[nabs-l] Google car takes to the streets

blackbyrdfly at gmail.com blackbyrdfly at gmail.com
Mon Apr 15 15:28:14 UTC 2013


Because the NFB car was a proof of concept campaign, and the Google car is a real mainstream product expected to hit the market and receive widespread adoption. 

Sent from my iPhone

On Apr 15, 2013, at 5:12 AM, Joshua Lester <JLester8462 at pccua.edu> wrote:

> Why are we all wanting the Google car?
> The NFB has its own car!
> http://www.blinddriverchallenge.org
> Blessings, Joshua
> ________________________________________
> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com]
> Sent: Monday, April 15, 2013 12:34 AM
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Google car takes to the streets
> 
> Rania,
> 
> Us therapists and our traveling... well, future therapist in my case,
> but still.  :)
> It would be so awesome to tell an employer when they ask how I'd be
> able to get from one hospital or school to the next, "Yes, I'm blind,
> but there are these amazing self-driving cars Google made and I have
> one.  I'd be happy to go wherever the clients are."  I would love that
> type of flexibility!
> 
> On 4/15/13, Rania Ismail LMT <raniaismail04 at gmail.com> wrote:
>> I would love to be able to drive my self places so I wouldn't have to
>> depend
>> on a cab to get from one place to another.
>> I do have a friend pick me up or my sister when they can but I think having
>> a car would make me more independent. Maybe I would be able to work at two
>> places and see more client's instead of only working at one place.
>> I would also like the freedom to go ware I want when I want with out having
>> to set a pick up time with the cab.
>> Rania,
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton
>> Sent: Sunday, April 14, 2013 11:52 PM
>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Google car takes to the streets
>> 
>> For me in terms of employment, a car would be a tremendous asset.  It
>> wouldn't limit me to staying in one spot to have clients come to me.
>> With a car someone in my field of work can be contracted out to do
>> home visits or to assist in hospice settings in addition to their job
>> at a hospital, school, or other fascility where they can stay and just
>> make rounds.  A car presents opportunities to me, and for me and
>> others who's careers would benefit from having the ability to drive
>> themselves it would be an investment.  In this case, it would
>> absolutely pay for itself, even gas because time would be far less
>> wasted, and I would get more fulfillment out of it because there would
>> be more time spent helping people and doing what I love to do than
>> sitting at a bus stop/walking to the next stop/sitting on the bus
>> twiddling my thumbs... and we won't even talk about the hassle of when
>> the driver screws up and you don't get off where you wanted to.
>> 
>> Employment aside, I'd also like my own car so I don't have to deal
>> with cabs.  Once I called a cab on a Sunday night and the dispatcher
>> gave me an ETA of 30 to 45 minutes.  The driver showed up 2 hours
>> later.  The car smelled of vomit, which I'm assuming was because a
>> drunk person was riding before me and the smell still had not been
>> fully cleaned out of the fabrics in the car, and I'm pretty sure from
>> the feel of the car that he was speeding on the highway.  Not to
>> mention that I asked him to take a route through downtown which was
>> quicker and a little less expensive, but he took me down the
>> expressway regardless... he did not get a good tip from me for that
>> one.  And when we were in the car the cab driver kept answering his
>> cell phone because I guess he didn't have one of those radios so he
>> used the cell... but that coupled with how fast we were going made me
>> feel really uncomfortable.  To me the buses I've ridden along with
>> that cab experience have turned me away from public transit because
>> they're usually shady.  I can use it and would if necessary, but if
>> given the choice I would rather save the time and frustration and
>> drive myself.  I respect the choice of those who say they would rather
>> stick with public transit, but for myself and others a car seems the
>> more practical way to go.
>> 
>> On 4/14/13, blackbyrdfly at gmail.com <blackbyrdfly at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Focus less on the barriers, and far, far more on all the alternatives and
>>> solutions. Unless you're receiving some serious discounts on public
>> transit
>>> and never use a cab, owning an autonomous car will pay for itself over
>> time,
>>> even with the need for insurance and fuel. Consider the cost of missed
>>> opportunities, not just the cost of transit alone. Also, time is money.
>> Less
>>> time walking and waiting means more time to generate revenue. And we
>> should
>>> never underestimate the earning potential of self employment, even while
>>> we're looking for traditional jobs. I've earned significant income doing
>>> electronics retail on eBay with two blind business partners, and one of
>> them
>>> now has a software startup of his own that got him off of SSI. It can be
>>> done if you want to work for it. It just takes creative problem solving.
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>> On Apr 14, 2013, at 6:27 PM, "Peter Donahue" <pdonahue2 at satx.rr.com>
>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Good evening Ashley and everyone,
>>>> 
>>>>   But not if we create the kind of incomes to allow us to perches these
>>>> vehicles and a whole lot more. Figure it out!
>>>> 
>>>> Peter Donahue
>>>> 
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Ashley Bramlett" <bookwormahb at earthlink.net>
>>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Sent: Sunday, April 14, 2013 5:29 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Google car takes to the streets
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Aleeha,
>>>> Thank you. I don't think we are even close either to having such a car
>>>> to
>>>> drive in public.
>>>> So, really we are arguing among ourselves about something in the distant
>>>> future. And, step back and think. Cars cost more money than taking
>>>> public
>>>> transit and this car will be more than the average car.
>>>> 
>>>> We have so so many barriers in employment now. You will have to save a
>> lot
>>>> for such a car and you can only save money if you got a job.
>>>> Getting a job is not easy and made worse in the economy. If you get
>>>> interviewed, even under schedule A in the government, you got other
>>>> competors against you with more job experience, more computer experience
>>>> perhaps. It's a catch 22; you need more experience for entry level jobs
>>>> but
>>>> you need a job to cultivate experience.
>>>> Yes we can work, but as I'm finding there are a number of barriers with
>>>> software accessibility to deal with on the job. Jobs you would not think
>>>> are
>>>> visual are visual. For instance, many communications jobs require not
>> only
>>>> the writing of pitch letters and press releases, but the compilation of
>>>> photos with adobe end design or using graphical layout software such as
>>>> microsoft publisher or photoshop to publish pr material. Not to mention
>>>> social media wich is semi accessible. Can you say the word captcha? For
>>>> real, these are barriers.
>>>> I'm really tired of people saying they'll just get employed or that
>> people
>>>> who cannot find work are making excuses. Having a degree does not
>>>> gaurantee
>>>> you a job. Having excellent references from professors and aquaintances
>>>> does
>>>> not gaurantee you a job.
>>>> 
>>>> I've been hoping to find at least a part time job to give me experience
>>>> before I go to grad school; actually not sure I'll do grad school but if
>> I
>>>> do, I'd sure like to work before grad school. And yes, I had internships
>>>> in
>>>> the government and one nonprofit. still not enough experience.
>>>> 
>>>> I'd suggest having a job before getting a google car if one even exists
>>>> for
>>>> the public.
>>>> Also, try not to make sweeping generalizations about why people aren't
>>>> employed. It could be you one day.
>>>> 
>>>> Ashley
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Aleeha Dudley
>>>> Sent: Sunday, April 14, 2013 3:50 PM
>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Google car takes to the streets
>>>> 
>>>> Hello all,
>>>>    I hesitate to stick my nose into this one, but it seems that this
>>>> thread has provoked my own strong opinions, both about the Google car
>>>> and about the attitude of some list members.
>>>>    First, I will say this. In my opinion, I would drive the Google
>>>> car if there was a way to provide a failsafe of sorts that would
>>>> activate should a malfunction in the system occur. I do not believe
>>>> that we are even close to having these cars in public, let alone to
>>>> knocking down the proverbial barrier that exists between the blind and
>>>> sighted communities which would allow them to even consider permitting
>>>> us to drive on the roads.
>>>>    The second part of my message concerns the language some people
>>>> are choosing to use on this list, as well as the hostile attitudes
>>>> that exist amoung some. If you choose to curse, please take it off
>>>> list. I for one am offended by some of the language on this list and
>>>> feel that many others are as well. We are supposed to be a community
>>>> of blind students assisting one another in our educational pursuits
>>>> and issues. With the attitude I have observed, it concerns me that
>>>> some students might be afraid to come forward, fearing being shut down
>>>> or criticized. As Kaiti has stated before, this list archive is
>>>> PUBLIC! That means anyone can find it and read it on the Internet. Not
>>>> so concerning until you think about the fact that most employers
>>>> looking for a valued employee will do a web search and background
>>>> check. This means that they can and will find these posts with these
>>>> offensive words and will probably think of you as a less valuable
>>>> candidate for the job, or perhaps dismiss your application altogether
>>>> if they see such language in your messages. For your own job security,
>>>> I suggest this language and negative attitude tone down. Please
>>>> consider other list members who may not condone such language or who
>>>> may be younger than most of us.
>>>> Thank you,
>>>> Aleeha
>>>> 
>>>> On 4/14/13, Ashley Bramlett <bookwormahb at earthlink.net> wrote:
>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>> I haven't read all this thread much. But from what I read, it seems
>>>>> like
>>>>> you
>>>>> 
>>>>> all believe the car would provide more transit options and you'd buy
>>>>> one
>>>>> if
>>>>> 
>>>>> given a choice.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I know the problems in the bus system; I've seen them and ridden
>>>>> paratransit
>>>>> 
>>>>> and felt its impact of unreliability and lateness.
>>>>> That said, I think other methods of travel are more efficient and safe.
>>>>> Things like cabs, car pools, getting rides with friends when you want
>>>>> to
>>>>> hang out, and hiring a driver would be better.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I do not support blind people driving because we cannot see to override
>>>>> the
>>>>> 
>>>>> car.
>>>>> I have to agree with the individual that said that having a car is self
>>>>> serving. We are putting other lives at risk.
>>>>> We face many obstacles on the rode like other cars wipping in front of
>> us
>>>>> when its not their turn; cars inching along not going the speed limit
>> and
>>>>> you got to move around them, waiting for pedestrians to walk, rode
>>>>> rage,
>>>>> and
>>>>> 
>>>>> drunk drivers.
>>>>> Without vision, we cannot! intervene the computerized car to override
>>>>> it
>>>>> when obstacles arise.
>>>>> I cannot tell you how many times my parents slammed on the brakes due
>>>>> to
>>>>> some driver wipping out in front of them, drivers who unexpectedly turn
>>>>> without turning on their turn signal like their supposed to,
>>>>> pedestrians
>>>>> who
>>>>> 
>>>>> are still walking across the street when the orange don't walk signal
>>>>> is
>>>>> on
>>>>> 
>>>>> thus making cars wait, having to swerve around bicyclists, and
>> distracted
>>>>> drivers on cell phones.
>>>>> All these obstacles create hazards which a human driver with eyes needs
>>>>> to
>>>>> see and make a quick judgement and use reflexes to act upon unexpected
>>>>> hazards.
>>>>> 
>>>>> So, yeah, when you all can afford a new google car, go right ahead and
>>>>> you
>>>>> never know who might be hurt if you even get a license. I just don't
>> want
>>>>> to
>>>>> 
>>>>> be on the road with you.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I think the nfb car sounded safer and it was built for blind people,
>>>>> but
>>>>> we
>>>>> 
>>>>> abandoned that project, probably cause of money.
>>>>> Ashley
>>>>> 
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: Kaiti Shelton
>>>>> Sent: Sunday, April 14, 2013 12:08 PM
>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Google car takes to the streets
>>>>> 
>>>>> I don't see it as self-serving either... in my experience with buses I
>>>>> have to agree with Sophie here.  Plus, some parts of town that I need
>>>>> to go either aren't served by buses, or take a really long time to get
>>>>> to which sometimes involves going in the opposite way of the
>>>>> destination for a while and then circling back because of Dayton's bus
>>>>> system.  (It's organized by buses going north-south and east-west, but
>>>>> sometimes when you're at a stop the time of the bus won't tell you if
>>>>> the bus is going north or south, or east or west so you have to roll
>>>>> with it.  I'd much rather just get into a car and drive than boomerang
>>>>> around the city just to get to one place, and then do it again
>>>>> returning to school.  And because of this, and the fact that it the
>>>>> bus system isn't exactly equivalent to a car, I don't consider it
>>>>> self-serving either.  I have no problem in supporting it and other
>>>>> programs of public transit for people who can't drive a car, which
>>>>> more often are people who are low income, have a suspended license, or
>>>>> who are inner-city, or elderly than blind, but if I and other blind
>>>>> people can afford a car and want one I don't see anything self-serving
>>>>> in that, it's just doing what is most efficient.  I actually think not
>>>>> taking advantage of this opportunity on the basis that the less than
>>>>> efficient public transit systems work fine and that other people can
>>>>> use the money or whatever that would go into buying this car would be
>>>>> like saying you'd pass up going to college even though you could
>>>>> because other people can be served by your tuition money, and the high
>>>>> school diploma would serve you just fine.  It's more efficient, so why
>>>>> not do it?
>>>>> 
>>>>> Sophie, I too see it more as an investment in independence.  :)
>>>>> 
>>>>> On 4/14/13, Robert William Kingett <kingettr at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Im buying this damn car the first chance I get. I'd rather be self
>>>>>> serving and frivolous and drive to some place within 20 minutes
>>>>>> instead
>>>>>> of sitting on the bus for three hours, or more, depending on if the
>>>>>> driver didn't call my stop and I'd be riding extra long. Here in
>>>>>> chicagothat isn't a problem but I used to live in Tallahassee FL where
>>>>>> there was no automated system to tell you where you were. So yes, I'd
>>>>>> much rather be self serving and save up. Besides, as I have said
>>>>>> before
>>>>>> in a previous message, this technology is driving along the streets of
>>>>>> Nevada. I'm so excited that I'm even grinning and daydreaming about
>>>>>> driving along side of a bus, and happy that I'm frivolous enough to
>>>>>> pay
>>>>>> for a self serving device that will allowfor me to get to the office
>>>>>> quicker, or to an interview on time, thus allowing me to have greater
>>>>>> chances to pay my taxes so you other non self serving blind people can
>>>>>> take the bus. I think it's a neat little circle of irony, don't you
>>>>>> think? LOL!
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> --
>>>>> Kaiti
>>>>> 
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>>>>> 
>>>>> 
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>> 
>> --
>> Kaiti
>> 
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