From raniaismail04 at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 02:43:28 2010 From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania ) Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 18:43:28 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! In-Reply-To: <0KYK009GAI454925@vms173005.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <4b8affad.85c2f10a.0f37.3223@mx.google.com> Hi My name is Rania, I am attending classes at Institute For Therapeutic Massage in NJ. Welcome to the list! Rania, -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Claudia Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:58 AM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! Hello, My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, and am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any ideas should you need it. Regards, Claudia B. Perry " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of man can perceive he can achieve." -- Napoleon Hill -----Original Message----- _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai l.com From dandrews at visi.com Mon Mar 1 01:12:12 2010 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 19:12:12 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Does anyone use a MacBook or MacBook Pro for school? In-Reply-To: <52CD820F340241D49E80247AA21C3C4E@OwnerPC> References: <52CD820F340241D49E80247AA21C3C4E@OwnerPC> Message-ID: Well, that is a pretty subjective statement. Using the Mac and using Windows screen readers is somewhat different, so it depends in part on what you are used to, and what you like. The important thing to keep in mind is how accessible are the applications you need/want to use. No one just uses a Mac or Windows, you do something, write, e-mail, surf the web, play music etc. So your choice should primarily be dictated by what applications you need and want to use. Dave At 07:34 PM 2/24/2010, you wrote: >Hi, > >I'm the parent of a blind 13 year old. He tells me that the screen >reader on the MacBook is great and that it is better than using a >Windows computer with JAWS. I'm curious whether or not this is >true. Have any of you used both? How do they compare? Which do >you prefer? Any insight you have would be greatly appreciated. > >Sally Thomas From alberto.2500 at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 02:41:11 2010 From: alberto.2500 at gmail.com (Alberto Arreola) Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 19:41:11 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! In-Reply-To: <0KYK009GAI454925@vms173005.mailsrvcs.net> References: <0KYK009GAI454925@vms173005.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <4b8b2946.9713f30a.6019.ffffcc55@mx.google.com> Welcome I'm Alberto I am a student at Utah Valley University. I'm studying for a computer science degree. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Claudia Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 12:58 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! Hello, My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, and am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any ideas should you need it. Regards, Claudia B. Perry " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of man can perceive he can achieve." -- Napoleon Hill -----Original Message----- _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail .com From claudia.perry at verizon.net Mon Mar 1 03:19:35 2010 From: claudia.perry at verizon.net (Claudia) Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 22:19:35 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! In-Reply-To: <3fea3c411002281346h7b62ecabw34ebdcc7a8dd4291@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <0KYL009O12KLWTW5@vms173005.mailsrvcs.net> Hello Nicole and Cindy, Cindy - thanks, I thought the quote was fantastic and describes my personal attributes.. Nicole - Since I did not lose my vision until 2001, I am not an avid Braille reader...I am in the process of learning contracted Braille. I cannot see large print, so I must rely on speech software. I like UOP because it has all of their textbooks online, so this was a perfect fit for me. If you ladies don't mind me asking, what are your majors at UNC and Stanford? Best, Claudia B. Perry " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of man can perceive he can achieve." -- Napoleon Hill -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Cindy Bennett Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 4:47 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! Hey, I am a junior at UNC Wilmington. I just wanted to say that i collect quotes, and i like the one in your signature. Cindy On 2/28/10, Nicole B. Torcolini wrote: > Hi, > > Welcome to the list. My name is Nicole; I am a sophomore at Stanford. > If you don't mind me asking, do you read Braille or large print? What > technology do you use? > > Nicole > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:57 AM > Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Hello, >> >> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently >> at University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan >> area, and am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can >> learn new techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here >> to give any ideas should you need it. >> >> Regards, >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >> mind of man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40 >> wavecable.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmai > l.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri zon.net From claudia.perry at verizon.net Mon Mar 1 03:21:17 2010 From: claudia.perry at verizon.net (Claudia) Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 22:21:17 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! In-Reply-To: <43979C438C45412CA5040A9E8785E028@hometwxakonvzn> Message-ID: <0KYL00KJF2NEPRL4@vms173017.mailsrvcs.net> Wow! Awesome, I am studying for my doctorate in Organizational psychology. I should complete it in 2014...long process, but I am excited about it! Regards, Claudia B. Perry " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of man can perceive he can achieve." -- Napoleon Hill -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of RJ Sandefur Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 5:01 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! Hi, I'm RJ Sandefur. I'm studying for my doctorate of theology. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Claudia" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 2:57 PM Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Hello, > > My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at > University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, > and > am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new > techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any > ideas should you need it. > > Regards, > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind > of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% 40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri zon.net From iamantonio at cox.net Mon Mar 1 04:19:27 2010 From: iamantonio at cox.net (Antonio M. Guimaraes) Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 23:19:27 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! References: <0KYK009GAI454925@vms173005.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: Claudia, Welcome. You will find lots of engaging, and informative posts here. We look forward to ones you compose yourself. Antonio Guimaraes If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary works in Braille. Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you. http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169 Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall ----- Original Message ----- From: "Claudia" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 2:57 PM Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Hello, > > My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at > University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, > and > am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new > techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any > ideas should you need it. > > Regards, > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind > of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net From joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 04:24:11 2010 From: joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com (RJ Sandefur) Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 23:24:11 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! References: <0KYL00KJF2NEPRL4@vms173017.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: Cool!, so are you conpletely blind? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Claudia" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 10:21 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Wow! Awesome, I am studying for my doctorate in Organizational psychology. > I > should complete it in 2014...long process, but I am excited about it! > > Regards, > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind > of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On > Behalf > Of RJ Sandefur > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 5:01 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Hi, I'm RJ Sandefur. I'm studying for my doctorate of theology. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 2:57 PM > Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Hello, >> >> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at >> University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, >> and >> am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new >> techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any >> ideas should you need it. >> >> Regards, >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >> of >> man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% > 40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri > zon.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 04:35:41 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 20:35:41 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! In-Reply-To: <4b8b2946.9713f30a.6019.ffffcc55@mx.google.com> References: <0KYK009GAI454925@vms173005.mailsrvcs.net> <4b8b2946.9713f30a.6019.ffffcc55@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <409c235c1002282035v367a28b1v139b568f2484a703@mail.gmail.com> Greetings! My name is Darian Smith, I am a student in San Francisco at city college of san francisco. I am studying to transfer to a four-year university andeventually get a degree in Orientation and mobility. As you can probably tell, there are some very intelligent, engaging and all-around nice people on this list and I am happy to be counted amungst the latest batch of people to have welcomed you! We all look forward to your unique insights and hope that we can assist as fellow students can. Best, Darian On 2/28/10, Alberto Arreola wrote: > Welcome I'm Alberto I am a student at Utah Valley University. I'm studying > for a computer science degree. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of Claudia > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 12:58 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Hello, > > My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at > University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, and > am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new > techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any > ideas should you need it. > > Regards, > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From corbbo at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 04:49:03 2010 From: corbbo at gmail.com (Corbb O'Connor) Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 23:49:03 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Thank you to the Membership Committee Message-ID: <9FF11798-2CAE-4E9A-BB34-5A799C874960@gmail.com> What a great conference call about parenting that you held tonight! Thanks for your work arranging this and making sure we were reminded about it several times! Corbb From nabs.president at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 05:15:44 2010 From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 23:15:44 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Thank you to the Membership Committee In-Reply-To: <9FF11798-2CAE-4E9A-BB34-5A799C874960@gmail.com> References: <9FF11798-2CAE-4E9A-BB34-5A799C874960@gmail.com> Message-ID: <85ff10071002282115m5d63fc8s32ea0c9c2f1136c3@mail.gmail.com> Hi all, Yes, I was there throughout the duration of the call, and I can say everyone stayed on their best behavior. :) In all seriousness, though, I thought it was a great discussion and the membership committee did an excellent job setting up the call and choosing two good role models to serve as speakers about parenting. I sincerely hope that more of you will participate in future NABS conference calls. I think many students will find the topics interesting and informative. Stay tuned for information about next month's call! Arielle On 2/28/10, Corbb O'Connor wrote: > What a great conference call about parenting that you held tonight! > Thanks for your work arranging this and making sure we were reminded > about it several times! > > Corbb > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com > -- Arielle Silverman President, National Association of Blind Students Phone: 602-502-2255 Email: nabs.president at gmail.com Website: www.nabslink.org From ntorcolini at wavecable.com Mon Mar 1 05:16:41 2010 From: ntorcolini at wavecable.com (Nicole B. Torcolini) Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 21:16:41 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! References: <0KYL009O12KLWTW5@vms173005.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <6432B468E31A49FDB20F562925593758@stanford.edu> I'm in the process of declaring my major as computer science. I lost my site when I was four, so I use Braille a lot. However, I do read a tiny bit slow at times, so I sometimes use the screen reader if there is a lot to read. What technology do you use? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Claudia" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 7:19 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Hello Nicole and Cindy, > > Cindy - thanks, I thought the quote was fantastic and describes my > personal > attributes.. > > Nicole - Since I did not lose my vision until 2001, I am not an avid > Braille > reader...I am in the process of learning contracted Braille. I cannot see > large print, so I must rely on speech software. I like UOP because it has > all of their textbooks online, so this was a perfect fit for me. If you > ladies don't mind me asking, what are your majors at UNC and Stanford? > > Best, > > > Claudia B. Perry > > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind > of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On > Behalf > Of Cindy Bennett > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 4:47 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Hey, I am a junior at UNC Wilmington. I just wanted to say that i collect > quotes, and i like the one in your signature. > > Cindy > > On 2/28/10, Nicole B. Torcolini wrote: >> Hi, >> >> Welcome to the list. My name is Nicole; I am a sophomore at >> Stanford. >> If you don't mind me asking, do you read Braille or large print? What >> technology do you use? >> >> Nicole >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Claudia" >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:57 AM >> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> >>> Hello, >>> >>> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently >>> at University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan >>> area, and am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can >>> learn new techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here >>> to give any ideas should you need it. >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Claudia B. Perry >>> >>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >>> mind of man can perceive he can achieve." >>> >>> -- Napoleon Hill >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40 >>> wavecable.com >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmai >> l.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri > zon.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecable.com From ntorcolini at wavecable.com Mon Mar 1 05:18:59 2010 From: ntorcolini at wavecable.com (Nicole B. Torcolini) Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 21:18:59 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! References: <0KYK009GAI454925@vms173005.mailsrvcs.net> <4b8b2946.9713f30a.6019.ffffcc55@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <839AFC30F9A94081969C8611607FB3CE@stanford.edu> Oh...another cs major? What's your favorite programming language? They started us on Java in high school, so that's my favorite. I will admit, though, that it is not without its limitations. I like it, though, because it almost won't allow you to mess up compared to the other languages that have almost no safety nets. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alberto Arreola" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 6:41 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Welcome I'm Alberto I am a student at Utah Valley University. I'm > studying > for a computer science degree. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On > Behalf > Of Claudia > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 12:58 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Hello, > > My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at > University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, > and > am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new > techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any > ideas should you need it. > > Regards, > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind > of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecable.com From nabs.president at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 05:28:35 2010 From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 23:28:35 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! In-Reply-To: <839AFC30F9A94081969C8611607FB3CE@stanford.edu> References: <0KYK009GAI454925@vms173005.mailsrvcs.net> <4b8b2946.9713f30a.6019.ffffcc55@mx.google.com> <839AFC30F9A94081969C8611607FB3CE@stanford.edu> Message-ID: <85ff10071002282128p1ffad573m66698e2faeca401a@mail.gmail.com> Hi Claudia, Welcome to the list. My name is Arielle Silverman and I am a graduate student at the University of Colorado getting my doctorate in social psychology, which I think is pretty similar to industrial/IO psych. I am also the current president of the National Association of Blind Students. If you should have any questions about our group or about how you can get involved in our parent organization, the National Federation of the Blind, please feel free to contact me by email at nabs.president at gmail.com or by phone at 602-502-2255 We will also be publishing our next issue of our quarterly newsletter, the Student Slate, soon, so stay tuned for that! You can read our latest issue on our Website at www.nabslink.org (it was just posted a few days ago!) Welcome again, Arielle Silverman President, National Association of Blind Students On 2/28/10, Nicole B. Torcolini wrote: > Oh...another cs major? What's your favorite programming language? They > started us on Java in high school, so that's my favorite. I will admit, > though, that it is not without its limitations. I like it, though, because > it almost won't allow you to mess up compared to the other languages that > have almost no safety nets. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Alberto Arreola" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 6:41 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Welcome I'm Alberto I am a student at Utah Valley University. I'm >> studying >> for a computer science degree. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of Claudia >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 12:58 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> Hello, >> >> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at >> University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, >> and >> am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new >> techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any >> ideas should you need it. >> >> Regards, >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >> of >> man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecable.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com > -- Arielle Silverman President, National Association of Blind Students Phone: 602-502-2255 Email: nabs.president at gmail.com Website: www.nabslink.org From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 06:03:02 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 22:03:02 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Thank you for Joining Us! Message-ID: <409c235c1002282203y6fb5b4ebr6ae00c19b811195d@mail.gmail.com> Hello everybody, I just wanted to take a moment and thank everyone for joining the National Association of Blind Students membership committee in what was a very informitive call. Melissa and Mark Riccabono were guest speakers on this call and were wonderful folks to share tips, tricks, and stories about being a blind parent. If you were there, I'm sure you will agree it was probably one of our best calls yet. If you missed it, just know there are more calls for everyone to make it to, and wonderful oppertunities to share stories with fellow students both familiar and unfamiliar to you. We'll be sending out the information for our next call very soon, so please stay tuned to your local list serve and check out nabs on twitter by looking up "nabslink" and on facebook by looking up "national association of blind students" Again, thank you for your presence on these calls and your support and please feel free to contact the membership committee should you have questions, comments or suggestions! Best, The Nabs Membership Committee. -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From claudia.perry at verizon.net Mon Mar 1 11:31:55 2010 From: claudia.perry at verizon.net (Claudia) Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2010 06:31:55 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! In-Reply-To: <4b8b2946.9713f30a.6019.ffffcc55@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <0KYL00L74PD3HCE5@vms173019.mailsrvcs.net> Hi Alberto, Nice to meet you. With a name like "Alberto", do you happen to be Hispanic? Regards, Claudia B. Perry " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of man can perceive he can achieve." -- Napoleon Hill -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Alberto Arreola Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 9:41 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! Welcome I'm Alberto I am a student at Utah Valley University. I'm studying for a computer science degree. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Claudia Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 12:58 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! Hello, My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, and am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any ideas should you need it. Regards, Claudia B. Perry " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of man can perceive he can achieve." -- Napoleon Hill -----Original Message----- _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri zon.net From claudia.perry at verizon.net Mon Mar 1 11:33:07 2010 From: claudia.perry at verizon.net (Claudia) Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2010 06:33:07 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! In-Reply-To: <409c235c1002282035v367a28b1v139b568f2484a703@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <0KYL00KKZPH0M1I0@vms173013.mailsrvcs.net> Thank you Darian, Looking forward to being involved with the group... Claudia B. Perry " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of man can perceive he can achieve." -- Napoleon Hill -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Darian Smith Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:36 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! Greetings! My name is Darian Smith, I am a student in San Francisco at city college of san francisco. I am studying to transfer to a four-year university andeventually get a degree in Orientation and mobility. As you can probably tell, there are some very intelligent, engaging and all-around nice people on this list and I am happy to be counted amungst the latest batch of people to have welcomed you! We all look forward to your unique insights and hope that we can assist as fellow students can. Best, Darian On 2/28/10, Alberto Arreola wrote: > Welcome I'm Alberto I am a student at Utah Valley University. I'm > studying for a computer science degree. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On > Behalf Of Claudia > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 12:58 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Hello, > > My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently > at University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan > area, and am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can > learn new techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here > to give any ideas should you need it. > > Regards, > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the > mind of man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gm > ail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri zon.net From claudia.perry at verizon.net Mon Mar 1 11:38:10 2010 From: claudia.perry at verizon.net (Claudia) Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2010 06:38:10 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] JAWS question In-Reply-To: <6432B468E31A49FDB20F562925593758@stanford.edu> Message-ID: <0KYL003PLPNIJRQ0@vms173001.mailsrvcs.net> Nicole, I use JAWS -- it is a God send, I would honestly be lost without it. Since we are in this topic I will pick your brains. I am having trouble finding a document, let's say a word document that may have some words in it, such as "blind student". So, when I am in "my documents" I know there is a search field, but I can't seem to get into it without the help of a sighted person. How do I search for a document in a specific folder, with just part of the title? Regards, Claudia B. Perry " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of man can perceive he can achieve." -- Napoleon Hill -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Nicole B. Torcolini Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 12:17 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! I'm in the process of declaring my major as computer science. I lost my site when I was four, so I use Braille a lot. However, I do read a tiny bit slow at times, so I sometimes use the screen reader if there is a lot to read. What technology do you use? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Claudia" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 7:19 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Hello Nicole and Cindy, > > Cindy - thanks, I thought the quote was fantastic and describes my > personal > attributes.. > > Nicole - Since I did not lose my vision until 2001, I am not an avid > Braille > reader...I am in the process of learning contracted Braille. I cannot see > large print, so I must rely on speech software. I like UOP because it has > all of their textbooks online, so this was a perfect fit for me. If you > ladies don't mind me asking, what are your majors at UNC and Stanford? > > Best, > > > Claudia B. Perry > > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind > of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On > Behalf > Of Cindy Bennett > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 4:47 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Hey, I am a junior at UNC Wilmington. I just wanted to say that i collect > quotes, and i like the one in your signature. > > Cindy > > On 2/28/10, Nicole B. Torcolini wrote: >> Hi, >> >> Welcome to the list. My name is Nicole; I am a sophomore at >> Stanford. >> If you don't mind me asking, do you read Braille or large print? What >> technology do you use? >> >> Nicole >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Claudia" >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:57 AM >> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> >>> Hello, >>> >>> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently >>> at University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan >>> area, and am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can >>> learn new techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here >>> to give any ideas should you need it. >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Claudia B. Perry >>> >>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >>> mind of man can perceive he can achieve." >>> >>> -- Napoleon Hill >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40 >>> wavecable.com >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmai >> l.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri > zon.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecab le.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri zon.net From claudia.perry at verizon.net Mon Mar 1 11:41:30 2010 From: claudia.perry at verizon.net (Claudia) Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2010 06:41:30 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <0KYL00ABSPUZ3LW1@vms173013.mailsrvcs.net> Hi RJ, I am not, but I can only see light. It is very poor. I have light perception in my right eye. My left eye is completely grayed out - no light perception there. Oh and I did forget to mention, I am a Air Force veteran. I was in the military from 1995 to 2000, I began having my vision difficulties while on active duty. I have a rare disorder named Devic's disease that rendered me blind and paralyzed from the chest down. Luckily, I have regained my strength back to walk again... Regards, Regards, Claudia B. Perry " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of man can perceive he can achieve." -- Napoleon Hill -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of RJ Sandefur Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:24 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! Cool!, so are you conpletely blind? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Claudia" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 10:21 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Wow! Awesome, I am studying for my doctorate in Organizational psychology. > I > should complete it in 2014...long process, but I am excited about it! > > Regards, > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind > of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On > Behalf > Of RJ Sandefur > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 5:01 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Hi, I'm RJ Sandefur. I'm studying for my doctorate of theology. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 2:57 PM > Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Hello, >> >> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at >> University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, >> and >> am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new >> techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any >> ideas should you need it. >> >> Regards, >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >> of >> man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% > 40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri > zon.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% 40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri zon.net From claudia.perry at verizon.net Mon Mar 1 11:45:13 2010 From: claudia.perry at verizon.net (Claudia) Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2010 06:45:13 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! In-Reply-To: <85ff10071002282128p1ffad573m66698e2faeca401a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <0KYL003XZPZ95FL3@vms173007.mailsrvcs.net> Hello Arielle, Thank you for the kind words. I am very excited about this group. I had planned to be at the conference, I just had to do some errands with my family. I am a parent myself, so the topic was very interesting...it was quite an adjustment from being a sighted parent to being a blind one. I think most of us had to adjust to that drastic change. Regards, Claudia B. Perry " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of man can perceive he can achieve." -- Napoleon Hill -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle Silverman Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 12:29 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! Hi Claudia, Welcome to the list. My name is Arielle Silverman and I am a graduate student at the University of Colorado getting my doctorate in social psychology, which I think is pretty similar to industrial/IO psych. I am also the current president of the National Association of Blind Students. If you should have any questions about our group or about how you can get involved in our parent organization, the National Federation of the Blind, please feel free to contact me by email at nabs.president at gmail.com or by phone at 602-502-2255 We will also be publishing our next issue of our quarterly newsletter, the Student Slate, soon, so stay tuned for that! You can read our latest issue on our Website at www.nabslink.org (it was just posted a few days ago!) Welcome again, Arielle Silverman President, National Association of Blind Students On 2/28/10, Nicole B. Torcolini wrote: > Oh...another cs major? What's your favorite programming language? > They started us on Java in high school, so that's my favorite. I will > admit, though, that it is not without its limitations. I like it, > though, because it almost won't allow you to mess up compared to the > other languages that have almost no safety nets. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Alberto Arreola" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 6:41 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Welcome I'm Alberto I am a student at Utah Valley University. I'm >> studying for a computer science degree. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf Of Claudia >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 12:58 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> Hello, >> >> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently >> at University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan >> area, and am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can >> learn new techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here >> to give any ideas should you need it. >> >> Regards, >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >> mind of man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500% >> 40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40 >> wavecable.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president > %40gmail.com > -- Arielle Silverman President, National Association of Blind Students Phone: 602-502-2255 Email: nabs.president at gmail.com Website: www.nabslink.org _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri zon.net From blindamp at q.com Mon Mar 1 12:46:30 2010 From: blindamp at q.com (Marty James) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2010 06:46:30 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns References: <20100228213708.17595.4707@web3.serotek.com> Message-ID: I am a blind hunter and I got a doe this year and am going for a turkey May 1st and 2nd. Marty James www.TheBlindBean.com Enjoy Your Java! Phone: 319-457-3582 Fax: 319-754-5226 E-mail: Marty at theblindbean.com 402 Center Street Middletown, IA 52638 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jedi" To: Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 3:37 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns > There is a blind man with a concealed weapons permit, but I can't remember > his name off hand. he's either from California or Florida, but his name > escapes me. He was all over the news for a while. > > Respectfully Submitted > > > Original message: >> Hello: > >> I know of two blind hunters. I presume they own their own firearms >> and >> transport them. I would think the bigger issue would be could the >> individual >> use a weapon. Blind hunters have sighted people help them aim. > >> Regards, > >> Robert Jaquiss, President >> Greater Ouachita Chapter >> National Federation of the Blind >> Email: rjaquiss at earthlink.net >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Robert Spangler" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2010 10:07 AM >> Subject: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns > > >>> Hello all, > >>> Does anyone know of any blind person who has experience with owning >>> guns, taken the concealed weapon carry test, or has any experience >>> with guns? My sister needs to know for a school research project. >>> Please email rachael.spangler at rockets.utoledo.edu > >>> Thanks, >>> -- >>> Robert Spangler >>> The University of Toledo >>> Student Senator - Administrative Affairs Committee Chair, College of >>> Arts and Sciences > >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/rjaquiss%40earthlink.net > > >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit > www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindamp%40q.com > From alberto.2500 at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 13:40:54 2010 From: alberto.2500 at gmail.com (Alberto Arreola) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2010 06:40:54 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! Message-ID: <4b8bc3d9.85c2f10a.2448.fffff107@mx.google.com> Yes i am. sent from my Verizon HTC Touch Pro 2 -----Original Message----- From: Claudia Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 4:31 AM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! Hi Alberto, Nice to meet you. With a name like "Alberto", do you happen to be Hispanic? Regards, Claudia B. Perry " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of man can perceive he can achieve." -- Napoleon Hill -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Alberto Arreola Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 9:41 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! Welcome I'm Alberto I am a student at Utah Valley University. I'm studying for a computer science degree. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Claudia Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 12:58 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! Hello, My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, and am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any ideas should you need it. Regards, Claudia B. Perry " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of man can perceive he can achieve." -- Napoleon Hill -----Original Message----- _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri zon.net _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail.com From joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 13:50:12 2010 From: joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com (RJ Sandefur) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2010 08:50:12 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] JAWS question References: <0KYL003PLPNIJRQ0@vms173001.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: Claudia, do you use Skype? RJ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Claudia" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 6:38 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] JAWS question > Nicole, > > I use JAWS -- it is a God send, I would honestly be lost without it. Since > we are in this topic I will pick your brains. I am having trouble finding > a > document, let's say a word document that may have some words in it, such > as > "blind student". So, when I am in "my documents" I know there is a search > field, but I can't seem to get into it without the help of a sighted > person. > How do I search for a document in a specific folder, with just part of the > title? > > Regards, > > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind > of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On > Behalf > Of Nicole B. Torcolini > Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 12:17 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > I'm in the process of declaring my major as computer science. I lost > my > site when I was four, so I use Braille a lot. However, I do read a tiny > bit > slow at times, so I sometimes use the screen reader if there is a lot to > read. What technology do you use? > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 7:19 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Hello Nicole and Cindy, >> >> Cindy - thanks, I thought the quote was fantastic and describes my >> personal >> attributes.. >> >> Nicole - Since I did not lose my vision until 2001, I am not an avid >> Braille >> reader...I am in the process of learning contracted Braille. I cannot see >> large print, so I must rely on speech software. I like UOP because it has >> all of their textbooks online, so this was a perfect fit for me. If you >> ladies don't mind me asking, what are your majors at UNC and Stanford? >> >> Best, >> >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >> of >> man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of Cindy Bennett >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 4:47 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> Hey, I am a junior at UNC Wilmington. I just wanted to say that i collect >> quotes, and i like the one in your signature. >> >> Cindy >> >> On 2/28/10, Nicole B. Torcolini wrote: >>> Hi, >>> >>> Welcome to the list. My name is Nicole; I am a sophomore at >>> Stanford. >>> If you don't mind me asking, do you read Braille or large print? What >>> technology do you use? >>> >>> Nicole >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Claudia" >>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >>> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:57 AM >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >>> >>> >>>> Hello, >>>> >>>> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently >>>> at University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan >>>> area, and am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can >>>> learn new techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here >>>> to give any ideas should you need it. >>>> >>>> Regards, >>>> >>>> Claudia B. Perry >>>> >>>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >>>> mind of man can perceive he can achieve." >>>> >>>> -- Napoleon Hill >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40 >>>> wavecable.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmai >>> l.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri >> zon.net >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecab > le.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri > zon.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com From alberto.2500 at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 14:12:10 2010 From: alberto.2500 at gmail.com (Alberto Arreola) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2010 07:12:10 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns Message-ID: <4b8bcb2d.c6c1f10a.7ac8.ffffc661@mx.google.com> That is really cool. How do you hunt do you have a sighted person help you poing the gun, or do you go just by sound? sent from my Verizon HTC Touch Pro 2 -----Original Message----- From: Marty James Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 5:46 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns I am a blind hunter and I got a doe this year and am going for a turkey May 1st and 2nd. Marty James www.TheBlindBean.com Enjoy Your Java! Phone: 319-457-3582 Fax: 319-754-5226 E-mail: Marty at theblindbean.com 402 Center Street Middletown, IA 52638 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jedi" To: Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 3:37 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns > There is a blind man with a concealed weapons permit, but I can't remember > his name off hand. he's either from California or Florida, but his name > escapes me. He was all over the news for a while. > > Respectfully Submitted > > > Original message: >> Hello: > >> I know of two blind hunters. I presume they own their own firearms >> and >> transport them. I would think the bigger issue would be could the >> individual >> use a weapon. Blind hunters have sighted people help them aim. > >> Regards, > >> Robert Jaquiss, President >> Greater Ouachita Chapter >> National Federation of the Blind >> Email: rjaquiss at earthlink.net >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Robert Spangler" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2010 10:07 AM >> Subject: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns > > >>> Hello all, > >>> Does anyone know of any blind person who has experience with owning >>> guns, taken the concealed weapon carry test, or has any experience >>> with guns? My sister needs to know for a school research project. >>> Please email rachael.spangler at rockets.utoledo.edu > >>> Thanks, >>> -- >>> Robert Spangler >>> The University of Toledo >>> Student Senator - Administrative Affairs Committee Chair, College of >>> Arts and Sciences > >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/rjaquiss%40earthlink.net > > >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit > www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindamp%40q.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail.com From joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 14:19:40 2010 From: joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com (RJ Sandefur) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2010 09:19:40 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! References: <0KYL00ABSPUZ3LW1@vms173013.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: I've been blind my whole life, and have told people, if I could see, I'd be in the United States Milatary! Thank you for serving your country! RJ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Claudia" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 6:41 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Hi RJ, > > I am not, but I can only see light. It is very poor. I have light > perception > in my right eye. My left eye is completely grayed out - no light > perception > there. Oh and I did forget to mention, I am a Air Force veteran. I was in > the military from 1995 to 2000, I began having my vision difficulties > while > on active duty. I have a rare disorder named Devic's disease that rendered > me blind and paralyzed from the chest down. Luckily, I have regained my > strength back to walk again... > > Regards, > > > Regards, > > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind > of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On > Behalf > Of RJ Sandefur > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:24 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Cool!, so are you conpletely blind? > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 10:21 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Wow! Awesome, I am studying for my doctorate in Organizational >> psychology. > >> I >> should complete it in 2014...long process, but I am excited about it! >> >> Regards, >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >> of >> man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of RJ Sandefur >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 5:01 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> Hi, I'm RJ Sandefur. I'm studying for my doctorate of theology. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Claudia" >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 2:57 PM >> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> >>> Hello, >>> >>> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at >>> University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, >>> and >>> am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new >>> techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any >>> ideas should you need it. >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Claudia B. Perry >>> >>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >>> mind >>> of >>> man can perceive he can achieve." >>> >>> -- Napoleon Hill >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% >> 40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri >> zon.net >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% > 40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri > zon.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com > From blindamp at q.com Mon Mar 1 15:10:08 2010 From: blindamp at q.com (Marty James) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2010 09:10:08 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns References: <4b8bcb2d.c6c1f10a.7ac8.ffffc661@mx.google.com> Message-ID: I have a laser scope on the gun. A guide tells me up, down, right or left and the whole control of the gun is in my hands. I also have a pistol that I shoot very accurately by sound for the house. Marty James www.TheBlindBean.com Enjoy Your Java! Phone: 319-457-3582 Fax: 319-754-5226 E-mail: Marty at theblindbean.com 402 Center Street Middletown, IA 52638 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alberto Arreola" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 8:12 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns > That is really cool. > How do you hunt do you have a sighted person help you poing the gun, or do > you go just by sound? > > sent from my Verizon HTC Touch Pro 2 > > -----Original Message----- > From: Marty James > Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 5:46 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns > > I am a blind hunter and I got a doe this year and am going for a turkey > May > 1st and 2nd. > Marty James > www.TheBlindBean.com > Enjoy Your Java! > > Phone: 319-457-3582 > Fax: 319-754-5226 > E-mail: Marty at theblindbean.com > > 402 Center Street > Middletown, IA > 52638 > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jedi" > To: > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 3:37 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns > > >> There is a blind man with a concealed weapons permit, but I can't >> remember >> his name off hand. he's either from California or Florida, but his name >> escapes me. He was all over the news for a while. >> >> Respectfully Submitted >> >> >> Original message: >>> Hello: >> >>> I know of two blind hunters. I presume they own their own firearms >>> and >>> transport them. I would think the bigger issue would be could the >>> individual >>> use a weapon. Blind hunters have sighted people help them aim. >> >>> Regards, >> >>> Robert Jaquiss, President >>> Greater Ouachita Chapter >>> National Federation of the Blind >>> Email: rjaquiss at earthlink.net >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Robert Spangler" >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> >>> Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2010 10:07 AM >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns >> >> >>>> Hello all, >> >>>> Does anyone know of any blind person who has experience with owning >>>> guns, taken the concealed weapon carry test, or has any experience >>>> with guns? My sister needs to know for a school research project. >>>> Please email rachael.spangler at rockets.utoledo.edu >> >>>> Thanks, >>>> -- >>>> Robert Spangler >>>> The University of Toledo >>>> Student Senator - Administrative Affairs Committee Chair, College of >>>> Arts and Sciences >> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/rjaquiss%40earthlink.net >> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net >> >> -- >> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindamp%40q.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindamp%40q.com > From bunnykatie6 at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 20:02:05 2010 From: bunnykatie6 at gmail.com (Katie Wang) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2010 15:02:05 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! In-Reply-To: References: <0KYL00ABSPUZ3LW1@vms173013.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <5096b4731003011202h6977fbabif6e1f04e9553363f@mail.gmail.com> Hi, Claudia, Welcome to the list! I just joined this group a few months ago but have found some very informative posts. I'm a graduate student in social psychology at Yale University, and I studied a bit of I/O psych as an undergrad. I'm a braille reader and a JAWS user. Feel free to contact me off-list if you have any questions about being a blind grad student in psychology! Best of luck with your studies! Katie On 3/1/10, RJ Sandefur wrote: > I've been blind my whole life, and have told people, if I could see, I'd be > in the United States Milatary! Thank you for serving your country! RJ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 6:41 AM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Hi RJ, >> >> I am not, but I can only see light. It is very poor. I have light >> perception >> in my right eye. My left eye is completely grayed out - no light >> perception >> there. Oh and I did forget to mention, I am a Air Force veteran. I was in >> the military from 1995 to 2000, I began having my vision difficulties >> while >> on active duty. I have a rare disorder named Devic's disease that rendered >> me blind and paralyzed from the chest down. Luckily, I have regained my >> strength back to walk again... >> >> Regards, >> >> >> Regards, >> >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >> of >> man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of RJ Sandefur >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:24 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> Cool!, so are you conpletely blind? >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Claudia" >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 10:21 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> >>> Wow! Awesome, I am studying for my doctorate in Organizational >>> psychology. >> >>> I >>> should complete it in 2014...long process, but I am excited about it! >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Claudia B. Perry >>> >>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >>> of >>> man can perceive he can achieve." >>> >>> -- Napoleon Hill >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>> Behalf >>> Of RJ Sandefur >>> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 5:01 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >>> >>> Hi, I'm RJ Sandefur. I'm studying for my doctorate of theology. >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Claudia" >>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >>> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 2:57 PM >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >>> >>> >>>> Hello, >>>> >>>> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at >>>> University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, >>>> and >>>> am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new >>>> techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any >>>> ideas should you need it. >>>> >>>> Regards, >>>> >>>> Claudia B. Perry >>>> >>>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >>>> mind >>>> of >>>> man can perceive he can achieve." >>>> >>>> -- Napoleon Hill >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% >>> 40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri >>> zon.net >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% >> 40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri >> zon.net >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmail.com > From mrsmigs at migliorelli.org Mon Mar 1 20:39:55 2010 From: mrsmigs at migliorelli.org (Maryann Migliorelli) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2010 13:39:55 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! References: <0KYL00KJF2NEPRL4@vms173017.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <018EB229338941F1AC23FE43C68AA283@PAULLAPTOP> Hi Claudia, I'm glad to see you took my advice and joined us. I'm sure you can add a lot to this list, and your willingness to learn from fellow students will serve you well. Please feel welcomed and know that you are among friends. Maryann Migliorelli From astrochem119 at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 22:51:17 2010 From: astrochem119 at gmail.com (Chelsea Cook) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2010 17:51:17 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! Message-ID: Hi, I am Chelsea Cook, long-time Federationist. I am about to graduate from high school and have been accepted at Virginia Tech and Florida Institute of Technology. Those are my top two, anyway. I love physics and astronomy and want to study physics or astrophysics (depending on where I go) for undergrad. I love quotes, too, so whoever had that file, please send it to me! I enjoy writing science fiction novels and poetry. Claudia, I like your sig quote! By the way, if any of you have heard about FIT, please let me know off-list. I am still deciding. Good luck in getting your doctorate and welcome! No matter what background you come from (I have been blind from birth and read Braille fluently) there are always people here for you to network and find support from. And no matter what, there will always be someone after you who can benifit from your experiences, so share! From, Chelsea Cook On 3/1/10, nabs-l-request at nfbnet.org wrote: > Send nabs-l mailing list submissions to > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > nabs-l-request at nfbnet.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > nabs-l-owner at nfbnet.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of nabs-l digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Greetings - New Member! (Claudia) > 2. Re: Greetings - New Member! (Nicole B. Torcolini) > 3. Re: Blind People Owning Guns (Jedi) > 4. Re: Greetings - New Member! (Cindy Bennett) > 5. Re: Greetings - New Member! (RJ Sandefur) > 6. Re: Greetings - New Member! (Nicole B. Torcolini) > 7. Re: Reminder about conference call (Antonio M. Guimaraes) > 8. Re: Greetings - New Member! (Rania ) > 9. Re: Does anyone use a MacBook or MacBook Pro for school? > (David Andrews) > 10. Re: Greetings - New Member! (Alberto Arreola) > 11. Re: Greetings - New Member! (Claudia) > 12. Re: Greetings - New Member! (Claudia) > 13. Re: Greetings - New Member! (Antonio M. Guimaraes) > 14. Re: Greetings - New Member! (RJ Sandefur) > 15. Re: Greetings - New Member! (Darian Smith) > 16. Thank you to the Membership Committee (Corbb O'Connor) > 17. Re: Thank you to the Membership Committee (Arielle Silverman) > 18. Re: Greetings - New Member! (Nicole B. Torcolini) > 19. Re: Greetings - New Member! (Nicole B. Torcolini) > 20. Re: Greetings - New Member! (Arielle Silverman) > 21. Thank you for Joining Us! (Darian Smith) > 22. Re: Greetings - New Member! (Claudia) > 23. Re: Greetings - New Member! (Claudia) > 24. Re: JAWS question (Claudia) > 25. Re: Greetings - New Member! (Claudia) > 26. Re: Greetings - New Member! (Claudia) > 27. Re: Blind People Owning Guns (Marty James) > 28. Re: Greetings - New Member! (Alberto Arreola) > 29. Re: JAWS question (RJ Sandefur) > 30. Re: Blind People Owning Guns (Alberto Arreola) > 31. Re: Greetings - New Member! (RJ Sandefur) > 32. Re: Blind People Owning Guns (Marty James) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 14:57:43 -0500 > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Message-ID: <0KYK009GAI454925 at vms173005.mailsrvcs.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > > Hello, > > My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at > University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, and > am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new > techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any > ideas should you need it. > > Regards, > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 13:28:38 -0800 > From: "Nicole B. Torcolini" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Message-ID: <4C5FF75C769144CC97359E1188A1EF53 at stanford.edu> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > > Hi, > > Welcome to the list. My name is Nicole; I am a sophomore at Stanford. > If you don't mind me asking, do you read Braille or large print? What > technology do you use? > > Nicole > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:57 AM > Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Hello, >> >> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at >> University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, >> and >> am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new >> techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any >> ideas should you need it. >> >> Regards, >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >> of >> man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecable.com >> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 16:37:08 -0500 > From: Jedi > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns > Message-ID: <20100228213708.17595.4707 at web3.serotek.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format="flowed" > > There is a blind man with a concealed weapons permit, but I can't > remember his name off hand. he's either from California or Florida, but > his name escapes me. He was all over the news for a while. > > Respectfully Submitted > > > Original message: >> Hello: > >> I know of two blind hunters. I presume they own their own firearms >> and >> transport them. I would think the bigger issue would be could the >> individual >> use a weapon. Blind hunters have sighted people help them aim. > >> Regards, > >> Robert Jaquiss, President >> Greater Ouachita Chapter >> National Federation of the Blind >> Email: rjaquiss at earthlink.net >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Robert Spangler" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2010 10:07 AM >> Subject: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns > > >>> Hello all, > >>> Does anyone know of any blind person who has experience with owning >>> guns, taken the concealed weapon carry test, or has any experience >>> with guns? My sister needs to know for a school research project. >>> Please email rachael.spangler at rockets.utoledo.edu > >>> Thanks, >>> -- >>> Robert Spangler >>> The University of Toledo >>> Student Senator - Administrative Affairs Committee Chair, College of >>> Arts and Sciences > >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/rjaquiss%40earthlink.net > > >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit > www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 16:46:58 -0500 > From: Cindy Bennett > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Message-ID: > <3fea3c411002281346h7b62ecabw34ebdcc7a8dd4291 at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > Hey, I am a junior at UNC Wilmington. I just wanted to say that i > collect quotes, and i like the one in your signature. > > Cindy > > On 2/28/10, Nicole B. Torcolini wrote: >> Hi, >> >> Welcome to the list. My name is Nicole; I am a sophomore at Stanford. >> If you don't mind me asking, do you read Braille or large print? What >> technology do you use? >> >> Nicole >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Claudia" >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:57 AM >> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> >>> Hello, >>> >>> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at >>> University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, >>> and >>> am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new >>> techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any >>> ideas should you need it. >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Claudia B. Perry >>> >>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >>> of >>> man can perceive he can achieve." >>> >>> -- Napoleon Hill >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecable.com >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.com >> > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 17:00:41 -0500 > From: "RJ Sandefur" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Message-ID: <43979C438C45412CA5040A9E8785E028 at hometwxakonvzn> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > > Hi, I'm RJ Sandefur. I'm studying for my doctorate of theology. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 2:57 PM > Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Hello, >> >> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at >> University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, >> and >> am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new >> techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any >> ideas should you need it. >> >> Regards, >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >> of >> man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com >> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 14:42:10 -0800 > From: "Nicole B. Torcolini" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Message-ID: <4C8F5E8645824B5C8C31E03F41151C2D at stanford.edu> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > > You collect quotes? Do you just collect ones from famous people, or can they > be from books as well? I have a whole file of ones that I have written down > from my reading. Would you like them? > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Cindy Bennett" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 1:46 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Hey, I am a junior at UNC Wilmington. I just wanted to say that i >> collect quotes, and i like the one in your signature. >> >> Cindy >> >> On 2/28/10, Nicole B. Torcolini wrote: >>> Hi, >>> >>> Welcome to the list. My name is Nicole; I am a sophomore at >>> Stanford. >>> If you don't mind me asking, do you read Braille or large print? What >>> technology do you use? >>> >>> Nicole >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Claudia" >>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >>> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:57 AM >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >>> >>> >>>> Hello, >>>> >>>> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at >>>> University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, >>>> and >>>> am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new >>>> techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any >>>> ideas should you need it. >>>> >>>> Regards, >>>> >>>> Claudia B. Perry >>>> >>>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >>>> mind >>>> of >>>> man can perceive he can achieve." >>>> >>>> -- Napoleon Hill >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecable.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecable.com >> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 7 > Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 18:03:48 -0500 > From: "Antonio M. Guimaraes" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Reminder about conference call > Message-ID: <6D3E21B2924648F2BC6DF50FFAA9CB20 at userf9b4fa60eb> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > > Conference call in about an hour > > Antonio Guimaraes > > If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup > trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of > highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary > works in Braille. > > Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you. > http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169 > Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Antonio M. Guimaraes" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2010 5:19 PM > Subject: [nabs-l] Reminder about conference call > > >> Hello all, >> >> I am re-posting the message about the NABS conference call that will take >> place tomorrow. >> >> Join the National Association of Blind Students and the membership >> committee in our latest conference call. >> >> This time we have Melissa and Mark Riccobono to discussing parenting as a >> blind person, and couple. >> >> Melissa is blind, and the president of the National Federation of the >> Blind of Md. She has been a leader in the Human Services Division. >> >> Mark Riccobono is director of the NFB Jernigan Institute. His leadership >> and ideas help drive our movement. >> >> Mark and Melissa are parents to Austin Riccobono, and they are expecting a >> >> second child. >> >> Join the call on February 28 at 7:00 pm eastern, 6 central, 5 mountain, 4 >> pacific. >> >> Dial 712-775-7100, >> access code 257963. >> >> Whether you are a parent, or might become a blind parent in the future; if >> >> you are a care-taker; if you want to know the joys and trials or >> parenting, and the unique aspects of parenting as a blind person, help >> make this call a success by joining and participating. >> >> This call is for you, so make the best of it. >> >> Antonio Guimaraes >> Membership committee >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net >> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 8 > Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 18:43:28 -0800 > From: "Rania " > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Message-ID: <4b8affad.85c2f10a.0f37.3223 at mx.google.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > Hi My name is Rania, > I am attending classes at Institute For Therapeutic Massage in NJ. > Welcome to the list! > Rania, > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of Claudia > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:58 AM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Hello, > > My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at > University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, and > am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new > techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any > ideas should you need it. > > Regards, > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai > l.com > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 9 > Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 19:12:12 -0600 > From: David Andrews > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does anyone use a MacBook or MacBook Pro for > school? > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed > > Well, that is a pretty subjective statement. Using the Mac and using > Windows screen readers is somewhat different, so it depends in part > on what you are used to, and what you like. > > The important thing to keep in mind is how accessible are the > applications you need/want to use. No one just uses a Mac or > Windows, you do something, write, e-mail, surf the web, play music > etc. So your choice should primarily be dictated by what > applications you need and want to use. > > Dave > > At 07:34 PM 2/24/2010, you wrote: >>Hi, >> >>I'm the parent of a blind 13 year old. He tells me that the screen >>reader on the MacBook is great and that it is better than using a >>Windows computer with JAWS. I'm curious whether or not this is >>true. Have any of you used both? How do they compare? Which do >>you prefer? Any insight you have would be greatly appreciated. >> >>Sally Thomas > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 10 > Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 19:41:11 -0700 > From: "Alberto Arreola" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Message-ID: <4b8b2946.9713f30a.6019.ffffcc55 at mx.google.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > Welcome I'm Alberto I am a student at Utah Valley University. I'm studying > for a computer science degree. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of Claudia > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 12:58 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Hello, > > My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at > University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, and > am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new > techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any > ideas should you need it. > > Regards, > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail > .com > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 11 > Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 22:19:35 -0500 > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Message-ID: <0KYL009O12KLWTW5 at vms173005.mailsrvcs.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > > Hello Nicole and Cindy, > > Cindy - thanks, I thought the quote was fantastic and describes my personal > attributes.. > > Nicole - Since I did not lose my vision until 2001, I am not an avid Braille > reader...I am in the process of learning contracted Braille. I cannot see > large print, so I must rely on speech software. I like UOP because it has > all of their textbooks online, so this was a perfect fit for me. If you > ladies don't mind me asking, what are your majors at UNC and Stanford? > > Best, > > > Claudia B. Perry > > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of Cindy Bennett > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 4:47 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Hey, I am a junior at UNC Wilmington. I just wanted to say that i collect > quotes, and i like the one in your signature. > > Cindy > > On 2/28/10, Nicole B. Torcolini wrote: >> Hi, >> >> Welcome to the list. My name is Nicole; I am a sophomore at Stanford. >> If you don't mind me asking, do you read Braille or large print? What >> technology do you use? >> >> Nicole >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Claudia" >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:57 AM >> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> >>> Hello, >>> >>> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently >>> at University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan >>> area, and am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can >>> learn new techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here >>> to give any ideas should you need it. >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Claudia B. Perry >>> >>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >>> mind of man can perceive he can achieve." >>> >>> -- Napoleon Hill >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40 >>> wavecable.com >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmai >> l.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri > zon.net > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 12 > Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 22:21:17 -0500 > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Message-ID: <0KYL00KJF2NEPRL4 at vms173017.mailsrvcs.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > > Wow! Awesome, I am studying for my doctorate in Organizational psychology. I > should complete it in 2014...long process, but I am excited about it! > > Regards, > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of RJ Sandefur > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 5:01 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Hi, I'm RJ Sandefur. I'm studying for my doctorate of theology. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 2:57 PM > Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Hello, >> >> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at >> University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, >> and >> am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new >> techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any >> ideas should you need it. >> >> Regards, >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >> of >> man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% > 40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri > zon.net > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 13 > Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 23:19:27 -0500 > From: "Antonio M. Guimaraes" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > > Claudia, > > Welcome. > > You will find lots of engaging, and informative posts here. We look forward > to ones you compose yourself. > > Antonio Guimaraes > > If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup > trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of > highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary > works in Braille. > > Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you. > http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169 > Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 2:57 PM > Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Hello, >> >> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at >> University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, >> and >> am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new >> techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any >> ideas should you need it. >> >> Regards, >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >> of >> man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net >> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 14 > Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 23:24:11 -0500 > From: "RJ Sandefur" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > > Cool!, so are you conpletely blind? > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 10:21 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Wow! Awesome, I am studying for my doctorate in Organizational psychology. >> >> I >> should complete it in 2014...long process, but I am excited about it! >> >> Regards, >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >> of >> man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of RJ Sandefur >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 5:01 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> Hi, I'm RJ Sandefur. I'm studying for my doctorate of theology. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Claudia" >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 2:57 PM >> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> >>> Hello, >>> >>> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at >>> University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, >>> and >>> am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new >>> techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any >>> ideas should you need it. >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Claudia B. Perry >>> >>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >>> of >>> man can perceive he can achieve." >>> >>> -- Napoleon Hill >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% >> 40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri >> zon.net >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com >> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 15 > Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 20:35:41 -0800 > From: Darian Smith > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Message-ID: > <409c235c1002282035v367a28b1v139b568f2484a703 at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > Greetings! > My name is Darian Smith, > I am a student in San Francisco at city college of san francisco. > I am studying to transfer to a four-year university andeventually get > a degree in Orientation and mobility. > As you can probably tell, there are some very intelligent, engaging > and all-around nice people on this list and I am happy to be counted > amungst the latest batch of people to have welcomed you! We all > look forward to your unique insights and hope that we can assist as > fellow students can. > Best, > Darian > > On 2/28/10, Alberto Arreola wrote: >> Welcome I'm Alberto I am a student at Utah Valley University. I'm >> studying >> for a computer science degree. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of Claudia >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 12:58 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> Hello, >> >> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at >> University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, >> and >> am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new >> techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any >> ideas should you need it. >> >> Regards, >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >> of >> man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Darian Smith > Skype: The_Blind_Truth > Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com > The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher > recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate > individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your > help! To Get Involved go to: > www.TeachBlindStudents.org > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 16 > Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 23:49:03 -0500 > From: Corbb O'Connor > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > Subject: [nabs-l] Thank you to the Membership Committee > Message-ID: <9FF11798-2CAE-4E9A-BB34-5A799C874960 at gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes > > What a great conference call about parenting that you held tonight! > Thanks for your work arranging this and making sure we were reminded > about it several times! > > Corbb > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 17 > Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 23:15:44 -0600 > From: Arielle Silverman > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Thank you to the Membership Committee > Message-ID: > <85ff10071002282115m5d63fc8s32ea0c9c2f1136c3 at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > Hi all, > > Yes, I was there throughout the duration of the call, and I can say > everyone stayed on their best behavior. :) > > In all seriousness, though, I thought it was a great discussion and > the membership committee did an excellent job setting up the call and > choosing two good role models to serve as speakers about parenting. > > I sincerely hope that more of you will participate in future NABS > conference calls. I think many students will find the topics > interesting and informative. > > Stay tuned for information about next month's call! > > Arielle > > On 2/28/10, Corbb O'Connor wrote: >> What a great conference call about parenting that you held tonight! >> Thanks for your work arranging this and making sure we were reminded >> about it several times! >> >> Corbb >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Arielle Silverman > President, National Association of Blind Students > Phone: 602-502-2255 > Email: > nabs.president at gmail.com > Website: > www.nabslink.org > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 18 > Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 21:16:41 -0800 > From: "Nicole B. Torcolini" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Message-ID: <6432B468E31A49FDB20F562925593758 at stanford.edu> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > > I'm in the process of declaring my major as computer science. I lost my > site when I was four, so I use Braille a lot. However, I do read a tiny bit > slow at times, so I sometimes use the screen reader if there is a lot to > read. What technology do you use? > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 7:19 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Hello Nicole and Cindy, >> >> Cindy - thanks, I thought the quote was fantastic and describes my >> personal >> attributes.. >> >> Nicole - Since I did not lose my vision until 2001, I am not an avid >> Braille >> reader...I am in the process of learning contracted Braille. I cannot see >> large print, so I must rely on speech software. I like UOP because it has >> all of their textbooks online, so this was a perfect fit for me. If you >> ladies don't mind me asking, what are your majors at UNC and Stanford? >> >> Best, >> >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >> of >> man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of Cindy Bennett >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 4:47 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> Hey, I am a junior at UNC Wilmington. I just wanted to say that i collect >> quotes, and i like the one in your signature. >> >> Cindy >> >> On 2/28/10, Nicole B. Torcolini wrote: >>> Hi, >>> >>> Welcome to the list. My name is Nicole; I am a sophomore at >>> Stanford. >>> If you don't mind me asking, do you read Braille or large print? What >>> technology do you use? >>> >>> Nicole >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Claudia" >>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >>> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:57 AM >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >>> >>> >>>> Hello, >>>> >>>> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently >>>> at University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan >>>> area, and am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can >>>> learn new techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here >>>> to give any ideas should you need it. >>>> >>>> Regards, >>>> >>>> Claudia B. Perry >>>> >>>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >>>> mind of man can perceive he can achieve." >>>> >>>> -- Napoleon Hill >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40 >>>> wavecable.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmai >>> l.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri >> zon.net >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecable.com >> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 19 > Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 21:18:59 -0800 > From: "Nicole B. Torcolini" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Message-ID: <839AFC30F9A94081969C8611607FB3CE at stanford.edu> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > > Oh...another cs major? What's your favorite programming language? They > started us on Java in high school, so that's my favorite. I will admit, > though, that it is not without its limitations. I like it, though, because > it almost won't allow you to mess up compared to the other languages that > have almost no safety nets. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Alberto Arreola" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 6:41 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Welcome I'm Alberto I am a student at Utah Valley University. I'm >> studying >> for a computer science degree. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of Claudia >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 12:58 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> Hello, >> >> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at >> University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, >> and >> am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new >> techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any >> ideas should you need it. >> >> Regards, >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >> of >> man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecable.com >> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 20 > Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 23:28:35 -0600 > From: Arielle Silverman > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Message-ID: > <85ff10071002282128p1ffad573m66698e2faeca401a at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > Hi Claudia, > > Welcome to the list. My name is Arielle Silverman and I am a graduate > student at the University of Colorado getting my doctorate in social > psychology, which I think is pretty similar to industrial/IO psych. I > am also the current president of the National Association of Blind > Students. If you should have any questions about our group or about > how you can get involved in our parent organization, the National > Federation of the Blind, please feel free to contact me by email at > nabs.president at gmail.com > or by phone at > 602-502-2255 > We will also be publishing our next issue of our quarterly newsletter, > the Student Slate, soon, so stay tuned for that! You can read our > latest issue on our Website at > www.nabslink.org > (it was just posted a few days ago!) > > Welcome again, > Arielle Silverman > President, National Association of Blind Students > > On 2/28/10, Nicole B. Torcolini wrote: >> Oh...another cs major? What's your favorite programming language? They >> started us on Java in high school, so that's my favorite. I will admit, >> though, that it is not without its limitations. I like it, though, because >> it almost won't allow you to mess up compared to the other languages that >> have almost no safety nets. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Alberto Arreola" >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 6:41 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> >>> Welcome I'm Alberto I am a student at Utah Valley University. I'm >>> studying >>> for a computer science degree. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>> Behalf >>> Of Claudia >>> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 12:58 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >>> >>> Hello, >>> >>> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at >>> University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, >>> and >>> am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new >>> techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any >>> ideas should you need it. >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Claudia B. Perry >>> >>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >>> of >>> man can perceive he can achieve." >>> >>> -- Napoleon Hill >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecable.com >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Arielle Silverman > President, National Association of Blind Students > Phone: 602-502-2255 > Email: > nabs.president at gmail.com > Website: > www.nabslink.org > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 21 > Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 22:03:02 -0800 > From: Darian Smith > To: Arizona-students at nfbnet.org, cabs-talk , > Colorado Center for the Blind mailing list , > Colorado Students , Florida Students > , Gabs at nfbnet.org, Illinois Students > , Kansas Students , Kentucky > Students , List for NABS State Presidents > , Louisiana Students > , mabs-request at nfbnet.org, Minnesota Students > , National Association of Blind Students mailing > list , New Hampshire Students > , New Jersey Students > , New Mexico Association of Blind Students > , North Carolina Students , > Oabs at nfbnet.org, tabs_students at googlegroups.com, Tennessee Students > , Utah Students , Virginia Students > > Subject: [nabs-l] Thank you for Joining Us! > Message-ID: > <409c235c1002282203y6fb5b4ebr6ae00c19b811195d at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > Hello everybody, > I just wanted to take a moment and thank everyone for joining the > National Association of Blind Students membership committee in what > was a very informitive call. > Melissa and Mark Riccabono were guest speakers on this call and > were wonderful folks to share tips, tricks, and stories about being a > blind parent. If you were there, I'm sure you will agree it was > probably one of our best calls yet. > If you missed it, just know there are more calls for everyone to > make it to, and wonderful oppertunities to share stories with fellow > students both familiar and unfamiliar to you. We'll be sending out > the information for our next call very soon, so please stay tuned > to your local list serve and check out nabs on twitter by looking up > "nabslink" and on facebook by looking up "national association of > blind students" > Again, thank you for your presence on these calls and your support and > please feel free to contact the membership committee should you have > questions, comments or suggestions! > Best, > The Nabs Membership Committee. > > -- > Darian Smith > Skype: The_Blind_Truth > Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com > The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher > recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate > individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your > help! To Get Involved go to: > www.TeachBlindStudents.org > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 22 > Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2010 06:31:55 -0500 > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Message-ID: <0KYL00L74PD3HCE5 at vms173019.mailsrvcs.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > > Hi Alberto, > > Nice to meet you. With a name like "Alberto", do you happen to be Hispanic? > > Regards, > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of Alberto Arreola > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 9:41 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Welcome I'm Alberto I am a student at Utah Valley University. I'm studying > for a computer science degree. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of Claudia > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 12:58 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Hello, > > My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at > University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, and > am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new > techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any > ideas should you need it. > > Regards, > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri > zon.net > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 23 > Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2010 06:33:07 -0500 > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Message-ID: <0KYL00KKZPH0M1I0 at vms173013.mailsrvcs.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > > Thank you Darian, > > Looking forward to being involved with the group... > > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of Darian Smith > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:36 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Greetings! > My name is Darian Smith, > I am a student in San Francisco at city college of san francisco. > I am studying to transfer to a four-year university andeventually get a > degree in Orientation and mobility. > As you can probably tell, there are some very intelligent, engaging and > all-around nice people on this list and I am happy to be counted amungst > the latest batch of people to have welcomed you! We all look forward to > your unique insights and hope that we can assist as fellow students can. > Best, > Darian > > On 2/28/10, Alberto Arreola wrote: >> Welcome I'm Alberto I am a student at Utah Valley University. I'm >> studying for a computer science degree. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf Of Claudia >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 12:58 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> Hello, >> >> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently >> at University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan >> area, and am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can >> learn new techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here >> to give any ideas should you need it. >> >> Regards, >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >> mind of man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%4 >> 0gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gm >> ail.com >> > > > -- > Darian Smith > Skype: The_Blind_Truth > Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com > The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher > recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals > into the field of blindness education, and we need your > help! To Get Involved go to: > www.TeachBlindStudents.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri > zon.net > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 24 > Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2010 06:38:10 -0500 > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] JAWS question > Message-ID: <0KYL003PLPNIJRQ0 at vms173001.mailsrvcs.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > > Nicole, > > I use JAWS -- it is a God send, I would honestly be lost without it. Since > we are in this topic I will pick your brains. I am having trouble finding a > document, let's say a word document that may have some words in it, such as > "blind student". So, when I am in "my documents" I know there is a search > field, but I can't seem to get into it without the help of a sighted person. > How do I search for a document in a specific folder, with just part of the > title? > > Regards, > > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of Nicole B. Torcolini > Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 12:17 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > I'm in the process of declaring my major as computer science. I lost my > site when I was four, so I use Braille a lot. However, I do read a tiny bit > slow at times, so I sometimes use the screen reader if there is a lot to > read. What technology do you use? > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 7:19 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Hello Nicole and Cindy, >> >> Cindy - thanks, I thought the quote was fantastic and describes my >> personal >> attributes.. >> >> Nicole - Since I did not lose my vision until 2001, I am not an avid >> Braille >> reader...I am in the process of learning contracted Braille. I cannot see >> large print, so I must rely on speech software. I like UOP because it has >> all of their textbooks online, so this was a perfect fit for me. If you >> ladies don't mind me asking, what are your majors at UNC and Stanford? >> >> Best, >> >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >> of >> man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of Cindy Bennett >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 4:47 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> Hey, I am a junior at UNC Wilmington. I just wanted to say that i collect >> quotes, and i like the one in your signature. >> >> Cindy >> >> On 2/28/10, Nicole B. Torcolini wrote: >>> Hi, >>> >>> Welcome to the list. My name is Nicole; I am a sophomore at >>> Stanford. >>> If you don't mind me asking, do you read Braille or large print? What >>> technology do you use? >>> >>> Nicole >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Claudia" >>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >>> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:57 AM >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >>> >>> >>>> Hello, >>>> >>>> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently >>>> at University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan >>>> area, and am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can >>>> learn new techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here >>>> to give any ideas should you need it. >>>> >>>> Regards, >>>> >>>> Claudia B. Perry >>>> >>>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >>>> mind of man can perceive he can achieve." >>>> >>>> -- Napoleon Hill >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40 >>>> wavecable.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmai >>> l.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri >> zon.net >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecab > le.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri > zon.net > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 25 > Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2010 06:41:30 -0500 > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Message-ID: <0KYL00ABSPUZ3LW1 at vms173013.mailsrvcs.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > > Hi RJ, > > I am not, but I can only see light. It is very poor. I have light perception > in my right eye. My left eye is completely grayed out - no light perception > there. Oh and I did forget to mention, I am a Air Force veteran. I was in > the military from 1995 to 2000, I began having my vision difficulties while > on active duty. I have a rare disorder named Devic's disease that rendered > me blind and paralyzed from the chest down. Luckily, I have regained my > strength back to walk again... > > Regards, > > > Regards, > > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of RJ Sandefur > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:24 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Cool!, so are you conpletely blind? > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 10:21 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Wow! Awesome, I am studying for my doctorate in Organizational psychology. > >> I >> should complete it in 2014...long process, but I am excited about it! >> >> Regards, >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >> of >> man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of RJ Sandefur >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 5:01 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> Hi, I'm RJ Sandefur. I'm studying for my doctorate of theology. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Claudia" >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 2:57 PM >> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> >>> Hello, >>> >>> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at >>> University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, >>> and >>> am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new >>> techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any >>> ideas should you need it. >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Claudia B. Perry >>> >>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >>> of >>> man can perceive he can achieve." >>> >>> -- Napoleon Hill >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% >> 40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri >> zon.net >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% > 40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri > zon.net > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 26 > Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2010 06:45:13 -0500 > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Message-ID: <0KYL003XZPZ95FL3 at vms173007.mailsrvcs.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > > Hello Arielle, > > Thank you for the kind words. I am very excited about this group. I had > planned to be at the conference, I just had to do some errands with my > family. I am a parent myself, so the topic was very interesting...it was > quite an adjustment from being a sighted parent to being a blind one. I > think most of us had to adjust to that drastic change. > > Regards, > > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of Arielle Silverman > Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 12:29 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Hi Claudia, > > Welcome to the list. My name is Arielle Silverman and I am a graduate > student at the University of Colorado getting my doctorate in social > psychology, which I think is pretty similar to industrial/IO psych. I am > also the current president of the National Association of Blind Students. If > you should have any questions about our group or about how you can get > involved in our parent organization, the National Federation of the Blind, > please feel free to contact me by email at nabs.president at gmail.com or by > phone at > 602-502-2255 > We will also be publishing our next issue of our quarterly newsletter, the > Student Slate, soon, so stay tuned for that! You can read our latest issue > on our Website at www.nabslink.org (it was just posted a few days ago!) > > Welcome again, > Arielle Silverman > President, National Association of Blind Students > > On 2/28/10, Nicole B. Torcolini wrote: >> Oh...another cs major? What's your favorite programming language? >> They started us on Java in high school, so that's my favorite. I will >> admit, though, that it is not without its limitations. I like it, >> though, because it almost won't allow you to mess up compared to the >> other languages that have almost no safety nets. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Alberto Arreola" >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 6:41 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> >>> Welcome I'm Alberto I am a student at Utah Valley University. I'm >>> studying for a computer science degree. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>> Behalf Of Claudia >>> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 12:58 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >>> >>> Hello, >>> >>> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently >>> at University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan >>> area, and am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can >>> learn new techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here >>> to give any ideas should you need it. >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Claudia B. Perry >>> >>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >>> mind of man can perceive he can achieve." >>> >>> -- Napoleon Hill >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500% >>> 40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40 >>> wavecable.com >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president >> %40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Arielle Silverman > President, National Association of Blind Students > Phone: 602-502-2255 > Email: > nabs.president at gmail.com > Website: > www.nabslink.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri > zon.net > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 27 > Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2010 06:46:30 -0600 > From: "Marty James" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=response > > I am a blind hunter and I got a doe this year and am going for a turkey May > 1st and 2nd. > Marty James > www.TheBlindBean.com > Enjoy Your Java! > > Phone: 319-457-3582 > Fax: 319-754-5226 > E-mail: Marty at theblindbean.com > > 402 Center Street > Middletown, IA > 52638 > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jedi" > To: > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 3:37 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns > > >> There is a blind man with a concealed weapons permit, but I can't remember >> >> his name off hand. he's either from California or Florida, but his name >> escapes me. He was all over the news for a while. >> >> Respectfully Submitted >> >> >> Original message: >>> Hello: >> >>> I know of two blind hunters. I presume they own their own firearms >>> and >>> transport them. I would think the bigger issue would be could the >>> individual >>> use a weapon. Blind hunters have sighted people help them aim. >> >>> Regards, >> >>> Robert Jaquiss, President >>> Greater Ouachita Chapter >>> National Federation of the Blind >>> Email: rjaquiss at earthlink.net >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Robert Spangler" >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> >>> Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2010 10:07 AM >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns >> >> >>>> Hello all, >> >>>> Does anyone know of any blind person who has experience with owning >>>> guns, taken the concealed weapon carry test, or has any experience >>>> with guns? My sister needs to know for a school research project. >>>> Please email rachael.spangler at rockets.utoledo.edu >> >>>> Thanks, >>>> -- >>>> Robert Spangler >>>> The University of Toledo >>>> Student Senator - Administrative Affairs Committee Chair, College of >>>> Arts and Sciences >> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/rjaquiss%40earthlink.net >> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net >> >> -- >> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindamp%40q.com >> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 28 > Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2010 06:40:54 -0700 > From: Alberto Arreola > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Message-ID: <4b8bc3d9.85c2f10a.2448.fffff107 at mx.google.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Yes i am. > > sent from my Verizon HTC Touch Pro 2 > > -----Original Message----- > From: Claudia > Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 4:31 AM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Hi Alberto, > > Nice to meet you. With a name like "Alberto", do you happen to be Hispanic? > > Regards, > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of Alberto Arreola > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 9:41 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Welcome I'm Alberto I am a student at Utah Valley University. I'm studying > for a computer science degree. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of Claudia > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 12:58 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Hello, > > My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at > University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, and > am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new > techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any > ideas should you need it. > > Regards, > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri > zon.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail.com > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 29 > Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2010 08:50:12 -0500 > From: "RJ Sandefur" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] JAWS question > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > > Claudia, do you use Skype? RJ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 6:38 AM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] JAWS question > > >> Nicole, >> >> I use JAWS -- it is a God send, I would honestly be lost without it. Since >> we are in this topic I will pick your brains. I am having trouble finding >> a >> document, let's say a word document that may have some words in it, such >> as >> "blind student". So, when I am in "my documents" I know there is a search >> field, but I can't seem to get into it without the help of a sighted >> person. >> How do I search for a document in a specific folder, with just part of the >> title? >> >> Regards, >> >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >> of >> man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of Nicole B. Torcolini >> Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 12:17 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> I'm in the process of declaring my major as computer science. I lost >> my >> site when I was four, so I use Braille a lot. However, I do read a tiny >> bit >> slow at times, so I sometimes use the screen reader if there is a lot to >> read. What technology do you use? >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Claudia" >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 7:19 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> >>> Hello Nicole and Cindy, >>> >>> Cindy - thanks, I thought the quote was fantastic and describes my >>> personal >>> attributes.. >>> >>> Nicole - Since I did not lose my vision until 2001, I am not an avid >>> Braille >>> reader...I am in the process of learning contracted Braille. I cannot see >>> large print, so I must rely on speech software. I like UOP because it has >>> all of their textbooks online, so this was a perfect fit for me. If you >>> ladies don't mind me asking, what are your majors at UNC and Stanford? >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> >>> Claudia B. Perry >>> >>> >>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >>> of >>> man can perceive he can achieve." >>> >>> -- Napoleon Hill >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>> Behalf >>> Of Cindy Bennett >>> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 4:47 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >>> >>> Hey, I am a junior at UNC Wilmington. I just wanted to say that i collect >>> quotes, and i like the one in your signature. >>> >>> Cindy >>> >>> On 2/28/10, Nicole B. Torcolini wrote: >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> Welcome to the list. My name is Nicole; I am a sophomore at >>>> Stanford. >>>> If you don't mind me asking, do you read Braille or large print? What >>>> technology do you use? >>>> >>>> Nicole >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Claudia" >>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>>> >>>> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:57 AM >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >>>> >>>> >>>>> Hello, >>>>> >>>>> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently >>>>> at University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan >>>>> area, and am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can >>>>> learn new techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here >>>>> to give any ideas should you need it. >>>>> >>>>> Regards, >>>>> >>>>> Claudia B. Perry >>>>> >>>>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >>>>> mind of man can perceive he can achieve." >>>>> >>>>> -- Napoleon Hill >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40 >>>>> wavecable.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmai >>>> l.com >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri >>> zon.net >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecab >> le.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri >> zon.net >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com >> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 30 > Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2010 07:12:10 -0700 > From: Alberto Arreola > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns > Message-ID: <4b8bcb2d.c6c1f10a.7ac8.ffffc661 at mx.google.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > That is really cool. > How do you hunt do you have a sighted person help you poing the gun, or do > you go just by sound? > > sent from my Verizon HTC Touch Pro 2 > > -----Original Message----- > From: Marty James > Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 5:46 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns > > I am a blind hunter and I got a doe this year and am going for a turkey May > 1st and 2nd. > Marty James > www.TheBlindBean.com > Enjoy Your Java! > > Phone: 319-457-3582 > Fax: 319-754-5226 > E-mail: Marty at theblindbean.com > > 402 Center Street > Middletown, IA > 52638 > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jedi" > To: > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 3:37 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns > > >> There is a blind man with a concealed weapons permit, but I can't remember >> >> his name off hand. he's either from California or Florida, but his name >> escapes me. He was all over the news for a while. >> >> Respectfully Submitted >> >> >> Original message: >>> Hello: >> >>> I know of two blind hunters. I presume they own their own firearms >>> and >>> transport them. I would think the bigger issue would be could the >>> individual >>> use a weapon. Blind hunters have sighted people help them aim. >> >>> Regards, >> >>> Robert Jaquiss, President >>> Greater Ouachita Chapter >>> National Federation of the Blind >>> Email: rjaquiss at earthlink.net >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Robert Spangler" >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> >>> Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2010 10:07 AM >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns >> >> >>>> Hello all, >> >>>> Does anyone know of any blind person who has experience with owning >>>> guns, taken the concealed weapon carry test, or has any experience >>>> with guns? My sister needs to know for a school research project. >>>> Please email rachael.spangler at rockets.utoledo.edu >> >>>> Thanks, >>>> -- >>>> Robert Spangler >>>> The University of Toledo >>>> Student Senator - Administrative Affairs Committee Chair, College of >>>> Arts and Sciences >> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/rjaquiss%40earthlink.net >> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net >> >> -- >> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindamp%40q.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail.com > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 31 > Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2010 09:19:40 -0500 > From: "RJ Sandefur" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > > I've been blind my whole life, and have told people, if I could see, I'd be > in the United States Milatary! Thank you for serving your country! RJ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 6:41 AM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Hi RJ, >> >> I am not, but I can only see light. It is very poor. I have light >> perception >> in my right eye. My left eye is completely grayed out - no light >> perception >> there. Oh and I did forget to mention, I am a Air Force veteran. I was in >> the military from 1995 to 2000, I began having my vision difficulties >> while >> on active duty. I have a rare disorder named Devic's disease that rendered >> me blind and paralyzed from the chest down. Luckily, I have regained my >> strength back to walk again... >> >> Regards, >> >> >> Regards, >> >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >> of >> man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of RJ Sandefur >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:24 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> Cool!, so are you conpletely blind? >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Claudia" >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 10:21 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> >>> Wow! Awesome, I am studying for my doctorate in Organizational >>> psychology. >> >>> I >>> should complete it in 2014...long process, but I am excited about it! >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Claudia B. Perry >>> >>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >>> of >>> man can perceive he can achieve." >>> >>> -- Napoleon Hill >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>> Behalf >>> Of RJ Sandefur >>> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 5:01 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >>> >>> Hi, I'm RJ Sandefur. I'm studying for my doctorate of theology. >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Claudia" >>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >>> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 2:57 PM >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >>> >>> >>>> Hello, >>>> >>>> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at >>>> University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, >>>> and >>>> am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new >>>> techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any >>>> ideas should you need it. >>>> >>>> Regards, >>>> >>>> Claudia B. Perry >>>> >>>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >>>> mind >>>> of >>>> man can perceive he can achieve." >>>> >>>> -- Napoleon Hill >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% >>> 40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri >>> zon.net >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% >> 40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri >> zon.net >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com >> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 32 > Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2010 09:10:08 -0600 > From: "Marty James" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > > I have a laser scope on the gun. A guide tells me up, down, right or left > and the whole control of the gun is in my hands. I also have a pistol that > I shoot very accurately by sound for the house. > Marty James > www.TheBlindBean.com > Enjoy Your Java! > > Phone: 319-457-3582 > Fax: 319-754-5226 > E-mail: Marty at theblindbean.com > > 402 Center Street > Middletown, IA > 52638 > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Alberto Arreola" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 8:12 AM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns > > >> That is really cool. >> How do you hunt do you have a sighted person help you poing the gun, or do >> >> you go just by sound? >> >> sent from my Verizon HTC Touch Pro 2 >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Marty James >> Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 5:46 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns >> >> I am a blind hunter and I got a doe this year and am going for a turkey >> May >> 1st and 2nd. >> Marty James >> www.TheBlindBean.com >> Enjoy Your Java! >> >> Phone: 319-457-3582 >> Fax: 319-754-5226 >> E-mail: Marty at theblindbean.com >> >> 402 Center Street >> Middletown, IA >> 52638 >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Jedi" >> To: >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 3:37 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns >> >> >>> There is a blind man with a concealed weapons permit, but I can't >>> remember >>> his name off hand. he's either from California or Florida, but his name >>> escapes me. He was all over the news for a while. >>> >>> Respectfully Submitted >>> >>> >>> Original message: >>>> Hello: >>> >>>> I know of two blind hunters. I presume they own their own firearms >>>> and >>>> transport them. I would think the bigger issue would be could the >>>> individual >>>> use a weapon. Blind hunters have sighted people help them aim. >>> >>>> Regards, >>> >>>> Robert Jaquiss, President >>>> Greater Ouachita Chapter >>>> National Federation of the Blind >>>> Email: rjaquiss at earthlink.net >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Robert Spangler" >>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>> >>>> Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2010 10:07 AM >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns >>> >>> >>>>> Hello all, >>> >>>>> Does anyone know of any blind person who has experience with owning >>>>> guns, taken the concealed weapon carry test, or has any experience >>>>> with guns? My sister needs to know for a school research project. >>>>> Please email rachael.spangler at rockets.utoledo.edu >>> >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> -- >>>>> Robert Spangler >>>>> The University of Toledo >>>>> Student Senator - Administrative Affairs Committee Chair, College of >>>>> Arts and Sciences >>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/rjaquiss%40earthlink.net >>> >>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net >>> >>> -- >>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindamp%40q.com >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindamp%40q.com >> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > > > End of nabs-l Digest, Vol 41, Issue 1 > ************************************* > -- "I ask you to look both ways. For the road to a knowledge of the stars leads through the atom; and important knowledge of the atom has been reached through the stars." Sir Arthur Eddington, British astrophysicist (1882-1944), Stars and Atoms (1928), Lecture 1 From corbbo at gmail.com Tue Mar 2 00:44:13 2010 From: corbbo at gmail.com (Corbb O'Connor) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2010 19:44:13 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] You only have 30 days left to win up to $12K from the NFB! References: <7638A85981599142811F69FBB9508B6B021DFEFB@FPNTEXCBE01.services.local> Message-ID: <0CE231FB-8866-423D-9B6B-CEF9DDBA08F4@gmail.com> If you will be a blind college student in the 2010-2011 academic year, and you're not applying for this scholarship, then you are ensuring that you're not several thousand dollars richer! You have nothing to lose by applying! Corbb NFB 2010 Scholarship Program for blind college students Deadline: March 31, 2010 I’ve attached a flyer about the National Federation of the Blind national scholarship program. This program is solely for legally blind students in the United States or Puerto Rico who will be attending college or university in fall 2010. We have 30 scholarships in our program. Students apply to the scholarship program (not for a particular scholarship). The NFB Scholarship Committee chooses the 30 winners from all who apply and later decides which scholarship each of the thirty winners will receive. $12,000 – 1 award $10,000 – 1 award $ 5,000 – 4 awards $ 3,000— 22 awards Plus other gifts to our 30 scholarship winners. Complete details are available on our Website at www.nfb.org/scholarships . Please share this information with other departments and agencies in your state that have contact with blind college students. Please give it to any high school senior intent on entering college in fall 2010 or any blind college student from college freshman up through working on a PhD, and any counselor, teacher, or parent working with a blind scholar. Cordially, Mr. Anil Lewis, Chairperson NFB Scholarship Committee NATIONAL FEDERATION OF THE BLIND 200 East Wells Street, Baltimore, MD 21230 at Jernigan Place Office: (410) 659-9314, x2415; Email: scholarships at nfb.org; Website: www.nfb.org/scholarships Discussion Groups: www.nfb.net.org There is a Braille literacy crisis in America. For the whole story, go to www.braille.org. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: pg 1, 2010 Scholarship Flyer.doc Type: application/msword Size: 46080 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- From sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca Tue Mar 2 03:00:06 2010 From: sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca (Sarah Jevnikar) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2010 22:00:06 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! In-Reply-To: <4b8b2946.9713f30a.6019.ffffcc55@mx.google.com> References: <0KYK009GAI454925@vms173005.mailsrvcs.net> <4b8b2946.9713f30a.6019.ffffcc55@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <003601cab9b4$78e07bf0$6aa173d0$@jevnikar@utoronto.ca> Hi Claudia, Welcome to the list! I hope you find companionship and great discussion and answers here. My name is Sarah Jevnikar and I'm a second-year student at the University of Toronto in Canada. I'm studying actuarial science. Hope to talk again soon, Sarah -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Alberto Arreola Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 9:41 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! Welcome I'm Alberto I am a student at Utah Valley University. I'm studying for a computer science degree. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Claudia Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 12:58 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! Hello, My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, and am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any ideas should you need it. Regards, Claudia B. Perry " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of man can perceive he can achieve." -- Napoleon Hill -----Original Message----- _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto ronto.ca From claudia.perry at verizon.net Tue Mar 2 03:18:17 2010 From: claudia.perry at verizon.net (Claudia) Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2010 22:18:17 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <0KYM00CGXX6CSI4C@vms173011.mailsrvcs.net> FYI - There are currently 2 blind service members in the Army -- of course, this happened to them while on active duty. One is Captain Ivan Castro, and the other is Lt. Boggart. I thought that was neat of the military to allow for these individuals to continue on active duty... Claudia B. Perry " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of man can perceive he can achieve." -- Napoleon Hill -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of RJ Sandefur Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 9:20 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! I've been blind my whole life, and have told people, if I could see, I'd be in the United States Milatary! Thank you for serving your country! RJ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Claudia" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 6:41 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Hi RJ, > > I am not, but I can only see light. It is very poor. I have light > perception in my right eye. My left eye is completely grayed out - no > light perception there. Oh and I did forget to mention, I am a Air > Force veteran. I was in the military from 1995 to 2000, I began having > my vision difficulties while on active duty. I have a rare disorder > named Devic's disease that rendered me blind and paralyzed from the > chest down. Luckily, I have regained my strength back to walk again... > > Regards, > > > Regards, > > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the > mind of man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On > Behalf Of RJ Sandefur > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:24 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Cool!, so are you conpletely blind? > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 10:21 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Wow! Awesome, I am studying for my doctorate in Organizational >> psychology. > >> I >> should complete it in 2014...long process, but I am excited about it! >> >> Regards, >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >> mind of man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf Of RJ Sandefur >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 5:01 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> Hi, I'm RJ Sandefur. I'm studying for my doctorate of theology. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Claudia" >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 2:57 PM >> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> >>> Hello, >>> >>> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently >>> at University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. >>> Metropolitan area, and am very excited to be a member of this group. >>> Perhaps I can learn new techniques for school as a blind individual. >>> I am also here to give any ideas should you need it. >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Claudia B. Perry >>> >>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >>> mind of man can perceive he can achieve." >>> >>> -- Napoleon Hill >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksan > defur% >> 40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry% > 40veri >> zon.net >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksan > defur% > 40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry% > 40veri > zon.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksan > defur%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri zon.net From claudia.perry at verizon.net Tue Mar 2 03:20:53 2010 From: claudia.perry at verizon.net (Claudia) Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2010 22:20:53 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] JAWS question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <0KYM00GB1XAMSQDA@vms173011.mailsrvcs.net> Hi RJ, I am somewhat embarrassed, because I don't know what that is...Please educate me on this technology. Claudia B. Perry " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of man can perceive he can achieve." -- Napoleon Hill -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of RJ Sandefur Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 8:50 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] JAWS question Claudia, do you use Skype? RJ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Claudia" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 6:38 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] JAWS question > Nicole, > > I use JAWS -- it is a God send, I would honestly be lost without it. Since > we are in this topic I will pick your brains. I am having trouble finding > a > document, let's say a word document that may have some words in it, such > as > "blind student". So, when I am in "my documents" I know there is a search > field, but I can't seem to get into it without the help of a sighted > person. > How do I search for a document in a specific folder, with just part of the > title? > > Regards, > > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind > of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On > Behalf > Of Nicole B. Torcolini > Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 12:17 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > I'm in the process of declaring my major as computer science. I lost > my > site when I was four, so I use Braille a lot. However, I do read a tiny > bit > slow at times, so I sometimes use the screen reader if there is a lot to > read. What technology do you use? > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 7:19 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Hello Nicole and Cindy, >> >> Cindy - thanks, I thought the quote was fantastic and describes my >> personal >> attributes.. >> >> Nicole - Since I did not lose my vision until 2001, I am not an avid >> Braille >> reader...I am in the process of learning contracted Braille. I cannot see >> large print, so I must rely on speech software. I like UOP because it has >> all of their textbooks online, so this was a perfect fit for me. If you >> ladies don't mind me asking, what are your majors at UNC and Stanford? >> >> Best, >> >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind >> of >> man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of Cindy Bennett >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 4:47 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> Hey, I am a junior at UNC Wilmington. I just wanted to say that i collect >> quotes, and i like the one in your signature. >> >> Cindy >> >> On 2/28/10, Nicole B. Torcolini wrote: >>> Hi, >>> >>> Welcome to the list. My name is Nicole; I am a sophomore at >>> Stanford. >>> If you don't mind me asking, do you read Braille or large print? What >>> technology do you use? >>> >>> Nicole >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Claudia" >>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >>> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:57 AM >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >>> >>> >>>> Hello, >>>> >>>> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently >>>> at University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan >>>> area, and am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can >>>> learn new techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here >>>> to give any ideas should you need it. >>>> >>>> Regards, >>>> >>>> Claudia B. Perry >>>> >>>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >>>> mind of man can perceive he can achieve." >>>> >>>> -- Napoleon Hill >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40 >>>> wavecable.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmai >>> l.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri >> zon.net >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecab > le.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri > zon.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% 40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri zon.net From sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca Tue Mar 2 03:12:38 2010 From: sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca (Sarah Jevnikar) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2010 22:12:38 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] JAWS question In-Reply-To: <0KYL003PLPNIJRQ0@vms173001.mailsrvcs.net> References: <6432B468E31A49FDB20F562925593758@stanford.edu> <0KYL003PLPNIJRQ0@vms173001.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <003701cab9b6$38eddea0$aac99be0$@jevnikar@utoronto.ca> Hi Claudia, Here's how you use Windows Find with JAWS. 1. From any program on your computer, press the windows key and f. 2. This will bring up a search page. Press control and end to get to the bottom of the page where it says "click here to use search companion" 3. Press enter. 4. Press tab until you hear "all files and folders button". Press enter again. 5. You'll hear "all or part of the file name". Type in what you remember. 6. If this is all you know about the file, press alt and r to begin searching. If you know of other attributes (where it might be on your computer, its size, etc., Navigate with tab and fill all info you want. Tab until you hear "search button", or press alt r after filling in all the information you know. Hope this helps. Sarah "Canada you made us proud in the Vancouver 2010 Olympic games!!" -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Claudia Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 6:38 AM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] JAWS question Nicole, I use JAWS -- it is a God send, I would honestly be lost without it. Since we are in this topic I will pick your brains. I am having trouble finding a document, let's say a word document that may have some words in it, such as "blind student". So, when I am in "my documents" I know there is a search field, but I can't seem to get into it without the help of a sighted person. How do I search for a document in a specific folder, with just part of the title? Regards, Claudia B. Perry " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of man can perceive he can achieve." -- Napoleon Hill -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Nicole B. Torcolini Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 12:17 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! I'm in the process of declaring my major as computer science. I lost my site when I was four, so I use Braille a lot. However, I do read a tiny bit slow at times, so I sometimes use the screen reader if there is a lot to read. What technology do you use? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Claudia" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 7:19 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Hello Nicole and Cindy, > > Cindy - thanks, I thought the quote was fantastic and describes my > personal > attributes.. > > Nicole - Since I did not lose my vision until 2001, I am not an avid > Braille > reader...I am in the process of learning contracted Braille. I cannot see > large print, so I must rely on speech software. I like UOP because it has > all of their textbooks online, so this was a perfect fit for me. If you > ladies don't mind me asking, what are your majors at UNC and Stanford? > > Best, > > > Claudia B. Perry > > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind > of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On > Behalf > Of Cindy Bennett > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 4:47 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Hey, I am a junior at UNC Wilmington. I just wanted to say that i collect > quotes, and i like the one in your signature. > > Cindy > > On 2/28/10, Nicole B. Torcolini wrote: >> Hi, >> >> Welcome to the list. My name is Nicole; I am a sophomore at >> Stanford. >> If you don't mind me asking, do you read Braille or large print? What >> technology do you use? >> >> Nicole >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Claudia" >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:57 AM >> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> >>> Hello, >>> >>> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently >>> at University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan >>> area, and am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can >>> learn new techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here >>> to give any ideas should you need it. >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Claudia B. Perry >>> >>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >>> mind of man can perceive he can achieve." >>> >>> -- Napoleon Hill >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40 >>> wavecable.com >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmai >> l.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri > zon.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecab le.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri zon.net _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto ronto.ca From jsorozco at gmail.com Tue Mar 2 14:56:02 2010 From: jsorozco at gmail.com (Joe Orozco) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 09:56:02 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] FW: Serotek declares war Message-ID: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: fred olver Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 07:11:28 -0600 Subject: [Chapter-presidents] Serotek declares war To: nfbmi-talk at nfbnet.org, NFB of Missouri Mailing List , NFB Chapter Presidents discussion list Subject: [leadership] Serotek declares war on the traditional adaptive technology industry and their blind ghetto products This is no warm fuzzy of a read, but something well worth the read and in my opinion long over due. Kudos to SeroTekCited from http://blog.serotek.com/ The Serotek Ultimatum Serotek declares war on the traditional adaptive technology industry and their blind ghetto products. With this announcement we are sending out a call to arms to every blind person and every advocate for the blind to rise up and throw off the tyranny that has shaped our lives for the past two decades. It is a tyranny of good intentions - or at least what began as good intentions. But as the proverb says, "the road to hell is paved with good intentions." And for the past two decades the technologies originally conceived to give us freedom have been our shackles. They have kept us tied down to underperforming, obscenely expensive approaches that only a small percentage of blind people can afford or master. They have shackled us to government largess and the charity of strangers to pay for what few among us could afford on our own. And we have been sheep, lead down the path, bleating from time to time, but without the vision or the resources to stand up and demand our due. That time is past. We stand today on the very edge of universal accessibility. Mainstream products like the iPod, iPhone, and newly announced iPad are fully accessible out of the box. And they bring with them a wealth of highly desirable accessibility applications. The cost to blind people is exactly the same as the cost to sighted people. It's the same equipment, the same software, the same functionality, and fully accessible. What Apple has done, others are doing as well. The adaptive technology vendor who creates hardware and software that is intended only for blind folks, and then only if they are subsidized by the government, is a dinosaur. The asteroid has hit the earth, the dust cloud is ubiquitous, the dinosaur's days are numbered. But dinosaurs are huge, and their extinction does not happen overnight.. Even as they die, they spawn others like them (take the Intel Reader for example). Thank you, no. Any blind person can have full accessibility to any type of information without the high-cost, blind-ghetto gear. They can get it in the same products their sighted friends are buying. But let's face it; if we keep buying that crap and keep besieging our visual resource center to buy that crap for us, the dinosaurs of the industry are going to keep making it. Their profit margins are very good indeed. And many have invested exactly none of that profit in creating the next generation of access technology, choosing instead to perpetuate the status quo. For instance, refreshable braille technology, arguably the most expensive blindness-specific(and to many very necessary) product has not changed significantly in 30 years. Yet, the cost remains out of reach for most blind people. Where's the innovation there? Why have companies not invested in cheaper, faster, smaller, and more efficient ways to make refreshable braille? Surely the piezoelectric braille cell is not the only way? And what about PC-based OCR software? It's still around a thousand dollars per license, yet core functionality hasn't changed much; sure, we get all sorts of features not at all related to reading, along with incremental accuracy improvements, but why are these prices not dropping either, especially when you consider that comparable off-the-shelf solutions like Abby Finereader can be had for as low as $79? ? And let's not forget the screen reader itself, the core technology that all of us need to access our computers in the first place. Do we see improvements, or just an attempt to mimic innovation with the addition of features which have nothing to do with the actual reading of the screen, while maintaining the same ridiculous price point. This maintaining of the status quo will, inevitably, face an enormous crash, worse than the transition from DOS to Windows based accessibility. You can expect a technology crash that will put users of the most expensive accessibility gear out of business. Why? I won't bore you with all the technical details, but the basic story is that some of these products have been kept current with patches and fixes and partial rewrites and other tricks we IT types use when we haven't got the budget to do it right, but we need to make the product work with the latest operating system. That process of patching and fixing creates an enormous legacy barrier that makes it impossible to rewrite without abandoning all who came before. But you can only keep a kluge working for so long before it will crumble under its own weight. That, my friends, is exactly where some of the leading adaptive technology vendors find themselves today. There are exceptions. Serotek is an exception because we have completely recreated our product base every three years. GW Micro is an exception because they built their product in a highly modular fashion and can update modules without destroying the whole. KNFB is an exception because they take advantage of off-the-shelf technologies, which translate ultimately into price drops and increased functionality. But even we who have done it right are on a path to obsolescence. The fundamental need for accessibility software is rapidly beginning to vanish. The universal accessibility principles we see Apple, Microsoft, Olympus, and others putting in place are going to eliminate the need for these specialty products in a matter of just a very few years. Stop and think. Why do you need accessibility tools? To read text? E-book devices are eliminating that need. None of them are perfect yet, but we are really only in the first generation. By Gen2 they will all be fully accessible. To find your way? GPS on your iPhone or your Android based phone will do that for you. To take notes? Easy on any laptop, netbook, or iPad. Heck, you can record it live and play it back at your convenience. Just what isn't accessible? You can play your music, catch a described video, scan a spreadsheet, take in a PowerPoint presentation - all using conventional, off-the-shelf systems and/or software that is free of charge. There are still some legacy situations where you need to create an accessibility path. Some corporations still have internal applications that do not lend themselves to modern devices. There will certainly be situations where a specialized product will better solve an accessibility problem than a mainstream one, especially in the short term. We don't advocate throwing the baby out with the bathwater, but we do advocate that we begin to hasten the inevitable change by using accessible mainstream solutions wherever possible. Even now, the leading edge companies are reinventing their internal systems with accessibility as a design criteria, so the situations that require specialized products will certainly become fewer as time goes on. If our current Assistive technology guard's reign is coming to an end, why the war? Why not just let it die its own, natural, inevitable death? Because nothing dies more slowly than an obsolete technology. Punch cards hung on for twenty or thirty years after they were completely obsolete. The same is true for magnetic tape. Old stuff represents a comparatively large investment, and people hate to throw away something they paid a lot of money for even if it's currently worthless. But that legacy stuff obscures the capabilities of the present. It gets used in situations where other solutions are cheaper and more practical. The legacy stuff clogs the vocational rehab channel, eating up the lion's share of the resources but serving a tiny portion of the need. It gets grandfathered into contracts. It gets specified when there is no earthly reason why the application requires it. The legacy stuff slows down the dawning of a fully accessible world. It hurts you and it hurts me. To be sure, I make my living creating and selling products that make our world accessible. But first and foremost, I am a blind person. I am one of you. And every day I face the same accessibility challenges you face. I have dedicated my life and my company to making the world more accessible for all of us, but I can't do it alone. This is a challenge that every blind person needs to take up. We need to shout from the rooftops: "Enough!" We need to commit ourselves in each and every situation to finding and using the most accessible off the shelf tool and/or the least-cost, highest function accessibility tool available. With our dollars and our commitment to making known that our needs and the needs of sighted people are 99% the same, we can reshape this marketplace. We can drive the dinosaurs into the tar pits and nurture those cute fuzzy little varmints that are ancestors to the next generation. We can be part of the solution rather than part of the problem. And all it takes is getting the best possible solution for your specific need. Once you have found the solution to fill that need, let the company know you appreciate their work towards better accessibility. Let your friends (sighted and blind) know about these accessibility features; they probably don't know that such features exist. Make your needs known to the vocational rehab people you are working with, and don't allow them to make recommendations for a specific technology for no other reason than that it's been in the contract for years. Make sure your schools and your workplace understand the need to push technology in to the accessible space. Show them the low-cost alternatives. In this economy some, the intelligent ones, will get it and the tide will begin to turn. And then in short order the tsunami of good sense will wash away the old, and give us the space to build a more accessible world for all of us. Let the demand ring out loud and clear and the market will follow.If this message rings true to you, don't just shake your fist in agreement and leave it at that. let your voice be heard! Arm yourself with the vision of a future where there are no social, conceptual, or economic barriers to accessibility, and let your words and your actions demonstrate that you will not rest until that vision is realized. Take out your wallet and let your consumer power shine! You do mater as a market people! You have kept this company alive with your money for 8 years this month! I believe that if we all get together and do our part, we will finally say "NO more!" same old same old! Join the revolution! Together we can change the world!Posted by Mike Calvo at 2:15 PM __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4907 (20100302) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4909 (20100302) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com From agrima at nbp.org Tue Mar 2 18:43:42 2010 From: agrima at nbp.org (Tony Grima) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 13:43:42 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Social Networking and You: Twitter, Facebook, and LinkedIn for Blind Users (by Anna Dresner) Message-ID: <4F48C89E57CB41AABB0194B02AF64EF7@nbp2.local> Social Networking and You: Twitter, Facebook, and LinkedIn for Blind Users By Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, text, and DAISY formats, $12.00 "I started my job search with my LinkedIn contacts." "Your tweets are hilarious!" "We're Facebook friends, but we've never met in person!" It seems like everyone these days is spending at least some of their time on social networking sites. If you're not participating, you may feel left out - and it doesn't help that none of these sites were designed with blind users in mind! But what exactly do Facebook, Twitter and LinkedIn have to offer? How do you get started on them? And what about issues of privacy? This book is designed to help you learn about these three social networking sites so that you can decide which, if any, you wish to join. Anna Dresner gives you enough information to get started; she describes how these sites work right now and gives you some idea about the sorts of things you can do on them. Anna offers commands and strategies for navigating these sites with screen readers, and includes pointers for handling specific situations using JAWS, Window-Eyes and System Access, and VoiceOver on the Mac. Note: The DAISY version of this book will work with any version of FSReader, which comes free with every installation of JAWS. Read the full table of contents for this book, or order it, at http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/SOCIAL.html ****** To order any books, send payment to: NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge it: toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 20. Or order any of our books online at http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html . From David.B.Andrews at state.mn.us Tue Mar 2 20:47:48 2010 From: David.B.Andrews at state.mn.us (Andrews, David B B (DEED)) Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2010 14:47:48 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Richard Bennett Message-ID: From: Wilson, Joanne [mailto:JWilson at nfb.org] Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2010 2:00 PM To: Andrews, David B B (DEED) Subject: Richard Bennett It is with deep regret and sadness I wish to inform you that on February 27, 2010 our colleague and friend Richard Bennett passed away in his home in Wilmington, Delaware. Catherine Newman, the president of the NFB of Delaware Student Division, conveys our thoughts about Richard best in the message that follows. Joanne Wilson President Richard H. Bennett of Delaware passed away late Saturday afternoon in his home in Wilmington Delaware. The student/career division group and the Delaware federation family will deeply miss "Papa Richard". He was a kind, caring, and wise man. He was a man who would give the shirt off his back for his federation family or anyone that needed his help for that matter. Respected by all who knew him, Richard was truly a champion for the cause of blind independence. Having dreamed for years of the founding of a student division in Delaware, he thought of us in the student division as his own personal daughters and sons. Ever compassionate and always patient, he was willing to explain things in such a way that everyone could understand. He was a lamp in the darkness and a living example of what we all hope to become; completely free and independent blind people fully capable of fulfilling our dreams. His encouragement helped us to become stronger people, and knowing that he believed in us as individuals and as a division we felt there wasn't a thing we couldn't accomplish. The student career division promises we will keep his memory alive, pass on his legacy of moving mountains in Delaware for blind and visually impaired people for generation to come. Family is asking that donations be sent to National Center or the Maryland School for the Blind in his memory. Memorial services details will be provided at a later date. From heatherperry at ymail.com Wed Mar 3 00:03:02 2010 From: heatherperry at ymail.com (Heather Perry) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 16:03:02 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nabs-l] nabs-l Digest, Vol 40, Issue 29 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <875911.10873.qm@web28208.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> ________________________________ From: "nabs-l-request at nfbnet.org" To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Sent: Sun, February 28, 2010 10:00:06 AM Subject: nabs-l Digest, Vol 40, Issue 29 Send nabs-l mailing list submissions to     nabs-l at nfbnet.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit     http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to     nabs-l-request at nfbnet.org You can reach the person managing the list at     nabs-l-owner at nfbnet.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of nabs-l digest..." Today's Topics:   1. Re: Blind People Owning Guns (Alberto Arreola)   2. Re: Blind People Owning Guns (Alberto Arreola)   3. Re: Delayed Mail (Maurice Mines)   4. Re: Blind People Owning Guns (Jamie Principato)   5. KnfbReader Hints and Tricks discussion open to all       (Michael Hingson)   6. KnfbReader Hints and Tricks discussion open to all (David Andrews)   7. Reminder about conference call (Antonio M. Guimaraes)   8. Duxbury (Joe Orozco)   9. Re: Duxbury (Justin Young)   10. Re: Duxbury (David)   11. Re: nabs-l Digest, Vol 40, Issue 28 (Jennifer Applegate)   12. Re: Duxbury (Sarah Jevnikar) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 12:20:16 -0700 From: "Alberto Arreola" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"     Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns Message-ID: <4b897071.9513f30a.14d3.676b at mx.google.com> Content-Type: text/plain;    charset="us-ascii" Yes I know of one person who has both a conceal weapons permit, and owns his own guns. His name is Carey McWilliams. He has a book out, and he also has his own website where he puts up videos of himself, and other things. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Robert Spangler Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2010 9:08 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns Hello all, Does anyone know of any blind person who has experience with owning guns, taken the concealed weapon carry test, or has any experience with guns?  My sister needs to know for a school research project. Please email rachael.spangler at rockets.utoledo.edu. Thanks, -- Robert Spangler The University of Toledo Student Senator - Administrative Affairs Committee Chair, College of Arts and Sciences _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail .com ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 12:39:18 -0700 From: "Alberto Arreola" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"     Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns Message-ID: <4b8974e6.9413f30a.0502.6e39 at mx.google.com> Content-Type: text/plain;    charset="us-ascii" You can email me off list if you are interested and I can provide you with more information. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Robert Spangler Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2010 9:08 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns Hello all, Does anyone know of any blind person who has experience with owning guns, taken the concealed weapon carry test, or has any experience with guns?  My sister needs to know for a school research project. Please email rachael.spangler at rockets.utoledo.edu. Thanks, -- Robert Spangler The University of Toledo Student Senator - Administrative Affairs Committee Chair, College of Arts and Sciences _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail .com ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 12:45:40 -0700 From: Maurice Mines To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list     Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Delayed Mail Message-ID: <4F30E190-34D4-46A8-9737-F37FCCCE5702 at me.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii hi same thing here as well. maurice ham call kd0iko. On Feb 27, 2010, at 7:00 AM, Meghan Whalen wrote: > I'm having the same problem. > > Meghan > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe Orozco" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > Sent: Friday, February 26, 2010 6:59 PM > Subject: [nabs-l] Delayed Mail > > >> Is it just me, or are other people receiving delayed mail from the NFBNet >> lists?  I've seen discussion on the Mac question for a couple days now, but >> I'm just now receiving Sally's original post.  I don't know if my Gmail, the >> mail server or my antivirus software is responsible. >> >> Joe Orozco >> >> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, >> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >> >> >> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature >> database 4899 (20100226) __________ >> >> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >> >> http://www.eset.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mewhalen%40wisc.edu > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/minesm%40me.com ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 16:33:53 -0500 From: Jamie Principato To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list     Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns Message-ID:     <63af025c1002271333t11677778ifc1fa9c730a48f84 at mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Actually, if anyone knows anything about this, could you e-mail me as well? I'd really like to know. Thanks, -Jamie On Sat, Feb 27, 2010 at 11:07 AM, Robert Spangler wrote: > Hello all, > > Does anyone know of any blind person who has experience with owning > guns, taken the concealed weapon carry test, or has any experience > with guns?  My sister needs to know for a school research project. > Please email rachael.spangler at rockets.utoledo.edu. > > Thanks, > -- > Robert Spangler > The University of Toledo > Student Senator - Administrative Affairs Committee Chair, College of > Arts and Sciences > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com > ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 16:45:34 -0600 From: "Michael Hingson" (by way of David     Andrews    ) To: david.andrews at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] KnfbReader Hints and Tricks discussion open to all Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed KnfbReader Hints and Tricks discussion open to all Everyone is invited next Thursday, March 4,  to participate in a combined on-line and telephone conference to discuss how we all use the KnfbReader Mobile.  A number of persons have wanted a forum to learn from other users "How do you do that?".  In response to these many requests we are arranging for everyone to be able to call in via phone or Skype in on line to participate. This innovative program will take place next Thursday, March 4, beginning at 9PM Eastern time, 8PM Central, 7PM Mountain, 6PM Pacific and 4PM Hawaiian time.  In order to attempt to make this program as available to all as possible we are offering two ways to participate.  First you can Skype into the program.  Skype is a communications program available free of charge through the internet.  If you have Skype simply call my Skype name, mhingson, and I will add you to the conference.  More instructions will be published later about this if necessary. If you wish to participate via phone Here are the dial-in instructions for the call.  The call -- in number is (218) 339-3600.  The access code is 329906#.  Simply call in no later than times given above to be a part of this call.  The program is free.  Only any relevant long distance charges will apply. Please bring your questions as well as your own reading techniques.  Please be ready to share and learn from the many other KnfbReader Mobile users and experts who will be participating in the call.  No question is too silly and no idea is unwelcome.  If you do not own a KnfbReader Mobile here is a chance for you to hear first hand from users how they read, learn, and succeed using this marvelous invention. I look forward to meeting you all next Thursday evening.  Thank you in advance for participating in this first KnfbReader Mobile users forum. Best, Mike Hingson The Michael Hingson Group, INC.       "Speaking with Vision"                   Michael Hingson, President                           (415) 827-4084                     info at michaelhingson.com                     www.michaelhingson.com for info on the new KNFB Reader Mobile, visit: http://knfbreader.michaelhingson.com ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 16:59:51 -0600 From: David Andrews To: david.andrews at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] KnfbReader Hints and Tricks discussion open to all Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed KnfbReader Hints and Tricks discussion open to all Everyone is invited next Thursday, March 4,  to participate in a combined on-line and telephone conference to discuss how we all use the KnfbReader Mobile.  A number of persons have wanted a forum to learn from other users "How do you do that?".  In response to these many requests we are arranging for everyone to be able to call in via phone or Skype in on line to participate. This innovative program will take place next Thursday, March 4, beginning at 9PM Eastern time, 8PM Central, 7PM Mountain, 6PM Pacific and 4PM Hawaiian time.  In order to attempt to make this program as available to all as possible we are offering two ways to participate.  First you can Skype into the program.  Skype is a communications program available free of charge through the internet.  If you have Skype simply call my Skype name, mhingson, and I will add you to the conference.  More instructions will be published later about this if necessary. If you wish to participate via phone Here are the dial-in instructions for the call.  The call -- in number is (218) 339-3600.  The access code is 329906#.  Simply call in no later than times given above to be a part of this call.  The program is free.  Only any relevant long distance charges will apply. Please bring your questions as well as your own reading techniques.  Please be ready to share and learn from the many other KnfbReader Mobile users and experts who will be participating in the call.  No question is too silly and no idea is unwelcome.  If you do not own a KnfbReader Mobile here is a chance for you to hear first hand from users how they read, learn, and succeed using this marvelous invention. I look forward to meeting you all next Thursday evening.  Thank you in advance for participating in this first KnfbReader Mobile users forum. Best, Mike Hingson The Michael Hingson Group, INC.       "Speaking with Vision"                   Michael Hingson, President                           (415) 827-4084                     info at michaelhingson.com                     www.michaelhingson.com for info on the new KNFB Reader Mobile, visit: http://knfbreader.michaelhingson.com ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 17:19:57 -0500 From: "Antonio M. Guimaraes" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"     Subject: [nabs-l] Reminder about conference call Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain;    charset="iso-8859-1" Hello all, I am re-posting the message about the NABS conference call that will take place tomorrow. Join the National Association of Blind Students and the membership committee in our latest conference call. This time we have Melissa and Mark Riccobono to discussing parenting as a blind person, and couple. Melissa is blind, and the president of the National Federation of the Blind of Md. She has been a leader in the Human Services Division. Mark Riccobono is director of the NFB Jernigan Institute. His leadership and ideas help drive our movement. Mark and Melissa are parents to Austin Riccobono, and they are expecting a second child. Join the call on February 28 at 7:00 pm eastern, 6 central, 5 mountain, 4 pacific. Dial 712-775-7100, access code 257963. Whether you are a parent, or might become a blind parent in the future; if you are a care-taker; if you want to know the joys and trials or parenting, and the unique aspects of parenting as a blind person, help make this call a success by joining and participating. This call is for you, so make the best of it. Antonio Guimaraes Membership committee _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 20:59:42 -0500 From: "Joe Orozco" To: "'NFBnet NFBCS Mailing List'" ,    "'National     Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Subject: [nabs-l] Duxbury Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain;    charset="us-ascii" Hello, Is Duxbury the only Braille translation software out there?  I'm considering the purchase of an embosser and want to factor in the cost of the appropriate software to make that purchase complete.  Thanks, and any recommendations on good embosser models is appreciated. Joe Orozco "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4901 (20100227) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com ------------------------------ Message: 9 Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 21:25:46 -0500 From: Justin Young To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list     Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Duxbury Message-ID:     <54d8179e1002271825lc810c9aif5edfbd92ff39372 at mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 I'm not sure if it's the only translation out there, but its the best and most commonly used.  As for embossers, I personally have a Juliet Justin On 2/27/10, Joe Orozco wrote: > Hello, > > Is Duxbury the only Braille translation software out there?  I'm considering > the purchase of an embosser and want to factor in the cost of the > appropriate software to make that purchase complete.  Thanks, and any > recommendations on good embosser models is appreciated. > > Joe Orozco > > "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, > some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature > database 4901 (20100227) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jty727%40gmail.com > ------------------------------ Message: 10 Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 22:58:57 -0600 From: David To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"     Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Duxbury Message-ID: <4b89f819.1408c00a.502e.3ade at mx.google.com> Content-Type: text/plain;    charset="us-ascii" Hi, Duxbury is possibly the most comprehensive Braille translator that I know of. The Index embossers made by a company in Sweden come with a piece of software called WinBraille, but I don't like the translation tables. Some of the contractions are a bit off, as well as some of the Braille symbols. That's just my opinion, though. David -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joe Orozco Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2010 8:00 PM To: 'NFBnet NFBCS Mailing List'; 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: [nabs-l] Duxbury Hello, Is Duxbury the only Braille translation software out there?  I'm considering the purchase of an embosser and want to factor in the cost of the appropriate software to make that purchase complete.  Thanks, and any recommendations on good embosser models is appreciated. Joe Orozco "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4901 (20100227) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co m ------------------------------ Message: 11 Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 01:20:51 -0600 From: "Jennifer Applegate" To: Subject: Re: [nabs-l] nabs-l Digest, Vol 40, Issue 28 Message-ID: <6F4D48FB333B4B40B1D8CB640E4BC6E3 at YOURH99HMLEC97> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";     reply-type=original I had to purchase another laptop at the beginning of last semester, as the screen went out on my laptop that I use for college.  I ended up with purchasing a mini notebook by asues from best buy for $300, and it had a trial of microsoft office 2007 for 60 days on it.  I purchased a student version of the software from microsoft for $59 about the time it ran out. Initially I was hesitant about purchasing it, as it did not have jaws on it or a disk drive to load jaws.  However my brother is a techy person and used an external disk drive to load my jaws software onto the notebook.  So I spent a total of $360, and it has been great for college purposes, especially when someone sighted needs to look at the screen to help me. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2010 12:00 PM Subject: nabs-l Digest, Vol 40, Issue 28 > Send nabs-l mailing list submissions to > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > nabs-l-request at nfbnet.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > nabs-l-owner at nfbnet.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of nabs-l digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > >  1. Re: Does anyone use a MacBook or MacBook Pro for school? >      (Kevin Fjelsted) >  2. questions about e-college (Maryann Migliorelli) >  3. Re: Does anyone use a MacBook or MacBook Pro for school? >      (Kevin Fjelsted) >  4. Delayed Mail (Joe Orozco) >  5. Re: Delayed Mail (Serena) >  6. Fw: March Issue Now Available (V Nork) >  7. Re: Delayed Mail (Nicole B. Torcolini) >  8. Re: Delayed Mail (Courtney Stover) >  9. Re: Delayed Mail (Rania ) >  10. Re: Delayed Mail (Meghan Whalen) >  11. Blind People Owning Guns (Robert Spangler) >  12. Re: Blind People Owning Guns (Robert Jaquiss) >  13. Re: Does anyone use a MacBook or MacBook Pro for school? >      (Briley Pollard) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Fri, 26 Feb 2010 13:43:35 -0600 > From: Kevin Fjelsted > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does anyone use a MacBook or MacBook Pro for > school? > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > There are a number of resources that will give a perspective on using > the mac. One web resource that I find helpful  is > http://www.lioncourt.com/. > I have a few entries on my blog at http://www.kfjelsted.com/ which > describe my personal experience. > It is also important to keep in mind that if one utilizes a Mac one > can run Windows within that Mac platform. THis is not true if one > picks a Windows platform I.E., there is a huge advantage by utilizing > a Mac platform over a WIndows platform from a flexibility perspective. > > I think it is a very powerful statement when the former Vice President > of Software Engineering in charge of JAWS development for Freedom > Scientific is now using a Mac almost exclusively. > Another factor worth considering is that JAWS is languishing and > appears to be getting bugler and bugler as time goes on. Unless there > is a major effort to turn things around the JAWS screen reader will > run out of steam very soon.  THis is a separate issue so if JAWS is > being compared to be fair one should compare some of the other Windows > screen readers. > -Kevin > On 2/25/10, Christopher Wright wrote: >> Hi Corbb, >> As someone who is following Mac-related developments, as much as >> possible, >> I'd like to know what brings you to that conclusion. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Corbb O'Connor" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Thursday, February 25, 2010 4:49 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does anyone use a MacBook or MacBook Pro for >> school? >> >> >>> Hi Sally, >>> >>> I'll probably initiate a firestorm with this comment, but I'll say it >>> anyway. I'm a blind user of the Mac, and love it. But if I didn't have >>> any residual vision, I'd be a JAWS user. I find that more programs are >>> accessible with JAWS on the Windows operating system, and that it's >>> just >>> easier to use. That said, if your son has remaining vision and  uses a >>> magnification software to see the screen, then go for the Mac.  It's >>> built-in, and very good. Combine that with VoiceOver, the built- in >>> screen >>> >>> reader on the Mac, and he'll be in good shape. But, if it's  easier for >>> him to use the screen reader than squint to see the screen,  then I'd >>> say >>> Windows. >>> >>> Hope that helps -- and I'm happy to answer more questions! >>> Corbb O'Connor >>> Senior, The George Washington University >>> >>> >>> On Feb 24, 2010, at 8:34 PM, Sally Thomas wrote: >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> I'm the parent of a blind 13 year old.  He tells me that the screen >>> reader on the MacBook is great and that it is better than using a >>> Windows >>> >>> computer with JAWS.  I'm curious whether or not this is true.  Have any >>> of you used both?  How do they compare?  Which do you  prefer?  Any >>> insight you have would be greatly appreciated. >>> >>> Sally Thomas >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/corbbo%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/chriswright11%40verizon.net >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kfjelsted%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kevin Fjelsted > B Harris, Inc. > http://www.bharrisinc.com > kevin.fjelsted at bharrisinc.com > http://www.linkedin.com/in/kevinfjelsted > Phone:  612.424.7333 EX. 301 > Direct:  612.424.7332 > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Fri, 26 Feb 2010 15:19:21 -0700 > From: "Maryann Migliorelli" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > , "Colorado Association of Blind Students List" > > Subject: [nabs-l] questions about e-college > Message-ID: <5D4F899913E44AC0B6CC2E1D05391B6B at PAULLAPTOP> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Hello Fellow students, > I'm wondering if anyone is using e-college for your online classes.  If > so, what screen reader are you using and where did you get whatever > scripts you needed to make it work.  Also, is anyone using my-scribe for > your online textbooks?  Is there another preferred puff bookreader with > the same features? > Thanks for any help given.  I'm investigating accessibility at Devry > University. > Maryann Migliorelli > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Fri, 26 Feb 2010 17:28:05 -0600 > From: Kevin Fjelsted > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does anyone use a MacBook or MacBook Pro for > school? > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > I did a quick check using retail online pricing. > The JAWS professional software costs $1,095.00 at the Freedom > Scientific online store. > THen in order to keep current there is a yearly SMA cost of $260.00. > Since Apple has not released a NetBook we cannot compare Netbooks. > HOwever Apple will begin selling the IPad at the end of March for $499 > which will be comparable and better than  a Netbook. The  IPad will > have the same accessibility using VoiceOver as the IPhone at no extra > cost. > A non-Netbook WIndows laptop can be had for say $550 retail. > If one then adds screen reading software plus a productivity suite it > would seem  that we are at least $1800 for a system. > > The Macbook laptop costs $999 retail. > > With the Macbook one already  has built-in accessibility plus core > productivity functions including mail, text processing, address > management, and calendaring. One can add IWOrk for the Mac at $80 and > get Pages (word processor compatible with Microsoft WOrd) Numbers > (spreadsheet compatible with Excel) and Keynote (presentations > including powerpoint compatibility). > > The Apple Mac Mini can be purchased for $599.00.  The Mini is a 2 > pound very small system that is not battery powered. I use the Mini > because I can throw it in a backpack and it takes up about the quarter > of the room of a laptop. > THe cool thing is that one doesn't need to attach a monitor if one > attaches a very short Apple provided converter cable to the Mini. > > In the pricing discussions it is important to focus not only on the > hardware but the software as well. > > On 2/26/10, Steve Jacobson wrote: >> Sally, >> >> Please allow me to both agree with Darrell and maybe muddy the waters >> further.  It the school uses MACS, it may still be wise to see what >> software >> they are using on >> the MACS to determine if it is accessible.  For example, if a school >> makes >> heavy use of Microsoft Office on the MAC, a blind student might be better >> off with a >> Windows computer with Microsoft Office installed as Microsoft Word is, to >> my >> knowledge, not accessible on the MAC.  In other words, the hardware and >> the >> software must both be considered.  What is the school using for class web >> sites, and can web sites be used with one computer better than the other? >> These are >> not questions that will necessarily give MAC or Windows the upper hand, >> but >> they need to be explored since he'll be in that school system for a few >> years to come. >> >> I don't think any objective person would try to say that either MAC or >> Windows are flat out better because it is more complicated than that.  At >> this point, there are >> more accessible applications running on Windows, but one doesn't run "all >> accessible applications" only the ones they are interested in, so if what >> he >> needs to do >> on the MAC is accessible, then it may not matter.  Apple, on the other >> hand, >> has more control over the applications written for the MAC, so in some >> cases, >> accessibility is probably more stable.  I say all this only to illustrate >> the complexity. >> >> VoiceOver is included with the MAC as has been said.  However, when >> buying >> computers for my kids, I found that MACBooks were substantially more >> expensive >> than Windows laptops.  One can argue correctly that you might get more, >> but >> the fact remains that you will probably pay more.  A Windows laptop with >> a >> screen >> reader will likely cost you more, though, than a MACBook, in all >> fairness, >> but at least when I looked, the total costs made the fact that VoiceOver >> was >> included >> somewhat less significant.  This may have changed, though. >> >> These are not the kind of clear answers you are looking for, but please >> ask >> if you have more questions. >> >> Best regards, >> >> Steve >> >> On Thu, 25 Feb 2010 07:45:41 -0700, Darrell Shandrow wrote: >> >>>Hello Sally, >> >>>As with many things inside and outside the assistive technology arena, a >>>judgment of which solution is the "best" for any particular application >>>can >>>be subjective. >>> >>>If your son is able to complete his school work on terms of equality with >>>his sighted peers, then the solution is best for his needs. If he is not, >>>then, perhaps, some modification is in order. >> >>>Many schools continue to rely on Apple for all or most of their >>>technology, >>>so your son's ability to use the same computer as other kids at school is >>>probably a big help to him, his teachers and the school's support staff. >> >>>On the other hand, if the school relies on Windows, then he might want to >>>consider switching to a screen reader like System Access, Window-Eyes or >>>JAWS. >> >>>Hope this helps. >> >>>Regards, >> >>>Darrell >> >>>-----Original Message----- >>>From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>> Behalf >>>Of Sally Thomas >>>Sent: Wednesday, February 24, 2010 6:34 PM >>>To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>Subject: [nabs-l] Does anyone use a MacBook or MacBook Pro for school? >> >>>Hi, >> >>>I'm the parent of a blind 13 year old.  He tells me that the screen >>>reader >>>on the MacBook is great and that it is better than using a Windows >>>computer >>>with JAWS.  I'm curious whether or not this is true.  Have any of you >>>used >>>both?  How do they compare?  Which do you prefer?  Any insight you have >>>would be greatly appreciated. >> >>>Sally Thomas >>>_______________________________________________ >>>nabs-l mailing list >>>nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>nabs-l: >>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/darrell.shandrow%40g >>>mail.com >> >> >>>_______________________________________________ >>>nabs-l mailing list >>>nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/steve.jacobson%40visi.com >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kfjelsted%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kevin Fjelsted > B Harris, Inc. > http://www.bharrisinc.com > kevin.fjelsted at bharrisinc.com > http://www.linkedin.com/in/kevinfjelsted > Phone:  612.424.7333 EX. 301 > Direct:  612.424.7332 > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Fri, 26 Feb 2010 19:59:14 -0500 > From: "Joe Orozco" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Subject: [nabs-l] Delayed Mail > Message-ID: <7B73E28DD4FE4B758127119FE3E0D256 at Rufus> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > > Is it just me, or are other people receiving delayed mail from the NFBNet > lists?  I've seen discussion on the Mac question for a couple days now, > but > I'm just now receiving Sally's original post.  I don't know if my Gmail, > the > mail server or my antivirus software is responsible. > > Joe Orozco > > "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, > some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature > database 4899 (20100226) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Fri, 26 Feb 2010 20:54:33 -0500 > From: "Serena" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Delayed Mail > Message-ID: <001501cab74f$ced119f0$0201a8c0 at Serene> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > > I am, too.  I'm not the tech wizzard who knows what's causing it.  I use > Verizon, not gmail. > > Serena > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Joe Orozco" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Friday, February 26, 2010 7:59 PM > Subject: [nabs-l] Delayed Mail > > >> Is it just me, or are other people receiving delayed mail from the NFBNet >> lists?  I've seen discussion on the Mac question for a couple days now, >> but >> I'm just now receiving Sally's original post.  I don't know if my Gmail, >> the >> mail server or my antivirus software is responsible. >> >> Joe Orozco >> >> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >> sleeves, >> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >> >> >> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >> signature >> database 4899 (20100226) __________ >> >> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >> >> http://www.eset.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizon.net > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Fri, 26 Feb 2010 18:01:51 -0800 > From: "V Nork" > To: > Cc: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > Subject: [nabs-l] Fw: March Issue Now Available > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > March Issue Now Available > ----- Original Message ----- > From: AccessWorld > To: AFB Subscriber > Sent: Friday, February 26, 2010 1:04 PM > Subject: March Issue Now Available > > > >      AFB American Foundation >      for the Blind  TM > > >      Expanding possibilities for people with vision loss > > The March issue of AccessWorld is now available on our web site. > > We apologize for the delay in getting these articles to you. We hope > you'll find the information to be worth the wait. This issue features: > > > > >  a.. Editor's Page > > >  b.. A Look Back: Two Historical Interviews with Deane Blaize > > >  c.. An Evaluation of Kindle 2 and Sony Reader Digital Book Players, by > Darren Burton-We report on the accessibility of two popular digital book > players > > >  d.. Apex and Intel: A Commentary, by Deborah Kendrick-A perspective on > two new products in the assistive technology market > > >  e.. What Can Policy Change Do for You?, by Paul Schroder-A look at > pending legislation and what it could mean for you > > >  f.. The ScripTalk Experience, by Bradley Hodges-A look at how people are > using ScripTalk to independently manage their prescription medications > > >  g.. Social Networking Is Becoming a Way of Life, by Marc Grossman-A > discussion of popular social networking sites > > >  h.. Book Review: Assistive Technology for Students Who Are Blind or > Visually Impaired: A Guide to Assessment > > >  i.. AccessWorld News > > >  j.. Letter to the Editor > > > Paul Schroeder > Acting Editor-in-Chief > > AccessWorld? is the American Foundation for the Blind's technology > magazine. > > Be sure to sign up on the AccessWorld home page to receive AccessWorld > Extra, the e-mail newsletter produced by AccessWorld staff six times per > year. When you sign up for AccessWorld Extra, you are also added to the > list of people who receive e-mail announcements when new issues of > AccessWorld are posted. > > > > > > "Remove" instructions > You are receiving this message because you are an AccessWorld reader. To > be taken off the distribution list, please reply to this message with the > word "remove" in the subject line, and we will remove you at once. (If you > do not wish to read AccessWorld and you have received this e-mail in > error, we sincerely apologize). > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 7 > Date: Fri, 26 Feb 2010 23:21:35 -0800 > From: "Nicole B. Torcolini" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Delayed Mail > Message-ID: <3AD6708333BB459F942259E640E906FE at stanford.edu> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=response > > Ditto. Sometimes, I also receive the reply before the original email. It's > not just this list; it also happens on the other two NFB hosted lists to > which I am subscribed. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Serena" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Friday, February 26, 2010 5:54 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Delayed Mail > > >>I am, too.  I'm not the tech wizzard who knows what's causing it.  I use >>Verizon, not gmail. >> >> Serena >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Joe Orozco" >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Friday, February 26, 2010 7:59 PM >> Subject: [nabs-l] Delayed Mail >> >> >>> Is it just me, or are other people receiving delayed mail from the >>> NFBNet >>> lists?  I've seen discussion on the Mac question for a couple days now, >>> but >>> I'm just now receiving Sally's original post.  I don't know if my Gmail, >>> the >>> mail server or my antivirus software is responsible. >>> >>> Joe Orozco >>> >>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >>> sleeves, >>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>> >>> >>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>> signature >>> database 4899 (20100226) __________ >>> >>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>> >>> http://www.eset.com >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizon.net >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecable.com > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 8 > Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 04:32:36 -0600 > From: Courtney Stover > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Delayed Mail > Message-ID: > <7949e5e21002270232r7f840107ucda0a18ea1ecc04c at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > Hi all: > > I, too, am receiving delayed mail.  Because of the variety of servers, > I'm thinking it has to be the NFB servers. > Courtney > > On 2/27/10, Nicole B. Torcolini wrote: >> Ditto. Sometimes, I also receive the reply before the original email. >> It's >> not just this list; it also happens on the other two NFB hosted lists to >> which I am subscribed. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Serena" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Friday, February 26, 2010 5:54 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Delayed Mail >> >> >>>I am, too.  I'm not the tech wizzard who knows what's causing it.  I use >>>Verizon, not gmail. >>> >>> Serena >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Joe Orozco" >>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >>> Sent: Friday, February 26, 2010 7:59 PM >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Delayed Mail >>> >>> >>>> Is it just me, or are other people receiving delayed mail from the >>>> NFBNet >>>> lists?  I've seen discussion on the Mac question for a couple days now, >>>> but >>>> I'm just now receiving Sally's original post.  I don't know if my >>>> Gmail, >>>> the >>>> mail server or my antivirus software is responsible. >>>> >>>> Joe Orozco >>>> >>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >>>> sleeves, >>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>> >>>> >>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>>> signature >>>> database 4899 (20100226) __________ >>>> >>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>> >>>> http://www.eset.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizon.net >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecable.com >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/liamskitten%40gmail.com >> > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 9 > Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 07:22:27 -0800 > From: "Rania " > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Delayed Mail > Message-ID: <4b890e8e.86c3f10a.428e.ffffbdd9 at mx.google.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > The same thing happends to me too. > Rania, > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On > Behalf > Of Nicole B. Torcolini > Sent: Friday, February 26, 2010 11:22 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Delayed Mail > > Ditto. Sometimes, I also receive the reply before the original email. It's > not just this list; it also happens on the other two NFB hosted lists to > which I am subscribed. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Serena" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Friday, February 26, 2010 5:54 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Delayed Mail > > >>I am, too.  I'm not the tech wizzard who knows what's causing it.  I use >>Verizon, not gmail. >> >> Serena >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Joe Orozco" >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Friday, February 26, 2010 7:59 PM >> Subject: [nabs-l] Delayed Mail >> >> >>> Is it just me, or are other people receiving delayed mail from the >>> NFBNet >>> lists?  I've seen discussion on the Mac question for a couple days now, >>> but >>> I'm just now receiving Sally's original post.  I don't know if my Gmail, >>> the >>> mail server or my antivirus software is responsible. >>> >>> Joe Orozco >>> >>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >>> sleeves, >>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>> >>> >>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>> signature >>> database 4899 (20100226) __________ >>> >>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>> >>> http://www.eset.com >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizo > n.net >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecab > le.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai > l.com > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 10 > Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 08:00:02 -0600 > From: Meghan Whalen > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Delayed Mail > Message-ID: <7C2847B7D5E547A589E355278C5A96FB at YOURZVIRQM73LR> > Content-Type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII; format=flowed; > reply-type=original > > I'm having the same problem. > > Meghan > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Joe Orozco" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Friday, February 26, 2010 6:59 PM > Subject: [nabs-l] Delayed Mail > > >> Is it just me, or are other people receiving delayed mail from the NFBNet >> lists?  I've seen discussion on the Mac question for a couple days now, >> but >> I'm just now receiving Sally's original post.  I don't know if my Gmail, >> the >> mail server or my antivirus software is responsible. >> >> Joe Orozco >> >> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >> sleeves, >> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >> >> >> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >> signature >> database 4899 (20100226) __________ >> >> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >> >> http://www.eset.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mewhalen%40wisc.edu >> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 11 > Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 11:07:36 -0500 > From: Robert Spangler > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > Subject: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns > Message-ID: > <19ccaa051002270807m7c1034fbqc7746c39bd536bcf at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > Hello all, > > Does anyone know of any blind person who has experience with owning > guns, taken the concealed weapon carry test, or has any experience > with guns?  My sister needs to know for a school research project. > Please email rachael.spangler at rockets.utoledo.edu. > > Thanks, > -- > Robert Spangler > The University of Toledo > Student Senator - Administrative Affairs Committee Chair, College of > Arts and Sciences > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 12 > Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 11:14:32 -0600 > From: "Robert Jaquiss" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Cc: rachael.spangler at rockets.utoledo.edu > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns > Message-ID: <5434D1A3166D4869AA5760396B59E81E at D3DTZP41> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > > Hello: > >    I know of two blind hunters. I presume they own their own firearms and > transport them. I would think the bigger issue would be could the > individual > use a weapon. Blind hunters have sighted people help them aim. > > Regards, > > Robert Jaquiss, President > Greater Ouachita Chapter > National Federation of the Blind > Email: rjaquiss at earthlink.net > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Robert Spangler" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2010 10:07 AM > Subject: [nabs-l] Blind People Owning Guns > > >> Hello all, >> >> Does anyone know of any blind person who has experience with owning >> guns, taken the concealed weapon carry test, or has any experience >> with guns?  My sister needs to know for a school research project. >> Please email rachael.spangler at rockets.utoledo.edu >> >> Thanks, >> -- >> Robert Spangler >> The University of Toledo >> Student Senator - Administrative Affairs Committee Chair, College of >> Arts and Sciences >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/rjaquiss%40earthlink.net > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 13 > Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 11:58:41 -0600 > From: Briley Pollard > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does anyone use a MacBook or MacBook Pro for > school? > Message-ID: <3EFF48F7-C5ED-4D0E-9066-5992189B1E20 at gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > I'm also a Mac user, and I can say that it would've been awesome to have > access to this technology in high school. Being able to use any of the > computers my sighted peers were using would've have been more convenient > on many fronts. > > Good luck, > BrileyOn Feb 25, 2010, at 8:33 PM, Maurice Mines wrote: > >> hi I am a mac user and  i use a braille desplay. and seem to be fine. >> On Feb 25, 2010, at 2:49 PM, Corbb O'Connor wrote: >> >>> Hi Sally, >>> >>> I'll probably initiate a firestorm with this comment, but I'll say it >>> anyway. I'm a blind user of the Mac, and love it. But if I didn't have >>> any residual vision, I'd be a JAWS user. I find that more programs are >>> accessible with JAWS on the Windows operating system, and that it's just >>> easier to use. That said, if your son has remaining vision and uses a >>> magnification software to see the screen, then go for the Mac. It's >>> built-in, and very good. Combine that with VoiceOver, the built-in >>> screen reader on the Mac, and he'll be in good shape. But, if it's >>> easier for him to use the screen reader than squint to see the screen, >>> then I'd say Windows. >>> >>> Hope that helps -- and I'm happy to answer more questions! >>> Corbb O'Connor >>> Senior, The George Washington University >>> >>> >>> On Feb 24, 2010, at 8:34 PM, Sally Thomas wrote: >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> I'm the parent of a blind 13 year old.  He tells me that the screen >>> reader on the MacBook is great and that it is better than using a >>> Windows computer with JAWS.  I'm curious whether or not this is true. >>> Have any of you used both?  How do they compare?  Which do you prefer? >>> Any insight you have would be greatly appreciated. >>> >>> Sally Thomas >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/corbbo%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/minesm%40me.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com > > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > > > End of nabs-l Digest, Vol 40, Issue 28 > ************************************** ------------------------------ Message: 12 Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 03:41:40 -0500 From: "Sarah Jevnikar" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"     Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Duxbury Message-ID: <000101cab851$d9278cb0$8b76a610$@jevnikar at utoronto.ca> Content-Type: text/plain;    charset="US-ASCII" Hi Joe and all, I have an Index Basic-D which as mentioned comes with WinBraille. I also have Duxbury, which generally seems more user-friendly. The advantage of WinBraille is that you can emboss documents directly from Microsoft Word if you want. I haven't used any of the aforementioned translation tables, so I can't compare the two products in that sense. The embosser itself is decent: you can print double-sided if you choose and it's easy to configure. It has speech output which helps, in spite of the fact that the embosser has a Swedish accent. I am told it can Braille graphics but I haven't tried it myself. It doesn't come with a sound-reducing case like some embossers do, and is loud. However it has always served my purposes and any issues I've had have been with the software rather than the embosser itself. Apologies for the usual verbosity. I hope that helped some though. Sarah -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of David Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2010 11:59 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Duxbury Hi, Duxbury is possibly the most comprehensive Braille translator that I know of. The Index embossers made by a company in Sweden come with a piece of software called WinBraille, but I don't like the translation tables. Some of the contractions are a bit off, as well as some of the Braille symbols. That's just my opinion, though. David -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joe Orozco Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2010 8:00 PM To: 'NFBnet NFBCS Mailing List'; 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: [nabs-l] Duxbury Hello, Is Duxbury the only Braille translation software out there?  I'm considering the purchase of an embosser and want to factor in the cost of the appropriate software to make that purchase complete.  Thanks, and any recommendations on good embosser models is appreciated. Joe Orozco "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4901 (20100227) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co m _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto ronto.ca ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org End of nabs-l Digest, Vol 40, Issue 29 ************************************** From marrie12 at gmail.com Tue Mar 2 18:08:54 2010 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 10:08:54 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] o.t: References: <460e3ec41003012237u199492efl3cf70cf56ee1c2fc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Begin forwarded message: > From: Elliott Barnes > Date: March 1, 2010 10:37:21 PM PST > To: Access e-mail forum > Cc: talks at talksusers.com, The Accessible Phones Discussion List , talks-uk at freelists.org > Subject: Re: [access] WFA User Protest > Reply-To: The Accessible Phones Discussion List > > If JAWS, Window-Eyes, and/or Hal and Supernova were abandoned and a > petition was created, would you sign that? Or would you use the same > logic that you're using now, and just say hey! I bet other companies > are working on an alternative? > What if, however, other companies were not working on other > alternatives, and a new operating system was created, and that > particular screenreader didn't work properly because it had been > abandond? > Some of you really make me wonder about this community, and how much > people care about screen readers and navigational assistants. > On 01/03/2010, Neil Barnfather - TalkNav wrote: >> A quick note to all of you who have, and those who as of yet have not signed >> the WFA user protest site. >> >> Before I start my message the link right here and now is >> www.talknav.com/protest >> >> Firstly, a note to all of you who have signed, thank you, but I have to at >> this stage say that it is way too few who have made this effort. We are >> nearing 700, yet for Vodafone to take this seriously we need thousands. >> >> To date we've not even got close to even the number of users of the >> application signing, let alone additional support. >> >> Can I especially ask those of you who either work with or for the >> organizations that supposedly represent us as blind folk, yes you lot, those >> of you at the RNIB, CNIB, AFB, NFB, etc, etc, you lot really have made me >> rather upset and irritated. >> >> To date I've posted two messages via each of your web-sites informing you >> all of our protest, has any one of you got back to me to ask for more >> detail, have you mass mailed your members, have you lobbied in our favour, >> have you, no sir. Is this an outrage, is this a complete lack of competence >> when it comes to supporting those who you claim to represent? This >> individual thinks so. So if you represent, or have a contact at your local >> blind organization please forward this message, we, or certainly I, am very, >> very disappointed in you all. >> >> As for those private individuals who have not yet signed, even if you do not >> own Access or a Symbian phone, your name should be on this list, the list >> says something about who we are and what we stand for as blind folks, it >> says that we will not lay down and be ignored whilst our tools to freedom >> and mobility are stolen from us. It says we have a voice and we are prepared >> to use it when necessary. >> >> This protest is about more than just Wayfinder Access, it is a symbol, now >> please, I urge you all, we need this link spreading, we need it sharing, >> Face Book pages, Twitter, those of you who produce pod casts, mailing lists >> etc, etc, if you believe in your freedom to mobility and your rights to >> accessible products then make your mark. >> >> More than this, those you know need to say that they too are in support of >> our cause, so get your address book and forward this link, personalize it >> with a few lines of message, get the word out there. >> >> The protest site has a league table on it at the bottom of the public >> signatures page, it's dynamic and countries move about on the list. To date >> we've only had a tiny portion of blind people around the world sign up. >> Spread the word folks. >> >> www.talknav.com/protest >> >> This issue rests squarely in your hands, make a difference today... >> >> Regards. >> >> Neil Barnfather. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Access mailing list >> Access at accessusers.com >> http://wfusers.com/mailman/listinfo/access >> >> Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: >> eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ >> and >> Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/ >> > > > -- > Elliott. > > Contact info: > > Skype: > bigboy11111 > MSN/Windows Live: > elliottabarnes at hotmail.co.uk > Website: > http://www.blindnet.co.nr/ > Twitter: > http://www.twitter.com/elliott94 > Blog: > http://www.elliottsblog.info/ > Last.fm profile page: > http://www.last.fm/user/elliottbarnes > Facebook: > http://facebook.com/elliott94 > Mobile number: > +447526601203 > > You received this message because you subscribed to the Accessible Phones Discussion List. > > If you don't want to receive messages from this list anymore, just send a blank e-mail to: > blindphones-unsubscribe at mosenexplosion.com From ginisd at sbcglobal.net Wed Mar 3 02:41:05 2010 From: ginisd at sbcglobal.net (V Nork) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 18:41:05 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] just a test Message-ID: <2B6866C0295B465ABF3FED30282A6E94@windows4c0ed96> From ginisd at sbcglobal.net Wed Mar 3 03:23:23 2010 From: ginisd at sbcglobal.net (V Nork) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 19:23:23 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] this is another test Message-ID: From ginisd at sbcglobal.net Wed Mar 3 03:28:46 2010 From: ginisd at sbcglobal.net (V Nork) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 19:28:46 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! References: <0KYL00KJF2NEPRL4@vms173017.mailsrvcs.net> <018EB229338941F1AC23FE43C68AA283@PAULLAPTOP> Message-ID: <4A7E12D672824E10839CFA6CEDEB59F6@windows4c0ed96> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Maryann Migliorelli" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 12:39 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Hi Claudia, I'm glad to see you took my advice and joined us. I'm sure > you > can add a lot to this list, and your willingness to learn from fellow > students will serve you well. Please feel welcomed and know that you are > among friends. > Maryann Migliorelli > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ginisd%40sbcglobal.net From jty727 at gmail.com Wed Mar 3 04:07:34 2010 From: jty727 at gmail.com (Justin Young) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 23:07:34 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Different Legislation for Visually Impaired/Blind Message-ID: <54d8179e1003022007y11b93591y509d2dc2a08e7d2c@mail.gmail.com> Hello to all! I am going to Washington D.C. for a conference with my school's Student Government Association. I was wondering if any had a list of the various pieces of legislation currently going through either House, Senate or both? I appreciate all help. I ask because my plan is to get my Congressman to become a co-Sponsor of some if not all legislation. thanks, Justin Young From marrie12 at gmail.com Wed Mar 3 04:28:49 2010 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 20:28:49 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Different Legislation for Visually Impaired/Blind In-Reply-To: <54d8179e1003022007y11b93591y509d2dc2a08e7d2c@mail.gmail.com> References: <54d8179e1003022007y11b93591y509d2dc2a08e7d2c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I believe one of the bills is the quiet cars bill but I can't remember. maybe look at www.nfb.org and see what you can see? Good luck on your trip. S On Mar 2, 2010, at 8:07 PM, Justin Young wrote: > Hello to all! > I am going to Washington D.C. for a conference with my school's > Student Government Association. I was wondering if any had a list of > the various pieces of legislation currently going through either > House, Senate or both? > I appreciate all help. I ask because my plan is to get my Congressman > to become a co-Sponsor of some if not all legislation. > thanks, > Justin Young > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com From mhartle at nfb.org Wed Mar 3 06:20:42 2010 From: mhartle at nfb.org (Hartle, Mary Jo) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2010 00:20:42 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Touch the Earth Tactile Book Released Message-ID: ATTENTION! ATTENTION!!! Touch the Earth Book Released The National Federation of the Blind is pleased to announce the release of a new tactile book created with the support of the National Aeronautics and Space Administration. Touch the Earth: A Multimedia book about the Earth's Biomes was written by Amy Hansen and conceptualized by Elissa Levine. It includes tactile graphics created by Noreen Grice. This book aims to educate middle school students while also providing guidance for teachers on how to incorporate this book into classroom instruction. Each book contains contracted Braille and large print, along with tactile and visual graphics to illustrate important concepts in both a tactually and visually friendly way. Each book also comes with a colorful tactile map of the continents of the Earth. Exclusively available through the NFB Independence Market , Touch the Earth (product# LSA91B) can be purchased for $20 . TO place an order please visit http://secure.nfb.org/ecommerce/asp/product.asp?product=854&cat=47&ph=&keywords=&recor=&SearchFor=&PT_ID or call (410) 659-9314. We are pleased to announce that we are offering one free copy upon request to schools and libraries for the blind across the country for their collections. Please contact Mary Jo T. Hartle, Director of Education for the National Federation of the Blind Jernigan Institute, at (410) 659-9314, ext. 2407, or by e-mail at mhartle at nfb.org to request a free copy for your institution. From CDanielsen at nfb.org Wed Mar 3 07:02:19 2010 From: CDanielsen at nfb.org (Danielsen, Chris) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2010 01:02:19 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Court Rules that National Conference of Bar Examiners Must Provide Individualized Testing Accommodations to Blind Law School Graduate Message-ID: FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE CONTACT: Chris Danielsen Director of Public Relations National Federation of the Blind (410) 659-9314, extension 2330 (410) 262-1281 (Cell) cdanielsen at nfb.org Court Rules that National Conference of Bar Examiners Must Provide Individualized Testing Accommodations to Blind Law School Graduate Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals Denies NCBE Motion to Stay Preliminary Injunction San Francisco, California (February 24, 2010): The Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals yesterday refused to stay a preliminary injunction requiring the National Conference of Bar Examiners (NCBE) to provide a blind law school graduate with the technology-based testing accommodations she needs to take two exams required to become a member of the State Bar of California. A federal judge had previously granted the preliminary injunction requiring the accommodations, but the NCBE appealed the ruling. The Ninth Circuit's ruling allows the plaintiff, Stephanie Enyart, to take the February 2010 Multistate Bar Examination (MBE) and March 2010 Multistate Professional Responsibility Examination (MPRE) on a laptop computer equipped with the assistive technology software Ms. Enyart relies upon for screen reading (JAWS) and screen magnification (ZoomText). Dr. Marc Maurer, President of the National Federation of the Blind, said: "The court's action puts an end to Stephanie Enyart's year-long ordeal to get the accommodations she needs to take this crucial step in her chosen career. As we have said before, those who control admission to the practice of law must themselves obey the law." The suit was filed on November 3, 2009, due to the NCBE's refusal, on multiple occasions during the past year, to allow Ms. Enyart to use the same technology on the MBE and MPRE that she has used on university and law school exams and in various jobs and internships. The suit charged that the NCBE violated the Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA) and California's Unruh Civil Rights Act by denying accommodations on the MBE and the MPRE. NCBE had argued that it fulfilled its legal obligations to Ms. Enyart by offering alternative accommodations, such as a human reader, notwithstanding evidence that these alternatives did not, in fact, fully accommodate Ms. Enyart's disability. In rejecting NCBE's argument, the court's ruling paves the way for other individuals prevented from pursuing their professional dreams by high stakes testing providers who take a rigid approach to disability accommodations. The plaintiff is represented with the support of the National Federation of the Blind by LaBarre Law Offices, P.C., in Denver, Colorado, and by Brown, Goldstein & Levy, LLP, in Baltimore, Maryland. The plaintiff is further represented by Disability Rights Advocates, a nonprofit law center that specializes in civil rights cases on behalf of persons with disabilities, based in Berkeley, California. ### About the National Federation of the Blind With more than 50,000 members, the National Federation of the Blind is the largest and most influential membership organization of blind people in the United States. The NFB improves blind people's lives through advocacy, education, research, technology, and programs encouraging independence and self-confidence. It is the leading force in the blindness field today and the voice of the nation's blind. In January 2004 the NFB opened the National Federation of the Blind Jernigan Institute, the first research and training center in the United States for the blind led by the blind. From newmanrl at cox.net Wed Mar 3 08:12:08 2010 From: newmanrl at cox.net (Robert Leslie Newman) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2010 02:12:08 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] 2010 Youth and Adult Writing Contest- Sponsored by NFB Writers' Division Message-ID: Greetings You all! RE: Last month of contest We do not want any of you to miss the opportunity to submit your creative writing in the NFB Writers' Division 2010 Writing Contest. There is only the days of March left. the deadline for submissions is post marked, April 1st. Below is the information you need to enter: the adult contests, poetry and fiction, are open to all entrants eighteen years and over. The youth contests are all about Braille and all poetry and fiction entries are required to be submitted in Braille. The age groups are divided into three categories: first through sixth grades, seventh and eighth grades, and ninth through twelfth grades. Prizes for contest winners range up to $100 for adult categories and up to $25 for youth categories. All contest winners will be announced at the Writers' Division business meeting during the NFB national convention to be held in Dallas, Texas, the first week of July, 2010. In addition, shortly after convention, a list of winners will appear on the Writers' Division website, www.nfb-writers-division.org. First, second, and third place winners in each category will appear in the summer and fall issues of the Writers' Division magazine, "Slate and Style." For additional contest details and submission guidelines, go to the Writers' Division website, www.nfb-writers-division.org. President NFB Writers' Division Robert Leslie Newman Email- newmanrl at cox.net Division Website Http://www.nfb-writers-division.org From aec732 at msn.com Wed Mar 3 08:14:59 2010 From: aec732 at msn.com (Annemarie Cooke) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2010 02:14:59 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Choice Magazine Listening Available Via NLS Message-ID: I have been asked to circulate the following, and am glad to do so because I read the publication, and really like it. They do a great job of selecting an interesting group of articles every other month. David Andrews CHOICE MAGAZINE FREE AS DIGITAL DOWNLOAD FROM NLS Reconnect with an old friend or meet a new one – CHOICE Magazine Listening is available for free digital download from the Library of Congress’ National Library Service for the Blind and Physically Handicapped's BARD program. Produced six times a year, each issue contains unabridged works from quality publications such as National Geographic, Smithsonian, Sports Illustrated, and the New Yorker. The articles, short stories, poetry and interviews are selected from more than 100 magazines and other periodicals. The selections are read by professional voice talent, not synthetic text-to-speech. Established in 1962, CHOICE Magazine Listening is available free of charge only to people who are blind, experiencing vision loss or have other disabilities that limit or prevent reading standard print. The audio anthology continues to be released on four-track cassette tape for those who prefer that format. website: www.choicemagazinelistening.org or calling toll-free 1-888-724-6423. Information on the digital download from NLS at: www.nlsbard.loc.gov or contacting a local NLS cooperating library located usually in state capitals in the US. Engage in discussion of Choice selections on Facebook and Twitter, too! From lilrichie411 at gmail.com Wed Mar 3 14:42:10 2010 From: lilrichie411 at gmail.com (Jordan Richardson) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 08:42:10 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: MABS conference call In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: The call will be at 9/8c tonight. We will talk about our spring seminar coinciding with MN's semi-annual convention. We will also talk about what's happening currently in MN. Thanks all, Jordan Richardson 2nd VP, Minnesota Association of Blind Students ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Katlyn May Kress Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 02:45:45 -0600 Subject: MABS conference call To: "Xiong, Lao" , Reed Hoffman , Rebecca Kragnes , "Niska, Matthias" , mn-abs-request at nfbnet.org, Minnesota Association of Blind Students List , Mari Flower , "Lombard, JoAnne" , "Langton, Deanna" , Katie Wintz , "Kamara, Kotumu" , Jordan Richardson , Jennifer Dunnam , Jeffrey Thompson , Jeffrey Thompson , Jean Rauschenbach , "Gittens, Michele" , "Erickson, Mark" , blind-international-students at nfbnet.org, Bev Collins , Betsy cyson , Anthony LLawlor , Anne Naber , Amy Hatten , Amanda Swanson Hello All, This week MABS will again hold a conference call. Call in to speak with other blind students and discuss interesting topics. Regretable I myself cannot be there this week as I will be out of town on college business. However, the other board members will be present to speak with you. The number to enter the conversation is 712-451-6000 the code to enter is 6227. I look forward to hearing about the conference. Katlyn Kress. President Minnesota Association of Blind Students. -- Jordan Richardson 2nd Vice President, Minnesota Association of Blind Students lilrichie411 at gmail.com "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." --Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. From kevin at kevinlarose.net Wed Mar 3 15:06:06 2010 From: kevin at kevinlarose.net (Kevin LaRose) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 07:06:06 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] o.t: References: <460e3ec41003012237u199492efl3cf70cf56ee1c2fc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I feel this petition could have very easily stood on its own without the vitriolic verbiage that accompanied it. The one sure way to immediately turn me off of a cause is by attempting to either guilt me or bully me, and the language in this message does some measure of both. KL From agrima at nbp.org Wed Mar 3 16:38:13 2010 From: agrima at nbp.org (Tony Grima) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2010 10:38:13 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] NBP-Announce: Social Networking and You: Twitter, Facebook, and LinkedIn for Blind Users (by Anna Dresner) Message-ID: Social Networking and You: Twitter, Facebook, and LinkedIn for Blind Users By Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, text, and DAISY formats, $12.00 "I started my job search with my LinkedIn contacts." "Your tweets are hilarious!" "We're Facebook friends, but we've never met in person!" It seems like everyone these days is spending at least some of their time on social networking sites. If you're not participating, you may feel left out - and it doesn't help that none of these sites were designed with blind users in mind! But what exactly do Facebook, Twitter and LinkedIn have to offer? How do you get started on them? And what about issues of privacy? This book is designed to help you learn about these three social networking sites so that you can decide which, if any, you wish to join. Anna Dresner gives you enough information to get started; she describes how these sites work right now and gives you some idea about the sorts of things you can do on them. Anna offers commands and strategies for navigating these sites with screen readers, and includes pointers for handling specific situations using JAWS, Window-Eyes and System Access, and VoiceOver on the Mac. Note: The DAISY version of this book will work with any version of FSReader, which comes free with every installation of JAWS. Read the full table of contents for this book, or order it, at http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/SOCIAL.html ****** To order any books, send payment to: NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge it: toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 20. Or order any of our books online at http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html . _______________________________________________ Nbp mailing list Nbp at nbp.org PLEASE DO NOT respond to this message! It is an automated message and your query will not reach us. Send questions to orders at nbp.org . Visit us at http://www.nbp.org From Dsmithnfb at gmail.com Wed Mar 3 17:08:15 2010 From: Dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 09:08:15 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] SFGate: Schools in state fired up over Day of Action Message-ID: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- This article was sent to you by someone who found it on SFGate. The original article can be found on SFGate.com here: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2010/02/28/BA2L1C6QNT.DTL --------------------------------------------------------------------- Sunday, February 28, 2010 (SF Chronicle) Schools in state fired up over Day of Action Nanette Asimov, Chronicle Staff Writer March 4th has gone viral. The upcoming Day of Action to Defend Public Education - rallies, marches, teach-ins, even political theater - began as an idea on the UC Berkeley campus last fall and has caught fire up and down California, from elementary school to graduate school, and across two dozen states. On the surface, Thursday's Day of Action seems likely to be an unprecedented show of unity among public education advocates at all levels who are angry that politicians and university officials with fingers on purse strings are letting the system decay. "Everybody's coming together," said Callie Maidhof, a student at UC Berkeley, where students have protested tuition hikes, budget cuts and layoffs since last fall. But some say the event is already scorched by the threat of violence. At an outdoor dance party early Friday, a crowd of Berkeley campus protesters seized a building, torched trash cans, threw bottles and got into an angry confrontation with police. Hostilities unwanted Students said protesters occupied the building in part to call attention to March 4th, and don't expect the hostilities to be repeated Thursday. "It's important not to inject that level of damage into every action, or you'll alienate lots of people who don't want to act that way," said Xander Lenc, a student at the dance party that got out of hand. A major goal of Thursday's Day of Action is to draw attention to education woes not only in California, but all over the country, Maidhof said. "We want public education to be open and free to all." Instead, college tuition has been climbing steadily in most states and in California, despite a state master plan calling for tuition-free colleges. At UC, next year's base tuition of $10,302 will be more than double that of six years ago. Recent tuition hikes of more than 30 percent at UC and at California State University have forced students to shoulder more of the cost of their education as state lawmakers have cut back on funding to the universities in response to the state's epic budget crisis. Schools are offering fewer courses, cutting wages, laying off employees and reducing enrollment. At community colleges, course cuts will close the door to 21,000 students next year. In the lower grades, thousands of teachers will get layoff warnings by March 15. Holding the Day of Action in time to highlight those pink slips is one reason students and teachers say they chose the date March 4. "We hope to educate our politicians that the system they have for funding schools is not equitable and needs to be changed," said Megan Caluza, who has taught special-needs students at El Dorado Elementary in San Francisco for two years and expects to be laid off. She'll march with colleagues and parents through the Mission District after school, then head to a 5 p.m. rally at Civic Center - one of many sponsored by labor unions and faculty. "Everyone agrees that education should be a right, not a privilege," said Joan Berezin, co-chairwoman of the social science department at Berkeley City College and an organizer. "This is our state, our education. If we don't defend it, who will?" All 23 campuses of California State University are holding events. A sense of humor Rachel Kerns, a sophomore at San Francisco State, recently put final touches on a 12-foot papier-mache "Draculator." It's one of four huge, in-your-face puppets that students, theater Professor Carlos Barón and artist Colette Crutcher are creating for Thursday's rally. The group is building a traditional Mexican weeping figure called "La Llorona" to cry for students, dinosaur bones to signify the extinction of education, and a huge skeleton in a graduation cap. "It's a student who's still paying college loans even after he's dead," Crutcher said with a laugh. "March 4th, I hope, will give the students a feeling of accomplishment," Barón said. "If we make noise, and if we're heard - if people laugh at our work - then we'll have achieved something very positive. We're not there to scream at people." March 4th was born on Oct. 24, when hundreds of students and employees from dozens of schools met at UC Berkeley to decide how to keep momentum alive after a major statewide campus walkout a month earlier to protest the fee hikes and cuts in the works. Since then it seems everyone is planning something for that day. "We wanted to get involved with the national call by California students who are facing the same crisis as we are," said Chris Persampieri, a student at Massasoit Community College in Brockton, Mass., one of several schools in dozens of states holding rallies. Will it make a difference? "I don't think March 4th is going to do anything," said UC Berkeley student Yana Pavlova. "We don't have the tangible power to change the law. So at the end of the day, we're back where we started, paying $30,000 for a 'public' education." A Day of Action: Events planned in the Bay Area and Sacramento. C3 A Day of Action to Defend Public Education Events planned Thursday in the Bay Area and Sacramento: Sacramento -- 11 a.m.-1 p.m.: State Capitol rally on the north steps. The purpose is to feature lessons on California's public education system, focusing on history, political science and economics. Speakers include Assembly Majority Leader Alberto Torrico, D-Fremont, and UC Berkeley Professor George Lakoff. -- Two-minute testimonials from faculty, alumni and public college students will follow. San Francisco -- Daylong: San Francisco public schools will host teach-ins, marches, rallies and letter writing starting at 7 a.m. Many will host rallies and marches, including El Dorado Elementary from 8:30 to 9:30 a.m.; George Washington High from 11:20 a.m. to noon; Feinstein Elementary at 1 p.m.; and Miraloma Elementary at 2:15 p.m. -- 7 a.m.: San Francisco State University campus action. -- 3 p.m.: March from 24th and Mission streets to Civic Center. -- 4 p.m.: March to State Building on McAllister Street. -- 5 p.m.: "Rally for Our Future" at Civic Center, with speakers and performances. Oakland -- Daylong: Oakland public schools will offer activities highlighting the impact of school funding cuts. Activities include leafleting and picketing before class. -- 11 a.m.: Laney College rally, followed by march (via Fruitvale BART) to Oakland City Hall. -- Noon-4 p.m.: Rally at Frank Ogawa Plaza (in front of Oakland City Hall, 14th and Broadway). -- 4 p.m.: Oakland school officials hold press conference at 1515 Clay St. UC Berkeley -- 7 a.m.-noon: Pickets on campus. -- Noon-1 p.m.: UC Berkeley rally at Bancroft and Telegraph, followed by a march to Oakland City Hall. Cal State East Bay, Hayward -- Noon: Rally, walkout and open mike/speak out at Agora Stage at noon; delivery of student demands to campus president. California Maritime Academy, Vallejo -- Noon: Street Theatre/Mock Die-In at Maritime's main quad. San Jose State -- 11 a.m.: March from San Jose City Hall to San Jose State Tower Lawn. -- Noon: Keep the Doors Open rally at San Jose State Tower Lawn Sonoma State -- 11:30 a.m.: Student walkout -- Noon-1:30 p.m.: Rally near Stevenson Quad E-mail Nanette Asimov at nasimov at sfchronicle.com. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Copyright 2010 SF Chronicle From ginisd at sbcglobal.net Wed Mar 3 19:52:19 2010 From: ginisd at sbcglobal.net (V Nork) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 11:52:19 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Will I receive this message, a test Message-ID: From joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com Thu Mar 4 00:29:18 2010 From: joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com (RJ Sandefur) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 19:29:18 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! References: <0KYK009GAI454925@vms173005.mailsrvcs.net><4b8b2946.9713f30a.6019.ffffcc55@mx.google.com> <003601cab9b4$78e07bf0$6aa173d0$@jevnikar@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <51DE1DB6A0C3433786234F467199A138@hometwxakonvzn> Sarah, What is bodkin which? RJ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sarah Jevnikar" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 10:00 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Hi Claudia, > Welcome to the list! I hope you find companionship and great discussion > and > answers here. My name is Sarah Jevnikar and I'm a second-year student at > the > University of Toronto in Canada. I'm studying actuarial science. > Hope to talk again soon, > Sarah > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On > Behalf > Of Alberto Arreola > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 9:41 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Welcome I'm Alberto I am a student at Utah Valley University. I'm > studying > for a computer science degree. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On > Behalf > Of Claudia > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 12:58 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Hello, > > My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently at > University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. Metropolitan area, > and > am very excited to be a member of this group. Perhaps I can learn new > techniques for school as a blind individual. I am also here to give any > ideas should you need it. > > Regards, > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind > of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto > ronto.ca > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com From lilrichie411 at gmail.com Thu Mar 4 01:45:58 2010 From: lilrichie411 at gmail.com (Jordan Richardson) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 19:45:58 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] MnABS Conference Call Update Message-ID: Hi all, Due to circumstances beyond our control, the MNABS conference call for tonight will have to be postponed until a later date. The reason, we will not have a constitutional forum for conducting business. We will contact you with the next meeting date. Thank you, Jordan Richardson 2nd Vice President, Minnesota Association of Blind Students -- Jordan Richardson 2nd Vice President, Minnesota Association of Blind Students lilrichie411 at gmail.com "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." --Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. From fantasyfanatic01 at gmail.com Thu Mar 4 02:58:22 2010 From: fantasyfanatic01 at gmail.com (Franandah Damstra) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 21:58:22 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! In-Reply-To: <4A7E12D672824E10839CFA6CEDEB59F6@windows4c0ed96> References: <0KYL00KJF2NEPRL4@vms173017.mailsrvcs.net> <018EB229338941F1AC23FE43C68AA283@PAULLAPTOP> <4A7E12D672824E10839CFA6CEDEB59F6@windows4c0ed96> Message-ID: Hi, Claudia Welcome to the group. I am one of the youngest members of the NABS list. I am a junior in high school. I am currently studding Japanese and Korean to become a translator and interpreter. I am already fluent in Spanish and English. I have a rare syndrome called De Morsier's Syndrome. I was born with poor vision, but it has gotten worse over the years. I can read a little bit out of my right eye, but I mostly use JAWS and transcribers. If you need any information from a younger persons prospective, feel free to contact me at any time! ~Franandah On 3/2/10, V Nork wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Maryann Migliorelli" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 12:39 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Hi Claudia, I'm glad to see you took my advice and joined us. I'm sure >> you >> can add a lot to this list, and your willingness to learn from fellow >> students will serve you well. Please feel welcomed and know that you are >> among friends. >> Maryann Migliorelli >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ginisd%40sbcglobal.net >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/fantasyfanatic01%40gmail.com > From corbbo at gmail.com Thu Mar 4 03:05:11 2010 From: corbbo at gmail.com (Corbb O'Connor) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 22:05:11 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Will I receive this message, a test In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6B07F88F-949A-4963-81BA-265D8D24DF59@gmail.com> No, but we did... Folks, if you don't see your message post to the list, check the web archive. Some e-mail programs don't send you a copy back once it's on the list. Oh, and if there was any kind of error -- you'd get a reply from the list headquarter system. On Mar 3, 2010, at 2:52 PM, V Nork wrote: _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/corbbo%40gmail.com From gwunder at earthlink.net Thu Mar 4 03:40:45 2010 From: gwunder at earthlink.net (Gary Wunder) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2010 21:40:45 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Freedom Scientific Reduces Price of Focus 40 Blue Braille Display by 38% Message-ID: I forward FYI. ----- Original Message ----- From: @ Freedom Scientific News To: gwunder at earthlink.net Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 3:20 PM Subject: Freedom Scientific Reduces Price of Focus 40 Blue Braille Display by 38% Having trouble viewing this email? Click here Greetings! FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE Media Contact: Brad Davis 800-444-4443 or 727-803-8000 www.FreedomScientific.com Sales: info at FreedomScientific.com Freedom Scientific Reduces Price of Focus 40 Blue Braille Display by 38% to Support Drive for Braille Literacy (St. Petersburg, Florida ­ March 3, 2010) - Freedom Scientific® today announced that it has reduced the US list price of its Focus 40 Blue Braille Display from $4,495 to $2,795, a $1,700 reduction, in a move to support Braille literacy. The National Federation of the Blind, in their report from the Jernigan Institute, has declared that there is a "Braille Literacy Crisis in America," citing such statistics as: a.. Fewer than 10 percent of the 1.3 million people who are legally blind in the United States are Braille readers b.. Only 10 percent of blind children in the US are learning Braille c.. Over 70 percent of blind adults are unemployed, and as many as 50 percent of blind high school students drop out of high school The factors that contribute to a low Braille literacy rate in the US are many, among them a shortage of qualified Braille teachers and an increasing reliance on recorded audio and text-to-speech technologies. "We believe that technology should be supporting Braille literacy, not replacing it," states Dr. Lee Hamilton, President and CEO of Freedom Scientific. "The combination of JAWS® and a Braille display makes learning and using Braille easy. JAWS can translate almost any electronic document or Web page into Braille and then display them on the Focus 40 Blue. JAWS also has a built-in Braille tutor that works with the Focus 40 Blue to provide immediate spoken help when the reader encounters an unfamiliar Braille symbol. This makes independent Braille study easier as it can be used with any document of interest to the student. With a computer and a Braille display, a person who is Braille literate can carry hundreds of books on a single memory card or USB thumb drive. "Unfortunately, Braille displays have always been expensive, which has meant that not everyone who wanted a Braille display could get one. Freedom Scientific wants to open the world of Braille to as many blind people as possible. We first drastically reduced the cost of Braille displays in 2004, when we introduced models 40% below the average price of currently available Braille displays. We are pleased that the manufacturing efficiencies inherent in our latest product design make it possible for us to reduce prices once again and hope this will make Braille accessible to many more people." The Focus 40 Blue is a compact portable Braille display that is the perfect companion to a desktop, laptop, or netbook PC. It connects via USB or Bluetooth® and has a Braille keyboard. The 40 Braille cells are constructed without seams between characters, so the user experience is like reading Braille on paper. The Focus 40 Blue works with Apple® computers and cell phones as well as with JAWS for Windows®. Freedom Scientific's Braille displays are the most reliable in the industry and are backed by technical support and service teams based in St. Petersburg, Florida. The new US/Canada list price for the Focus 40 Blue is USD 2,795 and includes a two-year manufacturer's warranty. For more information, please visit the Freedom Scientific Web site or call 800-444-4443. About Freedom Scientific Freedom Scientific is the leading worldwide provider of assistive technology products for those with vision impairments. The Company sells its products worldwide and has offices in Florida and Switzerland. The Company's products have been translated into 24 languages and are available in 55 countries. Freedom also has a line of software products for those with learning disabilities. Freedom Scientific® and JAWS for Windows® are either trademarks or registered trademarks in the United States and/or other countries. The names of actual companies and products mentioned herein may be the trademarks of their respective owners. Forward email This email was sent to gwunder at earthlink.net by freedomscientificnews at freedomscientific.com. Update Profile/Email Address | Instant removal with SafeUnsubscribe™ | Privacy Policy. Email Marketing by Freedom Scientific | 11800 31st Court North | St. Petersburg | FL | 33716-1805 From carol_castellano at verizon.net Thu Mar 4 04:07:36 2010 From: carol_castellano at verizon.net (Carol Castellano) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2010 22:07:36 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] NLCSD Message-ID: Ever Think About Earning a Doctorate? The National Leadership Consortium in Sensory Disabilities (NLCSD), funded by the U.S. Department of Education, Office of Special Education Programs, is accepting applications to doctoral programs in the areas of blind/visually impaired, deaf/hard of hearing, and deafblindness. Full tuition and a minimum of $20,000 annual living stipend will be provided to NLCSD Fellows for up to four years of full-time on campus study while they earn their doctorates at one of the 25 Consortium Universities. Fellowships are available to US citizens/permanent residents who must first be accepted into a doctoral program. The cohort will begin Fall 2010. The consortium members, and the doctoral programs they offer, are listed at http://www.salus.edu/nlcsd/index.html Applications must be postmarked by March 26, 2010. Applications postmarked after that date will not be considered. Notifications will be made to applicants by May 3, 2010. Please share this information with potential candidates, or consider applying yourself! The NFB is deeply concerned that we have strong leaders in order to continue our work to improve the education of blind children and the programs to train teachers to work with those children. We encourage those interested in providing leadership in this area to consider applying. Carol Castellano, President National Organization of Parents of Blind Children 973-377-0976 carol_castellano at verizon.net www.nfb.org/nopbc _______________________________________________ From kerrik2006 at gmail.com Thu Mar 4 04:08:29 2010 From: kerrik2006 at gmail.com (Kerri Kosten) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 23:08:29 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] FW: Serotek declares war In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi: Just thought I'd put my opinions. I like this a lot! I totally agree with everything Mike says in this blog. With what Apple is doing, there is no reason for such a high price for screenreaders such as Jaws. I will admit, right now I do not currently use System Access but am going to switch soon. I use the Iphone and love it...no more Mobile Speak for me! I will be getting the Ipad soon and may just use it instead of my windows netbook depending on how it works for me and how much I like it. I have a Pacmate and ocationally use the braille display for reading but take notes with my netbook. I barely use the Pacmate anymore. I think the big thing here is the braille displays. With so much technology out there today, there is no reason why braille displays should not be cheaper, even if that means changing their functionality a little to make the cost of production go down. I think blind people should be taking more of a stand to get these companies to lower their prices and quit this ridiculousness. I hope very strongly for a day when Windows is like the Mac where there is a built-in fully functional screenreader so people can use Windows right out of the box just like Voiceover for the Mac and Iphone. Just my two cents!! Kerri On 3/2/10, Joe Orozco wrote: > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: fred olver > Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 07:11:28 -0600 > Subject: [Chapter-presidents] Serotek declares war > To: nfbmi-talk at nfbnet.org, NFB of Missouri Mailing List > , NFB Chapter Presidents discussion list > > > Subject: [leadership] Serotek declares war on the traditional adaptive > technology industry and their blind ghetto products > This is no warm fuzzy of a read, but something well worth the read and > in my opinion long over due. Kudos to SeroTekCited from > http://blog.serotek.com/ > The Serotek Ultimatum > Serotek declares war on the traditional adaptive technology industry > and their blind ghetto products. With this announcement we are > sending out a > call to arms to every blind person and every advocate for the blind to rise > up and throw off the tyranny that has shaped our lives for the past two > decades. It is a tyranny of good intentions - or at least what began as > good > intentions. But as the proverb says, "the road to hell is paved with good > intentions." And for the past two decades the technologies originally > conceived to give us freedom have been our shackles. They have kept us tied > down to underperforming, obscenely expensive approaches that only a small > percentage of blind people can afford or master. They have shackled us to > government largess and the charity of strangers to pay for what few among > us > could afford on our own. And we have been sheep, lead down the path, > bleating from time to time, but without the vision or the resources to > stand > up and demand our due. > That time is past. > We stand today on the very edge of universal accessibility. Mainstream > products like the iPod, iPhone, and newly announced iPad are fully > accessible out of the box. And they bring with them a wealth of highly > desirable accessibility applications. The cost to blind people is exactly > the same as the cost to sighted people. It's the same equipment, the same > software, the same functionality, and fully accessible. > What Apple has done, others are doing as well. The adaptive technology > vendor who creates hardware and software that is intended only for blind > folks, and then only if they are subsidized by the government, is a > dinosaur. The asteroid has hit the earth, the dust cloud is ubiquitous, the > dinosaur's days are numbered. > But dinosaurs are huge, and their extinction does not happen overnight.. > Even as they die, they spawn others like them (take the Intel Reader for > example). Thank you, no. Any blind person can have full accessibility to > any > type of information without the high-cost, blind-ghetto gear. They can get > it in the same products their sighted friends are buying. But let's face > it; > if we keep buying that crap and keep besieging our visual resource center > to > buy that crap for us, the dinosaurs of the industry are going to keep > making > it. Their profit margins are very good indeed. And many have invested > exactly none of that profit in creating the next generation of access > technology, choosing instead to perpetuate the status quo. For instance, > refreshable braille technology, arguably the most expensive > blindness-specific(and to many very necessary) product has not changed > significantly in 30 years. Yet, the cost remains out of reach for most > blind > people. Where's the innovation there? Why have companies not invested in > cheaper, faster, smaller, and more efficient ways to make refreshable > braille? Surely the piezoelectric braille cell is not the only way? And > what > about PC-based OCR software? It's still around a thousand dollars per > license, yet core functionality hasn't changed much; sure, we get all sorts > of features not at all related to reading, along with incremental accuracy > improvements, but why are these prices not dropping either, especially when > you consider that comparable off-the-shelf solutions like Abby Finereader > can be had for as low as $79? ? And let's not forget the screen reader > itself, the core technology that all of us need to access our computers in > the first place. Do we see improvements, or just an attempt to mimic > innovation with the addition of features which have nothing to do with the > actual reading of the screen, while maintaining the same ridiculous price > point. > > This maintaining of the status quo will, inevitably, face an enormous > crash, > worse than the transition from DOS to Windows based accessibility. You can > expect a technology crash that will put users of the most expensive > accessibility gear out of business. > Why? I won't bore you with all the technical details, but the basic story > is > that some of these products have been kept current with patches and fixes > and partial rewrites and other tricks we IT types use when we haven't got > the budget to do it right, but we need to make the product work with the > latest operating system. That process of patching and fixing creates an > enormous legacy barrier that makes it impossible to rewrite without > abandoning all who came before. But you can only keep a kluge working for > so > long before it will crumble under its own weight. That, my friends, is > exactly where some of the leading adaptive technology vendors find > themselves today. > There are exceptions. Serotek is an exception because we have completely > recreated our product base every three years. GW Micro is an exception > because they built their product in a highly modular fashion and can update > modules without destroying the whole. KNFB is an exception because they > take > advantage of off-the-shelf technologies, which translate ultimately into > price drops and increased functionality. > > But even we who have done it right are on a path to obsolescence. The > fundamental need for accessibility software is rapidly beginning to vanish. > The universal accessibility principles we see Apple, Microsoft, Olympus, > and > others putting in place are going to eliminate the need for these specialty > products in a matter of just a very few years. > Stop and think. Why do you need accessibility tools? To read text? E-book > devices are eliminating that need. None of them are perfect yet, but we are > really only in the first generation. By Gen2 they will all be fully > accessible. To find your way? GPS on your iPhone or your Android based > phone > will do that for you. To take notes? Easy on any laptop, netbook, or iPad. > Heck, you can record it live and play it back at your convenience. Just > what > isn't accessible? You can play your music, catch a described video, scan a > spreadsheet, take in a PowerPoint presentation - all using conventional, > off-the-shelf systems and/or software that is free of charge. > There are still some legacy situations where you need to create an > accessibility path. Some corporations still have internal applications that > do not lend themselves to modern devices. There will certainly be > situations > where a specialized product will better solve an accessibility problem than > a mainstream one, especially in the short term. We don't advocate throwing > the baby out with the bathwater, but we do advocate that we begin to hasten > the inevitable change by using accessible mainstream solutions wherever > possible. Even now, the leading edge companies are reinventing their > internal systems with accessibility as a design criteria, so the situations > that require specialized products will certainly become fewer as time goes > on. > If our current Assistive technology guard's reign is coming to an end, why > the war? Why not just let it die its own, natural, inevitable death? > Because > nothing dies more slowly than an obsolete technology. Punch cards hung on > for twenty or thirty years after they were completely obsolete. The same is > true for magnetic tape. Old stuff represents a comparatively large > investment, and people hate to throw away something they paid a lot of > money > for even if it's currently worthless. But that legacy stuff obscures the > capabilities of the present. It gets used in situations where other > solutions are cheaper and more practical. The legacy stuff clogs the > vocational rehab channel, eating up the lion's share of the resources but > serving a tiny portion of the need. It gets grandfathered into contracts. > It > gets specified when there is no earthly reason why the application requires > it. The legacy stuff slows down the dawning of a fully accessible world. > It hurts you and it hurts me. > To be sure, I make my living creating and selling products that make our > world accessible. But first and foremost, I am a blind person. I am one of > you. And every day I face the same accessibility challenges you face. I > have > dedicated my life and my company to making the world more accessible for > all > of us, but I can't do it alone. This is a challenge that every blind person > needs to take up. We need to shout from the rooftops: "Enough!" > We need to commit ourselves in each and every situation to finding and > using > the most accessible off the shelf tool and/or the least-cost, highest > function accessibility tool available. With our dollars and our commitment > to making known that our needs and the needs of sighted people are 99% the > same, we can reshape this marketplace. We can drive the dinosaurs into the > tar pits and nurture those cute fuzzy little varmints that are ancestors to > the next generation. We can be part of the solution rather than part of the > problem. > And all it takes is getting the best possible solution for your > specific need. Once you have found the solution to fill that need, let > the company know you appreciate their work towards better > accessibility. Let your friends (sighted and blind) know about these > accessibility features; they probably don't know that such features > exist. Make your needs known to the vocational rehab people you are > working with, and don't allow them to make recommendations for a > specific technology for no other reason than that it's been in the > contract for years. Make sure your schools and your workplace > understand the need to push technology in to the accessible space. > Show them the low-cost alternatives. In this economy some, the > intelligent ones, will get it and the tide will begin to turn. And > then in short order the tsunami of good sense will wash away the old, > and give us the space to build a more accessible world for all of us. > Let the demand ring out loud and clear and the market will follow.If > this message rings true to you, don't just shake your fist in > agreement and leave it at that. let your voice be heard! Arm yourself > with the vision of a future where there are no social, conceptual, or > economic barriers to accessibility, and let your words and your > actions demonstrate that you will not rest until that vision is > realized. Take out your wallet and let your consumer power shine! You > do mater as a market people! You have kept this company alive with > your money for 8 years this month! I believe that if we all get > together and do our part, we will finally say "NO more!" same old same > old! Join the revolution! Together we can change the world!Posted by > Mike Calvo at 2:15 PM > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature > database 4907 (20100302) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature > database 4909 (20100302) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kerrik2006%40gmail.com > From corbbo at gmail.com Thu Mar 4 04:11:53 2010 From: corbbo at gmail.com (Corbb O'Connor) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 23:11:53 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Different Legislation for Visually Impaired/Blind In-Reply-To: References: <54d8179e1003022007y11b93591y509d2dc2a08e7d2c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: See the full legislative agenda for 2010 at the web site for the 2010 Washington Seminar: http://www.nfb.org/nfb/Washington_Seminar.asp You can download the agenda in Word format from that page. Corbb On Mar 2, 2010, at 11:28 PM, Sarah Alawami wrote: I believe one of the bills is the quiet cars bill but I can't remember. maybe look at www.nfb.org and see what you can see? Good luck on your trip. S On Mar 2, 2010, at 8:07 PM, Justin Young wrote: > Hello to all! > I am going to Washington D.C. for a conference with my school's > Student Government Association. I was wondering if any had a list of > the various pieces of legislation currently going through either > House, Senate or both? > I appreciate all help. I ask because my plan is to get my Congressman > to become a co-Sponsor of some if not all legislation. > thanks, > Justin Young > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info > for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/corbbo%40gmail.com From sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca Thu Mar 4 04:18:38 2010 From: sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca (Sarah Jevnikar) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 23:18:38 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! In-Reply-To: References: <0KYL00KJF2NEPRL4@vms173017.mailsrvcs.net> <018EB229338941F1AC23FE43C68AA283@PAULLAPTOP> <4A7E12D672824E10839CFA6CEDEB59F6@windows4c0ed96> Message-ID: <000601cabb51$c5686a20$50393e60$@jevnikar@utoronto.ca> Hi Frananda, Do you use Braille for all these languages? sarah -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Franandah Damstra Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 9:58 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! Hi, Claudia Welcome to the group. I am one of the youngest members of the NABS list. I am a junior in high school. I am currently studding Japanese and Korean to become a translator and interpreter. I am already fluent in Spanish and English. I have a rare syndrome called De Morsier's Syndrome. I was born with poor vision, but it has gotten worse over the years. I can read a little bit out of my right eye, but I mostly use JAWS and transcribers. If you need any information from a younger persons prospective, feel free to contact me at any time! ~Franandah On 3/2/10, V Nork wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Maryann Migliorelli" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 12:39 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Hi Claudia, I'm glad to see you took my advice and joined us. I'm sure >> you >> can add a lot to this list, and your willingness to learn from fellow >> students will serve you well. Please feel welcomed and know that you are >> among friends. >> Maryann Migliorelli >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ginisd%40sbcglobal.n et >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/fantasyfanatic01%40g mail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto ronto.ca From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Thu Mar 4 04:27:56 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2010 23:27:56 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] o.t: Message-ID: <20100304042756.2643.83526@web3.serotek.com> KL, I assume you refer to Mike Calvo's message that was forwarded to this list. If so, what petition are you referring to? Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > I feel this petition could have very easily stood on its own without the > vitriolic verbiage that accompanied it. The one sure way to immediately turn > me off of a cause is by attempting to either guilt me or bully me, and the > language in this message does some measure of both. > KL > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From info at michaelhingson.com Thu Mar 4 04:58:08 2010 From: info at michaelhingson.com (Michael Hingson) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2010 22:58:08 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] KnfbReader Mobile seminar change Message-ID: KnfbReader Mobile seminar change All, First let me remind you that we will be holding a teleconference tomorrow evening to discuss KnfbReader hints and trick as well as any other discussions you all wish to bring up. We shall begin promptly at 9PM Eastern time, 6PM Pacific time.. Due to a limitation of Skype we need to make a slight change to our plans for tomorrow's seminar. Skype will only allow five individuals to participate in any given conference group. This means that I can only bring a few persons into the group. We have several options 1. If others wish to initiate conferences which will include their friends and our conference line, (see the dial-in instructions below), you can do so by creating your own conference groups with one of the four participants in addition to yourself being our dial-in line. That is, conference three people plus you plus dialing into our phone line and suddenly you have four people conference in using Skype. This will permit more to come on board with Skype. That is, several of you can create Skype conference calls which will in turn conference into our system. 2. In order to accommodate all online participants we will now be opening a PC conference room. Here are the instructions for entering the PC conference room: . Go to the meeting Room: http://74.208.96.53/masteradmin/room.asp?id=rsb18eeae3cfd2. Meeting Password: no password required To join this meeting: 1. If you have not yet installed the Conferencing Plugin,install the small piece of software you will be asked to install before actually entering the conference room itself. 2. Click "Enter the conference room" to join the conference and enter your name when asked. Again, do not enter a password. If you wish to participate via phone Here are the dial-in instructions again for the call. The call -- in number is (218) 339-3600. The access code is 329906#. Simply call in no later than times given above to be a part of this call. The program is free. Only any relevant long distance charges will apply. It appears as if we will have quite a good group. I look forward to the discussions. We also will have several representatives from KnfbTechnologies with us to help answer your questions. I look forward to seeing you all tomorrow. If you have any questions please contact me at info at michaelhingson.com or by calling me at (415) 827-4084. See you tomorrow. Best, Michael Hingson The Michael Hingson Group, INC. "Speaking with Vision" Michael Hingson, President (415) 827-4084 info at michaelhingson.com www.michaelhingson.com for info on the new KNFB Reader Mobile, visit: http://knfbreader.michaelhingson.com From freespirit328 at gmail.com Thu Mar 4 05:54:14 2010 From: freespirit328 at gmail.com (Jennifer Aberdeen) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 00:54:14 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Different Legislation for Visually Impaired/Blind References: <54d8179e1003022007y11b93591y509d2dc2a08e7d2c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9D4E397B765E4F289C3E53EE5E15A926@Gateway> Hi, There's the Quiet Cars Act, The Technology Bill Of Rights Bill and one other one having to do with Social Security. Jen Add me on Facebook freespirit328 at gmail.com From ginisd at sbcglobal.net Thu Mar 4 14:03:31 2010 From: ginisd at sbcglobal.net (V Nork) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 06:03:31 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Will I receive this message, a test References: <6B07F88F-949A-4963-81BA-265D8D24DF59@gmail.com> Message-ID: I have been on the nabs list for a year or so. The pattern for me seems to be that after some hours, a copy of an e mail posted to the list by a member and viewable on the web archive turns up in my Outlook Express inbox. It can take from four hours to six ours, in my case. I was concerned since for a couple of days this pattern was different,, and it looked as if I was not going to receive any messages anymore, since I was behind about fifty e mails. Hence all the tests I sent as I tried to figure it out. Now all seems back to normal, I have all the messages currently in my OE that are viewable online in the web archives. what a relief, Ginnie ----- Original Message ----- From: "Corbb O'Connor" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 7:05 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Will I receive this message, a test > No, but we did... Folks, if you don't see your message post to the list, > check the web archive. Some e-mail programs don't send you a copy back > once it's on the list. Oh, and if there was any kind of error -- you'd > get a reply from the list headquarter system. > > On Mar 3, 2010, at 2:52 PM, V Nork wrote: > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/corbbo%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ginisd%40sbcglobal.net From fantasyfanatic01 at gmail.com Thu Mar 4 14:23:32 2010 From: fantasyfanatic01 at gmail.com (Franandah Damstra) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 06:23:32 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! In-Reply-To: <6387788217617845582@unknownmsgid> References: <0KYL00KJF2NEPRL4@vms173017.mailsrvcs.net> <018EB229338941F1AC23FE43C68AA283@PAULLAPTOP> <4A7E12D672824E10839CFA6CEDEB59F6@windows4c0ed96> <6387788217617845582@unknownmsgid> Message-ID: For English and Spanish I've used braille. I am learning Japanese braille, but most of the time I use use romanji wich uses the American alphebet. I've yet to find a good place to get good Japanese and Korean braille books. On 3/3/10, Sarah Jevnikar wrote: > Hi Frananda, > Do you use Braille for all these languages? > sarah > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of Franandah Damstra > Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 9:58 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Hi, Claudia > > Welcome to the group. I am one of the youngest members of the NABS > list. I am a junior in high school. I am currently studding Japanese > and Korean to become a translator and interpreter. I am already fluent > in Spanish and English. I have a rare syndrome called De Morsier's > Syndrome. I was born with poor vision, but it has gotten worse over > the years. I can read a little bit out of my right eye, but I mostly > use JAWS and transcribers. If you need any information from a younger > persons prospective, feel free to contact me at any time! > > ~Franandah > > On 3/2/10, V Nork wrote: >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Maryann Migliorelli" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 12:39 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> >>> Hi Claudia, I'm glad to see you took my advice and joined us. I'm sure >>> you >>> can add a lot to this list, and your willingness to learn from fellow >>> students will serve you well. Please feel welcomed and know that you are >>> among friends. >>> Maryann Migliorelli >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ginisd%40sbcglobal.n > et >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/fantasyfanatic01%40g > mail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto > ronto.ca > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/fantasyfanatic01%40gmail.com > From dandrews at visi.com Thu Mar 4 14:46:22 2010 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2010 08:46:22 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Will I receive this message, a test In-Reply-To: <6B07F88F-949A-4963-81BA-265D8D24DF59@gmail.com> References: <6B07F88F-949A-4963-81BA-265D8D24DF59@gmail.com> Message-ID: There were problems with the connection to the server for most of this week. I got it fixed late yesterday, and the system is now catching up. Hopefully things will be getting back to normal (it is hard typing with your fingers crossed!!!). Dave At 09:05 PM 3/3/2010, you wrote: >No, but we did... Folks, if you don't see your message post to the >list, check the web archive. Some e-mail programs don't send you a >copy back once it's on the list. Oh, and if there was any kind of >error -- you'd get a reply from the list headquarter system. > >On Mar 3, 2010, at 2:52 PM, V Nork wrote: > > >_______________________________________________ >nabs-l mailing list >nabs-l at nfbnet.org >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >nabs-l: >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/corbbo%40gmail.com > > >_______________________________________________ >nabs-l mailing list >nabs-l at nfbnet.org >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dandrews%40visi.com > > >__________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus >signature database 4913 (20100303) __________ > >The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. > >http://www.eset.com > > From dandrews at visi.com Thu Mar 4 14:52:25 2010 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2010 08:52:25 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] FW: Serotek declares war In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Well, Mike Calvo makes some good points, and there is some truth in what he says -- he also simplifies most things and glosses over a lot. System Access is a good product, for what it is -- but in many employment situations it just can't compete with JAWS or Window-Eyes. They are more sophisticated products, and have a variety of tools to customize them etc. You have to pay some how for the development of this stuff. Freedom Scientific dropped the price of one of its refreshable Braille displays by approximately $1500 yesterday. We aren't going to see built in access to lots of products, they are to inexpensive, designed and made overseas, have short life cycles etc. Maybe for the big things, but not all the little electronic stuff there is out there. Without legislation there will be islands of accessibility and oceans of inaccessibility. Dave At 10:08 PM 3/3/2010, you wrote: >Hi: > >Just thought I'd put my opinions. > >I like this a lot! >I totally agree with everything Mike says in this blog. >With what Apple is doing, there is no reason for such a high price for >screenreaders such as Jaws. >I will admit, right now I do not currently use System Access but am >going to switch soon. >I use the Iphone and love it...no more Mobile Speak for me! >I will be getting the Ipad soon and may just use it instead of my >windows netbook depending on how it works for me and how much I like >it. >I have a Pacmate and ocationally use the braille display for reading >but take notes with my netbook. I barely use the Pacmate anymore. > >I think the big thing here is the braille displays. With so much >technology out there today, there is no reason why braille displays >should not be cheaper, even if that means changing their functionality >a little to make the cost of production go down. > >I think blind people should be taking more of a stand to get these >companies to lower their prices and quit this ridiculousness. >I hope very strongly for a day when Windows is like the Mac where >there is a built-in fully functional screenreader so people can use >Windows right out of the box just like Voiceover for the Mac and >iPhone. > >Just my two cents!! > >Kerri From kevin at kevinlarose.net Thu Mar 4 15:13:14 2010 From: kevin at kevinlarose.net (Kevin LaRose) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 07:13:14 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] o.t: References: <20100304042756.2643.83526@web3.serotek.com> Message-ID: I was actually referring to the posting regarding the Wayfinder petition, and the verbiage contained therein. My message didn't show up tob the list until over twelve hours after I wrote it. KL From dandrews at visi.com Thu Mar 4 16:08:51 2010 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2010 10:08:51 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Will I receive this message, a test In-Reply-To: References: <6B07F88F-949A-4963-81BA-265D8D24DF59@gmail.com> Message-ID: We had problems with the connection to the server, which got behind because it couldn't get the mail out. the outbound queue was up to 30,000 e-mails -- it is now down to about 1000 which is pretty normal. I am sorry for any inconvenience, but things do break. Dave At 08:03 AM 3/4/2010, you wrote: >I have been on the nabs list for a year or so. The pattern for me >seems to be that after some hours, a copy of an e mail posted to >the list by a member and viewable on the web archive turns up in >my Outlook Express inbox. It can take from four hours to six ours, >in my case. I was concerned since for a couple of days this pattern >was different,, and it looked as if I was not going to receive any >messages anymore, since I was behind about fifty e mails. Hence >all the tests I sent as I tried to figure it out. Now all seems >back to normal, I have all the messages currently in my OE that >are viewable online in the web archives. what a relief, Ginnie >----- Original Message ----- From: "Corbb O'Connor" >To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 7:05 PM >Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Will I receive this message, a test > > >>No, but we did... Folks, if you don't see your message post to >>the list, check the web archive. Some e-mail programs don't send >>you a copy back once it's on the list. Oh, and if there was any >>kind of error -- you'd get a reply from the list headquarter system. >> >>On Mar 3, 2010, at 2:52 PM, V Nork wrote: From alberto.2500 at gmail.com Thu Mar 4 16:14:46 2010 From: alberto.2500 at gmail.com (Alberto Arreola) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 09:14:46 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! In-Reply-To: <0KYM00CGXX6CSI4C@vms173011.mailsrvcs.net> References: <0KYM00CGXX6CSI4C@vms173011.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <4b8fdc77.9513f30a.78bc.30e8@mx.google.com> I have a question for you what do they do in the service right now? -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Claudia Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 8:18 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! FYI - There are currently 2 blind service members in the Army -- of course, this happened to them while on active duty. One is Captain Ivan Castro, and the other is Lt. Boggart. I thought that was neat of the military to allow for these individuals to continue on active duty... Claudia B. Perry " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of man can perceive he can achieve." -- Napoleon Hill -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of RJ Sandefur Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 9:20 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! I've been blind my whole life, and have told people, if I could see, I'd be in the United States Milatary! Thank you for serving your country! RJ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Claudia" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 6:41 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > Hi RJ, > > I am not, but I can only see light. It is very poor. I have light > perception in my right eye. My left eye is completely grayed out - no > light perception there. Oh and I did forget to mention, I am a Air > Force veteran. I was in the military from 1995 to 2000, I began having > my vision difficulties while on active duty. I have a rare disorder > named Devic's disease that rendered me blind and paralyzed from the > chest down. Luckily, I have regained my strength back to walk again... > > Regards, > > > Regards, > > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the > mind of man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On > Behalf Of RJ Sandefur > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:24 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > Cool!, so are you conpletely blind? > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 10:21 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Wow! Awesome, I am studying for my doctorate in Organizational >> psychology. > >> I >> should complete it in 2014...long process, but I am excited about it! >> >> Regards, >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >> mind of man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf Of RJ Sandefur >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 5:01 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> Hi, I'm RJ Sandefur. I'm studying for my doctorate of theology. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Claudia" >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 2:57 PM >> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> >>> Hello, >>> >>> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently >>> at University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. >>> Metropolitan area, and am very excited to be a member of this group. >>> Perhaps I can learn new techniques for school as a blind individual. >>> I am also here to give any ideas should you need it. >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Claudia B. Perry >>> >>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >>> mind of man can perceive he can achieve." >>> >>> -- Napoleon Hill >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksan > defur% >> 40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry% > 40veri >> zon.net >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksan > defur% > 40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry% > 40veri > zon.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksan > defur%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri zon.net _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail .com From serenacucco at verizon.net Thu Mar 4 18:40:22 2010 From: serenacucco at verizon.net (Serena) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 13:40:22 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up with mobile facebook this time? Message-ID: <001601cabbca$266cc190$0301a8c0@Serene> Hey guys, Once again, when I go to m.facebook.com, Jaws tells me that the computer can't download a file! I remember the last time, I had to install Internet Explorer 8, but, to my knowledge, there is no I E 9 yet. Does anybody know what's going on with the mobile facebook site? Thanks, Serena From jty727 at gmail.com Thu Mar 4 21:10:06 2010 From: jty727 at gmail.com (Justin Young) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 16:10:06 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Different Legislation for Visually Impaired/Blind In-Reply-To: <9D4E397B765E4F289C3E53EE5E15A926@Gateway> References: <54d8179e1003022007y11b93591y509d2dc2a08e7d2c@mail.gmail.com> <9D4E397B765E4F289C3E53EE5E15A926@Gateway> Message-ID: <54d8179e1003041310o328ef62bo281c417a6463c87b@mail.gmail.com> I would like to thank you all for your help. On 3/4/10, Jennifer Aberdeen wrote: > Hi, > > There's the Quiet Cars Act, The Technology Bill Of Rights Bill and one other > one having to do with Social Security. > > Jen > Add me on Facebook > freespirit328 at gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jty727%40gmail.com > From ginisd at sbcglobal.net Fri Mar 5 01:48:59 2010 From: ginisd at sbcglobal.net (V Nork) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 17:48:59 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Will I receive this message, a test References: <6B07F88F-949A-4963-81BA-265D8D24DF59@gmail.com> Message-ID: <95CC0942C97F4FEF8E9040ED902B8E26@windows4c0ed96> thanks, I just thought it was something mysteriously wrong with my computer ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Andrews" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2010 8:08 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Will I receive this message, a test > We had problems with the connection to the server, which got behind > because it couldn't get the mail out. the outbound queue was up to 30,000 > e-mails -- it is now down to about 1000 which is pretty normal. I am > sorry for any inconvenience, but things do break. > > Dave > > At 08:03 AM 3/4/2010, you wrote: >>I have been on the nabs list for a year or so. The pattern for me seems >>to be that after some hours, a copy of an e mail posted to the list by a >>member and viewable on the web archive turns up in my Outlook Express >>inbox. It can take from four hours to six ours, in my case. I was >>concerned since for a couple of days this pattern was different,, and it >>looked as if I was not going to receive any messages anymore, since I was >>behind about fifty e mails. Hence all the tests I sent as I tried to >>figure it out. Now all seems back to normal, I have all the messages >>currently in my OE that are viewable online in the web archives. what a >>relief, Ginnie >>----- Original Message ----- From: "Corbb O'Connor" >>To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >>Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 7:05 PM >>Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Will I receive this message, a test >> >> >>>No, but we did... Folks, if you don't see your message post to the list, >>>check the web archive. Some e-mail programs don't send you a copy back >>>once it's on the list. Oh, and if there was any kind of error -- you'd >>>get a reply from the list headquarter system. >>> >>>On Mar 3, 2010, at 2:52 PM, V Nork wrote: > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ginisd%40sbcglobal.net From sparklylicious at suddenlink.net Fri Mar 5 01:49:53 2010 From: sparklylicious at suddenlink.net (hannah) Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2010 17:49:53 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up with mobilefacebook this time? Message-ID: <20100305014916.LMMT29667.omta01.suddenlink.net@BrailleNote> I know I am experienceing the same problem!!!! Any help will be greatly appreciated. I'm assuming that they are just updating their site... Hannah > ----- Original Message ----- >From: "Serena" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 13:40:22 -0500 >Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up with mobilefacebook this time? >Hey guys, >Once again, when I go to m.facebook.com, Jaws tells me that the computer can't download a file! I remember the last time, I had to install Internet Explorer 8, but, to my knowledge, there is no I E 9 yet. Does anybody know what's going on with the mobile facebook site? >Thanks, >Serena >_______________________________________________ >nabs-l mailing list >nabs-l at nfbnet.org >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sparklyli cious%40suddenlink.net From anjelinac26 at gmail.com Fri Mar 5 02:12:08 2010 From: anjelinac26 at gmail.com (Anjelina) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 21:12:08 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up with mobilefacebook this time? References: <001601cabbca$266cc190$0301a8c0@Serene> Message-ID: <9E9532101E8A4D259352FEAE86C3D6BE@D9P3ZND1> Not sure why the mobile site is not working with IE, but it's working find with Firefox. Anjelina ----- Original Message ----- From: "Serena" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2010 1:40 PM Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up with mobilefacebook this time? > Hey guys, > > Once again, when I go to m.facebook.com, Jaws tells me that the computer > can't download a file! I remember the last time, I had to install > Internet Explorer 8, but, to my knowledge, there is no I E 9 yet. Does > anybody know what's going on with the mobile facebook site? > > Thanks, > Serena > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/anjelinac26%40gmail.com > From thebluesisloose at gmail.com Fri Mar 5 02:57:22 2010 From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com (Beth) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 21:57:22 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up with mobile facebook this time? In-Reply-To: <001601cabbca$266cc190$0301a8c0@Serene> References: <001601cabbca$266cc190$0301a8c0@Serene> Message-ID: <4383d01d1003041857k5ce88dcfg9258521d39bc5790@mail.gmail.com> I use m.facebook.com all the time, and I have no idea what's up. I think Mark Zuckerberg and his colleagues just have too much time on their hands. Beth On 3/4/10, Serena wrote: > Hey guys, > > Once again, when I go to m.facebook.com, Jaws tells me that the computer > can't download a file! I remember the last time, I had to install Internet > Explorer 8, but, to my knowledge, there is no I E 9 yet. Does anybody know > what's going on with the mobile facebook site? > > Thanks, > Serena > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com > From bunnykatie6 at gmail.com Fri Mar 5 04:30:19 2010 From: bunnykatie6 at gmail.com (Katie Wang) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 23:30:19 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up with mobilefacebook this time? In-Reply-To: <20100305014916.LMMT29667.omta01.suddenlink.net@BrailleNote> References: <20100305014916.LMMT29667.omta01.suddenlink.net@BrailleNote> Message-ID: <5096b4731003042030r5e4263d9off934ea47aea13fd@mail.gmail.com> I'm having the same problem and I'm running IE 8. I assume that the site is just broken and they will fix it soon, but just in case I already emailed their accessibility team and emphasize how important it is for visually impaired users to have access to their mobile site using our computers. I hope they will get the problem resolved soon! Katie On 3/4/10, hannah wrote: > I know I am experienceing the same problem!!!! Any help will be > greatly appreciated. I'm assuming that they are just updating > their site... > Hannah > >> ----- Original Message ----- >>From: "Serena" >To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > >Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 13:40:22 -0500 >>Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up with > mobilefacebook this time? > >>Hey guys, > >>Once again, when I go to m.facebook.com, Jaws tells me that the > computer can't download a file! I remember the last time, I had > to install Internet Explorer 8, but, to my knowledge, there is no > I E 9 yet. Does anybody know what's going on with the mobile > facebook site? > >>Thanks, >>Serena >>_______________________________________________ >>nabs-l mailing list >>nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info > for nabs-l: >>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sparklyli > cious%40suddenlink.net > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmail.com > From lawnmower84 at hotmail.com Fri Mar 5 07:12:37 2010 From: lawnmower84 at hotmail.com (Jacob Struiksma) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 23:12:37 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up withmobilefacebook this time? In-Reply-To: <9E9532101E8A4D259352FEAE86C3D6BE@D9P3ZND1> References: <001601cabbca$266cc190$0301a8c0@Serene> <9E9532101E8A4D259352FEAE86C3D6BE@D9P3ZND1> Message-ID: I use face book with fire fox all the time -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anjelina Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2010 6:12 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up withmobilefacebook this time? Not sure why the mobile site is not working with IE, but it's working find with Firefox. Anjelina ----- Original Message ----- From: "Serena" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2010 1:40 PM Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up with mobilefacebook this time? > Hey guys, > > Once again, when I go to m.facebook.com, Jaws tells me that the > computer can't download a file! I remember the last time, I had to > install Internet Explorer 8, but, to my knowledge, there is no I E 9 > yet. Does anybody know what's going on with the mobile facebook site? > > Thanks, > Serena > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/anjelinac26%40 > gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lawnmower84%40hotmai l.com No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2722 - Release Date: 03/04/10 11:34:00 From raniaismail04 at gmail.com Fri Mar 5 15:30:51 2010 From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania ) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2010 07:30:51 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up withmobilefacebook this time? In-Reply-To: <20100305014916.LMMT29667.omta01.suddenlink.net@BrailleNote> Message-ID: <4b90f98c.1ac1f10a.4f33.2166@mx.google.com> I got the same thing so I am now trying to figure out how to post on friends walls using lite.facebook.com Rania, -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of hannah Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2010 5:50 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up withmobilefacebook this time? I know I am experienceing the same problem!!!! Any help will be greatly appreciated. I'm assuming that they are just updating their site... Hannah > ----- Original Message ----- >From: "Serena" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 13:40:22 -0500 >Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up with mobilefacebook this time? >Hey guys, >Once again, when I go to m.facebook.com, Jaws tells me that the computer can't download a file! I remember the last time, I had to install Internet Explorer 8, but, to my knowledge, there is no I E 9 yet. Does anybody know what's going on with the mobile facebook site? >Thanks, >Serena >_______________________________________________ >nabs-l mailing list >nabs-l at nfbnet.org >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sparklyli cious%40suddenlink.net _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai l.com No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2722 - Release Date: 03/04/10 11:34:00 From steve.jacobson at visi.com Fri Mar 5 12:58:14 2010 From: steve.jacobson at visi.com (Steve Jacobson) Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2010 06:58:14 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up with mobilefacebook this time? In-Reply-To: <9E9532101E8A4D259352FEAE86C3D6BE@D9P3ZND1> Message-ID: I have read on other lists that there is apparently a lot going on with both their mobile and their "lite" sights. In fact, it was not even working with FireFox for a time on Wednesday. Best regards, Steve Jacobson On Thu, 4 Mar 2010 21:12:08 -0500, Anjelina wrote: >Not sure why the mobile site is not working with IE, but it's working find >with Firefox. >Anjelina >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Serena" >To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > >Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2010 1:40 PM >Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up with mobilefacebook >this time? >> Hey guys, >> >> Once again, when I go to m.facebook.com, Jaws tells me that the computer >> can't download a file! I remember the last time, I had to install >> Internet Explorer 8, but, to my knowledge, there is no I E 9 yet. Does >> anybody know what's going on with the mobile facebook site? >> >> Thanks, >> Serena >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/anjelinac26%40gmail.com >> >_______________________________________________ >nabs-l mailing list >nabs-l at nfbnet.org >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/steve.jacobson%40visi.com From djdrocks4ever at gmail.com Fri Mar 5 15:11:30 2010 From: djdrocks4ever at gmail.com (David Dunphy) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2010 10:11:30 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up with mobilefacebook this time? References: <001601cabbca$266cc190$0301a8c0@Serene> Message-ID: Unfortunately, Facebook on the mobile site has changed something so this will not work now with IE8. If you use Firefox or have it, it will work using that. Not sure who to blame here, Microsoft for being unable to be flexible to site changes with their browser or facebook. Probably Microsoft, since if it works with Firefox, it should work with the main operating system browser too. >From David __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4918 (20100305) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com From serenacucco at verizon.net Fri Mar 5 17:31:29 2010 From: serenacucco at verizon.net (Serena) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2010 12:31:29 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Fw: free pdf converter! Message-ID: <002301cabc89$b1253eb0$0301a8c0@Serene> Hey everybody, I checked this out online and it looks really great! Those of you who hate Blackboard cuz of all the inaccessible PDF files, this might be the solution for you. Yes, it's free! Serena ----- Original Message ----- From: Carol Castellano To: serenacucco at verizon.net Sent: Friday, March 05, 2010 12:15 PM Subject: pdf converter 7) Free PDF Reader/Converter (From Dean Martineau's Top Tech Tidbits for Thursday at http://www.flying-blind.com/tidbits2010.html) Nuance has released a free pdf reader which allows you to convert pdf documents to Word, .txt. .xls or RTF format online, to complete forms and all this in a smaller and, they say, more secure package than Adobe Reader. http://www.nuance.com/imaging/products/pdf-reader.asp Carol Castellano, President National Organization of Parents of Blind Children 973-377-0976 carol_castellano at verizon.net www.nfb.org/nopbc From joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com Fri Mar 5 19:14:54 2010 From: joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com (RJ Sandefur) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2010 14:14:54 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Fw: free pdf converter! References: <002301cabc89$b1253eb0$0301a8c0@Serene> Message-ID: <9B1F945806DF48C58981B2E0AD303A3B@hometwxakonvzn> The instalation doesn't work to well with Jaws! RJ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Serena" To: "New Jersey Association of Blind Students" ; "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Friday, March 05, 2010 12:31 PM Subject: [nabs-l] Fw: free pdf converter! > Hey everybody, > > I checked this out online and it looks really great! Those of you who > hate Blackboard cuz of all the inaccessible PDF files, this might be the > solution for you. Yes, it's free! > > Serena > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Carol Castellano > To: serenacucco at verizon.net > Sent: Friday, March 05, 2010 12:15 PM > Subject: pdf converter > > > > 7) Free PDF Reader/Converter > > (From Dean Martineau's Top Tech Tidbits for Thursday at > http://www.flying-blind.com/tidbits2010.html) > > Nuance has released a free pdf reader which allows you to convert pdf > documents to Word, .txt. .xls or RTF format online, to complete forms and > all this in a smaller and, they say, more secure package than Adobe > Reader. > http://www.nuance.com/imaging/products/pdf-reader.asp > > > Carol Castellano, President > National Organization of Parents of Blind Children > 973-377-0976 > carol_castellano at verizon.net > www.nfb.org/nopbc > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com From kerrik2006 at gmail.com Fri Mar 5 20:24:47 2010 From: kerrik2006 at gmail.com (Kerri Kosten) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2010 15:24:47 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up with mobilefacebook this time? In-Reply-To: References: <001601cabbca$266cc190$0301a8c0@Serene> Message-ID: Hi: I began experiencing the same thing on Wednesday. I was disappointefd but what others have said is true...if you have Firefox or another Internet browser on your computer it works fine. I am hoping somehow it will fix as I like using Facebook with Internet Explorer much better than Firefox but using Firefox or another borwser is a work-around for now. Hope things get fixed though! Kerri On 3/5/10, David Dunphy wrote: > Unfortunately, Facebook on the mobile site has changed something so this > will not work now with IE8. If you use Firefox or have it, it will work > using that. Not sure who to blame here, Microsoft for being unable to be > flexible to site changes with their browser or facebook. Probably Microsoft, > since if it works with Firefox, it should work with the main operating > system browser too. > >From David > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature > database 4918 (20100305) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kerrik2006%40gmail.com > From kolbygarrison at triad.rr.com Fri Mar 5 21:05:05 2010 From: kolbygarrison at triad.rr.com (Kolby Garrison) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2010 16:05:05 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up with mobilefacebook this time? In-Reply-To: References: <001601cabbca$266cc190$0301a8c0@Serene> Message-ID: <014201cabca7$889f1dd0$99dd5970$@rr.com> I am experiencing the same thing whenever I try navigating to the mobile facebook site with internet explorer 8.0. The site opens without a hitch using Mozilla firefox 3.6 though. I hope facebook corrects the issue. Kolby From fantasyfanatic01 at gmail.com Fri Mar 5 21:30:01 2010 From: fantasyfanatic01 at gmail.com (Franandah Damstra) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2010 16:30:01 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! In-Reply-To: <4b8fdc77.9513f30a.78bc.30e8@mx.google.com> References: <0KYM00CGXX6CSI4C@vms173011.mailsrvcs.net> <4b8fdc77.9513f30a.78bc.30e8@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Service? On 3/4/10, Alberto Arreola wrote: > I have a question for you what do they do in the service right now? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of Claudia > Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 8:18 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > FYI - There are currently 2 blind service members in the Army -- of course, > this happened to them while on active duty. One is Captain Ivan Castro, and > the other is Lt. Boggart. I thought that was neat of the military to allow > for these individuals to continue on active duty... > > > Claudia B. Perry > > " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the mind of > man can perceive he can achieve." > > -- Napoleon Hill > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of RJ Sandefur > Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 9:20 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > I've been blind my whole life, and have told people, if I could see, I'd be > in the United States Milatary! Thank you for serving your country! RJ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Claudia" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 6:41 AM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! > > >> Hi RJ, >> >> I am not, but I can only see light. It is very poor. I have light >> perception in my right eye. My left eye is completely grayed out - no >> light perception there. Oh and I did forget to mention, I am a Air >> Force veteran. I was in the military from 1995 to 2000, I began having >> my vision difficulties while on active duty. I have a rare disorder >> named Devic's disease that rendered me blind and paralyzed from the >> chest down. Luckily, I have regained my strength back to walk again... >> >> Regards, >> >> >> Regards, >> >> >> Claudia B. Perry >> >> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >> mind of man can perceive he can achieve." >> >> -- Napoleon Hill >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf Of RJ Sandefur >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:24 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> Cool!, so are you conpletely blind? >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Claudia" >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 10:21 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >> >> >>> Wow! Awesome, I am studying for my doctorate in Organizational >>> psychology. >> >>> I >>> should complete it in 2014...long process, but I am excited about it! >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Claudia B. Perry >>> >>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >>> mind of man can perceive he can achieve." >>> >>> -- Napoleon Hill >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>> Behalf Of RJ Sandefur >>> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 5:01 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >>> >>> Hi, I'm RJ Sandefur. I'm studying for my doctorate of theology. >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Claudia" >>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >>> Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 2:57 PM >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings - New Member! >>> >>> >>>> Hello, >>>> >>>> My name is Claudia Perry. I am a visually impaired student currently >>>> at University of Phoenix. I live in the Washington, D.C. >>>> Metropolitan area, and am very excited to be a member of this group. >>>> Perhaps I can learn new techniques for school as a blind individual. >>>> I am also here to give any ideas should you need it. >>>> >>>> Regards, >>>> >>>> Claudia B. Perry >>>> >>>> " There are no limitations except those we acknowledge. Anything the >>>> mind of man can perceive he can achieve." >>>> >>>> -- Napoleon Hill >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksan >> defur% >>> 40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry% >> 40veri >>> zon.net >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksan >> defur% >> 40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry% >> 40veri >> zon.net >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksan >> defur%40gmail.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry%40veri > zon.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/fantasyfanatic01%40gmail.com > From serenacucco at verizon.net Sat Mar 6 00:18:45 2010 From: serenacucco at verizon.net (Serena) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2010 19:18:45 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up withmobilefacebook this time? References: <001601cabbca$266cc190$0301a8c0@Serene> Message-ID: <000f01cabcc2$9603f700$0301a8c0@Serene> Hey Dave, I just installed Fire Fox and mobile facebook works great now! Serena ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Dunphy" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Friday, March 05, 2010 10:11 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up withmobilefacebook this time? > Unfortunately, Facebook on the mobile site has changed something so this > will not work now with IE8. If you use Firefox or have it, it will work > using that. Not sure who to blame here, Microsoft for being unable to be > flexible to site changes with their browser or facebook. Probably > Microsoft, since if it works with Firefox, it should work with the main > operating system browser too. >>From David > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature database 4918 (20100305) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizon.net From kerrik2006 at gmail.com Sat Mar 6 00:23:26 2010 From: kerrik2006 at gmail.com (Kerri Kosten) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2010 19:23:26 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up with mobilefacebook this time? In-Reply-To: <014201cabca7$889f1dd0$99dd5970$@rr.com> References: <001601cabbca$266cc190$0301a8c0@Serene> <014201cabca7$889f1dd0$99dd5970$@rr.com> Message-ID: Hi All: This site is not as good as the m.facebook.com one, but until it gets fixed with IE, try using light.facebook.com It isn't as good, but if you log in and click on the link "Write" you can easily post your status and it's much less cluttered and such than the regular site...like I said not as good as the mobile one, but a work-around for now...at least for me! Hope that helps! Kerri On 3/5/10, Kolby Garrison wrote: > I am experiencing the same thing whenever I try navigating to the mobile > facebook site with internet explorer 8.0. The site opens without a hitch > using Mozilla firefox 3.6 though. I hope facebook corrects the issue. > Kolby > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kerrik2006%40gmail.com > From raniaismail04 at gmail.com Sat Mar 6 05:30:36 2010 From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania ) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2010 21:30:36 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up withmobilefacebook this time? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <4b91be5d.c6c1f10a.7f0c.00ee@mx.google.com> Lite.facebook.com is what I am using for now as well. Rania, -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kerri Kosten Sent: Friday, March 05, 2010 4:23 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up withmobilefacebook this time? Hi All: This site is not as good as the m.facebook.com one, but until it gets fixed with IE, try using light.facebook.com It isn't as good, but if you log in and click on the link "Write" you can easily post your status and it's much less cluttered and such than the regular site...like I said not as good as the mobile one, but a work-around for now...at least for me! Hope that helps! Kerri On 3/5/10, Kolby Garrison wrote: > I am experiencing the same thing whenever I try navigating to the mobile > facebook site with internet explorer 8.0. The site opens without a hitch > using Mozilla firefox 3.6 though. I hope facebook corrects the issue. > Kolby > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kerrik2006%40gmail.c om > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai l.com No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2725 - Release Date: 03/05/10 11:34:00 From anjelinac26 at gmail.com Sat Mar 6 03:29:40 2010 From: anjelinac26 at gmail.com (Anjelina) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2010 22:29:40 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's upwithmobilefacebook this time? References: <4b91be5d.c6c1f10a.7f0c.00ee@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <8C02D80C019142D6973640F6C8F86EB6@D9P3ZND1> http://m.facebook.com seems to be back in regular working order. Anjelina Sent from my iPhone ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rania " To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Saturday, March 06, 2010 12:30 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's upwithmobilefacebook this time? > Lite.facebook.com is what I am using for now as well. > Rania, > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On > Behalf > Of Kerri Kosten > Sent: Friday, March 05, 2010 4:23 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up > withmobilefacebook this time? > > Hi All: > > This site is not as good as the m.facebook.com one, but until it gets > fixed with IE, try using > light.facebook.com > > It isn't as good, but if you log in and click on the link "Write" you > can easily post your status and it's much less cluttered and such than > the regular site...like I said not as good as the mobile one, but a > work-around for now...at least for me! > > Hope that helps! > Kerri > > On 3/5/10, Kolby Garrison wrote: >> I am experiencing the same thing whenever I try navigating to the mobile >> facebook site with internet explorer 8.0. The site opens without a hitch >> using Mozilla firefox 3.6 though. I hope facebook corrects the issue. >> Kolby >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kerrik2006%40gmail.c > om >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai > l.com > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2725 - Release Date: 03/05/10 > 11:34:00 > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/anjelinac26%40gmail.com > From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Sat Mar 6 04:11:21 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2010 23:11:21 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] FW: Serotek declares war Message-ID: <20100306041121.1904.46167@web2.serotek.com> That's optomistic of you dave. Seriously mate, I believe we blind are caught up in a hegemonic relationship with assistive technology companies. I think we've bought into the notion that accessibility simply costs more, especially since we're a small market and anything out of the status quo such as Apple or SEROTEK is just simply second best. To clarify, I'm not saying that you yourself are saying this stuff, but I think we all have bought into these ideas without considering if they're actually valid. I think Mike Calvo's message, and his products, are waking us up and causing us as a community to think twice about what we believe regarding our technology, and I think that's why mike's kicking up so much sand and getting so many people riled up. Those who are simply discounting his message, as far as I'm concerned, are acting from an emotional gut reaction more than logic. When Mike's blog post hit the NFB lists, the poster told us all that Mike's message was not fun to read, and he was right. I Think the discussions that some of us are starting about assistive technology are a great place to start. It's obvious that the system as it is isn't working for a lot of reasons, and it's also obvious that assistive technology companies who make specialized devices will continue to play a large part in the success of blind people. Striking that balance is the name of the game if we want a system that functions well and empowers consumers to integrate into the mainstream world wile not compromising access. The trouble is that our current system is too expensive and quite prohibitive to many unless they're willing to depend on others with deeper pockets provided that blind people have access to those deep pockets in the first place. Respectfully, Jedi PS. I don't think it's accidental that FS lowered its Braille display costs. I think that FS does have good intensions with Braille literacy in mind, but I also think they're responding to Mike's message about the costs of assistive technology, especially since there's a great deal of interpersonal competition between FS and SEROTEK. Original message: > Well, Mike Calvo makes some good points, and there is some truth in > what he says -- he also simplifies most things and glosses over a > lot. System Access is a good product, for what it is -- but in many > employment situations it just can't compete with JAWS or > Window-Eyes. They are more sophisticated products, and have a > variety of tools to customize them etc. You have to pay some how for > the development of this stuff. > Freedom Scientific dropped the price of one of its refreshable > Braille displays by approximately $1500 yesterday. > We aren't going to see built in access to lots of products, they are > to inexpensive, designed and made overseas, have short life cycles > etc. Maybe for the big things, but not all the little electronic > stuff there is out there. Without legislation there will be islands > of accessibility and oceans of inaccessibility. > Dave > At 10:08 PM 3/3/2010, you wrote: >> Hi: >> Just thought I'd put my opinions. >> I like this a lot! >> I totally agree with everything Mike says in this blog. >> With what Apple is doing, there is no reason for such a high price for >> screenreaders such as Jaws. >> I will admit, right now I do not currently use System Access but am >> going to switch soon. >> I use the Iphone and love it...no more Mobile Speak for me! >> I will be getting the Ipad soon and may just use it instead of my >> windows netbook depending on how it works for me and how much I like >> it. >> I have a Pacmate and ocationally use the braille display for reading >> but take notes with my netbook. I barely use the Pacmate anymore. >> I think the big thing here is the braille displays. With so much >> technology out there today, there is no reason why braille displays >> should not be cheaper, even if that means changing their functionality >> a little to make the cost of production go down. >> I think blind people should be taking more of a stand to get these >> companies to lower their prices and quit this ridiculousness. >> I hope very strongly for a day when Windows is like the Mac where >> there is a built-in fully functional screenreader so people can use >> Windows right out of the box just like Voiceover for the Mac and >> iPhone. >> Just my two cents!! >> Kerri > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From graduate56 at juno.com Sat Mar 6 05:06:34 2010 From: graduate56 at juno.com (Melissa Green) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2010 22:06:34 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's upwithmobilefacebook this time? References: <001601cabbca$266cc190$0301a8c0@Serene> <000f01cabcc2$9603f700$0301a8c0@Serene> Message-ID: Mobile facebook is now working again with IE now. Have a blessed day. Warmly, Melissa Green "At the center of your being you have the answer; you know who you are and you know what you want." Blog: http://readergirl5674.blogspot.com Facebook: melissa green northern colorado twitter: melissa5674 msn: graduate1531 at msn.com Skype: lissa5674 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Serena" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Friday, March 05, 2010 5:18 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's upwithmobilefacebook this time? > > Hey Dave, > > I just installed Fire Fox and mobile facebook works great now! > > Serena > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "David Dunphy" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Friday, March 05, 2010 10:11 AM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up > withmobilefacebook this time? > > >> Unfortunately, Facebook on the mobile site has changed something so this >> will not work now with IE8. If you use Firefox or have it, it will work >> using that. Not sure who to blame here, Microsoft for being unable to be >> flexible to site changes with their browser or facebook. Probably >> Microsoft, since if it works with Firefox, it should work with the main >> operating system browser too. >>>From David >> >> >> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >> signature database 4918 (20100305) __________ >> >> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >> >> http://www.eset.com >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizon.net > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/graduate56%40juno.com > ____________________________________________________________ Nutrition Improve your career health. Click now to study nutrition! http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/c?cp=3y9zqunFV0MsD49pUKrjqQAAJ1BvHzEFemsEEZ0HiReBRkMJAAYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAASQwAAAAA= From sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca Sat Mar 6 07:18:09 2010 From: sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca (Sarah Jevnikar) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 02:18:09 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] alarm clocks In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <001801cabcfd$2ec34f60$8c49ee20$@jevnikar@utoronto.ca> sorry this is an old thread but I have a question. I know there are talking alarm clocks for VI people to operate independently. There are also alarm clocks with shakers to put under a pillow to shake someone who is hard of hearing/a deep sleeper awake. However, does anyone know if there is a alarm with a shaker which also talks so VI people can set it independently? This may seem counterintuitive, but it would be a huge help for me as a deep sleeper and someone who can't see the buttons to set it myself. Hopefully that made sense, and hopefully you've heard of something I haven't. Thanks, Sarah -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kevin Wassmer Sent: Thursday, December 31, 2009 7:16 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] alarm clocks Hello folks. I was wondering what alarm clocks you like. I need something that is nice and loud. This is because I am a heavy sleeper. I use my Braille Note as an Alarm Clock. However, that doesn't always work because it does crash sometimes. What would you recomend? _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto ronto.ca From sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca Sat Mar 6 07:34:17 2010 From: sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca (Sarah Jevnikar) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 02:34:17 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] On Study Groups In-Reply-To: <061EDF6B834D4AAD9C7906CE6125BDBA@windows4c0ed96> References: <061EDF6B834D4AAD9C7906CE6125BDBA@windows4c0ed96> Message-ID: <001901cabcff$6e8d8050$4ba880f0$@jevnikar@utoronto.ca> Hi Ginny, This is probably too late to be of use, but I've had a lot of experience in this area and hope it will help you. I was fortunate to be part of a study group by chance, as the tutor I had taught several of my classmates. It took some time for them to realize that I could contribute to the group as much as any of them, though. It was just a matter of persistence on my part. Then when the marks came out and I was doing better than them, they realized I didn't need to be "helped" as much as "worked with as an equally viable group member". In other classes, the students are able to send e-mails to each other through the Blackboard portal system. I wrote to my class asking if any of them were interested in joining an online study group through Skype, a program which allows people to talk to each other provided they have a microphone and an Internet connection. It's a free program. This has seemed successful thus far. I find that simply turning to the person next to me (provided they make noise so I know they're there!) and starting up a conversation is a great way to meet people to form study groups. They're in lecture too so they're taking the same classes, probably have similar interests at some level, and are also a captive audience. If they're not interested in studying in a group setting they're at least someone to ask questions of if you get lost, take notes for you if you miss class, or read printed documents to you that won't scan. Many of these things can be reciprocated by you (taking notes, recording lectures, etc.) so it's a give and take relationship. Often this leads to long-term relationships too which is great when spirits are low. I hope this helps somewhat. Sarah -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of V Nork Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010 3:37 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] On Study Groups Open question, what advice do any of you have for starting a study group in a class? I have never been a part of a study group, but I think it could really be a help in managing the work load and doing well in a class. Or would it? If any of you have been in a study group, what did you like and dislike about it? Did it benefit you? Are there strategies you used to start one in a class? Where did you meet, etcetera, Thanks for sharing your thoughts, Ginny _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto ronto.ca From raniaismail04 at gmail.com Sat Mar 6 14:33:47 2010 From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania ) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 06:33:47 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what'supwithmobilefacebook this time? In-Reply-To: <8C02D80C019142D6973640F6C8F86EB6@D9P3ZND1> Message-ID: <4b923dac.9c15f10a.3bd6.6fb0@mx.google.com> Thanks for letting us know! Rania, -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Anjelina Sent: Friday, March 05, 2010 7:30 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what'supwithmobilefacebook this time? http://m.facebook.com seems to be back in regular working order. Anjelina Sent from my iPhone ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rania " To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Saturday, March 06, 2010 12:30 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's upwithmobilefacebook this time? > Lite.facebook.com is what I am using for now as well. > Rania, > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On > Behalf > Of Kerri Kosten > Sent: Friday, March 05, 2010 4:23 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does any tech jeniouses know what's up > withmobilefacebook this time? > > Hi All: > > This site is not as good as the m.facebook.com one, but until it gets > fixed with IE, try using > light.facebook.com > > It isn't as good, but if you log in and click on the link "Write" you > can easily post your status and it's much less cluttered and such than > the regular site...like I said not as good as the mobile one, but a > work-around for now...at least for me! > > Hope that helps! > Kerri > > On 3/5/10, Kolby Garrison wrote: >> I am experiencing the same thing whenever I try navigating to the mobile >> facebook site with internet explorer 8.0. The site opens without a hitch >> using Mozilla firefox 3.6 though. I hope facebook corrects the issue. >> Kolby >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kerrik2006%40gmail.c > om >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai > l.com > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2725 - Release Date: 03/05/10 > 11:34:00 > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/anjelinac26%40gmail. com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai l.com No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2725 - Release Date: 03/05/10 11:34:00 From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Sat Mar 6 21:24:19 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 13:24:19 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Reflecting upon the March 4 day of action. Message-ID: <409c235c1003061324x60153b16q9cbb0ae8d6337d7b@mail.gmail.com> In much of the state of california, as well as other states across the nation Students, teachers and other supporters took part in a "day of action" this past thursday. This Day of action was aimed to organize and educate people to the harsh reality that state budget cuts present to all of those who believe that Education is not a privelege but a right. In California, many schools up and down the state from K-12 up through graduate schoolmade their voices heard and their numbers seen in a very major way. In the Bay area, masses of frustrated victums of the budgetcuts marched in the streets and on the freeway (arrests soon followed) to bring more attention to their causes. Armed with very creative Costumes and sighns, these peaceful demonstrators eventually made their way to San Francisco's Civic Center where a major rally much resembling a civil rights gathering of decades gone by took place. Union workers, school board members, and even a state senitor were present. there were featured; passionate student speakers from high schools and colleges as well as very thoughtful performances by many gifted students and student groups. I have to say that the energy in these rallys was really amazing- I couldn't help but to get goosebumps walking through the sea of people unified in fighiting for the same cause. I honestly hope that my fellow students found their way to their own demonstration no matter where you all are in this country. If there was a rally near you, I hope you made your voice heard, because when these cuts take place, they effect each and every student. It effects our teachers/instructors, it effects our classes, our disabled students offices, our rehabilitation services and other programs we enjoy/rely upon. I certainly plan to take up the cause and work along side my sighted peers- I have friends and family that this effects, their education, their jobs and to some extent their quality of life. I hope that you find the passion within you and organize within your student divisions, with in your communities, and within your colleges and schools. Thank you for your time. Warm regards, Darian -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From aleremita at executiveproductsinc.com Sat Mar 6 22:01:15 2010 From: aleremita at executiveproductsinc.com (Al Eremita) Date: Sat, 06 Mar 2010 16:01:15 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] FW: Executive NLS/BPH fitted case Message-ID: NEW EXECUTIVE NLS/BPH CASE!! Executive Products has designed the new EXECUTIVE NLS/BPH CASE for the NLS/BPH Digital Talking Book Player. Executive NLS/BPH Case. Executive Products has created a new soft form-fitted custom EXECUTIVE NLS/BPH CASE for the NLS/BPH digital talking book player. This case fits snuggly around your unit, and has a storage zipper compartment for your cartridges. The case has been designed to enable the user to easily utilize all keys, ports and accesses while on the unit. The unit can be carried on a comfortable shoulder strap or a hand carry strap. The unit may be used while walking, sitting or simply standing. The case is designed to allow easy access to load your cartridges, access buttons, USB port, headset jack and all other components of the reader. It comes with a large zippered pocket/flap that can accommodate up to three cartridges, and other accessories. The pocket/flap can be secured in an open position by fastening the flap under the unit. In the closed position, the pocket/flap protects the keys, covers the cartridge area, covers the power cord area in the rear and protects the overall unit. Features: •Access to all controls, Low profile. •Extremely durable with a superior design quality. •Features convenient D-ring's to attach carrying straps. •We use the best materials to create quality cases that protect digital book player. •A convenient zipper pocket for carrying cartridges and accessories. •Velcro fastens the flap while in the open and closed position. Available on GSA Schedule, contract number GS07F6046R https://www.executiveproductsinc.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=361&products_id=1841&osCsid=14ebd96fb23b48a3097aac1ba35292f3 NLS-1-Sm NLS-2-Side-s NLS-3-front-s We would like to extend a special thank you and recognize the Perkins Braille & Talking Book Library for assisting us with this project. We sincerely appreciate all their efforts. Have any questions please call us at 818-833-8822 or just e-mail us at customer_care at executiveproductsinc.com BookSense-Front-Small-open2 BookSense-Front-small-128 GW front view closed Gw-front-Open Book Sense Voice Sense Executive Products Inc. has designed and completed two new cases. The Book Sense will be ready to ship on Aug 3, 2009 and the Voice Sense is in stock ready to ship. We designed and created these cases to be functional, soft to the touch, and keep the user in mind. Both cases are made of soft black leather, protective cover to the key board cut out slots for USB ports, card slots, ear bud slots, etc. Both cases have a secured zipper storage area for ear buds, SD cards. The Voice Sense comes with rubberized eyelets that secure to the shoulder strap to reduce noise while walking. The Book Sense comes with a shoulder strap, wrist strap and a built in clip for your belt. As many of you know we have always designed and created our fitted cases with the user in mind. Our quality cases are used by many of you and always provide that touch of security for your expensive unit. An investment in your case provides you with the peace of mind that your unit will always be protected. As a dealer for EPI you are entitled to a discount to our products. We can drop ship direct to your customer, which reduces your inventory cost to zero. If you have any questions please call us direct at 866-833-1444 or e-mail me at aleremita at executiveproductsinc.com Other Products QX 400,420,440 Nokia N82 Book Port Book Courier Braille + Braille Icon BX 400,420,440 Victor Reader PlexTalk Pk Notetakers Voice Note Braille Note Braille lite SysOn Gps Cane Holders Global Sat Earth Mate BrailleNspeak Visit our website at www.ExecutiveProductsInc.com or call us Toll Free at 818-833-8822 Al Eremita Executive Products Inc. tback_yellow-1 12900 Bradley Ave. Sylmar Ca. 91342. Fax: 818-833-5798 Office: 818-833-8822 Mobile: 818-723-8444 www.ExecutiveProductsinc.com -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 47de8e4.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 2954 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... 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Name: 47de951.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 3615 bytes Desc: not available URL: From blackbyrdfly at gmail.com Sat Mar 6 22:50:01 2010 From: blackbyrdfly at gmail.com (Jamie Principato) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 17:50:01 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Accessibility issues, when readers are insufficient. Message-ID: <63af025c1003061450u4d690531kb6e6938ddc0e0dc6@mail.gmail.com> Hi all, Hope everyone is having a nice spring break, or will be soon at least. I was wondering if anyone knew of any recent (or semi-recent at least) lawsuits against universities, examination boards, school boards, etc that involve a blind student being denied access to printed course or exam material, and a human reader being deemed insufficient? I know about the suit against the BAR examiners, but I'd like to know if there have been any others that were similar? If anyone has any information, especially links to press releases or other sources of info, that would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Jamie From nabs.president at gmail.com Sun Mar 7 05:28:34 2010 From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 23:28:34 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Bulletin Additions Message-ID: <85ff10071003062128i23bbeec0o6abadc0a9dfcc563@mail.gmail.com> Hi all, Once again, if your state student division is doing anything exciting in the next month, or if you've just done something cool you'd like to share with the rest of NABS, please send me a brief paragraph to include in the next NABS bulletin. Please send to me by Monday at 5:00 EST. Thanks! Arielle -- Arielle Silverman President, National Association of Blind Students Phone: 602-502-2255 Email: nabs.president at gmail.com Website: www.nabslink.org From dandrews at visi.com Mon Mar 8 01:18:21 2010 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Sun, 07 Mar 2010 19:18:21 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: McTwit 2.7 released Message-ID: >Subject: McTwit 2.7 released > >http://EmpowermentZone.com/mtsetup.exe > >or .zip for a portable version > >Fixed the Follower and Leader commands based on updated Twitter API >requirements. Made the installer for JAWS scripts work on 64-bit Windows. > >Added support for the recent API feature that standardizes >retweets. The 3tweet command, Alt+3, now prompts whether to do a >standard or custom retweet. The standard behavior does not allow >one to add comments -- it is a verbatim relay of the prior >text. The custom option works like before, allowing one to edit the >text and add comments before or after the original text. There is >less built-in support for a custom retweet in the Twitter API and >web interface. It is like a tweet that indicates your source and >sends a copy to the @author retweeted. > >The New command, Alt+N, now includes standard retweets sent by your >leaders. The original author of a standard retweet is shown in the >second line of the viewing area. > >The /search command, Alt+Slash, now prompts whether to search >messages or users. The messages choice works like before. The >Users choice will prompt for a search query, using the same syntax >as the Find People page on the twittter.com web site. The results >are displayed as a user list, similar to the Followers or Leaders >command. Tab to the viewing area (or press Alt+V) for additional >information about the selected user in the list. Press Alt+X for >extra information. Use the Join command, Alt+J, if you want to >start following the person. > >The 2tweet command, Alt+2, now prompts for confirmation if you start >to reply publicly to a direct message. >Fixed a problem on Windows Vista and above where the McTwit window >was not activated after populating a list of messages or users. > >Added the official Twitter blog to the list of URLs offerred by the >Go command (when no items are in the list). Created a compilation >of about 150 topics from the support section of the Twitter web >site. The files TwitterHelpGuide.txt and TwitterHelpGuide.htm are >located in the McTwit program folder. The HTML version may also be >opened with the McTwit Help command, with an option in the McTwit >program group of the Windows Start Menu, or with the following link. >http://EmpowermentZone.com/TwitterHelpGuide.htm > >I have also made the McTwit documentation available separately at >http://EmpowermentZone.com/McTwit.htm > >Jamal From thebluesisloose at gmail.com Mon Mar 8 02:01:50 2010 From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com (Beth) Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2010 21:01:50 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Microsoft Access and other computer fluency questions Message-ID: <4383d01d1003071801g25f2c24k189ae4677f2eb31c@mail.gmail.com> Hi, guys. I am using my Vista computer with my web browser to compose this e-mail. Well, ... duh. I have a question for you all: has any of you ever tried to tackle Microsoft Access 2007 and made a database with it without exporting data from Excel? I did a little experimenting with the import data stuff, and found it helpful. But I have no clue how to do databases without doing the databases first from Keysoft then converting it to CSV files, then going from there to Excel spreadsheets, then ... you get the picture. ALso, has anyone tried Powerpoint with JAWS 10 and Windows Vista and Office 2007? Thanks for the help. Beth From lizmohnke at hotmail.com Mon Mar 8 06:10:28 2010 From: lizmohnke at hotmail.com (Elizabeth) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 01:10:28 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Reflecting upon the March 4 day of action. In-Reply-To: <409c235c1003061324x60153b16q9cbb0ae8d6337d7b@mail.gmail.com> References: <409c235c1003061324x60153b16q9cbb0ae8d6337d7b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: It is interesting to hear about how the people in California have reacted to the budget cuts made to the education system. I have not heard of any rallies to protest any such action here in Michigan. Although perhaps being a bit ahead of the curve in terms of the economic crises and a declining population may help, explain a different reaction when compared to that in California. All I can say is that I’m glad I’m not the one who has to decide on how the government chooses to spend what little money they have right now. If they are not cutting funding from schools, then they are cutting funds from library services, and when they are not cutting funds from library services, they are cutting funds from local road projects. And the list goes on and on. I think the only reason why things here in Michigan are not as bad as they are in California is our declining population. If not for this decrease in population, it is quite possible that things here in Michigan would be even worse then they are in California. I understand these cuts may be difficult, but it is also equally difficult to raise the revenue needed to sustain these services at their current levels. So if you do not want to see these services go, then perhaps you should be willing to support an increase in taxes to preserve the current levels of these services. But no one wants to see their taxes go up right now which makes it difficult to preserve the current levels of funding to all of the services state and local governments provide. So basically it boils down to the lesser of two evils. If you were the government, which one would you choose? Elizabeth > Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 13:24:19 -0800 > From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com > To: cabs-talk at nfbnet.org; nabs-l at nfbnet.org; nfbc-info at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] Reflecting upon the March 4 day of action. > > In much of the state of california, as well as other states across > the nation Students, teachers and other supporters took part in a > "day of action" this past thursday. This Day of action was aimed to > organize and educate people to the harsh reality that state budget > cuts present to all of those who believe that Education is not a > privelege but a right. > In California, many schools up and down the state from K-12 up > through graduate schoolmade their voices heard and their numbers seen > in a very major way. In the Bay area, masses of frustrated victums > of the budgetcuts marched in the streets and on the freeway (arrests > soon followed) to bring more attention to their causes. Armed with > very creative Costumes and sighns, these peaceful demonstrators > eventually made their way to San Francisco's Civic Center where a > major rally much resembling a civil rights gathering of decades gone > by took place. Union workers, school board members, and even a > state senitor were present. there were featured; passionate student > speakers from high schools and colleges as well as very thoughtful > performances by many gifted students and student groups. > I have to say that the energy in these rallys was really > amazing- I couldn't help but to get goosebumps walking through the > sea of people unified in fighiting for the same cause. > I honestly hope that my fellow students found their way to their > own demonstration no matter where you all are in this country. If > there was a rally near you, I hope you made your voice heard, because > when these cuts take place, they effect each and every student. It > effects our teachers/instructors, it effects our classes, our > disabled students offices, our rehabilitation services and other > programs we enjoy/rely upon. > I certainly plan to take up the cause and work along side my > sighted peers- I have friends and family that this effects, their > education, their jobs and to some extent their quality of life. > I hope that you find the passion within you and organize within > your student divisions, with in your communities, and within your > colleges and schools. > Thank you for your time. > Warm regards, > Darian > > > > -- > Darian Smith > Skype: The_Blind_Truth > Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com > The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher > recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate > individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your > help! To Get Involved go to: > www.TeachBlindStudents.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lizmohnke%40hotmail.com _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail: Trusted email with powerful SPAM protection. http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469227/direct/01/ From joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com Mon Mar 8 13:34:48 2010 From: joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com (RJ Sandefur) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 08:34:48 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Microsoft Access and other computer fluency questions References: <4383d01d1003071801g25f2c24k189ae4677f2eb31c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <73AF41E3D303457C81DDBE07C7AE8774@hometwxakonvzn> DBS never showed me how to use Microsoft access. RJ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Beth" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Sunday, March 07, 2010 9:01 PM Subject: [nabs-l] Microsoft Access and other computer fluency questions > Hi, guys. I am using my Vista computer with my web browser to compose > this e-mail. Well, ... duh. I have a question for you all: has any > of you ever tried to tackle Microsoft Access 2007 and made a database > with it without exporting data from Excel? I did a little > experimenting with the import data stuff, and found it helpful. But I > have no clue how to do databases without doing the databases first > from Keysoft then converting it to CSV files, then going from there to > Excel spreadsheets, then ... you get the picture. ALso, has anyone > tried Powerpoint with JAWS 10 and Windows Vista and Office 2007? > Thanks for the help. > Beth > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com From anjelinac26 at gmail.com Mon Mar 8 21:15:17 2010 From: anjelinac26 at gmail.com (Anjelina) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 16:15:17 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Online universities Message-ID: <82CF492BA56F4F2697B75EC27DA12ACF@D9P3ZND1> Has anyone had experience with online universities such as University of Phoenix or Capella University? If so what were your likes or dislikes. Thanks Anjelina From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Tue Mar 9 02:19:44 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 18:19:44 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Reflecting upon the March 4 day of action. In-Reply-To: References: <409c235c1003061324x60153b16q9cbb0ae8d6337d7b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <409c235c1003081819u28ab8cd5j77cf254eac274e6d@mail.gmail.com> Elizabeth, Very good points for sure. I know that one question you have to ask yourself as a californian (speaking in general terms) is what can you afford to have taken away from you by way of taxes? If you are one of those people who are working and barely get enough to make things work as it stands, how can you be asked to give that little bit you do have? a point that was brought up during the rally was something along the lines of... when the government wants to go to war; the money is there. When the government wants to bail out the banks; the money is there. Seems to not be the case for education. To me that makes some sense, but I also can understand that you could argue for the money to be spent on these things. Without making this too much of a political discussion, I guess I just would say that if people live in a state that is making noise much like california's students and teachers are doing; I would encourage you to join the fight because this effects you too. Budget cuts effect the level of services you get from rehab or school ( Private institutions not withstanding). I know that I plan on making my way up to sacramento twards the end of the month when the rallys take place at the capital. I think that the biggest thing to keep in mind in regards to your state and where it may or may not be in regards to budgetary considerations is to remember that this is as much a blindness issue as it is anything else. In fact, I would argue that this is bigger than blindness or the important issues of g blind students, because if you think about it we all are students and we all feel this. If you live in a state where this is not such an issue I would hope that you see that it does not become one (at least as best as one can). This is a matter of civic responsibility as well, and we have that responsibility to uphold as citizans of this country- we look to become integrated into society in a level equil to that of our sighted peers and here's a good oppertunity to do that. Respectfully, Darian On 3/7/10, Elizabeth wrote: > > It is interesting to hear about how the people in California have reacted to > the budget cuts made to the education system. I have not heard of any > rallies to protest any such action here in Michigan. Although perhaps being > a bit ahead of the curve in terms of the economic crises and a declining > population may help, explain a different reaction when compared to that in > California. All I can say is that I’m glad I’m not the one who has to decide > on how the government chooses to spend what little money they have right > now. If they are not cutting funding from schools, then they are cutting > funds from library services, and when they are not cutting funds from > library services, they are cutting funds from local road projects. And the > list goes on and on. I think the only reason why things here in Michigan are > not as bad as they are in California is our declining population. If not for > this decrease in population, it is quite possible that things here in > Michigan would be even worse then they are in California. I understand these > cuts may be difficult, but it is also equally difficult to raise the revenue > needed to sustain these services at their current levels. So if you do not > want to see these services go, then perhaps you should be willing to support > an increase in taxes to preserve the current levels of these services. But > no one wants to see their taxes go up right now which makes it difficult to > preserve the current levels of funding to all of the services state and > local governments provide. So basically it boils down to the lesser of two > evils. If you were the government, which one would you choose? > > Elizabeth > > > Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 13:24:19 -0800 >> From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com >> To: cabs-talk at nfbnet.org; nabs-l at nfbnet.org; nfbc-info at nfbnet.org >> Subject: [nabs-l] Reflecting upon the March 4 day of action. >> >> In much of the state of california, as well as other states across >> the nation Students, teachers and other supporters took part in a >> "day of action" this past thursday. This Day of action was aimed to >> organize and educate people to the harsh reality that state budget >> cuts present to all of those who believe that Education is not a >> privelege but a right. >> In California, many schools up and down the state from K-12 up >> through graduate schoolmade their voices heard and their numbers seen >> in a very major way. In the Bay area, masses of frustrated victums >> of the budgetcuts marched in the streets and on the freeway (arrests >> soon followed) to bring more attention to their causes. Armed with >> very creative Costumes and sighns, these peaceful demonstrators >> eventually made their way to San Francisco's Civic Center where a >> major rally much resembling a civil rights gathering of decades gone >> by took place. Union workers, school board members, and even a >> state senitor were present. there were featured; passionate student >> speakers from high schools and colleges as well as very thoughtful >> performances by many gifted students and student groups. >> I have to say that the energy in these rallys was really >> amazing- I couldn't help but to get goosebumps walking through the >> sea of people unified in fighiting for the same cause. >> I honestly hope that my fellow students found their way to their >> own demonstration no matter where you all are in this country. If >> there was a rally near you, I hope you made your voice heard, because >> when these cuts take place, they effect each and every student. It >> effects our teachers/instructors, it effects our classes, our >> disabled students offices, our rehabilitation services and other >> programs we enjoy/rely upon. >> I certainly plan to take up the cause and work along side my >> sighted peers- I have friends and family that this effects, their >> education, their jobs and to some extent their quality of life. >> I hope that you find the passion within you and organize within >> your student divisions, with in your communities, and within your >> colleges and schools. >> Thank you for your time. >> Warm regards, >> Darian >> >> >> >> -- >> Darian Smith >> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >> help! To Get Involved go to: >> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lizmohnke%40hotmail.com > > _________________________________________________________________ > Hotmail: Trusted email with powerful SPAM protection. > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469227/direct/01/ > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From mrsmigs at migliorelli.org Tue Mar 9 02:48:00 2010 From: mrsmigs at migliorelli.org (Maryann Migliorelli) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 19:48:00 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] help with microsoft outlook Message-ID: <001201cabf32$ef74a6f0$ce5df4d0$@org> Hello Fellow students, I was wondering if anyone knows how to send an e-mail in outlook without adding the address to your addressbook? I'm using office 2007 and can't find the place to turn such options on and off. Thanks for any help you can give. Maryann Migliorelli From sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca Tue Mar 9 03:41:48 2010 From: sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca (Sarah Jevnikar) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 22:41:48 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] help with Microsoft outlook In-Reply-To: <001201cabf32$ef74a6f0$ce5df4d0$@org> References: <001201cabf32$ef74a6f0$ce5df4d0$@org> Message-ID: <000001cabf3a$751613f0$5f423bd0$@jevnikar@utoronto.ca> Hi there, I don't know if this is helpful, but here goes. 1. from within Microsoft outlook, press control n. 2. type an address in the "to" field. If you use it only once it shouldn't be added to your address book. 3. fill in all remaining fields. Maybe you knew that already but I'm not sure what else to try. HTH, Sarah -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Maryann Migliorelli Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 9:48 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] help with microsoft outlook Hello Fellow students, I was wondering if anyone knows how to send an e-mail in outlook without adding the address to your addressbook? I'm using office 2007 and can't find the place to turn such options on and off. Thanks for any help you can give. Maryann Migliorelli _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto ronto.ca From dandrews at visi.com Tue Mar 9 09:06:23 2010 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 03:06:23 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Clisk, the Command Line Interface for Skype Message-ID: >Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2010 03:31:33 -0500 >From: Doug Lee >To: NFBnet GUI Talk Mailing List >Subject: [gui-talk] Clisk, the Command Line Interface for Skype > >This has been out there for a while, but I haven't really announced it >here I don't think. Anyone who doesn't like command lines can >probably safely skip this message. Anybody like me, though, who uses >them often, read on. > >I have been developing, and occasionally posting updates on my web >site for, a utility I call Clisk, which stands for the Command Line >Interface for Skype. I just released version 2.1.0, which is capable >of most Skype tasks, including listing and maintaining your contact >list, sending and receiving chat lines (though the UI is probably >better for that most of the time), handling contact detail requests, >making and managing calls and conferences, and handling voicemails. >Details, an online manual, and a download link can be found at >http://www.dlee.org/clisk/ > >For new users, I recommend the online manual, and once you get Clisk >running, the "help" or "?" command. The release notes for the various >Clisk releases will probably be confusing if read first. > > >-- >Doug Lee dgl at dlee.org http://www.dlee.org >SSB BART >Group doug.lee at ssbbartgroup.com http://www.ssbbartgroup.com >"The best executive is the one who has sense enough to pick good men to do >what he wants done, and self-restraint enough to keep from meddling with >them while they do it."--Theodore Roosevelt From raul at asmodean.net Tue Mar 9 09:08:06 2010 From: raul at asmodean.net (Raul A. Gallegos) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 03:08:06 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] The celebration continues: Retweet from GW Micro and win! Message-ID: Thanks to all of you who sent testimonials about Window-Eyes last month. To continue our 20-year anniversary celebration, GW Micro is pleased to announce our next promotion. To participate, you will need to have a Twitter account, and you will need to be a Follower of GW Micro on Twitter. Here's how it works. Login to your Twitter account, become a follower of GW Micro (if you aren't already), and then retweet (RT) the following message from GW Micro: "GW Micro is celebrating 20 years of excellence! Check us out at www.gwmicro.com. Become a follower, retweet this message and win $50!" Starting today, and on each Monday remaining in March, we'll have a new message for you to retweet. At the end of each week, we'll draw a random name from the list of everyone who has retweeted the message. That person will win a $50 gift card. So, hurry and go start tweeting! Jeremy Curry Director of Training GW Micro, Inc. Phone: (260) 489-3671 Fax: (260) 489-2608 Email: jeremy at gwmicro.com Web: www.gwmicro.com The gw-news list is an announce only list used for GW Micro news and product information. From dandrews at visi.com Tue Mar 9 09:22:26 2010 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 03:22:26 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] for mac users readhear daisy document reader update Message-ID: >Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 11:53:25 +1100 >From: Steve Pattison >To: Access L , > CUG Members >Subject: [gui-talk] fwd: for mac users readhear daisy document reader update > >From: Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith lynne at tft-bbs.co.uk > >The ReadHear DAISY and Digital EBook player for OSX has just undergone a >major update. This update resolves the very big and very irritating issue of >sentences been read repeatedly in DAISY 2 and DAISY 20.2 documents. A >number of other bug fixes were also added. > >Although the OLearia DAISY player is freeware and, as such, should certainly >not be discounted, in my humble opinion, ReadHear is now the best all-round >software DAISY player on the OSX platform. > >Built from the ground up with accessibility in mind, it has several >functions which >oLearia doesn't which, personally, we find very convenient. > >In particular the library function which, although not as flexible >as we'd like >to see it yet, is quite a powerful function. It allows you to scroll through a >book or document list and have bookmarks stored for each document in >your book library. > >I will be writing to the developers shortly; as I have lot of suggestions >for them. > >But for now, what we have is a good little player, although as I said >at the start, Olearia does a nice job. ReadHear's interface is, to be >honest, much more intuitive and interactive. > >If you want to try ReadHear, get it from: >www.gh-accessibility.com > >Lynne From dandrews at visi.com Tue Mar 9 09:47:54 2010 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 03:47:54 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB of Missouri State Convention to be Streamed Live Message-ID: 2010 NFB Of Missouri state convention will be streamed live from Springfield Missouri the dates are March 26 to March 28th the stream URL and schedule are below: stream URL: http://www.nfbmo.org/local_chapters/springfield/scripts/listen.m3u the stream will be active Saturday Morning general session 8:30 A.M. To 12:00 P.M. And the afternoon general session will be from 1:30 P.M. To 5:00 P.M. Saturday evening during the banquet from 6:30 P.M. Until 10:00 P.M. Sunday morning from 8:30 A.M. To 12:00 P.M. If you have problems connecting to the stream you may send an email to springfield_2010 at gary-springfield-mo.net or you may call 417-353-7493. Have a good night Gary Horchem National Federation of the Blind of Missouri Springfield Chapter President and NFBMO Webmaster From raniaismail04 at gmail.com Tue Mar 9 13:17:49 2010 From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania ) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 07:17:49 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Reflecting upon the March 4 day of action. In-Reply-To: <409c235c1003081819u28ab8cd5j77cf254eac274e6d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4b963c8b.9753f10a.64b3.071e@mx.google.com> In my state our transportation is totally being cut in arieas and in others the bus and train service is being reduced. Unforchenitly in my ariea it is being cut totally. Rania, -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Darian Smith Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 8:20 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Reflecting upon the March 4 day of action. Elizabeth, Very good points for sure. I know that one question you have to ask yourself as a californian (speaking in general terms) is what can you afford to have taken away from you by way of taxes? If you are one of those people who are working and barely get enough to make things work as it stands, how can you be asked to give that little bit you do have? a point that was brought up during the rally was something along the lines of... when the government wants to go to war; the money is there. When the government wants to bail out the banks; the money is there. Seems to not be the case for education. To me that makes some sense, but I also can understand that you could argue for the money to be spent on these things. Without making this too much of a political discussion, I guess I just would say that if people live in a state that is making noise much like california's students and teachers are doing; I would encourage you to join the fight because this effects you too. Budget cuts effect the level of services you get from rehab or school ( Private institutions not withstanding). I know that I plan on making my way up to sacramento twards the end of the month when the rallys take place at the capital. I think that the biggest thing to keep in mind in regards to your state and where it may or may not be in regards to budgetary considerations is to remember that this is as much a blindness issue as it is anything else. In fact, I would argue that this is bigger than blindness or the important issues of g blind students, because if you think about it we all are students and we all feel this. If you live in a state where this is not such an issue I would hope that you see that it does not become one (at least as best as one can). This is a matter of civic responsibility as well, and we have that responsibility to uphold as citizans of this country- we look to become integrated into society in a level equil to that of our sighted peers and here's a good oppertunity to do that. Respectfully, Darian On 3/7/10, Elizabeth wrote: > > It is interesting to hear about how the people in California have reacted to > the budget cuts made to the education system. I have not heard of any > rallies to protest any such action here in Michigan. Although perhaps being > a bit ahead of the curve in terms of the economic crises and a declining > population may help, explain a different reaction when compared to that in > California. All I can say is that I'm glad I'm not the one who has to decide > on how the government chooses to spend what little money they have right > now. If they are not cutting funding from schools, then they are cutting > funds from library services, and when they are not cutting funds from > library services, they are cutting funds from local road projects. And the > list goes on and on. I think the only reason why things here in Michigan are > not as bad as they are in California is our declining population. If not for > this decrease in population, it is quite possible that things here in > Michigan would be even worse then they are in California. I understand these > cuts may be difficult, but it is also equally difficult to raise the revenue > needed to sustain these services at their current levels. So if you do not > want to see these services go, then perhaps you should be willing to support > an increase in taxes to preserve the current levels of these services. But > no one wants to see their taxes go up right now which makes it difficult to > preserve the current levels of funding to all of the services state and > local governments provide. So basically it boils down to the lesser of two > evils. If you were the government, which one would you choose? > > Elizabeth > > > Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 13:24:19 -0800 >> From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com >> To: cabs-talk at nfbnet.org; nabs-l at nfbnet.org; nfbc-info at nfbnet.org >> Subject: [nabs-l] Reflecting upon the March 4 day of action. >> >> In much of the state of california, as well as other states across >> the nation Students, teachers and other supporters took part in a >> "day of action" this past thursday. This Day of action was aimed to >> organize and educate people to the harsh reality that state budget >> cuts present to all of those who believe that Education is not a >> privelege but a right. >> In California, many schools up and down the state from K-12 up >> through graduate schoolmade their voices heard and their numbers seen >> in a very major way. In the Bay area, masses of frustrated victums >> of the budgetcuts marched in the streets and on the freeway (arrests >> soon followed) to bring more attention to their causes. Armed with >> very creative Costumes and sighns, these peaceful demonstrators >> eventually made their way to San Francisco's Civic Center where a >> major rally much resembling a civil rights gathering of decades gone >> by took place. Union workers, school board members, and even a >> state senitor were present. there were featured; passionate student >> speakers from high schools and colleges as well as very thoughtful >> performances by many gifted students and student groups. >> I have to say that the energy in these rallys was really >> amazing- I couldn't help but to get goosebumps walking through the >> sea of people unified in fighiting for the same cause. >> I honestly hope that my fellow students found their way to their >> own demonstration no matter where you all are in this country. If >> there was a rally near you, I hope you made your voice heard, because >> when these cuts take place, they effect each and every student. It >> effects our teachers/instructors, it effects our classes, our >> disabled students offices, our rehabilitation services and other >> programs we enjoy/rely upon. >> I certainly plan to take up the cause and work along side my >> sighted peers- I have friends and family that this effects, their >> education, their jobs and to some extent their quality of life. >> I hope that you find the passion within you and organize within >> your student divisions, with in your communities, and within your >> colleges and schools. >> Thank you for your time. >> Warm regards, >> Darian >> >> >> >> -- >> Darian Smith >> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >> help! To Get Involved go to: >> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lizmohnke%40hotmail. com > > _________________________________________________________________ > Hotmail: Trusted email with powerful SPAM protection. > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469227/direct/01/ > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.co m > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai l.com No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2731 - Release Date: 03/08/10 13:33:00 From joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com Tue Mar 9 17:13:17 2010 From: joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com (RJ Sandefur) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 12:13:17 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] PDF's Message-ID: What's that Newonce thing? RJ From brownbears at mchsi.com Tue Mar 9 17:22:28 2010 From: brownbears at mchsi.com (Miranda brown) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 11:22:28 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Internet Message-ID: Hello NABS, I have JAWS on my dads computer and I have not used it for a long time and before everything worked fine. Now when I go to the internet it will not work it just keeps saying down parent document button when I press anything. I checked all of the FS recommended settings, performed disk scan, check hard drive, and defrag and nothing helps. Has anyone experienced this before and if you have any advice? From lizmohnke at hotmail.com Tue Mar 9 20:15:42 2010 From: lizmohnke at hotmail.com (Elizabeth) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 15:15:42 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Reflecting upon the March 4 day of action. In-Reply-To: <409c235c1003081819u28ab8cd5j77cf254eac274e6d@mail.gmail.com> References: <409c235c1003061324x60153b16q9cbb0ae8d6337d7b@mail.gmail.com>, , <409c235c1003081819u28ab8cd5j77cf254eac274e6d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Darian, I wish you the best of luck in your protests. They have not done much of anything here in Michigan, but perhaps they will have a greater effect out there in California. Although when you keep hearing about proposed budget cuts year after year, it just seems to become a normal part of life. If I were to participate in every protest against statewide budget cuts, then I’m honestly not quite sure how much of a life I would have left since they seem to appear on a fairly regular basis. I commend your active civic participation, but with all due respect, sometimes you just need to buckle down and ride out the hard times. Although I do agree with you on the issue of the bail out money that has been given to private corporations. I understand that in some ways this has helped our economy, but sometimes I wonder if this money could have been better spent on cash strapped state and local governments rather than the big banks on Wallstreet. But at any rate, good luck at your protests. Elizabeth > Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 18:19:44 -0800 > From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Reflecting upon the March 4 day of action. > > Elizabeth, > Very good points for sure. > I know that one question you have to ask yourself as a californian > (speaking in general terms) is what can you afford to have taken away > from you by way of taxes? If you are one of those people who are > working and barely get enough to make things work as it stands, how > can you be asked to give that little bit you do have? a point > that was brought up during the rally was something along the lines > of... when the government wants to go to war; the money is there. > When the government wants to bail out the banks; the money is there. > Seems to not be the case for education. To me that makes some sense, > but I also can understand that you could argue for the money to be > spent on these things. > Without making this too much of a political discussion, I guess I > just would say that if people live in a state that is making noise > much like california's students and teachers are doing; I would > encourage you to join the fight because this effects you too. > Budget cuts effect the level of services you get from rehab or school > ( Private institutions not withstanding). I know that I plan on > making my way up to sacramento twards the end of the month when the > rallys take place at the capital. I think that the biggest thing > to keep in mind in regards to your state and where it may or may not > be in regards to budgetary considerations is to remember that this is > as much a blindness issue as it is anything else. In fact, I would > argue that this is bigger than blindness or the important issues > of g blind students, because if you think about it we all are students > and we all feel this. If you live in a state where this is not such > an issue I would hope that you see that it does not become one (at > least as best as one can). This is a matter of civic responsibility > as well, and we have that responsibility to uphold as citizans of this > country- we look to become integrated into society in a level equil > to that of our sighted peers and here's a good oppertunity to do > that. > Respectfully, > Darian > > On 3/7/10, Elizabeth wrote: > > > > It is interesting to hear about how the people in California have reacted to > > the budget cuts made to the education system. I have not heard of any > > rallies to protest any such action here in Michigan. Although perhaps being > > a bit ahead of the curve in terms of the economic crises and a declining > > population may help, explain a different reaction when compared to that in > > California. All I can say is that I’m glad I’m not the one who has to decide > > on how the government chooses to spend what little money they have right > > now. If they are not cutting funding from schools, then they are cutting > > funds from library services, and when they are not cutting funds from > > library services, they are cutting funds from local road projects. And the > > list goes on and on. I think the only reason why things here in Michigan are > > not as bad as they are in California is our declining population. If not for > > this decrease in population, it is quite possible that things here in > > Michigan would be even worse then they are in California. I understand these > > cuts may be difficult, but it is also equally difficult to raise the revenue > > needed to sustain these services at their current levels. So if you do not > > want to see these services go, then perhaps you should be willing to support > > an increase in taxes to preserve the current levels of these services. But > > no one wants to see their taxes go up right now which makes it difficult to > > preserve the current levels of funding to all of the services state and > > local governments provide. So basically it boils down to the lesser of two > > evils. If you were the government, which one would you choose? > > > > Elizabeth > > > > > Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 13:24:19 -0800 > >> From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com > >> To: cabs-talk at nfbnet.org; nabs-l at nfbnet.org; nfbc-info at nfbnet.org > >> Subject: [nabs-l] Reflecting upon the March 4 day of action. > >> > >> In much of the state of california, as well as other states across > >> the nation Students, teachers and other supporters took part in a > >> "day of action" this past thursday. This Day of action was aimed to > >> organize and educate people to the harsh reality that state budget > >> cuts present to all of those who believe that Education is not a > >> privelege but a right. > >> In California, many schools up and down the state from K-12 up > >> through graduate schoolmade their voices heard and their numbers seen > >> in a very major way. In the Bay area, masses of frustrated victums > >> of the budgetcuts marched in the streets and on the freeway (arrests > >> soon followed) to bring more attention to their causes. Armed with > >> very creative Costumes and sighns, these peaceful demonstrators > >> eventually made their way to San Francisco's Civic Center where a > >> major rally much resembling a civil rights gathering of decades gone > >> by took place. Union workers, school board members, and even a > >> state senitor were present. there were featured; passionate student > >> speakers from high schools and colleges as well as very thoughtful > >> performances by many gifted students and student groups. > >> I have to say that the energy in these rallys was really > >> amazing- I couldn't help but to get goosebumps walking through the > >> sea of people unified in fighiting for the same cause. > >> I honestly hope that my fellow students found their way to their > >> own demonstration no matter where you all are in this country. If > >> there was a rally near you, I hope you made your voice heard, because > >> when these cuts take place, they effect each and every student. It > >> effects our teachers/instructors, it effects our classes, our > >> disabled students offices, our rehabilitation services and other > >> programs we enjoy/rely upon. > >> I certainly plan to take up the cause and work along side my > >> sighted peers- I have friends and family that this effects, their > >> education, their jobs and to some extent their quality of life. > >> I hope that you find the passion within you and organize within > >> your student divisions, with in your communities, and within your > >> colleges and schools. > >> Thank you for your time. > >> Warm regards, > >> Darian > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Darian Smith > >> Skype: The_Blind_Truth > >> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com > >> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher > >> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate > >> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your > >> help! To Get Involved go to: > >> www.TeachBlindStudents.org > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> nabs-l mailing list > >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > >> nabs-l: > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lizmohnke%40hotmail.com > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > Hotmail: Trusted email with powerful SPAM protection. > > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469227/direct/01/ > > _______________________________________________ > > nabs-l mailing list > > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > > nabs-l: > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > > > > > -- > Darian Smith > Skype: The_Blind_Truth > Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com > The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher > recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate > individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your > help! To Get Involved go to: > www.TeachBlindStudents.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lizmohnke%40hotmail.com _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469230/direct/01/ From daydreamingncolor at gmail.com Tue Mar 9 20:47:12 2010 From: daydreamingncolor at gmail.com (Aziza Cano) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 13:47:12 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Theatrical lighting done by the blind? Message-ID: <4BC2EED19921476A8DCACDC3E79621B1@azizaLatD430> Hi all, A friend of mine asked me to make some inquiries. She participates actively with her school's drama club, and has done everything from painting back drops, to performing, and manning the sound controlls. She is eager to try her hand at the lighting end of the theater work. Some of her classmates are discouraging, but her teacher says if she can find a good method, he will be up for giving it a shot. If anyone has experience in theatrical lighting as a blind individual, and has any tips or techniques they wouldn't mind sharing, she and I would really appreciate any information. Thanks. Aziza From astrochem119 at gmail.com Tue Mar 9 21:46:51 2010 From: astrochem119 at gmail.com (Chelsea Cook) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 16:46:51 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Internet Message-ID: Miranda, Does your dad have auto-updates turned on? The same thing happened to me after I was away for the summer on my mom's computer. Internet Explorer updated to version 8, I talked to the FS people and they said that IE 8 and JAWS 9 (or earlier) would not work anymoore. I suggest upgrading your JAWS to 10 or later, or if that is not an option, getting FireFox. It's not the same and some of the controls are a bit different, but it gets the job done fairly well. Hope this helps, Chelsea From marsha.drenth at gmail.com Tue Mar 9 22:33:30 2010 From: marsha.drenth at gmail.com (Marsha Drenth) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 17:33:30 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Theatrical lighting done by the blind? In-Reply-To: <4BC2EED19921476A8DCACDC3E79621B1@azizaLatD430> References: <4BC2EED19921476A8DCACDC3E79621B1@azizaLatD430> Message-ID: When I did lighting and sound in highschool. I would have the light board labeled in Braille. I would also have note cards to which slider switches for which scenes and when. If there is a scene change, I would use a line to know that the scene is changing, thus the lights would change. Having a label on the board to know what lights are which lights on the stage, is important to know. Practice makes perfect in this situation. marsha -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aziza Cano Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 3:47 PM To: NABS Mailing List; CABS Talk; Performing Arts Devision Mailing List Subject: [nabs-l] Theatrical lighting done by the blind? Hi all, A friend of mine asked me to make some inquiries. She participates actively with her school's drama club, and has done everything from painting back drops, to performing, and manning the sound controlls. She is eager to try her hand at the lighting end of the theater work. Some of her classmates are discouraging, but her teacher says if she can find a good method, he will be up for giving it a shot. If anyone has experience in theatrical lighting as a blind individual, and has any tips or techniques they wouldn't mind sharing, she and I would really appreciate any information. Thanks. Aziza _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marsha.drenth%40gmai l.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4929 (20100309) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4930 (20100309) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4930 (20100309) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com From kramc11 at gmail.com Wed Mar 10 00:41:27 2010 From: kramc11 at gmail.com (Mark J. Cadigan) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 19:41:27 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Theatrical lighting done by the blind? In-Reply-To: <4BC2EED19921476A8DCACDC3E79621B1@azizaLatD430> References: <4BC2EED19921476A8DCACDC3E79621B1@azizaLatD430> Message-ID: I have run the lights for my schools drama production. At my school the entire system is computerized. All you do is punch a button and bring up a preset light cue. This takes a lot of work to set up and get rite, but once you program the digital light board, all you have to do is hit the next button and it brings up the next cue. The stage director just says cue, threw the headsets, and if it is a light cue, I hit the button and the lights change. It works extremely well. I don't know what kind of setup there is at your school, but if it is anything like the setup in my schools Bulger theater, it will work fine. If you have any questions, you can email me off list and I would gladly discuss the specifics of how it works and whatnot. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Aziza Cano" To: "NABS Mailing List" ; "CABS Talk" ; "Performing Arts Devision Mailing List" Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 3:47 PM Subject: [nabs-l] Theatrical lighting done by the blind? > Hi all, > > A friend of mine asked me to make some inquiries. She participates > actively with her school's drama club, and has done everything from > painting back drops, to performing, and manning the sound controlls. She > is eager to try her hand at the lighting end of the theater work. Some of > her classmates are discouraging, but her teacher says if she can find a > good method, he will be up for giving it a shot. > > If anyone has experience in theatrical lighting as a blind individual, and > has any tips or techniques they wouldn't mind sharing, she and I would > really appreciate any information. > > Thanks. > Aziza > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11%40gmail.com From bunnykatie6 at gmail.com Wed Mar 10 01:37:51 2010 From: bunnykatie6 at gmail.com (Katie Wang) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 20:37:51 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Internet In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5096b4731003091737g499d7cddxb96470eae6624faf@mail.gmail.com> Hi, Miranda, I haven't experienced this specific problem before, but one possibility is that the web browser on your dad's computer was upgraded during the time you were not actively using it and it is no longer compatible with the currently installed version of JAWS. Do you know which version of Internet Explorer or Firefox and which version of JAWS you are using? It may be helpful to check on the FS website to see if these versions are compatible; if not you may need to purchase a JAWS upgrade. Hope that helps! Katie On 3/9/10, Miranda brown wrote: > Hello NABS, > I have JAWS on my dads computer and I have not used it for a long time and > before everything worked fine. Now when I go to the internet it will not > work it just keeps saying down parent document button when I press anything. > I checked all of the FS recommended settings, performed disk scan, check > hard drive, and defrag and nothing helps. Has anyone experienced this before > and if you have any advice? > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmail.com > From aec732 at msn.com Wed Mar 10 02:50:19 2010 From: aec732 at msn.com (Annemarie Cooke) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 21:50:19 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] April 1 deadline approaches for RFB&D scholarships! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Just a few weeks left to apply! Recording for the Blind and Dyslexic® (RFB&D®) is now accepting applications for the 2010 Scholastic Achievement Awards! College seniors or graduate students who are blind or visually impaired are eligible for the award. Each year, three top winners receive $6,000 and an all-expense paid trip to Washington, DC! The deadline of April 1st is fast-approaching! Click the below link to learn more! http://www.rfbd.org/About-RFB-D/National-Achievement-Awards/108/ Thanks! Annemarie Cooke From ebell at latech.edu Wed Mar 10 10:22:37 2010 From: ebell at latech.edu (Edward Bell) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 04:22:37 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Research Project--Institute on Blindness Message-ID: Caitlin Singletary, a doctoral student at Louisiana Tech University, is currently attempting to complete her dissertation. Specifically, her research is looking at psychological characteristics and how they are related to blindness skill sets. She is working with six national training centers, and using their current students as her participants. She also is including participants who have not been to a residential training center to complete her sample. If you have not been to a residential training center and would like to participate or receive more information, you can email her at cms055 at latech.edu or reach her by phone at 337-263-2812. The survey takes approximately 20-25 minutes over the phone. Please note that if you have completed training through public school or summer programs, you can participate. __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 4930 (20100309) __________ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com From RWest at nfb.org Wed Mar 10 10:43:16 2010 From: RWest at nfb.org (West, Renee) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 04:43:16 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB-NEWSLINER In Your Pocket Now Compatible Message-ID: FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE CONTACT: Chris Danielsen Director of Public Relations National Federation of the Blind (410) 659-9314, extension 2330 (410) 262-1281 (Cell) cdanielsen at nfb.org Scott White Director, NFB-NEWSLINE® National Federation of the Blind (410) 659-9314, extension 2231 swhite at nfb.org National Federation of the Blind’s Newspaper Service Now Offers More Digital Talking Book Player Compatibility NFB-NEWSLINE® In Your Pocket Now Compatible with BookSense and Book Port Plus Baltimore, Maryland (March 9 , 2010): NFB-NEWSLINE®, a free service that provides independent access by print-disabled people to hundreds of local and national publications and TV listings, is pleased to announce that NFB-NEWSLINE® In Your Pocket is now compatible with two more digital talking book players, the BookSense and Book Port Plus. Digital talking-book players such as BookSense and Book Port Plus allow print-disabled individuals to download and store books and music on a small handheld device, affording easy and portable access to a wide array of media. NFB-NEWSLINE® In Your Pocket is a dynamic software application for personal computers which, through an Internet connection, automatically downloads the publications of a subscriber’s choice to his or her digital talking-book player. Through this revolutionary access method, subscribers can now use their Book Port Plus or BookSense players to gain easy and immediate access to their favorite publications and enjoy the reading experience that is offered with a DAISY-reading device. Dr. Marc Maurer, President of the National Federation of the Blind, said: “With NFB-NEWSLINE®, the print-disabled can benefit from the vital news contained in newspapers and magazines. With the new device compatibility created for NFB-NEWSLINE® In Your Pocket, blind people have even more flexibility in where and how they access the news they need to succeed in all aspects of their lives.” NFB-NEWSLINE® allows those who cannot read conventional newsprint due to a visual or physical disability to access newspapers and magazines by download to a digital talking book player, over the telephone, or on the Web. To learn more about NFB-NEWSLINE®, please visit www.nfbnewsline.org; those interested in subscribing to the service may fill out the online application form, write to nfbnewsline at nfb.org, or call (866) 504-7300. In order to be eligible for NFB-NEWSLINE® an individual must be a US resident who is legally blind or has a physical or learning disability that prevents the independent reading of newspapers. For further information about NFB-NEWSLINE® In Your Pocket, visit www.nfbnewslineonline.org and select “NFB-NEWSLINE® In Your Pocket” from the NFB-NEWSLINE® Online Main Menu. ### About the National Federation of the Blind With more than 50,000 members, the National Federation of the Blind is the largest and most influential membership organization of blind people in the United States. The NFB improves blind people's lives through advocacy, education, research, technology, and programs encouraging independence and self-confidence. It is the leading force in the blindness field today and the voice of the nation's blind. In January 2004 the NFB opened the National Federation of the Blind Jernigan Institute, the first research and training center in the United States for the blind led by the blind. Renee West Manager, Marketing and Outreach Sponsored Technology Programs NATIONAL FEDERATION OF THE BLIND 200 East Wells Street Baltimore MD 21230 Phone: (410) 659-9314 ext. 2411 Fax: (410) 659-5129 Websites: www.nfb.org; www.nfbnewsline.org; www.nfbnewslineonline.org Follow us on Twitter! http://twitter.com/NFB_NEWSLINE -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 2010-03-09 NIYP release - CD edit - FINAL.doc Type: application/msword Size: 154112 bytes Desc: not available URL: From aec732 at msn.com Wed Mar 10 10:59:27 2010 From: aec732 at msn.com (Annemarie Cooke) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 04:59:27 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Apply for RFB&D Scholastic Achievement Awards Soon! Message-ID: Just a few weeks left to apply! Recording for the Blind and Dyslexic® (RFB&D®) is now accepting applications for the 2010 Scholastic Achievement Awards! College seniors or graduate students who are blind or visually impaired are eligible for the award. Each year, three top winners receive $6,000 and an all-expense paid trip to Washington, DC! The deadline of April 1st is fast-approaching! Click the below link to learn more! http://www.rfbd.org/About-RFB-D/National-Achievement-Awards/108/ From info at michaelhingson.com Wed Mar 10 11:07:29 2010 From: info at michaelhingson.com (Michael Hingson) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 05:07:29 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] KnfbReader Mobile Hints and Tricks seminar now on line Message-ID: KnfbReader Mobile Hints and Tricks seminar now on line Last Thursday evening many of us participated in a lively discussion about the KnfbReader Mobile. The online and teleconference discussion ran for nearly three hours and covered topics such as how to read currency, reading public signs, future developments and many other topics. The seminar is now available for you to stream or download. To listen to the seminar visit http://knfbreader.michaelhingson.com/products-mobile/products-mobile.php. You may also download the seminar by clicking on this link, http://hingson.s3.amazonaws.com/KnfbReaderHintsandTricks-March4-2010.mp3. After listening to the seminar should anyone have any questions please do not hesitate to email the list or me off list at info at michaelhingson.com. You may also feel free to call me at (415) 827-4084. We are ready to help you configure and order a Reader of your own should you wish one and do not yet own this wonderful device. Happy reading to all. Best, Mike Hingson The Michael Hingson Group, INC. "Speaking with Vision" Michael Hingson, President (415) 827-4084 info at michaelhingson.com www.michaelhingson.com for info on the new KNFB Reader Mobile, visit: http://knfbreader.michaelhingson.com From jkenn337 at gmail.com Wed Mar 10 12:50:58 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 07:50:58 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] winTriangle Message-ID: <655B893F87484BBA86EF6FDCA15DAC74@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> hi Does anyone on here use WinTriangle for math? Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. From jkenn337 at gmail.com Wed Mar 10 13:28:06 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 08:28:06 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] winTriangle for math Message-ID: <701CF333AA0E4FD88197E87B1BC287EF@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Hi I am getting this error when trying to start winTriangle. Error Report Contents The following information about your process will be reported: Exception Information Code: 0xc0000005 Flags: 0x00000000 Record: 0x0000000000000000 Address: 0x0000000073dd497d System Information Windows NT 5.1 Build: 2600 CPU Vendor Code: 756E6547 - 49656E69 - 6C65746E CPU Version: 000106C2 CPU Feature Code: BFE9FBFF CPU AMD Feature Code: 00D4E824 Module 1 Triangle1.exe Image Base: 0x00400000 Image Size: 0x00000000 Checksum: 0x00000000 Time Stamp: 0x3ea5ce38 Version Information The following files will be included in this error report: C:\DOCUME~1\Josh\LOCALS~1\Temp\dfea_appcompat.txt Close Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. From corbbo at gmail.com Wed Mar 10 14:38:52 2010 From: corbbo at gmail.com (Corbb O'Connor) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 09:38:52 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: New Virginia At Large Chapter References: <003301cac04f$67f57790$37e066b0$@com> Message-ID: Begin forwarded message: From: "Fredric Schroeder" Date: March 10, 2010 7:44:20 AM EST To: Subject: [Nfbv-announce] New At Large Chapter Reply-To: NFB of Virginia Information and Announcements Greetings all: The National Federation of the Blind of Virginia is creating an at large chapter for individuals in the state who do not have access to a local chapter. The chapter will meet by teleconference at 8:00 P.M. the last Thursday of each month. To join the call please follow these steps: Conference Details Date: Thursday, March 25, 2010 Start Time: 08:00 PM Eastern Daylight Time Dial-in Number: 1-219-509-8111 Participant Access Code: 3613754 What is the purpose of the At Large Chapter? The At Large Chapter gives interested individuals an opportunity to participate in the Federation even if there is no local chapter in their community. What will be discussed? At each At Large Chapter meeting we will provide information about the state and national activities of the Federation. We will also discuss our philosophy about blindness and how it applies to our day-to-day lives. At our first meeting on March 25, we will give a brief history of the Federation and we will talk about how the Federation has expanded opportunities for blind people in Virginia and the nation. Future meetings will include presentations on programs like NewsLine (our dialup newspaper service), summer youth programs and legislative activities. Do I have to be a paid member of the Federation to participate? As with local chapters, we hope individuals will join the Federation; however anyone is welcome to participate in the At Large Chapter. Is the call free? No. Each participant is responsible for any long-distance cost for the call. How long will the call last? We plan to keep calls to one hour. For more information contact: Fred Schroeder, President National Federation of the Blind of Virginia (703) 319-9226 fschroeder at sks.com _______________________________________________ Nfbv-announce mailing list Nfbv-announce at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbv-announce_nfbnet.org From marrie12 at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 02:14:10 2010 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 18:14:10 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: Apple Job Opening - Accessibility Software Quality Engineer References: Message-ID: <75A489DD-69D0-40E3-AD43-5158004DBD1A@gmail.com> Begin forwarded message: > From: Sarah Alawami > Date: March 10, 2010 6:10:20 PM PST > To: Feistyfolks > Subject: Fwd: Apple Job Opening - Accessibility Software Quality Engineer > >> >> Apple Inc. Job Opening! >> >> Job Title: Accessibility Software Quality Engineer >> Req #: 4953012 >> >> Location: Cupertino, CA >> >> Job Description: >> Do you want to directly and positively impact the lives of many Apple >> customers? Do you *really* want to change the world? Apple's VoiceOver >> Engineering Team is seeking a Software Quality Engineer who will help >> test and improve future versions of VoiceOver as well as the general >> accessibility of iPhone and Mac OS X. VoiceOver Is Apple's >> screenreader software that enables blind or visually impaired users to >> use Apple products. You'll be responsible for testing functionality, >> user experience, and performance, as well as text-to-speech and >> Braille display accuracy and speed. The ideal candidate will have >> experience with the software quality assurance process and will be >> extremely passionate about accessibility and VoiceOver. >> >> Job Responsibilities Include: >> - Defining/evolving the team's testing and performance strategy. >> - Developing test suites and scripts which work with Apple's automated >> test tools. >> - Testing the functionality of VoiceOver. >> - Testing the accessibility of iPhone and Mac OS X applications (using >> VoiceOver). >> - Contributing ideas to improve VoiceOver's user experience. >> - Testing alternative display devices, such as refreshable Braille >> displays. >> - Testing speech quality. >> - General testing of iPhone and Mac OS X. >> >> Key Requirements: >> - BSCS or equivalent. >> - Experience using the UNIX command line and scripting. >> - Experience using screen readers and knowledge of accessibility >> issues. >> - Experience using speech synthesis. >> - Fluent Braille reader. >> - Solid testing skills. >> - Strong communication skills. >> >> Additional Desired Skills: >> - Experience with refreshable Braille displays and other accessibility >> devices. >> - Experience with C, Objective-C, Mac OS X, Cocoa, Carbon, and Apple's >> Accessibility API. >> >> >> ** For additional information or to apply for this position, please >> visit our website at www.apple.com/jobs. ** >> >> ** Direct link to listed position: >> http://jobs.apple.com/index.ajs?BID=1&method=mExternal.showJob&RID=48170&CurrentPage=1 >> ** >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. >> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries at googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >> > From nabs.president at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 03:06:15 2010 From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 21:06:15 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Student Slate and NABS March Bulletin! Message-ID: <85ff10071003101906w5f99357ay84e2bc04b6a278fd@mail.gmail.com> national Association of Blind Students >From the Desk of the President March 10, 2010 In This Bulletin: 1. Student Slate is Back! 2. Last Chance to Apply for NFB Scholarships! 3. Get Ready for Convention! 4. Announcements Check out the Student Slate! Once again the NABS Slate committee has compiled an excellent newsletter with several unique and useful articles of interest to blind students! Please see the Spring 2010 issue of the Student Slate attached to this email. Find out about the progress we made at Washington Seminar, read about the experience of one of our top NFB scholarship winners, and learn about your right to informed choice in obtaining blindness training! Last Chance for NFB Scholarships: The deadline for the NFB's national scholarship application is coming up on March 31! Each year the National Federation of the Blind awards thirty scholarships to legally blind college and graduate students across the country. The scholarship includes a cash award ranging from $3000 to $12000, plus a free trip to the NFB national convention and often a piece of assistive technology such as a KNFB Reader Mobile. The scholarship application for 2010 is now on the Web at www.nfb.org/scholarships It's not too late to submit your application! applications are due by March 31, 2010. Already won a national NFB scholarship? You can apply again and potentially win a second scholarship, also known as a TenBroek fellowship. In addition, many NFB affiliates offer scholarships to blind students. You needn't be an active member of the NFB to win. Contact your NFB state president for details. Get Ready for Convention! The following appeared in the latest issue of the Braille Monitor, the monthly newsletter of the NFB: Dallas Site of 2010 NFB Convention The 2010 convention of the National Federation of the Blind will take place in Dallas, Texas, July 3-8, at the Hilton Anatole Hotel at 2201 Stemmons Freeway, Dallas, Texas 75207. Make your room reservation as soon as possible with the Hilton Anatole staff only. Call (214) 761-7500 (214) 761-7500. The 2010 room rates are singles, doubles, and twins $62 and triples and quads $67 a night, plus a 15 percent sales tax. The hotel is accepting reservations now. A $60-per-room deposit is required to make a reservation. Fifty percent of the deposit will be refunded if notice is given to the hotel of a reservation cancellation before June 1, 2010. The other 50 percent is not refundable. Rooms will be available on a first-come, first-served basis. Reservations may be made before June 1, 2010, assuming that rooms are still available. After that time the hotel will not hold our block of rooms for the convention. In other words, you should get your reservation in soon. Guestroom amenities include cable television, coffee pot, iron and ironing board, hair dryer, and high-speed Internet access. The Hilton Anatole has several excellent restaurants, twenty-four-hour-a-day room service, first-rate meeting space, and other top-notch facilities. It is in downtown Dallas with shuttle service to both the Dallas/Ft. Worth Airport and Love Field. The schedule for the 2010 convention will follow that of last year: Saturday, July 3 Seminar Day Sunday, July 4 Registration Day Monday, July 5 Board Meeting and Division Day Tuesday, July 6 Opening Session Wednesday, July 7 Business Session Thursday, July 8 Banquet Day and Adjournment To pre-register for the convention, go to www.nfb.org We know that attending a national NFB convention can often exceed a student’s budget. If you would like to attend the convention, talk to your state president about potential funding. Many state affiliates provide funding for their members to attend national conventions. Additionally, the Kenneth Jernigan Fund provides convention scholarships to first-time convention attendees. Talk to your state president for details. State Division Announcements: >From Montana: The MAB's Student Division Goes to The Montana School for the Deaf and Blind by Jim Reed On Friday, February 26th, 2010, the MAB's Student Division went to the Montana School for the Deaf and Blind to talk to its Blind high school students about college and being a blind college student. We met with five students, and there were at least five staff members who stayed for our full presentation, or who stopped by to see what was going on. One of the staff members said that because of our presentation, she felt she could be more effective working with her blind students. We talked to the students about techniques and strategies used to succeed in college. We talked about electronic documents, scanning print materials, hiring and using readers, and working with DSS. We also gave a demonstration of a Victor reader Stream playing textbooks from Recordings for the Blind and Dyslexic and Bookshare, as well as a textbook that had been scanned and converted into a Microsoft Word document. We talked about the importance of having good Braille speeds, and a solid working knowledge of the blindness techniques and technologies needed as a student. We told the students about some of the opportunities available to them through the NFB, the MAB, and the Student Division. We talked about the NFB College Scholarship program, the MAB scholarship, the Bozeman Chapter scholarship, and the NFB National Convention Scholarship for first-time attendees. We talked about members of the Student Division attending the national convention, the state convention, and Washington Seminar. We talked about Camp Eureka, and about the NFB's Youth Slam. We also talked about our training center experiences, and talked about the Colorado Center for the Blind's high school and college-prep programs. After we spoke to the students for about an hour, pizza was delivered, and as we ate, both students and staff used the time to talk to members of the Student Division and ask questions. Before we left, we gave the staff and students a CD-Rom that contained useful information, links, brochures, applications, Student Division contact info, and articles from the Braille Monitor. I think our trip was a success and that this approach could be applied successfully in larger towns with bigger school districts. >From Nebraska: On March 26-28, the Nebraska Association of Blind Students will host our second annual student Seminar. The seminar, entitled “Exploring the Depths,” is aimed at helping students prepare for college. We are pleased to welcome Eric Guillory, director of youth services at the Louisiana Center for the Blind, who will talk about how to handle Math and Science classes in high school and college. Other highlights will include a panel on center training, hands-on demonstrations of technology, and discussions of NFB philosophy. The seminar will also offer blind students an opportunity to network and socialize. If you are interested in attending the seminar, please contact Karen Anderson at kea.anderson at gmail.com. Introducing the College Leadership Program: >From Jason Ewell, who works at the NFB Department of Affiliate Action: In 2009 the Affiliate Action Department developed the College Leadership Program to provide an opportunity for promising young college students to attend their first national convention and Washington Seminar. Twenty-eight new Federationists attended the convention in Detroit last summer. Twelve participated in our Scholarship Alumni/College Leadership seminar in Baltimore in January. They then went to Washington, D.C. to join the other members of their state affiliate delegations on Capitol Hill. After returning home, several sent notes expressing their appreciation for the opportunity to attend and asking how they can get more involved in Federation activities in their affiliates. One note, from a college student who has been blind for only a year and who was attending her first national event, demonstrates that this new, exciting program is already helping to build the Federation. I thank you for the opportunity to come to Baltimore and Washington, D.C. I cannot really put into words all that I learned and took away from that trip. I was not sure before but now I know that NFB is where I belong. If you or anyone you know would be a good candidate for this program, please contact me at the National Center for the Blind at 410-659-9314, Ext. 2509, or by email at Jewell at nfb.org. -- Arielle Silverman President, National Association of Blind Students Phone: 602-502-2255 Email: nabs.president at gmail.com Website: www.nabslink.org From liamskitten at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 03:55:10 2010 From: liamskitten at gmail.com (Courtney Stover) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 21:55:10 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Student Slate and NABS March Bulletin! In-Reply-To: <85ff10071003101906w5f99357ay84e2bc04b6a278fd@mail.gmail.com> References: <85ff10071003101906w5f99357ay84e2bc04b6a278fd@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <7949e5e21003101955u6e493048rb1f1da38c6b2bc8c@mail.gmail.com> Arielle, For some reason, the attachment doesn't seem to have come through. Courtney On 3/10/10, Arielle Silverman wrote: > national Association of Blind Students > >From the Desk of the President > March 10, 2010 > > In This Bulletin: > 1. Student Slate is Back! > 2. Last Chance to Apply for NFB Scholarships! > 3. Get Ready for Convention! > 4. Announcements > Check out the Student Slate! > Once again the NABS Slate committee has compiled an excellent > newsletter with several unique and useful articles of interest to > blind students! Please see the Spring 2010 issue of the Student Slate > attached to this email. Find out about the progress we made at > Washington Seminar, read about the experience of one of our top NFB > scholarship winners, and learn about your right to informed choice in > obtaining blindness training! > > Last Chance for NFB Scholarships: > The deadline for the NFB's national scholarship application is coming > up on March 31! > > Each year the National Federation of the Blind awards thirty > scholarships to legally blind college and graduate students across the > country. The scholarship includes a cash award ranging from $3000 to > $12000, plus a free trip to the NFB national convention and often a > piece of assistive technology such as a KNFB Reader Mobile. The > scholarship application for 2010 is now on the Web at > www.nfb.org/scholarships > It's not too late to submit your application! > > applications are due by March 31, 2010. > Already won a national NFB scholarship? You can apply again and > potentially win a second scholarship, also known as a TenBroek > fellowship. > In addition, many NFB affiliates offer scholarships to blind students. > You needn't be an active member of the NFB to win. Contact your NFB > state president for details. > > Get Ready for Convention! > > The following appeared in the latest issue of the Braille Monitor, the > monthly newsletter of the NFB: > > Dallas Site of 2010 NFB Convention > The 2010 convention of the National Federation of the Blind will take > place in Dallas, Texas, July 3-8, at the Hilton Anatole Hotel at 2201 > Stemmons Freeway, Dallas, Texas 75207. Make your room reservation as > soon as possible with the Hilton Anatole staff only. Call > (214) 761-7500 (214) 761-7500. > The 2010 room rates are singles, doubles, and twins $62 and triples > and quads $67 a night, plus a 15 percent sales tax. The hotel is > accepting reservations now. A $60-per-room deposit is required to make > a reservation. Fifty percent of the deposit will be refunded if notice > is given to the hotel of a reservation cancellation before June 1, > 2010. The other 50 percent is not refundable. > Rooms will be available on a first-come, first-served basis. > Reservations may be made before June 1, 2010, assuming that rooms are > still available. After that time the hotel will not hold our block of > rooms for the convention. In other words, you should get your > reservation in soon. > Guestroom amenities include cable television, coffee pot, iron and > ironing board, hair dryer, and high-speed Internet access. The Hilton > Anatole has several excellent restaurants, twenty-four-hour-a-day room > service, first-rate meeting space, and other top-notch facilities. It > is in downtown Dallas with shuttle service to both the Dallas/Ft. > Worth Airport and Love Field. > The schedule for the 2010 convention will follow that of last year: > Saturday, July 3 Seminar Day > Sunday, July 4 Registration Day > Monday, July 5 Board Meeting and Division Day > Tuesday, July 6 Opening Session > Wednesday, July 7 Business Session > Thursday, July 8 Banquet Day and Adjournment > > To pre-register for the convention, go to > www.nfb.org > We know that attending a national NFB convention can often exceed a > student’s budget. If you would like to attend the convention, talk to > your state president about potential funding. Many state affiliates > provide funding for their members to attend national conventions. > Additionally, the Kenneth Jernigan Fund provides convention > scholarships to first-time convention attendees. Talk to your state > president for details. > > State Division Announcements: > >From Montana: > > The MAB's Student Division Goes to The Montana School for the Deaf and Blind > by Jim Reed > On Friday, February 26th, 2010, the MAB's Student Division went to the > Montana School for the Deaf and Blind to talk to its Blind high school > students about college and being a blind college student. We met with > five students, and there were at least five staff members who stayed > for our full presentation, or who stopped by to see what was going on. > One of the staff members said that because of our presentation, she > felt she could be more effective working with her blind students. > We talked to the students about techniques and strategies used to > succeed in college. We talked about electronic documents, scanning > print materials, hiring and using readers, and working with DSS. We > also gave a demonstration of a Victor reader Stream playing textbooks > from Recordings for the Blind and Dyslexic and Bookshare, as well as a > textbook that had been scanned and converted into a Microsoft Word > document. We talked about the importance of having good Braille > speeds, and a solid working knowledge of the blindness techniques and > technologies needed as a student. > We told the students about some of the opportunities available to them > through the NFB, the MAB, and the Student Division. We talked about > the NFB College Scholarship program, the MAB scholarship, the Bozeman > Chapter scholarship, and the NFB National Convention Scholarship for > first-time attendees. We talked about members of the Student Division > attending the national convention, the state convention, and > Washington Seminar. We talked about Camp Eureka, and about the NFB's > Youth Slam. We also talked about our training center experiences, and > talked about the Colorado Center for the Blind's high school and > college-prep programs. > After we spoke to the students for about an hour, pizza was delivered, > and as we ate, both students and staff used the time to talk to > members of the Student Division and ask questions. > Before we left, we gave the staff and students a CD-Rom that contained > useful information, links, brochures, applications, Student Division > contact info, and articles from the Braille Monitor. > I think our trip was a success and that this approach could be applied > successfully in larger towns with bigger school districts. > > >From Nebraska: > On March 26-28, the Nebraska Association of Blind Students will host > our second annual student Seminar. The seminar, entitled “Exploring > the Depths,” is aimed at helping students prepare for college. We are > pleased to welcome Eric Guillory, director of youth services at the > Louisiana Center for the Blind, who will talk about how to handle Math > and Science classes in high school and college. Other highlights will > include a panel on center training, hands-on demonstrations of > technology, and discussions of NFB philosophy. The seminar will also > offer blind students an opportunity to network and socialize. > If you are interested in attending the seminar, please contact Karen > Anderson at kea.anderson at gmail.com. > > Introducing the College Leadership Program: > >From Jason Ewell, who works at the NFB Department of Affiliate Action: > In 2009 the Affiliate Action Department developed the College > Leadership Program to provide an opportunity for promising young > college students to attend their first national convention and > Washington Seminar. Twenty-eight new Federationists attended the > convention in Detroit last summer. Twelve participated in our > Scholarship Alumni/College Leadership seminar in Baltimore in January. > They then went to Washington, D.C. to join the other members of their > state affiliate delegations on Capitol Hill. > After returning home, several sent notes expressing their appreciation > for the opportunity to attend and asking how they can get more > involved in Federation activities in their affiliates. One note, from > a college student who has been blind for only a year and who was > attending her first national event, demonstrates that this new, > exciting program is already helping to build the Federation. > > I thank you for the opportunity to come to Baltimore and Washington, > D.C. I cannot really put into words all that I learned and took away > from that trip. I was not sure before but now I know that NFB is where > I belong. > > If you or anyone you know would be a good candidate for this program, > please contact me at the National Center for the Blind at > 410-659-9314, Ext. 2509, or by email at Jewell at nfb.org. > > > > -- > Arielle Silverman > President, National Association of Blind Students > Phone: 602-502-2255 > Email: > nabs.president at gmail.com > Website: > www.nabslink.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/liamskitten%40gmail.com > From nabs.president at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 04:10:32 2010 From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 22:10:32 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Student Slate Attached Message-ID: <85ff10071003102010t58ec78bcrd1ebfb69e3e13eb5@mail.gmail.com> Hello again all, For some reason the Student Slate didn't come across in my last message. It should be attached to this one. Arielle On 3/10/10, Arielle Silverman wrote: > national Association of Blind Students > From the Desk of the President > March 10, 2010 > > In This Bulletin: > 1. Student Slate is Back! > 2. Last Chance to Apply for NFB Scholarships! > 3. Get Ready for Convention! > 4. Announcements > Check out the Student Slate! > Once again the NABS Slate committee has compiled an excellent > newsletter with several unique and useful articles of interest to > blind students! Please see the Spring 2010 issue of the Student Slate > attached to this email. Find out about the progress we made at > Washington Seminar, read about the experience of one of our top NFB > scholarship winners, and learn about your right to informed choice in > obtaining blindness training! > > Last Chance for NFB Scholarships: > The deadline for the NFB's national scholarship application is coming > up on March 31! > > Each year the National Federation of the Blind awards thirty > scholarships to legally blind college and graduate students across the > country. The scholarship includes a cash award ranging from $3000 to > $12000, plus a free trip to the NFB national convention and often a > piece of assistive technology such as a KNFB Reader Mobile. The > scholarship application for 2010 is now on the Web at > www.nfb.org/scholarships > It's not too late to submit your application! > > applications are due by March 31, 2010. > Already won a national NFB scholarship? You can apply again and > potentially win a second scholarship, also known as a TenBroek > fellowship. > In addition, many NFB affiliates offer scholarships to blind students. > You needn't be an active member of the NFB to win. Contact your NFB > state president for details. > > Get Ready for Convention! > > The following appeared in the latest issue of the Braille Monitor, the > monthly newsletter of the NFB: > > Dallas Site of 2010 NFB Convention > The 2010 convention of the National Federation of the Blind will take > place in Dallas, Texas, July 3-8, at the Hilton Anatole Hotel at 2201 > Stemmons Freeway, Dallas, Texas 75207. Make your room reservation as > soon as possible with the Hilton Anatole staff only. Call > (214) 761-7500 (214) 761-7500. > The 2010 room rates are singles, doubles, and twins $62 and triples > and quads $67 a night, plus a 15 percent sales tax. The hotel is > accepting reservations now. A $60-per-room deposit is required to make > a reservation. Fifty percent of the deposit will be refunded if notice > is given to the hotel of a reservation cancellation before June 1, > 2010. The other 50 percent is not refundable. > Rooms will be available on a first-come, first-served basis. > Reservations may be made before June 1, 2010, assuming that rooms are > still available. After that time the hotel will not hold our block of > rooms for the convention. In other words, you should get your > reservation in soon. > Guestroom amenities include cable television, coffee pot, iron and > ironing board, hair dryer, and high-speed Internet access. The Hilton > Anatole has several excellent restaurants, twenty-four-hour-a-day room > service, first-rate meeting space, and other top-notch facilities. It > is in downtown Dallas with shuttle service to both the Dallas/Ft. > Worth Airport and Love Field. > The schedule for the 2010 convention will follow that of last year: > Saturday, July 3 Seminar Day > Sunday, July 4 Registration Day > Monday, July 5 Board Meeting and Division Day > Tuesday, July 6 Opening Session > Wednesday, July 7 Business Session > Thursday, July 8 Banquet Day and Adjournment > > To pre-register for the convention, go to > www.nfb.org > We know that attending a national NFB convention can often exceed a > student’s budget. If you would like to attend the convention, talk to > your state president about potential funding. Many state affiliates > provide funding for their members to attend national conventions. > Additionally, the Kenneth Jernigan Fund provides convention > scholarships to first-time convention attendees. Talk to your state > president for details. > > State Division Announcements: > From Montana: > > The MAB's Student Division Goes to The Montana School for the Deaf and > Blind > by Jim Reed > On Friday, February 26th, 2010, the MAB's Student Division went to the > Montana School for the Deaf and Blind to talk to its Blind high school > students about college and being a blind college student. We met with > five students, and there were at least five staff members who stayed > for our full presentation, or who stopped by to see what was going on. > One of the staff members said that because of our presentation, she > felt she could be more effective working with her blind students. > We talked to the students about techniques and strategies used to > succeed in college. We talked about electronic documents, scanning > print materials, hiring and using readers, and working with DSS. We > also gave a demonstration of a Victor reader Stream playing textbooks > from Recordings for the Blind and Dyslexic and Bookshare, as well as a > textbook that had been scanned and converted into a Microsoft Word > document. We talked about the importance of having good Braille > speeds, and a solid working knowledge of the blindness techniques and > technologies needed as a student. > We told the students about some of the opportunities available to them > through the NFB, the MAB, and the Student Division. We talked about > the NFB College Scholarship program, the MAB scholarship, the Bozeman > Chapter scholarship, and the NFB National Convention Scholarship for > first-time attendees. We talked about members of the Student Division > attending the national convention, the state convention, and > Washington Seminar. We talked about Camp Eureka, and about the NFB's > Youth Slam. We also talked about our training center experiences, and > talked about the Colorado Center for the Blind's high school and > college-prep programs. > After we spoke to the students for about an hour, pizza was delivered, > and as we ate, both students and staff used the time to talk to > members of the Student Division and ask questions. > Before we left, we gave the staff and students a CD-Rom that contained > useful information, links, brochures, applications, Student Division > contact info, and articles from the Braille Monitor. > I think our trip was a success and that this approach could be applied > successfully in larger towns with bigger school districts. > > From Nebraska: > On March 26-28, the Nebraska Association of Blind Students will host > our second annual student Seminar. The seminar, entitled “Exploring > the Depths,” is aimed at helping students prepare for college. We are > pleased to welcome Eric Guillory, director of youth services at the > Louisiana Center for the Blind, who will talk about how to handle Math > and Science classes in high school and college. Other highlights will > include a panel on center training, hands-on demonstrations of > technology, and discussions of NFB philosophy. The seminar will also > offer blind students an opportunity to network and socialize. > If you are interested in attending the seminar, please contact Karen > Anderson at kea.anderson at gmail.com. > > Introducing the College Leadership Program: > From Jason Ewell, who works at the NFB Department of Affiliate Action: > In 2009 the Affiliate Action Department developed the College > Leadership Program to provide an opportunity for promising young > college students to attend their first national convention and > Washington Seminar. Twenty-eight new Federationists attended the > convention in Detroit last summer. Twelve participated in our > Scholarship Alumni/College Leadership seminar in Baltimore in January. > They then went to Washington, D.C. to join the other members of their > state affiliate delegations on Capitol Hill. > After returning home, several sent notes expressing their appreciation > for the opportunity to attend and asking how they can get more > involved in Federation activities in their affiliates. One note, from > a college student who has been blind for only a year and who was > attending her first national event, demonstrates that this new, > exciting program is already helping to build the Federation. > > I thank you for the opportunity to come to Baltimore and Washington, > D.C. I cannot really put into words all that I learned and took away > from that trip. I was not sure before but now I know that NFB is where > I belong. > > If you or anyone you know would be a good candidate for this program, > please contact me at the National Center for the Blind at > 410-659-9314, Ext. 2509, or by email at Jewell at nfb.org. > > > > -- > Arielle Silverman > President, National Association of Blind Students > Phone: 602-502-2255 > Email: > nabs.president at gmail.com > Website: > www.nabslink.org > -- Arielle Silverman President, National Association of Blind Students Phone: 602-502-2255 Email: nabs.president at gmail.com Website: www.nabslink.org -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Student Slate Spring 2010.doc Type: application/msword Size: 93184 bytes Desc: not available URL: From mikaelastevens at cableone.net Thu Mar 11 18:54:54 2010 From: mikaelastevens at cableone.net (Mikaela Stevens) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:54:54 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Email Message-ID: mikaelastevens at cableone.net From jj at bestmidi.com Thu Mar 11 19:40:13 2010 From: jj at bestmidi.com (J.J. Meddaugh) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:40:13 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Lots of Tech Items for Sale: VoiceNote, VoiceSense, braille printers, displays, etc. Message-ID: I have several items for sale currently. All are used but in great condition. Please send any questions about these items to jj at bestmidi.com. VoiceSense PDA with latest firmware, case, power supply, and shoulder strap $750 VoiceNote MPower with Keysoft 8.0 and latest Sendero GPS 6.2 $1,200 Braille Star 40 USB braille display, just cleaned by HandyTech, $1,000 Easylink braille keyboard. It's a bluetooth Perkins-style braille keyboard which can be used with your mobile phone software. $100 Index Everest braille sheetfed embosser. Version 8.2 of firmware. This model does not have USB or network ports. This unit prints but is a bit beat up cosmetically. $500 Metrologic MS6720 omnidirectional USB bar code scanner. use it with the BCScan.com website or other free sites which accept bar codes. $100 Nokia N75 cell phone. Locked to AT&T service and compatible with Talks or Mobile Speak. $75. Prices do not include shipping. I accept major credit cards, Paypal, and money orders. Thanks for reading. J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor From spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net Thu Mar 11 21:41:47 2010 From: spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net (Jen) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:41:47 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie Message-ID: <6FA19010D4E5420D887C06CAC6E2E700@HP31177120642> Hello All, My name is Jen. I am totally blind and have been since birth. I am studying to be a social worker at Saint Joseph College in West Hartford, Connecticut. I am a pianist and singer-song writer; writing songs is how I express what I cannot verbalize. I look forward to learning from all of you. From djdrocks4ever at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 22:41:16 2010 From: djdrocks4ever at gmail.com (David Dunphy) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 17:41:16 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie References: <6FA19010D4E5420D887C06CAC6E2E700@HP31177120642> Message-ID: <98AE109CF809451A834A82602896D3B5@radio360usa> Welcome to the list Jen. Great to meet you. ***** Tired of listening to the same old stations playing the same old songs over and over again? Then check out an internet radio station with plenty of interesting programming. Visit the home of Radio360 Where Variety Matters Most at http://www.radio360.us Check it out you won't be disappointed ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jen" To: "National Association of Blind Students" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 4:41 PM Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie > Hello All, > > My name is Jen. I am totally blind and have been since birth. I am > studying to be a social worker at Saint Joseph College in West Hartford, > Connecticut. I am a pianist and singer-song writer; writing songs is how > I express what I cannot verbalize. > > I look forward to learning from all of you. > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/djdrocks4ever%40gmail.com > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature database 4937 (20100311) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4937 (20100311) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com From serenacucco at verizon.net Thu Mar 11 23:01:14 2010 From: serenacucco at verizon.net (Serena) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 18:01:14 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie References: <6FA19010D4E5420D887C06CAC6E2E700@HP31177120642> Message-ID: <009201cac16e$c0482f80$0301a8c0@Serene> Hi Jenn, I'm Serena Cucco. I'm applying to Rutgers University in Newark, NJ to get my MSW. I really hope I get in! Serena ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jen" To: "National Association of Blind Students" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 4:41 PM Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie > Hello All, > > My name is Jen. I am totally blind and have been since birth. I am > studying to be a social worker at Saint Joseph College in West Hartford, > Connecticut. I am a pianist and singer-song writer; writing songs is how > I express what I cannot verbalize. > > I look forward to learning from all of you. > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizon.net From raniaismail04 at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 00:04:11 2010 From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania ) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 18:04:11 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie In-Reply-To: <6FA19010D4E5420D887C06CAC6E2E700@HP31177120642> Message-ID: <4b99770d.0e0db80a.71e3.2d50@mx.google.com> Hi Jen! Welcome to the list! My name is Rania, I am attending classes at Institute for Therapeutic Massage. I look forward to your posts. Feel free to join in! Rania, -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jen Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 3:42 PM To: National Association of Blind Students Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie Hello All, My name is Jen. I am totally blind and have been since birth. I am studying to be a social worker at Saint Joseph College in West Hartford, Connecticut. I am a pianist and singer-song writer; writing songs is how I express what I cannot verbalize. I look forward to learning from all of you. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai l.com No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2736 - Release Date: 03/11/10 01:33:00 From hope.paulos at maine.edu Thu Mar 11 23:26:50 2010 From: hope.paulos at maine.edu (Hope Paulos) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 18:26:50 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie References: <6FA19010D4E5420D887C06CAC6E2E700@HP31177120642> <009201cac16e$c0482f80$0301a8c0@Serene> Message-ID: Hello Jen!! Nice to have you on the list. My name is Hope Paulos and I've also been blind since birth. I graduated with 2 degrees: secondary education with a focus in Spanish, and modern languages concentrating in Spanish and German this past December. I plan to get my certification in assistive technology instruction then go on for my masters to become a teacher of the blind/visually impaired. I'm sure you'll find this list helpful and I look forward to hearing more from you. Hope Paulos and guide dog, Beignet ----- Original Message ----- From: "Serena" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 6:01 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Another Newbie > Hi Jenn, > > I'm Serena Cucco. I'm applying to Rutgers University in Newark, NJ to get > my MSW. I really hope I get in! > > Serena > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jen" > To: "National Association of Blind Students" > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 4:41 PM > Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie > > >> Hello All, >> >> My name is Jen. I am totally blind and have been since birth. I am >> studying to be a social worker at Saint Joseph College in West Hartford, >> Connecticut. I am a pianist and singer-song writer; writing songs is how >> I express what I cannot verbalize. >> >> I look forward to learning from all of you. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizon.net > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu From herekittykat2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 23:47:11 2010 From: herekittykat2 at gmail.com (Jewel S.) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 18:47:11 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie In-Reply-To: <4b99770d.0e0db80a.71e3.2d50@mx.google.com> References: <6FA19010D4E5420D887C06CAC6E2E700@HP31177120642> <4b99770d.0e0db80a.71e3.2d50@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <196c01b01003111547u73c3a625j6f9fd773339d2fe2@mail.gmail.com> Hello Jin! My name is Jewel. I will be attending community college in the fall toward an elementary education degree. Do you read Braille music? I am learning...slowly, but steadily. I know the quarter, half, and whole notes for C, D, E, F, and G. I haven't learned A or B yet, because it wasn't in the beginner book I got, but I did learn time signatures, whole rests, dotted half notes, and ties. The book I read was Braille music for Piano Beginners. I'm not really a piano beginner, as I learned some as a child, but I decided to read that one to learn Braille music from the beginning. I do love Braille music lots, and hope to start using it to play on my recorder and a friend's piano that needs to get some use since her daughter doesn't play anymore. ~Jewel On 3/11/10, Rania wrote: > Hi Jen! > Welcome to the list! > My name is Rania, > I am attending classes at Institute for Therapeutic Massage. > I look forward to your posts. > Feel free to join in! > Rania, > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of Jen > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 3:42 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students > Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie > > Hello All, > > My name is Jen. I am totally blind and have been since birth. I am studying > to be a social worker at Saint Joseph College in West Hartford, Connecticut. > I am a pianist and singer-song writer; writing songs is how I express what I > cannot verbalize. > > I look forward to learning from all of you. > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai > l.com > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2736 - Release Date: 03/11/10 > 01:33:00 > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat2%40gmail.com > From spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net Fri Mar 12 00:16:16 2010 From: spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net (Jen) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 19:16:16 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie Message-ID: Hey Everyone, Thanks for the great welcome! Serena, best of luck...I know you can do it! Hope, I took Spanish for eight years (fourth to twelfth grade), but since I haven't used it for a while, I have lost much of my fluency. Jewel, I don't know Braille music (tried to learn it once, but it proved impossible!) Instead, I learn music by ear / memory. It's hard to explain...if you want to know more, I can try to explain it off-list... Rania, I love your name! What is your last name? (I ask because I arrange people in my Address Book by last name to find them more easily.) From trillian551 at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 00:22:30 2010 From: trillian551 at gmail.com (Mary Fernandez) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 19:22:30 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie In-Reply-To: <4b99770d.0e0db80a.71e3.2d50@mx.google.com> References: <6FA19010D4E5420D887C06CAC6E2E700@HP31177120642> <4b99770d.0e0db80a.71e3.2d50@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Hey Je I'm Mary and I'm a sophomore at Emory University in Atlanta. I'm majoring in psychology and music. I'm a singer too! Welcome to the list! Mary On 3/11/10, Rania wrote: > Hi Jen! > Welcome to the list! > My name is Rania, > I am attending classes at Institute for Therapeutic Massage. > I look forward to your posts. > Feel free to join in! > Rania, > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of Jen > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 3:42 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students > Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie > > Hello All, > > My name is Jen. I am totally blind and have been since birth. I am studying > to be a social worker at Saint Joseph College in West Hartford, Connecticut. > I am a pianist and singer-song writer; writing songs is how I express what I > cannot verbalize. > > I look forward to learning from all of you. > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai > l.com > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2736 - Release Date: 03/11/10 > 01:33:00 > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/trillian551%40gmail.com > -- Mary Fernandez Emory University 2012 P.O. Box 123056 Atlanta Ga. 30322 Phone: 732-857-7004 In reaffirming the greatness of our nation, we understand that greatness is never a given. It must be earned. President Barack Obama From mikaelastevens at cableone.net Fri Mar 12 00:23:42 2010 From: mikaelastevens at cableone.net (Mikaela Stevens) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 17:23:42 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list Message-ID: Hello everyone, My name is Mikaela. I just joined the NABS mailing list, but I have been a member of NFB for about a year now. I received a scholarship from the NFB of Idaho last spring and realized what a great organization the NFB is and decided to join. Last summer I attended my first national convention, as well and had a great experience in Detroit. I met some of you there. You probably would remember me because I am a little person, also known as a dwarf, (along with my visual impairment). I stand just over three feet tall; for those of you who might be curious about my height--that is about the size of a three or four year old child. If anyone has any further questions for me about my condition, please do not hesitate to email me and I am happy to educate you. I am currently enrolled at BYU-Idaho, as a freshman, studying communications and vocal performance. I love anything to do with music: I have been singing for most of my life and I am currently learning to play piano. This will be my third year or so taking lessons, but I kept quitting so there were several years between. I play by ear and I know a little Braille music, however I don't really use it. I adore children and volunteer three times a week in three local kindergarten classes. I would love to teach kindergarten or first grade, but that is not the plan right now. Thank you for allowing me to join in your discussions! I'm looking so forward to meeting you all. Take care. Sincerely, Mikaela Stevens From raniaismail04 at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 01:49:32 2010 From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania ) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 19:49:32 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <4b998fbf.1090cc0a.18bc.2386@mx.google.com> Hi Welcome to the list. My name is Rania, I am attending classes at Institute For Therapeutic Massage. I look forward to reading more posts from you! Rania, -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mikaela Stevens Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 6:24 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list Hello everyone, My name is Mikaela. I just joined the NABS mailing list, but I have been a member of NFB for about a year now. I received a scholarship from the NFB of Idaho last spring and realized what a great organization the NFB is and decided to join. Last summer I attended my first national convention, as well and had a great experience in Detroit. I met some of you there. You probably would remember me because I am a little person, also known as a dwarf, (along with my visual impairment). I stand just over three feet tall; for those of you who might be curious about my height--that is about the size of a three or four year old child. If anyone has any further questions for me about my condition, please do not hesitate to email me and I am happy to educate you. I am currently enrolled at BYU-Idaho, as a freshman, studying communications and vocal performance. I love anything to do with music: I have been singing for most of my life and I am currently learning to play piano. This will be my third year or so taking lessons, but I kept quitting so there were several years between. I play by ear and I know a little Braille music, however I don't really use it. I adore children and volunteer three times a week in three local kindergarten classes. I would love to teach kindergarten or first grade, but that is not the plan right now. Thank you for allowing me to join in your discussions! I'm looking so forward to meeting you all. Take care. Sincerely, Mikaela Stevens _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai l.com No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2739 - Release Date: 03/11/10 15:50:00 From joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 00:55:10 2010 From: joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com (RJ Sandefur) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 19:55:10 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie References: <6FA19010D4E5420D887C06CAC6E2E700@HP31177120642><009201cac16e$c0482f80$0301a8c0@Serene> Message-ID: Hi Jen, I'm RJ Sandefur, I've also been blind since birth, and I'm going for my doctorate in theology with Andersonville theoloical seminary, where I recieved my masters degree in theology. My skype name is rj.sandefurg ----- Original Message ----- From: "Hope Paulos" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 6:26 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Another Newbie > Hello Jen!! Nice to have you on the list. My name is Hope Paulos and I've > also been blind since birth. I graduated with 2 degrees: secondary > education with a focus in Spanish, and modern languages concentrating in > Spanish and German this past December. I plan to get my certification in > assistive technology instruction then go on for my masters to become a > teacher of the blind/visually impaired. > I'm sure you'll find this list helpful and I look forward to hearing more > from you. > Hope Paulos and guide dog, Beignet > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Serena" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 6:01 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Another Newbie > > >> Hi Jenn, >> >> I'm Serena Cucco. I'm applying to Rutgers University in Newark, NJ to >> get my MSW. I really hope I get in! >> >> Serena >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Jen" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students" >> Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 4:41 PM >> Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie >> >> >>> Hello All, >>> >>> My name is Jen. I am totally blind and have been since birth. I am >>> studying to be a social worker at Saint Joseph College in West Hartford, >>> Connecticut. I am a pianist and singer-song writer; writing songs is how >>> I express what I cannot verbalize. >>> >>> I look forward to learning from all of you. >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizon.net >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com From joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 00:56:05 2010 From: joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com (RJ Sandefur) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 19:56:05 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie References: <6FA19010D4E5420D887C06CAC6E2E700@HP31177120642><009201cac16e$c0482f80$0301a8c0@Serene> Message-ID: Hope, didn't I see you on david's show the DJD invation? RJ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Hope Paulos" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 6:26 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Another Newbie > Hello Jen!! Nice to have you on the list. My name is Hope Paulos and I've > also been blind since birth. I graduated with 2 degrees: secondary > education with a focus in Spanish, and modern languages concentrating in > Spanish and German this past December. I plan to get my certification in > assistive technology instruction then go on for my masters to become a > teacher of the blind/visually impaired. > I'm sure you'll find this list helpful and I look forward to hearing more > from you. > Hope Paulos and guide dog, Beignet > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Serena" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 6:01 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Another Newbie > > >> Hi Jenn, >> >> I'm Serena Cucco. I'm applying to Rutgers University in Newark, NJ to >> get my MSW. I really hope I get in! >> >> Serena >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Jen" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students" >> Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 4:41 PM >> Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie >> >> >>> Hello All, >>> >>> My name is Jen. I am totally blind and have been since birth. I am >>> studying to be a social worker at Saint Joseph College in West Hartford, >>> Connecticut. I am a pianist and singer-song writer; writing songs is how >>> I express what I cannot verbalize. >>> >>> I look forward to learning from all of you. >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizon.net >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com From hope.paulos at maine.edu Fri Mar 12 00:59:47 2010 From: hope.paulos at maine.edu (Hope Paulos) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 19:59:47 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list References: Message-ID: <47073A0E04A5437E8BF49EF3365BCBE3@Hope> Welcome to the list, Mikaela!!! I hope you find it helpful and I'm sure you'll enjoy meeting new people on here. Hope and guide dog, Beignet ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mikaela Stevens" To: Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 7:23 PM Subject: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list > Hello everyone, > > > > My name is Mikaela. I just joined the NABS mailing list, but I have been a > member of NFB for about a year now. I received a scholarship from the NFB > of Idaho last spring and realized what a great organization the NFB is and > decided to join. Last summer I attended my first national convention, as > well and had a great experience in Detroit. I met some of you there. You > probably would remember me because I am a little person, also known as a > dwarf, (along with my visual impairment). I stand just over three feet > tall; for those of you who might be curious about my height--that is about > the size of a three or four year old child. If anyone has any further > questions for me about my condition, please do not hesitate to email me > and I am happy to educate you. > > > > I am currently enrolled at BYU-Idaho, as a freshman, studying > communications and vocal performance. I love anything to do with music: I > have been singing for most of my life and I am currently learning to play > piano. This will be my third year or so taking lessons, but I kept > quitting so there were several years between. I play by ear and I know a > little Braille music, however I don't really use it. I adore children and > volunteer three times a week in three local kindergarten classes. I would > love to teach kindergarten or first grade, but that is not the plan right > now. > > > > Thank you for allowing me to join in your discussions! I'm looking so > forward to meeting you all. Take care. > > > > Sincerely, > > Mikaela Stevens > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu From hope.paulos at maine.edu Fri Mar 12 01:54:05 2010 From: hope.paulos at maine.edu (Hope Paulos) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 20:54:05 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie References: <6FA19010D4E5420D887C06CAC6E2E700@HP31177120642><009201cac16e$c0482f80$0301a8c0@Serene> Message-ID: Yes. You did. ----- Original Message ----- From: "RJ Sandefur" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 7:56 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Another Newbie > Hope, didn't I see you on david's show the DJD invation? RJ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Hope Paulos" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 6:26 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Another Newbie > > >> Hello Jen!! Nice to have you on the list. My name is Hope Paulos and I've >> also been blind since birth. I graduated with 2 degrees: secondary >> education with a focus in Spanish, and modern languages concentrating in >> Spanish and German this past December. I plan to get my certification in >> assistive technology instruction then go on for my masters to become a >> teacher of the blind/visually impaired. >> I'm sure you'll find this list helpful and I look forward to hearing more >> from you. >> Hope Paulos and guide dog, Beignet >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Serena" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 6:01 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Another Newbie >> >> >>> Hi Jenn, >>> >>> I'm Serena Cucco. I'm applying to Rutgers University in Newark, NJ to >>> get my MSW. I really hope I get in! >>> >>> Serena >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Jen" >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students" >>> Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 4:41 PM >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie >>> >>> >>>> Hello All, >>>> >>>> My name is Jen. I am totally blind and have been since birth. I am >>>> studying to be a social worker at Saint Joseph College in West >>>> Hartford, >>>> Connecticut. I am a pianist and singer-song writer; writing songs is >>>> how >>>> I express what I cannot verbalize. >>>> >>>> I look forward to learning from all of you. >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizon.net >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu From oliver.doug1 at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 02:30:05 2010 From: oliver.doug1 at gmail.com (Doug Oliver) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 20:30:05 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie References: <6FA19010D4E5420D887C06CAC6E2E700@HP31177120642><4b99770d.0e0db80a.71e3.2d50@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <653CBA67D4E9433F9A4CFA3768CDCAE1@acer6e40e97492> welcome to all the new members! Take care, Doug ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mary Fernandez" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 6:22 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Another Newbie > Hey Je > I'm Mary and I'm a sophomore at Emory University in Atlanta. I'm > majoring in psychology and music. I'm a singer too! Welcome to the > list! > Mary > > > On 3/11/10, Rania wrote: >> Hi Jen! >> Welcome to the list! >> My name is Rania, >> I am attending classes at Institute for Therapeutic Massage. >> I look forward to your posts. >> Feel free to join in! >> Rania, >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of Jen >> Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 3:42 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students >> Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie >> >> Hello All, >> >> My name is Jen. I am totally blind and have been since birth. I am >> studying >> to be a social worker at Saint Joseph College in West Hartford, >> Connecticut. >> I am a pianist and singer-song writer; writing songs is how I express >> what I >> cannot verbalize. >> >> I look forward to learning from all of you. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai >> l.com >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >> Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2736 - Release Date: 03/11/10 >> 01:33:00 >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/trillian551%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Mary Fernandez > Emory University 2012 > P.O. Box 123056 > Atlanta Ga. > 30322 > Phone: 732-857-7004 > In reaffirming the greatness of our nation, we understand that > greatness is never a given. It must be earned. > President Barack Obama > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/oliver.doug1%40gmail.com From serenacucco at verizon.net Fri Mar 12 02:33:12 2010 From: serenacucco at verizon.net (Serena) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 21:33:12 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie References: Message-ID: <001301cac18c$5ce4c840$0301a8c0@Serene> Just wondering, do you use Facebook? Since we both wanna be social workers, I think we may have lots in common. Serena ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jen" To: "National Association of Blind Students" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 7:16 PM Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie > Hey Everyone, > > Thanks for the great welcome! > > Serena, best of luck...I know you can do it! > > Hope, I took Spanish for eight years (fourth to twelfth grade), but > since I haven't used it for a while, I have lost much of my fluency. > > Jewel, I don't know Braille music (tried to learn it once, but it proved > impossible!) Instead, I learn music by ear / memory. It's hard to > explain...if you want to know more, I can try to explain it off-list... > > Rania, I love your name! What is your last name? (I ask because I > arrange people in my Address Book by last name to find them more > easily.) > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizon.net From herekittykat2 at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 02:46:12 2010 From: herekittykat2 at gmail.com (Jewel S.) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 21:46:12 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list In-Reply-To: <47073A0E04A5437E8BF49EF3365BCBE3@Hope> References: <47073A0E04A5437E8BF49EF3365BCBE3@Hope> Message-ID: <196c01b01003111846g77c56e07r44edc5b483c028ff@mail.gmail.com> Hey Mikayla! Welcome to the group. You sound like a really busy person! My name is Jewel. I live in North Carolina, and will be studying elementary education toward a career as a teacher of the blind. I know a bit of Braille music myself, but have never been able to play by ear. I just suck at playing by ear, and admire people who can do it. Hope you enjoy the list, Jewel On 3/11/10, Hope Paulos wrote: > Welcome to the list, Mikaela!!! I hope you find it helpful and I'm sure > you'll enjoy meeting new people on here. > Hope and guide dog, Beignet > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mikaela Stevens" > To: > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 7:23 PM > Subject: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list > > >> Hello everyone, >> >> >> >> My name is Mikaela. I just joined the NABS mailing list, but I have been a >> >> member of NFB for about a year now. I received a scholarship from the NFB >> of Idaho last spring and realized what a great organization the NFB is and >> >> decided to join. Last summer I attended my first national convention, as >> well and had a great experience in Detroit. I met some of you there. You >> probably would remember me because I am a little person, also known as a >> dwarf, (along with my visual impairment). I stand just over three feet >> tall; for those of you who might be curious about my height--that is about >> >> the size of a three or four year old child. If anyone has any further >> questions for me about my condition, please do not hesitate to email me >> and I am happy to educate you. >> >> >> >> I am currently enrolled at BYU-Idaho, as a freshman, studying >> communications and vocal performance. I love anything to do with music: I >> have been singing for most of my life and I am currently learning to play >> piano. This will be my third year or so taking lessons, but I kept >> quitting so there were several years between. I play by ear and I know a >> little Braille music, however I don't really use it. I adore children and >> volunteer three times a week in three local kindergarten classes. I would >> love to teach kindergarten or first grade, but that is not the plan right >> now. >> >> >> >> Thank you for allowing me to join in your discussions! I'm looking so >> forward to meeting you all. Take care. >> >> >> >> Sincerely, >> >> Mikaela Stevens >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat2%40gmail.com > From ccook01 at knology.net Fri Mar 12 03:13:15 2010 From: ccook01 at knology.net (Corey Cook) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 22:13:15 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <231ACEEC8E8A4E09956A8BBEE0E904AD@coreyPC> welcome to the list -------------------------------------------------- From: "Mikaela Stevens" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 7:23 PM To: Subject: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list > Hello everyone, > > > > My name is Mikaela. I just joined the NABS mailing list, but I have been a > member of NFB for about a year now. I received a scholarship from the NFB > of Idaho last spring and realized what a great organization the NFB is and > decided to join. Last summer I attended my first national convention, as > well and had a great experience in Detroit. I met some of you there. You > probably would remember me because I am a little person, also known as a > dwarf, (along with my visual impairment). I stand just over three feet > tall; for those of you who might be curious about my height--that is about > the size of a three or four year old child. If anyone has any further > questions for me about my condition, please do not hesitate to email me > and I am happy to educate you. > > > > I am currently enrolled at BYU-Idaho, as a freshman, studying > communications and vocal performance. I love anything to do with music: I > have been singing for most of my life and I am currently learning to play > piano. This will be my third year or so taking lessons, but I kept > quitting so there were several years between. I play by ear and I know a > little Braille music, however I don't really use it. I adore children and > volunteer three times a week in three local kindergarten classes. I would > love to teach kindergarten or first grade, but that is not the plan right > now. > > > > Thank you for allowing me to join in your discussions! I'm looking so > forward to meeting you all. Take care. > > > > Sincerely, > > Mikaela Stevens > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ccook01%40knology.net > > From claudia.perry117 at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 03:41:26 2010 From: claudia.perry117 at gmail.com (Claudia Perry) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 22:41:26 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie In-Reply-To: References: <6FA19010D4E5420D887C06CAC6E2E700@HP31177120642> <009201cac16e$c0482f80$0301a8c0@Serene> Message-ID: <325b1af31003111941i24b45085o3d3051366d588591@mail.gmail.com> Hi Jen - I would love to learn how you learned to play the piano. I absolutely love music and have always wanted to learn to play the piano. I am legally blind and have only light perception...Could you give me pointers on how you accomplished this? Thanks, Claudia Perry On 3/11/10, Hope Paulos wrote: > Yes. You did. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "RJ Sandefur" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 7:56 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Another Newbie > > >> Hope, didn't I see you on david's show the DJD invation? RJ >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Hope Paulos" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 6:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Another Newbie >> >> >>> Hello Jen!! Nice to have you on the list. My name is Hope Paulos and I've >>> >>> also been blind since birth. I graduated with 2 degrees: secondary >>> education with a focus in Spanish, and modern languages concentrating in >>> Spanish and German this past December. I plan to get my certification in >>> assistive technology instruction then go on for my masters to become a >>> teacher of the blind/visually impaired. >>> I'm sure you'll find this list helpful and I look forward to hearing more >>> >>> from you. >>> Hope Paulos and guide dog, Beignet >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Serena" >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> >>> Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 6:01 PM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Another Newbie >>> >>> >>>> Hi Jenn, >>>> >>>> I'm Serena Cucco. I'm applying to Rutgers University in Newark, NJ to >>>> get my MSW. I really hope I get in! >>>> >>>> Serena >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Jen" >>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students" >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 4:41 PM >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie >>>> >>>> >>>>> Hello All, >>>>> >>>>> My name is Jen. I am totally blind and have been since birth. I am >>>>> studying to be a social worker at Saint Joseph College in West >>>>> Hartford, >>>>> Connecticut. I am a pianist and singer-song writer; writing songs is >>>>> how >>>>> I express what I cannot verbalize. >>>>> >>>>> I look forward to learning from all of you. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizon.net >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry117%40gmail.com > From joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 03:54:00 2010 From: joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com (RJ Sandefur) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 22:54:00 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie References: <6FA19010D4E5420D887C06CAC6E2E700@HP31177120642><009201cac16e$c0482f80$0301a8c0@Serene> Message-ID: <3C7521A4E2C1494FBFC87A1DB03E760F@hometwxakonvzn> You can reach me on skype at rj.sandefur I'm going to be doing a show called more to life. Sunday's from 2P.m. until 6P.M. RJ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Hope Paulos" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 8:54 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Another Newbie > Yes. You did. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "RJ Sandefur" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 7:56 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Another Newbie > > >> Hope, didn't I see you on david's show the DJD invation? RJ >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Hope Paulos" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 6:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Another Newbie >> >> >>> Hello Jen!! Nice to have you on the list. My name is Hope Paulos and >>> I've also been blind since birth. I graduated with 2 degrees: secondary >>> education with a focus in Spanish, and modern languages concentrating in >>> Spanish and German this past December. I plan to get my certification in >>> assistive technology instruction then go on for my masters to become a >>> teacher of the blind/visually impaired. >>> I'm sure you'll find this list helpful and I look forward to hearing >>> more from you. >>> Hope Paulos and guide dog, Beignet >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Serena" >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> >>> Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 6:01 PM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Another Newbie >>> >>> >>>> Hi Jenn, >>>> >>>> I'm Serena Cucco. I'm applying to Rutgers University in Newark, NJ to >>>> get my MSW. I really hope I get in! >>>> >>>> Serena >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Jen" >>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students" >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 4:41 PM >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie >>>> >>>> >>>>> Hello All, >>>>> >>>>> My name is Jen. I am totally blind and have been since birth. I am >>>>> studying to be a social worker at Saint Joseph College in West >>>>> Hartford, >>>>> Connecticut. I am a pianist and singer-song writer; writing songs is >>>>> how >>>>> I express what I cannot verbalize. >>>>> >>>>> I look forward to learning from all of you. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizon.net >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com From dandrews at visi.com Fri Mar 12 03:59:49 2010 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 21:59:49 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Less Than A Month Remains! Message-ID: Individuals and organizations who are making significant contributions in helping to change what it means to be blind are encouraged to apply for the Dr. Jacob Bolotin Award presented by the National Federation of the Blind. Nominations and letters of support should be completed online by March 31 and winners will be notified by May 15. For consideration, nominees must live and work in the United States. The Federation will award $50,000 this year to recognize and support individuals and organizations who share and live the philosophy of the National Federation of the Blind and Dr. Bolotin. For further details, to nominate an individual or organization, or to support a nomination which has already been made, go to http://www.nfb.org/nfb/Bolotin_Award.asp __________________________ Megan Wills Technical Administrative Assistant National Federation of the Blind 200 East Wells Street at Jernigan Place Baltimore, MD 21230 P: 410-659-9314 x2461 F: 410-685-5653 E: mwills at nfb.org __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 4934 (20100311) __________ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com From kolbygarrison at triad.rr.com Fri Mar 12 05:12:27 2010 From: kolbygarrison at triad.rr.com (Kolby Garrison) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 00:12:27 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie In-Reply-To: References: <6FA19010D4E5420D887C06CAC6E2E700@HP31177120642> <4b99770d.0e0db80a.71e3.2d50@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <021c01cac1a2$9bf926a0$d3eb73e0$@rr.com> Hello Jen, Welcome to the list. My name is Kolby, and I am pursuing my undergraduate degree in communication studies. Music is one of my passions though. Like you, I am a singer songwriter. Kolby From spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net Fri Mar 12 05:24:58 2010 From: spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net (Jen) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 00:24:58 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie References: <001301cac18c$5ce4c840$0301a8c0@Serene> Message-ID: <78751F5ACB92447EB66C4CB2A07A2092@HP31177120642> I don't use any social networking sites. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Serena" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:33 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Another Newbie Just wondering, do you use Facebook? Since we both want to be social workers, I think we may have lots in common. Serena ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jen" To: "National Association of Blind Students" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 7:16 PM Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie > Hey Everyone, > > Thanks for the great welcome! > > Serena, best of luck...I know you can do it! > > Hope, I took Spanish for eight years (fourth to twelfth grade), but > since I haven't used it for a while, I have lost much of my fluency. > > Jewel, I don't know Braille music (tried to learn it once, but it > proved > impossible!) Instead, I learn music by ear / memory. It's hard to > explain...if you want to know more, I can try to explain it > off-list... > > Rania, I love your name! What is your last name? (I ask because I > arrange people in my Address Book by last name to find them more > easily.) > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizon.net _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/spiderweb1%40sbcglobal.net From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 06:53:47 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 22:53:47 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list In-Reply-To: <231ACEEC8E8A4E09956A8BBEE0E904AD@coreyPC> References: <231ACEEC8E8A4E09956A8BBEE0E904AD@coreyPC> Message-ID: <409c235c1003112253y1299ffbfs176788db8474ebba@mail.gmail.com> hello Mikaela and welcome to the List! My Name is Darian, I am a student from San Francisco, California and I am studying at City College of San francisco. I am working on my general education classes and am looking to transfer, with an eye on teaching Orientation and Mobility. I would like to be able to work with Deaf-blind, dog guide teams and as much of the spectrum of individuals who can benifit from the increased confidence andquality of life that independent travel brings. during my free time, I like to go to sporting events, travel, DJ and just generally be pretty active when I can. I also am a board member of the national association of blind students and co-chair of our membership committee. The committee puts on monthly conference calls that have different feature topics each month and are open to all. On behalf of the committee, i would like to extend an invitation to you and anyone else who wants in on the action :). Should you have any questions about anything on this list; just ask, we all are more than willing to help our and answer what we can how we can. We also are excited to hear from you and your expiriences as a blind person. Thanks so much and welcome to the National associations of Blind students and our list serve! Best, Darian On 3/11/10, Corey Cook wrote: > welcome to the list > > > -------------------------------------------------- > From: "Mikaela Stevens" > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 7:23 PM > To: > Subject: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list > >> Hello everyone, >> >> >> >> My name is Mikaela. I just joined the NABS mailing list, but I have been a >> >> member of NFB for about a year now. I received a scholarship from the NFB >> of Idaho last spring and realized what a great organization the NFB is and >> >> decided to join. Last summer I attended my first national convention, as >> well and had a great experience in Detroit. I met some of you there. You >> probably would remember me because I am a little person, also known as a >> dwarf, (along with my visual impairment). I stand just over three feet >> tall; for those of you who might be curious about my height--that is about >> >> the size of a three or four year old child. If anyone has any further >> questions for me about my condition, please do not hesitate to email me >> and I am happy to educate you. >> >> >> >> I am currently enrolled at BYU-Idaho, as a freshman, studying >> communications and vocal performance. I love anything to do with music: I >> have been singing for most of my life and I am currently learning to play >> piano. This will be my third year or so taking lessons, but I kept >> quitting so there were several years between. I play by ear and I know a >> little Braille music, however I don't really use it. I adore children and >> volunteer three times a week in three local kindergarten classes. I would >> love to teach kindergarten or first grade, but that is not the plan right >> now. >> >> >> >> Thank you for allowing me to join in your discussions! I'm looking so >> forward to meeting you all. Take care. >> >> >> >> Sincerely, >> >> Mikaela Stevens >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ccook01%40knology.net >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 07:31:44 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 23:31:44 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie In-Reply-To: <021c01cac1a2$9bf926a0$d3eb73e0$@rr.com> References: <6FA19010D4E5420D887C06CAC6E2E700@HP31177120642> <4b99770d.0e0db80a.71e3.2d50@mx.google.com> <021c01cac1a2$9bf926a0$d3eb73e0$@rr.com> Message-ID: <409c235c1003112331j34365155o810ed6c1cc4534a5@mail.gmail.com> Greetings Jen, Welcome to the list! My name is Darian. I am a student in San Francisco at a community college here. I am studying my general eds to one day (whenever I grow up) :) become an Orientation and Mobility instructor. I enjoy Music but rather than write/sing (a talent I admire to be sure) IDJ. i also enjoy very much sports and one of my favorite things to do during the stretch of April- September is go to a baseball game or three (they have the best garlic fries!) heer at at&T park. I like to travel to new places and check out new portions of Familiar places. I also am a board member of the national association of blind students and serve as the co-chair of our membership committee. Each month the committee puts togethera conference call where interested individuals can contribute to a discussion on whatever the topic of interest to blind students might be at the time. We hope that you will check out these calls as well as all of the great events going on within your state division and on the national level. Nationally we all meet twice a year; once at our Washington legislative seminar in Janurary (Washington D.C.) and our national convention during our student seminar/business meeting and various other exciting national events (This year to take place in Dallas Texas). If you should have any questions you may contact me and you may also ask anybody on this listserve! Again, a huge welcome to you! Best, Darian On 3/11/10, Kolby Garrison wrote: > Hello Jen, > Welcome to the list. My name is Kolby, and I am pursuing my undergraduate > degree in communication studies. Music is one of my passions though. Like > you, I am a singer songwriter. > Kolby > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From djdrocks4ever at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 14:46:44 2010 From: djdrocks4ever at gmail.com (David Dunphy) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 09:46:44 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie References: <6FA19010D4E5420D887C06CAC6E2E700@HP31177120642> <4b99770d.0e0db80a.71e3.2d50@mx.google.com> <021c01cac1a2$9bf926a0$d3eb73e0$@rr.com> Message-ID: <6A44710CB8544A29B57D8131832BA950@radio360usa> That's awesome Jen that you like music so much. What kind of songs do you like to sing/perform? Welcome to the list. >From David ***** Tired of listening to the same old stations playing the same old songs over and over again? Then check out an internet radio station with plenty of interesting programming. Visit the home of Radio360 Where Variety Matters Most at http://www.radio360.us Check it out you won't be disappointed ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kolby Garrison" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 12:12 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Another Newbie > Hello Jen, > Welcome to the list. My name is Kolby, and I am pursuing my undergraduate > degree in communication studies. Music is one of my passions though. Like > you, I am a singer songwriter. > Kolby > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/djdrocks4ever%40gmail.com > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature database 4938 (20100312) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4938 (20100312) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com From spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net Fri Mar 12 16:26:26 2010 From: spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net (Jen) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 11:26:26 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list References: <231ACEEC8E8A4E09956A8BBEE0E904AD@coreyPC> <409c235c1003112253y1299ffbfs176788db8474ebba@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Good morning, Michaela, Welcome to the list! My name is Jen. I live in Connecticut and am studying to be a social worker at Saint Joseph College. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Darian Smith" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 1:53 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list hello Mikaela and welcome to the List! My Name is Darian, I am a student from San Francisco, California and I am studying at City College of San francisco. I am working on my general education classes and am looking to transfer, with an eye on teaching Orientation and Mobility. I would like to be able to work with Deaf-blind, dog guide teams and as much of the spectrum of individuals who can benifit from the increased confidence andquality of life that independent travel brings. during my free time, I like to go to sporting events, travel, DJ and just generally be pretty active when I can. I also am a board member of the national association of blind students and co-chair of our membership committee. The committee puts on monthly conference calls that have different feature topics each month and are open to all. On behalf of the committee, i would like to extend an invitation to you and anyone else who wants in on the action :). Should you have any questions about anything on this list; just ask, we all are more than willing to help our and answer what we can how we can. We also are excited to hear from you and your expiriences as a blind person. Thanks so much and welcome to the National associations of Blind students and our list serve! Best, Darian On 3/11/10, Corey Cook wrote: > welcome to the list > > > -------------------------------------------------- > From: "Mikaela Stevens" > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 7:23 PM > To: > Subject: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list > >> Hello everyone, >> >> >> >> My name is Mikaela. I just joined the NABS mailing list, but I have >> been a >> >> member of NFB for about a year now. I received a scholarship from the >> NFB >> of Idaho last spring and realized what a great organization the NFB >> is and >> >> decided to join. Last summer I attended my first national convention, >> as >> well and had a great experience in Detroit. I met some of you there. >> You >> probably would remember me because I am a little person, also known >> as a >> dwarf, (along with my visual impairment). I stand just over three >> feet >> tall; for those of you who might be curious about my height--that is >> about >> >> the size of a three or four year old child. If anyone has any further >> questions for me about my condition, please do not hesitate to email >> me >> and I am happy to educate you. >> >> >> >> I am currently enrolled at BYU-Idaho, as a freshman, studying >> communications and vocal performance. I love anything to do with >> music: I >> have been singing for most of my life and I am currently learning to >> play >> piano. This will be my third year or so taking lessons, but I kept >> quitting so there were several years between. I play by ear and I >> know a >> little Braille music, however I don't really use it. I adore children >> and >> volunteer three times a week in three local kindergarten classes. I >> would >> love to teach kindergarten or first grade, but that is not the plan >> right >> now. >> >> >> >> Thank you for allowing me to join in your discussions! I'm looking so >> forward to meeting you all. Take care. >> >> >> >> Sincerely, >> >> Mikaela Stevens >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ccook01%40knology.net >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/spiderweb1%40sbcglobal.net From spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net Fri Mar 12 16:47:10 2010 From: spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net (Jen) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 11:47:10 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Reply to David Message-ID: <52E88E3765864C14B9AC00852E9C8AED@HP31177120642> Hi David / All, My songs are a mix of genres (classical, pop and rock.) They are about my personal experiences which I turn into universal messages. If anyone wants to hear my songs, please reply, and I will send them to the list. They will come in Windows Media Player format. From spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net Fri Mar 12 17:01:12 2010 From: spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net (Jen) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 12:01:12 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] For Classical Music Lovers - Ten-Year-Old Girl Plays Mozart Message-ID: This is Aimi Kobayashi, a ten-year-old Japanese girl, playing Mozart's Piano Concerto 26. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=32gsiqbjbk8 From joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 17:19:57 2010 From: joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com (RJ Sandefur) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 12:19:57 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Reply to David References: <52E88E3765864C14B9AC00852E9C8AED@HP31177120642> Message-ID: Gen, Do you have skype? There's another singer I'd like for you to meet. Her name is Beth. RJ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jen" To: "National Association of Blind Students" Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 11:47 AM Subject: [nabs-l] Reply to David > Hi David / All, > > My songs are a mix of genres (classical, pop and rock.) They are about > my personal experiences which I turn into universal messages. If anyone > wants to hear my songs, please reply, and I will send them to the list. > They will come in Windows Media Player format. > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com From joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 17:24:54 2010 From: joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com (RJ Sandefur) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 12:24:54 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Reply to David References: <52E88E3765864C14B9AC00852E9C8AED@HP31177120642> Message-ID: <5F5206381B8F4C5084843896544E7138@hometwxakonvzn> I'd like to hear some of your music. RJ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jen" To: "National Association of Blind Students" Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 11:47 AM Subject: [nabs-l] Reply to David > Hi David / All, > > My songs are a mix of genres (classical, pop and rock.) They are about > my personal experiences which I turn into universal messages. If anyone > wants to hear my songs, please reply, and I will send them to the list. > They will come in Windows Media Player format. > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com From spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net Fri Mar 12 17:30:00 2010 From: spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net (Jen) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 12:30:00 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Reply to David References: <52E88E3765864C14B9AC00852E9C8AED@HP31177120642> Message-ID: <6B91EA82287F4540BB354C9612B9786D@HP31177120642> I don't have Skype. ----- Original Message ----- From: "RJ Sandefur" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 12:19 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Reply to David Gen, Do you have skype? There's another singer I'd like for you to meet. Her name is Beth. RJ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jen" To: "National Association of Blind Students" Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 11:47 AM Subject: [nabs-l] Reply to David > Hi David / All, > > My songs are a mix of genres (classical, pop and rock.) They are about > my personal experiences which I turn into universal messages. If > anyone > wants to hear my songs, please reply, and I will send them to the > list. > They will come in Windows Media Player format. > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/spiderweb1%40sbcglobal.net From spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net Fri Mar 12 17:36:46 2010 From: spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net (Jen) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 12:36:46 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Location of this year's national convention? Message-ID: <06F64B6E6C394C6DB2145414996C3FE5@HP31177120642> Does anyone know where this year's national convention will take place? From spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net Fri Mar 12 17:41:24 2010 From: spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net (Jen) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 12:41:24 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] What screen readers do you use? Message-ID: <2A3B4FA8DEB849E89759071F8DCB6F9E@HP31177120642> Hi Guys, I'm just curious...what screen reader do you use? I use JAWS 8 with Windows XP. I like JAWS 8 very much, especially the Dictionary Manager (I have to have the synthesizer speak words the way I want them pronounced (don't pronounce "Mister" as "M R.") From jj at bestmidi.com Fri Mar 12 17:46:19 2010 From: jj at bestmidi.com (J.J. Meddaugh) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 12:46:19 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] iBill Money Identifier in Stock at A T Guys Message-ID: Hello. This is just a quick note to let you know that A T Guys now has stock of the much talked about iBill Portable Money Identifier. This item will fit in your pocket and identifies all current U.S. currency. We currently have the iBill in stock and are shipping as soon as orders are received. We do have a limited supply, so get yours today before we sell out. Please visit http://www.ATGuys.com to place an order or to ask questions. We accept all major credit cards, Paypal, and Google Checkout as well as money orders. Thanks for reading. J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor From spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net Fri Mar 12 17:55:06 2010 From: spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net (Jen) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 12:55:06 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] "First Step" Message-ID: <49950775837141C9B729A3354A491C23@HP31177120642> This is my first song I ever wrote. I wrote this at age twelve, when I had my heart broken for the first time. A good male friend (we were never boyfriend / girlfriend) dumped me when he got accepted into the popular group. More songs are coming. I can only send one song at a time though. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: First Step.wma Type: audio/x-ms-wma Size: 7528251 bytes Desc: not available URL: From spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net Fri Mar 12 18:03:35 2010 From: spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net (Jen) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 13:03:35 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] "I Can See You're Blind" Message-ID: <3A0B3E4190DD44E5AD035D2F6561768B@HP31177120642> I wrote this song to a professor who discriminated against me because of my blindness. During my first semester at community college, this person made fun of the sound of my BrailleNote, saying it drove him crazy. (The professor's excuse was he had a bad day.) Did I mention this occurred in front of the class? So once I recovered from my shock, I wrote this song to say what I could not at the time. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: I Can See You're Blind.wma Type: audio/x-ms-wma Size: 5318119 bytes Desc: not available URL: From jkenn337 at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 18:17:41 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 13:17:41 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] another newby Message-ID: Hi I'm applying to capella niversity www.capella.edu online college to get my bachelers in information technology. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. From jkenn337 at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 18:19:05 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 13:19:05 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] foreign language Message-ID: <228CEB95DA3E46E09D5802983BBCC778@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Hi did you get braille materials when you studdied spanish and german? or did you have a reader both in and out of classes? Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. From jkenn337 at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 18:20:39 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 13:20:39 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] newby on list Message-ID: <96A69EC939B24B0ABE60C4F02B781DB4@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Hi I am married, my wife is blind and our son is three years old and sighted. we plan to home-school him. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. From jkenn337 at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 18:22:26 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 13:22:26 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] job goals Message-ID: Hi I want to work in technical support, comuter troubleshooting, computr sales or an apple specialist or assistive technology trainer whatever I can get. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. From jkenn337 at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 18:25:34 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 13:25:34 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] screen readers Message-ID: <8423D6DBCBF54F3CB14FE5500ED6F44C@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Hi I use a jaws11 demo but my favorite and most used screen readers are system access, and NVD and orca with knoppix adriane Linux. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. From jkenn337 at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 18:24:42 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 13:24:42 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] loadstone gps Message-ID: <8D3A15AFA95F441B89ABA37314FAF662@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Hi I also use the free open source loadstone gps as a navigational aid, I find it very useful it runs on my unlocked nokia e51 phone. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. From jkenn337 at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 18:30:59 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 13:30:59 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] screen readers Message-ID: Hi I think that NVDA and system access can do some things better than jaws and window-eyes. Orca is good also and for those who can afford macs they're good also. I want to get an ipod touch when I have the money. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. From jkenn337 at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 18:33:45 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 13:33:45 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] I can see you're blind Message-ID: <869F40BB6A504857BB1E8DEDAE626D78@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> hi and did the professor ever hear the song? if it were me I would have confronted the professor directly on the issue. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. From jkenn337 at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 18:37:50 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 13:37:50 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] icelandic language Message-ID: <39AF5739AC684DB690F2672987D50430@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> hi does anyone know the braille code for writing the icelandic language? Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. From jkenn337 at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 18:41:00 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 13:41:00 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] loadstone-gps and stuff Message-ID: <62537C4A9FBB479B87FFECAEC1201408@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Hi hey guys if you want a cheap talking phone go on ebay and get the nokia 6682 or nokia n82. a nice cheap accessible reader for your phone is the beyo cbs reader $118. loadstone-gps is free. and if you want phone service go to www.mrsimcard.com and you can get prepaid sim cards for your talking phone there. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. From alberto.2500 at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 19:43:23 2010 From: alberto.2500 at gmail.com (Alberto Arreola) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 12:43:23 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Reply to David In-Reply-To: <52E88E3765864C14B9AC00852E9C8AED@HP31177120642> References: <52E88E3765864C14B9AC00852E9C8AED@HP31177120642> Message-ID: <4b9a995d.9413f30a.3edd.7723@mx.google.com> Lets check them out. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jen Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 9:47 AM To: National Association of Blind Students Subject: [nabs-l] Reply to David Hi David / All, My songs are a mix of genres (classical, pop and rock.) They are about my personal experiences which I turn into universal messages. If anyone wants to hear my songs, please reply, and I will send them to the list. They will come in Windows Media Player format. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail .com From jkenn337 at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 20:48:40 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 15:48:40 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] foreign language References: <228CEB95DA3E46E09D5802983BBCC778@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> <6879284A7A9542AE8AF74AB30D52C98E@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> <14FC1B8B62F94FBCB4C861BEDA2AF93C@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Message-ID: Hi There is an older unsupported Icelandic synthesizer called infovox230. there is also a free one that comes with NVDA called ESpeak and ESpeak can read Icelandic. By the way is there anyone on this list who can add Irish Gaelic language to ESpeak? Josh Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. ----- Original Message ----- From: Hope Paulos To: Josh Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 3:38 PM Subject: Re: foreign language how'd you read them? Do they have an islandic speech synthesizer? ----- Original Message ----- From: Josh To: Hope Paulos Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 3:33 PM Subject: Re: foreign language yes I am interested in learning foreign languages. but I'm not interested in them as in getting a degree, but I just want to get books and learn them onmy own time. I scanned in several teach yourself books for languages like icelandic and finnish. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. ----- Original Message ----- From: Hope Paulos To: Josh Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 2:55 PM Subject: Re: foreign language The University provided me the textbooks in .doc format. I went to the bookstore and purchased them. Then took them to the disability support services office and had them remove the bindings and scan them for me. Are you interested in learning foreign languages? Hope and Beignet ----- Original Message ----- From: Josh To: Hope Paulos Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 2:18 PM Subject: Re: foreign language how did you get your textbooks? what format did they come in, or did you have to scan them? Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. ----- Original Message ----- From: Hope Paulos To: Josh Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 1:56 PM Subject: Re: foreign language I used a braille note and received texts in .doc format to study Spanish and German. I did the tests the same way. Teacher would send me the tests ahead of time because they trusted that I wouldn't cheat and I took them in the same room with the class. If I needed extra time, teachers would allow me to take them home. Again, they knew me really well it's a small university that I attended. HTH. Hope and Beignet ----- Original Message ----- From: Josh To: hope.paulos at maine.edu Cc: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 1:19 PM Subject: foreign language Hi did you get braille materials when you studdied spanish and german? or did you have a reader both in and out of classes? Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. From jkenn337 at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 20:56:13 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 15:56:13 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] foreign language References: <228CEB95DA3E46E09D5802983BBCC778@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> <6879284A7A9542AE8AF74AB30D52C98E@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> <14FC1B8B62F94FBCB4C861BEDA2AF93C@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Message-ID: <1721AD06BC504DFB8F2559293AD1721E@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Have you ever seen Icelandic before? it is a very interesting language! the icelandic people are genetically 60% Irish and the language sounds kind of like Irish, somewhat. Here is a sample of Icelandic. Icelaandic is very old, just like Finnish it has not changed much if at all since the 10th century or sso. Halló til allra sem blindir búa í Írland Ísland arabíska tal ríkjum Íran, og Finnland og Noregur! Mig langar að segja þér um Klango. Klango er raunverulegur samfélag blinda og sést fólk. Eru útvarpsstöðvum, einkapóst, hópar, huga að taka, mennta stærðfræði og algebra verkfæri, leikir og fleira! Ef þú vilt skrá þig fyrir klango en þörf hjálpa þú geta hátta the website: www.translate.google.com í kassi tegund http://www.klango.net og viðbót verður þýdd úr frummálinu sínu í eigin tungumál! Vissir þú að ef þú getur ekki efni á Jaws skjár lesandi hugbúnaður program, there er a frjáls skjár lesandi hugbúnaður program? Það er kallað NVDA. Það stendur fyrir utan sjónræn skrifborð aðgang. Það er ókeypis! Hægt er að sækja hann með því að fara til the website www.nvda-project.org. Vinsamlega bæta íslenska tungu sem ESpeak talgerfillName og einnig bæta við Færeyska og Írska Gaelic tungumál ESpeak. Svo vinsamlega ef þú ert að lesa þetta mundu að þú þarft ekki að borga fyrir skjá lesandi eða Klango! NVDA og Klango er frjáls frjáls frjáls! Svo fara fá þá fara sækja þá! Og vinsamlegast hjálpa til að bæta við tungumál ESpeak! Ef þú vilt ókeypis stýrikerfi og vilt ekki að nota Windows frá Microsoft: þú getur notað Vinux eða Knoppix-Adriane getur þú notað Google til að leita að þessum stýrikerfum! Þeir líka eru ókeypis! Ég vona að þú njótir þá eins mikið og ég hef. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. ----- Original Message ----- From: Hope Paulos To: Josh Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 3:38 PM Subject: Re: foreign language how'd you read them? Do they have an islandic speech synthesizer? ----- Original Message ----- From: Josh To: Hope Paulos Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 3:33 PM Subject: Re: foreign language yes I am interested in learning foreign languages. but I'm not interested in them as in getting a degree, but I just want to get books and learn them onmy own time. I scanned in several teach yourself books for languages like icelandic and finnish. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. ----- Original Message ----- From: Hope Paulos To: Josh Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 2:55 PM Subject: Re: foreign language The University provided me the textbooks in .doc format. I went to the bookstore and purchased them. Then took them to the disability support services office and had them remove the bindings and scan them for me. Are you interested in learning foreign languages? Hope and Beignet ----- Original Message ----- From: Josh To: Hope Paulos Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 2:18 PM Subject: Re: foreign language how did you get your textbooks? what format did they come in, or did you have to scan them? Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. ----- Original Message ----- From: Hope Paulos To: Josh Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 1:56 PM Subject: Re: foreign language I used a braille note and received texts in .doc format to study Spanish and German. I did the tests the same way. Teacher would send me the tests ahead of time because they trusted that I wouldn't cheat and I took them in the same room with the class. If I needed extra time, teachers would allow me to take them home. Again, they knew me really well it's a small university that I attended. HTH. Hope and Beignet ----- Original Message ----- From: Josh To: hope.paulos at maine.edu Cc: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 1:19 PM Subject: foreign language Hi did you get braille materials when you studdied spanish and german? or did you have a reader both in and out of classes? Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. From bunnykatie6 at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 22:17:31 2010 From: bunnykatie6 at gmail.com (Katie Wang) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 17:17:31 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list In-Reply-To: References: <231ACEEC8E8A4E09956A8BBEE0E904AD@coreyPC> <409c235c1003112253y1299ffbfs176788db8474ebba@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <5096b4731003121417m2e597744q29331cea49967cd9@mail.gmail.com> Hello, Mikaela, welcome to the list!My name is Katie and I live in Connecticut. I'm a first-year graduate student at Yale University studying social psychology. I'm fairly new to the list myself and have found it very informative, so I hope you will feel the same! I'm sure we will all learn much from you as well given your musical skills as well as your unique challenges of dealing with dwarfism in addition to your visual impairment. Look forward to seeing posts from you in the future! Katie On 3/12/10, Jen wrote: > Good morning, Michaela, > > Welcome to the list! My name is Jen. I live in Connecticut and am > studying to be a social worker at Saint Joseph College. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Darian Smith" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 1:53 AM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list > > > hello Mikaela and welcome to the List! > My Name is Darian, I am a student from San Francisco, California > and I am studying at City College of San francisco. I am working on > my general education classes and am looking to transfer, with an eye > on teaching Orientation and Mobility. I would like to be able to > work with Deaf-blind, dog guide teams and as much of the spectrum of > individuals who can benifit from the increased confidence andquality > of life that independent travel brings. > during my free time, I like to go to sporting events, travel, DJ > and just generally be pretty active when I can. > I also am a board member of the national association of blind > students and co-chair of our membership committee. The committee puts > on monthly conference calls that have different feature topics each > month and are open to all. On behalf of the committee, i would like > to extend an invitation to you and anyone else who wants in on the > action :). > Should you have any questions about anything on this list; just ask, > we all are more than willing to help our and answer what we can how we > can. We also are excited to hear from you and your expiriences as a > blind person. > Thanks so much and welcome to the National associations of Blind > students and our list serve! > Best, > Darian > > On 3/11/10, Corey Cook wrote: >> welcome to the list >> >> >> -------------------------------------------------- >> From: "Mikaela Stevens" >> Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 7:23 PM >> To: >> Subject: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list >> >>> Hello everyone, >>> >>> >>> >>> My name is Mikaela. I just joined the NABS mailing list, but I have >>> been a >>> >>> member of NFB for about a year now. I received a scholarship from the >>> NFB >>> of Idaho last spring and realized what a great organization the NFB >>> is and >>> >>> decided to join. Last summer I attended my first national convention, >>> as >>> well and had a great experience in Detroit. I met some of you there. >>> You >>> probably would remember me because I am a little person, also known >>> as a >>> dwarf, (along with my visual impairment). I stand just over three >>> feet >>> tall; for those of you who might be curious about my height--that is >>> about >>> >>> the size of a three or four year old child. If anyone has any further >>> questions for me about my condition, please do not hesitate to email >>> me >>> and I am happy to educate you. >>> >>> >>> >>> I am currently enrolled at BYU-Idaho, as a freshman, studying >>> communications and vocal performance. I love anything to do with >>> music: I >>> have been singing for most of my life and I am currently learning to >>> play >>> piano. This will be my third year or so taking lessons, but I kept >>> quitting so there were several years between. I play by ear and I >>> know a >>> little Braille music, however I don't really use it. I adore children >>> and >>> volunteer three times a week in three local kindergarten classes. I >>> would >>> love to teach kindergarten or first grade, but that is not the plan >>> right >>> now. >>> >>> >>> >>> Thank you for allowing me to join in your discussions! I'm looking so >>> forward to meeting you all. Take care. >>> >>> >>> >>> Sincerely, >>> >>> Mikaela Stevens >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ccook01%40knology.net >>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Darian Smith > Skype: The_Blind_Truth > Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com > The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher > recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate > individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your > help! To Get Involved go to: > www.TeachBlindStudents.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/spiderweb1%40sbcglobal.net > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmail.com > From djdrocks4ever at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 22:47:54 2010 From: djdrocks4ever at gmail.com (David Dunphy) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 17:47:54 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Reply to David References: <52E88E3765864C14B9AC00852E9C8AED@HP31177120642> Message-ID: <4F6C6150094044F2AD59202B069C9B19@radio360usa> I'd like to hear them. ***** Tired of listening to the same old stations playing the same old songs over and over again? Then check out an internet radio station with plenty of interesting programming. Visit the home of Radio360 Where Variety Matters Most at http://www.radio360.us Check it out you won't be disappointed ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jen" To: "National Association of Blind Students" Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 11:47 AM Subject: [nabs-l] Reply to David > Hi David / All, > > My songs are a mix of genres (classical, pop and rock.) They are about > my personal experiences which I turn into universal messages. If anyone > wants to hear my songs, please reply, and I will send them to the list. > They will come in Windows Media Player format. > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/djdrocks4ever%40gmail.com > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature database 4940 (20100312) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4940 (20100312) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com From dianefilipe at peoplepc.com Fri Mar 12 23:53:02 2010 From: dianefilipe at peoplepc.com (Diane) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 16:53:02 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Location of this year's national convention? In-Reply-To: <06F64B6E6C394C6DB2145414996C3FE5@HP31177120642> References: <06F64B6E6C394C6DB2145414996C3FE5@HP31177120642> Message-ID: In Dallas, Texas. I believe from July 3 to 8! Di ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jen" To: "National Association of Blind Students" Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 10:36 AM Subject: [nabs-l] Location of this year's national convention? > Does anyone know where this year's national convention will take place? > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dianefilipe%40peoplepc.com From kerrik2006 at gmail.com Sat Mar 13 01:43:04 2010 From: kerrik2006 at gmail.com (Kerri Kosten) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 20:43:04 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: IPad EBook to use voice over In-Reply-To: <8F23CB68DB494980A6DAAAD37351A7C2@josputer> References: <8F23CB68DB494980A6DAAAD37351A7C2@josputer> Message-ID: Hey All: not sure if many of you saw this or not, but this looks like good news on the ebooks front. I received this from the list for blind users of Apples Iphone. Hope you all enjoy! This sounds like great news and for once it sounds like blind/visually impaired Ipad users will have access to an Ebook store almost like on the Kindel. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Joney Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 18:03:24 -0500 Subject: IPad EBook to use voice over To: viphone at googlegroups.com Thought some of you would be interested in this considering the run round Amazon had. Apple's iBooks Store and Reader to Support VoiceOver 12 March, 2010 @ 3:19 pm by Lioncourt As Apple began taking pre-orders today for its new iPad device, they released a few more details about the product. Most exciting among these for VoiceOver users is the news that iBooks, the application that doubles as a digital bookstore and electronic book reader, will support VoiceOver. Apple's iBooks page describes its accessibility thus: Block quote start Unlike a paper book - or e-books on other devices - you can change iBooks on iPad to suit the way you read. Turn iPad to portrait to view a single page. Or view two pages at once by rotating to landscape. Change the text size. Even change the font. Touch and hold any word to look it up in the built-in dictionary or Wikipedia, or to search for it throughout the book and on the web. iBooks works with VoiceOver, the screen reader in iPad, so it can read you the contents of any page. Even with all these extras, reading is so natural on iPad, the technology seems to disappear. Block quote end Our readers will remember the controversy last year when the Authors' Guild tried to block text-to-speech on Amazon's Kindle book reader, claiming that text-to-speech was equivalent to audio book performances by human narrators. The guild will find it much harder to argue that bizarre stance this time, as the access is being offered via VoiceOver rather than a generalized text-to-speech option. By taking this approach, Apple will be providing VOiceOver users with a streamlined experience, and putting the Authors' Guild in a position of specifically having to oppose access for visually impaired users to their content. We do not believe the guild will want to try to take such a hostile stance. The iBooks application will also work as a reader for free books in ePub format, whether that content was purchased from the iBooks store or not. Once again, Apple is putting visually impaired users on equal footing with their sighted fellows. Joney "If God can bring you to it, He will lead you through it." Email: talk2owen at gmail.com Join me on: Twitter: http://twitter.com/talk2owen Gratitude log: http://www.GratitudeLog.com/join/talk2owen FaceBook: http://www.facebook.com/talk2owen -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "VIPhone" group. To post to this group, send email to viphone at googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to viphone+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/viphone?hl=en. From amylsabo at comcast.net Sat Mar 13 03:58:23 2010 From: amylsabo at comcast.net (Amy Sabo) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 03:58:23 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1788750036.3857061268452703844.JavaMail.root@sz0144a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> hello all, i too also want to welcome you to the list as well too. my name is amy sabo and, i'm attending metro state college majoring in speech communications with a minor in public relations. but, i'm originally from michigan. please feel free to share ideas, ask questions, observe, or just vent! we are all here for you and just know that you aren't alone here. well, that's all for now take care and i will talk to you soon! hugs, from amy ----- Original Message ----- From: Hope Paulos To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Sent: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 01:54:05 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Another Newbie Yes. You did. ----- Original Message ----- From: "RJ Sandefur" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 7:56 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Another Newbie > Hope, didn't I see you on david's show the DJD invation? RJ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Hope Paulos" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 6:26 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Another Newbie > > >> Hello Jen!! Nice to have you on the list. My name is Hope Paulos and I've >> also been blind since birth. I graduated with 2 degrees: secondary >> education with a focus in Spanish, and modern languages concentrating in >> Spanish and German this past December. I plan to get my certification in >> assistive technology instruction then go on for my masters to become a >> teacher of the blind/visually impaired. >> I'm sure you'll find this list helpful and I look forward to hearing more >> from you. >> Hope Paulos and guide dog, Beignet >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Serena" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 6:01 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Another Newbie >> >> >>> Hi Jenn, >>> >>> I'm Serena Cucco. I'm applying to Rutgers University in Newark, NJ to >>> get my MSW. I really hope I get in! >>> >>> Serena >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Jen" >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students" >>> Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 4:41 PM >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Another Newbie >>> >>> >>>> Hello All, >>>> >>>> My name is Jen. I am totally blind and have been since birth. I am >>>> studying to be a social worker at Saint Joseph College in West >>>> Hartford, >>>> Connecticut. I am a pianist and singer-song writer; writing songs is >>>> how >>>> I express what I cannot verbalize. >>>> >>>> I look forward to learning from all of you. >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizon.net >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/amylsabo%40comcast.net From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Sat Mar 13 04:01:32 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 20:01:32 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Reply to David In-Reply-To: <5F5206381B8F4C5084843896544E7138@hometwxakonvzn> References: <52E88E3765864C14B9AC00852E9C8AED@HP31177120642> <5F5206381B8F4C5084843896544E7138@hometwxakonvzn> Message-ID: <409c235c1003122001x2701973cu269db885fc418150@mail.gmail.com> Jen, you indeed sound very talented. have you heard of our national performing arts division? the president is a really awsome guy. His name id Dennis and he can be reached at dholston at nyc.rr.com so, you might want to chat with him about what they have going on there if you have not in the first place. Best, Darian On 3/12/10, RJ Sandefur wrote: > I'd like to hear some of your music. RJ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jen" > To: "National Association of Blind Students" > Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 11:47 AM > Subject: [nabs-l] Reply to David > > >> Hi David / All, >> >> My songs are a mix of genres (classical, pop and rock.) They are about >> my personal experiences which I turn into universal messages. If anyone >> wants to hear my songs, please reply, and I will send them to the list. >> They will come in Windows Media Player format. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From amylsabo at comcast.net Sat Mar 13 04:01:51 2010 From: amylsabo at comcast.net (Amy Sabo) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 04:01:51 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list In-Reply-To: <47073A0E04A5437E8BF49EF3365BCBE3@Hope> Message-ID: <1133260138.3857731268452911752.JavaMail.root@sz0144a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> hello all, welcome to the land of nabs. my name is amy sabo and, i currently attend metro state college where i'm pursuing my degree in speech communications with a minor in public relations. but, i'm originally from michigan. please feel free to share your thoughts, ask questions, give advice, or just vent! just know that you aren't alone here and, that together we can change what it means to be a blind student! well, that's all for now take care and i will talk to you soon! hugs, from amy ----- Original Message ----- From: Hope Paulos To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Sent: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 00:59:47 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list Welcome to the list, Mikaela!!! I hope you find it helpful and I'm sure you'll enjoy meeting new people on here. Hope and guide dog, Beignet ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mikaela Stevens" To: Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 7:23 PM Subject: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list > Hello everyone, > > > > My name is Mikaela. I just joined the NABS mailing list, but I have been a > member of NFB for about a year now. I received a scholarship from the NFB > of Idaho last spring and realized what a great organization the NFB is and > decided to join. Last summer I attended my first national convention, as > well and had a great experience in Detroit. I met some of you there. You > probably would remember me because I am a little person, also known as a > dwarf, (along with my visual impairment). I stand just over three feet > tall; for those of you who might be curious about my height--that is about > the size of a three or four year old child. If anyone has any further > questions for me about my condition, please do not hesitate to email me > and I am happy to educate you. > > > > I am currently enrolled at BYU-Idaho, as a freshman, studying > communications and vocal performance. I love anything to do with music: I > have been singing for most of my life and I am currently learning to play > piano. This will be my third year or so taking lessons, but I kept > quitting so there were several years between. I play by ear and I know a > little Braille music, however I don't really use it. I adore children and > volunteer three times a week in three local kindergarten classes. I would > love to teach kindergarten or first grade, but that is not the plan right > now. > > > > Thank you for allowing me to join in your discussions! I'm looking so > forward to meeting you all. Take care. > > > > Sincerely, > > Mikaela Stevens > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/amylsabo%40comcast.net From David.B.Andrews at state.mn.us Sat Mar 13 07:57:11 2010 From: David.B.Andrews at state.mn.us (Andrews, David B B (DEED)) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 01:57:11 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] FW: Bookshare - VR Stream Download Training Message-ID: From: HumanWare [mailto:marcom at humanware.com] Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 11:20 PM To: Andrews, David B B (DEED) Subject: Bookshare - VR Stream Download Training View this message in your browser HumanWare logo. The power is in your hands Bookshare - VR Stream Download Training Join us for a Webinar on March 16 1. Review of the Victor Reader Stream main features & benefits. 2. How to download content from Bookshare and use Companion Software to transfer content to the VR Stream 3. Questions & Answers Title: Bookshare - VR Stream Download Training Date: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 Time: 4:30 PM - 5:00 PM EDT Register Now After registering you will receive a confirmation email containing information about joining the Webinar. System Requirements PC-based attendees Required: Windows® 7, Vista, XP, 2003 Server or 2000 Macintosh®-based attendees Required: Mac OS® X 10.4.11 (Tiger®) or newer Space is limited. Reserve your Webinar seat now at: https://www2.gotomeeting.com/register/636080867 From lawnmower84 at hotmail.com Sat Mar 13 09:14:42 2010 From: lawnmower84 at hotmail.com (Jacob Struiksma) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 01:14:42 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] What screen readers do you use? In-Reply-To: <2A3B4FA8DEB849E89759071F8DCB6F9E@HP31177120642> References: <2A3B4FA8DEB849E89759071F8DCB6F9E@HP31177120642> Message-ID: I use JAWS 11 on my computer running windows XP service pack 3. I use mobile speak 4 on my smart phone sprint Samsung intrepid phone runs windows mobile professional 6.5. it has a qwerty key board and touch screen. It is very powerful phone and runs great. From Jacob Struiksma Seattle, WA -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jen Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 9:41 AM To: National Association of Blind Students Subject: [nabs-l] What screen readers do you use? Hi Guys, I'm just curious...what screen reader do you use? I use JAWS 8 with Windows XP. I like JAWS 8 very much, especially the Dictionary Manager (I have to have the synthesizer speak words the way I want them pronounced (don't pronounce "Mister" as "M R.") _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lawnmower84%40hotmai l.com No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2742 - Release Date: 03/12/10 11:33:00 From raniaismail04 at gmail.com Sat Mar 13 11:48:56 2010 From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania ) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 05:48:56 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] What screen readers do you use? In-Reply-To: <2A3B4FA8DEB849E89759071F8DCB6F9E@HP31177120642> Message-ID: <4b9b6dba.a215f10a.32b3.3357@mx.google.com> I use jaws 11. Rania, -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jen Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 11:41 AM To: National Association of Blind Students Subject: [nabs-l] What screen readers do you use? Hi Guys, I'm just curious...what screen reader do you use? I use JAWS 8 with Windows XP. I like JAWS 8 very much, especially the Dictionary Manager (I have to have the synthesizer speak words the way I want them pronounced (don't pronounce "Mister" as "M R.") _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai l.com No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2742 - Release Date: 03/12/10 13:33:00 From raniaismail04 at gmail.com Sat Mar 13 12:08:37 2010 From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania ) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 06:08:37 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] "I Can See You're Blind" In-Reply-To: <3A0B3E4190DD44E5AD035D2F6561768B@HP31177120642> Message-ID: <4b9b7258.47c1f10a.6f08.ffff9210@mx.google.com> Wow that sounded really good! Rania, -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jen Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 12:04 PM To: National Association of Blind Students Subject: [nabs-l] "I Can See You're Blind" I wrote this song to a professor who discriminated against me because of my blindness. During my first semester at community college, this person made fun of the sound of my BrailleNote, saying it drove him crazy. (The professor's excuse was he had a bad day.) Did I mention this occurred in front of the class? So once I recovered from my shock, I wrote this song to say what I could not at the time. No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2742 - Release Date: 03/12/10 13:33:00 From jkenn337 at gmail.com Sat Mar 13 18:23:57 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 13:23:57 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] anyone using NVDA or system access? Message-ID: <1BADF1828F6B4D86B74D189994B90B7C@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Hi is anyone on here using NVDA or system access or system access to go as their primary screen readers? or how about knoppix-adriane as your primary OS? Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. From djdrocks4ever at gmail.com Sat Mar 13 19:17:27 2010 From: djdrocks4ever at gmail.com (David Dunphy) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 14:17:27 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] A Special Edition Of The Djd Invasion Airs At A Special Time Tonight Message-ID: <38F02AE19D7D433D82319B1E07E6FA0E@radio360usa> Greetings All! Normally on Saturday nights on Radio360 after Pop Tops, we break out the popcorn and enjoy a good movie! But tonight's different! Join me for a special edition of The Djd Invasion starting at 8 PM eastern after Pop Tops With Dennis. Tonight's show will feature: A mix of pop and country tunes from past and present Some Irish tunes, whether they be classic, more contemporary, celtic in nature, or you might even get some songs from groups based out of Ireland Joann will be doing a live violin performance on air! And, a voice from Radio360's past will be part of tonight's show And if this isn't enough for you, during the program, you'll be welcome to make comments and requests by msn or aol instant messengers or through email to the address live at radio360.us or when the lines are open, come call in and say hello through skype at the address radio360usa or through the telephone by dialing 516-717-4425 This should be a musically entertaining, and fun Saturday night experience for all, so break out the drinks, crank up your speakers, and at 8 PM eastern up through 12 AM eastern, go to http://www.radio360.us/players/playerselection.shtml or copy the following url into your player: http://fast.icastcenter.com:9001/stream and come rock out with The Djd Invasion tonight! And if you'd like more info on my shows, head on over to http://www.radio360.us where you can sign up for the mailing list and more! Hope to see you there! Best regards, Djd, host of The Djd Invasion http://www.radio360.us __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4941 (20100313) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com From kerrik2006 at gmail.com Sat Mar 13 21:13:19 2010 From: kerrik2006 at gmail.com (Kerri Kosten) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 16:13:19 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] "I Can See You're Blind" In-Reply-To: <3A0B3E4190DD44E5AD035D2F6561768B@HP31177120642> References: <3A0B3E4190DD44E5AD035D2F6561768B@HP31177120642> Message-ID: Hey Jen: /Thanks for sharing this! Your a really good singer and I thought this song was very well-written!! Kerri On 3/12/10, Jen wrote: > I wrote this song to a professor who discriminated against me because of > my blindness. During my first semester at community college, this person > made fun of the sound of my BrailleNote, saying it drove him crazy. (The > professor's excuse was he had a bad day.) > > Did I mention this occurred in front of the class? > > So once I recovered from my shock, I wrote this song to say what I could > not at the time. > From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Sat Mar 13 21:55:31 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 13:55:31 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] What screen readers do you use? In-Reply-To: <2A3B4FA8DEB849E89759071F8DCB6F9E@HP31177120642> References: <2A3B4FA8DEB849E89759071F8DCB6F9E@HP31177120642> Message-ID: <409c235c1003131355x1f60f3e9wbfe85f274c29339f@mail.gmail.com> Hi Jen, That makes sense to me, I like my words where I can understand them too lol. I use JAWS 8 and windows xp as well. Happy saturday! Darian On 3/12/10, Jen wrote: > Hi Guys, > > I'm just curious...what screen reader do you use? I use JAWS 8 with > Windows XP. I like JAWS 8 very much, especially the Dictionary Manager > (I have to have the synthesizer speak words the way I want them > pronounced (don't pronounce "Mister" as "M R.") > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From jessicac.kostiw at gmail.com Sat Mar 13 23:10:57 2010 From: jessicac.kostiw at gmail.com (Jessica Kostiw) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 17:10:57 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Tried to Remove From List References: Message-ID: <7E3B887D4449477DAAC52AD77F1CBFCE@Jessica> David, I have tried to remove myself from this list twice, but for some reason every time I click the button it hasn't worked. Would you mind assisting me? Jessica Kostiw P.S. I hope this message isn't coming out argumentatively... I don't mean it to at all. :) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Josh" To: Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 12:17 PM Subject: [nabs-l] another newby > Hi > > I'm applying to capella niversity www.capella.edu online college to get my > bachelers in information technology. > > Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com > my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired > of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out > NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, > Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and > vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui > and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda > knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an > accessible computer. > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jessicac.kostiw%40gmail.com From cmcerteza at aol.com Sat Mar 13 23:37:36 2010 From: cmcerteza at aol.com (cmcerteza at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 18:37:36 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center Message-ID: <8CC911D4BF8F61C-6064-1163F@webmail-m093.sysops.aol.com> Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I’m new to the list and I would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training center but my counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want sponsor me. If there’s anyone here with a similar situation in previous years, how did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really appreciate your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation to answer my question. Thanks From fantasyfanatic01 at gmail.com Sun Mar 14 00:22:25 2010 From: fantasyfanatic01 at gmail.com (Franandah Damstra) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 19:22:25 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] foreign language In-Reply-To: <1721AD06BC504DFB8F2559293AD1721E@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> References: <228CEB95DA3E46E09D5802983BBCC778@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> <6879284A7A9542AE8AF74AB30D52C98E@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> <14FC1B8B62F94FBCB4C861BEDA2AF93C@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> <1721AD06BC504DFB8F2559293AD1721E@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Message-ID: I know both Spanish anf English. I use braille for both. Since Spanish is a very comman language, it is easy for me to get books in Spanish Braille. It is even easier than English Braille. As for my Japanese, I have yet to find good books in Japanese Braille. I am just learning the language through online pages with English Braille until I can find some books and sources in Japanese. On 3/12/10, Josh wrote: > Have you ever seen Icelandic before? it is a very interesting language! the > icelandic people are genetically 60% Irish and the language sounds kind of > like Irish, somewhat. Here is a sample of Icelandic. Icelaandic is very old, > just like Finnish it has not changed much if at all since the 10th century > or sso. > > Halló til allra sem blindir búa í Írland Ísland arabíska tal ríkjum Íran, og > Finnland og Noregur! > Mig langar að segja þér um Klango. Klango er raunverulegur samfélag blinda > og sést fólk. Eru útvarpsstöðvum, einkapóst, hópar, huga að taka, mennta > stærðfræði > og algebra verkfæri, leikir og fleira! Ef þú vilt skrá þig fyrir klango en > þörf hjálpa þú geta hátta the website: www.translate.google.com > í kassi tegund http://www.klango.net og viðbót verður þýdd úr frummálinu > sínu í eigin tungumál! > Vissir þú að ef þú getur ekki efni á Jaws skjár lesandi hugbúnaður program, > there er a frjáls skjár lesandi hugbúnaður program? Það er kallað NVDA. Það > stendur fyrir utan sjónræn skrifborð aðgang. Það er ókeypis! Hægt er að > sækja hann með því að fara til the website www.nvda-project.org. Vinsamlega > bæta > íslenska tungu sem ESpeak talgerfillName og einnig bæta við Færeyska og > Írska Gaelic tungumál ESpeak. Svo vinsamlega ef þú ert að lesa þetta mundu > að þú > þarft ekki að borga fyrir skjá lesandi eða Klango! NVDA og Klango er frjáls > frjáls frjáls! Svo fara fá þá fara sækja þá! Og vinsamlegast hjálpa til að > bæta við tungumál ESpeak! Ef þú vilt ókeypis stýrikerfi og vilt ekki að nota > Windows frá Microsoft: þú getur notað Vinux eða Knoppix-Adriane getur þú > notað > Google til að leita að þessum stýrikerfum! Þeir líka eru ókeypis! > Ég vona að þú njótir þá eins mikið og ég hef. > > > Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com > my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of > Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get > a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or > knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the > most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at > www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max > or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Hope Paulos > To: Josh > Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 3:38 PM > Subject: Re: foreign language > > > how'd you read them? Do they have an islandic speech synthesizer? > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Josh > To: Hope Paulos > Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 3:33 PM > Subject: Re: foreign language > > > yes I am interested in learning foreign languages. but I'm not > interested in them as in getting a degree, but I just want to get books and > learn them onmy own time. I scanned in several teach yourself books for > languages like icelandic and finnish. > > Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com > my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired > of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, > get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, > Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max > are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage > those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane > Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Hope Paulos > To: Josh > Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 2:55 PM > Subject: Re: foreign language > > > The University provided me the textbooks in .doc format. I went to the > bookstore and purchased them. Then took them to the disability support > services office and had them remove the bindings and scan them for me. Are > you interested in learning foreign languages? > Hope and Beignet > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Josh > To: Hope Paulos > Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 2:18 PM > Subject: Re: foreign language > > > how did you get your textbooks? what format did they come in, or did > you have to scan them? > > Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com > my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). > Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out > NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, > Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max > are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage > those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane > Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Hope Paulos > To: Josh > Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 1:56 PM > Subject: Re: foreign language > > > I used a braille note and received texts in .doc format to study > Spanish and German. I did the tests the same way. Teacher would send me the > tests ahead of time because they trusted that I wouldn't cheat and I took > them in the same room with the class. If I needed extra time, teachers would > allow me to take them home. Again, they knew me really well it's a small > university that I attended. > HTH. > Hope and Beignet > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Josh > To: hope.paulos at maine.edu > Cc: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 1:19 PM > Subject: foreign language > > > Hi > > did you get braille materials when you studdied spanish and > german? or did you have a reader both in and out of classes? > > Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com > my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated > frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for > screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and > switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix > ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try > vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and > nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an > accessible computer. > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/fantasyfanatic01%40gmail.com > From kerrik2006 at gmail.com Sun Mar 14 03:19:48 2010 From: kerrik2006 at gmail.com (Kerri Kosten) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 22:19:48 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list In-Reply-To: <1133260138.3857731268452911752.JavaMail.root@sz0144a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> References: <47073A0E04A5437E8BF49EF3365BCBE3@Hope> <1133260138.3857731268452911752.JavaMail.root@sz0144a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: Hi: Welcome to the list! My name is Kerri Kosten. I am a student majoring in Journalism at West Virginia University. I would like to be a sports reporter. I hope you like the list...I have found it very helpful! If you have any questions or anything please don't hesitate to ask! Look forward to seeing more posts from you! Kerri On 3/12/10, Amy Sabo wrote: > hello all, > > welcome to the land of nabs. my name is amy sabo and, i currently attend > metro state college where i'm pursuing my degree in speech communications > with a minor in public relations. but, i'm originally from michigan. > > please feel free to share your thoughts, ask questions, give advice, or just > vent! just know that you aren't alone here and, that together we can change > what it means to be a blind student! > > well, that's all for now take care and i will talk to you soon! > > > hugs, > from amy > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Hope Paulos > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Sent: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 00:59:47 +0000 (UTC) > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list > > Welcome to the list, Mikaela!!! I hope you find it helpful and I'm sure > you'll enjoy meeting new people on here. > Hope and guide dog, Beignet > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mikaela Stevens" > To: > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 7:23 PM > Subject: [nabs-l] New on NABS mailing list > > >> Hello everyone, >> >> >> >> My name is Mikaela. I just joined the NABS mailing list, but I have been a >> >> member of NFB for about a year now. I received a scholarship from the NFB >> of Idaho last spring and realized what a great organization the NFB is and >> >> decided to join. Last summer I attended my first national convention, as >> well and had a great experience in Detroit. I met some of you there. You >> probably would remember me because I am a little person, also known as a >> dwarf, (along with my visual impairment). I stand just over three feet >> tall; for those of you who might be curious about my height--that is about >> >> the size of a three or four year old child. If anyone has any further >> questions for me about my condition, please do not hesitate to email me >> and I am happy to educate you. >> >> >> >> I am currently enrolled at BYU-Idaho, as a freshman, studying >> communications and vocal performance. I love anything to do with music: I >> have been singing for most of my life and I am currently learning to play >> piano. This will be my third year or so taking lessons, but I kept >> quitting so there were several years between. I play by ear and I know a >> little Braille music, however I don't really use it. I adore children and >> volunteer three times a week in three local kindergarten classes. I would >> love to teach kindergarten or first grade, but that is not the plan right >> now. >> >> >> >> Thank you for allowing me to join in your discussions! I'm looking so >> forward to meeting you all. Take care. >> >> >> >> Sincerely, >> >> Mikaela Stevens >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/amylsabo%40comcast.net > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kerrik2006%40gmail.com > From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Sun Mar 14 03:44:30 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 19:44:30 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] newby on list In-Reply-To: <96A69EC939B24B0ABE60C4F02B781DB4@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> References: <96A69EC939B24B0ABE60C4F02B781DB4@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Message-ID: <409c235c1003131944g20489b73ob3b785a8be3ed4ff@mail.gmail.com> hello Josh and welcome to the list! My name is Darian. I am a student in San francisco at the local community college here and I am taking general education classes. I also serve as a board member for the national association of blind students and as a part of my position serve as membership co-chair for our membership committee. We are happy to have you and welcome your wisdom, questions and encouragement. Were you able to make it to our parenting call a few weeks back? Best, Darian On 3/12/10, Josh wrote: > Hi > > I am married, my wife is blind and our son is three years old and sighted. > we plan to home-school him. > > Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com > my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of > Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get > a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or > knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the > most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at > www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max > or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From clb5590 at gmail.com Sun Mar 14 03:45:22 2010 From: clb5590 at gmail.com (Cindy Bennett) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 22:45:22 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center In-Reply-To: <8CC911D4BF8F61C-6064-1163F@webmail-m093.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CC911D4BF8F61C-6064-1163F@webmail-m093.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <3fea3c411003131945i3c563105sa73245e1b79125ab@mail.gmail.com> If you look at the list archives, or if someone would be willing to resend the last edition of The Student Slate, since i did not save it onto my computer, there is an article in there about our right to an informed choice. I'm sure several people can tell you how they worked through this, and i think they should, but i found this article very helpful as i am planning to soon approach my state with the same request. Cindy On 3/13/10, cmcerteza at aol.com wrote: > > Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I’m new to the list and I > would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training center but my > counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want sponsor > me. If there’s anyone here with a similar situation in previous years, how > did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really appreciate > your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation to > answer my question. > > Thanks > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.com > From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Sun Mar 14 03:56:01 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 19:56:01 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center In-Reply-To: <8CC911D4BF8F61C-6064-1163F@webmail-m093.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CC911D4BF8F61C-6064-1163F@webmail-m093.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <409c235c1003131956u6b23cd20qf9245e9e99213fc9@mail.gmail.com> Casandra, Just my little bit of two cents to offer would be this... I remember thatI needed to justify to my counsoler that what California ( the state where I was residing) had to offere in regards to state ran training centers was not what I was going to best benifit from. to do this I had to do some research into the center(s) the state wanted to send me to and then do research on the NFB training center (s) I wanted to go to. Once I gathered my facts, i wrote a letter of justification ( a letter clearly articulating the main things I am wanting to gain from taking the time to gain skills, and what the NFB center offers that the state ran center does not.) Unfortunately, I no longer have that letter, as it went into nothing ness when my computer died on me some years back. I'm very positive that there are many people hereon this list that have stories to share that may be more helful than mine. That said, I hope my story helped you a little best, Darian On 3/13/10, cmcerteza at aol.com wrote: > > Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I’m new to the list and I > would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training center but my > counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want sponsor > me. If there’s anyone here with a similar situation in previous years, how > did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really appreciate > your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation to > answer my question. > > Thanks > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From rmlambert1987 at yahoo.com Sun Mar 14 04:18:41 2010 From: rmlambert1987 at yahoo.com (Rob Lambert) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 20:18:41 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nabs-l] Advice on problem with IRTI Message-ID: <241933.27189.qm@web56103.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Okay. Here's the timeline. Feburary 11th: Emailed plextalk with symptoms of my Pocket PTP1. Return email: Plextalk asks for a dealer replacement (warranty based). Communication between myself & the dealer continues for the next week finalizing everything. February 27th: Mailed to IRTI. March 1st: Arrived at IRTI. March 3rd: Emailed to confirm arrival, and asking for tracking number. March 4th: Returned email from IRTI saying that they got it & that it would be a few days before a replacement could be sent. Issue of tracking number was not addressed. March 9th: emailed to check on status of shipment. It is now March 13th. No pocket, no return email regarding shipment status. It has now been two weeks without my unit. It should not take this long to replace, considering the dealer & I are close (distance wise). I'm ready to call on Monday. If they give me another "a few more days", I will ask for a refund and buy something else, this time, direct from the manufacturer. Any further input or suggestions are welcome, as to anything else I should do.  From aleremita at executiveproductsinc.com Sun Mar 14 05:57:34 2010 From: aleremita at executiveproductsinc.com (Al Eremita) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 23:57:34 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Book Port Plus Leather Case Message-ID: New! "Book Port Plus case made with Napa leather. To order: Visit our website at www.ExecutiveProductsInc.com e-mail us at customer_care at executiveprodutsinc.com or call us Toll Free at 818-833-8822 Features: TurtleBack has created a new soft form-fitted custom leather case for the NEW Book Port Plus. This case is made of high grade Napa leather that fits snuggly around your unit, and has a storage zipper compartment for your flash cards. The case has been designed to enable the user to easily utilize your Book Port Plus while the case is on the unit, and allows the unit to be carried on a comfortable strap or clipped on your belt. The unit may be used while walking, sitting or simply standing. The case has easy access to the headset jack, USB port, and SD flash memory cards. The case is manufactured with high quality leather to provide durable outer protection. This case comes with a leather covered belt clip on the back of the unit. Book Port Plus case $35.99 Visit our website at www.ExecutiveProductsInc.com e-mail us at customer_care at executiveproductsinc.com or call us Toll Free at 818-833-8822 To purchase click on the link below: https://www.executiveproductsinc.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=54&products_id=1844&osCsid=7bc9c814dd0b8cb729a5a6aec3993560 Other items: BookSense-Front-Small-open2 BookSense-Front-small-128 GW front view closed Gw-front-Open Book Sense Voice Sense Executive Products Inc. has designed and completed two new cases. The Book Sense and the Voice Sense are in stock and ready to ship. We designed and created these cases to be functional, soft to the touch, and keep the user in mind. Both cases are made of soft black leather, protective cover to the key board cut out slots for USB ports, card slots, ear bud slots, etc. Both cases have a secured zipper storage area for ear buds, SD cards. The Voice Sense comes with rubberized eyelets that secure to the shoulder strap to reduce noise while walking. The Book Sense comes with a shoulder strap, wrist strap and a built in clip for your belt. As many of you know we have always designed and created our fitted cases with the user in mind. Our quality cases are used by many of you and always provide that touch of security for your expensive unit. An investment in your case provides you with the peace of mind that your unit will always be protected. As a dealer for EPI you are entitled to a discount to our products. We can drop ship direct to your customer, which reduces your inventory cost to zero. If you have any questions please call us direct at 818-833-8822 or e-mail me at customer_care at executiveproductsinc.com Other Products QX 400,420,440 Nokia N82 Book Port Book Courier Braille + Braille Icon BX 400,420,440 Victor Reader PlexTalk Pk Notetakers Voice Note Braille Note Braille lite SysOn Gps Cane Holders Global Sat Earth Mate BrailleNspeak Visit our website at www.ExecutiveProductsInc.com -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 375bd44.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 3518 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 375bd63.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 2441 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 375bd73.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 1967 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 375bd83.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 2632 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 375bd92.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 3546 bytes Desc: not available URL: From hope.paulos at maine.edu Sun Mar 14 15:26:59 2010 From: hope.paulos at maine.edu (Hope Paulos) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 11:26:59 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] "I Can See You're Blind" References: <3A0B3E4190DD44E5AD035D2F6561768B@HP31177120642> Message-ID: <3F3BCF20CCFC443F9BB88585148CD81E@Hope> Hi there. I just listened to the song you wrote and performed. Was this produced in a studio? The reason I ask is that I hear bass, drums, piano, and guitar. I can tell that none of these were machine (automatically) created. Also you have harmonies in the song. Very well done!! I play bass guitar and my father plays multiple instruments. I had him listen to it as well, and he was impressed. Hope and guide dog, Beignet ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jen" To: "National Association of Blind Students" Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 2:03 PM Subject: [nabs-l] "I Can See You're Blind" >I wrote this song to a professor who discriminated against me because of > my blindness. During my first semester at community college, this person > made fun of the sound of my BrailleNote, saying it drove him crazy. (The > professor's excuse was he had a bad day.) > > Did I mention this occurred in front of the class? > > So once I recovered from my shock, I wrote this song to say what I could > not at the time. > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu > From davidb521 at gmail.com Sun Mar 14 15:46:14 2010 From: davidb521 at gmail.com (David) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 10:46:14 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center In-Reply-To: <8CC911D4BF8F61C-6064-1163F@webmail-m093.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <4b9d04e1.e0d4e70a.36b4.0bd8@mx.google.com> Hi, I had something similar happen to me in Mississippi very recently. I had to go all the way to a hearing in order for me to go to the Louisiana Center for the Blind. The state didn't want to pay for out-of-state training because they felt that there training center in Tupelo was equivalent. You should get your councilor's response in writing so that it is official that your councilor is taking this stance. Also, you should justify why you should go to an NFB training center rather than the in-state facility, but this should be relatively simple to do. If your councilor refuses, appeal to the regional supervisor, then the director of Blind Services in your state. If all fails, go to a procedural hearing, and present your case. Remember that it is your legal right under informed choice to attend an NFB training center, and these agencies sometimes aren't concerned for there clients, but rather with themselves, as is the case with Mississippi. Feel free to contact me off-list if you have further questions. David -----Original Message-- --- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of cmcerteza at aol.com Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 5:38 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I'm new to the list and I would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training center but my counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want sponsor me. If there's anyone here with a similar situation in previous years, how did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really appreciate your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation to answer my question. Thanks _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co m From kat.bottner at gmail.com Sun Mar 14 16:36:19 2010 From: kat.bottner at gmail.com (Kat Bottner) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 12:36:19 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] "I Can See You're Blind" In-Reply-To: <4b9b7258.47c1f10a.6f08.ffff9210@mx.google.com> References: <3A0B3E4190DD44E5AD035D2F6561768B@HP31177120642> <4b9b7258.47c1f10a.6f08.ffff9210@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Yes I too, have to say that was a well done job, it was awesome. I'm also new on this list, but have been with the NFB for a year now, and for anyone who knows Liz Bottner, I'm her sister Kathryrn, but please feel free to call me Kat. Take Care, Kat On 3/13/10, Rania wrote: > Wow that sounded really good! > Rania, > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of Jen > Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 12:04 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students > Subject: [nabs-l] "I Can See You're Blind" > > I wrote this song to a professor who discriminated against me because of my > blindness. During my first semester at community college, this person made > fun of the sound of my BrailleNote, saying it drove him crazy. (The > professor's excuse was he had a bad day.) > > Did I mention this occurred in front of the class? > > So once I recovered from my shock, I wrote this song to say what I could not > at the time. > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2742 - Release Date: 03/12/10 > 13:33:00 > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kat.bottner%40gmail.com > From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Sun Mar 14 20:59:10 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 13:59:10 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center In-Reply-To: <4b9d04e1.e0d4e70a.36b4.0bd8@mx.google.com> References: <8CC911D4BF8F61C-6064-1163F@webmail-m093.sysops.aol.com> <4b9d04e1.e0d4e70a.36b4.0bd8@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <409c235c1003141359v23ffb522n9d0b413773755b96@mail.gmail.com> all, Cindy was absolutely correct; there are a couple of articles in the 2010 student slate (see atatchment) that might prove helpful here. I encourage you to take a moment and check out the slate, it certainly is very imformitive and the cast of many that help to put it together for us have done a great job on this one! Best, Darian On 3/14/10, David wrote: > Hi, > I had something similar happen to me in Mississippi very recently. I had to > go all the way to a hearing in order for me to go to the Louisiana Center > for the Blind. The state didn't want to pay for out-of-state training > because they felt that there training center in Tupelo was equivalent. You > should get your councilor's response in writing so that it is official that > your councilor is taking this stance. Also, you should justify why you > should go to an NFB training center rather than the in-state facility, but > this should be relatively simple to do. If your councilor refuses, appeal to > the regional supervisor, then the director of Blind Services in your state. > If all fails, go to a procedural hearing, and present your case. Remember > that it is your legal right under informed choice to attend an NFB training > center, and these agencies sometimes aren't concerned for there clients, but > rather with themselves, as is the case with Mississippi. Feel free to > contact me off-list if you have further questions. > David > > -----Original Message-- > --- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of cmcerteza at aol.com > Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 5:38 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center > > > Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I'm new to the list and I > would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training center but my > counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want sponsor > me. If there's anyone here with a similar situation in previous years, how > did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really appreciate > your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation to > answer my question. > > Thanks > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co > m > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: StudentSlateSpring2010.doc Type: application/msword Size: 93184 bytes Desc: not available URL: From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Sun Mar 14 21:03:38 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 14:03:38 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center In-Reply-To: <409c235c1003141359v23ffb522n9d0b413773755b96@mail.gmail.com> References: <8CC911D4BF8F61C-6064-1163F@webmail-m093.sysops.aol.com> <4b9d04e1.e0d4e70a.36b4.0bd8@mx.google.com> <409c235c1003141359v23ffb522n9d0b413773755b96@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <409c235c1003141403k7546ccb0p2fad7a3893a9bab5@mail.gmail.com> And David is a great example of how to get things done in this situation. David, are you at LCB currently? On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: > all, Cindy was absolutely correct; there are a couple of articles > in the 2010 student slate (see atatchment) that might prove helpful > here. > I encourage you to take a moment and check out the slate, it > certainly is very imformitive and the cast of many that help to put > it together for us have done a great job on this one! > Best, > Darian > > On 3/14/10, David wrote: >> Hi, >> I had something similar happen to me in Mississippi very recently. I had >> to >> go all the way to a hearing in order for me to go to the Louisiana Center >> for the Blind. The state didn't want to pay for out-of-state training >> because they felt that there training center in Tupelo was equivalent. >> You >> should get your councilor's response in writing so that it is official >> that >> your councilor is taking this stance. Also, you should justify why you >> should go to an NFB training center rather than the in-state facility, >> but >> this should be relatively simple to do. If your councilor refuses, appeal >> to >> the regional supervisor, then the director of Blind Services in your >> state. >> If all fails, go to a procedural hearing, and present your case. Remember >> that it is your legal right under informed choice to attend an NFB >> training >> center, and these agencies sometimes aren't concerned for there clients, >> but >> rather with themselves, as is the case with Mississippi. Feel free to >> contact me off-list if you have further questions. >> David >> >> -----Original Message-- >> --- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of cmcerteza at aol.com >> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 5:38 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >> >> >> Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I'm new to the list and I >> would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training center but >> my >> counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want >> sponsor >> me. If there's anyone here with a similar situation in previous years, >> how >> did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really >> appreciate >> your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation to >> answer my question. >> >> Thanks >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >> m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Darian Smith > Skype: The_Blind_Truth > Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com > The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher > recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate > individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your > help! To Get Involved go to: > www.TeachBlindStudents.org > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From alberto.2500 at gmail.com Sun Mar 14 22:52:06 2010 From: alberto.2500 at gmail.com (Alberto Arreola) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 16:52:06 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] What screen readers do you use? In-Reply-To: References: <2A3B4FA8DEB849E89759071F8DCB6F9E@HP31177120642> Message-ID: <4b9d6897.9513f30a.3e24.27e3@mx.google.com> I'm running Jaws 11 on windows Vista, and I like Jacob am running Mobile Speak 4 on an HTC Touch Pro 2 from Verizon. This is a touch screen phone with a full slide out qwerty keyboard. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jacob Struiksma Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 2:15 AM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] What screen readers do you use? I use JAWS 11 on my computer running windows XP service pack 3. I use mobile speak 4 on my smart phone sprint Samsung intrepid phone runs windows mobile professional 6.5. it has a qwerty key board and touch screen. It is very powerful phone and runs great. From Jacob Struiksma Seattle, WA -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jen Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 9:41 AM To: National Association of Blind Students Subject: [nabs-l] What screen readers do you use? Hi Guys, I'm just curious...what screen reader do you use? I use JAWS 8 with Windows XP. I like JAWS 8 very much, especially the Dictionary Manager (I have to have the synthesizer speak words the way I want them pronounced (don't pronounce "Mister" as "M R.") _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lawnmower84%40hotmai l.com No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2742 - Release Date: 03/12/10 11:33:00 _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail .com From kerrik2006 at gmail.com Sun Mar 14 23:10:10 2010 From: kerrik2006 at gmail.com (Kerri Kosten) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 19:10:10 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center In-Reply-To: <409c235c1003131956u6b23cd20qf9245e9e99213fc9@mail.gmail.com> References: <8CC911D4BF8F61C-6064-1163F@webmail-m093.sysops.aol.com> <409c235c1003131956u6b23cd20qf9245e9e99213fc9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi: I am in a similiar situation as you Cassandra. I also want to attend one of the NFB training centers and have had one meeting wiht my counselor. I think she is pretty clueless about blindness because I don't think she is getting what I am asking for and why. It will be a battle for me too as I am from W.VA and as far ad I understand their center is traditional...they put you in an hotel if that tells you anything...and before they put you in an hotel they had dorms... My process has sort of just started but I am very very nervous about the whole going in front of Rehab and the whole justification thing...but I think I will be able to handle it. Also, your state president should be able to help too if Rehab gives you too much of a problem. Just know, and this is definitely easier said than done but it is your right no matter what to go to whichever training center you think will best fit your needs under Informed Choice. It is sure nerve-racking though, especially the way some states put up a fight. I hope I don't have to go to court, but we'll see. Hope that helps! Kerri On 3/13/10, Darian Smith wrote: > Casandra, > Just my little bit of two cents to offer would be this... > I remember thatI needed to justify to my counsoler that what > California ( the state where I was residing) had to offere in > regards to state ran training centers was not what I was going to > best benifit from. > to do this I had to do some research into the center(s) the state > wanted to send me to and then do research on the NFB training center > (s) I wanted to go to. > Once I gathered my facts, i wrote a letter of justification ( a > letter clearly articulating the main things I am wanting to gain from > taking the time to gain skills, and what the NFB center offers that > the state ran center does not.) > Unfortunately, I no longer have that letter, as it went into nothing > ness when my computer died on me some years back. > I'm very positive that there are many people hereon this list > that have stories to share that may be more helful than mine. That > said, I hope my story helped you a little > best, > Darian > > > > On 3/13/10, cmcerteza at aol.com wrote: >> >> Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I’m new to the list and I >> would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training center but >> my >> counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want >> sponsor >> me. If there’s anyone here with a similar situation in previous years, how >> did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really >> appreciate >> your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation to >> answer my question. >> >> Thanks >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Darian Smith > Skype: The_Blind_Truth > Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com > The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher > recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate > individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your > help! To Get Involved go to: > www.TeachBlindStudents.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kerrik2006%40gmail.com > From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Sun Mar 14 23:50:01 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 16:50:01 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Location of this year's national convention? In-Reply-To: References: <06F64B6E6C394C6DB2145414996C3FE5@HP31177120642> Message-ID: <409c235c1003141650m7460bf7cq85043fde32b13819@mail.gmail.com> Indeed! Saturday through thursday bring your summer clothes and your cowboy boots; I know I will :) for more information here's the link: http://www.nfb.org/nfb/National_Convention.asp On 3/12/10, Diane wrote: > In Dallas, Texas. > I believe from July 3 to 8! > Di > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jen" > To: "National Association of Blind Students" > Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 10:36 AM > Subject: [nabs-l] Location of this year's national convention? > > >> Does anyone know where this year's national convention will take place? >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dianefilipe%40peoplepc.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From fantasyfanatic01 at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 01:38:53 2010 From: fantasyfanatic01 at gmail.com (Franandah Damstra) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 21:38:53 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] newby on list In-Reply-To: <409c235c1003131944g20489b73ob3b785a8be3ed4ff@mail.gmail.com> References: <96A69EC939B24B0ABE60C4F02B781DB4@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> <409c235c1003131944g20489b73ob3b785a8be3ed4ff@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hello! I am the youngest on the list. My name is Franandah. I am a junior in High School. I am fluent in English and Spanish. I am currently learning Japanese and Korean. I am studding to become a Translator and Interpeneter. If you ever want to know something from a teen's prospective, feel free to e-mail me! On 3/13/10, Darian Smith wrote: > hello Josh and welcome to the list! > My name is Darian. I am a student in San francisco at the local > community college here and I am taking general education classes. > I also serve as a board member for the national association of > blind students and as a part of my position serve as membership > co-chair for our membership committee. > We are happy to have you and welcome your wisdom, questions and > encouragement. > Were you able to make it to our parenting call a few weeks back? > Best, > Darian > > On 3/12/10, Josh wrote: >> Hi >> >> I am married, my wife is blind and our son is three years old and sighted. >> we plan to home-school him. >> >> Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com >> my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired >> of >> Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, >> get >> a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, >> or >> knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the >> most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at >> www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max >> or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Darian Smith > Skype: The_Blind_Truth > Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com > The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher > recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate > individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your > help! To Get Involved go to: > www.TeachBlindStudents.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/fantasyfanatic01%40gmail.com > From fantasyfanatic01 at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 01:39:59 2010 From: fantasyfanatic01 at gmail.com (Franandah Damstra) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 21:39:59 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] icelandic language In-Reply-To: <39AF5739AC684DB690F2672987D50430@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> References: <39AF5739AC684DB690F2672987D50430@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Message-ID: I don't, however, there are many places where you could look it up. I've searched around and Ive found the codes for Japanese and Korean. I know they are out there. I could take a look and get back to you. On 3/12/10, Josh wrote: > hi > > does anyone know the braille code for writing the icelandic language? > > Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com > my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of > Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get > a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or > knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the > most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at > www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max > or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/fantasyfanatic01%40gmail.com > From fantasyfanatic01 at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 01:41:16 2010 From: fantasyfanatic01 at gmail.com (Franandah Damstra) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 21:41:16 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] What screen readers do you use? In-Reply-To: References: <2A3B4FA8DEB849E89759071F8DCB6F9E@HP31177120642> Message-ID: I use Jaws 11 on my computer. I use Jaws 6 Mobile for my Pacmate. I also use Rockbox for my ipod. On 3/13/10, Jacob Struiksma wrote: > I use JAWS 11 on my computer running windows XP service pack 3. I use > mobile speak 4 on my smart phone sprint Samsung intrepid phone runs > windows mobile professional 6.5. it has a qwerty key board and touch > screen. It is very powerful phone and runs great. > From > Jacob Struiksma > Seattle, WA > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of Jen > Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 9:41 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students > Subject: [nabs-l] What screen readers do you use? > > Hi Guys, > > I'm just curious...what screen reader do you use? I use JAWS 8 with Windows > XP. I like JAWS 8 very much, especially the Dictionary Manager (I have to > have the synthesizer speak words the way I want them pronounced (don't > pronounce "Mister" as "M R.") > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lawnmower84%40hotmai > l.com > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2742 - Release Date: 03/12/10 > 11:33:00 > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/fantasyfanatic01%40gmail.com > From lizmohnke at hotmail.com Mon Mar 15 04:07:56 2010 From: lizmohnke at hotmail.com (Elizabeth) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 00:07:56 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Self- Defense Class Anyone? In-Reply-To: References: <2A3B4FA8DEB849E89759071F8DCB6F9E@HP31177120642>, , Message-ID: Hello List, For financial aid purposes, I signed up for a one-weekend self- Defense class. I thought it was a bit later in the semester, but as it turns out, it’s this upcoming weekend. Anyway, has anyone ever taken a self- Defense class before, and if so, were there any accommodations that you needed to make so you could fully participate in the class? I know this might be a bit last minute, but I would greatly appreciate any advice. I just sent my professor an email, so hopefully I will be able to talk to him before the class begins on Saturday. But in the meantime, it would be great to hear from anyone who has taken a self- Defense class before. Thanks, Elizabeth _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft’s powerful SPAM protection. http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/210850552/direct/01/ From mewhalen at wisc.edu Mon Mar 15 04:17:35 2010 From: mewhalen at wisc.edu (Meghan Whalen) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 22:17:35 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] OT: BookSense XT Raffle Message-ID: The Wisconsin Association of Guide dog Users is raffling off a BookSense XT which was generously donated by Roger Behm of Adaptive Information Systems Inc. This handy little gadget can play NLS digital Talking Books, music, .doc and .docx files, txt and so so much more! There are Bluetooth capabilities built right into the machine, an fm radio, a clock and other nifty little features. This sleek little machine can be mistaken for the common cellphone on the street, and comes with a 2 gig sd card for storing all of your data. There is also 8 gigs of built in memory! Do not be deceived though, for this is simply a slick little book reader and is only pretending to be a cellphone. 1000 tickets have been printed, so your chances are pretty high! 1 ticket costs $2 and 3 for $5. The drawing will be held on April 25 in Appleton Wisconsin at the National Federation of the Blind of Wisconsin state convention. If you're interested in winning this cute little fellow, please send checks to: Meghan Whalen 2566 Hoard St apt. 2 Madison WI 53704 All checks should be payable to the Wisconsin Association of Dog Guide Users. Upon receipt of your payment, I will fill out your tickets and enter them in our drawing. If possible, a Braille note identifying who you are would be a huge help. So, in short, here's the steps for buying tickets: 1. Grab an envelope 2. Write out a check for the number of tickets you would like to purchase. 3. Write down your name, phone, address, number of tickets purchasing and amount enclosed (preferably in Braille) and place it in the envelope. 4. Reply to this email with the same information provided in #3 for our records. 5. Alternatively, bring plenty of cash in your sweaty little hands to convention to purchase tickets from a friendly WAGDU representative. 6. Wait with baited breath for April 25 and see if you win. Thank you very much in advance for supporting the Wisconsin Association of Guide Dog Users. Sincerely, Meghan Whalen, President Wisconsin Association of Guide Dog Users From thebluesisloose at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 05:40:20 2010 From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com (Beth) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 01:40:20 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center In-Reply-To: <409c235c1003141403k7546ccb0p2fad7a3893a9bab5@mail.gmail.com> References: <8CC911D4BF8F61C-6064-1163F@webmail-m093.sysops.aol.com> <4b9d04e1.e0d4e70a.36b4.0bd8@mx.google.com> <409c235c1003141359v23ffb522n9d0b413773755b96@mail.gmail.com> <409c235c1003141403k7546ccb0p2fad7a3893a9bab5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4383d01d1003142240t508ff7f9vc248a0ac250a0c2a@mail.gmail.com> I am actually trying to go to the CCB in Colorado, but the Division of Blind Services is attempting to deny me. ALso, I have a family that claims they can't afford it. So I would love all the help I can get. Beth On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: > And David is a great example of how to get things done in this situation. > > David, are you at LCB currently? > > > On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >> all, Cindy was absolutely correct; there are a couple of articles >> in the 2010 student slate (see atatchment) that might prove helpful >> here. >> I encourage you to take a moment and check out the slate, it >> certainly is very imformitive and the cast of many that help to put >> it together for us have done a great job on this one! >> Best, >> Darian >> >> On 3/14/10, David wrote: >>> Hi, >>> I had something similar happen to me in Mississippi very recently. I had >>> to >>> go all the way to a hearing in order for me to go to the Louisiana Center >>> for the Blind. The state didn't want to pay for out-of-state training >>> because they felt that there training center in Tupelo was equivalent. >>> You >>> should get your councilor's response in writing so that it is official >>> that >>> your councilor is taking this stance. Also, you should justify why you >>> should go to an NFB training center rather than the in-state facility, >>> but >>> this should be relatively simple to do. If your councilor refuses, appeal >>> to >>> the regional supervisor, then the director of Blind Services in your >>> state. >>> If all fails, go to a procedural hearing, and present your case. Remember >>> that it is your legal right under informed choice to attend an NFB >>> training >>> center, and these agencies sometimes aren't concerned for there clients, >>> but >>> rather with themselves, as is the case with Mississippi. Feel free to >>> contact me off-list if you have further questions. >>> David >>> >>> -----Original Message-- >>> --- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>> Behalf >>> Of cmcerteza at aol.com >>> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 5:38 PM >>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>> >>> >>> Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I'm new to the list and I >>> would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training center but >>> my >>> counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want >>> sponsor >>> me. If there's anyone here with a similar situation in previous years, >>> how >>> did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really >>> appreciate >>> your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation to >>> answer my question. >>> >>> Thanks >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>> m >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Darian Smith >> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >> help! To Get Involved go to: >> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >> > > > -- > Darian Smith > Skype: The_Blind_Truth > Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com > The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher > recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate > individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your > help! To Get Involved go to: > www.TeachBlindStudents.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com > From davidb521 at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 12:22:58 2010 From: davidb521 at gmail.com (David) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 07:22:58 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center In-Reply-To: <4383d01d1003142240t508ff7f9vc248a0ac250a0c2a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4b9e26c1.ddb9e70a.1342.0ccc@mx.google.com> Hi. I am currently attending LCB. Beth, your family should not have to pay for training at CCB out of there pocket. You could always try doing what I did, by going to a hearing if all of the other VR officials deny your request. What state are you in? David -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Beth Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 12:40 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center I am actually trying to go to the CCB in Colorado, but the Division of Blind Services is attempting to deny me. ALso, I have a family that claims they can't afford it. So I would love all the help I can get. Beth On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: > And David is a great example of how to get things done in this situation. > > David, are you at LCB currently? > > > On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >> all, Cindy was absolutely correct; there are a couple of articles >> in the 2010 student slate (see atatchment) that might prove helpful >> here. >> I encourage you to take a moment and check out the slate, it >> certainly is very imformitive and the cast of many that help to put >> it together for us have done a great job on this one! >> Best, >> Darian >> >> On 3/14/10, David wrote: >>> Hi, >>> I had something similar happen to me in Mississippi very recently. I had >>> to >>> go all the way to a hearing in order for me to go to the Louisiana Center >>> for the Blind. The state didn't want to pay for out-of-state training >>> because they felt that there training center in Tupelo was equivalent. >>> You >>> should get your councilor's response in writing so that it is official >>> that >>> your councilor is taking this stance. Also, you should justify why you >>> should go to an NFB training center rather than the in-state facility, >>> but >>> this should be relatively simple to do. If your councilor refuses, appeal >>> to >>> the regional supervisor, then the director of Blind Services in your >>> state. >>> If all fails, go to a procedural hearing, and present your case. Remember >>> that it is your legal right under informed choice to attend an NFB >>> training >>> center, and these agencies sometimes aren't concerned for there clients, >>> but >>> rather with themselves, as is the case with Mississippi. Feel free to >>> contact me off-list if you have further questions. >>> David >>> >>> -----Original Message-- >>> --- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>> Behalf >>> Of cmcerteza at aol.com >>> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 5:38 PM >>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>> >>> >>> Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I'm new to the list and I >>> would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training center but >>> my >>> counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want >>> sponsor >>> me. If there's anyone here with a similar situation in previous years, >>> how >>> did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really >>> appreciate >>> your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation to >>> answer my question. >>> >>> Thanks >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>> m >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.co m >>> >> >> >> -- >> Darian Smith >> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >> help! To Get Involved go to: >> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >> > > > -- > Darian Smith > Skype: The_Blind_Truth > Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com > The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher > recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate > individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your > help! To Get Involved go to: > www.TeachBlindStudents.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gm ail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co m From raniaismail04 at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 13:23:25 2010 From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania ) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 08:23:25 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <4b9e26cd.4133e70a.0974.1605@mx.google.com> I had to fight with mine to let me go to BISM instead of the two centers my state has! I rote a letter and kept calling to find out ware the process was and I went. I know it is not easy but you have to put everything in writing and just keep on top of them about it! Rania, -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kerri Kosten Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 6:10 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center Hi: I am in a similiar situation as you Cassandra. I also want to attend one of the NFB training centers and have had one meeting wiht my counselor. I think she is pretty clueless about blindness because I don't think she is getting what I am asking for and why. It will be a battle for me too as I am from W.VA and as far ad I understand their center is traditional...they put you in an hotel if that tells you anything...and before they put you in an hotel they had dorms... My process has sort of just started but I am very very nervous about the whole going in front of Rehab and the whole justification thing...but I think I will be able to handle it. Also, your state president should be able to help too if Rehab gives you too much of a problem. Just know, and this is definitely easier said than done but it is your right no matter what to go to whichever training center you think will best fit your needs under Informed Choice. It is sure nerve-racking though, especially the way some states put up a fight. I hope I don't have to go to court, but we'll see. Hope that helps! Kerri On 3/13/10, Darian Smith wrote: > Casandra, > Just my little bit of two cents to offer would be this... > I remember thatI needed to justify to my counsoler that what > California ( the state where I was residing) had to offere in > regards to state ran training centers was not what I was going to > best benifit from. > to do this I had to do some research into the center(s) the state > wanted to send me to and then do research on the NFB training center > (s) I wanted to go to. > Once I gathered my facts, i wrote a letter of justification ( a > letter clearly articulating the main things I am wanting to gain from > taking the time to gain skills, and what the NFB center offers that > the state ran center does not.) Unfortunately, I no longer have that > letter, as it went into nothing ness when my computer died on me some > years back. > I'm very positive that there are many people hereon this list > that have stories to share that may be more helful than mine. That > said, I hope my story helped you a little best, > Darian > > > > On 3/13/10, cmcerteza at aol.com wrote: >> >> Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I'm new to the list >> and I would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training >> center but my counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services >> does not want sponsor me. If there's anyone here with a similar >> situation in previous years, how did you manage to go to the NFB >> training centers? I would really appreciate your comments and >> suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation to answer my >> question. >> >> Thanks >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40g >> mail.com >> > > > -- > Darian Smith > Skype: The_Blind_Truth > Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the > Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help > attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of > blindness education, and we need your > help! To Get Involved go to: > www.TeachBlindStudents.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kerrik2006%40g > mail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai l.com No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.790 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2748 - Release Date: 03/15/10 02:33:00 From thebluesisloose at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 14:00:06 2010 From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com (Beth) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 10:00:06 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center In-Reply-To: <4b9e26c1.ddb9e70a.1342.0ccc@mx.google.com> References: <4383d01d1003142240t508ff7f9vc248a0ac250a0c2a@mail.gmail.com> <4b9e26c1.ddb9e70a.1342.0ccc@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <4383d01d1003150700x1e230b32wa798b7b22dd91fb9@mail.gmail.com> I am in Florida. I am currently fighting to get to CCB from Florida, which has a traditional center in Daytona Beach. Beth On 3/15/10, David wrote: > Hi. > I am currently attending LCB. Beth, your family should not have to pay for > training at CCB out of there pocket. You could always try doing what I did, > by going to a hearing if all of the other VR officials deny your request. > What state are you in? > David > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of Beth > Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 12:40 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center > > I am actually trying to go to the CCB in Colorado, but the Division of > Blind Services is attempting to deny me. ALso, I have a family that > claims they can't afford it. So I would love all the help I can get. > Beth > > On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >> And David is a great example of how to get things done in this > situation. >> >> David, are you at LCB currently? >> >> >> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>> all, Cindy was absolutely correct; there are a couple of articles >>> in the 2010 student slate (see atatchment) that might prove helpful >>> here. >>> I encourage you to take a moment and check out the slate, it >>> certainly is very imformitive and the cast of many that help to put >>> it together for us have done a great job on this one! >>> Best, >>> Darian >>> >>> On 3/14/10, David wrote: >>>> Hi, >>>> I had something similar happen to me in Mississippi very recently. I had >>>> to >>>> go all the way to a hearing in order for me to go to the Louisiana > Center >>>> for the Blind. The state didn't want to pay for out-of-state training >>>> because they felt that there training center in Tupelo was equivalent. >>>> You >>>> should get your councilor's response in writing so that it is official >>>> that >>>> your councilor is taking this stance. Also, you should justify why you >>>> should go to an NFB training center rather than the in-state facility, >>>> but >>>> this should be relatively simple to do. If your councilor refuses, > appeal >>>> to >>>> the regional supervisor, then the director of Blind Services in your >>>> state. >>>> If all fails, go to a procedural hearing, and present your case. > Remember >>>> that it is your legal right under informed choice to attend an NFB >>>> training >>>> center, and these agencies sometimes aren't concerned for there clients, >>>> but >>>> rather with themselves, as is the case with Mississippi. Feel free to >>>> contact me off-list if you have further questions. >>>> David >>>> >>>> -----Original Message-- >>>> --- >>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>>> Behalf >>>> Of cmcerteza at aol.com >>>> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 5:38 PM >>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>>> >>>> >>>> Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I'm new to the list and > I >>>> would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training center > but >>>> my >>>> counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want >>>> sponsor >>>> me. If there's anyone here with a similar situation in previous years, >>>> how >>>> did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really >>>> appreciate >>>> your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation to >>>> answer my question. >>>> >>>> Thanks >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>>> m >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.co > m >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Darian Smith >>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>> >> >> >> -- >> Darian Smith >> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >> help! To Get Involved go to: >> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gm > ail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co > m > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com > From dlawless86 at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 14:49:53 2010 From: dlawless86 at gmail.com (Domonique Lawless) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 09:49:53 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center In-Reply-To: <4b9e26c1.ddb9e70a.1342.0ccc@mx.google.com> References: <4383d01d1003142240t508ff7f9vc248a0ac250a0c2a@mail.gmail.com> <4b9e26c1.ddb9e70a.1342.0ccc@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <423e6e461003150749m3a18aacana003fd4cb1179a55@mail.gmail.com> To all those interested in going to NFB training centers: Remember that when you explain to your VR counselors why you want to go to an NFB center that you provide logical justification for your desire to go there. You can't just say "LCB, CCB, or Blind INC. is better." you have to provide reasons why they are better centers and how those centers can better teach you the skills you need. Darian is right when he says you should right a justification letter. If your thoughts are laid out on paper (or e-mail) and are clear then they wil have a harder time denying you. Also, do as muchh research on your state center and the NFB center of your choice as possible. Another helpful thing to do would be to read the VR handbook of rights and regulations. I don't know what the proper title for it is but I am sure that there should be one for every state. Remember that if you present yourself as an active and knowledgeable consumer then you will be taken more seriously. I hope this helps! Domonique On 3/15/10, David wrote: > Hi. > I am currently attending LCB. Beth, your family should not have to pay for > training at CCB out of there pocket. You could always try doing what I did, > by going to a hearing if all of the other VR officials deny your request. > What state are you in? > David > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of Beth > Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 12:40 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center > > I am actually trying to go to the CCB in Colorado, but the Division of > Blind Services is attempting to deny me. ALso, I have a family that > claims they can't afford it. So I would love all the help I can get. > Beth > > On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >> And David is a great example of how to get things done in this > situation. >> >> David, are you at LCB currently? >> >> >> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>> all, Cindy was absolutely correct; there are a couple of articles >>> in the 2010 student slate (see atatchment) that might prove helpful >>> here. >>> I encourage you to take a moment and check out the slate, it >>> certainly is very imformitive and the cast of many that help to put >>> it together for us have done a great job on this one! >>> Best, >>> Darian >>> >>> On 3/14/10, David wrote: >>>> Hi, >>>> I had something similar happen to me in Mississippi very recently. I had >>>> to >>>> go all the way to a hearing in order for me to go to the Louisiana > Center >>>> for the Blind. The state didn't want to pay for out-of-state training >>>> because they felt that there training center in Tupelo was equivalent. >>>> You >>>> should get your councilor's response in writing so that it is official >>>> that >>>> your councilor is taking this stance. Also, you should justify why you >>>> should go to an NFB training center rather than the in-state facility, >>>> but >>>> this should be relatively simple to do. If your councilor refuses, > appeal >>>> to >>>> the regional supervisor, then the director of Blind Services in your >>>> state. >>>> If all fails, go to a procedural hearing, and present your case. > Remember >>>> that it is your legal right under informed choice to attend an NFB >>>> training >>>> center, and these agencies sometimes aren't concerned for there clients, >>>> but >>>> rather with themselves, as is the case with Mississippi. Feel free to >>>> contact me off-list if you have further questions. >>>> David >>>> >>>> -----Original Message-- >>>> --- >>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>>> Behalf >>>> Of cmcerteza at aol.com >>>> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 5:38 PM >>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>>> >>>> >>>> Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I'm new to the list and > I >>>> would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training center > but >>>> my >>>> counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want >>>> sponsor >>>> me. If there's anyone here with a similar situation in previous years, >>>> how >>>> did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really >>>> appreciate >>>> your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation to >>>> answer my question. >>>> >>>> Thanks >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>>> m >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.co > m >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Darian Smith >>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>> >> >> >> -- >> Darian Smith >> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >> help! To Get Involved go to: >> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gm > ail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co > m > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dlawless86%40gmail.com > From joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 15:58:46 2010 From: joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com (RJ Sandefur) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 11:58:46 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center References: <4383d01d1003142240t508ff7f9vc248a0ac250a0c2a@mail.gmail.com><4b9e26c1.ddb9e70a.1342.0ccc@mx.google.com> <4383d01d1003150700x1e230b32wa798b7b22dd91fb9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <5E244CACE9AA4810BFDE44AD2B6CAEA6@hometwxakonvzn> Could you provide us with a sample justification letter? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Beth" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 10:00 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >I am in Florida. I am currently fighting to get to CCB from Florida, > which has a traditional center in Daytona Beach. > Beth > > On 3/15/10, David wrote: >> Hi. >> I am currently attending LCB. Beth, your family should not have to pay >> for >> training at CCB out of there pocket. You could always try doing what I >> did, >> by going to a hearing if all of the other VR officials deny your request. >> What state are you in? >> David >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of Beth >> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 12:40 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >> >> I am actually trying to go to the CCB in Colorado, but the Division of >> Blind Services is attempting to deny me. ALso, I have a family that >> claims they can't afford it. So I would love all the help I can get. >> Beth >> >> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>> And David is a great example of how to get things done in this >> situation. >>> >>> David, are you at LCB currently? >>> >>> >>> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>>> all, Cindy was absolutely correct; there are a couple of articles >>>> in the 2010 student slate (see atatchment) that might prove helpful >>>> here. >>>> I encourage you to take a moment and check out the slate, it >>>> certainly is very imformitive and the cast of many that help to put >>>> it together for us have done a great job on this one! >>>> Best, >>>> Darian >>>> >>>> On 3/14/10, David wrote: >>>>> Hi, >>>>> I had something similar happen to me in Mississippi very recently. I >>>>> had >>>>> to >>>>> go all the way to a hearing in order for me to go to the Louisiana >> Center >>>>> for the Blind. The state didn't want to pay for out-of-state training >>>>> because they felt that there training center in Tupelo was equivalent. >>>>> You >>>>> should get your councilor's response in writing so that it is official >>>>> that >>>>> your councilor is taking this stance. Also, you should justify why you >>>>> should go to an NFB training center rather than the in-state facility, >>>>> but >>>>> this should be relatively simple to do. If your councilor refuses, >> appeal >>>>> to >>>>> the regional supervisor, then the director of Blind Services in your >>>>> state. >>>>> If all fails, go to a procedural hearing, and present your case. >> Remember >>>>> that it is your legal right under informed choice to attend an NFB >>>>> training >>>>> center, and these agencies sometimes aren't concerned for there >>>>> clients, >>>>> but >>>>> rather with themselves, as is the case with Mississippi. Feel free to >>>>> contact me off-list if you have further questions. >>>>> David >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message-- >>>>> --- >>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>>>> Behalf >>>>> Of cmcerteza at aol.com >>>>> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 5:38 PM >>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I'm new to the list >>>>> and >> I >>>>> would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training center >> but >>>>> my >>>>> counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want >>>>> sponsor >>>>> me. If there's anyone here with a similar situation in previous years, >>>>> how >>>>> did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really >>>>> appreciate >>>>> your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation >>>>> to >>>>> answer my question. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>>>> m >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.co >> m >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Darian Smith >>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Darian Smith >>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gm >> ail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >> m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com From jj at bestmidi.com Mon Mar 15 16:37:57 2010 From: jj at bestmidi.com (J.J. Meddaugh) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 12:37:57 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] OT: BookSense XT Raffle References: Message-ID: <53A9328F586C466CA34556D7FA01DA28@jage> Do you accept Paypal for those of us who don't know what a checkbook is anymore? Thanks. J.J. From jackson.dezman at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 17:12:03 2010 From: jackson.dezman at gmail.com (Dezman Jackson) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 12:12:03 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center References: <8CC911D4BF8F61C-6064-1163F@webmail-m093.sysops.aol.com><4b9d04e1.e0d4e70a.36b4.0bd8@mx.google.com> <409c235c1003141359v23ffb522n9d0b413773755b96@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <81CFA750E2C2478D98FCDFD3D69BDFE0@Dezman> I second that Darian. All would do well to take a look at this month's Student Slate. Dezman ----- Original Message ----- From: "Darian Smith" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 3:59 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center > all, Cindy was absolutely correct; there are a couple of articles > in the 2010 student slate (see atatchment) that might prove helpful > here. > I encourage you to take a moment and check out the slate, it > certainly is very imformitive and the cast of many that help to put > it together for us have done a great job on this one! > Best, > Darian > > On 3/14/10, David wrote: >> Hi, >> I had something similar happen to me in Mississippi very recently. I had >> to >> go all the way to a hearing in order for me to go to the Louisiana Center >> for the Blind. The state didn't want to pay for out-of-state training >> because they felt that there training center in Tupelo was equivalent. >> You >> should get your councilor's response in writing so that it is official >> that >> your councilor is taking this stance. Also, you should justify why you >> should go to an NFB training center rather than the in-state facility, >> but >> this should be relatively simple to do. If your councilor refuses, appeal >> to >> the regional supervisor, then the director of Blind Services in your >> state. >> If all fails, go to a procedural hearing, and present your case. Remember >> that it is your legal right under informed choice to attend an NFB >> training >> center, and these agencies sometimes aren't concerned for there clients, >> but >> rather with themselves, as is the case with Mississippi. Feel free to >> contact me off-list if you have further questions. >> David >> >> -----Original Message-- >> --- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of cmcerteza at aol.com >> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 5:38 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >> >> >> Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I'm new to the list and I >> would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training center but >> my >> counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want >> sponsor >> me. If there's anyone here with a similar situation in previous years, >> how >> did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really >> appreciate >> your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation to >> answer my question. >> >> Thanks >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >> m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Darian Smith > Skype: The_Blind_Truth > Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com > The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher > recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate > individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your > help! To Get Involved go to: > www.TeachBlindStudents.org > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jackson.dezman%40gmail.com > From jkenn337 at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 17:13:59 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 13:13:59 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] nvda and system access outperforming jaws for college class Message-ID: Hi I'm taking an online class, free one week seminar online to see how the screen readers perform with blackboard and the online classroom. my ratings: system access 100% nvda 95% jaws maybe 10% ok lets do scale from one to ten. 10 is best 1 is worst. system access: 10 NVDA, 10 jaws, 3 its kind of amazing that two free and very very low cost screen readers are outperforming jaws11, bigtime! I just might run the latest knopix-adriane distribution in a vm to see how that works with the online classroom. but any Linux distribution with the orca screen reader should yield similar results I just like knoppix because its easy to use and you don't have to be a linux expert unless you want to be in which case it lets you do that also when you are ready. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. From jkenn337 at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 17:23:23 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 13:23:23 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] nfb training centers Message-ID: <6C436D2431094C19B3D0156A36B7B73C@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Hi I attended the colorado center for the blind in colorado. It was an excellent experience and I learned a lot.. I now can get around my city back home in PA and visit people and stuff and hopefully once voc rehab gets me better computer I'll be attending capella university online then getting a job in computer tech support, sales, or access tech training job. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. From jkenn337 at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 17:28:53 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 13:28:53 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] nfb training centers and gps Message-ID: Hi shortly after I got back from the colorado nfb center I bought a nokia e51 and I got talks from someone, a gps receiver and use loadstone gps. I find using loadstone gps as a navigational aid really helps me. for those who are on a tight budget who want gps but can't afford sendero products here's what to do. go to ebay and get a nokia 6682 or get one from somewhere found'em on ebay for $30 or so. go to www.nuance-talks.com click the english link and get talks for $30 . go to ebay and get the IBlue 737a+ gps receiver for $60 or so. there, now ya got gps for $120. oh yeah and get loadstone gps and read my blog at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net to get info on setting it up and read the manual on the loadstone gps website. gps is an excellent navigational aid. combine it with traning from one of the centers and you won't get lost and will always know where you are located at. From herekittykat2 at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 17:59:34 2010 From: herekittykat2 at gmail.com (Jewel S.) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 13:59:34 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center In-Reply-To: <423e6e461003150749m3a18aacana003fd4cb1179a55@mail.gmail.com> References: <4383d01d1003142240t508ff7f9vc248a0ac250a0c2a@mail.gmail.com> <4b9e26c1.ddb9e70a.1342.0ccc@mx.google.com> <423e6e461003150749m3a18aacana003fd4cb1179a55@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <196c01b01003151059o64ac75fcj1f3a75e01b1a0182@mail.gmail.com> I had a question on this topic...I went to the state rehab center. While it was helpful, it did not help me as much as I felt I needed. I did not get any consumer education or college prep, and I feel that my O&M is still not up to par. The training was only 15 weeks, and so I did not get the chance to learn everything I felt I needed. Is this enough justification to request attending a NFB training center, to get more training in O&M and Braille than 15 weeks can provide, and to get self-esteem training (something I lack a bit, especially when I am stressed). And because I have attended the state rehab center, can I still attend an NFB center, or am I likely to be turned down because of my attendance at the state center? ~Jewel On 3/15/10, Domonique Lawless wrote: > To all those interested in going to NFB training centers: > > Remember that when you explain to your VR counselors why you want to > go to an NFB center that you provide logical justification for your > desire to go there. You can't just say "LCB, CCB, or Blind INC. is > better." you have to provide reasons why they are better centers and > how those centers can better teach you the skills you need. Darian is > right when he says you should right a justification letter. If your > thoughts are laid out on paper (or e-mail) and are clear then they wil > have a harder time denying you. Also, do as muchh research on your > state center and the NFB center of your choice as possible. Another > helpful thing to do would be to read the VR handbook of rights and > regulations. I don't know what the proper title for it is but I am > sure that there should be one for every state. Remember that if you > present yourself as an active and knowledgeable consumer then you will > be taken more seriously. > > I hope this helps! > Domonique > > On 3/15/10, David wrote: >> Hi. >> I am currently attending LCB. Beth, your family should not have to pay for >> training at CCB out of there pocket. You could always try doing what I >> did, >> by going to a hearing if all of the other VR officials deny your request. >> What state are you in? >> David >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of Beth >> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 12:40 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >> >> I am actually trying to go to the CCB in Colorado, but the Division of >> Blind Services is attempting to deny me. ALso, I have a family that >> claims they can't afford it. So I would love all the help I can get. >> Beth >> >> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>> And David is a great example of how to get things done in this >> situation. >>> >>> David, are you at LCB currently? >>> >>> >>> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>>> all, Cindy was absolutely correct; there are a couple of articles >>>> in the 2010 student slate (see atatchment) that might prove helpful >>>> here. >>>> I encourage you to take a moment and check out the slate, it >>>> certainly is very imformitive and the cast of many that help to put >>>> it together for us have done a great job on this one! >>>> Best, >>>> Darian >>>> >>>> On 3/14/10, David wrote: >>>>> Hi, >>>>> I had something similar happen to me in Mississippi very recently. I >>>>> had >>>>> to >>>>> go all the way to a hearing in order for me to go to the Louisiana >> Center >>>>> for the Blind. The state didn't want to pay for out-of-state training >>>>> because they felt that there training center in Tupelo was equivalent. >>>>> You >>>>> should get your councilor's response in writing so that it is official >>>>> that >>>>> your councilor is taking this stance. Also, you should justify why you >>>>> should go to an NFB training center rather than the in-state facility, >>>>> but >>>>> this should be relatively simple to do. If your councilor refuses, >> appeal >>>>> to >>>>> the regional supervisor, then the director of Blind Services in your >>>>> state. >>>>> If all fails, go to a procedural hearing, and present your case. >> Remember >>>>> that it is your legal right under informed choice to attend an NFB >>>>> training >>>>> center, and these agencies sometimes aren't concerned for there >>>>> clients, >>>>> but >>>>> rather with themselves, as is the case with Mississippi. Feel free to >>>>> contact me off-list if you have further questions. >>>>> David >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message-- >>>>> --- >>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>>>> Behalf >>>>> Of cmcerteza at aol.com >>>>> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 5:38 PM >>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I'm new to the list and >> I >>>>> would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training center >> but >>>>> my >>>>> counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want >>>>> sponsor >>>>> me. If there's anyone here with a similar situation in previous years, >>>>> how >>>>> did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really >>>>> appreciate >>>>> your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation to >>>>> answer my question. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>>>> m >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.co >> m >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Darian Smith >>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Darian Smith >>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gm >> ail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >> m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dlawless86%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat2%40gmail.com > From kramc11 at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 18:12:55 2010 From: kramc11 at gmail.com (Mark J. Cadigan) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 14:12:55 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center In-Reply-To: <4383d01d1003150700x1e230b32wa798b7b22dd91fb9@mail.gmail.com> References: <4383d01d1003142240t508ff7f9vc248a0ac250a0c2a@mail.gmail.com><4b9e26c1.ddb9e70a.1342.0ccc@mx.google.com> <4383d01d1003150700x1e230b32wa798b7b22dd91fb9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: What is a "traditional center"? What are the benefits of a NFB center? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Beth" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 10:00 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >I am in Florida. I am currently fighting to get to CCB from Florida, > which has a traditional center in Daytona Beach. > Beth > > On 3/15/10, David wrote: >> Hi. >> I am currently attending LCB. Beth, your family should not have to pay >> for >> training at CCB out of there pocket. You could always try doing what I >> did, >> by going to a hearing if all of the other VR officials deny your request. >> What state are you in? >> David >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of Beth >> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 12:40 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >> >> I am actually trying to go to the CCB in Colorado, but the Division of >> Blind Services is attempting to deny me. ALso, I have a family that >> claims they can't afford it. So I would love all the help I can get. >> Beth >> >> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>> And David is a great example of how to get things done in this >> situation. >>> >>> David, are you at LCB currently? >>> >>> >>> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>>> all, Cindy was absolutely correct; there are a couple of articles >>>> in the 2010 student slate (see atatchment) that might prove helpful >>>> here. >>>> I encourage you to take a moment and check out the slate, it >>>> certainly is very imformitive and the cast of many that help to put >>>> it together for us have done a great job on this one! >>>> Best, >>>> Darian >>>> >>>> On 3/14/10, David wrote: >>>>> Hi, >>>>> I had something similar happen to me in Mississippi very recently. I >>>>> had >>>>> to >>>>> go all the way to a hearing in order for me to go to the Louisiana >> Center >>>>> for the Blind. The state didn't want to pay for out-of-state training >>>>> because they felt that there training center in Tupelo was equivalent. >>>>> You >>>>> should get your councilor's response in writing so that it is official >>>>> that >>>>> your councilor is taking this stance. Also, you should justify why you >>>>> should go to an NFB training center rather than the in-state facility, >>>>> but >>>>> this should be relatively simple to do. If your councilor refuses, >> appeal >>>>> to >>>>> the regional supervisor, then the director of Blind Services in your >>>>> state. >>>>> If all fails, go to a procedural hearing, and present your case. >> Remember >>>>> that it is your legal right under informed choice to attend an NFB >>>>> training >>>>> center, and these agencies sometimes aren't concerned for there >>>>> clients, >>>>> but >>>>> rather with themselves, as is the case with Mississippi. Feel free to >>>>> contact me off-list if you have further questions. >>>>> David >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message-- >>>>> --- >>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>>>> Behalf >>>>> Of cmcerteza at aol.com >>>>> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 5:38 PM >>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I'm new to the list >>>>> and >> I >>>>> would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training center >> but >>>>> my >>>>> counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want >>>>> sponsor >>>>> me. If there's anyone here with a similar situation in previous years, >>>>> how >>>>> did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really >>>>> appreciate >>>>> your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation >>>>> to >>>>> answer my question. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>>>> m >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.co >> m >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Darian Smith >>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Darian Smith >>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gm >> ail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >> m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11%40gmail.com From thebluesisloose at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 18:26:38 2010 From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com (Beth) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 14:26:38 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center Message-ID: <4b9e7bc0.15dbf10a.615f.156d@mx.google.com> bethThat actually might be helpful. From thebluesisloose at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 18:26:40 2010 From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com (Beth) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 14:26:40 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center Message-ID: <4b9e7bc3.15dbf10a.615f.156e@mx.google.com> I wrote a justification letter and everything stating that Colorado was better because of the philosophical things it does and how ithelps the clients and that I had issues with my state center, but the VR people said there were closer centers that were comprable. What a joke! Anyway, if I go to CCB, if anyone is interested, I'd like to blog about my experiences for all the folks to read. Beth From thebluesisloose at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 18:26:43 2010 From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com (Beth) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 14:26:43 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] nfb training centers Message-ID: <4b9e7bc6.15dbf10a.615f.156f@mx.google.com> Wow. Was it cold up there? I want to attend CCB so bad right now. It's like getting to class is a battle and a half, and I hope CCB will help me come up with ideas for making a living as well as better my travel skills and cooking skills and all that good stuff. Beth From nabs.president at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 18:30:11 2010 From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 13:30:11 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center In-Reply-To: References: <4383d01d1003142240t508ff7f9vc248a0ac250a0c2a@mail.gmail.com> <4b9e26c1.ddb9e70a.1342.0ccc@mx.google.com> <4383d01d1003150700x1e230b32wa798b7b22dd91fb9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <85ff10071003151130m6f7b9340sf83970d5cba24d6b@mail.gmail.com> Hi all, A few things that haven't been mentioned yet: -- Definitely make friends with your NFB state president and chapter president, if you haven't already. They can write letters of support for you that you can use along with your justification letter and often have professional connections with people high on the rehab chain of command. -- Some benefits of NFB training centers that will rival almost any state-run center include the following: -- Duration: training lasts for six-nine months. -- Apartment living: You will gain skills that you will need if you want to live independently, skills you can't gain from dorm-style accommodations (cooking, upkeep, cleaning, etc.) -- Structured discovery travel: You will learn how to navigate in unfamiliar places (which you will need if you are attending college or working in a new city/state) -- College prep: In many instances the centers offer the opportunity to take a college class while you are attending. If college is part of your employment plan, highlight this fact. -- Contact the center you want to attend and see if the director will write an additional supporting letter backing up the claims you're making. Best of luck! Arielle On 3/15/10, Mark J. Cadigan wrote: > What is a "traditional center"? What are the benefits of a NFB center? > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Beth" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 10:00 AM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center > > >>I am in Florida. I am currently fighting to get to CCB from Florida, >> which has a traditional center in Daytona Beach. >> Beth >> >> On 3/15/10, David wrote: >>> Hi. >>> I am currently attending LCB. Beth, your family should not have to pay >>> for >>> training at CCB out of there pocket. You could always try doing what I >>> did, >>> by going to a hearing if all of the other VR officials deny your request. >>> What state are you in? >>> David >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>> Behalf >>> Of Beth >>> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 12:40 AM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>> >>> I am actually trying to go to the CCB in Colorado, but the Division of >>> Blind Services is attempting to deny me. ALso, I have a family that >>> claims they can't afford it. So I would love all the help I can get. >>> Beth >>> >>> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>>> And David is a great example of how to get things done in this >>> situation. >>>> >>>> David, are you at LCB currently? >>>> >>>> >>>> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>>>> all, Cindy was absolutely correct; there are a couple of articles >>>>> in the 2010 student slate (see atatchment) that might prove helpful >>>>> here. >>>>> I encourage you to take a moment and check out the slate, it >>>>> certainly is very imformitive and the cast of many that help to put >>>>> it together for us have done a great job on this one! >>>>> Best, >>>>> Darian >>>>> >>>>> On 3/14/10, David wrote: >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>> I had something similar happen to me in Mississippi very recently. I >>>>>> had >>>>>> to >>>>>> go all the way to a hearing in order for me to go to the Louisiana >>> Center >>>>>> for the Blind. The state didn't want to pay for out-of-state training >>>>>> because they felt that there training center in Tupelo was equivalent. >>>>>> You >>>>>> should get your councilor's response in writing so that it is official >>>>>> that >>>>>> your councilor is taking this stance. Also, you should justify why you >>>>>> should go to an NFB training center rather than the in-state facility, >>>>>> but >>>>>> this should be relatively simple to do. If your councilor refuses, >>> appeal >>>>>> to >>>>>> the regional supervisor, then the director of Blind Services in your >>>>>> state. >>>>>> If all fails, go to a procedural hearing, and present your case. >>> Remember >>>>>> that it is your legal right under informed choice to attend an NFB >>>>>> training >>>>>> center, and these agencies sometimes aren't concerned for there >>>>>> clients, >>>>>> but >>>>>> rather with themselves, as is the case with Mississippi. Feel free to >>>>>> contact me off-list if you have further questions. >>>>>> David >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message-- >>>>>> --- >>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>>>>> Behalf >>>>>> Of cmcerteza at aol.com >>>>>> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 5:38 PM >>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I'm new to the list >>>>>> and >>> I >>>>>> would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training center >>> but >>>>>> my >>>>>> counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want >>>>>> sponsor >>>>>> me. If there's anyone here with a similar situation in previous years, >>>>>> how >>>>>> did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really >>>>>> appreciate >>>>>> your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation >>>>>> to >>>>>> answer my question. >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>>>>> m >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.co >>> m >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Darian Smith >>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Darian Smith >>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gm >>> ail.com >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>> m >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11%40gmail.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com > -- Arielle Silverman President, National Association of Blind Students Phone: 602-502-2255 Email: nabs.president at gmail.com Website: www.nabslink.org From djdrocks4ever at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 18:38:40 2010 From: djdrocks4ever at gmail.com (David Dunphy) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 14:38:40 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center References: <4383d01d1003142240t508ff7f9vc248a0ac250a0c2a@mail.gmail.com><4b9e26c1.ddb9e70a.1342.0ccc@mx.google.com><423e6e461003150749m3a18aacana003fd4cb1179a55@mail.gmail.com> <196c01b01003151059o64ac75fcj1f3a75e01b1a0182@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <90B9C98188A1423E9B07A9D1EFB85E64@radio360usa> This might be an awesome idea for a Nabs conference call. Get someone from each center, maybe a combo of students and staff who work at these centers or who have attended, to answer questions about the centers, their locations, their classes, etc. And maybe have someone there to talk about justification letters and such. It seems that some new folks and others have some questions, so maybe this would be worth the time to talk about. Just my thoughts for what they're worth. ***** Tired of listening to the same old stations playing the same old songs over and over again? Then check out an internet radio station with plenty of interesting programming. Visit the home of Radio360 Where Variety Matters Most at http://www.radio360.us Check it out you won't be disappointed ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jewel S." To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 1:59 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >I had a question on this topic...I went to the state rehab center. > While it was helpful, it did not help me as much as I felt I needed. I > did not get any consumer education or college prep, and I feel that my > O&M is still not up to par. The training was only 15 weeks, and so I > did not get the chance to learn everything I felt I needed. Is this > enough justification to request attending a NFB training center, to > get more training in O&M and Braille than 15 weeks can provide, and to > get self-esteem training (something I lack a bit, especially when I am > stressed). And because I have attended the state rehab center, can I > still attend an NFB center, or am I likely to be turned down because > of my attendance at the state center? > > ~Jewel > > On 3/15/10, Domonique Lawless wrote: >> To all those interested in going to NFB training centers: >> >> Remember that when you explain to your VR counselors why you want to >> go to an NFB center that you provide logical justification for your >> desire to go there. You can't just say "LCB, CCB, or Blind INC. is >> better." you have to provide reasons why they are better centers and >> how those centers can better teach you the skills you need. Darian is >> right when he says you should right a justification letter. If your >> thoughts are laid out on paper (or e-mail) and are clear then they wil >> have a harder time denying you. Also, do as muchh research on your >> state center and the NFB center of your choice as possible. Another >> helpful thing to do would be to read the VR handbook of rights and >> regulations. I don't know what the proper title for it is but I am >> sure that there should be one for every state. Remember that if you >> present yourself as an active and knowledgeable consumer then you will >> be taken more seriously. >> >> I hope this helps! >> Domonique >> >> On 3/15/10, David wrote: >>> Hi. >>> I am currently attending LCB. Beth, your family should not have to pay >>> for >>> training at CCB out of there pocket. You could always try doing what I >>> did, >>> by going to a hearing if all of the other VR officials deny your >>> request. >>> What state are you in? >>> David >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>> Behalf >>> Of Beth >>> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 12:40 AM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>> >>> I am actually trying to go to the CCB in Colorado, but the Division of >>> Blind Services is attempting to deny me. ALso, I have a family that >>> claims they can't afford it. So I would love all the help I can get. >>> Beth >>> >>> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>>> And David is a great example of how to get things done in this >>> situation. >>>> >>>> David, are you at LCB currently? >>>> >>>> >>>> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>>>> all, Cindy was absolutely correct; there are a couple of articles >>>>> in the 2010 student slate (see atatchment) that might prove helpful >>>>> here. >>>>> I encourage you to take a moment and check out the slate, it >>>>> certainly is very imformitive and the cast of many that help to put >>>>> it together for us have done a great job on this one! >>>>> Best, >>>>> Darian >>>>> >>>>> On 3/14/10, David wrote: >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>> I had something similar happen to me in Mississippi very recently. I >>>>>> had >>>>>> to >>>>>> go all the way to a hearing in order for me to go to the Louisiana >>> Center >>>>>> for the Blind. The state didn't want to pay for out-of-state training >>>>>> because they felt that there training center in Tupelo was >>>>>> equivalent. >>>>>> You >>>>>> should get your councilor's response in writing so that it is >>>>>> official >>>>>> that >>>>>> your councilor is taking this stance. Also, you should justify why >>>>>> you >>>>>> should go to an NFB training center rather than the in-state >>>>>> facility, >>>>>> but >>>>>> this should be relatively simple to do. If your councilor refuses, >>> appeal >>>>>> to >>>>>> the regional supervisor, then the director of Blind Services in your >>>>>> state. >>>>>> If all fails, go to a procedural hearing, and present your case. >>> Remember >>>>>> that it is your legal right under informed choice to attend an NFB >>>>>> training >>>>>> center, and these agencies sometimes aren't concerned for there >>>>>> clients, >>>>>> but >>>>>> rather with themselves, as is the case with Mississippi. Feel free to >>>>>> contact me off-list if you have further questions. >>>>>> David >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message-- >>>>>> --- >>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>>>>> Behalf >>>>>> Of cmcerteza at aol.com >>>>>> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 5:38 PM >>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I'm new to the list >>>>>> and >>> I >>>>>> would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training center >>> but >>>>>> my >>>>>> counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want >>>>>> sponsor >>>>>> me. If there's anyone here with a similar situation in previous >>>>>> years, >>>>>> how >>>>>> did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really >>>>>> appreciate >>>>>> your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation >>>>>> to >>>>>> answer my question. >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>>>>> m >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.co >>> m >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Darian Smith >>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Darian Smith >>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gm >>> ail.com >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>> m >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dlawless86%40gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat2%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/djdrocks4ever%40gmail.com > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature database 4946 (20100315) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4946 (20100315) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com From aphelps at bism.org Mon Mar 15 18:41:01 2010 From: aphelps at bism.org (aphelps at bism.org) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 18:41:01 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center In-Reply-To: <196c01b01003151059o64ac75fcj1f3a75e01b1a0182@mail.gmail.com> References: <4383d01d1003142240t508ff7f9vc248a0ac250a0c2a@mail.gmail.com><4b9e26c1.ddb9e70a.1342.0ccc@mx.google.com><423e6e461003150749m3a18aacana003fd4cb1179a55@mail.gmail.com><196c01b01003151059o64ac75fcj1f3a75e01b1a0182@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1211116614-1268678458-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1522072332-@bda473.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Of course you can justify more training. Contact your state president and the director of the center you want to attend. There are many people who have been where you are and were able to go to a QUALITY training center. Don't give up! Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: "Jewel S." Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 13:59:34 To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center I had a question on this topic...I went to the state rehab center. While it was helpful, it did not help me as much as I felt I needed. I did not get any consumer education or college prep, and I feel that my O&M is still not up to par. The training was only 15 weeks, and so I did not get the chance to learn everything I felt I needed. Is this enough justification to request attending a NFB training center, to get more training in O&M and Braille than 15 weeks can provide, and to get self-esteem training (something I lack a bit, especially when I am stressed). And because I have attended the state rehab center, can I still attend an NFB center, or am I likely to be turned down because of my attendance at the state center? ~Jewel On 3/15/10, Domonique Lawless wrote: > To all those interested in going to NFB training centers: > > Remember that when you explain to your VR counselors why you want to > go to an NFB center that you provide logical justification for your > desire to go there. You can't just say "LCB, CCB, or Blind INC. is > better." you have to provide reasons why they are better centers and > how those centers can better teach you the skills you need. Darian is > right when he says you should right a justification letter. If your > thoughts are laid out on paper (or e-mail) and are clear then they wil > have a harder time denying you. Also, do as muchh research on your > state center and the NFB center of your choice as possible. Another > helpful thing to do would be to read the VR handbook of rights and > regulations. I don't know what the proper title for it is but I am > sure that there should be one for every state. Remember that if you > present yourself as an active and knowledgeable consumer then you will > be taken more seriously. > > I hope this helps! > Domonique > > On 3/15/10, David wrote: >> Hi. >> I am currently attending LCB. Beth, your family should not have to pay for >> training at CCB out of there pocket. You could always try doing what I >> did, >> by going to a hearing if all of the other VR officials deny your request. >> What state are you in? >> David >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of Beth >> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 12:40 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >> >> I am actually trying to go to the CCB in Colorado, but the Division of >> Blind Services is attempting to deny me. ALso, I have a family that >> claims they can't afford it. So I would love all the help I can get. >> Beth >> >> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>> And David is a great example of how to get things done in this >> situation. >>> >>> David, are you at LCB currently? >>> >>> >>> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>>> all, Cindy was absolutely correct; there are a couple of articles >>>> in the 2010 student slate (see atatchment) that might prove helpful >>>> here. >>>> I encourage you to take a moment and check out the slate, it >>>> certainly is very imformitive and the cast of many that help to put >>>> it together for us have done a great job on this one! >>>> Best, >>>> Darian >>>> >>>> On 3/14/10, David wrote: >>>>> Hi, >>>>> I had something similar happen to me in Mississippi very recently. I >>>>> had >>>>> to >>>>> go all the way to a hearing in order for me to go to the Louisiana >> Center >>>>> for the Blind. The state didn't want to pay for out-of-state training >>>>> because they felt that there training center in Tupelo was equivalent. >>>>> You >>>>> should get your councilor's response in writing so that it is official >>>>> that >>>>> your councilor is taking this stance. Also, you should justify why you >>>>> should go to an NFB training center rather than the in-state facility, >>>>> but >>>>> this should be relatively simple to do. If your councilor refuses, >> appeal >>>>> to >>>>> the regional supervisor, then the director of Blind Services in your >>>>> state. >>>>> If all fails, go to a procedural hearing, and present your case. >> Remember >>>>> that it is your legal right under informed choice to attend an NFB >>>>> training >>>>> center, and these agencies sometimes aren't concerned for there >>>>> clients, >>>>> but >>>>> rather with themselves, as is the case with Mississippi. Feel free to >>>>> contact me off-list if you have further questions. >>>>> David >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message-- >>>>> --- >>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>>>> Behalf >>>>> Of cmcerteza at aol.com >>>>> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 5:38 PM >>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I'm new to the list and >> I >>>>> would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training center >> but >>>>> my >>>>> counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want >>>>> sponsor >>>>> me. If there's anyone here with a similar situation in previous years, >>>>> how >>>>> did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really >>>>> appreciate >>>>> your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation to >>>>> answer my question. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>>>> m >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.co >> m >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Darian Smith >>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Darian Smith >>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gm >> ail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >> m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dlawless86%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat2%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/aphelps%40bism.org From mewhalen at wisc.edu Mon Mar 15 18:58:36 2010 From: mewhalen at wisc.edu (Meghan Whalen) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 13:58:36 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] OT: BookSense XT Raffle References: <53A9328F586C466CA34556D7FA01DA28@jage> Message-ID: Yes, I do, sorry, I meant to include my email address and paypal info in the first email. mewhalen at wisc.edu Thanks, Meghan ----- Original Message ----- From: "J.J. Meddaugh" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 11:37 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] OT: BookSense XT Raffle > Do you accept Paypal for those of us who don't know what a checkbook is > anymore? > Thanks. > > J.J. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mewhalen%40wisc.edu > From raniaismail04 at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 20:32:52 2010 From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania ) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 15:32:52 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center In-Reply-To: <90B9C98188A1423E9B07A9D1EFB85E64@radio360usa> Message-ID: <4b9e8b76.09cc660a.58b5.732b@mx.google.com> I think that is a great idea! -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of David Dunphy Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 1:39 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center This might be an awesome idea for a Nabs conference call. Get someone from each center, maybe a combo of students and staff who work at these centers or who have attended, to answer questions about the centers, their locations, their classes, etc. And maybe have someone there to talk about justification letters and such. It seems that some new folks and others have some questions, so maybe this would be worth the time to talk about. Just my thoughts for what they're worth. ***** Tired of listening to the same old stations playing the same old songs over and over again? Then check out an internet radio station with plenty of interesting programming. Visit the home of Radio360 Where Variety Matters Most at http://www.radio360.us Check it out you won't be disappointed ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jewel S." To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 1:59 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >I had a question on this topic...I went to the state rehab center. > While it was helpful, it did not help me as much as I felt I needed. I > did not get any consumer education or college prep, and I feel that my > O&M is still not up to par. The training was only 15 weeks, and so I > did not get the chance to learn everything I felt I needed. Is this > enough justification to request attending a NFB training center, to > get more training in O&M and Braille than 15 weeks can provide, and to > get self-esteem training (something I lack a bit, especially when I am > stressed). And because I have attended the state rehab center, can I > still attend an NFB center, or am I likely to be turned down because > of my attendance at the state center? > > ~Jewel > > On 3/15/10, Domonique Lawless wrote: >> To all those interested in going to NFB training centers: >> >> Remember that when you explain to your VR counselors why you want to >> go to an NFB center that you provide logical justification for your >> desire to go there. You can't just say "LCB, CCB, or Blind INC. is >> better." you have to provide reasons why they are better centers and >> how those centers can better teach you the skills you need. Darian is >> right when he says you should right a justification letter. If your >> thoughts are laid out on paper (or e-mail) and are clear then they wil >> have a harder time denying you. Also, do as muchh research on your >> state center and the NFB center of your choice as possible. Another >> helpful thing to do would be to read the VR handbook of rights and >> regulations. I don't know what the proper title for it is but I am >> sure that there should be one for every state. Remember that if you >> present yourself as an active and knowledgeable consumer then you will >> be taken more seriously. >> >> I hope this helps! >> Domonique >> >> On 3/15/10, David wrote: >>> Hi. >>> I am currently attending LCB. Beth, your family should not have to pay >>> for >>> training at CCB out of there pocket. You could always try doing what I >>> did, >>> by going to a hearing if all of the other VR officials deny your >>> request. >>> What state are you in? >>> David >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>> Behalf >>> Of Beth >>> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 12:40 AM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>> >>> I am actually trying to go to the CCB in Colorado, but the Division of >>> Blind Services is attempting to deny me. ALso, I have a family that >>> claims they can't afford it. So I would love all the help I can get. >>> Beth >>> >>> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>>> And David is a great example of how to get things done in this >>> situation. >>>> >>>> David, are you at LCB currently? >>>> >>>> >>>> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>>>> all, Cindy was absolutely correct; there are a couple of articles >>>>> in the 2010 student slate (see atatchment) that might prove helpful >>>>> here. >>>>> I encourage you to take a moment and check out the slate, it >>>>> certainly is very imformitive and the cast of many that help to put >>>>> it together for us have done a great job on this one! >>>>> Best, >>>>> Darian >>>>> >>>>> On 3/14/10, David wrote: >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>> I had something similar happen to me in Mississippi very recently. I >>>>>> had >>>>>> to >>>>>> go all the way to a hearing in order for me to go to the Louisiana >>> Center >>>>>> for the Blind. The state didn't want to pay for out-of-state training >>>>>> because they felt that there training center in Tupelo was >>>>>> equivalent. >>>>>> You >>>>>> should get your councilor's response in writing so that it is >>>>>> official >>>>>> that >>>>>> your councilor is taking this stance. Also, you should justify why >>>>>> you >>>>>> should go to an NFB training center rather than the in-state >>>>>> facility, >>>>>> but >>>>>> this should be relatively simple to do. If your councilor refuses, >>> appeal >>>>>> to >>>>>> the regional supervisor, then the director of Blind Services in your >>>>>> state. >>>>>> If all fails, go to a procedural hearing, and present your case. >>> Remember >>>>>> that it is your legal right under informed choice to attend an NFB >>>>>> training >>>>>> center, and these agencies sometimes aren't concerned for there >>>>>> clients, >>>>>> but >>>>>> rather with themselves, as is the case with Mississippi. Feel free to >>>>>> contact me off-list if you have further questions. >>>>>> David >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message-- >>>>>> --- >>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>>>>> Behalf >>>>>> Of cmcerteza at aol.com >>>>>> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 5:38 PM >>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I'm new to the list >>>>>> and >>> I >>>>>> would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training center >>> but >>>>>> my >>>>>> counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want >>>>>> sponsor >>>>>> me. If there's anyone here with a similar situation in previous >>>>>> years, >>>>>> how >>>>>> did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really >>>>>> appreciate >>>>>> your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation >>>>>> to >>>>>> answer my question. >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>>>>> m >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.co >>> m >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Darian Smith >>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Darian Smith >>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gm >>> ail.com >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>> m >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dlawless86%40gmail.c om >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat2%40gmai l.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/djdrocks4ever%40gmai l.com > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature database 4946 (20100315) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4946 (20100315) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai l.com No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.790 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2748 - Release Date: 03/15/10 02:33:00 From kc2992a at student.american.edu Mon Mar 15 19:52:54 2010 From: kc2992a at student.american.edu (Katy Carroll) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 15:52:54 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Self- Defense Class Anyone? In-Reply-To: References: <2A3B4FA8DEB849E89759071F8DCB6F9E@HP31177120642> Message-ID: <2fdbeb321003151252l584ea76cwce4de573a4d1d2cd@mail.gmail.com> Hi Elizabeth, I am partially sighted and take tae kwan do classes very frequently in my spare time. I started the martial art as a 1-credit class at my university. I basically took a casual approach to the class and worked with my teacher so that he knew exactly how much I could see and so forth. He was very thoughtful and would change his teaching style if I reminded him. He would show me variations of defense moves, even once showing me how to use my cane as an effective weapon. It seems though that you are on a tighter schedule, and that you won't have time to develop a relationship with your teacher, I recommend just asking questions, and continually show your interest in thae class, which will give your teacher the desire and opporunity to acknowledge your vision as a factor in your self-defense. Best, Kate On Mon, Mar 15, 2010 at 12:07 AM, Elizabeth wrote: > > Hello List, > > For financial aid purposes, I signed up for a one-weekend self- Defense > class. I thought it was a bit later in the semester, but as it turns out, > it’s this upcoming weekend. Anyway, has anyone ever taken a self- Defense > class before, and if so, were there any accommodations that you needed to > make so you could fully participate in the class? I know this might be a bit > last minute, but I would greatly appreciate any advice. I just sent my > professor an email, so hopefully I will be able to talk to him before the > class begins on Saturday. But in the meantime, it would be great to hear > from anyone who has taken a self- Defense class before. > > Thanks, > Elizabeth > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft’s powerful SPAM protection. > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/210850552/direct/01/ > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kc2992a%40student.american.edu > -- Kathryn CARROLL American University 631 521 3018 From spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net Mon Mar 15 19:55:40 2010 From: spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net (Jen) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 15:55:40 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Re-Post: Ten-Year-Old Plays Mozart Message-ID: Hello List, Since no one has posted to the link on-list, please reply to me on-list to spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net if you want to see this video. I will send it to you off-list. Jen From latinanewschic at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 20:20:44 2010 From: latinanewschic at gmail.com (Martha Harris) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 16:20:44 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] sample justification letter Message-ID: <130D335463224047909F1C790201D3D7@MarthaPC> Hi Everyone, I am in the process of requesting funding from my state agency to attend BLIND Inc. I'm pasting my letter below. HTH, Martha Dear XXX: I am writing to request funding to attend Blindness: Learning In New Dimensions Incorporated (BLIND, Incorporated), a facility that will provide comprehensive adjustment-to-blindness training. I recognize the necessity to learn job-related skills as well as alternative techniques that will affect my abilities to function successfully and competitively as a grad student and employee. I talked extensively with staff and former students of BLIND, Incorporated and found they live the positive philosophy I want. Not only does BLIND, Incorporated believe in blind people, most of its staff is blind. A board of directors who are all blind also governs it. This is in contrast to centers such as Pittsburgh Vision Services, which is staffed mainly by sighted people. I have learned to use a computer and some other blindness technology with some success, and as you know, computers, software, and technology change on a regular basis. In Communications Class, BLIND, Incorporated, will not only teach me some of this updated software and technology, but teach me how to "teach myself" when these changes occur. In addition, this Communications Class can capitalize on my current Braille skills to improve my reading and writing speed, and give me "hands-on" experience and practice with a variety of Braille devices and technology. I feel that this class can assist me in acquiring the "competitive edge" necessary for my college and employment objectives. I am able to do some household-related chores, but I need safe non-visual techniques for cooking. I have received some local services from BVS in the past, but I need a program that teaches these skills over a longer period of time. I will learn how to make every part of a meal on an electric and gas stove, in the oven, and on a charcoal grill. I will eventually know how to set up and cook for 40 people without assistance. Students live in apartments with a roommate and are required to cook daily and maintain this apartment while living there. I can be around blind and sighted people and practice what I am learning, outside of class. Another significant reason for comprehensive training is travel. I know how to travel independently in familiar areas and routes I have done several times before however, I am completely unsuccessful and dependent on sighted friends or pedestrians. I do not know how to figure out where I am in a new area, especially a city such as Washington, D.C. or Boston. I eventually want to be a journalist or researcher, and I need to move to an area with public transportation and places in walking distance. Growing up in Altoona, I have not had much experience with subways, light rails, and local buses. Furthermore, attending Bloomsburg University has placed me in a rural area with little traffic. I was never a confident traveler before, but now, because of lack of practice and time, I am nervous in heavy traffic. I need to know I can travel in a city by myself without taking excess time judging light cycles and second-guessing my decision to cross the street. Attending this center for 6-9 months will allow me to become confident and truly know I have the skills to be an independent traveler. I will learn how to discover and explore unfamiliar routes and how to plan the best way to get to a specific destination. This will be important for my future job. I am a journalism and sociology major, and as a journalist, I will possibly have to travel to new locations on a daily basis. I know, with the skills I currently possess, I cannot do this, no matter if I am in a rural or urban setting. If I am employed as a researcher or in another sociology-related field, I will attend large conferences and travel frequently for projects and data analysis. I lack confidence in crowds, and again, a conference is an unfamiliar place. I attended a conference in December, and if it weren't for my roommates, I would have been stranded and lost the whole time with no idea how to attend sessions. This is not dignified or independent and would not present a professional image. While at BLIND Incorporated, students attend a conference with 3,000 other blind people in a city, go on three-day tours, and go to a Minnesota state fair with over 1,000,000 people. There is no substitute for practical experience. The highly accomplished people at BLIND, Incorporated have a far broader and deeper wealth of experience about blindness than anyone else I could find locally. Under the rehabilitation act and regulations, clients have the right to informed choice. They have the right to choose their vocational goal, the services they need, the providers of those services, and the way those services are provided. This is not a privilege, but a right under federal law. I now wish to exercise this right. I am aware that other people from Pennsylvania have been funded through this agency to attend BLIND, Incorporated and other out of state training centers so a precedence has already been set. While I am attending BLIND, Incorporated, each instructor will send monthly progress reports to you, and we can also have conferences with you and the executive director either in person or by phone. The average time for the comprehensive training is six to nine months with individual variability. I know that no facility can cover everything, but I want to do what I can so that I do not have to keep coming back for more training every time I run into a new problem or task I cannot complete because of a lack of blindness skills. As stated in law, I want to maximize my potential so that I can be employable, not underemployed. Thank you for the opportunity to tell you why I want to attend BLIND, Incorporated. I think there is a much greater likelihood that I will be successful in both college and employment. Therefore, I request that you approve funding so that I can start training at BLIND, Incorporated. Sincerely, Martha Harris From spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net Mon Mar 15 20:51:43 2010 From: spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net (Jen) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 16:51:43 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions Message-ID: <8A660F1432864902BB2CE4534B0D942E@HP31177120642> 1. Am I the only one who sometimes wishes he / she could see? I am comfortable with my blindness and would not want to be sighted, but still wonder and am fascinated by what things look like at times (for new members, I have been blind since birth.) Yesterday, I took my my to a River Dance concert for her birthday. I loved the music but wanted to see the dancing that went with it as well. It was hard to try to picture it based on the music... 2. I love / cling to procedural order in life - follow all steps, and nothing can or will go wrong. I also try to make rules for everything that won't change so everything is in a contained "box" in my mind out of which it can't escape. I also find rules comforting so I don't have to think and can just do something automatically. An example of such a rule is "always take out your book in class [even if the professor isn't using it that day.] If you do this, you will always be a good student. If you don't, you are a bad student." I know there are no guarantees for things but still cling to the procedural mind set to keep my mental boxes of rules intact. Is being overly procedure-oriented a "blindism" or something with which the sighted struggle as well? Thanks for your input. From seacknit at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 20:54:56 2010 From: seacknit at gmail.com (Sarah Thomas) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 15:54:56 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: IPad EBook to use voice over In-Reply-To: References: <8F23CB68DB494980A6DAAAD37351A7C2@josputer> Message-ID: <9560e5331003151354w175a7157k9e4ebce6ca2f3e75@mail.gmail.com> This sounds promising. It made me think more about some of the Apple products. I'm now wondering if any of the bar code scanner apps for the iPhone work with Voice Over. Has anyone out there tried? Sally Thomas On Fri, Mar 12, 2010 at 8:43 PM, Kerri Kosten wrote: > Hey All: > > not sure if many of you saw this or not, but this looks like good news > on the ebooks front. I received this from the list for blind users of > Apples Iphone. > Hope you all enjoy! This sounds like great news and for once it sounds > like blind/visually impaired Ipad users will have access to an Ebook > store almost like on the Kindel. > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Joney > Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 18:03:24 -0500 > Subject: IPad EBook to use voice over > To: viphone at googlegroups.com > > Thought some of you would be interested in this considering the run round > Amazon had. > > > > Apple's iBooks Store and Reader to Support VoiceOver > > 12 March, 2010 @ 3:19 pm by Lioncourt > > > > As Apple began taking pre-orders today for its new iPad device, they > released a few more details about the product. Most exciting among these > for > VoiceOver > > users is the news that iBooks, the application that doubles as a digital > bookstore and electronic book reader, will support VoiceOver. > > > > Apple's > > iBooks page > > describes its accessibility thus: > > Block quote start > > > > Unlike a paper book - or e-books on other devices - you can change iBooks > on > iPad to suit the way you read. Turn iPad to portrait to view a single page. > > Or view two pages at once by rotating to landscape. Change the text size. > Even change the font. Touch and hold any word to look it up in the built-in > dictionary > > or Wikipedia, or to search for it throughout the book and on the web. > iBooks > works with VoiceOver, the screen reader in iPad, so it can read you the > contents > > of any page. Even with all these extras, reading is so natural on iPad, the > technology seems to disappear. > > Block quote end > > > > Our readers will remember the > > controversy last year > > when the > > Authors' Guild > > tried to block text-to-speech on Amazon's Kindle book reader, claiming that > text-to-speech was equivalent to audio book performances by human > narrators. > > > > The guild will find it much harder to argue that bizarre stance this time, > as the access is being offered via VoiceOver rather than a generalized > text-to-speech > > option. By taking this approach, Apple will be providing VOiceOver users > with a streamlined experience, and putting the > > Authors' Guild > > in a position of specifically having to oppose access for visually impaired > users to their content. We do not believe the guild will want to try to > take > > such a hostile stance. > > > > The iBooks application will also work as a reader for free books in ePub > format, whether that content was purchased from the iBooks store or not. > > > > Once again, Apple is putting visually impaired users on equal footing with > their sighted fellows. > > > > > > Joney > > "If God can bring you to it, > He will lead you through it." > > Email: talk2owen at gmail.com > Join me on: > Twitter: http://twitter.com/talk2owen > Gratitude log: http://www.GratitudeLog.com/join/talk2owen > FaceBook: http://www.facebook.com/talk2owen > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "VIPhone" group. > To post to this group, send email to viphone at googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > viphone+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/viphone?hl=en. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/seacknit%40gmail.com > From spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net Mon Mar 15 21:06:54 2010 From: spiderweb1 at sbcglobal.net (Jen) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 17:06:54 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] A Vent about the TI-36X Talking Scientific Calculator Message-ID: <5709C5EFD1FF46C0B0947AACB2E83D9A@HP31177120642> i Guys, Tomorrow will be the second time I have had someone from the Board of Education and Services for the Blind come to my house to troubleshoot problems with the TI-36X Talking Scientific Calculator. The reasons are twofold: 1. We had to calculate combinations and permutations in Statistics. Everyone else's calculator could do, say, "2 c 4 plus 8 c 3." If I tried this with mine, it calculated zero automatically. It turns out I have to add the numbers, then press "combinations" or "permutations," then write the answer to each problem, then plug the separate answers into the original problem. Get this, the manual for this calculator didn't tell me how to do the combinations and permutations, it said pressing the keystrokes for these operations would do the trick. Neither the trainer nor I knew this beforehand...we had to figure it out ourselves. 2. In class Monday, we had to calculate exponents. My calculator gave the wrong answer, but my BrailleNote gave the right one... In short, the interface is not intuitive. My counselor at Board of Education, Services for the Blind, said it was a new calculator, but my professor, who tried and failed to get it to work, said the technology was very old... I wish the folks at Orbit Research, the company which makes the calculator, would improve their manuals... You may reply if you wish, but they are not necessary...I just wanted to get this off my chest. From thebluesisloose at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 21:07:43 2010 From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com (Beth) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 17:07:43 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center In-Reply-To: References: <4383d01d1003142240t508ff7f9vc248a0ac250a0c2a@mail.gmail.com> <4b9e26c1.ddb9e70a.1342.0ccc@mx.google.com> <4383d01d1003150700x1e230b32wa798b7b22dd91fb9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4383d01d1003151407y2fb96305x25d0f57e78f6842c@mail.gmail.com> A traditional center doesnot teach as much as an NFB center. An NFB center motivates you to be who you want to be, NFB style. Beth On 3/15/10, Mark J. Cadigan wrote: > What is a "traditional center"? What are the benefits of a NFB center? > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Beth" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 10:00 AM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center > > >>I am in Florida. I am currently fighting to get to CCB from Florida, >> which has a traditional center in Daytona Beach. >> Beth >> >> On 3/15/10, David wrote: >>> Hi. >>> I am currently attending LCB. Beth, your family should not have to pay >>> for >>> training at CCB out of there pocket. You could always try doing what I >>> did, >>> by going to a hearing if all of the other VR officials deny your request. >>> What state are you in? >>> David >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>> Behalf >>> Of Beth >>> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 12:40 AM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>> >>> I am actually trying to go to the CCB in Colorado, but the Division of >>> Blind Services is attempting to deny me. ALso, I have a family that >>> claims they can't afford it. So I would love all the help I can get. >>> Beth >>> >>> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>>> And David is a great example of how to get things done in this >>> situation. >>>> >>>> David, are you at LCB currently? >>>> >>>> >>>> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>>>> all, Cindy was absolutely correct; there are a couple of articles >>>>> in the 2010 student slate (see atatchment) that might prove helpful >>>>> here. >>>>> I encourage you to take a moment and check out the slate, it >>>>> certainly is very imformitive and the cast of many that help to put >>>>> it together for us have done a great job on this one! >>>>> Best, >>>>> Darian >>>>> >>>>> On 3/14/10, David wrote: >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>> I had something similar happen to me in Mississippi very recently. I >>>>>> had >>>>>> to >>>>>> go all the way to a hearing in order for me to go to the Louisiana >>> Center >>>>>> for the Blind. The state didn't want to pay for out-of-state training >>>>>> because they felt that there training center in Tupelo was equivalent. >>>>>> You >>>>>> should get your councilor's response in writing so that it is official >>>>>> that >>>>>> your councilor is taking this stance. Also, you should justify why you >>>>>> should go to an NFB training center rather than the in-state facility, >>>>>> but >>>>>> this should be relatively simple to do. If your councilor refuses, >>> appeal >>>>>> to >>>>>> the regional supervisor, then the director of Blind Services in your >>>>>> state. >>>>>> If all fails, go to a procedural hearing, and present your case. >>> Remember >>>>>> that it is your legal right under informed choice to attend an NFB >>>>>> training >>>>>> center, and these agencies sometimes aren't concerned for there >>>>>> clients, >>>>>> but >>>>>> rather with themselves, as is the case with Mississippi. Feel free to >>>>>> contact me off-list if you have further questions. >>>>>> David >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message-- >>>>>> --- >>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>>>>> Behalf >>>>>> Of cmcerteza at aol.com >>>>>> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 5:38 PM >>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I'm new to the list >>>>>> and >>> I >>>>>> would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training center >>> but >>>>>> my >>>>>> counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want >>>>>> sponsor >>>>>> me. If there's anyone here with a similar situation in previous years, >>>>>> how >>>>>> did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really >>>>>> appreciate >>>>>> your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation >>>>>> to >>>>>> answer my question. >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>>>>> m >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.co >>> m >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Darian Smith >>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Darian Smith >>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gm >>> ail.com >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>> m >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11%40gmail.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com > From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Mon Mar 15 21:49:14 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 17:49:14 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] anyone using NVDA or system access? Message-ID: <20100315214914.25079.68537@web1> Hi. System Access is my primary screen reader and I love it. I especially like that I can plug into any computer I like so long as it doesn't have admistrative restrictions making outside exe files not allowed. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Hi > is anyone on here using NVDA or system access or system access to go as > their primary screen readers? or how about knoppix-adriane as your primary OS? > Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com > my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). > Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try > out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to > grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu > and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try > vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp > and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can > have an accessible computer. > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From serenacucco at verizon.net Mon Mar 15 22:12:02 2010 From: serenacucco at verizon.net (Serena) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 18:12:02 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Self- Defense Class Anyone? References: <2A3B4FA8DEB849E89759071F8DCB6F9E@HP31177120642> <2fdbeb321003151252l584ea76cwce4de573a4d1d2cd@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <003f01cac48c$8a88ff20$0301a8c0@Serene> Hi: I took Karate for many years. The class happened to be made up of people w/ disabilities, so the tdeachwer was great about explaining the moves to me. I also took private lessons from him for a while. Serena ----- Original Message ----- From: "Katy Carroll" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 3:52 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Self- Defense Class Anyone? Hi Elizabeth, I am partially sighted and take tae kwan do classes very frequently in my spare time. I started the martial art as a 1-credit class at my university. I basically took a casual approach to the class and worked with my teacher so that he knew exactly how much I could see and so forth. He was very thoughtful and would change his teaching style if I reminded him. He would show me variations of defense moves, even once showing me how to use my cane as an effective weapon. It seems though that you are on a tighter schedule, and that you won't have time to develop a relationship with your teacher, I recommend just asking questions, and continually show your interest in thae class, which will give your teacher the desire and opporunity to acknowledge your vision as a factor in your self-defense. Best, Kate On Mon, Mar 15, 2010 at 12:07 AM, Elizabeth wrote: > > Hello List, > > For financial aid purposes, I signed up for a one-weekend self- Defense > class. I thought it was a bit later in the semester, but as it turns out, > it’s this upcoming weekend. Anyway, has anyone ever taken a self- Defense > class before, and if so, were there any accommodations that you needed to > make so you could fully participate in the class? I know this might be a > bit > last minute, but I would greatly appreciate any advice. I just sent my > professor an email, so hopefully I will be able to talk to him before the > class begins on Saturday. But in the meantime, it would be great to hear > from anyone who has taken a self- Defense class before. > > Thanks, > Elizabeth > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft’s powerful SPAM protection. > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/210850552/direct/01/ > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kc2992a%40student.american.edu > -- Kathryn CARROLL American University 631 521 3018 _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizon.net From liamskitten at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 22:19:07 2010 From: liamskitten at gmail.com (Courtney Stover) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 17:19:07 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions In-Reply-To: <8A660F1432864902BB2CE4534B0D942E@HP31177120642> References: <8A660F1432864902BB2CE4534B0D942E@HP31177120642> Message-ID: <7949e5e21003151519p23e4f86bs84a8a315f0a2654e@mail.gmail.com> Gen, Your first question is a complicated one, and the answer will vary according to who in the blind community you ask. I'm somewhat of an anomaly, or at least feel like one, in the sense that not only do I sometimes "wish" to see, but it's becoming more and more of a goal for me. The research/technology for giving blind individuals at least some vision is progressing at an astonishing rate. I'm actively seeking to be part of the movement, through applying for research trials.. etc. etc. The reasons I want to see are precisely the ones you innumerated here. I know that blind people can be competent travelers and live/work independently. But I want to see people dancing across a stage or the brilliant specail effects in a movie or.. a million things. As to the second question.. I, too, am overly procedurally reliant. I really do believe it's a blindness thing. We're afraid of missing visual clues e.g. seeing sighted students taking out their books and looking incompetent that we tend to follow procedures in the hope that we don't stand out. Unfortunately, as I know from personal experience, that can have the reverse effect. Oftentimes, you can be the only person with a book on your desk, which rather defeats the purpose. Hope this post answers at least some of your questions, Courtney On 3/15/10, Jen wrote: > 1. Am I the only one who sometimes wishes he / she could see? > > I am comfortable with my blindness and would not want to be sighted, but > still wonder and am fascinated by what things look like at times (for > new members, I have been blind since birth.) > > Yesterday, I took my my to a River Dance concert for her birthday. I > loved the music but wanted to see the dancing that went with it as well. > It was hard to try to picture it based on the music... > > 2. I love / cling to procedural order in life - follow all steps, and > nothing can or will go wrong. I also try to make rules for everything > that won't change so everything is in a contained "box" in my mind out > of which it can't escape. I also find rules comforting so I don't have > to think and can just do something automatically. An example of such a > rule is "always take out your book in class [even if the professor isn't > using it that day.] If you do this, you will always be a good student. > If you don't, you are a bad student." > > I know there are no guarantees for things but still cling to the > procedural mind set to keep my mental boxes of rules intact. Is being > overly procedure-oriented a "blindism" or something with which the > sighted struggle as well? > > Thanks for your input. > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/liamskitten%40gmail.com > From serenacucco at verizon.net Mon Mar 15 22:42:22 2010 From: serenacucco at verizon.net (Serena) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 18:42:22 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions References: <8A660F1432864902BB2CE4534B0D942E@HP31177120642> <7949e5e21003151519p23e4f86bs84a8a315f0a2654e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <001f01cac490$c7334080$0301a8c0@Serene> Hi: I see what you're saying about wanting to see, but I actually don't. I'm also quite rule oriented, although I got more lose once I went to college. I doubt it's a blindism cuz a blind acquaintance of mine (not on this list) doesn't follow some basic social rules and pays the price for them. Serena ----- Original Message ----- From: "Courtney Stover" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 6:19 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions > Gen, > > Your first question is a complicated one, and the answer will vary > according to who in the blind community you ask. I'm somewhat of an > anomaly, or at least feel like one, in the sense that not only do I > sometimes "wish" to see, but it's becoming more and more of a goal for > me. The research/technology for giving blind individuals at least > some vision is progressing at an astonishing rate. I'm actively > seeking to be part of the movement, through applying for research > trials.. etc. etc. > > The reasons I want to see are precisely the ones you innumerated here. > I know that blind people can be competent travelers and live/work > independently. But I want to see people dancing across a stage or the > brilliant specail effects in a movie or.. a million things. > > As to the second question.. I, too, am overly procedurally reliant. I > really do believe it's a blindness thing. We're afraid of missing > visual clues e.g. seeing sighted students taking out their books and > looking incompetent that we tend to follow procedures in the hope that > we don't stand out. Unfortunately, as I know from personal > experience, that can have the reverse effect. Oftentimes, you can be > the only person with a book on your desk, which rather defeats the > purpose. > Hope this post answers at least some of your questions, > Courtney > > On 3/15/10, Jen wrote: >> 1. Am I the only one who sometimes wishes he / she could see? >> >> I am comfortable with my blindness and would not want to be sighted, but >> still wonder and am fascinated by what things look like at times (for >> new members, I have been blind since birth.) >> >> Yesterday, I took my my to a River Dance concert for her birthday. I >> loved the music but wanted to see the dancing that went with it as well. >> It was hard to try to picture it based on the music... >> >> 2. I love / cling to procedural order in life - follow all steps, and >> nothing can or will go wrong. I also try to make rules for everything >> that won't change so everything is in a contained "box" in my mind out >> of which it can't escape. I also find rules comforting so I don't have >> to think and can just do something automatically. An example of such a >> rule is "always take out your book in class [even if the professor isn't >> using it that day.] If you do this, you will always be a good student. >> If you don't, you are a bad student." >> >> I know there are no guarantees for things but still cling to the >> procedural mind set to keep my mental boxes of rules intact. Is being >> overly procedure-oriented a "blindism" or something with which the >> sighted struggle as well? >> >> Thanks for your input. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/liamskitten%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizon.net From serenacucco at verizon.net Mon Mar 15 22:47:53 2010 From: serenacucco at verizon.net (Serena) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 18:47:53 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] "I Can See You're Blind" References: <3A0B3E4190DD44E5AD035D2F6561768B@HP31177120642><4b9b7258.47c1f10a.6f08.ffff9210@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <009801cac491$8c508670$0301a8c0@Serene> Hey Kat, You finally joined the list! **smile!** Welcome. Serena ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kat Bottner" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 12:36 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] "I Can See You're Blind" > Yes I too, have to say that was a well done job, it was awesome. I'm > also new on this list, but have been with the NFB for a year now, and > for anyone who knows Liz Bottner, I'm her sister Kathryrn, but please > feel free to call me Kat. > > Take Care, > Kat > > On 3/13/10, Rania wrote: >> Wow that sounded really good! >> Rania, >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of Jen >> Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 12:04 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students >> Subject: [nabs-l] "I Can See You're Blind" >> >> I wrote this song to a professor who discriminated against me because of >> my >> blindness. During my first semester at community college, this person >> made >> fun of the sound of my BrailleNote, saying it drove him crazy. (The >> professor's excuse was he had a bad day.) >> >> Did I mention this occurred in front of the class? >> >> So once I recovered from my shock, I wrote this song to say what I could >> not >> at the time. >> >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >> Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2742 - Release Date: 03/12/10 >> 13:33:00 >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kat.bottner%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizon.net From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Mon Mar 15 23:00:16 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 19:00:16 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] nvda and system access outperforming jaws for college class Message-ID: <20100315230016.5701.31445@web3> Could you give us a more detailed review of what sA and NVDA can do that JFW can't? Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Hi > I'm taking an online class, free one week seminar online to see how the > screen readers perform with blackboard and the online classroom. > my ratings: > system access 100% > nvda 95% > jaws maybe 10% > ok lets do scale from one to ten. 10 is best 1 is worst. > system access: 10 > NVDA, 10 > jaws, 3 > its kind of amazing that two free and very very low cost screen readers > are outperforming jaws11, bigtime! I just might run the latest > knopix-adriane distribution in a vm to see how that works with the > online classroom. but any Linux distribution with the orca screen > reader should yield similar results I just like knoppix because its > easy to use and you don't have to be a linux expert unless you want to > be in which case it lets you do that also when you are ready. > Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com > my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). > Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try > out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to > grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu > and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try > vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp > and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can > have an accessible computer. > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From anjelinac26 at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 23:54:52 2010 From: anjelinac26 at gmail.com (Anjelina) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 19:54:52 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center References: <4383d01d1003142240t508ff7f9vc248a0ac250a0c2a@mail.gmail.com><4b9e26c1.ddb9e70a.1342.0ccc@mx.google.com><4383d01d1003150700x1e230b32wa798b7b22dd91fb9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: When I hear "traditional center" I think of programs which primarily have sighted instructors, do not rely on the benefits of sleep-shades, teach route travel, and usually these programs are at the most a few months. An NFB center is based on a independence, accepting blindness through seminars and discussions, teach the importance of Braille, structured-discovery in travel class, and instructors are blind or have had extensive training similar to the clients they serve and training is generally 6-9 months. The NFB centers seem to empower their clients than the "traditional center." Now, there are state agencies as well as private centers that model their programs after the three well-known centers and offer excellent training opportunities. I attended such a center (The Iowa Department for the Blind). I'm probably missing some important aspects but what has always been most notable to me is the difference in philosophy. HTH Anjelina ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark J. Cadigan" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 2:12 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center > What is a "traditional center"? What are the benefits of a NFB center? > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Beth" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 10:00 AM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center > > >>I am in Florida. I am currently fighting to get to CCB from Florida, >> which has a traditional center in Daytona Beach. >> Beth >> >> On 3/15/10, David wrote: >>> Hi. >>> I am currently attending LCB. Beth, your family should not have to pay >>> for >>> training at CCB out of there pocket. You could always try doing what I >>> did, >>> by going to a hearing if all of the other VR officials deny your >>> request. >>> What state are you in? >>> David >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>> Behalf >>> Of Beth >>> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 12:40 AM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>> >>> I am actually trying to go to the CCB in Colorado, but the Division of >>> Blind Services is attempting to deny me. ALso, I have a family that >>> claims they can't afford it. So I would love all the help I can get. >>> Beth >>> >>> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>>> And David is a great example of how to get things done in this >>> situation. >>>> >>>> David, are you at LCB currently? >>>> >>>> >>>> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>>>> all, Cindy was absolutely correct; there are a couple of articles >>>>> in the 2010 student slate (see atatchment) that might prove helpful >>>>> here. >>>>> I encourage you to take a moment and check out the slate, it >>>>> certainly is very imformitive and the cast of many that help to put >>>>> it together for us have done a great job on this one! >>>>> Best, >>>>> Darian >>>>> >>>>> On 3/14/10, David wrote: >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>> I had something similar happen to me in Mississippi very recently. I >>>>>> had >>>>>> to >>>>>> go all the way to a hearing in order for me to go to the Louisiana >>> Center >>>>>> for the Blind. The state didn't want to pay for out-of-state training >>>>>> because they felt that there training center in Tupelo was >>>>>> equivalent. >>>>>> You >>>>>> should get your councilor's response in writing so that it is >>>>>> official >>>>>> that >>>>>> your councilor is taking this stance. Also, you should justify why >>>>>> you >>>>>> should go to an NFB training center rather than the in-state >>>>>> facility, >>>>>> but >>>>>> this should be relatively simple to do. If your councilor refuses, >>> appeal >>>>>> to >>>>>> the regional supervisor, then the director of Blind Services in your >>>>>> state. >>>>>> If all fails, go to a procedural hearing, and present your case. >>> Remember >>>>>> that it is your legal right under informed choice to attend an NFB >>>>>> training >>>>>> center, and these agencies sometimes aren't concerned for there >>>>>> clients, >>>>>> but >>>>>> rather with themselves, as is the case with Mississippi. Feel free to >>>>>> contact me off-list if you have further questions. >>>>>> David >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message-- >>>>>> --- >>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>>>>> Behalf >>>>>> Of cmcerteza at aol.com >>>>>> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 5:38 PM >>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I'm new to the list >>>>>> and >>> I >>>>>> would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training center >>> but >>>>>> my >>>>>> counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want >>>>>> sponsor >>>>>> me. If there's anyone here with a similar situation in previous >>>>>> years, >>>>>> how >>>>>> did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really >>>>>> appreciate >>>>>> your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation >>>>>> to >>>>>> answer my question. >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>>>>> m >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.co >>> m >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Darian Smith >>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Darian Smith >>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gm >>> ail.com >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>> m >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/anjelinac26%40gmail.com > From kat.bottner at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 00:06:06 2010 From: kat.bottner at gmail.com (Kat Bottner) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 20:06:06 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] sample justification letter In-Reply-To: <130D335463224047909F1C790201D3D7@MarthaPC> References: <130D335463224047909F1C790201D3D7@MarthaPC> Message-ID: Well done, hope you are able to get funding from BVS, I live in Delaware, but I have friends that have told me stories about BVS and such things. Take care, and good luck, Kat On 3/15/10, Martha Harris wrote: > Hi Everyone, > I am in the process of requesting funding from my state agency to attend > BLIND Inc. I'm pasting my letter below. > > HTH, > Martha > > Dear XXX: > > > > I am writing to request funding to attend Blindness: Learning In New > Dimensions Incorporated (BLIND, Incorporated), a facility that will provide > comprehensive adjustment-to-blindness training. I recognize the necessity > to learn job-related skills as well as alternative techniques that will > affect my abilities to function successfully and competitively as a grad > student and employee. > > > > I talked extensively with staff and former students of BLIND, Incorporated > and found they live the positive philosophy I want. Not only does BLIND, > Incorporated believe in blind people, most of its staff is blind. A board of > directors who are all blind also governs it. This is in contrast to centers > such as Pittsburgh Vision Services, which is staffed mainly by sighted > people. > > > > I have learned to use a computer and some other blindness technology with > some success, and as you know, computers, software, and technology change on > a regular basis. In Communications Class, BLIND, Incorporated, will not > only teach me some of this updated software and technology, but teach me how > to "teach myself" when these changes occur. In addition, this > Communications Class can capitalize on my current Braille skills to improve > my reading and writing speed, and give me "hands-on" experience and practice > with a variety of Braille devices and technology. I feel that this class can > assist me in acquiring the "competitive edge" necessary for my college and > employment objectives. > > > > I am able to do some household-related chores, but I need safe non-visual > techniques for cooking. I have received some local services from BVS in the > past, but I need a program that teaches these skills over a longer period of > time. I will learn how to make every part of a meal on an electric and gas > stove, in the oven, and on a charcoal grill. I will eventually know how to > set up and cook for 40 people without assistance. > > > > Students live in apartments with a roommate and are required to cook daily > and maintain this apartment while living there. I can be around blind and > sighted people and practice what I am learning, outside of class. > > > > Another significant reason for comprehensive training is travel. I know how > to travel independently in familiar areas and routes I have done several > times before however, I am completely unsuccessful and dependent on sighted > friends or pedestrians. I do not know how to figure out where I am in a new > area, especially a city such as Washington, D.C. or Boston. I eventually > want to be a journalist or researcher, and I need to move to an area with > public transportation and places in walking distance. > > > > Growing up in Altoona, I have not had much experience with subways, light > rails, and local buses. Furthermore, attending Bloomsburg University has > placed me in a rural area with little traffic. I was never a confident > traveler before, but now, because of lack of practice and time, I am nervous > in heavy traffic. I need to know I can travel in a city by myself without > taking excess time judging light cycles and second-guessing my decision to > cross the street. > > > > Attending this center for 6-9 months will allow me to become confident and > truly know I have the skills to be an independent traveler. I will learn how > to discover and explore unfamiliar routes and how to plan the best way to > get to a specific destination. This will be important for my future job. I > am a journalism and sociology major, and as a journalist, I will possibly > have to travel to new locations on a daily basis. I know, with the skills I > currently possess, I cannot do this, no matter if I am in a rural or urban > setting. If I am employed as a researcher or in another sociology-related > field, I will attend large conferences and travel frequently for projects > and data analysis. I lack confidence in crowds, and again, a conference is > an unfamiliar place. > > > > I attended a conference in December, and if it weren't for my roommates, I > would have been stranded and lost the whole time with no idea how to attend > sessions. This is not dignified or independent and would not present a > professional image. While at BLIND Incorporated, students attend a > conference with 3,000 other blind people in a city, go on three-day tours, > and go to a Minnesota state fair with over 1,000,000 people. > > > > There is no substitute for practical experience. The highly accomplished > people at BLIND, Incorporated have a far broader and deeper wealth of > experience about blindness than anyone else I could find locally. > > > > Under the rehabilitation act and regulations, clients have the right to > informed choice. They have the right to choose their vocational goal, the > services they need, the providers of those services, and the way those > services are provided. This is not a privilege, but a right under federal > law. I now wish to exercise this right. I am aware that other people from > Pennsylvania have been funded through this agency to attend BLIND, > Incorporated and other out of state training centers so a precedence has > already been set. > > > > While I am attending BLIND, Incorporated, each instructor will send monthly > progress reports to you, and we can also have conferences with you and the > executive director either in person or by phone. The average time for the > comprehensive training is six to nine months with individual variability. I > know that no facility can cover everything, but I want to do what I can so > that I do not have to keep coming back for more training every time I run > into a new problem or task I cannot complete because of a lack of blindness > skills. As stated in law, I want to maximize my potential so that I can be > employable, not underemployed. > > > > Thank you for the opportunity to tell you why I want to attend BLIND, > Incorporated. I think there is a much greater likelihood that I will be > successful in both college and employment. Therefore, I request that you > approve funding so that I can start training at BLIND, Incorporated. > > > > Sincerely, > > > > Martha Harris > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kat.bottner%40gmail.com > From kerrik2006 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 00:07:23 2010 From: kerrik2006 at gmail.com (Kerri Kosten) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 20:07:23 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] nfb training centers In-Reply-To: <4b9e7bc6.15dbf10a.615f.156f@mx.google.com> References: <4b9e7bc6.15dbf10a.615f.156f@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Hi Beth: Who are you talking to at CCB? Who is helping you? I also want to attend CCB but am having a very hard time getting a hold of Julie Deden their director. She said she'd help me with the "whole thing" but I've only been able to speak to her once and it's been like two months. Kerri On 3/15/10, Beth wrote: > Wow. Was it cold up there? I want to attend CCB so bad right > now. It's like getting to class is a battle and a half, and I > hope CCB will help me come up with ideas for making a living as > well as better my travel skills and cooking skills and all that > good stuff. > Beth > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kerrik2006%40gmail.com > From ccook01 at knology.net Tue Mar 16 00:47:25 2010 From: ccook01 at knology.net (Corey Cook) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 20:47:25 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] university of phoenix In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6B4825ABCCF340479494CF8CF7401E1B@coreyPC> hello all, has anyone had any experience with taking online classes from the university of phoenix? I am thinking of using them to get a degree in information technology support. trying to get out of call center work and figure another degree might be the ticket. From hope.paulos at maine.edu Tue Mar 16 02:05:00 2010 From: hope.paulos at maine.edu (Hope Paulos) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 22:05:00 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions References: <8A660F1432864902BB2CE4534B0D942E@HP31177120642> Message-ID: <597CE17523034C6FB706D022CC93E3E3@Hope> Hi there. I sometimes wish I can see, but am perfectly fine being blind. As far as living life inside a box.. I do this, but am trying to break out of it. I want to be more spontaneous. In my case, living in my box is due to fear. Therefore, I'm attempting to becoome less fearful and more relaxed. To be honest (and brutally so) I believe living in one's box is a "blindism", that not all blind people have, but many do. HTH. Hope and Beignet ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jen" To: Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 4:51 PM Subject: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions > 1. Am I the only one who sometimes wishes he / she could see? > > I am comfortable with my blindness and would not want to be sighted, but > still wonder and am fascinated by what things look like at times (for > new members, I have been blind since birth.) > > Yesterday, I took my my to a River Dance concert for her birthday. I > loved the music but wanted to see the dancing that went with it as well. > It was hard to try to picture it based on the music... > > 2. I love / cling to procedural order in life - follow all steps, and > nothing can or will go wrong. I also try to make rules for everything > that won't change so everything is in a contained "box" in my mind out > of which it can't escape. I also find rules comforting so I don't have > to think and can just do something automatically. An example of such a > rule is "always take out your book in class [even if the professor isn't > using it that day.] If you do this, you will always be a good student. > If you don't, you are a bad student." > > I know there are no guarantees for things but still cling to the > procedural mind set to keep my mental boxes of rules intact. Is being > overly procedure-oriented a "blindism" or something with which the > sighted struggle as well? > > Thanks for your input. > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu From jj at bestmidi.com Tue Mar 16 03:25:27 2010 From: jj at bestmidi.com (J.J. Meddaugh) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 23:25:27 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] nvda and system access outperforming jaws for collegeclass References: <20100315230016.5701.31445@web3> Message-ID: <5F56ECC770654840BFE4EC0498B5F393@jage> Would also be interested in an inclusion of Window-Eyes in this comparison. J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jedi" To: Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 7:00 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] nvda and system access outperforming jaws for collegeclass > Could you give us a more detailed review of what sA and NVDA can do that > JFW can't? > > Respectfully, > Jedi > > > Original message: >> Hi > >> I'm taking an online class, free one week seminar online to see how the >> screen readers perform with blackboard and the online classroom. >> my ratings: >> system access 100% >> nvda 95% >> jaws maybe 10% >> ok lets do scale from one to ten. 10 is best 1 is worst. >> system access: 10 >> NVDA, 10 >> jaws, 3 > >> its kind of amazing that two free and very very low cost screen readers >> are outperforming jaws11, bigtime! I just might run the latest >> knopix-adriane distribution in a vm to see how that works with the online >> classroom. but any Linux distribution with the orca screen reader should >> yield similar results I just like knoppix because its easy to use and you >> don't have to be a linux expert unless you want to be in which case it >> lets you do that also when you are ready. > > >> Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com >> my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired >> of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out >> NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, >> Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and >> vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui >> and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda >> knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an >> accessible computer. >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit > www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com > From jsorozco at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 03:27:10 2010 From: jsorozco at gmail.com (Joe Orozco) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 23:27:10 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions In-Reply-To: <7949e5e21003151519p23e4f86bs84a8a315f0a2654e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8655770E362E4E67A8B728411B3032F1@Rufus> I'm perfectly comfortable with my blindness and would have to think long and hard before undergoing a procedure that could potentially restore my vision. That said, I am completely in favor of research and procedures to reduce blindness in future generations. Even with so-called universal design I think we will find that technology will outpace accessibility. Is it respectable to be blind? Yes, but it's not exactly a luxury. Joe Orozco "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Courtney Stover Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 6:19 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions Gen, Your first question is a complicated one, and the answer will vary according to who in the blind community you ask. I'm somewhat of an anomaly, or at least feel like one, in the sense that not only do I sometimes "wish" to see, but it's becoming more and more of a goal for me. The research/technology for giving blind individuals at least some vision is progressing at an astonishing rate. I'm actively seeking to be part of the movement, through applying for research trials.. etc. etc. The reasons I want to see are precisely the ones you innumerated here. I know that blind people can be competent travelers and live/work independently. But I want to see people dancing across a stage or the brilliant specail effects in a movie or.. a million things. As to the second question.. I, too, am overly procedurally reliant. I really do believe it's a blindness thing. We're afraid of missing visual clues e.g. seeing sighted students taking out their books and looking incompetent that we tend to follow procedures in the hope that we don't stand out. Unfortunately, as I know from personal experience, that can have the reverse effect. Oftentimes, you can be the only person with a book on your desk, which rather defeats the purpose. Hope this post answers at least some of your questions, Courtney On 3/15/10, Jen wrote: > 1. Am I the only one who sometimes wishes he / she could see? > > I am comfortable with my blindness and would not want to be sighted, but > still wonder and am fascinated by what things look like at times (for > new members, I have been blind since birth.) > > Yesterday, I took my my to a River Dance concert for her birthday. I > loved the music but wanted to see the dancing that went with it as well. > It was hard to try to picture it based on the music... > > 2. I love / cling to procedural order in life - follow all steps, and > nothing can or will go wrong. I also try to make rules for everything > that won't change so everything is in a contained "box" in my mind out > of which it can't escape. I also find rules comforting so I don't have > to think and can just do something automatically. An example of such a > rule is "always take out your book in class [even if the professor isn't > using it that day.] If you do this, you will always be a good student. > If you don't, you are a bad student." > > I know there are no guarantees for things but still cling to the > procedural mind set to keep my mental boxes of rules intact. Is being > overly procedure-oriented a "blindism" or something with which the > sighted struggle as well? > > Thanks for your input. > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/liamskit ten%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco %40gmail.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4947 (20100315) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4947 (20100315) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com From trillian551 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 03:29:41 2010 From: trillian551 at gmail.com (Mary Fernandez) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 23:29:41 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions In-Reply-To: <597CE17523034C6FB706D022CC93E3E3@Hope> References: <8A660F1432864902BB2CE4534B0D942E@HP31177120642> <597CE17523034C6FB706D022CC93E3E3@Hope> Message-ID: Hi Jen, Both your questions are highly intriguing and thought provoking. I for one, think that it is only natural and human to want to see as a blind person. Most of us have found wways with which we have succeeded in life. We know the alternative skills, we are competent people, and we have satisfactory lives. However, blindness is an inconvenience. While it is not the tragedy that the sighted world thinks it is, it does cause us frustration and annoyance. Most of that frustration is due to the fact of how others view us. Oh, what i wouldn't give to be able to walk into a room and have people say, oh look, she seems to be a nice person, ;instead of, Gasp, she's blind, and she's walking! For me though, aside from public attitudes, I really really wish I could drive. I am a highly independent and somewhat impatient person. In Atlanta, public transportation isn't the best, and oh, how i hate wating on saturdays for a bus that is over an hour late. And I really don't like asking people for rides since everyone is busy. Of course, most of my friends wouldn't refuse, but who wants to be a burden all the time? Long story short, it is perfectly normal to feel that way. Sighted people don't wish they could see, but some wish they were married, others that they had gotten an educations, still others that they had a different job. We all wish for things that we can't have. It's human nature. But as long as it is only a passing thought, something that doesn't stop us from living a full and meaningful life, it's not somethign to be overly worried about. As to your second question. I think this is merely a personality trait as opposed to a blind specific trait. It is true, that a lot of blind people like to be in control, because we have no control over our lack of sight, it is comforting, and often a smart thing to have set ways of doing things. Knowing as much as we can about our environment, and being able to run our lives in a predictable fashion is important, not only to blind people, but to everyone. However, being boxed in all the time, and never venturing out of a set parameter isn't always healthy. I think that we all, as individuals should try to do things differently at some point. Sometimes doing something a different way, or approaching a problem from a different perspective is very healthy. If we get boxed in, and set in our ways, it might lead us to become stuck in situations that can be solved in different ways. This is especially important for blind individuals, because we can't always do thing a certain way so we have to look for alternatives. Last semester, I was taking a statistics class, and I was so determined and used to being able to get everything accomplished on my own, without any sighted help, that I completely oversaw the solution right in front of my face. Hiring someone to describe graphics while I figured out a way to do it myself would have been the perfect solution. But instead, I had gotten so boxed in just hitting my head against a wall until it gave up, that I had to withdraw from the class. I was so stuck in the fact that I didn't have my books, had never used a statistics computer program, and my professor was unhelpful, that I just failed to look a the problem from a different perspective. I've learned my lesson. And it is a valuable one to learn at an early stage. We have different reasons for wanting to have structured lives. Someone mentioned fear, wanting to have complete control or even just because we don't care to know a different way since we have never needed to do so. These are all legitimate reasons, but it is important to recognize that getting set in our ways can lead to failure instead of success. I'm so sorry I went on so long. Hope this help though. Mary On 3/15/10, Hope Paulos wrote: > Hi there. I sometimes wish I can see, but am perfectly fine being blind. As > far as living life inside a box.. I do this, but am trying to break out of > it. I want to be more spontaneous. In my case, living in my box is due to > fear. Therefore, I'm attempting to becoome less fearful and more relaxed. To > be honest (and brutally so) I believe living in one's box is a "blindism", > that not all blind people have, but many do. > HTH. > Hope and Beignet > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jen" > To: > Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 4:51 PM > Subject: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions > > >> 1. Am I the only one who sometimes wishes he / she could see? >> >> I am comfortable with my blindness and would not want to be sighted, but >> still wonder and am fascinated by what things look like at times (for >> new members, I have been blind since birth.) >> >> Yesterday, I took my my to a River Dance concert for her birthday. I >> loved the music but wanted to see the dancing that went with it as well. >> It was hard to try to picture it based on the music... >> >> 2. I love / cling to procedural order in life - follow all steps, and >> nothing can or will go wrong. I also try to make rules for everything >> that won't change so everything is in a contained "box" in my mind out >> of which it can't escape. I also find rules comforting so I don't have >> to think and can just do something automatically. An example of such a >> rule is "always take out your book in class [even if the professor isn't >> using it that day.] If you do this, you will always be a good student. >> If you don't, you are a bad student." >> >> I know there are no guarantees for things but still cling to the >> procedural mind set to keep my mental boxes of rules intact. Is being >> overly procedure-oriented a "blindism" or something with which the >> sighted struggle as well? >> >> Thanks for your input. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/trillian551%40gmail.com > -- Mary Fernandez Emory University 2012 P.O. Box 123056 Atlanta Ga. 30322 Phone: 732-857-7004 In reaffirming the greatness of our nation, we understand that greatness is never a given. It must be earned. President Barack Obama From lizmohnke at hotmail.com Tue Mar 16 03:38:07 2010 From: lizmohnke at hotmail.com (Elizabeth) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 23:38:07 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] OT: BookSense XT Raffle In-Reply-To: References: , <53A9328F586C466CA34556D7FA01DA28@jage>, Message-ID: Do you need to be present at the convention in order to win? Thanks, Elizabeth > Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 13:58:36 -0500 > From: mewhalen at wisc.edu > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] OT: BookSense XT Raffle > > Yes, I do, sorry, I meant to include my email address and paypal info in the > first email. > > mewhalen at wisc.edu > > Thanks, > Meghan > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "J.J. Meddaugh" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 11:37 AM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] OT: BookSense XT Raffle > > > > Do you accept Paypal for those of us who don't know what a checkbook is > > anymore? > > Thanks. > > > > J.J. > > > > _______________________________________________ > > nabs-l mailing list > > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > > nabs-l: > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mewhalen%40wisc.edu > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lizmohnke%40hotmail.com _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail: Trusted email with powerful SPAM protection. http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/210850553/direct/01/ From graduate56 at juno.com Tue Mar 16 04:53:14 2010 From: graduate56 at juno.com (Melissa Green) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 00:53:14 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center References: <4383d01d1003142240t508ff7f9vc248a0ac250a0c2a@mail.gmail.com><4b9e26c1.ddb9e70a.1342.0ccc@mx.google.com><4383d01d1003150700x1e230b32wa798b7b22dd91fb9@mail.gmail.com> <85ff10071003151130m6f7b9340sf83970d5cba24d6b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi all. Arielle gave some good advice. I would like to add some things as well. I moved to colorado from New Jersey to attend the Colorado center. Since then many people have been able to get funding from the state agency. Which is really good and makes me happy. Now I will add my advice. I would add that you may need to fight in order to attend one of the nfb training centers. It isn't going to be easy either. Whin you go to a nfb training center, and it gets really tough during your training. Remind yourself of what you had to do to get to the center. Also, be prepared to be both gently but firmly brought out of your comfort zone. Aditionally, I would say that your program will be what you make it. It will be what you put in to it. Finally, although I love the idea of the training centers. A NFB center is not for everyone. They aare also not a cure all. Just keep all of this in mind. Melissa Green "Happiness is a butterfly, which, when pursued, is always just beyond your grasp, but which, if you will sit down quietly, may alight upon you." ----- Original Message ----- From: "Arielle Silverman" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 2:30 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center > Hi all, > > A few things that haven't been mentioned yet: > > -- Definitely make friends with your NFB state president and chapter > president, if you haven't already. They can write letters of support > for you that you can use along with your justification letter and > often have professional connections with people high on the rehab > chain of command. > > -- Some benefits of NFB training centers that will rival almost any > state-run center include the following: > > -- Duration: training lasts for six-nine months. > -- Apartment living: You will gain skills that you will need if you > want to live independently, skills you can't gain from dorm-style > accommodations (cooking, upkeep, cleaning, etc.) > -- Structured discovery travel: You will learn how to navigate in > unfamiliar places (which you will need if you are attending college or > working in a new city/state) > -- College prep: In many instances the centers offer the opportunity > to take a college class while you are attending. If college is part of > your employment plan, highlight this fact. > -- Contact the center you want to attend and see if the director will > write an additional supporting letter backing up the claims you're > making. > > Best of luck! > Arielle > > On 3/15/10, Mark J. Cadigan wrote: >> What is a "traditional center"? What are the benefits of a NFB center? >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Beth" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 10:00 AM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >> >> >>>I am in Florida. I am currently fighting to get to CCB from Florida, >>> which has a traditional center in Daytona Beach. >>> Beth >>> >>> On 3/15/10, David wrote: >>>> Hi. >>>> I am currently attending LCB. Beth, your family should not have to pay >>>> for >>>> training at CCB out of there pocket. You could always try doing what I >>>> did, >>>> by going to a hearing if all of the other VR officials deny your >>>> request. >>>> What state are you in? >>>> David >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>>> Behalf >>>> Of Beth >>>> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 12:40 AM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>>> >>>> I am actually trying to go to the CCB in Colorado, but the Division of >>>> Blind Services is attempting to deny me. ALso, I have a family that >>>> claims they can't afford it. So I would love all the help I can get. >>>> Beth >>>> >>>> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>>>> And David is a great example of how to get things done in this >>>> situation. >>>>> >>>>> David, are you at LCB currently? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>>>>> all, Cindy was absolutely correct; there are a couple of articles >>>>>> in the 2010 student slate (see atatchment) that might prove helpful >>>>>> here. >>>>>> I encourage you to take a moment and check out the slate, it >>>>>> certainly is very imformitive and the cast of many that help to >>>>>> put >>>>>> it together for us have done a great job on this one! >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> Darian >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/14/10, David wrote: >>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>> I had something similar happen to me in Mississippi very recently. I >>>>>>> had >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> go all the way to a hearing in order for me to go to the Louisiana >>>> Center >>>>>>> for the Blind. The state didn't want to pay for out-of-state >>>>>>> training >>>>>>> because they felt that there training center in Tupelo was >>>>>>> equivalent. >>>>>>> You >>>>>>> should get your councilor's response in writing so that it is >>>>>>> official >>>>>>> that >>>>>>> your councilor is taking this stance. Also, you should justify why >>>>>>> you >>>>>>> should go to an NFB training center rather than the in-state >>>>>>> facility, >>>>>>> but >>>>>>> this should be relatively simple to do. If your councilor refuses, >>>> appeal >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> the regional supervisor, then the director of Blind Services in your >>>>>>> state. >>>>>>> If all fails, go to a procedural hearing, and present your case. >>>> Remember >>>>>>> that it is your legal right under informed choice to attend an NFB >>>>>>> training >>>>>>> center, and these agencies sometimes aren't concerned for there >>>>>>> clients, >>>>>>> but >>>>>>> rather with themselves, as is the case with Mississippi. Feel free >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> contact me off-list if you have further questions. >>>>>>> David >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message-- >>>>>>> --- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] >>>>>>> On >>>>>>> Behalf >>>>>>> Of cmcerteza at aol.com >>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 5:38 PM >>>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I'm new to the list >>>>>>> and >>>> I >>>>>>> would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training >>>>>>> center >>>> but >>>>>>> my >>>>>>> counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want >>>>>>> sponsor >>>>>>> me. If there's anyone here with a similar situation in previous >>>>>>> years, >>>>>>> how >>>>>>> did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really >>>>>>> appreciate >>>>>>> your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> answer my question. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Thanks >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>>>>>> m >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.co >>>> m >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide >>>>>> teacher >>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Darian Smith >>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gm >>>> ail.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>>> m >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11%40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Arielle Silverman > President, National Association of Blind Students > Phone: 602-502-2255 > Email: > nabs.president at gmail.com > Website: > www.nabslink.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/graduate56%40juno.com > ____________________________________________________________ Home Improvement Projects Improve your home. Click for products, services, and project ideas. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/c?cp=hJ5bNALcpgJeACDMAjUlMgAAJ1BvHzEFemsEEZ0HiReBRkMJAAYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAShAAAAAA= From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Tue Mar 16 05:36:49 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 01:36:49 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions Message-ID: <20100316053649.10173.42749@web3> Well, the sighted sometimes cling to procedure, too. I think clinging to procedure is les a blindness thing and more a control freak thing. I'm not specifically calling anyone a control freak, but it's definitely evident that people who seek to have as much control in their lives as possible are also those who feel the most out of control or who feel that life is out of their control. I could see how blindness might make some feel this way especially since we blind are often taught that we have no power and/or no grasp of reality. Both are nonsense. As for me, I have some vision and can tell those of you wish none that you're not missing as much as the sighted would have you believe. i think Michael May puts it best in his seeeches related to have retained some vision. Basically, he says that while having a little sight is a convenience, that's all it is. Having sight does not get one a better job or a better life circumstance. The only thing sight will really gain any of us is normalcy or the ability to be invisible because we'd be like everyone else for whom the world is made. This is neither good or bad. It just is. As for me personally, I don't have a problem being blind, and I don't have a problem with the possibility of losing more sight, nor would I have a significant problem with gaining some other disability. In any case, adjustment would certainly \be part of the process, but human beins are certainly adaptable. When I weigh the benefits of being a sighted person with the benefits of who I am now, I think I'll take the latter as it's certainly true that I'd know none of you had I been sighted, and no amount of visual affects will replace the people and relationships I would miss. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > I'm perfectly comfortable with my blindness and would have to think long and > hard before undergoing a procedure that could potentially restore my vision. > That said, I am completely in favor of research and procedures to reduce > blindness in future generations. Even with so-called universal design I > think we will find that technology will outpace accessibility. Is it > respectable to be blind? Yes, but it's not exactly a luxury. > Joe Orozco > "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, > some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org > [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Courtney Stover > Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 6:19 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions > Gen, > Your first question is a complicated one, and the answer will vary > according to who in the blind community you ask. I'm somewhat of an > anomaly, or at least feel like one, in the sense that not only do I > sometimes "wish" to see, but it's becoming more and more of a goal for > me. The research/technology for giving blind individuals at least > some vision is progressing at an astonishing rate. I'm actively > seeking to be part of the movement, through applying for research > trials.. etc. etc. > The reasons I want to see are precisely the ones you innumerated here. > I know that blind people can be competent travelers and live/work > independently. But I want to see people dancing across a stage or the > brilliant specail effects in a movie or.. a million things. > As to the second question.. I, too, am overly procedurally reliant. I > really do believe it's a blindness thing. We're afraid of missing > visual clues e.g. seeing sighted students taking out their books and > looking incompetent that we tend to follow procedures in the hope that > we don't stand out. Unfortunately, as I know from personal > experience, that can have the reverse effect. Oftentimes, you can be > the only person with a book on your desk, which rather defeats the > purpose. > Hope this post answers at least some of your questions, > Courtney > On 3/15/10, Jen wrote: >> 1. Am I the only one who sometimes wishes he / she could see? >> I am comfortable with my blindness and would not want to be > sighted, but >> still wonder and am fascinated by what things look like at times (for >> new members, I have been blind since birth.) >> Yesterday, I took my my to a River Dance concert for her birthday. I >> loved the music but wanted to see the dancing that went with > it as well. >> It was hard to try to picture it based on the music... >> 2. I love / cling to procedural order in life - follow all steps, and >> nothing can or will go wrong. I also try to make rules for everything >> that won't change so everything is in a contained "box" in my mind out >> of which it can't escape. I also find rules comforting so I don't have >> to think and can just do something automatically. An example of such a >> rule is "always take out your book in class [even if the > professor isn't >> using it that day.] If you do this, you will always be a good student. >> If you don't, you are a bad student." >> I know there are no guarantees for things but still cling to the >> procedural mind set to keep my mental boxes of rules intact. Is being >> overly procedure-oriented a "blindism" or something with which the >> sighted struggle as well? >> Thanks for your input. >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/liamskit > ten%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco > %40gmail.com > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of > virus signature database 4947 (20100315) __________ > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > http://www.eset.com > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature > database 4947 (20100315) __________ > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > http://www.eset.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net Tue Mar 16 05:57:03 2010 From: pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net (Peter Donahue) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 00:57:03 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] nvda and system access outperforming jaws for collegeclass References: <20100315230016.5701.31445@web3> Message-ID: <001c01cac4cd$818b4bd0$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> Hello everyone, Can you run the same comparisons on Microsoft Office and other commonly used applications for which scripts have had to be created for JAWS and other screen readers to interact with them? This to me is the real test of whether or not screen reading software could be developed for far less the cost of the conventional screen readers. This is my counter challenge to developers of low or no-cost screen readers. Peter Donahue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jedi" To: Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 6:00 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] nvda and system access outperforming jaws for collegeclass Could you give us a more detailed review of what sA and NVDA can do that JFW can't? Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Hi > I'm taking an online class, free one week seminar online to see how the > screen readers perform with blackboard and the online classroom. > my ratings: > system access 100% > nvda 95% > jaws maybe 10% > ok lets do scale from one to ten. 10 is best 1 is worst. > system access: 10 > NVDA, 10 > jaws, 3 > its kind of amazing that two free and very very low cost screen readers > are outperforming jaws11, bigtime! I just might run the latest > knopix-adriane distribution in a vm to see how that works with the > online classroom. but any Linux distribution with the orca screen > reader should yield similar results I just like knoppix because its > easy to use and you don't have to be a linux expert unless you want to > be in which case it lets you do that also when you are ready. > Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com > my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). > Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try > out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to > grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu > and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try > vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp > and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can > have an accessible computer. > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pdonahue1%40sbcglobal.net From thebluesisloose at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 07:17:02 2010 From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com (Beth) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 03:17:02 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] nfb training centers In-Reply-To: References: <4b9e7bc6.15dbf10a.615f.156f@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <4383d01d1003160017t6dc6b3b0r3cb6031217530320@mail.gmail.com> I am talking to Julie. She's ofered to send a letter of justification and I just left her a message saying to do so. She is a big help. I was recommended for CCB by a friend who attended Louisiana, but said that CCB would be good because it's by a big city and has all modes of transportation I need to learn. Beth On 3/15/10, Kerri Kosten wrote: > Hi Beth: > > Who are you talking to at CCB? Who is helping you? I also want to > attend CCB but am having a very hard time getting a hold of Julie > Deden their director. She said she'd help me with the "whole thing" > but I've only been able to speak to her once and it's been like two > months. > > Kerri > > On 3/15/10, Beth wrote: >> Wow. Was it cold up there? I want to attend CCB so bad right >> now. It's like getting to class is a battle and a half, and I >> hope CCB will help me come up with ideas for making a living as >> well as better my travel skills and cooking skills and all that >> good stuff. >> Beth >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kerrik2006%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com > From raniaismail04 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 11:48:58 2010 From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania ) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 06:48:58 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <86DE943AF9954193A5D8A6FF6DE0D831@RainaIsmailPC> I also wish I can see what things look like! Like you I have been blind sinse birth. Rania, -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mary Fernandez Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 10:30 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions Hi Jen, Both your questions are highly intriguing and thought provoking. I for one, think that it is only natural and human to want to see as a blind person. Most of us have found wways with which we have succeeded in life. We know the alternative skills, we are competent people, and we have satisfactory lives. However, blindness is an inconvenience. While it is not the tragedy that the sighted world thinks it is, it does cause us frustration and annoyance. Most of that frustration is due to the fact of how others view us. Oh, what i wouldn't give to be able to walk into a room and have people say, oh look, she seems to be a nice person, ;instead of, Gasp, she's blind, and she's walking! For me though, aside from public attitudes, I really really wish I could drive. I am a highly independent and somewhat impatient person. In Atlanta, public transportation isn't the best, and oh, how i hate wating on saturdays for a bus that is over an hour late. And I really don't like asking people for rides since everyone is busy. Of course, most of my friends wouldn't refuse, but who wants to be a burden all the time? Long story short, it is perfectly normal to feel that way. Sighted people don't wish they could see, but some wish they were married, others that they had gotten an educations, still others that they had a different job. We all wish for things that we can't have. It's human nature. But as long as it is only a passing thought, something that doesn't stop us from living a full and meaningful life, it's not somethign to be overly worried about. As to your second question. I think this is merely a personality trait as opposed to a blind specific trait. It is true, that a lot of blind people like to be in control, because we have no control over our lack of sight, it is comforting, and often a smart thing to have set ways of doing things. Knowing as much as we can about our environment, and being able to run our lives in a predictable fashion is important, not only to blind people, but to everyone. However, being boxed in all the time, and never venturing out of a set parameter isn't always healthy. I think that we all, as individuals should try to do things differently at some point. Sometimes doing something a different way, or approaching a problem from a different perspective is very healthy. If we get boxed in, and set in our ways, it might lead us to become stuck in situations that can be solved in different ways. This is especially important for blind individuals, because we can't always do thing a certain way so we have to look for alternatives. Last semester, I was taking a statistics class, and I was so determined and used to being able to get everything accomplished on my own, without any sighted help, that I completely oversaw the solution right in front of my face. Hiring someone to describe graphics while I figured out a way to do it myself would have been the perfect solution. But instead, I had gotten so boxed in just hitting my head against a wall until it gave up, that I had to withdraw from the class. I was so stuck in the fact that I didn't have my books, had never used a statistics computer program, and my professor was unhelpful, that I just failed to look a the problem from a different perspective. I've learned my lesson. And it is a valuable one to learn at an early stage. We have different reasons for wanting to have structured lives. Someone mentioned fear, wanting to have complete control or even just because we don't care to know a different way since we have never needed to do so. These are all legitimate reasons, but it is important to recognize that getting set in our ways can lead to failure instead of success. I'm so sorry I went on so long. Hope this help though. Mary On 3/15/10, Hope Paulos wrote: > Hi there. I sometimes wish I can see, but am perfectly fine being > blind. As far as living life inside a box.. I do this, but am trying > to break out of it. I want to be more spontaneous. In my case, living > in my box is due to fear. Therefore, I'm attempting to becoome less > fearful and more relaxed. To be honest (and brutally so) I believe > living in one's box is a "blindism", that not all blind people have, but many do. > HTH. > Hope and Beignet > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jen" > To: > Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 4:51 PM > Subject: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions > > >> 1. Am I the only one who sometimes wishes he / she could see? >> >> I am comfortable with my blindness and would not want to be sighted, >> but still wonder and am fascinated by what things look like at times >> (for new members, I have been blind since birth.) >> >> Yesterday, I took my my to a River Dance concert for her birthday. I >> loved the music but wanted to see the dancing that went with it as well. >> It was hard to try to picture it based on the music... >> >> 2. I love / cling to procedural order in life - follow all steps, and >> nothing can or will go wrong. I also try to make rules for everything >> that won't change so everything is in a contained "box" in my mind >> out of which it can't escape. I also find rules comforting so I don't >> have to think and can just do something automatically. An example of >> such a rule is "always take out your book in class [even if the >> professor isn't using it that day.] If you do this, you will always be a good student. >> If you don't, you are a bad student." >> >> I know there are no guarantees for things but still cling to the >> procedural mind set to keep my mental boxes of rules intact. Is being >> overly procedure-oriented a "blindism" or something with which the >> sighted struggle as well? >> >> Thanks for your input. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%4 >> 0maine.edu >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/trillian551%40 > gmail.com > -- Mary Fernandez Emory University 2012 P.O. Box 123056 Atlanta Ga. 30322 Phone: 732-857-7004 In reaffirming the greatness of our nation, we understand that greatness is never a given. It must be earned. President Barack Obama _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai l.com No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.790 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2749 - Release Date: 03/15/10 14:33:00 From raniaismail04 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 11:59:41 2010 From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania ) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 06:59:41 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center In-Reply-To: References: <4383d01d1003142240t508ff7f9vc248a0ac250a0c2a@mail.gmail.com><4b9e26c1.ddb9e70a.1342.0ccc@mx.google.com><4383d01d1003150700x1e230b32wa798b7b22dd91fb9@mail.gmail.com><85ff10071003151130m6f7b9340sf83970d5cba24d6b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9F0D7014D5BC4BF58D269C0E0089977D@RainaIsmailPC> Yes good point! I really learned a lot about my self but yes you will be pushed to do so many things that you would have never thaught of doing! I felt that way but I put in what I wanted to get out of it and I am glad I did! Rania, -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Melissa Green Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 11:53 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center Hi all. Arielle gave some good advice. I would like to add some things as well. I moved to colorado from New Jersey to attend the Colorado center. Since then many people have been able to get funding from the state agency. Which is really good and makes me happy. Now I will add my advice. I would add that you may need to fight in order to attend one of the nfb training centers. It isn't going to be easy either. Whin you go to a nfb training center, and it gets really tough during your training. Remind yourself of what you had to do to get to the center. Also, be prepared to be both gently but firmly brought out of your comfort zone. Aditionally, I would say that your program will be what you make it. It will be what you put in to it. Finally, although I love the idea of the training centers. A NFB center is not for everyone. They aare also not a cure all. Just keep all of this in mind. Melissa Green "Happiness is a butterfly, which, when pursued, is always just beyond your grasp, but which, if you will sit down quietly, may alight upon you." ----- Original Message ----- From: "Arielle Silverman" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 2:30 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center > Hi all, > > A few things that haven't been mentioned yet: > > -- Definitely make friends with your NFB state president and chapter > president, if you haven't already. They can write letters of support > for you that you can use along with your justification letter and > often have professional connections with people high on the rehab > chain of command. > > -- Some benefits of NFB training centers that will rival almost any > state-run center include the following: > > -- Duration: training lasts for six-nine months. > -- Apartment living: You will gain skills that you will need if you > want to live independently, skills you can't gain from dorm-style > accommodations (cooking, upkeep, cleaning, etc.) > -- Structured discovery travel: You will learn how to navigate in > unfamiliar places (which you will need if you are attending college or > working in a new city/state) > -- College prep: In many instances the centers offer the opportunity > to take a college class while you are attending. If college is part of > your employment plan, highlight this fact. > -- Contact the center you want to attend and see if the director will > write an additional supporting letter backing up the claims you're > making. > > Best of luck! > Arielle > > On 3/15/10, Mark J. Cadigan wrote: >> What is a "traditional center"? What are the benefits of a NFB center? >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Beth" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 10:00 AM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >> >> >>>I am in Florida. I am currently fighting to get to CCB from Florida, >>> which has a traditional center in Daytona Beach. >>> Beth >>> >>> On 3/15/10, David wrote: >>>> Hi. >>>> I am currently attending LCB. Beth, your family should not have to pay >>>> for >>>> training at CCB out of there pocket. You could always try doing what I >>>> did, >>>> by going to a hearing if all of the other VR officials deny your >>>> request. >>>> What state are you in? >>>> David >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>>> Behalf >>>> Of Beth >>>> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 12:40 AM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>>> >>>> I am actually trying to go to the CCB in Colorado, but the Division of >>>> Blind Services is attempting to deny me. ALso, I have a family that >>>> claims they can't afford it. So I would love all the help I can get. >>>> Beth >>>> >>>> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>>>> And David is a great example of how to get things done in this >>>> situation. >>>>> >>>>> David, are you at LCB currently? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>>>>> all, Cindy was absolutely correct; there are a couple of articles >>>>>> in the 2010 student slate (see atatchment) that might prove helpful >>>>>> here. >>>>>> I encourage you to take a moment and check out the slate, it >>>>>> certainly is very imformitive and the cast of many that help to >>>>>> put >>>>>> it together for us have done a great job on this one! >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> Darian >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/14/10, David wrote: >>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>> I had something similar happen to me in Mississippi very recently. I >>>>>>> had >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> go all the way to a hearing in order for me to go to the Louisiana >>>> Center >>>>>>> for the Blind. The state didn't want to pay for out-of-state >>>>>>> training >>>>>>> because they felt that there training center in Tupelo was >>>>>>> equivalent. >>>>>>> You >>>>>>> should get your councilor's response in writing so that it is >>>>>>> official >>>>>>> that >>>>>>> your councilor is taking this stance. Also, you should justify why >>>>>>> you >>>>>>> should go to an NFB training center rather than the in-state >>>>>>> facility, >>>>>>> but >>>>>>> this should be relatively simple to do. If your councilor refuses, >>>> appeal >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> the regional supervisor, then the director of Blind Services in your >>>>>>> state. >>>>>>> If all fails, go to a procedural hearing, and present your case. >>>> Remember >>>>>>> that it is your legal right under informed choice to attend an NFB >>>>>>> training >>>>>>> center, and these agencies sometimes aren't concerned for there >>>>>>> clients, >>>>>>> but >>>>>>> rather with themselves, as is the case with Mississippi. Feel free >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> contact me off-list if you have further questions. >>>>>>> David >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message-- >>>>>>> --- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] >>>>>>> On >>>>>>> Behalf >>>>>>> Of cmcerteza at aol.com >>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 5:38 PM >>>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I'm new to the list >>>>>>> and >>>> I >>>>>>> would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training >>>>>>> center >>>> but >>>>>>> my >>>>>>> counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want >>>>>>> sponsor >>>>>>> me. If there's anyone here with a similar situation in previous >>>>>>> years, >>>>>>> how >>>>>>> did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really >>>>>>> appreciate >>>>>>> your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> answer my question. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Thanks >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>>>>>> m >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.co >>>> m >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide >>>>>> teacher >>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Darian Smith >>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gm >>>> ail.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>>> m >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gm ail.com >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11%40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gma il.com >> > > > -- > Arielle Silverman > President, National Association of Blind Students > Phone: 602-502-2255 > Email: > nabs.president at gmail.com > Website: > www.nabslink.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/graduate56%40juno.co m > ____________________________________________________________ Home Improvement Projects Improve your home. Click for products, services, and project ideas. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/c?cp=hJ5bNALcpgJeACDMAjUlMgAAJ1BvHz EFemsEEZ0HiReBRkMJAAYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAShAAAAAA= _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai l.com No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.790 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2749 - Release Date: 03/15/10 14:33:00 From mewhalen at wisc.edu Tue Mar 16 12:06:01 2010 From: mewhalen at wisc.edu (Meghan Whalen) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 06:06:01 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] OT: BookSense XT Raffle References: <53A9328F586C466CA34556D7FA01DA28@jage> Message-ID: <858CF754702444099E606E82DC3CA036@YOURZVIRQM73LR> No. We will contact the winner and mail the booksense. Meghan ----- Original Message ----- From: "Elizabeth" To: Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 9:38 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] OT: BookSense XT Raffle > > Do you need to be present at the convention in order to win? > > > > Thanks, > > Elizabeth > >> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 13:58:36 -0500 >> From: mewhalen at wisc.edu >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] OT: BookSense XT Raffle >> >> Yes, I do, sorry, I meant to include my email address and paypal info in >> the >> first email. >> >> mewhalen at wisc.edu >> >> Thanks, >> Meghan >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "J.J. Meddaugh" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 11:37 AM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] OT: BookSense XT Raffle >> >> >> > Do you accept Paypal for those of us who don't know what a checkbook is >> > anymore? >> > Thanks. >> > >> > J.J. >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > nabs-l mailing list >> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> > nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mewhalen%40wisc.edu >> > >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lizmohnke%40hotmail.com > > _________________________________________________________________ > Hotmail: Trusted email with powerful SPAM protection. > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/210850553/direct/01/ > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mewhalen%40wisc.edu > From liz.bottner at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 12:51:16 2010 From: liz.bottner at gmail.com (Liz Bottner) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 08:51:16 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] nvda and system access outperforming jaws for college class In-Reply-To: <5F56ECC770654840BFE4EC0498B5F393@jage> References: <20100315230016.5701.31445@web3> <5F56ECC770654840BFE4EC0498B5F393@jage> Message-ID: <4b9f7eb8.47c2f10a.0f53.75cd@mx.google.com> Can you say this without any bias toward any screen reader at all? Liz email: liz.bottner at gmail.com Visit my livejournal: http://unsilenceddream.livejournal.com  Follow me on Twitter: http://twitter.com/lizbot From jkenn337 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 12:49:32 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 08:49:32 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] colorado center for the blind nfb center Message-ID: <51C5BBA255A2446E8D5160608518B8A8@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Hello While I was at the Colorado center for the blind in Colorado I used an olympus ds50 digital recorder to record over 2gigs 2gb worth of mp3s. I then uploaded them onto the internet. then the director, Julie, asked me to remove them from the internet, which I have done. I still, however, possess all 103 recordings on a secure password protected external hard drive. so instead of someone blogging about their experience, with Julie's permission I would like to upload these recordings for you to listen to. if you would like to hear my experiences email jdeden at cocenter.org and ask her. I will not upload without permission from her. Josh jkenn337 at gmail.com From jkenn337 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 12:57:24 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 08:57:24 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] nvda and system access outperforming jfw11 Message-ID: <5C09124C9E57460BA0CC126C39B52CA6@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Hi system access and nvda read flash content better, format websites better and do it almost twice as fast as jfw. they also take up way less memory, they word with word excel and powerpoint and have faster response times in those programs. NVDA can display its settings dialogs and help files in 30 some languages all for free, jfw can't do that. nvda's tts can read over 50 languages jfw's eloquence only reads 10. nvda and system access I think have better handling of aria live regions and dynamic websites than jfw11 does. system access works with vista speech recognition so you can talk to the computer and it types for you. with jfw you pay extra hundreds of dollars for that feature. nvda and system access work much better with itunes than jfw11 or jfw10 does. system access and the free system access to go is the only screen reader that lets you fully access the itunes store. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. From jkenn337 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 12:59:16 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 08:59:16 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] sleep shades Message-ID: <1568C932ED534305937246D550181CF7@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Hi I did like the fact that they had us wear sleep shades. do wish sleep shades were re-designed, made of a different material so that in summer you would not get all sweaty and stuff. some material that would draw body heat away in summer and insulate it in winter. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. From jkenn337 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 13:00:39 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 09:00:39 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] university of phoenix Message-ID: hi capella is better, more friendly and more accessible I have experience. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. From jkenn337 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 13:04:29 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 09:04:29 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] window-eyes Message-ID: <74E307A16A8A45E994FFD8F6FCD9CB07@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Hi window-eyes performed about as well as jfw. I prefer nvda and system access or satogo because the commands are the same across all three screen readers whereas window-eyes and hal's commands are very different. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. From jkenn337 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 13:08:50 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 09:08:50 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] low cost or free screen readers Message-ID: <2EC66828F63C4350A7794952EF3A167F@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Hi the most comprehensive ofice support including ms-access is jfw, still. window-eyes and system access has the next best support you can do mostly with them what you can do with jfw. nvda comes in last place still. but this will hopefully change once nvda gets gdi hooks which are being worked on right now. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 13:42:01 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 06:42:01 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center In-Reply-To: <9F0D7014D5BC4BF58D269C0E0089977D@RainaIsmailPC> References: <4383d01d1003142240t508ff7f9vc248a0ac250a0c2a@mail.gmail.com> <4b9e26c1.ddb9e70a.1342.0ccc@mx.google.com> <4383d01d1003150700x1e230b32wa798b7b22dd91fb9@mail.gmail.com> <85ff10071003151130m6f7b9340sf83970d5cba24d6b@mail.gmail.com> <9F0D7014D5BC4BF58D269C0E0089977D@RainaIsmailPC> Message-ID: <409c235c1003160642q2502be11r967d540707aa625b@mail.gmail.com> Hello List, First, may I say that I've enjoyed reading this string, it's been full of alot of good advice, questions and expiriences. ( what this list serve is all about!). as for the conference call idea- it's just me, but I think that I also would find this topic to be something wonderful to discuss via conference call. there is certinly enough interest. I'm interested to see what the membership committee thinks Best, Darian On 3/16/10, Rania wrote: > Yes good point! > I really learned a lot about my self but yes you will be pushed to do so > many things that you would have never thaught of doing! > I felt that way but I put in what I wanted to get out of it and I am glad I > did! > Rania, > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of Melissa Green > Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 11:53 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center > > Hi all. > Arielle gave some good advice. > > I would like to add some things as well. > I moved to colorado from New Jersey to attend the Colorado center. > Since then many people have been able to get funding from the state agency. > Which is really good and makes me happy. > Now I will add my advice. I would add that you may need to fight in order > to attend one of the nfb training centers. It isn't going to be easy > either. > Whin you go to a nfb training center, and it gets really tough during your > training. Remind yourself of what you had to do to get to the center. > Also, be prepared to be both gently but firmly brought out of your comfort > zone. > Aditionally, I would say that your program will be what you make it. It > will be what you put in to it. > Finally, although I love the idea of the training centers. A NFB center is > not for everyone. They aare also not a cure all. > Just keep all of this in mind. > Melissa Green > "Happiness is a butterfly, which, when pursued, is always just beyond your > grasp, but which, if you will sit down quietly, may alight upon you." > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Arielle Silverman" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 2:30 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center > > >> Hi all, >> >> A few things that haven't been mentioned yet: >> >> -- Definitely make friends with your NFB state president and chapter >> president, if you haven't already. They can write letters of support >> for you that you can use along with your justification letter and >> often have professional connections with people high on the rehab >> chain of command. >> >> -- Some benefits of NFB training centers that will rival almost any >> state-run center include the following: >> >> -- Duration: training lasts for six-nine months. >> -- Apartment living: You will gain skills that you will need if you >> want to live independently, skills you can't gain from dorm-style >> accommodations (cooking, upkeep, cleaning, etc.) >> -- Structured discovery travel: You will learn how to navigate in >> unfamiliar places (which you will need if you are attending college or >> working in a new city/state) >> -- College prep: In many instances the centers offer the opportunity >> to take a college class while you are attending. If college is part of >> your employment plan, highlight this fact. >> -- Contact the center you want to attend and see if the director will >> write an additional supporting letter backing up the claims you're >> making. >> >> Best of luck! >> Arielle >> >> On 3/15/10, Mark J. Cadigan wrote: >>> What is a "traditional center"? What are the benefits of a NFB center? >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Beth" >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> >>> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 10:00 AM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>> >>> >>>>I am in Florida. I am currently fighting to get to CCB from Florida, >>>> which has a traditional center in Daytona Beach. >>>> Beth >>>> >>>> On 3/15/10, David wrote: >>>>> Hi. >>>>> I am currently attending LCB. Beth, your family should not have to pay >>>>> for >>>>> training at CCB out of there pocket. You could always try doing what I >>>>> did, >>>>> by going to a hearing if all of the other VR officials deny your >>>>> request. >>>>> What state are you in? >>>>> David >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>>>> Behalf >>>>> Of Beth >>>>> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 12:40 AM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>>>> >>>>> I am actually trying to go to the CCB in Colorado, but the Division of >>>>> Blind Services is attempting to deny me. ALso, I have a family that >>>>> claims they can't afford it. So I would love all the help I can get. >>>>> Beth >>>>> >>>>> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>>>>> And David is a great example of how to get things done in this >>>>> situation. >>>>>> >>>>>> David, are you at LCB currently? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>>>>>> all, Cindy was absolutely correct; there are a couple of articles >>>>>>> in the 2010 student slate (see atatchment) that might prove helpful >>>>>>> here. >>>>>>> I encourage you to take a moment and check out the slate, it >>>>>>> certainly is very imformitive and the cast of many that help to >>>>>>> put >>>>>>> it together for us have done a great job on this one! >>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>> Darian >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 3/14/10, David wrote: >>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>> I had something similar happen to me in Mississippi very recently. I >>>>>>>> had >>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>> go all the way to a hearing in order for me to go to the Louisiana >>>>> Center >>>>>>>> for the Blind. The state didn't want to pay for out-of-state >>>>>>>> training >>>>>>>> because they felt that there training center in Tupelo was >>>>>>>> equivalent. >>>>>>>> You >>>>>>>> should get your councilor's response in writing so that it is >>>>>>>> official >>>>>>>> that >>>>>>>> your councilor is taking this stance. Also, you should justify why >>>>>>>> you >>>>>>>> should go to an NFB training center rather than the in-state >>>>>>>> facility, >>>>>>>> but >>>>>>>> this should be relatively simple to do. If your councilor refuses, >>>>> appeal >>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>> the regional supervisor, then the director of Blind Services in your >>>>>>>> state. >>>>>>>> If all fails, go to a procedural hearing, and present your case. >>>>> Remember >>>>>>>> that it is your legal right under informed choice to attend an NFB >>>>>>>> training >>>>>>>> center, and these agencies sometimes aren't concerned for there >>>>>>>> clients, >>>>>>>> but >>>>>>>> rather with themselves, as is the case with Mississippi. Feel free >>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>> contact me off-list if you have further questions. >>>>>>>> David >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -----Original Message-- >>>>>>>> --- >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] >>>>>>>> On >>>>>>>> Behalf >>>>>>>> Of cmcerteza at aol.com >>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 5:38 PM >>>>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I'm new to the list >>>>>>>> and >>>>> I >>>>>>>> would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training >>>>>>>> center >>>>> but >>>>>>>> my >>>>>>>> counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not want >>>>>>>> sponsor >>>>>>>> me. If there's anyone here with a similar situation in previous >>>>>>>> years, >>>>>>>> how >>>>>>>> did you manage to go to the NFB training centers? I would really >>>>>>>> appreciate >>>>>>>> your comments and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation >>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>> answer my question. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Thanks >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> >>>>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>>>>>>> m >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> >>>>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.co >>>>> m >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide >>>>>>> teacher >>>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >>>>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gm >>>>> ail.com >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gmail.co >>>>> m >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gm > ail.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11%40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gma > il.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Arielle Silverman >> President, National Association of Blind Students >> Phone: 602-502-2255 >> Email: >> nabs.president at gmail.com >> Website: >> www.nabslink.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/graduate56%40juno.co > m >> > > ____________________________________________________________ > Home Improvement Projects > Improve your home. Click for products, services, and project ideas. > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/c?cp=hJ5bNALcpgJeACDMAjUlMgAAJ1BvHz > EFemsEEZ0HiReBRkMJAAYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAShAAAAAA= > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai > l.com > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 9.0.790 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2749 - Release Date: 03/15/10 > 14:33:00 > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 13:49:08 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 06:49:08 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] National Association of Blind Students Membership committee Presents: extra curricular activities; a conference call. Message-ID: <409c235c1003160649i3efb82d2ja7c3c36cf3e8744a@mail.gmail.com> Greetings fellow scholars! I think you and I both know what time it is! ( time to get those mid terms back *sigh*) Actually, it’s time for the National Association of Blind students membership conference call! (presented by your not-so- local National Association of Blind Students membership committee). This call will take place on Sunday march 21st (yep, this Sunday) at 7p.m. eastern time on the nabs conference line (712.775.7100, passscode 257963). We will be talking about extra curricular a Activities, and we will have Antonio Guimaraes of the membership committee and Cindy Bennet; a student, and officer of the North Carolina Association of Blind Students, to share their stories and encourage you to do the same. So, to recap: Who:? The National Association of Blind Students membership committee. What?: nabs membership conference call When?: Sunday! Sunday? Yes! Sunday! March 21st. Where?: I’m glad you asked! Call712.775.7100 and don’t forget to use the passcode 257963 to gain entrance to the party! Why?: Because while class is a very important part of the learning experience; getting into the social aspects of scholastic life is a very important and healthy thing. Need we say more? – Doubted it. We look forward to seeing you there! Warm regards, The NABS membership committee. -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From jkenn337 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 14:30:38 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 10:30:38 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] colorado nfb center Message-ID: Hi while at the colorado center I recorded the following. my support drop. my graduation meal, and graduation ceremony. one or two other people's graduation ceremonies. some braille classes. various mobility/travel lessons. braille class, cooking, and other classes. parties, weekend activities, and general fun outings and adventures with other students at the time. instructors: kathlene taber, cooking instructor. david neetfeld and steve dekuger and brent batron: travel. and others. if you want the recordings. email Julie deden or Kimberly johnson and ask them to let me upload them! jdeden at cocenter.org and kjohnson at cocenter.org . Josh From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 14:58:26 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 07:58:26 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions In-Reply-To: <86DE943AF9954193A5D8A6FF6DE0D831@RainaIsmailPC> References: <86DE943AF9954193A5D8A6FF6DE0D831@RainaIsmailPC> Message-ID: <409c235c1003160758w6a79fd81h89ea775d63654e24@mail.gmail.com> Hi all, I once had vision- partial vision. do I miss it? sure, sometimes but not always. is not having vision the end of the world or the end of life on this plannet? obviously not; we have how many million blind people on this planet? The beauty of being around other blind people is that they all have different tips and tricks they use to live life and live it to the fullest. So, while vision is not all it's cracked up to be; there's nothing wrong with wondering or wishing if that's how you feel. I think that the Idea of wanting to see, is normal. we, as humans have an interest from a young age in wanting to learn about things we don't know. We want to fanticize about flying or having a magical ability, that's just kind of how we are, so I think that what you feel is totally normal. Making rules and living in a box are both things that are not exclusive to blindness ( or so I think). When you think about it, people have different ways of getting things done; thing of the memory devices people utilize to remember names or numbers, I think that's ken to having a rule for something. I am reminded of a Star Trek (the next generation) Episode where "Robin Lefler" creates abook of rules "Lefler's laws". Point is, people do it, and it's not a blindness thing. as for the "Box" i think it can be best explained as one's comfort zone. People have either an easier time or a harder time dealing with reaching out of their comfort zone, depending on the person. Again, I've found it's not a blindness thing at all. I have friends that are better at reaching out and beyond their zone than I, and yet there are some friends that might find this harder to do than I may find. i hope this helps. Darian On 3/16/10, Rania wrote: > I also wish I can see what things look like! > Like you I have been blind sinse birth. > Rania, > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of Mary Fernandez > Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 10:30 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions > > Hi Jen, > Both your questions are highly intriguing and thought provoking. I for one, > think that it is only natural and human to want to see as a blind person. > Most of us have found wways with which we have succeeded in life. We know > the alternative skills, we are competent people, and we have satisfactory > lives. However, blindness is an inconvenience. While it is not the tragedy > that the sighted world thinks it is, it does cause us frustration and > annoyance. Most of that frustration is due to the fact of how others view > us. Oh, what i wouldn't give to be able to walk into a room and have people > say, oh look, she seems to be a nice person, ;instead of, Gasp, she's blind, > and she's walking! For me though, aside from public attitudes, I really > really wish I could drive. I am a highly independent and somewhat impatient > person. In Atlanta, public transportation isn't the best, and oh, how i hate > wating on saturdays for a bus that is over an hour late. And I really don't > like asking people for rides since everyone is busy. Of course, most of my > friends wouldn't refuse, but who wants to be a burden all the time? > Long story short, it is perfectly normal to feel that way. Sighted people > don't wish they could see, but some wish they were married, others that they > had gotten an educations, still others that they had a different job. We all > wish for things that we can't have. It's human nature. But as long as it is > only a passing thought, something that doesn't stop us from living a full > and meaningful life, it's not somethign to be overly worried about. > > As to your second question. I think this is merely a personality trait as > opposed to a blind specific trait. It is true, that a lot of blind people > like to be in control, because we have no control over our lack of sight, it > is comforting, and often a smart thing to have set ways of doing things. > Knowing as much as we can about our environment, and being able to run our > lives in a predictable fashion is important, not only to blind people, but > to everyone. However, being boxed in all the time, and never venturing out > of a set parameter isn't always healthy. > I think that we all, as individuals should try to do things > differently at some point. Sometimes doing something a different > way, or approaching a problem from a different perspective is very healthy. > If we get boxed in, and set in our ways, it might lead us to become stuck in > situations that can be solved in different ways. This is especially > important for blind individuals, because we can't always do thing a certain > way so we have to look for alternatives. Last semester, I was taking a > statistics class, and I was so determined and used to being able to get > everything accomplished on my own, without any sighted help, that I > completely oversaw the solution right in front of my face. Hiring someone to > describe graphics while I figured out a way to do it myself would have been > the perfect solution. But instead, I had gotten so boxed in just hitting my > head against a wall until it gave up, that I had to withdraw from the class. > I was so stuck in the fact that I didn't have my books, had never used a > statistics computer program, and my professor was unhelpful, that I just > failed to look a the problem from a different perspective. I've learned my > lesson. And it is a valuable one to learn at an early stage. We have > different reasons for wanting to have structured lives. > Someone mentioned fear, wanting to have complete control or even just > because we don't care to know a different way since we have never needed to > do so. These are all legitimate reasons, but it is important to recognize > that getting set in our ways can lead to failure instead of success. > I'm so sorry I went on so long. > Hope this help though. > Mary > > > On 3/15/10, Hope Paulos wrote: >> Hi there. I sometimes wish I can see, but am perfectly fine being >> blind. As far as living life inside a box.. I do this, but am trying >> to break out of it. I want to be more spontaneous. In my case, living >> in my box is due to fear. Therefore, I'm attempting to becoome less >> fearful and more relaxed. To be honest (and brutally so) I believe >> living in one's box is a "blindism", that not all blind people have, but > many do. >> HTH. >> Hope and Beignet >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Jen" >> To: >> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 4:51 PM >> Subject: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions >> >> >>> 1. Am I the only one who sometimes wishes he / she could see? >>> >>> I am comfortable with my blindness and would not want to be sighted, >>> but still wonder and am fascinated by what things look like at times >>> (for new members, I have been blind since birth.) >>> >>> Yesterday, I took my my to a River Dance concert for her birthday. I >>> loved the music but wanted to see the dancing that went with it as well. >>> It was hard to try to picture it based on the music... >>> >>> 2. I love / cling to procedural order in life - follow all steps, and >>> nothing can or will go wrong. I also try to make rules for everything >>> that won't change so everything is in a contained "box" in my mind >>> out of which it can't escape. I also find rules comforting so I don't >>> have to think and can just do something automatically. An example of >>> such a rule is "always take out your book in class [even if the >>> professor isn't using it that day.] If you do this, you will always be a > good student. >>> If you don't, you are a bad student." >>> >>> I know there are no guarantees for things but still cling to the >>> procedural mind set to keep my mental boxes of rules intact. Is being >>> overly procedure-oriented a "blindism" or something with which the >>> sighted struggle as well? >>> >>> Thanks for your input. >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%4 >>> 0maine.edu >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/trillian551%40 >> gmail.com >> > > > -- > Mary Fernandez > Emory University 2012 > P.O. Box 123056 > Atlanta Ga. > 30322 > Phone: 732-857-7004 > In reaffirming the greatness of our nation, we understand that greatness is > never a given. It must be earned. > President Barack Obama > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai > l.com > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 9.0.790 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2749 - Release Date: 03/15/10 > 14:33:00 > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From raniaismail04 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 16:23:42 2010 From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania ) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 11:23:42 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center In-Reply-To: <409c235c1003160642q2502be11r967d540707aa625b@mail.gmail.com> References: <4383d01d1003142240t508ff7f9vc248a0ac250a0c2a@mail.gmail.com><4b9e26c1.ddb9e70a.1342.0ccc@mx.google.com><4383d01d1003150700x1e230b32wa798b7b22dd91fb9@mail.gmail.com><85ff10071003151130m6f7b9340sf83970d5cba24d6b@mail.gmail.com><9F0D7014D5BC4BF58D269C0E0089977D@RainaIsmailPC> <409c235c1003160642q2502be11r967d540707aa625b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I think the idea for a conference call is a good one! Rania, -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Darian Smith Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 8:42 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center Hello List, First, may I say that I've enjoyed reading this string, it's been full of alot of good advice, questions and expiriences. ( what this list serve is all about!). as for the conference call idea- it's just me, but I think that I also would find this topic to be something wonderful to discuss via conference call. there is certinly enough interest. I'm interested to see what the membership committee thinks Best, Darian On 3/16/10, Rania wrote: > Yes good point! > I really learned a lot about my self but yes you will be pushed to do > so many things that you would have never thaught of doing! > I felt that way but I put in what I wanted to get out of it and I am > glad I did! > Rania, > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On > Behalf Of Melissa Green > Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 11:53 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center > > Hi all. > Arielle gave some good advice. > > I would like to add some things as well. > I moved to colorado from New Jersey to attend the Colorado center. > Since then many people have been able to get funding from the state agency. > Which is really good and makes me happy. > Now I will add my advice. I would add that you may need to fight in order > to attend one of the nfb training centers. It isn't going to be easy > either. > Whin you go to a nfb training center, and it gets really tough during > your training. Remind yourself of what you had to do to get to the center. > Also, be prepared to be both gently but firmly brought out of your > comfort zone. > Aditionally, I would say that your program will be what you make it. > It will be what you put in to it. > Finally, although I love the idea of the training centers. A NFB > center is not for everyone. They aare also not a cure all. > Just keep all of this in mind. > Melissa Green > "Happiness is a butterfly, which, when pursued, is always just beyond > your grasp, but which, if you will sit down quietly, may alight upon you." > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Arielle Silverman" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 2:30 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center > > >> Hi all, >> >> A few things that haven't been mentioned yet: >> >> -- Definitely make friends with your NFB state president and chapter >> president, if you haven't already. They can write letters of support >> for you that you can use along with your justification letter and >> often have professional connections with people high on the rehab >> chain of command. >> >> -- Some benefits of NFB training centers that will rival almost any >> state-run center include the following: >> >> -- Duration: training lasts for six-nine months. >> -- Apartment living: You will gain skills that you will need if you >> want to live independently, skills you can't gain from dorm-style >> accommodations (cooking, upkeep, cleaning, etc.) >> -- Structured discovery travel: You will learn how to navigate in >> unfamiliar places (which you will need if you are attending college >> or working in a new city/state) >> -- College prep: In many instances the centers offer the opportunity >> to take a college class while you are attending. If college is part >> of your employment plan, highlight this fact. >> -- Contact the center you want to attend and see if the director will >> write an additional supporting letter backing up the claims you're >> making. >> >> Best of luck! >> Arielle >> >> On 3/15/10, Mark J. Cadigan wrote: >>> What is a "traditional center"? What are the benefits of a NFB center? >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Beth" >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> >>> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 10:00 AM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>> >>> >>>>I am in Florida. I am currently fighting to get to CCB from >>>>Florida, which has a traditional center in Daytona Beach. >>>> Beth >>>> >>>> On 3/15/10, David wrote: >>>>> Hi. >>>>> I am currently attending LCB. Beth, your family should not have to >>>>> pay for training at CCB out of there pocket. You could always try >>>>> doing what I did, by going to a hearing if all of the other VR >>>>> officials deny your request. >>>>> What state are you in? >>>>> David >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] >>>>> On Behalf Of Beth >>>>> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 12:40 AM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>>>> >>>>> I am actually trying to go to the CCB in Colorado, but the >>>>> Division of Blind Services is attempting to deny me. ALso, I have >>>>> a family that claims they can't afford it. So I would love all the help I can get. >>>>> Beth >>>>> >>>>> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>>>>> And David is a great example of how to get things done in this >>>>> situation. >>>>>> >>>>>> David, are you at LCB currently? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/14/10, Darian Smith wrote: >>>>>>> all, Cindy was absolutely correct; there are a couple of articles >>>>>>> in the 2010 student slate (see atatchment) that might prove >>>>>>> helpful here. >>>>>>> I encourage you to take a moment and check out the slate, it >>>>>>> certainly is very imformitive and the cast of many that help >>>>>>> to put >>>>>>> it together for us have done a great job on this one! >>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>> Darian >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 3/14/10, David wrote: >>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>> I had something similar happen to me in Mississippi very >>>>>>>> recently. I had to go all the way to a hearing in order for me >>>>>>>> to go to the Louisiana >>>>> Center >>>>>>>> for the Blind. The state didn't want to pay for out-of-state >>>>>>>> training because they felt that there training center in Tupelo >>>>>>>> was equivalent. >>>>>>>> You >>>>>>>> should get your councilor's response in writing so that it is >>>>>>>> official that your councilor is taking this stance. Also, you >>>>>>>> should justify why you should go to an NFB training center >>>>>>>> rather than the in-state facility, but this should be >>>>>>>> relatively simple to do. If your councilor refuses, >>>>> appeal >>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>> the regional supervisor, then the director of Blind Services in >>>>>>>> your state. >>>>>>>> If all fails, go to a procedural hearing, and present your case. >>>>> Remember >>>>>>>> that it is your legal right under informed choice to attend an >>>>>>>> NFB training center, and these agencies sometimes aren't >>>>>>>> concerned for there clients, but rather with themselves, as is >>>>>>>> the case with Mississippi. Feel free to contact me off-list if >>>>>>>> you have further questions. >>>>>>>> David >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -----Original Message-- >>>>>>>> --- >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] >>>>>>>> On >>>>>>>> Behalf >>>>>>>> Of cmcerteza at aol.com >>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 5:38 PM >>>>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] NFB Training Center >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hello there, my name is Casandra from Illinois. I'm new to the >>>>>>>> list and >>>>> I >>>>>>>> would like to ask a question. I plan to attend an NFB training >>>>>>>> center >>>>> but >>>>>>>> my >>>>>>>> counselor from the Division of Rehabilitation Services does not >>>>>>>> want sponsor me. If there's anyone here with a similar >>>>>>>> situation in previous years, how did you manage to go to the >>>>>>>> NFB training centers? I would really appreciate your comments >>>>>>>> and suggestions. E mail me if you need more iformation to >>>>>>>> answer my question. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Thanks >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>> info for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> >>>>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gm > ail.co >>>>>>>> m >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>> info for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> >>>>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gm > ail.co >>>>> m >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation >>>>>>> of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment >>>>>>> campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals >>>>>>> into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation >>>>>> of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment >>>>>> campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals >>>>>> into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >>>>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloos > e%40gm >>>>> ail.com >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/davidb521%40gm > ail.co >>>>> m >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloos > e%40gm > ail.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11%40gmai > l.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president > %40gma > il.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Arielle Silverman >> President, National Association of Blind Students >> Phone: 602-502-2255 >> Email: >> nabs.president at gmail.com >> Website: >> www.nabslink.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/graduate56%40j > uno.co > m >> > > ____________________________________________________________ > Home Improvement Projects > Improve your home. Click for products, services, and project ideas. > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/c?cp=hJ5bNALcpgJeACDMAjUlMgAA > J1BvHz > EFemsEEZ0HiReBRkMJAAYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAShAAAAAA= > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04% > 40gmai > l.com > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 9.0.790 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2749 - Release Date: > 03/15/10 14:33:00 > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gm > ail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai l.com No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.790 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2750 - Release Date: 03/16/10 02:33:00 From pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net Tue Mar 16 15:49:39 2010 From: pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net (Peter Donahue) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 10:49:39 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] window-eyes References: <74E307A16A8A45E994FFD8F6FCD9CB07@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Message-ID: <009501cac520$49b25610$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> Hello Josh and listers, But we need specifics. We're not talking about one screen reader vs. another. We're talking about applications like Microsoft Office, Sonar, Sound Forge, Real Player, Winamp, etc. How well were you able to use them with System Access to Go and other free or low-cost screen readers compared to JAWS and Window-Eyes?I hope this makes sense. Peter Donahue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Josh" To: Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 8:04 AM Subject: [nabs-l] window-eyes Hi window-eyes performed about as well as jfw. I prefer nvda and system access or satogo because the commands are the same across all three screen readers whereas window-eyes and hal's commands are very different. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pdonahue1%40sbcglobal.net From thebluesisloose at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 16:09:18 2010 From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com (Beth) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 12:09:18 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] colorado nfb center Message-ID: <4b9fad0b.5578e70a.3adb.0392@mx.google.com> Wow. I can't waijt to go to CCB. Should be fun. Beth From hope.paulos at maine.edu Tue Mar 16 16:18:40 2010 From: hope.paulos at maine.edu (Hope Paulos) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 12:18:40 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] nvda and system access outperforming jfw11 References: <5C09124C9E57460BA0CC126C39B52CA6@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Message-ID: The only problem with these screen readers is it doesn't allow you to use the shortcut key insert + 4 on the number row to access the character map to be able to type in other languages. If this was implemented I'd change over to either of these screen readers in a heart-beat. Hope and Beignet ----- Original Message ----- From: "Josh" To: Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 8:57 AM Subject: [nabs-l] nvda and system access outperforming jfw11 > Hi > > system access and nvda read flash content better, format websites better > and do it almost twice as fast as jfw. they also take up way less memory, > they word with word excel and powerpoint and have faster response times in > those programs. NVDA can display its settings dialogs and help files in 30 > some languages all for free, jfw can't do that. nvda's tts can read over > 50 languages jfw's eloquence only reads 10. nvda and system access I think > have better handling of aria live regions and dynamic websites than jfw11 > does. system access works with vista speech recognition so you can talk to > the computer and it types for you. with jfw you pay extra hundreds of > dollars for that feature. nvda and system access work much better with > itunes than jfw11 or jfw10 does. system access and the free system access > to go is the only screen reader that lets you fully access the itunes > store. > > > Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com > my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired > of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out > NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, > Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and > vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui > and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda > knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an > accessible computer. > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu From pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net Tue Mar 16 16:31:15 2010 From: pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net (Peter Donahue) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 11:31:15 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] colorado nfb center References: Message-ID: <013601cac526$19a47d80$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> Hello Josh and listers, You should not need to get permission from anyone to upload content you produced to your own Web site. Provided you had permission to record these activities, and do not post them on any CCB servers without first getting their permission to do so and you're no longer a CCB student I'd say post them again. I know of several CCB students that posted recordings they made of various center activities. One such recording is on the Blind Cool Tech Web Site. Drew Webber made it when he was a CCB student. It was about their activity where they allowed center students to experience driving. Check it out at: http://www.blindcooltech.com Peter Donahue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Josh" To: "nabs-l list" Cc: "nabs" ; "julie deden" Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 9:30 AM Subject: [nabs-l] colorado nfb center Hi while at the colorado center I recorded the following. my support drop. my graduation meal, and graduation ceremony. one or two other people's graduation ceremonies. some braille classes. various mobility/travel lessons. braille class, cooking, and other classes. parties, weekend activities, and general fun outings and adventures with other students at the time. instructors: kathlene taber, cooking instructor. david neetfeld and steve dekuger and brent batron: travel. and others. if you want the recordings. email Julie deden or Kimberly johnson and ask them to let me upload them! jdeden at cocenter.org and kjohnson at cocenter.org . Josh _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pdonahue1%40sbcglobal.net From kerrik2006 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 16:34:54 2010 From: kerrik2006 at gmail.com (Kerri Kosten) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 12:34:54 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] nfb training centers In-Reply-To: <4383d01d1003160017t6dc6b3b0r3cb6031217530320@mail.gmail.com> References: <4b9e7bc6.15dbf10a.615f.156f@mx.google.com> <4383d01d1003160017t6dc6b3b0r3cb6031217530320@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi Beth: That's good. Good luck! Yeah, that's one of the big reasons I want to also go there too...big city, all different types of transportation options. Has she been hard to get a hold of? Kerri On 3/16/10, Beth wrote: > I am talking to Julie. She's ofered to send a letter of justification > and I just left her a message saying to do so. She is a big help. I > was recommended for CCB by a friend who attended Louisiana, but said > that CCB would be good because it's by a big city and has all modes of > transportation I need to learn. > Beth > > On 3/15/10, Kerri Kosten wrote: >> Hi Beth: >> >> Who are you talking to at CCB? Who is helping you? I also want to >> attend CCB but am having a very hard time getting a hold of Julie >> Deden their director. She said she'd help me with the "whole thing" >> but I've only been able to speak to her once and it's been like two >> months. >> >> Kerri >> >> On 3/15/10, Beth wrote: >>> Wow. Was it cold up there? I want to attend CCB so bad right >>> now. It's like getting to class is a battle and a half, and I >>> hope CCB will help me come up with ideas for making a living as >>> well as better my travel skills and cooking skills and all that >>> good stuff. >>> Beth >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kerrik2006%40gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kerrik2006%40gmail.com > From jkenn337 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 16:37:04 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 12:37:04 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Fw: Your MP3 Fiiles Message-ID: <16E6E2167A0D49A994CFF3DEACE7C2D6@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> From: Julie Deden To: 'Josh' ; 'Peter Donahue' Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 12:17 PM Subject: RE: Your MP3 Fiiles Hello Josh and Peter, I appreciate Josh your willingness to share information with others about your experiences at the center. I do not have a problem with you sharing your recordings if you are able to get permission with anyone else who is on the recording.. We did not know that you were making recordings for most of your program at the center. Many of the things that students go through need to be kept confidential and we must always respect people's privacy. So, if there are particular recordings that you may want to share they should be screened first. I do not want to hurt anyone or breech confidentiality. Give me a call so that we can discuss this. Thanks Julie From: Josh [mailto:jkenn337 at gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 9:58 AM To: Peter Donahue Cc: julie deden Subject: Re: Your MP3 Fiiles I did not place them on the ccb website, I placed them up on dropbox or sendspace, file sharing services. Josh Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter Donahue To: jkenn337 at gmail.com Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 11:45 AM Subject: Your MP3 Fiiles Hello Josh, Firstly I find it odd that Julie would ask you to remove those files from the Internet if they were uploaded to a Web site or other resource you yourself manage. If you placed them on a Web site or other resource managed by the CCB without first seeking the proper permission to do so she has every right to ask you to remove them. I'm a member of the NFB's Living History Group. We're in the process of creating a Web site that will contain audio and video content dealing with all aspects of the NFB's history. One of the activities we plan to undertake is an Oral History project. This is a project in which group members will interview federationists concerning their involvement in the NFB and its many programs and initiatives. I would be very interested in hearing your CCB recordings as some of them could be used in our oral history project. There's nothing better to convince potential center students of the value of attending an NFB training center than for these folks to hear from center attendees and graduates in their own words and in their own voices. If you could share these recordings with us that would be fantastic. We would need to review them prior to posting them to be sure they're free of objectionable content. Since you have so much material it may be that we would only post selected material but I think your work could be of value to future center attendees. Hope to hear from you soon. Peter Donahue "Will you come and awake our lost land from its slumber And her fetters we'll break, links that long are encumbered. And the air will resound with hosannas to greet you On the shore will be found gallant Irishmen to greet you." Will You Come to the Bower Traditional Irish Folk Song From pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net Tue Mar 16 17:02:55 2010 From: pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net (Peter Donahue) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 12:02:55 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Josh's CCB Recordings Message-ID: <019501cac52a$85a594c0$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> Hello everyone, Please disregard my last message concerning Josh's recordings. It is simply common courtesy to seek permission from others involved before recording activities and events of any kind to be sure everyone is aware that the recording is being made and to prevent breaches of confidentiality. There's nothing wrong with recording such activities, but we need to be respectful of others privacy and to be sure that the final product promotes all aspects of our activities. Peter Donahue "Will you come and awake our lost land from its slumber And her fetters we'll break, links that long are encumbered. And the air will resound with hosannas to greet you On the shore will be found gallant Irishmen to greet you." Will You Come to the Bower Traditional Irish Folk Song From jkenn337 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 17:28:45 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 13:28:45 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] screen readers Message-ID: <83667507BC2A42A3AA57DD35851BF68B@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Hi I don't use those prrograms so I couldn't say. I can say that the programs I do use work very well with system access. and most work very well with NVDA. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net From jkenn337 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 17:41:11 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 13:41:11 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] NVDA Message-ID: Hi also if you want better access without using ms-word you can download vmware player, its free, then download the newest knoppix-adriane and run it as a program under windows using vmware. openOffice is more stable under Linux than it is in Windows. Josh Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net From jkenn337 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 17:33:17 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 13:33:17 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] other languages screen readers Message-ID: Hi you don't need that insert-4 shortcut, windows provides a much better way to type in other languages. go to control panel. regional and language settings go to the languages tab, hit details, go to keyboard in the tree-view, tab to add, choose the language, hit ok. set your keyboard shortcut and you're done. for me, hitting alt+shift switches me between languages then to type an a+acute accent I hit left bracket, a, and there it is. you don't need jaws to type in other languages. sighted people don't have a special symbols dialog, if they want other languages they learn the alt codes with the numberPad, or they add a keyboard language using control panel. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net From jkenn337 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 17:34:24 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 13:34:24 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] other shortcuts Message-ID: <193B317C50724B299A9A1FBB93EFDB6A@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Hi also you don't need a special jaws dialog to go to the system tray, just hit windowsKey plus b, and you're there. learn your windows keyboard shortcuts guys it'll do you good. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net From jj at bestmidi.com Tue Mar 16 19:39:07 2010 From: jj at bestmidi.com (J.J. Meddaugh) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 15:39:07 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] window-eyes References: <74E307A16A8A45E994FFD8F6FCD9CB07@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Message-ID: <87E70300AF354AE989E021928D34F571@jage> Josh, You just showed extreme bias in your statements, unfortunately. If we want to do a true comparison between the screen readers, there would need to be quantifiable tasks and results to go by. It's easy for me to find someone who has a preference for just about anything, so it would be great if this could be taken further. There used to be a screen reader battle at the CSUN conference, and it may be time for such an event to be held again. J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor ----- Original Message ----- From: "Josh" To: Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 9:04 AM Subject: [nabs-l] window-eyes > Hi > > window-eyes performed about as well as jfw. I prefer nvda and system > access or satogo because the commands are the same across all three screen > readers whereas window-eyes and hal's commands are very different. > > Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com > my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired > of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out > NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, > Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and > vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui > and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda > knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an > accessible computer. > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com > From jj at bestmidi.com Tue Mar 16 19:44:25 2010 From: jj at bestmidi.com (J.J. Meddaugh) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 15:44:25 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] low cost or free screen readers References: <2EC66828F63C4350A7794952EF3A167F@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Message-ID: I'd wager there are few things you can't do with office and JFW that you can in Window-Eyes. Also, Window-Eyes has superior support for Powerpoint ane Excel, especially in the areas of visual presentation. J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor ----- Original Message ----- From: "Josh" To: "nabs-l list" Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 9:08 AM Subject: [nabs-l] low cost or free screen readers > Hi > > the most comprehensive ofice support including ms-access is jfw, still. > window-eyes and system access has the next best support you can do mostly > with them what you can do with jfw. nvda comes in last place still. but > this will hopefully change once nvda gets gdi hooks which are being worked > on right now. > > Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com > my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired > of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out > NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, > Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and > vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui > and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda > knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an > accessible computer. > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com > From anjelinac26 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 20:42:21 2010 From: anjelinac26 at gmail.com (Anjelina) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 16:42:21 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Locating reputable scholarships not related to blindness Message-ID: <1624C6B242F14DCE90DBA5404C0B9942@D9P3ZND1> What are some reputable scholarship sites you have used? A friend is wanting to steer away from blindness related scholarships. I recall seeing a list on the student list but cannot seem to locate the list of sties. Thanks Anjelina From thebluesisloose at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 21:05:15 2010 From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com (Beth) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 17:05:15 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] nfb training centers In-Reply-To: References: <4b9e7bc6.15dbf10a.615f.156f@mx.google.com> <4383d01d1003160017t6dc6b3b0r3cb6031217530320@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4383d01d1003161405p134f6c88wd4742ea773e7ad85@mail.gmail.com> No, she hasn't. But I've left her instructions on how to get the letter to me and stuff. Beth On 3/16/10, Kerri Kosten wrote: > Hi Beth: > > That's good. > > Good luck! > > Yeah, that's one of the big reasons I want to also go there too...big > city, all different types of transportation options. > > Has she been hard to get a hold of? > > Kerri > > On 3/16/10, Beth wrote: >> I am talking to Julie. She's ofered to send a letter of justification >> and I just left her a message saying to do so. She is a big help. I >> was recommended for CCB by a friend who attended Louisiana, but said >> that CCB would be good because it's by a big city and has all modes of >> transportation I need to learn. >> Beth >> >> On 3/15/10, Kerri Kosten wrote: >>> Hi Beth: >>> >>> Who are you talking to at CCB? Who is helping you? I also want to >>> attend CCB but am having a very hard time getting a hold of Julie >>> Deden their director. She said she'd help me with the "whole thing" >>> but I've only been able to speak to her once and it's been like two >>> months. >>> >>> Kerri >>> >>> On 3/15/10, Beth wrote: >>>> Wow. Was it cold up there? I want to attend CCB so bad right >>>> now. It's like getting to class is a battle and a half, and I >>>> hope CCB will help me come up with ideas for making a living as >>>> well as better my travel skills and cooking skills and all that >>>> good stuff. >>>> Beth >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kerrik2006%40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kerrik2006%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com > From clb5590 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 23:00:40 2010 From: clb5590 at gmail.com (Cindy Bennett) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 19:00:40 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Locating reputable scholarships not related to blindness In-Reply-To: <1624C6B242F14DCE90DBA5404C0B9942@D9P3ZND1> References: <1624C6B242F14DCE90DBA5404C0B9942@D9P3ZND1> Message-ID: <3fea3c411003161600p77c660a9x688fd5c7a4807b96@mail.gmail.com> I used www.fastweb.com. You can create a detailed profile and it matches you with scholarships that your profile deems you eligible for. Of course, you won't be eligible for all of your matches just by chance, and some will be ridiculous corporation scholarships that are easy to fill out but more like a raffle than a scholarship process becauase of the number of applicants, but it is a good resource. If your friend is in high school, the counseling office should ahve several good local scholarships. If your friend is a prospective student or already in college, that person should check out the financial aid office. They will have information about scholarships provided by the school and other entities. I filled out a lot of scholarships, but apart from my state NFB scholarship and another disability related ones, the other three were from local foundations, so i definitely stress that. Even state wide scholarships are better than national corporation ones, but who knows, I'm sure someone has won a scholarship from Wall-Mart. If your friend has a job, or worked somewhere in the past, they should check to see if the company they work for has scholarships for employees. I respect that your friend is trying to steer away from blindness related scholarships, but I would encourage your friend not to neglect them. There are several organizations that have started funds for students with disabilities, and some Lion's clubs have scholarships for students in the district they represent. It sounds ridiculous, but all in all, i probably applied for about 30 scholarships and only received 4, and i was a very strong student with adequate community involvement, so applying for a lot isn't bad, but try to fid scholarships with similar essay topics, and insure that the quality of your applications is good, because a lot of crappy apps won't get you money. But i stress local scholarships so much, because i received a much larger fraction of the local scholarships that i filled out. Hope that helps, and if anyone else has any other good websites or places with especially scholarships for grad students, i would love to hear about them as i will be applying for grad school in the fall. Cindy On 3/16/10, Anjelina wrote: > What are some reputable scholarship sites you have used? A friend is wanting > to steer away from blindness related scholarships. I recall seeing a list on > the student list but cannot seem to locate the list of sties. > Thanks > > Anjelina > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.com > From troubleclark at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 23:49:05 2010 From: troubleclark at gmail.com (Nathan Clark) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 19:49:05 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] excel skills Message-ID: Does anyone have a good resource, book or website that I can go to for Excel practice? I need to get more familiar with excel 2007 and wondering if anyone has any good tips for me. Thanks Nathan Clark From Kim.Charlson at Perkins.org Wed Mar 17 00:25:52 2010 From: Kim.Charlson at Perkins.org (Kim.Charlson at Perkins.org) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 19:25:52 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] [BANA-Announce] BANA Adopts IPA: Braille Message-ID: PRESS RELEASE February 2010 FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE CONTACT: Judith Dixon, Chairperson Braille Authority of North America PHONE: 1-202-707-0722 E-MAIL: jdix at loc.gov BANA Adopts IPA: Braille (International Phonetics Alphabet: Braille) The Braille Authority of North America (BANA) announces that it has adopted IPA Braille as the authorized BANA code for phonetics. This is a braille code for the transcription of the International Phonetic Alphabet as revised 2005 under the auspices of the International Council on English Braille (ICEB). Further information about the development and revision of this international code for phonetics may be found at the ICEB website at http://www.iceb.org/icebipa.htm. Electronic files of this code may be found on the ICEB website as well as that of the Braille Authority of North America at http://www.brailleauthority.org in the Publications link. The following formats are available: Print Document - IPA Braille (PDF [Adobe] file format, 61 pages) Braille Files (.brf format) - IPA Braille - Part 1 (BRF format, 25 lines per page by 40 cells per line, 116 pages) - IPA Braille - Part 2 Introduction (BRF format, 25 lines per page by 28 cells per line, 13 pages) Braille Files (Duxbury.dbx format) - IPA Braille - Part 1 - IPA Braille - Part 2 Introduction Corel Draw File (cdr tactile graphics format) - IPA Braille - Part 2 Tactile (CDR [Corel] format, 28 pages) PDF File (Adobe .pdf tactile graphics format) - IPA Braille - Part 2 Tactile (PDF [Adobe] format, 28 pages) The mission and purpose of the Braille Authority of North America are to assure literacy for tactile readers through the standardization of braille and/or tactile graphics. BANA promotes and facilitates the use, teaching, and production of braille. It publishes rules, interprets and renders opinions pertaining to braille in all existing codes. It deals with codes now in existence or to be developed in the future, in collaboration with other countries using English braille. In exercising its function and authority, BANA considers the effects of its decisions on other existing braille codes and formats; the ease of production by various methods; and acceptability to readers. For additional resource information, visit www.brailleauthority.org __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 4950 (20100316) __________ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com _______________________________________________ BANA-Announce mailing list BANA-Announce at brailleauthority.org http://www.brailleauthority.org/mailman/listinfo/bana-announce From pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net Wed Mar 17 00:33:28 2010 From: pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net (Peter Donahue) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 19:33:28 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] low cost or free screen readers References: <2EC66828F63C4350A7794952EF3A167F@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> Message-ID: <004e01cac569$77f78ab0$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> Hello Josh and listers, Have you tried System Access and NVDA with Station Playlist, Cakewalk Sonar, Sound Forge, Adobe Reader, Ed Sharp, Mozilla Thunderbird, File Zilla, FTP Explorer, Logos Library System Software, Libronix, Microsoft Visual Web Developer, Microsoft Visual Studio, Microsoft SQL Server, Adobe Dreamweaver, Adobe Contribute, Adobe Fireworks, Adobe ColdFusion Server,And the Webbie Internet Software Suite? I'll look forward to hearing your take on your experiences with these packages. Peter Donahue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Josh" To: "nabs-l list" Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 8:08 AM Subject: [nabs-l] low cost or free screen readers Hi the most comprehensive ofice support including ms-access is jfw, still. window-eyes and system access has the next best support you can do mostly with them what you can do with jfw. nvda comes in last place still. but this will hopefully change once nvda gets gdi hooks which are being worked on right now. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com my blog is at http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net (updated frequently). Tired of Microsoft Windows and paying thousands for screen-readers? try out NVDA, get a mac--, nvda--for Windows, or try out and switch to grml, Ubuntu, Vinux, or knoppix-adriane Linux desktops. Knoppix ubuntu and vinux-cli-max are the most accessible for beginners. also try vinux-gui and encourage those at www.cherrypal.com to use windows-xp and nvda knoppix-adriane Vinux-cli-max or grml so all blind people can have an accessible computer. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pdonahue1%40sbcglobal.net From nabs.president at gmail.com Wed Mar 17 00:57:42 2010 From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 19:57:42 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions In-Reply-To: <409c235c1003160758w6a79fd81h89ea775d63654e24@mail.gmail.com> References: <86DE943AF9954193A5D8A6FF6DE0D831@RainaIsmailPC> <409c235c1003160758w6a79fd81h89ea775d63654e24@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <85ff10071003161757t596768a9l220b633506a441@mail.gmail.com> Hi all, First of all, I think it's totally natural to be curious about experiences that you have never had, and doesn't have any deeper meaning. I too have never had any vision except light perception, and I sometimes wonder what it would be like to experience vision and all its components, simply because most other people around me have these experiences. Regarding wishing or desiring to see, while this is a little different than mere curiosity, I also think it's normal. I have often heard NFB members express the concern that wanting to be able to see or temporarily wishing they could see is at odds with NFB philosophy,, and I think these fears are unfounded. The NFB's former president, Kenneth Jernigan, made the oft-quoted statement that "with proper training and opportunity, blindness can be reduced to the level of a mere nuisance". According to www.dictionary.com, the word "nuisance" is defined as meaning "an obnoxious or annoying person, thing, condition, etc." So, even by Dr. Jernigan's optimistic standards, blindness is, frankly,, a big pain in the butt sometimes. You can believe that blindness is obnoxious or annoying without any departure from NFB philosophy. The point is not that blindness is a nothing or a neutral condition, but that blindness isn't the tragedy or disaster that many people think it to be, and doesn't prevent you from leading a full and satisfying life. There are plenty of situations in which blindness is less fun or less convenient than being sighted, and in these acknowledged cases it is natural to wish for the ease that sight would afford in that particular situation. So I think there's nothing wrong or "un-NFB-like" about supporting sight restoration research, for instance, or even being the beneficiary of a procedure once it becomes available. I would only be concerned if your interest in sight is constant and stems from a fundamental discontent with yourself and a feature of yourself that you can't change. Wishing for something you can't have (assuming your blindness is incurable) isn't an enjoyable or a healthy way to live life. I think we have all had instances when we felt dissatisfied with ourselves and our blindness, and may still come across those situations today. As blind people, we are constantly facing blatant and subtle signals that we are inferior to the sighted. If we don't have proper training and opportunity, we can all too easily succumb to this popular view of blindness and begin to see ourselves as broken people. When I was in middle school, I would periodically fantasize about being sighted. When I think about those times now, I realize that I didn't fantasize about seeing things, people's faces, or anything like that. I fantasized about the social acceptance and normalcy that I thought I would gain in the sighted world if I could see. For example, I remember thinking during O&M lessons, "I wish I could see because if I could, I wouldn't be out with this embarrassing mobility teacher guy and I'd be in drama class with my friends". Toward the end of seventh grade, I started feeling perpetually depressed about being blind and angry with sighted people for acting like they were "better" than me, and I perceived that blindness was what made me not belong in the sighted community like I wanted to. One day during the summer of that year, after I got home from a day camp I was attending (with sighted kids), I remember bursting into tears and saying something to the effect of, "I hate this camp, I'm tired of being blind, and I never want to go out and deal with sighted people again." I think this was when I hit bottom in regard to my acceptance of blindness, because after that I don't recall ever feeling such intense discontent or frustration with my blindness. Shortly after that day, I started spending more time with blind peers, and I realized that I could experience normal friendships with them and that it was OK to be blind. My journey to acceptance continued when I joined the NFB and understood that those who held negative views about my capabilities as a blind person were mistaken. I realize now that the negativity I felt wasn't a direct result of my blindness. Rather, it resulted from the dependency I felt on others because I didn't have proper training, as well as the isolation I experienced because I felt like I was the only one. I imagine that most if not all of us have had experiences like this, and I think that the intense negativity toward blindness, and the aching for sight, is a call to action. If you find yourself feeling this way, think of ways you can make blindness less of a burden. It may mean getting training, or moving away from someone in your life who is over-protecting you or making you feel inadequate, or getting to know blind peers or role models with whom you have common interests. On the other hand, if you generally feel good about yourself and what you're doing, but just occasionally get annoyed by blindness or think about being sighted, I don't think that's cause for concern. As a final note, regarding Jen's second question, I don't think blindness has anything to do with it. People differ in what psychologists call "need for structure", or their tendency to use rules and routines in their everyday lives. Again, it isn't a problem unless it's making you so rigid that it's hard to enjoy life, or participate in daily activities. Arielle On 3/16/10, Darian Smith wrote: > Hi all, > I once had vision- partial vision. do I miss it? sure, sometimes > but not always. is not having vision the end of the world or the > end of life on this plannet? obviously not; we have how many million > blind people on this planet? The beauty of being around other > blind people is that they all have different tips and tricks they > use to live life and live it to the fullest. So, while vision is not > all it's cracked up to be; there's nothing wrong with wondering or > wishing if that's how you feel. > I think that the Idea of wanting to see, is normal. we, as humans > have an interest from a young age in wanting to learn about > things we don't know. We want to fanticize about flying or having > a magical ability, that's just kind of how we are, so I think that > what you feel is totally normal. > Making rules and living in a box are both things that are not > exclusive to blindness ( or so I think). > When you think about it, people have different ways of getting > things done; thing of the memory devices people utilize to remember > names or numbers, I think that's ken to having a rule for something. > I am reminded of a Star Trek (the next generation) Episode where > "Robin Lefler" creates abook of rules "Lefler's laws". Point is, > people do it, and it's not a blindness thing. > as for the "Box" i think it can be best explained as one's > comfort zone. People have either an easier time or a harder time > dealing with reaching out of their comfort zone, depending on the > person. Again, I've found it's not a blindness thing at all. I have > friends that are better at reaching out and beyond their zone than > I, and yet there are some friends that might find this harder to do > than I may find. > i hope this helps. > Darian > > > On 3/16/10, Rania wrote: >> I also wish I can see what things look like! >> Like you I have been blind sinse birth. >> Rania, >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of Mary Fernandez >> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 10:30 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions >> >> Hi Jen, >> Both your questions are highly intriguing and thought provoking. I for >> one, >> think that it is only natural and human to want to see as a blind person. >> Most of us have found wways with which we have succeeded in life. We know >> the alternative skills, we are competent people, and we have satisfactory >> lives. However, blindness is an inconvenience. While it is not the tragedy >> that the sighted world thinks it is, it does cause us frustration and >> annoyance. Most of that frustration is due to the fact of how others view >> us. Oh, what i wouldn't give to be able to walk into a room and have >> people >> say, oh look, she seems to be a nice person, ;instead of, Gasp, she's >> blind, >> and she's walking! For me though, aside from public attitudes, I really >> really wish I could drive. I am a highly independent and somewhat >> impatient >> person. In Atlanta, public transportation isn't the best, and oh, how i >> hate >> wating on saturdays for a bus that is over an hour late. And I really >> don't >> like asking people for rides since everyone is busy. Of course, most of my >> friends wouldn't refuse, but who wants to be a burden all the time? >> Long story short, it is perfectly normal to feel that way. Sighted people >> don't wish they could see, but some wish they were married, others that >> they >> had gotten an educations, still others that they had a different job. We >> all >> wish for things that we can't have. It's human nature. But as long as it >> is >> only a passing thought, something that doesn't stop us from living a full >> and meaningful life, it's not somethign to be overly worried about. >> >> As to your second question. I think this is merely a personality trait as >> opposed to a blind specific trait. It is true, that a lot of blind people >> like to be in control, because we have no control over our lack of sight, >> it >> is comforting, and often a smart thing to have set ways of doing things. >> Knowing as much as we can about our environment, and being able to run our >> lives in a predictable fashion is important, not only to blind people, but >> to everyone. However, being boxed in all the time, and never venturing out >> of a set parameter isn't always healthy. >> I think that we all, as individuals should try to do things >> differently at some point. Sometimes doing something a different >> way, or approaching a problem from a different perspective is very >> healthy. >> If we get boxed in, and set in our ways, it might lead us to become stuck >> in >> situations that can be solved in different ways. This is especially >> important for blind individuals, because we can't always do thing a >> certain >> way so we have to look for alternatives. Last semester, I was taking a >> statistics class, and I was so determined and used to being able to get >> everything accomplished on my own, without any sighted help, that I >> completely oversaw the solution right in front of my face. Hiring someone >> to >> describe graphics while I figured out a way to do it myself would have >> been >> the perfect solution. But instead, I had gotten so boxed in just hitting >> my >> head against a wall until it gave up, that I had to withdraw from the >> class. >> I was so stuck in the fact that I didn't have my books, had never used a >> statistics computer program, and my professor was unhelpful, that I just >> failed to look a the problem from a different perspective. I've learned my >> lesson. And it is a valuable one to learn at an early stage. We have >> different reasons for wanting to have structured lives. >> Someone mentioned fear, wanting to have complete control or even just >> because we don't care to know a different way since we have never needed >> to >> do so. These are all legitimate reasons, but it is important to recognize >> that getting set in our ways can lead to failure instead of success. >> I'm so sorry I went on so long. >> Hope this help though. >> Mary >> >> >> On 3/15/10, Hope Paulos wrote: >>> Hi there. I sometimes wish I can see, but am perfectly fine being >>> blind. As far as living life inside a box.. I do this, but am trying >>> to break out of it. I want to be more spontaneous. In my case, living >>> in my box is due to fear. Therefore, I'm attempting to becoome less >>> fearful and more relaxed. To be honest (and brutally so) I believe >>> living in one's box is a "blindism", that not all blind people have, but >> many do. >>> HTH. >>> Hope and Beignet >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Jen" >>> To: >>> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 4:51 PM >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions >>> >>> >>>> 1. Am I the only one who sometimes wishes he / she could see? >>>> >>>> I am comfortable with my blindness and would not want to be sighted, >>>> but still wonder and am fascinated by what things look like at times >>>> (for new members, I have been blind since birth.) >>>> >>>> Yesterday, I took my my to a River Dance concert for her birthday. I >>>> loved the music but wanted to see the dancing that went with it as well. >>>> It was hard to try to picture it based on the music... >>>> >>>> 2. I love / cling to procedural order in life - follow all steps, and >>>> nothing can or will go wrong. I also try to make rules for everything >>>> that won't change so everything is in a contained "box" in my mind >>>> out of which it can't escape. I also find rules comforting so I don't >>>> have to think and can just do something automatically. An example of >>>> such a rule is "always take out your book in class [even if the >>>> professor isn't using it that day.] If you do this, you will always be a >> good student. >>>> If you don't, you are a bad student." >>>> >>>> I know there are no guarantees for things but still cling to the >>>> procedural mind set to keep my mental boxes of rules intact. Is being >>>> overly procedure-oriented a "blindism" or something with which the >>>> sighted struggle as well? >>>> >>>> Thanks for your input. >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%4 >>>> 0maine.edu >>>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/trillian551%40 >>> gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Mary Fernandez >> Emory University 2012 >> P.O. Box 123056 >> Atlanta Ga. >> 30322 >> Phone: 732-857-7004 >> In reaffirming the greatness of our nation, we understand that greatness >> is >> never a given. It must be earned. >> President Barack Obama >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai >> l.com >> >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >> Version: 9.0.790 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2749 - Release Date: 03/15/10 >> 14:33:00 >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Darian Smith > Skype: The_Blind_Truth > Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com > The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher > recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate > individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your > help! To Get Involved go to: > www.TeachBlindStudents.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com > -- Arielle Silverman President, National Association of Blind Students Phone: 602-502-2255 Email: nabs.president at gmail.com Website: www.nabslink.org From herekittykat2 at gmail.com Wed Mar 17 02:12:32 2010 From: herekittykat2 at gmail.com (Jewel S.) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 22:12:32 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] excel skills In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <196c01b01003161912r31c5ccd8v52eaac3f54df99b1@mail.gmail.com> Stacy Bleek has a great Excel navigation tutorial. It really helped me. She has other tutorials, too, that are great. Word, Powerpoint, and various options in JAWS. The tutorial for Excel is at . There is also a link to other tutorials on that page. Good luck! ~Jewel On 3/16/10, Nathan Clark wrote: > Does anyone have a good resource, book or website that I can go to for > Excel practice? I need to get more familiar with excel 2007 and > wondering if anyone has any good tips for me. > > Thanks > > Nathan Clark > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat2%40gmail.com > From iamantonio at cox.net Wed Mar 17 02:38:08 2010 From: iamantonio at cox.net (Antonio M. Guimaraes) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 22:38:08 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] National Association of Blind Students Membershipcommittee Presents: extra curricular activities; a conference call. References: <409c235c1003160649i3efb82d2ja7c3c36cf3e8744a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6FB19E0719B7462C8A9DF50E685E133D@userf9b4fa60eb> Hello there Darian, Thank you for putting up this very inviting notice about our call. I hope to see new college students, and high school students who are curious about this aspect of college life take part in our conversation on Sunday. I expect we will also see college grads and veteran campus dwellers share their valuable experiences with campus life, clubs, and organizations. See you there, Antonio Guimaraes If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary works in Braille. Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you. http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169 Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall ----- Original Message ----- From: "Darian Smith" To: ; "cabs-talk" ; "Colorado Students" ; "Florida Students" ; "Kansas Students" ; "Kentucky Students" ; "Louisiana Students" ; "Minnesota Students" ; "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" ; "Nebraska" ; "New Hampshire Students" ; "New Jersey Students" ; "New Mexico Association of Blind Students" ; "North Carolina Students" ; ; ; "Tennessee Students" ; "Utah Students" ; "Virginia Students" Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 9:49 AM Subject: [nabs-l] National Association of Blind Students Membershipcommittee Presents: extra curricular activities; a conference call. Greetings fellow scholars! I think you and I both know what time it is! ( time to get those mid terms back *sigh*) Actually, it’s time for the National Association of Blind students membership conference call! (presented by your not-so- local National Association of Blind Students membership committee). This call will take place on Sunday march 21st (yep, this Sunday) at 7p.m. eastern time on the nabs conference line (712.775.7100, passscode 257963). We will be talking about extra curricular a Activities, and we will have Antonio Guimaraes of the membership committee and Cindy Bennet; a student, and officer of the North Carolina Association of Blind Students, to share their stories and encourage you to do the same. So, to recap: Who:? The National Association of Blind Students membership committee. What?: nabs membership conference call When?: Sunday! Sunday? Yes! Sunday! March 21st. Where?: I’m glad you asked! Call712.775.7100 and don’t forget to use the passcode 257963 to gain entrance to the party! Why?: Because while class is a very important part of the learning experience; getting into the social aspects of scholastic life is a very important and healthy thing. Need we say more? – Doubted it. We look forward to seeing you there! Warm regards, The NABS membership committee. -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net From claudia.perry117 at gmail.com Wed Mar 17 02:48:35 2010 From: claudia.perry117 at gmail.com (Claudia Perry) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 22:48:35 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] university of phoenix In-Reply-To: <6B4825ABCCF340479494CF8CF7401E1B@coreyPC> References: <6B4825ABCCF340479494CF8CF7401E1B@coreyPC> Message-ID: <325b1af31003161948r71c8c218yf21eb2896d8b0002@mail.gmail.com> Hi Corey - My name is Claudia, and I just recently completed a Bachelor of Science in Management this past June 2009. I am a JAWS user and I must say that about 95% of my particular program was accessible. The ADA department, depending on the counselor you have, has been phenomenal in assisting me through the inaccessible things. I took all my courses strictly online. I am now working in the PhD in industrial and organizational psychology...I have completed 15 credits so far, so I have lots of courses to go...If you have any questions, you can send me a message at claudia.perry117 at gmail.com. Good luck! -- Claudia On 3/15/10, Corey Cook wrote: > hello all, > has anyone had any experience with taking online classes from the university > of phoenix? > I am thinking of using them to get a degree in information technology > support. > trying to get out of call center work and figure another degree might be the > ticket. > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry117%40gmail.com > From claudia.perry117 at gmail.com Wed Mar 17 03:10:57 2010 From: claudia.perry117 at gmail.com (Claudia Perry) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 23:10:57 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions In-Reply-To: <85ff10071003161757t596768a9l220b633506a441@mail.gmail.com> References: <86DE943AF9954193A5D8A6FF6DE0D831@RainaIsmailPC> <409c235c1003160758w6a79fd81h89ea775d63654e24@mail.gmail.com> <85ff10071003161757t596768a9l220b633506a441@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <325b1af31003162010md1046a2oe5007452b9107f42@mail.gmail.com> Hello Jen - I really appreciate your perspective. I have not been blind since birth, and believe me, I would give up blindness any day! I am not ashamed to be blind, I find it having slowed me down. As for the procedures, I think that blind individuals tend to like everything you discussed, because you have some sort of control. Sighted individuals struggle with this and do not practice it like you and I do. I am not a total, but I can only see light on or off at 1% degree of vision -- virtually not much. I wish you could see the beauty of life, but I suppose that not being able to see it ever, you would not know what to compare it to. I guess, if I had to compare it in other senses, take seeing like listening to music using a Bose stereo system, or eating the most decadent dish you have ever tasted -- nothing compares to the beauty of seeing colors. Additionally, I think that individuals miss out on some things that you may not known existed, because you cannot see it. And let's face it, no one is that patient to describe every little thing in this world. For instance, take candy, have you ever tryied a Chic-O-Stick, or Nerds candy? I had a completely blind friend of mine try these and she loved them. She had NEVER tired them in her life, and she is a 50+ old woman...I believe she has been also blind all her life. -- Claudia On 3/16/10, Arielle Silverman wrote: > Hi all, > > First of all, I think it's totally natural to be curious about > experiences that you have never had, and doesn't have any deeper > meaning. I too have never had any vision except light perception, and > I sometimes wonder what it would be like to experience vision and all > its components, simply because most other people around me have these > experiences. > > Regarding wishing or desiring to see, while this is a little different > than mere curiosity, I also think it's normal. I have often heard NFB > members express the concern that wanting to be able to see or > temporarily wishing they could see is at odds with NFB philosophy,, > and I think these fears are unfounded. The NFB's former president, > Kenneth Jernigan, made the oft-quoted statement that "with proper > training and opportunity, blindness can be reduced to the level of a > mere nuisance". According to www.dictionary.com, the word "nuisance" > is defined as meaning "an obnoxious or annoying person, thing, > condition, etc." So, even by Dr. Jernigan's optimistic standards, > blindness is, frankly,, a big pain in the butt sometimes. You can > believe that blindness is obnoxious or annoying without any departure > from NFB philosophy. The point is not that blindness is a nothing or a > neutral condition, but that blindness isn't the tragedy or disaster > that many people think it to be, and doesn't prevent you from leading > a full and satisfying life. There are plenty of situations in which > blindness is less fun or less convenient than being sighted, and in > these acknowledged cases it is natural to wish for the ease that sight > would afford in that particular situation. > > So I think there's nothing wrong or "un-NFB-like" about supporting > sight restoration research, for instance, or even being the > beneficiary of a procedure once it becomes available. I would only be > concerned if your interest in sight is constant and stems from a > fundamental discontent with yourself and a feature of yourself that > you can't change. Wishing for something you can't have (assuming your > blindness is incurable) isn't an enjoyable or a healthy way to live > life. > > I think we have all had instances when we felt dissatisfied with > ourselves and our blindness, and may still come across those > situations today. As blind people, we are constantly facing blatant > and subtle signals that we are inferior to the sighted. If we don't > have proper training and opportunity, we can all too easily succumb to > this popular view of blindness and begin to see ourselves as broken > people. > > When I was in middle school, I would periodically fantasize about > being sighted. When I think about those times now, I realize that I > didn't fantasize about seeing things, people's faces, or anything like > that. I fantasized about the social acceptance and normalcy that I > thought I would gain in the sighted world if I could see. For example, > I remember thinking during O&M lessons, "I wish I could see because if > I could, I wouldn't be out with this embarrassing mobility teacher guy > and I'd be in drama class with my friends". Toward the end of seventh > grade, I started feeling perpetually depressed about being blind and > angry with sighted people for acting like they were "better" than me, > and I perceived that blindness was what made me not belong in the > sighted community like I wanted to. One day during the summer of that > year, after I got home from a day camp I was attending (with sighted > kids), I remember bursting into tears and saying something to the > effect of, "I hate this camp, I'm tired of being blind, and I never > want to go out and deal with sighted people again." I think this was > when I hit bottom in regard to my acceptance of blindness, because > after that I don't recall ever feeling such intense discontent or > frustration with my blindness. Shortly after that day, I started > spending more time with blind peers, and I realized that I could > experience normal friendships with them and that it was OK to be > blind. My journey to acceptance continued when I joined the NFB and > understood that those who held negative views about my capabilities as > a blind person were mistaken. I realize now that the negativity I felt > wasn't a direct result of my blindness. Rather, it resulted from the > dependency I felt on others because I didn't have proper training, as > well as the isolation I experienced because I felt like I was the only > one. > > I imagine that most if not all of us have had experiences like this, > and I think that the intense negativity toward blindness, and the > aching for sight, is a call to action. If you find yourself feeling > this way, think of ways you can make blindness less of a burden. It > may mean getting training, or moving away from someone in your life > who is over-protecting you or making you feel inadequate, or getting > to know blind peers or role models with whom you have common > interests. On the other hand, if you generally feel good about > yourself and what you're doing, but just occasionally get annoyed by > blindness or think about being sighted, I don't think that's cause for > concern. > > As a final note, regarding Jen's second question, I don't think > blindness has anything to do with it. People differ in what > psychologists call "need for structure", or their tendency to use > rules and routines in their everyday lives. > Again, it isn't a problem unless it's making you so rigid that it's > hard to enjoy life, or participate in daily activities. > > Arielle > > On 3/16/10, Darian Smith wrote: >> Hi all, >> I once had vision- partial vision. do I miss it? sure, sometimes >> but not always. is not having vision the end of the world or the >> end of life on this plannet? obviously not; we have how many million >> blind people on this planet? The beauty of being around other >> blind people is that they all have different tips and tricks they >> use to live life and live it to the fullest. So, while vision is not >> all it's cracked up to be; there's nothing wrong with wondering or >> wishing if that's how you feel. >> I think that the Idea of wanting to see, is normal. we, as humans >> have an interest from a young age in wanting to learn about >> things we don't know. We want to fanticize about flying or having >> a magical ability, that's just kind of how we are, so I think that >> what you feel is totally normal. >> Making rules and living in a box are both things that are not >> exclusive to blindness ( or so I think). >> When you think about it, people have different ways of getting >> things done; thing of the memory devices people utilize to remember >> names or numbers, I think that's ken to having a rule for something. >> I am reminded of a Star Trek (the next generation) Episode where >> "Robin Lefler" creates abook of rules "Lefler's laws". Point is, >> people do it, and it's not a blindness thing. >> as for the "Box" i think it can be best explained as one's >> comfort zone. People have either an easier time or a harder time >> dealing with reaching out of their comfort zone, depending on the >> person. Again, I've found it's not a blindness thing at all. I have >> friends that are better at reaching out and beyond their zone than >> I, and yet there are some friends that might find this harder to do >> than I may find. >> i hope this helps. >> Darian >> >> >> On 3/16/10, Rania wrote: >>> I also wish I can see what things look like! >>> Like you I have been blind sinse birth. >>> Rania, >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>> Behalf >>> Of Mary Fernandez >>> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 10:30 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions >>> >>> Hi Jen, >>> Both your questions are highly intriguing and thought provoking. I for >>> one, >>> think that it is only natural and human to want to see as a blind person. >>> Most of us have found wways with which we have succeeded in life. We know >>> the alternative skills, we are competent people, and we have satisfactory >>> lives. However, blindness is an inconvenience. While it is not the >>> tragedy >>> that the sighted world thinks it is, it does cause us frustration and >>> annoyance. Most of that frustration is due to the fact of how others view >>> us. Oh, what i wouldn't give to be able to walk into a room and have >>> people >>> say, oh look, she seems to be a nice person, ;instead of, Gasp, she's >>> blind, >>> and she's walking! For me though, aside from public attitudes, I really >>> really wish I could drive. I am a highly independent and somewhat >>> impatient >>> person. In Atlanta, public transportation isn't the best, and oh, how i >>> hate >>> wating on saturdays for a bus that is over an hour late. And I really >>> don't >>> like asking people for rides since everyone is busy. Of course, most of >>> my >>> friends wouldn't refuse, but who wants to be a burden all the time? >>> Long story short, it is perfectly normal to feel that way. Sighted people >>> don't wish they could see, but some wish they were married, others that >>> they >>> had gotten an educations, still others that they had a different job. We >>> all >>> wish for things that we can't have. It's human nature. But as long as it >>> is >>> only a passing thought, something that doesn't stop us from living a full >>> and meaningful life, it's not somethign to be overly worried about. >>> >>> As to your second question. I think this is merely a personality trait as >>> opposed to a blind specific trait. It is true, that a lot of blind people >>> like to be in control, because we have no control over our lack of sight, >>> it >>> is comforting, and often a smart thing to have set ways of doing things. >>> Knowing as much as we can about our environment, and being able to run >>> our >>> lives in a predictable fashion is important, not only to blind people, >>> but >>> to everyone. However, being boxed in all the time, and never venturing >>> out >>> of a set parameter isn't always healthy. >>> I think that we all, as individuals should try to do things >>> differently at some point. Sometimes doing something a different >>> way, or approaching a problem from a different perspective is very >>> healthy. >>> If we get boxed in, and set in our ways, it might lead us to become stuck >>> in >>> situations that can be solved in different ways. This is especially >>> important for blind individuals, because we can't always do thing a >>> certain >>> way so we have to look for alternatives. Last semester, I was taking a >>> statistics class, and I was so determined and used to being able to get >>> everything accomplished on my own, without any sighted help, that I >>> completely oversaw the solution right in front of my face. Hiring someone >>> to >>> describe graphics while I figured out a way to do it myself would have >>> been >>> the perfect solution. But instead, I had gotten so boxed in just hitting >>> my >>> head against a wall until it gave up, that I had to withdraw from the >>> class. >>> I was so stuck in the fact that I didn't have my books, had never used a >>> statistics computer program, and my professor was unhelpful, that I just >>> failed to look a the problem from a different perspective. I've learned >>> my >>> lesson. And it is a valuable one to learn at an early stage. We have >>> different reasons for wanting to have structured lives. >>> Someone mentioned fear, wanting to have complete control or even just >>> because we don't care to know a different way since we have never needed >>> to >>> do so. These are all legitimate reasons, but it is important to recognize >>> that getting set in our ways can lead to failure instead of success. >>> I'm so sorry I went on so long. >>> Hope this help though. >>> Mary >>> >>> >>> On 3/15/10, Hope Paulos wrote: >>>> Hi there. I sometimes wish I can see, but am perfectly fine being >>>> blind. As far as living life inside a box.. I do this, but am trying >>>> to break out of it. I want to be more spontaneous. In my case, living >>>> in my box is due to fear. Therefore, I'm attempting to becoome less >>>> fearful and more relaxed. To be honest (and brutally so) I believe >>>> living in one's box is a "blindism", that not all blind people have, but >>> many do. >>>> HTH. >>>> Hope and Beignet >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Jen" >>>> To: >>>> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 4:51 PM >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions >>>> >>>> >>>>> 1. Am I the only one who sometimes wishes he / she could see? >>>>> >>>>> I am comfortable with my blindness and would not want to be sighted, >>>>> but still wonder and am fascinated by what things look like at times >>>>> (for new members, I have been blind since birth.) >>>>> >>>>> Yesterday, I took my my to a River Dance concert for her birthday. I >>>>> loved the music but wanted to see the dancing that went with it as >>>>> well. >>>>> It was hard to try to picture it based on the music... >>>>> >>>>> 2. I love / cling to procedural order in life - follow all steps, and >>>>> nothing can or will go wrong. I also try to make rules for everything >>>>> that won't change so everything is in a contained "box" in my mind >>>>> out of which it can't escape. I also find rules comforting so I don't >>>>> have to think and can just do something automatically. An example of >>>>> such a rule is "always take out your book in class [even if the >>>>> professor isn't using it that day.] If you do this, you will always be >>>>> a >>> good student. >>>>> If you don't, you are a bad student." >>>>> >>>>> I know there are no guarantees for things but still cling to the >>>>> procedural mind set to keep my mental boxes of rules intact. Is being >>>>> overly procedure-oriented a "blindism" or something with which the >>>>> sighted struggle as well? >>>>> >>>>> Thanks for your input. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%4 >>>>> 0maine.edu >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/trillian551%40 >>>> gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Mary Fernandez >>> Emory University 2012 >>> P.O. Box 123056 >>> Atlanta Ga. >>> 30322 >>> Phone: 732-857-7004 >>> In reaffirming the greatness of our nation, we understand that greatness >>> is >>> never a given. It must be earned. >>> President Barack Obama >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai >>> l.com >>> >>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >>> Version: 9.0.790 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2749 - Release Date: 03/15/10 >>> 14:33:00 >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Darian Smith >> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >> help! To Get Involved go to: >> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Arielle Silverman > President, National Association of Blind Students > Phone: 602-502-2255 > Email: > nabs.president at gmail.com > Website: > www.nabslink.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/claudia.perry117%40gmail.com > From corbbo at gmail.com Wed Mar 17 04:07:52 2010 From: corbbo at gmail.com (Corbb O'Connor) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 00:07:52 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: RFB&D: Deadline for $6,000 Award Coming Soon! References: <1103172059540.1101553811939.44253.6.170000E3@scheduler> Message-ID: From: Recording for the Blind & Dyslexic Date: March 17, 2010 12:00:39 AM EDT To: corbbo at gmail.com Subject: RFB&D: Deadline for $6,000 Award Coming Soon! Reply-To: mgreenwald at rfbd.org Having trouble viewing this email? Click here Accepting Applications for National Achievement Awards Top Winners Receive $6,000 Deadline: April 1st Dear Member, College seniors who are blind or visually impaired and high school seniors with learning disabilities are eligible to win $6,000. Share your story as an RFB&D member and you could become one of our 51st National Achievement Award winners. Click here to learn more and print out your application today! Top winners will also receive an all-expense paid trip to Washington, DC for an awards ceremony. Please forward this information along to anyone who may be eligible and contact me at mgreenwald at rfbd.org or (609)243-7087 for more information. Don't miss this opportunity! The deadline is fast approaching. Sincerely, Melissa Greenwald NAA Coordinator www.rfbd.org ©2010 Recording for the Blind & Dyslexic, Incorporated. All Rights Reserved. Recording for the Blind & Dyslexic ®, RFB&D®, Learning Through Listening®, the "Heart & Headphones" design and all trademarks are owned by Recording for the Blind & Dyslexic, Incorporated Forward this email This email was sent to corbbo at gmail.com by mgreenwald at rfbd.org. Update Profile/Email Address | Instant removal with SafeUnsubscribe™ | Privacy Policy. Recording for the Blind & Dyslexic | 20 Roszel Road | Princeton | NJ | 08540 From liamskitten at gmail.com Wed Mar 17 04:54:25 2010 From: liamskitten at gmail.com (Courtney Stover) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 23:54:25 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Accessible E-Books Message-ID: <7949e5e21003162154v20edddf4x20b5360715cb8e09@mail.gmail.com> Hi all: Does anyone know if the E-books available through the new Adobe Digital Edition program are accessible? Also, are the books one can purchase from fictionwise.com accessible? I'm looking to download an short story published exclusively as an E-book, and figuring out which option is most accessible is tricky. Thanks for your help. Courtney Stover From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Wed Mar 17 06:11:15 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 23:11:15 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] nfb training centers In-Reply-To: <4383d01d1003161405p134f6c88wd4742ea773e7ad85@mail.gmail.com> References: <4b9e7bc6.15dbf10a.615f.156f@mx.google.com> <4383d01d1003160017t6dc6b3b0r3cb6031217530320@mail.gmail.com> <4383d01d1003161405p134f6c88wd4742ea773e7ad85@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <409c235c1003162311x2a4b6e7em544854c413be9be5@mail.gmail.com> Hi all, I too went to the CCB, Julie is great, sometimes a little difficult to get a hold of by phone, so E-mailing as a follow-up to the calls might be a good idea. If you live in florida then yes,I'd imagine Colorado is going to be cold. But it's beautiful out there even when it is cold. the Denver Metro area is a great area to travel in. There's a light rail and bus system and it covers alot of area. you can actually take the bus from denver to boulder ( an hour bus ride from denver) and check out that really nice college town. There's alot to do in Denver/boulder, but as the program goes; it's a great program and so long as you put the effort in, you will gain alot. It's worth saying as others have, that all of the NFB training centers are really great centers and if you get somebody who have gone to blind inc or lcb they will tell you what make those centers special as they see them. So, this is just my view about CCB one of three very fine National Federation of the blind training centers. for what it's worth, Darian On 3/16/10, Beth wrote: > No, she hasn't. But I've left her instructions on how to get the > letter to me and stuff. > Beth > > On 3/16/10, Kerri Kosten wrote: >> Hi Beth: >> >> That's good. >> >> Good luck! >> >> Yeah, that's one of the big reasons I want to also go there too...big >> city, all different types of transportation options. >> >> Has she been hard to get a hold of? >> >> Kerri >> >> On 3/16/10, Beth wrote: >>> I am talking to Julie. She's ofered to send a letter of justification >>> and I just left her a message saying to do so. She is a big help. I >>> was recommended for CCB by a friend who attended Louisiana, but said >>> that CCB would be good because it's by a big city and has all modes of >>> transportation I need to learn. >>> Beth >>> >>> On 3/15/10, Kerri Kosten wrote: >>>> Hi Beth: >>>> >>>> Who are you talking to at CCB? Who is helping you? I also want to >>>> attend CCB but am having a very hard time getting a hold of Julie >>>> Deden their director. She said she'd help me with the "whole thing" >>>> but I've only been able to speak to her once and it's been like two >>>> months. >>>> >>>> Kerri >>>> >>>> On 3/15/10, Beth wrote: >>>>> Wow. Was it cold up there? I want to attend CCB so bad right >>>>> now. It's like getting to class is a battle and a half, and I >>>>> hope CCB will help me come up with ideas for making a living as >>>>> well as better my travel skills and cooking skills and all that >>>>> good stuff. >>>>> Beth >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kerrik2006%40gmail.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kerrik2006%40gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From mikaelastevens at cableone.net Wed Mar 17 15:07:49 2010 From: mikaelastevens at cableone.net (Mikaela Stevens) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 09:07:49 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Students needed for research study Message-ID: Hello everyone, Some of you may already know about this research study, but for those of you who do not, many more blind students are needed to make this study worthwhile. All you have to do is complete a survey online. If you have time and are interested, here is further information (this message is from Frances Mary D'Andrea): Seeking Students for Research Study Students who are between the ages of 16 and 22 years who are Braille readers and users of assistive technology are needed for a study. This study will explore how you use both Braille and electronic information for classroom work, and how you learned these literacy practices. The purpose of this research will be to add to our understanding of the current role of both hard-copy (paper) Braille and use of electronic access to information by people who are blind from ages 16-22, and your attitudes and perceptions about both braille and technology. This information will inform how we prepare pre-service teachers to instruct young braille readers. If you are interested in participating in this study or getting more information, please contact me via email at fmd22 at pitt.edu, by calling 412-521-5797, or by writing to me at: Thank you and take care! Mikaela Stevens From corbbo at gmail.com Wed Mar 17 15:31:51 2010 From: corbbo at gmail.com (Corbb O'Connor) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 11:31:51 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] RFB&D: Deadline for $6,000 Award Coming Soon! In-Reply-To: References: <1103172059540.1101553811939.44253.6.170000E3@scheduler> Message-ID: <4CF567B0-E4EE-42ED-90E8-26994C482CA7@gmail.com> Not sure why folks are having trouble with the link, but here it is again: http://www.rfbd.org/About-RFB-D/National-Achievement-Awards/108/ From nabs.president at gmail.com Wed Mar 17 15:58:52 2010 From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 10:58:52 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Survey for Blind Youth Ages 16-22 Message-ID: <85ff10071003170858t12c70284o97bf4d4e7aac5274@mail.gmail.com> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: "Riccobono, Mark" Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 11:34:40 -0400 Subject: Please Pass this On To: Arielle Silverman Arielle, Can you please pass this message onto NFB students. --------- Dear Students, I encourage you to participate in the below survey. This survey will not take you more than 10 minutes and it can help to make a significant contribution to programs for the blind. Please make your voice heard. Sincerely, Mark A. Riccobono Executive Director, Jernigan Institute National Federation of the Blind [Flyer for Students: Announcement of Study] Seeking Students for Research Study Students who are between the ages of 16 and 22 years who are braille readers and users of assistive technology are needed for a study. This study will explore how you use both braille and electronic information for classroom work, and how you learned these literacy practices. The purpose of this research will be to add to our understanding of the current role of both hard-copy (paper) braille and use of electronic access to information by people who are blind from ages 16-22, and your attitudes and perceptions about both braille and technology. This information will inform how we prepare pre-service teachers to instruct young braille readers. If you are interested in participating in this study or getting more information, please contact me via email at fmd22 at pitt.edu, by calling 412-521-5797, or by writing to me at: Frances Mary D'Andrea 5513 Posvar Hall University of Pittsburgh Pittsburgh PA 15260 If you are under 18, you MUST have your parents' or guardians' permission. A consent form will be send to you in braille or electronically after you verify that you are: 1. between the ages of 16-22 2. a student enrolled in school 3. a braille reader 4. a user of electronic assistive technology devices, hardware, or software. If you are under 18, your parents will also receive a consent form that must be signed before you can participate. Let me know if you have any questions. Thank you for your interest! Frances Mary D'Andrea -- Arielle Silverman President, National Association of Blind Students Phone: 602-502-2255 Email: nabs.president at gmail.com Website: www.nabslink.org From alberto.2500 at gmail.com Wed Mar 17 18:41:24 2010 From: alberto.2500 at gmail.com (Alberto Arreola) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 12:41:24 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Survey for Blind Youth Ages 16-22 In-Reply-To: <85ff10071003170858t12c70284o97bf4d4e7aac5274@mail.gmail.com> References: <85ff10071003170858t12c70284o97bf4d4e7aac5274@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4ba12255.9613f30a.71ba.ffffc3bc@mx.google.com> I took this a while ago it isn't that bad. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle Silverman Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2010 9:59 AM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] Survey for Blind Youth Ages 16-22 ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: "Riccobono, Mark" Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 11:34:40 -0400 Subject: Please Pass this On To: Arielle Silverman Arielle, Can you please pass this message onto NFB students. --------- Dear Students, I encourage you to participate in the below survey. This survey will not take you more than 10 minutes and it can help to make a significant contribution to programs for the blind. Please make your voice heard. Sincerely, Mark A. Riccobono Executive Director, Jernigan Institute National Federation of the Blind [Flyer for Students: Announcement of Study] Seeking Students for Research Study Students who are between the ages of 16 and 22 years who are braille readers and users of assistive technology are needed for a study. This study will explore how you use both braille and electronic information for classroom work, and how you learned these literacy practices. The purpose of this research will be to add to our understanding of the current role of both hard-copy (paper) braille and use of electronic access to information by people who are blind from ages 16-22, and your attitudes and perceptions about both braille and technology. This information will inform how we prepare pre-service teachers to instruct young braille readers. If you are interested in participating in this study or getting more information, please contact me via email at fmd22 at pitt.edu, by calling 412-521-5797, or by writing to me at: Frances Mary D'Andrea 5513 Posvar Hall University of Pittsburgh Pittsburgh PA 15260 If you are under 18, you MUST have your parents' or guardians' permission. A consent form will be send to you in braille or electronically after you verify that you are: 1. between the ages of 16-22 2. a student enrolled in school 3. a braille reader 4. a user of electronic assistive technology devices, hardware, or software. If you are under 18, your parents will also receive a consent form that must be signed before you can participate. Let me know if you have any questions. Thank you for your interest! Frances Mary D'Andrea -- Arielle Silverman President, National Association of Blind Students Phone: 602-502-2255 Email: nabs.president at gmail.com Website: www.nabslink.org _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/alberto.2500%40gmail .com From jess28 at samobile.net Wed Mar 17 18:48:56 2010 From: jess28 at samobile.net (Jessica Trask) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 14:48:56 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] low cost or free screen readers Message-ID: <20100317184856.20140.80813@web3> Peter, I know of some people using ed sharp with System Access. Keep in mind most of these people are running ed sharp and System Access on netbooks. So they wouldn't have any use for most of the other software other then Adobe Reader with I do believe also works with System Access. My fiancee hasn't tried it yet but he believes that Station Play list might work with System Access. He at the moment is waiting for a new desktop to come from the state of New York. So he won't be broadcasting until that happens hopefully in the next few weeks or so because the laptop he has really isn't meant to a broadcasting computer. Jessica -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From iamantonio at cox.net Thu Mar 18 02:14:10 2010 From: iamantonio at cox.net (Antonio M. Guimaraes) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 22:14:10 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Students needed for research study References: Message-ID: FM DAndria was a colleague through my work at the national braille press, and I believe the research is worthwhile. She was on the AFB staff, and is now working on her doctorate dissertation on something related to braille literacy. I would strongly encourage those who qualify for the study to take her up on it, and help inform research on braille and technology. . Sincerely, Antonio Guimaraes If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary works in Braille. Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you. http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169 Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mikaela Stevens" To: Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2010 11:07 AM Subject: [nabs-l] Students needed for research study > Hello everyone, > > > > Some of you may already know about this research study, but for those of > you who do not, many more blind students are needed to make this study > worthwhile. All you have to do is complete a survey online. If you have > time and are interested, here is further information (this message is from > Frances Mary D'Andrea): > > > > Seeking Students for Research Study > > Students who are between the ages of 16 and 22 years who are Braille > readers and users of assistive technology are needed for a study. This > study will explore how you use both Braille and electronic information for > classroom work, and how you learned these literacy practices. The purpose > of this research will be to add to our understanding of the current role > of both hard-copy (paper) Braille and use of electronic access to > information by people who are blind from ages 16-22, and your attitudes > and perceptions about both braille and technology. This information will > inform how we prepare pre-service teachers to instruct young braille > readers. > > If you are interested in participating in this study or getting more > information, please contact me via email at fmd22 at pitt.edu, > by calling 412-521-5797, or by writing to me at: > > > > Thank you and take care! > > > > Mikaela Stevens > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net > From ccook01 at knology.net Thu Mar 18 02:31:03 2010 From: ccook01 at knology.net (Corey Cook) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 22:31:03 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] information systems In-Reply-To: References: <1103172059540.1101553811939.44253.6.170000E3@scheduler> Message-ID: <902DD3F5769F421A8EE7AFEC4A7C36F4@coreyPC> From ccook01 at knology.net Thu Mar 18 02:31:38 2010 From: ccook01 at knology.net (Corey Cook) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 22:31:38 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Information Systems Message-ID: <86B4488F626548E3954901F80B32514D@coreyPC> Hello all, I am considering going threw the University of Phoenix online to get a masters level degree in Information Systems. I am writing to see what you guys think the chances are I will be able to use this degree to get a job once I am done. Currently I am working in customer service for a well known wireless company and am finding that I would like to move out of call center work. From iamantonio at cox.net Thu Mar 18 02:55:51 2010 From: iamantonio at cox.net (Antonio M. Guimaraes) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 22:55:51 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions References: <8A660F1432864902BB2CE4534B0D942E@HP31177120642> <7949e5e21003151519p23e4f86bs84a8a315f0a2654e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4365B0B117464E2C8FF7D22E34FF233A@userf9b4fa60eb> Courtney, I am just beginning to read this thread, so come from not having seen what others have said. I disagree that blind people are generally rule-following individuals that do not deviate from what is expected. This is more a matter of habit than anything else. Consider the person going to a fast food place. The norm, one might argue, is to order fries and a drink with your sandwich. Do blind people ultimately seek to know what is expected, and follow it as a rule? I doubt it. Blind people are as rule-breaking as anyone else. Now, if you don't know, and are not informed that people are acting a certain way, and you are acting in the way you think to be the norm, there is a social disconnect where communication is concerned. Let me use an embarrassing example or two to illustrate this point. When I was newly arrived in the united states, I was at lunch with people I hardly knew. I hang with them because they were all from Brazil, and spoke my language, but I didn't find much in common with them. I was blind, and had to deal with more learning than they did as far as nemeth and grade 2 braille. We all learned the language, and culture, and I guess my point here is that I felt uncomfortable hanging out with people just so they could get me through the lunch lines, and back to class in time. This was also middle school, and I found the people at the lunch table to be immature and irrelevant to my situation, and ultimate goals. Enough analyzing the lunch friends. In the instance when I did something socially unacceptable, I had finished drinking my Sunny D drink, and finished eating my burger. I thought for some reason that it would be a good idea to insert my sandwich rapper in the bottle, but the bottle opening was too small for this. I could sense the conversation stopping and people looking at me. I had just committed a social blunder. Consider my first few weeks in an American classroom, at the same middle school, in a math class in a language I did not speak, with a teacher writing on a board I could not see, working on something from which I was completely excluded. This time I thought it would be interesting to breathe in as much as I could, and let the air out while mouthing the words to a Brazilian Rap. Again, not such an acceptable thing to do, and a thing I wouldn't do today. I was excluded from the social situation, and went outside the norm. I could have gotten out a book at math class, and pretended to go along with the work, but I was excluded. People were reciting and reading math problems in unison, and I couldn't do it because I didn't speak the language, and could not read the material. I could have done the expected, and followed social rules, and not tried to jump through hoops to place the rapper inside the bottle, and I could have stayed quiet, and motionless in the class. I got bored and had a minute of strange behavior by mouthing words to something. I know I was being observed, and in both situations, I went outside the norm. Maybe I am an isolated case. To answer the original question, I am sure there are others who are strict followers of rules, and procedures. They will always drive on the right side of the road in this country, and try so hard to do what is expected of them that they may stress out more than enjoy life. I was having a conversation with someone about something related to this topic, and we noted that those who are highly intelligent to the point of genius try, and they many times don't have to try hard, to be perfect. This is how they operate, but I bet they are not alone. They are the ones who will get the perfect score on SAT's and the like, Sincerely, Antonio Guimaraes If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary works in Braille. Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you. http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169 Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall ----- Original Message ----- From: "Courtney Stover" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 6:19 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions > Gen, > > Your first question is a complicated one, and the answer will vary > according to who in the blind community you ask. I'm somewhat of an > anomaly, or at least feel like one, in the sense that not only do I > sometimes "wish" to see, but it's becoming more and more of a goal for > me. The research/technology for giving blind individuals at least > some vision is progressing at an astonishing rate. I'm actively > seeking to be part of the movement, through applying for research > trials.. etc. etc. > > The reasons I want to see are precisely the ones you innumerated here. > I know that blind people can be competent travelers and live/work > independently. But I want to see people dancing across a stage or the > brilliant specail effects in a movie or.. a million things. > > As to the second question.. I, too, am overly procedurally reliant. I > really do believe it's a blindness thing. We're afraid of missing > visual clues e.g. seeing sighted students taking out their books and > looking incompetent that we tend to follow procedures in the hope that > we don't stand out. Unfortunately, as I know from personal > experience, that can have the reverse effect. Oftentimes, you can be > the only person with a book on your desk, which rather defeats the > purpose. > Hope this post answers at least some of your questions, > Courtney > > On 3/15/10, Jen wrote: >> 1. Am I the only one who sometimes wishes he / she could see? >> >> I am comfortable with my blindness and would not want to be sighted, but >> still wonder and am fascinated by what things look like at times (for >> new members, I have been blind since birth.) >> >> Yesterday, I took my my to a River Dance concert for her birthday. I >> loved the music but wanted to see the dancing that went with it as well. >> It was hard to try to picture it based on the music... >> >> 2. I love / cling to procedural order in life - follow all steps, and >> nothing can or will go wrong. I also try to make rules for everything >> that won't change so everything is in a contained "box" in my mind out >> of which it can't escape. I also find rules comforting so I don't have >> to think and can just do something automatically. An example of such a >> rule is "always take out your book in class [even if the professor isn't >> using it that day.] If you do this, you will always be a good student. >> If you don't, you are a bad student." >> >> I know there are no guarantees for things but still cling to the >> procedural mind set to keep my mental boxes of rules intact. Is being >> overly procedure-oriented a "blindism" or something with which the >> sighted struggle as well? >> >> Thanks for your input. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/liamskitten%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Thu Mar 18 12:02:23 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2010 05:02:23 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] *breaking news*National Association Of Blind Students membership committee presents: Training Centers; a conference call Message-ID: <409c235c1003180502o100640d3mec4960f03121da22@mail.gmail.com> In the spirit of baseball season- Let's go for a dubble-header; two calls for the price of one! Please see below announcement Happy Late- week fellow federationests/scholars, In response to a very engaging and interesting list serve string (or two) on training centers; The National Association of Blind Students membership committee is pleased to present to you all a training center’s conference call. On this call, we will talk about what an National Federation of the Blind training center is and where they and state-ran training centers for the blind tend to differ. We also will talk about informed choice; what it means, why it’s important, and hear from individuals who have exercised their right to informed choice in order to get the training they considered best for themselves. And we, of course will discuss what questions, comments, or topics of interest anybody wants to add to the conversation. All who are interested in going to a training center of some kind, as well as those who are going or have graduated from a training center are welcomed to take part in this very informative and exciting conference call. The call will take place on Sunday March 21st at 5:30 p.m. eastern time ( an hour and a half prior to our “extra curricular activities” conference call. The call-in information is (218)339-3600 Passcode is 808277 *Please note, that this conference line will be utilized for only the training center conference call. If you are interested in joining the extra curricular activities conference call that takes place after this (you are more than welcome to take part in both calls), the number you’ll want to use is the phone number normally used for the membership conference calls (712) 775 – 7100.* Thank you for your enthusiasm and great interest; we look forward to seeing you on the call! Aimming to please, empower and inform, Your friendly nation wide Nabs Membership Committee. -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Thu Mar 18 16:33:58 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2010 12:33:58 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions Message-ID: <20100318163358.2774.29984@web2> What's worse is that people assume that these weird behaviors happen because of blindness alone when they could be from some other reason such as not knowing what to do with one's wrapper or just simply feeling frustrated and not knowing what to do about it. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Courtney, > I am just beginning to read this thread, so come from not having seen what > others have said. > I disagree that blind people are generally rule-following individuals that > do not deviate from what is expected. This is more a matter of habit than > anything else. > Consider the person going to a fast food place. The norm, one might argue, > is to order fries and a drink with your sandwich. Do blind people ultimately > seek to know what is expected, and follow it as a rule? I doubt it. > Blind people are as rule-breaking as anyone else. > Now, if you don't know, and are not informed that people are acting a > certain way, and you are acting in the way you think to be the norm, there > is a social disconnect where communication is concerned. Let me use an > embarrassing example or two to illustrate this point. > When I was newly arrived in the united states, I was at lunch with people I > hardly knew. I hang with them because they were all from Brazil, and spoke > my language, but I didn't find much in common with them. I was blind, and > had to deal with more learning than they did as far as nemeth and grade 2 > braille. We all learned the language, and culture, and I guess my point here > is that I felt uncomfortable hanging out with people just so they could get > me through the lunch lines, and back to class in time. This was also middle > school, and I found the people at the lunch table to be immature and > irrelevant to my situation, and ultimate goals. > Enough analyzing the lunch friends. In the instance when I did something > socially unacceptable, I had finished drinking my Sunny D drink, and > finished eating my burger. I thought for some reason that it would be a good > idea to insert my sandwich rapper in the bottle, but the bottle opening was > too small for this. I could sense the conversation stopping and people > looking at me. I had just committed a social blunder. > Consider my first few weeks in an American classroom, at the same middle > school, in a math class in a language I did not speak, with a teacher > writing on a board I could not see, working on something from which I was > completely excluded. This time I thought it would be interesting to breathe > in as much as I could, and let the air out while mouthing the words to a > Brazilian Rap. Again, not such an acceptable thing to do, and a thing I > wouldn't do today. I was excluded from the social situation, and went > outside the norm. > I could have gotten out a book at math class, and pretended to go along with > the work, but I was excluded. People were reciting and reading math problems > in unison, and I couldn't do it because I didn't speak the language, and > could not read the material. > I could have done the expected, and followed social rules, and not tried to > jump through hoops to place the rapper inside the bottle, and I could have > stayed quiet, and motionless in the class. I got bored and had a minute of > strange behavior by mouthing words to something. I know I was being > observed, and in both situations, I went outside the norm. > Maybe I am an isolated case. > To answer the original question, I am sure there are others who are strict > followers of rules, and procedures. They will always drive on the right side > of the road in this country, and try so hard to do what is expected of them > that they may stress out more than enjoy life. > I was having a conversation with someone about something related to this > topic, and we noted that those who are highly intelligent to the point of > genius try, and they many times don't have to try hard, to be perfect. This > is how they operate, but I bet they are not alone. They are the ones who > will get the perfect score on SAT's and the like, > Sincerely, > Antonio Guimaraes > If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup > trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of > highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary > works in Braille. > Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you. > http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169 > Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Courtney Stover" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 6:19 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Am I the only one?Two Questions >> Gen, >> Your first question is a complicated one, and the answer will vary >> according to who in the blind community you ask. I'm somewhat of an >> anomaly, or at least feel like one, in the sense that not only do I >> sometimes "wish" to see, but it's becoming more and more of a goal for >> me. The research/technology for giving blind individuals at least >> some vision is progressing at an astonishing rate. I'm actively >> seeking to be part of the movement, through applying for research >> trials.. etc. etc. >> The reasons I want to see are precisely the ones you innumerated here. >> I know that blind people can be competent travelers and live/work >> independently. But I want to see people dancing across a stage or the >> brilliant specail effects in a movie or.. a million things. >> As to the second question.. I, too, am overly procedurally reliant. I >> really do believe it's a blindness thing. We're afraid of missing >> visual clues e.g. seeing sighted students taking out their books and >> looking incompetent that we tend to follow procedures in the hope that >> we don't stand out. Unfortunately, as I know from personal >> experience, that can have the reverse effect. Oftentimes, you can be >> the only person with a book on your desk, which rather defeats the >> purpose. >> Hope this post answers at least some of your questions, >> Courtney >> On 3/15/10, Jen wrote: >>> 1. Am I the only one who sometimes wishes he / she could see? >>> I am comfortable with my blindness and would not want to be sighted, but >>> still wonder and am fascinated by what things look like at times (for >>> new members, I have been blind since birth.) >>> Yesterday, I took my my to a River Dance concert for her birthday. I >>> loved the music but wanted to see the dancing that went with it as well. >>> It was hard to try to picture it based on the music... >>> 2. I love / cling to procedural order in life - follow all steps, and >>> nothing can or will go wrong. I also try to make rules for everything >>> that won't change so everything is in a contained "box" in my mind out >>> of which it can't escape. I also find rules comforting so I don't have >>> to think and can just do something automatically. An example of such a >>> rule is "always take out your book in class [even if the professor isn't >>> using it that day.] If you do this, you will always be a good student. >>> If you don't, you are a bad student." >>> I know there are no guarantees for things but still cling to the >>> procedural mind set to keep my mental boxes of rules intact. Is being >>> overly procedure-oriented a "blindism" or something with which the >>> sighted struggle as well? >>> Thanks for your input. >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/liamskitten%40gmail.com >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From kerrik2006 at gmail.com Fri Mar 19 01:01:27 2010 From: kerrik2006 at gmail.com (Kerri Kosten) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2010 21:01:27 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] *breaking news*National Association Of Blind Students membership committee presents: Training Centers; a conference call In-Reply-To: <409c235c1003180502o100640d3mec4960f03121da22@mail.gmail.com> References: <409c235c1003180502o100640d3mec4960f03121da22@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hey Darian and All: I definitely want to attend both of these sessions. However, I and possibly others who use the Iphone may have a little problem. As you may or may not know, the Iphone is touchscreen...everything touchscreen. When dialing a regular number as the one for the call, it is fine. However, when entering an extention or in this case a passcode, it becomes tricky. You have to explore around the screen until you find the "keypad" button. After that you have to hit the numbers on the touch-virtual screen. It is very hard to do, and often slow. So, the time in order to dial the extention/passcode often times out and you have to try several times in order to dial the numbers for the passcode fast enough. The call begins at 5:30...what time should those of us who use the Iphone begin trying to enter the room without being too early? Sorry this is such a strange question...the only reason I am asking is my NFB chapter has these conference calls and I began trying to enter the meeting five minutes before and was a couple of minutes late because I couldn't dial the extention fast enough on the Iphone. I don't want to be too early but I don't want to be late and interrupt things either. Thanks! Kerri On 3/18/10, Darian Smith wrote: > In the spirit of baseball season- Let's go for a dubble-header; two > calls for the price of one! > Please see below announcement > Happy Late- week fellow federationests/scholars, > > In response to a very engaging and interesting list serve string > (or two) on training centers; The National Association of Blind > Students membership committee is pleased to present to you all a > training center’s conference call. > On this call, we will talk about what an National Federation of > the Blind training center is and where they and state-ran training > centers for the blind tend to differ. > We also will talk about informed choice; what it means, why it’s > important, and hear from individuals who have exercised their right > to informed choice in order to get the training they considered best > for themselves. > And we, of course will discuss what questions, comments, or > topics of interest anybody wants to add to the conversation. > All who are interested in going to a training center of some kind, as > well as those who are going or have graduated from a training center > are welcomed to take part in this very informative and exciting > conference call. > The call will take place on Sunday March 21st at 5:30 p.m. eastern > time ( an hour and a half prior to our “extra curricular activities” > conference call. > The call-in information is (218)339-3600 > Passcode is 808277 > *Please note, that this conference line will be utilized for only > the training center conference call. If you are interested in > joining the extra curricular activities conference call that takes > place after this (you are more than welcome to take part in both > calls), > the number you’ll want to use is the phone number normally used for > the membership conference calls (712) 775 – 7100.* > Thank you for your enthusiasm and great interest; we look forward to > seeing you on the call! > Aimming to please, empower and inform, > Your friendly nation wide Nabs Membership Committee. > > > > > > > > > > > -- > Darian Smith > Skype: The_Blind_Truth > Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com > The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher > recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate > individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your > help! To Get Involved go to: > www.TeachBlindStudents.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kerrik2006%40gmail.com > From NShaheen at nfb.org Fri Mar 19 02:25:36 2010 From: NShaheen at nfb.org (Shaheen, Natalie) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2010 21:25:36 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] STEM-ulating Growthin in New Fields Contest Message-ID: Federationists: Have you or your child participated in one of the following NCBYS programs: Science Academy 2004, Rocket On! 2004, Science Academy 2005, Rocket On! 2005, Science Academy 2006, Rocket On! 2006, Youth Slam 2007, Jr. Science Academy 2008, or Youth Slam 2009? If so, we have a contest for you! Show us in a creative way what science means to you now. You can write a poem, write an essay, submit original song lyrics, or create a piece of tactile art. The theme of this contest is "STEM-ulating Growth in New Fields." The top ten entries will be featured on the brand new Accessible Bulletin Board in the Betsy Zaborowski Conference Room at the NFB Jernigan Institute. The top ten entries will also be featured on www.blindscience.org and in NFB publications. In addition, the creator of the first place entry will receive a $25 gift certificate to iTunes! If you are interested in entering this STEM-ulating contest. please visit www.blindscience.org and follow the "STEM-ulating Growth in New Fields Contest" link for the rules and to fill out an online entry form. Entries are due no later than March 31, 2010. If you have questions, please contact Natalie Shaheen at the NFB Jernigan Institute (Nshaheen at nfb.org or 410-659-9314, extension 2293). Warmest regards, Natalie Shaheen Natalie L. Shaheen, MEd Education Program Specialist Jernigan Institute NATIONAL FEDERATION OF THE BLIND 200 E. Wells Street at Jernigan Place. Baltimore, MD 21230 Phone: (410) 659-9314 x2293 Email: nshaheen at nfb.org Fax: (410) 659-5129 Visit: www.nfb.org From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Fri Mar 19 08:25:22 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2010 01:25:22 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] *breaking news*National Association Of Blind Students membership committee presents: Training Centers; a conference call In-Reply-To: References: <409c235c1003180502o100640d3mec4960f03121da22@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <409c235c1003190125w5878e31bo379ccf94c227fb21@mail.gmail.com> Kerri, I agree that aspect of using an I phone is sometimes a little tricky, but I would proabably say that if you want to show up five, minutes or so before the fact, I would imagine you would be fine. I like using s headphone or blue tooth set up to make that aspect of things easier as a side. See you on the calls! Best, Darian On 3/18/10, Kerri Kosten wrote: > Hey Darian and All: > > I definitely want to attend both of these sessions. > > However, I and possibly others who use the Iphone may have a little problem. > > As you may or may not know, the Iphone is touchscreen...everything > touchscreen. > > When dialing a regular number as the one for the call, it is fine. > > However, when entering an extention or in this case a passcode, it > becomes tricky. You have to explore around the screen until you find > the "keypad" button. After that you have to hit the numbers on the > touch-virtual screen. It is very hard to do, and often slow. So, the > time in order to dial the extention/passcode often times out and you > have to try several times in order to dial the numbers for the > passcode fast enough. > > The call begins at 5:30...what time should those of us who use the > Iphone begin trying to enter the room without being too early? > > Sorry this is such a strange question...the only reason I am asking is > my NFB chapter has these conference calls and I began trying to enter > the meeting five minutes before and was a couple of minutes late > because I couldn't dial the extention fast enough on the Iphone. > > I don't want to be too early but I don't want to be late and interrupt > things either. > > Thanks! > Kerri > > On 3/18/10, Darian Smith wrote: >> In the spirit of baseball season- Let's go for a dubble-header; two >> calls for the price of one! >> Please see below announcement >> Happy Late- week fellow federationests/scholars, >> >> In response to a very engaging and interesting list serve string >> (or two) on training centers; The National Association of Blind >> Students membership committee is pleased to present to you all a >> training center’s conference call. >> On this call, we will talk about what an National Federation of >> the Blind training center is and where they and state-ran training >> centers for the blind tend to differ. >> We also will talk about informed choice; what it means, why it’s >> important, and hear from individuals who have exercised their right >> to informed choice in order to get the training they considered best >> for themselves. >> And we, of course will discuss what questions, comments, or >> topics of interest anybody wants to add to the conversation. >> All who are interested in going to a training center of some kind, as >> well as those who are going or have graduated from a training center >> are welcomed to take part in this very informative and exciting >> conference call. >> The call will take place on Sunday March 21st at 5:30 p.m. eastern >> time ( an hour and a half prior to our “extra curricular activities” >> conference call. >> The call-in information is (218)339-3600 >> Passcode is 808277 >> *Please note, that this conference line will be utilized for only >> the training center conference call. If you are interested in >> joining the extra curricular activities conference call that takes >> place after this (you are more than welcome to take part in both >> calls), >> the number you’ll want to use is the phone number normally used for >> the membership conference calls (712) 775 – 7100.* >> Thank you for your enthusiasm and great interest; we look forward to >> seeing you on the call! >> Aimming to please, empower and inform, >> Your friendly nation wide Nabs Membership Committee. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Darian Smith >> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >> help! To Get Involved go to: >> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kerrik2006%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From mrsmigs at migliorelli.org Fri Mar 19 16:27:53 2010 From: mrsmigs at migliorelli.org (Maryann Migliorelli) Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2010 10:27:53 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] OT: BookSense XT Raffle In-Reply-To: References: , <53A9328F586C466CA34556D7FA01DA28@jage>, Message-ID: <019001cac781$2016e380$6044aa80$@org> Could you post out the raffle details again? How much are the tickets? What paypal account should we use? Thanks. Maryann Migliorelli From mrsmigs at migliorelli.org Fri Mar 19 16:44:01 2010 From: mrsmigs at migliorelli.org (Maryann Migliorelli) Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2010 10:44:01 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] window-eyes In-Reply-To: <87E70300AF354AE989E021928D34F571@jage> References: <74E307A16A8A45E994FFD8F6FCD9CB07@YOURGHQGU4MTYI> <87E70300AF354AE989E021928D34F571@jage> Message-ID: <019701cac783$60c5f630$2251e290$@org> Perhaps it's a task that could be taken up well by the team at the N.F.B. Technology Center. Seeing as how we have access to all the best screen reading technology in one place, it might be the right one for such a job. Perhaps we might bring it up to the staff there, and see what can be done. Just my thoughts. Maryann Migliorelli From mewhalen at wisc.edu Sat Mar 20 03:59:48 2010 From: mewhalen at wisc.edu (Meghan Whalen) Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2010 21:59:48 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] OT: BookSense XT Raffle References: <53A9328F586C466CA34556D7FA01DA28@jage> <019001cac781$2016e380$6044aa80$@org> Message-ID: <8906A89FCBE542A1A6B15B5DB7E2E7A2@YOURZVIRQM73LR> Tickets are $2 for 1 or $5 for 3. You don't have to be present to win. The drawing will be on April 25. The paypal is: mewhalen at wisc.edu ----- Original Message ----- From: "Maryann Migliorelli" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Friday, March 19, 2010 10:27 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] OT: BookSense XT Raffle > Could you post out the raffle details again? How much are the tickets? > What paypal account should we use? Thanks. > Maryann Migliorelli > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mewhalen%40wisc.edu > From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Sat Mar 20 15:45:01 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 08:45:01 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] **Reminder!**National Association Of Blind Students membership Committee presents: A conference call and some people, followed by a conference call and some more people!! Message-ID: <409c235c1003200845j7dc3aef8v51a040163431ea4f@mail.gmail.com> In the spirit of baseball season-- let's play two! ; two calls for the price of one! Please see below announcement Happy Late- week fellow federationests/scholars, In response to a very engaging and interesting list serve string (or two) on training centers; The National Association of Blind Students membership committee is pleased to present to you all a training center’s conference call. Some of the Speakers contribuiting to the discussion with their experiences will include: Karen Anderson (current student of the LouisianaCenter for the Blind and Current 1st Vice president of the National association of Blind Students), Arielle Silverman(Graduate of the Louisiana Center for the Blind and Current President of the National Association of Blind Students), Amy Phelps (Director of Blind Industries and Services of Maryland), as well as others who have an experience as a student in a successful training center environment. On this call, we will talk about what an National Federation of the Blind training center is and where they and state-ran training centers for the blind tend to differ. We also will talk about informed choice; what it means, why it’s important, and hear from individuals who have exercised their right to informed choice in order to get the training they considered best for themselves. And we, of course will discuss what questions, comments, or topics of interest anybody wants to add to the conversation. All who are interested in going to a training center of some kind, as well as those who are going or have graduated from a training center are welcomed to take part in this very informative and exciting conference call. The call will take place on Sunday March 21st at 5:30 p.m. eastern time ( an hour and a half prior to our “extra curricular activities” conference call. The call-in information is (218)339-3600 Passcode is 808277 *Please note, that this conference line will be utilized for only the training center conference call. If you are interested in joining the extra curricular activities conference call that takes place after this (you are more than welcome to take part in both calls), the number you’ll want to use is the phone number normally used for the membership conference calls (712) 775 – 7100.* Thank you for your enthusiasm and great interest; we look forward to seeing you on the call! Aimming to please, empower and inform, Your friendly nation wide Nabs Membership Committee. Greetings fellow scholars! I think you and I both know what time it is! ( time to get those mid terms back *sigh*) Actually, it?s time for the National Association of Blind students membership conference call! (presented by your not-so- local National Association of Blind Students membership committee). This call will take place on Sunday march 21st (yep, this Sunday) at 7p.m. eastern time on the nabs conference line (712.775.7100, passscode 257963). We will be talking about extra curricular a Activities, and we will have Antonio Guimaraes of the membership committee, and current student in Rode Island and Cindy Bennet; a student, and officer of the North Carolina Association of Blind Students, to share their stories and encourage you to do the same. So, to recap: Who:? The National Association of Blind Students membership committee. What?: nabs membership conference call When?: Sunday! Sunday? Yes! Sunday! March 21st. Where?: I’m glad you asked! Call712.775.7100 and don’t forget to use the passcode 257963 to gain entrance to the party! Why?: Because while class is a very important part of the learning experience; getting into the social aspects of scholastic life is a very important and healthy thing. Need we say more? ? Doubted it. We look forward to seeing you there! Warm regards, The NABS membership committee. -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From jsorozco at gmail.com Sat Mar 20 17:13:59 2010 From: jsorozco at gmail.com (Joe Orozco) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 13:13:59 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Accessible Real-time Trading Programs Message-ID: Sorry for the cross-post. Does anyone have any information on JAWS accessible real-time trading programs? Thanks in advance. Joe Orozco "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4959 (20100319) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com From thebluesisloose at gmail.com Sat Mar 20 17:24:25 2010 From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com (Beth) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 13:24:25 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado Message-ID: <4383d01d1003201024k69bcf8d5q4fa20be10e90c3ac@mail.gmail.com> Hi, guys. As luck would have it, I am looking at plane fares for both Louisiana and Colorado so that I can get a cheaper bid on a training center, possibly Colorado. How much is it to fly, say, from Orlando to Denver versus Orlando to Monroe, Louisiana? I'd like to know also what airlines you went with and so that I cancompare the prices. Thanks. Beth From jj at bestmidi.com Sat Mar 20 18:02:56 2010 From: jj at bestmidi.com (J.J. Meddaugh) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 14:02:56 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado References: <4383d01d1003201024k69bcf8d5q4fa20be10e90c3ac@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Beth, I did a quick check at dates in April, and the cheapest to Denver looks to be around $211 with the cheapest tickets coming from Delta. Midwest Airlines offers a nonstop route for $259 on various dates. As for Monroe, the cheapest dates in April offer a fare of $244 roundtrip, also from Delta. There is no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe. Prices for airline tickets change wildly, but there really doesn't seem to be a lot of difference between the two, and I wouldn't base my decision on which training center to visit purely on who has the cheapest flights. J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor ----- Original Message ----- From: "Beth" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" ; "NFB of Florida Listserv" Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 1:24 PM Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado > Hi, guys. As luck would have it, I am looking at plane fares for both > Louisiana and Colorado so that I can get a cheaper bid on a training > center, possibly Colorado. How much is it to fly, say, from Orlando > to Denver versus Orlando to Monroe, Louisiana? I'd like to know also > what airlines you went with and so that I cancompare the prices. > Thanks. > Beth > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com > From thebluesisloose at gmail.com Sat Mar 20 20:28:52 2010 From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com (Beth) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 16:28:52 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado In-Reply-To: References: <4383d01d1003201024k69bcf8d5q4fa20be10e90c3ac@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4383d01d1003201328t2974379aia5e2dad7ded22b36@mail.gmail.com> Then what must I decide or what must my decision be based on? Now that I know there's no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe, I've got something in my favor, but what should the decision be based upon? Beth On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: > Beth, > I did a quick check at dates in April, and the cheapest to Denver looks to > be around $211 with the cheapest tickets coming from Delta. > Midwest Airlines offers a nonstop route for $259 on various dates. > > As for Monroe, the cheapest dates in April offer a fare of $244 roundtrip, > also from Delta. There is no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe. > Prices for airline tickets change wildly, but there really doesn't seem to > be a lot of difference between the two, and I wouldn't base my decision on > which training center to visit purely on who has the cheapest flights. > > > > > J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com > A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Beth" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > ; "NFB of Florida Listserv" > Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 1:24 PM > Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado > > >> Hi, guys. As luck would have it, I am looking at plane fares for both >> Louisiana and Colorado so that I can get a cheaper bid on a training >> center, possibly Colorado. How much is it to fly, say, from Orlando >> to Denver versus Orlando to Monroe, Louisiana? I'd like to know also >> what airlines you went with and so that I cancompare the prices. >> Thanks. >> Beth >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com > From jj at bestmidi.com Sat Mar 20 22:23:11 2010 From: jj at bestmidi.com (J.J. Meddaugh) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 18:23:11 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado References: <4383d01d1003201024k69bcf8d5q4fa20be10e90c3ac@mail.gmail.com> <4383d01d1003201328t2974379aia5e2dad7ded22b36@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9960FCF3B0B14266981754C2EB1F74F5@jage> Honestly, you should probably consider lots of things way before plane fares. The three training centers are not exact copies of each other. Have you spoken with the directors or students of each center to gauge opinions? J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor ----- Original Message ----- From: "Beth" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 4:28 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado > Then what must I decide or what must my decision be based on? Now > that I know there's no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe, I've > got something in my favor, but what should the decision be based upon? > Beth > > On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: >> Beth, >> I did a quick check at dates in April, and the cheapest to Denver looks >> to >> be around $211 with the cheapest tickets coming from Delta. >> Midwest Airlines offers a nonstop route for $259 on various dates. >> >> As for Monroe, the cheapest dates in April offer a fare of $244 >> roundtrip, >> also from Delta. There is no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe. >> Prices for airline tickets change wildly, but there really doesn't seem >> to >> be a lot of difference between the two, and I wouldn't base my decision >> on >> which training center to visit purely on who has the cheapest flights. >> >> >> >> >> J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com >> A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Beth" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> ; "NFB of Florida Listserv" >> Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 1:24 PM >> Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >> >> >>> Hi, guys. As luck would have it, I am looking at plane fares for both >>> Louisiana and Colorado so that I can get a cheaper bid on a training >>> center, possibly Colorado. How much is it to fly, say, from Orlando >>> to Denver versus Orlando to Monroe, Louisiana? I'd like to know also >>> what airlines you went with and so that I cancompare the prices. >>> Thanks. >>> Beth >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com > From lizmohnke at hotmail.com Sat Mar 20 23:30:18 2010 From: lizmohnke at hotmail.com (Elizabeth) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 19:30:18 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado In-Reply-To: <4383d01d1003201328t2974379aia5e2dad7ded22b36@mail.gmail.com> References: <4383d01d1003201024k69bcf8d5q4fa20be10e90c3ac@mail.gmail.com>, , <4383d01d1003201328t2974379aia5e2dad7ded22b36@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi Beth, Please forgive me, but I have not had a chance to read through all of the messages regarding this topic. You can correct me if I am wrong, but based on this current thread, it sounds as though you are trying to decide which training center to visit with the possibility of becoming a student in the not so distant future. If that is the case, then perhaps you could visit both centers rather than just one of them. I understand this may not be possible for your individual situation, but I found this to be a tremendous help for me a few years ago when the cost of traveling was more affordable. If you cannot afford to visit both centers, you could also try calling each center to see if you could speak with a current student about their current experiences at the training center. You could also ask to speak with recent graduates from the center. Sometimes the person who answers the phone when you call the center is a previous student, so you could ask them what they think of the training center as well. Although the flight information provided in the previous post should not be the sole determining factor in your decision, I think it should be a part of it especially if you are considering any visits back home for the holidays. Another thing I think you should consider is the location of the training center. If you’re looking for some small town Southern charm, then perhaps Louisiana is the place for you. But if you would rather see some snow and breathe in some mountain air, then perhaps you should check out Colorado instead. Some people find bigger cities too much of a challenge while others may get bored easily in a small town with not as much to do. In my opinion the basic skills and confidence you learn at either center is the same. They are just run by different people with different personalities and slightly different management styles. I have heard that Louisiana is a bit more strict while Colorado is a bit more laid back. But a lot of what you get out of a training center depends a lot on what you put into it. If you go into it with an open mind and the willingness to learn new things, then I think either center would work for you as long as you are also willing to put in all the hard work that is necessary to successfully complete the six to nine month program. What I think sets NFB centers apart from most state run facilities is our philosophy about blindness. They are also well grounded in stable leadership that does not seem to change simply because the director decides to try something new that could be seen as controversial like what has recently happened here in Michigan. Overall, I think the training you will receive will be similar no matter which training center you choose. And even though you are not brave enough to withstand the frigid cold winters of Minnesota, the ideas presented here could also be used for anyone who is thinking about attending Blind, Inc as well. I hope this gives you, or anyone else, some things to think about when trying to decide which NFB training center to attend. I’m sure the tomorrow’s conference call will provide more information, but here is something to get you started in the meantime. Elizabeth _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail is redefining busy with tools for the New Busy. Get more from your inbox. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_2 From thebluesisloose at gmail.com Sat Mar 20 23:40:28 2010 From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com (Beth) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 19:40:28 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado In-Reply-To: <9960FCF3B0B14266981754C2EB1F74F5@jage> References: <4383d01d1003201024k69bcf8d5q4fa20be10e90c3ac@mail.gmail.com> <4383d01d1003201328t2974379aia5e2dad7ded22b36@mail.gmail.com> <9960FCF3B0B14266981754C2EB1F74F5@jage> Message-ID: <4383d01d1003201640o531c9da0m288a44558c68913f@mail.gmail.com> Yes, I have. The thing that bothers me is that one girl didn't like Louisiana as much as the other two people I've spoken to. Then, I haven't spoken to anybody in Colorado student wise. But I spoke with the director, so she says it's nice over there. She even gave me a good reason to consider it. But I am having to decide quick because I want to leave in May, and the state agency doesn't want to paqy in full. Now, of course, we're not sure they're willing to pay at all. Beth On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: > Honestly, you should probably consider lots of things way before plane > fares. The three training centers are not exact copies of each other. Have > you spoken with the directors or students of each center to gauge opinions? > > > J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com > A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Beth" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 4:28 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado > > >> Then what must I decide or what must my decision be based on? Now >> that I know there's no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe, I've >> got something in my favor, but what should the decision be based upon? >> Beth >> >> On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: >>> Beth, >>> I did a quick check at dates in April, and the cheapest to Denver looks >>> to >>> be around $211 with the cheapest tickets coming from Delta. >>> Midwest Airlines offers a nonstop route for $259 on various dates. >>> >>> As for Monroe, the cheapest dates in April offer a fare of $244 >>> roundtrip, >>> also from Delta. There is no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe. >>> Prices for airline tickets change wildly, but there really doesn't seem >>> to >>> be a lot of difference between the two, and I wouldn't base my decision >>> on >>> which training center to visit purely on who has the cheapest flights. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com >>> A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Beth" >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> ; "NFB of Florida Listserv" >>> Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 1:24 PM >>> Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >>> >>> >>>> Hi, guys. As luck would have it, I am looking at plane fares for both >>>> Louisiana and Colorado so that I can get a cheaper bid on a training >>>> center, possibly Colorado. How much is it to fly, say, from Orlando >>>> to Denver versus Orlando to Monroe, Louisiana? I'd like to know also >>>> what airlines you went with and so that I cancompare the prices. >>>> Thanks. >>>> Beth >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com > From graduate56 at juno.com Sun Mar 21 00:08:12 2010 From: graduate56 at juno.com (Melissa Green) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 20:08:12 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado References: <4383d01d1003201024k69bcf8d5q4fa20be10e90c3ac@mail.gmail.com>, , <4383d01d1003201328t2974379aia5e2dad7ded22b36@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <87B7238A91464CC9A3408E915DCECEC4@user6e5a84c1f5> Those are really good suggestions. I agree you need to keep an open-mind whin going to a NFB center. Your success, and experience is what you will make it. Have a blessed day. Melissa Green "Happiness is a butterfly, which, when pursued, is always just beyond your grasp, but which, if you will sit down quietly, may alight upon you." ----- Original Message ----- From: "Elizabeth" To: Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 7:30 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado Hi Beth, Please forgive me, but I have not had a chance to read through all of the messages regarding this topic. You can correct me if I am wrong, but based on this current thread, it sounds as though you are trying to decide which training center to visit with the possibility of becoming a student in the not so distant future. If that is the case, then perhaps you could visit both centers rather than just one of them. I understand this may not be possible for your individual situation, but I found this to be a tremendous help for me a few years ago when the cost of traveling was more affordable. If you cannot afford to visit both centers, you could also try calling each center to see if you could speak with a current student about their current experiences at the training center. You could also ask to speak with recent graduates from the center. Sometimes the person who answers the phone when you call the center is a previous student, so you could ask them what they think of the training center as well. Although the flight information provided in the previous post should not be the sole determining factor in your decision, I think it should be a part of it especially if you are considering any visits back home for the holidays. Another thing I think you should consider is the location of the training center. If you’re looking for some small town Southern charm, then perhaps Louisiana is the place for you. But if you would rather see some snow and breathe in some mountain air, then perhaps you should check out Colorado instead. Some people find bigger cities too much of a challenge while others may get bored easily in a small town with not as much to do. In my opinion the basic skills and confidence you learn at either center is the same. They are just run by different people with different personalities and slightly different management styles. I have heard that Louisiana is a bit more strict while Colorado is a bit more laid back. But a lot of what you get out of a training center depends a lot on what you put into it. If you go into it with an open mind and the willingness to learn new things, then I think either center would work for you as long as you are also willing to put in all the hard work that is necessary to successfully complete the six to nine month program. What I think sets NFB centers apart from most state run facilities is our philosophy about blindness. They are also well grounded in stable leadership that does not seem to change simply because the director decides to try something new that could be seen as controversial like what has recently happened here in Michigan. Overall, I think the training you will receive will be similar no matter which training center you choose. And even though you are not brave enough to withstand the frigid cold winters of Minnesota, the ideas presented here could also be used for anyone who is thinking about attending Blind, Inc as well. I hope this gives you, or anyone else, some things to think about when trying to decide which NFB training center to attend. I’m sure the tomorrow’s conference call will provide more information, but here is something to get you started in the meantime. Elizabeth _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail is redefining busy with tools for the New Busy. Get more from your inbox. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_2 _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/graduate56%40juno.com ____________________________________________________________ Hotel Hotel pics, info and virtual tours. Click here to book a hotel online. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/c?cp=KIQAkK62DXZvXKviQ3jgCgAAJ1BvHzEFemsEEZ0HiReBRkMJAAYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAATRAAAAAA= From marrie12 at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 00:10:01 2010 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 17:10:01 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] This is ridiculous! Message-ID: No this is not a news article it is a rant from me. on march 8 2010 I was having issues to activate jaws so I contacted freedom scientific and told them what the problem was. they failed to help me and in my mind shrugged me off like I was a number. Here is the content of the message. Message begins here. Thank you for contacting Technical Support. Due to the complex nature of your problem activating the JAWSR for WindowsR screen reading software, it would be best if you would contact our Technical Support Department by telephone at (727) 803-8600 between the hours of 8:30 AM and 7:00 PM EST. If you would, please give the technician who answers the ticket number of 196568, so that he or she can read your e-mail message, and will be better able to assist you. Likewise, if you have any additional questions regarding this or any other issue, please don't hesitate to contact us. Ok this is odd, I got an error that the server had encountered an error. I'll attach the file in text format. Will this ruin the activation process? I tried I think twice to do this. Take care. Message ends here Ok so I show someone else the error message of which I will paste the contents of the file in to this email and they said that it looked like my modem or router was issuing an ipv6 address. I already new that and we think freedom's server are a bit confused as to what is going on on my end. or sprints end actually. I'm sending this to as many people as I can can including lists and so forth to see if I can get somebody's attention. I have tried to work with Rick justice but our schedules seem to clash as I'm at school 24/7. lol. Ok here is the content of the error message... Information SentinelLM: Error[17]: Probably no servers are running on this subnet. OK Information SentinelLM: Error[4]: License server hostname not specified correctly. Set environment variable LSHOST to (colon-separated) name(s) of server(s). OK Client Activator Error Code: 30004 License server hostname not specified correctly. Set environment variable LSHOST to (colon-separated) name(s) of server(s). OK I hypothesis that this is not my end that's doing this as I can visit the net for exams and googling and other things including skype. Sincerely, Sarah k Alawami From joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 01:32:28 2010 From: joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com (RJ Sandefur) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 21:32:28 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] This is ridiculous! References: Message-ID: Have you spoken to any one from tech support? I know some one from the NFB of Florida, who might be able to assist you. I can try to set up a meeting on skype. My skype is rj.sandefur RJ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sarah Alawami" To: "Sarah Alawami" Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 8:10 PM Subject: [nabs-l] This is ridiculous! > No this is not a news article it is a rant from me. > on march 8 2010 I was having issues to activate jaws so I contacted > freedom scientific and told them what the problem was. they failed to help > me and in my mind shrugged me off like I was a number. Here is the content > of the message. > Message begins here. > Thank you for contacting Technical Support. Due to the complex nature of > your problem activating the JAWSR for WindowsR screen reading software, it > would be best if you would contact our Technical Support Department by > telephone at (727) 803-8600 between the hours of 8:30 AM and 7:00 PM EST. > If you would, please give the technician who answers the ticket number of > 196568, so that he or she can read your e-mail message, and will be better > able to assist you. Likewise, if you have any additional questions > regarding this or any other issue, please don't hesitate to contact us. > Ok this is odd, I got an error that the server had encountered an error. > I'll attach the file in text format. Will this ruin the activation > process? > I tried I think twice to do this. > > Take care. > Message ends here > > Ok so I show someone else the error message of which I will paste the > contents of the file in to this email and they said that it looked like my > modem or router was issuing an ipv6 address. I already new that and we > think freedom's server are a bit confused as to what is going on on my > end. or sprints end actually. I'm sending this to as many people as I can > can including lists and so forth to see if I can get somebody's attention. > I have tried to work with Rick justice but our schedules seem to clash as > I'm at school 24/7. lol. Ok here is the content of the error message... > > Information > SentinelLM: Error[17]: Probably no servers are running on this subnet. > OK > Information > SentinelLM: Error[4]: License server hostname not specified correctly. Set > environment variable LSHOST to > (colon-separated) name(s) of server(s). > OK > > Client Activator > Error Code: 30004 > License server hostname not specified correctly. > Set environment variable LSHOST to (colon-separated) name(s) of server(s). > OK > > I hypothesis that this is not my end that's doing this as I can visit the > net for exams and googling and other things including skype. > > Sincerely, > Sarah k Alawami > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com From joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 01:42:00 2010 From: joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com (RJ Sandefur) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 21:42:00 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado References: <4383d01d1003201024k69bcf8d5q4fa20be10e90c3ac@mail.gmail.com>, , <4383d01d1003201328t2974379aia5e2dad7ded22b36@mail.gmail.com> <87B7238A91464CC9A3408E915DCECEC4@user6e5a84c1f5> Message-ID: <9107CA88E28F41CD84FA3495679DFE27@hometwxakonvzn> Beth, You've said to me that You wish to learn subway travel Correct? Why do you think you need this skill? How will going to colarido help you, verses going to rustin? Now, I personally know the answers, because you and I've talked about this vea skype. However, here is your chance to tell us why Colarido is the place for you. RJ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Melissa Green" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 8:08 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado Those are really good suggestions. I agree you need to keep an open-mind whin going to a NFB center. Your success, and experience is what you will make it. Have a blessed day. Melissa Green "Happiness is a butterfly, which, when pursued, is always just beyond your grasp, but which, if you will sit down quietly, may alight upon you." ----- Original Message ----- From: "Elizabeth" To: Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 7:30 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado Hi Beth, Please forgive me, but I have not had a chance to read through all of the messages regarding this topic. You can correct me if I am wrong, but based on this current thread, it sounds as though you are trying to decide which training center to visit with the possibility of becoming a student in the not so distant future. If that is the case, then perhaps you could visit both centers rather than just one of them. I understand this may not be possible for your individual situation, but I found this to be a tremendous help for me a few years ago when the cost of traveling was more affordable. If you cannot afford to visit both centers, you could also try calling each center to see if you could speak with a current student about their current experiences at the training center. You could also ask to speak with recent graduates from the center. Sometimes the person who answers the phone when you call the center is a previous student, so you could ask them what they think of the training center as well. Although the flight information provided in the previous post should not be the sole determining factor in your decision, I think it should be a part of it especially if you are considering any visits back home for the holidays. Another thing I think you should consider is the location of the training center. If you’re looking for some small town Southern charm, then perhaps Louisiana is the place for you. But if you would rather see some snow and breathe in some mountain air, then perhaps you should check out Colorado instead. Some people find bigger cities too much of a challenge while others may get bored easily in a small town with not as much to do. In my opinion the basic skills and confidence you learn at either center is the same. They are just run by different people with different personalities and slightly different management styles. I have heard that Louisiana is a bit more strict while Colorado is a bit more laid back. But a lot of what you get out of a training center depends a lot on what you put into it. If you go into it with an open mind and the willingness to learn new things, then I think either center would work for you as long as you are also willing to put in all the hard work that is necessary to successfully complete the six to nine month program. What I think sets NFB centers apart from most state run facilities is our philosophy about blindness. They are also well grounded in stable leadership that does not seem to change simply because the director decides to try something new that could be seen as controversial like what has recently happened here in Michigan. Overall, I think the training you will receive will be similar no matter which training center you choose. And even though you are not brave enough to withstand the frigid cold winters of Minnesota, the ideas presented here could also be used for anyone who is thinking about attending Blind, Inc as well. I hope this gives you, or anyone else, some things to think about when trying to decide which NFB training center to attend. I’m sure the tomorrow’s conference call will provide more information, but here is something to get you started in the meantime. Elizabeth _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail is redefining busy with tools for the New Busy. Get more from your inbox. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_2 _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/graduate56%40juno.com ____________________________________________________________ Hotel Hotel pics, info and virtual tours. Click here to book a hotel online. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/c?cp=KIQAkK62DXZvXKviQ3jgCgAAJ1BvHzEFemsEEZ0HiReBRkMJAAYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAATRAAAAAA= _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Sun Mar 21 02:05:52 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 22:05:52 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] This is ridiculous! Message-ID: <20100321020552.19195.95081@web2> I can understand why you'd feel frustrated. However, I personally don't think you're being shrugged off by FS. It sounds like they just want you to contact them by phone because your problem seems complex to them or at least complex enough that its solution can't be conveyed concisely or efficiently via e-mail. I would suggest then that you call tech support as soon as they're available to get things straightened out. If you can't wait until monday, it sounds like RJ is ready and able to help. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Have you spoken to any one from tech support? I know some one from the NFB > of Florida, who might be able to assist you. I can try to set up a meeting > on skype. My skype is rj.sandefur RJ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Sarah Alawami" > To: "Sarah Alawami" > Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 8:10 PM > Subject: [nabs-l] This is ridiculous! >> No this is not a news article it is a rant from me. >> on march 8 2010 I was having issues to activate jaws so I contacted >> freedom scientific and told them what the problem was. they failed to help >> me and in my mind shrugged me off like I was a number. Here is the content >> of the message. >> Message begins here. >> Thank you for contacting Technical Support. Due to the complex nature of >> your problem activating the JAWSR for WindowsR screen reading software, it >> would be best if you would contact our Technical Support Department by >> telephone at (727) 803-8600 between the hours of 8:30 AM and 7:00 PM EST. >> If you would, please give the technician who answers the ticket number of >> 196568, so that he or she can read your e-mail message, and will be better >> able to assist you. Likewise, if you have any additional questions >> regarding this or any other issue, please don't hesitate to contact us. >> Ok this is odd, I got an error that the server had encountered an error. >> I'll attach the file in text format. Will this ruin the activation >> process? >> I tried I think twice to do this. >> Take care. >> Message ends here >> Ok so I show someone else the error message of which I will paste the >> contents of the file in to this email and they said that it looked like my >> modem or router was issuing an ipv6 address. I already new that and we >> think freedom's server are a bit confused as to what is going on on my >> end. or sprints end actually. I'm sending this to as many people as I can >> can including lists and so forth to see if I can get somebody's attention. >> I have tried to work with Rick justice but our schedules seem to clash as >> I'm at school 24/7. lol. Ok here is the content of the error message... >> Information >> SentinelLM: Error[17]: Probably no servers are running on this subnet. >> OK >> Information >> SentinelLM: Error[4]: License server hostname not specified correctly. Set >> environment variable LSHOST to >> (colon-separated) name(s) of server(s). >> OK >> Client Activator >> Error Code: 30004 >> License server hostname not specified correctly. >> Set environment variable LSHOST to (colon-separated) name(s) of server(s). >> OK >> I hypothesis that this is not my end that's doing this as I can visit the >> net for exams and googling and other things including skype. >> Sincerely, >> Sarah k Alawami >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From thebluesisloose at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 02:40:21 2010 From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com (Beth) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 22:40:21 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado In-Reply-To: <9107CA88E28F41CD84FA3495679DFE27@hometwxakonvzn> References: <4383d01d1003201024k69bcf8d5q4fa20be10e90c3ac@mail.gmail.com> <4383d01d1003201328t2974379aia5e2dad7ded22b36@mail.gmail.com> <87B7238A91464CC9A3408E915DCECEC4@user6e5a84c1f5> <9107CA88E28F41CD84FA3495679DFE27@hometwxakonvzn> Message-ID: <4383d01d1003201940g7f9b6c72u1b72185347281050@mail.gmail.com> Colorado is the better fit because a. it is laid back, B. Subway travel may come in handy if I decide I'm working in a bigger metropolitan city, which I plan to do, outside the state of Foorida, C. This may put me in a better position to get a job. Beth On 3/20/10, RJ Sandefur wrote: > Beth, You've said to me that You wish to learn subway travel Correct? Why do > you think you need this skill? How will going to colarido help you, verses > going to rustin? Now, I personally know the answers, because you and I've > talked about this vea skype. However, here is your chance to tell us why > Colarido is the place for you. RJ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Melissa Green" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 8:08 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado > > > Those are really good suggestions. > I agree you need to keep an open-mind whin going to a NFB center. > Your success, and experience is what you will make it. > > Have a blessed day. > > Melissa Green > "Happiness is a butterfly, which, when pursued, is always just beyond your > grasp, but which, if you will sit down quietly, may alight upon you." > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Elizabeth" > To: > Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 7:30 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado > > > > Hi Beth, > > Please forgive me, but I have not had a chance to read through all of the > messages regarding this topic. You can correct me if I am wrong, but based > on this current thread, it sounds as though you are trying to decide which > training center to visit with the possibility of becoming a student in the > not so distant future. If that is the case, then perhaps you could visit > both centers rather than just one of them. I understand this may not be > possible for your individual situation, but I found this to be a tremendous > help for me a few years ago when the cost of traveling was more affordable. > > If you cannot afford to visit both centers, you could also try calling each > center to see if you could speak with a current student about their current > experiences at the training center. You could also ask to speak with recent > graduates from the center. Sometimes the person who answers the phone when > you call the center is a previous student, so you could ask them what they > think of the training center as well. > > Although the flight information provided in the previous post should not be > the sole determining factor in your decision, I think it should be a part of > it especially if you are considering any visits back home for the holidays. > Another thing I think you should consider is the location of the training > center. If you’re looking for some small town Southern charm, then perhaps > Louisiana is the place for you. But if you would rather see some snow and > breathe in some mountain air, then perhaps you should check out Colorado > instead. Some people find bigger cities too much of a challenge while others > may get bored easily in a small town with not as much to do. > > In my opinion the basic skills and confidence you learn at either center is > the same. They are just run by different people with different personalities > and slightly different management styles. I have heard that Louisiana is a > bit more strict while Colorado is a bit more laid back. But a lot of what > you get out of a training center depends a lot on what you put into it. If > you go into it with an open mind and the willingness to learn new things, > then I think either center would work for you as long as you are also > willing to put in all the hard work that is necessary to successfully > complete the six to nine month program. > > What I think sets NFB centers apart from most state run facilities is our > philosophy about blindness. They are also well grounded in stable leadership > that does not seem to change simply because the director decides to try > something new that could be seen as controversial like what has recently > happened here in Michigan. > > Overall, I think the training you will receive will be similar no matter > which training center you choose. And even though you are not brave enough > to withstand the frigid cold winters of Minnesota, the ideas presented here > could also be used for anyone who is thinking about attending Blind, Inc as > well. I hope this gives you, or anyone else, some things to think about when > trying to decide which NFB training center to attend. I’m sure the > tomorrow’s > conference call will provide more information, but here is something to get > you started in the meantime. > > Elizabeth > > _________________________________________________________________ > Hotmail is redefining busy with tools for the New Busy. Get more from your > inbox. > http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_2 > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/graduate56%40juno.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Hotel > Hotel pics, info and virtual tours. Click here to book a hotel online. > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/c?cp=KIQAkK62DXZvXKviQ3jgCgAAJ1BvHzEFemsEEZ0HiReBRkMJAAYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAATRAAAAAA= > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com > From pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net Sun Mar 21 02:41:56 2010 From: pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net (Peter Donahue) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 21:41:56 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] This is ridiculous! References: <20100321020552.19195.95081@web2> Message-ID: <000e01cac8a0$1328e450$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> Hello Jedi and everyone, My thoughts too. Peter Donahue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jedi" To: Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 9:05 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] This is ridiculous! I can understand why you'd feel frustrated. However, I personally don't think you're being shrugged off by FS. It sounds like they just want you to contact them by phone because your problem seems complex to them or at least complex enough that its solution can't be conveyed concisely or efficiently via e-mail. I would suggest then that you call tech support as soon as they're available to get things straightened out. If you can't wait until monday, it sounds like RJ is ready and able to help. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Have you spoken to any one from tech support? I know some one from the NFB > of Florida, who might be able to assist you. I can try to set up a meeting > on skype. My skype is rj.sandefur RJ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Sarah Alawami" > To: "Sarah Alawami" > Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 8:10 PM > Subject: [nabs-l] This is ridiculous! >> No this is not a news article it is a rant from me. >> on march 8 2010 I was having issues to activate jaws so I contacted >> freedom scientific and told them what the problem was. they failed to >> help >> me and in my mind shrugged me off like I was a number. Here is the >> content >> of the message. >> Message begins here. >> Thank you for contacting Technical Support. Due to the complex nature >> of >> your problem activating the JAWSR for WindowsR screen reading software, >> it >> would be best if you would contact our Technical Support Department by >> telephone at (727) 803-8600 between the hours of 8:30 AM and 7:00 PM EST. >> If you would, please give the technician who answers the ticket number of >> 196568, so that he or she can read your e-mail message, and will be >> better >> able to assist you. Likewise, if you have any additional questions >> regarding this or any other issue, please don't hesitate to contact us. >> Ok this is odd, I got an error that the server had encountered an error. >> I'll attach the file in text format. Will this ruin the activation >> process? >> I tried I think twice to do this. >> Take care. >> Message ends here >> Ok so I show someone else the error message of which I will paste the >> contents of the file in to this email and they said that it looked like >> my >> modem or router was issuing an ipv6 address. I already new that and we >> think freedom's server are a bit confused as to what is going on on my >> end. or sprints end actually. I'm sending this to as many people as I can >> can including lists and so forth to see if I can get somebody's >> attention. >> I have tried to work with Rick justice but our schedules seem to clash as >> I'm at school 24/7. lol. Ok here is the content of the error message... >> Information >> SentinelLM: Error[17]: Probably no servers are running on this subnet. >> OK >> Information >> SentinelLM: Error[4]: License server hostname not specified correctly. >> Set >> environment variable LSHOST to >> (colon-separated) name(s) of server(s). >> OK >> Client Activator >> Error Code: 30004 >> License server hostname not specified correctly. >> Set environment variable LSHOST to (colon-separated) name(s) of >> server(s). >> OK >> I hypothesis that this is not my end that's doing this as I can visit the >> net for exams and googling and other things including skype. >> Sincerely, >> Sarah k Alawami >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pdonahue1%40sbcglobal.net From dandrews at visi.com Sun Mar 21 03:17:45 2010 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 22:17:45 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado In-Reply-To: <4383d01d1003201328t2974379aia5e2dad7ded22b36@mail.gmail.co m> References: <4383d01d1003201024k69bcf8d5q4fa20be10e90c3ac@mail.gmail.com> <4383d01d1003201328t2974379aia5e2dad7ded22b36@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Your decision should be based on where you can get the best training and experience that coincides with your style and interests and needs. Talk to each center, see what they excel in, specialize in, push etc., and pick the one that fits you the best. Dave At 03:28 PM 3/20/2010, you wrote: >Then what must I decide or what must my decision be based on? Now >that I know there's no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe, I've >got something in my favor, but what should the decision be based upon? >Beth From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Sun Mar 21 03:53:25 2010 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 23:53:25 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado References: <4383d01d1003201024k69bcf8d5q4fa20be10e90c3ac@mail.gmail.com><4383d01d1003201328t2974379aia5e2dad7ded22b36@mail.gmail.com><9960FCF3B0B14266981754C2EB1F74F5@jage> <4383d01d1003201640o531c9da0m288a44558c68913f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <182977857AA943D8A114A0FC92A965F6@Ashley> Beth, Consider several things other than plane fairs. These include the climate, the type of travel and the size of the center; I heard one is smaller. Plane fairs fluctuate from season to season and with different airlines so this is one small factor. Yes you have to decide quickly but they can't deny you; they have to pay because its your right to choose the service provider you want. I have not been to an nfb center but I support anyone's choice to go. Ashley ----- Original Message ----- From: "Beth" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 7:40 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado > Yes, I have. The thing that bothers me is that one girl didn't like > Louisiana as much as the other two people I've spoken to. Then, I > haven't spoken to anybody in Colorado student wise. But I spoke with > the director, so she says it's nice over there. She even gave me a > good reason to consider it. But I am having to decide quick because I > want to leave in May, and the state agency doesn't want to paqy in > full. Now, of course, we're not sure they're willing to pay at all. > Beth > > On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: >> Honestly, you should probably consider lots of things way before plane >> fares. The three training centers are not exact copies of each other. >> Have >> you spoken with the directors or students of each center to gauge >> opinions? >> >> >> J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com >> A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Beth" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 4:28 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >> >> >>> Then what must I decide or what must my decision be based on? Now >>> that I know there's no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe, I've >>> got something in my favor, but what should the decision be based upon? >>> Beth >>> >>> On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: >>>> Beth, >>>> I did a quick check at dates in April, and the cheapest to Denver looks >>>> to >>>> be around $211 with the cheapest tickets coming from Delta. >>>> Midwest Airlines offers a nonstop route for $259 on various dates. >>>> >>>> As for Monroe, the cheapest dates in April offer a fare of $244 >>>> roundtrip, >>>> also from Delta. There is no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe. >>>> Prices for airline tickets change wildly, but there really doesn't seem >>>> to >>>> be a lot of difference between the two, and I wouldn't base my decision >>>> on >>>> which training center to visit purely on who has the cheapest flights. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com >>>> A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Beth" >>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>> ; "NFB of Florida Listserv" >>>> Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 1:24 PM >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >>>> >>>> >>>>> Hi, guys. As luck would have it, I am looking at plane fares for both >>>>> Louisiana and Colorado so that I can get a cheaper bid on a training >>>>> center, possibly Colorado. How much is it to fly, say, from Orlando >>>>> to Denver versus Orlando to Monroe, Louisiana? I'd like to know also >>>>> what airlines you went with and so that I cancompare the prices. >>>>> Thanks. >>>>> Beth >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net > From lizmohnke at hotmail.com Sun Mar 21 03:58:37 2010 From: lizmohnke at hotmail.com (Elizabeth) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 23:58:37 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado In-Reply-To: <4383d01d1003201640o531c9da0m288a44558c68913f@mail.gmail.com> References: <4383d01d1003201024k69bcf8d5q4fa20be10e90c3ac@mail.gmail.com>, , <4383d01d1003201328t2974379aia5e2dad7ded22b36@mail.gmail.com>, <9960FCF3B0B14266981754C2EB1F74F5@jage>, <4383d01d1003201640o531c9da0m288a44558c68913f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Well, with all do respect, I would not make a decision based solely upon hearing about one bad experience any more than I would on the cost of the airline ticket. Just because someone else had a bad experience does not necessarily mean that you will experience the same. Everyone goes to a training center at different stages of accepting their blindness and possibly their identity as simply just another person in this world who happens to be blind. So I think maturity can also play a role in how much you get out of a training center as well. And as far as learning specific skills like learning how to ride a subway, I do not think it really matters which center you choose because I think all three would prepare you to perform this skill. I know of several graduates from the Louisiana Center who ride the subway just fine. The key ingredient is confidence in thinking that you can perform a skill no matter what kind of situation you may encounter along the way. Elizabeth > Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 19:40:28 -0400 > From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado > > Yes, I have. The thing that bothers me is that one girl didn't like > Louisiana as much as the other two people I've spoken to. Then, I > haven't spoken to anybody in Colorado student wise. But I spoke with > the director, so she says it's nice over there. She even gave me a > good reason to consider it. But I am having to decide quick because I > want to leave in May, and the state agency doesn't want to paqy in > full. Now, of course, we're not sure they're willing to pay at all. > Beth > > On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: > > Honestly, you should probably consider lots of things way before plane > > fares. The three training centers are not exact copies of each other. Have > > you spoken with the directors or students of each center to gauge opinions? > > > > > > J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com > > A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Beth" > > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > > > Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 4:28 PM > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado > > > > > >> Then what must I decide or what must my decision be based on? Now > >> that I know there's no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe, I've > >> got something in my favor, but what should the decision be based upon? > >> Beth > >> > >> On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: > >>> Beth, > >>> I did a quick check at dates in April, and the cheapest to Denver looks > >>> to > >>> be around $211 with the cheapest tickets coming from Delta. > >>> Midwest Airlines offers a nonstop route for $259 on various dates. > >>> > >>> As for Monroe, the cheapest dates in April offer a fare of $244 > >>> roundtrip, > >>> also from Delta. There is no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe. > >>> Prices for airline tickets change wildly, but there really doesn't seem > >>> to > >>> be a lot of difference between the two, and I wouldn't base my decision > >>> on > >>> which training center to visit purely on who has the cheapest flights. > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com > >>> A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor > >>> ----- Original Message ----- > >>> From: "Beth" > >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > >>> ; "NFB of Florida Listserv" > >>> Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 1:24 PM > >>> Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado > >>> > >>> > >>>> Hi, guys. As luck would have it, I am looking at plane fares for both > >>>> Louisiana and Colorado so that I can get a cheaper bid on a training > >>>> center, possibly Colorado. How much is it to fly, say, from Orlando > >>>> to Denver versus Orlando to Monroe, Louisiana? I'd like to know also > >>>> what airlines you went with and so that I cancompare the prices. > >>>> Thanks. > >>>> Beth > >>>> > >>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>> nabs-l mailing list > >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > >>>> nabs-l: > >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com > >>>> > >>> > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> nabs-l mailing list > >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > >>> nabs-l: > >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com > >>> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> nabs-l mailing list > >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > >> nabs-l: > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com > >> > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > nabs-l mailing list > > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > > nabs-l: > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lizmohnke%40hotmail.com _________________________________________________________________ The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your inbox. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_3 From lizmohnke at hotmail.com Sun Mar 21 04:19:54 2010 From: lizmohnke at hotmail.com (Elizabeth) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 00:19:54 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] BookSense XT Raffle In-Reply-To: <8906A89FCBE542A1A6B15B5DB7E2E7A2@YOURZVIRQM73LR> References: , <53A9328F586C466CA34556D7FA01DA28@jage>, , , <019001cac781$2016e380$6044aa80$@org>, <8906A89FCBE542A1A6B15B5DB7E2E7A2@YOURZVIRQM73LR> Message-ID: Hi Meghan, I would like to buy two sets of three tickets for ten dollars. However, I'm just a bit behind the times, and i do not have a pay pal account. Do I need to have a pay pal account to pay for the tickets? Is there any way I could just send you a check instead? I'm sure you have most likely answered this question already, but a gentle reminder would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Elizabeth _________________________________________________________________ The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your inbox. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_3 From nabs.president at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 04:27:57 2010 From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 23:27:57 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado In-Reply-To: References: <4383d01d1003201024k69bcf8d5q4fa20be10e90c3ac@mail.gmail.com> <4383d01d1003201328t2974379aia5e2dad7ded22b36@mail.gmail.com> <9960FCF3B0B14266981754C2EB1F74F5@jage> <4383d01d1003201640o531c9da0m288a44558c68913f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <85ff10071003202127y4cdf8458p24bd67a58a03416c@mail.gmail.com> Hi all, When talking to current or former students at the different centers, it might be better to ask more objective questions. So rather than asking how they felt about the program, ask for a run-down of the typical daily schedule, what a typical lesson is like in each of the classes, and what kinds of activities students do outside of training hours. Then you can judge the evidence on your own and see how the information you get about the content of the program matches your needs and expectations. Otherwise, you might be led in a particular direction based on one or two people's idiosyncratic reactions to the center. Arielle On 3/20/10, Elizabeth wrote: > > Well, with all do respect, I would not make a decision based solely upon > hearing about one bad experience any more than I would on the cost of the > airline ticket. Just because someone else had a bad experience does not > necessarily mean that you will experience the same. Everyone goes to a > training center at different stages of accepting their blindness and > possibly their identity as simply just another person in this world who > happens to be blind. So I think maturity can also play a role in how much > you get out of a training center as well. > > And as far as learning specific skills like learning how to ride a subway, I > do not think it really matters which center you choose because I think all > three would prepare you to perform this skill. I know of several graduates > from the Louisiana Center who ride the subway just fine. The key ingredient > is confidence in thinking that you can perform a skill no matter what kind > of situation you may encounter along the way. > > Elizabeth > > > >> Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 19:40:28 -0400 >> From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >> >> Yes, I have. The thing that bothers me is that one girl didn't like >> Louisiana as much as the other two people I've spoken to. Then, I >> haven't spoken to anybody in Colorado student wise. But I spoke with >> the director, so she says it's nice over there. She even gave me a >> good reason to consider it. But I am having to decide quick because I >> want to leave in May, and the state agency doesn't want to paqy in >> full. Now, of course, we're not sure they're willing to pay at all. >> Beth >> >> On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: >> > Honestly, you should probably consider lots of things way before plane >> > fares. The three training centers are not exact copies of each other. >> > Have >> > you spoken with the directors or students of each center to gauge >> > opinions? >> > >> > >> > J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com >> > A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor >> > ----- Original Message ----- >> > From: "Beth" >> > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> > >> > Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 4:28 PM >> > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >> > >> > >> >> Then what must I decide or what must my decision be based on? Now >> >> that I know there's no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe, I've >> >> got something in my favor, but what should the decision be based upon? >> >> Beth >> >> >> >> On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: >> >>> Beth, >> >>> I did a quick check at dates in April, and the cheapest to Denver >> >>> looks >> >>> to >> >>> be around $211 with the cheapest tickets coming from Delta. >> >>> Midwest Airlines offers a nonstop route for $259 on various dates. >> >>> >> >>> As for Monroe, the cheapest dates in April offer a fare of $244 >> >>> roundtrip, >> >>> also from Delta. There is no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe. >> >>> Prices for airline tickets change wildly, but there really doesn't >> >>> seem >> >>> to >> >>> be a lot of difference between the two, and I wouldn't base my >> >>> decision >> >>> on >> >>> which training center to visit purely on who has the cheapest flights. >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com >> >>> A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor >> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >> >>> From: "Beth" >> >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >>> ; "NFB of Florida Listserv" >> >>> Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 1:24 PM >> >>> Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >> >>> >> >>> >> >>>> Hi, guys. As luck would have it, I am looking at plane fares for both >> >>>> Louisiana and Colorado so that I can get a cheaper bid on a training >> >>>> center, possibly Colorado. How much is it to fly, say, from Orlando >> >>>> to Denver versus Orlando to Monroe, Louisiana? I'd like to know also >> >>>> what airlines you went with and so that I cancompare the prices. >> >>>> Thanks. >> >>>> Beth >> >>>> >> >>>> _______________________________________________ >> >>>> nabs-l mailing list >> >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> >>>> nabs-l: >> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com >> >>>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >> >>> nabs-l mailing list >> >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> >>> nabs-l: >> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >> >>> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> nabs-l mailing list >> >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> >> nabs-l: >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com >> >> >> > >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > nabs-l mailing list >> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> > nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >> > >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lizmohnke%40hotmail.com > > > _________________________________________________________________ > The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your inbox. > http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_3 > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com > -- Arielle Silverman President, National Association of Blind Students Phone: 602-502-2255 Email: nabs.president at gmail.com Website: www.nabslink.org From dlawless86 at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 04:42:06 2010 From: dlawless86 at gmail.com (Domonique Lawless) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 23:42:06 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado In-Reply-To: <4383d01d1003201940g7f9b6c72u1b72185347281050@mail.gmail.com> References: <4383d01d1003201024k69bcf8d5q4fa20be10e90c3ac@mail.gmail.com> <4383d01d1003201328t2974379aia5e2dad7ded22b36@mail.gmail.com> <87B7238A91464CC9A3408E915DCECEC4@user6e5a84c1f5> <9107CA88E28F41CD84FA3495679DFE27@hometwxakonvzn> <4383d01d1003201940g7f9b6c72u1b72185347281050@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <423e6e461003202142x39ecba8fja140676908e629f@mail.gmail.com> Beth, Remember that when you listen to other people's reviews of things that you take their opinions with a grain of salt. Someone may have had a bad experience at one of the centers but it doesn't make it a bad place. You shouldn't decide to go or not to go based on the experiences of one person. Also, take into consideration that if a person had a negative experience they might focus on only the bad part and not some of the good things that happened too. If you seek feedback, look at a broad range of people. I hope this helps. Domonique On 3/20/10, Beth wrote: > Colorado is the better fit because > a. it is laid back, > B. Subway travel may come in handy if I decide I'm working in a bigger > metropolitan city, which I plan to do, outside the state of Foorida, > C. This may put me in a better position to get a job. > Beth > > On 3/20/10, RJ Sandefur wrote: >> Beth, You've said to me that You wish to learn subway travel Correct? Why >> do >> you think you need this skill? How will going to colarido help you, verses >> going to rustin? Now, I personally know the answers, because you and I've >> talked about this vea skype. However, here is your chance to tell us why >> Colarido is the place for you. RJ >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Melissa Green" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 8:08 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >> >> >> Those are really good suggestions. >> I agree you need to keep an open-mind whin going to a NFB center. >> Your success, and experience is what you will make it. >> >> Have a blessed day. >> >> Melissa Green >> "Happiness is a butterfly, which, when pursued, is always just beyond your >> grasp, but which, if you will sit down quietly, may alight upon you." >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Elizabeth" >> To: >> Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 7:30 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >> >> >> >> Hi Beth, >> >> Please forgive me, but I have not had a chance to read through all of the >> messages regarding this topic. You can correct me if I am wrong, but based >> on this current thread, it sounds as though you are trying to decide which >> training center to visit with the possibility of becoming a student in the >> not so distant future. If that is the case, then perhaps you could visit >> both centers rather than just one of them. I understand this may not be >> possible for your individual situation, but I found this to be a >> tremendous >> help for me a few years ago when the cost of traveling was more >> affordable. >> >> If you cannot afford to visit both centers, you could also try calling >> each >> center to see if you could speak with a current student about their >> current >> experiences at the training center. You could also ask to speak with >> recent >> graduates from the center. Sometimes the person who answers the phone when >> you call the center is a previous student, so you could ask them what they >> think of the training center as well. >> >> Although the flight information provided in the previous post should not >> be >> the sole determining factor in your decision, I think it should be a part >> of >> it especially if you are considering any visits back home for the >> holidays. >> Another thing I think you should consider is the location of the training >> center. If you’re looking for some small town Southern charm, then perhaps >> Louisiana is the place for you. But if you would rather see some snow and >> breathe in some mountain air, then perhaps you should check out Colorado >> instead. Some people find bigger cities too much of a challenge while >> others >> may get bored easily in a small town with not as much to do. >> >> In my opinion the basic skills and confidence you learn at either center >> is >> the same. They are just run by different people with different >> personalities >> and slightly different management styles. I have heard that Louisiana is a >> bit more strict while Colorado is a bit more laid back. But a lot of what >> you get out of a training center depends a lot on what you put into it. If >> you go into it with an open mind and the willingness to learn new things, >> then I think either center would work for you as long as you are also >> willing to put in all the hard work that is necessary to successfully >> complete the six to nine month program. >> >> What I think sets NFB centers apart from most state run facilities is our >> philosophy about blindness. They are also well grounded in stable >> leadership >> that does not seem to change simply because the director decides to try >> something new that could be seen as controversial like what has recently >> happened here in Michigan. >> >> Overall, I think the training you will receive will be similar no matter >> which training center you choose. And even though you are not brave enough >> to withstand the frigid cold winters of Minnesota, the ideas presented >> here >> could also be used for anyone who is thinking about attending Blind, Inc >> as >> well. I hope this gives you, or anyone else, some things to think about >> when >> trying to decide which NFB training center to attend. I’m sure the >> tomorrow’s >> conference call will provide more information, but here is something to >> get >> you started in the meantime. >> >> Elizabeth >> >> _________________________________________________________________ >> Hotmail is redefining busy with tools for the New Busy. Get more from your >> inbox. >> http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_2 >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/graduate56%40juno.com >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> Hotel >> Hotel pics, info and virtual tours. Click here to book a hotel online. >> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/c?cp=KIQAkK62DXZvXKviQ3jgCgAAJ1BvHzEFemsEEZ0HiReBRkMJAAYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAATRAAAAAA= >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dlawless86%40gmail.com > From djdrocks4ever at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 05:48:36 2010 From: djdrocks4ever at gmail.com (David Dunphy) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 01:48:36 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] This is ridiculous! References: <20100321020552.19195.95081@web2> Message-ID: <08D0E3C69D1645368AB0E0EA3AC66BE2@radio360usa> Hang in there Sara. I think telling people how to plug a computer into the wall or how to turn it on is too complex a problem for FreedomScientific lol. Hell, I called once and the guy on the phone actually had to think about his first name, no joke. From thebluesisloose at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 06:59:42 2010 From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com (Beth) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 02:59:42 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado In-Reply-To: References: <4383d01d1003201024k69bcf8d5q4fa20be10e90c3ac@mail.gmail.com> <4383d01d1003201328t2974379aia5e2dad7ded22b36@mail.gmail.com> <9960FCF3B0B14266981754C2EB1F74F5@jage> <4383d01d1003201640o531c9da0m288a44558c68913f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4383d01d1003202359o5dc589ccm11c1ee32b4faacce@mail.gmail.com> You have all made good points. I do have a question: how can I best get the state agency to pay for Colorado and not give me hell about the money? I'm seriously trying to find where it says in Section 504 of the Rehabilitation Act of 1973, but it says stuff about programs that receive federal funding. NFB centers to my knowledge don't get that, so I don't know how NFB centers apply. Beth On 3/20/10, Elizabeth wrote: > > Well, with all do respect, I would not make a decision based solely upon > hearing about one bad experience any more than I would on the cost of the > airline ticket. Just because someone else had a bad experience does not > necessarily mean that you will experience the same. Everyone goes to a > training center at different stages of accepting their blindness and > possibly their identity as simply just another person in this world who > happens to be blind. So I think maturity can also play a role in how much > you get out of a training center as well. > > And as far as learning specific skills like learning how to ride a subway, I > do not think it really matters which center you choose because I think all > three would prepare you to perform this skill. I know of several graduates > from the Louisiana Center who ride the subway just fine. The key ingredient > is confidence in thinking that you can perform a skill no matter what kind > of situation you may encounter along the way. > > Elizabeth > > > >> Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 19:40:28 -0400 >> From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >> >> Yes, I have. The thing that bothers me is that one girl didn't like >> Louisiana as much as the other two people I've spoken to. Then, I >> haven't spoken to anybody in Colorado student wise. But I spoke with >> the director, so she says it's nice over there. She even gave me a >> good reason to consider it. But I am having to decide quick because I >> want to leave in May, and the state agency doesn't want to paqy in >> full. Now, of course, we're not sure they're willing to pay at all. >> Beth >> >> On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: >> > Honestly, you should probably consider lots of things way before plane >> > fares. The three training centers are not exact copies of each other. >> > Have >> > you spoken with the directors or students of each center to gauge >> > opinions? >> > >> > >> > J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com >> > A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor >> > ----- Original Message ----- >> > From: "Beth" >> > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> > >> > Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 4:28 PM >> > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >> > >> > >> >> Then what must I decide or what must my decision be based on? Now >> >> that I know there's no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe, I've >> >> got something in my favor, but what should the decision be based upon? >> >> Beth >> >> >> >> On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: >> >>> Beth, >> >>> I did a quick check at dates in April, and the cheapest to Denver >> >>> looks >> >>> to >> >>> be around $211 with the cheapest tickets coming from Delta. >> >>> Midwest Airlines offers a nonstop route for $259 on various dates. >> >>> >> >>> As for Monroe, the cheapest dates in April offer a fare of $244 >> >>> roundtrip, >> >>> also from Delta. There is no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe. >> >>> Prices for airline tickets change wildly, but there really doesn't >> >>> seem >> >>> to >> >>> be a lot of difference between the two, and I wouldn't base my >> >>> decision >> >>> on >> >>> which training center to visit purely on who has the cheapest flights. >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com >> >>> A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor >> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >> >>> From: "Beth" >> >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >>> ; "NFB of Florida Listserv" >> >>> Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 1:24 PM >> >>> Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >> >>> >> >>> >> >>>> Hi, guys. As luck would have it, I am looking at plane fares for both >> >>>> Louisiana and Colorado so that I can get a cheaper bid on a training >> >>>> center, possibly Colorado. How much is it to fly, say, from Orlando >> >>>> to Denver versus Orlando to Monroe, Louisiana? I'd like to know also >> >>>> what airlines you went with and so that I cancompare the prices. >> >>>> Thanks. >> >>>> Beth >> >>>> >> >>>> _______________________________________________ >> >>>> nabs-l mailing list >> >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> >>>> nabs-l: >> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com >> >>>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >> >>> nabs-l mailing list >> >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> >>> nabs-l: >> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >> >>> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> nabs-l mailing list >> >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> >> nabs-l: >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com >> >> >> > >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > nabs-l mailing list >> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> > nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >> > >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lizmohnke%40hotmail.com > > > _________________________________________________________________ > The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your inbox. > http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_3 > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com > From thebluesisloose at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 07:01:06 2010 From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com (Beth) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 03:01:06 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] This is ridiculous! In-Reply-To: <08D0E3C69D1645368AB0E0EA3AC66BE2@radio360usa> References: <20100321020552.19195.95081@web2> <08D0E3C69D1645368AB0E0EA3AC66BE2@radio360usa> Message-ID: <4383d01d1003210001r1c16fc26p2bfcdc60f8434a18@mail.gmail.com> All I can say to that, Dave, is hey, that's hilarious. FS should be knowledgeable about computer stuff and sadly, HumanWare is better. I actually have connections to HumanWare and absolutely adore their products, so ... Beth On 3/21/10, David Dunphy wrote: > Hang in there Sara. I think telling people how to plug a computer into the > wall or how to turn it on is too complex a problem for FreedomScientific > lol. Hell, I called once and the guy on the phone actually had to think > about his first name, no joke. > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com > From thebluesisloose at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 07:44:09 2010 From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com (Beth) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 03:44:09 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] CCB Message-ID: <4383d01d1003210044h1267089chd30adbc34bc25663@mail.gmail.com> Hi. It's Beth. This message goes out to any CCB students and alumni. I'd like to ask a few questions. If you can answer them, please e-mail me off list. First question: what is a day at CCB like? Secondly, what is a typical lesson like? Thirdly, what stuff do you do outside normal training hours? I think it would be appropriate to pose these questions to this list so that I can get some information about where I'd like to go. Forget about plane fares and costs, since those details are menial compared to the training. Beth From thebluesisloose at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 07:41:58 2010 From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com (Beth) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 03:41:58 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado In-Reply-To: <85ff10071003202127y4cdf8458p24bd67a58a03416c@mail.gmail.com> References: <4383d01d1003201024k69bcf8d5q4fa20be10e90c3ac@mail.gmail.com> <4383d01d1003201328t2974379aia5e2dad7ded22b36@mail.gmail.com> <9960FCF3B0B14266981754C2EB1F74F5@jage> <4383d01d1003201640o531c9da0m288a44558c68913f@mail.gmail.com> <85ff10071003202127y4cdf8458p24bd67a58a03416c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4383d01d1003210041k149dd77p16d854d01ce491bb@mail.gmail.com> Good point, Arielle. I'll probably solicit some questions answers I guess from a few of you guys on the list. But that'll be a separate topic. Beth On 3/21/10, Arielle Silverman wrote: > Hi all, > > When talking to current or former students at the different centers, > it might be better to ask more objective questions. So rather than > asking how they felt about the program, ask for a run-down of the > typical daily schedule, what a typical lesson is like in each of the > classes, and what kinds of activities students do outside of training > hours. Then you can judge the evidence on your own and see how the > information you get about the content of the program matches your > needs and expectations. Otherwise, you might be led in a particular > direction based on one or two people's idiosyncratic reactions to the > center. > > Arielle > > On 3/20/10, Elizabeth wrote: >> >> Well, with all do respect, I would not make a decision based solely upon >> hearing about one bad experience any more than I would on the cost of the >> airline ticket. Just because someone else had a bad experience does not >> necessarily mean that you will experience the same. Everyone goes to a >> training center at different stages of accepting their blindness and >> possibly their identity as simply just another person in this world who >> happens to be blind. So I think maturity can also play a role in how much >> you get out of a training center as well. >> >> And as far as learning specific skills like learning how to ride a subway, >> I >> do not think it really matters which center you choose because I think all >> three would prepare you to perform this skill. I know of several graduates >> from the Louisiana Center who ride the subway just fine. The key >> ingredient >> is confidence in thinking that you can perform a skill no matter what kind >> of situation you may encounter along the way. >> >> Elizabeth >> >> >> >>> Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 19:40:28 -0400 >>> From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com >>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >>> >>> Yes, I have. The thing that bothers me is that one girl didn't like >>> Louisiana as much as the other two people I've spoken to. Then, I >>> haven't spoken to anybody in Colorado student wise. But I spoke with >>> the director, so she says it's nice over there. She even gave me a >>> good reason to consider it. But I am having to decide quick because I >>> want to leave in May, and the state agency doesn't want to paqy in >>> full. Now, of course, we're not sure they're willing to pay at all. >>> Beth >>> >>> On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: >>> > Honestly, you should probably consider lots of things way before plane >>> > fares. The three training centers are not exact copies of each other. >>> > Have >>> > you spoken with the directors or students of each center to gauge >>> > opinions? >>> > >>> > >>> > J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com >>> > A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor >>> > ----- Original Message ----- >>> > From: "Beth" >>> > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> > >>> > Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 4:28 PM >>> > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >>> > >>> > >>> >> Then what must I decide or what must my decision be based on? Now >>> >> that I know there's no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe, I've >>> >> got something in my favor, but what should the decision be based upon? >>> >> Beth >>> >> >>> >> On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: >>> >>> Beth, >>> >>> I did a quick check at dates in April, and the cheapest to Denver >>> >>> looks >>> >>> to >>> >>> be around $211 with the cheapest tickets coming from Delta. >>> >>> Midwest Airlines offers a nonstop route for $259 on various dates. >>> >>> >>> >>> As for Monroe, the cheapest dates in April offer a fare of $244 >>> >>> roundtrip, >>> >>> also from Delta. There is no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe. >>> >>> Prices for airline tickets change wildly, but there really doesn't >>> >>> seem >>> >>> to >>> >>> be a lot of difference between the two, and I wouldn't base my >>> >>> decision >>> >>> on >>> >>> which training center to visit purely on who has the cheapest >>> >>> flights. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com >>> >>> A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >>> From: "Beth" >>> >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> >>> ; "NFB of Florida Listserv" >>> >>> Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 1:24 PM >>> >>> Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>> Hi, guys. As luck would have it, I am looking at plane fares for >>> >>>> both >>> >>>> Louisiana and Colorado so that I can get a cheaper bid on a training >>> >>>> center, possibly Colorado. How much is it to fly, say, from Orlando >>> >>>> to Denver versus Orlando to Monroe, Louisiana? I'd like to know also >>> >>>> what airlines you went with and so that I cancompare the prices. >>> >>>> Thanks. >>> >>>> Beth >>> >>>> >>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>> >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> >>>> for >>> >>>> nabs-l: >>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com >>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> >> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >>> >> nabs-l mailing list >>> >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> >> nabs-l: >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com >>> >> >>> > >>> > >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > nabs-l mailing list >>> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> > nabs-l: >>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >>> > >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lizmohnke%40hotmail.com >> >> >> _________________________________________________________________ >> The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your inbox. >> http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_3 >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Arielle Silverman > President, National Association of Blind Students > Phone: 602-502-2255 > Email: > nabs.president at gmail.com > Website: > www.nabslink.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com > From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 11:00:26 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 04:00:26 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado In-Reply-To: <4383d01d1003210041k149dd77p16d854d01ce491bb@mail.gmail.com> References: <4383d01d1003201024k69bcf8d5q4fa20be10e90c3ac@mail.gmail.com> <4383d01d1003201328t2974379aia5e2dad7ded22b36@mail.gmail.com> <9960FCF3B0B14266981754C2EB1F74F5@jage> <4383d01d1003201640o531c9da0m288a44558c68913f@mail.gmail.com> <85ff10071003202127y4cdf8458p24bd67a58a03416c@mail.gmail.com> <4383d01d1003210041k149dd77p16d854d01ce491bb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <409c235c1003210400t149f2aceu7a9fcd8b7402ad44@mail.gmail.com> Hi Beth, I would agree with pretty much everybody's thoughts on this subject. I think that it is very important to get a read from a few diffferent students on the matter of what training center to go to. it is a good thing to talk to graduates and if possible current students of the three training centers and get a sense of the strenths and weaknesses of each center via the asking of non-loaded questions, much like Arielle suggested earlier on in the string. I also liked the points that Elizabeth and Dominique brought up; mainly the gem regarding taking neggitive expiriences with a grain of salt. I would even further suggest to take any Singular expirience with a grain of salt, even if it's a glowing review; the more expiriences you can gain from other people, the better. I hope that you will be able to make the conference call, as well as anybody else who has questions, and hopefully all of the folks who have contributed their wise words are able to make it as well. Best, Darian On 3/21/10, Beth wrote: > Good point, Arielle. I'll probably solicit some questions answers I > guess from a few of you guys on the list. But that'll be a separate > topic. > Beth > > On 3/21/10, Arielle Silverman wrote: >> Hi all, >> >> When talking to current or former students at the different centers, >> it might be better to ask more objective questions. So rather than >> asking how they felt about the program, ask for a run-down of the >> typical daily schedule, what a typical lesson is like in each of the >> classes, and what kinds of activities students do outside of training >> hours. Then you can judge the evidence on your own and see how the >> information you get about the content of the program matches your >> needs and expectations. Otherwise, you might be led in a particular >> direction based on one or two people's idiosyncratic reactions to the >> center. >> >> Arielle >> >> On 3/20/10, Elizabeth wrote: >>> >>> Well, with all do respect, I would not make a decision based solely upon >>> hearing about one bad experience any more than I would on the cost of the >>> airline ticket. Just because someone else had a bad experience does not >>> necessarily mean that you will experience the same. Everyone goes to a >>> training center at different stages of accepting their blindness and >>> possibly their identity as simply just another person in this world who >>> happens to be blind. So I think maturity can also play a role in how much >>> you get out of a training center as well. >>> >>> And as far as learning specific skills like learning how to ride a >>> subway, >>> I >>> do not think it really matters which center you choose because I think >>> all >>> three would prepare you to perform this skill. I know of several >>> graduates >>> from the Louisiana Center who ride the subway just fine. The key >>> ingredient >>> is confidence in thinking that you can perform a skill no matter what >>> kind >>> of situation you may encounter along the way. >>> >>> Elizabeth >>> >>> >>> >>>> Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 19:40:28 -0400 >>>> From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com >>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >>>> >>>> Yes, I have. The thing that bothers me is that one girl didn't like >>>> Louisiana as much as the other two people I've spoken to. Then, I >>>> haven't spoken to anybody in Colorado student wise. But I spoke with >>>> the director, so she says it's nice over there. She even gave me a >>>> good reason to consider it. But I am having to decide quick because I >>>> want to leave in May, and the state agency doesn't want to paqy in >>>> full. Now, of course, we're not sure they're willing to pay at all. >>>> Beth >>>> >>>> On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: >>>> > Honestly, you should probably consider lots of things way before plane >>>> > fares. The three training centers are not exact copies of each other. >>>> > Have >>>> > you spoken with the directors or students of each center to gauge >>>> > opinions? >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com >>>> > A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor >>>> > ----- Original Message ----- >>>> > From: "Beth" >>>> > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>> > >>>> > Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 4:28 PM >>>> > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >>>> > >>>> > >>>> >> Then what must I decide or what must my decision be based on? Now >>>> >> that I know there's no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe, I've >>>> >> got something in my favor, but what should the decision be based >>>> >> upon? >>>> >> Beth >>>> >> >>>> >> On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: >>>> >>> Beth, >>>> >>> I did a quick check at dates in April, and the cheapest to Denver >>>> >>> looks >>>> >>> to >>>> >>> be around $211 with the cheapest tickets coming from Delta. >>>> >>> Midwest Airlines offers a nonstop route for $259 on various dates. >>>> >>> >>>> >>> As for Monroe, the cheapest dates in April offer a fare of $244 >>>> >>> roundtrip, >>>> >>> also from Delta. There is no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe. >>>> >>> Prices for airline tickets change wildly, but there really doesn't >>>> >>> seem >>>> >>> to >>>> >>> be a lot of difference between the two, and I wouldn't base my >>>> >>> decision >>>> >>> on >>>> >>> which training center to visit purely on who has the cheapest >>>> >>> flights. >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com >>>> >>> A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor >>>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >>> From: "Beth" >>>> >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>> >>> ; "NFB of Florida Listserv" >>>> >>> Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 1:24 PM >>>> >>> Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>>> Hi, guys. As luck would have it, I am looking at plane fares for >>>> >>>> both >>>> >>>> Louisiana and Colorado so that I can get a cheaper bid on a >>>> >>>> training >>>> >>>> center, possibly Colorado. How much is it to fly, say, from Orlando >>>> >>>> to Denver versus Orlando to Monroe, Louisiana? I'd like to know >>>> >>>> also >>>> >>>> what airlines you went with and so that I cancompare the prices. >>>> >>>> Thanks. >>>> >>>> Beth >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> >>>> for >>>> >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>>> >>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> >>> for >>>> >>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>>> >> >>>> >> _______________________________________________ >>>> >> nabs-l mailing list >>>> >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> >> nabs-l: >>>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com >>>> >> >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > _______________________________________________ >>>> > nabs-l mailing list >>>> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> > nabs-l: >>>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >>>> > >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lizmohnke%40hotmail.com >>> >>> >>> _________________________________________________________________ >>> The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your >>> inbox. >>> http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_3 >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Arielle Silverman >> President, National Association of Blind Students >> Phone: 602-502-2255 >> Email: >> nabs.president at gmail.com >> Website: >> www.nabslink.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From lizmohnke at hotmail.com Sun Mar 21 14:23:45 2010 From: lizmohnke at hotmail.com (Elizabeth) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 10:23:45 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] BookSense XT Raffle In-Reply-To: References: , , <53A9328F586C466CA34556D7FA01DA28@jage>, , , , , , <019001cac781$2016e380$6044aa80$@org>, , <8906A89FCBE542A1A6B15B5DB7E2E7A2@YOURZVIRQM73LR>, Message-ID: Oops, I thought I sent this message privately, but I guess not. Oh well, I guess everyone knows now that I might not be as tech savvy as others on the list. Good thing I didn't include anything too personal in the message. Elizabeth > From: lizmohnke at hotmail.com > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 00:19:54 -0400 > Subject: [nabs-l] BookSense XT Raffle > > > Hi Meghan, > > > > I would like to buy two sets of three tickets for ten dollars. However, I'm just a bit behind the times, and i do not have a pay pal account. Do I need to have a pay pal account to pay for the tickets? Is there any way I could just send you a check instead? I'm sure you have most likely answered this question already, but a gentle reminder would be greatly appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > Elizabeth > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your inbox. > http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_3 > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lizmohnke%40hotmail.com _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail is redefining busy with tools for the New Busy. Get more from your inbox. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_2 From lizmohnke at hotmail.com Sun Mar 21 15:32:48 2010 From: lizmohnke at hotmail.com (Elizabeth) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 11:32:48 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado In-Reply-To: <85ff10071003202127y4cdf8458p24bd67a58a03416c@mail.gmail.com> References: <4383d01d1003201024k69bcf8d5q4fa20be10e90c3ac@mail.gmail.com>, , <4383d01d1003201328t2974379aia5e2dad7ded22b36@mail.gmail.com>, <9960FCF3B0B14266981754C2EB1F74F5@jage>, <4383d01d1003201640o531c9da0m288a44558c68913f@mail.gmail.com>, , <85ff10071003202127y4cdf8458p24bd67a58a03416c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Arielle, Thanks for bringing up a good point. I have been told that I sometimes ask too many questions, so that is generally not a problem for me. Personally, I would probably start by asking a broad question, and then ask more specific questions based on how the person answered it . But it definitely is a good idea to have some specific questions in mind before you begin the conversation. As someone who made a decision to attend a training center for all the wrong reasons, I cannot emphasize enough how important it is to really take the time to get all the information you can to make the decision that is right for you. It can really make a difference in what you end up getting out of your experience. Even though I had a bad experience at one of the training centers, I do my best not to discourage anyone for considering it as an option for their own training. It was not the right fit for me, but it was the perfect fit for a friend of mine. And even though we may have different opinions about the training center, we still have respect for each other, and are still good friends despite our differences. Anyway, I hope that at least some of what I have said helps in the decision making process for anyone who is considering any one of the NFB training centers. Elizabeth > Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 23:27:57 -0500 > From: nabs.president at gmail.com > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado > > Hi all, > > When talking to current or former students at the different centers, > it might be better to ask more objective questions. So rather than > asking how they felt about the program, ask for a run-down of the > typical daily schedule, what a typical lesson is like in each of the > classes, and what kinds of activities students do outside of training > hours. Then you can judge the evidence on your own and see how the > information you get about the content of the program matches your > needs and expectations. Otherwise, you might be led in a particular > direction based on one or two people's idiosyncratic reactions to the > center. > > Arielle > > On 3/20/10, Elizabeth wrote: > > > > Well, with all do respect, I would not make a decision based solely upon > > hearing about one bad experience any more than I would on the cost of the > > airline ticket. Just because someone else had a bad experience does not > > necessarily mean that you will experience the same. Everyone goes to a > > training center at different stages of accepting their blindness and > > possibly their identity as simply just another person in this world who > > happens to be blind. So I think maturity can also play a role in how much > > you get out of a training center as well. > > > > And as far as learning specific skills like learning how to ride a subway, I > > do not think it really matters which center you choose because I think all > > three would prepare you to perform this skill. I know of several graduates > > from the Louisiana Center who ride the subway just fine. The key ingredient > > is confidence in thinking that you can perform a skill no matter what kind > > of situation you may encounter along the way. > > > > Elizabeth > > > > > > > >> Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 19:40:28 -0400 > >> From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com > >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado > >> > >> Yes, I have. The thing that bothers me is that one girl didn't like > >> Louisiana as much as the other two people I've spoken to. Then, I > >> haven't spoken to anybody in Colorado student wise. But I spoke with > >> the director, so she says it's nice over there. She even gave me a > >> good reason to consider it. But I am having to decide quick because I > >> want to leave in May, and the state agency doesn't want to paqy in > >> full. Now, of course, we're not sure they're willing to pay at all. > >> Beth > >> > >> On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: > >> > Honestly, you should probably consider lots of things way before plane > >> > fares. The three training centers are not exact copies of each other. > >> > Have > >> > you spoken with the directors or students of each center to gauge > >> > opinions? > >> > > >> > > >> > J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com > >> > A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor > >> > ----- Original Message ----- > >> > From: "Beth" > >> > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > >> > > >> > Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 4:28 PM > >> > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado > >> > > >> > > >> >> Then what must I decide or what must my decision be based on? Now > >> >> that I know there's no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe, I've > >> >> got something in my favor, but what should the decision be based upon? > >> >> Beth > >> >> > >> >> On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: > >> >>> Beth, > >> >>> I did a quick check at dates in April, and the cheapest to Denver > >> >>> looks > >> >>> to > >> >>> be around $211 with the cheapest tickets coming from Delta. > >> >>> Midwest Airlines offers a nonstop route for $259 on various dates. > >> >>> > >> >>> As for Monroe, the cheapest dates in April offer a fare of $244 > >> >>> roundtrip, > >> >>> also from Delta. There is no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe. > >> >>> Prices for airline tickets change wildly, but there really doesn't > >> >>> seem > >> >>> to > >> >>> be a lot of difference between the two, and I wouldn't base my > >> >>> decision > >> >>> on > >> >>> which training center to visit purely on who has the cheapest flights. > >> >>> > >> >>> > >> >>> > >> >>> > >> >>> J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com > >> >>> A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor > >> >>> ----- Original Message ----- > >> >>> From: "Beth" > >> >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > >> >>> ; "NFB of Florida Listserv" > >> >>> Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 1:24 PM > >> >>> Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado > >> >>> > >> >>> > >> >>>> Hi, guys. As luck would have it, I am looking at plane fares for both > >> >>>> Louisiana and Colorado so that I can get a cheaper bid on a training > >> >>>> center, possibly Colorado. How much is it to fly, say, from Orlando > >> >>>> to Denver versus Orlando to Monroe, Louisiana? I'd like to know also > >> >>>> what airlines you went with and so that I cancompare the prices. > >> >>>> Thanks. > >> >>>> Beth > >> >>>> > >> >>>> _______________________________________________ > >> >>>> nabs-l mailing list > >> >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >> >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > >> >>>> nabs-l: > >> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com > >> >>>> > >> >>> > >> >>> > >> >>> _______________________________________________ > >> >>> nabs-l mailing list > >> >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > >> >>> nabs-l: > >> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com > >> >>> > >> >> > >> >> _______________________________________________ > >> >> nabs-l mailing list > >> >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > >> >> nabs-l: > >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com > >> >> > >> > > >> > > >> > _______________________________________________ > >> > nabs-l mailing list > >> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > >> > nabs-l: > >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com > >> > > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> nabs-l mailing list > >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > >> nabs-l: > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lizmohnke%40hotmail.com > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your inbox. > > http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_3 > > _______________________________________________ > > nabs-l mailing list > > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > > nabs-l: > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com > > > > > -- > Arielle Silverman > President, National Association of Blind Students > Phone: 602-502-2255 > Email: > nabs.president at gmail.com > Website: > www.nabslink.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lizmohnke%40hotmail.com _________________________________________________________________ The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your inbox. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_3 From dandrews at visi.com Sun Mar 21 16:54:57 2010 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 11:54:57 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] CCB In-Reply-To: <4383d01d1003210044h1267089chd30adbc34bc25663@mail.gmail.co m> References: <4383d01d1003210044h1267089chd30adbc34bc25663@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: We have a list for CCB Alumni. To subscribe go to: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/ccb-alumni_nfbnet.org or send e-mail to ccb-alumni-request at nfbnet.org and put the word subscribe in the subject line. Dave At 02:44 AM 3/21/2010, you wrote: >Hi. It's Beth. This message goes out to any CCB students and alumni. > I'd like to ask a few questions. If you can answer them, please >e-mail me off list. First question: what is a day at CCB like? >Secondly, what is a typical lesson like? Thirdly, what stuff do you >do outside normal training hours? I think it would be appropriate to >pose these questions to this list so that I can get some information >about where I'd like to go. Forget about plane fares and costs, since >those details are menial compared to the training. >Beth > >_______________________________________________ >nabs-l mailing list >nabs-l at nfbnet.org >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dandrews%40visi.com > > >__________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus >signature database 4962 (20100321) __________ > >The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. > >http://www.eset.com From joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 17:22:01 2010 From: joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com (RJ Sandefur) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 13:22:01 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado References: <4383d01d1003201024k69bcf8d5q4fa20be10e90c3ac@mail.gmail.com>, , <4383d01d1003201328t2974379aia5e2dad7ded22b36@mail.gmail.com>, <9960FCF3B0B14266981754C2EB1F74F5@jage>, <4383d01d1003201640o531c9da0m288a44558c68913f@mail.gmail.com>, , <85ff10071003202127y4cdf8458p24bd67a58a03416c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <0BAF7E3D7B7F420FBBB39009F7375798@hometwxakonvzn> Beth, You should try to attend the conference call Darin, Its next week right? RJ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Elizabeth" To: Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 11:32 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado > > Arielle, > > Thanks for bringing up a good point. I have been told that I sometimes ask > too many questions, so that is generally not a problem for me. Personally, > I would probably start by asking a broad question, and then ask more > specific questions based on how the person answered it . But it definitely > is a good idea to have some specific questions in mind before you begin > the conversation. > > As someone who made a decision to attend a training center for all the > wrong reasons, I cannot emphasize enough how important it is to really > take the time to get all the information you can to make the decision that > is right for you. It can really make a difference in what you end up > getting out of your experience. Even though I had a bad experience at one > of the training centers, I do my best not to discourage anyone for > considering it as an option for their own training. It was not the right > fit for me, but it was the perfect fit for a friend of mine. And even > though we may have different opinions about the training center, we still > have respect for each other, and are still good friends despite our > differences. > > Anyway, I hope that at least some of what I have said helps in the > decision making process for anyone who is considering any one of the NFB > training centers. > > Elizabeth > > >> Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 23:27:57 -0500 >> From: nabs.president at gmail.com >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >> >> Hi all, >> >> When talking to current or former students at the different centers, >> it might be better to ask more objective questions. So rather than >> asking how they felt about the program, ask for a run-down of the >> typical daily schedule, what a typical lesson is like in each of the >> classes, and what kinds of activities students do outside of training >> hours. Then you can judge the evidence on your own and see how the >> information you get about the content of the program matches your >> needs and expectations. Otherwise, you might be led in a particular >> direction based on one or two people's idiosyncratic reactions to the >> center. >> >> Arielle >> >> On 3/20/10, Elizabeth wrote: >> > >> > Well, with all do respect, I would not make a decision based solely >> > upon >> > hearing about one bad experience any more than I would on the cost of >> > the >> > airline ticket. Just because someone else had a bad experience does not >> > necessarily mean that you will experience the same. Everyone goes to a >> > training center at different stages of accepting their blindness and >> > possibly their identity as simply just another person in this world who >> > happens to be blind. So I think maturity can also play a role in how >> > much >> > you get out of a training center as well. >> > >> > And as far as learning specific skills like learning how to ride a >> > subway, I >> > do not think it really matters which center you choose because I think >> > all >> > three would prepare you to perform this skill. I know of several >> > graduates >> > from the Louisiana Center who ride the subway just fine. The key >> > ingredient >> > is confidence in thinking that you can perform a skill no matter what >> > kind >> > of situation you may encounter along the way. >> > >> > Elizabeth >> > >> > >> > >> >> Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 19:40:28 -0400 >> >> From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com >> >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >> >> >> >> Yes, I have. The thing that bothers me is that one girl didn't like >> >> Louisiana as much as the other two people I've spoken to. Then, I >> >> haven't spoken to anybody in Colorado student wise. But I spoke with >> >> the director, so she says it's nice over there. She even gave me a >> >> good reason to consider it. But I am having to decide quick because I >> >> want to leave in May, and the state agency doesn't want to paqy in >> >> full. Now, of course, we're not sure they're willing to pay at all. >> >> Beth >> >> >> >> On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: >> >> > Honestly, you should probably consider lots of things way before >> >> > plane >> >> > fares. The three training centers are not exact copies of each >> >> > other. >> >> > Have >> >> > you spoken with the directors or students of each center to gauge >> >> > opinions? >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com >> >> > A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor >> >> > ----- Original Message ----- >> >> > From: "Beth" >> >> > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> > >> >> > Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 4:28 PM >> >> > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >> >> > >> >> > >> >> >> Then what must I decide or what must my decision be based on? Now >> >> >> that I know there's no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe, I've >> >> >> got something in my favor, but what should the decision be based >> >> >> upon? >> >> >> Beth >> >> >> >> >> >> On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: >> >> >>> Beth, >> >> >>> I did a quick check at dates in April, and the cheapest to Denver >> >> >>> looks >> >> >>> to >> >> >>> be around $211 with the cheapest tickets coming from Delta. >> >> >>> Midwest Airlines offers a nonstop route for $259 on various dates. >> >> >>> >> >> >>> As for Monroe, the cheapest dates in April offer a fare of $244 >> >> >>> roundtrip, >> >> >>> also from Delta. There is no nonstop service from Orlando to >> >> >>> Monroe. >> >> >>> Prices for airline tickets change wildly, but there really doesn't >> >> >>> seem >> >> >>> to >> >> >>> be a lot of difference between the two, and I wouldn't base my >> >> >>> decision >> >> >>> on >> >> >>> which training center to visit purely on who has the cheapest >> >> >>> flights. >> >> >>> >> >> >>> >> >> >>> >> >> >>> >> >> >>> J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com >> >> >>> A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor >> >> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >> >> >>> From: "Beth" >> >> >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> >>> ; "NFB of Florida Listserv" >> >> >>> Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 1:24 PM >> >> >>> Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >> >> >>> >> >> >>> >> >> >>>> Hi, guys. As luck would have it, I am looking at plane fares for >> >> >>>> both >> >> >>>> Louisiana and Colorado so that I can get a cheaper bid on a >> >> >>>> training >> >> >>>> center, possibly Colorado. How much is it to fly, say, from >> >> >>>> Orlando >> >> >>>> to Denver versus Orlando to Monroe, Louisiana? I'd like to know >> >> >>>> also >> >> >>>> what airlines you went with and so that I cancompare the prices. >> >> >>>> Thanks. >> >> >>>> Beth >> >> >>>> >> >> >>>> _______________________________________________ >> >> >>>> nabs-l mailing list >> >> >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> >> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> >> >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> >> >>>> for >> >> >>>> nabs-l: >> >> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com >> >> >>>> >> >> >>> >> >> >>> >> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >> >> >>> nabs-l mailing list >> >> >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> >> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> >> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> >> >>> for >> >> >>> nabs-l: >> >> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >> >> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> >> nabs-l mailing list >> >> >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> >> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> >> >> for >> >> >> nabs-l: >> >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > _______________________________________________ >> >> > nabs-l mailing list >> >> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> >> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> >> > for >> >> > nabs-l: >> >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >> >> > >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> nabs-l mailing list >> >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> >> nabs-l: >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lizmohnke%40hotmail.com >> > >> > >> > _________________________________________________________________ >> > The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your >> > inbox. >> > http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_3 >> > _______________________________________________ >> > nabs-l mailing list >> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> > nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com >> > >> >> >> -- >> Arielle Silverman >> President, National Association of Blind Students >> Phone: 602-502-2255 >> Email: >> nabs.president at gmail.com >> Website: >> www.nabslink.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lizmohnke%40hotmail.com > > _________________________________________________________________ > The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your inbox. > http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_3 > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com From mewhalen at wisc.edu Sun Mar 21 17:34:43 2010 From: mewhalen at wisc.edu (Meghan Whalen) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 11:34:43 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Workout DVDS? Message-ID: <44EED67D572C4F85BC1A575B634DA58D@YOURZVIRQM73LR> I have a friend looking for a workout DVD that gives enough description so she can use it for cardio when she travels. If anyone has suggestions, that'd be great. Thanks in advance, Meghan From marrie12 at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 17:48:11 2010 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 10:48:11 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] This is ridiculous! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: It started with an email to tech support but my schedual does not allow for me to call fs as I'm always n classes or in conditinos not sutible for phone calls, stuck at the student union at the school for example. lol. so I don't kow what to do but I know it is not my end that is causing the issue. On Mar 20, 2010, at 6:32 PM, RJ Sandefur wrote: > Have you spoken to any one from tech support? I know some one from the NFB of Florida, who might be able to assist you. I can try to set up a meeting on skype. My skype is rj.sandefur RJ > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sarah Alawami" > To: "Sarah Alawami" > Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 8:10 PM > Subject: [nabs-l] This is ridiculous! > > >> No this is not a news article it is a rant from me. >> on march 8 2010 I was having issues to activate jaws so I contacted freedom scientific and told them what the problem was. they failed to help me and in my mind shrugged me off like I was a number. Here is the content of the message. >> Message begins here. >> Thank you for contacting Technical Support. Due to the complex nature of >> your problem activating the JAWSR for WindowsR screen reading software, it >> would be best if you would contact our Technical Support Department by >> telephone at (727) 803-8600 between the hours of 8:30 AM and 7:00 PM EST. >> If you would, please give the technician who answers the ticket number of >> 196568, so that he or she can read your e-mail message, and will be better >> able to assist you. Likewise, if you have any additional questions >> regarding this or any other issue, please don't hesitate to contact us. >> Ok this is odd, I got an error that the server had encountered an error. >> I'll attach the file in text format. Will this ruin the activation process? >> I tried I think twice to do this. >> >> Take care. >> Message ends here >> >> Ok so I show someone else the error message of which I will paste the contents of the file in to this email and they said that it looked like my modem or router was issuing an ipv6 address. I already new that and we think freedom's server are a bit confused as to what is going on on my end. or sprints end actually. I'm sending this to as many people as I can can including lists and so forth to see if I can get somebody's attention. I have tried to work with Rick justice but our schedules seem to clash as I'm at school 24/7. lol. Ok here is the content of the error message... >> >> Information >> SentinelLM: Error[17]: Probably no servers are running on this subnet. >> OK >> Information >> SentinelLM: Error[4]: License server hostname not specified correctly. Set environment variable LSHOST to >> (colon-separated) name(s) of server(s). >> OK >> >> Client Activator >> Error Code: 30004 >> License server hostname not specified correctly. >> Set environment variable LSHOST to (colon-separated) name(s) of server(s). >> OK >> >> I hypothesis that this is not my end that's doing this as I can visit the net for exams and googling and other things including skype. >> >> Sincerely, >> Sarah k Alawami >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com From marrie12 at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 17:50:52 2010 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 10:50:52 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] This is ridiculous! In-Reply-To: <20100321020552.19195.95081@web2> References: <20100321020552.19195.95081@web2> Message-ID: <0D03040C-2B35-4F1F-84CD-61FA73EFD980@gmail.com> I remember when there techsupport was better when they were henter joise. When I had problems with jaws way back in 2002 they said over the phone to call my dealer to fix it and the dealer fixed it in a flash. the guy did not even think, theone at fs, to look int eh system tray for a blinking button that confused jaws. it was an error with a printer driver I had installed. Also I would in my form letter tell fs what I did to trouble shoot and they woudl tell meto do the same thing I just said I did, this was a few years ago and I'm sick of it! Ok I'm done for now. but I really appreciate your guys's help. On Mar 20, 2010, at 7:05 PM, Jedi wrote: > I can understand why you'd feel frustrated. However, I personally don't think you're being shrugged off by FS. It sounds like they just want you to contact them by phone because your problem seems complex to them or at least complex enough that its solution can't be conveyed concisely or efficiently via e-mail. I would suggest then that you call tech support as soon as they're available to get things straightened out. If you can't wait until monday, it sounds like RJ is ready and able to help. > > Respectfully, > Jedi > > Original message: >> Have you spoken to any one from tech support? I know some one from the NFB >> of Florida, who might be able to assist you. I can try to set up a meeting >> on skype. My skype is rj.sandefur RJ >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Sarah Alawami" >> To: "Sarah Alawami" >> Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 8:10 PM >> Subject: [nabs-l] This is ridiculous! > > >>> No this is not a news article it is a rant from me. >>> on march 8 2010 I was having issues to activate jaws so I contacted >>> freedom scientific and told them what the problem was. they failed to help >>> me and in my mind shrugged me off like I was a number. Here is the content >>> of the message. >>> Message begins here. >>> Thank you for contacting Technical Support. Due to the complex nature of >>> your problem activating the JAWSR for WindowsR screen reading software, it >>> would be best if you would contact our Technical Support Department by >>> telephone at (727) 803-8600 between the hours of 8:30 AM and 7:00 PM EST. >>> If you would, please give the technician who answers the ticket number of >>> 196568, so that he or she can read your e-mail message, and will be better >>> able to assist you. Likewise, if you have any additional questions >>> regarding this or any other issue, please don't hesitate to contact us. >>> Ok this is odd, I got an error that the server had encountered an error. >>> I'll attach the file in text format. Will this ruin the activation >>> process? >>> I tried I think twice to do this. > >>> Take care. >>> Message ends here > >>> Ok so I show someone else the error message of which I will paste the >>> contents of the file in to this email and they said that it looked like my >>> modem or router was issuing an ipv6 address. I already new that and we >>> think freedom's server are a bit confused as to what is going on on my >>> end. or sprints end actually. I'm sending this to as many people as I can >>> can including lists and so forth to see if I can get somebody's attention. >>> I have tried to work with Rick justice but our schedules seem to clash as >>> I'm at school 24/7. lol. Ok here is the content of the error message... > >>> Information >>> SentinelLM: Error[17]: Probably no servers are running on this subnet. >>> OK >>> Information >>> SentinelLM: Error[4]: License server hostname not specified correctly. Set >>> environment variable LSHOST to >>> (colon-separated) name(s) of server(s). >>> OK > >>> Client Activator >>> Error Code: 30004 >>> License server hostname not specified correctly. >>> Set environment variable LSHOST to (colon-separated) name(s) of server(s). >>> OK > >>> I hypothesis that this is not my end that's doing this as I can visit the >>> net for exams and googling and other things including skype. > >>> Sincerely, >>> Sarah k Alawami >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com > > >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com From marrie12 at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 17:52:14 2010 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 10:52:14 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] This is ridiculous! In-Reply-To: <08D0E3C69D1645368AB0E0EA3AC66BE2@radio360usa> References: <20100321020552.19195.95081@web2> <08D0E3C69D1645368AB0E0EA3AC66BE2@radio360usa> Message-ID: Oh lol! Yeh I had someone once in an email say "Oh I don't know about htat" when all it was was I had to go to view, arrange by, then the names thing and it would put the files in the right order. I sent in instructins on how to do that and they never got back to me. lol. On Mar 20, 2010, at 10:48 PM, David Dunphy wrote: > Hang in there Sara. I think telling people how to plug a computer into the wall or how to turn it on is too complex a problem for FreedomScientific lol. Hell, I called once and the guy on the phone actually had to think about his first name, no joke. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com From marrie12 at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 17:54:40 2010 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 10:54:40 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] This is ridiculous! Message-ID: No this is not a news article it is a rant from me. on march 8 2010 I was having issues to activate jaws so I contacted freedom scientific and told them what the problem was. they failed to help me and in my mind shrugged me off like I was a number. Here is the content of the message. Message begins here. Thank you for contacting Technical Support. Due to the complex nature of your problem activating the JAWSR for WindowsR screen reading software, it would be best if you would contact our Technical Support Department by telephone at (727) 803-8600 between the hours of 8:30 AM and 7:00 PM EST. If you would, please give the technician who answers the ticket number of 196568, so that he or she can read your e-mail message, and will be better able to assist you. Likewise, if you have any additional questions regarding this or any other issue, please don't hesitate to contact us. Ok this is odd, I got an error that the server had encountered an error. I'll attach the file in text format. Will this ruin the activation process? I tried I think twice to do this. Take care. Message ends here Ok so I show someone else the error message of which I will paste the contents of the file in to this email and they said that it looked like my modem or router was issuing an ipv6 address. I already new that and we think freedom's server are a bit confused as to what is going on on my end. or sprints end actually. I'm sending this to as many people as I can can including lists and so forth to see if I can get somebody's attention. I have tried to work with Rick justice but our schedules seem to clash as I'm at school 24/7. lol. Ok here is the content of the error message... Information SentinelLM: Error[17]: Probably no servers are running on this subnet. OK Information SentinelLM: Error[4]: License server hostname not specified correctly. Set environment variable LSHOST to (colon-separated) name(s) of server(s). OK Client Activator Error Code: 30004 License server hostname not specified correctly. Set environment variable LSHOST to (colon-separated) name(s) of server(s). OK I hypothesis that this is not my end that's doing this as I can visit the net for exams and googling and other things including skype. Sincerely, Sarah k Alawami From jkenn337 at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 18:02:00 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 14:02:00 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] nfbnet.org file area Message-ID: <6938AB66B4034072957420ED9F0BA03D@joshcomputer> hey guys it seems like the nfbnet.org file area is broke. I want to get a demo of outspoken for my windows98 virtual machine. also I hear there is mac-os8 floating around with outspoken installed that can run in windows xp vista or 7 doees anyone have it? Josh Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Sun Mar 21 18:23:43 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 14:23:43 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] This is ridiculous! Message-ID: <20100321182343.15615.41377@web1> Huh. Every time I've called HumanWare about some technical issue related to the brailliant, the tech support agent didn't seem to know anything about the Brailliant except that it's a HumanWare product. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > All I can say to that, Dave, is hey, that's hilarious. FS should be > knowledgeable about computer stuff and sadly, HumanWare is better. I > actually have connections to HumanWare and absolutely adore their > products, so ... > Beth > On 3/21/10, David Dunphy wrote: >> Hang in there Sara. I think telling people how to plug a computer into the >> wall or how to turn it on is too complex a problem for FreedomScientific >> lol. Hell, I called once and the guy on the phone actually had to think >> about his first name, no joke. >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 19:23:25 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 12:23:25 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] A NABS conference call sunday sandwitch! Message-ID: <409c235c1003211223j5744d3d9n2b7e0c74ab24a5c@mail.gmail.com> In the spirit of baseball season- Let's go for a dubble-header; two calls for the price of one! Please see below announcement Happy Late- week fellow federationests/scholars, In response to a very engaging and interesting list serve string (or two) on training centers; The National Association of Blind Students membership committee is pleased to present to you all a training center’s conference call. Some of the Speakers contribuiting to the discussion with their experiences will include: Karen Anderson (current student of the LouisianaCenter for the Blind and Current 1st Vice president of the National association of Blind Students), Arielle Silverman(Graduate of the Louisiana Center for the Blind and Current President of the National Association of Blind Students), Amy Phelps (Director of Blind Industries and Services of Maryland), as well as others who have an experience as a student in a successful training center environment. On this call, we will talk about what an National Federation of the Blind training center is and where they and state-ran training centers for the blind tend to differ. We also will talk about informed choice; what it means, why it’s important, and hear from individuals who have exercised their right to informed choice in order to get the training they considered best for themselves. And we, of course will discuss what questions, comments, or topics of interest anybody wants to add to the conversation. All who are interested in going to a training center of some kind, as well as those who are going or have graduated from a training center are welcomed to take part in this very informative and exciting conference call. The call will take place on Sunday March 21st at 5:30 p.m. eastern time ( an hour and a half prior to our “extra curricular activities” conference call. The call-in information is (218)339-3600 Passcode is 808277 *Please note, that this conference line will be utilized for only the training center conference call. If you are interested in joining the extra curricular activities conference call that takes place after this (you are more than welcome to take part in both calls), the number you’ll want to use is the phone number normally used for the membership conference calls (712) 775 – 7100.* Thank you for your enthusiasm and great interest; we look forward to seeing you on the call! Aimming to please, empower and inform, Your friendly nation wide Nabs Membership Committee. Greetings fellow scholars! I think you and I both know what time it is! ( time to get those mid terms back *sigh*) Actually, it?s time for the National Association of Blind students membership conference call! (presented by your not-so- local National Association of Blind Students membership committee). This call will take place on Sunday march 21st (yep, this Sunday) at 7p.m. eastern time on the nabs conference line (712.775.7100, passscode 257963). We will be talking about extra curricular a Activities, and we will have Antonio Guimaraes of the membership committee, and current student in Rode Island and Cindy Bennet; a student, and officer of the North Carolina Association of Blind Students, to share their stories and encourage you to do the same. So, to recap: Who:? The National Association of Blind Students membership committee. What?: nabs membership conference call When?: Sunday! Sunday? Yes! Sunday! March 21st. Where?: I’m glad you asked! Call712.775.7100 and don’t forget to use the passcode 257963 to gain entrance to the party! Why?: Because while class is a very important part of the learning experience; getting into the social aspects of scholastic life is a very important and healthy thing. Need we say more? ? Doubted it. We look forward to seeing you there! Warm regards, The NABS membership committee. -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From marrie12 at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 20:04:49 2010 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 13:04:49 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] This is ridiculous! In-Reply-To: <20100321182343.15615.41377@web1> References: <20100321182343.15615.41377@web1> Message-ID: <12C7A879-212D-4C58-9A68-A5742D59E51F@gmail.com> Oh lol that's sort of the situatin I'm in. On Mar 21, 2010, at 11:23 AM, Jedi wrote: > Huh. Every time I've called HumanWare about some technical issue related to the brailliant, the tech support agent didn't seem to know anything about the Brailliant except that it's a HumanWare product. > > Respectfully, > Jedi > > > Original message: >> All I can say to that, Dave, is hey, that's hilarious. FS should be >> knowledgeable about computer stuff and sadly, HumanWare is better. I >> actually have connections to HumanWare and absolutely adore their >> products, so ... >> Beth > >> On 3/21/10, David Dunphy wrote: >>> Hang in there Sara. I think telling people how to plug a computer into the >>> wall or how to turn it on is too complex a problem for FreedomScientific >>> lol. Hell, I called once and the guy on the phone actually had to think >>> about his first name, no joke. > > >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com > > >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 20:15:42 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 13:15:42 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado In-Reply-To: <0BAF7E3D7B7F420FBBB39009F7375798@hometwxakonvzn> References: <4383d01d1003201024k69bcf8d5q4fa20be10e90c3ac@mail.gmail.com> <4383d01d1003201328t2974379aia5e2dad7ded22b36@mail.gmail.com> <9960FCF3B0B14266981754C2EB1F74F5@jage> <4383d01d1003201640o531c9da0m288a44558c68913f@mail.gmail.com> <85ff10071003202127y4cdf8458p24bd67a58a03416c@mail.gmail.com> <0BAF7E3D7B7F420FBBB39009F7375798@hometwxakonvzn> Message-ID: <409c235c1003211315h6a5e0979x7c2697d04708f128@mail.gmail.com> RJ and list, the call is today at 5:30 eastern, followed by extra curricular activities at 7 p.m. Thanks, Darian On 3/21/10, RJ Sandefur wrote: > Beth, You should try to attend the conference call Darin, Its next week > right? RJ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Elizabeth" > To: > Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 11:32 AM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado > > >> >> Arielle, >> >> Thanks for bringing up a good point. I have been told that I sometimes ask >> >> too many questions, so that is generally not a problem for me. Personally, >> >> I would probably start by asking a broad question, and then ask more >> specific questions based on how the person answered it . But it definitely >> >> is a good idea to have some specific questions in mind before you begin >> the conversation. >> >> As someone who made a decision to attend a training center for all the >> wrong reasons, I cannot emphasize enough how important it is to really >> take the time to get all the information you can to make the decision that >> >> is right for you. It can really make a difference in what you end up >> getting out of your experience. Even though I had a bad experience at one >> of the training centers, I do my best not to discourage anyone for >> considering it as an option for their own training. It was not the right >> fit for me, but it was the perfect fit for a friend of mine. And even >> though we may have different opinions about the training center, we still >> have respect for each other, and are still good friends despite our >> differences. >> >> Anyway, I hope that at least some of what I have said helps in the >> decision making process for anyone who is considering any one of the NFB >> training centers. >> >> Elizabeth >> >> >>> Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 23:27:57 -0500 >>> From: nabs.president at gmail.com >>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >>> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> When talking to current or former students at the different centers, >>> it might be better to ask more objective questions. So rather than >>> asking how they felt about the program, ask for a run-down of the >>> typical daily schedule, what a typical lesson is like in each of the >>> classes, and what kinds of activities students do outside of training >>> hours. Then you can judge the evidence on your own and see how the >>> information you get about the content of the program matches your >>> needs and expectations. Otherwise, you might be led in a particular >>> direction based on one or two people's idiosyncratic reactions to the >>> center. >>> >>> Arielle >>> >>> On 3/20/10, Elizabeth wrote: >>> > >>> > Well, with all do respect, I would not make a decision based solely >>> > upon >>> > hearing about one bad experience any more than I would on the cost of >>> > the >>> > airline ticket. Just because someone else had a bad experience does not >>> > necessarily mean that you will experience the same. Everyone goes to a >>> > training center at different stages of accepting their blindness and >>> > possibly their identity as simply just another person in this world who >>> > happens to be blind. So I think maturity can also play a role in how >>> > much >>> > you get out of a training center as well. >>> > >>> > And as far as learning specific skills like learning how to ride a >>> > subway, I >>> > do not think it really matters which center you choose because I think >>> > all >>> > three would prepare you to perform this skill. I know of several >>> > graduates >>> > from the Louisiana Center who ride the subway just fine. The key >>> > ingredient >>> > is confidence in thinking that you can perform a skill no matter what >>> > kind >>> > of situation you may encounter along the way. >>> > >>> > Elizabeth >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> >> Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 19:40:28 -0400 >>> >> From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com >>> >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >>> >> >>> >> Yes, I have. The thing that bothers me is that one girl didn't like >>> >> Louisiana as much as the other two people I've spoken to. Then, I >>> >> haven't spoken to anybody in Colorado student wise. But I spoke with >>> >> the director, so she says it's nice over there. She even gave me a >>> >> good reason to consider it. But I am having to decide quick because I >>> >> want to leave in May, and the state agency doesn't want to paqy in >>> >> full. Now, of course, we're not sure they're willing to pay at all. >>> >> Beth >>> >> >>> >> On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: >>> >> > Honestly, you should probably consider lots of things way before >>> >> > plane >>> >> > fares. The three training centers are not exact copies of each >>> >> > other. >>> >> > Have >>> >> > you spoken with the directors or students of each center to gauge >>> >> > opinions? >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> > J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com >>> >> > A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor >>> >> > ----- Original Message ----- >>> >> > From: "Beth" >>> >> > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> >> > >>> >> > Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 4:28 PM >>> >> > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> >> Then what must I decide or what must my decision be based on? Now >>> >> >> that I know there's no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe, I've >>> >> >> got something in my favor, but what should the decision be based >>> >> >> upon? >>> >> >> Beth >>> >> >> >>> >> >> On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: >>> >> >>> Beth, >>> >> >>> I did a quick check at dates in April, and the cheapest to Denver >>> >> >>> looks >>> >> >>> to >>> >> >>> be around $211 with the cheapest tickets coming from Delta. >>> >> >>> Midwest Airlines offers a nonstop route for $259 on various dates. >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> As for Monroe, the cheapest dates in April offer a fare of $244 >>> >> >>> roundtrip, >>> >> >>> also from Delta. There is no nonstop service from Orlando to >>> >> >>> Monroe. >>> >> >>> Prices for airline tickets change wildly, but there really doesn't >>> >> >>> seem >>> >> >>> to >>> >> >>> be a lot of difference between the two, and I wouldn't base my >>> >> >>> decision >>> >> >>> on >>> >> >>> which training center to visit purely on who has the cheapest >>> >> >>> flights. >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com >>> >> >>> A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor >>> >> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >> >>> From: "Beth" >>> >> >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> >> >>> ; "NFB of Florida Listserv" >>> >> >>> Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 1:24 PM >>> >> >>> Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>>> Hi, guys. As luck would have it, I am looking at plane fares for >>> >> >>>> both >>> >> >>>> Louisiana and Colorado so that I can get a cheaper bid on a >>> >> >>>> training >>> >> >>>> center, possibly Colorado. How much is it to fly, say, from >>> >> >>>> Orlando >>> >> >>>> to Denver versus Orlando to Monroe, Louisiana? I'd like to know >>> >> >>>> also >>> >> >>>> what airlines you went with and so that I cancompare the prices. >>> >> >>>> Thanks. >>> >> >>>> Beth >>> >> >>>> >>> >> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>> >> >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>> >> >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> >> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> >> >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> >> >>>> >>> >> >>>> for >>> >> >>>> nabs-l: >>> >> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com >>> >> >>>> >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >> >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> >> >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> >> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> >> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> >> >>> for >>> >> >>> nabs-l: >>> >> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >>> >> >>> >>> >> >> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >>> >> >> nabs-l mailing list >>> >> >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> >> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> >> >> for >>> >> >> nabs-l: >>> >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com >>> >> >> >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> > _______________________________________________ >>> >> > nabs-l mailing list >>> >> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> >> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> >> > for >>> >> > nabs-l: >>> >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >>> >> > >>> >> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >>> >> nabs-l mailing list >>> >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> >> nabs-l: >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lizmohnke%40hotmail.com >>> > >>> > >>> > _________________________________________________________________ >>> > The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your >>> > inbox. >>> > http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_3 >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > nabs-l mailing list >>> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> > nabs-l: >>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com >>> > >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Arielle Silverman >>> President, National Association of Blind Students >>> Phone: 602-502-2255 >>> Email: >>> nabs.president at gmail.com >>> Website: >>> www.nabslink.org >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lizmohnke%40hotmail.com >> >> _________________________________________________________________ >> The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your inbox. >> http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_3 >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 20:28:30 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 13:28:30 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? Message-ID: <409c235c1003211328g71fc37c9n1dc20f289a8b9945@mail.gmail.com> Hi list, I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity as a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did people interact with you? Thoughts? Best, Darian -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From kc2992a at student.american.edu Sun Mar 21 20:36:01 2010 From: kc2992a at student.american.edu (Katy Carroll) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 16:36:01 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] advice Message-ID: <2fdbeb321003211336w496f9c34gdac167baca20607d@mail.gmail.com> Hi List! I have run numerous times into the same dilemma and I am convinced this dilemma will become more and more of a problem as I move on in my career, unless I do something about it, which is why i am posing this problem to you: Recently I went to a meeting of a professional organization here in DC. Not surprisingly, each of the attendees were given name tags with one's name and either place of work or study to wear during the event, to help initiate networking. I am partially blind, and don't feel the need to carry a cane with me. However, I can't see other people;s name tags, and can't comment or respond to what is written on them. i would like to be able to ask peopel who they are and where they work without looking liek I can't read. has anyone perfected a introduction by which they can do this? I would appreciate any thoughts. Sincerely, -- Kathryn CARROLL American University 631 521 3018 From marrie12 at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 21:18:49 2010 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 14:18:49 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? In-Reply-To: <409c235c1003211328g71fc37c9n1dc20f289a8b9945@mail.gmail.com> References: <409c235c1003211328g71fc37c9n1dc20f289a8b9945@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <37F973E5-D64B-4A34-9F28-BDA371D4E9F8@gmail.com> I don't socialise but that has nothing to do with my blindness. I choose not to socialise with anyone because I'm there to get my degree and nothing else. I know that sounds cruel but those are my thoughts. Take care. On Mar 21, 2010, at 1:28 PM, Darian Smith wrote: > Hi list, > > I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming > involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or > college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you > feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a > ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity as > a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did > people interact with you? > Thoughts? > Best, > Darian > -- > Darian Smith > Skype: The_Blind_Truth > Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com > The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher > recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate > individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your > help! To Get Involved go to: > www.TeachBlindStudents.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com From bunnykatie6 at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 21:53:20 2010 From: bunnykatie6 at gmail.com (Katie Wang) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 17:53:20 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] This is ridiculous! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5096b4731003211453x1368a53g53bdb48b93093156@mail.gmail.com> Hi, Sarah, Unfortunately, it does seem that your best option would be calling tech support at FS. I did contact them once regarding some strange problem with JAWS installation and they were very patient and walked me through the entire process until things worked out. I know you must have a busy schedule and calling tech support may mean that you will have to be stuck on the phone for a while, but according to their email their tech support is available for relatively long hours (till 7 PM on week days) and i think it may be worthwhile to move things around a bit on your schedule to find time and give them a call. Hope you can get your problem solved soon. Good luck! Katie On 3/21/10, Sarah Alawami wrote: > No this is not a news article it is a rant from me. > on march 8 2010 I was having issues to activate jaws so I contacted freedom > scientific and told them what the problem was. they failed to help me and in > my mind shrugged me off like I was a number. Here is the content of the > message. > Message begins here. > Thank you for contacting Technical Support. Due to the complex nature of > your problem activating the JAWSR for WindowsR screen reading software, it > would be best if you would contact our Technical Support Department by > telephone at (727) 803-8600 between the hours of 8:30 AM and 7:00 PM EST. > If you would, please give the technician who answers the ticket number of > 196568, so that he or she can read your e-mail message, and will be better > able to assist you. Likewise, if you have any additional questions > regarding this or any other issue, please don't hesitate to contact us. > Ok this is odd, I got an error that the server had encountered an error. > I'll attach the file in text format. Will this ruin the activation process? > I tried I think twice to do this. > > Take care. > Message ends here > > Ok so I show someone else the error message of which I will paste the > contents of the file in to this email and they said that it looked like my > modem or router was issuing an ipv6 address. I already new that and we think > freedom's server are a bit confused as to what is going on on my end. or > sprints end actually. I'm sending this to as many people as I can can > including lists and so forth to see if I can get somebody's attention. I > have tried to work with Rick justice but our schedules seem to clash as I'm > at school 24/7. lol. Ok here is the content of the error message... > > Information > SentinelLM: Error[17]: Probably no servers are running on this subnet. > OK > Information > SentinelLM: Error[4]: License server hostname not specified correctly. Set > environment variable LSHOST to > (colon-separated) name(s) of server(s). > OK > > Client Activator > Error Code: 30004 > License server hostname not specified correctly. > Set environment variable LSHOST to (colon-separated) name(s) of server(s). > OK > > I hypothesis that this is not my end that's doing this as I can visit the > net for exams and googling and other things including skype. > > Sincerely, > Sarah k Alawami > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmail.com > From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Sun Mar 21 22:27:34 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 18:27:34 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? Message-ID: <20100321222734.10377.87216@web3> Frankly, my time is taken up with school, homework, and the nFB. I did join the school's step team. Step is a type of dance much like stomp minus any instruments. I found the club difficult for a few reasons. First, the uniform necessary for the club was expensive and I didn't have the money; the other dancers on the team (most notably the Captain) didn't understand this and thought that my unwillingness to buy the uniform was a personal choice rather than a choice inspired by the reality of my situation. Next, the dancers tended to use a visual form of communication that I was not privy to, and no one really tried to let me in even when I asked for as much information as I could get. To add to that, the Captain said that blindness was not an issue and refused my talking with the team explicitly about blindness. Then, the issue came up later on in the middle of dance practice where fellow team members wanted to know how much I could see putting me in a very uncomfortable position. It was also clear that as an individual person (blindness aside), I was just not someone who fit into the general atmosphere. to be honest, I've made occasional inquiries at other clubs on campus such as the free thinkers society (mostly a group of atheists who spend their time criticizing theists without understanding that their view is no more valid) and the disability rights club (a pan-disability movement with its own agenda that isn't in keeping with my values as a blind person and a member of the NFB). I just figured that campus clubs weren't the best route for me. That doesn't mean that I stopped socializing though, and I don't think that clubs have to be the only way to socialize for blind students just to be normal. I joined off-campus associations such as the local Democrats. I also started weightlifting at an all-women's gym. both of these involvements are less formal than a campus club. The Dems are formal, but I don't get to see them as often as I'd like. My real avenue for socializing at school is simply to engage in interpersonal relationships as I discover them. My blindness as an identity has informed these relationships somewhat because I don't make it a habbit of befriending those who spend their time with me asking question after question about blindness. I instead choose friends who just get it or at least get it enough to know that blindness should not be the central focus of their interest in me. If they have questions, then they ask, but not in that "bombs away" style that so many people favor. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Hi list, > I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming > involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or > college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you > feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a > ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity as > a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did > people interact with you? > Thoughts? > Best, > Darian > -- > Darian Smith > Skype: The_Blind_Truth > Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com > The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher > recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate > individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your > help! To Get Involved go to: > www.TeachBlindStudents.org > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From mrsmigs at migliorelli.org Sun Mar 21 23:11:42 2010 From: mrsmigs at migliorelli.org (Maryann Migliorelli) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 17:11:42 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Aerobic Exercise Tape Message-ID: <000f01cac94b$dfa604d0$9ef20e70$@org> Hi Megan, Click the link below to find out information about a good workout. This is a routine I have used for quite a while. It's still on cassette tape, but I'm sure it could be transferred to cd or mp3 files for your friend. You can write me off list if you have any questions at mrsmigs at migliorelli.org Maryann Migliorelli http://www.independentliving.com/prodinfo.asp?number=TEX1 From aphelps at bism.org Sun Mar 21 23:12:18 2010 From: aphelps at bism.org (aphelps at bism.org) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 23:12:18 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] Justification letter to attend training center In-Reply-To: <409c235c1003211315h6a5e0979x7c2697d04708f128@mail.gmail.com> References: <4383d01d1003201024k69bcf8d5q4fa20be10e90c3ac@mail.gmail.com><4383d01d1003201328t2974379aia5e2dad7ded22b36@mail.gmail.com><9960FCF3B0B14266981754C2EB1F74F5@jage><4383d01d1003201640o531c9da0m288a44558c68913f@mail.gmail.com><85ff10071003202127y4cdf8458p24bd67a58a03416c@mail.gmail.com><0BAF7E3D7B7F420FBBB39009F7375798@hometwxakonvzn><409c235c1003211315h6a5e0979x7c2697d04708f128@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1092221376-1269213136-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-106574476-@bda473.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> If you would like a copy of the letter, please email me at aphelps at bism.org Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: Darian Smith Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 13:15:42 To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado RJ and list, the call is today at 5:30 eastern, followed by extra curricular activities at 7 p.m. Thanks, Darian On 3/21/10, RJ Sandefur wrote: > Beth, You should try to attend the conference call Darin, Its next week > right? RJ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Elizabeth" > To: > Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 11:32 AM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado > > >> >> Arielle, >> >> Thanks for bringing up a good point. I have been told that I sometimes ask >> >> too many questions, so that is generally not a problem for me. Personally, >> >> I would probably start by asking a broad question, and then ask more >> specific questions based on how the person answered it . But it definitely >> >> is a good idea to have some specific questions in mind before you begin >> the conversation. >> >> As someone who made a decision to attend a training center for all the >> wrong reasons, I cannot emphasize enough how important it is to really >> take the time to get all the information you can to make the decision that >> >> is right for you. It can really make a difference in what you end up >> getting out of your experience. Even though I had a bad experience at one >> of the training centers, I do my best not to discourage anyone for >> considering it as an option for their own training. It was not the right >> fit for me, but it was the perfect fit for a friend of mine. And even >> though we may have different opinions about the training center, we still >> have respect for each other, and are still good friends despite our >> differences. >> >> Anyway, I hope that at least some of what I have said helps in the >> decision making process for anyone who is considering any one of the NFB >> training centers. >> >> Elizabeth >> >> >>> Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 23:27:57 -0500 >>> From: nabs.president at gmail.com >>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >>> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> When talking to current or former students at the different centers, >>> it might be better to ask more objective questions. So rather than >>> asking how they felt about the program, ask for a run-down of the >>> typical daily schedule, what a typical lesson is like in each of the >>> classes, and what kinds of activities students do outside of training >>> hours. Then you can judge the evidence on your own and see how the >>> information you get about the content of the program matches your >>> needs and expectations. Otherwise, you might be led in a particular >>> direction based on one or two people's idiosyncratic reactions to the >>> center. >>> >>> Arielle >>> >>> On 3/20/10, Elizabeth wrote: >>> > >>> > Well, with all do respect, I would not make a decision based solely >>> > upon >>> > hearing about one bad experience any more than I would on the cost of >>> > the >>> > airline ticket. Just because someone else had a bad experience does not >>> > necessarily mean that you will experience the same. Everyone goes to a >>> > training center at different stages of accepting their blindness and >>> > possibly their identity as simply just another person in this world who >>> > happens to be blind. So I think maturity can also play a role in how >>> > much >>> > you get out of a training center as well. >>> > >>> > And as far as learning specific skills like learning how to ride a >>> > subway, I >>> > do not think it really matters which center you choose because I think >>> > all >>> > three would prepare you to perform this skill. I know of several >>> > graduates >>> > from the Louisiana Center who ride the subway just fine. The key >>> > ingredient >>> > is confidence in thinking that you can perform a skill no matter what >>> > kind >>> > of situation you may encounter along the way. >>> > >>> > Elizabeth >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> >> Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 19:40:28 -0400 >>> >> From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com >>> >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >>> >> >>> >> Yes, I have. The thing that bothers me is that one girl didn't like >>> >> Louisiana as much as the other two people I've spoken to. Then, I >>> >> haven't spoken to anybody in Colorado student wise. But I spoke with >>> >> the director, so she says it's nice over there. She even gave me a >>> >> good reason to consider it. But I am having to decide quick because I >>> >> want to leave in May, and the state agency doesn't want to paqy in >>> >> full. Now, of course, we're not sure they're willing to pay at all. >>> >> Beth >>> >> >>> >> On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: >>> >> > Honestly, you should probably consider lots of things way before >>> >> > plane >>> >> > fares. The three training centers are not exact copies of each >>> >> > other. >>> >> > Have >>> >> > you spoken with the directors or students of each center to gauge >>> >> > opinions? >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> > J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com >>> >> > A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor >>> >> > ----- Original Message ----- >>> >> > From: "Beth" >>> >> > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> >> > >>> >> > Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 4:28 PM >>> >> > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> >> Then what must I decide or what must my decision be based on? Now >>> >> >> that I know there's no nonstop service from Orlando to Monroe, I've >>> >> >> got something in my favor, but what should the decision be based >>> >> >> upon? >>> >> >> Beth >>> >> >> >>> >> >> On 3/20/10, J.J. Meddaugh wrote: >>> >> >>> Beth, >>> >> >>> I did a quick check at dates in April, and the cheapest to Denver >>> >> >>> looks >>> >> >>> to >>> >> >>> be around $211 with the cheapest tickets coming from Delta. >>> >> >>> Midwest Airlines offers a nonstop route for $259 on various dates. >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> As for Monroe, the cheapest dates in April offer a fare of $244 >>> >> >>> roundtrip, >>> >> >>> also from Delta. There is no nonstop service from Orlando to >>> >> >>> Monroe. >>> >> >>> Prices for airline tickets change wildly, but there really doesn't >>> >> >>> seem >>> >> >>> to >>> >> >>> be a lot of difference between the two, and I wouldn't base my >>> >> >>> decision >>> >> >>> on >>> >> >>> which training center to visit purely on who has the cheapest >>> >> >>> flights. >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com >>> >> >>> A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor >>> >> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >> >>> From: "Beth" >>> >> >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> >> >>> ; "NFB of Florida Listserv" >>> >> >>> Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 1:24 PM >>> >> >>> Subject: [nabs-l] plane fares for Louisiana and Colorado >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>>> Hi, guys. As luck would have it, I am looking at plane fares for >>> >> >>>> both >>> >> >>>> Louisiana and Colorado so that I can get a cheaper bid on a >>> >> >>>> training >>> >> >>>> center, possibly Colorado. How much is it to fly, say, from >>> >> >>>> Orlando >>> >> >>>> to Denver versus Orlando to Monroe, Louisiana? I'd like to know >>> >> >>>> also >>> >> >>>> what airlines you went with and so that I cancompare the prices. >>> >> >>>> Thanks. >>> >> >>>> Beth >>> >> >>>> >>> >> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>> >> >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>> >> >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> >> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> >> >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> >> >>>> >>> >> >>>> for >>> >> >>>> nabs-l: >>> >> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com >>> >> >>>> >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >> >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> >> >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> >> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> >> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> >> >>> for >>> >> >>> nabs-l: >>> >> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >>> >> >>> >>> >> >> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >>> >> >> nabs-l mailing list >>> >> >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> >> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> >> >> for >>> >> >> nabs-l: >>> >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jj%40bestmidi.com >>> >> >> >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> > _______________________________________________ >>> >> > nabs-l mailing list >>> >> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> >> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> >> > for >>> >> > nabs-l: >>> >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com >>> >> > >>> >> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >>> >> nabs-l mailing list >>> >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> >> nabs-l: >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lizmohnke%40hotmail.com >>> > >>> > >>> > _________________________________________________________________ >>> > The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your >>> > inbox. >>> > http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_3 >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > nabs-l mailing list >>> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> > nabs-l: >>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com >>> > >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Arielle Silverman >>> President, National Association of Blind Students >>> Phone: 602-502-2255 >>> Email: >>> nabs.president at gmail.com >>> Website: >>> www.nabslink.org >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lizmohnke%40hotmail.com >> >> _________________________________________________________________ >> The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your inbox. >> http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_3 >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/aphelps%40bism.org From hope.paulos at maine.edu Sun Mar 21 22:51:37 2010 From: hope.paulos at maine.edu (Hope Paulos) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 18:51:37 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] advice References: <2fdbeb321003211336w496f9c34gdac167baca20607d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: You might want to carry an id cane to let people know that you have a visual impairment. That way they're more likely to be willing to provide you with more info about themselves so that you can have the same benefits as all of the other attendees. Just my thoughts. Hope and Beignet ----- Original Message ----- From: "Katy Carroll" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 4:36 PM Subject: [nabs-l] advice > Hi List! > > I have run numerous times into the same dilemma and I am convinced this > dilemma will become more and more of a problem as I move on in my career, > unless I do something about it, which is why i am posing this problem to > you: > > Recently I went to a meeting of a professional organization here in DC. > Not > surprisingly, each of the attendees were given name tags with one's name > and > either place of work or study to wear during the event, to help initiate > networking. I am partially blind, and don't feel the need to carry a cane > with me. However, I can't see other people;s name tags, and can't comment > or > respond to what is written on them. i would like to be able to ask peopel > who they are and where they work without looking liek I can't read. has > anyone perfected a introduction by which they can do this? > > I would appreciate any thoughts. > > Sincerely, > -- > Kathryn CARROLL > American University > 631 521 3018 > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Sun Mar 21 23:58:23 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 19:58:23 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Workout DVDS? Message-ID: <20100321235823.14357.54201@web1> I would recommend the 30 day shtred series. There's much more than just cardio, but the descriptions are decent. For those things that aren't described well, it would not be a bad idea to have a reader describe them to her before she actually uses the video. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > I have a friend looking for a workout DVD that gives enough description > so she can use it for cardio when she travels. If anyone has > suggestions, that'd be great. > Thanks in advance, > Meghan > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From nabs.president at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 00:37:39 2010 From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 19:37:39 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Thanks Everyone! Message-ID: <85ff10071003211737o32fb16dej8df4b5e09ef92bbb@mail.gmail.com> Hi all, I just wanted to thank everyone who participated in both of our conference calls this evening. I don't know the exact counts, but I know we had at least fifteen people on our training centers call, and several on our extracurricular activities call as well. I was doing other things but did hang out in the background on both calls and I observed some interesting, informative and lively discussions. I am thrilled to see so many of our members participating, and so many students making themselves available to answer questions and offer resources and advice. Since we don't meet in person very often as a national entity, the conference calls and list discussions are really valuable for us to feel connected as an organization, and for our individual members to obtain mentorship and information. Keep up the great work! All the best, Arielle -- Arielle Silverman President, National Association of Blind Students Phone: 602-502-2255 Email: nabs.president at gmail.com Website: www.nabslink.org From joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 00:58:37 2010 From: joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com (RJ Sandefur) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 20:58:37 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] CCB References: <4383d01d1003210044h1267089chd30adbc34bc25663@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <89AC8B19403E4CEB86340765ED408C24@hometwxakonvzn> Beth, I think that's what you should do. RJ ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Andrews" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 12:54 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] CCB > We have a list for CCB Alumni. To subscribe go to: > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/ccb-alumni_nfbnet.org > > or send e-mail to ccb-alumni-request at nfbnet.org and put the word subscribe > in the subject line. > > Dave > > At 02:44 AM 3/21/2010, you wrote: >>Hi. It's Beth. This message goes out to any CCB students and alumni. >> I'd like to ask a few questions. If you can answer them, please >>e-mail me off list. First question: what is a day at CCB like? >>Secondly, what is a typical lesson like? Thirdly, what stuff do you >>do outside normal training hours? I think it would be appropriate to >>pose these questions to this list so that I can get some information >>about where I'd like to go. Forget about plane fares and costs, since >>those details are menial compared to the training. >>Beth >> >>_______________________________________________ >>nabs-l mailing list >>nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>nabs-l: >>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dandrews%40visi.com >> >> >>__________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus >>signature database 4962 (20100321) __________ >> >>The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. >> >>http://www.eset.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com From blackbyrdfly at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 00:11:53 2010 From: blackbyrdfly at gmail.com (Jamie Principato) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 20:11:53 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? In-Reply-To: <409c235c1003211328g71fc37c9n1dc20f289a8b9945@mail.gmail.com> References: <409c235c1003211328g71fc37c9n1dc20f289a8b9945@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <63af025c1003211711q157b9dfdl390a29051a9da982@mail.gmail.com> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get involved in as much as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz Band, and a Youth Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate and public speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I couldn't wait for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups and activities to choose from. When I got to high school, I encountered a lot of...problems...with the school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went to this high school because we were told it offered the most for visually impaired students). I could go on all day with the details here, but I'll spare you that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students at this school tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, avoiding activities and student events. I learned shortly after joining Model UN and Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and planning to go to a pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the fact t I joined and attended these clubs without telling them first, and that if I was going to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a permission note (no other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a teacher to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I attend these activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally unless I sat with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman stands with my class. My mother and I told them that all of this was unnecessary, and we complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other issues, we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home school support group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I took advantage of my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular activities in my community, even sports (something that never would have flown at that school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on campus and in the city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing club, a volunteer organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also try to get the most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, and make use of campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been having is that transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by house recently changed its schedule and now stops running early in the evening. The only way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or get home from a club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you need to get out a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if money is tight one month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside of attending class, including attending free activities or events. I guess that's just one price of living off campus though. On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith wrote: > Hi list, > > I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming > involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or > college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you > feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a > ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity as > a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did > people interact with you? > Thoughts? > Best, > Darian > -- > Darian Smith > Skype: The_Blind_Truth > Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com > The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher > recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate > individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your > help! To Get Involved go to: > www.TeachBlindStudents.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com > From joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 02:44:02 2010 From: joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com (RJ Sandefur) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 22:44:02 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] advice References: <2fdbeb321003211336w496f9c34gdac167baca20607d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hope, Do they make such canes? Or are you joking? RJ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Hope Paulos" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 6:51 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] advice > You might want to carry an id cane to let people know that you have a > visual impairment. That way they're more likely to be willing to provide > you with more info about themselves so that you can have the same benefits > as all of the other attendees. > Just my thoughts. > Hope and Beignet > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Katy Carroll" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 4:36 PM > Subject: [nabs-l] advice > > >> Hi List! >> >> I have run numerous times into the same dilemma and I am convinced this >> dilemma will become more and more of a problem as I move on in my career, >> unless I do something about it, which is why i am posing this problem to >> you: >> >> Recently I went to a meeting of a professional organization here in DC. >> Not >> surprisingly, each of the attendees were given name tags with one's name >> and >> either place of work or study to wear during the event, to help initiate >> networking. I am partially blind, and don't feel the need to carry a cane >> with me. However, I can't see other people;s name tags, and can't comment >> or >> respond to what is written on them. i would like to be able to ask peopel >> who they are and where they work without looking liek I can't read. has >> anyone perfected a introduction by which they can do this? >> >> I would appreciate any thoughts. >> >> Sincerely, >> -- >> Kathryn CARROLL >> American University >> 631 521 3018 >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Mon Mar 22 03:33:53 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 23:33:53 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] advice Message-ID: <20100322033353.28690.99879@web2> forgive my candor as I mean what I'm about to say with all due respect. Most blind and visually impaired people who don't carry canes are attempting to pass as sighted. However, most also find themselves with similar problems to your own and wonder how they can maintain their appearance of being mostly sighted and yet deal with the fact that they are not. The reality of your situation is that, unless you're willing to say you're illiterate or learning disabled, there isn't any way for you to stay in the closet as it were and still get the information you need. As I see it, you have two choices: you can verbally identify yourself as a blind or visually impaired person and ask them to identify themselves based on the fact that you can't read their tag, or non-verbally identify your need by carrying a cane or wearing a tag that says "blind" or "visually impaired" on it. I assume you wish to conduct yourself with dignity, so I highly suggest you consider carrying a cane. I don't blame you if carrying a cane brings fear that people will treat you differently. Unfortunately, they will. However, your own comfort with your vision impairment will eventually rub off on people to the point where they will treat you as a colleague rather than some interesting display. This process is far easier than wondering what the best way of meeting your needs without coming out is. As I said, please forgive my frankness; I have been in this situation myself and can honestly find no better way to assist you than to be completely straightforward with you. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Hi List! > I have run numerous times into the same dilemma and I am convinced this > dilemma will become more and more of a problem as I move on in my career, > unless I do something about it, which is why i am posing this problem to > you: > Recently I went to a meeting of a professional organization here in DC. Not > surprisingly, each of the attendees were given name tags with one's name and > either place of work or study to wear during the event, to help initiate > networking. I am partially blind, and don't feel the need to carry a cane > with me. However, I can't see other people;s name tags, and can't comment or > respond to what is written on them. i would like to be able to ask peopel > who they are and where they work without looking liek I can't read. has > anyone perfected a introduction by which they can do this? > I would appreciate any thoughts. > Sincerely, > -- > Kathryn CARROLL > American University > 631 521 3018 > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From nabs.president at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 03:02:45 2010 From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 22:02:45 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? In-Reply-To: <63af025c1003211711q157b9dfdl390a29051a9da982@mail.gmail.com> References: <409c235c1003211328g71fc37c9n1dc20f289a8b9945@mail.gmail.com> <63af025c1003211711q157b9dfdl390a29051a9da982@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <85ff10071003212002q3a8ccb98od340966f988ce3fb@mail.gmail.com> Hi Jamie and all, Jamie, I'm so sorry that you had to deal with such ridiculous shenanigans from your school's "vision department". I think their requiring a teacher to chaperone you during a school dance and not letting you sit with your class at pep rallies was particularly egregious and discriminatory. I'm glad you were able to bounce back and put yourself out there to join clubs again in college. I think this also illustrates the sad truth that often the schools with "the most for the visually impaired" are really offering "the most institutionalized, custodial, superfluous services" for the visually impaired. We see a similar phenomenon in colleges and universities who have such an active and involved DSS office that students are, ironically, facing more discrimination and hardship through over-protection and bureaucracy than if they had no DSS office at all. True enough, in my own experience and that of many other stories I've heard, sometimes the best "accommodation" is no accommodation at all. Of course there are certain situations when we do need accommodations--print accessibility, for instance--but in situations where our own alternative techniques are enough to let us do something right along with our sighted counterparts, not getting extra accommodations is incredibly liberating. Arielle On 3/21/10, Jamie Principato wrote: > In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get involved in as much > as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz Band, and a Youth > Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate and public > speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I couldn't wait > for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups and activities to > choose from. > > When I got to high school, I encountered a lot of...problems...with the > school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went to this high > school because we were told it offered the most for visually impaired > students). I could go on all day with the details here, but I'll spare you > that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students at this school > tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, avoiding > activities and student events. I learned shortly after joining Model UN and > Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and planning to go to a > pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the fact t I joined > and attended these clubs without telling them first, and that if I was going > to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a permission note (no > other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a teacher > to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I attend these > activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally unless I sat > with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman stands with my > class. My mother and I told them that all of this was unnecessary, and we > complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other issues, > we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. > > We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home school support > group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I took advantage of > my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular activities in my > community, even sports (something that never would have flown at that > school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on campus and in the > city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing club, a volunteer > organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also try to get the > most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, and make use of > campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been having is that > transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by house recently > changed its schedule and now stops running early in the evening. The only > way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or get home from a > club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you need to get out > a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if money is tight one > month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside of attending > class, including attending free activities or events. I guess that's just > one price of living off campus though. > > On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith wrote: > >> Hi list, >> >> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you >> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity as >> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >> people interact with you? >> Thoughts? >> Best, >> Darian >> -- >> Darian Smith >> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >> help! To Get Involved go to: >> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com >> > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com > -- Arielle Silverman President, National Association of Blind Students Phone: 602-502-2255 Email: nabs.president at gmail.com Website: www.nabslink.org From joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 04:50:09 2010 From: joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com (RJ Sandefur) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 00:50:09 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? References: <409c235c1003211328g71fc37c9n1dc20f289a8b9945@mail.gmail.com> <37F973E5-D64B-4A34-9F28-BDA371D4E9F8@gmail.com> Message-ID: <523374E9A35646DAB0C4BC23E315E11B@hometwxakonvzn> I felt the same way as Sarah does! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sarah Alawami" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 5:18 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >I don't socialise but that has nothing to do with my blindness. I choose >not to socialise with anyone because I'm there to get my degree and nothing >else. I know that sounds cruel but those are my thoughts. > > Take care. > On Mar 21, 2010, at 1:28 PM, Darian Smith wrote: > >> Hi list, >> >> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you >> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity as >> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >> people interact with you? >> Thoughts? >> Best, >> Darian >> -- >> Darian Smith >> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >> help! To Get Involved go to: >> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com From Lavar.phillips at hotmail.com Mon Mar 22 07:01:17 2010 From: Lavar.phillips at hotmail.com (Lavar.phillips at hotmail.com) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 03:01:17 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] advice In-Reply-To: <20100322033353.28690.99879@web2> References: <20100322033353.28690.99879@web2> Message-ID: Kathryn This will be a big issue for you if you do not speak up. I have very good sight in my left eye, but not enough to see 20/20. when I cant see something I ask people I don't care what they think because if you don't speak up no one will know and you will not get the full benefit of the meeting. Jedi I disagree with your statement that people who are blind or visually impaired who do not carry a cane are trying to sighted. I think if they did not need it in their life and could get around without hurting themselves then what is the sense of a cane. I do think that a person should know their limits and ask for help. So Kathryn ask for help at the meetings even if that means recording peoples names and numbers and when they ask why you are doing it say cause I am visually impaired. -------------------------------------------------- From: "Jedi" Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 11:33 PM To: Subject: Re: [nabs-l] advice > forgive my candor as I mean what I'm about to say with all due respect. > Most blind and visually impaired people who don't carry canes are > attempting to pass as sighted. However, most also find themselves with > similar problems to your own and wonder how they can maintain their > appearance of being mostly sighted and yet deal with the fact that they > are not. The reality of your situation is that, unless you're willing to > say you're illiterate or learning disabled, there isn't any way for you to > stay in the closet as it were and still get the information you need. As I > see it, you have two choices: you can verbally identify yourself as a > blind or visually impaired person and ask them to identify themselves > based on the fact that you can't read their tag, or non-verbally identify > your need by carrying a cane or wearing a tag that says "blind" or > "visually impaired" on it. I assume you wish to conduct yourself with > dignity, so I highly suggest you consider carrying a cane. I don't blame > you if carrying a cane brings fear that people will treat you differently. > Unfortunately, they will. However, your own comfort with your vision > impairment will eventually rub off on people to the point where they will > treat you as a colleague rather than some interesting display. This > process is far easier than wondering what the best way of meeting your > needs without coming out is. As I said, please forgive my frankness; I > have been in this situation myself and can honestly find no better way to > assist you than to be completely straightforward with you. > > Respectfully, > Jedi > > Original message: >> Hi List! > >> I have run numerous times into the same dilemma and I am convinced this >> dilemma will become more and more of a problem as I move on in my career, >> unless I do something about it, which is why i am posing this problem to >> you: > >> Recently I went to a meeting of a professional organization here in DC. >> Not >> surprisingly, each of the attendees were given name tags with one's name >> and >> either place of work or study to wear during the event, to help initiate >> networking. I am partially blind, and don't feel the need to carry a cane >> with me. However, I can't see other people;s name tags, and can't comment >> or >> respond to what is written on them. i would like to be able to ask peopel >> who they are and where they work without looking liek I can't read. has >> anyone perfected a introduction by which they can do this? > >> I would appreciate any thoughts. > >> Sincerely, >> -- >> Kathryn CARROLL >> American University >> 631 521 3018 >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit > www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lavar.phillips%40hotmail.com > From sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca Mon Mar 22 10:43:29 2010 From: sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca (Sarah Jevnikar) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 06:43:29 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? In-Reply-To: <523374E9A35646DAB0C4BC23E315E11B@hometwxakonvzn> References: <409c235c1003211328g71fc37c9n1dc20f289a8b9945@mail.gmail.com> <37F973E5-D64B-4A34-9F28-BDA371D4E9F8@gmail.com> <523374E9A35646DAB0C4BC23E315E11B@hometwxakonvzn> Message-ID: <000001cac9ac$83ceb380$8b6c1a80$@jevnikar@utoronto.ca> I disagree with RJ and Sarah. Obviously you're there to get a degree but there is so much more to education than that. Learning from lectures and texts is such a small portion of what you will learn in life it can't hurt to expose yourself to a wide range of people and interests while so many opportunities are available to you. Maybe you won't like what you learn from others or you won't make the friends you hoped but putting yourself out there can only benefit you In the long run. Respectfully, Sarah Jevnikar -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of RJ Sandefur Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:50 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? I felt the same way as Sarah does! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sarah Alawami" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 5:18 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >I don't socialise but that has nothing to do with my blindness. I choose >not to socialise with anyone because I'm there to get my degree and nothing >else. I know that sounds cruel but those are my thoughts. > > Take care. > On Mar 21, 2010, at 1:28 PM, Darian Smith wrote: > >> Hi list, >> >> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you >> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity as >> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >> people interact with you? >> Thoughts? >> Best, >> Darian >> -- >> Darian Smith >> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >> help! To Get Involved go to: >> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% 40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto ronto.ca From kramc11 at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 13:23:14 2010 From: kramc11 at gmail.com (Mark J. Cadigan) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 09:23:14 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? In-Reply-To: <63af025c1003211711q157b9dfdl390a29051a9da982@mail.gmail.com> References: <409c235c1003211328g71fc37c9n1dc20f289a8b9945@mail.gmail.com> <63af025c1003211711q157b9dfdl390a29051a9da982@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <87C4399F41414C96930F485BAD0C02FC@SonyPC> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of clubs or other school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew for a play, but I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything other than professional questions about things of a technical nature. I did my job well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that if they talked to me they would offend me or something like that. Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved in the boy scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy scouts and life teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or technical in nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't know if this is blindness related, or what. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jamie Principato" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get involved in as > much > as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz Band, and a > Youth > Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate and public > speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I couldn't wait > for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups and activities > to > choose from. > > When I got to high school, I encountered a lot of...problems...with the > school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went to this high > school because we were told it offered the most for visually impaired > students). I could go on all day with the details here, but I'll spare you > that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students at this school > tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, > avoiding > activities and student events. I learned shortly after joining Model UN > and > Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and planning to go to > a > pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the fact t I joined > and attended these clubs without telling them first, and that if I was > going > to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a permission note (no > other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a > teacher > to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I attend these > activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally unless I sat > with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman stands with my > class. My mother and I told them that all of this was unnecessary, and we > complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other > issues, > we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. > > We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home school support > group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I took advantage > of > my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular activities in > my > community, even sports (something that never would have flown at that > school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on campus and in > the > city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing club, a volunteer > organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also try to get the > most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, and make use of > campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been having is that > transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by house recently > changed its schedule and now stops running early in the evening. The only > way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or get home from > a > club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you need to get > out > a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if money is tight > one > month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside of attending > class, including attending free activities or events. I guess that's just > one price of living off campus though. > > On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith wrote: > >> Hi list, >> >> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you >> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity as >> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >> people interact with you? >> Thoughts? >> Best, >> Darian >> -- >> Darian Smith >> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >> help! To Get Involved go to: >> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com >> > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11%40gmail.com From hope.paulos at maine.edu Mon Mar 22 15:47:30 2010 From: hope.paulos at maine.edu (Hope Paulos) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 11:47:30 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] advice References: <2fdbeb321003211336w496f9c34gdac167baca20607d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <67A6205E30FF471D9E143596408786AE@Hope> They make such canes. I don'tknow where you can get them though. Hope and Beignet ----- Original Message ----- From: "RJ Sandefur" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 10:44 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] advice > Hope, Do they make such canes? Or are you joking? RJ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Hope Paulos" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 6:51 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] advice > > >> You might want to carry an id cane to let people know that you have a >> visual impairment. That way they're more likely to be willing to provide >> you with more info about themselves so that you can have the same >> benefits as all of the other attendees. >> Just my thoughts. >> Hope and Beignet >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Katy Carroll" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 4:36 PM >> Subject: [nabs-l] advice >> >> >>> Hi List! >>> >>> I have run numerous times into the same dilemma and I am convinced this >>> dilemma will become more and more of a problem as I move on in my >>> career, >>> unless I do something about it, which is why i am posing this problem to >>> you: >>> >>> Recently I went to a meeting of a professional organization here in DC. >>> Not >>> surprisingly, each of the attendees were given name tags with one's name >>> and >>> either place of work or study to wear during the event, to help initiate >>> networking. I am partially blind, and don't feel the need to carry a >>> cane >>> with me. However, I can't see other people;s name tags, and can't >>> comment or >>> respond to what is written on them. i would like to be able to ask >>> peopel >>> who they are and where they work without looking liek I can't read. has >>> anyone perfected a introduction by which they can do this? >>> >>> I would appreciate any thoughts. >>> >>> Sincerely, >>> -- >>> Kathryn CARROLL >>> American University >>> 631 521 3018 >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu From brileyp at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 20:42:28 2010 From: brileyp at gmail.com (Briley Pollard) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 15:42:28 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] advice In-Reply-To: <20100322033353.28690.99879@web2> References: <20100322033353.28690.99879@web2> Message-ID: I echo Jedi's sentaments on this. It is a harsh reality, but it is either you carry a cane, or risk not acquiring information you need. In the end though, accepting this and embracing it will only be liberating on many levels. It is difficult though, and I don't think anyone is saying it won't be. Best, Briley On Mar 21, 2010, at 10:33 PM, Jedi wrote: > forgive my candor as I mean what I'm about to say with all due respect. Most blind and visually impaired people who don't carry canes are attempting to pass as sighted. However, most also find themselves with similar problems to your own and wonder how they can maintain their appearance of being mostly sighted and yet deal with the fact that they are not. The reality of your situation is that, unless you're willing to say you're illiterate or learning disabled, there isn't any way for you to stay in the closet as it were and still get the information you need. As I see it, you have two choices: you can verbally identify yourself as a blind or visually impaired person and ask them to identify themselves based on the fact that you can't read their tag, or non-verbally identify your need by carrying a cane or wearing a tag that says "blind" or "visually impaired" on it. I assume you wish to conduct yourself with dignity, so I highly suggest you consider carrying a cane. I don't blame you if carrying a cane brings fear that people will treat you differently. Unfortunately, they will. However, your own comfort with your vision impairment will eventually rub off on people to the point where they will treat you as a colleague rather than some interesting display. This process is far easier than wondering what the best way of meeting your needs without coming out is. As I said, please forgive my frankness; I have been in this situation myself and can honestly find no better way to assist you than to be completely straightforward with you. > > Respectfully, > Jedi > > Original message: >> Hi List! > >> I have run numerous times into the same dilemma and I am convinced this >> dilemma will become more and more of a problem as I move on in my career, >> unless I do something about it, which is why i am posing this problem to >> you: > >> Recently I went to a meeting of a professional organization here in DC. Not >> surprisingly, each of the attendees were given name tags with one's name and >> either place of work or study to wear during the event, to help initiate >> networking. I am partially blind, and don't feel the need to carry a cane >> with me. However, I can't see other people;s name tags, and can't comment or >> respond to what is written on them. i would like to be able to ask peopel >> who they are and where they work without looking liek I can't read. has >> anyone perfected a introduction by which they can do this? > >> I would appreciate any thoughts. > >> Sincerely, >> -- >> Kathryn CARROLL >> American University >> 631 521 3018 >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com From brileyp at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 20:45:32 2010 From: brileyp at gmail.com (Briley Pollard) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 15:45:32 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? In-Reply-To: <20100321222734.10377.87216@web3> References: <20100321222734.10377.87216@web3> Message-ID: <101D66EF-F086-4A43-B44E-B7F80A84CA01@gmail.com> I don't think anyone is saying that clubs are the only way to get involved on campus, but they can be a good starting point for many people. Briley On Mar 21, 2010, at 5:27 PM, Jedi wrote: > Frankly, my time is taken up with school, homework, and the nFB. I did join the school's step team. Step is a type of dance much like stomp minus any instruments. I found the club difficult for a few reasons. First, the uniform necessary for the club was expensive and I didn't have the money; the other dancers on the team (most notably the Captain) didn't understand this and thought that my unwillingness to buy the uniform was a personal choice rather than a choice inspired by the reality of my situation. Next, the dancers tended to use a visual form of communication that I was not privy to, and no one really tried to let me in even when I asked for as much information as I could get. To add to that, the Captain said that blindness was not an issue and refused my talking with the team explicitly about blindness. Then, the issue came up later on in the middle of dance practice where fellow team members wanted to know how much I could see putting me in a very uncomfortable position. It was also clear that as an individual person (blindness aside), I was just not someone who fit into the general atmosphere. to be honest, I've made occasional inquiries at other clubs on campus such as the free thinkers society (mostly a group of atheists who spend their time criticizing theists without understanding that their view is no more valid) and the disability rights club (a pan-disability movement with its own agenda that isn't in keeping with my values as a blind person and a member of the NFB). I just figured that campus clubs weren't the best route for me. > > That doesn't mean that I stopped socializing though, and I don't think that clubs have to be the only way to socialize for blind students just to be normal. I joined off-campus associations such as the local Democrats. I also started weightlifting at an all-women's gym. both of these involvements are less formal than a campus club. The Dems are formal, but I don't get to see them as often as I'd like. My real avenue for socializing at school is simply to engage in interpersonal relationships as I discover them. My blindness as an identity has informed these relationships somewhat because I don't make it a habbit of befriending those who spend their time with me asking question after question about blindness. I instead choose friends who just get it or at least get it enough to know that blindness should not be the central focus of their interest in me. If they have questions, then they ask, but not in that "bombs away" style that so many people favor. > > Respectfully, > Jedi > > > Original message: >> Hi list, > >> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you >> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity as >> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >> people interact with you? >> Thoughts? >> Best, >> Darian >> -- >> Darian Smith >> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >> help! To Get Involved go to: >> www.TeachBlindStudents.org > >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com From serenacucco at verizon.net Mon Mar 22 21:30:07 2010 From: serenacucco at verizon.net (Serena) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 17:30:07 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? References: <20100321222734.10377.87216@web3> <101D66EF-F086-4A43-B44E-B7F80A84CA01@gmail.com> Message-ID: <006e01caca06$d81e4f40$0201a8c0@Serene> When I was in college, I joined several clubs, including a couple of mentoring programs for disadvantaged youth and a club for people with disabilities. Although the club didn't necessarily promote the NFB philosophy exactly, it wasn't against the NFB, either. I finally joined it for comrodory more than anything else, after an ignorant sighted so-called friend badmouthed a fellow blind student to me about his lack of blindness skills. Although some of her points were valid, I always tried to keep my opinion about the blind student's lack of skills to myself and thaught it was inappropriate for her to talk about him to me. Serena ----- Original Message ----- From: "Briley Pollard" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 4:45 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >I don't think anyone is saying that clubs are the only way to get involved >on campus, but they can be a good starting point for many people. > > Briley > On Mar 21, 2010, at 5:27 PM, Jedi wrote: > >> Frankly, my time is taken up with school, homework, and the nFB. I did >> join the school's step team. Step is a type of dance much like stomp >> minus any instruments. I found the club difficult for a few reasons. >> First, the uniform necessary for the club was expensive and I didn't have >> the money; the other dancers on the team (most notably the Captain) >> didn't understand this and thought that my unwillingness to buy the >> uniform was a personal choice rather than a choice inspired by the >> reality of my situation. Next, the dancers tended to use a visual form of >> communication that I was not privy to, and no one really tried to let me >> in even when I asked for as much information as I could get. To add to >> that, the Captain said that blindness was not an issue and refused my >> talking with the team explicitly about blindness. Then, the issue came up >> later on in the middle of dance practice where fellow team members wanted >> to know how much I could see putting me in a very uncomfortable position. > It was also clear that as an individual person (blindness aside), I was > just not someone who fit into the general atmosphere. to be honest, I've > made occasional inquiries at other clubs on campus such as the free > thinkers society (mostly a group of atheists who spend their time > criticizing theists without understanding that their view is no more > valid) and the disability rights club (a pan-disability movement with its > own agenda that isn't in keeping with my values as a blind person and a > member of the NFB). I just figured that campus clubs weren't the best > route for me. >> >> That doesn't mean that I stopped socializing though, and I don't think >> that clubs have to be the only way to socialize for blind students just >> to be normal. I joined off-campus associations such as the local >> Democrats. I also started weightlifting at an all-women's gym. both of >> these involvements are less formal than a campus club. The Dems are >> formal, but I don't get to see them as often as I'd like. My real avenue >> for socializing at school is simply to engage in interpersonal >> relationships as I discover them. My blindness as an identity has >> informed these relationships somewhat because I don't make it a habbit of >> befriending those who spend their time with me asking question after >> question about blindness. I instead choose friends who just get it or at >> least get it enough to know that blindness should not be the central >> focus of their interest in me. If they have questions, then they ask, but >> not in that "bombs away" style that so many people favor. >> >> Respectfully, >> Jedi >> >> >> Original message: >>> Hi list, >> >>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you >>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity as >>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>> people interact with you? >>> Thoughts? >>> Best, >>> Darian >>> -- >>> Darian Smith >>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net >> >> -- >> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizon.net From thebluesisloose at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 23:32:57 2010 From: thebluesisloose at gmail.com (Beth) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 19:32:57 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? In-Reply-To: <006e01caca06$d81e4f40$0201a8c0@Serene> References: <20100321222734.10377.87216@web3> <101D66EF-F086-4A43-B44E-B7F80A84CA01@gmail.com> <006e01caca06$d81e4f40$0201a8c0@Serene> Message-ID: <4383d01d1003221632h5fa48c0bs62a102d65c504526@mail.gmail.com> I never really socialized in high school, except in marching band. I never went to prom, sadly. But homecoming was sad because I never got a date. Because of behavioral issues that people noticed, I had to have an adult chaperone with me at project graduation. It made the experience less fun, and I didn't get to socialize all the time with friends. In college, I found myself again and joined a couple of clubs, but I don't get out because of transportation like what Jamie was talking about. Buses run on certain times and they're not always around, even on campus. Beth On 3/22/10, Serena wrote: > When I was in college, I joined several clubs, including a couple of > mentoring programs for disadvantaged youth and a club for people with > disabilities. Although the club didn't necessarily promote the NFB > philosophy exactly, it wasn't against the NFB, either. I finally joined it > for comrodory more than anything else, after an ignorant sighted so-called > friend badmouthed a fellow blind student to me about his lack of blindness > skills. Although some of her points were valid, I always tried to keep my > opinion about the blind student's lack of skills to myself and thaught it > was inappropriate for her to talk about him to me. > > Serena > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Briley Pollard" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 4:45 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > > >>I don't think anyone is saying that clubs are the only way to get involved >>on campus, but they can be a good starting point for many people. >> >> Briley >> On Mar 21, 2010, at 5:27 PM, Jedi wrote: >> >>> Frankly, my time is taken up with school, homework, and the nFB. I did >>> join the school's step team. Step is a type of dance much like stomp >>> minus any instruments. I found the club difficult for a few reasons. >>> First, the uniform necessary for the club was expensive and I didn't have >>> >>> the money; the other dancers on the team (most notably the Captain) >>> didn't understand this and thought that my unwillingness to buy the >>> uniform was a personal choice rather than a choice inspired by the >>> reality of my situation. Next, the dancers tended to use a visual form of >>> >>> communication that I was not privy to, and no one really tried to let me >>> in even when I asked for as much information as I could get. To add to >>> that, the Captain said that blindness was not an issue and refused my >>> talking with the team explicitly about blindness. Then, the issue came up >>> >>> later on in the middle of dance practice where fellow team members wanted >>> >>> to know how much I could see putting me in a very uncomfortable position. >> It was also clear that as an individual person (blindness aside), I was >> just not someone who fit into the general atmosphere. to be honest, I've >> made occasional inquiries at other clubs on campus such as the free >> thinkers society (mostly a group of atheists who spend their time >> criticizing theists without understanding that their view is no more >> valid) and the disability rights club (a pan-disability movement with its >> own agenda that isn't in keeping with my values as a blind person and a >> member of the NFB). I just figured that campus clubs weren't the best >> route for me. >>> >>> That doesn't mean that I stopped socializing though, and I don't think >>> that clubs have to be the only way to socialize for blind students just >>> to be normal. I joined off-campus associations such as the local >>> Democrats. I also started weightlifting at an all-women's gym. both of >>> these involvements are less formal than a campus club. The Dems are >>> formal, but I don't get to see them as often as I'd like. My real avenue >>> for socializing at school is simply to engage in interpersonal >>> relationships as I discover them. My blindness as an identity has >>> informed these relationships somewhat because I don't make it a habbit of >>> >>> befriending those who spend their time with me asking question after >>> question about blindness. I instead choose friends who just get it or at >>> least get it enough to know that blindness should not be the central >>> focus of their interest in me. If they have questions, then they ask, but >>> >>> not in that "bombs away" style that so many people favor. >>> >>> Respectfully, >>> Jedi >>> >>> >>> Original message: >>>> Hi list, >>> >>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you >>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity as >>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>> people interact with you? >>>> Thoughts? >>>> Best, >>>> Darian >>>> -- >>>> Darian Smith >>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net >>> >>> -- >>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/serenacucco%40verizon.net >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com > From parnell at sccoast.net Tue Mar 23 00:14:42 2010 From: parnell at sccoast.net (Parnell and Kim Diggs) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 19:14:42 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Thru Our Eyes interview with Parnell Diggs Message-ID: Important Announcement! On Wednesday, march 24, at 8:00 pm. EST, Joe Ruffalo, host of Thru Our Eyes will be interviewing Parnell Diggs, committee chair of the Imagination Fund-Race for Independence sponsored by the National Federation of the Blind. Joe and Parnell will discuss the following: The history of the Imagination Fund. The importance of this valuable program, What national, state and chapter projects have received funding? How to get involved? What is the Race for Independence? What is the blind driver challenge? How to access Thru Our Eyes: Logging into www.thruoureyes.org or for JAWS users, log into www.thruoureyes.org/jaws.html or to listen via phone, please call, 1 605 475 6333, code 833520 If you wish to call with a question, please phone 1 888 572 0141 and press 0 for on air questions. Press 3 for Lenny on questions on podcast and web shows Special Note: Please contact Joe Ruffalo at nfbnj at yahoo.com to discuss the possibility of divisions, and projects to be interviewed with the objective of hosting their own show. Remember: When we all do, it becomes doable! Best, Joe Ruffalo At times, we are blinded by our ability to see. The more we try, the more we succeed. Everything is impossible until you do it. Keep believing. Keep dreaming. Keep learning Let's work together. Let's make a difference! Joseph J. Ruffalo President, National Federation of the Blind of New Jersey Phone: 973-743-0075 Please visit our State and National Web Sites http://www.nfbnj.org http://www.thruoureyes.org http://www.blindchildren.org http://www.nfb.org From marrie12 at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 00:29:17 2010 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 17:29:17 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? In-Reply-To: <000001cac9ac$83ceb380$8b6c1a80$@jevnikar@utoronto.ca> References: <409c235c1003211328g71fc37c9n1dc20f289a8b9945@mail.gmail.com> <37F973E5-D64B-4A34-9F28-BDA371D4E9F8@gmail.com> <523374E9A35646DAB0C4BC23E315E11B@hometwxakonvzn> <000001cac9ac$83ceb380$8b6c1a80$@jevnikar@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <93DBD489-52E2-476A-BA5A-832236F243BE@gmail.com> No in my opinion it will get you distracted from work and work is what you are there to accomplish. nothing more. I have no time to go out and have fun now that I'm doing 13 credits. only in the summer or duroing spring break can I pleasure myself in singing karoque. but college is for work alone in my opinion even if it is a choir class. On Mar 22, 2010, at 3:43 AM, Sarah Jevnikar wrote: > I disagree with RJ and Sarah. Obviously you're there to get a degree but > there is so much more to education than that. Learning from lectures and > texts is such a small portion of what you will learn in life it can't hurt > to expose yourself to a wide range of people and interests while so many > opportunities are available to you. Maybe you won't like what you learn from > others or you won't make the friends you hoped but putting yourself out > there can only benefit you In the long run. > Respectfully, > Sarah Jevnikar > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of RJ Sandefur > Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:50 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > > I felt the same way as Sarah does! > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Sarah Alawami" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 5:18 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > > >> I don't socialise but that has nothing to do with my blindness. I choose >> not to socialise with anyone because I'm there to get my degree and nothing > >> else. I know that sounds cruel but those are my thoughts. >> >> Take care. >> On Mar 21, 2010, at 1:28 PM, Darian Smith wrote: >> >>> Hi list, >>> >>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you >>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity as >>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>> people interact with you? >>> Thoughts? >>> Best, >>> Darian >>> -- >>> Darian Smith >>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% > 40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto > ronto.ca > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com From marrie12 at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 00:30:14 2010 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 17:30:14 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? In-Reply-To: <87C4399F41414C96930F485BAD0C02FC@SonyPC> References: <409c235c1003211328g71fc37c9n1dc20f289a8b9945@mail.gmail.com> <63af025c1003211711q157b9dfdl390a29051a9da982@mail.gmail.com> <87C4399F41414C96930F485BAD0C02FC@SonyPC> Message-ID: <0464D9EC-060D-4951-863A-2E15CDAE4059@gmail.com> actually I'm the same way I get allong better if I'm talking professioonally to someone rather then just a 1 on 1 conversation. those who have talked to me already can attest, escept when I'm drunk. lol. On Mar 22, 2010, at 6:23 AM, Mark J. Cadigan wrote: > I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of clubs or other school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew for a play, but I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything other than professional questions about things of a technical nature. I did my job well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that if they talked to me they would offend me or something like that. > > Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved in the boy scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy scouts and life teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or technical in nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't know if this is blindness related, or what. > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jamie Principato" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > > >> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get involved in as much >> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz Band, and a Youth >> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate and public >> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I couldn't wait >> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups and activities to >> choose from. >> >> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot of...problems...with the >> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went to this high >> school because we were told it offered the most for visually impaired >> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but I'll spare you >> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students at this school >> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, avoiding >> activities and student events. I learned shortly after joining Model UN and >> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and planning to go to a >> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the fact t I joined >> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and that if I was going >> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a permission note (no >> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a teacher >> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I attend these >> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally unless I sat >> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman stands with my >> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was unnecessary, and we >> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other issues, >> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. >> >> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home school support >> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I took advantage of >> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular activities in my >> community, even sports (something that never would have flown at that >> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on campus and in the >> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing club, a volunteer >> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also try to get the >> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, and make use of >> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been having is that >> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by house recently >> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the evening. The only >> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or get home from a >> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you need to get out >> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if money is tight one >> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside of attending >> class, including attending free activities or events. I guess that's just >> one price of living off campus though. >> >> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith wrote: >> >>> Hi list, >>> >>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you >>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity as >>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>> people interact with you? >>> Thoughts? >>> Best, >>> Darian >>> -- >>> Darian Smith >>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com From joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 02:44:14 2010 From: joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com (RJ Sandefur) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 22:44:14 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] advice References: <2fdbeb321003211336w496f9c34gdac167baca20607d@mail.gmail.com> <67A6205E30FF471D9E143596408786AE@Hope> Message-ID: <261E059E01E349DC944D3B1FF4E2DB88@hometwxakonvzn> Thanks! What are you going for? forgot to ask. Feel free to call me on skype. rj.sandefur----- Original Message -- RJ--- From: "Hope Paulos" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 11:47 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] advice > They make such canes. I don'tknow where you can get them though. > Hope and Beignet > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "RJ Sandefur" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 10:44 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] advice > > >> Hope, Do they make such canes? Or are you joking? RJ >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Hope Paulos" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 6:51 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] advice >> >> >>> You might want to carry an id cane to let people know that you have a >>> visual impairment. That way they're more likely to be willing to provide >>> you with more info about themselves so that you can have the same >>> benefits as all of the other attendees. >>> Just my thoughts. >>> Hope and Beignet >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Katy Carroll" >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> >>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 4:36 PM >>> Subject: [nabs-l] advice >>> >>> >>>> Hi List! >>>> >>>> I have run numerous times into the same dilemma and I am convinced this >>>> dilemma will become more and more of a problem as I move on in my >>>> career, >>>> unless I do something about it, which is why i am posing this problem >>>> to >>>> you: >>>> >>>> Recently I went to a meeting of a professional organization here in DC. >>>> Not >>>> surprisingly, each of the attendees were given name tags with one's >>>> name and >>>> either place of work or study to wear during the event, to help >>>> initiate >>>> networking. I am partially blind, and don't feel the need to carry a >>>> cane >>>> with me. However, I can't see other people;s name tags, and can't >>>> comment or >>>> respond to what is written on them. i would like to be able to ask >>>> peopel >>>> who they are and where they work without looking liek I can't read. has >>>> anyone perfected a introduction by which they can do this? >>>> >>>> I would appreciate any thoughts. >>>> >>>> Sincerely, >>>> -- >>>> Kathryn CARROLL >>>> American University >>>> 631 521 3018 >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com From alexandera.castillo at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 03:19:28 2010 From: alexandera.castillo at gmail.com (Alexander Castillo) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 23:19:28 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Advice Message-ID: Hello, having found myself in a similar situation as many others, having enough sight to get around, yet not being able to see well enough to fully function as a sighted individual. Which ever way one addresses this concern, there will be two basic ways to handle it. The first is by relying on others, to recognize your difference, or by acknowledging that difference yourself. I would recommend the laddder, as it will serve you most of the time, and you will be in control of the situation. During these meet and greets, in the past, I relied on my vision for information on what was around me, and who. I would overhear conversations, pick up hints here and there, ask around what table this was or that one, but once I started to use a cane, people actually sought me out, and when I did approach them, there were no distractions, just typical meet and greet conversation. . The cane made people aware of who I was and I did not have to present myself as someone with a visual impairment, it was already acknowledge. The rest, chatting up potential employers and colleagues was dependent on my personality and when necessary, resume, and not on a need to identify myself, or make sure that others understood that I was visually impaired, or partially sighted, or legally blind.... In short, as many others have stated, it is very possible that identifying yourself with non -verbal means, that mean being a cane, as it is most accepted and respected, will possibly be of great bennifitt in these situations. Alex Castillo From jj at bestmidi.com Tue Mar 23 04:01:29 2010 From: jj at bestmidi.com (J.J. Meddaugh) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 00:01:29 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Huge Savings on Mobile Geo GPS and Mobile Speak Message-ID: If you've been waiting for that super sale to convince you to purchase mobile Geo, the GPS software package made by Sendero and Code Factory for Windows Mobile Phones, then listen up. In honor of the CSUN conference, A T Guys is pleased to offer Mobile Geo for a special price of $599. That's nearly $300 off the retail price for the software. Or, purchase the Mobile Speak Adventure bundle and receive Mobile Speak 4, Mobile Geo, and Mobile Magnifier for $725. These deals are available from http://www.ATGuys.com for a limited time. Please write support at atguys.com or call 269-216-4798n with any questions. We'd be happy to help you out. A T Guys is a premier licensed Code Factory distributor. J.J. Meddaugh - ATGuys.com A premier Licensed Code Factory and KNFB Reader distributor From blackbyrdfly at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 14:50:57 2010 From: blackbyrdfly at gmail.com (Jamie Principato) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 10:50:57 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? In-Reply-To: <93DBD489-52E2-476A-BA5A-832236F243BE@gmail.com> References: <409c235c1003211328g71fc37c9n1dc20f289a8b9945@mail.gmail.com> <37F973E5-D64B-4A34-9F28-BDA371D4E9F8@gmail.com> <523374E9A35646DAB0C4BC23E315E11B@hometwxakonvzn> <93DBD489-52E2-476A-BA5A-832236F243BE@gmail.com> Message-ID: <63af025c1003230750t2a8c7549uf505fd910cfda28d@mail.gmail.com> I consider myself to be very academic-oriented. My career goal is to become a researcher and university professor of cognitive psychology, but f you only focus on work and nothing else though, if you don't branch out and at least devote a little effort to extracurricular interactions, how will you develop relationships with future colleagues? On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 8:29 PM, Sarah Alawami wrote: > No in my opinion it will get you distracted from work and work is what you > are there to accomplish. nothing more. I have no time to go out and have fun > now that I'm doing 13 credits. only in the summer or duroing spring break > can I pleasure myself in singing karoque. but college is for work alone in > my opinion even if it is a choir class. > On Mar 22, 2010, at 3:43 AM, Sarah Jevnikar wrote: > > > I disagree with RJ and Sarah. Obviously you're there to get a degree but > > there is so much more to education than that. Learning from lectures and > > texts is such a small portion of what you will learn in life it can't > hurt > > to expose yourself to a wide range of people and interests while so many > > opportunities are available to you. Maybe you won't like what you learn > from > > others or you won't make the friends you hoped but putting yourself out > > there can only benefit you In the long run. > > Respectfully, > > Sarah Jevnikar > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On > Behalf > > Of RJ Sandefur > > Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:50 AM > > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > > > > I felt the same way as Sarah does! > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Sarah Alawami" > > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > > > Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 5:18 PM > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > > > > > >> I don't socialise but that has nothing to do with my blindness. I choose > >> not to socialise with anyone because I'm there to get my degree and > nothing > > > >> else. I know that sounds cruel but those are my thoughts. > >> > >> Take care. > >> On Mar 21, 2010, at 1:28 PM, Darian Smith wrote: > >> > >>> Hi list, > >>> > >>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming > >>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or > >>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you > >>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a > >>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity as > >>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did > >>> people interact with you? > >>> Thoughts? > >>> Best, > >>> Darian > >>> -- > >>> Darian Smith > >>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth > >>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com > >>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher > >>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate > >>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your > >>> help! To Get Involved go to: > >>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> nabs-l mailing list > >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > >>> nabs-l: > >>> > > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> nabs-l mailing list > >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > >> nabs-l: > >> > > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% > > 40gmail.com > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > nabs-l mailing list > > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > > nabs-l: > > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto > > ronto.ca > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > nabs-l mailing list > > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com > From hope.paulos at maine.edu Tue Mar 23 18:57:22 2010 From: hope.paulos at maine.edu (Hope Paulos) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 14:57:22 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? References: <409c235c1003211328g71fc37c9n1dc20f289a8b9945@mail.gmail.com><37F973E5-D64B-4A34-9F28-BDA371D4E9F8@gmail.com><523374E9A35646DAB0C4BC23E315E11B@hometwxakonvzn><93DBD489-52E2-476A-BA5A-832236F243BE@gmail.com> <63af025c1003230750t2a8c7549uf505fd910cfda28d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: When I first began my college career, I believed what RJ and Sarah A did; that no fun was to be had while attending classes. Perhaps in the first year or so of college that might be necessary. The only reason I say that is because college is much different than high school; however, after the first year it's likely that you will have adjusted to the rigor of college. In order to release stress, you have to have fun. Weather you do extra curricular activities on or off campus, sing for pleasure or run, you *have* to release stress. You can amerce yourself fully in classes and homework for the majority of the day (or even during the week), but on the weekend, you should relax and get away from school for a while. Otherwise, if you attend college for a significant amount of time, like I did (8 years), it's going to ware on you. Just my opinion. Hope and Beignet ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jamie Principato" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2010 10:50 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >I consider myself to be very academic-oriented. My career goal is to become > a researcher and university professor of cognitive psychology, but f you > only focus on work and nothing else though, if you don't branch out and at > least devote a little effort to extracurricular interactions, how will you > develop relationships with future colleagues? > > On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 8:29 PM, Sarah Alawami wrote: > >> No in my opinion it will get you distracted from work and work is what >> you >> are there to accomplish. nothing more. I have no time to go out and have >> fun >> now that I'm doing 13 credits. only in the summer or duroing spring break >> can I pleasure myself in singing karoque. but college is for work alone >> in >> my opinion even if it is a choir class. >> On Mar 22, 2010, at 3:43 AM, Sarah Jevnikar wrote: >> >> > I disagree with RJ and Sarah. Obviously you're there to get a degree >> > but >> > there is so much more to education than that. Learning from lectures >> > and >> > texts is such a small portion of what you will learn in life it can't >> hurt >> > to expose yourself to a wide range of people and interests while so >> > many >> > opportunities are available to you. Maybe you won't like what you learn >> from >> > others or you won't make the friends you hoped but putting yourself out >> > there can only benefit you In the long run. >> > Respectfully, >> > Sarah Jevnikar >> > >> > -----Original Message----- >> > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> > Of RJ Sandefur >> > Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:50 AM >> > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >> > >> > I felt the same way as Sarah does! >> > ----- Original Message ----- >> > From: "Sarah Alawami" >> > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> > >> > Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 5:18 PM >> > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >> > >> > >> >> I don't socialise but that has nothing to do with my blindness. I >> >> choose >> >> not to socialise with anyone because I'm there to get my degree and >> nothing >> > >> >> else. I know that sounds cruel but those are my thoughts. >> >> >> >> Take care. >> >> On Mar 21, 2010, at 1:28 PM, Darian Smith wrote: >> >> >> >>> Hi list, >> >>> >> >>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >> >>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >> >>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you >> >>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >> >>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity as >> >>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >> >>> people interact with you? >> >>> Thoughts? >> >>> Best, >> >>> Darian >> >>> -- >> >>> Darian Smith >> >>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >> >>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >> >>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide >> >>> teacher >> >>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >> >>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >> >>> help! To Get Involved go to: >> >>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >> >>> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >> >>> nabs-l mailing list >> >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> >>> nabs-l: >> >>> >> > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> nabs-l mailing list >> >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> >> nabs-l: >> >> >> > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% >> > 40gmail.com >> > >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > nabs-l mailing list >> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> > nabs-l: >> > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto >> > ronto.ca >> > >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > nabs-l mailing list >> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com >> > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu From kc2992a at student.american.edu Tue Mar 23 20:57:38 2010 From: kc2992a at student.american.edu (Katy Carroll) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 16:57:38 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] advice In-Reply-To: <261E059E01E349DC944D3B1FF4E2DB88@hometwxakonvzn> References: <2fdbeb321003211336w496f9c34gdac167baca20607d@mail.gmail.com> <67A6205E30FF471D9E143596408786AE@Hope> <261E059E01E349DC944D3B1FF4E2DB88@hometwxakonvzn> Message-ID: <2fdbeb321003231357hd02b55dp7a6a3ea6c505cbea@mail.gmail.com> Hi everyone, I appreciate all the responses. I have been mulling them over. I am one of those people who can get along fine without a cane, and so I only use a cane when I am traveling somewhere new. I realize even balancing my behavior brings it's own problems. Thanks for the advice. Kate On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 10:44 PM, RJ Sandefur wrote: > Thanks! What are you going for? forgot to ask. Feel free to call me on > skype. rj.sandefur----- Original Message -- RJ--- From: "Hope Paulos" < > hope.paulos at maine.edu> > > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" < > nabs-l at nfbnet.org> > Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 11:47 AM > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] advice > > > They make such canes. I don'tknow where you can get them though. >> Hope and Beignet >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "RJ Sandefur" < >> joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com> >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" < >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org> >> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 10:44 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] advice >> >> >> Hope, Do they make such canes? Or are you joking? RJ >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Hope Paulos" >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" < >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org> >>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 6:51 PM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] advice >>> >>> >>> You might want to carry an id cane to let people know that you have a >>>> visual impairment. That way they're more likely to be willing to provide you >>>> with more info about themselves so that you can have the same benefits as >>>> all of the other attendees. >>>> Just my thoughts. >>>> Hope and Beignet >>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Katy Carroll" < >>>> kc2992a at student.american.edu> >>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" < >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org> >>>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 4:36 PM >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] advice >>>> >>>> >>>> Hi List! >>>>> >>>>> I have run numerous times into the same dilemma and I am convinced this >>>>> dilemma will become more and more of a problem as I move on in my >>>>> career, >>>>> unless I do something about it, which is why i am posing this problem >>>>> to >>>>> you: >>>>> >>>>> Recently I went to a meeting of a professional organization here in DC. >>>>> Not >>>>> surprisingly, each of the attendees were given name tags with one's >>>>> name and >>>>> either place of work or study to wear during the event, to help >>>>> initiate >>>>> networking. I am partially blind, and don't feel the need to carry a >>>>> cane >>>>> with me. However, I can't see other people;s name tags, and can't >>>>> comment or >>>>> respond to what is written on them. i would like to be able to ask >>>>> peopel >>>>> who they are and where they work without looking liek I can't read. has >>>>> anyone perfected a introduction by which they can do this? >>>>> >>>>> I would appreciate any thoughts. >>>>> >>>>> Sincerely, >>>>> -- >>>>> Kathryn CARROLL >>>>> American University >>>>> 631 521 3018 >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu >>>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kc2992a%40student.american.edu > -- Kathryn CARROLL American University 631 521 3018 From kc2992a at student.american.edu Tue Mar 23 20:58:38 2010 From: kc2992a at student.american.edu (Katy Carroll) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 16:58:38 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Advice In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2fdbeb321003231358u7d575f43qd6a389996f025fce@mail.gmail.com> Thanks Alex! On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 11:19 PM, Alexander Castillo < alexandera.castillo at gmail.com> wrote: > Hello, having found myself in a similar situation as many others, > having enough sight to get around, yet not being able to see well > enough to fully function as a sighted individual. Which ever way one > addresses this concern, there will be two basic ways to handle it. > The first is by relying on others, to recognize your difference, or by > acknowledging that difference yourself. > > I would recommend the laddder, as it will serve you most of the time, > and you will be in control of the situation. > > During these meet and greets, in the past, I relied on my vision for > information on what was around me, and who. I would overhear > conversations, pick up hints here and there, ask around what table > this was or that one, but once I started to use a cane, people > actually sought me out, and when I did approach them, there were no > distractions, just typical meet and greet conversation. . > > The cane made people aware of who I was and I did not have to present > myself as someone with a visual impairment, it was already > acknowledge. The rest, chatting up potential employers and colleagues > was dependent on my personality and when necessary, resume, and not on > a need to identify myself, or make sure that others understood that I > was visually impaired, or partially sighted, or legally blind.... > > In short, as many others have stated, it is very possible that > identifying yourself with non -verbal means, that mean being a cane, > as it is most accepted and respected, will possibly be of great > bennifitt in these situations. > > Alex Castillo > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kc2992a%40student.american.edu > -- Kathryn CARROLL American University 631 521 3018 From mrsmigs at migliorelli.org Tue Mar 23 21:53:29 2010 From: mrsmigs at migliorelli.org (Maryann Migliorelli) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 15:53:29 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] advice In-Reply-To: <2fdbeb321003231357hd02b55dp7a6a3ea6c505cbea@mail.gmail.com> References: <2fdbeb321003211336w496f9c34gdac167baca20607d@mail.gmail.com> <67A6205E30FF471D9E143596408786AE@Hope> <261E059E01E349DC944D3B1FF4E2DB88@hometwxakonvzn> <2fdbeb321003231357hd02b55dp7a6a3ea6c505cbea@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <003901cacad3$46a2b920$d3e82b60$@org> Hello, I didn't respond to this for a while but hope that you will consider this thought. I know plenty of folks who do consider themselves blind but don't carry a cane openly when they aren't using it. They do, however, keep one in their bag or purse for convenient use when they do need it. That being said, they are very comfortable with their blindness and have no problems asking for visual help when it's needed. If you are comfortable enough with your blindness and don't wish to carry a cane with you at these meetings, you might just get comfortable saying, "Hello, I'm (blind, visually impaired, not seeing well today, pick something that works for you) and can't read your name tag. Will you please share your information with me/" Sometimes we have to ask this question even with the obvious signs such as canes or guide dogs because people just don't think about it. Let's face it, we're an anomaly to most people in these situations. Generally people just take it for granted that everyone there will read their name tag, and that they will do the same. It's just something to keep in the back of your mind going in so that you can be conscious of it and get comfortable asking for the information you want. I've been having to do this at networking events for years. It does get easier with time and as you become more comfortable with talking openly about your blindness. I hope this helps. Maryann Migliorelli From marrie12 at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 22:06:06 2010 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 15:06:06 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? In-Reply-To: <63af025c1003230750t2a8c7549uf505fd910cfda28d@mail.gmail.com> References: <409c235c1003211328g71fc37c9n1dc20f289a8b9945@mail.gmail.com> <37F973E5-D64B-4A34-9F28-BDA371D4E9F8@gmail.com> <523374E9A35646DAB0C4BC23E315E11B@hometwxakonvzn> <93DBD489-52E2-476A-BA5A-832236F243BE@gmail.com> <63af025c1003230750t2a8c7549uf505fd910cfda28d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: true but you don't want to be distracted from work. so you treat college like a work place. Ok I'm hanging out at the student union right now but I'm talking to no one unless I have to get up to get food. lol. On Mar 23, 2010, at 7:50 AM, Jamie Principato wrote: > I consider myself to be very academic-oriented. My career goal is to become > a researcher and university professor of cognitive psychology, but f you > only focus on work and nothing else though, if you don't branch out and at > least devote a little effort to extracurricular interactions, how will you > develop relationships with future colleagues? > > On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 8:29 PM, Sarah Alawami wrote: > >> No in my opinion it will get you distracted from work and work is what you >> are there to accomplish. nothing more. I have no time to go out and have fun >> now that I'm doing 13 credits. only in the summer or duroing spring break >> can I pleasure myself in singing karoque. but college is for work alone in >> my opinion even if it is a choir class. >> On Mar 22, 2010, at 3:43 AM, Sarah Jevnikar wrote: >> >>> I disagree with RJ and Sarah. Obviously you're there to get a degree but >>> there is so much more to education than that. Learning from lectures and >>> texts is such a small portion of what you will learn in life it can't >> hurt >>> to expose yourself to a wide range of people and interests while so many >>> opportunities are available to you. Maybe you won't like what you learn >> from >>> others or you won't make the friends you hoped but putting yourself out >>> there can only benefit you In the long run. >>> Respectfully, >>> Sarah Jevnikar >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >>> Of RJ Sandefur >>> Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:50 AM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>> >>> I felt the same way as Sarah does! >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Sarah Alawami" >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> >>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 5:18 PM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>> >>> >>>> I don't socialise but that has nothing to do with my blindness. I choose >>>> not to socialise with anyone because I'm there to get my degree and >> nothing >>> >>>> else. I know that sounds cruel but those are my thoughts. >>>> >>>> Take care. >>>> On Mar 21, 2010, at 1:28 PM, Darian Smith wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi list, >>>>> >>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you >>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity as >>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>>> people interact with you? >>>>> Thoughts? >>>>> Best, >>>>> Darian >>>>> -- >>>>> Darian Smith >>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% >>> 40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto >>> ronto.ca >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com >> > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com From marrie12 at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 22:06:58 2010 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 15:06:58 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? In-Reply-To: References: <409c235c1003211328g71fc37c9n1dc20f289a8b9945@mail.gmail.com><37F973E5-D64B-4A34-9F28-BDA371D4E9F8@gmail.com><523374E9A35646DAB0C4BC23E315E11B@hometwxakonvzn><93DBD489-52E2-476A-BA5A-832236F243BE@gmail.com> <63af025c1003230750t2a8c7549uf505fd910cfda28d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8B3D7D10-5C5C-445A-85B6-C4D59F689270@gmail.com> actually I've been attending colledge for 8 years and my first yeaear I had fun and stuff during my breaks but this distracted me from school so I quit doing that resently. On Mar 23, 2010, at 11:57 AM, Hope Paulos wrote: > When I first began my college career, I believed what RJ and Sarah A did; that no fun was to be had while attending classes. Perhaps in the first year or so of college that might be necessary. The only reason I say that is because college is much different than high school; however, after the first year it's likely that you will have adjusted to the rigor of college. In order to release stress, you have to have fun. Weather you do extra curricular activities on or off campus, sing for pleasure or run, you *have* to release stress. You can amerce yourself fully in classes and homework for the majority of the day (or even during the week), but on the weekend, you should relax and get away from school for a while. Otherwise, if you attend college for a significant amount of time, like I did (8 years), it's going to ware on you. > Just my opinion. > Hope and Beignet > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jamie Principato" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2010 10:50 AM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > > >> I consider myself to be very academic-oriented. My career goal is to become >> a researcher and university professor of cognitive psychology, but f you >> only focus on work and nothing else though, if you don't branch out and at >> least devote a little effort to extracurricular interactions, how will you >> develop relationships with future colleagues? >> >> On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 8:29 PM, Sarah Alawami wrote: >> >>> No in my opinion it will get you distracted from work and work is what you >>> are there to accomplish. nothing more. I have no time to go out and have fun >>> now that I'm doing 13 credits. only in the summer or duroing spring break >>> can I pleasure myself in singing karoque. but college is for work alone in >>> my opinion even if it is a choir class. >>> On Mar 22, 2010, at 3:43 AM, Sarah Jevnikar wrote: >>> >>> > I disagree with RJ and Sarah. Obviously you're there to get a degree > but >>> > there is so much more to education than that. Learning from lectures > and >>> > texts is such a small portion of what you will learn in life it can't >>> hurt >>> > to expose yourself to a wide range of people and interests while so > many >>> > opportunities are available to you. Maybe you won't like what you learn >>> from >>> > others or you won't make the friends you hoped but putting yourself out >>> > there can only benefit you In the long run. >>> > Respectfully, >>> > Sarah Jevnikar >>> > >>> > -----Original Message----- >>> > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>> Behalf >>> > Of RJ Sandefur >>> > Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:50 AM >>> > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>> > >>> > I felt the same way as Sarah does! >>> > ----- Original Message ----- >>> > From: "Sarah Alawami" >>> > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> > >>> > Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 5:18 PM >>> > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>> > >>> > >>> >> I don't socialise but that has nothing to do with my blindness. I >> choose >>> >> not to socialise with anyone because I'm there to get my degree and >>> nothing >>> > >>> >> else. I know that sounds cruel but those are my thoughts. >>> >> >>> >> Take care. >>> >> On Mar 21, 2010, at 1:28 PM, Darian Smith wrote: >>> >> >>> >>> Hi list, >>> >>> >>> >>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>> >>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>> >>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you >>> >>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>> >>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity as >>> >>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>> >>> people interact with you? >>> >>> Thoughts? >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> Darian >>> >>> -- >>> >>> Darian Smith >>> >>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>> >>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>> >>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide >>> teacher >>> >>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>> >>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>> >>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>> >>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> >>> > >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >>> >> nabs-l mailing list >>> >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> >> nabs-l: >>> >> >>> > >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% >>> > 40gmail.com >>> > >>> > >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > nabs-l mailing list >>> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> > nabs-l: >>> > >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto >>> > ronto.ca >>> > >>> > >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > nabs-l mailing list >>> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40maine.edu > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com From joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 23:11:32 2010 From: joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com (RJ Sandefur) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 19:11:32 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? References: <409c235c1003211328g71fc37c9n1dc20f289a8b9945@mail.gmail.com><37F973E5-D64B-4A34-9F28-BDA371D4E9F8@gmail.com><523374E9A35646DAB0C4BC23E315E11B@hometwxakonvzn><93DBD489-52E2-476A-BA5A-832236F243BE@gmail.com><63af025c1003230750t2a8c7549uf505fd910cfda28d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <57D245D233D24571B17DB921DCBE4903@hometwxakonvzn> The only thing I partisapated in was student Government. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sarah Alawami" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2010 6:06 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > true but you don't want to be distracted from work. so you treat college > like a work place. Ok I'm hanging out at the student union right now but > I'm talking to no one unless I have to get up to get food. lol. > On Mar 23, 2010, at 7:50 AM, Jamie Principato wrote: > >> I consider myself to be very academic-oriented. My career goal is to >> become >> a researcher and university professor of cognitive psychology, but f you >> only focus on work and nothing else though, if you don't branch out and >> at >> least devote a little effort to extracurricular interactions, how will >> you >> develop relationships with future colleagues? >> >> On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 8:29 PM, Sarah Alawami >> wrote: >> >>> No in my opinion it will get you distracted from work and work is what >>> you >>> are there to accomplish. nothing more. I have no time to go out and have >>> fun >>> now that I'm doing 13 credits. only in the summer or duroing spring >>> break >>> can I pleasure myself in singing karoque. but college is for work alone >>> in >>> my opinion even if it is a choir class. >>> On Mar 22, 2010, at 3:43 AM, Sarah Jevnikar wrote: >>> >>>> I disagree with RJ and Sarah. Obviously you're there to get a degree >>>> but >>>> there is so much more to education than that. Learning from lectures >>>> and >>>> texts is such a small portion of what you will learn in life it can't >>> hurt >>>> to expose yourself to a wide range of people and interests while so >>>> many >>>> opportunities are available to you. Maybe you won't like what you learn >>> from >>>> others or you won't make the friends you hoped but putting yourself out >>>> there can only benefit you In the long run. >>>> Respectfully, >>>> Sarah Jevnikar >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>> Behalf >>>> Of RJ Sandefur >>>> Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:50 AM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>> >>>> I felt the same way as Sarah does! >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Sarah Alawami" >>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>> >>>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 5:18 PM >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>> >>>> >>>>> I don't socialise but that has nothing to do with my blindness. I >>>>> choose >>>>> not to socialise with anyone because I'm there to get my degree and >>> nothing >>>> >>>>> else. I know that sounds cruel but those are my thoughts. >>>>> >>>>> Take care. >>>>> On Mar 21, 2010, at 1:28 PM, Darian Smith wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hi list, >>>>>> >>>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you >>>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity as >>>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>>>> people interact with you? >>>>>> Thoughts? >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> Darian >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide >>>>>> teacher >>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% >>>> 40gmail.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto >>>> ronto.ca >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com > From blackbyrdfly at gmail.com Wed Mar 24 01:45:31 2010 From: blackbyrdfly at gmail.com (Jamie Principato) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 21:45:31 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? In-Reply-To: References: <409c235c1003211328g71fc37c9n1dc20f289a8b9945@mail.gmail.com> <37F973E5-D64B-4A34-9F28-BDA371D4E9F8@gmail.com> <523374E9A35646DAB0C4BC23E315E11B@hometwxakonvzn> <93DBD489-52E2-476A-BA5A-832236F243BE@gmail.com> <63af025c1003230750t2a8c7549uf505fd910cfda28d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <63af025c1003231845q17688afs625694b4b77927ca@mail.gmail.com> I suppose, but not all work places are the same, and I suppose it will depend on what you intend to do. I know that in my workplace, I'll be regularly interacting with administrators, colleagues, students, lab assistants, and members of the community, and especially with colleagues, I'll want to feel like I'm on friendly terms with everyone and can enjoy working with them. I'm working in a Visual Information Processing lab right now, and the professors in the lab hold monthly lab socials for all the profs, grad students and undergrads that work there. they also have retreats holiday activities, and enjoy each others company outside of school and work. The idea is that a lab team made up of people who can enjoy healthy social activity with their colleagues, they'll have a happier, more productive time collaborating on research. On Tue, Mar 23, 2010 at 6:06 PM, Sarah Alawami wrote: > true but you don't want to be distracted from work. so you treat college > like a work place. Ok I'm hanging out at the student union right now but I'm > talking to no one unless I have to get up to get food. lol. > On Mar 23, 2010, at 7:50 AM, Jamie Principato wrote: > > > I consider myself to be very academic-oriented. My career goal is to > become > > a researcher and university professor of cognitive psychology, but f you > > only focus on work and nothing else though, if you don't branch out and > at > > least devote a little effort to extracurricular interactions, how will > you > > develop relationships with future colleagues? > > > > On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 8:29 PM, Sarah Alawami > wrote: > > > >> No in my opinion it will get you distracted from work and work is what > you > >> are there to accomplish. nothing more. I have no time to go out and have > fun > >> now that I'm doing 13 credits. only in the summer or duroing spring > break > >> can I pleasure myself in singing karoque. but college is for work alone > in > >> my opinion even if it is a choir class. > >> On Mar 22, 2010, at 3:43 AM, Sarah Jevnikar wrote: > >> > >>> I disagree with RJ and Sarah. Obviously you're there to get a degree > but > >>> there is so much more to education than that. Learning from lectures > and > >>> texts is such a small portion of what you will learn in life it can't > >> hurt > >>> to expose yourself to a wide range of people and interests while so > many > >>> opportunities are available to you. Maybe you won't like what you learn > >> from > >>> others or you won't make the friends you hoped but putting yourself out > >>> there can only benefit you In the long run. > >>> Respectfully, > >>> Sarah Jevnikar > >>> > >>> -----Original Message----- > >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On > >> Behalf > >>> Of RJ Sandefur > >>> Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:50 AM > >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > >>> > >>> I felt the same way as Sarah does! > >>> ----- Original Message ----- > >>> From: "Sarah Alawami" > >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > >>> > >>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 5:18 PM > >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > >>> > >>> > >>>> I don't socialise but that has nothing to do with my blindness. I > choose > >>>> not to socialise with anyone because I'm there to get my degree and > >> nothing > >>> > >>>> else. I know that sounds cruel but those are my thoughts. > >>>> > >>>> Take care. > >>>> On Mar 21, 2010, at 1:28 PM, Darian Smith wrote: > >>>> > >>>>> Hi list, > >>>>> > >>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming > >>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or > >>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you > >>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a > >>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity as > >>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did > >>>>> people interact with you? > >>>>> Thoughts? > >>>>> Best, > >>>>> Darian > >>>>> -- > >>>>> Darian Smith > >>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth > >>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com > >>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide > teacher > >>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate > >>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your > >>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: > >>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org > >>>>> > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>> nabs-l mailing list > >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > >>>>> nabs-l: > >>>>> > >>> > >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>> nabs-l mailing list > >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > >>>> nabs-l: > >>>> > >>> > >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% > >>> 40gmail.com > >>> > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> nabs-l mailing list > >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > >>> nabs-l: > >>> > >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto > >>> ronto.ca > >>> > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> nabs-l mailing list > >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > >> nabs-l: > >>> > >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> nabs-l mailing list > >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > >> nabs-l: > >> > >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com > >> > > _______________________________________________ > > nabs-l mailing list > > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com > From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Wed Mar 24 04:33:29 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 21:33:29 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? In-Reply-To: <63af025c1003231845q17688afs625694b4b77927ca@mail.gmail.com> References: <409c235c1003211328g71fc37c9n1dc20f289a8b9945@mail.gmail.com> <37F973E5-D64B-4A34-9F28-BDA371D4E9F8@gmail.com> <523374E9A35646DAB0C4BC23E315E11B@hometwxakonvzn> <93DBD489-52E2-476A-BA5A-832236F243BE@gmail.com> <63af025c1003230750t2a8c7549uf505fd910cfda28d@mail.gmail.com> <63af025c1003231845q17688afs625694b4b77927ca@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <409c235c1003232133q78e21d0ftaae38493eddae99f@mail.gmail.com> Maybe it's the californian in me, but I think it's perfectly fine to "play hard" as well as work hard. it's equally important not to "take your eyes off of the ball" or "prize" in so far as to remembering why you are in college. On 3/23/10, Jamie Principato wrote: > I suppose, but not all work places are the same, and I suppose it will > depend on what you intend to do. I know that in my workplace, I'll be > regularly interacting with administrators, colleagues, students, lab > assistants, and members of the community, and especially with colleagues, > I'll want to feel like I'm on friendly terms with everyone and can enjoy > working with them. I'm working in a Visual Information Processing lab right > now, and the professors in the lab hold monthly lab socials for all the > profs, grad students and undergrads that work there. they also have retreats > holiday activities, and enjoy each others company outside of school and > work. The idea is that a lab team made up of people who can enjoy healthy > social activity with their colleagues, they'll have a happier, more > productive time collaborating on research. > > On Tue, Mar 23, 2010 at 6:06 PM, Sarah Alawami wrote: > >> true but you don't want to be distracted from work. so you treat college >> like a work place. Ok I'm hanging out at the student union right now but >> I'm >> talking to no one unless I have to get up to get food. lol. >> On Mar 23, 2010, at 7:50 AM, Jamie Principato wrote: >> >> > I consider myself to be very academic-oriented. My career goal is to >> become >> > a researcher and university professor of cognitive psychology, but f you >> > only focus on work and nothing else though, if you don't branch out and >> at >> > least devote a little effort to extracurricular interactions, how will >> you >> > develop relationships with future colleagues? >> > >> > On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 8:29 PM, Sarah Alawami >> wrote: >> > >> >> No in my opinion it will get you distracted from work and work is what >> you >> >> are there to accomplish. nothing more. I have no time to go out and >> >> have >> fun >> >> now that I'm doing 13 credits. only in the summer or duroing spring >> break >> >> can I pleasure myself in singing karoque. but college is for work alone >> in >> >> my opinion even if it is a choir class. >> >> On Mar 22, 2010, at 3:43 AM, Sarah Jevnikar wrote: >> >> >> >>> I disagree with RJ and Sarah. Obviously you're there to get a degree >> but >> >>> there is so much more to education than that. Learning from lectures >> and >> >>> texts is such a small portion of what you will learn in life it can't >> >> hurt >> >>> to expose yourself to a wide range of people and interests while so >> many >> >>> opportunities are available to you. Maybe you won't like what you >> >>> learn >> >> from >> >>> others or you won't make the friends you hoped but putting yourself >> >>> out >> >>> there can only benefit you In the long run. >> >>> Respectfully, >> >>> Sarah Jevnikar >> >>> >> >>> -----Original Message----- >> >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> >> Behalf >> >>> Of RJ Sandefur >> >>> Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:50 AM >> >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >> >>> >> >>> I felt the same way as Sarah does! >> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >> >>> From: "Sarah Alawami" >> >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >>> >> >>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 5:18 PM >> >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >> >>> >> >>> >> >>>> I don't socialise but that has nothing to do with my blindness. I >> choose >> >>>> not to socialise with anyone because I'm there to get my degree and >> >> nothing >> >>> >> >>>> else. I know that sounds cruel but those are my thoughts. >> >>>> >> >>>> Take care. >> >>>> On Mar 21, 2010, at 1:28 PM, Darian Smith wrote: >> >>>> >> >>>>> Hi list, >> >>>>> >> >>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >> >>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >> >>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you >> >>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >> >>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity >> >>>>> as >> >>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >> >>>>> people interact with you? >> >>>>> Thoughts? >> >>>>> Best, >> >>>>> Darian >> >>>>> -- >> >>>>> Darian Smith >> >>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >> >>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >> >>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide >> teacher >> >>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >> >>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >> >>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >> >>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >> >>>>> >> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >> >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >> >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> >>>>> for >> >>>>> nabs-l: >> >>>>> >> >>> >> >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> _______________________________________________ >> >>>> nabs-l mailing list >> >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> >>>> nabs-l: >> >>>> >> >>> >> >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% >> >>> 40gmail.com >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >> >>> nabs-l mailing list >> >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> >>> nabs-l: >> >>> >> >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto >> >>> ronto.ca >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >> >>> nabs-l mailing list >> >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> >> nabs-l: >> >>> >> >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> nabs-l mailing list >> >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> >> nabs-l: >> >> >> >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com >> >> >> > _______________________________________________ >> > nabs-l mailing list >> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com >> > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Wed Mar 24 04:58:51 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 00:58:51 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? Message-ID: <20100324045851.16792.53455@web1> It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of access to informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a large gap between minorities and their non-minority counterparts. There really is no right way to handle this problem because it affects us all so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left out, it may be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear you. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of clubs or other > school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew for a play, but > I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything other than > professional questions about things of a technical nature. I did my job > well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that if they talked > to me they would offend me or something like that. > Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved in the boy > scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy scouts and life > teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or technical in > nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't know if this is > blindness related, or what. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jamie Principato" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get involved in as >> much >> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz Band, and a >> Youth >> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate and public >> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I couldn't wait >> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups and activities >> to >> choose from. >> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot of...problems...with the >> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went to this high >> school because we were told it offered the most for visually impaired >> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but I'll spare you >> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students at this school >> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, >> avoiding >> activities and student events. I learned shortly after joining Model UN >> and >> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and planning to go to >> a >> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the fact t I joined >> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and that if I was >> going >> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a permission note (no >> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a >> teacher >> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I attend these >> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally unless I sat >> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman stands with my >> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was unnecessary, and we >> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other >> issues, >> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. >> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home school support >> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I took advantage >> of >> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular activities in >> my >> community, even sports (something that never would have flown at that >> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on campus and in >> the >> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing club, a volunteer >> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also try to get the >> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, and make use of >> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been having is that >> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by house recently >> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the evening. The only >> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or get home from >> a >> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you need to get >> out >> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if money is tight >> one >> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside of attending >> class, including attending free activities or events. I guess that's just >> one price of living off campus though. >> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith wrote: >>> Hi list, >>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you >>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity as >>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>> people interact with you? >>> Thoughts? >>> Best, >>> Darian >>> -- >>> Darian Smith >>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Wed Mar 24 05:05:19 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 22:05:19 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] advice In-Reply-To: <003901cacad3$46a2b920$d3e82b60$@org> References: <2fdbeb321003211336w496f9c34gdac167baca20607d@mail.gmail.com> <67A6205E30FF471D9E143596408786AE@Hope> <261E059E01E349DC944D3B1FF4E2DB88@hometwxakonvzn> <2fdbeb321003231357hd02b55dp7a6a3ea6c505cbea@mail.gmail.com> <003901cacad3$46a2b920$d3e82b60$@org> Message-ID: <409c235c1003232205j27cf2826vd5eac72a683c9791@mail.gmail.com> Hi all, Much like Maryann, I've just been reading and thinking. and I find that issues of cane usage and brail reading become rather lively subjects amungst us. while I understand that this string is more so about the first and not the second, I just felt a urge to point out how these matters tend to have you picking sides on something that I feel has no easy answer. I tend to believe that you have a comfort level as it relates to identifying with any part of yourself. This can be concerning gender, sexuality, ethnicity or disability. I feel that it's very important to find your comfort level and be ok with it; otherwise, you run the risk of finding yourself conforming to a standerd that just doesn't feel right for you. As I hinted to earlier in this message, this does not have to be linked to blindness, if you can identify with it, it applies (so I think). I know people who are perfectly fine considering themselves blind, they so happen to use some of the non visual techniques that we have grown to know and use as effortlessly as we breathe, but they may not use a cane all of the time. For those people, I would not be ready to make the judgement that they are in some way hiding their blindness. In the situation that Kathryn poses to us, I think I might keep a cane on hand and use it insituations like this. The reason i would is to possibly save the potential multiple explainations that I would have otherwise had to give. I should close by saying that this is coming from a person who once had rather functional vision and could see well enough to get around just fine with out a cane, should he had wanted to, but chose for himself to use a cane. respectfully, Darian On 3/23/10, Maryann Migliorelli wrote: > Hello, I didn't respond to this for a while but hope that you will consider > this thought. I know plenty of folks who do consider themselves blind but > don't carry a cane openly when they aren't using it. They do, however, keep > one in their bag or purse for convenient use when they do need it. That > being said, they are very comfortable with their blindness and have no > problems asking for visual help when it's needed. If you are comfortable > enough with your blindness and don't wish to carry a cane with you at these > meetings, you might just get comfortable saying, "Hello, I'm (blind, > visually impaired, not seeing well today, pick something that works for you) > and can't read your name tag. Will you please share your information with > me/" > Sometimes we have to ask this question even with the obvious signs > such as canes or guide dogs because people just don't think about it. Let's > face it, we're an anomaly to most people in these situations. Generally > people just take it for granted that everyone there will read their name > tag, and that they will do the same. It's just something to keep in the > back of your mind going in so that you can be conscious of it and get > comfortable asking for the information you want. I've been having to do > this at networking events for years. It does get easier with time and as > you become more comfortable with talking openly about your blindness. > I hope this helps. > Maryann Migliorelli > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From jsorozco at gmail.com Wed Mar 24 13:15:52 2010 From: jsorozco at gmail.com (Joe Orozco) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 09:15:52 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? In-Reply-To: <20100324045851.16792.53455@web1> Message-ID: Jedi, I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or witnessed this behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, could you give examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification to explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be accurate. Joe Orozco "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of access to informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a large gap between minorities and their non-minority counterparts. There really is no right way to handle this problem because it affects us all so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left out, it may be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear you. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of clubs or other > school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew for a play, but > I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything other than > professional questions about things of a technical nature. I did my job > well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that if they talked > to me they would offend me or something like that. > Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved in the boy > scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy scouts and life > teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or technical in > nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't know if this is > blindness related, or what. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jamie Principato" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get involved in as >> much >> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz Band, and a >> Youth >> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate and public >> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I couldn't wait >> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups and activities >> to >> choose from. >> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot of...problems...with the >> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went to this high >> school because we were told it offered the most for visually impaired >> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but I'll spare you >> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students at this school >> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, >> avoiding >> activities and student events. I learned shortly after joining Model UN >> and >> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and planning to go to >> a >> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the fact t I joined >> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and that if I was >> going >> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a permission note (no >> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a >> teacher >> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I attend these >> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally unless I sat >> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman stands with my >> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was unnecessary, and we >> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other >> issues, >> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. >> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home school support >> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I took advantage >> of >> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular activities in >> my >> community, even sports (something that never would have flown at that >> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on campus and in >> the >> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing club, a volunteer >> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also try to get the >> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, and make use of >> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been having is that >> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by house recently >> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the evening. The only >> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or get home from >> a >> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you need to get >> out >> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if money is tight >> one >> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside of attending >> class, including attending free activities or events. I guess that's just >> one price of living off campus though. >> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith wrote: >>> Hi list, >>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you >>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity as >>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>> people interact with you? >>> Thoughts? >>> Best, >>> Darian >>> -- >>> Darian Smith >>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher >>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr dfly%40gmail.com >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% 40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin djedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco %40gmail.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4969 (20100323) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4969 (20100323) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com From brileyp at gmail.com Wed Mar 24 13:35:28 2010 From: brileyp at gmail.com (Briley Pollard) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 08:35:28 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? In-Reply-To: <409c235c1003232133q78e21d0ftaae38493eddae99f@mail.gmail.com> References: <409c235c1003211328g71fc37c9n1dc20f289a8b9945@mail.gmail.com> <37F973E5-D64B-4A34-9F28-BDA371D4E9F8@gmail.com> <523374E9A35646DAB0C4BC23E315E11B@hometwxakonvzn> <93DBD489-52E2-476A-BA5A-832236F243BE@gmail.com> <63af025c1003230750t2a8c7549uf505fd910cfda28d@mail.gmail.com> <63af025c1003231845q17688afs625694b4b77927ca@mail.gmail.com> <409c235c1003232133q78e21d0ftaae38493eddae99f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: College is just as much about the social experience as it is the academic. So much change happens over those 4 years of life, (or in my case a little more), and peers are a big part of that growing process. On Mar 23, 2010, at 11:33 PM, Darian Smith wrote: > Maybe it's the californian in me, but I think it's perfectly fine to > "play hard" as well as work hard. it's equally important not to > "take your eyes off of the ball" or "prize" in so far as to > remembering why you are in college. > > On 3/23/10, Jamie Principato wrote: >> I suppose, but not all work places are the same, and I suppose it will >> depend on what you intend to do. I know that in my workplace, I'll be >> regularly interacting with administrators, colleagues, students, lab >> assistants, and members of the community, and especially with colleagues, >> I'll want to feel like I'm on friendly terms with everyone and can enjoy >> working with them. I'm working in a Visual Information Processing lab right >> now, and the professors in the lab hold monthly lab socials for all the >> profs, grad students and undergrads that work there. they also have retreats >> holiday activities, and enjoy each others company outside of school and >> work. The idea is that a lab team made up of people who can enjoy healthy >> social activity with their colleagues, they'll have a happier, more >> productive time collaborating on research. >> >> On Tue, Mar 23, 2010 at 6:06 PM, Sarah Alawami wrote: >> >>> true but you don't want to be distracted from work. so you treat college >>> like a work place. Ok I'm hanging out at the student union right now but >>> I'm >>> talking to no one unless I have to get up to get food. lol. >>> On Mar 23, 2010, at 7:50 AM, Jamie Principato wrote: >>> >>>> I consider myself to be very academic-oriented. My career goal is to >>> become >>>> a researcher and university professor of cognitive psychology, but f you >>>> only focus on work and nothing else though, if you don't branch out and >>> at >>>> least devote a little effort to extracurricular interactions, how will >>> you >>>> develop relationships with future colleagues? >>>> >>>> On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 8:29 PM, Sarah Alawami >>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> No in my opinion it will get you distracted from work and work is what >>> you >>>>> are there to accomplish. nothing more. I have no time to go out and >>>>> have >>> fun >>>>> now that I'm doing 13 credits. only in the summer or duroing spring >>> break >>>>> can I pleasure myself in singing karoque. but college is for work alone >>> in >>>>> my opinion even if it is a choir class. >>>>> On Mar 22, 2010, at 3:43 AM, Sarah Jevnikar wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> I disagree with RJ and Sarah. Obviously you're there to get a degree >>> but >>>>>> there is so much more to education than that. Learning from lectures >>> and >>>>>> texts is such a small portion of what you will learn in life it can't >>>>> hurt >>>>>> to expose yourself to a wide range of people and interests while so >>> many >>>>>> opportunities are available to you. Maybe you won't like what you >>>>>> learn >>>>> from >>>>>> others or you won't make the friends you hoped but putting yourself >>>>>> out >>>>>> there can only benefit you In the long run. >>>>>> Respectfully, >>>>>> Sarah Jevnikar >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>>>> Behalf >>>>>> Of RJ Sandefur >>>>>> Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:50 AM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>>> >>>>>> I felt the same way as Sarah does! >>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>>> From: "Sarah Alawami" >>>>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 5:18 PM >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> I don't socialise but that has nothing to do with my blindness. I >>> choose >>>>>>> not to socialise with anyone because I'm there to get my degree and >>>>> nothing >>>>>> >>>>>>> else. I know that sounds cruel but those are my thoughts. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Take care. >>>>>>> On Mar 21, 2010, at 1:28 PM, Darian Smith wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hi list, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>>>>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you >>>>>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>>>>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- identity >>>>>>>> as >>>>>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>>>>>> people interact with you? >>>>>>>> Thoughts? >>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>> Darian >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide >>> teacher >>>>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur% >>>>>> 40gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >>>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto >>>>>> ronto.ca >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >>>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >>>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com >>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Darian Smith > Skype: The_Blind_Truth > Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com > The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher > recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate > individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your > help! To Get Involved go to: > www.TeachBlindStudents.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com From brileyp at gmail.com Wed Mar 24 13:46:56 2010 From: brileyp at gmail.com (Briley Pollard) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 08:46:56 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] advice In-Reply-To: <003901cacad3$46a2b920$d3e82b60$@org> References: <2fdbeb321003211336w496f9c34gdac167baca20607d@mail.gmail.com> <67A6205E30FF471D9E143596408786AE@Hope> <261E059E01E349DC944D3B1FF4E2DB88@hometwxakonvzn> <2fdbeb321003231357hd02b55dp7a6a3ea6c505cbea@mail.gmail.com> <003901cacad3$46a2b920$d3e82b60$@org> Message-ID: <01E59C2C-3C36-4B24-BCDC-58C09D9FC985@gmail.com> Let it also be said that the more comfortable you are with yourself and your blindness, the more comfortable others will be around you. I'm not saying you won't run into people who are uncomfortable, but if you seem confident and capable, especially in professional settings, most people will be put at ease. Briley On Mar 23, 2010, at 4:53 PM, Maryann Migliorelli wrote: > Hello, I didn't respond to this for a while but hope that you will consider > this thought. I know plenty of folks who do consider themselves blind but > don't carry a cane openly when they aren't using it. They do, however, keep > one in their bag or purse for convenient use when they do need it. That > being said, they are very comfortable with their blindness and have no > problems asking for visual help when it's needed. If you are comfortable > enough with your blindness and don't wish to carry a cane with you at these > meetings, you might just get comfortable saying, "Hello, I'm (blind, > visually impaired, not seeing well today, pick something that works for you) > and can't read your name tag. Will you please share your information with > me/" > Sometimes we have to ask this question even with the obvious signs > such as canes or guide dogs because people just don't think about it. Let's > face it, we're an anomaly to most people in these situations. Generally > people just take it for granted that everyone there will read their name > tag, and that they will do the same. It's just something to keep in the > back of your mind going in so that you can be conscious of it and get > comfortable asking for the information you want. I've been having to do > this at networking events for years. It does get easier with time and as > you become more comfortable with talking openly about your blindness. > I hope this helps. > Maryann Migliorelli > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Wed Mar 24 16:43:38 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 09:43:38 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] advice In-Reply-To: <01E59C2C-3C36-4B24-BCDC-58C09D9FC985@gmail.com> References: <2fdbeb321003211336w496f9c34gdac167baca20607d@mail.gmail.com> <67A6205E30FF471D9E143596408786AE@Hope> <261E059E01E349DC944D3B1FF4E2DB88@hometwxakonvzn> <2fdbeb321003231357hd02b55dp7a6a3ea6c505cbea@mail.gmail.com> <003901cacad3$46a2b920$d3e82b60$@org> <01E59C2C-3C36-4B24-BCDC-58C09D9FC985@gmail.com> Message-ID: <409c235c1003240943qe5d257h1a2ef2bc17657079@mail.gmail.com> Agreed, Brileyy. When you become comfortable in your identity (however you identify yourself), you certainly are going to feel more comfortable in your own skin and this results in you being more confident. I know I am generalizing this statement, but I think that it's inportant to give this wider context because I feel that as blind students we find ourselves struggling with more than just our view and the public's view of being blind. I think using a cane maybe a good idea in this situation; I know that I would, but it's really up to what you have available to you and your feeling about the situation you are going to be walking into. On 3/24/10, Briley Pollard wrote: > Let it also be said that the more comfortable you are with yourself and your > blindness, the more comfortable others will be around you. I'm not saying > you won't run into people who are uncomfortable, but if you seem confident > and capable, especially in professional settings, most people will be put at > ease. > > Briley > On Mar 23, 2010, at 4:53 PM, Maryann Migliorelli wrote: > >> Hello, I didn't respond to this for a while but hope that you will >> consider >> this thought. I know plenty of folks who do consider themselves blind but >> don't carry a cane openly when they aren't using it. They do, however, >> keep >> one in their bag or purse for convenient use when they do need it. That >> being said, they are very comfortable with their blindness and have no >> problems asking for visual help when it's needed. If you are comfortable >> enough with your blindness and don't wish to carry a cane with you at >> these >> meetings, you might just get comfortable saying, "Hello, I'm (blind, >> visually impaired, not seeing well today, pick something that works for >> you) >> and can't read your name tag. Will you please share your information with >> me/" >> Sometimes we have to ask this question even with the obvious signs >> such as canes or guide dogs because people just don't think about it. >> Let's >> face it, we're an anomaly to most people in these situations. Generally >> people just take it for granted that everyone there will read their name >> tag, and that they will do the same. It's just something to keep in the >> back of your mind going in so that you can be conscious of it and get >> comfortable asking for the information you want. I've been having to do >> this at networking events for years. It does get easier with time and as >> you become more comfortable with talking openly about your blindness. >> I hope this helps. >> Maryann Migliorelli >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From kim at senderogroup.com Wed Mar 24 20:17:26 2010 From: kim at senderogroup.com (Kim Casey) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 13:17:26 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Announcing two brand new Sendero products and the new Sendero GPS 2010 for BrailleNote Message-ID: Announcing two brand new Sendero products and the new Sendero GPS 2010 for BrailleNote More options for independence, March 23, 2010 gui-talk at nfbnet.org, trainer-talk at nfbnet.org 1. With a shake of the iPhone, Sendero GPS LookAround announces the nearest address, cross street, heading and points of interest. LookAround runs on the iPhone 3GS. Positioning is done through a combination of cell towers and GPS along with the iPhone's built in compass. The optional free Voice Over program provides accessibility to the touch-screen. Sendero GPS LookAround is the first in a series of apps planned for the iPhone and is expected to be free or very low cost depending on the features enabled by the time of its release in April. 2. The new Sendero Maps software for the PC will provide the virtual explore capabilities available on the 4 products powered by Sendero GPS version 2010 or later. The full keyboard and power of the PC may sometimes be preferable when researching a location or calculating long routes. These routes and points of interest can be transferred to and from portable Sendero GPS devices. Sendero Maps will be included at no additional charge with the purchase of a new Sendero GPS 2010 for the BrailleNote. There may be a small charge for those upgrading. Sendero Maps version 1 does not yet offer GPS tracking. 3. Not to be upstaged by the new kids on the block, Sendero GPS 2010 for the BrailleNote is packed with new features, maps and points of interest. It is the gold standard for accessible GPS. For a list of features since the last paid upgrade, go to http://senderogroup.com/products/GPS/v2010changes.htm From January 2000 to March 2010, Sendero Group is proud to have developed accessible GPS for six platforms. Since not one size fits all, Sendero will continue to improve current products and to offer new ones based on your user input. To see an entire list of all accessible GPS products, go to http://senderogroup.com/docs/Summary_GPS.doc Contact Sendero Group: http://www.senderogroup.com Toll free phone (US and Canada): 1-888-757-6810 Direct phone: +1 530 757-6800 From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Thu Mar 25 00:51:22 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 20:51:22 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? Message-ID: <20100325005122.15742.45@web1> Joe, The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually becoming a key issue for those who study organizational communication and diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a fancy way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently based on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member of a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by your minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or one of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or maybe it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is controlled by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less likely to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some point and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that for people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or one of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't yet become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to experience this interesting problem at some point. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Jedi, > I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or witnessed this > behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, could you give > examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification to > explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be accurate. > Joe Orozco > "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, > some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org > [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi > Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for > minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in > school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of access to > informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real > obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from > just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a > large gap between minorities and their non-minority counterparts. There > really is no right way to handle this problem because it affects us all > so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left out, it may > be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear you. > Respectfully, > Jedi > Original message: >> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of > clubs or other >> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew > for a play, but >> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything > other than >> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I > did my job >> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that > if they talked >> to me they would offend me or something like that. >> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved in the boy >> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy > scouts and life >> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or > technical in >> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't > know if this is >> blindness related, or what. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Jamie Principato" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get > involved in as >>> much >>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz Band, and a >>> Youth >>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate and public >>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I > couldn't wait >>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups > and activities >>> to >>> choose from. >>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot > of...problems...with the >>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went > to this high >>> school because we were told it offered the most for visually impaired >>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but > I'll spare you >>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students > at this school >>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, >>> avoiding >>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after > joining Model UN >>> and >>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and > planning to go to >>> a >>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the > fact t I joined >>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and > that if I was >>> going >>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a > permission note (no >>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a >>> teacher >>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I attend these >>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally > unless I sat >>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman > stands with my >>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was > unnecessary, and we >>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other >>> issues, >>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. >>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home > school support >>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I > took advantage >>> of >>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular > activities in >>> my >>> community, even sports (something that never would have flown at that >>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on > campus and in >>> the >>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing > club, a volunteer >>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also > try to get the >>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, > and make use of >>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been > having is that >>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by > house recently >>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the > evening. The only >>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or > get home from >>> a >>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you > need to get >>> out >>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if > money is tight >>> one >>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside > of attending >>> class, including attending free activities or events. I > guess that's just >>> one price of living off campus though. >>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith > wrote: >>>> Hi list, >>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you >>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- > identity as >>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>> people interact with you? >>>> Thoughts? >>>> Best, >>>> Darian >>>> -- >>>> Darian Smith >>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a > nationwide teacher >>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your > account info for >>>> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr > dfly%40gmail.com >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% > 40gmail.com >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin > djedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From jsorozco at gmail.com Thu Mar 25 04:14:14 2010 From: jsorozco at gmail.com (Joe Orozco) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 00:14:14 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? In-Reply-To: <20100325005122.15742.45@web1> Message-ID: <70608F40D7CA425E858F24BC415D8E61@Rufus> Interesting. If we're talking straight up blindness, I think we've all experienced a moment or two of feeling out of place in light of the dominant sighted crowd. I certainly experience with each meeting I attend until I shake off the feeling and plunge forward. If we're talking ethnic minority, I can't say I've experienced that before, but I don't know if it's because the feeling is overshadowed by the blindness factor or because I've genuinely never witnessed this behavior. Regardless, what I find interesting about this discussion is that it makes blindness an identity factor. I think the original post asked how we as blind individuals handled campus involvement, when our philosophy claims blindness can be reduced to the level of a nuisance. I know this position does not claim blindness can be eliminated, but it would appear to suggest blindness is irrelevant to one's sense of self. So, rather than ask, "how do you, as a blind person, handle X, Y and Z," shouldn't we be asking how to handle the task in general? Interesting discussion. Joe Orozco "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 8:51 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? Joe, The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually becoming a key issue for those who study organizational communication and diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a fancy way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently based on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member of a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by your minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or one of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or maybe it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is controlled by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less likely to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some point and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that for people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or one of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't yet become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to experience this interesting problem at some point. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Jedi, > I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or witnessed this > behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, could you give > examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification to > explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be accurate. > Joe Orozco > "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, > some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org > [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi > Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for > minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in > school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of access to > informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real > obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from > just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a > large gap between minorities and their non-minority counterparts. There > really is no right way to handle this problem because it affects us all > so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left out, it may > be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear you. > Respectfully, > Jedi > Original message: >> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of > clubs or other >> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew > for a play, but >> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything > other than >> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I > did my job >> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that > if they talked >> to me they would offend me or something like that. >> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved in the boy >> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy > scouts and life >> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or > technical in >> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't > know if this is >> blindness related, or what. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Jamie Principato" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get > involved in as >>> much >>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz Band, and a >>> Youth >>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate and public >>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I > couldn't wait >>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups > and activities >>> to >>> choose from. >>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot > of...problems...with the >>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went > to this high >>> school because we were told it offered the most for visually impaired >>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but > I'll spare you >>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students > at this school >>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, >>> avoiding >>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after > joining Model UN >>> and >>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and > planning to go to >>> a >>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the > fact t I joined >>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and > that if I was >>> going >>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a > permission note (no >>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a >>> teacher >>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I attend these >>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally > unless I sat >>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman > stands with my >>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was > unnecessary, and we >>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other >>> issues, >>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. >>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home > school support >>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I > took advantage >>> of >>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular > activities in >>> my >>> community, even sports (something that never would have flown at that >>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on > campus and in >>> the >>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing > club, a volunteer >>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also > try to get the >>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, > and make use of >>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been > having is that >>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by > house recently >>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the > evening. The only >>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or > get home from >>> a >>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you > need to get >>> out >>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if > money is tight >>> one >>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside > of attending >>> class, including attending free activities or events. I > guess that's just >>> one price of living off campus though. >>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith > wrote: >>>> Hi list, >>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you >>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- > identity as >>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>> people interact with you? >>>> Thoughts? >>>> Best, >>>> Darian >>>> -- >>>> Darian Smith >>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a > nationwide teacher >>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your > account info for >>>> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr > dfly%40gmail.com >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% > 40gmail.com >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin > djedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco %40gmail.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4972 (20100324) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4972 (20100324) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Thu Mar 25 08:08:05 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 04:08:05 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? Message-ID: <20100325080805.13352.99896@web2> Joe, I think it's both. I think we should ask how to handle the task in general, but I think it's also fair to ask how to handle the task of socializing as blind people specifically since we are viewed differently by society than the sighted are. It is my personal view that blindness is a nuisance and an identity. Blindness definitely does inconvenience us especially since the world was not made for our convenience in much the same way as it's not made for the left-handed, but blindness has also transformed itself into a part of our identities since the experiences we have as a result shape our world views in much the same way that ethnicity does. Let me explain my view of identity and blindness a little. Having dark skin in and of itself doesn't shape a person's world view, and neither does having less eyesight than what's considered standard. However, belonging to an ethnic culture does shape one's world view, and so does belonging to the NFB. There has been some argument about whether or not there is a blind culture. the answer is yes and no. There are common factors and experiences that all blind people have, but the NFB is definitely a culture because we have taken-for-granted assumptions and a specific way of communicating those assumptions based on values associated with them. As a result, our world view is changed somewhat in much the same way that the world views of other Americans belonging to other co-cultures are changed. We also have the experience of being a minority to consider, and I doubt people will argue how much being a minority influences things. Put that all together and you have a unique set of experiences that make up one key factor in the shaping of our collective and individual identities. I don't think that's a bad thing at all; it's just something to keep in mind when entering into social situations. Does that make any sense? Probably not, but I'm willing to clarify as needed. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Interesting. If we're talking straight up blindness, I think we've all > experienced a moment or two of feeling out of place in light of the dominant > sighted crowd. I certainly experience with each meeting I attend until I > shake off the feeling and plunge forward. If we're talking ethnic minority, > I can't say I've experienced that before, but I don't know if it's because > the feeling is overshadowed by the blindness factor or because I've > genuinely never witnessed this behavior. > Regardless, what I find interesting about this discussion is that it makes > blindness an identity factor. I think the original post asked how we as > blind individuals handled campus involvement, when our philosophy claims > blindness can be reduced to the level of a nuisance. I know this position > does not claim blindness can be eliminated, but it would appear to suggest > blindness is irrelevant to one's sense of self. So, rather than ask, "how > do you, as a blind person, handle X, Y and Z," shouldn't we be asking how to > handle the task in general? > Interesting discussion. > Joe Orozco > "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, > some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org > [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi > Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 8:51 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > Joe, > The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually becoming > a key issue for those who study organizational communication and > diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a fancy > way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently based > on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member of > a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just > didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by your > minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or one > of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or maybe > it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. > Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is controlled > by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are > rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less likely > to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some point > and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that for > people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or one > of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't yet > become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant > population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to > experience this interesting problem at some point. > Respectfully, > Jedi > Original message: >> Jedi, >> I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or > witnessed this >> behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, > could you give >> examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification to >> explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be > accurate. >> Joe Orozco >> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up > their sleeves, >> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >> It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for >> minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in >> school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of > access to >> informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real >> obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from >> just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a >> large gap between minorities and their non-minority > counterparts. There >> really is no right way to handle this problem because it > affects us all >> so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left > out, it may >> be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear you. >> Respectfully, >> Jedi >> Original message: >>> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of >> clubs or other >>> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew >> for a play, but >>> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything >> other than >>> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I >> did my job >>> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that >> if they talked >>> to me they would offend me or something like that. >>> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved > in the boy >>> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy >> scouts and life >>> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or >> technical in >>> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't >> know if this is >>> blindness related, or what. >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Jamie Principato" >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> >>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get >> involved in as >>>> much >>>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz > Band, and a >>>> Youth >>>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate > and public >>>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I >> couldn't wait >>>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups >> and activities >>>> to >>>> choose from. >>>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot >> of...problems...with the >>>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went >> to this high >>>> school because we were told it offered the most for > visually impaired >>>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but >> I'll spare you >>>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students >> at this school >>>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, >>>> avoiding >>>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after >> joining Model UN >>>> and >>>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and >> planning to go to >>>> a >>>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the >> fact t I joined >>>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and >> that if I was >>>> going >>>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a >> permission note (no >>>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a >>>> teacher >>>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I > attend these >>>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally >> unless I sat >>>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman >> stands with my >>>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was >> unnecessary, and we >>>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other >>>> issues, >>>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. >>>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home >> school support >>>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I >> took advantage >>>> of >>>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular >> activities in >>>> my >>>> community, even sports (something that never would have > flown at that >>>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on >> campus and in >>>> the >>>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing >> club, a volunteer >>>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also >> try to get the >>>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, >> and make use of >>>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been >> having is that >>>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by >> house recently >>>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the >> evening. The only >>>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or >> get home from >>>> a >>>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you >> need to get >>>> out >>>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if >> money is tight >>>> one >>>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside >> of attending >>>> class, including attending free activities or events. I >> guess that's just >>>> one price of living off campus though. >>>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith >> wrote: >>>>> Hi list, >>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new > people? do you >>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- >> identity as >>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>>> people interact with you? >>>>> Thoughts? >>>>> Best, >>>>> Darian >>>>> -- >>>>> Darian Smith >>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a >> nationwide teacher >>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >> account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr >> dfly%40gmail.com >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your > account info for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% >> 40gmail.com >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin >> djedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From aphelps at BISM.org Thu Mar 25 21:09:18 2010 From: aphelps at BISM.org (Amy Phelps) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 17:09:18 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Independence 2010! Message-ID: <144BBD32E57C5045B736FBC8D447D0EC027EAEA3@blindmail.BISM.COM> If you are entering into the 10th, 11th, or 12th grade in the fall and are looking for something fun and exciting to do this summer---consider Independence 2010 . Independence 2010 will include learning to travel independently, independent living skills, assistive technology, Braille, physical fitness, philosophy class, career exploration, and several confidence building activities including attending the 2010 National Convention of the National Federation of the Blind in Dallas, Texas. In addition to learning the skills of blindness, students will have fun learning from successful blind role models and participate in exciting confidence building activities such as playing goalball, attending a summer festival, watching movies under the stars, enjoying the Inner Harbor and Little Italy in Baltimore and exploring Washington DC to name just a few of the thing we will do. So don't delay, sign up today! Warm regards, Amy C. Phelps Amy C. Phelps, CRC, NOMC Director of Rehabilitation Services Blind Industries and Services of Maryland 3345 Washington Blvd Baltimore, MD 21227 Phone: 410-737-2642 Mobile: 410-274-1647 Fax: 410-737-2689 Toll Free: 888-322-4567 E-mail: aphelps at bism.org Web site: www.bism.org "A frog in a well, can only see its piece of the sky" ~Unknown Confidentiality Note: The information contained in this message may be privileged and confidential and protected from disclosure. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by replying to the message and deleting it from your computer. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image001.gif Type: image/gif Size: 4341 bytes Desc: image001.gif URL: From marrie12 at gmail.com Thu Mar 25 23:17:56 2010 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 16:17:56 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? In-Reply-To: <20100325005122.15742.45@web1> References: <20100325005122.15742.45@web1> Message-ID: Yea this colledge does not handle blind people at all well. it's like they think I am a disease not only that but a singing disease. loo. Ok time for dinner now and then choir. Take care all. On Mar 24, 2010, at 5:51 PM, Jedi wrote: > Joe, > > The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually becoming a key issue for those who study organizational communication and diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a fancy way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently based on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member of a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by your minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or one of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or maybe it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is controlled by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less likely to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some point and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that for people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or one of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't yet become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to experience this interesting problem at some point. > > Respectfully, > Jedi > > > Original message: >> Jedi, > >> I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or witnessed this >> behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, could you give >> examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification to >> explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be accurate. > >> Joe Orozco > >> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, >> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > >> It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for >> minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in >> school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of access to >> informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real >> obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from >> just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a >> large gap between minorities and their non-minority counterparts. There >> really is no right way to handle this problem because it affects us all >> so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left out, it may >> be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear you. > >> Respectfully, >> Jedi > > >> Original message: >>> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of >> clubs or other >>> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew >> for a play, but >>> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything >> other than >>> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I >> did my job >>> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that >> if they talked >>> to me they would offend me or something like that. > >>> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved in the boy >>> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy >> scouts and life >>> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or >> technical in >>> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't >> know if this is >>> blindness related, or what. > > >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Jamie Principato" >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> >>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > > >>>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get >> involved in as >>>> much >>>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz Band, and a >>>> Youth >>>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate and public >>>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I >> couldn't wait >>>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups >> and activities >>>> to >>>> choose from. > >>>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot >> of...problems...with the >>>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went >> to this high >>>> school because we were told it offered the most for visually impaired >>>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but >> I'll spare you >>>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students >> at this school >>>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, >>>> avoiding >>>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after >> joining Model UN >>>> and >>>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and >> planning to go to >>>> a >>>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the >> fact t I joined >>>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and >> that if I was >>>> going >>>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a >> permission note (no >>>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a >>>> teacher >>>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I attend these >>>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally >> unless I sat >>>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman >> stands with my >>>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was >> unnecessary, and we >>>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other >>>> issues, >>>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. > >>>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home >> school support >>>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I >> took advantage >>>> of >>>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular >> activities in >>>> my >>>> community, even sports (something that never would have flown at that >>>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on >> campus and in >>>> the >>>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing >> club, a volunteer >>>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also >> try to get the >>>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, >> and make use of >>>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been >> having is that >>>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by >> house recently >>>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the >> evening. The only >>>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or >> get home from >>>> a >>>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you >> need to get >>>> out >>>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if >> money is tight >>>> one >>>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside >> of attending >>>> class, including attending free activities or events. I >> guess that's just >>>> one price of living off campus though. > >>>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith >> wrote: > >>>>> Hi list, > >>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new people? do you >>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- >> identity as >>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>>> people interact with you? >>>>> Thoughts? >>>>> Best, >>>>> Darian >>>>> -- >>>>> Darian Smith >>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a >> nationwide teacher >>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org > >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >> account info for >>>>> nabs-l: > > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr >> dfly%40gmail.com > >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% >> 40gmail.com > > >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for nabs-l: > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin >> djedi%40samobile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com From marrie12 at gmail.com Thu Mar 25 23:21:00 2010 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 16:21:00 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? In-Reply-To: <70608F40D7CA425E858F24BC415D8E61@Rufus> References: <70608F40D7CA425E858F24BC415D8E61@Rufus> Message-ID: <5C6D886E-0CD5-4808-B882-2E6ED747070A@gmail.com> True. Maybe the reason I'm anti social is I have no social skills to begin it I wirhwe talk to much or don't' talk at all and sometimes I come across as rude but I'm so used to beeing int he teaching invironment that I cannot for me get out of it. I'm not making much sense as I am starting to get a bit hungry.. Hehaha. I do know this much I have a harder time socialising with the sighree then with the bind. theer is so much that can be comunicated in silence. so much we can't see. I really enjoy reading these discussions and view points as it makes me think about what I need to work on or not bather working on. Take care all. On Mar 24, 2010, at 9:14 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: > Interesting. If we're talking straight up blindness, I think we've all > experienced a moment or two of feeling out of place in light of the dominant > sighted crowd. I certainly experience with each meeting I attend until I > shake off the feeling and plunge forward. If we're talking ethnic minority, > I can't say I've experienced that before, but I don't know if it's because > the feeling is overshadowed by the blindness factor or because I've > genuinely never witnessed this behavior. > > Regardless, what I find interesting about this discussion is that it makes > blindness an identity factor. I think the original post asked how we as > blind individuals handled campus involvement, when our philosophy claims > blindness can be reduced to the level of a nuisance. I know this position > does not claim blindness can be eliminated, but it would appear to suggest > blindness is irrelevant to one's sense of self. So, rather than ask, "how > do you, as a blind person, handle X, Y and Z," shouldn't we be asking how to > handle the task in general? > > Interesting discussion. > > Joe Orozco > > "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, > some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org > [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi > Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 8:51 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > > Joe, > > The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually becoming > a key issue for those who study organizational communication and > diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a fancy > way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently based > on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member of > a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just > didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by your > minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or one > of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or maybe > it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. > Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is controlled > by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are > rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less likely > to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some point > and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that for > people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or one > of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't yet > become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant > population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to > experience this interesting problem at some point. > > Respectfully, > Jedi > > > Original message: >> Jedi, > >> I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or > witnessed this >> behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, > could you give >> examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification to >> explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be > accurate. > >> Joe Orozco > >> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up > their sleeves, >> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > >> It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for >> minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in >> school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of > access to >> informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real >> obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from >> just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a >> large gap between minorities and their non-minority > counterparts. There >> really is no right way to handle this problem because it > affects us all >> so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left > out, it may >> be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear you. > >> Respectfully, >> Jedi > > >> Original message: >>> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of >> clubs or other >>> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew >> for a play, but >>> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything >> other than >>> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I >> did my job >>> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that >> if they talked >>> to me they would offend me or something like that. > >>> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved > in the boy >>> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy >> scouts and life >>> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or >> technical in >>> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't >> know if this is >>> blindness related, or what. > > >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Jamie Principato" >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> >>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > > >>>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get >> involved in as >>>> much >>>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz > Band, and a >>>> Youth >>>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate > and public >>>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I >> couldn't wait >>>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups >> and activities >>>> to >>>> choose from. > >>>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot >> of...problems...with the >>>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went >> to this high >>>> school because we were told it offered the most for > visually impaired >>>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but >> I'll spare you >>>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students >> at this school >>>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, >>>> avoiding >>>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after >> joining Model UN >>>> and >>>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and >> planning to go to >>>> a >>>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the >> fact t I joined >>>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and >> that if I was >>>> going >>>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a >> permission note (no >>>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a >>>> teacher >>>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I > attend these >>>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally >> unless I sat >>>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman >> stands with my >>>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was >> unnecessary, and we >>>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other >>>> issues, >>>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. > >>>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home >> school support >>>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I >> took advantage >>>> of >>>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular >> activities in >>>> my >>>> community, even sports (something that never would have > flown at that >>>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on >> campus and in >>>> the >>>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing >> club, a volunteer >>>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also >> try to get the >>>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, >> and make use of >>>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been >> having is that >>>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by >> house recently >>>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the >> evening. The only >>>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or >> get home from >>>> a >>>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you >> need to get >>>> out >>>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if >> money is tight >>>> one >>>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside >> of attending >>>> class, including attending free activities or events. I >> guess that's just >>>> one price of living off campus though. > >>>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith >> wrote: > >>>>> Hi list, > >>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new > people? do you >>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- >> identity as >>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>>> people interact with you? >>>>> Thoughts? >>>>> Best, >>>>> Darian >>>>> -- >>>>> Darian Smith >>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a >> nationwide teacher >>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org > >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >> account info for >>>>> nabs-l: > > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr >> dfly%40gmail.com > >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your > account info for >>>> nabs-l: > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% >> 40gmail.com > > >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for nabs-l: > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin >> djedi%40samobile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit > www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco > %40gmail.com > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of > virus signature database 4972 (20100324) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature > database 4972 (20100324) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com From nabs.president at gmail.com Fri Mar 26 01:00:39 2010 From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 20:00:39 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? In-Reply-To: <5C6D886E-0CD5-4808-B882-2E6ED747070A@gmail.com> References: <70608F40D7CA425E858F24BC415D8E61@Rufus> <5C6D886E-0CD5-4808-B882-2E6ED747070A@gmail.com> Message-ID: <85ff10071003251800q61ce064u2e7090bc2c48a5f4@mail.gmail.com> Hi all, A few comments from an amateur social psychologist: There is research showing that members of minority groups (i.e. ethnic minorities) sometimes experience the same kinds of awkward interactions with majority group members that we have discussed as happening to blind people. Specifically, majority group members (i.e. white Americans) sometimes feel awkward when interacting with minority members, especially out of concern that they might accidentally come across as being prejudiced or racist. The result is that the interaction tends to be strained and there is more tension than there should be, and minority group members can get left out as a result of the awkwardness. Of course this doesn't happen to all minority members and certainly many majority members have no problem interacting across race or ethnicity lines, just as plenty of sighted people have no problem befriending, working with or dating blind people. But it is a general tendency. I think the question of whether blindness is an identity or a situation/characteristic is interesting. My hunch is that it depends on who you ask; in other words, blind people can range from being completely disidentified (and often not voluntarily associating with other blind people) to completely identified and highly affiliated (to the point of having no close sighted friends). For low-identifiers, blindness probably feels more like a single characteristic; for high identifiers, blindness may feel like a trait coupled with a social group label. In the NFB, when we talk about "the blind" or "the nation's blind", we are implicitly acknowledging that the blind have a common identity, even if we don't all believe that this common identity or fate is rooted in culture. As part of my Ph.D. training I do intend to do some research investigating whether blindness is a coherent identity and, if it is, whether it has similar effects on people's self-concept and behavior as other identities (i.e. ethnic, religious, etc.) For example, I suspect that the constant messages we get from the public about our inferiority and the devastation of blindness pose unique psychological issues that we contend with, and that it can be difficult to see ourselves as whole, capable beings when our identities as blind people are construed in the public eye as compromised or broken. One final thought: I've found it interesting that many sighted people seem to think of blindness as a condition or trait but don't think of "the blind" as a coherent group with the same rights as racial, ethnic, and other cultural groups. This was apparent in the debate over the movie Blindness. I heard several people (some sighted, some blind) argue that the movie was OK because the people portrayed in it weren't "real blind people"; rather, they were sighted people who went blind as part of the plot. Of course, any of us who were sighted at one time know that people who go blind are still blind people; nevertheless, there appeared to be that distinction in some people's minds. I think this is also why it's hard for us to make civil rights arguments against blatant injustices (i.e. "Treating blacks with this kind of discrimination is unacceptable, and so treating us this way is also unacceptable"). A lot of people just don't get it, or think that treating blind people differently is OK because stereotypes about blindness are somehow more valid than stereotypes about other minority groups. I'm not sure how to bridge that thought gap or how to demonstrate the existence of the common blind identity in situations where we are all affected by the same discriminations or denials of rights. Arielle On 3/25/10, Sarah Alawami wrote: > True. Maybe the reason I'm anti social is I have no social skills to begin > it I wirhwe talk to much or don't' talk at all and sometimes I come across > as rude but I'm so used to beeing int he teaching invironment that I cannot > for me get out of it. I'm not making much sense as I am starting to get a > bit hungry.. Hehaha. I do know this much I have a harder time socialising > with the sighree then with the bind. theer is so much that can be > comunicated in silence. so much we can't see. > > I really enjoy reading these discussions and view points as it makes me > think about what I need to work on or not bather working on. > > Take care all. > On Mar 24, 2010, at 9:14 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: > >> Interesting. If we're talking straight up blindness, I think we've all >> experienced a moment or two of feeling out of place in light of the >> dominant >> sighted crowd. I certainly experience with each meeting I attend until I >> shake off the feeling and plunge forward. If we're talking ethnic >> minority, >> I can't say I've experienced that before, but I don't know if it's because >> the feeling is overshadowed by the blindness factor or because I've >> genuinely never witnessed this behavior. >> >> Regardless, what I find interesting about this discussion is that it makes >> blindness an identity factor. I think the original post asked how we as >> blind individuals handled campus involvement, when our philosophy claims >> blindness can be reduced to the level of a nuisance. I know this position >> does not claim blindness can be eliminated, but it would appear to suggest >> blindness is irrelevant to one's sense of self. So, rather than ask, "how >> do you, as a blind person, handle X, Y and Z," shouldn't we be asking how >> to >> handle the task in general? >> >> Interesting discussion. >> >> Joe Orozco >> >> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, >> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 8:51 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >> >> Joe, >> >> The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually becoming >> a key issue for those who study organizational communication and >> diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a fancy >> way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently based >> on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member of >> a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just >> didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by your >> minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or one >> of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or maybe >> it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. >> Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is controlled >> by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are >> rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less likely >> to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some point >> and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that for >> people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or one >> of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't yet >> become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant >> population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to >> experience this interesting problem at some point. >> >> Respectfully, >> Jedi >> >> >> Original message: >>> Jedi, >> >>> I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or >> witnessed this >>> behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, >> could you give >>> examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification to >>> explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be >> accurate. >> >>> Joe Orozco >> >>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up >> their sleeves, >>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM >>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >> >>> It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for >>> minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in >>> school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of >> access to >>> informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real >>> obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from >>> just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a >>> large gap between minorities and their non-minority >> counterparts. There >>> really is no right way to handle this problem because it >> affects us all >>> so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left >> out, it may >>> be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear you. >> >>> Respectfully, >>> Jedi >> >> >>> Original message: >>>> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of >>> clubs or other >>>> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew >>> for a play, but >>>> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything >>> other than >>>> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I >>> did my job >>>> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that >>> if they talked >>>> to me they would offend me or something like that. >> >>>> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved >> in the boy >>>> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy >>> scouts and life >>>> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or >>> technical in >>>> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't >>> know if this is >>>> blindness related, or what. >> >> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Jamie Principato" >>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>> >>>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >> >> >>>>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get >>> involved in as >>>>> much >>>>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz >> Band, and a >>>>> Youth >>>>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate >> and public >>>>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I >>> couldn't wait >>>>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups >>> and activities >>>>> to >>>>> choose from. >> >>>>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot >>> of...problems...with the >>>>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went >>> to this high >>>>> school because we were told it offered the most for >> visually impaired >>>>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but >>> I'll spare you >>>>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students >>> at this school >>>>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, >>>>> avoiding >>>>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after >>> joining Model UN >>>>> and >>>>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and >>> planning to go to >>>>> a >>>>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the >>> fact t I joined >>>>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and >>> that if I was >>>>> going >>>>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a >>> permission note (no >>>>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a >>>>> teacher >>>>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I >> attend these >>>>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally >>> unless I sat >>>>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman >>> stands with my >>>>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was >>> unnecessary, and we >>>>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other >>>>> issues, >>>>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. >> >>>>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home >>> school support >>>>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I >>> took advantage >>>>> of >>>>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular >>> activities in >>>>> my >>>>> community, even sports (something that never would have >> flown at that >>>>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on >>> campus and in >>>>> the >>>>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing >>> club, a volunteer >>>>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also >>> try to get the >>>>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, >>> and make use of >>>>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been >>> having is that >>>>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by >>> house recently >>>>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the >>> evening. The only >>>>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or >>> get home from >>>>> a >>>>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you >>> need to get >>>>> out >>>>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if >>> money is tight >>>>> one >>>>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside >>> of attending >>>>> class, including attending free activities or events. I >>> guess that's just >>>>> one price of living off campus though. >> >>>>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith >>> wrote: >> >>>>>> Hi list, >> >>>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new >> people? do you >>>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- >>> identity as >>>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>>>> people interact with you? >>>>>> Thoughts? >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> Darian >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a >>> nationwide teacher >>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>> account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >> >> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr >>> dfly%40gmail.com >> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >> account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% >>> 40gmail.com >> >> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>> info for nabs-l: >> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin >>> djedi%40samobile.net >> >> -- >> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco >> %40gmail.com >> >> >> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of >> virus signature database 4972 (20100324) __________ >> >> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >> >> http://www.eset.com >> >> >> >> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >> signature >> database 4972 (20100324) __________ >> >> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >> >> http://www.eset.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com > -- Arielle Silverman President, National Association of Blind Students Phone: 602-502-2255 Email: nabs.president at gmail.com Website: www.nabslink.org From nabs.president at gmail.com Fri Mar 26 01:08:15 2010 From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 20:08:15 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? In-Reply-To: <85ff10071003251800q61ce064u2e7090bc2c48a5f4@mail.gmail.com> References: <70608F40D7CA425E858F24BC415D8E61@Rufus> <5C6D886E-0CD5-4808-B882-2E6ED747070A@gmail.com> <85ff10071003251800q61ce064u2e7090bc2c48a5f4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <85ff10071003251808w1bb79dc8t27a0d69f43ef89c@mail.gmail.com> Hi again, Re-reading the posts thus far, I will add that I agree with Jedi. Blindness itself doesn't constitute the social identity. The identity comes from the social reaction we experience as a result of blindness, and the ways we've developed to respond to that social reaction. I would venture to guess that this is similar to the effects of skin color or biological sex on the development of racial and gender identities. Race and sex are mere characteristics to the extent that they by themselves don't influence how people function, just as blindness by itself doesn't significantly alter or take away from how we function. It's the social expectations associated with race, sex, and disability that shape how those identities form and how they influence people's sense of self. Arielle On 3/25/10, Arielle Silverman wrote: > Hi all, > > A few comments from an amateur social psychologist: > > There is research showing that members of minority groups (i.e. ethnic > minorities) sometimes experience the same kinds of awkward > interactions with majority group members that we have discussed as > happening to blind people. Specifically, majority group members (i.e. > white Americans) sometimes feel awkward when interacting with minority > members, especially out of concern that they might accidentally come > across as being prejudiced or racist. The result is that the > interaction tends to be strained and there is more tension than there > should be, and minority group members can get left out as a result of > the awkwardness. Of course this doesn't happen to all minority members > and certainly many majority members have no problem interacting across > race or ethnicity lines, just as plenty of sighted people have no > problem befriending, working with or dating blind people. But it is a > general tendency. > > I think the question of whether blindness is an identity or a > situation/characteristic is interesting. My hunch is that it depends > on who you ask; in other words, blind people can range from being > completely disidentified (and often not voluntarily associating with > other blind people) to completely identified and highly affiliated (to > the point of having no close sighted friends). For low-identifiers, > blindness probably feels more like a single characteristic; for high > identifiers, blindness may feel like a trait coupled with a social > group label. In the NFB, when we talk about "the blind" or "the > nation's blind", we are implicitly acknowledging that the blind have a > common identity, even if we don't all believe that this common > identity or fate is rooted in culture. > > As part of my Ph.D. training I do intend to do some research > investigating whether blindness is a coherent identity and, if it is, > whether it has similar effects on people's self-concept and behavior > as other identities (i.e. ethnic, religious, etc.) For example, I > suspect that the constant messages we get from the public about our > inferiority and the devastation of blindness pose unique psychological > issues that we contend with, and that it can be difficult to see > ourselves as whole, capable beings when our identities as blind people > are construed in the public eye as compromised or broken. > > One final thought: I've found it interesting that many sighted people > seem to think of blindness as a condition or trait but don't think of > "the blind" as a coherent group with the same rights as racial, > ethnic, and other cultural groups. This was apparent in the debate > over the movie Blindness. I heard several people (some sighted, some > blind) argue that the movie was OK because the people portrayed in it > weren't "real blind people"; rather, they were sighted people who went > blind as part of the plot. Of course, any of us who were sighted at > one time know that people who go blind are still blind people; > nevertheless, there appeared to be that distinction in some people's > minds. I think this is also why it's hard for us to make civil rights > arguments against blatant injustices (i.e. "Treating blacks with this > kind of discrimination is unacceptable, and so treating us this way is > also unacceptable"). A lot of people just don't get it, or think that > treating blind people differently is OK because stereotypes about > blindness are somehow more valid than stereotypes about other minority > groups. I'm not sure how to bridge that thought gap or how to > demonstrate the existence of the common blind identity in situations > where we are all affected by the same discriminations or denials of > rights. > > Arielle > > On 3/25/10, Sarah Alawami wrote: >> True. Maybe the reason I'm anti social is I have no social skills to >> begin >> it I wirhwe talk to much or don't' talk at all and sometimes I come >> across >> as rude but I'm so used to beeing int he teaching invironment that I >> cannot >> for me get out of it. I'm not making much sense as I am starting to get a >> bit hungry.. Hehaha. I do know this much I have a harder time socialising >> with the sighree then with the bind. theer is so much that can be >> comunicated in silence. so much we can't see. >> >> I really enjoy reading these discussions and view points as it makes me >> think about what I need to work on or not bather working on. >> >> Take care all. >> On Mar 24, 2010, at 9:14 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: >> >>> Interesting. If we're talking straight up blindness, I think we've all >>> experienced a moment or two of feeling out of place in light of the >>> dominant >>> sighted crowd. I certainly experience with each meeting I attend until >>> I >>> shake off the feeling and plunge forward. If we're talking ethnic >>> minority, >>> I can't say I've experienced that before, but I don't know if it's >>> because >>> the feeling is overshadowed by the blindness factor or because I've >>> genuinely never witnessed this behavior. >>> >>> Regardless, what I find interesting about this discussion is that it >>> makes >>> blindness an identity factor. I think the original post asked how we as >>> blind individuals handled campus involvement, when our philosophy claims >>> blindness can be reduced to the level of a nuisance. I know this >>> position >>> does not claim blindness can be eliminated, but it would appear to >>> suggest >>> blindness is irrelevant to one's sense of self. So, rather than ask, >>> "how >>> do you, as a blind person, handle X, Y and Z," shouldn't we be asking >>> how >>> to >>> handle the task in general? >>> >>> Interesting discussion. >>> >>> Joe Orozco >>> >>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >>> sleeves, >>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 8:51 PM >>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>> >>> Joe, >>> >>> The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually becoming >>> a key issue for those who study organizational communication and >>> diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a fancy >>> way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently based >>> on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member of >>> a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just >>> didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by your >>> minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or one >>> of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or maybe >>> it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. >>> Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is controlled >>> by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are >>> rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less likely >>> to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some point >>> and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that for >>> people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or one >>> of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't yet >>> become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant >>> population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to >>> experience this interesting problem at some point. >>> >>> Respectfully, >>> Jedi >>> >>> >>> Original message: >>>> Jedi, >>> >>>> I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or >>> witnessed this >>>> behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, >>> could you give >>>> examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification to >>>> explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be >>> accurate. >>> >>>> Joe Orozco >>> >>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up >>> their sleeves, >>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM >>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>> >>>> It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for >>>> minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in >>>> school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of >>> access to >>>> informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real >>>> obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from >>>> just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a >>>> large gap between minorities and their non-minority >>> counterparts. There >>>> really is no right way to handle this problem because it >>> affects us all >>>> so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left >>> out, it may >>>> be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear you. >>> >>>> Respectfully, >>>> Jedi >>> >>> >>>> Original message: >>>>> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of >>>> clubs or other >>>>> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew >>>> for a play, but >>>>> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything >>>> other than >>>>> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I >>>> did my job >>>>> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that >>>> if they talked >>>>> to me they would offend me or something like that. >>> >>>>> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved >>> in the boy >>>>> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy >>>> scouts and life >>>>> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or >>>> technical in >>>>> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't >>>> know if this is >>>>> blindness related, or what. >>> >>> >>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>> From: "Jamie Principato" >>>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>>> >>>>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>> >>> >>>>>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get >>>> involved in as >>>>>> much >>>>>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz >>> Band, and a >>>>>> Youth >>>>>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate >>> and public >>>>>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I >>>> couldn't wait >>>>>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups >>>> and activities >>>>>> to >>>>>> choose from. >>> >>>>>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot >>>> of...problems...with the >>>>>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went >>>> to this high >>>>>> school because we were told it offered the most for >>> visually impaired >>>>>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but >>>> I'll spare you >>>>>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students >>>> at this school >>>>>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, >>>>>> avoiding >>>>>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after >>>> joining Model UN >>>>>> and >>>>>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and >>>> planning to go to >>>>>> a >>>>>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the >>>> fact t I joined >>>>>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and >>>> that if I was >>>>>> going >>>>>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a >>>> permission note (no >>>>>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a >>>>>> teacher >>>>>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I >>> attend these >>>>>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally >>>> unless I sat >>>>>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman >>>> stands with my >>>>>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was >>>> unnecessary, and we >>>>>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other >>>>>> issues, >>>>>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. >>> >>>>>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home >>>> school support >>>>>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I >>>> took advantage >>>>>> of >>>>>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular >>>> activities in >>>>>> my >>>>>> community, even sports (something that never would have >>> flown at that >>>>>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on >>>> campus and in >>>>>> the >>>>>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing >>>> club, a volunteer >>>>>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also >>>> try to get the >>>>>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, >>>> and make use of >>>>>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been >>>> having is that >>>>>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by >>>> house recently >>>>>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the >>>> evening. The only >>>>>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or >>>> get home from >>>>>> a >>>>>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you >>>> need to get >>>>>> out >>>>>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if >>>> money is tight >>>>>> one >>>>>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside >>>> of attending >>>>>> class, including attending free activities or events. I >>>> guess that's just >>>>>> one price of living off campus though. >>> >>>>>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith >>>> wrote: >>> >>>>>>> Hi list, >>> >>>>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>>>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new >>> people? do you >>>>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>>>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- >>>> identity as >>>>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>>>>> people interact with you? >>>>>>> Thoughts? >>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>> Darian >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a >>>> nationwide teacher >>>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>> account info for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>> >>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr >>>> dfly%40gmail.com >>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>> account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% >>>> 40gmail.com >>> >>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>> info for nabs-l: >>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin >>>> djedi%40samobile.net >>> >>> -- >>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>> info for nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco >>> %40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of >>> virus signature database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>> >>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>> >>> http://www.eset.com >>> >>> >>> >>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>> signature >>> database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>> >>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>> >>> http://www.eset.com >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Arielle Silverman > President, National Association of Blind Students > Phone: 602-502-2255 > Email: > nabs.president at gmail.com > Website: > www.nabslink.org > -- Arielle Silverman President, National Association of Blind Students Phone: 602-502-2255 Email: nabs.president at gmail.com Website: www.nabslink.org From mworkman.lists at gmail.com Fri Mar 26 03:29:27 2010 From: mworkman.lists at gmail.com (Marc Workman) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 21:29:27 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity In-Reply-To: <85ff10071003251808w1bb79dc8t27a0d69f43ef89c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I think the issue of blindness constituting identity is definitely very interesting, and I've been thinking about it a bit recently. I believe that blindness does shape our sense of who we are, and this is largely socially influenced, but it's also deeper than that. It's almost certainly true that the challenges, discrimination, exclusion, etc that blind people routinely experience influence our identity. However, and this is where I part somewhat with so called NFB philosophy, I'm not sure that, in the absence of these factors, blindness would be reduced to a mere characteristic, if mere characteristic is supposed to mean something rather trivial and unimportant like hair and eye colour. I definitely think that, in the absence of social and environmental barriers, blind people would be able to flourish as well as anyone else; I don't question that claim, but I think perceiving the world in a unique way, in the way blind people do with little or no sight, is a significant factor in how a person's identity is constituted. Arielle called sex a mere characteristic. As with blindness, if calling it a mere characteristic is supposed to mean that it is as trivial as being 5 foot 6 instead of 5 foot 5, then I don't think it is a mere characteristic. I don't have evidence of this, but I think I would feel differently about my body if I had the ability to grow a human being inside of it. My hunch is that the ability, or lack of ability, to give birth probably affects how one views one's body and thus one's sense of self in a non-trivial way. Similarly, relying heavily on auditory input, developing better memories, perceiving the world with little to no reliance on sight, I think these all affect a person's sense of identity in non-trivial ways, and they don't depend on social factors. Clarification, I'm not trying to suggest that women are defined by their ability to give birth. I'm only saying that to possess that ability might shape how you think about yourself in a way that is more significant than whether you have short or long hair. Best, Marc -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On Behalf Of Arielle Silverman Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 7:08 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? Hi again, Re-reading the posts thus far, I will add that I agree with Jedi. Blindness itself doesn't constitute the social identity. The identity comes from the social reaction we experience as a result of blindness, and the ways we've developed to respond to that social reaction. I would venture to guess that this is similar to the effects of skin color or biological sex on the development of racial and gender identities. Race and sex are mere characteristics to the extent that they by themselves don't influence how people function, just as blindness by itself doesn't significantly alter or take away from how we function. It's the social expectations associated with race, sex, and disability that shape how those identities form and how they influence people's sense of self. Arielle On 3/25/10, Arielle Silverman wrote: > Hi all, > > A few comments from an amateur social psychologist: > > There is research showing that members of minority groups (i.e. ethnic > minorities) sometimes experience the same kinds of awkward > interactions with majority group members that we have discussed as > happening to blind people. Specifically, majority group members (i.e. > white Americans) sometimes feel awkward when interacting with minority > members, especially out of concern that they might accidentally come > across as being prejudiced or racist. The result is that the > interaction tends to be strained and there is more tension than there > should be, and minority group members can get left out as a result of > the awkwardness. Of course this doesn't happen to all minority members > and certainly many majority members have no problem interacting across > race or ethnicity lines, just as plenty of sighted people have no > problem befriending, working with or dating blind people. But it is a > general tendency. > > I think the question of whether blindness is an identity or a > situation/characteristic is interesting. My hunch is that it depends > on who you ask; in other words, blind people can range from being > completely disidentified (and often not voluntarily associating with > other blind people) to completely identified and highly affiliated (to > the point of having no close sighted friends). For low-identifiers, > blindness probably feels more like a single characteristic; for high > identifiers, blindness may feel like a trait coupled with a social > group label. In the NFB, when we talk about "the blind" or "the > nation's blind", we are implicitly acknowledging that the blind have a > common identity, even if we don't all believe that this common > identity or fate is rooted in culture. > > As part of my Ph.D. training I do intend to do some research > investigating whether blindness is a coherent identity and, if it is, > whether it has similar effects on people's self-concept and behavior > as other identities (i.e. ethnic, religious, etc.) For example, I > suspect that the constant messages we get from the public about our > inferiority and the devastation of blindness pose unique psychological > issues that we contend with, and that it can be difficult to see > ourselves as whole, capable beings when our identities as blind people > are construed in the public eye as compromised or broken. > > One final thought: I've found it interesting that many sighted people > seem to think of blindness as a condition or trait but don't think of > "the blind" as a coherent group with the same rights as racial, > ethnic, and other cultural groups. This was apparent in the debate > over the movie Blindness. I heard several people (some sighted, some > blind) argue that the movie was OK because the people portrayed in it > weren't "real blind people"; rather, they were sighted people who went > blind as part of the plot. Of course, any of us who were sighted at > one time know that people who go blind are still blind people; > nevertheless, there appeared to be that distinction in some people's > minds. I think this is also why it's hard for us to make civil rights > arguments against blatant injustices (i.e. "Treating blacks with this > kind of discrimination is unacceptable, and so treating us this way is > also unacceptable"). A lot of people just don't get it, or think that > treating blind people differently is OK because stereotypes about > blindness are somehow more valid than stereotypes about other minority > groups. I'm not sure how to bridge that thought gap or how to > demonstrate the existence of the common blind identity in situations > where we are all affected by the same discriminations or denials of > rights. > > Arielle > > On 3/25/10, Sarah Alawami wrote: >> True. Maybe the reason I'm anti social is I have no social skills to >> begin >> it I wirhwe talk to much or don't' talk at all and sometimes I come >> across >> as rude but I'm so used to beeing int he teaching invironment that I >> cannot >> for me get out of it. I'm not making much sense as I am starting to get a >> bit hungry.. Hehaha. I do know this much I have a harder time socialising >> with the sighree then with the bind. theer is so much that can be >> comunicated in silence. so much we can't see. >> >> I really enjoy reading these discussions and view points as it makes me >> think about what I need to work on or not bather working on. >> >> Take care all. >> On Mar 24, 2010, at 9:14 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: >> >>> Interesting. If we're talking straight up blindness, I think we've all >>> experienced a moment or two of feeling out of place in light of the >>> dominant >>> sighted crowd. I certainly experience with each meeting I attend until >>> I >>> shake off the feeling and plunge forward. If we're talking ethnic >>> minority, >>> I can't say I've experienced that before, but I don't know if it's >>> because >>> the feeling is overshadowed by the blindness factor or because I've >>> genuinely never witnessed this behavior. >>> >>> Regardless, what I find interesting about this discussion is that it >>> makes >>> blindness an identity factor. I think the original post asked how we as >>> blind individuals handled campus involvement, when our philosophy claims >>> blindness can be reduced to the level of a nuisance. I know this >>> position >>> does not claim blindness can be eliminated, but it would appear to >>> suggest >>> blindness is irrelevant to one's sense of self. So, rather than ask, >>> "how >>> do you, as a blind person, handle X, Y and Z," shouldn't we be asking >>> how >>> to >>> handle the task in general? >>> >>> Interesting discussion. >>> >>> Joe Orozco >>> >>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >>> sleeves, >>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 8:51 PM >>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>> >>> Joe, >>> >>> The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually becoming >>> a key issue for those who study organizational communication and >>> diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a fancy >>> way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently based >>> on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member of >>> a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just >>> didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by your >>> minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or one >>> of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or maybe >>> it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. >>> Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is controlled >>> by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are >>> rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less likely >>> to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some point >>> and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that for >>> people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or one >>> of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't yet >>> become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant >>> population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to >>> experience this interesting problem at some point. >>> >>> Respectfully, >>> Jedi >>> >>> >>> Original message: >>>> Jedi, >>> >>>> I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or >>> witnessed this >>>> behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, >>> could you give >>>> examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification to >>>> explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be >>> accurate. >>> >>>> Joe Orozco >>> >>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up >>> their sleeves, >>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM >>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>> >>>> It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for >>>> minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in >>>> school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of >>> access to >>>> informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real >>>> obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from >>>> just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a >>>> large gap between minorities and their non-minority >>> counterparts. There >>>> really is no right way to handle this problem because it >>> affects us all >>>> so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left >>> out, it may >>>> be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear you. >>> >>>> Respectfully, >>>> Jedi >>> >>> >>>> Original message: >>>>> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of >>>> clubs or other >>>>> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew >>>> for a play, but >>>>> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything >>>> other than >>>>> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I >>>> did my job >>>>> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that >>>> if they talked >>>>> to me they would offend me or something like that. >>> >>>>> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved >>> in the boy >>>>> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy >>>> scouts and life >>>>> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or >>>> technical in >>>>> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't >>>> know if this is >>>>> blindness related, or what. >>> >>> >>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>> From: "Jamie Principato" >>>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>>> >>>>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>> >>> >>>>>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get >>>> involved in as >>>>>> much >>>>>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz >>> Band, and a >>>>>> Youth >>>>>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate >>> and public >>>>>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I >>>> couldn't wait >>>>>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups >>>> and activities >>>>>> to >>>>>> choose from. >>> >>>>>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot >>>> of...problems...with the >>>>>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went >>>> to this high >>>>>> school because we were told it offered the most for >>> visually impaired >>>>>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but >>>> I'll spare you >>>>>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students >>>> at this school >>>>>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, >>>>>> avoiding >>>>>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after >>>> joining Model UN >>>>>> and >>>>>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and >>>> planning to go to >>>>>> a >>>>>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the >>>> fact t I joined >>>>>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and >>>> that if I was >>>>>> going >>>>>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a >>>> permission note (no >>>>>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a >>>>>> teacher >>>>>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I >>> attend these >>>>>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally >>>> unless I sat >>>>>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman >>>> stands with my >>>>>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was >>>> unnecessary, and we >>>>>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other >>>>>> issues, >>>>>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. >>> >>>>>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home >>>> school support >>>>>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I >>>> took advantage >>>>>> of >>>>>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular >>>> activities in >>>>>> my >>>>>> community, even sports (something that never would have >>> flown at that >>>>>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on >>>> campus and in >>>>>> the >>>>>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing >>>> club, a volunteer >>>>>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also >>>> try to get the >>>>>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, >>>> and make use of >>>>>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been >>>> having is that >>>>>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by >>>> house recently >>>>>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the >>>> evening. The only >>>>>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or >>>> get home from >>>>>> a >>>>>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you >>>> need to get >>>>>> out >>>>>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if >>>> money is tight >>>>>> one >>>>>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside >>>> of attending >>>>>> class, including attending free activities or events. I >>>> guess that's just >>>>>> one price of living off campus though. >>> >>>>>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith >>>> wrote: >>> >>>>>>> Hi list, >>> >>>>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>>>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new >>> people? do you >>>>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>>>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- >>>> identity as >>>>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>>>>> people interact with you? >>>>>>> Thoughts? >>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>> Darian >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a >>>> nationwide teacher >>>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>> account info for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>> >>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr >>>> dfly%40gmail.com >>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>> account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% >>>> 40gmail.com >>> >>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>> info for nabs-l: >>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin >>>> djedi%40samobile.net >>> >>> -- >>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>> info for nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco >>> %40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of >>> virus signature database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>> >>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>> >>> http://www.eset.com >>> >>> >>> >>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>> signature >>> database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>> >>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>> >>> http://www.eset.com >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gma il.com >> > > > -- > Arielle Silverman > President, National Association of Blind Students > Phone: 602-502-2255 > Email: > nabs.president at gmail.com > Website: > www.nabslink.org > -- Arielle Silverman President, National Association of Blind Students Phone: 602-502-2255 Email: nabs.president at gmail.com Website: www.nabslink.org _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma il.com From dandrews at visi.com Fri Mar 26 04:28:54 2010 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 21:28:54 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? In-Reply-To: <85ff10071003251800q61ce064u2e7090bc2c48a5f4@mail.gmail.com > References: <70608F40D7CA425E858F24BC415D8E61@Rufus> <5C6D886E-0CD5-4808-B882-2E6ED747070A@gmail.com> <85ff10071003251800q61ce064u2e7090bc2c48a5f4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Arrielle, how you feel and identify isn't a constant I think, it depends on the situation, how I feel, what I am doing etc. It will also depend on the kind of work one does, whether or not she is in blindness field etc. Also, How you are treated, in part depends on how you react to them. For example, last week some guy tried insisted on helping me across a street, grabbing my arm etc. I politely but firmly made it clear that he shouldn't touch me without my permission. He got mad, grumbled about ungrateful people etc. If I had played the poor helpless blind guy and accepted his help he would have acted fine towards me. But since I didn't, I was treated like a minority and pushed away. Finally, at some level many people think of us as children-like creatures. We aren't regarded as independent thinking human beings with rights and responsibilities. We are pseudo-children I think. That is why civil rights etc. become a problem. Dave At 06:00 PM 3/25/2010, you wrote: >Hi all, > >A few comments from an amateur social psychologist: > >There is research showing that members of minority groups (i.e. ethnic >minorities) sometimes experience the same kinds of awkward >interactions with majority group members that we have discussed as >happening to blind people. Specifically, majority group members (i.e. >white Americans) sometimes feel awkward when interacting with minority >members, especially out of concern that they might accidentally come >across as being prejudiced or racist. The result is that the >interaction tends to be strained and there is more tension than there >should be, and minority group members can get left out as a result of >the awkwardness. Of course this doesn't happen to all minority members >and certainly many majority members have no problem interacting across >race or ethnicity lines, just as plenty of sighted people have no >problem befriending, working with or dating blind people. But it is a >general tendency. > >I think the question of whether blindness is an identity or a >situation/characteristic is interesting. My hunch is that it depends >on who you ask; in other words, blind people can range from being >completely disidentified (and often not voluntarily associating with >other blind people) to completely identified and highly affiliated (to >the point of having no close sighted friends). For low-identifiers, >blindness probably feels more like a single characteristic; for high >identifiers, blindness may feel like a trait coupled with a social >group label. In the NFB, when we talk about "the blind" or "the >nation's blind", we are implicitly acknowledging that the blind have a >common identity, even if we don't all believe that this common >identity or fate is rooted in culture. > >As part of my Ph.D. training I do intend to do some research >investigating whether blindness is a coherent identity and, if it is, >whether it has similar effects on people's self-concept and behavior >as other identities (i.e. ethnic, religious, etc.) For example, I >suspect that the constant messages we get from the public about our >inferiority and the devastation of blindness pose unique psychological >issues that we contend with, and that it can be difficult to see >ourselves as whole, capable beings when our identities as blind people >are construed in the public eye as compromised or broken. > >One final thought: I've found it interesting that many sighted people >seem to think of blindness as a condition or trait but don't think of >"the blind" as a coherent group with the same rights as racial, >ethnic, and other cultural groups. This was apparent in the debate >over the movie Blindness. I heard several people (some sighted, some >blind) argue that the movie was OK because the people portrayed in it >weren't "real blind people"; rather, they were sighted people who went >blind as part of the plot. Of course, any of us who were sighted at >one time know that people who go blind are still blind people; >nevertheless, there appeared to be that distinction in some people's >minds. I think this is also why it's hard for us to make civil rights >arguments against blatant injustices (i.e. "Treating blacks with this >kind of discrimination is unacceptable, and so treating us this way is >also unacceptable"). A lot of people just don't get it, or think that >treating blind people differently is OK because stereotypes about >blindness are somehow more valid than stereotypes about other minority >groups. I'm not sure how to bridge that thought gap or how to >demonstrate the existence of the common blind identity in situations >where we are all affected by the same discriminations or denials of >rights. > >Arielle > >On 3/25/10, Sarah Alawami wrote: > > True. Maybe the reason I'm anti social is I have no social skills to begin > > it I wirhwe talk to much or don't' talk at all and sometimes I come across > > as rude but I'm so used to beeing int he teaching invironment that I cannot > > for me get out of it. I'm not making much sense as I am starting to get a > > bit hungry.. Hehaha. I do know this much I have a harder time socialising > > with the sighree then with the bind. theer is so much that can be > > comunicated in silence. so much we can't see. > > > > I really enjoy reading these discussions and view points as it makes me > > think about what I need to work on or not bather working on. > > > > Take care all. > > On Mar 24, 2010, at 9:14 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: > > > >> Interesting. If we're talking straight up blindness, I think we've all > >> experienced a moment or two of feeling out of place in light of the > >> dominant > >> sighted crowd. I certainly experience with each meeting I attend until I > >> shake off the feeling and plunge forward. If we're talking ethnic > >> minority, > >> I can't say I've experienced that before, but I don't know if it's because > >> the feeling is overshadowed by the blindness factor or because I've > >> genuinely never witnessed this behavior. > >> > >> Regardless, what I find interesting about this discussion is that it makes > >> blindness an identity factor. I think the original post asked how we as > >> blind individuals handled campus involvement, when our philosophy claims > >> blindness can be reduced to the level of a nuisance. I know this position > >> does not claim blindness can be eliminated, but it would appear to suggest > >> blindness is irrelevant to one's sense of self. So, rather than ask, "how > >> do you, as a blind person, handle X, Y and Z," shouldn't we be asking how > >> to > >> handle the task in general? > >> > >> Interesting discussion. > >> > >> Joe Orozco > >> > >> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, > >> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > >> > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org > >> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi > >> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 8:51 PM > >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > >> > >> Joe, > >> > >> The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually becoming > >> a key issue for those who study organizational communication and > >> diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a fancy > >> way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently based > >> on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member of > >> a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just > >> didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by your > >> minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or one > >> of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or maybe > >> it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. > >> Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is controlled > >> by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are > >> rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less likely > >> to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some point > >> and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that for > >> people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or one > >> of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't yet > >> become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant > >> population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to > >> experience this interesting problem at some point. > >> > >> Respectfully, > >> Jedi > >> > >> > >> Original message: > >>> Jedi, > >> > >>> I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or > >> witnessed this > >>> behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, > >> could you give > >>> examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification to > >>> explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be > >> accurate. > >> > >>> Joe Orozco > >> > >>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up > >> their sleeves, > >>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > >> > >>> -----Original Message----- > >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org > >>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi > >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM > >>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > >> > >>> It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for > >>> minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in > >>> school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of > >> access to > >>> informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real > >>> obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from > >>> just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a > >>> large gap between minorities and their non-minority > >> counterparts. There > >>> really is no right way to handle this problem because it > >> affects us all > >>> so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left > >> out, it may > >>> be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear you. > >> > >>> Respectfully, > >>> Jedi > >> > >> > >>> Original message: > >>>> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of > >>> clubs or other > >>>> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew > >>> for a play, but > >>>> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything > >>> other than > >>>> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I > >>> did my job > >>>> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that > >>> if they talked > >>>> to me they would offend me or something like that. > >> > >>>> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved > >> in the boy > >>>> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy > >>> scouts and life > >>>> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or > >>> technical in > >>>> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't > >>> know if this is > >>>> blindness related, or what. > >> > >> > >>>> ----- Original Message ----- > >>>> From: "Jamie Principato" > >>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > >>>> > >>>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM > >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > >> > >> > >>>>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get > >>> involved in as > >>>>> much > >>>>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz > >> Band, and a > >>>>> Youth > >>>>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate > >> and public > >>>>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I > >>> couldn't wait > >>>>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups > >>> and activities > >>>>> to > >>>>> choose from. > >> > >>>>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot > >>> of...problems...with the > >>>>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went > >>> to this high > >>>>> school because we were told it offered the most for > >> visually impaired > >>>>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but > >>> I'll spare you > >>>>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students > >>> at this school > >>>>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, > >>>>> avoiding > >>>>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after > >>> joining Model UN > >>>>> and > >>>>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and > >>> planning to go to > >>>>> a > >>>>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the > >>> fact t I joined > >>>>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and > >>> that if I was > >>>>> going > >>>>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a > >>> permission note (no > >>>>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a > >>>>> teacher > >>>>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I > >> attend these > >>>>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally > >>> unless I sat > >>>>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman > >>> stands with my > >>>>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was > >>> unnecessary, and we > >>>>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other > >>>>> issues, > >>>>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. > >> > >>>>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home > >>> school support > >>>>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I > >>> took advantage > >>>>> of > >>>>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular > >>> activities in > >>>>> my > >>>>> community, even sports (something that never would have > >> flown at that > >>>>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on > >>> campus and in > >>>>> the > >>>>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing > >>> club, a volunteer > >>>>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also > >>> try to get the > >>>>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, > >>> and make use of > >>>>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been > >>> having is that > >>>>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by > >>> house recently > >>>>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the > >>> evening. The only > >>>>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or > >>> get home from > >>>>> a > >>>>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you > >>> need to get > >>>>> out > >>>>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if > >>> money is tight > >>>>> one > >>>>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside > >>> of attending > >>>>> class, including attending free activities or events. I > >>> guess that's just > >>>>> one price of living off campus though. > >> > >>>>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith > >>> wrote: > >> > >>>>>> Hi list, > >> > >>>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming > >>>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or > >>>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new > >> people? do you > >>>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a > >>>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- > >>> identity as > >>>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did > >>>>>> people interact with you? > >>>>>> Thoughts? > >>>>>> Best, > >>>>>> Darian > >>>>>> -- > >>>>>> Darian Smith > >>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth > >>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com > >>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a > >>> nationwide teacher > >>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate > >>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your > >>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: > >>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org > >> > >>>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list > >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your > >>> account info for > >>>>>> nabs-l: > >> > >> > >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr > >>> dfly%40gmail.com > >> > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>> nabs-l mailing list > >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your > >> account info for > >>>>> nabs-l: > >> > >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% > >>> 40gmail.com > >> > >> > >>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>> nabs-l mailing list > >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > >>> info for nabs-l: > >> > >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin > >>> djedi%40samobile.net > >> > >> -- > >> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit > >> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> nabs-l mailing list > >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > >> info for nabs-l: > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco > >> %40gmail.com > >> > >> > >> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of > >> virus signature database 4972 (20100324) __________ > >> > >> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > >> > >> http://www.eset.com > >> > >> > >> > >> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > >> signature > >> database 4972 (20100324) __________ > >> > >> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > >> > >> http://www.eset.com > >> > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> nabs-l mailing list > >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > >> nabs-l: > >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > nabs-l mailing list > > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > > nabs-l: > > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com > > > > >-- >Arielle Silverman >President, National Association of Blind Students >Phone: 602-502-2255 >Email: >nabs.president at gmail.com >Website: >www.nabslink.org > >_______________________________________________ >nabs-l mailing list >nabs-l at nfbnet.org >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dandrews%40visi.com From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Fri Mar 26 05:57:21 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 01:57:21 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity Message-ID: <20100326055721.17856.60266@web2> Marc, I'm a woman, and I don't see myself differently because I have the ability to give birth, but I do perceive the world based on the fact that sexism in all its forms is still alive and well int he world. As to blindness, I definitely think that we physically perceive the world slightly different than the sighted, but not enough to really warrant saying that blindness fundamentally shifts our world view. Neuroscientists are starting to show that the blind and sighted use the same rules for perceiving the world, we just use different inputs or modalities even though our brains more or less process the information the same way the brains of sighted people do. I think however, that being blind has produced a number of very interesting experiences that we all have in common including a world that is obsessed with perceiving the world visually. I use the word "obsessed" because it's clear that while vision is useful, it's almost like sighted people sometimes go overboard with touchscreens and a lot of flashy and unnecessary graphic material. Add the fact that the NfB as an organization with assumptions and values that shape our blindness lives and even our non-blindness lives, and you've got the making of a cultural identity. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > I think the issue of blindness constituting identity is definitely very > interesting, and I've been thinking about it a bit recently. > I believe that blindness does shape our sense of who we are, and this is > largely socially influenced, but it's also deeper than that. It's almost > certainly true that the challenges, discrimination, exclusion, etc that > blind people routinely experience influence our identity. However, and this > is where I part somewhat with so called NFB philosophy, I'm not sure that, > in the absence of these factors, blindness would be reduced to a mere > characteristic, if mere characteristic is supposed to mean something rather > trivial and unimportant like hair and eye colour. I definitely think that, > in the absence of social and environmental barriers, blind people would be > able to flourish as well as anyone else; I don't question that claim, but I > think perceiving the world in a unique way, in the way blind people do with > little or no sight, is a significant factor in how a person's identity is > constituted. > Arielle called sex a mere characteristic. As with blindness, if calling it > a mere characteristic is supposed to mean that it is as trivial as being 5 > foot 6 instead of 5 foot 5, then I don't think it is a mere characteristic. > I don't have evidence of this, but I think I would feel differently about my > body if I had the ability to grow a human being inside of it. My hunch is > that the ability, or lack of ability, to give birth probably affects how one > views one's body and thus one's sense of self in a non-trivial way. > Similarly, relying heavily on auditory input, developing better memories, > perceiving the world with little to no reliance on sight, I think these all > affect a person's sense of identity in non-trivial ways, and they don't > depend on social factors. > Clarification, I'm not trying to suggest that women are defined by their > ability to give birth. I'm only saying that to possess that ability might > shape how you think about yourself in a way that is more significant than > whether you have short or long hair. > Best, > Marc > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On > Behalf Of Arielle Silverman > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 7:08 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > Hi again, > Re-reading the posts thus far, I will add that I agree with Jedi. > Blindness itself doesn't constitute the social identity. The identity > comes from the social reaction we experience as a result of blindness, > and the ways we've developed to respond to that social reaction. I > would venture to guess that this is similar to the effects of skin > color or biological sex on the development of racial and gender > identities. Race and sex are mere characteristics to the extent that > they by themselves don't influence how people function, just as > blindness by itself doesn't significantly alter or take away from how > we function. It's the social expectations associated with race, sex, > and disability that shape how those identities form and how they > influence people's sense of self. > Arielle > On 3/25/10, Arielle Silverman wrote: >> Hi all, >> A few comments from an amateur social psychologist: >> There is research showing that members of minority groups (i.e. ethnic >> minorities) sometimes experience the same kinds of awkward >> interactions with majority group members that we have discussed as >> happening to blind people. Specifically, majority group members (i.e. >> white Americans) sometimes feel awkward when interacting with minority >> members, especially out of concern that they might accidentally come >> across as being prejudiced or racist. The result is that the >> interaction tends to be strained and there is more tension than there >> should be, and minority group members can get left out as a result of >> the awkwardness. Of course this doesn't happen to all minority members >> and certainly many majority members have no problem interacting across >> race or ethnicity lines, just as plenty of sighted people have no >> problem befriending, working with or dating blind people. But it is a >> general tendency. >> I think the question of whether blindness is an identity or a >> situation/characteristic is interesting. My hunch is that it depends >> on who you ask; in other words, blind people can range from being >> completely disidentified (and often not voluntarily associating with >> other blind people) to completely identified and highly affiliated (to >> the point of having no close sighted friends). For low-identifiers, >> blindness probably feels more like a single characteristic; for high >> identifiers, blindness may feel like a trait coupled with a social >> group label. In the NFB, when we talk about "the blind" or "the >> nation's blind", we are implicitly acknowledging that the blind have a >> common identity, even if we don't all believe that this common >> identity or fate is rooted in culture. >> As part of my Ph.D. training I do intend to do some research >> investigating whether blindness is a coherent identity and, if it is, >> whether it has similar effects on people's self-concept and behavior >> as other identities (i.e. ethnic, religious, etc.) For example, I >> suspect that the constant messages we get from the public about our >> inferiority and the devastation of blindness pose unique psychological >> issues that we contend with, and that it can be difficult to see >> ourselves as whole, capable beings when our identities as blind people >> are construed in the public eye as compromised or broken. >> One final thought: I've found it interesting that many sighted people >> seem to think of blindness as a condition or trait but don't think of >> "the blind" as a coherent group with the same rights as racial, >> ethnic, and other cultural groups. This was apparent in the debate >> over the movie Blindness. I heard several people (some sighted, some >> blind) argue that the movie was OK because the people portrayed in it >> weren't "real blind people"; rather, they were sighted people who went >> blind as part of the plot. Of course, any of us who were sighted at >> one time know that people who go blind are still blind people; >> nevertheless, there appeared to be that distinction in some people's >> minds. I think this is also why it's hard for us to make civil rights >> arguments against blatant injustices (i.e. "Treating blacks with this >> kind of discrimination is unacceptable, and so treating us this way is >> also unacceptable"). A lot of people just don't get it, or think that >> treating blind people differently is OK because stereotypes about >> blindness are somehow more valid than stereotypes about other minority >> groups. I'm not sure how to bridge that thought gap or how to >> demonstrate the existence of the common blind identity in situations >> where we are all affected by the same discriminations or denials of >> rights. >> Arielle >> On 3/25/10, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>> True. Maybe the reason I'm anti social is I have no social skills to >>> begin >>> it I wirhwe talk to much or don't' talk at all and sometimes I come >>> across >>> as rude but I'm so used to beeing int he teaching invironment that I >>> cannot >>> for me get out of it. I'm not making much sense as I am starting to get a >>> bit hungry.. Hehaha. I do know this much I have a harder time socialising >>> with the sighree then with the bind. theer is so much that can be >>> comunicated in silence. so much we can't see. >>> I really enjoy reading these discussions and view points as it makes me >>> think about what I need to work on or not bather working on. >>> Take care all. >>> On Mar 24, 2010, at 9:14 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: >>>> Interesting. If we're talking straight up blindness, I think we've all >>>> experienced a moment or two of feeling out of place in light of the >>>> dominant >>>> sighted crowd. I certainly experience with each meeting I attend until >>>> I >>>> shake off the feeling and plunge forward. If we're talking ethnic >>>> minority, >>>> I can't say I've experienced that before, but I don't know if it's >>>> because >>>> the feeling is overshadowed by the blindness factor or because I've >>>> genuinely never witnessed this behavior. >>>> Regardless, what I find interesting about this discussion is that it >>>> makes >>>> blindness an identity factor. I think the original post asked how we as >>>> blind individuals handled campus involvement, when our philosophy claims >>>> blindness can be reduced to the level of a nuisance. I know this >>>> position >>>> does not claim blindness can be eliminated, but it would appear to >>>> suggest >>>> blindness is irrelevant to one's sense of self. So, rather than ask, >>>> "how >>>> do you, as a blind person, handle X, Y and Z," shouldn't we be asking >>>> how >>>> to >>>> handle the task in general? >>>> Interesting discussion. >>>> Joe Orozco >>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >>>> sleeves, >>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 8:51 PM >>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>> Joe, >>>> The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually becoming >>>> a key issue for those who study organizational communication and >>>> diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a fancy >>>> way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently based >>>> on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member of >>>> a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just >>>> didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by your >>>> minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or one >>>> of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or maybe >>>> it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. >>>> Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is controlled >>>> by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are >>>> rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less likely >>>> to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some point >>>> and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that for >>>> people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or one >>>> of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't yet >>>> become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant >>>> population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to >>>> experience this interesting problem at some point. >>>> Respectfully, >>>> Jedi >>>> Original message: >>>>> Jedi, >>>>> I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or >>>> witnessed this >>>>> behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, >>>> could you give >>>>> examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification to >>>>> explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be >>>> accurate. >>>>> Joe Orozco >>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up >>>> their sleeves, >>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM >>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>> It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for >>>>> minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in >>>>> school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of >>>> access to >>>>> informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real >>>>> obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from >>>>> just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a >>>>> large gap between minorities and their non-minority >>>> counterparts. There >>>>> really is no right way to handle this problem because it >>>> affects us all >>>>> so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left >>>> out, it may >>>>> be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear you. >>>>> Respectfully, >>>>> Jedi >>>>> Original message: >>>>>> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of >>>>> clubs or other >>>>>> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew >>>>> for a play, but >>>>>> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything >>>>> other than >>>>>> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I >>>>> did my job >>>>>> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that >>>>> if they talked >>>>>> to me they would offend me or something like that. >>>>>> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved >>>> in the boy >>>>>> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy >>>>> scouts and life >>>>>> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or >>>>> technical in >>>>>> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't >>>>> know if this is >>>>>> blindness related, or what. >>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>>> From: "Jamie Principato" >>>>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>>>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get >>>>> involved in as >>>>>>> much >>>>>>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz >>>> Band, and a >>>>>>> Youth >>>>>>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate >>>> and public >>>>>>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I >>>>> couldn't wait >>>>>>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups >>>>> and activities >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> choose from. >>>>>>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot >>>>> of...problems...with the >>>>>>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went >>>>> to this high >>>>>>> school because we were told it offered the most for >>>> visually impaired >>>>>>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but >>>>> I'll spare you >>>>>>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students >>>>> at this school >>>>>>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, >>>>>>> avoiding >>>>>>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after >>>>> joining Model UN >>>>>>> and >>>>>>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and >>>>> planning to go to >>>>>>> a >>>>>>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the >>>>> fact t I joined >>>>>>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and >>>>> that if I was >>>>>>> going >>>>>>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a >>>>> permission note (no >>>>>>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a >>>>>>> teacher >>>>>>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I >>>> attend these >>>>>>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally >>>>> unless I sat >>>>>>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman >>>>> stands with my >>>>>>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was >>>>> unnecessary, and we >>>>>>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other >>>>>>> issues, >>>>>>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. >>>>>>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home >>>>> school support >>>>>>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I >>>>> took advantage >>>>>>> of >>>>>>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular >>>>> activities in >>>>>>> my >>>>>>> community, even sports (something that never would have >>>> flown at that >>>>>>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on >>>>> campus and in >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing >>>>> club, a volunteer >>>>>>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also >>>>> try to get the >>>>>>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, >>>>> and make use of >>>>>>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been >>>>> having is that >>>>>>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by >>>>> house recently >>>>>>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the >>>>> evening. The only >>>>>>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or >>>>> get home from >>>>>>> a >>>>>>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you >>>>> need to get >>>>>>> out >>>>>>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if >>>>> money is tight >>>>>>> one >>>>>>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside >>>>> of attending >>>>>>> class, including attending free activities or events. I >>>>> guess that's just >>>>>>> one price of living off campus though. >>>>>>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith >>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> Hi list, >>>>>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>>>>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new >>>> people? do you >>>>>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>>>>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- >>>>> identity as >>>>>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>>>>>> people interact with you? >>>>>>>> Thoughts? >>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>> Darian >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a >>>>> nationwide teacher >>>>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>> account info for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr >>>>> dfly%40gmail.com >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>> account info for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% >>>>> 40gmail.com >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>> info for nabs-l: >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin >>>>> djedi%40samobile.net >>>> -- >>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>> info for nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco >>>> %40gmail.com >>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of >>>> virus signature database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>> http://www.eset.com >>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>>> signature >>>> database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>> http://www.eset.com >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gma > il.com >> -- >> Arielle Silverman >> President, National Association of Blind Students >> Phone: 602-502-2255 >> Email: >> nabs.president at gmail.com >> Website: >> www.nabslink.org > -- > Arielle Silverman > President, National Association of Blind Students > Phone: 602-502-2255 > Email: > nabs.president at gmail.com > Website: > www.nabslink.org > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma > il.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From iamantonio at cox.net Fri Mar 26 13:15:48 2010 From: iamantonio at cox.net (Antonio M. Guimaraes) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 09:15:48 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? References: <70608F40D7CA425E858F24BC415D8E61@Rufus> Message-ID: Joe, It would be unfair to simply ask how one does a thing with no regard to blindness. How do you travel? How do most sighted people travel? So, how one travels as a blind person is relevant. Another example is how you read. In the explanation somewhere you will say, well, as a blind person I read in Braille, or use recorded text, and so on. Antonio Guimaraes If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary works in Braille. Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you. http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169 Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe Orozco" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 12:14 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > Interesting. If we're talking straight up blindness, I think we've all > experienced a moment or two of feeling out of place in light of the > dominant > sighted crowd. I certainly experience with each meeting I attend until I > shake off the feeling and plunge forward. If we're talking ethnic > minority, > I can't say I've experienced that before, but I don't know if it's because > the feeling is overshadowed by the blindness factor or because I've > genuinely never witnessed this behavior. > > Regardless, what I find interesting about this discussion is that it makes > blindness an identity factor. I think the original post asked how we as > blind individuals handled campus involvement, when our philosophy claims > blindness can be reduced to the level of a nuisance. I know this position > does not claim blindness can be eliminated, but it would appear to suggest > blindness is irrelevant to one's sense of self. So, rather than ask, "how > do you, as a blind person, handle X, Y and Z," shouldn't we be asking how > to > handle the task in general? > > Interesting discussion. > > Joe Orozco > > "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, > some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org > [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi > Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 8:51 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > > Joe, > > The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually becoming > a key issue for those who study organizational communication and > diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a fancy > way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently based > on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member of > a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just > didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by your > minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or one > of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or maybe > it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. > Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is controlled > by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are > rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less likely > to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some point > and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that for > people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or one > of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't yet > become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant > population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to > experience this interesting problem at some point. > > Respectfully, > Jedi > > > Original message: >> Jedi, > >> I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or > witnessed this >> behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, > could you give >> examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification to >> explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be > accurate. > >> Joe Orozco > >> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up > their sleeves, >> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > >> It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for >> minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in >> school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of > access to >> informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real >> obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from >> just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a >> large gap between minorities and their non-minority > counterparts. There >> really is no right way to handle this problem because it > affects us all >> so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left > out, it may >> be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear you. > >> Respectfully, >> Jedi > > >> Original message: >>> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of >> clubs or other >>> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew >> for a play, but >>> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything >> other than >>> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I >> did my job >>> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that >> if they talked >>> to me they would offend me or something like that. > >>> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved > in the boy >>> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy >> scouts and life >>> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or >> technical in >>> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't >> know if this is >>> blindness related, or what. > > >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Jamie Principato" >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> >>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > > >>>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get >> involved in as >>>> much >>>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz > Band, and a >>>> Youth >>>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate > and public >>>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I >> couldn't wait >>>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups >> and activities >>>> to >>>> choose from. > >>>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot >> of...problems...with the >>>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went >> to this high >>>> school because we were told it offered the most for > visually impaired >>>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but >> I'll spare you >>>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students >> at this school >>>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, >>>> avoiding >>>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after >> joining Model UN >>>> and >>>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and >> planning to go to >>>> a >>>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the >> fact t I joined >>>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and >> that if I was >>>> going >>>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a >> permission note (no >>>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a >>>> teacher >>>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I > attend these >>>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally >> unless I sat >>>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman >> stands with my >>>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was >> unnecessary, and we >>>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other >>>> issues, >>>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. > >>>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home >> school support >>>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I >> took advantage >>>> of >>>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular >> activities in >>>> my >>>> community, even sports (something that never would have > flown at that >>>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on >> campus and in >>>> the >>>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing >> club, a volunteer >>>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also >> try to get the >>>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, >> and make use of >>>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been >> having is that >>>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by >> house recently >>>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the >> evening. The only >>>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or >> get home from >>>> a >>>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you >> need to get >>>> out >>>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if >> money is tight >>>> one >>>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside >> of attending >>>> class, including attending free activities or events. I >> guess that's just >>>> one price of living off campus though. > >>>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith >> wrote: > >>>>> Hi list, > >>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new > people? do you >>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- >> identity as >>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>>> people interact with you? >>>>> Thoughts? >>>>> Best, >>>>> Darian >>>>> -- >>>>> Darian Smith >>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a >> nationwide teacher >>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org > >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >> account info for >>>>> nabs-l: > > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr >> dfly%40gmail.com > >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your > account info for >>>> nabs-l: > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% >> 40gmail.com > > >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for nabs-l: > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin >> djedi%40samobile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit > www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco > %40gmail.com > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of > virus signature database 4972 (20100324) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature > database 4972 (20100324) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net From iamantonio at cox.net Fri Mar 26 13:40:38 2010 From: iamantonio at cox.net (Antonio M. Guimaraes) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 09:40:38 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity References: Message-ID: <783B076A71C347B0805DC04DD8ECF592@userf9b4fa60eb> Interesting points, Mark. Some times the blind community identifies so much with being blind to the point of doing most things and conducting much of their interactions with other blind people. Some have mentioned during the scholastic socialization discussion that their time is taken up mostly with NFB business, and not much else. While this is important work, the NFB and other blind people exist in a bigger world context, and to exclude ourselves, our activities, and our work from the world is to make blindness more than it needs to be. That said, I am blind, and identify myself as such. Not doing so would consist in denial. My blindness presents challenges, maybe yours doesn't, and I am fighting almost daily to improve my access and participation in the world I want to be a part of. People notice my green eyes every day, but that characteristic does not present challenges. I need to read some of the NFB philosophy articles again to speak with more authority on them, but we some times take these writings as dogma, and take them out of context. I don't think Jernigan was diminishing the meaning of how hard it is to be blind at times. He was some times imagining a perfect world where every blind person has training and opportunity. And therein lies the precondition to normal life as a blind person: training and opportunity. I haven't much where cooking skills are concerned, but I don't have to go back to an NFB-run center to get good training in that regard. In some regards, some training centers are a drama magnet for the residents. As long as I get the training somewhere, and have the opportunity, then I will live that area of life more confidently as a blind person. One can not get all the training necessary for life in a 6 month period, so we keep getting trained in life, and opening the doors for ourselves. Antonio Guimaraes If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary works in Braille. Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you. http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169 Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marc Workman" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 11:29 PM Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity >I think the issue of blindness constituting identity is definitely very > interesting, and I've been thinking about it a bit recently. > > I believe that blindness does shape our sense of who we are, and this is > largely socially influenced, but it's also deeper than that. It's almost > certainly true that the challenges, discrimination, exclusion, etc that > blind people routinely experience influence our identity. However, and > this > is where I part somewhat with so called NFB philosophy, I'm not sure that, > in the absence of these factors, blindness would be reduced to a mere > characteristic, if mere characteristic is supposed to mean something > rather > trivial and unimportant like hair and eye colour. I definitely think > that, > in the absence of social and environmental barriers, blind people would be > able to flourish as well as anyone else; I don't question that claim, but > I > think perceiving the world in a unique way, in the way blind people do > with > little or no sight, is a significant factor in how a person's identity is > constituted. > > Arielle called sex a mere characteristic. As with blindness, if calling > it > a mere characteristic is supposed to mean that it is as trivial as being 5 > foot 6 instead of 5 foot 5, then I don't think it is a mere > characteristic. > I don't have evidence of this, but I think I would feel differently about > my > body if I had the ability to grow a human being inside of it. My hunch is > that the ability, or lack of ability, to give birth probably affects how > one > views one's body and thus one's sense of self in a non-trivial way. > Similarly, relying heavily on auditory input, developing better memories, > perceiving the world with little to no reliance on sight, I think these > all > affect a person's sense of identity in non-trivial ways, and they don't > depend on social factors. > > Clarification, I'm not trying to suggest that women are defined by their > ability to give birth. I'm only saying that to possess that ability might > shape how you think about yourself in a way that is more significant than > whether you have short or long hair. > > Best, > > Marc > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On > Behalf Of Arielle Silverman > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 7:08 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > > > Hi again, > > Re-reading the posts thus far, I will add that I agree with Jedi. > Blindness itself doesn't constitute the social identity. The identity > comes from the social reaction we experience as a result of blindness, > and the ways we've developed to respond to that social reaction. I > would venture to guess that this is similar to the effects of skin > color or biological sex on the development of racial and gender > identities. Race and sex are mere characteristics to the extent that > they by themselves don't influence how people function, just as > blindness by itself doesn't significantly alter or take away from how > we function. It's the social expectations associated with race, sex, > and disability that shape how those identities form and how they > influence people's sense of self. > > Arielle > > > On 3/25/10, Arielle Silverman wrote: >> Hi all, >> >> A few comments from an amateur social psychologist: >> >> There is research showing that members of minority groups (i.e. ethnic >> minorities) sometimes experience the same kinds of awkward >> interactions with majority group members that we have discussed as >> happening to blind people. Specifically, majority group members (i.e. >> white Americans) sometimes feel awkward when interacting with minority >> members, especially out of concern that they might accidentally come >> across as being prejudiced or racist. The result is that the >> interaction tends to be strained and there is more tension than there >> should be, and minority group members can get left out as a result of >> the awkwardness. Of course this doesn't happen to all minority members >> and certainly many majority members have no problem interacting across >> race or ethnicity lines, just as plenty of sighted people have no >> problem befriending, working with or dating blind people. But it is a >> general tendency. >> >> I think the question of whether blindness is an identity or a >> situation/characteristic is interesting. My hunch is that it depends >> on who you ask; in other words, blind people can range from being >> completely disidentified (and often not voluntarily associating with >> other blind people) to completely identified and highly affiliated (to >> the point of having no close sighted friends). For low-identifiers, >> blindness probably feels more like a single characteristic; for high >> identifiers, blindness may feel like a trait coupled with a social >> group label. In the NFB, when we talk about "the blind" or "the >> nation's blind", we are implicitly acknowledging that the blind have a >> common identity, even if we don't all believe that this common >> identity or fate is rooted in culture. >> >> As part of my Ph.D. training I do intend to do some research >> investigating whether blindness is a coherent identity and, if it is, >> whether it has similar effects on people's self-concept and behavior >> as other identities (i.e. ethnic, religious, etc.) For example, I >> suspect that the constant messages we get from the public about our >> inferiority and the devastation of blindness pose unique psychological >> issues that we contend with, and that it can be difficult to see >> ourselves as whole, capable beings when our identities as blind people >> are construed in the public eye as compromised or broken. >> >> One final thought: I've found it interesting that many sighted people >> seem to think of blindness as a condition or trait but don't think of >> "the blind" as a coherent group with the same rights as racial, >> ethnic, and other cultural groups. This was apparent in the debate >> over the movie Blindness. I heard several people (some sighted, some >> blind) argue that the movie was OK because the people portrayed in it >> weren't "real blind people"; rather, they were sighted people who went >> blind as part of the plot. Of course, any of us who were sighted at >> one time know that people who go blind are still blind people; >> nevertheless, there appeared to be that distinction in some people's >> minds. I think this is also why it's hard for us to make civil rights >> arguments against blatant injustices (i.e. "Treating blacks with this >> kind of discrimination is unacceptable, and so treating us this way is >> also unacceptable"). A lot of people just don't get it, or think that >> treating blind people differently is OK because stereotypes about >> blindness are somehow more valid than stereotypes about other minority >> groups. I'm not sure how to bridge that thought gap or how to >> demonstrate the existence of the common blind identity in situations >> where we are all affected by the same discriminations or denials of >> rights. >> >> Arielle >> >> On 3/25/10, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>> True. Maybe the reason I'm anti social is I have no social skills to >>> begin >>> it I wirhwe talk to much or don't' talk at all and sometimes I come >>> across >>> as rude but I'm so used to beeing int he teaching invironment that I >>> cannot >>> for me get out of it. I'm not making much sense as I am starting to get >>> a >>> bit hungry.. Hehaha. I do know this much I have a harder time >>> socialising >>> with the sighree then with the bind. theer is so much that can be >>> comunicated in silence. so much we can't see. >>> >>> I really enjoy reading these discussions and view points as it makes me >>> think about what I need to work on or not bather working on. >>> >>> Take care all. >>> On Mar 24, 2010, at 9:14 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: >>> >>>> Interesting. If we're talking straight up blindness, I think we've all >>>> experienced a moment or two of feeling out of place in light of the >>>> dominant >>>> sighted crowd. I certainly experience with each meeting I attend until >>>> I >>>> shake off the feeling and plunge forward. If we're talking ethnic >>>> minority, >>>> I can't say I've experienced that before, but I don't know if it's >>>> because >>>> the feeling is overshadowed by the blindness factor or because I've >>>> genuinely never witnessed this behavior. >>>> >>>> Regardless, what I find interesting about this discussion is that it >>>> makes >>>> blindness an identity factor. I think the original post asked how we >>>> as >>>> blind individuals handled campus involvement, when our philosophy >>>> claims >>>> blindness can be reduced to the level of a nuisance. I know this >>>> position >>>> does not claim blindness can be eliminated, but it would appear to >>>> suggest >>>> blindness is irrelevant to one's sense of self. So, rather than ask, >>>> "how >>>> do you, as a blind person, handle X, Y and Z," shouldn't we be asking >>>> how >>>> to >>>> handle the task in general? >>>> >>>> Interesting discussion. >>>> >>>> Joe Orozco >>>> >>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >>>> sleeves, >>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 8:51 PM >>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>> >>>> Joe, >>>> >>>> The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually becoming >>>> a key issue for those who study organizational communication and >>>> diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a fancy >>>> way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently based >>>> on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member of >>>> a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just >>>> didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by your >>>> minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or one >>>> of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or maybe >>>> it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. >>>> Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is controlled >>>> by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are >>>> rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less likely >>>> to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some point >>>> and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that for >>>> people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or one >>>> of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't yet >>>> become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant >>>> population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to >>>> experience this interesting problem at some point. >>>> >>>> Respectfully, >>>> Jedi >>>> >>>> >>>> Original message: >>>>> Jedi, >>>> >>>>> I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or >>>> witnessed this >>>>> behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, >>>> could you give >>>>> examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification to >>>>> explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be >>>> accurate. >>>> >>>>> Joe Orozco >>>> >>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up >>>> their sleeves, >>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM >>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>> >>>>> It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for >>>>> minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in >>>>> school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of >>>> access to >>>>> informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real >>>>> obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from >>>>> just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a >>>>> large gap between minorities and their non-minority >>>> counterparts. There >>>>> really is no right way to handle this problem because it >>>> affects us all >>>>> so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left >>>> out, it may >>>>> be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear you. >>>> >>>>> Respectfully, >>>>> Jedi >>>> >>>> >>>>> Original message: >>>>>> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of >>>>> clubs or other >>>>>> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew >>>>> for a play, but >>>>>> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything >>>>> other than >>>>>> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I >>>>> did my job >>>>>> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that >>>>> if they talked >>>>>> to me they would offend me or something like that. >>>> >>>>>> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved >>>> in the boy >>>>>> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy >>>>> scouts and life >>>>>> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or >>>>> technical in >>>>>> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't >>>>> know if this is >>>>>> blindness related, or what. >>>> >>>> >>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>>> From: "Jamie Principato" >>>>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>> >>>> >>>>>>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get >>>>> involved in as >>>>>>> much >>>>>>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz >>>> Band, and a >>>>>>> Youth >>>>>>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate >>>> and public >>>>>>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I >>>>> couldn't wait >>>>>>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups >>>>> and activities >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> choose from. >>>> >>>>>>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot >>>>> of...problems...with the >>>>>>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went >>>>> to this high >>>>>>> school because we were told it offered the most for >>>> visually impaired >>>>>>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but >>>>> I'll spare you >>>>>>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students >>>>> at this school >>>>>>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, >>>>>>> avoiding >>>>>>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after >>>>> joining Model UN >>>>>>> and >>>>>>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and >>>>> planning to go to >>>>>>> a >>>>>>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the >>>>> fact t I joined >>>>>>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and >>>>> that if I was >>>>>>> going >>>>>>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a >>>>> permission note (no >>>>>>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a >>>>>>> teacher >>>>>>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I >>>> attend these >>>>>>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally >>>>> unless I sat >>>>>>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman >>>>> stands with my >>>>>>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was >>>>> unnecessary, and we >>>>>>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other >>>>>>> issues, >>>>>>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. >>>> >>>>>>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home >>>>> school support >>>>>>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I >>>>> took advantage >>>>>>> of >>>>>>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular >>>>> activities in >>>>>>> my >>>>>>> community, even sports (something that never would have >>>> flown at that >>>>>>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on >>>>> campus and in >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing >>>>> club, a volunteer >>>>>>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also >>>>> try to get the >>>>>>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, >>>>> and make use of >>>>>>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been >>>>> having is that >>>>>>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by >>>>> house recently >>>>>>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the >>>>> evening. The only >>>>>>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or >>>>> get home from >>>>>>> a >>>>>>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you >>>>> need to get >>>>>>> out >>>>>>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if >>>>> money is tight >>>>>>> one >>>>>>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside >>>>> of attending >>>>>>> class, including attending free activities or events. I >>>>> guess that's just >>>>>>> one price of living off campus though. >>>> >>>>>>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith >>>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>>>>> Hi list, >>>> >>>>>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>>>>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new >>>> people? do you >>>>>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>>>>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- >>>>> identity as >>>>>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>>>>>> people interact with you? >>>>>>>> Thoughts? >>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>> Darian >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a >>>>> nationwide teacher >>>>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>> account info for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>>> >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr >>>>> dfly%40gmail.com >>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>> account info for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% >>>>> 40gmail.com >>>> >>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>> info for nabs-l: >>>> >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin >>>>> djedi%40samobile.net >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>> info for nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco >>>> %40gmail.com >>>> >>>> >>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of >>>> virus signature database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>>> >>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>> >>>> http://www.eset.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>>> signature >>>> database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>>> >>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>> >>>> http://www.eset.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gma > il.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Arielle Silverman >> President, National Association of Blind Students >> Phone: 602-502-2255 >> Email: >> nabs.president at gmail.com >> Website: >> www.nabslink.org >> > > > -- > Arielle Silverman > President, National Association of Blind Students > Phone: 602-502-2255 > Email: > nabs.president at gmail.com > Website: > www.nabslink.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma > il.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net From mworkman.lists at gmail.com Fri Mar 26 15:14:55 2010 From: mworkman.lists at gmail.com (Marc Workman) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 09:14:55 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity In-Reply-To: <20100326055721.17856.60266@web2> Message-ID: Jedi, I'm not sure it's possible to say that you don't see yourself differently because you have the ability to give birth. I'm only saying that I suspect I would view my body differently if I had that ability. It's not something I'll ever know. But here's another example if that one doesn't satisfy you. If I were a woman, I would probably be 60 pounds lighter and six or seven inches shorter on average. Again, I can't say for sure, but I'm pretty sure that living in the world, in any world, with a body that is 60 pounds lighter and 7 inches shorter would have a non-trivial impact on my sense of self. And here's a blindness example. In my experience, blind people tend to have better memories than the average sighted person. Unless you want to argue that this is only because of social factors, which I admit probably is a factor but not the only factor, then better memories will be around even after all social barriers are removed. I'm pretty sure again that having a better memory that allows me to quickly recall information changes the way I am able to think in a non-trivial way. If I suddenly lost my better memory, even if I didn't need it to get around successfully in the world, it would have an impact on my sense of self. Would I be a completely different person? Probably not, but it would affect my identity more than if I went out and got a haircut tomorrow. Example 2: You say that evidence shows that the brains of blind people more or less process information the same way the brains of sighted people do. I've seen evidence that suggests the contrary, particularly with respect to language processing. There is evidence that some blind people end up using the occipital lobe, the part of the brain normally reserved for visual processing, to conduct language processing. As a result, studies have shown that certain sorts of language processing occur faster among blind people. This seems to me that it could also affect the way I think and my sense of self in a non-trivial way. And it doesn't seem to be entirely social. Any social context that includes an oral language will have the same result. Though I admit that this can be more or less emphasized depending on social factors. Finally, I wonder if some people think there is a danger in acknowledging that blindness can shape our identities even in the absence of harmful social attitudes. I can see the potential danger. If we say that we are different, then others can argue that we should thus be treated differently. So I can understand why it might be better to deny it even if it's true. Alternatively, you could just not think it's true, but I think the examples of better memories and increased language processing abilities, plus others that I'm sure I could come up with if I spent some time researching, suggest that blindness does generally affect the ways in which we are able to think and thus our sense of self in what I keep saying are merely non-trivial ways. Regards, Marc -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On Behalf Of Jedi Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 11:57 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity Marc, I'm a woman, and I don't see myself differently because I have the ability to give birth, but I do perceive the world based on the fact that sexism in all its forms is still alive and well int he world. As to blindness, I definitely think that we physically perceive the world slightly different than the sighted, but not enough to really warrant saying that blindness fundamentally shifts our world view. Neuroscientists are starting to show that the blind and sighted use the same rules for perceiving the world, we just use different inputs or modalities even though our brains more or less process the information the same way the brains of sighted people do. I think however, that being blind has produced a number of very interesting experiences that we all have in common including a world that is obsessed with perceiving the world visually. I use the word "obsessed" because it's clear that while vision is useful, it's almost like sighted people sometimes go overboard with touchscreens and a lot of flashy and unnecessary graphic material. Add the fact that the NfB as an organization with assumptions and values that shape our blindness lives and even our non-blindness lives, and you've got the making of a cultural identity. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > I think the issue of blindness constituting identity is definitely very > interesting, and I've been thinking about it a bit recently. > I believe that blindness does shape our sense of who we are, and this is > largely socially influenced, but it's also deeper than that. It's almost > certainly true that the challenges, discrimination, exclusion, etc that > blind people routinely experience influence our identity. However, and this > is where I part somewhat with so called NFB philosophy, I'm not sure that, > in the absence of these factors, blindness would be reduced to a mere > characteristic, if mere characteristic is supposed to mean something rather > trivial and unimportant like hair and eye colour. I definitely think that, > in the absence of social and environmental barriers, blind people would be > able to flourish as well as anyone else; I don't question that claim, but I > think perceiving the world in a unique way, in the way blind people do with > little or no sight, is a significant factor in how a person's identity is > constituted. > Arielle called sex a mere characteristic. As with blindness, if calling it > a mere characteristic is supposed to mean that it is as trivial as being 5 > foot 6 instead of 5 foot 5, then I don't think it is a mere characteristic. > I don't have evidence of this, but I think I would feel differently about my > body if I had the ability to grow a human being inside of it. My hunch is > that the ability, or lack of ability, to give birth probably affects how one > views one's body and thus one's sense of self in a non-trivial way. > Similarly, relying heavily on auditory input, developing better memories, > perceiving the world with little to no reliance on sight, I think these all > affect a person's sense of identity in non-trivial ways, and they don't > depend on social factors. > Clarification, I'm not trying to suggest that women are defined by their > ability to give birth. I'm only saying that to possess that ability might > shape how you think about yourself in a way that is more significant than > whether you have short or long hair. > Best, > Marc > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On > Behalf Of Arielle Silverman > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 7:08 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > Hi again, > Re-reading the posts thus far, I will add that I agree with Jedi. > Blindness itself doesn't constitute the social identity. The identity > comes from the social reaction we experience as a result of blindness, > and the ways we've developed to respond to that social reaction. I > would venture to guess that this is similar to the effects of skin > color or biological sex on the development of racial and gender > identities. Race and sex are mere characteristics to the extent that > they by themselves don't influence how people function, just as > blindness by itself doesn't significantly alter or take away from how > we function. It's the social expectations associated with race, sex, > and disability that shape how those identities form and how they > influence people's sense of self. > Arielle > On 3/25/10, Arielle Silverman wrote: >> Hi all, >> A few comments from an amateur social psychologist: >> There is research showing that members of minority groups (i.e. ethnic >> minorities) sometimes experience the same kinds of awkward >> interactions with majority group members that we have discussed as >> happening to blind people. Specifically, majority group members (i.e. >> white Americans) sometimes feel awkward when interacting with minority >> members, especially out of concern that they might accidentally come >> across as being prejudiced or racist. The result is that the >> interaction tends to be strained and there is more tension than there >> should be, and minority group members can get left out as a result of >> the awkwardness. Of course this doesn't happen to all minority members >> and certainly many majority members have no problem interacting across >> race or ethnicity lines, just as plenty of sighted people have no >> problem befriending, working with or dating blind people. But it is a >> general tendency. >> I think the question of whether blindness is an identity or a >> situation/characteristic is interesting. My hunch is that it depends >> on who you ask; in other words, blind people can range from being >> completely disidentified (and often not voluntarily associating with >> other blind people) to completely identified and highly affiliated (to >> the point of having no close sighted friends). For low-identifiers, >> blindness probably feels more like a single characteristic; for high >> identifiers, blindness may feel like a trait coupled with a social >> group label. In the NFB, when we talk about "the blind" or "the >> nation's blind", we are implicitly acknowledging that the blind have a >> common identity, even if we don't all believe that this common >> identity or fate is rooted in culture. >> As part of my Ph.D. training I do intend to do some research >> investigating whether blindness is a coherent identity and, if it is, >> whether it has similar effects on people's self-concept and behavior >> as other identities (i.e. ethnic, religious, etc.) For example, I >> suspect that the constant messages we get from the public about our >> inferiority and the devastation of blindness pose unique psychological >> issues that we contend with, and that it can be difficult to see >> ourselves as whole, capable beings when our identities as blind people >> are construed in the public eye as compromised or broken. >> One final thought: I've found it interesting that many sighted people >> seem to think of blindness as a condition or trait but don't think of >> "the blind" as a coherent group with the same rights as racial, >> ethnic, and other cultural groups. This was apparent in the debate >> over the movie Blindness. I heard several people (some sighted, some >> blind) argue that the movie was OK because the people portrayed in it >> weren't "real blind people"; rather, they were sighted people who went >> blind as part of the plot. Of course, any of us who were sighted at >> one time know that people who go blind are still blind people; >> nevertheless, there appeared to be that distinction in some people's >> minds. I think this is also why it's hard for us to make civil rights >> arguments against blatant injustices (i.e. "Treating blacks with this >> kind of discrimination is unacceptable, and so treating us this way is >> also unacceptable"). A lot of people just don't get it, or think that >> treating blind people differently is OK because stereotypes about >> blindness are somehow more valid than stereotypes about other minority >> groups. I'm not sure how to bridge that thought gap or how to >> demonstrate the existence of the common blind identity in situations >> where we are all affected by the same discriminations or denials of >> rights. >> Arielle >> On 3/25/10, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>> True. Maybe the reason I'm anti social is I have no social skills to >>> begin >>> it I wirhwe talk to much or don't' talk at all and sometimes I come >>> across >>> as rude but I'm so used to beeing int he teaching invironment that I >>> cannot >>> for me get out of it. I'm not making much sense as I am starting to get a >>> bit hungry.. Hehaha. I do know this much I have a harder time socialising >>> with the sighree then with the bind. theer is so much that can be >>> comunicated in silence. so much we can't see. >>> I really enjoy reading these discussions and view points as it makes me >>> think about what I need to work on or not bather working on. >>> Take care all. >>> On Mar 24, 2010, at 9:14 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: >>>> Interesting. If we're talking straight up blindness, I think we've all >>>> experienced a moment or two of feeling out of place in light of the >>>> dominant >>>> sighted crowd. I certainly experience with each meeting I attend until >>>> I >>>> shake off the feeling and plunge forward. If we're talking ethnic >>>> minority, >>>> I can't say I've experienced that before, but I don't know if it's >>>> because >>>> the feeling is overshadowed by the blindness factor or because I've >>>> genuinely never witnessed this behavior. >>>> Regardless, what I find interesting about this discussion is that it >>>> makes >>>> blindness an identity factor. I think the original post asked how we as >>>> blind individuals handled campus involvement, when our philosophy claims >>>> blindness can be reduced to the level of a nuisance. I know this >>>> position >>>> does not claim blindness can be eliminated, but it would appear to >>>> suggest >>>> blindness is irrelevant to one's sense of self. So, rather than ask, >>>> "how >>>> do you, as a blind person, handle X, Y and Z," shouldn't we be asking >>>> how >>>> to >>>> handle the task in general? >>>> Interesting discussion. >>>> Joe Orozco >>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >>>> sleeves, >>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 8:51 PM >>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>> Joe, >>>> The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually becoming >>>> a key issue for those who study organizational communication and >>>> diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a fancy >>>> way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently based >>>> on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member of >>>> a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just >>>> didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by your >>>> minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or one >>>> of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or maybe >>>> it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. >>>> Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is controlled >>>> by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are >>>> rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less likely >>>> to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some point >>>> and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that for >>>> people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or one >>>> of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't yet >>>> become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant >>>> population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to >>>> experience this interesting problem at some point. >>>> Respectfully, >>>> Jedi >>>> Original message: >>>>> Jedi, >>>>> I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or >>>> witnessed this >>>>> behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, >>>> could you give >>>>> examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification to >>>>> explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be >>>> accurate. >>>>> Joe Orozco >>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up >>>> their sleeves, >>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM >>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>> It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for >>>>> minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in >>>>> school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of >>>> access to >>>>> informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real >>>>> obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from >>>>> just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a >>>>> large gap between minorities and their non-minority >>>> counterparts. There >>>>> really is no right way to handle this problem because it >>>> affects us all >>>>> so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left >>>> out, it may >>>>> be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear you. >>>>> Respectfully, >>>>> Jedi >>>>> Original message: >>>>>> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of >>>>> clubs or other >>>>>> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew >>>>> for a play, but >>>>>> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything >>>>> other than >>>>>> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I >>>>> did my job >>>>>> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that >>>>> if they talked >>>>>> to me they would offend me or something like that. >>>>>> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved >>>> in the boy >>>>>> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy >>>>> scouts and life >>>>>> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or >>>>> technical in >>>>>> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't >>>>> know if this is >>>>>> blindness related, or what. >>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>>> From: "Jamie Principato" >>>>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>>>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get >>>>> involved in as >>>>>>> much >>>>>>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz >>>> Band, and a >>>>>>> Youth >>>>>>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate >>>> and public >>>>>>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I >>>>> couldn't wait >>>>>>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups >>>>> and activities >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> choose from. >>>>>>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot >>>>> of...problems...with the >>>>>>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went >>>>> to this high >>>>>>> school because we were told it offered the most for >>>> visually impaired >>>>>>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but >>>>> I'll spare you >>>>>>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students >>>>> at this school >>>>>>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, >>>>>>> avoiding >>>>>>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after >>>>> joining Model UN >>>>>>> and >>>>>>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and >>>>> planning to go to >>>>>>> a >>>>>>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the >>>>> fact t I joined >>>>>>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and >>>>> that if I was >>>>>>> going >>>>>>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a >>>>> permission note (no >>>>>>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a >>>>>>> teacher >>>>>>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I >>>> attend these >>>>>>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally >>>>> unless I sat >>>>>>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman >>>>> stands with my >>>>>>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was >>>>> unnecessary, and we >>>>>>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other >>>>>>> issues, >>>>>>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. >>>>>>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home >>>>> school support >>>>>>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I >>>>> took advantage >>>>>>> of >>>>>>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular >>>>> activities in >>>>>>> my >>>>>>> community, even sports (something that never would have >>>> flown at that >>>>>>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on >>>>> campus and in >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing >>>>> club, a volunteer >>>>>>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also >>>>> try to get the >>>>>>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, >>>>> and make use of >>>>>>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been >>>>> having is that >>>>>>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by >>>>> house recently >>>>>>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the >>>>> evening. The only >>>>>>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or >>>>> get home from >>>>>>> a >>>>>>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you >>>>> need to get >>>>>>> out >>>>>>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if >>>>> money is tight >>>>>>> one >>>>>>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside >>>>> of attending >>>>>>> class, including attending free activities or events. I >>>>> guess that's just >>>>>>> one price of living off campus though. >>>>>>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith >>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> Hi list, >>>>>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>>>>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new >>>> people? do you >>>>>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>>>>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- >>>>> identity as >>>>>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>>>>>> people interact with you? >>>>>>>> Thoughts? >>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>> Darian >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a >>>>> nationwide teacher >>>>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>> account info for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr >>>>> dfly%40gmail.com >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>> account info for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% >>>>> 40gmail.com >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>> info for nabs-l: >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin >>>>> djedi%40samobile.net >>>> -- >>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>> info for nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco >>>> %40gmail.com >>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of >>>> virus signature database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>> http://www.eset.com >>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>>> signature >>>> database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>> http://www.eset.com >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gma > il.com >> -- >> Arielle Silverman >> President, National Association of Blind Students >> Phone: 602-502-2255 >> Email: >> nabs.president at gmail.com >> Website: >> www.nabslink.org > -- > Arielle Silverman > President, National Association of Blind Students > Phone: 602-502-2255 > Email: > nabs.president at gmail.com > Website: > www.nabslink.org > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma > il.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo bile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma il.com From brileyp at gmail.com Fri Mar 26 15:09:33 2010 From: brileyp at gmail.com (Briley Pollard) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 10:09:33 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity In-Reply-To: <783B076A71C347B0805DC04DD8ECF592@userf9b4fa60eb> References: <783B076A71C347B0805DC04DD8ECF592@userf9b4fa60eb> Message-ID: You present some interesting and valid points, Antonio. I've always been troubled by the fact that some blind people seem to grab onto that, and hold it as the most important aspect of their identity. Blindness is a part of who I am, and it is important, this I will never deny. I am also a woman, a sister, a musician, a daughter, etc. I am not ashamed of my blindness, but I live in a sighted world, and by cutting myself off from that, I would not only be doing myself a disservice, but the sighted world. Do I have blind friends? Of course I do. Do we share common frustrations due to our common trait? Yes. But I also have sighted friends, and I don't feel any less kinship with them because they can see and I can't. I am saddened by the fact that I have heard many of my blind peers say that they only have blind friends, and they wouldn't know how to go about starting relationships with sighted people. This would be like me as a Christian exclusively associating with only Christians. Is it nice to have friends who share my beliefs? Of course. But it is important to have people in my life with a different perspective. Is it sometimes difficult to integrate ourselves into a world where people may be uncomfortable with us? Yes. But that doesn't mean we should stop trying. Briley On Mar 26, 2010, at 8:40 AM, Antonio M. Guimaraes wrote: > Interesting points, Mark. > > Some times the blind community identifies so much with being blind to the point of doing most things and conducting much of their interactions with other blind people. Some have mentioned during the scholastic socialization discussion that their time is taken up mostly with NFB business, and not much else. > > While this is important work, the NFB and other blind people exist in a bigger world context, and to exclude ourselves, our activities, and our work from the world is to make blindness more than it needs to be. > > That said, I am blind, and identify myself as such. Not doing so would consist in denial. My blindness presents challenges, maybe yours doesn't, and I am fighting almost daily to improve my access and participation in the world I want to be a part of. > > People notice my green eyes every day, but that characteristic does not present challenges. I need to read some of the NFB philosophy articles again to speak with more authority on them, but we some times take these writings as dogma, and take them out of context. I don't think Jernigan was diminishing the meaning of how hard it is to be blind at times. He was some times imagining a perfect world where every blind person has training and opportunity. And therein lies the precondition to normal life as a blind person: training and opportunity. I haven't much where cooking skills are concerned, but I don't have to go back to an NFB-run center to get good training in that regard. In some regards, some training centers are a drama magnet for the residents. > > As long as I get the training somewhere, and have the opportunity, then I will live that area of life more confidently as a blind person. > > One can not get all the training necessary for life in a 6 month period, so we keep getting trained in life, and opening the doors for ourselves. > > Antonio Guimaraes > > If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary works in Braille. > > Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you. > http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169 > Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marc Workman" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 11:29 PM > Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity > > >> I think the issue of blindness constituting identity is definitely very >> interesting, and I've been thinking about it a bit recently. >> >> I believe that blindness does shape our sense of who we are, and this is >> largely socially influenced, but it's also deeper than that. It's almost >> certainly true that the challenges, discrimination, exclusion, etc that >> blind people routinely experience influence our identity. However, and this >> is where I part somewhat with so called NFB philosophy, I'm not sure that, >> in the absence of these factors, blindness would be reduced to a mere >> characteristic, if mere characteristic is supposed to mean something rather >> trivial and unimportant like hair and eye colour. I definitely think that, >> in the absence of social and environmental barriers, blind people would be >> able to flourish as well as anyone else; I don't question that claim, but I >> think perceiving the world in a unique way, in the way blind people do with >> little or no sight, is a significant factor in how a person's identity is >> constituted. >> >> Arielle called sex a mere characteristic. As with blindness, if calling it >> a mere characteristic is supposed to mean that it is as trivial as being 5 >> foot 6 instead of 5 foot 5, then I don't think it is a mere characteristic. >> I don't have evidence of this, but I think I would feel differently about my >> body if I had the ability to grow a human being inside of it. My hunch is >> that the ability, or lack of ability, to give birth probably affects how one >> views one's body and thus one's sense of self in a non-trivial way. >> Similarly, relying heavily on auditory input, developing better memories, >> perceiving the world with little to no reliance on sight, I think these all >> affect a person's sense of identity in non-trivial ways, and they don't >> depend on social factors. >> >> Clarification, I'm not trying to suggest that women are defined by their >> ability to give birth. I'm only saying that to possess that ability might >> shape how you think about yourself in a way that is more significant than >> whether you have short or long hair. >> >> Best, >> >> Marc >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >> Behalf Of Arielle Silverman >> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 7:08 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >> >> >> Hi again, >> >> Re-reading the posts thus far, I will add that I agree with Jedi. >> Blindness itself doesn't constitute the social identity. The identity >> comes from the social reaction we experience as a result of blindness, >> and the ways we've developed to respond to that social reaction. I >> would venture to guess that this is similar to the effects of skin >> color or biological sex on the development of racial and gender >> identities. Race and sex are mere characteristics to the extent that >> they by themselves don't influence how people function, just as >> blindness by itself doesn't significantly alter or take away from how >> we function. It's the social expectations associated with race, sex, >> and disability that shape how those identities form and how they >> influence people's sense of self. >> >> Arielle >> >> >> On 3/25/10, Arielle Silverman wrote: >>> Hi all, >>> >>> A few comments from an amateur social psychologist: >>> >>> There is research showing that members of minority groups (i.e. ethnic >>> minorities) sometimes experience the same kinds of awkward >>> interactions with majority group members that we have discussed as >>> happening to blind people. Specifically, majority group members (i.e. >>> white Americans) sometimes feel awkward when interacting with minority >>> members, especially out of concern that they might accidentally come >>> across as being prejudiced or racist. The result is that the >>> interaction tends to be strained and there is more tension than there >>> should be, and minority group members can get left out as a result of >>> the awkwardness. Of course this doesn't happen to all minority members >>> and certainly many majority members have no problem interacting across >>> race or ethnicity lines, just as plenty of sighted people have no >>> problem befriending, working with or dating blind people. But it is a >>> general tendency. >>> >>> I think the question of whether blindness is an identity or a >>> situation/characteristic is interesting. My hunch is that it depends >>> on who you ask; in other words, blind people can range from being >>> completely disidentified (and often not voluntarily associating with >>> other blind people) to completely identified and highly affiliated (to >>> the point of having no close sighted friends). For low-identifiers, >>> blindness probably feels more like a single characteristic; for high >>> identifiers, blindness may feel like a trait coupled with a social >>> group label. In the NFB, when we talk about "the blind" or "the >>> nation's blind", we are implicitly acknowledging that the blind have a >>> common identity, even if we don't all believe that this common >>> identity or fate is rooted in culture. >>> >>> As part of my Ph.D. training I do intend to do some research >>> investigating whether blindness is a coherent identity and, if it is, >>> whether it has similar effects on people's self-concept and behavior >>> as other identities (i.e. ethnic, religious, etc.) For example, I >>> suspect that the constant messages we get from the public about our >>> inferiority and the devastation of blindness pose unique psychological >>> issues that we contend with, and that it can be difficult to see >>> ourselves as whole, capable beings when our identities as blind people >>> are construed in the public eye as compromised or broken. >>> >>> One final thought: I've found it interesting that many sighted people >>> seem to think of blindness as a condition or trait but don't think of >>> "the blind" as a coherent group with the same rights as racial, >>> ethnic, and other cultural groups. This was apparent in the debate >>> over the movie Blindness. I heard several people (some sighted, some >>> blind) argue that the movie was OK because the people portrayed in it >>> weren't "real blind people"; rather, they were sighted people who went >>> blind as part of the plot. Of course, any of us who were sighted at >>> one time know that people who go blind are still blind people; >>> nevertheless, there appeared to be that distinction in some people's >>> minds. I think this is also why it's hard for us to make civil rights >>> arguments against blatant injustices (i.e. "Treating blacks with this >>> kind of discrimination is unacceptable, and so treating us this way is >>> also unacceptable"). A lot of people just don't get it, or think that >>> treating blind people differently is OK because stereotypes about >>> blindness are somehow more valid than stereotypes about other minority >>> groups. I'm not sure how to bridge that thought gap or how to >>> demonstrate the existence of the common blind identity in situations >>> where we are all affected by the same discriminations or denials of >>> rights. >>> >>> Arielle >>> >>> On 3/25/10, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>>> True. Maybe the reason I'm anti social is I have no social skills to >>>> begin >>>> it I wirhwe talk to much or don't' talk at all and sometimes I come >>>> across >>>> as rude but I'm so used to beeing int he teaching invironment that I >>>> cannot >>>> for me get out of it. I'm not making much sense as I am starting to get a >>>> bit hungry.. Hehaha. I do know this much I have a harder time socialising >>>> with the sighree then with the bind. theer is so much that can be >>>> comunicated in silence. so much we can't see. >>>> >>>> I really enjoy reading these discussions and view points as it makes me >>>> think about what I need to work on or not bather working on. >>>> >>>> Take care all. >>>> On Mar 24, 2010, at 9:14 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: >>>> >>>>> Interesting. If we're talking straight up blindness, I think we've all >>>>> experienced a moment or two of feeling out of place in light of the >>>>> dominant >>>>> sighted crowd. I certainly experience with each meeting I attend until >>>>> I >>>>> shake off the feeling and plunge forward. If we're talking ethnic >>>>> minority, >>>>> I can't say I've experienced that before, but I don't know if it's >>>>> because >>>>> the feeling is overshadowed by the blindness factor or because I've >>>>> genuinely never witnessed this behavior. >>>>> >>>>> Regardless, what I find interesting about this discussion is that it >>>>> makes >>>>> blindness an identity factor. I think the original post asked how we as >>>>> blind individuals handled campus involvement, when our philosophy claims >>>>> blindness can be reduced to the level of a nuisance. I know this >>>>> position >>>>> does not claim blindness can be eliminated, but it would appear to >>>>> suggest >>>>> blindness is irrelevant to one's sense of self. So, rather than ask, >>>>> "how >>>>> do you, as a blind person, handle X, Y and Z," shouldn't we be asking >>>>> how >>>>> to >>>>> handle the task in general? >>>>> >>>>> Interesting discussion. >>>>> >>>>> Joe Orozco >>>>> >>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >>>>> sleeves, >>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 8:51 PM >>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>> >>>>> Joe, >>>>> >>>>> The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually becoming >>>>> a key issue for those who study organizational communication and >>>>> diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a fancy >>>>> way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently based >>>>> on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member of >>>>> a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just >>>>> didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by your >>>>> minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or one >>>>> of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or maybe >>>>> it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. >>>>> Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is controlled >>>>> by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are >>>>> rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less likely >>>>> to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some point >>>>> and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that for >>>>> people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or one >>>>> of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't yet >>>>> become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant >>>>> population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to >>>>> experience this interesting problem at some point. >>>>> >>>>> Respectfully, >>>>> Jedi >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Original message: >>>>>> Jedi, >>>>> >>>>>> I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or >>>>> witnessed this >>>>>> behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, >>>>> could you give >>>>>> examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification to >>>>>> explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be >>>>> accurate. >>>>> >>>>>> Joe Orozco >>>>> >>>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up >>>>> their sleeves, >>>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM >>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>> >>>>>> It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for >>>>>> minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in >>>>>> school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of >>>>> access to >>>>>> informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real >>>>>> obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from >>>>>> just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a >>>>>> large gap between minorities and their non-minority >>>>> counterparts. There >>>>>> really is no right way to handle this problem because it >>>>> affects us all >>>>>> so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left >>>>> out, it may >>>>>> be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear you. >>>>> >>>>>> Respectfully, >>>>>> Jedi >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> Original message: >>>>>>> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of >>>>>> clubs or other >>>>>>> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew >>>>>> for a play, but >>>>>>> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything >>>>>> other than >>>>>>> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I >>>>>> did my job >>>>>>> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that >>>>>> if they talked >>>>>>> to me they would offend me or something like that. >>>>> >>>>>>> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved >>>>> in the boy >>>>>>> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy >>>>>> scouts and life >>>>>>> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or >>>>>> technical in >>>>>>> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't >>>>>> know if this is >>>>>>> blindness related, or what. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>>>> From: "Jamie Principato" >>>>>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>>>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get >>>>>> involved in as >>>>>>>> much >>>>>>>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz >>>>> Band, and a >>>>>>>> Youth >>>>>>>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate >>>>> and public >>>>>>>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I >>>>>> couldn't wait >>>>>>>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups >>>>>> and activities >>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>> choose from. >>>>> >>>>>>>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot >>>>>> of...problems...with the >>>>>>>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went >>>>>> to this high >>>>>>>> school because we were told it offered the most for >>>>> visually impaired >>>>>>>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but >>>>>> I'll spare you >>>>>>>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students >>>>>> at this school >>>>>>>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, >>>>>>>> avoiding >>>>>>>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after >>>>>> joining Model UN >>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and >>>>>> planning to go to >>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the >>>>>> fact t I joined >>>>>>>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and >>>>>> that if I was >>>>>>>> going >>>>>>>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a >>>>>> permission note (no >>>>>>>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a >>>>>>>> teacher >>>>>>>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I >>>>> attend these >>>>>>>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally >>>>>> unless I sat >>>>>>>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman >>>>>> stands with my >>>>>>>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was >>>>>> unnecessary, and we >>>>>>>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other >>>>>>>> issues, >>>>>>>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. >>>>> >>>>>>>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home >>>>>> school support >>>>>>>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I >>>>>> took advantage >>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular >>>>>> activities in >>>>>>>> my >>>>>>>> community, even sports (something that never would have >>>>> flown at that >>>>>>>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on >>>>>> campus and in >>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing >>>>>> club, a volunteer >>>>>>>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also >>>>>> try to get the >>>>>>>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, >>>>>> and make use of >>>>>>>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been >>>>>> having is that >>>>>>>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by >>>>>> house recently >>>>>>>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the >>>>>> evening. The only >>>>>>>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or >>>>>> get home from >>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you >>>>>> need to get >>>>>>>> out >>>>>>>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if >>>>>> money is tight >>>>>>>> one >>>>>>>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside >>>>>> of attending >>>>>>>> class, including attending free activities or events. I >>>>>> guess that's just >>>>>>>> one price of living off campus though. >>>>> >>>>>>>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith >>>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hi list, >>>>> >>>>>>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>>>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>>>>>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new >>>>> people? do you >>>>>>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>>>>>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- >>>>>> identity as >>>>>>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>>>>>>> people interact with you? >>>>>>>>> Thoughts? >>>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>>> Darian >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a >>>>>> nationwide teacher >>>>>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>>> account info for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr >>>>>> dfly%40gmail.com >>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>> account info for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% >>>>>> 40gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>> info for nabs-l: >>>>> >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin >>>>>> djedi%40samobile.net >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>> info for nabs-l: >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco >>>>> %40gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of >>>>> virus signature database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>>>> >>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>>> >>>>> http://www.eset.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>>>> signature >>>>> database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>>>> >>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>>> >>>>> http://www.eset.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gma >> il.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Arielle Silverman >>> President, National Association of Blind Students >>> Phone: 602-502-2255 >>> Email: >>> nabs.president at gmail.com >>> Website: >>> www.nabslink.org >>> >> >> >> -- >> Arielle Silverman >> President, National Association of Blind Students >> Phone: 602-502-2255 >> Email: >> nabs.president at gmail.com >> Website: >> www.nabslink.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >> il.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Fri Mar 26 17:01:05 2010 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 10:01:05 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity In-Reply-To: References: <783B076A71C347B0805DC04DD8ECF592@userf9b4fa60eb> Message-ID: <409c235c1003261001x4b52b152wd264596edfea46f3@mail.gmail.com> i see it being true that some blind people find it easier to stay within the bubble of blindness. I would agree that this is not terribly healthy, and that there are other parts of us as human beings that need to be nurtured. I would also suggest that blind people arn't the only such people that do it; that everyone who can identify with something does this and has to try to be a little more aware that in fact they may be clinging onto one part of themselves ( the part that identifies witha religion, a passtime, an ethnic identity). I think it's a good idea to be in touch withthe one's blindness and explore it, as well as find people to support that growth and exploration )hince the NFB and the oppertunities it gives us as blind people). I also think that it is equally good that we explore the other parts of us that we have as a part of us. While it is true that we may have special interest groups and divisions in the NFB, it is also great to be a part of things in the community. Being a part of groups, programs, oppertunities give us the chance to be apart of the greater world around us and build our confidence and strenthin the belief that we as blind people have the ability to live our lives as members of a society full of great deversity. Just my thoughts, Darian On 3/26/10, Briley Pollard wrote: > You present some interesting and valid points, Antonio. I've always been > troubled by the fact that some blind people seem to grab onto that, and hold > it as the most important aspect of their identity. Blindness is a part of > who I am, and it is important, this I will never deny. I am also a woman, a > sister, a musician, a daughter, etc. I am not ashamed of my blindness, but I > live in a sighted world, and by cutting myself off from that, I would not > only be doing myself a disservice, but the sighted world. Do I have blind > friends? Of course I do. Do we share common frustrations due to our common > trait? Yes. But I also have sighted friends, and I don't feel any less > kinship with them because they can see and I can't. > > I am saddened by the fact that I have heard many of my blind peers say that > they only have blind friends, and they wouldn't know how to go about > starting relationships with sighted people. This would be like me as a > Christian exclusively associating with only Christians. Is it nice to have > friends who share my beliefs? Of course. But it is important to have people > in my life with a different perspective. > > Is it sometimes difficult to integrate ourselves into a world where people > may be uncomfortable with us? Yes. But that doesn't mean we should stop > trying. > > Briley > > On Mar 26, 2010, at 8:40 AM, Antonio M. Guimaraes wrote: > >> Interesting points, Mark. >> >> Some times the blind community identifies so much with being blind to the >> point of doing most things and conducting much of their interactions with >> other blind people. Some have mentioned during the scholastic >> socialization discussion that their time is taken up mostly with NFB >> business, and not much else. >> >> While this is important work, the NFB and other blind people exist in a >> bigger world context, and to exclude ourselves, our activities, and our >> work from the world is to make blindness more than it needs to be. >> >> That said, I am blind, and identify myself as such. Not doing so would >> consist in denial. My blindness presents challenges, maybe yours doesn't, >> and I am fighting almost daily to improve my access and participation in >> the world I want to be a part of. >> >> People notice my green eyes every day, but that characteristic does not >> present challenges. I need to read some of the NFB philosophy articles >> again to speak with more authority on them, but we some times take these >> writings as dogma, and take them out of context. I don't think Jernigan >> was diminishing the meaning of how hard it is to be blind at times. He was >> some times imagining a perfect world where every blind person has training >> and opportunity. And therein lies the precondition to normal life as a >> blind person: training and opportunity. I haven't much where cooking >> skills are concerned, but I don't have to go back to an NFB-run center to >> get good training in that regard. In some regards, some training centers >> are a drama magnet for the residents. >> >> As long as I get the training somewhere, and have the opportunity, then I >> will live that area of life more confidently as a blind person. >> >> One can not get all the training necessary for life in a 6 month period, >> so we keep getting trained in life, and opening the doors for ourselves. >> >> Antonio Guimaraes >> >> If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup >> trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of >> highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary >> works in Braille. >> >> Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you. >> http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169 >> Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marc Workman" >> >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 11:29 PM >> Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity >> >> >>> I think the issue of blindness constituting identity is definitely very >>> interesting, and I've been thinking about it a bit recently. >>> >>> I believe that blindness does shape our sense of who we are, and this is >>> largely socially influenced, but it's also deeper than that. It's almost >>> certainly true that the challenges, discrimination, exclusion, etc that >>> blind people routinely experience influence our identity. However, and >>> this >>> is where I part somewhat with so called NFB philosophy, I'm not sure >>> that, >>> in the absence of these factors, blindness would be reduced to a mere >>> characteristic, if mere characteristic is supposed to mean something >>> rather >>> trivial and unimportant like hair and eye colour. I definitely think >>> that, >>> in the absence of social and environmental barriers, blind people would >>> be >>> able to flourish as well as anyone else; I don't question that claim, but >>> I >>> think perceiving the world in a unique way, in the way blind people do >>> with >>> little or no sight, is a significant factor in how a person's identity is >>> constituted. >>> >>> Arielle called sex a mere characteristic. As with blindness, if calling >>> it >>> a mere characteristic is supposed to mean that it is as trivial as being >>> 5 >>> foot 6 instead of 5 foot 5, then I don't think it is a mere >>> characteristic. >>> I don't have evidence of this, but I think I would feel differently about >>> my >>> body if I had the ability to grow a human being inside of it. My hunch >>> is >>> that the ability, or lack of ability, to give birth probably affects how >>> one >>> views one's body and thus one's sense of self in a non-trivial way. >>> Similarly, relying heavily on auditory input, developing better memories, >>> perceiving the world with little to no reliance on sight, I think these >>> all >>> affect a person's sense of identity in non-trivial ways, and they don't >>> depend on social factors. >>> >>> Clarification, I'm not trying to suggest that women are defined by their >>> ability to give birth. I'm only saying that to possess that ability >>> might >>> shape how you think about yourself in a way that is more significant than >>> whether you have short or long hair. >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> Marc >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >>> Behalf Of Arielle Silverman >>> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 7:08 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>> >>> >>> Hi again, >>> >>> Re-reading the posts thus far, I will add that I agree with Jedi. >>> Blindness itself doesn't constitute the social identity. The identity >>> comes from the social reaction we experience as a result of blindness, >>> and the ways we've developed to respond to that social reaction. I >>> would venture to guess that this is similar to the effects of skin >>> color or biological sex on the development of racial and gender >>> identities. Race and sex are mere characteristics to the extent that >>> they by themselves don't influence how people function, just as >>> blindness by itself doesn't significantly alter or take away from how >>> we function. It's the social expectations associated with race, sex, >>> and disability that shape how those identities form and how they >>> influence people's sense of self. >>> >>> Arielle >>> >>> >>> On 3/25/10, Arielle Silverman wrote: >>>> Hi all, >>>> >>>> A few comments from an amateur social psychologist: >>>> >>>> There is research showing that members of minority groups (i.e. ethnic >>>> minorities) sometimes experience the same kinds of awkward >>>> interactions with majority group members that we have discussed as >>>> happening to blind people. Specifically, majority group members (i.e. >>>> white Americans) sometimes feel awkward when interacting with minority >>>> members, especially out of concern that they might accidentally come >>>> across as being prejudiced or racist. The result is that the >>>> interaction tends to be strained and there is more tension than there >>>> should be, and minority group members can get left out as a result of >>>> the awkwardness. Of course this doesn't happen to all minority members >>>> and certainly many majority members have no problem interacting across >>>> race or ethnicity lines, just as plenty of sighted people have no >>>> problem befriending, working with or dating blind people. But it is a >>>> general tendency. >>>> >>>> I think the question of whether blindness is an identity or a >>>> situation/characteristic is interesting. My hunch is that it depends >>>> on who you ask; in other words, blind people can range from being >>>> completely disidentified (and often not voluntarily associating with >>>> other blind people) to completely identified and highly affiliated (to >>>> the point of having no close sighted friends). For low-identifiers, >>>> blindness probably feels more like a single characteristic; for high >>>> identifiers, blindness may feel like a trait coupled with a social >>>> group label. In the NFB, when we talk about "the blind" or "the >>>> nation's blind", we are implicitly acknowledging that the blind have a >>>> common identity, even if we don't all believe that this common >>>> identity or fate is rooted in culture. >>>> >>>> As part of my Ph.D. training I do intend to do some research >>>> investigating whether blindness is a coherent identity and, if it is, >>>> whether it has similar effects on people's self-concept and behavior >>>> as other identities (i.e. ethnic, religious, etc.) For example, I >>>> suspect that the constant messages we get from the public about our >>>> inferiority and the devastation of blindness pose unique psychological >>>> issues that we contend with, and that it can be difficult to see >>>> ourselves as whole, capable beings when our identities as blind people >>>> are construed in the public eye as compromised or broken. >>>> >>>> One final thought: I've found it interesting that many sighted people >>>> seem to think of blindness as a condition or trait but don't think of >>>> "the blind" as a coherent group with the same rights as racial, >>>> ethnic, and other cultural groups. This was apparent in the debate >>>> over the movie Blindness. I heard several people (some sighted, some >>>> blind) argue that the movie was OK because the people portrayed in it >>>> weren't "real blind people"; rather, they were sighted people who went >>>> blind as part of the plot. Of course, any of us who were sighted at >>>> one time know that people who go blind are still blind people; >>>> nevertheless, there appeared to be that distinction in some people's >>>> minds. I think this is also why it's hard for us to make civil rights >>>> arguments against blatant injustices (i.e. "Treating blacks with this >>>> kind of discrimination is unacceptable, and so treating us this way is >>>> also unacceptable"). A lot of people just don't get it, or think that >>>> treating blind people differently is OK because stereotypes about >>>> blindness are somehow more valid than stereotypes about other minority >>>> groups. I'm not sure how to bridge that thought gap or how to >>>> demonstrate the existence of the common blind identity in situations >>>> where we are all affected by the same discriminations or denials of >>>> rights. >>>> >>>> Arielle >>>> >>>> On 3/25/10, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>>>> True. Maybe the reason I'm anti social is I have no social skills to >>>>> begin >>>>> it I wirhwe talk to much or don't' talk at all and sometimes I come >>>>> across >>>>> as rude but I'm so used to beeing int he teaching invironment that I >>>>> cannot >>>>> for me get out of it. I'm not making much sense as I am starting to get >>>>> a >>>>> bit hungry.. Hehaha. I do know this much I have a harder time >>>>> socialising >>>>> with the sighree then with the bind. theer is so much that can be >>>>> comunicated in silence. so much we can't see. >>>>> >>>>> I really enjoy reading these discussions and view points as it makes me >>>>> think about what I need to work on or not bather working on. >>>>> >>>>> Take care all. >>>>> On Mar 24, 2010, at 9:14 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Interesting. If we're talking straight up blindness, I think we've >>>>>> all >>>>>> experienced a moment or two of feeling out of place in light of the >>>>>> dominant >>>>>> sighted crowd. I certainly experience with each meeting I attend >>>>>> until >>>>>> I >>>>>> shake off the feeling and plunge forward. If we're talking ethnic >>>>>> minority, >>>>>> I can't say I've experienced that before, but I don't know if it's >>>>>> because >>>>>> the feeling is overshadowed by the blindness factor or because I've >>>>>> genuinely never witnessed this behavior. >>>>>> >>>>>> Regardless, what I find interesting about this discussion is that it >>>>>> makes >>>>>> blindness an identity factor. I think the original post asked how we >>>>>> as >>>>>> blind individuals handled campus involvement, when our philosophy >>>>>> claims >>>>>> blindness can be reduced to the level of a nuisance. I know this >>>>>> position >>>>>> does not claim blindness can be eliminated, but it would appear to >>>>>> suggest >>>>>> blindness is irrelevant to one's sense of self. So, rather than ask, >>>>>> "how >>>>>> do you, as a blind person, handle X, Y and Z," shouldn't we be asking >>>>>> how >>>>>> to >>>>>> handle the task in general? >>>>>> >>>>>> Interesting discussion. >>>>>> >>>>>> Joe Orozco >>>>>> >>>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >>>>>> sleeves, >>>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 8:51 PM >>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>>> >>>>>> Joe, >>>>>> >>>>>> The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually becoming >>>>>> a key issue for those who study organizational communication and >>>>>> diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a fancy >>>>>> way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently >>>>>> based >>>>>> on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member >>>>>> of >>>>>> a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just >>>>>> didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by your >>>>>> minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or one >>>>>> of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or maybe >>>>>> it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. >>>>>> Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is >>>>>> controlled >>>>>> by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are >>>>>> rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less likely >>>>>> to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some point >>>>>> and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that >>>>>> for >>>>>> people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or >>>>>> one >>>>>> of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't yet >>>>>> become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant >>>>>> population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to >>>>>> experience this interesting problem at some point. >>>>>> >>>>>> Respectfully, >>>>>> Jedi >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Original message: >>>>>>> Jedi, >>>>>> >>>>>>> I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or >>>>>> witnessed this >>>>>>> behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, >>>>>> could you give >>>>>>> examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be >>>>>> accurate. >>>>>> >>>>>>> Joe Orozco >>>>>> >>>>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up >>>>>> their sleeves, >>>>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM >>>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>>> >>>>>>> It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for >>>>>>> minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in >>>>>>> school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of >>>>>> access to >>>>>>> informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real >>>>>>> obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from >>>>>>> just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a >>>>>>> large gap between minorities and their non-minority >>>>>> counterparts. There >>>>>>> really is no right way to handle this problem because it >>>>>> affects us all >>>>>>> so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left >>>>>> out, it may >>>>>>> be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear >>>>>>> you. >>>>>> >>>>>>> Respectfully, >>>>>>> Jedi >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> Original message: >>>>>>>> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of >>>>>>> clubs or other >>>>>>>> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew >>>>>>> for a play, but >>>>>>>> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything >>>>>>> other than >>>>>>>> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I >>>>>>> did my job >>>>>>>> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that >>>>>>> if they talked >>>>>>>> to me they would offend me or something like that. >>>>>> >>>>>>>> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved >>>>>> in the boy >>>>>>>> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy >>>>>>> scouts and life >>>>>>>> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or >>>>>>> technical in >>>>>>>> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't >>>>>>> know if this is >>>>>>>> blindness related, or what. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>>>>> From: "Jamie Principato" >>>>>>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>>>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get >>>>>>> involved in as >>>>>>>>> much >>>>>>>>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz >>>>>> Band, and a >>>>>>>>> Youth >>>>>>>>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate >>>>>> and public >>>>>>>>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I >>>>>>> couldn't wait >>>>>>>>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups >>>>>>> and activities >>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>> choose from. >>>>>> >>>>>>>>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot >>>>>>> of...problems...with the >>>>>>>>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went >>>>>>> to this high >>>>>>>>> school because we were told it offered the most for >>>>>> visually impaired >>>>>>>>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but >>>>>>> I'll spare you >>>>>>>>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students >>>>>>> at this school >>>>>>>>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, >>>>>>>>> avoiding >>>>>>>>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after >>>>>>> joining Model UN >>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and >>>>>>> planning to go to >>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the >>>>>>> fact t I joined >>>>>>>>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and >>>>>>> that if I was >>>>>>>>> going >>>>>>>>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a >>>>>>> permission note (no >>>>>>>>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find >>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>> teacher >>>>>>>>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I >>>>>> attend these >>>>>>>>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally >>>>>>> unless I sat >>>>>>>>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman >>>>>>> stands with my >>>>>>>>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was >>>>>>> unnecessary, and we >>>>>>>>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other >>>>>>>>> issues, >>>>>>>>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. >>>>>> >>>>>>>>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home >>>>>>> school support >>>>>>>>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I >>>>>>> took advantage >>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular >>>>>>> activities in >>>>>>>>> my >>>>>>>>> community, even sports (something that never would have >>>>>> flown at that >>>>>>>>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on >>>>>>> campus and in >>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing >>>>>>> club, a volunteer >>>>>>>>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also >>>>>>> try to get the >>>>>>>>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, >>>>>>> and make use of >>>>>>>>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been >>>>>>> having is that >>>>>>>>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by >>>>>>> house recently >>>>>>>>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the >>>>>>> evening. The only >>>>>>>>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or >>>>>>> get home from >>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you >>>>>>> need to get >>>>>>>>> out >>>>>>>>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if >>>>>>> money is tight >>>>>>>>> one >>>>>>>>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside >>>>>>> of attending >>>>>>>>> class, including attending free activities or events. I >>>>>>> guess that's just >>>>>>>>> one price of living off campus though. >>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Hi list, >>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>>>>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school >>>>>>>>>> or >>>>>>>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new >>>>>> people? do you >>>>>>>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at >>>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- >>>>>>> identity as >>>>>>>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>>>>>>>> people interact with you? >>>>>>>>>> Thoughts? >>>>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>>>> Darian >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>>>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a >>>>>>> nationwide teacher >>>>>>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>>>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need >>>>>>>>>> your >>>>>>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>>>> account info for >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr >>>>>>> dfly%40gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>>> account info for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% >>>>>>> 40gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>> info for nabs-l: >>>>>> >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin >>>>>>> djedi%40samobile.net >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>> info for nabs-l: >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco >>>>>> %40gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of >>>>>> virus signature database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>>>>> >>>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.eset.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>>>>> signature >>>>>> database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>>>>> >>>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.eset.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gma >>> il.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Arielle Silverman >>>> President, National Association of Blind Students >>>> Phone: 602-502-2255 >>>> Email: >>>> nabs.president at gmail.com >>>> Website: >>>> www.nabslink.org >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Arielle Silverman >>> President, National Association of Blind Students >>> Phone: 602-502-2255 >>> Email: >>> nabs.president at gmail.com >>> Website: >>> www.nabslink.org >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >>> il.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com > -- Darian Smith Skype: The_Blind_Truth Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com The National Federation of the Blind has launched a nationwide teacher recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your help! To Get Involved go to: www.TeachBlindStudents.org From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Fri Mar 26 19:14:23 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 15:14:23 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity Message-ID: <20100326191423.2589.83106@web3> Marc, Seems how you're not a woman, and seems how you're not me, it isn't your place to tell me what I think about myself in light of my ability to give birth. I'm telling you that aside from the social consequences of being the child bearing half of the spiecies, I don't think about it much, and I suspect you would because you're not a woman. That is not to say that some women don't think about it more than I do, but I personally don't think about it much. I also suspect that sighted people think the same way. They think about the differences of blindness more than many of us do. Next, blind people do not have inherently better memories nor better language processing skills. On the whole, we're on par with the sighted even if there are small brain differences. Just hanging out at an NFB meeting or convention shows us how many differences there are between us all: some have better memories than others, some are well spoken while others aren't. The research I'm speaking of shows that blind people handle voice recognition with the same parts of the brain that the sighted handle face recognition and that we handle space-related tasks with the same mechanism the sighted do except that we use different inputs for the information. The occipital lobe of the brain lights up when reading Braille the same way it does when reading print. For some of us, the occipital lobe lights up when listening to text because that's our primary form of reading. that may be linked to the researched you're talking about. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Jedi, > I'm not sure it's possible to say that you don't see yourself differently > because you have the ability to give birth. I'm only saying that I suspect > I would view my body differently if I had that ability. It's not something > I'll ever know. But here's another example if that one doesn't satisfy you. > If I were a woman, I would probably be 60 pounds lighter and six or seven > inches shorter on average. Again, I can't say for sure, but I'm pretty sure > that living in the world, in any world, with a body that is 60 pounds > lighter and 7 inches shorter would have a non-trivial impact on my sense of > self. > And here's a blindness example. In my experience, blind people tend to have > better memories than the average sighted person. Unless you want to argue > that this is only because of social factors, which I admit probably is a > factor but not the only factor, then better memories will be around even > after all social barriers are removed. I'm pretty sure again that having a > better memory that allows me to quickly recall information changes the way I > am able to think in a non-trivial way. If I suddenly lost my better memory, > even if I didn't need it to get around successfully in the world, it would > have an impact on my sense of self. Would I be a completely different > person? Probably not, but it would affect my identity more than if I went > out and got a haircut tomorrow. > Example 2: You say that evidence shows that the brains of blind people more > or less process information the same way the brains of sighted people do. > I've seen evidence that suggests the contrary, particularly with respect to > language processing. There is evidence that some blind people end up using > the occipital lobe, the part of the brain normally reserved for visual > processing, to conduct language processing. As a result, studies have shown > that certain sorts of language processing occur faster among blind people. > This seems to me that it could also affect the way I think and my sense of > self in a non-trivial way. And it doesn't seem to be entirely social. Any > social context that includes an oral language will have the same result. > Though I admit that this can be more or less emphasized depending on social > factors. > Finally, I wonder if some people think there is a danger in acknowledging > that blindness can shape our identities even in the absence of harmful > social attitudes. I can see the potential danger. If we say that we are > different, then others can argue that we should thus be treated differently. > So I can understand why it might be better to deny it even if it's true. > Alternatively, you could just not think it's true, but I think the examples > of better memories and increased language processing abilities, plus others > that I'm sure I could come up with if I spent some time researching, suggest > that blindness does generally affect the ways in which we are able to think > and thus our sense of self in what I keep saying are merely non-trivial > ways. > Regards, > Marc > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On > Behalf Of Jedi > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 11:57 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity > Marc, > I'm a woman, and I don't see myself differently because I have the > ability to give birth, but I do perceive the world based on the fact > that sexism in all its forms is still alive and well int he world. As > to blindness, I definitely think that we physically perceive the world > slightly different than the sighted, but not enough to really warrant > saying that blindness fundamentally shifts our world view. > Neuroscientists are starting to show that the blind and sighted use the > same rules for perceiving the world, we just use different inputs or > modalities even though our brains more or less process the information > the same way the brains of sighted people do. I think however, that > being blind has produced a number of very interesting experiences that > we all have in common including a world that is obsessed with > perceiving the world visually. I use the word "obsessed" because it's > clear that while vision is useful, it's almost like sighted people > sometimes go overboard with touchscreens and a lot of flashy and > unnecessary graphic material. Add the fact that the NfB as an > organization with assumptions and values that shape our blindness lives > and even our non-blindness lives, and you've got the making of a > cultural identity. > Respectfully, > Jedi > Original message: >> I think the issue of blindness constituting identity is definitely very >> interesting, and I've been thinking about it a bit recently. >> I believe that blindness does shape our sense of who we are, and this is >> largely socially influenced, but it's also deeper than that. It's almost >> certainly true that the challenges, discrimination, exclusion, etc that >> blind people routinely experience influence our identity. However, and > this >> is where I part somewhat with so called NFB philosophy, I'm not sure that, >> in the absence of these factors, blindness would be reduced to a mere >> characteristic, if mere characteristic is supposed to mean something > rather >> trivial and unimportant like hair and eye colour. I definitely think > that, >> in the absence of social and environmental barriers, blind people would be >> able to flourish as well as anyone else; I don't question that claim, but > I >> think perceiving the world in a unique way, in the way blind people do > with >> little or no sight, is a significant factor in how a person's identity is >> constituted. >> Arielle called sex a mere characteristic. As with blindness, if calling > it >> a mere characteristic is supposed to mean that it is as trivial as being 5 >> foot 6 instead of 5 foot 5, then I don't think it is a mere > characteristic. >> I don't have evidence of this, but I think I would feel differently about > my >> body if I had the ability to grow a human being inside of it. My hunch is >> that the ability, or lack of ability, to give birth probably affects how > one >> views one's body and thus one's sense of self in a non-trivial way. >> Similarly, relying heavily on auditory input, developing better memories, >> perceiving the world with little to no reliance on sight, I think these > all >> affect a person's sense of identity in non-trivial ways, and they don't >> depend on social factors. >> Clarification, I'm not trying to suggest that women are defined by their >> ability to give birth. I'm only saying that to possess that ability might >> shape how you think about yourself in a way that is more significant than >> whether you have short or long hair. >> Best, >> Marc >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >> Behalf Of Arielle Silverman >> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 7:08 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >> Hi again, >> Re-reading the posts thus far, I will add that I agree with Jedi. >> Blindness itself doesn't constitute the social identity. The identity >> comes from the social reaction we experience as a result of blindness, >> and the ways we've developed to respond to that social reaction. I >> would venture to guess that this is similar to the effects of skin >> color or biological sex on the development of racial and gender >> identities. Race and sex are mere characteristics to the extent that >> they by themselves don't influence how people function, just as >> blindness by itself doesn't significantly alter or take away from how >> we function. It's the social expectations associated with race, sex, >> and disability that shape how those identities form and how they >> influence people's sense of self. >> Arielle >> On 3/25/10, Arielle Silverman wrote: >>> Hi all, >>> A few comments from an amateur social psychologist: >>> There is research showing that members of minority groups (i.e. ethnic >>> minorities) sometimes experience the same kinds of awkward >>> interactions with majority group members that we have discussed as >>> happening to blind people. Specifically, majority group members (i.e. >>> white Americans) sometimes feel awkward when interacting with minority >>> members, especially out of concern that they might accidentally come >>> across as being prejudiced or racist. The result is that the >>> interaction tends to be strained and there is more tension than there >>> should be, and minority group members can get left out as a result of >>> the awkwardness. Of course this doesn't happen to all minority members >>> and certainly many majority members have no problem interacting across >>> race or ethnicity lines, just as plenty of sighted people have no >>> problem befriending, working with or dating blind people. But it is a >>> general tendency. >>> I think the question of whether blindness is an identity or a >>> situation/characteristic is interesting. My hunch is that it depends >>> on who you ask; in other words, blind people can range from being >>> completely disidentified (and often not voluntarily associating with >>> other blind people) to completely identified and highly affiliated (to >>> the point of having no close sighted friends). For low-identifiers, >>> blindness probably feels more like a single characteristic; for high >>> identifiers, blindness may feel like a trait coupled with a social >>> group label. In the NFB, when we talk about "the blind" or "the >>> nation's blind", we are implicitly acknowledging that the blind have a >>> common identity, even if we don't all believe that this common >>> identity or fate is rooted in culture. >>> As part of my Ph.D. training I do intend to do some research >>> investigating whether blindness is a coherent identity and, if it is, >>> whether it has similar effects on people's self-concept and behavior >>> as other identities (i.e. ethnic, religious, etc.) For example, I >>> suspect that the constant messages we get from the public about our >>> inferiority and the devastation of blindness pose unique psychological >>> issues that we contend with, and that it can be difficult to see >>> ourselves as whole, capable beings when our identities as blind people >>> are construed in the public eye as compromised or broken. >>> One final thought: I've found it interesting that many sighted people >>> seem to think of blindness as a condition or trait but don't think of >>> "the blind" as a coherent group with the same rights as racial, >>> ethnic, and other cultural groups. This was apparent in the debate >>> over the movie Blindness. I heard several people (some sighted, some >>> blind) argue that the movie was OK because the people portrayed in it >>> weren't "real blind people"; rather, they were sighted people who went >>> blind as part of the plot. Of course, any of us who were sighted at >>> one time know that people who go blind are still blind people; >>> nevertheless, there appeared to be that distinction in some people's >>> minds. I think this is also why it's hard for us to make civil rights >>> arguments against blatant injustices (i.e. "Treating blacks with this >>> kind of discrimination is unacceptable, and so treating us this way is >>> also unacceptable"). A lot of people just don't get it, or think that >>> treating blind people differently is OK because stereotypes about >>> blindness are somehow more valid than stereotypes about other minority >>> groups. I'm not sure how to bridge that thought gap or how to >>> demonstrate the existence of the common blind identity in situations >>> where we are all affected by the same discriminations or denials of >>> rights. >>> Arielle >>> On 3/25/10, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>>> True. Maybe the reason I'm anti social is I have no social skills to >>>> begin >>>> it I wirhwe talk to much or don't' talk at all and sometimes I come >>>> across >>>> as rude but I'm so used to beeing int he teaching invironment that I >>>> cannot >>>> for me get out of it. I'm not making much sense as I am starting to get > a >>>> bit hungry.. Hehaha. I do know this much I have a harder time > socialising >>>> with the sighree then with the bind. theer is so much that can be >>>> comunicated in silence. so much we can't see. >>>> I really enjoy reading these discussions and view points as it makes me >>>> think about what I need to work on or not bather working on. >>>> Take care all. >>>> On Mar 24, 2010, at 9:14 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: >>>>> Interesting. If we're talking straight up blindness, I think we've all >>>>> experienced a moment or two of feeling out of place in light of the >>>>> dominant >>>>> sighted crowd. I certainly experience with each meeting I attend until >>>>> I >>>>> shake off the feeling and plunge forward. If we're talking ethnic >>>>> minority, >>>>> I can't say I've experienced that before, but I don't know if it's >>>>> because >>>>> the feeling is overshadowed by the blindness factor or because I've >>>>> genuinely never witnessed this behavior. >>>>> Regardless, what I find interesting about this discussion is that it >>>>> makes >>>>> blindness an identity factor. I think the original post asked how we > as >>>>> blind individuals handled campus involvement, when our philosophy > claims >>>>> blindness can be reduced to the level of a nuisance. I know this >>>>> position >>>>> does not claim blindness can be eliminated, but it would appear to >>>>> suggest >>>>> blindness is irrelevant to one's sense of self. So, rather than ask, >>>>> "how >>>>> do you, as a blind person, handle X, Y and Z," shouldn't we be asking >>>>> how >>>>> to >>>>> handle the task in general? >>>>> Interesting discussion. >>>>> Joe Orozco >>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >>>>> sleeves, >>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 8:51 PM >>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>> Joe, >>>>> The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually becoming >>>>> a key issue for those who study organizational communication and >>>>> diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a fancy >>>>> way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently based >>>>> on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member of >>>>> a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just >>>>> didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by your >>>>> minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or one >>>>> of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or maybe >>>>> it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. >>>>> Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is controlled >>>>> by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are >>>>> rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less likely >>>>> to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some point >>>>> and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that for >>>>> people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or one >>>>> of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't yet >>>>> become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant >>>>> population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to >>>>> experience this interesting problem at some point. >>>>> Respectfully, >>>>> Jedi >>>>> Original message: >>>>>> Jedi, >>>>>> I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or >>>>> witnessed this >>>>>> behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, >>>>> could you give >>>>>> examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification to >>>>>> explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be >>>>> accurate. >>>>>> Joe Orozco >>>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up >>>>> their sleeves, >>>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM >>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>>> It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for >>>>>> minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in >>>>>> school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of >>>>> access to >>>>>> informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real >>>>>> obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from >>>>>> just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a >>>>>> large gap between minorities and their non-minority >>>>> counterparts. There >>>>>> really is no right way to handle this problem because it >>>>> affects us all >>>>>> so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left >>>>> out, it may >>>>>> be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear you. >>>>>> Respectfully, >>>>>> Jedi >>>>>> Original message: >>>>>>> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of >>>>>> clubs or other >>>>>>> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew >>>>>> for a play, but >>>>>>> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything >>>>>> other than >>>>>>> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I >>>>>> did my job >>>>>>> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that >>>>>> if they talked >>>>>>> to me they would offend me or something like that. >>>>>>> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved >>>>> in the boy >>>>>>> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy >>>>>> scouts and life >>>>>>> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or >>>>>> technical in >>>>>>> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't >>>>>> know if this is >>>>>>> blindness related, or what. >>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>>>> From: "Jamie Principato" >>>>>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>>>>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get >>>>>> involved in as >>>>>>>> much >>>>>>>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz >>>>> Band, and a >>>>>>>> Youth >>>>>>>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate >>>>> and public >>>>>>>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I >>>>>> couldn't wait >>>>>>>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups >>>>>> and activities >>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>> choose from. >>>>>>>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot >>>>>> of...problems...with the >>>>>>>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went >>>>>> to this high >>>>>>>> school because we were told it offered the most for >>>>> visually impaired >>>>>>>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but >>>>>> I'll spare you >>>>>>>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students >>>>>> at this school >>>>>>>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, >>>>>>>> avoiding >>>>>>>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after >>>>>> joining Model UN >>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and >>>>>> planning to go to >>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the >>>>>> fact t I joined >>>>>>>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and >>>>>> that if I was >>>>>>>> going >>>>>>>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a >>>>>> permission note (no >>>>>>>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a >>>>>>>> teacher >>>>>>>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I >>>>> attend these >>>>>>>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally >>>>>> unless I sat >>>>>>>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman >>>>>> stands with my >>>>>>>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was >>>>>> unnecessary, and we >>>>>>>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other >>>>>>>> issues, >>>>>>>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. >>>>>>>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home >>>>>> school support >>>>>>>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I >>>>>> took advantage >>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular >>>>>> activities in >>>>>>>> my >>>>>>>> community, even sports (something that never would have >>>>> flown at that >>>>>>>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on >>>>>> campus and in >>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing >>>>>> club, a volunteer >>>>>>>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also >>>>>> try to get the >>>>>>>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, >>>>>> and make use of >>>>>>>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been >>>>>> having is that >>>>>>>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by >>>>>> house recently >>>>>>>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the >>>>>> evening. The only >>>>>>>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or >>>>>> get home from >>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you >>>>>> need to get >>>>>>>> out >>>>>>>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if >>>>>> money is tight >>>>>>>> one >>>>>>>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside >>>>>> of attending >>>>>>>> class, including attending free activities or events. I >>>>>> guess that's just >>>>>>>> one price of living off campus though. >>>>>>>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> Hi list, >>>>>>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>>>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>>>>>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new >>>>> people? do you >>>>>>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>>>>>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- >>>>>> identity as >>>>>>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>>>>>>> people interact with you? >>>>>>>>> Thoughts? >>>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>>> Darian >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a >>>>>> nationwide teacher >>>>>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>>> account info for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr >>>>>> dfly%40gmail.com >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>> account info for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% >>>>>> 40gmail.com >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>> info for nabs-l: >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin >>>>>> djedi%40samobile.net >>>>> -- >>>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>> info for nabs-l: >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco >>>>> %40gmail.com >>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of >>>>> virus signature database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>>> http://www.eset.com >>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>>>> signature >>>>> database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>>> http://www.eset.com >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gma >> il.com >>> -- >>> Arielle Silverman >>> President, National Association of Blind Students >>> Phone: 602-502-2255 >>> Email: >>> nabs.president at gmail.com >>> Website: >>> www.nabslink.org >> -- >> Arielle Silverman >> President, National Association of Blind Students >> Phone: 602-502-2255 >> Email: >> nabs.president at gmail.com >> Website: >> www.nabslink.org >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >> il.com >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo > bile.net > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit > www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma > il.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Fri Mar 26 19:14:29 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 15:14:29 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity Message-ID: <20100326191429.15536.71193@web1> Briley and all: It may be useful to define identity in this context. When I talk about identity, I don't mean that blindness does or should become the major influence in one's life. Instead, I mean to speak of identity in the same context of other social justice movements and communication situations where identity is a key player in a given context. How much one identifieis with the blindness community is going to depend heavily on a lot of things including what other identities a person has such as being a woman, a person of color, gay, disabled in some other way, Christian, the list goes on. A lot will also depend on life experiences because some of those identities are highlighted for each of us specifically in different ways. Does that make sense? Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > You present some interesting and valid points, Antonio. I've always > been troubled by the fact that some blind people seem to grab onto > that, and hold it as the most important aspect of their identity. > Blindness is a part of who I am, and it is important, this I will never > deny. I am also a woman, a sister, a musician, a daughter, etc. I am > not ashamed of my blindness, but I live in a sighted world, and by > cutting myself off from that, I would not only be doing myself a > disservice, but the sighted world. Do I have blind friends? Of course I > do. Do we share common frustrations due to our common trait? Yes. But I > also have sighted friends, and I don't feel any less kinship with them > because they can see and I can't. > I am saddened by the fact that I have heard many of my blind peers say > that they only have blind friends, and they wouldn't know how to go > about starting relationships with sighted people. This would be like me > as a Christian exclusively associating with only Christians. Is it nice > to have friends who share my beliefs? Of course. But it is important to > have people in my life with a different perspective. > Is it sometimes difficult to integrate ourselves into a world where > people may be uncomfortable with us? Yes. But that doesn't mean we > should stop trying. > Briley > On Mar 26, 2010, at 8:40 AM, Antonio M. Guimaraes wrote: >> Interesting points, Mark. >> Some times the blind community identifies so much with being blind to >> the point of doing most things and conducting much of their >> interactions with other blind people. Some have mentioned during the >> scholastic socialization discussion that their time is taken up mostly >> with NFB business, and not much else. >> While this is important work, the NFB and other blind people exist in a >> bigger world context, and to exclude ourselves, our activities, and our >> work from the world is to make blindness more than it needs to be. >> That said, I am blind, and identify myself as such. Not doing so would >> consist in denial. My blindness presents challenges, maybe yours >> doesn't, and I am fighting almost daily to improve my access and >> participation in the world I want to be a part of. >> People notice my green eyes every day, but that characteristic does not >> present challenges. I need to read some of the NFB philosophy articles >> again to speak with more authority on them, but we some times take >> these writings as dogma, and take them out of context. I don't think >> Jernigan was diminishing the meaning of how hard it is to be blind at >> times. He was some times imagining a perfect world where every blind >> person has training and opportunity. And therein lies the precondition >> to normal life as a blind person: training and opportunity. I haven't >> much where cooking skills are concerned, but I don't have to go back to >> an NFB-run center to get good training in that regard. In some regards, >> some training centers are a drama magnet for the residents. >> As long as I get the training somewhere, and have the opportunity, then >> I will live that area of life more confidently as a blind person. >> One can not get all the training necessary for life in a 6 month >> period, so we keep getting trained in life, and opening the doors for >> ourselves. >> Antonio Guimaraes >> If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of >> pickup trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite >> number of highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's >> great literary works in Braille. >> Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you. >> http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169 >> Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marc Workman" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 11:29 PM >> Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity >>> I think the issue of blindness constituting identity is definitely very >>> interesting, and I've been thinking about it a bit recently. >>> I believe that blindness does shape our sense of who we are, and this is >>> largely socially influenced, but it's also deeper than that. It's almost >>> certainly true that the challenges, discrimination, exclusion, etc that >>> blind people routinely experience influence our identity. However, and this >>> is where I part somewhat with so called NFB philosophy, I'm not sure that, >>> in the absence of these factors, blindness would be reduced to a mere >>> characteristic, if mere characteristic is supposed to mean something rather >>> trivial and unimportant like hair and eye colour. I definitely think that, >>> in the absence of social and environmental barriers, blind people would be >>> able to flourish as well as anyone else; I don't question that claim, but I >>> think perceiving the world in a unique way, in the way blind people do with >>> little or no sight, is a significant factor in how a person's identity is >>> constituted. >>> Arielle called sex a mere characteristic. As with blindness, if calling it >>> a mere characteristic is supposed to mean that it is as trivial as being 5 >>> foot 6 instead of 5 foot 5, then I don't think it is a mere characteristic. >>> I don't have evidence of this, but I think I would feel differently about my >>> body if I had the ability to grow a human being inside of it. My hunch is >>> that the ability, or lack of ability, to give birth probably affects how one >>> views one's body and thus one's sense of self in a non-trivial way. >>> Similarly, relying heavily on auditory input, developing better memories, >>> perceiving the world with little to no reliance on sight, I think these all >>> affect a person's sense of identity in non-trivial ways, and they don't >>> depend on social factors. >>> Clarification, I'm not trying to suggest that women are defined by their >>> ability to give birth. I'm only saying that to possess that ability might >>> shape how you think about yourself in a way that is more significant than >>> whether you have short or long hair. >>> Best, >>> Marc >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >>> Behalf Of Arielle Silverman >>> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 7:08 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>> Hi again, >>> Re-reading the posts thus far, I will add that I agree with Jedi. >>> Blindness itself doesn't constitute the social identity. The identity >>> comes from the social reaction we experience as a result of blindness, >>> and the ways we've developed to respond to that social reaction. I >>> would venture to guess that this is similar to the effects of skin >>> color or biological sex on the development of racial and gender >>> identities. Race and sex are mere characteristics to the extent that >>> they by themselves don't influence how people function, just as >>> blindness by itself doesn't significantly alter or take away from how >>> we function. It's the social expectations associated with race, sex, >>> and disability that shape how those identities form and how they >>> influence people's sense of self. >>> Arielle >>> On 3/25/10, Arielle Silverman wrote: >>>> Hi all, >>>> A few comments from an amateur social psychologist: >>>> There is research showing that members of minority groups (i.e. ethnic >>>> minorities) sometimes experience the same kinds of awkward >>>> interactions with majority group members that we have discussed as >>>> happening to blind people. Specifically, majority group members (i.e. >>>> white Americans) sometimes feel awkward when interacting with minority >>>> members, especially out of concern that they might accidentally come >>>> across as being prejudiced or racist. The result is that the >>>> interaction tends to be strained and there is more tension than there >>>> should be, and minority group members can get left out as a result of >>>> the awkwardness. Of course this doesn't happen to all minority members >>>> and certainly many majority members have no problem interacting across >>>> race or ethnicity lines, just as plenty of sighted people have no >>>> problem befriending, working with or dating blind people. But it is a >>>> general tendency. >>>> I think the question of whether blindness is an identity or a >>>> situation/characteristic is interesting. My hunch is that it depends >>>> on who you ask; in other words, blind people can range from being >>>> completely disidentified (and often not voluntarily associating with >>>> other blind people) to completely identified and highly affiliated (to >>>> the point of having no close sighted friends). For low-identifiers, >>>> blindness probably feels more like a single characteristic; for high >>>> identifiers, blindness may feel like a trait coupled with a social >>>> group label. In the NFB, when we talk about "the blind" or "the >>>> nation's blind", we are implicitly acknowledging that the blind have a >>>> common identity, even if we don't all believe that this common >>>> identity or fate is rooted in culture. >>>> As part of my Ph.D. training I do intend to do some research >>>> investigating whether blindness is a coherent identity and, if it is, >>>> whether it has similar effects on people's self-concept and behavior >>>> as other identities (i.e. ethnic, religious, etc.) For example, I >>>> suspect that the constant messages we get from the public about our >>>> inferiority and the devastation of blindness pose unique psychological >>>> issues that we contend with, and that it can be difficult to see >>>> ourselves as whole, capable beings when our identities as blind people >>>> are construed in the public eye as compromised or broken. >>>> One final thought: I've found it interesting that many sighted people >>>> seem to think of blindness as a condition or trait but don't think of >>>> "the blind" as a coherent group with the same rights as racial, >>>> ethnic, and other cultural groups. This was apparent in the debate >>>> over the movie Blindness. I heard several people (some sighted, some >>>> blind) argue that the movie was OK because the people portrayed in it >>>> weren't "real blind people"; rather, they were sighted people who went >>>> blind as part of the plot. Of course, any of us who were sighted at >>>> one time know that people who go blind are still blind people; >>>> nevertheless, there appeared to be that distinction in some people's >>>> minds. I think this is also why it's hard for us to make civil rights >>>> arguments against blatant injustices (i.e. "Treating blacks with this >>>> kind of discrimination is unacceptable, and so treating us this way is >>>> also unacceptable"). A lot of people just don't get it, or think that >>>> treating blind people differently is OK because stereotypes about >>>> blindness are somehow more valid than stereotypes about other minority >>>> groups. I'm not sure how to bridge that thought gap or how to >>>> demonstrate the existence of the common blind identity in situations >>>> where we are all affected by the same discriminations or denials of >>>> rights. >>>> Arielle >>>> On 3/25/10, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>>>> True. Maybe the reason I'm anti social is I have no social skills to >>>>> begin >>>>> it I wirhwe talk to much or don't' talk at all and sometimes I come >>>>> across >>>>> as rude but I'm so used to beeing int he teaching invironment that I >>>>> cannot >>>>> for me get out of it. I'm not making much sense as I am starting to get a >>>>> bit hungry.. Hehaha. I do know this much I have a harder time socialising >>>>> with the sighree then with the bind. theer is so much that can be >>>>> comunicated in silence. so much we can't see. >>>>> I really enjoy reading these discussions and view points as it makes me >>>>> think about what I need to work on or not bather working on. >>>>> Take care all. >>>>> On Mar 24, 2010, at 9:14 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: >>>>>> Interesting. If we're talking straight up blindness, I think we've all >>>>>> experienced a moment or two of feeling out of place in light of the >>>>>> dominant >>>>>> sighted crowd. I certainly experience with each meeting I attend until >>>>>> I >>>>>> shake off the feeling and plunge forward. If we're talking ethnic >>>>>> minority, >>>>>> I can't say I've experienced that before, but I don't know if it's >>>>>> because >>>>>> the feeling is overshadowed by the blindness factor or because I've >>>>>> genuinely never witnessed this behavior. >>>>>> Regardless, what I find interesting about this discussion is that it >>>>>> makes >>>>>> blindness an identity factor. I think the original post asked how we as >>>>>> blind individuals handled campus involvement, when our philosophy claims >>>>>> blindness can be reduced to the level of a nuisance. I know this >>>>>> position >>>>>> does not claim blindness can be eliminated, but it would appear to >>>>>> suggest >>>>>> blindness is irrelevant to one's sense of self. So, rather than ask, >>>>>> "how >>>>>> do you, as a blind person, handle X, Y and Z," shouldn't we be asking >>>>>> how >>>>>> to >>>>>> handle the task in general? >>>>>> Interesting discussion. >>>>>> Joe Orozco >>>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >>>>>> sleeves, >>>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 8:51 PM >>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>>> Joe, >>>>>> The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually becoming >>>>>> a key issue for those who study organizational communication and >>>>>> diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a fancy >>>>>> way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently based >>>>>> on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member of >>>>>> a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just >>>>>> didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by your >>>>>> minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or one >>>>>> of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or maybe >>>>>> it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. >>>>>> Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is controlled >>>>>> by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are >>>>>> rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less likely >>>>>> to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some point >>>>>> and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that for >>>>>> people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or one >>>>>> of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't yet >>>>>> become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant >>>>>> population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to >>>>>> experience this interesting problem at some point. >>>>>> Respectfully, >>>>>> Jedi >>>>>> Original message: >>>>>>> Jedi, >>>>>>> I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or >>>>>> witnessed this >>>>>>> behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, >>>>>> could you give >>>>>>> examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification to >>>>>>> explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be >>>>>> accurate. >>>>>>> Joe Orozco >>>>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up >>>>>> their sleeves, >>>>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM >>>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>>>> It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for >>>>>>> minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in >>>>>>> school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of >>>>>> access to >>>>>>> informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real >>>>>>> obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from >>>>>>> just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a >>>>>>> large gap between minorities and their non-minority >>>>>> counterparts. There >>>>>>> really is no right way to handle this problem because it >>>>>> affects us all >>>>>>> so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left >>>>>> out, it may >>>>>>> be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear you. >>>>>>> Respectfully, >>>>>>> Jedi >>>>>>> Original message: >>>>>>>> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of >>>>>>> clubs or other >>>>>>>> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew >>>>>>> for a play, but >>>>>>>> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything >>>>>>> other than >>>>>>>> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I >>>>>>> did my job >>>>>>>> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that >>>>>>> if they talked >>>>>>>> to me they would offend me or something like that. >>>>>>>> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved >>>>>> in the boy >>>>>>>> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy >>>>>>> scouts and life >>>>>>>> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or >>>>>>> technical in >>>>>>>> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't >>>>>>> know if this is >>>>>>>> blindness related, or what. >>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>>>>> From: "Jamie Principato" >>>>>>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>>>>>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get >>>>>>> involved in as >>>>>>>>> much >>>>>>>>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz >>>>>> Band, and a >>>>>>>>> Youth >>>>>>>>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate >>>>>> and public >>>>>>>>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I >>>>>>> couldn't wait >>>>>>>>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups >>>>>>> and activities >>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>> choose from. >>>>>>>>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot >>>>>>> of...problems...with the >>>>>>>>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went >>>>>>> to this high >>>>>>>>> school because we were told it offered the most for >>>>>> visually impaired >>>>>>>>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but >>>>>>> I'll spare you >>>>>>>>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students >>>>>>> at this school >>>>>>>>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, >>>>>>>>> avoiding >>>>>>>>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after >>>>>>> joining Model UN >>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and >>>>>>> planning to go to >>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the >>>>>>> fact t I joined >>>>>>>>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and >>>>>>> that if I was >>>>>>>>> going >>>>>>>>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a >>>>>>> permission note (no >>>>>>>>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a >>>>>>>>> teacher >>>>>>>>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I >>>>>> attend these >>>>>>>>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally >>>>>>> unless I sat >>>>>>>>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman >>>>>>> stands with my >>>>>>>>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was >>>>>>> unnecessary, and we >>>>>>>>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other >>>>>>>>> issues, >>>>>>>>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. >>>>>>>>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home >>>>>>> school support >>>>>>>>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I >>>>>>> took advantage >>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular >>>>>>> activities in >>>>>>>>> my >>>>>>>>> community, even sports (something that never would have >>>>>> flown at that >>>>>>>>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on >>>>>>> campus and in >>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing >>>>>>> club, a volunteer >>>>>>>>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also >>>>>>> try to get the >>>>>>>>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, >>>>>>> and make use of >>>>>>>>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been >>>>>>> having is that >>>>>>>>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by >>>>>>> house recently >>>>>>>>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the >>>>>>> evening. The only >>>>>>>>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or >>>>>>> get home from >>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you >>>>>>> need to get >>>>>>>>> out >>>>>>>>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if >>>>>>> money is tight >>>>>>>>> one >>>>>>>>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside >>>>>>> of attending >>>>>>>>> class, including attending free activities or events. I >>>>>>> guess that's just >>>>>>>>> one price of living off campus though. >>>>>>>>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> Hi list, >>>>>>>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>>>>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>>>>>>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new >>>>>> people? do you >>>>>>>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>>>>>>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- >>>>>>> identity as >>>>>>>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>>>>>>>> people interact with you? >>>>>>>>>> Thoughts? >>>>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>>>> Darian >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>>>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a >>>>>>> nationwide teacher >>>>>>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>>>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>>>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>>>> account info for >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr >>>>>>> dfly%40gmail.com >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>>> account info for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% >>>>>>> 40gmail.com >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>> info for nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin >>>>>>> djedi%40samobile.net >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>> info for nabs-l: >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco >>>>>> %40gmail.com >>>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of >>>>>> virus signature database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>>>> http://www.eset.com >>>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>>>>> signature >>>>>> database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>>>> http://www.eset.com >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gma >>> il.com >>>> -- >>>> Arielle Silverman >>>> President, National Association of Blind Students >>>> Phone: 602-502-2255 >>>> Email: >>>> nabs.president at gmail.com >>>> Website: >>>> www.nabslink.org >>> -- >>> Arielle Silverman >>> President, National Association of Blind Students >>> Phone: 602-502-2255 >>> Email: >>> nabs.president at gmail.com >>> Website: >>> www.nabslink.org >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >>> il.com >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From mworkman.lists at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 00:05:47 2010 From: mworkman.lists at gmail.com (Marc Workman) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 18:05:47 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity In-Reply-To: <20100326191423.2589.83106@web3> Message-ID: Jedi, I hope that I did not try to tell you what you think about your ability to give birth. I said that I wasn't sure it was possible to say that you don't see yourself differently. I admit I should have clarified, but what I said has absolutely nothing to do with you and what you think about yourself. I was saying that it is literally impossible to make a claim like the one you made. The reason it is impossible is because to know for sure if you do or do not see yourself differently as a result of possessing the ability to give birth, you would have had to have grown up as a man and as a woman, which is not physically possible. So I suppose you can say that you don't think about it, and you probably don't, but since you have nothing to compare it to, it's impossible to say whether it does or does not shape how you think about yourself. It would be like me saying, I don't think about my ability to be self-aware. Therefore, it isn't a part of my identity, or, I don't think much about my ability to feel pain, so I would be the same person if I lacked this ability. I can say that I don't think about these things, and it can be true that I don't think about these things, but I can't say that they do not shape my identity, which is what I thought you were trying to say. The deeper claim I'm making is that identity is not something you can just step outside of and say features X and Y are part of my identity, but features A, B, and C are not. I want to say that there are things about you that affect your identity that you are not at all aware of, and it is not possible to step outside of your identity and take stock of the factors that make you who you are. If you step outside of your identity, the you that is doing the stepping disappears. So it's a philosophical claim that you can never no for sure what exactly shapes your sense of self because knowing this would require stepping outside yourself to have a look, but this is not possible. As for language processing, I'm going to paste an article abstract below my name. It discusses the faster language processing that I mentioned. Please correct me if I'm wrong: The difference in opinion here seems to be that you think that identity is socially constructed. I'm only suggesting that there is a close link between the body and identity and that possessing a body that functions in a rather significantly different way (e.g., one that is capable of visual perception versus one that is not) has a non-trivial impact on one's sense of self. It doesn't strike me as a particularly bold claim, no more than to say that I would probably be a different person if I had a photographic memory, the ability to sense infrared signals, or the sense of smell of a dog. And though I don't think that how we perceive our bodies is beyond social influence, I'm not sure that it is entirely socially constructed either. Abstract follows. Marc Event -related potentials during auditory language processing in congenitally blind and sighted people Brigitte Roder Abstract While behavioral studies have documented delayed language acquisition in blind children, other studies have revealed better speech discrimination abilities for blind than sighted adults. Several brain imaging studies have provided evidence for cortical reorganization due to visual deprivation but the cerebral organization of language in blind humans is not known yet. We hypothesized that the increasing specialization of language systems normally observed during development may not take place to the same degree in blind individuals since posterior visual areas do not receive their adequate input. On the other hand, we hypothesized that blind people, due to their greater reliance upon the auditory language signal, may process speech faster than sighted people. To test these assumptions, event-related potentials were recorded while 11 congenitally blind and 11 sighted adults matched in age, gender, handedness and education were engaged in a language task. Participants listened to sentences in order to decide after each sentence if it was meaningful or not. Incongruous sentence-final words elicited an N400 effect in both groups. The N400 effect had a left-lateralized fronto-central scalp distribution in the sighted but a symmetric and broad topography in the blind. Furthermore, the N400 effect started earlier in the blind than in the sighted. Closed class compared to open class sentence middle words elicited a more pronounced late negativity in the blind than in the sighted. These results suggest that blind people process auditory language stimuli faster than sighted people and that some language functions may be reorganized in the blind. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On Behalf Of Jedi Sent: Friday, March 26, 2010 1:14 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity Marc, Seems how you're not a woman, and seems how you're not me, it isn't your place to tell me what I think about myself in light of my ability to give birth. I'm telling you that aside from the social consequences of being the child bearing half of the spiecies, I don't think about it much, and I suspect you would because you're not a woman. That is not to say that some women don't think about it more than I do, but I personally don't think about it much. I also suspect that sighted people think the same way. They think about the differences of blindness more than many of us do. Next, blind people do not have inherently better memories nor better language processing skills. On the whole, we're on par with the sighted even if there are small brain differences. Just hanging out at an NFB meeting or convention shows us how many differences there are between us all: some have better memories than others, some are well spoken while others aren't. The research I'm speaking of shows that blind people handle voice recognition with the same parts of the brain that the sighted handle face recognition and that we handle space-related tasks with the same mechanism the sighted do except that we use different inputs for the information. The occipital lobe of the brain lights up when reading Braille the same way it does when reading print. For some of us, the occipital lobe lights up when listening to text because that's our primary form of reading. that may be linked to the researched you're talking about. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Jedi, > I'm not sure it's possible to say that you don't see yourself differently > because you have the ability to give birth. I'm only saying that I suspect > I would view my body differently if I had that ability. It's not something > I'll ever know. But here's another example if that one doesn't satisfy you. > If I were a woman, I would probably be 60 pounds lighter and six or seven > inches shorter on average. Again, I can't say for sure, but I'm pretty sure > that living in the world, in any world, with a body that is 60 pounds > lighter and 7 inches shorter would have a non-trivial impact on my sense of > self. > And here's a blindness example. In my experience, blind people tend to have > better memories than the average sighted person. Unless you want to argue > that this is only because of social factors, which I admit probably is a > factor but not the only factor, then better memories will be around even > after all social barriers are removed. I'm pretty sure again that having a > better memory that allows me to quickly recall information changes the way I > am able to think in a non-trivial way. If I suddenly lost my better memory, > even if I didn't need it to get around successfully in the world, it would > have an impact on my sense of self. Would I be a completely different > person? Probably not, but it would affect my identity more than if I went > out and got a haircut tomorrow. > Example 2: You say that evidence shows that the brains of blind people more > or less process information the same way the brains of sighted people do. > I've seen evidence that suggests the contrary, particularly with respect to > language processing. There is evidence that some blind people end up using > the occipital lobe, the part of the brain normally reserved for visual > processing, to conduct language processing. As a result, studies have shown > that certain sorts of language processing occur faster among blind people. > This seems to me that it could also affect the way I think and my sense of > self in a non-trivial way. And it doesn't seem to be entirely social. Any > social context that includes an oral language will have the same result. > Though I admit that this can be more or less emphasized depending on social > factors. > Finally, I wonder if some people think there is a danger in acknowledging > that blindness can shape our identities even in the absence of harmful > social attitudes. I can see the potential danger. If we say that we are > different, then others can argue that we should thus be treated differently. > So I can understand why it might be better to deny it even if it's true. > Alternatively, you could just not think it's true, but I think the examples > of better memories and increased language processing abilities, plus others > that I'm sure I could come up with if I spent some time researching, suggest > that blindness does generally affect the ways in which we are able to think > and thus our sense of self in what I keep saying are merely non-trivial > ways. > Regards, > Marc > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On > Behalf Of Jedi > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 11:57 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity > Marc, > I'm a woman, and I don't see myself differently because I have the > ability to give birth, but I do perceive the world based on the fact > that sexism in all its forms is still alive and well int he world. As > to blindness, I definitely think that we physically perceive the world > slightly different than the sighted, but not enough to really warrant > saying that blindness fundamentally shifts our world view. > Neuroscientists are starting to show that the blind and sighted use the > same rules for perceiving the world, we just use different inputs or > modalities even though our brains more or less process the information > the same way the brains of sighted people do. I think however, that > being blind has produced a number of very interesting experiences that > we all have in common including a world that is obsessed with > perceiving the world visually. I use the word "obsessed" because it's > clear that while vision is useful, it's almost like sighted people > sometimes go overboard with touchscreens and a lot of flashy and > unnecessary graphic material. Add the fact that the NfB as an > organization with assumptions and values that shape our blindness lives > and even our non-blindness lives, and you've got the making of a > cultural identity. > Respectfully, > Jedi > Original message: >> I think the issue of blindness constituting identity is definitely very >> interesting, and I've been thinking about it a bit recently. >> I believe that blindness does shape our sense of who we are, and this is >> largely socially influenced, but it's also deeper than that. It's almost >> certainly true that the challenges, discrimination, exclusion, etc that >> blind people routinely experience influence our identity. However, and > this >> is where I part somewhat with so called NFB philosophy, I'm not sure that, >> in the absence of these factors, blindness would be reduced to a mere >> characteristic, if mere characteristic is supposed to mean something > rather >> trivial and unimportant like hair and eye colour. I definitely think > that, >> in the absence of social and environmental barriers, blind people would be >> able to flourish as well as anyone else; I don't question that claim, but > I >> think perceiving the world in a unique way, in the way blind people do > with >> little or no sight, is a significant factor in how a person's identity is >> constituted. >> Arielle called sex a mere characteristic. As with blindness, if calling > it >> a mere characteristic is supposed to mean that it is as trivial as being 5 >> foot 6 instead of 5 foot 5, then I don't think it is a mere > characteristic. >> I don't have evidence of this, but I think I would feel differently about > my >> body if I had the ability to grow a human being inside of it. My hunch is >> that the ability, or lack of ability, to give birth probably affects how > one >> views one's body and thus one's sense of self in a non-trivial way. >> Similarly, relying heavily on auditory input, developing better memories, >> perceiving the world with little to no reliance on sight, I think these > all >> affect a person's sense of identity in non-trivial ways, and they don't >> depend on social factors. >> Clarification, I'm not trying to suggest that women are defined by their >> ability to give birth. I'm only saying that to possess that ability might >> shape how you think about yourself in a way that is more significant than >> whether you have short or long hair. >> Best, >> Marc >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >> Behalf Of Arielle Silverman >> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 7:08 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >> Hi again, >> Re-reading the posts thus far, I will add that I agree with Jedi. >> Blindness itself doesn't constitute the social identity. The identity >> comes from the social reaction we experience as a result of blindness, >> and the ways we've developed to respond to that social reaction. I >> would venture to guess that this is similar to the effects of skin >> color or biological sex on the development of racial and gender >> identities. Race and sex are mere characteristics to the extent that >> they by themselves don't influence how people function, just as >> blindness by itself doesn't significantly alter or take away from how >> we function. It's the social expectations associated with race, sex, >> and disability that shape how those identities form and how they >> influence people's sense of self. >> Arielle >> On 3/25/10, Arielle Silverman wrote: >>> Hi all, >>> A few comments from an amateur social psychologist: >>> There is research showing that members of minority groups (i.e. ethnic >>> minorities) sometimes experience the same kinds of awkward >>> interactions with majority group members that we have discussed as >>> happening to blind people. Specifically, majority group members (i.e. >>> white Americans) sometimes feel awkward when interacting with minority >>> members, especially out of concern that they might accidentally come >>> across as being prejudiced or racist. The result is that the >>> interaction tends to be strained and there is more tension than there >>> should be, and minority group members can get left out as a result of >>> the awkwardness. Of course this doesn't happen to all minority members >>> and certainly many majority members have no problem interacting across >>> race or ethnicity lines, just as plenty of sighted people have no >>> problem befriending, working with or dating blind people. But it is a >>> general tendency. >>> I think the question of whether blindness is an identity or a >>> situation/characteristic is interesting. My hunch is that it depends >>> on who you ask; in other words, blind people can range from being >>> completely disidentified (and often not voluntarily associating with >>> other blind people) to completely identified and highly affiliated (to >>> the point of having no close sighted friends). For low-identifiers, >>> blindness probably feels more like a single characteristic; for high >>> identifiers, blindness may feel like a trait coupled with a social >>> group label. In the NFB, when we talk about "the blind" or "the >>> nation's blind", we are implicitly acknowledging that the blind have a >>> common identity, even if we don't all believe that this common >>> identity or fate is rooted in culture. >>> As part of my Ph.D. training I do intend to do some research >>> investigating whether blindness is a coherent identity and, if it is, >>> whether it has similar effects on people's self-concept and behavior >>> as other identities (i.e. ethnic, religious, etc.) For example, I >>> suspect that the constant messages we get from the public about our >>> inferiority and the devastation of blindness pose unique psychological >>> issues that we contend with, and that it can be difficult to see >>> ourselves as whole, capable beings when our identities as blind people >>> are construed in the public eye as compromised or broken. >>> One final thought: I've found it interesting that many sighted people >>> seem to think of blindness as a condition or trait but don't think of >>> "the blind" as a coherent group with the same rights as racial, >>> ethnic, and other cultural groups. This was apparent in the debate >>> over the movie Blindness. I heard several people (some sighted, some >>> blind) argue that the movie was OK because the people portrayed in it >>> weren't "real blind people"; rather, they were sighted people who went >>> blind as part of the plot. Of course, any of us who were sighted at >>> one time know that people who go blind are still blind people; >>> nevertheless, there appeared to be that distinction in some people's >>> minds. I think this is also why it's hard for us to make civil rights >>> arguments against blatant injustices (i.e. "Treating blacks with this >>> kind of discrimination is unacceptable, and so treating us this way is >>> also unacceptable"). A lot of people just don't get it, or think that >>> treating blind people differently is OK because stereotypes about >>> blindness are somehow more valid than stereotypes about other minority >>> groups. I'm not sure how to bridge that thought gap or how to >>> demonstrate the existence of the common blind identity in situations >>> where we are all affected by the same discriminations or denials of >>> rights. >>> Arielle >>> On 3/25/10, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>>> True. Maybe the reason I'm anti social is I have no social skills to >>>> begin >>>> it I wirhwe talk to much or don't' talk at all and sometimes I come >>>> across >>>> as rude but I'm so used to beeing int he teaching invironment that I >>>> cannot >>>> for me get out of it. I'm not making much sense as I am starting to get > a >>>> bit hungry.. Hehaha. I do know this much I have a harder time > socialising >>>> with the sighree then with the bind. theer is so much that can be >>>> comunicated in silence. so much we can't see. >>>> I really enjoy reading these discussions and view points as it makes me >>>> think about what I need to work on or not bather working on. >>>> Take care all. >>>> On Mar 24, 2010, at 9:14 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: >>>>> Interesting. If we're talking straight up blindness, I think we've all >>>>> experienced a moment or two of feeling out of place in light of the >>>>> dominant >>>>> sighted crowd. I certainly experience with each meeting I attend until >>>>> I >>>>> shake off the feeling and plunge forward. If we're talking ethnic >>>>> minority, >>>>> I can't say I've experienced that before, but I don't know if it's >>>>> because >>>>> the feeling is overshadowed by the blindness factor or because I've >>>>> genuinely never witnessed this behavior. >>>>> Regardless, what I find interesting about this discussion is that it >>>>> makes >>>>> blindness an identity factor. I think the original post asked how we > as >>>>> blind individuals handled campus involvement, when our philosophy > claims >>>>> blindness can be reduced to the level of a nuisance. I know this >>>>> position >>>>> does not claim blindness can be eliminated, but it would appear to >>>>> suggest >>>>> blindness is irrelevant to one's sense of self. So, rather than ask, >>>>> "how >>>>> do you, as a blind person, handle X, Y and Z," shouldn't we be asking >>>>> how >>>>> to >>>>> handle the task in general? >>>>> Interesting discussion. >>>>> Joe Orozco >>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >>>>> sleeves, >>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 8:51 PM >>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>> Joe, >>>>> The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually becoming >>>>> a key issue for those who study organizational communication and >>>>> diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a fancy >>>>> way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently based >>>>> on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member of >>>>> a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just >>>>> didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by your >>>>> minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or one >>>>> of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or maybe >>>>> it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. >>>>> Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is controlled >>>>> by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are >>>>> rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less likely >>>>> to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some point >>>>> and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that for >>>>> people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or one >>>>> of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't yet >>>>> become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant >>>>> population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to >>>>> experience this interesting problem at some point. >>>>> Respectfully, >>>>> Jedi >>>>> Original message: >>>>>> Jedi, >>>>>> I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or >>>>> witnessed this >>>>>> behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, >>>>> could you give >>>>>> examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification to >>>>>> explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be >>>>> accurate. >>>>>> Joe Orozco >>>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up >>>>> their sleeves, >>>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM >>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>>> It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for >>>>>> minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in >>>>>> school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of >>>>> access to >>>>>> informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real >>>>>> obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from >>>>>> just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a >>>>>> large gap between minorities and their non-minority >>>>> counterparts. There >>>>>> really is no right way to handle this problem because it >>>>> affects us all >>>>>> so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left >>>>> out, it may >>>>>> be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear you. >>>>>> Respectfully, >>>>>> Jedi >>>>>> Original message: >>>>>>> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of >>>>>> clubs or other >>>>>>> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew >>>>>> for a play, but >>>>>>> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything >>>>>> other than >>>>>>> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I >>>>>> did my job >>>>>>> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that >>>>>> if they talked >>>>>>> to me they would offend me or something like that. >>>>>>> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved >>>>> in the boy >>>>>>> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy >>>>>> scouts and life >>>>>>> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or >>>>>> technical in >>>>>>> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't >>>>>> know if this is >>>>>>> blindness related, or what. >>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>>>> From: "Jamie Principato" >>>>>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>>>>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get >>>>>> involved in as >>>>>>>> much >>>>>>>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz >>>>> Band, and a >>>>>>>> Youth >>>>>>>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate >>>>> and public >>>>>>>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I >>>>>> couldn't wait >>>>>>>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups >>>>>> and activities >>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>> choose from. >>>>>>>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot >>>>>> of...problems...with the >>>>>>>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went >>>>>> to this high >>>>>>>> school because we were told it offered the most for >>>>> visually impaired >>>>>>>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but >>>>>> I'll spare you >>>>>>>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students >>>>>> at this school >>>>>>>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, >>>>>>>> avoiding >>>>>>>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after >>>>>> joining Model UN >>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and >>>>>> planning to go to >>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the >>>>>> fact t I joined >>>>>>>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and >>>>>> that if I was >>>>>>>> going >>>>>>>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a >>>>>> permission note (no >>>>>>>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a >>>>>>>> teacher >>>>>>>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I >>>>> attend these >>>>>>>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally >>>>>> unless I sat >>>>>>>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman >>>>>> stands with my >>>>>>>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was >>>>>> unnecessary, and we >>>>>>>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other >>>>>>>> issues, >>>>>>>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. >>>>>>>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home >>>>>> school support >>>>>>>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I >>>>>> took advantage >>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular >>>>>> activities in >>>>>>>> my >>>>>>>> community, even sports (something that never would have >>>>> flown at that >>>>>>>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on >>>>>> campus and in >>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing >>>>>> club, a volunteer >>>>>>>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also >>>>>> try to get the >>>>>>>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, >>>>>> and make use of >>>>>>>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been >>>>>> having is that >>>>>>>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by >>>>>> house recently >>>>>>>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the >>>>>> evening. The only >>>>>>>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or >>>>>> get home from >>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you >>>>>> need to get >>>>>>>> out >>>>>>>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if >>>>>> money is tight >>>>>>>> one >>>>>>>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside >>>>>> of attending >>>>>>>> class, including attending free activities or events. I >>>>>> guess that's just >>>>>>>> one price of living off campus though. >>>>>>>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> Hi list, >>>>>>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>>>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>>>>>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new >>>>> people? do you >>>>>>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>>>>>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- >>>>>> identity as >>>>>>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>>>>>>> people interact with you? >>>>>>>>> Thoughts? >>>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>>> Darian >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a >>>>>> nationwide teacher >>>>>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>>> account info for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr >>>>>> dfly%40gmail.com >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>> account info for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% >>>>>> 40gmail.com >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>> info for nabs-l: >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin >>>>>> djedi%40samobile.net >>>>> -- >>>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>> info for nabs-l: >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco >>>>> %40gmail.com >>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of >>>>> virus signature database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>>> http://www.eset.com >>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>>>> signature >>>>> database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>>> http://www.eset.com >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gma >> il.com >>> -- >>> Arielle Silverman >>> President, National Association of Blind Students >>> Phone: 602-502-2255 >>> Email: >>> nabs.president at gmail.com >>> Website: >>> www.nabslink.org >> -- >> Arielle Silverman >> President, National Association of Blind Students >> Phone: 602-502-2255 >> Email: >> nabs.president at gmail.com >> Website: >> www.nabslink.org >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >> il.com >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo > bile.net > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit > www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma > il.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo bile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma il.com From brileyp at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 03:04:21 2010 From: brileyp at gmail.com (Briley Pollard) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 22:04:21 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity In-Reply-To: <20100326191429.15536.71193@web1> References: <20100326191429.15536.71193@web1> Message-ID: <674E5E11-CC29-45D3-87F5-51A2302E0743@gmail.com> Jedi, I was simply adding to the convo. I agreed with how you identified identity, and your comments about blindness as an aspect of identity. What I was mainly responding too was the comment someone made about blind people sometimes isolating or dealing with only other blind people in social situations because they are uncomfortable in a sighted world. In that sense, I was just saying that sometimes blind people overidentify with their blindness. How we see ourselves and how others see us are different sides of the same coin I suppose. On Mar 26, 2010, at 2:14 PM, Jedi wrote: > Briley and all: > > It may be useful to define identity in this context. When I talk about identity, I don't mean that blindness does or should become the major influence in one's life. Instead, I mean to speak of identity in the same context of other social justice movements and communication situations where identity is a key player in a given context. How much one identifieis with the blindness community is going to depend heavily on a lot of things including what other identities a person has such as being a woman, a person of color, gay, disabled in some other way, Christian, the list goes on. A lot will also depend on life experiences because some of those identities are highlighted for each of us specifically in different ways. Does that make sense? > > Respectfully, > Jedi > > > Original message: >> You present some interesting and valid points, Antonio. I've always been troubled by the fact that some blind people seem to grab onto that, and hold it as the most important aspect of their identity. Blindness is a part of who I am, and it is important, this I will never deny. I am also a woman, a sister, a musician, a daughter, etc. I am not ashamed of my blindness, but I live in a sighted world, and by cutting myself off from that, I would not only be doing myself a disservice, but the sighted world. Do I have blind friends? Of course I do. Do we share common frustrations due to our common trait? Yes. But I also have sighted friends, and I don't feel any less kinship with them because they can see and I can't. > >> I am saddened by the fact that I have heard many of my blind peers say that they only have blind friends, and they wouldn't know how to go about starting relationships with sighted people. This would be like me as a Christian exclusively associating with only Christians. Is it nice to have friends who share my beliefs? Of course. But it is important to have people in my life with a different perspective. > >> Is it sometimes difficult to integrate ourselves into a world where people may be uncomfortable with us? Yes. But that doesn't mean we should stop trying. > >> Briley > >> On Mar 26, 2010, at 8:40 AM, Antonio M. Guimaraes wrote: > >>> Interesting points, Mark. > >>> Some times the blind community identifies so much with being blind to the point of doing most things and conducting much of their interactions with other blind people. Some have mentioned during the scholastic socialization discussion that their time is taken up mostly with NFB business, and not much else. > >>> While this is important work, the NFB and other blind people exist in a bigger world context, and to exclude ourselves, our activities, and our work from the world is to make blindness more than it needs to be. > >>> That said, I am blind, and identify myself as such. Not doing so would consist in denial. My blindness presents challenges, maybe yours doesn't, and I am fighting almost daily to improve my access and participation in the world I want to be a part of. > >>> People notice my green eyes every day, but that characteristic does not present challenges. I need to read some of the NFB philosophy articles again to speak with more authority on them, but we some times take these writings as dogma, and take them out of context. I don't think Jernigan was diminishing the meaning of how hard it is to be blind at times. He was some times imagining a perfect world where every blind person has training and opportunity. And therein lies the precondition to normal life as a blind person: training and opportunity. I haven't much where cooking skills are concerned, but I don't have to go back to an NFB-run center to get good training in that regard. In some regards, some training centers are a drama magnet for the residents. > >>> As long as I get the training somewhere, and have the opportunity, then I will live that area of life more confidently as a blind person. > >>> One can not get all the training necessary for life in a 6 month period, so we keep getting trained in life, and opening the doors for ourselves. > >>> Antonio Guimaraes > >>> If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary works in Braille. > >>> Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you. >>> http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169 >>> Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marc Workman" >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 11:29 PM >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity > > >>>> I think the issue of blindness constituting identity is definitely very >>>> interesting, and I've been thinking about it a bit recently. > >>>> I believe that blindness does shape our sense of who we are, and this is >>>> largely socially influenced, but it's also deeper than that. It's almost >>>> certainly true that the challenges, discrimination, exclusion, etc that >>>> blind people routinely experience influence our identity. However, and this >>>> is where I part somewhat with so called NFB philosophy, I'm not sure that, >>>> in the absence of these factors, blindness would be reduced to a mere >>>> characteristic, if mere characteristic is supposed to mean something rather >>>> trivial and unimportant like hair and eye colour. I definitely think that, >>>> in the absence of social and environmental barriers, blind people would be >>>> able to flourish as well as anyone else; I don't question that claim, but I >>>> think perceiving the world in a unique way, in the way blind people do with >>>> little or no sight, is a significant factor in how a person's identity is >>>> constituted. > >>>> Arielle called sex a mere characteristic. As with blindness, if calling it >>>> a mere characteristic is supposed to mean that it is as trivial as being 5 >>>> foot 6 instead of 5 foot 5, then I don't think it is a mere characteristic. >>>> I don't have evidence of this, but I think I would feel differently about my >>>> body if I had the ability to grow a human being inside of it. My hunch is >>>> that the ability, or lack of ability, to give birth probably affects how one >>>> views one's body and thus one's sense of self in a non-trivial way. >>>> Similarly, relying heavily on auditory input, developing better memories, >>>> perceiving the world with little to no reliance on sight, I think these all >>>> affect a person's sense of identity in non-trivial ways, and they don't >>>> depend on social factors. > >>>> Clarification, I'm not trying to suggest that women are defined by their >>>> ability to give birth. I'm only saying that to possess that ability might >>>> shape how you think about yourself in a way that is more significant than >>>> whether you have short or long hair. > >>>> Best, > >>>> Marc > >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >>>> Behalf Of Arielle Silverman >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 7:08 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > > >>>> Hi again, > >>>> Re-reading the posts thus far, I will add that I agree with Jedi. >>>> Blindness itself doesn't constitute the social identity. The identity >>>> comes from the social reaction we experience as a result of blindness, >>>> and the ways we've developed to respond to that social reaction. I >>>> would venture to guess that this is similar to the effects of skin >>>> color or biological sex on the development of racial and gender >>>> identities. Race and sex are mere characteristics to the extent that >>>> they by themselves don't influence how people function, just as >>>> blindness by itself doesn't significantly alter or take away from how >>>> we function. It's the social expectations associated with race, sex, >>>> and disability that shape how those identities form and how they >>>> influence people's sense of self. > >>>> Arielle > > >>>> On 3/25/10, Arielle Silverman wrote: >>>>> Hi all, > >>>>> A few comments from an amateur social psychologist: > >>>>> There is research showing that members of minority groups (i.e. ethnic >>>>> minorities) sometimes experience the same kinds of awkward >>>>> interactions with majority group members that we have discussed as >>>>> happening to blind people. Specifically, majority group members (i.e. >>>>> white Americans) sometimes feel awkward when interacting with minority >>>>> members, especially out of concern that they might accidentally come >>>>> across as being prejudiced or racist. The result is that the >>>>> interaction tends to be strained and there is more tension than there >>>>> should be, and minority group members can get left out as a result of >>>>> the awkwardness. Of course this doesn't happen to all minority members >>>>> and certainly many majority members have no problem interacting across >>>>> race or ethnicity lines, just as plenty of sighted people have no >>>>> problem befriending, working with or dating blind people. But it is a >>>>> general tendency. > >>>>> I think the question of whether blindness is an identity or a >>>>> situation/characteristic is interesting. My hunch is that it depends >>>>> on who you ask; in other words, blind people can range from being >>>>> completely disidentified (and often not voluntarily associating with >>>>> other blind people) to completely identified and highly affiliated (to >>>>> the point of having no close sighted friends). For low-identifiers, >>>>> blindness probably feels more like a single characteristic; for high >>>>> identifiers, blindness may feel like a trait coupled with a social >>>>> group label. In the NFB, when we talk about "the blind" or "the >>>>> nation's blind", we are implicitly acknowledging that the blind have a >>>>> common identity, even if we don't all believe that this common >>>>> identity or fate is rooted in culture. > >>>>> As part of my Ph.D. training I do intend to do some research >>>>> investigating whether blindness is a coherent identity and, if it is, >>>>> whether it has similar effects on people's self-concept and behavior >>>>> as other identities (i.e. ethnic, religious, etc.) For example, I >>>>> suspect that the constant messages we get from the public about our >>>>> inferiority and the devastation of blindness pose unique psychological >>>>> issues that we contend with, and that it can be difficult to see >>>>> ourselves as whole, capable beings when our identities as blind people >>>>> are construed in the public eye as compromised or broken. > >>>>> One final thought: I've found it interesting that many sighted people >>>>> seem to think of blindness as a condition or trait but don't think of >>>>> "the blind" as a coherent group with the same rights as racial, >>>>> ethnic, and other cultural groups. This was apparent in the debate >>>>> over the movie Blindness. I heard several people (some sighted, some >>>>> blind) argue that the movie was OK because the people portrayed in it >>>>> weren't "real blind people"; rather, they were sighted people who went >>>>> blind as part of the plot. Of course, any of us who were sighted at >>>>> one time know that people who go blind are still blind people; >>>>> nevertheless, there appeared to be that distinction in some people's >>>>> minds. I think this is also why it's hard for us to make civil rights >>>>> arguments against blatant injustices (i.e. "Treating blacks with this >>>>> kind of discrimination is unacceptable, and so treating us this way is >>>>> also unacceptable"). A lot of people just don't get it, or think that >>>>> treating blind people differently is OK because stereotypes about >>>>> blindness are somehow more valid than stereotypes about other minority >>>>> groups. I'm not sure how to bridge that thought gap or how to >>>>> demonstrate the existence of the common blind identity in situations >>>>> where we are all affected by the same discriminations or denials of >>>>> rights. > >>>>> Arielle > >>>>> On 3/25/10, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>>>>> True. Maybe the reason I'm anti social is I have no social skills to >>>>>> begin >>>>>> it I wirhwe talk to much or don't' talk at all and sometimes I come >>>>>> across >>>>>> as rude but I'm so used to beeing int he teaching invironment that I >>>>>> cannot >>>>>> for me get out of it. I'm not making much sense as I am starting to get a >>>>>> bit hungry.. Hehaha. I do know this much I have a harder time socialising >>>>>> with the sighree then with the bind. theer is so much that can be >>>>>> comunicated in silence. so much we can't see. > >>>>>> I really enjoy reading these discussions and view points as it makes me >>>>>> think about what I need to work on or not bather working on. > >>>>>> Take care all. >>>>>> On Mar 24, 2010, at 9:14 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: > >>>>>>> Interesting. If we're talking straight up blindness, I think we've all >>>>>>> experienced a moment or two of feeling out of place in light of the >>>>>>> dominant >>>>>>> sighted crowd. I certainly experience with each meeting I attend until >>>>>>> I >>>>>>> shake off the feeling and plunge forward. If we're talking ethnic >>>>>>> minority, >>>>>>> I can't say I've experienced that before, but I don't know if it's >>>>>>> because >>>>>>> the feeling is overshadowed by the blindness factor or because I've >>>>>>> genuinely never witnessed this behavior. > >>>>>>> Regardless, what I find interesting about this discussion is that it >>>>>>> makes >>>>>>> blindness an identity factor. I think the original post asked how we as >>>>>>> blind individuals handled campus involvement, when our philosophy claims >>>>>>> blindness can be reduced to the level of a nuisance. I know this >>>>>>> position >>>>>>> does not claim blindness can be eliminated, but it would appear to >>>>>>> suggest >>>>>>> blindness is irrelevant to one's sense of self. So, rather than ask, >>>>>>> "how >>>>>>> do you, as a blind person, handle X, Y and Z," shouldn't we be asking >>>>>>> how >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> handle the task in general? > >>>>>>> Interesting discussion. > >>>>>>> Joe Orozco > >>>>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >>>>>>> sleeves, >>>>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 8:51 PM >>>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > >>>>>>> Joe, > >>>>>>> The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually becoming >>>>>>> a key issue for those who study organizational communication and >>>>>>> diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a fancy >>>>>>> way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently based >>>>>>> on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member of >>>>>>> a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just >>>>>>> didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by your >>>>>>> minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or one >>>>>>> of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or maybe >>>>>>> it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. >>>>>>> Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is controlled >>>>>>> by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are >>>>>>> rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less likely >>>>>>> to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some point >>>>>>> and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that for >>>>>>> people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or one >>>>>>> of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't yet >>>>>>> become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant >>>>>>> population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to >>>>>>> experience this interesting problem at some point. > >>>>>>> Respectfully, >>>>>>> Jedi > > >>>>>>> Original message: >>>>>>>> Jedi, > >>>>>>>> I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or >>>>>>> witnessed this >>>>>>>> behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, >>>>>>> could you give >>>>>>>> examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification to >>>>>>>> explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be >>>>>>> accurate. > >>>>>>>> Joe Orozco > >>>>>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up >>>>>>> their sleeves, >>>>>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM >>>>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > >>>>>>>> It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for >>>>>>>> minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in >>>>>>>> school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of >>>>>>> access to >>>>>>>> informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real >>>>>>>> obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from >>>>>>>> just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a >>>>>>>> large gap between minorities and their non-minority >>>>>>> counterparts. There >>>>>>>> really is no right way to handle this problem because it >>>>>>> affects us all >>>>>>>> so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left >>>>>>> out, it may >>>>>>>> be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear you. > >>>>>>>> Respectfully, >>>>>>>> Jedi > > >>>>>>>> Original message: >>>>>>>>> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of >>>>>>>> clubs or other >>>>>>>>> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew >>>>>>>> for a play, but >>>>>>>>> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything >>>>>>>> other than >>>>>>>>> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I >>>>>>>> did my job >>>>>>>>> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that >>>>>>>> if they talked >>>>>>>>> to me they would offend me or something like that. > >>>>>>>>> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved >>>>>>> in the boy >>>>>>>>> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy >>>>>>>> scouts and life >>>>>>>>> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or >>>>>>>> technical in >>>>>>>>> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't >>>>>>>> know if this is >>>>>>>>> blindness related, or what. > > >>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>>>>>> From: "Jamie Principato" >>>>>>>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > > >>>>>>>>>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get >>>>>>>> involved in as >>>>>>>>>> much >>>>>>>>>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz >>>>>>> Band, and a >>>>>>>>>> Youth >>>>>>>>>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate >>>>>>> and public >>>>>>>>>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I >>>>>>>> couldn't wait >>>>>>>>>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups >>>>>>>> and activities >>>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>> choose from. > >>>>>>>>>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot >>>>>>>> of...problems...with the >>>>>>>>>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went >>>>>>>> to this high >>>>>>>>>> school because we were told it offered the most for >>>>>>> visually impaired >>>>>>>>>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but >>>>>>>> I'll spare you >>>>>>>>>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students >>>>>>>> at this school >>>>>>>>>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, >>>>>>>>>> avoiding >>>>>>>>>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after >>>>>>>> joining Model UN >>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and >>>>>>>> planning to go to >>>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the >>>>>>>> fact t I joined >>>>>>>>>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and >>>>>>>> that if I was >>>>>>>>>> going >>>>>>>>>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a >>>>>>>> permission note (no >>>>>>>>>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find a >>>>>>>>>> teacher >>>>>>>>>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I >>>>>>> attend these >>>>>>>>>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally >>>>>>>> unless I sat >>>>>>>>>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman >>>>>>>> stands with my >>>>>>>>>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was >>>>>>>> unnecessary, and we >>>>>>>>>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other >>>>>>>>>> issues, >>>>>>>>>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. > >>>>>>>>>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home >>>>>>>> school support >>>>>>>>>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I >>>>>>>> took advantage >>>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular >>>>>>>> activities in >>>>>>>>>> my >>>>>>>>>> community, even sports (something that never would have >>>>>>> flown at that >>>>>>>>>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on >>>>>>>> campus and in >>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing >>>>>>>> club, a volunteer >>>>>>>>>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also >>>>>>>> try to get the >>>>>>>>>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, >>>>>>>> and make use of >>>>>>>>>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been >>>>>>>> having is that >>>>>>>>>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by >>>>>>>> house recently >>>>>>>>>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the >>>>>>>> evening. The only >>>>>>>>>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or >>>>>>>> get home from >>>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you >>>>>>>> need to get >>>>>>>>>> out >>>>>>>>>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if >>>>>>>> money is tight >>>>>>>>>> one >>>>>>>>>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside >>>>>>>> of attending >>>>>>>>>> class, including attending free activities or events. I >>>>>>>> guess that's just >>>>>>>>>> one price of living off campus though. > >>>>>>>>>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith >>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>> Hi list, > >>>>>>>>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>>>>>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school or >>>>>>>>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new >>>>>>> people? do you >>>>>>>>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at a >>>>>>>>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- >>>>>>>> identity as >>>>>>>>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>>>>>>>>> people interact with you? >>>>>>>>>>> Thoughts? >>>>>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>>>>> Darian >>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>>>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>>>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>>>>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a >>>>>>>> nationwide teacher >>>>>>>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>>>>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need your >>>>>>>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>>>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org > >>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>>>>> account info for >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: > > >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr >>>>>>>> dfly%40gmail.com > >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>>>> account info for >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: > >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% >>>>>>>> 40gmail.com > > >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>> info for nabs-l: > >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin >>>>>>>> djedi%40samobile.net > >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>>>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>> info for nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco >>>>>>> %40gmail.com > > >>>>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of >>>>>>> virus signature database 4972 (20100324) __________ > >>>>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > >>>>>>> http://www.eset.com > > > >>>>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>>>>>> signature >>>>>>> database 4972 (20100324) __________ > >>>>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > >>>>>>> http://www.eset.com > > > >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>>> nabs-l: > >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com > > >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: > >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gma >>>> il.com > > > >>>>> -- >>>>> Arielle Silverman >>>>> President, National Association of Blind Students >>>>> Phone: 602-502-2255 >>>>> Email: >>>>> nabs.president at gmail.com >>>>> Website: >>>>> www.nabslink.org > > > >>>> -- >>>> Arielle Silverman >>>> President, National Association of Blind Students >>>> Phone: 602-502-2255 >>>> Email: >>>> nabs.president at gmail.com >>>> Website: >>>> www.nabslink.org > >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >>>> il.com > > >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net > > >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com > > >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Sat Mar 27 03:19:44 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 23:19:44 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity Message-ID: <20100327031944.4299.4719@web3> Marc, This is a circular argument as far as I'm concerned, and i don't think we're going to ever agree completely on this issue. I don't know how many times I have to tell you that I don't see myself differently because I have the ability to give birth. If I do, it's because I learned from my society that I'm supposed to. But before that, I really didn't care. And to be honest, I care about it less than some other women do. Same goes for my blindness. Before I learned that i'm different from others, it didn't occur to me that I couldn't see. I just figured that I was what I was. What it really comes down to is that society tells us what different experiences mean, and we think of ourselves based on those meanings. For example, most White people don't really think about the fact that they're White because it's not something that's regularly drawn attention to. That may be less true now that discussions about racism have become more mainstream, but people take their Whiteness for granted because they are sort of like the invisible norm. Other ethnicities don't have that luxury, so they are more aware of their skin color because society has told them that they are different from White people in fundamental ways. If there was no meaning assigned to skin color, we might observe that someone is Black and someone is White, but that's about as far as it would go. But instead, this socially constructed meaning created that identity that having a different skin color other than White produces. I think your article is interesting because it almost repeats long-held notions about blind people that have been around in the field of special education for a long time: blind people's language development is delayed, especially since they can't see what's being talked about in order to link some object with it's symbolic counterpart, yet blind people develop an amazingness with words themselves because they have no other way to really get information. Some folks believe that even our amazing ability with words isn't enough since we still can't link these words with the things they represent. What I think is really going on with these brain studies is that blind people are using parts of their brains to make inferences about what they're being told. It's a skill we pick up over time as a way of supplimenting what we already get. I wouldn't be terribly surprised if the sighted could do the same thing and that more of their brains would light up if they used the skill more. there's a fine distinction there. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Jedi, > I hope that I did not try to tell you what you think about your ability to > give birth. I said that I wasn't sure it was possible to say that you don't > see yourself differently. I admit I should have clarified, but what I said > has absolutely nothing to do with you and what you think about yourself. I > was saying that it is literally impossible to make a claim like the one you > made. The reason it is impossible is because to know for sure if you do or > do not see yourself differently as a result of possessing the ability to > give birth, you would have had to have grown up as a man and as a woman, > which is not physically possible. So I suppose you can say that you don't > think about it, and you probably don't, but since you have nothing to > compare it to, it's impossible to say whether it does or does not shape how > you think about yourself. It would be like me saying, I don't think about > my ability to be self-aware. Therefore, it isn't a part of my identity, or, > I don't think much about my ability to feel pain, so I would be the same > person if I lacked this ability. I can say that I don't think about these > things, and it can be true that I don't think about these things, but I > can't say that they do not shape my identity, which is what I thought you > were trying to say. > The deeper claim I'm making is that identity is not something you can just > step outside of and say features X and Y are part of my identity, but > features A, B, and C are not. I want to say that there are things about you > that affect your identity that you are not at all aware of, and it is not > possible to step outside of your identity and take stock of the factors that > make you who you are. If you step outside of your identity, the you that is > doing the stepping disappears. So it's a philosophical claim that you can > never no for sure what exactly shapes your sense of self because knowing > this would require stepping outside yourself to have a look, but this is not > possible. > As for language processing, I'm going to paste an article abstract below my > name. It discusses the faster language processing that I mentioned. > Please correct me if I'm wrong: The difference in opinion here seems to be > that you think that identity is socially constructed. I'm only suggesting > that there is a close link between the body and identity and that possessing > a body that functions in a rather significantly different way (e.g., one > that is capable of visual perception versus one that is not) has a > non-trivial impact on one's sense of self. It doesn't strike me as a > particularly bold claim, no more than to say that I would probably be a > different person if I had a photographic memory, the ability to sense > infrared signals, or the sense of smell of a dog. And though I don't think > that how we perceive our bodies is beyond social influence, I'm not sure > that it is entirely socially constructed either. > Abstract follows. > Marc > Event -related potentials during auditory language processing in > congenitally blind and sighted people > Brigitte Roder > Abstract > While behavioral studies have documented delayed language acquisition in > blind children, other studies have revealed better speech discrimination > abilities for blind than sighted adults. Several brain imaging studies have > provided evidence for cortical reorganization due to visual deprivation but > the cerebral organization of language in blind humans is not known yet. > We hypothesized that the increasing specialization of language systems > normally observed during development may not take place to the same degree > in blind individuals since posterior visual areas do not receive their > adequate input. On the other hand, we hypothesized that blind people, due to > their greater reliance upon the auditory language signal, may process speech > faster than sighted people. > To test these assumptions, event-related potentials were recorded while 11 > congenitally blind and 11 sighted adults matched in age, gender, handedness > and education were engaged in a language task. Participants listened to > sentences in order to decide after each sentence if it was meaningful or > not. > Incongruous sentence-final words elicited an N400 effect in both groups. The > N400 effect had a left-lateralized fronto-central scalp distribution in the > sighted but a symmetric and broad topography in the blind. Furthermore, the > N400 effect started earlier in the blind than in the sighted. Closed class > compared to open class sentence middle words elicited a more pronounced late > negativity in the blind than in the sighted. > These results suggest that blind people process auditory language stimuli > faster than sighted people and that some language functions may be > reorganized in the blind. > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On > Behalf Of Jedi > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2010 1:14 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity > Marc, > Seems how you're not a woman, and seems how you're not me, it isn't > your place to tell me what I think about myself in light of my ability > to give birth. I'm telling you that aside from the social consequences > of being the child bearing half of the spiecies, I don't think about it > much, and I suspect you would because you're not a woman. That is not > to say that some women don't think about it more than I do, but I > personally don't think about it much. I also suspect that sighted > people think the same way. They think about the differences of > blindness more than many of us do. > Next, blind people do not have inherently better memories nor better > language processing skills. On the whole, we're on par with the sighted > even if there are small brain differences. Just hanging out at an NFB > meeting or convention shows us how many differences there are between > us all: some have better memories than others, some are well spoken > while others aren't. The research I'm speaking of shows that blind > people handle voice recognition with the same parts of the brain that > the sighted handle face recognition and that we handle space-related > tasks with the same mechanism the sighted do except that we use > different inputs for the information. The occipital lobe of the brain > lights up when reading Braille the same way it does when reading print. > For some of us, the occipital lobe lights up when listening to text > because that's our primary form of reading. that may be linked to the > researched you're talking about. > Respectfully, > Jedi > Original message: >> Jedi, >> I'm not sure it's possible to say that you don't see yourself differently >> because you have the ability to give birth. I'm only saying that I > suspect >> I would view my body differently if I had that ability. It's not > something >> I'll ever know. But here's another example if that one doesn't satisfy > you. >> If I were a woman, I would probably be 60 pounds lighter and six or seven >> inches shorter on average. Again, I can't say for sure, but I'm pretty > sure >> that living in the world, in any world, with a body that is 60 pounds >> lighter and 7 inches shorter would have a non-trivial impact on my sense > of >> self. >> And here's a blindness example. In my experience, blind people tend to > have >> better memories than the average sighted person. Unless you want to argue >> that this is only because of social factors, which I admit probably is a >> factor but not the only factor, then better memories will be around even >> after all social barriers are removed. I'm pretty sure again that having > a >> better memory that allows me to quickly recall information changes the way > I >> am able to think in a non-trivial way. If I suddenly lost my better > memory, >> even if I didn't need it to get around successfully in the world, it would >> have an impact on my sense of self. Would I be a completely different >> person? Probably not, but it would affect my identity more than if I went >> out and got a haircut tomorrow. >> Example 2: You say that evidence shows that the brains of blind people > more >> or less process information the same way the brains of sighted people do. >> I've seen evidence that suggests the contrary, particularly with respect > to >> language processing. There is evidence that some blind people end up > using >> the occipital lobe, the part of the brain normally reserved for visual >> processing, to conduct language processing. As a result, studies have > shown >> that certain sorts of language processing occur faster among blind people. >> This seems to me that it could also affect the way I think and my sense of >> self in a non-trivial way. And it doesn't seem to be entirely social. > Any >> social context that includes an oral language will have the same result. >> Though I admit that this can be more or less emphasized depending on > social >> factors. >> Finally, I wonder if some people think there is a danger in acknowledging >> that blindness can shape our identities even in the absence of harmful >> social attitudes. I can see the potential danger. If we say that we are >> different, then others can argue that we should thus be treated > differently. >> So I can understand why it might be better to deny it even if it's true. >> Alternatively, you could just not think it's true, but I think the > examples >> of better memories and increased language processing abilities, plus > others >> that I'm sure I could come up with if I spent some time researching, > suggest >> that blindness does generally affect the ways in which we are able to > think >> and thus our sense of self in what I keep saying are merely non-trivial >> ways. >> Regards, >> Marc >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >> Behalf Of Jedi >> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 11:57 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity >> Marc, >> I'm a woman, and I don't see myself differently because I have the >> ability to give birth, but I do perceive the world based on the fact >> that sexism in all its forms is still alive and well int he world. As >> to blindness, I definitely think that we physically perceive the world >> slightly different than the sighted, but not enough to really warrant >> saying that blindness fundamentally shifts our world view. >> Neuroscientists are starting to show that the blind and sighted use the >> same rules for perceiving the world, we just use different inputs or >> modalities even though our brains more or less process the information >> the same way the brains of sighted people do. I think however, that >> being blind has produced a number of very interesting experiences that >> we all have in common including a world that is obsessed with >> perceiving the world visually. I use the word "obsessed" because it's >> clear that while vision is useful, it's almost like sighted people >> sometimes go overboard with touchscreens and a lot of flashy and >> unnecessary graphic material. Add the fact that the NfB as an >> organization with assumptions and values that shape our blindness lives >> and even our non-blindness lives, and you've got the making of a >> cultural identity. >> Respectfully, >> Jedi >> Original message: >>> I think the issue of blindness constituting identity is definitely very >>> interesting, and I've been thinking about it a bit recently. >>> I believe that blindness does shape our sense of who we are, and this is >>> largely socially influenced, but it's also deeper than that. It's almost >>> certainly true that the challenges, discrimination, exclusion, etc that >>> blind people routinely experience influence our identity. However, and >> this >>> is where I part somewhat with so called NFB philosophy, I'm not sure > that, >>> in the absence of these factors, blindness would be reduced to a mere >>> characteristic, if mere characteristic is supposed to mean something >> rather >>> trivial and unimportant like hair and eye colour. I definitely think >> that, >>> in the absence of social and environmental barriers, blind people would > be >>> able to flourish as well as anyone else; I don't question that claim, but >> I >>> think perceiving the world in a unique way, in the way blind people do >> with >>> little or no sight, is a significant factor in how a person's identity is >>> constituted. >>> Arielle called sex a mere characteristic. As with blindness, if calling >> it >>> a mere characteristic is supposed to mean that it is as trivial as being > 5 >>> foot 6 instead of 5 foot 5, then I don't think it is a mere >> characteristic. >>> I don't have evidence of this, but I think I would feel differently about >> my >>> body if I had the ability to grow a human being inside of it. My hunch > is >>> that the ability, or lack of ability, to give birth probably affects how >> one >>> views one's body and thus one's sense of self in a non-trivial way. >>> Similarly, relying heavily on auditory input, developing better memories, >>> perceiving the world with little to no reliance on sight, I think these >> all >>> affect a person's sense of identity in non-trivial ways, and they don't >>> depend on social factors. >>> Clarification, I'm not trying to suggest that women are defined by their >>> ability to give birth. I'm only saying that to possess that ability > might >>> shape how you think about yourself in a way that is more significant than >>> whether you have short or long hair. >>> Best, >>> Marc >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >>> Behalf Of Arielle Silverman >>> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 7:08 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>> Hi again, >>> Re-reading the posts thus far, I will add that I agree with Jedi. >>> Blindness itself doesn't constitute the social identity. The identity >>> comes from the social reaction we experience as a result of blindness, >>> and the ways we've developed to respond to that social reaction. I >>> would venture to guess that this is similar to the effects of skin >>> color or biological sex on the development of racial and gender >>> identities. Race and sex are mere characteristics to the extent that >>> they by themselves don't influence how people function, just as >>> blindness by itself doesn't significantly alter or take away from how >>> we function. It's the social expectations associated with race, sex, >>> and disability that shape how those identities form and how they >>> influence people's sense of self. >>> Arielle >>> On 3/25/10, Arielle Silverman wrote: >>>> Hi all, >>>> A few comments from an amateur social psychologist: >>>> There is research showing that members of minority groups (i.e. ethnic >>>> minorities) sometimes experience the same kinds of awkward >>>> interactions with majority group members that we have discussed as >>>> happening to blind people. Specifically, majority group members (i.e. >>>> white Americans) sometimes feel awkward when interacting with minority >>>> members, especially out of concern that they might accidentally come >>>> across as being prejudiced or racist. The result is that the >>>> interaction tends to be strained and there is more tension than there >>>> should be, and minority group members can get left out as a result of >>>> the awkwardness. Of course this doesn't happen to all minority members >>>> and certainly many majority members have no problem interacting across >>>> race or ethnicity lines, just as plenty of sighted people have no >>>> problem befriending, working with or dating blind people. But it is a >>>> general tendency. >>>> I think the question of whether blindness is an identity or a >>>> situation/characteristic is interesting. My hunch is that it depends >>>> on who you ask; in other words, blind people can range from being >>>> completely disidentified (and often not voluntarily associating with >>>> other blind people) to completely identified and highly affiliated (to >>>> the point of having no close sighted friends). For low-identifiers, >>>> blindness probably feels more like a single characteristic; for high >>>> identifiers, blindness may feel like a trait coupled with a social >>>> group label. In the NFB, when we talk about "the blind" or "the >>>> nation's blind", we are implicitly acknowledging that the blind have a >>>> common identity, even if we don't all believe that this common >>>> identity or fate is rooted in culture. >>>> As part of my Ph.D. training I do intend to do some research >>>> investigating whether blindness is a coherent identity and, if it is, >>>> whether it has similar effects on people's self-concept and behavior >>>> as other identities (i.e. ethnic, religious, etc.) For example, I >>>> suspect that the constant messages we get from the public about our >>>> inferiority and the devastation of blindness pose unique psychological >>>> issues that we contend with, and that it can be difficult to see >>>> ourselves as whole, capable beings when our identities as blind people >>>> are construed in the public eye as compromised or broken. >>>> One final thought: I've found it interesting that many sighted people >>>> seem to think of blindness as a condition or trait but don't think of >>>> "the blind" as a coherent group with the same rights as racial, >>>> ethnic, and other cultural groups. This was apparent in the debate >>>> over the movie Blindness. I heard several people (some sighted, some >>>> blind) argue that the movie was OK because the people portrayed in it >>>> weren't "real blind people"; rather, they were sighted people who went >>>> blind as part of the plot. Of course, any of us who were sighted at >>>> one time know that people who go blind are still blind people; >>>> nevertheless, there appeared to be that distinction in some people's >>>> minds. I think this is also why it's hard for us to make civil rights >>>> arguments against blatant injustices (i.e. "Treating blacks with this >>>> kind of discrimination is unacceptable, and so treating us this way is >>>> also unacceptable"). A lot of people just don't get it, or think that >>>> treating blind people differently is OK because stereotypes about >>>> blindness are somehow more valid than stereotypes about other minority >>>> groups. I'm not sure how to bridge that thought gap or how to >>>> demonstrate the existence of the common blind identity in situations >>>> where we are all affected by the same discriminations or denials of >>>> rights. >>>> Arielle >>>> On 3/25/10, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>>>> True. Maybe the reason I'm anti social is I have no social skills to >>>>> begin >>>>> it I wirhwe talk to much or don't' talk at all and sometimes I come >>>>> across >>>>> as rude but I'm so used to beeing int he teaching invironment that I >>>>> cannot >>>>> for me get out of it. I'm not making much sense as I am starting to get >> a >>>>> bit hungry.. Hehaha. I do know this much I have a harder time >> socialising >>>>> with the sighree then with the bind. theer is so much that can be >>>>> comunicated in silence. so much we can't see. >>>>> I really enjoy reading these discussions and view points as it makes me >>>>> think about what I need to work on or not bather working on. >>>>> Take care all. >>>>> On Mar 24, 2010, at 9:14 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: >>>>>> Interesting. If we're talking straight up blindness, I think we've > all >>>>>> experienced a moment or two of feeling out of place in light of the >>>>>> dominant >>>>>> sighted crowd. I certainly experience with each meeting I attend > until >>>>>> I >>>>>> shake off the feeling and plunge forward. If we're talking ethnic >>>>>> minority, >>>>>> I can't say I've experienced that before, but I don't know if it's >>>>>> because >>>>>> the feeling is overshadowed by the blindness factor or because I've >>>>>> genuinely never witnessed this behavior. >>>>>> Regardless, what I find interesting about this discussion is that it >>>>>> makes >>>>>> blindness an identity factor. I think the original post asked how we >> as >>>>>> blind individuals handled campus involvement, when our philosophy >> claims >>>>>> blindness can be reduced to the level of a nuisance. I know this >>>>>> position >>>>>> does not claim blindness can be eliminated, but it would appear to >>>>>> suggest >>>>>> blindness is irrelevant to one's sense of self. So, rather than ask, >>>>>> "how >>>>>> do you, as a blind person, handle X, Y and Z," shouldn't we be asking >>>>>> how >>>>>> to >>>>>> handle the task in general? >>>>>> Interesting discussion. >>>>>> Joe Orozco >>>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >>>>>> sleeves, >>>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 8:51 PM >>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>>> Joe, >>>>>> The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually becoming >>>>>> a key issue for those who study organizational communication and >>>>>> diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a fancy >>>>>> way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently > based >>>>>> on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member > of >>>>>> a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just >>>>>> didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by your >>>>>> minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or one >>>>>> of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or maybe >>>>>> it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. >>>>>> Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is > controlled >>>>>> by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are >>>>>> rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less likely >>>>>> to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some point >>>>>> and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that > for >>>>>> people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or > one >>>>>> of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't yet >>>>>> become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant >>>>>> population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to >>>>>> experience this interesting problem at some point. >>>>>> Respectfully, >>>>>> Jedi >>>>>> Original message: >>>>>>> Jedi, >>>>>>> I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or >>>>>> witnessed this >>>>>>> behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, >>>>>> could you give >>>>>>> examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification > to >>>>>>> explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be >>>>>> accurate. >>>>>>> Joe Orozco >>>>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up >>>>>> their sleeves, >>>>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM >>>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>>>> It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for >>>>>>> minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in >>>>>>> school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of >>>>>> access to >>>>>>> informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real >>>>>>> obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from >>>>>>> just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a >>>>>>> large gap between minorities and their non-minority >>>>>> counterparts. There >>>>>>> really is no right way to handle this problem because it >>>>>> affects us all >>>>>>> so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left >>>>>> out, it may >>>>>>> be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear > you. >>>>>>> Respectfully, >>>>>>> Jedi >>>>>>> Original message: >>>>>>>> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of >>>>>>> clubs or other >>>>>>>> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew >>>>>>> for a play, but >>>>>>>> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything >>>>>>> other than >>>>>>>> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I >>>>>>> did my job >>>>>>>> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that >>>>>>> if they talked >>>>>>>> to me they would offend me or something like that. >>>>>>>> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved >>>>>> in the boy >>>>>>>> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy >>>>>>> scouts and life >>>>>>>> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or >>>>>>> technical in >>>>>>>> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't >>>>>>> know if this is >>>>>>>> blindness related, or what. >>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>>>>> From: "Jamie Principato" >>>>>>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>>>>>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get >>>>>>> involved in as >>>>>>>>> much >>>>>>>>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz >>>>>> Band, and a >>>>>>>>> Youth >>>>>>>>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate >>>>>> and public >>>>>>>>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I >>>>>>> couldn't wait >>>>>>>>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups >>>>>>> and activities >>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>> choose from. >>>>>>>>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot >>>>>>> of...problems...with the >>>>>>>>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went >>>>>>> to this high >>>>>>>>> school because we were told it offered the most for >>>>>> visually impaired >>>>>>>>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but >>>>>>> I'll spare you >>>>>>>>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students >>>>>>> at this school >>>>>>>>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, >>>>>>>>> avoiding >>>>>>>>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after >>>>>>> joining Model UN >>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and >>>>>>> planning to go to >>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the >>>>>>> fact t I joined >>>>>>>>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and >>>>>>> that if I was >>>>>>>>> going >>>>>>>>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a >>>>>>> permission note (no >>>>>>>>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find > a >>>>>>>>> teacher >>>>>>>>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I >>>>>> attend these >>>>>>>>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally >>>>>>> unless I sat >>>>>>>>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman >>>>>>> stands with my >>>>>>>>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was >>>>>>> unnecessary, and we >>>>>>>>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other >>>>>>>>> issues, >>>>>>>>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. >>>>>>>>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home >>>>>>> school support >>>>>>>>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I >>>>>>> took advantage >>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular >>>>>>> activities in >>>>>>>>> my >>>>>>>>> community, even sports (something that never would have >>>>>> flown at that >>>>>>>>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on >>>>>>> campus and in >>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing >>>>>>> club, a volunteer >>>>>>>>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also >>>>>>> try to get the >>>>>>>>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, >>>>>>> and make use of >>>>>>>>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been >>>>>>> having is that >>>>>>>>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by >>>>>>> house recently >>>>>>>>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the >>>>>>> evening. The only >>>>>>>>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or >>>>>>> get home from >>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you >>>>>>> need to get >>>>>>>>> out >>>>>>>>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if >>>>>>> money is tight >>>>>>>>> one >>>>>>>>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside >>>>>>> of attending >>>>>>>>> class, including attending free activities or events. I >>>>>>> guess that's just >>>>>>>>> one price of living off campus though. >>>>>>>>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> Hi list, >>>>>>>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>>>>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school > or >>>>>>>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new >>>>>> people? do you >>>>>>>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at > a >>>>>>>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- >>>>>>> identity as >>>>>>>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>>>>>>>> people interact with you? >>>>>>>>>> Thoughts? >>>>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>>>> Darian >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>>>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a >>>>>>> nationwide teacher >>>>>>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>>>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need > your >>>>>>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>>>> account info for >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr >>>>>>> dfly%40gmail.com >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>>> account info for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% >>>>>>> 40gmail.com >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>> info for nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin >>>>>>> djedi%40samobile.net >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>> info for nabs-l: >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco >>>>>> %40gmail.com >>>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of >>>>>> virus signature database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>>>> http://www.eset.com >>>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>>>>> signature >>>>>> database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>>>> http://www.eset.com >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gma >>> il.com >>>> -- >>>> Arielle Silverman >>>> President, National Association of Blind Students >>>> Phone: 602-502-2255 >>>> Email: >>>> nabs.president at gmail.com >>>> Website: >>>> www.nabslink.org >>> -- >>> Arielle Silverman >>> President, National Association of Blind Students >>> Phone: 602-502-2255 >>> Email: >>> nabs.president at gmail.com >>> Website: >>> www.nabslink.org >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >>> il.com >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >> bile.net >> -- >> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >> il.com >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo > bile.net > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit > www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma > il.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From JFreeh at nfb.org Sat Mar 27 04:27:42 2010 From: JFreeh at nfb.org (Freeh, Jessica) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 21:27:42 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] National Federation of the Blind and Blackboard to Demonstrate New Accessibility Features at CSUN Message-ID: FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE CONTACT: Chris Danielsen Director of Public Relations National Federation of the Blind (410) 659-9314, extension 2330 (410) 262-1281 (Cell) cdanielsen at nfb.org National Federation of the Blind and Blackboard to Demonstrate New Accessibility Features at CSUN Blackboard Learn Platform Brings Accessibility Enhancements for the Blind San Diego, California (March 25, 2010): The National Federation of the Blind (NFB), the nation’s leading advocate for equal education for blind students, and Blackboard Inc., will present and demonstrate the new accessibility features of the Blackboard Learn™ platform at the California State University, Northridge, (CSUN) 25th annual International Technology & Persons with Disabilities conference, held in San Diego, CA, March 22–27. The presentation of Blackboard’s improved and more accessible experience will be held on March 25 at 4:20 p.m. Pacific Time. Blackboard Learn, an online learning platform, is used by thousands of institutions to provide online education, course materials, discussion boards, assignment submissions, electronic grading, and numerous other components intended to enhance the learning experience or to provide distance education. Previously, blind students encountered a number of accessibility barriers when using the Blackboard platform with nonvisual screen access technology. Blackboard Learn, Release 9, showed great improvement over prior releases, and during the past year, Blackboard has invested further in a range of enhancements to Blackboard Learn that represent significant improvements to the usability of Blackboard for blind users. Dr. Marc Maurer, President of the National Federation of the Blind, said: “We are pleased to help Blackboard present the accessibility features of the Blackboard Learn platform to the influential audience at CSUN. These features will ensure that blind students are not at a disadvantage in classes utilizing Blackboard and can access course materials online just as their sighted peers do. We commend Blackboard for their hard work in this area.” The accessibility improvements to Blackboard Learn include faster navigation and improved form interaction, allowing blind users to submit assignments, participate in discussion forums, send and receive e-mail, take tests and quizzes, and participate in polls. Blind instructors can also submit content with the improved accessible forms. For more information about the National Federation of the Blind, please visit www.nfb.org. ### About the National Federation of the Blind With more than 50,000 members, the National Federation of the Blind is the largest and most influential membership organization of blind people in the United States. The NFB improves blind people’s lives through advocacy, education, research, technology, and programs encouraging independence and self-confidence. It is the leading force in the blindness field today and the voice of the nation's blind. In January 2004 the NFB opened the National Federation of the Blind Jernigan Institute, the first research and training center in the United States for the blind led by the blind. From nabs.president at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 04:42:56 2010 From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 23:42:56 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Sample Justification Letter Message-ID: <85ff10071003262142l70e5c434k98d68c49904fceea@mail.gmail.com> Hi all, As an addendum to our listserv discussion and conference call about getting justification to attend NFB training centers, Jim Omvig shared with us a sample justification letter that you can use to guide you when writing your letter justifying your choice to attend an NFB training center. We felt it would be beneficial to many blind students on this list, so I am attaching it here. Please note that this is just a sample, and can serve as the basic framework for your letter, but to write a strong and personal letter, you should feel free to insert examples of how you personally will benefit from the particular training center that you have chosen to attend. Talk about specific skills that you need training in, how those skills are relevant to your vocational goal, and give examples of activities at the center you have chosen that teach these skills through challenge and discovery. I also think the best-crafted letter will come after conversations with other center students, as we discussed earlier. Please also feel free to share this with students in your state divisions or affiliates who are going through this process. Best of luck to all! -- Arielle Silverman President, National Association of Blind Students Phone: 602-502-2255 Email: nabs.president at gmail.com Website: www.nabslink.org -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Justification_to_attend_NFB_training_center.rtf Type: application/rtf Size: 37531 bytes Desc: not available URL: From mworkman.lists at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 05:22:16 2010 From: mworkman.lists at gmail.com (Marc Workman) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 23:22:16 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity In-Reply-To: <20100327031944.4299.4719@web3> Message-ID: Jedi, What specifically do you find circular? You can keep telling me that you don't see yourself differently, and I will say yet again that how you see yourself is not the issue. I don't think about my ability to sense pain. Does this mean that possessing or lacking the ability to sense pain makes no difference to a person's identity? It would seem to according to your argument. I don't think of my ability for self-consciousness unless society draws my attention to it, so therefore being self-conscious does not affect my identity outside of a social context. It seems to me that being self-conscious or not is likely to have an impact on a person's identity regardless of social context. Whether one sees one's ability for self-consciousness as important or not makes absolutely no difference. You said, What it really comes down to is that society tells us what different experiences mean. It's this claim that I disagree with. You seem to be saying that there is no experience, physical or otherwise, that isn't entirely socially mediated. I just don't think the body is that malleable. I don't think society can make up the meaning of experiences out of thin air as you seem to imply. You also said, What I think is really going on with these brain studies is that blind people are using parts of their brains to make inferences about what they're being told. It's a skill we pick up over time as a way of supplimenting what we already get. I wouldn't be terribly surprised if the sighted could do the same thing and that more of their brains would light up if they used the skill more. there's a fine distinction there. It sounds to me like you are saying that blind people end up developing skills that allow them to think in different ways. That is all that I have been suggesting. Of course sighted people could do it if they found a way of developing the skill, perhaps walking around blind folded would do it. If this isn't what you had in mind, then I'm afraid the distinction was a bit too fine for me. I'm not sure if we'll come to agreement either, but I do want to better understand the social constructionist position that you seem to be espousing. Regards, Marc -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On Behalf Of Jedi Sent: Friday, March 26, 2010 9:20 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity Marc, This is a circular argument as far as I'm concerned, and i don't think we're going to ever agree completely on this issue. I don't know how many times I have to tell you that I don't see myself differently because I have the ability to give birth. If I do, it's because I learned from my society that I'm supposed to. But before that, I really didn't care. And to be honest, I care about it less than some other women do. Same goes for my blindness. Before I learned that i'm different from others, it didn't occur to me that I couldn't see. I just figured that I was what I was. What it really comes down to is that society tells us what different experiences mean, and we think of ourselves based on those meanings. For example, most White people don't really think about the fact that they're White because it's not something that's regularly drawn attention to. That may be less true now that discussions about racism have become more mainstream, but people take their Whiteness for granted because they are sort of like the invisible norm. Other ethnicities don't have that luxury, so they are more aware of their skin color because society has told them that they are different from White people in fundamental ways. If there was no meaning assigned to skin color, we might observe that someone is Black and someone is White, but that's about as far as it would go. But instead, this socially constructed meaning created that identity that having a different skin color other than White produces. I think your article is interesting because it almost repeats long-held notions about blind people that have been around in the field of special education for a long time: blind people's language development is delayed, especially since they can't see what's being talked about in order to link some object with it's symbolic counterpart, yet blind people develop an amazingness with words themselves because they have no other way to really get information. Some folks believe that even our amazing ability with words isn't enough since we still can't link these words with the things they represent. What I think is really going on with these brain studies is that blind people are using parts of their brains to make inferences about what they're being told. It's a skill we pick up over time as a way of supplimenting what we already get. I wouldn't be terribly surprised if the sighted could do the same thing and that more of their brains would light up if they used the skill more. there's a fine distinction there. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Jedi, > I hope that I did not try to tell you what you think about your ability to > give birth. I said that I wasn't sure it was possible to say that you don't > see yourself differently. I admit I should have clarified, but what I said > has absolutely nothing to do with you and what you think about yourself. I > was saying that it is literally impossible to make a claim like the one you > made. The reason it is impossible is because to know for sure if you do or > do not see yourself differently as a result of possessing the ability to > give birth, you would have had to have grown up as a man and as a woman, > which is not physically possible. So I suppose you can say that you don't > think about it, and you probably don't, but since you have nothing to > compare it to, it's impossible to say whether it does or does not shape how > you think about yourself. It would be like me saying, I don't think about > my ability to be self-aware. Therefore, it isn't a part of my identity, or, > I don't think much about my ability to feel pain, so I would be the same > person if I lacked this ability. I can say that I don't think about these > things, and it can be true that I don't think about these things, but I > can't say that they do not shape my identity, which is what I thought you > were trying to say. > The deeper claim I'm making is that identity is not something you can just > step outside of and say features X and Y are part of my identity, but > features A, B, and C are not. I want to say that there are things about you > that affect your identity that you are not at all aware of, and it is not > possible to step outside of your identity and take stock of the factors that > make you who you are. If you step outside of your identity, the you that is > doing the stepping disappears. So it's a philosophical claim that you can > never no for sure what exactly shapes your sense of self because knowing > this would require stepping outside yourself to have a look, but this is not > possible. > As for language processing, I'm going to paste an article abstract below my > name. It discusses the faster language processing that I mentioned. > Please correct me if I'm wrong: The difference in opinion here seems to be > that you think that identity is socially constructed. I'm only suggesting > that there is a close link between the body and identity and that possessing > a body that functions in a rather significantly different way (e.g., one > that is capable of visual perception versus one that is not) has a > non-trivial impact on one's sense of self. It doesn't strike me as a > particularly bold claim, no more than to say that I would probably be a > different person if I had a photographic memory, the ability to sense > infrared signals, or the sense of smell of a dog. And though I don't think > that how we perceive our bodies is beyond social influence, I'm not sure > that it is entirely socially constructed either. > Abstract follows. > Marc > Event -related potentials during auditory language processing in > congenitally blind and sighted people > Brigitte Roder > Abstract > While behavioral studies have documented delayed language acquisition in > blind children, other studies have revealed better speech discrimination > abilities for blind than sighted adults. Several brain imaging studies have > provided evidence for cortical reorganization due to visual deprivation but > the cerebral organization of language in blind humans is not known yet. > We hypothesized that the increasing specialization of language systems > normally observed during development may not take place to the same degree > in blind individuals since posterior visual areas do not receive their > adequate input. On the other hand, we hypothesized that blind people, due to > their greater reliance upon the auditory language signal, may process speech > faster than sighted people. > To test these assumptions, event-related potentials were recorded while 11 > congenitally blind and 11 sighted adults matched in age, gender, handedness > and education were engaged in a language task. Participants listened to > sentences in order to decide after each sentence if it was meaningful or > not. > Incongruous sentence-final words elicited an N400 effect in both groups. The > N400 effect had a left-lateralized fronto-central scalp distribution in the > sighted but a symmetric and broad topography in the blind. Furthermore, the > N400 effect started earlier in the blind than in the sighted. Closed class > compared to open class sentence middle words elicited a more pronounced late > negativity in the blind than in the sighted. > These results suggest that blind people process auditory language stimuli > faster than sighted people and that some language functions may be > reorganized in the blind. > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On > Behalf Of Jedi > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2010 1:14 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity > Marc, > Seems how you're not a woman, and seems how you're not me, it isn't > your place to tell me what I think about myself in light of my ability > to give birth. I'm telling you that aside from the social consequences > of being the child bearing half of the spiecies, I don't think about it > much, and I suspect you would because you're not a woman. That is not > to say that some women don't think about it more than I do, but I > personally don't think about it much. I also suspect that sighted > people think the same way. They think about the differences of > blindness more than many of us do. > Next, blind people do not have inherently better memories nor better > language processing skills. On the whole, we're on par with the sighted > even if there are small brain differences. Just hanging out at an NFB > meeting or convention shows us how many differences there are between > us all: some have better memories than others, some are well spoken > while others aren't. The research I'm speaking of shows that blind > people handle voice recognition with the same parts of the brain that > the sighted handle face recognition and that we handle space-related > tasks with the same mechanism the sighted do except that we use > different inputs for the information. The occipital lobe of the brain > lights up when reading Braille the same way it does when reading print. > For some of us, the occipital lobe lights up when listening to text > because that's our primary form of reading. that may be linked to the > researched you're talking about. > Respectfully, > Jedi > Original message: >> Jedi, >> I'm not sure it's possible to say that you don't see yourself differently >> because you have the ability to give birth. I'm only saying that I > suspect >> I would view my body differently if I had that ability. It's not > something >> I'll ever know. But here's another example if that one doesn't satisfy > you. >> If I were a woman, I would probably be 60 pounds lighter and six or seven >> inches shorter on average. Again, I can't say for sure, but I'm pretty > sure >> that living in the world, in any world, with a body that is 60 pounds >> lighter and 7 inches shorter would have a non-trivial impact on my sense > of >> self. >> And here's a blindness example. In my experience, blind people tend to > have >> better memories than the average sighted person. Unless you want to argue >> that this is only because of social factors, which I admit probably is a >> factor but not the only factor, then better memories will be around even >> after all social barriers are removed. I'm pretty sure again that having > a >> better memory that allows me to quickly recall information changes the way > I >> am able to think in a non-trivial way. If I suddenly lost my better > memory, >> even if I didn't need it to get around successfully in the world, it would >> have an impact on my sense of self. Would I be a completely different >> person? Probably not, but it would affect my identity more than if I went >> out and got a haircut tomorrow. >> Example 2: You say that evidence shows that the brains of blind people > more >> or less process information the same way the brains of sighted people do. >> I've seen evidence that suggests the contrary, particularly with respect > to >> language processing. There is evidence that some blind people end up > using >> the occipital lobe, the part of the brain normally reserved for visual >> processing, to conduct language processing. As a result, studies have > shown >> that certain sorts of language processing occur faster among blind people. >> This seems to me that it could also affect the way I think and my sense of >> self in a non-trivial way. And it doesn't seem to be entirely social. > Any >> social context that includes an oral language will have the same result. >> Though I admit that this can be more or less emphasized depending on > social >> factors. >> Finally, I wonder if some people think there is a danger in acknowledging >> that blindness can shape our identities even in the absence of harmful >> social attitudes. I can see the potential danger. If we say that we are >> different, then others can argue that we should thus be treated > differently. >> So I can understand why it might be better to deny it even if it's true. >> Alternatively, you could just not think it's true, but I think the > examples >> of better memories and increased language processing abilities, plus > others >> that I'm sure I could come up with if I spent some time researching, > suggest >> that blindness does generally affect the ways in which we are able to > think >> and thus our sense of self in what I keep saying are merely non-trivial >> ways. >> Regards, >> Marc >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >> Behalf Of Jedi >> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 11:57 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity >> Marc, >> I'm a woman, and I don't see myself differently because I have the >> ability to give birth, but I do perceive the world based on the fact >> that sexism in all its forms is still alive and well int he world. As >> to blindness, I definitely think that we physically perceive the world >> slightly different than the sighted, but not enough to really warrant >> saying that blindness fundamentally shifts our world view. >> Neuroscientists are starting to show that the blind and sighted use the >> same rules for perceiving the world, we just use different inputs or >> modalities even though our brains more or less process the information >> the same way the brains of sighted people do. I think however, that >> being blind has produced a number of very interesting experiences that >> we all have in common including a world that is obsessed with >> perceiving the world visually. I use the word "obsessed" because it's >> clear that while vision is useful, it's almost like sighted people >> sometimes go overboard with touchscreens and a lot of flashy and >> unnecessary graphic material. Add the fact that the NfB as an >> organization with assumptions and values that shape our blindness lives >> and even our non-blindness lives, and you've got the making of a >> cultural identity. >> Respectfully, >> Jedi >> Original message: >>> I think the issue of blindness constituting identity is definitely very >>> interesting, and I've been thinking about it a bit recently. >>> I believe that blindness does shape our sense of who we are, and this is >>> largely socially influenced, but it's also deeper than that. It's almost >>> certainly true that the challenges, discrimination, exclusion, etc that >>> blind people routinely experience influence our identity. However, and >> this >>> is where I part somewhat with so called NFB philosophy, I'm not sure > that, >>> in the absence of these factors, blindness would be reduced to a mere >>> characteristic, if mere characteristic is supposed to mean something >> rather >>> trivial and unimportant like hair and eye colour. I definitely think >> that, >>> in the absence of social and environmental barriers, blind people would > be >>> able to flourish as well as anyone else; I don't question that claim, but >> I >>> think perceiving the world in a unique way, in the way blind people do >> with >>> little or no sight, is a significant factor in how a person's identity is >>> constituted. >>> Arielle called sex a mere characteristic. As with blindness, if calling >> it >>> a mere characteristic is supposed to mean that it is as trivial as being > 5 >>> foot 6 instead of 5 foot 5, then I don't think it is a mere >> characteristic. >>> I don't have evidence of this, but I think I would feel differently about >> my >>> body if I had the ability to grow a human being inside of it. My hunch > is >>> that the ability, or lack of ability, to give birth probably affects how >> one >>> views one's body and thus one's sense of self in a non-trivial way. >>> Similarly, relying heavily on auditory input, developing better memories, >>> perceiving the world with little to no reliance on sight, I think these >> all >>> affect a person's sense of identity in non-trivial ways, and they don't >>> depend on social factors. >>> Clarification, I'm not trying to suggest that women are defined by their >>> ability to give birth. I'm only saying that to possess that ability > might >>> shape how you think about yourself in a way that is more significant than >>> whether you have short or long hair. >>> Best, >>> Marc >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >>> Behalf Of Arielle Silverman >>> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 7:08 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>> Hi again, >>> Re-reading the posts thus far, I will add that I agree with Jedi. >>> Blindness itself doesn't constitute the social identity. The identity >>> comes from the social reaction we experience as a result of blindness, >>> and the ways we've developed to respond to that social reaction. I >>> would venture to guess that this is similar to the effects of skin >>> color or biological sex on the development of racial and gender >>> identities. Race and sex are mere characteristics to the extent that >>> they by themselves don't influence how people function, just as >>> blindness by itself doesn't significantly alter or take away from how >>> we function. It's the social expectations associated with race, sex, >>> and disability that shape how those identities form and how they >>> influence people's sense of self. >>> Arielle >>> On 3/25/10, Arielle Silverman wrote: >>>> Hi all, >>>> A few comments from an amateur social psychologist: >>>> There is research showing that members of minority groups (i.e. ethnic >>>> minorities) sometimes experience the same kinds of awkward >>>> interactions with majority group members that we have discussed as >>>> happening to blind people. Specifically, majority group members (i.e. >>>> white Americans) sometimes feel awkward when interacting with minority >>>> members, especially out of concern that they might accidentally come >>>> across as being prejudiced or racist. The result is that the >>>> interaction tends to be strained and there is more tension than there >>>> should be, and minority group members can get left out as a result of >>>> the awkwardness. Of course this doesn't happen to all minority members >>>> and certainly many majority members have no problem interacting across >>>> race or ethnicity lines, just as plenty of sighted people have no >>>> problem befriending, working with or dating blind people. But it is a >>>> general tendency. >>>> I think the question of whether blindness is an identity or a >>>> situation/characteristic is interesting. My hunch is that it depends >>>> on who you ask; in other words, blind people can range from being >>>> completely disidentified (and often not voluntarily associating with >>>> other blind people) to completely identified and highly affiliated (to >>>> the point of having no close sighted friends). For low-identifiers, >>>> blindness probably feels more like a single characteristic; for high >>>> identifiers, blindness may feel like a trait coupled with a social >>>> group label. In the NFB, when we talk about "the blind" or "the >>>> nation's blind", we are implicitly acknowledging that the blind have a >>>> common identity, even if we don't all believe that this common >>>> identity or fate is rooted in culture. >>>> As part of my Ph.D. training I do intend to do some research >>>> investigating whether blindness is a coherent identity and, if it is, >>>> whether it has similar effects on people's self-concept and behavior >>>> as other identities (i.e. ethnic, religious, etc.) For example, I >>>> suspect that the constant messages we get from the public about our >>>> inferiority and the devastation of blindness pose unique psychological >>>> issues that we contend with, and that it can be difficult to see >>>> ourselves as whole, capable beings when our identities as blind people >>>> are construed in the public eye as compromised or broken. >>>> One final thought: I've found it interesting that many sighted people >>>> seem to think of blindness as a condition or trait but don't think of >>>> "the blind" as a coherent group with the same rights as racial, >>>> ethnic, and other cultural groups. This was apparent in the debate >>>> over the movie Blindness. I heard several people (some sighted, some >>>> blind) argue that the movie was OK because the people portrayed in it >>>> weren't "real blind people"; rather, they were sighted people who went >>>> blind as part of the plot. Of course, any of us who were sighted at >>>> one time know that people who go blind are still blind people; >>>> nevertheless, there appeared to be that distinction in some people's >>>> minds. I think this is also why it's hard for us to make civil rights >>>> arguments against blatant injustices (i.e. "Treating blacks with this >>>> kind of discrimination is unacceptable, and so treating us this way is >>>> also unacceptable"). A lot of people just don't get it, or think that >>>> treating blind people differently is OK because stereotypes about >>>> blindness are somehow more valid than stereotypes about other minority >>>> groups. I'm not sure how to bridge that thought gap or how to >>>> demonstrate the existence of the common blind identity in situations >>>> where we are all affected by the same discriminations or denials of >>>> rights. >>>> Arielle >>>> On 3/25/10, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>>>> True. Maybe the reason I'm anti social is I have no social skills to >>>>> begin >>>>> it I wirhwe talk to much or don't' talk at all and sometimes I come >>>>> across >>>>> as rude but I'm so used to beeing int he teaching invironment that I >>>>> cannot >>>>> for me get out of it. I'm not making much sense as I am starting to get >> a >>>>> bit hungry.. Hehaha. I do know this much I have a harder time >> socialising >>>>> with the sighree then with the bind. theer is so much that can be >>>>> comunicated in silence. so much we can't see. >>>>> I really enjoy reading these discussions and view points as it makes me >>>>> think about what I need to work on or not bather working on. >>>>> Take care all. >>>>> On Mar 24, 2010, at 9:14 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: >>>>>> Interesting. If we're talking straight up blindness, I think we've > all >>>>>> experienced a moment or two of feeling out of place in light of the >>>>>> dominant >>>>>> sighted crowd. I certainly experience with each meeting I attend > until >>>>>> I >>>>>> shake off the feeling and plunge forward. If we're talking ethnic >>>>>> minority, >>>>>> I can't say I've experienced that before, but I don't know if it's >>>>>> because >>>>>> the feeling is overshadowed by the blindness factor or because I've >>>>>> genuinely never witnessed this behavior. >>>>>> Regardless, what I find interesting about this discussion is that it >>>>>> makes >>>>>> blindness an identity factor. I think the original post asked how we >> as >>>>>> blind individuals handled campus involvement, when our philosophy >> claims >>>>>> blindness can be reduced to the level of a nuisance. I know this >>>>>> position >>>>>> does not claim blindness can be eliminated, but it would appear to >>>>>> suggest >>>>>> blindness is irrelevant to one's sense of self. So, rather than ask, >>>>>> "how >>>>>> do you, as a blind person, handle X, Y and Z," shouldn't we be asking >>>>>> how >>>>>> to >>>>>> handle the task in general? >>>>>> Interesting discussion. >>>>>> Joe Orozco >>>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >>>>>> sleeves, >>>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 8:51 PM >>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>>> Joe, >>>>>> The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually becoming >>>>>> a key issue for those who study organizational communication and >>>>>> diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a fancy >>>>>> way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently > based >>>>>> on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member > of >>>>>> a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just >>>>>> didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by your >>>>>> minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or one >>>>>> of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or maybe >>>>>> it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. >>>>>> Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is > controlled >>>>>> by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are >>>>>> rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less likely >>>>>> to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some point >>>>>> and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that > for >>>>>> people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or > one >>>>>> of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't yet >>>>>> become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant >>>>>> population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to >>>>>> experience this interesting problem at some point. >>>>>> Respectfully, >>>>>> Jedi >>>>>> Original message: >>>>>>> Jedi, >>>>>>> I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or >>>>>> witnessed this >>>>>>> behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, >>>>>> could you give >>>>>>> examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification > to >>>>>>> explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be >>>>>> accurate. >>>>>>> Joe Orozco >>>>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up >>>>>> their sleeves, >>>>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM >>>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>>>> It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for >>>>>>> minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in >>>>>>> school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of >>>>>> access to >>>>>>> informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real >>>>>>> obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from >>>>>>> just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a >>>>>>> large gap between minorities and their non-minority >>>>>> counterparts. There >>>>>>> really is no right way to handle this problem because it >>>>>> affects us all >>>>>>> so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left >>>>>> out, it may >>>>>>> be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear > you. >>>>>>> Respectfully, >>>>>>> Jedi >>>>>>> Original message: >>>>>>>> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of >>>>>>> clubs or other >>>>>>>> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew >>>>>>> for a play, but >>>>>>>> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything >>>>>>> other than >>>>>>>> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I >>>>>>> did my job >>>>>>>> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that >>>>>>> if they talked >>>>>>>> to me they would offend me or something like that. >>>>>>>> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved >>>>>> in the boy >>>>>>>> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy >>>>>>> scouts and life >>>>>>>> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or >>>>>>> technical in >>>>>>>> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't >>>>>>> know if this is >>>>>>>> blindness related, or what. >>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>>>>> From: "Jamie Principato" >>>>>>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? >>>>>>>>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get >>>>>>> involved in as >>>>>>>>> much >>>>>>>>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz >>>>>> Band, and a >>>>>>>>> Youth >>>>>>>>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate >>>>>> and public >>>>>>>>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I >>>>>>> couldn't wait >>>>>>>>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups >>>>>>> and activities >>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>> choose from. >>>>>>>>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot >>>>>>> of...problems...with the >>>>>>>>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went >>>>>>> to this high >>>>>>>>> school because we were told it offered the most for >>>>>> visually impaired >>>>>>>>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but >>>>>>> I'll spare you >>>>>>>>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students >>>>>>> at this school >>>>>>>>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student body, >>>>>>>>> avoiding >>>>>>>>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after >>>>>>> joining Model UN >>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and >>>>>>> planning to go to >>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the >>>>>>> fact t I joined >>>>>>>>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and >>>>>>> that if I was >>>>>>>>> going >>>>>>>>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a >>>>>>> permission note (no >>>>>>>>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find > a >>>>>>>>> teacher >>>>>>>>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I >>>>>> attend these >>>>>>>>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally >>>>>>> unless I sat >>>>>>>>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman >>>>>>> stands with my >>>>>>>>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was >>>>>>> unnecessary, and we >>>>>>>>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of other >>>>>>>>> issues, >>>>>>>>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. >>>>>>>>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home >>>>>>> school support >>>>>>>>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I >>>>>>> took advantage >>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular >>>>>>> activities in >>>>>>>>> my >>>>>>>>> community, even sports (something that never would have >>>>>> flown at that >>>>>>>>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on >>>>>>> campus and in >>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing >>>>>>> club, a volunteer >>>>>>>>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also >>>>>>> try to get the >>>>>>>>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, >>>>>>> and make use of >>>>>>>>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been >>>>>>> having is that >>>>>>>>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by >>>>>>> house recently >>>>>>>>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the >>>>>>> evening. The only >>>>>>>>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or >>>>>>> get home from >>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you >>>>>>> need to get >>>>>>>>> out >>>>>>>>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if >>>>>>> money is tight >>>>>>>>> one >>>>>>>>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside >>>>>>> of attending >>>>>>>>> class, including attending free activities or events. I >>>>>>> guess that's just >>>>>>>>> one price of living off campus though. >>>>>>>>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> Hi list, >>>>>>>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>>>>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school > or >>>>>>>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new >>>>>> people? do you >>>>>>>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at > a >>>>>>>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- >>>>>>> identity as >>>>>>>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how did >>>>>>>>>> people interact with you? >>>>>>>>>> Thoughts? >>>>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>>>> Darian >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>>>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a >>>>>>> nationwide teacher >>>>>>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>>>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need > your >>>>>>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>>>> account info for >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr >>>>>>> dfly%40gmail.com >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>>> account info for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% >>>>>>> 40gmail.com >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>> info for nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin >>>>>>> djedi%40samobile.net >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>> info for nabs-l: >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco >>>>>> %40gmail.com >>>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of >>>>>> virus signature database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>>>> http://www.eset.com >>>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>>>>> signature >>>>>> database 4972 (20100324) __________ >>>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>>>> http://www.eset.com >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gma >>> il.com >>>> -- >>>> Arielle Silverman >>>> President, National Association of Blind Students >>>> Phone: 602-502-2255 >>>> Email: >>>> nabs.president at gmail.com >>>> Website: >>>> www.nabslink.org >>> -- >>> Arielle Silverman >>> President, National Association of Blind Students >>> Phone: 602-502-2255 >>> Email: >>> nabs.president at gmail.com >>> Website: >>> www.nabslink.org >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >>> il.com >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >> bile.net >> -- >> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >> il.com >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo > bile.net > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit > www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma > il.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo bile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma il.com From daydreamingncolor at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 05:39:05 2010 From: daydreamingncolor at gmail.com (Aziza Cano) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 23:39:05 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity References: <20100327031944.4299.4719@web3> Message-ID: <4C2ACE0917354157A9A69B0F1029B229@azizaLatD430> Well said Jedi! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jedi" To: Sent: Friday, March 26, 2010 9:19 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity > Marc, > > This is a circular argument as far as I'm concerned, and i don't think > we're going to ever agree completely on this issue. I don't know how many > times I have to tell you that I don't see myself differently because I > have the ability to give birth. If I do, it's because I learned from my > society that I'm supposed to. But before that, I really didn't care. And > to be honest, I care about it less than some other women do. Same goes for > my blindness. Before I learned that i'm different from others, it didn't > occur to me that I couldn't see. I just figured that I was what I was. > What it really comes down to is that society tells us what different > experiences mean, and we think of ourselves based on those meanings. For > example, most White people don't really think about the fact that they're > White because it's not something that's regularly drawn attention to. That > may be less true now that discussions about racism have become more > mainstream, but people take their Whiteness for granted because they are > sort of like the invisible norm. Other ethnicities don't have that luxury, > so they are more aware of their skin color because society has told them > that they are different from White people in fundamental ways. If there > was no meaning assigned to skin color, we might observe that someone is > Black and someone is White, but that's about as far as it would go. But > instead, this socially constructed meaning created that identity that > having a different skin color other than White produces. > > I think your article is interesting because it almost repeats long-held > notions about blind people that have been around in the field of special > education for a long time: blind people's language development is delayed, > especially since they can't see what's being talked about in order to link > some object with it's symbolic counterpart, yet blind people develop an > amazingness with words themselves because they have no other way to really > get information. Some folks believe that even our amazing ability with > words isn't enough since we still can't link these words with the things > they represent. What I think is really going on with these brain studies > is that blind people are using parts of their brains to make inferences > about what they're being told. It's a skill we pick up over time as a way > of supplimenting what we already get. I wouldn't be terribly surprised if > the sighted could do the same thing and that more of their brains would > light up if they used the skill more. there's a fine distinction there. > > Respectfully, > Jedi > > > > Original message: >> Jedi, > >> I hope that I did not try to tell you what you think about your ability >> to >> give birth. I said that I wasn't sure it was possible to say that you >> don't >> see yourself differently. I admit I should have clarified, but what I >> said >> has absolutely nothing to do with you and what you think about yourself. >> I >> was saying that it is literally impossible to make a claim like the one >> you >> made. The reason it is impossible is because to know for sure if you do >> or >> do not see yourself differently as a result of possessing the ability to >> give birth, you would have had to have grown up as a man and as a woman, >> which is not physically possible. So I suppose you can say that you >> don't >> think about it, and you probably don't, but since you have nothing to >> compare it to, it's impossible to say whether it does or does not shape >> how >> you think about yourself. It would be like me saying, I don't think >> about >> my ability to be self-aware. Therefore, it isn't a part of my identity, >> or, >> I don't think much about my ability to feel pain, so I would be the same >> person if I lacked this ability. I can say that I don't think about >> these >> things, and it can be true that I don't think about these things, but I >> can't say that they do not shape my identity, which is what I thought you >> were trying to say. > >> The deeper claim I'm making is that identity is not something you can >> just >> step outside of and say features X and Y are part of my identity, but >> features A, B, and C are not. I want to say that there are things about >> you >> that affect your identity that you are not at all aware of, and it is not >> possible to step outside of your identity and take stock of the factors >> that >> make you who you are. If you step outside of your identity, the you that >> is >> doing the stepping disappears. So it's a philosophical claim that you >> can >> never no for sure what exactly shapes your sense of self because knowing >> this would require stepping outside yourself to have a look, but this is >> not >> possible. > >> As for language processing, I'm going to paste an article abstract below >> my >> name. It discusses the faster language processing that I mentioned. > >> Please correct me if I'm wrong: The difference in opinion here seems to >> be >> that you think that identity is socially constructed. I'm only >> suggesting >> that there is a close link between the body and identity and that >> possessing >> a body that functions in a rather significantly different way (e.g., one >> that is capable of visual perception versus one that is not) has a >> non-trivial impact on one's sense of self. It doesn't strike me as a >> particularly bold claim, no more than to say that I would probably be a >> different person if I had a photographic memory, the ability to sense >> infrared signals, or the sense of smell of a dog. And though I don't >> think >> that how we perceive our bodies is beyond social influence, I'm not sure >> that it is entirely socially constructed either. > >> Abstract follows. > >> Marc > >> Event -related potentials during auditory language processing in >> congenitally blind and sighted people >> Brigitte Roder >> Abstract > >> While behavioral studies have documented delayed language acquisition in >> blind children, other studies have revealed better speech discrimination >> abilities for blind than sighted adults. Several brain imaging studies >> have >> provided evidence for cortical reorganization due to visual deprivation >> but >> the cerebral organization of language in blind humans is not known yet. > >> We hypothesized that the increasing specialization of language systems >> normally observed during development may not take place to the same >> degree >> in blind individuals since posterior visual areas do not receive their >> adequate input. On the other hand, we hypothesized that blind people, due >> to >> their greater reliance upon the auditory language signal, may process >> speech >> faster than sighted people. > >> To test these assumptions, event-related potentials were recorded while >> 11 >> congenitally blind and 11 sighted adults matched in age, gender, >> handedness >> and education were engaged in a language task. Participants listened to >> sentences in order to decide after each sentence if it was meaningful or >> not. > >> Incongruous sentence-final words elicited an N400 effect in both groups. >> The >> N400 effect had a left-lateralized fronto-central scalp distribution in >> the >> sighted but a symmetric and broad topography in the blind. Furthermore, >> the >> N400 effect started earlier in the blind than in the sighted. Closed >> class >> compared to open class sentence middle words elicited a more pronounced >> late >> negativity in the blind than in the sighted. > >> These results suggest that blind people process auditory language stimuli >> faster than sighted people and that some language functions may be >> reorganized in the blind. > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >> Behalf Of Jedi >> Sent: Friday, March 26, 2010 1:14 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity > > >> Marc, > >> Seems how you're not a woman, and seems how you're not me, it isn't >> your place to tell me what I think about myself in light of my ability >> to give birth. I'm telling you that aside from the social consequences >> of being the child bearing half of the spiecies, I don't think about it >> much, and I suspect you would because you're not a woman. That is not >> to say that some women don't think about it more than I do, but I >> personally don't think about it much. I also suspect that sighted >> people think the same way. They think about the differences of >> blindness more than many of us do. > >> Next, blind people do not have inherently better memories nor better >> language processing skills. On the whole, we're on par with the sighted >> even if there are small brain differences. Just hanging out at an NFB >> meeting or convention shows us how many differences there are between >> us all: some have better memories than others, some are well spoken >> while others aren't. The research I'm speaking of shows that blind >> people handle voice recognition with the same parts of the brain that >> the sighted handle face recognition and that we handle space-related >> tasks with the same mechanism the sighted do except that we use >> different inputs for the information. The occipital lobe of the brain >> lights up when reading Braille the same way it does when reading print. >> For some of us, the occipital lobe lights up when listening to text >> because that's our primary form of reading. that may be linked to the >> researched you're talking about. > >> Respectfully, >> Jedi > >> Original message: >>> Jedi, > >>> I'm not sure it's possible to say that you don't see yourself >>> differently >>> because you have the ability to give birth. I'm only saying that I >> suspect >>> I would view my body differently if I had that ability. It's not >> something >>> I'll ever know. But here's another example if that one doesn't satisfy >> you. >>> If I were a woman, I would probably be 60 pounds lighter and six or >>> seven >>> inches shorter on average. Again, I can't say for sure, but I'm pretty >> sure >>> that living in the world, in any world, with a body that is 60 pounds >>> lighter and 7 inches shorter would have a non-trivial impact on my sense >> of >>> self. > >>> And here's a blindness example. In my experience, blind people tend to >> have >>> better memories than the average sighted person. Unless you want to >>> argue >>> that this is only because of social factors, which I admit probably is a >>> factor but not the only factor, then better memories will be around even >>> after all social barriers are removed. I'm pretty sure again that >>> having >> a >>> better memory that allows me to quickly recall information changes the >>> way >> I >>> am able to think in a non-trivial way. If I suddenly lost my better >> memory, >>> even if I didn't need it to get around successfully in the world, it >>> would >>> have an impact on my sense of self. Would I be a completely different >>> person? Probably not, but it would affect my identity more than if I >>> went >>> out and got a haircut tomorrow. > >>> Example 2: You say that evidence shows that the brains of blind people >> more >>> or less process information the same way the brains of sighted people >>> do. >>> I've seen evidence that suggests the contrary, particularly with respect >> to >>> language processing. There is evidence that some blind people end up >> using >>> the occipital lobe, the part of the brain normally reserved for visual >>> processing, to conduct language processing. As a result, studies have >> shown >>> that certain sorts of language processing occur faster among blind >>> people. >>> This seems to me that it could also affect the way I think and my sense >>> of >>> self in a non-trivial way. And it doesn't seem to be entirely social. >> Any >>> social context that includes an oral language will have the same result. >>> Though I admit that this can be more or less emphasized depending on >> social >>> factors. > >>> Finally, I wonder if some people think there is a danger in >>> acknowledging >>> that blindness can shape our identities even in the absence of harmful >>> social attitudes. I can see the potential danger. If we say that we >>> are >>> different, then others can argue that we should thus be treated >> differently. >>> So I can understand why it might be better to deny it even if it's true. >>> Alternatively, you could just not think it's true, but I think the >> examples >>> of better memories and increased language processing abilities, plus >> others >>> that I'm sure I could come up with if I spent some time researching, >> suggest >>> that blindness does generally affect the ways in which we are able to >> think >>> and thus our sense of self in what I keep saying are merely non-trivial >>> ways. > >>> Regards, > >>> Marc > >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >>> Behalf Of Jedi >>> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 11:57 PM >>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity > > >>> Marc, > >>> I'm a woman, and I don't see myself differently because I have the >>> ability to give birth, but I do perceive the world based on the fact >>> that sexism in all its forms is still alive and well int he world. As >>> to blindness, I definitely think that we physically perceive the world >>> slightly different than the sighted, but not enough to really warrant >>> saying that blindness fundamentally shifts our world view. >>> Neuroscientists are starting to show that the blind and sighted use the >>> same rules for perceiving the world, we just use different inputs or >>> modalities even though our brains more or less process the information >>> the same way the brains of sighted people do. I think however, that >>> being blind has produced a number of very interesting experiences that >>> we all have in common including a world that is obsessed with >>> perceiving the world visually. I use the word "obsessed" because it's >>> clear that while vision is useful, it's almost like sighted people >>> sometimes go overboard with touchscreens and a lot of flashy and >>> unnecessary graphic material. Add the fact that the NfB as an >>> organization with assumptions and values that shape our blindness lives >>> and even our non-blindness lives, and you've got the making of a >>> cultural identity. > >>> Respectfully, >>> Jedi > > >>> Original message: >>>> I think the issue of blindness constituting identity is definitely very >>>> interesting, and I've been thinking about it a bit recently. > >>>> I believe that blindness does shape our sense of who we are, and this >>>> is >>>> largely socially influenced, but it's also deeper than that. It's >>>> almost >>>> certainly true that the challenges, discrimination, exclusion, etc that >>>> blind people routinely experience influence our identity. However, and >>> this >>>> is where I part somewhat with so called NFB philosophy, I'm not sure >> that, >>>> in the absence of these factors, blindness would be reduced to a mere >>>> characteristic, if mere characteristic is supposed to mean something >>> rather >>>> trivial and unimportant like hair and eye colour. I definitely think >>> that, >>>> in the absence of social and environmental barriers, blind people would >> be >>>> able to flourish as well as anyone else; I don't question that claim, >>>> but >>> I >>>> think perceiving the world in a unique way, in the way blind people do >>> with >>>> little or no sight, is a significant factor in how a person's identity >>>> is >>>> constituted. > >>>> Arielle called sex a mere characteristic. As with blindness, if >>>> calling >>> it >>>> a mere characteristic is supposed to mean that it is as trivial as >>>> being >> 5 >>>> foot 6 instead of 5 foot 5, then I don't think it is a mere >>> characteristic. >>>> I don't have evidence of this, but I think I would feel differently >>>> about >>> my >>>> body if I had the ability to grow a human being inside of it. My hunch >> is >>>> that the ability, or lack of ability, to give birth probably affects >>>> how >>> one >>>> views one's body and thus one's sense of self in a non-trivial way. >>>> Similarly, relying heavily on auditory input, developing better >>>> memories, >>>> perceiving the world with little to no reliance on sight, I think these >>> all >>>> affect a person's sense of identity in non-trivial ways, and they don't >>>> depend on social factors. > >>>> Clarification, I'm not trying to suggest that women are defined by >>>> their >>>> ability to give birth. I'm only saying that to possess that ability >> might >>>> shape how you think about yourself in a way that is more significant >>>> than >>>> whether you have short or long hair. > >>>> Best, > >>>> Marc > >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >>>> Behalf Of Arielle Silverman >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 7:08 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > > >>>> Hi again, > >>>> Re-reading the posts thus far, I will add that I agree with Jedi. >>>> Blindness itself doesn't constitute the social identity. The identity >>>> comes from the social reaction we experience as a result of blindness, >>>> and the ways we've developed to respond to that social reaction. I >>>> would venture to guess that this is similar to the effects of skin >>>> color or biological sex on the development of racial and gender >>>> identities. Race and sex are mere characteristics to the extent that >>>> they by themselves don't influence how people function, just as >>>> blindness by itself doesn't significantly alter or take away from how >>>> we function. It's the social expectations associated with race, sex, >>>> and disability that shape how those identities form and how they >>>> influence people's sense of self. > >>>> Arielle > > >>>> On 3/25/10, Arielle Silverman wrote: >>>>> Hi all, > >>>>> A few comments from an amateur social psychologist: > >>>>> There is research showing that members of minority groups (i.e. ethnic >>>>> minorities) sometimes experience the same kinds of awkward >>>>> interactions with majority group members that we have discussed as >>>>> happening to blind people. Specifically, majority group members (i.e. >>>>> white Americans) sometimes feel awkward when interacting with minority >>>>> members, especially out of concern that they might accidentally come >>>>> across as being prejudiced or racist. The result is that the >>>>> interaction tends to be strained and there is more tension than there >>>>> should be, and minority group members can get left out as a result of >>>>> the awkwardness. Of course this doesn't happen to all minority members >>>>> and certainly many majority members have no problem interacting across >>>>> race or ethnicity lines, just as plenty of sighted people have no >>>>> problem befriending, working with or dating blind people. But it is a >>>>> general tendency. > >>>>> I think the question of whether blindness is an identity or a >>>>> situation/characteristic is interesting. My hunch is that it depends >>>>> on who you ask; in other words, blind people can range from being >>>>> completely disidentified (and often not voluntarily associating with >>>>> other blind people) to completely identified and highly affiliated (to >>>>> the point of having no close sighted friends). For low-identifiers, >>>>> blindness probably feels more like a single characteristic; for high >>>>> identifiers, blindness may feel like a trait coupled with a social >>>>> group label. In the NFB, when we talk about "the blind" or "the >>>>> nation's blind", we are implicitly acknowledging that the blind have a >>>>> common identity, even if we don't all believe that this common >>>>> identity or fate is rooted in culture. > >>>>> As part of my Ph.D. training I do intend to do some research >>>>> investigating whether blindness is a coherent identity and, if it is, >>>>> whether it has similar effects on people's self-concept and behavior >>>>> as other identities (i.e. ethnic, religious, etc.) For example, I >>>>> suspect that the constant messages we get from the public about our >>>>> inferiority and the devastation of blindness pose unique psychological >>>>> issues that we contend with, and that it can be difficult to see >>>>> ourselves as whole, capable beings when our identities as blind people >>>>> are construed in the public eye as compromised or broken. > >>>>> One final thought: I've found it interesting that many sighted people >>>>> seem to think of blindness as a condition or trait but don't think of >>>>> "the blind" as a coherent group with the same rights as racial, >>>>> ethnic, and other cultural groups. This was apparent in the debate >>>>> over the movie Blindness. I heard several people (some sighted, some >>>>> blind) argue that the movie was OK because the people portrayed in it >>>>> weren't "real blind people"; rather, they were sighted people who went >>>>> blind as part of the plot. Of course, any of us who were sighted at >>>>> one time know that people who go blind are still blind people; >>>>> nevertheless, there appeared to be that distinction in some people's >>>>> minds. I think this is also why it's hard for us to make civil rights >>>>> arguments against blatant injustices (i.e. "Treating blacks with this >>>>> kind of discrimination is unacceptable, and so treating us this way is >>>>> also unacceptable"). A lot of people just don't get it, or think that >>>>> treating blind people differently is OK because stereotypes about >>>>> blindness are somehow more valid than stereotypes about other minority >>>>> groups. I'm not sure how to bridge that thought gap or how to >>>>> demonstrate the existence of the common blind identity in situations >>>>> where we are all affected by the same discriminations or denials of >>>>> rights. > >>>>> Arielle > >>>>> On 3/25/10, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>>>>> True. Maybe the reason I'm anti social is I have no social skills to >>>>>> begin >>>>>> it I wirhwe talk to much or don't' talk at all and sometimes I come >>>>>> across >>>>>> as rude but I'm so used to beeing int he teaching invironment that I >>>>>> cannot >>>>>> for me get out of it. I'm not making much sense as I am starting to >>>>>> get >>> a >>>>>> bit hungry.. Hehaha. I do know this much I have a harder time >>> socialising >>>>>> with the sighree then with the bind. theer is so much that can be >>>>>> comunicated in silence. so much we can't see. > >>>>>> I really enjoy reading these discussions and view points as it makes >>>>>> me >>>>>> think about what I need to work on or not bather working on. > >>>>>> Take care all. >>>>>> On Mar 24, 2010, at 9:14 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: > >>>>>>> Interesting. If we're talking straight up blindness, I think we've >> all >>>>>>> experienced a moment or two of feeling out of place in light of the >>>>>>> dominant >>>>>>> sighted crowd. I certainly experience with each meeting I attend >> until >>>>>>> I >>>>>>> shake off the feeling and plunge forward. If we're talking ethnic >>>>>>> minority, >>>>>>> I can't say I've experienced that before, but I don't know if it's >>>>>>> because >>>>>>> the feeling is overshadowed by the blindness factor or because I've >>>>>>> genuinely never witnessed this behavior. > >>>>>>> Regardless, what I find interesting about this discussion is that it >>>>>>> makes >>>>>>> blindness an identity factor. I think the original post asked how >>>>>>> we >>> as >>>>>>> blind individuals handled campus involvement, when our philosophy >>> claims >>>>>>> blindness can be reduced to the level of a nuisance. I know this >>>>>>> position >>>>>>> does not claim blindness can be eliminated, but it would appear to >>>>>>> suggest >>>>>>> blindness is irrelevant to one's sense of self. So, rather than >>>>>>> ask, >>>>>>> "how >>>>>>> do you, as a blind person, handle X, Y and Z," shouldn't we be >>>>>>> asking >>>>>>> how >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> handle the task in general? > >>>>>>> Interesting discussion. > >>>>>>> Joe Orozco > >>>>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >>>>>>> sleeves, >>>>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 8:51 PM >>>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > >>>>>>> Joe, > >>>>>>> The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually >>>>>>> becoming >>>>>>> a key issue for those who study organizational communication and >>>>>>> diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a >>>>>>> fancy >>>>>>> way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently >> based >>>>>>> on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member >> of >>>>>>> a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just >>>>>>> didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by >>>>>>> your >>>>>>> minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or >>>>>>> one >>>>>>> of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or >>>>>>> maybe >>>>>>> it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. >>>>>>> Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is >> controlled >>>>>>> by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are >>>>>>> rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less >>>>>>> likely >>>>>>> to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some >>>>>>> point >>>>>>> and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that >> for >>>>>>> people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or >> one >>>>>>> of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't >>>>>>> yet >>>>>>> become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant >>>>>>> population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to >>>>>>> experience this interesting problem at some point. > >>>>>>> Respectfully, >>>>>>> Jedi > > >>>>>>> Original message: >>>>>>>> Jedi, > >>>>>>>> I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or >>>>>>> witnessed this >>>>>>>> behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, >>>>>>> could you give >>>>>>>> examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification >> to >>>>>>>> explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be >>>>>>> accurate. > >>>>>>>> Joe Orozco > >>>>>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up >>>>>>> their sleeves, >>>>>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam >>>>>>>> Ewing > >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM >>>>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > >>>>>>>> It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for >>>>>>>> minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in >>>>>>>> school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of >>>>>>> access to >>>>>>>> informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real >>>>>>>> obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from >>>>>>>> just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling >>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>> large gap between minorities and their non-minority >>>>>>> counterparts. There >>>>>>>> really is no right way to handle this problem because it >>>>>>> affects us all >>>>>>>> so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left >>>>>>> out, it may >>>>>>>> be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear >> you. > >>>>>>>> Respectfully, >>>>>>>> Jedi > > >>>>>>>> Original message: >>>>>>>>> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of >>>>>>>> clubs or other >>>>>>>>> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew >>>>>>>> for a play, but >>>>>>>>> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything >>>>>>>> other than >>>>>>>>> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I >>>>>>>> did my job >>>>>>>>> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that >>>>>>>> if they talked >>>>>>>>> to me they would offend me or something like that. > >>>>>>>>> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved >>>>>>> in the boy >>>>>>>>> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy >>>>>>>> scouts and life >>>>>>>>> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or >>>>>>>> technical in >>>>>>>>> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't >>>>>>>> know if this is >>>>>>>>> blindness related, or what. > > >>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>>>>>> From: "Jamie Principato" >>>>>>>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > > >>>>>>>>>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get >>>>>>>> involved in as >>>>>>>>>> much >>>>>>>>>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz >>>>>>> Band, and a >>>>>>>>>> Youth >>>>>>>>>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate >>>>>>> and public >>>>>>>>>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I >>>>>>>> couldn't wait >>>>>>>>>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups >>>>>>>> and activities >>>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>> choose from. > >>>>>>>>>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot >>>>>>>> of...problems...with the >>>>>>>>>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went >>>>>>>> to this high >>>>>>>>>> school because we were told it offered the most for >>>>>>> visually impaired >>>>>>>>>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but >>>>>>>> I'll spare you >>>>>>>>>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students >>>>>>>> at this school >>>>>>>>>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student >>>>>>>>>> body, >>>>>>>>>> avoiding >>>>>>>>>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after >>>>>>>> joining Model UN >>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and >>>>>>>> planning to go to >>>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the >>>>>>>> fact t I joined >>>>>>>>>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and >>>>>>>> that if I was >>>>>>>>>> going >>>>>>>>>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a >>>>>>>> permission note (no >>>>>>>>>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first >>>>>>>>>> find >> a >>>>>>>>>> teacher >>>>>>>>>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I >>>>>>> attend these >>>>>>>>>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally >>>>>>>> unless I sat >>>>>>>>>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman >>>>>>>> stands with my >>>>>>>>>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was >>>>>>>> unnecessary, and we >>>>>>>>>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of >>>>>>>>>> other >>>>>>>>>> issues, >>>>>>>>>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. > >>>>>>>>>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home >>>>>>>> school support >>>>>>>>>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I >>>>>>>> took advantage >>>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular >>>>>>>> activities in >>>>>>>>>> my >>>>>>>>>> community, even sports (something that never would have >>>>>>> flown at that >>>>>>>>>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on >>>>>>>> campus and in >>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing >>>>>>>> club, a volunteer >>>>>>>>>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also >>>>>>>> try to get the >>>>>>>>>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, >>>>>>>> and make use of >>>>>>>>>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been >>>>>>>> having is that >>>>>>>>>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by >>>>>>>> house recently >>>>>>>>>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the >>>>>>>> evening. The only >>>>>>>>>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or >>>>>>>> get home from >>>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you >>>>>>>> need to get >>>>>>>>>> out >>>>>>>>>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if >>>>>>>> money is tight >>>>>>>>>> one >>>>>>>>>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside >>>>>>>> of attending >>>>>>>>>> class, including attending free activities or events. I >>>>>>>> guess that's just >>>>>>>>>> one price of living off campus though. > >>>>>>>>>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith >>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>> Hi list, > >>>>>>>>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>>>>>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school >> or >>>>>>>>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new >>>>>>> people? do you >>>>>>>>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends >>>>>>>>>>> at >> a >>>>>>>>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- >>>>>>>> identity as >>>>>>>>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how >>>>>>>>>>> did >>>>>>>>>>> people interact with you? >>>>>>>>>>> Thoughts? >>>>>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>>>>> Darian >>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>>>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>>>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>>>>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a >>>>>>>> nationwide teacher >>>>>>>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>>>>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need >> your >>>>>>>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>>>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org > >>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>>>>> account info for >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: > > >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr >>>>>>>> dfly%40gmail.com > >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>>>> account info for >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: > >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% >>>>>>>> 40gmail.com > > >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>> info for nabs-l: > >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin >>>>>>>> djedi%40samobile.net > >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>>>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>> info for nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco >>>>>>> %40gmail.com > > >>>>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of >>>>>>> virus signature database 4972 (20100324) __________ > >>>>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > >>>>>>> http://www.eset.com > > > >>>>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>>>>>> signature >>>>>>> database 4972 (20100324) __________ > >>>>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > >>>>>>> http://www.eset.com > > > >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: > > > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com > > >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: > > > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gma >>>> il.com > > > >>>>> -- >>>>> Arielle Silverman >>>>> President, National Association of Blind Students >>>>> Phone: 602-502-2255 >>>>> Email: >>>>> nabs.president at gmail.com >>>>> Website: >>>>> www.nabslink.org > > > >>>> -- >>>> Arielle Silverman >>>> President, National Association of Blind Students >>>> Phone: 602-502-2255 >>>> Email: >>>> nabs.president at gmail.com >>>> Website: >>>> www.nabslink.org > >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: > > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >>>> il.com > > >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: > > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >>> bile.net > >>> -- >>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >>> il.com > > >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >> bile.net > >> -- >> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >> il.com > > >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit > www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/daydreamingncolor%40gmail.com From smwhalenpsp at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 07:25:16 2010 From: smwhalenpsp at gmail.com (Sean Whalen) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 03:25:16 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4EE0E6E24C0941DAAD5B54AB5E5B39BC@VALUED04C3B21F> The point is that without ever having had the experience of being a man, you cannot say for sure that your being a woman does or does not have an impact on how you see yourself or experience the world. I suspect it does, but without any basis for comparison, you can't say. Just as my being blind from birth prohibits me from determining whether or not or to what degree my blindness affects how I view myself and experience the world. My gut feeling is that my blindness has a fairly profound affect on at least a significant subset of the things I experience and the way in which I experience them. Blindness is absolutely part of my identity, as is my height, skin color and love of the Chicago Cubs. Your identity is just an exhaustive list of all of the characteristics and attributes which make a particular person the particular person that they are. To what degree I identify myself as blind or identify with the greater community of blind people is a completely separate question from that of whether or not blindness is part of my identity. I don't think blindness, strictly defined, is a social construct, while I think the concept of disability is. I'm sure that to articulate my reasons for feeling this way would require more time than I am willing to put into it now, but that is my gut feeling. Thought I'd throw my two cents into this interesting discussion. All the best, Sean From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Sat Mar 27 08:55:07 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 04:55:07 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity Message-ID: <20100327085507.27488.99879@web2> Well, if we want to get down to brass tacks, we can all say that we will never know just how our beingness affects our perceptions, but the bottom line still lies at the fact that our perception of our beingness is largely determine by what our culture teaches us about it, and identity is the presentation of how we respond to those teachings in our interactions with ourselves and others. I think it's interesting that two men have been interested in whether or not I see myself differently because I can give birth yet no women have weighed in on the subject. I also think they're more interesting in my birthing abilities than I am. Well gentlemen, you're welcome to those abilities so long as you're willing to take the identity that comes with them. *tongue in cheek* Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > The point is that without ever having had the experience of being a man, you > cannot say for sure that your being a woman does or does not have an impact > on how you see yourself or experience the world. I suspect it does, but > without any basis for comparison, you can't say. Just as my being blind from > birth prohibits me from determining whether or not or to what degree my > blindness affects how I view myself and experience the world. My gut feeling > is that my blindness has a fairly profound affect on at least a significant > subset of the things I experience and the way in which I experience them. > Blindness is absolutely part of my identity, as is my height, skin color and > love of the Chicago Cubs. Your identity is just an exhaustive list of all of > the characteristics and attributes which make a particular person the > particular person that they are. > To what degree I identify myself as blind or identify with the greater > community of blind people is a completely separate question from that of > whether or not blindness is part of my identity. > I don't think blindness, strictly defined, is a social construct, while I > think the concept of disability is. I'm sure that to articulate my reasons > for feeling this way would require more time than I am willing to put into > it now, but that is my gut feeling. > Thought I'd throw my two cents into this interesting discussion. > All the best, > Sean > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From brileyp at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 12:55:51 2010 From: brileyp at gmail.com (Briley Pollard) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 07:55:51 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity In-Reply-To: <20100327085507.27488.99879@web2> References: <20100327085507.27488.99879@web2> Message-ID: <281B1782-71A9-42DE-B9A0-53C7D663B4A6@gmail.com> Jedi, I thought you handled the issue of giving birth quite capably. I am not a mother yet, so no, I don't think about my ability to pop out kids as a big part of who I am... or really ponder it as a part of identity at all. Do you men see your ability to participate in making children as a part of your identity? Probably not. So, it is semi chauvinist of you to assume we are attached to our uterus as a part of us that gives us self worth. Briley On Mar 27, 2010, at 3:55 AM, Jedi wrote: > Well, if we want to get down to brass tacks, we can all say that we will never know just how our being is affects our perceptions, but the bottom line still lies at the fact that our perception of our beingness is largely determine by what our culture teaches us about it, and identity is the presentation of how we respond to those teachings in our interactions with ourselves and others. > > I think it's interesting that two men have been interested in whether or not I see myself differently because I can give birth yet no women have weighed in on the subject. I also think they're more interesting in my birthing abilities than I am. Well gentlemen, you're welcome to those abilities so long as you're willing to take the identity that comes with them. *tongue in cheek* > > Respectfully, > Jedi > > > > Original message: >> The point is that without ever having had the experience of being a man, you >> cannot say for sure that your being a woman does or does not have an impact >> on how you see yourself or experience the world. I suspect it does, but >> without any basis for comparison, you can't say. Just as my being blind from >> birth prohibits me from determining whether or not or to what degree my >> blindness affects how I view myself and experience the world. My gut feeling >> is that my blindness has a fairly profound affect on at least a significant >> subset of the things I experience and the way in which I experience them. > >> Blindness is absolutely part of my identity, as is my height, skin color and >> love of the Chicago Cubs. Your identity is just an exhaustive list of all of >> the characteristics and attributes which make a particular person the >> particular person that they are. > >> To what degree I identify myself as blind or identify with the greater >> community of blind people is a completely separate question from that of >> whether or not blindness is part of my identity. > >> I don't think blindness, strictly defined, is a social construct, while I >> think the concept of disability is. I'm sure that to articulate my reasons >> for feeling this way would require more time than I am willing to put into >> it now, but that is my gut feeling. > >> Thought I'd throw my two cents into this interesting discussion. > >> All the best, > >> Sean > > >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com From brileyp at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 12:57:59 2010 From: brileyp at gmail.com (Briley Pollard) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 07:57:59 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Also, for the record, finding identity in being female is not necessarily linked to our ability to produce offspring...there is more to being a woman than giving birth. On Mar 27, 2010, at 12:22 AM, Marc Workman wrote: > Jedi, > > What specifically do you find circular? > > You can keep telling me that you don't see yourself differently, and I will > say yet again that how you see yourself is not the issue. I don't think > about my ability to sense pain. Does this mean that possessing or lacking > the ability to sense pain makes no difference to a person's identity? It > would seem to according to your argument. I don't think of my ability for > self-consciousness unless society draws my attention to it, so therefore > being self-conscious does not affect my identity outside of a social > context. It seems to me that being self-conscious or not is likely to have > an impact on a person's identity regardless of social context. Whether one > sees one's ability for self-consciousness as important or not makes > absolutely no difference. > > You said, > What it really comes down to is that society tells us what different > experiences mean. > > It's this claim that I disagree with. You seem to be saying that there is > no experience, physical or otherwise, that isn't entirely socially mediated. > I just don't think the body is that malleable. I don't think society can > make up the meaning of experiences out of thin air as you seem to imply. > > You also said, > What I think is really going on with these brain studies is that blind > people are using parts of their brains to make inferences about what they're > being told. It's a skill we pick up over time as a way of supplimenting what > we already get. I wouldn't be terribly surprised if the sighted could do the > same thing and that more of their brains would light up if they used the > skill more. there's a fine distinction there. > > It sounds to me like you are saying that blind people end up developing > skills that allow them to think in different ways. That is all that I have > been suggesting. Of course sighted people could do it if they found a way > of developing the skill, perhaps walking around blind folded would do it. > If this isn't what you had in mind, then I'm afraid the distinction was a > bit too fine for me. > > I'm not sure if we'll come to agreement either, but I do want to better > understand the social constructionist position that you seem to be > espousing. > > Regards, > > Marc > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On > Behalf Of Jedi > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2010 9:20 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity > > > Marc, > > This is a circular argument as far as I'm concerned, and i don't think > we're going to ever agree completely on this issue. I don't know how > many times I have to tell you that I don't see myself differently > because I have the ability to give birth. If I do, it's because I > learned from my society that I'm supposed to. But before that, I really > didn't care. And to be honest, I care about it less than some other > women do. Same goes for my blindness. Before I learned that i'm > different from others, it didn't occur to me that I couldn't see. I > just figured that I was what I was. What it really comes down to is > that society tells us what different experiences mean, and we think of > ourselves based on those meanings. For example, most White people don't > really think about the fact that they're White because it's not > something that's regularly drawn attention to. That may be less true > now that discussions about racism have become more mainstream, but > people take their Whiteness for granted because they are sort of like > the invisible norm. Other ethnicities don't have that luxury, so they > are more aware of their skin color because society has told them that > they are different from White people in fundamental ways. If there was > no meaning assigned to skin color, we might observe that someone is > Black and someone is White, but that's about as far as it would go. But > instead, this socially constructed meaning created that identity that > having a different skin color other than White produces. > > I think your article is interesting because it almost repeats long-held > notions about blind people that have been around in the field of > special education for a long time: blind people's language development > is delayed, especially since they can't see what's being talked about > in order to link some object with it's symbolic counterpart, yet blind > people develop an amazingness with words themselves because they have > no other way to really get information. Some folks believe that even > our amazing ability with words isn't enough since we still can't link > these words with the things they represent. What I think is really > going on with these brain studies is that blind people are using parts > of their brains to make inferences about what they're being told. It's > a skill we pick up over time as a way of supplimenting what we already > get. I wouldn't be terribly surprised if the sighted could do the same > thing and that more of their brains would light up if they used the > skill more. there's a fine distinction there. > > Respectfully, > Jedi > > > > Original message: >> Jedi, > >> I hope that I did not try to tell you what you think about your ability to >> give birth. I said that I wasn't sure it was possible to say that you > don't >> see yourself differently. I admit I should have clarified, but what I > said >> has absolutely nothing to do with you and what you think about yourself. > I >> was saying that it is literally impossible to make a claim like the one > you >> made. The reason it is impossible is because to know for sure if you do > or >> do not see yourself differently as a result of possessing the ability to >> give birth, you would have had to have grown up as a man and as a woman, >> which is not physically possible. So I suppose you can say that you don't >> think about it, and you probably don't, but since you have nothing to >> compare it to, it's impossible to say whether it does or does not shape > how >> you think about yourself. It would be like me saying, I don't think about >> my ability to be self-aware. Therefore, it isn't a part of my identity, > or, >> I don't think much about my ability to feel pain, so I would be the same >> person if I lacked this ability. I can say that I don't think about > these >> things, and it can be true that I don't think about these things, but I >> can't say that they do not shape my identity, which is what I thought you >> were trying to say. > >> The deeper claim I'm making is that identity is not something you can just >> step outside of and say features X and Y are part of my identity, but >> features A, B, and C are not. I want to say that there are things about > you >> that affect your identity that you are not at all aware of, and it is not >> possible to step outside of your identity and take stock of the factors > that >> make you who you are. If you step outside of your identity, the you that > is >> doing the stepping disappears. So it's a philosophical claim that you can >> never no for sure what exactly shapes your sense of self because knowing >> this would require stepping outside yourself to have a look, but this is > not >> possible. > >> As for language processing, I'm going to paste an article abstract below > my >> name. It discusses the faster language processing that I mentioned. > >> Please correct me if I'm wrong: The difference in opinion here seems to be >> that you think that identity is socially constructed. I'm only suggesting >> that there is a close link between the body and identity and that > possessing >> a body that functions in a rather significantly different way (e.g., one >> that is capable of visual perception versus one that is not) has a >> non-trivial impact on one's sense of self. It doesn't strike me as a >> particularly bold claim, no more than to say that I would probably be a >> different person if I had a photographic memory, the ability to sense >> infrared signals, or the sense of smell of a dog. And though I don't > think >> that how we perceive our bodies is beyond social influence, I'm not sure >> that it is entirely socially constructed either. > >> Abstract follows. > >> Marc > >> Event -related potentials during auditory language processing in >> congenitally blind and sighted people >> Brigitte Roder >> Abstract > >> While behavioral studies have documented delayed language acquisition in >> blind children, other studies have revealed better speech discrimination >> abilities for blind than sighted adults. Several brain imaging studies > have >> provided evidence for cortical reorganization due to visual deprivation > but >> the cerebral organization of language in blind humans is not known yet. > >> We hypothesized that the increasing specialization of language systems >> normally observed during development may not take place to the same degree >> in blind individuals since posterior visual areas do not receive their >> adequate input. On the other hand, we hypothesized that blind people, due > to >> their greater reliance upon the auditory language signal, may process > speech >> faster than sighted people. > >> To test these assumptions, event-related potentials were recorded while 11 >> congenitally blind and 11 sighted adults matched in age, gender, > handedness >> and education were engaged in a language task. Participants listened to >> sentences in order to decide after each sentence if it was meaningful or >> not. > >> Incongruous sentence-final words elicited an N400 effect in both groups. > The >> N400 effect had a left-lateralized fronto-central scalp distribution in > the >> sighted but a symmetric and broad topography in the blind. Furthermore, > the >> N400 effect started earlier in the blind than in the sighted. Closed class >> compared to open class sentence middle words elicited a more pronounced > late >> negativity in the blind than in the sighted. > >> These results suggest that blind people process auditory language stimuli >> faster than sighted people and that some language functions may be >> reorganized in the blind. > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >> Behalf Of Jedi >> Sent: Friday, March 26, 2010 1:14 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity > > >> Marc, > >> Seems how you're not a woman, and seems how you're not me, it isn't >> your place to tell me what I think about myself in light of my ability >> to give birth. I'm telling you that aside from the social consequences >> of being the child bearing half of the spiecies, I don't think about it >> much, and I suspect you would because you're not a woman. That is not >> to say that some women don't think about it more than I do, but I >> personally don't think about it much. I also suspect that sighted >> people think the same way. They think about the differences of >> blindness more than many of us do. > >> Next, blind people do not have inherently better memories nor better >> language processing skills. On the whole, we're on par with the sighted >> even if there are small brain differences. Just hanging out at an NFB >> meeting or convention shows us how many differences there are between >> us all: some have better memories than others, some are well spoken >> while others aren't. The research I'm speaking of shows that blind >> people handle voice recognition with the same parts of the brain that >> the sighted handle face recognition and that we handle space-related >> tasks with the same mechanism the sighted do except that we use >> different inputs for the information. The occipital lobe of the brain >> lights up when reading Braille the same way it does when reading print. >> For some of us, the occipital lobe lights up when listening to text >> because that's our primary form of reading. that may be linked to the >> researched you're talking about. > >> Respectfully, >> Jedi > >> Original message: >>> Jedi, > >>> I'm not sure it's possible to say that you don't see yourself differently >>> because you have the ability to give birth. I'm only saying that I >> suspect >>> I would view my body differently if I had that ability. It's not >> something >>> I'll ever know. But here's another example if that one doesn't satisfy >> you. >>> If I were a woman, I would probably be 60 pounds lighter and six or seven >>> inches shorter on average. Again, I can't say for sure, but I'm pretty >> sure >>> that living in the world, in any world, with a body that is 60 pounds >>> lighter and 7 inches shorter would have a non-trivial impact on my sense >> of >>> self. > >>> And here's a blindness example. In my experience, blind people tend to >> have >>> better memories than the average sighted person. Unless you want to > argue >>> that this is only because of social factors, which I admit probably is a >>> factor but not the only factor, then better memories will be around even >>> after all social barriers are removed. I'm pretty sure again that having >> a >>> better memory that allows me to quickly recall information changes the > way >> I >>> am able to think in a non-trivial way. If I suddenly lost my better >> memory, >>> even if I didn't need it to get around successfully in the world, it > would >>> have an impact on my sense of self. Would I be a completely different >>> person? Probably not, but it would affect my identity more than if I went >>> out and got a haircut tomorrow. > >>> Example 2: You say that evidence shows that the brains of blind people >> more >>> or less process information the same way the brains of sighted people do. >>> I've seen evidence that suggests the contrary, particularly with respect >> to >>> language processing. There is evidence that some blind people end up >> using >>> the occipital lobe, the part of the brain normally reserved for visual >>> processing, to conduct language processing. As a result, studies have >> shown >>> that certain sorts of language processing occur faster among blind > people. >>> This seems to me that it could also affect the way I think and my sense > of >>> self in a non-trivial way. And it doesn't seem to be entirely social. >> Any >>> social context that includes an oral language will have the same result. >>> Though I admit that this can be more or less emphasized depending on >> social >>> factors. > >>> Finally, I wonder if some people think there is a danger in acknowledging >>> that blindness can shape our identities even in the absence of harmful >>> social attitudes. I can see the potential danger. If we say that we are >>> different, then others can argue that we should thus be treated >> differently. >>> So I can understand why it might be better to deny it even if it's true. >>> Alternatively, you could just not think it's true, but I think the >> examples >>> of better memories and increased language processing abilities, plus >> others >>> that I'm sure I could come up with if I spent some time researching, >> suggest >>> that blindness does generally affect the ways in which we are able to >> think >>> and thus our sense of self in what I keep saying are merely non-trivial >>> ways. > >>> Regards, > >>> Marc > >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >>> Behalf Of Jedi >>> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 11:57 PM >>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity > > >>> Marc, > >>> I'm a woman, and I don't see myself differently because I have the >>> ability to give birth, but I do perceive the world based on the fact >>> that sexism in all its forms is still alive and well int he world. As >>> to blindness, I definitely think that we physically perceive the world >>> slightly different than the sighted, but not enough to really warrant >>> saying that blindness fundamentally shifts our world view. >>> Neuroscientists are starting to show that the blind and sighted use the >>> same rules for perceiving the world, we just use different inputs or >>> modalities even though our brains more or less process the information >>> the same way the brains of sighted people do. I think however, that >>> being blind has produced a number of very interesting experiences that >>> we all have in common including a world that is obsessed with >>> perceiving the world visually. I use the word "obsessed" because it's >>> clear that while vision is useful, it's almost like sighted people >>> sometimes go overboard with touchscreens and a lot of flashy and >>> unnecessary graphic material. Add the fact that the NfB as an >>> organization with assumptions and values that shape our blindness lives >>> and even our non-blindness lives, and you've got the making of a >>> cultural identity. > >>> Respectfully, >>> Jedi > > >>> Original message: >>>> I think the issue of blindness constituting identity is definitely very >>>> interesting, and I've been thinking about it a bit recently. > >>>> I believe that blindness does shape our sense of who we are, and this is >>>> largely socially influenced, but it's also deeper than that. It's > almost >>>> certainly true that the challenges, discrimination, exclusion, etc that >>>> blind people routinely experience influence our identity. However, and >>> this >>>> is where I part somewhat with so called NFB philosophy, I'm not sure >> that, >>>> in the absence of these factors, blindness would be reduced to a mere >>>> characteristic, if mere characteristic is supposed to mean something >>> rather >>>> trivial and unimportant like hair and eye colour. I definitely think >>> that, >>>> in the absence of social and environmental barriers, blind people would >> be >>>> able to flourish as well as anyone else; I don't question that claim, > but >>> I >>>> think perceiving the world in a unique way, in the way blind people do >>> with >>>> little or no sight, is a significant factor in how a person's identity > is >>>> constituted. > >>>> Arielle called sex a mere characteristic. As with blindness, if calling >>> it >>>> a mere characteristic is supposed to mean that it is as trivial as being >> 5 >>>> foot 6 instead of 5 foot 5, then I don't think it is a mere >>> characteristic. >>>> I don't have evidence of this, but I think I would feel differently > about >>> my >>>> body if I had the ability to grow a human being inside of it. My hunch >> is >>>> that the ability, or lack of ability, to give birth probably affects how >>> one >>>> views one's body and thus one's sense of self in a non-trivial way. >>>> Similarly, relying heavily on auditory input, developing better > memories, >>>> perceiving the world with little to no reliance on sight, I think these >>> all >>>> affect a person's sense of identity in non-trivial ways, and they don't >>>> depend on social factors. > >>>> Clarification, I'm not trying to suggest that women are defined by their >>>> ability to give birth. I'm only saying that to possess that ability >> might >>>> shape how you think about yourself in a way that is more significant > than >>>> whether you have short or long hair. > >>>> Best, > >>>> Marc > >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >>>> Behalf Of Arielle Silverman >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 7:08 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > > >>>> Hi again, > >>>> Re-reading the posts thus far, I will add that I agree with Jedi. >>>> Blindness itself doesn't constitute the social identity. The identity >>>> comes from the social reaction we experience as a result of blindness, >>>> and the ways we've developed to respond to that social reaction. I >>>> would venture to guess that this is similar to the effects of skin >>>> color or biological sex on the development of racial and gender >>>> identities. Race and sex are mere characteristics to the extent that >>>> they by themselves don't influence how people function, just as >>>> blindness by itself doesn't significantly alter or take away from how >>>> we function. It's the social expectations associated with race, sex, >>>> and disability that shape how those identities form and how they >>>> influence people's sense of self. > >>>> Arielle > > >>>> On 3/25/10, Arielle Silverman wrote: >>>>> Hi all, > >>>>> A few comments from an amateur social psychologist: > >>>>> There is research showing that members of minority groups (i.e. ethnic >>>>> minorities) sometimes experience the same kinds of awkward >>>>> interactions with majority group members that we have discussed as >>>>> happening to blind people. Specifically, majority group members (i.e. >>>>> white Americans) sometimes feel awkward when interacting with minority >>>>> members, especially out of concern that they might accidentally come >>>>> across as being prejudiced or racist. The result is that the >>>>> interaction tends to be strained and there is more tension than there >>>>> should be, and minority group members can get left out as a result of >>>>> the awkwardness. Of course this doesn't happen to all minority members >>>>> and certainly many majority members have no problem interacting across >>>>> race or ethnicity lines, just as plenty of sighted people have no >>>>> problem befriending, working with or dating blind people. But it is a >>>>> general tendency. > >>>>> I think the question of whether blindness is an identity or a >>>>> situation/characteristic is interesting. My hunch is that it depends >>>>> on who you ask; in other words, blind people can range from being >>>>> completely disidentified (and often not voluntarily associating with >>>>> other blind people) to completely identified and highly affiliated (to >>>>> the point of having no close sighted friends). For low-identifiers, >>>>> blindness probably feels more like a single characteristic; for high >>>>> identifiers, blindness may feel like a trait coupled with a social >>>>> group label. In the NFB, when we talk about "the blind" or "the >>>>> nation's blind", we are implicitly acknowledging that the blind have a >>>>> common identity, even if we don't all believe that this common >>>>> identity or fate is rooted in culture. > >>>>> As part of my Ph.D. training I do intend to do some research >>>>> investigating whether blindness is a coherent identity and, if it is, >>>>> whether it has similar effects on people's self-concept and behavior >>>>> as other identities (i.e. ethnic, religious, etc.) For example, I >>>>> suspect that the constant messages we get from the public about our >>>>> inferiority and the devastation of blindness pose unique psychological >>>>> issues that we contend with, and that it can be difficult to see >>>>> ourselves as whole, capable beings when our identities as blind people >>>>> are construed in the public eye as compromised or broken. > >>>>> One final thought: I've found it interesting that many sighted people >>>>> seem to think of blindness as a condition or trait but don't think of >>>>> "the blind" as a coherent group with the same rights as racial, >>>>> ethnic, and other cultural groups. This was apparent in the debate >>>>> over the movie Blindness. I heard several people (some sighted, some >>>>> blind) argue that the movie was OK because the people portrayed in it >>>>> weren't "real blind people"; rather, they were sighted people who went >>>>> blind as part of the plot. Of course, any of us who were sighted at >>>>> one time know that people who go blind are still blind people; >>>>> nevertheless, there appeared to be that distinction in some people's >>>>> minds. I think this is also why it's hard for us to make civil rights >>>>> arguments against blatant injustices (i.e. "Treating blacks with this >>>>> kind of discrimination is unacceptable, and so treating us this way is >>>>> also unacceptable"). A lot of people just don't get it, or think that >>>>> treating blind people differently is OK because stereotypes about >>>>> blindness are somehow more valid than stereotypes about other minority >>>>> groups. I'm not sure how to bridge that thought gap or how to >>>>> demonstrate the existence of the common blind identity in situations >>>>> where we are all affected by the same discriminations or denials of >>>>> rights. > >>>>> Arielle > >>>>> On 3/25/10, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>>>>> True. Maybe the reason I'm anti social is I have no social skills to >>>>>> begin >>>>>> it I wirhwe talk to much or don't' talk at all and sometimes I come >>>>>> across >>>>>> as rude but I'm so used to beeing int he teaching invironment that I >>>>>> cannot >>>>>> for me get out of it. I'm not making much sense as I am starting to > get >>> a >>>>>> bit hungry.. Hehaha. I do know this much I have a harder time >>> socialising >>>>>> with the sighree then with the bind. theer is so much that can be >>>>>> comunicated in silence. so much we can't see. > >>>>>> I really enjoy reading these discussions and view points as it makes > me >>>>>> think about what I need to work on or not bather working on. > >>>>>> Take care all. >>>>>> On Mar 24, 2010, at 9:14 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: > >>>>>>> Interesting. If we're talking straight up blindness, I think we've >> all >>>>>>> experienced a moment or two of feeling out of place in light of the >>>>>>> dominant >>>>>>> sighted crowd. I certainly experience with each meeting I attend >> until >>>>>>> I >>>>>>> shake off the feeling and plunge forward. If we're talking ethnic >>>>>>> minority, >>>>>>> I can't say I've experienced that before, but I don't know if it's >>>>>>> because >>>>>>> the feeling is overshadowed by the blindness factor or because I've >>>>>>> genuinely never witnessed this behavior. > >>>>>>> Regardless, what I find interesting about this discussion is that it >>>>>>> makes >>>>>>> blindness an identity factor. I think the original post asked how we >>> as >>>>>>> blind individuals handled campus involvement, when our philosophy >>> claims >>>>>>> blindness can be reduced to the level of a nuisance. I know this >>>>>>> position >>>>>>> does not claim blindness can be eliminated, but it would appear to >>>>>>> suggest >>>>>>> blindness is irrelevant to one's sense of self. So, rather than ask, >>>>>>> "how >>>>>>> do you, as a blind person, handle X, Y and Z," shouldn't we be asking >>>>>>> how >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> handle the task in general? > >>>>>>> Interesting discussion. > >>>>>>> Joe Orozco > >>>>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >>>>>>> sleeves, >>>>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 8:51 PM >>>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > >>>>>>> Joe, > >>>>>>> The issue of inaccessibility to informal networks is actually > becoming >>>>>>> a key issue for those who study organizational communication and >>>>>>> diversity. Basically, inaccessibility to informal networks is a fancy >>>>>>> way of saying that one is left out or somehow treated differently >> based >>>>>>> on their minority group status. Either as a blind person or a member >> of >>>>>>> a minority group, have you ever had that gut feeling that you just >>>>>>> didn't belong or that your social interactions were influenced by > your >>>>>>> minority status? Perhaps you were the only member of a minority or > one >>>>>>> of few? Maybe it wasn't something that anyone said directly, or maybe >>>>>>> it was. But either way, that gut feeling was still there. >>>>>>> Organizational scholars would say that this kind of thing is >> controlled >>>>>>> by context for sure. If your workplace and general environment are >>>>>>> rather diverse and handle diversity well, you're probably less likely >>>>>>> to have this experience. If not, than you probably will at some point >>>>>>> and to some degree or other. But basically, the bottom line is that >> for >>>>>>> people who experience this problem, they tend to be the only one or >> one >>>>>>> of few representing their minority in an organization that hasn't yet >>>>>>> become aware of its assumptions and ideologies favoring the dominant >>>>>>> population. If you ask me, blindness will definitely cause one to >>>>>>> experience this interesting problem at some point. > >>>>>>> Respectfully, >>>>>>> Jedi > > >>>>>>> Original message: >>>>>>>> Jedi, > >>>>>>>> I'm part of a minority group and have never experienced or >>>>>>> witnessed this >>>>>>>> behavior. What are you basing these conclusions on? Or, >>>>>>> could you give >>>>>>>> examples? If blind people are going to use this as a justification >> to >>>>>>>> explain their social isolation, I'd like the comparison to be >>>>>>> accurate. > >>>>>>>> Joe Orozco > >>>>>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up >>>>>>> their sleeves, >>>>>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi >>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 12:59 AM >>>>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > >>>>>>>> It's not just a blindness thing precisely. It's not uncommon for >>>>>>>> minority groups to have difficulty making friends on the job or in >>>>>>>> school: things are cordial at work, but there's often lack of >>>>>>> access to >>>>>>>> informal social networks which can, in some cases, become a real >>>>>>>> obstacle even during work hours. Causes might include anything from >>>>>>>> just not knowing what to say to a minority group member to feeling a >>>>>>>> large gap between minorities and their non-minority >>>>>>> counterparts. There >>>>>>>> really is no right way to handle this problem because it >>>>>>> affects us all >>>>>>>> so differently. If it concerns you that you're feeling left >>>>>>> out, it may >>>>>>>> be worth addressing to someone who you feel will most likely hear >> you. > >>>>>>>> Respectfully, >>>>>>>> Jedi > > >>>>>>>> Original message: >>>>>>>>> I am currently in high school. I don't do much in terms of >>>>>>>> clubs or other >>>>>>>>> school activities in school. I briefly joined the stage crew >>>>>>>> for a play, but >>>>>>>>> I was kind of in the way. No one talked to me, about anything >>>>>>>> other than >>>>>>>>> professional questions about things of a technical nature. I >>>>>>>> did my job >>>>>>>>> well, but I clearly did not fit in. people were afraid that >>>>>>>> if they talked >>>>>>>>> to me they would offend me or something like that. > >>>>>>>>> Because I don't do many activities in school, I am involved >>>>>>> in the boy >>>>>>>>> scouts, life teen, and the NFB. Even at places such as boy >>>>>>>> scouts and life >>>>>>>>> teen, most of the conversations I have are professional or >>>>>>>> technical in >>>>>>>>> nature. I really don't have many sighted friends. I don't >>>>>>>> know if this is >>>>>>>>> blindness related, or what. > > >>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>>>>>> From: "Jamie Principato" >>>>>>>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 8:11 PM >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] being scholastically social? > > >>>>>>>>>> In middle school, I would jump at the opportunity to get >>>>>>>> involved in as >>>>>>>>>> much >>>>>>>>>> as my parents would allow. I did Student Government, Jazz >>>>>>> Band, and a >>>>>>>>>> Youth >>>>>>>>>> Leadership organization that focused on competitive debate >>>>>>> and public >>>>>>>>>> speaking (think like a junior Toastmasters International). I >>>>>>>> couldn't wait >>>>>>>>>> for high school when I'd have even more interesting groups >>>>>>>> and activities >>>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>> choose from. > >>>>>>>>>> When I got to high school, I encountered a lot >>>>>>>> of...problems...with the >>>>>>>>>> school's Vision department (which is sad since I only went >>>>>>>> to this high >>>>>>>>>> school because we were told it offered the most for >>>>>>> visually impaired >>>>>>>>>> students). I could go on all day with the details here, but >>>>>>>> I'll spare you >>>>>>>>>> that. One of these issues was the fact that blind students >>>>>>>> at this school >>>>>>>>>> tended to be very...disconnected from the rest of the student > body, >>>>>>>>>> avoiding >>>>>>>>>> activities and student events. I learned shortly after >>>>>>>> joining Model UN >>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>> Psychology Club, attending the first Freshman dance, and >>>>>>>> planning to go to >>>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>>> pep rally that the Vision department wasn't happy with the >>>>>>>> fact t I joined >>>>>>>>>> and attended these clubs without telling them first, and >>>>>>>> that if I was >>>>>>>>>> going >>>>>>>>>> to keep attending, they'd need my mother to write up a >>>>>>>> permission note (no >>>>>>>>>> other student needed to do this) and they would have to first find >> a >>>>>>>>>> teacher >>>>>>>>>> to stay late in the day and basically babysit me while I >>>>>>> attend these >>>>>>>>>> activities. Oh, and I wasn't allowed to go to that pep rally >>>>>>>> unless I sat >>>>>>>>>> with my TVI and the other teachers, not in the Freshman >>>>>>>> stands with my >>>>>>>>>> class. My mother and I told them that all of this was >>>>>>>> unnecessary, and we >>>>>>>>>> complained to the principal, but between this and a number of > other >>>>>>>>>> issues, >>>>>>>>>> we just ended up taking matters into our own hands. > >>>>>>>>>> We registered as a home schooling family, and joined a home >>>>>>>> school support >>>>>>>>>> group with about 70 or so other families in the county. I >>>>>>>> took advantage >>>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>>> my new freedom and got involved in a ton of extracurricular >>>>>>>> activities in >>>>>>>>>> my >>>>>>>>>> community, even sports (something that never would have >>>>>>> flown at that >>>>>>>>>> school). Now that I'm in college, I try to get involved on >>>>>>>> campus and in >>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>> city when ever I can. I joined the university's fencing >>>>>>>> club, a volunteer >>>>>>>>>> organization, and I'm currently applying to Psi Chi. I also >>>>>>>> try to get the >>>>>>>>>> most out of campus cultural events like plays or concerts, >>>>>>>> and make use of >>>>>>>>>> campus facilities like the gym. THe only issue I've been >>>>>>>> having is that >>>>>>>>>> transportation in my city. The only bus that comes near by >>>>>>>> house recently >>>>>>>>>> changed its schedule and now stops running early in the >>>>>>>> evening. The only >>>>>>>>>> way to really go out in the evening for any sort of event or >>>>>>>> get home from >>>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>>> club meeting is to take a cab or ride with a friend, but you >>>>>>>> need to get >>>>>>>>>> out >>>>>>>>>> a bit first to make those sighted friends. I find that if >>>>>>>> money is tight >>>>>>>>>> one >>>>>>>>>> month, it's pretty unlikely that I'll be doing much outside >>>>>>>> of attending >>>>>>>>>> class, including attending free activities or events. I >>>>>>>> guess that's just >>>>>>>>>> one price of living off campus though. > >>>>>>>>>> On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Darian Smith >>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>> Hi list, > >>>>>>>>>>> I'm curious to here what people's thoughts are about becoming >>>>>>>>>>> involved in clubs and campus activities in school (high school >> or >>>>>>>>>>> college). do you jump at the oppertunity to meet new >>>>>>> people? do you >>>>>>>>>>> feel nervous about it. have you met some of your best friends at >> a >>>>>>>>>>> ralley, social club, campus society? how did your self- >>>>>>>> identity as >>>>>>>>>>> a blind person factor into your interactions with people? how > did >>>>>>>>>>> people interact with you? >>>>>>>>>>> Thoughts? >>>>>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>>>>> Darian >>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>> Darian Smith >>>>>>>>>>> Skype: The_Blind_Truth >>>>>>>>>>> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com >>>>>>>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind has launched a >>>>>>>> nationwide teacher >>>>>>>>>>> recruitment campaign to help attract energetic and passionate >>>>>>>>>>> individuals into the field of blindness education, and we need >> your >>>>>>>>>>> help! To Get Involved go to: >>>>>>>>>>> www.TeachBlindStudents.org > >>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>>>>> account info for >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: > > >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyr >>>>>>>> dfly%40gmail.com > >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your >>>>>>> account info for >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: > >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kramc11% >>>>>>>> 40gmail.com > > >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>> info for nabs-l: > >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin >>>>>>>> djedi%40samobile.net > >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>>>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>> info for nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco >>>>>>> %40gmail.com > > >>>>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of >>>>>>> virus signature database 4972 (20100324) __________ > >>>>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > >>>>>>> http://www.eset.com > > > >>>>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>>>>>> signature >>>>>>> database 4972 (20100324) __________ > >>>>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > >>>>>>> http://www.eset.com > > > >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>>> nabs-l: > > > >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com > > >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: > > > >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gma >>>> il.com > > > >>>>> -- >>>>> Arielle Silverman >>>>> President, National Association of Blind Students >>>>> Phone: 602-502-2255 >>>>> Email: >>>>> nabs.president at gmail.com >>>>> Website: >>>>> www.nabslink.org > > > >>>> -- >>>> Arielle Silverman >>>> President, National Association of Blind Students >>>> Phone: 602-502-2255 >>>> Email: >>>> nabs.president at gmail.com >>>> Website: >>>> www.nabslink.org > >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: > > >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >>>> il.com > > >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: > > >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >>> bile.net > >>> -- >>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: > >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >>> il.com > > >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: > >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >> bile.net > >> -- >> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >> il.com > > >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo > bile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit > www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma > il.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com From kolbygarrison at triad.rr.com Sat Mar 27 15:20:22 2010 From: kolbygarrison at triad.rr.com (Kolby Garrison) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 11:20:22 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity In-Reply-To: <674E5E11-CC29-45D3-87F5-51A2302E0743@gmail.com> References: <20100326191429.15536.71193@web1> <674E5E11-CC29-45D3-87F5-51A2302E0743@gmail.com> Message-ID: <012301cacdc1$04eacf40$0ec06dc0$@rr.com> Hello Briley and All, Briley, I love your analogy of how we see ourselves and how others see us as being the two sides of a coin. That is one of the best analogies that I have heard for perception in a while. By the way I am thoroughly enjoying this particular discussion, and when I have a spare moment I plan to contribute my thoughts on the matter. Disability identity and blindness identity in particular is a subject that a person in the disability services office on my college campus and I talked about recently, and it is something that has been brought to the forefront of my mind as of late. Kolby From mworkman.lists at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 16:00:04 2010 From: mworkman.lists at gmail.com (Marc Workman) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 10:00:04 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity In-Reply-To: <281B1782-71A9-42DE-B9A0-53C7D663B4A6@gmail.com> Message-ID: For the record, here is exactly what I said about the ability to give birth. Arielle called sex a mere characteristic. As with blindness, if calling it a mere characteristic is supposed to mean that it is as trivial as being 5 foot 6 instead of 5 foot 5, then I don't think it is a mere characteristic. I don't have evidence of this, but I think I would feel differently about my body if I had the ability to grow a human being inside of it. My hunch is that the ability, or lack of ability, to give birth probably affects how one views one's body and thus one's sense of self in a non-trivial way. The confusion here is that how one views one's body can be interpreted in more than one way. The way Jedi, I believe, interpreted it was that it meant how one consciously views one's body. In which case, if you don't consciously view your body in that way, then what I said is clearly false, but what I said does not have to be interpreted as how one consciously views one's body. Instead, what I meant, but didn't make clear enough, is that it might affect the unconscious relationship one has with one's body. I think the pain example illustrates this. I don't have to consciously view my ability to feel pain as a significant part of who I am for this ability to significantly affect the unconscious relationship I have with my body. And this is what I said later in the exact same message. Clarification, I'm not trying to suggest that women are defined by their ability to give birth. I'm only saying that to possess that ability might shape how you think about yourself in a way that is more significant than whether you have short or long hair. Again, how you think about yourself can be interpreted in the two ways mentioned above. Does this really sound shovanistic or even semi-shovanistic? I notice that of all the other examples I mentioned, being 60 pounds lighter, being 7 inches shorter, being able to feel pain, being self-aware, being able to sense infrared, having a photographic memory, possessing the sense of smell of a dog, this one has received all of the attention. I realize that it was a bad example, not because I no longer think it's true, but because women have been thought of for so long as baby producing machines that my even mentioning it, as qualified as my statements were, cannot be done without reminding women of that and bringing up a set of issues that I really had no intention of bringing up. Jedi said, identity is the presentation of how we respond to those teachings in our interactions with ourselves and others. I don't understand what is meant by this sentence, but it seems to be at the heart of the debate. It sounds like question begging to me. You want to argue that identity is socially constructed, but there is no argument. This is just how you define identity. I think Sean's definition makes more sense, Your identity is just an exhaustive list of all of the characteristics and attributes which make a particular person the particular person that they are. This definition leaves the question of where these characteristics come from as an open one. It could be entirely social, or it could be entirely biological, or it could be some combination of the two. Then the argument is to say that it makes a good deal of sense to suppose that certain significant bodily variations will have non-trivial affects on how one perceives and experiences the world, which will influence the person's identity. Regards, Marc -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On Behalf Of Briley Pollard Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 6:56 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity Jedi, I thought you handled the issue of giving birth quite capably. I am not a mother yet, so no, I don't think about my ability to pop out kids as a big part of who I am... or really ponder it as a part of identity at all. Do you men see your ability to participate in making children as a part of your identity? Probably not. So, it is semi chauvinist of you to assume we are attached to our uterus as a part of us that gives us self worth. Briley On Mar 27, 2010, at 3:55 AM, Jedi wrote: > Well, if we want to get down to brass tacks, we can all say that we will never know just how our being is affects our perceptions, but the bottom line still lies at the fact that our perception of our beingness is largely determine by what our culture teaches us about it, and identity is the presentation of how we respond to those teachings in our interactions with ourselves and others. > > I think it's interesting that two men have been interested in whether or not I see myself differently because I can give birth yet no women have weighed in on the subject. I also think they're more interesting in my birthing abilities than I am. Well gentlemen, you're welcome to those abilities so long as you're willing to take the identity that comes with them. *tongue in cheek* > > Respectfully, > Jedi > > > > Original message: >> The point is that without ever having had the experience of being a man, you >> cannot say for sure that your being a woman does or does not have an impact >> on how you see yourself or experience the world. I suspect it does, but >> without any basis for comparison, you can't say. Just as my being blind from >> birth prohibits me from determining whether or not or to what degree my >> blindness affects how I view myself and experience the world. My gut feeling >> is that my blindness has a fairly profound affect on at least a significant >> subset of the things I experience and the way in which I experience them. > >> Blindness is absolutely part of my identity, as is my height, skin color and >> love of the Chicago Cubs. Your identity is just an exhaustive list of all of >> the characteristics and attributes which make a particular person the >> particular person that they are. > >> To what degree I identify myself as blind or identify with the greater >> community of blind people is a completely separate question from that of >> whether or not blindness is part of my identity. > >> I don't think blindness, strictly defined, is a social construct, while I >> think the concept of disability is. I'm sure that to articulate my reasons >> for feeling this way would require more time than I am willing to put into >> it now, but that is my gut feeling. > >> Thought I'd throw my two cents into this interesting discussion. > >> All the best, > >> Sean > > >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo bile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma il.com From jsorozco at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 16:54:06 2010 From: jsorozco at gmail.com (Joe Orozco) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 12:54:06 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity In-Reply-To: <281B1782-71A9-42DE-B9A0-53C7D663B4A6@gmail.com> Message-ID: <446387ADD28B48958A5749BEDC709E2B@Rufus> Hello, Were I Marc, I think I would have drawn out the baby example a little differently, touching on a woman's maternal instinct that stems from her ability to give birth, as opposed to concentrating on the capacity to give birth itself. It's interesting though that the same people who claim child bearing is most definitely not a part of their identity make speculations about what is or is not a part of the identity for a member of an ethnic minority. Assumptions abound, and I think it only goes to show that our identity is not the product of societal expectations. Regardless, if the argument is made that blind people function about as equally as sighted people, is there really a cultural identity? We use different technology, different tools to get around, but these could be nothing more than industrial features just as specialized as certain professional environments like engineering, architecture, medicine, etc. I am well aware of people who use words like "blink" to characterize this so-called culture, but it has always been my opinion that such terms are a deliberate attempt to preserve their own sense of belonging to a group when inclusion in mainstream society does not come by so easily. The fact that people come together for a common social justice cause does not automatically translate to a cultural identity, and if it does, it is no more substantial than the informal cultures that spring up from smokers, bar hoppers, computer gamers and other loose social cultures. Jernigan argued blindness could be reduced to a nuisance. Society would beg to differ; therefore, is our sense of identity truly constructed by the established expectations of society? If so, the world would be a rather grim cycle of recurring expectations. Blind people, or people with disabilities in general, would never have been allowed to make the progress we've witnessed over the past half century. It is at the very root of NFB philosophy that blind people integrate with the mainstream public, that blindness be reduced to nothing more than a characteristic. If this is true, we cannot claim our identity is shaped by the way we cope with societal norms, because blindness has nothing more to do with our daily interactions than does our height or the color of our eyes. In my opinion, what makes the point about blindness identity so convoluted is that people allow the NFB to dictate when the blindness card is and is not played. The organization's philosophy says that with proper training you can do it all. Nevertheless, we need special laws to give people preferred treatment for running vending facilities on federal property. We work for other laws that would increase social security caps so that employment does not wipe out these benefits. I don't know if the philosophy exists in a vacuum completely independent of policy positions, but for people whose life is the NFB, the oscillating values and standards must surely be confusing. Best regards, Joe Orozco "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4978 (20100326) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com From lizmohnke at hotmail.com Sat Mar 27 19:27:26 2010 From: lizmohnke at hotmail.com (Elizabeth) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 15:27:26 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity In-Reply-To: References: <281B1782-71A9-42DE-B9A0-53C7D663B4A6@gmail.com>, Message-ID: Wow, it appears as though the discussion on identity has grown a bit since I last checked the list the other day. As a sociology major, I would have to say that one’s identity is made up not only how someone sees themselves, but also how others see them as well. How others see us is generally reflected in how we see ourselves as well as the world around us. In terms of the blind community having its own culture, I would agree with this statement since the norms of the blind community are not always reflected in the dominate culture. My American Cultures professor defines culture as language and language as culture. Since the blind community appears to have its own language, in that I mean our own unique way of expressing ideas that are generally not expressed in the same way in mainstream society, then I would say that the blind community does in fact have its own culture. Since this culture appears to be in conflict with the dominate culture found in our society, one could also argue that the culture of the blind community could be considered as a counterculture as well. As far as the discussion on being female and the ability to give birth, as a woman, I believe that the ability to give birth does play a role in how women shape their identity. While sex is defined as the characteristics of being male or female that are given to us at birth, gender is defined as the social definitions and expectations that are associated with being male or female. One of the social expectations of being female is the ability to give birth. While women have been given more choices in regards to the ability to make their own decisions about this matter, I believe that it still plays a role in how women see themselves in society as well as how the general population sees the role of women in society. Respectfully, Elizabeth _________________________________________________________________ The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your inbox. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_3 From dandrews at visi.com Sat Mar 27 20:38:40 2010 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 13:38:40 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Texas Hold 'Em Tournament Message-ID: I have been asked to circulate the following: >From: "Charlie Richardson" >To: >Subject: Can you get this message out for me? >Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 09:37:09 -0400 >Content-Type: multipart/alternative; > boundary="----=_NextPart_000_002C_01CACD91.1291AF90" > >For the People, Bringing Our World Together One Voice at a Time, >teams up with All Inplay, Fun and Friendship for All. > >The FTP Benefit Texas Hold 'Em Tournament will be held on June 12, >2010 starting at noon eastern and running for 8 hours. The >tournament will be held on >www.allinplay.com and a $20 donation to >www.for-the-people.com/tournament.htm >will get you 100,000 chips to play with other live players. > >At the end of the tournament the top three players will receive >$200, $100 and $50 respectively. There are 2 3-month and 6 1-month >subscriptions to www.allinplay.com up for >grabs too. These will be awarded to non-cash prize winners and will >be drawn at the post tournament party which will be held on >www.for-the-people.com in the Poker >Pals chat room. > >This isn't all. Sign up early because one of the first 50 to sign >up will be playing free. That's right, one of the first 50 will >have their name drawn at the post tournament party for $20 making >the tournament cost them nothing. > >For more information or to sign up visit >www.for-the-people.com/tournament.htm > > From pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net Sat Mar 27 22:16:27 2010 From: pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net (Peter Donahue) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 17:16:27 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Assistance Please Message-ID: <001d01cacdfb$2670ea20$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> Hello everyone, The only thing standing between your being able to hear the recordings of last year's NABS Meeting in Detroit and not is some information I requested but did not receive. I would appreciate it if someone can send me the following so I can wrap this project up, to permit you to relive the 2009 NABS Meeting complete with that World-famous election, and making plans to record this year's NABS meeting in Dallas: 1. A list of all of the past NABS Presidents that spoke during last year's meeting along with the years they served and 2. A list of the current NABS Board of Directors. I'd like to have these recordings online and available by April 1, 2010. As soon as I receive this information the sooner you can relive the memories of the 2009 NABS Annual Meeting. Your cooperation would be very much appreciated. Peter Donahue "Will you come and awake our lost land from its slumber And her fetters we'll break, links that long are encumbered. And the air will resound with hosannas to greet you On the shore will be found gallant Irishmen to greet you." Will You Come to the Bower Traditional Irish Folk Song From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Sat Mar 27 22:45:51 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 18:45:51 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity Message-ID: <20100327224551.10634.30883@web3> Briley, I'm glad you said something because it took me a while to understand why I replied so snarkily last time. I realized that I felt incensed that two men would insist that I perceive myself differently because I can give birth. To me, it was as bad as if some sighted person got on list and told us all that our lack of eyesight shapes how we see ourselves. Some would say yes, and others would say no. For those who would say no, I think we'd feel pretty frustrated because it would be almost like that sighted person was telling us that because they saw us differently because we're blind, so should we regardless if we do or not. What frustrated me most is that I twice said that, in my experience of not being a mother, I didn't think much about my ability to have children and yet I felt argued with as though someone who saw themselves as having more authority on the topic, a man, had the final authority on how I felt about myself as a woman. It was so frustrating. And you're quite right that men probably don't think about their ability to be part of the procreation process any more or less than we do. Same goes for sighted people. I've heard sighted people say that they don't realize how much they take for granted, and that's quite true. They mean to say that they feel sorry for us, but the fact is that they really have no idea how much privilege they have in society just as many in a given "superior" (in quotes) class don't. Thanks again for your comments. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Jedi, > I thought you handled the issue of giving birth quite capably. I am not > a mother yet, so no, I don't think about my ability to pop out kids as > a big part of who I am... or really ponder it as a part of identity at > all. Do you men see your ability to participate in making children as a > part of your identity? Probably not. So, it is semi chauvinist of you > to assume we are attached to our uterus as a part of us that gives us > self worth. > Briley > On Mar 27, 2010, at 3:55 AM, Jedi wrote: >> Well, if we want to get down to brass tacks, we can all say that we >> will never know just how our being is affects our perceptions, but the >> bottom line still lies at the fact that our perception of our beingness >> is largely determine by what our culture teaches us about it, and >> identity is the presentation of how we respond to those teachings in >> our interactions with ourselves and others. >> I think it's interesting that two men have been interested in whether >> or not I see myself differently because I can give birth yet no women >> have weighed in on the subject. I also think they're more interesting >> in my birthing abilities than I am. Well gentlemen, you're welcome to >> those abilities so long as you're willing to take the identity that >> comes with them. *tongue in cheek* >> Respectfully, >> Jedi >> Original message: >>> The point is that without ever having had the experience of being a man, you >>> cannot say for sure that your being a woman does or does not have an impact >>> on how you see yourself or experience the world. I suspect it does, but >>> without any basis for comparison, you can't say. Just as my being blind from >>> birth prohibits me from determining whether or not or to what degree my >>> blindness affects how I view myself and experience the world. My gut feeling >>> is that my blindness has a fairly profound affect on at least a significant >>> subset of the things I experience and the way in which I experience them. >>> Blindness is absolutely part of my identity, as is my height, skin color and >>> love of the Chicago Cubs. Your identity is just an exhaustive list of all of >>> the characteristics and attributes which make a particular person the >>> particular person that they are. >>> To what degree I identify myself as blind or identify with the greater >>> community of blind people is a completely separate question from that of >>> whether or not blindness is part of my identity. >>> I don't think blindness, strictly defined, is a social construct, while I >>> think the concept of disability is. I'm sure that to articulate my reasons >>> for feeling this way would require more time than I am willing to put into >>> it now, but that is my gut feeling. >>> Thought I'd throw my two cents into this interesting discussion. >>> All the best, >>> Sean >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net >> -- >> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Sat Mar 27 23:07:20 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 19:07:20 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity Message-ID: <20100327230720.1390.48116@web1> Joe, To clarify something. I certainly did not mean to speculate on how people of different ethnicities feel about their identities and whatever those identities are composed of. Instead, I meant to point out that skin color alone probably wouldn't matter so much in our society if we didn't attribute so many non-related traits to it. I think blindness, and gender are more or less the same thing. I'd also like to address the interesting question you posed about blind culture. Is there a blind culture? yes. In fact, I have so far noticed three distinct blindness cultures. I do not think that blindness alone is the root of these cultures. Instead, I think that fundamental assumptions, values, and artifacts make up these cultures. in our specific case, the topic is blindness. Even so, I believe that those of us in the NFB culture are influenced by those assumptions and values in other aspects of our lives. I think the three cultures are the NFB culture, the ACB culture, and the non-affiliated culture. I also add that these cultures are limited to the United States. The world over has even more blind cultures, and many of those cultures have something common with each other. Organizational scholars and anthropologists have been talking about organizational cultures for a while now, but I think that these blind cultures go a little deeper than that because they touch on something more fundamental that one's profession for example. Because the world does by and large have such negative views about blindness, our lives as blind people are fundamentally affected. Perhaps our cultures would become much looser if blindness weren't such a big deal in our society. I can't speak much on any of the blindness cultures in the U.S. except the NFB because (1) I haven't had an opportunity to really observe them and (2) I am a member of the NFB and have been for eight years now. We do have some fundamental beliefs or taken-for-granted assumptions about ourselves as blind people and as people in general, and I think they can be summed up in the statements that it's respectable to be blind and that the problem of blindness is more an attitudinal one than a physical one. Then we have our values. We value personal autonomy in the right to choose our own paths, the importance of a greater collective for mutual gain and benefit, and close-knit familial structure for passing information and getting work done. Our artifacts (the most noticeable portion of a culture) are the long white canes that we favor, the symbol of the Whozit (and the old circle and triangle logo from the 40s). There's a lot more that could be said to describe our culture, but that's a tidbit for you. I don't know about the rest of you, but my life outside of blindness is affected by these assumptions, values, and artifacts. For me, the assumption of blindness respectability translates that it's respectable to be human in all of humanity's forms. The value of collectivity influences the way I relate to people. As for artifacts, it goes without saying that the white cane gets me where I need to go both in and out of blindness contexts. Does this make sense? What I'm getting at is that the NFB isn't a loose organization or social club, and it's much more than just a civil rights movement. It's not necessarily restricted to our blindness alone; if it were, we probably wouldn't have a counterpart organization like the ACB whose values and culture are slightly different than ours even though they are also blind. Joe, you're right that the issue of identity in general is convoluted. There are never easy answers. the best anyone can hope for is to be as consistent as possible with their assumptions and values even if the artifacts change. Human beings in general are an intersection of identities that take primacy in all kinds of combinations for each of us as individuals. By the way, I think the idea of a maternal instinct is really a matter of gendered rhetoric. The maternal instinct is really a matter of a species wanting to procreate and protect/nurture their young. Men have this instinct, too, and individuals of either sex have it to a greater or lesser degree than others. I don't know that I could confidently say that carrying a child for nine months makes much of a difference in this pattern because some women are able to have children, do so, and then decide to give them to someone else for example. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Hello, > Were I Marc, I think I would have drawn out the baby example a little > differently, touching on a woman's maternal instinct that stems from her > ability to give birth, as opposed to concentrating on the capacity to give > birth itself. It's interesting though that the same people who claim child > bearing is most definitely not a part of their identity make speculations > about what is or is not a part of the identity for a member of an ethnic > minority. Assumptions abound, and I think it only goes to show that our > identity is not the product of societal expectations. > Regardless, if the argument is made that blind people function about as > equally as sighted people, is there really a cultural identity? We use > different technology, different tools to get around, but these could be > nothing more than industrial features just as specialized as certain > professional environments like engineering, architecture, medicine, etc. I > am well aware of people who use words like "blink" to characterize this > so-called culture, but it has always been my opinion that such terms are a > deliberate attempt to preserve their own sense of belonging to a group when > inclusion in mainstream society does not come by so easily. The fact that > people come together for a common social justice cause does not > automatically translate to a cultural identity, and if it does, it is no > more substantial than the informal cultures that spring up from smokers, bar > hoppers, computer gamers and other loose social cultures. > Jernigan argued blindness could be reduced to a nuisance. Society would beg > to differ; therefore, is our sense of identity truly constructed by the > established expectations of society? If so, the world would be a rather > grim cycle of recurring expectations. Blind people, or people with > disabilities in general, would never have been allowed to make the progress > we've witnessed over the past half century. It is at the very root of NFB > philosophy that blind people integrate with the mainstream public, that > blindness be reduced to nothing more than a characteristic. If this is > true, we cannot claim our identity is shaped by the way we cope with > societal norms, because blindness has nothing more to do with our daily > interactions than does our height or the color of our eyes. > In my opinion, what makes the point about blindness identity so convoluted > is that people allow the NFB to dictate when the blindness card is and is > not played. The organization's philosophy says that with proper training > you can do it all. Nevertheless, we need special laws to give people > preferred treatment for running vending facilities on federal property. We > work for other laws that would increase social security caps so that > employment does not wipe out these benefits. I don't know if the philosophy > exists in a vacuum completely independent of policy positions, but for > people whose life is the NFB, the oscillating values and standards must > surely be confusing. > Best regards, > Joe Orozco > "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, > some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature > database 4978 (20100326) __________ > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > http://www.eset.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From mworkman.lists at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 23:53:50 2010 From: mworkman.lists at gmail.com (Marc Workman) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 17:53:50 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity In-Reply-To: <20100327224551.10634.30883@web3> Message-ID: This will be the fourth time that I've clarified what I said, but what I said keeps getting distorted, so I'll try one more time. Jedi said, two men would insist that I perceive myself differently because I can give birth. I've read every message on this subject, and I didn't read one man, let alone two, say anything like that. How on earth could anyone know how you perceive yourself? I certainly don't, and I have never said that I did. For the record, I have no idea how Jedi perceives herself. I only know that she says that she doesn't give much thought to her ability to give birth, and I don't question that at all. But that is just not the issue that is being discussed. How you perceive yourself has nothing to do with this. Identity is much more than just how you perceive yourself. Your ability to perceive, how you perceive, what you perceive, these are all already influenced by your identity. So whether or not you think about a particular feature of yourself does not alone determine whether it is or is not a part of your identity. I truly regret bringing up the ability to give birth. There is way too much bagage that comes with a discussion of that topic, and I clearly offended some people, which I had no intention of doing. The fact that I'm a man makes my bringing it up all the more problematic for some. I tried to choose my words carefully, including the clarification that I was in no way suggesting that women are defined by this ability, but even this wasn't enough to avoid the bagage, which is fine, I get that. It was a bad example, but the disappointing thing is that so much energy has been focused on this one example that it has over-shadowed what could have been a deeper discussion of blindness and identity. That is unfortunate and makes me really wish I had never mentioned it. No hard feelings I hope. Marc -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On Behalf Of Jedi Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 4:46 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity Briley, I'm glad you said something because it took me a while to understand why I replied so snarkily last time. I realized that I felt incensed that two men would insist that I perceive myself differently because I can give birth. To me, it was as bad as if some sighted person got on list and told us all that our lack of eyesight shapes how we see ourselves. Some would say yes, and others would say no. For those who would say no, I think we'd feel pretty frustrated because it would be almost like that sighted person was telling us that because they saw us differently because we're blind, so should we regardless if we do or not. What frustrated me most is that I twice said that, in my experience of not being a mother, I didn't think much about my ability to have children and yet I felt argued with as though someone who saw themselves as having more authority on the topic, a man, had the final authority on how I felt about myself as a woman. It was so frustrating. And you're quite right that men probably don't think about their ability to be part of the procreation process any more or less than we do. Same goes for sighted people. I've heard sighted people say that they don't realize how much they take for granted, and that's quite true. They mean to say that they feel sorry for us, but the fact is that they really have no idea how much privilege they have in society just as many in a given "superior" (in quotes) class don't. Thanks again for your comments. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Jedi, > I thought you handled the issue of giving birth quite capably. I am not > a mother yet, so no, I don't think about my ability to pop out kids as > a big part of who I am... or really ponder it as a part of identity at > all. Do you men see your ability to participate in making children as a > part of your identity? Probably not. So, it is semi chauvinist of you > to assume we are attached to our uterus as a part of us that gives us > self worth. > Briley > On Mar 27, 2010, at 3:55 AM, Jedi wrote: >> Well, if we want to get down to brass tacks, we can all say that we >> will never know just how our being is affects our perceptions, but the >> bottom line still lies at the fact that our perception of our beingness >> is largely determine by what our culture teaches us about it, and >> identity is the presentation of how we respond to those teachings in >> our interactions with ourselves and others. >> I think it's interesting that two men have been interested in whether >> or not I see myself differently because I can give birth yet no women >> have weighed in on the subject. I also think they're more interesting >> in my birthing abilities than I am. Well gentlemen, you're welcome to >> those abilities so long as you're willing to take the identity that >> comes with them. *tongue in cheek* >> Respectfully, >> Jedi >> Original message: >>> The point is that without ever having had the experience of being a man, you >>> cannot say for sure that your being a woman does or does not have an impact >>> on how you see yourself or experience the world. I suspect it does, but >>> without any basis for comparison, you can't say. Just as my being blind from >>> birth prohibits me from determining whether or not or to what degree my >>> blindness affects how I view myself and experience the world. My gut feeling >>> is that my blindness has a fairly profound affect on at least a significant >>> subset of the things I experience and the way in which I experience them. >>> Blindness is absolutely part of my identity, as is my height, skin color and >>> love of the Chicago Cubs. Your identity is just an exhaustive list of all of >>> the characteristics and attributes which make a particular person the >>> particular person that they are. >>> To what degree I identify myself as blind or identify with the greater >>> community of blind people is a completely separate question from that of >>> whether or not blindness is part of my identity. >>> I don't think blindness, strictly defined, is a social construct, while I >>> think the concept of disability is. I'm sure that to articulate my reasons >>> for feeling this way would require more time than I am willing to put into >>> it now, but that is my gut feeling. >>> Thought I'd throw my two cents into this interesting discussion. >>> All the best, >>> Sean >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo bile.net >> -- >> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo bile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma il.com From liamskitten at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 23:57:37 2010 From: liamskitten at gmail.com (Courtney Stover) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 18:57:37 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Assistance Please In-Reply-To: <001d01cacdfb$2670ea20$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> References: <001d01cacdfb$2670ea20$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> Message-ID: <7949e5e21003271657l453aecf0u67a9d24a308de548@mail.gmail.com> Peter, I can't help you much with your first question. However, you can find a full list of the current Nabs board here: http://www.nabslink.org/about/board.shtml If the link doesn't work, I'll be more than happy to copy/paste the info in a separate message. Thanks so much for all the work you do. Courtney On 3/27/10, Peter Donahue wrote: > Hello everyone, > > The only thing standing between your being able to hear the recordings > of last year's NABS Meeting in Detroit and not is some information I > requested but did not receive. I would appreciate it if someone can send me > the following so I can wrap this project up, to permit you to relive the > 2009 NABS Meeting complete with that World-famous election, and making plans > to record this year's NABS meeting in Dallas: > > 1. A list of all of the past NABS Presidents that spoke during last year's > meeting along with the years they served and > 2. A list of the current NABS Board of Directors. > > I'd like to have these recordings online and available by April 1, 2010. > As soon as I receive this information the sooner you can relive the memories > of the 2009 NABS Annual Meeting. Your cooperation would be very much > appreciated. > > Peter Donahue > "Will you come and awake our lost land from its slumber > And her fetters we'll break, links that long are encumbered. > And the air will resound with hosannas to greet you > On the shore will be found gallant Irishmen to greet you." > Will You Come to the Bower > Traditional Irish Folk Song > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/liamskitten%40gmail.com > From kerrik2006 at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 00:17:04 2010 From: kerrik2006 at gmail.com (Kerri Kosten) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 20:17:04 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Assistance Please In-Reply-To: <001d01cacdfb$2670ea20$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> References: <001d01cacdfb$2670ea20$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> Message-ID: Hi Peter: I am pretty sure you can find the current board of directors on the nabs website at www.nabslink.org. I wasn't at last year's convention so don't know the answer to your other question sorry! Hope someone else can answer your question as I would really like to hear last year's nabs meeting since I wasn't there and it wasn't streamed on the nfb website like general session was. Thanks, and hope this helps. Kerri On 3/27/10, Peter Donahue wrote: > Hello everyone, > > The only thing standing between your being able to hear the recordings > of last year's NABS Meeting in Detroit and not is some information I > requested but did not receive. I would appreciate it if someone can send me > the following so I can wrap this project up, to permit you to relive the > 2009 NABS Meeting complete with that World-famous election, and making plans > to record this year's NABS meeting in Dallas: > > 1. A list of all of the past NABS Presidents that spoke during last year's > meeting along with the years they served and > 2. A list of the current NABS Board of Directors. > > I'd like to have these recordings online and available by April 1, 2010. > As soon as I receive this information the sooner you can relive the memories > of the 2009 NABS Annual Meeting. Your cooperation would be very much > appreciated. > > Peter Donahue > "Will you come and awake our lost land from its slumber > And her fetters we'll break, links that long are encumbered. > And the air will resound with hosannas to greet you > On the shore will be found gallant Irishmen to greet you." > Will You Come to the Bower > Traditional Irish Folk Song > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kerrik2006%40gmail.com > From nabs.president at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 00:18:08 2010 From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 19:18:08 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity In-Reply-To: References: <20100327224551.10634.30883@web3> Message-ID: <85ff10071003271718k3d38461ci1879321397fbff1e@mail.gmail.com> Hi all, With all due respect to the discussions thus far regarding the components of identity and culture, I'd like to steer the conversation a little closer to what we originally started with when we were talking about belonging, or lack thereof, in the sighted world, joining student clubs, etc. I am curious--Is there such a thing as "over-identifying" with blindness or spending too much time with blind people? Does spending time with blind people necessarily take away from how much time and energy you can put into relationships with the sighted? Or, is it possible to simultaneously feel a strong connection with other blind people and still engage in productive connections with sighted people at work, and have healthy social connections with sighted people as well? I tend to take the latter view, and am a little saddened when people make comments to the effect that we should spend less time with other blind people in order to achieve our goal of integration, as if the two objectives are mutually exclusive. Sometimes I think people (blind and sighted alike) have the implicit assumption that relationships with sighted people are somehow superior to relationships we have with the blind, and that it's to our advantage to, for example, avoid spending all our time at NFB meetings, or try not to work in the blindness field on principle, or to only date sighted people. Of course, people differ in the extremity of these views. But I do think it's entirely possible and healthy to juggle a strong "blind identity" with the other identities and connections we have in the world, without taking away from either one. I'm interested to hear your views about this, but I'd like to close with a concrete example. When I was in high school and college, most of my close friends were blind. I often felt, as many of you have described, that I could only sustain casual relationships with sighted people, but that I could only feel the deep, reciprocal connections I had with other blind people. When I started graduate school, after receiving blindness training at LCB and being a member and leader in NABS for five years, I finally began to perceive that my fellow students, who were all sighted, didn't care much about my blindness and were for the most part able to treat me like anyone else. I have been dating a sighted guy for the past year, which is something I never thought would happen, and with him I feel the same kind of reciprocal intimacy that I thought I could only have with other blind people. My point in disclosing all that is that I honestly don't think I would have reached this level of confidence and belonging in my sighted community if I hadn't had the strong, affirming relationships that I had for so many years with my blind friends. Around other blind people I felt normal and capable, and was able to become a reciprocating partner and a leader. I had to be able to do those things and practice them over time before I could go into the uncertainty of a new sighted community with the right social skills and confidence to integrate and build new connections, including finding my boyfriend. It's just something to think about. Arielle On 3/27/10, Marc Workman wrote: > This will be the fourth time that I've clarified what I said, but what I > said keeps getting distorted, so I'll try one more time. > > Jedi said, > two men would insist that I perceive myself differently because I can give > birth. > > I've read every message on this subject, and I didn't read one man, let > alone two, say anything like that. > > How on earth could anyone know how you perceive yourself? I certainly don't, > and I have never said that I did. For the record, I have no idea how Jedi > perceives herself. I only know that she says that she doesn't give much > thought to her ability to give birth, and I don't question that at all. But > that is just not the issue that is being discussed. How you perceive > yourself has nothing to do with this. Identity is much more than just how > you perceive yourself. Your ability to perceive, how you perceive, what you > perceive, these are all already influenced by your identity. So whether or > not you think about a particular feature of yourself does not alone > determine whether it is or is not a part of your identity. > > I truly regret bringing up the ability to give birth. There is way too much > bagage that comes with a discussion of that topic, and I clearly offended > some people, which I had no intention of doing. The fact that I'm a man > makes my bringing it up all the more problematic for some. I tried to > choose my words carefully, including the clarification that I was in no way > suggesting that women are defined by this ability, but even this wasn't > enough to avoid the bagage, which is fine, I get that. It was a bad > example, but the disappointing thing is that so much energy has been focused > on this one example that it has over-shadowed what could have been a deeper > discussion of blindness and identity. That is unfortunate and makes me > really wish I had never mentioned it. > > No hard feelings I hope. > > Marc > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On > Behalf Of Jedi > Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 4:46 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity > > > Briley, > > I'm glad you said something because it took me a while to understand > why I replied so snarkily last time. I realized that I felt incensed > that two men would insist that I perceive myself differently because I > can give birth. To me, it was as bad as if some sighted person got on > list and told us all that our lack of eyesight shapes how we see > ourselves. Some would say yes, and others would say no. For those who > would say no, I think we'd feel pretty frustrated because it would be > almost like that sighted person was telling us that because they saw us > differently because we're blind, so should we regardless if we do or > not. What frustrated me most is that I twice said that, in my > experience of not being a mother, I didn't think much about my ability > to have children and yet I felt argued with as though someone who saw > themselves as having more authority on the topic, a man, had the final > authority on how I felt about myself as a woman. It was so frustrating. > And you're quite right that men probably don't think about their > ability to be part of the procreation process any more or less than we > do. Same goes for sighted people. I've heard sighted people say that > they don't realize how much they take for granted, and that's quite > true. They mean to say that they feel sorry for us, but the fact is > that they really have no idea how much privilege they have in society > just as many in a given "superior" (in quotes) class don't. Thanks > again for your comments. > > Respectfully, > Jedi > > > Original message: >> Jedi, > >> I thought you handled the issue of giving birth quite capably. I am not >> a mother yet, so no, I don't think about my ability to pop out kids as >> a big part of who I am... or really ponder it as a part of identity at >> all. Do you men see your ability to participate in making children as a >> part of your identity? Probably not. So, it is semi chauvinist of you >> to assume we are attached to our uterus as a part of us that gives us >> self worth. > >> Briley > > > >> On Mar 27, 2010, at 3:55 AM, Jedi wrote: > >>> Well, if we want to get down to brass tacks, we can all say that we >>> will never know just how our being is affects our perceptions, but the >>> bottom line still lies at the fact that our perception of our beingness >>> is largely determine by what our culture teaches us about it, and >>> identity is the presentation of how we respond to those teachings in >>> our interactions with ourselves and others. > >>> I think it's interesting that two men have been interested in whether >>> or not I see myself differently because I can give birth yet no women >>> have weighed in on the subject. I also think they're more interesting >>> in my birthing abilities than I am. Well gentlemen, you're welcome to >>> those abilities so long as you're willing to take the identity that >>> comes with them. *tongue in cheek* > >>> Respectfully, >>> Jedi > > > >>> Original message: >>>> The point is that without ever having had the experience of being a man, > you >>>> cannot say for sure that your being a woman does or does not have an > impact >>>> on how you see yourself or experience the world. I suspect it does, but >>>> without any basis for comparison, you can't say. Just as my being blind > from >>>> birth prohibits me from determining whether or not or to what degree my >>>> blindness affects how I view myself and experience the world. My gut > feeling >>>> is that my blindness has a fairly profound affect on at least a > significant >>>> subset of the things I experience and the way in which I experience > them. > >>>> Blindness is absolutely part of my identity, as is my height, skin color > and >>>> love of the Chicago Cubs. Your identity is just an exhaustive list of > all of >>>> the characteristics and attributes which make a particular person the >>>> particular person that they are. > >>>> To what degree I identify myself as blind or identify with the greater >>>> community of blind people is a completely separate question from that of >>>> whether or not blindness is part of my identity. > >>>> I don't think blindness, strictly defined, is a social construct, while > I >>>> think the concept of disability is. I'm sure that to articulate my > reasons >>>> for feeling this way would require more time than I am willing to put > into >>>> it now, but that is my gut feeling. > >>>> Thought I'd throw my two cents into this interesting discussion. > >>>> All the best, > >>>> Sean > > >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >>>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo > bile.net > >>> -- >>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com > > >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo > bile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit > www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma > il.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com > -- Arielle Silverman President, National Association of Blind Students Phone: 602-502-2255 Email: nabs.president at gmail.com Website: www.nabslink.org From pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net Sun Mar 28 00:25:04 2010 From: pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net (Peter Donahue) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 19:25:04 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Assistance Please References: <001d01cacdfb$2670ea20$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> <7949e5e21003271657l453aecf0u67a9d24a308de548@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <000e01cace0d$1dbb20a0$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> Hello Courtney and everyone, That list is out-of-date. I checked it earlier. There is also a problem with the page itself. Someone needs to update the information and fix the page. Thanks anyway. Peter Donahue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Courtney Stover" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 6:57 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Assistance Please Peter, I can't help you much with your first question. However, you can find a full list of the current Nabs board here: http://www.nabslink.org/about/board.shtml If the link doesn't work, I'll be more than happy to copy/paste the info in a separate message. Thanks so much for all the work you do. Courtney On 3/27/10, Peter Donahue wrote: > Hello everyone, > > The only thing standing between your being able to hear the recordings > of last year's NABS Meeting in Detroit and not is some information I > requested but did not receive. I would appreciate it if someone can send > me > the following so I can wrap this project up, to permit you to relive the > 2009 NABS Meeting complete with that World-famous election, and making > plans > to record this year's NABS meeting in Dallas: > > 1. A list of all of the past NABS Presidents that spoke during last year's > meeting along with the years they served and > 2. A list of the current NABS Board of Directors. > > I'd like to have these recordings online and available by April 1, > 2010. > As soon as I receive this information the sooner you can relive the > memories > of the 2009 NABS Annual Meeting. Your cooperation would be very much > appreciated. > > Peter Donahue > "Will you come and awake our lost land from its slumber > And her fetters we'll break, links that long are encumbered. > And the air will resound with hosannas to greet you > On the shore will be found gallant Irishmen to greet you." > Will You Come to the Bower > Traditional Irish Folk Song > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/liamskitten%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pdonahue1%40sbcglobal.net From nabs.president at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 00:26:51 2010 From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 19:26:51 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Assistance Please In-Reply-To: References: <001d01cacdfb$2670ea20$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> Message-ID: <85ff10071003271726id0413c3qcd78a20c1eaab496@mail.gmail.com> Hi Peter and all, Peter, here is the information you requested: (and also for those of you who were curious) The following presidents spoke at the 2009 convention: James Gashel: pres 1967-1971 Marc Maurer: pres 1971-1977 Scott Labarre: pres 1991-1993 Shawn Mayo: pres 1997-2001 Angela Wolf: pres 2001-2005 Ryan Strunk: pres 2005-2007 Tai Blas: pres 2007-2008 The board of directors are listed online, but I will reprint it again: President: Arielle Silverman First Vice-President: Karen Anderson Second Vice-President: Sean Whalen Secretary: Janice Jeang Treasurer: Nijat Worley Board Members: Isaiah Wilcox, Meghan Whalen, Domonique Lawless, and Darian Smith Thanks Peter for your assistance in recording last year's NABS meeting! Arielle On 3/27/10, Kerri Kosten wrote: > Hi Peter: > > I am pretty sure you can find the current board of directors on the > nabs website at www.nabslink.org. > > I wasn't at last year's convention so don't know the answer to your > other question sorry! > > Hope someone else can answer your question as I would really like to > hear last year's nabs meeting since I wasn't there and it wasn't > streamed on the nfb website like general session was. > > Thanks, and hope this helps. > > Kerri > > On 3/27/10, Peter Donahue wrote: >> Hello everyone, >> >> The only thing standing between your being able to hear the recordings >> of last year's NABS Meeting in Detroit and not is some information I >> requested but did not receive. I would appreciate it if someone can send >> me >> the following so I can wrap this project up, to permit you to relive the >> 2009 NABS Meeting complete with that World-famous election, and making >> plans >> to record this year's NABS meeting in Dallas: >> >> 1. A list of all of the past NABS Presidents that spoke during last year's >> meeting along with the years they served and >> 2. A list of the current NABS Board of Directors. >> >> I'd like to have these recordings online and available by April 1, >> 2010. >> As soon as I receive this information the sooner you can relive the >> memories >> of the 2009 NABS Annual Meeting. Your cooperation would be very much >> appreciated. >> >> Peter Donahue >> "Will you come and awake our lost land from its slumber >> And her fetters we'll break, links that long are encumbered. >> And the air will resound with hosannas to greet you >> On the shore will be found gallant Irishmen to greet you." >> Will You Come to the Bower >> Traditional Irish Folk Song >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kerrik2006%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com > -- Arielle Silverman President, National Association of Blind Students Phone: 602-502-2255 Email: nabs.president at gmail.com Website: www.nabslink.org From jsorozco at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 00:34:22 2010 From: jsorozco at gmail.com (Joe Orozco) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 20:34:22 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity In-Reply-To: <20100327230720.1390.48116@web1> Message-ID: <4309ABB502BF4B90A4BACFC6C4F54124@Rufus> Jedi, Thanks for the thought-provoking response. I don't know that I agree with all your points, but I also agree that another post would only make the issue circular. One of these days we'll have to round up Marc and the others to have one of these debates in person. Maybe Antonio will share his pitcher of Sprite. Joe Orozco "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 7:07 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity Joe, To clarify something. I certainly did not mean to speculate on how people of different ethnicities feel about their identities and whatever those identities are composed of. Instead, I meant to point out that skin color alone probably wouldn't matter so much in our society if we didn't attribute so many non-related traits to it. I think blindness, and gender are more or less the same thing. I'd also like to address the interesting question you posed about blind culture. Is there a blind culture? yes. In fact, I have so far noticed three distinct blindness cultures. I do not think that blindness alone is the root of these cultures. Instead, I think that fundamental assumptions, values, and artifacts make up these cultures. in our specific case, the topic is blindness. Even so, I believe that those of us in the NFB culture are influenced by those assumptions and values in other aspects of our lives. I think the three cultures are the NFB culture, the ACB culture, and the non-affiliated culture. I also add that these cultures are limited to the United States. The world over has even more blind cultures, and many of those cultures have something common with each other. Organizational scholars and anthropologists have been talking about organizational cultures for a while now, but I think that these blind cultures go a little deeper than that because they touch on something more fundamental that one's profession for example. Because the world does by and large have such negative views about blindness, our lives as blind people are fundamentally affected. Perhaps our cultures would become much looser if blindness weren't such a big deal in our society. I can't speak much on any of the blindness cultures in the U.S. except the NFB because (1) I haven't had an opportunity to really observe them and (2) I am a member of the NFB and have been for eight years now. We do have some fundamental beliefs or taken-for-granted assumptions about ourselves as blind people and as people in general, and I think they can be summed up in the statements that it's respectable to be blind and that the problem of blindness is more an attitudinal one than a physical one. Then we have our values. We value personal autonomy in the right to choose our own paths, the importance of a greater collective for mutual gain and benefit, and close-knit familial structure for passing information and getting work done. Our artifacts (the most noticeable portion of a culture) are the long white canes that we favor, the symbol of the Whozit (and the old circle and triangle logo from the 40s). There's a lot more that could be said to describe our culture, but that's a tidbit for you. I don't know about the rest of you, but my life outside of blindness is affected by these assumptions, values, and artifacts. For me, the assumption of blindness respectability translates that it's respectable to be human in all of humanity's forms. The value of collectivity influences the way I relate to people. As for artifacts, it goes without saying that the white cane gets me where I need to go both in and out of blindness contexts. Does this make sense? What I'm getting at is that the NFB isn't a loose organization or social club, and it's much more than just a civil rights movement. It's not necessarily restricted to our blindness alone; if it were, we probably wouldn't have a counterpart organization like the ACB whose values and culture are slightly different than ours even though they are also blind. Joe, you're right that the issue of identity in general is convoluted. There are never easy answers. the best anyone can hope for is to be as consistent as possible with their assumptions and values even if the artifacts change. Human beings in general are an intersection of identities that take primacy in all kinds of combinations for each of us as individuals. By the way, I think the idea of a maternal instinct is really a matter of gendered rhetoric. The maternal instinct is really a matter of a species wanting to procreate and protect/nurture their young. Men have this instinct, too, and individuals of either sex have it to a greater or lesser degree than others. I don't know that I could confidently say that carrying a child for nine months makes much of a difference in this pattern because some women are able to have children, do so, and then decide to give them to someone else for example. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Hello, > Were I Marc, I think I would have drawn out the baby example a little > differently, touching on a woman's maternal instinct that stems from her > ability to give birth, as opposed to concentrating on the capacity to give > birth itself. It's interesting though that the same people who claim child > bearing is most definitely not a part of their identity make speculations > about what is or is not a part of the identity for a member of an ethnic > minority. Assumptions abound, and I think it only goes to show that our > identity is not the product of societal expectations. > Regardless, if the argument is made that blind people function about as > equally as sighted people, is there really a cultural identity? We use > different technology, different tools to get around, but these could be > nothing more than industrial features just as specialized as certain > professional environments like engineering, architecture, medicine, etc. I > am well aware of people who use words like "blink" to characterize this > so-called culture, but it has always been my opinion that such terms are a > deliberate attempt to preserve their own sense of belonging to a group when > inclusion in mainstream society does not come by so easily. The fact that > people come together for a common social justice cause does not > automatically translate to a cultural identity, and if it does, it is no > more substantial than the informal cultures that spring up from smokers, bar > hoppers, computer gamers and other loose social cultures. > Jernigan argued blindness could be reduced to a nuisance. Society would beg > to differ; therefore, is our sense of identity truly constructed by the > established expectations of society? If so, the world would be a rather > grim cycle of recurring expectations. Blind people, or people with > disabilities in general, would never have been allowed to make the progress > we've witnessed over the past half century. It is at the very root of NFB > philosophy that blind people integrate with the mainstream public, that > blindness be reduced to nothing more than a characteristic. If this is > true, we cannot claim our identity is shaped by the way we cope with > societal norms, because blindness has nothing more to do with our daily > interactions than does our height or the color of our eyes. > In my opinion, what makes the point about blindness identity so convoluted > is that people allow the NFB to dictate when the blindness card is and is > not played. The organization's philosophy says that with proper training > you can do it all. Nevertheless, we need special laws to give people > preferred treatment for running vending facilities on federal property. We > work for other laws that would increase social security caps so that > employment does not wipe out these benefits. I don't know if the philosophy > exists in a vacuum completely independent of policy positions, but for > people whose life is the NFB, the oscillating values and standards must > surely be confusing. > Best regards, > Joe Orozco > "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, > some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature > database 4978 (20100326) __________ > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > http://www.eset.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblin djedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsorozco %40gmail.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4978 (20100326) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4978 (20100326) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Sun Mar 28 01:08:47 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 21:08:47 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity Message-ID: <20100328010847.13310.17732@web3> Arielle, Any guesses as to why there seems to be an attitutde that mixed relationships are better than all blind relationships? I was wondering if it has to do with this idea that since the blind inherently have lesser social skills, then it would not be a good idea for a blind person to mingle with other blind people if they wanted to learn better social skills. I agree that that's not true at all, but I was just wondering if this couldn't be one explanation for the attitude you describe. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Hi all, > With all due respect to the discussions thus far regarding the > components of identity and culture, I'd like to steer the conversation > a little closer to what we originally started with when we were > talking about belonging, or lack thereof, in the sighted world, > joining student clubs, etc. I am curious--Is there such a thing as > "over-identifying" with blindness or spending too much time with blind > people? Does spending time with blind people necessarily take away > from how much time and energy you can put into relationships with the > sighted? Or, is it possible to simultaneously feel a strong connection > with other blind people and still engage in productive connections > with sighted people at work, and have healthy social connections with > sighted people as well? > I tend to take the latter view, and am a little saddened when people > make comments to the effect that we should spend less time with other > blind people in order to achieve our goal of integration, as if the > two objectives are mutually exclusive. Sometimes I think people (blind > and sighted alike) have the implicit assumption that relationships > with sighted people are somehow superior to relationships we have with > the blind, and that it's to our advantage to, for example, avoid > spending all our time at NFB meetings, or try not to work in the > blindness field on principle, or to only date sighted people. Of > course, people differ in the extremity of these views. But I do think > it's entirely possible and healthy to juggle a strong "blind identity" > with the other identities and connections we have in the world, > without taking away from either one. > I'm interested to hear your views about this, but I'd like to close > with a concrete example. When I was in high school and college, most > of my close friends were blind. I often felt, as many of you have > described, that I could only sustain casual relationships with sighted > people, but that I could only feel the deep, reciprocal connections I > had with other blind people. When I started graduate school, after > receiving blindness training at LCB and being a member and leader in > NABS for five years, I finally began to perceive that my fellow > students, who were all sighted, didn't care much about my blindness > and were for the most part able to treat me like anyone else. I have > been dating a sighted guy for the past year, which is something I > never thought would happen, and with him I feel the same kind of > reciprocal intimacy that I thought I could only have with other blind > people. My point in disclosing all that is that I honestly don't think > I would have reached this level of confidence and belonging in my > sighted community if I hadn't had the strong, affirming relationships > that I had for so many years with my blind friends. Around other blind > people I felt normal and capable, and was able to become a > reciprocating partner and a leader. I had to be able to do those > things and practice them over time before I could go into the > uncertainty of a new sighted community with the right social skills > and confidence to integrate and build new connections, including > finding my boyfriend. It's just something to think about. > Arielle > On 3/27/10, Marc Workman wrote: >> This will be the fourth time that I've clarified what I said, but what I >> said keeps getting distorted, so I'll try one more time. >> Jedi said, >> two men would insist that I perceive myself differently because I can give >> birth. >> I've read every message on this subject, and I didn't read one man, let >> alone two, say anything like that. >> How on earth could anyone know how you perceive yourself? I certainly don't, >> and I have never said that I did. For the record, I have no idea how Jedi >> perceives herself. I only know that she says that she doesn't give much >> thought to her ability to give birth, and I don't question that at all. But >> that is just not the issue that is being discussed. How you perceive >> yourself has nothing to do with this. Identity is much more than just how >> you perceive yourself. Your ability to perceive, how you perceive, what you >> perceive, these are all already influenced by your identity. So whether or >> not you think about a particular feature of yourself does not alone >> determine whether it is or is not a part of your identity. >> I truly regret bringing up the ability to give birth. There is way too much >> bagage that comes with a discussion of that topic, and I clearly offended >> some people, which I had no intention of doing. The fact that I'm a man >> makes my bringing it up all the more problematic for some. I tried to >> choose my words carefully, including the clarification that I was in no way >> suggesting that women are defined by this ability, but even this wasn't >> enough to avoid the bagage, which is fine, I get that. It was a bad >> example, but the disappointing thing is that so much energy has been focused >> on this one example that it has over-shadowed what could have been a deeper >> discussion of blindness and identity. That is unfortunate and makes me >> really wish I had never mentioned it. >> No hard feelings I hope. >> Marc >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >> Behalf Of Jedi >> Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 4:46 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity >> Briley, >> I'm glad you said something because it took me a while to understand >> why I replied so snarkily last time. I realized that I felt incensed >> that two men would insist that I perceive myself differently because I >> can give birth. To me, it was as bad as if some sighted person got on >> list and told us all that our lack of eyesight shapes how we see >> ourselves. Some would say yes, and others would say no. For those who >> would say no, I think we'd feel pretty frustrated because it would be >> almost like that sighted person was telling us that because they saw us >> differently because we're blind, so should we regardless if we do or >> not. What frustrated me most is that I twice said that, in my >> experience of not being a mother, I didn't think much about my ability >> to have children and yet I felt argued with as though someone who saw >> themselves as having more authority on the topic, a man, had the final >> authority on how I felt about myself as a woman. It was so frustrating. >> And you're quite right that men probably don't think about their >> ability to be part of the procreation process any more or less than we >> do. Same goes for sighted people. I've heard sighted people say that >> they don't realize how much they take for granted, and that's quite >> true. They mean to say that they feel sorry for us, but the fact is >> that they really have no idea how much privilege they have in society >> just as many in a given "superior" (in quotes) class don't. Thanks >> again for your comments. >> Respectfully, >> Jedi >> Original message: >>> Jedi, >>> I thought you handled the issue of giving birth quite capably. I am not >>> a mother yet, so no, I don't think about my ability to pop out kids as >>> a big part of who I am... or really ponder it as a part of identity at >>> all. Do you men see your ability to participate in making children as a >>> part of your identity? Probably not. So, it is semi chauvinist of you >>> to assume we are attached to our uterus as a part of us that gives us >>> self worth. >>> Briley >>> On Mar 27, 2010, at 3:55 AM, Jedi wrote: >>>> Well, if we want to get down to brass tacks, we can all say that we >>>> will never know just how our being is affects our perceptions, but the >>>> bottom line still lies at the fact that our perception of our beingness >>>> is largely determine by what our culture teaches us about it, and >>>> identity is the presentation of how we respond to those teachings in >>>> our interactions with ourselves and others. >>>> I think it's interesting that two men have been interested in whether >>>> or not I see myself differently because I can give birth yet no women >>>> have weighed in on the subject. I also think they're more interesting >>>> in my birthing abilities than I am. Well gentlemen, you're welcome to >>>> those abilities so long as you're willing to take the identity that >>>> comes with them. *tongue in cheek* >>>> Respectfully, >>>> Jedi >>>> Original message: >>>>> The point is that without ever having had the experience of being a man, >> you >>>>> cannot say for sure that your being a woman does or does not have an >> impact >>>>> on how you see yourself or experience the world. I suspect it does, but >>>>> without any basis for comparison, you can't say. Just as my being blind >> from >>>>> birth prohibits me from determining whether or not or to what degree my >>>>> blindness affects how I view myself and experience the world. My gut >> feeling >>>>> is that my blindness has a fairly profound affect on at least a >> significant >>>>> subset of the things I experience and the way in which I experience >> them. >>>>> Blindness is absolutely part of my identity, as is my height, skin color >> and >>>>> love of the Chicago Cubs. Your identity is just an exhaustive list of >> all of >>>>> the characteristics and attributes which make a particular person the >>>>> particular person that they are. >>>>> To what degree I identify myself as blind or identify with the greater >>>>> community of blind people is a completely separate question from that of >>>>> whether or not blindness is part of my identity. >>>>> I don't think blindness, strictly defined, is a social construct, while >> I >>>>> think the concept of disability is. I'm sure that to articulate my >> reasons >>>>> for feeling this way would require more time than I am willing to put >> into >>>>> it now, but that is my gut feeling. >>>>> Thought I'd throw my two cents into this interesting discussion. >>>>> All the best, >>>>> Sean >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >> bile.net >>>> -- >>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >> bile.net >> -- >> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >> il.com >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com > -- > Arielle Silverman > President, National Association of Blind Students > Phone: 602-502-2255 > Email: > nabs.president at gmail.com > Website: > www.nabslink.org > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From mikaelastevens at cableone.net Sun Mar 28 01:47:37 2010 From: mikaelastevens at cableone.net (Mikaela Stevens) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 19:47:37 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Assistance Please In-Reply-To: <000e01cace0d$1dbb20a0$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> References: <001d01cacdfb$2670ea20$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn><7949e5e21003271657l453aecf0u67a9d24a308de548@mail.gmail.com> <000e01cace0d$1dbb20a0$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> Message-ID: <516C45EE0A604CD4BDEC6C401D8444BC@MikealaPC> Peter, Here is the information Arielle sent earlier today: The following presidents spoke at the 2009 convention: James Gashel: pres 1967-1971 Marc Maurer: pres 1971-1977 Scott Labarre: pres 1991-1993 Shawn Mayo: pres 1997-2001 Angela Wolf: pres 2001-2005 Ryan Strunk: pres 2005-2007 Tai Blas: pres 2007-2008 The board of directors are listed online, but I will reprint it again: President: Arielle Silverman First Vice-President: Karen Anderson Second Vice-President: Sean Whalen Secretary: Janice Jeang Treasurer: Nijat Worley Board Members: Isaiah Wilcox, Meghan Whalen, Domonique Lawless, and Darian Smith Respectfully, Mikaela ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter Donahue" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 6:25 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Assistance Please > Hello Courtney and everyone, > > That list is out-of-date. I checked it earlier. There is also a problem > with the page itself. Someone needs to update the information and fix the > page. Thanks anyway. > > Peter Donahue > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Courtney Stover" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 6:57 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Assistance Please > > > Peter, > > I can't help you much with your first question. However, you can find > a full list of the current Nabs board here: > http://www.nabslink.org/about/board.shtml > If the link doesn't work, I'll be more than happy to copy/paste the > info in a separate message. Thanks so much for all the work you do. > Courtney > > On 3/27/10, Peter Donahue wrote: >> Hello everyone, >> >> The only thing standing between your being able to hear the >> recordings >> of last year's NABS Meeting in Detroit and not is some information I >> requested but did not receive. I would appreciate it if someone can send >> me >> the following so I can wrap this project up, to permit you to relive the >> 2009 NABS Meeting complete with that World-famous election, and making >> plans >> to record this year's NABS meeting in Dallas: >> >> 1. A list of all of the past NABS Presidents that spoke during last >> year's >> meeting along with the years they served and >> 2. A list of the current NABS Board of Directors. >> >> I'd like to have these recordings online and available by April 1, >> 2010. >> As soon as I receive this information the sooner you can relive the >> memories >> of the 2009 NABS Annual Meeting. Your cooperation would be very much >> appreciated. >> >> Peter Donahue >> "Will you come and awake our lost land from its slumber >> And her fetters we'll break, links that long are encumbered. >> And the air will resound with hosannas to greet you >> On the shore will be found gallant Irishmen to greet you." >> Will You Come to the Bower >> Traditional Irish Folk Song >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/liamskitten%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pdonahue1%40sbcglobal.net > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mikaelastevens%40cableone.net From pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net Sun Mar 28 02:05:13 2010 From: pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net (Peter Donahue) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 21:05:13 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Assistance Please References: <001d01cacdfb$2670ea20$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> Message-ID: <000f01cace1b$1bf12db0$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> Hello, I was all ready there earlier today. The page is out-dated and has problems. I'm one of the developers of the new NABS Web Site. I'm not pleased that the site is not being managed as well as it should. Had I been able to retrieve this information from there this thread never would have started. I contacted Ariel prior to posting this request and have not received a response from her. The files are all ready on server. I just need the information I requested so I can create the access page. I want this monkey out of my hair by April 1, and would appreciate some cooperation. Peter Donahue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kerri Kosten" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 7:17 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Assistance Please Hi Peter: I am pretty sure you can find the current board of directors on the nabs website at www.nabslink.org. I wasn't at last year's convention so don't know the answer to your other question sorry! Hope someone else can answer your question as I would really like to hear last year's nabs meeting since I wasn't there and it wasn't streamed on the nfb website like general session was. Thanks, and hope this helps. Kerri On 3/27/10, Peter Donahue wrote: > Hello everyone, > > The only thing standing between your being able to hear the recordings > of last year's NABS Meeting in Detroit and not is some information I > requested but did not receive. I would appreciate it if someone can send > me > the following so I can wrap this project up, to permit you to relive the > 2009 NABS Meeting complete with that World-famous election, and making > plans > to record this year's NABS meeting in Dallas: > > 1. A list of all of the past NABS Presidents that spoke during last year's > meeting along with the years they served and > 2. A list of the current NABS Board of Directors. > > I'd like to have these recordings online and available by April 1, > 2010. > As soon as I receive this information the sooner you can relive the > memories > of the 2009 NABS Annual Meeting. Your cooperation would be very much > appreciated. > > Peter Donahue > "Will you come and awake our lost land from its slumber > And her fetters we'll break, links that long are encumbered. > And the air will resound with hosannas to greet you > On the shore will be found gallant Irishmen to greet you." > Will You Come to the Bower > Traditional Irish Folk Song > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kerrik2006%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pdonahue1%40sbcglobal.net From tealbloodworth at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 02:11:51 2010 From: tealbloodworth at gmail.com (autTeal Bloodwortho) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 21:11:51 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity References: <281B1782-71A9-42DE-B9A0-53C7D663B4A6@gmail.com>, Message-ID: very well said elizabeth -Teal ----- Original Message ----- From: "Elizabeth" To: Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 2:27 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity Wow, it appears as though the discussion on identity has grown a bit since I last checked the list the other day. As a sociology major, I would have to say that one’s identity is made up not only how someone sees themselves, but also how others see them as well. How others see us is generally reflected in how we see ourselves as well as the world around us. In terms of the blind community having its own culture, I would agree with this statement since the norms of the blind community are not always reflected in the dominate culture. My American Cultures professor defines culture as language and language as culture. Since the blind community appears to have its own language, in that I mean our own unique way of expressing ideas that are generally not expressed in the same way in mainstream society, then I would say that the blind community does in fact have its own culture. Since this culture appears to be in conflict with the dominate culture found in our society, one could also argue that the culture of the blind community could be considered as a counterculture as well. As far as the discussion on being female and the ability to give birth, as a woman, I believe that the ability to give birth does play a role in how women shape their identity. While sex is defined as the characteristics of being male or female that are given to us at birth, gender is defined as the social definitions and expectations that are associated with being male or female. One of the social expectations of being female is the ability to give birth. While women have been given more choices in regards to the ability to make their own decisions about this matter, I believe that it still plays a role in how women see themselves in society as well as how the general population sees the role of women in society. Respectfully, Elizabeth _________________________________________________________________ The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your inbox. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_3 _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/tealbloodworth%40gmail.com From jsorozco at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 02:26:20 2010 From: jsorozco at gmail.com (Joe Orozco) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 22:26:20 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane Message-ID: <0D32DDCAFC414DD889E321F12E812322@Rufus> Hello all, Finding myself low on my stash of collapsible canes, I called the National Center and discovered they no longer carried those fiber glass types with the chains. I don't actually like the chains. In fact, I promptly take them off and lose them, and I much prefer these to the dorky ones with the elastic bands, no offense if you happen to sport these. Besides, I am now a dork, because since that's all they had, that's all I got. So, my question: Would it really not be acceptable to paint my cane a different color? I think the little elastic band is mortifying, and short of replacing the cap with something cooler, I thought about painting my cane black or blue or some sweeter combination than the dull white, and I guess the point is not so much whether this is acceptable. I'll paint my cane all the colors of the rainbow if it so moves me, but legally, could someone actually claim they did not know I was blind in the case of an accident if my cane were not white? Laugh all you want, but I'm thinking of starting a revolution of multicolored canes. You'll be jealous when I have a cane to match my outfits! It'th called getting in touch with my feminine thide. *grin* Thanks for any serious responses. If we've never met, look for the smooth operator with the brand-new black magic stick. Best, Joe Orozco "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4978 (20100326) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com From pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net Sun Mar 28 02:40:29 2010 From: pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net (Peter Donahue) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 21:40:29 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Recordings Page Construction Begun Message-ID: <005201cace20$082bbd40$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> Hello everyone, This was not my favorite way to obtain needed information but I wish to public thank Arielle Silverman for coming through. I have all ready dumped the information on to the recordings access page and will start making it up. It could be online as early as Monday but will definitely be up by April First. Again thanks. Peter Donahue "Will you come and awake our lost land from its slumber And her fetters we'll break, links that long are encumbered. And the air will resound with hosannas to greet you On the shore will be found gallant Irishmen to greet you." Will You Come to the Bower Traditional Irish Folk Song From brileyp at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 03:09:42 2010 From: brileyp at gmail.com (Briley Pollard) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 22:09:42 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity In-Reply-To: <85ff10071003271718k3d38461ci1879321397fbff1e@mail.gmail.com> References: <20100327224551.10634.30883@web3> <85ff10071003271718k3d38461ci1879321397fbff1e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I don't think anyone said that anyone should spend less time with other blind people. I think the point was made by a few individuals that sometimes, blind people associate exclusively with other blind people on a personal level, and this is what can be unhealthy. I think balance is always important in anything. No one should have blind or sighted friends simply based on the fact of whether they can see or not. But having only friends that belong to one subset of people can be limiting in some ways. Briley On Mar 27, 2010, at 7:18 PM, Arielle Silverman wrote: > Hi all, > > With all due respect to the discussions thus far regarding the > components of identity and culture, I'd like to steer the conversation > a little closer to what we originally started with when we were > talking about belonging, or lack thereof, in the sighted world, > joining student clubs, etc. I am curious--Is there such a thing as > "over-identifying" with blindness or spending too much time with blind > people? Does spending time with blind people necessarily take away > from how much time and energy you can put into relationships with the > sighted? Or, is it possible to simultaneously feel a strong connection > with other blind people and still engage in productive connections > with sighted people at work, and have healthy social connections with > sighted people as well? > > I tend to take the latter view, and am a little saddened when people > make comments to the effect that we should spend less time with other > blind people in order to achieve our goal of integration, as if the > two objectives are mutually exclusive. Sometimes I think people (blind > and sighted alike) have the implicit assumption that relationships > with sighted people are somehow superior to relationships we have with > the blind, and that it's to our advantage to, for example, avoid > spending all our time at NFB meetings, or try not to work in the > blindness field on principle, or to only date sighted people. Of > course, people differ in the extremity of these views. But I do think > it's entirely possible and healthy to juggle a strong "blind identity" > with the other identities and connections we have in the world, > without taking away from either one. > > I'm interested to hear your views about this, but I'd like to close > with a concrete example. When I was in high school and college, most > of my close friends were blind. I often felt, as many of you have > described, that I could only sustain casual relationships with sighted > people, but that I could only feel the deep, reciprocal connections I > had with other blind people. When I started graduate school, after > receiving blindness training at LCB and being a member and leader in > NABS for five years, I finally began to perceive that my fellow > students, who were all sighted, didn't care much about my blindness > and were for the most part able to treat me like anyone else. I have > been dating a sighted guy for the past year, which is something I > never thought would happen, and with him I feel the same kind of > reciprocal intimacy that I thought I could only have with other blind > people. My point in disclosing all that is that I honestly don't think > I would have reached this level of confidence and belonging in my > sighted community if I hadn't had the strong, affirming relationships > that I had for so many years with my blind friends. Around other blind > people I felt normal and capable, and was able to become a > reciprocating partner and a leader. I had to be able to do those > things and practice them over time before I could go into the > uncertainty of a new sighted community with the right social skills > and confidence to integrate and build new connections, including > finding my boyfriend. It's just something to think about. > > Arielle > > On 3/27/10, Marc Workman wrote: >> This will be the fourth time that I've clarified what I said, but what I >> said keeps getting distorted, so I'll try one more time. >> >> Jedi said, >> two men would insist that I perceive myself differently because I can give >> birth. >> >> I've read every message on this subject, and I didn't read one man, let >> alone two, say anything like that. >> >> How on earth could anyone know how you perceive yourself? I certainly don't, >> and I have never said that I did. For the record, I have no idea how Jedi >> perceives herself. I only know that she says that she doesn't give much >> thought to her ability to give birth, and I don't question that at all. But >> that is just not the issue that is being discussed. How you perceive >> yourself has nothing to do with this. Identity is much more than just how >> you perceive yourself. Your ability to perceive, how you perceive, what you >> perceive, these are all already influenced by your identity. So whether or >> not you think about a particular feature of yourself does not alone >> determine whether it is or is not a part of your identity. >> >> I truly regret bringing up the ability to give birth. There is way too much >> bagage that comes with a discussion of that topic, and I clearly offended >> some people, which I had no intention of doing. The fact that I'm a man >> makes my bringing it up all the more problematic for some. I tried to >> choose my words carefully, including the clarification that I was in no way >> suggesting that women are defined by this ability, but even this wasn't >> enough to avoid the bagage, which is fine, I get that. It was a bad >> example, but the disappointing thing is that so much energy has been focused >> on this one example that it has over-shadowed what could have been a deeper >> discussion of blindness and identity. That is unfortunate and makes me >> really wish I had never mentioned it. >> >> No hard feelings I hope. >> >> Marc >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >> Behalf Of Jedi >> Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 4:46 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity >> >> >> Briley, >> >> I'm glad you said something because it took me a while to understand >> why I replied so snarkily last time. I realized that I felt incensed >> that two men would insist that I perceive myself differently because I >> can give birth. To me, it was as bad as if some sighted person got on >> list and told us all that our lack of eyesight shapes how we see >> ourselves. Some would say yes, and others would say no. For those who >> would say no, I think we'd feel pretty frustrated because it would be >> almost like that sighted person was telling us that because they saw us >> differently because we're blind, so should we regardless if we do or >> not. What frustrated me most is that I twice said that, in my >> experience of not being a mother, I didn't think much about my ability >> to have children and yet I felt argued with as though someone who saw >> themselves as having more authority on the topic, a man, had the final >> authority on how I felt about myself as a woman. It was so frustrating. >> And you're quite right that men probably don't think about their >> ability to be part of the procreation process any more or less than we >> do. Same goes for sighted people. I've heard sighted people say that >> they don't realize how much they take for granted, and that's quite >> true. They mean to say that they feel sorry for us, but the fact is >> that they really have no idea how much privilege they have in society >> just as many in a given "superior" (in quotes) class don't. Thanks >> again for your comments. >> >> Respectfully, >> Jedi >> >> >> Original message: >>> Jedi, >> >>> I thought you handled the issue of giving birth quite capably. I am not >>> a mother yet, so no, I don't think about my ability to pop out kids as >>> a big part of who I am... or really ponder it as a part of identity at >>> all. Do you men see your ability to participate in making children as a >>> part of your identity? Probably not. So, it is semi chauvinist of you >>> to assume we are attached to our uterus as a part of us that gives us >>> self worth. >> >>> Briley >> >> >> >>> On Mar 27, 2010, at 3:55 AM, Jedi wrote: >> >>>> Well, if we want to get down to brass tacks, we can all say that we >>>> will never know just how our being is affects our perceptions, but the >>>> bottom line still lies at the fact that our perception of our beingness >>>> is largely determine by what our culture teaches us about it, and >>>> identity is the presentation of how we respond to those teachings in >>>> our interactions with ourselves and others. >> >>>> I think it's interesting that two men have been interested in whether >>>> or not I see myself differently because I can give birth yet no women >>>> have weighed in on the subject. I also think they're more interesting >>>> in my birthing abilities than I am. Well gentlemen, you're welcome to >>>> those abilities so long as you're willing to take the identity that >>>> comes with them. *tongue in cheek* >> >>>> Respectfully, >>>> Jedi >> >> >> >>>> Original message: >>>>> The point is that without ever having had the experience of being a man, >> you >>>>> cannot say for sure that your being a woman does or does not have an >> impact >>>>> on how you see yourself or experience the world. I suspect it does, but >>>>> without any basis for comparison, you can't say. Just as my being blind >> from >>>>> birth prohibits me from determining whether or not or to what degree my >>>>> blindness affects how I view myself and experience the world. My gut >> feeling >>>>> is that my blindness has a fairly profound affect on at least a >> significant >>>>> subset of the things I experience and the way in which I experience >> them. >> >>>>> Blindness is absolutely part of my identity, as is my height, skin color >> and >>>>> love of the Chicago Cubs. Your identity is just an exhaustive list of >> all of >>>>> the characteristics and attributes which make a particular person the >>>>> particular person that they are. >> >>>>> To what degree I identify myself as blind or identify with the greater >>>>> community of blind people is a completely separate question from that of >>>>> whether or not blindness is part of my identity. >> >>>>> I don't think blindness, strictly defined, is a social construct, while >> I >>>>> think the concept of disability is. I'm sure that to articulate my >> reasons >>>>> for feeling this way would require more time than I am willing to put >> into >>>>> it now, but that is my gut feeling. >> >>>>> Thought I'd throw my two cents into this interesting discussion. >> >>>>> All the best, >> >>>>> Sean >> >> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>>>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >> bile.net >> >>>> -- >>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com >> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >> bile.net >> >> -- >> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >> il.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Arielle Silverman > President, National Association of Blind Students > Phone: 602-502-2255 > Email: > nabs.president at gmail.com > Website: > www.nabslink.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com From blackbyrdfly at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 03:23:03 2010 From: blackbyrdfly at gmail.com (Jamie Principato) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 23:23:03 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane In-Reply-To: <0D32DDCAFC414DD889E321F12E812322@Rufus> References: <0D32DDCAFC414DD889E321F12E812322@Rufus> Message-ID: I'm really not sure of the legality of this. I can't imagine it's too strict. I know the wording tends to say "white cane", but then there are canes with colored handles and/or tips. I got into decorating my cane once I was comfortable using one, but for safety reasons, I never alter the cane's primary color. I keep the bulk of it white since I know this will be ost easily seen by drivers, and I focus mainly on the handle and/or tip. I've made beaded loops to go at the end of the handle instead of that elastic thing, or sometimes I'd braid a loop with colored embroidery thread, and I've made covers for the handle out of fabrics, ribbons, beads, colored paper, or what ever suited me. Once on Valentine's day, I put a pink loop on the handle, wrapped red ribbon around it, and stuck a plastic heart at the end of the cane just a few inches above the tip. I figured that this was fitting for the occasion, but it was still pretty obvious by the main color of the cane and the way I was holding/using it that I was blind. On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 10:26 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: > Hello all, > > Finding myself low on my stash of collapsible canes, I called the National > Center and discovered they no longer carried those fiber glass types with > the chains. I don't actually like the chains. In fact, I promptly take > them off and lose them, and I much prefer these to the dorky ones with the > elastic bands, no offense if you happen to sport these. Besides, I am now > a > dork, because since that's all they had, that's all I got. > > So, my question: Would it really not be acceptable to paint my cane a > different color? I think the little elastic band is mortifying, and short > of replacing the cap with something cooler, I thought about painting my > cane > black or blue or some sweeter combination than the dull white, and I guess > the point is not so much whether this is acceptable. I'll paint my cane > all > the colors of the rainbow if it so moves me, but legally, could someone > actually claim they did not know I was blind in the case of an accident if > my cane were not white? > > Laugh all you want, but I'm thinking of starting a revolution of > multicolored canes. You'll be jealous when I have a cane to match my > outfits! It'th called getting in touch with my feminine thide. *grin* > > Thanks for any serious responses. If we've never met, look for the smooth > operator with the brand-new black magic stick. > > Best, > > Joe Orozco > > "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, > some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature > database 4978 (20100326) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com > From pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net Sun Mar 28 04:35:09 2010 From: pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net (Peter Donahue) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 23:35:09 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Checking States Message-ID: <003301cace30$0d12ac00$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> Hello again everyone, I can safely say that the 2009 NABS Meeting Recordings Access Page is half-way done. There is still lots of work to do before it goes on the site. I've taken the list of officers and board members and added the state where they live or attend school. I'll list them below. Please tell me if any of them are incorrect so I can fix them on the page to be sure they're right. Here goes: President: Arielle Silverman, Colorado First Vice-President: Karen Anderson, Nebraska Second Vice-President: Sean Whalen, Wisconsin Secretary: Janice Jeang, Illinois Treasurer: Nijat Worley, Washington D.C. Board Members: Isaiah Wilcox, Washington State Meghan Whalen, Wisconsin Domonique Lawless, Tennessee Darian Smith, California Your assistance with this will be greatly appreciated. Peter Donahue From cherylandmaxx at hotmail.com Sun Mar 28 04:44:44 2010 From: cherylandmaxx at hotmail.com (cheryl echevarria) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 21:44:44 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Help with Travel to National Convention Message-ID: Hello my name is Cheryl Echevarria and I am Treasurer of the Greater Long Island Chapter of the National Federation of the Blind here in New York State. I own a travel agency and I know that the National Convention is coming up in July the Dates of the Convention are July 3-8, 2010. If you have not made your travel arrangements please give me a call and I would be glad to assist you in anyway possible. Thank you. Your sister in the NFB Cheryl Echevarria Independent Travel Consultant http://Echevarriatravel.com 1-866-580-5574 http://blog.echevarriatravel.com Reservations at echevarriatravel.com Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Montrose Travel CST-1018299-10 From graduate56 at juno.com Sun Mar 28 03:10:30 2010 From: graduate56 at juno.com (Melissa Green) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 21:10:30 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity References: <20100327224551.10634.30883@web3> <85ff10071003271718k3d38461ci1879321397fbff1e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <923BDD3D2DC4478E881C566B9FB61BA2@melissa> Arielle. Thanks for sharing your experiences. I agree with you. I take the same aproach that you took. In my opinion some people can go to an extreme. Basing their identity on just asociating with sighted people. This allows them to not really deal witheir blindness. I am sure there are those who base their Identity on asociating with blind people. However, I think that the aforementioned extreme. Have a blessed day. Warmly, Melissa Green "At the center of your being you have the answer; you know who you are and you know what you want." Blog: http://readergirl5674.blogspot.com Facebook: melissa green northern colorado twitter: melissa5674 msn: graduate1531 at msn.com Linked in http://www.linkedin.com/in/melissagreen5674 Skype: lissa5674 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Arielle Silverman" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 6:18 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity > Hi all, > > With all due respect to the discussions thus far regarding the > components of identity and culture, I'd like to steer the conversation > a little closer to what we originally started with when we were > talking about belonging, or lack thereof, in the sighted world, > joining student clubs, etc. I am curious--Is there such a thing as > "over-identifying" with blindness or spending too much time with blind > people? Does spending time with blind people necessarily take away > from how much time and energy you can put into relationships with the > sighted? Or, is it possible to simultaneously feel a strong connection > with other blind people and still engage in productive connections > with sighted people at work, and have healthy social connections with > sighted people as well? > > I tend to take the latter view, and am a little saddened when people > make comments to the effect that we should spend less time with other > blind people in order to achieve our goal of integration, as if the > two objectives are mutually exclusive. Sometimes I think people (blind > and sighted alike) have the implicit assumption that relationships > with sighted people are somehow superior to relationships we have with > the blind, and that it's to our advantage to, for example, avoid > spending all our time at NFB meetings, or try not to work in the > blindness field on principle, or to only date sighted people. Of > course, people differ in the extremity of these views. But I do think > it's entirely possible and healthy to juggle a strong "blind identity" > with the other identities and connections we have in the world, > without taking away from either one. > > I'm interested to hear your views about this, but I'd like to close > with a concrete example. When I was in high school and college, most > of my close friends were blind. I often felt, as many of you have > described, that I could only sustain casual relationships with sighted > people, but that I could only feel the deep, reciprocal connections I > had with other blind people. When I started graduate school, after > receiving blindness training at LCB and being a member and leader in > NABS for five years, I finally began to perceive that my fellow > students, who were all sighted, didn't care much about my blindness > and were for the most part able to treat me like anyone else. I have > been dating a sighted guy for the past year, which is something I > never thought would happen, and with him I feel the same kind of > reciprocal intimacy that I thought I could only have with other blind > people. My point in disclosing all that is that I honestly don't think > I would have reached this level of confidence and belonging in my > sighted community if I hadn't had the strong, affirming relationships > that I had for so many years with my blind friends. Around other blind > people I felt normal and capable, and was able to become a > reciprocating partner and a leader. I had to be able to do those > things and practice them over time before I could go into the > uncertainty of a new sighted community with the right social skills > and confidence to integrate and build new connections, including > finding my boyfriend. It's just something to think about. > > Arielle > > On 3/27/10, Marc Workman wrote: >> This will be the fourth time that I've clarified what I said, but what I >> said keeps getting distorted, so I'll try one more time. >> >> Jedi said, >> two men would insist that I perceive myself differently because I can >> give >> birth. >> >> I've read every message on this subject, and I didn't read one man, let >> alone two, say anything like that. >> >> How on earth could anyone know how you perceive yourself? I certainly >> don't, >> and I have never said that I did. For the record, I have no idea how >> Jedi >> perceives herself. I only know that she says that she doesn't give much >> thought to her ability to give birth, and I don't question that at all. >> But >> that is just not the issue that is being discussed. How you perceive >> yourself has nothing to do with this. Identity is much more than just >> how >> you perceive yourself. Your ability to perceive, how you perceive, what >> you >> perceive, these are all already influenced by your identity. So whether >> or >> not you think about a particular feature of yourself does not alone >> determine whether it is or is not a part of your identity. >> >> I truly regret bringing up the ability to give birth. There is way too >> much >> bagage that comes with a discussion of that topic, and I clearly offended >> some people, which I had no intention of doing. The fact that I'm a man >> makes my bringing it up all the more problematic for some. I tried to >> choose my words carefully, including the clarification that I was in no >> way >> suggesting that women are defined by this ability, but even this wasn't >> enough to avoid the bagage, which is fine, I get that. It was a bad >> example, but the disappointing thing is that so much energy has been >> focused >> on this one example that it has over-shadowed what could have been a >> deeper >> discussion of blindness and identity. That is unfortunate and makes me >> really wish I had never mentioned it. >> >> No hard feelings I hope. >> >> Marc >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >> Behalf Of Jedi >> Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 4:46 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity >> >> >> Briley, >> >> I'm glad you said something because it took me a while to understand >> why I replied so snarkily last time. I realized that I felt incensed >> that two men would insist that I perceive myself differently because I >> can give birth. To me, it was as bad as if some sighted person got on >> list and told us all that our lack of eyesight shapes how we see >> ourselves. Some would say yes, and others would say no. For those who >> would say no, I think we'd feel pretty frustrated because it would be >> almost like that sighted person was telling us that because they saw us >> differently because we're blind, so should we regardless if we do or >> not. What frustrated me most is that I twice said that, in my >> experience of not being a mother, I didn't think much about my ability >> to have children and yet I felt argued with as though someone who saw >> themselves as having more authority on the topic, a man, had the final >> authority on how I felt about myself as a woman. It was so frustrating. >> And you're quite right that men probably don't think about their >> ability to be part of the procreation process any more or less than we >> do. Same goes for sighted people. I've heard sighted people say that >> they don't realize how much they take for granted, and that's quite >> true. They mean to say that they feel sorry for us, but the fact is >> that they really have no idea how much privilege they have in society >> just as many in a given "superior" (in quotes) class don't. Thanks >> again for your comments. >> >> Respectfully, >> Jedi >> >> >> Original message: >>> Jedi, >> >>> I thought you handled the issue of giving birth quite capably. I am not >>> a mother yet, so no, I don't think about my ability to pop out kids as >>> a big part of who I am... or really ponder it as a part of identity at >>> all. Do you men see your ability to participate in making children as a >>> part of your identity? Probably not. So, it is semi chauvinist of you >>> to assume we are attached to our uterus as a part of us that gives us >>> self worth. >> >>> Briley >> >> >> >>> On Mar 27, 2010, at 3:55 AM, Jedi wrote: >> >>>> Well, if we want to get down to brass tacks, we can all say that we >>>> will never know just how our being is affects our perceptions, but the >>>> bottom line still lies at the fact that our perception of our beingness >>>> is largely determine by what our culture teaches us about it, and >>>> identity is the presentation of how we respond to those teachings in >>>> our interactions with ourselves and others. >> >>>> I think it's interesting that two men have been interested in whether >>>> or not I see myself differently because I can give birth yet no women >>>> have weighed in on the subject. I also think they're more interesting >>>> in my birthing abilities than I am. Well gentlemen, you're welcome to >>>> those abilities so long as you're willing to take the identity that >>>> comes with them. *tongue in cheek* >> >>>> Respectfully, >>>> Jedi >> >> >> >>>> Original message: >>>>> The point is that without ever having had the experience of being a >>>>> man, >> you >>>>> cannot say for sure that your being a woman does or does not have an >> impact >>>>> on how you see yourself or experience the world. I suspect it does, >>>>> but >>>>> without any basis for comparison, you can't say. Just as my being >>>>> blind >> from >>>>> birth prohibits me from determining whether or not or to what degree >>>>> my >>>>> blindness affects how I view myself and experience the world. My gut >> feeling >>>>> is that my blindness has a fairly profound affect on at least a >> significant >>>>> subset of the things I experience and the way in which I experience >> them. >> >>>>> Blindness is absolutely part of my identity, as is my height, skin >>>>> color >> and >>>>> love of the Chicago Cubs. Your identity is just an exhaustive list of >> all of >>>>> the characteristics and attributes which make a particular person the >>>>> particular person that they are. >> >>>>> To what degree I identify myself as blind or identify with the greater >>>>> community of blind people is a completely separate question from that >>>>> of >>>>> whether or not blindness is part of my identity. >> >>>>> I don't think blindness, strictly defined, is a social construct, >>>>> while >> I >>>>> think the concept of disability is. I'm sure that to articulate my >> reasons >>>>> for feeling this way would require more time than I am willing to put >> into >>>>> it now, but that is my gut feeling. >> >>>>> Thought I'd throw my two cents into this interesting discussion. >> >>>>> All the best, >> >>>>> Sean >> >> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>>>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >> bile.net >> >>>> -- >>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com >> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >> bile.net >> >> -- >> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >> il.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Arielle Silverman > President, National Association of Blind Students > Phone: 602-502-2255 > Email: > nabs.president at gmail.com > Website: > www.nabslink.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/graduate56%40juno.com > ____________________________________________________________ Weight Loss Program Best Weight Loss Program - Click Here! http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/c?cp=mo_P0RNmzkBD1EdvdPNSBQAAJ1BvHzEFemsEEZ0HiReBRkMJAAYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAEUgAAAAA= From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Sun Mar 28 05:15:00 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 01:15:00 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane Message-ID: <20100328051500.32396.93138@web2> Joe, I don't know if you're aware of this or not, but your comment quoted as "It'th called getting in touch with my feminine thide. " could be taken as offensive as it is highly reminessent of the lisp associated with the gay stereotype. I would advise you don't use it here. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Hello all, > Finding myself low on my stash of collapsible canes, I called the National > Center and discovered they no longer carried those fiber glass types with > the chains. I don't actually like the chains. In fact, I promptly take > them off and lose them, and I much prefer these to the dorky ones with the > elastic bands, no offense if you happen to sport these. Besides, I am now a > dork, because since that's all they had, that's all I got. > So, my question: Would it really not be acceptable to paint my cane a > different color? I think the little elastic band is mortifying, and short > of replacing the cap with something cooler, I thought about painting my cane > black or blue or some sweeter combination than the dull white, and I guess > the point is not so much whether this is acceptable. I'll paint my cane all > the colors of the rainbow if it so moves me, but legally, could someone > actually claim they did not know I was blind in the case of an accident if > my cane were not white? > Laugh all you want, but I'm thinking of starting a revolution of > multicolored canes. You'll be jealous when I have a cane to match my > outfits! It'th called getting in touch with my feminine thide. *grin* > Thanks for any serious responses. If we've never met, look for the smooth > operator with the brand-new black magic stick. > Best, > Joe Orozco > "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, > some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature > database 4978 (20100326) __________ > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > http://www.eset.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Sun Mar 28 05:19:59 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 01:19:59 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane Message-ID: <20100328051959.32178.97665@web2> Joe and all: I can't imagine that it would make a big difference what color the cane is. Originally, canes for the blind weren't white; it was the Lions Club who figured it was a good idea to make canes white so that drivers could see blind people better and know to stop for them. The brightness of the cane was especially important then because we didn't have the cane travel skills that we do now. In all reality, the need for the cane to be white may be outdated. I'd say do whatever you like with your cane. I know one lady who had one of those ribbed Iowa canes, and she wrapped blue wire tightly in the ridges such that her cane was blue from top to tip. I also heard tale of a company in New York somewhere that makes black canes. So have at it Joe and we'll see your sporting new fashion at the next big gig! Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > I'm really not sure of the legality of this. I can't imagine it's too > strict. I know the wording tends to say "white cane", but then there are > canes with colored handles and/or tips. > I got into decorating my cane once I was comfortable using one, but for > safety reasons, I never alter the cane's primary color. I keep the bulk of > it white since I know this will be ost easily seen by drivers, and I focus > mainly on the handle and/or tip. I've made beaded loops to go at the end of > the handle instead of that elastic thing, or sometimes I'd braid a loop with > colored embroidery thread, and I've made covers for the handle out of > fabrics, ribbons, beads, colored paper, or what ever suited me. Once on > Valentine's day, I put a pink loop on the handle, wrapped red ribbon around > it, and stuck a plastic heart at the end of the cane just a few inches above > the tip. I figured that this was fitting for the occasion, but it was still > pretty obvious by the main color of the cane and the way I was holding/using > it that I was blind. > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 10:26 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: >> Hello all, >> Finding myself low on my stash of collapsible canes, I called the National >> Center and discovered they no longer carried those fiber glass types with >> the chains. I don't actually like the chains. In fact, I promptly take >> them off and lose them, and I much prefer these to the dorky ones with the >> elastic bands, no offense if you happen to sport these. Besides, I am now >> a >> dork, because since that's all they had, that's all I got. >> So, my question: Would it really not be acceptable to paint my cane a >> different color? I think the little elastic band is mortifying, and short >> of replacing the cap with something cooler, I thought about painting my >> cane >> black or blue or some sweeter combination than the dull white, and I guess >> the point is not so much whether this is acceptable. I'll paint my cane >> all >> the colors of the rainbow if it so moves me, but legally, could someone >> actually claim they did not know I was blind in the case of an accident if >> my cane were not white? >> Laugh all you want, but I'm thinking of starting a revolution of >> multicolored canes. You'll be jealous when I have a cane to match my >> outfits! It'th called getting in touch with my feminine thide. *grin* >> Thanks for any serious responses. If we've never met, look for the smooth >> operator with the brand-new black magic stick. >> Best, >> Joe Orozco >> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, >> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >> signature >> database 4978 (20100326) __________ >> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >> http://www.eset.com >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From corbbo at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 05:27:33 2010 From: corbbo at gmail.com (Corbb O'Connor) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 01:27:33 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity In-Reply-To: <20100328010847.13310.17732@web3> References: <20100328010847.13310.17732@web3> Message-ID: <528A8FC9-25A3-435B-8735-D035E0E9BEB3@gmail.com> I really hope there's a better term than "mixed" for a blind-sighted relationship, but at this hour I can't come up with one and will use it for the purposes of brevity! I used to think that I couldn't see myself marrying another blind person. I used to think about all the practical implications: well what if I want to travel in a remote place for a vacation, and the only way to get around is via car? Or how will I raise kids if I can't watch them in order to give them independence? And the list goes on. That's all in past tense for a reason. Thanks to what all of you in the NFB have taught me over the last many years, I now see blindness or vision as a non-issue for relationships. There are far more important characteristics to think about. On the parenting issue, Melissa & Mark Riccobono's teleconference clarified many issues for me and erased many of the misconceptions I held about my own abilities. I've also seen lots of blind-blind relationships (and marriages!) and how effective they can be...just as effective as sighted-sighted or "mixed" relationships...and that's changed my opinion. So, Jedi, I believe that a predisposition by a blind person to think that he/she wants to marry a sighted person can be a misconception about the abilities of the blind. I don't think it has anything to do with social skills -- for me, it was about the practical implications of living in a sighted world as a blind person. -Corbb On Mar 27, 2010, at 9:08 PM, Jedi wrote: Arielle, Any guesses as to why there seems to be an attitutde that mixed relationships are better than all blind relationships? I was wondering if it has to do with this idea that since the blind inherently have lesser social skills, then it would not be a good idea for a blind person to mingle with other blind people if they wanted to learn better social skills. I agree that that's not true at all, but I was just wondering if this couldn't be one explanation for the attitude you describe. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Hi all, > With all due respect to the discussions thus far regarding the > components of identity and culture, I'd like to steer the conversation > a little closer to what we originally started with when we were > talking about belonging, or lack thereof, in the sighted world, > joining student clubs, etc. I am curious--Is there such a thing as > "over-identifying" with blindness or spending too much time with blind > people? Does spending time with blind people necessarily take away > from how much time and energy you can put into relationships with the > sighted? Or, is it possible to simultaneously feel a strong connection > with other blind people and still engage in productive connections > with sighted people at work, and have healthy social connections with > sighted people as well? > I tend to take the latter view, and am a little saddened when people > make comments to the effect that we should spend less time with other > blind people in order to achieve our goal of integration, as if the > two objectives are mutually exclusive. Sometimes I think people (blind > and sighted alike) have the implicit assumption that relationships > with sighted people are somehow superior to relationships we have with > the blind, and that it's to our advantage to, for example, avoid > spending all our time at NFB meetings, or try not to work in the > blindness field on principle, or to only date sighted people. Of > course, people differ in the extremity of these views. But I do think > it's entirely possible and healthy to juggle a strong "blind identity" > with the other identities and connections we have in the world, > without taking away from either one. > I'm interested to hear your views about this, but I'd like to close > with a concrete example. When I was in high school and college, most > of my close friends were blind. I often felt, as many of you have > described, that I could only sustain casual relationships with sighted > people, but that I could only feel the deep, reciprocal connections I > had with other blind people. When I started graduate school, after > receiving blindness training at LCB and being a member and leader in > NABS for five years, I finally began to perceive that my fellow > students, who were all sighted, didn't care much about my blindness > and were for the most part able to treat me like anyone else. I have > been dating a sighted guy for the past year, which is something I > never thought would happen, and with him I feel the same kind of > reciprocal intimacy that I thought I could only have with other blind > people. My point in disclosing all that is that I honestly don't think > I would have reached this level of confidence and belonging in my > sighted community if I hadn't had the strong, affirming relationships > that I had for so many years with my blind friends. Around other blind > people I felt normal and capable, and was able to become a > reciprocating partner and a leader. I had to be able to do those > things and practice them over time before I could go into the > uncertainty of a new sighted community with the right social skills > and confidence to integrate and build new connections, including > finding my boyfriend. It's just something to think about. > Arielle > On 3/27/10, Marc Workman wrote: >> This will be the fourth time that I've clarified what I said, but >> what I >> said keeps getting distorted, so I'll try one more time. >> Jedi said, >> two men would insist that I perceive myself differently because I >> can give >> birth. >> I've read every message on this subject, and I didn't read one man, >> let >> alone two, say anything like that. >> How on earth could anyone know how you perceive yourself? I >> certainly don't, >> and I have never said that I did. For the record, I have no idea >> how Jedi >> perceives herself. I only know that she says that she doesn't give >> much >> thought to her ability to give birth, and I don't question that at >> all. But >> that is just not the issue that is being discussed. How you perceive >> yourself has nothing to do with this. Identity is much more than >> just how >> you perceive yourself. Your ability to perceive, how you perceive, >> what you >> perceive, these are all already influenced by your identity. So >> whether or >> not you think about a particular feature of yourself does not alone >> determine whether it is or is not a part of your identity. >> I truly regret bringing up the ability to give birth. There is way >> too much >> bagage that comes with a discussion of that topic, and I clearly >> offended >> some people, which I had no intention of doing. The fact that I'm >> a man >> makes my bringing it up all the more problematic for some. I tried >> to >> choose my words carefully, including the clarification that I was >> in no way >> suggesting that women are defined by this ability, but even this >> wasn't >> enough to avoid the bagage, which is fine, I get that. It was a bad >> example, but the disappointing thing is that so much energy has >> been focused >> on this one example that it has over-shadowed what could have been >> a deeper >> discussion of blindness and identity. That is unfortunate and >> makes me >> really wish I had never mentioned it. >> No hard feelings I hope. >> Marc >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >> Behalf Of Jedi >> Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 4:46 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity >> Briley, >> I'm glad you said something because it took me a while to understand >> why I replied so snarkily last time. I realized that I felt incensed >> that two men would insist that I perceive myself differently >> because I >> can give birth. To me, it was as bad as if some sighted person got on >> list and told us all that our lack of eyesight shapes how we see >> ourselves. Some would say yes, and others would say no. For those who >> would say no, I think we'd feel pretty frustrated because it would be >> almost like that sighted person was telling us that because they >> saw us >> differently because we're blind, so should we regardless if we do or >> not. What frustrated me most is that I twice said that, in my >> experience of not being a mother, I didn't think much about my >> ability >> to have children and yet I felt argued with as though someone who saw >> themselves as having more authority on the topic, a man, had the >> final >> authority on how I felt about myself as a woman. It was so >> frustrating. >> And you're quite right that men probably don't think about their >> ability to be part of the procreation process any more or less than >> we >> do. Same goes for sighted people. I've heard sighted people say that >> they don't realize how much they take for granted, and that's quite >> true. They mean to say that they feel sorry for us, but the fact is >> that they really have no idea how much privilege they have in society >> just as many in a given "superior" (in quotes) class don't. Thanks >> again for your comments. >> Respectfully, >> Jedi >> Original message: >>> Jedi, >>> I thought you handled the issue of giving birth quite capably. I >>> am not >>> a mother yet, so no, I don't think about my ability to pop out >>> kids as >>> a big part of who I am... or really ponder it as a part of >>> identity at >>> all. Do you men see your ability to participate in making children >>> as a >>> part of your identity? Probably not. So, it is semi chauvinist of >>> you >>> to assume we are attached to our uterus as a part of us that gives >>> us >>> self worth. >>> Briley >>> On Mar 27, 2010, at 3:55 AM, Jedi wrote: >>>> Well, if we want to get down to brass tacks, we can all say that we >>>> will never know just how our being is affects our perceptions, >>>> but the >>>> bottom line still lies at the fact that our perception of our >>>> beingness >>>> is largely determine by what our culture teaches us about it, and >>>> identity is the presentation of how we respond to those teachings >>>> in >>>> our interactions with ourselves and others. >>>> I think it's interesting that two men have been interested in >>>> whether >>>> or not I see myself differently because I can give birth yet no >>>> women >>>> have weighed in on the subject. I also think they're more >>>> interesting >>>> in my birthing abilities than I am. Well gentlemen, you're >>>> welcome to >>>> those abilities so long as you're willing to take the identity that >>>> comes with them. *tongue in cheek* >>>> Respectfully, >>>> Jedi >>>> Original message: >>>>> The point is that without ever having had the experience of >>>>> being a man, >> you >>>>> cannot say for sure that your being a woman does or does not >>>>> have an >> impact >>>>> on how you see yourself or experience the world. I suspect it >>>>> does, but >>>>> without any basis for comparison, you can't say. Just as my >>>>> being blind >> from >>>>> birth prohibits me from determining whether or not or to what >>>>> degree my >>>>> blindness affects how I view myself and experience the world. My >>>>> gut >> feeling >>>>> is that my blindness has a fairly profound affect on at least a >> significant >>>>> subset of the things I experience and the way in which I >>>>> experience >> them. >>>>> Blindness is absolutely part of my identity, as is my height, >>>>> skin color >> and >>>>> love of the Chicago Cubs. Your identity is just an exhaustive >>>>> list of >> all of >>>>> the characteristics and attributes which make a particular >>>>> person the >>>>> particular person that they are. >>>>> To what degree I identify myself as blind or identify with the >>>>> greater >>>>> community of blind people is a completely separate question from >>>>> that of >>>>> whether or not blindness is part of my identity. >>>>> I don't think blindness, strictly defined, is a social >>>>> construct, while >> I >>>>> think the concept of disability is. I'm sure that to articulate my >> reasons >>>>> for feeling this way would require more time than I am willing >>>>> to put >> into >>>>> it now, but that is my gut feeling. >>>>> Thought I'd throw my two cents into this interesting discussion. >>>>> All the best, >>>>> Sean >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>> info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >> bile.net >>>> -- >>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >> bile.net >> -- >> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >> il.com >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com > -- > Arielle Silverman > President, National Association of Blind Students > Phone: 602-502-2255 > Email: > nabs.president at gmail.com > Website: > www.nabslink.org > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info > for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/corbbo%40gmail.com From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Sun Mar 28 07:20:19 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 03:20:19 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity Message-ID: <20100328072019.13301.43306@web3> Corbb, Sorry, but I think I miswrote. The social skills thing I was referring to is an attitude I've observed in some professionals working with blind people. I've observed some of them acting like having two blind people (or several) hanging together can be a bad thing because we're supposedly socially deficient by nature of blindness and that hanging with sighted persons is much healthier to improve social skills. I was wondering if this attitude corelates to Arielle's experiences. Sorry about that. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > I really hope there's a better term than "mixed" for a blind-sighted > relationship, but at this hour I can't come up with one and will use > it for the purposes of brevity! > I used to think that I couldn't see myself marrying another blind > person. I used to think about all the practical implications: well > what if I want to travel in a remote place for a vacation, and the > only way to get around is via car? Or how will I raise kids if I can't > watch them in order to give them independence? And the list goes on. > That's all in past tense for a reason. > Thanks to what all of you in the NFB have taught me over the last many > years, I now see blindness or vision as a non-issue for relationships. > There are far more important characteristics to think about. On the > parenting issue, Melissa & Mark Riccobono's teleconference clarified > many issues for me and erased many of the misconceptions I held about > my own abilities. I've also seen lots of blind-blind relationships > (and marriages!) and how effective they can be...just as effective as > sighted-sighted or "mixed" relationships...and that's changed my > opinion. > So, Jedi, I believe that a predisposition by a blind person to think > that he/she wants to marry a sighted person can be a misconception > about the abilities of the blind. I don't think it has anything to do > with social skills -- for me, it was about the practical implications > of living in a sighted world as a blind person. > -Corbb > On Mar 27, 2010, at 9:08 PM, Jedi wrote: > Arielle, > Any guesses as to why there seems to be an attitutde that mixed > relationships are better than all blind relationships? I was wondering > if it has to do with this idea that since the blind inherently have > lesser social skills, then it would not be a good idea for a blind > person to mingle with other blind people if they wanted to learn > better social skills. I agree that that's not true at all, but I was > just wondering if this couldn't be one explanation for the attitude > you describe. > Respectfully, > Jedi > Original message: >> Hi all, >> With all due respect to the discussions thus far regarding the >> components of identity and culture, I'd like to steer the conversation >> a little closer to what we originally started with when we were >> talking about belonging, or lack thereof, in the sighted world, >> joining student clubs, etc. I am curious--Is there such a thing as >> "over-identifying" with blindness or spending too much time with blind >> people? Does spending time with blind people necessarily take away >> from how much time and energy you can put into relationships with the >> sighted? Or, is it possible to simultaneously feel a strong connection >> with other blind people and still engage in productive connections >> with sighted people at work, and have healthy social connections with >> sighted people as well? >> I tend to take the latter view, and am a little saddened when people >> make comments to the effect that we should spend less time with other >> blind people in order to achieve our goal of integration, as if the >> two objectives are mutually exclusive. Sometimes I think people (blind >> and sighted alike) have the implicit assumption that relationships >> with sighted people are somehow superior to relationships we have with >> the blind, and that it's to our advantage to, for example, avoid >> spending all our time at NFB meetings, or try not to work in the >> blindness field on principle, or to only date sighted people. Of >> course, people differ in the extremity of these views. But I do think >> it's entirely possible and healthy to juggle a strong "blind identity" >> with the other identities and connections we have in the world, >> without taking away from either one. >> I'm interested to hear your views about this, but I'd like to close >> with a concrete example. When I was in high school and college, most >> of my close friends were blind. I often felt, as many of you have >> described, that I could only sustain casual relationships with sighted >> people, but that I could only feel the deep, reciprocal connections I >> had with other blind people. When I started graduate school, after >> receiving blindness training at LCB and being a member and leader in >> NABS for five years, I finally began to perceive that my fellow >> students, who were all sighted, didn't care much about my blindness >> and were for the most part able to treat me like anyone else. I have >> been dating a sighted guy for the past year, which is something I >> never thought would happen, and with him I feel the same kind of >> reciprocal intimacy that I thought I could only have with other blind >> people. My point in disclosing all that is that I honestly don't think >> I would have reached this level of confidence and belonging in my >> sighted community if I hadn't had the strong, affirming relationships >> that I had for so many years with my blind friends. Around other blind >> people I felt normal and capable, and was able to become a >> reciprocating partner and a leader. I had to be able to do those >> things and practice them over time before I could go into the >> uncertainty of a new sighted community with the right social skills >> and confidence to integrate and build new connections, including >> finding my boyfriend. It's just something to think about. >> Arielle >> On 3/27/10, Marc Workman wrote: >>> This will be the fourth time that I've clarified what I said, but >>> what I >>> said keeps getting distorted, so I'll try one more time. >>> Jedi said, >>> two men would insist that I perceive myself differently because I >>> can give >>> birth. >>> I've read every message on this subject, and I didn't read one man, >>> let >>> alone two, say anything like that. >>> How on earth could anyone know how you perceive yourself? I >>> certainly don't, >>> and I have never said that I did. For the record, I have no idea >>> how Jedi >>> perceives herself. I only know that she says that she doesn't give >>> much >>> thought to her ability to give birth, and I don't question that at >>> all. But >>> that is just not the issue that is being discussed. How you perceive >>> yourself has nothing to do with this. Identity is much more than >>> just how >>> you perceive yourself. Your ability to perceive, how you perceive, >>> what you >>> perceive, these are all already influenced by your identity. So >>> whether or >>> not you think about a particular feature of yourself does not alone >>> determine whether it is or is not a part of your identity. >>> I truly regret bringing up the ability to give birth. There is way >>> too much >>> bagage that comes with a discussion of that topic, and I clearly >>> offended >>> some people, which I had no intention of doing. The fact that I'm >>> a man >>> makes my bringing it up all the more problematic for some. I tried >>> to >>> choose my words carefully, including the clarification that I was >>> in no way >>> suggesting that women are defined by this ability, but even this >>> wasn't >>> enough to avoid the bagage, which is fine, I get that. It was a bad >>> example, but the disappointing thing is that so much energy has >>> been focused >>> on this one example that it has over-shadowed what could have been >>> a deeper >>> discussion of blindness and identity. That is unfortunate and >>> makes me >>> really wish I had never mentioned it. >>> No hard feelings I hope. >>> Marc >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >>> Behalf Of Jedi >>> Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 4:46 PM >>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity >>> Briley, >>> I'm glad you said something because it took me a while to understand >>> why I replied so snarkily last time. I realized that I felt incensed >>> that two men would insist that I perceive myself differently >>> because I >>> can give birth. To me, it was as bad as if some sighted person got on >>> list and told us all that our lack of eyesight shapes how we see >>> ourselves. Some would say yes, and others would say no. For those who >>> would say no, I think we'd feel pretty frustrated because it would be >>> almost like that sighted person was telling us that because they >>> saw us >>> differently because we're blind, so should we regardless if we do or >>> not. What frustrated me most is that I twice said that, in my >>> experience of not being a mother, I didn't think much about my >>> ability >>> to have children and yet I felt argued with as though someone who saw >>> themselves as having more authority on the topic, a man, had the >>> final >>> authority on how I felt about myself as a woman. It was so >>> frustrating. >>> And you're quite right that men probably don't think about their >>> ability to be part of the procreation process any more or less than >>> we >>> do. Same goes for sighted people. I've heard sighted people say that >>> they don't realize how much they take for granted, and that's quite >>> true. They mean to say that they feel sorry for us, but the fact is >>> that they really have no idea how much privilege they have in society >>> just as many in a given "superior" (in quotes) class don't. Thanks >>> again for your comments. >>> Respectfully, >>> Jedi >>> Original message: >>>> Jedi, >>>> I thought you handled the issue of giving birth quite capably. I >>>> am not >>>> a mother yet, so no, I don't think about my ability to pop out >>>> kids as >>>> a big part of who I am... or really ponder it as a part of >>>> identity at >>>> all. Do you men see your ability to participate in making children >>>> as a >>>> part of your identity? Probably not. So, it is semi chauvinist of >>>> you >>>> to assume we are attached to our uterus as a part of us that gives >>>> us >>>> self worth. >>>> Briley >>>> On Mar 27, 2010, at 3:55 AM, Jedi wrote: >>>>> Well, if we want to get down to brass tacks, we can all say that we >>>>> will never know just how our being is affects our perceptions, >>>>> but the >>>>> bottom line still lies at the fact that our perception of our >>>>> beingness >>>>> is largely determine by what our culture teaches us about it, and >>>>> identity is the presentation of how we respond to those teachings >>>>> in >>>>> our interactions with ourselves and others. >>>>> I think it's interesting that two men have been interested in >>>>> whether >>>>> or not I see myself differently because I can give birth yet no >>>>> women >>>>> have weighed in on the subject. I also think they're more >>>>> interesting >>>>> in my birthing abilities than I am. Well gentlemen, you're >>>>> welcome to >>>>> those abilities so long as you're willing to take the identity that >>>>> comes with them. *tongue in cheek* >>>>> Respectfully, >>>>> Jedi >>>>> Original message: >>>>>> The point is that without ever having had the experience of >>>>>> being a man, >>> you >>>>>> cannot say for sure that your being a woman does or does not >>>>>> have an >>> impact >>>>>> on how you see yourself or experience the world. I suspect it >>>>>> does, but >>>>>> without any basis for comparison, you can't say. Just as my >>>>>> being blind >>> from >>>>>> birth prohibits me from determining whether or not or to what >>>>>> degree my >>>>>> blindness affects how I view myself and experience the world. My >>>>>> gut >>> feeling >>>>>> is that my blindness has a fairly profound affect on at least a >>> significant >>>>>> subset of the things I experience and the way in which I >>>>>> experience >>> them. >>>>>> Blindness is absolutely part of my identity, as is my height, >>>>>> skin color >>> and >>>>>> love of the Chicago Cubs. Your identity is just an exhaustive >>>>>> list of >>> all of >>>>>> the characteristics and attributes which make a particular >>>>>> person the >>>>>> particular person that they are. >>>>>> To what degree I identify myself as blind or identify with the >>>>>> greater >>>>>> community of blind people is a completely separate question from >>>>>> that of >>>>>> whether or not blindness is part of my identity. >>>>>> I don't think blindness, strictly defined, is a social >>>>>> construct, while >>> I >>>>>> think the concept of disability is. I'm sure that to articulate my >>> reasons >>>>>> for feeling this way would require more time than I am willing >>>>>> to put >>> into >>>>>> it now, but that is my gut feeling. >>>>>> Thought I'd throw my two cents into this interesting discussion. >>>>>> All the best, >>>>>> Sean >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>> info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >>> bile.net >>>>> -- >>>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >>> bile.net >>> -- >>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >>> il.com >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com >> -- >> Arielle Silverman >> President, National Association of Blind Students >> Phone: 602-502-2255 >> Email: >> nabs.president at gmail.com >> Website: >> www.nabslink.org >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> for nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From nefamphetamine at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 13:23:29 2010 From: nefamphetamine at gmail.com (Nef) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 09:23:29 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane In-Reply-To: References: <0D32DDCAFC414DD889E321F12E812322@Rufus> Message-ID: <3d644bc31003280623g23d3e285na16e0718b9622e3e@mail.gmail.com> When I grow up, I wanna be a combination of the two of you! On 3/27/10, Jamie Principato wrote: > I'm really not sure of the legality of this. I can't imagine it's too > strict. I know the wording tends to say "white cane", but then there are > canes with colored handles and/or tips. > > I got into decorating my cane once I was comfortable using one, but for > safety reasons, I never alter the cane's primary color. I keep the bulk of > it white since I know this will be ost easily seen by drivers, and I focus > mainly on the handle and/or tip. I've made beaded loops to go at the end of > the handle instead of that elastic thing, or sometimes I'd braid a loop with > colored embroidery thread, and I've made covers for the handle out of > fabrics, ribbons, beads, colored paper, or what ever suited me. Once on > Valentine's day, I put a pink loop on the handle, wrapped red ribbon around > it, and stuck a plastic heart at the end of the cane just a few inches above > the tip. I figured that this was fitting for the occasion, but it was still > pretty obvious by the main color of the cane and the way I was holding/using > it that I was blind. > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 10:26 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: > >> Hello all, >> >> Finding myself low on my stash of collapsible canes, I called the National >> Center and discovered they no longer carried those fiber glass types with >> the chains. I don't actually like the chains. In fact, I promptly take >> them off and lose them, and I much prefer these to the dorky ones with the >> elastic bands, no offense if you happen to sport these. Besides, I am now >> a >> dork, because since that's all they had, that's all I got. >> >> So, my question: Would it really not be acceptable to paint my cane a >> different color? I think the little elastic band is mortifying, and short >> of replacing the cap with something cooler, I thought about painting my >> cane >> black or blue or some sweeter combination than the dull white, and I guess >> the point is not so much whether this is acceptable. I'll paint my cane >> all >> the colors of the rainbow if it so moves me, but legally, could someone >> actually claim they did not know I was blind in the case of an accident if >> my cane were not white? >> >> Laugh all you want, but I'm thinking of starting a revolution of >> multicolored canes. You'll be jealous when I have a cane to match my >> outfits! It'th called getting in touch with my feminine thide. *grin* >> >> Thanks for any serious responses. If we've never met, look for the smooth >> operator with the brand-new black magic stick. >> >> Best, >> >> Joe Orozco >> >> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, >> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >> >> >> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >> signature >> database 4978 (20100326) __________ >> >> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >> >> http://www.eset.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com >> > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nefamphetamine%40gmail.com > -- Peace, love and empathy, Nefertiti From dianefilipe at peoplepc.com Sun Mar 28 14:14:51 2010 From: dianefilipe at peoplepc.com (Diane) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 08:14:51 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane In-Reply-To: <0D32DDCAFC414DD889E321F12E812322@Rufus> References: <0D32DDCAFC414DD889E321F12E812322@Rufus> Message-ID: <5AE1FDC38D8041B4AC4CCC11ADC56862@DianePC> Joe, There is a reason the canes are white..safety for you and others! Di ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe Orozco" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Cc: "'NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List'" Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 8:26 PM Subject: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane > Hello all, > > Finding myself low on my stash of collapsible canes, I called the National > Center and discovered they no longer carried those fiber glass types with > the chains. I don't actually like the chains. In fact, I promptly take > them off and lose them, and I much prefer these to the dorky ones with the > elastic bands, no offense if you happen to sport these. Besides, I am now > a > dork, because since that's all they had, that's all I got. > > So, my question: Would it really not be acceptable to paint my cane a > different color? I think the little elastic band is mortifying, and short > of replacing the cap with something cooler, I thought about painting my > cane > black or blue or some sweeter combination than the dull white, and I guess > the point is not so much whether this is acceptable. I'll paint my cane > all > the colors of the rainbow if it so moves me, but legally, could someone > actually claim they did not know I was blind in the case of an accident if > my cane were not white? > > Laugh all you want, but I'm thinking of starting a revolution of > multicolored canes. You'll be jealous when I have a cane to match my > outfits! It'th called getting in touch with my feminine thide. *grin* > > Thanks for any serious responses. If we've never met, look for the smooth > operator with the brand-new black magic stick. > > Best, > > Joe Orozco > > "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, > some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature > database 4978 (20100326) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dianefilipe%40peoplepc.com From alexandera.castillo at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 14:33:40 2010 From: alexandera.castillo at gmail.com (Alexander Castillo) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 10:33:40 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity Message-ID: Hi list; this is an Interesting discussion on blindness and Identity. I definitely agree that blindness is not part of my identity, but rather it is a physical characteristic which by choice, I identify with. As an example, I will say that for most of my life, the notion of there being a blind “community” was non-existent, as most of my peers were and still are sighted, I did not attend any specialized schools, and whenever the issue of my lacking 20/20 vision came up, it was always a negative and not a positive. As a result, I saw myself as a guy who could just about do most things, except read what was on the blackboard at school. As I got older and my vision decreased, I began to see myself as just less of a competent person, and because socially, I had no experiences with blindness and I had never chosen to self identify as blind, I was simply lacking ability as opposed to being someone who could have alternative ways of being able. In other words, my lack of identifying with that physical characteristic called blindness, lead me to believe that I wasn’t blind, just not capable of doing certain things. As I began to use a cane, and saw certain benefits of its usage, and I began to associate with people who were capable, and shared that same characteristic of blindness, I started to identify with that physical trait. However, I do not have an identity as a blind person, in the way that many sighted people might see me as having. I am not a blind creature, just like every other blind creature. As a note, it is this label, this identity and social perception which most of us are working to change in society. So, this is definitely a social construct. I see myself as Male, Dominican, 29, working toward such degree, with interest in this that and the other…. Blindness is not first on my list, unless I’m thinking about advocacy, or NFB, or how it creeps me out when I am rushing on the Subway, and someone asks me if I need help going up or down stairs. Also, I’ve noted that my Maleness is the first characteristic which I wrote down. As males, we are often reminding each other of masculinity, what it is to be a man, doing manly things and such. This social pressure on our maleness is perhaps what we guys are projecting here when we are attributing the female identity as one consumed by child birth, as that is the one characteristic which in our manly minds, Marks the clearest difference between our sexes. I would say that in this society, although females are reaching equal status as males, we are still very male oriented. It would make sense then, that in being male, one would need to identify more with the trait and therefore assume that women have a similar need to do so with being female. I would say that Jedi has a solid argument by stating that she does not identify with the ability to give birth or will identify with it until she, if she chooses to, gives birth or starts thinking about doing so. In the United States, I see myself as male and Dominican, but when I am in the Dominican Republic, I simply see myself as male. Thanks for reading, Alex From jkenn337 at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 17:14:37 2010 From: jkenn337 at gmail.com (Josh) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 13:14:37 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] anyone here use a mac? Message-ID: Hi Does anyone on here use an apple computer? I'll be getting a macbook pro with 250gig hard drive, 4gigs of ram and a 2.5ghz processor to go to capella online university. I am the first person in the history of my state to have gotten a mac from the pennsylvania agency. it'll be dual-booted with windows7. Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net From marrie12 at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 18:11:05 2010 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 11:11:05 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] anyone here use a mac? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <7101CE38-5F85-4A3F-A466-BC24FF250CDE@gmail.com> Yeah I use a macbook pro almost eh same model you have. wht do you need help wtih? Take care. On Mar 28, 2010, at 10:14 AM, Josh wrote: > Hi > > Does anyone on here use an apple computer? I'll be getting a macbook pro with 250gig hard drive, 4gigs of ram and a 2.5ghz processor to go to capella online university. I am the first person in the history of my state to have gotten a mac from the pennsylvania agency. it'll be dual-booted with windows7. > > Josh Kennedy jkenn337 at gmail.com http://jkenn337.klangoblog.net > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com From nabs.president at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 18:56:45 2010 From: nabs.president at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 13:56:45 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Checking States In-Reply-To: <003301cace30$0d12ac00$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> References: <003301cace30$0d12ac00$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> Message-ID: <85ff10071003281156i72daaf96i4bcd470a8acda86@mail.gmail.com> Hi Peter, A few of these states are incorrect. I will correct them here in order to close on-list discussion on this. In the future, Peter or others requesting information about the NABS board, please email me privately at nabs.president at gmail.com to avoid cluttering the list. Thanks! Arielle Silverman-Colorado Karen Anderson-Nebraska Sean Whalen-Virginia Janice Jeang-Texas Nijat Worley-Colorado Isaiah Wilcox-Georgia Meghan Whalen-Wisconsin Domonique Lawless-Tennessee Darian Smith-California On 3/27/10, Peter Donahue wrote: > Hello again everyone, > > I can safely say that the 2009 NABS Meeting Recordings Access Page is > half-way done. There is still lots of work to do before it goes on the site. > I've taken the list of officers and board members and added the state where > they live or attend school. I'll list them below. Please tell me if any of > them are incorrect so I can fix them on the page to be sure they're right. > Here goes: > > President: Arielle Silverman, Colorado > First Vice-President: Karen Anderson, Nebraska > Second Vice-President: Sean Whalen, Wisconsin > Secretary: Janice Jeang, Illinois > Treasurer: Nijat Worley, Washington D.C. > > Board Members: > Isaiah Wilcox, Washington State > Meghan Whalen, Wisconsin > Domonique Lawless, Tennessee > Darian Smith, California > > Your assistance with this will be greatly appreciated. > > Peter Donahue > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com > -- Arielle Silverman President, National Association of Blind Students Phone: 602-502-2255 Email: nabs.president at gmail.com Website: www.nabslink.org From jsorozco at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 20:00:56 2010 From: jsorozco at gmail.com (Joe Orozco) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 16:00:56 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane In-Reply-To: <20100328051500.32396.93138@web2> Message-ID: <865AC609436C4FAEAEE61A5CD41A94BC@Rufus> Jedi, Yes, I was aware of it. Actually, that was the point? The *grin* after my comment clearly signaled the comment was nothing more than humor, but if the comment personally offended you, I do sincerely apologize. Joe Orozco "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4980 (20100328) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com From marrie12 at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 22:20:17 2010 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 15:20:17 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane In-Reply-To: <0D32DDCAFC414DD889E321F12E812322@Rufus> References: <0D32DDCAFC414DD889E321F12E812322@Rufus> Message-ID: <3FEBEDCD-0767-48B7-8D6D-4D3ED1488602@gmail.com> I don't know if that would be a good idea. you want the car or what ever ot reflect off of the surface of the cane so I think white would be safer in the long run. Take care. On Mar 27, 2010, at 7:26 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: > Hello all, > > Finding myself low on my stash of collapsible canes, I called the National > Center and discovered they no longer carried those fiber glass types with > the chains. I don't actually like the chains. In fact, I promptly take > them off and lose them, and I much prefer these to the dorky ones with the > elastic bands, no offense if you happen to sport these. Besides, I am now a > dork, because since that's all they had, that's all I got. > > So, my question: Would it really not be acceptable to paint my cane a > different color? I think the little elastic band is mortifying, and short > of replacing the cap with something cooler, I thought about painting my cane > black or blue or some sweeter combination than the dull white, and I guess > the point is not so much whether this is acceptable. I'll paint my cane all > the colors of the rainbow if it so moves me, but legally, could someone > actually claim they did not know I was blind in the case of an accident if > my cane were not white? > > Laugh all you want, but I'm thinking of starting a revolution of > multicolored canes. You'll be jealous when I have a cane to match my > outfits! It'th called getting in touch with my feminine thide. *grin* > > Thanks for any serious responses. If we've never met, look for the smooth > operator with the brand-new black magic stick. > > Best, > > Joe Orozco > > "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, > some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature > database 4978 (20100326) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com From bunnykatie6 at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 22:44:23 2010 From: bunnykatie6 at gmail.com (Katie Wang) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 18:44:23 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity In-Reply-To: <20100328072019.13301.43306@web3> References: <20100328072019.13301.43306@web3> Message-ID: <5096b4731003281544t26ce49f0k1f3b824991a014ca@mail.gmail.com> Arielle, thanks for sharing your experiences! I agree with you that it is totally possible for one to feel strong connections with both the sighted and the blind community, and as many have mentioned, achieving a balance is the most important thing. Given that blindness is a low-incidence disability, it is very likely that our classmates, colleagues, and people we come into contact with on a daily basis are exclusively sighted, so I would say that for most of us, having the confidence and ability to form meaningful relationships with our sighted peers is extremely important to a healthy sense of belonging. At the same time, it is also true that being in touch with the blindness community can help us better deal with blindness-related issues and acquire information that will help us become more competent, confident individuals. Growing up, almost all of my friends are sighted, not because I avoided socializing with other blind people per se but simply because they were not around and I was not very active in seeking out such socialization opportunities. However, since starting college and coming in contact with the NFB, I have found that being part of the blindness community can be extremely helpful, especially when I encounter blindness-related issues in my personal and professional pursuits. Overall, I think as long as our involvement in the blindness community does not take away so much of our time and energy that it prevents us from making friends in our daily lives or hinders what we are doing as a student or a professional, it is definitely a very beneficial thing! Katie On 3/28/10, Jedi wrote: > Corbb, > > Sorry, but I think I miswrote. The social skills thing I was referring > to is an attitude I've observed in some professionals working with > blind people. I've observed some of them acting like having two blind > people (or several) hanging together can be a bad thing because we're > supposedly socially deficient by nature of blindness and that hanging > with sighted persons is much healthier to improve social skills. I was > wondering if this attitude corelates to Arielle's experiences. Sorry > about that. > > Respectfully, > Jedi > > > Original message: >> I really hope there's a better term than "mixed" for a blind-sighted >> relationship, but at this hour I can't come up with one and will use >> it for the purposes of brevity! > >> I used to think that I couldn't see myself marrying another blind >> person. I used to think about all the practical implications: well >> what if I want to travel in a remote place for a vacation, and the >> only way to get around is via car? Or how will I raise kids if I can't >> watch them in order to give them independence? And the list goes on. >> That's all in past tense for a reason. > >> Thanks to what all of you in the NFB have taught me over the last many >> years, I now see blindness or vision as a non-issue for relationships. >> There are far more important characteristics to think about. On the >> parenting issue, Melissa & Mark Riccobono's teleconference clarified >> many issues for me and erased many of the misconceptions I held about >> my own abilities. I've also seen lots of blind-blind relationships >> (and marriages!) and how effective they can be...just as effective as >> sighted-sighted or "mixed" relationships...and that's changed my >> opinion. > >> So, Jedi, I believe that a predisposition by a blind person to think >> that he/she wants to marry a sighted person can be a misconception >> about the abilities of the blind. I don't think it has anything to do >> with social skills -- for me, it was about the practical implications >> of living in a sighted world as a blind person. > >> -Corbb > > >> On Mar 27, 2010, at 9:08 PM, Jedi wrote: > >> Arielle, > >> Any guesses as to why there seems to be an attitutde that mixed >> relationships are better than all blind relationships? I was wondering >> if it has to do with this idea that since the blind inherently have >> lesser social skills, then it would not be a good idea for a blind >> person to mingle with other blind people if they wanted to learn >> better social skills. I agree that that's not true at all, but I was >> just wondering if this couldn't be one explanation for the attitude >> you describe. > >> Respectfully, >> Jedi > > >> Original message: >>> Hi all, > >>> With all due respect to the discussions thus far regarding the >>> components of identity and culture, I'd like to steer the conversation >>> a little closer to what we originally started with when we were >>> talking about belonging, or lack thereof, in the sighted world, >>> joining student clubs, etc. I am curious--Is there such a thing as >>> "over-identifying" with blindness or spending too much time with blind >>> people? Does spending time with blind people necessarily take away >>> from how much time and energy you can put into relationships with the >>> sighted? Or, is it possible to simultaneously feel a strong connection >>> with other blind people and still engage in productive connections >>> with sighted people at work, and have healthy social connections with >>> sighted people as well? > >>> I tend to take the latter view, and am a little saddened when people >>> make comments to the effect that we should spend less time with other >>> blind people in order to achieve our goal of integration, as if the >>> two objectives are mutually exclusive. Sometimes I think people (blind >>> and sighted alike) have the implicit assumption that relationships >>> with sighted people are somehow superior to relationships we have with >>> the blind, and that it's to our advantage to, for example, avoid >>> spending all our time at NFB meetings, or try not to work in the >>> blindness field on principle, or to only date sighted people. Of >>> course, people differ in the extremity of these views. But I do think >>> it's entirely possible and healthy to juggle a strong "blind identity" >>> with the other identities and connections we have in the world, >>> without taking away from either one. > >>> I'm interested to hear your views about this, but I'd like to close >>> with a concrete example. When I was in high school and college, most >>> of my close friends were blind. I often felt, as many of you have >>> described, that I could only sustain casual relationships with sighted >>> people, but that I could only feel the deep, reciprocal connections I >>> had with other blind people. When I started graduate school, after >>> receiving blindness training at LCB and being a member and leader in >>> NABS for five years, I finally began to perceive that my fellow >>> students, who were all sighted, didn't care much about my blindness >>> and were for the most part able to treat me like anyone else. I have >>> been dating a sighted guy for the past year, which is something I >>> never thought would happen, and with him I feel the same kind of >>> reciprocal intimacy that I thought I could only have with other blind >>> people. My point in disclosing all that is that I honestly don't think >>> I would have reached this level of confidence and belonging in my >>> sighted community if I hadn't had the strong, affirming relationships >>> that I had for so many years with my blind friends. Around other blind >>> people I felt normal and capable, and was able to become a >>> reciprocating partner and a leader. I had to be able to do those >>> things and practice them over time before I could go into the >>> uncertainty of a new sighted community with the right social skills >>> and confidence to integrate and build new connections, including >>> finding my boyfriend. It's just something to think about. > >>> Arielle > >>> On 3/27/10, Marc Workman wrote: >>>> This will be the fourth time that I've clarified what I said, but >>>> what I >>>> said keeps getting distorted, so I'll try one more time. > >>>> Jedi said, >>>> two men would insist that I perceive myself differently because I >>>> can give >>>> birth. > >>>> I've read every message on this subject, and I didn't read one man, >>>> let >>>> alone two, say anything like that. > >>>> How on earth could anyone know how you perceive yourself? I >>>> certainly don't, >>>> and I have never said that I did. For the record, I have no idea >>>> how Jedi >>>> perceives herself. I only know that she says that she doesn't give >>>> much >>>> thought to her ability to give birth, and I don't question that at >>>> all. But >>>> that is just not the issue that is being discussed. How you perceive >>>> yourself has nothing to do with this. Identity is much more than >>>> just how >>>> you perceive yourself. Your ability to perceive, how you perceive, >>>> what you >>>> perceive, these are all already influenced by your identity. So >>>> whether or >>>> not you think about a particular feature of yourself does not alone >>>> determine whether it is or is not a part of your identity. > >>>> I truly regret bringing up the ability to give birth. There is way >>>> too much >>>> bagage that comes with a discussion of that topic, and I clearly >>>> offended >>>> some people, which I had no intention of doing. The fact that I'm >>>> a man >>>> makes my bringing it up all the more problematic for some. I tried >>>> to >>>> choose my words carefully, including the clarification that I was >>>> in no way >>>> suggesting that women are defined by this ability, but even this >>>> wasn't >>>> enough to avoid the bagage, which is fine, I get that. It was a bad >>>> example, but the disappointing thing is that so much energy has >>>> been focused >>>> on this one example that it has over-shadowed what could have been >>>> a deeper >>>> discussion of blindness and identity. That is unfortunate and >>>> makes me >>>> really wish I had never mentioned it. > >>>> No hard feelings I hope. > >>>> Marc > > > >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >>>> Behalf Of Jedi >>>> Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 4:46 PM >>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity > > >>>> Briley, > >>>> I'm glad you said something because it took me a while to understand >>>> why I replied so snarkily last time. I realized that I felt incensed >>>> that two men would insist that I perceive myself differently >>>> because I >>>> can give birth. To me, it was as bad as if some sighted person got on >>>> list and told us all that our lack of eyesight shapes how we see >>>> ourselves. Some would say yes, and others would say no. For those who >>>> would say no, I think we'd feel pretty frustrated because it would be >>>> almost like that sighted person was telling us that because they >>>> saw us >>>> differently because we're blind, so should we regardless if we do or >>>> not. What frustrated me most is that I twice said that, in my >>>> experience of not being a mother, I didn't think much about my >>>> ability >>>> to have children and yet I felt argued with as though someone who saw >>>> themselves as having more authority on the topic, a man, had the >>>> final >>>> authority on how I felt about myself as a woman. It was so >>>> frustrating. >>>> And you're quite right that men probably don't think about their >>>> ability to be part of the procreation process any more or less than >>>> we >>>> do. Same goes for sighted people. I've heard sighted people say that >>>> they don't realize how much they take for granted, and that's quite >>>> true. They mean to say that they feel sorry for us, but the fact is >>>> that they really have no idea how much privilege they have in society >>>> just as many in a given "superior" (in quotes) class don't. Thanks >>>> again for your comments. > >>>> Respectfully, >>>> Jedi > > >>>> Original message: >>>>> Jedi, > >>>>> I thought you handled the issue of giving birth quite capably. I >>>>> am not >>>>> a mother yet, so no, I don't think about my ability to pop out >>>>> kids as >>>>> a big part of who I am... or really ponder it as a part of >>>>> identity at >>>>> all. Do you men see your ability to participate in making children >>>>> as a >>>>> part of your identity? Probably not. So, it is semi chauvinist of >>>>> you >>>>> to assume we are attached to our uterus as a part of us that gives >>>>> us >>>>> self worth. > >>>>> Briley > > > >>>>> On Mar 27, 2010, at 3:55 AM, Jedi wrote: > >>>>>> Well, if we want to get down to brass tacks, we can all say that we >>>>>> will never know just how our being is affects our perceptions, >>>>>> but the >>>>>> bottom line still lies at the fact that our perception of our >>>>>> beingness >>>>>> is largely determine by what our culture teaches us about it, and >>>>>> identity is the presentation of how we respond to those teachings >>>>>> in >>>>>> our interactions with ourselves and others. > >>>>>> I think it's interesting that two men have been interested in >>>>>> whether >>>>>> or not I see myself differently because I can give birth yet no >>>>>> women >>>>>> have weighed in on the subject. I also think they're more >>>>>> interesting >>>>>> in my birthing abilities than I am. Well gentlemen, you're >>>>>> welcome to >>>>>> those abilities so long as you're willing to take the identity that >>>>>> comes with them. *tongue in cheek* > >>>>>> Respectfully, >>>>>> Jedi > > > >>>>>> Original message: >>>>>>> The point is that without ever having had the experience of >>>>>>> being a man, >>>> you >>>>>>> cannot say for sure that your being a woman does or does not >>>>>>> have an >>>> impact >>>>>>> on how you see yourself or experience the world. I suspect it >>>>>>> does, but >>>>>>> without any basis for comparison, you can't say. Just as my >>>>>>> being blind >>>> from >>>>>>> birth prohibits me from determining whether or not or to what >>>>>>> degree my >>>>>>> blindness affects how I view myself and experience the world. My >>>>>>> gut >>>> feeling >>>>>>> is that my blindness has a fairly profound affect on at least a >>>> significant >>>>>>> subset of the things I experience and the way in which I >>>>>>> experience >>>> them. > >>>>>>> Blindness is absolutely part of my identity, as is my height, >>>>>>> skin color >>>> and >>>>>>> love of the Chicago Cubs. Your identity is just an exhaustive >>>>>>> list of >>>> all of >>>>>>> the characteristics and attributes which make a particular >>>>>>> person the >>>>>>> particular person that they are. > >>>>>>> To what degree I identify myself as blind or identify with the >>>>>>> greater >>>>>>> community of blind people is a completely separate question from >>>>>>> that of >>>>>>> whether or not blindness is part of my identity. > >>>>>>> I don't think blindness, strictly defined, is a social >>>>>>> construct, while >>>> I >>>>>>> think the concept of disability is. I'm sure that to articulate my >>>> reasons >>>>>>> for feeling this way would require more time than I am willing >>>>>>> to put >>>> into >>>>>>> it now, but that is my gut feeling. > >>>>>>> Thought I'd throw my two cents into this interesting discussion. > >>>>>>> All the best, > >>>>>>> Sean > > >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>> info for >>>> nabs-l: > >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >>>> bile.net > >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: > >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com > > >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: > >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >>>> bile.net > >>>> -- >>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >>>> il.com > > >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com > > > >>> -- >>> Arielle Silverman >>> President, National Association of Blind Students >>> Phone: 602-502-2255 >>> Email: >>> nabs.president at gmail.com >>> Website: >>> www.nabslink.org > >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit > www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmail.com > From dianefilipe at peoplepc.com Sun Mar 28 23:16:10 2010 From: dianefilipe at peoplepc.com (Diane) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 17:16:10 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] many thanks!!! Message-ID: <0787EB62F6A04164A266FA4733C7C6F4@DianePC> Many thanks to Marty Rahn, Melissa Green, and Linda and Bonnie Anderson for purchasing the Mickey mouse earrings! They are now ready for the convention in Orlando and have helped raise money for CABS! How many can I send you? Di From jsorozco at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 00:33:56 2010 From: jsorozco at gmail.com (Joe Orozco) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 20:33:56 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Not Just Your Average Cane In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <04AC544B5C23482BA021D7E070CDA5A4@Rufus> Hi Mark, Having started the thread, I feel compelled to respond to your thoughtful post. It goes without say that people's opinions here do not reflect any official NFB positions, and I honestly doubt the NFB would genuinely care if all its members suddenly decided to sport a wide range of colorfully decorated canes. I think Dr. Maurer would probably find the concept amusing, and doesn't Whozit sport a black cane in our logo? That fellow was far ahead of the curve. For my own part, I'm headed to Michael's sometime soon to embark upon a project to transform my own cane into the walking wonder I know it can be. I think that in doing so I would do well to use a measure of practical sense. Security checkpoints at airports and federal buildings would probably not look kindly on a cane that is different from what is popularly accepted. We can't expect the world to automatically get that blind people have their own sense of pizzazz, and by the same token, we can't expect people to pick up on the fact we're blind at night if using something as obscure as a black cane, even though I agree with the previous subscriber that motorists should respect pedestrians with or without this new breed of eye candy. I'm glad people pointed out the jurisdictions that specifically call for the cane to be white. In asking my question, sarcasm notwithstanding, I was not really setting out to violate laws that are meant to preserve my safety, but I do not want these laws to tuck me away into a label that can be every bit as condescending as terms like "handicapped." If senior citizens can sport all manner of creatively designed walking canes, by golly, I want my own mode of transportation to broadcast my own sense of humor. It's not as if I can smack a bumper sticker on my German shepherd's butt and call it good, although, can you imagine the wide range of clever slogans one could produce with that kind of strategic angle? All of this having been said, I spent nearly a year working on behalf of victims of human trafficking. I learned all about the negative connotations associated with words like "pimping," and for using that term to catch your attention, I am truly sorry. In summation, I think the responses on both lists to which the question went out has been mostly positive. It's no scientific survey, but I think it is at least slightly indicative of the membership's willingness to explore the idea or at least humor my nonsense. People who have given more straight-laced responses are no doubt secretly glad they're not the only ones who thought of this, because original this idea is most certainly not. Let's leave out the references to accessible currency and other controversial topics out of it this time around. We debate those serious issues all the time and should enjoy the all too infrequent light banter. Best, Joe Orozco and the Soon to Be Improved Sir Tap-A-Lot What, as if you haven't ever thought of giving your cane a name??? "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing -----Original Message----- From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mark BurningHawk Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:51 PM To: NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Pimp My Cane I'm following this thread, and I know a large percentage of the folks here are NFB members; I personally a not, nor any organization, for that matter. I find a bit of hypocrisy in this discussion: First the NFB rails against things like audible cross walk signals and so on, claiming that the blind don't need them, that it's not what the blind "want," whatever. Same with identifiable currency. Now, however, I hear a bunch of the same people saying, in effect, "I want to carry a symbol of blindness! I want to proclaim my blindness to everyone so that they can alter their behaviors appropriately in recognition of the fact that I'm blind!" I should think the true spirit of the NFB might be to use a black cane and give no indication whatsoever of blindness, except on a purely voluntary basis. I just don't understand this. Mark BurningHawk Skype and Twitter: BurningHawk1969 Home: Http://MarkBurningHawk.net/ Namaste! _______________________________________________ blindlaw mailing list blindlaw at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for blindlaw: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/jsoroz co%40gmail.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4980 (20100328) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4980 (20100328) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Mon Mar 29 02:20:51 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 22:20:51 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity Message-ID: <20100329022051.1744.37064@web1> Since we are all intersections of identity in one way or another, maybe the real mystery here is why we each choose certain parts of ourselves to identify with more than others. Alex, I would say that for me, blindness is an identity that formed as a result of my being aware of social status differences between the blind and sighted, and that identity was merged with how the NFB defines blindness. Then from observing people in the NFB, I learned to identify my blind self with strength, vigor, energy, history, and the ability to do pretty well anything. Isn't that interesting? I think I'm starting to develop a feminine identity that's based on the same principles as a way of standing up in a world that is, as you've pointing out, still mostly male-oriented. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Hi list; this is an Interesting discussion on blindness and Identity. > I definitely agree that blindness is not part of my identity, but > rather it is a physical characteristic which by choice, I identify > with. As an example, I will say that for most of my life, the notion > of there being a blind “community” was non-existent, as most of my > peers were and still are sighted, I did not attend any specialized > schools, and whenever the issue of my lacking 20/20 vision came up, it > was always a negative and not a positive. As a result, I saw myself as > a guy who could just about do most things, except read what was on the > blackboard at school. > As I got older and my vision decreased, I began to see myself as just > less of a competent person, and because socially, I had no experiences > with blindness and I had never chosen to self identify as blind, I was > simply lacking ability as opposed to being someone who could have > alternative ways of being able. In other words, my lack of identifying > with that physical characteristic called blindness, lead me to believe > that I wasn’t blind, just not capable of doing certain things. > As I began to use a cane, and saw certain benefits of its usage, and I > began to associate with people who were capable, and shared that same > characteristic of blindness, I started to identify with that physical > trait. However, I do not have an identity as a blind person, in the > way that many sighted people might see me as having. I am not a blind > creature, just like every other blind creature. As a note, it is this > label, this identity and social perception which most of us are > working to change in society. So, this is definitely a social > construct. > I see myself as Male, Dominican, 29, working toward such degree, with > interest in this that and the other…. Blindness is not first on my > list, unless I’m thinking about advocacy, or NFB, or how it creeps me > out when I am rushing on the Subway, and someone asks me if I need > help going up or down stairs. > Also, I’ve noted that my Maleness is the first characteristic which I > wrote down. As males, we are often reminding each other of > masculinity, what it is to be a man, doing manly things and such. This > social pressure on our maleness is perhaps what we guys are projecting > here when we are attributing the female identity as one consumed by > child birth, as that is the one characteristic which in our manly > minds, Marks the clearest difference between our sexes. I would say > that in this society, although females are reaching equal status as > males, we are still very male oriented. It would make sense then, that > in being male, one would need to identify more with the trait and > therefore assume that women have a similar need to do so with being > female. I would say that Jedi has a solid argument by stating that > she does not identify with the ability to give birth or will identify > with it until she, if she chooses to, gives birth or starts thinking > about doing so. > In the United States, I see myself as male and Dominican, but when I > am in the Dominican Republic, I simply see myself as male. > Thanks for reading, > Alex > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Mon Mar 29 02:28:02 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 22:28:02 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane Message-ID: <20100329022802.15753.14543@web3> Grin? Oh. I missed it. Thanks. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Jedi, > Yes, I was aware of it. Actually, that was the point? The *grin* after my > comment clearly signaled the comment was nothing more than humor, but if the > comment personally offended you, I do sincerely apologize. > Joe Orozco > "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, > some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature > database 4980 (20100328) __________ > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > http://www.eset.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Mon Mar 29 02:32:00 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 22:32:00 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Not Just Your Average Cane Message-ID: <20100329023200.2291.74806@web2> No worries Joe. I once called my cane Fido because I got sick of people who would ask me if I had a dog. I then responde with "Yes, he's a skinny white lab!" I like yours though. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Hi Mark, > Having started the thread, I feel compelled to respond to your thoughtful > post. It goes without say that people's opinions here do not reflect any > official NFB positions, and I honestly doubt the NFB would genuinely care if > all its members suddenly decided to sport a wide range of colorfully > decorated canes. I think Dr. Maurer would probably find the concept > amusing, and doesn't Whozit sport a black cane in our logo? That fellow was > far ahead of the curve. > For my own part, I'm headed to Michael's sometime soon to embark upon a > project to transform my own cane into the walking wonder I know it can be. > I think that in doing so I would do well to use a measure of practical > sense. Security checkpoints at airports and federal buildings would > probably not look kindly on a cane that is different from what is popularly > accepted. We can't expect the world to automatically get that blind people > have their own sense of pizzazz, and by the same token, we can't expect > people to pick up on the fact we're blind at night if using something as > obscure as a black cane, even though I agree with the previous subscriber > that motorists should respect pedestrians with or without this new breed of > eye candy. > I'm glad people pointed out the jurisdictions that specifically call for the > cane to be white. In asking my question, sarcasm notwithstanding, I was not > really setting out to violate laws that are meant to preserve my safety, but > I do not want these laws to tuck me away into a label that can be every bit > as condescending as terms like "handicapped." If senior citizens can sport > all manner of creatively designed walking canes, by golly, I want my own > mode of transportation to broadcast my own sense of humor. It's not as if I > can smack a bumper sticker on my German shepherd's butt and call it good, > although, can you imagine the wide range of clever slogans one could produce > with that kind of strategic angle? > All of this having been said, I spent nearly a year working on behalf of > victims of human trafficking. I learned all about the negative connotations > associated with words like "pimping," and for using that term to catch your > attention, I am truly sorry. > In summation, I think the responses on both lists to which the question went > out has been mostly positive. It's no scientific survey, but I think it is > at least slightly indicative of the membership's willingness to explore the > idea or at least humor my nonsense. People who have given more > straight-laced responses are no doubt secretly glad they're not the only > ones who thought of this, because original this idea is most certainly not. > Let's leave out the references to accessible currency and other > controversial topics out of it this time around. We debate those serious > issues all the time and should enjoy the all too infrequent light banter. > Best, > Joe Orozco and the Soon to Be Improved Sir Tap-A-Lot > What, as if you haven't ever thought of giving your cane a name??? > "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, > some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > -----Original Message----- > From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org > [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mark BurningHawk > Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:51 PM > To: NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List > Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Pimp My Cane > I'm following this thread, and I know a large percentage of the folks > here are NFB members; I personally a not, nor any organization, for > that matter. I find a bit of hypocrisy in this discussion: First the > NFB rails against things like audible cross walk signals and so on, > claiming that the blind don't need them, that it's not what the blind > "want," whatever. Same with identifiable currency. Now, however, I > hear a bunch of the same people saying, in effect, "I want to carry a > symbol of blindness! I want to proclaim my blindness to everyone so > that they can alter their behaviors appropriately in recognition of > the fact that I'm blind!" I should think the true spirit of the NFB > might be to use a black cane and give no indication whatsoever of > blindness, except on a purely voluntary basis. I just don't > understand this. > Mark BurningHawk > Skype and Twitter: BurningHawk1969 > Home: Http://MarkBurningHawk.net/ > Namaste! > _______________________________________________ > blindlaw mailing list > blindlaw at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for blindlaw: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/jsoroz > co%40gmail.com > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of > virus signature database 4980 (20100328) __________ > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > http://www.eset.com > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature > database 4980 (20100328) __________ > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > http://www.eset.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From brileyp at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 03:00:59 2010 From: brileyp at gmail.com (Briley Pollard) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 22:00:59 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Not Just Your Average Cane In-Reply-To: <04AC544B5C23482BA021D7E070CDA5A4@Rufus> References: <04AC544B5C23482BA021D7E070CDA5A4@Rufus> Message-ID: I'm only responding to comment on the magnificence of the title "Sir Tap-A-Lot". I am greatly amused. Briley On Mar 28, 2010, at 7:33 PM, Joe Orozco wrote: > Hi Mark, > > Having started the thread, I feel compelled to respond to your thoughtful > post. It goes without say that people's opinions here do not reflect any > official NFB positions, and I honestly doubt the NFB would genuinely care if > all its members suddenly decided to sport a wide range of colorfully > decorated canes. I think Dr. Maurer would probably find the concept > amusing, and doesn't Whozit sport a black cane in our logo? That fellow was > far ahead of the curve. > > For my own part, I'm headed to Michael's sometime soon to embark upon a > project to transform my own cane into the walking wonder I know it can be. > I think that in doing so I would do well to use a measure of practical > sense. Security checkpoints at airports and federal buildings would > probably not look kindly on a cane that is different from what is popularly > accepted. We can't expect the world to automatically get that blind people > have their own sense of pizzazz, and by the same token, we can't expect > people to pick up on the fact we're blind at night if using something as > obscure as a black cane, even though I agree with the previous subscriber > that motorists should respect pedestrians with or without this new breed of > eye candy. > > I'm glad people pointed out the jurisdictions that specifically call for the > cane to be white. In asking my question, sarcasm notwithstanding, I was not > really setting out to violate laws that are meant to preserve my safety, but > I do not want these laws to tuck me away into a label that can be every bit > as condescending as terms like "handicapped." If senior citizens can sport > all manner of creatively designed walking canes, by golly, I want my own > mode of transportation to broadcast my own sense of humor. It's not as if I > can smack a bumper sticker on my German shepherd's butt and call it good, > although, can you imagine the wide range of clever slogans one could produce > with that kind of strategic angle? > > All of this having been said, I spent nearly a year working on behalf of > victims of human trafficking. I learned all about the negative connotations > associated with words like "pimping," and for using that term to catch your > attention, I am truly sorry. > > In summation, I think the responses on both lists to which the question went > out has been mostly positive. It's no scientific survey, but I think it is > at least slightly indicative of the membership's willingness to explore the > idea or at least humor my nonsense. People who have given more > straight-laced responses are no doubt secretly glad they're not the only > ones who thought of this, because original this idea is most certainly not. > Let's leave out the references to accessible currency and other > controversial topics out of it this time around. We debate those serious > issues all the time and should enjoy the all too infrequent light banter. > > Best, > > Joe Orozco and the Soon to Be Improved Sir Tap-A-Lot > > What, as if you haven't ever thought of giving your cane a name??? > > "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, > some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > > -----Original Message----- > From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org > [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mark BurningHawk > Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:51 PM > To: NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List > Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Pimp My Cane > > I'm following this thread, and I know a large percentage of the folks > here are NFB members; I personally a not, nor any organization, for > that matter. I find a bit of hypocrisy in this discussion: First the > NFB rails against things like audible cross walk signals and so on, > claiming that the blind don't need them, that it's not what the blind > "want," whatever. Same with identifiable currency. Now, however, I > hear a bunch of the same people saying, in effect, "I want to carry a > symbol of blindness! I want to proclaim my blindness to everyone so > that they can alter their behaviors appropriately in recognition of > the fact that I'm blind!" I should think the true spirit of the NFB > might be to use a black cane and give no indication whatsoever of > blindness, except on a purely voluntary basis. I just don't > understand this. > > Mark BurningHawk > Skype and Twitter: BurningHawk1969 > Home: Http://MarkBurningHawk.net/ > Namaste! > > > _______________________________________________ > blindlaw mailing list > blindlaw at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for blindlaw: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/jsoroz > co%40gmail.com > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of > virus signature database 4980 (20100328) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature > database 4980 (20100328) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com From smwhalenpsp at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 03:19:25 2010 From: smwhalenpsp at gmail.com (Sean Whalen) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 23:19:25 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I hesitate to beat the proverbial dead horse, but I take exception to being directly or indirectly labeled as sexist or a chauvinist. Yes, it was perhaps not the best example to select. No, maybe I shouldn't have jumped on board with that specific example when Mark provided several others that work just as well. But, the fact remains that what Mark has argued is 100% true. Nobody ever at any point claimed to know how being a woman makes one feel or how much anybody in particular does or does not think about the implications on their existence of being of one sex or the other. We were talking about identity and the way in which individuals experience the world. Identity, in one sense, is just a description of a person which individuates that person. In this sense, blindness, sex, skin color, and an infinite list of other attributes are certainly part of one's identity. This is how I think of identity. What I overlooked, and think other people refer to when speaking of identity, is sense of self. I agree with others who have said as much that blindness, sex, etc... play greater or lesser roles in one's identity and that this can vary greatly from person to person. I certainly identify myself as being blind, but it isn't a dominant part of my identity or sense of self. As for the way individuals experience the world, and back to the initial point that Mark made, none of us can know how or to what degree any of our characteristics influence how we experience the world. I'm blind, was never sighted, and therefore have no basis for comparison to experiencing the world in a visual versus nonvisual way. I can guess as to how being blind differs from being sighted, but I can't say with any certainty. Similarly, as a man, I can't say how experiencing the world as a woman differs from my experience. I completely agree that a large majority of the differences and supposed differences between women and men are socially constructed, but the fact remains that there are biological differences that exist. I would think that those differences have at least some affect on how men and women experience the world, but, of course, I can't ever know this. That is the point. If anybody can find anything sexist about that, please explain it to me. Maybe there is something in this point of view that I am overlooking, and if that is the case, I would sincerely like to understand it so I can reexamine some of my assumptions. I really do apologize to anybody who may have taken offense to anything I have said, but in reading it back, I still agree with all of it. To Arielle's point about the notion that some people seem to espouse, namely that blind people shouldn't spend too much time socializing with other blind people, I think she is spot on. Blind friends don't come at the expense of sighted friends and vice versa. Social relations with blind folks and sighted folks are not mutually exclusive. I am wary of anybody who thinks that associating with, befriending, or dating exclusively sighted people is a mark of success. This pretty obviously says something about how the holders of this point of view feel about blind people. Likewise, I think it is not good for a blind person to insist on associating exclusively with blind people. We are all part of a larger society, and it doesn't make a lot of sense to consign yourself to dealing with a small subset of it. I completely understand how it can feel more comfortable and one can feel less conspicuous in a group when being blind is the norm and not an anomaly, but getting outside of one's comfort zone is the only way to expand it. It's difficult to integrate into society on terms of equality with the sighted if we are not willing to take steps toward doing so. Sean From dandrews at visi.com Mon Mar 29 03:20:44 2010 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 22:20:44 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] =?iso-8859-1?q?NFB-NEWSLINE=AE_Announces_New_Flexibility?= =?iso-8859-1?q?_and_More_Choice_in_Managing_Your_Favorites!?= Message-ID: We are now pleased to offer you even more flexibility in using NFB-NEWSLINE®. Taking into account your many suggestions, you can now manage your favorite publications via the Internet, all while enjoying the ability to create different favorite lists, depending on the way you want your content delivered. To further explain this, consider this: In the past, subscribers were limited to having six favorite publications, available via telephone, Web News on Demand, e-mail, or NFB-NEWSLINE® In Your Pocket. Now, you can have an unlimited number of favorites on the Web, with NFB-NEWSLINE® In Your Pocket, or via e-mail. For users who may use several delivery methods now, or who wish to expand the way in which they receive their content, you can create lists of favorites that could be the same or completely different, depending on your preference. Each of the delivery methods is independent of each other. The choice is completely up to you! Please note, however, that current telephone-only users are still limited to six favorites, and no changes or actions will be necessary on your part. We will be reviewing the option to lift the restriction of six publications with a future service enhancement. And that's not all. We have also given you the ability to establish your favorite TV channels over the Web. For those users who are using the telephone only, you can still manage your favorite channels just like you have done in the past. Ready to explore these groundbreaking enhancements? Simply go to www.nfbnewslineonline.org and log in. At the main page, navigate to the link for "Manage All Your Favorites." From this page, you can simply select the appropriate link to manage that favorite delivery method. A few things to remember: If you had not already requested the newspapers by e-mail option, you must complete the online request form found at www.nfbnewsline.org. Follow the link for "Newspapers by E-mail." Also, if you already had favorites established, we have carried these over as a convenience to you, and these publications will show up in the appropriate delivery option. You can modify these as you wish. It's that simple. If you have any questions, please feel free to call us at (866) 504-7300 or e-mail us at nfbnewsline at nfb.org. From mrsmigs at migliorelli.org Mon Mar 29 03:22:48 2010 From: mrsmigs at migliorelli.org (Maryann Migliorelli) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 21:22:48 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane In-Reply-To: <0D32DDCAFC414DD889E321F12E812322@Rufus> References: <0D32DDCAFC414DD889E321F12E812322@Rufus> Message-ID: <001501caceef$1b7fb3e0$527f1ba0$@org> Greetings, Knowing some of the lawyers that I do, they could definitely make that argument stick in court. I don't blame you if you want to paint your cane, but your question should definitely be considered carefully before you do it. I do know someone who has a few support canes which happen to coordinate with her outfits, but her white cane is definitely still white. Have fun with your new one no matter what color it turns out to be. Maryann Migliorelli From marrie12 at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 03:23:41 2010 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 20:23:41 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Not Just Your Average Cane In-Reply-To: <20100329023200.2291.74806@web2> References: <20100329023200.2291.74806@web2> Message-ID: <1B8F1495-D32C-434E-AEBC-77714C78F2B8@gmail.com> Hey I named my cane joseph. Well that one got run over by a wheel chair and joseph junior got smashed in a door so now joseph junior is back. lol. but in all seriousness good luck and be careful when decorating your cane. not to much in my opinion but maybe you could do something that would catch a driver's attention so they could see you better. Take care.. s On Mar 28, 2010, at 7:32 PM, Jedi wrote: > No worries Joe. I once called my cane Fido because I got sick of people who would ask me if I had a dog. I then responde with "Yes, he's a skinny white lab!" I like yours though. > > Respectfully, > Jedi > > > Original message: >> Hi Mark, > >> Having started the thread, I feel compelled to respond to your thoughtful >> post. It goes without say that people's opinions here do not reflect any >> official NFB positions, and I honestly doubt the NFB would genuinely care if >> all its members suddenly decided to sport a wide range of colorfully >> decorated canes. I think Dr. Maurer would probably find the concept >> amusing, and doesn't Whozit sport a black cane in our logo? That fellow was >> far ahead of the curve. > >> For my own part, I'm headed to Michael's sometime soon to embark upon a >> project to transform my own cane into the walking wonder I know it can be. >> I think that in doing so I would do well to use a measure of practical >> sense. Security checkpoints at airports and federal buildings would >> probably not look kindly on a cane that is different from what is popularly >> accepted. We can't expect the world to automatically get that blind people >> have their own sense of pizzazz, and by the same token, we can't expect >> people to pick up on the fact we're blind at night if using something as >> obscure as a black cane, even though I agree with the previous subscriber >> that motorists should respect pedestrians with or without this new breed of >> eye candy. > >> I'm glad people pointed out the jurisdictions that specifically call for the >> cane to be white. In asking my question, sarcasm notwithstanding, I was not >> really setting out to violate laws that are meant to preserve my safety, but >> I do not want these laws to tuck me away into a label that can be every bit >> as condescending as terms like "handicapped." If senior citizens can sport >> all manner of creatively designed walking canes, by golly, I want my own >> mode of transportation to broadcast my own sense of humor. It's not as if I >> can smack a bumper sticker on my German shepherd's butt and call it good, >> although, can you imagine the wide range of clever slogans one could produce >> with that kind of strategic angle? > >> All of this having been said, I spent nearly a year working on behalf of >> victims of human trafficking. I learned all about the negative connotations >> associated with words like "pimping," and for using that term to catch your >> attention, I am truly sorry. > >> In summation, I think the responses on both lists to which the question went >> out has been mostly positive. It's no scientific survey, but I think it is >> at least slightly indicative of the membership's willingness to explore the >> idea or at least humor my nonsense. People who have given more >> straight-laced responses are no doubt secretly glad they're not the only >> ones who thought of this, because original this idea is most certainly not. >> Let's leave out the references to accessible currency and other >> controversial topics out of it this time around. We debate those serious >> issues all the time and should enjoy the all too infrequent light banter. > >> Best, > >> Joe Orozco and the Soon to Be Improved Sir Tap-A-Lot > >> What, as if you haven't ever thought of giving your cane a name??? > >> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their sleeves, >> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org >> [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mark BurningHawk >> Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:51 PM >> To: NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List >> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Pimp My Cane > >> I'm following this thread, and I know a large percentage of the folks >> here are NFB members; I personally a not, nor any organization, for >> that matter. I find a bit of hypocrisy in this discussion: First the >> NFB rails against things like audible cross walk signals and so on, >> claiming that the blind don't need them, that it's not what the blind >> "want," whatever. Same with identifiable currency. Now, however, I >> hear a bunch of the same people saying, in effect, "I want to carry a >> symbol of blindness! I want to proclaim my blindness to everyone so >> that they can alter their behaviors appropriately in recognition of >> the fact that I'm blind!" I should think the true spirit of the NFB >> might be to use a black cane and give no indication whatsoever of >> blindness, except on a purely voluntary basis. I just don't >> understand this. > >> Mark BurningHawk >> Skype and Twitter: BurningHawk1969 >> Home: Http://MarkBurningHawk.net/ >> Namaste! > > >> _______________________________________________ >> blindlaw mailing list >> blindlaw at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for blindlaw: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/jsoroz >> co%40gmail.com > > >> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of >> virus signature database 4980 (20100328) __________ > >> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > >> http://www.eset.com > > > >> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature >> database 4980 (20100328) __________ > >> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > >> http://www.eset.com > > > >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com From mrsmigs at migliorelli.org Mon Mar 29 03:35:38 2010 From: mrsmigs at migliorelli.org (Maryann Migliorelli) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 21:35:38 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] naming your cane Message-ID: <001901cacef0$e6687a00$b3396e00$@org> I'm sure that at the next NAGDU meeting, I will be forced to say, "Hi, My name is Maryann, and I have a long, white cane whose name is Edith." Why Edith you may ask. Edith means extended device for identification by touch of hazards. Enjoy that one for what it's worth, and have a great week. Maryann Migliorelli From anjelinac26 at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 05:41:37 2010 From: anjelinac26 at gmail.com (anjelinac26 at gmail.com) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 01:41:37 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] naming your cane In-Reply-To: <001901cacef0$e6687a00$b3396e00$@org> References: <001901cacef0$e6687a00$b3396e00$@org> Message-ID: <1E92192B-DE5A-460D-B0E5-7C8F27BF52C4@gmail.com> I love the humor brought to this discussion. Is there a law which states a cane must be a certain color? The Nfb canes don't have the reflective tape the amvutech canes have. Cane decorating sounds like fun. Anjelina Sent from my iPhone On Mar 28, 2010, at 11:35 PM, "Maryann Migliorelli" wrote: > I'm sure that at the next NAGDU meeting, I will be forced to say, > "Hi, My > name is Maryann, and I have a long, white cane whose name is > Edith." Why > Edith you may ask. Edith means extended device for identification > by touch > of hazards. > > Enjoy that one for what it's worth, and have a great week. > > Maryann Migliorelli > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info > for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/anjelinac26%40gmail.com From daydreamingncolor at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 05:52:46 2010 From: daydreamingncolor at gmail.com (Aziza Cano) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 23:52:46 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] naming your cane References: <001901cacef0$e6687a00$b3396e00$@org> <1E92192B-DE5A-460D-B0E5-7C8F27BF52C4@gmail.com> Message-ID: <07E54671C7404EB4A1449A5468D3224E@azizaLatD430> My folding cane was named Fred. When I transitioned to a straight white cane it became named Alfred. (My friends get to name my canes, I think they have an obsession with the name Fred.) ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Cc: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 11:41 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] naming your cane >I love the humor brought to this discussion. Is there a law which states a >cane must be a certain color? The Nfb canes don't have the reflective tape >the amvutech canes have. Cane decorating sounds like fun. > > > Anjelina > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 28, 2010, at 11:35 PM, "Maryann Migliorelli" > > wrote: > >> I'm sure that at the next NAGDU meeting, I will be forced to say, "Hi, >> My >> name is Maryann, and I have a long, white cane whose name is Edith." >> Why >> Edith you may ask. Edith means extended device for identification by >> touch >> of hazards. >> >> Enjoy that one for what it's worth, and have a great week. >> >> Maryann Migliorelli >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/anjelinac26%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/daydreamingncolor%40gmail.com From marrie12 at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 07:05:58 2010 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 00:05:58 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] naming your cane In-Reply-To: <001901cacef0$e6687a00$b3396e00$@org> References: <001901cacef0$e6687a00$b3396e00$@org> Message-ID: Hey not a bad idea. Mine is named jjoseph as I love that name so much. On Mar 28, 2010, at 8:35 PM, Maryann Migliorelli wrote: > I'm sure that at the next NAGDU meeting, I will be forced to say, "Hi, My > name is Maryann, and I have a long, white cane whose name is Edith." Why > Edith you may ask. Edith means extended device for identification by touch > of hazards. > > Enjoy that one for what it's worth, and have a great week. > > Maryann Migliorelli > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com From marrie12 at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 07:06:38 2010 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 00:06:38 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] naming your cane In-Reply-To: <1E92192B-DE5A-460D-B0E5-7C8F27BF52C4@gmail.com> References: <001901cacef0$e6687a00$b3396e00$@org> <1E92192B-DE5A-460D-B0E5-7C8F27BF52C4@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hmm not sure about the law but I'd think white is standard as it is sceen by drivers or should be anyways. On Mar 28, 2010, at 10:41 PM, anjelinac26 at gmail.com wrote: > I love the humor brought to this discussion. Is there a law which states a cane must be a certain color? The Nfb canes don't have the reflective tape the amvutech canes have. Cane decorating sounds like fun. > > > Anjelina > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 28, 2010, at 11:35 PM, "Maryann Migliorelli" wrote: > >> I'm sure that at the next NAGDU meeting, I will be forced to say, "Hi, My >> name is Maryann, and I have a long, white cane whose name is Edith." Why >> Edith you may ask. Edith means extended device for identification by touch >> of hazards. >> >> Enjoy that one for what it's worth, and have a great week. >> >> Maryann Migliorelli >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/anjelinac26%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Mon Mar 29 07:25:25 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 03:25:25 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane Message-ID: <20100329072525.17857.17732@web3> It seems to me the question we should be asking is why canes are white in the first place. Originally, the cane was painted white as a way of telling drivers to stop for the blind. It was a member of the Lions Club that had the idea in the first place because he observed a blind man having difficulty in crossing a street because there was too much traffic. Now, we say that the white cane makes it easier to see us and so cars are required to stop. It is also worth noting that cars are supposed to stop for all pedestrians. So what we are saying is that blind people need more notice. Why? I agree that until electric cars make noise, they do need to stop for us because we can't hear them. But again, they should stop for everyone because no one can really hear them. The white cane laws are civil rights laws that basically say that blind people cannot be automatically held accountable for any injuries that occur to them based on the idea that they should know better than to be out in the world in the first place. Are we now saying that if the cane isn't white so people know we're blind, then any accidents that occur as a result are our fault? White cane laws require that blind people should be treated as anyone else whether injuries occur or not. The white cane laws also say that a blind person shall not be discriminated against as we travel in the world. Really and truly, the laws were meant to protect the person, not the cane itself. What I'm getting at is this. The white cane is currently a symbol by which the sighted recognize us by, and that symbol tells the sighted that they need to treat us a certain way. . Would things really change if we changed the colors of our canes? Or would attitudes have to change because now we're saying that it really isn't the responsibility of the sighted to look out for the blind specifically? What do you think? Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Greetings, Knowing some of the lawyers that I do, they could definitely > make that argument stick in court. > I don't blame you if you want to paint your cane, but your question should > definitely be considered carefully before you do it. > I do know someone who has a few support canes which happen to coordinate > with her outfits, but her white cane is definitely still white. > Have fun with your new one no matter what color it turns out to be. > Maryann Migliorelli > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca Mon Mar 29 08:40:22 2010 From: sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca (Sarah Jevnikar) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 04:40:22 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane In-Reply-To: <20100329072525.17857.17732@web3> References: <20100329072525.17857.17732@web3> Message-ID: <000401cacf1b$796f14b0$6c4d3e10$@jevnikar@utoronto.ca> Hi all, I used to decorate my cane for every season or holiday when I was younger and I think it's a cool idea but I have different concerns. I'm sorry; I feel like a party pooper but here they are. Decorated canes are fun but what do they say about us? Unprofessional comes to mind, as most of us are at the age where we're looking for summer or full-time employment. But perhaps temporary decorations would be ok ... Now on a different note, a cane spans from the belt area (and purse area too, depending on your preference or length of strap) to a person's shoes. So, which should it match? Belt/purse or shoes? Or should they all coordinate? Just something to ponder. Sarah Jevnikar -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 3:25 AM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane It seems to me the question we should be asking is why canes are white in the first place. Originally, the cane was painted white as a way of telling drivers to stop for the blind. It was a member of the Lions Club that had the idea in the first place because he observed a blind man having difficulty in crossing a street because there was too much traffic. Now, we say that the white cane makes it easier to see us and so cars are required to stop. It is also worth noting that cars are supposed to stop for all pedestrians. So what we are saying is that blind people need more notice. Why? I agree that until electric cars make noise, they do need to stop for us because we can't hear them. But again, they should stop for everyone because no one can really hear them. The white cane laws are civil rights laws that basically say that blind people cannot be automatically held accountable for any injuries that occur to them based on the idea that they should know better than to be out in the world in the first place. Are we now saying that if the cane isn't white so people know we're blind, then any accidents that occur as a result are our fault? White cane laws require that blind people should be treated as anyone else whether injuries occur or not. The white cane laws also say that a blind person shall not be discriminated against as we travel in the world. Really and truly, the laws were meant to protect the person, not the cane itself. What I'm getting at is this. The white cane is currently a symbol by which the sighted recognize us by, and that symbol tells the sighted that they need to treat us a certain way. . Would things really change if we changed the colors of our canes? Or would attitudes have to change because now we're saying that it really isn't the responsibility of the sighted to look out for the blind specifically? What do you think? Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > Greetings, Knowing some of the lawyers that I do, they could definitely > make that argument stick in court. > I don't blame you if you want to paint your cane, but your question should > definitely be considered carefully before you do it. > I do know someone who has a few support canes which happen to coordinate > with her outfits, but her white cane is definitely still white. > Have fun with your new one no matter what color it turns out to be. > Maryann Migliorelli > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo bile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto ronto.ca From brileyp at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 10:47:01 2010 From: brileyp at gmail.com (Briley Pollard) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 05:47:01 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I, personally, wasn't disagreeing that there are differences between men and women, and that these may impact how one experiences the world. The problem was that simply being a woman wasn't the example used, it was our "ability to give birth" that was. Yes, I identify with being a woman, and I have no problem with that aspect of myself being a part of my identity. But the ability to give birth does not a woman make, and that was what I took exception with, personally. On Mar 28, 2010, at 10:19 PM, Sean Whalen wrote: > I hesitate to beat the proverbial dead horse, but I take exception to being > directly or indirectly labeled as sexist or a chauvinist. > > Yes, it was perhaps not the best example to select. No, maybe I shouldn't > have jumped on board with that specific example when Mark provided several > others that work just as well. But, the fact remains that what Mark has > argued is 100% true. Nobody ever at any point claimed to know how being a > woman makes one feel or how much anybody in particular does or does not > think about the implications on their existence of being of one sex or the > other. > > We were talking about identity and the way in which individuals experience > the world. Identity, in one sense, is just a description of a person which > individuates that person. In this sense, blindness, sex, skin color, and an > infinite list of other attributes are certainly part of one's identity. This > is how I think of identity. What I overlooked, and think other people refer > to when speaking of identity, is sense of self. I agree with others who have > said as much that blindness, sex, etc... play greater or lesser roles in > one's identity and that this can vary greatly from person to person. I > certainly identify myself as being blind, but it isn't a dominant part of my > identity or sense of self. > > As for the way individuals experience the world, and back to the initial > point that Mark made, none of us can know how or to what degree any of our > characteristics influence how we experience the world. I'm blind, was never > sighted, and therefore have no basis for comparison to experiencing the > world in a visual versus nonvisual way. I can guess as to how being blind > differs from being sighted, but I can't say with any certainty. Similarly, > as a man, I can't say how experiencing the world as a woman differs from my > experience. I completely agree that a large majority of the differences and > supposed differences between women and men are socially constructed, but the > fact remains that there are biological differences that exist. I would think > that those differences have at least some affect on how men and women > experience the world, but, of course, I can't ever know this. That is the > point. If anybody can find anything sexist about that, please explain it to > me. Maybe there is something in this point of view that I am overlooking, > and if that is the case, I would sincerely like to understand it so I can > reexamine some of my assumptions. > > I really do apologize to anybody who may have taken offense to anything I > have said, but in reading it back, I still agree with all of it. > > To Arielle's point about the notion that some people seem to espouse, namely > that blind people shouldn't spend too much time socializing with other blind > people, I think she is spot on. Blind friends don't come at the expense of > sighted friends and vice versa. Social relations with blind folks and > sighted folks are not mutually exclusive. I am wary of anybody who thinks > that associating with, befriending, or dating exclusively sighted people is > a mark of success. This pretty obviously says something about how the > holders of this point of view feel about blind people. Likewise, I think it > is not good for a blind person to insist on associating exclusively with > blind people. We are all part of a larger society, and it doesn't make a lot > of sense to consign yourself to dealing with a small subset of it. I > completely understand how it can feel more comfortable and one can feel less > conspicuous in a group when being blind is the norm and not an anomaly, but > getting outside of one's comfort zone is the only way to expand it. It's > difficult to integrate into society on terms of equality with the sighted if > we are not willing to take steps toward doing so. > > Sean > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com From brileyp at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 10:50:50 2010 From: brileyp at gmail.com (Briley Pollard) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 05:50:50 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] naming your cane In-Reply-To: <07E54671C7404EB4A1449A5468D3224E@azizaLatD430> References: <001901cacef0$e6687a00$b3396e00$@org> <1E92192B-DE5A-460D-B0E5-7C8F27BF52C4@gmail.com> <07E54671C7404EB4A1449A5468D3224E@azizaLatD430> Message-ID: <723887C8-762E-425B-8B0E-6C5D04EB7C62@gmail.com> My canes have always been called Mr. Stick or Mr. Tap-it, (but the implications of the ladder weren't always understood, so I haven't used that one lately). Briley On Mar 29, 2010, at 12:52 AM, Aziza Cano wrote: > My folding cane was named Fred. When I transitioned to a straight white cane it became named Alfred. (My friends get to name my canes, I think they have an obsession with the name Fred.) > ----- Original Message ----- From: > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > Cc: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 11:41 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] naming your cane > > >> I love the humor brought to this discussion. Is there a law which states a cane must be a certain color? The Nfb canes don't have the reflective tape the amvutech canes have. Cane decorating sounds like fun. >> >> >> Anjelina >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 28, 2010, at 11:35 PM, "Maryann Migliorelli" > > wrote: >> >>> I'm sure that at the next NAGDU meeting, I will be forced to say, "Hi, My >>> name is Maryann, and I have a long, white cane whose name is Edith." Why >>> Edith you may ask. Edith means extended device for identification by touch >>> of hazards. >>> >>> Enjoy that one for what it's worth, and have a great week. >>> >>> Maryann Migliorelli >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/anjelinac26%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/daydreamingncolor%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com From brileyp at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 10:52:26 2010 From: brileyp at gmail.com (Briley Pollard) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 05:52:26 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane In-Reply-To: <000401cacf1b$796f14b0$6c4d3e10$@jevnikar@utoronto.ca> References: <20100329072525.17857.17732@web3> <000401cacf1b$796f14b0$6c4d3e10$@jevnikar@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: I did consider the matching with purse and shoes aspect too... but maybe that is because I'm admittedly a bit overly conscious of things matching. On Mar 29, 2010, at 3:40 AM, Sarah Jevnikar wrote: > Hi all, > I used to decorate my cane for every season or holiday when I was younger > and I think it's a cool idea but I have different concerns. > > I'm sorry; I feel like a party pooper but here they are. > > Decorated canes are fun but what do they say about us? Unprofessional comes > to mind, as most of us are at the age where we're looking for summer or > full-time employment. But perhaps temporary decorations would be ok ... > > Now on a different note, a cane spans from the belt area (and purse area > too, depending on your preference or length of strap) to a person's shoes. > So, which should it match? Belt/purse or shoes? Or should they all > coordinate? > > Just something to ponder. > > Sarah Jevnikar > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of Jedi > Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 3:25 AM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane > > It seems to me the question we should be asking is why canes are white > in the first place. > > Originally, the cane was painted white as a way of telling drivers to > stop for the blind. It was a member of the Lions Club that had the idea > in the first place because he observed a blind man having difficulty in > crossing a street because there was too much traffic. Now, we say that > the white cane makes it easier to see us and so cars are required to > stop. It is also worth noting that cars are supposed to stop for all > pedestrians. So what we are saying is that blind people need more > notice. Why? I agree that until electric cars make noise, they do need > to stop for us because we can't hear them. But again, they should stop > for everyone because no one can really hear them. > > The white cane laws are civil rights laws that basically say that blind > people cannot be automatically held accountable for any injuries that > occur to them based on the idea that they should know better than to be > out in the world in the first place. Are we now saying that if the cane > isn't white so people know we're blind, then any accidents that occur > as a result are our fault? White cane laws require that blind people > should be treated as anyone else whether injuries occur or not. The > white cane laws also say that a blind person shall not be discriminated > against as we travel in the world. Really and truly, the laws were > meant to protect the person, not the cane itself. > > What I'm getting at is this. The white cane is currently a symbol by > which the sighted recognize us by, and that symbol tells the sighted > that they need to treat us a certain way. . Would things really change > if we changed the colors of our canes? Or would attitudes have to > change because now we're saying that it really isn't the responsibility > of the sighted to look out for the blind specifically? What do you think? > > Respectfully, > Jedi > > > Original message: >> Greetings, Knowing some of the lawyers that I do, they could definitely >> make that argument stick in court. >> I don't blame you if you want to paint your cane, but your question should >> definitely be considered carefully before you do it. >> I do know someone who has a few support canes which happen to coordinate >> with her outfits, but her white cane is definitely still white. > >> Have fun with your new one no matter what color it turns out to be. >> Maryann Migliorelli > > > > >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo > bile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit > www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto > ronto.ca > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com From brileyp at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 10:55:53 2010 From: brileyp at gmail.com (Briley Pollard) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 05:55:53 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane In-Reply-To: <20100329072525.17857.17732@web3> References: <20100329072525.17857.17732@web3> Message-ID: While your points are interesting, I'd like to interject that, (at night), when people are out walking or biking, it is generally hoped that they will wear clothing that drivers will easily be able to see. I've heard several of my friends complain when driving at night that people go jogging or biking while wearing dark clothes, and it makes them difficult to see. I'm not disputing your points, but wanted to point this out. Unrelatedly, it is too early to be alive, and I'm too tired to be an effective typist, so please excuse any grievous errors on my part. Briley On Mar 29, 2010, at 2:25 AM, Jedi wrote: > It seems to me the question we should be asking is why canes are white in the first place. > > Originally, the cane was painted white as a way of telling drivers to stop for the blind. It was a member of the Lions Club that had the idea in the first place because he observed a blind man having difficulty in crossing a street because there was too much traffic. Now, we say that the white cane makes it easier to see us and so cars are required to stop. It is also worth noting that cars are supposed to stop for all pedestrians. So what we are saying is that blind people need more notice. Why? I agree that until electric cars make noise, they do need to stop for us because we can't hear them. But again, they should stop for everyone because no one can really hear them. > > The white cane laws are civil rights laws that basically say that blind people cannot be automatically held accountable for any injuries that occur to them based on the idea that they should know better than to be out in the world in the first place. Are we now saying that if the cane isn't white so people know we're blind, then any accidents that occur as a result are our fault? White cane laws require that blind people should be treated as anyone else whether injuries occur or not. The white cane laws also say that a blind person shall not be discriminated against as we travel in the world. Really and truly, the laws were meant to protect the person, not the cane itself. > > What I'm getting at is this. The white cane is currently a symbol by which the sighted recognize us by, and that symbol tells the sighted that they need to treat us a certain way. . Would things really change if we changed the colors of our canes? Or would attitudes have to change because now we're saying that it really isn't the responsibility of the sighted to look out for the blind specifically? What do you think? > > Respectfully, > Jedi > > > Original message: >> Greetings, Knowing some of the lawyers that I do, they could definitely >> make that argument stick in court. >> I don't blame you if you want to paint your cane, but your question should >> definitely be considered carefully before you do it. >> I do know someone who has a few support canes which happen to coordinate >> with her outfits, but her white cane is definitely still white. > >> Have fun with your new one no matter what color it turns out to be. >> Maryann Migliorelli > > > > >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com From raniaismail04 at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 12:49:08 2010 From: raniaismail04 at gmail.com (Rania ) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 07:49:08 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] naming your cane In-Reply-To: <1E92192B-DE5A-460D-B0E5-7C8F27BF52C4@gmail.com> References: <001901cacef0$e6687a00$b3396e00$@org> <1E92192B-DE5A-460D-B0E5-7C8F27BF52C4@gmail.com> Message-ID: <406373D3C197456C8687A7F6C91EBAA8@RainaIsmailPC> Yes that sounds like a great idea! Rania, -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of anjelinac26 at gmail.com Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 12:42 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Cc: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] naming your cane I love the humor brought to this discussion. Is there a law which states a cane must be a certain color? The Nfb canes don't have the reflective tape the amvutech canes have. Cane decorating sounds like fun. Anjelina Sent from my iPhone On Mar 28, 2010, at 11:35 PM, "Maryann Migliorelli" wrote: > I'm sure that at the next NAGDU meeting, I will be forced to say, "Hi, > My name is Maryann, and I have a long, white cane whose name is > Edith." Why Edith you may ask. Edith means extended device for > identification by touch of hazards. > > Enjoy that one for what it's worth, and have a great week. > > Maryann Migliorelli > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/anjelinac26%40 > gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai l.com No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.791 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2776 - Release Date: 03/28/10 13:32:00 From iamantonio at cox.net Mon Mar 29 12:40:24 2010 From: iamantonio at cox.net (Antonio M. Guimaraes) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 08:40:24 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity References: <20100327224551.10634.30883@web3> <85ff10071003271718k3d38461ci1879321397fbff1e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Arielle, Thank you for your observations, and re-focus on this topic. I am blind, will always be blind, and will never remove myself from blindness-related activities. My brothers are blind, my very significant other is blind, and I am very involved in the work of the NFB in my state. I am connected to blindness as part of my very identity. To me, and others might argue the point, blindness defines who I am, but does not as a rule limit what I do. I read Braille, am a member of the NLS talking books program, worked for national braille Press, use Jaws, Kurzweil, and the Franklin talking dictionary. These are tools at my disposal, and though the tools themselves don't define what I do, they are how I do things. I have certain beliefs about what blindness is, and is not, and I try to the best of my ability to carry on with as a competent blind man. I don't simply happen to be blind, I am blind, and a not ashamed to be so. That is just an expression of me, from me. I am connected to blindness in a significant way. As to working in the blindness field, I've done it, and if I have to, will do it again. Not as a chore, but as a means of income, and job satisfaction. Blind people need to be successful members of society, and not segregate themselves around teaching or working with the blind.. If that is what one wants to do, there is plenty of room for employment in blindness-related professions. I think we need that. But my career choices and interests are not restricted to my characteristic as a blind person. I wish to be a successful, working man. To be quite honest, one probably does not have much an opportunity to make say, a six figure salary working in the blindness field. The opportunity is not there, from how I see it in my limited knowledge of salary and compensation. I don't measure success by the number of zeros at the end of my pay check, but I have chosen a path outside blindness. I am not interested, and for the most part want my success to be recognized by society at large. To work and to give of oneself is an honorable thing, but to be recognized as capable by the community at large speaks volumes to your ability to functions as a fully-contributing individual. Besides, most blind people will find success outside of the blindness professions, simply by the limited number of jobs that exist in that arena. I think my desire to want to be more in the community, and a little less in the blind community is a reflection of NFB philosophy. If I view blindness as a characteristic, I am likely to focus on more important things, since a mere characteristic is not so important as principle, or one's goals. I surely would never spend time with work in the field of an insignificant characteristic. I don't belong, and would feel funny about belonging to the parents of the green-eyed international. I would not want to focus my attention, are rarely thing about the fact that I have green eyes. It's a characteristic. Either blindness is a characteristic about which we make no fuss, or it is something bigger. If it's something bigger, perhaps Jernigan was wrong, or we take him out of context. My work in the blindness community is very important to me. Ask those close to me how much I do, and how I enjoy working in the NFB, and you'll think they are talking about another person, not the one writing this post. Why. Not because I am a hypocrite, but because I realize there needs to be a balance in how we spend our time. If I am blind, and have only blind friends, and promote only the blindness cause, I can surely be called narrow-minded, and not very dynamic. If all I can talk about is blindness policy, and not politics and a wider range of the body of human knowledge and affairs, you can count me as a little stagnant. I see Arielle's example of having mostly blind friends, getting training, and growing her social circle to include a sighted boyfriend, and others as progressing out of her comfort zone, and finding acceptance in the more immediate world around her. These are people she will be working with and for, so it is a very good thing that she find her place beyond the one she holds in our midst. I will likely not stop working for the blindness cause, but to spend all of my time in NFB meetings, as I believed Arielle mentioned, is an imbalance. It all comes to choice. Some will never leave their homes and rocking chairs. Some will stay attached to blindness organizations as a main course of action. Some will balance their time and priorities, and some will want nothing to do with the blindness organizations. Some will choose to work as braille teachers, or Social Studies teachers. Some, and by far not most, will direct and help run a training center for the blind, while others will be managers and directors of mainstream organizations. You reader will hopefully take up post in the profession you chose, or the one where opportunity presents itself, and I hope you feel fulfilled regardless of the kind of organization for which you choose to do good work. Sincerely, Antonio Guimaraes If an infinite number of rednecks riding in an infinite number of pickup trucks fire an infinite number of shotgun rounds at an infinite number of highway signs, they will eventually produce all the world's great literary works in Braille. Shop online and support the NFB of RI at no additional cost to you. http://www.givebackamerica.com/charity.php?b=169 Givebackamerica.org, America's Online Charity Shopping Mall ----- Original Message ----- From: "Arielle Silverman" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 8:18 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity > Hi all, > > With all due respect to the discussions thus far regarding the > components of identity and culture, I'd like to steer the conversation > a little closer to what we originally started with when we were > talking about belonging, or lack thereof, in the sighted world, > joining student clubs, etc. I am curious--Is there such a thing as > "over-identifying" with blindness or spending too much time with blind > people? Does spending time with blind people necessarily take away > from how much time and energy you can put into relationships with the > sighted? Or, is it possible to simultaneously feel a strong connection > with other blind people and still engage in productive connections > with sighted people at work, and have healthy social connections with > sighted people as well? > > I tend to take the latter view, and am a little saddened when people > make comments to the effect that we should spend less time with other > blind people in order to achieve our goal of integration, as if the > two objectives are mutually exclusive. Sometimes I think people (blind > and sighted alike) have the implicit assumption that relationships > with sighted people are somehow superior to relationships we have with > the blind, and that it's to our advantage to, for example, avoid > spending all our time at NFB meetings, or try not to work in the > blindness field on principle, or to only date sighted people. Of > course, people differ in the extremity of these views. But I do think > it's entirely possible and healthy to juggle a strong "blind identity" > with the other identities and connections we have in the world, > without taking away from either one. > > I'm interested to hear your views about this, but I'd like to close > with a concrete example. When I was in high school and college, most > of my close friends were blind. I often felt, as many of you have > described, that I could only sustain casual relationships with sighted > people, but that I could only feel the deep, reciprocal connections I > had with other blind people. When I started graduate school, after > receiving blindness training at LCB and being a member and leader in > NABS for five years, I finally began to perceive that my fellow > students, who were all sighted, didn't care much about my blindness > and were for the most part able to treat me like anyone else. I have > been dating a sighted guy for the past year, which is something I > never thought would happen, and with him I feel the same kind of > reciprocal intimacy that I thought I could only have with other blind > people. My point in disclosing all that is that I honestly don't think > I would have reached this level of confidence and belonging in my > sighted community if I hadn't had the strong, affirming relationships > that I had for so many years with my blind friends. Around other blind > people I felt normal and capable, and was able to become a > reciprocating partner and a leader. I had to be able to do those > things and practice them over time before I could go into the > uncertainty of a new sighted community with the right social skills > and confidence to integrate and build new connections, including > finding my boyfriend. It's just something to think about. > > Arielle > > On 3/27/10, Marc Workman wrote: >> This will be the fourth time that I've clarified what I said, but what I >> said keeps getting distorted, so I'll try one more time. >> >> Jedi said, >> two men would insist that I perceive myself differently because I can >> give >> birth. >> >> I've read every message on this subject, and I didn't read one man, let >> alone two, say anything like that. >> >> How on earth could anyone know how you perceive yourself? I certainly >> don't, >> and I have never said that I did. For the record, I have no idea how >> Jedi >> perceives herself. I only know that she says that she doesn't give much >> thought to her ability to give birth, and I don't question that at all. >> But >> that is just not the issue that is being discussed. How you perceive >> yourself has nothing to do with this. Identity is much more than just >> how >> you perceive yourself. Your ability to perceive, how you perceive, what >> you >> perceive, these are all already influenced by your identity. So whether >> or >> not you think about a particular feature of yourself does not alone >> determine whether it is or is not a part of your identity. >> >> I truly regret bringing up the ability to give birth. There is way too >> much >> bagage that comes with a discussion of that topic, and I clearly offended >> some people, which I had no intention of doing. The fact that I'm a man >> makes my bringing it up all the more problematic for some. I tried to >> choose my words carefully, including the clarification that I was in no >> way >> suggesting that women are defined by this ability, but even this wasn't >> enough to avoid the bagage, which is fine, I get that. It was a bad >> example, but the disappointing thing is that so much energy has been >> focused >> on this one example that it has over-shadowed what could have been a >> deeper >> discussion of blindness and identity. That is unfortunate and makes me >> really wish I had never mentioned it. >> >> No hard feelings I hope. >> >> Marc >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]On >> Behalf Of Jedi >> Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 4:46 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Identity >> >> >> Briley, >> >> I'm glad you said something because it took me a while to understand >> why I replied so snarkily last time. I realized that I felt incensed >> that two men would insist that I perceive myself differently because I >> can give birth. To me, it was as bad as if some sighted person got on >> list and told us all that our lack of eyesight shapes how we see >> ourselves. Some would say yes, and others would say no. For those who >> would say no, I think we'd feel pretty frustrated because it would be >> almost like that sighted person was telling us that because they saw us >> differently because we're blind, so should we regardless if we do or >> not. What frustrated me most is that I twice said that, in my >> experience of not being a mother, I didn't think much about my ability >> to have children and yet I felt argued with as though someone who saw >> themselves as having more authority on the topic, a man, had the final >> authority on how I felt about myself as a woman. It was so frustrating. >> And you're quite right that men probably don't think about their >> ability to be part of the procreation process any more or less than we >> do. Same goes for sighted people. I've heard sighted people say that >> they don't realize how much they take for granted, and that's quite >> true. They mean to say that they feel sorry for us, but the fact is >> that they really have no idea how much privilege they have in society >> just as many in a given "superior" (in quotes) class don't. Thanks >> again for your comments. >> >> Respectfully, >> Jedi >> >> >> Original message: >>> Jedi, >> >>> I thought you handled the issue of giving birth quite capably. I am not >>> a mother yet, so no, I don't think about my ability to pop out kids as >>> a big part of who I am... or really ponder it as a part of identity at >>> all. Do you men see your ability to participate in making children as a >>> part of your identity? Probably not. So, it is semi chauvinist of you >>> to assume we are attached to our uterus as a part of us that gives us >>> self worth. >> >>> Briley >> >> >> >>> On Mar 27, 2010, at 3:55 AM, Jedi wrote: >> >>>> Well, if we want to get down to brass tacks, we can all say that we >>>> will never know just how our being is affects our perceptions, but the >>>> bottom line still lies at the fact that our perception of our beingness >>>> is largely determine by what our culture teaches us about it, and >>>> identity is the presentation of how we respond to those teachings in >>>> our interactions with ourselves and others. >> >>>> I think it's interesting that two men have been interested in whether >>>> or not I see myself differently because I can give birth yet no women >>>> have weighed in on the subject. I also think they're more interesting >>>> in my birthing abilities than I am. Well gentlemen, you're welcome to >>>> those abilities so long as you're willing to take the identity that >>>> comes with them. *tongue in cheek* >> >>>> Respectfully, >>>> Jedi >> >> >> >>>> Original message: >>>>> The point is that without ever having had the experience of being a >>>>> man, >> you >>>>> cannot say for sure that your being a woman does or does not have an >> impact >>>>> on how you see yourself or experience the world. I suspect it does, >>>>> but >>>>> without any basis for comparison, you can't say. Just as my being >>>>> blind >> from >>>>> birth prohibits me from determining whether or not or to what degree >>>>> my >>>>> blindness affects how I view myself and experience the world. My gut >> feeling >>>>> is that my blindness has a fairly profound affect on at least a >> significant >>>>> subset of the things I experience and the way in which I experience >> them. >> >>>>> Blindness is absolutely part of my identity, as is my height, skin >>>>> color >> and >>>>> love of the Chicago Cubs. Your identity is just an exhaustive list of >> all of >>>>> the characteristics and attributes which make a particular person the >>>>> particular person that they are. >> >>>>> To what degree I identify myself as blind or identify with the greater >>>>> community of blind people is a completely separate question from that >>>>> of >>>>> whether or not blindness is part of my identity. >> >>>>> I don't think blindness, strictly defined, is a social construct, >>>>> while >> I >>>>> think the concept of disability is. I'm sure that to articulate my >> reasons >>>>> for feeling this way would require more time than I am willing to put >> into >>>>> it now, but that is my gut feeling. >> >>>>> Thought I'd throw my two cents into this interesting discussion. >> >>>>> All the best, >> >>>>> Sean >> >> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>>>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >> bile.net >> >>>> -- >>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com >> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >> bile.net >> >> -- >> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gma >> il.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Arielle Silverman > President, National Association of Blind Students > Phone: 602-502-2255 > Email: > nabs.president at gmail.com > Website: > www.nabslink.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/iamantonio%40cox.net From clb5590 at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 15:33:02 2010 From: clb5590 at gmail.com (Cindy Bennett) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 11:33:02 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] studying abroad Message-ID: <3fea3c411003290833l179ed83ajcebbe63d09b65bce@mail.gmail.com> At the NC student seminar, a couple of students had questions about studying abroad as a blind person, and there was no one present with experience, so i said i would ask around. I also had someone ask about it in an lj community i am in, so, i was curious if those of you, particularly these who have studied abroad in Spanish speaking countries wouldn't mind emailing me, and letting me put you in touch with the students who were interested. I think this could be a good conference call topic as well. Cindy From dlawless86 at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 15:50:18 2010 From: dlawless86 at gmail.com (Domonique Lawless) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 10:50:18 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Not Just Your Average Cane In-Reply-To: <1B8F1495-D32C-434E-AEBC-77714C78F2B8@gmail.com> References: <20100329023200.2291.74806@web2> <1B8F1495-D32C-434E-AEBC-77714C78F2B8@gmail.com> Message-ID: <423e6e461003290850w13b459a0vf3ab1d31ee8a8a0@mail.gmail.com> Joe and Fellow Listers, I don't know if this has already been mentioned, but it is perfectly exceptable to have multiple canes. If you own more than one you can pick one to decorate and see if it will work for you and still ensure your safety when traveling. Let us know how the decorating works out for you. Domonique . On 3/28/10, Sarah Alawami wrote: > Hey I named my cane joseph. Well that one got run over by a wheel chair and > joseph junior got smashed in a door so now joseph junior is back. lol. > > but in all seriousness good luck and be careful when decorating your cane. > not to much in my opinion but maybe you could do something that would catch > a driver's attention so they could see you better. > > Take care.. > s > On Mar 28, 2010, at 7:32 PM, Jedi wrote: > >> No worries Joe. I once called my cane Fido because I got sick of people >> who would ask me if I had a dog. I then responde with "Yes, he's a skinny >> white lab!" I like yours though. >> >> Respectfully, >> Jedi >> >> >> Original message: >>> Hi Mark, >> >>> Having started the thread, I feel compelled to respond to your thoughtful >>> post. It goes without say that people's opinions here do not reflect any >>> official NFB positions, and I honestly doubt the NFB would genuinely care >>> if >>> all its members suddenly decided to sport a wide range of colorfully >>> decorated canes. I think Dr. Maurer would probably find the concept >>> amusing, and doesn't Whozit sport a black cane in our logo? That fellow >>> was >>> far ahead of the curve. >> >>> For my own part, I'm headed to Michael's sometime soon to embark upon a >>> project to transform my own cane into the walking wonder I know it can >>> be. >>> I think that in doing so I would do well to use a measure of practical >>> sense. Security checkpoints at airports and federal buildings would >>> probably not look kindly on a cane that is different from what is >>> popularly >>> accepted. We can't expect the world to automatically get that blind >>> people >>> have their own sense of pizzazz, and by the same token, we can't expect >>> people to pick up on the fact we're blind at night if using something as >>> obscure as a black cane, even though I agree with the previous subscriber >>> that motorists should respect pedestrians with or without this new breed >>> of >>> eye candy. >> >>> I'm glad people pointed out the jurisdictions that specifically call for >>> the >>> cane to be white. In asking my question, sarcasm notwithstanding, I was >>> not >>> really setting out to violate laws that are meant to preserve my safety, >>> but >>> I do not want these laws to tuck me away into a label that can be every >>> bit >>> as condescending as terms like "handicapped." If senior citizens can >>> sport >>> all manner of creatively designed walking canes, by golly, I want my own >>> mode of transportation to broadcast my own sense of humor. It's not as >>> if I >>> can smack a bumper sticker on my German shepherd's butt and call it good, >>> although, can you imagine the wide range of clever slogans one could >>> produce >>> with that kind of strategic angle? >> >>> All of this having been said, I spent nearly a year working on behalf of >>> victims of human trafficking. I learned all about the negative >>> connotations >>> associated with words like "pimping," and for using that term to catch >>> your >>> attention, I am truly sorry. >> >>> In summation, I think the responses on both lists to which the question >>> went >>> out has been mostly positive. It's no scientific survey, but I think it >>> is >>> at least slightly indicative of the membership's willingness to explore >>> the >>> idea or at least humor my nonsense. People who have given more >>> straight-laced responses are no doubt secretly glad they're not the only >>> ones who thought of this, because original this idea is most certainly >>> not. >>> Let's leave out the references to accessible currency and other >>> controversial topics out of it this time around. We debate those serious >>> issues all the time and should enjoy the all too infrequent light banter. >> >>> Best, >> >>> Joe Orozco and the Soon to Be Improved Sir Tap-A-Lot >> >>> What, as if you haven't ever thought of giving your cane a name??? >> >>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >>> sleeves, >>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org >>> [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mark BurningHawk >>> Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:51 PM >>> To: NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List >>> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Pimp My Cane >> >>> I'm following this thread, and I know a large percentage of the folks >>> here are NFB members; I personally a not, nor any organization, for >>> that matter. I find a bit of hypocrisy in this discussion: First the >>> NFB rails against things like audible cross walk signals and so on, >>> claiming that the blind don't need them, that it's not what the blind >>> "want," whatever. Same with identifiable currency. Now, however, I >>> hear a bunch of the same people saying, in effect, "I want to carry a >>> symbol of blindness! I want to proclaim my blindness to everyone so >>> that they can alter their behaviors appropriately in recognition of >>> the fact that I'm blind!" I should think the true spirit of the NFB >>> might be to use a black cane and give no indication whatsoever of >>> blindness, except on a purely voluntary basis. I just don't >>> understand this. >> >>> Mark BurningHawk >>> Skype and Twitter: BurningHawk1969 >>> Home: Http://MarkBurningHawk.net/ >>> Namaste! >> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> blindlaw mailing list >>> blindlaw at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>> info for blindlaw: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/jsoroz >>> co%40gmail.com >> >> >>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of >>> virus signature database 4980 (20100328) __________ >> >>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >> >>> http://www.eset.com >> >> >> >>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>> signature >>> database 4980 (20100328) __________ >> >>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >> >>> http://www.eset.com >> >> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net >> >> -- >> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dlawless86%40gmail.com > From herekittykat2 at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 15:53:47 2010 From: herekittykat2 at gmail.com (Jewel S.) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 11:53:47 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] naming your cane In-Reply-To: <406373D3C197456C8687A7F6C91EBAA8@RainaIsmailPC> References: <001901cacef0$e6687a00$b3396e00$@org> <1E92192B-DE5A-460D-B0E5-7C8F27BF52C4@gmail.com> <406373D3C197456C8687A7F6C91EBAA8@RainaIsmailPC> Message-ID: <196c01b01003290853w42baf4edlbc4073724056ac89@mail.gmail.com> I name my canes, but not with such a good name as Edith. My first cane was Busephalas, the great white horse of Alexander the Great. My current cane is Silver, the white horse of the Lone Ranger. I have a third cane that I haven't named yet, though since it's a straight cane, I've considered naming it after one of the white elephants (taller, harder to hide, right?). It's just for fun, and I do it just for the heck of it. ~Jewel On 3/29/10, Rania wrote: > Yes that sounds like a great idea! > Rania, > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf > Of anjelinac26 at gmail.com > Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 12:42 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Cc: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] naming your cane > > I love the humor brought to this discussion. Is there a law which states a > cane must be a certain color? The Nfb canes don't have the reflective tape > the amvutech canes have. Cane decorating sounds like fun. > > > Anjelina > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 28, 2010, at 11:35 PM, "Maryann Migliorelli" > wrote: > >> I'm sure that at the next NAGDU meeting, I will be forced to say, "Hi, >> My name is Maryann, and I have a long, white cane whose name is >> Edith." Why Edith you may ask. Edith means extended device for >> identification by touch of hazards. >> >> Enjoy that one for what it's worth, and have a great week. >> >> Maryann Migliorelli >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/anjelinac26%40 >> gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai > l.com > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 9.0.791 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2776 - Release Date: 03/28/10 > 13:32:00 > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat2%40gmail.com > From herekittykat2 at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 15:58:20 2010 From: herekittykat2 at gmail.com (Jewel S.) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 11:58:20 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane In-Reply-To: References: <20100329072525.17857.17732@web3> Message-ID: <196c01b01003290858y1b785d08g6620f845e8cfe499@mail.gmail.com> In all of the White Cane Laws that I've seen, there is a secotion that says that no blind person shall be held accountable if not using a white cane or guide dog. I don't recall the exact wording for my state, but it basically say that a blind person cannot be made accountable through negligence for not having a white cane or guide dog. I don't see why a person couldn't have a black cane, red cane, or rainbow cane, if they wanted. Just don't expect epople to recognize your visual impairment if you don't have a white cane. Be prepared to do more explaining, and explaining why you don't have a white cane. ~Jewel On 3/29/10, Briley Pollard wrote: > I did consider the matching with purse and shoes aspect too... but maybe > that is because I'm admittedly a bit overly conscious of things matching. > On Mar 29, 2010, at 3:40 AM, Sarah Jevnikar wrote: > >> Hi all, >> I used to decorate my cane for every season or holiday when I was younger >> and I think it's a cool idea but I have different concerns. >> >> I'm sorry; I feel like a party pooper but here they are. >> >> Decorated canes are fun but what do they say about us? Unprofessional >> comes >> to mind, as most of us are at the age where we're looking for summer or >> full-time employment. But perhaps temporary decorations would be ok ... >> >> Now on a different note, a cane spans from the belt area (and purse area >> too, depending on your preference or length of strap) to a person's shoes. >> So, which should it match? Belt/purse or shoes? Or should they all >> coordinate? >> >> Just something to ponder. >> >> Sarah Jevnikar >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of Jedi >> Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 3:25 AM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane >> >> It seems to me the question we should be asking is why canes are white >> in the first place. >> >> Originally, the cane was painted white as a way of telling drivers to >> stop for the blind. It was a member of the Lions Club that had the idea >> in the first place because he observed a blind man having difficulty in >> crossing a street because there was too much traffic. Now, we say that >> the white cane makes it easier to see us and so cars are required to >> stop. It is also worth noting that cars are supposed to stop for all >> pedestrians. So what we are saying is that blind people need more >> notice. Why? I agree that until electric cars make noise, they do need >> to stop for us because we can't hear them. But again, they should stop >> for everyone because no one can really hear them. >> >> The white cane laws are civil rights laws that basically say that blind >> people cannot be automatically held accountable for any injuries that >> occur to them based on the idea that they should know better than to be >> out in the world in the first place. Are we now saying that if the cane >> isn't white so people know we're blind, then any accidents that occur >> as a result are our fault? White cane laws require that blind people >> should be treated as anyone else whether injuries occur or not. The >> white cane laws also say that a blind person shall not be discriminated >> against as we travel in the world. Really and truly, the laws were >> meant to protect the person, not the cane itself. >> >> What I'm getting at is this. The white cane is currently a symbol by >> which the sighted recognize us by, and that symbol tells the sighted >> that they need to treat us a certain way. . Would things really change >> if we changed the colors of our canes? Or would attitudes have to >> change because now we're saying that it really isn't the responsibility >> of the sighted to look out for the blind specifically? What do you think? >> >> Respectfully, >> Jedi >> >> >> Original message: >>> Greetings, Knowing some of the lawyers that I do, they could definitely >>> make that argument stick in court. >>> I don't blame you if you want to paint your cane, but your question >>> should >>> definitely be considered carefully before you do it. >>> I do know someone who has a few support canes which happen to coordinate >>> with her outfits, but her white cane is definitely still white. >> >>> Have fun with your new one no matter what color it turns out to be. >>> Maryann Migliorelli >> >> >> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >> bile.net >> >> -- >> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto >> ronto.ca >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat2%40gmail.com > From daydreamingncolor at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 19:41:03 2010 From: daydreamingncolor at gmail.com (Aziza Cano) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 13:41:03 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane References: <20100329072525.17857.17732@web3> <196c01b01003290858y1b785d08g6620f845e8cfe499@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: But, legally does this apply to different colored canes? I think that section refers to people who choose not to use a travel aid, like the high parcials that do not wish to use a cane. Just a thought. Aziza ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jewel S." To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 9:58 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane > In all of the White Cane Laws that I've seen, there is a secotion that > says that no blind person shall be held accountable if not using a > white cane or guide dog. I don't recall the exact wording for my > state, but it basically say that a blind person cannot be made > accountable through negligence for not having a white cane or guide > dog. I don't see why a person couldn't have a black cane, red cane, or > rainbow cane, if they wanted. Just don't expect epople to recognize > your visual impairment if you don't have a white cane. Be prepared to > do more explaining, and explaining why you don't have a white cane. > > ~Jewel > > On 3/29/10, Briley Pollard wrote: >> I did consider the matching with purse and shoes aspect too... but maybe >> that is because I'm admittedly a bit overly conscious of things matching. >> On Mar 29, 2010, at 3:40 AM, Sarah Jevnikar wrote: >> >>> Hi all, >>> I used to decorate my cane for every season or holiday when I was >>> younger >>> and I think it's a cool idea but I have different concerns. >>> >>> I'm sorry; I feel like a party pooper but here they are. >>> >>> Decorated canes are fun but what do they say about us? Unprofessional >>> comes >>> to mind, as most of us are at the age where we're looking for summer or >>> full-time employment. But perhaps temporary decorations would be ok ... >>> >>> Now on a different note, a cane spans from the belt area (and purse area >>> too, depending on your preference or length of strap) to a person's >>> shoes. >>> So, which should it match? Belt/purse or shoes? Or should they all >>> coordinate? >>> >>> Just something to ponder. >>> >>> Sarah Jevnikar >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>> Behalf >>> Of Jedi >>> Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 3:25 AM >>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane >>> >>> It seems to me the question we should be asking is why canes are white >>> in the first place. >>> >>> Originally, the cane was painted white as a way of telling drivers to >>> stop for the blind. It was a member of the Lions Club that had the idea >>> in the first place because he observed a blind man having difficulty in >>> crossing a street because there was too much traffic. Now, we say that >>> the white cane makes it easier to see us and so cars are required to >>> stop. It is also worth noting that cars are supposed to stop for all >>> pedestrians. So what we are saying is that blind people need more >>> notice. Why? I agree that until electric cars make noise, they do need >>> to stop for us because we can't hear them. But again, they should stop >>> for everyone because no one can really hear them. >>> >>> The white cane laws are civil rights laws that basically say that blind >>> people cannot be automatically held accountable for any injuries that >>> occur to them based on the idea that they should know better than to be >>> out in the world in the first place. Are we now saying that if the cane >>> isn't white so people know we're blind, then any accidents that occur >>> as a result are our fault? White cane laws require that blind people >>> should be treated as anyone else whether injuries occur or not. The >>> white cane laws also say that a blind person shall not be discriminated >>> against as we travel in the world. Really and truly, the laws were >>> meant to protect the person, not the cane itself. >>> >>> What I'm getting at is this. The white cane is currently a symbol by >>> which the sighted recognize us by, and that symbol tells the sighted >>> that they need to treat us a certain way. . Would things really change >>> if we changed the colors of our canes? Or would attitudes have to >>> change because now we're saying that it really isn't the responsibility >>> of the sighted to look out for the blind specifically? What do you >>> think? >>> >>> Respectfully, >>> Jedi >>> >>> >>> Original message: >>>> Greetings, Knowing some of the lawyers that I do, they could >>>> definitely >>>> make that argument stick in court. >>>> I don't blame you if you want to paint your cane, but your question >>>> should >>>> definitely be considered carefully before you do it. >>>> I do know someone who has a few support canes which happen to >>>> coordinate >>>> with her outfits, but her white cane is definitely still white. >>> >>>> Have fun with your new one no matter what color it turns out to be. >>>> Maryann Migliorelli >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >>> bile.net >>> >>> -- >>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto >>> ronto.ca >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat2%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/daydreamingncolor%40gmail.com From daydreamingncolor at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 19:42:20 2010 From: daydreamingncolor at gmail.com (Aziza Cano) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 13:42:20 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] naming your cane References: <001901cacef0$e6687a00$b3396e00$@org><1E92192B-DE5A-460D-B0E5-7C8F27BF52C4@gmail.com><406373D3C197456C8687A7F6C91EBAA8@RainaIsmailPC> <196c01b01003290853w42baf4edlbc4073724056ac89@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <3E82EF92FA844D0CA701BD0CEDF8A086@azizaLatD430> I think the decoration and naming of a cane makes your cane more unique. Its yours, and you know its yours. Also, it makes it feel a little more special, like it belongs with you. Rather than this long stick like thing that you must carry around... Aziza ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jewel S." To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 9:53 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] naming your cane >I name my canes, but not with such a good name as Edith. > > My first cane was Busephalas, the great white horse of Alexander the > Great. My current cane is Silver, the white horse of the Lone Ranger. > I have a third cane that I haven't named yet, though since it's a > straight cane, I've considered naming it after one of the white > elephants (taller, harder to hide, right?). It's just for fun, and I > do it just for the heck of it. > > ~Jewel > > On 3/29/10, Rania wrote: >> Yes that sounds like a great idea! >> Rania, >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of anjelinac26 at gmail.com >> Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 12:42 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Cc: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] naming your cane >> >> I love the humor brought to this discussion. Is there a law which states >> a >> cane must be a certain color? The Nfb canes don't have the reflective >> tape >> the amvutech canes have. Cane decorating sounds like fun. >> >> >> Anjelina >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 28, 2010, at 11:35 PM, "Maryann Migliorelli" >> >> wrote: >> >>> I'm sure that at the next NAGDU meeting, I will be forced to say, "Hi, >>> My name is Maryann, and I have a long, white cane whose name is >>> Edith." Why Edith you may ask. Edith means extended device for >>> identification by touch of hazards. >>> >>> Enjoy that one for what it's worth, and have a great week. >>> >>> Maryann Migliorelli >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/anjelinac26%40 >>> gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai >> l.com >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >> Version: 9.0.791 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2776 - Release Date: 03/28/10 >> 13:32:00 >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat2%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/daydreamingncolor%40gmail.com From daydreamingncolor at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 19:42:49 2010 From: daydreamingncolor at gmail.com (Aziza Cano) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 13:42:49 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Not Just Your Average Cane References: <20100329023200.2291.74806@web2><1B8F1495-D32C-434E-AEBC-77714C78F2B8@gmail.com> <423e6e461003290850w13b459a0vf3ab1d31ee8a8a0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <5702A487EF4D4A9E8F06E2034668D16E@azizaLatD430> That's a good idea. That way it isn't a done deal if it doesn't work out. Aziza ----- Original Message ----- From: "Domonique Lawless" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 9:50 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Not Just Your Average Cane > Joe and Fellow Listers, > > I don't know if this has already been mentioned, but it is perfectly > exceptable to have multiple canes. If you own more than one you can > pick one to decorate and see if it will work for you and still ensure > your safety when traveling. Let us know how the decorating works out > for you. > > Domonique . > > On 3/28/10, Sarah Alawami wrote: >> Hey I named my cane joseph. Well that one got run over by a wheel chair >> and >> joseph junior got smashed in a door so now joseph junior is back. lol. >> >> but in all seriousness good luck and be careful when decorating your >> cane. >> not to much in my opinion but maybe you could do something that would >> catch >> a driver's attention so they could see you better. >> >> Take care.. >> s >> On Mar 28, 2010, at 7:32 PM, Jedi wrote: >> >>> No worries Joe. I once called my cane Fido because I got sick of people >>> who would ask me if I had a dog. I then responde with "Yes, he's a >>> skinny >>> white lab!" I like yours though. >>> >>> Respectfully, >>> Jedi >>> >>> >>> Original message: >>>> Hi Mark, >>> >>>> Having started the thread, I feel compelled to respond to your >>>> thoughtful >>>> post. It goes without say that people's opinions here do not reflect >>>> any >>>> official NFB positions, and I honestly doubt the NFB would genuinely >>>> care >>>> if >>>> all its members suddenly decided to sport a wide range of colorfully >>>> decorated canes. I think Dr. Maurer would probably find the concept >>>> amusing, and doesn't Whozit sport a black cane in our logo? That >>>> fellow >>>> was >>>> far ahead of the curve. >>> >>>> For my own part, I'm headed to Michael's sometime soon to embark upon a >>>> project to transform my own cane into the walking wonder I know it can >>>> be. >>>> I think that in doing so I would do well to use a measure of practical >>>> sense. Security checkpoints at airports and federal buildings would >>>> probably not look kindly on a cane that is different from what is >>>> popularly >>>> accepted. We can't expect the world to automatically get that blind >>>> people >>>> have their own sense of pizzazz, and by the same token, we can't expect >>>> people to pick up on the fact we're blind at night if using something >>>> as >>>> obscure as a black cane, even though I agree with the previous >>>> subscriber >>>> that motorists should respect pedestrians with or without this new >>>> breed >>>> of >>>> eye candy. >>> >>>> I'm glad people pointed out the jurisdictions that specifically call >>>> for >>>> the >>>> cane to be white. In asking my question, sarcasm notwithstanding, I >>>> was >>>> not >>>> really setting out to violate laws that are meant to preserve my >>>> safety, >>>> but >>>> I do not want these laws to tuck me away into a label that can be every >>>> bit >>>> as condescending as terms like "handicapped." If senior citizens can >>>> sport >>>> all manner of creatively designed walking canes, by golly, I want my >>>> own >>>> mode of transportation to broadcast my own sense of humor. It's not as >>>> if I >>>> can smack a bumper sticker on my German shepherd's butt and call it >>>> good, >>>> although, can you imagine the wide range of clever slogans one could >>>> produce >>>> with that kind of strategic angle? >>> >>>> All of this having been said, I spent nearly a year working on behalf >>>> of >>>> victims of human trafficking. I learned all about the negative >>>> connotations >>>> associated with words like "pimping," and for using that term to catch >>>> your >>>> attention, I am truly sorry. >>> >>>> In summation, I think the responses on both lists to which the question >>>> went >>>> out has been mostly positive. It's no scientific survey, but I think >>>> it >>>> is >>>> at least slightly indicative of the membership's willingness to explore >>>> the >>>> idea or at least humor my nonsense. People who have given more >>>> straight-laced responses are no doubt secretly glad they're not the >>>> only >>>> ones who thought of this, because original this idea is most certainly >>>> not. >>>> Let's leave out the references to accessible currency and other >>>> controversial topics out of it this time around. We debate those >>>> serious >>>> issues all the time and should enjoy the all too infrequent light >>>> banter. >>> >>>> Best, >>> >>>> Joe Orozco and the Soon to Be Improved Sir Tap-A-Lot >>> >>>> What, as if you haven't ever thought of giving your cane a name??? >>> >>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >>>> sleeves, >>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>> [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mark BurningHawk >>>> Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:51 PM >>>> To: NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List >>>> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Pimp My Cane >>> >>>> I'm following this thread, and I know a large percentage of the folks >>>> here are NFB members; I personally a not, nor any organization, for >>>> that matter. I find a bit of hypocrisy in this discussion: First the >>>> NFB rails against things like audible cross walk signals and so on, >>>> claiming that the blind don't need them, that it's not what the blind >>>> "want," whatever. Same with identifiable currency. Now, however, I >>>> hear a bunch of the same people saying, in effect, "I want to carry a >>>> symbol of blindness! I want to proclaim my blindness to everyone so >>>> that they can alter their behaviors appropriately in recognition of >>>> the fact that I'm blind!" I should think the true spirit of the NFB >>>> might be to use a black cane and give no indication whatsoever of >>>> blindness, except on a purely voluntary basis. I just don't >>>> understand this. >>> >>>> Mark BurningHawk >>>> Skype and Twitter: BurningHawk1969 >>>> Home: Http://MarkBurningHawk.net/ >>>> Namaste! >>> >>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> blindlaw mailing list >>>> blindlaw at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>> info for blindlaw: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/jsoroz >>>> co%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of >>>> virus signature database 4980 (20100328) __________ >>> >>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>> >>>> http://www.eset.com >>> >>> >>> >>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>>> signature >>>> database 4980 (20100328) __________ >>> >>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>> >>>> http://www.eset.com >>> >>> >>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net >>> >>> -- >>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dlawless86%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/daydreamingncolor%40gmail.com From daydreamingncolor at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 19:59:45 2010 From: daydreamingncolor at gmail.com (Aziza Cano) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 13:59:45 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane References: <20100329072525.17857.17732@web3> <000401cacf1b$796f14b0$6c4d3e10$@jevnikar@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: Well I believe that everyone would take into consideration their job and schools and decorate accordingly. Besides, I doubt anyone would be extremely outlandish with their canes decorations. As for what to match it to, that of course depends on the person. Aziza ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sarah Jevnikar" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 2:40 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane > Hi all, > I used to decorate my cane for every season or holiday when I was younger > and I think it's a cool idea but I have different concerns. > > I'm sorry; I feel like a party pooper but here they are. > > Decorated canes are fun but what do they say about us? Unprofessional > comes > to mind, as most of us are at the age where we're looking for summer or > full-time employment. But perhaps temporary decorations would be ok ... > > Now on a different note, a cane spans from the belt area (and purse area > too, depending on your preference or length of strap) to a person's shoes. > So, which should it match? Belt/purse or shoes? Or should they all > coordinate? > > Just something to ponder. > > Sarah Jevnikar > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On > Behalf > Of Jedi > Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 3:25 AM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane > > It seems to me the question we should be asking is why canes are white > in the first place. > > Originally, the cane was painted white as a way of telling drivers to > stop for the blind. It was a member of the Lions Club that had the idea > in the first place because he observed a blind man having difficulty in > crossing a street because there was too much traffic. Now, we say that > the white cane makes it easier to see us and so cars are required to > stop. It is also worth noting that cars are supposed to stop for all > pedestrians. So what we are saying is that blind people need more > notice. Why? I agree that until electric cars make noise, they do need > to stop for us because we can't hear them. But again, they should stop > for everyone because no one can really hear them. > > The white cane laws are civil rights laws that basically say that blind > people cannot be automatically held accountable for any injuries that > occur to them based on the idea that they should know better than to be > out in the world in the first place. Are we now saying that if the cane > isn't white so people know we're blind, then any accidents that occur > as a result are our fault? White cane laws require that blind people > should be treated as anyone else whether injuries occur or not. The > white cane laws also say that a blind person shall not be discriminated > against as we travel in the world. Really and truly, the laws were > meant to protect the person, not the cane itself. > > What I'm getting at is this. The white cane is currently a symbol by > which the sighted recognize us by, and that symbol tells the sighted > that they need to treat us a certain way. . Would things really change > if we changed the colors of our canes? Or would attitudes have to > change because now we're saying that it really isn't the responsibility > of the sighted to look out for the blind specifically? What do you think? > > Respectfully, > Jedi > > > Original message: >> Greetings, Knowing some of the lawyers that I do, they could definitely >> make that argument stick in court. >> I don't blame you if you want to paint your cane, but your question >> should >> definitely be considered carefully before you do it. >> I do know someone who has a few support canes which happen to coordinate >> with her outfits, but her white cane is definitely still white. > >> Have fun with your new one no matter what color it turns out to be. >> Maryann Migliorelli > > > > >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo > bile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit > www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto > ronto.ca > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/daydreamingncolor%40gmail.com From daydreamingncolor at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 20:02:25 2010 From: daydreamingncolor at gmail.com (Aziza Cano) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 14:02:25 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane References: <20100329072525.17857.17732@web3> Message-ID: <02BC6CBFCAF44D78B6648C2665482A70@azizaLatD430> I agree with Jedi. Do our canes have to be white? Why should thier be a special identification symbol to identify us as blind. The sighted public sees a blind person and reacts a certain way. But would they treat us differently if they did not know that we were blind just by looking at us? Do we not deserve that sense of normalcy as well? I view my cane as a travel aid. It increases my confidence and independence, I do not think of it as a method of which to let others know I am blind, because frankly, its none of their business. If I require assistance I will ask for it, until then, I would like to be reguarded as just another person. Aziza ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jedi" To: Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 1:25 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane > It seems to me the question we should be asking is why canes are white in > the first place. > > Originally, the cane was painted white as a way of telling drivers to stop > for the blind. It was a member of the Lions Club that had the idea in the > first place because he observed a blind man having difficulty in crossing > a street because there was too much traffic. Now, we say that the white > cane makes it easier to see us and so cars are required to stop. It is > also worth noting that cars are supposed to stop for all pedestrians. So > what we are saying is that blind people need more notice. Why? I agree > that until electric cars make noise, they do need to stop for us because > we can't hear them. But again, they should stop for everyone because no > one can really hear them. > > The white cane laws are civil rights laws that basically say that blind > people cannot be automatically held accountable for any injuries that > occur to them based on the idea that they should know better than to be > out in the world in the first place. Are we now saying that if the cane > isn't white so people know we're blind, then any accidents that occur as a > result are our fault? White cane laws require that blind people should be > treated as anyone else whether injuries occur or not. The white cane laws > also say that a blind person shall not be discriminated against as we > travel in the world. Really and truly, the laws were meant to protect the > person, not the cane itself. > > What I'm getting at is this. The white cane is currently a symbol by which > the sighted recognize us by, and that symbol tells the sighted that they > need to treat us a certain way. . Would things really change if we changed > the colors of our canes? Or would attitudes have to change because now > we're saying that it really isn't the responsibility of the sighted to > look out for the blind specifically? What do you think? > > Respectfully, > Jedi > > > Original message: >> Greetings, Knowing some of the lawyers that I do, they could definitely >> make that argument stick in court. >> I don't blame you if you want to paint your cane, but your question >> should >> definitely be considered carefully before you do it. >> I do know someone who has a few support canes which happen to coordinate >> with her outfits, but her white cane is definitely still white. > >> Have fun with your new one no matter what color it turns out to be. >> Maryann Migliorelli > > > > >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net > > -- > Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit > www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/daydreamingncolor%40gmail.com From corbbo at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 20:08:03 2010 From: corbbo at gmail.com (Corbb O'Connor) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 16:08:03 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] studying abroad In-Reply-To: <3fea3c411003290833l179ed83ajcebbe63d09b65bce@mail.gmail.com> References: <3fea3c411003290833l179ed83ajcebbe63d09b65bce@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <73D58BBD-7E5D-41F9-8656-5FE07C03558B@gmail.com> I am happy to be a resource to any of the students at the NC seminar, or anybody else on this list who has questions. I studied in Galway, Ireland, but I evaluated studying abroad in a Spanish-speaking country. On Mar 29, 2010, at 11:33 AM, Cindy Bennett wrote: At the NC student seminar, a couple of students had questions about studying abroad as a blind person, and there was no one present with experience, so i said i would ask around. I also had someone ask about it in an lj community i am in, so, i was curious if those of you, particularly these who have studied abroad in Spanish speaking countries wouldn't mind emailing me, and letting me put you in touch with the students who were interested. I think this could be a good conference call topic as well. Cindy _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/corbbo%40gmail.com From blackbyrdfly at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 20:12:26 2010 From: blackbyrdfly at gmail.com (Jamie Principato) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 16:12:26 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Not Just Your Average Cane In-Reply-To: <5702A487EF4D4A9E8F06E2034668D16E@azizaLatD430> References: <20100329023200.2291.74806@web2> <1B8F1495-D32C-434E-AEBC-77714C78F2B8@gmail.com> <423e6e461003290850w13b459a0vf3ab1d31ee8a8a0@mail.gmail.com> <5702A487EF4D4A9E8F06E2034668D16E@azizaLatD430> Message-ID: I just had a cool idea that I thought I'd share. I've found that my telescoping cane comes apart if you take off the cap at the top and let the sections fall out. If you have more than one telescoping cane, you could paint the different sections of one and leave the other white, and mix and match. If one day you want a very colorful cane, use the colored one. If you only feel like a little pizazz another day, swap out a few of the colored sections for white ones and just leave one or two bands colored, maybe the handle and tip. Or you could go all white if, say, you're going out at night and want to be very visible. On Mon, Mar 29, 2010 at 3:42 PM, Aziza Cano wrote: > That's a good idea. That way it isn't a done deal if it doesn't work out. > Aziza > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Domonique Lawless" < > dlawless86 at gmail.com> > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" < > nabs-l at nfbnet.org> > Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 9:50 AM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Not Just Your Average Cane > > > Joe and Fellow Listers, >> >> I don't know if this has already been mentioned, but it is perfectly >> exceptable to have multiple canes. If you own more than one you can >> pick one to decorate and see if it will work for you and still ensure >> your safety when traveling. Let us know how the decorating works out >> for you. >> >> Domonique . >> >> On 3/28/10, Sarah Alawami wrote: >> >>> Hey I named my cane joseph. Well that one got run over by a wheel chair >>> and >>> joseph junior got smashed in a door so now joseph junior is back. lol. >>> >>> but in all seriousness good luck and be careful when decorating your >>> cane. >>> not to much in my opinion but maybe you could do something that would >>> catch >>> a driver's attention so they could see you better. >>> >>> Take care.. >>> s >>> On Mar 28, 2010, at 7:32 PM, Jedi wrote: >>> >>> No worries Joe. I once called my cane Fido because I got sick of people >>>> who would ask me if I had a dog. I then responde with "Yes, he's a >>>> skinny >>>> white lab!" I like yours though. >>>> >>>> Respectfully, >>>> Jedi >>>> >>>> >>>> Original message: >>>> >>>>> Hi Mark, >>>>> >>>> >>>> Having started the thread, I feel compelled to respond to your >>>>> thoughtful >>>>> post. It goes without say that people's opinions here do not reflect >>>>> any >>>>> official NFB positions, and I honestly doubt the NFB would genuinely >>>>> care >>>>> if >>>>> all its members suddenly decided to sport a wide range of colorfully >>>>> decorated canes. I think Dr. Maurer would probably find the concept >>>>> amusing, and doesn't Whozit sport a black cane in our logo? That >>>>> fellow >>>>> was >>>>> far ahead of the curve. >>>>> >>>> >>>> For my own part, I'm headed to Michael's sometime soon to embark upon a >>>>> project to transform my own cane into the walking wonder I know it can >>>>> be. >>>>> I think that in doing so I would do well to use a measure of practical >>>>> sense. Security checkpoints at airports and federal buildings would >>>>> probably not look kindly on a cane that is different from what is >>>>> popularly >>>>> accepted. We can't expect the world to automatically get that blind >>>>> people >>>>> have their own sense of pizzazz, and by the same token, we can't expect >>>>> people to pick up on the fact we're blind at night if using something >>>>> as >>>>> obscure as a black cane, even though I agree with the previous >>>>> subscriber >>>>> that motorists should respect pedestrians with or without this new >>>>> breed >>>>> of >>>>> eye candy. >>>>> >>>> >>>> I'm glad people pointed out the jurisdictions that specifically call >>>>> for >>>>> the >>>>> cane to be white. In asking my question, sarcasm notwithstanding, I >>>>> was >>>>> not >>>>> really setting out to violate laws that are meant to preserve my >>>>> safety, >>>>> but >>>>> I do not want these laws to tuck me away into a label that can be every >>>>> bit >>>>> as condescending as terms like "handicapped." If senior citizens can >>>>> sport >>>>> all manner of creatively designed walking canes, by golly, I want my >>>>> own >>>>> mode of transportation to broadcast my own sense of humor. It's not as >>>>> if I >>>>> can smack a bumper sticker on my German shepherd's butt and call it >>>>> good, >>>>> although, can you imagine the wide range of clever slogans one could >>>>> produce >>>>> with that kind of strategic angle? >>>>> >>>> >>>> All of this having been said, I spent nearly a year working on behalf >>>>> of >>>>> victims of human trafficking. I learned all about the negative >>>>> connotations >>>>> associated with words like "pimping," and for using that term to catch >>>>> your >>>>> attention, I am truly sorry. >>>>> >>>> >>>> In summation, I think the responses on both lists to which the question >>>>> went >>>>> out has been mostly positive. It's no scientific survey, but I think >>>>> it >>>>> is >>>>> at least slightly indicative of the membership's willingness to explore >>>>> the >>>>> idea or at least humor my nonsense. People who have given more >>>>> straight-laced responses are no doubt secretly glad they're not the >>>>> only >>>>> ones who thought of this, because original this idea is most certainly >>>>> not. >>>>> Let's leave out the references to accessible currency and other >>>>> controversial topics out of it this time around. We debate those >>>>> serious >>>>> issues all the time and should enjoy the all too infrequent light >>>>> banter. >>>>> >>>> >>>> Best, >>>>> >>>> >>>> Joe Orozco and the Soon to Be Improved Sir Tap-A-Lot >>>>> >>>> >>>> What, as if you haven't ever thought of giving your cane a name??? >>>>> >>>> >>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >>>>> sleeves, >>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>> [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mark BurningHawk >>>>> Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:51 PM >>>>> To: NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List >>>>> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Pimp My Cane >>>>> >>>> >>>> I'm following this thread, and I know a large percentage of the folks >>>>> here are NFB members; I personally a not, nor any organization, for >>>>> that matter. I find a bit of hypocrisy in this discussion: First the >>>>> NFB rails against things like audible cross walk signals and so on, >>>>> claiming that the blind don't need them, that it's not what the blind >>>>> "want," whatever. Same with identifiable currency. Now, however, I >>>>> hear a bunch of the same people saying, in effect, "I want to carry a >>>>> symbol of blindness! I want to proclaim my blindness to everyone so >>>>> that they can alter their behaviors appropriately in recognition of >>>>> the fact that I'm blind!" I should think the true spirit of the NFB >>>>> might be to use a black cane and give no indication whatsoever of >>>>> blindness, except on a purely voluntary basis. I just don't >>>>> understand this. >>>>> >>>> >>>> Mark BurningHawk >>>>> Skype and Twitter: BurningHawk1969 >>>>> Home: Http://MarkBurningHawk.net/ >>>>> Namaste! >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> blindlaw mailing list >>>>> blindlaw at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>> info for blindlaw: >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/jsoroz >>>>> co%40gmail.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of >>>>> virus signature database 4980 (20100328) __________ >>>>> >>>> >>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.eset.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>>>> signature >>>>> database 4980 (20100328) __________ >>>>> >>>> >>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.eset.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net >>>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dlawless86%40gmail.com >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/daydreamingncolor%40gmail.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com > From mewhalen at wisc.edu Mon Mar 29 20:30:12 2010 From: mewhalen at wisc.edu (Meghan Whalen) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 15:30:12 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Ipod Raffle Message-ID: Please distribute as widely as possible. The Wisconsin Association of Blind Students is raffling off an Ipod nanno, valued at approximately $200. The Nanno is the first place prize, and the winner has the option of recieving the cash equivlent. Second place is $200 and third place is $100. The Ipod Nanno has Voice Over, a built in screen reading technology designed by Apple which makes their technology accessible to the Blind. This device is highly pocketable and can store plenty of music for your listening pleasure. The drawing for the Nanno will be held on Sunday, April at the Wisconsin State convention, and you don't have to be present to win. If you are interested in entering the raffle, please send a check payable to the Wisconsin Association of Blind Students (WABS) to: Meghan Whalen 2566 Hoard St Apt. 2 Madison WI 53704 mewhalen at wisc.edu If possible, please both email and mail the following information (braille is prefered) 1. Name 2. Address 3. Phone 4. number of tickets ordered 5. dollar amount Please send checks no later than Monday, April 19. Alternatively, you can send money via paypal to: mewhalen at wisc.edu and include the same information. Thank you very much for your support of WABS! Meghan Whalen, President Wisconsin Association of Blind Students From mewhalen at wisc.edu Mon Mar 29 20:53:30 2010 From: mewhalen at wisc.edu (Meghan Whalen) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 15:53:30 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Ipod Raffle amendment Message-ID: <1D232D48759945B68D486E3D0A61830C@YOURZVIRQM73LR> I failed to mention that tickets are $2 for 1 or $5 for 3. Sorry about that. Meghan ----- Original Message ----- From: Meghan Whalen To: Wisconsin Association of Blind Students List ; National Federation of the Blind of Wisconsin News List ; NFB of Wisconsin Dane County Chapter List ; National Association of Blind Students mailing list Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 3:30 PM Subject: Ipod Raffle Please distribute as widely as possible. The Wisconsin Association of Blind Students is raffling off an Ipod nanno, valued at approximately $200. The Nanno is the first place prize, and the winner has the option of recieving the cash equivlent. Second place is $200 and third place is $100. The Ipod Nanno has Voice Over, a built in screen reading technology designed by Apple which makes their technology accessible to the Blind. This device is highly pocketable and can store plenty of music for your listening pleasure. The drawing for the Nanno will be held on Sunday, April at the Wisconsin State convention, and you don't have to be present to win. If you are interested in entering the raffle, please send a check payable to the Wisconsin Association of Blind Students (WABS) to: Meghan Whalen 2566 Hoard St Apt. 2 Madison WI 53704 mewhalen at wisc.edu If possible, please both email and mail the following information (braille is prefered) 1. Name 2. Address 3. Phone 4. number of tickets ordered 5. dollar amount Please send checks no later than Monday, April 19. Alternatively, you can send money via paypal to: mewhalen at wisc.edu and include the same information. Thank you very much for your support of WABS! Meghan Whalen, President Wisconsin Association of Blind Students From pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net Mon Mar 29 20:57:33 2010 From: pdonahue1 at sbcglobal.net (Peter Donahue) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 15:57:33 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] naming your cane References: <001901cacef0$e6687a00$b3396e00$@org><1E92192B-DE5A-460D-B0E5-7C8F27BF52C4@gmail.com><406373D3C197456C8687A7F6C91EBAA8@RainaIsmailPC><196c01b01003290853w42baf4edlbc4073724056ac89@mail.gmail.com> <3E82EF92FA844D0CA701BD0CEDF8A086@azizaLatD430> Message-ID: <000701cacf82$74ec1ed0$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> Hello Azizza and everyone, David Andrews calls his came "Harry." I believe he still has a message signature that reads, "David Andrews and white cane Harry." Peter Donahue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Aziza Cano" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 2:42 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] naming your cane I think the decoration and naming of a cane makes your cane more unique. Its yours, and you know its yours. Also, it makes it feel a little more special, like it belongs with you. Rather than this long stick like thing that you must carry around... Aziza ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jewel S." To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 9:53 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] naming your cane >I name my canes, but not with such a good name as Edith. > > My first cane was Busephalas, the great white horse of Alexander the > Great. My current cane is Silver, the white horse of the Lone Ranger. > I have a third cane that I haven't named yet, though since it's a > straight cane, I've considered naming it after one of the white > elephants (taller, harder to hide, right?). It's just for fun, and I > do it just for the heck of it. > > ~Jewel > > On 3/29/10, Rania wrote: >> Yes that sounds like a great idea! >> Rania, >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >> Behalf >> Of anjelinac26 at gmail.com >> Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 12:42 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Cc: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] naming your cane >> >> I love the humor brought to this discussion. Is there a law which states >> a >> cane must be a certain color? The Nfb canes don't have the reflective >> tape >> the amvutech canes have. Cane decorating sounds like fun. >> >> >> Anjelina >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 28, 2010, at 11:35 PM, "Maryann Migliorelli" >> >> wrote: >> >>> I'm sure that at the next NAGDU meeting, I will be forced to say, "Hi, >>> My name is Maryann, and I have a long, white cane whose name is >>> Edith." Why Edith you may ask. Edith means extended device for >>> identification by touch of hazards. >>> >>> Enjoy that one for what it's worth, and have a great week. >>> >>> Maryann Migliorelli >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/anjelinac26%40 >>> gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/raniaismail04%40gmai >> l.com >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >> Version: 9.0.791 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2776 - Release Date: 03/28/10 >> 13:32:00 >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat2%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/daydreamingncolor%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pdonahue1%40sbcglobal.net From herekittykat2 at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 21:40:38 2010 From: herekittykat2 at gmail.com (Jewel S.) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 17:40:38 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane In-Reply-To: <02BC6CBFCAF44D78B6648C2665482A70@azizaLatD430> References: <20100329072525.17857.17732@web3> <02BC6CBFCAF44D78B6648C2665482A70@azizaLatD430> Message-ID: <196c01b01003291440u773ae733q53e3e8eb44293634@mail.gmail.com> I would imagine that a cane other than white would be considered the equivalent of a walking stick or such. It would give the carrier no extra access rights, but nor would it make the carrier any more responsible. It would be the same as if the blind person was walking with neither white cane or guide dog. Just don't expect cars to yield to your rainbow-coloured cane...not that they yield anyway. ~Jewel On 3/29/10, Aziza Cano wrote: > I agree with Jedi. Do our canes have to be white? Why should thier be a > special identification symbol to identify us as blind. The sighted public > sees a blind person and reacts a certain way. But would they treat us > differently if they did not know that we were blind just by looking at us? > Do we not deserve that sense of normalcy as well? I view my cane as a travel > aid. It increases my confidence and independence, I do not think of it as a > method of which to let others know I am blind, because frankly, its none of > their business. If I require assistance I will ask for it, until then, I > would like to be reguarded as just another person. > Aziza > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jedi" > To: > Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 1:25 AM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane > > >> It seems to me the question we should be asking is why canes are white in >> the first place. >> >> Originally, the cane was painted white as a way of telling drivers to stop >> >> for the blind. It was a member of the Lions Club that had the idea in the >> first place because he observed a blind man having difficulty in crossing >> a street because there was too much traffic. Now, we say that the white >> cane makes it easier to see us and so cars are required to stop. It is >> also worth noting that cars are supposed to stop for all pedestrians. So >> what we are saying is that blind people need more notice. Why? I agree >> that until electric cars make noise, they do need to stop for us because >> we can't hear them. But again, they should stop for everyone because no >> one can really hear them. >> >> The white cane laws are civil rights laws that basically say that blind >> people cannot be automatically held accountable for any injuries that >> occur to them based on the idea that they should know better than to be >> out in the world in the first place. Are we now saying that if the cane >> isn't white so people know we're blind, then any accidents that occur as a >> >> result are our fault? White cane laws require that blind people should be >> treated as anyone else whether injuries occur or not. The white cane laws >> also say that a blind person shall not be discriminated against as we >> travel in the world. Really and truly, the laws were meant to protect the >> person, not the cane itself. >> >> What I'm getting at is this. The white cane is currently a symbol by which >> >> the sighted recognize us by, and that symbol tells the sighted that they >> need to treat us a certain way. . Would things really change if we changed >> >> the colors of our canes? Or would attitudes have to change because now >> we're saying that it really isn't the responsibility of the sighted to >> look out for the blind specifically? What do you think? >> >> Respectfully, >> Jedi >> >> >> Original message: >>> Greetings, Knowing some of the lawyers that I do, they could definitely >>> make that argument stick in court. >>> I don't blame you if you want to paint your cane, but your question >>> should >>> definitely be considered carefully before you do it. >>> I do know someone who has a few support canes which happen to coordinate >>> with her outfits, but her white cane is definitely still white. >> >>> Have fun with your new one no matter what color it turns out to be. >>> Maryann Migliorelli >> >> >> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net >> >> -- >> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/daydreamingncolor%40gmail.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat2%40gmail.com > From blackbyrdfly at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 22:56:21 2010 From: blackbyrdfly at gmail.com (Jamie Principato) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 18:56:21 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane In-Reply-To: References: <20100329072525.17857.17732@web3> <196c01b01003290858y1b785d08g6620f845e8cfe499@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: If the law allows a blind person to not use a cane at all, then there is nothing that prohibits a blind person from using a cane of a different color. It would be no different from carrying a colored stick just for the hell of it. On Mon, Mar 29, 2010 at 3:41 PM, Aziza Cano wrote: > But, legally does this apply to different colored canes? I think that > section refers to people who choose not to use a travel aid, like the high > parcials that do not wish to use a cane. Just a thought. > Aziza > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jewel S." > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" < > nabs-l at nfbnet.org> > Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 9:58 AM > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane > > > In all of the White Cane Laws that I've seen, there is a secotion that >> says that no blind person shall be held accountable if not using a >> white cane or guide dog. I don't recall the exact wording for my >> state, but it basically say that a blind person cannot be made >> accountable through negligence for not having a white cane or guide >> dog. I don't see why a person couldn't have a black cane, red cane, or >> rainbow cane, if they wanted. Just don't expect epople to recognize >> your visual impairment if you don't have a white cane. Be prepared to >> do more explaining, and explaining why you don't have a white cane. >> >> ~Jewel >> >> On 3/29/10, Briley Pollard wrote: >> >>> I did consider the matching with purse and shoes aspect too... but maybe >>> that is because I'm admittedly a bit overly conscious of things matching. >>> On Mar 29, 2010, at 3:40 AM, Sarah Jevnikar wrote: >>> >>> Hi all, >>>> I used to decorate my cane for every season or holiday when I was >>>> younger >>>> and I think it's a cool idea but I have different concerns. >>>> >>>> I'm sorry; I feel like a party pooper but here they are. >>>> >>>> Decorated canes are fun but what do they say about us? Unprofessional >>>> comes >>>> to mind, as most of us are at the age where we're looking for summer or >>>> full-time employment. But perhaps temporary decorations would be ok ... >>>> >>>> Now on a different note, a cane spans from the belt area (and purse area >>>> too, depending on your preference or length of strap) to a person's >>>> shoes. >>>> So, which should it match? Belt/purse or shoes? Or should they all >>>> coordinate? >>>> >>>> Just something to ponder. >>>> >>>> Sarah Jevnikar >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>>> Behalf >>>> Of Jedi >>>> Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 3:25 AM >>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane >>>> >>>> It seems to me the question we should be asking is why canes are white >>>> in the first place. >>>> >>>> Originally, the cane was painted white as a way of telling drivers to >>>> stop for the blind. It was a member of the Lions Club that had the idea >>>> in the first place because he observed a blind man having difficulty in >>>> crossing a street because there was too much traffic. Now, we say that >>>> the white cane makes it easier to see us and so cars are required to >>>> stop. It is also worth noting that cars are supposed to stop for all >>>> pedestrians. So what we are saying is that blind people need more >>>> notice. Why? I agree that until electric cars make noise, they do need >>>> to stop for us because we can't hear them. But again, they should stop >>>> for everyone because no one can really hear them. >>>> >>>> The white cane laws are civil rights laws that basically say that blind >>>> people cannot be automatically held accountable for any injuries that >>>> occur to them based on the idea that they should know better than to be >>>> out in the world in the first place. Are we now saying that if the cane >>>> isn't white so people know we're blind, then any accidents that occur >>>> as a result are our fault? White cane laws require that blind people >>>> should be treated as anyone else whether injuries occur or not. The >>>> white cane laws also say that a blind person shall not be discriminated >>>> against as we travel in the world. Really and truly, the laws were >>>> meant to protect the person, not the cane itself. >>>> >>>> What I'm getting at is this. The white cane is currently a symbol by >>>> which the sighted recognize us by, and that symbol tells the sighted >>>> that they need to treat us a certain way. . Would things really change >>>> if we changed the colors of our canes? Or would attitudes have to >>>> change because now we're saying that it really isn't the responsibility >>>> of the sighted to look out for the blind specifically? What do you >>>> think? >>>> >>>> Respectfully, >>>> Jedi >>>> >>>> >>>> Original message: >>>> >>>>> Greetings, Knowing some of the lawyers that I do, they could >>>>> definitely >>>>> make that argument stick in court. >>>>> I don't blame you if you want to paint your cane, but your question >>>>> should >>>>> definitely be considered carefully before you do it. >>>>> I do know someone who has a few support canes which happen to >>>>> coordinate >>>>> with her outfits, but her white cane is definitely still white. >>>>> >>>> >>>> Have fun with your new one no matter what color it turns out to be. >>>>> Maryann Migliorelli >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >>>> bile.net >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto >>>> ronto.ca >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat2%40gmail.com >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/daydreamingncolor%40gmail.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com > From dandrews at visi.com Tue Mar 30 00:02:39 2010 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 19:02:39 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] naming your cane In-Reply-To: <000701cacf82$74ec1ed0$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> References: <001901cacef0$e6687a00$b3396e00$@org> <1E92192B-DE5A-460D-B0E5-7C8F27BF52C4@gmail.com> <406373D3C197456C8687A7F6C91EBAA8@RainaIsmailPC> <196c01b01003290853w42baf4edlbc4073724056ac89@mail.gmail.com> <3E82EF92FA844D0CA701BD0CEDF8A086@azizaLatD430> <000701cacf82$74ec1ed0$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> Message-ID: That footer is on one of my computers, and it was "David Andrews and Long White Cane Harry." I started using it because of all the elaborate signatures some guide dog users have -- which are overdone in my opinion. I am sorry if that offends some of you dogsters but that is how I feel. Dave At 03:57 PM 3/29/2010, you wrote: >Hello Azizza and everyone, > David Andrews calls his came "Harry." I believe he still has a message >signature that reads, >"David Andrews and white cane Harry." > >Peter Donahue From loneblindjedi at samobile.net Tue Mar 30 00:08:50 2010 From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 20:08:50 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane Message-ID: <20100330000850.10105.73173@web1> Well, I would think it should apply. Respectfully, Jedi Original message: > But, legally does this apply to different colored canes? I think that > section refers to people who choose not to use a travel aid, like the high > parcials that do not wish to use a cane. Just a thought. > Aziza > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jewel S." > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 9:58 AM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane >> In all of the White Cane Laws that I've seen, there is a secotion that >> says that no blind person shall be held accountable if not using a >> white cane or guide dog. I don't recall the exact wording for my >> state, but it basically say that a blind person cannot be made >> accountable through negligence for not having a white cane or guide >> dog. I don't see why a person couldn't have a black cane, red cane, or >> rainbow cane, if they wanted. Just don't expect epople to recognize >> your visual impairment if you don't have a white cane. Be prepared to >> do more explaining, and explaining why you don't have a white cane. >> ~Jewel >> On 3/29/10, Briley Pollard wrote: >>> I did consider the matching with purse and shoes aspect too... but maybe >>> that is because I'm admittedly a bit overly conscious of things matching. >>> On Mar 29, 2010, at 3:40 AM, Sarah Jevnikar wrote: >>>> Hi all, >>>> I used to decorate my cane for every season or holiday when I was >>>> younger >>>> and I think it's a cool idea but I have different concerns. >>>> I'm sorry; I feel like a party pooper but here they are. >>>> Decorated canes are fun but what do they say about us? Unprofessional >>>> comes >>>> to mind, as most of us are at the age where we're looking for summer or >>>> full-time employment. But perhaps temporary decorations would be ok ... >>>> Now on a different note, a cane spans from the belt area (and purse area >>>> too, depending on your preference or length of strap) to a person's >>>> shoes. >>>> So, which should it match? Belt/purse or shoes? Or should they all >>>> coordinate? >>>> Just something to ponder. >>>> Sarah Jevnikar >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On >>>> Behalf >>>> Of Jedi >>>> Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 3:25 AM >>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Pimp My Cane >>>> It seems to me the question we should be asking is why canes are white >>>> in the first place. >>>> Originally, the cane was painted white as a way of telling drivers to >>>> stop for the blind. It was a member of the Lions Club that had the idea >>>> in the first place because he observed a blind man having difficulty in >>>> crossing a street because there was too much traffic. Now, we say that >>>> the white cane makes it easier to see us and so cars are required to >>>> stop. It is also worth noting that cars are supposed to stop for all >>>> pedestrians. So what we are saying is that blind people need more >>>> notice. Why? I agree that until electric cars make noise, they do need >>>> to stop for us because we can't hear them. But again, they should stop >>>> for everyone because no one can really hear them. >>>> The white cane laws are civil rights laws that basically say that blind >>>> people cannot be automatically held accountable for any injuries that >>>> occur to them based on the idea that they should know better than to be >>>> out in the world in the first place. Are we now saying that if the cane >>>> isn't white so people know we're blind, then any accidents that occur >>>> as a result are our fault? White cane laws require that blind people >>>> should be treated as anyone else whether injuries occur or not. The >>>> white cane laws also say that a blind person shall not be discriminated >>>> against as we travel in the world. Really and truly, the laws were >>>> meant to protect the person, not the cane itself. >>>> What I'm getting at is this. The white cane is currently a symbol by >>>> which the sighted recognize us by, and that symbol tells the sighted >>>> that they need to treat us a certain way. . Would things really change >>>> if we changed the colors of our canes? Or would attitudes have to >>>> change because now we're saying that it really isn't the responsibility >>>> of the sighted to look out for the blind specifically? What do you >>>> think? >>>> Respectfully, >>>> Jedi >>>> Original message: >>>>> Greetings, Knowing some of the lawyers that I do, they could >>>>> definitely >>>>> make that argument stick in court. >>>>> I don't blame you if you want to paint your cane, but your question >>>>> should >>>>> definitely be considered carefully before you do it. >>>>> I do know someone who has a few support canes which happen to >>>>> coordinate >>>>> with her outfits, but her white cane is definitely still white. >>>>> Have fun with your new one no matter what color it turns out to be. >>>>> Maryann Migliorelli >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samo >>>> bile.net >>>> -- >>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto >>>> ronto.ca >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%40gmail.com >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat2%40gmail.com >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/daydreamingncolor%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net -- Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. From sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca Tue Mar 30 00:28:09 2010 From: sarah.jevnikar at utoronto.ca (Sarah Jevnikar) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 20:28:09 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] naming your cane In-Reply-To: References: <001901cacef0$e6687a00$b3396e00$@org> <1E92192B-DE5A-460D-B0E5-7C8F27BF52C4@gmail.com> <406373D3C197456C8687A7F6C91EBAA8@RainaIsmailPC> <196c01b01003290853w42baf4edlbc4073724056ac89@mail.gmail.com> <3E82EF92FA844D0CA701BD0CEDF8A086@azizaLatD430> <000701cacf82$74ec1ed0$4001a8c0@yourfsyly0jtwn> Message-ID: <002501cacf9f$e1307740$a39165c0$@jevnikar@utoronto.ca> I always wondered about the "long white cane Harry" ... I'm with you Dave. If I do get a dog they will not be part of my e-mail signature, but that's just me. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of David Andrews Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 8:03 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] naming your cane That footer is on one of my computers, and it was "David Andrews and Long White Cane Harry." I started using it because of all the elaborate signatures some guide dog users have -- which are overdone in my opinion. I am sorry if that offends some of you dogsters but that is how I feel. Dave At 03:57 PM 3/29/2010, you wrote: >Hello Azizza and everyone, > David Andrews calls his came "Harry." I believe he still has a message >signature that reads, >"David Andrews and white cane Harry." > >Peter Donahue _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jevnikar%40uto ronto.ca From dlawless86 at gmail.com Tue Mar 30 01:08:03 2010 From: dlawless86 at gmail.com (Domonique Lawless) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 20:08:03 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Not Just Your Average Cane In-Reply-To: References: <20100329023200.2291.74806@web2> <1B8F1495-D32C-434E-AEBC-77714C78F2B8@gmail.com> <423e6e461003290850w13b459a0vf3ab1d31ee8a8a0@mail.gmail.com> <5702A487EF4D4A9E8F06E2034668D16E@azizaLatD430> Message-ID: <423e6e461003291808n283a0f7cu3ff3ca8c770490cc@mail.gmail.com> Jamie, That's a really cool idea. I'd like to try that some day. Domonique On 3/29/10, Jamie Principato wrote: > I just had a cool idea that I thought I'd share. I've found that my > telescoping cane comes apart if you take off the cap at the top and let the > sections fall out. If you have more than one telescoping cane, you could > paint the different sections of one and leave the other white, and mix and > match. If one day you want a very colorful cane, use the colored one. If you > only feel like a little pizazz another day, swap out a few of the colored > sections for white ones and just leave one or two bands colored, maybe the > handle and tip. Or you could go all white if, say, you're going out at night > and want to be very visible. > > On Mon, Mar 29, 2010 at 3:42 PM, Aziza Cano > wrote: > >> That's a good idea. That way it isn't a done deal if it doesn't work out. >> Aziza >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Domonique Lawless" < >> dlawless86 at gmail.com> >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" < >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org> >> Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 9:50 AM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Not Just Your Average Cane >> >> >> Joe and Fellow Listers, >>> >>> I don't know if this has already been mentioned, but it is perfectly >>> exceptable to have multiple canes. If you own more than one you can >>> pick one to decorate and see if it will work for you and still ensure >>> your safety when traveling. Let us know how the decorating works out >>> for you. >>> >>> Domonique . >>> >>> On 3/28/10, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>> >>>> Hey I named my cane joseph. Well that one got run over by a wheel chair >>>> and >>>> joseph junior got smashed in a door so now joseph junior is back. lol. >>>> >>>> but in all seriousness good luck and be careful when decorating your >>>> cane. >>>> not to much in my opinion but maybe you could do something that would >>>> catch >>>> a driver's attention so they could see you better. >>>> >>>> Take care.. >>>> s >>>> On Mar 28, 2010, at 7:32 PM, Jedi wrote: >>>> >>>> No worries Joe. I once called my cane Fido because I got sick of people >>>>> who would ask me if I had a dog. I then responde with "Yes, he's a >>>>> skinny >>>>> white lab!" I like yours though. >>>>> >>>>> Respectfully, >>>>> Jedi >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Original message: >>>>> >>>>>> Hi Mark, >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Having started the thread, I feel compelled to respond to your >>>>>> thoughtful >>>>>> post. It goes without say that people's opinions here do not reflect >>>>>> any >>>>>> official NFB positions, and I honestly doubt the NFB would genuinely >>>>>> care >>>>>> if >>>>>> all its members suddenly decided to sport a wide range of colorfully >>>>>> decorated canes. I think Dr. Maurer would probably find the concept >>>>>> amusing, and doesn't Whozit sport a black cane in our logo? That >>>>>> fellow >>>>>> was >>>>>> far ahead of the curve. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> For my own part, I'm headed to Michael's sometime soon to embark upon >>>>> a >>>>>> project to transform my own cane into the walking wonder I know it can >>>>>> be. >>>>>> I think that in doing so I would do well to use a measure of practical >>>>>> sense. Security checkpoints at airports and federal buildings would >>>>>> probably not look kindly on a cane that is different from what is >>>>>> popularly >>>>>> accepted. We can't expect the world to automatically get that blind >>>>>> people >>>>>> have their own sense of pizzazz, and by the same token, we can't >>>>>> expect >>>>>> people to pick up on the fact we're blind at night if using something >>>>>> as >>>>>> obscure as a black cane, even though I agree with the previous >>>>>> subscriber >>>>>> that motorists should respect pedestrians with or without this new >>>>>> breed >>>>>> of >>>>>> eye candy. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> I'm glad people pointed out the jurisdictions that specifically call >>>>>> for >>>>>> the >>>>>> cane to be white. In asking my question, sarcasm notwithstanding, I >>>>>> was >>>>>> not >>>>>> really setting out to violate laws that are meant to preserve my >>>>>> safety, >>>>>> but >>>>>> I do not want these laws to tuck me away into a label that can be >>>>>> every >>>>>> bit >>>>>> as condescending as terms like "handicapped." If senior citizens can >>>>>> sport >>>>>> all manner of creatively designed walking canes, by golly, I want my >>>>>> own >>>>>> mode of transportation to broadcast my own sense of humor. It's not >>>>>> as >>>>>> if I >>>>>> can smack a bumper sticker on my German shepherd's butt and call it >>>>>> good, >>>>>> although, can you imagine the wide range of clever slogans one could >>>>>> produce >>>>>> with that kind of strategic angle? >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> All of this having been said, I spent nearly a year working on behalf >>>>>> of >>>>>> victims of human trafficking. I learned all about the negative >>>>>> connotations >>>>>> associated with words like "pimping," and for using that term to catch >>>>>> your >>>>>> attention, I am truly sorry. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> In summation, I think the responses on both lists to which the >>>>> question >>>>>> went >>>>>> out has been mostly positive. It's no scientific survey, but I think >>>>>> it >>>>>> is >>>>>> at least slightly indicative of the membership's willingness to >>>>>> explore >>>>>> the >>>>>> idea or at least humor my nonsense. People who have given more >>>>>> straight-laced responses are no doubt secretly glad they're not the >>>>>> only >>>>>> ones who thought of this, because original this idea is most certainly >>>>>> not. >>>>>> Let's leave out the references to accessible currency and other >>>>>> controversial topics out of it this time around. We debate those >>>>>> serious >>>>>> issues all the time and should enjoy the all too infrequent light >>>>>> banter. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Best, >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Joe Orozco and the Soon to Be Improved Sir Tap-A-Lot >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> What, as if you haven't ever thought of giving your cane a name??? >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their >>>>>> sleeves, >>>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org >>>>>> [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mark BurningHawk >>>>>> Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:51 PM >>>>>> To: NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List >>>>>> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] Pimp My Cane >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> I'm following this thread, and I know a large percentage of the folks >>>>>> here are NFB members; I personally a not, nor any organization, for >>>>>> that matter. I find a bit of hypocrisy in this discussion: First the >>>>>> NFB rails against things like audible cross walk signals and so on, >>>>>> claiming that the blind don't need them, that it's not what the blind >>>>>> "want," whatever. Same with identifiable currency. Now, however, I >>>>>> hear a bunch of the same people saying, in effect, "I want to carry a >>>>>> symbol of blindness! I want to proclaim my blindness to everyone so >>>>>> that they can alter their behaviors appropriately in recognition of >>>>>> the fact that I'm blind!" I should think the true spirit of the NFB >>>>>> might be to use a black cane and give no indication whatsoever of >>>>>> blindness, except on a purely voluntary basis. I just don't >>>>>> understand this. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Mark BurningHawk >>>>>> Skype and Twitter: BurningHawk1969 >>>>>> Home: Http://MarkBurningHawk.net/ >>>>>> Namaste! >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> blindlaw mailing list >>>>>> blindlaw at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>> info for blindlaw: >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/jsoroz >>>>>> co%40gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of >>>>>> virus signature database 4980 (20100328) __________ >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> http://www.eset.com >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>>>>> signature >>>>>> database 4980 (20100328) __________ >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> http://www.eset.com >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network. Visit >>>>> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere. >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/marrie12%40gmail.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dlawless86%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/daydreamingncolor%40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com >> > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dlawless86%40gmail.com > From corbbo at gmail.com Tue Mar 30 14:07:22 2010 From: corbbo at gmail.com (Corbb O'Connor) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2010 10:07:22 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: MEAFlink: Webinar -- Creating an Accessible Outdoor Service Site from the Utah Conservation Corps References: <4397BAE4D075B04B942AD75DF3DAE7AC09F2C3A5@cyexc00.meus.corp> Message-ID: <134B71DA-1967-4B11-801F-406CE050D48B@gmail.com> Hi folks, MEAF, the Mitsubishi Electric America Foundation, is a great group, and this webinar looks very interesting. With recent discussions on the NABS list about community service as a blind person, this webinar may be of interest to some of you. Note that the registration deadline is easy to remember: noon on Tax Day, April 15! (By the way, if the name MEAF sounds familiar, it is because they sponsor the American Association of People with Disabilities' Summer Congressional Internship Program...something all of you should apply for at some point during your three summers of college!) Corbb Begin forwarded message: From: "Berg, Allison" Date: March 30, 2010 9:41:22 AM EDT Subject: MEAFlink: Webinar -- Creating an Accessible Outdoor Service Site from the Utah Conservation Corps MEAF is pleased to be a co-presenter on a National Service Inclusion Project webinar featuring MEAF grantee The Corps Network and the Utah Conservation Corps. The webinar will introduce participants to strategies for developing inclusive volunteer service opportunities and the newly issued Inclusion Crew Toolkit. We hope you will join us on April 16th. Please feel free to share this announcement with your networks. Webinar: Creating an Accessible Outdoor Service Site from the Utah Conservation Corps Date: Friday, April 16th, Time: 3:00pm – 4:00pm EST (2:00 PM Central, 1:00 PM Mountain, 12:00 PM Pacific) The National Service Inclusion Project (NSIP) is pleased to announce our next web conference to be held on Friday, April 16th at 3:00pm EST. NSIP is pleased to be joined by Kevin Webb, Director of the Mitsubishi Electric America Foundation, Kate Stephens, Assistant Director of the AmeriCorps Utah Conservation Corps, and Jeff Sheen, Training Development Specialist for the Center for Persons with Disabilities. This web conference will provide an overview of the AmeriCorps Utah Conservation Corps, strategies for making outdoor sites accessible to individuals with disabilities, and reasonable accommodations you can implement within your own site to ensure equal access and participation. Specifically, we will discuss: - An overview of the inclusion efforts at the Utah Conservation Corps - Specific reasonable accommodations the Utah Conservation Corps has provided - Specific strategies for developing physically accessible outdoor service projects - Development of accessible community gardens - A toolkit created to guide programs in the development of inclusive service and conservation corps programs Featured Speakers: Mr. Kevin Webb, MA Director Mitsubishi Electric America Foundation Ms. Kate Stephens, MA Assistant Director Utah Conservation Corps Mr. Jeff Sheen, MA Training Development Specialist Center for Persons with Disabilities To register for this event, please email nsip at umb.edu by 12:00 PM EST on Thursday, April 15th with the following info: -Name -Organization -Email -Phone -If you require CART* to participate, please also indicate that in your email. Please note: We will send out confirmation emails by Thursday afternoon, April 15th with instructions how to sign into the web conference. *CART service provides instantaneous translation of the speech text using real-time software. Teleconference participants receive caption services over the web. This is an accommodation we provide to participants who are Deaf or hard of hearing. The National Service Inclusion Project (NSIP) is training and technical assistance provider on disability inclusion, under a cooperative agreement (#08TAHMA001) from Corporation for National and Community Service (CNCS). NSIP partners with the Association on University Centers on Disability, National Council on Independent Living, Association on Higher Education and Disability and National Down Syndrome Congress to build connections among disability organizations and all CNCS grantees, to increase the participation of people with disabilities in national service. --- Spread the word: Potential AmeriCorps members can apply online and AmeriCorps programs can post opportunities at http://www.americorps.gov From kc2992a at student.american.edu Tue Mar 30 20:12:03 2010 From: kc2992a at student.american.edu (Katy Carroll) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2010 16:12:03 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] studying abroad In-Reply-To: <73D58BBD-7E5D-41F9-8656-5FE07C03558B@gmail.com> References: <3fea3c411003290833l179ed83ajcebbe63d09b65bce@mail.gmail.com> <73D58BBD-7E5D-41F9-8656-5FE07C03558B@gmail.com> Message-ID: <2fdbeb321003301312g46385857vf8901601f51c4259@mail.gmail.com> I am also happy to be a resource. I studied abroad in Paris, France. -Kate On Mon, Mar 29, 2010 at 4:08 PM, Corbb O'Connor wrote: > I am happy to be a resource to any of the students at the NC seminar, or > anybody else on this list who has questions. I studied in Galway, Ireland, > but I evaluated studying abroad in a Spanish-speaking country. > > > On Mar 29, 2010, at 11:33 AM, Cindy Bennett wrote: > > At the NC student seminar, a couple of students had questions about > studying abroad as a blind person, and there was no one present with > experience, so i said i would ask around. I also had someone ask about > it in an lj community i am in, so, i was curious if those of you, > particularly these who have studied abroad in Spanish speaking > countries wouldn't mind emailing me, and letting me put you in touch > with the students who were interested. > > I think this could be a good conference call topic as well. > > Cindy > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/corbbo%40gmail.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kc2992a%40student.american.edu > -- Kathryn CARROLL American University 631 521 3018 From braille at nbpcb.org Tue Mar 30 21:00:14 2010 From: braille at nbpcb.org (Louise Walch) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2010 16:00:14 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] NCLB Braille Exam at NFB Convention Message-ID: Hello all, Testing for National Certification in Literary Braille (NCLB). will be held at this year's NFB National Convention in Dallas this July. Date: Sunday and Monday, July 4-5, 2010 Time: 1-5pm on both days Location: Hilton Anatole Hotel 2201 Stemmons Freeway Dallas, Texas 75207 Cost: $250 (or $75 per single section) Application deadline: Sunday, June 13, 2010 *Unless otherwise notified, candidates must be present for all four sections. Sections one and two will be offered on Sunday, july 4, and sections three and four will be offered on Monday, July 5. To apply online go to: https://nbpcb.org/members/login.php?r=/members/er.php?eid=41 For further information please contact Louise Walch, NCLB coordinator at braille at nbpcb.org or call 318-257-4554. Thanks, Louise Louise Walch NCLB Braille Exam Coordinator braille at nbpcb.org www.nbpcb.org Louise G. Walch NBPCB Coordinator braille at nbpcb.org www.nbpcb.org