[nabs-l] the test accomodations

Mon Apr 29 01:13:50 UTC 2013

Kirt,
Thanks. I do intend to use that idea of process of elimination.
If they mispronounce say  2 or 3 of five terms, I'll do what I know and then
look at the rest carefully by having them spell words. If I get a reader 
though with an accent or poor english skills, I might have a hard time 
understanding how they spell; in this case, I'll ask them to spell using a 
word; meaning spell phonetically. Sometimes B and d sound alike in which 
case I'd have to ask which letter they mean.

Thanks for reminding me about using the other definitions. Perhaps I'm just 
too worried. I just want a fair chance to succeed with a decent reader and I 
have no clue what sort of reader I'll get. Some student readers are decent. 
Others mumble and act like they've never read aloud in their lives.

Its stressful to work with an untrained reader who may or may not know how 
to pronounce words. but that is what I have to deal with since I cannot 
bring my own readers in.

I'll just do my best with what I have.
Ashley

-----Original Message----- 
From: Kirt Manwaring
Sent: Sunday, April 28, 2013 4:38 PM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] the test accomodations

Ashley,
  I think you'll probably be fine.  When I've had readers mispronounce
things in other languages, it's usually been easy enough for me to
have them pronounce the other words in the matching list and, from
there, it hasn't been that hard to figure out what's what.  Best of
luck to you!

On 4/28/13, Ashley Bramlett <bookwormahb at earthlink.net> wrote:
> Hi Tyler,
> I've worked with incompetent readers. I've tried to accommodate their poor
> reading level. Some of them have mumbled to the page or speak fast so I
> cannot differientiate between choice A and B. I ask them to slow down and 
> I
>
> lean in toward them to hear better.
> Actually, its my experience that good readers do not look down at the page
> but rather they sit up straight and their voice projects out and they sort
> of look toward me. Its hard to describe. But their face is not in the 
> page,
>
> but yeah of course they are looking at it to read.
> I think your suggestion of changing seats to sit
> across from them is a good one.
>
> Finally, I think you misunderstand my comments. I never said things will 
> be
>
> perfect and yes I have in fact made my own accomodations. A few examples.
> For instance, I learn better in braille or large print if its something 
> with
>
> symbols.
> So, I use my perkins to braille out key items to study or use my braille
> note or my very old embosser on occasion.
> Sometimes I don't know how to spell proper places and other nouns so i
> go to that word with jaws and read it character by character.
> I've often not had my accomodations met that state I get handouts in
> electronic format. So I take them in paper form and scan them.
>
> Sometimes I have articles to read that are not electronic; no online 
> version
>
> is available. if it is, and the professor is helpful, they send me the
> links.
> So in those instances, I have used readers I hired.
>
> So, of course I do more work and work around studying and living in a
> sighted world.
> But when a school is  a huge community college and should make the
> accomodations to test you fairly, I do have a problem. They could also 
> have
>
> a braille display or heaven forbid they actually do in-house brailling. 
> What
>
> a concept!
> Having a braille display and reading it on the pc would solve this problem
> since I'd be reading the words like everyone else.
> Note that I've suggested getting a braille display; even a small one, a 
> long
>
> time ago.
>
> They also lost their Assistive tech guy who could have done the brailling.
> They are supposedly looking for a AT assistant.
>
> Anyway, the best I can do is advocate to the dss office and speak to the
> professor and hopefully work something out.
>
> Ashley
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Littlefield, Tyler
> Sent: Sunday, April 28, 2013 3:56 AM
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] the test accomodations
>
> Ashley:
> I'm not sure what you mean by compitant. I've had people read from all
> ranges. There are people that read slower, but your two concerns ("They
> talk to the paper" and "'tThey don't know arabic words") are pretty far
> out there.
>
> First, they're going to be looking at the paper that they're reading.
> its physically impossible, unless they were to turn to face you for them
> to be looking straight at you. I'm not sure if this is a problem, but
> try sitting across from them at a table if you must be facing them.
> Second, if they mumble or have issues this is problematic and I suggest
> finding someone else. If you are unable to find a reader from department
> x, know that said reader probably won't know all the words, and it will
> be up to you guys to work things out to try to figure out what they
> mean. If they're reading from the book, flip to the back where there's
> generally a glossary.
>
> What it comes down to is you are blind, and as a result you have to make
> your own accomidations. You can scream and hollar about ADA as much as
> you want, but it doesn't matter. When they outright violate your rights,
> that's when you need to scream about ADA. When your reader isn't
> perfect, it needs to be accepted as one of the points to doing business,
> and you as the student needs to work it out. I'm not saying you need to
> lay down and take everything--I fully agree that you should complain
> about the math issue you mentioned. What I am saying though is you'll
> get a lot farther if you are willing to be flexable and acknowledge and
> accept that this won't be a perfect shot. It's something you have to
> deal with unless you want to find alternative means to getting the books
> that you need.
>
>
> I just want to throw one more thing out there at you. Being in college,
> as lame as it may sound really does get you ready for later work life.
> I've seen numerous complaints about professor x y and z for the last few
> semesters; if you're in a job, you already have to overcome the "wow
> she's blind" factor most of the time. Refusing to be flexable or work
> with people won't do you any good. You might call up the ADA, but when
> it really comes down to it, people can find a good reason to drop you
> eventually if they want to, and they don't even have to tell you it's
> because you're blind and unflexable. People don't have to hire you if
> they don't want to, and they don't have to tell you it's because you're
> blind; they can tell you someone else got the job and hand it to the
> loser who got half your GPA if they really want to. Again, it doesn't
> mean you should take everything, but I feel like you could problem solve
> some of these issues a lot more if you were willing to accept people's
> ideas and get outside the box, and starting now can only help you in the
> future.
>
> Good luck,
> On 4/27/2013 10:18 PM, Ashley Bramlett wrote:
>> Arielle,
>> I was told I have to use their readers by the dss office. I will check 
>> the
>>
>> student handbook and the disability website to check on policies. But I
>> believe that I cannot use my own reader. Believe me, I'd love to have
>> another staff member or another student assist me who can read.
>>
>> My accomodations are between me and the professor to some extent. but 
>> when
>>
>> I take a test in the testing center, it is my understand I have to follow
>>
>> their rules. One rule might be I have to use their readers from the dss
>> office. But I will see if such a policy is written down. I'll ask my
>> counselor who tells me this to get me that policy. Ashley
>>
>> -----Original Message----- From: Arielle Silverman
>> Sent: Saturday, April 27, 2013 10:28 PM
>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] the test accomodations
>>
>> Again, who is "they"? Brining your own reader is a valid testing
>> accommodation that blind students have used. I haven't because I
>> prefer to use JAWS, but several of my blind friends have done this.
>> A disabilities office can choose what accommodations to provide
>> students, but they cannot tell you which available accommodations you
>> can use and which you can't. That decision is between you and the
>> professor to make.
>> Arielle
>>
>> On 4/27/13, Ashley Bramlett <bookwormahb at earthlink.net> wrote:
>>> Arielle,
>>> oOh, um, this is a community college. I'm finished my BA degree but
>>> taking
>>> classes to further my studies and get a writing certificate. The class I
>>> need a competent reader for is religion.
>>> No a TA won't work. Also, Its community college.
>>> you make it sound easy. Gee, I do wish I could get my own readers. Gosh.
>>>
>>> I
>>> can think of like 20 people who would be competent readers and have a
>>> clue
>>> how to read such a test. But no, they don't allow me to do this.
>>>
>>> I do indeed have my own readers for studying and reading texts and
>>> looking
>>> up material and research, but
>>> no I cannot bring a reader to the exam. Personally, I think this is a
>>> legal
>>>
>>> matter and they need to change the policy so you can have the option to
>>> bring your own competent reader as an accomodation under the ADA. Its
>>> not
>>> fair, not equal access, and can cause one to get a lower
>>> grade using bad readers.
>>>
>>> Ashley
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Arielle Silverman
>>> Sent: Saturday, April 27, 2013 7:45 PM
>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] the test accomodations
>>>
>>> You can also ask the professor if the teaching assistant can
>>> read/scribe your exam, if there is one for the class. Most teaching
>>> assistants are graduate students or advanced undergraduates in the
>>> department and should know the material well, and since they're
>>> trusted employees of the professor, they are trusted not to help you
>>> cheat. Plus, many TA's have nothing else to do during an exam and
>>> would otherwise just be sitting around. If the class has no teaching
>>> assistant, as in a community college, maybe the professor could read
>>> it for you and scribe your answers during office hours the day before
>>> the test or some such?
>>> I know that blind students have hired their own readers for testing,
>>> which allows them to pick people who are competent. Some disability
>>> services offices frown on this practice because they prefer to hire
>>> and manage readers themselves, but it's an option that's at least
>>> worth discussing with your professor, who might not care much.
>>> Arielle
>>>
>>> On 4/27/13, Suzanne Germano <sgermano at asu.edu> wrote:
>>>> I haven't used readers since I am a partial and use cctv but when I had
>>>> disabled students pay for a chemistry lab aid I insisted the person was
>>>>
>>>> a
>>>> chem major and an A student.
>>>>
>>>> So maybe you could find your readers through the department. And then
>>>> you
>>>> interview them by having them read to you.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sat, Apr 27, 2013 at 3:30 PM, Kirt <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I'm in the middle of the nightmare that is transferring between
>>>>> colleges,
>>>>> but the college I am leaving almost always provided me with competent
>>>>> and
>>>>> capable readers. Sure, they might pronounce a few words incorrectly
>>>>> But
>>>>> they knew how to read out loud.  I hope I don't run into the same
>>>>> problem
>>>>> you are dealing with right now and my next college.
>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>>
>>>>> On Apr 27, 2013, at 11:21 AM, "Ashley Bramlett"
>>>>> <bookwormahb at earthlink.net>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> > Hi all,
>>>>> >
>>>>> > As finals approach, I wanted to know what test accomodations you
>>>>> get.
>>>>> > Do
>>>>> you feel they are adaquate and meet your needs?
>>>>> > If you need a reader and person to scribe your answers on a
>>>>> scantron,
>>>>> how are they? Are they competent readers?
>>>>> >
>>>>> > I’m going through a discriminatory situation now. Most my readers
>>>>> were
>>>>> incompetent but I got around that by asking them to speak slower and
>>>>> repeat
>>>>> things; I mean they could not speak all that clearly and read fast and
>>>>> spoke to the paper not articulately to me. Many exams I took with jaws
>>>>> to
>>>>> avoid this; I feel this way is slower for me and a reader can directly
>>>>> mark
>>>>> my answers on a scantron as well as go back to questions I missed. If
>>>>> I
>>>>> need a reader scribe I should be given a competent reader.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > I’ll tell more about this specific test issue in another message.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Look forward to seeing your responses.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Ashley
>>>>> > _______________________________________________
>>>>> > nabs-l mailing list
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>>>>>
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>
>
> --
> Take care,
> Ty
> http://tds-solutions.net
> He that will not reason is a bigot; he that cannot reason is a fool; he 
> that
>
> dares not reason is a slave.
> Sent from my Toaster (tm).
>
>
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