[nabs-l] Ending the NFB/ACB feud

Tue May 19 23:10:39 UTC 2009

Aziza,
An employment seminar and student seminar are very different.  I think an 
employment seminar targeted toward both groups or non affiliated consumers 
might work.
Have you been to nfb student seminars?  If you have you know they are 
infused with
nfb philosophy.  For instance several years ago I heard a pannel of Stacy, 
Arielle, and Brian speak about their experiences with classes, internships 
and community service.  All members spoke of the experience and touched on 
NFB philosophy, how they were changing what it means to be blind and hoping 
the next blind person would have a fair chance.  Stacy spoke of the 
discrimination in her horse riding class but stuck with it due to the high 
expectations and belief of the nfb.
I hear students get up and preach about what they've done, high 
expectations, setting example and the attitude of changing what it means to 
be blind.
If you want to see for yourself there are transcripts of some speeches in 
nfb publications and I can provide those links.

This is partly why a joint student seminar will not work.
An employment seminar on the other hand might work.  We could get outside 
speakers to give tips to benefit all including the sighted members of the 
organizations.  Topics like pros/cons of disclosing your blindness, 
interview techniques, cover letters, resumes and networking are just a few 
topics.  This seminar would not be so philosopically driven.
Also there are logistical issues in getting a joint student seminar.  Of 
course there may be for the employment seminar.  Who would fund it?  I doubt 
the nabs nfb board.
We would need a lot of hotel space to bring two groups together but the 
rates would have to be low enough for people to afford.

Ashley

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Aziza C" <daydreamingncolor at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, May 18, 2009 9:48 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Ending the NFB/ACB feud

>I don't think it's that simple Ashley. I think people need to take the
> time to ask themselves if they want history to repeat itself, or if
> we're willing to try. Trying won't hurt anyone. Besides, who said this
> seminar Jim thought of would merge us? It could, but no one said it
> would. What makes an employment seminar any better or different than a
> student seminar?
> Aziza
>
> On 5/18/09, Ashley  Bramlett <bookwormahb at earthlink.net> wrote:
>> Angela and all,
>> Yes members of each group may have good cordial
>> relationships.  I am one of them.  I find I have more in common with the
>> members than
>> I have differences.  On matters of difference, I don't discuss it and 
>> agree
>> to disagree.
>> Having relationships to hang out, go out to eat, go to movies, etc is one
>> thing but
>> to say they join together is another.  Organizations that have opposing
>> priorities cannot work together.  Organizations that have differing
>> philosophies cannot work together.  I can have friends of both groups 
>> just
>> as I can have friends of differing religions or politics.  I don't 
>> discuss
>> these passionate disagreements as to not cause a fight or hurt feelings.
>>
>> Both groups agree on some legislative ideas and for those I think we can 
>> and
>> should work together.  For instance we agree on the hybread car problem 
>> as
>> well as nonvisual access to voter machines.  We agree that websites and
>> internet email should be accessible.  I think ACB and NFB sued AOL 
>> jointly
>> for accessibility.
>>
>> I would be supportive of a joint activity such as an
>> employment seminar.  This activity would
>> be a sort of non denominational thing where blind and visually impaired
>> consumers of ACB, NFB or neither
>> group would come together to learn and network and make new blind 
>> friends.
>> But I don't support a merger.
>> I have gotten some tips for living, networking, and socialization from 
>> both
>> groups.  Yep I have attended ACB events and meetings. You might have 
>> guessed
>> that.
>> Both groups have meetings at restaurants and its fun to socialize and
>> network over a three course meal.
>> Its a great place to get jaws questions answered, find out about jobs,
>> adapting to recreation activities or descriptive video.  Many alternative
>> techniques are the same.  They read braille or have menus read to them, 
>> use
>> canes and use screen readers/magnification.  Both groups have members 
>> that
>> seem well functioning with jobs and have adjusted to being blind.  A big
>> difference I see in northern VA is ACB members don't have a defined
>> philosophy and this is not infused in the meeting.  They are a low key 
>> laid
>> back group.  NOVA ACB has a social committee which plans for accessible
>> tours, trips to described movies/plays, walks, and more.  Recently they 
>> set
>> up two tours of museums in DC.  NFB on the other hand is serious.  The 
>> tone
>> of the meeting is more strict.
>> Members are friendly but not laid back. They don't discuss social events
>> because that is not the purpose of the meeting.  Instead I hear about NFB
>> scholarships, planning to fundraise and convention.
>> So those are some of my observations about the local chapters of nfb and
>> ACB.
>> I contend that we can have joint activities if both parties agree but
>> certainly no merger.  Religious groups do this too.  Christians have non
>> denominational retreats and outreach events.
>> Differences are hidden and they focus on common goals.  But after the 
>> short
>> event they go back to their separate churches and worship in their own
>> style.
>>
>> Finally I did not mean to be judgemental.  But I think some of us young
>> people don't know the history.  I need to learn more myself.  I don't 
>> know
>> enough.
>> I just think that an idea to merge is so unreal that's its niave.
>> Will the Palistenians and Isralelies resolve differences and stop 
>> fighting?
>> I think not since this hatred is entrenched in history.  I wish there 
>> were
>> peace in the Middle East though.
>> Will the western and eastern ideals stop clashing?  I think not because 
>> we
>> have opposite views on lifestyle sometimes.
>>
>> Ashley
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Angela fowler" <fowlers at syix.com>
>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Monday, May 18, 2009 7:06 PM
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Ending the NFB/ACB feud
>>
>>
>>> Ashley, I think to say that folks are naive and unaware of the history
>>> between NFB and ACB is a hasty unfounded remark which fails to take into
>>> account two things.
>>> First, you said yourself that rank and file members of these
>>> organizations often have good cordial relationships. The project which 
>>> is
>>> being discussed is a grass-roots project which at this point has nothing
>>> to
>>> do with the leadership of either organization.
>>> Second, no one here has failed to acknowledge the history. Aziza,
>>> Jim and the other proponents of this project are just as well aware of 
>>> it
>>> as
>>> you and I are. What they are saying is that younger members of the NFB 
>>> and
>>> ACB were not around for the bitterest battles in the '60's and '70's, 
>>> and
>>> may be able to be brought together.
>>> Let's discuss the proposal on the bases of merit, and keep our hasty
>>> judgments about people's since of realism or knowledge of the
>>> organizations'
>>> history out of it!
>>> With respect
>>> Angela
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>> Behalf
>>> Of Ashley Bramlett
>>> Sent: Monday, May 18, 2009 3:44 PM
>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Ending the NFB/ACB feud
>>>
>>> Aziza,
>>> The ACB hates the nfb.  The leadership has different goals and 
>>> priorities.
>>> Also different philosophies.  Rank and file members of NFB often get 
>>> along
>>> as aquaintances with ACB and vise versa.  However we are too unlike.  We
>>> are
>>> best kept separate.  If you or anyone thinks we should merge 
>>> successfully,
>>> you are niave and do not know the history.  Why don't you read the 
>>> version
>>> of history of each group?  The ACB is People of Vision.  The nfb is
>>> Walking
>>> alone and Marching Together.
>>>
>>>
>>> Ashley
>>>
>>>
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>>
>>
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>
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