[nabs-l] AFB now accepting scholarship applications
Tara Annis
TAnnis at afb.net
Thu Jan 6 19:30:53 UTC 2011
I just wanted to let everyone know that the American Foundation for the Blind (AFB) is now accepting applications for our 2011 scholarships.
You can go directly to the form by visiting www.afb.org/scholarships.asp. Our homepage, www.afb.org, has a link to the form, under the "headlines" section as well.
I have sent this announcement to the NFB parents of blind children listserv and AER listserv, but would like more advertisement; so please feel free to spread the word by sending information to other listservs, make announcements on your Facebook pages, or through word of mouth. You can contact me, if you have any questions.
Tara Annis
Information Specialist
American Foundation for the Blind
1000 fifth Ave.
Suite 350
Huntington, WV 25701
Phone: (304) 710-3035
E-mail: tannis at afb.net
Visit our web site at: www.afb.org
Expanding possibilities for people with vision loss (TM)
Information provided in this message is for educational and informational use only and is not intended as medical advice or as an endorsement of any product.
-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of nabs-l-request at nfbnet.org
Sent: Wednesday, January 05, 2011 1:00 PM
To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
Subject: nabs-l Digest, Vol 51, Issue 4
Send nabs-l mailing list submissions to
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
nabs-l-request at nfbnet.org
You can reach the person managing the list at
nabs-l-owner at nfbnet.org
When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of nabs-l digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: baltimore maryland (Kat Bottner)
2. Re: books on blind history (Steve Jacobson)
3. Re: Blindness and Psychology (Mary Fernandez)
4. Re: Need Guidance: Several Heavily Visual Labs Coming Up
(Brian Hatgelakas)
5. Re: books on blind history (Scott C. LaBarre)
6. Re: Need Guidance: Several Heavily Visual Labs Coming Up
(Steve Jacobson)
7. Re: White House Disability Group Call: Monday Jan. 10 at 3:00
PM (Courtney Stover)
8. Re: White House Disability Group Call: Monday Jan. 10 at 3:00
PM (Anita Adkins)
9. Re: Need Guidance: Several Heavily Visual Labs Coming Up
(Arielle Silverman)
10. NABS State Division Contact Info (Arielle Silverman)
11. NABS Bulletin Announcements (Arielle Silverman)
12. Procedure for writing Words, Music and Plain-song using dots
(1829) in DAISY format (Greg Kearney)
13. Adobe In Design (humberto)
14. FW: [nfbwnews] FW: [blindlaw] Great Opinion in Enyart v. NCBE
(Carrie Gilmer)
15. kurzweil or new docuscanPlus? (Josh Kennedy)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2011 13:28:28 -0500
From: Kat Bottner <kat.bottner at gmail.com>
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] baltimore maryland
Message-ID:
<AANLkTimhOz5qdGOfZ_q+h4yck7EcE9L2UKnj-P2fy+mQ at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Hey Josh,
I've been back and forth to Baltimore from Delaware and like you, want
to move there at some point. I've noticed that paratransit is better,
and yes they do have busses and just a better over all transportation
system. I want to work at the Maryland School for the Blind as a
teachers's assistant, I passed the national certified test for the
state of Maryland. I was three points off the needed score for
Delaware, but we don't have a school for the blind here, only a school
for the deaf, that does have a deaf-blind program , but it's not the
same as working in a school for the blind.
I'm very intrested in what Maryland has to offer the blind community,
I dont' think I've ever said I dont like something I've heard about
their services etc. I have friends there, and they tell me nothing
but totally awesome things about the over all services, transportation
and any other general programs that people with disabilities can take
advantage of.
Another plus is that the NFB headquarters is in Baltimore as well, so
again, that's a reason for me to relocate at some point. I hope all
this information helps, if you have any other question, feel free to e
mail me off list.
Thanks and take care,
Kat
On 1/4/11, Josh Kennedy <jkenn337 at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi
>
> Are there lots of blind people who have jobs living in Baltimore
> Maryland? Once I get my bachelors degree from capella university I would
> like to try and find a job there and move there. There are no jobs in
> the information technology field here in Berks County in the city of
> Reading Pennsylvania Berks county Pennsylvania unfortunately. I will
> have to move if I want work. I would like to live in a place where I
> could take a bus or train and go to the beach frequently in the summer.
> Also Baltimore has an aquarium with dolphins. I never saw dolphins
> before, was interested in what they are like since I was little. I'm now
> 28 years old. Plus Baltimore has inner harbor and its a fairly big city.
> Much bigger than Reading PA. My wife bought me a kapten gps for
> christmas. I already have a trekker breeze and we're short or I'm short
> on money this month so I'll send the kapten back, get money back for it
> and use that money to pay for my college textbooks. The trekker breeze
> works fine for me. its a tough little deice like the nls player is made
> to last so is the breeze. Humanware did a good job with its construction.
>
>
> Josh
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kat.bottner%40gmail.com
>
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Tue, 04 Jan 2011 12:32:06 -0600
From: "Steve Jacobson" <steve.jacobson at visi.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] books on blind history
Message-ID: <auto-000023831175 at mailback2.g2host.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Dr. Jernigan gave an interesting banquet address called "Blindness, Is History Against Us" perhaps from 1973 or so which notes that blind people have
been more a part of history than commonly believed. He covers a few who were quite well-known but are not commonly heard of today. You might find that
interesting. The text can be found at
http://nfb.org/legacy/fr/fr1/fr92fl17.htm
I found this to be very interesting when I read it for the first time many years ago, but I ended up almost reading the whole thing now while looking for it.
When doing a search on NFB.ORG, I did not find the text of "Hope Deferred," but there are a number of references to it. I did find a PDF version within
GoogleBooks for $5 but don't know about the accessibility. This may still be copyrighted.
Best regards,
Steve Jacobson
On Tue, 04 Jan 2011 09:40:13 -0500, Anita Adkins wrote:
>Hello,
>First, let me apologize to this list about my mistakes in the previous
>email. I usually proofread before I send an email, but of course, this time
>when it would matter, I failed to do that.
>The book you mention is by a major contributor to the cause of the NFB, and
>I imagine if it is available, it is probably in their library, also, I
>believe, named after him, and so you may call and speak with someone at the
>NFB store about this publication because if it is available for purchase or
>otherwise, they will know it. Also, the NFB has other publications related
>to blindness that you may find interesting. The contact info for them is
>below.
>The phone number for questions or concerns is 410-659-9314, ext. 2216
>the book section of the Independence Market at the NFB address is:
>http://secure.nfb.org/ecommerce/asp/prodtype.asp?prodtype=57
>Anita
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Dennis Clark" <dennisgclark at sbcglobal.net>
>To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
><nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>Sent: Tuesday, January 04, 2011 9:12 AM
>Subject: [nabs-l] books on blind history
>> Hello Everyone,
>> I am hoping to get the titles and authors of any books on blindness which
>> you may have found helpful or educational. Many many years ago I read a
>> book called "hope Deferred" by Jacobus Tendbrook (probably misspelled). I
>> think it was written in the 1940's, and my memory is that I learned a lot
>> about the history of blindness from the book. I just looked on Bookshare
>> for Hope Deferred, but it is not there. If anyone can tell me where I
>> might be able to get a copy of this, along with any other titles about the
>> history of blindness which you have found worthwhile, I would really
>> appreciate it.
>> Warmest regards,
>> Dennis
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/aadkins7%40verizon.net
>_______________________________________________
>nabs-l mailing list
>nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/steve.jacobson%40visi.com
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2011 14:45:36 -0500
From: Mary Fernandez <trillian551 at gmail.com>
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Blindness and Psychology
Message-ID:
<AANLkTinofr5_dzq=W7ctz9zWJ-FSyU72Y3uuM3bE4F3T at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Hi Nicole,
This is an extremely interesting topic, and I know there is some
literature out there on it. I would suggest that you use your college
databases, and research that question. I would start with PsychInfo
and branch off from there. The sage journal has the latest in psych
research usually. So if your on campus on the school network just do a
google scholar search and see what you find.
I'll probably go ahead and look around myself too. But let us know
what kind of stuff you find.
Sincerely,
Mary
On 1/3/11, Nicole B. Torcolini at Home <ntorcolini at wavecable.com> wrote:
> This quarter, I am taking a psychology course. In the book, it talks
> about imagery in the brain. Does anyone know of a resource that talks about
> the affect that blindness can have on this function of the brain?
>
> Thanks,
> Nicole
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/trillian551%40gmail.com
>
--
Mary Fernandez
Emory University 2012
P.O. Box 123056
Atlanta Ga.
30322
Phone: 732-857-7004
"Books are the quietest and most constant of friends; they are the
most accessible and wisest of counselors, and the most patient of
teachers."
Charles W. Eliot
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Tue, 04 Jan 2011 14:50:08 -0500
From: "Brian Hatgelakas" <brian.hatgelakas at verizon.net>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Need Guidance: Several Heavily Visual Labs
Coming Up
Message-ID: <001001cbac48$990c3d10$9560c747 at BRIAN>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
reply-type=original
Why would you need this type of class for just a general studdies degree?
It baffles me? At scols like my almardara Point Park University in
Pittsburgh PA all you had to take was one general science class that was
based only on reading and lecture notes. I received an A. in that course!
The instructor made the course fun and interesting!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tina Hansen" <th404 at comcast.net>
To: <nfb-science at nfbnet.org>
Cc: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, January 04, 2011 1:26 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] Need Guidance: Several Heavily Visual Labs Coming Up
> You probably know that during the past quarter, I have been taking an
> environmental science course at my local community college for a General
> Studies degree. I'm in the second course in the series, and there are a
> number of labs coming up that either use chemicals, or are heavily
> dependent on measurements. I don't know if the lists accept attachments,
> but I felt the best way to give people an idea of what these labs are like
> is to send the information about them that I've gotten from my instructor.
> The instructor and I are not sure how to deal with these labs, but I
> figured that if you got a look at them, you could give me some ideas on
> how I might be able to participate and not just sit on the sidelines. So
> if you have any ideas on how I might deal with these labs, I'm all ears.
> Thanks.
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brian.hatgelakas%40verizon.net
>
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2011 12:51:53 -0700
From: "Scott C. LaBarre" <slabarre at labarrelaw.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] books on blind history
Message-ID: <41AF5421452C4E6CB186F0AC1947ADB2 at labarre>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
I apologize if this suggestion has been made already but I haven't been able
to review all the posts. You should contact our Jacobus tenBroek Library
and ask the library staff to give you research leads. They may also be able
to tell you how to get an accessible version of Hope Defered etc. Call 410
659-9314 and ask for the tenBroek Library.
Scott C. LaBarre, Esq.
LaBarre Law Offices P.C.
1660 South Albion Street, Ste. 918
Denver, Colorado 80222
303 504-5979 (voice)
303 757-3640 (fax)
slabarre at labarrelaw.com (e-mail)
www.labarrelaw.com (website)
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This message may contain confidential and privileged
information. If you are not the designated recipient, you may not read,
copy, distribute or retain this message. If you received this message in
error, please notify the sender at 303) 504-5979 or slabarre at labarrelaw.com,
and destroy and delete it from your system. This message and any attachments
are covered by the Electronic
Communications Privacy Act, 18 U.S.C. ?? 2510-2521.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Jacobson" <steve.jacobson at visi.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, January 04, 2011 11:32 AM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] books on blind history
> Dr. Jernigan gave an interesting banquet address called "Blindness, Is
> History Against Us" perhaps from 1973 or so which notes that blind people
> have
> been more a part of history than commonly believed. He covers a few who
> were quite well-known but are not commonly heard of today. You might find
> that
> interesting. The text can be found at
>
> http://nfb.org/legacy/fr/fr1/fr92fl17.htm
>
> I found this to be very interesting when I read it for the first time many
> years ago, but I ended up almost reading the whole thing now while looking
> for it.
>
> When doing a search on NFB.ORG, I did not find the text of "Hope
> Deferred," but there are a number of references to it. I did find a PDF
> version within
> GoogleBooks for $5 but don't know about the accessibility. This may still
> be copyrighted.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Steve Jacobson
>
> On Tue, 04 Jan 2011 09:40:13 -0500, Anita Adkins wrote:
>
>>Hello,
>
>>First, let me apologize to this list about my mistakes in the previous
>>email. I usually proofread before I send an email, but of course, this
>>time
>>when it would matter, I failed to do that.
>
>>The book you mention is by a major contributor to the cause of the NFB,
>>and
>>I imagine if it is available, it is probably in their library, also, I
>>believe, named after him, and so you may call and speak with someone at
>>the
>>NFB store about this publication because if it is available for purchase
>>or
>>otherwise, they will know it. Also, the NFB has other publications related
>>to blindness that you may find interesting. The contact info for them is
>>below.
>>The phone number for questions or concerns is 410-659-9314, ext. 2216
>>the book section of the Independence Market at the NFB address is:
>>http://secure.nfb.org/ecommerce/asp/prodtype.asp?prodtype=57
>
>>Anita
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: "Dennis Clark" <dennisgclark at sbcglobal.net>
>>To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
>><nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>Sent: Tuesday, January 04, 2011 9:12 AM
>>Subject: [nabs-l] books on blind history
>
>
>>> Hello Everyone,
>>> I am hoping to get the titles and authors of any books on blindness
>>> which
>>> you may have found helpful or educational. Many many years ago I read a
>>> book called "hope Deferred" by Jacobus Tendbrook (probably misspelled).
>>> I
>>> think it was written in the 1940's, and my memory is that I learned a
>>> lot
>>> about the history of blindness from the book. I just looked on
>>> Bookshare
>>> for Hope Deferred, but it is not there. If anyone can tell me where I
>>> might be able to get a copy of this, along with any other titles about
>>> the
>>> history of blindness which you have found worthwhile, I would really
>>> appreciate it.
>>> Warmest regards,
>>> Dennis
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/aadkins7%40verizon.net
>
>
>>_______________________________________________
>>nabs-l mailing list
>>nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>nabs-l:
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/steve.jacobson%40visi.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/slabarre%40labarrelaw.com
>
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Tue, 04 Jan 2011 14:39:32 -0600
From: "Steve Jacobson" <steve.jacobson at visi.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Need Guidance: Several Heavily Visual Labs
Coming Up
Message-ID: <auto-000023832923 at mailback2.g2host.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Tina,
There are a lot of considerations in figuring out how you deal with this. Let me start by saying that when I was in school, I took a general physics class
because it was an area I wanted to learn. The instructor was not happy and he did not want me to take the class at all, let alone the lab. My compromise
was to take the class without the lab and receive one less credit. After taking the class, which was near the beginning of my college experience, I learned
about other blind people who took similar labs. Since I took the class because I wanted to learn the subject, I have always regretted the fact that I didn't
take the lab. I also saw students strike up friendships in the less formal settings of a lab. I say all this to contrast my response with one other response to
your note that wondered why you have to do all this when he didn't. Probably the first thing you need to determine iswhether you want to get in there and
experience what the other students are experiencing, or whether you just want to meet a requirement.
When I read the materials, it seems that there are a lot of things you will be able to observe. The rings in a tree won't be as expressive to you in terms of the
information they convey, but you will likely be able to feel them, and probably even judge relative thicknesses with your fingernail, and while I'm no gardener,
I know from firsthand experience that you will be able to tell a good deal about the differences in soil by feeling it. This sounds like a set of courses where
the labs contribute a lot to what is learned, and if your instructor has taken this time to discuss your participation with you, I have to think this is a good sign.
Here are a couple of things that occur to me. It appears that some of your activities occur in a group. Understanding which activities are in groups might be
important. One thing that sometimes works if you are in a group or a team is that you might be a good person to be the taker of notes. I don't mean you
wouldn't do anything else, but some of the functions you can't easily do could be done by other members, but you can still feel you are pulling your weight by
doing something that many others will not want to do. Maybe you are less squeamish than some. I know a blind person who won a lot of points with her
biology lab partner because the blind person didn't mind coming into contact with the white rats they were observing. Her partner couldn't handle that part
of their lab and was glad to handle some of the other things that the blind person had some difficulty in handling. How are you with earthworms, for
example? <smile>
If a lot of these labs do not involve groups or teams, having someone work with you on some of this as a reader is also an option. If you were to advertise in
your clas that another student could earn a little something extra working with you while being able to get their own work done might work. If the college
has a DSS office, they may know of people who do reading who may have a particular interest. In the old days, before DSS offices, advertising within the
class itself or on bulletin boards did work pretty well, if the DSS office either can't help or doesn't play that role.
Finally, establishing with the instructor what it is that he or she wants you to get out of this experience is important. The instructor may not be concerned if
you dot every "I" and cross every "T" if the instructor feels that you are making a serious effort to do what you can and that you are indeed sharing the
experience and learning the basics. Especially when students work in teams, the experience is never exactly the same for every student. This will depend
upon the flexibility of the instructor, and I know that some might not be all that helpful, but it is likely that many would be. Make sure the instructor knows
you are honestly curious. Anyone present can tell you what color occurs when a chemical is poured on the soil, physically seeing that color isn't important
unless you are going to make a career of this, and then there really are some options. You would, in that case, talk with Mr. Supalo, the blind guy who has
worked with others to develop audible instruments for measuring colors resulting from chemical reactions. But you might also wonder if there is a sound to
the reaction. You might let the instructor know that you are curious about what you can determine by feeling the slice of the tree's rings that are displayed
from a core. There might even be some alternate experiments that you might be able to do to bring home some of the same points if it is important to you
and the instructor. The instructor would have to guide you on this because I'm just an old math major, but it occurs to me that observing soil that is wet and
then observing it after it has dried for a day might yield some information about the makeup of the soil, maybe different information, but perhaps useful
information.
As you can probably tell, I hate to see blind people left out of experiences like this even if one can't learn every single thing in the same way as we would
with sight. I hope that there might be some ideas here that help.
Best regards,
Steve Jacobson
On Tue, 4 Jan 2011 10:26:57 -0800, Tina Hansen wrote:
>You probably know that during the past quarter, I have been taking an environmental science course at my local community college for a General Studies
degree. I'm in the second course in the series, and there are a number of labs coming up that either use chemicals, or are heavily dependent on
measurements. I don't know if the lists accept attachments, but I felt the best way to give people an idea of what these labs are like is to send the
information about them that I've gotten from my instructor. The instructor and I are not sure how to deal with these labs, but I figured that if you got a look at
them, you could give me some ideas on how I might be able to participate and not just sit on the sidelines. So if you have any ideas on how I might deal with
these labs, I'm all ears. Thanks.
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2011 14:59:50 -0600
From: Courtney Stover <liamskitten at gmail.com>
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] White House Disability Group Call: Monday Jan.
10 at 3:00 PM
Message-ID:
<AANLkTi=X8G9WZchbCGbm7NAvNGhpXciaWwYvMJUna9e3 at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Anita,
Thanks for pasting the info in.
Courtney
On 1/4/11, Anita Adkins <aadkins7 at verizon.net> wrote:
> Hey,
> Sorry if you have been asswered by Mike, but the number is provieded in the
> email. I, too, had truble finding it at first, but the number is immediately
> after the sentence, but still on the same line, that reads "The conference
> call-in information is as follows" or words to that effect.
> I will also paste the number from the email here.
> "Dial in: (800) 230-1093"
> If this msg didn't come from someone who is a frequenter on this list, I
> might have taken it for a scam. There is just something about the way it is
> worded. Mike, did you get it from a real contact, meaning someone in the
> whitehouse, or did you get it from somewhere else? Just curious, and I may
> be wrong. I don't know why I get that feeling, but it just doesn't seem to
> have a genuine feel to it. Maybe it is because it is "off the record", but
> it is asking to be widely distributed. That seems contradictory. I'm not
> sure. If it is genuine, I apologize in advance for my doubting it. Anita
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Courtney Stover" <liamskitten at gmail.com>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Monday, January 03, 2011 8:41 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] White House Disability Group Call: Monday Jan. 10 at
> 3:00 PM
>
>
> Mike,
>
> Did any subsequent messages give the dial-in info? I know there's
> that website where you can get captioning, and I'm not sure if the
> call will be streamed from there, or if there's some info we're
> missing.
> Courtney
>
> On 1/3/11, Mike Freeman <k7uij at panix.com> wrote:
>> Begin forwarded message: > From: "Outreach ,
>> Disability (CRT)"
>> <Disability.Outreach at usdoj.gov> > Date: January
>> 3, 2011 7:35:27 PST > To: "Basrawi, Mazen (CRT)"
>> <Mazen.Basrawi at usdoj.gov> > Subject: White House
>> Disability Group Call: Monday Jan. 10 at 3:00
>> PM > > Dear Disability Community, > > > > In
>> order to help keep you more informed, the White
>> House Disability Group is hosting monthly calls
>> to update you on various disability issues as
>> well as to introduce you to persons who work on
>> disability issues in the federal
>> government. > > > > This call is off the record
>> and not for press purposes. We strongly urge and
>> ask that you distribute this email broadly to
>> your networks and list serves so that anyone who
>> wants to participate can do so. > > > > Our next
>> call will be Monday, January 10 at 3:00 PM
>> Eastern. > > > > The conference call information
>> is below. > > > > Dial in: (800) 230-1093 > >
>> Title: Disability Call (use instead of code) > >
>> Date of Call: 01/10/2011 > > Start Time: 3:00 PM
>> Eastern > > For live captioning, at time of call,
>> log onto: > >
>> http://www.fedrcc.us//Enter.aspx?EventID=1679107&CustomerID=321
>> <http://www.fedrcc.us/Enter.aspx?EventID=1679107&CustomerID=321>
>> > > > > > > Again, please distribute
>> widely. > > > > The White House ?? 1600
>> Pennsylvania Avenue, NW ?? Washington DC 20500 ?? 202-456-1111 > > > >
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/liamskitten%40gmail.com
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/aadkins7%40verizon.net
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/liamskitten%40gmail.com
>
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Tue, 04 Jan 2011 16:36:22 -0500
From: "Anita Adkins" <aadkins7 at verizon.net>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] White House Disability Group Call: Monday Jan.
10 at 3:00 PM
Message-ID: <F18409057E4143F195EBAC5EC3BFD291 at AnitaAdkinsPC>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
reply-type=original
Hi,
You are welcome. Also, as for my comments, I did a bit of research and found
that that number is the whitehouse's comments number, meaning it is most
likely not spam or anything like that, for which I am thankful. Have a great
day. Anita
----- Original Message -----
From: "Courtney Stover" <liamskitten at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, January 04, 2011 3:59 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] White House Disability Group Call: Monday Jan. 10 at
3:00 PM
Anita,
Thanks for pasting the info in.
Courtney
On 1/4/11, Anita Adkins <aadkins7 at verizon.net> wrote:
> Hey,
> Sorry if you have been asswered by Mike, but the number is provieded in
> the
> email. I, too, had truble finding it at first, but the number is
> immediately
> after the sentence, but still on the same line, that reads "The conference
> call-in information is as follows" or words to that effect.
> I will also paste the number from the email here.
> "Dial in: (800) 230-1093"
> If this msg didn't come from someone who is a frequenter on this list, I
> might have taken it for a scam. There is just something about the way it
> is
> worded. Mike, did you get it from a real contact, meaning someone in the
> whitehouse, or did you get it from somewhere else? Just curious, and I may
> be wrong. I don't know why I get that feeling, but it just doesn't seem to
> have a genuine feel to it. Maybe it is because it is "off the record", but
> it is asking to be widely distributed. That seems contradictory. I'm not
> sure. If it is genuine, I apologize in advance for my doubting it. Anita
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Courtney Stover" <liamskitten at gmail.com>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Monday, January 03, 2011 8:41 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] White House Disability Group Call: Monday Jan. 10 at
> 3:00 PM
>
>
> Mike,
>
> Did any subsequent messages give the dial-in info? I know there's
> that website where you can get captioning, and I'm not sure if the
> call will be streamed from there, or if there's some info we're
> missing.
> Courtney
>
> On 1/3/11, Mike Freeman <k7uij at panix.com> wrote:
>> Begin forwarded message: > From: "Outreach ,
>> Disability (CRT)"
>> <Disability.Outreach at usdoj.gov> > Date: January
>> 3, 2011 7:35:27 PST > To: "Basrawi, Mazen (CRT)"
>> <Mazen.Basrawi at usdoj.gov> > Subject: White House
>> Disability Group Call: Monday Jan. 10 at 3:00
>> PM > > Dear Disability Community, > > > > In
>> order to help keep you more informed, the White
>> House Disability Group is hosting monthly calls
>> to update you on various disability issues as
>> well as to introduce you to persons who work on
>> disability issues in the federal
>> government. > > > > This call is off the record
>> and not for press purposes. We strongly urge and
>> ask that you distribute this email broadly to
>> your networks and list serves so that anyone who
>> wants to participate can do so. > > > > Our next
>> call will be Monday, January 10 at 3:00 PM
>> Eastern. > > > > The conference call information
>> is below. > > > > Dial in: (800) 230-1093 > >
>> Title: Disability Call (use instead of code) > >
>> Date of Call: 01/10/2011 > > Start Time: 3:00 PM
>> Eastern > > For live captioning, at time of call,
>> log onto: > >
>> http://www.fedrcc.us//Enter.aspx?EventID=1679107&CustomerID=321
>> <http://www.fedrcc.us/Enter.aspx?EventID=1679107&CustomerID=321>
>> > > > > > > Again, please distribute
>> widely. > > > > The White House ?? 1600
>> Pennsylvania Avenue, NW ?? Washington DC 20500 ?? 202-456-1111 > > > >
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/liamskitten%40gmail.com
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/aadkins7%40verizon.net
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/liamskitten%40gmail.com
>
_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/aadkins7%40verizon.net
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2011 16:59:36 -0700
From: Arielle Silverman <nabs.president at gmail.com>
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Need Guidance: Several Heavily Visual Labs
Coming Up
Message-ID:
<AANLkTinAP-0e_yCvWaDmqWERfRLd-r0YsHyg6dvtbiyQ at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Hi Tina,
I would second everything Steve said. Also, if you are strong in math,
you could offer to be the one in charge of calculations for your
group, as well as note-taking.
Also, if you have labs that require you to draw and label diagrams, I
think writing up a verbal description of the organisms/environments
you are working with is acceptable.
Arielle
On 1/4/11, Steve Jacobson <steve.jacobson at visi.com> wrote:
> Tina,
>
> There are a lot of considerations in figuring out how you deal with this.
> Let me start by saying that when I was in school, I took a general physics
> class
> because it was an area I wanted to learn. The instructor was not happy and
> he did not want me to take the class at all, let alone the lab. My
> compromise
> was to take the class without the lab and receive one less credit. After
> taking the class, which was near the beginning of my college experience, I
> learned
> about other blind people who took similar labs. Since I took the class
> because I wanted to learn the subject, I have always regretted the fact that
> I didn't
> take the lab. I also saw students strike up friendships in the less formal
> settings of a lab. I say all this to contrast my response with one other
> response to
> your note that wondered why you have to do all this when he didn't.
> Probably the first thing you need to determine iswhether you want to get in
> there and
> experience what the other students are experiencing, or whether you just
> want to meet a requirement.
>
> When I read the materials, it seems that there are a lot of things you will
> be able to observe. The rings in a tree won't be as expressive to you in
> terms of the
> information they convey, but you will likely be able to feel them, and
> probably even judge relative thicknesses with your fingernail, and while I'm
> no gardener,
> I know from firsthand experience that you will be able to tell a good deal
> about the differences in soil by feeling it. This sounds like a set of
> courses where
> the labs contribute a lot to what is learned, and if your instructor has
> taken this time to discuss your participation with you, I have to think this
> is a good sign.
>
> Here are a couple of things that occur to me. It appears that some of your
> activities occur in a group. Understanding which activities are in groups
> might be
> important. One thing that sometimes works if you are in a group or a team
> is that you might be a good person to be the taker of notes. I don't mean
> you
> wouldn't do anything else, but some of the functions you can't easily do
> could be done by other members, but you can still feel you are pulling your
> weight by
> doing something that many others will not want to do. Maybe you are less
> squeamish than some. I know a blind person who won a lot of points with her
> biology lab partner because the blind person didn't mind coming into contact
> with the white rats they were observing. Her partner couldn't handle that
> part
> of their lab and was glad to handle some of the other things that the blind
> person had some difficulty in handling. How are you with earthworms, for
> example? <smile>
>
> If a lot of these labs do not involve groups or teams, having someone work
> with you on some of this as a reader is also an option. If you were to
> advertise in
> your clas that another student could earn a little something extra working
> with you while being able to get their own work done might work. If the
> college
> has a DSS office, they may know of people who do reading who may have a
> particular interest. In the old days, before DSS offices, advertising
> within the
> class itself or on bulletin boards did work pretty well, if the DSS office
> either can't help or doesn't play that role.
>
> Finally, establishing with the instructor what it is that he or she wants
> you to get out of this experience is important. The instructor may not be
> concerned if
> you dot every "I" and cross every "T" if the instructor feels that you are
> making a serious effort to do what you can and that you are indeed sharing
> the
> experience and learning the basics. Especially when students work in teams,
> the experience is never exactly the same for every student. This will
> depend
> upon the flexibility of the instructor, and I know that some might not be
> all that helpful, but it is likely that many would be. Make sure the
> instructor knows
> you are honestly curious. Anyone present can tell you what color occurs
> when a chemical is poured on the soil, physically seeing that color isn't
> important
> unless you are going to make a career of this, and then there really are
> some options. You would, in that case, talk with Mr. Supalo, the blind guy
> who has
> worked with others to develop audible instruments for measuring colors
> resulting from chemical reactions. But you might also wonder if there is a
> sound to
> the reaction. You might let the instructor know that you are curious about
> what you can determine by feeling the slice of the tree's rings that are
> displayed
> from a core. There might even be some alternate experiments that you might
> be able to do to bring home some of the same points if it is important to
> you
> and the instructor. The instructor would have to guide you on this because
> I'm just an old math major, but it occurs to me that observing soil that is
> wet and
> then observing it after it has dried for a day might yield some information
> about the makeup of the soil, maybe different information, but perhaps
> useful
> information.
>
> As you can probably tell, I hate to see blind people left out of experiences
> like this even if one can't learn every single thing in the same way as we
> would
> with sight. I hope that there might be some ideas here that help.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Steve Jacobson
>
> On Tue, 4 Jan 2011 10:26:57 -0800, Tina Hansen wrote:
>
>>You probably know that during the past quarter, I have been taking an
>> environmental science course at my local community college for a General
>> Studies
> degree. I'm in the second course in the series, and there are a number of
> labs coming up that either use chemicals, or are heavily dependent on
> measurements. I don't know if the lists accept attachments, but I felt the
> best way to give people an idea of what these labs are like is to send the
> information about them that I've gotten from my instructor. The instructor
> and I are not sure how to deal with these labs, but I figured that if you
> got a look at
> them, you could give me some ideas on how I might be able to participate and
> not just sit on the sidelines. So if you have any ideas on how I might deal
> with
> these labs, I'm all ears. Thanks.
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nabs.president%40gmail.com
>
--
Arielle Silverman
President, National Association of Blind Students
Phone: 602-502-2255
Email:
nabs.president at gmail.com
Website:
www.nabslink.org
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2011 17:11:53 -0700
From: Arielle Silverman <nabs.president at gmail.com>
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>, nabs-presidents at nfbnet.org
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS State Division Contact Info
Message-ID:
<AANLkTikwrjfBWYx9_nMzaoNEd1Z+N5HUR4z5_5oe_m7G at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Hello students,
As Washington Seminar approaches we are making a big push to ensure
that our contact list for all the NABS state student divisions is as
up-to-date as possible. To help us with this effort I would like to
request the following:
-- If you are serving as president of a state student division at this
time, please send me an email at
nabs.president at gmail.com
with your current phone number and email address. Please do this even
if you have been president for several years, just so we can be sure
your contact info is accurate.
-- If your state doesn't have a formal student division yet but you
are involved with efforts to organize one, and would like to be listed
on the NABS website as a contact for blind students in your state,
please email me your contact info.
-- Just as an early heads-up, our Washington Seminar meeting this year
will once again include the presidents' lunch. We would like to have
one representative from each state attend this meeting, even if there
is no formal division in your state. This is a good opportunity to
chat with the NABS board and other division leaders about any
questions or concerns you may have, and to exchange ideas. Also, for
the first time we will be having a breakout session dedicated to
division development issues. All are welcome to attend, even if you
are not a state division president or contact.
Thanks for your assistance, and see you in Washington!
--
Arielle Silverman
President, National Association of Blind Students
Phone: 602-502-2255
Email:
nabs.president at gmail.com
Website:
www.nabslink.org
------------------------------
Message: 11
Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2011 17:21:17 -0700
From: Arielle Silverman <nabs.president at gmail.com>
To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
Cc: nabs-presidents at nfbnet.org
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Bulletin Announcements
Message-ID:
<AANLkTiktdoyjkFGVLacPdOhjjAuNHutq9FrkhbdhfNOC at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Hello again,
Another NABS bulletin will be coming out soon! If you have any
announcements you would like to make before Washington Seminar, please
send them to me by the end of the week. Thanks!
Arielle
--
Arielle Silverman
President, National Association of Blind Students
Phone: 602-502-2255
Email:
nabs.president at gmail.com
Website:
www.nabslink.org
------------------------------
Message: 12
Date: Tue, 04 Jan 2011 19:00:12 -0600
From: Greg Kearney <gkearney at gmail.com> (by way of David Andrews
<dandrews at visi.com>)
To: blindtlk at nfbnet.org,
Subject: [nabs-l] Procedure for writing Words, Music and Plain-song
using dots (1829) in DAISY format
Message-ID: <auto-000184924819 at mailfront2.g2host.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed"
Procedure for writing Words, Music and Plain-song using dots D7769
Louis Braille's 1829 book setting out the Braille code can now be
downloaded from our library system. As this title is in the public
domain no library login is required.
This is a full text full audio DAISY digital talking book which
includes photographs of the original 1829 raised type book along with
explanatory production notes and the original footnotes. Navigation
is by section at the first navigation level as well as by the
original first edition page numbers.
The URL to the download link is as follows:
http://www.guidedogswa.org/library/openbiblio/shared/biblio_view.php?bibid=107755&tab=opac
Gregory Kearney | Manager Accessible Media
Association for the Blind of WA - Guide Dogs WA
PO Box 101, Victoria Park WA 6979 | 61 Kitchener Ave, Victoria Park WA 6100
Tel: 08 9311 8246 | Fax: 08 9361 8696 | www.guidedogswa.com.au
Tel: 307-224-4022 (North America)
Email: greg.kearney at guidedogswa.com.au
Email: gkearney at gmail.com
_______________________________________________
Dtb-talk mailing list
Dtb-talk at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/dtb-talk_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for Dtb-talk:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/dtb-talk_nfbnet.org/dandrews%40visi.com
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: test.png
Type: image/png
Size: 439 bytes
Desc: not available
URL: <http://www.nfbnet.org/pipermail/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/attachments/20110104/721c4ce5/attachment-0001.png>
------------------------------
Message: 13
Date: Tue, 04 Jan 2011 20:00:31 -0800
From: humberto <humbertoa5369 at netzero.net>
To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org, blindTlk at nfbNet.org
Subject: [nabs-l] Adobe In Design
Message-ID: <rg001f0032PutTY05g0FQs at netzero.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed
Hello,
Is anybody familiar with Adobe In design? Is this software
accessible with screen readers like JAWS, NVDA, or some other? If
so, how accessible? Also, is this free?
Does anyone use this program? I've heard that this program is
used for publishing newspapers and books, and has anyone done
such things successfully with In Design?
------------------------------
Message: 14
Date: Wed, 5 Jan 2011 09:00:56 -0600
From: "Carrie Gilmer" <carrie.gilmer at gmail.com>
To: "'NFBnet Blind Kid Mailing List, \(for parents of blind
children\)'" <blindkid at nfbnet.org>, "'National Association of Blind
Students mailing list'" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Subject: [nabs-l] FW: [nfbwnews] FW: [blindlaw] Great Opinion in
Enyart v. NCBE
Message-ID: <4d2487ac.c9e82a0a.4663.ffff8322 at mx.google.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
:)
-----Original Message-----
From: nfbwnews-bounces at nfbwis.org [mailto:nfbwnews-bounces at nfbwis.org] On
Behalf Of Hyde, David W. (ESC)
Sent: Wednesday, January 05, 2011 8:04 AM
To: 'Gorman, Mary M - DHS (Mary.Gorman at dhs.wisconsin.gov)'; 'nfb of
wisconsin (nfbwnews at nfbwis.org)'; 'mabullis at hotmail.com'
Subject: [nfbwnews] FW: [blindlaw] Great Opinion in Enyart v. NCBE
You can read this for yourself, but I'll summarize.
If it stands, and has precedent value this means that:
1. A private testing or regulatory entity cannot determine which
accommodations it will offer, and may not refuse to offer others unless they
can show that doing so would compromise the test or impose an undue
hardship.
2.The accommodations must be fitted to the person, not the person to the
accommodation.
3. Refusal to make specific accommodations can be considered irreparable
damage to the disabled person.
We'll se what happens next, but this is a most interesting ruling, and may
have implications for at least other private entities that produce tests
required for licensure.
-----Original Message-----
6From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
Behalf Of Scott C. LaBarre
Sent: Tuesday, January 04, 2011 3:02 PM
To: NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: [blindlaw] Great Opinion in Enyart v. NCBE
Friends, we secured a wonderful victory in the Enyart case. Please find an
accessible pdf attached. The Panel upheld Judge Breyer's original ruling
that NCBE must provide the requested accommodations of Stephanie Enyart.
Additionally, the 9th Circuit made it clear that the DOJ regulation
requiring that test administraters provide the accommodations that best
insure that a person with a disability to take the exam on a level playing
field applies.
Scott C. LaBarre, Esq.
LaBarre Law Offices P.C.
1660 South Albion Street, Ste. 918
Denver, Colorado 80222
303 504-5979 (voice)
303 757-3640 (fax)
slabarre at labarrelaw.com (e-mail)
www.labarrelaw.com (website)
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This message may contain confidential and privileged
information. If you are not the designated recipient, you may not read,
copy, distribute or retain this message. If you received this message in
error, please notify the sender at 303) 504-5979 or slabarre at labarrelaw.com,
and destroy and delete it from your system. This message and any attachments
are covered by the Electronic Communications Privacy Act, 18 U.S.C. ??
2510-2521.
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: opinion 9th circuit enyart v. ncbe 1-4-11.pdf
Type: application/pdf
Size: 112005 bytes
Desc: not available
URL: <http://www.nfbnet.org/pipermail/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/attachments/20110105/2262e72f/attachment-0001.pdf>
------------------------------
Message: 15
Date: Wed, 05 Jan 2011 10:57:48 -0500
From: Josh Kennedy <jkenn337 at gmail.com>
To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
Subject: [nabs-l] kurzweil or new docuscanPlus?
Message-ID: <4D2494FC.4060406 at gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Hi
Depending on your rrequirements you may want to save some money and buy
docuscanPlus from serotek. just go to www.docuscanplus.com its
self-voiceing and you can also install the thing on your computer. Oh
and by the way this friday they'll be taking pre-orders for the
hover-cam which works with docuscanplus. docuscanplus uses omnipage OCR.
they'll be adding foreign language recognition to it soon. why use a
camera to scan books? no debinding the book, hoverCam focuses and
adjusts for lighting automatically. best of all to scan a book just
position it under the camera and turn the pages until you're done.
Josh
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
End of nabs-l Digest, Vol 51, Issue 4
*************************************
More information about the NABS-L
mailing list