[nabs-l] Security in ourselves, acceptance in others

Chris Nusbaum dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com
Thu Jun 2 19:57:24 UTC 2011


I completely agree, Mike! Great post!

 Chris

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--- Sent from my BrailleNote

 ----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Freeman" <k7uij at panix.com
To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org
Date sent: Sat, 28 May 2011 15:06:28 -0700
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Security in ourselves, acceptance in others

Kirt:

I agree with you almost entirely.  Now that I've heard your 
parents' story,
perhaps I understand a bit more why you seem bound and determined 
to find
fault withus (the NFB).  All I can say is that the Federation, as 
all other
organizations on Mother Earth, are made of human beings (I'm not 
counting
crows or ants or monkeys or chimps here).  As such, we're not 
perfect.  I know
several very fine Federationists whom I would steer new members 
away from
(no names, please) until  these new members had a bit of 
leavening in our
philosophy and ways so as to understand where the Federationists 
I'm
speaking of are coming from.  So what? That's life in the fast 
lane.

I know of persons in my state who were Federationists thirty-odd 
years ago
and who, because of one or two incidents back then, are 
suspicious of
everything the Federation does now.  It's almost as if everyone 
expects the
Federation to be perfect and immutable  and when it is not, 
blames it for
misfortunes that befall them, maintaining that it is the NFB 
philosophy of
blindness that is to blame rather than all-too-fallible members 
of homo
sapiens sapiens from whom NFB and every other organization draw 
their
memberships.  Is it any wonder that we who have been elected to 
the NFB
leadership express some frustration? It often seems to me, at 
least, that we
are confronted with "heads I win; tails you lose" Such 
double-binds are
double-plus unfair.  "Don't you *dare* try to convince me of the 
rightness of
your philosophy or I'll call you militant, radical, uncaring, 
boorish,
unethical, dastardly, thoughtless, unloving and any other 
pejorative
adjectives I can think of!".  I'm sorry but that ain't fair.

To be sure, I don't try to convince died-in-the-wool ACB members 
that they
are wrong; they have a right to believe as they wish and to 
express
themselves and to organize to bring pressure on the Powers that 
Be to get
their ideas implemented.  But I don't have to take it lying down 
if I think
the issue of sufficient importance.

I once read a letter from Dr.  Maurer to a now-committed 
Federationist who
wrote to him expressing great doubt about the efficacy of NFB 
philosophy and
asked for reading material.  Obviously, dr.  maurer sent it along 
with a
letter, part of which said something that might surprise you.  He 
said: "I'd
rather have you join ACB than join nothing.  In this country, we 
make our
voices heard through collective action and by joining either ACB 
or NFB, you
have a chance to make your voice count.".  I agree with this 
completely.

Does this mean that a non-joiner can't have influence? Certainly 
not.
However, given the political structure in this country, many 
voices have
more influence than one voice.

Do I think everyone should join an organization of the blind? I 
think we
could get a lot done were this so.  But it isn't going to happen 
and to force
the issue would be to negate the very freedoms and dignity that 
we're
fighting for.  However, those who do not join and who then 
complain I
consider morally bankrupt.  In effect, I consider the phrase 
"silent
majority" to be an oxymoron.  By definition, the only people who 
count
politically are those who speak up.  How else is one to know what 
the "silent
majority" really wants? Both sides in any debate claim that they 
speak for
it.  It is in this sense that we of NFB say we speak for the 
blind.  ACB says
it also.  And we're both right.


But bback to the initial intent of this thread.  I don't know 
where all of
you get the idea that we of NFB are continually attacking the 
ACB.  Frankly,
I don't even think about ACB most of the time (a state of affairs 
which
galls them immensely).  ACB can do its thing and as long as it 
doesn't
adversely impact NFB's goals, it's OK with me.  If its actions 
*do* impact
them, I'll fight them.  For the most part, however, we just go 
our separate
ways.

But to say that we of NFB shouldn't say what we think (assuming 
that we're
not being petty or cruel) is applying a double-standard of 
behavior sinceACB
often compares itself favorably to us and no one says a thing.

Finally, let's cut to the chase here.  And here I *will* use 
names.  Humberto
Avila asked a question about dating blind versus sighted people.  
A lively
thread ensued in which Joshua Lester was honest enough to reveal 
his
frustrations and insecurities.  Should we have simply said "yeah; 
ain't it
awful!" and gone on our way?or should we have challenged his 
beliefs just a
bit (as we did), causing him to defend his views and, in the 
process, think
them through at least a bit? We debate damned near everything 
else on this
list.  Why should this thread be exempt? I don't think any of us 
were
denigrating Joshua.  In fact, I venture to say that we were 
trying to be
encouraging.  In effect, we were saying "think out of the box!".  
Obviously,
being challenged with new ideas can be a bit uncomfortable.  But 
Joshua did
not appear to me to take offense.  If he did, we owe him an 
apology.  But was
it better to try to expand his horizons (something his messages 
practically
begged us to do) or just ignore them.  IMO it could go either 
way.

Mike


-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org 
[mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Kirt Manwaring
Sent: Saturday, May 28, 2011 1:10 PM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Security in ourselves, acceptance in others

Mike,
  That makes a lot of sense...I find myself agreeing with you.  
Mostly.
  The only thing I'd say is there's a difference between 
constructive
preaching and destructive preaching.  It's good, even necessary, 
to spread
our philosophy.  Just like my church sends out missionaries by 
the thousands
to spread what we believe is the gospel, millions of Christians 
around the
world get involved with outreach ministries and procelyting, and 
so forth.
As you say, that's human nature and when people try and build up 
their own
philosophy by spreading the message to others, I say it's a 
beautiful thing.
  The problem is destructive preaching.  So when a Mormon 
missionary
deliberately attacks another church, when a Christian minister 
decides to
burn the Qu'ran instead of talking about Christ, or when a 
Federationist
goes out of his way to smear the Council instead of strengthening 
the
Federation.  I get that there are times the Federaion and Council 
are in
conflict because it's what our respective philosophies demand.  
(even if the
ACB doesn't have a national philosophy, strictly speaking)  But 
in that
conflict, when it happens, it critical that we stand by our own 
message
rather than going out of our way to destroy theirs.  America's a 
free market
of ideas-strengthening our own position will serve us better than 
weakening
anyone else's.  Of course, you know how that all translates in to 
the
political realm and I suspect it doesn't always translate well.
  But I think, especially on a personal level, we live our 
philosophy and we
share it.  That doesn't mean we make an effort to call them out 
or make them
feel like their beliefs are wrong.  If their beliefs are wrong, 
better for
them to realize it in time if they're the kind of person that 
will...if they
aren't, why not let it rest and try to get along? t the veeat, 
say godbye
and avoid an unpleasant confrontation if you know the other 
person won't
bend.  I recognize that philosophy doesn't always work when 
dealing with
other organizations but, when dealing with individuals, I don't 
see why it
can't.  Isn't it better to live a life as a respectable blind 
person, answer
questions as they're presented, maybe talk a little about the 
Federation if
it comes up and let them decide what they want?  If they accept 
it, great!
If not, that's ok too.  I know plenty of respectable blind people 
outside
the Federation-our way isn't the only ay for people to become 
independent
and empowered.  Maybe another way is honestly better for someone 
else.  And,
if they don't want that independence and empowerment after it's 
been offered
kindly and respectfully, isn't it better just to drop the subject 
and try to
be friends?  Who knows,maybe they'd come around eventually.  An 
angry debate
certainly wouldn't help that happen.
  In closing, I'd like to share an experience that kept me out of 
the NFB
for a long time, even though it didn't happen to me.  My parents 
found out I
was blind a w months after I was born.  Naturally those first few 
years were
really difficult for them, I can't imagine what that's like for a 
parent.
Anyways my mom decided she wanted to be an O&M instructor, so she 
went to
school in Arizona.  While there, she was introduced to the 
Federation and
went to a meeting.  The way she told me the story, a blind woman 
approached
her and said "I'm going to tell you something important.  Your 
son is blind.
You are not.  So you'll never be able to understand him as much 
as we can."
Had that first introduction to the Federation been more 
respectful, I
suspect I'd be a lifetime member.  As it stands now, my parents 
are still a
little on guard around the Federation (although they certainly 
support my
involvement), and they themselves are not Federationists.  I 
often wonder
how much more involved they would be had that first introduction 
gone just a
little bit differently.
  Warmly,
Kirt

On 5/28/11, Mike Freeman <k7uij at panix.com> wrote:
 Kirt:

 I agree that, ideally at least, we should live and let live.  In 
fact,
 as a practical matter, that is what is done here in the state of
 Washington: the NFB of Washington and the Washington Council of 
the
 Blind work together when we can -- often rather closely -- but 
we
 agree to disagree on some matters and as long as no one stirs 
the pot,
 we tend to stay out of each other's way on matters on which we
 disagree, if only because neither organization has sufficient 
political
clout to prevail easily when we work at cross-purposes.
 But you can bet your life that if WCB actively pushed something 
that
 was totally against NFB policy, we of NFB would try to defeat 
WCB's
 effort.  In like fashion, I am certain that WCB would do the 
same viz.
 our efforts if they directly contradicted some ACB policy that 
WCB
 members held dear.  That isn't really a problem in that Mitch
 Pomerantz, President of ACB, himself said that ACB stands for no
 organized philosophy and ACB doesn't enforce unified policy 
directives
 on its affiliates.  In other words, the problem hasn't arisen 
here --
 at least not in the past twenty-five years.  And the threats to
 blindness agencies in this state have been of sufficient 
magnitude
 that we (NFBW and WCB) were on the same side, even if we love 
some the
agencies a bit less than do members of WCB; there was no 
alternative.

 Having said this, I don't believe that the lack of effectiveness 
in
 the black civil rights movement of the late 1960's was due to
 fragmented voices within that movement.  Rather, I think it was 
due in
 some measure to martin Luther King Jr.'s scattering his shots --
 coming out against the Vietnam War and for anti-poverty 
initiatives,
 for example, instead of keeping his "eye on the prize" as the 
PBS
 history of the civil rights movement is called.  I think there 
was room
 enough for many voices in the civil rights movement although I 
confess
 that many WASPs such as I were turned off big-time by Stoakley
 Carmichael, H.  Rap Brown, bobby Seal, Eldrige Cleaver and other 
persons of
like mind.

 I think the comparison by some of our detractors of NFB to a 
religion
 is much overblown.  However, I think the comparison is valid to 
this
 extent: if one truly applied your "live and let live" and 
"preach by
example"
 philosophy -- quite admirable in the abstract -- to religion, 
there
 would be no missionaries, no jihad, no outreach ministries, and 
the
 like.  Put another way, it's human nature to try to reach out to
 convince those with whom we disagree or those whom we would 
convert.
 "gospel" means "good news", after all.

 Does this mean that we should look down upon blind people who do 
not
 have the skills of blindness? Of course not.  They, like we, are
 "Within the Grace of God" as tenBroek's speech is entitled.  
Does this
 mean that there are not alternative ways to look at the problems 
of
blindness? Again, of course not.
 But let us remember that we of NFB are out to do nothing less 
than to
 change society -- to obliterate the stereotype of the "helpless 
blind
 person" and the discriminatory treatment, blighted hopes and 
missed
 opportunities that flow from this misbegotten stereotype.  And 
in the
 United States, change is effected by banding together in 
associations
 of like mind to advocate for those policies we believe in.  This 
is not
 an undertaking of passivity.  For better or worse, advocacy 
involves,
 to some extent at least, preaching.  Of course this does not 
mean that
 we should be intolerant or maintain that there are no other
 viewpoints.  But it *also* doesn't mean that we refrain from
 passionately advocating for what we believe in.  that's the way 
things get
done in this country.

 How this all plays out at a personal level isn't always easy to
 fathom.  As I've said before, no one ever said being a 
Federationist
 was easy.  But I submit that *not* saying anything -- even if 
only
 words of encouragement -- when we find injustice, erroneous
 stereotypes and persons selling themselves short -- is contrary 
to what we
have pledged ourselves to accomplish.

 WE should never be obnoxious or boorish.  But saying nothing is 
itself
 making a statement.

 What this all amounts to is espousal of the Serenity Prayer: "O 
god:
 give me the strength to change the things I can, the patience to
 accept the things I cannot and the wisdom to discern the 
difference.".

 Mike


 -----Original Message-----
 From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org 
[mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
 Behalf Of Kirt Manwaring
 Sent: Saturday, May 28, 2011 10:36 AM
 To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
 Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Security in ourselves, acceptance in 
others

 Mike,
   In the African-american struggle for huma rights, there 
were/are
 lots of different philosophies and approaches taken by a lot of
 different people-you probably know more about that than me 
having
 lived through a lot of the craziness.  Do you think more 
could've
 happened faster if...say, Martin Luther King and Malcolm X spent 
less
 time bickering and more time cooperating or, at the very least,
 ignoring each other?  I'm not denying that both of them did a 
lot to
 better the condition of black people...but imagine what could've
 happened if the two of them didn't take so long to reconcile-or, 
if
 nothing else, if they didn't spend time attacking each others'
 philosophies and devoted that energy to their respective 
movements?
   Could that comparison be aplicable to us?  Am I remiss when I 
say
 that we in NFB sometimes spend too much time attacking the
 philosophies of other blind people rather than advancing our own
 philosophy?  Am I remiss in saying that many in the ACB spend 
more
 time trying to tear down the Federation instead of building up 
the
 Council?  Why can't we, if nothing else, leave each other alone 
and
 spend all our time working on our own goals?
   Maybe we could take that comparison further, to incolude 
individual
 blind people who disagree with us.  Ideally we should try to 
engage in
 constructive dialogue and find some sort of common ground with 
people
 who disagree and, for example, have next to no travel or daily 
living
skills.
 After all, we hope they'll "see the light", so to speak, and 
become
 empowered with good training.  But let's say they don't accept 
our
 philosophy...whether they're compitent blind people or not, 
let's say
 they want nothing to do with the Federation.  I say first we try 
and
 learn whatever we can from them, no matter their skills and 
atitude
 (or lack thereof).  Once we've learned something from them, even 
if
 it's as simple as "I need to have better cane skills" or "this 
guy has
 terrible hygiene-at least I know now why it's so important to 
take
 showers!", then I think we try and let them learn from us.  That 
can
 either be  by talking or by them looking at our example...if 
they
 chose to not accept our world view, there's no reason to get 
angry and
 defensive.  There is still probably common ground somewhere and, 
even
 in the highly unlikely event you can't find any (which is 
probably due
 to you not looking hard enough), just ignore the person and move 
on.
 If we can't be friends, there's no reason to be enemies...live 
and let
 live, and all that jazz.
   Warmly,
 Kirt

 On 5/28/11, Mike Freeman <k7uij at panix.com> wrote:
 I know of no site that has everything gathered in one place.  
However,
 you could do worse than to read Dr.  Floyd Matson's book, 
"Walking
 Alone and marching together" (available on the NFB website and 
via
 the NLS Web-braille
 site) and, if you'd wish to see the alternative point-of-view, 
James
 McGivern's "People of Vision: a History of the american Council 
of
 the Blind", also available from the NLS Web-braille and BARD 
sites.

 It might also behoove us all to reread or re-listen-to the NFB
 convention banquet speechdes of Drs.  tenBroke, Jernigan and 
Maurer.

 I know that's a lot of reading but no one ever said 
Federationism was
 easy!
 (huge grin)

 Mike


 -----Original Message-----
 From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org 
[mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
 Behalf Of Josh Gregory
 Sent: Saturday, May 28, 2011 10:07 AM
 To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
 Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Security in ourselves, acceptance in 
others

 Is there a site with...  the history of blind people and what 
they
 went through? I'm curious now, this is a good thread.
 Josh

 sent from my Apex
 Email: joshkart12 at gmail.com

  ----- Original Message -----
 From: "Mike Freeman" <k7uij at panix.com
 To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"
 <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
 Date sent: Sat, 28 May 2011 09:52:47 -0700
 Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Security in ourselves, acceptance in 
others

 Although I was never subject to one, I can still remember when, 
at
 late as the 1960's, welfare workers conducted "night raids" with 
the
 help of the police wherein said workers would visit blind 
clients and
 go through their homes to make sure that nothing had been bought 
that
 would indicate that the clients had unreported income.  This 
extended
 even to such items as a new dress.

 I echo Briley's sentiments that many today have no concept of 
what
 went down in the past.

 Mike


 -----Original Message-----
 From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org
 [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Briley Pollard
 Sent: Saturday, May 28, 2011 7:28 AM
 To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
 Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Security in ourselves, acceptance in 
others

 I think it is not always an appropriate comparison to say our
 struggle for civil rights isn't completely parallel with the 
black
 American experience, but we have struggled for civil rights.  Go 
read
 some history on how blind people have been treated by families 
and
 institutions over the years.  Blind children were targets for 
sexual
 assault in extremely high numbers because they were considered 
to be
 vulnerable.  They were placed in horrific living conditions
 throughout history in institutions because families believed 
that
 blindness was equal to ineffectiveness, and that they'd never be 
able
 to succeed or help out their relatives.  As a people group, we 
have
 suffered many indignities that I don't think the current 
generation
 of blind people even come close to realizing.

 Best,
 Briley
 On May 28, 2011, at 1:23 AM, Darian Smith wrote:

  Mike:
  African-Americans/blacks (however one choosses to term
 themselves)would not have been too keen on the idea based upon 
how
 they were treated by whites  up to that time.
   It is curious that how    african-americans were treated is
 always
  one of the first ways we as blind  people choose to make our
 comparisons in our struggle  for first-class citizanship.  I 
wonder,
 were blind people  beatin and hosed down when they peacefully 
protest
 the unjust ways they were treated? Were  they lybnched?  Can we
 safely make those  comparisons?  unless  I am missing something 
(I
 could be, and it wouldn't be the first or last time I have), we  
have
 some similarities with regards to civil rights, but largely our
 histories were quite different and  the scars, deaths,risks were 
felt
 on largely different levels.
  Just  some thoughts on  the matter,and I very much appreciate 
the
 question.
   Respectfully,
   Darian

  On 5/26/11, Mike Freeman <k7uij at panix.com> wrote:
  Darian:

  What do  you think African-americans would have said during the
 1950's and 1960's had one of their number said he/she would 
rather
 date a Caucasian person because of the concern for two black 
persons
 dating?

  Mike


  -----Original Message-----
  From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org
 [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On  Behalf Of Darian Smith
  Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2011 5:49 PM
  To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
  Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Security in ourselves, acceptance in 
others

  Jedi,
   Sure-let me see...
  We as federationests have certain ways that we like to deal 
with
 situations, ways that we see life or phrase things in life.  For
 example We like to use  the term "blind"  as opposed to 
"visually
 impaired" or any variant there of.  We also like if a person 
uses
 products with Braille  on them (braille watches, braille 
compass,
 braille books and the like, but somehow we tend to make people 
who
 don't utilize these things seem lesser for not.
   I have a friend who would much rather date a sighted  
gentleman
 than a blind gentleman because she is concerned about the idea 
of two
 blind people dating.
   Personally I may feel a certain way about  these things, but I
 would like to think that  it's  huge to  consider where each 
person is in
  their life and  accept them into the  fold as they are.    I am
 fine
  with educatinn,  so long as  we arn't critical and that we are
 accepting, because  seems to me that weas people hate to be told 
that
 we are "wrong"
  for thinking like we do.
   Does that make sense?
   Respecgfully,
   Darian


  On 5/26/11, Darian Smith <dsmithnfb at gmail.com> wrote:
  Very good points.
   We as blind people are a minority, and I think it's  good to
 remember that  there are other minorities out there.  How does 
one
 member of a minority group address another member of that same 
group
 if they don't feel that this person is acting like they should 
in
 public?  Don't feel like this person is projecting a positive 
image
 of the rest of that group to society?
     I believe that we all face that problem and how we deal with 
it
 varies, but I would hope that we know enough to not  take  it 
upon
 ourselves to change the worlds opinions.  I think we can model 
that
 positive image that is with in our grasp to become, that 
probably is
 the  healthiest way to approach this  idea of 
perception-changing
 that we  think about alot,  Does that make sense?
   thoughts?

  On 5/26/11, Jedi <loneblindjedi at samobile.net> wrote:
  Excellent points.

  I'm going to add to that some.

  I've noticed that we also tend to judge a person's actions when
 they attempt to handle a vexing situation like overhelpfulness 
or
 discrimination.  I've been doing some research on the effects of
 such judgment and have concluded that it creates an invisible
 audience for the blind person in question.  This audience is 
made of
 both the blind and the sighted community and creates thoughts 
like
 "What will my blind friends and colleagues think of me if I 
react
 this or that way?
  What will the sighted person I'm talking to think? What will
 sighted bystanders think?" What this does is create a win/lose
 situation where the stakes are high.  Aside from causing stress 
that
 limits problem-solving ability, this high stakes situation also
 creates a greater likelihood of negative response to perceived
 threats to the blind person's self-concept and sense of efficacy 
in the
interaction.
  So for example, an overly helpful person might cause a blind 
person
 to feel ineffective as it is.  But the invisible audience 
concept
 boosts that feeling considerably because of the stress involved  
with
 feeling like they have to show themselves as both effective  and
 graceful in handling both the offers of help and the person  
who's
 offering it.  Is any of this making sense? So the bottom line  
is
 that by trying to be the perfect ambassador for the blind, we  
may be
 shooting ourselves in the foot by creating such a high  stakes
 situation in our mind that the stress lowers our ability to  
present
 the cool, calm, and effective image we want to offer to the 
public.

  On that note, I've noticed that our community seems to have it 
in
 our heads that we're responsible for how the sighted feel about 
us.
  The truth is that there are limits to that responsibility.
 Sure, we
  want to set a good impression in all areas, but so does 
everyone
 else.  The sad truth is that we are judged based on the actions 
of
 one person.
  But the thing is, there's nothing that we can really do about 
that
 except to expose a given sighted person to the diversity of our
 population.  Even if we set the perfect impression, it's likely 
that
 the sighted person will still stereotype by saying that we're 
all
 amazing or that the one individual in question is the exception 
to  a
 rule.  It seems to me that the only people who really get that  
we're
 as diverse as they are are those who know how to deconstruct
 society's grand narrative or are those who have seen enough
 diversity in our population to realize that they can't judge all 
of
 us based on one  person.

  Respectfully,
  Jedi

  Original message:
  That makes perfect sense, but we should not fall into the trap 
of
 taking responsibility for others' actions.  When we do that, we  
lose
 sight of our own goals and direction in life.  Unless you're a
 therapist, or a rehab teacher working with people like that, it 
is
 not your job to fix them.  Even as a therapist or teacher, your
 place is to be a mentor and an instructor.  As I previously 
said,  if
 that person, after being shown compassion and alternative ways  
of
 thinking, doing and living chooses to fall back into old  
patterns as
 soon as the instructor's back is turned, that shows a  lack of
 respect for everyone around them, including themselves.
 So
  if a person wants to wallow in misery and self-pity, let them!
  That person will either fall hard when they find out their
 parents/family members/significant other or what have you can't  
take
 care of them forever, and then they'll realize what needs to  
happen
 in due time, or they will get sick of the status quo and  want 
to
 change it.  And if people hold it against a decent blind  person
 because they've met a person like that in the past, it's  not 
worth
 it to try and make them feel any differently.  They will  either 
come
 around in time or they  won't.  Choice is the key word here.
  Everyone is free to think as they choose so long as it's not
 hurting anyone.  So, while it might temporarily sting a bit to 
lose
 out on a potential friendship due to someone's ignorance, as 
soon  as
 you meet someone who's worth your time, you forget about that  
other
 person real quick

  On 5/26/11, Daniel Romero <djdan567 at gmail.com> wrote:
  I think the reason why this might go down is because of the 
view
 that we get from the public in general.  Most people who are  
sighted
 are not used to a blind person.  You have to understand  that 
one
 blind person being seen is a huge thing.  They're now  reliable 
for
 what a person thinks about blind people.  They are  the ones 
setting
 an example.  So if you have a blind person who  smells bad, 
rocks,
 pokes their eyes or just do not have the  proper skills, the 
outside
 person will make an assumtion and say  that all blind people are 
like
 that.  i'm not saying it's right  for blind people to call out 
other
 blind people with a skills set  that is lower then theirs, 
they're
 just calling them out because  they are representing blind 
people.
 It puts a bad label on us  blind people who do take care of
 ourselves, have the skills to be  independent and succeed.  like 
i
 said, i'm not saying it's right  but I don't think us who do 
have the
 skills want to have a  negative conotation.  Not all blind 
people
 poke their eyes, rock,  hop, twitch,bump into everything, smell 
bad,
 do not clean their own clothes, or anything like that.  So to be 
part
 of a group  that's going to display such a view that is negative 
to
 the public, we fall right behind that.  Am I making sense?

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