[nabs-l] Dating & Sighted-Blind-Low Vision

Joshua Lester jlester8462 at students.pccua.edu
Fri Mar 23 02:51:35 UTC 2012


Wow!
I think Jews, (depending on which group,) believe the same thing.
BTW, Beth, will you be at convention, this year?
Please E-mail me offlist.
Thanks, Joshua

On 3/22/12, Beth <thebluesisloose at gmail.com> wrote:
> For me, a guide dog is not an option if I marry the man I want or
> any Muslim for that matter because they think dogs are impure.
> Beth
>
>  ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Nicole B. Torcolini at Home" <ntorcolini at wavecable.com
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> Date sent: Thu, 22 Mar 2012 19:29:35 -0700
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Dating & Sighted-Blind-Low Vision
>
> I'm not saying that this is a reason to get one, and I know that
> they are
> not for everyone, and, if you tell the training center that you
> want one for
> this reason, they're probably not going to accept you, but guide
> dogs can
> sometimes be a way to break the ice in awkward situations.
> However, there is
> of course a flip side to that. Some people who have guide dogs
> don't like it
> when people talk to them because of their dogs. .
>
> Nicole
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mary Fernandez" <trillian551 at gmail.com
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2012 6:42 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Dating & Sighted-Blind-Low Vision
>
>
> Hello All,
> This is a really fantastic topic for a number of reasons. First,
> dating is hard as a blind person. But dating can also be hard for
> someone who is overweight, someone who is well below average
> height,
> someone who has trouble hearing, etc. In short, dating can be
> hard for
> anyone who isn't simply average, someone who doesn't fall
> squarely in
> the fattest part of the bell curve when we look at populations.
> Even
> geniuses have trouble dating, I'm friends with some, and it's a
> true
> story.
> I was having a conversation about dating with a very good friend
> of
> mine a few days ago. And one of the things we both agreed upon,
> is
> that one of the challenges of dating in the typical ways that
> most
> people do, is that most sighted people see you as an asexual
> being,
> who needs help, and who cannot be viewed as datable. Which, like
> Arielle said,  makes it hard for blind people to go to bars and
> other
> hang out places where singles gather and just pick up someone and
> go
> on a date. We have to carry a heavier burden by making ourselves
> even
> more accessible than most people, and this might play havoc with
> our
> self-esteem.  The courting sequence usually goes something like
> this:
> Man and woman sit at bar. Man and woman makes eye-contact.
> If man and woman give each other physical cue, man will usually,
> though not always, make a comment which will spark off
> conversation.
> If woman is interested, about 2 minutes into the conversation she
> will
> angle herself toward the man. If conversation continues to be
> stimulating, and man and woman are getting a deeper connection,
> casual
> touching might begin, and a second date might be requested.
> Now, lets look at this from a blind perspective. Man or woman
> walk
> into bar, after using cane successfully, fending off unwanted
> requests
> to be helped, man or woman find barstool. After being observed to
> enter by most of the bar, observers' mis-conceptions about
> blindness
> will have been activated. And our shot of having this normal
> courting
> sequence is nipped at the bud. Of course, a person who wasn't
> there
> before hand might come in, look at your gorgeous skirt and be
> instantly drawn in. Which is why, I like to arrive early at
> parties
> and spark up a conversation with new comers. When they find out
> your
> blind however, all bets are off.
> This is not to say that blind individuals cannot and should not
> have a
> dating experience. On the contrary, I have been fairly successful
> in
> dating along with many other blind women and men I know. Like
> Arielle
> and others mentioned, whether someone is sighted or blind should
> be
> irrelevant in who you choose to spend your time with and consider
> as a
> potential romantic partner. there are so many other things that
> come
> into play. What's important to you? Values, humor, kindness,
> intelligence, height, hair color, philosophical view, political
> parties? Could you truly date a democrat with all those liberal
> ideas
> they have? Or God forbid you find a blind conservative, but
> decide to
> stay with them because it's more comfortable. Relationships are
> so
> incredibly hard and take a lot of work .You learn a lot from each
> other. But hopefully, most of the time you enjoy each other
> thoroughly, know what your flaws are and continue to like the
> person
> despite them, and have a stronger basis for that relationship
> than
> mere visual acuity.
> So, basically, yes, if online dating is something you want to
> explore, than yes, do it! If the single chess club is something
> your
> into, go for it! If a singles book club, (which is totally
> something
> I'm looking into right now), sounds interesting, then by all
> means. Be
>  creative, don't limit yourself to national convention or the
> local
> bar,, try speed dating! Trivia night! Just going to house
> parties. But
> most of all, be comfortable with yourself, don't go looking for a
> sighted date or a blind date for validation. Because that never
> ends
> well. The truth of the matter is that even those of us who are
> completely comfortable with their blindness, who lead, full happy
> and
> fulfilled life, can be put down sometimes by being perceived by
> the
> sighted world as somehow lacking, when we know we are not. But,
> you do
> learn that you really are ok, and that dating is just one more
> thing
> we have to do using alternative skills. I know, from the
> experience of
> friends, that some sighted people like to date blind people,
> because
> it makes them feel useful. It validates their self-worth, since
> they
> have someone they can help all the time. And I know blind people
> who
> think that dating someone who is sighted is somehow a superior
> experience. I've done both, and speaking from a woman's
> perspective.
> All men have issues. But you can find some truly golden ones
> among
> them all.
> A long post of mine can never be complete without my usual
> reference
> to fashion and looking good. Dress to bring out the best features
> of
> yourself. Even at my worse jeans, shirt and sneakers college
> chic,
> when I wake up 10 minutes before class, I always wear color.
> Because I
> have a nice skin tone, and color is my friend. Look nice, get
> some
> delicious lotion or perfume, and go get em.
> Sincerely,
> Mary
>
> On 3/22/12, Doug Oliver <oliver.doug1 at gmail.com> wrote:
>  I'm gonna way in on this topic.
>  My fiancee is actually sited and I'm blind, she's been around
> blind people
>  growing up, so she's very much accustomed to dating a blind
> person.
>  We've met in person twice and it's been great.
>  Take care,
>  Doug
>
>  ----- Original Message -----
>  From: "Ashley" <cumbiambera2005 at gmail.com
>  To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
>  <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>  Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2012 7:42 PM
>  Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Dating & Sighted-Blind-Low Vision
>
>
>  Hello all,
>  Like some of the people who have posted already, I have had my
> own
>  experiences with dating, as well as simply meeting people
> online. As a
>  matter of fact, my current boyfriend is someone I met online,
> and he
>  is blind as well. We have been dating a little over a year now,
> and I
>  have also had the chance to meet him in person. I can say that
> some of
>  what we've been through, especially when we met, was both good
> and
>  bad, and even though he is blind, it was a little more
> disastrous
>  because of his family who are sighted. Well the first time we
> actually
>  got to "see" each other was through a webcam, and both families
> were
>  present, not only for discriptive purposes but also because of
> us
>  being long distance, and it was the only way the two families
> could
>  meet. About 6 months later I got to visit him in person, and
> that was
>  a little weird because he lives in another country, and a part
> of
>  another culture, and that in itself brings its own barriers. I
>  actually stayed at his house with his family, and I imagine it
> was
>  hard on them because they've never dealt with another blind
> person
>  besides him, and he is not as independent as I am. I have also
> met
>  sighted people online, but I did not meet them through dating
> sites. I
>  met them through pages we both visit, (blogs, etc), and in my
> opinion,
>  that's better because you're actually meeting people you have
> things
>  in common with, regardless of whether you date or not, and like
> most
>  people have said already, one of the main things to consider
> when
>  dating someone, blind or sighted, is what kinds of things you
> share in
>  common with the other person. I personally have never dated a
> sighted
>  person, but I have made some interesting friends online who are
>  sighted. Some know I'm blind, and some do not, but not because I
>  haven't wanted to tell them. I don't meet these people in person
>  mainly because most of them are not from the U.S. and therefore
> it
>  really hasn't come up. Besides, I'm not as close to them, and we
>  mainly talk about music, which is what i have in common with
> most of
>  these people I meet anyway. I have also met blind friends
> online, and
>  basically the same goes for them. So as most people have already
> said,
>  I don't think it's that much different dating a sighted person
> from a
>  blind person. A blind person might be a little more
> understanding
>  considering they go through some of the same things. But on the
> other
>  side, that may not always be the case, if the person isn't
> completely
>  adjusted to their blindness, or they have been with their family
> their
>  entire life, and don't really understand the independence issue
> such
>  as in my case. So I think dating both blind and sighted people
> can
>  have their ups and downs, and it's just a matter of knowing how
> to
>  handle each situation as it comes. Good luck.
>
>
>  On 3/22/12, Arielle Silverman <arielle71 at gmail.com> wrote:
>  Hi all,
>  I have a little experience with online dating, but not much. I
> was on
>  a dating site for a year or so and chatted with a few guys but
> didn't
>  find anyone I actually wanted to meet in person. I have a lot of
>  friends (sighted and blind) who do online dating and I've heard
> the
>  whole gamut, from happily-ever-after marriages to disastrous
> first
>  dates and a few people who walked away after my friend's
> blindness was
>  revealed online. It really doesn't hurt to try it. If you do
> find
>  someone you like and want to meet, it's best to meet them in a
> public
>  place. But there's nothing dangerous about just putting a
> profile up
>  and seeing what happens.
>  Some dating sites are free and others charge a fee for joining.
>  Interestingly, the site I used was free, and when I was visiting
> my
>  sister and her roommate they were checking out one of the paid
> sites.
>  I told them about the free site I was on and they looked at it
> and
>  said they thought the guys on the free site were a lot more
> attractive
>  and appealing than the guys on the paid one. So it's possible
> the
>  people you might meet on a free site are less "desperate" and
> hence
>  are better catches.
>  I'm sure there's a lot of debate about when to reveal blindness
> during
>  an online dating encounter. Some people put it in their
> profiles,
>  others wait until the first meeting and still others reveal it
> at some
>  point in the middle. I'd tend to treat it like a job interview
> and
>  reveal blindness after I've connected with someone online but
> before
>  we meet in person so they aren't totally shocked or freaked out
> when
>  they see me. Unfortunately rejections due to blindness can
> happen at
>  any point in the process. You'll have to decide whether you
> would
>  prefer to take that risk earlier on or to give them a chance to
> get to
>  know you before they learn about your blindness.
>  Regarding dating blind vs. sighted people: Like many of us I
> have done
>  both. I never consciously decided that I wanted to date a blind
> person
>  or a sighted person, and I would not recommend that line of
> thinking.
>  I simply dated guys with whom I felt a connection and who felt
> the
>  same way toward me, regardless of whether or not they were
> blind. I
>  will say that in some ways establishing the initial relationship
> was
>  easier with blind guys, because I didn't have to wonder about
> what
>  nonverbal signals they were sending or how they might interpret
> my
>  nonverbal signals. However, when I try to compare the
> relationship I
>  have had with my sighted boyfriend over the past three years
> with the
>  other relationships I have had with blind guys, I really can't
> think
>  of any major differences. I do think that regardless of
> blindness
>  status, it's important for you and your partner to share
> interests and
>  passions in common. NFB and blindness are passions that many of
> us
>  share, and they help bring many blind couples together. However,
> there
>  are other interests or passions you may share with sighted folks
>  around you, and finding a partner who shares one of those
> passions
>  with you can be similarly rewarding. In other words, instead of
>  deciding who to date based on whether they are sighted or blind,
> I
>  think it's more helpful to choose based on how much you share in
>  common with them. I know that for us blind folks it can be hard
> to
>  meet and connect with people at bars or large gatherings like
> singles'
>  parties. But if you can find communities of people that share
> your
>  interests-whether that be your local NFB chapter or student
> division,
>  classes, church groups or clubs you might be in-that's a much
> better
>  way to build lasting connections.
>  Arielle
>
>  On 3/22/12, Nimer M. Jaber, IC³ <nimerjaber1 at gmail.com> wrote:
>  Oops, I missed a point: I wouldn't go to an NFB convention
> simply for
>  the dating scene. I'm sure relationships do develop at things
> like
>  that, however most people are going to be preoccupied with
> general
>  sessions, exhibits, orientation around a huge massive hotel, etc
> etc
>  to really pay attention to who's around them for dating.
>
>  Later.
>
>  On 22.03.2012, Nimer M. Jaber, IC³ <nimerjaber1 at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>  Hello Robin,
>
>  Or you could just go ahead and do the online dating thing and
> learn
>  from it. It has turned out well for some, and not so well for
> others.
>  As for the sighted vs. blind thing, I would ask what you want.
> Not
>  dating a blind person simply because you think you'll look cool
> and
>  more independent for dating a sighted person will limit your
> options,
>  just like not dating a sighted person because you're afraid of
> being
>  rejected is crazy as well. We're all individuals. Many blind
> people
>  have underlying disabilities, some may not be adjusted to their
>  blindness completely, etc etc but you wouldn't have to
> necessarily
>  feel self-conscious about the blindness issues, your appearance,
> etc
>  etc. Sighted people in my experience are going to ask many
> questions.
>  Especially at first, you'll probably have to do a whole lot more
>  educating than dating, and it might get annoying, but many are
> willing
>  to learn and it could work out. As for good dating sites ... why
> not
>  just getting onto the social networks like Facebook and put your
>  status as single? Maybe attend some of the singles conferences
> that
>  are out there? And if someone interests you, then go after them
>  (whether online or not).
>
>  Anyway, talk to you later and peace. May you have much luck with
> your
>  dating search.
>
>  Nimer J
>
>  On 22.03.2012, Joshua Lester <jlester8462 at students.pccua.edu>
> wrote:
>  Also, it has been proven, that there are people on chat sites,
> that
>  pretend to be something, to get your attention, and then when
> you meet
>  them, they're a criminal.
>  Be careful, and meet people one on one, and in person.
>  Come to the NFB convention, and you might meet someone, and oh
> yes,
>  there are sighted members in the NFB, as well!
>  Blessings, Joshua
>
>  On 3/22/12, Gloria G <gloria.graves at gmail.com> wrote:
>  Hi,
>  I have never gone on to any of the online dating sites, but I
> would
>  be
>  very
>  careful because a person online is not as friendly or charming
> as
>  they
>  appear to be over emails. I have dated very few blind people and
> find
>  that
>  there is always a focus on blindness in the relationship and I
> feel
>  that
>  is
>  a negative thing at times because we all live with blindness on
> a
>  daily
>  basis and want to know we are more than our blindness. I have
> found
>  there
>  are a lot of people open to dating a blind person expecially
> when
>  they
>  are
>  confident and out going. I have been in a relationship with a
> sited
>  person
>  for 3 years and things are wonderful.
>  ----- Original Message -----
>  From: "Robin" <robinmel71 at earthlink.net
>  To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>  Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2012 4:47 PM
>  Subject: [nabs-l] Dating & Sighted-Blind-Low Vision
>
>
>  Hello to everyone,
>  I am just wondering if anyone has had any experience with online
>  dating
>  and if so what sites would you recommend? What experiences have
> you
>  had
>  with dating sighted people vs dating blind people? I look
> forward to
>  hearing your stories.
>
>
>  I seldom think about my limitations, and they never make me sad.
>  Perhaps
>  there is just a touch of yearning at times; but it is vague,
> like a
>  breeze
>
>  among flowers.
>  Hellen Keller
>
>
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>
>  --
>  Nimer Jaber, IC³ and Freedom Scientific JAWS Certifications
>
>  The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
>  addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended
> recipient,
>  please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
>  correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its
> contents
>  by anyone other than the intended recipient may result in civil
> or
>  criminal action. I have checked this email and all corresponding
>  attachments for security threats. However, security of your
> machine is
>  up to you. Thanks.
>
>  Registered Linux User 529141.
>  http://counter.li.org/
>  Vinux testing and documentation coordinator
>  To get more information about a free and accessible operating
> system,
>  please click here:
>  http://www.vinuxproject.org
>
>  To find out about a free and versatile screen reader for windows
> XP
>  and above, please click here:
>  http://www.nvda-project.org
>
>  You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology
> news.
>
>  Check out my blog related to technology by clicking here:
>  http://nimertech.blogspot.com
>
>  To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at
> (720)
>  (251-4530) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.
>
>
>
>  --
>  Nimer Jaber, IC³ and Freedom Scientific JAWS Certifications
>
>  The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
>  addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended
> recipient,
>  please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
>  correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its
> contents
>  by anyone other than the intended recipient may result in civil
> or
>  criminal action. I have checked this email and all corresponding
>  attachments for security threats. However, security of your
> machine is
>  up to you. Thanks.
>
>  Registered Linux User 529141.
>  http://counter.li.org/
>  Vinux testing and documentation coordinator
>  To get more information about a free and accessible operating
> system,
>  please click here:
>  http://www.vinuxproject.org
>
>  To find out about a free and versatile screen reader for windows
> XP
>  and above, please click here:
>  http://www.nvda-project.org
>
>  You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology
> news.
>
>  Check out my blog related to technology by clicking here:
>  http://nimertech.blogspot.com
>
>  To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at
> (720)
>  (251-4530) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.
>
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>
> --
> Mary Fernandez
> Emory 2012
> "Do I dare
> Disturb the universe?
> In a minute there is time
> For decisions and revisions which a minute will reverse."
> --
> T.S. Eliot
>
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