. He
> called
> his test drive historic. "This is sort of our going to the moon project,"
>
> he said
>
>
>
> In 2004 Jernigan Institute challenged university research teams to
> develop
> a vehicle that would one day allow the blind to drive.
>
> Virginia Tech was the only university in the nation to accept the
> nonprofit's call two years later, said Dennis Hong, director of the
> Robotics and Mechanisms Laboratory, part of the Virginia Tech mechanical
> engineering department.
>
> The National Federation of the Blind provided a $3,000 grant to launch
> the
> project.
>
>
>
> "I thought it would be a very rewarding project, helping the blind,"
>
> said Hong, the current faculty adviser on the project. "We are not  only
> excited about the vehicle itself, but more than that, we are  excited
> about
> the potential of the many spin-off technologies from  this project that
> can
> be used for helping the blind in so many ways."
>
>
>
> The team will bring the Blind Driver Challenge vehicle to the National
> Federation of the Blind's Youth Slam summer camp event held July 26
> through
> Aug. 1 in College Park, Md. There, the team hopes to have  teenagers who
> would be obtaining their driver's licenses, but cannot  because of their
> blindness, drive the buggy.
>
>
>
> Wesley Majerus, an access technology specialist with the National
> Federation of the Blind's Jernigan Institute, finishes driving the
> Virginia
> Tech Blind Driver Challenge vehicle around a roped-off  driving course on
> a
> campus parking lot. The experience, he said, was liberating.
>
>
>
> Youth participants also are expected to remote control drive miniature
> cars. Additionally, the car is expected to ride in a National  Federation
> of
> the Blind-sponsored parade in Washington D.C.
>
>
>
> "I most look forward to learning as much as I can from these bright  young
> students," said Greg Jannaman, who led the Virginia Tech student  team in
> his senior year and graduated in May with a bachelor's degree  in
> mechanical
> engineering. "Blind students from across the nation  apply to be selected
> to
> attend this summer camp. While we are there to  provide an educational
> experience for them, I can only imagine the  invaluable feedback and fresh
> new ideas that they will provide in return."
>
>
>
> Jannaman is excited about the vehicle's success. "There wasn't a  moment's
> hesitation with any of our blind drivers, whereas  blind-folded sighted
> drivers weren't as quick to let go of their  preconceptions," said
> Jannaman
> of Hendersonville, Tenn. "The blind  drivers actually performed better
> than
> their sighted counterparts. An  overwhelming sense of accomplishment
> overcame me as I simply rode  along while Wes and Mark successfully
> navigated the driving course without my assistance."
>
>
>
> Early models of the Blind Driver Challenge vehicle relied more on
> technologies for fully autonomous vehicles, previously developed by
> Virginia Tech mechanical engineering students as part of the DARPA  Urban
> Challenge. The student team redesigned the vehicle so that the  blind
> motorist has complete control of the driving process, as any  sighted
> driver
> would.
>
>
>
> This change in approach led to new challenges, including how to
> effectively convey the high bandwidth of information from the laser
> sensors
> scanning the vehicle's surrounding environment to the driver  fast enough
> and accurate enough to allow safe driving. As a result,  the team
> developed
> non-visual interface technologies, including a  vibrating vest for
> feedback
> on speed, a click counter steering wheel  with audio cues, spoken commands
> for directional feedback, and a  unique tactile map interface that
> utilizes
> compressed air to provide  information about the road and obstacles
> surrounding the vehicle.
>
>
>
> Riccobono knows of mock ups and non-working "blind driver car" set-ups
> from the past, but says this is the first working vehicle to put the
> blind
> and visually impaired in control of the steering wheel. "Blind  people
> have
> brains, the capacity to make decisions," he said. "Blind  people want to
> live independent lives, why would they not want to drive?"
>
>
>
> Even once the technology is perfected, laws now barring the blind from
> driving and public perception must be changed, Riccobono said. "This  is
> the
> piece that we know will be the most difficult," said Riccobono,  adding
> that
> the car must be near-perfected before the National  Federation of the
> Blind
> can truly push the car to law-makers and the  general public. He said this
> effort will take millions of dollars in development.
>
>
>
> The 2009-10 student team already is planning major changes to the
> technology, including replacing the dirt buggy vehicle with a fully
> electric car commonly used by traffic officers in downtown city centers.
>
> The all-electric vehicle would reduce the vibration which can cause
> problems to the laser sensor, and it will provide clean electric power
> for
> the computing units and that is better for the environment.
>
>
>
> Source: Virginia Tech (news : web)
>
>
>
>
>
> Sarah Alawami
>
> msn: chellist at hotmail.com
>
> website: http://www.marrie.org
>
> twitter: http://twitter.com/marrie1
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/aguimaraes%40nbp.org
>



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l.net 


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.com



From dandrews at visi.com  Sat Jul 18 04:12:15 2009
From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 23:12:15 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] South Carolina Assistive Technology Teaching Job
Message-ID: <auto-000108059996@mailfront1.g2host.com>


>From: "Marty R. McKenzie" <marty2 at ftc-i.net>
>To: <david.andrews at nfbnet.org>
>Subject: Job Posting for Circulation
>Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 21:27:42 -0400
>The direct link is 
><http://www.scsdb.org/documents/jobs/138377.htm>http://www.scsdb.org/documents/jobs/138377.htm 
>and the text is below.



>Marty McKenzie
>
>Please post and circulate
>
>table with 8 columns and 24 rows
>Career Opportunity
>
>Class Title:
>
>Teacher/Access Technology Specialist
>
>Position#:
>
>138377
>
>Class Code/Slot:
>
>CB10/20
>
>Band:
>
>5
>
>Department:
>
>Outreach/Blind School
>
>Location:
>
>Spartanburg
>
>Employment Information:
>
>FTE Position/ 42 weeks per year/37.5 hours per week
>
>Salary Range:
>
>Minimum:
>
>$24,452
>
>Midpoint:
>
>$34,847
>
>Duties:
>
>Provide individual student and group instruction on campus in the SC 
>School for the Blind and in the off-campus mainstreamed program so 
>that students receive
>appropriate instruction and can demonstrate increase knowledge in 
>the use of access technology.  Coordinate and assist with individual 
>and multidisciplinary
>assistive/access technology assessments for students at the SC 
>School for the Blind.  Develop appropriate IEP goals in the use of 
>Access Technology(AT)
>that leads to students' success and independence in the integration 
>of AT with the general curricula as well with activities related to 
>the use of computers,
>note takers, and various AT items in recreation, academics and 
>independent living. Maintains an accurate inventory of the School 
>for the Blind Access Technology.
>Recommend AT purchases based on current trends, research and cost 
>effectiveness needed for student instruction and use.  Monitor 
>service maintenance agreements
>and updates to ensure, with the coordination of the SCSDB IT staff, 
>that all software and equipment is kept current.  Coordinate with 
>SCSDB IT to ensure
>that all Access Technology is appropriately placed, in good working 
>order, and that copyright law is not violated.
>
>Qualifications:
>
>Bachelor's Degree and 3 years experience in the use of, training in, 
>and support of Access Technology.  Must have knowledge of 
>information processing operations,
>micro/minicomputer hardware/software and state-of-the-art technology 
>as it relates to individuals with disabilities.  Must also have 
>background in installation,
>operation, testing and maintenance of Access Technology for 
>individuals who are blind, i.e., refreshable Braille, scanning and 
>speech software.  Must be
>proficient in Braille, and computerized production of Braille.  Must 
>have an expert use of Microsoft Office and office equipment such as 
>computer, fax
>and thermoform copier.
>
>State Application Required:
>
>Office of Human Resources
>
>SC School for the Deaf and the Blind
>
>355 Cedar Springs Road
>
>Spartanburg, SC  29302
>
>Opening Date:
>
>June 18, 2009
>
>Closing Date:
>
>Until Filled

From alberto.2500 at gmail.com  Sat Jul 18 04:15:44 2009
From: alberto.2500 at gmail.com (alberto arreola)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 22:15:44 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
In-Reply-To: <COL118-W305BE6D7FB556E5221E68BA1F0@phx.gbl>
References: <85ff10070907162146g6b3757f5oe9ba17bbedeab805@mail.gmail.com>
	<COL118-W305BE6D7FB556E5221E68BA1F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <4a614c70.1fd6720a.4603.6d62@mx.google.com>

Elizabeth:
My parents are from Mexico so I know Spanish as my first language I learned
English when I started going to school back in kindergarten, but I recommend
that you find out  if with this degree you are going to be working with
people from other countries, or if it's just one of their requirements.
Then make a choice based on what you think, and find out.  I would say make
a choice on whatever language you feel confident that you can learn, or do a
little research on several fields that are involved with that degree, and
what foreign people they deal with the most.

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Elizabeth
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 8:50 PM
To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language


Hello List,
 
I have been looking over the requirements of a particular degree I am
interested in obtaining and noticed that it has a foreign language
requirement. I'm not as afraid about how to take a foreign language class as
a blind student as much as I am about how to go about deciding which
language I should take. Back when I went to high school, there were only two
foreign languages to choose from, and since I enjoyed my art and journalism
electives, I chose to take neither of them. 
 
However, in today's college environment it appears as though it is no longer
a simple choice between French or Spanish. The community college I am
currently attending has French, Spanish, German, Japanese, and Vietnamese.
In addition, the four year college I would like to transfer into offers
courses in Arabic, Chinese, Greek, Hebrew, Latin, Italian, Portuguese,
Russian, Swahili, and Ojibwa. So with all these options, does anyone have
any advice on how I could go about picking the right one for me? I have a
few ideas in mind, but I am interested in hearing how other students have
gone about making this decision.
 
Thanks,
Elizabeth
_________________________________________________________________
Windows LiveT: Keep your life in sync. 
http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009
_______________________________________________
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nabs-l at nfbnet.org
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.com



From tagrig at verizon.net  Sat Jul 18 04:24:18 2009
From: tagrig at verizon.net (tatyana)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 00:24:18 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
References: <85ff10070907162146g6b3757f5oe9ba17bbedeab805@mail.gmail.com>
	<COL118-W305BE6D7FB556E5221E68BA1F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <35E2FE01242A4F9694F9F64A9184F8EE@laptop>

Depending on what language would be useful for your career. My friend who is 
in  a graduate school of chemestry says that he is studying Japaneese on his 
own because  he wants to get an access to a lot of technology articles that 
in Japaneese.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Elizabeth" <lizmohnke at hotmail.com>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 10:49 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language



Hello List,

I have been looking over the requirements of a particular degree I am 
interested in obtaining and noticed that it has a foreign language 
requirement. I’m not as afraid about how to take a foreign language class as 
a blind student as much as I am about how to go about deciding which 
language I should take. Back when I went to high school, there were only two 
foreign languages to choose from, and since I enjoyed my art and journalism 
electives, I chose to take neither of them.

However, in today’s college environment it appears as though it is no longer 
a simple choice between French or Spanish. The community college I am 
currently attending has French, Spanish, German, Japanese, and Vietnamese. 
In addition, the four year college I would like to transfer into offers 
courses in Arabic, Chinese, Greek, Hebrew, Latin, Italian, Portuguese, 
Russian, Swahili, and Ojibwa. So with all these options, does anyone have 
any advice on how I could go about picking the right one for me? I have a 
few ideas in mind, but I am interested in hearing how other students have 
gone about making this decision.

Thanks,
Elizabeth
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live™: Keep your life in sync.
http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009
_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
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From braille at sbcglobal.net  Sat Jul 18 04:27:27 2009
From: braille at sbcglobal.net (Mary Donahue)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 21:27:27 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
References: <85ff10070907162146g6b3757f5oe9ba17bbedeab805@mail.gmail.com>
	<COL118-W305BE6D7FB556E5221E68BA1F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <04B5F83FFD3344AE84CF313B1B1F8DB8@valued3a11ee5d>

Hello Elizabeth and listers,

    Speaking from personal experience, I chose Spanish because the 
pronunciation and phonetics are very easy to grasp. During my third year of 
college, I found out that beginning Italian was going to be offered, so, 
since Italian was very similar to Spanish, I took it and had fun with it. 
Unfortunately, when the second semester of the Italian course was offered a 
year later, I was already carrying fourteen credits, and did not want to 
overload my class load with four more.

    Getting back to Spanish, I ended up being a Spanish major, so naturally, 
I tend to suggest that language. You may want to talk to other students who 
have taken other languages these colleges offer.

    At any rate, those are my two cents' worth.

Mary Donahue


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Elizabeth" <lizmohnke at hotmail.com>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 7:49 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language



Hello List,

I have been looking over the requirements of a particular degree I am 
interested in obtaining and noticed that it has a foreign language 
requirement. I’m not as afraid about how to take a foreign language class as 
a blind student as much as I am about how to go about deciding which 
language I should take. Back when I went to high school, there were only two 
foreign languages to choose from, and since I enjoyed my art and journalism 
electives, I chose to take neither of them.

However, in today’s college environment it appears as though it is no longer 
a simple choice between French or Spanish. The community college I am 
currently attending has French, Spanish, German, Japanese, and Vietnamese. 
In addition, the four year college I would like to transfer into offers 
courses in Arabic, Chinese, Greek, Hebrew, Latin, Italian, Portuguese, 
Russian, Swahili, and Ojibwa. So with all these options, does anyone have 
any advice on how I could go about picking the right one for me? I have a 
few ideas in mind, but I am interested in hearing how other students have 
gone about making this decision.

Thanks,
Elizabeth
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live™: Keep your life in sync.
http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009
_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/braille%40sbcglobal.net 



From jonte711 at gmail.com  Sat Jul 18 04:47:55 2009
From: jonte711 at gmail.com (jonte)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 23:47:55 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
Message-ID: <4a6153ca.06045a0a.326c.391e@mx.google.com>


Hello, 
Please do not feel discouraged from learning a foreign language because you are blind.  
Blindness and learning to speak a language have ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with each other. 
A blind person can learn to speak a language just as well as any sighted individual.
  
However, you may have difficulty writing braille in certain languages such as Russian or Chinese because of the different alphabets.
 
 I'm sure it is possible, though!
Jonte  

-----Original Message-----
From: Monika Reinholz <monika_r_r at hotmail.com>
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 10:40 PM
To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language


Elizabeth,

First of all, Spanish is basically essential in this day and age no matter your field of study. So that would be a good one to go with. Also, you should look at what your major is/will be and what you intend to do with it. Some languages would be better served in certain fields...for example something to do with computers might be helpful to take Japanese or Swahili. 
I, for one, am going into the healthcare sector so Spanish and ASL would highly valuable for me. Of course, I'm not sure how much more difficult some languages would be to learn than others for someone who is blind. Not saying its impossible, just might have to work around some things more.

But that would be my advice at least. I hope I was of some help.
Monika


 
> From: lizmohnke at hotmail.com
> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 22:49:56 -0400
> Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
> 
> 
> Hello List,
> 
> I have been looking over the requirements of a particular degree I am interested in obtaining and noticed that it has a foreign language requirement. I’m not as afraid about how to take a foreign language class as a blind student as much as I am about how to go about deciding which language I should take. Back when I went to high school, there were only two foreign languages to choose from, and since I enjoyed my art and journalism electives, I chose to take neither of them. 
> 
> However, in today’s college environment it appears as though it is no longer a simple choice between French or Spanish. The community college I am currently attending has French, Spanish, German, Japanese, and Vietnamese. In addition, the four year college I would like to transfer into offers courses in Arabic, Chinese, Greek, Hebrew, Latin, Italian, Portuguese, Russian, Swahili, and Ojibwa. So with all these options, does anyone have any advice on how I could go about picking the right one for me? I have a few ideas in mind, but I am interested in hearing how other students have gone about making this decision.
> 
> Thanks,
> Elizabeth
> _________________________________________________________________
> Windows Live™: Keep your life in sync. 
> http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/monika_r_r%40hotmail.com
_______________________________________________
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nabs-l at nfbnet.org
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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
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From cumbiambera2005 at gmail.com  Sat Jul 18 04:47:51 2009
From: cumbiambera2005 at gmail.com (Cumbiambera2005)
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 23:47:51 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Three Technical Tragidies In One Day: please Help?
Message-ID: <4804d1140907172147s713823cft2de2b5b4b75424f5@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Nabsters,
Well today has been one of the busiest and most technically
complicated days I've had in a while, so i'm really needing some help.
Well, the first problem was a problem with the internet, which
hopefully got resolved already. I host an internet show that did not
go well, and was having some technical difficulties, but by a
replacement of the modem, I think i was able to solve the issue.
However, my version of winamp had to be replaced, and I had gotten the
wrong version. Originally I was using version 5.52, which was working
for me just fine. However, i was unable to locate that version again,
and am now using version 5.552, which seems to be going ok so far,
though I'd like to be able to find the version I was using before if
that is at all possible. However, since I had to reinstall, I am
unable to reset the broadcast plug-ins that I need for broadcast. If
anyone knows anything about this, I would encourage you to contact me
off-list, as some help with restarting my connections would be very
much appreciated. Please forgive me if I'm not explaining myself
thoroughly, I am kind of stressed.
Also I am having some issues with my stereo, and need some advice on
what to do. Before, I was able to hook my stereo up to my computer
through the tape deck, with the end of the tape adapter going into the
headphone jack of my computer. Unfortunately, my tape deck is no
longer responding, (I think the motor is dead), so i need to find an
alternative to using it. i tried using a headphone splitter, with the
splitter going into my stereo, and another cable that has two male
ends, with one end connected to my computer, and the other into one
end of the splitter. Then, I connected my headphones into the other
end, (I like to listen with headphones). I tried using two different
splitters, and the first was either defected or it was the wrong one
because I was only hearing sound from the left ear. Then I tried my
own splitter that I've had for a while, which worked perfect.
Unfortunately, the sound is not loud enough, i'm getting the volume
from my computer, rather than the strong volume of my stereo. I can
not play music outloud at all with this setup. I don't know how else
to accomplish this task without purchassing a new stereo, does anyone
have any advice for me? Also if I do need to purchase one, I'd like to
do this as independently as possible, so if anyone knows how best to
go about that, some advice on that would also be appreciated.
my next thing to do was to install a plugin to winamp called a dfx or
something like that, does anyone know about this? It seems to work but
I can't stop that window from opening each time I open winamp.
SO those are all my technical issues, does anyone have advice on any of them?
Any help on any of these things would be greatly appreciated.
Ashley


From spangler.robert at gmail.com  Sat Jul 18 14:09:11 2009
From: spangler.robert at gmail.com (Robert Spangler)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 10:09:11 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
In-Reply-To: <COL111-W435918EEFAA3A8E14A8875C01F0@phx.gbl>
References: <85ff10070907162146g6b3757f5oe9ba17bbedeab805@mail.gmail.com>	<COL118-W305BE6D7FB556E5221E68BA1F0@phx.gbl>
	<COL111-W435918EEFAA3A8E14A8875C01F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <4A61D787.7060603@gmail.com>

If any of you have taken languages that use a non-Roman alphabet, such 
as Arabic, what have you done to make the class materials accessible? 
I'd like to take Arabic and Chinese at my university but not sure how 
they would accommodate me.  I studied a bit of Chinese on my own and 
just used Pinyin (the English alphabet version) but not sure how this 
would go over in classes.

Thanks,
Robby

On 7/17/2009 11:40 PM, Monika Reinholz wrote:
>
> Elizabeth,
>
> First of all, Spanish is basically essential in this day and age no matter your field of study. So that would be a good one to go with. Also, you should look at what your major is/will be and what you intend to do with it. Some languages would be better served in certain fields...for example something to do with computers might be helpful to take Japanese or Swahili.
> I, for one, am going into the healthcare sector so Spanish and ASL would highly valuable for me. Of course, I'm not sure how much more difficult some languages would be to learn than others for someone who is blind. Not saying its impossible, just might have to work around some things more.
>
> But that would be my advice at least. I hope I was of some help.
> Monika
>
>
>
>> From: lizmohnke at hotmail.com
>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 22:49:56 -0400
>> Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
>>
>>
>> Hello List,
>>
>> I have been looking over the requirements of a particular degree I am interested in obtaining and noticed that it has a foreign language requirement. I’m not as afraid about how to take a foreign language class as a blind student as much as I am about how to go about deciding which language I should take. Back when I went to high school, there were only two foreign languages to choose from, and since I enjoyed my art and journalism electives, I chose to take neither of them.
>>
>> However, in today’s college environment it appears as though it is no longer a simple choice between French or Spanish. The community college I am currently attending has French, Spanish, German, Japanese, and Vietnamese. In addition, the four year college I would like to transfer into offers courses in Arabic, Chinese, Greek, Hebrew, Latin, Italian, Portuguese, Russian, Swahili, and Ojibwa. So with all these options, does anyone have any advice on how I could go about picking the right one for me? I have a few ideas in mind, but I am interested in hearing how other students have gone about making this decision.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Elizabeth
>> _________________________________________________________________
>> Windows Live™: Keep your life in sync.
>> http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/monika_r_r%40hotmail.com
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/spangler.robert%40gmail.com
>


From davidb521 at gmail.com  Sat Jul 18 14:46:28 2009
From: davidb521 at gmail.com (David Bouchard)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 09:46:28 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Southeastern Student Seminar
Message-ID: <4a61e03f.1d1d640a.4cd6.0224@mx.google.com>

Hi, 
I am interested in attending the Southeastern Student Seminar in Macon, GA on August 14-16. However, I need information such as the location, and any general information about the seminar would be helpful. Also, if any guys are going, and they are interested in a roommate, I am interested. 
Thanks, 
David


From tealbloodworth at gmail.com  Sat Jul 18 15:19:36 2009
From: tealbloodworth at gmail.com (Teal Bloodworth)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 10:19:36 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
References: <85ff10070907162146g6b3757f5oe9ba17bbedeab805@mail.gmail.com><COL118-W305BE6D7FB556E5221E68BA1F0@phx.gbl>
	<BLU0-SMTP626326C99BFC5429BEE1B1C41F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <4605E24589364A39955A23684B9FE22B@teal6e6857f643>

Hi Elizabeth

I also have to take a foreign language for my social work major and i was 
told that the spanish is the more realistic choice since that is the more 
common language found in the US.

                -Teal
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Rachel Jacobs" <oceanrls at hotmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, July 18, 2009 10:28 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language


Hey Elizabeth. I also had to take a foreign language for my undergraduat
degree. I really did not like this, so for me I wanted to take the easiest
one. I think if you are looking for the easiest, it is probably spanish. I
had no problem learning spanish, and I did very  well in all of the classes.
Good luck!
Rachel Jacobs
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Elizabeth" <lizmohnke at hotmail.com>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 10:49 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language



Hello List,

I have been looking over the requirements of a particular degree I am
interested in obtaining and noticed that it has a foreign language
requirement. I’m not as afraid about how to take a foreign language class as
a blind student as much as I am about how to go about deciding which
language I should take. Back when I went to high school, there were only two
foreign languages to choose from, and since I enjoyed my art and journalism
electives, I chose to take neither of them.

However, in today’s college environment it appears as though it is no longer
a simple choice between French or Spanish. The community college I am
currently attending has French, Spanish, German, Japanese, and Vietnamese.
In addition, the four year college I would like to transfer into offers
courses in Arabic, Chinese, Greek, Hebrew, Latin, Italian, Portuguese,
Russian, Swahili, and Ojibwa. So with all these options, does anyone have
any advice on how I could go about picking the right one for me? I have a
few ideas in mind, but I am interested in hearing how other students have
gone about making this decision.

Thanks,
Elizabeth
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live™: Keep your life in sync.
http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009
_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/oceanrls%40hotmail.com


_______________________________________________
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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
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From jw927 at comcast.net  Sat Jul 18 16:18:29 2009
From: jw927 at comcast.net (Jessica)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 12:18:29 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] volunteer job
Message-ID: <6B24C2221FE6425984D59AAA66C44868@Jess>

Hi, I hope everyone is having a great summer.  Well, I just want to let all of you know I accepted a volunteer job yesterday.  I will be volunteering from August 3 to the 14, but only on the weekdays.  My hours are from 9-3.  My job is helping kids learn Braille.  Although I am excited about working with kids, I am also nervous because I want to do a good job.  Oh I forgot to mention the program is held at the NFB. Any encouragement would be greatly appreciated!

From djdrocks4ever at gmail.com  Sat Jul 18 18:25:39 2009
From: djdrocks4ever at gmail.com (David Dunphy)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 13:25:39 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Come Listen To NFB Members Show Case Their Talents
Message-ID: <5CE478D7304B498FA2187D6EAAAD984E@thedjdinvasion>

Hello There!
Please feel free to send this to anyone you know who was in the NFB's show case of talent show in Detroit or to anyone you think would want to know about this!
Join Radio360 and the Performing Arts Division Of The National Federation Of The Blind as we present to you The National Federation Of The Blind Show Case Of talent For 2009 tonight, Saturday, July 18, 2009 starting at 8 PM eastern time!
What you'll be hearing is the talent show that occurred at this year's national convention in Detroit. Come listen to some tell stories, others make you laugh, and even have some sing and/or play musical instruments.
It's a great way to kick back, have a nice snack or dinner, and be entertained by your fellow NFB federationists if you're in the NFB, or by talented blind people from across the country.
As stated above, the fun begins at 8 PM eastern this evening on Radio360.
So come find out what some of us were lucky enough to hear live at the convention on July 7. You can do this by saving this email, and at 8 PM eastern, going to
http://www.radio360.us
and there will be a link on that page for you to select how you'd like to listen to the show, and then to connect to the program. And if you come in before 8, you can hear our performing arts division president Dennis and his show Pop Tops!
So join the fun tonight at
http://www.radio360.us
starting at 8 PM eastern. On behalf of Radio360 and the performing arts division, we hope to see you there tonight!
Best regards,
David Dunphy, Station Manager for Radio360
http://www.radio360.us


__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4257 (20090718) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com


From thebluesisloose at gmail.com  Sat Jul 18 18:27:35 2009
From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com (Beth)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 14:27:35 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
In-Reply-To: <4a6145d8.22bd720a.4baf.6ba7@mx.google.com>
References: <A51FC018DF074D7C9E108C2FE48D9574@sacomputer>
	<2DC4995A9D63452C909B533D9C3F8602@nbp2.local>
	<000f01ca0705$c4fac480$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn>
	<4a6145d8.22bd720a.4baf.6ba7@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <4383d01d0907181127i2ae876e6p2be463bb0f85f710@mail.gmail.com>

Id be all for the blind behind the wheel thing because I'd be able to
live in a rural setting and never ever have to wory about buses and
trains.  But what about Guyco auto insurance? lol
Beth

On 7/17/09, alberto arreola <alberto.2500 at gmail.com> wrote:
> Peter:
> I would be willing to get on board with this and even giving my opinions on
> the product if I were asked to.  I've always had a great interest in cars
> even though I'm blind I always like to go check them out, and ask stuff
> about them.  I know this project will take a lot of time, and money to make
> good for use, but if we all put an effert it can happen.  Some of us have to
> lose our fear of trying this out, and think positively of it and think of
> all the options that could be open to us if it comes to be.
>
> Alberto
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
> Of Peter Donahue
> Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 11:41 AM
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
>
> Hello Antonio and listers,
>
>     Then how about getting on board with it and supporting future
> resolutions and efforts to make such a vehicle a reality. Remember this the
> next time paratransit	 is late, fails to show up, or busses don't run in a
>
> particular community you wish to visit or live  causing you to be confined
> to the urban environment, miss an important test or worse lose a job
> opportunity due to the unavailability of public transportation. How
> different it would be if you could jump in the car and drive yourself there
> rather than relying on public transit.
>
>     This is just scratching the surface. Being able to live where one wants
> to live, go when one wants to go without being restricted by the
> availability or lack of public transportation in one's community is not just
>
> awesome, it's empowering!!!
>
> Peter Donahue
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Antonio Guimaraes" <aguimaraes at nbp.org>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 10:16 AM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
>
>
> Sarah,
>
> I am not surprised about people voting down the 2007 resolution to put
> effort and funding behing a car the blind can drive. I would have voted
> against it myself.
>
> It is very good to stimulate and promote innovative research into this type
> of thing, but there are more tangible things to be concerned with, so the
> resolution didn't pass, if I remember correctly.
>
> I can't emphasize enough that this kind of research and development is
> exciting, and important.
>
> Skepticism will always come up about these things though, because we don't
> know what the future could hold for a car the blind can drive.
>
> I don't understand how blind people expect to drive safely, sure we know we
> are capable of deciding this and that, and of taking control and making
> driving decisions. But aren't we now fighting to be able to cross streets
> safely? Hybrid cars should be making noise so we know what to do as
> pedestrians, but I wonder how much noise things will need to make for us to
> drive safely.
>
> If cars can have sensord to detect all things on the road for a blind
> driver, why not work on a similar thing for blind pedestrians to cross
> safely?
>
> I don't expect an answer on that question, since I am being a bit of a
> devil's advocate. Pedestrian safety should rest with car manufacturers, but
> if we are fighting this battle with hybrids today, and keep on with a
> mission for a blind driver car, we will be questioned, if not ridiculed.
>
> Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Sarah Alawami" <marrie12 at gmail.com>
> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 4:07 AM
> Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
>
>
>>I did voat against this in 2007 and I still do. Are you surprised?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Begin msg
>>
>>
>>
>> Mark Riccobono, executive director of the National Federation of the
>> Blind's
>> Jernigan Institute, drives the Virginia Tech Blind Driver Challenge
>> vehicle
>> through an obstacle course of traffic cones on a campus  parking lot. In
>> the
>> passenger seat is Greg Jannaman, who led the  student team within the
>> mechanical engineering department during the  past year, and is monitoring
>> the software of the vehicle. Credit:
>>
>> Steven Mackay, Virginia Tech
>>
>>
>>
>> A student team in the Virginia Tech College of Engineering is  providing
>> the blind with an opportunity many never thought possible:
>>
>> The opportunity to drive.
>>
>>
>>
>> A retrofitted four-wheel dirt buggy developed by the Blind Driver
>> Challenge team (http://www.me.vt.edu/blinddriver/) from Virginia  Tech's
>> Robotics and Mechanisms Laboratory uses laser range finders, an  instant
>> voice command interface and a host of other innovative,  cutting-edge
>> technology to guide blind drivers as they steer, brake, and accelerate.
>>
>> Although in the early testing stage, the National Federation of the  Blind
>> -- which spurred the project -- considers the vehicle a major
>> breakthrough
>> for independent living of the visually impaired.
>>
>>
>>
>> "It was great!" said Wes Majerus, of Baltimore, the first blind person  to
>> drive the buggy on a closed course at the Virginia Tech campus this
>> summer.
>> Majerus is an access technology specialist with the National  Federation
>> of
>> the Blind's Jernigan Institute in Baltimore, a research  and training
>> institute dedicated to developing technologies and  services to help the
>> blind achieve independence.
>>
>>
>>
>> Majerus called his drive a liberating experience, adding that he drove
>> before on Nebraska farm roads with his father as a guide in the  passenger
>> seat.
>>
>>
>>
>> Sitting inside the vehicle, a blind driver can turn the steering  wheel,
>> stop and accelerate by following data from a computing unit  that uses
>> sensory information from the laser range finder serving as  the 'eyes' of
>> the driver, in addition to a combination of voice  commands and a
>> vibrating
>> vest as guides. A member of the Virginia Tech  student team sat next to
>> Majerus in the passenger seat to monitor the system's software operations.
>>
>>
>>
>> "It's a great first step," Majerus added. "As far as the differences
>> between human instructions and those given by the voice in the Blind
>> Driver
>> Challenge car, the car's instructions are very precise. You use  the
>> technology to act on the environment -- the driving course -- in a  very
>> orderly manner. In some cases, the human passenger will be vague,  "turn
>> left" -- does that mean just a small turn to the left, or are we  going
>> for
>> large amounts of turn?"
>>
>>
>>
>> Also driving the vehicle was Mark Riccobono, also of Baltimore, the
>> executive director of the Jernigan Institute, who also is blind. He
>> called
>> his test drive historic. "This is sort of our going to the moon project,"
>>
>> he said
>>
>>
>>
>> In 2004 Jernigan Institute challenged university research teams to
>> develop
>> a vehicle that would one day allow the blind to drive.
>>
>> Virginia Tech was the only university in the nation to accept the
>> nonprofit's call two years later, said Dennis Hong, director of the
>> Robotics and Mechanisms Laboratory, part of the Virginia Tech mechanical
>> engineering department.
>>
>> The National Federation of the Blind provided a $3,000 grant to launch
>> the
>> project.
>>
>>
>>
>> "I thought it would be a very rewarding project, helping the blind,"
>>
>> said Hong, the current faculty adviser on the project. "We are not  only
>> excited about the vehicle itself, but more than that, we are  excited
>> about
>> the potential of the many spin-off technologies from  this project that
>> can
>> be used for helping the blind in so many ways."
>>
>>
>>
>> The team will bring the Blind Driver Challenge vehicle to the National
>> Federation of the Blind's Youth Slam summer camp event held July 26
>> through
>> Aug. 1 in College Park, Md. There, the team hopes to have  teenagers who
>> would be obtaining their driver's licenses, but cannot  because of their
>> blindness, drive the buggy.
>>
>>
>>
>> Wesley Majerus, an access technology specialist with the National
>> Federation of the Blind's Jernigan Institute, finishes driving the
>> Virginia
>> Tech Blind Driver Challenge vehicle around a roped-off  driving course on
>> a
>> campus parking lot. The experience, he said, was liberating.
>>
>>
>>
>> Youth participants also are expected to remote control drive miniature
>> cars. Additionally, the car is expected to ride in a National  Federation
>> of
>> the Blind-sponsored parade in Washington D.C.
>>
>>
>>
>> "I most look forward to learning as much as I can from these bright  young
>> students," said Greg Jannaman, who led the Virginia Tech student  team in
>> his senior year and graduated in May with a bachelor's degree  in
>> mechanical
>> engineering. "Blind students from across the nation  apply to be selected
>> to
>> attend this summer camp. While we are there to  provide an educational
>> experience for them, I can only imagine the  invaluable feedback and fresh
>> new ideas that they will provide in return."
>>
>>
>>
>> Jannaman is excited about the vehicle's success. "There wasn't a  moment's
>> hesitation with any of our blind drivers, whereas  blind-folded sighted
>> drivers weren't as quick to let go of their  preconceptions," said
>> Jannaman
>> of Hendersonville, Tenn. "The blind  drivers actually performed better
>> than
>> their sighted counterparts. An  overwhelming sense of accomplishment
>> overcame me as I simply rode  along while Wes and Mark successfully
>> navigated the driving course without my assistance."
>>
>>
>>
>> Early models of the Blind Driver Challenge vehicle relied more on
>> technologies for fully autonomous vehicles, previously developed by
>> Virginia Tech mechanical engineering students as part of the DARPA  Urban
>> Challenge. The student team redesigned the vehicle so that the  blind
>> motorist has complete control of the driving process, as any  sighted
>> driver
>> would.
>>
>>
>>
>> This change in approach led to new challenges, including how to
>> effectively convey the high bandwidth of information from the laser
>> sensors
>> scanning the vehicle's surrounding environment to the driver  fast enough
>> and accurate enough to allow safe driving. As a result,  the team
>> developed
>> non-visual interface technologies, including a  vibrating vest for
>> feedback
>> on speed, a click counter steering wheel  with audio cues, spoken commands
>> for directional feedback, and a  unique tactile map interface that
>> utilizes
>> compressed air to provide  information about the road and obstacles
>> surrounding the vehicle.
>>
>>
>>
>> Riccobono knows of mock ups and non-working "blind driver car" set-ups
>> from the past, but says this is the first working vehicle to put the
>> blind
>> and visually impaired in control of the steering wheel. "Blind  people
>> have
>> brains, the capacity to make decisions," he said. "Blind  people want to
>> live independent lives, why would they not want to drive?"
>>
>>
>>
>> Even once the technology is perfected, laws now barring the blind from
>> driving and public perception must be changed, Riccobono said. "This  is
>> the
>> piece that we know will be the most difficult," said Riccobono,  adding
>> that
>> the car must be near-perfected before the National  Federation of the
>> Blind
>> can truly push the car to law-makers and the  general public. He said this
>> effort will take millions of dollars in development.
>>
>>
>>
>> The 2009-10 student team already is planning major changes to the
>> technology, including replacing the dirt buggy vehicle with a fully
>> electric car commonly used by traffic officers in downtown city centers.
>>
>> The all-electric vehicle would reduce the vibration which can cause
>> problems to the laser sensor, and it will provide clean electric power
>> for
>> the computing units and that is better for the environment.
>>
>>
>>
>> Source: Virginia Tech (news : web)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sarah Alawami
>>
>> msn: chellist at hotmail.com
>>
>> website: http://www.marrie.org
>>
>> twitter: http://twitter.com/marrie1
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/aguimaraes%40nbp.org
>>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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> l.net
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
>
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>


From queen.marsha.lindsey at gmail.com  Sat Jul 18 20:02:57 2009
From: queen.marsha.lindsey at gmail.com (Marsha)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 16:02:57 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] volunteer job
In-Reply-To: <6B24C2221FE6425984D59AAA66C44868@Jess>
References: <6B24C2221FE6425984D59AAA66C44868@Jess>
Message-ID: <F59050F7C8B543C886BDEB8F2B8BD6EF@Cptr233>

Jessica, there is nothing to worry about. I am going to be helping with the
same program at the same time. If you like children then things will be
fine. 
See you in august!
Marsha



-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Jessica
Sent: Saturday, July 18, 2009 12:18 PM
To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
Subject: [nabs-l] volunteer job

Hi, I hope everyone is having a great summer.  Well, I just want to let all
of you know I accepted a volunteer job yesterday.  I will be volunteering
from August 3 to the 14, but only on the weekdays.  My hours are from 9-3.
My job is helping kids learn Braille.  Although I am excited about working
with kids, I am also nervous because I want to do a good job.  Oh I forgot
to mention the program is held at the NFB. Any encouragement would be
greatly appreciated!
_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/queen.marsha.lindsey
%40gmail.com
 

__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
database 4257 (20090718) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com
 
 

__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
database 4257 (20090718) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com
 



From davidb521 at gmail.com  Sat Jul 18 20:25:38 2009
From: davidb521 at gmail.com (David)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 15:25:38 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Come Listen To NFB Members Show Case Their Talents
In-Reply-To: <5CE478D7304B498FA2187D6EAAAD984E@thedjdinvasion>
Message-ID: <4a622fd1.1c1d640a.43ec.0cbf@mx.google.com>


Will the show be recorded for those who may miss it and wish to hear it
later?
-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of David Dunphy
Sent: Saturday, July 18, 2009 1:26 PM
To: Undisclosed-Recipient:;
Subject: [nabs-l] Come Listen To NFB Members Show Case Their Talents

Hello There!
Please feel free to send this to anyone you know who was in the NFB's show
case of talent show in Detroit or to anyone you think would want to know
about this!
Join Radio360 and the Performing Arts Division Of The National Federation Of
The Blind as we present to you The National Federation Of The Blind Show
Case Of talent For 2009 tonight, Saturday, July 18, 2009 starting at 8 PM
eastern time!
What you'll be hearing is the talent show that occurred at this year's
national convention in Detroit. Come listen to some tell stories, others
make you laugh, and even have some sing and/or play musical instruments.
It's a great way to kick back, have a nice snack or dinner, and be
entertained by your fellow NFB federationists if you're in the NFB, or by
talented blind people from across the country.
As stated above, the fun begins at 8 PM eastern this evening on Radio360.
So come find out what some of us were lucky enough to hear live at the
convention on July 7. You can do this by saving this email, and at 8 PM
eastern, going to
http://www.radio360.us
and there will be a link on that page for you to select how you'd like to
listen to the show, and then to connect to the program. And if you come in
before 8, you can hear our performing arts division president Dennis and his
show Pop Tops!
So join the fun tonight at
http://www.radio360.us
starting at 8 PM eastern. On behalf of Radio360 and the performing arts
division, we hope to see you there tonight!
Best regards,
David Dunphy, Station Manager for Radio360
http://www.radio360.us


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database 4257 (20090718) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com

_______________________________________________
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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
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m



From djdrocks4ever at gmail.com  Sat Jul 18 20:53:53 2009
From: djdrocks4ever at gmail.com (David Dunphy)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 15:53:53 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Come Listen To NFB Members Show Case Their Talents
References: <4a622fd1.1c1d640a.43ec.0cbf@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <138EBB70AC014DAAB87665CFB6174138@thedjdinvasion>

It's possible it will get aired again, so more etails will be forth coming.

__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4257 (20090718) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com





From nijat1989 at gmail.com  Sun Jul 19 00:55:06 2009
From: nijat1989 at gmail.com (Nijat Worley)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 00:55:06 -0000
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
References: <20090717191921.17416.94103@web3.serotek.com>
Message-ID: <1E6114EF3D7F422484CF13C7D6A0FFEE@Nijatash>

Jedi,
   I think you will meet and interview an artificial intelligence before you 
meet a nice person from somewhere else besides Earth. Just remember that 
when interviewing an artificial intelligence, you will only get the answers 
that have been programmed into its memory, and nothing new, or original. LOL
   Nijat

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jedi" <loneblindjedi at samobile.net>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 1:19 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle


> Hi.
>
> Personally, I would like a vehicle where I have an autopilot option where 
> the car drives for me, or I can choose to drive myself with its 
> instructions. And perhaps, I can assign certain functions to the computer 
> and do the rest myself. That's just me. Really though, I've always dreamed 
> of hiring an artificial intelligence, especially if it has a body of its 
> own such as an android or something. I've always been fascinated with 
> aritifical intelligences. I'd love to interview one and see what I come 
> out with. In fact, it's a lifetime of mine to do so. My other lifetime 
> goal is to meet an honest to goodness person from somewhere other than 
> Earth. Any guesses which will happen first?
>
> Respectfully,
> Jedi
>
>
> Original message:
>> Hello:
>
>>      In response to the comments regarding a car drivable by a blind 
>> person;
>> As a member of the Committee on Research and Development, I believe this 
>> is
>> important research. It is important that we the NFB are involved with 
>> this
>> sort of project. Efforts are underway to create autonomous vehicles. Two
>> such efforts were the DARPA (Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency)
>> Grand Challenges of 2005 and 2007. The 2007 challenge showed that it was
>> possible to build a vehicle that could navigate in an urban setting. In 
>> the
>> coming years, I am confident that there will be vehicles that will drive
>> themselves. These vehicles will use a variety of technologies including 
>> GPS.
>> One thing that will be needed is a way for an operator to get his/her
>> vehicle onto a road or maneuver in a parking lot. These activities could 
>> I
>> think be done by a blind person given the appropriate adaptations. Being
>> involved with those doing this sort of research helps ensure that are 
>> needs
>> are considered when developing new technologies. As an organization, we 
>> must
>> be proactive and get involved with product developments, so we can 
>> continue
>> to effectively function in society.
>
>>      In the past, it was possible for us to create alternative techniques 
>> in
>> response to technological developments. With the rapid changes in our 
>> world,
>> we must be more involved, so we can for example have appliances that we 
>> can
>> use, computer operating systems that are accessible, accessible cell 
>> phones
>> etc. A personal vehicle would be of great help in getting to work, school 
>> or
>> wherever else we want to go.
>
>>      The technologies described in the article could also benefit those 
>> in
>> wheelchairs. Like it or not, we have an aging population. Wheelchair
>> mobility is difficult and users must take great care not to roll down 
>> steps
>> etc. Some sensors might mike their lives easier.
>
>> Regards,
>
>> Robert Jaquiss
>
>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net
>
> -- 
> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.  Visit 
> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.
>
> _______________________________________________
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> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
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> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nijat1989%40gmail.com 



From MRiccobono at nfb.org  Sun Jul 19 00:57:53 2009
From: MRiccobono at nfb.org (Riccobono,
	Mark)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 19:57:53 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Youth March for Independence
Message-ID: <auto-000108131866@mailfront1.g2host.com>


Come join the National Federation of the Blind 
for a historic gathering to celebrate the next generation of blind innovators!

On Friday, July 31, the blind students and their 
mentors from the 2009 NFB Youth Slam will gather 
in our nation’s capitol for an inspirational 
rally at the Lincoln Memorial and Reflecting Pool 
followed by the NFB Youth March for Independence 
on the National Mall in Washington, D.C. After 
the march, blind students, blind mentors, and 
friends will gather for a celebratory program of 
the past week’s achievements in the United States 
Capitol Visitor Center.  Members of congress will 
be in attendance, and speakers will include Dr. 
Marc Maurer (President of the NFB), NFB Youth 
Slam students, members of the United States 
Congress, and officials from NASA including one 
of the astronauts from the STS 125 shuttle 
mission--the same mission that carried two Louis 
Braille Bicentennial Silver Dollars to space.



We encourage Federationists and friends to come 
be part of these historic events­you will not want to miss it!



Schedule of Events:

The rally at the Lincoln Memorial will kick off 
at 2:45 p.m. just in front of the reflecting pool 
and at the foot of the steps where so many other 
revolutionary historic gatherings have taken place.



The NFB Youth March is expected to leave the 
rally site at the Lincoln Memorial at 
approximately 3:20 p.m. proceeding down the 
National Mall to the National Air and Space 
Museum.  Please note that the distance from the 
memorial to the museum is approximately 1.5 miles.



The closing ceremonies at the Capitol Visitors 
Center will begin at 5:30 pm. (doors open) with 
the program beginning at 6:00 p.m. in the Congressional Auditorium.



The Capitol Visitor Center is closed to the 
public, so please let security know that you are 
attending the NFB event.  We encourage you to get 
there early as there is a security screening 
before the entrance to the Capitol Visitor 
Center; the link to items that are not permitted 
is 
<http://www.visitthecapitol.gov/Visit/Visitor%20Safety%20and%20Policies/>http://www.visitthecapitol.gov/Visit/Visitor%20Safety%20and%20Policies/. 




The Capitol Visitors Center entrance is on the 
East side of the Capitol near the intersection of First and Maryland streets.



If you are coming to the concluding ceremony 
only, the easiest way to get there is by metro.  The three closest stops are:
    * Union Station – Located at First Street, NW, and Massachusetts Avenue
    * Capitol South – Located at First Street between C and D Streets, SE
    * Federal Center, SW – Located at the 
Southwest corner of Third and D streets, SW

For more information about the metro, visit 
<http://www.wmata.com/>http://www.wmata.com/.



Please join us for this historic event where the 
next generation of the blind is helping to change 
what it means to be blind!  The NFB Youth Slam is 
one of the ways that the National Federation of 
the Blind Jernigan Institute is providing more 
opportunities for blind youth to pursue careers 
that were once falsely perceived as impossible 
and empowering the next generation to interject 
their voice into the leadership of this country.



Let us celebrate the accomplishments of these 
youth and their mentors while looking forward to 
their future full of opportunities!



If you have any questions, please call Mark 
Riccobono at 410-659-9314 ext. 2368 or e-mail 
<mailto:mriccobono at nfb.org>mriccobono at nfb.org


From nijat1989 at gmail.com  Sun Jul 19 01:14:00 2009
From: nijat1989 at gmail.com (Nijat Worley)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 01:14:00 -0000
Subject: [nabs-l] Learning a foreign language
Message-ID: <6D2CA1156395446CA01EE4CBC363F4F1@Nijatash>

Greetings Nabsters,
   Speaking of learning a foreign language, I am also going to be learning a foreign language this Faull and I need some advice from anyone that can give me some suggestions. I will be learning Russian. I went and downloaded the Russian voice for Real Speek Solo, and it works great. If I change my keyboard layout to Russian, and type in the Russian language, the Real Speak Solo voice reads the text in the Russian language for me. This is great, but for some strange reason it does not read Russian websites in Russian. I think JAWS has an automatic language recognition feature that should recognize the Russian language, and switch to it at once. Do any of you know why JAWS is not reading the websites in Russian?
   I am also trying to find the international Braille code so that I can learn Russian Braille. I understand that they use the same Braille as we do, however, they have more letters in their alphabet than we do, so some of our contractions become letters in their language. Does anywon know where I can get a hard Braille copy of the international Braille code, or the Braille code in Russian? I called the American Printing House for the Blind, and they did not have anything for me. Any ideas or suggestions will be appreciated.
   Thank you very much.
   Yours
   Nijat

From lizmohnke at hotmail.com  Sun Jul 19 02:04:28 2009
From: lizmohnke at hotmail.com (Elizabeth)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 22:04:28 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
In-Reply-To: <COL111-W435918EEFAA3A8E14A8875C01F0@phx.gbl>
References: <85ff10070907162146g6b3757f5oe9ba17bbedeab805@mail.gmail.com>
	<COL118-W305BE6D7FB556E5221E68BA1F0@phx.gbl> 
	<COL111-W435918EEFAA3A8E14A8875C01F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <COL118-W37AD8A7E21D32E87820D71BA1C0@phx.gbl>


Hello List,
 
Thank you for all of your suggestions for choosing a foreign language. It appears as though most of you would suggest Spanish on the grounds that it is a commonly spoken language and is easy to learn. Others suggested that I choose a language that would prove to be the most useful in obtaining a job. And this is where I hit a crossroad, because if I were to choose a language based on this criteria alone, it would most likely be Arabic. However, since it took me about a weeks worth of practice to be able to correctly pronounce the name of the currently proclaimed President of Iran, I’m not quite sure how easy it would be to learn. 
 
My current major is sociology, and when I transfer I am looking at majoring in social relations and policy. I am interested in obtaining a career in government or public service. I’m sure that I could benefit from learning Spanish, but I figure that I could learn it just as easily on my own away from the academic setting. Since it is such a common language, I was looking for something else that might give me a bit more advantage in securing a job and yet still somewhat easy to learn. So does anyone on here have any experience in a foreign language other than Spanish? Also, does anyone know which foreign languages would work well as a base language for learning additional languages?
 
Thanks,
Elizabeth
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live™ Hotmail®: Celebrate the moment with your favorite sports pics. Check it out.
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From freespirit328 at gmail.com  Sun Jul 19 03:18:34 2009
From: freespirit328 at gmail.com (Jennifer Aberdeen)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 23:18:34 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
References: <85ff10070907162146g6b3757f5oe9ba17bbedeab805@mail.gmail.com><COL118-W305BE6D7FB556E5221E68BA1F0@phx.gbl>
	<COL111-W435918EEFAA3A8E14A8875C01F0@phx.gbl>
	<COL118-W37AD8A7E21D32E87820D71BA1C0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <5C1284764134499183948802174C0579@Gateway>

All language branch off from Latin, so that might be a good one. Arabic is 
hard, especially because it doesn't use the roman alphabet, but on a 
positive note, you could very easily get a job working for the FBI if you 
spoke Arabic...that's what I've been told anyway.

Jen

Shop my AVON online store
http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com

Get healthy!
http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com

Contact me:

Jennifer Aberdeen
PO Box 1184
Woonsocket, RI 02895
401-762-3258 (home)
401-644-5607 (cell)
freespirit328 at gmail.com
SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Elizabeth" <lizmohnke at hotmail.com>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, July 18, 2009 10:04 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language



Hello List,

Thank you for all of your suggestions for choosing a foreign language. It 
appears as though most of you would suggest Spanish on the grounds that it 
is a commonly spoken language and is easy to learn. Others suggested that I 
choose a language that would prove to be the most useful in obtaining a job. 
And this is where I hit a crossroad, because if I were to choose a language 
based on this criteria alone, it would most likely be Arabic. However, since 
it took me about a weeks worth of practice to be able to correctly pronounce 
the name of the currently proclaimed President of Iran, I’m not quite sure 
how easy it would be to learn.

My current major is sociology, and when I transfer I am looking at majoring 
in social relations and policy. I am interested in obtaining a career in 
government or public service. I’m sure that I could benefit from learning 
Spanish, but I figure that I could learn it just as easily on my own away 
from the academic setting. Since it is such a common language, I was looking 
for something else that might give me a bit more advantage in securing a job 
and yet still somewhat easy to learn. So does anyone on here have any 
experience in a foreign language other than Spanish? Also, does anyone know 
which foreign languages would work well as a base language for learning 
additional languages?

Thanks,
Elizabeth
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live™ Hotmail®: Celebrate the moment with your favorite sports pics. 
Check it out.
http://www.windowslive.com/Online/Hotmail/Campaign/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_QA_HM_sports_photos_072009&cat=sports
_______________________________________________
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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
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From riss287 at yahoo.com  Sun Jul 19 03:49:35 2009
From: riss287 at yahoo.com (Marissa Slaughter)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 20:49:35 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
In-Reply-To: <5C1284764134499183948802174C0579@Gateway>
Message-ID: <173504.15111.qm@web32607.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Well, not all languages branch out from Latin. All the Romance/Western languages do, but not the others. But I definitely agree about Arabic. It may be hard to learn, but it would be great for getting a job in foreign relations. 

--- On Sat, 7/18/09, Jennifer Aberdeen <freespirit328 at gmail.com> wrote:

From: Jennifer Aberdeen <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Date: Saturday, July 18, 2009, 11:18 PM

All language branch off from Latin, so that might be a good one. Arabic is hard, especially because it doesn't use the roman alphabet, but on a positive note, you could very easily get a job working for the FBI if you spoke Arabic...that's what I've been told anyway.

Jen

Shop my AVON online store
http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com

Get healthy!
http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com

Contact me:

Jennifer Aberdeen
PO Box 1184
Woonsocket, RI 02895
401-762-3258 (home)
401-644-5607 (cell)
freespirit328 at gmail.com
SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
----- Original Message ----- From: "Elizabeth" <lizmohnke at hotmail.com>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, July 18, 2009 10:04 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language



Hello List,

Thank you for all of your suggestions for choosing a foreign language. It appears as though most of you would suggest Spanish on the grounds that it is a commonly spoken language and is easy to learn. Others suggested that I choose a language that would prove to be the most useful in obtaining a job. And this is where I hit a crossroad, because if I were to choose a language based on this criteria alone, it would most likely be Arabic. However, since it took me about a weeks worth of practice to be able to correctly pronounce the name of the currently proclaimed President of Iran, I’m not quite sure how easy it would be to learn.

My current major is sociology, and when I transfer I am looking at majoring in social relations and policy. I am interested in obtaining a career in government or public service. I’m sure that I could benefit from learning Spanish, but I figure that I could learn it just as easily on my own away from the academic setting. Since it is such a common language, I was looking for something else that might give me a bit more advantage in securing a job and yet still somewhat easy to learn. So does anyone on here have any experience in a foreign language other than Spanish? Also, does anyone know which foreign languages would work well as a base language for learning additional languages?

Thanks,
Elizabeth
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live™ Hotmail®: Celebrate the moment with your favorite sports pics. Check it out.
http://www.windowslive.com/Online/Hotmail/Campaign/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_QA_HM_sports_photos_072009&cat=sports
_______________________________________________
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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmail.com 

_______________________________________________
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From jonte711 at gmail.com  Sun Jul 19 03:56:25 2009
From: jonte711 at gmail.com (jonte)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 22:56:25 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
Message-ID: <4a629934.0e35640a.1637.08ae@mx.google.com>


Hi Elizabeth
I have experience in Spanish, French, and Italian. 
These languages are very easy to learn because they are grammatically similar and not difficult to speak. 
 Like many people on this list, I would suggest learning Spanish and you may also benefit from learning Chinese if you would like to work for the government. 
Jonte  

-----Original Message-----
From: Elizabeth <lizmohnke at hotmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, July 18, 2009 9:04 PM
To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language


Hello List,
 
Thank you for all of your suggestions for choosing a foreign language. It appears as though most of you would suggest Spanish on the grounds that it is a commonly spoken language and is easy to learn. Others suggested that I choose a language that would prove to be the most useful in obtaining a job. And this is where I hit a crossroad, because if I were to choose a language based on this criteria alone, it would most likely be Arabic. However, since it took me about a weeks worth of practice to be able to correctly pronounce the name of the currently proclaimed President of Iran, I’m not quite sure how easy it would be to learn. 
 
My current major is sociology, and when I transfer I am looking at majoring in social relations and policy. I am interested in obtaining a career in government or public service. I’m sure that I could benefit from learning Spanish, but I figure that I could learn it just as easily on my own away from the academic setting. Since it is such a common language, I was looking for something else that might give me a bit more advantage in securing a job and yet still somewhat easy to learn. So does anyone on here have any experience in a foreign language other than Spanish? Also, does anyone know which foreign languages would work well as a base language for learning additional languages?
 
Thanks,
Elizabeth
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live™ Hotmail®: Celebrate the moment with your favorite sports pics. Check it out.
http://www.windowslive.com/Online/Hotmail/Campaign/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_QA_HM_sports_photos_072009&cat=sports
_______________________________________________
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nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
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From freespirit328 at gmail.com  Sun Jul 19 04:15:15 2009
From: freespirit328 at gmail.com (Jennifer Aberdeen)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 00:15:15 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
Message-ID: <6EEA4BC18C314240B8CE10244BB87A5B@Gateway>

Hi all,

Does anyone know if any of the online Universities, such as the University of Phoenix, have all their reading material available in e-text directly from the website?

I'm not sure if I'm going to take any classes. One of my biggest obstacles, and I'm sure for a lot of other blind people, is not having access to my text books. I can't scan my books because the state won't purchase Kurzweil for me, and listening to it on tape doesn't work because of my hearing problem. The best way is with e-text, but I'm not sure who has it and how easy or complicated it is to use.

I tried AIU, but they didn't have most of their books avaiable in an accessible format.

Jen

Shop my AVON online store
http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com

Get healthy!
http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com

Contact me:

Jennifer Aberdeen
PO Box 1184
Woonsocket, RI 02895
401-762-3258 (home)
401-644-5607 (cell)
freespirit328 at gmail.com
SKYPE: J.Aberdeen

From jonte711 at gmail.com  Sun Jul 19 04:57:05 2009
From: jonte711 at gmail.com (jonte)
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 23:57:05 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
Message-ID: <4a62a76d.1d1d640a.2fb3.049b@mx.google.com>


And even if you spoke Arabic or another language that doesn't use the Roman alphabet but didn't write it, you would probably still be an asset.
Jonte 

-----Original Message-----
From: Jennifer Aberdeen <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, July 18, 2009 10:18 PM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language

All language branch off from Latin, so that might be a good one. Arabic is 
hard, especially because it doesn't use the roman alphabet, but on a 
positive note, you could very easily get a job working for the FBI if you 
spoke Arabic...that's what I've been told anyway.

Jen

Shop my AVON online store
http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com

Get healthy!
http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com

Contact me:

Jennifer Aberdeen
PO Box 1184
Woonsocket, RI 02895
401-762-3258 (home)
401-644-5607 (cell)
freespirit328 at gmail.com
SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Elizabeth" <lizmohnke at hotmail.com>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, July 18, 2009 10:04 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language



Hello List,

Thank you for all of your suggestions for choosing a foreign language. It 
appears as though most of you would suggest Spanish on the grounds that it 
is a commonly spoken language and is easy to learn. Others suggested that I 
choose a language that would prove to be the most useful in obtaining a job. 
And this is where I hit a crossroad, because if I were to choose a language 
based on this criteria alone, it would most likely be Arabic. However, since 
it took me about a weeks worth of practice to be able to correctly pronounce 
the name of the currently proclaimed President of Iran, I’m not quite sure 
how easy it would be to learn.

My current major is sociology, and when I transfer I am looking at majoring 
in social relations and policy. I am interested in obtaining a career in 
government or public service. I’m sure that I could benefit from learning 
Spanish, but I figure that I could learn it just as easily on my own away 
from the academic setting. Since it is such a common language, I was looking 
for something else that might give me a bit more advantage in securing a job 
and yet still somewhat easy to learn. So does anyone on here have any 
experience in a foreign language other than Spanish? Also, does anyone know 
which foreign languages would work well as a base language for learning 
additional languages?

Thanks,
Elizabeth
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live™ Hotmail®: Celebrate the moment with your favorite sports pics. 
Check it out.
http://www.windowslive.com/Online/Hotmail/Campaign/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_QA_HM_sports_photos_072009&cat=sports
_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmail.com 


_______________________________________________
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nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jonte711%40gmail.com



From tagrig at verizon.net  Sun Jul 19 05:05:35 2009
From: tagrig at verizon.net (Tatyana)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 01:05:35 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] learning Russian
References: <6D2CA1156395446CA01EE4CBC363F4F1@Nijatash>
Message-ID: <F67EAFD6CCE9428C82017C6BF2C6EDCA@home>

Hi Nijat,
I'm Russian living in the states and I use both English and Russian on my 
computer. I use Russian speech synthesizer and for Russian web sites I need 
to swich it on manualy and Jaws doesn't  swich on Russian automaticaly.
Russian Braille is easy to learn it's similar to English. Russian  books 
generally don't use contracted Braille so you really don't need learning 
Russian contractions.
I can help you with your questions and learning Russian. Write on my address
tagrig at verizon.net

Tatyana.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Nijat Worley" <nijat1989 at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, May 02, 2009 9:06 AM
Subject: [nabs-l] Learning a foreign language


> Greetings Nabsters,
>   Speaking of learning a foreign language, I am also going to be learning 
> a foreign language this Faull and I need some advice from anyone that can 
> give me some suggestions. I will be learning Russian. I went and 
> downloaded the Russian voice for Real Speek Solo, and it works great. If I 
> change my keyboard layout to Russian, and type in the Russian language, 
> the Real Speak Solo voice reads the text in the Russian language for me. 
> This is great, but for some strange reason it does not read Russian 
> websites in Russian. I think JAWS has an automatic language recognition 
> feature that should recognize the Russian language, and switch to it at 
> once. Do any of you know why JAWS is not reading the websites in Russian?
>   I am also trying to find the international Braille code so that I can 
> learn Russian Braille. I understand that they use the same Braille as we 
> do, however, they have more letters in their alphabet than we do, so some 
> of our contractions become letters in their language. Does anywon know 
> where I can get a hard Braille copy of the international Braille code, or 
> the Braille code in Russian? I called the American Printing House for the 
> Blind, and they did not have anything for me. Any ideas or suggestions 
> will be appreciated.
>   Thank you very much.
>   Yours
>   Nijat
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/tagrig%40verizon.net
> 




From corbbo at gmail.com  Sun Jul 19 06:21:11 2009
From: corbbo at gmail.com (Corbb O'Connor)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 02:21:11 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Brand-new K-NFB Reader for sale at a discount
Message-ID: <74D11146-BE49-4D1B-9A81-7A56E6A6008E@gmail.com>

Now before you go wondering why a scholarship winner is selling his K- 
NFB Reader, know that I am using the funds to purchase a Trekker GPS,  
which is of a more immediate need to me. I'm not looking to profit  
from a gracious NFB scholarship.

I'm looking to sell a brand new K-NFB Reader Mobile. It does not  
include Talks or MobileSpeak, the screen reader for cell phones, but  
it does include the new Nokia N82 phone and K-NFB Reader  
software...all in their original packaging. (Those programs typically  
retail for about $300.)

My initial asking price is $1350 plus shipping (retails for $1370 plus  
shipping). However, I am open to negotiate that price. This product  
will be sold as-is, with no additional warranty or guarantee. Payments  
MUST be processed through PayPal.

If you're interested, DO NOT REPLY TO THIS E-MAIL. E-mail me OFF-LIST!

Thanks,
Corbb


From jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com  Sun Jul 19 10:32:39 2009
From: jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com (Jess)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 06:32:39 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
In-Reply-To: <6EEA4BC18C314240B8CE10244BB87A5B@Gateway>
References: <6EEA4BC18C314240B8CE10244BB87A5B@Gateway>
Message-ID: <FCAD13A0F72545FEBD172BB25302FF0D@Jessica>

Jen,
You would have to talk to them and find out. But, I would think they might
Jessica
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
To: "NABS-L" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 12:15 AM
Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs


> Hi all,
>
> Does anyone know if any of the online Universities, such as the University 
> of Phoenix, have all their reading material available in e-text directly 
> from the website?
>
> I'm not sure if I'm going to take any classes. One of my biggest 
> obstacles, and I'm sure for a lot of other blind people, is not having 
> access to my text books. I can't scan my books because the state won't 
> purchase Kurzweil for me, and listening to it on tape doesn't work because 
> of my hearing problem. The best way is with e-text, but I'm not sure who 
> has it and how easy or complicated it is to use.
>
> I tried AIU, but they didn't have most of their books avaiable in an 
> accessible format.
>
> Jen
>
> Shop my AVON online store
> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>
> Get healthy!
> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>
> Contact me:
>
> Jennifer Aberdeen
> PO Box 1184
> Woonsocket, RI 02895
> 401-762-3258 (home)
> 401-644-5607 (cell)
> freespirit328 at gmail.com
> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan%40gmail.com 




From rjaquiss at earthlink.net  Sun Jul 19 13:03:48 2009
From: rjaquiss at earthlink.net (Robert Jaquiss)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 08:03:48 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Grants for doctoral students in entrepreneurship
Message-ID: <2D3E1743C7C9432C81A1843020022CEB@D3DTZP41>

RFP Alerts: Philanthropy News DigestHello Colleagues:

     I thought this might be of interest.

Regards,

Robert Jaquiss, President
Greater Ouachita Chapter
National Federation of the Blind
Email: rjaquiss at earthlink.net
----- Original Message ----- 
From: PND RFP Alerts 
To: Rjaquiss at earthlink.net 
Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 4:26 AM
Subject: Today's RFPs from Philanthropy News Digest


              
            July 19, 2009

            The following requests for proposals have been posted to Philanthropy News Digest: 


            Kauffman Foundation Accepting Proposals for Entrepreneurship Dissertation Fellowship Grants
            Up to fifteen grants of $20,000 each will be awarded to Ph.D., D.B.A., or other doctoral students working on dissertations in the area of entrepreneurship.... 
            Deadline: September 23, 2009 
            Posted: July 19, 2009



--------------------------------------------------------------------
            Get Professional Grantseeking Power
            Only Foundation Directory Online Professional has four comprehensive databases, updated weekly. Search grantmakers, companies, grants, and 990s to pinpoint new prospects for funding. Subscribe. >> 



            You received this e-mail because you subscribed to PND RFP Alerts with the username "rjaquiss." To change the subjects of your alerts or to unsubscribe, click here.


            Foundation Center . 79 Fifth Avenue, New York, NY 10003 . (212) 620-4230  
     

From adrianne.dempsey at gmail.com  Sun Jul 19 15:55:59 2009
From: adrianne.dempsey at gmail.com (Adrianne Dempsey)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 11:55:59 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
References: <85ff10070907162146g6b3757f5oe9ba17bbedeab805@mail.gmail.com>
	<COL118-W305BE6D7FB556E5221E68BA1F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <43A4FA0BA3AA4A2381F89FB4E7F0BE73@YOUR314E04A90B>

If I were you, I would think about what career you're pursuing and the 
location in which you plan on living.  Think about what languages you hear 
most around that area and what languages people in your work place speak. If 
you want to visit a certain country or host an exchange student that is 
another way to pick a language.  And yet another thing to think about is 
your ancestors, and if you have any interest in that culture.  The first is 
mainly what I would think about, but it is a preference, and these are all 
reasons I have herd.  Also you may want to attempt a few words in each 
language your debating between and see how well you say them.  Also take a 
look at the grammar and find the one that is least likely to confuse you, 
unless you like challenges.  Also their is that option of learning more than 
one.  I wish you luck and enjoy what ever language you choose to learn. 
Languages are fun and so very useful.


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Elizabeth" <lizmohnke at hotmail.com>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 10:49 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language



Hello List,

I have been looking over the requirements of a particular degree I am 
interested in obtaining and noticed that it has a foreign language 
requirement. I’m not as afraid about how to take a foreign language class as 
a blind student as much as I am about how to go about deciding which 
language I should take. Back when I went to high school, there were only two 
foreign languages to choose from, and since I enjoyed my art and journalism 
electives, I chose to take neither of them.

However, in today’s college environment it appears as though it is no longer 
a simple choice between French or Spanish. The community college I am 
currently attending has French, Spanish, German, Japanese, and Vietnamese. 
In addition, the four year college I would like to transfer into offers 
courses in Arabic, Chinese, Greek, Hebrew, Latin, Italian, Portuguese, 
Russian, Swahili, and Ojibwa. So with all these options, does anyone have 
any advice on how I could go about picking the right one for me? I have a 
few ideas in mind, but I am interested in hearing how other students have 
gone about making this decision.

Thanks,
Elizabeth
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live™: Keep your life in sync.
http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009
_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
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From spangler.robert at gmail.com  Sun Jul 19 16:33:06 2009
From: spangler.robert at gmail.com (Robert Spangler)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 12:33:06 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
In-Reply-To: <COL118-W37AD8A7E21D32E87820D71BA1C0@phx.gbl>
References: <85ff10070907162146g6b3757f5oe9ba17bbedeab805@mail.gmail.com>	<COL118-W305BE6D7FB556E5221E68BA1F0@phx.gbl>
	<COL111-W435918EEFAA3A8E14A8875C01F0@phx.gbl>
	<COL118-W37AD8A7E21D32E87820D71BA1C0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <4A634AC2.8030802@gmail.com>

LOL, did you learn to speak the supposed President of Iran's name in 
Arabic or Farsi, as Farsi is their official language?  Arabic, as others 
have said on this list, would be a very useful language in foreign 
relations.  I feel that Chinese would be very good for business as we 
will probably be negotiating with them more and more over the next 
decades.  I myself have studied Arabic but never how to write it--I used 
Pimsleur's audio tutorials which focus on speaking.  The only thing you 
run into here is that classes that you take will most likely require you 
to write as well and I am not sure what type of accommodations they 
would set up--If you could work with the teacher one-on-one, for 
instance, perhaps they can teach you how to write the language using 
Roman letters as that's what languages like Arabic and Chinese do for 
Braille.  In fact, in the 1800s, there were a few Roman systems 
developed for writing Chinese so that people in the Army could learn it 
easier.  Chinese, with its pictographic way of writing things, makes it 
impossible to "sound out" words to learn pronunciation.

- Robby

On 7/18/2009 10:04 PM, Elizabeth wrote:
>
> Hello List,
>
> Thank you for all of your suggestions for choosing a foreign language. It appears as though most of you would suggest Spanish on the grounds that it is a commonly spoken language and is easy to learn. Others suggested that I choose a language that would prove to be the most useful in obtaining a job. And this is where I hit a crossroad, because if I were to choose a language based on this criteria alone, it would most likely be Arabic. However, since it took me about a weeks worth of practice to be able to correctly pronounce the name of the currently proclaimed President of Iran, I’m not quite sure how easy it would be to learn.
>
> My current major is sociology, and when I transfer I am looking at majoring in social relations and policy. I am interested in obtaining a career in government or public service. I’m sure that I could benefit from learning Spanish, but I figure that I could learn it just as easily on my own away from the academic setting. Since it is such a common language, I was looking for something else that might give me a bit more advantage in securing a job and yet still somewhat easy to learn. So does anyone on here have any experience in a foreign language other than Spanish? Also, does anyone know which foreign languages would work well as a base language for learning additional languages?
>
> Thanks,
> Elizabeth
> _________________________________________________________________
> Windows Live™ Hotmail®: Celebrate the moment with your favorite sports pics. Check it out.
> http://www.windowslive.com/Online/Hotmail/Campaign/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_QA_HM_sports_photos_072009&cat=sports
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/spangler.robert%40gmail.com
>


From liz.bottner at gmail.com  Sun Jul 19 16:40:45 2009
From: liz.bottner at gmail.com (Liz Bottner)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 12:40:45 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Introduction: Robert Jaquiss
In-Reply-To: <761578B8765A4C6FBCE0FCC9788E1FBA@D3DTZP41>
References: <761578B8765A4C6FBCE0FCC9788E1FBA@D3DTZP41>
Message-ID: <4a634c57.0e538c0a.0b00.fffff858@mx.google.com>

Hi Robert, 

Welcome to the list. My name is Liz Bottner. I am in the process of trying
to get into graduate school to pursue a masters in teaching visually
impaired children, adult rehabilitation and possibly also assistive
technology as a specialization. I have applied to Northern Illinois
University, and only taking the GRE stands between me and possibly being
accepted. I'm planning on taking that sometime in January, and then the rest
is out of my control. 

I remember meeting you at the Vertical Mentoring Workshop conference that
took place in Seattle in the summer of 2006. 

Take care, 

Liz 

email: 
liz.bottner at gmail.com 
Visit my livejournal: 
http://unsilenceddream.livejournal.com 
Follow me on Twitter: 
http://twitter.com/lizbot 




From iamantonio at cox.net  Sun Jul 19 17:11:45 2009
From: iamantonio at cox.net (Antonio M. Guimaraes)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 13:11:45 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
References: <6EEA4BC18C314240B8CE10244BB87A5B@Gateway>
Message-ID: <06AFBF73D64F436392F4860CC0534326@userf9b4fa60eb>

Hi Jen,

I thought to contact you privately first, but I wonder, if you don't mind 
sharing it with the list, why the state won't purchase Kurzweil for you.

Do they not realize you are blind, and thus print-disabled, and so would 
need to scan college materials for school?

do you, and do they understand that perhaps limmiting you to online schools 
with accessible electronic texts is severely limmiting your options, and 
that the one thing between you and an URI or some other college education is 
a $1000 scanning software?

More importantly, do you think it worth it to get one of us here in RI on 
board with you, and pushing, convincing the counselor, or giving you some 
guidance about your accomodations, and how you could put up a bit more of a 
fight for them?

It's not about what you want, but about what you'll need to succeed, or even 
have a basic chance to access information in college.

Antonio Guimaraes

If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup 
trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of 
highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary 
works in Braille.

Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you.
http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169
Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
To: "NABS-L" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 12:15 AM
Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs


> Hi all,
>
> Does anyone know if any of the online Universities, such as the University 
> of Phoenix, have all their reading material available in e-text directly 
> from the website?
>
> I'm not sure if I'm going to take any classes. One of my biggest 
> obstacles, and I'm sure for a lot of other blind people, is not having 
> access to my text books. I can't scan my books because the state won't 
> purchase Kurzweil for me, and listening to it on tape doesn't work because 
> of my hearing problem. The best way is with e-text, but I'm not sure who 
> has it and how easy or complicated it is to use.
>
> I tried AIU, but they didn't have most of their books avaiable in an 
> accessible format.
>
> Jen
>
> Shop my AVON online store
> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>
> Get healthy!
> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>
> Contact me:
>
> Jennifer Aberdeen
> PO Box 1184
> Woonsocket, RI 02895
> 401-762-3258 (home)
> 401-644-5607 (cell)
> freespirit328 at gmail.com
> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net 



From nijat1989 at gmail.com  Sun Jul 19 17:28:23 2009
From: nijat1989 at gmail.com (Nijat Worley)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 17:28:23 -0000
Subject: [nabs-l] Learning a foreign language
Message-ID: <6CFE4D131B0C41618BB5DED734715E1F@Nijatash>

Greetings Nabsters,
   Speaking of learning a foreign language, I am also going to be learning a foreign language this Faull and I need some advice from anyone that can give me some suggestions. I will be learning Russian. I went and downloaded the Russian voice for Real Speek Solo, and it works great. If I change my keyboard layout to Russian, and type in the Russian language, the Real Speak Solo voice reads the text in the Russian language for me. This is great, but for some strange reason it does not read Russian websites in Russian. I think JAWS has an automatic language recognition feature that should recognize the Russian language, and switch to it at once. Do any of you know why JAWS is not reading the websites in Russian?
   I am also trying to find the international Braille code so that I can learn Russian Braille. I understand that they use the same Braille as we do, however, they have more letters in their alphabet than we do, so some of our contractions become letters in their language. Does anywon know where I can get a hard Braille copy of the international Braille code, or the Braille code in Russian? I called the American Printing House for the Blind, and they did not have anything for me. Any ideas or suggestions will be appreciated.
   Thank you very much.
   Yours
   Nijat

From djdrocks4ever at gmail.com  Sun Jul 19 17:57:27 2009
From: djdrocks4ever at gmail.com (David Dunphy)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 12:57:27 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Convention Highlights Gone Over And More On Tonight's Djd
	Invasion
Message-ID: <4CAC7C922CA84094906E8A0FB00C351D@thedjdinvasion>

Hello All!
Join me tonight for another edition of The Djd Invasion starting at 7 PM eastern on Radio360, and this should be an informative evening if nothing else. This program will include
My thoughts and some of my experiences at my first ebver NFB convention including some audio clips to be played from there
Your opportunity to call in if you went and have something you'd like to say about it
A great variety of upbeat pop rock and country songs from the 80's through today, including a cash it or trash it track
And more...
You'll be able to call in to the show when songs are not being played by phone by calling
516-717-4425
or through skype at
radio360usa
or I can be contacted through email, msn, or aol instant messengers at the address
live at radio360.us
As to whether or not there will be a co host tonight??? You'll just have to tune in to find out!
So to check out this edition of The Djd Invasion, save this email, and at 7 PM eastern, head on over to
http://www.radio360.us/players/playerselection.html
to join in the fun that is The Djd Invasion. I hope to see you all there!
Best regards,
David Dunphy, host of The Djd Invasion and Radio360 Station Manager
http://www.radio360.us


__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4259 (20090719) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com


From sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca  Sun Jul 19 18:20:10 2009
From: sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca (sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 14:20:10 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
In-Reply-To: <COL111-W435918EEFAA3A8E14A8875C01F0@phx.gbl>
References: <85ff10070907162146g6b3757f5oe9ba17bbedeab805@mail.gmail.com>
	<COL118-W305BE6D7FB556E5221E68BA1F0@phx.gbl>
	<COL111-W435918EEFAA3A8E14A8875C01F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <20090719142010.lh5oo9nlesgko4cw@webmail.utoronto.ca>

Hi Elizabeth,
This is a great question, one which I have struglled with myself. Take  
whatever language you'ere interested in or can fit into your schedule.  
University is a time to explore new things so take advantage of that.  
If your a Braille reader like myself romance languages such as French  
or Spanish will be easier to receive Braille materials in without  
having to learn a new Braile system, but obviously if you want to  
learn something you'll work with your professors and DSS office to  
figure out what's best for you.
Please let us know how it goes, and good luck!
Sarah
P.S.: Have any Braille readers taken any non-romance languages such as  
Swahili, chinese or Hindi? I'm eager to try but have no idea where to  
begin learning them.


Quoting Monika Reinholz <monika_r_r at hotmail.com>:

>
> Elizabeth,
>
> First of all, Spanish is basically essential in this day and age no   
> matter your field of study. So that would be a good one to go with.   
> Also, you should look at what your major is/will be and what you   
> intend to do with it. Some languages would be better served in   
> certain fields...for example something to do with computers might be  
>  helpful to take Japanese or Swahili.
> I, for one, am going into the healthcare sector so Spanish and ASL   
> would highly valuable for me. Of course, I'm not sure how much more   
> difficult some languages would be to learn than others for someone   
> who is blind. Not saying its impossible, just might have to work   
> around some things more.
>
> But that would be my advice at least. I hope I was of some help.
> Monika
>
>
>
>> From: lizmohnke at hotmail.com
>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 22:49:56 -0400
>> Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
>>
>>
>> Hello List,
>>
>> I have been looking over the requirements of a particular degree I   
>> am interested in obtaining and noticed that it has a foreign   
>> language requirement. I’m not as afraid about how to take a foreign  
>>  language class as a blind student as much as I am about how to go   
>> about deciding which language I should take. Back when I went to   
>> high school, there were only two foreign languages to choose from,   
>> and since I enjoyed my art and journalism electives, I chose to   
>> take neither of them.
>>
>> However, in today’s college environment it appears as though it is   
>> no longer a simple choice between French or Spanish. The community   
>> college I am currently attending has French, Spanish, German,   
>> Japanese, and Vietnamese. In addition, the four year college I   
>> would like to transfer into offers courses in Arabic, Chinese,   
>> Greek, Hebrew, Latin, Italian, Portuguese, Russian, Swahili, and   
>> Ojibwa. So with all these options, does anyone have any advice on   
>> how I could go about picking the right one for me? I have a few   
>> ideas in mind, but I am interested in hearing how other students   
>> have gone about making this decision.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Elizabeth
>> _________________________________________________________________
>> Windows Live™: Keep your life in sync.
>> http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info   
>> for nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/monika_r_r%40hotmail.com
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40utoronto.ca
>





From adrianne.dempsey at gmail.com  Sun Jul 19 18:35:11 2009
From: adrianne.dempsey at gmail.com (Adrianne Dempsey)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 14:35:11 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
References: <85ff10070907162146g6b3757f5oe9ba17bbedeab805@mail.gmail.com><COL118-W305BE6D7FB556E5221E68BA1F0@phx.gbl>
	<COL111-W435918EEFAA3A8E14A8875C01F0@phx.gbl>
	<COL118-W37AD8A7E21D32E87820D71BA1C0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <6D9AEC8FC0344B9DBEBCDA0243F19F33@YOUR314E04A90B>

I speak Ottawa, German, Slovak, and Spanish, though none of them fluently. 
I speak enough to get around and can have deasent conversations. German is 
most like English, Spanish is the simplest, and Slovak is similar to 
pollish.  As far as a base, that depends what languages you want to learn. 
Languages are categorized by type.  Love languages are like Spanish French 
Italian and so on and so on.  A good base for these languages is latten but 
it is not useful on it's own except in the medical and science fields, 
however it will help your command of English and with the love languages. 
Then their are Germanic languages, German, English, Flemish, Dutch, and so 
on, a good base for these is German, but you already speak English, so you 
have your base for that.  Their are the Slavic languages, Slovak, pollish, 
Russian, and so on and so on.  A good base for this is probably Russian. 
But any eastern European language is very good to learn as it is more rare 
that people hear speak them and their are many good jobs in political fields 
as well as social work.  Arabic is a good language for a base of middle 
eastern languages.  Also it is very sought out in a lot of job fields. 
Chinese would be a good language to learn also, as it will most likely be 
the business language of the world in the next ten years or so.  However 
Chinese has pitch changes and their very important if you want to say the 
right thing.  So it gets complicated.  Korean is probably a good language to 
learn in this category, as much business is dun with that country and in 
future allot of political ventures.  Japanese is good to learn for the same 
reason, but it has become a fad in the U.S.and so it would be more 
competition in trying to find a job.  Then their is Swahili and that is 
becoming a universal business language between countries in Africa.  I hope 
this helps some.


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Elizabeth" <lizmohnke at hotmail.com>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, July 18, 2009 10:04 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language



Hello List,

Thank you for all of your suggestions for choosing a foreign language. It 
appears as though most of you would suggest Spanish on the grounds that it 
is a commonly spoken language and is easy to learn. Others suggested that I 
choose a language that would prove to be the most useful in obtaining a job. 
And this is where I hit a crossroad, because if I were to choose a language 
based on this criteria alone, it would most likely be Arabic. However, since 
it took me about a weeks worth of practice to be able to correctly pronounce 
the name of the currently proclaimed President of Iran, I’m not quite sure 
how easy it would be to learn.

My current major is sociology, and when I transfer I am looking at majoring 
in social relations and policy. I am interested in obtaining a career in 
government or public service. I’m sure that I could benefit from learning 
Spanish, but I figure that I could learn it just as easily on my own away 
from the academic setting. Since it is such a common language, I was looking 
for something else that might give me a bit more advantage in securing a job 
and yet still somewhat easy to learn. So does anyone on here have any 
experience in a foreign language other than Spanish? Also, does anyone know 
which foreign languages would work well as a base language for learning 
additional languages?

Thanks,
Elizabeth
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live™ Hotmail®: Celebrate the moment with your favorite sports pics. 
Check it out.
http://www.windowslive.com/Online/Hotmail/Campaign/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_QA_HM_sports_photos_072009&cat=sports
_______________________________________________
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nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/adrianne.dempsey%40gmail.com



From freespirit328 at gmail.com  Sun Jul 19 19:22:31 2009
From: freespirit328 at gmail.com (Jennifer Aberdeen)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 15:22:31 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
References: <6EEA4BC18C314240B8CE10244BB87A5B@Gateway>
	<06AFBF73D64F436392F4860CC0534326@userf9b4fa60eb>
Message-ID: <8DECAF49B2624A189FEB1FD2ED7726A7@Gateway>

Kurtzweil was recommended by my instructor at the Carroll Center, rather she 
taught me how to use it, but because it wasn't written in the report, the 
state said no when I mentioned it. I even told my counselor that I may have 
thrown away some very important papers because I didn't know what they were. 
Her response was "why did you throw them away?" "what do you think they 
might have been?" I told her I thought they might have been Social Security 
documents, and her response was, "Nine out of ten times you don't need 
them."

I'll have to go into debt again to buy myself this thing if I really need 
it, I guess, and honestly, if I do decide to take classes, I might be better 
off just trying to get financial aid because the state doesn't help me with 
that much.

Jen

Shop my AVON online store
http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com

Get healthy!
http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com

Contact me:

Jennifer Aberdeen
PO Box 1184
Woonsocket, RI 02895
401-762-3258 (home)
401-644-5607 (cell)
freespirit328 at gmail.com
SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Antonio M. Guimaraes" <iamantonio at cox.net>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 1:11 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs


> Hi Jen,
>
> I thought to contact you privately first, but I wonder, if you don't mind 
> sharing it with the list, why the state won't purchase Kurzweil for you.
>
> Do they not realize you are blind, and thus print-disabled, and so would 
> need to scan college materials for school?
>
> do you, and do they understand that perhaps limmiting you to online 
> schools with accessible electronic texts is severely limmiting your 
> options, and that the one thing between you and an URI or some other 
> college education is a $1000 scanning software?
>
> More importantly, do you think it worth it to get one of us here in RI on 
> board with you, and pushing, convincing the counselor, or giving you some 
> guidance about your accomodations, and how you could put up a bit more of 
> a fight for them?
>
> It's not about what you want, but about what you'll need to succeed, or 
> even have a basic chance to access information in college.
>
> Antonio Guimaraes
>
> If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup 
> trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of 
> highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary 
> works in Braille.
>
> Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you.
> http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169
> Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
> To: "NABS-L" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 12:15 AM
> Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>
>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Does anyone know if any of the online Universities, such as the 
>> University of Phoenix, have all their reading material available in 
>> e-text directly from the website?
>>
>> I'm not sure if I'm going to take any classes. One of my biggest 
>> obstacles, and I'm sure for a lot of other blind people, is not having 
>> access to my text books. I can't scan my books because the state won't 
>> purchase Kurzweil for me, and listening to it on tape doesn't work 
>> because of my hearing problem. The best way is with e-text, but I'm not 
>> sure who has it and how easy or complicated it is to use.
>>
>> I tried AIU, but they didn't have most of their books avaiable in an 
>> accessible format.
>>
>> Jen
>>
>> Shop my AVON online store
>> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>>
>> Get healthy!
>> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>>
>> Contact me:
>>
>> Jennifer Aberdeen
>> PO Box 1184
>> Woonsocket, RI 02895
>> 401-762-3258 (home)
>> 401-644-5607 (cell)
>> freespirit328 at gmail.com
>> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmail.com 



From jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com  Sun Jul 19 20:00:37 2009
From: jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com (Jess)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 16:00:37 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
In-Reply-To: <06AFBF73D64F436392F4860CC0534326@userf9b4fa60eb>
References: <6EEA4BC18C314240B8CE10244BB87A5B@Gateway>
	<06AFBF73D64F436392F4860CC0534326@userf9b4fa60eb>
Message-ID: <4a637b76.261e640a.57a2.042f@mx.google.com>

Antonio,
If you pay attention to Jen's Signature then you notice that she's already
working and in when you are  dealing with a rehab agency they take that into
consideration. And, since she's selling Avon that automatically means that
she wouldn't qualify for services from a rehab counselor any longer. Jen,
feel free to correct me if I'm incorrect.	
Jessica

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Antonio M. Guimaraes
Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 1:12 PM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs

Hi Jen,

I thought to contact you privately first, but I wonder, if you don't mind 
sharing it with the list, why the state won't purchase Kurzweil for you.

Do they not realize you are blind, and thus print-disabled, and so would 
need to scan college materials for school?

do you, and do they understand that perhaps limmiting you to online schools 
with accessible electronic texts is severely limmiting your options, and 
that the one thing between you and an URI or some other college education is

a $1000 scanning software?

More importantly, do you think it worth it to get one of us here in RI on 
board with you, and pushing, convincing the counselor, or giving you some 
guidance about your accomodations, and how you could put up a bit more of a 
fight for them?

It's not about what you want, but about what you'll need to succeed, or even

have a basic chance to access information in college.

Antonio Guimaraes

If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup 
trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of 
highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary 
works in Braille.

Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you.
http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169
Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
To: "NABS-L" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 12:15 AM
Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs


> Hi all,
>
> Does anyone know if any of the online Universities, such as the University

> of Phoenix, have all their reading material available in e-text directly 
> from the website?
>
> I'm not sure if I'm going to take any classes. One of my biggest 
> obstacles, and I'm sure for a lot of other blind people, is not having 
> access to my text books. I can't scan my books because the state won't 
> purchase Kurzweil for me, and listening to it on tape doesn't work because

> of my hearing problem. The best way is with e-text, but I'm not sure who 
> has it and how easy or complicated it is to use.
>
> I tried AIU, but they didn't have most of their books avaiable in an 
> accessible format.
>
> Jen
>
> Shop my AVON online store
> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>
> Get healthy!
> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>
> Contact me:
>
> Jennifer Aberdeen
> PO Box 1184
> Woonsocket, RI 02895
> 401-762-3258 (home)
> 401-644-5607 (cell)
> freespirit328 at gmail.com
> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net



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From rjaquiss at earthlink.net  Sun Jul 19 20:24:52 2009
From: rjaquiss at earthlink.net (Robert Jaquiss)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 15:24:52 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
References: <6EEA4BC18C314240B8CE10244BB87A5B@Gateway>
	<06AFBF73D64F436392F4860CC0534326@userf9b4fa60eb>
Message-ID: <9E8B9EE0FEEF4A7095B7C14CE75395DA@D3DTZP41>

Hello:

     It is my view that a student is likely to need K1000 software 
regardless of the school he/she attends. My wife is a student at Walden and 
she has had to buy textbooks. If you are studying a technical field such as 
IT or computer science, you might have a better chance of finding electronic 
versions of the books you want.

Regards,

Robert

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Antonio M. Guimaraes" <iamantonio at cox.net>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 12:11 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs


> Hi Jen,
>
> I thought to contact you privately first, but I wonder, if you don't mind 
> sharing it with the list, why the state won't purchase Kurzweil for you.
>
> Do they not realize you are blind, and thus print-disabled, and so would 
> need to scan college materials for school?
>
> do you, and do they understand that perhaps limmiting you to online 
> schools with accessible electronic texts is severely limmiting your 
> options, and that the one thing between you and an URI or some other 
> college education is a $1000 scanning software?
>
> More importantly, do you think it worth it to get one of us here in RI on 
> board with you, and pushing, convincing the counselor, or giving you some 
> guidance about your accomodations, and how you could put up a bit more of 
> a fight for them?
>
> It's not about what you want, but about what you'll need to succeed, or 
> even have a basic chance to access information in college.
>
> Antonio Guimaraes
>
> If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup 
> trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of 
> highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary 
> works in Braille.
>
> Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you.
> http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169
> Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
> To: "NABS-L" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 12:15 AM
> Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>
>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Does anyone know if any of the online Universities, such as the 
>> University of Phoenix, have all their reading material available in 
>> e-text directly from the website?
>>
>> I'm not sure if I'm going to take any classes. One of my biggest 
>> obstacles, and I'm sure for a lot of other blind people, is not having 
>> access to my text books. I can't scan my books because the state won't 
>> purchase Kurzweil for me, and listening to it on tape doesn't work 
>> because of my hearing problem. The best way is with e-text, but I'm not 
>> sure who has it and how easy or complicated it is to use.
>>
>> I tried AIU, but they didn't have most of their books avaiable in an 
>> accessible format.
>>
>> Jen
>>
>> Shop my AVON online store
>> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>>
>> Get healthy!
>> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>>
>> Contact me:
>>
>> Jennifer Aberdeen
>> PO Box 1184
>> Woonsocket, RI 02895
>> 401-762-3258 (home)
>> 401-644-5607 (cell)
>> freespirit328 at gmail.com
>> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/rjaquiss%40earthlink.net 



From nabs.president at gmail.com  Sun Jul 19 20:51:11 2009
From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 06:51:11 +1000
Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
In-Reply-To: <9E8B9EE0FEEF4A7095B7C14CE75395DA@D3DTZP41>
References: <6EEA4BC18C314240B8CE10244BB87A5B@Gateway>
	<06AFBF73D64F436392F4860CC0534326@userf9b4fa60eb>
	<9E8B9EE0FEEF4A7095B7C14CE75395DA@D3DTZP41>
Message-ID: <85ff10070907191351j14f3d802rad07b7b5272fb460@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Jen and all,

Jen, if your instructor at the Carroll center recommended Kurzweil,
contact her and ask her to re-write your report with the Kurzweil 1000
recommendation included. This seems like a reasonable request
especially if it could mean the difference between getting and not
getting it. Also inform your rehab counselor that because of your
hearing loss E-texts are much more accessible to you than are audio
materials. This alone should put you further up the chain for
receiving Kurzweil. Kurzweil is extremely useful not only for scanning
hard copies of textbooks, but also for converting PDF versions of
E-textbooks and papers into a format that you can understand.

Also see if the university you want to attend has any public computing
facilities with scanners and OCR software available to blind students.
This might be a viable option if you can't get your own personal copy
of Kurzweil.

Arielle


On 7/20/09, Robert Jaquiss <rjaquiss at earthlink.net> wrote:
> Hello:
>
>      It is my view that a student is likely to need K1000 software
> regardless of the school he/she attends. My wife is a student at Walden and
> she has had to buy textbooks. If you are studying a technical field such as
> IT or computer science, you might have a better chance of finding electronic
> versions of the books you want.
>
> Regards,
>
> Robert
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Antonio M. Guimaraes" <iamantonio at cox.net>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 12:11 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>
>
>> Hi Jen,
>>
>> I thought to contact you privately first, but I wonder, if you don't mind
>> sharing it with the list, why the state won't purchase Kurzweil for you.
>>
>> Do they not realize you are blind, and thus print-disabled, and so would
>> need to scan college materials for school?
>>
>> do you, and do they understand that perhaps limmiting you to online
>> schools with accessible electronic texts is severely limmiting your
>> options, and that the one thing between you and an URI or some other
>> college education is a $1000 scanning software?
>>
>> More importantly, do you think it worth it to get one of us here in RI on
>> board with you, and pushing, convincing the counselor, or giving you some
>> guidance about your accomodations, and how you could put up a bit more of
>> a fight for them?
>>
>> It's not about what you want, but about what you'll need to succeed, or
>> even have a basic chance to access information in college.
>>
>> Antonio Guimaraes
>>
>> If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup
>> trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of
>> highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary
>>
>> works in Braille.
>>
>> Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you.
>> http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169
>> Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
>> To: "NABS-L" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 12:15 AM
>> Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>
>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> Does anyone know if any of the online Universities, such as the
>>> University of Phoenix, have all their reading material available in
>>> e-text directly from the website?
>>>
>>> I'm not sure if I'm going to take any classes. One of my biggest
>>> obstacles, and I'm sure for a lot of other blind people, is not having
>>> access to my text books. I can't scan my books because the state won't
>>> purchase Kurzweil for me, and listening to it on tape doesn't work
>>> because of my hearing problem. The best way is with e-text, but I'm not
>>> sure who has it and how easy or complicated it is to use.
>>>
>>> I tried AIU, but they didn't have most of their books avaiable in an
>>> accessible format.
>>>
>>> Jen
>>>
>>> Shop my AVON online store
>>> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>>>
>>> Get healthy!
>>> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>>>
>>> Contact me:
>>>
>>> Jennifer Aberdeen
>>> PO Box 1184
>>> Woonsocket, RI 02895
>>> 401-762-3258 (home)
>>> 401-644-5607 (cell)
>>> freespirit328 at gmail.com
>>> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/rjaquiss%40earthlink.net
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com
>


-- 
Arielle Silverman
President, National Association of Blind Students
Phone:  602-502-2255
Email:
nabs.president at gmail.com
Website:
www.nabslink.org


From loneblindjedi at samobile.net  Sun Jul 19 23:08:49 2009
From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 19:08:49 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle
Message-ID: <20090719230849.29362.3936@web1.serotek.com>

Nijat,

Let me clarify. I'd like to meet a fully functional artificial 
intelligence. The current intelligences we have rely on mathematical 
patterns in order to figure out what comments would fit where. 
Alternatively, they can work like Google search engines where they 
focus on key words and create dialog that way. Our own brains do these 
things in their own way, but we have the creativity necessary to think 
outside our mathmatical/key word programming if necessary. The best in 
AI would also be able to do that. Hasn't anyone here seen Star Trek or 
star wars? They are both great examples of what AI could look like in 
the future.

Respectfully,
Jedi
Original message:
> Jedi,
>    I think you will meet and interview an artificial intelligence before you
> meet a nice person from somewhere else besides Earth. Just remember that
> when interviewing an artificial intelligence, you will only get the answers
> that have been programmed into its memory, and nothing new, or original. LOL
>    Nijat

> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jedi" <loneblindjedi at samobile.net>
> To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Friday, July 17, 2009 1:19 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind can take wheel with new vehicle


>> Hi.

>> Personally, I would like a vehicle where I have an autopilot option where
>> the car drives for me, or I can choose to drive myself with its
>> instructions. And perhaps, I can assign certain functions to the computer
>> and do the rest myself. That's just me. Really though, I've always dreamed
>> of hiring an artificial intelligence, especially if it has a body of its
>> own such as an android or something. I've always been fascinated with
>> aritifical intelligences. I'd love to interview one and see what I come
>> out with. In fact, it's a lifetime of mine to do so. My other lifetime
>> goal is to meet an honest to goodness person from somewhere other than
>> Earth. Any guesses which will happen first?

>> Respectfully,
>> Jedi


>> Original message:
>>> Hello:

>>>      In response to the comments regarding a car drivable by a blind
>>> person;
>>> As a member of the Committee on Research and Development, I believe this
>>> is
>>> important research. It is important that we the NFB are involved with
>>> this
>>> sort of project. Efforts are underway to create autonomous vehicles. Two
>>> such efforts were the DARPA (Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency)
>>> Grand Challenges of 2005 and 2007. The 2007 challenge showed that it was
>>> possible to build a vehicle that could navigate in an urban setting. In
>>> the
>>> coming years, I am confident that there will be vehicles that will drive
>>> themselves. These vehicles will use a variety of technologies including
>>> GPS.
>>> One thing that will be needed is a way for an operator to get his/her
>>> vehicle onto a road or maneuver in a parking lot. These activities could
>>> I
>>> think be done by a blind person given the appropriate adaptations. Being
>>> involved with those doing this sort of research helps ensure that are
>>> needs
>>> are considered when developing new technologies. As an organization, we
>>> must
>>> be proactive and get involved with product developments, so we can
>>> continue
>>> to effectively function in society.

>>>      In the past, it was possible for us to create alternative techniques
>>> in
>>> response to technological developments. With the rapid changes in our
>>> world,
>>> we must be more involved, so we can for example have appliances that we
>>> can
>>> use, computer operating systems that are accessible, accessible cell
>>> phones
>>> etc. A personal vehicle would be of great help in getting to work, school
>>> or
>>> wherever else we want to go.

>>>      The technologies described in the article could also benefit those
>>> in
>>> wheelchairs. Like it or not, we have an aging population. Wheelchair
>>> mobility is difficult and users must take great care not to roll down
>>> steps
>>> etc. Some sensors might mike their lives easier.

>>> Regards,

>>> Robert Jaquiss


>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net

>> --
>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.  Visit
>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.

>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nijat1989%40gmail.com


> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net

-- 
Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.  Visit 
www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.


From loneblindjedi at samobile.net  Sun Jul 19 23:13:52 2009
From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 19:13:52 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Brand-new K-NFB Reader for sale at a discount
Message-ID: <20090719231352.27082.42817@web1.serotek.com>

Corbb,

Will you please post your e-mail address?

Also, I don't know if you're aware, but you'd do well to keep your 
reader phone and use wayFinder as it's much cheaper than a Trekker and 
is also more versitle. Just a thought.

Respectfully,
Jedi


Original message:
> Now before you go wondering why a scholarship winner is selling his K-
> NFB Reader, know that I am using the funds to purchase a Trekker GPS,
> which is of a more immediate need to me. I'm not looking to profit
> from a gracious NFB scholarship.

> I'm looking to sell a brand new K-NFB Reader Mobile. It does not
> include Talks or MobileSpeak, the screen reader for cell phones, but
> it does include the new Nokia N82 phone and K-NFB Reader
> software...all in their original packaging. (Those programs typically
> retail for about $300.)

> My initial asking price is $1350 plus shipping (retails for $1370 plus
> shipping). However, I am open to negotiate that price. This product
> will be sold as-is, with no additional warranty or guarantee. Payments
> MUST be processed through PayPal.

> If you're interested, DO NOT REPLY TO THIS E-MAIL. E-mail me OFF-LIST!

> Thanks,
> Corbb

> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net

-- 
Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.  Visit 
www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.


From lakeisha.renee at gmail.com  Sun Jul 19 23:20:58 2009
From: lakeisha.renee at gmail.com (LaKeisha Holmes)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 19:20:58 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Southeastern Student Seminar
In-Reply-To: <4a61e03f.1d1d640a.4cd6.0224@mx.google.com>
References: <4a61e03f.1d1d640a.4cd6.0224@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <157cfe700907191620q405ad640t15e6967273e86742@mail.gmail.com>

The Southeast regional seminar will be held August 14th-16th at the
Ramada Plaza hotel in Macon GA. At the seminar we will learn basic
life skills from dressing up for special occasions to changing a tire
on a car. We will also have a banquet on Saturday night with a keynote
speaker. If anyone has any questions; feel free to call me at
678-877-6263. You can also email me at lakeisha.renee at gmail.com.

On 7/18/09, David Bouchard <davidb521 at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi,
> I am interested in attending the Southeastern Student Seminar in Macon, GA
> on August 14-16. However, I need information such as the location, and any
> general information about the seminar would be helpful. Also, if any guys
> are going, and they are interested in a roommate, I am interested.
> Thanks,
> David
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lakeisha.renee%40gmail.com
>


From haltaf at carrollu.edu  Sun Jul 19 23:48:04 2009
From: haltaf at carrollu.edu (Hina)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 18:48:04 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
References: <85ff10070907162146g6b3757f5oe9ba17bbedeab805@mail.gmail.com><COL118-W305BE6D7FB556E5221E68BA1F0@phx.gbl><COL111-W435918EEFAA3A8E14A8875C01F0@phx.gbl>
	<20090719142010.lh5oo9nlesgko4cw@webmail.utoronto.ca>
Message-ID: <0F01155398204757932FA35076C6297E@DB8D43F1>

hi,
i am an international student and do know hindi and urdu, learning some 
chinese.
i can help if you  need any assistance.
hina.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: <sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 1:20 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language


> Hi Elizabeth,
> This is a great question, one which I have struglled with myself. Take 
> whatever language you'ere interested in or can fit into your schedule. 
> University is a time to explore new things so take advantage of that.  If 
> your a Braille reader like myself romance languages such as French  or 
> Spanish will be easier to receive Braille materials in without  having to 
> learn a new Braile system, but obviously if you want to  learn something 
> you'll work with your professors and DSS office to  figure out what's best 
> for you.
> Please let us know how it goes, and good luck!
> Sarah
> P.S.: Have any Braille readers taken any non-romance languages such as 
> Swahili, chinese or Hindi? I'm eager to try but have no idea where to 
> begin learning them.
>
>
> Quoting Monika Reinholz <monika_r_r at hotmail.com>:
>
>>
>> Elizabeth,
>>
>> First of all, Spanish is basically essential in this day and age no 
>> matter your field of study. So that would be a good one to go with. 
>> Also, you should look at what your major is/will be and what you   intend 
>> to do with it. Some languages would be better served in   certain 
>> fields...for example something to do with computers might be  helpful to 
>> take Japanese or Swahili.
>> I, for one, am going into the healthcare sector so Spanish and ASL 
>> would highly valuable for me. Of course, I'm not sure how much more 
>> difficult some languages would be to learn than others for someone   who 
>> is blind. Not saying its impossible, just might have to work   around 
>> some things more.
>>
>> But that would be my advice at least. I hope I was of some help.
>> Monika
>>
>>
>>
>>> From: lizmohnke at hotmail.com
>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 22:49:56 -0400
>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Choosing a Foreign Language
>>>
>>>
>>> Hello List,
>>>
>>> I have been looking over the requirements of a particular degree I   am 
>>> interested in obtaining and noticed that it has a foreign   language 
>>> requirement. I’m not as afraid about how to take a foreign  language 
>>> class as a blind student as much as I am about how to go   about 
>>> deciding which language I should take. Back when I went to   high 
>>> school, there were only two foreign languages to choose from,   and 
>>> since I enjoyed my art and journalism electives, I chose to   take 
>>> neither of them.
>>>
>>> However, in today’s college environment it appears as though it is   no 
>>> longer a simple choice between French or Spanish. The community 
>>> college I am currently attending has French, Spanish, German, 
>>> Japanese, and Vietnamese. In addition, the four year college I   would 
>>> like to transfer into offers courses in Arabic, Chinese,   Greek, 
>>> Hebrew, Latin, Italian, Portuguese, Russian, Swahili, and   Ojibwa. So 
>>> with all these options, does anyone have any advice on   how I could go 
>>> about picking the right one for me? I have a few   ideas in mind, but I 
>>> am interested in hearing how other students   have gone about making 
>>> this decision.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Elizabeth
>>> _________________________________________________________________
>>> Windows Live™: Keep your life in sync.
>>> http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info   for 
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/monika_r_r%40hotmail.com
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40utoronto.ca
>>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/haltaf%40carrollu.edu
> 



From freespirit328 at gmail.com  Sun Jul 19 23:58:24 2009
From: freespirit328 at gmail.com (Jennifer Aberdeen)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 19:58:24 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
References: <6EEA4BC18C314240B8CE10244BB87A5B@Gateway><06AFBF73D64F436392F4860CC0534326@userf9b4fa60eb>
	<4a637b76.261e640a.57a2.042f@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <6E6431E244A24BE0BF813B2126B1F741@Gateway>

Hi Jess,

I do sell AVON, but I don't make much money doing it. It gives me a little 
spending money, that's about it.

Actually I did tell my counsellor that I wanted to sell Avon full time, but 
she didn't want to hear that, lol.

Jen

Shop my AVON online store
http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com

Get healthy!
http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com

Contact me:

Jennifer Aberdeen
PO Box 1184
Woonsocket, RI 02895
401-762-3258 (home)
401-644-5607 (cell)
freespirit328 at gmail.com
SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jess" <jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com>
To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 4:00 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs


> Antonio,
> If you pay attention to Jen's Signature then you notice that she's already
> working and in when you are  dealing with a rehab agency they take that 
> into
> consideration. And, since she's selling Avon that automatically means that
> she wouldn't qualify for services from a rehab counselor any longer. Jen,
> feel free to correct me if I'm incorrect.
> Jessica
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
> Behalf
> Of Antonio M. Guimaraes
> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 1:12 PM
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>
> Hi Jen,
>
> I thought to contact you privately first, but I wonder, if you don't mind
> sharing it with the list, why the state won't purchase Kurzweil for you.
>
> Do they not realize you are blind, and thus print-disabled, and so would
> need to scan college materials for school?
>
> do you, and do they understand that perhaps limmiting you to online 
> schools
> with accessible electronic texts is severely limmiting your options, and
> that the one thing between you and an URI or some other college education 
> is
>
> a $1000 scanning software?
>
> More importantly, do you think it worth it to get one of us here in RI on
> board with you, and pushing, convincing the counselor, or giving you some
> guidance about your accomodations, and how you could put up a bit more of 
> a
> fight for them?
>
> It's not about what you want, but about what you'll need to succeed, or 
> even
>
> have a basic chance to access information in college.
>
> Antonio Guimaraes
>
> If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup
> trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of
> highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary
> works in Braille.
>
> Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you.
> http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169
> Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
> To: "NABS-L" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 12:15 AM
> Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>
>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Does anyone know if any of the online Universities, such as the 
>> University
>
>> of Phoenix, have all their reading material available in e-text directly
>> from the website?
>>
>> I'm not sure if I'm going to take any classes. One of my biggest
>> obstacles, and I'm sure for a lot of other blind people, is not having
>> access to my text books. I can't scan my books because the state won't
>> purchase Kurzweil for me, and listening to it on tape doesn't work 
>> because
>
>> of my hearing problem. The best way is with e-text, but I'm not sure who
>> has it and how easy or complicated it is to use.
>>
>> I tried AIU, but they didn't have most of their books avaiable in an
>> accessible format.
>>
>> Jen
>>
>> Shop my AVON online store
>> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>>
>> Get healthy!
>> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>>
>> Contact me:
>>
>> Jennifer Aberdeen
>> PO Box 1184
>> Woonsocket, RI 02895
>> 401-762-3258 (home)
>> 401-644-5607 (cell)
>> freespirit328 at gmail.com
>> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan
> %40gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmail.com 



From jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com  Mon Jul 20 01:42:40 2009
From: jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com (Jess)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 21:42:40 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
In-Reply-To: <6E6431E244A24BE0BF813B2126B1F741@Gateway>
References: <6EEA4BC18C314240B8CE10244BB87A5B@Gateway><06AFBF73D64F436392F4860CC0534326@userf9b4fa60eb>	<4a637b76.261e640a.57a2.042f@mx.google.com>
	<6E6431E244A24BE0BF813B2126B1F741@Gateway>
Message-ID: <4a63cba2.1d35640a.2a85.1b04@mx.google.com>

Jen,
You do have to choice to not continue with your Individual Plan for
Employment if you'd like to sell Avon full time. Your rehab counselor sounds
a lot like mine and Rania's where each of our rehab counselors aren't being
supportive with what we want to do for our careers. It sounding like your
rehab counselor is doing the same exact thing that mine and Rania's are.
What are you planning to study in college? If you go that route? Sounds like
you need to meet with your rehab counselor and tell her that you'd rather
sell Avon full time instead of going school. Just stuck to your guns so to
speak when you talk to your rehab counselor. There is a lot that I've
learned from living in three different states dealing with three different
rehab agencies and several rehab counselors in each of these state agencies
for the blind and visually impaired. 
Jessica

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Jennifer Aberdeen
Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 7:58 PM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs

Hi Jess,

I do sell AVON, but I don't make much money doing it. It gives me a little 
spending money, that's about it.

Actually I did tell my counsellor that I wanted to sell Avon full time, but 
she didn't want to hear that, lol.

Jen

Shop my AVON online store
http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com

Get healthy!
http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com

Contact me:

Jennifer Aberdeen
PO Box 1184
Woonsocket, RI 02895
401-762-3258 (home)
401-644-5607 (cell)
freespirit328 at gmail.com
SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jess" <jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com>
To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 4:00 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs


> Antonio,
> If you pay attention to Jen's Signature then you notice that she's already
> working and in when you are  dealing with a rehab agency they take that 
> into
> consideration. And, since she's selling Avon that automatically means that
> she wouldn't qualify for services from a rehab counselor any longer. Jen,
> feel free to correct me if I'm incorrect.
> Jessica
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
> Behalf
> Of Antonio M. Guimaraes
> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 1:12 PM
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>
> Hi Jen,
>
> I thought to contact you privately first, but I wonder, if you don't mind
> sharing it with the list, why the state won't purchase Kurzweil for you.
>
> Do they not realize you are blind, and thus print-disabled, and so would
> need to scan college materials for school?
>
> do you, and do they understand that perhaps limmiting you to online 
> schools
> with accessible electronic texts is severely limmiting your options, and
> that the one thing between you and an URI or some other college education 
> is
>
> a $1000 scanning software?
>
> More importantly, do you think it worth it to get one of us here in RI on
> board with you, and pushing, convincing the counselor, or giving you some
> guidance about your accomodations, and how you could put up a bit more of 
> a
> fight for them?
>
> It's not about what you want, but about what you'll need to succeed, or 
> even
>
> have a basic chance to access information in college.
>
> Antonio Guimaraes
>
> If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup
> trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of
> highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary
> works in Braille.
>
> Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you.
> http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169
> Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
> To: "NABS-L" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 12:15 AM
> Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>
>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Does anyone know if any of the online Universities, such as the 
>> University
>
>> of Phoenix, have all their reading material available in e-text directly
>> from the website?
>>
>> I'm not sure if I'm going to take any classes. One of my biggest
>> obstacles, and I'm sure for a lot of other blind people, is not having
>> access to my text books. I can't scan my books because the state won't
>> purchase Kurzweil for me, and listening to it on tape doesn't work 
>> because
>
>> of my hearing problem. The best way is with e-text, but I'm not sure who
>> has it and how easy or complicated it is to use.
>>
>> I tried AIU, but they didn't have most of their books avaiable in an
>> accessible format.
>>
>> Jen
>>
>> Shop my AVON online store
>> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>>
>> Get healthy!
>> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>>
>> Contact me:
>>
>> Jennifer Aberdeen
>> PO Box 1184
>> Woonsocket, RI 02895
>> 401-762-3258 (home)
>> 401-644-5607 (cell)
>> freespirit328 at gmail.com
>> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>>
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan
> %40gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmai
l.com 


_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan
%40gmail.com



From freespirit328 at gmail.com  Mon Jul 20 02:32:41 2009
From: freespirit328 at gmail.com (Jennifer Aberdeen)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 22:32:41 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
References: <6EEA4BC18C314240B8CE10244BB87A5B@Gateway><06AFBF73D64F436392F4860CC0534326@userf9b4fa60eb>	<4a637b76.261e640a.57a2.042f@mx.google.com><6E6431E244A24BE0BF813B2126B1F741@Gateway>
	<4a63cba2.1d35640a.2a85.1b04@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <F38827DA383F46E1AA266EC72EB04EE1@Gateway>

Jessica,

I have, in a sense, discontinued my association with the VR Counselor. 
Although I haven't closed my case, I'm not keeping in contact with her. I 
told her I wanted to sell AVON full-time. She didn't agree; her season was 
that it's very difficult to make AVON a full-time, prophitable business. 
That is probably true, but I think I have enough friends and acquaintances 
to make a go of it. What a lot of people don't realize is that I can sell 
Avon products to anyone in the United States via my website, which gives 
direct delivery options.

Jen

Shop my AVON online store
http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com

Get healthy!
http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com

Contact me:

Jennifer Aberdeen
PO Box 1184
Woonsocket, RI 02895
401-762-3258 (home)
401-644-5607 (cell)
freespirit328 at gmail.com
SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jess" <jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com>
To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 9:42 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs


> Jen,
> You do have to choice to not continue with your Individual Plan for
> Employment if you'd like to sell Avon full time. Your rehab counselor 
> sounds
> a lot like mine and Rania's where each of our rehab counselors aren't 
> being
> supportive with what we want to do for our careers. It sounding like your
> rehab counselor is doing the same exact thing that mine and Rania's are.
> What are you planning to study in college? If you go that route? Sounds 
> like
> you need to meet with your rehab counselor and tell her that you'd rather
> sell Avon full time instead of going school. Just stuck to your guns so to
> speak when you talk to your rehab counselor. There is a lot that I've
> learned from living in three different states dealing with three different
> rehab agencies and several rehab counselors in each of these state 
> agencies
> for the blind and visually impaired.
> Jessica
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
> Behalf
> Of Jennifer Aberdeen
> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 7:58 PM
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>
> Hi Jess,
>
> I do sell AVON, but I don't make much money doing it. It gives me a little
> spending money, that's about it.
>
> Actually I did tell my counsellor that I wanted to sell Avon full time, 
> but
> she didn't want to hear that, lol.
>
> Jen
>
> Shop my AVON online store
> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>
> Get healthy!
> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>
> Contact me:
>
> Jennifer Aberdeen
> PO Box 1184
> Woonsocket, RI 02895
> 401-762-3258 (home)
> 401-644-5607 (cell)
> freespirit328 at gmail.com
> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Jess" <jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com>
> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 4:00 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>
>
>> Antonio,
>> If you pay attention to Jen's Signature then you notice that she's 
>> already
>> working and in when you are  dealing with a rehab agency they take that
>> into
>> consideration. And, since she's selling Avon that automatically means 
>> that
>> she wouldn't qualify for services from a rehab counselor any longer. Jen,
>> feel free to correct me if I'm incorrect.
>> Jessica
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>> Behalf
>> Of Antonio M. Guimaraes
>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 1:12 PM
>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>
>> Hi Jen,
>>
>> I thought to contact you privately first, but I wonder, if you don't mind
>> sharing it with the list, why the state won't purchase Kurzweil for you.
>>
>> Do they not realize you are blind, and thus print-disabled, and so would
>> need to scan college materials for school?
>>
>> do you, and do they understand that perhaps limmiting you to online
>> schools
>> with accessible electronic texts is severely limmiting your options, and
>> that the one thing between you and an URI or some other college education
>> is
>>
>> a $1000 scanning software?
>>
>> More importantly, do you think it worth it to get one of us here in RI on
>> board with you, and pushing, convincing the counselor, or giving you some
>> guidance about your accomodations, and how you could put up a bit more of
>> a
>> fight for them?
>>
>> It's not about what you want, but about what you'll need to succeed, or
>> even
>>
>> have a basic chance to access information in college.
>>
>> Antonio Guimaraes
>>
>> If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup
>> trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of
>> highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great 
>> literary
>> works in Braille.
>>
>> Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you.
>> http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169
>> Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
>> To: "NABS-L" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 12:15 AM
>> Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>
>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> Does anyone know if any of the online Universities, such as the
>>> University
>>
>>> of Phoenix, have all their reading material available in e-text directly
>>> from the website?
>>>
>>> I'm not sure if I'm going to take any classes. One of my biggest
>>> obstacles, and I'm sure for a lot of other blind people, is not having
>>> access to my text books. I can't scan my books because the state won't
>>> purchase Kurzweil for me, and listening to it on tape doesn't work
>>> because
>>
>>> of my hearing problem. The best way is with e-text, but I'm not sure who
>>> has it and how easy or complicated it is to use.
>>>
>>> I tried AIU, but they didn't have most of their books avaiable in an
>>> accessible format.
>>>
>>> Jen
>>>
>>> Shop my AVON online store
>>> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>>>
>>> Get healthy!
>>> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>>>
>>> Contact me:
>>>
>>> Jennifer Aberdeen
>>> PO Box 1184
>>> Woonsocket, RI 02895
>>> 401-762-3258 (home)
>>> 401-644-5607 (cell)
>>> freespirit328 at gmail.com
>>> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>>
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan
>> %40gmail.com
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmai
> l.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan
> %40gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmail.com 



From lakeisha.renee at gmail.com  Mon Jul 20 03:22:42 2009
From: lakeisha.renee at gmail.com (LaKeisha Holmes)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 23:22:42 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Southeastern Student Seminar
In-Reply-To: <4a61e03f.1d1d640a.4cd6.0224@mx.google.com>
References: <4a61e03f.1d1d640a.4cd6.0224@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <4a63e304.01025a0a.1f77.7112@mx.google.com>

Hi,
My name is LaKeisha  Holmes. I am the treasurer for the Georgia Association
of Blind  Students and also the  coordinator for the southeast regional
seminar. The southeast regional seminar will be held on August 14th through
the 16th. The name of the seminar is U Improving U. It was designed to teach
young blind individuals basic life skills. The students will learn basic
life skills from dressing up for a special occasion to changing a tire on a
vehicle. If anyone has any questions or want to know more information about
the event; feel free to call me at 678-877-6263. You can also email me at
lakeisha.renee at gmail.com as  well.
Thanks

LaKeisha Holmes
Treasurer
Cobb County Empowerment Chapter
Georgia Association of Blind Students

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of David Bouchard
Sent: Saturday, July 18, 2009 10:46 AM
To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
Subject: [nabs-l] Southeastern Student Seminar

Hi, 
I am interested in attending the Southeastern Student Seminar in Macon, GA
on August 14-16. However, I need information such as the location, and any
general information about the seminar would be helpful. Also, if any guys
are going, and they are interested in a roommate, I am interested. 
Thanks, 
David

_______________________________________________
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nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lakeisha.renee%40gma
il.com
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 
Version: 8.5.375 / Virus Database: 270.13.19/2245 - Release Date: 07/18/09
05:57:00



From raniaismail04 at gmail.com  Mon Jul 20 03:26:38 2009
From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania)
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 23:26:38 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
References: <6EEA4BC18C314240B8CE10244BB87A5B@Gateway><06AFBF73D64F436392F4860CC0534326@userf9b4fa60eb>	<4a637b76.261e640a.57a2.042f@mx.google.com><6E6431E244A24BE0BF813B2126B1F741@Gateway><4a63cba2.1d35640a.2a85.1b04@mx.google.com>
	<F38827DA383F46E1AA266EC72EB04EE1@Gateway>
Message-ID: <000701ca08e9$e4e474e0$2801a8c0@DHQ5QJF1>

How do you manage to sell stuff online? I couldn't do it because I don't 
know enough people to sell stuff to and I couldn't leave the house because I 
would have to have UPS come to my house every day to pick up boxees and 
another reason why it wouldn't work for me is because I still live at home 
with my parrents so there is no space for me to store stuff anyway. That's 
why I just terned that idea down really quick and told her I wanted to go 
back to school and finish up while the information was still fresh in my 
head.
Rania,
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 10:32 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs


> Jessica,
>
> I have, in a sense, discontinued my association with the VR Counselor. 
> Although I haven't closed my case, I'm not keeping in contact with her. I 
> told her I wanted to sell AVON full-time. She didn't agree; her season was 
> that it's very difficult to make AVON a full-time, prophitable business. 
> That is probably true, but I think I have enough friends and acquaintances 
> to make a go of it. What a lot of people don't realize is that I can sell 
> Avon products to anyone in the United States via my website, which gives 
> direct delivery options.
>
> Jen
>
> Shop my AVON online store
> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>
> Get healthy!
> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>
> Contact me:
>
> Jennifer Aberdeen
> PO Box 1184
> Woonsocket, RI 02895
> 401-762-3258 (home)
> 401-644-5607 (cell)
> freespirit328 at gmail.com
> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Jess" <jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com>
> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" 
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 9:42 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>
>
>> Jen,
>> You do have to choice to not continue with your Individual Plan for
>> Employment if you'd like to sell Avon full time. Your rehab counselor 
>> sounds
>> a lot like mine and Rania's where each of our rehab counselors aren't 
>> being
>> supportive with what we want to do for our careers. It sounding like your
>> rehab counselor is doing the same exact thing that mine and Rania's are.
>> What are you planning to study in college? If you go that route? Sounds 
>> like
>> you need to meet with your rehab counselor and tell her that you'd rather
>> sell Avon full time instead of going school. Just stuck to your guns so 
>> to
>> speak when you talk to your rehab counselor. There is a lot that I've
>> learned from living in three different states dealing with three 
>> different
>> rehab agencies and several rehab counselors in each of these state 
>> agencies
>> for the blind and visually impaired.
>> Jessica
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
>> Behalf
>> Of Jennifer Aberdeen
>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 7:58 PM
>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>
>> Hi Jess,
>>
>> I do sell AVON, but I don't make much money doing it. It gives me a 
>> little
>> spending money, that's about it.
>>
>> Actually I did tell my counsellor that I wanted to sell Avon full time, 
>> but
>> she didn't want to hear that, lol.
>>
>> Jen
>>
>> Shop my AVON online store
>> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>>
>> Get healthy!
>> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>>
>> Contact me:
>>
>> Jennifer Aberdeen
>> PO Box 1184
>> Woonsocket, RI 02895
>> 401-762-3258 (home)
>> 401-644-5607 (cell)
>> freespirit328 at gmail.com
>> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Jess" <jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com>
>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 4:00 PM
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>
>>
>>> Antonio,
>>> If you pay attention to Jen's Signature then you notice that she's 
>>> already
>>> working and in when you are  dealing with a rehab agency they take that
>>> into
>>> consideration. And, since she's selling Avon that automatically means 
>>> that
>>> she wouldn't qualify for services from a rehab counselor any longer. 
>>> Jen,
>>> feel free to correct me if I'm incorrect.
>>> Jessica
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>> Behalf
>>> Of Antonio M. Guimaraes
>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 1:12 PM
>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>
>>> Hi Jen,
>>>
>>> I thought to contact you privately first, but I wonder, if you don't 
>>> mind
>>> sharing it with the list, why the state won't purchase Kurzweil for you.
>>>
>>> Do they not realize you are blind, and thus print-disabled, and so would
>>> need to scan college materials for school?
>>>
>>> do you, and do they understand that perhaps limmiting you to online
>>> schools
>>> with accessible electronic texts is severely limmiting your options, and
>>> that the one thing between you and an URI or some other college 
>>> education
>>> is
>>>
>>> a $1000 scanning software?
>>>
>>> More importantly, do you think it worth it to get one of us here in RI 
>>> on
>>> board with you, and pushing, convincing the counselor, or giving you 
>>> some
>>> guidance about your accomodations, and how you could put up a bit more 
>>> of
>>> a
>>> fight for them?
>>>
>>> It's not about what you want, but about what you'll need to succeed, or
>>> even
>>>
>>> have a basic chance to access information in college.
>>>
>>> Antonio Guimaraes
>>>
>>> If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup
>>> trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number 
>>> of
>>> highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great 
>>> literary
>>> works in Braille.
>>>
>>> Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you.
>>> http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169
>>> Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall
>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>> From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
>>> To: "NABS-L" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 12:15 AM
>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>
>>>
>>>> Hi all,
>>>>
>>>> Does anyone know if any of the online Universities, such as the
>>>> University
>>>
>>>> of Phoenix, have all their reading material available in e-text 
>>>> directly
>>>> from the website?
>>>>
>>>> I'm not sure if I'm going to take any classes. One of my biggest
>>>> obstacles, and I'm sure for a lot of other blind people, is not having
>>>> access to my text books. I can't scan my books because the state won't
>>>> purchase Kurzweil for me, and listening to it on tape doesn't work
>>>> because
>>>
>>>> of my hearing problem. The best way is with e-text, but I'm not sure 
>>>> who
>>>> has it and how easy or complicated it is to use.
>>>>
>>>> I tried AIU, but they didn't have most of their books avaiable in an
>>>> accessible format.
>>>>
>>>> Jen
>>>>
>>>> Shop my AVON online store
>>>> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>>>>
>>>> Get healthy!
>>>> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>>>>
>>>> Contact me:
>>>>
>>>> Jennifer Aberdeen
>>>> PO Box 1184
>>>> Woonsocket, RI 02895
>>>> 401-762-3258 (home)
>>>> 401-644-5607 (cell)
>>>> freespirit328 at gmail.com
>>>> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>
>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan
>>> %40gmail.com
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmai
>> l.com
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan
>> %40gmail.com
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmail.com 



From freespirit328 at gmail.com  Mon Jul 20 05:08:09 2009
From: freespirit328 at gmail.com (Jennifer Aberdeen)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 01:08:09 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
References: <6EEA4BC18C314240B8CE10244BB87A5B@Gateway><06AFBF73D64F436392F4860CC0534326@userf9b4fa60eb>	<4a637b76.261e640a.57a2.042f@mx.google.com><6E6431E244A24BE0BF813B2126B1F741@Gateway><4a63cba2.1d35640a.2a85.1b04@mx.google.com><F38827DA383F46E1AA266EC72EB04EE1@Gateway>
	<000701ca08e9$e4e474e0$2801a8c0@DHQ5QJF1>
Message-ID: <E7932D6DE4F84686872083A47CB2EE98@Gateway>

The products can be shipped directly from the AVON warehouse. I don't have 
any stock in my house.

Jen

Shop my AVON online store
http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com

Get healthy!
http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com

Contact me:

Jennifer Aberdeen
PO Box 1184
Woonsocket, RI 02895
401-762-3258 (home)
401-644-5607 (cell)
freespirit328 at gmail.com
SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Rania" <raniaismail04 at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 11:26 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs


> How do you manage to sell stuff online? I couldn't do it because I don't 
> know enough people to sell stuff to and I couldn't leave the house because 
> I would have to have UPS come to my house every day to pick up boxees and 
> another reason why it wouldn't work for me is because I still live at home 
> with my parrents so there is no space for me to store stuff anyway. That's 
> why I just terned that idea down really quick and told her I wanted to go 
> back to school and finish up while the information was still fresh in my 
> head.
> Rania,
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 10:32 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>
>
>> Jessica,
>>
>> I have, in a sense, discontinued my association with the VR Counselor. 
>> Although I haven't closed my case, I'm not keeping in contact with her. I 
>> told her I wanted to sell AVON full-time. She didn't agree; her season 
>> was that it's very difficult to make AVON a full-time, prophitable 
>> business. That is probably true, but I think I have enough friends and 
>> acquaintances to make a go of it. What a lot of people don't realize is 
>> that I can sell Avon products to anyone in the United States via my 
>> website, which gives direct delivery options.
>>
>> Jen
>>
>> Shop my AVON online store
>> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>>
>> Get healthy!
>> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>>
>> Contact me:
>>
>> Jennifer Aberdeen
>> PO Box 1184
>> Woonsocket, RI 02895
>> 401-762-3258 (home)
>> 401-644-5607 (cell)
>> freespirit328 at gmail.com
>> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Jess" <jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com>
>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" 
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 9:42 PM
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>
>>
>>> Jen,
>>> You do have to choice to not continue with your Individual Plan for
>>> Employment if you'd like to sell Avon full time. Your rehab counselor 
>>> sounds
>>> a lot like mine and Rania's where each of our rehab counselors aren't 
>>> being
>>> supportive with what we want to do for our careers. It sounding like 
>>> your
>>> rehab counselor is doing the same exact thing that mine and Rania's are.
>>> What are you planning to study in college? If you go that route? Sounds 
>>> like
>>> you need to meet with your rehab counselor and tell her that you'd 
>>> rather
>>> sell Avon full time instead of going school. Just stuck to your guns so 
>>> to
>>> speak when you talk to your rehab counselor. There is a lot that I've
>>> learned from living in three different states dealing with three 
>>> different
>>> rehab agencies and several rehab counselors in each of these state 
>>> agencies
>>> for the blind and visually impaired.
>>> Jessica
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
>>> Behalf
>>> Of Jennifer Aberdeen
>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 7:58 PM
>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>
>>> Hi Jess,
>>>
>>> I do sell AVON, but I don't make much money doing it. It gives me a 
>>> little
>>> spending money, that's about it.
>>>
>>> Actually I did tell my counsellor that I wanted to sell Avon full time, 
>>> but
>>> she didn't want to hear that, lol.
>>>
>>> Jen
>>>
>>> Shop my AVON online store
>>> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>>>
>>> Get healthy!
>>> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>>>
>>> Contact me:
>>>
>>> Jennifer Aberdeen
>>> PO Box 1184
>>> Woonsocket, RI 02895
>>> 401-762-3258 (home)
>>> 401-644-5607 (cell)
>>> freespirit328 at gmail.com
>>> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>> From: "Jess" <jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com>
>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"
>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 4:00 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>
>>>
>>>> Antonio,
>>>> If you pay attention to Jen's Signature then you notice that she's 
>>>> already
>>>> working and in when you are  dealing with a rehab agency they take that
>>>> into
>>>> consideration. And, since she's selling Avon that automatically means 
>>>> that
>>>> she wouldn't qualify for services from a rehab counselor any longer. 
>>>> Jen,
>>>> feel free to correct me if I'm incorrect.
>>>> Jessica
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>>> Behalf
>>>> Of Antonio M. Guimaraes
>>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 1:12 PM
>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>>
>>>> Hi Jen,
>>>>
>>>> I thought to contact you privately first, but I wonder, if you don't 
>>>> mind
>>>> sharing it with the list, why the state won't purchase Kurzweil for 
>>>> you.
>>>>
>>>> Do they not realize you are blind, and thus print-disabled, and so 
>>>> would
>>>> need to scan college materials for school?
>>>>
>>>> do you, and do they understand that perhaps limmiting you to online
>>>> schools
>>>> with accessible electronic texts is severely limmiting your options, 
>>>> and
>>>> that the one thing between you and an URI or some other college 
>>>> education
>>>> is
>>>>
>>>> a $1000 scanning software?
>>>>
>>>> More importantly, do you think it worth it to get one of us here in RI 
>>>> on
>>>> board with you, and pushing, convincing the counselor, or giving you 
>>>> some
>>>> guidance about your accomodations, and how you could put up a bit more 
>>>> of
>>>> a
>>>> fight for them?
>>>>
>>>> It's not about what you want, but about what you'll need to succeed, or
>>>> even
>>>>
>>>> have a basic chance to access information in college.
>>>>
>>>> Antonio Guimaraes
>>>>
>>>> If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of 
>>>> pickup
>>>> trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number 
>>>> of
>>>> highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great 
>>>> literary
>>>> works in Braille.
>>>>
>>>> Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you.
>>>> http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169
>>>> Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
>>>> To: "NABS-L" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 12:15 AM
>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>
>>>>> Does anyone know if any of the online Universities, such as the
>>>>> University
>>>>
>>>>> of Phoenix, have all their reading material available in e-text 
>>>>> directly
>>>>> from the website?
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm not sure if I'm going to take any classes. One of my biggest
>>>>> obstacles, and I'm sure for a lot of other blind people, is not having
>>>>> access to my text books. I can't scan my books because the state won't
>>>>> purchase Kurzweil for me, and listening to it on tape doesn't work
>>>>> because
>>>>
>>>>> of my hearing problem. The best way is with e-text, but I'm not sure 
>>>>> who
>>>>> has it and how easy or complicated it is to use.
>>>>>
>>>>> I tried AIU, but they didn't have most of their books avaiable in an
>>>>> accessible format.
>>>>>
>>>>> Jen
>>>>>
>>>>> Shop my AVON online store
>>>>> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>>>>>
>>>>> Get healthy!
>>>>> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>>>>>
>>>>> Contact me:
>>>>>
>>>>> Jennifer Aberdeen
>>>>> PO Box 1184
>>>>> Woonsocket, RI 02895
>>>>> 401-762-3258 (home)
>>>>> 401-644-5607 (cell)
>>>>> freespirit328 at gmail.com
>>>>> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>>
>>>>
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan
>>>> %40gmail.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmai
>>> l.com
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan
>>> %40gmail.com
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmail.com 



From jbahm at pcdesk.net  Mon Jul 20 06:08:59 2009
From: jbahm at pcdesk.net (Joseph C. Lininger)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 00:08:59 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Learning a foreign language
In-Reply-To: <6D2CA1156395446CA01EE4CBC363F4F1@Nijatash>
References: <6D2CA1156395446CA01EE4CBC363F4F1@Nijatash>
Message-ID: <4A6409FB.5000206@pcdesk.net>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Nijat,

Below I have quoted part of your message and then answered your
questions below the quote.

> This is great, but for some strange reason it does not read Russian websites
> in Russian. I think JAWS has an automatic language recognition feature that should
> recognize the Russian language, and switch to it at once. Do any of you know why
> JAWS is not reading the websites in Russian?

In fact, I do know why. You're probably missing one of the ingredients
to get that to work. A few things have to be true in order to switch
languages on the fly like that.

1. You must have a Russian language synthesizer installed. You've
already met this requirement.

2. I believe you need to have Russian language support installed in
Windows. This one you probably haven't done.

3. The site has to identify itself as a Russian language site. Not all
sites will do that.

I haven't ever tried to do this myself, but this is my understanding of
what one must do to make it work.

> I am also trying to find the international Braille code so that I can learn Russian
> Braille. I understand that they use the same Braille as we do, however, they have
> more letters in their alphabet than we do, so some of our contractions become letters

I won't venture a guess on this one, prefering to leave it in the hands
of someone more qualified to answer.
Joe
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From raniaismail04 at gmail.com  Mon Jul 20 10:35:48 2009
From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 06:35:48 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
References: <6EEA4BC18C314240B8CE10244BB87A5B@Gateway><06AFBF73D64F436392F4860CC0534326@userf9b4fa60eb>	<4a637b76.261e640a.57a2.042f@mx.google.com><6E6431E244A24BE0BF813B2126B1F741@Gateway><4a63cba2.1d35640a.2a85.1b04@mx.google.com><F38827DA383F46E1AA266EC72EB04EE1@Gateway><000701ca08e9$e4e474e0$2801a8c0@DHQ5QJF1>
	<E7932D6DE4F84686872083A47CB2EE98@Gateway>
Message-ID: <003b01ca0925$d9332c90$2801a8c0@DHQ5QJF1>

Do you have to go to school to get training doing that?
Rania,
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, July 20, 2009 1:08 AM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs


> The products can be shipped directly from the AVON warehouse. I don't have 
> any stock in my house.
>
> Jen
>
> Shop my AVON online store
> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>
> Get healthy!
> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>
> Contact me:
>
> Jennifer Aberdeen
> PO Box 1184
> Woonsocket, RI 02895
> 401-762-3258 (home)
> 401-644-5607 (cell)
> freespirit328 at gmail.com
> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Rania" <raniaismail04 at gmail.com>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 11:26 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>
>
>> How do you manage to sell stuff online? I couldn't do it because I don't 
>> know enough people to sell stuff to and I couldn't leave the house 
>> because I would have to have UPS come to my house every day to pick up 
>> boxees and another reason why it wouldn't work for me is because I still 
>> live at home with my parrents so there is no space for me to store stuff 
>> anyway. That's why I just terned that idea down really quick and told her 
>> I wanted to go back to school and finish up while the information was 
>> still fresh in my head.
>> Rania,
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 10:32 PM
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>
>>
>>> Jessica,
>>>
>>> I have, in a sense, discontinued my association with the VR Counselor. 
>>> Although I haven't closed my case, I'm not keeping in contact with her. 
>>> I told her I wanted to sell AVON full-time. She didn't agree; her season 
>>> was that it's very difficult to make AVON a full-time, prophitable 
>>> business. That is probably true, but I think I have enough friends and 
>>> acquaintances to make a go of it. What a lot of people don't realize is 
>>> that I can sell Avon products to anyone in the United States via my 
>>> website, which gives direct delivery options.
>>>
>>> Jen
>>>
>>> Shop my AVON online store
>>> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>>>
>>> Get healthy!
>>> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>>>
>>> Contact me:
>>>
>>> Jennifer Aberdeen
>>> PO Box 1184
>>> Woonsocket, RI 02895
>>> 401-762-3258 (home)
>>> 401-644-5607 (cell)
>>> freespirit328 at gmail.com
>>> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>> From: "Jess" <jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com>
>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" 
>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 9:42 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>
>>>
>>>> Jen,
>>>> You do have to choice to not continue with your Individual Plan for
>>>> Employment if you'd like to sell Avon full time. Your rehab counselor 
>>>> sounds
>>>> a lot like mine and Rania's where each of our rehab counselors aren't 
>>>> being
>>>> supportive with what we want to do for our careers. It sounding like 
>>>> your
>>>> rehab counselor is doing the same exact thing that mine and Rania's 
>>>> are.
>>>> What are you planning to study in college? If you go that route? Sounds 
>>>> like
>>>> you need to meet with your rehab counselor and tell her that you'd 
>>>> rather
>>>> sell Avon full time instead of going school. Just stuck to your guns so 
>>>> to
>>>> speak when you talk to your rehab counselor. There is a lot that I've
>>>> learned from living in three different states dealing with three 
>>>> different
>>>> rehab agencies and several rehab counselors in each of these state 
>>>> agencies
>>>> for the blind and visually impaired.
>>>> Jessica
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
>>>> Behalf
>>>> Of Jennifer Aberdeen
>>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 7:58 PM
>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>>
>>>> Hi Jess,
>>>>
>>>> I do sell AVON, but I don't make much money doing it. It gives me a 
>>>> little
>>>> spending money, that's about it.
>>>>
>>>> Actually I did tell my counsellor that I wanted to sell Avon full time, 
>>>> but
>>>> she didn't want to hear that, lol.
>>>>
>>>> Jen
>>>>
>>>> Shop my AVON online store
>>>> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>>>>
>>>> Get healthy!
>>>> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>>>>
>>>> Contact me:
>>>>
>>>> Jennifer Aberdeen
>>>> PO Box 1184
>>>> Woonsocket, RI 02895
>>>> 401-762-3258 (home)
>>>> 401-644-5607 (cell)
>>>> freespirit328 at gmail.com
>>>> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> From: "Jess" <jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com>
>>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"
>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 4:00 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Antonio,
>>>>> If you pay attention to Jen's Signature then you notice that she's 
>>>>> already
>>>>> working and in when you are  dealing with a rehab agency they take 
>>>>> that
>>>>> into
>>>>> consideration. And, since she's selling Avon that automatically means 
>>>>> that
>>>>> she wouldn't qualify for services from a rehab counselor any longer. 
>>>>> Jen,
>>>>> feel free to correct me if I'm incorrect.
>>>>> Jessica
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>>>> Behalf
>>>>> Of Antonio M. Guimaraes
>>>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 1:12 PM
>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi Jen,
>>>>>
>>>>> I thought to contact you privately first, but I wonder, if you don't 
>>>>> mind
>>>>> sharing it with the list, why the state won't purchase Kurzweil for 
>>>>> you.
>>>>>
>>>>> Do they not realize you are blind, and thus print-disabled, and so 
>>>>> would
>>>>> need to scan college materials for school?
>>>>>
>>>>> do you, and do they understand that perhaps limmiting you to online
>>>>> schools
>>>>> with accessible electronic texts is severely limmiting your options, 
>>>>> and
>>>>> that the one thing between you and an URI or some other college 
>>>>> education
>>>>> is
>>>>>
>>>>> a $1000 scanning software?
>>>>>
>>>>> More importantly, do you think it worth it to get one of us here in RI 
>>>>> on
>>>>> board with you, and pushing, convincing the counselor, or giving you 
>>>>> some
>>>>> guidance about your accomodations, and how you could put up a bit more 
>>>>> of
>>>>> a
>>>>> fight for them?
>>>>>
>>>>> It's not about what you want, but about what you'll need to succeed, 
>>>>> or
>>>>> even
>>>>>
>>>>> have a basic chance to access information in college.
>>>>>
>>>>> Antonio Guimaraes
>>>>>
>>>>> If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of 
>>>>> pickup
>>>>> trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number 
>>>>> of
>>>>> highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great 
>>>>> literary
>>>>> works in Braille.
>>>>>
>>>>> Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you.
>>>>> http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169
>>>>> Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall
>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>> From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
>>>>> To: "NABS-L" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 12:15 AM
>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Does anyone know if any of the online Universities, such as the
>>>>>> University
>>>>>
>>>>>> of Phoenix, have all their reading material available in e-text 
>>>>>> directly
>>>>>> from the website?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm not sure if I'm going to take any classes. One of my biggest
>>>>>> obstacles, and I'm sure for a lot of other blind people, is not 
>>>>>> having
>>>>>> access to my text books. I can't scan my books because the state 
>>>>>> won't
>>>>>> purchase Kurzweil for me, and listening to it on tape doesn't work
>>>>>> because
>>>>>
>>>>>> of my hearing problem. The best way is with e-text, but I'm not sure 
>>>>>> who
>>>>>> has it and how easy or complicated it is to use.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I tried AIU, but they didn't have most of their books avaiable in an
>>>>>> accessible format.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jen
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Shop my AVON online store
>>>>>> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Get healthy!
>>>>>> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Contact me:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jennifer Aberdeen
>>>>>> PO Box 1184
>>>>>> Woonsocket, RI 02895
>>>>>> 401-762-3258 (home)
>>>>>> 401-644-5607 (cell)
>>>>>> freespirit328 at gmail.com
>>>>>> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>>
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan
>>>>> %40gmail.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>>
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmai
>>>> l.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan
>>>> %40gmail.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmail.com
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
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From nijat1989 at gmail.com  Mon Jul 20 15:20:17 2009
From: nijat1989 at gmail.com (Nijat Worley)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 09:20:17 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Learning a foreign language
In-Reply-To: <4A6409FB.5000206@pcdesk.net>
References: <6D2CA1156395446CA01EE4CBC363F4F1@Nijatash>
	<4A6409FB.5000206@pcdesk.net>
Message-ID: <7ab194dc0907200820w5ce37601j8ea6b72c694c58dc@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Joe,
   Thank you for the tips. I will try them to see if I can get it to
work. Thanks again for the suggestions.
   Nijat


On 7/20/09, Joseph C. Lininger <jbahm at pcdesk.net> wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA256
>
> Nijat,
>
> Below I have quoted part of your message and then answered your
> questions below the quote.
>
>> This is great, but for some strange reason it does not read Russian
>> websites
>> in Russian. I think JAWS has an automatic language recognition feature
>> that should
>> recognize the Russian language, and switch to it at once. Do any of you
>> know why
>> JAWS is not reading the websites in Russian?
>
> In fact, I do know why. You're probably missing one of the ingredients
> to get that to work. A few things have to be true in order to switch
> languages on the fly like that.
>
> 1. You must have a Russian language synthesizer installed. You've
> already met this requirement.
>
> 2. I believe you need to have Russian language support installed in
> Windows. This one you probably haven't done.
>
> 3. The site has to identify itself as a Russian language site. Not all
> sites will do that.
>
> I haven't ever tried to do this myself, but this is my understanding of
> what one must do to make it work.
>
>> I am also trying to find the international Braille code so that I can
>> learn Russian
>> Braille. I understand that they use the same Braille as we do, however,
>> they have
>> more letters in their alphabet than we do, so some of our contractions
>> become letters
>
> I won't venture a guess on this one, prefering to leave it in the hands
> of someone more qualified to answer.
> Joe
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (MingW32)
>
> iQEcBAEBCAAGBQJKZAn7AAoJEMh8jNraUiwqJ+sH/0kPbYCKYjdJOJfwFYQwGlCq
> /lphbEJJJWbojXwDxjDCvRXsqSsVgsZjI4PVBJ8TabhM1iBVvIqKvnhGNHlVsM1X
> Fe3rKsRgD+LXGKCrVKbO5hbvH2siyNeCpyNHGfZmPSCjVZAjc6xfTicR0S+qS6KY
> DdGllYt1yYoyUWFjaDxfwuLlma4ijySHGGAfEk47DouhYyGeroltxnN6XOfVxHQh
> CgAsNsmPXU7VruJ/1iUiHWkosHzN2vUSBkpAGeA6z6EFhAg4UEVeuBwlJjra32NB
> P9pZvUOOvu0VOnrw2ysKSVENEe2Q2Kj9al1cQpqHv9biuHET/iGFZ4Aj/Z0HAZY=
> =/NTO
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nijat1989%40gmail.com
>


From freespirit328 at gmail.com  Mon Jul 20 18:45:54 2009
From: freespirit328 at gmail.com (Jennifer Aberdeen)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 14:45:54 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
References: <6EEA4BC18C314240B8CE10244BB87A5B@Gateway><06AFBF73D64F436392F4860CC0534326@userf9b4fa60eb>	<4a637b76.261e640a.57a2.042f@mx.google.com><6E6431E244A24BE0BF813B2126B1F741@Gateway><4a63cba2.1d35640a.2a85.1b04@mx.google.com><F38827DA383F46E1AA266EC72EB04EE1@Gateway><000701ca08e9$e4e474e0$2801a8c0@DHQ5QJF1><E7932D6DE4F84686872083A47CB2EE98@Gateway>
	<003b01ca0925$d9332c90$2801a8c0@DHQ5QJF1>
Message-ID: <7647CBAB074F4932ACE8CBA78EFAA9E1@Gateway>

Nope, there's a training area on the website; It's not very accessible, but 
it's not manditory either.

Jen

Shop my AVON online store
http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com

Get healthy!
http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com

Contact me:

Jennifer Aberdeen
PO Box 1184
Woonsocket, RI 02895
401-762-3258 (home)
401-644-5607 (cell)
freespirit328 at gmail.com
SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Rania" <raniaismail04 at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, July 20, 2009 6:35 AM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs


> Do you have to go to school to get training doing that?
> Rania,
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Monday, July 20, 2009 1:08 AM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>
>
>> The products can be shipped directly from the AVON warehouse. I don't 
>> have any stock in my house.
>>
>> Jen
>>
>> Shop my AVON online store
>> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>>
>> Get healthy!
>> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>>
>> Contact me:
>>
>> Jennifer Aberdeen
>> PO Box 1184
>> Woonsocket, RI 02895
>> 401-762-3258 (home)
>> 401-644-5607 (cell)
>> freespirit328 at gmail.com
>> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Rania" <raniaismail04 at gmail.com>
>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 11:26 PM
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>
>>
>>> How do you manage to sell stuff online? I couldn't do it because I don't 
>>> know enough people to sell stuff to and I couldn't leave the house 
>>> because I would have to have UPS come to my house every day to pick up 
>>> boxees and another reason why it wouldn't work for me is because I still 
>>> live at home with my parrents so there is no space for me to store stuff 
>>> anyway. That's why I just terned that idea down really quick and told 
>>> her I wanted to go back to school and finish up while the information 
>>> was still fresh in my head.
>>> Rania,
>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>> From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 10:32 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>
>>>
>>>> Jessica,
>>>>
>>>> I have, in a sense, discontinued my association with the VR Counselor. 
>>>> Although I haven't closed my case, I'm not keeping in contact with her. 
>>>> I told her I wanted to sell AVON full-time. She didn't agree; her 
>>>> season was that it's very difficult to make AVON a full-time, 
>>>> prophitable business. That is probably true, but I think I have enough 
>>>> friends and acquaintances to make a go of it. What a lot of people 
>>>> don't realize is that I can sell Avon products to anyone in the United 
>>>> States via my website, which gives direct delivery options.
>>>>
>>>> Jen
>>>>
>>>> Shop my AVON online store
>>>> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>>>>
>>>> Get healthy!
>>>> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>>>>
>>>> Contact me:
>>>>
>>>> Jennifer Aberdeen
>>>> PO Box 1184
>>>> Woonsocket, RI 02895
>>>> 401-762-3258 (home)
>>>> 401-644-5607 (cell)
>>>> freespirit328 at gmail.com
>>>> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> From: "Jess" <jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com>
>>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" 
>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 9:42 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Jen,
>>>>> You do have to choice to not continue with your Individual Plan for
>>>>> Employment if you'd like to sell Avon full time. Your rehab counselor 
>>>>> sounds
>>>>> a lot like mine and Rania's where each of our rehab counselors aren't 
>>>>> being
>>>>> supportive with what we want to do for our careers. It sounding like 
>>>>> your
>>>>> rehab counselor is doing the same exact thing that mine and Rania's 
>>>>> are.
>>>>> What are you planning to study in college? If you go that route? 
>>>>> Sounds like
>>>>> you need to meet with your rehab counselor and tell her that you'd 
>>>>> rather
>>>>> sell Avon full time instead of going school. Just stuck to your guns 
>>>>> so to
>>>>> speak when you talk to your rehab counselor. There is a lot that I've
>>>>> learned from living in three different states dealing with three 
>>>>> different
>>>>> rehab agencies and several rehab counselors in each of these state 
>>>>> agencies
>>>>> for the blind and visually impaired.
>>>>> Jessica
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
>>>>> Behalf
>>>>> Of Jennifer Aberdeen
>>>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 7:58 PM
>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi Jess,
>>>>>
>>>>> I do sell AVON, but I don't make much money doing it. It gives me a 
>>>>> little
>>>>> spending money, that's about it.
>>>>>
>>>>> Actually I did tell my counsellor that I wanted to sell Avon full 
>>>>> time, but
>>>>> she didn't want to hear that, lol.
>>>>>
>>>>> Jen
>>>>>
>>>>> Shop my AVON online store
>>>>> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>>>>>
>>>>> Get healthy!
>>>>> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>>>>>
>>>>> Contact me:
>>>>>
>>>>> Jennifer Aberdeen
>>>>> PO Box 1184
>>>>> Woonsocket, RI 02895
>>>>> 401-762-3258 (home)
>>>>> 401-644-5607 (cell)
>>>>> freespirit328 at gmail.com
>>>>> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>> From: "Jess" <jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com>
>>>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"
>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 4:00 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Antonio,
>>>>>> If you pay attention to Jen's Signature then you notice that she's 
>>>>>> already
>>>>>> working and in when you are  dealing with a rehab agency they take 
>>>>>> that
>>>>>> into
>>>>>> consideration. And, since she's selling Avon that automatically means 
>>>>>> that
>>>>>> she wouldn't qualify for services from a rehab counselor any longer. 
>>>>>> Jen,
>>>>>> feel free to correct me if I'm incorrect.
>>>>>> Jessica
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>>>>> Behalf
>>>>>> Of Antonio M. Guimaraes
>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 1:12 PM
>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Jen,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I thought to contact you privately first, but I wonder, if you don't 
>>>>>> mind
>>>>>> sharing it with the list, why the state won't purchase Kurzweil for 
>>>>>> you.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Do they not realize you are blind, and thus print-disabled, and so 
>>>>>> would
>>>>>> need to scan college materials for school?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> do you, and do they understand that perhaps limmiting you to online
>>>>>> schools
>>>>>> with accessible electronic texts is severely limmiting your options, 
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> that the one thing between you and an URI or some other college 
>>>>>> education
>>>>>> is
>>>>>>
>>>>>> a $1000 scanning software?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> More importantly, do you think it worth it to get one of us here in 
>>>>>> RI on
>>>>>> board with you, and pushing, convincing the counselor, or giving you 
>>>>>> some
>>>>>> guidance about your accomodations, and how you could put up a bit 
>>>>>> more of
>>>>>> a
>>>>>> fight for them?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It's not about what you want, but about what you'll need to succeed, 
>>>>>> or
>>>>>> even
>>>>>>
>>>>>> have a basic chance to access information in college.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Antonio Guimaraes
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of 
>>>>>> pickup
>>>>>> trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite 
>>>>>> number of
>>>>>> highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great 
>>>>>> literary
>>>>>> works in Braille.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you.
>>>>>> http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169
>>>>>> Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall
>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>> From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
>>>>>> To: "NABS-L" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 12:15 AM
>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Does anyone know if any of the online Universities, such as the
>>>>>>> University
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> of Phoenix, have all their reading material available in e-text 
>>>>>>> directly
>>>>>>> from the website?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'm not sure if I'm going to take any classes. One of my biggest
>>>>>>> obstacles, and I'm sure for a lot of other blind people, is not 
>>>>>>> having
>>>>>>> access to my text books. I can't scan my books because the state 
>>>>>>> won't
>>>>>>> purchase Kurzweil for me, and listening to it on tape doesn't work
>>>>>>> because
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> of my hearing problem. The best way is with e-text, but I'm not sure 
>>>>>>> who
>>>>>>> has it and how easy or complicated it is to use.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I tried AIU, but they didn't have most of their books avaiable in an
>>>>>>> accessible format.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Jen
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Shop my AVON online store
>>>>>>> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Get healthy!
>>>>>>> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Contact me:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Jennifer Aberdeen
>>>>>>> PO Box 1184
>>>>>>> Woonsocket, RI 02895
>>>>>>> 401-762-3258 (home)
>>>>>>> 401-644-5607 (cell)
>>>>>>> freespirit328 at gmail.com
>>>>>>> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan
>>>>>> %40gmail.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmai
>>>>> l.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan
>>>>> %40gmail.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmail.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmail.com
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmail.com 



From raniaismail04 at gmail.com  Mon Jul 20 20:01:14 2009
From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 16:01:14 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
References: <6EEA4BC18C314240B8CE10244BB87A5B@Gateway><06AFBF73D64F436392F4860CC0534326@userf9b4fa60eb>	<4a637b76.261e640a.57a2.042f@mx.google.com><6E6431E244A24BE0BF813B2126B1F741@Gateway><4a63cba2.1d35640a.2a85.1b04@mx.google.com><F38827DA383F46E1AA266EC72EB04EE1@Gateway><000701ca08e9$e4e474e0$2801a8c0@DHQ5QJF1><E7932D6DE4F84686872083A47CB2EE98@Gateway><003b01ca0925$d9332c90$2801a8c0@DHQ5QJF1>
	<7647CBAB074F4932ACE8CBA78EFAA9E1@Gateway>
Message-ID: <001101ca0974$d76aafb0$2801a8c0@DHQ5QJF1>

well you can email me off list at raniaismail04 at gmail.com so we don't fill 
the in boxes of those who don't want to read this.
Rania,
Rania,
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, July 20, 2009 2:45 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs


> Nope, there's a training area on the website; It's not very accessible, 
> but it's not manditory either.
>
> Jen
>
> Shop my AVON online store
> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>
> Get healthy!
> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>
> Contact me:
>
> Jennifer Aberdeen
> PO Box 1184
> Woonsocket, RI 02895
> 401-762-3258 (home)
> 401-644-5607 (cell)
> freespirit328 at gmail.com
> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Rania" <raniaismail04 at gmail.com>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Monday, July 20, 2009 6:35 AM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>
>
>> Do you have to go to school to get training doing that?
>> Rania,
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Monday, July 20, 2009 1:08 AM
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>
>>
>>> The products can be shipped directly from the AVON warehouse. I don't 
>>> have any stock in my house.
>>>
>>> Jen
>>>
>>> Shop my AVON online store
>>> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>>>
>>> Get healthy!
>>> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>>>
>>> Contact me:
>>>
>>> Jennifer Aberdeen
>>> PO Box 1184
>>> Woonsocket, RI 02895
>>> 401-762-3258 (home)
>>> 401-644-5607 (cell)
>>> freespirit328 at gmail.com
>>> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>> From: "Rania" <raniaismail04 at gmail.com>
>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 11:26 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>
>>>
>>>> How do you manage to sell stuff online? I couldn't do it because I 
>>>> don't know enough people to sell stuff to and I couldn't leave the 
>>>> house because I would have to have UPS come to my house every day to 
>>>> pick up boxees and another reason why it wouldn't work for me is 
>>>> because I still live at home with my parrents so there is no space for 
>>>> me to store stuff anyway. That's why I just terned that idea down 
>>>> really quick and told her I wanted to go back to school and finish up 
>>>> while the information was still fresh in my head.
>>>> Rania,
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
>>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 10:32 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Jessica,
>>>>>
>>>>> I have, in a sense, discontinued my association with the VR Counselor. 
>>>>> Although I haven't closed my case, I'm not keeping in contact with 
>>>>> her. I told her I wanted to sell AVON full-time. She didn't agree; her 
>>>>> season was that it's very difficult to make AVON a full-time, 
>>>>> prophitable business. That is probably true, but I think I have enough 
>>>>> friends and acquaintances to make a go of it. What a lot of people 
>>>>> don't realize is that I can sell Avon products to anyone in the United 
>>>>> States via my website, which gives direct delivery options.
>>>>>
>>>>> Jen
>>>>>
>>>>> Shop my AVON online store
>>>>> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>>>>>
>>>>> Get healthy!
>>>>> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>>>>>
>>>>> Contact me:
>>>>>
>>>>> Jennifer Aberdeen
>>>>> PO Box 1184
>>>>> Woonsocket, RI 02895
>>>>> 401-762-3258 (home)
>>>>> 401-644-5607 (cell)
>>>>> freespirit328 at gmail.com
>>>>> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>> From: "Jess" <jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com>
>>>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" 
>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 9:42 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Jen,
>>>>>> You do have to choice to not continue with your Individual Plan for
>>>>>> Employment if you'd like to sell Avon full time. Your rehab counselor 
>>>>>> sounds
>>>>>> a lot like mine and Rania's where each of our rehab counselors aren't 
>>>>>> being
>>>>>> supportive with what we want to do for our careers. It sounding like 
>>>>>> your
>>>>>> rehab counselor is doing the same exact thing that mine and Rania's 
>>>>>> are.
>>>>>> What are you planning to study in college? If you go that route? 
>>>>>> Sounds like
>>>>>> you need to meet with your rehab counselor and tell her that you'd 
>>>>>> rather
>>>>>> sell Avon full time instead of going school. Just stuck to your guns 
>>>>>> so to
>>>>>> speak when you talk to your rehab counselor. There is a lot that I've
>>>>>> learned from living in three different states dealing with three 
>>>>>> different
>>>>>> rehab agencies and several rehab counselors in each of these state 
>>>>>> agencies
>>>>>> for the blind and visually impaired.
>>>>>> Jessica
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
>>>>>> Behalf
>>>>>> Of Jennifer Aberdeen
>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 7:58 PM
>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Jess,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I do sell AVON, but I don't make much money doing it. It gives me a 
>>>>>> little
>>>>>> spending money, that's about it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Actually I did tell my counsellor that I wanted to sell Avon full 
>>>>>> time, but
>>>>>> she didn't want to hear that, lol.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jen
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Shop my AVON online store
>>>>>> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Get healthy!
>>>>>> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Contact me:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jennifer Aberdeen
>>>>>> PO Box 1184
>>>>>> Woonsocket, RI 02895
>>>>>> 401-762-3258 (home)
>>>>>> 401-644-5607 (cell)
>>>>>> freespirit328 at gmail.com
>>>>>> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>> From: "Jess" <jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com>
>>>>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"
>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 4:00 PM
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Antonio,
>>>>>>> If you pay attention to Jen's Signature then you notice that she's 
>>>>>>> already
>>>>>>> working and in when you are  dealing with a rehab agency they take 
>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>> into
>>>>>>> consideration. And, since she's selling Avon that automatically 
>>>>>>> means that
>>>>>>> she wouldn't qualify for services from a rehab counselor any longer. 
>>>>>>> Jen,
>>>>>>> feel free to correct me if I'm incorrect.
>>>>>>> Jessica
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] 
>>>>>>> On
>>>>>>> Behalf
>>>>>>> Of Antonio M. Guimaraes
>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 1:12 PM
>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi Jen,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I thought to contact you privately first, but I wonder, if you don't 
>>>>>>> mind
>>>>>>> sharing it with the list, why the state won't purchase Kurzweil for 
>>>>>>> you.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Do they not realize you are blind, and thus print-disabled, and so 
>>>>>>> would
>>>>>>> need to scan college materials for school?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> do you, and do they understand that perhaps limmiting you to online
>>>>>>> schools
>>>>>>> with accessible electronic texts is severely limmiting your options, 
>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>> that the one thing between you and an URI or some other college 
>>>>>>> education
>>>>>>> is
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> a $1000 scanning software?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> More importantly, do you think it worth it to get one of us here in 
>>>>>>> RI on
>>>>>>> board with you, and pushing, convincing the counselor, or giving you 
>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>> guidance about your accomodations, and how you could put up a bit 
>>>>>>> more of
>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>> fight for them?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It's not about what you want, but about what you'll need to succeed, 
>>>>>>> or
>>>>>>> even
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> have a basic chance to access information in college.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Antonio Guimaraes
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of 
>>>>>>> pickup
>>>>>>> trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite 
>>>>>>> number of
>>>>>>> highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great 
>>>>>>> literary
>>>>>>> works in Braille.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you.
>>>>>>> http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169
>>>>>>> Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>> From: "Jennifer Aberdeen" <freespirit328 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>> To: "NABS-L" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 12:15 AM
>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Online degree programs
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Does anyone know if any of the online Universities, such as the
>>>>>>>> University
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> of Phoenix, have all their reading material available in e-text 
>>>>>>>> directly
>>>>>>>> from the website?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I'm not sure if I'm going to take any classes. One of my biggest
>>>>>>>> obstacles, and I'm sure for a lot of other blind people, is not 
>>>>>>>> having
>>>>>>>> access to my text books. I can't scan my books because the state 
>>>>>>>> won't
>>>>>>>> purchase Kurzweil for me, and listening to it on tape doesn't work
>>>>>>>> because
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> of my hearing problem. The best way is with e-text, but I'm not 
>>>>>>>> sure who
>>>>>>>> has it and how easy or complicated it is to use.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I tried AIU, but they didn't have most of their books avaiable in 
>>>>>>>> an
>>>>>>>> accessible format.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Jen
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Shop my AVON online store
>>>>>>>> http://jaberdeen.avonrepresentative.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Get healthy!
>>>>>>>> http://jaberdeen.qhealthbeauty.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Contact me:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Jennifer Aberdeen
>>>>>>>> PO Box 1184
>>>>>>>> Woonsocket, RI 02895
>>>>>>>> 401-762-3258 (home)
>>>>>>>> 401-644-5607 (cell)
>>>>>>>> freespirit328 at gmail.com
>>>>>>>> SKYPE: J.Aberdeen
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan
>>>>>>> %40gmail.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmai
>>>>>> l.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan
>>>>>> %40gmail.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmail.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmail.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmail.com
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%40gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmail.com 



From djdrocks4ever at gmail.com  Mon Jul 20 22:00:05 2009
From: djdrocks4ever at gmail.com (David Dunphy)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 17:00:05 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] The NFB Convention Talent Show Reairs Tonight
Message-ID: <1E93AE55C04C41D4BB61F05B0C4F9C36@thedjdinvasion>

Just a reminder for those who may not have heard that the performing arts division's Show Case Of Talent, which occurred at the national convention in Detroit, will reair tonight at 7 PM eastern at
http://www.radio360.us
so be sure to check it out.
>From David Dunphy

*****
If you're tired of hearing the same old songs on your local radio station, and if you can't find the variety you've always wanted, then check out the station that I own and operate with a great group of broadcasters called Radio360. You'll hear all types of music and programming, plus you're able to control what you hear through requests, interaction with the djs, and more!
To find out more about the station, visit us on the web at
http://www.radio360.us
Follow us on twitter at
http://www.twitter.com/radio360usa
or add us to your MySpace at
http://www.myspace.com/radio360usa
Come check us out, you won't be disappointed!!!


__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4262 (20090720) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com


From pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net  Tue Jul 21 00:27:12 2009
From: pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net (Peter Donahue)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 19:27:12 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Youth SLAM Events
References: <1E93AE55C04C41D4BB61F05B0C4F9C36@thedjdinvasion>
Message-ID: <001701ca0999$feb03ed0$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn>

Hello David and listers,

    Will you be airing any events from the 2009 NFB Youth SLAM or do you 
plan to feature material from this event on up-coming programs? Thanks for 
your hard work in putting featuring convention recollections on last night's 
program and featuring the Talent Show recordings on this show too.

Peter Donahue


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "David Dunphy" <djdrocks4ever at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>; "Performing Arts Division list" 
<perform-talk at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, July 20, 2009 5:00 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] The NFB Convention Talent Show Reairs Tonight


Just a reminder for those who may not have heard that the performing arts 
division's Show Case Of Talent, which occurred at the national convention in 
Detroit, will reair tonight at 7 PM eastern at
http://www.radio360.us
so be sure to check it out.
>From David Dunphy

*****
If you're tired of hearing the same old songs on your local radio station, 
and if you can't find the variety you've always wanted, then check out the 
station that I own and operate with a great group of broadcasters called 
Radio360. You'll hear all types of music and programming, plus you're able 
to control what you hear through requests, interaction with the djs, and 
more!
To find out more about the station, visit us on the web at
http://www.radio360.us
Follow us on twitter at
http://www.twitter.com/radio360usa
or add us to your MySpace at
http://www.myspace.com/radio360usa
Come check us out, you won't be disappointed!!!


__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature 
database 4262 (20090720) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pdonahue1%40sbcglobal.net 



From clinton.waterbury at gmail.com  Tue Jul 21 02:49:09 2009
From: clinton.waterbury at gmail.com (clinton waterbury)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 20:49:09 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Victor reader stream issue...  Help!!!
Message-ID: <6D69A2D1-BDC7-4494-9A3A-517EEEE14668@gmail.com>

Hello all.
I am using a victor reader stream to take notes for my classes, but I  
am running into a couple of problems.
1. The stream errors out when I connect it to my mac, and won't even  
let me repair the disk.
2. the audio files are not playable by the mac, but I may have another  
way of playing those.
The not connecting issue is by far the worst issue with the thing I  
have, and when I try to connect it to a winows virtual machine...  On  
the mac, the stream locks up and I have to take out the pattery to  
even get it running again.
Any ideas?


From braille at nbpcb.org  Tue Jul 21 03:56:17 2009
From: braille at nbpcb.org (Braille Certification)
Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 22:56:17 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] NCLB Braille Exam in Pennsylvania, Aug 9
Message-ID: <auto-000111065314@mailfront2.g2host.com>



Testing for the National Certification in Literary Braille (NClB) 
will be held on Sunday, August 9, 2009, at Salus University 
(established by the Pennsylvania College of Optometry) in Elkins 
Park, PA. The cost is $250 and the application deadline is Sunday, July 26.




Please see the attached flyer for more details, view our website at 
<http://www.nbpcb.org/>www.nbpcb.org or contact me, Louise Walch, 
NCLB Coordinator, at <mailto:braille at nbpcb.org>braille at nbpcb.org.



Exams are also being scheduled in New Mexico, Georgia, and Virginia 
in the near future.



Please pass this information along to anyone you think might be interested.



Thanks,



Louise


Louise G. Walch
NBPCB Coordinator
<mailto:braille at nbpcb.org>braille at nbpcb.org
www.nbpcb.org


__________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus 
signature database 4255 (20090717) __________

The message was checked by ESET Smart Security.

<http://www.eset.com>http://www.eset.com

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From commanderlumpy2003 at earthlink.net  Tue Jul 21 18:46:07 2009
From: commanderlumpy2003 at earthlink.net (Kevin Wassmer)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 12:46:07 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] test
Message-ID: <AEC9EC46A2B944E2ACAD04686C77FAE6@usore540475a8f>

This is a test to see if something will work.


Cause its been 18 days
Since I first held you 
But to me it feels just like
It feels like a lifetime
I'm trying hard to re-arrange
Some say its the hardest thing to do
But that's another 18 days
Without you..

From commanderlumpy2003 at earthlink.net  Tue Jul 21 20:02:54 2009
From: commanderlumpy2003 at earthlink.net (Kevin)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 14:02:54 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] test
References: <AEC9EC46A2B944E2ACAD04686C77FAE6@usore540475a8f>
Message-ID: <049CA71935D141698EF49AFA225CACE4@usore540475a8f>

well my email works agaion. I have ben having truble with email today.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Kevin Wassmer" <commanderlumpy2003 at earthlink.net>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, July 21, 2009 12:46 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] test


> This is a test to see if something will work.
>
>
> Cause its been 18 days
> Since I first held you
> But to me it feels just like
> It feels like a lifetime
> I'm trying hard to re-arrange
> Some say its the hardest thing to do
> But that's another 18 days
> Without you..
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/commanderlumpy2003%40earthlink.net
> 



From rjaquiss at earthlink.net  Wed Jul 22 03:59:39 2009
From: rjaquiss at earthlink.net (Robert Jaquiss)
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 22:59:39 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] CourseSmart Accessibility?
Message-ID: <C3A23134C228414DBAF3E9DA6527E76B@D3DTZP41>

Hello:

     Has anyone had success working with downloaded materials from CourseSmart?
http://www.coursesmart.com

Thank you.

Regards,

Robert Jaquiss

From gymnastdave at sbcglobal.net  Wed Jul 22 19:48:59 2009
From: gymnastdave at sbcglobal.net (Dave Wright)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 14:48:59 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Kingston 32GB SD Card and book Sense specials
Message-ID: <32E653C6A4E543D0A04BA423FFD97FBE@dwrigh6>

Hello all,

Handy Tech North America has a limited quantity of Kingston 32 GB SD cards
for only $139.00.  Order the hot new BookSense standard or BookSense XT book
reader for the special summer price of $314.00 or $449.0 respectively,  and
enjoy a $50.00 discount off the cost of the 32 GB SD Card.  Plus you still
get the complementary 8 GB Card with the BookSense XT and 2 GB SD Card with
the BookSense Standard, in either case, you'll have plenty of room for your
books, music and recordings.
If interested, please contact Handy Tech North America at:

651-636-5184
sales at handytech.us

handy Tech North America, where It's All About Adapting!


Best regards,
   Dave Wright
Technical support specialist- Handy Tech North America
 
Phone:  651-636-5184
Mobile: 347-422-7085
 
Fax:  866-347-8249
 
E-mail and MSN:
support at handytech.us
 
Web site:
http://www.handytech.us

From westbchris at gmail.com  Thu Jul 23 00:11:57 2009
From: westbchris at gmail.com (Chris Westbrook)
Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 20:11:57 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Kingston 32GB SD Card and book Sense specials
References: <32E653C6A4E543D0A04BA423FFD97FBE@dwrigh6>
Message-ID: <427D4434EDB846FC9519AE64AB9EC794@lenovo4903350b>

Just saw one on amazon for under $100.  Does yours come in a gold package or 
something?
http://tinyurl.com/lanjoo

Original Message ----- 
From: "Dave Wright" <gymnastdave at sbcglobal.netz>
To: "NFB of Illinois Mailing List" <il-talk at nfbnet.org>; "Illinois 
Association of Blind Students List" <iabs-talk at nfbnet.org>
Cc: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, July 22, 2009 3:48 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] Kingston 32GB SD Card and book Sense specials


> Hello all,
>
> Handy Tech North America has a limited quantity of Kingston 32 GB SD cards
> for only $139.00.  Order the hot new BookSense standard or BookSense XT 
> book
> reader for the special summer price of $314.00 or $449.0 respectively, 
> and
> enjoy a $50.00 discount off the cost of the 32 GB SD Card.  Plus you still
> get the complementary 8 GB Card with the BookSense XT and 2 GB SD Card 
> with
> the BookSense Standard, in either case, you'll have plenty of room for 
> your
> books, music and recordings.
> If interested, please contact Handy Tech North America at:
>
> 651-636-5184
> sales at handytech.us
>
> handy Tech North America, where It's All About Adapting!
>
>
> Best regards,
>   Dave Wright
> Technical support specialist- Handy Tech North America
>
> Phone:  651-636-5184
> Mobile: 347-422-7085
>
> Fax:  866-347-8249
>
> E-mail and MSN:
> support at handytech.us
>
> Web site:
> http://www.handytech.us
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/westbchris%40gmail.com
> 



From happytrails at samobile.net  Thu Jul 23 08:35:31 2009
From: happytrails at samobile.net (Snow Bunny)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 03:35:31 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] For sale Braille Manuals
Message-ID: <auto-000108758904@mailfront1.g2host.com>


For sale:  Two hard copy Braille manuals, one for the Braille Sense 
Plus and one for the Victor Reader Stream, for more details contact Beth at

happytrails at samobile.net

-- 
Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.  Visit 
www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.



From JFreeh at nfb.org  Thu Jul 23 08:42:39 2009
From: JFreeh at nfb.org (Freeh,
	Jessica)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 03:42:39 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] National Federation of the Blind and Blind Business Owner
 File Complaint with Small Business Administration
Message-ID: <auto-000111412056@mailfront2.g2host.com>



FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE



CONTACT:

Chris Danielsen

Director of Public Relations

National Federation of the Blind

(410) 659-9314, extension 2330

(410) 262-1281 (Cell)

cdanielsen at nfb.org



National Federation of the Blind and Blind Business Owner
File Complaint with Small Business Administration





SBA's Inaccessible Web Site Discriminates Against the Blind



Baltimore, Maryland (July 22, 2009): The National Federation of the 
Blind, the nation's oldest and largest organization of blind people 
and the leading advocate for equal access by the blind to information 
technology, and Virgil Stinnett, a blind business owner from 
Honolulu, Hawaii, filed an administrative complaint today with the 
Small Business Administration (SBA).  The complaint asserts that the 
SBA's Web site violates Section 508 of the Rehabilitation Act because 
it is inaccessible to blind people who use text-to-speech screen 
access technology or Braille displays to access information on the 
Internet.  Because of the inaccessibility of the SBA Web site, blind 
people cannot fill out forms on the site or take online courses 
offered by the SBA.  Mr. Stinnett was unable to apply for 
certification under Section 8(a) of the Small Business Act because of 
the inaccessibility of the Web site.  Section 8(a) certification 
would provide Mr. Stinnett's business with access to federal and 
private procurement markets.



Dr. Marc Maurer, President of the National Federation of the Blind, 
said: "Blind Americans have the same dreams, the same goals, and the 
same entrepreneurial spirit as all other Americans.  If we are to 
have equal access to the tools and techniques needed to be effective 
business owners and to compete on terms of equality with our sighted 
peers, we must have equal access to the resources offered on the SBA 
Web site and other government sites.  The National Federation of the 
Blind demands equality for blind business owners and will tolerate 
nothing less."



Virgil Stinnett, owner of Good News HI, a business providing military 
dining services, said: "As a blind entrepreneur, access to the SBA 
Web site is critical in order for me to use its programs and services 
and expand my business.  The fact that I could not access the Web 
site has cost me time and resources that I would not have needed to 
expend if I had been able to use the site like everyone else.  I hope 
the action we are taking today will prompt the SBA to take immediate 
steps so that all Americans, blind and sighted, have equal access to 
the programs, training, and resources that it provides."



Complainants are represented by attorneys Daniel F. Goldstein and 
Allison L. Harper of Brown, Goldstein & Levy, LLP, <?xml:namespace 
prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" />120 
E. Baltimore Street, Suite 1700, Baltimore, MD 21202, (410) 962-1030, 
fax: (410) 385-0869, <mailto:dfg at browngold.com>dfg at browngold.com, 
<mailto:ah at browngold.com>ah at browngold.com, 
<http://www.browngold.com/>www.browngold.com.





###

From slabarre at labarrelaw.com  Thu Jul 23 14:30:25 2009
From: slabarre at labarrelaw.com (Scott C. LaBarre)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 08:30:25 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] for broad distribution
Message-ID: <1498D081271340779156AFA8F10AAF7C@labarre>

Greetings:

We are very interested in talking to anyone who is blind/visually impaired and interested in pursuing a Doctor of Chiropractic degree from Palmer College of Chiropractic.  We are also interested in talking to any blind/visually impaired employees who either work directly for or through a contractor to provide switchboard/communication services for the Veterans Administration.  Finally, we are interested in speaking with anyone, blind/visually impaired, who is planning on attending law school, is currently an undergrad, and who plans on taking the LSAT either this fall or in the next year.  

Please contact me at the below information. 
Thanks,  
Scott C. LaBarre, Esq.

LaBarre Law Offices P.C.
1660 South Albion Street, Ste. 918
Denver, Colorado 80222
303 504-5979 (voice)
303 757-3640 (fax)
slabarre at labarrelaw.com (e-mail)
www.labarrelaw.com (website)

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This message may contain confidential and privileged information. If you are not the designated recipient, you may not read, copy, distribute or retain this message. If you received this message in error, please notify the sender at 303) 504-5979 or slabarre at labarrelaw.com, and destroy and delete it from your system. This message and any attachments are covered by the Electronic
Communications Privacy Act, 18 U.S.C. §§ 2510-2521.

From nabs.president at gmail.com  Thu Jul 23 17:43:05 2009
From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 03:43:05 +1000
Subject: [nabs-l] Youth Slam Absence
Message-ID: <85ff10070907231043l4b6d4398t2411872807134acd@mail.gmail.com>

Dear NABS listers,

	Tomorrow (Friday)  I will be going to Baltimore to serve as a mentor
in the upcoming NFB Youth Slam. At the end of the Youth Slam I will be
making a stop off in New York City before returning home on Tuesday,
August 4. I will be out of email contact while in Baltimore, but will
resume contact on Wednesday, August 5. If you need immediate NABS
assistance, please email first vice-president Karen Anderson at
Kea_anderson at cox.net
Otherwise, I will respond to your message on August 5.

	I will  also send out my first president’s bulletin on Thursday,
August 6. If you have any announcements that you’d like to see
included in the bulletin, such as information about upcoming student
seminars or other events during the month of August, please send these
to me before I return on the 5th.

	Hope everyone has a great weekend and I look forward to seeing some
of you as fellow mentors and students at the Youth Slam!

Cordially,
Arielle


-- 
Arielle Silverman
President, National Association of Blind Students
Phone:  602-502-2255
Email:
nabs.president at gmail.com
Website:
www.nabslink.org


From jessicac.kostiw at gmail.com  Thu Jul 23 22:01:48 2009
From: jessicac.kostiw at gmail.com (Jessica Kostiw)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 17:01:48 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] For sale Braille Manuals
References: <auto-000108758904@mailfront1.g2host.com>
Message-ID: <004e01ca0be1$2f527280$d157a962@Jessica>

This brings up a question.  What are the differences between the two?
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Snow Bunny (by way of David Andrews<dandrews at visi.com>)" 
<happytrails at samobile.net>
To: <david.andrews at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Thursday, July 23, 2009 3:35 AM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] For sale Braille Manuals


>
> For sale:  Two hard copy Braille manuals, one for the Braille Sense Plus 
> and one for the Victor Reader Stream, for more details contact Beth at
>
> happytrails at samobile.net
>
> -- 
> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.  Visit 
> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessicac.kostiw%40gmail.com 



From cowboy0210 at gmail.com  Thu Jul 23 22:48:32 2009
From: cowboy0210 at gmail.com (cowboy0210 at gmail.com)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 22:48:32 +0000
Subject: [nabs-l] Youth Slam Absence
In-Reply-To: <85ff10070907231043l4b6d4398t2411872807134acd@mail.gmail.com>
References: <85ff10070907231043l4b6d4398t2411872807134acd@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1704915964-1248389341-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-2139439384-@bxe1110.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>

Speaking of Youth Slam, as I am typing, I am sitting in a cab enroute to the National Center!
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

-----Original Message-----
From: Arielle Silverman <nabs.president at gmail.com>

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 03:43:05 
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>; <nabs-presidents at nfbnet.org>
Subject: [nabs-l] Youth Slam Absence


Dear NABS listers,

	Tomorrow (Friday)  I will be going to Baltimore to serve as a mentor
in the upcoming NFB Youth Slam. At the end of the Youth Slam I will be
making a stop off in New York City before returning home on Tuesday,
August 4. I will be out of email contact while in Baltimore, but will
resume contact on Wednesday, August 5. If you need immediate NABS
assistance, please email first vice-president Karen Anderson at
Kea_anderson at cox.net
Otherwise, I will respond to your message on August 5.

	I will  also send out my first president’s bulletin on Thursday,
August 6. If you have any announcements that you’d like to see
included in the bulletin, such as information about upcoming student
seminars or other events during the month of August, please send these
to me before I return on the 5th.

	Hope everyone has a great weekend and I look forward to seeing some
of you as fellow mentors and students at the Youth Slam!

Cordially,
Arielle


-- 
Arielle Silverman
President, National Association of Blind Students
Phone:  602-502-2255
Email:
nabs.president at gmail.com
Website:
www.nabslink.org

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/cowboy0210%40gmail.com

From djdrocks4ever at gmail.com  Thu Jul 23 22:51:25 2009
From: djdrocks4ever at gmail.com (David Dunphy)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 17:51:25 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Youth Slam Absence
References: <85ff10070907231043l4b6d4398t2411872807134acd@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <11D1F6E65EA04B4B86EF8EEDB3C45DEE@thedjdinvasion>

If you're going to New York City, make sure you grab a slice of pizza if you 
can. There's nothing like a pizza in New York. I'm sorry but Minnesota and 
other states just can't cut it when it comes to a good slice of chese pizza. 
I grew up in NY for 25 years, so I should know.

*****
If you're tired of hearing the same old songs on your local radio station, 
and if you can't find the variety you've always wanted, then check out the 
station that I own and operate with a great group of broadcasters called 
Radio360. You'll hear all types of music and programming, plus you're able 
to control what you hear through requests, interaction with the djs, and 
more!
To find out more about the station, visit us on the web at
http://www.radio360.us
Follow us on twitter at
http://www.twitter.com/radio360usa
or add us to your MySpace at
http://www.myspace.com/radio360usa
Come check us out, you won't be disappointed!!! 


__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4271 (20090723) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com





From jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com  Fri Jul 24 00:20:18 2009
From: jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com (Jess)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 20:20:18 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] For sale Braille Manuals
In-Reply-To: <004e01ca0be1$2f527280$d157a962@Jessica>
References: <auto-000108758904@mailfront1.g2host.com>
	<004e01ca0be1$2f527280$d157a962@Jessica>
Message-ID: <4a68fe61.09035a0a.48fe.34e2@mx.google.com>

Beth,
The Braille Sense Plus is also a small portable note taker. The Victor
Reader Stream is a n MP3 player.
Jessica 

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Jessica Kostiw
Sent: Thursday, July 23, 2009 6:02 PM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list;
david.andrews at nfbnet.org
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] For sale Braille Manuals

This brings up a question.  What are the differences between the two?
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Snow Bunny (by way of David Andrews<dandrews at visi.com>)" 
<happytrails at samobile.net>
To: <david.andrews at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Thursday, July 23, 2009 3:35 AM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] For sale Braille Manuals


>
> For sale:  Two hard copy Braille manuals, one for the Braille Sense Plus 
> and one for the Victor Reader Stream, for more details contact Beth at
>
> happytrails at samobile.net
>
> -- 
> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.  Visit 
> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessicac.kostiw%40gm
ail.com 


_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan
%40gmail.com



From slabarre at labarrelaw.com  Fri Jul 24 03:24:38 2009
From: slabarre at labarrelaw.com (Scott C. LaBarre)
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 22:24:38 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Looking for People
Message-ID: <auto-000108919123@mailfront1.g2host.com>

Greetings:

We are very interested in talking to anyone who 
is blind/visually impaired and interested in 
pursuing a Doctor of Chiropractic degree from 
Palmer College of Chiropractic.  We are also 
interested in talking to any blind/visually 
impaired employees who either work directly for 
or through a contractor to provide 
switchboard/communication services for the 
Veterans Administration.  Finally, we are 
interested in speaking with anyone, 
blind/visually impaired, who is planning on 
attending law school, is currently an undergrad, 
and who plans on taking the LSAT either this fall or in the next year.

Please contact me at the below information.
Thanks,
Scott C. LaBarre, Esq.

LaBarre Law Offices P.C.
1660 South Albion Street, Ste. 918
Denver, Colorado 80222
303 504-5979 (voice)
303 757-3640 (fax)
<mailto:slabarre at labarrelaw.com>slabarre at labarrelaw.com (e-mail)
<http://www.labarrelaw.com>www.labarrelaw.com (website)

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This message may contain 
confidential and privileged information. If you 
are not the designated recipient, you may not 
read, copy, distribute or retain this message. If 
you received this message in error, please notify 
the sender at 303) 504-5979 or 
<mailto:slabarre at labarrelaw.com>slabarre at labarrelaw.com, 
and destroy and delete it from your system. This 
message and any attachments are covered by the Electronic
Communications Privacy Act, 18 U.S.C. §§ 2510-2521.


From amylsabo at comcast.net  Fri Jul 24 04:21:19 2009
From: amylsabo at comcast.net (Amy Sabo)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 04:21:19 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [nabs-l] Youth Slam Absence
In-Reply-To: <11D1F6E65EA04B4B86EF8EEDB3C45DEE@thedjdinvasion>
Message-ID: <2091916930.4730031248409279856.JavaMail.root@sz0144a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

hey david,

well, i can see that you are very homesick for nyc! i kinda of thought so my dear! thanks for the heads up and i will talk to you soon my dear!

hugs,
from amy

----- Original Message -----

From: David Dunphy 

To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list 

Sent: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 22:51:25 +0000 (UTC)

Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Youth Slam Absence



If you're going to New York City, make sure you grab a slice of pizza if you 

can. There's nothing like a pizza in New York. I'm sorry but Minnesota and 

other states just can't cut it when it comes to a good slice of chese pizza. 

I grew up in NY for 25 years, so I should know.



*****

If you're tired of hearing the same old songs on your local radio station, 

and if you can't find the variety you've always wanted, then check out the 

station that I own and operate with a great group of broadcasters called 

Radio360. You'll hear all types of music and programming, plus you're able 

to control what you hear through requests, interaction with the djs, and 

more!

To find out more about the station, visit us on the web at

http://www.radio360.us

Follow us on twitter at

http://www.twitter.com/radio360usa

or add us to your MySpace at

http://www.myspace.com/radio360usa

Come check us out, you won't be disappointed!!! 





__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4271 (20090723) __________



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From slabarre at labarrelaw.com  Fri Jul 24 15:54:28 2009
From: slabarre at labarrelaw.com (Scott C. LaBarre)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 09:54:28 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Fw: NASA Presents Coins Flown in Space to National
	Federation of the Blind
Message-ID: <DFA5343926D54318A07E2FA04F4A8B13@labarre>

See the below release from NASA.  For broad distribution.
Scott C. LaBarre, Esq.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "NASA News" <hqnews at mediaservices.nasa.gov>
To: "NASA News" <hqnews at mediaservices.nasa.gov>
Sent: Friday, July 24, 2009 9:10 AM
Subject: NASA Presents Coins Flown in Space to National Federation of the 
Blind


> July 24, 2009
>
> Stephanie Schierholz
> Headquarters, Washington
> 202-358-4997
> stephanie.schierholz at nasa.gov
>
> Chris Danielsen
> National Federation of the Blind, Baltimore
> 410-659-9314, ext. 2330
> cdanielsen at nfb.org
>
> MEDIA ADVISORY: M09-140
>
> NASA PRESENTS COINS FLOWN IN SPACE TO NATIONAL FEDERATION OF THE BLIND
>
> WASHINGTON -- During a ceremony July 31, senior NASA officials will
> present the National Federation of the Blind with two Louis Braille
> Bicentennial Silver Dollars that flew on space shuttle Atlantis's
> mission to the Hubble Space Telescope in May 2009. Marc Maurer,
> president of the National Federation of the Blind, will accept the
> coins on behalf of the organization. The ceremony will take place at
> 6 p.m. EDT at the Capitol Visitor Center in Washington.
>
> In celebration of the 200th anniversary of Louis Braille's birthday,
> Congress authorized the minting of the 2009 Louis Braille
> Bicentennial Silver Dollar. NASA flew one proof and one uncirculated
> commemorative coin on the recent Hubble servicing mission. The coins
> are the first to feature tactile, readable Braille, which enables the
> blind to read and learn, just as Hubble allows people to learn about
> the universe.
>
> NASA astronaut Gregory H. Johnson will speak at the celebratory
> closing of the National Federation of the Blind's 2009 Youth Slam. At
> the Youth Slam, 200 blind high school students from across the nation
> will participate in five days of activities to help encourage the
> blind youth of America to consider careers in science, technology,
> engineering and mathematics.
>
> Reporters planning on attending the event must contact Chris Danielsen
> at 410-659-9314, ext. 2330, or cdanielsen at nfb.org by 5 p.m. on July
> 30.
>
> NASA and the National Federation of the Blind have been collaborating
> for more than five years to inspire and engage blind students to lend
> their unique talents to disciplines critical to the nation's
> engineering, scientific and technical missions.
>
> NASA Television will broadcast a Video File of the event. For NASA TV
> streaming video, schedules and downlink information, visit:
>
>
>
> http://www.nasa.gov/ntv
>
>
> For more information about NASA's education programs, visit:
>
>
>
> http://www.nasa.gov/education
>
>
> For more information about the Hubble Space Telescope, visit:
>
>
>
> http://www.nasa.gov/hubble
>
>
> For more information about the National Federation of the Blind,
> visit:
>
>
>
> http://www.nfb.org
>
>
> -end-
>
>
>
> To subscribe to the list, send a message to:
> hqnews-subscribe at mediaservices.nasa.gov
> To remove your address from the list, send a message to:
> hqnews-unsubscribe at mediaservices.nasa.gov
> 




From aguimaraes at nbp.org  Fri Jul 24 16:53:49 2009
From: aguimaraes at nbp.org (Antonio Guimaraes)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 12:53:49 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Kingston 32GB SD Card and book Sense specials
References: <32E653C6A4E543D0A04BA423FFD97FBE@dwrigh6>
	<427D4434EDB846FC9519AE64AB9EC794@lenovo4903350b>
Message-ID: <CE7A734D6E7F4B46962210D92B8B272B@nbp2.local>

Try newegg.com

and you will find that sort of thing for even cheaper.

Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr.


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Chris Westbrook" <westbchris at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, July 22, 2009 8:11 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Kingston 32GB SD Card and book Sense specials


> Just saw one on amazon for under $100.  Does yours come in a gold package 
> or something?
> http://tinyurl.com/lanjoo
>
> Original Message ----- 
> From: "Dave Wright" <gymnastdave at sbcglobal.netz>
> To: "NFB of Illinois Mailing List" <il-talk at nfbnet.org>; "Illinois 
> Association of Blind Students List" <iabs-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, July 22, 2009 3:48 PM
> Subject: [nabs-l] Kingston 32GB SD Card and book Sense specials
>
>
>> Hello all,
>>
>> Handy Tech North America has a limited quantity of Kingston 32 GB SD 
>> cards
>> for only $139.00.  Order the hot new BookSense standard or BookSense XT 
>> book
>> reader for the special summer price of $314.00 or $449.0 respectively, 
>> and
>> enjoy a $50.00 discount off the cost of the 32 GB SD Card.  Plus you 
>> still
>> get the complementary 8 GB Card with the BookSense XT and 2 GB SD Card 
>> with
>> the BookSense Standard, in either case, you'll have plenty of room for 
>> your
>> books, music and recordings.
>> If interested, please contact Handy Tech North America at:
>>
>> 651-636-5184
>> sales at handytech.us
>>
>> handy Tech North America, where It's All About Adapting!
>>
>>
>> Best regards,
>>   Dave Wright
>> Technical support specialist- Handy Tech North America
>>
>> Phone:  651-636-5184
>> Mobile: 347-422-7085
>>
>> Fax:  866-347-8249
>>
>> E-mail and MSN:
>> support at handytech.us
>>
>> Web site:
>> http://www.handytech.us
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/westbchris%40gmail.com
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/aguimaraes%40nbp.org
> 




From dandrews at visi.com  Fri Jul 24 18:59:50 2009
From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 13:59:50 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Technology for Sale
Message-ID: <auto-000111657594@mailfront2.g2host.com>

I have been asked to post the following ad:

FOR SALE:      New T-Mobile Wing Smart Phone, still in box, never 
used, asking $200.00; new Plextalk PTR2/T1, still in box, never used, 
asking $600.00;
Used Braille Sense Plus with current updates, asking $4,500.00;  New 
Victor Reader Stream Digital Talking Book Player-Daisy/NISO/MP3, 
asking $250.00.

Please e-mail
hlsnider at earthlink.net
  if interested.




David Andrews and white cane Harry.




From amylsabo at comcast.net  Fri Jul 24 19:52:36 2009
From: amylsabo at comcast.net (Amy Sabo)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 19:52:36 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [nabs-l] Introduction: Robert Jaquiss
In-Reply-To: <761578B8765A4C6FBCE0FCC9788E1FBA@D3DTZP41>
Message-ID: <2143727662.4929591248465156241.JavaMail.root@sz0144a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

hello all,

well, i see that there have been many new people new to the list lately and, i thought it would be a good idea to introduce myself to you all here in one message. my name is amy sabo and, i'm from colorado but, i'm originally from michigan. i will be finally returning to college in the fall at a new college called metro state college in denver to finish mmy b.a. in speech communications with a minor in journalism/public relations. i had to transfer to this school because the university that i was attending was too difficuklt for me academically and also there were many financial issues that i was also dealing with too!

please feel free to share youtr thoughts, ideas, suggestions, concerns, or anyything else you want to share with us! we are all here for you and we are all in the same boat as blind students. i hope that you enjjoy this list as i have for many years and can make many friends as well too here!

well, that's all for now take care and i will talk to you all soon!


hugs,
from amy

----- Original Message -----

From: Robert Jaquiss 

To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org

Sent: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 12:36:02 +0000 (UTC)

Subject: [nabs-l] Introduction: Robert Jaquiss



Hello:



     I am writing to introduce myself. I am Robert Jaquiss, a soon to be student at Louisiana Technical College (LTC). I intend to study computer network support. I am a returning student having been employed for about 27 years. I have a background in computer programming, adaptive technology and tactile graphics. Have a great day.



Regards,



Robert Jaquiss, President

Greater Ouachita Chapter

National Federation of the Blind

Email: rjaquiss at earthlink.net

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From amylsabo at comcast.net  Fri Jul 24 19:58:00 2009
From: amylsabo at comcast.net (Amy Sabo)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 19:58:00 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [nabs-l] Victor Reader Stream
In-Reply-To: <B40C8B60AC004103A84E20E2D0714E59@MIRANDA>
Message-ID: <1572646170.4931391248465480149.JavaMail.root@sz0144a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

hello miranda,

well, that sucks that you have only had the stream for only a month and it's not working well! one suggestion that i might give is to take out the battery for about 30 seconds or so and then put it back in and then turning it on. or, charging it with the adapter. if that doesn't work than you will need to contact humanware to have them do a tech support with you over the phone if that doesn't work than you will need to send it back to them. since it's still under warranty you won't be charged for another new one.

i had to do this myself a year ago and it sucked with the stream not working for me and i had to send it to get a new one. i hope that this is helpful for you and that you can get it solved! take care and i will talk to you soon!


hugs,
from amy

----- Original Message -----

From: Miranda brown 

To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' 

Sent: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 18:03:19 +0000 (UTC)

Subject: [nabs-l] Victor Reader Stream



Hi,



My victor reader stream will not turn on, I tried the hard reset and that

did not work.  Any suggestions? I have only had it for about a month. 



Miranda 



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From amylsabo at comcast.net  Fri Jul 24 21:31:26 2009
From: amylsabo at comcast.net (Amy Sabo)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 21:31:26 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief
In-Reply-To: <8CBD2B57C37189E-988-1085@MBLK-M01.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <663315758.4962181248471085999.JavaMail.root@sz0144a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>


hello darren and all,

sorry, for the late response to this topic. my desktop wasn't working at all before i left for michigan for both the west side with my family and then in detroit for convention. plus, i didn't fix it until now so, i'm very late in responding to all of yourr responses and old mail in my invox too! my response to national convention was very unique than it has been in the past 17 years i have been in the nfb.

this year's convention being in my home state of michigan was awesome to say the least of the icing on the cake for me and my sister too! we had our parents attend some of the general sessions and also banquet too for the first time was so awesome to share my world the blibndness world with them!

they enjoyed themselves but, were sad that they couldn't attend the exhibit hall at all due to their schedules and all for them to come to the east side until the end of the week! but, they do plan to come to national convention next year in dallas to visit the exhibit hall and also do some sigghtseeing too!

so, that's my views on national convention for me take care all and let's keep this thread going!


hugs to all,
from amy
----- Original Message -----

From: Darian Smith 

To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org

Sent: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 16:15:49 +0000 (UTC)

Subject: [nabs-l] Detroit Debrief



Hey all,

  What a convention, huh? I actually don't know if this has taken place 

yet, but I am interested to hear people's thoughts on convention.  I 

would like to hear about what Highlights people took from this 

convention an, and  if you are a "rookie" what your first impressions 

were of this year's  installment of the grand event.

Would you do it again, "Rookies"?



have an  awsome day!

Darian





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From marrie12 at gmail.com  Fri Jul 24 21:53:14 2009
From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 14:53:14 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] FW: friends with disabilities
Message-ID: <CD4783D15AC04B9187400490ECEEBD10@sacomputer>

Friends with Disabilities, Please Read

I've taken the following from www.adapt.org/takeaction:

ADAPT - It's time to pass the CCA!

ADAPT TALKS BACK TO THE DEMOCRATS!

The Democratic National Committee has created ads talking about the need for
healthcare reform, but they don't tell you about the need to eliminate the
institutional bias.

ADAPT is talking back to the Democrats in a language they should understand.
ADAPT has produced its own video telling the Democrats that "It's time to
pass
the Community Choice Act." Watch the video here. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pqs-fdhDZE8feature=player_embedded

The Democratic National Committee (DNC) has a paper position supporting the
Community Choice Act, but the DNC stands by and watches while the Democratic
Leadership does nothing to eliminate the institutional bias. Instead, the
DNC publicly supports healthcare reform that perpetuates Medicaid's
institutional
bias that steals the freedom... and lives... of Americans with disabilities
and older Americans. 

When the aging and disability communities advocated that healthcare reform
eliminate the institutional bias, we were told that "It's too expensive." We
were told to be patient. We were told to wait. Well, we cannot and will not
wait any longer. Tell the Democrats that it's time to eliminate the
institutional
bias. Tell them that it's time to pass the Community Choice Act.

Seniors and people with disabilities overwhelmingly prefer to live in the
community with supports rather than receive long term assistance in a
nursing
facility or other institution. Unfortunately, under federal rules, the
Medicaid system does not give people a choice and often requires that people
go
into a nursing facility or other institution to get the assistance they
need. 

The Community Choice Act gives people real choice in long term care options.
This legislation ends the institutional bias in the Medicaid program by
giving
individuals who are eligible for nursing facility services or other
institutional "care" equal access to community-based services and supports,
like attendant
services.

Personally, I'm shocked by the attitude of the DNC. I expected better of
them. Institutional bias was supposed to have been stopped 10 years ago, and
yet
it continues to be an issue. Here in my home state of Tennessee, the
governor has cut vast amounts of funding for people with disabilities. His
feeling
is, more or less, that if people with disabilities can't support themselves
without state funding, then they should be put aside in institutions.

The 19th anniversary celebration of the Americans with Disabilities Act was
held at City Hall this morning here in Memphis. There were many inspiring
and
informative speeches, one of the last of which was given by Randy Alexander,
a disability rights advocate who works here at the Center for Independent
Living. He told of the actions that are being taken right now by ADAPT to
get the message to the DNC. I myself have been following news of the
protests
on Twitter. I'd like to encourage all who read this to join with us. Make
your voice heard! I'd like to see as many individuals and organizations
involved
as possible. If enough people fight for their rights, changes WILL be made!

You can find information about ADAPT and ways in which you can get involved
and stay up-to-date on the website mentioned at the beginning of this post.
I ask everyone to please pass this on, and stay tuned for more updates.

Regards,
Becky 

From amylsabo at comcast.net  Fri Jul 24 21:54:11 2009
From: amylsabo at comcast.net (Amy Sabo)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 21:54:11 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [nabs-l] Thank You Peter
In-Reply-To: <947C96F4184B443AA0BE919FE1434EB4@Rufus>
Message-ID: <963465141.4970331248472451732.JavaMail.root@sz0144a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

hello joe,

thanks for posting this to the list. i', sorry for the late response to this thread since my desktop wasn't in commission before convention and even afterwwards so it's now working so my aapologies on this late note. i didn't know that the nabs meeting was being recorded! if there a possibility could i get a copy of it or will there be a link on the nabs website aso people who weren't ablle to attend the meeting at convention, or for people to relive it perhaps? i'm just curious...

well, that's all for now take care and i will talk to you soon!


hugs,
from amy

----- Original Message -----

From: Joe Orozco 

To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' 

Sent: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 22:49:24 +0000 (UTC)

Subject: [nabs-l] Thank You Peter



Hello all,



I just want to thank Peter Donahue for recording the student meeting and all

the other meetings he covered during convention.  He's real generous to

volunteer his time, and such service should not go unappreciated.  By the

sound of it, no pun intended, it seems as though those of us not at the

meeting will have a lot to look forward to.



Regards,



Joe Orozco



"A man who wants to lead the orchestra must turn his back on the

crowd."--Max Lucado





__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature

database 4237 (20090712) __________



The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.



http://www.eset.com







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From amylsabo at comcast.net  Fri Jul 24 22:02:00 2009
From: amylsabo at comcast.net (Amy Sabo)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 22:02:00 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update
In-Reply-To: <85ff10070907101711k426fcb70te8cb3e290bd7de8c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <428969585.4972461248472920627.JavaMail.root@sz0144a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

hello arielle and all,

first of all i want to give a huge congratulations to the new nabs board and i look forward to working with you all! i too was present at the nabs meeting and also participated in some of the election process since at the end of the meeting i had to leave because of my knee condition getting very bad!

i feel that the nabs meeting was one of the best i ever went to this year at national convention. we learned a lot from the past nabs presidents and also i have used some of what they discussed in my life as a leader with the ndfb and other organizations i have been a leader of. the election process imo was unique but, i klikked the idea of having voting cards. it was very democractic and it solved some of the problems with the voting process. i do believe that we first need to do the voice vote and this card idea was faster with the counters besides using our hands so the counters knew that the ppeople who were voting were paying members of the organization.

so, that's my food for thought on this topic. again, sorry for the late notice and i look forward to new and eexciting things for nabs in the future and, i would like to assist and help in anyway i can. so, take care all and let's contiune to change what it means to be a blind student in the usa!



hugs to all,
from amy

----- Original Message -----

From: Arielle Silverman 

To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org

Sent: Sat, 11 Jul 2009 00:11:42 +0000 (UTC)

Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Leadership Update



Hello NABS members:



    Last weekend the National Association of Blind Students held our

annual business meeting in conjunction with the NFB convention in

Detroit. At this year’s business meeting we heard from several of our

former presidents and they taught us a lot about the history and

legacy of our organization and about how we can continue that legacy.

We also got some updated information from RFB, BookShare and about

recent developments regarding the Kindle DX issue. Finally, we

conducted elections and I was elected to serve as the next president

of NABS. I am deeply honored to continue serving this organization and

to join the ranks of those who have come before me, and I would like

to thank all of you for your support  and for your assistance with

making the business meeting and Monte Carlo Night fund-raiser run as

smoothly as possible.



Several others joined our NABS board for the first time. The complete

list of officers and board members is:

President: Arielle Silverman

First Vice-President: Karen Anderson

Second Vice-President: Sean Whalen

Secretary: Janice Jeang

Treasurer: Nijat Worley

Board Member 1: Isaiah Wilcox

Board Member 2: Meghan Whalen

Board Member 3: Domonique Lawless

Board Member 4: Darian Smith

Congratulations to all who were elected. Additionally, we had several

other NABS members who sought election to the board, and consequently

ended up with more interested persons than we could include on the

board. I see this as a good sign that we have a substantial group of

students who care about NABS and helping us to achieve our goals. If

you ran for a board position but were not elected or even if you

didn’t run for a board position but still want to make a contribution

to NABS, there is plenty of work to go around. Stay tuned for an

announcement in the next week or two about NABS committees and  how to

join them. I would also like to set up some telephone focus groups in

the next few months to get your feedback on how we can improve

specific aspects of NABS such as the Student Slate, Website,

convention activities, state division outreach and election policies.

If you want  your voice to be heard, stay tuned  for more details

about these conference calls.



Also, from now on please direct all NABS inquiries to

Nabs.president at gmail.com

The official email address shown on our Website,

president at nabslink.org

also works, but email from both addresses will go to the same place. I

will check this organizational email address daily, and I or another

NABS board member will reply to your query within three days of

receiving it. You can also call me with any questions or  concerns at

602-502-2255

And again, someone will return all phone messages within three days.



I will be sending out a president’s bulletin to the NABS listserv and

the state division lists during the first week of each month. This

bulletin will contain updates about NABS activities as well as other

announcements of interest such as information about state and regional

student division events and news from the NFB Jernigan Institute, RFB,

BookShare, etc. If you  have an announcement that  you would like to

appear in the next president’s bulletin, please send it to me before

the first of the month at noon.



Finally, if you are currently president of a state student division,

please email me off-list with your state, phone number, email address

and whether or not you’re subscribed to  the NABS-Presidents listserv.

I want to be sure the Website and my master state contact list is

updated and that everyone gets on the Presidents list who should be on

it. If you are in a state that doesn’t have a student division yet and

you want to serve as the student contact for your state, also send me

this information.



I’m looking forward to an exciting and productive two years with NABS,

and hope all  of you will join me in making NABS as strong as it can

be!





-- 

Arielle Silverman

President, National Association of Blind Students

Phone:  602-502-2255

Email:

nabs.president at gmail.com

Website:

www.nabslink.org



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From troubleclark at gmail.com  Fri Jul 24 22:31:28 2009
From: troubleclark at gmail.com (Nathan Clark)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 18:31:28 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Victor Reader Stream
In-Reply-To: <1572646170.4931391248465480149.JavaMail.root@sz0144a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <B40C8B60AC004103A84E20E2D0714E59@MIRANDA>
	<1572646170.4931391248465480149.JavaMail.root@sz0144a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <fc8eb2b0907241531r286d42aev2465433dba1299e7@mail.gmail.com>

Dear Maranda
I think you should charge it for a while and see what happens.
Nathan

On 7/24/09, Amy Sabo <amylsabo at comcast.net> wrote:
> hello miranda,
>
> well, that sucks that you have only had the stream for only a month and it's
> not working well! one suggestion that i might give is to take out the
> battery for about 30 seconds or so and then put it back in and then turning
> it on. or, charging it with the adapter. if that doesn't work than you will
> need to contact humanware to have them do a tech support with you over the
> phone if that doesn't work than you will need to send it back to them. since
> it's still under warranty you won't be charged for another new one.
>
> i had to do this myself a year ago and it sucked with the stream not working
> for me and i had to send it to get a new one. i hope that this is helpful
> for you and that you can get it solved! take care and i will talk to you
> soon!
>
>
> hugs,
> from amy
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: Miranda brown
>
> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'
>
> Sent: Wed, 15 Jul 2009 18:03:19 +0000 (UTC)
>
> Subject: [nabs-l] Victor Reader Stream
>
>
>
> Hi,
>
>
>
> My victor reader stream will not turn on, I tried the hard reset and that
>
> did not work.  Any suggestions? I have only had it for about a month.
>
>
>
> Miranda
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> nabs-l mailing list
>
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/amylsabo%40comcast.net
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/troubleclark%40gmail.com
>


From troubleclark at gmail.com  Fri Jul 24 22:34:29 2009
From: troubleclark at gmail.com (Nathan Clark)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 18:34:29 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Youth Slam Absence
In-Reply-To: <2091916930.4730031248409279856.JavaMail.root@sz0144a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <11D1F6E65EA04B4B86EF8EEDB3C45DEE@thedjdinvasion>
	<2091916930.4730031248409279856.JavaMail.root@sz0144a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <fc8eb2b0907241534r182a31b0me427fb2180afa27@mail.gmail.com>

I am going to the Slam as a student and I am from Maryland.

Nathan

On 7/24/09, Amy Sabo <amylsabo at comcast.net> wrote:
> hey david,
>
> well, i can see that you are very homesick for nyc! i kinda of thought so my
> dear! thanks for the heads up and i will talk to you soon my dear!
>
> hugs,
> from amy
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: David Dunphy
>
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>
> Sent: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 22:51:25 +0000 (UTC)
>
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Youth Slam Absence
>
>
>
> If you're going to New York City, make sure you grab a slice of pizza if you
>
> can. There's nothing like a pizza in New York. I'm sorry but Minnesota and
>
> other states just can't cut it when it comes to a good slice of chese pizza.
>
> I grew up in NY for 25 years, so I should know.
>
>
>
> *****
>
> If you're tired of hearing the same old songs on your local radio station,
>
> and if you can't find the variety you've always wanted, then check out the
>
> station that I own and operate with a great group of broadcasters called
>
> Radio360. You'll hear all types of music and programming, plus you're able
>
> to control what you hear through requests, interaction with the djs, and
>
> more!
>
> To find out more about the station, visit us on the web at
>
> http://www.radio360.us
>
> Follow us on twitter at
>
> http://www.twitter.com/radio360usa
>
> or add us to your MySpace at
>
> http://www.myspace.com/radio360usa
>
> Come check us out, you won't be disappointed!!!
>
>
>
>
>
> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
> database 4271 (20090723) __________
>
>
>
> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>
>
>
> http://www.eset.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> nabs-l mailing list
>
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/amylsabo%40comcast.net
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/troubleclark%40gmail.com
>


From amylsabo at comcast.net  Fri Jul 24 23:23:08 2009
From: amylsabo at comcast.net (Amy Sabo)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 23:23:08 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [nabs-l] People are weird when it comes to blindness
In-Reply-To: <B5D18D7B70854ADCA60455C93313AA6B@thedjdinvasion>
Message-ID: <1394631029.4996651248477788679.JavaMail.root@sz0144a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

hello david,

i too get those weird looks and remarks when i use my cane and when my sister uses her guide dog. people think we are uniique when we are just like others who happen to be just like them but, we just can't see that's all!

i liked your sense on this and i do greatly appreciate it! well, my dear that's all for now take care and i will talk to you soon!


hugs always,
from amy

----- Original Message -----

From: David Dunphy 

To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list 

Sent: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 23:07:18 +0000 (UTC)

Subject: Re: [nabs-l] People are weird when it comes to blindness



That's OK. Someone who saw me walking with my cane the other day said that I 

need to activate my sonar so I can cross the street. Go figure that!

>From David



*****

If you're tired of hearing the same old songs on your local radio station, 

and if you can't find the variety you've always wanted, then check out the 

station that I own and operate with a great group of broadcasters called 

Radio360. You'll hear all types of music and programming, plus you're able 

to control what you hear through requests, interaction with the djs, and 

more!

To find out more about the station, visit us on the web at

http://www.radio360.us

Follow us on twitter at

http://www.twitter.com/radio360usa

or add us to your MySpace at

http://www.myspace.com/radio360usa

Come check us out, you won't be disappointed!!! 





_______________________________________________

nabs-l mailing list

nabs-l at nfbnet.org

http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org

To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:

http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/amylsabo%40comcast.net



From pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net  Sat Jul 25 00:08:44 2009
From: pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net (Peter Donahue)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 19:08:44 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Thank You Peter
References: <963465141.4970331248472451732.JavaMail.root@sz0144a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <000501ca0cbc$14b8f0d0$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn>

Hello Amy and listers,

    It's being worked on. I have one project ahead of it to wrap up but will 
begin processing the audio and posting it to the NABS Web Site in the next 
few weeks. Stay tuned for further information.

Peter Donahue


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Amy Sabo" <amylsabo at comcast.net>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 24, 2009 4:54 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Thank You Peter


hello joe,

thanks for posting this to the list. i', sorry for the late response to this 
thread since my desktop wasn't in commission before convention and even 
afterwwards so it's now working so my aapologies on this late note. i didn't 
know that the nabs meeting was being recorded! if there a possibility could 
i get a copy of it or will there be a link on the nabs website aso people 
who weren't ablle to attend the meeting at convention, or for people to 
relive it perhaps? i'm just curious...

well, that's all for now take care and i will talk to you soon!


hugs,
from amy

----- Original Message -----

From: Joe Orozco

To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'

Sent: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 22:49:24 +0000 (UTC)

Subject: [nabs-l] Thank You Peter



Hello all,



I just want to thank Peter Donahue for recording the student meeting and all

the other meetings he covered during convention.  He's real generous to

volunteer his time, and such service should not go unappreciated.  By the

sound of it, no pun intended, it seems as though those of us not at the

meeting will have a lot to look forward to.



Regards,



Joe Orozco



"A man who wants to lead the orchestra must turn his back on the

crowd."--Max Lucado





__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature

database 4237 (20090712) __________



The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.



http://www.eset.com







_______________________________________________

nabs-l mailing list

nabs-l at nfbnet.org

http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org

To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
nabs-l:

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_______________________________________________
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http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pdonahue1%40sbcglobal.net 



From tealbloodworth at gmail.com  Sun Jul 26 03:16:07 2009
From: tealbloodworth at gmail.com (Teal Bloodworth)
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 2009 22:16:07 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] living in a sighted world
Message-ID: <9D663AB199EE4E6F95051FDE333EDB50@teal6e6857f643>

Hello All 

Since i have joined a widely discussed topic has been the treatment of the blind and visually impaired in society. Recently when flying back from New York after recieving my new guide dog i had a very interesting conversation with a woman on the plane about this actual problem. 

This woman was a very intellegent bilingual (not sure of her nationality) whom i suppose was  handicapped. She shared that she had had extreme arthritis since the age of 8 and went through numerous surgeries and years of dialisis (sp?). When first boarding the plane she had already been seated bulkhead and respectfully asked me if she could pet my dog. Replying with a friendly "yes" she informed me of her friend sending her an email informing her of how to act around a service dog because of her frequent traveling.

 Later in the flight since it was long (new york to memphis) we started a conversation about the ACB and NFB. She seemd very well informed however i told her the main differences. The ACB focuses more on changing the world for us, and the NFB has a more realistic approach to the world since we are the minority in helping us adapt to the world. She actually made a very good point that it would be good for the two to work together and create a happy medium, however she doesnt know the controversy between the two. This actually seemed like a good idea when we started talking about the change of money. Word is that the ACB is going to change either the size or the color of the bills. This is more like foreign money and seems useful to some but it is just as useful to ask what the order of your change is and folding the bills or putting them in the appropriate place. We said that it would be a good idea even for the two to work together and keep the bills the same size/color but maybe making them tactile? 

This flight was interesting and this woman made me feel the least uncomfortable and unworthy that anyone sighted has done in my 2 1/2 years of darkness. Also this brought up the previous topic on discrimination or ignorance. This is a very fine line and my current thoughts are this. When we are walking on the street and someone doesnt "think you can do this" maybe they are not informed of our capabilities. Also even something i have said on here before about a landlord not calling me back because of my blindness....perhaps they felt i was a liability issue because i was more likely to be injured? is there really any actual hate towards us because of our physical disadvantage? Or is it simply lack of knowledge? People may not know of the many things that are available to us so that we can gain independence and sense of self sufficiency because not even i knew of these before i needed them.

And as for another question on guide dogs they are allowed anywhere the general public is allowed and no you do not have to pay extra fees for pets because they are not pets. 

If anyone has any thoughts, feelings or comments i would love to hear them. 

            -Teal 

From alena.roberts2282 at gmail.com  Sun Jul 26 05:38:00 2009
From: alena.roberts2282 at gmail.com (alena roberts)
Date: Sat, 25 Jul 2009 22:38:00 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] living in a sighted world
In-Reply-To: <9D663AB199EE4E6F95051FDE333EDB50@teal6e6857f643>
References: <9D663AB199EE4E6F95051FDE333EDB50@teal6e6857f643>
Message-ID: <3af83dbb0907252238j65063fe6qeda81cb7b564b713@mail.gmail.com>

I think that the attitude towards those with disabilities is a
combination of ignorance and prejudice. For the most part I would like
to believe that it is simply ignorance, but I know some people just
don't like those with disabilities because they're different. I am
currently working for an assistive tech company where I feel like I am
teaching my sighted peers something new on a more regular basis than I
should be. I also am helping them with social media, and people say
the dumbest things on twitter, which makes me frustrated. I think the
best thing we can do is educate people as much as possible, and
encourage people to think outside of the box they live in. I am glad
to hear that you had such a good conversation with someone on a plane.
I find that the people who are enquisitive about how I do things tend
to be the most open minded about accepting that people with
disabilities can learn to do almost anything with the right training
and modifications.

On 7/25/09, Teal Bloodworth <tealbloodworth at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello All
>
> Since i have joined a widely discussed topic has been the treatment of the
> blind and visually impaired in society. Recently when flying back from New
> York after recieving my new guide dog i had a very interesting conversation
> with a woman on the plane about this actual problem.
>
> This woman was a very intellegent bilingual (not sure of her nationality)
> whom i suppose was  handicapped. She shared that she had had extreme
> arthritis since the age of 8 and went through numerous surgeries and years
> of dialisis (sp?). When first boarding the plane she had already been seated
> bulkhead and respectfully asked me if she could pet my dog. Replying with a
> friendly "yes" she informed me of her friend sending her an email informing
> her of how to act around a service dog because of her frequent traveling.
>
>  Later in the flight since it was long (new york to memphis) we started a
> conversation about the ACB and NFB. She seemd very well informed however i
> told her the main differences. The ACB focuses more on changing the world
> for us, and the NFB has a more realistic approach to the world since we are
> the minority in helping us adapt to the world. She actually made a very good
> point that it would be good for the two to work together and create a happy
> medium, however she doesnt know the controversy between the two. This
> actually seemed like a good idea when we started talking about the change of
> money. Word is that the ACB is going to change either the size or the color
> of the bills. This is more like foreign money and seems useful to some but
> it is just as useful to ask what the order of your change is and folding the
> bills or putting them in the appropriate place. We said that it would be a
> good idea even for the two to work together and keep the bills the same
> size/color but maybe making them tactile?
>
> This flight was interesting and this woman made me feel the least
> uncomfortable and unworthy that anyone sighted has done in my 2 1/2 years of
> darkness. Also this brought up the previous topic on discrimination or
> ignorance. This is a very fine line and my current thoughts are this. When
> we are walking on the street and someone doesnt "think you can do this"
> maybe they are not informed of our capabilities. Also even something i have
> said on here before about a landlord not calling me back because of my
> blindness....perhaps they felt i was a liability issue because i was more
> likely to be injured? is there really any actual hate towards us because of
> our physical disadvantage? Or is it simply lack of knowledge? People may not
> know of the many things that are available to us so that we can gain
> independence and sense of self sufficiency because not even i knew of these
> before i needed them.
>
> And as for another question on guide dogs they are allowed anywhere the
> general public is allowed and no you do not have to pay extra fees for pets
> because they are not pets.
>
> If anyone has any thoughts, feelings or comments i would love to hear them.
>
>             -Teal
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alena.roberts2282%40gmail.com
>


-- 
Alena Roberts
Blog: http://www.blindgal.com/


From lawnmower84 at hotmail.com  Sun Jul 26 10:01:35 2009
From: lawnmower84 at hotmail.com (Jacob Struiksma)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 04:01:35 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] living in a sighted world
In-Reply-To: <3af83dbb0907252238j65063fe6qeda81cb7b564b713@mail.gmail.com>
References: <9D663AB199EE4E6F95051FDE333EDB50@teal6e6857f643>
	<3af83dbb0907252238j65063fe6qeda81cb7b564b713@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <COL0-DAV1229FD62A1D8E6B0B7E9E5B5170@phx.gbl>

What assistive tech company   are you working for?
From
Jacob Struiksma


-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of alena roberts
Sent: Saturday, July 25, 2009 11:38 PM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] living in a sighted world

I think that the attitude towards those with disabilities is a combination
of ignorance and prejudice. For the most part I would like to believe that
it is simply ignorance, but I know some people just don't like those with
disabilities because they're different. I am currently working for an
assistive tech company where I feel like I am teaching my sighted peers
something new on a more regular basis than I should be. I also am helping
them with social media, and people say the dumbest things on twitter, which
makes me frustrated. I think the best thing we can do is educate people as
much as possible, and encourage people to think outside of the box they live
in. I am glad to hear that you had such a good conversation with someone on
a plane.
I find that the people who are enquisitive about how I do things tend to be
the most open minded about accepting that people with disabilities can learn
to do almost anything with the right training and modifications.

On 7/25/09, Teal Bloodworth <tealbloodworth at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello All
>
> Since i have joined a widely discussed topic has been the treatment of 
> the blind and visually impaired in society. Recently when flying back 
> from New York after recieving my new guide dog i had a very 
> interesting conversation with a woman on the plane about this actual
problem.
>
> This woman was a very intellegent bilingual (not sure of her 
> nationality) whom i suppose was  handicapped. She shared that she had 
> had extreme arthritis since the age of 8 and went through numerous 
> surgeries and years of dialisis (sp?). When first boarding the plane 
> she had already been seated bulkhead and respectfully asked me if she 
> could pet my dog. Replying with a friendly "yes" she informed me of 
> her friend sending her an email informing her of how to act around a
service dog because of her frequent traveling.
>
>  Later in the flight since it was long (new york to memphis) we 
> started a conversation about the ACB and NFB. She seemd very well 
> informed however i told her the main differences. The ACB focuses more 
> on changing the world for us, and the NFB has a more realistic 
> approach to the world since we are the minority in helping us adapt to 
> the world. She actually made a very good point that it would be good 
> for the two to work together and create a happy medium, however she 
> doesnt know the controversy between the two. This actually seemed like 
> a good idea when we started talking about the change of money. Word is 
> that the ACB is going to change either the size or the color of the 
> bills. This is more like foreign money and seems useful to some but it 
> is just as useful to ask what the order of your change is and folding 
> the bills or putting them in the appropriate place. We said that it 
> would be a good idea even for the two to work together and keep the bills
the same size/color but maybe making them tactile?
>
> This flight was interesting and this woman made me feel the least 
> uncomfortable and unworthy that anyone sighted has done in my 2 1/2 
> years of darkness. Also this brought up the previous topic on 
> discrimination or ignorance. This is a very fine line and my current 
> thoughts are this. When we are walking on the street and someone doesnt
"think you can do this"
> maybe they are not informed of our capabilities. Also even something i 
> have said on here before about a landlord not calling me back because 
> of my blindness....perhaps they felt i was a liability issue because i 
> was more likely to be injured? is there really any actual hate towards 
> us because of our physical disadvantage? Or is it simply lack of 
> knowledge? People may not know of the many things that are available 
> to us so that we can gain independence and sense of self sufficiency 
> because not even i knew of these before i needed them.
>
> And as for another question on guide dogs they are allowed anywhere 
> the general public is allowed and no you do not have to pay extra fees 
> for pets because they are not pets.
>
> If anyone has any thoughts, feelings or comments i would love to hear
them.
>
>             -Teal
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alena.roberts2
> 282%40gmail.com
>


--
Alena Roberts
Blog: http://www.blindgal.com/

_______________________________________________
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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lawnmower84%40hotmai
l.com



From gymnastdave at sbcglobal.net  Sun Jul 26 18:03:35 2009
From: gymnastdave at sbcglobal.net (Dave Wright)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 13:03:35 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Brand New MSI Wind for sale
Message-ID: <A8B667598EC5448188C59FCD6EA7FA0D@dwrigh6>

Hello all,

Handy Tech North America has 1 new and still in the box MSI Wind Netbook
Computer for which we are asking $350.  This unit has the 6 cell battery,
1.6 GhZ Atom processor, 160 GB HD, 1 GB of RAM, Wi-Fi, Bluetooth, 3 USB
ports, a four in one card reader and is running Windows XP Home.  The device
is upgradable to 2 GB and doing so is a simple process of adding a second 1
GB memory stick, but for some reason MSI places a tamper proof sticker over
the compartment into which this memory stick should be placed.  Personally I
said the heck with it, upgraded my memory and it works great, but then I
also over clock to 24 percent and my Wind runs nice and snappy in spite of
the fact that either modification will void the warranty.

You can of course use your favorite screen reader, but for an additional
$150 I can install a System Access Atom license.  

Interested parties may contact my office during the week at:  651-636-5184

Or send e-mail any time to:

sales at handytech.us


Best Regards:
Dave Wright
Work Phone: 347-422-7085
Email:
dwrigh6 at gmail.com
WebPage:
http://www.knfbreader.com

From dandrews at visi.com  Mon Jul 27 00:10:23 2009
From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 19:10:23 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Youth Slam Absence
In-Reply-To: <2091916930.4730031248409279856.JavaMail.root@sz0144a.emery
	ville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <11D1F6E65EA04B4B86EF8EEDB3C45DEE@thedjdinvasion>
	<2091916930.4730031248409279856.JavaMail.root@sz0144a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <auto-000109213596@mailfront1.g2host.com>

Amy:

If you want to carry on a private correspondence / flirtation, or 
whatever it is with David, please do it in private e-mail, not on 
this list that goes to hundreds of persons.

David Andrews, List Owner

At 11:21 PM 7/23/2009, you wrote:
>hey david,
>
>well, i can see that you are very homesick for nyc! i kinda of 
>thought so my dear! thanks for the heads up and i will talk to you 
>soon my dear!
>
>hugs,
>from amy
>
>----- Original Message -----
>
>From: David Dunphy
>
>To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>
>Sent: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 22:51:25 +0000 (UTC)
>
>Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Youth Slam Absence
>
>
>
>If you're going to New York City, make sure you grab a slice of pizza if you
>
>can. There's nothing like a pizza in New York. I'm sorry but Minnesota and
>
>other states just can't cut it when it comes to a good slice of chese pizza.
>
>I grew up in NY for 25 years, so I should know.
>
>
>
>*****
>
>If you're tired of hearing the same old songs on your local radio station,
>
>and if you can't find the variety you've always wanted, then check out the
>
>station that I own and operate with a great group of broadcasters called
>
>Radio360. You'll hear all types of music and programming, plus you're able
>
>to control what you hear through requests, interaction with the djs, and
>
>more!
>
>To find out more about the station, visit us on the web at
>
>http://www.radio360.us
>
>Follow us on twitter at
>
>http://www.twitter.com/radio360usa
>
>or add us to your MySpace at
>
>http://www.myspace.com/radio360usa
>
>Come check us out, you won't be disappointed!!!
>
>
>
>
>
>__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus 
>signature database 4271 (20090723) __________
>
>
>
>The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>
>
>
>http://www.eset.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>
>nabs-l mailing list
>
>nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>
>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>
>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>
>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/amylsabo%40comcast.net
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>nabs-l mailing list
>nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dandrews%40visi.com
>
>
>__________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus 
>signature database 4275 (20090724) __________
>
>The message was checked by ESET Smart Security.
>
>http://www.eset.com



From AZNOR99 at aol.com  Mon Jul 27 00:20:19 2009
From: AZNOR99 at aol.com (by way of David Andrews <dandrews@visi.com>)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 19:20:19 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Youth Slam Now on Twitter
Message-ID: <auto-000109213902@mailfront1.g2host.com>


200 blind high school students have just 
converged on the campus of the University of 
Maryland to spend a wild week learning about 
science, technology, engineering, and math.  With 
more than 70 adult blind mentors, they will build 
greenhouses, dissect sharks, learn CSI techniques, and even drive cars.



You can follow along through the week and learn 
breaking news from the NFB Youth Slam by going to

<http://www.twitter.com/NFBYouthSlam>www.twitter.com/NFBYouthSlam

or follow “NFBYouthSlam” if you already have a Twitter account,.



Two hundred blind and low vision students from 
all across the country will attend this five-day 
adventure that will engage, inspire, and 
encourage the next generation of blind youth to 
consider careers falsely believed to be 
impossible for the blind.  Have you ever wanted 
to build and launch a rocket?  Are you interested 
in learning about forensics?  Or do you have an 
interest in journalism?  The possibilities are plentiful at the NFB Youth Slam!

While staying at the University of Maryland, 
College Park, students will be mentored by blind 
role models during fun and challenging activities 
designed to build confidence and increase science literacy.  Participants
Students and mentors dance during the closing party of the 2007
will also have the opportunity to attend 
workshops on topics such as leadership, career 
preparation, and blindness.  In addition, 
students will have time for fun and mingling 
during social activities, such as extreme sports, 
recreation night, and a talent show.


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From alena.roberts2282 at gmail.com  Mon Jul 27 01:22:37 2009
From: alena.roberts2282 at gmail.com (alena roberts)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 18:22:37 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] living in a sighted world
In-Reply-To: <COL0-DAV1229FD62A1D8E6B0B7E9E5B5170@phx.gbl>
References: <9D663AB199EE4E6F95051FDE333EDB50@teal6e6857f643>
	<3af83dbb0907252238j65063fe6qeda81cb7b564b713@mail.gmail.com>
	<COL0-DAV1229FD62A1D8E6B0B7E9E5B5170@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <3af83dbb0907261822n2b3b0fcq640547f0d5d18014@mail.gmail.com>

ViewPlus Technologies. We design and manufacture the Tiger embossers.
It is a good company, I think that my sighted peers just have a lot to
learn.

On 7/26/09, Jacob Struiksma <lawnmower84 at hotmail.com> wrote:
> What assistive tech company   are you working for?
> From
> Jacob Struiksma
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
> Of alena roberts
> Sent: Saturday, July 25, 2009 11:38 PM
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] living in a sighted world
>
> I think that the attitude towards those with disabilities is a combination
> of ignorance and prejudice. For the most part I would like to believe that
> it is simply ignorance, but I know some people just don't like those with
> disabilities because they're different. I am currently working for an
> assistive tech company where I feel like I am teaching my sighted peers
> something new on a more regular basis than I should be. I also am helping
> them with social media, and people say the dumbest things on twitter, which
> makes me frustrated. I think the best thing we can do is educate people as
> much as possible, and encourage people to think outside of the box they live
> in. I am glad to hear that you had such a good conversation with someone on
> a plane.
> I find that the people who are enquisitive about how I do things tend to be
> the most open minded about accepting that people with disabilities can learn
> to do almost anything with the right training and modifications.
>
> On 7/25/09, Teal Bloodworth <tealbloodworth at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hello All
>>
>> Since i have joined a widely discussed topic has been the treatment of
>> the blind and visually impaired in society. Recently when flying back
>> from New York after recieving my new guide dog i had a very
>> interesting conversation with a woman on the plane about this actual
> problem.
>>
>> This woman was a very intellegent bilingual (not sure of her
>> nationality) whom i suppose was  handicapped. She shared that she had
>> had extreme arthritis since the age of 8 and went through numerous
>> surgeries and years of dialisis (sp?). When first boarding the plane
>> she had already been seated bulkhead and respectfully asked me if she
>> could pet my dog. Replying with a friendly "yes" she informed me of
>> her friend sending her an email informing her of how to act around a
> service dog because of her frequent traveling.
>>
>>  Later in the flight since it was long (new york to memphis) we
>> started a conversation about the ACB and NFB. She seemd very well
>> informed however i told her the main differences. The ACB focuses more
>> on changing the world for us, and the NFB has a more realistic
>> approach to the world since we are the minority in helping us adapt to
>> the world. She actually made a very good point that it would be good
>> for the two to work together and create a happy medium, however she
>> doesnt know the controversy between the two. This actually seemed like
>> a good idea when we started talking about the change of money. Word is
>> that the ACB is going to change either the size or the color of the
>> bills. This is more like foreign money and seems useful to some but it
>> is just as useful to ask what the order of your change is and folding
>> the bills or putting them in the appropriate place. We said that it
>> would be a good idea even for the two to work together and keep the bills
> the same size/color but maybe making them tactile?
>>
>> This flight was interesting and this woman made me feel the least
>> uncomfortable and unworthy that anyone sighted has done in my 2 1/2
>> years of darkness. Also this brought up the previous topic on
>> discrimination or ignorance. This is a very fine line and my current
>> thoughts are this. When we are walking on the street and someone doesnt
> "think you can do this"
>> maybe they are not informed of our capabilities. Also even something i
>> have said on here before about a landlord not calling me back because
>> of my blindness....perhaps they felt i was a liability issue because i
>> was more likely to be injured? is there really any actual hate towards
>> us because of our physical disadvantage? Or is it simply lack of
>> knowledge? People may not know of the many things that are available
>> to us so that we can gain independence and sense of self sufficiency
>> because not even i knew of these before i needed them.
>>
>> And as for another question on guide dogs they are allowed anywhere
>> the general public is allowed and no you do not have to pay extra fees
>> for pets because they are not pets.
>>
>> If anyone has any thoughts, feelings or comments i would love to hear
> them.
>>
>>             -Teal
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alena.roberts2
>> 282%40gmail.com
>>
>
>
> --
> Alena Roberts
> Blog: http://www.blindgal.com/
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lawnmower84%40hotmai
> l.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alena.roberts2282%40gmail.com
>


-- 
Alena Roberts
Blog: http://www.blindgal.com/


From tealbloodworth at gmail.com  Mon Jul 27 04:14:56 2009
From: tealbloodworth at gmail.com (Teal Bloodworth)
Date: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 23:14:56 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] living in a sighted world
References: <9D663AB199EE4E6F95051FDE333EDB50@teal6e6857f643>
	<3af83dbb0907252238j65063fe6qeda81cb7b564b713@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20A28D802B0F4D7EBA80D986C0954D32@teal6e6857f643>

actually it is kind of funny that you say you work there and are teaching 
them. I find that people who use the adaptive technology are going to be 
alittle more fluent with how to use it, like many other things. Actually a 
man at the kentucky office for the blind in louisville, mario island is one 
of the best users of jaws that i have ever met and my local A/T instructor 
calls me every once in awhile to ask questions and says that i know jaws 
better than her and i really have only been working with it for about a 
year.

As for you....i know myspace very well and can navigate with simple key 
strokes if anyone ever has a question. Actually most websites have become 
alittle more accessable. and as for the original topic, i agree with you 
100%. I love it when people are interested and ask questions like what do 
you miss the most about having sight, is it harder for you to do school work 
and i also love it when they compare how strong they are to how strong i am 
because i have taken what i was given so well and succeeded. People are very 
hateful, yes, but you have to give some of them a chance because they just 
dont know how to help/not help or how to act. Yes some people are disgusted 
by us because of our "special treatment" or alittle more attention and help 
but they really just dont understand it or are jealous of our success.

            -Teal

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "alena roberts" <alena.roberts2282 at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 26, 2009 12:38 AM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] living in a sighted world


>I think that the attitude towards those with disabilities is a
> combination of ignorance and prejudice. For the most part I would like
> to believe that it is simply ignorance, but I know some people just
> don't like those with disabilities because they're different. I am
> currently working for an assistive tech company where I feel like I am
> teaching my sighted peers something new on a more regular basis than I
> should be. I also am helping them with social media, and people say
> the dumbest things on twitter, which makes me frustrated. I think the
> best thing we can do is educate people as much as possible, and
> encourage people to think outside of the box they live in. I am glad
> to hear that you had such a good conversation with someone on a plane.
> I find that the people who are enquisitive about how I do things tend
> to be the most open minded about accepting that people with
> disabilities can learn to do almost anything with the right training
> and modifications.
>
> On 7/25/09, Teal Bloodworth <tealbloodworth at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hello All
>>
>> Since i have joined a widely discussed topic has been the treatment of 
>> the
>> blind and visually impaired in society. Recently when flying back from 
>> New
>> York after recieving my new guide dog i had a very interesting 
>> conversation
>> with a woman on the plane about this actual problem.
>>
>> This woman was a very intellegent bilingual (not sure of her nationality)
>> whom i suppose was  handicapped. She shared that she had had extreme
>> arthritis since the age of 8 and went through numerous surgeries and 
>> years
>> of dialisis (sp?). When first boarding the plane she had already been 
>> seated
>> bulkhead and respectfully asked me if she could pet my dog. Replying with 
>> a
>> friendly "yes" she informed me of her friend sending her an email 
>> informing
>> her of how to act around a service dog because of her frequent traveling.
>>
>>  Later in the flight since it was long (new york to memphis) we started a
>> conversation about the ACB and NFB. She seemd very well informed however 
>> i
>> told her the main differences. The ACB focuses more on changing the world
>> for us, and the NFB has a more realistic approach to the world since we 
>> are
>> the minority in helping us adapt to the world. She actually made a very 
>> good
>> point that it would be good for the two to work together and create a 
>> happy
>> medium, however she doesnt know the controversy between the two. This
>> actually seemed like a good idea when we started talking about the change 
>> of
>> money. Word is that the ACB is going to change either the size or the 
>> color
>> of the bills. This is more like foreign money and seems useful to some 
>> but
>> it is just as useful to ask what the order of your change is and folding 
>> the
>> bills or putting them in the appropriate place. We said that it would be 
>> a
>> good idea even for the two to work together and keep the bills the same
>> size/color but maybe making them tactile?
>>
>> This flight was interesting and this woman made me feel the least
>> uncomfortable and unworthy that anyone sighted has done in my 2 1/2 years 
>> of
>> darkness. Also this brought up the previous topic on discrimination or
>> ignorance. This is a very fine line and my current thoughts are this. 
>> When
>> we are walking on the street and someone doesnt "think you can do this"
>> maybe they are not informed of our capabilities. Also even something i 
>> have
>> said on here before about a landlord not calling me back because of my
>> blindness....perhaps they felt i was a liability issue because i was more
>> likely to be injured? is there really any actual hate towards us because 
>> of
>> our physical disadvantage? Or is it simply lack of knowledge? People may 
>> not
>> know of the many things that are available to us so that we can gain
>> independence and sense of self sufficiency because not even i knew of 
>> these
>> before i needed them.
>>
>> And as for another question on guide dogs they are allowed anywhere the
>> general public is allowed and no you do not have to pay extra fees for 
>> pets
>> because they are not pets.
>>
>> If anyone has any thoughts, feelings or comments i would love to hear 
>> them.
>>
>>             -Teal
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alena.roberts2282%40gmail.com
>>
>
>
> -- 
> Alena Roberts
> Blog: http://www.blindgal.com/
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/tealbloodworth%40gmail.com 



From snowball07 at gmail.com  Mon Jul 27 15:21:14 2009
From: snowball07 at gmail.com (Janice)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 10:21:14 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Meeting Minutes
Message-ID: <006EDC836FE84119AE83070E18550163@your0d10610b06>

Hey Nabsters,

Attached to this email, as a word file, is the first meting minutes for our new NABS administration. This is the NABS board's attempt at keeping "you" the student, informed. I am quite excited that I get to post up my minutes and be the humble messenger. BE nice- *smile* 
I sincerely apologize for the tardiness of the minutes being released.  I was extraordinary ill after National Convention, and it looked like I was getting better for a bit. However, the flu/ fever has taken a turn for the worse again. Nothing super serious, but just enough to keep me some what unbalanced. Anyways, enough of my rambling. Here they are: enjoy!

Kindest Regards,

Janice Jeang 
Secretary 
national Association of Blind Students
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From amylsabo at comcast.net  Mon Jul 27 19:56:44 2009
From: amylsabo at comcast.net (Amy Sabo)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 19:56:44 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: [nfbmi-talk] Braille music resources
Message-ID: <1217875258.5682111248724604931.JavaMail.root@sz0144a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

hello all,

i'm forwarding to you all a message in regards to finding resources or ideas for braille music.. pleasse read the note for more information. take care all and i will talk to you all soon!


hugs,
from amy

----- Forwarded Message -----

From: Diana Mohnke 

To: nfbmi-talk at nfbnet.org

Sent: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 22:09:03 +0000 (UTC)

Subject: [nfbmi-talk] Braille music resources











Hello,



 



Does anyone here know of anyone in Michigan who teaches Braille music?  Kim has been learning Braille music from an elderly

woman in Lansing

who has recently become ill.  It would be

preferable to have someone from the Lansing

area but all resources are welcomed.  Feel

free to contact me at d_mohnke18 at yahoo.com

or by phone at 989-640-3171.



 



Thanks, 



Diana 









      

_______________________________________________

nfbmi-talk mailing list

nfbmi-talk at nfbnet.org

http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbmi-talk_nfbnet.org

To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nfbmi-talk:

http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbmi-talk_nfbnet.org/amylsabo%40comcast.net



From aguimaraes at nbp.org  Mon Jul 27 20:01:43 2009
From: aguimaraes at nbp.org (Antonio Guimaraes)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 16:01:43 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Meeting Minutes
References: <006EDC836FE84119AE83070E18550163@your0d10610b06>
Message-ID: <2D892AA5BB634FF48574BCA6015EEEF8@nbp2.local>

Thank you for the minutes. Nice work. Couple of thoughts:

Yes, membership is interested in reading board meetings minutes. I speak for 
myself, but this would provide a chance to stay informed, involved, and for 
the board to be accountable to the membership.

Yes, I would like to see the minutes archived on the site.

thank you for your diligent work, and keep up the work.

Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Janice" <snowball07 at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 11:21 AM
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Meeting Minutes


Hey Nabsters,

Attached to this email, as a word file, is the first meting minutes for our 
new NABS administration. This is the NABS board's attempt at keeping "you" 
the student, informed. I am quite excited that I get to post up my minutes 
and be the humble messenger. BE nice- *smile*
I sincerely apologize for the tardiness of the minutes being released.  I 
was extraordinary ill after National Convention, and it looked like I was 
getting better for a bit. However, the flu/ fever has taken a turn for the 
worse again. Nothing super serious, but just enough to keep me some what 
unbalanced. Anyways, enough of my rambling. Here they are: enjoy!

Kindest Regards,

Janice Jeang
Secretary
national Association of Blind Students


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/aguimaraes%40nbp.org
> 




From cowboy0210 at gmail.com  Mon Jul 27 21:23:41 2009
From: cowboy0210 at gmail.com (Kevin Ledford)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 17:23:41 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Update from Youth Slam
Message-ID: <5487baf30907271423v79ccbbe0x19ff700583943f9f@mail.gmail.com>

Greetings and good afternoon fellow NABSters,

Just wanted to say hello and hope everyone is having a wonderful beginning
to their week. Today was our first full day here at Youth Slam and so far
for myself and my mentees, it has been an awesome day! Last night we got to
hear remarks from NFB Jernigan Institute Executive Director Mark Riccobono,
Karen Zakhnini, Georgia Affiliate President Anil Lewis, NABS President
Arielle Silverman, Mary Jo Thorpe-Hartle and many others welcoming all the
fine students here to Youth Slam. It was a very long day but such an awesome
start to the week!

This morning, we had the privilege to hear from Dr. Maurer and others also
welcoming us and helping to get the week kicked off in the right direction!
We are just now finishing our track activities for the day and will be
attending the bbq and activities in the quad.

Hope everyone has a wonderful evening. For those unable to attend we are
missing you and wishing you the best!

Who are we? N F B !!!!!

-- 
Best Regards,

Kevin D. Ledford


"Do not let what you cannot do interfere with what you can do."

- John Wooden

From clinton.waterbury at gmail.com  Mon Jul 27 21:30:39 2009
From: clinton.waterbury at gmail.com (clinton waterbury)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 15:30:39 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Myitlab...  The never-ending battle
Message-ID: <542FA720-ED78-40BF-B56D-4E0830BF77E3@gmail.com>

Hello all.
I am having an issue with a website/piece of software called myitlab  
that my school uses for submitting assignments and tests.
I can get as far as being able to answer all the questions on a test,  
but then the submition issue happens.
I can't even use keystrokes in jaws, window-eyes, and even voiceover  
on the mac of all things to click on the finish button on the  
webpage.  I have to have someone come over and click my mouse for me  
no matter what computer I am on.  The major issues I see with this are  
1, lack of being able to be independant with my own school work, and  
2, not having a way to have someone come over to the computer and  
click the mouse to get it to submit.
Any Thoughts?  All input would be greatly apprieciated.
Thanks.
Clinton.


From qmsingleton at comcast.net  Mon Jul 27 23:18:24 2009
From: qmsingleton at comcast.net (Quintina M. Singleton)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 18:18:24 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Thruoureyes Show Announcement
Message-ID: <auto-000111973938@mailfront2.g2host.com>


The next Thruoureyes with Joe Ruffalo internet radio program 
scheduled for this coming Wednesday July 29 at <?xml:namespace prefix 
= st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" />8:00 PM EST 
is for current and aspiring crafters.  Joyce Kane, the National 
Federation of the Blind  Krafters division president along with a few 
other valued members of the group will be speaking with Mr. Ruffalo 
about  ways they share their artistic work learn and teach others How 
to be expressive through craftsmanship.   <?xml:namespace prefix = o 
ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

Thruoureyes has a new 'listen-on-phone' number. its 1-605-475-6333, 
access code: 833520. Anyone can also listen as usual at 
thruoureyes.org or for jaws users: www.thruoureyes.org/jaws.html

The call in number for those interested in asking a question remains 
the same: 1-888-572-0141



From dlawless86 at gmail.com  Tue Jul 28 00:17:02 2009
From: dlawless86 at gmail.com (Domonique Lawless)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 19:17:02 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Myitlab... The never-ending battle
In-Reply-To: <542FA720-ED78-40BF-B56D-4E0830BF77E3@gmail.com>
References: <542FA720-ED78-40BF-B56D-4E0830BF77E3@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <423e6e460907271717m720db370obe751ce51bef81b0@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Clinton,
Maybe you can have your teachers e-mail you a word document with the
test in it. This way you can independently take your exams. If that
doesn't work out then see if the teacher can help you find a reader in
that particular department.

Hope this helps,
Domonique

On 7/27/09, clinton waterbury <clinton.waterbury at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello all.
> I am having an issue with a website/piece of software called myitlab
> that my school uses for submitting assignments and tests.
> I can get as far as being able to answer all the questions on a test,
> but then the submition issue happens.
> I can't even use keystrokes in jaws, window-eyes, and even voiceover
> on the mac of all things to click on the finish button on the
> webpage.  I have to have someone come over and click my mouse for me
> no matter what computer I am on.  The major issues I see with this are
> 1, lack of being able to be independant with my own school work, and
> 2, not having a way to have someone come over to the computer and
> click the mouse to get it to submit.
> Any Thoughts?  All input would be greatly apprieciated.
> Thanks.
> Clinton.
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dlawless86%40gmail.com
>


From labney at charter.net  Tue Jul 28 00:36:25 2009
From: labney at charter.net (Lou)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 19:36:25 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Myitlab...  The never-ending battle
In-Reply-To: <542FA720-ED78-40BF-B56D-4E0830BF77E3@gmail.com>
References: <542FA720-ED78-40BF-B56D-4E0830BF77E3@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <004b01ca0f1b$70961ca0$51c255e0$@net>

Hi, try using the application  key and click on open after you click on the
finish button. I have had to do this to get some pages to load.
Hth
Lou
-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of clinton waterbury
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 4:31 PM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: [nabs-l] Myitlab... The never-ending battle

Hello all.
I am having an issue with a website/piece of software called myitlab  
that my school uses for submitting assignments and tests.
I can get as far as being able to answer all the questions on a test,  
but then the submition issue happens.
I can't even use keystrokes in jaws, window-eyes, and even voiceover  
on the mac of all things to click on the finish button on the  
webpage.  I have to have someone come over and click my mouse for me  
no matter what computer I am on.  The major issues I see with this are  
1, lack of being able to be independant with my own school work, and  
2, not having a way to have someone come over to the computer and  
click the mouse to get it to submit.
Any Thoughts?  All input would be greatly apprieciated.
Thanks.
Clinton.

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/labney%40charter.net



From mohnked at hotmail.com  Tue Jul 28 01:25:50 2009
From: mohnked at hotmail.com (Diana Mohnke)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 21:25:50 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: [nfbmi-talk] Braille music resources
In-Reply-To: <1217875258.5682111248724604931.JavaMail.root@sz0144a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <1217875258.5682111248724604931.JavaMail.root@sz0144a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <SNT105-W100F69DCD50E7910329A1AA1150@phx.gbl>


Hello everyone,
 
I originally posted this message only on the Michigan listserv since we are looking for resources in the Michigan area.  Please do not contact me unless you have any useful information we could use in Michigan for my sister to learn Braille music.  A note for those who forward personal messages from other lists, I hope you contact the person who originally posted the message to make sure that it is okay that the message can be forwarded on as it appears.  I did not intend for my message to extend past the Michigan listserv. 
 
Thanks,
Diana Mohnke 

 
> Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 19:56:44 +0000
> From: amylsabo at comcast.net
> To: PERFORM-TALK at NFBNET.ORG
> CC: NABS-L at NFBNET.ORG
> Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: [nfbmi-talk] Braille music resources
> 
> hello all,
> 
> i'm forwarding to you all a message in regards to finding resources or ideas for braille music.. pleasse read the note for more information. take care all and i will talk to you all soon!
> 
> 
> hugs,
> from amy
> 
> ----- Forwarded Message -----
> 
> From: Diana Mohnke 
> 
> To: nfbmi-talk at nfbnet.org
> 
> Sent: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 22:09:03 +0000 (UTC)
> 
> Subject: [nfbmi-talk] Braille music resources
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hello,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Does anyone here know of anyone in Michigan who teaches Braille music? Kim has been learning Braille music from an elderly
> 
> woman in Lansing
> 
> who has recently become ill. It would be
> 
> preferable to have someone from the Lansing
> 
> area but all resources are welcomed. Feel
> 
> free to contact me at d_mohnke18 at yahoo.com
> 
> or by phone at 989-640-3171.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks, 
> 
> 
> 
> Diana 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> nfbmi-talk mailing list
> 
> nfbmi-talk at nfbnet.org
> 
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbmi-talk_nfbnet.org
> 
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nfbmi-talk:
> 
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbmi-talk_nfbnet.org/amylsabo%40comcast.net
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mohnked%40hotmail.com

_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live™ Hotmail®: Search, add, and share the web’s latest sports videos. Check it out.
http://www.windowslive.com/Online/Hotmail/Campaign/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_QA_HM_sports_videos_072009&cat=sports

From clinton.waterbury at gmail.com  Tue Jul 28 01:28:38 2009
From: clinton.waterbury at gmail.com (clinton waterbury)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 19:28:38 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Myitlab... The never-ending battle
In-Reply-To: <423e6e460907271717m720db370obe751ce51bef81b0@mail.gmail.com>
References: <542FA720-ED78-40BF-B56D-4E0830BF77E3@gmail.com>
	<423e6e460907271717m720db370obe751ce51bef81b0@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <F7CD5345-222A-4A07-A6D7-C45291F6AFD8@gmail.com>

I've tried having them e-mail the assignments but the response I got  
was something along the lines of Oh...  We can't get the tests from  
myitlab, and the reader thing I also talked to my adviser about and  
they for some reason determined that a reader would not be appropriate  
for me, and that I should just go to the computer lab at the drc, so  
that's when I figured test it with safari and voiceover, and that's  
when I got the same results that I did with jaws.
They then tried putting window-eyes on the computer at school, and I  
could arrow down the page, but someone would still end up having to  
click the buttons to go to the next questions, so now I'm fighting to  
get jaws 9 back on the system, and I'm starting to wonder what the  
point of it is, as I get the same results described in my initial  
message.
On Jul 27, 2009, at 6:17 PM, Domonique Lawless wrote:

> Hi Clinton,
> Maybe you can have your teachers e-mail you a word document with the
> test in it. This way you can independently take your exams. If that
> doesn't work out then see if the teacher can help you find a reader in
> that particular department.
>
> Hope this helps,
> Domonique
>
> On 7/27/09, clinton waterbury <clinton.waterbury at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hello all.
>> I am having an issue with a website/piece of software called myitlab
>> that my school uses for submitting assignments and tests.
>> I can get as far as being able to answer all the questions on a test,
>> but then the submition issue happens.
>> I can't even use keystrokes in jaws, window-eyes, and even voiceover
>> on the mac of all things to click on the finish button on the
>> webpage.  I have to have someone come over and click my mouse for me
>> no matter what computer I am on.  The major issues I see with this  
>> are
>> 1, lack of being able to be independant with my own school work, and
>> 2, not having a way to have someone come over to the computer and
>> click the mouse to get it to submit.
>> Any Thoughts?  All input would be greatly apprieciated.
>> Thanks.
>> Clinton.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dlawless86%40gmail.com
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info  
> for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clinton.waterbury%40gmail.com



From commanderlumpy2003 at earthlink.net  Tue Jul 28 01:46:42 2009
From: commanderlumpy2003 at earthlink.net (Kevin Wassmer)
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 19:46:42 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Myitlab... The never-ending battle
References: <542FA720-ED78-40BF-B56D-4E0830BF77E3@gmail.com><423e6e460907271717m720db370obe751ce51bef81b0@mail.gmail.com>
	<F7CD5345-222A-4A07-A6D7-C45291F6AFD8@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <A8362FFAFE1542A0955A1FF10467BA11@usore540475a8f>

Call Ron Gardner. He could advacat a reader for  you. I am glad I went to 
SUU. They had a great DRC there. It made the DRC at SLCC look bad.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "clinton waterbury" <clinton.waterbury at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 7:28 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Myitlab... The never-ending battle


> I've tried having them e-mail the assignments but the response I got  was 
> something along the lines of Oh...  We can't get the tests from  myitlab, 
> and the reader thing I also talked to my adviser about and  they for some 
> reason determined that a reader would not be appropriate  for me, and that 
> I should just go to the computer lab at the drc, so  that's when I figured 
> test it with safari and voiceover, and that's  when I got the same results 
> that I did with jaws.
> They then tried putting window-eyes on the computer at school, and I 
> could arrow down the page, but someone would still end up having to  click 
> the buttons to go to the next questions, so now I'm fighting to  get jaws 
> 9 back on the system, and I'm starting to wonder what the  point of it is, 
> as I get the same results described in my initial  message.
> On Jul 27, 2009, at 6:17 PM, Domonique Lawless wrote:
>
>> Hi Clinton,
>> Maybe you can have your teachers e-mail you a word document with the
>> test in it. This way you can independently take your exams. If that
>> doesn't work out then see if the teacher can help you find a reader in
>> that particular department.
>>
>> Hope this helps,
>> Domonique
>>
>> On 7/27/09, clinton waterbury <clinton.waterbury at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Hello all.
>>> I am having an issue with a website/piece of software called myitlab
>>> that my school uses for submitting assignments and tests.
>>> I can get as far as being able to answer all the questions on a test,
>>> but then the submition issue happens.
>>> I can't even use keystrokes in jaws, window-eyes, and even voiceover
>>> on the mac of all things to click on the finish button on the
>>> webpage.  I have to have someone come over and click my mouse for me
>>> no matter what computer I am on.  The major issues I see with this  are
>>> 1, lack of being able to be independant with my own school work, and
>>> 2, not having a way to have someone come over to the computer and
>>> click the mouse to get it to submit.
>>> Any Thoughts?  All input would be greatly apprieciated.
>>> Thanks.
>>> Clinton.
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dlawless86%40gmail.com
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info  for 
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clinton.waterbury%40gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/commanderlumpy2003%40earthlink.net
> 



From Maurice.Sloane at humanware.com  Tue Jul 28 07:58:17 2009
From: Maurice.Sloane at humanware.com (Maurice Sloane)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 02:58:17 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] KeySoft 8.0 Released
Message-ID: <auto-000109414455@mailfront1.g2host.com>

HumanWare is pleased to announce the release of KeySoft 8.0.



The HumanWare web page
http://www.humanware.com/en-usa/support/braillenote/software/keysoft_8.0
_upgrade  provides details on the release and links to the required
download files.



Please read all instructions carefully before downloading and installing
the new software.  Do not attempt to upgrade to KeySoft 8.0 before
installing the KeySoft 8.0 Product key that matches the serial number of
your BrailleNote mPower or BrailleNote PK.



If you have trouble obtaining the 8.0 product key, and you consider you
are eligible to have access to KeySoft 8.0, please email
sma at humanware.com, stating the serial number of your unit.



KeySoft 8.0 requires one count of a Software Maintenance Agreement
(SMA).



New BrailleNote mPower and PK units purchased after 1 January 2009 are
eligible to receive a free upgrade to KeySoft 8.0.



We hope you enjoy KeySoft 8.0.



The following is an extract from the KeySoft 8 web page.



Version 8.0 is packed with a wide range of features to enhance the way
you work and learn. This document includes useful information about the
version.



KeyChat (mPower and PK)



KeyChat allows you to communicate through Google Talk, iChat and other
XMPP chatting services.



With KeyChat you can:

* Read and write messages in your preferred grade of Braille

* Send, receive and manage conversations

* Follow chat history with familiar KeySoft commands

* Receive Audio or Braille prompts when a message arrives

* Add new friends or select from existing IM contacts

* Set up IM services options



Audible.com Book Library Access (mPower and PK)



To obtain Audible books, you have to be a member of the Audible service
and use the Audible manager PC software to authorize your BrailleNote to
play the protected Audible books. For information, please visit:
http://www.audible.com/humanware



Fully integrated into KeyBook, you can listen to Audible books and
customize various settings such as narration speed and audio tone. When
reading Audible books, a user can:



* Navigate by heading or time jump

* List headings

* Use place markers

* Insert or view a Text note

* Obtain book information (book title, the number of pages, total time)

* Obtain details about the current position (section heading, page)



Bookshare Access (mPower and PK)



The existing support for unpacking electronic books from Bookshare.org
is enhanced to include the new .zip or bks2 format adopted by Bookshare.


If books are downloaded with the default .zip extension, it is necessary
to change the BookReader filter to all files. Alternatively, use the
KeySoft File Manager to unpack the books as they will not appear when
browsing via the Book Reader application.



NIMAS book support (mPower and PK)



NIMAS books are text files and they are structured like DAISY books.
Move through DAISY elements, or use the familiar KeySoft sentence and
paragraph navigation commands in text DAISY books if you prefer.  NIMAS
(National Instructional Materials Accessibility Standard) is the format
used for educational text books in the United States. For more
information, please visit: http://nimas.cast.org/.



Trial Sendero GPS Version 6 (mPower and PK)



KeySoft version 8.0 offers a great opportunity to get familiar with GPS.
The version includes the latest Sendero GPS version 6.0. Users can
browse their preferred map and navigate outdoors during a 90 days free
trial.  After this trial period, users can continue enjoying their
system at a preferential price. Users are required to download the
desired maps from the Sendero site. For real time navigation, you will
need a GPS receiver.



mPower platforms: Users downloading version 8.0 will have Sendero V 6.0
installed by default. From the Main menu, go to the "Navigation" option.
You will be prompted to press T to run the trial version or register
your copy of Sendero GPS (R).  After pressing T, information will be
provided on how to get the Sendero application up and running.



Note that if you were already running a Sendero GPS under KeySoft 7.5,
the first time you run the GPS after installing KeySoft 8, the GPS
program will automatically detect your version. You will hear the
message: "An older version of GPS has been detected".  Please reset
while holding down J K L (QT models) or dots 4 5 6 (BT models).  After
resetting, an additional reset will be required. Afterwards, upon
resetting a second time, you will be able to use your GPS version
without issue.



PK platforms: PK users will find the navigation option in the Main menu,
however, they will need to copy the GPS_6_0.exe file onto the CF Card.
Users will find the GPS_6_0.exe file on our BrailleNote download page.



PK GPS Installation procedure:

1. Install KeySoft 8.0

2. Copy GPS_6_0.exe to the root of /, or /windows, or /flash disk, or
/Compact Flash.

3. Then type N for Navigation option from the main menu.



For more information, please refer to the KeySoft 8.0 FAQ document on
our Web site.



Some components of Sendero GPS are now included within the KeySoft suite
and cannot be removed or uninstalled by the user.  The "Navigation"
option will remain in the KeySoft Main Menu after the expiration of the
Sendero GPS trial period.



More Hewlett Packard printer models supported (mPower only)



Students and teachers can now select from a wide range of Hewlett
Packard printers. Printers supported via the KeySoft generic printing
engine must have a USB port and be part of the list given in the KeySoft
8.0 FAQ's.



To print through the generic driver select "hp generic USB printer" from
the "printer type" list in KeyWord print menu.



To save a JPEG file select "Generic JPEG printer" from the printer type
list, then select a folder destination.



WiFi now supports the WPA PSK encryption (mPower)



KeySoft 8 supports WPA PSK (Pre Shared Key) when using a wireless G card
such as the Ambicom 54G.

Two options are available when creating a connection configuration. When
prompted "Use WPAPSK?", if one is using either the Ambicom WL54G or the
US Robotics Wireless MAXg USB Adapter USR5421, and the wireless signal
is encrypted using WPA personal, set this option to yes and press enter.




The next option prompts the user for the WPA Pre Shared Key.  This is a
passphrase that is between 8 and 64 characters and must match the
passphrase that was originally entered in the wireless router. It is
important to note that the passphrase is case sensitive.



Once this information has been entered, exit the connection
configuration list with a space with E, or escape key on a QT and type a
Y to save changes.  Connect to the internet as you would normally and
the mPower will successfully connect to a wireless G signal that is
encrypted using WPA.



Other enhancements and changes:

* Eloquence speech is now supported in the PK.

* Eloquence speech in Spanish has been added to both the mPower and the
PK.

* In KeyBook, the text-to speech used is Eloquence even if Keynote Gold
is selected as the main TTS. After exiting KeyBook, the TTS will return
to the user selected setting.

* In order to synchronize KeySoft Planner and Address list with Outlook
on a PC and version KeySoft 8, it is necessary to install KeySync 4, an
updated version of KeySync. Download KeySyncSetup.exe from our KeySoft
8.0 web page and install on your PC according to the built-in
installation procedures.

* On BT models, the ink print inclusion command Backspace with Enter
with C in KeyWord has been changed to Backspace with Enter with J.
Backspace with Enter with C is now the global command to access the
KeyChat menu.

* On QT models, Function with C has changed from Unicode macro to the
global key to access KeyChat menu.The command for Unicode macro is now
Shift with Function with C.

* In Daisy books the "Where am I" information (Space with 1-5-6 or Read
with Q) now gives a list of information. Previously the information
would all be spoken at once.

* The Virtual Memory (VM) is now monitored. When the virtual memory
falls below 3%, the user receives a warning message. 3% free is 1MB of
the 32MB total available. Best practices for usage with low VM:

1. Eloquence uses substantially more VM than KeyNote Gold. If something
cannot be achieved because of the VM limitations, switching to KGM is
likely to improve that dramatically.



2. Once you have entered KeyWeb, and even if you exit, the virtual
memory will have taken a "big hit" as a part of the IE system stays
loaded. Therefore, if possible, it could help to do a reset after
finishing a web browsing session before doing anything that is memory
intensive. For example, download all your books from Bookshare, reset,
then read your books.

* A double chime is now heard after performing a Reset (Reset + 123 on
mPower BT and PK and Reset + sdf on mPower QT). This is used to
distinguish from the beeps heard after a hard reset (Reset + 456 or
jkl).



Near the bottom of the KeySoft 8.0 Web page you will find headings and
links for



Release Note KeySoft 8.0



KeySoft 8.0 Frequently Asked Questions



Product Key Download



BrailNote mPower Upgrade

KeySoft 8.0 mPower Upgrade Instructions

KeySoft 8.0 mPower Download

mPower Bootloader Download

Zip files for KeySoft 8.0 mPower



BrailleNote PK Upgrade

KeySoft 8.0 PK Upgrade Instructions

KeySoft 8.0 BrailleNote PK Download

BrailleNote PK Upgrader

BrailleNote PK GPS

Zip files for KeySoft 8.0 BrailleNote PK



KeySync 4



________________



Maurice Sloane

HumanWare NZ



Phone: +64 3 384 4555

Direct Dial +64 3 940 2223

Mobile: +64 21 528 374

Email: maurice.sloane at humanware.com
<mailto:maurice.sloane at humanware.com>

Website: www.humanware.com






__________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus 
signature database 4283 (20090727) __________

The message was checked by ESET Smart Security.

http://www.eset.com
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From jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com  Tue Jul 28 10:37:15 2009
From: jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com (Jess)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 06:37:15 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Minilab... The never-ending battle
In-Reply-To: <A8362FFAFE1542A0955A1FF10467BA11@usore540475a8f>
References: <542FA720-ED78-40BF-B56D-4E0830BF77E3@gmail.com><423e6e460907271717m720db370obe751ce51bef81b0@mail.gmail.com>	<F7CD5345-222A-4A07-A6D7-C45291F6AFD8@gmail.com>
	<A8362FFAFE1542A0955A1FF10467BA11@usore540475a8f>
Message-ID: <4a6ed50b.47c2f10a.4f43.3aa9@mx.google.com>

Kevin.
I disagree with you. I attended SLCC for almost two years and I thought
their Disability Resource Center was wonderful. On the flip side though I
attended the Community College of Vermont and I wasn't really impressed with
their disability services office. Also, I was spoiled by going to a decent
sized community college the first time I went to college. And, I had another
opportunity to attend another decent sized community college when I moved to
Northeastern New York and I also had the same experience as noted above when
I attended SLCC. They Jokingly call the Hudson Valley Community College the
Harvard on the Hudson River.  Because the city of Troy where it's located is
on the Hudson River. 

Clinton,
I'm sorry I can't be of any assistance to you because I never took any
online classes when I attended SLCC. I did pretty much all my classes on
campus. Unfortunately, that is the only thing that comes to mind that you
might have to do. Because especially Freedom Scientific has a lousy track
record of making needed improvements to JAWS so these online systems like
Blackboard and myitlab work with their software correctly. We had a friend
whom before he worked for FS that attended a two year college in Augusta
Georgia where he's from and he was having  a lot of problems with using
Blackboard with JFW.  So what I would do is contact both FS and G!W Micro
tech support and see if they might be willing to make the required to make
the myitlab online system work with both JFW and Window Eyes. Good Luck 

Jessica

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Kevin Wassmer
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 9:47 PM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Myitlab... The never-ending battle

Call Ron Gardner. He could advacat a reader for  you. I am glad I went to 
SUU. They had a great DRC there. It made the DRC at SLCC look bad.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "clinton waterbury" <clinton.waterbury at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 7:28 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Myitlab... The never-ending battle


> I've tried having them e-mail the assignments but the response I got  was 
> something along the lines of Oh...  We can't get the tests from  myitlab, 
> and the reader thing I also talked to my adviser about and  they for some 
> reason determined that a reader would not be appropriate  for me, and that

> I should just go to the computer lab at the drc, so  that's when I figured

> test it with safari and voiceover, and that's  when I got the same results

> that I did with jaws.
> They then tried putting window-eyes on the computer at school, and I 
> could arrow down the page, but someone would still end up having to  click

> the buttons to go to the next questions, so now I'm fighting to  get jaws 
> 9 back on the system, and I'm starting to wonder what the  point of it is,

> as I get the same results described in my initial  message.
> On Jul 27, 2009, at 6:17 PM, Domonique Lawless wrote:
>
>> Hi Clinton,
>> Maybe you can have your teachers e-mail you a word document with the
>> test in it. This way you can independently take your exams. If that
>> doesn't work out then see if the teacher can help you find a reader in
>> that particular department.
>>
>> Hope this helps,
>> Domonique
>>
>> On 7/27/09, clinton waterbury <clinton.waterbury at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Hello all.
>>> I am having an issue with a website/piece of software called myitlab
>>> that my school uses for submitting assignments and tests.
>>> I can get as far as being able to answer all the questions on a test,
>>> but then the submition issue happens.
>>> I can't even use keystrokes in jaws, window-eyes, and even voiceover
>>> on the mac of all things to click on the finish button on the
>>> webpage.  I have to have someone come over and click my mouse for me
>>> no matter what computer I am on.  The major issues I see with this  are
>>> 1, lack of being able to be independant with my own school work, and
>>> 2, not having a way to have someone come over to the computer and
>>> click the mouse to get it to submit.
>>> Any Thoughts?  All input would be greatly apprieciated.
>>> Thanks.
>>> Clinton.
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dlawless86%40gmail.c
om
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info  for 
>> nabs-l:
>>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clinton.waterbury%40
gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/commanderlumpy2003%4
0earthlink.net
> 


_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan
%40gmail.com



From dandrews at visi.com  Tue Jul 28 11:25:13 2009
From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 06:25:13 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: [nfbmi-talk] Braille music resources
In-Reply-To: <SNT105-W100F69DCD50E7910329A1AA1150@phx.gbl>
References: <1217875258.5682111248724604931.JavaMail.root@sz0144a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<SNT105-W100F69DCD50E7910329A1AA1150@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <auto-000109432136@mailfront1.g2host.com>

While you make a good point that people should 
check with the originator before recirculating 
information, the other side of it is that you 
posted to a public list, that is archived, and 
searchable via google and everybody else.  Any 
message posted on any public list can always take 
on a life of its own, so you should never post 
personal information unless you want it to be public.

Dave

At 08:25 PM 7/27/2009, you wrote:

>Hello everyone,
>
>I originally posted this message only on the 
>Michigan listserv since we are looking for 
>resources in the Michigan area.  Please do not 
>contact me unless you have any useful 
>information we could use in Michigan for my 
>sister to learn Braille music.  A note for those 
>who forward personal messages from other lists, 
>I hope you contact the person who originally 
>posted the message to make sure that it is okay 
>that the message can be forwarded on as it 
>appears.  I did not intend for my message to 
>extend past the Michigan listserv.
>
>Thanks,
>Diana Mohnke
>
>
> > Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2009 19:56:44 +0000
> > From: amylsabo at comcast.net
> > To: PERFORM-TALK at NFBNET.ORG
> > CC: NABS-L at NFBNET.ORG
> > Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: [nfbmi-talk] Braille music resources
> >
> > hello all,
> >
> > i'm forwarding to you all a message in 
> regards to finding resources or ideas for 
> braille music.. pleasse read the note for more 
> information. take care all and i will talk to you all soon!
> >
> >
> > hugs,
> > from amy
> >
> > ----- Forwarded Message -----
> >
> > From: Diana Mohnke
> >
> > To: nfbmi-talk at nfbnet.org
> >
> > Sent: Sun, 26 Jul 2009 22:09:03 +0000 (UTC)
> >
> > Subject: [nfbmi-talk] Braille music resources
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Hello,
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Does anyone here know of anyone in Michigan 
> who teaches Braille music? Kim has been learning Braille music from an elderly
> >
> > woman in Lansing
> >
> > who has recently become ill. It would be
> >
> > preferable to have someone from the Lansing
> >
> > area but all resources are welcomed. Feel
> >
> > free to contact me at d_mohnke18 at yahoo.com
> >
> > or by phone at 989-640-3171.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> >
> >
> > Diana
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> >
> > nfbmi-talk mailing list
> >
> > nfbmi-talk at nfbnet.org
> >
> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbmi-talk_nfbnet.org
> >
> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or 
> get your account info for nfbmi-talk:
> >
> > 
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbmi-talk_nfbnet.org/amylsabo%40comcast.net
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > nabs-l mailing list
> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or 
> get your account info for nabs-l:
> > 
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mohnked%40hotmail.com
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>Windows Live™ Hotmail®: Search, add, and share 
>the web’s latest sports videos. Check it out.
>http://www.windowslive.com/Online/Hotmail/Campaign/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_QA_HM_sports_videos_072009&cat=sports
>_______________________________________________
>nabs-l mailing list
>nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dandrews%40visi.com
>
>
>__________ Information from ESET Smart Security, 
>version of virus signature database 4283 (20090727) __________
>
>The message was checked by ESET Smart Security.
>
>http://www.eset.com



From clinton.waterbury at gmail.com  Tue Jul 28 12:12:24 2009
From: clinton.waterbury at gmail.com (clinton waterbury)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 06:12:24 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Minilab... The never-ending battle
In-Reply-To: <4a6ed50b.47c2f10a.4f43.3aa9@mx.google.com>
References: <542FA720-ED78-40BF-B56D-4E0830BF77E3@gmail.com><423e6e460907271717m720db370obe751ce51bef81b0@mail.gmail.com>	<F7CD5345-222A-4A07-A6D7-C45291F6AFD8@gmail.com>
	<A8362FFAFE1542A0955A1FF10467BA11@usore540475a8f>
	<4a6ed50b.47c2f10a.4f43.3aa9@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <AEC4FCEE-4AEB-4D9B-99C0-52F8C49AE303@gmail.com>

Jess.
I'm taking all the classes on campus, and they still won't really help  
out with things much.
On Jul 28, 2009, at 4:37 AM, Jess wrote:

> Kevin.
> I disagree with you. I attended SLCC for almost two years and I  
> thought
> their Disability Resource Center was wonderful. On the flip side  
> though I
> attended the Community College of Vermont and I wasn't really  
> impressed with
> their disability services office. Also, I was spoiled by going to a  
> decent
> sized community college the first time I went to college. And, I had  
> another
> opportunity to attend another decent sized community college when I  
> moved to
> Northeastern New York and I also had the same experience as noted  
> above when
> I attended SLCC. They Jokingly call the Hudson Valley Community  
> College the
> Harvard on the Hudson River.  Because the city of Troy where it's  
> located is
> on the Hudson River.
>
> Clinton,
> I'm sorry I can't be of any assistance to you because I never took any
> online classes when I attended SLCC. I did pretty much all my  
> classes on
> campus. Unfortunately, that is the only thing that comes to mind  
> that you
> might have to do. Because especially Freedom Scientific has a lousy  
> track
> record of making needed improvements to JAWS so these online systems  
> like
> Blackboard and myitlab work with their software correctly. We had a  
> friend
> whom before he worked for FS that attended a two year college in  
> Augusta
> Georgia where he's from and he was having  a lot of problems with  
> using
> Blackboard with JFW.  So what I would do is contact both FS and G!W  
> Micro
> tech support and see if they might be willing to make the required  
> to make
> the myitlab online system work with both JFW and Window Eyes. Good  
> Luck
>
> Jessica
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]  
> On Behalf
> Of Kevin Wassmer
> Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 9:47 PM
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Myitlab... The never-ending battle
>
> Call Ron Gardner. He could advacat a reader for  you. I am glad I  
> went to
> SUU. They had a great DRC there. It made the DRC at SLCC look bad.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "clinton waterbury" <clinton.waterbury at gmail.com>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 7:28 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Myitlab... The never-ending battle
>
>
>> I've tried having them e-mail the assignments but the response I  
>> got  was
>> something along the lines of Oh...  We can't get the tests from   
>> myitlab,
>> and the reader thing I also talked to my adviser about and  they  
>> for some
>> reason determined that a reader would not be appropriate  for me,  
>> and that
>
>> I should just go to the computer lab at the drc, so  that's when I  
>> figured
>
>> test it with safari and voiceover, and that's  when I got the same  
>> results
>
>> that I did with jaws.
>> They then tried putting window-eyes on the computer at school, and I
>> could arrow down the page, but someone would still end up having  
>> to  click
>
>> the buttons to go to the next questions, so now I'm fighting to   
>> get jaws
>> 9 back on the system, and I'm starting to wonder what the  point of  
>> it is,
>
>> as I get the same results described in my initial  message.
>> On Jul 27, 2009, at 6:17 PM, Domonique Lawless wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Clinton,
>>> Maybe you can have your teachers e-mail you a word document with the
>>> test in it. This way you can independently take your exams. If that
>>> doesn't work out then see if the teacher can help you find a  
>>> reader in
>>> that particular department.
>>>
>>> Hope this helps,
>>> Domonique
>>>
>>> On 7/27/09, clinton waterbury <clinton.waterbury at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Hello all.
>>>> I am having an issue with a website/piece of software called  
>>>> myitlab
>>>> that my school uses for submitting assignments and tests.
>>>> I can get as far as being able to answer all the questions on a  
>>>> test,
>>>> but then the submition issue happens.
>>>> I can't even use keystrokes in jaws, window-eyes, and even  
>>>> voiceover
>>>> on the mac of all things to click on the finish button on the
>>>> webpage.  I have to have someone come over and click my mouse for  
>>>> me
>>>> no matter what computer I am on.  The major issues I see with  
>>>> this  are
>>>> 1, lack of being able to be independant with my own school work,  
>>>> and
>>>> 2, not having a way to have someone come over to the computer and
>>>> click the mouse to get it to submit.
>>>> Any Thoughts?  All input would be greatly apprieciated.
>>>> Thanks.
>>>> Clinton.
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info  
>>>> for
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dlawless86%40gmail.c
> om
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info   
>>> for
>>> nabs-l:
>>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clinton.waterbury%40
> gmail.com
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/commanderlumpy2003 
> %4
> 0earthlink.net
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessica.trask.reagan
> %40gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info  
> for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clinton.waterbury%40gmail.com



From jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com  Tue Jul 28 15:55:21 2009
From: jessica.trask.reagan at gmail.com (Jess)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 11:55:21 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Minilab... The never-ending battle
In-Reply-To: <AEC4FCEE-4AEB-4D9B-99C0-52F8C49AE303@gmail.com>
References: <542FA720-ED78-40BF-B56D-4E0830BF77E3@gmail.com><423e6e460907271717m720db370obe751ce51bef81b0@mail.gmail.com>	<F7CD5345-222A-4A07-A6D7-C45291F6AFD8@gmail.com>	<A8362FFAFE1542A0955A1FF10467BA11@usore540475a8f>	<4a6ed50b.47c2f10a.4f43.3aa9@mx.google.com>
	<AEC4FCEE-4AEB-4D9B-99C0-52F8C49AE303@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4a6f1f9c.1cba720a.6efb.ffffdb2c@mx.google.com>

Clinton,
Are your professors posting their items online? If this is the case then
have you tried talking to them and telling them the myitlab software isn't
accessible for someone is totally blind students. If you tell them that they
may be willing to accommodate you with the items through email or in print
so that you can scan them in the computer. Telina, doesn't have any other
ideas on needs to be done? I only say that because the first year I was
attending SLCC she was doing the technology stuff pretty much. Like I said
earlier I might be a good idea to contact both tech support for both FS and
GW Micro because they may be willing to work with you and the publisher to
make it accessible for future blind students. Because I have a feeling that
it's something  a problem with something in the programming language in JAWS
and I Window Eyes. Have you tried downloading a thirty day demo of System
Access to see if you run into the same problem using SA that you are having
with both JFW and Window Eyes?
Jessica

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of clinton waterbury
Sent: Tuesday, July 28, 2009 8:12 AM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Minilab... The never-ending battle

Jess.
I'm taking all the classes on campus, and they still won't really help  
out with things much.
On Jul 28, 2009, at 4:37 AM, Jess wrote:

> Kevin.
> I disagree with you. I attended SLCC for almost two years and I  
> thought
> their Disability Resource Center was wonderful. On the flip side  
> though I
> attended the Community College of Vermont and I wasn't really  
> impressed with
> their disability services office. Also, I was spoiled by going to a  
> decent
> sized community college the first time I went to college. And, I had  
> another
> opportunity to attend another decent sized community college when I  
> moved to
> Northeastern New York and I also had the same experience as noted  
> above when
> I attended SLCC. They Jokingly call the Hudson Valley Community  
> College the
> Harvard on the Hudson River.  Because the city of Troy where it's  
> located is
> on the Hudson River.
>
> Clinton,
> I'm sorry I can't be of any assistance to you because I never took any
> online classes when I attended SLCC. I did pretty much all my  
> classes on
> campus. Unfortunately, that is the only thing that comes to mind  
> that you
> might have to do. Because especially Freedom Scientific has a lousy  
> track
> record of making needed improvements to JAWS so these online systems  
> like
> Blackboard and myitlab work with their software correctly. We had a  
> friend
> whom before he worked for FS that attended a two year college in  
> Augusta
> Georgia where he's from and he was having  a lot of problems with  
> using
> Blackboard with JFW.  So what I would do is contact both FS and G!W  
> Micro
> tech support and see if they might be willing to make the required  
> to make
> the myitlab online system work with both JFW and Window Eyes. Good  
> Luck
>
> Jessica
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]  
> On Behalf
> Of Kevin Wassmer
> Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 9:47 PM
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Myitlab... The never-ending battle
>
> Call Ron Gardner. He could advacat a reader for  you. I am glad I  
> went to
> SUU. They had a great DRC there. It made the DRC at SLCC look bad.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "clinton waterbury" <clinton.waterbury at gmail.com>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 7:28 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Myitlab... The never-ending battle
>
>
>> I've tried having them e-mail the assignments but the response I  
>> got  was
>> something along the lines of Oh...  We can't get the tests from   
>> myitlab,
>> and the reader thing I also talked to my adviser about and  they  
>> for some
>> reason determined that a reader would not be appropriate  for me,  
>> and that
>
>> I should just go to the computer lab at the drc, so  that's when I  
>> figured
>
>> test it with safari and voiceover, and that's  when I got the same  
>> results
>
>> that I did with jaws.
>> They then tried putting window-eyes on the computer at school, and I
>> could arrow down the page, but someone would still end up having  
>> to  click
>
>> the buttons to go to the next questions, so now I'm fighting to   
>> get jaws
>> 9 back on the system, and I'm starting to wonder what the  point of  
>> it is,
>
>> as I get the same results described in my initial  message.
>> On Jul 27, 2009, at 6:17 PM, Domonique Lawless wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Clinton,
>>> Maybe you can have your teachers e-mail you a word document with the
>>> test in it. This way you can independently take your exams. If that
>>> doesn't work out then see if the teacher can help you find a  
>>> reader in
>>> that particular department.
>>>
>>> Hope this helps,
>>> Domonique
>>>
>>> On 7/27/09, clinton waterbury <clinton.waterbury at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Hello all.
>>>> I am having an issue with a website/piece of software called  
>>>> myitlab
>>>> that my school uses for submitting assignments and tests.
>>>> I can get as far as being able to answer all the questions on a  
>>>> test,
>>>> but then the submition issue happens.
>>>> I can't even use keystrokes in jaws, window-eyes, and even  
>>>> voiceover
>>>> on the mac of all things to click on the finish button on the
>>>> webpage.  I have to have someone come over and click my mouse for  
>>>> me
>>>> no matter what computer I am on.  The major issues I see with  
>>>> this  are
>>>> 1, lack of being able to be independant with my own school work,  
>>>> and
>>>> 2, not having a way to have someone come over to the computer and
>>>> click the mouse to get it to submit.
>>>> Any Thoughts?  All input would be greatly apprieciated.
>>>> Thanks.
>>>> Clinton.
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info  
>>>> for
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dlawless86%40gmail.c
> om
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info   
>>> for
>>> nabs-l:
>>>
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clinton.waterbury%40
> gmail.com
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>>
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> %4
> 0earthlink.net
>>
>
>
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%40gmail.com



From jmassay1 at cox.net  Tue Jul 28 16:08:57 2009
From: jmassay1 at cox.net (JMassay)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 11:08:57 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] FW: testing accomidation question
Message-ID: <187561387D6542D896FC50AC808539B1@MERLIN>

Please post to list for Jim Reed. Thanks,

Jeannie 

 

  _____  

From: Jim Reed [mailto:jim275_2 at yahoo.com] 
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 7:51 PM
To: jmassay1 at cox.net
Subject: testing accomidation question

 


Jeannie, 

I need to ask the NABS list an importiant question, but I am no longer on
it. thus I can't post to the list. Are you on the NABS list? If so, could
you post the following question for me? As I am not on the list, please have
people reply directly back to me at jim275_2 at yahoo.com. 

Thanks, 
Jim

Let me preface the following question by saying that I assume the reason my
DSS office gives me extra time (time and a half) to take a test is because
some blind people take longer to read and write than their blind or sighted
counterparts. 

That said, I had several take home final exams last semester that were all
given and due at roughly the same time, so I asked DSS for extra time, and I
was denied. It says on mu DSS card that I am approved for extra time for
taking test, yet the DSS office said that extra time does not apply to take
home exams. Isn't a take home exam still a test?

Anyhow, moving on...

In January, 2010, I will have to take a comprehensive final exam covering
all of my graduate classes. The way the exam works is that I will be given
the exam questions one week prior to the exam date,  then, I have that one
week to prepaire an outline of my response, and then, I  take the test. This
is not quite the same thing as a take home exam because what you turn in as
your exam is acctually written at the testing location, not at home.  I
don't believe there is a time limit for this exam, but if there is, I know I
will get extra time.

I am worried about the week I will have to prepair my answers for the exam;
I don't know that I will be physically able to review as much as I will need
to, or to work as many hours as I will need to without my eyes giving out.
With the exception of this semester's textbooks, all of my review materials
(textbooks, exams, notes, handouts, etc.) will be in print format; that's a
lot of readiing for eyes that like to get tired. During last semester's
final exam week, I was often forced to stop working sooner than I intended
to because I became unable to read or see the computer, regardless of the
magnification I used.

As I already mentioned, DSS denied my last request for extra time on a take
home exam, so, I expect that they will do the same for my comprehensive
exam.  I fear I will need the extra time to prepair, and not be able to get
it. How can I make sure I get the extra time I need? 

As I am no longer subscribed to the NABS list, please email responses
directlly to me at jim275_2 at yahoo.com.

Thanks, 
Jim Reed

"A hundred times every day I remind myself that my inner and outer life
depend on the labors of other men, living and dead, and that I must exert
myself in order to give in the same measure as I have received and am still
receiving." - Albert Einstein





 


From pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net  Tue Jul 28 19:36:08 2009
From: pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net (Peter Donahue)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 14:36:08 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Youth SLAM Blog and Twitter
Message-ID: <016601ca0fba$a9076bd0$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn>

Good afternoon everyone,

    For those interested in the goings on at the second NFB Youth SLAM you 
can keep up with the latest happenings by following the NFB Youth SLAM on 
Twitter, or by visiting the NFB Youth SLAM blog to read student accounts of 
their experiences at this great activity. Their URLS art listed below:

Follow the 2009 National Federation of the Blind Youth SLAM on Twitter at:
http://www.twitter.com/nfbyouthslam

        Visit the2009 NFB Youth SLAM Blog at:
http://www.nfbyouthslam.org

    Happy slamming.

Peter Donahue

 "Will you come and awake our lost land from its slumber
      And her fetters we'll break, links that long are encumbered.
      And the air will resound with hosannas to greet you
      On the shore will be found gallant Irishmen to greet you."
Will You Come to the Bower
Traditional Irish Folk Song



From pajohns1 at vt.edu  Tue Jul 28 20:06:51 2009
From: pajohns1 at vt.edu (pajohns1 at vt.edu)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 16:06:51 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] FW: testing accomidation question
References: <187561387D6542D896FC50AC808539B1@MERLIN>
Message-ID: <95714EB2B6E143BFBE63DCE2853A314E@useripvq7z5u3t>

Jim,

        I hope folks post their responses to the list and include Jim in the
cc.  I wonder why extra-time is needed on a take home comprehensive exam.
As a graduate student it is my responsibility to be able to quickly recall 
large amounts of data quickly and accurately.  To do this I spent many long 
hours organizing and rewriting notes in the process developing a system to 
quickly locate related data.  This is time intensive and often quite frankly 
was boring beyond belief.  It required sacrifices, but what really is more 
important than passing one's comps or final exam??  For me at least all the 
long hours paid off in that by the time I saw my comp questions I already 
had a basic answer planned and could spend my time finding supporting 
material and citations.

        Since the comprehensive exam covers material already covered in 
previous courses I strongly suspect a fair number of hints have been dropped 
on what is and what isn't important.  Also, there is the grapevine of 
students who have already taken and passed the exam.  Ask them about the 
nature and type of questions to be asked.  I'd even go so far as to ask the 
profs for suggestions on what to focus on in my preparation.

        It has been my experience having successfully passed three 
comprehensive exams that my profs wanted to ensure I knew the material and 
fairly acess me on the topics covered.  They never asked a question which 
hadn't been extensively covered in one of my core courses.

        Grad school is hard, no question about it, and it is even harder 
being blind, but it is by no means impossible.  Buckle down, start early, 
and study hard.  It can be done, there are enough of us on this list with 
multiple advanced degrees to prove it.

Patrick

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "JMassay" <jmassay1 at cox.net>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, July 28, 2009 12:08 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] FW: testing accomidation question


> Please post to list for Jim Reed. Thanks,
>
> Jeannie
>
>
>
>  _____
>
> From: Jim Reed [mailto:jim275_2 at yahoo.com]
> Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 7:51 PM
> To: jmassay1 at cox.net
> Subject: testing accomidation question
>
>
>
>
> Jeannie,
>
> I need to ask the NABS list an importiant question, but I am no longer on
> it. thus I can't post to the list. Are you on the NABS list? If so, could
> you post the following question for me? As I am not on the list, please
> have
> people reply directly back to me at jim275_2 at yahoo.com.
>
> Thanks,
> Jim
>
> Let me preface the following question by saying that I assume the reason
> my
> DSS office gives me extra time (time and a half) to take a test is because
> some blind people take longer to read and write than their blind or
> sighted
> counterparts.
>
> That said, I had several take home final exams last semester that were all
> given and due at roughly the same time, so I asked DSS for extra time, and
> I
> was denied. It says on mu DSS card that I am approved for extra time for
> taking test, yet the DSS office said that extra time does not apply to
> take
> home exams. Isn't a take home exam still a test?
>
> Anyhow, moving on...
>
> In January, 2010, I will have to take a comprehensive final exam covering
> all of my graduate classes. The way the exam works is that I will be given
> the exam questions one week prior to the exam date,  then, I have that one
> week to prepaire an outline of my response, and then, I  take the test.
> This
> is not quite the same thing as a take home exam because what you turn in
> as
> your exam is acctually written at the testing location, not at home.  I
> don't believe there is a time limit for this exam, but if there is, I know
> I
> will get extra time.
>
> I am worried about the week I will have to prepair my answers for the
> exam;
> I don't know that I will be physically able to review as much as I will
> need
> to, or to work as many hours as I will need to without my eyes giving out.
> With the exception of this semester's textbooks, all of my review
> materials
> (textbooks, exams, notes, handouts, etc.) will be in print format; that's
> a
> lot of readiing for eyes that like to get tired. During last semester's
> final exam week, I was often forced to stop working sooner than I intended
> to because I became unable to read or see the computer, regardless of the
> magnification I used.
>
> As I already mentioned, DSS denied my last request for extra time on a
> take
> home exam, so, I expect that they will do the same for my comprehensive
> exam.  I fear I will need the extra time to prepair, and not be able to
> get
> it. How can I make sure I get the extra time I need?
>
> As I am no longer subscribed to the NABS list, please email responses
> directlly to me at jim275_2 at yahoo.com.
>
> Thanks,
> Jim Reed
>
> "A hundred times every day I remind myself that my inner and outer life
> depend on the labors of other men, living and dead, and that I must exert
> myself in order to give in the same measure as I have received and am
> still
> receiving." - Albert Einstein
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pajohns1%40vt.edu



From snowball07 at gmail.com  Wed Jul 29 00:40:05 2009
From: snowball07 at gmail.com (Janice)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 19:40:05 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Meeting Minutes
References: <006EDC836FE84119AE83070E18550163@your0d10610b06>
	<2D892AA5BB634FF48574BCA6015EEEF8@nbp2.local>
Message-ID: <32ABDB9638F84FD2B3E8310F4B43F0E9@your0d10610b06>

    Hello Antonio,

I will be sure to pass the message along to our webmaster(and the co-chairs 
of the committee in charge). I am sure they will be much obliged. I believe 
such plans are already in the works. Thank you for your thoughts and 
suggestions. Keep the good ideas flowing!

Kindest Regards,

Janice Jeang
Secretary
National Association of Blind Students
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Antonio Guimaraes" <aguimaraes at nbp.org>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 3:01 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Meeting Minutes


> Thank you for the minutes. Nice work. Couple of thoughts:
>
> Yes, membership is interested in reading board meetings minutes. I speak 
> for myself, but this would provide a chance to stay informed, involved, 
> and for the board to be accountable to the membership.
>
> Yes, I would like to see the minutes archived on the site.
>
> thank you for your diligent work, and keep up the work.
>
> Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr.
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Janice" <snowball07 at gmail.com>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 11:21 AM
> Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Meeting Minutes
>
>
> Hey Nabsters,
>
> Attached to this email, as a word file, is the first meting minutes for 
> our new NABS administration. This is the NABS board's attempt at keeping 
> "you" the student, informed. I am quite excited that I get to post up my 
> minutes and be the humble messenger. BE nice- *smile*
> I sincerely apologize for the tardiness of the minutes being released.  I 
> was extraordinary ill after National Convention, and it looked like I was 
> getting better for a bit. However, the flu/ fever has taken a turn for the 
> worse again. Nothing super serious, but just enough to keep me some what 
> unbalanced. Anyways, enough of my rambling. Here they are: enjoy!
>
> Kindest Regards,
>
> Janice Jeang
> Secretary
> national Association of Blind Students
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/aguimaraes%40nbp.org
>>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/snowball07%40gmail.com 



From pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net  Wed Jul 29 02:03:32 2009
From: pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net (Peter Donahue)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 21:03:32 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Breaking Web Site Bottlenecks
References: <006EDC836FE84119AE83070E18550163@your0d10610b06><2D892AA5BB634FF48574BCA6015EEEF8@nbp2.local>
	<32ABDB9638F84FD2B3E8310F4B43F0E9@your0d10610b06>
Message-ID: <000501ca0ff0$c739c4a0$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn>

Hello Janice and listers,

    And require the secretary or anyone who produces material for the Web 
site to mark up their own pages for posting to the site. Our chapter is all 
ready doing that. It goes a long way to breaking  Web Site maintenance 
bottlenecks and will challenge these individuals to learn anew skill; one 
they thought was beyond them or they weren't smart enough to grasp. Once you 
get the hang of marking up Web pages it eventually becomes second-nature. 
It's more food for thought.

Peter Donahue

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Janice" <snowball07 at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, July 28, 2009 7:40 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Meeting Minutes


    Hello Antonio,

I will be sure to pass the message along to our webmaster(and the co-chairs
of the committee in charge). I am sure they will be much obliged. I believe
such plans are already in the works. Thank you for your thoughts and
suggestions. Keep the good ideas flowing!

Kindest Regards,

Janice Jeang
Secretary
National Association of Blind Students
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Antonio Guimaraes" <aguimaraes at nbp.org>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 3:01 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Meeting Minutes


> Thank you for the minutes. Nice work. Couple of thoughts:
>
> Yes, membership is interested in reading board meetings minutes. I speak
> for myself, but this would provide a chance to stay informed, involved,
> and for the board to be accountable to the membership.
>
> Yes, I would like to see the minutes archived on the site.
>
> thank you for your diligent work, and keep up the work.
>
> Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr.
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Janice" <snowball07 at gmail.com>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 11:21 AM
> Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Meeting Minutes
>
>
> Hey Nabsters,
>
> Attached to this email, as a word file, is the first meting minutes for
> our new NABS administration. This is the NABS board's attempt at keeping
> "you" the student, informed. I am quite excited that I get to post up my
> minutes and be the humble messenger. BE nice- *smile*
> I sincerely apologize for the tardiness of the minutes being released.  I
> was extraordinary ill after National Convention, and it looked like I was
> getting better for a bit. However, the flu/ fever has taken a turn for the
> worse again. Nothing super serious, but just enough to keep me some what
> unbalanced. Anyways, enough of my rambling. Here they are: enjoy!
>
> Kindest Regards,
>
> Janice Jeang
> Secretary
> national Association of Blind Students
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/aguimaraes%40nbp.org
>>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/snowball07%40gmail.com


_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pdonahue1%40sbcglobal.net 



From trev.saunders at gmail.com  Wed Jul 29 02:22:23 2009
From: trev.saunders at gmail.com (Trevor Saunders)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 22:22:23 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Breaking Web Site Bottlenecks
In-Reply-To: <000501ca0ff0$c739c4a0$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn>
References: <006EDC836FE84119AE83070E18550163@your0d10610b06><2D892AA5BB634FF48574BCA6015EEEF8@nbp2.local>
	<32ABDB9638F84FD2B3E8310F4B43F0E9@your0d10610b06>
	<000501ca0ff0$c739c4a0$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn>
Message-ID: <E1MVyoB-00084V-U7@tbsaunde>

Hi,

once you learn how to marking up text as you write it can be faster and in some
sense more accessible than fiddling with fonts and sizes etc.
Another option if everyone can make it work well for them is to use wiki style
markup which is somewhat simpler than html.

Trev


From bookwormahb at earthlink.net  Wed Jul 29 03:29:36 2009
From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley  Bramlett)
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 23:29:36 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] FW: testing accomidation question
References: <187561387D6542D896FC50AC808539B1@MERLIN>
Message-ID: <9152887DF50D41E18BE5698526CEF7CC@Ashley>

Hi all,
Please post to the list and copy Jim.  Jim raised good questions.  These are 
questions I ponder too since I may attend grad school later.  I just 
graduated in May with a BA from Marymount.
Two questions you asked are:
1. Should you get extra time for a take home exam?
2. What are the best ways to review and study for such a mass amount of 
information tested on only in a week?

I agree with Patrick.  With preparation and organization you may not need 
extra time.  I also got time and a half or double time on exams in college. 
They assumed i needed extra time to take it orally; I took it by using a 
reader or listening to jaws doing it electronically.  To me this leveled the 
playing field because I need things repeated; its not like reading braille 
and listening is very different and for me takes more time and effort.
I only had a couple take home exams here and there and I requested extra 
time from the prof for one of them and got it.  Some may disagree because of 
philosophy.  I decided I needed it because the book was only recorded by rfb 
and I did not have many notes to review from reading; I did not do that as I 
typically do since the prof relied more on the lecture than the book.  Thus 
by taking notes from the text I felt I was wasting my time.  So I needed a 
reader to assist me and my readers were doing their own work at that time. 
Other students were skimming and using the index to look up key concepts for 
the answers.  Since I needed a reader and even with like four readers I was 
working on their schedule too I chose to have extended time.

But a comprehensive final exam for grad school is different.  You said your 
notes, handouts etc are in print.  You said your eyes were getting tired for 
preping for your past exams.  I have some vision too but it wasn't enough to 
read with magnification.  So I learned braille and accessed my books through 
rfb at a young age.  Jim I suggest you use alternative techniques so you can 
give your eyes a rest.  How about getting some textbooks through RFB if 
available.  I assume you use Zoomtext on the computer.  Why not use the 
speech that comes with Zoomtext?  Another idea is to get jaws or a screen 
reader and you can switch between auditory and visual methods then.  Do you 
have a scanner?  If so scanning programs: Openbook and Kirzweil have great 
low vision and speech features.  For instance you can change the contrast, 
size, and color of text.

I hope others can give better suggestions for preping for a final exam like 
this using alternative techniques.  I don't have a perfect solution either. 
I always found take home tests harder since the others could skim anything 
and find answers where as I relied on lecture notes from the prof like 
powerpoints, handouts and my own notes.

Here is what I did and suggest.  The key is advanced preparation.

1. Organize your notes.  For me I did it by chapters.  Although for a 
comprehensive final you'd want something more concise.

2. Mark important pages in your text you may refer to.  Highlighting works 
if you see it.  Also post it notes or paper clips work too.  Then with your 
own eyes or a reader review that information.

3. Patrick said this one and #4 too. Ask other students about the types of 
questions from past experiences.

4. Your profs want you to succeed.  So ask questions what to focus on.  I 
did this for tests and it worked great.  I went to their office hours and 
they were glad I was interested in the class and I got them to give hints on 
what to study for.
I don't know if they have office hours for grad school, but if so, use them 
since profs like to see you're working hard and have questions for them.

5. Since you'll have the questions in advance, form a study group or get a 
study partner.  Although i did not have the exact questions, i had a study 
guide and this helped me usually.  We exchanged what we knew and together 
formed a larger picture.

6. Even though you may get the questions only a week in advance, you can 
prep before hand.  For a big final I studied several weeks ahead of time.  I 
realize a comprehensive test is much much larger, but if possible make more 
time.  I took several chapters and reviewed the key points.  I broke my 
study sessions up to avoid burnout but after a while I was fatiguing.  Maybe 
make a schedule as to what you study so you have a systematic way to study 
it and don't neglect some areas.

You seem to be a visual learner.  Maybe try something auditory.  How about 
explaining the key points of the course on a digital recorder or cassette 
player.  Then replay it.  If you explain it in your own words you'll more 
likely remember it and repeating it makes it stick in your brain.  Your eyes 
can't fatigue using this study technique.

I hope it works out.

Ashley

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "JMassay" <jmassay1 at cox.net>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, July 28, 2009 12:08 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] FW: testing accomidation question


> Please post to list for Jim Reed. Thanks,
>
> Jeannie
>
>
>
>  _____
>
> From: Jim Reed [mailto:jim275_2 at yahoo.com]
> Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 7:51 PM
> To: jmassay1 at cox.net
> Subject: testing accomidation question
>
>
>
>
> Jeannie,
>
> I need to ask the NABS list an importiant question, but I am no longer on
> it. thus I can't post to the list. Are you on the NABS list? If so, could
> you post the following question for me? As I am not on the list, please 
> have
> people reply directly back to me at jim275_2 at yahoo.com.
>
> Thanks,
> Jim
>
> Let me preface the following question by saying that I assume the reason 
> my
> DSS office gives me extra time (time and a half) to take a test is because
> some blind people take longer to read and write than their blind or 
> sighted
> counterparts.
>
> That said, I had several take home final exams last semester that were all
> given and due at roughly the same time, so I asked DSS for extra time, and 
> I
> was denied. It says on mu DSS card that I am approved for extra time for
> taking test, yet the DSS office said that extra time does not apply to 
> take
> home exams. Isn't a take home exam still a test?
>
> Anyhow, moving on...
>
> In January, 2010, I will have to take a comprehensive final exam covering
> all of my graduate classes. The way the exam works is that I will be given
> the exam questions one week prior to the exam date,  then, I have that one
> week to prepaire an outline of my response, and then, I  take the test. 
> This
> is not quite the same thing as a take home exam because what you turn in 
> as
> your exam is acctually written at the testing location, not at home.  I
> don't believe there is a time limit for this exam, but if there is, I know 
> I
> will get extra time.
>
> I am worried about the week I will have to prepair my answers for the 
> exam;
> I don't know that I will be physically able to review as much as I will 
> need
> to, or to work as many hours as I will need to without my eyes giving out.
> With the exception of this semester's textbooks, all of my review 
> materials
> (textbooks, exams, notes, handouts, etc.) will be in print format; that's 
> a
> lot of readiing for eyes that like to get tired. During last semester's
> final exam week, I was often forced to stop working sooner than I intended
> to because I became unable to read or see the computer, regardless of the
> magnification I used.
>
> As I already mentioned, DSS denied my last request for extra time on a 
> take
> home exam, so, I expect that they will do the same for my comprehensive
> exam.  I fear I will need the extra time to prepair, and not be able to 
> get
> it. How can I make sure I get the extra time I need?
>
> As I am no longer subscribed to the NABS list, please email responses
> directlly to me at jim275_2 at yahoo.com.
>
> Thanks,
> Jim Reed
>
> "A hundred times every day I remind myself that my inner and outer life
> depend on the labors of other men, living and dead, and that I must exert
> myself in order to give in the same measure as I have received and am 
> still
> receiving." - Albert Einstein
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net
>
> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus 
> signature database 4286 (20090728) __________
>
> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>
> http://www.eset.com
>
>
> 



From aguimaraes at nbp.org  Wed Jul 29 20:36:10 2009
From: aguimaraes at nbp.org (Antonio Guimaraes)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 16:36:10 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] FWD: Project Hire:  Transition to Employment
Message-ID: <9A2CC8CB4F2F46C188F783B888FC7BE0@nbp2.local>

Hello friends, 

Just a reminder again that here at Mississippi State University we are initiating an exciting new opportunity for recent high school and college graduates and seniors who are blind or have low vision to be involved in an on-line intervention to enhance their employability.  We are recruiting almost 100 students from all over the country who will be involved for 8 weeks of supplemental activity in either September - November or January-February.  Students will be randomly assigned to a group, so we are hoping to get all our candidates lined up by September 1.  The purpose of the program is two-fold.  First, we are hoping it will be beneficial to the participants in preparing them to find employment, but it is also a research project to develop evidenced based practice which we hope will be replicable and available nationwide.

Attached are 2 email flyers about the program, one for college students and one for both high school and college students.  We can send braille and large print as well if anyone is interested.  Please post this on your office bulletin boards and help pass the word to interested students.  Students can sign up on line through our website at www.blind.msstate.edu .  Please contact me if you have any questions.  

Thanks for your help!

BJ

B. J. LeJeune, M.Ed,CRC, CVRT 
RRTC on Blindness and Low Vision
Mississippi State University
P. O. Box 6189
Mississippi State, MS  39762
bjlejeune at colled.msstate.edu 
662-325-2694

Attachment 1:

                     

Project HIRE:  New Opportunity for College Grads or Seniors who are Blind or Visually Impaired:  An Online Employment Preparation Program



 

Are you interested in finding a job? Are you a senior or recent graduate from college? If you answer yes to both of these questions, we have a program for you that is being offered online, and it's free! We know that young adults who are blind or visually impaired often have difficulty finding employment, and we want to help by providing a program that specifically focuses on identifying the right job for you and the steps to take to find that job. The program will last 8 weeks, beginning in the Fall of 2009 or the Winter of 2010, and it will cover the following topics:  

·        Self-assessment & discovery

·        Interest & career exploration

·        Job search skills training

·        Employment issues specific to blindness

·        How to locate specific job openings & apply for jobs

 

This program will take place online, so you can be located anywhere in the U.S. and participate. You can participate from home, school, or anywhere you have internet access. We can also help you obtain internet access in order to participate if this is a problem for you. Although this is an online program, it will involve interaction with others and will require completion of assignments. Two programs will be offered: one for seniors or recent graduates from high school and one for seniors or recent graduates from college. 

 

Specific requirements for participation include:

·        Legal blindness or more severe visual impairment

·        Blindness as the primary disability, without additional significant disabilities

·        Senior in high school (or recent graduate) who does not plan to attend college, OR Senior in college (or recent graduate), under the age of 25, who expects to seek (or is seeking) employment after graduation

·        Basic computer literacy and knowledge of accessibility software/hardware that would allow participation in an intervention provided on the Internet

 

If you meet these requirements and are interested in participating in one of these free programs, you can get information and sign up on line at http://www2.blind.msstate.edu, or  contact Lynda Goleman at  1-800-675-7782 or lgoleman at colled.msstate.edu 

 




Attachment 2:

                     

New Opportunity for Youth who are Blind or Visually Impaired:  An Online Employment Preparation Program



 

Are you interested in finding a job? Are you a senior or recent graduate from high school OR a senior or recent graduate from college? If you answer yes to both of these questions, we have a program for you that is being offered online, and it's free! We know that youth who are blind or visually impaired often have difficulty finding employment, and we want to help by providing a program that specifically focuses on identifying the right job for you and the steps to take to find that job. The program will last 8 weeks, beginning in the Fall of 2009 or the Winter of 2010, and it will cover the following topics:  

·        Self-assessment & discovery

·        Interest & career exploration

·        Job search skills training

·        Employment issues specific to blindness

·        How to locate specific job openings & apply for jobs

 

This program will take place online, so you can be located anywhere in the U.S. and participate. You can participate from home, school, or anywhere you have internet access. We can also help you obtain internet access in order to participate if this is a problem for you. Although this is an online program, it will involve interaction with others and will require completion of assignments. Two programs will be offered: one for seniors or recent graduates from high school and one for seniors or recent graduates from college. 

 

Specific requirements for participation include:

·        Legal blindness or more severe visual impairment

·        Blindness as the primary disability, without additional significant disabilities

·        Senior in high school (or recent graduate) who does not plan to attend college, OR Senior in college (or recent graduate), under the age of 25, who expects to seek (or is seeking) employment after graduation

·        Basic computer literacy and knowledge of accessibility software/hardware that would allow participation in an intervention provided on the Internet

 

If you meet these requirements and are interested in participating in one of these free programs, you can get information and sign up on line at http://www2.blind.msstate.edu or  contact Lynda Goleman at  1-800-675-7782 or lgoleman at colled.msstate.edu 

 




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From miriamd at optonline.net  Wed Jul 29 23:10:54 2009
From: miriamd at optonline.net (Miriam D. Feiner)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 19:10:54 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] nabs-l Digest, Vol 33, Issue 26
In-Reply-To: <mailman.13.1248886803.7391.nabs-l_nfbnet.org@nfbnet.org>
References: <mailman.13.1248886803.7391.nabs-l_nfbnet.org@nfbnet.org>
Message-ID: <3FABDAC6FDCD448F8DC366CE6A70291E@5P8NPB1>


My name is Miriam Feiner and I am starting  a MSW program at New York
University in September. I was wondering if anyone knows of a APA Wizard
program that is compatable with JAWS. (APA - American Psychological
Association, a specific formatting style.) There are many wizards that help
format the papers for you. I just was looking for one that I could use  with
JAWS. Thanks 


-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of nabs-l-request at nfbnet.org
Sent: Wednesday, July 29, 2009 1:00 PM
To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
Subject: nabs-l Digest, Vol 33, Issue 26

Send nabs-l mailing list submissions to
	nabs-l at nfbnet.org

To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
	http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
	nabs-l-request at nfbnet.org

You can reach the person managing the list at
	nabs-l-owner at nfbnet.org

When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of nabs-l digest..."


Today's Topics:

   1. NFB Youth SLAM Blog and Twitter (Peter Donahue)
   2. Re: FW: testing accomidation question (pajohns1 at vt.edu)
   3. Re: NABS Meeting Minutes (Janice)
   4. Breaking Web Site Bottlenecks (Peter Donahue)
   5. Re: Breaking Web Site Bottlenecks (Trevor Saunders)
   6. Re: FW: testing accomidation question (Ashley  Bramlett)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 14:36:08 -0500
From: "Peter Donahue" <pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net>
Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Youth SLAM Blog and Twitter
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Cc: "NFBnet Blind Kid Mailing List,	\(for parents of blind children\)"
	<blindkid at nfbnet.org>,	Professionals in Blindness Education
Division
	List	<pibe-division at nfbnet.org>
Message-ID: <016601ca0fba$a9076bd0$4001a8c0 at yourfsyly0jtwn>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="iso-8859-1"

Good afternoon everyone,

    For those interested in the goings on at the second NFB Youth SLAM you 
can keep up with the latest happenings by following the NFB Youth SLAM on 
Twitter, or by visiting the NFB Youth SLAM blog to read student accounts of 
their experiences at this great activity. Their URLS art listed below:

Follow the 2009 National Federation of the Blind Youth SLAM on Twitter at:
http://www.twitter.com/nfbyouthslam

        Visit the2009 NFB Youth SLAM Blog at:
http://www.nfbyouthslam.org

    Happy slamming.

Peter Donahue

 "Will you come and awake our lost land from its slumber
      And her fetters we'll break, links that long are encumbered.
      And the air will resound with hosannas to greet you
      On the shore will be found gallant Irishmen to greet you."
Will You Come to the Bower
Traditional Irish Folk Song




------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 16:06:51 -0400
From: <pajohns1 at vt.edu>
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] FW: testing accomidation question
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
	<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Cc: jim275_2 at yahoo.com
Message-ID: <95714EB2B6E143BFBE63DCE2853A314E at useripvq7z5u3t>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
	reply-type=original

Jim,

        I hope folks post their responses to the list and include Jim in the
cc.  I wonder why extra-time is needed on a take home comprehensive exam.
As a graduate student it is my responsibility to be able to quickly recall 
large amounts of data quickly and accurately.  To do this I spent many long 
hours organizing and rewriting notes in the process developing a system to 
quickly locate related data.  This is time intensive and often quite frankly

was boring beyond belief.  It required sacrifices, but what really is more 
important than passing one's comps or final exam??  For me at least all the 
long hours paid off in that by the time I saw my comp questions I already 
had a basic answer planned and could spend my time finding supporting 
material and citations.

        Since the comprehensive exam covers material already covered in 
previous courses I strongly suspect a fair number of hints have been dropped

on what is and what isn't important.  Also, there is the grapevine of 
students who have already taken and passed the exam.  Ask them about the 
nature and type of questions to be asked.  I'd even go so far as to ask the 
profs for suggestions on what to focus on in my preparation.

        It has been my experience having successfully passed three 
comprehensive exams that my profs wanted to ensure I knew the material and 
fairly acess me on the topics covered.  They never asked a question which 
hadn't been extensively covered in one of my core courses.

        Grad school is hard, no question about it, and it is even harder 
being blind, but it is by no means impossible.  Buckle down, start early, 
and study hard.  It can be done, there are enough of us on this list with 
multiple advanced degrees to prove it.

Patrick

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "JMassay" <jmassay1 at cox.net>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, July 28, 2009 12:08 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] FW: testing accomidation question


> Please post to list for Jim Reed. Thanks,
>
> Jeannie
>
>
>
>  _____
>
> From: Jim Reed [mailto:jim275_2 at yahoo.com]
> Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 7:51 PM
> To: jmassay1 at cox.net
> Subject: testing accomidation question
>
>
>
>
> Jeannie,
>
> I need to ask the NABS list an importiant question, but I am no longer on
> it. thus I can't post to the list. Are you on the NABS list? If so, could
> you post the following question for me? As I am not on the list, please
> have
> people reply directly back to me at jim275_2 at yahoo.com.
>
> Thanks,
> Jim
>
> Let me preface the following question by saying that I assume the reason
> my
> DSS office gives me extra time (time and a half) to take a test is because
> some blind people take longer to read and write than their blind or
> sighted
> counterparts.
>
> That said, I had several take home final exams last semester that were all
> given and due at roughly the same time, so I asked DSS for extra time, and
> I
> was denied. It says on mu DSS card that I am approved for extra time for
> taking test, yet the DSS office said that extra time does not apply to
> take
> home exams. Isn't a take home exam still a test?
>
> Anyhow, moving on...
>
> In January, 2010, I will have to take a comprehensive final exam covering
> all of my graduate classes. The way the exam works is that I will be given
> the exam questions one week prior to the exam date,  then, I have that one
> week to prepaire an outline of my response, and then, I  take the test.
> This
> is not quite the same thing as a take home exam because what you turn in
> as
> your exam is acctually written at the testing location, not at home.  I
> don't believe there is a time limit for this exam, but if there is, I know
> I
> will get extra time.
>
> I am worried about the week I will have to prepair my answers for the
> exam;
> I don't know that I will be physically able to review as much as I will
> need
> to, or to work as many hours as I will need to without my eyes giving out.
> With the exception of this semester's textbooks, all of my review
> materials
> (textbooks, exams, notes, handouts, etc.) will be in print format; that's
> a
> lot of readiing for eyes that like to get tired. During last semester's
> final exam week, I was often forced to stop working sooner than I intended
> to because I became unable to read or see the computer, regardless of the
> magnification I used.
>
> As I already mentioned, DSS denied my last request for extra time on a
> take
> home exam, so, I expect that they will do the same for my comprehensive
> exam.  I fear I will need the extra time to prepair, and not be able to
> get
> it. How can I make sure I get the extra time I need?
>
> As I am no longer subscribed to the NABS list, please email responses
> directlly to me at jim275_2 at yahoo.com.
>
> Thanks,
> Jim Reed
>
> "A hundred times every day I remind myself that my inner and outer life
> depend on the labors of other men, living and dead, and that I must exert
> myself in order to give in the same measure as I have received and am
> still
> receiving." - Albert Einstein
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pajohns1%40vt.edu




------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 19:40:05 -0500
From: "Janice" <snowball07 at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Meeting Minutes
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
	<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Message-ID: <32ABDB9638F84FD2B3E8310F4B43F0E9 at your0d10610b06>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
	reply-type=response

    Hello Antonio,

I will be sure to pass the message along to our webmaster(and the co-chairs 
of the committee in charge). I am sure they will be much obliged. I believe 
such plans are already in the works. Thank you for your thoughts and 
suggestions. Keep the good ideas flowing!

Kindest Regards,

Janice Jeang
Secretary
National Association of Blind Students
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Antonio Guimaraes" <aguimaraes at nbp.org>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 3:01 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Meeting Minutes


> Thank you for the minutes. Nice work. Couple of thoughts:
>
> Yes, membership is interested in reading board meetings minutes. I speak 
> for myself, but this would provide a chance to stay informed, involved, 
> and for the board to be accountable to the membership.
>
> Yes, I would like to see the minutes archived on the site.
>
> thank you for your diligent work, and keep up the work.
>
> Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr.
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Janice" <snowball07 at gmail.com>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 11:21 AM
> Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Meeting Minutes
>
>
> Hey Nabsters,
>
> Attached to this email, as a word file, is the first meting minutes for 
> our new NABS administration. This is the NABS board's attempt at keeping 
> "you" the student, informed. I am quite excited that I get to post up my 
> minutes and be the humble messenger. BE nice- *smile*
> I sincerely apologize for the tardiness of the minutes being released.  I 
> was extraordinary ill after National Convention, and it looked like I was 
> getting better for a bit. However, the flu/ fever has taken a turn for the

> worse again. Nothing super serious, but just enough to keep me some what 
> unbalanced. Anyways, enough of my rambling. Here they are: enjoy!
>
> Kindest Regards,
>
> Janice Jeang
> Secretary
> national Association of Blind Students
>
>
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
>
>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> nabs-l:
>>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/aguimaraes%40nbp.org
>>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/snowball07%40gmail.c
om 




------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 21:03:32 -0500
From: "Peter Donahue" <pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net>
Subject: [nabs-l] Breaking Web Site Bottlenecks
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
	<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Message-ID: <000501ca0ff0$c739c4a0$4001a8c0 at yourfsyly0jtwn>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="iso-8859-1"

Hello Janice and listers,

    And require the secretary or anyone who produces material for the Web 
site to mark up their own pages for posting to the site. Our chapter is all 
ready doing that. It goes a long way to breaking  Web Site maintenance 
bottlenecks and will challenge these individuals to learn anew skill; one 
they thought was beyond them or they weren't smart enough to grasp. Once you

get the hang of marking up Web pages it eventually becomes second-nature. 
It's more food for thought.

Peter Donahue

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Janice" <snowball07 at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, July 28, 2009 7:40 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Meeting Minutes


    Hello Antonio,

I will be sure to pass the message along to our webmaster(and the co-chairs
of the committee in charge). I am sure they will be much obliged. I believe
such plans are already in the works. Thank you for your thoughts and
suggestions. Keep the good ideas flowing!

Kindest Regards,

Janice Jeang
Secretary
National Association of Blind Students
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Antonio Guimaraes" <aguimaraes at nbp.org>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 3:01 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NABS Meeting Minutes


> Thank you for the minutes. Nice work. Couple of thoughts:
>
> Yes, membership is interested in reading board meetings minutes. I speak
> for myself, but this would provide a chance to stay informed, involved,
> and for the board to be accountable to the membership.
>
> Yes, I would like to see the minutes archived on the site.
>
> thank you for your diligent work, and keep up the work.
>
> Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr.
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Janice" <snowball07 at gmail.com>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 11:21 AM
> Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Meeting Minutes
>
>
> Hey Nabsters,
>
> Attached to this email, as a word file, is the first meting minutes for
> our new NABS administration. This is the NABS board's attempt at keeping
> "you" the student, informed. I am quite excited that I get to post up my
> minutes and be the humble messenger. BE nice- *smile*
> I sincerely apologize for the tardiness of the minutes being released.  I
> was extraordinary ill after National Convention, and it looked like I was
> getting better for a bit. However, the flu/ fever has taken a turn for the
> worse again. Nothing super serious, but just enough to keep me some what
> unbalanced. Anyways, enough of my rambling. Here they are: enjoy!
>
> Kindest Regards,
>
> Janice Jeang
> Secretary
> national Association of Blind Students
>
>
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
>
>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/aguimaraes%40nbp.org
>>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/snowball07%40gmail.c
om


_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pdonahue1%40sbcgloba
l.net 




------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 22:22:23 -0400
From: Trevor Saunders <trev.saunders at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Breaking Web Site Bottlenecks
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
	<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Message-ID: <E1MVyoB-00084V-U7 at tbsaunde>

Hi,

once you learn how to marking up text as you write it can be faster and in
some
sense more accessible than fiddling with fonts and sizes etc.
Another option if everyone can make it work well for them is to use wiki
style
markup which is somewhat simpler than html.

Trev



------------------------------

Message: 6
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 2009 23:29:36 -0400
From: "Ashley  Bramlett" <bookwormahb at earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] FW: testing accomidation question
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
	<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Cc: jim275_2 at yahoo.com
Message-ID: <9152887DF50D41E18BE5698526CEF7CC at Ashley>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
	reply-type=original

Hi all,
Please post to the list and copy Jim.  Jim raised good questions.  These are

questions I ponder too since I may attend grad school later.  I just 
graduated in May with a BA from Marymount.
Two questions you asked are:
1. Should you get extra time for a take home exam?
2. What are the best ways to review and study for such a mass amount of 
information tested on only in a week?

I agree with Patrick.  With preparation and organization you may not need 
extra time.  I also got time and a half or double time on exams in college. 
They assumed i needed extra time to take it orally; I took it by using a 
reader or listening to jaws doing it electronically.  To me this leveled the

playing field because I need things repeated; its not like reading braille 
and listening is very different and for me takes more time and effort.
I only had a couple take home exams here and there and I requested extra 
time from the prof for one of them and got it.  Some may disagree because of

philosophy.  I decided I needed it because the book was only recorded by rfb

and I did not have many notes to review from reading; I did not do that as I

typically do since the prof relied more on the lecture than the book.  Thus 
by taking notes from the text I felt I was wasting my time.  So I needed a 
reader to assist me and my readers were doing their own work at that time. 
Other students were skimming and using the index to look up key concepts for

the answers.  Since I needed a reader and even with like four readers I was 
working on their schedule too I chose to have extended time.

But a comprehensive final exam for grad school is different.  You said your 
notes, handouts etc are in print.  You said your eyes were getting tired for

preping for your past exams.  I have some vision too but it wasn't enough to

read with magnification.  So I learned braille and accessed my books through

rfb at a young age.  Jim I suggest you use alternative techniques so you can

give your eyes a rest.  How about getting some textbooks through RFB if 
available.  I assume you use Zoomtext on the computer.  Why not use the 
speech that comes with Zoomtext?  Another idea is to get jaws or a screen 
reader and you can switch between auditory and visual methods then.  Do you 
have a scanner?  If so scanning programs: Openbook and Kirzweil have great 
low vision and speech features.  For instance you can change the contrast, 
size, and color of text.

I hope others can give better suggestions for preping for a final exam like 
this using alternative techniques.  I don't have a perfect solution either. 
I always found take home tests harder since the others could skim anything 
and find answers where as I relied on lecture notes from the prof like 
powerpoints, handouts and my own notes.

Here is what I did and suggest.  The key is advanced preparation.

1. Organize your notes.  For me I did it by chapters.  Although for a 
comprehensive final you'd want something more concise.

2. Mark important pages in your text you may refer to.  Highlighting works 
if you see it.  Also post it notes or paper clips work too.  Then with your 
own eyes or a reader review that information.

3. Patrick said this one and #4 too. Ask other students about the types of 
questions from past experiences.

4. Your profs want you to succeed.  So ask questions what to focus on.  I 
did this for tests and it worked great.  I went to their office hours and 
they were glad I was interested in the class and I got them to give hints on

what to study for.
I don't know if they have office hours for grad school, but if so, use them 
since profs like to see you're working hard and have questions for them.

5. Since you'll have the questions in advance, form a study group or get a 
study partner.  Although i did not have the exact questions, i had a study 
guide and this helped me usually.  We exchanged what we knew and together 
formed a larger picture.

6. Even though you may get the questions only a week in advance, you can 
prep before hand.  For a big final I studied several weeks ahead of time.  I

realize a comprehensive test is much much larger, but if possible make more 
time.  I took several chapters and reviewed the key points.  I broke my 
study sessions up to avoid burnout but after a while I was fatiguing.  Maybe

make a schedule as to what you study so you have a systematic way to study 
it and don't neglect some areas.

You seem to be a visual learner.  Maybe try something auditory.  How about 
explaining the key points of the course on a digital recorder or cassette 
player.  Then replay it.  If you explain it in your own words you'll more 
likely remember it and repeating it makes it stick in your brain.  Your eyes

can't fatigue using this study technique.

I hope it works out.

Ashley

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "JMassay" <jmassay1 at cox.net>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, July 28, 2009 12:08 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] FW: testing accomidation question


> Please post to list for Jim Reed. Thanks,
>
> Jeannie
>
>
>
>  _____
>
> From: Jim Reed [mailto:jim275_2 at yahoo.com]
> Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 7:51 PM
> To: jmassay1 at cox.net
> Subject: testing accomidation question
>
>
>
>
> Jeannie,
>
> I need to ask the NABS list an importiant question, but I am no longer on
> it. thus I can't post to the list. Are you on the NABS list? If so, could
> you post the following question for me? As I am not on the list, please 
> have
> people reply directly back to me at jim275_2 at yahoo.com.
>
> Thanks,
> Jim
>
> Let me preface the following question by saying that I assume the reason 
> my
> DSS office gives me extra time (time and a half) to take a test is because
> some blind people take longer to read and write than their blind or 
> sighted
> counterparts.
>
> That said, I had several take home final exams last semester that were all
> given and due at roughly the same time, so I asked DSS for extra time, and

> I
> was denied. It says on mu DSS card that I am approved for extra time for
> taking test, yet the DSS office said that extra time does not apply to 
> take
> home exams. Isn't a take home exam still a test?
>
> Anyhow, moving on...
>
> In January, 2010, I will have to take a comprehensive final exam covering
> all of my graduate classes. The way the exam works is that I will be given
> the exam questions one week prior to the exam date,  then, I have that one
> week to prepaire an outline of my response, and then, I  take the test. 
> This
> is not quite the same thing as a take home exam because what you turn in 
> as
> your exam is acctually written at the testing location, not at home.  I
> don't believe there is a time limit for this exam, but if there is, I know

> I
> will get extra time.
>
> I am worried about the week I will have to prepair my answers for the 
> exam;
> I don't know that I will be physically able to review as much as I will 
> need
> to, or to work as many hours as I will need to without my eyes giving out.
> With the exception of this semester's textbooks, all of my review 
> materials
> (textbooks, exams, notes, handouts, etc.) will be in print format; that's 
> a
> lot of readiing for eyes that like to get tired. During last semester's
> final exam week, I was often forced to stop working sooner than I intended
> to because I became unable to read or see the computer, regardless of the
> magnification I used.
>
> As I already mentioned, DSS denied my last request for extra time on a 
> take
> home exam, so, I expect that they will do the same for my comprehensive
> exam.  I fear I will need the extra time to prepair, and not be able to 
> get
> it. How can I make sure I get the extra time I need?
>
> As I am no longer subscribed to the NABS list, please email responses
> directlly to me at jim275_2 at yahoo.com.
>
> Thanks,
> Jim Reed
>
> "A hundred times every day I remind myself that my inner and outer life
> depend on the labors of other men, living and dead, and that I must exert
> myself in order to give in the same measure as I have received and am 
> still
> receiving." - Albert Einstein
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthl
ink.net
>
> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus 
> signature database 4286 (20090728) __________
>
> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>
> http://www.eset.com
>
>
> 




------------------------------

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org


End of nabs-l Digest, Vol 33, Issue 26
**************************************

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17:58:00



From trev.saunders at gmail.com  Thu Jul 30 00:33:04 2009
From: trev.saunders at gmail.com (Trevor Saunders)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 20:33:04 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] nabs-l Digest, Vol 33, Issue 26
In-Reply-To: <3FABDAC6FDCD448F8DC366CE6A70291E@5P8NPB1>
References: <mailman.13.1248886803.7391.nabs-l_nfbnet.org@nfbnet.org>
	<3FABDAC6FDCD448F8DC366CE6A70291E@5P8NPB1>
Message-ID: <E1MWJZw-00042B-AD@tbsaunde>

Hi,

Well this isn't word and I doubt its what you'r thinking of, but its a great 
option.  Latex allows you to describe the structure of your document and then a 
program deals with arranging the text in a pretty pdf for you to print.  Latex 
is great because it allows you to just lay out structure and let the program 
deal with the details.  It does a pretty good job and can be adapted with 
prewritten packages to do things like conform to APA or MLA.  It is also very 
accessible because its just text.

Trev


From blindhistory at gmail.com  Thu Jul 30 04:08:03 2009
From: blindhistory at gmail.com (Lora)
Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 22:08:03 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] CCTV Monitor issues please help!
Message-ID: <ea6d2ed00907292108t7f8b57ebg162953e9a3d50793@mail.gmail.com>

I have a Merlin CCTV that doubles as my computer monitor. While I am working
on my computer the screen keeps flickering black and then coming back on. I
haven't noticed a difference with my CCTV. Any suggestions? Thanks in
advance.

-- 
Lora and Trice

From solsticesinger at gmail.com  Thu Jul 30 10:12:55 2009
From: solsticesinger at gmail.com (solsticesinger)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 05:12:55 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] APA referencing
Message-ID: <4832CCA73F484248989D014F6CCB4DE8@shannon>

Hi, all.

I'm having some trouble with APA referencing for journal articles, books, and websites. Can anyone offer any advice or suggestions? I'm working on a major paper, and many things must be cited correctly.

I appreciate any help anyone can offer.

Shannon
Are you a fan of women's music? If so, check out the Eclectic Collection: A Celebration of Women In Music, each Wednesday evening from 7 to 9 eastern.
www.radio360.us

From pajohns1 at vt.edu  Thu Jul 30 11:50:18 2009
From: pajohns1 at vt.edu (pajohns1 at vt.edu)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 07:50:18 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] APA referencing
References: <4832CCA73F484248989D014F6CCB4DE8@shannon>
Message-ID: <93E9CEF2EA9D4C34B05B8EDF9DD8E5AF@useripvq7z5u3t>


        Try http://library.williams.edu/citing/styles/apa.php it has an easy 
to read style guide for APA and the other major citation styles.


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "solsticesinger" <solsticesinger at gmail.com>
To: "Human Services Mailing List" <humanser at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Thursday, July 30, 2009 6:12 AM
Subject: [nabs-l] APA referencing


> Hi, all.
>
> I'm having some trouble with APA referencing for journal articles, books, 
> and websites. Can anyone offer any advice or suggestions? I'm working on a 
> major paper, and many things must be cited correctly.
>
> I appreciate any help anyone can offer.
>
> Shannon
> Are you a fan of women's music? If so, check out the Eclectic Collection: 
> A Celebration of Women In Music, each Wednesday evening from 7 to 9 
> eastern.
> www.radio360.us
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pajohns1%40vt.edu 



From marrie12 at gmail.com  Thu Jul 30 19:54:44 2009
From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 12:54:44 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Pass the green dumpster,
	please: making your business handicap accessible
Message-ID: <64D0AE025FFD416FBC08F3672120C01E@sacomputer>

I got this off of a friend of mine. This has some interesting stuff.

 

Take care and have a blessed day.

 

 

Pass the green dumpster, please: making your business handicap accessible
 
  By Eileen Feldman
  Wicked Local Somerville ,  Jul 30, 2009 @ 06:17 AM
 
  Somerville -
 
  This past Sunday, July 26, we marked the 19th anniversary of the Americans
  with Disabilities Act (ADA). The ADA of 1990 was modeled after the first
  major   piece of civil rights disability law, the Rehabilitation Act of
  1973.
 
  The ADA directs all local governments to provide readily usable programs 
  and
  opportunities to all; covers public transportation services; and directs 
  all
  public accommodations, such as restaurants, retail stores, hotels, movie
  theaters, private schools, convention centers, doctors' offices, homeless
  shelters,   transportation depots, zoos, funeral homes, day care centers,
  and recreation facilities to provide all programs in the most inclusively
  accessible manner
  possible, regardless of size or funding. It also sets out standards for
  accessible telephones, televisions and other communications technology.
 
  While government services, including subsidized housing, must provide all
  employment and program opportunities in a manner that is readily usable to
  everyone   regardless of costing issues, non-governmental public
  accommodations are directed to eliminate all barriers where "readily
  achievable."
 
  Recently, some friends suggested that the management of a local restaurant
  place a secure ramp over a three-inch step at the entrance. Management
  responded   as follows: "... I am happy to say that I have personally
  rectified the whole situation by placing a new plywood plank in our back
  entrance (by the kitchen,   down the alley, past the green dumpster, and
  around the pot holes) and have put up a sign as well as informed my staff 
  on
  how to direct those of the handicapped   persuasion to a segregated back
  entrance away from the public eye."
 
  I kid you not.
 
  Although we might chuckle with both outrage and sympathy for the 
  ineptitude
  exhibited by this particular management, such a discriminatory attitude is
  tacitly   revealed in many government programs. Here, cultural ignorance
  cannot be claimed as an excuse. Mobility-impaired applicants and customers
  should not have   to call ahead in order to enter locked, segregated back
  and side entrances or poorly maintained lifts and elevators. In addition,
  21st Century Americans
  with disabilities can rightfully expect that all architectural,
  communication and informational impediments to government-sponsored 
  housing,
  employment,
  economic, social and cultural opportunities have been identified, and
  transition planning is ongoing to successfully eliminate these barriers,
  step by  step. Our state and local governments should know how to model
  inclusive opportunity for all.
 
  In Somerville, which counted nearly 20 percent residents with disabilities
  in its 2000 Census, there are a majority of stores, restaurants, agencies
  and   establishments that can immediately enhance their services with a
  little awareness.
 
  Here are 10 examples of easily removable barriers:
 
  . One-step entrance: replace step with slip-resistant ramp.
  . Service counters too high: replace with counters between 28 and 34 
  inches
  high.
  . Hard-to-grip door hardware: replace with levers or loop handles.
  . Too-narrow entrance: install offset hinges to widen doorways to at least
  32 inches when fully open.
  . Too-high thresholds: bevel       all thresholds to be less than one-half
  inch high.
  . No inclusive parking: re-stripe parking lots to include van-accessible
  parking spaces.
  . Not level or smooth path to entrance: replace entryway gravel and brick
  materials with hardtop.
  . Impassable aisles to goods and services: rearrange aisles to be at least
  36 inches clear, and with cane-detectable edges under all shelves and
  displays.
 
  . Tripping hazards: use low-pile, tightly woven carpeting and securely
  attach along all edges.
  . No wayfinding to goods and services: provide signs and room 
  names/numbers
  in large print with high contrast, and include Braille signage wherever
  signage   is required.
 
 
  Even in this economy, financial incentives exist to bust those barriers
  once and for all.
 
  Small business can claim a Disabled Access Tax Credit of up to $5,000 to
  offset these costs for access - see IRS Code, Section 44.
 
  Larger businesses can claim up to $15,000 per year for expenses associated
  with the removal of architectural and transportation barriers, and for the
  provision   of accessible information and communications - see IRS Code,
  Section 190.
 
  You can call the IRS and ask about the ADA Tax Incentives for Businesses 
  at
  800-829-1040.
  Before the summer is out, why not accomplish at least one of these
  improvements? Let everyone in. When you put that welcome mat out for
  everyone, there's   no telling what riches may come.

Sarah Alawami

msn: chellist at hotmail.com

website: http://www.marrie.org

twitter: http://twitter.com/marrie1

klango: marrie

 




From aguimaraes at nbp.org  Thu Jul 30 21:09:56 2009
From: aguimaraes at nbp.org (Antonio Guimaraes)
Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 17:09:56 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] FWD: Project Hire:  Transition to Employment
References: <9A2CC8CB4F2F46C188F783B888FC7BE0@nbp2.local>
Message-ID: <C7CA67A0DF674D1D8A3046749E35F0FD@nbp2.local>

I tried this to the list yesterday, but not sure it all made it in because 
of the attachments.

Here is an extract from the attached files.
Antonio Guimaraes



Attachment 1:



Project HIRE:  New Opportunity for College Grads or Seniors who are Blind or 
Visually Impaired:  An Online Employment Preparation Program





Are you interested in finding a job? Are you a senior or recent graduate 
from college? If you answer yes to both of these questions, we have a 
program for you that is being offered online, and it's free! We know that 
young adults who are blind or visually impaired often have difficulty 
finding employment, and we want to help by providing a program that 
specifically focuses on identifying the right job for you and the steps to 
take to find that job. The program will last 8 weeks, beginning in the Fall 
of 2009 or the Winter of 2010, and it will cover the following topics:

·        Self-assessment & discovery

·        Interest & career exploration

·        Job search skills training

·        Employment issues specific to blindness

·        How to locate specific job openings & apply for jobs



This program will take place online, so you can be located anywhere in the 
U.S. and participate. You can participate from home, school, or anywhere you 
have internet access. We can also help you obtain internet access in order 
to participate if this is a problem for you. Although this is an online 
program, it will involve interaction with others and will require completion 
of assignments. Two programs will be offered: one for seniors or recent 
graduates from high school and one for seniors or recent graduates from 
college.



Specific requirements for participation include:

·        Legal blindness or more severe visual impairment

·        Blindness as the primary disability, without additional significant 
disabilities

·        Senior in high school (or recent graduate) who does not plan to 
attend college, OR Senior in college (or recent graduate), under the age of 
25, who expects to seek (or is seeking) employment after graduation

·        Basic computer literacy and knowledge of accessibility 
software/hardware that would allow participation in an intervention provided 
on the Internet



If you meet these requirements and are interested in participating in one of 
these free programs, you can get information and sign up on line at 
http://www2.blind.msstate.edu, or  contact Lynda Goleman at  1-800-675-7782 
or lgoleman at colled.msstate.edu






Attachment 2:



New Opportunity for Youth who are Blind or Visually Impaired:  An Online 
Employment Preparation Program





Are you interested in finding a job? Are you a senior or recent graduate 
from high school OR a senior or recent graduate from college? If you answer 
yes to both of these questions, we have a program for you that is being 
offered online, and it's free! We know that youth who are blind or visually 
impaired often have difficulty finding employment, and we want to help by 
providing a program that specifically focuses on identifying the right job 
for you and the steps to take to find that job. The program will last 8 
weeks, beginning in the Fall of 2009 or the Winter of 2010, and it will 
cover the following topics:

·        Self-assessment & discovery

·        Interest & career exploration

·        Job search skills training

·        Employment issues specific to blindness

·        How to locate specific job openings & apply for jobs



This program will take place online, so you can be located anywhere in the 
U.S. and participate. You can participate from home, school, or anywhere you 
have internet access. We can also help you obtain internet access in order 
to participate if this is a problem for you. Although this is an online 
program, it will involve interaction with others and will require completion 
of assignments. Two programs will be offered: one for seniors or recent 
graduates from high school and one for seniors or recent graduates from 
college.



Specific requirements for participation include:

·        Legal blindness or more severe visual impairment

·        Blindness as the primary disability, without additional significant 
disabilities

·        Senior in high school (or recent graduate) who does not plan to 
attend college, OR Senior in college (or recent graduate), under the age of 
25, who expects to seek (or is seeking) employment after graduation

·        Basic computer literacy and knowledge of accessibility 
software/hardware that would allow participation in an intervention provided 
on the Internet



If you meet these requirements and are interested in participating in one of 
these free programs, you can get information and sign up on line at 
http://www2.blind.msstate.edu or  contact Lynda Goleman at  1-800-675-7782 
or lgoleman at colled.msstate.edu







Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr.

ReadBooks Coordinator
National Braille Press
aguimaraes at nbp.org
1800 548-7323, ext 440.
(617) 266-6160

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: FOPBC at aol.com
  To: fopbc at nfbnet.org
  Sent: Wednesday, July 29, 2009 4:36 PM
  Subject: [Fopbc] Fwd: Project Hire: Transition to Employment





----------------------------------------------------------------------------


    Hello friends,

    Just a reminder again that here at Mississippi State University we are 
initiating an exciting new opportunity for recent high school and college 
graduates and seniors who are blind or have low vision to be involved in an 
on-line intervention to enhance their employability.  We are recruiting 
almost 100 students from all over the country who will be involved for 8 
weeks of supplemental activity in either September - November or 
January-February.  Students will be randomly assigned to a group, so we are 
hoping to get all our candidates lined up by September 1.  The purpose of 
the program is two-fold.  First, we are hoping it will be beneficial to the 
participants in preparing them to find employment, but it is also a research 
project to develop evidenced based practice which we hope will be replicable 
and available nationwide.

    Attached are 2 email flyers about the program, one for college students 
and one for both high school and college students.  We can send braille and 
large print as well if anyone is interested.  Please post this on your 
office bulletin boards and help pass the word to interested students. 
Students can sign up on line through our website at www.blind.msstate.edu . 
Please contact me if you have any questions.

    Thanks for your help!

    BJ

    B. J. LeJeune, M.Ed,CRC, CVRT
    RRTC on Blindness and Low Vision
    Mississippi State University
    P. O. Box 6189
    Mississippi State, MS  39762
    bjlejeune at colled.msstate.edu
    662-325-2694



Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr.

ReadBooks Coordinator
National Braille Press
aguimaraes at nbp.org
1800 548-7323, ext 440.
(617) 266-6160

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Antonio Guimaraes" <aguimaraes at nbp.org>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, July 29, 2009 4:36 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] FWD: Project Hire: Transition to Employment


> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/aguimaraes%40nbp.org
> 




From dandrews at visi.com  Fri Jul 31 15:36:12 2009
From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 10:36:12 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] How many children in America are not taught to read?
Message-ID: <auto-000109959805@mailfront1.g2host.com>

 From Dr. Maurer:

Subject: [Brl-campaign] How many children in America are not taught to read?

The answer is 90 percent if the children are 
blind.  Most Americans are shocked to hear this 
statistic.  And we should be.  The blind read and write using
Braille, so why is our educational system failing 
to teach Braille to so many children?  Why are 
these children being denied the opportunities that come
with a proper education?  What if you could not 
read and write?  Where would you be today?

There are three primary reasons for this 
educational crisis: (1) there are not enough 
Braille teachers; (2) some teachers of blind children have not received
enough training; and (3) many educators do not 
think Braille instruction is even necessary.

To bring critically-needed attention to this 
educational crisis, the United States Congress 
authorized the minting of the 2009 Louis Braille Bicentennial
Silver Dollar with a portion of the sale of each 
coin going toward a revolutionary and 
comprehensive Braille literacy campaign.

Learning to read and write is fundamental to 
education, which in turn is paramount to full and 
equal participation in American society.  This coin, the
first U.S. coin to have proper tactile Braille, 
symbolizes independence, opportunity, and the 
potential of blind people to make significant contributions
to society when they learn to read and write 
using Braille.  To learn more, read our report
The Braille Literacy Crisis in America,
or watch our video
Making Change with a Dollar.

Please purchase this unique and beautiful coin now
  and help solve this educational crisis for blind children in America.

The law authorizing this 2009 silver dollar 
requires that any coins not sold by midnight on 
December 31, 2009, be melted down.  Time is of the essence­­a
90 percent illiteracy rate is not acceptable and 
the opportunity to purchase this coin will soon be gone.

Be part of the solution, give the gift of 
literacy, and create new opportunities.
Please buy the Louis Braille Bicentennial Silver Dollar now.

Marc Maurer, President

NATIONAL FEDERATION OF THE BLIND  



From corbbo at gmail.com  Fri Jul 31 05:09:59 2009
From: corbbo at gmail.com (Corbb O'Connor)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 01:09:59 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Victor reader stream issue... Help!!!
In-Reply-To: <6D69A2D1-BDC7-4494-9A3A-517EEEE14668@gmail.com>
References: <6D69A2D1-BDC7-4494-9A3A-517EEEE14668@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4ed9a39a0907302209x2ca7b165m76a01b5bc4f45f8e@mail.gmail.com>

The same thing happens to me. As for you not being able to see the
Stream, it's because you may need to format (or re-format) the SD
card. Turn on the Stream, hit the 7 key until you hear "Format SD
Card," and then confirm twice. You'll hear beeps until the card is
reformatted. Note: you WILL lose ALL data on that SD card. Per the
Stream manual, you will not be able to play the audio files without
converting them via the converter software. But yes, I understand that
you can't do that since the system locks up when I connect it to my
Windows Virtual Machine.

Corbb

On Mon, Jul 20, 2009 at 10:49 PM, clinton
waterbury<clinton.waterbury at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello all.
> I am using a victor reader stream to take notes for my classes, but I am
> running into a couple of problems.
> 1. The stream errors out when I connect it to my mac, and won't even let me
> repair the disk.
> 2. the audio files are not playable by the mac, but I may have another way
> of playing those.
> The not connecting issue is by far the worst issue with the thing I have,
> and when I try to connect it to a winows virtual machine...  On the mac, the
> stream locks up and I have to take out the pattery to even get it running
> again.
> Any ideas?
>
> _______________________________________________
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> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
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>


From winy_kwany at yahoo.com  Fri Jul 31 16:34:52 2009
From: winy_kwany at yahoo.com (Winy Kwany)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 09:34:52 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [nabs-l] Microsoft Exel and JAWS--any help?
Message-ID: <613090.63947.qm@web62402.mail.re1.yahoo.com>


Hi all,
I need help to learn how to use Microsoft Exel and JAWS. For those who is good in this, would you please to write me off list? There are some questions that I need to ask.
I look forward to hearing from you soon. Any help will be highly apreciated. Thanks a lot.
Winy.
Email: winy_kwany at yahoo.com


      


From tealbloodworth at gmail.com  Fri Jul 31 18:01:55 2009
From: tealbloodworth at gmail.com (Teal Bloodworth)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 13:01:55 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Microsoft Exel and JAWS--any help?
References: <613090.63947.qm@web62402.mail.re1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <5E2EBDF2C8844BA7B51697A6667E0A00@teal6e6857f643>

I am personally not sure how to use excell but you can find tutorials to 
work with alot of microsoft programs like excell, word and powerpoint at

accesstechnologyinstitute.com


        -Teal
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Winy Kwany" <winy_kwany at yahoo.com>
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 31, 2009 11:34 AM
Subject: [nabs-l] Microsoft Exel and JAWS--any help?


>
> Hi all,
> I need help to learn how to use Microsoft Exel and JAWS. For those who is 
> good in this, would you please to write me off list? There are some 
> questions that I need to ask.
> I look forward to hearing from you soon. Any help will be highly 
> apreciated. Thanks a lot.
> Winy.
> Email: winy_kwany at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/tealbloodworth%40gmail.com 



From alena.roberts2282 at gmail.com  Fri Jul 31 18:16:26 2009
From: alena.roberts2282 at gmail.com (alena roberts)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 11:16:26 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] using blogger with JAWS in IE
Message-ID: <3af83dbb0907311116o1b2e014fy5ba8c7f1fc38b2ff@mail.gmail.com>

Heyall,

I am trying to post to a blogger blog using IE and JAWS. I use a mac
at home, but I have to use a PC at work. Blogger works just fine on my
mac, but I am having trouble at work. When I try to post a new blog
the only edit fields I can access are the title and tags. The edit
field for the body of the post simply says frame and then end of
frame. I convinced my co-worker to switch from using word press to
blogger because it is easier for me, at least on my mac. Can someone
help please? I hope I haven't confused anyone too much. I look forward
to any responses.

By the way Firefox is not working currently on my computer so that is
why I'm using IE.

-- 
Alena Roberts
Blog: http://www.blindgal.com/


From lawnmower84 at hotmail.com  Fri Jul 31 19:03:10 2009
From: lawnmower84 at hotmail.com (Jacob Struiksma)
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 13:03:10 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] using blogger with JAWS in IE
In-Reply-To: <3af83dbb0907311116o1b2e014fy5ba8c7f1fc38b2ff@mail.gmail.com>
References: <3af83dbb0907311116o1b2e014fy5ba8c7f1fc38b2ff@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <COL0-DAV2FD66C880219DA834552FB5100@phx.gbl>

I would reinstall Firefox
From
Jacob
 

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of alena roberts
Sent: Friday, July 31, 2009 12:16 PM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: [nabs-l] using blogger with JAWS in IE

Heyall,

I am trying to post to a blogger blog using IE and JAWS. I use a mac at
home, but I have to use a PC at work. Blogger works just fine on my mac, but
I am having trouble at work. When I try to post a new blog the only edit
fields I can access are the title and tags. The edit field for the body of
the post simply says frame and then end of frame. I convinced my co-worker
to switch from using word press to blogger because it is easier for me, at
least on my mac. Can someone help please? I hope I haven't confused anyone
too much. I look forward to any responses.

By the way Firefox is not working currently on my computer so that is why
I'm using IE.

--
Alena Roberts
Blog: http://www.blindgal.com/

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