[nabs-l] unemployment rate

Sun May 29 15:05:54 UTC 2011

WE in the Federation face a conundrum: on the one hand, our ultimate goal is
the complete integration of the blind into society on a basis of equality
with the sighted. This inevitably means that as we come closer to this goal
and we presumably succeed at lowering the unemployment rate for the blind,
the number of blind persons working in mainstream (as opposed to
blindness-centered) ocupations, will increase as a fraction of the total
employed blind population. If this does not occur, the question can be
legitimately asked, I think, whether we've truly met the aforementioned goal
of integration into society.

On the other hand, if all of us work outside the "blindness system", where
will blindness-specific training come from (and it will always be needed as
we always will be a minority within society).

As King Mongkut said in "the King and I": "It's a puzzlement!".

Mike Freeman

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Anmol Bhatia
Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2011 7:38 AM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] unemployment rate

Arielle,
This email is a bit late, but I had to respond to this post. I happened to
go through and clean out my inbox and happen to find it. The attorney 
Who was your role models was right when he told you to rise above your
blindness and connect with the larger sighted society, but this does not
mean that a blind person should completely disconnect themselves from the
blind community. I would argue that good successful blind people are really
needed in the blind community and frankly groups like the NFB and ACB are a
good place blind people who are in search of success blind people as
mentors. In addition, blindness is part of who we are and disconnecting the
blind community is basically disconnecting a part of the the blind person
is.
Just my thoughts.

Anmol

I seldom think about my limitations, and they never make me sad. Perhaps
there is just a touch of yearning at times; but it is vague, like a breeze
among flowers.
Hellen Keller

--- On Mon, 2/14/11, Arielle Silverman <nabs.president at gmail.com> wrote:

> From: Arielle Silverman <nabs.president at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] unemployment rate
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Date: Monday, February 14, 2011, 10:22 PM
> Hi all,
> 
> I think it's important to remember that those of us who are
> NFB
> members have much of our contact with other NFB members and
> many NFB
> members choose to work in blindness rehabilitation or
> education
> because they are drawn to helping resolve the social
> obstacles that
> blind people face. It's entirely possible that the majority
> of the
> blind people who don't join a blindness organization choose
> not to
> work in the blindness field. In fact, some blind people go
> so far as
> to avoid all contact with the blind community. One of my
> only blind
> role models growing up was an attorney who repeatedly told
> me that the
> best thing I could do for myself was to rise above my
> blindness and
> connect with other blind people as little as possible. It
> apparently
> worked for him as he is an intelligent, successful, happily
> married
> man, but I know that's certainly not the way for all of us.
> Those of
> us who choose to join organizations do so in large part
> because we
> want to affiliate with and reach out to other blind people,
> so
> naturally those of us who join consumer organizations will
> be more
> likely to find employment in the blindness field.
> 
> Arielle
> 
> On 2/14/11, Anmol Bhatia <anmolpbhatia at yahoo.com>
> wrote:
> > Kirt,
> > You raise some really good points and I happen to
> totally agree with you. I
> > think now with unemployment in general being high,
> unemployment amongest the
> > blind is higher then 70 percent. The 70 percent was
> the unemployment in the
> > 1990s and early 2000s when the national employment was
> at about 4 to 5
> > percent. Of the 20 percent of blind people who are
> employment half or more
> > are working in a non-main stream environment meaning
> blindness pesific or
> > disability pesific agency or serving people who are
> eather blind or
> > disabled. Others go through a special training to
> directly related to their
> > blindness in order to work in a main-stream
> organization. For example, those
> > who are working for the IRS are working for a
> main-stream organization, but
> > most have gone through a special training at Lions
> World Services for the
> > Blind in order to do their job. The problem I 
> see is that how many blind
> > people can go to work for the Division Services for
> the Blind or the
> >  Indistry for the Blind?
> > You are also correct in that we must consider that
> some have more then just
> > blind as a disability which effects  their
> ability to hold a job. We have
> > been discussing such issues in one of my class.
> However, I see to many
> > perfectly fine people who's disability is only
> blindness waste away good
> > potential.
> > I could on all night discussing this, but these are
> just my thoughts for
> > now.
> >
> > Anmol
> > I seldom think about my limitations, and they never
> make me sad. Perhaps
> > there is just a touch of yearning at times; but it is
> vague, like a breeze
> > among flowers.
> > Hellen Keller
> >
> >
> > --- On Mon, 2/14/11, Kirt Manwaring <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> >> From: Kirt Manwaring <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com>
> >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] unemployment rate
> >> To: "National Association of Blind Students
> mailing list"
> >> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> >> Date: Monday, February 14, 2011, 2:56 PM
> >> Sean,
> >>   I'd like to point out a few things.
> >>   First...other disabilities, particularly
> severe
> >> cognative
> >> disabilities, are extremely relivant to a person's
> job
> >> eligability.  I
> >> don't want to sound prejudiced...but that's just
> the way it
> >> is.  I
> >> know lots of people with severe mental
> disabilities who
> >> happen to be
> >> blind as well and, while I'm not under-valuing
> them as
> >> people, I am
> >> fully aware that some of those disabilities impact
> a
> >> person's ability
> >> to work.  That's why I'm curious what the
> unemployment
> >> rate is for
> >> people who are only blind...because, for a lot of
> those
> >> people, other
> >> severe cognative disabilities are definitely a
> factor in
> >> their
> >> unemployed status.
> >>   As for the question about blind people working
> in
> >> the blindness
> >> field...I'm a little lost as to why you think I
> was
> >> implying that was
> >> inferior.  I'm just curious because that's where
> most
> >> blind people I
> >> know work.  Indeed I'm hard-pressed to find a
> totally
> >> blind person in
> >> my local area who I know that doesn't work in the
> blindness
> >> field...so
> >> I think it's a legitimate question.  It's like if
> I
> >> were to ask what
> >> percentage of the American working population
> works in,
> >> say, the
> >> lobbying business.  That, to me, does not imply
> the
> >> inferiority or
> >> superiority of that kind of work...it just means
> I'm
> >> interested to
> >> know how many employed blind people have jobs in
> the
> >> blindness field.
> >> Do you see my point?  I just want to know because
> I'm
> >> a blind person
> >> and most blind people I know work primarily with
> other
> >> blind
> >> people...so I wonder if anyone has any kind of
> data to show
> >> how many
> >> blind people work outside of the blindness arena.
> >> That's all, I just
> >> want to know because I'm probably not going to
> have a job
> >> in the field
> >> of blindness and I want to see where that puts
> me,
> >> percentage-wise.
> >> In this case, I'm not looking down my nose at
> anyone.
> >>   All the best,
> >> Kirt
> >>
> >> On 2/14/11, Sean Whalen <smwhalenpsp at gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >> > People who are not actively looking for
> employment are
> >> considered not to be
> >> > part of the labor force.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Of course the 30% for nonblind folks' rate
> of
> >> nonparticipation is vastly
> >> > higher than the rate that would apply to only
> those,
> >> say, under 65.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Blind people with other disabilities are
> blind people
> >> too, so why shouldn't
> >> > we count them? Nonblind folks with other
> disabilities
> >> count in the general
> >> > unemployment and labor force nonparticipation
> rates.
> >> Sure, you could figure
> >> > out an unemployment rate for people who are
> blind and
> >> have no other
> >> > disabilities, but how is that instructive?
> You could
> >> also find the rate for
> >> > the blind people who have no additional
> disability, a
> >> college degree and
> >> > IQ's above the national average, but then you
> are hand
> >> selecting who you are
> >> > looking at and ignore the population as a
> whole.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > I wouldn't trust numbers from AFB - they say
> there are
> >> 25 million blind or
> >> > visually impaired people in the US. Right.
> And NFB has
> >> 50,000 members.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Finally, related to the initial post, why
> does it
> >> matter how many of the
> >> > blind people with jobs work in the blindness
> field?
> >> That hearkens back to
> >> > the ridiculous notion that these are somehow
> lesser
> >> jobs. Yes, it may be
> >> > easier to get them because you are working
> with and
> >> being hired by people
> >> > who have experience with blindness, and are
> therefore
> >> less likely to be
> >> > freaked out by it, but they are not inferior
> jobs, nor
> >> are those who do them
> >> > less successful people.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Sorry for the list of disjointed thoughts,
> but take
> >> them for what they're
> >> > worth.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Take care,
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Sean
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> _______________________________________________
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> >> >
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
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> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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> 
> 
> -- 
> Arielle Silverman
> President, National Association of Blind Students
> Phone:  602-502-2255
> Email:
> nabs.president at gmail.com
> Website:
> www.nabslink.org
> 
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