[nabs-l] Philosophical Homogeneity

Sun Jul 22 01:17:31 UTC 2012

Kirt,

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't you join NABS? Didn't you, 
at one point, seek national office in NABS? If this is the case, you 
might want to know that joining NABS, let alone serving as a national 
officer, means that you have joined the NFB. Or least, that is how I 
read the NABS constitution. For those NABS constitution scholars out 
there, is that the case? And if you have unknowingly joined the NFB 
Kirt, that also means that you have also signed the pledge. Ah, those 
dubious NFB-ers! *kidding* In all seriousness though, and provided I'm 
correct in my understanding, it may be helpful information to you, 
Kirt, and everyone, in order to engage in a manner congruent to your beliefs.

Respectfully,
Jedi
Original message:
> Julie,
>   Yes, there is debate within the federation and, yes, I'm glad for
> it.  But the point is, were I to sign on to the NFB pledge, I would be
> limiting myself to keeping that debate within the federation.  That's
> something I just can not do.
>   And another thing.  You said some of the resolutions at this last
> convention were fairly close, and by NFB standards they were.  But,
> even the closest resolution ended up passing the role call of states
> with something like a 35-15 margin.  If that kind of margin were seen
> in, say, an election for political office, what you called "fairly
> clos" would be considered a landslide.  I'm not saying that's right or
> wrong, I'm just saying that's the way it is.
>   Best,
> Kirt

> On 7/20/12, Julie McGinnity <kaybaycar at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi all,

>> While I understand the reluctance to speak up against a stance the
>> organization has taken, I believe that the organization cannot grow
>> and change if this does not happen.  This is why we let people have a
>> voice on these lists and at board meetings, so that each person can be
>> heard, even if they disagree with the majority.  One person can
>> influence many others.  Think about the debate over some of those
>> resolutions.  I listened to the different points of view on a couple
>> of them before casting my vote, and some of those votes were rather
>> close.

>> We need people in the NFB who are willing to give us different ways of
>> looking at things, even (especially) when they do not fit the  typical
>> mold we are used to.  I believe in the positive philosophy of
>> blindness, but I'm not going to say that there is only one way to
>> implement this philosophy.  So if you disagree with the majority on an
>> issue, let your voice be heard, so that you can change the current
>> position.  I have questioned things within the NFB before, and in
>> discussing my issues, I have learned a lot about why things are the
>> way they are.  We can't lose the ones who disagree with us on any
>> given issue because if we do, the democratic process wouldn't work.
>> There would be no debate, no majority or minority.  That would be
>> extremely boring and would not make a good organization.

>> On 7/20/12, Kirt Manwaring <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Justin,
>>>   Sometimes I wish it were as simple as you're making it out to be.
>>> While I am not denying that individual Federationists can (and do)
>>> have widely differing opinions, when you become a fully participating
>>> member in the Federation you are agreeing, in essence, to keep those
>>> disagreements within the Federation and to abide by the policies and
>>> programs of the Federation, even when you personally disagree.  That's
>>> why I'm uncomfortable with organized religion; that's why, for all my
>>> admiration and agreement with most of what the Federation does, I hold
>>> myself back from full participation.  To illustrate, I will copy and
>>> paste a copy of the NFB pledge I found in the braille monitor.
>>>  "I pledge to participate actively in the effort of the National
>>> Federation of the Blind to achieve equality, opportunity, and security
>>> for the blind; to
>>> support the policies and programs of the Federation; and to abide by
>>> its constitution."
>>>   I can not in good faith sign on to such a pledge as it binds me to
>>> support the programs of the Federation, even in those rare instances
>>> when I don't want to.  If I disagree with the course the Federation
>>> takes on a particular issue, I can not voice that disagreement
>>> publicly outside the Federation.  At best, I can stay under the radar
>>> by not making my opposition to such and such a policy widely known
>>> outside the Federation.  People can, and have, been expelled from the
>>> Federation for loudly voicing their disagreement in public.
>>>   No, before you ask, I can't really think of one particular issue on
>>> which I passionately disagree with the NFB's position.  Certainly
>>> right now I have no personal opinion diverging enough from the NFB's
>>> official stance to compel me to public opposition.  But it could
>>> happen, and I refuse to sign away my right to free expression,
>>> wherever I chose, in the event it becomes an issue.  I agree with
>>> about 90 percent of commonly held NFB philosophy, and that's enough
>>> for me to get involved and participate as much as I can without
>>> signing on to that pledge.  It's kind of a complicated issue, and I
>>> see it as far less black and white than you've made it out to be.  Of
>>> course, that is totally my opinion, and I don't intend for this to
>>> sound like a personal attack in the slightest.  If I'm entitled to my
>>> beliefs, you're certainly entitled to yours.
>>>   Best,
>>> Kirt

>>> On 7/20/12, Justin Salisbury <PRESIDENT at alumni.ecu.edu> wrote:
>>>> Dear List,

>>>> There are always different opinions in our organization.  If you've met
>>>> two
>>>> or three Federationists-or ACB people, for that matter-with strong
>>>> opinions
>>>> in any direction, that doesn't necessarily mean anything.

>>>> We do not shun people who disagree with our national leadership.

>>>> I am always willing to discuss what we're doing.

>>>> I make decisions because of my core beliefs and not just because someone
>>>> from Baltimore told me what to do.

>>>> At the end of the day, after a vote, the answer is "yes" or "no," but
>>>> that
>>>> doesn't mean that every single member voted "yes" or every single member
>>>> voted "no."  We organizationally adopt the position of the majority
>>>> within
>>>> us.

>>>> About closet Federationism: We'd love to have you active in our
>>>> organization
>>>> because actively supporting our efforts helps us accomplish our goals
>>>> much
>>>> more than quietly supporting us.  If we all sat in our closets and let
>>>> everyone else do the work, we wouldn't live in the wonderful world that
>>>> our
>>>> active members have worked so hard to create for us.  In fact, we might
>>>> not
>>>> even have closets in which to sit.

>>>> In an earlier post, I used organized religion to illustrate the certain
>>>> absence of philosophical homogeneity, and that was really the only tie I
>>>> was
>>>> mentioning or even implying with religion.  I understand that some
>>>> people
>>>> are very uncomfortable with the concept of organized religion-as I once
>>>> was-and wished not to make anyone uncomfortable.

>>>> Justin

>>>> Justin M. Salisbury
>>>> Class of 2012
>>>> B.A. in Mathematics
>>>> East Carolina University
>>>> president at alumni.ecu.edu

>>>> “Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can
>>>> change
>>>> the world; indeed, it’s the only thing that ever has.”    —MARGARET MEAD

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>> --
>> Julie McG
>>  Lindbergh High School class of 2009, National Federation of the Blind
>> of Missouri recording secretary,
>> Missouri Association of Guide dog Users President,
>> and proud graduate of Guiding Eyes for the Blind

>> "For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that
>> everyone who believes in him may not perish but may have eternal
>> life."
>> John 3:16

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