[nabs-l] social norms: how we can fit in with sighted societyat social gatherings

[Desiree Oudinot]

As far as rocking goes, that is one problem I didn't have. But what I
can't get out of the habit of is eye poking. I don't do it in public
anymore, which I suppose is an improvement, but when I'm alone, I
definitely do that. In one way, it's a method of stress relief, on a
subconscious level that I can't understand. But every now and then my
parents will catch me at it and tell me not to do it.
As far as eye contact goes, I think that I look in the general
direction of where someone is speaking, but I agree, nystagmus is a
problem. I can't always control my eye movement, especially when I'm
nervous or upset, plus I'm very sensitive to light so I have a
tendency to squint or keep my eyes closed because keeping them open is
uncomfortable or at times painful. Should I be condemned for not
looking sighted for this? I certainly hope not.

On 9/15/12, Ashley Bramlett <bookwormahb at earthlink.net> wrote:
> Arielle,
> I think a seminar could be held without seeming like preaching.
> I said to Chris that norms differ based on the situation.
> We'd have to be careful though; we do not want participants to feel that
> every situation is very scripted. As I said before, social gatherings,
> particularly among young people, are relaxed and informal.
>
> If you did such a seminar the format could be lecture based, modeling, and
> question and answer. People could even submit questions anonymously for the
> discussion part.
> What could be covered are standard rules of etiquette. My dad feels that
> blind people are not as polite and in crowds are quick to shove each other
> aside, and sadly this is partly true.
> Its not about acting like sighted people, its about being courteous and
> blending in.
> You could talk about it briefly and role play situations. Topics like
> manners, what to do when you greet a new person,
> how you are supposed to wait in line for many things, clothing tips,
> nonverbal communication like gestures, and acceptable ways of fidgiting.
> Blindisms are not acceptable, but there are acceptable ways of fidgiting or
> self stimulation that are.
>
> We want to come across as approachable and nice people. Nonverbal
> communication includes correct posture. I suppose if it’s a chronic issue,
> one might want to ask a doctor about it to ensure no underlying
> coordination disorder exists. You could also work with a physical theripist
> if a muscular problem is present preventing you from having correct posture.
> My guess is a lot of blind people look down as they do not have visual
> stimulation to look up and around. Then it’s a habit to be bent over at the
> shoulders which is hard to correct. Another theory I have is that blind kids
> were sheltered and kept from moving about freely; eventually, this affects
> posture because your body adapts to a still position; muscles can shorten,
> lose their elasticity, become stiff and disjointed.
>
> I do pretty good with posture. But, I do struggle with eye contact. I have
> some vision and if I try to focus for a long time, my eyes start their
> nystagmus fit, meaning they shake involuntarily. Another thing is my parents
> tell me I look like I'm staring at people; I don't mean too, but its simply
> that I'm looking around  to see what I can.
> Another thing is while I have stopped rocking since my folks worked on that
> as I was young, I do it occasionally. I do so involuntarily for balance
> probably without knowing I'm doing it. So, its impossible for me to stop
> rocking totally; I simply cannot control a behavior I do not realize I'm
> doing. If I concentrate on walking upright and still, I won't do it. But I
> won't do this most of the time; I simply have too much to think about rather
> than asking myself, am I walking straight, walking upright, and is my head
> still.
>
>
> I think its important for us to find out about norms and find out where to
> find such information. The seminar should include that. Online resources
> about fashion trends and etiquette is an idea; asking people around us is
> another, and
> finally magazines would be another. I also wonder if there are existing
> videos either for the public, or for us specifically, on this. Maybe AFB or
> APH would have something, or maybe a video with good descriptions exists for
> the general audience. I don't know.
>
> Speaking of nonverbal communication, I'd really like to learn gestures.
> Someday, if I take public speaking, I'm going to ask the teacher to teach me
> this.
>
> Ashley
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Arielle Silverman
> Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2012 12:26 AM
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] social norms: how we can fit in with sighted societyat
> social gatherings
>
> Hi all,
> I think it is absolutely critical to point out that "sighted society"
> is not a uniform group of people who all share identical norms,
> attitudes and actions. If it were, there would be no wars, no
> religious or political differences, no unique languages, cultures,
> customs, etc. Rather, "society" as a whole is divided into many
> subgroups that all carry different norms. A few norms, like not
> killing other people, are near-universal, but most customs relating to
> dress, mannerisms, speech, nonverbal communication, etc. differ
> between cultures and sometimes between subgroups within a culture
> (i.e. people dress differently in San Francisco  than they do in
> Washington, D.C. and college students dress differently from lawyers
> etc.) It is impossible to teach blind people a universal set of
> nonverbal behaviors to adopt even if we wanted to. And, I believe that
> blind people should have just as much right as sighted people to make
> informed choices about what kinds of norms to follow or not follow,
> just as women can choose whether to be stay-at-home mothers or to work
> even if being a working woman is not yet "the norm". Of course, there
> are consequences for failing to "blend in"  and look like everybody
> else, but sometimes there are things to be gained by doing this, or
> "blending in" is simply too difficult. As responsible adults we need
> to weigh the costs and benefits of following the norms for specific
> situations. For example, if I am interviewing for a job, it is
> probably to my advantage to purchase and wear a suit. However, if I am
> doing something less high-stakes, and money is tight, I can probably
> get away with just wearing some nice slacks or a dress, even if most
> of the other people there are wearing suits.
> I do think it is useful to give blind students information about how
> they can learn about the norms present in their particular culture,
> i.e. how to learn about the dress code for a new job, where to read
> about current fashions, etc. It is also good to provide a forum for
> students to ask questions if they wish to learn more about how to
> blend in in specific situations. However, I do not think that
> preaching to blind students about the importance of blending in does
> much good. The consequences of not blending in are self-evident, and
> again, blind students are responsible young adults who need to come to
> these decisions for ourselves.
> Finally, I need to once again speak up on behalf of those blind folks
> who are labeled "weird" or "socially unskilled" by blind and sighted
> alike. As a community of blind people with common experiences, we need
> to stop passing judgment or trying to give these folks social
> makeovers, and instead acknowledge that all of us are human beings
> with different levels of skill and ability in different areas. I
> always find myself advocating for this often-misunderstood subset of
> the blind community because in some ways I am part of that group. I
> spent much of my childhood being labeled as socially inadequate,
> struggled with a few different "blindisms" and today still deal with
> lifelong gait and posture issues, and challenges with attempting eye
> contact. Because of these things some may say I look more "blind" than
> the average successful blind person, yet I am a successful graduate
> student, financially self-sufficient and in a committed relationship.
> In my own case I am very very aware of the importance of blending in
> and of how "different" I look at times, because this was emphasized to
> me over and over again as a child. My issues are complicated and I
> have still not determined if the problems I have with posture and
> balance are due to an over-protective home environment when I was
> learning to walk, an as-yet-undiagnosed balance/coordination
> impairment, or both. My problem with eye contact is related to the
> fact my vision is such that I feel like I am looking at someone's face
> when I am actually looking slightly down (and if I actually look up
> toward their face I see nothing). I can correct for this but it takes
> a ton of effort and focus for me to do so, so most of the time I end
> up looking down at someone instead of up at them even though I have
> been told hundreds of times how important it is  to attempt eye
> contact. Some others in our community have additional disabilities or
> mental conditions that make "blending in" by our definition
> practically impossible, yet these folks still have a lot to offer in
> their own way. My point is that so-called social skill deficits like
> these are often due to a lot more than just not knowing any better or
> being mentally deficient. It is important to recognize that all
> members of our community have strengths and abilities of their own,
> even if they seem weak or deficient or even "weird" to us, and we
> should do what we can to empower these people instead of using them as
> examples of what's wrong with our community as a whole. I hope that
> made some sense.
> Best,
> Arielle
>
> On 9/14/12, Beth <thebluesisloose at gmail.com> wrote:
>> I've tried to avoid getting into this thread, but here goes:
>> 1. Blind people acting like sighted people scares the crap out of
>> me because it just does for some reason.
>> 2. Girls' conformity rules are terrible: for instance, girls
>> shouldn't be scientists.  What does that statement say about us
>> girls?  Girls should be married to men with decent jobs.  No, I
>> will not marry a man with any job so I can be taken care of, and
>> this isn't the friggin' 1800's.  Girls and women can take care of
>> themselves, and they can work and support families.  Jason, my
>> current bf, does not work and can't do what society says, be a
>> man and work and get paid for the woman.  Some societies demand
>> that all men work and women stay home.  We, Americans though we
>> are, still have these demands on blind women.  I as a blind woman
>> cannot accept conformity or defeat due to womanhood.  Since Jason
>> can't work and follow society's rules of manhood, it's up to me
>> to do it.  Girls should not always do typing, nursing, or
>> different "womanly" professions where they get paid less than
>> ordinary men.  Jason, due to his disability, does not work.  I,
>> due to mental illness, may never work.  I want to work so bad,
>> but where?  Goodwill is out of the question.  I'm not working for
>> nothing or low wages because I'm a woman.  And no way will I
>> accept sexual harassment because I have breasts and different
>> organs inside me.  I as a blind woman will not accept rules
>> saying "You will be taken care of.  You will be a stay-at-home
>> wife.  You will be poor."  No way.
>> Beth
>>
>>  ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Marc Workman <mworkman.lists at gmail.com
>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> Date sent: Fri, 14 Sep 2012 20:37:00 -0600
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] social norms: how we can fit in with
>> sighted societyat social gatherings
>>
>> Chris wrote,
>> Therefore, it is important that we know the unwritten rules which
>> our sighted society has made.  If we don't know them and follow
>> them, what does that say about us as blind people? It says we are
>> weird, different, abnormal, incompetent, dependent, etc.
>>
>> Alternatively, perhaps it says that those rules are not natural,
>> that they are the product of sighted people simply aping one
>> another, and that they are arbitrary. I believe that such
>> unwritten rules often needlessly cause huge amounts of anxiety,
>> self-loathing, and anguish.
>>
>> We had a similar discussion on this list some time ago,
>> particularly around the subject of so called "blindisms, and I
>> put that term in quotes as a way of acknowledging that it is
>> pejorative. I'm sure it could be found on line by anyone who is
>> interested.
>>
>> Personally, I would rather live in a world where blind people are
>> accepted and respected not simply to the extent that they can
>> look and act like sighted people, but on the grounds that they
>> are human beings possessing dignity and as equally worthy of
>> respect as sighted people. The message shouldn't be, "hey, we can
>> follow your rules, so you should accept us". Instead, the message
>> should be, "we, like you, have many talents and weaknesses, feel
>> pleasure and pain, reach our full potential through the formation
>> of deep and meaningful relationships with other human beings, and
>> your failure to treat us with respect and as equals is unfair,
>> discriminatory, and immoral", to borrow from Mr. Lewis.
>>
>> By the way, I think this goes well beyond blind people fitting
>> into sighted society. We are constantly policing one another's
>> behaviour. Probably one of the more obvious examples of this has
>> to do with gender. There are hundreds if not thousands of mostly
>> unspoken rules about what makes a man a man and how real men
>> ought to behave, and there are twice as many concerning women.
>> These rules are enforced in subtle but effective ways, and the
>> result is often a great deal of suffering for anyone who cannot,
>> or chooses not to, conform. These gender rules are just as
>> arbitrary as those around sighted/blind behaviour, and the effort
>> similarly should be to relax and remove such rules, not to more
>> explicitly and fervently teach boys and girls the so called right
>> way to act.
>>
>> This is of course easier said than done, and failing to conform
>> does unfortunately often result in suffering, such as missed
>> social, volunteer, and employment opportunities. So I don't judge
>> or condemn anyone who makes a serious effort to learn the
>> unwritten rules of sighted society, just as I don't judge someone
>> who wants to spend all of his or her time reading medical
>> journals and desperately praying for a cure. It's hard being
>> blind in the particular society in which we live, and conforming
>> can make things a little bit easier. But I still think we should
>> work more on changing attitudes and less on teaching blind people
>> how to look and act like sighted people.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Marc
>> On 2012-09-14, at 3:04 PM, Chris Nusbaum
>> <dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>  Hi Brandon and all,
>>
>>  I'm taking the liberty here to change the subject of this
>> thread, as if we're going to discuss the topic which Brandon has
>> brought up in his post, I think it would prevent confusion if we
>> changed the subject to reflect the actual topic of Brandon's
>> message.
>>
>>  Brandon, your idea about the NFB conducting some kind of
>> instructional seminar or workshop on social norms and how we can
>> "fit in" with the sighted public is a great one! I think you
>> should talk with the NFB leadership about this! I believe NOPBC
>> (the parents division) has touched on this topic in their
>> seminars at conventions.  One of the topics at the parents
>> seminar at the Maryland state convention is almost always social
>> skills, especially what sighted society has deemed socially
>> acceptable and how we as blind people can fit in at social
>> gatherings, conforming as best we can to the "norms" of society.
>> I believe this is arguably more important for blind students, as
>> we are often in social gatherings (or want to be in them) at our
>> schools, with our friends, or in our communities.  Therefore, it
>> is important  that we know the unwritten rules which our sighted
>> society has made.  If we don't know them and follow them, what
>> does that say about us as blind people? It says we are weird,
>> different, abnormal, incompetent, dependent, etc.  These are the
>> very adjectives we in the Federation have been working to cut out
>> from the vocabulary of the public when in the context of
>> blindness and blind people.  In other words, these are the very
>> things we don't want sighted people thinking about us.  If this
>> is how sighted people perceive us, then it puts our ability to
>> get a job, volunteer in our community, and become first-class
>> citizens at risk.  So, I think this would be a great thing for
>> the NFB to do, and one which I'm kind of surprised we're not
>> doing already.  Also, since this is an important topic for blind
>> students, perhaps "social skills and norms" could be the topic of
>> a future NABS membership call.
>>
>>  Just my thoughts,
>>
>>  Chris
>>
>>  ----- Original Message -----
>>  From: "Brandon Keith Biggs" <brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com
>>  To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>  Date sent: Mon, 10 Sep 2012 21:15:16 -0700
>>  Subject: Re: [nabs-l] condoms and Sexual Health
>>
>>  Hello,
>>  We aren't promoting sex among students, we are promoting safe
>> sex.  There is
>>  a huge difference.  If the student division is the only one with
>> some
>>  practical sense about sexual activities, I'm a little scared...
>> :)
>>  I do agree though, sex, dating and excepted socializing among a
>> sighted
>>  community is a very big topic that is often times ignored by the
>> blind
>>  community.
>>  I have been told by sighted TVIs that many blind folks (youth or
>> not) have
>>  some very strange mannerisms and beliefs that are totally
>> against the grain
>>  of sighted society.  My mom in particular, who is a TVI, has
>> suggested that
>>  the NFB should really give some instruction on how the sighted
>> world thinks.
>>  Otherwise what will happen (and what has happened) is the world
>> looks at a
>>  gathering of blind people and cringes because they are so weird.
>> or a
>>  sighted girl sees a blind guy and thinks she wants to talk to
>> him and when
>>  she is about to sit down and say hi, the guy does something
>> really weird and
>>  she turns around and walks a mile away.
>>  This is a little different than the deal with the condoms, but
>> both sexual
>>  health and social issues are topics that are very much in need
>> of attention
>>  among blind individuals, and students in particular.
>>  I feel strongly that having some active workshops on this that
>> aren't meant
>>  to be uncomfortable, but still deal with the taboo problems
>> would greatly
>>  improve convention.
>>  Thank you,
>>
>>  Brandon Keith Biggs
>>  -----Original Message-----
>>  From: Arielle Silverman
>>  Sent: Monday, September 10, 2012 8:18 PM
>>  To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>  Subject: Re: [nabs-l] condoms and Sexual Health
>>
>>  Hi all,
>>  I have joked in the past about how NABS should sell Brailled
>> Whozit
>>  condoms at convention! Kidding aside, though, there are probably
>> some
>>  NFB leaders with more conservative leanings, who might feel that
>> NABS
>>  selling condoms at convention would be promoting sexual activity
>> among
>>  young or unmarried blind students.  I don't agree with that
>> position,
>>  but some people do and since anything NABS does is, by
>> extension, an
>>  NFB-sanctioned event, we would need to balance the benefits of
>>  providing condoms against possibly upsetting the NFB leadership
>> or
>>  bringing on an unwanted political debate.
>>  I would be more likely to support a NABS breakout session, at
>>  Washington Seminar or elsewhere, about sexuality in general, and
>>  perhaps include an opportunity to try putting a condom on the
>>  proverbial banana or some such.  When I was 15, I went to a
>> diversity
>>  camp (for sighted teens) and there was a sexuality workshop
>> available
>>  as one of several choices.  They passed around condoms and in
>> fact,
>>  this was the first time I actually felt one.  A general workshop
>> about
>>  sex, dating and etiquette, etc.  might be worth having.
>>  Arielle
>>
>>  On 9/10/12, Brandon Keith Biggs <brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>  Hello,
>>  This would be an awesome idea! Not only because many people have
>> never
>>  seen
>>
>>  a condom, so they could finger the packages with labels without
>> having to
>>  be
>>
>>  embarrassed, but when I was at the hotel I didn't run into any
>> condoms in
>>  the store.  Granted I wasn't looking for them, but I was
>> browsing...
>>  Condoms,
>>
>>  lube and Dental Dams, all labeled in Braille! We would also
>> probably need
>>  to
>>
>>  provide guides for people on how to find the right way to put on
>> a condom
>>  or
>>
>>  use a dental dam.
>>  Another thing I didn't see at the NABS table is hot serial.  The
>> packing
>>  guide in the nabs newsletter  said to pack a ton of things and I
>> for one
>>  don't keep hot serial in the house and I don't shop at places
>> that sell
>>  hot
>>
>>  serial, so wasn't able to grab a box.  But I would have loved to
>> buy a box
>>  for even $10 or more, the breakfasts there were $10 alone...
>> (Then of
>>  course
>>
>>  we could sell bole and spoon packs for the poor folks who didn't
>> bring
>>  their
>>
>>  own utensil's).
>>  Thanks,
>>
>>  Brandon Keith Biggs
>>  -----Original Message-----
>>  From: Anmol Bhatia
>>  Sent: Monday, September 10, 2012 8:28 AM
>>  To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>  Subject: Re: [nabs-l] condoms and Sexual Health
>>
>>
>>  You would be a good place to sell and buy condoms? At the NFB
>>  convention...
>>
>>  Perhaps Nabs should sell condoms at the NABS table.  We can even
>> braille
>>  them
>>
>>  so the perso can know what kind of condoms they have.  lol
>>
>>  Anmol
>>
>>  I seldom think about my limitations, and they never make me sad.
>> Perhaps
>>  there is just a touch of yearning at times; but it is vague,
>> like a breeze
>>  among flowers.
>>  Hellen Keller
>>
>>
>>  --- On Sun, 9/9/12, Carly Mihalakis <carlymih at comcast.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>  From: Carly Mihalakis <carlymih at comcast.net
>>  Subject: Re: [nabs-l] condoms and Sexual Health
>>  To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
>>  <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>, "National Association of Blind Students
>> mailing
>>  list"
>>
>>  <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>  Date: Sunday, September 9, 2012, 10:54 PM
>>  Hi, Brandon,
>>
>>  I went into a place in Denver to  buy a dildo yes, on
>>  the bigger, ribbed side to use in the old fashioned bath tub
>>  I had at the time, to get myself off with the faucet.
>>  Traditionally, I need something in my ass, to cum.  If I
>>  remember, the folks in their wer very cool, look at the
>>  blind girl going to by herself a dildo! Don't worry! If
>>  you're relaxed, and cool about what you're doing so will be
>>  the bookstore, personnel.  Let us know how goes it,
>>  okay?  At 04:52 PM 9/8/2012, SA Mobile wrote:
>>  Those are the best places to get stuff as the staff are
>>  professional and are trained to make customers feel at ease.
>>  Just make sure the shop is of good repute.
>>
>>  Respectfully,
>>  Jedi
>>
>>  Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>  On 08/09/2012, at 12:36 PM, "Brandon Keith Biggs"
>>  <brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com
>>  wrote:
>>
>>  Hello,
>>  Thank goodness my father was a nurse and when I
>>  turned 18, he said addio to being in with me at the doctor.
>>  I do find it amusing though that some doctors are actually
>>  really uncomfortable touching me because I'm blind...  That
>>  only happened after my dad started leaving the room.
>>  Thank you Arielle for those websites.  I don't feel
>>  that condoms are something I want to buy from a website I've
>>  never heard of before unless someone I know has gotten or
>>  knows that site is trust worthy.
>>  I was told that flavored condoms were only to be
>>  used in oral intercourse.  The same is not for lube I
>>  presume?
>>  Also, has anyone ever gone into a sex store? How
>>  was it as a blind shopper? Even from sighted people I hear
>>  the experience is often not pleasant.
>>  Thanks,
>>
>>  Brandon Keith Biggs
>>  -----Original Message----- From: Arielle
>>  Silverman
>>  Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2012 10:00 AM
>>  To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>  Subject: [nabs-l] condoms and Sexual Health
>>
>>  Hi all,
>>  I know the recent discussions about sex and dating
>>  are kind of in a
>>  gray area as to whether or not they're on-topic
>>  for this list, since
>>  most of the issues Koby brought up are not really
>>  unique to blindness.
>>  So if the moderators or Dave feel this is getting
>>  too far afield, I
>>  will happily respect your judgment.  However, I
>>  also think that
>>  Brandon's question about where to get condoms is a
>>  legitimate one and
>>  that there might be other blind people out here,
>>  including teenagers,
>>  who have similar concerns about how to get
>>  condoms, birth control or
>>  sexual health information without a lot of
>>  awkwardness or
>>  embarrassment.  It can be particularly difficult if
>>  you have to depend
>>  on someone else (especially parents) for
>>  transportation which can make
>>  going to a clinic or drugstore difficult.
>>  There are a few places to buy condoms online,
>>  including
>>  www.condomania.com
>>  www.undercovercondoms.com
>>  and
>>  www.condomdepot.com
>>  Believe it or not, they also have some condom
>>  choices at
>>  www.amazon.com
>>  If you go to your health center on campus for any
>>  reason, it shouldn't
>>  be a problem  to ask a doctor or nurse there
>>  about condoms.
>>  I cannot answer the questions about when to begin
>>  having sex with a
>>  partner because that is a highly individual
>>  decision.  However, I feel
>>  it important that anyone who is considering having
>>  sex for the first
>>  time ensure you understand what all of your
>>  options are for preventing
>>  pregnancy and sexually transmitted diseases, the
>>  advantages and
>>  disadvantages of each option, and the proper way
>>  to use condoms  and
>>  birth control.  There are  a couple different
>>  websites with this kind
>>  of information:
>>  www.plannedparenthood.org
>>  (includes live chat with a sexual health educator)
>>  or
>>  www.scarleteen.com
>>  This issue is particularly close to my heart at
>>  the moment because my
>>  boyfriend's sister just had an unintended
>>  pregnancy at a very
>>  inopportune time (while still in college, with a
>>  guy she had only
>>  known for a few months) and was apparently taking
>>  birth control pills,
>>  but had not been taking them consistently.  While I
>>  don't believe that
>>  sex  should be feared, it is something that
>>  takes some responsibility,
>>  planning and foresight to ensure it is enjoyable
>>  while minimizing the
>>  risks.  Also, while I won't go into details here,
>>  there are other ways
>>  to be physically intimate with someone that are
>>  less risky, which
>>  these online forums will talk about.
>>  I also want to bring up  an issue that is
>>  somewhat relevant to sexual
>>  health, which I experienced and I think that some
>>  of you might also be
>>  struggling with.  This is the issue of having your
>>  parents drive you to
>>  doctors' appointments and then having them want to
>>  sit in or even
>>  participate in your appointments.  Since I attended
>>  college in my home
>>  city, my mother always wanted to drive me to my
>>  doctors' appointments
>>  and would then want to come in and chat with the
>>  doctor while he/she
>>  was examining me.  This was partly because my
>>  parents and I saw many of
>>  the same doctors and she often thought it was a
>>  good opportunity to
>>  ask the doctor a quick question about her own
>>  health while she was
>>  there, or because she was curious to see what the
>>  doctor recommended
>>  to me about a particular issue.  I eventually
>>  realized that while it
>>  wasn't ill-intentioned, it was a violation of my
>>  privacy as an adult
>>  patient and I asked her to wait in the waiting
>>  room while I was seeing
>>  the doctor.  I didn't actually take this stand
>>  until I was 21 and in
>>  hindsight I wish I had done  it much earlier.
>>  By the time you are 18,
>>  unless you have a serious cognitive disability,
>>  you have a right to
>>  privacy of your medical information and it is
>>  important to establish a
>>  good doctor-patient relationship without a third
>>  person interfering.
>>  This is especially true when it comes to sexual
>>  health and by the time
>>  you are 18 or even 16, you will want to start
>>  discussing your sexual
>>  activities or questions with your doctors without
>>  your parents being
>>  around.  You might also want to consider getting a
>>  driver or even
>>  taking the bus to medical appointments to avoid
>>  this problem.
>>  On a related note, by the time you are in high
>>  school, you should know
>>  the names of all medications you take on  a
>>  regular basis and any
>>  chronic medical conditions you may have.  If you
>>  ever have to go to the
>>  emergency room, this kind  of information may
>>  be requested of you.
>>  Best,
>>  Arielle
>>
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