From kwakmiso at aol.com Fri Mar 1 05:18:47 2013 From: kwakmiso at aol.com (Miso Kwak) Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2013 00:18:47 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nabs-l] Donating Brailled ACT Prep Resource In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8CFE453622502D4-BD4-AE808@webmail-m035.sysops.aol.com> I am a high school senior who can say "I am done with the ACT!" with gratitude and pride. Long story short, my parents purchased a braille version of Real ACT Prep Guide 2nd edition for me from the APH last summer and used it for the preparation. Since I am done, I no longer need it, so I would like to donate the book to someone who is in need of ACT prep resource in Braille. It includes overview of the test, practice questions, three different practice ACT tests, and answer keys along with explanation. The books (each volume) are in a good condition. I read through only once. Unfortunately I do not have a print copy to complement but tactile diagrams were well done and I personally had no problem using the book to self-study and getting the score I wanted. If you are interested please e-mail me off the list. Please take it and use it well. Thank you. Miso Kwak From aridamoulakis at gmail.com Fri Mar 1 17:12:40 2013 From: aridamoulakis at gmail.com (Ari Damoulakis) Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2013 19:12:40 +0200 Subject: [nabs-l] Great new calendar app for the blind Message-ID: Hi everyone I have never really enjoyed or liked the calendar on the IPhone, so I was very happy to read about this new calendar app specifically made and designed for us by the organisation for the blind in Belgium. I was so happy I just purchased it and it seems really great, although am still trying it. It is in English and Dutch. Here's the web site. http://www.vo-calendar.com/en/ Ari From rbacchus228 at gmail.com Fri Mar 1 18:10:56 2013 From: rbacchus228 at gmail.com (Roanna Baccchus) Date: Fri, 01 Mar 2013 13:10:56 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Happy Spring Break Message-ID: <5130ef64.27b3ec0a.5d25.ffffc3db@mx.google.com> Hi everyone I hope you are well. Welcome to the month of March. I can't believe it's almost Spring. I wic you all a safe and happy Spring Break. From brlsurfer at gmail.com Fri Mar 1 23:33:00 2013 From: brlsurfer at gmail.com (vejas) Date: Fri, 01 Mar 2013 15:33:00 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Great new calendar app for the blind Message-ID: <51313ab0.8295e00a.3143.0f4c@mx.google.com> Hi Ari, Does the app cost anything or is it free? Also, what do you like about it better compared to the i-phone calendar? I myself have an i-phone, although I don't use the calendar on it much because I usually stick to my braille-note apex. Vejas ----- Original Message ----- From: Ari Damoulakis Hi Miso, I have decided to take the SAT (not the ACT) but I still find it interesting that you had a good experience with the ACT. I took the practice ACT and the practice SAT, and my p-ACT was brailled horribly. The reading comprehension was very confusing, and the diagrams were not drawn well. But are you good at reading diagrams? (I'm not, lol.) Vejas ----- Original Message ----- From: Miso Kwak Hi all, Our school commonly uses google docs (now know as google drive) to share assignments. I have an IPhone 5. Has anyone else used Gd with the IPhone? Were you able to do it successfully? Were there any limitations? Are there any helpful commands? Thanks very much. Vejas From brlsurfer at gmail.com Fri Mar 1 23:38:43 2013 From: brlsurfer at gmail.com (vejas) Date: Fri, 01 Mar 2013 15:38:43 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] dropbox problem Message-ID: <51313c07.c332310a.237b.ffffc1b1@mx.google.com> Hi, Many of you have probably used drop-box before. I use it on my i-phone and there is a problem that I seem to have when finding new files. I use this site primarily for Spanish. I downloaded my Spanish folder onto my Dropbox a few months ago. For some reason when I log into dropbox and go into my folder, new files my teacher just posted don't show up and only the old ones do. Has anyone had a similar problem? Thanks, Vejas From kwakmiso at aol.com Fri Mar 1 23:57:25 2013 From: kwakmiso at aol.com (Miso Kwak) Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2013 18:57:25 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nabs-l] Donating Brailled ACT Prep Resource In-Reply-To: <51313aae.8295e00a.3143.0f4a@mx.google.com> References: <51313aae.8295e00a.3143.0f4a@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <8CFE4EFA7D04BCF-1344-A33DA@webmail-m167.sysops.aol.com> I did fairly well on the SAT but not outstandingly. Both Critical Reading and math sections were not making much progress. CR because how not so straightforward the questions were plus ridiculously many vocabularies I need to be aware of (English is my second language) and Math in general is not my strongest suit... I found that ACT reading sections were much straightforward and I was scoring almost perfect score from little studying. Math was okay. Science took a lot of time but pulled a great score (I was lucky for the day I think) I think SAT writing is actually easier but they are essentially the same, just asked in different ways. Anyways, in my case, I was focusing on SAT for a long time, was frustrated at my stagnant score, took the ACT, realized I had so much potential, so crammed in the beginning of my senior year, and took the test. Result was what I wanted, so it worked out well in the end. Please if any of you need/want it take the book. Miso -----Original Message----- From: vejas To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Sent: Fri, Mar 1, 2013 3:35 pm Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Donating Brailled ACT Prep Resource Hi Miso, I have decided to take the SAT (not the ACT) but I still find it interesting that you had a good experience with the ACT. I took the practice ACT and the practice SAT, and my p-ACT was brailled horribly. The reading comprehension was very confusing, and the diagrams were not drawn well. But are you good at reading diagrams? (I'm not, lol.) Vejas ----- Original Message ----- From: Miso Kwak References: <51313aae.8295e00a.3143.0f4a@mx.google.com> <8CFE4EFA7D04BCF-1344-A33DA@webmail-m167.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: I know my sister got an OK score on the SAT but a very good score on the ACT. I'm not sure exactly how the tests differ since I only took the SAT, but it does sound like it tests people in a way that some find they can do a lot better on. I think I've heard that the ACT focuses more on testing your ability to learn new information or problem-solve rather than testing how much knowledge you've already accumulated. Could be better for students who have English as a second language or are disadvantaged in their early education. Arielle Arielle On 3/1/13, Miso Kwak wrote: > I did fairly well on the SAT but not outstandingly. Both Critical > Reading and math sections were not making much progress. > CR because how not so straightforward the questions were plus > ridiculously many vocabularies I need to be aware of (English is my > second language) > and Math in general is not my strongest suit... > I found that ACT reading sections were much straightforward and I was > scoring almost perfect score from little studying. > Math was okay. Science took a lot of time but pulled a great score (I > was lucky for the day I think) > I think SAT writing is actually easier but they are essentially the > same, just asked in different ways. > Anyways, in my case, I was focusing on SAT for a long time, was > frustrated at my stagnant score, took the ACT, realized I had so much > potential, so crammed in the beginning of my senior year, and took the > test. Result was what I wanted, so it worked out well in the end. > Please if any of you need/want it take the book. > Miso > > -----Original Message----- > From: vejas > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > Sent: Fri, Mar 1, 2013 3:35 pm > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Donating Brailled ACT Prep Resource > > Hi Miso, > I have decided to take the SAT (not the ACT) but I still find it > interesting that you had a good experience with the ACT. I took > the practice ACT and the practice SAT, and my p-ACT was brailled > horribly. The reading comprehension was very confusing, and the > diagrams were not drawn well. But are you good at reading > diagrams? (I'm not, lol.) > Vejas > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Miso Kwak To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Date sent: Fri, 1 Mar 2013 00:18:47 -0500 (EST) > Subject: [nabs-l] Donating Brailled ACT Prep Resource > > I am a high school senior who can say "I am done with the ACT!" > with > gratitude and pride. > Long story short, my parents purchased a braille version of Real > ACT > Prep Guide 2nd edition for me from the APH last summer and used > it for > the preparation. > Since I am done, I no longer need it, so I would like to donate > the > book to someone who is in need of ACT prep resource in Braille. > It includes overview of the test, practice questions, three > different > practice ACT tests, and answer keys along with explanation. > The books (each volume) are in a good condition. I read through > only > once. > Unfortunately I do not have a print copy to complement but > tactile > diagrams were well done and I personally had no problem using the > book > to self-study and getting the score I wanted. > If you are interested please e-mail me off the list. Please take > it and > use it well. > Thank you. > Miso Kwak > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info > for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brlsurfer%40g > mail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kwakmiso%40aol.com > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From dandrews at visi.com Sat Mar 2 10:59:03 2013 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Sat, 02 Mar 2013 04:59:03 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Accessible Spyware Removal Programs In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I use Malware bytes. Dave At 05:39 AM 2/28/2013, you wrote: >Hi All, >I'm wondering if you would know of any spyware removal programs that >are completely accessible with JAWS? I've tried addaware and Spybot, >and those are okay but not completely accessible. I don't mean >antivirus, I mean spyware removal! >Ian From k7uij at panix.com Sat Mar 2 15:15:25 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Sat, 2 Mar 2013 07:15:25 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Whozit Drives and Write-protect Message-ID: <000701ce1758$c4b80c00$4e282400$@panix.com> Hello, everyone. At the recent Washington Seminar, I purchased one of the 8-gig Whozit memory-sticks NABS was selling. Pretty cool! Recently, however, I seem to have inadvertently triggered "write-protect" behavior, i.e., my BrailleSensePLUS requires two iterations to delete a file and I can't write to the drive anymore. Have I inadvertently put too much stuff on the drive or, more plausibly, is there a write-protect bit I don't know about? And if there's a write-protect switch, where the heck is it? Failing this, how can I fix the problem? I'm not being allowed to reformat the drive. T I A! Mike Freeman From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Sat Mar 2 19:22:59 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Sat, 2 Mar 2013 14:22:59 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Donating Brailled ACT Prep Resource In-Reply-To: References: <51313aae.8295e00a.3143.0f4a@mx.google.com> <8CFE4EFA7D04BCF-1344-A33DA@webmail-m167.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: Hi, I took both, the ACT twice and the SAT once. Even with English as my first language, I have to agree with Miso that I found the ACT to be much more straightforward in the English sections, although on the SAT my math score was better. I found the science difficult, but I took Genetics as opposed to Physics or Chemistry my junior year, and unfortunately since only a few high schools offer Genetics courses the standardized tests don't include it in the science sections. However, I found the diagrams on both the science and math sections of the ACT to be really well done and more straightforward than the ones on the SAT, but every set of both tests is different so every person taking them will have different experiences. (Gotta love how unstandard standardized testing really is). On 3/2/13, Arielle Silverman wrote: > I know my sister got an OK score on the SAT but a very good score on > the ACT. I'm not sure exactly how the tests differ since I only took > the SAT, but it does sound like it tests people in a way that some > find they can do a lot better on. I think I've heard that the ACT > focuses more on testing your ability to learn new information or > problem-solve rather than testing how much knowledge you've already > accumulated. Could be better for students who have English as a second > language or are disadvantaged in their early education. > Arielle > Arielle > > On 3/1/13, Miso Kwak wrote: >> I did fairly well on the SAT but not outstandingly. Both Critical >> Reading and math sections were not making much progress. >> CR because how not so straightforward the questions were plus >> ridiculously many vocabularies I need to be aware of (English is my >> second language) >> and Math in general is not my strongest suit... >> I found that ACT reading sections were much straightforward and I was >> scoring almost perfect score from little studying. >> Math was okay. Science took a lot of time but pulled a great score (I >> was lucky for the day I think) >> I think SAT writing is actually easier but they are essentially the >> same, just asked in different ways. >> Anyways, in my case, I was focusing on SAT for a long time, was >> frustrated at my stagnant score, took the ACT, realized I had so much >> potential, so crammed in the beginning of my senior year, and took the >> test. Result was what I wanted, so it worked out well in the end. >> Please if any of you need/want it take the book. >> Miso >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: vejas >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> >> Sent: Fri, Mar 1, 2013 3:35 pm >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Donating Brailled ACT Prep Resource >> >> Hi Miso, >> I have decided to take the SAT (not the ACT) but I still find it >> interesting that you had a good experience with the ACT. I took >> the practice ACT and the practice SAT, and my p-ACT was brailled >> horribly. The reading comprehension was very confusing, and the >> diagrams were not drawn well. But are you good at reading >> diagrams? (I'm not, lol.) >> Vejas >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Miso Kwak > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Date sent: Fri, 1 Mar 2013 00:18:47 -0500 (EST) >> Subject: [nabs-l] Donating Brailled ACT Prep Resource >> >> I am a high school senior who can say "I am done with the ACT!" >> with >> gratitude and pride. >> Long story short, my parents purchased a braille version of Real >> ACT >> Prep Guide 2nd edition for me from the APH last summer and used >> it for >> the preparation. >> Since I am done, I no longer need it, so I would like to donate >> the >> book to someone who is in need of ACT prep resource in Braille. >> It includes overview of the test, practice questions, three >> different >> practice ACT tests, and answer keys along with explanation. >> The books (each volume) are in a good condition. I read through >> only >> once. >> Unfortunately I do not have a print copy to complement but >> tactile >> diagrams were well done and I personally had no problem using the >> book >> to self-study and getting the score I wanted. >> If you are interested please e-mail me off the list. Please take >> it and >> use it well. >> Thank you. >> Miso Kwak >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brlsurfer%40g >> mail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kwakmiso%40aol.com >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Sat Mar 2 20:18:37 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Sat, 2 Mar 2013 15:18:37 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] dropbox problem In-Reply-To: <51313c07.c332310a.237b.ffffc1b1@mx.google.com> References: <51313c07.c332310a.237b.ffffc1b1@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Hi, Vejas, I have actually fallen out of favor with the mobile Dropbox app since they took away the feature where you could stream audio files from Dropbox to your device, but perhaps you have to refresh the list by three finger swiping down. Sometimes with other apps I've closed them in the app chooser and re-opened them to get them to work propperly. Try these. I still have the app on my phone, so I will test it myself as well and let you know how it works for me. HTH.. On 3/1/13, vejas wrote: > Hi, > Many of you have probably used drop-box before. I use it on my > i-phone and there is a problem that I seem to have when finding > new files. I use this site primarily for Spanish. I downloaded > my Spanish folder onto my Dropbox a few months ago. For some > reason when I log into dropbox and go into my folder, new files > my teacher just posted don't show up and only the old ones do. > Has anyone had a similar problem? > Thanks, > Vejas > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From k7uij at panix.com Sat Mar 2 20:30:01 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Sat, 2 Mar 2013 12:30:01 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] dropbox problem In-Reply-To: References: <51313c07.c332310a.237b.ffffc1b1@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <000b01ce1784$b7c49a00$274dce00$@panix.com> You can still stream dropbox files using the Filer app. Mike -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2013 12:19 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] dropbox problem Hi, Vejas, I have actually fallen out of favor with the mobile Dropbox app since they took away the feature where you could stream audio files from Dropbox to your device, but perhaps you have to refresh the list by three finger swiping down. Sometimes with other apps I've closed them in the app chooser and re-opened them to get them to work propperly. Try these. I still have the app on my phone, so I will test it myself as well and let you know how it works for me. HTH.. On 3/1/13, vejas wrote: > Hi, > Many of you have probably used drop-box before. I use it on my > i-phone and there is a problem that I seem to have when finding new > files. I use this site primarily for Spanish. I downloaded my > Spanish folder onto my Dropbox a few months ago. For some reason when > I log into dropbox and go into my folder, new files my teacher just > posted don't show up and only the old ones do. > Has anyone had a similar problem? > Thanks, > Vejas > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% > 40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From sweetpeareader at gmail.com Sat Mar 2 21:12:46 2013 From: sweetpeareader at gmail.com (Sophie Trist) Date: Sat, 02 Mar 2013 15:12:46 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Donating Brailled ACT Prep Resource Message-ID: <51326b6e.26abec0a.30a1.5404@mx.google.com> Miso, congrats on being finished with the ACT and almost finished with school. That must be a great feeling. I'm a high school sophmore, and I will be needing ACT prep soon. If no one else has contacted you about it, I'll take it. Contact me off-list at this email address: sweetpeareader at gmail.com. Best wishes, Sophie ----- Original Message ----- From: Miso Kwak References: <51313c07.c332310a.237b.ffffc1b1@mx.google.com> <000b01ce1784$b7c49a00$274dce00$@panix.com> Message-ID: Is it worth it? I find it a little silly that I would have to use two separate apps just to do something I used to be able to easily do from dropbox itself. Does the filer app have any other functions itself that make it worth the purchase/use? On 3/2/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > You can still stream dropbox files using the Filer app. > > Mike > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2013 12:19 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] dropbox problem > > Hi, Vejas, > > I have actually fallen out of favor with the mobile Dropbox app since they > took away the feature where you could stream audio files from Dropbox to > your device, but perhaps you have to refresh the list by three finger > swiping down. Sometimes with other apps I've closed them in the app > chooser > and re-opened them to get them to work propperly. > Try these. I still have the app on my phone, so I will test it myself as > well and let you know how it works for me. > > HTH.. > > On 3/1/13, vejas wrote: >> Hi, >> Many of you have probably used drop-box before. I use it on my >> i-phone and there is a problem that I seem to have when finding new >> files. I use this site primarily for Spanish. I downloaded my >> Spanish folder onto my Dropbox a few months ago. For some reason when >> I log into dropbox and go into my folder, new files my teacher just >> posted don't show up and only the old ones do. >> Has anyone had a similar problem? >> Thanks, >> Vejas >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% >> 40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From k7uij at panix.com Sat Mar 2 22:02:23 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Sat, 2 Mar 2013 14:02:23 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] dropbox problem In-Reply-To: References: <51313c07.c332310a.237b.ffffc1b1@mx.google.com> <000b01ce1784$b7c49a00$274dce00$@panix.com> Message-ID: <001d01ce1791$9f0f9b60$dd2ed220$@panix.com> Well, you can rename files for one thing. But it's a bit tricky. Mike Freeman -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2013 1:14 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] dropbox problem Is it worth it? I find it a little silly that I would have to use two separate apps just to do something I used to be able to easily do from dropbox itself. Does the filer app have any other functions itself that make it worth the purchase/use? On 3/2/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > You can still stream dropbox files using the Filer app. > > Mike > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2013 12:19 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] dropbox problem > > Hi, Vejas, > > I have actually fallen out of favor with the mobile Dropbox app since they > took away the feature where you could stream audio files from Dropbox to > your device, but perhaps you have to refresh the list by three finger > swiping down. Sometimes with other apps I've closed them in the app > chooser > and re-opened them to get them to work propperly. > Try these. I still have the app on my phone, so I will test it myself as > well and let you know how it works for me. > > HTH.. > > On 3/1/13, vejas wrote: >> Hi, >> Many of you have probably used drop-box before. I use it on my >> i-phone and there is a problem that I seem to have when finding new >> files. I use this site primarily for Spanish. I downloaded my >> Spanish folder onto my Dropbox a few months ago. For some reason when >> I log into dropbox and go into my folder, new files my teacher just >> posted don't show up and only the old ones do. >> Has anyone had a similar problem? >> Thanks, >> Vejas >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% >> 40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai l.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Sun Mar 3 03:50:36 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum) Date: Sat, 2 Mar 2013 22:50:36 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Maryland Association of Blind Students open conference call: Sunday, March 3 at 7 PM EST Message-ID: <000901ce17c2$44356f90$cca04eb0$@gmail.com> Hi everyone, On behalf of the Maryland Association of Blind Students (MDABS,) I would like to invite you to join our open conference call to be held on Sunday, March 3 at 7 PM Eastern Time. During this call, we will discuss and finalize the agenda for our seminar to be held in April on social issues as they relate to blindness. We will also begin to brainstorm ways to invite students to attend our seminar as well as to get the word out about our division. Whether or not you are an MDABS member, we welcome your participation and your feedback. We want to hear from you! To join this very important teleconference, please call (712) 432-6499. When you hear the music indicating that you have called in, press the pound key. At the main menu, press 1 for live chat rooms. When asked for the room code, enter 63227 (which spells MDABS on your phone's keypad) followed by the pound key. You are now in the room. If you have any questions, please don't hesitate to write to me or call me at the phone number or email address below. I hope to talk with some of you on the conference call! Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students: a division of the National Federation of the Blind of Maryland Phone: (443) 547-2409 Email: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Personal Twitter: @Chrisn98 MDABS Twitter: @MDMdabs Personal Facebook: www.facebook.com/dotkid Join the MDABS Facebook Group: search for Maryland Association of Blind Students Skype: christpher.nusbaum3 or search for Chris Nusbaum "Together, we are changing what it means to be blind." - Motto of the Louisiana Center for the Blind From coastergirl92 at gmail.com Sun Mar 3 06:12:28 2013 From: coastergirl92 at gmail.com (Sarah Meeks) Date: Sat, 2 Mar 2013 22:12:28 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] dropbox problem In-Reply-To: <000b01ce1784$b7c49a00$274dce00$@panix.com> References: <51313c07.c332310a.237b.ffffc1b1@mx.google.com> <000b01ce1784$b7c49a00$274dce00$@panix.com> Message-ID: Cool Sent from my iPhone On Mar 2, 2013, at 12:30 PM, "Mike Freeman" wrote: > You can still stream dropbox files using the Filer app. > > Mike > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2013 12:19 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] dropbox problem > > Hi, Vejas, > > I have actually fallen out of favor with the mobile Dropbox app since they > took away the feature where you could stream audio files from Dropbox to > your device, but perhaps you have to refresh the list by three finger > swiping down. Sometimes with other apps I've closed them in the app chooser > and re-opened them to get them to work propperly. > Try these. I still have the app on my phone, so I will test it myself as > well and let you know how it works for me. > > HTH.. > > On 3/1/13, vejas wrote: >> Hi, >> Many of you have probably used drop-box before. I use it on my >> i-phone and there is a problem that I seem to have when finding new >> files. I use this site primarily for Spanish. I downloaded my >> Spanish folder onto my Dropbox a few months ago. For some reason when >> I log into dropbox and go into my folder, new files my teacher just >> posted don't show up and only the old ones do. >> Has anyone had a similar problem? >> Thanks, >> Vejas >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% >> 40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/coastergirl92%40gmail.com From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Sun Mar 3 14:24:49 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 14:24:49 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! Message-ID: I've contacted the support staff, and they won't get back with me! Here's the problem. I renewed my membership, and downloaded a book that I needed for class. The problem is, that I can't use the reading software with Internet Explorer! Their software only works with Google Chrome, which Jaws 10.0 won't work with! Good grief! What's going on? BTW, I can't afford to upgrade Jaws. Thanks, Joshua From k7uij at panix.com Sun Mar 3 15:32:54 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 07:32:54 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <002401ce1824$5fff76f0$1ffe64d0$@panix.com> Why not get the .BRF version of the book? Or using your DAISY player of choice -- Stream, BookSense, Book Port Plus, Plextalk Pocket or the like or, if you don't own one of these (and it's hard to imagine anyone under forty *not* owning one), why not try FSReader, Amis or one of the other computer-based Daisy players out there? Be a bit imaginative, my friend. Life isn't for the faint-of-heart! Mike Freeman -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 6:25 AM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! I've contacted the support staff, and they won't get back with me! Here's the problem. I renewed my membership, and downloaded a book that I needed for class. The problem is, that I can't use the reading software with Internet Explorer! Their software only works with Google Chrome, which Jaws 10.0 won't work with! Good grief! What's going on? BTW, I can't afford to upgrade Jaws. Thanks, Joshua _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From hotdancer1416 at gmail.com Sun Mar 3 20:44:53 2013 From: hotdancer1416 at gmail.com (Ashlee g) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 15:44:53 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! In-Reply-To: <002401ce1824$5fff76f0$1ffe64d0$@panix.com> References: <002401ce1824$5fff76f0$1ffe64d0$@panix.com> Message-ID: <3BBABC29-3F29-4B48-AF71-3B981028B5C2@gmail.com> Hi this is Lavonya, Would Barde have any of the books that you are looking for? I would also try learning ally. A lot of these different book formats can be put into MP3 and then you can listen to them on your digital Beauclair if you have one. By the way I can use the dictation feature on my my iPad mini now and that is why my spelling has improved. Now if I could just remember punctuation. NOTHING ABOUT US, WITHOUT US. AUTISTICS RULE On Mar 3, 2013, at 10:32, "Mike Freeman" wrote: > Why not get the .BRF version of the book? Or using your DAISY player of > choice -- Stream, BookSense, Book Port Plus, Plextalk Pocket or the like or, > if you don't own one of these (and it's hard to imagine anyone under forty > *not* owning one), why not try FSReader, Amis or one of the other > computer-based Daisy players out there? Be a bit imaginative, my friend. > Life isn't for the faint-of-heart! > > Mike Freeman > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester > Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 6:25 AM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! > > I've contacted the support staff, and they won't get back with me! > Here's the problem. > I renewed my membership, and downloaded a book that I needed for class. > The problem is, that I can't use the reading software with Internet > Explorer! > Their software only works with Google Chrome, which Jaws 10.0 won't work > with! > Good grief! > What's going on? > BTW, I can't afford to upgrade Jaws. > Thanks, Joshua > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hotdancer1416%40gmail.com From dsykora29 at gmail.com Sun Mar 3 20:46:45 2013 From: dsykora29 at gmail.com (Danielle Sykora) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 15:46:45 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! In-Reply-To: <002401ce1824$5fff76f0$1ffe64d0$@panix.com> References: <002401ce1824$5fff76f0$1ffe64d0$@panix.com> Message-ID: I have used bookshare books with jaws 10 and internet explorer before and didn't have any problems. Maybe its the file type you downloaded it as? I used Daisy Text. On 3/3/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > Why not get the .BRF version of the book? Or using your DAISY player of > choice -- Stream, BookSense, Book Port Plus, Plextalk Pocket or the like > or, > if you don't own one of these (and it's hard to imagine anyone under forty > *not* owning one), why not try FSReader, Amis or one of the other > computer-based Daisy players out there? Be a bit imaginative, my friend. > Life isn't for the faint-of-heart! > > Mike Freeman > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester > Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 6:25 AM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! > > I've contacted the support staff, and they won't get back with me! > Here's the problem. > I renewed my membership, and downloaded a book that I needed for class. > The problem is, that I can't use the reading software with Internet > Explorer! > Their software only works with Google Chrome, which Jaws 10.0 won't work > with! > Good grief! > What's going on? > BTW, I can't afford to upgrade Jaws. > Thanks, Joshua > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsykora29%40gmail.com > From k7uij at panix.com Sun Mar 3 20:51:33 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 12:51:33 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! In-Reply-To: References: <002401ce1824$5fff76f0$1ffe64d0$@panix.com> Message-ID: <004d01ce1850$e40c8880$ac259980$@panix.com> I suspect that perhaps the gentleman doesn't know which file to look at. My advice would be to look at the .XML file. However, depending upon how it's written, Internet Explorer reads .XML files well ... or not-so-well. But I'd bet the Amis public-domain DAISY player would also work well. Mike Freeman -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Danielle Sykora Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 12:47 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! I have used bookshare books with jaws 10 and internet explorer before and didn't have any problems. Maybe its the file type you downloaded it as? I used Daisy Text. On 3/3/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > Why not get the .BRF version of the book? Or using your DAISY player > of choice -- Stream, BookSense, Book Port Plus, Plextalk Pocket or the > like or, if you don't own one of these (and it's hard to imagine > anyone under forty > *not* owning one), why not try FSReader, Amis or one of the other > computer-based Daisy players out there? Be a bit imaginative, my friend. > Life isn't for the faint-of-heart! > > Mike Freeman > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua > Lester > Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 6:25 AM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! > > I've contacted the support staff, and they won't get back with me! > Here's the problem. > I renewed my membership, and downloaded a book that I needed for class. > The problem is, that I can't use the reading software with Internet > Explorer! > Their software only works with Google Chrome, which Jaws 10.0 won't > work with! > Good grief! > What's going on? > BTW, I can't afford to upgrade Jaws. > Thanks, Joshua > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsykora29%40gmail. > com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From k7uij at panix.com Sun Mar 3 20:54:48 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 12:54:48 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! In-Reply-To: References: <002401ce1824$5fff76f0$1ffe64d0$@panix.com> Message-ID: <004e01ce1851$58957310$09c05930$@panix.com> Further thought: whether Joshua likes it or not, being part of the mainstream means that that he will have to keep up with the latest software, i.e., upgrade to JAWS 14. This is something blind and sighted alike must deal with. For better or worse, the computer field doesn't stay static and there's no requirement that everything work with all versions of everything that went before. That was the sort of thing that made IBM's OS-360 so unwieldy. But that's going back a way. Mike Freeman -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Danielle Sykora Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 12:47 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! I have used bookshare books with jaws 10 and internet explorer before and didn't have any problems. Maybe its the file type you downloaded it as? I used Daisy Text. On 3/3/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > Why not get the .BRF version of the book? Or using your DAISY player of > choice -- Stream, BookSense, Book Port Plus, Plextalk Pocket or the like > or, > if you don't own one of these (and it's hard to imagine anyone under forty > *not* owning one), why not try FSReader, Amis or one of the other > computer-based Daisy players out there? Be a bit imaginative, my friend. > Life isn't for the faint-of-heart! > > Mike Freeman > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester > Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 6:25 AM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! > > I've contacted the support staff, and they won't get back with me! > Here's the problem. > I renewed my membership, and downloaded a book that I needed for class. > The problem is, that I can't use the reading software with Internet > Explorer! > Their software only works with Google Chrome, which Jaws 10.0 won't work > with! > Good grief! > What's going on? > BTW, I can't afford to upgrade Jaws. > Thanks, Joshua > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsykora29%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From pdonahue2 at satx.rr.com Sun Mar 3 21:29:04 2013 From: pdonahue2 at satx.rr.com (Peter Donahue) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 15:29:04 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! References: <002401ce1824$5fff76f0$1ffe64d0$@panix.com> <004d01ce1850$e40c8880$ac259980$@panix.com> Message-ID: <000f01ce1856$21d563d0$df1fbf48@yourfsyly0jtwn> Hello Mike and everyone, We each have folders to which we save our downloaded Bookshare books. Beneath these root folders we create folders for each author and save the books by that author in to the author's folder. Whenever we download a Bookshare Book we save a copy of the .xml file back to the author's folder and rename it to have a .html extension. We then copy or move the .html file in to the folder of the book we wish to read. This comes in handy whenever you wish to read books containing computer or other types of code of interest. We've gotten the best results with Firefox. Hope this helps. Peter Donahue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Freeman" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 2:51 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! I suspect that perhaps the gentleman doesn't know which file to look at. My advice would be to look at the .XML file. However, depending upon how it's written, Internet Explorer reads .XML files well ... or not-so-well. But I'd bet the Amis public-domain DAISY player would also work well. Mike Freeman -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Danielle Sykora Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 12:47 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! I have used bookshare books with jaws 10 and internet explorer before and didn't have any problems. Maybe its the file type you downloaded it as? I used Daisy Text. On 3/3/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > Why not get the .BRF version of the book? Or using your DAISY player > of choice -- Stream, BookSense, Book Port Plus, Plextalk Pocket or the > like or, if you don't own one of these (and it's hard to imagine > anyone under forty > *not* owning one), why not try FSReader, Amis or one of the other > computer-based Daisy players out there? Be a bit imaginative, my friend. > Life isn't for the faint-of-heart! > > Mike Freeman > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua > Lester > Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 6:25 AM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! > > I've contacted the support staff, and they won't get back with me! > Here's the problem. > I renewed my membership, and downloaded a book that I needed for class. > The problem is, that I can't use the reading software with Internet > Explorer! > Their software only works with Google Chrome, which Jaws 10.0 won't > work with! > Good grief! > What's going on? > BTW, I can't afford to upgrade Jaws. > Thanks, Joshua > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsykora29%40gmail. > com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pdonahue2%40satx.rr.com From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Sun Mar 3 21:38:13 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 16:38:13 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] song lyrics Message-ID: <511A465892BB43ABA770EBF0B588560E@OwnerPC> Hi all, I’m supposed to analyze song lyrics for sociological concepts for family sociology. Any good websites to find lyrics? So far, I seem to find fragments of lyrics, not the whole song; if I search for a particular song, I can often find lyrics, but searching this way I need the exact title. Thanks. Ashley From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Sun Mar 3 22:12:23 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (christopher nusbaum) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 17:12:23 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Reminder: Maryland Association of blind students conference call Message-ID: <-9094318324454053000@unknownmsgid> Hi all, This is a reminder that the Maryland Association of blind students will be having an important open conference call tonight at 7 PM Eastern time to discuss our upcoming seminar in April. We welcome your input and ideas, whether or not you are a member of our student division. We want to hear from you! To join this conference call, dial 712-432-6499. When you hear the music indicating that you have called in, press the pound key. At the main menu, press one. When asked for the room code, type in 63227 followed by the pound key. You are now in the room. I hope to see many of you tonight on the call! If you have any questions, please let me know. Thanks, Chris Nusbaum Sent from my iPhone From sweetpeareader at gmail.com Sun Mar 3 22:21:27 2013 From: sweetpeareader at gmail.com (Sophie Trist) Date: Sun, 03 Mar 2013 16:21:27 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] song lyrics Message-ID: <5133cd09.26abec0a.30a1.70c1@mx.google.com> Ashley,=20there's=20a=20website=20where=20you=20can=20find=20song=20lyrics.= =20I=20think=20 it's=20called=20www.superlyrics.com,=20but=20I=20might=20just=20be=20thinki= ng=20of=20 the=20title=20of=20the=20page.=20Just=20goggle=20"super=20lyrics"=20and=20i= t=20should=20 come=20up.=20The=20songs=20are=20listed=20by=20artist,=20so=20you=20can=20j= ust=20look=20at=20 any=20artist=20you=20want. HTH, Sophie =20-----=20Original=20Message=20----- From:=20"Ashley=20Bramlett"=20 References: <5133cd09.26abec0a.30a1.70c1@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Hi Ashley, Usually if you search a phrase from lyrics in google a bunch of song lyric web sites should come up. If you have any set of lyrics in your mind that you particularly like that might be a good place to start. I usually use a site called a-z lyrics Universe , www.azlyrics.com. They have songs and artists alphabetized, so if you know a particular artist you want it should be pretty easy to browse and find them on that sight. They also have complete lyrics for all their songs. Hope this helps, and good luck on your project! On 3/3/13, Sophie Trist wrote: > Ashley, there's a website where you can find song lyrics. I think > it's called www.superlyrics.com, but I might just be thinking of > the title of the page. Just goggle "super lyrics" and it should > come up. The songs are listed by artist, so you can just look at > any artist you want. > > HTH, > Sophie > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ashley Bramlett" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > Date sent: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 16:38:13 -0500 > Subject: [nabs-l] song lyrics > > Hi all, > > I’m supposed to analyze song lyrics for sociological concepts > for family sociology. > Any good websites to find lyrics? So far, I seem to find > fragments of lyrics, not the whole song; if I search for a > particular song, I can often find lyrics, but searching this way > I need the exact title. > > Thanks. > Ashley > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info > for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade > r%40gmail.com > > > -- Kaiti From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Sun Mar 3 22:51:47 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 17:51:47 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! In-Reply-To: <000f01ce1856$21d563d0$df1fbf48@yourfsyly0jtwn> References: <002401ce1824$5fff76f0$1ffe64d0$@panix.com> <004d01ce1850$e40c8880$ac259980$@panix.com> <000f01ce1856$21d563d0$df1fbf48@yourfsyly0jtwn> Message-ID: Hi all, Mike, I agree with you that the computer industry is far from static, but Josh did indicate that he is unable to pay for a Jaws update. Unfortunately, this part of the problem, (although I likewise suspect the main issue at work is he's probably trying to read the wrong type of file on the web reader too), isn't his fault. However, by that same token... Josh: Mike does have a really good point and everything is constantly updating. Bookshare has recently added a lot of new features to make their site keep up with the needs of it's users and the other adapting technology out there. If you can't pay for it yourself I would suggest trying to see if you can get an upgrade through your state voc rehab agency or something. Your local NFB chapter should be able to direct you in other possible means specific to where you live and what might be locally available to you for getting a more recent version of jaws and an SMA package which will keep you up-to-date for the next two versions. A good rule of thumb is to not let yourself fall more than two versions behind in software because then things really start to not mesh well with other programs which have been updated. (speaking from experience where my school district didn't upgrade my jaws from version 6 to 11 until they had to with the release of windows 7). an SMA would be a great investment too. If you're not able to get a new version of jaws, try NVDA; it's free and you never have to pay for updates, plus it works pretty well and the commands, although somewhat different, are pretty easy to learn. Aside from the screenreader issues, make sure you're downloading a text file, like daisy text. If you're downloading brf the web reader probably won't know how to read it. As others have said you could also try opening it in fs reader, or if you have Duxberry or something like it you can download a brf file and translate it to text. I've done this when my notetaker wasn't available and it worked pretty well. Also, if all else fails, I have found that it's easier to reach Bookshare for tech help if you just call them rather than mess with the email system. They're really helpful and willing to assist customers over the phone, and it resolves issues a lot more quickly than doing everything via the web. Good luck. On 3/3/13, Peter Donahue wrote: > Hello Mike and everyone, > > We each have folders to which we save our downloaded Bookshare books. > Beneath these root folders we create folders for each author and save the > books by that author in to the author's folder. Whenever we download a > Bookshare Book we save a copy of the .xml file back to the author's folder > and rename it to have a .html extension. We then copy or move the .html file > > in to the folder of the book we wish to read. This comes in handy whenever > you wish to read books containing computer or other types of code of > interest. We've gotten the best results with Firefox. Hope this helps. > > Peter Donahue > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mike Freeman" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 2:51 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! > > > I suspect that perhaps the gentleman doesn't know which file to look at. My > advice would be to look at the .XML file. However, depending upon how it's > written, Internet Explorer reads .XML files well ... or not-so-well. But > I'd > bet the Amis public-domain DAISY player would also work well. > > Mike Freeman > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Danielle > Sykora > Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 12:47 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! > > I have used bookshare books with jaws 10 and internet explorer before and > didn't have any problems. Maybe its the file type you downloaded it as? I > used Daisy Text. > > On 3/3/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >> Why not get the .BRF version of the book? Or using your DAISY player >> of choice -- Stream, BookSense, Book Port Plus, Plextalk Pocket or the >> like or, if you don't own one of these (and it's hard to imagine >> anyone under forty >> *not* owning one), why not try FSReader, Amis or one of the other >> computer-based Daisy players out there? Be a bit imaginative, my friend. >> Life isn't for the faint-of-heart! >> >> Mike Freeman >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua >> Lester >> Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 6:25 AM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! >> >> I've contacted the support staff, and they won't get back with me! >> Here's the problem. >> I renewed my membership, and downloaded a book that I needed for class. >> The problem is, that I can't use the reading software with Internet >> Explorer! >> Their software only works with Google Chrome, which Jaws 10.0 won't >> work with! >> Good grief! >> What's going on? >> BTW, I can't afford to upgrade Jaws. >> Thanks, Joshua >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsykora29%40gmail. >> com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pdonahue2%40satx.rr.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From jim.hulme at gmail.com Sun Mar 3 22:55:19 2013 From: jim.hulme at gmail.com (James Hulme) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 17:55:19 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Reminder: Maryland Association of blind students conference call In-Reply-To: <-9094318324454053000@unknownmsgid> References: <-9094318324454053000@unknownmsgid> Message-ID: Hello Chris Nusbaum: Thank you for the reminder. I did get your voicemail msg today. See you on the cionference call at 7PMET Jimmy Hulme 908-868-2836 (M) jim.hulme at gmail.com On Sun, Mar 3, 2013 at 5:12 PM, christopher nusbaum < dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com> wrote: > Hi all, > > This is a reminder that the Maryland Association of blind students > will be having an important open conference call tonight at 7 PM > Eastern time to discuss our upcoming seminar in April. We welcome your > input and ideas, whether or not you are a member of our student > division. We want to hear from you! > > To join this conference call, dial 712-432-6499. When you hear the > music indicating that you have called in, press the pound key. At the > main menu, press one. When asked for the room code, type in 63227 > followed by the pound key. You are now in the room. > > I hope to see many of you tonight on the call! If you have any > questions, please let me know. > > Thanks, > > Chris Nusbaum > > Sent from my iPhone > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jim.hulme%40gmail.com > From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Sun Mar 3 23:04:15 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum) Date: Sun, 03 Mar 2013 18:04:15 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! Message-ID: <5133d704.4ac1e00a.4803.7e5c@mx.google.com> Joshua, I'm a little confused. What is this reading software you speak of? To my knowledge, Bookshare doesn't have its own reading software. Are you referring to FS Reader? Thanks, Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: Joshua Lester References: <5133d704.4ac1e00a.4803.7e5c@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <007101ce1865$d84ad730$88e08590$@panix.com> Think he's trying to read the book with IE 7 and JAWS 10. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris Nusbaum Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 3:04 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! Joshua, I'm a little confused. What is this reading software you speak of? To my knowledge, Bookshare doesn't have its own reading software. Are you referring to FS Reader? Thanks, Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: Joshua Lester References: <5133d704.4ac1e00a.4803.7e5c@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <408FFAFE57A84FCBB9A766EC18E89084@OwnerPC> Chris, Actually, bookshare does have a free daisy software to get if you want it. -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 6:04 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! Joshua, I'm a little confused. What is this reading software you speak of? To my knowledge, Bookshare doesn't have its own reading software. Are you referring to FS Reader? Thanks, Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: Joshua Lester References: <5133d704.4ac1e00a.4803.7e5c@mx.google.com> <007101ce1865$d84ad730$88e08590$@panix.com> Message-ID: Hi all: Let me see if I can clarify a bit of what's going on here, at least to the best of my understanding. Bookshare has recently instituted their own "web reader" This feature allows you to read books through the web without ever having to download them to a computer hard drive. Unfortunately, this feature only works with Google Chrome, which, I'm presuming, is where Joshua's frustration comes from. Joshua: there are two things you need to be aware of. First and foremost, the method everyone on this list has advocated (downloading the file type known as Daisy Text and then reading the XML file in Internet Explorer works beautifully with Jaws 10, and I would know, since I had this version until very recently.) If you need further help, the tech support people are astoundingly helpful. They do not contact patrons during the weekend, which is why they may not have contacted you before now. Secondly, they are working to make the Web Reader accessible with other browsers. However, Chrome is one of the most innovative, with ever-expanding functionality and excellent security. Firefox has frequent updates, which makes it difficult for Bookshare engineering to keep the software compatible, and Internet Explorer's security issues are a concern for the staff when making the Reader compatible with it. There are two other points which I would like to address. If I cause offense, I apologize profusely, but I believe these things need to be stated. Firstly: there are Demo versions of Jaws. While I do not advocate this as a permanent solution, it is an excellent temporary one while financial ducks are put in a row. It does require you to restart the computer every forty minutes, but the advantages are absolutely worth it. I know we don't often realize how far behind software we actually are until we get such upgrades. However, upgrading your Jaws (even in demo temporarily) would virtually eliminate the myriad of technological problems you have brought to this list. Secondly: Joshua, please be clearer in your E-mails. I realize there is immense frustration in technology that is not working properly (my hours-long battle with Learning Ally's Read Here player today makes me particularly sympathetic to your plight), but E-mails which do not clearly define your problem serve no one. If you had clearly explained that you were attempting to use a new feature called the Web Reader which only worked in Chrome, and you needed alternative solutions, much of the confusion I sensed underlying many of the messages in this topic could have been averted. I'll address one final point and then close. I agree wholeheartedly with Mike and Caiti. I am one of those under 40 who has none of the players Mike named (partially due to finances, but mostly due to vastly preferring DoubleTalk, the synthesizer used on the original Book Port when it comes to text files, rather than the more "human" voices utilized by many of these players, which are so unbearably grating for me that I am incapable of concentrating on the information being presented.) However, when I do need to read Daisy files, I take advantage of the many Pc-based options or find a way to convert them in to text. And I always try and keep my software up to date, even if that means using Demos. We are disadvantaged enough as it is without hampering ourselves by being unwilling to innovate. Again, I hope at least some of what I have said is helpful, and that I have not given offense. Warmest Regards, Courtney P.S.: If anyone could suggest a Daisy player with a synthesizer similar to DoubleTalk, I would be immensely grateful; I live in fear of the day my BookPort dies. From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Mon Mar 4 01:28:15 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum) Date: Sun, 03 Mar 2013 20:28:15 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Reminder: Maryland Association of blind studentsconference call Message-ID: <5133f8c4.c9d9e00a.53ce.ffff970a@mx.google.com> Jimmy, Thank you for your participation on this call! I think we had a good discussion. Thanks again! Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: James Hulme wrote: Hi all, This is a reminder that the Maryland Association of blind students will be having an important open conference call tonight at 7 PM Eastern time to discuss our upcoming seminar in April. We welcome your input and ideas, whether or not you are a member of our student division. We want to hear from you! To join this conference call, dial 712-432-6499. When you hear the music indicating that you have called in, press the pound key. At the main menu, press one. When asked for the room code, type in 63227 followed by the pound key. You are now in the room. I hope to see many of you tonight on the call! If you have any questions, please let me know. Thanks, Chris Nusbaum Sent from my iPhone _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jim.hulme%40g mail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbau m%40gmail.com From pgradioman at hotmail.com Mon Mar 4 01:36:41 2013 From: pgradioman at hotmail.com (Preston Gaylor) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 20:36:41 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Reminder: Maryland Association of blind studentsconference call In-Reply-To: <5133f8c4.c9d9e00a.53ce.ffff970a@mx.google.com> References: <5133f8c4.c9d9e00a.53ce.ffff970a@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Dear Chris: Sorry that I missed out on the call, it just dawned on me that it it occured an hour ago! I'm glad that you all had a great discusion! Did you guys talk about the different commities that you told me on Haytell that one time? PrestonD Sent from my iPod On Mar 3, 2013, at 8:30 PM, "Chris Nusbaum" wrote: > Jimmy, > > Thank you for your participation on this call! I think we had a good discussion. Thanks again! > > Chris > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: James Hulme To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Date sent: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 17:55:19 -0500 > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Reminder: Maryland Association of blind studentsconference call > > Hello Chris Nusbaum: > > Thank you for the reminder. I did get your voicemail msg today. See you on > the cionference call at 7PMET > > Jimmy Hulme > 908-868-2836 (M) > jim.hulme at gmail.com > > On Sun, Mar 3, 2013 at 5:12 PM, christopher nusbaum < > dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com> wrote: > > Hi all, > > This is a reminder that the Maryland Association of blind students > will be having an important open conference call tonight at 7 PM > Eastern time to discuss our upcoming seminar in April. We welcome your > input and ideas, whether or not you are a member of our student > division. We want to hear from you! > > To join this conference call, dial 712-432-6499. When you hear the > music indicating that you have called in, press the pound key. At the > main menu, press one. When asked for the room code, type in 63227 > followed by the pound key. You are now in the room. > > I hope to see many of you tonight on the call! If you have any > questions, please let me know. > > Thanks, > > Chris Nusbaum > > Sent from my iPhone > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jim.hulme%40g > mail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbau > m%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pgradioman%40hotmail.com From jim.hulme at gmail.com Mon Mar 4 01:42:59 2013 From: jim.hulme at gmail.com (James Hulme) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 20:42:59 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Reminder: Maryland Association of blind studentsconference call In-Reply-To: <5133f8c4.c9d9e00a.53ce.ffff970a@mx.google.com> References: <5133f8c4.c9d9e00a.53ce.ffff970a@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Chris Nusbaum: No problem. I think if we are deciding on a talent show that I would prob. read my song I wrote just a little while ago called Journey. Anyways please stay in touch and let me know when Beth will Skype her presentation. I look fwd. to hearing her presentation about dating. All in all, please send her my congrats on creating this chapter a memorable one. As of right now I am planning on upgrading from Windows Live Messenger to Skype. I do not have Skype. How will others be able to listen to her presentation? Thanks for your extended cooperation. Jimmy Hulme 609-660-0699 (H) 908-868-2836 (M) jim.hulme at gmail.com Twitter: @JimHulmeLookout http://www.facebook.com/jimmy.hulme1 On Sun, Mar 3, 2013 at 8:28 PM, Chris Nusbaum wrote: > Jimmy, > > Thank you for your participation on this call! I think we had a good > discussion. Thanks again! > > Chris > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: James Hulme To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Date sent: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 17:55:19 -0500 > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Reminder: Maryland Association of blind > studentsconference call > > Hello Chris Nusbaum: > > Thank you for the reminder. I did get your voicemail msg today. See you > on > the cionference call at 7PMET > > Jimmy Hulme > 908-868-2836 (M) > jim.hulme at gmail.com > > On Sun, Mar 3, 2013 at 5:12 PM, christopher nusbaum < > dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com> wrote: > > Hi all, > > This is a reminder that the Maryland Association of blind students > will be having an important open conference call tonight at 7 PM > Eastern time to discuss our upcoming seminar in April. We welcome your > input and ideas, whether or not you are a member of our student > division. We want to hear from you! > > To join this conference call, dial 712-432-6499. When you hear the > music indicating that you have called in, press the pound key. At the > main menu, press one. When asked for the room code, type in 63227 > followed by the pound key. You are now in the room. > > I hope to see many of you tonight on the call! If you have any > questions, please let me know. > > Thanks, > > Chris Nusbaum > > Sent from my iPhone > > ______________________________**_________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jim.**hulme%40g > mail.com > > ______________________________**_________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/**dotkid.nusbau > m%40gmail.com > > > ______________________________**_________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jim.** > hulme%40gmail.com > From k7uij at panix.com Mon Mar 4 01:47:56 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 17:47:56 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! In-Reply-To: References: <5133d704.4ac1e00a.4803.7e5c@mx.google.com> <007101ce1865$d84ad730$88e08590$@panix.com> Message-ID: <008601ce187a$4be6d9a0$e3b48ce0$@panix.com> Courtney: You probably won't find one as the majority of people have moved on to what they perceive as more human-sounding (and thus, presumably, intelligible) synthesizers or speech systems. However, be advised that Access Solutions (the maker of the DECtalk USB speech synthesizer) has just come out with a TrippleTalk (which sounds much like DoubleTalk) USb synthesizer. Contact Mike Cozzolino for more details. You could then use this with a netbook machine of some sort. Mike -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Courtney Stover Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 4:52 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! Hi all: Let me see if I can clarify a bit of what's going on here, at least to the best of my understanding. Bookshare has recently instituted their own "web reader" This feature allows you to read books through the web without ever having to download them to a computer hard drive. Unfortunately, this feature only works with Google Chrome, which, I'm presuming, is where Joshua's frustration comes from. Joshua: there are two things you need to be aware of. First and foremost, the method everyone on this list has advocated (downloading the file type known as Daisy Text and then reading the XML file in Internet Explorer works beautifully with Jaws 10, and I would know, since I had this version until very recently.) If you need further help, the tech support people are astoundingly helpful. They do not contact patrons during the weekend, which is why they may not have contacted you before now. Secondly, they are working to make the Web Reader accessible with other browsers. However, Chrome is one of the most innovative, with ever-expanding functionality and excellent security. Firefox has frequent updates, which makes it difficult for Bookshare engineering to keep the software compatible, and Internet Explorer's security issues are a concern for the staff when making the Reader compatible with it. There are two other points which I would like to address. If I cause offense, I apologize profusely, but I believe these things need to be stated. Firstly: there are Demo versions of Jaws. While I do not advocate this as a permanent solution, it is an excellent temporary one while financial ducks are put in a row. It does require you to restart the computer every forty minutes, but the advantages are absolutely worth it. I know we don't often realize how far behind software we actually are until we get such upgrades. However, upgrading your Jaws (even in demo temporarily) would virtually eliminate the myriad of technological problems you have brought to this list. Secondly: Joshua, please be clearer in your E-mails. I realize there is immense frustration in technology that is not working properly (my hours-long battle with Learning Ally's Read Here player today makes me particularly sympathetic to your plight), but E-mails which do not clearly define your problem serve no one. If you had clearly explained that you were attempting to use a new feature called the Web Reader which only worked in Chrome, and you needed alternative solutions, much of the confusion I sensed underlying many of the messages in this topic could have been averted. I'll address one final point and then close. I agree wholeheartedly with Mike and Caiti. I am one of those under 40 who has none of the players Mike named (partially due to finances, but mostly due to vastly preferring DoubleTalk, the synthesizer used on the original Book Port when it comes to text files, rather than the more "human" voices utilized by many of these players, which are so unbearably grating for me that I am incapable of concentrating on the information being presented.) However, when I do need to read Daisy files, I take advantage of the many Pc-based options or find a way to convert them in to text. And I always try and keep my software up to date, even if that means using Demos. We are disadvantaged enough as it is without hampering ourselves by being unwilling to innovate. Again, I hope at least some of what I have said is helpful, and that I have not given offense. Warmest Regards, Courtney P.S.: If anyone could suggest a Daisy player with a synthesizer similar to DoubleTalk, I would be immensely grateful; I live in fear of the day my BookPort dies. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Mon Mar 4 02:02:56 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Mon, 4 Mar 2013 02:02:56 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! In-Reply-To: <008601ce187a$4be6d9a0$e3b48ce0$@panix.com> References: <5133d704.4ac1e00a.4803.7e5c@mx.google.com> <007101ce1865$d84ad730$88e08590$@panix.com> , <008601ce187a$4be6d9a0$e3b48ce0$@panix.com> Message-ID: Thanks for all of your responses! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Mike Freeman [k7uij at panix.com] Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 7:47 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! Courtney: You probably won't find one as the majority of people have moved on to what they perceive as more human-sounding (and thus, presumably, intelligible) synthesizers or speech systems. However, be advised that Access Solutions (the maker of the DECtalk USB speech synthesizer) has just come out with a TrippleTalk (which sounds much like DoubleTalk) USb synthesizer. Contact Mike Cozzolino for more details. You could then use this with a netbook machine of some sort. Mike -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Courtney Stover Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 4:52 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! Hi all: Let me see if I can clarify a bit of what's going on here, at least to the best of my understanding. Bookshare has recently instituted their own "web reader" This feature allows you to read books through the web without ever having to download them to a computer hard drive. Unfortunately, this feature only works with Google Chrome, which, I'm presuming, is where Joshua's frustration comes from. Joshua: there are two things you need to be aware of. First and foremost, the method everyone on this list has advocated (downloading the file type known as Daisy Text and then reading the XML file in Internet Explorer works beautifully with Jaws 10, and I would know, since I had this version until very recently.) If you need further help, the tech support people are astoundingly helpful. They do not contact patrons during the weekend, which is why they may not have contacted you before now. Secondly, they are working to make the Web Reader accessible with other browsers. However, Chrome is one of the most innovative, with ever-expanding functionality and excellent security. Firefox has frequent updates, which makes it difficult for Bookshare engineering to keep the software compatible, and Internet Explorer's security issues are a concern for the staff when making the Reader compatible with it. There are two other points which I would like to address. If I cause offense, I apologize profusely, but I believe these things need to be stated. Firstly: there are Demo versions of Jaws. While I do not advocate this as a permanent solution, it is an excellent temporary one while financial ducks are put in a row. It does require you to restart the computer every forty minutes, but the advantages are absolutely worth it. I know we don't often realize how far behind software we actually are until we get such upgrades. However, upgrading your Jaws (even in demo temporarily) would virtually eliminate the myriad of technological problems you have brought to this list. Secondly: Joshua, please be clearer in your E-mails. I realize there is immense frustration in technology that is not working properly (my hours-long battle with Learning Ally's Read Here player today makes me particularly sympathetic to your plight), but E-mails which do not clearly define your problem serve no one. If you had clearly explained that you were attempting to use a new feature called the Web Reader which only worked in Chrome, and you needed alternative solutions, much of the confusion I sensed underlying many of the messages in this topic could have been averted. I'll address one final point and then close. I agree wholeheartedly with Mike and Caiti. I am one of those under 40 who has none of the players Mike named (partially due to finances, but mostly due to vastly preferring DoubleTalk, the synthesizer used on the original Book Port when it comes to text files, rather than the more "human" voices utilized by many of these players, which are so unbearably grating for me that I am incapable of concentrating on the information being presented.) However, when I do need to read Daisy files, I take advantage of the many Pc-based options or find a way to convert them in to text. And I always try and keep my software up to date, even if that means using Demos. We are disadvantaged enough as it is without hampering ourselves by being unwilling to innovate. Again, I hope at least some of what I have said is helpful, and that I have not given offense. Warmest Regards, Courtney P.S.: If anyone could suggest a Daisy player with a synthesizer similar to DoubleTalk, I would be immensely grateful; I live in fear of the day my BookPort dies. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu From liamskitten at gmail.com Mon Mar 4 02:09:30 2013 From: liamskitten at gmail.com (Courtney Stover) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 20:09:30 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! In-Reply-To: References: <5133d704.4ac1e00a.4803.7e5c@mx.google.com> <007101ce1865$d84ad730$88e08590$@panix.com> <008601ce187a$4be6d9a0$e3b48ce0$@panix.com> Message-ID: Mike, I do know that my belief that Double Talk is immensely more intelligible than the majority of synthesizers currently available is definitely a minority one! *smile* And thank you so very much for the info; using it with a Netbook definitely seems like a very workable solution! Warmest Regards, Courtney From hotdancer1416 at gmail.com Mon Mar 4 02:13:08 2013 From: hotdancer1416 at gmail.com (Ashlee g) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 21:13:08 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! In-Reply-To: References: <5133d704.4ac1e00a.4803.7e5c@mx.google.com> <007101ce1865$d84ad730$88e08590$@panix.com> <008601ce187a$4be6d9a0$e3b48ce0$@panix.com> Message-ID: <47FF8F59-82C1-41EB-BC7E-6DAB9C23A65D@gmail.com> So now I get to ask a crazy question what the heck is doubletalk? NOTHING ABOUT US, WITHOUT US. AUTISTICS RULE On Mar 3, 2013, at 21:09, Courtney Stover wrote: > Mike, > > I do know that my belief that Double Talk is immensely more > intelligible than the majority of synthesizers currently available is > definitely a minority one! *smile* > > And thank you so very much for the info; using it with a Netbook > definitely seems like a very workable solution! > Warmest Regards, > Courtney > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hotdancer1416%40gmail.com From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Mon Mar 4 02:28:19 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 21:28:19 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! In-Reply-To: <47FF8F59-82C1-41EB-BC7E-6DAB9C23A65D@gmail.com> References: <5133d704.4ac1e00a.4803.7e5c@mx.google.com> <007101ce1865$d84ad730$88e08590$@panix.com> <008601ce187a$4be6d9a0$e3b48ce0$@panix.com> <47FF8F59-82C1-41EB-BC7E-6DAB9C23A65D@gmail.com> Message-ID: <000001ce187f$f04c2b80$d0e48280$@gmail.com> Ashley, Double Talk is the speech synthesizer used on the original BookPort. Chris Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashlee g Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 9:13 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! So now I get to ask a crazy question what the heck is doubletalk? NOTHING ABOUT US, WITHOUT US. AUTISTICS RULE On Mar 3, 2013, at 21:09, Courtney Stover wrote: > Mike, > > I do know that my belief that Double Talk is immensely more > intelligible than the majority of synthesizers currently available is > definitely a minority one! *smile* > > And thank you so very much for the info; using it with a Netbook > definitely seems like a very workable solution! > Warmest Regards, > Courtney > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hotdancer1416%40gm > ail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om From hotdancer1416 at gmail.com Mon Mar 4 02:31:10 2013 From: hotdancer1416 at gmail.com (Ashlee g) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 21:31:10 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! In-Reply-To: <000001ce187f$f04c2b80$d0e48280$@gmail.com> References: <5133d704.4ac1e00a.4803.7e5c@mx.google.com> <007101ce1865$d84ad730$88e08590$@panix.com> <008601ce187a$4be6d9a0$e3b48ce0$@panix.com> <47FF8F59-82C1-41EB-BC7E-6DAB9C23A65D@gmail.com> <000001ce187f$f04c2b80$d0e48280$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <36840566-AE30-491C-BF22-899E033AA988@gmail.com> Okay what are NOTHING ABOUT US, WITHOUT US. AUTISTICS RULE On Mar 3, 2013, at 21:28, "Chris Nusbaum" wrote: > Ashley, > > Double Talk is the speech synthesizer used on the original BookPort. > > Chris > > Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair > Public Relations Committee > Maryland Association of Blind Students > Phone: (443) 547-2409 > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashlee g > Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 9:13 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! > > So now I get to ask a crazy question what the heck is doubletalk? > > NOTHING ABOUT US, WITHOUT US. AUTISTICS RULE > > On Mar 3, 2013, at 21:09, Courtney Stover wrote: > >> Mike, >> >> I do know that my belief that Double Talk is immensely more >> intelligible than the majority of synthesizers currently available is >> definitely a minority one! *smile* >> >> And thank you so very much for the info; using it with a Netbook >> definitely seems like a very workable solution! >> Warmest Regards, >> Courtney >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hotdancer1416%40gm >> ail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hotdancer1416%40gmail.com From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Mon Mar 4 02:55:28 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 21:55:28 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] song lyrics In-Reply-To: References: <5133cd09.26abec0a.30a1.70c1@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <3E3EDD701C644E40A15AF999102FB3F7@OwnerPC> Thanks to the two of you that responded. So, Kaiti, I was at the site you referenced. Its got so many links. its confusing. There is a link called music videos and soundtracks which I assume is not what I want. Does this site have older songs; like from the 70s or 80s? Do I just click on a letter of the artist's name? So, if I wanted Michael Jackson, would I click on J? If you can clarify that would be helpful. I'll certainly also search for strings of lyrics on google. Ashley -----Original Message----- From: Kaiti Shelton Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 5:32 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] song lyrics Hi Ashley, Usually if you search a phrase from lyrics in google a bunch of song lyric web sites should come up. If you have any set of lyrics in your mind that you particularly like that might be a good place to start. I usually use a site called a-z lyrics Universe , www.azlyrics.com. They have songs and artists alphabetized, so if you know a particular artist you want it should be pretty easy to browse and find them on that sight. They also have complete lyrics for all their songs. Hope this helps, and good luck on your project! On 3/3/13, Sophie Trist wrote: > Ashley, there's a website where you can find song lyrics. I think > it's called www.superlyrics.com, but I might just be thinking of > the title of the page. Just goggle "super lyrics" and it should > come up. The songs are listed by artist, so you can just look at > any artist you want. > > HTH, > Sophie > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ashley Bramlett" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > Date sent: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 16:38:13 -0500 > Subject: [nabs-l] song lyrics > > Hi all, > > I’m supposed to analyze song lyrics for sociological concepts > for family sociology. > Any good websites to find lyrics? So far, I seem to find > fragments of lyrics, not the whole song; if I search for a > particular song, I can often find lyrics, but searching this way > I need the exact title. > > Thanks. > Ashley > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info > for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade > r%40gmail.com > > > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From k7uij at panix.com Mon Mar 4 03:01:20 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 19:01:20 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] song lyrics In-Reply-To: <3E3EDD701C644E40A15AF999102FB3F7@OwnerPC> References: <5133cd09.26abec0a.30a1.70c1@mx.google.com> <3E3EDD701C644E40A15AF999102FB3F7@OwnerPC> Message-ID: <00a001ce1884$8cd74170$a685c450$@panix.com> Ashley: Novel idea: rather than ask, why not just try the links and see what they do? It's a pretty sure bet that's how those knowledgeable on the subject gained their expertise. Mike Freeman -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley Bramlett Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 6:55 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] song lyrics Thanks to the two of you that responded. So, Kaiti, I was at the site you referenced. Its got so many links. its confusing. There is a link called music videos and soundtracks which I assume is not what I want. Does this site have older songs; like from the 70s or 80s? Do I just click on a letter of the artist's name? So, if I wanted Michael Jackson, would I click on J? If you can clarify that would be helpful. I'll certainly also search for strings of lyrics on google. Ashley -----Original Message----- From: Kaiti Shelton Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 5:32 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] song lyrics Hi Ashley, Usually if you search a phrase from lyrics in google a bunch of song lyric web sites should come up. If you have any set of lyrics in your mind that you particularly like that might be a good place to start. I usually use a site called a-z lyrics Universe , www.azlyrics.com. They have songs and artists alphabetized, so if you know a particular artist you want it should be pretty easy to browse and find them on that sight. They also have complete lyrics for all their songs. Hope this helps, and good luck on your project! On 3/3/13, Sophie Trist wrote: > Ashley, there's a website where you can find song lyrics. I think > it's called www.superlyrics.com, but I might just be thinking of > the title of the page. Just goggle "super lyrics" and it should > come up. The songs are listed by artist, so you can just look at > any artist you want. > > HTH, > Sophie > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ashley Bramlett" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > Date sent: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 16:38:13 -0500 > Subject: [nabs-l] song lyrics > > Hi all, > > I'm supposed to analyze song lyrics for sociological concepts > for family sociology. > Any good websites to find lyrics? So far, I seem to find > fragments of lyrics, not the whole song; if I search for a > particular song, I can often find lyrics, but searching this way > I need the exact title. > > Thanks. > Ashley > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info > for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade > r%40gmail.com > > > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink. net _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Mon Mar 4 03:13:08 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 22:13:08 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] song lyrics In-Reply-To: References: <5133cd09.26abec0a.30a1.70c1@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <00548C840FE240F39560FCF8CB69A290@OwnerPC> Also, I tried clicking on a letter and names came up so I assume those are artist names. there is a search box on the site. I wonder if it would be better to put in the artist name first name, last name or the opposite order. -----Original Message----- From: Kaiti Shelton Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 5:32 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] song lyrics Hi Ashley, Usually if you search a phrase from lyrics in google a bunch of song lyric web sites should come up. If you have any set of lyrics in your mind that you particularly like that might be a good place to start. I usually use a site called a-z lyrics Universe , www.azlyrics.com. They have songs and artists alphabetized, so if you know a particular artist you want it should be pretty easy to browse and find them on that sight. They also have complete lyrics for all their songs. Hope this helps, and good luck on your project! On 3/3/13, Sophie Trist wrote: > Ashley, there's a website where you can find song lyrics. I think > it's called www.superlyrics.com, but I might just be thinking of > the title of the page. Just goggle "super lyrics" and it should > come up. The songs are listed by artist, so you can just look at > any artist you want. > > HTH, > Sophie > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ashley Bramlett" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > Date sent: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 16:38:13 -0500 > Subject: [nabs-l] song lyrics > > Hi all, > > I’m supposed to analyze song lyrics for sociological concepts > for family sociology. > Any good websites to find lyrics? So far, I seem to find > fragments of lyrics, not the whole song; if I search for a > particular song, I can often find lyrics, but searching this way > I need the exact title. > > Thanks. > Ashley > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info > for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade > r%40gmail.com > > > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Mon Mar 4 03:48:16 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 22:48:16 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] song lyrics In-Reply-To: <00548C840FE240F39560FCF8CB69A290@OwnerPC> References: <5133cd09.26abec0a.30a1.70c1@mx.google.com> <00548C840FE240F39560FCF8CB69A290@OwnerPC> Message-ID: Hi Ashley, The letters pull up all the artists just as they would if you were scrolling on an IPod. So, if you wanted to scroll through Michael Jackson songs you would look under M, or if you were lookingfor say, Kelly Clarkson, you would look under K. If you want to use the search box I'd recommend typing it in first name then last name since that's how it's listed when you browse by letter. Also, using insert F7 to bring up the links list makes everything go a lot faster. On 3/3/13, Ashley Bramlett wrote: > Also, I tried clicking on a letter and names came up so I assume those are > artist names. > there is a search box on the site. I wonder if it would be better > to put in the artist name first name, last name or the opposite order. > -----Original Message----- > From: Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 5:32 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] song lyrics > > Hi Ashley, > > Usually if you search a phrase from lyrics in google a bunch of song > lyric web sites should come up. If you have any set of lyrics in your > mind that you particularly like that might be a good place to start. > > I usually use a site called a-z lyrics Universe , www.azlyrics.com. > They have songs and artists alphabetized, so if you know a particular > artist you want it should be pretty easy to browse and find them on > that sight. They also have complete lyrics for all their songs. > > Hope this helps, and good luck on your project! > > On 3/3/13, Sophie Trist wrote: >> Ashley, there's a website where you can find song lyrics. I think >> it's called www.superlyrics.com, but I might just be thinking of >> the title of the page. Just goggle "super lyrics" and it should >> come up. The songs are listed by artist, so you can just look at >> any artist you want. >> >> HTH, >> Sophie >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Ashley Bramlett" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> > Date sent: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 16:38:13 -0500 >> Subject: [nabs-l] song lyrics >> >> Hi all, >> >> I’m supposed to analyze song lyrics for sociological concepts >> for family sociology. >> Any good websites to find lyrics? So far, I seem to find >> fragments of lyrics, not the whole song; if I search for a >> particular song, I can often find lyrics, but searching this way >> I need the exact title. >> >> Thanks. >> Ashley >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade >> r%40gmail.com >> >> >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From wmodnl at hotmail.com Mon Mar 4 04:13:07 2013 From: wmodnl at hotmail.com (William O'donnell) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 23:13:07 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Did you try Firefox? After all, another name for Internet explorer is not IE, rather incompetent explorer. That browser crashes on me more times a week than I type on a computer. Have a good evening. Sent from my iPad On Mar 3, 2013, at 9:26 AM, "Joshua Lester" wrote: > I've contacted the support staff, and they won't get back with me! > Here's the problem. > I renewed my membership, and downloaded a book that I needed for class. > The problem is, that I can't use the reading software with Internet Explorer! > Their software only works with Google Chrome, which Jaws 10.0 won't work with! > Good grief! > What's going on? > BTW, I can't afford to upgrade Jaws. > Thanks, Joshua > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/wmodnl%40hotmail.com From wmodnl at hotmail.com Mon Mar 4 04:19:49 2013 From: wmodnl at hotmail.com (William O'donnell) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 23:19:49 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! In-Reply-To: References: <002401ce1824$5fff76f0$1ffe64d0$@panix.com> <004d01ce1850$e40c8880$ac259980$@panix.com> <000f01ce1856$21d563d0$df1fbf48@yourfsyly0jtwn> Message-ID: One more "food for thought" here, is that: Paying for an update can be worked out another way. In other words, there is a w ay out of this trap. As long as you have a written letter, and a tech evaluation that will state, in short, that your update is required for your machine to properly function, then state rehab will "fit the bill." We can talk further off-list about how to do this effectively, utilizing the chain of command. Hope this helps. Now, get out of that trap, since there is a way out! Sent from my iPad On Mar 3, 2013, at 5:52 PM, "Kaiti Shelton" wrote: > Hi all, > > Mike, I agree with you that the computer industry is far from static, > but Josh did indicate that he is unable to pay for a Jaws update. > Unfortunately, this part of the problem, (although I likewise suspect > the main issue at work is he's probably trying to read the wrong type > of file on the web reader too), isn't his fault. However, by that > same token... > > Josh: Mike does have a really good point and everything is constantly > updating. Bookshare has recently added a lot of new features to make > their site keep up with the needs of it's users and the other adapting > technology out there. If you can't pay for it yourself I would > suggest trying to see if you can get an upgrade through your state voc > rehab agency or something. Your local NFB chapter should be able to > direct you in other possible means specific to where you live and what > might be locally available to you for getting a more recent version of > jaws and an SMA package which will keep you up-to-date for the next > two versions. A good rule of thumb is to not let yourself fall more > than two versions behind in software because then things really start > to not mesh well with other programs which have been updated. > (speaking from experience where my school district didn't upgrade my > jaws from version 6 to 11 until they had to with the release of > windows 7). an SMA would be a great investment too. If you're not > able to get a new version of jaws, try NVDA; it's free and you never > have to pay for updates, plus it works pretty well and the commands, > although somewhat different, are pretty easy to learn. Aside from the > screenreader issues, make sure you're downloading a text file, like > daisy text. If you're downloading brf the web reader probably won't > know how to read it. As others have said you could also try opening > it in fs reader, or if you have Duxberry or something like it you can > download a brf file and translate it to text. I've done this when my > notetaker wasn't available and it worked pretty well. > > Also, if all else fails, I have found that it's easier to reach > Bookshare for tech help if you just call them rather than mess with > the email system. They're really helpful and willing to assist > customers over the phone, and it resolves issues a lot more quickly > than doing everything via the web. > > Good luck. > > > On 3/3/13, Peter Donahue wrote: >> Hello Mike and everyone, >> >> We each have folders to which we save our downloaded Bookshare books. >> Beneath these root folders we create folders for each author and save the >> books by that author in to the author's folder. Whenever we download a >> Bookshare Book we save a copy of the .xml file back to the author's folder >> and rename it to have a .html extension. We then copy or move the .html file >> >> in to the folder of the book we wish to read. This comes in handy whenever >> you wish to read books containing computer or other types of code of >> interest. We've gotten the best results with Firefox. Hope this helps. >> >> Peter Donahue >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Mike Freeman" >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 2:51 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! >> >> >> I suspect that perhaps the gentleman doesn't know which file to look at. My >> advice would be to look at the .XML file. However, depending upon how it's >> written, Internet Explorer reads .XML files well ... or not-so-well. But >> I'd >> bet the Amis public-domain DAISY player would also work well. >> >> Mike Freeman >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Danielle >> Sykora >> Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 12:47 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! >> >> I have used bookshare books with jaws 10 and internet explorer before and >> didn't have any problems. Maybe its the file type you downloaded it as? I >> used Daisy Text. >> >> On 3/3/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>> Why not get the .BRF version of the book? Or using your DAISY player >>> of choice -- Stream, BookSense, Book Port Plus, Plextalk Pocket or the >>> like or, if you don't own one of these (and it's hard to imagine >>> anyone under forty >>> *not* owning one), why not try FSReader, Amis or one of the other >>> computer-based Daisy players out there? Be a bit imaginative, my friend. >>> Life isn't for the faint-of-heart! >>> >>> Mike Freeman >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua >>> Lester >>> Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 6:25 AM >>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! >>> >>> I've contacted the support staff, and they won't get back with me! >>> Here's the problem. >>> I renewed my membership, and downloaded a book that I needed for class. >>> The problem is, that I can't use the reading software with Internet >>> Explorer! >>> Their software only works with Google Chrome, which Jaws 10.0 won't >>> work with! >>> Good grief! >>> What's going on? >>> BTW, I can't afford to upgrade Jaws. >>> Thanks, Joshua >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsykora29%40gmail. >>> com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pdonahue2%40satx.rr.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/wmodnl%40hotmail.com From wmodnl at hotmail.com Mon Mar 4 04:25:48 2013 From: wmodnl at hotmail.com (William O'donnell) Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 23:25:48 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! In-Reply-To: References: <5133d704.4ac1e00a.4803.7e5c@mx.google.com> <007101ce1865$d84ad730$88e08590$@panix.com> Message-ID: You are discussing demos as another option. Isn't true, that if you install a demo and you have a full version already installed, the prior authorization key will work on the newer version? I remember this being true prior, as long as the computer had an active key. Another thing to do, is to go in the registry and actually find and copy the key. People do this, when they have 1 authorization and want to use this on multiple computers. It is quite technical, and someone on here can probably help you. Have a good evening. Sent from my iPad On Mar 3, 2013, at 7:53 PM, "Courtney Stover" wrote: > Hi all: > > Let me see if I can clarify a bit of what's going on here, at least to > the best of my understanding. > > Bookshare has recently instituted their own "web reader" This feature > allows you to read books through the web without ever having to > download them to a computer hard drive. Unfortunately, this feature > only works with Google Chrome, which, I'm presuming, is where Joshua's > frustration comes from. > > Joshua: there are two things you need to be aware of. > > First and foremost, the method everyone on this list has advocated > (downloading the file type known as Daisy Text and then reading the > XML file in Internet Explorer works beautifully with Jaws 10, and I > would know, since I had this version until very recently.) If you > need further help, the tech support people are astoundingly helpful. > They do not contact patrons during the weekend, which is why they may > not have contacted you before now. > > Secondly, they are working to make the Web Reader accessible with > other browsers. However, Chrome is one of the most innovative, with > ever-expanding functionality and excellent security. Firefox has > frequent updates, which makes it difficult for Bookshare engineering > to keep the software compatible, and Internet Explorer's security > issues are a concern for the staff when making the Reader compatible > with it. > > There are two other points which I would like to address. If I cause > offense, I apologize profusely, but I believe these things need to be > stated. > > Firstly: there are Demo versions of Jaws. While I do not advocate > this as a permanent solution, it is an excellent temporary one while > financial ducks are put in a row. It does require you to restart the > computer every forty minutes, but the advantages are absolutely worth > it. I know we don't often realize how far behind software we actually > are until we get such upgrades. However, upgrading your Jaws (even in > demo temporarily) would virtually eliminate the myriad of > technological problems you have brought to this list. > > Secondly: Joshua, please be clearer in your E-mails. I realize there > is immense frustration in technology that is not working properly (my > hours-long battle with Learning Ally's Read Here player today makes me > particularly sympathetic to your plight), but E-mails which do not > clearly define your problem serve no one. If you had clearly > explained that you were attempting to use a new feature called the Web > Reader which only worked in Chrome, and you needed alternative > solutions, much of the confusion I sensed underlying many of the > messages in this topic could have been averted. > > I'll address one final point and then close. I agree wholeheartedly > with Mike and Caiti. I am one of those under 40 who has none of the > players Mike named (partially due to finances, but mostly due to > vastly preferring DoubleTalk, the synthesizer used on the original > Book Port when it comes to text files, rather than the more "human" > voices utilized by many of these players, which are so unbearably > grating for me that I am incapable of concentrating on the information > being presented.) However, when I do need to read Daisy files, I take > advantage of the many Pc-based options or find a way to convert them > in to text. And I always try and keep my software up to date, even if > that means using Demos. We are disadvantaged enough as it is without > hampering ourselves by being unwilling to innovate. > Again, I hope at least some of what I have said is helpful, and that I > have not given offense. > Warmest Regards, > Courtney > P.S.: If anyone could suggest a Daisy player with a synthesizer > similar to DoubleTalk, I would be immensely grateful; I live in fear > of the day my BookPort dies. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/wmodnl%40hotmail.com From hotdancer1416 at gmail.com Mon Mar 4 11:20:45 2013 From: hotdancer1416 at gmail.com (Ashlee g) Date: Mon, 4 Mar 2013 06:20:45 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] song lyrics In-Reply-To: <00a001ce1884$8cd74170$a685c450$@panix.com> References: <5133cd09.26abec0a.30a1.70c1@mx.google.com> <3E3EDD701C644E40A15AF999102FB3F7@OwnerPC> <00a001ce1884$8cd74170$a685c450$@panix.com> Message-ID: Hi Ashley, This is Lavonya. Are using a Mac? Or Windows computer? Are you attending to find music on a playlist on your computer, were are you trying to find lyrics to something that might be online? Because if you are looking for music online, Google will be your best bet. NOTHING ABOUT US, WITHOUT US. AUTISTICS RULE On Mar 3, 2013, at 22:01, "Mike Freeman" wrote: > Ashley: > > Novel idea: rather than ask, why not just try the links and see what they > do? It's a pretty sure bet that's how those knowledgeable on the subject > gained their expertise. > > Mike Freeman > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley Bramlett > Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 6:55 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] song lyrics > > Thanks to the two of you that responded. > So, Kaiti, > I was at the site you referenced. Its got so many links. its confusing. > There is a link called music videos and > soundtracks which I assume is not what I want. > Does this site have older songs; like from the 70s or 80s? > Do I just click on a letter of the artist's name? > So, if I wanted Michael Jackson, would I click on J? > > If you can clarify that would be helpful. I'll certainly also search for > strings of lyrics on google. > > Ashley > -----Original Message----- > From: Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 5:32 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] song lyrics > > Hi Ashley, > > Usually if you search a phrase from lyrics in google a bunch of song > lyric web sites should come up. If you have any set of lyrics in your > mind that you particularly like that might be a good place to start. > > I usually use a site called a-z lyrics Universe , www.azlyrics.com. > They have songs and artists alphabetized, so if you know a particular > artist you want it should be pretty easy to browse and find them on > that sight. They also have complete lyrics for all their songs. > > Hope this helps, and good luck on your project! > > On 3/3/13, Sophie Trist wrote: >> Ashley, there's a website where you can find song lyrics. I think >> it's called www.superlyrics.com, but I might just be thinking of >> the title of the page. Just goggle "super lyrics" and it should >> come up. The songs are listed by artist, so you can just look at >> any artist you want. >> >> HTH, >> Sophie >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Ashley Bramlett" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> > Date sent: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 16:38:13 -0500 >> Subject: [nabs-l] song lyrics >> >> Hi all, >> >> I'm supposed to analyze song lyrics for sociological concepts >> for family sociology. >> Any good websites to find lyrics? So far, I seem to find >> fragments of lyrics, not the whole song; if I search for a >> particular song, I can often find lyrics, but searching this way >> I need the exact title. >> >> Thanks. >> Ashley >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade >> r%40gmail.com > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink. > net > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hotdancer1416%40gmail.com From jsoro620 at gmail.com Mon Mar 4 13:11:36 2013 From: jsoro620 at gmail.com (Joe Orozco) Date: Mon, 4 Mar 2013 08:11:36 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Is College Worth It? Message-ID: Two points I would give specifically to the NABS audience before sharing this week's teaser: first, if you think you're going to attend one of the NFB training centers, which should always be a personal decision, do it before college. Telling yourself you'll do it later is a good way to never do it at all. That's personal experience speaking. Second, if you don't believe in going to college, do check out the excellent article in this month's Braille Monitor: My Dream, My Business, and My Life by Vincent M. Tagliarino. Okay, this week's article follows: Does the thought of starting college make your stomach drop? Or, if you're already there, are you convinced college is a social experiment designed to shake you out of your money while smug professors watch you suffer? Why do people go to college? It must be built into our DNA. Some of our parents went, and now they expect us to go. Worse, some of our parents did not go, and now they want us to be the first to live the American dream. It's bad enough high schools teach to the test. Parents, teachers, and guidance counselors propel students to meet the qualifications to get into the right school, whatever that means. The last time I checked, a Georgetown graduate was having just as hard of a time finding a job as the guy with a degree from the junior college down the street. Read the rest of the article here: http://joeorozco.com/blog_is_college_worth_it From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Mon Mar 4 20:27:27 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Mon, 4 Mar 2013 15:27:27 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] song lyrics In-Reply-To: References: <5133cd09.26abec0a.30a1.70c1@mx.google.com><3E3EDD701C644E40A15AF999102FB3F7@OwnerPC><00a001ce1884$8cd74170$a685c450$@panix.com> Message-ID: <8EDABD29AE1846E6892C914181DD9B8D@OwnerPC> Lavanya, I use a windows 7 computer and yes I do want lyrics o songs. -----Original Message----- From: Ashlee g Sent: Monday, March 04, 2013 6:20 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] song lyrics Hi Ashley, This is Lavonya. Are using a Mac? Or Windows computer? Are you attending to find music on a playlist on your computer, were are you trying to find lyrics to something that might be online? Because if you are looking for music online, Google will be your best bet. NOTHING ABOUT US, WITHOUT US. AUTISTICS RULE On Mar 3, 2013, at 22:01, "Mike Freeman" wrote: > Ashley: > > Novel idea: rather than ask, why not just try the links and see what they > do? It's a pretty sure bet that's how those knowledgeable on the subject > gained their expertise. > > Mike Freeman > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley > Bramlett > Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 6:55 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] song lyrics > > Thanks to the two of you that responded. > So, Kaiti, > I was at the site you referenced. Its got so many links. its confusing. > There is a link called music videos and > soundtracks which I assume is not what I want. > Does this site have older songs; like from the 70s or 80s? > Do I just click on a letter of the artist's name? > So, if I wanted Michael Jackson, would I click on J? > > If you can clarify that would be helpful. I'll certainly also search for > strings of lyrics on google. > > Ashley > -----Original Message----- > From: Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 5:32 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] song lyrics > > Hi Ashley, > > Usually if you search a phrase from lyrics in google a bunch of song > lyric web sites should come up. If you have any set of lyrics in your > mind that you particularly like that might be a good place to start. > > I usually use a site called a-z lyrics Universe , www.azlyrics.com. > They have songs and artists alphabetized, so if you know a particular > artist you want it should be pretty easy to browse and find them on > that sight. They also have complete lyrics for all their songs. > > Hope this helps, and good luck on your project! > > On 3/3/13, Sophie Trist wrote: >> Ashley, there's a website where you can find song lyrics. I think >> it's called www.superlyrics.com, but I might just be thinking of >> the title of the page. Just goggle "super lyrics" and it should >> come up. The songs are listed by artist, so you can just look at >> any artist you want. >> >> HTH, >> Sophie >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Ashley Bramlett" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> > Date sent: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 16:38:13 -0500 >> Subject: [nabs-l] song lyrics >> >> Hi all, >> >> I'm supposed to analyze song lyrics for sociological concepts >> for family sociology. >> Any good websites to find lyrics? So far, I seem to find >> fragments of lyrics, not the whole song; if I search for a >> particular song, I can often find lyrics, but searching this way >> I need the exact title. >> >> Thanks. >> Ashley >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade >> r%40gmail.com > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink. > net > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hotdancer1416%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Mon Mar 4 23:05:46 2013 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Mon, 4 Mar 2013 15:05:46 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Seeking student division announcements Message-ID: <52EB0AFE-6644-4010-9CDA-A301157E5D8A@gmail.com> Greetings, Does your student division have a big event coming up that it wishes to have announced far and wide? if you do then send it to me directly at dsmithnfb at gmail.com and I'll make sure that nabs does it's best to get it out there on Facebook and twitter, as well as other student division list serves! Be sure to tell me what state it's from in your subject line, so I know you aren't sending me a personal invite *smile*. I'll be sending stuff out over the week, so if you get it to me before friday, i'll make sure that it gets out before the weekend finishes out. Best, Darian Darian Smith 2nd Vice President, National Association of Blind Students Follow us on twitter: @nabslink Facebook:nabs link website: www.nabslink.org From hotdancer1416 at gmail.com Tue Mar 5 02:08:04 2013 From: hotdancer1416 at gmail.com (Ashlee g) Date: Mon, 4 Mar 2013 21:08:04 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] song lyrics In-Reply-To: <8EDABD29AE1846E6892C914181DD9B8D@OwnerPC> References: <5133cd09.26abec0a.30a1.70c1@mx.google.com> <3E3EDD701C644E40A15AF999102FB3F7@OwnerPC> <00a001ce1884$8cd74170$a685c450$@panix.com> <8EDABD29AE1846E6892C914181DD9B8D@OwnerPC> Message-ID: Well if that's what you're looking for lyrics, then try Google I just did that yesterday and it works beautifully NOTHING ABOUT US, WITHOUT US. AUTISTICS RULE On Mar 4, 2013, at 15:27, "Ashley Bramlett" wrote: > Lavanya, > I use a windows 7 computer and yes I do want lyrics o songs. > > -----Original Message----- From: Ashlee g > Sent: Monday, March 04, 2013 6:20 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] song lyrics > > Hi Ashley, > This is Lavonya. Are using a Mac? Or Windows computer? Are you attending to find music on a playlist on your computer, were are you trying to find lyrics to something that might be online? Because if you are looking for music online, Google will be your best bet. > > NOTHING ABOUT US, WITHOUT US. AUTISTICS RULE > > On Mar 3, 2013, at 22:01, "Mike Freeman" wrote: > >> Ashley: >> >> Novel idea: rather than ask, why not just try the links and see what they >> do? It's a pretty sure bet that's how those knowledgeable on the subject >> gained their expertise. >> >> Mike Freeman >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley Bramlett >> Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 6:55 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] song lyrics >> >> Thanks to the two of you that responded. >> So, Kaiti, >> I was at the site you referenced. Its got so many links. its confusing. >> There is a link called music videos and >> soundtracks which I assume is not what I want. >> Does this site have older songs; like from the 70s or 80s? >> Do I just click on a letter of the artist's name? >> So, if I wanted Michael Jackson, would I click on J? >> >> If you can clarify that would be helpful. I'll certainly also search for >> strings of lyrics on google. >> >> Ashley >> -----Original Message----- From: Kaiti Shelton >> Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 5:32 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] song lyrics >> >> Hi Ashley, >> >> Usually if you search a phrase from lyrics in google a bunch of song >> lyric web sites should come up. If you have any set of lyrics in your >> mind that you particularly like that might be a good place to start. >> >> I usually use a site called a-z lyrics Universe , www.azlyrics.com. >> They have songs and artists alphabetized, so if you know a particular >> artist you want it should be pretty easy to browse and find them on >> that sight. They also have complete lyrics for all their songs. >> >> Hope this helps, and good luck on your project! >> >> On 3/3/13, Sophie Trist wrote: >>> Ashley, there's a website where you can find song lyrics. I think >>> it's called www.superlyrics.com, but I might just be thinking of >>> the title of the page. Just goggle "super lyrics" and it should >>> come up. The songs are listed by artist, so you can just look at >>> any artist you want. >>> >>> HTH, >>> Sophie >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Ashley Bramlett" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>> >> Date sent: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 16:38:13 -0500 >>> Subject: [nabs-l] song lyrics >>> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> I'm supposed to analyze song lyrics for sociological concepts >>> for family sociology. >>> Any good websites to find lyrics? So far, I seem to find >>> fragments of lyrics, not the whole song; if I search for a >>> particular song, I can often find lyrics, but searching this way >>> I need the exact title. >>> >>> Thanks. >>> Ashley >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade >>> r%40gmail.com >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink. >> net >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hotdancer1416%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hotdancer1416%40gmail.com From codyjbair at yahoo.com Tue Mar 5 05:05:16 2013 From: codyjbair at yahoo.com (Cody Bair) Date: Mon, 4 Mar 2013 21:05:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nabs-l] Text Boxes and JAWS Message-ID: <1362459916.34496.YahooMailClassic@web125201.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> HI all, Do any of you know how to read text with JAWS that is inside a text box on a word document? Thanks, Cody From Zunaira.Wasif at dbs.fldoe.org Tue Mar 5 13:29:57 2013 From: Zunaira.Wasif at dbs.fldoe.org (Wasif, Zunaira) Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 08:29:57 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! In-Reply-To: <007101ce1865$d84ad730$88e08590$@panix.com> References: <5133d704.4ac1e00a.4803.7e5c@mx.google.com> <007101ce1865$d84ad730$88e08590$@panix.com> Message-ID: <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE205@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> Joshua, if you are in school, then your counselor at blind services may upgrade your JAWS. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 6:22 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! Think he's trying to read the book with IE 7 and JAWS 10. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris Nusbaum Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 3:04 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! Joshua, I'm a little confused. What is this reading software you speak of? To my knowledge, Bookshare doesn't have its own reading software. Are you referring to FS Reader? Thanks, Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: Joshua Lester References: <5133d704.4ac1e00a.4803.7e5c@mx.google.com> <007101ce1865$d84ad730$88e08590$@panix.com> <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE205@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> Message-ID: Another option would be to use a third-party player. You have a Victor reader stream or another player that plays Bookshare books? Sent from my iPhone On Mar 5, 2013, at 8:29 AM, "Wasif, Zunaira" wrote: > Joshua, if you are in school, then your counselor at blind services may > upgrade your JAWS. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike > Freeman > Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 6:22 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! > > Think he's trying to read the book with IE 7 and JAWS 10. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris > Nusbaum > Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 3:04 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! > > Joshua, > > I'm a little confused. What is this reading software you speak of? To > my knowledge, Bookshare doesn't have its own reading software. Are you > referring to FS Reader? > > Thanks, > > Chris > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Joshua Lester To: "nabs-l at nfbnet.org" 14:24:49 +0000 > Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! > > I've contacted the support staff, and they won't get back with me! > Here's the problem. > I renewed my membership, and downloaded a book that I needed for class. > The problem is, that I can't use the reading software with Internet > Explorer! > Their software only works with Google Chrome, which Jaws 10.0 won't work > with! > Good grief! > What's going on? > BTW, I can't afford to upgrade Jaws. > Thanks, Joshua > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbau > m%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. > fldoe.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40gmail.com From deb.mendelsohn at gmail.com Tue Mar 5 15:28:48 2013 From: deb.mendelsohn at gmail.com (Deb Mendelsohn) Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 08:28:48 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] CAT JOKE Message-ID: Smile of the day A guy frantically walks into a pet hospital with his ill stricken dog in his arms and yells, "Doctor please tell me what's wrong with him!" The veterinarian grabs the dog and places it on the gurney and examines him meticulously from head to toe and even listens to his lungs and heart beat. Unable to provide a diagnosis for the canine he leaves the room. The veterinarian returns momentarily with a cat in his arms and places it on top of the dog. He signals the cat to get to work and it starts to sniff the canine from top to bottom while the owner looks in awe. Once finished doing it's job the cat leaves the room with the doctor. The doctor then returns to tell the man that his dog is very sick and has a few days left to live. He then proceeds to hand the hospital bill over to the man. The gentleman reviews the charges and then yells, "Thirteen hundred dollars for you to tell me that my dog is dying?" "Yes," the doctor replies. "Three hundred dollars for my physical examination and one thousand dollars for the CAT Scan." -- ** From clb5590 at gmail.com Tue Mar 5 19:23:31 2013 From: clb5590 at gmail.com (Cindy Bennett) Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 11:23:31 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick Online Survey Opportunity Message-ID: Hello, We are a team of researchers at the University of Washington conducting a survey on the use of cameras and tactile graphics by people who are blind or have low vision. This survey will inform the design of a smartphone application that provides feedback to aid users scanning QR codes (barcodes that encode textual information). It is part of a larger project to convert textbook graphics into a tactile graphics with embedded QR codes for the text labels. The goal of this survey is to determine how cameras and tactile graphics are currently used by blind and low vision adults, and what types of feedback are most helpful in guiding users to scan the QR codes that are placed on the graphics. This survey is intended to be completed by adults 18 and over who identify as low vision or blind. If you complete the survey and provide contact information, you will be entered in a lottery to win one of multiple $25 Amazon gift cards. We would appreciate it if you would forward this on to people who might have valuable input. If you would be willing to fill out the survey, which should take 15-20 minutes, please follow the link below: https://catalyst.uw.edu/webq/survey/milnel2/191002 Thanks, Catherine Baker, Graduate Student at the University of Washington and Lauren Milne, Graduate Student at the University of Washington You may contact Professor Richard Ladner at (206) 543-9347 if you have any questions or if you want to learn more about this research. You may also contact the University of Washington Human Subjects Division at (206) 543-0098 if you have any questions about your rights as a subject. -- Cindy Bennett Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington clb5590 at gmail.com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Tue Mar 5 20:58:10 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 15:58:10 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! In-Reply-To: References: <5133d704.4ac1e00a.4803.7e5c@mx.google.com> <007101ce1865$d84ad730$88e08590$@panix.com> <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE205@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> Message-ID: Either way your state rehab should be able to get your what you need. Call your councelor or if you don't have one yet call and see if you can make an appointment to get set up with one. On 3/5/13, Hope Paulos wrote: > Another option would be to use a third-party player. You have a Victor > reader stream or another player that plays Bookshare books? > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 5, 2013, at 8:29 AM, "Wasif, Zunaira" > wrote: > >> Joshua, if you are in school, then your counselor at blind services may >> upgrade your JAWS. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >> Freeman >> Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 6:22 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! >> >> Think he's trying to read the book with IE 7 and JAWS 10. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris >> Nusbaum >> Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 3:04 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! >> >> Joshua, >> >> I'm a little confused. What is this reading software you speak of? To >> my knowledge, Bookshare doesn't have its own reading software. Are you >> referring to FS Reader? >> >> Thanks, >> >> Chris >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Joshua Lester > To: "nabs-l at nfbnet.org" > 14:24:49 +0000 >> Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! >> >> I've contacted the support staff, and they won't get back with me! >> Here's the problem. >> I renewed my membership, and downloaded a book that I needed for class. >> The problem is, that I can't use the reading software with Internet >> Explorer! >> Their software only works with Google Chrome, which Jaws 10.0 won't work >> with! >> Good grief! >> What's going on? >> BTW, I can't afford to upgrade Jaws. >> Thanks, Joshua >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbau >> m%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. >> fldoe.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com Tue Mar 5 21:34:22 2013 From: blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com (Aleeha Dudley) Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 16:34:22 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! In-Reply-To: References: <5133d704.4ac1e00a.4803.7e5c@mx.google.com> <007101ce1865$d84ad730$88e08590$@panix.com> <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE205@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> Message-ID: <675F4AC9-4F46-42BA-8263-996CAC7D104F@gmail.com> Hello, Although many on this list have given you some excellent advice, let me add a few things. First, what version of windows are you running? You may be able to upgrade to Internet explorer 9 and use the web player that bookshare has just introduced. Second, you can download a program called fs reader if you don't already have it that is from freedom scientific and will read bookshare books. Third and finally, you can use an iPod or other audio player to play the audio versions of bookshare books. Please let me know if you have any questions. I Thanks, Aleeha Aleeha dudley On Mar 5, 2013, at 3:58 PM, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Either way your state rehab should be able to get your what you need. > Call your councelor or if you don't have one yet call and see if you > can make an appointment to get set up with one. > > On 3/5/13, Hope Paulos wrote: >> Another option would be to use a third-party player. You have a Victor >> reader stream or another player that plays Bookshare books? >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 5, 2013, at 8:29 AM, "Wasif, Zunaira" >> wrote: >> >>> Joshua, if you are in school, then your counselor at blind services may >>> upgrade your JAWS. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>> Freeman >>> Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 6:22 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! >>> >>> Think he's trying to read the book with IE 7 and JAWS 10. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris >>> Nusbaum >>> Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 3:04 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! >>> >>> Joshua, >>> >>> I'm a little confused. What is this reading software you speak of? To >>> my knowledge, Bookshare doesn't have its own reading software. Are you >>> referring to FS Reader? >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Chris >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: Joshua Lester >> To: "nabs-l at nfbnet.org" >> 14:24:49 +0000 >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! >>> >>> I've contacted the support staff, and they won't get back with me! >>> Here's the problem. >>> I renewed my membership, and downloaded a book that I needed for class. >>> The problem is, that I can't use the reading software with Internet >>> Explorer! >>> Their software only works with Google Chrome, which Jaws 10.0 won't work >>> with! >>> Good grief! >>> What's going on? >>> BTW, I can't afford to upgrade Jaws. >>> Thanks, Joshua >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbau >>> m%40gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. >>> fldoe.org >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com From kaybaycar at gmail.com Tue Mar 5 21:50:21 2013 From: kaybaycar at gmail.com (Julie McGinnity) Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 15:50:21 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] song lyrics In-Reply-To: References: <5133cd09.26abec0a.30a1.70c1@mx.google.com> <3E3EDD701C644E40A15AF999102FB3F7@OwnerPC> <00a001ce1884$8cd74170$a685c450$@panix.com> <8EDABD29AE1846E6892C914181DD9B8D@OwnerPC> Message-ID: Hi Ashley, I usually just google the title of the song and then write the word lyrics next to it. If you know the artist that helps too. You should be able to find the entire song that way. On 3/4/13, Ashlee g wrote: > Well if that's what you're looking for lyrics, then try Google I just did > that yesterday and it works beautifully > > NOTHING ABOUT US, WITHOUT US. AUTISTICS RULE > > On Mar 4, 2013, at 15:27, "Ashley Bramlett" > wrote: > >> Lavanya, >> I use a windows 7 computer and yes I do want lyrics o songs. >> >> -----Original Message----- From: Ashlee g >> Sent: Monday, March 04, 2013 6:20 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] song lyrics >> >> Hi Ashley, >> This is Lavonya. Are using a Mac? Or Windows computer? Are you attending >> to find music on a playlist on your computer, were are you trying to find >> lyrics to something that might be online? Because if you are looking for >> music online, Google will be your best bet. >> >> NOTHING ABOUT US, WITHOUT US. AUTISTICS RULE >> >> On Mar 3, 2013, at 22:01, "Mike Freeman" wrote: >> >>> Ashley: >>> >>> Novel idea: rather than ask, why not just try the links and see what >>> they >>> do? It's a pretty sure bet that's how those knowledgeable on the subject >>> gained their expertise. >>> >>> Mike Freeman >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley >>> Bramlett >>> Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 6:55 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] song lyrics >>> >>> Thanks to the two of you that responded. >>> So, Kaiti, >>> I was at the site you referenced. Its got so many links. its confusing. >>> There is a link called music videos and >>> soundtracks which I assume is not what I want. >>> Does this site have older songs; like from the 70s or 80s? >>> Do I just click on a letter of the artist's name? >>> So, if I wanted Michael Jackson, would I click on J? >>> >>> If you can clarify that would be helpful. I'll certainly also search for >>> strings of lyrics on google. >>> >>> Ashley >>> -----Original Message----- From: Kaiti Shelton >>> Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 5:32 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] song lyrics >>> >>> Hi Ashley, >>> >>> Usually if you search a phrase from lyrics in google a bunch of song >>> lyric web sites should come up. If you have any set of lyrics in your >>> mind that you particularly like that might be a good place to start. >>> >>> I usually use a site called a-z lyrics Universe , www.azlyrics.com. >>> They have songs and artists alphabetized, so if you know a particular >>> artist you want it should be pretty easy to browse and find them on >>> that sight. They also have complete lyrics for all their songs. >>> >>> Hope this helps, and good luck on your project! >>> >>> On 3/3/13, Sophie Trist wrote: >>>> Ashley, there's a website where you can find song lyrics. I think >>>> it's called www.superlyrics.com, but I might just be thinking of >>>> the title of the page. Just goggle "super lyrics" and it should >>>> come up. The songs are listed by artist, so you can just look at >>>> any artist you want. >>>> >>>> HTH, >>>> Sophie >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Ashley Bramlett" >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >>>> >>> Date sent: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 16:38:13 -0500 >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] song lyrics >>>> >>>> Hi all, >>>> >>>> I'm supposed to analyze song lyrics for sociological concepts >>>> for family sociology. >>>> Any good websites to find lyrics? So far, I seem to find >>>> fragments of lyrics, not the whole song; if I search for a >>>> particular song, I can often find lyrics, but searching this way >>>> I need the exact title. >>>> >>>> Thanks. >>>> Ashley >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade >>>> r%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink. >>> net >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hotdancer1416%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hotdancer1416%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kaybaycar%40gmail.com > -- Julie McG National Association of Guide dog Users board member, National Federation of the Blind performing arts division secretary, Missouri Association of Guide dog Users President, and Guiding Eyes for the Blind graduate 2008 "For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that everyone who believes in him may not perish but may have eternal life." John 3:16 From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Tue Mar 5 22:12:06 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 22:12:06 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! In-Reply-To: <675F4AC9-4F46-42BA-8263-996CAC7D104F@gmail.com> References: <5133d704.4ac1e00a.4803.7e5c@mx.google.com> <007101ce1865$d84ad730$88e08590$@panix.com> <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE205@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> , <675F4AC9-4F46-42BA-8263-996CAC7D104F@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, Aleeha! How's it going? I'll probably get booed for this on the list, like I was at the Jaws seminar, but I'm using Windows Vista. I'll download FS Reader. Is it free? Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Aleeha Dudley [blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2013 3:34 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! Hello, Although many on this list have given you some excellent advice, let me add a few things. First, what version of windows are you running? You may be able to upgrade to Internet explorer 9 and use the web player that bookshare has just introduced. Second, you can download a program called fs reader if you don't already have it that is from freedom scientific and will read bookshare books. Third and finally, you can use an iPod or other audio player to play the audio versions of bookshare books. Please let me know if you have any questions. I Thanks, Aleeha Aleeha dudley On Mar 5, 2013, at 3:58 PM, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Either way your state rehab should be able to get your what you need. > Call your councelor or if you don't have one yet call and see if you > can make an appointment to get set up with one. > > On 3/5/13, Hope Paulos wrote: >> Another option would be to use a third-party player. You have a Victor >> reader stream or another player that plays Bookshare books? >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 5, 2013, at 8:29 AM, "Wasif, Zunaira" >> wrote: >> >>> Joshua, if you are in school, then your counselor at blind services may >>> upgrade your JAWS. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>> Freeman >>> Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 6:22 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! >>> >>> Think he's trying to read the book with IE 7 and JAWS 10. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris >>> Nusbaum >>> Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 3:04 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! >>> >>> Joshua, >>> >>> I'm a little confused. What is this reading software you speak of? To >>> my knowledge, Bookshare doesn't have its own reading software. Are you >>> referring to FS Reader? >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Chris >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: Joshua Lester >> To: "nabs-l at nfbnet.org" >> 14:24:49 +0000 >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Frustrated with Bookshare! >>> >>> I've contacted the support staff, and they won't get back with me! >>> Here's the problem. >>> I renewed my membership, and downloaded a book that I needed for class. >>> The problem is, that I can't use the reading software with Internet >>> Explorer! >>> Their software only works with Google Chrome, which Jaws 10.0 won't work >>> with! >>> Good grief! >>> What's going on? >>> BTW, I can't afford to upgrade Jaws. >>> Thanks, Joshua >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbau >>> m%40gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. >>> fldoe.org >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com From gloria.graves at gmail.com Tue Mar 5 22:15:42 2013 From: gloria.graves at gmail.com (Gloria G) Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 16:15:42 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Drop Box Message-ID: <47A7B971578542AE988F59DF23F41FFF@Gloria> Hello all, I am a first time user of drop box. I have gone to the cite and have created an account. I was given a link by my professor to a page on drop box where I would be able to go and down load some articles that will be used in the class. I have not been able to get the link to work. Can anyone help? I would be more than happy to post the link to see if anyone else can find the page, or offer any help. Thanks in advance! Gloria From zdreicer at gmail.com Tue Mar 5 22:39:30 2013 From: zdreicer at gmail.com (Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer) Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 15:39:30 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Drop Box In-Reply-To: <47A7B971578542AE988F59DF23F41FFF@Gloria> References: <47A7B971578542AE988F59DF23F41FFF@Gloria> Message-ID: <54284389-6C0B-45C2-9CB9-E920EA7EDF16@gmail.com> Have them put your textbooks into a shared folder Sent from my iPhone using voiceOver On Mar 5, 2013, at 3:15 PM, "Gloria G" wrote: > Hello all, > I am a first time user of drop box. I have gone to the cite and have created an account. I was given a link by my professor to a page on drop box where I would be able to go and down load some articles that will be used in the class. I have not been able to get the link to work. Can anyone help? I would be more than happy to post the link to see if anyone else can find the page, or offer any help. Thanks in advance! > Gloria > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail.com From arielle71 at gmail.com Tue Mar 5 23:06:46 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 16:06:46 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Drop Box In-Reply-To: <54284389-6C0B-45C2-9CB9-E920EA7EDF16@gmail.com> References: <47A7B971578542AE988F59DF23F41FFF@Gloria> <54284389-6C0B-45C2-9CB9-E920EA7EDF16@gmail.com> Message-ID: Posting the link or a copy of the error message you get when trying to click the link may help. Arielle On 3/5/13, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer wrote: > Have them put your textbooks into a shared folder > > Sent from my iPhone using voiceOver > > On Mar 5, 2013, at 3:15 PM, "Gloria G" wrote: > >> Hello all, >> I am a first time user of drop box. I have gone to the cite and have >> created an account. I was given a link by my professor to a page on drop >> box where I would be able to go and down load some articles that will be >> used in the class. I have not been able to get the link to work. Can >> anyone help? I would be more than happy to post the link to see if anyone >> else can find the page, or offer any help. Thanks in advance! >> Gloria >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From k7uij at panix.com Tue Mar 5 23:11:47 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 15:11:47 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Drop Box In-Reply-To: <54284389-6C0B-45C2-9CB9-E920EA7EDF16@gmail.com> References: <47A7B971578542AE988F59DF23F41FFF@Gloria> <54284389-6C0B-45C2-9CB9-E920EA7EDF16@gmail.com> Message-ID: Either that or have the individual put the file into his /her Public folder and then send you the link to the file obtained by right -clicking the file and then selecting the copy public link "choice ;then have him /her paste that into a message to you. Mike Freeman sent from my iPhone On Mar 5, 2013, at 14:39, "Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer" wrote: > Have them put your textbooks into a shared folder > > Sent from my iPhone using voiceOver > > On Mar 5, 2013, at 3:15 PM, "Gloria G" wrote: > >> Hello all, >> I am a first time user of drop box. I have gone to the cite and have created an account. I was given a link by my professor to a page on drop box where I would be able to go and down load some articles that will be used in the class. I have not been able to get the link to work. Can anyone help? I would be more than happy to post the link to see if anyone else can find the page, or offer any help. Thanks in advance! >> Gloria >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From gloria.graves at gmail.com Tue Mar 5 23:47:37 2013 From: gloria.graves at gmail.com (Gloria G) Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 17:47:37 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Drop Box References: <47A7B971578542AE988F59DF23F41FFF@Gloria><54284389-6C0B-45C2-9CB9-E920EA7EDF16@gmail.com> Message-ID: <03B48C1329D04E9A8822F2F5BB7B061D@Gloria> Thanks! I have tried that but had no luck. I will continue to work on it. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Arielle Silverman" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2013 5:06 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Drop Box > Posting the link or a copy of the error message you get when trying to > click the link may help. > Arielle > > On 3/5/13, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer wrote: >> Have them put your textbooks into a shared folder >> >> Sent from my iPhone using voiceOver >> >> On Mar 5, 2013, at 3:15 PM, "Gloria G" wrote: >> >>> Hello all, >>> I am a first time user of drop box. I have gone to the cite and have >>> created an account. I was given a link by my professor to a page on drop >>> box where I would be able to go and down load some articles that will be >>> used in the class. I have not been able to get the link to work. Can >>> anyone help? I would be more than happy to post the link to see if >>> anyone >>> else can find the page, or offer any help. Thanks in advance! >>> Gloria >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gmail.com From lissa1531 at gmail.com Tue Mar 5 23:48:24 2013 From: lissa1531 at gmail.com (melissa Green) Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 16:48:24 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Drop Box References: <47A7B971578542AE988F59DF23F41FFF@Gloria> Message-ID: <1D3C3CE49B564CDDA49C755738549033@HP30910210001> glorria. I have a class that uses drop box. I access it through the class web page. If there is a web page for your class, go there and try to access drop box. Also I agree post the link and the error message. Sincerely, Melissa and Pj Happiness always looks small while you hold it in your hands, but let it go, and you learn at once how big and precious it is. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gloria G" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2013 3:15 PM Subject: [nabs-l] Drop Box Hello all, I am a first time user of drop box. I have gone to the cite and have created an account. I was given a link by my professor to a page on drop box where I would be able to go and down load some articles that will be used in the class. I have not been able to get the link to work. Can anyone help? I would be more than happy to post the link to see if anyone else can find the page, or offer any help. Thanks in advance! Gloria _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lissa1531%40gmail.com From freethaught at gmail.com Tue Mar 5 23:57:53 2013 From: freethaught at gmail.com (Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr.) Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 18:57:53 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Braille conference call Message-ID: <2E1D3430-2BE2-4873-83BE-D8A0D004C468@gmail.com> Hello students, There'll be a conference call tonight regarding the Nemeth Uniform Braille System. I apologize for the short notice, but all are welcome, especially students interested in developments with NUBS, which is an alternative to Unified English Braille. Developments with NUBS should be of special interest to students of math and science who may be concerned with how the current, 40-year-old Nemeth code will withstand the test of time with the implementation of English Braille.0 The call is in just an hour, at 8:00 P.M. eastern. Here is the call-in number and conference code: Phone Number: (605) 715-4920 Access Code: 737124# Antonio Guimaraes From gloria.graves at gmail.com Wed Mar 6 00:05:15 2013 From: gloria.graves at gmail.com (Gloria G) Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 18:05:15 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Drop Box References: <47A7B971578542AE988F59DF23F41FFF@Gloria> <1D3C3CE49B564CDDA49C755738549033@HP30910210001> Message-ID: thanks ----- Original Message ----- From: "melissa Green" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2013 5:48 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Drop Box > glorria. > I have a class that uses drop box. > I access it through the class web page. > If there is a web page for your class, go there and try to access drop > box. > Also I agree post the link and the error message. > > Sincerely, > Melissa and Pj > Happiness always looks small while you hold it in your hands, but let it > go, > and you learn at once how big and precious it is. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Gloria G" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2013 3:15 PM > Subject: [nabs-l] Drop Box > > > Hello all, > I am a first time user of drop box. I have gone to the cite and have > created > an account. I was given a link by my professor to a page on drop box where > I > would be able to go and down load some articles that will be used in the > class. I have not been able to get the link to work. Can anyone help? I > would be more than happy to post the link to see if anyone else can find > the > page, or offer any help. Thanks in advance! > Gloria > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lissa1531%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gmail.com From brlsurfer at gmail.com Wed Mar 6 01:12:23 2013 From: brlsurfer at gmail.com (vejas) Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2013 17:12:23 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] serious problem with the braillenote Message-ID: <51369802.0adae00a.1475.ffff818d@mx.google.com> Hi all, I am having a very serious problem with my braille note. I was reading a part of a textbook for class when my braille note's braille display suddenly stopped working. Now I can use the braille-note's speech, but I'm an avid Braille reader, and I need the Braille because it's very inconvinient without it. I've already tried plugging it in and doing a 4-5-6 reset. Any suggesttions welcome. Thanks! Vejas From zdreicer at gmail.com Wed Mar 6 01:38:03 2013 From: zdreicer at gmail.com (Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer) Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 18:38:03 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] serious problem with the braillenote In-Reply-To: <51369802.0adae00a.1475.ffff818d@mx.google.com> References: <51369802.0adae00a.1475.ffff818d@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <80FF1EAA803B42DFA76F25FDCBC666B5@ZachlaptopPC> Does it say the display is not operating? Sent from my Acer Aspire As5733 -----Original Message----- From: vejas Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2013 6:12 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] serious problem with the braillenote Hi all, I am having a very serious problem with my braille note. I was reading a part of a textbook for class when my braille note's braille display suddenly stopped working. Now I can use the braille-note's speech, but I'm an avid Braille reader, and I need the Braille because it's very inconvinient without it. I've already tried plugging it in and doing a 4-5-6 reset. Any suggesttions welcome. Thanks! Vejas _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail.com From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Wed Mar 6 02:00:15 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum) Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 21:00:15 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] serious problem with the braillenote In-Reply-To: <51369802.0adae00a.1475.ffff818d@mx.google.com> References: <51369802.0adae00a.1475.ffff818d@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <007c01ce1a0e$592ba560$0b82f020$@gmail.com> Vejas, I would call HumanWare about this and ask them whether a 1-2-3 reset might fix it. If this doesn't work, sad to say your Braille display has died and it needs to be sent in to be replaced. Chris Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of vejas Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2013 8:12 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] serious problem with the braillenote Hi all, I am having a very serious problem with my braille note. I was reading a part of a textbook for class when my braille note's braille display suddenly stopped working. Now I can use the braille-note's speech, but I'm an avid Braille reader, and I need the Braille because it's very inconvinient without it. I've already tried plugging it in and doing a 4-5-6 reset. Any suggesttions welcome. Thanks! Vejas _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om From zdreicer at gmail.com Wed Mar 6 02:15:16 2013 From: zdreicer at gmail.com (Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer) Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 19:15:16 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] 4 Vejas Message-ID: Sent from my Acer Aspire As5733 -----Original Message----- From: Cricket Bidleman Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2013 7:07 PM To: zdreicer at gmail.com ; braillenote at freelists.org Subject: re: [BNU] Fw: [nabs-l] serious problem with the braillenote My suggestion is this. We need to know if the pins are all up or down because if they're down, you probably turned the braille off and the speech on. If the pins are all up, then you'll have to get it sent in. If the pins go up and down sporadically, you still have to get it sent in... Unless it's in exercise mode... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer" From this page, you can unsubscribe, change email delivery settings and view list archives. If you have any comments or questions for list moderators, please send an email to braillenote-moderators at freelists.org. Thanks. From brlsurfer at gmail.com Wed Mar 6 02:23:11 2013 From: brlsurfer at gmail.com (vejas) Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2013 18:23:11 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] serious problem with the braillenote Message-ID: <5136a898.e626310a.2856.7417@mx.google.com> Not that I know of. It just stopped working. Vejas ----- Original Message ----- From: "Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer" References: <5136a898.e626310a.2856.7417@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Vejas, I'm not sure if you've already done this or not, but if you haven't tried toggling the braille and speech on and off give it a shot. I used to inadvertently hit the buttons to turn the braille off and the speech on as I was reading sometimes, so it's worth a shot. Hopefully, that will be the fix. If not, call Humanware tomorrow and see what they can do. Hopefully you won't have to send it away for repairs. Good luck. On 3/5/13, vejas wrote: > Not that I know of. It just stopped working. > Vejas > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > Date sent: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 18:38:03 -0700 > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] serious problem with the braillenote > > Does it say the display is not operating? > > > > Sent from my Acer Aspire As5733 > -----Original Message----- > From: vejas > Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2013 6:12 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] serious problem with the braillenote > > Hi all, > I am having a very serious problem with my braille note. I was > reading a part of a textbook for class when my braille note's > braille display suddenly stopped working. Now I can use the > braille-note's speech, but I'm an avid Braille reader, and I need > the Braille because it's very inconvinient without it. I've > already tried plugging it in and doing a 4-5-6 reset. Any > suggesttions welcome. > Thanks! > Vejas > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info > for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm > ail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info > for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brlsurfer%40g > mail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Wed Mar 6 03:11:04 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2013 22:11:04 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Drop Box In-Reply-To: References: <47A7B971578542AE988F59DF23F41FFF@Gloria> <1D3C3CE49B564CDDA49C755738549033@HP30910210001> Message-ID: I'd recommend asking your professor to just create a shared folder with you. That way he/she could just put the files into the folder and you won't have to worry about links not working. They'll also download right to your computer so you could access them directly from the dropbox program. Hope this helps. On 3/5/13, Gloria G wrote: > thanks > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "melissa Green" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2013 5:48 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Drop Box > > >> glorria. >> I have a class that uses drop box. >> I access it through the class web page. >> If there is a web page for your class, go there and try to access drop >> box. >> Also I agree post the link and the error message. >> >> Sincerely, >> Melissa and Pj >> Happiness always looks small while you hold it in your hands, but let it >> go, >> and you learn at once how big and precious it is. >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Gloria G" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2013 3:15 PM >> Subject: [nabs-l] Drop Box >> >> >> Hello all, >> I am a first time user of drop box. I have gone to the cite and have >> created >> an account. I was given a link by my professor to a page on drop box where >> >> I >> would be able to go and down load some articles that will be used in the >> class. I have not been able to get the link to work. Can anyone help? I >> would be more than happy to post the link to see if anyone else can find >> the >> page, or offer any help. Thanks in advance! >> Gloria >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lissa1531%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gmail.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From sweetpeareader at gmail.com Wed Mar 6 03:13:14 2013 From: sweetpeareader at gmail.com (Sophie Trist) Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2013 21:13:14 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] serious problem with the braillenote Message-ID: <5136b470.88c7ec0a.5075.ffff8483@mx.google.com> Vejas, I've had this problem before, and it's super easy to fix. You simply go to the options menu and press B for braille. It'll say, "Braille on? Currently (in your case it's probably no.)" In that case, just hit Y for yes, and that should turn it back on. ----- Original Message ----- From: vejas References: <5136b470.88c7ec0a.5075.ffff8483@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Hey guys, I also have a problem with my BrailleNote and want to see if anyone else had had this same problem: The dot 5 key of my Braille keyboard is not working; I can press it, but the BrailleNote is not recognizing it. It actually told me once that it is a "Command 306- Data Misalignment." When I called HumanWare they said that it had to be sent in. Any thoughts? If anyone has experienced this problem, did you send it in? If I unscrew the unit, is there a way to solve the issue on my own? Miigwech, Jordan Richardson On 5 March 2013 21:13, Sophie Trist wrote: > Vejas, I've had this problem before, and it's super easy to fix. You > simply go to the options menu and press B for braille. It'll say, "Braille > on? Currently (in your case it's probably no.)" In that case, just hit Y > for yes, and that should turn it back on. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: vejas To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Date sent: Tue, 05 Mar 2013 17:12:23 -0800 > Subject: [nabs-l] serious problem with the braillenote > > Hi all, > I am having a very serious problem with my braille note. I was > reading a part of a textbook for class when my braille note's > braille display suddenly stopped working. Now I can use the > braille-note's speech, but I'm an avid Braille reader, and I need > the Braille because it's very inconvinient without it. I've > already tried plugging it in and doing a 4-5-6 reset. Any > suggesttions welcome. > Thanks! > Vejas > > ______________________________**_________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/**sweetpeareade > r%40gmail.com > > > ______________________________**_________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/** > lilrichie411%40gmail.com > -- Jordan Richardson President, Minnesota Association of Blind Students lilrichie411 at gmail.com "It is easier to build strong children than to repair broken men." ~*Frederick Douglass* From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Wed Mar 6 06:07:08 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2013 01:07:08 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] serious problem with the braillenote In-Reply-To: References: <5136b470.88c7ec0a.5075.ffff8483@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <2BED0AF82F7B4A44934D7A3C508A1A4E@OwnerPC> Jordan, It sounds like a mechanical issue. Send it in to be fixed. I did not have that problem, but I had pins sticking up when I did not press them. I had to get it repared. I hope they can fix it. -----Original Message----- From: Jordan Richardson Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2013 11:50 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] serious problem with the braillenote Hey guys, I also have a problem with my BrailleNote and want to see if anyone else had had this same problem: The dot 5 key of my Braille keyboard is not working; I can press it, but the BrailleNote is not recognizing it. It actually told me once that it is a "Command 306- Data Misalignment." When I called HumanWare they said that it had to be sent in. Any thoughts? If anyone has experienced this problem, did you send it in? If I unscrew the unit, is there a way to solve the issue on my own? Miigwech, Jordan Richardson On 5 March 2013 21:13, Sophie Trist wrote: > Vejas, I've had this problem before, and it's super easy to fix. You > simply go to the options menu and press B for braille. It'll say, "Braille > on? Currently (in your case it's probably no.)" In that case, just hit Y > for yes, and that should turn it back on. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: vejas To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Date sent: Tue, 05 Mar 2013 17:12:23 -0800 > Subject: [nabs-l] serious problem with the braillenote > > Hi all, > I am having a very serious problem with my braille note. I was > reading a part of a textbook for class when my braille note's > braille display suddenly stopped working. Now I can use the > braille-note's speech, but I'm an avid Braille reader, and I need > the Braille because it's very inconvinient without it. I've > already tried plugging it in and doing a 4-5-6 reset. Any > suggesttions welcome. > Thanks! > Vejas > > ______________________________**_________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/**sweetpeareade > r%40gmail.com > > > ______________________________**_________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/** > lilrichie411%40gmail.com > -- Jordan Richardson President, Minnesota Association of Blind Students lilrichie411 at gmail.com "It is easier to build strong children than to repair broken men." ~*Frederick Douglass* _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Wed Mar 6 06:21:24 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2013 01:21:24 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] serious problem with the braillenote In-Reply-To: <2BED0AF82F7B4A44934D7A3C508A1A4E@OwnerPC> References: <5136b470.88c7ec0a.5075.ffff8483@mx.google.com> <2BED0AF82F7B4A44934D7A3C508A1A4E@OwnerPC> Message-ID: Jordan, Keys sticking like that is really common with the Apex models, it's just a mechanical glitch that, unfortunately, a lot of them have. Don't try to fix it on your own; that would risk causing more damage. If you can make it through the school year, as it would really stink to send it away and risk not having it back in time for state testing/final exams/whatever might arise at the end of the year for you, that might be ideal. I would usually try to stick out my BrailleNote problems till after my finals and have my aid ship the unit off to Humanware at the end of the last exam day so it would be ready to go when I started school again in August. If you can manage to do this and it's not too much of a struggle, E.G. you have a laptop you can use for major writing assignments or to fix any typing errors you might not be able to solve on the BrailleNote before turning in work, then try it out. Hope this helps. On 3/6/13, Ashley Bramlett wrote: > Jordan, > It sounds like a mechanical issue. Send it in to be fixed. > I did not have that problem, but I had pins sticking up when I did not press > > them. > I had to get it repared. I hope they can fix it. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Jordan Richardson > Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2013 11:50 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] serious problem with the braillenote > > Hey guys, > I also have a problem with my BrailleNote and want to see if anyone else > had had this same problem: > The dot 5 key of my Braille keyboard is not working; I can press it, but > the BrailleNote is not recognizing it. It actually told me once that it is > a "Command 306- Data Misalignment." When I called HumanWare they said that > it had to be sent in. > Any thoughts? If anyone has experienced this problem, did you send it in? > If I unscrew the unit, is there a way to solve the issue on my own? > > Miigwech, > Jordan Richardson > > On 5 March 2013 21:13, Sophie Trist wrote: > >> Vejas, I've had this problem before, and it's super easy to fix. You >> simply go to the options menu and press B for braille. It'll say, >> "Braille >> on? Currently (in your case it's probably no.)" In that case, just hit Y >> for yes, and that should turn it back on. >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: vejas > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Date sent: Tue, 05 Mar 2013 17:12:23 -0800 >> Subject: [nabs-l] serious problem with the braillenote >> >> Hi all, >> I am having a very serious problem with my braille note. I was >> reading a part of a textbook for class when my braille note's >> braille display suddenly stopped working. Now I can use the >> braille-note's speech, but I'm an avid Braille reader, and I need >> the Braille because it's very inconvinient without it. I've >> already tried plugging it in and doing a 4-5-6 reset. Any >> suggesttions welcome. >> Thanks! >> Vejas >> >> ______________________________**_________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/**sweetpeareade >> r%40gmail.com >> >> >> ______________________________**_________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/** >> lilrichie411%40gmail.com >> > > > > -- > Jordan Richardson > President, Minnesota Association of Blind Students > lilrichie411 at gmail.com > "It is easier to build strong children than to repair broken men." > ~*Frederick > Douglass* > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From zdreicer at gmail.com Wed Mar 6 19:08:32 2013 From: zdreicer at gmail.com (Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer) Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2013 12:08:32 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Fw: [BNU] Fw: serious problem with the braillenote Message-ID: <6CB01FAD0F5247FC97C5ED1342D4E651@ZachlaptopPC> 4 Vejas. I hope this helps. Sent from my Acer Aspire As5733 -----Original Message----- From: Paul Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2013 9:56 AM To: zdreicer at gmail.com ; braillenote at freelists.org Subject: re: [BNU] Fw: [nabs-l] serious problem with the braillenote What I would recomend is that you clean your braille display. Use a damp; Not wet! Cloth to clean it. Then use a dry cloth to dry it off. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer" From this page, you can unsubscribe, change email delivery settings and view list archives. If you have any comments or questions for list moderators, please send an email to braillenote-moderators at freelists.org. Thanks. From deb.mendelsohn at gmail.com Wed Mar 6 22:21:46 2013 From: deb.mendelsohn at gmail.com (Deb Mendelsohn) Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2013 15:21:46 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: Statler Center E-Newsletter March 2013 In-Reply-To: <7C5873397009004AAF744388A779F3D9695306@mail1.int.olmstedcenter.org> References: <7C5873397009004AAF744388A779F3D9695306@mail1.int.olmstedcenter.org> Message-ID: HI ALL, STATLER CENTER IS A SCHOOL FOR THE BLIND TEACHING HOSPITALITY SKILLS. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Hirschfelt, Jeff Date: Wed, Mar 6, 2013 at 2:49 PM Subject: Statler Center E-Newsletter March 2013 To: *STATLER CENTER***** *The National Statler Center for Careers in Hospitality Service* **** *A Program of the Olmsted Center for Sight***** *Volume 8 Number 11 E-Newsletter March 2013 ***** **** ** ** ** ** iPads are here!* *Keeping up with the latest technology advances is one of the ways that the National Statler Center is able to best help its students, and another step has been taken with the purchase of several Apple iPads for use in the classroom.**** ** ** The tablet computers, in both the mini and full-sized versions, will be used in conjunction with a number of applications, or “apps”, that have been found to be of special benefit to those who are blind or visually impaired. A primary use is to have the tablet act as an easily portable document reader and input device for classroom activity. People can use the audible reading function to quickly scan through documents and insert their own notes and comments into the text. But the iPad can do a lot of really different things. For example, one app uses the tablet’s camera to tell the person what color an item is, which can be quite useful to blind students dressing up for a job interview, among other uses.**** ** ** Student response has been quite positive as we introduce these tools into the classroom, and we plan to have more iPads and other cutting edge technological tools on hand soon. Our goal is to give our students every possible edge in meeting their technological needs both personally and professionally. **** *[image: Title: Technology Trainer Linda Lange demonstrates the iPad to student Pat C.]***** Technology Trainer Linda Lange **** demonstrates the iPad to student Pat C.**** ** ** Statler Center gets messages in the media**** *New video gives student perspectives on program** *Working in conjunction with MWM Buffalo, a video production company in Buffalo, NY, the National Statler Center has released a new video taken at the Fall 2012 class graduation in Albany NY that helps to tell the story of the program from the perspective of the students at graduation, with follow-up on graduates as they get ready to embark on their job search.**** ** ** You Tube Statler Video can be found here .**** ** ** Thanks to quality narration and interviews with several of the program graduates, the production is easy to follow for visually impaired people as well. Listening to the people in the video, it is clear that the experience of the Statler Center training made a difference in the lives of these students, as we’ve been doing since 1999. To make it as easy to find as possible, the video will be available on our web site, on the Statler Center’s Facebook page and via Statler’s Twitter feed.**** ** ** The last part of the new video gives updates on the placement of several of the graduates from that last class to graduate from the program. After all, everyone likes a happy ending!**** * * *Kentucky Sound Prints radio show offers Statler recruiting overview* A meeting with members of the Kentucky Council of the Blind in February was recently featured on the Kentucky Council of the Blind’s “Sound Prints” radio program, airing on stations across Kentucky and available on the organization’s web site. In the interview, Patrick Keyes, Statler’s admissions coordinator, talked about the program and how Statler Center can make a difference for the blind and visually impaired. **** ** ** You Tube Sound Prints interview can be found here .**** ** ** Graduate Notes:**** ** ** A few weeks ago, *Kevin M.* called to let us know of his 10-year anniversary at his job at Hotel Albany, and that he’s very grateful for these 10 years. Kevin is our longest-working graduate.**** ** ** Last month, *Mark R.* sent us a note at the end of his first week in customer service at Proctors Theater. “I can't tell you how much I enjoy going to this job (even with the 50 minute bus ride). Thanks to all of you at The Statler Center for getting me on this path!”**** ** ** 2013 Statler and STEC Training Calendar****** ** *Statler Hospitality Training Program ***** Buffalo, NY -- May 1 – July 11, 2013 **** **** **** *STEC Customer Service & Contact Center Program ***** Buffalo, NY -- May 23 – July 11, 2013 **** **** Now is the time to enroll for next classes* *Interest is growing for the openings in the upcoming Statler Center classes for both Hospitality training and the STEC programs, starting on May 1 and May 23, respectively. If you know of anyone who would be able to take advantage of our unique training program, this is the time to have them contact us.**** *Go to “How to Apply for Enrollment” at **www.StatlerCenter.org* * or contact Pat Keyes at 716-888-4526 or **PKeyes at StatlerCenter.org* ** ** ** ** ** *Disabled Veterans Eligible for Statler Training* The National Statler Center has been approved by the *United States Department of Veterans Affairs* to provide employment training and placement services for disabled. With full support from Veterans Affairs, Statler encourages all disabled veterans to contact Jeff at Statler to discuss enrollment. Reach Mr. Hirschfelt at 716-888-4631 or jhirschfelt at StatlerCenter.org And please spread this word to the disabled veterans you know.**** **** * ***** * ***** Support for Statler comes through ACCES-VR, Arlene Reuss Memorial Trust, August Galasso Foundation, Balbach Foundation, Bannerot-Lappe Foundation, The Bauer Family Foundation, CBVH, The Hearst Foundation, Conrad N. Hilton Foundation, The Henry Niles Foundation, Herb and Aaron Siegel Family Foundation, Lavelle Fund for the Blind, May and Stanley Smith Charitable Foundation, Reader’s Digest Partners for Sight Foundation, The Statler Foundation.**** **** * ***** *To opt out of the newsletter click this link* newsletter at StatlerCenter.org* *** *CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE*: This e-mail and attachments, if any, may contain confidential information which is privileged and protected from disclosure by Federal and State confidentiality laws, rules or regulations. This e-mail and attachments, if any, are intended for the designated addressee only. If you are not the designated addressee, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, or distribution of this e-mail and its attachments, if any, may be unlawful and may subject you to legal consequences. If you have received this e-mail and its attachments in error, please contact the Statler Center (716) 882-5690 and delete the e-mail and its attachments from your computer. Thank you**** ** ** ** ** ** ** ** ** ** ** ** ** ** ** -- *Deb's Cell: 520-225-8244* -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image001.png Type: image/png Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image004.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 6931 bytes Desc: not available URL: From sweetpeareader at gmail.com Thu Mar 7 00:06:06 2013 From: sweetpeareader at gmail.com (Sophie Trist) Date: Wed, 06 Mar 2013 18:06:06 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] huge bookshare issue Message-ID: <5137da16.0349ec0a.5e49.447f@mx.google.com> Today in class, I accidentally deleted from my braillenote the book we're reading for class. So I went on Bookshare and downloaded it again with no problem. However, when I tried to open it, the book was blank. There was no text at all in the BRF file. I tried downloading another book, just to see if it worked, and it did. The text ppeared just like normal. So then I tried my school book again, and it was blank again. I am at a complete loss. It is not feasible for me to download the Bookshare book on a laptop at this time, and I don't own a victor stream or anything like that. Any help you guys give me would be MAJORLY appreciated since I need this book, like, ASAP. From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Thu Mar 7 00:14:09 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2013 19:14:09 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] huge bookshare issue In-Reply-To: <5137da16.0349ec0a.5e49.447f@mx.google.com> References: <5137da16.0349ec0a.5e49.447f@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <799F30C7FFCD42BDB4B5315B380AE86E@OwnerPC> Hi, it sounds like an error in that book then; maybe they did not code it right for a brf format or something like that. I think you'll need to call their tech support. -----Original Message----- From: Sophie Trist Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2013 7:06 PM To: nabs Subject: [nabs-l] huge bookshare issue Today in class, I accidentally deleted from my braillenote the book we're reading for class. So I went on Bookshare and downloaded it again with no problem. However, when I tried to open it, the book was blank. There was no text at all in the BRF file. I tried downloading another book, just to see if it worked, and it did. The text ppeared just like normal. So then I tried my school book again, and it was blank again. I am at a complete loss. It is not feasible for me to download the Bookshare book on a laptop at this time, and I don't own a victor stream or anything like that. Any help you guys give me would be MAJORLY appreciated since I need this book, like, ASAP. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From hope.paulos at gmail.com Thu Mar 7 00:19:59 2013 From: hope.paulos at gmail.com (Hope Paulos) Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2013 19:19:59 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] huge bookshare issue In-Reply-To: <5137da16.0349ec0a.5e49.447f@mx.google.com> References: <5137da16.0349ec0a.5e49.447f@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <08E03D21-0A36-4F39-AEF1-D77BB3CA83DA@gmail.com> Try a warm reset of BN and if that doesn't work download again. Just my thoughts. Sent from my iPhone On Mar 6, 2013, at 7:06 PM, Sophie Trist wrote: > Today in class, I accidentally deleted from my braillenote the book we're reading for class. So I went on Bookshare and downloaded it again with no problem. However, when I tried to open it, the book was blank. There was no text at all in the BRF file. I tried downloading another book, just to see if it worked, and it did. The text ppeared just like normal. So then I tried my school book again, and it was blank again. I am at a complete loss. It is not feasible for me to download the Bookshare book on a laptop at this time, and I don't own a victor stream or anything like that. Any help you guys give me would be MAJORLY appreciated since I need this book, like, ASAP. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40gmail.com From kwakmiso at aol.com Thu Mar 7 01:47:25 2013 From: kwakmiso at aol.com (Miso Kwak) Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2013 20:47:25 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nabs-l] College Dining Hall In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8CFE8ECD9EE70FF-D50-A667@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com> This may seem like an insignificant question, but it just came to my attention recently. I have been visiting a few college campuses recently and realized that many of the dining halls utilize all-you-can-eat service. If that's the case and the dining hall is buffet style, how do you navigate around and get food? Do you always have someone to help you? Miso From kwakmiso at aol.com Thu Mar 7 01:52:47 2013 From: kwakmiso at aol.com (Miso Kwak) Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2013 20:52:47 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nabs-l] College Dining Hall In-Reply-To: <8CFE8ECD9EE70FF-D50-A667@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CFE8ECD9EE70FF-D50-A667@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <8CFE8ED9A2D3EA5-D50-A6F6@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com> After hitting the send button, I realized that this e-mail went out to more than NABS listserve. Anyone replying, could you make sure that the e-mail stays within the list please? I apologize for my mistake and any consequential inconvinience. Miso Kwak -----Original Message----- From: Miso Kwak To: nabs-l ; NLDippold ; acb-l ; azcb-chat Sent: Wed, Mar 6, 2013 5:48 pm Subject: [nabs-l] College Dining Hall This may seem like an insignificant question, but it just came to my attention recently. I have been visiting a few college campuses recently and realized that many of the dining halls utilize all-you-can-eat service. If that's the case and the dining hall is buffet style, how do you navigate around and get food? Do you always have someone to help you? Miso _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kwakmiso%40aol.com From zdreicer at gmail.com Thu Mar 7 01:52:56 2013 From: zdreicer at gmail.com (Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer) Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2013 18:52:56 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] College Dining Hall In-Reply-To: <8CFE8ECD9EE70FF-D50-A667@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CFE8ECD9EE70FF-D50-A667@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <1E10A746BFEF4459BE7883FD98B6A06A@ZachlaptopPC> Hi, I just asked that question of a friend who is teaching me some things like that, and she said that she would ask for assistance in a situation like this. I am in the exact situation, and one of my sighted friends is helping me through it every day. I will forward her your email and perhaps she will explain it better than me. Sent from my Acer Aspire As5733 -----Original Message----- From: Miso Kwak Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2013 6:47 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org ; NLDippold at aol.com ; acb-l at acb.org ; azcb-chat at yahoogroups.com Subject: [nabs-l] College Dining Hall This may seem like an insignificant question, but it just came to my attention recently. I have been visiting a few college campuses recently and realized that many of the dining halls utilize all-you-can-eat service. If that's the case and the dining hall is buffet style, how do you navigate around and get food? Do you always have someone to help you? Miso _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail.com From ptrck.molloy at gmail.com Thu Mar 7 02:04:58 2013 From: ptrck.molloy at gmail.com (Patrick Molloy) Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2013 21:04:58 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] College Dining Hall In-Reply-To: <1E10A746BFEF4459BE7883FD98B6A06A@ZachlaptopPC> References: <8CFE8ECD9EE70FF-D50-A667@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com> <1E10A746BFEF4459BE7883FD98B6A06A@ZachlaptopPC> Message-ID: I think you have a couple of options here. First, you can try the dining hall on your own if you feel you can do it. If that doesn't work, then ask a friend for help. Third, ask the people working at your dining hall for a hand if you go during a slower time. See what you can do ahead of time to make your life easier: Check menus online if possible and know generally what you want. Also, try and avoid going at prime lunch/dinner times (12 noon and 6:00.) Often these times draw the most crowds, thus making it very difficult to navigate, whether blind or sighted. So, if you can eat at off hours, that will make things easier. Finally, realize that what works for some people may not work for you. If your college has a huge dining hall that's difficult to get around, then there's no shame in getting help. You may start out by having someone help you, but have them gradually back off as you become more and more familiar with the layout and the setup. Out of curiosity, do you have a certain school in mind? If so, then you can start a dialog with the dining services people and see if they can be of any help to you. Patrick On 3/6/13, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer wrote: > Hi, I just asked that question of a friend who is teaching me some things > like that, and she said that she would ask for assistance in a situation > like this. I am in the exact situation, and one of my sighted friends is > helping me through it every day. I will forward her your email and perhaps > she will explain it better than me. > > > > Sent from my Acer Aspire As5733 > -----Original Message----- > From: Miso Kwak > Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2013 6:47 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org ; NLDippold at aol.com ; acb-l at acb.org ; > azcb-chat at yahoogroups.com > Subject: [nabs-l] College Dining Hall > > This may seem like an insignificant question, but it just came to my > attention recently. > I have been visiting a few college campuses recently and realized that > many of the dining halls utilize all-you-can-eat service. > If that's the case and the dining hall is buffet style, how do you > navigate around and get food? Do you always have someone to help you? > Miso > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ptrck.molloy%40gmail.com > From kwakmiso at aol.com Thu Mar 7 02:20:23 2013 From: kwakmiso at aol.com (Miso Kwak) Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2013 21:20:23 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nabs-l] College Dining Hall In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8CFE8F1752697E5-D50-A958@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com> Thank you for the reply. I have no idea. I am still waiting to hear back from many of my schools. I have no doubt I will be fine once I enroll in college wherever that may be. I just wondered about it because buffet style seemed to be the case for the most of colleges. Miso From rosz1878 at fredonia.edu Thu Mar 7 02:27:18 2013 From: rosz1878 at fredonia.edu (Lisa E Roszyk) Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2013 21:27:18 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] College Dining Hall In-Reply-To: <8CFE8F1752697E5-D50-A958@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CFE8F1752697E5-D50-A958@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: in my experince making nive wiht lunch ladies does the trick any time i go into a dining hall on my campus and need help there is always at least one cook willing to walk around the buffet with me or if i dont feel like having help i simply sniff and try to figure it out from there theres also this peive of eqpuiment i forget what it is called but you hold it up to a sign and it reads whats on it for you so if you can go around and have the dining hall marked with where the sign s are i think that can help or you know there always the back up way of just asking the person next to you in line whats in front of you i hope this was helpful if not simply disregard On Wed, Mar 6, 2013 at 9:20 PM, Miso Kwak wrote: > Thank you for the reply. > I have no idea. I am still waiting to hear back from many of my schools. > I have no doubt I will be fine once I enroll in college wherever that may > be. > I just wondered about it because buffet style seemed to be the case for > the most of colleges. > > Miso > > > > ______________________________**_________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/** > rosz1878%40fredonia.edu > From arielle71 at gmail.com Thu Mar 7 03:17:35 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2013 20:17:35 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] College Dining Hall In-Reply-To: References: <8CFE8F1752697E5-D50-A958@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: I agree with the idea of walking around the dining hall by yourself first, at a slow time, to see what the layout is like. You might find there are a couple of counters that have most of the food you like and then you can memorize where those counters are and get to know the people who work them. Also sometimes parts of the dining hall are cafeteria-style so you can order what you want and have it served to you on a tray. If it is a true buffet, meaning you have to find and serve the food yourself, then either getting help from an employee or asking for information from the person in front of you in line are both good options. I know when I was in college, I opted out of buffets completely and would get most of my food either at a food court at the student union (which was cafeteria-style service places like Chic Filet and Einstein Bagels) or I would buy microwave meals and snacks to keep in my dorm. This wasn't really because of blindness ,just personal preference (plus I'm a small eater so all-you-can-eat isn't usually cost-effective for me :). But your school may have some non-buffet options that are also less crowded and might even have better-quality food. Arielle On 3/6/13, Lisa E Roszyk wrote: > in my experince making nive wiht lunch ladies does the trick any time i go > into a dining hall on my campus and need help there is always at least one > cook willing to walk around the buffet with me or if i dont feel like > having help i simply sniff and try to figure it out from there theres also > this peive of eqpuiment i forget what it is called but you hold it up to a > sign and it reads whats on it for you so if you can go around and have the > dining hall marked with where the sign s are i think that can help or you > know there always the back up way of just asking the person next to you in > line whats in front of you i hope this was helpful if not simply disregard > > On Wed, Mar 6, 2013 at 9:20 PM, Miso Kwak wrote: > >> Thank you for the reply. >> I have no idea. I am still waiting to hear back from many of my schools. >> I have no doubt I will be fine once I enroll in college wherever that may >> be. >> I just wondered about it because buffet style seemed to be the case for >> the most of colleges. >> >> Miso >> >> >> >> ______________________________**_________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/** >> rosz1878%40fredonia.edu >> > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From k7uij at panix.com Thu Mar 7 03:28:47 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2013 19:28:47 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] huge bookshare issue In-Reply-To: <5137da16.0349ec0a.5e49.447f@mx.google.com> References: <5137da16.0349ec0a.5e49.447f@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <00cb01ce1ae3$e1a4dee0$a4ee9ca0$@panix.com> Tell me the book and I'll see if I can download the .BRF version. Mike Freeman -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Sophie Trist Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2013 4:06 PM To: nabs Subject: [nabs-l] huge bookshare issue Today in class, I accidentally deleted from my braillenote the book we're reading for class. So I went on Bookshare and downloaded it again with no problem. However, when I tried to open it, the book was blank. There was no text at all in the BRF file. I tried downloading another book, just to see if it worked, and it did. The text ppeared just like normal. So then I tried my school book again, and it was blank again. I am at a complete loss. It is not feasible for me to download the Bookshare book on a laptop at this time, and I don't own a victor stream or anything like that. Any help you guys give me would be MAJORLY appreciated since I need this book, like, ASAP. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Thu Mar 7 04:07:39 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2013 23:07:39 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] College Dining Hall In-Reply-To: References: <8CFE8F1752697E5-D50-A958@webmail-d054.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: Hi Miso, I very much so agree with what has been said. The dining hall isn't that bad, but it might be best to figure it out for the specific dining halls of the school you end up choosing to attend. A good idea that I used was to make a point of having my Orientation and Mobility Specialist help me get oriented at least to the main cafeteria my school has. We worked in the weeks leading up to the fall semester,, and it was great because only a handful of summer students were on campus. I was able to go in and walk around the cafeteria with my O&M teacher describing what was on the right and left of me as I went. It was easier than I had thought since our food area is set up with a round salad and soup bar in the middle and a horseshoe-shaped path going around it. On the outside of the horseshoe are the windows to order from the pizza place, the sweet shop, the pasta bar, grill, etc. There are little areas for drinks and stuff off of the main horseshoe, but they're pretty easy to find. Most cafeterias I've seen have been set up in a logical way of some sort like that. I was able to learn exactly where everything is, even around the salad bar. eEven though that part of the cafeteria is buffet style, I was able to learn exactly where to go for soup, salad stuff, fruit, etc and can usually get what I need independently. However, from time to time I'll ask an employee or even someone next to me if I'm in the right spot for fruit, or I'll check to make sure what's in front of me is what I really want before I get it. I always check the menu online so I can know exactly which window I'll be going to for lunch and dinner, or if I'll want to go to any of the other dining halls to buy something specific that the other ones aren't serving that day. I try to steer clear of the big crouds; I try to eat breakfast before 9:00, lunch around 11:00 or after 1:30, and dinner right when I get out of class at 4:15 to beat the rush. And, like Arielle, sometimes I opt not to have lunch or dinner in the dining hall at all depending on what they're serving or my schedule. Even though we're ala carte at my university, the portion sizes are sometimes way too big for me to handle, especially with heavy foods such as pasta. I always keep some microwavable soups, crackers, and other staples in my room in case I'd rather make something myself. Other times, when I only have a half hour to eat dinner, I'll go through the cafeteria earlier in the day and grab some vegetables, a sandwitch, a drink, and a snack, and take it in a lunch box so I can eat dinner between classes. But when I'm in the dining halls and need help or clarification on something I don't hesitate to ask if someone can read something for me or tell me what I'm about to do. I've made some good connections with the dining staff so they have been able to accomodate for me when necessary (they know to ask me what kind of pizza I want instead of making me fill out an order slip, and the cashiers usually will tell me how much I spent or what my remaining meal plan balance is since I can't read the numbers that show up on a screen). Generally, I've found that both employees and students will be really willing to help with little things like that. On 3/6/13, Arielle Silverman wrote: > I agree with the idea of walking around the dining hall by yourself > first, at a slow time, to see what the layout is like. You might find > there are a couple of counters that have most of the food you like and > then you can memorize where those counters are and get to know the > people who work them. Also sometimes parts of the dining hall are > cafeteria-style so you can order what you want and have it served to > you on a tray. If it is a true buffet, meaning you have to find and > serve the food yourself, then either getting help from an employee or > asking for information from the person in front of you in line are > both good options. I know when I was in college, I opted out of > buffets completely and would get most of my food either at a food > court at the student union (which was cafeteria-style service places > like Chic Filet and Einstein Bagels) or I would buy microwave meals > and snacks to keep in my dorm. This wasn't really because of blindness > ,just personal preference (plus I'm a small eater so all-you-can-eat > isn't usually cost-effective for me :). But your school may have some > non-buffet options that are also less crowded and might even have > better-quality food. > Arielle > > On 3/6/13, Lisa E Roszyk wrote: >> in my experince making nive wiht lunch ladies does the trick any time i >> go >> into a dining hall on my campus and need help there is always at least >> one >> cook willing to walk around the buffet with me or if i dont feel like >> having help i simply sniff and try to figure it out from there theres >> also >> this peive of eqpuiment i forget what it is called but you hold it up to >> a >> sign and it reads whats on it for you so if you can go around and have >> the >> dining hall marked with where the sign s are i think that can help or you >> know there always the back up way of just asking the person next to you >> in >> line whats in front of you i hope this was helpful if not simply >> disregard >> >> On Wed, Mar 6, 2013 at 9:20 PM, Miso Kwak wrote: >> >>> Thank you for the reply. >>> I have no idea. I am still waiting to hear back from many of my schools. >>> I have no doubt I will be fine once I enroll in college wherever that >>> may >>> be. >>> I just wondered about it because buffet style seemed to be the case for >>> the most of colleges. >>> >>> Miso >>> >>> >>> >>> ______________________________**_________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/**options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/** >>> rosz1878%40fredonia.edu >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From sweetpeareader at gmail.com Thu Mar 7 12:34:14 2013 From: sweetpeareader at gmail.com (Sophie Trist) Date: Thu, 07 Mar 2013 06:34:14 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] huge bookshare issue Message-ID: <5138896f.6259ec0a.4cdb.629e@mx.google.com> It's Absalom, Absalom by William Faulkner. Has anyone else had this problem before? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Freeman" http://securus.co.in/zi/drdujnyelwzolik/zcxqruzqsrfdf/kgoyxbkvvvjwnnh Anmol Bhatia From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Thu Mar 7 18:26:02 2013 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Thu, 7 Mar 2013 10:26:02 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: North Carolina EYE Retreat announcement In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: >From North Carolina: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: "Alan A. Chase" Date: Mon, 4 Mar 2013 21:52:29 -0500 Subject: North Carolina EYE Retreat announcement To: dsmithnfb at gmail.com The North Carolina Association of Blind Students and Governor Morehead School Alumni Association is sponsoring the 5th annual Envisioning Youth Empowerment Retreat (EYE Retreat). The EYE Retreat is a weeklong summer camp for high school and college students with visual impairments to learn about college and career transition skills. The 2013 EYE Retreat is scheduled for Monday, July 29 to Saturday, August 3 on the campus of The Governor Morehead School for the Blind and North Carolina State University. The EYE Retreat provides all food and housing for the week. Participants are only responsible for the cost of transportation to and from Raleigh. In previous years, the EYE Retreat has had participants come from California, Connecticut, Delaware, Georgia, South Carolina, Virginia, and all over North Carolina. Only 30 slots are available on a first come first serve basis. The EYE Retreat curriculum is based on research that indicates what skills and activities help make college and career transitions most successful for students with disabilities. Each year group leaders who are current college students or employed youth are selected to serve as group leaders to mentor and support participants through the weeklong retreat. The EYE Retreat is based on three main principles include 1) real world applications, 2) mentoring, and 3) identifying available resources. Please visit our website at www.eyeretreat.edublogs.com or facebook page at http://www.facebook.com/#!/pages/Envisioning-Youth-Empowerment-Retreat/224500254258888 for more information. The application is attached. -- *Alan A. Chase, M.Ed.* Occupational Course of Study Teacher, New Hanover County Schools Program Coordinator, Envisioning Youth Empowerment Retreat President, North Carolina Association of Blind Students Secretary, Governor Morehead School Alumni Association -- Darian Smith Text the word BLIND to 85944 to donate $10 to the NFB Imagination Fund via your phone bill. The time is now to eliminate Subminimum Wages for People with Disabilities http://www.nfb.org/fairwages “We know not of our future, but we know of our past. A past that is made up of our ancestor’s Dreams, their stories and hopes. These sights once seen, sounds heard and emotions felt are now our knowledge. The knowledge that guides us to this very moment…” -Darian Smith -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Application 2013.doc Type: application/msword Size: 99328 bytes Desc: not available URL: From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Thu Mar 7 18:34:58 2013 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Thu, 7 Mar 2013 10:34:58 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: All About Chemistry Camp! A Call Presented by the California Association of Blind Students In-Reply-To: References: <4A57705573644F81B3ACF706E525DD73@HenryPC> Message-ID: Greetings, The following comes from California, and is open to both high school students and their parents. Please forward to those you feel may benifit. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Hoby Wedler Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2013 14:05:14 -0800 Subject: All About Chemistry Camp! A Call Presented by the California Association of Blind Students To: Darian Smith Have you ever wondered how you, your blind or visually impaired (BVI) child, or your student could tackle very visual science subjects in school? Have you wondered if there are accessible means of exploring science in the laboratory for BVI students? Then our fire side discussion about the California chemistry camp is for you! Chemistry camp is a program hosted by Accessible Science, a nonprofit working to make science more accessible to BVI students. The camp is sure to be an educational, exciting, academic and social meeting from May 3-5, 2013 near Napa, California. The discussion will include an overview of camp by founder and coordinator Hoby Wedler, discussion on filling out the application and applying for camp, information on time and place of camp and camp logistics, and perhaps most importantly, it will include testimonials from past mentors, instructors, and student alum! There will be plenty of time for your questions and comments throughout the call. If you want more information on how blind students can study extremely visual subjects or want information on talking constructively with people who tell you that you can’t study visual subjects, this call is sure to answer some of your questions about accessibility and most importantly, about how you or a BVI high school student you know can easily partake in the 2013 chemistry camp. When: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 from 6:00-7:00 PM Pacific time Where: Call (218) 339-2500 Access code: 958093. We hope to chat with you on March 12! Yours very truly, The Membership Committee of the California Association of Blind Students -- Darian Smith Text the word BLIND to 85944 to donate $10 to the NFB Imagination Fund via your phone bill. The time is now to eliminate Subminimum Wages for People with Disabilities http://www.nfb.org/fairwages “We know not of our future, but we know of our past. A past that is made up of our ancestor’s Dreams, their stories and hopes. These sights once seen, sounds heard and emotions felt are now our knowledge. The knowledge that guides us to this very moment…” -Darian Smith -- Darian Smith Text the word BLIND to 85944 to donate $10 to the NFB Imagination Fund via your phone bill. The time is now to eliminate Subminimum Wages for People with Disabilities http://www.nfb.org/fairwages “We know not of our future, but we know of our past. A past that is made up of our ancestor’s Dreams, their stories and hopes. These sights once seen, sounds heard and emotions felt are now our knowledge. The knowledge that guides us to this very moment…” -Darian Smith From jsoro620 at gmail.com Thu Mar 7 23:22:11 2013 From: jsoro620 at gmail.com (Joe) Date: Thu, 7 Mar 2013 18:22:11 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Complete A Survey, Maybe Win an iPad Mini Message-ID: <01d601ce1b8a$98cd20e0$ca6762a0$@gmail.com> Hi, I thought a lot of you would be interested in sharing your thoughts on popular technology while simultaneously entering to win an iPad Mini. For all the detes, check out the link: Serotek Consumer Tech Survey http://www.serotek.com/survey From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 7 04:46:39 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2013 23:46:39 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings Message-ID: <003601ce1aee$c2b036f0$4810a4d0$@gmail.com> Hello, my name is Justin Williams, and I am in school for the Master's of Rehabilitation counseling degree with the intent to obtain my Lpc, then my PHd right afterwards. From Zunaira.Wasif at dbs.fldoe.org Fri Mar 8 13:04:07 2013 From: Zunaira.Wasif at dbs.fldoe.org (Wasif, Zunaira) Date: Fri, 8 Mar 2013 08:04:07 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings In-Reply-To: <003601ce1aee$c2b036f0$4810a4d0$@gmail.com> References: <003601ce1aee$c2b036f0$4810a4d0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE22C@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> I am a counselor in the field and have one more class to complete in order to obtain my masters. Let me know if you have questions. You can email me off list at Zunaira.wasif at dbs.fldoe.org -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2013 11:47 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings Hello, my name is Justin Williams, and I am in school for the Master's of Rehabilitation counseling degree with the intent to obtain my Lpc, then my PHd right afterwards. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. fldoe.org From gloria.graves at gmail.com Fri Mar 8 15:22:50 2013 From: gloria.graves at gmail.com (Gloria G) Date: Fri, 8 Mar 2013 09:22:50 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Recording on the I-phone Message-ID: <98DB47DD187E41FEB23A55CA841A63E9@Gloria> Hello all, I was wondering if someone could give me directions as to how to go about only doing a voice recording on the I-phone? Is it difficult? I would also have to turn this into a MP3 file, so how might I do that. Any help is appreciated. Thanks! Gloria From joshkart12 at gmail.com Fri Mar 8 15:31:12 2013 From: joshkart12 at gmail.com (Josh Gregory) Date: Fri, 8 Mar 2013 10:31:12 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Recording on the I-phone In-Reply-To: <98DB47DD187E41FEB23A55CA841A63E9@Gloria> References: <98DB47DD187E41FEB23A55CA841A63E9@Gloria> Message-ID: <7102002C-CF6C-41AC-9662-EB111C589313@gmail.com> You could just use the built in voice memos application in the iPhone, and then just convert the recording to MP3 in iTunes. If you would like help with this, feel free to email me off list. Sent from my iPhone On Mar 8, 2013, at 10:22 AM, "Gloria G" wrote: > Hello all, > I was wondering if someone could give me directions as to how to go about only doing a voice recording on the I-phone? Is it difficult? I would also have to turn this into a MP3 file, so how might I do that. Any help is appreciated. Thanks! > Gloria > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Fri Mar 8 15:39:15 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Fri, 8 Mar 2013 10:39:15 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Recording on the I-phone In-Reply-To: <7102002C-CF6C-41AC-9662-EB111C589313@gmail.com> References: <98DB47DD187E41FEB23A55CA841A63E9@Gloria> <7102002C-CF6C-41AC-9662-EB111C589313@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, Using the IPhone to record voice is not that difficult at all. Just go into the voice memos app, hit the record button (in the bottom left-hand corner of the screen. If your phone is not muted you will hear a little ding to indicate that you're recordinng. When you want to stop recording, hit the stop button, (In the bottom right-hand corner of the screen. Again, you should hear a little ding to let you know the recording has stopped assuming the phone is not muted. To view this recording in a list of recordings hit the stop button when the phone is not being used to record. It will bring up all your recordings, with the one you most recently made at the top of the list. You can scroll through the list of recordings, double tap to hear them. Below the list is the little progress bar which you can use to rewind or fastforward through a recording. Below that on the left is a share button, which you can use to send the recording to yourself through email to download it onto a computer. On the right of that button is the delete button. Going back to share, if you send it to yourself through email you can download the file and use a file conversion tool to convert the m4a file to mp3. Hope this helps. On 3/8/13, Josh Gregory wrote: > You could just use the built in voice memos application in the iPhone, and > then just convert the recording to MP3 in iTunes. If you would like help > with this, feel free to email me off list. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 8, 2013, at 10:22 AM, "Gloria G" wrote: > >> Hello all, >> I was wondering if someone could give me directions as to how to go about >> only doing a voice recording on the I-phone? Is it difficult? I would also >> have to turn this into a MP3 file, so how might I do that. Any help is >> appreciated. Thanks! >> Gloria >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From gloria.graves at gmail.com Fri Mar 8 15:58:34 2013 From: gloria.graves at gmail.com (Gloria G) Date: Fri, 8 Mar 2013 09:58:34 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Recording on the I-phone References: <98DB47DD187E41FEB23A55CA841A63E9@Gloria><7102002C-CF6C-41AC-9662-EB111C589313@gmail.com> Message-ID: <87CA9FFFB57F4F07BE27CCB351EC01FE@Gloria> Thank you very much! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kaiti Shelton" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Friday, March 08, 2013 9:39 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Recording on the I-phone > Hi, > > Using the IPhone to record voice is not that difficult at all. Just > go into the voice memos app, hit the record button (in the bottom > left-hand corner of the screen. If your phone is not muted you will > hear a little ding to indicate that you're recordinng. When you want > to stop recording, hit the stop button, (In the bottom right-hand > corner of the screen. Again, you should hear a little ding to let you > know the recording has stopped assuming the phone is not muted. To > view this recording in a list of recordings hit the stop button when > the phone is not being used to record. It will bring up all your > recordings, with the one you most recently made at the top of the > list. > > You can scroll through the list of recordings, double tap to hear > them. Below the list is the little progress bar which you can use to > rewind or fastforward through a recording. Below that on the left is > a share button, which you can use to send the recording to yourself > through email to download it onto a computer. On the right of that > button is the delete button. > > Going back to share, if you send it to yourself through email you can > download the file and use a file conversion tool to convert the m4a > file to mp3. Hope this helps. > > On 3/8/13, Josh Gregory wrote: >> You could just use the built in voice memos application in the iPhone, >> and >> then just convert the recording to MP3 in iTunes. If you would like help >> with this, feel free to email me off list. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 8, 2013, at 10:22 AM, "Gloria G" wrote: >> >>> Hello all, >>> I was wondering if someone could give me directions as to how to go >>> about >>> only doing a voice recording on the I-phone? Is it difficult? I would >>> also >>> have to turn this into a MP3 file, so how might I do that. Any help is >>> appreciated. Thanks! >>> Gloria >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gmail.com From gloria.graves at gmail.com Fri Mar 8 16:01:16 2013 From: gloria.graves at gmail.com (Gloria G) Date: Fri, 8 Mar 2013 10:01:16 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Recording on the I-phone References: <98DB47DD187E41FEB23A55CA841A63E9@Gloria> <7102002C-CF6C-41AC-9662-EB111C589313@gmail.com> Message-ID: <345B005DC6E945DB8B7E933CFE5267BF@Gloria> Thank you very much! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Josh Gregory" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Friday, March 08, 2013 9:31 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Recording on the I-phone > You could just use the built in voice memos application in the iPhone, and > then just convert the recording to MP3 in iTunes. If you would like help > with this, feel free to email me off list. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 8, 2013, at 10:22 AM, "Gloria G" wrote: > >> Hello all, >> I was wondering if someone could give me directions as to how to go about >> only doing a voice recording on the I-phone? Is it difficult? I would >> also have to turn this into a MP3 file, so how might I do that. Any help >> is appreciated. Thanks! >> Gloria >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gmail.com From herekittykat2 at gmail.com Fri Mar 8 22:20:17 2013 From: herekittykat2 at gmail.com (Jewel) Date: Fri, 8 Mar 2013 17:20:17 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Recording on the I-phone In-Reply-To: <345B005DC6E945DB8B7E933CFE5267BF@Gloria> References: <98DB47DD187E41FEB23A55CA841A63E9@Gloria> <7102002C-CF6C-41AC-9662-EB111C589313@gmail.com> <345B005DC6E945DB8B7E933CFE5267BF@Gloria> Message-ID: <7404DA82-0D31-441F-AF60-B12333E9D05C@gmail.com> Sent from my iPhone On Mar 8, 2013, at 11:01 AM, "Gloria G" wrote: > Thank you very much! > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Josh Gregory" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > Sent: Friday, March 08, 2013 9:31 AM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Recording on the I-phone > > >> You could just use the built in voice memos application in the iPhone, and then just convert the recording to MP3 in iTunes. If you would like help with this, feel free to email me off list. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 8, 2013, at 10:22 AM, "Gloria G" wrote: >> >>> Hello all, >>> I was wondering if someone could give me directions as to how to go about only doing a voice recording on the I-phone? Is it difficult? I would also have to turn this into a MP3 file, so how might I do that. Any help is appreciated. Thanks! >>> Gloria >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat2%40gmail.comAnother way to record on the iPhone if you have Dropbox is through the app Dropvox. With this app, it is just as simple as the other mentioned. You press the start recording button when you want to record, then press the stop recording button when you are done. The difference is that as soon as you stop recording, it will start uploading the recording to Dropbox. Then you can access that recording from any computer you have downloaded Dropbox on. From arielle71 at gmail.com Sat Mar 9 17:23:45 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Sat, 9 Mar 2013 10:23:45 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings In-Reply-To: <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE22C@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> References: <003601ce1aee$c2b036f0$4810a4d0$@gmail.com> <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE22C@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> Message-ID: Hi Justin, Welcome to the list. After your master's, what field are you hoping to get your Ph.D. in? Rehabilitation counseling or research? Are you more interested in the counseling side or the research side? I'm asking because I'm doing my Ph.D. in social psychology hoping to become a research professor who focuses on blindness-related social issues, especially those relating to education and rehabilitation. It is always nice to meet someone else who is interested in similar research topics. My field is a bit different from yours but I'm still available to answer questions about the basic Ph.D. process. Arielle On 3/8/13, Wasif, Zunaira wrote: > I am a counselor in the field and have one more class to complete in > order to obtain my masters. Let me know if you have questions. You can > email me off list at Zunaira.wasif at dbs.fldoe.org > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin > williams > Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2013 11:47 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings > > Hello, my name is Justin Williams, and I am in school for the Master's > of Rehabilitation counseling degree with the intent to obtain my Lpc, > then my PHd right afterwards. > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. > fldoe.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From dandrews at visi.com Sat Mar 9 18:10:01 2013 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Sat, 09 Mar 2013 12:10:01 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: Victor Reader Stream VRS2 Message-ID: > >Executive Products has designed the NEW Victor >Reader Stream 2 (VRS2) and its now available on our website. >Please click on the link below > >https://www.executiveproductsinc.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=1944 > >Protect your unit .. Buy an EPI case. > >Executive Products Inc. > >12900 Bradley Ave. >Sylmar Ca. 91342. >Fax: 818-833-5890 >Office: 818-833-8080 > >www.ExecutiveProductsinc.com From rbacchus228 at gmail.com Sat Mar 9 18:36:05 2013 From: rbacchus228 at gmail.com (Roanna Baccchus) Date: Sat, 09 Mar 2013 13:36:05 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Re- Greetings Message-ID: <513b811b.4544ec0a.0c9e.2c96@mx.google.com> Hi Justin welcome to the list. I am a second-year college student. I home you enjoy the list. From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Sat Mar 9 19:05:07 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Sat, 9 Mar 2013 14:05:07 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Happy Spring Break In-Reply-To: <5130ef64.27b3ec0a.5d25.ffffc3db@mx.google.com> References: <5130ef64.27b3ec0a.5d25.ffffc3db@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <7FBEB3E5AAC04012A11BCC91FB43A8D7@OwnerPC> My spring break starts March 11. So Roanna, yours was earlier. I hope you enjoyed yours. On my break I'm doing some reading for school, but do not have to study as we are at a stopping point in both my classes and I had a midterm before break in one. Other than that, I'm relaxing, reading some books I've wanted to read for a while, going to a concert, and hanging out with a few friends, probably will bowl with them. For anyone else on break, enjoy. -----Original Message----- From: Roanna Baccchus Sent: Friday, March 01, 2013 1:10 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] Happy Spring Break Hi everyone I hope you are well. Welcome to the month of March. I can't believe it's almost Spring. I wic you all a safe and happy Spring Break. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From dsmithnfb at gmail.com Sun Mar 10 00:05:51 2013 From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith) Date: Sat, 9 Mar 2013 16:05:51 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: FW: Job Opportunity In-Reply-To: <008f01ce1cfd$7cd2daa0$76788fe0$@gmail.com> References: <090DE19460C85C459C8D2B0D00F74D22B72702@MS3.wsifb-domain.com> <008f01ce1cfd$7cd2daa0$76788fe0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: nabs.president at gmail.com Date: Sat, 9 Mar 2013 14:36:56 -0500 Subject: FW: Job Opportunity To: Darian Smith From: Laura True [mailto:ltrue at wsifb.com] Sent: Monday, March 04, 2013 1:27 PM Subject: Job Opportunity Good afternoon! Please see attached announcement. We are currently hiring 15+ visually impaired/blind candidates in El Paso, TX. WSIFB is willing to negotiate relocation for qualified candidates. Please contact me and/or send me the resume's of any candidates you may have interested in this position. Thank you so much for your time! Laura True Recruiting Specialist/Human Resources Winston Salem Industries for the Blind Ltrue at wsifb.com 336-245-5653 (Office) Please visit us at http://www.wsifb.com/ -- Darian Smith Text the word BLIND to 85944 to donate $10 to the NFB Imagination Fund via your phone bill. The time is now to eliminate Subminimum Wages for People with Disabilities http://www.nfb.org/fairwages “We know not of our future, but we know of our past. A past that is made up of our ancestor’s Dreams, their stories and hopes. These sights once seen, sounds heard and emotions felt are now our knowledge. The knowledge that guides us to this very moment…” -Darian Smith -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: USCIS CSR Job Announcement - El Paso 02.25.13.docx Type: application/vnd.openxmlformats-officedocument.wordprocessingml.document Size: 15843 bytes Desc: not available URL: From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Sat Mar 9 03:00:30 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Fri, 8 Mar 2013 22:00:30 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Happy Spring Break In-Reply-To: <7FBEB3E5AAC04012A11BCC91FB43A8D7@OwnerPC> References: <5130ef64.27b3ec0a.5d25.ffffc3db@mx.google.com> <7FBEB3E5AAC04012A11BCC91FB43A8D7@OwnerPC> Message-ID: <008e01ce1c72$42f7d230$c8e77690$@gmail.com> I'm on brake. I will enjoy. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley Bramlett Sent: Saturday, March 09, 2013 2:05 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Happy Spring Break My spring break starts March 11. So Roanna, yours was earlier. I hope you enjoyed yours. On my break I'm doing some reading for school, but do not have to study as we are at a stopping point in both my classes and I had a midterm before break in one. Other than that, I'm relaxing, reading some books I've wanted to read for a while, going to a concert, and hanging out with a few friends, probably will bowl with them. For anyone else on break, enjoy. -----Original Message----- From: Roanna Baccchus Sent: Friday, March 01, 2013 1:10 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] Happy Spring Break Hi everyone I hope you are well. Welcome to the month of March. I can't believe it's almost Spring. I wic you all a safe and happy Spring Break. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink. net _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Sat Mar 9 03:01:13 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Fri, 8 Mar 2013 22:01:13 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Happy Spring Break In-Reply-To: <7FBEB3E5AAC04012A11BCC91FB43A8D7@OwnerPC> References: <5130ef64.27b3ec0a.5d25.ffffc3db@mx.google.com> <7FBEB3E5AAC04012A11BCC91FB43A8D7@OwnerPC> Message-ID: <009001ce1c72$5c923be0$15b6b3a0$@gmail.com> Really, I plan to do a research paper to be brutally honest. No rest for the for me. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley Bramlett Sent: Saturday, March 09, 2013 2:05 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Happy Spring Break My spring break starts March 11. So Roanna, yours was earlier. I hope you enjoyed yours. On my break I'm doing some reading for school, but do not have to study as we are at a stopping point in both my classes and I had a midterm before break in one. Other than that, I'm relaxing, reading some books I've wanted to read for a while, going to a concert, and hanging out with a few friends, probably will bowl with them. For anyone else on break, enjoy. -----Original Message----- From: Roanna Baccchus Sent: Friday, March 01, 2013 1:10 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] Happy Spring Break Hi everyone I hope you are well. Welcome to the month of March. I can't believe it's almost Spring. I wic you all a safe and happy Spring Break. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink. net _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Sat Mar 9 03:01:30 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Fri, 8 Mar 2013 22:01:30 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Re- Greetings In-Reply-To: <513b811b.4544ec0a.0c9e.2c96@mx.google.com> References: <513b811b.4544ec0a.0c9e.2c96@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <009201ce1c72$66b5c100$34214300$@gmail.com> Certainly will. Thanks. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Roanna Baccchus Sent: Saturday, March 09, 2013 1:36 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] Re- Greetings Hi Justin welcome to the list. I am a second-year college student. I home you enjoy the list. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From blacklotus86 at gmail.com Sun Mar 10 22:51:34 2013 From: blacklotus86 at gmail.com (zeynep sule yilmaz) Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2013 17:51:34 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings In-Reply-To: References: <003601ce1aee$c2b036f0$4810a4d0$@gmail.com> <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE22C@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> Message-ID: Hello Justin and everyone, I’m doing my master’s in rehabilitation counseling psychology and I have a broad range of information about PhD programs and their focusing area. If you have any question, please feel free to ask me. Zeynep 2013/3/9, Arielle Silverman : > Hi Justin, > Welcome to the list. After your master's, what field are you hoping to > get your Ph.D. in? Rehabilitation counseling or research? Are you more > interested in the counseling side or the research side? > I'm asking because I'm doing my Ph.D. in social psychology hoping to > become a research professor who focuses on blindness-related social > issues, especially those relating to education and rehabilitation. It > is always nice to meet someone else who is interested in similar > research topics. My field is a bit different from yours but I'm still > available to answer questions about the basic Ph.D. process. > Arielle > > On 3/8/13, Wasif, Zunaira wrote: >> I am a counselor in the field and have one more class to complete in >> order to obtain my masters. Let me know if you have questions. You can >> email me off list at Zunaira.wasif at dbs.fldoe.org >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >> williams >> Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2013 11:47 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings >> >> Hello, my name is Justin Williams, and I am in school for the Master's >> of Rehabilitation counseling degree with the intent to obtain my Lpc, >> then my PHd right afterwards. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. >> fldoe.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blacklotus86%40gmail.com > From k7uij at panix.com Mon Mar 11 00:49:13 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2013 17:49:13 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] huge bookshare issue In-Reply-To: <5138896f.6259ec0a.4cdb.629e@mx.google.com> References: <5138896f.6259ec0a.4cdb.629e@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <007f01ce1df2$40fe1e90$c2fa5bb0$@panix.com> Dear Sophie: I just downloaded the book using my BrailleSensePLUS B32 running the latest firmware that allows Bookshare downloads. I downloaded both the DAISY and BRF versions without difficulty and unzipped and opened the BRF (Braille) version and could reade it in Braille without problems. I therefore haven't a clue what's going on. Mike Freeman -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Sophie Trist Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2013 4:34 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] huge bookshare issue It's Absalom, Absalom by William Faulkner. Has anyone else had this problem before? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Freeman" References: <003601ce1aee$c2b036f0$4810a4d0$@gmail.com> <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE22C@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> Message-ID: <000301ce1d2f$c0d4c100$427e4300$@gmail.com> Thank you Arielle and Zeynep for offering to assist me. Yes, let's talk. I would like to go into ADA consulting, but also, I would like to go into research but I don't know for exactly what. I do not know how research specialties work. I would like to do something more than just blindness issues; I like the social component you have going. I do like research, and spreading it around to vocational rehabilitation issues seems like it would be good. I love ADA stuff. I would like to use research and skill to be an advocate, and to push the wider community to accept us. I don't know what major would be good. I'm trying to stay at the university of South Carolina; I have a house, and moving would be annoying. The only way that might derail me is the right job for the wounded warriors, but I really want the PhD. I plan to get my MRC, LPC, and certification in psychiatric counseling, but I would like to then immediately move on to the PHD program. I appreciate both of you emailing me. Thank you. When can I pick one of your brains? Maybe over personal email, or over the phone. What ever is more convenient. I don't want to fill the list up with personal chatter. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of zeynep sule yilmaz Sent: Sunday, March 10, 2013 6:52 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings Hello Justin and everyone, I'm doing my master's in rehabilitation counseling psychology and I have a broad range of information about PhD programs and their focusing area. If you have any question, please feel free to ask me. Zeynep 2013/3/9, Arielle Silverman : > Hi Justin, > Welcome to the list. After your master's, what field are you hoping to > get your Ph.D. in? Rehabilitation counseling or research? Are you more > interested in the counseling side or the research side? > I'm asking because I'm doing my Ph.D. in social psychology hoping to > become a research professor who focuses on blindness-related social > issues, especially those relating to education and rehabilitation. It > is always nice to meet someone else who is interested in similar > research topics. My field is a bit different from yours but I'm still > available to answer questions about the basic Ph.D. process. > Arielle > > On 3/8/13, Wasif, Zunaira wrote: >> I am a counselor in the field and have one more class to complete in >> order to obtain my masters. Let me know if you have questions. You can >> email me off list at Zunaira.wasif at dbs.fldoe.org >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >> williams >> Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2013 11:47 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings >> >> Hello, my name is Justin Williams, and I am in school for the Master's >> of Rehabilitation counseling degree with the intent to obtain my Lpc, >> then my PHd right afterwards. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. >> fldoe.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blacklotus86%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From sweetpeareader at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 03:02:57 2013 From: sweetpeareader at gmail.com (Sophie Trist) Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2013 22:02:57 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] huge bookshare issue Message-ID: <513d498e.ae54ec0a.4a1d.ffffc1b2@mx.google.com> Mike, thanks for trying. Another person said they were also able to download and read it, so it's probably a braillenote glitch. Anyway, because of the urgency of the situation, I obtained the book through other means last week. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Freeman" References: <513d498e.ae54ec0a.4a1d.ffffc1b2@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <009001ce1e07$8a7faab0$9f7f0010$@panix.com> Good for you, sophie! Sorry yu had to go through the nuisance and anxiety but resourcefulness is the name of the game here. Mike -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Sophie Trist Sent: Sunday, March 10, 2013 8:03 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] huge bookshare issue Mike, thanks for trying. Another person said they were also able to download and read it, so it's probably a braillenote glitch. Anyway, because of the urgency of the situation, I obtained the book through other means last week. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Freeman" Hi, Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts while using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to facebook or bookshare, I'll get: Security alert dialog. informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or changed by others. However, there is a problem with the site's security certificate. The security certificate is from a trusted certifying athority. The security certificate date is valid. The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not match the name of the site. Do you want to continue? The problem is: 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I just hit yes on it. 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote lags. for example, from "The name on the security certificate is invalid…" to "do you want to continue…" it takes the braillenote a second at most to jump from those two line. When you're dealing with four lines, that's four seconds, just to get to the prompt. With all of that added up, it takes about a minute to get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the prompt and it still brings up security stuff.. Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, etc? :) Thanks From zdreicer at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 05:09:08 2013 From: zdreicer at gmail.com (Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer) Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2013 23:09:08 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <93FBCE83-30CF-45A0-8D83-01E19947C20B@gmail.com> good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! I can not figure a way around them either. Do you know of the braillenote mailing list? Sent from my iPhone On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson wrote: > Hi, > > Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts while using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to facebook or bookshare, I'll get: > Security alert dialog. > informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or changed by others. However, there is a problem with the site's security certificate. The security certificate is from a trusted certifying athority. > The security certificate date is valid. > The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not match the name of the site. > Do you want to continue? > > The problem is: > 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I just hit yes on it. > 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote lags. for example, from "The name on the security certificate is invalid…" to "do you want to continue…" it takes the braillenote a second at most to jump from those two line. When you're dealing with four lines, that's four seconds, just to get to the prompt. With all of that added up, it takes about a minute to get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the prompt and it still brings up security stuff.. > > Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, etc? :) > > Thanks > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail.com From coastergirl92 at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 06:07:35 2013 From: coastergirl92 at gmail.com (Sarah) Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2013 22:07:35 -0800 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote Message-ID: <513d74af.26bd440a.6a79.ffffaca0@mx.google.com> I have this thing pop up about every 5 seconds! ----- Original Message ----- From: Valerie Gibson References: <93FBCE83-30CF-45A0-8D83-01E19947C20B@gmail.com> Message-ID: I think i saw something about it on the BN mailing list, but someone said their computer was doing it too, and I have not had that problem. Overall, the thread on it was not too helpful, but maybe I just didn't dig deep enough. Another bad part about all this is, I can't even exit the internet because the dialog pops up again. I have to reset my BN. It's sadly getting to the point where, if not for the braille display, the BN would not be worth having…at least that's my thinking. I know the BN can only do so muc, but if it were half as good as a mobile device that would be something. I don't mean to bash the braillenote or the manufacturer, and I appologize if my tone is coming across as such, it's just…to spend that much money on a device and have your iphone/ipad, which coasts a fifth of the price, work more flawlessly is a wee bit disappointing. Maybe humanware should up the game and make a iphone/ipad docking station with a braille display at the bottom…or an iphone/ipad case with a braille display somehow built in. You have to admit, that would be beautiful. :) If anyone figures out a way around this, please let me know. Thanks so much. On Mar 11, 2013, at 12:09 AM, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer wrote: > good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! I can not figure a way around them either. Do you know of the braillenote mailing list? > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts while using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to facebook or bookshare, I'll get: >> Security alert dialog. >> informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or changed by others. However, there is a problem with the site's security certificate. The security certificate is from a trusted certifying athority. >> The security certificate date is valid. >> The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not match the name of the site. >> Do you want to continue? >> >> The problem is: >> 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I just hit yes on it. >> 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote lags. for example, from "The name on the security certificate is invalid…" to "do you want to continue…" it takes the braillenote a second at most to jump from those two line. When you're dealing with four lines, that's four seconds, just to get to the prompt. With all of that added up, it takes about a minute to get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the prompt and it still brings up security stuff.. >> >> Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, etc? :) >> >> Thanks >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%40gmail.com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 07:30:45 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 03:30:45 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: References: <93FBCE83-30CF-45A0-8D83-01E19947C20B@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, Have you tried pairing your BN up with your Iphone and going off of Safari using the BN only as a display? I know the pairing takes a little time, but if it doesn't give you the alerts any more it might be worth it. Personally I use the BrailleSense and love it. The On-Hand is smaller and only slightly thicker than the Apex, still has all the standard features like word processing, calculator, calendar, etc, and the internet is pretty good on it. Didn't mean to throw out the shameless plug, but if you get to the point where you need a new notetaker it might be something to consider. On 3/11/13, Valerie Gibson wrote: > I think i saw something about it on the BN mailing list, but someone said > their computer was doing it too, and I have not had that problem. Overall, > the thread on it was not too helpful, but maybe I just didn't dig deep > enough. > > Another bad part about all this is, I can't even exit the internet because > the dialog pops up again. I have to reset my BN. > > It's sadly getting to the point where, if not for the braille display, the > BN would not be worth having…at least that's my thinking. > > I know the BN can only do so muc, but if it were half as good as a mobile > device that would be something. I don't mean to bash the braillenote or the > manufacturer, and I appologize if my tone is coming across as such, it's > just…to spend that much money on a device and have your iphone/ipad, which > coasts a fifth of the price, work more flawlessly is a wee bit > disappointing. > > Maybe humanware should up the game and make a iphone/ipad docking station > with a braille display at the bottom…or an iphone/ipad case with a braille > display somehow built in. You have to admit, that would be beautiful. :) > > If anyone figures out a way around this, please let me know. Thanks so > much. > On Mar 11, 2013, at 12:09 AM, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer > wrote: > >> good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! I can not >> figure a way around them either. Do you know of the braillenote mailing >> list? >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson >> wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> >>> Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts while >>> using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to facebook or >>> bookshare, I'll get: >>> Security alert dialog. >>> informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or changed by >>> others. However, there is a problem with the site's security certificate. >>> The security certificate is from a trusted certifying athority. >>> The security certificate date is valid. >>> The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not match the >>> name of the site. >>> Do you want to continue? >>> >>> The problem is: >>> 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I just hit >>> yes on it. >>> 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote lags. >>> for example, from "The name on the security certificate is invalid…" to >>> "do you want to continue…" it takes the braillenote a second at most to >>> jump from those two line. When you're dealing with four lines, that's >>> four seconds, just to get to the prompt. With all of that added up, it >>> takes about a minute to get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the >>> prompt and it still brings up security stuff.. >>> >>> Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, etc? :) >>> >>> Thanks >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From sweetpeareader at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 11:29:44 2013 From: sweetpeareader at gmail.com (Sophie Trist) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 06:29:44 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote Message-ID: <513dc056.6259ec0a.4cdb.122d@mx.google.com> I've=20had=20the=20security=20alert=20issue=20too.=20Going=20on=20Bookshare= =20has=20 become=20a=20pain=20since=20it=20literally=20takes=2010=20minutes=20to=20ge= t=20on=20the=20 dang=20website.=20The=20BN/iPhone=20pairing=20is=20a=20good=20idea,=20as=20= long=20as=20 you=20have=20Read2Go=20on=20your=20iPhone=20and=20can=20read=20the=20book=20= in=20an=20 environment=20where=20phones=20can=20be=20used.=20I=20don't=20know=20a=20wa= y=20around=20 them,=20but=20I=20do=20know=20what=20causes=20the=20security=20alerts.=20Ev= ery=20 website=20has=20security=20certificates=20signed=20by=20different=20compani= es=20 to=20say=20that=20they're=20authentic=20websites.=20The=20BN=20program=20do= esn't=20 have=20a=20good=20list=20of=20security=20companies,=20so=20when=20an=20unfa= miliar=20one=20 pops=20up,=20it=20sends=20one=20of=20those=20alerts.=20So=20it's=20a=20Huma= nware=20issue,=20 not=20a=20user=20issue. =20-----=20Original=20Message=20----- From:=20Kaiti=20Shelton=20=20wrote: =20I=20think=20i=20saw=20something=20about=20it=20on=20the=20BN=20mailing=20= list,=20but=20 someone=20said =20their=20computer=20was=20doing=20it=20too,=20and=20I=20have=20not=20had= =20that=20 problem.=20=20Overall, =20the=20thread=20on=20it=20was=20not=20too=20helpful,=20but=20maybe=20I=20= just=20didn't=20 dig=20deep =20enough. =20Another=20bad=20part=20about=20all=20this=20is,=20I=20can't=20even=20exi= t=20the=20 internet=20because =20the=20dialog=20pops=20up=20again.=20I=20have=20to=20reset=20my=20BN. =20It's=20sadly=20getting=20to=20the=20point=20where,=20if=20not=20for=20th= e=20braille=20 display,=20the =20BN=20would=20not=20be=20worth=20having=85at=20least=20that's=20my=20thin= king. =20I=20know=20the=20BN=20can=20only=20do=20so=20muc,=20but=20if=20it=20were= =20half=20as=20good=20as=20 a=20mobile =20device=20that=20would=20be=20something.=20=20I=20don't=20mean=20to=20bas= h=20the=20 braillenote=20or=20the =20manufacturer,=20and=20I=20appologize=20if=20my=20tone=20is=20coming=20ac= ross=20as=20 such,=20it's =20just=85to=20spend=20that=20much=20money=20on=20a=20device=20and=20have=20= your=20 iphone/ipad,=20which =20coasts=20a=20fifth=20of=20the=20price,=20work=20more=20flawlessly=20is=20= a=20wee=20bit =20disappointing. =20Maybe=20humanware=20should=20up=20the=20game=20and=20make=20a=20iphone/i= pad=20 docking=20station =20with=20a=20braille=20display=20at=20the=20bottom=85or=20an=20iphone/ipad= =20case=20with=20 a=20braille =20display=20somehow=20built=20in.=20=20You=20have=20to=20admit,=20that=20w= ould=20be=20 beautiful.=20:) =20If=20anyone=20figures=20out=20a=20way=20around=20this,=20please=20let=20= me=20know.=20 Thanks=20so =20much. =20On=20Mar=2011,=202013,=20at=2012:09=20AM,=20Zachary=20N.=20Griego-Dreice= r=20 References: <513dc056.6259ec0a.4cdb.122d@mx.google.com> Message-ID: That might be a good project. I'm sure if enough people tell Humanware that they need to update their list of security companies that they'll include it in the next update to minimize complaints. Humanware already had to drop the prices of the Apex because of waning demand for their supply, so they'll want to fix the glitch to deter people from not sticking with their company. On 3/11/13, Sophie Trist wrote: > I've had the security alert issue too. Going on Bookshare has > become a pain since it literally takes 10 minutes to get on the > dang website. The BN/iPhone pairing is a good idea, as long as > you have Read2Go on your iPhone and can read the book in an > environment where phones can be used. I don't know a way around > them, but I do know what causes the security alerts. Every > website has security certificates signed by different companies > to say that they're authentic websites. The BN program doesn't > have a good list of security companies, so when an unfamiliar one > pops up, it sends one of those alerts. So it's a Humanware issue, > not a user issue. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Kaiti Shelton To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 03:30:45 -0400 > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote > > Hi, > > Have you tried pairing your BN up with your Iphone and going off > of > Safari using the BN only as a display? I know the pairing takes > a > little time, but if it doesn't give you the alerts any more it > might > be worth it. Personally I use the BrailleSense and love it. The > On-Hand is smaller and only slightly thicker than the Apex, still > has > all the standard features like word processing, calculator, > calendar, > etc, and the internet is pretty good on it. Didn't mean to throw > out > the shameless plug, but if you get to the point where you need a > new > notetaker it might be something to consider. > > On 3/11/13, Valerie Gibson wrote: > I think i saw something about it on the BN mailing list, but > someone said > their computer was doing it too, and I have not had that > problem. Overall, > the thread on it was not too helpful, but maybe I just didn't > dig deep > enough. > > Another bad part about all this is, I can't even exit the > internet because > the dialog pops up again. I have to reset my BN. > > It's sadly getting to the point where, if not for the braille > display, the > BN would not be worth having…at least that's my thinking. > > I know the BN can only do so muc, but if it were half as good as > a mobile > device that would be something. I don't mean to bash the > braillenote or the > manufacturer, and I appologize if my tone is coming across as > such, it's > just…to spend that much money on a device and have your > iphone/ipad, which > coasts a fifth of the price, work more flawlessly is a wee bit > disappointing. > > Maybe humanware should up the game and make a iphone/ipad > docking station > with a braille display at the bottom…or an iphone/ipad case with > a braille > display somehow built in. You have to admit, that would be > beautiful. :) > > If anyone figures out a way around this, please let me know. > Thanks so > much. > On Mar 11, 2013, at 12:09 AM, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer > wrote: > > good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! > I can not > figure a way around them either. Do you know of the braillenote > mailing > list? > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson > wrote: > > Hi, > > Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts > while > using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to > facebook or > bookshare, I'll get: > Security alert dialog. > informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or > changed by > others. However, there is a problem with the site's security > certificate. > The security certificate is from a trusted certifying athority. > The security certificate date is valid. > The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not > match the > name of the site. > Do you want to continue? > > The problem is: > 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I > just hit > yes on it. > 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote > lags. > for example, from "The name on the security certificate is > invalid…" to > "do you want to continue…" it takes the braillenote a second at > most to > jump from those two line. When you're dealing with four lines, > that's > four seconds, just to get to the prompt. With all of that added > up, it > takes about a minute to get past that. I even tried hitting > "no" on the > prompt and it still brings up security stuff.. > > Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, > etc? :) > > Thanks > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm > ail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%4 > 0gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarine > t104%40gmail.com > > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info > for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade > r%40gmail.com > > > -- Kaiti From valandkayla at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 15:14:59 2013 From: valandkayla at gmail.com (Valerie Gibson) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 10:14:59 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: References: <513dc056.6259ec0a.4cdb.122d@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <119177CA-51B9-423A-A075-E1C10C28CFF2@gmail.com> I do like the idea of using safari to get on the bookshare web site. However the problem with that is you can't download the books onto the braillenote that way. Using read2go is another good way, but it's features are so limited compared to many book readers, including the one on the BN. I think I will write to humanware about this issue, and for now transfer my bookshare books from my computer to the BN. On Mar 11, 2013, at 8:34 AM, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > That might be a good project. I'm sure if enough people tell > Humanware that they need to update their list of security companies > that they'll include it in the next update to minimize complaints. > Humanware already had to drop the prices of the Apex because of waning > demand for their supply, so they'll want to fix the glitch to deter > people from not sticking with their company. > > On 3/11/13, Sophie Trist wrote: >> I've had the security alert issue too. Going on Bookshare has >> become a pain since it literally takes 10 minutes to get on the >> dang website. The BN/iPhone pairing is a good idea, as long as >> you have Read2Go on your iPhone and can read the book in an >> environment where phones can be used. I don't know a way around >> them, but I do know what causes the security alerts. Every >> website has security certificates signed by different companies >> to say that they're authentic websites. The BN program doesn't >> have a good list of security companies, so when an unfamiliar one >> pops up, it sends one of those alerts. So it's a Humanware issue, >> not a user issue. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Kaiti Shelton > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> > Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 03:30:45 -0400 >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >> >> Hi, >> >> Have you tried pairing your BN up with your Iphone and going off >> of >> Safari using the BN only as a display? I know the pairing takes >> a >> little time, but if it doesn't give you the alerts any more it >> might >> be worth it. Personally I use the BrailleSense and love it. The >> On-Hand is smaller and only slightly thicker than the Apex, still >> has >> all the standard features like word processing, calculator, >> calendar, >> etc, and the internet is pretty good on it. Didn't mean to throw >> out >> the shameless plug, but if you get to the point where you need a >> new >> notetaker it might be something to consider. >> >> On 3/11/13, Valerie Gibson wrote: >> I think i saw something about it on the BN mailing list, but >> someone said >> their computer was doing it too, and I have not had that >> problem. Overall, >> the thread on it was not too helpful, but maybe I just didn't >> dig deep >> enough. >> >> Another bad part about all this is, I can't even exit the >> internet because >> the dialog pops up again. I have to reset my BN. >> >> It's sadly getting to the point where, if not for the braille >> display, the >> BN would not be worth having…at least that's my thinking. >> >> I know the BN can only do so muc, but if it were half as good as >> a mobile >> device that would be something. I don't mean to bash the >> braillenote or the >> manufacturer, and I appologize if my tone is coming across as >> such, it's >> just…to spend that much money on a device and have your >> iphone/ipad, which >> coasts a fifth of the price, work more flawlessly is a wee bit >> disappointing. >> >> Maybe humanware should up the game and make a iphone/ipad >> docking station >> with a braille display at the bottom…or an iphone/ipad case with >> a braille >> display somehow built in. You have to admit, that would be >> beautiful. :) >> >> If anyone figures out a way around this, please let me know. >> Thanks so >> much. >> On Mar 11, 2013, at 12:09 AM, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer >> > wrote: >> >> good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! >> I can not >> figure a way around them either. Do you know of the braillenote >> mailing >> list? >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson >> > wrote: >> >> Hi, >> >> Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts >> while >> using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to >> facebook or >> bookshare, I'll get: >> Security alert dialog. >> informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or >> changed by >> others. However, there is a problem with the site's security >> certificate. >> The security certificate is from a trusted certifying athority. >> The security certificate date is valid. >> The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not >> match the >> name of the site. >> Do you want to continue? >> >> The problem is: >> 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I >> just hit >> yes on it. >> 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote >> lags. >> for example, from "The name on the security certificate is >> invalid…" to >> "do you want to continue…" it takes the braillenote a second at >> most to >> jump from those two line. When you're dealing with four lines, >> that's >> four seconds, just to get to the prompt. With all of that added >> up, it >> takes about a minute to get past that. I even tried hitting >> "no" on the >> prompt and it still brings up security stuff.. >> >> Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, >> etc? :) >> >> Thanks >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm >> ail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%4 >> 0gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarine >> t104%40gmail.com >> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade >> r%40gmail.com >> >> >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%40gmail.com From k7uij at panix.com Mon Mar 11 15:29:52 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 08:29:52 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <47D05B8C-67DD-49AD-A894-314F3233FCF7@panix.com> Use a real computer with enough power to get through this stuff quickly. Mike Freeman sent from my iPhone On Mar 10, 2013, at 21:59, Valerie Gibson wrote: > Hi, > > Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts while using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to facebook or bookshare, I'll get: > Security alert dialog. > informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or changed by others. However, there is a problem with the site's security certificate. The security certificate is from a trusted certifying athority. > The security certificate date is valid. > The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not match the name of the site. > Do you want to continue? > > The problem is: > 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I just hit yes on it. > 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote lags. for example, from "The name on the security certificate is invalid…" to "do you want to continue…" it takes the braillenote a second at most to jump from those two line. When you're dealing with four lines, that's four seconds, just to get to the prompt. With all of that added up, it takes about a minute to get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the prompt and it still brings up security stuff.. > > Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, etc? :) > > Thanks > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From k7uij at panix.com Mon Mar 11 15:35:02 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 08:35:02 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: References: <93FBCE83-30CF-45A0-8D83-01E19947C20B@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4F13E2D5-1C98-4B46-9115-485669329F25@panix.com> If Humanware sold as many note takers as Apple does i-devices, they would've be as expensive. And Apple's braille support isn't all that great. Mike Freeman sent from my iPhone On Mar 10, 2013, at 23:38, Valerie Gibson wrote: > I think i saw something about it on the BN mailing list, but someone said their computer was doing it too, and I have not had that problem. Overall, the thread on it was not too helpful, but maybe I just didn't dig deep enough. > > Another bad part about all this is, I can't even exit the internet because the dialog pops up again. I have to reset my BN. > > It's sadly getting to the point where, if not for the braille display, the BN would not be worth having…at least that's my thinking. > > I know the BN can only do so muc, but if it were half as good as a mobile device that would be something. I don't mean to bash the braillenote or the manufacturer, and I appologize if my tone is coming across as such, it's just…to spend that much money on a device and have your iphone/ipad, which coasts a fifth of the price, work more flawlessly is a wee bit disappointing. > > Maybe humanware should up the game and make a iphone/ipad docking station with a braille display at the bottom…or an iphone/ipad case with a braille display somehow built in. You have to admit, that would be beautiful. :) > > If anyone figures out a way around this, please let me know. Thanks so much. > On Mar 11, 2013, at 12:09 AM, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer wrote: > >> good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! I can not figure a way around them either. Do you know of the braillenote mailing list? >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> >>> Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts while using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to facebook or bookshare, I'll get: >>> Security alert dialog. >>> informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or changed by others. However, there is a problem with the site's security certificate. The security certificate is from a trusted certifying athority. >>> The security certificate date is valid. >>> The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not match the name of the site. >>> Do you want to continue? >>> >>> The problem is: >>> 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I just hit yes on it. >>> 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote lags. for example, from "The name on the security certificate is invalid…" to "do you want to continue…" it takes the braillenote a second at most to jump from those two line. When you're dealing with four lines, that's four seconds, just to get to the prompt. With all of that added up, it takes about a minute to get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the prompt and it still brings up security stuff.. >>> >>> Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, etc? :) >>> >>> Thanks >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From coastergirl92 at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 18:05:20 2013 From: coastergirl92 at gmail.com (Sarah) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 11:05:20 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote Message-ID: <513e1ced.aa88440a.1960.5850@mx.google.com> Yeah=20my=20point=20is=20the=20same=20why=20in=20the=20world=20would=20you= =20have=20to=20pay=20 over=20$5,000=20for=20a=20device=20that=20can=20barely=20do=20more=20than=20= go=20on=20 Facebook=20or=20google=20or=20Bookshare=20when=20an=20iPhone=20costs=20less= =20than=20 half=20the=20price=20and=20you=20can=20do=20anything=20on=20it. =20-----=20Original=20Message=20----- From:=20Valerie=20Gibson=20=20wrote: =20good=20evening=20Valerie.=20=20I=20get=20those=20annoying=20things=20all= =20the=20time!=20 I=20can=20not=20figure=20a=20way=20around=20them=20either.=20=20Do=20you=20= know=20of=20=20the=20 braillenote=20mailing=20list? =20Sent=20from=20my=20iPhone =20On=20Mar=2010,=202013,=20at=2010:59=20PM,=20Valerie=20Gibson=20 =20wrote: =20Hi, =20Quick=20question.=20=20Does=20anyone=20ever=20get=20a=20ton=20of=20secur= ity=20alerts=20 while=20using=20the=20internet=20on=20the=20braillenote=20apex?=20=20When=20= I=20go=20to=20 facebook=20or=20bookshare,=20I'll=20get: =20Security=20alert=20dialog. =20informationyou=20exchange=20with=20this=20site=20cannot=20be=20viewed=20= or=20 changed=20by=20others.=20=20However,=20there=20is=20a=20problem=20with=20th= e=20site's=20 security=20certificate.=20=20The=20security=20certificate=20is=20from=20a=20= trusted=20 certifying=20athority. =20The=20security=20certificate=20date=20is=20valid. =20The=20name=20on=20the=20security=20certificate=20is=20invalid=20or=20doe= s=20not=20 match=20the=20name=20of=20the=20site. =20Do=20you=20want=20to=20continue? =20The=20problem=20is: =201.=20=20I=20can=20sometimes=20get=20eight=20or=20ten=20of=20these=20in=20= a=20row,=20and=20I=20 just=20hit=20yes=20on=20it. =202.=20=20When=20i'm=20moving=20to=20a=20new=20line=20on=20the=20dialog,=20= the=20braillenote=20 lags.=20=20for=20example,=20from=20"The=20name=20on=20the=20security=20cert= ificate=20is=20 invalid=85"=20to=20"do=20you=20want=20to=20continue=85"=20it=20takes=20the= =20braillenote=20 a=20second=20at=20most=20to=20jump=20from=20those=20two=20line.=20=20When=20= you're=20 dealing=20with=20four=20lines,=20that's=20four=20seconds,=20just=20to=20get= =20to=20the=20 prompt.=20=20With=20all=20of=20that=20added=20up,=20it=20takes=20about=20a= =20minute=20to=20 get=20past=20that.=20=20I=20even=20tried=20hitting=20"no"=20on=20the=20prom= pt=20and=20it=20 still=20brings=20up=20security=20stuff.. =20Any=20advice,=20suggestions,=20helpful=20hints,=20complaints=20such=20as= =20this,=20 etc?=20:) =20Thanks =20_______________________________________________ =20nabs-l=20mailing=20list =20nabs-l at nfbnet.org =20http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org =20To=20unsubscribe,=20change=20your=20list=20options=20or=20get=20your=20a= ccount=20 info=20for=20nabs-l: =20 http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm ail.com =20_______________________________________________ =20nabs-l=20mailing=20list =20nabs-l at nfbnet.org =20http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org =20To=20unsubscribe,=20change=20your=20list=20options=20or=20get=20your=20a= ccount=20 info=20for=20nabs-l: =20 http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%4 0gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l=20mailing=20list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To=20unsubscribe,=20change=20your=20list=20options=20or=20get=20your=20acco= unt=20info=20 for=20nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/coastergirl92 %40gmail.com From ptrck.molloy at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 18:49:05 2013 From: ptrck.molloy at gmail.com (Patrick Molloy) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 14:49:05 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: <513e1ced.aa88440a.1960.5850@mx.google.com> References: <513e1ced.aa88440a.1960.5850@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Along the same line as the original topic of this post, I'm wondering why it is that Bookshare, which is in the "my favorites" folder on the BrailleNote, would give us such a hard time when trying to get on. I was trying to download a book this past weekend and must have run into a dozen of those security alerts. Sometimes I can just exit out, but other times, I exit out and there's another security alert! Patrick On 3/11/13, Sarah wrote: > Yeah my point is the same why in the world would you have to pay > over $5,000 for a device that can barely do more than go on > Facebook or google or Bookshare when an iPhone costs less than > half the price and you can do anything on it. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Valerie Gibson To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 01:38:15 -0500 > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote > > I think i saw something about it on the BN mailing list, but > someone said their computer was doing it too, and I have not had > that problem. Overall, the thread on it was not too helpful, but > maybe I just didn't dig deep enough. > > Another bad part about all this is, I can't even exit the > internet because the dialog pops up again. I have to reset my > BN. > > It's sadly getting to the point where, if not for the braille > display, the BN would not be worth having…at least that's my > thinking. > > I know the BN can only do so muc, but if it were half as good as > a mobile device that would be something. I don't mean to bash > the braillenote or the manufacturer, and I appologize if my tone > is coming across as such, it's just…to spend that much money on a > device and have your iphone/ipad, which coasts a fifth of the > price, work more flawlessly is a wee bit disappointing. > > Maybe humanware should up the game and make a iphone/ipad docking > station with a braille display at the bottom…or an iphone/ipad > case with a braille display somehow built in. You have to admit, > that would be beautiful. :) > > If anyone figures out a way around this, please let me know. > Thanks so much. > On Mar 11, 2013, at 12:09 AM, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer > wrote: > > good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! > I can not figure a way around them either. Do you know of the > braillenote mailing list? > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson > wrote: > > Hi, > > Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts > while using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to > facebook or bookshare, I'll get: > Security alert dialog. > informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or > changed by others. However, there is a problem with the site's > security certificate. The security certificate is from a trusted > certifying athority. > The security certificate date is valid. > The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not > match the name of the site. > Do you want to continue? > > The problem is: > 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I > just hit yes on it. > 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote > lags. for example, from "The name on the security certificate is > invalid…" to "do you want to continue…" it takes the braillenote > a second at most to jump from those two line. When you're > dealing with four lines, that's four seconds, just to get to the > prompt. With all of that added up, it takes about a minute to > get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the prompt and it > still brings up security stuff.. > > Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, > etc? :) > > Thanks > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm > ail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%4 > 0gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info > for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/coastergirl92 > %40gmail.com > > > From k7uij at panix.com Mon Mar 11 18:55:22 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 11:55:22 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: <513e1ced.aa88440a.1960.5850@mx.google.com> References: <513e1ced.aa88440a.1960.5850@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <2AE594DA-C122-4567-8DAF-E93C598AF48D@panix.com> The answer is extremely simple although my observation is that most blind people do not want to hear it. First, piezoelectric braille displays are expensive and the demand for them is small enough that their price is unlikely to decrease much. Second, Apple sells far more i-devices than Humanware, HIMS and Levelstar/APH sell note-takers. Therefore, Apple can take advantage of economies of scale in production that note-taker manufacturers can only dream of. High production quantity translates directly into lower prices This is the economic consequence of being the minority we know ourselves to be. The fact that note-takers are, in essence, glorified PDAs with braille displays matters not one whit where economics are concerned. The kicker here is that we cannot depend upon mainstream devices to meet all our needs All the complaining in the world won't change this reality. The one consolation we have here is that slates and styluses are still cheap! Mike Freeman sent from my iPhone On Mar 11, 2013, at 11:05, Sarah wrote: > Yeah my point is the same why in the world would you have to pay over $5,000 for a device that can barely do more than go on Facebook or google or Bookshare when an iPhone costs less than half the price and you can do anything on it. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Valerie Gibson To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 01:38:15 -0500 > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote > > I think i saw something about it on the BN mailing list, but someone said their computer was doing it too, and I have not had that problem. Overall, the thread on it was not too helpful, but maybe I just didn't dig deep enough. > > Another bad part about all this is, I can't even exit the internet because the dialog pops up again. I have to reset my BN. > > It's sadly getting to the point where, if not for the braille display, the BN would not be worth having…at least that's my thinking. > > I know the BN can only do so muc, but if it were half as good as a mobile device that would be something. I don't mean to bash the braillenote or the manufacturer, and I appologize if my tone is coming across as such, it's just…to spend that much money on a device and have your iphone/ipad, which coasts a fifth of the price, work more flawlessly is a wee bit disappointing. > > Maybe humanware should up the game and make a iphone/ipad docking station with a braille display at the bottom…or an iphone/ipad case with a braille display somehow built in. You have to admit, that would be beautiful. :) > > If anyone figures out a way around this, please let me know. Thanks so much. > On Mar 11, 2013, at 12:09 AM, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer wrote: > > good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! I can not figure a way around them either. Do you know of the braillenote mailing list? > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson wrote: > > Hi, > > Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts while using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to facebook or bookshare, I'll get: > Security alert dialog. > informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or changed by others. However, there is a problem with the site's security certificate. The security certificate is from a trusted certifying athority. > The security certificate date is valid. > The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not match the name of the site. > Do you want to continue? > > The problem is: > 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I just hit yes on it. > 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote lags. for example, from "The name on the security certificate is invalid…" to "do you want to continue…" it takes the braillenote a second at most to jump from those two line. When you're dealing with four lines, that's four seconds, just to get to the prompt. With all of that added up, it takes about a minute to get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the prompt and it still brings up security stuff.. > > Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, etc? :) > > Thanks > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm > ail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%4 > 0gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/coastergirl92 > %40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From k7uij at panix.com Mon Mar 11 18:57:20 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 11:57:20 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: References: <513e1ced.aa88440a.1960.5850@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Can you say "identity verification"? Mike Freeman sent from my iPhone On Mar 11, 2013, at 11:49, Patrick Molloy wrote: > Along the same line as the original topic of this post, I'm wondering > why it is that Bookshare, which is in the "my favorites" folder on the > BrailleNote, would give us such a hard time when trying to get on. I > was trying to download a book this past weekend and must have run into > a dozen of those security alerts. Sometimes I can just exit out, but > other times, I exit out and there's another security alert! > Patrick > > On 3/11/13, Sarah wrote: >> Yeah my point is the same why in the world would you have to pay >> over $5,000 for a device that can barely do more than go on >> Facebook or google or Bookshare when an iPhone costs less than >> half the price and you can do anything on it. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Valerie Gibson > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> > Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 01:38:15 -0500 >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >> >> I think i saw something about it on the BN mailing list, but >> someone said their computer was doing it too, and I have not had >> that problem. Overall, the thread on it was not too helpful, but >> maybe I just didn't dig deep enough. >> >> Another bad part about all this is, I can't even exit the >> internet because the dialog pops up again. I have to reset my >> BN. >> >> It's sadly getting to the point where, if not for the braille >> display, the BN would not be worth having…at least that's my >> thinking. >> >> I know the BN can only do so muc, but if it were half as good as >> a mobile device that would be something. I don't mean to bash >> the braillenote or the manufacturer, and I appologize if my tone >> is coming across as such, it's just…to spend that much money on a >> device and have your iphone/ipad, which coasts a fifth of the >> price, work more flawlessly is a wee bit disappointing. >> >> Maybe humanware should up the game and make a iphone/ipad docking >> station with a braille display at the bottom…or an iphone/ipad >> case with a braille display somehow built in. You have to admit, >> that would be beautiful. :) >> >> If anyone figures out a way around this, please let me know. >> Thanks so much. >> On Mar 11, 2013, at 12:09 AM, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer >> wrote: >> >> good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! >> I can not figure a way around them either. Do you know of the >> braillenote mailing list? >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson >> wrote: >> >> Hi, >> >> Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts >> while using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to >> facebook or bookshare, I'll get: >> Security alert dialog. >> informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or >> changed by others. However, there is a problem with the site's >> security certificate. The security certificate is from a trusted >> certifying athority. >> The security certificate date is valid. >> The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not >> match the name of the site. >> Do you want to continue? >> >> The problem is: >> 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I >> just hit yes on it. >> 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote >> lags. for example, from "The name on the security certificate is >> invalid…" to "do you want to continue…" it takes the braillenote >> a second at most to jump from those two line. When you're >> dealing with four lines, that's four seconds, just to get to the >> prompt. With all of that added up, it takes about a minute to >> get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the prompt and it >> still brings up security stuff.. >> >> Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, >> etc? :) >> >> Thanks >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm >> ail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%4 >> 0gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/coastergirl92 >> %40gmail.com >> >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From sweetpeareader at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 20:13:56 2013 From: sweetpeareader at gmail.com (Sophie Trist) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 14:13:56 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote Message-ID: <513e3b05.43baec0a.48df.0fb8@mx.google.com> Mike,=20I'm=20going=20to=20have=20to=20disagree=20with=20you=20here.=20Slat= es=20and=20 styluses=20are=20very=20inefficient.=20On=20my=20BN,=20I=20can=20type=20not= es=20in=20 class=20faster=20than=20most=20sighted=20kids=20can=20write=20them.=20On=20= an=20S&S,=20 notetaking=20would=20take=20ten=20times=20as=20long=20and=20be=20three=20ti= mes=20as=20 difficult.=20Also,=20I=20have=20found=20Apple's=20braille=20support=20to=20= be=20very=20 nice.=20Yeah,=20it's=20not=20perfect,=20but=20it's=20great=20all=20things=20= considered.=20Okay,=20sorry=20for=20the=20rant=20and=20for=20getting=20off= =20topic.=20 Kaiti,=20I=20like=20your=20idea=20of=20petitioning=20Humanware=20to=20inclu= de=20an=20 updated=20list=20of=20security=20certificates=20(as=20well=20as=20a=20freak= in=20Docx=20 converter)=20into=20their=20next=20update.=20Does=20anyone=20know=20how=20w= e=20could=20 get=20such=20a=20project=20started? Yours=20sincerely, Sophie =20-----=20Original=20Message=20----- From:=20Mike=20Freeman=20=20= wrote: =20Yeah=20my=20point=20is=20the=20same=20why=20in=20the=20world=20would=20y= ou=20have=20to=20pay=20 over=20$5,000=20for=20a=20device=20that=20can=20barely=20do=20more=20than=20= go=20on=20 Facebook=20or=20google=20or=20Bookshare=20when=20an=20iPhone=20costs=20less= =20than=20 half=20the=20price=20and=20you=20can=20do=20anything=20on=20it. =20-----=20Original=20Message=20----- =20From:=20Valerie=20Gibson=20=20wrote: =20good=20evening=20Valerie.=20=20I=20get=20those=20annoying=20things=20all= =20the=20time!=20 I=20can=20not=20figure=20a=20way=20around=20them=20either.=20=20Do=20you=20= know=20of=20=20the=20 braillenote=20mailing=20list? =20Sent=20from=20my=20iPhone =20On=20Mar=2010,=202013,=20at=2010:59=20PM,=20Valerie=20Gibson=20 =20wrote: =20Hi, =20Quick=20question.=20=20Does=20anyone=20ever=20get=20a=20ton=20of=20secur= ity=20alerts=20 while=20using=20the=20internet=20on=20the=20braillenote=20apex?=20=20When=20= I=20go=20to=20 facebook=20or=20bookshare,=20I'll=20get: =20Security=20alert=20dialog. =20informationyou=20exchange=20with=20this=20site=20cannot=20be=20viewed=20= or=20 changed=20by=20others.=20=20However,=20there=20is=20a=20problem=20with=20th= e=20site's=20 security=20certificate.=20=20The=20security=20certificate=20is=20from=20a=20= trusted=20 certifying=20athority. =20The=20security=20certificate=20date=20is=20valid. =20The=20name=20on=20the=20security=20certificate=20is=20invalid=20or=20doe= s=20not=20 match=20the=20name=20of=20the=20site. =20Do=20you=20want=20to=20continue? =20The=20problem=20is: =201.=20=20I=20can=20sometimes=20get=20eight=20or=20ten=20of=20these=20in=20= a=20row,=20and=20I=20 just=20hit=20yes=20on=20it. =202.=20=20When=20i'm=20moving=20to=20a=20new=20line=20on=20the=20dialog,=20= the=20braillenote=20 lags.=20=20for=20example,=20from=20"The=20name=20on=20the=20security=20cert= ificate=20is=20 invalid=E2=80=A6"=20to=20"do=20you=20want=20to=20continue=E2=80=A6"=20it=20= takes=20the=20 braillenote=20a=20second=20at=20most=20to=20jump=20from=20those=20two=20lin= e.=20=20When=20 you're=20dealing=20with=20four=20lines,=20that's=20four=20seconds,=20just=20= to=20get=20 to=20the=20prompt.=20=20With=20all=20of=20that=20added=20up,=20it=20takes=20= about=20a=20 minute=20to=20get=20past=20that.=20=20I=20even=20tried=20hitting=20"no"=20o= n=20the=20prompt=20 and=20it=20still=20brings=20up=20security=20stuff.. =20Any=20advice,=20suggestions,=20helpful=20hints,=20complaints=20such=20as= =20this,=20 etc?=20:) =20Thanks =20_______________________________________________ =20nabs-l=20mailing=20list =20nabs-l at nfbnet.org =20http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org =20To=20unsubscribe,=20change=20your=20list=20options=20or=20get=20your=20a= ccount=20 info=20for=20nabs-l: =20 http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm =20ail.com =20_______________________________________________ =20nabs-l=20mailing=20list =20nabs-l at nfbnet.org =20http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org =20To=20unsubscribe,=20change=20your=20list=20options=20or=20get=20your=20a= ccount=20 info=20for=20nabs-l: =20 http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%4 =200gmail.com =20_______________________________________________ =20nabs-l=20mailing=20list =20nabs-l at nfbnet.org =20http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org =20To=20unsubscribe,=20change=20your=20list=20options=20or=20get=20your=20a= ccount=20 info=20for=20nabs-l: =20 http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/coastergirl92 =20%40gmail.com =20_______________________________________________ =20nabs-l=20mailing=20list =20nabs-l at nfbnet.org =20http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org =20To=20unsubscribe,=20change=20your=20list=20options=20or=20get=20your=20a= ccount=20 info=20for=20nabs-l: =20 http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l=20mailing=20list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To=20unsubscribe,=20change=20your=20list=20options=20or=20get=20your=20acco= unt=20info=20 for=20nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade r%40gmail.com From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Mon Mar 11 20:23:43 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 16:23:43 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: <513e1ced.aa88440a.1960.5850@mx.google.com> References: <513e1ced.aa88440a.1960.5850@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Sara, Some people want the ease of a notetaker built with braille displays and speech. In a braille note, you can turn it off and turn it on and be in the same document and pick up where you left off. Also it’s a keyboard. Its user friend;ly; no double tapping or issues with swiping the wrong way. You can also go on google, facebook, etc with a netbook or laptop which is also portable. It depends on your needs. I prefer phones with buttons; much easier to stay oriented. Not everyone wants or needs a I phone, and not everyone can afford it. So, your argument seems kind of backward. True the braille note has its problems like these security issues you all brought up, but still its simple relatively speaking, user friendly, and is very powerful even without connecting to the internet. Some of us like notetaking and reading those notes in braille. true you can connect some displays to the Iphone, but I heard its not an exact science and those small displays sure cannot fit much braille on them. You keep your Iphone if that is your preference, but, I hope humanware continues to improve the Braillenote and stay up with technology. Ashley -----Original Message----- From: Sarah Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 2:05 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote Yeah my point is the same why in the world would you have to pay over $5,000 for a device that can barely do more than go on Facebook or google or Bookshare when an iPhone costs less than half the price and you can do anything on it. ----- Original Message ----- From: Valerie Gibson wrote: good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! I can not figure a way around them either. Do you know of the braillenote mailing list? Sent from my iPhone On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson wrote: Hi, Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts while using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to facebook or bookshare, I'll get: Security alert dialog. informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or changed by others. However, there is a problem with the site's security certificate. The security certificate is from a trusted certifying athority. The security certificate date is valid. The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not match the name of the site. Do you want to continue? The problem is: 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I just hit yes on it. 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote lags. for example, from "The name on the security certificate is invalid? to "do you want to continue? it takes the braillenote a second at most to jump from those two line. When you're dealing with four lines, that's four seconds, just to get to the prompt. With all of that added up, it takes about a minute to get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the prompt and it still brings up security stuff.. Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, etc? :) Thanks _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm ail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%4 0gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/coastergirl92 %40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Mon Mar 11 20:33:19 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 16:33:19 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: <2AE594DA-C122-4567-8DAF-E93C598AF48D@panix.com> References: <513e1ced.aa88440a.1960.5850@mx.google.com> <2AE594DA-C122-4567-8DAF-E93C598AF48D@panix.com> Message-ID: <1FC28CBB0B4E44F68C67F3A1CDD908BE@OwnerPC> Mike, yes, yes! We cannot depend on only mainstream products which is why Sara's comment about not buying a braille note when an I Phone can do more on the internet bothered me. Some of us see the value in the braille display, menus, and buttons of our own portable PDAs. I believe in making mainstream stuff accessible; we should be able to buy and use any phone sighted people use; we are part of society and want to communicate just as much as everyone else does. But at the same time, there is a place for our dedicated notetakers and its disheartening to see someone not support it. Yeah, its terribly expensive and you have to get vr or another funding source for it, but for many people its well worth it. Ashley -----Original Message----- From: Mike Freeman Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 2:55 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote The answer is extremely simple although my observation is that most blind people do not want to hear it. First, piezoelectric braille displays are expensive and the demand for them is small enough that their price is unlikely to decrease much. Second, Apple sells far more i-devices than Humanware, HIMS and Levelstar/APH sell note-takers. Therefore, Apple can take advantage of economies of scale in production that note-taker manufacturers can only dream of. High production quantity translates directly into lower prices This is the economic consequence of being the minority we know ourselves to be. The fact that note-takers are, in essence, glorified PDAs with braille displays matters not one whit where economics are concerned. The kicker here is that we cannot depend upon mainstream devices to meet all our needs All the complaining in the world won't change this reality. The one consolation we have here is that slates and styluses are still cheap! Mike Freeman sent from my iPhone On Mar 11, 2013, at 11:05, Sarah wrote: > Yeah my point is the same why in the world would you have to pay over > $5,000 for a device that can barely do more than go on Facebook or google > or Bookshare when an iPhone costs less than half the price and you can do > anything on it. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Valerie Gibson To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 01:38:15 -0500 > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote > > I think i saw something about it on the BN mailing list, but someone said > their computer was doing it too, and I have not had that problem. > Overall, the thread on it was not too helpful, but maybe I just didn't dig > deep enough. > > Another bad part about all this is, I can't even exit the internet because > the dialog pops up again. I have to reset my BN. > > It's sadly getting to the point where, if not for the braille display, the > BN would not be worth having…at least that's my thinking. > > I know the BN can only do so muc, but if it were half as good as a mobile > device that would be something. I don't mean to bash the braillenote or > the manufacturer, and I appologize if my tone is coming across as such, > it's just…to spend that much money on a device and have your iphone/ipad, > which coasts a fifth of the price, work more flawlessly is a wee bit > disappointing. > > Maybe humanware should up the game and make a iphone/ipad docking station > with a braille display at the bottom…or an iphone/ipad case with a braille > display somehow built in. You have to admit, that would be beautiful. :) > > If anyone figures out a way around this, please let me know. Thanks so > much. > On Mar 11, 2013, at 12:09 AM, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer > wrote: > > good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! I can not > figure a way around them either. Do you know of the braillenote mailing > list? > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson > wrote: > > Hi, > > Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts while using > the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to facebook or bookshare, > I'll get: > Security alert dialog. > informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or changed by > others. However, there is a problem with the site's security certificate. > The security certificate is from a trusted certifying athority. > The security certificate date is valid. > The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not match the name > of the site. > Do you want to continue? > > The problem is: > 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I just hit yes > on it. > 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote lags. > for example, from "The name on the security certificate is invalid…" to > "do you want to continue…" it takes the braillenote a second at most to > jump from those two line. When you're dealing with four lines, that's > four seconds, just to get to the prompt. With all of that added up, it > takes about a minute to get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the > prompt and it still brings up security stuff.. > > Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, etc? :) > > Thanks > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm > ail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%4 > 0gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/coastergirl92 > %40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From valandkayla at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 20:37:17 2013 From: valandkayla at gmail.com (Valerie Gibson) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 15:37:17 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: <2AE594DA-C122-4567-8DAF-E93C598AF48D@panix.com> References: <513e1ced.aa88440a.1960.5850@mx.google.com> <2AE594DA-C122-4567-8DAF-E93C598AF48D@panix.com> Message-ID: I completely understand the supply and demand factor, but nowadays manufacturing companies are offering some sort of payment plan to pay over a set amount of time. Would it not stand to reason that humanware could do the same? Not everyone has voc rehab helping them out right away when first entering college, for example, and I think the expense of the BN is merely a small portion on why braille is consider by some to be obsolete. Personally, I love brailole for my studies, and if I have to read something aloud, I'd feel a little silly trying to read aloud behind a screen reader. I know this is kind of touching off base; I just think more should and could be done with humanware's notetakers as far as sales and quality. Again this is not to show an unappriciation for what they've done so far. On Mar 11, 2013, at 1:55 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: > The answer is extremely simple although my observation is that most blind people do not want to hear it. > First, piezoelectric braille displays are expensive and the demand for them is small enough that their price is unlikely to decrease much. > Second, Apple sells far more i-devices than Humanware, HIMS and Levelstar/APH sell note-takers. Therefore, Apple can take advantage of economies of scale in production that note-taker manufacturers can only dream of. High production quantity translates directly into lower prices > This is the economic consequence of being the minority we know ourselves to be. The fact that note-takers are, in essence, glorified PDAs with braille displays matters not one whit where economics are concerned. The kicker here is that we cannot depend upon mainstream devices to meet all our needs > All the complaining in the world won't change this reality. The one consolation we have here is that slates and styluses are still cheap! > > Mike Freeman > sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 11, 2013, at 11:05, Sarah wrote: > >> Yeah my point is the same why in the world would you have to pay over $5,000 for a device that can barely do more than go on Facebook or google or Bookshare when an iPhone costs less than half the price and you can do anything on it. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Valerie Gibson > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 01:38:15 -0500 >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >> >> I think i saw something about it on the BN mailing list, but someone said their computer was doing it too, and I have not had that problem. Overall, the thread on it was not too helpful, but maybe I just didn't dig deep enough. >> >> Another bad part about all this is, I can't even exit the internet because the dialog pops up again. I have to reset my BN. >> >> It's sadly getting to the point where, if not for the braille display, the BN would not be worth having…at least that's my thinking. >> >> I know the BN can only do so muc, but if it were half as good as a mobile device that would be something. I don't mean to bash the braillenote or the manufacturer, and I appologize if my tone is coming across as such, it's just…to spend that much money on a device and have your iphone/ipad, which coasts a fifth of the price, work more flawlessly is a wee bit disappointing. >> >> Maybe humanware should up the game and make a iphone/ipad docking station with a braille display at the bottom…or an iphone/ipad case with a braille display somehow built in. You have to admit, that would be beautiful. :) >> >> If anyone figures out a way around this, please let me know. Thanks so much. >> On Mar 11, 2013, at 12:09 AM, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer wrote: >> >> good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! I can not figure a way around them either. Do you know of the braillenote mailing list? >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson wrote: >> >> Hi, >> >> Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts while using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to facebook or bookshare, I'll get: >> Security alert dialog. >> informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or changed by others. However, there is a problem with the site's security certificate. The security certificate is from a trusted certifying athority. >> The security certificate date is valid. >> The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not match the name of the site. >> Do you want to continue? >> >> The problem is: >> 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I just hit yes on it. >> 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote lags. for example, from "The name on the security certificate is invalid…" to "do you want to continue…" it takes the braillenote a second at most to jump from those two line. When you're dealing with four lines, that's four seconds, just to get to the prompt. With all of that added up, it takes about a minute to get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the prompt and it still brings up security stuff.. >> >> Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, etc? :) >> >> Thanks >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm >> ail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%4 >> 0gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/coastergirl92 >> %40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%40gmail.com From valandkayla at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 20:42:35 2013 From: valandkayla at gmail.com (Valerie Gibson) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 15:42:35 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: References: <513e1ced.aa88440a.1960.5850@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Ashley, I agree with what you've said. This is my main reason for a complain. = I don't mean to complain because I want to bash what humanware is doing, = but only because there is so much more potential to be had. I just = think the apple devices are becoming more convenient than the = braillenote. One thing i loved about the braillenote in the beginning = was it's ability to do so much in one device. With these security = dialogs, I'd much perfer getting online on my computer. One could see = how cumbersome this could be for school things where the internet is = required. On Mar 11, 2013, at 3:23 PM, "Ashley Bramlett" = wrote: > Sara, > Some people want the ease of a notetaker built with braille displays = and speech. > In a braille note, you can turn it off and turn it on and be in the = same document and pick up where you left off. > Also it=A1=AFs a keyboard. Its user friend;ly; no double tapping or = issues with swiping the wrong way. > You can also go on google, facebook, etc with a netbook or laptop = which is also portable. > It depends on your needs. I prefer phones with buttons; much easier to = stay oriented. Not everyone wants or needs a I phone, and not everyone = can afford it. >=20 > So, your argument seems kind of backward. True the braille note has = its problems like these security issues you all brought up, but still = its simple relatively speaking, user friendly, and is very powerful even = without connecting to the internet. Some of us like notetaking and = reading those notes in braille. true you can connect some displays to = the Iphone, but I heard its not an exact science and those small = displays sure cannot fit much braille on them. You keep your Iphone if = that is your preference, but, I hope humanware continues to improve the = Braillenote and stay up with technology. >=20 > Ashley >=20 > -----Original Message----- From: Sarah > Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 2:05 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >=20 > Yeah my point is the same why in the world would you have to pay > over $5,000 for a device that can barely do more than go on > Facebook or google or Bookshare when an iPhone costs less than > half the price and you can do anything on it. >=20 > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Valerie Gibson To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 01:38:15 -0500 > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >=20 > I think i saw something about it on the BN mailing list, but > someone said their computer was doing it too, and I have not had > that problem. Overall, the thread on it was not too helpful, but > maybe I just didn't dig deep enough. >=20 > Another bad part about all this is, I can't even exit the > internet because the dialog pops up again. I have to reset my > BN. >=20 > It's sadly getting to the point where, if not for the braille > display, the BN would not be worth having=85at least that's my > thinking. >=20 > I know the BN can only do so muc, but if it were half as good as > a mobile device that would be something. I don't mean to bash > the braillenote or the manufacturer, and I appologize if my tone > is coming across as such, it's just=85to spend that much money on a > device and have your iphone/ipad, which coasts a fifth of the > price, work more flawlessly is a wee bit disappointing. >=20 > Maybe humanware should up the game and make a iphone/ipad docking > station with a braille display at the bottom=85or an iphone/ipad > case with a braille display somehow built in. You have to admit, > that would be beautiful. :) >=20 > If anyone figures out a way around this, please let me know. > Thanks so much. > On Mar 11, 2013, at 12:09 AM, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer > wrote: >=20 > good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! > I can not figure a way around them either. Do you know of the > braillenote mailing list? >=20 > Sent from my iPhone >=20 > On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson > wrote: >=20 > Hi, >=20 > Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts > while using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to > facebook or bookshare, I'll get: > Security alert dialog. > informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or > changed by others. However, there is a problem with the site's > security certificate. The security certificate is from a trusted > certifying athority. > The security certificate date is valid. > The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not > match the name of the site. > Do you want to continue? >=20 > The problem is: > 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I > just hit yes on it. > 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote > lags. for example, from "The name on the security certificate is > invalid? to "do you want to continue? it takes the braillenote > a second at most to jump from those two line. When you're > dealing with four lines, that's four seconds, just to get to the > prompt. With all of that added up, it takes about a minute to > get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the prompt and it > still brings up security stuff.. >=20 > Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, > etc? :) >=20 > Thanks > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for nabs-l: >=20 > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm > ail.com >=20 > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for nabs-l: >=20 > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%4 > 0gmail.com >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info > for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/coastergirl92 > %40gmail.com >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for = nabs-l: > = http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlin= k.net=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for = nabs-l: > = http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%40gmail.co= m From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Mon Mar 11 20:43:58 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 16:43:58 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: <513e3b05.43baec0a.48df.0fb8@mx.google.com> References: <513e3b05.43baec0a.48df.0fb8@mx.google.com> Message-ID: As for the slate versus the notetaker, generally, its faster with the notetaker; but a slate can be as fast as a pencil and paper if you have practiced enough. But I would never be fast like that as I did not grow up with it. I like the petetion idea too. why not do i t online or at the nfb convention? -----Original Message----- From: Sophie Trist Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 4:13 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote Mike, I'm going to have to disagree with you here. Slates and styluses are very inefficient. On my BN, I can type notes in class faster than most sighted kids can write them. On an S&S, notetaking would take ten times as long and be three times as difficult. Also, I have found Apple's braille support to be very nice. Yeah, it's not perfect, but it's great all things considered. Okay, sorry for the rant and for getting off topic. Kaiti, I like your idea of petitioning Humanware to include an updated list of security certificates (as well as a freakin Docx converter) into their next update. Does anyone know how we could get such a project started? Yours sincerely, Sophie ----- Original Message ----- From: Mike Freeman wrote: Yeah my point is the same why in the world would you have to pay over $5,000 for a device that can barely do more than go on Facebook or google or Bookshare when an iPhone costs less than half the price and you can do anything on it. ----- Original Message ----- From: Valerie Gibson wrote: good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! I can not figure a way around them either. Do you know of the braillenote mailing list? Sent from my iPhone On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson wrote: Hi, Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts while using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to facebook or bookshare, I'll get: Security alert dialog. informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or changed by others. However, there is a problem with the site's security certificate. The security certificate is from a trusted certifying athority. The security certificate date is valid. The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not match the name of the site. Do you want to continue? The problem is: 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I just hit yes on it. 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote lags. for example, from "The name on the security certificate is invalid?? to "do you want to continue?? it takes the braillenote a second at most to jump from those two line. When you're dealing with four lines, that's four seconds, just to get to the prompt. With all of that added up, it takes about a minute to get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the prompt and it still brings up security stuff.. Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, etc? :) Thanks _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm ail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%4 0gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/coastergirl92 %40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade r%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Mon Mar 11 21:07:05 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 17:07:05 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: References: <513e1ced.aa88440a.1960.5850@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Valerie, Bugs happen. Have any of you asked humanware about this and if so what was their response? I suspect they will fix it. I don't go online with the braillenote, so am not too sure of these problems. I suppose exiting doesn't work? If there is an error, I often just exit the screen. -----Original Message----- From: Valerie Gibson Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 4:42 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote Ashley, I agree with what you've said. This is my main reason for a complain. I don't mean to complain because I want to bash what humanware is doing, but only because there is so much more potential to be had. I just think the apple devices are becoming more convenient than the braillenote. One thing i loved about the braillenote in the beginning was it's ability to do so much in one device. With these security dialogs, I'd much perfer getting online on my computer. One could see how cumbersome this could be for school things where the internet is required. On Mar 11, 2013, at 3:23 PM, "Ashley Bramlett" wrote: > Sara, > Some people want the ease of a notetaker built with braille displays and > speech. > In a braille note, you can turn it off and turn it on and be in the same > document and pick up where you left off. > Also it’s a keyboard. Its user friend;ly; no double tapping or issues > with swiping the wrong way. > You can also go on google, facebook, etc with a netbook or laptop which > is also portable. > It depends on your needs. I prefer phones with buttons; much easier to > stay oriented. Not everyone wants or needs a I phone, and not everyone can > afford it. > > So, your argument seems kind of backward. True the braille note has its > problems like these security issues you all brought up, but still its > simple relatively speaking, user friendly, and is very powerful even > without connecting to the internet. Some of us like notetaking and reading > those notes in braille. true you can connect some displays to the Iphone, > but I heard its not an exact science and those small displays sure cannot > fit much braille on them. You keep your Iphone if that is your preference, > but, I hope humanware continues to improve the Braillenote and stay up > with technology. > > Ashley > > -----Original Message----- From: Sarah > Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 2:05 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote > > Yeah my point is the same why in the world would you have to pay > over $5,000 for a device that can barely do more than go on > Facebook or google or Bookshare when an iPhone costs less than > half the price and you can do anything on it. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Valerie Gibson To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 01:38:15 -0500 > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote > > I think i saw something about it on the BN mailing list, but > someone said their computer was doing it too, and I have not had > that problem. Overall, the thread on it was not too helpful, but > maybe I just didn't dig deep enough. > > Another bad part about all this is, I can't even exit the > internet because the dialog pops up again. I have to reset my > BN. > > It's sadly getting to the point where, if not for the braille > display, the BN would not be worth having�at least that's my > thinking. > > I know the BN can only do so muc, but if it were half as good as > a mobile device that would be something. I don't mean to bash > the braillenote or the manufacturer, and I appologize if my tone > is coming across as such, it's just�to spend that much money on a > device and have your iphone/ipad, which coasts a fifth of the > price, work more flawlessly is a wee bit disappointing. > > Maybe humanware should up the game and make a iphone/ipad docking > station with a braille display at the bottom�or an iphone/ipad > case with a braille display somehow built in. You have to admit, > that would be beautiful. :) > > If anyone figures out a way around this, please let me know. > Thanks so much. > On Mar 11, 2013, at 12:09 AM, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer > wrote: > > good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! > I can not figure a way around them either. Do you know of the > braillenote mailing list? > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson > wrote: > > Hi, > > Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts > while using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to > facebook or bookshare, I'll get: > Security alert dialog. > informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or > changed by others. However, there is a problem with the site's > security certificate. The security certificate is from a trusted > certifying athority. > The security certificate date is valid. > The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not > match the name of the site. > Do you want to continue? > > The problem is: > 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I > just hit yes on it. > 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote > lags. for example, from "The name on the security certificate is > invalid? to "do you want to continue? it takes the braillenote > a second at most to jump from those two line. When you're > dealing with four lines, that's four seconds, just to get to the > prompt. With all of that added up, it takes about a minute to > get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the prompt and it > still brings up security stuff.. > > Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, > etc? :) > > Thanks > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm > ail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%4 > 0gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info > for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/coastergirl92 > %40gmail.com > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From k7uij at panix.com Mon Mar 11 21:20:55 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 14:20:55 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: References: <513e3b05.43baec0a.48df.0fb8@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <12257A5B-5829-4D5D-9C26-7AECE2C4B5E4@panix.com> sophie: I don't know you so am reluctant to comment upon your assertion that a slate is inefficient except to say that such assertions are often made by those who do not use a slate extensively and therefore are unfamiliar with how efficient it can be in skilled hands. As for electronic petitions, they are IMO worthless since they cannot be verified. Moreover, keeping up with such things as security certificates and current trends in web design is a thankless, if not an impossible task for manufacturers of specialized devices. And Apple periodically breaks Braille support and we must wait months for the fix! Mike Freeman sent from my iPhone On Mar 11, 2013, at 13:43, "Ashley Bramlett" wrote: > As for the slate versus the notetaker, generally, its faster with the notetaker; but a slate can be as fast as a pencil and paper if you have practiced enough. But I would never be fast like that as I did not grow up with it. > > I like the petetion idea too. why not do i t online or at the nfb convention? > > -----Original Message----- From: Sophie Trist > Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 4:13 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote > > Mike, I'm going to have to disagree with you here. Slates and > styluses are very inefficient. On my BN, I can type notes in > class faster than most sighted kids can write them. On an S&S, > notetaking would take ten times as long and be three times as > difficult. Also, I have found Apple's braille support to be very > nice. Yeah, it's not perfect, but it's great all things > considered. Okay, sorry for the rant and for getting off topic. > Kaiti, I like your idea of petitioning Humanware to include an > updated list of security certificates (as well as a freakin Docx > converter) into their next update. Does anyone know how we could > get such a project started? > > Yours sincerely, > Sophie > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Mike Freeman To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 11:55:22 -0700 > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote > > The answer is extremely simple although my observation is that > most blind people do not want to hear it. > First, piezoelectric braille displays are expensive and the > demand for them is small enough that their price is unlikely to > decrease much. > Second, Apple sells far more i-devices than Humanware, HIMS and > Levelstar/APH sell note-takers. Therefore, Apple can take > advantage of economies of scale in production that note-taker > manufacturers can only dream of. High production quantity > translates directly into lower prices > This is the economic consequence of being the minority we know > ourselves to be. The fact that note-takers are, in essence, > glorified PDAs with braille displays matters not one whit where > economics are concerned. The kicker here is that we cannot depend > upon mainstream devices to meet all our needs > All the complaining in the world won't change this reality. The > one consolation we have here is that slates and styluses are > still cheap! > > Mike Freeman > sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 11, 2013, at 11:05, Sarah wrote: > > Yeah my point is the same why in the world would you have to pay > over $5,000 for a device that can barely do more than go on > Facebook or google or Bookshare when an iPhone costs less than > half the price and you can do anything on it. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Valerie Gibson To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 01:38:15 -0500 > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote > > I think i saw something about it on the BN mailing list, but > someone said their computer was doing it too, and I have not had > that problem. Overall, the thread on it was not too helpful, but > maybe I just didn't dig deep enough. > > Another bad part about all this is, I can't even exit the > internet because the dialog pops up again. I have to reset my > BN. > > It's sadly getting to the point where, if not for the braille > display, the BN would not be worth having?쫆t least that's my > thinking. > > I know the BN can only do so muc, but if it were half as good as > a mobile device that would be something. I don't mean to bash > the braillenote or the manufacturer, and I appologize if my tone > is coming across as such, it's just?쫡o spend that much money on > a device and have your iphone/ipad, which coasts a fifth of the > price, work more flawlessly is a wee bit disappointing. > > Maybe humanware should up the game and make a iphone/ipad > docking station with a braille display at the bottom?쫛r an > iphone/ipad case with a braille display somehow built in. You > have to admit, that would be beautiful. :) > > If anyone figures out a way around this, please let me know. > Thanks so much. > On Mar 11, 2013, at 12:09 AM, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer > wrote: > > good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! > I can not figure a way around them either. Do you know of the > braillenote mailing list? > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson > wrote: > > Hi, > > Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts > while using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to > facebook or bookshare, I'll get: > Security alert dialog. > informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or > changed by others. However, there is a problem with the site's > security certificate. The security certificate is from a trusted > certifying athority. > The security certificate date is valid. > The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not > match the name of the site. > Do you want to continue? > > The problem is: > 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I > just hit yes on it. > 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote > lags. for example, from "The name on the security certificate is > invalid?? to "do you want to continue?? it takes the > braillenote a second at most to jump from those two line. When > you're dealing with four lines, that's four seconds, just to get > to the prompt. With all of that added up, it takes about a > minute to get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the prompt > and it still brings up security stuff.. > > Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, > etc? :) > > Thanks > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm > ail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%4 > 0gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/coastergirl92 > %40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix > .com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info > for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade > r%40gmail.com > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From blacklotus86 at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 21:25:24 2013 From: blacklotus86 at gmail.com (zeynep sule yilmaz) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 16:25:24 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: scholarship opportunity notice -received this afternoon...any of you a NY state resident? Message-ID: Hi everyone, I got an email regarding a scholarship anonncement and would like to share with you. Please find attached scholarship anonncement for rehabilitation counseling students who is NY resident. Good luck, Zeynep -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Marge Tierney Scholarship Announcement 3-4-13.doc Type: application/msword Size: 26624 bytes Desc: not available URL: From mistydbradley at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 21:43:37 2013 From: mistydbradley at gmail.com (Misty Dawn Bradley) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 17:43:37 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Navigating Job Fairs Message-ID: <1A0B02D10E7D4C31A38796C200534562@acerd37f251f21> Hi all, The community college that I am attending is having a job fair next week. I have never really attended a job fair, so I was wondering if anyone here has any tips on navigating a job fair? There will be 60 or 70 different employers there, so it will probably be a large job fair. The good thing is that the college provided a spread sheet on the employers and job positions, but it does not discuss how things will be laid out. Will it look bad to potential employers if you have help navigating around the job fair, such as someone who walks with you and just reads out the signs and tells you what is where, or is it better to do that independently, even though you will not know which booth or table is which? I am usually a very independent person that does just about everything on my own, but this is something new for me, and I don't want to look bad or awkward to employers while moving around the job fair. Also, I do not know if it would turn employers away if I go to each table and ask which company it is. Also, if you had to fill out any applications there on the spot, how did you manage that? Have any of you had any success with job fairs, and what did you find that worked for you? Any tips or experiences will be appreciated. Thank you, Misty From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 21:52:44 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 17:52:44 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: <12257A5B-5829-4D5D-9C26-7AECE2C4B5E4@panix.com> References: <513e3b05.43baec0a.48df.0fb8@mx.google.com> <12257A5B-5829-4D5D-9C26-7AECE2C4B5E4@panix.com> Message-ID: Sophie and all, I have to disagree with Mike's last comment. Seeing as Humanware caters to a very specific group of people and is dependent on their money to keep their company afloat they would be frankly speaking stupid not to listen to a complaint such as this from their customers. This isn't some tiny little glitch that is just a nuisance every once in a while, ut is a reoccurring thing. This is the precise reason why I switched to Hims instead of Humanware. Not for this precise reason, but when you compare the two sets of notetakers side by side it's no wonder why web surfing on the BrailleSense is faster; a machine running a decent version of windows software rather than MS Dos like the BrailleNote is going to produce better results because it is more in sync with the other technology out there today. I can only wonder why Humanware hasn't figured out how to upgrade their operating system from one of the 90's to something more current. Of course the BrailleSense line of notetakers are by no means flawless, but I have found that my BrailleSense responds a lot better, I don't have to reset it as much as I had to reset my BrailleNote, and the web surfing is pretty good considering it's on a notetaker rather than a laptop. I think if enough people were to sign something and explicitly state the problem and the inconvenience it causes then Humanware would be wise to listen and at least make some effort in updating the security certificate list. The fact that this happens on sites which Humanware already programs into the favorites is another good point and one worth mentioning as well. Perhaps NABS could start something and hopefully it would matriculate to other divisions. I've heard plenty of older people complain about issues with their BrailleNotes as well so this wouldn't just be something for the students to work on if it were to happen. On 3/11/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > sophie: > I don't know you so am reluctant to comment upon your assertion that a slate > is inefficient except to say that such assertions are often made by those > who do not use a slate extensively and therefore are unfamiliar with how > efficient it can be in skilled hands. > As for electronic petitions, they are IMO worthless since they cannot be > verified. Moreover, keeping up with such things as security certificates and > current trends in web design is a thankless, if not an impossible task for > manufacturers of specialized devices. > And Apple periodically breaks Braille support and we must wait months for > the fix! > > Mike Freeman > sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 11, 2013, at 13:43, "Ashley Bramlett" > wrote: > >> As for the slate versus the notetaker, generally, its faster with the >> notetaker; but a slate can be as fast as a pencil and paper if you have >> practiced enough. But I would never be fast like that as I did not grow up >> with it. >> >> I like the petetion idea too. why not do i t online or at the nfb >> convention? >> >> -----Original Message----- From: Sophie Trist >> Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 4:13 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >> >> Mike, I'm going to have to disagree with you here. Slates and >> styluses are very inefficient. On my BN, I can type notes in >> class faster than most sighted kids can write them. On an S&S, >> notetaking would take ten times as long and be three times as >> difficult. Also, I have found Apple's braille support to be very >> nice. Yeah, it's not perfect, but it's great all things >> considered. Okay, sorry for the rant and for getting off topic. >> Kaiti, I like your idea of petitioning Humanware to include an >> updated list of security certificates (as well as a freakin Docx >> converter) into their next update. Does anyone know how we could >> get such a project started? >> >> Yours sincerely, >> Sophie >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Mike Freeman > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> > Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 11:55:22 -0700 >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >> >> The answer is extremely simple although my observation is that >> most blind people do not want to hear it. >> First, piezoelectric braille displays are expensive and the >> demand for them is small enough that their price is unlikely to >> decrease much. >> Second, Apple sells far more i-devices than Humanware, HIMS and >> Levelstar/APH sell note-takers. Therefore, Apple can take >> advantage of economies of scale in production that note-taker >> manufacturers can only dream of. High production quantity >> translates directly into lower prices >> This is the economic consequence of being the minority we know >> ourselves to be. The fact that note-takers are, in essence, >> glorified PDAs with braille displays matters not one whit where >> economics are concerned. The kicker here is that we cannot depend >> upon mainstream devices to meet all our needs >> All the complaining in the world won't change this reality. The >> one consolation we have here is that slates and styluses are >> still cheap! >> >> Mike Freeman >> sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 11, 2013, at 11:05, Sarah wrote: >> >> Yeah my point is the same why in the world would you have to pay >> over $5,000 for a device that can barely do more than go on >> Facebook or google or Bookshare when an iPhone costs less than >> half the price and you can do anything on it. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Valerie Gibson > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> > Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 01:38:15 -0500 >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >> >> I think i saw something about it on the BN mailing list, but >> someone said their computer was doing it too, and I have not had >> that problem. Overall, the thread on it was not too helpful, but >> maybe I just didn't dig deep enough. >> >> Another bad part about all this is, I can't even exit the >> internet because the dialog pops up again. I have to reset my >> BN. >> >> It's sadly getting to the point where, if not for the braille >> display, the BN would not be worth having?쫆t least that's my >> thinking. >> >> I know the BN can only do so muc, but if it were half as good as >> a mobile device that would be something. I don't mean to bash >> the braillenote or the manufacturer, and I appologize if my tone >> is coming across as such, it's just?쫡o spend that much money on >> a device and have your iphone/ipad, which coasts a fifth of the >> price, work more flawlessly is a wee bit disappointing. >> >> Maybe humanware should up the game and make a iphone/ipad >> docking station with a braille display at the bottom?쫛r an >> iphone/ipad case with a braille display somehow built in. You >> have to admit, that would be beautiful. :) >> >> If anyone figures out a way around this, please let me know. >> Thanks so much. >> On Mar 11, 2013, at 12:09 AM, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer >> wrote: >> >> good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! >> I can not figure a way around them either. Do you know of the >> braillenote mailing list? >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson >> wrote: >> >> Hi, >> >> Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts >> while using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to >> facebook or bookshare, I'll get: >> Security alert dialog. >> informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or >> changed by others. However, there is a problem with the site's >> security certificate. The security certificate is from a trusted >> certifying athority. >> The security certificate date is valid. >> The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not >> match the name of the site. >> Do you want to continue? >> >> The problem is: >> 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I >> just hit yes on it. >> 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote >> lags. for example, from "The name on the security certificate is >> invalid?? to "do you want to continue?? it takes the >> braillenote a second at most to jump from those two line. When >> you're dealing with four lines, that's four seconds, just to get >> to the prompt. With all of that added up, it takes about a >> minute to get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the prompt >> and it still brings up security stuff.. >> >> Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, >> etc? :) >> >> Thanks >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm >> ail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%4 >> 0gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/coastergirl92 >> %40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix >> .com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade >> r%40gmail.com >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 21:59:06 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 17:59:06 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: References: <513e3b05.43baec0a.48df.0fb8@mx.google.com> <12257A5B-5829-4D5D-9C26-7AECE2C4B5E4@panix.com> Message-ID: Sophie and all again, Sorry about that, I got excited and was a little unclear. Anyway, what I meant to say in my first paragraph was that I have to agree with Sophie on the issue of a slate is sort of old fashioned. I've primarily heard of older people using it and most people I know who are my age were never even taught how to use one. Plus you have to write everything backwards and to me that just seems a lot more complicated than writing on a bt keyboard. Plus with slates you only have the option of writing braille, which doesn't work today when you're expected to produce print for professors or teachers if you're working on something for school. Maybe it's a generational thing, but I sort of see notetakers as the successsors to the slate since you have more options with them. On 3/11/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Sophie and all, > > I have to disagree with Mike's last comment. Seeing as Humanware > caters to a very specific group of people and is dependent on their > money to keep their company afloat they would be frankly speaking > stupid not to listen to a complaint such as this from their customers. > This isn't some tiny little glitch that is just a nuisance every once > in a while, ut is a reoccurring thing. This is the precise reason why > I switched to Hims instead of Humanware. Not for this precise reason, > but when you compare the two sets of notetakers side by side it's no > wonder why web surfing on the BrailleSense is faster; a machine > running a decent version of windows software rather than MS Dos like > the BrailleNote is going to produce better results because it is more > in sync with the other technology out there today. I can only wonder > why Humanware hasn't figured out how to upgrade their operating system > from one of the 90's to something more current. Of course the > BrailleSense line of notetakers are by no means flawless, but I have > found that my BrailleSense responds a lot better, I don't have to > reset it as much as I had to reset my BrailleNote, and the web surfing > is pretty good considering it's on a notetaker rather than a laptop. > > I think if enough people were to sign something and explicitly state > the problem and the inconvenience it causes then Humanware would be > wise to listen and at least make some effort in updating the security > certificate list. The fact that this happens on sites which Humanware > already programs into the favorites is another good point and one > worth mentioning as well. Perhaps NABS could start something and > hopefully it would matriculate to other divisions. I've heard plenty > of older people complain about issues with their BrailleNotes as well > so this wouldn't just be something for the students to work on if it > were to happen. > > On 3/11/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >> sophie: >> I don't know you so am reluctant to comment upon your assertion that a >> slate >> is inefficient except to say that such assertions are often made by those >> who do not use a slate extensively and therefore are unfamiliar with how >> efficient it can be in skilled hands. >> As for electronic petitions, they are IMO worthless since they cannot be >> verified. Moreover, keeping up with such things as security certificates >> and >> current trends in web design is a thankless, if not an impossible task >> for >> manufacturers of specialized devices. >> And Apple periodically breaks Braille support and we must wait months for >> the fix! >> >> Mike Freeman >> sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 11, 2013, at 13:43, "Ashley Bramlett" >> wrote: >> >>> As for the slate versus the notetaker, generally, its faster with the >>> notetaker; but a slate can be as fast as a pencil and paper if you have >>> practiced enough. But I would never be fast like that as I did not grow >>> up >>> with it. >>> >>> I like the petetion idea too. why not do i t online or at the nfb >>> convention? >>> >>> -----Original Message----- From: Sophie Trist >>> Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 4:13 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >>> >>> Mike, I'm going to have to disagree with you here. Slates and >>> styluses are very inefficient. On my BN, I can type notes in >>> class faster than most sighted kids can write them. On an S&S, >>> notetaking would take ten times as long and be three times as >>> difficult. Also, I have found Apple's braille support to be very >>> nice. Yeah, it's not perfect, but it's great all things >>> considered. Okay, sorry for the rant and for getting off topic. >>> Kaiti, I like your idea of petitioning Humanware to include an >>> updated list of security certificates (as well as a freakin Docx >>> converter) into their next update. Does anyone know how we could >>> get such a project started? >>> >>> Yours sincerely, >>> Sophie >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: Mike Freeman >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> >> Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 11:55:22 -0700 >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >>> >>> The answer is extremely simple although my observation is that >>> most blind people do not want to hear it. >>> First, piezoelectric braille displays are expensive and the >>> demand for them is small enough that their price is unlikely to >>> decrease much. >>> Second, Apple sells far more i-devices than Humanware, HIMS and >>> Levelstar/APH sell note-takers. Therefore, Apple can take >>> advantage of economies of scale in production that note-taker >>> manufacturers can only dream of. High production quantity >>> translates directly into lower prices >>> This is the economic consequence of being the minority we know >>> ourselves to be. The fact that note-takers are, in essence, >>> glorified PDAs with braille displays matters not one whit where >>> economics are concerned. The kicker here is that we cannot depend >>> upon mainstream devices to meet all our needs >>> All the complaining in the world won't change this reality. The >>> one consolation we have here is that slates and styluses are >>> still cheap! >>> >>> Mike Freeman >>> sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 11, 2013, at 11:05, Sarah wrote: >>> >>> Yeah my point is the same why in the world would you have to pay >>> over $5,000 for a device that can barely do more than go on >>> Facebook or google or Bookshare when an iPhone costs less than >>> half the price and you can do anything on it. >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: Valerie Gibson >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> >> Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 01:38:15 -0500 >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >>> >>> I think i saw something about it on the BN mailing list, but >>> someone said their computer was doing it too, and I have not had >>> that problem. Overall, the thread on it was not too helpful, but >>> maybe I just didn't dig deep enough. >>> >>> Another bad part about all this is, I can't even exit the >>> internet because the dialog pops up again. I have to reset my >>> BN. >>> >>> It's sadly getting to the point where, if not for the braille >>> display, the BN would not be worth having?쫆t least that's my >>> thinking. >>> >>> I know the BN can only do so muc, but if it were half as good as >>> a mobile device that would be something. I don't mean to bash >>> the braillenote or the manufacturer, and I appologize if my tone >>> is coming across as such, it's just?쫡o spend that much money on >>> a device and have your iphone/ipad, which coasts a fifth of the >>> price, work more flawlessly is a wee bit disappointing. >>> >>> Maybe humanware should up the game and make a iphone/ipad >>> docking station with a braille display at the bottom?쫛r an >>> iphone/ipad case with a braille display somehow built in. You >>> have to admit, that would be beautiful. :) >>> >>> If anyone figures out a way around this, please let me know. >>> Thanks so much. >>> On Mar 11, 2013, at 12:09 AM, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer >>> wrote: >>> >>> good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! >>> I can not figure a way around them either. Do you know of the >>> braillenote mailing list? >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson >>> wrote: >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts >>> while using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to >>> facebook or bookshare, I'll get: >>> Security alert dialog. >>> informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or >>> changed by others. However, there is a problem with the site's >>> security certificate. The security certificate is from a trusted >>> certifying athority. >>> The security certificate date is valid. >>> The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not >>> match the name of the site. >>> Do you want to continue? >>> >>> The problem is: >>> 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I >>> just hit yes on it. >>> 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote >>> lags. for example, from "The name on the security certificate is >>> invalid?? to "do you want to continue?? it takes the >>> braillenote a second at most to jump from those two line. When >>> you're dealing with four lines, that's four seconds, just to get >>> to the prompt. With all of that added up, it takes about a >>> minute to get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the prompt >>> and it still brings up security stuff.. >>> >>> Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, >>> etc? :) >>> >>> Thanks >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>> info for nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm >>> ail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>> info for nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%4 >>> 0gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>> info for nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/coastergirl92 >>> %40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>> info for nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix >>> .com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade >>> r%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > -- Kaiti From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 22:02:54 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 18:02:54 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Navigating Job Fairs In-Reply-To: <1A0B02D10E7D4C31A38796C200534562@acerd37f251f21> References: <1A0B02D10E7D4C31A38796C200534562@acerd37f251f21> Message-ID: Hello, I think having someone with you would be ideal. I don't think it would look bad to employers if you have someone to inform you which table you were walking up to, or to help you fill out an application if they have paper copies available. From talking to you they should be able to tell what kind of person you are and appreciate that you took the consideration to have someone give you a slight amount of assistance to be informed in the job fair. On 3/11/13, Misty Dawn Bradley wrote: > Hi all, > The community college that I am attending is having a job fair next week. I > have never really attended a job fair, so I was wondering if anyone here has > any tips on navigating a job fair? There will be 60 or 70 different > employers there, so it will probably be a large job fair. The good thing is > that the college provided a spread sheet on the employers and job positions, > but it does not discuss how things will be laid out. Will it look bad to > potential employers if you have help navigating around the job fair, such as > someone who walks with you and just reads out the signs and tells you what > is where, or is it better to do that independently, even though you will not > know which booth or table is which? I am usually a very independent person > that does just about everything on my own, but this is something new for me, > and I don't want to look bad or awkward to employers while moving around the > job fair. Also, I do not know if it would turn employers away if I go to > each table and ask which company it is. Also, if you had to fill out any > applications there on the spot, how did you manage that? Have any of you had > any success with job fairs, and what did you find that worked for you? > Any tips or experiences will be appreciated. > Thank you, > Misty > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Mon Mar 11 22:35:00 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 18:35:00 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Navigating Job Fairs In-Reply-To: <1A0B02D10E7D4C31A38796C200534562@acerd37f251f21> References: <1A0B02D10E7D4C31A38796C200534562@acerd37f251f21> Message-ID: <4C559E167F3741B49C887AECE4F010EC@OwnerPC> Hello, I suggest having a guide. Its very noisy and crowded especially with the amount of employers you described. The challenge is knowing where the lines end in the maze of people and knowing what table is what. So yes, I suggest having someone navigate it with you. If you cannot have someone, go at a less busy time such as the last hour and then ask what each table is as you get near it. For job applications, this is where a fellow sighted guide comes in handy; if you don't have that, another representative at the table may be able to assist you. Often there are two people at each table; so one can help you while another answers questions. Another way may be to fill it out later with a reader and mail it in or fax it. I suspect though that this will not be an issue because most job applications are online anyway. -----Original Message----- From: Misty Dawn Bradley Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 5:43 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] Navigating Job Fairs Hi all, The community college that I am attending is having a job fair next week. I have never really attended a job fair, so I was wondering if anyone here has any tips on navigating a job fair? There will be 60 or 70 different employers there, so it will probably be a large job fair. The good thing is that the college provided a spread sheet on the employers and job positions, but it does not discuss how things will be laid out. Will it look bad to potential employers if you have help navigating around the job fair, such as someone who walks with you and just reads out the signs and tells you what is where, or is it better to do that independently, even though you will not know which booth or table is which? I am usually a very independent person that does just about everything on my own, but this is something new for me, and I don't want to look bad or awkward to employers while moving around the job fair. Also, I do not know if it would turn employers away if I go to each table and ask which company it is. Also, if you had to fill out any applications there on the spot, how did you manage that? Have any of you had any success with job fairs, and what did you find that worked for you? Any tips or experiences will be appreciated. Thank you, Misty _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From arielle71 at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 22:43:35 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 16:43:35 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Navigating Job Fairs In-Reply-To: <4C559E167F3741B49C887AECE4F010EC@OwnerPC> References: <1A0B02D10E7D4C31A38796C200534562@acerd37f251f21> <4C559E167F3741B49C887AECE4F010EC@OwnerPC> Message-ID: This is a great question and I'm curious to hear from anyone who has successfully made a job connection at a job fair. I suspect that job fairs are a resource under-utilized by blind job seekers, in part because of the access issues being brought up here. I agree that bringing a guide or reader would probably be wise, though I know it may be difficult to find someone to do it. If you have a dedicated reader already then this seems like a fine time to bring this person along and compensate them for their help in navigating and filling out job applications. I would be less excited about the idea of bringing a family member or friend with you since it is an imposition on their time (plus telling the employer you are with your mom or dad might make a less favorable impression) but depending on the kind of relationship you have with this person, this may work. You also want to be sure your reader/guide goes where you want them to go and doesn't filter the information for you (again, this can be a problem with parents etc. sometimes). On the other hand, if you don't have access to a reader, going at a less busy time and asking each table who they are seems like a fine solution too. It would also be nice if the job fair had an information table and then you could go there and ask the representative to point you to specific employers' tables (who you've identified in advance by looking at the online info). Best of luck and keep us posted, Arielle On 3/11/13, Ashley Bramlett wrote: > Hello, > I suggest having a guide. Its very noisy and crowded especially with the > amount of employers you described. > The challenge is knowing where the lines end in the maze of people and > knowing what table is what. So yes, I suggest having someone navigate it > with you. If you cannot have someone, go at a less busy time such as the > last hour and then ask what each table is as you get near it. For job > applications, this is where a fellow sighted guide comes in handy; if you > don't have that, another representative at the table may be able to assist > you. Often there are two people at each table; so one can help you while > another answers questions. > > Another way may be to fill it out later with a reader and mail it in or fax > > it. > I suspect though that this will not be an issue because most job > applications are online anyway. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Misty Dawn Bradley > Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 5:43 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: [nabs-l] Navigating Job Fairs > > Hi all, > The community college that I am attending is having a job fair next week. I > > have never really attended a job fair, so I was wondering if anyone here has > > any tips on navigating a job fair? There will be 60 or 70 different > employers there, so it will probably be a large job fair. The good thing is > > that the college provided a spread sheet on the employers and job positions, > > but it does not discuss how things will be laid out. Will it look bad to > potential employers if you have help navigating around the job fair, such as > > someone who walks with you and just reads out the signs and tells you what > is where, or is it better to do that independently, even though you will not > > know which booth or table is which? I am usually a very independent person > that does just about everything on my own, but this is something new for me, > > and I don't want to look bad or awkward to employers while moving around the > > job fair. Also, I do not know if it would turn employers away if I go to > each table and ask which company it is. Also, if you had to fill out any > applications there on the spot, how did you manage that? Have any of you had > > any success with job fairs, and what did you find that worked for you? > Any tips or experiences will be appreciated. > Thank you, > Misty > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From arielle71 at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 22:52:14 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 16:52:14 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: References: <513e3b05.43baec0a.48df.0fb8@mx.google.com> <12257A5B-5829-4D5D-9C26-7AECE2C4B5E4@panix.com> Message-ID: Hi all, One alternative everyone seems to forget about is getting a stand-alone Braille display and pairing it with a mainstream PC, Mac or I-device. APH sells a stand-alone display for about $1800 and there may be others. I bought one because I didn't see the point of spending an additional $4000 to get a Braille Note (assuming the Apex runs around $6000), which is basically just a Braille display and a bunch of other things that you can get in better quality on a mainstream device for far less than $4000. As someone who used a Braille Note for seven years, and a Braille Lite for six more before that, I have to agree with the complaints about antiquated operating systems. In addition, while I'm no tech expert, I'm pretty sure that in 2013 we should not have to still be dealing with batteries that require calibration or that lose their "memory" if you don't fully charge them between uses. I don't know a single person who never had a problem with their Braille Note battery. Hopefully they will get better someday. I will say, the one time I miss my Braille Note is when giving presentations, because I like to have my own notes separate from what is on the PowerPoint slide and the Braille Note was great for that. I use hard-copy Braille now when I need to read something aloud, but sometimes that can be hard to come by. Arielle On 3/11/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Sophie and all again, > > Sorry about that, I got excited and was a little unclear. Anyway, > what I meant to say in my first paragraph was that I have to agree > with Sophie on the issue of a slate is sort of old fashioned. I've > primarily heard of older people using it and most people I know who > are my age were never even taught how to use one. Plus you have to > write everything backwards and to me that just seems a lot more > complicated than writing on a bt keyboard. Plus with slates you only > have the option of writing braille, which doesn't work today when > you're expected to produce print for professors or teachers if you're > working on something for school. Maybe it's a generational thing, but > I sort of see notetakers as the successsors to the slate since you > have more options with them. > > > On 3/11/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >> Sophie and all, >> >> I have to disagree with Mike's last comment. Seeing as Humanware >> caters to a very specific group of people and is dependent on their >> money to keep their company afloat they would be frankly speaking >> stupid not to listen to a complaint such as this from their customers. >> This isn't some tiny little glitch that is just a nuisance every once >> in a while, ut is a reoccurring thing. This is the precise reason why >> I switched to Hims instead of Humanware. Not for this precise reason, >> but when you compare the two sets of notetakers side by side it's no >> wonder why web surfing on the BrailleSense is faster; a machine >> running a decent version of windows software rather than MS Dos like >> the BrailleNote is going to produce better results because it is more >> in sync with the other technology out there today. I can only wonder >> why Humanware hasn't figured out how to upgrade their operating system >> from one of the 90's to something more current. Of course the >> BrailleSense line of notetakers are by no means flawless, but I have >> found that my BrailleSense responds a lot better, I don't have to >> reset it as much as I had to reset my BrailleNote, and the web surfing >> is pretty good considering it's on a notetaker rather than a laptop. >> >> I think if enough people were to sign something and explicitly state >> the problem and the inconvenience it causes then Humanware would be >> wise to listen and at least make some effort in updating the security >> certificate list. The fact that this happens on sites which Humanware >> already programs into the favorites is another good point and one >> worth mentioning as well. Perhaps NABS could start something and >> hopefully it would matriculate to other divisions. I've heard plenty >> of older people complain about issues with their BrailleNotes as well >> so this wouldn't just be something for the students to work on if it >> were to happen. >> >> On 3/11/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>> sophie: >>> I don't know you so am reluctant to comment upon your assertion that a >>> slate >>> is inefficient except to say that such assertions are often made by those >>> who do not use a slate extensively and therefore are unfamiliar with how >>> efficient it can be in skilled hands. >>> As for electronic petitions, they are IMO worthless since they cannot be >>> verified. Moreover, keeping up with such things as security certificates >>> and >>> current trends in web design is a thankless, if not an impossible task >>> for >>> manufacturers of specialized devices. >>> And Apple periodically breaks Braille support and we must wait months for >>> the fix! >>> >>> Mike Freeman >>> sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 11, 2013, at 13:43, "Ashley Bramlett" >>> wrote: >>> >>>> As for the slate versus the notetaker, generally, its faster with the >>>> notetaker; but a slate can be as fast as a pencil and paper if you have >>>> practiced enough. But I would never be fast like that as I did not grow >>>> up >>>> with it. >>>> >>>> I like the petetion idea too. why not do i t online or at the nfb >>>> convention? >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- From: Sophie Trist >>>> Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 4:13 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >>>> >>>> Mike, I'm going to have to disagree with you here. Slates and >>>> styluses are very inefficient. On my BN, I can type notes in >>>> class faster than most sighted kids can write them. On an S&S, >>>> notetaking would take ten times as long and be three times as >>>> difficult. Also, I have found Apple's braille support to be very >>>> nice. Yeah, it's not perfect, but it's great all things >>>> considered. Okay, sorry for the rant and for getting off topic. >>>> Kaiti, I like your idea of petitioning Humanware to include an >>>> updated list of security certificates (as well as a freakin Docx >>>> converter) into their next update. Does anyone know how we could >>>> get such a project started? >>>> >>>> Yours sincerely, >>>> Sophie >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: Mike Freeman >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> >>> Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 11:55:22 -0700 >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >>>> >>>> The answer is extremely simple although my observation is that >>>> most blind people do not want to hear it. >>>> First, piezoelectric braille displays are expensive and the >>>> demand for them is small enough that their price is unlikely to >>>> decrease much. >>>> Second, Apple sells far more i-devices than Humanware, HIMS and >>>> Levelstar/APH sell note-takers. Therefore, Apple can take >>>> advantage of economies of scale in production that note-taker >>>> manufacturers can only dream of. High production quantity >>>> translates directly into lower prices >>>> This is the economic consequence of being the minority we know >>>> ourselves to be. The fact that note-takers are, in essence, >>>> glorified PDAs with braille displays matters not one whit where >>>> economics are concerned. The kicker here is that we cannot depend >>>> upon mainstream devices to meet all our needs >>>> All the complaining in the world won't change this reality. The >>>> one consolation we have here is that slates and styluses are >>>> still cheap! >>>> >>>> Mike Freeman >>>> sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 11, 2013, at 11:05, Sarah wrote: >>>> >>>> Yeah my point is the same why in the world would you have to pay >>>> over $5,000 for a device that can barely do more than go on >>>> Facebook or google or Bookshare when an iPhone costs less than >>>> half the price and you can do anything on it. >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: Valerie Gibson >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> >>> Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 01:38:15 -0500 >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >>>> >>>> I think i saw something about it on the BN mailing list, but >>>> someone said their computer was doing it too, and I have not had >>>> that problem. Overall, the thread on it was not too helpful, but >>>> maybe I just didn't dig deep enough. >>>> >>>> Another bad part about all this is, I can't even exit the >>>> internet because the dialog pops up again. I have to reset my >>>> BN. >>>> >>>> It's sadly getting to the point where, if not for the braille >>>> display, the BN would not be worth having?쫆t least that's my >>>> thinking. >>>> >>>> I know the BN can only do so muc, but if it were half as good as >>>> a mobile device that would be something. I don't mean to bash >>>> the braillenote or the manufacturer, and I appologize if my tone >>>> is coming across as such, it's just?쫡o spend that much money on >>>> a device and have your iphone/ipad, which coasts a fifth of the >>>> price, work more flawlessly is a wee bit disappointing. >>>> >>>> Maybe humanware should up the game and make a iphone/ipad >>>> docking station with a braille display at the bottom?쫛r an >>>> iphone/ipad case with a braille display somehow built in. You >>>> have to admit, that would be beautiful. :) >>>> >>>> If anyone figures out a way around this, please let me know. >>>> Thanks so much. >>>> On Mar 11, 2013, at 12:09 AM, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! >>>> I can not figure a way around them either. Do you know of the >>>> braillenote mailing list? >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts >>>> while using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to >>>> facebook or bookshare, I'll get: >>>> Security alert dialog. >>>> informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or >>>> changed by others. However, there is a problem with the site's >>>> security certificate. The security certificate is from a trusted >>>> certifying athority. >>>> The security certificate date is valid. >>>> The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not >>>> match the name of the site. >>>> Do you want to continue? >>>> >>>> The problem is: >>>> 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I >>>> just hit yes on it. >>>> 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote >>>> lags. for example, from "The name on the security certificate is >>>> invalid?? to "do you want to continue?? it takes the >>>> braillenote a second at most to jump from those two line. When >>>> you're dealing with four lines, that's four seconds, just to get >>>> to the prompt. With all of that added up, it takes about a >>>> minute to get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the prompt >>>> and it still brings up security stuff.. >>>> >>>> Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, >>>> etc? :) >>>> >>>> Thanks >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>> info for nabs-l: >>>> >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm >>>> ail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>> info for nabs-l: >>>> >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%4 >>>> 0gmail.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>> info for nabs-l: >>>> >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/coastergirl92 >>>> %40gmail.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>> info for nabs-l: >>>> >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix >>>> .com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade >>>> r%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From jsoro620 at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 22:57:24 2013 From: jsoro620 at gmail.com (Joe) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 18:57:24 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Is Graduate School Worth It? Message-ID: <01ef01ce1eab$cbe1d920$63a58b60$@gmail.com> Why do you want to go to graduate school? You generally felt college was worth it. You got your bachelor's degree because you heard a college degree leads to a better salary. Maybe you feel grad school is the next logical step because you think the specialty of a Master's will make you more marketable. A doctoral degree? Outside of academia, I don't know that the degree will open up that many more doors than an undergraduate diploma. In most cases people are continuing to climb the scholastic ladder because they want to gain a distinct advantage over competing job applicants, but the diminishing returns of graduate studies should make us wonder if we are making the wisest investments of our energy, time, and money. Some career tracks require education beyond a Bachelor's. To my knowledge, you can't become a licensed clinical social worker without a Master's in social work. As far as I know, you can't become a doctor without medical school. Attorneys can't be attorneys without taking the Bar, and in most jurisdictions you can't take the Bar without graduating from an accredited law school. If your interests lie in a highly specialized field that requires advanced education, may your efforts be blessed. Nothing will be more fulfilling than following your own dream. For those of us considering careers in the humanities and social sciences, we have to ask some hard questions. Let's start with one of the most obvious ones: Read the rest of the article: http://joeorozco.com/blog_is_graduate_school_worth_it From gloria.graves at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 23:08:41 2013 From: gloria.graves at gmail.com (Gloria G) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 18:08:41 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Is Graduate School Worth It? References: <01ef01ce1eab$cbe1d920$63a58b60$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <39737F4B25D9442C8D7E0E2F3818E3B6@Gloria> Thank you for sending this! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe" To: "'NATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF BLIND STUDENTS'" Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 5:57 PM Subject: [nabs-l] Is Graduate School Worth It? > Why do you want to go to graduate school? You generally felt college was > worth it. You got your bachelor's degree because you heard a college > degree > leads to a better salary. Maybe you feel grad school is the next logical > step because you think the specialty of a Master's will make you more > marketable. A doctoral degree? Outside of academia, I don't know that the > degree will open up that many more doors than an undergraduate diploma. In > most cases people are continuing to climb the scholastic ladder because > they > want to gain a distinct advantage over competing job applicants, but the > diminishing returns of graduate studies should make us wonder if we are > making the wisest investments of our energy, time, and money. > > Some career tracks require education beyond a Bachelor's. To my knowledge, > you can't become a licensed clinical social worker without a Master's in > social work. As far as I know, you can't become a doctor without medical > school. Attorneys can't be attorneys without taking the Bar, and in most > jurisdictions you can't take the Bar without graduating from an accredited > law school. If your interests lie in a highly specialized field that > requires advanced education, may your efforts be blessed. Nothing will be > more fulfilling than following your own dream. > > For those of us considering careers in the humanities and social sciences, > we have to ask some hard questions. Let's start with one of the most > obvious > ones: > > > > Read the rest of the article: > > > > http://joeorozco.com/blog_is_graduate_school_worth_it > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gmail.com From arielle71 at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 23:26:39 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 17:26:39 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings In-Reply-To: <000301ce1d2f$c0d4c100$427e4300$@gmail.com> References: <003601ce1aee$c2b036f0$4810a4d0$@gmail.com> <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE22C@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> <000301ce1d2f$c0d4c100$427e4300$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi Justin, If you want to talk off-list you can email me at arielle71 at gmail.com Best, Arielle On 3/9/13, justin williams wrote: > Thank you Arielle and Zeynep for offering to assist me. > > Yes, let's talk. I would like to go into ADA consulting, but also, I would > like to go into research but I don't know for exactly what. I do not know > how research specialties work. I would like to do something more than just > blindness issues; I like the social component you have going. I do like > research, and spreading it around to vocational rehabilitation issues seems > like it would be good. I love ADA stuff. I would like to use research and > skill to be an advocate, and to push the wider community to accept us. I > don't know what major would be good. I'm trying to stay at the university > of South Carolina; I have a house, and moving would be annoying. The only > way that might derail me is the right job for the wounded warriors, but I > really want the PhD. I plan to get my MRC, LPC, and certification in > psychiatric counseling, but I would like to then immediately move on to the > PHD program. I appreciate both of you emailing me. Thank you. When can > I > pick one of your brains? Maybe over personal email, or over the phone. > What > ever is more convenient. I don't want to fill the list up with personal > chatter. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of zeynep sule > yilmaz > Sent: Sunday, March 10, 2013 6:52 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Greetings > > Hello Justin and everyone, > > I'm doing my master's in rehabilitation counseling psychology and I > have a broad range of information about PhD programs and their > focusing area. If you have any question, please feel free to ask me. > > Zeynep > > > 2013/3/9, Arielle Silverman : >> Hi Justin, >> Welcome to the list. After your master's, what field are you hoping to >> get your Ph.D. in? Rehabilitation counseling or research? Are you more >> interested in the counseling side or the research side? >> I'm asking because I'm doing my Ph.D. in social psychology hoping to >> become a research professor who focuses on blindness-related social >> issues, especially those relating to education and rehabilitation. It >> is always nice to meet someone else who is interested in similar >> research topics. My field is a bit different from yours but I'm still >> available to answer questions about the basic Ph.D. process. >> Arielle >> >> On 3/8/13, Wasif, Zunaira wrote: >>> I am a counselor in the field and have one more class to complete in >>> order to obtain my masters. Let me know if you have questions. You can >>> email me off list at Zunaira.wasif at dbs.fldoe.org >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>> williams >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2013 11:47 PM >>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Greetings >>> >>> Hello, my name is Justin Williams, and I am in school for the Master's >>> of Rehabilitation counseling degree with the intent to obtain my Lpc, >>> then my PHd right afterwards. >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. >>> fldoe.org >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blacklotus86%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Tue Mar 12 00:12:14 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 20:12:14 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games Message-ID: Hi all, There is a heavy trend toward developing video games and portable games for on screen use. >From fun games like bowling and basketball to academic games for math and science, they are out there. Some are portable; others are for home use. For at home we have the WII, Playstation and xbox. For portable options, there are numerous ones. All tablets and smart phones have games. Then you have the Kindle, Nook, and more. So what technology, if any, do you use as an alternative to these on screen games? Games range from adaptations of real card or board games to new ones developed for these portable book readers and tablets. Scrabble, Hangman, monopoly, and word searches are some games. I am beginning to feel left out when people talk about all these games. Perhaps, you all feel that way. My mother, who usually hates technology, has fallen in love with a few games on her new Kindle Fire; of course, not accessible to us. My mom is intimidated by computers, yet somehow picked up the concept in the kindle okay. She has games, music aps, and books on it. Perhaps, there are IOS games out there. I suppose there are computer games which I just haven’t looked at. I’d love to have a version of hangman, word puzzles, and card games for the pc. There are two games I had as a kid; I don’t know if both still exist as its old technology. But one does. 1. The Speak n Spell was a handheld thing; like a primative computer. You used it as a dictionary and it had academic games on it such as guessing partial words, a word scramble where you had to unscramble letters to make a word, word matching, and more games. 2. The Franklin Language master still exists; I saw it online. Most have the pc for a dictionary. But for those who want another portable option or a way to expand your vocabulary, this is excellent. It is lightweight with a qwerty style keyboard and speaks everything as well as a way to magnify the text. You can play word games on it such as hangman, word scramble, flash cards, word train, creating anagrams and more. I think there’s ten games on it. So what else is out there? Maybe something from APH? Thanks. Ashley From avila.bert.humberto2 at gmail.com Tue Mar 12 00:16:07 2013 From: avila.bert.humberto2 at gmail.com (Humberto Avila) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 17:16:07 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] FW: NVDA screen reader News: NVDA 2013.1beta1 available for testing In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <006001ce1eb6$cbda3700$638ea500$@gmail.com> -----Original Message----- From: nvda-announce-bounces at lists.nvaccess.org [mailto:nvda-announce-bounces at lists.nvaccess.org] On Behalf Of NVDA announcement list Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 9:31 AM To: nvda-announce at lists.nvaccess.org Subject: NVDA screen reader News: NVDA 2013.1beta1 available for testing NV Access is pleased to announce the release of NVDA 2013.1beta1. It is intended for those who are interested in testing and evaluating the upcoming NVDA 2013.1 release, but is not recommended for production use. Testers are encouraged to report any bugs found while using this beta. Note that some translations may not yet be updated. They will be updated by the time of the final 2013.1 release. Highlights of this release include a more intuitive and consistent laptop keyboard layout; basic support for Microsoft PowerPoint; support for long descriptions in web browsers; and support for input of computer braille for braille displays which have a braille keyboard. For more information such as links to download and what's new, please visit http://www.nvda-project.org/blog/NVDA2013.1beta1Released- Please consider donating to NV Access to support NVDA's continued development: http://www.nvaccess.org/wiki/Donate -- This is the NVDA announcement mailing list. To unsubscribe or edit your options, please visit: http://lists.nvaccess.org/listinfo/nvda-announce From jty727 at gmail.com Tue Mar 12 00:38:35 2013 From: jty727 at gmail.com (Justin Young) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 20:38:35 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible Message-ID: Hi All! Hope the semester is treating you all great! I know the IPhone is popular, but I was looking a few other phones and wanted to know if anyone knew if the Droids were accessible? I don't know the features it might have so I wanted to ask if any have tried them and could provide feedback. Thanks in advance! Justin Young From coasterfreak88 at me.com Tue Mar 12 00:52:51 2013 From: coasterfreak88 at me.com (John Moore) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 19:52:51 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Justin. I am also thinking about moving to ANdroid from an IPhone. A good resource is www.androidaccess.net. They have a lot of info on Android use ability. They also have a link to a Google Group for blind Droid users. Hope this helps. From jty727 at gmail.com Tue Mar 12 01:03:52 2013 From: jty727 at gmail.com (Justin Young) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 21:03:52 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks for the resources! Justin On 3/11/13, John Moore wrote: > Hi Justin. I am also thinking about moving to ANdroid from an IPhone. A good > resource is www.androidaccess.net. They have a lot of info on Android use > ability. They also have a link to a Google Group for blind Droid users. Hope > this helps. > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jty727%40gmail.com > From carlymih at comcast.net Tue Mar 12 01:06:06 2013 From: carlymih at comcast.net (Carly Mihalakis) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 18:06:06 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Navigating Job Fairs In-Reply-To: <1A0B02D10E7D4C31A38796C200534562@acerd37f251f21> References: <1A0B02D10E7D4C31A38796C200534562@acerd37f251f21> Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20130311175909.01bf3e88@comcast.net> Hi, Misty, From what I have been able to notice, sighted people sort of expect you to have an assistant of sorts to walk around with you, reading names, filling out aps. In fact, it would seem to me that bumbling around a job fair by oneself might represent an inability to know when to call on assistance. and that could also turn potential employers off to the idea of hiring a blind person. What do you think of this? Keep us posted on how this job fair goes, okay? for today, Car, just about everything on my own, but this is something new for me, and I don't want to look bad or awkward to employers while moving around the job fair. Also, I do not know if it would turn employers away if I go to each table and ask which company it is. Also, if you had to fill out any applications there on the spot, how did you manage that? Have any of you had any success with job fairs, and what did you find that worked for you? >Any tips or experiences will be appreciated. >Thank you, >Misty >_______________________________________________ >nabs-l mailing list >nabs-l at nfbnet.org >http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carlymih%40comcast.net From turtlepower17 at gmail.com Tue Mar 12 01:21:33 2013 From: turtlepower17 at gmail.com (Desiree Oudinot) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 21:21:33 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi, For the PC, try going to www.kitchensinc.net. there are a variety of free card and word games, as well as some others, that are fully accessible. They are self-voicing. They use Sappi. However, nothing shows up on the screen while you're playing. I'm not sure if you asked this question because you would like to have games to play with sighted people, but that's something for you to take into consideration if that's the case. There is also the RS games client, which is free as well. You can find it at rsgames.org. This has mostly card games, like uno, rummy, blackjack, and it also has monopoly. These are multiplayer games, so you need an active internet connection to run the client. There are others, some are free and some are not, but if you want to get a better sense of what audio games are available, I would suggest checking out audiogames.net. They have an extensive database of pretty much every accessible game in existance. There's also a forum where not only audio games are discussed, but how people make adaptations to be able to play certain video games, too. As a side note, there are quite a few IOS games that are accessible, from what I understand. However, since I'm not an IPhone user, I know very little about them, only that there are a whole bunch of them coming out. Development of PC games has slowed considerably, but it seems that some of the games on the IPhone are accessible without the developers intending them to be. On 3/11/13, Ashley Bramlett wrote: > Hi all, > > There is a heavy trend toward developing video games and portable games for > on screen use. > From fun games like bowling and basketball to academic games for math and > science, they are out there. > Some are portable; others are for home use. > For at home we have the WII, Playstation and xbox. For portable options, > there are numerous ones. All tablets and smart phones have games. Then you > have the Kindle, Nook, and more. > > So what technology, if any, do you use as an alternative to these on screen > games? > Games range from adaptations of real card or board games to new ones > developed for these portable book readers and tablets. > Scrabble, Hangman, monopoly, and word searches are some games. > > I am beginning to feel left out when people talk about all these games. > Perhaps, you all feel that way. > My mother, who usually hates technology, has fallen in love with a few games > on her new Kindle Fire; of course, not accessible to us. My mom is > intimidated by computers, yet somehow picked up the concept in the kindle > okay. She has games, music aps, and books on it. > Perhaps, there are IOS games out there. I suppose there are computer games > which I just haven’t looked at. > I’d love to have a version of hangman, word puzzles, and card games for the > pc. > There are two games I had as a kid; I don’t know if both still exist as its > old technology. But one does. > 1. The Speak n Spell was a handheld thing; like a primative computer. You > used it as a dictionary and it had academic games on it such as guessing > partial words, a word scramble where you had to unscramble letters to make a > word, word matching, and more games. > 2. The Franklin Language master still exists; I saw it online. Most have the > pc for a dictionary. But for those who want another portable option or a way > to expand your vocabulary, this is excellent. It is lightweight with a > qwerty style keyboard and speaks everything as well as a way to magnify the > text. You can play word games on it such as hangman, word scramble, flash > cards, word train, creating anagrams and more. I think there’s ten games on > it. > > So what else is out there? Maybe something from APH? > > Thanks. > Ashley > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/turtlepower17%40gmail.com > From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Tue Mar 12 01:32:30 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 21:32:30 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <9F3A5759A9AE41338F3F21E4A352A42D@OwnerPC> Hi Desiree, I'm interested in both types; games for me that can be only audible. But also games for multiple players. Are card games for more than one player or do you simply play against the computer? If you've played the card games, how does it work with jaws? Does jaws speak the card you are on and you press buttons to flip cards around? I've seen solitar being played and they use the mouse to flip and drag the cards around. I have a little vision. When you say self voicing, does this mean you use a built in speech synthesizer? Also, is rs games free? I'll have a look at these links. Thanks. Ashley -----Original Message----- From: Desiree Oudinot Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 9:21 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games Hi, For the PC, try going to www.kitchensinc.net. there are a variety of free card and word games, as well as some others, that are fully accessible. They are self-voicing. They use Sappi. However, nothing shows up on the screen while you're playing. I'm not sure if you asked this question because you would like to have games to play with sighted people, but that's something for you to take into consideration if that's the case. There is also the RS games client, which is free as well. You can find it at rsgames.org. This has mostly card games, like uno, rummy, blackjack, and it also has monopoly. These are multiplayer games, so you need an active internet connection to run the client. There are others, some are free and some are not, but if you want to get a better sense of what audio games are available, I would suggest checking out audiogames.net. They have an extensive database of pretty much every accessible game in existance. There's also a forum where not only audio games are discussed, but how people make adaptations to be able to play certain video games, too. As a side note, there are quite a few IOS games that are accessible, from what I understand. However, since I'm not an IPhone user, I know very little about them, only that there are a whole bunch of them coming out. Development of PC games has slowed considerably, but it seems that some of the games on the IPhone are accessible without the developers intending them to be. On 3/11/13, Ashley Bramlett wrote: > Hi all, > > There is a heavy trend toward developing video games and portable games > for > on screen use. > From fun games like bowling and basketball to academic games for math and > science, they are out there. > Some are portable; others are for home use. > For at home we have the WII, Playstation and xbox. For portable options, > there are numerous ones. All tablets and smart phones have games. Then you > have the Kindle, Nook, and more. > > So what technology, if any, do you use as an alternative to these on > screen > games? > Games range from adaptations of real card or board games to new ones > developed for these portable book readers and tablets. > Scrabble, Hangman, monopoly, and word searches are some games. > > I am beginning to feel left out when people talk about all these games. > Perhaps, you all feel that way. > My mother, who usually hates technology, has fallen in love with a few > games > on her new Kindle Fire; of course, not accessible to us. My mom is > intimidated by computers, yet somehow picked up the concept in the kindle > okay. She has games, music aps, and books on it. > Perhaps, there are IOS games out there. I suppose there are computer games > which I just haven’t looked at. > I’d love to have a version of hangman, word puzzles, and card games for > the > pc. > There are two games I had as a kid; I don’t know if both still exist as > its > old technology. But one does. > 1. The Speak n Spell was a handheld thing; like a primative computer. You > used it as a dictionary and it had academic games on it such as guessing > partial words, a word scramble where you had to unscramble letters to make > a > word, word matching, and more games. > 2. The Franklin Language master still exists; I saw it online. Most have > the > pc for a dictionary. But for those who want another portable option or a > way > to expand your vocabulary, this is excellent. It is lightweight with a > qwerty style keyboard and speaks everything as well as a way to magnify > the > text. You can play word games on it such as hangman, word scramble, flash > cards, word train, creating anagrams and more. I think there’s ten games > on > it. > > So what else is out there? Maybe something from APH? > > Thanks. > Ashley > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/turtlepower17%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From k7uij at panix.com Tue Mar 12 01:34:37 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 18:34:37 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <014601ce1ec1$c2bcd640$483682c0$@panix.com> They aren't accessible out of the box. Several vendors are working on screen-readers for them and a few such screen-readers are available. Some functions and apps work; many do not. So the venturesome can try Android phones but accessibility is very-much a work in progress. Mike Freeman -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Justin Young Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 5:39 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible Hi All! Hope the semester is treating you all great! I know the IPhone is popular, but I was looking a few other phones and wanted to know if anyone knew if the Droids were accessible? I don't know the features it might have so I wanted to ask if any have tried them and could provide feedback. Thanks in advance! Justin Young _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From k7uij at panix.com Tue Mar 12 01:36:49 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 18:36:49 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <014801ce1ec2$11b5aa10$3520fe30$@panix.com> Ashley: God is saving you from blowing your dollars on frivolities! (grin) Mike -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley Bramlett Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 5:12 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games Hi all, There is a heavy trend toward developing video games and portable games for on screen use. >From fun games like bowling and basketball to academic games for math and science, they are out there. Some are portable; others are for home use. For at home we have the WII, Playstation and xbox. For portable options, there are numerous ones. All tablets and smart phones have games. Then you have the Kindle, Nook, and more. So what technology, if any, do you use as an alternative to these on screen games? Games range from adaptations of real card or board games to new ones developed for these portable book readers and tablets. Scrabble, Hangman, monopoly, and word searches are some games. I am beginning to feel left out when people talk about all these games. Perhaps, you all feel that way. My mother, who usually hates technology, has fallen in love with a few games on her new Kindle Fire; of course, not accessible to us. My mom is intimidated by computers, yet somehow picked up the concept in the kindle okay. She has games, music aps, and books on it. Perhaps, there are IOS games out there. I suppose there are computer games which I just haven’t looked at. I’d love to have a version of hangman, word puzzles, and card games for the pc. There are two games I had as a kid; I don’t know if both still exist as its old technology. But one does. 1. The Speak n Spell was a handheld thing; like a primative computer. You used it as a dictionary and it had academic games on it such as guessing partial words, a word scramble where you had to unscramble letters to make a word, word matching, and more games. 2. The Franklin Language master still exists; I saw it online. Most have the pc for a dictionary. But for those who want another portable option or a way to expand your vocabulary, this is excellent. It is lightweight with a qwerty style keyboard and speaks everything as well as a way to magnify the text. You can play word games on it such as hangman, word scramble, flash cards, word train, creating anagrams and more. I think there’s ten games on it. So what else is out there? Maybe something from APH? Thanks. Ashley _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From hotdancer1416 at gmail.com Tue Mar 12 01:39:40 2013 From: hotdancer1416 at gmail.com (Ashlee g) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 21:39:40 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible In-Reply-To: <014601ce1ec1$c2bcd640$483682c0$@panix.com> References: <014601ce1ec1$c2bcd640$483682c0$@panix.com> Message-ID: <3CB5CA86-06E7-4769-A7CA-7EED99608BA8@gmail.com> i have a droid, and works as well as talks, and mobile speaks. NOTHING ABOUT US, WITHOUT US. AUTISTICS RULE On Mar 11, 2013, at 21:34, "Mike Freeman" wrote: > They aren't accessible out of the box. Several vendors are working on > screen-readers for them and a few such screen-readers are available. Some > functions and apps work; many do not. So the venturesome can try Android > phones but accessibility is very-much a work in progress. > > Mike Freeman > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Justin Young > Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 5:39 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible > > Hi All! > > Hope the semester is treating you all great! I know the IPhone is > popular, but I was looking a few other phones and wanted to know if > anyone knew if the Droids were accessible? I don't know the features > it might have so I wanted to ask if any have tried them and could > provide feedback. Thanks in advance! > > Justin Young > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hotdancer1416%40gmail.com From k7uij at panix.com Tue Mar 12 01:42:16 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 18:42:16 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: References: <513e3b05.43baec0a.48df.0fb8@mx.google.com> <12257A5B-5829-4D5D-9C26-7AECE2C4B5E4@panix.com> Message-ID: <014901ce1ec2$d48c8270$7da58750$@panix.com> I was going to leave this alone, but ... one ddoes *not* write on a slate backward. One writes with the horizontal plane rotated 180 degrees around the vertical axis. It's very simple: if you open a door going into a room with the doorknob on the right; when you leave the room by that door, the knob is on your left. I'm not dissing note-takers but, frankly, I am appalled when I see people dissing the slate. And to hear that people aren't being taught to use it ... please save me from apoplexy. That's about like not teaching the sighted to write with pen or pencil. Whatever else may be said, slates and styluses don't have batteries that go dead or need recharging. Mike Freeman -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 2:59 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote Sophie and all again, Sorry about that, I got excited and was a little unclear. Anyway, what I meant to say in my first paragraph was that I have to agree with Sophie on the issue of a slate is sort of old fashioned. I've primarily heard of older people using it and most people I know who are my age were never even taught how to use one. Plus you have to write everything backwards and to me that just seems a lot more complicated than writing on a bt keyboard. Plus with slates you only have the option of writing braille, which doesn't work today when you're expected to produce print for professors or teachers if you're working on something for school. Maybe it's a generational thing, but I sort of see notetakers as the successsors to the slate since you have more options with them. On 3/11/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Sophie and all, > > I have to disagree with Mike's last comment. Seeing as Humanware > caters to a very specific group of people and is dependent on their > money to keep their company afloat they would be frankly speaking > stupid not to listen to a complaint such as this from their customers. > This isn't some tiny little glitch that is just a nuisance every once > in a while, ut is a reoccurring thing. This is the precise reason why > I switched to Hims instead of Humanware. Not for this precise reason, > but when you compare the two sets of notetakers side by side it's no > wonder why web surfing on the BrailleSense is faster; a machine > running a decent version of windows software rather than MS Dos like > the BrailleNote is going to produce better results because it is more > in sync with the other technology out there today. I can only wonder > why Humanware hasn't figured out how to upgrade their operating system > from one of the 90's to something more current. Of course the > BrailleSense line of notetakers are by no means flawless, but I have > found that my BrailleSense responds a lot better, I don't have to > reset it as much as I had to reset my BrailleNote, and the web surfing > is pretty good considering it's on a notetaker rather than a laptop. > > I think if enough people were to sign something and explicitly state > the problem and the inconvenience it causes then Humanware would be > wise to listen and at least make some effort in updating the security > certificate list. The fact that this happens on sites which Humanware > already programs into the favorites is another good point and one > worth mentioning as well. Perhaps NABS could start something and > hopefully it would matriculate to other divisions. I've heard plenty > of older people complain about issues with their BrailleNotes as well > so this wouldn't just be something for the students to work on if it > were to happen. > > On 3/11/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >> sophie: >> I don't know you so am reluctant to comment upon your assertion that a >> slate >> is inefficient except to say that such assertions are often made by those >> who do not use a slate extensively and therefore are unfamiliar with how >> efficient it can be in skilled hands. >> As for electronic petitions, they are IMO worthless since they cannot be >> verified. Moreover, keeping up with such things as security certificates >> and >> current trends in web design is a thankless, if not an impossible task >> for >> manufacturers of specialized devices. >> And Apple periodically breaks Braille support and we must wait months for >> the fix! >> >> Mike Freeman >> sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 11, 2013, at 13:43, "Ashley Bramlett" >> wrote: >> >>> As for the slate versus the notetaker, generally, its faster with the >>> notetaker; but a slate can be as fast as a pencil and paper if you have >>> practiced enough. But I would never be fast like that as I did not grow >>> up >>> with it. >>> >>> I like the petetion idea too. why not do i t online or at the nfb >>> convention? >>> >>> -----Original Message----- From: Sophie Trist >>> Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 4:13 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >>> >>> Mike, I'm going to have to disagree with you here. Slates and >>> styluses are very inefficient. On my BN, I can type notes in >>> class faster than most sighted kids can write them. On an S&S, >>> notetaking would take ten times as long and be three times as >>> difficult. Also, I have found Apple's braille support to be very >>> nice. Yeah, it's not perfect, but it's great all things >>> considered. Okay, sorry for the rant and for getting off topic. >>> Kaiti, I like your idea of petitioning Humanware to include an >>> updated list of security certificates (as well as a freakin Docx >>> converter) into their next update. Does anyone know how we could >>> get such a project started? >>> >>> Yours sincerely, >>> Sophie >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: Mike Freeman >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> >> Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 11:55:22 -0700 >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >>> >>> The answer is extremely simple although my observation is that >>> most blind people do not want to hear it. >>> First, piezoelectric braille displays are expensive and the >>> demand for them is small enough that their price is unlikely to >>> decrease much. >>> Second, Apple sells far more i-devices than Humanware, HIMS and >>> Levelstar/APH sell note-takers. Therefore, Apple can take >>> advantage of economies of scale in production that note-taker >>> manufacturers can only dream of. High production quantity >>> translates directly into lower prices >>> This is the economic consequence of being the minority we know >>> ourselves to be. The fact that note-takers are, in essence, >>> glorified PDAs with braille displays matters not one whit where >>> economics are concerned. The kicker here is that we cannot depend >>> upon mainstream devices to meet all our needs >>> All the complaining in the world won't change this reality. The >>> one consolation we have here is that slates and styluses are >>> still cheap! >>> >>> Mike Freeman >>> sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 11, 2013, at 11:05, Sarah wrote: >>> >>> Yeah my point is the same why in the world would you have to pay >>> over $5,000 for a device that can barely do more than go on >>> Facebook or google or Bookshare when an iPhone costs less than >>> half the price and you can do anything on it. >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: Valerie Gibson >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> >> Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 01:38:15 -0500 >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >>> >>> I think i saw something about it on the BN mailing list, but >>> someone said their computer was doing it too, and I have not had >>> that problem. Overall, the thread on it was not too helpful, but >>> maybe I just didn't dig deep enough. >>> >>> Another bad part about all this is, I can't even exit the >>> internet because the dialog pops up again. I have to reset my >>> BN. >>> >>> It's sadly getting to the point where, if not for the braille >>> display, the BN would not be worth having?쫆t least that's my >>> thinking. >>> >>> I know the BN can only do so muc, but if it were half as good as >>> a mobile device that would be something. I don't mean to bash >>> the braillenote or the manufacturer, and I appologize if my tone >>> is coming across as such, it's just?쫡o spend that much money on >>> a device and have your iphone/ipad, which coasts a fifth of the >>> price, work more flawlessly is a wee bit disappointing. >>> >>> Maybe humanware should up the game and make a iphone/ipad >>> docking station with a braille display at the bottom?쫛r an >>> iphone/ipad case with a braille display somehow built in. You >>> have to admit, that would be beautiful. :) >>> >>> If anyone figures out a way around this, please let me know. >>> Thanks so much. >>> On Mar 11, 2013, at 12:09 AM, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer >>> wrote: >>> >>> good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! >>> I can not figure a way around them either. Do you know of the >>> braillenote mailing list? >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson >>> wrote: >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts >>> while using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to >>> facebook or bookshare, I'll get: >>> Security alert dialog. >>> informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or >>> changed by others. However, there is a problem with the site's >>> security certificate. The security certificate is from a trusted >>> certifying athority. >>> The security certificate date is valid. >>> The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not >>> match the name of the site. >>> Do you want to continue? >>> >>> The problem is: >>> 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I >>> just hit yes on it. >>> 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote >>> lags. for example, from "The name on the security certificate is >>> invalid?? to "do you want to continue?? it takes the >>> braillenote a second at most to jump from those two line. When >>> you're dealing with four lines, that's four seconds, just to get >>> to the prompt. With all of that added up, it takes about a >>> minute to get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the prompt >>> and it still brings up security stuff.. >>> >>> Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, >>> etc? :) >>> >>> Thanks >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>> info for nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm >>> ail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>> info for nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%4 >>> 0gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>> info for nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/coastergirl92 >>> %40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>> info for nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix >>> .com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade >>> r%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From k7uij at panix.com Tue Mar 12 01:48:23 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 18:48:23 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: References: <513e3b05.43baec0a.48df.0fb8@mx.google.com> <12257A5B-5829-4D5D-9C26-7AECE2C4B5E4@panix.com> Message-ID: <014a01ce1ec3$aeec70b0$0cc55210$@panix.com> Kaiti: I understand your frustration. I, too, have heard that Humanware has fallen down drastically on tech support and in keeping their note-takers up-to-date. I, too, use HIMS products. I, too, like them. But have no illusions: HIMS products have plenty of glitches and HIMS has released software that obviously wasn't tested thoroughly enough to get rid of what ought to have been obvious bugs. My point is that all-too-many people are expecting note-takers to do things that they haven't the horse-power or software sophistication to do. The key to me is to use each device for what it's good for, not to expect one device to do it all. Mike Freeman -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 2:53 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote Sophie and all, I have to disagree with Mike's last comment. Seeing as Humanware caters to a very specific group of people and is dependent on their money to keep their company afloat they would be frankly speaking stupid not to listen to a complaint such as this from their customers. This isn't some tiny little glitch that is just a nuisance every once in a while, ut is a reoccurring thing. This is the precise reason why I switched to Hims instead of Humanware. Not for this precise reason, but when you compare the two sets of notetakers side by side it's no wonder why web surfing on the BrailleSense is faster; a machine running a decent version of windows software rather than MS Dos like the BrailleNote is going to produce better results because it is more in sync with the other technology out there today. I can only wonder why Humanware hasn't figured out how to upgrade their operating system from one of the 90's to something more current. Of course the BrailleSense line of notetakers are by no means flawless, but I have found that my BrailleSense responds a lot better, I don't have to reset it as much as I had to reset my BrailleNote, and the web surfing is pretty good considering it's on a notetaker rather than a laptop. I think if enough people were to sign something and explicitly state the problem and the inconvenience it causes then Humanware would be wise to listen and at least make some effort in updating the security certificate list. The fact that this happens on sites which Humanware already programs into the favorites is another good point and one worth mentioning as well. Perhaps NABS could start something and hopefully it would matriculate to other divisions. I've heard plenty of older people complain about issues with their BrailleNotes as well so this wouldn't just be something for the students to work on if it were to happen. On 3/11/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > sophie: > I don't know you so am reluctant to comment upon your assertion that a slate > is inefficient except to say that such assertions are often made by those > who do not use a slate extensively and therefore are unfamiliar with how > efficient it can be in skilled hands. > As for electronic petitions, they are IMO worthless since they cannot be > verified. Moreover, keeping up with such things as security certificates and > current trends in web design is a thankless, if not an impossible task for > manufacturers of specialized devices. > And Apple periodically breaks Braille support and we must wait months for > the fix! > > Mike Freeman > sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 11, 2013, at 13:43, "Ashley Bramlett" > wrote: > >> As for the slate versus the notetaker, generally, its faster with the >> notetaker; but a slate can be as fast as a pencil and paper if you have >> practiced enough. But I would never be fast like that as I did not grow up >> with it. >> >> I like the petetion idea too. why not do i t online or at the nfb >> convention? >> >> -----Original Message----- From: Sophie Trist >> Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 4:13 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >> >> Mike, I'm going to have to disagree with you here. Slates and >> styluses are very inefficient. On my BN, I can type notes in >> class faster than most sighted kids can write them. On an S&S, >> notetaking would take ten times as long and be three times as >> difficult. Also, I have found Apple's braille support to be very >> nice. Yeah, it's not perfect, but it's great all things >> considered. Okay, sorry for the rant and for getting off topic. >> Kaiti, I like your idea of petitioning Humanware to include an >> updated list of security certificates (as well as a freakin Docx >> converter) into their next update. Does anyone know how we could >> get such a project started? >> >> Yours sincerely, >> Sophie >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Mike Freeman > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> > Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 11:55:22 -0700 >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >> >> The answer is extremely simple although my observation is that >> most blind people do not want to hear it. >> First, piezoelectric braille displays are expensive and the >> demand for them is small enough that their price is unlikely to >> decrease much. >> Second, Apple sells far more i-devices than Humanware, HIMS and >> Levelstar/APH sell note-takers. Therefore, Apple can take >> advantage of economies of scale in production that note-taker >> manufacturers can only dream of. High production quantity >> translates directly into lower prices >> This is the economic consequence of being the minority we know >> ourselves to be. The fact that note-takers are, in essence, >> glorified PDAs with braille displays matters not one whit where >> economics are concerned. The kicker here is that we cannot depend >> upon mainstream devices to meet all our needs >> All the complaining in the world won't change this reality. The >> one consolation we have here is that slates and styluses are >> still cheap! >> >> Mike Freeman >> sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 11, 2013, at 11:05, Sarah wrote: >> >> Yeah my point is the same why in the world would you have to pay >> over $5,000 for a device that can barely do more than go on >> Facebook or google or Bookshare when an iPhone costs less than >> half the price and you can do anything on it. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Valerie Gibson > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> > Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 01:38:15 -0500 >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >> >> I think i saw something about it on the BN mailing list, but >> someone said their computer was doing it too, and I have not had >> that problem. Overall, the thread on it was not too helpful, but >> maybe I just didn't dig deep enough. >> >> Another bad part about all this is, I can't even exit the >> internet because the dialog pops up again. I have to reset my >> BN. >> >> It's sadly getting to the point where, if not for the braille >> display, the BN would not be worth having?쫆t least that's my >> thinking. >> >> I know the BN can only do so muc, but if it were half as good as >> a mobile device that would be something. I don't mean to bash >> the braillenote or the manufacturer, and I appologize if my tone >> is coming across as such, it's just?쫡o spend that much money on >> a device and have your iphone/ipad, which coasts a fifth of the >> price, work more flawlessly is a wee bit disappointing. >> >> Maybe humanware should up the game and make a iphone/ipad >> docking station with a braille display at the bottom?쫛r an >> iphone/ipad case with a braille display somehow built in. You >> have to admit, that would be beautiful. :) >> >> If anyone figures out a way around this, please let me know. >> Thanks so much. >> On Mar 11, 2013, at 12:09 AM, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer >> wrote: >> >> good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! >> I can not figure a way around them either. Do you know of the >> braillenote mailing list? >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson >> wrote: >> >> Hi, >> >> Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts >> while using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to >> facebook or bookshare, I'll get: >> Security alert dialog. >> informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or >> changed by others. However, there is a problem with the site's >> security certificate. The security certificate is from a trusted >> certifying athority. >> The security certificate date is valid. >> The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not >> match the name of the site. >> Do you want to continue? >> >> The problem is: >> 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I >> just hit yes on it. >> 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote >> lags. for example, from "The name on the security certificate is >> invalid?? to "do you want to continue?? it takes the >> braillenote a second at most to jump from those two line. When >> you're dealing with four lines, that's four seconds, just to get >> to the prompt. With all of that added up, it takes about a >> minute to get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the prompt >> and it still brings up security stuff.. >> >> Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, >> etc? :) >> >> Thanks >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm >> ail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%4 >> 0gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/coastergirl92 >> %40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix >> .com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade >> r%40gmail.com >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From jty727 at gmail.com Tue Mar 12 01:52:20 2013 From: jty727 at gmail.com (Justin Young) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 21:52:20 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible In-Reply-To: <3CB5CA86-06E7-4769-A7CA-7EED99608BA8@gmail.com> References: <014601ce1ec1$c2bcd640$483682c0$@panix.com> <3CB5CA86-06E7-4769-A7CA-7EED99608BA8@gmail.com> Message-ID: thanks for your feedback! Justin On 3/11/13, Ashlee g wrote: > i have a droid, and works as well as talks, and mobile speaks. > > NOTHING ABOUT US, WITHOUT US. AUTISTICS RULE > > On Mar 11, 2013, at 21:34, "Mike Freeman" wrote: > >> They aren't accessible out of the box. Several vendors are working on >> screen-readers for them and a few such screen-readers are available. Some >> functions and apps work; many do not. So the venturesome can try Android >> phones but accessibility is very-much a work in progress. >> >> Mike Freeman >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Justin Young >> Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 5:39 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible >> >> Hi All! >> >> Hope the semester is treating you all great! I know the IPhone is >> popular, but I was looking a few other phones and wanted to know if >> anyone knew if the Droids were accessible? I don't know the features >> it might have so I wanted to ask if any have tried them and could >> provide feedback. Thanks in advance! >> >> Justin Young >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hotdancer1416%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jty727%40gmail.com > From steve.jacobson at visi.com Tue Mar 12 02:28:44 2013 From: steve.jacobson at visi.com (Steve Jacobson) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 21:28:44 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Is Graduate School Worth It? In-Reply-To: <39737F4B25D9442C8D7E0E2F3818E3B6@Gloria> Message-ID: It almost sounds as though you are not running the Basic version of Lotus Notes. Are you ever hearing the messsage list? Best regards, Steve Jacobson On Mon, 11 Mar 2013 18:08:41 -0500, Gloria G wrote: >Thank you for sending this! >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Joe" >To: "'NATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF BLIND STUDENTS'" >Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 5:57 PM >Subject: [nabs-l] Is Graduate School Worth It? >> Why do you want to go to graduate school? You generally felt college was >> worth it. You got your bachelor's degree because you heard a college >> degree >> leads to a better salary. Maybe you feel grad school is the next logical >> step because you think the specialty of a Master's will make you more >> marketable. A doctoral degree? Outside of academia, I don't know that the >> degree will open up that many more doors than an undergraduate diploma. In >> most cases people are continuing to climb the scholastic ladder because >> they >> want to gain a distinct advantage over competing job applicants, but the >> diminishing returns of graduate studies should make us wonder if we are >> making the wisest investments of our energy, time, and money. >> >> Some career tracks require education beyond a Bachelor's. To my knowledge, >> you can't become a licensed clinical social worker without a Master's in >> social work. As far as I know, you can't become a doctor without medical >> school. Attorneys can't be attorneys without taking the Bar, and in most >> jurisdictions you can't take the Bar without graduating from an accredited >> law school. If your interests lie in a highly specialized field that >> requires advanced education, may your efforts be blessed. Nothing will be >> more fulfilling than following your own dream. >> >> For those of us considering careers in the humanities and social sciences, >> we have to ask some hard questions. Let's start with one of the most >> obvious >> ones: >> >> >> >> Read the rest of the article: >> >> >> >> http://joeorozco.com/blog_is_graduate_school_worth_it >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gmail.com >_______________________________________________ >nabs-l mailing list >nabs-l at nfbnet.org >http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/steve.jacobson%40visi.com From jty727 at gmail.com Tue Mar 12 03:22:05 2013 From: jty727 at gmail.com (Justin Young) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 23:22:05 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible In-Reply-To: References: <014601ce1ec1$c2bcd640$483682c0$@panix.com> <3CB5CA86-06E7-4769-A7CA-7EED99608BA8@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi Again All, I was wondering if anyone knew what the most accessible Android operating system cell phone is out there? I know the IPhone is great, but still exploring. Thanks for all your help as always in my inexperience of these different phones!:) On 3/11/13, Justin Young wrote: > thanks for your feedback! > > Justin > > On 3/11/13, Ashlee g wrote: >> i have a droid, and works as well as talks, and mobile speaks. >> >> NOTHING ABOUT US, WITHOUT US. AUTISTICS RULE >> >> On Mar 11, 2013, at 21:34, "Mike Freeman" wrote: >> >>> They aren't accessible out of the box. Several vendors are working on >>> screen-readers for them and a few such screen-readers are available. >>> Some >>> functions and apps work; many do not. So the venturesome can try Android >>> phones but accessibility is very-much a work in progress. >>> >>> Mike Freeman >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Justin >>> Young >>> Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 5:39 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible >>> >>> Hi All! >>> >>> Hope the semester is treating you all great! I know the IPhone is >>> popular, but I was looking a few other phones and wanted to know if >>> anyone knew if the Droids were accessible? I don't know the features >>> it might have so I wanted to ask if any have tried them and could >>> provide feedback. Thanks in advance! >>> >>> Justin Young >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hotdancer1416%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jty727%40gmail.com >> > From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Tue Mar 12 03:36:37 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 23:36:37 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: <014a01ce1ec3$aeec70b0$0cc55210$@panix.com> References: <513e3b05.43baec0a.48df.0fb8@mx.google.com> <12257A5B-5829-4D5D-9C26-7AECE2C4B5E4@panix.com> <014a01ce1ec3$aeec70b0$0cc55210$@panix.com> Message-ID: Hi Mike, I believe I mentioned that the BrailleSense is not glitch-free. It has it's bugs, but in comparison to the BrailleNote, at least in my observations, it seems to do a better job simply because the software it uses is more current. I am with you though on not expecting a notetaker to do everything; I certainly don't. I use a pc for most of my work and leave the braille reading and quick notetaking for things that aren't as significant as class notes. (A habit I learned from the BrailleNote too, which I and others I know have found has the occasional habit of deleting files without the input to do so from the user). I don't hold full faith in my BrailleSense for everything, but as someone who does use it for reading books in braille because I prefer to read off of a notetaker, I can sympathize with those who are frustrated at Humanware's lack of upkeep to their system. Although personally I always transfered books from the pc to the notetaker through a flashdrive just because I could get what I needed faster, I do think that if Humanware went to the length of putting Bookshare in the favorites, thereby promoting accessing it from the device to download books directly to the unit, then they should have at least made some effort to make that feature work for people who might want to use it. The slate I've seen sounds different from what you're describing. It was a rectangular metal strip with pin-prick sized holes for the stylis to go into. The way it was explained to me, you open it up, place it over the paper so that the side where you have to use the stylis is lined up with the hinge of the instrument on the right side of the page. Then you start on the right and write each character backwards, moving in right to left motion, so that when you take the instrument off the page and flip it over the braille is there. Because of the necessity to flip everything my teachers thought it was much more practical to stick with a Perkins brailler, as I could quickly move in linear fashion across the page without flipping each character. I guess that has been the practice taught to kids my age and younger in my area. On 3/11/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > Kaiti: > > I understand your frustration. I, too, have heard that Humanware has fallen > down drastically on tech support and in keeping their note-takers > up-to-date. I, too, use HIMS products. I, too, like them. But have no > illusions: HIMS products have plenty of glitches and HIMS has released > software that obviously wasn't tested thoroughly enough to get rid of what > ought to have been obvious bugs. > > My point is that all-too-many people are expecting note-takers to do things > that they haven't the horse-power or software sophistication to do. > > The key to me is to use each device for what it's good for, not to expect > one device to do it all. > > Mike Freeman > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 2:53 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote > > Sophie and all, > > I have to disagree with Mike's last comment. Seeing as Humanware > caters to a very specific group of people and is dependent on their > money to keep their company afloat they would be frankly speaking > stupid not to listen to a complaint such as this from their customers. > This isn't some tiny little glitch that is just a nuisance every once > in a while, ut is a reoccurring thing. This is the precise reason why > I switched to Hims instead of Humanware. Not for this precise reason, > but when you compare the two sets of notetakers side by side it's no > wonder why web surfing on the BrailleSense is faster; a machine > running a decent version of windows software rather than MS Dos like > the BrailleNote is going to produce better results because it is more > in sync with the other technology out there today. I can only wonder > why Humanware hasn't figured out how to upgrade their operating system > from one of the 90's to something more current. Of course the > BrailleSense line of notetakers are by no means flawless, but I have > found that my BrailleSense responds a lot better, I don't have to > reset it as much as I had to reset my BrailleNote, and the web surfing > is pretty good considering it's on a notetaker rather than a laptop. > > I think if enough people were to sign something and explicitly state > the problem and the inconvenience it causes then Humanware would be > wise to listen and at least make some effort in updating the security > certificate list. The fact that this happens on sites which Humanware > already programs into the favorites is another good point and one > worth mentioning as well. Perhaps NABS could start something and > hopefully it would matriculate to other divisions. I've heard plenty > of older people complain about issues with their BrailleNotes as well > so this wouldn't just be something for the students to work on if it > were to happen. > > On 3/11/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >> sophie: >> I don't know you so am reluctant to comment upon your assertion that a >> slate >> is inefficient except to say that such assertions are often made by those >> who do not use a slate extensively and therefore are unfamiliar with how >> efficient it can be in skilled hands. >> As for electronic petitions, they are IMO worthless since they cannot be >> verified. Moreover, keeping up with such things as security certificates >> and >> current trends in web design is a thankless, if not an impossible task for >> manufacturers of specialized devices. >> And Apple periodically breaks Braille support and we must wait months for >> the fix! >> >> Mike Freeman >> sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 11, 2013, at 13:43, "Ashley Bramlett" >> wrote: >> >>> As for the slate versus the notetaker, generally, its faster with the >>> notetaker; but a slate can be as fast as a pencil and paper if you have >>> practiced enough. But I would never be fast like that as I did not grow >>> up >>> with it. >>> >>> I like the petetion idea too. why not do i t online or at the nfb >>> convention? >>> >>> -----Original Message----- From: Sophie Trist >>> Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 4:13 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >>> >>> Mike, I'm going to have to disagree with you here. Slates and >>> styluses are very inefficient. On my BN, I can type notes in >>> class faster than most sighted kids can write them. On an S&S, >>> notetaking would take ten times as long and be three times as >>> difficult. Also, I have found Apple's braille support to be very >>> nice. Yeah, it's not perfect, but it's great all things >>> considered. Okay, sorry for the rant and for getting off topic. >>> Kaiti, I like your idea of petitioning Humanware to include an >>> updated list of security certificates (as well as a freakin Docx >>> converter) into their next update. Does anyone know how we could >>> get such a project started? >>> >>> Yours sincerely, >>> Sophie >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: Mike Freeman >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> >> Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 11:55:22 -0700 >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >>> >>> The answer is extremely simple although my observation is that >>> most blind people do not want to hear it. >>> First, piezoelectric braille displays are expensive and the >>> demand for them is small enough that their price is unlikely to >>> decrease much. >>> Second, Apple sells far more i-devices than Humanware, HIMS and >>> Levelstar/APH sell note-takers. Therefore, Apple can take >>> advantage of economies of scale in production that note-taker >>> manufacturers can only dream of. High production quantity >>> translates directly into lower prices >>> This is the economic consequence of being the minority we know >>> ourselves to be. The fact that note-takers are, in essence, >>> glorified PDAs with braille displays matters not one whit where >>> economics are concerned. The kicker here is that we cannot depend >>> upon mainstream devices to meet all our needs >>> All the complaining in the world won't change this reality. The >>> one consolation we have here is that slates and styluses are >>> still cheap! >>> >>> Mike Freeman >>> sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 11, 2013, at 11:05, Sarah wrote: >>> >>> Yeah my point is the same why in the world would you have to pay >>> over $5,000 for a device that can barely do more than go on >>> Facebook or google or Bookshare when an iPhone costs less than >>> half the price and you can do anything on it. >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: Valerie Gibson >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> >> Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 01:38:15 -0500 >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >>> >>> I think i saw something about it on the BN mailing list, but >>> someone said their computer was doing it too, and I have not had >>> that problem. Overall, the thread on it was not too helpful, but >>> maybe I just didn't dig deep enough. >>> >>> Another bad part about all this is, I can't even exit the >>> internet because the dialog pops up again. I have to reset my >>> BN. >>> >>> It's sadly getting to the point where, if not for the braille >>> display, the BN would not be worth having?쫆t least that's my >>> thinking. >>> >>> I know the BN can only do so muc, but if it were half as good as >>> a mobile device that would be something. I don't mean to bash >>> the braillenote or the manufacturer, and I appologize if my tone >>> is coming across as such, it's just?쫡o spend that much money on >>> a device and have your iphone/ipad, which coasts a fifth of the >>> price, work more flawlessly is a wee bit disappointing. >>> >>> Maybe humanware should up the game and make a iphone/ipad >>> docking station with a braille display at the bottom?쫛r an >>> iphone/ipad case with a braille display somehow built in. You >>> have to admit, that would be beautiful. :) >>> >>> If anyone figures out a way around this, please let me know. >>> Thanks so much. >>> On Mar 11, 2013, at 12:09 AM, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer >>> wrote: >>> >>> good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! >>> I can not figure a way around them either. Do you know of the >>> braillenote mailing list? >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson >>> wrote: >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts >>> while using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to >>> facebook or bookshare, I'll get: >>> Security alert dialog. >>> informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or >>> changed by others. However, there is a problem with the site's >>> security certificate. The security certificate is from a trusted >>> certifying athority. >>> The security certificate date is valid. >>> The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not >>> match the name of the site. >>> Do you want to continue? >>> >>> The problem is: >>> 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I >>> just hit yes on it. >>> 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote >>> lags. for example, from "The name on the security certificate is >>> invalid?? to "do you want to continue?? it takes the >>> braillenote a second at most to jump from those two line. When >>> you're dealing with four lines, that's four seconds, just to get >>> to the prompt. With all of that added up, it takes about a >>> minute to get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the prompt >>> and it still brings up security stuff.. >>> >>> Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, >>> etc? :) >>> >>> Thanks >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>> info for nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm >>> ail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>> info for nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%4 >>> 0gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>> info for nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/coastergirl92 >>> %40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>> info for nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix >>> .com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade >>> r%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Tue Mar 12 03:44:34 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 23:44:34 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games In-Reply-To: <014801ce1ec2$11b5aa10$3520fe30$@panix.com> References: <014801ce1ec2$11b5aa10$3520fe30$@panix.com> Message-ID: Hi Ashley, have you heard of RS games? It's a free client you download to your PC. They have accessible games including Monopoly, Uno, 1,000 Miles, Apples to Apples, Farkle (a dice game), Rummy, and Battleship. Not quite word games like what you're thinking of, (well, maybe Apples to Apples to an extent), but they're still pretty good. On 3/11/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > Ashley: > > God is saving you from blowing your dollars on frivolities! (grin) > > Mike > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley Bramlett > Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 5:12 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games > > Hi all, > > There is a heavy trend toward developing video games and portable games for > on screen use. > From fun games like bowling and basketball to academic games for math and > science, they are out there. > Some are portable; others are for home use. > For at home we have the WII, Playstation and xbox. For portable options, > there are numerous ones. All tablets and smart phones have games. Then you > have the Kindle, Nook, and more. > > So what technology, if any, do you use as an alternative to these on screen > games? > Games range from adaptations of real card or board games to new ones > developed for these portable book readers and tablets. > Scrabble, Hangman, monopoly, and word searches are some games. > > I am beginning to feel left out when people talk about all these games. > Perhaps, you all feel that way. > My mother, who usually hates technology, has fallen in love with a few games > on her new Kindle Fire; of course, not accessible to us. My mom is > intimidated by computers, yet somehow picked up the concept in the kindle > okay. She has games, music aps, and books on it. > Perhaps, there are IOS games out there. I suppose there are computer games > which I just haven’t looked at. > I’d love to have a version of hangman, word puzzles, and card games for the > pc. > There are two games I had as a kid; I don’t know if both still exist as its > old technology. But one does. > 1. The Speak n Spell was a handheld thing; like a primative computer. You > used it as a dictionary and it had academic games on it such as guessing > partial words, a word scramble where you had to unscramble letters to make a > word, word matching, and more games. > 2. The Franklin Language master still exists; I saw it online. Most have the > pc for a dictionary. But for those who want another portable option or a way > to expand your vocabulary, this is excellent. It is lightweight with a > qwerty style keyboard and speaks everything as well as a way to magnify the > text. You can play word games on it such as hangman, word scramble, flash > cards, word train, creating anagrams and more. I think there’s ten games on > it. > > So what else is out there? Maybe something from APH? > > Thanks. > Ashley > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From coasterfreak88 at me.com Tue Mar 12 05:06:55 2013 From: coasterfreak88 at me.com (John Moore) Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 00:06:55 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible In-Reply-To: References: <014601ce1ec1$c2bcd640$483682c0$@panix.com> <3CB5CA86-06E7-4769-A7CA-7EED99608BA8@gmail.com> Message-ID: <83618F56-DC5F-4B1C-9248-6D32D2D2C7BA@me.com> A lot of people say that the Nexus 4 is the best one right now, with the Samsung Galaxy S3 behind it. From brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com Tue Mar 12 05:08:31 2013 From: brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com (Brandon Keith Biggs) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 22:08:31 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hello, The old Braille Plus had hangman and Blackjack for a while, but then a new version made them not work anymore. The Apex has IF and the computer has audio games, Muds and browser games. Please see audiogames.net for a list of around 300+ games that are totally accessible. They include multiple chess, blackjack, poker, worm and other arcade games, as well as FPSes, RPGs and advanced IF games. There are also strategy games and audio versions of mainstream games. Thanks, Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: Ashley Bramlett Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 5:12 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games Hi all, There is a heavy trend toward developing video games and portable games for on screen use. >From fun games like bowling and basketball to academic games for math and science, they are out there. Some are portable; others are for home use. For at home we have the WII, Playstation and xbox. For portable options, there are numerous ones. All tablets and smart phones have games. Then you have the Kindle, Nook, and more. So what technology, if any, do you use as an alternative to these on screen games? Games range from adaptations of real card or board games to new ones developed for these portable book readers and tablets. Scrabble, Hangman, monopoly, and word searches are some games. I am beginning to feel left out when people talk about all these games. Perhaps, you all feel that way. My mother, who usually hates technology, has fallen in love with a few games on her new Kindle Fire; of course, not accessible to us. My mom is intimidated by computers, yet somehow picked up the concept in the kindle okay. She has games, music aps, and books on it. Perhaps, there are IOS games out there. I suppose there are computer games which I just haven’t looked at. I’d love to have a version of hangman, word puzzles, and card games for the pc. There are two games I had as a kid; I don’t know if both still exist as its old technology. But one does. 1. The Speak n Spell was a handheld thing; like a primative computer. You used it as a dictionary and it had academic games on it such as guessing partial words, a word scramble where you had to unscramble letters to make a word, word matching, and more games. 2. The Franklin Language master still exists; I saw it online. Most have the pc for a dictionary. But for those who want another portable option or a way to expand your vocabulary, this is excellent. It is lightweight with a qwerty style keyboard and speaks everything as well as a way to magnify the text. You can play word games on it such as hangman, word scramble, flash cards, word train, creating anagrams and more. I think there’s ten games on it. So what else is out there? Maybe something from APH? Thanks. Ashley _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com From brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com Tue Mar 12 05:10:24 2013 From: brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com (Brandon Keith Biggs) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 22:10:24 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6F2D6B93FECA4A96B19E4EF2B374716A@BrandonsLaptop2> Hello, Yes they are, Jellybean in particular. There is also a special tablet made by APH that is an android phone with a Braille display and all the features of an Android phone, the Braille Plus 18. Thanks, Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: Justin Young Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 5:38 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible Hi All! Hope the semester is treating you all great! I know the IPhone is popular, but I was looking a few other phones and wanted to know if anyone knew if the Droids were accessible? I don't know the features it might have so I wanted to ask if any have tried them and could provide feedback. Thanks in advance! Justin Young _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com From coasterfreak88 at me.com Tue Mar 12 05:13:27 2013 From: coasterfreak88 at me.com (John Moore) Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 00:13:27 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible In-Reply-To: <014601ce1ec1$c2bcd640$483682c0$@panix.com> References: <014601ce1ec1$c2bcd640$483682c0$@panix.com> Message-ID: <2CAE4ABD-49EE-4B1C-A1E4-D0B3FF01D140@me.com> Hey Mike; that depends on what phone you have. Android 4.2 now has TalkBack built in and it is useable out of the box. That's why I mentioned the Nexus4 in my last email. That is GOogle's new phone and it has the latest version of Android. From hotdancer1416 at gmail.com Tue Mar 12 10:48:02 2013 From: hotdancer1416 at gmail.com (Ashlee g) Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 06:48:02 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games In-Reply-To: References: <014801ce1ec2$11b5aa10$3520fe30$@panix.com> Message-ID: <8FEC6A20-7588-4D01-9A19-FDD8F6647719@gmail.com> Hi Ashley Have you heard of the playroom because that's another good one. It has similar games to RS games come up with some people say that it's better. And then there's teaching Inc. but my hesitance with this one is that from what I'm told it doesn't really work with Windows 8 or seven brother. Both RS games, and the playroom, allow the user to play the games, and it chat. You can also find out who's live online and send them a private message, with the playroom you can invite you can create again and invite people wear with RS games you can create a game and then you wait for someone to join. Both client give you the option to create and/or join again. NOTHING ABOUT US, WITHOUT US. AUTISTICS RULE On Mar 11, 2013, at 23:44, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Hi Ashley, > > have you heard of RS games? It's a free client you download to your > PC. They have accessible games including Monopoly, Uno, 1,000 Miles, > Apples to Apples, Farkle (a dice game), Rummy, and Battleship. Not > quite word games like what you're thinking of, (well, maybe Apples to > Apples to an extent), but they're still pretty good. > > On 3/11/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >> Ashley: >> >> God is saving you from blowing your dollars on frivolities! (grin) >> >> Mike >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley Bramlett >> Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 5:12 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games >> >> Hi all, >> >> There is a heavy trend toward developing video games and portable games for >> on screen use. >> From fun games like bowling and basketball to academic games for math and >> science, they are out there. >> Some are portable; others are for home use. >> For at home we have the WII, Playstation and xbox. For portable options, >> there are numerous ones. All tablets and smart phones have games. Then you >> have the Kindle, Nook, and more. >> >> So what technology, if any, do you use as an alternative to these on screen >> games? >> Games range from adaptations of real card or board games to new ones >> developed for these portable book readers and tablets. >> Scrabble, Hangman, monopoly, and word searches are some games. >> >> I am beginning to feel left out when people talk about all these games. >> Perhaps, you all feel that way. >> My mother, who usually hates technology, has fallen in love with a few games >> on her new Kindle Fire; of course, not accessible to us. My mom is >> intimidated by computers, yet somehow picked up the concept in the kindle >> okay. She has games, music aps, and books on it. >> Perhaps, there are IOS games out there. I suppose there are computer games >> which I just haven’t looked at. >> I’d love to have a version of hangman, word puzzles, and card games for the >> pc. >> There are two games I had as a kid; I don’t know if both still exist as its >> old technology. But one does. >> 1. The Speak n Spell was a handheld thing; like a primative computer. You >> used it as a dictionary and it had academic games on it such as guessing >> partial words, a word scramble where you had to unscramble letters to make a >> word, word matching, and more games. >> 2. The Franklin Language master still exists; I saw it online. Most have the >> pc for a dictionary. But for those who want another portable option or a way >> to expand your vocabulary, this is excellent. It is lightweight with a >> qwerty style keyboard and speaks everything as well as a way to magnify the >> text. You can play word games on it such as hangman, word scramble, flash >> cards, word train, creating anagrams and more. I think there’s ten games on >> it. >> >> So what else is out there? Maybe something from APH? >> >> Thanks. >> Ashley >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hotdancer1416%40gmail.com From jty727 at gmail.com Tue Mar 12 12:17:01 2013 From: jty727 at gmail.com (Justin Young) Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 08:17:01 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible In-Reply-To: <2CAE4ABD-49EE-4B1C-A1E4-D0B3FF01D140@me.com> References: <014601ce1ec1$c2bcd640$483682c0$@panix.com> <2CAE4ABD-49EE-4B1C-A1E4-D0B3FF01D140@me.com> Message-ID: Very cool I'll have to look into those. Thanks so much! Justin On 3/12/13, John Moore wrote: > Hey Mike; that depends on what phone you have. Android 4.2 now has TalkBack > built in and it is useable out of the box. That's why I mentioned the Nexus4 > in my last email. That is GOogle's new phone and it has the latest version > of Android. > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jty727%40gmail.com > From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 12:54:58 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 08:54:58 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible In-Reply-To: <6F2D6B93FECA4A96B19E4EF2B374716A@BrandonsLaptop2> References: <6F2D6B93FECA4A96B19E4EF2B374716A@BrandonsLaptop2> Message-ID: <004901ce1e57$a392ad90$eab808b0$@gmail.com> What companies have the android phones that are accessible? -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon Keith Biggs Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 1:10 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible Hello, Yes they are, Jellybean in particular. There is also a special tablet made by APH that is an android phone with a Braille display and all the features of an Android phone, the Braille Plus 18. Thanks, Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: Justin Young Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 5:38 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible Hi All! Hope the semester is treating you all great! I know the IPhone is popular, but I was looking a few other phones and wanted to know if anyone knew if the Droids were accessible? I don't know the features it might have so I wanted to ask if any have tried them and could provide feedback. Thanks in advance! Justin Young _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai l.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From steve.jacobson at visi.com Tue Mar 12 15:12:20 2013 From: steve.jacobson at visi.com (Steve Jacobson) Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 10:12:20 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Is Graduate School Worth It? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Sorry, everyone, I replied to the wrong note. {grin} Best regards, Steve Jacobson On Mon, 11 Mar 2013 21:28:44 -0500, Steve Jacobson wrote: >It almost sounds as though you are not running the Basic version of Lotus Notes. Are you ever hearing the messsage list? >Best regards, >Steve Jacobson >On Mon, 11 Mar 2013 18:08:41 -0500, Gloria G wrote: >>Thank you for sending this! >>----- Original Message ----- >>From: "Joe" >>To: "'NATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF BLIND STUDENTS'" >>Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 5:57 PM >>Subject: [nabs-l] Is Graduate School Worth It? >>> Why do you want to go to graduate school? You generally felt college was >>> worth it. You got your bachelor's degree because you heard a college >>> degree >>> leads to a better salary. Maybe you feel grad school is the next logical >>> step because you think the specialty of a Master's will make you more >>> marketable. A doctoral degree? Outside of academia, I don't know that the >>> degree will open up that many more doors than an undergraduate diploma. In >>> most cases people are continuing to climb the scholastic ladder because >>> they >>> want to gain a distinct advantage over competing job applicants, but the >>> diminishing returns of graduate studies should make us wonder if we are >>> making the wisest investments of our energy, time, and money. >>> >>> Some career tracks require education beyond a Bachelor's. To my knowledge, >>> you can't become a licensed clinical social worker without a Master's in >>> social work. As far as I know, you can't become a doctor without medical >>> school. Attorneys can't be attorneys without taking the Bar, and in most >>> jurisdictions you can't take the Bar without graduating from an accredited >>> law school. If your interests lie in a highly specialized field that >>> requires advanced education, may your efforts be blessed. Nothing will be >>> more fulfilling than following your own dream. >>> >>> For those of us considering careers in the humanities and social sciences, >>> we have to ask some hard questions. Let's start with one of the most >>> obvious >>> ones: >>> >>> >>> >>> Read the rest of the article: >>> >>> >>> >>> http://joeorozco.com/blog_is_graduate_school_worth_it >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gmail.com >>_______________________________________________ >>nabs-l mailing list >>nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/steve.jacobson%40visi.com >_______________________________________________ >nabs-l mailing list >nabs-l at nfbnet.org >http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/steve.jacobson%40visi.com From pgradioman at hotmail.com Tue Mar 12 19:50:01 2013 From: pgradioman at hotmail.com (Preston Gaylor) Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 15:50:01 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Dear Valiery: I get them a lot when I'm browsing Facebook on my Apex! I really hate when I try to exit the dialog, because the dialog is still up on the Braille display for numours times! I'm not sure how to help you with this, I just wanted to share my experience with it. IIII was thinking, maybe it's giving that dialog because it is running an old version of Internet Explorer! I don't know, I'm just guessing that might be why. Thanks for reading, and good luck fixing this issue! Sincerley, Preston Gaylor Sent from my iPod On Mar 11, 2013, at 1:00 AM, "Valerie Gibson" wrote: > Hi, > > Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts while using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to facebook or bookshare, I'll get: > Security alert dialog. > informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or changed by others. However, there is a problem with the site's security certificate. The security certificate is from a trusted certifying athority. > The security certificate date is valid. > The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not match the name of the site. > Do you want to continue? > > The problem is: > 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I just hit yes on it. > 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote lags. for example, from "The name on the security certificate is invalid…" to "do you want to continue…" it takes the braillenote a second at most to jump from those two line. When you're dealing with four lines, that's four seconds, just to get to the prompt. With all of that added up, it takes about a minute to get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the prompt and it still brings up security stuff.. > > Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, etc? :) > > Thanks > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pgradioman%40hotmail.com From trillian551 at gmail.com Tue Mar 12 17:52:22 2013 From: trillian551 at gmail.com (Mary Fernandez) Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 13:52:22 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Navigating Job Fairs In-Reply-To: <7.0.1.0.2.20130311175909.01bf3e88@comcast.net> References: <1A0B02D10E7D4C31A38796C200534562@acerd37f251f21> <7.0.1.0.2.20130311175909.01bf3e88@comcast.net> Message-ID: Hi Misty and all, My senior year in college was almost exclusively dedicated to looking for a job. As a result, I attended more job fairs than I care to remember. I never really considered having a reader as an option for me, since many times, I’d go in between classes, if the fair was on campus, and having to wait for someone, or trying to figure out people’s schedules, can complicate things. I also loved going to job fairs on my own and figuring out where things are and meeting people. Here are some tips that helped me be successful at job fairs. These are just things that worked for me, and having a guide or reader might be the best option for someone else. Before attending the fair I would always look at the online program of the companies that would be there. I would then make a short list of the companies I definitely wanted to talk to. At these things there is usually a registration/information table. They will hand you a name tag, and usually a print list of the companies present. I’d take a couple of minutes to talk to one of the people at the information table, asking about the layout of the room, and finding out which of the companies I wanted to meet were closest to the door. I’d then walk in and find the table. Although it might seem a bit intimidating with so many people around, I find that career fairs are usually organized chaos. The people in the isles are waiting to talk to a recruiter. And each table has fairly big signs, so it is easy, as you are trying to find a table, to just ask the different people in line and they will point you to where you want to go. Once you find the first table, talk to the recruiter and get their contact information. Make sure to bring a note taking device with you, whether it be your phone or a notetaker. I have very rarely seen paper applications at the tables, but if they do have them there, they are almost guaranteed to have them online. Recruiters are often more than happy to send you to their website, or send you a follow up email with the print information they were handing out. If you are truly interested in a company, you will email them after the event with any follow up questions, or just a simple thank you for talking to me note. Once you are done speaking to a recruiter, it is very simple to ask where the next company you want to talk to is. I found this to be an incredibly useful strategy, as they will have a list of booths in front of them, and they also get to see that you are totally independent, which always makes a good impression. Lastly, sometimes when there are so many people around, it is hard to know when someone is talking to you if they don’t say your name, and in comes the name tags. Most recruiters will pretend that they know you, and say “hi, ms…” Once you get through your first career fair, you will figure out what works and doesn’t for you. And if you are anything like me, you will actually really love them, as you get to meet really cool people, whether students or recruiters, that you would not have otherwise. Best of luck! Mary F On 3/11/13, Carly Mihalakis wrote: > Hi, Misty, > > From what I have been able to notice, sighted people sort of > expect you to have an assistant of sorts to walk around with you, > reading names, filling out aps. In fact, it would seem to me that > bumbling around a job fair by oneself might represent an inability to > know when to call on assistance. and that could also turn potential > employers off to the idea of hiring a blind person. > What do you think of this? > Keep us posted on how this job fair goes, okay? > for today, Car, > > just about everything on my own, but this is something new for me, > and I don't want to look bad or awkward to employers while moving > around the job fair. Also, I do not know if it would turn employers > away if I go to each table and ask which company it is. Also, if you > had to fill out any applications there on the spot, how did you > manage that? Have any of you had any success with job fairs, and what > did you find that worked for you? >>Any tips or experiences will be appreciated. >>Thank you, >>Misty >>_______________________________________________ >>nabs-l mailing list >>nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carlymih%40comcast.net > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/trillian551%40gmail.com > -- Mary Fernandez "I've learned that people will forget what you said, people will forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them feel." — Maya Angelou From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Tue Mar 12 22:30:27 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 18:30:27 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games In-Reply-To: References: <014801ce1ec2$11b5aa10$3520fe30$@panix.com> Message-ID: <86A07FF37ADF4857AB0F54CD12BD5A82@OwnerPC> Kaiti, Thanks. Do you play the games with other players online or alone? I haven't heard of apples to apples. Sounds neat. Ashley -----Original Message----- From: Kaiti Shelton Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 11:44 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games Hi Ashley, have you heard of RS games? It's a free client you download to your PC. They have accessible games including Monopoly, Uno, 1,000 Miles, Apples to Apples, Farkle (a dice game), Rummy, and Battleship. Not quite word games like what you're thinking of, (well, maybe Apples to Apples to an extent), but they're still pretty good. On 3/11/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > Ashley: > > God is saving you from blowing your dollars on frivolities! (grin) > > Mike > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley > Bramlett > Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 5:12 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games > > Hi all, > > There is a heavy trend toward developing video games and portable games > for > on screen use. > From fun games like bowling and basketball to academic games for math and > science, they are out there. > Some are portable; others are for home use. > For at home we have the WII, Playstation and xbox. For portable options, > there are numerous ones. All tablets and smart phones have games. Then you > have the Kindle, Nook, and more. > > So what technology, if any, do you use as an alternative to these on > screen > games? > Games range from adaptations of real card or board games to new ones > developed for these portable book readers and tablets. > Scrabble, Hangman, monopoly, and word searches are some games. > > I am beginning to feel left out when people talk about all these games. > Perhaps, you all feel that way. > My mother, who usually hates technology, has fallen in love with a few > games > on her new Kindle Fire; of course, not accessible to us. My mom is > intimidated by computers, yet somehow picked up the concept in the kindle > okay. She has games, music aps, and books on it. > Perhaps, there are IOS games out there. I suppose there are computer games > which I just haven’t looked at. > I’d love to have a version of hangman, word puzzles, and card games for > the > pc. > There are two games I had as a kid; I don’t know if both still exist as > its > old technology. But one does. > 1. The Speak n Spell was a handheld thing; like a primative computer. You > used it as a dictionary and it had academic games on it such as guessing > partial words, a word scramble where you had to unscramble letters to make > a > word, word matching, and more games. > 2. The Franklin Language master still exists; I saw it online. Most have > the > pc for a dictionary. But for those who want another portable option or a > way > to expand your vocabulary, this is excellent. It is lightweight with a > qwerty style keyboard and speaks everything as well as a way to magnify > the > text. You can play word games on it such as hangman, word scramble, flash > cards, word train, creating anagrams and more. I think there’s ten games > on > it. > > So what else is out there? Maybe something from APH? > > Thanks. > Ashley > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 21:20:52 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 17:20:52 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Is Graduate School Worth It? In-Reply-To: <01ef01ce1eab$cbe1d920$63a58b60$@gmail.com> References: <01ef01ce1eab$cbe1d920$63a58b60$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <005801ce1e9e$4fe6e0c0$efb4a240$@gmail.com> I don't agree with the article; if you have a dream, pursue it. You just have to take your career and work it. It is starting to be that an undergraduate degree isn't going to cut it. You have to find your career path, and quit listening to all of the nay Sayers who are predicting gloom and doom. Sure, they have a point, but only for those who do not have a good plan, and a determination to manifest their dreams. Wayne Dyer would have a field day with this one. It is not that the reasons stated in the article aren't true; in deed they can come true at times. However, if you tailor your own career path and experiences to fit your situation, then you will be able to give yourself the specialized skill set you need. Where are all of the smart people? Hell, I don't know. I know where one is; is reacting to the article even as we speak. Making a lot of money is merely having a good idea, and a good plan. I don't feel as if those folks are any smarter than I am, but what they had was a determination to succeed. If you enter into grad school with some half-baked notion of coming out and making a lot of money without doing the proper research, then it will be more difficult to execute. It is not that you have to have a complete map, but you do want to have some idea on what you would like to see happen. You have to have some idea of what skills and talents you possess, and which ones you would like to truly accentuate. If you can work a plan without going to grad school, then by all means, don't go. However, you are in charge of your fate. If you want to be an entrepreneur, then you are right. Really, all you need is a good plan, the right personal development, and the funds to start. Or, you can get your MBA and become a top manager. You can combine the two; it doesn't matter, but you have to tailor make yourself. You have to put your skills set in play in the best possible situation at the given time. If the teaching is moving to online, then become an online teacher. You just have to have a good plan to make the grad school option work so that you do become prosperous enough to pay back student loans. You have to build the rewards into your own career, and don't depend on a single job or field to do it for you. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joe Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 6:57 PM To: 'NATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF BLIND STUDENTS' Subject: [nabs-l] Is Graduate School Worth It? Why do you want to go to graduate school? You generally felt college was worth it. You got your bachelor's degree because you heard a college degree leads to a better salary. Maybe you feel grad school is the next logical step because you think the specialty of a Master's will make you more marketable. A doctoral degree? Outside of academia, I don't know that the degree will open up that many more doors than an undergraduate diploma. In most cases people are continuing to climb the scholastic ladder because they want to gain a distinct advantage over competing job applicants, but the diminishing returns of graduate studies should make us wonder if we are making the wisest investments of our energy, time, and money. Some career tracks require education beyond a Bachelor's. To my knowledge, you can't become a licensed clinical social worker without a Master's in social work. As far as I know, you can't become a doctor without medical school. Attorneys can't be attorneys without taking the Bar, and in most jurisdictions you can't take the Bar without graduating from an accredited law school. If your interests lie in a highly specialized field that requires advanced education, may your efforts be blessed. Nothing will be more fulfilling than following your own dream. For those of us considering careers in the humanities and social sciences, we have to ask some hard questions. Let's start with one of the most obvious ones: Read the rest of the article: http://joeorozco.com/blog_is_graduate_school_worth_it _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From philso1003 at gmail.com Wed Mar 13 14:37:52 2013 From: philso1003 at gmail.com (Philip S) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 10:37:52 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Human services occupation and the economy Message-ID: Hi group, Do you feel if there's a correlation between the economy/job market and the number of blind people choosing human services fields as their university majors and occupations? For example, do you feel there has been an increase in the number of blind people going into social work, counseling, human services fields during the economic downturn? Thanks. Phil From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Mon Mar 11 20:09:29 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 16:09:29 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible In-Reply-To: <83618F56-DC5F-4B1C-9248-6D32D2D2C7BA@me.com> References: <014601ce1ec1$c2bcd640$483682c0$@panix.com> <3CB5CA86-06E7-4769-A7CA-7EED99608BA8@gmail.com> <83618F56-DC5F-4B1C-9248-6D32D2D2C7BA@me.com> Message-ID: <004201ce1e94$572d4220$0587c660$@gmail.com> It is accessible right out of the box? What company uses that one. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of John Moore Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 1:07 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible A lot of people say that the Nexus 4 is the best one right now, with the Samsung Galaxy S3 behind it. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From k7uij at panix.com Wed Mar 13 02:27:23 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 19:27:23 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote In-Reply-To: References: <513e3b05.43baec0a.48df.0fb8@mx.google.com> <12257A5B-5829-4D5D-9C26-7AECE2C4B5E4@panix.com> <014a01ce1ec3$aeec70b0$0cc55210$@panix.com> Message-ID: <00e601ce1f92$4c50c0d0$e4f24270$@panix.com> Kaiti: We could run this one into the ground so I'll answer as briefly as I can. First, "stylus" is spelled S T Y L U S. And the device you describe is the correct one. However, the "confusion" is on the part of your TVI who obviously wasn't taught at a NFB-oriented school or knew many competent slate-users. I'm not knocking her; I'm just saying you were short-changed. For one thing, you don't write "backward" with the slate and stylus. Yes, you do punch cells from right-to-left. But that's only logical if you're producing dots on the reverse side of the page. For another, you are not writing "backward"; you are writing mirror-image. That is, dot 1 is *always* on the top whether you use a Braillewriter or slate and stylus. It's just that on a Braillewriter, you push the upper-left key just as you would read it while with a slate and stylus, you push the upper-right indentation to make the Braille on the reverse side. Fred Schroeder always said that people made Braille waaay to hard. Had you been educated in the Albuquerque public schools when he directed the VI program, you would have called dots 1, 2, 3 the "first" side" and dots 4, 5, 6 the "second side". You would have learned that on a Braillewriter, the "first side" was on the left and with a slate, it was on the right. You would be told that, say, the letter e was first-side top and second-side middle and that would hold whether you were using a slate or a Braillewriter. And you would have been introduced to the slate *first.* Then when you were pretty good, you would have found the Braillewriter a no-brainer. I taught myself to use a slate and stylus by keeping my ham radio log (we hams back then had to write down every contact/transmission) with a slate. Believe me, with people checking in and out of the conversations frequently, I got fast PDQ. But enough on this issue. I'm not saying the BN is perfect. In fact, I've heard many of the same complaints as you and that Humanware's tech support has gone down-hill quickly. But I can assure you that the word processor in the BN handles some aspects of Braille usage (when writing, of course) better than the Sense note-takers. I think a good deal of the problem lies with the programmers who are Korean. But the Sense note-takers are superbly engineered and I wouldn't be without my BrailleSensePLUS B32. But have a little sympathy for Humanware. Web sites are changing all the time and manufacturers of note-takers have a tiger by the tail trying to keep up with their changing appearance and syntax. One more thing and I'll get off my soapbox. Someone (it wasn't you, I think) suggested that Humanware have a monthly payment plan. Really? Are we not asking a wee bit much when we want our note-taker purveyors to be our finance companies, too? I realize others do this but Humanware may not be in a position to bring that one off. Now I'll go back to lurking. Thank you, everyone, for your indulgence. Mike Freeman -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 8:37 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote Hi Mike, I believe I mentioned that the BrailleSense is not glitch-free. It has it's bugs, but in comparison to the BrailleNote, at least in my observations, it seems to do a better job simply because the software it uses is more current. I am with you though on not expecting a notetaker to do everything; I certainly don't. I use a pc for most of my work and leave the braille reading and quick notetaking for things that aren't as significant as class notes. (A habit I learned from the BrailleNote too, which I and others I know have found has the occasional habit of deleting files without the input to do so from the user). I don't hold full faith in my BrailleSense for everything, but as someone who does use it for reading books in braille because I prefer to read off of a notetaker, I can sympathize with those who are frustrated at Humanware's lack of upkeep to their system. Although personally I always transfered books from the pc to the notetaker through a flashdrive just because I could get what I needed faster, I do think that if Humanware went to the length of putting Bookshare in the favorites, thereby promoting accessing it from the device to download books directly to the unit, then they should have at least made some effort to make that feature work for people who might want to use it. The slate I've seen sounds different from what you're describing. It was a rectangular metal strip with pin-prick sized holes for the stylis to go into. The way it was explained to me, you open it up, place it over the paper so that the side where you have to use the stylis is lined up with the hinge of the instrument on the right side of the page. Then you start on the right and write each character backwards, moving in right to left motion, so that when you take the instrument off the page and flip it over the braille is there. Because of the necessity to flip everything my teachers thought it was much more practical to stick with a Perkins brailler, as I could quickly move in linear fashion across the page without flipping each character. I guess that has been the practice taught to kids my age and younger in my area. On 3/11/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > Kaiti: > > I understand your frustration. I, too, have heard that Humanware has fallen > down drastically on tech support and in keeping their note-takers > up-to-date. I, too, use HIMS products. I, too, like them. But have no > illusions: HIMS products have plenty of glitches and HIMS has released > software that obviously wasn't tested thoroughly enough to get rid of what > ought to have been obvious bugs. > > My point is that all-too-many people are expecting note-takers to do things > that they haven't the horse-power or software sophistication to do. > > The key to me is to use each device for what it's good for, not to expect > one device to do it all. > > Mike Freeman > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 2:53 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote > > Sophie and all, > > I have to disagree with Mike's last comment. Seeing as Humanware > caters to a very specific group of people and is dependent on their > money to keep their company afloat they would be frankly speaking > stupid not to listen to a complaint such as this from their customers. > This isn't some tiny little glitch that is just a nuisance every once > in a while, ut is a reoccurring thing. This is the precise reason why > I switched to Hims instead of Humanware. Not for this precise reason, > but when you compare the two sets of notetakers side by side it's no > wonder why web surfing on the BrailleSense is faster; a machine > running a decent version of windows software rather than MS Dos like > the BrailleNote is going to produce better results because it is more > in sync with the other technology out there today. I can only wonder > why Humanware hasn't figured out how to upgrade their operating system > from one of the 90's to something more current. Of course the > BrailleSense line of notetakers are by no means flawless, but I have > found that my BrailleSense responds a lot better, I don't have to > reset it as much as I had to reset my BrailleNote, and the web surfing > is pretty good considering it's on a notetaker rather than a laptop. > > I think if enough people were to sign something and explicitly state > the problem and the inconvenience it causes then Humanware would be > wise to listen and at least make some effort in updating the security > certificate list. The fact that this happens on sites which Humanware > already programs into the favorites is another good point and one > worth mentioning as well. Perhaps NABS could start something and > hopefully it would matriculate to other divisions. I've heard plenty > of older people complain about issues with their BrailleNotes as well > so this wouldn't just be something for the students to work on if it > were to happen. > > On 3/11/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >> sophie: >> I don't know you so am reluctant to comment upon your assertion that a >> slate >> is inefficient except to say that such assertions are often made by those >> who do not use a slate extensively and therefore are unfamiliar with how >> efficient it can be in skilled hands. >> As for electronic petitions, they are IMO worthless since they cannot be >> verified. Moreover, keeping up with such things as security certificates >> and >> current trends in web design is a thankless, if not an impossible task for >> manufacturers of specialized devices. >> And Apple periodically breaks Braille support and we must wait months for >> the fix! >> >> Mike Freeman >> sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 11, 2013, at 13:43, "Ashley Bramlett" >> wrote: >> >>> As for the slate versus the notetaker, generally, its faster with the >>> notetaker; but a slate can be as fast as a pencil and paper if you have >>> practiced enough. But I would never be fast like that as I did not grow >>> up >>> with it. >>> >>> I like the petetion idea too. why not do i t online or at the nfb >>> convention? >>> >>> -----Original Message----- From: Sophie Trist >>> Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 4:13 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >>> >>> Mike, I'm going to have to disagree with you here. Slates and >>> styluses are very inefficient. On my BN, I can type notes in >>> class faster than most sighted kids can write them. On an S&S, >>> notetaking would take ten times as long and be three times as >>> difficult. Also, I have found Apple's braille support to be very >>> nice. Yeah, it's not perfect, but it's great all things >>> considered. Okay, sorry for the rant and for getting off topic. >>> Kaiti, I like your idea of petitioning Humanware to include an >>> updated list of security certificates (as well as a freakin Docx >>> converter) into their next update. Does anyone know how we could >>> get such a project started? >>> >>> Yours sincerely, >>> Sophie >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: Mike Freeman >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> >> Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 11:55:22 -0700 >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >>> >>> The answer is extremely simple although my observation is that >>> most blind people do not want to hear it. >>> First, piezoelectric braille displays are expensive and the >>> demand for them is small enough that their price is unlikely to >>> decrease much. >>> Second, Apple sells far more i-devices than Humanware, HIMS and >>> Levelstar/APH sell note-takers. Therefore, Apple can take >>> advantage of economies of scale in production that note-taker >>> manufacturers can only dream of. High production quantity >>> translates directly into lower prices >>> This is the economic consequence of being the minority we know >>> ourselves to be. The fact that note-takers are, in essence, >>> glorified PDAs with braille displays matters not one whit where >>> economics are concerned. The kicker here is that we cannot depend >>> upon mainstream devices to meet all our needs >>> All the complaining in the world won't change this reality. The >>> one consolation we have here is that slates and styluses are >>> still cheap! >>> >>> Mike Freeman >>> sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 11, 2013, at 11:05, Sarah wrote: >>> >>> Yeah my point is the same why in the world would you have to pay >>> over $5,000 for a device that can barely do more than go on >>> Facebook or google or Bookshare when an iPhone costs less than >>> half the price and you can do anything on it. >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: Valerie Gibson >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> >> Date sent: Mon, 11 Mar 2013 01:38:15 -0500 >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote >>> >>> I think i saw something about it on the BN mailing list, but >>> someone said their computer was doing it too, and I have not had >>> that problem. Overall, the thread on it was not too helpful, but >>> maybe I just didn't dig deep enough. >>> >>> Another bad part about all this is, I can't even exit the >>> internet because the dialog pops up again. I have to reset my >>> BN. >>> >>> It's sadly getting to the point where, if not for the braille >>> display, the BN would not be worth having?쫆t least that's my >>> thinking. >>> >>> I know the BN can only do so muc, but if it were half as good as >>> a mobile device that would be something. I don't mean to bash >>> the braillenote or the manufacturer, and I appologize if my tone >>> is coming across as such, it's just?쫡o spend that much money on >>> a device and have your iphone/ipad, which coasts a fifth of the >>> price, work more flawlessly is a wee bit disappointing. >>> >>> Maybe humanware should up the game and make a iphone/ipad >>> docking station with a braille display at the bottom?쫛r an >>> iphone/ipad case with a braille display somehow built in. You >>> have to admit, that would be beautiful. :) >>> >>> If anyone figures out a way around this, please let me know. >>> Thanks so much. >>> On Mar 11, 2013, at 12:09 AM, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer >>> wrote: >>> >>> good evening Valerie. I get those annoying things all the time! >>> I can not figure a way around them either. Do you know of the >>> braillenote mailing list? >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 10, 2013, at 10:59 PM, Valerie Gibson >>> wrote: >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> Quick question. Does anyone ever get a ton of security alerts >>> while using the internet on the braillenote apex? When I go to >>> facebook or bookshare, I'll get: >>> Security alert dialog. >>> informationyou exchange with this site cannot be viewed or >>> changed by others. However, there is a problem with the site's >>> security certificate. The security certificate is from a trusted >>> certifying athority. >>> The security certificate date is valid. >>> The name on the security certificate is invalid or does not >>> match the name of the site. >>> Do you want to continue? >>> >>> The problem is: >>> 1. I can sometimes get eight or ten of these in a row, and I >>> just hit yes on it. >>> 2. When i'm moving to a new line on the dialog, the braillenote >>> lags. for example, from "The name on the security certificate is >>> invalid?? to "do you want to continue?? it takes the >>> braillenote a second at most to jump from those two line. When >>> you're dealing with four lines, that's four seconds, just to get >>> to the prompt. With all of that added up, it takes about a >>> minute to get past that. I even tried hitting "no" on the prompt >>> and it still brings up security stuff.. >>> >>> Any advice, suggestions, helpful hints, complaints such as this, >>> etc? :) >>> >>> Thanks >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>> info for nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm >>> ail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>> info for nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/valandkayla%4 >>> 0gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>> info for nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/coastergirl92 >>> %40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>> info for nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix >>> .com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade >>> r%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Wed Mar 13 16:03:05 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 12:03:05 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games In-Reply-To: <86A07FF37ADF4857AB0F54CD12BD5A82@OwnerPC> References: <014801ce1ec2$11b5aa10$3520fe30$@panix.com> <86A07FF37ADF4857AB0F54CD12BD5A82@OwnerPC> Message-ID: Ashley, You can do both. You have the options of joining games other people have started, starting a game and waiting for other players to join your game, or starting your own game and adding a bot which basically plays you against the computer. Apples to Apples is really fun. If you're into word games I think you'd like it. Basically you have these cards with words on them and each player in the game takes turns being judge. Each player has to pick the card which they feel best matches the card with the category word, then the judge picks the card that they like the best. The objective is to get picked the most times to win the game. It's a little more complex than that, but that's a simple way of looking at it. On 3/12/13, Ashley Bramlett wrote: > Kaiti, > Thanks. Do you play the games with other players online or alone? > I haven't heard of apples to apples. Sounds neat. > > Ashley > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 11:44 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games > > Hi Ashley, > > have you heard of RS games? It's a free client you download to your > PC. They have accessible games including Monopoly, Uno, 1,000 Miles, > Apples to Apples, Farkle (a dice game), Rummy, and Battleship. Not > quite word games like what you're thinking of, (well, maybe Apples to > Apples to an extent), but they're still pretty good. > > On 3/11/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >> Ashley: >> >> God is saving you from blowing your dollars on frivolities! (grin) >> >> Mike >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley >> Bramlett >> Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 5:12 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games >> >> Hi all, >> >> There is a heavy trend toward developing video games and portable games >> for >> on screen use. >> From fun games like bowling and basketball to academic games for math and >> science, they are out there. >> Some are portable; others are for home use. >> For at home we have the WII, Playstation and xbox. For portable options, >> there are numerous ones. All tablets and smart phones have games. Then >> you >> have the Kindle, Nook, and more. >> >> So what technology, if any, do you use as an alternative to these on >> screen >> games? >> Games range from adaptations of real card or board games to new ones >> developed for these portable book readers and tablets. >> Scrabble, Hangman, monopoly, and word searches are some games. >> >> I am beginning to feel left out when people talk about all these games. >> Perhaps, you all feel that way. >> My mother, who usually hates technology, has fallen in love with a few >> games >> on her new Kindle Fire; of course, not accessible to us. My mom is >> intimidated by computers, yet somehow picked up the concept in the kindle >> okay. She has games, music aps, and books on it. >> Perhaps, there are IOS games out there. I suppose there are computer >> games >> which I just haven’t looked at. >> I’d love to have a version of hangman, word puzzles, and card games for >> the >> pc. >> There are two games I had as a kid; I don’t know if both still exist as >> its >> old technology. But one does. >> 1. The Speak n Spell was a handheld thing; like a primative computer. You >> used it as a dictionary and it had academic games on it such as guessing >> partial words, a word scramble where you had to unscramble letters to make >> >> a >> word, word matching, and more games. >> 2. The Franklin Language master still exists; I saw it online. Most have >> the >> pc for a dictionary. But for those who want another portable option or a >> way >> to expand your vocabulary, this is excellent. It is lightweight with a >> qwerty style keyboard and speaks everything as well as a way to magnify >> the >> text. You can play word games on it such as hangman, word scramble, flash >> cards, word train, creating anagrams and more. I think there’s ten games >> on >> it. >> >> So what else is out there? Maybe something from APH? >> >> Thanks. >> Ashley >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Tue Mar 12 17:04:06 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 13:04:06 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Human services occupation and the economy In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000001ce1f43$9bf41e60$d3dc5b20$@gmail.com> It tends to fit the skill set more often then not? I've never thought about it in reguards to economy, but you may have something, because rehab counseling is a rather robust field when it comes to jobs. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Philip S Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:38 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] Human services occupation and the economy Hi group, Do you feel if there's a correlation between the economy/job market and the number of blind people choosing human services fields as their university majors and occupations? For example, do you feel there has been an increase in the number of blind people going into social work, counseling, human services fields during the economic downturn? Thanks. Phil _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From freethaught at gmail.com Wed Mar 13 00:56:04 2013 From: freethaught at gmail.com (Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr.) Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 20:56:04 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Yahoo tech support procedure Message-ID: <8B8F1B88-2151-49D0-A528-06CED9A7977D@gmail.com> Hello all, I want to inquire about Yahoo's technical support procedures for people who are blind. One of my friends found a 1800 number for technical support, but encountered questionable sales tactics from the group claiming to be supporting the Yahoo site. First they asked to get remote access to his computer. Then they proceeded to tell him about some software that would monitor for malware. The software allegedly cost $99. My friend never bought it. So I decided to look into this matter. I called the number, and gave them a bogus email address along with a date of birth. Dave, the technical support associate from India, told me that my email address had been compromised. Remember, I gave them a bogus email address. He started asking me to go through the process of giving him remote access. He referred me to join.me. This is when I ended the call. The support number is 1800 906-0932. Is this common procedure for technical support used at Yahoo? Should they be asking for remote access? And are they supposed to sell product like that? I spoke with AFB's information line, and their employee, Tara, confirmed having seen something similar happening about a year ago. She was surprised this was still happening. I look forward to any feedback about this. Antonio From brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com Tue Mar 12 18:00:51 2013 From: brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com (Brandon Keith Biggs) Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 11:00:51 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible In-Reply-To: <004901ce1e57$a392ad90$eab808b0$@gmail.com> References: <6F2D6B93FECA4A96B19E4EF2B374716A@BrandonsLaptop2> <004901ce1e57$a392ad90$eab808b0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <447386A5B65049B5A419DF4C0E404B14@BrandonsLaptop2> Hello, I'm pretty sure that is like asking what companies make accessible windows computers. The screen readers are software so can probably be installed on any phone. Thanks, Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: justin williams Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 5:54 AM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible What companies have the android phones that are accessible? -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon Keith Biggs Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 1:10 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible Hello, Yes they are, Jellybean in particular. There is also a special tablet made by APH that is an android phone with a Braille display and all the features of an Android phone, the Braille Plus 18. Thanks, Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: Justin Young Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 5:38 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] Are Droids Accessible Hi All! Hope the semester is treating you all great! I know the IPhone is popular, but I was looking a few other phones and wanted to know if anyone knew if the Droids were accessible? I don't know the features it might have so I wanted to ask if any have tried them and could provide feedback. Thanks in advance! Justin Young _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai l.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Tue Mar 12 19:13:00 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 15:13:00 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Navigating Job Fairs In-Reply-To: References: <1A0B02D10E7D4C31A38796C200534562@acerd37f251f21> <7.0.1.0.2.20130311175909.01bf3e88@comcast.net> Message-ID: <002601ce1f55$9e130190$da3904b0$@gmail.com> Did you use a cane, or a dog/ -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mary Fernandez Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 1:52 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Navigating Job Fairs Hi Misty and all, My senior year in college was almost exclusively dedicated to looking for a job. As a result, I attended more job fairs than I care to remember. I never really considered having a reader as an option for me, since many times, I'd go in between classes, if the fair was on campus, and having to wait for someone, or trying to figure out people's schedules, can complicate things. I also loved going to job fairs on my own and figuring out where things are and meeting people. Here are some tips that helped me be successful at job fairs. These are just things that worked for me, and having a guide or reader might be the best option for someone else. Before attending the fair I would always look at the online program of the companies that would be there. I would then make a short list of the companies I definitely wanted to talk to. At these things there is usually a registration/information table. They will hand you a name tag, and usually a print list of the companies present. I'd take a couple of minutes to talk to one of the people at the information table, asking about the layout of the room, and finding out which of the companies I wanted to meet were closest to the door. I'd then walk in and find the table. Although it might seem a bit intimidating with so many people around, I find that career fairs are usually organized chaos. The people in the isles are waiting to talk to a recruiter. And each table has fairly big signs, so it is easy, as you are trying to find a table, to just ask the different people in line and they will point you to where you want to go. Once you find the first table, talk to the recruiter and get their contact information. Make sure to bring a note taking device with you, whether it be your phone or a notetaker. I have very rarely seen paper applications at the tables, but if they do have them there, they are almost guaranteed to have them online. Recruiters are often more than happy to send you to their website, or send you a follow up email with the print information they were handing out. If you are truly interested in a company, you will email them after the event with any follow up questions, or just a simple thank you for talking to me note. Once you are done speaking to a recruiter, it is very simple to ask where the next company you want to talk to is. I found this to be an incredibly useful strategy, as they will have a list of booths in front of them, and they also get to see that you are totally independent, which always makes a good impression. Lastly, sometimes when there are so many people around, it is hard to know when someone is talking to you if they don't say your name, and in comes the name tags. Most recruiters will pretend that they know you, and say "hi, ms." Once you get through your first career fair, you will figure out what works and doesn't for you. And if you are anything like me, you will actually really love them, as you get to meet really cool people, whether students or recruiters, that you would not have otherwise. Best of luck! Mary F On 3/11/13, Carly Mihalakis wrote: > Hi, Misty, > > From what I have been able to notice, sighted people sort of > expect you to have an assistant of sorts to walk around with you, > reading names, filling out aps. In fact, it would seem to me that > bumbling around a job fair by oneself might represent an inability to > know when to call on assistance. and that could also turn potential > employers off to the idea of hiring a blind person. > What do you think of this? > Keep us posted on how this job fair goes, okay? > for today, Car, > > just about everything on my own, but this is something new for me, and > I don't want to look bad or awkward to employers while moving around > the job fair. Also, I do not know if it would turn employers away if I > go to each table and ask which company it is. Also, if you had to fill > out any applications there on the spot, how did you manage that? Have > any of you had any success with job fairs, and what did you find that > worked for you? >>Any tips or experiences will be appreciated. >>Thank you, >>Misty >>_______________________________________________ >>nabs-l mailing list >>nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carlymih%40comcast >>.net > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/trillian551%40gmai > l.com > -- Mary Fernandez "I've learned that people will forget what you said, people will forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them feel." - Maya Angelou _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From brice.smith319 at gmail.com Wed Mar 13 19:22:38 2013 From: brice.smith319 at gmail.com (Brice Smith) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 15:22:38 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Word and Headers? Message-ID: Hello, Does anyone know how to edit the contents of a header in Microsoft Word. I can read the contents of it with insert plus F1. But I need to actually edit this and normal navigation isn't working. Thanks, Brice From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Tue Mar 12 19:27:37 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 15:27:37 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Word and Headers? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <004501ce1f57$a8247360$f86d5a20$@gmail.com> Alt n h e will put you in the edit field. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brice Smith Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:23 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] Word and Headers? Hello, Does anyone know how to edit the contents of a header in Microsoft Word. I can read the contents of it with insert plus F1. But I need to actually edit this and normal navigation isn't working. Thanks, Brice _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From trillian551 at gmail.com Wed Mar 13 19:30:49 2013 From: trillian551 at gmail.com (Mary Fernandez) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 15:30:49 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Navigating Job Fairs In-Reply-To: <002601ce1f55$9e130190$da3904b0$@gmail.com> References: <1A0B02D10E7D4C31A38796C200534562@acerd37f251f21> <7.0.1.0.2.20130311175909.01bf3e88@comcast.net> <002601ce1f55$9e130190$da3904b0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi all, I used a cane during all my adventures. Thanks. Mary On 3/12/13, justin williams wrote: > Did you use a cane, or a dog/ > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mary Fernandez > Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 1:52 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Navigating Job Fairs > > Hi Misty and all, > My senior year in college was almost exclusively dedicated to looking for a > job. As a result, I attended more job fairs than I care to remember. I > never > really considered having a reader as an option for me, since many times, > I'd > go in between classes, if the fair was on campus, and having to wait for > someone, or trying to figure out people's schedules, can complicate things. > I also loved going to job fairs on my own and figuring out where things are > and meeting people. > Here are some tips that helped me be successful at job fairs. These are > just > things that worked for me, and having a guide or reader might be the best > option for someone else. > Before attending the fair I would always look at the online program of the > companies that would be there. I would then make a short list of the > companies I definitely wanted to talk to. > At these things there is usually a registration/information table. > They will hand you a name tag, and usually a print list of the companies > present. I'd take a couple of minutes to talk to one of the people at the > information table, asking about the layout of the room, and finding out > which of the companies I wanted to meet were closest to the door. > I'd then walk in and find the table. Although it might seem a bit > intimidating with so many people around, I find that career fairs are > usually organized chaos. The people in the isles are waiting to talk to a > recruiter. And each table has fairly big signs, so it is easy, as you are > trying to find a table, to just ask the different people in line and they > will point you to where you want to go. > Once you find the first table, talk to the recruiter and get their contact > information. Make sure to bring a note taking device with you, whether it > be > your phone or a notetaker. I have very rarely seen paper applications at > the > tables, but if they do have them there, they are almost guaranteed to have > them online. Recruiters are often more than happy to send you to their > website, or send you a follow up email with the print information they were > handing out. If you are truly interested in a company, you will email them > after the event with any follow up questions, or just a simple thank you > for > talking to me note. > Once you are done speaking to a recruiter, it is very simple to ask where > the next company you want to talk to is. I found this to be an incredibly > useful strategy, as they will have a list of booths in front of them, and > they also get to see that you are totally independent, which always makes a > good impression. Lastly, sometimes when there are so many people around, it > is hard to know when someone is talking to you if they don't say your name, > and in comes the name tags. Most recruiters will pretend that they know > you, > and say "hi, ms." > Once you get through your first career fair, you will figure out what works > and doesn't for you. And if you are anything like me, you will actually > really love them, as you get to meet really cool people, whether students > or > recruiters, that you would not have otherwise. > Best of luck! > Mary F > > > On 3/11/13, Carly Mihalakis wrote: >> Hi, Misty, >> >> From what I have been able to notice, sighted people sort of >> expect you to have an assistant of sorts to walk around with you, >> reading names, filling out aps. In fact, it would seem to me that >> bumbling around a job fair by oneself might represent an inability to >> know when to call on assistance. and that could also turn potential >> employers off to the idea of hiring a blind person. >> What do you think of this? >> Keep us posted on how this job fair goes, okay? >> for today, Car, >> >> just about everything on my own, but this is something new for me, and >> I don't want to look bad or awkward to employers while moving around >> the job fair. Also, I do not know if it would turn employers away if I >> go to each table and ask which company it is. Also, if you had to fill >> out any applications there on the spot, how did you manage that? Have >> any of you had any success with job fairs, and what did you find that >> worked for you? >>>Any tips or experiences will be appreciated. >>>Thank you, >>>Misty >>>_______________________________________________ >>>nabs-l mailing list >>>nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carlymih%40comcast >>>.net >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/trillian551%40gmai >> l.com >> > > > -- > Mary Fernandez > "I've learned that people will forget what you said, people will forget > what > you did, but people will never forget how you made them feel." > - > Maya Angelou > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/trillian551%40gmail.com > -- Mary Fernandez "I've learned that people will forget what you said, people will forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them feel." — Maya Angelou From brice.smith319 at gmail.com Wed Mar 13 19:34:59 2013 From: brice.smith319 at gmail.com (Brice Smith) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 15:34:59 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Word and Headers? In-Reply-To: <004501ce1f57$a8247360$f86d5a20$@gmail.com> References: <004501ce1f57$a8247360$f86d5a20$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Thank you for your fast response, Justin. I'm on a tight deadline and this is exactly what I needed. Brice On 3/12/13, justin williams wrote: > Alt n h e will put you in the edit field. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brice Smith > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:23 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] Word and Headers? > > Hello, > Does anyone know how to edit the contents of a header in Microsoft Word. I > can read the contents of it with insert plus F1. But I need to actually > edit > this and normal navigation isn't working. > > Thanks, > Brice > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com > -- Brice Smith North Carolina State University, Communication - Public Relations Brice.Smith319 at gmail.com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Wed Mar 13 20:10:22 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 16:10:22 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Yahoo tech support procedure In-Reply-To: <8B8F1B88-2151-49D0-A528-06CED9A7977D@gmail.com> References: <8B8F1B88-2151-49D0-A528-06CED9A7977D@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, Antonio. This is really disturbing. I just recently created a yahoo account purely to join a professional group housed there and didn't see anything there. I know in the sign up process it said that there was techical assistance available to users who were visually impaired or hard of hearing, but I don't recal seeing that number. Obviously, I've reached the same conclusion you have that it's bogus and a scam targeting these users who need assistance. Perhaps it would be useful if we knew what type of assistance or what part of the site was related to the need for technical support. I am interested in investigating this. From my experiences with Yahoo, there is a lot to be desired in terms of accessibility, and if this number really goes to their tech support people and they're really running this scam something will definitely need to be done. On 3/12/13, Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr. wrote: > Hello all, > I want to inquire about Yahoo's technical support procedures for people who > are blind. > > One of my friends found a 1800 number for technical support, but encountered > questionable sales tactics from the group claiming to be supporting the > Yahoo site. > > First they asked to get remote access to his computer. Then they proceeded > to tell him about some software that would monitor for malware. The software > allegedly cost $99. My friend never bought it. > So I decided to look into this matter. I called the number, and gave them a > bogus email address along with a date of birth. > > Dave, the technical support associate from India, told me that my email > address had been compromised. > > Remember, I gave them a bogus email address. > > He started asking me to go through the process of giving him remote access. > He referred me to join.me. > > This is when I ended the call. > The support number is 1800 906-0932. > > Is this common procedure for technical support used at Yahoo? > > Should they be asking for remote access? And are they supposed to sell > product like that? > > I spoke with AFB's information line, and their employee, Tara, confirmed > having seen something similar happening about a year ago. She was surprised > this was still happening. > > I look forward to any feedback about this. > > Antonio > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Tue Mar 12 20:59:09 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 16:59:09 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Word and Headers? In-Reply-To: References: <004501ce1f57$a8247360$f86d5a20$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <00a401ce1f64$71ba52b0$552ef810$@gmail.com> Not a problem. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brice Smith Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:35 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Word and Headers? Thank you for your fast response, Justin. I'm on a tight deadline and this is exactly what I needed. Brice On 3/12/13, justin williams wrote: > Alt n h e will put you in the edit field. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brice > Smith > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:23 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] Word and Headers? > > Hello, > Does anyone know how to edit the contents of a header in Microsoft > Word. I can read the contents of it with insert plus F1. But I need to > actually edit this and normal navigation isn't working. > > Thanks, > Brice > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40g > mail.com > -- Brice Smith North Carolina State University, Communication - Public Relations Brice.Smith319 at gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From zerone1683 at gmail.com Wed Mar 13 22:32:58 2013 From: zerone1683 at gmail.com (Chun Chao) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 15:32:58 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Yahoo tech support procedure In-Reply-To: <8B8F1B88-2151-49D0-A528-06CED9A7977D@gmail.com> References: <8B8F1B88-2151-49D0-A528-06CED9A7977D@gmail.com> Message-ID: <001c01ce203a$b81f8af0$285ea0d0$@com> Hello NABS: I have never used the 1800 number tech support, just the help files online within the website. However, I can definitely say that I closed my (3-day-old) Yahoo email account. Not only was navigation terrible but the online help files for accessibility configuration were not accurate either. I ended up getting an email account from the new Outlook.com by Microsoft. It is true that Microsoft can still better their accessibility features, but the internet mail was much easier to navigate and configure than was the Yahoo mail. Gmail is still the best way to go for email service, but if you want another email or two to help organize things, I do not recommend using multiple accounts from just one email service. Regards, C.C. Alan -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr. Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 5:56 PM To: GUI Talk Mailing List Discussion of the Graphical User Interface Cc: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] Yahoo tech support procedure Hello all, I want to inquire about Yahoo's technical support procedures for people who are blind. One of my friends found a 1800 number for technical support, but encountered questionable sales tactics from the group claiming to be supporting the Yahoo site. First they asked to get remote access to his computer. Then they proceeded to tell him about some software that would monitor for malware. The software allegedly cost $99. My friend never bought it. So I decided to look into this matter. I called the number, and gave them a bogus email address along with a date of birth. Dave, the technical support associate from India, told me that my email address had been compromised. Remember, I gave them a bogus email address. He started asking me to go through the process of giving him remote access. He referred me to join.me. This is when I ended the call. The support number is 1800 906-0932. Is this common procedure for technical support used at Yahoo? Should they be asking for remote access? And are they supposed to sell product like that? I spoke with AFB's information line, and their employee, Tara, confirmed having seen something similar happening about a year ago. She was surprised this was still happening. I look forward to any feedback about this. Antonio _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zerone1683%40gmail.com From hhamraz at gmail.com Wed Mar 13 22:39:33 2013 From: hhamraz at gmail.com (Hamid Hamraz) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 18:39:33 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID Message-ID: Dear Folks, It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to represent my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To be more precise, the target people benefiting are those whose residual sight lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who want to let the other people around them know about their blindness. Carrying a cane is indeed an option. However, I personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using it and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have a special symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere in any size at one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware of that). However, there is no such a thing here in US, and setting that up requires time and educating the society about that. My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. Hamid From hotdancer1416 at gmail.com Wed Mar 13 22:51:11 2013 From: hotdancer1416 at gmail.com (Ashlee g) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 18:51:11 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5F242764-3B1C-4934-B3CE-50418860AB29@gmail.com> As I am unable to speak, and use a cane at the same time, do to me using a device, and or ASL, i just carry my cane in my purse, and use it when i am unsure of my Surroundings. So for me, a folding cane is more appropriate. And it works out well, because I just leave it in my purse, so that I don't forget it. I just started doing this quite recently actually. Because I had a very difficult time trying to figure out a way to Cheruiyot but still communicate when necessary or when I just wanted to. NOTHING ABOUT US, WITHOUT US. AUTISTICS RULE On Mar 13, 2013, at 18:39, "Hamid Hamraz" wrote: > Dear Folks, > > It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to represent my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To be more precise, the target people benefiting are those whose residual sight lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who want to let the other people around them know about their blindness. Carrying a cane is indeed an option. However, I personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using it and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have a special symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere in any size at one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware of that). However, there is no such a thing here in US, and setting that up requires time and educating the society about that. > > My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. > > Hamid > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hotdancer1416%40gmail.com From kwakmiso at aol.com Wed Mar 13 22:55:19 2013 From: kwakmiso at aol.com (Miso Kwak) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 18:55:19 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: <01d601ce1b8a$98cd20e0$ca6762a0$@gmail.com> References: <01d601ce1b8a$98cd20e0$ca6762a0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <8CFEE54F890B100-1E5C-15BA5@webmail-d192.sysops.aol.com> Hello, I would like to know if any of you have participated in the STEP program offered by Junior Blind in California. If you have the experience, could you comment on how it was? Would you recommend it? I am trying to select a summer program that will help me improve my independent living skills (mobility, home management, etc) and realize that there are a few different options available, so I just want to hear from someone if anyone on the list has experience with Junior Blind's STEP program. Thank you. Miso Kwak From gloria.graves at gmail.com Wed Mar 13 23:07:23 2013 From: gloria.graves at gmail.com (Gloria G) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 18:07:23 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Converting files from the I-phone Message-ID: Hi all, I recently conducted an interview in which I used my I-phone as a recording device. My professor would like students to upload the file to sound cloud, and was wondering if anyone could provide me with instructions on how to take a I-phone recorded file and convert it to a MP3 file to be uploaded to sound cloud? This is my first time recording with the I-phone and my first time having to convert this type of file. Any help is appreciated. Thanks in advance! Gloria From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Wed Mar 13 23:54:37 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 19:54:37 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: <5F242764-3B1C-4934-B3CE-50418860AB29@gmail.com> References: <5F242764-3B1C-4934-B3CE-50418860AB29@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, I really like the telescopic canes from NFB. During the day I can carry it around and people clearly know what it is; but I've found that they're good enough for use if necessary as well. They're also the most compact option available if space is also somewhat of a concern. HTH. On 3/13/13, Ashlee g wrote: > As I am unable to speak, and use a cane at the same time, do to me using a > device, and or ASL, i just carry my cane in my purse, and use it when i am > unsure of my Surroundings. So for me, a folding cane is more appropriate. > And it works out well, because I just leave it in my purse, so that I don't > forget it. I just started doing this quite recently actually. Because I had > a very difficult time trying to figure out a way to Cheruiyot but still > communicate when necessary or when I just wanted to. > > NOTHING ABOUT US, WITHOUT US. AUTISTICS RULE > > On Mar 13, 2013, at 18:39, "Hamid Hamraz" wrote: > >> Dear Folks, >> >> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to represent my >> blindness without making a functional use of cane. To be more precise, the >> target people benefiting are those whose residual sight lets them to walk >> without the use of a cane and who want to let the other people around them >> know about their blindness. Carrying a cane is indeed an option. However, >> I personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using it >> and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have a special >> symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere in any size at >> one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware of that). However, >> there is no such a thing here in US, and setting that up requires time and >> educating the society about that. >> >> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need something >> much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a functional tool. I >> appreciate any suggestion. >> >> Hamid >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hotdancer1416%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Tue Mar 12 23:57:11 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 19:57:11 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: References: <5F242764-3B1C-4934-B3CE-50418860AB29@gmail.com> Message-ID: <000001ce1f7d$5095f120$f1c1d360$@gmail.com> I agree. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 7:55 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID Hi, I really like the telescopic canes from NFB. During the day I can carry it around and people clearly know what it is; but I've found that they're good enough for use if necessary as well. They're also the most compact option available if space is also somewhat of a concern. HTH. On 3/13/13, Ashlee g wrote: > As I am unable to speak, and use a cane at the same time, do to me > using a device, and or ASL, i just carry my cane in my purse, and use > it when i am unsure of my Surroundings. So for me, a folding cane is more appropriate. > And it works out well, because I just leave it in my purse, so that I > don't forget it. I just started doing this quite recently actually. > Because I had a very difficult time trying to figure out a way to > Cheruiyot but still communicate when necessary or when I just wanted to. > > NOTHING ABOUT US, WITHOUT US. AUTISTICS RULE > > On Mar 13, 2013, at 18:39, "Hamid Hamraz" wrote: > >> Dear Folks, >> >> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to represent >> my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To be more >> precise, the target people benefiting are those whose residual sight >> lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who want to let the >> other people around them know about their blindness. Carrying a cane >> is indeed an option. However, I personally think that holding a long >> cane in my hand without using it and walking perfectly is weird in >> public. In Germany, they have a special symbol representing this >> which can be attached anywhere in any size at one's own discretion >> (and everybody is indeed aware of that). However, there is no such a >> thing here in US, and setting that up requires time and educating the society about that. >> >> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need >> something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a >> functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. >> >> Hamid >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hotdancer1416%40g >> mail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% > 40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Wed Mar 13 23:58:07 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 19:58:07 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Yahoo tech support procedure In-Reply-To: <001c01ce203a$b81f8af0$285ea0d0$@com> References: <8B8F1B88-2151-49D0-A528-06CED9A7977D@gmail.com> <001c01ce203a$b81f8af0$285ea0d0$@com> Message-ID: Hi, Absolutely agreed. I love my gmail account, but the least you should do for security is to use different service providers (MSN, AOL, etc). Also, don't use the same password on all your accounts, and periodically change them for security. I just looked up the help files and agree as well; they're not very accurate. I don't know what your friend was trying to do with yahoo, but if it's something that could be done with gmail, (which actually has pretty useful help files specific to accessing the gmail with screenreaders such as jaws), try that. Yahoo just doesn't sound safe to me and the tech support issue is kind of freaky. On 3/13/13, Chun Chao wrote: > Hello NABS: > > I have never used the 1800 number tech support, just the help files online > within the website. > However, I can definitely say that I closed my (3-day-old) Yahoo email > account. > Not only was navigation terrible but the online help files for > accessibility > configuration were not accurate either. > > I ended up getting an email account from the new Outlook.com by Microsoft. > It is true that Microsoft can still better their accessibility features, > but > the internet mail was much easier to navigate and configure than was the > Yahoo mail. > Gmail is still the best way to go for email service, but if you want > another > email or two to help organize things, I do not recommend using multiple > accounts from just one email service. > > Regards, > C.C. Alan > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Antonio M. > Guimaraes Jr. > Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 5:56 PM > To: GUI Talk Mailing List Discussion of the Graphical User Interface > Cc: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: [nabs-l] Yahoo tech support procedure > > Hello all, > I want to inquire about Yahoo's technical support procedures for people who > are blind. > > One of my friends found a 1800 number for technical support, but > encountered > questionable sales tactics from the group claiming to be supporting the > Yahoo site. > > First they asked to get remote access to his computer. Then they proceeded > to tell him about some software that would monitor for malware. The > software > allegedly cost $99. My friend never bought it. > So I decided to look into this matter. I called the number, and gave them a > bogus email address along with a date of birth. > > Dave, the technical support associate from India, told me that my email > address had been compromised. > > Remember, I gave them a bogus email address. > > He started asking me to go through the process of giving him remote access. > He referred me to join.me. > > This is when I ended the call. > The support number is 1800 906-0932. > > Is this common procedure for technical support used at Yahoo? > > Should they be asking for remote access? And are they supposed to sell > product like that? > > I spoke with AFB's information line, and their employee, Tara, confirmed > having seen something similar happening about a year ago. She was surprised > this was still happening. > > I look forward to any feedback about this. > > Antonio > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zerone1683%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Wed Mar 13 00:01:11 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 20:01:11 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Yahoo tech support procedure In-Reply-To: References: <8B8F1B88-2151-49D0-A528-06CED9A7977D@gmail.com> <001c01ce203a$b81f8af0$285ea0d0$@com> Message-ID: <000201ce1f7d$df5202f0$9df608d0$@gmail.com> Where is the yahoo groups? -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 7:58 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Yahoo tech support procedure Hi, Absolutely agreed. I love my gmail account, but the least you should do for security is to use different service providers (MSN, AOL, etc). Also, don't use the same password on all your accounts, and periodically change them for security. I just looked up the help files and agree as well; they're not very accurate. I don't know what your friend was trying to do with yahoo, but if it's something that could be done with gmail, (which actually has pretty useful help files specific to accessing the gmail with screenreaders such as jaws), try that. Yahoo just doesn't sound safe to me and the tech support issue is kind of freaky. On 3/13/13, Chun Chao wrote: > Hello NABS: > > I have never used the 1800 number tech support, just the help files > online within the website. > However, I can definitely say that I closed my (3-day-old) Yahoo email > account. > Not only was navigation terrible but the online help files for > accessibility configuration were not accurate either. > > I ended up getting an email account from the new Outlook.com by Microsoft. > It is true that Microsoft can still better their accessibility > features, but the internet mail was much easier to navigate and > configure than was the Yahoo mail. > Gmail is still the best way to go for email service, but if you want > another email or two to help organize things, I do not recommend using > multiple accounts from just one email service. > > Regards, > C.C. Alan > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Antonio M. > Guimaraes Jr. > Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 5:56 PM > To: GUI Talk Mailing List Discussion of the Graphical User Interface > Cc: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: [nabs-l] Yahoo tech support procedure > > Hello all, > I want to inquire about Yahoo's technical support procedures for > people who are blind. > > One of my friends found a 1800 number for technical support, but > encountered questionable sales tactics from the group claiming to be > supporting the Yahoo site. > > First they asked to get remote access to his computer. Then they > proceeded to tell him about some software that would monitor for > malware. The software allegedly cost $99. My friend never bought it. > So I decided to look into this matter. I called the number, and gave > them a bogus email address along with a date of birth. > > Dave, the technical support associate from India, told me that my > email address had been compromised. > > Remember, I gave them a bogus email address. > > He started asking me to go through the process of giving him remote access. > He referred me to join.me. > > This is when I ended the call. > The support number is 1800 906-0932. > > Is this common procedure for technical support used at Yahoo? > > Should they be asking for remote access? And are they supposed to sell > product like that? > > I spoke with AFB's information line, and their employee, Tara, > confirmed having seen something similar happening about a year ago. > She was surprised this was still happening. > > I look forward to any feedback about this. > > Antonio > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zerone1683%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% > 40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From k7uij at panix.com Thu Mar 14 00:25:48 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 17:25:48 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Converting files from the I-phone In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <014d01ce204a$7af86150$70e923f0$@panix.com> If you transfer your music and other files to an itunes library on your PC, there will be a Voice Memos playlist. Your memo will be part of it. Make a note of its number and search your itunes library on the hard disk for anything with that name. It will probably have a .m4a extension. Copy that file to a temporary area and use Switch or other sound-file converter to change it to .mp3. I haven't tried this with voice memos but it oughtta work. If you do not use an iTunes library on your PC, you're kind of S O L in that Apple does not really allow file conversion programs such as you'll need on its i-devices. At least that's my present information. HMMM ... if you have a large email disk space quota, you might be able to email yourself the voice memo aas an attachment and then use Switch or whatever to convert it. Mike Freeman -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Gloria G Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 4:07 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] Converting files from the I-phone Hi all, I recently conducted an interview in which I used my I-phone as a recording device. My professor would like students to upload the file to sound cloud, and was wondering if anyone could provide me with instructions on how to take a I-phone recorded file and convert it to a MP3 file to be uploaded to sound cloud? This is my first time recording with the I-phone and my first time having to convert this type of file. Any help is appreciated. Thanks in advance! Gloria _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From k7uij at panix.com Thu Mar 14 00:31:54 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 17:31:54 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com> Hamid: With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your cake and eat it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages of being recognized as blind whereas on the other, you don't want to really appear blind or be judged because you do not believe you need a cane. My friend, you can't have it both ways. Why do you even care whether the public considers you blind or not or whether they consider it weird that you might appear to not need a cane? Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons who use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows them as blind whereas you consider that you do not? Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most of us would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a label to being prohibited from going places or doing things because of the alleged inability of the blind. Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! Mike Freeman -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid Hamraz Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID Dear Folks, It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to represent my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To be more precise, the target people benefiting are those whose residual sight lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who want to let the other people around them know about their blindness. Carrying a cane is indeed an option. However, I personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using it and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have a special symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere in any size at one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware of that). However, there is no such a thing here in US, and setting that up requires time and educating the society about that. My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. Hamid _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 01:08:32 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (christopher nusbaum) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 21:08:32 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com> References: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com> Message-ID: <-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid> Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not of inferiority. Just my thoughts Chris Nusbaum Sent from my iPhone On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: > Hamid: > > With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your cake and eat > it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages of being recognized as > blind whereas on the other, you don't want to really appear blind or be > judged because you do not believe you need a cane. My friend, you can't have > it both ways. Why do you even care whether the public considers you blind or > not or whether they consider it weird that you might appear to not need a > cane? Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons who > use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows them as blind > whereas you consider that you do not? > > Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. > > We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most of us > would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a label to being > prohibited from going places or doing things because of the alleged > inability of the blind. > > Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! > > Mike Freeman > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid Hamraz > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID > > Dear Folks, > > It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to represent my > blindness without making a functional use of cane. To be more precise, the > target people benefiting are those whose residual sight lets them to walk > without the use of a cane and who want to let the other people around them > know about their blindness. Carrying a cane is indeed an option. However, I > personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using it and > walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have a special symbol > representing this which can be attached anywhere in any size at one's own > discretion (and everybody is indeed aware of that). However, there is no > such a thing here in US, and setting that up requires time and educating the > society about that. > > > My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need something > much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a functional tool. I > appreciate any suggestion. > > Hamid > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 01:13:39 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (christopher nusbaum) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 21:13:39 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: <8CFEE54F890B100-1E5C-15BA5@webmail-d192.sysops.aol.com> References: <01d601ce1b8a$98cd20e0$ca6762a0$@gmail.com> <8CFEE54F890B100-1E5C-15BA5@webmail-d192.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <2649427510829919549@unknownmsgid> Miso, What is the junior blind of America? I've heard of the step program offered by the Louisiana Center for the blind in Ruston, but I haven't heard of this step program nor have I heard of the organization which puts it on. As far as summer programs, although it's ultimately up to you and your parents, I would definitely recommend checking out the NFB training centers. I have participated in Louisiana Center for the blinds buddy program and am planning to attend their step program this summer. I have found it to be a wonderful experience and one that I have gained a lot from. So, I would definitely recommend checking them out. Chris Nusbaum Sent from my iPhone On Mar 13, 2013, at 6:56 PM, Miso Kwak wrote: > Hello, > I would like to know if any of you have participated in the STEP program offered by Junior Blind in California. > If you have the experience, could you comment on how it was? > Would you recommend it? > I am trying to select a summer program that will help me improve my independent living skills (mobility, home management, etc) and realize that there are a few different options available, so I just want to hear from someone if anyone on the list has experience with Junior Blind's STEP program. > Thank you. > Miso Kwak > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Wed Mar 13 01:18:16 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 21:18:16 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: <2649427510829919549@unknownmsgid> References: <01d601ce1b8a$98cd20e0$ca6762a0$@gmail.com> <8CFEE54F890B100-1E5C-15BA5@webmail-d192.sysops.aol.com> <2649427510829919549@unknownmsgid> Message-ID: <001801ce1f88$a472e6d0$ed58b470$@gmail.com> I would also check out thenfb training centers. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of christopher nusbaum Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 9:14 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Miso, What is the junior blind of America? I've heard of the step program offered by the Louisiana Center for the blind in Ruston, but I haven't heard of this step program nor have I heard of the organization which puts it on. As far as summer programs, although it's ultimately up to you and your parents, I would definitely recommend checking out the NFB training centers. I have participated in Louisiana Center for the blinds buddy program and am planning to attend their step program this summer. I have found it to be a wonderful experience and one that I have gained a lot from. So, I would definitely recommend checking them out. Chris Nusbaum Sent from my iPhone On Mar 13, 2013, at 6:56 PM, Miso Kwak wrote: > Hello, > I would like to know if any of you have participated in the STEP program offered by Junior Blind in California. > If you have the experience, could you comment on how it was? > Would you recommend it? > I am trying to select a summer program that will help me improve my independent living skills (mobility, home management, etc) and realize that there are a few different options available, so I just want to hear from someone if anyone on the list has experience with Junior Blind's STEP program. > Thank you. > Miso Kwak > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g > mail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From kwakmiso at aol.com Thu Mar 14 01:21:37 2013 From: kwakmiso at aol.com (Miso) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 18:21:37 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Message-ID: Thank you Chris. Currently i applied to Colorado Center for the Blind. My application got accepted but California has not approved my funding because there are 'similar programs in California'. Junior Blind of America is a private school for the blind in Los Angeles which the CA department of rehab is recommending me to go instead of CCB. From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Wed Mar 13 01:34:06 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 21:34:06 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: <51412635.674dec0a.4244.ffff9c83SMTPIN_ADDED_MISSING@mx.google.com> References: <51412635.674dec0a.4244.ffff9c83SMTPIN_ADDED_MISSING@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <002c01ce1f8a$dab1b3f0$90151bd0$@gmail.com> Give the Colorado center a call and tell them. Make sure you can justify your decision though. Colorado will offer you experiences far from home that you can't get in California. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Miso Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 9:22 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Thank you Chris. Currently i applied to Colorado Center for the Blind. My application got accepted but California has not approved my funding because there are 'similar programs in California'. Junior Blind of America is a private school for the blind in Los Angeles which the CA department of rehab is recommending me to go instead of CCB. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From kobycox at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 01:34:04 2013 From: kobycox at gmail.com (Koby Cox) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 20:34:04 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: <51412634.08a0ec0a.5b74.ffff8279SMTPIN_ADDED_MISSING@mx.google.com> References: <51412634.08a0ec0a.5b74.ffff8279SMTPIN_ADDED_MISSING@mx.google.com> Message-ID: I think it would be best for me and you to discuss this issue over the phone. Your stay rehab center is going to recommend that you attend their state agency because they don't want to pay for funding for you to go to Denver. If you would like to discuss this further please don't hesitate to contact me either on list or off list. Koby Sent from my iPhone On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:21 PM, Miso wrote: > Thank you Chris. Currently i applied to Colorado Center for the Blind. My application got accepted but California has not approved my funding because there are 'similar programs in California'. > Junior Blind of America is a private school for the blind in Los Angeles which the CA department of rehab is recommending me to go instead of CCB. > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kobycox%40gmail.com From arielle71 at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 02:04:08 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 20:04:08 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: References: <51412634.08a0ec0a.5b74.ffff8279SMTPIN_ADDED_MISSING@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Hi Miso and all, Reasons why the Colorado Center is likely superior to the Junior Blind of America's program include: -- Most if not all instructors at CCB are blind as is the director and the youth services coordinator. This will expose you to blind mentors and role models. Junior Blind is likely mostly staffed by people who are sighted. -- The CCB teaches you how to travel in unfamiliar areas, whereas many traditional O&M programs only teach people how to navigate specific areas. If you plan to go to college out of state, you can argue this "structured discovery" O&M training will be much more useful. -- CCB will teach you how to get around using buses and trains in another state. Again, important for out-of-state college experiences. -- CCB has college prep and work experience programs where you may be able to take a college class and/or get a summer job. I don't know if Junior Blind of America offers those things. I haven't done anything with Junior Blind of America since I was fifteen, but when I did go on a weeklong trip with them at age fifteen, I got the sense that their philosophy about blindness isn't very progressive. I'm pretty confident that going to the CCB program instead will be worth the extra hassle. Definitely speak with Julie and/or Brent about your problems getting funding. They are experienced dealing with state agencies including the one in CA. Best of luck, Arielle On 3/13/13, Koby Cox wrote: > I think it would be best for me and you to discuss this issue over the > phone. Your stay rehab center is going to recommend that you attend their > state agency because they don't want to pay for funding for you to go to > Denver. If you would like to discuss this further please don't hesitate to > contact me either on list or off list. > > Koby > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:21 PM, Miso wrote: > >> Thank you Chris. Currently i applied to Colorado Center for the Blind. My >> application got accepted but California has not approved my funding >> because there are 'similar programs in California'. >> Junior Blind of America is a private school for the blind in Los Angeles >> which the CA department of rehab is recommending me to go instead of CCB. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kobycox%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Wed Mar 13 02:09:43 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 22:09:43 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: References: <51412634.08a0ec0a.5b74.ffff8279SMTPIN_ADDED_MISSING@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <002e01ce1f8f$d47c66b0$7d753410$@gmail.com> And Denver is all sourts of awesome. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle Silverman Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:04 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hi Miso and all, Reasons why the Colorado Center is likely superior to the Junior Blind of America's program include: -- Most if not all instructors at CCB are blind as is the director and the youth services coordinator. This will expose you to blind mentors and role models. Junior Blind is likely mostly staffed by people who are sighted. -- The CCB teaches you how to travel in unfamiliar areas, whereas many traditional O&M programs only teach people how to navigate specific areas. If you plan to go to college out of state, you can argue this "structured discovery" O&M training will be much more useful. -- CCB will teach you how to get around using buses and trains in another state. Again, important for out-of-state college experiences. -- CCB has college prep and work experience programs where you may be able to take a college class and/or get a summer job. I don't know if Junior Blind of America offers those things. I haven't done anything with Junior Blind of America since I was fifteen, but when I did go on a weeklong trip with them at age fifteen, I got the sense that their philosophy about blindness isn't very progressive. I'm pretty confident that going to the CCB program instead will be worth the extra hassle. Definitely speak with Julie and/or Brent about your problems getting funding. They are experienced dealing with state agencies including the one in CA. Best of luck, Arielle On 3/13/13, Koby Cox wrote: > I think it would be best for me and you to discuss this issue over the > phone. Your stay rehab center is going to recommend that you attend > their state agency because they don't want to pay for funding for you > to go to Denver. If you would like to discuss this further please > don't hesitate to contact me either on list or off list. > > Koby > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:21 PM, Miso wrote: > >> Thank you Chris. Currently i applied to Colorado Center for the >> Blind. My application got accepted but California has not approved my >> funding because there are 'similar programs in California'. >> Junior Blind of America is a private school for the blind in Los >> Angeles which the CA department of rehab is recommending me to go instead of CCB. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kobycox%40gmail.c >> om > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. > com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 04:47:56 2013 From: brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com (Brandon Keith Biggs) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 21:47:56 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: <8CFEE54F890B100-1E5C-15BA5@webmail-d192.sysops.aol.com> References: <01d601ce1b8a$98cd20e0$ca6762a0$@gmail.com> <8CFEE54F890B100-1E5C-15BA5@webmail-d192.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: Hello, It depends where you are at in your living skills. I had been living on my own for a few months before I went to the Step 2 program and I found it only good for the few hours of work experience they provided. They aren't very inventive when it comes to giving each person a unique work environment, but you do get to do an internship. I did not like however, the step 1 folks were mentored by the step 2 people for both sessions and the step 2 people had to sit through classes the step 1 participant's were taking. Step 1 is a ton of classes on how to give an interview, talk about yourself and act professionally dressing wise and so on. When I went it was very lecture based and very little real-time experiences, but I could tell some people really needed the learning. I could already cook, clean, do laundry and had had a summer job the year before in a much freer environment, so I found STEP oppressive, but I did learn how to deal with authority in a mature way and even though I won't repeat it, I am glad I went. The campus is also very oddly situated, so it takes for ever to go anywhere and they expect people to work around the schedule they set up, so for example, I had a 2 hour commute on Para transit to and from work and I had work to do at home. They were not very accommodating for those of us who wanted to become work junkies, working till 10, grabbing food, then waking up at 6 and leaving. They wanted you to actually be around with other people and do tasks like instruct the other students on how to use the computer for example. Personally, the YES2 program in Washington state is more my cup of tee than the STEP2 program, but I know plenty of other people who really loved it and or who would really like it. You can email me off list if you have any more questions. brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com Thanks, Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: Miso Kwak Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:55 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hello, I would like to know if any of you have participated in the STEP program offered by Junior Blind in California. If you have the experience, could you comment on how it was? Would you recommend it? I am trying to select a summer program that will help me improve my independent living skills (mobility, home management, etc) and realize that there are a few different options available, so I just want to hear from someone if anyone on the list has experience with Junior Blind's STEP program. Thank you. Miso Kwak _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com From sparklylicious at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 05:28:44 2013 From: sparklylicious at gmail.com (Hannah Chadwick) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 22:28:44 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: References: <01d601ce1b8a$98cd20e0$ca6762a0$@gmail.com> <8CFEE54F890B100-1E5C-15BA5@webmail-d192.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <002301ce2074$cd744f50$685cedf0$@gmail.com> Hi all, So I just wanted to clarify since I've been to the STEP programs at Junior Blind of America. There is STEP 1 and STEP 2, and they are both summer programs that focus on helping young adults with job interviewing skills, career research, and during STEP 2, the students are placed on a work site. They are expected to travel to and from work using public transportation. STEP 1 is 3 weeks and provides students with various info on the topics mentioned above. STEP 2 is 7 weeks and students have the opportunity to do an internship. I would be glad to provide more info on the STEP programs, however, I think that Miso is referring to the Independent living program that Junior Blind also offers. The Davidson Program for Independence, DPI is a residential program for blind individuals who wish to learn skills such as orientation and mobility, technology, cooking, Braille, and of course independent living skills. I did not attend DPI so I don't know specifically what they do and how they run. I did have friends who attended both the STEP programs as well as DPI. They told me they learned a lot and they found it very helpful. I'm sure there are pros and cons to attending any residential program. Please don't hesitate to contact me off list if you have further questions. All the best, Hannah -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon Keith Biggs Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 9:48 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hello, It depends where you are at in your living skills. I had been living on my own for a few months before I went to the Step 2 program and I found it only good for the few hours of work experience they provided. They aren't very inventive when it comes to giving each person a unique work environment, but you do get to do an internship. I did not like however, the step 1 folks were mentored by the step 2 people for both sessions and the step 2 people had to sit through classes the step 1 participant's were taking. Step 1 is a ton of classes on how to give an interview, talk about yourself and act professionally dressing wise and so on. When I went it was very lecture based and very little real-time experiences, but I could tell some people really needed the learning. I could already cook, clean, do laundry and had had a summer job the year before in a much freer environment, so I found STEP oppressive, but I did learn how to deal with authority in a mature way and even though I won't repeat it, I am glad I went. The campus is also very oddly situated, so it takes for ever to go anywhere and they expect people to work around the schedule they set up, so for example, I had a 2 hour commute on Para transit to and from work and I had work to do at home. They were not very accommodating for those of us who wanted to become work junkies, working till 10, grabbing food, then waking up at 6 and leaving. They wanted you to actually be around with other people and do tasks like instruct the other students on how to use the computer for example. Personally, the YES2 program in Washington state is more my cup of tee than the STEP2 program, but I know plenty of other people who really loved it and or who would really like it. You can email me off list if you have any more questions. brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com Thanks, Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: Miso Kwak Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:55 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hello, I would like to know if any of you have participated in the STEP program offered by Junior Blind in California. If you have the experience, could you comment on how it was? Would you recommend it? I am trying to select a summer program that will help me improve my independent living skills (mobility, home management, etc) and realize that there are a few different options available, so I just want to hear from someone if anyone on the list has experience with Junior Blind's STEP program. Thank you. Miso Kwak _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai l.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sparklylicious%40gmail.c om From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 05:32:25 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 01:32:25 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: <-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid> References: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com> <-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid> Message-ID: Mike, I have to disagree here. As one of those partials who elects when to use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you may not be considering. Electing when and when not to use a cane is not always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; some of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas without a cane some times should give up their right to identify themself as a visually impaired person. E.G, I would never do any type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria right across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm coming right back I don't always choose to actively use it. My choice to not use a cane in this instance does not mean I should forfit my right to identify myself as a visually impaired person because I am; the use of the cane does not change my inability to read print or to see great distances and it does not change the fact that I am legally blind and am identified that way. It also doesn't change the level of security I have with my blindness; if a person refuses to use a cane or fights against it because they're afraid of the social implications then that is insecurity, but if they're visually having a good day and want to run a quick errand that's in a very familiar area with minimal travel or risk of injury and they're confident in their ability to use audio cues and the vision they have then that is their choice and doesn't make them insecure with themself or their blindness. As long as they have the confidence and security to not be afraid of using it and to identify and use it when they need to, to be confident and secure whether they're using a cane or not, and don't pose risk to themselves in the cases where they don't use it there is nothing that would suggest insecurity. We don't know the exact visual situation of anyone on this list unless they've written about it, so I don't think it is fair to judge about someone's level of security with their blindness based on their cane habits when we don't know what their vision is like. Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social situations. Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria with my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention using something besides my name. When they see the cane (or sometimes read National Federation of the Blind on it if they're close enough to see it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before getting my name. Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then the person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're informed and they see that it's not a big deal. And, I have to make one small correction. The main market for the lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may not use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since they are the ones who originated the telescopic design. Although I do know people who are totally blind or only have light perception that use the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty quickly because they use them so much. For someone who may not use the cane every single day but still would benefit from having an identifier to let other people know they're visually impaired these canes are great. Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need one. Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to have an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my eyes because even if that person may not need to use it by having one for people to see they must be okay with their blindness and comfortable in explaining their visual impairment to others should the question arise. On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: > Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to > alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive > thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that > identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not of > inferiority. > > Just my thoughts > > Chris Nusbaum > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: > >> Hamid: >> >> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your cake and >> eat >> it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages of being recognized >> as >> blind whereas on the other, you don't want to really appear blind or be >> judged because you do not believe you need a cane. My friend, you can't >> have >> it both ways. Why do you even care whether the public considers you blind >> or >> not or whether they consider it weird that you might appear to not need a >> cane? Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons >> who >> use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows them as >> blind >> whereas you consider that you do not? >> >> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >> >> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most of us >> would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a label to >> being >> prohibited from going places or doing things because of the alleged >> inability of the blind. >> >> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >> >> Mike Freeman >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid Hamraz >> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >> >> Dear Folks, >> >> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to represent my >> blindness without making a functional use of cane. To be more precise, >> the >> target people benefiting are those whose residual sight lets them to walk >> without the use of a cane and who want to let the other people around >> them >> know about their blindness. Carrying a cane is indeed an option. However, >> I >> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using it and >> walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have a special >> symbol >> representing this which can be attached anywhere in any size at one's own >> discretion (and everybody is indeed aware of that). However, there is no >> such a thing here in US, and setting that up requires time and educating >> the >> society about that. >> >> >> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need something >> much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a functional tool. I >> appreciate any suggestion. >> >> Hamid >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From kwakmiso at aol.com Thu Mar 14 06:20:49 2013 From: kwakmiso at aol.com (Miso Kwak) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 02:20:49 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: <002301ce2074$cd744f50$685cedf0$@gmail.com> References: <002301ce2074$cd744f50$685cedf0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <8CFEE93347C9D6A-1AB8-1A53E@webmail-d136.sysops.aol.com> Thank you everyone for helpful answers. To clarify, I was referring to the STEP not Davidson. I lived in California barely 4 years, so I experienced JBA only twice. I personally didn't like the atmosphere and philosophy very much although not unbearable... I think at this point, after reading feedbacks, I would prefer one of the NFB centers over JBA. I think then the task to do is to get my request to attend CCB justified. I will contact staff at the CCB and see what I can do. Thank you again. Miso Kwak -----Original Message----- From: Hannah Chadwick To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Sent: Wed, Mar 13, 2013 10:29 pm Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hi all, So I just wanted to clarify since I've been to the STEP programs at Junior Blind of America. There is STEP 1 and STEP 2, and they are both summer programs that focus on helping young adults with job interviewing skills, career research, and during STEP 2, the students are placed on a work site. They are expected to travel to and from work using public transportation. STEP 1 is 3 weeks and provides students with various info on the topics mentioned above. STEP 2 is 7 weeks and students have the opportunity to do an internship. I would be glad to provide more info on the STEP programs, however, I think that Miso is referring to the Independent living program that Junior Blind also offers. The Davidson Program for Independence, DPI is a residential program for blind individuals who wish to learn skills such as orientation and mobility, technology, cooking, Braille, and of course independent living skills. I did not attend DPI so I don't know specifically what they do and how they run. I did have friends who attended both the STEP programs as well as DPI. They told me they learned a lot and they found it very helpful. I'm sure there are pros and cons to attending any residential program. Please don't hesitate to contact me off list if you have further questions. All the best, Hannah -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon Keith Biggs Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 9:48 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hello, It depends where you are at in your living skills. I had been living on my own for a few months before I went to the Step 2 program and I found it only good for the few hours of work experience they provided. They aren't very inventive when it comes to giving each person a unique work environment, but you do get to do an internship. I did not like however, the step 1 folks were mentored by the step 2 people for both sessions and the step 2 people had to sit through classes the step 1 participant's were taking. Step 1 is a ton of classes on how to give an interview, talk about yourself and act professionally dressing wise and so on. When I went it was very lecture based and very little real-time experiences, but I could tell some people really needed the learning. I could already cook, clean, do laundry and had had a summer job the year before in a much freer environment, so I found STEP oppressive, but I did learn how to deal with authority in a mature way and even though I won't repeat it, I am glad I went. The campus is also very oddly situated, so it takes for ever to go anywhere and they expect people to work around the schedule they set up, so for example, I had a 2 hour commute on Para transit to and from work and I had work to do at home. They were not very accommodating for those of us who wanted to become work junkies, working till 10, grabbing food, then waking up at 6 and leaving. They wanted you to actually be around with other people and do tasks like instruct the other students on how to use the computer for example. Personally, the YES2 program in Washington state is more my cup of tee than the STEP2 program, but I know plenty of other people who really loved it and or who would really like it. You can email me off list if you have any more questions. brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com Thanks, Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: Miso Kwak Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:55 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hello, I would like to know if any of you have participated in the STEP program offered by Junior Blind in California. If you have the experience, could you comment on how it was? Would you recommend it? I am trying to select a summer program that will help me improve my independent living skills (mobility, home management, etc) and realize that there are a few different options available, so I just want to hear from someone if anyone on the list has experience with Junior Blind's STEP program. Thank you. Miso Kwak _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai l.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sparklylicious%40gmail.c om _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kwakmiso%40aol.com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Wed Mar 13 10:27:49 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 06:27:49 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: References: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com> <-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid> Message-ID: <001b01ce1fd5$69d56190$3d8024b0$@gmail.com> Agreed. I ma an avid cane user, but if not using it won't be a detriment in a given situation, then you shouldn't. Sometimes, you just want both hands free. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:32 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID Mike, I have to disagree here. As one of those partials who elects when to use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you may not be considering. Electing when and when not to use a cane is not always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; some of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas without a cane some times should give up their right to identify themself as a visually impaired person. E.G, I would never do any type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria right across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm coming right back I don't always choose to actively use it. My choice to not use a cane in this instance does not mean I should forfit my right to identify myself as a visually impaired person because I am; the use of the cane does not change my inability to read print or to see great distances and it does not change the fact that I am legally blind and am identified that way. It also doesn't change the level of security I have with my blindness; if a person refuses to use a cane or fights against it because they're afraid of the social implications then that is insecurity, but if they're visually having a good day and want to run a quick errand that's in a very familiar area with minimal travel or risk of injury and they're confident in their ability to use audio cues and the vision they have then that is their choice and doesn't make them insecure with themself or their blindness. As long as they have the confidence and security to not be afraid of using it and to identify and use it when they need to, to be confident and secure whether they're using a cane or not, and don't pose risk to themselves in the cases where they don't use it there is nothing that would suggest insecurity. We don't know the exact visual situation of anyone on this list unless they've written about it, so I don't think it is fair to judge about someone's level of security with their blindness based on their cane habits when we don't know what their vision is like. Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social situations. Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria with my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention using something besides my name. When they see the cane (or sometimes read National Federation of the Blind on it if they're close enough to see it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before getting my name. Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then the person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're informed and they see that it's not a big deal. And, I have to make one small correction. The main market for the lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may not use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since they are the ones who originated the telescopic design. Although I do know people who are totally blind or only have light perception that use the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty quickly because they use them so much. For someone who may not use the cane every single day but still would benefit from having an identifier to let other people know they're visually impaired these canes are great. Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need one. Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to have an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my eyes because even if that person may not need to use it by having one for people to see they must be okay with their blindness and comfortable in explaining their visual impairment to others should the question arise. On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: > Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to > alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive > thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that > identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not of > inferiority. > > Just my thoughts > > Chris Nusbaum > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: > >> Hamid: >> >> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your cake >> and eat it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages of >> being recognized as blind whereas on the other, you don't want to >> really appear blind or be judged because you do not believe you need >> a cane. My friend, you can't have it both ways. Why do you even care >> whether the public considers you blind or not or whether they >> consider it weird that you might appear to not need a cane? Moreover, >> aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons who use >> canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows them as >> blind whereas you consider that you do not? >> >> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >> >> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most >> of us would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a >> label to being prohibited from going places or doing things because >> of the alleged inability of the blind. >> >> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >> >> Mike Freeman >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid >> Hamraz >> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >> >> Dear Folks, >> >> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to represent >> my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To be more >> precise, the target people benefiting are those whose residual sight >> lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who want to let the >> other people around them know about their blindness. Carrying a cane >> is indeed an option. However, I personally think that holding a long >> cane in my hand without using it and walking perfectly is weird in >> public. In Germany, they have a special symbol representing this >> which can be attached anywhere in any size at one's own discretion >> (and everybody is indeed aware of that). However, there is no such a >> thing here in US, and setting that up requires time and educating the >> society about that. >> >> >> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need >> something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a >> functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. >> >> Hamid >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40 >> gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% > 40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From leyeshprintse at ymail.com Thu Mar 14 12:44:29 2013 From: leyeshprintse at ymail.com (Leye-Shprintse) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 05:44:29 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [nabs-l] security alerts on the braillenote Message-ID: <1363265069.85933.BPMail_high_noncarrier@web122602.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> BS"D Ashley, * "true you can connect some displays to the Iphone, but I heard its not an exact science and those small displays sure cannot fit much braille on them." You can connect different Braille displays to Apple's products and not only them with fewer cells. What I understand, the Braille tables for English works great on Apple's products but they have some problem with other languages. å, ä and ö in Swedish are not correct as an example but I do not let that stop me. I only wanted to point this out. In Sweden, products as BrailleNote and BrailleSense are not big at all. I have never used one and no of my blind friends either what I know, I had not even heard about them before I joined this list. It is interesting anyway. Kind regards, Leye-Shprintse From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Thu Mar 14 14:05:01 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 14:05:01 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: <8CFEE93347C9D6A-1AB8-1A53E@webmail-d136.sysops.aol.com> References: <002301ce2074$cd744f50$685cedf0$@gmail.com>, <8CFEE93347C9D6A-1AB8-1A53E@webmail-d136.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: Hi Miso. If you're proficient in Braille, the NFB trainig center wouldn't be your best bet. Although they do independence training, you have to attend Braille classes, every day. If you need independence training, you'd be better off getting the skills from a VR rep. That's what I'm doing, since my VR said that LCB would be a waste of my time. Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Miso Kwak [kwakmiso at aol.com] Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:20 AM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Thank you everyone for helpful answers. To clarify, I was referring to the STEP not Davidson. I lived in California barely 4 years, so I experienced JBA only twice. I personally didn't like the atmosphere and philosophy very much although not unbearable... I think at this point, after reading feedbacks, I would prefer one of the NFB centers over JBA. I think then the task to do is to get my request to attend CCB justified. I will contact staff at the CCB and see what I can do. Thank you again. Miso Kwak -----Original Message----- From: Hannah Chadwick To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Sent: Wed, Mar 13, 2013 10:29 pm Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hi all, So I just wanted to clarify since I've been to the STEP programs at Junior Blind of America. There is STEP 1 and STEP 2, and they are both summer programs that focus on helping young adults with job interviewing skills, career research, and during STEP 2, the students are placed on a work site. They are expected to travel to and from work using public transportation. STEP 1 is 3 weeks and provides students with various info on the topics mentioned above. STEP 2 is 7 weeks and students have the opportunity to do an internship. I would be glad to provide more info on the STEP programs, however, I think that Miso is referring to the Independent living program that Junior Blind also offers. The Davidson Program for Independence, DPI is a residential program for blind individuals who wish to learn skills such as orientation and mobility, technology, cooking, Braille, and of course independent living skills. I did not attend DPI so I don't know specifically what they do and how they run. I did have friends who attended both the STEP programs as well as DPI. They told me they learned a lot and they found it very helpful. I'm sure there are pros and cons to attending any residential program. Please don't hesitate to contact me off list if you have further questions. All the best, Hannah -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon Keith Biggs Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 9:48 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hello, It depends where you are at in your living skills. I had been living on my own for a few months before I went to the Step 2 program and I found it only good for the few hours of work experience they provided. They aren't very inventive when it comes to giving each person a unique work environment, but you do get to do an internship. I did not like however, the step 1 folks were mentored by the step 2 people for both sessions and the step 2 people had to sit through classes the step 1 participant's were taking. Step 1 is a ton of classes on how to give an interview, talk about yourself and act professionally dressing wise and so on. When I went it was very lecture based and very little real-time experiences, but I could tell some people really needed the learning. I could already cook, clean, do laundry and had had a summer job the year before in a much freer environment, so I found STEP oppressive, but I did learn how to deal with authority in a mature way and even though I won't repeat it, I am glad I went. The campus is also very oddly situated, so it takes for ever to go anywhere and they expect people to work around the schedule they set up, so for example, I had a 2 hour commute on Para transit to and from work and I had work to do at home. They were not very accommodating for those of us who wanted to become work junkies, working till 10, grabbing food, then waking up at 6 and leaving. They wanted you to actually be around with other people and do tasks like instruct the other students on how to use the computer for example. Personally, the YES2 program in Washington state is more my cup of tee than the STEP2 program, but I know plenty of other people who really loved it and or who would really like it. You can email me off list if you have any more questions. brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com Thanks, Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: Miso Kwak Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:55 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hello, I would like to know if any of you have participated in the STEP program offered by Junior Blind in California. If you have the experience, could you comment on how it was? Would you recommend it? I am trying to select a summer program that will help me improve my independent living skills (mobility, home management, etc) and realize that there are a few different options available, so I just want to hear from someone if anyone on the list has experience with Junior Blind's STEP program. Thank you. Miso Kwak _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai l.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sparklylicious%40gmail.c om _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kwakmiso%40aol.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu From pdonahue2 at satx.rr.com Thu Mar 14 14:33:13 2013 From: pdonahue2 at satx.rr.com (Peter Donahue) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 09:33:13 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America References: <51412635.674dec0a.4244.ffff9c83SMTPIN_ADDED_MISSING@mx.google.com> <002c01ce1f8a$dab1b3f0$90151bd0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <009801ce20c0$dcbfa580$df1fbf48@yourfsyly0jtwn> Good morning everyone, If I had it to do over again or felt the need for orientation and adjustment training nothing but an NFB center would do. I've had less than favorable experiences with residential schools for the blind and adult orientation centers. They were less than satisfactory. If you can attend an NFB center by all means do it! Peter Donahue ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 8:34 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Give the Colorado center a call and tell them. Make sure you can justify your decision though. Colorado will offer you experiences far from home that you can't get in California. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Miso Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 9:22 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Thank you Chris. Currently i applied to Colorado Center for the Blind. My application got accepted but California has not approved my funding because there are 'similar programs in California'. Junior Blind of America is a private school for the blind in Los Angeles which the CA department of rehab is recommending me to go instead of CCB. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pdonahue2%40satx.rr.com From k7uij at panix.com Thu Mar 14 14:41:51 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 07:41:51 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: References: <002301ce2074$cd744f50$685cedf0$@gmail.com>, <8CFEE93347C9D6A-1AB8-1A53E@webmail-d136.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <004801ce20c2$11523eb0$33f6bc10$@panix.com> Joshua: Did you check out LCB for yourself? Might not your VR counselor be prejudiced against NFB centers? Just a thought. Mike -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 7:05 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hi Miso. If you're proficient in Braille, the NFB trainig center wouldn't be your best bet. Although they do independence training, you have to attend Braille classes, every day. If you need independence training, you'd be better off getting the skills from a VR rep. That's what I'm doing, since my VR said that LCB would be a waste of my time. Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Miso Kwak [kwakmiso at aol.com] Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:20 AM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Thank you everyone for helpful answers. To clarify, I was referring to the STEP not Davidson. I lived in California barely 4 years, so I experienced JBA only twice. I personally didn't like the atmosphere and philosophy very much although not unbearable... I think at this point, after reading feedbacks, I would prefer one of the NFB centers over JBA. I think then the task to do is to get my request to attend CCB justified. I will contact staff at the CCB and see what I can do. Thank you again. Miso Kwak -----Original Message----- From: Hannah Chadwick To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Sent: Wed, Mar 13, 2013 10:29 pm Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hi all, So I just wanted to clarify since I've been to the STEP programs at Junior Blind of America. There is STEP 1 and STEP 2, and they are both summer programs that focus on helping young adults with job interviewing skills, career research, and during STEP 2, the students are placed on a work site. They are expected to travel to and from work using public transportation. STEP 1 is 3 weeks and provides students with various info on the topics mentioned above. STEP 2 is 7 weeks and students have the opportunity to do an internship. I would be glad to provide more info on the STEP programs, however, I think that Miso is referring to the Independent living program that Junior Blind also offers. The Davidson Program for Independence, DPI is a residential program for blind individuals who wish to learn skills such as orientation and mobility, technology, cooking, Braille, and of course independent living skills. I did not attend DPI so I don't know specifically what they do and how they run. I did have friends who attended both the STEP programs as well as DPI. They told me they learned a lot and they found it very helpful. I'm sure there are pros and cons to attending any residential program. Please don't hesitate to contact me off list if you have further questions. All the best, Hannah -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon Keith Biggs Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 9:48 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hello, It depends where you are at in your living skills. I had been living on my own for a few months before I went to the Step 2 program and I found it only good for the few hours of work experience they provided. They aren't very inventive when it comes to giving each person a unique work environment, but you do get to do an internship. I did not like however, the step 1 folks were mentored by the step 2 people for both sessions and the step 2 people had to sit through classes the step 1 participant's were taking. Step 1 is a ton of classes on how to give an interview, talk about yourself and act professionally dressing wise and so on. When I went it was very lecture based and very little real-time experiences, but I could tell some people really needed the learning. I could already cook, clean, do laundry and had had a summer job the year before in a much freer environment, so I found STEP oppressive, but I did learn how to deal with authority in a mature way and even though I won't repeat it, I am glad I went. The campus is also very oddly situated, so it takes for ever to go anywhere and they expect people to work around the schedule they set up, so for example, I had a 2 hour commute on Para transit to and from work and I had work to do at home. They were not very accommodating for those of us who wanted to become work junkies, working till 10, grabbing food, then waking up at 6 and leaving. They wanted you to actually be around with other people and do tasks like instruct the other students on how to use the computer for example. Personally, the YES2 program in Washington state is more my cup of tee than the STEP2 program, but I know plenty of other people who really loved it and or who would really like it. You can email me off list if you have any more questions. brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com Thanks, Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: Miso Kwak Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:55 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hello, I would like to know if any of you have participated in the STEP program offered by Junior Blind in California. If you have the experience, could you comment on how it was? Would you recommend it? I am trying to select a summer program that will help me improve my independent living skills (mobility, home management, etc) and realize that there are a few different options available, so I just want to hear from someone if anyone on the list has experience with Junior Blind's STEP program. Thank you. Miso Kwak _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai l.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sparklylicious%40gmail.c om _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kwakmiso%40aol.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From k7uij at panix.com Thu Mar 14 15:05:22 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 08:05:22 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: References: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com> <-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid> Message-ID: <004b01ce20c5$5a44fd80$0ecef880$@panix.com> Kaiti: We shall have to agree to disagree. I see no reason to identify as "visually impaired" unless one wishes special help or perks. Why not just be blind and have done with the matter? Much simpler. In fact, I know a guy who was nearly totally blind for many years due to an explosion. He got a good deal of sight back (he's lost it again now) and used his sight to look around, traveling with a cane as he always did; thus, he got the benefit of sight plus didn't have to worry about when he should or should not use a cane, whether to identify etc. etc. Peace! Mike Freeman -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:32 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID Mike, I have to disagree here. As one of those partials who elects when to use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you may not be considering. Electing when and when not to use a cane is not always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; some of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas without a cane some times should give up their right to identify themself as a visually impaired person. E.G, I would never do any type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria right across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm coming right back I don't always choose to actively use it. My choice to not use a cane in this instance does not mean I should forfit my right to identify myself as a visually impaired person because I am; the use of the cane does not change my inability to read print or to see great distances and it does not change the fact that I am legally blind and am identified that way. It also doesn't change the level of security I have with my blindness; if a person refuses to use a cane or fights against it because they're afraid of the social implications then that is insecurity, but if they're visually having a good day and want to run a quick errand that's in a very familiar area with minimal travel or risk of injury and they're confident in their ability to use audio cues and the vision they have then that is their choice and doesn't make them insecure with themself or their blindness. As long as they have the confidence and security to not be afraid of using it and to identify and use it when they need to, to be confident and secure whether they're using a cane or not, and don't pose risk to themselves in the cases where they don't use it there is nothing that would suggest insecurity. We don't know the exact visual situation of anyone on this list unless they've written about it, so I don't think it is fair to judge about someone's level of security with their blindness based on their cane habits when we don't know what their vision is like. Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social situations. Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria with my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention using something besides my name. When they see the cane (or sometimes read National Federation of the Blind on it if they're close enough to see it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before getting my name. Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then the person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're informed and they see that it's not a big deal. And, I have to make one small correction. The main market for the lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may not use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since they are the ones who originated the telescopic design. Although I do know people who are totally blind or only have light perception that use the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty quickly because they use them so much. For someone who may not use the cane every single day but still would benefit from having an identifier to let other people know they're visually impaired these canes are great. Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need one. Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to have an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my eyes because even if that person may not need to use it by having one for people to see they must be okay with their blindness and comfortable in explaining their visual impairment to others should the question arise. On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: > Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to > alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive > thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that > identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not of > inferiority. > > Just my thoughts > > Chris Nusbaum > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: > >> Hamid: >> >> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your cake and >> eat >> it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages of being recognized >> as >> blind whereas on the other, you don't want to really appear blind or be >> judged because you do not believe you need a cane. My friend, you can't >> have >> it both ways. Why do you even care whether the public considers you blind >> or >> not or whether they consider it weird that you might appear to not need a >> cane? Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons >> who >> use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows them as >> blind >> whereas you consider that you do not? >> >> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >> >> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most of us >> would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a label to >> being >> prohibited from going places or doing things because of the alleged >> inability of the blind. >> >> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >> >> Mike Freeman >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid Hamraz >> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >> >> Dear Folks, >> >> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to represent my >> blindness without making a functional use of cane. To be more precise, >> the >> target people benefiting are those whose residual sight lets them to walk >> without the use of a cane and who want to let the other people around >> them >> know about their blindness. Carrying a cane is indeed an option. However, >> I >> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using it and >> walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have a special >> symbol >> representing this which can be attached anywhere in any size at one's own >> discretion (and everybody is indeed aware of that). However, there is no >> such a thing here in US, and setting that up requires time and educating >> the >> society about that. >> >> >> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need something >> much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a functional tool. I >> appreciate any suggestion. >> >> Hamid >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai l.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 16:42:33 2013 From: blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com (Aleeha Dudley) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 12:42:33 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: <004b01ce20c5$5a44fd80$0ecef880$@panix.com> References: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com> <-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid> <004b01ce20c5$5a44fd80$0ecef880$@panix.com> Message-ID: Hi, I'm going to stick my "oar in" as they say. Kaiti and Mike, I think there may be a bit of misunderstanding. I think what is sought by the original poster on this thread is an identification symbol, something to say "I am blind" that is not as bulky as a cane. I definitely disagree with this. What I do not disagree with is using one's functional vision when you have it and, if that be your desire, to not use a cane if you don't need it. What I do disagree with is the concept of wanting the "you poor blind person" perks of blindness without carrying a cane, as the original poster seems to want. There is a fine line that I think is lost in the grey here. ALeeha On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > Kaiti: > > We shall have to agree to disagree. I see no reason to identify as > "visually > impaired" unless one wishes special help or perks. Why not just be blind > and > have done with the matter? Much simpler. > > In fact, I know a guy who was nearly totally blind for many years due to an > explosion. He got a good deal of sight back (he's lost it again now) and > used his sight to look around, traveling with a cane as he always did; > thus, > he got the benefit of sight plus didn't have to worry about when he should > or should not use a cane, whether to identify etc. etc. > > Peace! > > Mike Freeman > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:32 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID > > Mike, > > I have to disagree here. As one of those partials who elects when to > use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you may > not be considering. Electing when and when not to use a cane is not > always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; some > of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. > Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas > without a cane some times should give up their right to identify > themself as a visually impaired person. E.G, I would never do any > type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a > street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see > like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under > normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria right > across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm coming > right back I don't always choose to actively use it. My choice to not > use a cane in this instance does not mean I should forfit my right to > identify myself as a visually impaired person because I am; the use of > the cane does not change my inability to read print or to see great > distances and it does not change the fact that I am legally blind and > am identified that way. It also doesn't change the level of security > I have with my blindness; if a person refuses to use a cane or fights > against it because they're afraid of the social implications then that > is insecurity, but if they're visually having a good day and want to > run a quick errand that's in a very familiar area with minimal travel > or risk of injury and they're confident in their ability to use audio > cues and the vision they have then that is their choice and doesn't > make them insecure with themself or their blindness. As long as they > have the confidence and security to not be afraid of using it and to > identify and use it when they need to, to be confident and secure > whether they're using a cane or not, and don't pose risk to > themselves in the cases where they don't use it there is nothing that > would suggest insecurity. We don't know the exact visual situation of > anyone on this list unless they've written about it, so I don't think > it is fair to judge about someone's level of security with their > blindness based on their cane habits when we don't know what their > vision is like. > > Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social situations. > Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've > had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria with > my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention using > something besides my name. When they see the cane (or sometimes read > National Federation of the Blind on it if they're close enough to see > it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring > to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before > getting my name. Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an > opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then the > person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're > informed and they see that it's not a big deal. > > And, I have to make one small correction. The main market for the > lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may not > use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since they > are the ones who originated the telescopic design. Although I do know > people who are totally blind or only have light perception that use > the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty quickly > because they use them so much. For someone who may not use the cane > every single day but still would benefit from having an identifier to > let other people know they're visually impaired these canes are great. > Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild > hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need > one. Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can > see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not > tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. > In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to have > an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my eyes > because even if that person may not need to use it by having one for > people to see they must be okay with their blindness and comfortable > in explaining their visual impairment to others should the question > arise. > > On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >> Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to >> alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive >> thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that >> identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not of >> inferiority. >> >> Just my thoughts >> >> Chris Nusbaum >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: >> >>> Hamid: >>> >>> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your cake and >>> eat >>> it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages of being >>> recognized >>> as >>> blind whereas on the other, you don't want to really appear blind or be >>> judged because you do not believe you need a cane. My friend, you can't >>> have >>> it both ways. Why do you even care whether the public considers you >>> blind >>> or >>> not or whether they consider it weird that you might appear to not need >>> a >>> cane? Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons >>> who >>> use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows them as >>> blind >>> whereas you consider that you do not? >>> >>> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >>> >>> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most of >>> us >>> would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a label to >>> being >>> prohibited from going places or doing things because of the alleged >>> inability of the blind. >>> >>> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >>> >>> Mike Freeman >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid >>> Hamraz >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>> >>> Dear Folks, >>> >>> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to represent my >>> blindness without making a functional use of cane. To be more precise, >>> the >>> target people benefiting are those whose residual sight lets them to >>> walk >>> without the use of a cane and who want to let the other people around >>> them >>> know about their blindness. Carrying a cane is indeed an option. >>> However, >>> I >>> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using it >>> and >>> walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have a special >>> symbol >>> representing this which can be attached anywhere in any size at one's >>> own >>> discretion (and everybody is indeed aware of that). However, there is no >>> such a thing here in US, and setting that up requires time and educating >>> the >>> society about that. >>> >>> >>> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need >>> something >>> much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a functional tool. I >>> appreciate any suggestion. >>> >>> Hamid >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c > om >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai > l.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com > From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Wed Mar 13 17:17:13 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 13:17:13 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: References: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com> <-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid> <004b01ce20c5$5a44fd80$0ecef880$@panix.com> Message-ID: <003901ce200e$9b1504c0$d13f0e40$@gmail.com> Our fine line is that we are trying to predict, and or control people's reactions. If you do not have a cane with you while walking in our country, people probably will not know you are blind. The original poster has every right to not use a cane and rely on functional vision. However, the reactions of people can't be controlled. If they don't know he is blind, they will react to him as if he is sighted. It is his choice. In America, I don't think we have a way to not carry a cane, but have everyone know that you are blind. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha Dudley Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:43 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID Hi, I'm going to stick my "oar in" as they say. Kaiti and Mike, I think there may be a bit of misunderstanding. I think what is sought by the original poster on this thread is an identification symbol, something to say "I am blind" that is not as bulky as a cane. I definitely disagree with this. What I do not disagree with is using one's functional vision when you have it and, if that be your desire, to not use a cane if you don't need it. What I do disagree with is the concept of wanting the "you poor blind person" perks of blindness without carrying a cane, as the original poster seems to want. There is a fine line that I think is lost in the grey here. ALeeha On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > Kaiti: > > We shall have to agree to disagree. I see no reason to identify as > "visually impaired" unless one wishes special help or perks. Why not > just be blind and have done with the matter? Much simpler. > > In fact, I know a guy who was nearly totally blind for many years due > to an explosion. He got a good deal of sight back (he's lost it again > now) and used his sight to look around, traveling with a cane as he > always did; thus, he got the benefit of sight plus didn't have to > worry about when he should or should not use a cane, whether to > identify etc. etc. > > Peace! > > Mike Freeman > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti > Shelton > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:32 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID > > Mike, > > I have to disagree here. As one of those partials who elects when to > use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you may > not be considering. Electing when and when not to use a cane is not > always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; some > of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. > Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas > without a cane some times should give up their right to identify > themself as a visually impaired person. E.G, I would never do any > type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a > street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see > like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under > normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria right > across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm coming > right back I don't always choose to actively use it. My choice to not > use a cane in this instance does not mean I should forfit my right to > identify myself as a visually impaired person because I am; the use of > the cane does not change my inability to read print or to see great > distances and it does not change the fact that I am legally blind and > am identified that way. It also doesn't change the level of security > I have with my blindness; if a person refuses to use a cane or fights > against it because they're afraid of the social implications then that > is insecurity, but if they're visually having a good day and want to > run a quick errand that's in a very familiar area with minimal travel > or risk of injury and they're confident in their ability to use audio > cues and the vision they have then that is their choice and doesn't > make them insecure with themself or their blindness. As long as they > have the confidence and security to not be afraid of using it and to > identify and use it when they need to, to be confident and secure > whether they're using a cane or not, and don't pose risk to > themselves in the cases where they don't use it there is nothing that > would suggest insecurity. We don't know the exact visual situation of > anyone on this list unless they've written about it, so I don't think > it is fair to judge about someone's level of security with their > blindness based on their cane habits when we don't know what their > vision is like. > > Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social situations. > Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've > had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria with > my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention using > something besides my name. When they see the cane (or sometimes read > National Federation of the Blind on it if they're close enough to see > it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring > to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before > getting my name. Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an > opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then the > person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're > informed and they see that it's not a big deal. > > And, I have to make one small correction. The main market for the > lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may not > use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since they > are the ones who originated the telescopic design. Although I do know > people who are totally blind or only have light perception that use > the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty quickly > because they use them so much. For someone who may not use the cane > every single day but still would benefit from having an identifier to > let other people know they're visually impaired these canes are great. > Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild > hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need > one. Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can > see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not > tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. > In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to have > an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my eyes > because even if that person may not need to use it by having one for > people to see they must be okay with their blindness and comfortable > in explaining their visual impairment to others should the question > arise. > > On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >> Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to >> alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive >> thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that >> identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not >> of inferiority. >> >> Just my thoughts >> >> Chris Nusbaum >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: >> >>> Hamid: >>> >>> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your cake >>> and eat it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages of >>> being recognized as blind whereas on the other, you don't want to >>> really appear blind or be judged because you do not believe you need >>> a cane. My friend, you can't have it both ways. Why do you even care >>> whether the public considers you blind or not or whether they >>> consider it weird that you might appear to not need a cane? >>> Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons >>> who use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows >>> them as blind whereas you consider that you do not? >>> >>> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >>> >>> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most >>> of us would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a >>> label to being prohibited from going places or doing things because >>> of the alleged inability of the blind. >>> >>> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >>> >>> Mike Freeman >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid >>> Hamraz >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>> >>> Dear Folks, >>> >>> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to >>> represent my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To >>> be more precise, the target people benefiting are those whose >>> residual sight lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who >>> want to let the other people around them know about their blindness. >>> Carrying a cane is indeed an option. >>> However, >>> I >>> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using >>> it and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have a >>> special symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere in >>> any size at one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware of >>> that). However, there is no such a thing here in US, and setting >>> that up requires time and educating the society about that. >>> >>> >>> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need >>> something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a >>> functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. >>> >>> Hamid >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.co >>> m >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g > mail.c > om >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% > 40gmai > l.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%4 > 0gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From herekittykat2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 17:16:05 2013 From: herekittykat2 at gmail.com (Jewel) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 13:16:05 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games In-Reply-To: References: <014801ce1ec2$11b5aa10$3520fe30$@panix.com> <86A07FF37ADF4857AB0F54CD12BD5A82@OwnerPC> Message-ID: Hi, On the topic of accessible games, I can add a list of some of the accessible games available on ios devices (such as my iPhone 4S). Below I will list them and give a brief description. *Blindfold Ping-Pong: Using the motion sensors of the iPhone, you swing your phone as if hitting an invisible ball that you can only hear as it bounces off the game table *Clever Clues: Using crossword-like clues, this game asks you to find the word to match the clues. The words range from three letters to nine letters in length. *Moxy: Using the letter tiles given, create words on a five-by-three grid. You get more points if you make a moxy (it's set to animal words) *Pig Dice: Shaking the phone, you roll the dice to gain more points, but if you get a 1, you lose all the points for that round. The winner is the first to 100. *Robo-E: Your robot avatar has to move waste balls around a walled-in area to put them in energy rings. If the ball hits a wall, it can't go any further in that area, and if you manage to stick the ball in a corner, the ball is truly stuck and you have no choice but to redo your move or restart the level. It starts with a five-by-five grid and one ball, increasing the number of balls and the size of the grid as you progress. *Shredder: A tutor for playing chess, this game tells you advices you on good moves, among other things. Good for increasing your ability in chess. *Sudoku for All: Just what it says, a sudoku puzzle that is accessible to blind players. *Tap the Mole: Remember the arcade game where you had to hit the mole with a hammer? This is similar. You have a grid and have to find the hole that the mole comes out of and "hit" him by double-tapping on him. *ZanyTouch: Sort of like BopIt, you have to do the gesture that the game tells you to make. Gestures include swiping up, down, left and right, pinching, shaking the phone, and tapping with one finger or two. *Papa Sangre: Follow the sound of the music notes to collect them while avoiding enemies and other traps. This is, in my opinion, a very challenging game to play. *Sixth Sense: I’ve not really played this much yet, but it’s a zombie-shooting game using audio cues. Escape from the House: A short game based on the movie, The House at the End of the Street. Using gestures like shaking the phone and tapping to walk or run, you have to find your way out of the house. Things that Go Bump in the Night: A text-based game that uses tabs to make the game easier to play. No need to type commands; you can tap on objects to choose an action or an exit to go there. DeSteeno Games: A group of a few oldies but goodies. Atlantic City Blackjack has you playing against a bot; Casino has four casino-style games that you play by typing, and there are some sound effects if you want them. Dodge City Desperados has you play as the sheriff seeking out outlaws (interactive fiction). Destination Mars is a space game in which you try to land on Mars. Run for President is sort of like a board game in which you go around and spend money and collect electoral votes. Finally, Sounds Like gives you clues for parts of a word, and you have to use these clues to guess the word. Frotz: Frotz is not just one or even four games. This is a collection of many different interactive fiction games. If you are new to IF, I suggest trying the game “The Dream Hold,” which is an introductory interactive fiction written by Andrew plotkin AKA Zarf. It’s a great introduction, as is the game “Bronze.” There are more, and I get suggestions for new games all the time from the Apple VIS website and podcast. They can be found at www.applevis.com Hope that helps, Jewel On 3/13/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Ashley, > > You can do both. You have the options of joining games other people > have started, starting a game and waiting for other players to join > your game, or starting your own game and adding a bot which basically > plays you against the computer. > > Apples to Apples is really fun. If you're into word games I think > you'd like it. Basically you have these cards with words on them and > each player in the game takes turns being judge. Each player has to > pick the card which they feel best matches the card with the category > word, then the judge picks the card that they like the best. The > objective is to get picked the most times to win the game. It's a > little more complex than that, but that's a simple way of looking at > it. > > On 3/12/13, Ashley Bramlett wrote: >> Kaiti, >> Thanks. Do you play the games with other players online or alone? >> I haven't heard of apples to apples. Sounds neat. >> >> Ashley >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Kaiti Shelton >> Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 11:44 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games >> >> Hi Ashley, >> >> have you heard of RS games? It's a free client you download to your >> PC. They have accessible games including Monopoly, Uno, 1,000 Miles, >> Apples to Apples, Farkle (a dice game), Rummy, and Battleship. Not >> quite word games like what you're thinking of, (well, maybe Apples to >> Apples to an extent), but they're still pretty good. >> >> On 3/11/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>> Ashley: >>> >>> God is saving you from blowing your dollars on frivolities! (grin) >>> >>> Mike >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley >>> Bramlett >>> Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 5:12 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games >>> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> There is a heavy trend toward developing video games and portable games >>> for >>> on screen use. >>> From fun games like bowling and basketball to academic games for math >>> and >>> science, they are out there. >>> Some are portable; others are for home use. >>> For at home we have the WII, Playstation and xbox. For portable options, >>> there are numerous ones. All tablets and smart phones have games. Then >>> you >>> have the Kindle, Nook, and more. >>> >>> So what technology, if any, do you use as an alternative to these on >>> screen >>> games? >>> Games range from adaptations of real card or board games to new ones >>> developed for these portable book readers and tablets. >>> Scrabble, Hangman, monopoly, and word searches are some games. >>> >>> I am beginning to feel left out when people talk about all these games. >>> Perhaps, you all feel that way. >>> My mother, who usually hates technology, has fallen in love with a few >>> games >>> on her new Kindle Fire; of course, not accessible to us. My mom is >>> intimidated by computers, yet somehow picked up the concept in the >>> kindle >>> okay. She has games, music aps, and books on it. >>> Perhaps, there are IOS games out there. I suppose there are computer >>> games >>> which I just haven’t looked at. >>> I’d love to have a version of hangman, word puzzles, and card games for >>> the >>> pc. >>> There are two games I had as a kid; I don’t know if both still exist as >>> its >>> old technology. But one does. >>> 1. The Speak n Spell was a handheld thing; like a primative computer. >>> You >>> used it as a dictionary and it had academic games on it such as guessing >>> partial words, a word scramble where you had to unscramble letters to >>> make >>> >>> a >>> word, word matching, and more games. >>> 2. The Franklin Language master still exists; I saw it online. Most have >>> the >>> pc for a dictionary. But for those who want another portable option or a >>> way >>> to expand your vocabulary, this is excellent. It is lightweight with a >>> qwerty style keyboard and speaks everything as well as a way to magnify >>> the >>> text. You can play word games on it such as hangman, word scramble, >>> flash >>> cards, word train, creating anagrams and more. I think there’s ten games >>> on >>> it. >>> >>> So what else is out there? Maybe something from APH? >>> >>> Thanks. >>> Ashley >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat2%40gmail.com > From blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 17:29:07 2013 From: blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com (Aleeha Dudley) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 13:29:07 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: <003901ce200e$9b1504c0$d13f0e40$@gmail.com> References: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com> <-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid> <004b01ce20c5$5a44fd80$0ecef880$@panix.com> <003901ce200e$9b1504c0$d13f0e40$@gmail.com> Message-ID: I guess I just don't see the problem with allowing people to interact with you as though you are sighted. If for some reason, you can't see that interaction, then tell them you are blind. On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: > Our fine line is that we are trying to predict, and or control people's > reactions. If you do not have a cane with you while walking in our > country, > people probably will not know you are blind. The original poster has every > right to not use a cane and rely on functional vision. However, the > reactions of people can't be controlled. If they don't know he is blind, > they will react to him as if he is sighted. It is his choice. In America, > I don't think we have a way to not carry a cane, but have everyone know > that > you are blind. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha Dudley > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:43 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID > > Hi, > I'm going to stick my "oar in" as they say. Kaiti and Mike, I think > there may be a bit of misunderstanding. I think what is sought by the > original poster on this thread is an identification symbol, something to > say > "I am blind" that is not as bulky as a cane. I definitely disagree with > this. What I do not disagree with is using one's functional vision when you > have it and, if that be your desire, to not use a cane if you don't need > it. > What I do disagree with is the concept of wanting the "you poor blind > person" perks of blindness without carrying a cane, as the original poster > seems to want. There is a fine line that I think is lost in the grey here. > ALeeha > > On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >> Kaiti: >> >> We shall have to agree to disagree. I see no reason to identify as >> "visually impaired" unless one wishes special help or perks. Why not >> just be blind and have done with the matter? Much simpler. >> >> In fact, I know a guy who was nearly totally blind for many years due >> to an explosion. He got a good deal of sight back (he's lost it again >> now) and used his sight to look around, traveling with a cane as he >> always did; thus, he got the benefit of sight plus didn't have to >> worry about when he should or should not use a cane, whether to >> identify etc. etc. >> >> Peace! >> >> Mike Freeman >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >> Shelton >> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:32 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >> >> Mike, >> >> I have to disagree here. As one of those partials who elects when to >> use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you may >> not be considering. Electing when and when not to use a cane is not >> always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; some >> of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. >> Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas >> without a cane some times should give up their right to identify >> themself as a visually impaired person. E.G, I would never do any >> type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a >> street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see >> like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under >> normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria right >> across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm coming >> right back I don't always choose to actively use it. My choice to not >> use a cane in this instance does not mean I should forfit my right to >> identify myself as a visually impaired person because I am; the use of >> the cane does not change my inability to read print or to see great >> distances and it does not change the fact that I am legally blind and >> am identified that way. It also doesn't change the level of security >> I have with my blindness; if a person refuses to use a cane or fights >> against it because they're afraid of the social implications then that >> is insecurity, but if they're visually having a good day and want to >> run a quick errand that's in a very familiar area with minimal travel >> or risk of injury and they're confident in their ability to use audio >> cues and the vision they have then that is their choice and doesn't >> make them insecure with themself or their blindness. As long as they >> have the confidence and security to not be afraid of using it and to >> identify and use it when they need to, to be confident and secure >> whether they're using a cane or not, and don't pose risk to >> themselves in the cases where they don't use it there is nothing that >> would suggest insecurity. We don't know the exact visual situation of >> anyone on this list unless they've written about it, so I don't think >> it is fair to judge about someone's level of security with their >> blindness based on their cane habits when we don't know what their >> vision is like. >> >> Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social situations. >> Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've >> had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria with >> my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention using >> something besides my name. When they see the cane (or sometimes read >> National Federation of the Blind on it if they're close enough to see >> it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring >> to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before >> getting my name. Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an >> opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then the >> person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're >> informed and they see that it's not a big deal. >> >> And, I have to make one small correction. The main market for the >> lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may not >> use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since they >> are the ones who originated the telescopic design. Although I do know >> people who are totally blind or only have light perception that use >> the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty quickly >> because they use them so much. For someone who may not use the cane >> every single day but still would benefit from having an identifier to >> let other people know they're visually impaired these canes are great. >> Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild >> hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need >> one. Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can >> see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not >> tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. >> In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to have >> an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my eyes >> because even if that person may not need to use it by having one for >> people to see they must be okay with their blindness and comfortable >> in explaining their visual impairment to others should the question >> arise. >> >> On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >>> Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to >>> alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive >>> thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that >>> identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not >>> of inferiority. >>> >>> Just my thoughts >>> >>> Chris Nusbaum >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: >>> >>>> Hamid: >>>> >>>> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your cake >>>> and eat it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages of >>>> being recognized as blind whereas on the other, you don't want to >>>> really appear blind or be judged because you do not believe you need >>>> a cane. My friend, you can't have it both ways. Why do you even care >>>> whether the public considers you blind or not or whether they >>>> consider it weird that you might appear to not need a cane? >>>> Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons >>>> who use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows >>>> them as blind whereas you consider that you do not? >>>> >>>> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >>>> >>>> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most >>>> of us would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a >>>> label to being prohibited from going places or doing things because >>>> of the alleged inability of the blind. >>>> >>>> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >>>> >>>> Mike Freeman >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid >>>> Hamraz >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>> >>>> Dear Folks, >>>> >>>> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to >>>> represent my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To >>>> be more precise, the target people benefiting are those whose >>>> residual sight lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who >>>> want to let the other people around them know about their blindness. >>>> Carrying a cane is indeed an option. >>>> However, >>>> I >>>> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using >>>> it and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have a >>>> special symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere in >>>> any size at one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware of >>>> that). However, there is no such a thing here in US, and setting >>>> that up requires time and educating the society about that. >>>> >>>> >>>> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need >>>> something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a >>>> functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. >>>> >>>> Hamid >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.co >>>> m >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g >> mail.c >> om >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% >> 40gmai >> l.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%4 >> 0gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com > From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Wed Mar 13 17:31:57 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 13:31:57 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: References: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com> <-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid> <004b01ce20c5$5a44fd80$0ecef880$@panix.com> <003901ce200e$9b1504c0$d13f0e40$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <004801ce2010$a9d558a0$fd8009e0$@gmail.com> Just use whatever works. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha Dudley Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:29 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID I guess I just don't see the problem with allowing people to interact with you as though you are sighted. If for some reason, you can't see that interaction, then tell them you are blind. On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: > Our fine line is that we are trying to predict, and or control > people's reactions. If you do not have a cane with you while walking > in our country, people probably will not know you are blind. The > original poster has every right to not use a cane and rely on > functional vision. However, the reactions of people can't be > controlled. If they don't know he is blind, they will react to him as > if he is sighted. It is his choice. In America, I don't think we > have a way to not carry a cane, but have everyone know that you are > blind. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha > Dudley > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:43 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID > > Hi, > I'm going to stick my "oar in" as they say. Kaiti and Mike, I > think there may be a bit of misunderstanding. I think what is sought > by the original poster on this thread is an identification symbol, > something to say "I am blind" that is not as bulky as a cane. I > definitely disagree with this. What I do not disagree with is using > one's functional vision when you have it and, if that be your desire, > to not use a cane if you don't need it. > What I do disagree with is the concept of wanting the "you poor blind > person" perks of blindness without carrying a cane, as the original > poster seems to want. There is a fine line that I think is lost in the grey here. > ALeeha > > On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >> Kaiti: >> >> We shall have to agree to disagree. I see no reason to identify as >> "visually impaired" unless one wishes special help or perks. Why not >> just be blind and have done with the matter? Much simpler. >> >> In fact, I know a guy who was nearly totally blind for many years due >> to an explosion. He got a good deal of sight back (he's lost it again >> now) and used his sight to look around, traveling with a cane as he >> always did; thus, he got the benefit of sight plus didn't have to >> worry about when he should or should not use a cane, whether to >> identify etc. etc. >> >> Peace! >> >> Mike Freeman >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >> Shelton >> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:32 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >> >> Mike, >> >> I have to disagree here. As one of those partials who elects when to >> use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you >> may not be considering. Electing when and when not to use a cane is >> not always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; >> some of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. >> Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas >> without a cane some times should give up their right to identify >> themself as a visually impaired person. E.G, I would never do any >> type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a >> street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see >> like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under >> normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria >> right across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm >> coming right back I don't always choose to actively use it. My >> choice to not use a cane in this instance does not mean I should >> forfit my right to identify myself as a visually impaired person >> because I am; the use of the cane does not change my inability to >> read print or to see great distances and it does not change the fact >> that I am legally blind and am identified that way. It also doesn't >> change the level of security I have with my blindness; if a person >> refuses to use a cane or fights against it because they're afraid of >> the social implications then that is insecurity, but if they're >> visually having a good day and want to run a quick errand that's in a >> very familiar area with minimal travel or risk of injury and they're >> confident in their ability to use audio cues and the vision they have >> then that is their choice and doesn't make them insecure with >> themself or their blindness. As long as they have the confidence and >> security to not be afraid of using it and to identify and use it when >> they need to, to be confident and secure whether they're using a cane >> or not, and don't pose risk to themselves in the cases where they >> don't use it there is nothing that would suggest insecurity. We >> don't know the exact visual situation of anyone on this list unless >> they've written about it, so I don't think it is fair to judge about >> someone's level of security with their blindness based on their cane >> habits when we don't know what their vision is like. >> >> Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social situations. >> Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've >> had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria >> with my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention >> using something besides my name. When they see the cane (or >> sometimes read National Federation of the Blind on it if they're >> close enough to see >> it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring >> to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before >> getting my name. Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an >> opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then >> the person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're >> informed and they see that it's not a big deal. >> >> And, I have to make one small correction. The main market for the >> lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may >> not use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since >> they are the ones who originated the telescopic design. Although I >> do know people who are totally blind or only have light perception >> that use the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty >> quickly because they use them so much. For someone who may not use >> the cane every single day but still would benefit from having an >> identifier to let other people know they're visually impaired these canes are great. >> Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild >> hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need >> one. Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can >> see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not >> tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. >> In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to >> have an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my >> eyes because even if that person may not need to use it by having one >> for people to see they must be okay with their blindness and >> comfortable in explaining their visual impairment to others should >> the question arise. >> >> On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >>> Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to >>> alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive >>> thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that >>> identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not >>> of inferiority. >>> >>> Just my thoughts >>> >>> Chris Nusbaum >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: >>> >>>> Hamid: >>>> >>>> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your >>>> cake and eat it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages >>>> of being recognized as blind whereas on the other, you don't want >>>> to really appear blind or be judged because you do not believe you >>>> need a cane. My friend, you can't have it both ways. Why do you >>>> even care whether the public considers you blind or not or whether >>>> they consider it weird that you might appear to not need a cane? >>>> Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons >>>> who use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows >>>> them as blind whereas you consider that you do not? >>>> >>>> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >>>> >>>> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most >>>> of us would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a >>>> label to being prohibited from going places or doing things because >>>> of the alleged inability of the blind. >>>> >>>> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >>>> >>>> Mike Freeman >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid >>>> Hamraz >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>> >>>> Dear Folks, >>>> >>>> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to >>>> represent my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To >>>> be more precise, the target people benefiting are those whose >>>> residual sight lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who >>>> want to let the other people around them know about their blindness. >>>> Carrying a cane is indeed an option. >>>> However, >>>> I >>>> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using >>>> it and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have >>>> a special symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere >>>> in any size at one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware >>>> of that). However, there is no such a thing here in US, and setting >>>> that up requires time and educating the society about that. >>>> >>>> >>>> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need >>>> something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a >>>> functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. >>>> >>>> Hamid >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.c >>>> o >>>> m >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40 >> g >> mail.c >> om >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104 >> % >> 40gmai >> l.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993% >> 4 >> 0gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%4 > 0gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From agrima at nbp.org Thu Mar 14 18:17:05 2013 From: agrima at nbp.org (Tony Grima) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 14:17:05 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! Message-ID: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or DAISY: $9 Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full tutorial together and save! The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, and has a better camera. Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used in both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them easily. If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this update to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all the appendices. An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone reference card. Order at: http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html ****** To order any books, send payment to: NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge it: toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. Or order any of our books online at http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. From clb5590 at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 18:56:07 2013 From: clb5590 at gmail.com (Cindy Bennett) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 11:56:07 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs Message-ID: Hi everyone, When I get to the Google Drive web page, I notice that there are a series of buttons such as create, upload, and share. How do you get these buttons to activate? I pressed enter on the create button and JAWS said “loading” and then “load complete,” but I can’t find where the document is to write. I am really interested in exploring accessibility, and I know there are a couple of workarounds. But I am in a situation where one of my colleagues is having files oddly deleted from her Dropbox and is incredibly frustrated and wants to switch to Google docs right now. So I am trying to get some quick answers to investigate preliminary accessibility. I know that with Google Calendar, I have an incredibly difficult time pressing the buttons to create and share calendars. I know there is a Google accessibility web page, but their advice really hasn’t worked for me. I know that there is a series of JAWS commands such as rooting the jaws cursor to the pc cursor and left mouse clicking, and that really doesn’t work for me although maybe I am doing it incorrectly. The Google docs web page seems to have some similarities in a negative way to the web interface of Google Calendar. Does anyone use Google docs on their iPhone? I have a blue tooth keyboard so although no optimal, I could do that. Does anyone use Google docs on their mac? I have a duel system meaning that I use bootcamp. I really haven’t found VoiceOver to be as efficient, and I really don’t want to have to switch sides every time I need to work on a Google doc, but I am curious. Thanks for your input, and sorry for all of the details. I always appreciate the help I receive from this list. -- Cindy Bennett Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington clb5590 at gmail.com From k7uij at panix.com Thu Mar 14 19:07:13 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 12:07:13 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <850CD7D3-28A6-4CE4-A12D-DC504341F7B3@panix.com> Under what circumstances are files being deleted from your friend's dropbox? What app is she using? Mike Freeman sent from my iPhone On Mar 14, 2013, at 11:56, Cindy Bennett wrote: > Hi everyone, > > When I get to the Google Drive web page, I notice that there are a > series of buttons such as create, upload, and share. How do you get > these buttons to activate? I pressed enter on the create button and > JAWS said “loading” and then “load complete,” but I can’t find where > the document is to write. > > I am really interested in exploring accessibility, and I know there > are a couple of workarounds. But I am in a situation where one of my > colleagues is having files oddly deleted from her Dropbox and is > incredibly frustrated and wants to switch to Google docs right now. So > I am trying to get some quick answers to investigate preliminary > accessibility. > > I know that with Google Calendar, I have an incredibly difficult time > pressing the buttons to create and share calendars. I know there is a > Google accessibility web page, but their advice really hasn’t worked > for me. I know that there is a series of JAWS commands such as rooting > the jaws cursor to the pc cursor and left mouse clicking, and that > really doesn’t work for me although maybe I am doing it incorrectly. > > The Google docs web page seems to have some similarities in a negative > way to the web interface of Google Calendar. > > Does anyone use Google docs on their iPhone? I have a blue tooth > keyboard so although no optimal, I could do that. > > Does anyone use Google docs on their mac? > > I have a duel system meaning that I use bootcamp. I really haven’t > found VoiceOver to be as efficient, and I really don’t want to have to > switch sides every time I need to work on a Google doc, but I am > curious. > > Thanks for your input, and sorry for all of the details. I always > appreciate the help I receive from this list. > > > -- > Cindy Bennett > Secretary: National Association of Blind Students > Legislative Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington > > B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington > clb5590 at gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From k7uij at panix.com Thu Mar 14 19:32:25 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 12:32:25 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: References: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com> <-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid> <004b01ce20c5$5a44fd80$0ecef880$@panix.com> Message-ID: <1F33A128-E111-45FC-A957-66DEEB057E09@panix.com> I concur. Mike Freeman sent from my iPhone On Mar 14, 2013, at 9:42, Aleeha Dudley wrote: > Hi, > I'm going to stick my "oar in" as they say. Kaiti and Mike, I > think there may be a bit of misunderstanding. I think what is sought > by the original poster on this thread is an identification symbol, > something to say "I am blind" that is not as bulky as a cane. I > definitely disagree with this. What I do not disagree with is using > one's functional vision when you have it and, if that be your desire, > to not use a cane if you don't need it. What I do disagree with is the > concept of wanting the "you poor blind person" perks of blindness > without carrying a cane, as the original poster seems to want. There > is a fine line that I think is lost in the grey here. > ALeeha > > On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >> Kaiti: >> >> We shall have to agree to disagree. I see no reason to identify as >> "visually >> impaired" unless one wishes special help or perks. Why not just be blind >> and >> have done with the matter? Much simpler. >> >> In fact, I know a guy who was nearly totally blind for many years due to an >> explosion. He got a good deal of sight back (he's lost it again now) and >> used his sight to look around, traveling with a cane as he always did; >> thus, >> he got the benefit of sight plus didn't have to worry about when he should >> or should not use a cane, whether to identify etc. etc. >> >> Peace! >> >> Mike Freeman >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton >> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:32 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >> From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Wed Mar 13 19:34:37 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 15:34:37 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> Message-ID: <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the Blind. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony Grima Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or DAISY: $9 Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full tutorial together and save! The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, and has a better camera. Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used in both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them easily. If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this update to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all the appendices. An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone reference card. Order at: http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html ****** To order any books, send payment to: NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge it: toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. Or order any of our books online at http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 19:42:49 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 15:42:49 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: <004801ce2010$a9d558a0$fd8009e0$@gmail.com> References: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com> <-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid> <004b01ce20c5$5a44fd80$0ecef880$@panix.com> <003901ce200e$9b1504c0$d13f0e40$@gmail.com> <004801ce2010$a9d558a0$fd8009e0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, Mike, that is not how it works at all and I really have a problem with the incinuation that people who identify themselves as visually impaired use that title to get special treatment. I use my functional vision as well as a cane when I feel it appropriate, and receive accomodations such as braille, electronic format for textbooks, and assistive technology that I need. I do what I can independently and ask for sighted assistance when I need something read or would like a little clarification on something visual that I cannot see. These are not "special perks" as you put it. My personal choice to use VI over blind is that it makes things easier for people to understand. I have had some situations when I have used the term blind and people assume I can't see anything at all. This has lead to well-intended but unnecessary superhelping and other consequences. For me it's much simpler to say I'm visually impaired, indicating that I have some functional vision and giving sighted people a slightly clearer idea about me. The NFB recognizes these terms "blind, legally blind, visually impaired," as interchangeable, so it all comes down to personal choice. There is nothing that says one term is preferential over the other and has to be used by everyone. Afterall, visual impairment is a continuum with varying degrees of blindness, so for some visually impaired is a more accurate descriptor. I think that even if the original poster is slightly preoccupied with the image of being blind then getting an identity cane might be the first step in correcting that. The more people see it, the more he'll have to answer questions about himself and his visual impairment and get used to it. Not all, but some visually impaired people have to psychologically ease into being comfortable with identifying themselves in this way and that shouldn't be held against them if that's what they have to do. Heck, I've even heard partially sighted people speak at state conventions about how they grew more comfortable with their blindness by beginning to associate themselves with the NFB, so it sounds like the poster may be on the right track. Again, we don't really know the situation; any one of us could be reading something that the poster didn't intentionally mean because that is a side-effect of electronic messages... things often get misconstrued. He never said he didn't want to be identified as blind in order to gain priveledges; he just wanted something to let people know, but he still has enough functional vision to walk without a cane. I think the wording about walking perfectly may be a little presumptuous, (no one, blind or sighted, walks exactly perfectly because it's anatomically impossible), but like I said this might be a good step in putting blindness/visual impairment/whatever you'd like to call it into perspective. On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: > Just use whatever works. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha Dudley > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:29 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID > > I guess I just don't see the problem with allowing people to interact with > you as though you are sighted. If for some reason, you can't see that > interaction, then tell them you are blind. > > > On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >> Our fine line is that we are trying to predict, and or control >> people's reactions. If you do not have a cane with you while walking >> in our country, people probably will not know you are blind. The >> original poster has every right to not use a cane and rely on >> functional vision. However, the reactions of people can't be >> controlled. If they don't know he is blind, they will react to him as >> if he is sighted. It is his choice. In America, I don't think we >> have a way to not carry a cane, but have everyone know that you are >> blind. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >> Dudley >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:43 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >> >> Hi, >> I'm going to stick my "oar in" as they say. Kaiti and Mike, I >> think there may be a bit of misunderstanding. I think what is sought >> by the original poster on this thread is an identification symbol, >> something to say "I am blind" that is not as bulky as a cane. I >> definitely disagree with this. What I do not disagree with is using >> one's functional vision when you have it and, if that be your desire, >> to not use a cane if you don't need it. >> What I do disagree with is the concept of wanting the "you poor blind >> person" perks of blindness without carrying a cane, as the original >> poster seems to want. There is a fine line that I think is lost in the > grey here. >> ALeeha >> >> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>> Kaiti: >>> >>> We shall have to agree to disagree. I see no reason to identify as >>> "visually impaired" unless one wishes special help or perks. Why not >>> just be blind and have done with the matter? Much simpler. >>> >>> In fact, I know a guy who was nearly totally blind for many years due >>> to an explosion. He got a good deal of sight back (he's lost it again >>> now) and used his sight to look around, traveling with a cane as he >>> always did; thus, he got the benefit of sight plus didn't have to >>> worry about when he should or should not use a cane, whether to >>> identify etc. etc. >>> >>> Peace! >>> >>> Mike Freeman >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>> Shelton >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:32 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>> >>> Mike, >>> >>> I have to disagree here. As one of those partials who elects when to >>> use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you >>> may not be considering. Electing when and when not to use a cane is >>> not always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; >>> some of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. >>> Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas >>> without a cane some times should give up their right to identify >>> themself as a visually impaired person. E.G, I would never do any >>> type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a >>> street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see >>> like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under >>> normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria >>> right across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm >>> coming right back I don't always choose to actively use it. My >>> choice to not use a cane in this instance does not mean I should >>> forfit my right to identify myself as a visually impaired person >>> because I am; the use of the cane does not change my inability to >>> read print or to see great distances and it does not change the fact >>> that I am legally blind and am identified that way. It also doesn't >>> change the level of security I have with my blindness; if a person >>> refuses to use a cane or fights against it because they're afraid of >>> the social implications then that is insecurity, but if they're >>> visually having a good day and want to run a quick errand that's in a >>> very familiar area with minimal travel or risk of injury and they're >>> confident in their ability to use audio cues and the vision they have >>> then that is their choice and doesn't make them insecure with >>> themself or their blindness. As long as they have the confidence and >>> security to not be afraid of using it and to identify and use it when >>> they need to, to be confident and secure whether they're using a cane >>> or not, and don't pose risk to themselves in the cases where they >>> don't use it there is nothing that would suggest insecurity. We >>> don't know the exact visual situation of anyone on this list unless >>> they've written about it, so I don't think it is fair to judge about >>> someone's level of security with their blindness based on their cane >>> habits when we don't know what their vision is like. >>> >>> Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social situations. >>> Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've >>> had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria >>> with my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention >>> using something besides my name. When they see the cane (or >>> sometimes read National Federation of the Blind on it if they're >>> close enough to see >>> it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring >>> to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before >>> getting my name. Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an >>> opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then >>> the person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're >>> informed and they see that it's not a big deal. >>> >>> And, I have to make one small correction. The main market for the >>> lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may >>> not use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since >>> they are the ones who originated the telescopic design. Although I >>> do know people who are totally blind or only have light perception >>> that use the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty >>> quickly because they use them so much. For someone who may not use >>> the cane every single day but still would benefit from having an >>> identifier to let other people know they're visually impaired these >>> canes > are great. >>> Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild >>> hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need >>> one. Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can >>> see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not >>> tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. >>> In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to >>> have an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my >>> eyes because even if that person may not need to use it by having one >>> for people to see they must be okay with their blindness and >>> comfortable in explaining their visual impairment to others should >>> the question arise. >>> >>> On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >>>> Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to >>>> alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive >>>> thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that >>>> identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not >>>> of inferiority. >>>> >>>> Just my thoughts >>>> >>>> Chris Nusbaum >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hamid: >>>>> >>>>> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your >>>>> cake and eat it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages >>>>> of being recognized as blind whereas on the other, you don't want >>>>> to really appear blind or be judged because you do not believe you >>>>> need a cane. My friend, you can't have it both ways. Why do you >>>>> even care whether the public considers you blind or not or whether >>>>> they consider it weird that you might appear to not need a cane? >>>>> Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons >>>>> who use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows >>>>> them as blind whereas you consider that you do not? >>>>> >>>>> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >>>>> >>>>> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most >>>>> of us would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a >>>>> label to being prohibited from going places or doing things because >>>>> of the alleged inability of the blind. >>>>> >>>>> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >>>>> >>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid >>>>> Hamraz >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>> >>>>> Dear Folks, >>>>> >>>>> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to >>>>> represent my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To >>>>> be more precise, the target people benefiting are those whose >>>>> residual sight lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who >>>>> want to let the other people around them know about their blindness. >>>>> Carrying a cane is indeed an option. >>>>> However, >>>>> I >>>>> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using >>>>> it and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have >>>>> a special symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere >>>>> in any size at one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware >>>>> of that). However, there is no such a thing here in US, and setting >>>>> that up requires time and educating the society about that. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need >>>>> something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a >>>>> functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. >>>>> >>>>> Hamid >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.c >>>>> o >>>>> m >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40 >>> g >>> mail.c >>> om >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104 >>> % >>> 40gmai >>> l.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993% >>> 4 >>> 0gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%4 >> 0gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From clb5590 at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 19:48:43 2013 From: clb5590 at gmail.com (Cindy Bennett) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 12:48:43 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs In-Reply-To: <850CD7D3-28A6-4CE4-A12D-DC504341F7B3@panix.com> References: <850CD7D3-28A6-4CE4-A12D-DC504341F7B3@panix.com> Message-ID: I'm not sure what is going on exactly. I personally have never experienced the problem. It is true though that the "conflicted copy" thing is annoying. People cannot work on documents at the same time, and when they do, if you do not make sure to transfer all of the new data from the conflicted copy to the parent copy, you can end up inadvertently losing information. Also, my lab has always used Google docs, so I would prefer to use the same system as my colleagues. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks. Cindy On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > Under what circumstances are files being deleted from your friend's dropbox? > What app is she using? > > Mike Freeman > sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 14, 2013, at 11:56, Cindy Bennett wrote: > >> Hi everyone, >> >> When I get to the Google Drive web page, I notice that there are a >> series of buttons such as create, upload, and share. How do you get >> these buttons to activate? I pressed enter on the create button and >> JAWS said “loading” and then “load complete,” but I can’t find where >> the document is to write. >> >> I am really interested in exploring accessibility, and I know there >> are a couple of workarounds. But I am in a situation where one of my >> colleagues is having files oddly deleted from her Dropbox and is >> incredibly frustrated and wants to switch to Google docs right now. So >> I am trying to get some quick answers to investigate preliminary >> accessibility. >> >> I know that with Google Calendar, I have an incredibly difficult time >> pressing the buttons to create and share calendars. I know there is a >> Google accessibility web page, but their advice really hasn’t worked >> for me. I know that there is a series of JAWS commands such as rooting >> the jaws cursor to the pc cursor and left mouse clicking, and that >> really doesn’t work for me although maybe I am doing it incorrectly. >> >> The Google docs web page seems to have some similarities in a negative >> way to the web interface of Google Calendar. >> >> Does anyone use Google docs on their iPhone? I have a blue tooth >> keyboard so although no optimal, I could do that. >> >> Does anyone use Google docs on their mac? >> >> I have a duel system meaning that I use bootcamp. I really haven’t >> found VoiceOver to be as efficient, and I really don’t want to have to >> switch sides every time I need to work on a Google doc, but I am >> curious. >> >> Thanks for your input, and sorry for all of the details. I always >> appreciate the help I receive from this list. >> >> >> -- >> Cindy Bennett >> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students >> Legislative Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington >> >> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >> clb5590 at gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.com > -- Cindy Bennett Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington clb5590 at gmail.com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 19:49:43 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 15:49:43 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: References: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com> <-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid> <004b01ce20c5$5a44fd80$0ecef880$@panix.com> <003901ce200e$9b1504c0$d13f0e40$@gmail.com> <004801ce2010$a9d558a0$fd8009e0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Absolutely on that front. There is no point of interacting with people under false pretenses as if you were sighted... If one is worried about social situations due to people thinking they're blind, then they might want to think about the possible awkward situation of a friend suddenly finding out about something that important that was there all along and kept from them. On 3/14/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Hi, > > Mike, that is not how it works at all and I really have a problem with > the incinuation that people who identify themselves as visually > impaired use that title to get special treatment. I use my functional > vision as well as a cane when I feel it appropriate, and receive > accomodations such as braille, electronic format for textbooks, and > assistive technology that I need. I do what I can independently and > ask for sighted assistance when I need something read or would like a > little clarification on something visual that I cannot see. These are > not "special perks" as you put it. My personal choice to use VI over > blind is that it makes things easier for people to understand. I have > had some situations when I have used the term blind and people assume > I can't see anything at all. This has lead to well-intended but > unnecessary superhelping and other consequences. For me it's much > simpler to say I'm visually impaired, indicating that I have some > functional vision and giving sighted people a slightly clearer idea > about me. The NFB recognizes these terms "blind, legally blind, > visually impaired," as interchangeable, so it all comes down to > personal choice. There is nothing that says one term is preferential > over the other and has to be used by everyone. Afterall, visual > impairment is a continuum with varying degrees of blindness, so for > some visually impaired is a more accurate descriptor. > > I think that even if the original poster is slightly preoccupied with > the image of being blind then getting an identity cane might be the > first step in correcting that. The more people see it, the more he'll > have to answer questions about himself and his visual impairment and > get used to it. Not all, but some visually impaired people have to > psychologically ease into being comfortable with identifying > themselves in this way and that shouldn't be held against them if > that's what they have to do. Heck, I've even heard partially sighted > people speak at state conventions about how they grew more comfortable > with their blindness by beginning to associate themselves with the > NFB, so it sounds like the poster may be on the right track. Again, > we don't really know the situation; any one of us could be reading > something that the poster didn't intentionally mean because that is a > side-effect of electronic messages... things often get misconstrued. > He never said he didn't want to be identified as blind in order to > gain priveledges; he just wanted something to let people know, but he > still has enough functional vision to walk without a cane. I think > the wording about walking perfectly may be a little presumptuous, (no > one, blind or sighted, walks exactly perfectly because it's > anatomically impossible), but like I said this might be a good step in > putting blindness/visual impairment/whatever you'd like to call it > into perspective. > > > On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >> Just use whatever works. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >> Dudley >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:29 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >> >> I guess I just don't see the problem with allowing people to interact >> with >> you as though you are sighted. If for some reason, you can't see that >> interaction, then tell them you are blind. >> >> >> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>> Our fine line is that we are trying to predict, and or control >>> people's reactions. If you do not have a cane with you while walking >>> in our country, people probably will not know you are blind. The >>> original poster has every right to not use a cane and rely on >>> functional vision. However, the reactions of people can't be >>> controlled. If they don't know he is blind, they will react to him as >>> if he is sighted. It is his choice. In America, I don't think we >>> have a way to not carry a cane, but have everyone know that you are >>> blind. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>> Dudley >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:43 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>> >>> Hi, >>> I'm going to stick my "oar in" as they say. Kaiti and Mike, I >>> think there may be a bit of misunderstanding. I think what is sought >>> by the original poster on this thread is an identification symbol, >>> something to say "I am blind" that is not as bulky as a cane. I >>> definitely disagree with this. What I do not disagree with is using >>> one's functional vision when you have it and, if that be your desire, >>> to not use a cane if you don't need it. >>> What I do disagree with is the concept of wanting the "you poor blind >>> person" perks of blindness without carrying a cane, as the original >>> poster seems to want. There is a fine line that I think is lost in the >> grey here. >>> ALeeha >>> >>> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>> Kaiti: >>>> >>>> We shall have to agree to disagree. I see no reason to identify as >>>> "visually impaired" unless one wishes special help or perks. Why not >>>> just be blind and have done with the matter? Much simpler. >>>> >>>> In fact, I know a guy who was nearly totally blind for many years due >>>> to an explosion. He got a good deal of sight back (he's lost it again >>>> now) and used his sight to look around, traveling with a cane as he >>>> always did; thus, he got the benefit of sight plus didn't have to >>>> worry about when he should or should not use a cane, whether to >>>> identify etc. etc. >>>> >>>> Peace! >>>> >>>> Mike Freeman >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>>> Shelton >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:32 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>> >>>> Mike, >>>> >>>> I have to disagree here. As one of those partials who elects when to >>>> use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you >>>> may not be considering. Electing when and when not to use a cane is >>>> not always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; >>>> some of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. >>>> Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas >>>> without a cane some times should give up their right to identify >>>> themself as a visually impaired person. E.G, I would never do any >>>> type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a >>>> street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see >>>> like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under >>>> normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria >>>> right across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm >>>> coming right back I don't always choose to actively use it. My >>>> choice to not use a cane in this instance does not mean I should >>>> forfit my right to identify myself as a visually impaired person >>>> because I am; the use of the cane does not change my inability to >>>> read print or to see great distances and it does not change the fact >>>> that I am legally blind and am identified that way. It also doesn't >>>> change the level of security I have with my blindness; if a person >>>> refuses to use a cane or fights against it because they're afraid of >>>> the social implications then that is insecurity, but if they're >>>> visually having a good day and want to run a quick errand that's in a >>>> very familiar area with minimal travel or risk of injury and they're >>>> confident in their ability to use audio cues and the vision they have >>>> then that is their choice and doesn't make them insecure with >>>> themself or their blindness. As long as they have the confidence and >>>> security to not be afraid of using it and to identify and use it when >>>> they need to, to be confident and secure whether they're using a cane >>>> or not, and don't pose risk to themselves in the cases where they >>>> don't use it there is nothing that would suggest insecurity. We >>>> don't know the exact visual situation of anyone on this list unless >>>> they've written about it, so I don't think it is fair to judge about >>>> someone's level of security with their blindness based on their cane >>>> habits when we don't know what their vision is like. >>>> >>>> Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social situations. >>>> Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've >>>> had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria >>>> with my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention >>>> using something besides my name. When they see the cane (or >>>> sometimes read National Federation of the Blind on it if they're >>>> close enough to see >>>> it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring >>>> to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before >>>> getting my name. Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an >>>> opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then >>>> the person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're >>>> informed and they see that it's not a big deal. >>>> >>>> And, I have to make one small correction. The main market for the >>>> lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may >>>> not use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since >>>> they are the ones who originated the telescopic design. Although I >>>> do know people who are totally blind or only have light perception >>>> that use the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty >>>> quickly because they use them so much. For someone who may not use >>>> the cane every single day but still would benefit from having an >>>> identifier to let other people know they're visually impaired these >>>> canes >> are great. >>>> Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild >>>> hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need >>>> one. Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can >>>> see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not >>>> tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. >>>> In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to >>>> have an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my >>>> eyes because even if that person may not need to use it by having one >>>> for people to see they must be okay with their blindness and >>>> comfortable in explaining their visual impairment to others should >>>> the question arise. >>>> >>>> On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >>>>> Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to >>>>> alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive >>>>> thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that >>>>> identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not >>>>> of inferiority. >>>>> >>>>> Just my thoughts >>>>> >>>>> Chris Nusbaum >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hamid: >>>>>> >>>>>> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your >>>>>> cake and eat it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages >>>>>> of being recognized as blind whereas on the other, you don't want >>>>>> to really appear blind or be judged because you do not believe you >>>>>> need a cane. My friend, you can't have it both ways. Why do you >>>>>> even care whether the public considers you blind or not or whether >>>>>> they consider it weird that you might appear to not need a cane? >>>>>> Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons >>>>>> who use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows >>>>>> them as blind whereas you consider that you do not? >>>>>> >>>>>> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >>>>>> >>>>>> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most >>>>>> of us would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a >>>>>> label to being prohibited from going places or doing things because >>>>>> of the alleged inability of the blind. >>>>>> >>>>>> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid >>>>>> Hamraz >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>> >>>>>> Dear Folks, >>>>>> >>>>>> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to >>>>>> represent my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To >>>>>> be more precise, the target people benefiting are those whose >>>>>> residual sight lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who >>>>>> want to let the other people around them know about their blindness. >>>>>> Carrying a cane is indeed an option. >>>>>> However, >>>>>> I >>>>>> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using >>>>>> it and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have >>>>>> a special symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere >>>>>> in any size at one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware >>>>>> of that). However, there is no such a thing here in US, and setting >>>>>> that up requires time and educating the society about that. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need >>>>>> something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a >>>>>> functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. >>>>>> >>>>>> Hamid >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.c >>>>>> o >>>>>> m >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40 >>>> g >>>> mail.c >>>> om >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104 >>>> % >>>> 40gmai >>>> l.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Kaiti >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993% >>>> 4 >>>> 0gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>> 0gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%4 >>> 0gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > -- Kaiti From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 19:57:00 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 15:57:00 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games In-Reply-To: References: <014801ce1ec2$11b5aa10$3520fe30$@panix.com> <86A07FF37ADF4857AB0F54CD12BD5A82@OwnerPC> Message-ID: That list is great! Thanks for posting it. I've played Papa Sangre before... it's great when you have multiple people and can tag team. Kind of helps give people time to think if you take turns too, (getting stuck on the same round can be kind of frustrating since each round is progressively more challenging). On 3/14/13, Jewel wrote: > Hi, > On the topic of accessible games, I can add a list of some of the > accessible games available on ios devices (such as my iPhone 4S). > Below I will list them and give a brief description. > > *Blindfold Ping-Pong: Using the motion sensors of the iPhone, you > swing your phone as if hitting an invisible ball that you can only > hear as it bounces off the game table > *Clever Clues: Using crossword-like clues, this game asks you to find > the word to match the clues. The words range from three letters to > nine letters in length. > *Moxy: Using the letter tiles given, create words on a five-by-three > grid. You get more points if you make a moxy (it's set to animal > words) > *Pig Dice: Shaking the phone, you roll the dice to gain more points, > but if you get a 1, you lose all the points for that round. The winner > is the first to 100. > *Robo-E: Your robot avatar has to move waste balls around a walled-in > area to put them in energy rings. If the ball hits a wall, it can't go > any further in that area, and if you manage to stick the ball in a > corner, the ball is truly stuck and you have no choice but to redo > your move or restart the level. It starts with a five-by-five grid and > one ball, increasing the number of balls and the size of the grid as > you progress. > *Shredder: A tutor for playing chess, this game tells you advices you > on good moves, among other things. Good for increasing your ability in > chess. > *Sudoku for All: Just what it says, a sudoku puzzle that is accessible > to blind players. > *Tap the Mole: Remember the arcade game where you had to hit the mole > with a hammer? This is similar. You have a grid and have to find the > hole that the mole comes out of and "hit" him by double-tapping on > him. > *ZanyTouch: Sort of like BopIt, you have to do the gesture that the > game tells you to make. Gestures include swiping up, down, left and > right, pinching, shaking the phone, and tapping with one finger or > two. > *Papa Sangre: Follow the sound of the music notes to collect them > while avoiding enemies and other traps. This is, in my opinion, a very > challenging game to play. > *Sixth Sense: I’ve not really played this much yet, but it’s a > zombie-shooting game using audio cues. > Escape from the House: A short game based on the movie, The House at > the End of the Street. Using gestures like shaking the phone and > tapping to walk or run, you have to find your way out of the house. > Things that Go Bump in the Night: A text-based game that uses tabs to > make the game easier to play. No need to type commands; you can tap on > objects to choose an action or an exit to go there. > DeSteeno Games: A group of a few oldies but goodies. Atlantic City > Blackjack has you playing against a bot; Casino has four casino-style > games that you play by typing, and there are some sound effects if you > want them. Dodge City Desperados has you play as the sheriff seeking > out outlaws (interactive fiction). Destination Mars is a space game in > which you try to land on Mars. Run for President is sort of like a > board game in which you go around and spend money and collect > electoral votes. Finally, Sounds Like gives you clues for parts of a > word, and you have to use these clues to guess the word. > Frotz: Frotz is not just one or even four games. This is a collection > of many different interactive fiction games. If you are new to IF, I > suggest trying the game “The Dream Hold,” which is an introductory > interactive fiction written by Andrew plotkin AKA Zarf. It’s a great > introduction, as is the game “Bronze.” > > There are more, and I get suggestions for new games all the time from > the Apple VIS website and podcast. They can be found at > www.applevis.com > > Hope that helps, > Jewel > > On 3/13/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >> Ashley, >> >> You can do both. You have the options of joining games other people >> have started, starting a game and waiting for other players to join >> your game, or starting your own game and adding a bot which basically >> plays you against the computer. >> >> Apples to Apples is really fun. If you're into word games I think >> you'd like it. Basically you have these cards with words on them and >> each player in the game takes turns being judge. Each player has to >> pick the card which they feel best matches the card with the category >> word, then the judge picks the card that they like the best. The >> objective is to get picked the most times to win the game. It's a >> little more complex than that, but that's a simple way of looking at >> it. >> >> On 3/12/13, Ashley Bramlett wrote: >>> Kaiti, >>> Thanks. Do you play the games with other players online or alone? >>> I haven't heard of apples to apples. Sounds neat. >>> >>> Ashley >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Kaiti Shelton >>> Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 11:44 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games >>> >>> Hi Ashley, >>> >>> have you heard of RS games? It's a free client you download to your >>> PC. They have accessible games including Monopoly, Uno, 1,000 Miles, >>> Apples to Apples, Farkle (a dice game), Rummy, and Battleship. Not >>> quite word games like what you're thinking of, (well, maybe Apples to >>> Apples to an extent), but they're still pretty good. >>> >>> On 3/11/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>> Ashley: >>>> >>>> God is saving you from blowing your dollars on frivolities! (grin) >>>> >>>> Mike >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley >>>> Bramlett >>>> Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 5:12 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] alternatives to visual games >>>> >>>> Hi all, >>>> >>>> There is a heavy trend toward developing video games and portable games >>>> for >>>> on screen use. >>>> From fun games like bowling and basketball to academic games for math >>>> and >>>> science, they are out there. >>>> Some are portable; others are for home use. >>>> For at home we have the WII, Playstation and xbox. For portable >>>> options, >>>> there are numerous ones. All tablets and smart phones have games. Then >>>> you >>>> have the Kindle, Nook, and more. >>>> >>>> So what technology, if any, do you use as an alternative to these on >>>> screen >>>> games? >>>> Games range from adaptations of real card or board games to new ones >>>> developed for these portable book readers and tablets. >>>> Scrabble, Hangman, monopoly, and word searches are some games. >>>> >>>> I am beginning to feel left out when people talk about all these games. >>>> Perhaps, you all feel that way. >>>> My mother, who usually hates technology, has fallen in love with a few >>>> games >>>> on her new Kindle Fire; of course, not accessible to us. My mom is >>>> intimidated by computers, yet somehow picked up the concept in the >>>> kindle >>>> okay. She has games, music aps, and books on it. >>>> Perhaps, there are IOS games out there. I suppose there are computer >>>> games >>>> which I just haven’t looked at. >>>> I’d love to have a version of hangman, word puzzles, and card games for >>>> the >>>> pc. >>>> There are two games I had as a kid; I don’t know if both still exist as >>>> its >>>> old technology. But one does. >>>> 1. The Speak n Spell was a handheld thing; like a primative computer. >>>> You >>>> used it as a dictionary and it had academic games on it such as >>>> guessing >>>> partial words, a word scramble where you had to unscramble letters to >>>> make >>>> >>>> a >>>> word, word matching, and more games. >>>> 2. The Franklin Language master still exists; I saw it online. Most >>>> have >>>> the >>>> pc for a dictionary. But for those who want another portable option or >>>> a >>>> way >>>> to expand your vocabulary, this is excellent. It is lightweight with a >>>> qwerty style keyboard and speaks everything as well as a way to magnify >>>> the >>>> text. You can play word games on it such as hangman, word scramble, >>>> flash >>>> cards, word train, creating anagrams and more. I think there’s ten >>>> games >>>> on >>>> it. >>>> >>>> So what else is out there? Maybe something from APH? >>>> >>>> Thanks. >>>> Ashley >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat2%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Thu Mar 14 20:00:15 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 20:00:15 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: References: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com> <-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid> <004b01ce20c5$5a44fd80$0ecef880$@panix.com> <003901ce200e$9b1504c0$d13f0e40$@gmail.com> <004801ce2010$a9d558a0$fd8009e0$@gmail.com> , Message-ID: Kaiti: Did you read my posts about "Visually Impaired, Vs. Blind?" Basicly for me, I'd rather refer to myself as blind, (I'm totally blind,) but I'm not "visually impaired." There's a difference between sight, and vision. I've talked about that alot on these lists. Sight, is natural, (what we lack,) but vision is inward. If we didn't have vision, there would be no NFB. Vision is like this. "Where do you see yourself, in the next 5 years?" Using that logic, our vision isn't impaired, but our sight is. Let's just refer to ourselves as blind and get it over with. Good point Mike! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:49 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID Absolutely on that front. There is no point of interacting with people under false pretenses as if you were sighted... If one is worried about social situations due to people thinking they're blind, then they might want to think about the possible awkward situation of a friend suddenly finding out about something that important that was there all along and kept from them. On 3/14/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Hi, > > Mike, that is not how it works at all and I really have a problem with > the incinuation that people who identify themselves as visually > impaired use that title to get special treatment. I use my functional > vision as well as a cane when I feel it appropriate, and receive > accomodations such as braille, electronic format for textbooks, and > assistive technology that I need. I do what I can independently and > ask for sighted assistance when I need something read or would like a > little clarification on something visual that I cannot see. These are > not "special perks" as you put it. My personal choice to use VI over > blind is that it makes things easier for people to understand. I have > had some situations when I have used the term blind and people assume > I can't see anything at all. This has lead to well-intended but > unnecessary superhelping and other consequences. For me it's much > simpler to say I'm visually impaired, indicating that I have some > functional vision and giving sighted people a slightly clearer idea > about me. The NFB recognizes these terms "blind, legally blind, > visually impaired," as interchangeable, so it all comes down to > personal choice. There is nothing that says one term is preferential > over the other and has to be used by everyone. Afterall, visual > impairment is a continuum with varying degrees of blindness, so for > some visually impaired is a more accurate descriptor. > > I think that even if the original poster is slightly preoccupied with > the image of being blind then getting an identity cane might be the > first step in correcting that. The more people see it, the more he'll > have to answer questions about himself and his visual impairment and > get used to it. Not all, but some visually impaired people have to > psychologically ease into being comfortable with identifying > themselves in this way and that shouldn't be held against them if > that's what they have to do. Heck, I've even heard partially sighted > people speak at state conventions about how they grew more comfortable > with their blindness by beginning to associate themselves with the > NFB, so it sounds like the poster may be on the right track. Again, > we don't really know the situation; any one of us could be reading > something that the poster didn't intentionally mean because that is a > side-effect of electronic messages... things often get misconstrued. > He never said he didn't want to be identified as blind in order to > gain priveledges; he just wanted something to let people know, but he > still has enough functional vision to walk without a cane. I think > the wording about walking perfectly may be a little presumptuous, (no > one, blind or sighted, walks exactly perfectly because it's > anatomically impossible), but like I said this might be a good step in > putting blindness/visual impairment/whatever you'd like to call it > into perspective. > > > On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >> Just use whatever works. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >> Dudley >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:29 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >> >> I guess I just don't see the problem with allowing people to interact >> with >> you as though you are sighted. If for some reason, you can't see that >> interaction, then tell them you are blind. >> >> >> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>> Our fine line is that we are trying to predict, and or control >>> people's reactions. If you do not have a cane with you while walking >>> in our country, people probably will not know you are blind. The >>> original poster has every right to not use a cane and rely on >>> functional vision. However, the reactions of people can't be >>> controlled. If they don't know he is blind, they will react to him as >>> if he is sighted. It is his choice. In America, I don't think we >>> have a way to not carry a cane, but have everyone know that you are >>> blind. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>> Dudley >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:43 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>> >>> Hi, >>> I'm going to stick my "oar in" as they say. Kaiti and Mike, I >>> think there may be a bit of misunderstanding. I think what is sought >>> by the original poster on this thread is an identification symbol, >>> something to say "I am blind" that is not as bulky as a cane. I >>> definitely disagree with this. What I do not disagree with is using >>> one's functional vision when you have it and, if that be your desire, >>> to not use a cane if you don't need it. >>> What I do disagree with is the concept of wanting the "you poor blind >>> person" perks of blindness without carrying a cane, as the original >>> poster seems to want. There is a fine line that I think is lost in the >> grey here. >>> ALeeha >>> >>> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>> Kaiti: >>>> >>>> We shall have to agree to disagree. I see no reason to identify as >>>> "visually impaired" unless one wishes special help or perks. Why not >>>> just be blind and have done with the matter? Much simpler. >>>> >>>> In fact, I know a guy who was nearly totally blind for many years due >>>> to an explosion. He got a good deal of sight back (he's lost it again >>>> now) and used his sight to look around, traveling with a cane as he >>>> always did; thus, he got the benefit of sight plus didn't have to >>>> worry about when he should or should not use a cane, whether to >>>> identify etc. etc. >>>> >>>> Peace! >>>> >>>> Mike Freeman >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>>> Shelton >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:32 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>> >>>> Mike, >>>> >>>> I have to disagree here. As one of those partials who elects when to >>>> use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you >>>> may not be considering. Electing when and when not to use a cane is >>>> not always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; >>>> some of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. >>>> Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas >>>> without a cane some times should give up their right to identify >>>> themself as a visually impaired person. E.G, I would never do any >>>> type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a >>>> street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see >>>> like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under >>>> normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria >>>> right across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm >>>> coming right back I don't always choose to actively use it. My >>>> choice to not use a cane in this instance does not mean I should >>>> forfit my right to identify myself as a visually impaired person >>>> because I am; the use of the cane does not change my inability to >>>> read print or to see great distances and it does not change the fact >>>> that I am legally blind and am identified that way. It also doesn't >>>> change the level of security I have with my blindness; if a person >>>> refuses to use a cane or fights against it because they're afraid of >>>> the social implications then that is insecurity, but if they're >>>> visually having a good day and want to run a quick errand that's in a >>>> very familiar area with minimal travel or risk of injury and they're >>>> confident in their ability to use audio cues and the vision they have >>>> then that is their choice and doesn't make them insecure with >>>> themself or their blindness. As long as they have the confidence and >>>> security to not be afraid of using it and to identify and use it when >>>> they need to, to be confident and secure whether they're using a cane >>>> or not, and don't pose risk to themselves in the cases where they >>>> don't use it there is nothing that would suggest insecurity. We >>>> don't know the exact visual situation of anyone on this list unless >>>> they've written about it, so I don't think it is fair to judge about >>>> someone's level of security with their blindness based on their cane >>>> habits when we don't know what their vision is like. >>>> >>>> Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social situations. >>>> Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've >>>> had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria >>>> with my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention >>>> using something besides my name. When they see the cane (or >>>> sometimes read National Federation of the Blind on it if they're >>>> close enough to see >>>> it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring >>>> to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before >>>> getting my name. Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an >>>> opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then >>>> the person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're >>>> informed and they see that it's not a big deal. >>>> >>>> And, I have to make one small correction. The main market for the >>>> lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may >>>> not use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since >>>> they are the ones who originated the telescopic design. Although I >>>> do know people who are totally blind or only have light perception >>>> that use the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty >>>> quickly because they use them so much. For someone who may not use >>>> the cane every single day but still would benefit from having an >>>> identifier to let other people know they're visually impaired these >>>> canes >> are great. >>>> Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild >>>> hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need >>>> one. Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can >>>> see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not >>>> tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. >>>> In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to >>>> have an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my >>>> eyes because even if that person may not need to use it by having one >>>> for people to see they must be okay with their blindness and >>>> comfortable in explaining their visual impairment to others should >>>> the question arise. >>>> >>>> On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >>>>> Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to >>>>> alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive >>>>> thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that >>>>> identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not >>>>> of inferiority. >>>>> >>>>> Just my thoughts >>>>> >>>>> Chris Nusbaum >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hamid: >>>>>> >>>>>> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your >>>>>> cake and eat it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages >>>>>> of being recognized as blind whereas on the other, you don't want >>>>>> to really appear blind or be judged because you do not believe you >>>>>> need a cane. My friend, you can't have it both ways. Why do you >>>>>> even care whether the public considers you blind or not or whether >>>>>> they consider it weird that you might appear to not need a cane? >>>>>> Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons >>>>>> who use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows >>>>>> them as blind whereas you consider that you do not? >>>>>> >>>>>> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >>>>>> >>>>>> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most >>>>>> of us would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a >>>>>> label to being prohibited from going places or doing things because >>>>>> of the alleged inability of the blind. >>>>>> >>>>>> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid >>>>>> Hamraz >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>> >>>>>> Dear Folks, >>>>>> >>>>>> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to >>>>>> represent my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To >>>>>> be more precise, the target people benefiting are those whose >>>>>> residual sight lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who >>>>>> want to let the other people around them know about their blindness. >>>>>> Carrying a cane is indeed an option. >>>>>> However, >>>>>> I >>>>>> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using >>>>>> it and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have >>>>>> a special symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere >>>>>> in any size at one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware >>>>>> of that). However, there is no such a thing here in US, and setting >>>>>> that up requires time and educating the society about that. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need >>>>>> something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a >>>>>> functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. >>>>>> >>>>>> Hamid >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.c >>>>>> o >>>>>> m >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40 >>>> g >>>> mail.c >>>> om >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104 >>>> % >>>> 40gmai >>>> l.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Kaiti >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993% >>>> 4 >>>> 0gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>> 0gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%4 >>> 0gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 20:13:20 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 16:13:20 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: <004801ce20c2$11523eb0$33f6bc10$@panix.com> References: <002301ce2074$cd744f50$685cedf0$@gmail.com> <8CFEE93347C9D6A-1AB8-1A53E@webmail-d136.sysops.aol.com> <004801ce20c2$11523eb0$33f6bc10$@panix.com> Message-ID: Hi Miso, Overall, your councelor should offer you consumer choice. I know that's a hot topic now as we talked about it at the Ohio state convention last November. Talk to the CCB staff and get justification. Get specifics on their program as well as the junior blind program and outline what you could get in Colorado that isn't available in California. Also draw on your past experiences with Junior Blind since you have them and use those to explain why Colorado would be a better opportunity. Ultimately they should have given you this option since it's not like you're asking for them to fund you flying to Baltimore for a Journigan center program, or even Louisiana which would bring up higher plane costs, but hopefully once they have some justification they'll see what you're treally trying to get out of going to a center. Josh, I agree with Mike here. Voc Rehab councelors are not always very fond of the NFB, and also it takes a little pushing and prodding to get what you really need out of them. Look into the center, call and find out if it would really be a "waste of your time" or if it would be something truly beneficial for you. Don't just take the word of your councelor, who is sighted and probably has no idea what the centers really do anyway. On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > Joshua: > > Did you check out LCB for yourself? Might not your VR counselor be > prejudiced against NFB centers? > > Just a thought. > > Mike > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 7:05 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hi Miso. > If you're proficient in Braille, the NFB trainig center wouldn't be your > best bet. > Although they do independence training, you have to attend Braille classes, > every day. > If you need independence training, you'd be better off getting the skills > from a VR rep. > That's what I'm doing, since my VR said that LCB would be a waste of my > time. > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Miso Kwak > [kwakmiso at aol.com] > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:20 AM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Thank you everyone for helpful answers. > To clarify, I was referring to the STEP not Davidson. > I lived in California barely 4 years, so I experienced JBA only twice. > I personally didn't like the atmosphere and philosophy very much > although not unbearable... > I think at this point, after reading feedbacks, I would prefer one of > the NFB centers over JBA. I think then the task to do is to get my > request to attend CCB justified. > I will contact staff at the CCB and see what I can do. > Thank you again. > Miso Kwak > > -----Original Message----- > From: Hannah Chadwick > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > > Sent: Wed, Mar 13, 2013 10:29 pm > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hi all, > So I just wanted to clarify since I've been to the STEP programs at > Junior > Blind of America. There is STEP 1 and STEP 2, and they are both summer > programs that focus on helping young adults with job interviewing > skills, > career research, and during STEP 2, the students are placed on a work > site. > They are expected to travel to and from work using public > transportation. > STEP 1 is 3 weeks and provides students with various info on the topics > mentioned above. STEP 2 is 7 weeks and students have the opportunity to > do > an internship. > I would be glad to provide more info on the STEP programs, however, I > think > that Miso is referring to the Independent living program that Junior > Blind > also offers. > The Davidson Program for Independence, DPI is a residential program for > blind individuals who wish to learn skills such as orientation and > mobility, > technology, cooking, Braille, and of course independent living skills. > I did > not attend DPI so I don't know specifically what they do and how they > run. I > did have friends who attended both the STEP programs as well as DPI. > They > told me they learned a lot and they found it very helpful. I'm sure > there > are pros and cons to attending any residential program. Please don't > hesitate to contact me off list if you have further questions. > All the best, Hannah > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon > Keith > Biggs > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 9:48 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hello, > It depends where you are at in your living skills. I had been living on > my > own for a few months before I went to the Step 2 program and I found it > only > good for the few hours of work experience they provided. They aren't > very > inventive when it comes to giving each person a unique work > environment, but > you do get to do an internship. I did not like however, the step 1 folks > were mentored by the step 2 people for both sessions and the step 2 > people > had to sit through classes the step 1 participant's were taking. > Step 1 is a ton of classes on how to give an interview, talk about > yourself > and act professionally dressing wise and so on. When I went it was very > lecture based and very little real-time experiences, but I could tell > some > people really needed the learning. I could already cook, clean, do > laundry > and had had a summer job the year before in a much freer environment, > so I > found STEP oppressive, but I did learn how to deal with authority in a > mature way and even though I won't repeat it, I am glad I went. > The campus is also very oddly situated, so it takes for ever to go > anywhere > and they expect people to work around the schedule they set up, so for > example, I had a 2 hour commute on Para transit to and from work and I > had > work to do at home. They were not very accommodating for those of us who > wanted to become work junkies, working till 10, grabbing food, then > waking > up at 6 and leaving. They wanted you to actually be around with other > people > and do tasks like instruct the other students on how to use the > computer for > example. > Personally, the YES2 program in Washington state is more my cup of tee > than > the STEP2 program, but I know plenty of other people who really loved > it and > or who would really like it. > You can email me off list if you have any more questions. > brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Miso Kwak > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:55 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hello, > I would like to know if any of you have participated in the STEP program > offered by Junior Blind in California. > If you have the experience, could you comment on how it was? > Would you recommend it? > I am trying to select a summer program that will help me improve my > independent living skills (mobility, home management, etc) and realize > that > there are a few different options available, so I just want to hear from > someone if anyone on the list has experience with Junior Blind's STEP > program. > Thank you. > Miso Kwak > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sparklylicious%40gmail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kwakmiso%40aol.com > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Thu Mar 14 20:19:52 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 20:19:52 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: References: <002301ce2074$cd744f50$685cedf0$@gmail.com> <8CFEE93347C9D6A-1AB8-1A53E@webmail-d136.sysops.aol.com> <004801ce20c2$11523eb0$33f6bc10$@panix.com>, Message-ID: My Voc Rehab counselor loves the NFB, but she said that they couldn't afford to send me to LCB, and that LCB wouldn't be my best bet, because she said, (and Pam Allen agreed,) that I didn't need to go to the Braille classes, which are required. What the NFB centers need to do, is to offer a test. If someone is already proficient in Braille, they shouldn't have to be required to take the Braille courses. Then, they could just focus on the independence training. Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:13 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hi Miso, Overall, your councelor should offer you consumer choice. I know that's a hot topic now as we talked about it at the Ohio state convention last November. Talk to the CCB staff and get justification. Get specifics on their program as well as the junior blind program and outline what you could get in Colorado that isn't available in California. Also draw on your past experiences with Junior Blind since you have them and use those to explain why Colorado would be a better opportunity. Ultimately they should have given you this option since it's not like you're asking for them to fund you flying to Baltimore for a Journigan center program, or even Louisiana which would bring up higher plane costs, but hopefully once they have some justification they'll see what you're treally trying to get out of going to a center. Josh, I agree with Mike here. Voc Rehab councelors are not always very fond of the NFB, and also it takes a little pushing and prodding to get what you really need out of them. Look into the center, call and find out if it would really be a "waste of your time" or if it would be something truly beneficial for you. Don't just take the word of your councelor, who is sighted and probably has no idea what the centers really do anyway. On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > Joshua: > > Did you check out LCB for yourself? Might not your VR counselor be > prejudiced against NFB centers? > > Just a thought. > > Mike > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 7:05 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hi Miso. > If you're proficient in Braille, the NFB trainig center wouldn't be your > best bet. > Although they do independence training, you have to attend Braille classes, > every day. > If you need independence training, you'd be better off getting the skills > from a VR rep. > That's what I'm doing, since my VR said that LCB would be a waste of my > time. > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Miso Kwak > [kwakmiso at aol.com] > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:20 AM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Thank you everyone for helpful answers. > To clarify, I was referring to the STEP not Davidson. > I lived in California barely 4 years, so I experienced JBA only twice. > I personally didn't like the atmosphere and philosophy very much > although not unbearable... > I think at this point, after reading feedbacks, I would prefer one of > the NFB centers over JBA. I think then the task to do is to get my > request to attend CCB justified. > I will contact staff at the CCB and see what I can do. > Thank you again. > Miso Kwak > > -----Original Message----- > From: Hannah Chadwick > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > > Sent: Wed, Mar 13, 2013 10:29 pm > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hi all, > So I just wanted to clarify since I've been to the STEP programs at > Junior > Blind of America. There is STEP 1 and STEP 2, and they are both summer > programs that focus on helping young adults with job interviewing > skills, > career research, and during STEP 2, the students are placed on a work > site. > They are expected to travel to and from work using public > transportation. > STEP 1 is 3 weeks and provides students with various info on the topics > mentioned above. STEP 2 is 7 weeks and students have the opportunity to > do > an internship. > I would be glad to provide more info on the STEP programs, however, I > think > that Miso is referring to the Independent living program that Junior > Blind > also offers. > The Davidson Program for Independence, DPI is a residential program for > blind individuals who wish to learn skills such as orientation and > mobility, > technology, cooking, Braille, and of course independent living skills. > I did > not attend DPI so I don't know specifically what they do and how they > run. I > did have friends who attended both the STEP programs as well as DPI. > They > told me they learned a lot and they found it very helpful. I'm sure > there > are pros and cons to attending any residential program. Please don't > hesitate to contact me off list if you have further questions. > All the best, Hannah > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon > Keith > Biggs > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 9:48 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hello, > It depends where you are at in your living skills. I had been living on > my > own for a few months before I went to the Step 2 program and I found it > only > good for the few hours of work experience they provided. They aren't > very > inventive when it comes to giving each person a unique work > environment, but > you do get to do an internship. I did not like however, the step 1 folks > were mentored by the step 2 people for both sessions and the step 2 > people > had to sit through classes the step 1 participant's were taking. > Step 1 is a ton of classes on how to give an interview, talk about > yourself > and act professionally dressing wise and so on. When I went it was very > lecture based and very little real-time experiences, but I could tell > some > people really needed the learning. I could already cook, clean, do > laundry > and had had a summer job the year before in a much freer environment, > so I > found STEP oppressive, but I did learn how to deal with authority in a > mature way and even though I won't repeat it, I am glad I went. > The campus is also very oddly situated, so it takes for ever to go > anywhere > and they expect people to work around the schedule they set up, so for > example, I had a 2 hour commute on Para transit to and from work and I > had > work to do at home. They were not very accommodating for those of us who > wanted to become work junkies, working till 10, grabbing food, then > waking > up at 6 and leaving. They wanted you to actually be around with other > people > and do tasks like instruct the other students on how to use the > computer for > example. > Personally, the YES2 program in Washington state is more my cup of tee > than > the STEP2 program, but I know plenty of other people who really loved > it and > or who would really like it. > You can email me off list if you have any more questions. > brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Miso Kwak > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:55 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hello, > I would like to know if any of you have participated in the STEP program > offered by Junior Blind in California. > If you have the experience, could you comment on how it was? > Would you recommend it? > I am trying to select a summer program that will help me improve my > independent living skills (mobility, home management, etc) and realize > that > there are a few different options available, so I just want to hear from > someone if anyone on the list has experience with Junior Blind's STEP > program. > Thank you. > Miso Kwak > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sparklylicious%40gmail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kwakmiso%40aol.com > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu From arielle71 at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 20:58:57 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 14:58:57 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: References: <002301ce2074$cd744f50$685cedf0$@gmail.com> <8CFEE93347C9D6A-1AB8-1A53E@webmail-d136.sysops.aol.com> <004801ce20c2$11523eb0$33f6bc10$@panix.com> Message-ID: You do have to take Braille every day at the adult programs, but the summer programs may be different. Also, if your Braille is very good you can get your schedule adjusted on an individual basis after you start. I had my Braille taken down from daily to once per week so I could work on slate-and-stylus skills, and then I used the other four days for extra home management/cooking time (which I needed). Many students finished one class entirely in the middle of their program and then transitioned to spending that time in the other classes, or in a volunteer or college class setting. While the NFB center programs do tend to follow a set curriculum for most students, they are always willing to make exceptions and try to accommodate your particular needs. Arielle On 3/14/13, Joshua Lester wrote: > My Voc Rehab counselor loves the NFB, but she said that they couldn't afford > to send me to LCB, and that LCB wouldn't be my best bet, because she said, > (and Pam Allen agreed,) that I didn't need to go to the Braille classes, > which are required. > What the NFB centers need to do, is to offer a test. > If someone is already proficient in Braille, they shouldn't have to be > required to take the Braille courses. > Then, they could just focus on the independence training. > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton > [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:13 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hi Miso, > > Overall, your councelor should offer you consumer choice. I know > that's a hot topic now as we talked about it at the Ohio state > convention last November. Talk to the CCB staff and get > justification. Get specifics on their program as well as the junior > blind program and outline what you could get in Colorado that isn't > available in California. Also draw on your past experiences with > Junior Blind since you have them and use those to explain why Colorado > would be a better opportunity. Ultimately they should have given you > this option since it's not like you're asking for them to fund you > flying to Baltimore for a Journigan center program, or even Louisiana > which would bring up higher plane costs, but hopefully once they have > some justification they'll see what you're treally trying to get out > of going to a center. > > Josh, I agree with Mike here. Voc Rehab councelors are not always > very fond of the NFB, and also it takes a little pushing and prodding > to get what you really need out of them. Look into the center, call > and find out if it would really be a "waste of your time" or if it > would be something truly beneficial for you. Don't just take the word > of your councelor, who is sighted and probably has no idea what the > centers really do anyway. > > On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >> Joshua: >> >> Did you check out LCB for yourself? Might not your VR counselor be >> prejudiced against NFB centers? >> >> Just a thought. >> >> Mike >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua >> Lester >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 7:05 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America >> >> Hi Miso. >> If you're proficient in Braille, the NFB trainig center wouldn't be your >> best bet. >> Although they do independence training, you have to attend Braille >> classes, >> every day. >> If you need independence training, you'd be better off getting the skills >> from a VR rep. >> That's what I'm doing, since my VR said that LCB would be a waste of my >> time. >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Miso Kwak >> [kwakmiso at aol.com] >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:20 AM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America >> >> Thank you everyone for helpful answers. >> To clarify, I was referring to the STEP not Davidson. >> I lived in California barely 4 years, so I experienced JBA only twice. >> I personally didn't like the atmosphere and philosophy very much >> although not unbearable... >> I think at this point, after reading feedbacks, I would prefer one of >> the NFB centers over JBA. I think then the task to do is to get my >> request to attend CCB justified. >> I will contact staff at the CCB and see what I can do. >> Thank you again. >> Miso Kwak >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Hannah Chadwick >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> >> Sent: Wed, Mar 13, 2013 10:29 pm >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America >> >> Hi all, >> So I just wanted to clarify since I've been to the STEP programs at >> Junior >> Blind of America. There is STEP 1 and STEP 2, and they are both summer >> programs that focus on helping young adults with job interviewing >> skills, >> career research, and during STEP 2, the students are placed on a work >> site. >> They are expected to travel to and from work using public >> transportation. >> STEP 1 is 3 weeks and provides students with various info on the topics >> mentioned above. STEP 2 is 7 weeks and students have the opportunity to >> do >> an internship. >> I would be glad to provide more info on the STEP programs, however, I >> think >> that Miso is referring to the Independent living program that Junior >> Blind >> also offers. >> The Davidson Program for Independence, DPI is a residential program for >> blind individuals who wish to learn skills such as orientation and >> mobility, >> technology, cooking, Braille, and of course independent living skills. >> I did >> not attend DPI so I don't know specifically what they do and how they >> run. I >> did have friends who attended both the STEP programs as well as DPI. >> They >> told me they learned a lot and they found it very helpful. I'm sure >> there >> are pros and cons to attending any residential program. Please don't >> hesitate to contact me off list if you have further questions. >> All the best, Hannah >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >> Keith >> Biggs >> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 9:48 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America >> >> Hello, >> It depends where you are at in your living skills. I had been living on >> my >> own for a few months before I went to the Step 2 program and I found it >> only >> good for the few hours of work experience they provided. They aren't >> very >> inventive when it comes to giving each person a unique work >> environment, but >> you do get to do an internship. I did not like however, the step 1 folks >> were mentored by the step 2 people for both sessions and the step 2 >> people >> had to sit through classes the step 1 participant's were taking. >> Step 1 is a ton of classes on how to give an interview, talk about >> yourself >> and act professionally dressing wise and so on. When I went it was very >> lecture based and very little real-time experiences, but I could tell >> some >> people really needed the learning. I could already cook, clean, do >> laundry >> and had had a summer job the year before in a much freer environment, >> so I >> found STEP oppressive, but I did learn how to deal with authority in a >> mature way and even though I won't repeat it, I am glad I went. >> The campus is also very oddly situated, so it takes for ever to go >> anywhere >> and they expect people to work around the schedule they set up, so for >> example, I had a 2 hour commute on Para transit to and from work and I >> had >> work to do at home. They were not very accommodating for those of us who >> wanted to become work junkies, working till 10, grabbing food, then >> waking >> up at 6 and leaving. They wanted you to actually be around with other >> people >> and do tasks like instruct the other students on how to use the >> computer for >> example. >> Personally, the YES2 program in Washington state is more my cup of tee >> than >> the STEP2 program, but I know plenty of other people who really loved >> it and >> or who would really like it. >> You can email me off list if you have any more questions. >> brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com >> Thanks, >> >> Brandon Keith Biggs >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Miso Kwak >> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:55 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America >> >> Hello, >> I would like to know if any of you have participated in the STEP program >> offered by Junior Blind in California. >> If you have the experience, could you comment on how it was? >> Would you recommend it? >> I am trying to select a summer program that will help me improve my >> independent living skills (mobility, home management, etc) and realize >> that >> there are a few different options available, so I just want to hear from >> someone if anyone on the list has experience with Junior Blind's STEP >> program. >> Thank you. >> Miso Kwak >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai >> l.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sparklylicious%40gmail.c >> om >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kwakmiso%40aol.com >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From k7uij at panix.com Thu Mar 14 21:38:56 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 14:38:56 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: References: <002301ce2074$cd744f50$685cedf0$@gmail.com> <8CFEE93347C9D6A-1AB8-1A53E@webmail-d136.sysops.aol.com> <004801ce20c2$11523eb0$33f6bc10$@panix.com>, Message-ID: <005701ce20fc$54edef90$fec9ceb0$@panix.com> How they gonna test your slate skills? And did Pam herself tell you? Mike -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:20 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America My Voc Rehab counselor loves the NFB, but she said that they couldn't afford to send me to LCB, and that LCB wouldn't be my best bet, because she said, (and Pam Allen agreed,) that I didn't need to go to the Braille classes, which are required. What the NFB centers need to do, is to offer a test. If someone is already proficient in Braille, they shouldn't have to be required to take the Braille courses. Then, they could just focus on the independence training. Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:13 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hi Miso, Overall, your councelor should offer you consumer choice. I know that's a hot topic now as we talked about it at the Ohio state convention last November. Talk to the CCB staff and get justification. Get specifics on their program as well as the junior blind program and outline what you could get in Colorado that isn't available in California. Also draw on your past experiences with Junior Blind since you have them and use those to explain why Colorado would be a better opportunity. Ultimately they should have given you this option since it's not like you're asking for them to fund you flying to Baltimore for a Journigan center program, or even Louisiana which would bring up higher plane costs, but hopefully once they have some justification they'll see what you're treally trying to get out of going to a center. Josh, I agree with Mike here. Voc Rehab councelors are not always very fond of the NFB, and also it takes a little pushing and prodding to get what you really need out of them. Look into the center, call and find out if it would really be a "waste of your time" or if it would be something truly beneficial for you. Don't just take the word of your councelor, who is sighted and probably has no idea what the centers really do anyway. On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > Joshua: > > Did you check out LCB for yourself? Might not your VR counselor be > prejudiced against NFB centers? > > Just a thought. > > Mike > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 7:05 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hi Miso. > If you're proficient in Braille, the NFB trainig center wouldn't be your > best bet. > Although they do independence training, you have to attend Braille classes, > every day. > If you need independence training, you'd be better off getting the skills > from a VR rep. > That's what I'm doing, since my VR said that LCB would be a waste of my > time. > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Miso Kwak > [kwakmiso at aol.com] > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:20 AM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Thank you everyone for helpful answers. > To clarify, I was referring to the STEP not Davidson. > I lived in California barely 4 years, so I experienced JBA only twice. > I personally didn't like the atmosphere and philosophy very much > although not unbearable... > I think at this point, after reading feedbacks, I would prefer one of > the NFB centers over JBA. I think then the task to do is to get my > request to attend CCB justified. > I will contact staff at the CCB and see what I can do. > Thank you again. > Miso Kwak > > -----Original Message----- > From: Hannah Chadwick > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > > Sent: Wed, Mar 13, 2013 10:29 pm > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hi all, > So I just wanted to clarify since I've been to the STEP programs at > Junior > Blind of America. There is STEP 1 and STEP 2, and they are both summer > programs that focus on helping young adults with job interviewing > skills, > career research, and during STEP 2, the students are placed on a work > site. > They are expected to travel to and from work using public > transportation. > STEP 1 is 3 weeks and provides students with various info on the topics > mentioned above. STEP 2 is 7 weeks and students have the opportunity to > do > an internship. > I would be glad to provide more info on the STEP programs, however, I > think > that Miso is referring to the Independent living program that Junior > Blind > also offers. > The Davidson Program for Independence, DPI is a residential program for > blind individuals who wish to learn skills such as orientation and > mobility, > technology, cooking, Braille, and of course independent living skills. > I did > not attend DPI so I don't know specifically what they do and how they > run. I > did have friends who attended both the STEP programs as well as DPI. > They > told me they learned a lot and they found it very helpful. I'm sure > there > are pros and cons to attending any residential program. Please don't > hesitate to contact me off list if you have further questions. > All the best, Hannah > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon > Keith > Biggs > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 9:48 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hello, > It depends where you are at in your living skills. I had been living on > my > own for a few months before I went to the Step 2 program and I found it > only > good for the few hours of work experience they provided. They aren't > very > inventive when it comes to giving each person a unique work > environment, but > you do get to do an internship. I did not like however, the step 1 folks > were mentored by the step 2 people for both sessions and the step 2 > people > had to sit through classes the step 1 participant's were taking. > Step 1 is a ton of classes on how to give an interview, talk about > yourself > and act professionally dressing wise and so on. When I went it was very > lecture based and very little real-time experiences, but I could tell > some > people really needed the learning. I could already cook, clean, do > laundry > and had had a summer job the year before in a much freer environment, > so I > found STEP oppressive, but I did learn how to deal with authority in a > mature way and even though I won't repeat it, I am glad I went. > The campus is also very oddly situated, so it takes for ever to go > anywhere > and they expect people to work around the schedule they set up, so for > example, I had a 2 hour commute on Para transit to and from work and I > had > work to do at home. They were not very accommodating for those of us who > wanted to become work junkies, working till 10, grabbing food, then > waking > up at 6 and leaving. They wanted you to actually be around with other > people > and do tasks like instruct the other students on how to use the > computer for > example. > Personally, the YES2 program in Washington state is more my cup of tee > than > the STEP2 program, but I know plenty of other people who really loved > it and > or who would really like it. > You can email me off list if you have any more questions. > brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Miso Kwak > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:55 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hello, > I would like to know if any of you have participated in the STEP program > offered by Junior Blind in California. > If you have the experience, could you comment on how it was? > Would you recommend it? > I am trying to select a summer program that will help me improve my > independent living skills (mobility, home management, etc) and realize > that > there are a few different options available, so I just want to hear from > someone if anyone on the list has experience with Junior Blind's STEP > program. > Thank you. > Miso Kwak > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sparklylicious%40gmail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kwakmiso%40aol.com > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai l.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From k7uij at panix.com Thu Mar 14 21:45:28 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 14:45:28 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> I don't see why it's superior to the 5. Mike -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the Blind. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony Grima Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or DAISY: $9 Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full tutorial together and save! The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, and has a better camera. Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used in both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them easily. If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this update to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all the appendices. An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone reference card. Order at: http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html ****** To order any books, send payment to: NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge it: toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. Or order any of our books online at http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From jsoro620 at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 22:39:00 2013 From: jsoro620 at gmail.com (Joe) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 18:39:00 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs In-Reply-To: References: <850CD7D3-28A6-4CE4-A12D-DC504341F7B3@panix.com> Message-ID: <018701ce2104$b9163830$2b42a890$@gmail.com> Have you downloaded the desktop app? It should work like Dropbox and be just as accessible. Joe -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Cindy Bennett Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:49 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs I'm not sure what is going on exactly. I personally have never experienced the problem. It is true though that the "conflicted copy" thing is annoying. People cannot work on documents at the same time, and when they do, if you do not make sure to transfer all of the new data from the conflicted copy to the parent copy, you can end up inadvertently losing information. Also, my lab has always used Google docs, so I would prefer to use the same system as my colleagues. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks. Cindy On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > Under what circumstances are files being deleted from your friend's dropbox? > What app is she using? > > Mike Freeman > sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 14, 2013, at 11:56, Cindy Bennett wrote: > >> Hi everyone, >> >> When I get to the Google Drive web page, I notice that there are a >> series of buttons such as create, upload, and share. How do you get >> these buttons to activate? I pressed enter on the create button and >> JAWS said "loading" and then "load complete," but I can't find where >> the document is to write. >> >> I am really interested in exploring accessibility, and I know there >> are a couple of workarounds. But I am in a situation where one of my >> colleagues is having files oddly deleted from her Dropbox and is >> incredibly frustrated and wants to switch to Google docs right now. >> So I am trying to get some quick answers to investigate preliminary >> accessibility. >> >> I know that with Google Calendar, I have an incredibly difficult time >> pressing the buttons to create and share calendars. I know there is a >> Google accessibility web page, but their advice really hasn't worked >> for me. I know that there is a series of JAWS commands such as >> rooting the jaws cursor to the pc cursor and left mouse clicking, and >> that really doesn't work for me although maybe I am doing it incorrectly. >> >> The Google docs web page seems to have some similarities in a >> negative way to the web interface of Google Calendar. >> >> Does anyone use Google docs on their iPhone? I have a blue tooth >> keyboard so although no optimal, I could do that. >> >> Does anyone use Google docs on their mac? >> >> I have a duel system meaning that I use bootcamp. I really haven't >> found VoiceOver to be as efficient, and I really don't want to have >> to switch sides every time I need to work on a Google doc, but I am >> curious. >> >> Thanks for your input, and sorry for all of the details. I always >> appreciate the help I receive from this list. >> >> >> -- >> Cindy Bennett >> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative >> Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington >> >> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >> clb5590 at gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.co > m > -- Cindy Bennett Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington clb5590 at gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Thu Mar 14 22:53:08 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 18:53:08 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Happy Spring Break In-Reply-To: <008e01ce1c72$42f7d230$c8e77690$@gmail.com> References: <5130ef64.27b3ec0a.5d25.ffffc3db@mx.google.com><7FBEB3E5AAC04012A11BCC91FB43A8D7@OwnerPC> <008e01ce1c72$42f7d230$c8e77690$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <0A14EFF34DFC42FE978A965096ED874A@OwnerPC> I am on break now and I hope yours is fun and relaxing like mine is. I will see my baby nephew this weekend and I look forward to that. -----Original Message----- From: justin williams Sent: Friday, March 08, 2013 10:00 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Happy Spring Break I'm on brake. I will enjoy. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley Bramlett Sent: Saturday, March 09, 2013 2:05 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Happy Spring Break My spring break starts March 11. So Roanna, yours was earlier. I hope you enjoyed yours. On my break I'm doing some reading for school, but do not have to study as we are at a stopping point in both my classes and I had a midterm before break in one. Other than that, I'm relaxing, reading some books I've wanted to read for a while, going to a concert, and hanging out with a few friends, probably will bowl with them. For anyone else on break, enjoy. -----Original Message----- From: Roanna Baccchus Sent: Friday, March 01, 2013 1:10 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] Happy Spring Break Hi everyone I hope you are well. Welcome to the month of March. I can't believe it's almost Spring. I wic you all a safe and happy Spring Break. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink. net _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From arielle71 at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 00:09:54 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 18:09:54 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: References: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com> <-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid> <004b01ce20c5$5a44fd80$0ecef880$@panix.com> <003901ce200e$9b1504c0$d13f0e40$@gmail.com> <004801ce2010$a9d558a0$fd8009e0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi all, I guess I'm not quite getting what the advantage is of an ID cane over a regular one? With either cane, you are telling the world that you are blind (or visually impaired or whatever term you want to use). The ID cane gives you less tactile info than the regular one does. I totally understand that sometimes you might not need a cane to get around, but if you're going to use an ID cane anyway, why not just use the regular one and get a little extra tactile info too? It might not be necessary but it can't possibly hurt you to use a regular cane instead of an ID cane. Is there some way an ID cane is more convenient to use than a regular white cane? I agree that sometimes it is more convenient to not use a cane at all because it keeps your hands free. In those cases maybe wearing some kind of ID symbol would better help with making sure others around you know you are blind. However I think those situations where you really need both of your hands are pretty unusual. Arielle On 3/14/13, Joshua Lester wrote: > Kaiti: > Did you read my posts about "Visually Impaired, Vs. Blind?" > Basicly for me, I'd rather refer to myself as blind, (I'm totally blind,) > but I'm not "visually impaired." > There's a difference between sight, and vision. > I've talked about that alot on these lists. > Sight, is natural, (what we lack,) but vision is inward. > If we didn't have vision, there would be no NFB. > Vision is like this. > "Where do you see yourself, in the next 5 years?" > Using that logic, our vision isn't impaired, but our sight is. > Let's just refer to ourselves as blind and get it over with. > Good point Mike! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton > [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:49 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID > > Absolutely on that front. There is no point of interacting with > people under false pretenses as if you were sighted... If one is > worried about social situations due to people thinking they're blind, > then they might want to think about the possible awkward situation of > a friend suddenly finding out about something that important that was > there all along and kept from them. > > On 3/14/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >> Hi, >> >> Mike, that is not how it works at all and I really have a problem with >> the incinuation that people who identify themselves as visually >> impaired use that title to get special treatment. I use my functional >> vision as well as a cane when I feel it appropriate, and receive >> accomodations such as braille, electronic format for textbooks, and >> assistive technology that I need. I do what I can independently and >> ask for sighted assistance when I need something read or would like a >> little clarification on something visual that I cannot see. These are >> not "special perks" as you put it. My personal choice to use VI over >> blind is that it makes things easier for people to understand. I have >> had some situations when I have used the term blind and people assume >> I can't see anything at all. This has lead to well-intended but >> unnecessary superhelping and other consequences. For me it's much >> simpler to say I'm visually impaired, indicating that I have some >> functional vision and giving sighted people a slightly clearer idea >> about me. The NFB recognizes these terms "blind, legally blind, >> visually impaired," as interchangeable, so it all comes down to >> personal choice. There is nothing that says one term is preferential >> over the other and has to be used by everyone. Afterall, visual >> impairment is a continuum with varying degrees of blindness, so for >> some visually impaired is a more accurate descriptor. >> >> I think that even if the original poster is slightly preoccupied with >> the image of being blind then getting an identity cane might be the >> first step in correcting that. The more people see it, the more he'll >> have to answer questions about himself and his visual impairment and >> get used to it. Not all, but some visually impaired people have to >> psychologically ease into being comfortable with identifying >> themselves in this way and that shouldn't be held against them if >> that's what they have to do. Heck, I've even heard partially sighted >> people speak at state conventions about how they grew more comfortable >> with their blindness by beginning to associate themselves with the >> NFB, so it sounds like the poster may be on the right track. Again, >> we don't really know the situation; any one of us could be reading >> something that the poster didn't intentionally mean because that is a >> side-effect of electronic messages... things often get misconstrued. >> He never said he didn't want to be identified as blind in order to >> gain priveledges; he just wanted something to let people know, but he >> still has enough functional vision to walk without a cane. I think >> the wording about walking perfectly may be a little presumptuous, (no >> one, blind or sighted, walks exactly perfectly because it's >> anatomically impossible), but like I said this might be a good step in >> putting blindness/visual impairment/whatever you'd like to call it >> into perspective. >> >> >> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>> Just use whatever works. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>> Dudley >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:29 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>> >>> I guess I just don't see the problem with allowing people to interact >>> with >>> you as though you are sighted. If for some reason, you can't see that >>> interaction, then tell them you are blind. >>> >>> >>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>> Our fine line is that we are trying to predict, and or control >>>> people's reactions. If you do not have a cane with you while walking >>>> in our country, people probably will not know you are blind. The >>>> original poster has every right to not use a cane and rely on >>>> functional vision. However, the reactions of people can't be >>>> controlled. If they don't know he is blind, they will react to him as >>>> if he is sighted. It is his choice. In America, I don't think we >>>> have a way to not carry a cane, but have everyone know that you are >>>> blind. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>> Dudley >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:43 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>> >>>> Hi, >>>> I'm going to stick my "oar in" as they say. Kaiti and Mike, I >>>> think there may be a bit of misunderstanding. I think what is sought >>>> by the original poster on this thread is an identification symbol, >>>> something to say "I am blind" that is not as bulky as a cane. I >>>> definitely disagree with this. What I do not disagree with is using >>>> one's functional vision when you have it and, if that be your desire, >>>> to not use a cane if you don't need it. >>>> What I do disagree with is the concept of wanting the "you poor blind >>>> person" perks of blindness without carrying a cane, as the original >>>> poster seems to want. There is a fine line that I think is lost in the >>> grey here. >>>> ALeeha >>>> >>>> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>> Kaiti: >>>>> >>>>> We shall have to agree to disagree. I see no reason to identify as >>>>> "visually impaired" unless one wishes special help or perks. Why not >>>>> just be blind and have done with the matter? Much simpler. >>>>> >>>>> In fact, I know a guy who was nearly totally blind for many years due >>>>> to an explosion. He got a good deal of sight back (he's lost it again >>>>> now) and used his sight to look around, traveling with a cane as he >>>>> always did; thus, he got the benefit of sight plus didn't have to >>>>> worry about when he should or should not use a cane, whether to >>>>> identify etc. etc. >>>>> >>>>> Peace! >>>>> >>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>>>> Shelton >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:32 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>> >>>>> Mike, >>>>> >>>>> I have to disagree here. As one of those partials who elects when to >>>>> use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you >>>>> may not be considering. Electing when and when not to use a cane is >>>>> not always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; >>>>> some of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. >>>>> Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas >>>>> without a cane some times should give up their right to identify >>>>> themself as a visually impaired person. E.G, I would never do any >>>>> type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a >>>>> street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see >>>>> like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under >>>>> normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria >>>>> right across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm >>>>> coming right back I don't always choose to actively use it. My >>>>> choice to not use a cane in this instance does not mean I should >>>>> forfit my right to identify myself as a visually impaired person >>>>> because I am; the use of the cane does not change my inability to >>>>> read print or to see great distances and it does not change the fact >>>>> that I am legally blind and am identified that way. It also doesn't >>>>> change the level of security I have with my blindness; if a person >>>>> refuses to use a cane or fights against it because they're afraid of >>>>> the social implications then that is insecurity, but if they're >>>>> visually having a good day and want to run a quick errand that's in a >>>>> very familiar area with minimal travel or risk of injury and they're >>>>> confident in their ability to use audio cues and the vision they have >>>>> then that is their choice and doesn't make them insecure with >>>>> themself or their blindness. As long as they have the confidence and >>>>> security to not be afraid of using it and to identify and use it when >>>>> they need to, to be confident and secure whether they're using a cane >>>>> or not, and don't pose risk to themselves in the cases where they >>>>> don't use it there is nothing that would suggest insecurity. We >>>>> don't know the exact visual situation of anyone on this list unless >>>>> they've written about it, so I don't think it is fair to judge about >>>>> someone's level of security with their blindness based on their cane >>>>> habits when we don't know what their vision is like. >>>>> >>>>> Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social situations. >>>>> Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've >>>>> had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria >>>>> with my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention >>>>> using something besides my name. When they see the cane (or >>>>> sometimes read National Federation of the Blind on it if they're >>>>> close enough to see >>>>> it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring >>>>> to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before >>>>> getting my name. Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an >>>>> opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then >>>>> the person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're >>>>> informed and they see that it's not a big deal. >>>>> >>>>> And, I have to make one small correction. The main market for the >>>>> lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may >>>>> not use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since >>>>> they are the ones who originated the telescopic design. Although I >>>>> do know people who are totally blind or only have light perception >>>>> that use the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty >>>>> quickly because they use them so much. For someone who may not use >>>>> the cane every single day but still would benefit from having an >>>>> identifier to let other people know they're visually impaired these >>>>> canes >>> are great. >>>>> Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild >>>>> hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need >>>>> one. Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can >>>>> see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not >>>>> tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. >>>>> In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to >>>>> have an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my >>>>> eyes because even if that person may not need to use it by having one >>>>> for people to see they must be okay with their blindness and >>>>> comfortable in explaining their visual impairment to others should >>>>> the question arise. >>>>> >>>>> On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >>>>>> Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to >>>>>> alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive >>>>>> thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that >>>>>> identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not >>>>>> of inferiority. >>>>>> >>>>>> Just my thoughts >>>>>> >>>>>> Chris Nusbaum >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Hamid: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your >>>>>>> cake and eat it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages >>>>>>> of being recognized as blind whereas on the other, you don't want >>>>>>> to really appear blind or be judged because you do not believe you >>>>>>> need a cane. My friend, you can't have it both ways. Why do you >>>>>>> even care whether the public considers you blind or not or whether >>>>>>> they consider it weird that you might appear to not need a cane? >>>>>>> Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons >>>>>>> who use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows >>>>>>> them as blind whereas you consider that you do not? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most >>>>>>> of us would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a >>>>>>> label to being prohibited from going places or doing things because >>>>>>> of the alleged inability of the blind. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid >>>>>>> Hamraz >>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Dear Folks, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to >>>>>>> represent my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To >>>>>>> be more precise, the target people benefiting are those whose >>>>>>> residual sight lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who >>>>>>> want to let the other people around them know about their blindness. >>>>>>> Carrying a cane is indeed an option. >>>>>>> However, >>>>>>> I >>>>>>> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using >>>>>>> it and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have >>>>>>> a special symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere >>>>>>> in any size at one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware >>>>>>> of that). However, there is no such a thing here in US, and setting >>>>>>> that up requires time and educating the society about that. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need >>>>>>> something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a >>>>>>> functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hamid >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.c >>>>>>> o >>>>>>> m >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40 >>>>> g >>>>> mail.c >>>>> om >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104 >>>>> % >>>>> 40gmai >>>>> l.com >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Kaiti >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993% >>>>> 4 >>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>> 0gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%4 >>>> 0gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 00:53:44 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 20:53:44 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> Message-ID: <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! I don't see why it's superior to the 5. Mike -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the Blind. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony Grima Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or DAISY: $9 Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full tutorial together and save! The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, and has a better camera. Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used in both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them easily. If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this update to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all the appendices. An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone reference card. Order at: http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html ****** To order any books, send payment to: NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge it: toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. Or order any of our books online at http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 00:54:51 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 20:54:51 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: References: <002301ce2074$cd744f50$685cedf0$@gmail.com> <8CFEE93347C9D6A-1AB8-1A53E@webmail-d136.sysops.aol.com> <004801ce20c2$11523eb0$33f6bc10$@panix.com>, Message-ID: <007801ce204e$892d2c20$9b878460$@gmail.com> The Colorado center, from what I understand, will let you tailor your schedule. If you don't need braille, you should be able to skip it. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 4:20 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America My Voc Rehab counselor loves the NFB, but she said that they couldn't afford to send me to LCB, and that LCB wouldn't be my best bet, because she said, (and Pam Allen agreed,) that I didn't need to go to the Braille classes, which are required. What the NFB centers need to do, is to offer a test. If someone is already proficient in Braille, they shouldn't have to be required to take the Braille courses. Then, they could just focus on the independence training. Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:13 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hi Miso, Overall, your councelor should offer you consumer choice. I know that's a hot topic now as we talked about it at the Ohio state convention last November. Talk to the CCB staff and get justification. Get specifics on their program as well as the junior blind program and outline what you could get in Colorado that isn't available in California. Also draw on your past experiences with Junior Blind since you have them and use those to explain why Colorado would be a better opportunity. Ultimately they should have given you this option since it's not like you're asking for them to fund you flying to Baltimore for a Journigan center program, or even Louisiana which would bring up higher plane costs, but hopefully once they have some justification they'll see what you're treally trying to get out of going to a center. Josh, I agree with Mike here. Voc Rehab councelors are not always very fond of the NFB, and also it takes a little pushing and prodding to get what you really need out of them. Look into the center, call and find out if it would really be a "waste of your time" or if it would be something truly beneficial for you. Don't just take the word of your councelor, who is sighted and probably has no idea what the centers really do anyway. On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > Joshua: > > Did you check out LCB for yourself? Might not your VR counselor be > prejudiced against NFB centers? > > Just a thought. > > Mike > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua > Lester > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 7:05 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hi Miso. > If you're proficient in Braille, the NFB trainig center wouldn't be > your best bet. > Although they do independence training, you have to attend Braille > classes, every day. > If you need independence training, you'd be better off getting the > skills from a VR rep. > That's what I'm doing, since my VR said that LCB would be a waste of > my time. > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Miso Kwak > [kwakmiso at aol.com] > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:20 AM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Thank you everyone for helpful answers. > To clarify, I was referring to the STEP not Davidson. > I lived in California barely 4 years, so I experienced JBA only twice. > I personally didn't like the atmosphere and philosophy very much > although not unbearable... > I think at this point, after reading feedbacks, I would prefer one of > the NFB centers over JBA. I think then the task to do is to get my > request to attend CCB justified. > I will contact staff at the CCB and see what I can do. > Thank you again. > Miso Kwak > > -----Original Message----- > From: Hannah Chadwick > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > > Sent: Wed, Mar 13, 2013 10:29 pm > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hi all, > So I just wanted to clarify since I've been to the STEP programs at > Junior Blind of America. There is STEP 1 and STEP 2, and they are both > summer programs that focus on helping young adults with job > interviewing skills, career research, and during STEP 2, the students > are placed on a work site. > They are expected to travel to and from work using public > transportation. > STEP 1 is 3 weeks and provides students with various info on the > topics mentioned above. STEP 2 is 7 weeks and students have the > opportunity to do an internship. > I would be glad to provide more info on the STEP programs, however, > I think that Miso is referring to the Independent living program that > Junior Blind also offers. > The Davidson Program for Independence, DPI is a residential program > for blind individuals who wish to learn skills such as orientation and > mobility, technology, cooking, Braille, and of course independent > living skills. > I did > not attend DPI so I don't know specifically what they do and how they > run. I did have friends who attended both the STEP programs as well as > DPI. > They > told me they learned a lot and they found it very helpful. I'm sure > there are pros and cons to attending any residential program. Please > don't hesitate to contact me off list if you have further questions. > All the best, Hannah > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon > Keith Biggs > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 9:48 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hello, > It depends where you are at in your living skills. I had been living > on my own for a few months before I went to the Step 2 program and I > found it only good for the few hours of work experience they provided. > They aren't very inventive when it comes to giving each person a > unique work environment, but you do get to do an internship. I did not > like however, the step 1 folks were mentored by the step 2 people for > both sessions and the step 2 people had to sit through classes the > step 1 participant's were taking. > Step 1 is a ton of classes on how to give an interview, talk about > yourself and act professionally dressing wise and so on. When I went > it was very lecture based and very little real-time experiences, but I > could tell some people really needed the learning. I could already > cook, clean, do laundry and had had a summer job the year before in a > much freer environment, so I found STEP oppressive, but I did learn > how to deal with authority in a mature way and even though I won't > repeat it, I am glad I went. > The campus is also very oddly situated, so it takes for ever to go > anywhere and they expect people to work around the schedule they set > up, so for example, I had a 2 hour commute on Para transit to and from > work and I had work to do at home. They were not very accommodating > for those of us who wanted to become work junkies, working till 10, > grabbing food, then waking up at 6 and leaving. They wanted you to > actually be around with other people and do tasks like instruct the > other students on how to use the computer for example. > Personally, the YES2 program in Washington state is more my cup of tee > than the STEP2 program, but I know plenty of other people who really > loved it and or who would really like it. > You can email me off list if you have any more questions. > brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Miso Kwak > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:55 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hello, > I would like to know if any of you have participated in the STEP > program offered by Junior Blind in California. > If you have the experience, could you comment on how it was? > Would you recommend it? > I am trying to select a summer program that will help me improve my > independent living skills (mobility, home management, etc) and realize > that there are a few different options available, so I just want to > hear from someone if anyone on the list has experience with Junior > Blind's STEP program. > Thank you. > Miso Kwak > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% > 40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sparklylicious%40g > mail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kwakmiso%40aol.com > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > a.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% > 40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Fri Mar 15 00:56:04 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 00:56:04 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: <007801ce204e$892d2c20$9b878460$@gmail.com> References: <002301ce2074$cd744f50$685cedf0$@gmail.com> <8CFEE93347C9D6A-1AB8-1A53E@webmail-d136.sysops.aol.com> <004801ce20c2$11523eb0$33f6bc10$@panix.com>, , <007801ce204e$892d2c20$9b878460$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hmmm? Why then does LCB require Braille for everyone then? If all NFB centers aren't the same, that's fine, but LCB needs to follow suit. Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of justin williams [justin.williams2 at gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 7:54 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America The Colorado center, from what I understand, will let you tailor your schedule. If you don't need braille, you should be able to skip it. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 4:20 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America My Voc Rehab counselor loves the NFB, but she said that they couldn't afford to send me to LCB, and that LCB wouldn't be my best bet, because she said, (and Pam Allen agreed,) that I didn't need to go to the Braille classes, which are required. What the NFB centers need to do, is to offer a test. If someone is already proficient in Braille, they shouldn't have to be required to take the Braille courses. Then, they could just focus on the independence training. Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:13 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hi Miso, Overall, your councelor should offer you consumer choice. I know that's a hot topic now as we talked about it at the Ohio state convention last November. Talk to the CCB staff and get justification. Get specifics on their program as well as the junior blind program and outline what you could get in Colorado that isn't available in California. Also draw on your past experiences with Junior Blind since you have them and use those to explain why Colorado would be a better opportunity. Ultimately they should have given you this option since it's not like you're asking for them to fund you flying to Baltimore for a Journigan center program, or even Louisiana which would bring up higher plane costs, but hopefully once they have some justification they'll see what you're treally trying to get out of going to a center. Josh, I agree with Mike here. Voc Rehab councelors are not always very fond of the NFB, and also it takes a little pushing and prodding to get what you really need out of them. Look into the center, call and find out if it would really be a "waste of your time" or if it would be something truly beneficial for you. Don't just take the word of your councelor, who is sighted and probably has no idea what the centers really do anyway. On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > Joshua: > > Did you check out LCB for yourself? Might not your VR counselor be > prejudiced against NFB centers? > > Just a thought. > > Mike > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua > Lester > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 7:05 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hi Miso. > If you're proficient in Braille, the NFB trainig center wouldn't be > your best bet. > Although they do independence training, you have to attend Braille > classes, every day. > If you need independence training, you'd be better off getting the > skills from a VR rep. > That's what I'm doing, since my VR said that LCB would be a waste of > my time. > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Miso Kwak > [kwakmiso at aol.com] > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:20 AM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Thank you everyone for helpful answers. > To clarify, I was referring to the STEP not Davidson. > I lived in California barely 4 years, so I experienced JBA only twice. > I personally didn't like the atmosphere and philosophy very much > although not unbearable... > I think at this point, after reading feedbacks, I would prefer one of > the NFB centers over JBA. I think then the task to do is to get my > request to attend CCB justified. > I will contact staff at the CCB and see what I can do. > Thank you again. > Miso Kwak > > -----Original Message----- > From: Hannah Chadwick > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > > Sent: Wed, Mar 13, 2013 10:29 pm > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hi all, > So I just wanted to clarify since I've been to the STEP programs at > Junior Blind of America. There is STEP 1 and STEP 2, and they are both > summer programs that focus on helping young adults with job > interviewing skills, career research, and during STEP 2, the students > are placed on a work site. > They are expected to travel to and from work using public > transportation. > STEP 1 is 3 weeks and provides students with various info on the > topics mentioned above. STEP 2 is 7 weeks and students have the > opportunity to do an internship. > I would be glad to provide more info on the STEP programs, however, > I think that Miso is referring to the Independent living program that > Junior Blind also offers. > The Davidson Program for Independence, DPI is a residential program > for blind individuals who wish to learn skills such as orientation and > mobility, technology, cooking, Braille, and of course independent > living skills. > I did > not attend DPI so I don't know specifically what they do and how they > run. I did have friends who attended both the STEP programs as well as > DPI. > They > told me they learned a lot and they found it very helpful. I'm sure > there are pros and cons to attending any residential program. Please > don't hesitate to contact me off list if you have further questions. > All the best, Hannah > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon > Keith Biggs > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 9:48 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hello, > It depends where you are at in your living skills. I had been living > on my own for a few months before I went to the Step 2 program and I > found it only good for the few hours of work experience they provided. > They aren't very inventive when it comes to giving each person a > unique work environment, but you do get to do an internship. I did not > like however, the step 1 folks were mentored by the step 2 people for > both sessions and the step 2 people had to sit through classes the > step 1 participant's were taking. > Step 1 is a ton of classes on how to give an interview, talk about > yourself and act professionally dressing wise and so on. When I went > it was very lecture based and very little real-time experiences, but I > could tell some people really needed the learning. I could already > cook, clean, do laundry and had had a summer job the year before in a > much freer environment, so I found STEP oppressive, but I did learn > how to deal with authority in a mature way and even though I won't > repeat it, I am glad I went. > The campus is also very oddly situated, so it takes for ever to go > anywhere and they expect people to work around the schedule they set > up, so for example, I had a 2 hour commute on Para transit to and from > work and I had work to do at home. They were not very accommodating > for those of us who wanted to become work junkies, working till 10, > grabbing food, then waking up at 6 and leaving. They wanted you to > actually be around with other people and do tasks like instruct the > other students on how to use the computer for example. > Personally, the YES2 program in Washington state is more my cup of tee > than the STEP2 program, but I know plenty of other people who really > loved it and or who would really like it. > You can email me off list if you have any more questions. > brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Miso Kwak > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:55 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hello, > I would like to know if any of you have participated in the STEP > program offered by Junior Blind in California. > If you have the experience, could you comment on how it was? > Would you recommend it? > I am trying to select a summer program that will help me improve my > independent living skills (mobility, home management, etc) and realize > that there are a few different options available, so I just want to > hear from someone if anyone on the list has experience with Junior > Blind's STEP program. > Thank you. > Miso Kwak > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% > 40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sparklylicious%40g > mail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kwakmiso%40aol.com > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > a.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% > 40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu From kwakmiso at aol.com Fri Mar 15 00:59:30 2013 From: kwakmiso at aol.com (Miso) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 17:59:30 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Message-ID: Thanj you for feedbacks. They are all helpful. I am not too worried about schedulem I am sure I can work things out as needed. From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 01:02:01 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 21:02:01 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: References: <002301ce2074$cd744f50$685cedf0$@gmail.com> <8CFEE93347C9D6A-1AB8-1A53E@webmail-d136.sysops.aol.com> <004801ce20c2$11523eb0$33f6bc10$@panix.com>, , <007801ce204e$892d2c20$9b878460$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <007a01ce204f$8981bf50$9c853df0$@gmail.com> Each one does things a little different. They're a little more liberal in their methods. That center is good for intermediate skilled and above. Not that they can't take you from point A to point z. I wouldn't need braille either, and would be better served working on other skills. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 8:56 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hmmm? Why then does LCB require Braille for everyone then? If all NFB centers aren't the same, that's fine, but LCB needs to follow suit. Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of justin williams [justin.williams2 at gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 7:54 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America The Colorado center, from what I understand, will let you tailor your schedule. If you don't need braille, you should be able to skip it. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 4:20 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America My Voc Rehab counselor loves the NFB, but she said that they couldn't afford to send me to LCB, and that LCB wouldn't be my best bet, because she said, (and Pam Allen agreed,) that I didn't need to go to the Braille classes, which are required. What the NFB centers need to do, is to offer a test. If someone is already proficient in Braille, they shouldn't have to be required to take the Braille courses. Then, they could just focus on the independence training. Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:13 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hi Miso, Overall, your councelor should offer you consumer choice. I know that's a hot topic now as we talked about it at the Ohio state convention last November. Talk to the CCB staff and get justification. Get specifics on their program as well as the junior blind program and outline what you could get in Colorado that isn't available in California. Also draw on your past experiences with Junior Blind since you have them and use those to explain why Colorado would be a better opportunity. Ultimately they should have given you this option since it's not like you're asking for them to fund you flying to Baltimore for a Journigan center program, or even Louisiana which would bring up higher plane costs, but hopefully once they have some justification they'll see what you're treally trying to get out of going to a center. Josh, I agree with Mike here. Voc Rehab councelors are not always very fond of the NFB, and also it takes a little pushing and prodding to get what you really need out of them. Look into the center, call and find out if it would really be a "waste of your time" or if it would be something truly beneficial for you. Don't just take the word of your councelor, who is sighted and probably has no idea what the centers really do anyway. On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > Joshua: > > Did you check out LCB for yourself? Might not your VR counselor be > prejudiced against NFB centers? > > Just a thought. > > Mike > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua > Lester > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 7:05 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hi Miso. > If you're proficient in Braille, the NFB trainig center wouldn't be > your best bet. > Although they do independence training, you have to attend Braille > classes, every day. > If you need independence training, you'd be better off getting the > skills from a VR rep. > That's what I'm doing, since my VR said that LCB would be a waste of > my time. > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Miso Kwak > [kwakmiso at aol.com] > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:20 AM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Thank you everyone for helpful answers. > To clarify, I was referring to the STEP not Davidson. > I lived in California barely 4 years, so I experienced JBA only twice. > I personally didn't like the atmosphere and philosophy very much > although not unbearable... > I think at this point, after reading feedbacks, I would prefer one of > the NFB centers over JBA. I think then the task to do is to get my > request to attend CCB justified. > I will contact staff at the CCB and see what I can do. > Thank you again. > Miso Kwak > > -----Original Message----- > From: Hannah Chadwick > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > > Sent: Wed, Mar 13, 2013 10:29 pm > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hi all, > So I just wanted to clarify since I've been to the STEP programs at > Junior Blind of America. There is STEP 1 and STEP 2, and they are both > summer programs that focus on helping young adults with job > interviewing skills, career research, and during STEP 2, the students > are placed on a work site. > They are expected to travel to and from work using public > transportation. > STEP 1 is 3 weeks and provides students with various info on the > topics mentioned above. STEP 2 is 7 weeks and students have the > opportunity to do an internship. > I would be glad to provide more info on the STEP programs, however, > I think that Miso is referring to the Independent living program that > Junior Blind also offers. > The Davidson Program for Independence, DPI is a residential program > for blind individuals who wish to learn skills such as orientation and > mobility, technology, cooking, Braille, and of course independent > living skills. > I did > not attend DPI so I don't know specifically what they do and how they > run. I did have friends who attended both the STEP programs as well as > DPI. > They > told me they learned a lot and they found it very helpful. I'm sure > there are pros and cons to attending any residential program. Please > don't hesitate to contact me off list if you have further questions. > All the best, Hannah > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon > Keith Biggs > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 9:48 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hello, > It depends where you are at in your living skills. I had been living > on my own for a few months before I went to the Step 2 program and I > found it only good for the few hours of work experience they provided. > They aren't very inventive when it comes to giving each person a > unique work environment, but you do get to do an internship. I did not > like however, the step 1 folks were mentored by the step 2 people for > both sessions and the step 2 people had to sit through classes the > step 1 participant's were taking. > Step 1 is a ton of classes on how to give an interview, talk about > yourself and act professionally dressing wise and so on. When I went > it was very lecture based and very little real-time experiences, but I > could tell some people really needed the learning. I could already > cook, clean, do laundry and had had a summer job the year before in a > much freer environment, so I found STEP oppressive, but I did learn > how to deal with authority in a mature way and even though I won't > repeat it, I am glad I went. > The campus is also very oddly situated, so it takes for ever to go > anywhere and they expect people to work around the schedule they set > up, so for example, I had a 2 hour commute on Para transit to and from > work and I had work to do at home. They were not very accommodating > for those of us who wanted to become work junkies, working till 10, > grabbing food, then waking up at 6 and leaving. They wanted you to > actually be around with other people and do tasks like instruct the > other students on how to use the computer for example. > Personally, the YES2 program in Washington state is more my cup of tee > than the STEP2 program, but I know plenty of other people who really > loved it and or who would really like it. > You can email me off list if you have any more questions. > brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Miso Kwak > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:55 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hello, > I would like to know if any of you have participated in the STEP > program offered by Junior Blind in California. > If you have the experience, could you comment on how it was? > Would you recommend it? > I am trying to select a summer program that will help me improve my > independent living skills (mobility, home management, etc) and realize > that there are a few different options available, so I just want to > hear from someone if anyone on the list has experience with Junior > Blind's STEP program. > Thank you. > Miso Kwak > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% > 40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sparklylicious%40g > mail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kwakmiso%40aol.com > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > a.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% > 40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 01:08:34 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 21:08:34 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: References: <002301ce2074$cd744f50$685cedf0$@gmail.com> <8CFEE93347C9D6A-1AB8-1A53E@webmail-d136.sysops.aol.com> <004801ce20c2$11523eb0$33f6bc10$@panix.com>, , <007801ce204e$892d2c20$9b878460$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <007c01ce2050$73f4ab10$5bde0130$@gmail.com> Keep in mind that LCB is the quintasential training center; the one that the other two are designed after. They have to do a little something to separate themselves from LCB. They have to bring a different flare and panache. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 8:56 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hmmm? Why then does LCB require Braille for everyone then? If all NFB centers aren't the same, that's fine, but LCB needs to follow suit. Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of justin williams [justin.williams2 at gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 7:54 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America The Colorado center, from what I understand, will let you tailor your schedule. If you don't need braille, you should be able to skip it. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 4:20 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America My Voc Rehab counselor loves the NFB, but she said that they couldn't afford to send me to LCB, and that LCB wouldn't be my best bet, because she said, (and Pam Allen agreed,) that I didn't need to go to the Braille classes, which are required. What the NFB centers need to do, is to offer a test. If someone is already proficient in Braille, they shouldn't have to be required to take the Braille courses. Then, they could just focus on the independence training. Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:13 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hi Miso, Overall, your councelor should offer you consumer choice. I know that's a hot topic now as we talked about it at the Ohio state convention last November. Talk to the CCB staff and get justification. Get specifics on their program as well as the junior blind program and outline what you could get in Colorado that isn't available in California. Also draw on your past experiences with Junior Blind since you have them and use those to explain why Colorado would be a better opportunity. Ultimately they should have given you this option since it's not like you're asking for them to fund you flying to Baltimore for a Journigan center program, or even Louisiana which would bring up higher plane costs, but hopefully once they have some justification they'll see what you're treally trying to get out of going to a center. Josh, I agree with Mike here. Voc Rehab councelors are not always very fond of the NFB, and also it takes a little pushing and prodding to get what you really need out of them. Look into the center, call and find out if it would really be a "waste of your time" or if it would be something truly beneficial for you. Don't just take the word of your councelor, who is sighted and probably has no idea what the centers really do anyway. On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > Joshua: > > Did you check out LCB for yourself? Might not your VR counselor be > prejudiced against NFB centers? > > Just a thought. > > Mike > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua > Lester > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 7:05 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hi Miso. > If you're proficient in Braille, the NFB trainig center wouldn't be > your best bet. > Although they do independence training, you have to attend Braille > classes, every day. > If you need independence training, you'd be better off getting the > skills from a VR rep. > That's what I'm doing, since my VR said that LCB would be a waste of > my time. > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Miso Kwak > [kwakmiso at aol.com] > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:20 AM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Thank you everyone for helpful answers. > To clarify, I was referring to the STEP not Davidson. > I lived in California barely 4 years, so I experienced JBA only twice. > I personally didn't like the atmosphere and philosophy very much > although not unbearable... > I think at this point, after reading feedbacks, I would prefer one of > the NFB centers over JBA. I think then the task to do is to get my > request to attend CCB justified. > I will contact staff at the CCB and see what I can do. > Thank you again. > Miso Kwak > > -----Original Message----- > From: Hannah Chadwick > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > > Sent: Wed, Mar 13, 2013 10:29 pm > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hi all, > So I just wanted to clarify since I've been to the STEP programs at > Junior Blind of America. There is STEP 1 and STEP 2, and they are both > summer programs that focus on helping young adults with job > interviewing skills, career research, and during STEP 2, the students > are placed on a work site. > They are expected to travel to and from work using public > transportation. > STEP 1 is 3 weeks and provides students with various info on the > topics mentioned above. STEP 2 is 7 weeks and students have the > opportunity to do an internship. > I would be glad to provide more info on the STEP programs, however, > I think that Miso is referring to the Independent living program that > Junior Blind also offers. > The Davidson Program for Independence, DPI is a residential program > for blind individuals who wish to learn skills such as orientation and > mobility, technology, cooking, Braille, and of course independent > living skills. > I did > not attend DPI so I don't know specifically what they do and how they > run. I did have friends who attended both the STEP programs as well as > DPI. > They > told me they learned a lot and they found it very helpful. I'm sure > there are pros and cons to attending any residential program. Please > don't hesitate to contact me off list if you have further questions. > All the best, Hannah > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon > Keith Biggs > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 9:48 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hello, > It depends where you are at in your living skills. I had been living > on my own for a few months before I went to the Step 2 program and I > found it only good for the few hours of work experience they provided. > They aren't very inventive when it comes to giving each person a > unique work environment, but you do get to do an internship. I did not > like however, the step 1 folks were mentored by the step 2 people for > both sessions and the step 2 people had to sit through classes the > step 1 participant's were taking. > Step 1 is a ton of classes on how to give an interview, talk about > yourself and act professionally dressing wise and so on. When I went > it was very lecture based and very little real-time experiences, but I > could tell some people really needed the learning. I could already > cook, clean, do laundry and had had a summer job the year before in a > much freer environment, so I found STEP oppressive, but I did learn > how to deal with authority in a mature way and even though I won't > repeat it, I am glad I went. > The campus is also very oddly situated, so it takes for ever to go > anywhere and they expect people to work around the schedule they set > up, so for example, I had a 2 hour commute on Para transit to and from > work and I had work to do at home. They were not very accommodating > for those of us who wanted to become work junkies, working till 10, > grabbing food, then waking up at 6 and leaving. They wanted you to > actually be around with other people and do tasks like instruct the > other students on how to use the computer for example. > Personally, the YES2 program in Washington state is more my cup of tee > than the STEP2 program, but I know plenty of other people who really > loved it and or who would really like it. > You can email me off list if you have any more questions. > brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Miso Kwak > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:55 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hello, > I would like to know if any of you have participated in the STEP > program offered by Junior Blind in California. > If you have the experience, could you comment on how it was? > Would you recommend it? > I am trying to select a summer program that will help me improve my > independent living skills (mobility, home management, etc) and realize > that there are a few different options available, so I just want to > hear from someone if anyone on the list has experience with Junior > Blind's STEP program. > Thank you. > Miso Kwak > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% > 40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sparklylicious%40g > mail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kwakmiso%40aol.com > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > a.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% > 40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Fri Mar 15 01:10:19 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 21:10:19 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: References: <002301ce2074$cd744f50$685cedf0$@gmail.com><8CFEE93347C9D6A-1AB8-1A53E@webmail-d136.sysops.aol.com><004801ce20c2$11523eb0$33f6bc10$@panix.com>, , <007801ce204e$892d2c20$9b878460$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi Josh, I believe all nfb centers may be flexible. However, LCB is more ridgid. I heard they have more projects and challenge activities students have to do. Even at LCB though, I know you can take a class a short time; once you meet the requirements of the class, you can do a project and finish the class freeing more time for other classes. All NFB centers are not the same; different territory of the states; different challenge activities and a slight variation on the graduation projects. For instance, Colorado has more activities with snow such as skiing because of the climate. LCB, as you know, is in hot Louisiana near New Orleans. They go to Marti Gra and I think do activities for Fat Tuesday; I think they may participate in some parade as well. Blind Inc has an ESL program for new immigrants who need to learn English and the other centers do not. NFB centers have more things in common than they do differences. But there are differences and perhaps the class schedule is one difference. If LCB isn't going to meet your needs, that is okay. I know what you mean about a waste of time in a class that you feel you do not need. However, talk to the center about it to base your decision on facts, not what your counselor says. Ashley -----Original Message----- From: Joshua Lester Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 8:56 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hmmm? Why then does LCB require Braille for everyone then? If all NFB centers aren't the same, that's fine, but LCB needs to follow suit. Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of justin williams [justin.williams2 at gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 7:54 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America The Colorado center, from what I understand, will let you tailor your schedule. If you don't need braille, you should be able to skip it. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 4:20 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America My Voc Rehab counselor loves the NFB, but she said that they couldn't afford to send me to LCB, and that LCB wouldn't be my best bet, because she said, (and Pam Allen agreed,) that I didn't need to go to the Braille classes, which are required. What the NFB centers need to do, is to offer a test. If someone is already proficient in Braille, they shouldn't have to be required to take the Braille courses. Then, they could just focus on the independence training. Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:13 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hi Miso, Overall, your councelor should offer you consumer choice. I know that's a hot topic now as we talked about it at the Ohio state convention last November. Talk to the CCB staff and get justification. Get specifics on their program as well as the junior blind program and outline what you could get in Colorado that isn't available in California. Also draw on your past experiences with Junior Blind since you have them and use those to explain why Colorado would be a better opportunity. Ultimately they should have given you this option since it's not like you're asking for them to fund you flying to Baltimore for a Journigan center program, or even Louisiana which would bring up higher plane costs, but hopefully once they have some justification they'll see what you're treally trying to get out of going to a center. Josh, I agree with Mike here. Voc Rehab councelors are not always very fond of the NFB, and also it takes a little pushing and prodding to get what you really need out of them. Look into the center, call and find out if it would really be a "waste of your time" or if it would be something truly beneficial for you. Don't just take the word of your councelor, who is sighted and probably has no idea what the centers really do anyway. On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > Joshua: > > Did you check out LCB for yourself? Might not your VR counselor be > prejudiced against NFB centers? > > Just a thought. > > Mike > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua > Lester > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 7:05 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hi Miso. > If you're proficient in Braille, the NFB trainig center wouldn't be > your best bet. > Although they do independence training, you have to attend Braille > classes, every day. > If you need independence training, you'd be better off getting the > skills from a VR rep. > That's what I'm doing, since my VR said that LCB would be a waste of > my time. > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Miso Kwak > [kwakmiso at aol.com] > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:20 AM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Thank you everyone for helpful answers. > To clarify, I was referring to the STEP not Davidson. > I lived in California barely 4 years, so I experienced JBA only twice. > I personally didn't like the atmosphere and philosophy very much > although not unbearable... > I think at this point, after reading feedbacks, I would prefer one of > the NFB centers over JBA. I think then the task to do is to get my > request to attend CCB justified. > I will contact staff at the CCB and see what I can do. > Thank you again. > Miso Kwak > > -----Original Message----- > From: Hannah Chadwick > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > > Sent: Wed, Mar 13, 2013 10:29 pm > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hi all, > So I just wanted to clarify since I've been to the STEP programs at > Junior Blind of America. There is STEP 1 and STEP 2, and they are both > summer programs that focus on helping young adults with job > interviewing skills, career research, and during STEP 2, the students > are placed on a work site. > They are expected to travel to and from work using public > transportation. > STEP 1 is 3 weeks and provides students with various info on the > topics mentioned above. STEP 2 is 7 weeks and students have the > opportunity to do an internship. > I would be glad to provide more info on the STEP programs, however, > I think that Miso is referring to the Independent living program that > Junior Blind also offers. > The Davidson Program for Independence, DPI is a residential program > for blind individuals who wish to learn skills such as orientation and > mobility, technology, cooking, Braille, and of course independent > living skills. > I did > not attend DPI so I don't know specifically what they do and how they > run. I did have friends who attended both the STEP programs as well as > DPI. > They > told me they learned a lot and they found it very helpful. I'm sure > there are pros and cons to attending any residential program. Please > don't hesitate to contact me off list if you have further questions. > All the best, Hannah > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon > Keith Biggs > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 9:48 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hello, > It depends where you are at in your living skills. I had been living > on my own for a few months before I went to the Step 2 program and I > found it only good for the few hours of work experience they provided. > They aren't very inventive when it comes to giving each person a > unique work environment, but you do get to do an internship. I did not > like however, the step 1 folks were mentored by the step 2 people for > both sessions and the step 2 people had to sit through classes the > step 1 participant's were taking. > Step 1 is a ton of classes on how to give an interview, talk about > yourself and act professionally dressing wise and so on. When I went > it was very lecture based and very little real-time experiences, but I > could tell some people really needed the learning. I could already > cook, clean, do laundry and had had a summer job the year before in a > much freer environment, so I found STEP oppressive, but I did learn > how to deal with authority in a mature way and even though I won't > repeat it, I am glad I went. > The campus is also very oddly situated, so it takes for ever to go > anywhere and they expect people to work around the schedule they set > up, so for example, I had a 2 hour commute on Para transit to and from > work and I had work to do at home. They were not very accommodating > for those of us who wanted to become work junkies, working till 10, > grabbing food, then waking up at 6 and leaving. They wanted you to > actually be around with other people and do tasks like instruct the > other students on how to use the computer for example. > Personally, the YES2 program in Washington state is more my cup of tee > than the STEP2 program, but I know plenty of other people who really > loved it and or who would really like it. > You can email me off list if you have any more questions. > brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Miso Kwak > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:55 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hello, > I would like to know if any of you have participated in the STEP > program offered by Junior Blind in California. > If you have the experience, could you comment on how it was? > Would you recommend it? > I am trying to select a summer program that will help me improve my > independent living skills (mobility, home management, etc) and realize > that there are a few different options available, so I just want to > hear from someone if anyone on the list has experience with Junior > Blind's STEP program. > Thank you. > Miso Kwak > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% > 40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sparklylicious%40g > mail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kwakmiso%40aol.com > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > a.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% > 40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From arielle71 at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 01:11:54 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 19:11:54 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: <007c01ce2050$73f4ab10$5bde0130$@gmail.com> References: <002301ce2074$cd744f50$685cedf0$@gmail.com> <8CFEE93347C9D6A-1AB8-1A53E@webmail-d136.sysops.aol.com> <004801ce20c2$11523eb0$33f6bc10$@panix.com> <007801ce204e$892d2c20$9b878460$@gmail.com> <007c01ce2050$73f4ab10$5bde0130$@gmail.com> Message-ID: As I mentioned, I went to LCB and they adjusted my Braille down from daily to once per week at my request, after Mr. Whittle (Braille instructor) and I both agreed that my Braille speed was good and the only Braille area in which I was weak was slate and stylus. I think any of the centers will provide such accommodation if you as the student make a strong case for it and if the instructors and center director are on board. Staff at CCB might be a little more liberal than LCB in deciding when someone should be allowed to waive a class, but any of the centers will work with you. Arielle On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: > Keep in mind that LCB is the quintasential training center; the one that > the > other two are designed after. They have to do a little something to > separate themselves from LCB. They have to bring a different flare and > panache. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 8:56 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hmmm? > Why then does LCB require Braille for everyone then? > If all NFB centers aren't the same, that's fine, but LCB needs to follow > suit. > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of justin williams > [justin.williams2 at gmail.com] > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 7:54 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > The Colorado center, from what I understand, will let you tailor your > schedule. If you don't need braille, you should be able to skip it. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 4:20 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > My Voc Rehab counselor loves the NFB, but she said that they couldn't > afford > to send me to LCB, and that LCB wouldn't be my best bet, because she said, > (and Pam Allen agreed,) that I didn't need to go to the Braille classes, > which are required. > What the NFB centers need to do, is to offer a test. > If someone is already proficient in Braille, they shouldn't have to be > required to take the Braille courses. > Then, they could just focus on the independence training. > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton > [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:13 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hi Miso, > > Overall, your councelor should offer you consumer choice. I know that's a > hot topic now as we talked about it at the Ohio state convention last > November. Talk to the CCB staff and get justification. Get specifics on > their program as well as the junior blind program and outline what you > could > get in Colorado that isn't available in California. Also draw on your past > experiences with Junior Blind since you have them and use those to explain > why Colorado would be a better opportunity. Ultimately they should have > given you this option since it's not like you're asking for them to fund > you > flying to Baltimore for a Journigan center program, or even Louisiana which > would bring up higher plane costs, but hopefully once they have some > justification they'll see what you're treally trying to get out of going to > a center. > > Josh, I agree with Mike here. Voc Rehab councelors are not always very > fond > of the NFB, and also it takes a little pushing and prodding to get what you > really need out of them. Look into the center, call and find out if it > would really be a "waste of your time" or if it would be something truly > beneficial for you. Don't just take the word of your councelor, who is > sighted and probably has no idea what the centers really do anyway. > > On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >> Joshua: >> >> Did you check out LCB for yourself? Might not your VR counselor be >> prejudiced against NFB centers? >> >> Just a thought. >> >> Mike >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua >> Lester >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 7:05 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America >> >> Hi Miso. >> If you're proficient in Braille, the NFB trainig center wouldn't be >> your best bet. >> Although they do independence training, you have to attend Braille >> classes, every day. >> If you need independence training, you'd be better off getting the >> skills from a VR rep. >> That's what I'm doing, since my VR said that LCB would be a waste of >> my time. >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Miso Kwak >> [kwakmiso at aol.com] >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:20 AM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America >> >> Thank you everyone for helpful answers. >> To clarify, I was referring to the STEP not Davidson. >> I lived in California barely 4 years, so I experienced JBA only twice. >> I personally didn't like the atmosphere and philosophy very much >> although not unbearable... >> I think at this point, after reading feedbacks, I would prefer one of >> the NFB centers over JBA. I think then the task to do is to get my >> request to attend CCB justified. >> I will contact staff at the CCB and see what I can do. >> Thank you again. >> Miso Kwak >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Hannah Chadwick >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> >> Sent: Wed, Mar 13, 2013 10:29 pm >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America >> >> Hi all, >> So I just wanted to clarify since I've been to the STEP programs at >> Junior Blind of America. There is STEP 1 and STEP 2, and they are both >> summer programs that focus on helping young adults with job >> interviewing skills, career research, and during STEP 2, the students >> are placed on a work site. >> They are expected to travel to and from work using public >> transportation. >> STEP 1 is 3 weeks and provides students with various info on the >> topics mentioned above. STEP 2 is 7 weeks and students have the >> opportunity to do an internship. >> I would be glad to provide more info on the STEP programs, however, >> I think that Miso is referring to the Independent living program that >> Junior Blind also offers. >> The Davidson Program for Independence, DPI is a residential program >> for blind individuals who wish to learn skills such as orientation and >> mobility, technology, cooking, Braille, and of course independent >> living skills. >> I did >> not attend DPI so I don't know specifically what they do and how they >> run. I did have friends who attended both the STEP programs as well as >> DPI. >> They >> told me they learned a lot and they found it very helpful. I'm sure >> there are pros and cons to attending any residential program. Please >> don't hesitate to contact me off list if you have further questions. >> All the best, Hannah >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >> Keith Biggs >> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 9:48 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America >> >> Hello, >> It depends where you are at in your living skills. I had been living >> on my own for a few months before I went to the Step 2 program and I >> found it only good for the few hours of work experience they provided. >> They aren't very inventive when it comes to giving each person a >> unique work environment, but you do get to do an internship. I did not >> like however, the step 1 folks were mentored by the step 2 people for >> both sessions and the step 2 people had to sit through classes the >> step 1 participant's were taking. >> Step 1 is a ton of classes on how to give an interview, talk about >> yourself and act professionally dressing wise and so on. When I went >> it was very lecture based and very little real-time experiences, but I >> could tell some people really needed the learning. I could already >> cook, clean, do laundry and had had a summer job the year before in a >> much freer environment, so I found STEP oppressive, but I did learn >> how to deal with authority in a mature way and even though I won't >> repeat it, I am glad I went. >> The campus is also very oddly situated, so it takes for ever to go >> anywhere and they expect people to work around the schedule they set >> up, so for example, I had a 2 hour commute on Para transit to and from >> work and I had work to do at home. They were not very accommodating >> for those of us who wanted to become work junkies, working till 10, >> grabbing food, then waking up at 6 and leaving. They wanted you to >> actually be around with other people and do tasks like instruct the >> other students on how to use the computer for example. >> Personally, the YES2 program in Washington state is more my cup of tee >> than the STEP2 program, but I know plenty of other people who really >> loved it and or who would really like it. >> You can email me off list if you have any more questions. >> brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com >> Thanks, >> >> Brandon Keith Biggs >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Miso Kwak >> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:55 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America >> >> Hello, >> I would like to know if any of you have participated in the STEP >> program offered by Junior Blind in California. >> If you have the experience, could you comment on how it was? >> Would you recommend it? >> I am trying to select a summer program that will help me improve my >> independent living skills (mobility, home management, etc) and realize >> that there are a few different options available, so I just want to >> hear from someone if anyone on the list has experience with Junior >> Blind's STEP program. >> Thank you. >> Miso Kwak >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% >> 40gmai >> l.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sparklylicious%40g >> mail.c >> om >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kwakmiso%40aol.com >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >> a.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% >> 40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 01:33:38 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 21:33:38 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: References: <002301ce2074$cd744f50$685cedf0$@gmail.com><8CFEE93347C9D6A-1AB8-1A53E@webmail-d136.sysops.aol.com><004801ce20c2$11523eb0$33f6bc10$@panix.com>, , <007801ce204e$892d2c20$9b878460$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <00a201ce2053$f46335c0$dd29a140$@gmail.com> Well that's good. Happy to hear all that from you folks. When I talked to L C B, they were seemingly unyielding. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley Bramlett Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 9:10 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hi Josh, I believe all nfb centers may be flexible. However, LCB is more ridgid. I heard they have more projects and challenge activities students have to do. Even at LCB though, I know you can take a class a short time; once you meet the requirements of the class, you can do a project and finish the class freeing more time for other classes. All NFB centers are not the same; different territory of the states; different challenge activities and a slight variation on the graduation projects. For instance, Colorado has more activities with snow such as skiing because of the climate. LCB, as you know, is in hot Louisiana near New Orleans. They go to Marti Gra and I think do activities for Fat Tuesday; I think they may participate in some parade as well. Blind Inc has an ESL program for new immigrants who need to learn English and the other centers do not. NFB centers have more things in common than they do differences. But there are differences and perhaps the class schedule is one difference. If LCB isn't going to meet your needs, that is okay. I know what you mean about a waste of time in a class that you feel you do not need. However, talk to the center about it to base your decision on facts, not what your counselor says. Ashley -----Original Message----- From: Joshua Lester Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 8:56 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hmmm? Why then does LCB require Braille for everyone then? If all NFB centers aren't the same, that's fine, but LCB needs to follow suit. Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of justin williams [justin.williams2 at gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 7:54 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America The Colorado center, from what I understand, will let you tailor your schedule. If you don't need braille, you should be able to skip it. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 4:20 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America My Voc Rehab counselor loves the NFB, but she said that they couldn't afford to send me to LCB, and that LCB wouldn't be my best bet, because she said, (and Pam Allen agreed,) that I didn't need to go to the Braille classes, which are required. What the NFB centers need to do, is to offer a test. If someone is already proficient in Braille, they shouldn't have to be required to take the Braille courses. Then, they could just focus on the independence training. Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:13 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America Hi Miso, Overall, your councelor should offer you consumer choice. I know that's a hot topic now as we talked about it at the Ohio state convention last November. Talk to the CCB staff and get justification. Get specifics on their program as well as the junior blind program and outline what you could get in Colorado that isn't available in California. Also draw on your past experiences with Junior Blind since you have them and use those to explain why Colorado would be a better opportunity. Ultimately they should have given you this option since it's not like you're asking for them to fund you flying to Baltimore for a Journigan center program, or even Louisiana which would bring up higher plane costs, but hopefully once they have some justification they'll see what you're treally trying to get out of going to a center. Josh, I agree with Mike here. Voc Rehab councelors are not always very fond of the NFB, and also it takes a little pushing and prodding to get what you really need out of them. Look into the center, call and find out if it would really be a "waste of your time" or if it would be something truly beneficial for you. Don't just take the word of your councelor, who is sighted and probably has no idea what the centers really do anyway. On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > Joshua: > > Did you check out LCB for yourself? Might not your VR counselor be > prejudiced against NFB centers? > > Just a thought. > > Mike > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua > Lester > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 7:05 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hi Miso. > If you're proficient in Braille, the NFB trainig center wouldn't be > your best bet. > Although they do independence training, you have to attend Braille > classes, every day. > If you need independence training, you'd be better off getting the > skills from a VR rep. > That's what I'm doing, since my VR said that LCB would be a waste of > my time. > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Miso Kwak > [kwakmiso at aol.com] > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:20 AM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Thank you everyone for helpful answers. > To clarify, I was referring to the STEP not Davidson. > I lived in California barely 4 years, so I experienced JBA only twice. > I personally didn't like the atmosphere and philosophy very much > although not unbearable... > I think at this point, after reading feedbacks, I would prefer one of > the NFB centers over JBA. I think then the task to do is to get my > request to attend CCB justified. > I will contact staff at the CCB and see what I can do. > Thank you again. > Miso Kwak > > -----Original Message----- > From: Hannah Chadwick > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > > Sent: Wed, Mar 13, 2013 10:29 pm > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hi all, > So I just wanted to clarify since I've been to the STEP programs at > Junior Blind of America. There is STEP 1 and STEP 2, and they are both > summer programs that focus on helping young adults with job > interviewing skills, career research, and during STEP 2, the students > are placed on a work site. > They are expected to travel to and from work using public > transportation. > STEP 1 is 3 weeks and provides students with various info on the > topics mentioned above. STEP 2 is 7 weeks and students have the > opportunity to do an internship. > I would be glad to provide more info on the STEP programs, however, > I think that Miso is referring to the Independent living program that > Junior Blind also offers. > The Davidson Program for Independence, DPI is a residential program > for blind individuals who wish to learn skills such as orientation and > mobility, technology, cooking, Braille, and of course independent > living skills. > I did > not attend DPI so I don't know specifically what they do and how they > run. I did have friends who attended both the STEP programs as well as > DPI. > They > told me they learned a lot and they found it very helpful. I'm sure > there are pros and cons to attending any residential program. Please > don't hesitate to contact me off list if you have further questions. > All the best, Hannah > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon > Keith Biggs > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 9:48 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hello, > It depends where you are at in your living skills. I had been living > on my own for a few months before I went to the Step 2 program and I > found it only good for the few hours of work experience they provided. > They aren't very inventive when it comes to giving each person a > unique work environment, but you do get to do an internship. I did not > like however, the step 1 folks were mentored by the step 2 people for > both sessions and the step 2 people had to sit through classes the > step 1 participant's were taking. > Step 1 is a ton of classes on how to give an interview, talk about > yourself and act professionally dressing wise and so on. When I went > it was very lecture based and very little real-time experiences, but I > could tell some people really needed the learning. I could already > cook, clean, do laundry and had had a summer job the year before in a > much freer environment, so I found STEP oppressive, but I did learn > how to deal with authority in a mature way and even though I won't > repeat it, I am glad I went. > The campus is also very oddly situated, so it takes for ever to go > anywhere and they expect people to work around the schedule they set > up, so for example, I had a 2 hour commute on Para transit to and from > work and I had work to do at home. They were not very accommodating > for those of us who wanted to become work junkies, working till 10, > grabbing food, then waking up at 6 and leaving. They wanted you to > actually be around with other people and do tasks like instruct the > other students on how to use the computer for example. > Personally, the YES2 program in Washington state is more my cup of tee > than the STEP2 program, but I know plenty of other people who really > loved it and or who would really like it. > You can email me off list if you have any more questions. > brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Miso Kwak > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:55 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > > Hello, > I would like to know if any of you have participated in the STEP > program offered by Junior Blind in California. > If you have the experience, could you comment on how it was? > Would you recommend it? > I am trying to select a summer program that will help me improve my > independent living skills (mobility, home management, etc) and realize > that there are a few different options available, so I just want to > hear from someone if anyone on the list has experience with Junior > Blind's STEP program. > Thank you. > Miso Kwak > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% > 40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sparklylicious%40g > mail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kwakmiso%40aol.com > > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > a.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% > 40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink. net _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From dandrews at visi.com Fri Mar 15 01:52:27 2013 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 20:52:27 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] {Disarmed} NBP, At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! Message-ID: > >NBP logo > > >[] > > >Image: Blue flames and the words iOS6 Updates >iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users >by Anna Dresner >In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or DAISY: $9 > > > >Get the >full >iPhone tutorial - or get both >this >book and the full tutorial together and save! > > The iPhone 5 - which was introduced last > September - is faster than previous iPhones, > can take advantage of the faster 4G network, and has a better camera. > >Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, >this book is a supplement that you can use >alongside our >Getting >Started with the iPhone and iOS5 for Blind >Users. The same section titles are used in both >this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them easily. > >If you already know the basics of using the >iPhone, you can use this update to review what's >new. This book includes updated versions of the >braille display and Bluetooth commands and >revised versions of all the appendices. An >additional appendix that lists all the apps >referred to in this book, along with links you >can use to find them in the iTunes store. These >materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone reference card. > >Read the full table of contents - and place an order - at: >http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html > > >See >all of our iPhone books and tutorials! >****** >To order any books, send payment to: >NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 >Or call and charge it: toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. >Or order any of our books online at >http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. > >Forward >to a friend > > >NBP logo > > > > > > >Copyright © 2013 National Braille Press, All rights reserved. > >National Braille Press >88 Saint Stephen St >Boston, MA 02115 > >Add >us to your address book > > >www.nbp.org > > > Connect with us! > >Facebook logo > >Twitter logo > > >Linkedin logo > >YouTube logo > > >[] > > > >Email Marketing Powered by MailChimp > From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 02:08:45 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 22:08:45 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: References: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com> <-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid> <004b01ce20c5$5a44fd80$0ecef880$@panix.com> <003901ce200e$9b1504c0$d13f0e40$@gmail.com> <004801ce2010$a9d558a0$fd8009e0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Josh, I don't believe I was on the list at the time of those posts, but besides that, in my last post I mentioned my reasoning behind using the term visually impaired. Your logic works for you and is accurate; you are totally blind so there is no question about terminology. However, for those of us with some functional sight visually impaired is a more accurate descriptor (see my last email for examples why). I'm sure most people are smart enough to separate the tow meanings of the word vision; obviously sight has no bearing on one's ability to form a vision of what they want to do or become in the future, but they are two separate things. All I'm asking is for a little more consideration of the perspectives of people with varying degrees of sight and the reasons for why they choose to do the things they do. Just because these choices and their needs might be different from someone who is totally blind that doesn't make them wrong. Arielle, I may not be the best person to shed light on this as I use my telescopic as a cane too, but I went to a Voc Rehab program for my state with a girl who had an identity cane but visually didn't need to use it much. She would carry it with her to let people know, but her vision was stable and good enough that she could read slightly enlarged print, (and I believe she got a provisional drivers license she can use as long as it's not dark or too bright outside too). I guess it goes back to just letting people know; she was very willing to discuss her vision with people if asked and identified herself as a visually impaired person, but functionally she had enough sight where using a cane in most circumstances would have just been something she didn't need. On 3/14/13, Arielle Silverman wrote: > Hi all, > I guess I'm not quite getting what the advantage is of an ID cane over > a regular one? With either cane, you are telling the world that you > are blind (or visually impaired or whatever term you want to use). The > ID cane gives you less tactile info than the regular one does. I > totally understand that sometimes you might not need a cane to get > around, but if you're going to use an ID cane anyway, why not just use > the regular one and get a little extra tactile info too? It might not > be necessary but it can't possibly hurt you to use a regular cane > instead of an ID cane. Is there some way an ID cane is more convenient > to use than a regular white cane? > I agree that sometimes it is more convenient to not use a cane at all > because it keeps your hands free. In those cases maybe wearing some > kind of ID symbol would better help with making sure others around you > know you are blind. However I think those situations where you really > need both of your hands are pretty unusual. > Arielle > > On 3/14/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >> Kaiti: >> Did you read my posts about "Visually Impaired, Vs. Blind?" >> Basicly for me, I'd rather refer to myself as blind, (I'm totally blind,) >> but I'm not "visually impaired." >> There's a difference between sight, and vision. >> I've talked about that alot on these lists. >> Sight, is natural, (what we lack,) but vision is inward. >> If we didn't have vision, there would be no NFB. >> Vision is like this. >> "Where do you see yourself, in the next 5 years?" >> Using that logic, our vision isn't impaired, but our sight is. >> Let's just refer to ourselves as blind and get it over with. >> Good point Mike! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:49 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >> >> Absolutely on that front. There is no point of interacting with >> people under false pretenses as if you were sighted... If one is >> worried about social situations due to people thinking they're blind, >> then they might want to think about the possible awkward situation of >> a friend suddenly finding out about something that important that was >> there all along and kept from them. >> >> On 3/14/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>> Hi, >>> >>> Mike, that is not how it works at all and I really have a problem with >>> the incinuation that people who identify themselves as visually >>> impaired use that title to get special treatment. I use my functional >>> vision as well as a cane when I feel it appropriate, and receive >>> accomodations such as braille, electronic format for textbooks, and >>> assistive technology that I need. I do what I can independently and >>> ask for sighted assistance when I need something read or would like a >>> little clarification on something visual that I cannot see. These are >>> not "special perks" as you put it. My personal choice to use VI over >>> blind is that it makes things easier for people to understand. I have >>> had some situations when I have used the term blind and people assume >>> I can't see anything at all. This has lead to well-intended but >>> unnecessary superhelping and other consequences. For me it's much >>> simpler to say I'm visually impaired, indicating that I have some >>> functional vision and giving sighted people a slightly clearer idea >>> about me. The NFB recognizes these terms "blind, legally blind, >>> visually impaired," as interchangeable, so it all comes down to >>> personal choice. There is nothing that says one term is preferential >>> over the other and has to be used by everyone. Afterall, visual >>> impairment is a continuum with varying degrees of blindness, so for >>> some visually impaired is a more accurate descriptor. >>> >>> I think that even if the original poster is slightly preoccupied with >>> the image of being blind then getting an identity cane might be the >>> first step in correcting that. The more people see it, the more he'll >>> have to answer questions about himself and his visual impairment and >>> get used to it. Not all, but some visually impaired people have to >>> psychologically ease into being comfortable with identifying >>> themselves in this way and that shouldn't be held against them if >>> that's what they have to do. Heck, I've even heard partially sighted >>> people speak at state conventions about how they grew more comfortable >>> with their blindness by beginning to associate themselves with the >>> NFB, so it sounds like the poster may be on the right track. Again, >>> we don't really know the situation; any one of us could be reading >>> something that the poster didn't intentionally mean because that is a >>> side-effect of electronic messages... things often get misconstrued. >>> He never said he didn't want to be identified as blind in order to >>> gain priveledges; he just wanted something to let people know, but he >>> still has enough functional vision to walk without a cane. I think >>> the wording about walking perfectly may be a little presumptuous, (no >>> one, blind or sighted, walks exactly perfectly because it's >>> anatomically impossible), but like I said this might be a good step in >>> putting blindness/visual impairment/whatever you'd like to call it >>> into perspective. >>> >>> >>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>> Just use whatever works. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>> Dudley >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:29 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>> >>>> I guess I just don't see the problem with allowing people to interact >>>> with >>>> you as though you are sighted. If for some reason, you can't see that >>>> interaction, then tell them you are blind. >>>> >>>> >>>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>> Our fine line is that we are trying to predict, and or control >>>>> people's reactions. If you do not have a cane with you while walking >>>>> in our country, people probably will not know you are blind. The >>>>> original poster has every right to not use a cane and rely on >>>>> functional vision. However, the reactions of people can't be >>>>> controlled. If they don't know he is blind, they will react to him as >>>>> if he is sighted. It is his choice. In America, I don't think we >>>>> have a way to not carry a cane, but have everyone know that you are >>>>> blind. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>>> Dudley >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:43 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>> I'm going to stick my "oar in" as they say. Kaiti and Mike, I >>>>> think there may be a bit of misunderstanding. I think what is sought >>>>> by the original poster on this thread is an identification symbol, >>>>> something to say "I am blind" that is not as bulky as a cane. I >>>>> definitely disagree with this. What I do not disagree with is using >>>>> one's functional vision when you have it and, if that be your desire, >>>>> to not use a cane if you don't need it. >>>>> What I do disagree with is the concept of wanting the "you poor blind >>>>> person" perks of blindness without carrying a cane, as the original >>>>> poster seems to want. There is a fine line that I think is lost in the >>>> grey here. >>>>> ALeeha >>>>> >>>>> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>> Kaiti: >>>>>> >>>>>> We shall have to agree to disagree. I see no reason to identify as >>>>>> "visually impaired" unless one wishes special help or perks. Why not >>>>>> just be blind and have done with the matter? Much simpler. >>>>>> >>>>>> In fact, I know a guy who was nearly totally blind for many years due >>>>>> to an explosion. He got a good deal of sight back (he's lost it again >>>>>> now) and used his sight to look around, traveling with a cane as he >>>>>> always did; thus, he got the benefit of sight plus didn't have to >>>>>> worry about when he should or should not use a cane, whether to >>>>>> identify etc. etc. >>>>>> >>>>>> Peace! >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>>>>> Shelton >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:32 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike, >>>>>> >>>>>> I have to disagree here. As one of those partials who elects when to >>>>>> use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you >>>>>> may not be considering. Electing when and when not to use a cane is >>>>>> not always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; >>>>>> some of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. >>>>>> Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas >>>>>> without a cane some times should give up their right to identify >>>>>> themself as a visually impaired person. E.G, I would never do any >>>>>> type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a >>>>>> street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see >>>>>> like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under >>>>>> normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria >>>>>> right across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm >>>>>> coming right back I don't always choose to actively use it. My >>>>>> choice to not use a cane in this instance does not mean I should >>>>>> forfit my right to identify myself as a visually impaired person >>>>>> because I am; the use of the cane does not change my inability to >>>>>> read print or to see great distances and it does not change the fact >>>>>> that I am legally blind and am identified that way. It also doesn't >>>>>> change the level of security I have with my blindness; if a person >>>>>> refuses to use a cane or fights against it because they're afraid of >>>>>> the social implications then that is insecurity, but if they're >>>>>> visually having a good day and want to run a quick errand that's in a >>>>>> very familiar area with minimal travel or risk of injury and they're >>>>>> confident in their ability to use audio cues and the vision they have >>>>>> then that is their choice and doesn't make them insecure with >>>>>> themself or their blindness. As long as they have the confidence and >>>>>> security to not be afraid of using it and to identify and use it when >>>>>> they need to, to be confident and secure whether they're using a cane >>>>>> or not, and don't pose risk to themselves in the cases where they >>>>>> don't use it there is nothing that would suggest insecurity. We >>>>>> don't know the exact visual situation of anyone on this list unless >>>>>> they've written about it, so I don't think it is fair to judge about >>>>>> someone's level of security with their blindness based on their cane >>>>>> habits when we don't know what their vision is like. >>>>>> >>>>>> Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social >>>>>> situations. >>>>>> Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've >>>>>> had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria >>>>>> with my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention >>>>>> using something besides my name. When they see the cane (or >>>>>> sometimes read National Federation of the Blind on it if they're >>>>>> close enough to see >>>>>> it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring >>>>>> to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before >>>>>> getting my name. Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an >>>>>> opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then >>>>>> the person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're >>>>>> informed and they see that it's not a big deal. >>>>>> >>>>>> And, I have to make one small correction. The main market for the >>>>>> lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may >>>>>> not use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since >>>>>> they are the ones who originated the telescopic design. Although I >>>>>> do know people who are totally blind or only have light perception >>>>>> that use the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty >>>>>> quickly because they use them so much. For someone who may not use >>>>>> the cane every single day but still would benefit from having an >>>>>> identifier to let other people know they're visually impaired these >>>>>> canes >>>> are great. >>>>>> Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild >>>>>> hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need >>>>>> one. Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can >>>>>> see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not >>>>>> tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. >>>>>> In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to >>>>>> have an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my >>>>>> eyes because even if that person may not need to use it by having one >>>>>> for people to see they must be okay with their blindness and >>>>>> comfortable in explaining their visual impairment to others should >>>>>> the question arise. >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >>>>>>> Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to >>>>>>> alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive >>>>>>> thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that >>>>>>> identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not >>>>>>> of inferiority. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Just my thoughts >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Chris Nusbaum >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hamid: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your >>>>>>>> cake and eat it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages >>>>>>>> of being recognized as blind whereas on the other, you don't want >>>>>>>> to really appear blind or be judged because you do not believe you >>>>>>>> need a cane. My friend, you can't have it both ways. Why do you >>>>>>>> even care whether the public considers you blind or not or whether >>>>>>>> they consider it weird that you might appear to not need a cane? >>>>>>>> Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons >>>>>>>> who use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows >>>>>>>> them as blind whereas you consider that you do not? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most >>>>>>>> of us would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a >>>>>>>> label to being prohibited from going places or doing things because >>>>>>>> of the alleged inability of the blind. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid >>>>>>>> Hamraz >>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Dear Folks, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to >>>>>>>> represent my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To >>>>>>>> be more precise, the target people benefiting are those whose >>>>>>>> residual sight lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who >>>>>>>> want to let the other people around them know about their >>>>>>>> blindness. >>>>>>>> Carrying a cane is indeed an option. >>>>>>>> However, >>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using >>>>>>>> it and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have >>>>>>>> a special symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere >>>>>>>> in any size at one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware >>>>>>>> of that). However, there is no such a thing here in US, and setting >>>>>>>> that up requires time and educating the society about that. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need >>>>>>>> something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a >>>>>>>> functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hamid >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.c >>>>>>>> o >>>>>>>> m >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40 >>>>>> g >>>>>> mail.c >>>>>> om >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104 >>>>>> % >>>>>> 40gmai >>>>>> l.com >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993% >>>>>> 4 >>>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>>> 0gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%4 >>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From arielle71 at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 02:14:45 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 20:14:45 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: References: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com> <-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid> <004b01ce20c5$5a44fd80$0ecef880$@panix.com> <003901ce200e$9b1504c0$d13f0e40$@gmail.com> <004801ce2010$a9d558a0$fd8009e0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: I still don't get it though. If she wanted people to know, and she had to hold something in her hand either way, what's the benefit of holding an ID cane instead of a real one? How long is an ID cane? Is there some other inconvenience about using a real cane that isn't present with an ID cane? Arielle On 3/14/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Josh, > > I don't believe I was on the list at the time of those posts, but > besides that, in my last post I mentioned my reasoning behind using > the term visually impaired. Your logic works for you and is accurate; > you are totally blind so there is no question about terminology. > However, for those of us with some functional sight visually impaired > is a more accurate descriptor (see my last email for examples why). > I'm sure most people are smart enough to separate the tow meanings of > the word vision; obviously sight has no bearing on one's ability to > form a vision of what they want to do or become in the future, but > they are two separate things. > > All I'm asking is for a little more consideration of the perspectives > of people with varying degrees of sight and the reasons for why they > choose to do the things they do. Just because these choices and their > needs might be different from someone who is totally blind that > doesn't make them wrong. > > Arielle, I may not be the best person to shed light on this as I use > my telescopic as a cane too, but I went to a Voc Rehab program for my > state with a girl who had an identity cane but visually didn't need to > use it much. She would carry it with her to let people know, but her > vision was stable and good enough that she could read slightly > enlarged print, (and I believe she got a provisional drivers license > she can use as long as it's not dark or too bright outside too). I > guess it goes back to just letting people know; she was very willing > to discuss her vision with people if asked and identified herself as a > visually impaired person, but functionally she had enough sight where > using a cane in most circumstances would have just been something she > didn't need. > > On 3/14/13, Arielle Silverman wrote: >> Hi all, >> I guess I'm not quite getting what the advantage is of an ID cane over >> a regular one? With either cane, you are telling the world that you >> are blind (or visually impaired or whatever term you want to use). The >> ID cane gives you less tactile info than the regular one does. I >> totally understand that sometimes you might not need a cane to get >> around, but if you're going to use an ID cane anyway, why not just use >> the regular one and get a little extra tactile info too? It might not >> be necessary but it can't possibly hurt you to use a regular cane >> instead of an ID cane. Is there some way an ID cane is more convenient >> to use than a regular white cane? >> I agree that sometimes it is more convenient to not use a cane at all >> because it keeps your hands free. In those cases maybe wearing some >> kind of ID symbol would better help with making sure others around you >> know you are blind. However I think those situations where you really >> need both of your hands are pretty unusual. >> Arielle >> >> On 3/14/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>> Kaiti: >>> Did you read my posts about "Visually Impaired, Vs. Blind?" >>> Basicly for me, I'd rather refer to myself as blind, (I'm totally >>> blind,) >>> but I'm not "visually impaired." >>> There's a difference between sight, and vision. >>> I've talked about that alot on these lists. >>> Sight, is natural, (what we lack,) but vision is inward. >>> If we didn't have vision, there would be no NFB. >>> Vision is like this. >>> "Where do you see yourself, in the next 5 years?" >>> Using that logic, our vision isn't impaired, but our sight is. >>> Let's just refer to ourselves as blind and get it over with. >>> Good point Mike! >>> Blessings, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:49 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>> >>> Absolutely on that front. There is no point of interacting with >>> people under false pretenses as if you were sighted... If one is >>> worried about social situations due to people thinking they're blind, >>> then they might want to think about the possible awkward situation of >>> a friend suddenly finding out about something that important that was >>> there all along and kept from them. >>> >>> On 3/14/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> Mike, that is not how it works at all and I really have a problem with >>>> the incinuation that people who identify themselves as visually >>>> impaired use that title to get special treatment. I use my functional >>>> vision as well as a cane when I feel it appropriate, and receive >>>> accomodations such as braille, electronic format for textbooks, and >>>> assistive technology that I need. I do what I can independently and >>>> ask for sighted assistance when I need something read or would like a >>>> little clarification on something visual that I cannot see. These are >>>> not "special perks" as you put it. My personal choice to use VI over >>>> blind is that it makes things easier for people to understand. I have >>>> had some situations when I have used the term blind and people assume >>>> I can't see anything at all. This has lead to well-intended but >>>> unnecessary superhelping and other consequences. For me it's much >>>> simpler to say I'm visually impaired, indicating that I have some >>>> functional vision and giving sighted people a slightly clearer idea >>>> about me. The NFB recognizes these terms "blind, legally blind, >>>> visually impaired," as interchangeable, so it all comes down to >>>> personal choice. There is nothing that says one term is preferential >>>> over the other and has to be used by everyone. Afterall, visual >>>> impairment is a continuum with varying degrees of blindness, so for >>>> some visually impaired is a more accurate descriptor. >>>> >>>> I think that even if the original poster is slightly preoccupied with >>>> the image of being blind then getting an identity cane might be the >>>> first step in correcting that. The more people see it, the more he'll >>>> have to answer questions about himself and his visual impairment and >>>> get used to it. Not all, but some visually impaired people have to >>>> psychologically ease into being comfortable with identifying >>>> themselves in this way and that shouldn't be held against them if >>>> that's what they have to do. Heck, I've even heard partially sighted >>>> people speak at state conventions about how they grew more comfortable >>>> with their blindness by beginning to associate themselves with the >>>> NFB, so it sounds like the poster may be on the right track. Again, >>>> we don't really know the situation; any one of us could be reading >>>> something that the poster didn't intentionally mean because that is a >>>> side-effect of electronic messages... things often get misconstrued. >>>> He never said he didn't want to be identified as blind in order to >>>> gain priveledges; he just wanted something to let people know, but he >>>> still has enough functional vision to walk without a cane. I think >>>> the wording about walking perfectly may be a little presumptuous, (no >>>> one, blind or sighted, walks exactly perfectly because it's >>>> anatomically impossible), but like I said this might be a good step in >>>> putting blindness/visual impairment/whatever you'd like to call it >>>> into perspective. >>>> >>>> >>>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>> Just use whatever works. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>>> Dudley >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:29 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>> >>>>> I guess I just don't see the problem with allowing people to interact >>>>> with >>>>> you as though you are sighted. If for some reason, you can't see that >>>>> interaction, then tell them you are blind. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>>> Our fine line is that we are trying to predict, and or control >>>>>> people's reactions. If you do not have a cane with you while walking >>>>>> in our country, people probably will not know you are blind. The >>>>>> original poster has every right to not use a cane and rely on >>>>>> functional vision. However, the reactions of people can't be >>>>>> controlled. If they don't know he is blind, they will react to him >>>>>> as >>>>>> if he is sighted. It is his choice. In America, I don't think we >>>>>> have a way to not carry a cane, but have everyone know that you are >>>>>> blind. >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>>>> Dudley >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:43 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>> I'm going to stick my "oar in" as they say. Kaiti and Mike, I >>>>>> think there may be a bit of misunderstanding. I think what is sought >>>>>> by the original poster on this thread is an identification symbol, >>>>>> something to say "I am blind" that is not as bulky as a cane. I >>>>>> definitely disagree with this. What I do not disagree with is using >>>>>> one's functional vision when you have it and, if that be your desire, >>>>>> to not use a cane if you don't need it. >>>>>> What I do disagree with is the concept of wanting the "you poor blind >>>>>> person" perks of blindness without carrying a cane, as the original >>>>>> poster seems to want. There is a fine line that I think is lost in >>>>>> the >>>>> grey here. >>>>>> ALeeha >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>>> Kaiti: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We shall have to agree to disagree. I see no reason to identify as >>>>>>> "visually impaired" unless one wishes special help or perks. Why not >>>>>>> just be blind and have done with the matter? Much simpler. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> In fact, I know a guy who was nearly totally blind for many years >>>>>>> due >>>>>>> to an explosion. He got a good deal of sight back (he's lost it >>>>>>> again >>>>>>> now) and used his sight to look around, traveling with a cane as he >>>>>>> always did; thus, he got the benefit of sight plus didn't have to >>>>>>> worry about when he should or should not use a cane, whether to >>>>>>> identify etc. etc. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Peace! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>>>>>> Shelton >>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:32 PM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Mike, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I have to disagree here. As one of those partials who elects when >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you >>>>>>> may not be considering. Electing when and when not to use a cane is >>>>>>> not always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; >>>>>>> some of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. >>>>>>> Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas >>>>>>> without a cane some times should give up their right to identify >>>>>>> themself as a visually impaired person. E.G, I would never do any >>>>>>> type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a >>>>>>> street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see >>>>>>> like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under >>>>>>> normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria >>>>>>> right across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm >>>>>>> coming right back I don't always choose to actively use it. My >>>>>>> choice to not use a cane in this instance does not mean I should >>>>>>> forfit my right to identify myself as a visually impaired person >>>>>>> because I am; the use of the cane does not change my inability to >>>>>>> read print or to see great distances and it does not change the fact >>>>>>> that I am legally blind and am identified that way. It also doesn't >>>>>>> change the level of security I have with my blindness; if a person >>>>>>> refuses to use a cane or fights against it because they're afraid of >>>>>>> the social implications then that is insecurity, but if they're >>>>>>> visually having a good day and want to run a quick errand that's in >>>>>>> a >>>>>>> very familiar area with minimal travel or risk of injury and they're >>>>>>> confident in their ability to use audio cues and the vision they >>>>>>> have >>>>>>> then that is their choice and doesn't make them insecure with >>>>>>> themself or their blindness. As long as they have the confidence >>>>>>> and >>>>>>> security to not be afraid of using it and to identify and use it >>>>>>> when >>>>>>> they need to, to be confident and secure whether they're using a >>>>>>> cane >>>>>>> or not, and don't pose risk to themselves in the cases where they >>>>>>> don't use it there is nothing that would suggest insecurity. We >>>>>>> don't know the exact visual situation of anyone on this list unless >>>>>>> they've written about it, so I don't think it is fair to judge about >>>>>>> someone's level of security with their blindness based on their cane >>>>>>> habits when we don't know what their vision is like. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social >>>>>>> situations. >>>>>>> Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've >>>>>>> had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria >>>>>>> with my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention >>>>>>> using something besides my name. When they see the cane (or >>>>>>> sometimes read National Federation of the Blind on it if they're >>>>>>> close enough to see >>>>>>> it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring >>>>>>> to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before >>>>>>> getting my name. Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me >>>>>>> an >>>>>>> opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then >>>>>>> the person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're >>>>>>> informed and they see that it's not a big deal. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> And, I have to make one small correction. The main market for the >>>>>>> lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may >>>>>>> not use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this >>>>>>> since >>>>>>> they are the ones who originated the telescopic design. Although I >>>>>>> do know people who are totally blind or only have light perception >>>>>>> that use the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty >>>>>>> quickly because they use them so much. For someone who may not use >>>>>>> the cane every single day but still would benefit from having an >>>>>>> identifier to let other people know they're visually impaired these >>>>>>> canes >>>>> are great. >>>>>>> Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild >>>>>>> hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need >>>>>>> one. Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can >>>>>>> see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not >>>>>>> tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a >>>>>>> cane. >>>>>>> In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to >>>>>>> have an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my >>>>>>> eyes because even if that person may not need to use it by having >>>>>>> one >>>>>>> for people to see they must be okay with their blindness and >>>>>>> comfortable in explaining their visual impairment to others should >>>>>>> the question arise. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >>>>>>>> Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to >>>>>>>> alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive >>>>>>>> thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that >>>>>>>> identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not >>>>>>>> of inferiority. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Just my thoughts >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Chris Nusbaum >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hamid: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your >>>>>>>>> cake and eat it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages >>>>>>>>> of being recognized as blind whereas on the other, you don't want >>>>>>>>> to really appear blind or be judged because you do not believe you >>>>>>>>> need a cane. My friend, you can't have it both ways. Why do you >>>>>>>>> even care whether the public considers you blind or not or whether >>>>>>>>> they consider it weird that you might appear to not need a cane? >>>>>>>>> Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons >>>>>>>>> who use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows >>>>>>>>> them as blind whereas you consider that you do not? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and >>>>>>>>> most >>>>>>>>> of us would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a >>>>>>>>> label to being prohibited from going places or doing things >>>>>>>>> because >>>>>>>>> of the alleged inability of the blind. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid >>>>>>>>> Hamraz >>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Dear Folks, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to >>>>>>>>> represent my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To >>>>>>>>> be more precise, the target people benefiting are those whose >>>>>>>>> residual sight lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who >>>>>>>>> want to let the other people around them know about their >>>>>>>>> blindness. >>>>>>>>> Carrying a cane is indeed an option. >>>>>>>>> However, >>>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>>> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using >>>>>>>>> it and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have >>>>>>>>> a special symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere >>>>>>>>> in any size at one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware >>>>>>>>> of that). However, there is no such a thing here in US, and >>>>>>>>> setting >>>>>>>>> that up requires time and educating the society about that. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need >>>>>>>>> something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a >>>>>>>>> functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hamid >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.c >>>>>>>>> o >>>>>>>>> m >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40 >>>>>>> g >>>>>>> mail.c >>>>>>> om >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104 >>>>>>> % >>>>>>> 40gmai >>>>>>> l.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993% >>>>>>> 4 >>>>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>>>> 0gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%4 >>>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Kaiti >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From k7uij at panix.com Fri Mar 15 02:15:44 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 19:15:44 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much more cheaply than is the 5. Mike -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! I don't see why it's superior to the 5. Mike -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the Blind. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony Grima Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or DAISY: $9 Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full tutorial together and save! The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, and has a better camera. Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used in both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them easily. If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this update to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all the appendices. An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone reference card. Order at: http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html ****** To order any books, send payment to: NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge it: toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. Or order any of our books online at http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From sweetpeareader at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 02:16:24 2013 From: sweetpeareader at gmail.com (Sophie Trist) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 21:16:24 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! Message-ID: <5142847f.c3dae00a.3be5.3d09@mx.google.com> Justin, I've heard that the 5 is faster and has a bigger screen, that's it. Other than that, it hs the same functions as a 4 and is equally accessible. ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" References: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com> <-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid> <004b01ce20c5$5a44fd80$0ecef880$@panix.com> <003901ce200e$9b1504c0$d13f0e40$@gmail.com> <004801ce2010$a9d558a0$fd8009e0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <00c201ce2124$d05f5150$711df3f0$@panix.com> Kaiti: Part of the reason people are reacting is that all-too-often, people use "visually impaired", among other terms, as euphemisms to avoid their considering themselves blind. If I may begently churlish (a contradiction if I ever uttered one), even you insist upon the need to differentiate between "blind" and "visually impaired". In the office of an optometrist, oculist or ophthalmologist, I canunderstand this. But why should it matter for the general public to know or care? You don't have to explain anything to anyone and many of us (yes, even those with considerable vision) have just found it easier to callourselves "blind" and be done with it. No more worrying about when the lighting is good and when it is not; no more worrying about whether one might miss a step up or down; in short, sight goes into the background. That's thereasoning, anyway. You may feel differently and that's your right. But there's a reason we're the national Federation of the Blind rather than being the National Federation of the visually Limited. ACB has a Council of citizens with Low vision; we do not. (wide grin) Different strokes ... Mike -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 7:09 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID Josh, I don't believe I was on the list at the time of those posts, but besides that, in my last post I mentioned my reasoning behind using the term visually impaired. Your logic works for you and is accurate; you are totally blind so there is no question about terminology. However, for those of us with some functional sight visually impaired is a more accurate descriptor (see my last email for examples why). I'm sure most people are smart enough to separate the tow meanings of the word vision; obviously sight has no bearing on one's ability to form a vision of what they want to do or become in the future, but they are two separate things. All I'm asking is for a little more consideration of the perspectives of people with varying degrees of sight and the reasons for why they choose to do the things they do. Just because these choices and their needs might be different from someone who is totally blind that doesn't make them wrong. Arielle, I may not be the best person to shed light on this as I use my telescopic as a cane too, but I went to a Voc Rehab program for my state with a girl who had an identity cane but visually didn't need to use it much. She would carry it with her to let people know, but her vision was stable and good enough that she could read slightly enlarged print, (and I believe she got a provisional drivers license she can use as long as it's not dark or too bright outside too). I guess it goes back to just letting people know; she was very willing to discuss her vision with people if asked and identified herself as a visually impaired person, but functionally she had enough sight where using a cane in most circumstances would have just been something she didn't need. On 3/14/13, Arielle Silverman wrote: > Hi all, > I guess I'm not quite getting what the advantage is of an ID cane over > a regular one? With either cane, you are telling the world that you > are blind (or visually impaired or whatever term you want to use). The > ID cane gives you less tactile info than the regular one does. I > totally understand that sometimes you might not need a cane to get > around, but if you're going to use an ID cane anyway, why not just use > the regular one and get a little extra tactile info too? It might not > be necessary but it can't possibly hurt you to use a regular cane > instead of an ID cane. Is there some way an ID cane is more convenient > to use than a regular white cane? > I agree that sometimes it is more convenient to not use a cane at all > because it keeps your hands free. In those cases maybe wearing some > kind of ID symbol would better help with making sure others around you > know you are blind. However I think those situations where you really > need both of your hands are pretty unusual. > Arielle > > On 3/14/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >> Kaiti: >> Did you read my posts about "Visually Impaired, Vs. Blind?" >> Basicly for me, I'd rather refer to myself as blind, (I'm totally blind,) >> but I'm not "visually impaired." >> There's a difference between sight, and vision. >> I've talked about that alot on these lists. >> Sight, is natural, (what we lack,) but vision is inward. >> If we didn't have vision, there would be no NFB. >> Vision is like this. >> "Where do you see yourself, in the next 5 years?" >> Using that logic, our vision isn't impaired, but our sight is. >> Let's just refer to ourselves as blind and get it over with. >> Good point Mike! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:49 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >> >> Absolutely on that front. There is no point of interacting with >> people under false pretenses as if you were sighted... If one is >> worried about social situations due to people thinking they're blind, >> then they might want to think about the possible awkward situation of >> a friend suddenly finding out about something that important that was >> there all along and kept from them. >> >> On 3/14/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>> Hi, >>> >>> Mike, that is not how it works at all and I really have a problem with >>> the incinuation that people who identify themselves as visually >>> impaired use that title to get special treatment. I use my functional >>> vision as well as a cane when I feel it appropriate, and receive >>> accomodations such as braille, electronic format for textbooks, and >>> assistive technology that I need. I do what I can independently and >>> ask for sighted assistance when I need something read or would like a >>> little clarification on something visual that I cannot see. These are >>> not "special perks" as you put it. My personal choice to use VI over >>> blind is that it makes things easier for people to understand. I have >>> had some situations when I have used the term blind and people assume >>> I can't see anything at all. This has lead to well-intended but >>> unnecessary superhelping and other consequences. For me it's much >>> simpler to say I'm visually impaired, indicating that I have some >>> functional vision and giving sighted people a slightly clearer idea >>> about me. The NFB recognizes these terms "blind, legally blind, >>> visually impaired," as interchangeable, so it all comes down to >>> personal choice. There is nothing that says one term is preferential >>> over the other and has to be used by everyone. Afterall, visual >>> impairment is a continuum with varying degrees of blindness, so for >>> some visually impaired is a more accurate descriptor. >>> >>> I think that even if the original poster is slightly preoccupied with >>> the image of being blind then getting an identity cane might be the >>> first step in correcting that. The more people see it, the more he'll >>> have to answer questions about himself and his visual impairment and >>> get used to it. Not all, but some visually impaired people have to >>> psychologically ease into being comfortable with identifying >>> themselves in this way and that shouldn't be held against them if >>> that's what they have to do. Heck, I've even heard partially sighted >>> people speak at state conventions about how they grew more comfortable >>> with their blindness by beginning to associate themselves with the >>> NFB, so it sounds like the poster may be on the right track. Again, >>> we don't really know the situation; any one of us could be reading >>> something that the poster didn't intentionally mean because that is a >>> side-effect of electronic messages... things often get misconstrued. >>> He never said he didn't want to be identified as blind in order to >>> gain priveledges; he just wanted something to let people know, but he >>> still has enough functional vision to walk without a cane. I think >>> the wording about walking perfectly may be a little presumptuous, (no >>> one, blind or sighted, walks exactly perfectly because it's >>> anatomically impossible), but like I said this might be a good step in >>> putting blindness/visual impairment/whatever you'd like to call it >>> into perspective. >>> >>> >>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>> Just use whatever works. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>> Dudley >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:29 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>> >>>> I guess I just don't see the problem with allowing people to interact >>>> with >>>> you as though you are sighted. If for some reason, you can't see that >>>> interaction, then tell them you are blind. >>>> >>>> >>>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>> Our fine line is that we are trying to predict, and or control >>>>> people's reactions. If you do not have a cane with you while walking >>>>> in our country, people probably will not know you are blind. The >>>>> original poster has every right to not use a cane and rely on >>>>> functional vision. However, the reactions of people can't be >>>>> controlled. If they don't know he is blind, they will react to him as >>>>> if he is sighted. It is his choice. In America, I don't think we >>>>> have a way to not carry a cane, but have everyone know that you are >>>>> blind. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>>> Dudley >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:43 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>> I'm going to stick my "oar in" as they say. Kaiti and Mike, I >>>>> think there may be a bit of misunderstanding. I think what is sought >>>>> by the original poster on this thread is an identification symbol, >>>>> something to say "I am blind" that is not as bulky as a cane. I >>>>> definitely disagree with this. What I do not disagree with is using >>>>> one's functional vision when you have it and, if that be your desire, >>>>> to not use a cane if you don't need it. >>>>> What I do disagree with is the concept of wanting the "you poor blind >>>>> person" perks of blindness without carrying a cane, as the original >>>>> poster seems to want. There is a fine line that I think is lost in the >>>> grey here. >>>>> ALeeha >>>>> >>>>> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>> Kaiti: >>>>>> >>>>>> We shall have to agree to disagree. I see no reason to identify as >>>>>> "visually impaired" unless one wishes special help or perks. Why not >>>>>> just be blind and have done with the matter? Much simpler. >>>>>> >>>>>> In fact, I know a guy who was nearly totally blind for many years due >>>>>> to an explosion. He got a good deal of sight back (he's lost it again >>>>>> now) and used his sight to look around, traveling with a cane as he >>>>>> always did; thus, he got the benefit of sight plus didn't have to >>>>>> worry about when he should or should not use a cane, whether to >>>>>> identify etc. etc. >>>>>> >>>>>> Peace! >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>>>>> Shelton >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:32 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike, >>>>>> >>>>>> I have to disagree here. As one of those partials who elects when to >>>>>> use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you >>>>>> may not be considering. Electing when and when not to use a cane is >>>>>> not always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; >>>>>> some of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. >>>>>> Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas >>>>>> without a cane some times should give up their right to identify >>>>>> themself as a visually impaired person. E.G, I would never do any >>>>>> type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a >>>>>> street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see >>>>>> like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under >>>>>> normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria >>>>>> right across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm >>>>>> coming right back I don't always choose to actively use it. My >>>>>> choice to not use a cane in this instance does not mean I should >>>>>> forfit my right to identify myself as a visually impaired person >>>>>> because I am; the use of the cane does not change my inability to >>>>>> read print or to see great distances and it does not change the fact >>>>>> that I am legally blind and am identified that way. It also doesn't >>>>>> change the level of security I have with my blindness; if a person >>>>>> refuses to use a cane or fights against it because they're afraid of >>>>>> the social implications then that is insecurity, but if they're >>>>>> visually having a good day and want to run a quick errand that's in a >>>>>> very familiar area with minimal travel or risk of injury and they're >>>>>> confident in their ability to use audio cues and the vision they have >>>>>> then that is their choice and doesn't make them insecure with >>>>>> themself or their blindness. As long as they have the confidence and >>>>>> security to not be afraid of using it and to identify and use it when >>>>>> they need to, to be confident and secure whether they're using a cane >>>>>> or not, and don't pose risk to themselves in the cases where they >>>>>> don't use it there is nothing that would suggest insecurity. We >>>>>> don't know the exact visual situation of anyone on this list unless >>>>>> they've written about it, so I don't think it is fair to judge about >>>>>> someone's level of security with their blindness based on their cane >>>>>> habits when we don't know what their vision is like. >>>>>> >>>>>> Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social >>>>>> situations. >>>>>> Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've >>>>>> had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria >>>>>> with my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention >>>>>> using something besides my name. When they see the cane (or >>>>>> sometimes read National Federation of the Blind on it if they're >>>>>> close enough to see >>>>>> it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring >>>>>> to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before >>>>>> getting my name. Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an >>>>>> opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then >>>>>> the person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're >>>>>> informed and they see that it's not a big deal. >>>>>> >>>>>> And, I have to make one small correction. The main market for the >>>>>> lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may >>>>>> not use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since >>>>>> they are the ones who originated the telescopic design. Although I >>>>>> do know people who are totally blind or only have light perception >>>>>> that use the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty >>>>>> quickly because they use them so much. For someone who may not use >>>>>> the cane every single day but still would benefit from having an >>>>>> identifier to let other people know they're visually impaired these >>>>>> canes >>>> are great. >>>>>> Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild >>>>>> hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need >>>>>> one. Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can >>>>>> see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not >>>>>> tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. >>>>>> In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to >>>>>> have an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my >>>>>> eyes because even if that person may not need to use it by having one >>>>>> for people to see they must be okay with their blindness and >>>>>> comfortable in explaining their visual impairment to others should >>>>>> the question arise. >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >>>>>>> Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to >>>>>>> alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive >>>>>>> thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that >>>>>>> identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not >>>>>>> of inferiority. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Just my thoughts >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Chris Nusbaum >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hamid: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your >>>>>>>> cake and eat it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages >>>>>>>> of being recognized as blind whereas on the other, you don't want >>>>>>>> to really appear blind or be judged because you do not believe you >>>>>>>> need a cane. My friend, you can't have it both ways. Why do you >>>>>>>> even care whether the public considers you blind or not or whether >>>>>>>> they consider it weird that you might appear to not need a cane? >>>>>>>> Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons >>>>>>>> who use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows >>>>>>>> them as blind whereas you consider that you do not? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most >>>>>>>> of us would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a >>>>>>>> label to being prohibited from going places or doing things because >>>>>>>> of the alleged inability of the blind. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid >>>>>>>> Hamraz >>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Dear Folks, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to >>>>>>>> represent my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To >>>>>>>> be more precise, the target people benefiting are those whose >>>>>>>> residual sight lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who >>>>>>>> want to let the other people around them know about their >>>>>>>> blindness. >>>>>>>> Carrying a cane is indeed an option. >>>>>>>> However, >>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using >>>>>>>> it and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have >>>>>>>> a special symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere >>>>>>>> in any size at one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware >>>>>>>> of that). However, there is no such a thing here in US, and setting >>>>>>>> that up requires time and educating the society about that. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need >>>>>>>> something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a >>>>>>>> functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hamid >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.c >>>>>>>> o >>>>>>>> m >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40 >>>>>> g >>>>>> mail.c >>>>>> om >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104 >>>>>> % >>>>>> 40gmai >>>>>> l.com >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993% >>>>>> 4 >>>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>>> 0gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%4 >>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai l.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai l.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Fri Mar 15 02:34:00 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 22:34:00 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: References: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com><-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid><004b01ce20c5$5a44fd80$0ecef880$@panix.com><003901ce200e$9b1504c0$d13f0e40$@gmail.com><004801ce2010$a9d558a0$fd8009e0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Kaiti, I understand where you are coming from. I always have my regular folding cane handy when out alone. As someone with functional vision, I also like the term visually impaired or low vision. I think I use it since I grew up with it and sort of adopted it as part of my identity. It wasn't til I met Federationists that I found everyone using the term blind; Nfb people do not distinguish those with some sight from totals. I understand why; but at the same time, it seems odd because someone who functions visually for some tasks well will use it in life and therefore may have some different needs than a totally blind person. Of course, those with visual impairments should learn nonvisual techniques unless their vision is always efficient and reliable. But in addition to nonvisual methods, they will certainly use vision. I do not walk outside on campus without a cane; its too unpredictable with steps, bumps, and curves. But, I would walk inside the dorm and some buildings either without a cane or just carrying it. It seemed faster to do this for me and not be concerned with the cane's arc and hitting someone. Just as you explained, I feel that walking without a cane for a short predictable distance doesn't say anything about my adjustment to blindness. I'm comfortable with my visual condition and will talk about it if needed or educate people. It doesn't mean I'm hiding the condition or anything. I know some low vision people who are embarrassed to use canes, so I can see why the totally blind people who spoke up would think that. But this is not the case for all legally blind people. As for the terms, I think people know the difference between sight and vision. So, I don't see why that would play into your argument. For Josh, saying blind makes sense. But I'd have to say that downplaying other terms seems a bit far to me. I think those of us with vision have to balance when to use it and what tools to use. If we make a knowledgable and informed choice, we are well off and hopefully compete well. I don't have enough vision to walk much without a cane or simply hold an ID cane. So for me, a regular cane is in my tool box, but for someone else who is just on the threshhold of legal blindness, they may choose a ID cane. Ashley -----Original Message----- From: Kaiti Shelton Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:08 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID Josh, I don't believe I was on the list at the time of those posts, but besides that, in my last post I mentioned my reasoning behind using the term visually impaired. Your logic works for you and is accurate; you are totally blind so there is no question about terminology. However, for those of us with some functional sight visually impaired is a more accurate descriptor (see my last email for examples why). I'm sure most people are smart enough to separate the tow meanings of the word vision; obviously sight has no bearing on one's ability to form a vision of what they want to do or become in the future, but they are two separate things. All I'm asking is for a little more consideration of the perspectives of people with varying degrees of sight and the reasons for why they choose to do the things they do. Just because these choices and their needs might be different from someone who is totally blind that doesn't make them wrong. Arielle, I may not be the best person to shed light on this as I use my telescopic as a cane too, but I went to a Voc Rehab program for my state with a girl who had an identity cane but visually didn't need to use it much. She would carry it with her to let people know, but her vision was stable and good enough that she could read slightly enlarged print, (and I believe she got a provisional drivers license she can use as long as it's not dark or too bright outside too). I guess it goes back to just letting people know; she was very willing to discuss her vision with people if asked and identified herself as a visually impaired person, but functionally she had enough sight where using a cane in most circumstances would have just been something she didn't need. On 3/14/13, Arielle Silverman wrote: > Hi all, > I guess I'm not quite getting what the advantage is of an ID cane over > a regular one? With either cane, you are telling the world that you > are blind (or visually impaired or whatever term you want to use). The > ID cane gives you less tactile info than the regular one does. I > totally understand that sometimes you might not need a cane to get > around, but if you're going to use an ID cane anyway, why not just use > the regular one and get a little extra tactile info too? It might not > be necessary but it can't possibly hurt you to use a regular cane > instead of an ID cane. Is there some way an ID cane is more convenient > to use than a regular white cane? > I agree that sometimes it is more convenient to not use a cane at all > because it keeps your hands free. In those cases maybe wearing some > kind of ID symbol would better help with making sure others around you > know you are blind. However I think those situations where you really > need both of your hands are pretty unusual. > Arielle > > On 3/14/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >> Kaiti: >> Did you read my posts about "Visually Impaired, Vs. Blind?" >> Basicly for me, I'd rather refer to myself as blind, (I'm totally blind,) >> but I'm not "visually impaired." >> There's a difference between sight, and vision. >> I've talked about that alot on these lists. >> Sight, is natural, (what we lack,) but vision is inward. >> If we didn't have vision, there would be no NFB. >> Vision is like this. >> "Where do you see yourself, in the next 5 years?" >> Using that logic, our vision isn't impaired, but our sight is. >> Let's just refer to ourselves as blind and get it over with. >> Good point Mike! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:49 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >> >> Absolutely on that front. There is no point of interacting with >> people under false pretenses as if you were sighted... If one is >> worried about social situations due to people thinking they're blind, >> then they might want to think about the possible awkward situation of >> a friend suddenly finding out about something that important that was >> there all along and kept from them. >> >> On 3/14/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>> Hi, >>> >>> Mike, that is not how it works at all and I really have a problem with >>> the incinuation that people who identify themselves as visually >>> impaired use that title to get special treatment. I use my functional >>> vision as well as a cane when I feel it appropriate, and receive >>> accomodations such as braille, electronic format for textbooks, and >>> assistive technology that I need. I do what I can independently and >>> ask for sighted assistance when I need something read or would like a >>> little clarification on something visual that I cannot see. These are >>> not "special perks" as you put it. My personal choice to use VI over >>> blind is that it makes things easier for people to understand. I have >>> had some situations when I have used the term blind and people assume >>> I can't see anything at all. This has lead to well-intended but >>> unnecessary superhelping and other consequences. For me it's much >>> simpler to say I'm visually impaired, indicating that I have some >>> functional vision and giving sighted people a slightly clearer idea >>> about me. The NFB recognizes these terms "blind, legally blind, >>> visually impaired," as interchangeable, so it all comes down to >>> personal choice. There is nothing that says one term is preferential >>> over the other and has to be used by everyone. Afterall, visual >>> impairment is a continuum with varying degrees of blindness, so for >>> some visually impaired is a more accurate descriptor. >>> >>> I think that even if the original poster is slightly preoccupied with >>> the image of being blind then getting an identity cane might be the >>> first step in correcting that. The more people see it, the more he'll >>> have to answer questions about himself and his visual impairment and >>> get used to it. Not all, but some visually impaired people have to >>> psychologically ease into being comfortable with identifying >>> themselves in this way and that shouldn't be held against them if >>> that's what they have to do. Heck, I've even heard partially sighted >>> people speak at state conventions about how they grew more comfortable >>> with their blindness by beginning to associate themselves with the >>> NFB, so it sounds like the poster may be on the right track. Again, >>> we don't really know the situation; any one of us could be reading >>> something that the poster didn't intentionally mean because that is a >>> side-effect of electronic messages... things often get misconstrued. >>> He never said he didn't want to be identified as blind in order to >>> gain priveledges; he just wanted something to let people know, but he >>> still has enough functional vision to walk without a cane. I think >>> the wording about walking perfectly may be a little presumptuous, (no >>> one, blind or sighted, walks exactly perfectly because it's >>> anatomically impossible), but like I said this might be a good step in >>> putting blindness/visual impairment/whatever you'd like to call it >>> into perspective. >>> >>> >>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>> Just use whatever works. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>> Dudley >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:29 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>> >>>> I guess I just don't see the problem with allowing people to interact >>>> with >>>> you as though you are sighted. If for some reason, you can't see that >>>> interaction, then tell them you are blind. >>>> >>>> >>>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>> Our fine line is that we are trying to predict, and or control >>>>> people's reactions. If you do not have a cane with you while walking >>>>> in our country, people probably will not know you are blind. The >>>>> original poster has every right to not use a cane and rely on >>>>> functional vision. However, the reactions of people can't be >>>>> controlled. If they don't know he is blind, they will react to him as >>>>> if he is sighted. It is his choice. In America, I don't think we >>>>> have a way to not carry a cane, but have everyone know that you are >>>>> blind. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>>> Dudley >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:43 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>> I'm going to stick my "oar in" as they say. Kaiti and Mike, I >>>>> think there may be a bit of misunderstanding. I think what is sought >>>>> by the original poster on this thread is an identification symbol, >>>>> something to say "I am blind" that is not as bulky as a cane. I >>>>> definitely disagree with this. What I do not disagree with is using >>>>> one's functional vision when you have it and, if that be your desire, >>>>> to not use a cane if you don't need it. >>>>> What I do disagree with is the concept of wanting the "you poor blind >>>>> person" perks of blindness without carrying a cane, as the original >>>>> poster seems to want. There is a fine line that I think is lost in the >>>> grey here. >>>>> ALeeha >>>>> >>>>> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>> Kaiti: >>>>>> >>>>>> We shall have to agree to disagree. I see no reason to identify as >>>>>> "visually impaired" unless one wishes special help or perks. Why not >>>>>> just be blind and have done with the matter? Much simpler. >>>>>> >>>>>> In fact, I know a guy who was nearly totally blind for many years due >>>>>> to an explosion. He got a good deal of sight back (he's lost it again >>>>>> now) and used his sight to look around, traveling with a cane as he >>>>>> always did; thus, he got the benefit of sight plus didn't have to >>>>>> worry about when he should or should not use a cane, whether to >>>>>> identify etc. etc. >>>>>> >>>>>> Peace! >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>>>>> Shelton >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:32 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike, >>>>>> >>>>>> I have to disagree here. As one of those partials who elects when to >>>>>> use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you >>>>>> may not be considering. Electing when and when not to use a cane is >>>>>> not always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; >>>>>> some of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. >>>>>> Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas >>>>>> without a cane some times should give up their right to identify >>>>>> themself as a visually impaired person. E.G, I would never do any >>>>>> type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a >>>>>> street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see >>>>>> like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under >>>>>> normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria >>>>>> right across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm >>>>>> coming right back I don't always choose to actively use it. My >>>>>> choice to not use a cane in this instance does not mean I should >>>>>> forfit my right to identify myself as a visually impaired person >>>>>> because I am; the use of the cane does not change my inability to >>>>>> read print or to see great distances and it does not change the fact >>>>>> that I am legally blind and am identified that way. It also doesn't >>>>>> change the level of security I have with my blindness; if a person >>>>>> refuses to use a cane or fights against it because they're afraid of >>>>>> the social implications then that is insecurity, but if they're >>>>>> visually having a good day and want to run a quick errand that's in a >>>>>> very familiar area with minimal travel or risk of injury and they're >>>>>> confident in their ability to use audio cues and the vision they have >>>>>> then that is their choice and doesn't make them insecure with >>>>>> themself or their blindness. As long as they have the confidence and >>>>>> security to not be afraid of using it and to identify and use it when >>>>>> they need to, to be confident and secure whether they're using a cane >>>>>> or not, and don't pose risk to themselves in the cases where they >>>>>> don't use it there is nothing that would suggest insecurity. We >>>>>> don't know the exact visual situation of anyone on this list unless >>>>>> they've written about it, so I don't think it is fair to judge about >>>>>> someone's level of security with their blindness based on their cane >>>>>> habits when we don't know what their vision is like. >>>>>> >>>>>> Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social >>>>>> situations. >>>>>> Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've >>>>>> had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria >>>>>> with my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention >>>>>> using something besides my name. When they see the cane (or >>>>>> sometimes read National Federation of the Blind on it if they're >>>>>> close enough to see >>>>>> it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring >>>>>> to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before >>>>>> getting my name. Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an >>>>>> opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then >>>>>> the person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're >>>>>> informed and they see that it's not a big deal. >>>>>> >>>>>> And, I have to make one small correction. The main market for the >>>>>> lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may >>>>>> not use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since >>>>>> they are the ones who originated the telescopic design. Although I >>>>>> do know people who are totally blind or only have light perception >>>>>> that use the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty >>>>>> quickly because they use them so much. For someone who may not use >>>>>> the cane every single day but still would benefit from having an >>>>>> identifier to let other people know they're visually impaired these >>>>>> canes >>>> are great. >>>>>> Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild >>>>>> hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need >>>>>> one. Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can >>>>>> see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not >>>>>> tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. >>>>>> In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to >>>>>> have an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my >>>>>> eyes because even if that person may not need to use it by having one >>>>>> for people to see they must be okay with their blindness and >>>>>> comfortable in explaining their visual impairment to others should >>>>>> the question arise. >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >>>>>>> Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to >>>>>>> alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive >>>>>>> thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that >>>>>>> identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not >>>>>>> of inferiority. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Just my thoughts >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Chris Nusbaum >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hamid: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your >>>>>>>> cake and eat it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages >>>>>>>> of being recognized as blind whereas on the other, you don't want >>>>>>>> to really appear blind or be judged because you do not believe you >>>>>>>> need a cane. My friend, you can't have it both ways. Why do you >>>>>>>> even care whether the public considers you blind or not or whether >>>>>>>> they consider it weird that you might appear to not need a cane? >>>>>>>> Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons >>>>>>>> who use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows >>>>>>>> them as blind whereas you consider that you do not? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most >>>>>>>> of us would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a >>>>>>>> label to being prohibited from going places or doing things because >>>>>>>> of the alleged inability of the blind. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid >>>>>>>> Hamraz >>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Dear Folks, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to >>>>>>>> represent my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To >>>>>>>> be more precise, the target people benefiting are those whose >>>>>>>> residual sight lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who >>>>>>>> want to let the other people around them know about their >>>>>>>> blindness. >>>>>>>> Carrying a cane is indeed an option. >>>>>>>> However, >>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using >>>>>>>> it and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have >>>>>>>> a special symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere >>>>>>>> in any size at one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware >>>>>>>> of that). However, there is no such a thing here in US, and setting >>>>>>>> that up requires time and educating the society about that. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need >>>>>>>> something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a >>>>>>>> functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hamid >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.c >>>>>>>> o >>>>>>>> m >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40 >>>>>> g >>>>>> mail.c >>>>>> om >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104 >>>>>> % >>>>>> 40gmai >>>>>> l.com >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993% >>>>>> 4 >>>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>>> 0gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%4 >>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From mworkman.lists at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 02:33:37 2013 From: mworkman.lists at gmail.com (Marc Workman) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 20:33:37 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: References: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com> <-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid> <004b01ce20c5$5a44fd80$0ecef880$@panix.com> <003901ce200e$9b1504c0$d13f0e40$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Aleeha wrote, > I guess I just don't see the problem with allowing people to interact with you as though you are sighted. If for some reason, you can't see that interaction, then tell them you are blind. I guess I find this a little hard to understand. If you're standing at an intersection, and someone in a nearby car is gesturing at you to go ahead, you should tell him you can't see? Of course you would have no idea he is gesturing at you in the first place, and he probably wouldn't hear you tell him you can't see even if you tried telling him. And if someone smiles and nods at you as you walk past her, and you give no acknowledgement of this whatsoever, giving the impression you're rude or unfriendly, you should just tell her you can't see? Of course, assuming she just walks past without commenting on your rudeness, you will have no idea that you've given her the impression you're rude or unfriendly. It doesn't make a lot of sense to me to say that when you can't see that someone is trying to interact with you in a visual way, you should just tell that person you're blind. The whole point is that you don't always realize when someone is trying to interact with you in a visual way if you are blind. Arielle, An ID cane is typically smaller and lighter than a mobility cane, isn't it? Not significantly perhaps, but enough that I might use one if I didn't need the information provided by a mobility cane. Ideally though, if the cane is strictly for ID purposes, I would think some other sort of symbol, a pin perhaps, would be far more convenient. This might be a problem in terms of conspicuousness, but setting that aside, I can see the value of a symbol that performs the same identification function as an ID cane without occupying a hand. I'm not sure I agree that situations where you need both of your hands are unusual. I suppose if you interpret the word "need" in a very strict sense, this may be more plausible. But carrying six bags of groceries is much easier with two hands, dragging two suitcases is also easier with a second hand, carrying a large box or two cups of coffee, again much easier, or even holding a light object in one hand while trying to unlock a door, hold a partner's hand, lift up the trash bin lid, take out your wallet, and so on. A second hand may not be strictly necessary to accomplish many everyday tasks, but it sure makes things easier a lot of the time. Cheers, Marc On 2013-03-14, at 11:29 AM, Aleeha Dudley wrote: > I guess I just don't see the problem with allowing people to interact > with you as though you are sighted. If for some reason, you can't see > that interaction, then tell them you are blind. > > > On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >> Our fine line is that we are trying to predict, and or control people's >> reactions. If you do not have a cane with you while walking in our >> country, >> people probably will not know you are blind. The original poster has every >> right to not use a cane and rely on functional vision. However, the >> reactions of people can't be controlled. If they don't know he is blind, >> they will react to him as if he is sighted. It is his choice. In America, >> I don't think we have a way to not carry a cane, but have everyone know >> that >> you are blind. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha Dudley >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:43 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >> >> Hi, >> I'm going to stick my "oar in" as they say. Kaiti and Mike, I think >> there may be a bit of misunderstanding. I think what is sought by the >> original poster on this thread is an identification symbol, something to >> say >> "I am blind" that is not as bulky as a cane. I definitely disagree with >> this. What I do not disagree with is using one's functional vision when you >> have it and, if that be your desire, to not use a cane if you don't need >> it. >> What I do disagree with is the concept of wanting the "you poor blind >> person" perks of blindness without carrying a cane, as the original poster >> seems to want. There is a fine line that I think is lost in the grey here. >> ALeeha >> >> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>> Kaiti: >>> >>> We shall have to agree to disagree. I see no reason to identify as >>> "visually impaired" unless one wishes special help or perks. Why not >>> just be blind and have done with the matter? Much simpler. >>> >>> In fact, I know a guy who was nearly totally blind for many years due >>> to an explosion. He got a good deal of sight back (he's lost it again >>> now) and used his sight to look around, traveling with a cane as he >>> always did; thus, he got the benefit of sight plus didn't have to >>> worry about when he should or should not use a cane, whether to >>> identify etc. etc. >>> >>> Peace! >>> >>> Mike Freeman >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>> Shelton >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:32 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>> >>> Mike, >>> >>> I have to disagree here. As one of those partials who elects when to >>> use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you may >>> not be considering. Electing when and when not to use a cane is not >>> always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; some >>> of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. >>> Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas >>> without a cane some times should give up their right to identify >>> themself as a visually impaired person. E.G, I would never do any >>> type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a >>> street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see >>> like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under >>> normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria right >>> across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm coming >>> right back I don't always choose to actively use it. My choice to not >>> use a cane in this instance does not mean I should forfit my right to >>> identify myself as a visually impaired person because I am; the use of >>> the cane does not change my inability to read print or to see great >>> distances and it does not change the fact that I am legally blind and >>> am identified that way. It also doesn't change the level of security >>> I have with my blindness; if a person refuses to use a cane or fights >>> against it because they're afraid of the social implications then that >>> is insecurity, but if they're visually having a good day and want to >>> run a quick errand that's in a very familiar area with minimal travel >>> or risk of injury and they're confident in their ability to use audio >>> cues and the vision they have then that is their choice and doesn't >>> make them insecure with themself or their blindness. As long as they >>> have the confidence and security to not be afraid of using it and to >>> identify and use it when they need to, to be confident and secure >>> whether they're using a cane or not, and don't pose risk to >>> themselves in the cases where they don't use it there is nothing that >>> would suggest insecurity. We don't know the exact visual situation of >>> anyone on this list unless they've written about it, so I don't think >>> it is fair to judge about someone's level of security with their >>> blindness based on their cane habits when we don't know what their >>> vision is like. >>> >>> Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social situations. >>> Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've >>> had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria with >>> my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention using >>> something besides my name. When they see the cane (or sometimes read >>> National Federation of the Blind on it if they're close enough to see >>> it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring >>> to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before >>> getting my name. Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an >>> opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then the >>> person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're >>> informed and they see that it's not a big deal. >>> >>> And, I have to make one small correction. The main market for the >>> lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may not >>> use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since they >>> are the ones who originated the telescopic design. Although I do know >>> people who are totally blind or only have light perception that use >>> the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty quickly >>> because they use them so much. For someone who may not use the cane >>> every single day but still would benefit from having an identifier to >>> let other people know they're visually impaired these canes are great. >>> Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild >>> hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need >>> one. Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can >>> see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not >>> tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. >>> In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to have >>> an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my eyes >>> because even if that person may not need to use it by having one for >>> people to see they must be okay with their blindness and comfortable >>> in explaining their visual impairment to others should the question >>> arise. >>> >>> On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >>>> Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to >>>> alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive >>>> thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that >>>> identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not >>>> of inferiority. >>>> >>>> Just my thoughts >>>> >>>> Chris Nusbaum >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hamid: >>>>> >>>>> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your cake >>>>> and eat it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages of >>>>> being recognized as blind whereas on the other, you don't want to >>>>> really appear blind or be judged because you do not believe you need >>>>> a cane. My friend, you can't have it both ways. Why do you even care >>>>> whether the public considers you blind or not or whether they >>>>> consider it weird that you might appear to not need a cane? >>>>> Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons >>>>> who use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows >>>>> them as blind whereas you consider that you do not? >>>>> >>>>> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >>>>> >>>>> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most >>>>> of us would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a >>>>> label to being prohibited from going places or doing things because >>>>> of the alleged inability of the blind. >>>>> >>>>> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >>>>> >>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid >>>>> Hamraz >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>> >>>>> Dear Folks, >>>>> >>>>> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to >>>>> represent my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To >>>>> be more precise, the target people benefiting are those whose >>>>> residual sight lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who >>>>> want to let the other people around them know about their blindness. >>>>> Carrying a cane is indeed an option. >>>>> However, >>>>> I >>>>> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using >>>>> it and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have a >>>>> special symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere in >>>>> any size at one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware of >>>>> that). However, there is no such a thing here in US, and setting >>>>> that up requires time and educating the society about that. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need >>>>> something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a >>>>> functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. >>>>> >>>>> Hamid >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.co >>>>> m >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g >>> mail.c >>> om >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% >>> 40gmai >>> l.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%4 >>> 0gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mworkman.lists%40gmail.com From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Fri Mar 15 02:48:53 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 22:48:53 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: <00c201ce2124$d05f5150$711df3f0$@panix.com> References: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com> <-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid> <004b01ce20c5$5a44fd80$0ecef880$@panix.com> <003901ce200e$9b1504c0$d13f0e40$@gmail.com> <004801ce2010$a9d558a0$fd8009e0$@gmail.com> <00c201ce2124$d05f5150$711df3f0$@panix.com> Message-ID: Mike, While many legally blind or low vision people avoid the tools of blindness, some of us do not. I know other low vision people who use canes and braille, for instance. Others have not warmed up to the need for instruction in those techniques if they are losing vision. But for those of us who grew up with some functional vision, if we had good educators, we learned to use both our vision and other senses together. I use my vision for tasks from identifying what type of cereal is on the shelf, to reading signs or seeing visual landmarks, to helping me clean up items in an area such as on a table. For me visually scanning may be faster than feeling around the whole surface although, I do some of that as well. So I see where Kaiti is coming from. I'd say that if you use nonvisual techniques such as a cane and braille you don't have to worry about the lighting or steps or other visual factors either. Also, I find that the public and my friends accept who I am. They become at ease with me if I'm easy going with them. Its only blind people that argue over this label thing. When Kaiti said this, it was said better than I could have done. "My personal choice to use VI over blind is that it makes things easier for people to understand. I have had some situations when I have used the term blind and people assume I can't see anything at all. This has lead to well-intended but unnecessary superhelping and other consequences. For me it's much simpler to say I'm visually impaired, indicating that I have some functional vision and giving sighted people a slightly clearer idea about me. " Well said Kaiti and I've had some experiences too where people assumed I couldn't see anything. Anyway, I think we'll just disagree here. But I'm glad Kaiti spoke up since those with no vision in NFB seem to be more vocal and its nice to find someone using low vision tools and nonvisual techniques together as I do. Ashley -----Original Message----- From: Mike Freeman Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:28 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID Kaiti: Part of the reason people are reacting is that all-too-often, people use "visually impaired", among other terms, as euphemisms to avoid their considering themselves blind. If I may begently churlish (a contradiction if I ever uttered one), even you insist upon the need to differentiate between "blind" and "visually impaired". In the office of an optometrist, oculist or ophthalmologist, I canunderstand this. But why should it matter for the general public to know or care? You don't have to explain anything to anyone and many of us (yes, even those with considerable vision) have just found it easier to callourselves "blind" and be done with it. No more worrying about when the lighting is good and when it is not; no more worrying about whether one might miss a step up or down; in short, sight goes into the background. That's thereasoning, anyway. You may feel differently and that's your right. But there's a reason we're the national Federation of the Blind rather than being the National Federation of the visually Limited. ACB has a Council of citizens with Low vision; we do not. (wide grin) Different strokes ... Mike -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 7:09 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID Josh, I don't believe I was on the list at the time of those posts, but besides that, in my last post I mentioned my reasoning behind using the term visually impaired. Your logic works for you and is accurate; you are totally blind so there is no question about terminology. However, for those of us with some functional sight visually impaired is a more accurate descriptor (see my last email for examples why). I'm sure most people are smart enough to separate the tow meanings of the word vision; obviously sight has no bearing on one's ability to form a vision of what they want to do or become in the future, but they are two separate things. All I'm asking is for a little more consideration of the perspectives of people with varying degrees of sight and the reasons for why they choose to do the things they do. Just because these choices and their needs might be different from someone who is totally blind that doesn't make them wrong. Arielle, I may not be the best person to shed light on this as I use my telescopic as a cane too, but I went to a Voc Rehab program for my state with a girl who had an identity cane but visually didn't need to use it much. She would carry it with her to let people know, but her vision was stable and good enough that she could read slightly enlarged print, (and I believe she got a provisional drivers license she can use as long as it's not dark or too bright outside too). I guess it goes back to just letting people know; she was very willing to discuss her vision with people if asked and identified herself as a visually impaired person, but functionally she had enough sight where using a cane in most circumstances would have just been something she didn't need. On 3/14/13, Arielle Silverman wrote: > Hi all, > I guess I'm not quite getting what the advantage is of an ID cane over > a regular one? With either cane, you are telling the world that you > are blind (or visually impaired or whatever term you want to use). The > ID cane gives you less tactile info than the regular one does. I > totally understand that sometimes you might not need a cane to get > around, but if you're going to use an ID cane anyway, why not just use > the regular one and get a little extra tactile info too? It might not > be necessary but it can't possibly hurt you to use a regular cane > instead of an ID cane. Is there some way an ID cane is more convenient > to use than a regular white cane? > I agree that sometimes it is more convenient to not use a cane at all > because it keeps your hands free. In those cases maybe wearing some > kind of ID symbol would better help with making sure others around you > know you are blind. However I think those situations where you really > need both of your hands are pretty unusual. > Arielle > > On 3/14/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >> Kaiti: >> Did you read my posts about "Visually Impaired, Vs. Blind?" >> Basicly for me, I'd rather refer to myself as blind, (I'm totally blind,) >> but I'm not "visually impaired." >> There's a difference between sight, and vision. >> I've talked about that alot on these lists. >> Sight, is natural, (what we lack,) but vision is inward. >> If we didn't have vision, there would be no NFB. >> Vision is like this. >> "Where do you see yourself, in the next 5 years?" >> Using that logic, our vision isn't impaired, but our sight is. >> Let's just refer to ourselves as blind and get it over with. >> Good point Mike! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:49 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >> >> Absolutely on that front. There is no point of interacting with >> people under false pretenses as if you were sighted... If one is >> worried about social situations due to people thinking they're blind, >> then they might want to think about the possible awkward situation of >> a friend suddenly finding out about something that important that was >> there all along and kept from them. >> >> On 3/14/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>> Hi, >>> >>> Mike, that is not how it works at all and I really have a problem with >>> the incinuation that people who identify themselves as visually >>> impaired use that title to get special treatment. I use my functional >>> vision as well as a cane when I feel it appropriate, and receive >>> accomodations such as braille, electronic format for textbooks, and >>> assistive technology that I need. I do what I can independently and >>> ask for sighted assistance when I need something read or would like a >>> little clarification on something visual that I cannot see. These are >>> not "special perks" as you put it. My personal choice to use VI over >>> blind is that it makes things easier for people to understand. I have >>> had some situations when I have used the term blind and people assume >>> I can't see anything at all. This has lead to well-intended but >>> unnecessary superhelping and other consequences. For me it's much >>> simpler to say I'm visually impaired, indicating that I have some >>> functional vision and giving sighted people a slightly clearer idea >>> about me. The NFB recognizes these terms "blind, legally blind, >>> visually impaired," as interchangeable, so it all comes down to >>> personal choice. There is nothing that says one term is preferential >>> over the other and has to be used by everyone. Afterall, visual >>> impairment is a continuum with varying degrees of blindness, so for >>> some visually impaired is a more accurate descriptor. >>> >>> I think that even if the original poster is slightly preoccupied with >>> the image of being blind then getting an identity cane might be the >>> first step in correcting that. The more people see it, the more he'll >>> have to answer questions about himself and his visual impairment and >>> get used to it. Not all, but some visually impaired people have to >>> psychologically ease into being comfortable with identifying >>> themselves in this way and that shouldn't be held against them if >>> that's what they have to do. Heck, I've even heard partially sighted >>> people speak at state conventions about how they grew more comfortable >>> with their blindness by beginning to associate themselves with the >>> NFB, so it sounds like the poster may be on the right track. Again, >>> we don't really know the situation; any one of us could be reading >>> something that the poster didn't intentionally mean because that is a >>> side-effect of electronic messages... things often get misconstrued. >>> He never said he didn't want to be identified as blind in order to >>> gain priveledges; he just wanted something to let people know, but he >>> still has enough functional vision to walk without a cane. I think >>> the wording about walking perfectly may be a little presumptuous, (no >>> one, blind or sighted, walks exactly perfectly because it's >>> anatomically impossible), but like I said this might be a good step in >>> putting blindness/visual impairment/whatever you'd like to call it >>> into perspective. >>> >>> >>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>> Just use whatever works. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>> Dudley >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:29 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>> >>>> I guess I just don't see the problem with allowing people to interact >>>> with >>>> you as though you are sighted. If for some reason, you can't see that >>>> interaction, then tell them you are blind. >>>> >>>> >>>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>> Our fine line is that we are trying to predict, and or control >>>>> people's reactions. If you do not have a cane with you while walking >>>>> in our country, people probably will not know you are blind. The >>>>> original poster has every right to not use a cane and rely on >>>>> functional vision. However, the reactions of people can't be >>>>> controlled. If they don't know he is blind, they will react to him as >>>>> if he is sighted. It is his choice. In America, I don't think we >>>>> have a way to not carry a cane, but have everyone know that you are >>>>> blind. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>>> Dudley >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:43 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>> I'm going to stick my "oar in" as they say. Kaiti and Mike, I >>>>> think there may be a bit of misunderstanding. I think what is sought >>>>> by the original poster on this thread is an identification symbol, >>>>> something to say "I am blind" that is not as bulky as a cane. I >>>>> definitely disagree with this. What I do not disagree with is using >>>>> one's functional vision when you have it and, if that be your desire, >>>>> to not use a cane if you don't need it. >>>>> What I do disagree with is the concept of wanting the "you poor blind >>>>> person" perks of blindness without carrying a cane, as the original >>>>> poster seems to want. There is a fine line that I think is lost in the >>>> grey here. >>>>> ALeeha >>>>> >>>>> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>> Kaiti: >>>>>> >>>>>> We shall have to agree to disagree. I see no reason to identify as >>>>>> "visually impaired" unless one wishes special help or perks. Why not >>>>>> just be blind and have done with the matter? Much simpler. >>>>>> >>>>>> In fact, I know a guy who was nearly totally blind for many years due >>>>>> to an explosion. He got a good deal of sight back (he's lost it again >>>>>> now) and used his sight to look around, traveling with a cane as he >>>>>> always did; thus, he got the benefit of sight plus didn't have to >>>>>> worry about when he should or should not use a cane, whether to >>>>>> identify etc. etc. >>>>>> >>>>>> Peace! >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>>>>> Shelton >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:32 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike, >>>>>> >>>>>> I have to disagree here. As one of those partials who elects when to >>>>>> use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you >>>>>> may not be considering. Electing when and when not to use a cane is >>>>>> not always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; >>>>>> some of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. >>>>>> Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas >>>>>> without a cane some times should give up their right to identify >>>>>> themself as a visually impaired person. E.G, I would never do any >>>>>> type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a >>>>>> street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see >>>>>> like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under >>>>>> normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria >>>>>> right across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm >>>>>> coming right back I don't always choose to actively use it. My >>>>>> choice to not use a cane in this instance does not mean I should >>>>>> forfit my right to identify myself as a visually impaired person >>>>>> because I am; the use of the cane does not change my inability to >>>>>> read print or to see great distances and it does not change the fact >>>>>> that I am legally blind and am identified that way. It also doesn't >>>>>> change the level of security I have with my blindness; if a person >>>>>> refuses to use a cane or fights against it because they're afraid of >>>>>> the social implications then that is insecurity, but if they're >>>>>> visually having a good day and want to run a quick errand that's in a >>>>>> very familiar area with minimal travel or risk of injury and they're >>>>>> confident in their ability to use audio cues and the vision they have >>>>>> then that is their choice and doesn't make them insecure with >>>>>> themself or their blindness. As long as they have the confidence and >>>>>> security to not be afraid of using it and to identify and use it when >>>>>> they need to, to be confident and secure whether they're using a cane >>>>>> or not, and don't pose risk to themselves in the cases where they >>>>>> don't use it there is nothing that would suggest insecurity. We >>>>>> don't know the exact visual situation of anyone on this list unless >>>>>> they've written about it, so I don't think it is fair to judge about >>>>>> someone's level of security with their blindness based on their cane >>>>>> habits when we don't know what their vision is like. >>>>>> >>>>>> Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social >>>>>> situations. >>>>>> Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've >>>>>> had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria >>>>>> with my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention >>>>>> using something besides my name. When they see the cane (or >>>>>> sometimes read National Federation of the Blind on it if they're >>>>>> close enough to see >>>>>> it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring >>>>>> to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before >>>>>> getting my name. Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an >>>>>> opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then >>>>>> the person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're >>>>>> informed and they see that it's not a big deal. >>>>>> >>>>>> And, I have to make one small correction. The main market for the >>>>>> lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may >>>>>> not use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since >>>>>> they are the ones who originated the telescopic design. Although I >>>>>> do know people who are totally blind or only have light perception >>>>>> that use the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty >>>>>> quickly because they use them so much. For someone who may not use >>>>>> the cane every single day but still would benefit from having an >>>>>> identifier to let other people know they're visually impaired these >>>>>> canes >>>> are great. >>>>>> Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild >>>>>> hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need >>>>>> one. Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can >>>>>> see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not >>>>>> tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. >>>>>> In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to >>>>>> have an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my >>>>>> eyes because even if that person may not need to use it by having one >>>>>> for people to see they must be okay with their blindness and >>>>>> comfortable in explaining their visual impairment to others should >>>>>> the question arise. >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >>>>>>> Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to >>>>>>> alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive >>>>>>> thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that >>>>>>> identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not >>>>>>> of inferiority. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Just my thoughts >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Chris Nusbaum >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hamid: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your >>>>>>>> cake and eat it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages >>>>>>>> of being recognized as blind whereas on the other, you don't want >>>>>>>> to really appear blind or be judged because you do not believe you >>>>>>>> need a cane. My friend, you can't have it both ways. Why do you >>>>>>>> even care whether the public considers you blind or not or whether >>>>>>>> they consider it weird that you might appear to not need a cane? >>>>>>>> Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons >>>>>>>> who use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows >>>>>>>> them as blind whereas you consider that you do not? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most >>>>>>>> of us would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a >>>>>>>> label to being prohibited from going places or doing things because >>>>>>>> of the alleged inability of the blind. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid >>>>>>>> Hamraz >>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Dear Folks, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to >>>>>>>> represent my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To >>>>>>>> be more precise, the target people benefiting are those whose >>>>>>>> residual sight lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who >>>>>>>> want to let the other people around them know about their >>>>>>>> blindness. >>>>>>>> Carrying a cane is indeed an option. >>>>>>>> However, >>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using >>>>>>>> it and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have >>>>>>>> a special symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere >>>>>>>> in any size at one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware >>>>>>>> of that). However, there is no such a thing here in US, and setting >>>>>>>> that up requires time and educating the society about that. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need >>>>>>>> something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a >>>>>>>> functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hamid >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.c >>>>>>>> o >>>>>>>> m >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40 >>>>>> g >>>>>> mail.c >>>>>> om >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104 >>>>>> % >>>>>> 40gmai >>>>>> l.com >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993% >>>>>> 4 >>>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>>> 0gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%4 >>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai l.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai l.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 02:54:16 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 22:54:16 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> Message-ID: <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of those little ones? -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much more cheaply than is the 5. Mike -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! I don't see why it's superior to the 5. Mike -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the Blind. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony Grima Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or DAISY: $9 Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full tutorial together and save! The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, and has a better camera. Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used in both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them easily. If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this update to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all the appendices. An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone reference card. Order at: http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html ****** To order any books, send payment to: NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge it: toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. Or order any of our books online at http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From k7uij at panix.com Fri Mar 15 02:55:56 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 19:55:56 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: References: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com><-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid><004b01ce20c5$5a44fd80$0ecef880$@panix.com><003901ce200e$9b1504c0$d13f0e40$@gmail.com><004801ce2010$a9d558a0$fd8009e0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <00cf01ce2128$9e1b70d0$da525270$@panix.com> Ashley: I think most of us (blind or partially-sighted) walk in familiar areas without a cane. Certainly I don't use one around the house. (grin) I suspect many Federationists would be less critical of "visually impaired" and like terms were people not to use such terms as a mechanism to avoid their considering themselves blind -- something most of us *do* consider crucial for good adjustment. But your descriptions below are valid and I have no argument with them. Oh yes -- if we could also get rid of both the saying that "in the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king" and the hierarchy of sight that most people believe in that is the wellspring of that statement, we'd also be less suspicious that alternative descriptions of visual problems are euphemisms. Incidentally, how well one travels doesn't necessarily indicate how much one sees. Mike Freeman -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley Bramlett Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 7:34 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID Kaiti, I understand where you are coming from. I always have my regular folding cane handy when out alone. As someone with functional vision, I also like the term visually impaired or low vision. I think I use it since I grew up with it and sort of adopted it as part of my identity. It wasn't til I met Federationists that I found everyone using the term blind; Nfb people do not distinguish those with some sight from totals. I understand why; but at the same time, it seems odd because someone who functions visually for some tasks well will use it in life and therefore may have some different needs than a totally blind person. Of course, those with visual impairments should learn nonvisual techniques unless their vision is always efficient and reliable. But in addition to nonvisual methods, they will certainly use vision. I do not walk outside on campus without a cane; its too unpredictable with steps, bumps, and curves. But, I would walk inside the dorm and some buildings either without a cane or just carrying it. It seemed faster to do this for me and not be concerned with the cane's arc and hitting someone. Just as you explained, I feel that walking without a cane for a short predictable distance doesn't say anything about my adjustment to blindness. I'm comfortable with my visual condition and will talk about it if needed or educate people. It doesn't mean I'm hiding the condition or anything. I know some low vision people who are embarrassed to use canes, so I can see why the totally blind people who spoke up would think that. But this is not the case for all legally blind people. As for the terms, I think people know the difference between sight and vision. So, I don't see why that would play into your argument. For Josh, saying blind makes sense. But I'd have to say that downplaying other terms seems a bit far to me. I think those of us with vision have to balance when to use it and what tools to use. If we make a knowledgable and informed choice, we are well off and hopefully compete well. I don't have enough vision to walk much without a cane or simply hold an ID cane. So for me, a regular cane is in my tool box, but for someone else who is just on the threshhold of legal blindness, they may choose a ID cane. Ashley -----Original Message----- From: Kaiti Shelton Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:08 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID Josh, I don't believe I was on the list at the time of those posts, but besides that, in my last post I mentioned my reasoning behind using the term visually impaired. Your logic works for you and is accurate; you are totally blind so there is no question about terminology. However, for those of us with some functional sight visually impaired is a more accurate descriptor (see my last email for examples why). I'm sure most people are smart enough to separate the tow meanings of the word vision; obviously sight has no bearing on one's ability to form a vision of what they want to do or become in the future, but they are two separate things. All I'm asking is for a little more consideration of the perspectives of people with varying degrees of sight and the reasons for why they choose to do the things they do. Just because these choices and their needs might be different from someone who is totally blind that doesn't make them wrong. Arielle, I may not be the best person to shed light on this as I use my telescopic as a cane too, but I went to a Voc Rehab program for my state with a girl who had an identity cane but visually didn't need to use it much. She would carry it with her to let people know, but her vision was stable and good enough that she could read slightly enlarged print, (and I believe she got a provisional drivers license she can use as long as it's not dark or too bright outside too). I guess it goes back to just letting people know; she was very willing to discuss her vision with people if asked and identified herself as a visually impaired person, but functionally she had enough sight where using a cane in most circumstances would have just been something she didn't need. On 3/14/13, Arielle Silverman wrote: > Hi all, > I guess I'm not quite getting what the advantage is of an ID cane over > a regular one? With either cane, you are telling the world that you > are blind (or visually impaired or whatever term you want to use). The > ID cane gives you less tactile info than the regular one does. I > totally understand that sometimes you might not need a cane to get > around, but if you're going to use an ID cane anyway, why not just use > the regular one and get a little extra tactile info too? It might not > be necessary but it can't possibly hurt you to use a regular cane > instead of an ID cane. Is there some way an ID cane is more convenient > to use than a regular white cane? > I agree that sometimes it is more convenient to not use a cane at all > because it keeps your hands free. In those cases maybe wearing some > kind of ID symbol would better help with making sure others around you > know you are blind. However I think those situations where you really > need both of your hands are pretty unusual. > Arielle > > On 3/14/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >> Kaiti: >> Did you read my posts about "Visually Impaired, Vs. Blind?" >> Basicly for me, I'd rather refer to myself as blind, (I'm totally blind,) >> but I'm not "visually impaired." >> There's a difference between sight, and vision. >> I've talked about that alot on these lists. >> Sight, is natural, (what we lack,) but vision is inward. >> If we didn't have vision, there would be no NFB. >> Vision is like this. >> "Where do you see yourself, in the next 5 years?" >> Using that logic, our vision isn't impaired, but our sight is. >> Let's just refer to ourselves as blind and get it over with. >> Good point Mike! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:49 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >> >> Absolutely on that front. There is no point of interacting with >> people under false pretenses as if you were sighted... If one is >> worried about social situations due to people thinking they're blind, >> then they might want to think about the possible awkward situation of >> a friend suddenly finding out about something that important that was >> there all along and kept from them. >> >> On 3/14/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>> Hi, >>> >>> Mike, that is not how it works at all and I really have a problem with >>> the incinuation that people who identify themselves as visually >>> impaired use that title to get special treatment. I use my functional >>> vision as well as a cane when I feel it appropriate, and receive >>> accomodations such as braille, electronic format for textbooks, and >>> assistive technology that I need. I do what I can independently and >>> ask for sighted assistance when I need something read or would like a >>> little clarification on something visual that I cannot see. These are >>> not "special perks" as you put it. My personal choice to use VI over >>> blind is that it makes things easier for people to understand. I have >>> had some situations when I have used the term blind and people assume >>> I can't see anything at all. This has lead to well-intended but >>> unnecessary superhelping and other consequences. For me it's much >>> simpler to say I'm visually impaired, indicating that I have some >>> functional vision and giving sighted people a slightly clearer idea >>> about me. The NFB recognizes these terms "blind, legally blind, >>> visually impaired," as interchangeable, so it all comes down to >>> personal choice. There is nothing that says one term is preferential >>> over the other and has to be used by everyone. Afterall, visual >>> impairment is a continuum with varying degrees of blindness, so for >>> some visually impaired is a more accurate descriptor. >>> >>> I think that even if the original poster is slightly preoccupied with >>> the image of being blind then getting an identity cane might be the >>> first step in correcting that. The more people see it, the more he'll >>> have to answer questions about himself and his visual impairment and >>> get used to it. Not all, but some visually impaired people have to >>> psychologically ease into being comfortable with identifying >>> themselves in this way and that shouldn't be held against them if >>> that's what they have to do. Heck, I've even heard partially sighted >>> people speak at state conventions about how they grew more comfortable >>> with their blindness by beginning to associate themselves with the >>> NFB, so it sounds like the poster may be on the right track. Again, >>> we don't really know the situation; any one of us could be reading >>> something that the poster didn't intentionally mean because that is a >>> side-effect of electronic messages... things often get misconstrued. >>> He never said he didn't want to be identified as blind in order to >>> gain priveledges; he just wanted something to let people know, but he >>> still has enough functional vision to walk without a cane. I think >>> the wording about walking perfectly may be a little presumptuous, (no >>> one, blind or sighted, walks exactly perfectly because it's >>> anatomically impossible), but like I said this might be a good step in >>> putting blindness/visual impairment/whatever you'd like to call it >>> into perspective. >>> >>> >>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>> Just use whatever works. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>> Dudley >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:29 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>> >>>> I guess I just don't see the problem with allowing people to interact >>>> with >>>> you as though you are sighted. If for some reason, you can't see that >>>> interaction, then tell them you are blind. >>>> >>>> >>>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>> Our fine line is that we are trying to predict, and or control >>>>> people's reactions. If you do not have a cane with you while walking >>>>> in our country, people probably will not know you are blind. The >>>>> original poster has every right to not use a cane and rely on >>>>> functional vision. However, the reactions of people can't be >>>>> controlled. If they don't know he is blind, they will react to him as >>>>> if he is sighted. It is his choice. In America, I don't think we >>>>> have a way to not carry a cane, but have everyone know that you are >>>>> blind. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>>> Dudley >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:43 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>> I'm going to stick my "oar in" as they say. Kaiti and Mike, I >>>>> think there may be a bit of misunderstanding. I think what is sought >>>>> by the original poster on this thread is an identification symbol, >>>>> something to say "I am blind" that is not as bulky as a cane. I >>>>> definitely disagree with this. What I do not disagree with is using >>>>> one's functional vision when you have it and, if that be your desire, >>>>> to not use a cane if you don't need it. >>>>> What I do disagree with is the concept of wanting the "you poor blind >>>>> person" perks of blindness without carrying a cane, as the original >>>>> poster seems to want. There is a fine line that I think is lost in the >>>> grey here. >>>>> ALeeha >>>>> >>>>> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>> Kaiti: >>>>>> >>>>>> We shall have to agree to disagree. I see no reason to identify as >>>>>> "visually impaired" unless one wishes special help or perks. Why not >>>>>> just be blind and have done with the matter? Much simpler. >>>>>> >>>>>> In fact, I know a guy who was nearly totally blind for many years due >>>>>> to an explosion. He got a good deal of sight back (he's lost it again >>>>>> now) and used his sight to look around, traveling with a cane as he >>>>>> always did; thus, he got the benefit of sight plus didn't have to >>>>>> worry about when he should or should not use a cane, whether to >>>>>> identify etc. etc. >>>>>> >>>>>> Peace! >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>>>>> Shelton >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:32 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike, >>>>>> >>>>>> I have to disagree here. As one of those partials who elects when to >>>>>> use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you >>>>>> may not be considering. Electing when and when not to use a cane is >>>>>> not always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; >>>>>> some of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. >>>>>> Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas >>>>>> without a cane some times should give up their right to identify >>>>>> themself as a visually impaired person. E.G, I would never do any >>>>>> type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a >>>>>> street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see >>>>>> like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under >>>>>> normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria >>>>>> right across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm >>>>>> coming right back I don't always choose to actively use it. My >>>>>> choice to not use a cane in this instance does not mean I should >>>>>> forfit my right to identify myself as a visually impaired person >>>>>> because I am; the use of the cane does not change my inability to >>>>>> read print or to see great distances and it does not change the fact >>>>>> that I am legally blind and am identified that way. It also doesn't >>>>>> change the level of security I have with my blindness; if a person >>>>>> refuses to use a cane or fights against it because they're afraid of >>>>>> the social implications then that is insecurity, but if they're >>>>>> visually having a good day and want to run a quick errand that's in a >>>>>> very familiar area with minimal travel or risk of injury and they're >>>>>> confident in their ability to use audio cues and the vision they have >>>>>> then that is their choice and doesn't make them insecure with >>>>>> themself or their blindness. As long as they have the confidence and >>>>>> security to not be afraid of using it and to identify and use it when >>>>>> they need to, to be confident and secure whether they're using a cane >>>>>> or not, and don't pose risk to themselves in the cases where they >>>>>> don't use it there is nothing that would suggest insecurity. We >>>>>> don't know the exact visual situation of anyone on this list unless >>>>>> they've written about it, so I don't think it is fair to judge about >>>>>> someone's level of security with their blindness based on their cane >>>>>> habits when we don't know what their vision is like. >>>>>> >>>>>> Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social >>>>>> situations. >>>>>> Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've >>>>>> had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria >>>>>> with my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention >>>>>> using something besides my name. When they see the cane (or >>>>>> sometimes read National Federation of the Blind on it if they're >>>>>> close enough to see >>>>>> it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring >>>>>> to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before >>>>>> getting my name. Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an >>>>>> opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then >>>>>> the person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're >>>>>> informed and they see that it's not a big deal. >>>>>> >>>>>> And, I have to make one small correction. The main market for the >>>>>> lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may >>>>>> not use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since >>>>>> they are the ones who originated the telescopic design. Although I >>>>>> do know people who are totally blind or only have light perception >>>>>> that use the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty >>>>>> quickly because they use them so much. For someone who may not use >>>>>> the cane every single day but still would benefit from having an >>>>>> identifier to let other people know they're visually impaired these >>>>>> canes >>>> are great. >>>>>> Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild >>>>>> hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need >>>>>> one. Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can >>>>>> see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not >>>>>> tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. >>>>>> In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to >>>>>> have an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my >>>>>> eyes because even if that person may not need to use it by having one >>>>>> for people to see they must be okay with their blindness and >>>>>> comfortable in explaining their visual impairment to others should >>>>>> the question arise. >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >>>>>>> Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to >>>>>>> alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive >>>>>>> thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that >>>>>>> identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not >>>>>>> of inferiority. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Just my thoughts >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Chris Nusbaum >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hamid: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your >>>>>>>> cake and eat it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages >>>>>>>> of being recognized as blind whereas on the other, you don't want >>>>>>>> to really appear blind or be judged because you do not believe you >>>>>>>> need a cane. My friend, you can't have it both ways. Why do you >>>>>>>> even care whether the public considers you blind or not or whether >>>>>>>> they consider it weird that you might appear to not need a cane? >>>>>>>> Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons >>>>>>>> who use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows >>>>>>>> them as blind whereas you consider that you do not? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most >>>>>>>> of us would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a >>>>>>>> label to being prohibited from going places or doing things because >>>>>>>> of the alleged inability of the blind. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid >>>>>>>> Hamraz >>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Dear Folks, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to >>>>>>>> represent my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To >>>>>>>> be more precise, the target people benefiting are those whose >>>>>>>> residual sight lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who >>>>>>>> want to let the other people around them know about their >>>>>>>> blindness. >>>>>>>> Carrying a cane is indeed an option. >>>>>>>> However, >>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using >>>>>>>> it and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have >>>>>>>> a special symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere >>>>>>>> in any size at one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware >>>>>>>> of that). However, there is no such a thing here in US, and setting >>>>>>>> that up requires time and educating the society about that. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need >>>>>>>> something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a >>>>>>>> functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hamid >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.c >>>>>>>> o >>>>>>>> m >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40 >>>>>> g >>>>>> mail.c >>>>>> om >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104 >>>>>> % >>>>>> 40gmai >>>>>> l.com >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993% >>>>>> 4 >>>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>>> 0gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%4 >>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai l.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai l.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink. net _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From mrbobprinter2012 at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 03:55:35 2013 From: mrbobprinter2012 at gmail.com (Robert A Hansen) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 22:55:35 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID Message-ID: <4y8ojjtr72l0dwmbvh3qqmrk.1363319638565@email.android.com> The word blind has many meanings.  Too mny for me to count. Robert H Sent from Samsung tabletMike Freeman wrote:Ashley: I think most of us (blind or partially-sighted) walk in familiar areas without a cane. Certainly I don't use one around the house. (grin) I suspect many Federationists would be less critical of "visually impaired" and like terms were people not to use such terms as a mechanism to avoid their considering themselves blind -- something most of us *do* consider crucial for good adjustment. But your descriptions below are valid and I have no argument with them. Oh yes -- if we could also get rid of both the saying that "in the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king" and the hierarchy of sight that most people believe in that is the wellspring of that statement, we'd also be less suspicious that alternative descriptions of visual problems are euphemisms. Incidentally, how well one travels doesn't necessarily indicate how much one sees. Mike Freeman -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley Bramlett Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 7:34 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID Kaiti, I understand where you are coming from. I always have my regular folding cane handy when out alone. As someone with functional vision, I also like the term visually impaired or low vision. I think I use it since I grew up with it and sort of adopted it as part of my identity. It wasn't til I met Federationists that I found everyone using the term blind; Nfb people do not distinguish those with some sight from totals. I understand why; but at the same time, it seems odd because someone who functions visually for some tasks well will use it in life and therefore may have some different needs than a totally  blind person. Of course, those with visual impairments should learn nonvisual techniques unless their vision is always efficient and reliable. But in addition to nonvisual methods, they will certainly use vision. I do not walk outside on campus without a cane; its too unpredictable with steps, bumps, and curves. But, I would walk  inside the dorm and some buildings either without a cane or just carrying it. It seemed faster to do this for me and not be concerned with the cane's arc and hitting someone. Just as you explained, I feel that walking without a cane for a short predictable distance doesn't say anything about my adjustment to blindness. I'm comfortable with my visual condition and will talk about it if needed or educate people. It doesn't mean I'm hiding the condition or anything. I know some low vision people who are embarrassed to use canes, so I can see why the totally blind people who spoke up would think that. But this is not the case for all legally blind people. As for the terms, I think people know the difference between sight and vision. So, I don't see why that would play into your argument. For Josh, saying blind makes sense. But I'd have to say that downplaying other terms seems a bit far to me. I think those of us with vision have to balance when to use it and what tools to use. If we make a knowledgable and informed choice, we are well off and hopefully compete well. I don't have enough vision to walk much without a cane or simply hold an ID cane. So for me, a regular cane is in my tool box, but for someone else who is just on the threshhold of legal blindness, they may choose a ID cane. Ashley -----Original Message----- From: Kaiti Shelton Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:08 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID Josh, I don't believe I was on the list at the time of those posts, but besides that, in my last post I mentioned my reasoning behind using the term visually impaired.  Your logic works for you and is accurate; you are totally blind so there is no question about terminology. However, for those of us with some functional sight visually impaired is a more accurate descriptor (see my last email for examples why). I'm sure most people are smart enough to separate the tow meanings of the word vision; obviously sight has no bearing on one's ability to form a vision of what they want to do or become in the future, but they are two separate things. All I'm asking is for a little more consideration of the perspectives of people with varying degrees of sight and the reasons for why they choose to do the things they do.  Just because these choices and their needs might be different from someone who is totally blind that doesn't make them wrong. Arielle, I may not be the best person to shed light on this as I use my telescopic as a cane too, but I went to a Voc Rehab program for my state with a girl who had an identity cane but visually didn't need to use it much.  She would carry it with her to let people know, but her vision was stable and good enough that she could read slightly enlarged print, (and I believe she got a provisional drivers license she can use as long as it's not dark or too bright outside too).  I guess it goes back to just letting people know; she was very willing to discuss her vision with people if asked and identified herself as a visually impaired person, but functionally she had enough sight where using a cane in most circumstances would have just been something she didn't need. On 3/14/13, Arielle Silverman wrote: > Hi all, > I guess I'm not quite getting what the advantage is of an ID cane over > a regular one? With either cane, you are telling the world that you > are blind (or visually impaired or whatever term you want to use). The > ID cane gives you less tactile info than the regular one does. I > totally understand that sometimes you might not need a cane to get > around, but if you're going to use an ID cane anyway, why not just use > the regular one and get a little extra tactile info too? It might not > be necessary but it can't possibly hurt you to use a regular cane > instead of an ID cane. Is there some way an ID cane is more convenient > to use than a regular white cane? > I agree that sometimes it is more convenient to not use a cane at all > because it keeps your hands free. In those cases maybe wearing some > kind of ID symbol would better help with making sure others around you > know you are blind. However I think those situations where you really > need both of your hands are pretty unusual. > Arielle > > On 3/14/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >> Kaiti: >> Did you read my posts about "Visually Impaired, Vs. Blind?" >> Basicly for me, I'd rather refer to myself as blind, (I'm totally blind,) >> but I'm not "visually impaired." >> There's a difference between sight, and vision. >> I've talked about that alot on these lists. >> Sight, is natural, (what we lack,) but vision is inward. >> If we didn't have vision, there would be no NFB. >> Vision is like this. >> "Where do you see yourself, in the next 5 years?" >> Using that logic, our vision isn't impaired, but our sight is. >> Let's just refer to ourselves as blind and get it over with. >> Good point Mike! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:49 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >> >> Absolutely on that front.  There is no point of interacting with >> people under false pretenses as if you were sighted... If one is >> worried about social situations due to people thinking they're blind, >> then they might want to think about the possible awkward situation of >> a friend suddenly finding out about something that important that was >> there all along and kept from them. >> >> On 3/14/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>> Hi, >>> >>> Mike, that is not how it works at all and I really have a problem with >>> the incinuation that people who identify themselves as visually >>> impaired use that title to get special treatment.  I use my functional >>> vision as well as a cane when I feel it appropriate, and receive >>> accomodations such as braille, electronic format for textbooks, and >>> assistive technology that I need.  I do what I can independently and >>> ask for sighted assistance when I need something read or would like a >>> little clarification on something visual that I cannot see.  These are >>> not "special perks" as you put it.  My personal choice to use VI over >>> blind is that it makes things easier for people to understand.  I have >>> had some situations when I have used the term blind and people assume >>> I can't see anything at all.  This has lead to well-intended but >>> unnecessary superhelping and other consequences.  For me it's much >>> simpler to say I'm visually impaired, indicating that I have some >>> functional vision and giving sighted people a slightly clearer idea >>> about me.  The NFB recognizes these terms "blind, legally blind, >>> visually impaired," as interchangeable, so it all comes down to >>> personal choice.  There is nothing that says one term is preferential >>> over the other and has to be used by everyone.  Afterall, visual >>> impairment is a continuum with varying degrees of blindness, so for >>> some visually impaired is a more accurate descriptor. >>> >>> I think that even if the original poster is slightly preoccupied with >>> the image of being blind then getting an identity cane might be the >>> first step in correcting that.  The more people see it, the more he'll >>> have to answer questions about himself and his visual impairment and >>> get used to it.  Not all, but some visually impaired people have to >>> psychologically ease into being comfortable with identifying >>> themselves in this way and that shouldn't be held against them if >>> that's what they have to do.  Heck, I've even heard partially sighted >>> people speak at state conventions about how they grew more comfortable >>> with their blindness by beginning to associate themselves with the >>> NFB, so it sounds like the poster may be on the right track.  Again, >>> we don't really know the situation; any one of us could be reading >>> something that the poster didn't intentionally mean because that is a >>> side-effect of electronic messages... things often get misconstrued. >>> He never said he didn't want to be identified as blind in order to >>> gain priveledges; he just wanted something to let people know, but he >>> still has enough functional vision to walk without a cane.  I think >>> the wording about walking perfectly may be a little presumptuous, (no >>> one, blind or sighted, walks exactly perfectly because it's >>> anatomically impossible), but like I said this might be a good step in >>> putting blindness/visual impairment/whatever you'd like to call it >>> into perspective. >>> >>> >>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>> Just use whatever works. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>> Dudley >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:29 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>> >>>> I guess I just don't see the problem with allowing people to interact >>>> with >>>> you as though you are sighted. If for some reason, you can't see that >>>> interaction, then tell them you are blind. >>>> >>>> >>>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>> Our fine line is that we are trying to predict, and or control >>>>> people's reactions.  If you do not have a cane with you while walking >>>>> in our country, people probably will not know you are blind.  The >>>>> original poster has every right to not use a cane and rely on >>>>> functional vision. However, the reactions of people can't be >>>>> controlled.  If they don't know he is blind, they will react to him as >>>>> if he is sighted.  It is his choice.  In America, I don't think we >>>>> have a way to not carry a cane, but have everyone know that you are >>>>> blind. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>>> Dudley >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:43 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>>      I'm going to stick my "oar in" as they say. Kaiti and Mike, I >>>>> think there may be a bit of misunderstanding. I think what is sought >>>>> by the original poster on this thread is an identification symbol, >>>>> something to say "I am blind" that is not as bulky as a cane. I >>>>> definitely disagree with this. What I do not disagree with is using >>>>> one's functional vision when you have it and, if that be your desire, >>>>> to not use a cane if you don't need it. >>>>> What I do disagree with is the concept of wanting the "you poor blind >>>>> person" perks of blindness without carrying a cane, as the original >>>>> poster seems to want. There is a fine line that I think is lost in the >>>> grey here. >>>>> ALeeha >>>>> >>>>> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>> Kaiti: >>>>>> >>>>>> We shall have to agree to disagree. I see no reason to identify as >>>>>> "visually impaired" unless one wishes special help or perks. Why not >>>>>> just be blind and have done with the matter? Much simpler. >>>>>> >>>>>> In fact, I know a guy who was nearly totally blind for many years due >>>>>> to an explosion. He got a good deal of sight back (he's lost it again >>>>>> now) and used his sight to look around, traveling with a cane as he >>>>>> always did; thus, he got the benefit of sight plus didn't have to >>>>>> worry about when he should or should not use a cane, whether to >>>>>> identify etc. etc. >>>>>> >>>>>> Peace! >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>>>>> Shelton >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:32 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike, >>>>>> >>>>>> I have to disagree here.  As one of those partials who elects when to >>>>>> use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you >>>>>> may not be considering.  Electing when and when not to use a cane is >>>>>> not always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; >>>>>> some of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. >>>>>> Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas >>>>>> without a cane some times should give up their right to identify >>>>>> themself as a visually impaired person.  E.G, I would never do any >>>>>> type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a >>>>>> street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see >>>>>> like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under >>>>>> normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria >>>>>> right across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm >>>>>> coming right back I don't always choose to actively use it.  My >>>>>> choice to not use a cane in this instance does not mean I should >>>>>> forfit my right to identify myself as a visually impaired person >>>>>> because I am; the use of the cane does not change my inability to >>>>>> read print or to see great distances and it does not change the fact >>>>>> that I am legally blind and am identified that way.  It also doesn't >>>>>> change the level of security I have with my blindness; if a person >>>>>> refuses to use a cane or fights against it because they're afraid of >>>>>> the social implications then that is insecurity, but if they're >>>>>> visually having a good day and want to run a quick errand that's in a >>>>>> very familiar area with minimal travel or risk of injury and they're >>>>>> confident in their ability to use audio cues and the vision they have >>>>>> then that is their choice and doesn't make them insecure with >>>>>> themself or their blindness.  As long as they have the confidence and >>>>>> security to not be afraid of using it and to identify and use it when >>>>>> they need to, to be confident and secure whether they're using a cane >>>>>> or not,  and  don't pose risk to themselves in the cases where they >>>>>> don't use it there is nothing that would suggest insecurity.  We >>>>>> don't know the exact visual situation of anyone on this list unless >>>>>> they've written about it, so I don't think it is fair to judge about >>>>>> someone's level of security with their blindness based on their cane >>>>>> habits when we don't know what their vision is like. >>>>>> >>>>>> Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social >>>>>> situations. >>>>>>  Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've >>>>>> had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria >>>>>> with my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention >>>>>> using something besides my name.  When they see the cane (or >>>>>> sometimes read National Federation of the Blind on it if they're >>>>>> close enough to see >>>>>> it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring >>>>>> to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before >>>>>> getting my name.  Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an >>>>>> opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then >>>>>> the person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're >>>>>> informed and they see that it's not a big deal. >>>>>> >>>>>> And, I have to make one small correction.  The main market for the >>>>>> lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may >>>>>> not use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since >>>>>> they are the ones who originated the telescopic design.  Although I >>>>>> do know people who are totally blind or only have light perception >>>>>> that use the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty >>>>>> quickly because they use them so much.  For someone who may not use >>>>>> the cane every single day but still would benefit from having an >>>>>> identifier to let other people know they're visually impaired these >>>>>> canes >>>> are great. >>>>>>  Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild >>>>>> hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need >>>>>> one.  Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can >>>>>> see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not >>>>>> tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. >>>>>> In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to >>>>>> have an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my >>>>>> eyes because even if that person may not need to use it by having one >>>>>> for people to see they must be okay with their blindness and >>>>>> comfortable in explaining their visual impairment to others should >>>>>> the question arise. >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >>>>>>> Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to >>>>>>> alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive >>>>>>> thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that >>>>>>> identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not >>>>>>> of inferiority. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Just my thoughts >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Chris Nusbaum >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hamid: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your >>>>>>>> cake and eat it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages >>>>>>>> of being recognized as blind whereas on the other, you don't want >>>>>>>> to really appear blind or be judged because you do not believe you >>>>>>>> need a cane. My friend, you can't have it both ways. Why do you >>>>>>>> even care whether the public considers you blind or not or whether >>>>>>>> they consider it weird that you might appear to not need a cane? >>>>>>>> Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons >>>>>>>> who use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows >>>>>>>> them as blind whereas you consider that you do not? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most >>>>>>>> of us would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a >>>>>>>> label to being prohibited from going places or doing things because >>>>>>>> of the alleged inability of the blind. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid >>>>>>>> Hamraz >>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Dear Folks, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to >>>>>>>> represent my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To >>>>>>>> be more precise, the target people benefiting are those whose >>>>>>>> residual sight lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who >>>>>>>> want to let the other people around them know about their >>>>>>>> blindness. >>>>>>>> Carrying a cane is indeed an option. >>>>>>>> However, >>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using >>>>>>>> it and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have >>>>>>>> a special symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere >>>>>>>> in any size at one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware >>>>>>>> of that). However, there is no such a thing here in US, and setting >>>>>>>> that up requires time and educating the society about that. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need >>>>>>>> something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a >>>>>>>> functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hamid >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.c >>>>>>>> o >>>>>>>> m >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40 >>>>>> g >>>>>> mail.c >>>>>> om >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104 >>>>>> % >>>>>> 40gmai >>>>>> l.com >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993% >>>>>> 4 >>>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>>> 0gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%4 >>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai l.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai l.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink. net _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mrbobprinter2012%40gmail.com From bunnykatie6 at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 04:41:18 2013 From: bunnykatie6 at gmail.com (Katie Wang) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 00:41:18 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs In-Reply-To: <018701ce2104$b9163830$2b42a890$@gmail.com> References: <850CD7D3-28A6-4CE4-A12D-DC504341F7B3@panix.com> <018701ce2104$b9163830$2b42a890$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi all, I'm in the same boat as Cindy and would really like to use Google Doc to collaborate with my colleagues. I have Google Drive on my Ipod Touch, which enables me to read all the uploaded content, but I find editing to be quite tedious even with a Bluetooth keyboard. I haven't had any luck with the desktop version of Google Drive - I just installed it on my PC but JAWS wouldn't even speak the sign-in screen. Any suggestions for possible work-arounds would be much appreciated! Katie On 3/14/13, Joe wrote: > Have you downloaded the desktop app? It should work like Dropbox and be > just > as accessible. > > Joe > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Cindy Bennett > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:49 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs > > I'm not sure what is going on exactly. I personally have never experienced > the problem. It is true though that the "conflicted copy" > thing is annoying. People cannot work on documents at the same time, and > when they do, if you do not make sure to transfer all of the new data from > the conflicted copy to the parent copy, you can end up inadvertently losing > information. > > Also, my lab has always used Google docs, so I would prefer to use the same > system as my colleagues. > > Any help would be appreciated. > > Thanks. > > Cindy > > > On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >> Under what circumstances are files being deleted from your friend's > dropbox? >> What app is she using? >> >> Mike Freeman >> sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 14, 2013, at 11:56, Cindy Bennett wrote: >> >>> Hi everyone, >>> >>> When I get to the Google Drive web page, I notice that there are a >>> series of buttons such as create, upload, and share. How do you get >>> these buttons to activate? I pressed enter on the create button and >>> JAWS said "loading" and then "load complete," but I can't find where >>> the document is to write. >>> >>> I am really interested in exploring accessibility, and I know there >>> are a couple of workarounds. But I am in a situation where one of my >>> colleagues is having files oddly deleted from her Dropbox and is >>> incredibly frustrated and wants to switch to Google docs right now. >>> So I am trying to get some quick answers to investigate preliminary >>> accessibility. >>> >>> I know that with Google Calendar, I have an incredibly difficult time >>> pressing the buttons to create and share calendars. I know there is a >>> Google accessibility web page, but their advice really hasn't worked >>> for me. I know that there is a series of JAWS commands such as >>> rooting the jaws cursor to the pc cursor and left mouse clicking, and >>> that really doesn't work for me although maybe I am doing it >>> incorrectly. >>> >>> The Google docs web page seems to have some similarities in a >>> negative way to the web interface of Google Calendar. >>> >>> Does anyone use Google docs on their iPhone? I have a blue tooth >>> keyboard so although no optimal, I could do that. >>> >>> Does anyone use Google docs on their mac? >>> >>> I have a duel system meaning that I use bootcamp. I really haven't >>> found VoiceOver to be as efficient, and I really don't want to have >>> to switch sides every time I need to work on a Google doc, but I am >>> curious. >>> >>> Thanks for your input, and sorry for all of the details. I always >>> appreciate the help I receive from this list. >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Cindy Bennett >>> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative >>> Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington >>> >>> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >>> clb5590 at gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.co >> m >> > > > -- > Cindy Bennett > Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative Coordinator: > National Federation of the Blind of Washington > > B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington > clb5590 at gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmail.com > From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 05:57:04 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 01:57:04 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs In-Reply-To: References: <850CD7D3-28A6-4CE4-A12D-DC504341F7B3@panix.com> <018701ce2104$b9163830$2b42a890$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <007801ce2078$c4b650d0$4e22f270$@gmail.com> Is this how we are suppose to text? Please forgive me, I know nothing about I phone as ofyet. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Katie Wang Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 12:41 AM To: jsoro620 at gmail.com; National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs Hi all, I'm in the same boat as Cindy and would really like to use Google Doc to collaborate with my colleagues. I have Google Drive on my Ipod Touch, which enables me to read all the uploaded content, but I find editing to be quite tedious even with a Bluetooth keyboard. I haven't had any luck with the desktop version of Google Drive - I just installed it on my PC but JAWS wouldn't even speak the sign-in screen. Any suggestions for possible work-arounds would be much appreciated! Katie On 3/14/13, Joe wrote: > Have you downloaded the desktop app? It should work like Dropbox and be > just > as accessible. > > Joe > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Cindy Bennett > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:49 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs > > I'm not sure what is going on exactly. I personally have never experienced > the problem. It is true though that the "conflicted copy" > thing is annoying. People cannot work on documents at the same time, and > when they do, if you do not make sure to transfer all of the new data from > the conflicted copy to the parent copy, you can end up inadvertently losing > information. > > Also, my lab has always used Google docs, so I would prefer to use the same > system as my colleagues. > > Any help would be appreciated. > > Thanks. > > Cindy > > > On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >> Under what circumstances are files being deleted from your friend's > dropbox? >> What app is she using? >> >> Mike Freeman >> sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 14, 2013, at 11:56, Cindy Bennett wrote: >> >>> Hi everyone, >>> >>> When I get to the Google Drive web page, I notice that there are a >>> series of buttons such as create, upload, and share. How do you get >>> these buttons to activate? I pressed enter on the create button and >>> JAWS said "loading" and then "load complete," but I can't find where >>> the document is to write. >>> >>> I am really interested in exploring accessibility, and I know there >>> are a couple of workarounds. But I am in a situation where one of my >>> colleagues is having files oddly deleted from her Dropbox and is >>> incredibly frustrated and wants to switch to Google docs right now. >>> So I am trying to get some quick answers to investigate preliminary >>> accessibility. >>> >>> I know that with Google Calendar, I have an incredibly difficult time >>> pressing the buttons to create and share calendars. I know there is a >>> Google accessibility web page, but their advice really hasn't worked >>> for me. I know that there is a series of JAWS commands such as >>> rooting the jaws cursor to the pc cursor and left mouse clicking, and >>> that really doesn't work for me although maybe I am doing it >>> incorrectly. >>> >>> The Google docs web page seems to have some similarities in a >>> negative way to the web interface of Google Calendar. >>> >>> Does anyone use Google docs on their iPhone? I have a blue tooth >>> keyboard so although no optimal, I could do that. >>> >>> Does anyone use Google docs on their mac? >>> >>> I have a duel system meaning that I use bootcamp. I really haven't >>> found VoiceOver to be as efficient, and I really don't want to have >>> to switch sides every time I need to work on a Google doc, but I am >>> curious. >>> >>> Thanks for your input, and sorry for all of the details. I always >>> appreciate the help I receive from this list. >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Cindy Bennett >>> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative >>> Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington >>> >>> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >>> clb5590 at gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.co >> m >> > > > -- > Cindy Bennett > Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative Coordinator: > National Federation of the Blind of Washington > > B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington > clb5590 at gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 07:31:35 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 03:31:35 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: <4y8ojjtr72l0dwmbvh3qqmrk.1363319638565@email.android.com> References: <4y8ojjtr72l0dwmbvh3qqmrk.1363319638565@email.android.com> Message-ID: Hi again all, Ashley, very well said. I got exactly where you were coming from on all of that, so I absolutely concur! Mike, I do agree that those stupid terms "Hierarchy of sight," and all that are... well... stupid as you said. (I guess I was brought up to be extremely independent as in my 19 years I have never even heard those terms until tonight, but I laughed when I looked them up). No wonder there is all this misunderstanding with things like that floating around. Good grief! You are right that vision is not always indicative of travel skills, but it depends on the individual person, what their O-&-M training has been like, how comfortable they are with travel, if they are secure enough to not let pride or fear of social stigma get in the way of them using a cane when they need it, etc. You're right; some people are certainly better at all these components of travel and have higher levels of blindness-related self-esteem than others. It is unfortunate that these things have made terminology such an issue for those partials who don't milk the blind card for what it's worth and then go back to pretending they're sighted. Arielle, The person I know has just one of the telescopic canes since she can easily put it in her purse. It's the smallest and most light-weight option available so for her since she rarely uses it it's the most feasible and convenient option I guess. But, I may not fully understand it either as although I have a model that is commonly used as a stand-alone identity cane I actually use it because I like how light it is. I know the initial poster mentioned in Germany they do have pins or some sort of symbol people wear as their identification, but I'm not sure how that would go down in the NFB community if it were to be introduced since the cane, Identity or functional in model, is the symbol of blindness that has been established. I think that was the point of establishing the identity cane concept. Speaking of German stuff and canes, if you ever have a chance to check one out you should do so. The one I've seen is pretty awesome and I wish we could get them here without paying extra for ordering overseas. On 3/14/13, Robert A Hansen wrote: > The word blind has many meanings.  Too mny for me to count. > > Robert H > > > > > > > Sent from Samsung tabletMike Freeman wrote:Ashley: > > I think most of us (blind or partially-sighted) walk in familiar areas > without a cane. Certainly I don't use one around the house. (grin) > > I suspect many Federationists would be less critical of "visually impaired" > and like terms were people not to use such terms as a mechanism to avoid > their considering themselves blind -- something most of us *do* consider > crucial for good adjustment. But your descriptions below are valid and I > have no argument with them. Oh yes -- if we could also get rid of both the > saying that "in the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king" and the > hierarchy of sight that most people believe in that is the wellspring of > that statement, we'd also be less suspicious that alternative descriptions > of visual problems are euphemisms. > > Incidentally, how well one travels doesn't necessarily indicate how much one > sees. > > Mike Freeman > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley Bramlett > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 7:34 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID > > Kaiti, > I understand where you are coming from. I always have my regular folding > cane handy when out alone. > As someone with functional vision, I also like the term visually impaired or > > low vision. > I think I use it since I grew up with it and sort of adopted it as part of > my identity. > It wasn't til I met Federationists that I found everyone using the term > blind; Nfb people do not distinguish those with some sight from totals. I > understand why; but at the same time, it seems odd because someone who > functions visually for some tasks well will use it in life and therefore may > > have some different needs than a totally  blind person. Of course, those > with visual impairments should learn nonvisual techniques unless their > vision is always efficient and reliable. But in addition to nonvisual > methods, they will certainly use vision. > > I do not walk outside on campus without a cane; its too unpredictable with > steps, bumps, and curves. But, I would walk  inside the dorm and some > buildings either without a cane or just carrying it. It seemed faster to do > this for me and not be concerned with the cane's arc and hitting someone. > Just as you explained, I feel that walking without a cane for a short > predictable distance > doesn't say anything about my adjustment to blindness. I'm comfortable with > my visual condition and will talk about it if needed or educate people. It > doesn't mean I'm hiding the condition or anything. I know some low vision > people who are embarrassed to use canes, so I can see why the totally blind > people who spoke up would think that. But this is not the case for all > legally blind people. > > As for the terms, I think people > know the difference between sight and vision. So, I don't see why that would > > play into your argument. > For Josh, saying blind makes sense. > But I'd have to say that downplaying other terms seems a bit far to me. > > I think those of us with vision have to balance when to use it and what > tools to use. If we make a knowledgable and informed choice, we are well off > > and hopefully compete well. I don't have enough vision to walk much without > a cane or simply hold an ID cane. So for me, a regular cane is in my tool > box, but for someone else who is just on the threshhold of legal blindness, > they may choose a ID cane. > > Ashley > -----Original Message----- > From: Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:08 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID > > Josh, > > I don't believe I was on the list at the time of those posts, but > besides that, in my last post I mentioned my reasoning behind using > the term visually impaired.  Your logic works for you and is accurate; > you are totally blind so there is no question about terminology. > However, for those of us with some functional sight visually impaired > is a more accurate descriptor (see my last email for examples why). > I'm sure most people are smart enough to separate the tow meanings of > the word vision; obviously sight has no bearing on one's ability to > form a vision of what they want to do or become in the future, but > they are two separate things. > > All I'm asking is for a little more consideration of the perspectives > of people with varying degrees of sight and the reasons for why they > choose to do the things they do.  Just because these choices and their > needs might be different from someone who is totally blind that > doesn't make them wrong. > > Arielle, I may not be the best person to shed light on this as I use > my telescopic as a cane too, but I went to a Voc Rehab program for my > state with a girl who had an identity cane but visually didn't need to > use it much.  She would carry it with her to let people know, but her > vision was stable and good enough that she could read slightly > enlarged print, (and I believe she got a provisional drivers license > she can use as long as it's not dark or too bright outside too).  I > guess it goes back to just letting people know; she was very willing > to discuss her vision with people if asked and identified herself as a > visually impaired person, but functionally she had enough sight where > using a cane in most circumstances would have just been something she > didn't need. > > On 3/14/13, Arielle Silverman wrote: >> Hi all, >> I guess I'm not quite getting what the advantage is of an ID cane over >> a regular one? With either cane, you are telling the world that you >> are blind (or visually impaired or whatever term you want to use). The >> ID cane gives you less tactile info than the regular one does. I >> totally understand that sometimes you might not need a cane to get >> around, but if you're going to use an ID cane anyway, why not just use >> the regular one and get a little extra tactile info too? It might not >> be necessary but it can't possibly hurt you to use a regular cane >> instead of an ID cane. Is there some way an ID cane is more convenient >> to use than a regular white cane? >> I agree that sometimes it is more convenient to not use a cane at all >> because it keeps your hands free. In those cases maybe wearing some >> kind of ID symbol would better help with making sure others around you >> know you are blind. However I think those situations where you really >> need both of your hands are pretty unusual. >> Arielle >> >> On 3/14/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>> Kaiti: >>> Did you read my posts about "Visually Impaired, Vs. Blind?" >>> Basicly for me, I'd rather refer to myself as blind, (I'm totally blind,) >>> but I'm not "visually impaired." >>> There's a difference between sight, and vision. >>> I've talked about that alot on these lists. >>> Sight, is natural, (what we lack,) but vision is inward. >>> If we didn't have vision, there would be no NFB. >>> Vision is like this. >>> "Where do you see yourself, in the next 5 years?" >>> Using that logic, our vision isn't impaired, but our sight is. >>> Let's just refer to ourselves as blind and get it over with. >>> Good point Mike! >>> Blessings, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:49 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>> >>> Absolutely on that front.  There is no point of interacting with >>> people under false pretenses as if you were sighted... If one is >>> worried about social situations due to people thinking they're blind, >>> then they might want to think about the possible awkward situation of >>> a friend suddenly finding out about something that important that was >>> there all along and kept from them. >>> >>> On 3/14/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> Mike, that is not how it works at all and I really have a problem with >>>> the incinuation that people who identify themselves as visually >>>> impaired use that title to get special treatment.  I use my functional >>>> vision as well as a cane when I feel it appropriate, and receive >>>> accomodations such as braille, electronic format for textbooks, and >>>> assistive technology that I need.  I do what I can independently and >>>> ask for sighted assistance when I need something read or would like a >>>> little clarification on something visual that I cannot see.  These are >>>> not "special perks" as you put it.  My personal choice to use VI over >>>> blind is that it makes things easier for people to understand.  I have >>>> had some situations when I have used the term blind and people assume >>>> I can't see anything at all.  This has lead to well-intended but >>>> unnecessary superhelping and other consequences.  For me it's much >>>> simpler to say I'm visually impaired, indicating that I have some >>>> functional vision and giving sighted people a slightly clearer idea >>>> about me.  The NFB recognizes these terms "blind, legally blind, >>>> visually impaired," as interchangeable, so it all comes down to >>>> personal choice.  There is nothing that says one term is preferential >>>> over the other and has to be used by everyone.  Afterall, visual >>>> impairment is a continuum with varying degrees of blindness, so for >>>> some visually impaired is a more accurate descriptor. >>>> >>>> I think that even if the original poster is slightly preoccupied with >>>> the image of being blind then getting an identity cane might be the >>>> first step in correcting that.  The more people see it, the more he'll >>>> have to answer questions about himself and his visual impairment and >>>> get used to it.  Not all, but some visually impaired people have to >>>> psychologically ease into being comfortable with identifying >>>> themselves in this way and that shouldn't be held against them if >>>> that's what they have to do.  Heck, I've even heard partially sighted >>>> people speak at state conventions about how they grew more comfortable >>>> with their blindness by beginning to associate themselves with the >>>> NFB, so it sounds like the poster may be on the right track.  Again, >>>> we don't really know the situation; any one of us could be reading >>>> something that the poster didn't intentionally mean because that is a >>>> side-effect of electronic messages... things often get misconstrued. >>>> He never said he didn't want to be identified as blind in order to >>>> gain priveledges; he just wanted something to let people know, but he >>>> still has enough functional vision to walk without a cane.  I think >>>> the wording about walking perfectly may be a little presumptuous, (no >>>> one, blind or sighted, walks exactly perfectly because it's >>>> anatomically impossible), but like I said this might be a good step in >>>> putting blindness/visual impairment/whatever you'd like to call it >>>> into perspective. >>>> >>>> >>>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>> Just use whatever works. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>>> Dudley >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:29 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>> >>>>> I guess I just don't see the problem with allowing people to interact >>>>> with >>>>> you as though you are sighted. If for some reason, you can't see that >>>>> interaction, then tell them you are blind. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>>> Our fine line is that we are trying to predict, and or control >>>>>> people's reactions.  If you do not have a cane with you while walking >>>>>> in our country, people probably will not know you are blind.  The >>>>>> original poster has every right to not use a cane and rely on >>>>>> functional vision. However, the reactions of people can't be >>>>>> controlled.  If they don't know he is blind, they will react to him as >>>>>> if he is sighted.  It is his choice.  In America, I don't think we >>>>>> have a way to not carry a cane, but have everyone know that you are >>>>>> blind. >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>>>> Dudley >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:43 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>      I'm going to stick my "oar in" as they say. Kaiti and Mike, I >>>>>> think there may be a bit of misunderstanding. I think what is sought >>>>>> by the original poster on this thread is an identification symbol, >>>>>> something to say "I am blind" that is not as bulky as a cane. I >>>>>> definitely disagree with this. What I do not disagree with is using >>>>>> one's functional vision when you have it and, if that be your desire, >>>>>> to not use a cane if you don't need it. >>>>>> What I do disagree with is the concept of wanting the "you poor blind >>>>>> person" perks of blindness without carrying a cane, as the original >>>>>> poster seems to want. There is a fine line that I think is lost in the >>>>> grey here. >>>>>> ALeeha >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>>> Kaiti: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We shall have to agree to disagree. I see no reason to identify as >>>>>>> "visually impaired" unless one wishes special help or perks. Why not >>>>>>> just be blind and have done with the matter? Much simpler. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> In fact, I know a guy who was nearly totally blind for many years due >>>>>>> to an explosion. He got a good deal of sight back (he's lost it again >>>>>>> now) and used his sight to look around, traveling with a cane as he >>>>>>> always did; thus, he got the benefit of sight plus didn't have to >>>>>>> worry about when he should or should not use a cane, whether to >>>>>>> identify etc. etc. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Peace! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>>>>>> Shelton >>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:32 PM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Mike, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I have to disagree here.  As one of those partials who elects when to >>>>>>> use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you >>>>>>> may not be considering.  Electing when and when not to use a cane is >>>>>>> not always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; >>>>>>> some of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. >>>>>>> Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas >>>>>>> without a cane some times should give up their right to identify >>>>>>> themself as a visually impaired person.  E.G, I would never do any >>>>>>> type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a >>>>>>> street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see >>>>>>> like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under >>>>>>> normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria >>>>>>> right across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm >>>>>>> coming right back I don't always choose to actively use it.  My >>>>>>> choice to not use a cane in this instance does not mean I should >>>>>>> forfit my right to identify myself as a visually impaired person >>>>>>> because I am; the use of the cane does not change my inability to >>>>>>> read print or to see great distances and it does not change the fact >>>>>>> that I am legally blind and am identified that way.  It also doesn't >>>>>>> change the level of security I have with my blindness; if a person >>>>>>> refuses to use a cane or fights against it because they're afraid of >>>>>>> the social implications then that is insecurity, but if they're >>>>>>> visually having a good day and want to run a quick errand that's in a >>>>>>> very familiar area with minimal travel or risk of injury and they're >>>>>>> confident in their ability to use audio cues and the vision they have >>>>>>> then that is their choice and doesn't make them insecure with >>>>>>> themself or their blindness.  As long as they have the confidence and >>>>>>> security to not be afraid of using it and to identify and use it when >>>>>>> they need to, to be confident and secure whether they're using a cane >>>>>>> or not,  and  don't pose risk to themselves in the cases where they >>>>>>> don't use it there is nothing that would suggest insecurity.  We >>>>>>> don't know the exact visual situation of anyone on this list unless >>>>>>> they've written about it, so I don't think it is fair to judge about >>>>>>> someone's level of security with their blindness based on their cane >>>>>>> habits when we don't know what their vision is like. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social >>>>>>> situations. >>>>>>>  Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've >>>>>>> had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria >>>>>>> with my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention >>>>>>> using something besides my name.  When they see the cane (or >>>>>>> sometimes read National Federation of the Blind on it if they're >>>>>>> close enough to see >>>>>>> it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring >>>>>>> to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before >>>>>>> getting my name.  Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an >>>>>>> opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then >>>>>>> the person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're >>>>>>> informed and they see that it's not a big deal. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> And, I have to make one small correction.  The main market for the >>>>>>> lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may >>>>>>> not use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since >>>>>>> they are the ones who originated the telescopic design.  Although I >>>>>>> do know people who are totally blind or only have light perception >>>>>>> that use the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty >>>>>>> quickly because they use them so much.  For someone who may not use >>>>>>> the cane every single day but still would benefit from having an >>>>>>> identifier to let other people know they're visually impaired these >>>>>>> canes >>>>> are great. >>>>>>>  Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild >>>>>>> hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need >>>>>>> one.  Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can >>>>>>> see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not >>>>>>> tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. >>>>>>> In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to >>>>>>> have an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my >>>>>>> eyes because even if that person may not need to use it by having one >>>>>>> for people to see they must be okay with their blindness and >>>>>>> comfortable in explaining their visual impairment to others should >>>>>>> the question arise. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >>>>>>>> Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to >>>>>>>> alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive >>>>>>>> thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that >>>>>>>> identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not >>>>>>>> of inferiority. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Just my thoughts >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Chris Nusbaum >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hamid: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your >>>>>>>>> cake and eat it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages >>>>>>>>> of being recognized as blind whereas on the other, you don't want >>>>>>>>> to really appear blind or be judged because you do not believe you >>>>>>>>> need a cane. My friend, you can't have it both ways. Why do you >>>>>>>>> even care whether the public considers you blind or not or whether >>>>>>>>> they consider it weird that you might appear to not need a cane? >>>>>>>>> Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons >>>>>>>>> who use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows >>>>>>>>> them as blind whereas you consider that you do not? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most >>>>>>>>> of us would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a >>>>>>>>> label to being prohibited from going places or doing things because >>>>>>>>> of the alleged inability of the blind. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid >>>>>>>>> Hamraz >>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Dear Folks, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to >>>>>>>>> represent my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To >>>>>>>>> be more precise, the target people benefiting are those whose >>>>>>>>> residual sight lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who >>>>>>>>> want to let the other people around them know about their >>>>>>>>> blindness. >>>>>>>>> Carrying a cane is indeed an option. >>>>>>>>> However, >>>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>>> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using >>>>>>>>> it and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have >>>>>>>>> a special symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere >>>>>>>>> in any size at one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware >>>>>>>>> of that). However, there is no such a thing here in US, and setting >>>>>>>>> that up requires time and educating the society about that. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need >>>>>>>>> something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a >>>>>>>>> functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hamid >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.c >>>>>>>>> o >>>>>>>>> m >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40 >>>>>>> g >>>>>>> mail.c >>>>>>> om >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104 >>>>>>> % >>>>>>> 40gmai >>>>>>> l.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993% >>>>>>> 4 >>>>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>>>> 0gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%4 >>>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai > l.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Kaiti >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai > l.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink. > net > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mrbobprinter2012%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From jhud7789 at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 10:02:01 2013 From: jhud7789 at gmail.com (Joseph Hudson) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 05:02:01 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com> Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. Sent from my iPhone On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" wrote: > Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of those little > ones? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). > However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much more > cheaply than is the 5. > > Mike > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. I was > told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any better than > the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; I am just > inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > I don't see why it's superior to the 5. > > Mike > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the Blind. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony Grima > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > > iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users by Anna > Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or DAISY: $9 > > Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full tutorial > together and save! > > The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster than > previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, and has a > better camera. > > Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a supplement that > you can use alongside our Getting Started with the iPhone and iOS5 for Blind > Users. The same section titles are used in both this supplement and the full > tutorial, so you can find them easily. > > If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this update > to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of the braille > display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all the appendices. > An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this book, > along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. These > materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone reference > card. > > Order at: > http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html > > See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! > http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html > ****** > To order any books, send payment to: > NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge it: > toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. > Or order any of our books online at > http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail.com From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 10:57:32 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (christopher nusbaum) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 06:57:32 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: References: <4y8ojjtr72l0dwmbvh3qqmrk.1363319638565@email.android.com> Message-ID: <-8051197567416071273@unknownmsgid> It's all part of the politically correct society in which we live today. Unfortunately, terms like "visually impaired," "visually challenged," "higherarchy of sight," etc, which were created to be "sensitive" to others have turned out to hurt the blind rather than help us. I even saw the term "hard-of-seeing" in the App Store's description of an accessible Twitter client. Just call us what we are, blind! It would probably take a lot of anxiety on the part of sighted people about offending us out of the picture. Sorry for the rant. Chris Nusbaum Sent from my iPhone On Mar 15, 2013, at 3:32 AM, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Hi again all, > > Ashley, very well said. I got exactly where you were coming from on > all of that, so I absolutely concur! > > Mike, I do agree that those stupid terms "Hierarchy of sight," and all > that are... well... stupid as you said. (I guess I was brought up to > be extremely independent as in my 19 years I have never even heard > those terms until tonight, but I laughed when I looked them up). No > wonder there is all this misunderstanding with things like that > floating around. Good grief! > You are right that vision is not always indicative of travel skills, > but it depends on the individual person, what their O-&-M training has > been like, how comfortable they are with travel, if they are secure > enough to not let pride or fear of social stigma get in the way of > them using a cane when they need it, etc. You're right; some people > are certainly better at all these components of travel and have higher > levels of blindness-related self-esteem than others. It is > unfortunate that these things have made terminology such an issue for > those partials who don't milk the blind card for what it's worth and > then go back to pretending they're sighted. > > Arielle, The person I know has just one of the telescopic canes since > she can easily put it in her purse. It's the smallest and most > light-weight option available so for her since she rarely uses it it's > the most feasible and convenient option I guess. But, I may not fully > understand it either as although I have a model that is commonly used > as a stand-alone identity cane I actually use it because I like how > light it is. > > I know the initial poster mentioned in Germany they do have pins or > some sort of symbol people wear as their identification, but I'm not > sure how that would go down in the NFB community if it were to be > introduced since the cane, Identity or functional in model, is the > symbol of blindness that has been established. I think that was the > point of establishing the identity cane concept. > > Speaking of German stuff and canes, if you ever have a chance to > check one out you should do so. The one I've seen is pretty awesome > and I wish we could get them here without paying extra for ordering > overseas. > > On 3/14/13, Robert A Hansen wrote: >> The word blind has many meanings. Too mny for me to count. >> >> Robert H >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Sent from Samsung tabletMike Freeman wrote:Ashley: >> >> I think most of us (blind or partially-sighted) walk in familiar areas >> without a cane. Certainly I don't use one around the house. (grin) >> >> I suspect many Federationists would be less critical of "visually impaired" >> and like terms were people not to use such terms as a mechanism to avoid >> their considering themselves blind -- something most of us *do* consider >> crucial for good adjustment. But your descriptions below are valid and I >> have no argument with them. Oh yes -- if we could also get rid of both the >> saying that "in the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king" and the >> hierarchy of sight that most people believe in that is the wellspring of >> that statement, we'd also be less suspicious that alternative descriptions >> of visual problems are euphemisms. >> >> Incidentally, how well one travels doesn't necessarily indicate how much one >> sees. >> >> Mike Freeman >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley Bramlett >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 7:34 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >> >> Kaiti, >> I understand where you are coming from. I always have my regular folding >> cane handy when out alone. >> As someone with functional vision, I also like the term visually impaired or >> >> low vision. >> I think I use it since I grew up with it and sort of adopted it as part of >> my identity. >> It wasn't til I met Federationists that I found everyone using the term >> blind; Nfb people do not distinguish those with some sight from totals. I >> understand why; but at the same time, it seems odd because someone who >> functions visually for some tasks well will use it in life and therefore may >> >> have some different needs than a totally blind person. Of course, those >> with visual impairments should learn nonvisual techniques unless their >> vision is always efficient and reliable. But in addition to nonvisual >> methods, they will certainly use vision. >> >> I do not walk outside on campus without a cane; its too unpredictable with >> steps, bumps, and curves. But, I would walk inside the dorm and some >> buildings either without a cane or just carrying it. It seemed faster to do >> this for me and not be concerned with the cane's arc and hitting someone. >> Just as you explained, I feel that walking without a cane for a short >> predictable distance >> doesn't say anything about my adjustment to blindness. I'm comfortable with >> my visual condition and will talk about it if needed or educate people. It >> doesn't mean I'm hiding the condition or anything. I know some low vision >> people who are embarrassed to use canes, so I can see why the totally blind >> people who spoke up would think that. But this is not the case for all >> legally blind people. >> >> As for the terms, I think people >> know the difference between sight and vision. So, I don't see why that would >> >> play into your argument. >> For Josh, saying blind makes sense. >> But I'd have to say that downplaying other terms seems a bit far to me. >> >> I think those of us with vision have to balance when to use it and what >> tools to use. If we make a knowledgable and informed choice, we are well off >> >> and hopefully compete well. I don't have enough vision to walk much without >> a cane or simply hold an ID cane. So for me, a regular cane is in my tool >> box, but for someone else who is just on the threshhold of legal blindness, >> they may choose a ID cane. >> >> Ashley >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Kaiti Shelton >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:08 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >> >> Josh, >> >> I don't believe I was on the list at the time of those posts, but >> besides that, in my last post I mentioned my reasoning behind using >> the term visually impaired. Your logic works for you and is accurate; >> you are totally blind so there is no question about terminology. >> However, for those of us with some functional sight visually impaired >> is a more accurate descriptor (see my last email for examples why). >> I'm sure most people are smart enough to separate the tow meanings of >> the word vision; obviously sight has no bearing on one's ability to >> form a vision of what they want to do or become in the future, but >> they are two separate things. >> >> All I'm asking is for a little more consideration of the perspectives >> of people with varying degrees of sight and the reasons for why they >> choose to do the things they do. Just because these choices and their >> needs might be different from someone who is totally blind that >> doesn't make them wrong. >> >> Arielle, I may not be the best person to shed light on this as I use >> my telescopic as a cane too, but I went to a Voc Rehab program for my >> state with a girl who had an identity cane but visually didn't need to >> use it much. She would carry it with her to let people know, but her >> vision was stable and good enough that she could read slightly >> enlarged print, (and I believe she got a provisional drivers license >> she can use as long as it's not dark or too bright outside too). I >> guess it goes back to just letting people know; she was very willing >> to discuss her vision with people if asked and identified herself as a >> visually impaired person, but functionally she had enough sight where >> using a cane in most circumstances would have just been something she >> didn't need. >> >> On 3/14/13, Arielle Silverman wrote: >>> Hi all, >>> I guess I'm not quite getting what the advantage is of an ID cane over >>> a regular one? With either cane, you are telling the world that you >>> are blind (or visually impaired or whatever term you want to use). The >>> ID cane gives you less tactile info than the regular one does. I >>> totally understand that sometimes you might not need a cane to get >>> around, but if you're going to use an ID cane anyway, why not just use >>> the regular one and get a little extra tactile info too? It might not >>> be necessary but it can't possibly hurt you to use a regular cane >>> instead of an ID cane. Is there some way an ID cane is more convenient >>> to use than a regular white cane? >>> I agree that sometimes it is more convenient to not use a cane at all >>> because it keeps your hands free. In those cases maybe wearing some >>> kind of ID symbol would better help with making sure others around you >>> know you are blind. However I think those situations where you really >>> need both of your hands are pretty unusual. >>> Arielle >>> >>> On 3/14/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>> Kaiti: >>>> Did you read my posts about "Visually Impaired, Vs. Blind?" >>>> Basicly for me, I'd rather refer to myself as blind, (I'm totally blind,) >>>> but I'm not "visually impaired." >>>> There's a difference between sight, and vision. >>>> I've talked about that alot on these lists. >>>> Sight, is natural, (what we lack,) but vision is inward. >>>> If we didn't have vision, there would be no NFB. >>>> Vision is like this. >>>> "Where do you see yourself, in the next 5 years?" >>>> Using that logic, our vision isn't impaired, but our sight is. >>>> Let's just refer to ourselves as blind and get it over with. >>>> Good point Mike! >>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:49 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>> >>>> Absolutely on that front. There is no point of interacting with >>>> people under false pretenses as if you were sighted... If one is >>>> worried about social situations due to people thinking they're blind, >>>> then they might want to think about the possible awkward situation of >>>> a friend suddenly finding out about something that important that was >>>> there all along and kept from them. >>>> >>>> On 3/14/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>>> Hi, >>>>> >>>>> Mike, that is not how it works at all and I really have a problem with >>>>> the incinuation that people who identify themselves as visually >>>>> impaired use that title to get special treatment. I use my functional >>>>> vision as well as a cane when I feel it appropriate, and receive >>>>> accomodations such as braille, electronic format for textbooks, and >>>>> assistive technology that I need. I do what I can independently and >>>>> ask for sighted assistance when I need something read or would like a >>>>> little clarification on something visual that I cannot see. These are >>>>> not "special perks" as you put it. My personal choice to use VI over >>>>> blind is that it makes things easier for people to understand. I have >>>>> had some situations when I have used the term blind and people assume >>>>> I can't see anything at all. This has lead to well-intended but >>>>> unnecessary superhelping and other consequences. For me it's much >>>>> simpler to say I'm visually impaired, indicating that I have some >>>>> functional vision and giving sighted people a slightly clearer idea >>>>> about me. The NFB recognizes these terms "blind, legally blind, >>>>> visually impaired," as interchangeable, so it all comes down to >>>>> personal choice. There is nothing that says one term is preferential >>>>> over the other and has to be used by everyone. Afterall, visual >>>>> impairment is a continuum with varying degrees of blindness, so for >>>>> some visually impaired is a more accurate descriptor. >>>>> >>>>> I think that even if the original poster is slightly preoccupied with >>>>> the image of being blind then getting an identity cane might be the >>>>> first step in correcting that. The more people see it, the more he'll >>>>> have to answer questions about himself and his visual impairment and >>>>> get used to it. Not all, but some visually impaired people have to >>>>> psychologically ease into being comfortable with identifying >>>>> themselves in this way and that shouldn't be held against them if >>>>> that's what they have to do. Heck, I've even heard partially sighted >>>>> people speak at state conventions about how they grew more comfortable >>>>> with their blindness by beginning to associate themselves with the >>>>> NFB, so it sounds like the poster may be on the right track. Again, >>>>> we don't really know the situation; any one of us could be reading >>>>> something that the poster didn't intentionally mean because that is a >>>>> side-effect of electronic messages... things often get misconstrued. >>>>> He never said he didn't want to be identified as blind in order to >>>>> gain priveledges; he just wanted something to let people know, but he >>>>> still has enough functional vision to walk without a cane. I think >>>>> the wording about walking perfectly may be a little presumptuous, (no >>>>> one, blind or sighted, walks exactly perfectly because it's >>>>> anatomically impossible), but like I said this might be a good step in >>>>> putting blindness/visual impairment/whatever you'd like to call it >>>>> into perspective. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>>> Just use whatever works. >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>>>> Dudley >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:29 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>> >>>>>> I guess I just don't see the problem with allowing people to interact >>>>>> with >>>>>> you as though you are sighted. If for some reason, you can't see that >>>>>> interaction, then tell them you are blind. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>>>> Our fine line is that we are trying to predict, and or control >>>>>>> people's reactions. If you do not have a cane with you while walking >>>>>>> in our country, people probably will not know you are blind. The >>>>>>> original poster has every right to not use a cane and rely on >>>>>>> functional vision. However, the reactions of people can't be >>>>>>> controlled. If they don't know he is blind, they will react to him as >>>>>>> if he is sighted. It is his choice. In America, I don't think we >>>>>>> have a way to not carry a cane, but have everyone know that you are >>>>>>> blind. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>>>>> Dudley >>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:43 PM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>> I'm going to stick my "oar in" as they say. Kaiti and Mike, I >>>>>>> think there may be a bit of misunderstanding. I think what is sought >>>>>>> by the original poster on this thread is an identification symbol, >>>>>>> something to say "I am blind" that is not as bulky as a cane. I >>>>>>> definitely disagree with this. What I do not disagree with is using >>>>>>> one's functional vision when you have it and, if that be your desire, >>>>>>> to not use a cane if you don't need it. >>>>>>> What I do disagree with is the concept of wanting the "you poor blind >>>>>>> person" perks of blindness without carrying a cane, as the original >>>>>>> poster seems to want. There is a fine line that I think is lost in the >>>>>> grey here. >>>>>>> ALeeha >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>>>> Kaiti: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We shall have to agree to disagree. I see no reason to identify as >>>>>>>> "visually impaired" unless one wishes special help or perks. Why not >>>>>>>> just be blind and have done with the matter? Much simpler. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> In fact, I know a guy who was nearly totally blind for many years due >>>>>>>> to an explosion. He got a good deal of sight back (he's lost it again >>>>>>>> now) and used his sight to look around, traveling with a cane as he >>>>>>>> always did; thus, he got the benefit of sight plus didn't have to >>>>>>>> worry about when he should or should not use a cane, whether to >>>>>>>> identify etc. etc. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Peace! >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>>>>>>> Shelton >>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:32 PM >>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Mike, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I have to disagree here. As one of those partials who elects when to >>>>>>>> use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you >>>>>>>> may not be considering. Electing when and when not to use a cane is >>>>>>>> not always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; >>>>>>>> some of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. >>>>>>>> Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas >>>>>>>> without a cane some times should give up their right to identify >>>>>>>> themself as a visually impaired person. E.G, I would never do any >>>>>>>> type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a >>>>>>>> street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see >>>>>>>> like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under >>>>>>>> normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria >>>>>>>> right across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm >>>>>>>> coming right back I don't always choose to actively use it. My >>>>>>>> choice to not use a cane in this instance does not mean I should >>>>>>>> forfit my right to identify myself as a visually impaired person >>>>>>>> because I am; the use of the cane does not change my inability to >>>>>>>> read print or to see great distances and it does not change the fact >>>>>>>> that I am legally blind and am identified that way. It also doesn't >>>>>>>> change the level of security I have with my blindness; if a person >>>>>>>> refuses to use a cane or fights against it because they're afraid of >>>>>>>> the social implications then that is insecurity, but if they're >>>>>>>> visually having a good day and want to run a quick errand that's in a >>>>>>>> very familiar area with minimal travel or risk of injury and they're >>>>>>>> confident in their ability to use audio cues and the vision they have >>>>>>>> then that is their choice and doesn't make them insecure with >>>>>>>> themself or their blindness. As long as they have the confidence and >>>>>>>> security to not be afraid of using it and to identify and use it when >>>>>>>> they need to, to be confident and secure whether they're using a cane >>>>>>>> or not, and don't pose risk to themselves in the cases where they >>>>>>>> don't use it there is nothing that would suggest insecurity. We >>>>>>>> don't know the exact visual situation of anyone on this list unless >>>>>>>> they've written about it, so I don't think it is fair to judge about >>>>>>>> someone's level of security with their blindness based on their cane >>>>>>>> habits when we don't know what their vision is like. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social >>>>>>>> situations. >>>>>>>> Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've >>>>>>>> had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria >>>>>>>> with my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention >>>>>>>> using something besides my name. When they see the cane (or >>>>>>>> sometimes read National Federation of the Blind on it if they're >>>>>>>> close enough to see >>>>>>>> it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring >>>>>>>> to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before >>>>>>>> getting my name. Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an >>>>>>>> opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then >>>>>>>> the person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're >>>>>>>> informed and they see that it's not a big deal. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> And, I have to make one small correction. The main market for the >>>>>>>> lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may >>>>>>>> not use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since >>>>>>>> they are the ones who originated the telescopic design. Although I >>>>>>>> do know people who are totally blind or only have light perception >>>>>>>> that use the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty >>>>>>>> quickly because they use them so much. For someone who may not use >>>>>>>> the cane every single day but still would benefit from having an >>>>>>>> identifier to let other people know they're visually impaired these >>>>>>>> canes >>>>>> are great. >>>>>>>> Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild >>>>>>>> hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need >>>>>>>> one. Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can >>>>>>>> see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not >>>>>>>> tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. >>>>>>>> In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to >>>>>>>> have an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my >>>>>>>> eyes because even if that person may not need to use it by having one >>>>>>>> for people to see they must be okay with their blindness and >>>>>>>> comfortable in explaining their visual impairment to others should >>>>>>>> the question arise. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >>>>>>>>> Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to >>>>>>>>> alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive >>>>>>>>> thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that >>>>>>>>> identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not >>>>>>>>> of inferiority. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Just my thoughts >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Chris Nusbaum >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Hamid: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your >>>>>>>>>> cake and eat it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages >>>>>>>>>> of being recognized as blind whereas on the other, you don't want >>>>>>>>>> to really appear blind or be judged because you do not believe you >>>>>>>>>> need a cane. My friend, you can't have it both ways. Why do you >>>>>>>>>> even care whether the public considers you blind or not or whether >>>>>>>>>> they consider it weird that you might appear to not need a cane? >>>>>>>>>> Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons >>>>>>>>>> who use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows >>>>>>>>>> them as blind whereas you consider that you do not? >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most >>>>>>>>>> of us would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a >>>>>>>>>> label to being prohibited from going places or doing things because >>>>>>>>>> of the alleged inability of the blind. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid >>>>>>>>>> Hamraz >>>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >>>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Dear Folks, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to >>>>>>>>>> represent my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To >>>>>>>>>> be more precise, the target people benefiting are those whose >>>>>>>>>> residual sight lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who >>>>>>>>>> want to let the other people around them know about their >>>>>>>>>> blindness. >>>>>>>>>> Carrying a cane is indeed an option. >>>>>>>>>> However, >>>>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>>>> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using >>>>>>>>>> it and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have >>>>>>>>>> a special symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere >>>>>>>>>> in any size at one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware >>>>>>>>>> of that). However, there is no such a thing here in US, and setting >>>>>>>>>> that up requires time and educating the society about that. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need >>>>>>>>>> something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a >>>>>>>>>> functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Hamid >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.c >>>>>>>>>> o >>>>>>>>>> m >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40 >>>>>>>> g >>>>>>>> mail.c >>>>>>>> om >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104 >>>>>>>> % >>>>>>>> 40gmai >>>>>>>> l.com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993% >>>>>>>> 4 >>>>>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>>>>> 0gmail >>>>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%4 >>>>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai >> l.com >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Kaiti >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Kaiti >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai >> l.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink. >> net >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mrbobprinter2012%40gmail.com >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 11:01:20 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (christopher nusbaum) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 07:01:20 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs In-Reply-To: <007801ce2078$c4b650d0$4e22f270$@gmail.com> References: <850CD7D3-28A6-4CE4-A12D-DC504341F7B3@panix.com> <018701ce2104$b9163830$2b42a890$@gmail.com> <007801ce2078$c4b650d0$4e22f270$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <-7975979423357182835@unknownmsgid> Justin, I'm not sure I understand what you are asking. What would you like to know about texting on the iPhone? And Katie, unfortunately Google Drive is inaccessible and there are no work-arounds that I know of unless you use another program such as Dropbox. Chris Nusbaum Sent from my iPhone On Mar 15, 2013, at 1:57 AM, justin williams wrote: > Is this how we are suppose to text? Please forgive me, I know nothing about > I phone as ofyet. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Katie Wang > Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 12:41 AM > To: jsoro620 at gmail.com; National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs > > Hi all, > > I'm in the same boat as Cindy and would really like to use Google Doc > to collaborate with my colleagues. I have Google Drive on my Ipod > Touch, which enables me to read all the uploaded content, but I find > editing to be quite tedious even with a Bluetooth keyboard. I haven't > had any luck with the desktop version of Google Drive - I just > installed it on my PC but JAWS wouldn't even speak the sign-in screen. > Any suggestions for possible work-arounds would be much appreciated! > > Katie > > > On 3/14/13, Joe wrote: >> Have you downloaded the desktop app? It should work like Dropbox and be >> just >> as accessible. >> >> Joe >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Cindy Bennett >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:49 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs >> >> I'm not sure what is going on exactly. I personally have never experienced >> the problem. It is true though that the "conflicted copy" >> thing is annoying. People cannot work on documents at the same time, and >> when they do, if you do not make sure to transfer all of the new data from >> the conflicted copy to the parent copy, you can end up inadvertently > losing >> information. >> >> Also, my lab has always used Google docs, so I would prefer to use the > same >> system as my colleagues. >> >> Any help would be appreciated. >> >> Thanks. >> >> Cindy >> >> >> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>> Under what circumstances are files being deleted from your friend's >> dropbox? >>> What app is she using? >>> >>> Mike Freeman >>> sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 14, 2013, at 11:56, Cindy Bennett wrote: >>> >>>> Hi everyone, >>>> >>>> When I get to the Google Drive web page, I notice that there are a >>>> series of buttons such as create, upload, and share. How do you get >>>> these buttons to activate? I pressed enter on the create button and >>>> JAWS said "loading" and then "load complete," but I can't find where >>>> the document is to write. >>>> >>>> I am really interested in exploring accessibility, and I know there >>>> are a couple of workarounds. But I am in a situation where one of my >>>> colleagues is having files oddly deleted from her Dropbox and is >>>> incredibly frustrated and wants to switch to Google docs right now. >>>> So I am trying to get some quick answers to investigate preliminary >>>> accessibility. >>>> >>>> I know that with Google Calendar, I have an incredibly difficult time >>>> pressing the buttons to create and share calendars. I know there is a >>>> Google accessibility web page, but their advice really hasn't worked >>>> for me. I know that there is a series of JAWS commands such as >>>> rooting the jaws cursor to the pc cursor and left mouse clicking, and >>>> that really doesn't work for me although maybe I am doing it >>>> incorrectly. >>>> >>>> The Google docs web page seems to have some similarities in a >>>> negative way to the web interface of Google Calendar. >>>> >>>> Does anyone use Google docs on their iPhone? I have a blue tooth >>>> keyboard so although no optimal, I could do that. >>>> >>>> Does anyone use Google docs on their mac? >>>> >>>> I have a duel system meaning that I use bootcamp. I really haven't >>>> found VoiceOver to be as efficient, and I really don't want to have >>>> to switch sides every time I need to work on a Google doc, but I am >>>> curious. >>>> >>>> Thanks for your input, and sorry for all of the details. I always >>>> appreciate the help I receive from this list. >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Cindy Bennett >>>> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative >>>> Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington >>>> >>>> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >>>> clb5590 at gmail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.co >>> m >>> >> >> >> -- >> Cindy Bennett >> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative Coordinator: >> National Federation of the Blind of Washington >> >> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >> clb5590 at gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com From mauriciopmalmeida at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 11:03:05 2013 From: mauriciopmalmeida at gmail.com (Mauricio Almeida) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 07:03:05 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: <-8051197567416071273@unknownmsgid> References: <4y8ojjtr72l0dwmbvh3qqmrk.1363319638565@email.android.com> <-8051197567416071273@unknownmsgid> Message-ID: <54D066E7-DCAB-4E3F-94F1-BED35744A860@gmail.com> amen, chris. some people are way too over worried about what people think, and tend on making a bigger deal of things than they should. besides,s omeone who does not accept blindness and would get offended by something like that would have to deal with the reality anyway, so.On Mar 15, 2013, at 6:57 AM, christopher nusbaum wrote: > It's all part of the politically correct society in which we live > today. Unfortunately, terms like "visually impaired," "visually > challenged," "higherarchy of sight," etc, which were created to be > "sensitive" to others have turned out to hurt the blind rather than > help us. I even saw the term "hard-of-seeing" in the App Store's > description of an accessible Twitter client. Just call us what we are, > blind! It would probably take a lot of anxiety on the part of sighted > people about offending us out of the picture. Sorry for the rant. > > Chris Nusbaum > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 15, 2013, at 3:32 AM, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > >> Hi again all, >> >> Ashley, very well said. I got exactly where you were coming from on >> all of that, so I absolutely concur! >> >> Mike, I do agree that those stupid terms "Hierarchy of sight," and all >> that are... well... stupid as you said. (I guess I was brought up to >> be extremely independent as in my 19 years I have never even heard >> those terms until tonight, but I laughed when I looked them up). No >> wonder there is all this misunderstanding with things like that >> floating around. Good grief! >> You are right that vision is not always indicative of travel skills, >> but it depends on the individual person, what their O-&-M training has >> been like, how comfortable they are with travel, if they are secure >> enough to not let pride or fear of social stigma get in the way of >> them using a cane when they need it, etc. You're right; some people >> are certainly better at all these components of travel and have higher >> levels of blindness-related self-esteem than others. It is >> unfortunate that these things have made terminology such an issue for >> those partials who don't milk the blind card for what it's worth and >> then go back to pretending they're sighted. >> >> Arielle, The person I know has just one of the telescopic canes since >> she can easily put it in her purse. It's the smallest and most >> light-weight option available so for her since she rarely uses it it's >> the most feasible and convenient option I guess. But, I may not fully >> understand it either as although I have a model that is commonly used >> as a stand-alone identity cane I actually use it because I like how >> light it is. >> >> I know the initial poster mentioned in Germany they do have pins or >> some sort of symbol people wear as their identification, but I'm not >> sure how that would go down in the NFB community if it were to be >> introduced since the cane, Identity or functional in model, is the >> symbol of blindness that has been established. I think that was the >> point of establishing the identity cane concept. >> >> Speaking of German stuff and canes, if you ever have a chance to >> check one out you should do so. The one I've seen is pretty awesome >> and I wish we could get them here without paying extra for ordering >> overseas. >> >> On 3/14/13, Robert A Hansen wrote: >>> The word blind has many meanings. Too mny for me to count. >>> >>> Robert H >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Sent from Samsung tabletMike Freeman wrote:Ashley: >>> >>> I think most of us (blind or partially-sighted) walk in familiar areas >>> without a cane. Certainly I don't use one around the house. (grin) >>> >>> I suspect many Federationists would be less critical of "visually impaired" >>> and like terms were people not to use such terms as a mechanism to avoid >>> their considering themselves blind -- something most of us *do* consider >>> crucial for good adjustment. But your descriptions below are valid and I >>> have no argument with them. Oh yes -- if we could also get rid of both the >>> saying that "in the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king" and the >>> hierarchy of sight that most people believe in that is the wellspring of >>> that statement, we'd also be less suspicious that alternative descriptions >>> of visual problems are euphemisms. >>> >>> Incidentally, how well one travels doesn't necessarily indicate how much one >>> sees. >>> >>> Mike Freeman >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley Bramlett >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 7:34 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>> >>> Kaiti, >>> I understand where you are coming from. I always have my regular folding >>> cane handy when out alone. >>> As someone with functional vision, I also like the term visually impaired or >>> >>> low vision. >>> I think I use it since I grew up with it and sort of adopted it as part of >>> my identity. >>> It wasn't til I met Federationists that I found everyone using the term >>> blind; Nfb people do not distinguish those with some sight from totals. I >>> understand why; but at the same time, it seems odd because someone who >>> functions visually for some tasks well will use it in life and therefore may >>> >>> have some different needs than a totally blind person. Of course, those >>> with visual impairments should learn nonvisual techniques unless their >>> vision is always efficient and reliable. But in addition to nonvisual >>> methods, they will certainly use vision. >>> >>> I do not walk outside on campus without a cane; its too unpredictable with >>> steps, bumps, and curves. But, I would walk inside the dorm and some >>> buildings either without a cane or just carrying it. It seemed faster to do >>> this for me and not be concerned with the cane's arc and hitting someone. >>> Just as you explained, I feel that walking without a cane for a short >>> predictable distance >>> doesn't say anything about my adjustment to blindness. I'm comfortable with >>> my visual condition and will talk about it if needed or educate people. It >>> doesn't mean I'm hiding the condition or anything. I know some low vision >>> people who are embarrassed to use canes, so I can see why the totally blind >>> people who spoke up would think that. But this is not the case for all >>> legally blind people. >>> >>> As for the terms, I think people >>> know the difference between sight and vision. So, I don't see why that would >>> >>> play into your argument. >>> For Josh, saying blind makes sense. >>> But I'd have to say that downplaying other terms seems a bit far to me. >>> >>> I think those of us with vision have to balance when to use it and what >>> tools to use. If we make a knowledgable and informed choice, we are well off >>> >>> and hopefully compete well. I don't have enough vision to walk much without >>> a cane or simply hold an ID cane. So for me, a regular cane is in my tool >>> box, but for someone else who is just on the threshhold of legal blindness, >>> they may choose a ID cane. >>> >>> Ashley >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Kaiti Shelton >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:08 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>> >>> Josh, >>> >>> I don't believe I was on the list at the time of those posts, but >>> besides that, in my last post I mentioned my reasoning behind using >>> the term visually impaired. Your logic works for you and is accurate; >>> you are totally blind so there is no question about terminology. >>> However, for those of us with some functional sight visually impaired >>> is a more accurate descriptor (see my last email for examples why). >>> I'm sure most people are smart enough to separate the tow meanings of >>> the word vision; obviously sight has no bearing on one's ability to >>> form a vision of what they want to do or become in the future, but >>> they are two separate things. >>> >>> All I'm asking is for a little more consideration of the perspectives >>> of people with varying degrees of sight and the reasons for why they >>> choose to do the things they do. Just because these choices and their >>> needs might be different from someone who is totally blind that >>> doesn't make them wrong. >>> >>> Arielle, I may not be the best person to shed light on this as I use >>> my telescopic as a cane too, but I went to a Voc Rehab program for my >>> state with a girl who had an identity cane but visually didn't need to >>> use it much. She would carry it with her to let people know, but her >>> vision was stable and good enough that she could read slightly >>> enlarged print, (and I believe she got a provisional drivers license >>> she can use as long as it's not dark or too bright outside too). I >>> guess it goes back to just letting people know; she was very willing >>> to discuss her vision with people if asked and identified herself as a >>> visually impaired person, but functionally she had enough sight where >>> using a cane in most circumstances would have just been something she >>> didn't need. >>> >>> On 3/14/13, Arielle Silverman wrote: >>>> Hi all, >>>> I guess I'm not quite getting what the advantage is of an ID cane over >>>> a regular one? With either cane, you are telling the world that you >>>> are blind (or visually impaired or whatever term you want to use). The >>>> ID cane gives you less tactile info than the regular one does. I >>>> totally understand that sometimes you might not need a cane to get >>>> around, but if you're going to use an ID cane anyway, why not just use >>>> the regular one and get a little extra tactile info too? It might not >>>> be necessary but it can't possibly hurt you to use a regular cane >>>> instead of an ID cane. Is there some way an ID cane is more convenient >>>> to use than a regular white cane? >>>> I agree that sometimes it is more convenient to not use a cane at all >>>> because it keeps your hands free. In those cases maybe wearing some >>>> kind of ID symbol would better help with making sure others around you >>>> know you are blind. However I think those situations where you really >>>> need both of your hands are pretty unusual. >>>> Arielle >>>> >>>> On 3/14/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>> Kaiti: >>>>> Did you read my posts about "Visually Impaired, Vs. Blind?" >>>>> Basicly for me, I'd rather refer to myself as blind, (I'm totally blind,) >>>>> but I'm not "visually impaired." >>>>> There's a difference between sight, and vision. >>>>> I've talked about that alot on these lists. >>>>> Sight, is natural, (what we lack,) but vision is inward. >>>>> If we didn't have vision, there would be no NFB. >>>>> Vision is like this. >>>>> "Where do you see yourself, in the next 5 years?" >>>>> Using that logic, our vision isn't impaired, but our sight is. >>>>> Let's just refer to ourselves as blind and get it over with. >>>>> Good point Mike! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >>>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:49 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>> >>>>> Absolutely on that front. There is no point of interacting with >>>>> people under false pretenses as if you were sighted... If one is >>>>> worried about social situations due to people thinking they're blind, >>>>> then they might want to think about the possible awkward situation of >>>>> a friend suddenly finding out about something that important that was >>>>> there all along and kept from them. >>>>> >>>>> On 3/14/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike, that is not how it works at all and I really have a problem with >>>>>> the incinuation that people who identify themselves as visually >>>>>> impaired use that title to get special treatment. I use my functional >>>>>> vision as well as a cane when I feel it appropriate, and receive >>>>>> accomodations such as braille, electronic format for textbooks, and >>>>>> assistive technology that I need. I do what I can independently and >>>>>> ask for sighted assistance when I need something read or would like a >>>>>> little clarification on something visual that I cannot see. These are >>>>>> not "special perks" as you put it. My personal choice to use VI over >>>>>> blind is that it makes things easier for people to understand. I have >>>>>> had some situations when I have used the term blind and people assume >>>>>> I can't see anything at all. This has lead to well-intended but >>>>>> unnecessary superhelping and other consequences. For me it's much >>>>>> simpler to say I'm visually impaired, indicating that I have some >>>>>> functional vision and giving sighted people a slightly clearer idea >>>>>> about me. The NFB recognizes these terms "blind, legally blind, >>>>>> visually impaired," as interchangeable, so it all comes down to >>>>>> personal choice. There is nothing that says one term is preferential >>>>>> over the other and has to be used by everyone. Afterall, visual >>>>>> impairment is a continuum with varying degrees of blindness, so for >>>>>> some visually impaired is a more accurate descriptor. >>>>>> >>>>>> I think that even if the original poster is slightly preoccupied with >>>>>> the image of being blind then getting an identity cane might be the >>>>>> first step in correcting that. The more people see it, the more he'll >>>>>> have to answer questions about himself and his visual impairment and >>>>>> get used to it. Not all, but some visually impaired people have to >>>>>> psychologically ease into being comfortable with identifying >>>>>> themselves in this way and that shouldn't be held against them if >>>>>> that's what they have to do. Heck, I've even heard partially sighted >>>>>> people speak at state conventions about how they grew more comfortable >>>>>> with their blindness by beginning to associate themselves with the >>>>>> NFB, so it sounds like the poster may be on the right track. Again, >>>>>> we don't really know the situation; any one of us could be reading >>>>>> something that the poster didn't intentionally mean because that is a >>>>>> side-effect of electronic messages... things often get misconstrued. >>>>>> He never said he didn't want to be identified as blind in order to >>>>>> gain priveledges; he just wanted something to let people know, but he >>>>>> still has enough functional vision to walk without a cane. I think >>>>>> the wording about walking perfectly may be a little presumptuous, (no >>>>>> one, blind or sighted, walks exactly perfectly because it's >>>>>> anatomically impossible), but like I said this might be a good step in >>>>>> putting blindness/visual impairment/whatever you'd like to call it >>>>>> into perspective. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>>>> Just use whatever works. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>>>>> Dudley >>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:29 PM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I guess I just don't see the problem with allowing people to interact >>>>>>> with >>>>>>> you as though you are sighted. If for some reason, you can't see that >>>>>>> interaction, then tell them you are blind. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>>>>> Our fine line is that we are trying to predict, and or control >>>>>>>> people's reactions. If you do not have a cane with you while walking >>>>>>>> in our country, people probably will not know you are blind. The >>>>>>>> original poster has every right to not use a cane and rely on >>>>>>>> functional vision. However, the reactions of people can't be >>>>>>>> controlled. If they don't know he is blind, they will react to him as >>>>>>>> if he is sighted. It is his choice. In America, I don't think we >>>>>>>> have a way to not carry a cane, but have everyone know that you are >>>>>>>> blind. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>>>>>> Dudley >>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:43 PM >>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>> I'm going to stick my "oar in" as they say. Kaiti and Mike, I >>>>>>>> think there may be a bit of misunderstanding. I think what is sought >>>>>>>> by the original poster on this thread is an identification symbol, >>>>>>>> something to say "I am blind" that is not as bulky as a cane. I >>>>>>>> definitely disagree with this. What I do not disagree with is using >>>>>>>> one's functional vision when you have it and, if that be your desire, >>>>>>>> to not use a cane if you don't need it. >>>>>>>> What I do disagree with is the concept of wanting the "you poor blind >>>>>>>> person" perks of blindness without carrying a cane, as the original >>>>>>>> poster seems to want. There is a fine line that I think is lost in the >>>>>>> grey here. >>>>>>>> ALeeha >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>>>>> Kaiti: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> We shall have to agree to disagree. I see no reason to identify as >>>>>>>>> "visually impaired" unless one wishes special help or perks. Why not >>>>>>>>> just be blind and have done with the matter? Much simpler. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> In fact, I know a guy who was nearly totally blind for many years due >>>>>>>>> to an explosion. He got a good deal of sight back (he's lost it again >>>>>>>>> now) and used his sight to look around, traveling with a cane as he >>>>>>>>> always did; thus, he got the benefit of sight plus didn't have to >>>>>>>>> worry about when he should or should not use a cane, whether to >>>>>>>>> identify etc. etc. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Peace! >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>>>>>>>> Shelton >>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:32 PM >>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Mike, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I have to disagree here. As one of those partials who elects when to >>>>>>>>> use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you >>>>>>>>> may not be considering. Electing when and when not to use a cane is >>>>>>>>> not always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; >>>>>>>>> some of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. >>>>>>>>> Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas >>>>>>>>> without a cane some times should give up their right to identify >>>>>>>>> themself as a visually impaired person. E.G, I would never do any >>>>>>>>> type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a >>>>>>>>> street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see >>>>>>>>> like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under >>>>>>>>> normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria >>>>>>>>> right across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm >>>>>>>>> coming right back I don't always choose to actively use it. My >>>>>>>>> choice to not use a cane in this instance does not mean I should >>>>>>>>> forfit my right to identify myself as a visually impaired person >>>>>>>>> because I am; the use of the cane does not change my inability to >>>>>>>>> read print or to see great distances and it does not change the fact >>>>>>>>> that I am legally blind and am identified that way. It also doesn't >>>>>>>>> change the level of security I have with my blindness; if a person >>>>>>>>> refuses to use a cane or fights against it because they're afraid of >>>>>>>>> the social implications then that is insecurity, but if they're >>>>>>>>> visually having a good day and want to run a quick errand that's in a >>>>>>>>> very familiar area with minimal travel or risk of injury and they're >>>>>>>>> confident in their ability to use audio cues and the vision they have >>>>>>>>> then that is their choice and doesn't make them insecure with >>>>>>>>> themself or their blindness. As long as they have the confidence and >>>>>>>>> security to not be afraid of using it and to identify and use it when >>>>>>>>> they need to, to be confident and secure whether they're using a cane >>>>>>>>> or not, and don't pose risk to themselves in the cases where they >>>>>>>>> don't use it there is nothing that would suggest insecurity. We >>>>>>>>> don't know the exact visual situation of anyone on this list unless >>>>>>>>> they've written about it, so I don't think it is fair to judge about >>>>>>>>> someone's level of security with their blindness based on their cane >>>>>>>>> habits when we don't know what their vision is like. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social >>>>>>>>> situations. >>>>>>>>> Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've >>>>>>>>> had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria >>>>>>>>> with my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention >>>>>>>>> using something besides my name. When they see the cane (or >>>>>>>>> sometimes read National Federation of the Blind on it if they're >>>>>>>>> close enough to see >>>>>>>>> it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring >>>>>>>>> to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before >>>>>>>>> getting my name. Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an >>>>>>>>> opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then >>>>>>>>> the person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're >>>>>>>>> informed and they see that it's not a big deal. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> And, I have to make one small correction. The main market for the >>>>>>>>> lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may >>>>>>>>> not use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since >>>>>>>>> they are the ones who originated the telescopic design. Although I >>>>>>>>> do know people who are totally blind or only have light perception >>>>>>>>> that use the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty >>>>>>>>> quickly because they use them so much. For someone who may not use >>>>>>>>> the cane every single day but still would benefit from having an >>>>>>>>> identifier to let other people know they're visually impaired these >>>>>>>>> canes >>>>>>> are great. >>>>>>>>> Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild >>>>>>>>> hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need >>>>>>>>> one. Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can >>>>>>>>> see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not >>>>>>>>> tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. >>>>>>>>> In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to >>>>>>>>> have an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my >>>>>>>>> eyes because even if that person may not need to use it by having one >>>>>>>>> for people to see they must be okay with their blindness and >>>>>>>>> comfortable in explaining their visual impairment to others should >>>>>>>>> the question arise. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >>>>>>>>>> Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to >>>>>>>>>> alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive >>>>>>>>>> thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that >>>>>>>>>> identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not >>>>>>>>>> of inferiority. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Just my thoughts >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Chris Nusbaum >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Hamid: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your >>>>>>>>>>> cake and eat it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages >>>>>>>>>>> of being recognized as blind whereas on the other, you don't want >>>>>>>>>>> to really appear blind or be judged because you do not believe you >>>>>>>>>>> need a cane. My friend, you can't have it both ways. Why do you >>>>>>>>>>> even care whether the public considers you blind or not or whether >>>>>>>>>>> they consider it weird that you might appear to not need a cane? >>>>>>>>>>> Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons >>>>>>>>>>> who use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows >>>>>>>>>>> them as blind whereas you consider that you do not? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most >>>>>>>>>>> of us would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a >>>>>>>>>>> label to being prohibited from going places or doing things because >>>>>>>>>>> of the alleged inability of the blind. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid >>>>>>>>>>> Hamraz >>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >>>>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Dear Folks, >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to >>>>>>>>>>> represent my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To >>>>>>>>>>> be more precise, the target people benefiting are those whose >>>>>>>>>>> residual sight lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who >>>>>>>>>>> want to let the other people around them know about their >>>>>>>>>>> blindness. >>>>>>>>>>> Carrying a cane is indeed an option. >>>>>>>>>>> However, >>>>>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>>>>> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using >>>>>>>>>>> it and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have >>>>>>>>>>> a special symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere >>>>>>>>>>> in any size at one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware >>>>>>>>>>> of that). However, there is no such a thing here in US, and setting >>>>>>>>>>> that up requires time and educating the society about that. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need >>>>>>>>>>> something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a >>>>>>>>>>> functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Hamid >>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.c >>>>>>>>>>> o >>>>>>>>>>> m >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40 >>>>>>>>> g >>>>>>>>> mail.c >>>>>>>>> om >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104 >>>>>>>>> % >>>>>>>>> 40gmai >>>>>>>>> l.com >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993% >>>>>>>>> 4 >>>>>>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>>>>>> 0gmail >>>>>>>> .com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%4 >>>>>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai >>> l.com >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Kaiti >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai >>> l.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink. >>> net >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mrbobprinter2012%40gmail.com >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mauriciopmalmeida%40gmail.com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 14 12:40:56 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 08:40:56 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs In-Reply-To: <-7975979423357182835@unknownmsgid> References: <850CD7D3-28A6-4CE4-A12D-DC504341F7B3@panix.com> <018701ce2104$b9163830$2b42a890$@gmail.com> <007801ce2078$c4b650d0$4e22f270$@gmail.com> <-7975979423357182835@unknownmsgid> Message-ID: <00a401ce20b1$2e6f7640$8b4e62c0$@gmail.com> What do we use google dots for/ -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of christopher nusbaum Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 7:01 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs Justin, I'm not sure I understand what you are asking. What would you like to know about texting on the iPhone? And Katie, unfortunately Google Drive is inaccessible and there are no work-arounds that I know of unless you use another program such as Dropbox. Chris Nusbaum Sent from my iPhone On Mar 15, 2013, at 1:57 AM, justin williams wrote: > Is this how we are suppose to text? Please forgive me, I know nothing > about I phone as ofyet. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Katie > Wang > Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 12:41 AM > To: jsoro620 at gmail.com; National Association of Blind Students mailing > list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs > > Hi all, > > I'm in the same boat as Cindy and would really like to use Google Doc > to collaborate with my colleagues. I have Google Drive on my Ipod > Touch, which enables me to read all the uploaded content, but I find > editing to be quite tedious even with a Bluetooth keyboard. I haven't > had any luck with the desktop version of Google Drive - I just > installed it on my PC but JAWS wouldn't even speak the sign-in screen. > Any suggestions for possible work-arounds would be much appreciated! > > Katie > > > On 3/14/13, Joe wrote: >> Have you downloaded the desktop app? It should work like Dropbox and >> be just as accessible. >> >> Joe >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Cindy >> Bennett >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:49 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs >> >> I'm not sure what is going on exactly. I personally have never >> experienced the problem. It is true though that the "conflicted copy" >> thing is annoying. People cannot work on documents at the same time, >> and when they do, if you do not make sure to transfer all of the new >> data from the conflicted copy to the parent copy, you can end up >> inadvertently > losing >> information. >> >> Also, my lab has always used Google docs, so I would prefer to use >> the > same >> system as my colleagues. >> >> Any help would be appreciated. >> >> Thanks. >> >> Cindy >> >> >> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>> Under what circumstances are files being deleted from your friend's >> dropbox? >>> What app is she using? >>> >>> Mike Freeman >>> sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 14, 2013, at 11:56, Cindy Bennett wrote: >>> >>>> Hi everyone, >>>> >>>> When I get to the Google Drive web page, I notice that there are a >>>> series of buttons such as create, upload, and share. How do you get >>>> these buttons to activate? I pressed enter on the create button and >>>> JAWS said "loading" and then "load complete," but I can't find >>>> where the document is to write. >>>> >>>> I am really interested in exploring accessibility, and I know there >>>> are a couple of workarounds. But I am in a situation where one of >>>> my colleagues is having files oddly deleted from her Dropbox and is >>>> incredibly frustrated and wants to switch to Google docs right now. >>>> So I am trying to get some quick answers to investigate preliminary >>>> accessibility. >>>> >>>> I know that with Google Calendar, I have an incredibly difficult >>>> time pressing the buttons to create and share calendars. I know >>>> there is a Google accessibility web page, but their advice really >>>> hasn't worked for me. I know that there is a series of JAWS >>>> commands such as rooting the jaws cursor to the pc cursor and left >>>> mouse clicking, and that really doesn't work for me although maybe >>>> I am doing it incorrectly. >>>> >>>> The Google docs web page seems to have some similarities in a >>>> negative way to the web interface of Google Calendar. >>>> >>>> Does anyone use Google docs on their iPhone? I have a blue tooth >>>> keyboard so although no optimal, I could do that. >>>> >>>> Does anyone use Google docs on their mac? >>>> >>>> I have a duel system meaning that I use bootcamp. I really haven't >>>> found VoiceOver to be as efficient, and I really don't want to have >>>> to switch sides every time I need to work on a Google doc, but I am >>>> curious. >>>> >>>> Thanks for your input, and sorry for all of the details. I always >>>> appreciate the help I receive from this list. >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Cindy Bennett >>>> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative >>>> Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington >>>> >>>> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >>>> clb5590 at gmail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.c >>>> om >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail. >>> co >>> m >>> >> >> >> -- >> Cindy Bennett >> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative Coordinator: >> National Federation of the Blind of Washington >> >> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >> clb5590 at gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail. >> com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmai > l.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g > mail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 13:02:54 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (christopher nusbaum) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 09:02:54 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs In-Reply-To: <00a401ce20b1$2e6f7640$8b4e62c0$@gmail.com> References: <850CD7D3-28A6-4CE4-A12D-DC504341F7B3@panix.com> <018701ce2104$b9163830$2b42a890$@gmail.com> <007801ce2078$c4b650d0$4e22f270$@gmail.com> <-7975979423357182835@unknownmsgid> <00a401ce20b1$2e6f7640$8b4e62c0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <8496505895316868752@unknownmsgid> Google Docs is a tool for creating, working with, and sharing documents in the cloud. Chris Nusbaum Sent from my iPhone On Mar 15, 2013, at 8:41 AM, justin williams wrote: > What do we use google dots for/ > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of christopher > nusbaum > Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 7:01 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs > > Justin, I'm not sure I understand what you are asking. What would you like > to know about texting on the iPhone? And Katie, unfortunately Google Drive > is inaccessible and there are no work-arounds that I know of unless you use > another program such as Dropbox. > > Chris Nusbaum > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 15, 2013, at 1:57 AM, justin williams > wrote: > >> Is this how we are suppose to text? Please forgive me, I know nothing >> about I phone as ofyet. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Katie >> Wang >> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 12:41 AM >> To: jsoro620 at gmail.com; National Association of Blind Students mailing >> list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs >> >> Hi all, >> >> I'm in the same boat as Cindy and would really like to use Google Doc >> to collaborate with my colleagues. I have Google Drive on my Ipod >> Touch, which enables me to read all the uploaded content, but I find >> editing to be quite tedious even with a Bluetooth keyboard. I haven't >> had any luck with the desktop version of Google Drive - I just >> installed it on my PC but JAWS wouldn't even speak the sign-in screen. >> Any suggestions for possible work-arounds would be much appreciated! >> >> Katie >> >> >> On 3/14/13, Joe wrote: >>> Have you downloaded the desktop app? It should work like Dropbox and >>> be just as accessible. >>> >>> Joe >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Cindy >>> Bennett >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:49 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs >>> >>> I'm not sure what is going on exactly. I personally have never >>> experienced the problem. It is true though that the "conflicted copy" >>> thing is annoying. People cannot work on documents at the same time, >>> and when they do, if you do not make sure to transfer all of the new >>> data from the conflicted copy to the parent copy, you can end up >>> inadvertently >> losing >>> information. >>> >>> Also, my lab has always used Google docs, so I would prefer to use >>> the >> same >>> system as my colleagues. >>> >>> Any help would be appreciated. >>> >>> Thanks. >>> >>> Cindy >>> >>> >>> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>> Under what circumstances are files being deleted from your friend's >>> dropbox? >>>> What app is she using? >>>> >>>> Mike Freeman >>>> sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 14, 2013, at 11:56, Cindy Bennett wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi everyone, >>>>> >>>>> When I get to the Google Drive web page, I notice that there are a >>>>> series of buttons such as create, upload, and share. How do you get >>>>> these buttons to activate? I pressed enter on the create button and >>>>> JAWS said "loading" and then "load complete," but I can't find >>>>> where the document is to write. >>>>> >>>>> I am really interested in exploring accessibility, and I know there >>>>> are a couple of workarounds. But I am in a situation where one of >>>>> my colleagues is having files oddly deleted from her Dropbox and is >>>>> incredibly frustrated and wants to switch to Google docs right now. >>>>> So I am trying to get some quick answers to investigate preliminary >>>>> accessibility. >>>>> >>>>> I know that with Google Calendar, I have an incredibly difficult >>>>> time pressing the buttons to create and share calendars. I know >>>>> there is a Google accessibility web page, but their advice really >>>>> hasn't worked for me. I know that there is a series of JAWS >>>>> commands such as rooting the jaws cursor to the pc cursor and left >>>>> mouse clicking, and that really doesn't work for me although maybe >>>>> I am doing it incorrectly. >>>>> >>>>> The Google docs web page seems to have some similarities in a >>>>> negative way to the web interface of Google Calendar. >>>>> >>>>> Does anyone use Google docs on their iPhone? I have a blue tooth >>>>> keyboard so although no optimal, I could do that. >>>>> >>>>> Does anyone use Google docs on their mac? >>>>> >>>>> I have a duel system meaning that I use bootcamp. I really haven't >>>>> found VoiceOver to be as efficient, and I really don't want to have >>>>> to switch sides every time I need to work on a Google doc, but I am >>>>> curious. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks for your input, and sorry for all of the details. I always >>>>> appreciate the help I receive from this list. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Cindy Bennett >>>>> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative >>>>> Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington >>>>> >>>>> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >>>>> clb5590 at gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.c >>>>> om >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail. >>>> co >>>> m >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Cindy Bennett >>> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative > Coordinator: >>> National Federation of the Blind of Washington >>> >>> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >>> clb5590 at gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail. >>> com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmai >> l.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g >> mail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Fri Mar 15 13:57:31 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 09:57:31 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs In-Reply-To: References: <850CD7D3-28A6-4CE4-A12D-DC504341F7B3@panix.com><018701ce2104$b9163830$2b42a890$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4EA9151731404BDDB23E988EB9C5F562@OwnerPC> last year I tried google docs and it wasn't accessible; guess they have tweaked it to work to some extent. What is google drive? I have a desktop too and if I used google docs, I might have to install the drive. -----Original Message----- From: Katie Wang Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 12:41 AM To: jsoro620 at gmail.com ; National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs Hi all, I'm in the same boat as Cindy and would really like to use Google Doc to collaborate with my colleagues. I have Google Drive on my Ipod Touch, which enables me to read all the uploaded content, but I find editing to be quite tedious even with a Bluetooth keyboard. I haven't had any luck with the desktop version of Google Drive - I just installed it on my PC but JAWS wouldn't even speak the sign-in screen. Any suggestions for possible work-arounds would be much appreciated! Katie On 3/14/13, Joe wrote: > Have you downloaded the desktop app? It should work like Dropbox and be > just > as accessible. > > Joe > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Cindy Bennett > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:49 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs > > I'm not sure what is going on exactly. I personally have never experienced > the problem. It is true though that the "conflicted copy" > thing is annoying. People cannot work on documents at the same time, and > when they do, if you do not make sure to transfer all of the new data from > the conflicted copy to the parent copy, you can end up inadvertently > losing > information. > > Also, my lab has always used Google docs, so I would prefer to use the > same > system as my colleagues. > > Any help would be appreciated. > > Thanks. > > Cindy > > > On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >> Under what circumstances are files being deleted from your friend's > dropbox? >> What app is she using? >> >> Mike Freeman >> sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 14, 2013, at 11:56, Cindy Bennett wrote: >> >>> Hi everyone, >>> >>> When I get to the Google Drive web page, I notice that there are a >>> series of buttons such as create, upload, and share. How do you get >>> these buttons to activate? I pressed enter on the create button and >>> JAWS said "loading" and then "load complete," but I can't find where >>> the document is to write. >>> >>> I am really interested in exploring accessibility, and I know there >>> are a couple of workarounds. But I am in a situation where one of my >>> colleagues is having files oddly deleted from her Dropbox and is >>> incredibly frustrated and wants to switch to Google docs right now. >>> So I am trying to get some quick answers to investigate preliminary >>> accessibility. >>> >>> I know that with Google Calendar, I have an incredibly difficult time >>> pressing the buttons to create and share calendars. I know there is a >>> Google accessibility web page, but their advice really hasn't worked >>> for me. I know that there is a series of JAWS commands such as >>> rooting the jaws cursor to the pc cursor and left mouse clicking, and >>> that really doesn't work for me although maybe I am doing it >>> incorrectly. >>> >>> The Google docs web page seems to have some similarities in a >>> negative way to the web interface of Google Calendar. >>> >>> Does anyone use Google docs on their iPhone? I have a blue tooth >>> keyboard so although no optimal, I could do that. >>> >>> Does anyone use Google docs on their mac? >>> >>> I have a duel system meaning that I use bootcamp. I really haven't >>> found VoiceOver to be as efficient, and I really don't want to have >>> to switch sides every time I need to work on a Google doc, but I am >>> curious. >>> >>> Thanks for your input, and sorry for all of the details. I always >>> appreciate the help I receive from this list. >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Cindy Bennett >>> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative >>> Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington >>> >>> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >>> clb5590 at gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.co >> m >> > > > -- > Cindy Bennett > Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative Coordinator: > National Federation of the Blind of Washington > > B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington > clb5590 at gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Fri Mar 15 14:00:08 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 10:00:08 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs In-Reply-To: <00a401ce20b1$2e6f7640$8b4e62c0$@gmail.com> References: <850CD7D3-28A6-4CE4-A12D-DC504341F7B3@panix.com><018701ce2104$b9163830$2b42a890$@gmail.com><007801ce2078$c4b650d0$4e22f270$@gmail.com><-7975979423357182835@unknownmsgid> <00a401ce20b1$2e6f7640$8b4e62c0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: google docs is a file sharing system for editiing. not sure what the google drive does which sounds likes its inaccessible. Ah, has google been made aware of this? -----Original Message----- From: justin williams Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 8:40 AM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs What do we use google dots for/ -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of christopher nusbaum Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 7:01 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs Justin, I'm not sure I understand what you are asking. What would you like to know about texting on the iPhone? And Katie, unfortunately Google Drive is inaccessible and there are no work-arounds that I know of unless you use another program such as Dropbox. Chris Nusbaum Sent from my iPhone On Mar 15, 2013, at 1:57 AM, justin williams wrote: > Is this how we are suppose to text? Please forgive me, I know nothing > about I phone as ofyet. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Katie > Wang > Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 12:41 AM > To: jsoro620 at gmail.com; National Association of Blind Students mailing > list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs > > Hi all, > > I'm in the same boat as Cindy and would really like to use Google Doc > to collaborate with my colleagues. I have Google Drive on my Ipod > Touch, which enables me to read all the uploaded content, but I find > editing to be quite tedious even with a Bluetooth keyboard. I haven't > had any luck with the desktop version of Google Drive - I just > installed it on my PC but JAWS wouldn't even speak the sign-in screen. > Any suggestions for possible work-arounds would be much appreciated! > > Katie > > > On 3/14/13, Joe wrote: >> Have you downloaded the desktop app? It should work like Dropbox and >> be just as accessible. >> >> Joe >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Cindy >> Bennett >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:49 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs >> >> I'm not sure what is going on exactly. I personally have never >> experienced the problem. It is true though that the "conflicted copy" >> thing is annoying. People cannot work on documents at the same time, >> and when they do, if you do not make sure to transfer all of the new >> data from the conflicted copy to the parent copy, you can end up >> inadvertently > losing >> information. >> >> Also, my lab has always used Google docs, so I would prefer to use >> the > same >> system as my colleagues. >> >> Any help would be appreciated. >> >> Thanks. >> >> Cindy >> >> >> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>> Under what circumstances are files being deleted from your friend's >> dropbox? >>> What app is she using? >>> >>> Mike Freeman >>> sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 14, 2013, at 11:56, Cindy Bennett wrote: >>> >>>> Hi everyone, >>>> >>>> When I get to the Google Drive web page, I notice that there are a >>>> series of buttons such as create, upload, and share. How do you get >>>> these buttons to activate? I pressed enter on the create button and >>>> JAWS said "loading" and then "load complete," but I can't find >>>> where the document is to write. >>>> >>>> I am really interested in exploring accessibility, and I know there >>>> are a couple of workarounds. But I am in a situation where one of >>>> my colleagues is having files oddly deleted from her Dropbox and is >>>> incredibly frustrated and wants to switch to Google docs right now. >>>> So I am trying to get some quick answers to investigate preliminary >>>> accessibility. >>>> >>>> I know that with Google Calendar, I have an incredibly difficult >>>> time pressing the buttons to create and share calendars. I know >>>> there is a Google accessibility web page, but their advice really >>>> hasn't worked for me. I know that there is a series of JAWS >>>> commands such as rooting the jaws cursor to the pc cursor and left >>>> mouse clicking, and that really doesn't work for me although maybe >>>> I am doing it incorrectly. >>>> >>>> The Google docs web page seems to have some similarities in a >>>> negative way to the web interface of Google Calendar. >>>> >>>> Does anyone use Google docs on their iPhone? I have a blue tooth >>>> keyboard so although no optimal, I could do that. >>>> >>>> Does anyone use Google docs on their mac? >>>> >>>> I have a duel system meaning that I use bootcamp. I really haven't >>>> found VoiceOver to be as efficient, and I really don't want to have >>>> to switch sides every time I need to work on a Google doc, but I am >>>> curious. >>>> >>>> Thanks for your input, and sorry for all of the details. I always >>>> appreciate the help I receive from this list. >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Cindy Bennett >>>> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative >>>> Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington >>>> >>>> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >>>> clb5590 at gmail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.c >>>> om >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail. >>> co >>> m >>> >> >> >> -- >> Cindy Bennett >> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative Coordinator: >> National Federation of the Blind of Washington >> >> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >> clb5590 at gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail. >> com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmai > l.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g > mail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From kirt.crazydude at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 15:58:31 2013 From: kirt.crazydude at gmail.com (Kirt) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 09:58:31 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: <0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com> References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> <0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com> Message-ID: <3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com> If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, or to your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds up, rolls up Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone with a keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple keyboard really isn't practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, something I haven't heard mentioned yet that is potentially very relevant, the iPhone five has a significantly better camera than the four ass. I have a for S, and the camera works, but sometimes it's a little bit slow with apps like vizwizz And the MoneyReader, and I've heard it's a real headache messing with OCR apps on the four ass camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. Whoa, Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of risqué today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) Sent from my iPhone On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: > Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" wrote: > >> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of those little >> ones? >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). >> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much more >> cheaply than is the 5. >> >> Mike >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams >> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. I was >> told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any better than >> the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; I am just >> inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> I don't see why it's superior to the 5. >> >> Mike >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams >> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the Blind. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony Grima >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> >> iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users by Anna >> Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or DAISY: $9 >> >> Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full tutorial >> together and save! >> >> The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster than >> previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, and has a >> better camera. >> >> Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a supplement that >> you can use alongside our Getting Started with the iPhone and iOS5 for Blind >> Users. The same section titles are used in both this supplement and the full >> tutorial, so you can find them easily. >> >> If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this update >> to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of the braille >> display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all the appendices. >> An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this book, >> along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. These >> materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone reference >> card. >> >> Order at: >> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html >> >> See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! >> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html >> ****** >> To order any books, send payment to: >> NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge it: >> toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. >> Or order any of our books online at >> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40gmail.com From jordyn2493 at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 16:14:21 2013 From: jordyn2493 at gmail.com (Jordyn Castor) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 12:14:21 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs In-Reply-To: <4EA9151731404BDDB23E988EB9C5F562@OwnerPC> References: <850CD7D3-28A6-4CE4-A12D-DC504341F7B3@panix.com><018701ce2104$b9163830$2b42a890$@gmail.com> <4EA9151731404BDDB23E988EB9C5F562@OwnerPC> Message-ID: <514348DD.70705@gmail.com> Hey everyone! Has anyone tried using Chrome with ChromeVox to access Google Docs? I'm wondering if that might work a bit better since both are technologies Google has developed. I haven't played around with this, but I really need to. On 3/15/2013 9:57 AM, Ashley Bramlett wrote: > last year I tried google docs and it wasn't accessible; guess they > have tweaked it to work to some extent. > What is google drive? I have a desktop too and if I used google docs, > I might have to install the drive. > > -----Original Message----- From: Katie Wang > Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 12:41 AM > To: jsoro620 at gmail.com ; National Association of Blind Students > mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs > > Hi all, > > I'm in the same boat as Cindy and would really like to use Google Doc > to collaborate with my colleagues. I have Google Drive on my Ipod > Touch, which enables me to read all the uploaded content, but I find > editing to be quite tedious even with a Bluetooth keyboard. I haven't > had any luck with the desktop version of Google Drive - I just > installed it on my PC but JAWS wouldn't even speak the sign-in screen. > Any suggestions for possible work-arounds would be much appreciated! > > Katie > > > On 3/14/13, Joe wrote: >> Have you downloaded the desktop app? It should work like Dropbox and be >> just >> as accessible. >> >> Joe >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Cindy >> Bennett >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:49 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs >> >> I'm not sure what is going on exactly. I personally have never >> experienced >> the problem. It is true though that the "conflicted copy" >> thing is annoying. People cannot work on documents at the same time, and >> when they do, if you do not make sure to transfer all of the new data >> from >> the conflicted copy to the parent copy, you can end up inadvertently >> losing >> information. >> >> Also, my lab has always used Google docs, so I would prefer to use >> the same >> system as my colleagues. >> >> Any help would be appreciated. >> >> Thanks. >> >> Cindy >> >> >> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>> Under what circumstances are files being deleted from your friend's >> dropbox? >>> What app is she using? >>> >>> Mike Freeman >>> sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 14, 2013, at 11:56, Cindy Bennett wrote: >>> >>>> Hi everyone, >>>> >>>> When I get to the Google Drive web page, I notice that there are a >>>> series of buttons such as create, upload, and share. How do you get >>>> these buttons to activate? I pressed enter on the create button and >>>> JAWS said "loading" and then "load complete," but I can't find where >>>> the document is to write. >>>> >>>> I am really interested in exploring accessibility, and I know there >>>> are a couple of workarounds. But I am in a situation where one of my >>>> colleagues is having files oddly deleted from her Dropbox and is >>>> incredibly frustrated and wants to switch to Google docs right now. >>>> So I am trying to get some quick answers to investigate preliminary >>>> accessibility. >>>> >>>> I know that with Google Calendar, I have an incredibly difficult time >>>> pressing the buttons to create and share calendars. I know there is a >>>> Google accessibility web page, but their advice really hasn't worked >>>> for me. I know that there is a series of JAWS commands such as >>>> rooting the jaws cursor to the pc cursor and left mouse clicking, and >>>> that really doesn't work for me although maybe I am doing it >>>> incorrectly. >>>> >>>> The Google docs web page seems to have some similarities in a >>>> negative way to the web interface of Google Calendar. >>>> >>>> Does anyone use Google docs on their iPhone? I have a blue tooth >>>> keyboard so although no optimal, I could do that. >>>> >>>> Does anyone use Google docs on their mac? >>>> >>>> I have a duel system meaning that I use bootcamp. I really haven't >>>> found VoiceOver to be as efficient, and I really don't want to have >>>> to switch sides every time I need to work on a Google doc, but I am >>>> curious. >>>> >>>> Thanks for your input, and sorry for all of the details. I always >>>> appreciate the help I receive from this list. >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Cindy Bennett >>>> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative >>>> Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington >>>> >>>> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >>>> clb5590 at gmail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.co >>> m >>> >> >> >> -- >> Cindy Bennett >> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative >> Coordinator: >> National Federation of the Blind of Washington >> >> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >> clb5590 at gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmail.com >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jordyn2493%40gmail.com > From k7uij at panix.com Fri Mar 15 16:41:15 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 09:41:15 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: <3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com> References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> <0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com> <3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com> Message-ID: <3B9C3289-A8FB-4441-BD24-5A2B7604D519@panix.com> The Apple keyboard fits just fine in a backpack. And its feel is superb. Right on about the camera, though. Mike Freeman sent from my iPhone On Mar 15, 2013, at 8:58, Kirt wrote: > If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, or to your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds up, rolls up Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone with a keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple keyboard really isn't practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, something I haven't heard mentioned yet that is potentially very relevant, the iPhone five has a significantly better camera than the four ass. I have a for S, and the camera works, but sometimes it's a little bit slow with apps like vizwizz And the MoneyReader, and I've heard it's a real headache messing with OCR apps on the four ass camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. Whoa, Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of risqué today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: > >> Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" wrote: >> >>> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of those little >>> ones? >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). >>> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much more >>> cheaply than is the 5. >>> >>> Mike >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. I was >>> told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any better than >>> the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; I am just >>> inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- From clb5590 at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 16:43:37 2013 From: clb5590 at gmail.com (Cindy) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 09:43:37 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs In-Reply-To: <514348DD.70705@gmail.com> References: <850CD7D3-28A6-4CE4-A12D-DC504341F7B3@panix.com> <018701ce2104$b9163830$2b42a890$@gmail.com> <4EA9151731404BDDB23E988EB9C5F562@OwnerPC> <514348DD.70705@gmail.com> Message-ID: How is google drive more accessible? Can you create documents within google drive? To me it seemed similar to an empty Dropbox. That is since I couldn't figure out how to even open a document. I tried on the web yesterday but if you use JAWS, NVDA, or VoiceOver, the "supported" screen readers, you have to turn off typing feedback, the virtual cursor in all applications, and auto forms mode and forms mode in general. To me, that is too much to do every time I switch windows, so I think that Jordyn is correct in that ChromeVox might be the best bet. You have to download google chrome and then get the chromevox extension from the google chrome store. I got as far as the crappy interactive tutorial. I recommend opening up the list of chromevox keystrokes in another internet browser while attempting the tutorial. That's what I am going to try today. So maybe if I can get the hang of chromevox I'll start trying to use it with docs and calendar. I read 2 different things on different google web pages. One said that chromevox is intended to be a screen reader supplement meant to enhance the accessibility of their products. The page on chromevox in the chrome store said that this feature is not yet available and that other screen readers should be turned off before accessing google chrome with chromevox. So I'm not sure which is true. I should have attempted to use it in conjunction with jaws first, because without thinking, I put jaws to sleep in chrome and I learned that to disable sleep mode I have to have sighted assistance to click the buttons or I have to reset jaws settings. I looked all around for this answer and finally called tech support. The person I talked to did not seem to really know that much or be happy to assist me with my question, so if anyone knows another way to disable sleep mode, I'd be excited to learn it so I can independently toggle between attempting things with and without JAWS in conjunction with ChromeVox. So that's as far as I got yesterday. If anyone else has any good information about google products please keep it coming! Cindy Bennett Legislative Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington Secretary: National Association of Blind Students B.A. Psychology: UNC Wilmington clb5590 at gmail.com Sent from my iPhone On Mar 15, 2013, at 9:14 AM, Jordyn Castor wrote: > Hey everyone! > Has anyone tried using Chrome with ChromeVox to access Google Docs? I'm wondering if that might work a bit better since both are technologies Google has developed. > I haven't played around with this, but I really need to. > On 3/15/2013 9:57 AM, Ashley Bramlett wrote: >> last year I tried google docs and it wasn't accessible; guess they have tweaked it to work to some extent. >> What is google drive? I have a desktop too and if I used google docs, I might have to install the drive. >> >> -----Original Message----- From: Katie Wang >> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 12:41 AM >> To: jsoro620 at gmail.com ; National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs >> >> Hi all, >> >> I'm in the same boat as Cindy and would really like to use Google Doc >> to collaborate with my colleagues. I have Google Drive on my Ipod >> Touch, which enables me to read all the uploaded content, but I find >> editing to be quite tedious even with a Bluetooth keyboard. I haven't >> had any luck with the desktop version of Google Drive - I just >> installed it on my PC but JAWS wouldn't even speak the sign-in screen. >> Any suggestions for possible work-arounds would be much appreciated! >> >> Katie >> >> >> On 3/14/13, Joe wrote: >>> Have you downloaded the desktop app? It should work like Dropbox and be >>> just >>> as accessible. >>> >>> Joe >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Cindy Bennett >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:49 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs >>> >>> I'm not sure what is going on exactly. I personally have never experienced >>> the problem. It is true though that the "conflicted copy" >>> thing is annoying. People cannot work on documents at the same time, and >>> when they do, if you do not make sure to transfer all of the new data from >>> the conflicted copy to the parent copy, you can end up inadvertently losing >>> information. >>> >>> Also, my lab has always used Google docs, so I would prefer to use the same >>> system as my colleagues. >>> >>> Any help would be appreciated. >>> >>> Thanks. >>> >>> Cindy >>> >>> >>> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>> Under what circumstances are files being deleted from your friend's >>> dropbox? >>>> What app is she using? >>>> >>>> Mike Freeman >>>> sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 14, 2013, at 11:56, Cindy Bennett wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi everyone, >>>>> >>>>> When I get to the Google Drive web page, I notice that there are a >>>>> series of buttons such as create, upload, and share. How do you get >>>>> these buttons to activate? I pressed enter on the create button and >>>>> JAWS said "loading" and then "load complete," but I can't find where >>>>> the document is to write. >>>>> >>>>> I am really interested in exploring accessibility, and I know there >>>>> are a couple of workarounds. But I am in a situation where one of my >>>>> colleagues is having files oddly deleted from her Dropbox and is >>>>> incredibly frustrated and wants to switch to Google docs right now. >>>>> So I am trying to get some quick answers to investigate preliminary >>>>> accessibility. >>>>> >>>>> I know that with Google Calendar, I have an incredibly difficult time >>>>> pressing the buttons to create and share calendars. I know there is a >>>>> Google accessibility web page, but their advice really hasn't worked >>>>> for me. I know that there is a series of JAWS commands such as >>>>> rooting the jaws cursor to the pc cursor and left mouse clicking, and >>>>> that really doesn't work for me although maybe I am doing it >>>>> incorrectly. >>>>> >>>>> The Google docs web page seems to have some similarities in a >>>>> negative way to the web interface of Google Calendar. >>>>> >>>>> Does anyone use Google docs on their iPhone? I have a blue tooth >>>>> keyboard so although no optimal, I could do that. >>>>> >>>>> Does anyone use Google docs on their mac? >>>>> >>>>> I have a duel system meaning that I use bootcamp. I really haven't >>>>> found VoiceOver to be as efficient, and I really don't want to have >>>>> to switch sides every time I need to work on a Google doc, but I am >>>>> curious. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks for your input, and sorry for all of the details. I always >>>>> appreciate the help I receive from this list. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Cindy Bennett >>>>> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative >>>>> Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington >>>>> >>>>> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >>>>> clb5590 at gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.co >>>> m >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Cindy Bennett >>> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative Coordinator: >>> National Federation of the Blind of Washington >>> >>> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >>> clb5590 at gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jordyn2493%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.com From jordyn2493 at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 16:49:33 2013 From: jordyn2493 at gmail.com (Jordyn Castor) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 12:49:33 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs In-Reply-To: References: <850CD7D3-28A6-4CE4-A12D-DC504341F7B3@panix.com> <018701ce2104$b9163830$2b42a890$@gmail.com> <4EA9151731404BDDB23E988EB9C5F562@OwnerPC> <514348DD.70705@gmail.com> Message-ID: <5143511D.6050105@gmail.com> Well. With Google Drive, you can create documents and then save them to your Google drive. You can't open Google Docs in anything other than a web browser though. So I don't see how it's really that helpful. Jordyn On 3/15/2013 12:43 PM, Cindy wrote: > How is google drive more accessible? Can you create documents within google drive? To me it seemed similar to an empty Dropbox. That is since I couldn't figure out how to even open a document. > > I tried on the web yesterday but if you use JAWS, NVDA, or VoiceOver, the "supported" screen readers, you have to turn off typing feedback, the virtual cursor in all applications, and auto forms mode and forms mode in general. To me, that is too much to do every time I switch windows, so I think that Jordyn is correct in that ChromeVox might be the best bet. You have to download google chrome and then get the chromevox extension from the google chrome store. I got as far as the crappy interactive tutorial. I recommend opening up the list of chromevox keystrokes in another internet browser while attempting the tutorial. That's what I am going to try today. So maybe if I can get the hang of chromevox I'll start trying to use it with docs and calendar. I read 2 different things on different google web pages. One said that chromevox is intended to be a screen reader supplement meant to enhance the accessibility of their products. The page on chromevox in the chrome store said that this feature is not yet available and that other screen readers should be turned off before accessing google chrome with chromevox. So I'm not sure which is true. I should have attempted to use it in conjunction with jaws first, because without thinking, I put jaws to sleep in chrome and I learned that to disable sleep mode I have to have sighted assistance to click the buttons or I have to reset jaws settings. I looked all around for this answer and finally called tech support. The person I talked to did not seem to really know that much or be happy to assist me with my question, so if anyone knows another way to disable sleep mode, I'd be excited to learn it so I can independently toggle between attempting things with and without JAWS in conjunction with ChromeVox. So that's as far as I got yesterday. If anyone else has any good information about google products please keep it coming! > > Cindy Bennett > Legislative Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington > Secretary: National Association of Blind Students > > B.A. Psychology: UNC Wilmington > clb5590 at gmail.com > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 15, 2013, at 9:14 AM, Jordyn Castor wrote: > >> Hey everyone! >> Has anyone tried using Chrome with ChromeVox to access Google Docs? I'm wondering if that might work a bit better since both are technologies Google has developed. >> I haven't played around with this, but I really need to. >> On 3/15/2013 9:57 AM, Ashley Bramlett wrote: >>> last year I tried google docs and it wasn't accessible; guess they have tweaked it to work to some extent. >>> What is google drive? I have a desktop too and if I used google docs, I might have to install the drive. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- From: Katie Wang >>> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 12:41 AM >>> To: jsoro620 at gmail.com ; National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs >>> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> I'm in the same boat as Cindy and would really like to use Google Doc >>> to collaborate with my colleagues. I have Google Drive on my Ipod >>> Touch, which enables me to read all the uploaded content, but I find >>> editing to be quite tedious even with a Bluetooth keyboard. I haven't >>> had any luck with the desktop version of Google Drive - I just >>> installed it on my PC but JAWS wouldn't even speak the sign-in screen. >>> Any suggestions for possible work-arounds would be much appreciated! >>> >>> Katie >>> >>> >>> On 3/14/13, Joe wrote: >>>> Have you downloaded the desktop app? It should work like Dropbox and be >>>> just >>>> as accessible. >>>> >>>> Joe >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Cindy Bennett >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:49 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs >>>> >>>> I'm not sure what is going on exactly. I personally have never experienced >>>> the problem. It is true though that the "conflicted copy" >>>> thing is annoying. People cannot work on documents at the same time, and >>>> when they do, if you do not make sure to transfer all of the new data from >>>> the conflicted copy to the parent copy, you can end up inadvertently losing >>>> information. >>>> >>>> Also, my lab has always used Google docs, so I would prefer to use the same >>>> system as my colleagues. >>>> >>>> Any help would be appreciated. >>>> >>>> Thanks. >>>> >>>> Cindy >>>> >>>> >>>> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>> Under what circumstances are files being deleted from your friend's >>>> dropbox? >>>>> What app is she using? >>>>> >>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>> sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 14, 2013, at 11:56, Cindy Bennett wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hi everyone, >>>>>> >>>>>> When I get to the Google Drive web page, I notice that there are a >>>>>> series of buttons such as create, upload, and share. How do you get >>>>>> these buttons to activate? I pressed enter on the create button and >>>>>> JAWS said "loading" and then "load complete," but I can't find where >>>>>> the document is to write. >>>>>> >>>>>> I am really interested in exploring accessibility, and I know there >>>>>> are a couple of workarounds. But I am in a situation where one of my >>>>>> colleagues is having files oddly deleted from her Dropbox and is >>>>>> incredibly frustrated and wants to switch to Google docs right now. >>>>>> So I am trying to get some quick answers to investigate preliminary >>>>>> accessibility. >>>>>> >>>>>> I know that with Google Calendar, I have an incredibly difficult time >>>>>> pressing the buttons to create and share calendars. I know there is a >>>>>> Google accessibility web page, but their advice really hasn't worked >>>>>> for me. I know that there is a series of JAWS commands such as >>>>>> rooting the jaws cursor to the pc cursor and left mouse clicking, and >>>>>> that really doesn't work for me although maybe I am doing it >>>>>> incorrectly. >>>>>> >>>>>> The Google docs web page seems to have some similarities in a >>>>>> negative way to the web interface of Google Calendar. >>>>>> >>>>>> Does anyone use Google docs on their iPhone? I have a blue tooth >>>>>> keyboard so although no optimal, I could do that. >>>>>> >>>>>> Does anyone use Google docs on their mac? >>>>>> >>>>>> I have a duel system meaning that I use bootcamp. I really haven't >>>>>> found VoiceOver to be as efficient, and I really don't want to have >>>>>> to switch sides every time I need to work on a Google doc, but I am >>>>>> curious. >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks for your input, and sorry for all of the details. I always >>>>>> appreciate the help I receive from this list. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Cindy Bennett >>>>>> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative >>>>>> Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington >>>>>> >>>>>> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >>>>>> clb5590 at gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.co >>>>> m >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Cindy Bennett >>>> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative Coordinator: >>>> National Federation of the Blind of Washington >>>> >>>> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >>>> clb5590 at gmail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmail.com >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jordyn2493%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jordyn2493%40gmail.com From kirt.crazydude at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 17:37:29 2013 From: kirt.crazydude at gmail.com (Kirt Manwaring) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 11:37:29 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: <3B9C3289-A8FB-4441-BD24-5A2B7604D519@panix.com> References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> <0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com> <3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com> <3B9C3289-A8FB-4441-BD24-5A2B7604D519@panix.com> Message-ID: Mike, Maybe I'm a spoiled and whiny product of the twenty-first century, but something that "is small enough to fit in my backpack" just isn't portable enough for me. I want something that can sit in my pocket, right alongside my phone. Heck, something built into my phone's case would be ideal, although I'm content to use my braille note as a keyboard for the time being. Just my personal preference; as you said on another thread, different strokes... Best, Kirt On 3/15/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > The Apple keyboard fits just fine in a backpack. And its feel is superb. > Right on about the camera, though. > > Mike Freeman > sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 15, 2013, at 8:58, Kirt wrote: > >> If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, or to >> your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds up, rolls >> up Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone with a >> keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple keyboard really isn't >> practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, something I haven't heard >> mentioned yet that is potentially very relevant, the iPhone five has a >> significantly better camera than the four ass. I have a for S, and the >> camera works, but sometimes it's a little bit slow with apps like vizwizz >> And the MoneyReader, and I've heard it's a real headache messing with OCR >> apps on the four ass camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. >> Whoa, Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of >> risqué today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: >> >>> Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of those >>>> little >>>> ones? >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>> Freeman >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). >>>> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much more >>>> cheaply than is the 5. >>>> >>>> Mike >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>> williams >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. I >>>> was >>>> told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any better >>>> than >>>> the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; I am just >>>> inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40gmail.com > From k7uij at panix.com Fri Mar 15 17:54:00 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 10:54:00 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs In-Reply-To: References: <850CD7D3-28A6-4CE4-A12D-DC504341F7B3@panix.com> <018701ce2104$b9163830$2b42a890$@gmail.com> <4EA9151731404BDDB23E988EB9C5F562@OwnerPC> <514348DD.70705@gmail.com> Message-ID: <79318F9F-0513-46CB-BDBC-AE8A28AAECE0@panix.com> She is at it again; note her sig. Mike Freeman sent from my iPhone On Mar 15, 2013, at 9:43, Cindy wrote: > How is google drive more accessible? Can you create documents within google drive? To me it seemed similar to an empty Dropbox. That is since I couldn't figure out how to even open a document. > > I tried on the web yesterday but if you use JAWS, NVDA, or VoiceOver, the "supported" screen readers, you have to turn off typing feedback, the virtual cursor in all applications, and auto forms mode and forms mode in general. To me, that is too much to do every time I switch windows, so I think that Jordyn is correct in that ChromeVox might be the best bet. You have to download google chrome and then get the chromevox extension from the google chrome store. I got as far as the crappy interactive tutorial. I recommend opening up the list of chromevox keystrokes in another internet browser while attempting the tutorial. That's what I am going to try today. So maybe if I can get the hang of chromevox I'll start trying to use it with docs and calendar. I read 2 different things on different google web pages. One said that chromevox is intended to be a screen reader supplement meant to enhance the accessibility of their products. The page on chromevox in the chrome store said tha > t this feature is not yet available and that other screen readers should be turned off before accessing google chrome with chromevox. So I'm not sure which is true. I should have attempted to use it in conjunction with jaws first, because without thinking, I put jaws to sleep in chrome and I learned that to disable sleep mode I have to have sighted assistance to click the buttons or I have to reset jaws settings. I looked all around for this answer and finally called tech support. The person I talked to did not seem to really know that much or be happy to assist me with my question, so if anyone knows another way to disable sleep mode, I'd be excited to learn it so I can independently toggle between attempting things with and without JAWS in conjunction with ChromeVox. So that's as far as I got yesterday. If anyone else has any good information about google products please keep it coming! > > Cindy Bennett > Legislative Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington > Secretary: National Association of Blind Students > > B.A. Psychology: UNC Wilmington > clb5590 at gmail.com > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 15, 2013, at 9:14 AM, Jordyn Castor wrote: > >> Hey everyone! >> Has anyone tried using Chrome with ChromeVox to access Google Docs? I'm wondering if that might work a bit better since both are technologies Google has developed. >> I haven't played around with this, but I really need to. >> On 3/15/2013 9:57 AM, Ashley Bramlett wrote: >>> last year I tried google docs and it wasn't accessible; guess they have tweaked it to work to some extent. >>> What is google drive? I have a desktop too and if I used google docs, I might have to install the drive. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- From: Katie Wang >>> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 12:41 AM >>> To: jsoro620 at gmail.com ; National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs >>> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> I'm in the same boat as Cindy and would really like to use Google Doc >>> to collaborate with my colleagues. I have Google Drive on my Ipod >>> Touch, which enables me to read all the uploaded content, but I find >>> editing to be quite tedious even with a Bluetooth keyboard. I haven't >>> had any luck with the desktop version of Google Drive - I just >>> installed it on my PC but JAWS wouldn't even speak the sign-in screen. >>> Any suggestions for possible work-arounds would be much appreciated! >>> >>> Katie >>> >>> From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Fri Mar 15 18:10:22 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 14:10:22 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs In-Reply-To: <514348DD.70705@gmail.com> References: <850CD7D3-28A6-4CE4-A12D-DC504341F7B3@panix.com><018701ce2104$b9163830$2b42a890$@gmail.com><4EA9151731404BDDB23E988EB9C5F562@OwnerPC> <514348DD.70705@gmail.com> Message-ID: what is chromevox? -----Original Message----- From: Jordyn Castor Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 12:14 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs Hey everyone! Has anyone tried using Chrome with ChromeVox to access Google Docs? I'm wondering if that might work a bit better since both are technologies Google has developed. I haven't played around with this, but I really need to. On 3/15/2013 9:57 AM, Ashley Bramlett wrote: > last year I tried google docs and it wasn't accessible; guess they have > tweaked it to work to some extent. > What is google drive? I have a desktop too and if I used google docs, I > might have to install the drive. > > -----Original Message----- From: Katie Wang > Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 12:41 AM > To: jsoro620 at gmail.com ; National Association of Blind Students mailing > list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs > > Hi all, > > I'm in the same boat as Cindy and would really like to use Google Doc > to collaborate with my colleagues. I have Google Drive on my Ipod > Touch, which enables me to read all the uploaded content, but I find > editing to be quite tedious even with a Bluetooth keyboard. I haven't > had any luck with the desktop version of Google Drive - I just > installed it on my PC but JAWS wouldn't even speak the sign-in screen. > Any suggestions for possible work-arounds would be much appreciated! > > Katie > > > On 3/14/13, Joe wrote: >> Have you downloaded the desktop app? It should work like Dropbox and be >> just >> as accessible. >> >> Joe >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Cindy >> Bennett >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:49 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs >> >> I'm not sure what is going on exactly. I personally have never >> experienced >> the problem. It is true though that the "conflicted copy" >> thing is annoying. People cannot work on documents at the same time, and >> when they do, if you do not make sure to transfer all of the new data >> from >> the conflicted copy to the parent copy, you can end up inadvertently >> losing >> information. >> >> Also, my lab has always used Google docs, so I would prefer to use the >> same >> system as my colleagues. >> >> Any help would be appreciated. >> >> Thanks. >> >> Cindy >> >> >> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>> Under what circumstances are files being deleted from your friend's >> dropbox? >>> What app is she using? >>> >>> Mike Freeman >>> sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 14, 2013, at 11:56, Cindy Bennett wrote: >>> >>>> Hi everyone, >>>> >>>> When I get to the Google Drive web page, I notice that there are a >>>> series of buttons such as create, upload, and share. How do you get >>>> these buttons to activate? I pressed enter on the create button and >>>> JAWS said "loading" and then "load complete," but I can't find where >>>> the document is to write. >>>> >>>> I am really interested in exploring accessibility, and I know there >>>> are a couple of workarounds. But I am in a situation where one of my >>>> colleagues is having files oddly deleted from her Dropbox and is >>>> incredibly frustrated and wants to switch to Google docs right now. >>>> So I am trying to get some quick answers to investigate preliminary >>>> accessibility. >>>> >>>> I know that with Google Calendar, I have an incredibly difficult time >>>> pressing the buttons to create and share calendars. I know there is a >>>> Google accessibility web page, but their advice really hasn't worked >>>> for me. I know that there is a series of JAWS commands such as >>>> rooting the jaws cursor to the pc cursor and left mouse clicking, and >>>> that really doesn't work for me although maybe I am doing it >>>> incorrectly. >>>> >>>> The Google docs web page seems to have some similarities in a >>>> negative way to the web interface of Google Calendar. >>>> >>>> Does anyone use Google docs on their iPhone? I have a blue tooth >>>> keyboard so although no optimal, I could do that. >>>> >>>> Does anyone use Google docs on their mac? >>>> >>>> I have a duel system meaning that I use bootcamp. I really haven't >>>> found VoiceOver to be as efficient, and I really don't want to have >>>> to switch sides every time I need to work on a Google doc, but I am >>>> curious. >>>> >>>> Thanks for your input, and sorry for all of the details. I always >>>> appreciate the help I receive from this list. >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Cindy Bennett >>>> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative >>>> Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington >>>> >>>> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >>>> clb5590 at gmail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.co >>> m >>> >> >> >> -- >> Cindy Bennett >> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative >> Coordinator: >> National Federation of the Blind of Washington >> >> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >> clb5590 at gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jordyn2493%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 18:44:44 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 14:44:44 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> <0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com> <3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com> <3B9C3289-A8FB-4441-BD24-5A2B7604D519@panix.com> Message-ID: Hi, I've seen the 4, 4S, and 5; the 5 does have a longer screen in terms of length, but the phone itself is a little longer and smaller in width. I don't think that necessarily makes it "smaller" as Apple initially announced as their big marketing ticket to get people's attention. It responds very well, much more quickly with and without voiceover. (I was able to compare it with my 4 and I loved the quick feedback). The 4s is sold cheaply because it's an old model and the 5 is more in demand in theory because it's the latest and greatest. I got a deal on my 4 because when I got it the 4s had just come out. Same situation here; I guess Apple likes to phase out their old models from sale with the exception of trade-ins. I have one of those cases with the keyboard that slides out from underneath and although it isn't a separate device it does have it's downfalls that I didn't anticipate when I was getting it. It makes the phone thicker, which in turn makes the phone itself less portable. It sticll can fit in a pocket, but not as comfortably as it did in my other case. I also don't like how the case has no padding whatsoever. I'm very careful with my phone, but although I don't drop it I don't like the idea of there being no padding should the phone fall out of my hand. There are benefits and disadvantages to portable keyboard cases and stand-alone roll up or other bluetooth keyboards, but it just depends on what you're comfortable with and what you prefer in not just terms of portability, but safety of your phone and other factors. On 3/15/13, Kirt Manwaring wrote: > Mike, > Maybe I'm a spoiled and whiny product of the twenty-first century, > but something that "is small enough to fit in my backpack" just isn't > portable enough for me. I want something that can sit in my pocket, > right alongside my phone. Heck, something built into my phone's case > would be ideal, although I'm content to use my braille note as a > keyboard for the time being. Just my personal preference; as you said > on another thread, different strokes... > Best, > Kirt > > On 3/15/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >> The Apple keyboard fits just fine in a backpack. And its feel is superb. >> Right on about the camera, though. >> >> Mike Freeman >> sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 15, 2013, at 8:58, Kirt wrote: >> >>> If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, or to >>> your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds up, rolls >>> up Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone with >>> a >>> keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple keyboard really >>> isn't >>> practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, something I haven't >>> heard >>> mentioned yet that is potentially very relevant, the iPhone five has a >>> significantly better camera than the four ass. I have a for S, and the >>> camera works, but sometimes it's a little bit slow with apps like >>> vizwizz >>> And the MoneyReader, and I've heard it's a real headache messing with >>> OCR >>> apps on the four ass camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. >>> Whoa, Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of >>> risqué today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: >>> >>>> Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of those >>>>> little >>>>> ones? >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>>> Freeman >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>> >>>>> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). >>>>> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much more >>>>> cheaply than is the 5. >>>>> >>>>> Mike >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>>> williams >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>> >>>>> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. I >>>>> was >>>>> told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any better >>>>> than >>>>> the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; I am just >>>>> inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From clb5590 at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 21:08:40 2013 From: clb5590 at gmail.com (Cindy Bennett) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 14:08:40 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs In-Reply-To: References: <850CD7D3-28A6-4CE4-A12D-DC504341F7B3@panix.com> <018701ce2104$b9163830$2b42a890$@gmail.com> <4EA9151731404BDDB23E988EB9C5F562@OwnerPC> <514348DD.70705@gmail.com> Message-ID: ChromeVox is a screen reader created by google meant to be used in google chrome to access google products with voice output. Cindy On 3/15/13, Ashley Bramlett wrote: > what is chromevox? > > -----Original Message----- > From: Jordyn Castor > Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 12:14 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs > > Hey everyone! > Has anyone tried using Chrome with ChromeVox to access Google Docs? I'm > wondering if that might work a bit better since both are technologies > Google has developed. > I haven't played around with this, but I really need to. > On 3/15/2013 9:57 AM, Ashley Bramlett wrote: >> last year I tried google docs and it wasn't accessible; guess they have >> tweaked it to work to some extent. >> What is google drive? I have a desktop too and if I used google docs, I >> might have to install the drive. >> >> -----Original Message----- From: Katie Wang >> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 12:41 AM >> To: jsoro620 at gmail.com ; National Association of Blind Students mailing >> list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs >> >> Hi all, >> >> I'm in the same boat as Cindy and would really like to use Google Doc >> to collaborate with my colleagues. I have Google Drive on my Ipod >> Touch, which enables me to read all the uploaded content, but I find >> editing to be quite tedious even with a Bluetooth keyboard. I haven't >> had any luck with the desktop version of Google Drive - I just >> installed it on my PC but JAWS wouldn't even speak the sign-in screen. >> Any suggestions for possible work-arounds would be much appreciated! >> >> Katie >> >> >> On 3/14/13, Joe wrote: >>> Have you downloaded the desktop app? It should work like Dropbox and be >>> just >>> as accessible. >>> >>> Joe >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Cindy >>> Bennett >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:49 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs >>> >>> I'm not sure what is going on exactly. I personally have never >>> experienced >>> the problem. It is true though that the "conflicted copy" >>> thing is annoying. People cannot work on documents at the same time, and >>> when they do, if you do not make sure to transfer all of the new data >>> from >>> the conflicted copy to the parent copy, you can end up inadvertently >>> losing >>> information. >>> >>> Also, my lab has always used Google docs, so I would prefer to use the >>> same >>> system as my colleagues. >>> >>> Any help would be appreciated. >>> >>> Thanks. >>> >>> Cindy >>> >>> >>> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>> Under what circumstances are files being deleted from your friend's >>> dropbox? >>>> What app is she using? >>>> >>>> Mike Freeman >>>> sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 14, 2013, at 11:56, Cindy Bennett wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi everyone, >>>>> >>>>> When I get to the Google Drive web page, I notice that there are a >>>>> series of buttons such as create, upload, and share. How do you get >>>>> these buttons to activate? I pressed enter on the create button and >>>>> JAWS said "loading" and then "load complete," but I can't find where >>>>> the document is to write. >>>>> >>>>> I am really interested in exploring accessibility, and I know there >>>>> are a couple of workarounds. But I am in a situation where one of my >>>>> colleagues is having files oddly deleted from her Dropbox and is >>>>> incredibly frustrated and wants to switch to Google docs right now. >>>>> So I am trying to get some quick answers to investigate preliminary >>>>> accessibility. >>>>> >>>>> I know that with Google Calendar, I have an incredibly difficult time >>>>> pressing the buttons to create and share calendars. I know there is a >>>>> Google accessibility web page, but their advice really hasn't worked >>>>> for me. I know that there is a series of JAWS commands such as >>>>> rooting the jaws cursor to the pc cursor and left mouse clicking, and >>>>> that really doesn't work for me although maybe I am doing it >>>>> incorrectly. >>>>> >>>>> The Google docs web page seems to have some similarities in a >>>>> negative way to the web interface of Google Calendar. >>>>> >>>>> Does anyone use Google docs on their iPhone? I have a blue tooth >>>>> keyboard so although no optimal, I could do that. >>>>> >>>>> Does anyone use Google docs on their mac? >>>>> >>>>> I have a duel system meaning that I use bootcamp. I really haven't >>>>> found VoiceOver to be as efficient, and I really don't want to have >>>>> to switch sides every time I need to work on a Google doc, but I am >>>>> curious. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks for your input, and sorry for all of the details. I always >>>>> appreciate the help I receive from this list. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Cindy Bennett >>>>> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative >>>>> Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington >>>>> >>>>> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >>>>> clb5590 at gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.co >>>> m >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Cindy Bennett >>> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative >>> Coordinator: >>> National Federation of the Blind of Washington >>> >>> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >>> clb5590 at gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jordyn2493%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.com > -- Cindy Bennett Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington clb5590 at gmail.com From zeek786 at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 23:44:42 2013 From: zeek786 at gmail.com (Zeeshan Khan) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 16:44:42 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam Message-ID: Hi everyone, So I went to school for accounting and sat for the CPA exam in 2011 for both the BEC and Auditing parts, but I did not pass. After that I stopped and didn't pursue it further. But now I feel that I have left it incomplete and want to go back to the CPA exams and reattempt it and hopefully pass it this time. So here are my questions / conerns. 1. How long did it take to pass being visually impaired? 2. What programs / resources did you use? I have used Roger CPA, but I beleive his stuff expires after a bit? Is Becker really that good? 3. How long did u spend studying for each part? 4. Do you have a job now after having passed it? 5. How much did you study each day? 6. How did you study? took a live course, studied on your own, got a tutor ? 7. Is it worth the effort and time, especially give the fact that I am legally blind, it is much mroe difficult studying for it? I look forward to hearing all of your experiences. Thank you, -- Zeeshan Khan ToiBooks www.toibooks.com http://www.facebook.com/ToiBooks From clb5590 at gmail.com Sat Mar 16 02:19:21 2013 From: clb5590 at gmail.com (Cindy Bennett) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 19:19:21 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs In-Reply-To: References: <850CD7D3-28A6-4CE4-A12D-DC504341F7B3@panix.com> <018701ce2104$b9163830$2b42a890$@gmail.com> <4EA9151731404BDDB23E988EB9C5F562@OwnerPC> <514348DD.70705@gmail.com> Message-ID: Ok, really interesting discovery. I enabled sleep mode with JAWS while in Chrome using ChromeVox, and then I attempted to figure out how to disable sleep mode to see if JAWS can in fact work in conjunction with ChromeVox. If you press insert 6, you can view the settings for all of the applications on your computer. However, Chrome did not appear in this list of applications. Turns out that when you enable sleep mode in Chrome, it enables it in Firefox too. Somehow Chrome is using those settings. So Chrome will not show up as an application. The good thing about this is that it is easy to toggle sleep mode with JAWS when using Chrome. The bad news is that if you use Firefox and Chrome at the same time, you will have to toggle this setting each time you switch windows. So I don't really recommend that. I opened Firefox yesterday and thought the page was frozen because JAWS didn't talk at all. But now I know that it is really because when I put JAWS to sleep in Chrome, it went to sleep in Firefox as well. Bizarre. Cindy On 3/15/13, Cindy Bennett wrote: > ChromeVox is a screen reader created by google meant to be used in > google chrome to access google products with voice output. > > Cindy > > On 3/15/13, Ashley Bramlett wrote: >> what is chromevox? >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Jordyn Castor >> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 12:14 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs >> >> Hey everyone! >> Has anyone tried using Chrome with ChromeVox to access Google Docs? I'm >> wondering if that might work a bit better since both are technologies >> Google has developed. >> I haven't played around with this, but I really need to. >> On 3/15/2013 9:57 AM, Ashley Bramlett wrote: >>> last year I tried google docs and it wasn't accessible; guess they have >>> tweaked it to work to some extent. >>> What is google drive? I have a desktop too and if I used google docs, I >>> might have to install the drive. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- From: Katie Wang >>> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 12:41 AM >>> To: jsoro620 at gmail.com ; National Association of Blind Students mailing >>> list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs >>> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> I'm in the same boat as Cindy and would really like to use Google Doc >>> to collaborate with my colleagues. I have Google Drive on my Ipod >>> Touch, which enables me to read all the uploaded content, but I find >>> editing to be quite tedious even with a Bluetooth keyboard. I haven't >>> had any luck with the desktop version of Google Drive - I just >>> installed it on my PC but JAWS wouldn't even speak the sign-in screen. >>> Any suggestions for possible work-arounds would be much appreciated! >>> >>> Katie >>> >>> >>> On 3/14/13, Joe wrote: >>>> Have you downloaded the desktop app? It should work like Dropbox and be >>>> just >>>> as accessible. >>>> >>>> Joe >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Cindy >>>> Bennett >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:49 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs >>>> >>>> I'm not sure what is going on exactly. I personally have never >>>> experienced >>>> the problem. It is true though that the "conflicted copy" >>>> thing is annoying. People cannot work on documents at the same time, >>>> and >>>> when they do, if you do not make sure to transfer all of the new data >>>> from >>>> the conflicted copy to the parent copy, you can end up inadvertently >>>> losing >>>> information. >>>> >>>> Also, my lab has always used Google docs, so I would prefer to use the >>>> same >>>> system as my colleagues. >>>> >>>> Any help would be appreciated. >>>> >>>> Thanks. >>>> >>>> Cindy >>>> >>>> >>>> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>> Under what circumstances are files being deleted from your friend's >>>> dropbox? >>>>> What app is she using? >>>>> >>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>> sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 14, 2013, at 11:56, Cindy Bennett wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hi everyone, >>>>>> >>>>>> When I get to the Google Drive web page, I notice that there are a >>>>>> series of buttons such as create, upload, and share. How do you get >>>>>> these buttons to activate? I pressed enter on the create button and >>>>>> JAWS said "loading" and then "load complete," but I can't find where >>>>>> the document is to write. >>>>>> >>>>>> I am really interested in exploring accessibility, and I know there >>>>>> are a couple of workarounds. But I am in a situation where one of my >>>>>> colleagues is having files oddly deleted from her Dropbox and is >>>>>> incredibly frustrated and wants to switch to Google docs right now. >>>>>> So I am trying to get some quick answers to investigate preliminary >>>>>> accessibility. >>>>>> >>>>>> I know that with Google Calendar, I have an incredibly difficult time >>>>>> pressing the buttons to create and share calendars. I know there is a >>>>>> Google accessibility web page, but their advice really hasn't worked >>>>>> for me. I know that there is a series of JAWS commands such as >>>>>> rooting the jaws cursor to the pc cursor and left mouse clicking, and >>>>>> that really doesn't work for me although maybe I am doing it >>>>>> incorrectly. >>>>>> >>>>>> The Google docs web page seems to have some similarities in a >>>>>> negative way to the web interface of Google Calendar. >>>>>> >>>>>> Does anyone use Google docs on their iPhone? I have a blue tooth >>>>>> keyboard so although no optimal, I could do that. >>>>>> >>>>>> Does anyone use Google docs on their mac? >>>>>> >>>>>> I have a duel system meaning that I use bootcamp. I really haven't >>>>>> found VoiceOver to be as efficient, and I really don't want to have >>>>>> to switch sides every time I need to work on a Google doc, but I am >>>>>> curious. >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks for your input, and sorry for all of the details. I always >>>>>> appreciate the help I receive from this list. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Cindy Bennett >>>>>> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative >>>>>> Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington >>>>>> >>>>>> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >>>>>> clb5590 at gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.co >>>>> m >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Cindy Bennett >>>> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative >>>> Coordinator: >>>> National Federation of the Blind of Washington >>>> >>>> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >>>> clb5590 at gmail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jordyn2493%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Cindy Bennett > Secretary: National Association of Blind Students > Legislative Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington > > B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington > clb5590 at gmail.com > -- Cindy Bennett Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington clb5590 at gmail.com From dandrews at visi.com Sat Mar 16 02:21:35 2013 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 21:21:35 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: References: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com> <-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid> Message-ID: Well, I will throw my two cents in, as someone who used to have some vision, and not carry a cane always. Ultimately I figured out that it was confusing to other people, sometimes I did, sometimes I didn't. Ultimately, I decided it was easier for all for me to carry all the time. Further, if something unpredicted came up, I could deal with it. Dave At 12:32 AM 3/14/2013, you wrote: >Mike, > >I have to disagree here. As one of those partials who elects when to >use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you may >not be considering. Electing when and when not to use a cane is not >always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; some >of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. >Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas >without a cane some times should give up their right to identify >themself as a visually impaired person. E.G, I would never do any >type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a >street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see >like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under >normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria right >across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm coming >right back I don't always choose to actively use it. My choice to not >use a cane in this instance does not mean I should forfit my right to >identify myself as a visually impaired person because I am; the use of >the cane does not change my inability to read print or to see great >distances and it does not change the fact that I am legally blind and >am identified that way. It also doesn't change the level of security >I have with my blindness; if a person refuses to use a cane or fights >against it because they're afraid of the social implications then that >is insecurity, but if they're visually having a good day and want to >run a quick errand that's in a very familiar area with minimal travel >or risk of injury and they're confident in their ability to use audio >cues and the vision they have then that is their choice and doesn't >make them insecure with themself or their blindness. As long as they >have the confidence and security to not be afraid of using it and to >identify and use it when they need to, to be confident and secure >whether they're using a cane or not, and don't pose risk to >themselves in the cases where they don't use it there is nothing that >would suggest insecurity. We don't know the exact visual situation of >anyone on this list unless they've written about it, so I don't think >it is fair to judge about someone's level of security with their >blindness based on their cane habits when we don't know what their >vision is like. > >Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social situations. > Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've >had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria with >my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention using >something besides my name. When they see the cane (or sometimes read >National Federation of the Blind on it if they're close enough to see >it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring >to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before >getting my name. Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an >opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then the >person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're >informed and they see that it's not a big deal. > >And, I have to make one small correction. The main market for the >lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may not >use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since they >are the ones who originated the telescopic design. Although I do know >people who are totally blind or only have light perception that use >the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty quickly >because they use them so much. For someone who may not use the cane >every single day but still would benefit from having an identifier to >let other people know they're visually impaired these canes are great. > Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild >hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need >one. Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can >see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not >tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. >In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to have >an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my eyes >because even if that person may not need to use it by having one for >people to see they must be okay with their blindness and comfortable >in explaining their visual impairment to others should the question >arise. > >On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: > > Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to > > alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive > > thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that > > identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not of > > inferiority. > > > > Just my thoughts > > > > Chris Nusbaum > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > > On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: > > > >> Hamid: > >> > >> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your cake and > >> eat > >> it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages of being recognized > >> as > >> blind whereas on the other, you don't want to really appear blind or be > >> judged because you do not believe you need a cane. My friend, you can't > >> have > >> it both ways. Why do you even care whether the public considers you blind > >> or > >> not or whether they consider it weird that you might appear to not need a > >> cane? Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons > >> who > >> use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows them as > >> blind > >> whereas you consider that you do not? > >> > >> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. > >> > >> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most of us > >> would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a label to > >> being > >> prohibited from going places or doing things because of the alleged > >> inability of the blind. > >> > >> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! > >> > >> Mike Freeman > >> > >> > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid Hamraz > >> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM > >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > >> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID > >> > >> Dear Folks, > >> > >> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to represent my > >> blindness without making a functional use of cane. To be more precise, > >> the > >> target people benefiting are those whose residual sight lets them to walk > >> without the use of a cane and who want to let the other people around > >> them > >> know about their blindness. Carrying a cane is indeed an option. However, > >> I > >> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using it and > >> walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have a special > >> symbol > >> representing this which can be attached anywhere in any size at one's own > >> discretion (and everybody is indeed aware of that). However, there is no > >> such a thing here in US, and setting that up requires time and educating > >> the > >> society about that. > >> > >> > >> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need something > >> much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a functional tool. I > >> appreciate any suggestion. > >> > >> Hamid From dandrews at visi.com Sat Mar 16 02:24:37 2013 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 21:24:37 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America In-Reply-To: References: <002301ce2074$cd744f50$685cedf0$@gmail.com> <8CFEE93347C9D6A-1AB8-1A53E@webmail-d136.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: Joshua -- I wouldn't agree. LCB teaches more than Braille. Further, a good center will expand on the skills you have, not teach you what you already know. When I went to a center I worked on Grade 3 braille and Nemeth, since I was a proficient user. I was a good traveler, and cook, so they had me do some teaching. That sharpens your skills! Dave At 09:05 AM 3/14/2013, you wrote: >Hi Miso. >If you're proficient in Braille, the NFB trainig center wouldn't be >your best bet. >Although they do independence training, you have to attend Braille >classes, every day. >If you need independence training, you'd be better off getting the >skills from a VR rep. >That's what I'm doing, since my VR said that LCB would be a waste of my time. >Blessings, Joshua >________________________________________ >From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Miso Kwak >[kwakmiso at aol.com] >Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:20 AM >To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > >Thank you everyone for helpful answers. >To clarify, I was referring to the STEP not Davidson. >I lived in California barely 4 years, so I experienced JBA only twice. >I personally didn't like the atmosphere and philosophy very much >although not unbearable... >I think at this point, after reading feedbacks, I would prefer one of >the NFB centers over JBA. I think then the task to do is to get my >request to attend CCB justified. >I will contact staff at the CCB and see what I can do. >Thank you again. >Miso Kwak > >-----Original Message----- >From: Hannah Chadwick >To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > >Sent: Wed, Mar 13, 2013 10:29 pm >Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > >Hi all, >So I just wanted to clarify since I've been to the STEP programs at >Junior >Blind of America. There is STEP 1 and STEP 2, and they are both summer >programs that focus on helping young adults with job interviewing >skills, >career research, and during STEP 2, the students are placed on a work >site. >They are expected to travel to and from work using public >transportation. >STEP 1 is 3 weeks and provides students with various info on the topics >mentioned above. STEP 2 is 7 weeks and students have the opportunity to >do >an internship. > I would be glad to provide more info on the STEP programs, however, I >think >that Miso is referring to the Independent living program that Junior >Blind >also offers. >The Davidson Program for Independence, DPI is a residential program for >blind individuals who wish to learn skills such as orientation and >mobility, >technology, cooking, Braille, and of course independent living skills. >I did >not attend DPI so I don't know specifically what they do and how they >run. I >did have friends who attended both the STEP programs as well as DPI. >They >told me they learned a lot and they found it very helpful. I'm sure >there >are pros and cons to attending any residential program. Please don't >hesitate to contact me off list if you have further questions. >All the best, Hannah >-----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >Keith >Biggs >Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 9:48 PM >To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >Subject: Re: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > >Hello, >It depends where you are at in your living skills. I had been living on >my >own for a few months before I went to the Step 2 program and I found it >only >good for the few hours of work experience they provided. They aren't >very >inventive when it comes to giving each person a unique work >environment, but >you do get to do an internship. I did not like however, the step 1 folks >were mentored by the step 2 people for both sessions and the step 2 >people >had to sit through classes the step 1 participant's were taking. >Step 1 is a ton of classes on how to give an interview, talk about >yourself >and act professionally dressing wise and so on. When I went it was very >lecture based and very little real-time experiences, but I could tell >some >people really needed the learning. I could already cook, clean, do >laundry >and had had a summer job the year before in a much freer environment, >so I >found STEP oppressive, but I did learn how to deal with authority in a >mature way and even though I won't repeat it, I am glad I went. >The campus is also very oddly situated, so it takes for ever to go >anywhere >and they expect people to work around the schedule they set up, so for >example, I had a 2 hour commute on Para transit to and from work and I >had >work to do at home. They were not very accommodating for those of us who >wanted to become work junkies, working till 10, grabbing food, then >waking >up at 6 and leaving. They wanted you to actually be around with other >people >and do tasks like instruct the other students on how to use the >computer for >example. >Personally, the YES2 program in Washington state is more my cup of tee >than >the STEP2 program, but I know plenty of other people who really loved >it and >or who would really like it. >You can email me off list if you have any more questions. >brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com >Thanks, > >Brandon Keith Biggs >-----Original Message----- >From: Miso Kwak >Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:55 PM >To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >Subject: [nabs-l] STEP Program offered by Junior Blind of America > >Hello, >I would like to know if any of you have participated in the STEP program >offered by Junior Blind in California. >If you have the experience, could you comment on how it was? >Would you recommend it? >I am trying to select a summer program that will help me improve my >independent living skills (mobility, home management, etc) and realize >that >there are a few different options available, so I just want to hear from >someone if anyone on the list has experience with Junior Blind's STEP >program. >Thank you. >Miso Kwak From dandrews at visi.com Sat Mar 16 02:31:27 2013 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 21:31:27 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs In-Reply-To: References: <850CD7D3-28A6-4CE4-A12D-DC504341F7B3@panix.com> <018701ce2104$b9163830$2b42a890$@gmail.com> Message-ID: You might try Chrome with the ChromeBox extension. This seems to be where Google is putting the majority of its efforts at this time. They indicate they want to support other browsers and screen readers, but it is spotty at best for now. Dave At 11:41 PM 3/14/2013, you wrote: >Hi all, > >I'm in the same boat as Cindy and would really like to use Google Doc >to collaborate with my colleagues. I have Google Drive on my Ipod >Touch, which enables me to read all the uploaded content, but I find >editing to be quite tedious even with a Bluetooth keyboard. I haven't >had any luck with the desktop version of Google Drive - I just >installed it on my PC but JAWS wouldn't even speak the sign-in screen. >Any suggestions for possible work-arounds would be much appreciated! > >Katie > > >On 3/14/13, Joe wrote: > > Have you downloaded the desktop app? It should work like Dropbox and be > > just > > as accessible. > > > > Joe > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Cindy Bennett > > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 3:49 PM > > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs > > > > I'm not sure what is going on exactly. I personally have never experienced > > the problem. It is true though that the "conflicted copy" > > thing is annoying. People cannot work on documents at the same time, and > > when they do, if you do not make sure to transfer all of the new data from > > the conflicted copy to the parent copy, you can end up inadvertently losing > > information. > > > > Also, my lab has always used Google docs, so I would prefer to use the same > > system as my colleagues. > > > > Any help would be appreciated. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Cindy > > > > > > On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > >> Under what circumstances are files being deleted from your friend's > > dropbox? > >> What app is she using? > >> > >> Mike Freeman > >> sent from my iPhone > >> > >> On Mar 14, 2013, at 11:56, Cindy Bennett wrote: > >> > >>> Hi everyone, > >>> > >>> When I get to the Google Drive web page, I notice that there are a > >>> series of buttons such as create, upload, and share. How do you get > >>> these buttons to activate? I pressed enter on the create button and > >>> JAWS said "loading" and then "load complete," but I can't find where > >>> the document is to write. > >>> > >>> I am really interested in exploring accessibility, and I know there > >>> are a couple of workarounds. But I am in a situation where one of my > >>> colleagues is having files oddly deleted from her Dropbox and is > >>> incredibly frustrated and wants to switch to Google docs right now. > >>> So I am trying to get some quick answers to investigate preliminary > >>> accessibility. > >>> > >>> I know that with Google Calendar, I have an incredibly difficult time > >>> pressing the buttons to create and share calendars. I know there is a > >>> Google accessibility web page, but their advice really hasn't worked > >>> for me. I know that there is a series of JAWS commands such as > >>> rooting the jaws cursor to the pc cursor and left mouse clicking, and > >>> that really doesn't work for me although maybe I am doing it > >>> incorrectly. > >>> > >>> The Google docs web page seems to have some similarities in a > >>> negative way to the web interface of Google Calendar. > >>> > >>> Does anyone use Google docs on their iPhone? I have a blue tooth > >>> keyboard so although no optimal, I could do that. > >>> > >>> Does anyone use Google docs on their mac? > >>> > >>> I have a duel system meaning that I use bootcamp. I really haven't > >>> found VoiceOver to be as efficient, and I really don't want to have > >>> to switch sides every time I need to work on a Google doc, but I am > >>> curious. > >>> > >>> Thanks for your input, and sorry for all of the details. I always > >>> appreciate the help I receive from this list. > >>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> Cindy Bennett > >>> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative > >>> Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington > >>> > >>> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington > >>> clb5590 at gmail.com > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> nabs-l mailing list > >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > >>> nabs-l: > >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> nabs-l mailing list > >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org > >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > >> nabs-l: > >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.co > >> m > >> > > > > From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 05:13:10 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 01:13:10 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: <3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com> References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> <0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com> <3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com> Message-ID: <006d01ce213b$c9dbdee0$5d939ca0$@gmail.com> Yeah, I definitely want a portable keyboard. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 11:59 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, or to your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds up, rolls up Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone with a keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple keyboard really isn't practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, something I haven't heard mentioned yet that is potentially very relevant, the iPhone five has a significantly better camera than the four ass. I have a for S, and the camera works, but sometimes it's a little bit slow with apps like vizwizz And the MoneyReader, and I've heard it's a real headache messing with OCR apps on the four ass camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. Whoa, Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of risqué today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) Sent from my iPhone On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: > Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" wrote: > >> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of those >> little ones? >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >> Freeman >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). >> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much >> more cheaply than is the 5. >> >> Mike >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >> williams >> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. >> I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any >> better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; >> I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >> Freeman >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> I don't see why it's superior to the 5. >> >> Mike >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >> williams >> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the Blind. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony >> Grima >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> >> iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users >> by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or >> DAISY: $9 >> >> Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full >> tutorial together and save! >> >> The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster >> than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, >> and has a better camera. >> >> Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a >> supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the >> iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used in >> both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them easily. >> >> If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this >> update to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of >> the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all the appendices. >> An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this >> book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. >> These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone >> reference card. >> >> Order at: >> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html >> >> See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! >> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html >> ****** >> To order any books, send payment to: >> NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge it: >> toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. >> Or order any of our books online at >> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >> 40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >> 40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >> 40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail. >> com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40g > mail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail.com From deb.mendelsohn at gmail.com Sat Mar 16 06:58:32 2013 From: deb.mendelsohn at gmail.com (Deb Mendelsohn) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 23:58:32 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] SAP Online Job Search Guide Message-ID: SAP Online Job Search Guide inShare2 This resource page contains the best online resources for furthering your career within the SAP world. The Job Boards Listing the Most SAP Jobs Global: - Monster – world’s largest job board, localized versions in most countries, the American version currently has over 3,900 SAP jobs posted - Indeed.com – aggregates other job boards, also has localized across the world and claims to have 29,000 SAP jobs USA & Canada: - Dice – the biggest IT job board in North America, 3,600 SAP jobs listed - CareerJet – currently aggregating over 23,500 openings in SAP - Workopolis – largest site in Canada, 460 SAP vacancies Europe: - The SAP Job Board – sister site of the IT Job Board, 1,660 SAP jobs in Europe - Jobserve – mainly for UK openings, 360 SAP jobs at the moment - Simply SAP – another SAP only job board with about 300 vacancies - Jobpilot – a Monster owned IT job board in Germany, “more than” 1,000 SAP vacancies - Keljob – most SAP jobs in France, just over 800 in total Australia & New Zealand: - Seek – same but for Kiwis, listing 110 SAP jobs in New Zealand The Biggest LinkedIn Groups: - SAP People – almost 10,000 members, lots of recruiters here The Biggest Twitter Lists: - SAP Channels – follow a number of SAP news channels - SAP Business One – list for Business One folks Recruiters: - Recruit 121 – SAP and ERP focused, offices in the US and Europe, 33 SAP jobs listed - Sapphire – big IT recruiter in Canada, with about 34 SAP jobs on their books - Speller International – large Australian SAP recruiter listing 70 jobs on their website inShare2 Jorgen Sundberg Jorgen is the original Undercover Recruiter, after 7 years in tech recruiting he now helps companies with social media for recruitment, sales & marketing at Link Humans in London. - - - - - Related posts: 1. Oracle Online Jobs and Career Guide 2. The Job Search Application for Linkedin You Must Use 3. How to Search and Find Jobs with Twitter 4. 5 Tricks Recruiters Use to Find You -- *Deb's Cell: 520-225-8244* From aridamoulakis at gmail.com Sat Mar 16 12:57:09 2013 From: aridamoulakis at gmail.com (Ari Damoulakis) Date: Sat, 16 Mar 2013 14:57:09 +0200 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs In-Reply-To: References: <850CD7D3-28A6-4CE4-A12D-DC504341F7B3@panix.com> <018701ce2104$b9163830$2b42a890$@gmail.com> <4EA9151731404BDDB23E988EB9C5F562@OwnerPC> <514348DD.70705@gmail.com> Message-ID: I know nothing about google docs, but for accessibility of google calendar try Povidi, which is specifically for the blind to work with Google Calendar. www.povidi.com From k7uij at panix.com Sat Mar 16 18:27:07 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Sat, 16 Mar 2013 11:27:07 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: <006d01ce213b$c9dbdee0$5d939ca0$@gmail.com> References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> <0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com> <3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com> <006d01ce213b$c9dbdee0$5d939ca0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <005701ce2273$de724fe0$9b56efa0$@panix.com> Unless you're using your iPhone for heavy note-taking (something I do *not* recommend), I think you'll use a keyboard far less than you imagine you will. Prticularly now that Fleksy is on the scene, I do not use my keyboard or even my BrailleSensePLUS paired to the iPhone as much as I did a couple of years ago. Mike Freeman -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:13 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! Yeah, I definitely want a portable keyboard. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 11:59 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, or to your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds up, rolls up Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone with a keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple keyboard really isn't practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, something I haven't heard mentioned yet that is potentially very relevant, the iPhone five has a significantly better camera than the four ass. I have a for S, and the camera works, but sometimes it's a little bit slow with apps like vizwizz And the MoneyReader, and I've heard it's a real headache messing with OCR apps on the four ass camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. Whoa, Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of risqué today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) Sent from my iPhone On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: > Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" wrote: > >> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of those >> little ones? >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >> Freeman >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). >> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much >> more cheaply than is the 5. >> >> Mike >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >> williams >> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. >> I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any >> better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; >> I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >> Freeman >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> I don't see why it's superior to the 5. >> >> Mike >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >> williams >> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the Blind. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony >> Grima >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> >> iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users >> by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or >> DAISY: $9 >> >> Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full >> tutorial together and save! >> >> The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster >> than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, >> and has a better camera. >> >> Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a >> supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the >> iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used in >> both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them easily. >> >> If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this >> update to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of >> the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all the appendices. >> An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this >> book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. >> These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone >> reference card. >> >> Order at: >> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html >> >> See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! >> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html >> ****** >> To order any books, send payment to: >> NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge it: >> toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. >> Or order any of our books online at >> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >> 40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >> 40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >> 40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail. >> com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40g > mail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 20:12:15 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 16:12:15 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: <005701ce2273$de724fe0$9b56efa0$@panix.com> References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> <0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com> <3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com> <006d01ce213b$c9dbdee0$5d939ca0$@gmail.com> <005701ce2273$de724fe0$9b56efa0$@panix.com> Message-ID: <011901ce21b9$639bbbe0$2ad333a0$@gmail.com> Yeah, at some point, but as a full time student, I would like a bridge so I can be effective until I get the hang of the gestures. I don't have three to four hours a day for a week to spend on the I phone, and I can't afford to loose time. The keyboard just seems like the answer. I'll be studying for exams and doing final papers in the next few weeks. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 2:27 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! Unless you're using your iPhone for heavy note-taking (something I do *not* recommend), I think you'll use a keyboard far less than you imagine you will. Prticularly now that Fleksy is on the scene, I do not use my keyboard or even my BrailleSensePLUS paired to the iPhone as much as I did a couple of years ago. Mike Freeman -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:13 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! Yeah, I definitely want a portable keyboard. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 11:59 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, or to your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds up, rolls up Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone with a keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple keyboard really isn't practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, something I haven't heard mentioned yet that is potentially very relevant, the iPhone five has a significantly better camera than the four ass. I have a for S, and the camera works, but sometimes it's a little bit slow with apps like vizwizz And the MoneyReader, and I've heard it's a real headache messing with OCR apps on the four ass camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. Whoa, Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of risqué today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) Sent from my iPhone On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: > Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" wrote: > >> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of those >> little ones? >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >> Freeman >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). >> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much >> more cheaply than is the 5. >> >> Mike >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >> williams >> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. >> I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any >> better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; >> I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >> Freeman >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> I don't see why it's superior to the 5. >> >> Mike >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >> williams >> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the Blind. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony >> Grima >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> >> iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users >> by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or >> DAISY: $9 >> >> Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full >> tutorial together and save! >> >> The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster >> than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, >> and has a better camera. >> >> Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a >> supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the >> iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used in >> both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them easily. >> >> If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this >> update to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of >> the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all the appendices. >> An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this >> book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. >> These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone >> reference card. >> >> Order at: >> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html >> >> See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! >> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html >> ****** >> To order any books, send payment to: >> NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge it: >> toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. >> Or order any of our books online at >> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >> 40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >> 40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >> 40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail. >> com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40g > mail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail.com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Sat Mar 16 21:33:22 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Sat, 16 Mar 2013 17:33:22 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: <011901ce21b9$639bbbe0$2ad333a0$@gmail.com> References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> <0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com> <3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com> <006d01ce213b$c9dbdee0$5d939ca0$@gmail.com> <005701ce2273$de724fe0$9b56efa0$@panix.com> <011901ce21b9$639bbbe0$2ad333a0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, Justin, I'm a little confused as to why you would need to do heavy notetaking on the IPhone. Do you mean you'd use it to take notes and study in lieu of a computer? If you have one it would probably make more sense and be easier to just use a laptop, but I'm sure you have a reason. Just curious. On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: > Yeah, at some point, but as a full time student, I would like a bridge so I > can be effective until I get the hang of the gestures. I don't have three > to four hours a day for a week to spend on the I phone, and I can't afford > to loose time. The keyboard just seems like the answer. I'll be studying > for exams and doing final papers in the next few weeks. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman > Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 2:27 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > Unless you're using your iPhone for heavy note-taking (something I do *not* > recommend), I think you'll use a keyboard far less than you imagine you > will. Prticularly now that Fleksy is on the scene, I do not use my keyboard > or even my BrailleSensePLUS paired to the iPhone as much as I did a couple > of years ago. > > Mike Freeman > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:13 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > Yeah, I definitely want a portable keyboard. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt > Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 11:59 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, or to > your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds up, rolls up > Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone with a > keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple keyboard really isn't > practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, something I haven't heard > mentioned yet that is potentially very relevant, the iPhone five has a > significantly better camera than the four ass. I have a for S, and the > camera works, but sometimes it's a little bit slow with apps like vizwizz > And the MoneyReader, and I've heard it's a real headache messing with OCR > apps on the four ass camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. Whoa, > Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of risqué > today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: > >> Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" >> wrote: >> >>> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of those >>> little ones? >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>> Freeman >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). >>> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much >>> more cheaply than is the 5. >>> >>> Mike >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>> williams >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. >>> I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any >>> better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; >>> I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>> Freeman >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> I don't see why it's superior to the 5. >>> >>> Mike >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>> williams >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the Blind. >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony >>> Grima >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM >>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> >>> iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users >>> by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or >>> DAISY: $9 >>> >>> Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full >>> tutorial together and save! >>> >>> The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster >>> than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, >>> and has a better camera. >>> >>> Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a >>> supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the >>> iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used in >>> both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them easily. >>> >>> If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this >>> update to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of >>> the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all >>> the appendices. >>> An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this >>> book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. >>> These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone >>> reference card. >>> >>> Order at: >>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html >>> >>> See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! >>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html >>> ****** >>> To order any books, send payment to: >>> NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge it: >>> toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. >>> Or order any of our books online at >>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>> 40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>> 40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>> 40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail. >>> com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40g >> mail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From joshkart12 at gmail.com Sat Mar 16 21:43:59 2013 From: joshkart12 at gmail.com (Josh Gregory) Date: Sat, 16 Mar 2013 17:43:59 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> <0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com> <3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com> <006d01ce213b$c9dbdee0$5d939ca0$@gmail.com> <005701ce2273$de724fe0$9b56efa0$@panix.com> <011901ce21b9$639bbbe0$2ad333a0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <47B71796-011D-466D-8F39-28256D9E3501@gmail.com> Yeah, the iPhone can be used for stuff like this, but it's not really meant for the heavy stuff. Sent from my iPhone On Mar 16, 2013, at 5:33 PM, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Hi, > > Justin, I'm a little confused as to why you would need to do heavy > notetaking on the IPhone. Do you mean you'd use it to take notes and > study in lieu of a computer? If you have one it would probably make > more sense and be easier to just use a laptop, but I'm sure you have a > reason. Just curious. > > On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: >> Yeah, at some point, but as a full time student, I would like a bridge so I >> can be effective until I get the hang of the gestures. I don't have three >> to four hours a day for a week to spend on the I phone, and I can't afford >> to loose time. The keyboard just seems like the answer. I'll be studying >> for exams and doing final papers in the next few weeks. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman >> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 2:27 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> Unless you're using your iPhone for heavy note-taking (something I do *not* >> recommend), I think you'll use a keyboard far less than you imagine you >> will. Prticularly now that Fleksy is on the scene, I do not use my keyboard >> or even my BrailleSensePLUS paired to the iPhone as much as I did a couple >> of years ago. >> >> Mike Freeman >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:13 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> Yeah, I definitely want a portable keyboard. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt >> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 11:59 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, or to >> your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds up, rolls up >> Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone with a >> keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple keyboard really isn't >> practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, something I haven't heard >> mentioned yet that is potentially very relevant, the iPhone five has a >> significantly better camera than the four ass. I have a for S, and the >> camera works, but sometimes it's a little bit slow with apps like vizwizz >> And the MoneyReader, and I've heard it's a real headache messing with OCR >> apps on the four ass camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. Whoa, >> Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of risqué >> today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: >> >>> Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of those >>>> little ones? >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>> Freeman >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). >>>> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much >>>> more cheaply than is the 5. >>>> >>>> Mike >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>> williams >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. >>>> I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any >>>> better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; >>>> I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>> Freeman >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> I don't see why it's superior to the 5. >>>> >>>> Mike >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>> williams >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the Blind. >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony >>>> Grima >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM >>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> >>>> iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users >>>> by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or >>>> DAISY: $9 >>>> >>>> Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full >>>> tutorial together and save! >>>> >>>> The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster >>>> than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, >>>> and has a better camera. >>>> >>>> Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a >>>> supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the >>>> iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used in >>>> both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them easily. >>>> >>>> If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this >>>> update to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of >>>> the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all >>>> the appendices. >>>> An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this >>>> book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. >>>> These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone >>>> reference card. >>>> >>>> Order at: >>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html >>>> >>>> See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! >>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html >>>> ****** >>>> To order any books, send payment to: >>>> NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge it: >>>> toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. >>>> Or order any of our books online at >>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>> 40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>> 40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>> 40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail. >>>> com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40g >>> mail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 21:53:57 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 17:53:57 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> <0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com> <3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com> <006d01ce213b$c9dbdee0$5d939ca0$@gmail.com> <005701ce2273$de724fe0$9b56efa0$@panix.com> <011901ce21b9$639bbbe0$2ad333a0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <000601ce21c7$98d4bb50$ca7e31f0$@gmail.com> No I just ment for general operations such as texting and internet or maneuvering. No heavy notetaking. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 5:33 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! Hi, Justin, I'm a little confused as to why you would need to do heavy notetaking on the IPhone. Do you mean you'd use it to take notes and study in lieu of a computer? If you have one it would probably make more sense and be easier to just use a laptop, but I'm sure you have a reason. Just curious. On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: > Yeah, at some point, but as a full time student, I would like a > bridge so I can be effective until I get the hang of the gestures. I > don't have three to four hours a day for a week to spend on the I > phone, and I can't afford to loose time. The keyboard just seems like > the answer. I'll be studying for exams and doing final papers in the next few weeks. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike > Freeman > Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 2:27 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > Unless you're using your iPhone for heavy note-taking (something I do > *not* recommend), I think you'll use a keyboard far less than you > imagine you will. Prticularly now that Fleksy is on the scene, I do > not use my keyboard or even my BrailleSensePLUS paired to the iPhone > as much as I did a couple of years ago. > > Mike Freeman > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin > williams > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:13 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > Yeah, I definitely want a portable keyboard. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt > Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 11:59 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, or > to your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds up, > rolls up Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your > phone with a keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple > keyboard really isn't practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, > something I haven't heard mentioned yet that is potentially very > relevant, the iPhone five has a significantly better camera than the > four ass. I have a for S, and the camera works, but sometimes it's a > little bit slow with apps like vizwizz And the MoneyReader, and I've > heard it's a real headache messing with OCR apps on the four ass > camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. Whoa, Siri just > messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of risqué today, so > I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: > >> Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" >> wrote: >> >>> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of those >>> little ones? >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>> Freeman >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). >>> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much >>> more cheaply than is the 5. >>> >>> Mike >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>> williams >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. >>> I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any >>> better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for >>> sure; I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>> Freeman >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> I don't see why it's superior to the 5. >>> >>> Mike >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>> williams >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the Blind. >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony >>> Grima >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM >>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> >>> iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users >>> by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or >>> DAISY: $9 >>> >>> Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full >>> tutorial together and save! >>> >>> The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster >>> than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, >>> and has a better camera. >>> >>> Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a >>> supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the >>> iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used in >>> both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them easily. >>> >>> If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this >>> update to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of >>> the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of >>> all the appendices. >>> An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this >>> book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. >>> These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone >>> reference card. >>> >>> Order at: >>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html >>> >>> See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! >>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html >>> ****** >>> To order any books, send payment to: >>> NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge it: >>> toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. >>> Or order any of our books online at >>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2 >>> % >>> 40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.co >>> m >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2 >>> % >>> 40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.co >>> m >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2 >>> % >>> 40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail. >>> com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40 >> g >> mail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% > 40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Fri Mar 15 21:54:33 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 17:54:33 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> <0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com> <3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com> <006d01ce213b$c9dbdee0$5d939ca0$@gmail.com> <005701ce2273$de724fe0$9b56efa0$@panix.com> <011901ce21b9$639bbbe0$2ad333a0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <000801ce21c7$ae022df0$0a0689d0$@gmail.com> I jump ahead sometimes folks. I don't always explain myself as I should. I apologize for that. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 5:33 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! Hi, Justin, I'm a little confused as to why you would need to do heavy notetaking on the IPhone. Do you mean you'd use it to take notes and study in lieu of a computer? If you have one it would probably make more sense and be easier to just use a laptop, but I'm sure you have a reason. Just curious. On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: > Yeah, at some point, but as a full time student, I would like a bridge so I > can be effective until I get the hang of the gestures. I don't have three > to four hours a day for a week to spend on the I phone, and I can't afford > to loose time. The keyboard just seems like the answer. I'll be studying > for exams and doing final papers in the next few weeks. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman > Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 2:27 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > Unless you're using your iPhone for heavy note-taking (something I do *not* > recommend), I think you'll use a keyboard far less than you imagine you > will. Prticularly now that Fleksy is on the scene, I do not use my keyboard > or even my BrailleSensePLUS paired to the iPhone as much as I did a couple > of years ago. > > Mike Freeman > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:13 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > Yeah, I definitely want a portable keyboard. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt > Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 11:59 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, or to > your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds up, rolls up > Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone with a > keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple keyboard really isn't > practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, something I haven't heard > mentioned yet that is potentially very relevant, the iPhone five has a > significantly better camera than the four ass. I have a for S, and the > camera works, but sometimes it's a little bit slow with apps like vizwizz > And the MoneyReader, and I've heard it's a real headache messing with OCR > apps on the four ass camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. Whoa, > Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of risqué > today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: > >> Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" >> wrote: >> >>> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of those >>> little ones? >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>> Freeman >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). >>> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much >>> more cheaply than is the 5. >>> >>> Mike >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>> williams >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. >>> I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any >>> better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; >>> I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>> Freeman >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> I don't see why it's superior to the 5. >>> >>> Mike >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>> williams >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the Blind. >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony >>> Grima >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM >>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> >>> iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users >>> by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or >>> DAISY: $9 >>> >>> Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full >>> tutorial together and save! >>> >>> The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster >>> than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, >>> and has a better camera. >>> >>> Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a >>> supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the >>> iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used in >>> both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them easily. >>> >>> If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this >>> update to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of >>> the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all >>> the appendices. >>> An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this >>> book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. >>> These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone >>> reference card. >>> >>> Order at: >>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html >>> >>> See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! >>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html >>> ****** >>> To order any books, send payment to: >>> NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge it: >>> toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. >>> Or order any of our books online at >>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>> 40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>> 40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>> 40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail. >>> com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40g >> mail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai l.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From kirt.crazydude at gmail.com Sat Mar 16 22:29:58 2013 From: kirt.crazydude at gmail.com (Kirt Manwaring) Date: Sat, 16 Mar 2013 16:29:58 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: <000801ce21c7$ae022df0$0a0689d0$@gmail.com> References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> <0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com> <3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com> <006d01ce213b$c9dbdee0$5d939ca0$@gmail.com> <005701ce2273$de724fe0$9b56efa0$@panix.com> <011901ce21b9$639bbbe0$2ad333a0$@gmail.com> <000801ce21c7$ae022df0$0a0689d0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Mike, I agree fleksy can be a game changer. Still, portable (and by that I mean pocket-sized) bluetooth keyboards are a realistic option and, speaking from personal experience, I can type much faster on a bluetooth keyboard or paired apex than I can with fleksy, although fleksy is definitely a huge improvement over standard touch typing. When I had a small bluetooth keyboard, I used it all the time for things like texting, e-mail, light notetaking (calendars, contacts, etc), web browsing and the like. Even with fleksy and a braille note apex, I'm finding that I miss my little bluetooth keyboard more and more the longer I don't have one. Yes, it was slightly uncomfortable in my pocket...but I'm used to carrying lots of things in my pockets, so that wasn't a big deal. Yes, it cost something like sixty dollars; I'll probably pay up and get another one soon, just because the dang thing was so practical for me. Again, I'm just saying what's worked for me, and I totally recognize that my prefered style isn't right for everybody. As far as I'm concerned, if fleksy gets the job done for you and does most everything you want it do, more power to you. Your pocket book would probably agree with me. :) Best, Kirt On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: > I jump ahead sometimes folks. I don't always explain myself as I should. > I > apologize for that. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 5:33 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > Hi, > > Justin, I'm a little confused as to why you would need to do heavy > notetaking on the IPhone. Do you mean you'd use it to take notes and > study in lieu of a computer? If you have one it would probably make > more sense and be easier to just use a laptop, but I'm sure you have a > reason. Just curious. > > On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: >> Yeah, at some point, but as a full time student, I would like a bridge >> so > I >> can be effective until I get the hang of the gestures. I don't have >> three >> to four hours a day for a week to spend on the I phone, and I can't >> afford >> to loose time. The keyboard just seems like the answer. I'll be studying >> for exams and doing final papers in the next few weeks. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman >> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 2:27 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> Unless you're using your iPhone for heavy note-taking (something I do > *not* >> recommend), I think you'll use a keyboard far less than you imagine you >> will. Prticularly now that Fleksy is on the scene, I do not use my > keyboard >> or even my BrailleSensePLUS paired to the iPhone as much as I did a >> couple >> of years ago. >> >> Mike Freeman >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin > williams >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:13 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> Yeah, I definitely want a portable keyboard. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt >> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 11:59 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, or to >> your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds up, rolls > up >> Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone with a >> keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple keyboard really >> isn't >> practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, something I haven't heard >> mentioned yet that is potentially very relevant, the iPhone five has a >> significantly better camera than the four ass. I have a for S, and the >> camera works, but sometimes it's a little bit slow with apps like vizwizz >> And the MoneyReader, and I've heard it's a real headache messing with OCR >> apps on the four ass camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. > Whoa, >> Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of risqué >> today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: >> >>> Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of those >>>> little ones? >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>> Freeman >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). >>>> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much >>>> more cheaply than is the 5. >>>> >>>> Mike >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>> williams >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. >>>> I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any >>>> better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; >>>> I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>> Freeman >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> I don't see why it's superior to the 5. >>>> >>>> Mike >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>> williams >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the >>>> Blind. >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony >>>> Grima >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM >>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> >>>> iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users >>>> by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or >>>> DAISY: $9 >>>> >>>> Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full >>>> tutorial together and save! >>>> >>>> The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster >>>> than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, >>>> and has a better camera. >>>> >>>> Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a >>>> supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the >>>> iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used in >>>> both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them >>>> easily. >>>> >>>> If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this >>>> update to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of >>>> the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all >>>> the appendices. >>>> An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this >>>> book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. >>>> These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone >>>> reference card. >>>> >>>> Order at: >>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html >>>> >>>> See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! >>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html >>>> ****** >>>> To order any books, send payment to: >>>> NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge >>>> it: >>>> toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. >>>> Or order any of our books online at >>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>> 40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>> 40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>> 40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail. >>>> com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40g >>> mail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai > l.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40gmail.com > From k7uij at panix.com Sat Mar 16 23:15:13 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Sat, 16 Mar 2013 16:15:13 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> <0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com> <3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com> <006d01ce213b$c9dbdee0$5d939ca0$@gmail.com> <005701ce2273$de724fe0$9b56efa0$@panix.com> <011901ce21b9$639bbbe0$2ad333a0$@gmail.com> <000801ce21c7$ae022df0$0a0689d0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <00a901ce229c$1d388910$57a99b30$@panix.com> Actually, I prefer a note-taker to the iPhone for serious work. For stuff that isn't serious, I don't want to be bothered with a keyboard. To each his/her own. Say! How about let's do away with cellphones altogether so we actually have to speak to each other once again? (grin) Mike -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt Manwaring Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 3:30 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! Mike, I agree fleksy can be a game changer. Still, portable (and by that I mean pocket-sized) bluetooth keyboards are a realistic option and, speaking from personal experience, I can type much faster on a bluetooth keyboard or paired apex than I can with fleksy, although fleksy is definitely a huge improvement over standard touch typing. When I had a small bluetooth keyboard, I used it all the time for things like texting, e-mail, light notetaking (calendars, contacts, etc), web browsing and the like. Even with fleksy and a braille note apex, I'm finding that I miss my little bluetooth keyboard more and more the longer I don't have one. Yes, it was slightly uncomfortable in my pocket...but I'm used to carrying lots of things in my pockets, so that wasn't a big deal. Yes, it cost something like sixty dollars; I'll probably pay up and get another one soon, just because the dang thing was so practical for me. Again, I'm just saying what's worked for me, and I totally recognize that my prefered style isn't right for everybody. As far as I'm concerned, if fleksy gets the job done for you and does most everything you want it do, more power to you. Your pocket book would probably agree with me. :) Best, Kirt On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: > I jump ahead sometimes folks. I don't always explain myself as I should. > I > apologize for that. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 5:33 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > Hi, > > Justin, I'm a little confused as to why you would need to do heavy > notetaking on the IPhone. Do you mean you'd use it to take notes and > study in lieu of a computer? If you have one it would probably make > more sense and be easier to just use a laptop, but I'm sure you have a > reason. Just curious. > > On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: >> Yeah, at some point, but as a full time student, I would like a bridge >> so > I >> can be effective until I get the hang of the gestures. I don't have >> three >> to four hours a day for a week to spend on the I phone, and I can't >> afford >> to loose time. The keyboard just seems like the answer. I'll be studying >> for exams and doing final papers in the next few weeks. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman >> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 2:27 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> Unless you're using your iPhone for heavy note-taking (something I do > *not* >> recommend), I think you'll use a keyboard far less than you imagine you >> will. Prticularly now that Fleksy is on the scene, I do not use my > keyboard >> or even my BrailleSensePLUS paired to the iPhone as much as I did a >> couple >> of years ago. >> >> Mike Freeman >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin > williams >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:13 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> Yeah, I definitely want a portable keyboard. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt >> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 11:59 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, or to >> your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds up, rolls > up >> Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone with a >> keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple keyboard really >> isn't >> practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, something I haven't heard >> mentioned yet that is potentially very relevant, the iPhone five has a >> significantly better camera than the four ass. I have a for S, and the >> camera works, but sometimes it's a little bit slow with apps like vizwizz >> And the MoneyReader, and I've heard it's a real headache messing with OCR >> apps on the four ass camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. > Whoa, >> Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of risqué >> today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: >> >>> Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of those >>>> little ones? >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>> Freeman >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). >>>> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much >>>> more cheaply than is the 5. >>>> >>>> Mike >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>> williams >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. >>>> I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any >>>> better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; >>>> I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>> Freeman >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> I don't see why it's superior to the 5. >>>> >>>> Mike >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>> williams >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the >>>> Blind. >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony >>>> Grima >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM >>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> >>>> iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users >>>> by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or >>>> DAISY: $9 >>>> >>>> Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full >>>> tutorial together and save! >>>> >>>> The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster >>>> than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, >>>> and has a better camera. >>>> >>>> Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a >>>> supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the >>>> iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used in >>>> both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them >>>> easily. >>>> >>>> If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this >>>> update to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of >>>> the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all >>>> the appendices. >>>> An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this >>>> book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. >>>> These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone >>>> reference card. >>>> >>>> Order at: >>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html >>>> >>>> See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! >>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html >>>> ****** >>>> To order any books, send payment to: >>>> NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge >>>> it: >>>> toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. >>>> Or order any of our books online at >>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>> 40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>> 40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>> 40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail. >>>> com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40g >>> mail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai > l.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40gmail.c om > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Sun Mar 17 00:13:15 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Sat, 16 Mar 2013 20:13:15 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: <00a901ce229c$1d388910$57a99b30$@panix.com> References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> <0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com> <3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com> <006d01ce213b$c9dbdee0$5d939ca0$@gmail.com> <005701ce2273$de724fe0$9b56efa0$@panix.com> <011901ce21b9$639bbbe0$2ad333a0$@gmail.com> <000801ce21c7$ae022df0$0a0689d0$@gmail.com> <00a901ce229c$1d388910$57a99b30$@panix.com> Message-ID: Yes, Social skills have definitely deteriorated, but the blame can't be placed on cell phones; it's the operators who use them who are really at fault. When you consider the original objective behind cell phones, (which was to make it easier for people to get in touch with each other wherever they may be), they have accomplished that goal. It was only when texting came on the scene that people have seriously withdrawn, and it seems the younger the generation the more they text and the worse their social skills are. I didn't get an IPhone till about a year and a half ago, so I think I was spared the texting-mania when it first came out and my sighted friends all got cell phones, but I see them do it, and even worse I see friends of my younger siblings do it---even while they're at my house supposed to be hanging out with their friend---and it boggles the crap out of me. I mean, how can you be so rude as to be carrying on a texting conversation with someone else when you're supposed to be at someone's house and spending time with them? It's really the operators at fault; the whole point of texting was to allow people to send quick messages that wouldn't be worth a phone call... things like, "On my way, be there in 5," or "I'll call you later." Not "OMG did you hear this latest gossip," and hen have a message so long that the receiver's phone gets five or six pages of text. People have definitely warped it and are using it for the wrong reasons, sacrificing their social skills in the process. On 3/16/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > Actually, I prefer a note-taker to the iPhone for serious work. For stuff > that isn't serious, I don't want to be bothered with a keyboard. > > To each his/her own. > > Say! How about let's do away with cellphones altogether so we actually have > to speak to each other once again? (grin) > > Mike > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt Manwaring > Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 3:30 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > Mike, > I agree fleksy can be a game changer. Still, portable (and by that > I mean pocket-sized) bluetooth keyboards are a realistic option and, > speaking from personal experience, I can type much faster on a > bluetooth keyboard or paired apex than I can with fleksy, although > fleksy is definitely a huge improvement over standard touch typing. > When I had a small bluetooth keyboard, I used it all the time for > things like texting, e-mail, light notetaking (calendars, contacts, > etc), web browsing and the like. Even with fleksy and a braille note > apex, I'm finding that I miss my little bluetooth keyboard more and > more the longer I don't have one. Yes, it was slightly uncomfortable > in my pocket...but I'm used to carrying lots of things in my pockets, > so that wasn't a big deal. Yes, it cost something like sixty dollars; > I'll probably pay up and get another one soon, just because the dang > thing was so practical for me. Again, I'm just saying what's worked > for me, and I totally recognize that my prefered style isn't right for > everybody. As far as I'm concerned, if fleksy gets the job done for > you and does most everything you want it do, more power to you. Your > pocket book would probably agree with me. :) > Best, > Kirt > > On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: >> I jump ahead sometimes folks. I don't always explain myself as I should. >> I >> apologize for that. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >> Shelton >> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 5:33 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> Hi, >> >> Justin, I'm a little confused as to why you would need to do heavy >> notetaking on the IPhone. Do you mean you'd use it to take notes and >> study in lieu of a computer? If you have one it would probably make >> more sense and be easier to just use a laptop, but I'm sure you have a >> reason. Just curious. >> >> On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: >>> Yeah, at some point, but as a full time student, I would like a bridge >>> so >> I >>> can be effective until I get the hang of the gestures. I don't have >>> three >>> to four hours a day for a week to spend on the I phone, and I can't >>> afford >>> to loose time. The keyboard just seems like the answer. I'll be >>> studying >>> for exams and doing final papers in the next few weeks. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>> Freeman >>> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 2:27 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> Unless you're using your iPhone for heavy note-taking (something I do >> *not* >>> recommend), I think you'll use a keyboard far less than you imagine you >>> will. Prticularly now that Fleksy is on the scene, I do not use my >> keyboard >>> or even my BrailleSensePLUS paired to the iPhone as much as I did a >>> couple >>> of years ago. >>> >>> Mike Freeman >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >> williams >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:13 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> Yeah, I definitely want a portable keyboard. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt >>> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 11:59 AM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, or to >>> your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds up, rolls >> up >>> Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone with a >>> keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple keyboard really >>> isn't >>> practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, something I haven't >>> heard >>> mentioned yet that is potentially very relevant, the iPhone five has a >>> significantly better camera than the four ass. I have a for S, and the >>> camera works, but sometimes it's a little bit slow with apps like >>> vizwizz >>> And the MoneyReader, and I've heard it's a real headache messing with >>> OCR >>> apps on the four ass camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. >> Whoa, >>> Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of risqué >>> today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: >>> >>>> Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of those >>>>> little ones? >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>>> Freeman >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>> >>>>> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). >>>>> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much >>>>> more cheaply than is the 5. >>>>> >>>>> Mike >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>>> williams >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>> >>>>> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. >>>>> I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any >>>>> better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; >>>>> I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>>> Freeman >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>> >>>>> I don't see why it's superior to the 5. >>>>> >>>>> Mike >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>>> williams >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>> >>>>> I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the >>>>> Blind. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony >>>>> Grima >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM >>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users >>>>> by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or >>>>> DAISY: $9 >>>>> >>>>> Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full >>>>> tutorial together and save! >>>>> >>>>> The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster >>>>> than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, >>>>> and has a better camera. >>>>> >>>>> Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a >>>>> supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the >>>>> iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used in >>>>> both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them >>>>> easily. >>>>> >>>>> If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this >>>>> update to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of >>>>> the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all >>>>> the appendices. >>>>> An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this >>>>> book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. >>>>> These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone >>>>> reference card. >>>>> >>>>> Order at: >>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html >>>>> >>>>> See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! >>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html >>>>> ****** >>>>> To order any books, send payment to: >>>>> NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge >>>>> it: >>>>> toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. >>>>> Or order any of our books online at >>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>> 40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>> 40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>> 40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail. >>>>> com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40g >>>> mail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai >> l.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40gmail.c > om >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From mistydbradley at gmail.com Sun Mar 17 02:26:02 2013 From: mistydbradley at gmail.com (Misty Dawn Bradley) Date: Sat, 16 Mar 2013 22:26:02 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org><007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com><006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com><007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com><00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com><006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com><0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com><3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com><006d01ce213b$c9dbdee0$5d939ca0$@gmail.com><005701ce2273$de724fe0$9b56efa0$@panix.com><011901ce21b9$639bbbe0$2ad333a0$@gmail.com><000801ce21c7$ae022df0$0a0689d0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49097C63CC24449FB0B221C08D674A0F@acerd37f251f21> Hi, I also use a bluetooth keyboard and find it very useful and quicker than typing on the touch screen. SpeedDots has a small bluetooth keyboard for about $44, and this is the one I have. They also sell a case for it for $10 that has a belt clip and loops on the back in case you want a case to put it in, but it could also fit in a pocket on its own. I like it because it is easy to pair and the keys can be differentiated from each other. It also has an on and off switch. Hth, Misty ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kirt Manwaring" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 6:29 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! Mike, I agree fleksy can be a game changer. Still, portable (and by that I mean pocket-sized) bluetooth keyboards are a realistic option and, speaking from personal experience, I can type much faster on a bluetooth keyboard or paired apex than I can with fleksy, although fleksy is definitely a huge improvement over standard touch typing. When I had a small bluetooth keyboard, I used it all the time for things like texting, e-mail, light notetaking (calendars, contacts, etc), web browsing and the like. Even with fleksy and a braille note apex, I'm finding that I miss my little bluetooth keyboard more and more the longer I don't have one. Yes, it was slightly uncomfortable in my pocket...but I'm used to carrying lots of things in my pockets, so that wasn't a big deal. Yes, it cost something like sixty dollars; I'll probably pay up and get another one soon, just because the dang thing was so practical for me. Again, I'm just saying what's worked for me, and I totally recognize that my prefered style isn't right for everybody. As far as I'm concerned, if fleksy gets the job done for you and does most everything you want it do, more power to you. Your pocket book would probably agree with me. :) Best, Kirt On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: > I jump ahead sometimes folks. I don't always explain myself as I should. > I > apologize for that. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 5:33 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > Hi, > > Justin, I'm a little confused as to why you would need to do heavy > notetaking on the IPhone. Do you mean you'd use it to take notes and > study in lieu of a computer? If you have one it would probably make > more sense and be easier to just use a laptop, but I'm sure you have a > reason. Just curious. > > On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: >> Yeah, at some point, but as a full time student, I would like a bridge >> so > I >> can be effective until I get the hang of the gestures. I don't have >> three >> to four hours a day for a week to spend on the I phone, and I can't >> afford >> to loose time. The keyboard just seems like the answer. I'll be studying >> for exams and doing final papers in the next few weeks. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman >> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 2:27 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> Unless you're using your iPhone for heavy note-taking (something I do > *not* >> recommend), I think you'll use a keyboard far less than you imagine you >> will. Prticularly now that Fleksy is on the scene, I do not use my > keyboard >> or even my BrailleSensePLUS paired to the iPhone as much as I did a >> couple >> of years ago. >> >> Mike Freeman >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin > williams >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:13 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> Yeah, I definitely want a portable keyboard. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt >> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 11:59 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, or to >> your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds up, rolls > up >> Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone with a >> keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple keyboard really >> isn't >> practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, something I haven't heard >> mentioned yet that is potentially very relevant, the iPhone five has a >> significantly better camera than the four ass. I have a for S, and the >> camera works, but sometimes it's a little bit slow with apps like vizwizz >> And the MoneyReader, and I've heard it's a real headache messing with OCR >> apps on the four ass camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. > Whoa, >> Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of risqué >> today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: >> >>> Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of those >>>> little ones? >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>> Freeman >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). >>>> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much >>>> more cheaply than is the 5. >>>> >>>> Mike >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>> williams >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. >>>> I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any >>>> better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; >>>> I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>> Freeman >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> I don't see why it's superior to the 5. >>>> >>>> Mike >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>> williams >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the >>>> Blind. >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony >>>> Grima >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM >>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> >>>> iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users >>>> by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or >>>> DAISY: $9 >>>> >>>> Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full >>>> tutorial together and save! >>>> >>>> The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster >>>> than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, >>>> and has a better camera. >>>> >>>> Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a >>>> supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the >>>> iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used in >>>> both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them >>>> easily. >>>> >>>> If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this >>>> update to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of >>>> the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all >>>> the appendices. >>>> An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this >>>> book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. >>>> These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone >>>> reference card. >>>> >>>> Order at: >>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html >>>> >>>> See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! >>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html >>>> ****** >>>> To order any books, send payment to: >>>> NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge >>>> it: >>>> toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. >>>> Or order any of our books online at >>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>> 40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>> 40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>> 40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail. >>>> com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40g >>> mail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai > l.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Sat Mar 16 03:48:04 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 23:48:04 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: <49097C63CC24449FB0B221C08D674A0F@acerd37f251f21> References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org><007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com><006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com><007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com><00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com><006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com><0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com><3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com><006d01ce213b$c9dbdee0$5d939ca0$@gmail.com><005701ce2273$de724fe0$9b56efa0$@panix.com><011901ce21b9$639bbbe0$2ad333a0$@gmail.com><000801ce21c7$ae022df0$0a0689d0$@gmail.com> <49097C63CC24449FB0B221C08D674A0F@acerd37f251f21> Message-ID: <001101ce21f9$11002ac0$33008040$@gmail.com> Can you get that from a store, orr should I get that online? Is it speed dots.com or some such like that? -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Misty Dawn Bradley Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 10:26 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! Hi, I also use a bluetooth keyboard and find it very useful and quicker than typing on the touch screen. SpeedDots has a small bluetooth keyboard for about $44, and this is the one I have. They also sell a case for it for $10 that has a belt clip and loops on the back in case you want a case to put it in, but it could also fit in a pocket on its own. I like it because it is easy to pair and the keys can be differentiated from each other. It also has an on and off switch. Hth, Misty ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kirt Manwaring" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 6:29 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! Mike, I agree fleksy can be a game changer. Still, portable (and by that I mean pocket-sized) bluetooth keyboards are a realistic option and, speaking from personal experience, I can type much faster on a bluetooth keyboard or paired apex than I can with fleksy, although fleksy is definitely a huge improvement over standard touch typing. When I had a small bluetooth keyboard, I used it all the time for things like texting, e-mail, light notetaking (calendars, contacts, etc), web browsing and the like. Even with fleksy and a braille note apex, I'm finding that I miss my little bluetooth keyboard more and more the longer I don't have one. Yes, it was slightly uncomfortable in my pocket...but I'm used to carrying lots of things in my pockets, so that wasn't a big deal. Yes, it cost something like sixty dollars; I'll probably pay up and get another one soon, just because the dang thing was so practical for me. Again, I'm just saying what's worked for me, and I totally recognize that my prefered style isn't right for everybody. As far as I'm concerned, if fleksy gets the job done for you and does most everything you want it do, more power to you. Your pocket book would probably agree with me. :) Best, Kirt On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: > I jump ahead sometimes folks. I don't always explain myself as I should. > I > apologize for that. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 5:33 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > Hi, > > Justin, I'm a little confused as to why you would need to do heavy > notetaking on the IPhone. Do you mean you'd use it to take notes and > study in lieu of a computer? If you have one it would probably make > more sense and be easier to just use a laptop, but I'm sure you have a > reason. Just curious. > > On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: >> Yeah, at some point, but as a full time student, I would like a bridge >> so > I >> can be effective until I get the hang of the gestures. I don't have >> three >> to four hours a day for a week to spend on the I phone, and I can't >> afford >> to loose time. The keyboard just seems like the answer. I'll be studying >> for exams and doing final papers in the next few weeks. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman >> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 2:27 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> Unless you're using your iPhone for heavy note-taking (something I do > *not* >> recommend), I think you'll use a keyboard far less than you imagine you >> will. Prticularly now that Fleksy is on the scene, I do not use my > keyboard >> or even my BrailleSensePLUS paired to the iPhone as much as I did a >> couple >> of years ago. >> >> Mike Freeman >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin > williams >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:13 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> Yeah, I definitely want a portable keyboard. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt >> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 11:59 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, or to >> your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds up, rolls > up >> Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone with a >> keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple keyboard really >> isn't >> practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, something I haven't heard >> mentioned yet that is potentially very relevant, the iPhone five has a >> significantly better camera than the four ass. I have a for S, and the >> camera works, but sometimes it's a little bit slow with apps like vizwizz >> And the MoneyReader, and I've heard it's a real headache messing with OCR >> apps on the four ass camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. > Whoa, >> Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of risqué >> today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: >> >>> Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of those >>>> little ones? >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>> Freeman >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). >>>> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much >>>> more cheaply than is the 5. >>>> >>>> Mike >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>> williams >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. >>>> I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any >>>> better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; >>>> I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>> Freeman >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> I don't see why it's superior to the 5. >>>> >>>> Mike >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>> williams >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the >>>> Blind. >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony >>>> Grima >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM >>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> >>>> iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users >>>> by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or >>>> DAISY: $9 >>>> >>>> Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full >>>> tutorial together and save! >>>> >>>> The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster >>>> than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, >>>> and has a better camera. >>>> >>>> Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a >>>> supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the >>>> iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used in >>>> both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them >>>> easily. >>>> >>>> If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this >>>> update to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of >>>> the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all >>>> the appendices. >>>> An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this >>>> book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. >>>> These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone >>>> reference card. >>>> >>>> Order at: >>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html >>>> >>>> See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! >>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html >>>> ****** >>>> To order any books, send payment to: >>>> NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge >>>> it: >>>> toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. >>>> Or order any of our books online at >>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>> 40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>> 40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>> 40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail. >>>> com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40g >>> mail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai > l.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40gmail.c om > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.co m _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Sun Mar 17 13:16:01 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (christopher nusbaum) Date: Sun, 17 Mar 2013 09:16:01 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: <001101ce21f9$11002ac0$33008040$@gmail.com> References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> <0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com> <3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com> <006d01ce213b$c9dbdee0$5d939ca0$@gmail.com> <005701ce2273$de724fe0$9b56efa0$@panix.com> <011901ce21b9$639bbbe0$2ad333a0$@gmail.com> <000801ce21c7$ae022df0$0a0689d0$@gmail.com> <49097C63CC24449FB0B221C08D674A0F@acerd37f251f21> <001101ce21f9$11002ac0$33008040$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <-1641968015518240724@unknownmsgid> Justin, That is the right website, and it is an online only store. Chris Nusbaum Sent from my iPhone On Mar 16, 2013, at 11:48 PM, justin williams wrote: > Can you get that from a store, orr should I get that online? Is it speed > dots.com or some such like that? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Misty Dawn > Bradley > Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 10:26 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > Hi, > I also use a bluetooth keyboard and find it very useful and quicker than > typing on the touch screen. SpeedDots has a small bluetooth keyboard for > about $44, and this is the one I have. They also sell a case for it for $10 > that has a belt clip and loops on the back in case you want a case to put it > in, but it could also fit in a pocket on its own. I like it because it is > easy to pair and the keys can be differentiated from each other. It also has > an on and off switch. > Hth, > Misty > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Kirt Manwaring" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 6:29 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > > Mike, > I agree fleksy can be a game changer. Still, portable (and by that > I mean pocket-sized) bluetooth keyboards are a realistic option and, > speaking from personal experience, I can type much faster on a > bluetooth keyboard or paired apex than I can with fleksy, although > fleksy is definitely a huge improvement over standard touch typing. > When I had a small bluetooth keyboard, I used it all the time for > things like texting, e-mail, light notetaking (calendars, contacts, > etc), web browsing and the like. Even with fleksy and a braille note > apex, I'm finding that I miss my little bluetooth keyboard more and > more the longer I don't have one. Yes, it was slightly uncomfortable > in my pocket...but I'm used to carrying lots of things in my pockets, > so that wasn't a big deal. Yes, it cost something like sixty dollars; > I'll probably pay up and get another one soon, just because the dang > thing was so practical for me. Again, I'm just saying what's worked > for me, and I totally recognize that my prefered style isn't right for > everybody. As far as I'm concerned, if fleksy gets the job done for > you and does most everything you want it do, more power to you. Your > pocket book would probably agree with me. :) > Best, > Kirt > > On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: >> I jump ahead sometimes folks. I don't always explain myself as I should. >> I >> apologize for that. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton >> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 5:33 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> Hi, >> >> Justin, I'm a little confused as to why you would need to do heavy >> notetaking on the IPhone. Do you mean you'd use it to take notes and >> study in lieu of a computer? If you have one it would probably make >> more sense and be easier to just use a laptop, but I'm sure you have a >> reason. Just curious. >> >> On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: >>> Yeah, at some point, but as a full time student, I would like a bridge >>> so >> I >>> can be effective until I get the hang of the gestures. I don't have >>> three >>> to four hours a day for a week to spend on the I phone, and I can't >>> afford >>> to loose time. The keyboard just seems like the answer. I'll be studying >>> for exams and doing final papers in the next few weeks. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman >>> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 2:27 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> Unless you're using your iPhone for heavy note-taking (something I do >> *not* >>> recommend), I think you'll use a keyboard far less than you imagine you >>> will. Prticularly now that Fleksy is on the scene, I do not use my >> keyboard >>> or even my BrailleSensePLUS paired to the iPhone as much as I did a >>> couple >>> of years ago. >>> >>> Mike Freeman >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >> williams >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:13 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> Yeah, I definitely want a portable keyboard. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt >>> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 11:59 AM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, or to >>> your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds up, rolls >> up >>> Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone with a >>> keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple keyboard really >>> isn't >>> practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, something I haven't heard >>> mentioned yet that is potentially very relevant, the iPhone five has a >>> significantly better camera than the four ass. I have a for S, and the >>> camera works, but sometimes it's a little bit slow with apps like vizwizz >>> And the MoneyReader, and I've heard it's a real headache messing with OCR >>> apps on the four ass camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. >> Whoa, >>> Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of risqué >>> today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: >>> >>>> Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of those >>>>> little ones? >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>>> Freeman >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>> >>>>> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). >>>>> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much >>>>> more cheaply than is the 5. >>>>> >>>>> Mike >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>>> williams >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>> >>>>> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. >>>>> I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any >>>>> better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; >>>>> I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>>> Freeman >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>> >>>>> I don't see why it's superior to the 5. >>>>> >>>>> Mike >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>>> williams >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>> >>>>> I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the >>>>> Blind. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony >>>>> Grima >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM >>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users >>>>> by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or >>>>> DAISY: $9 >>>>> >>>>> Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full >>>>> tutorial together and save! >>>>> >>>>> The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster >>>>> than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, >>>>> and has a better camera. >>>>> >>>>> Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a >>>>> supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the >>>>> iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used in >>>>> both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them >>>>> easily. >>>>> >>>>> If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this >>>>> update to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of >>>>> the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all >>>>> the appendices. >>>>> An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this >>>>> book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. >>>>> These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone >>>>> reference card. >>>>> >>>>> Order at: >>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html >>>>> >>>>> See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! >>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html >>>>> ****** >>>>> To order any books, send payment to: >>>>> NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge >>>>> it: >>>>> toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. >>>>> Or order any of our books online at >>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>> 40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>> 40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>> 40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail. >>>>> com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40g >>>> mail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai >> l.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40gmail.c > om >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.co > m > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Sun Mar 17 13:22:48 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (christopher nusbaum) Date: Sun, 17 Mar 2013 09:22:48 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: <00a901ce229c$1d388910$57a99b30$@panix.com> References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> <0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com> <3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com> <006d01ce213b$c9dbdee0$5d939ca0$@gmail.com> <005701ce2273$de724fe0$9b56efa0$@panix.com> <011901ce21b9$639bbbe0$2ad333a0$@gmail.com> <000801ce21c7$ae022df0$0a0689d0$@gmail.com> <00a901ce229c$1d388910$57a99b30$@panix.com> Message-ID: <5342218330889113065@unknownmsgid> Mike, are you starting to miss using that deep voice of yours all the time? Grin! Chris Nusbaum Sent from my iPhone On Mar 16, 2013, at 7:16 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: > Actually, I prefer a note-taker to the iPhone for serious work. For stuff > that isn't serious, I don't want to be bothered with a keyboard. > > To each his/her own. > > Say! How about let's do away with cellphones altogether so we actually have > to speak to each other once again? (grin) > > Mike > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt Manwaring > Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 3:30 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > Mike, > I agree fleksy can be a game changer. Still, portable (and by that > I mean pocket-sized) bluetooth keyboards are a realistic option and, > speaking from personal experience, I can type much faster on a > bluetooth keyboard or paired apex than I can with fleksy, although > fleksy is definitely a huge improvement over standard touch typing. > When I had a small bluetooth keyboard, I used it all the time for > things like texting, e-mail, light notetaking (calendars, contacts, > etc), web browsing and the like. Even with fleksy and a braille note > apex, I'm finding that I miss my little bluetooth keyboard more and > more the longer I don't have one. Yes, it was slightly uncomfortable > in my pocket...but I'm used to carrying lots of things in my pockets, > so that wasn't a big deal. Yes, it cost something like sixty dollars; > I'll probably pay up and get another one soon, just because the dang > thing was so practical for me. Again, I'm just saying what's worked > for me, and I totally recognize that my prefered style isn't right for > everybody. As far as I'm concerned, if fleksy gets the job done for > you and does most everything you want it do, more power to you. Your > pocket book would probably agree with me. :) > Best, > Kirt > > On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: >> I jump ahead sometimes folks. I don't always explain myself as I should. >> I >> apologize for that. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton >> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 5:33 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> Hi, >> >> Justin, I'm a little confused as to why you would need to do heavy >> notetaking on the IPhone. Do you mean you'd use it to take notes and >> study in lieu of a computer? If you have one it would probably make >> more sense and be easier to just use a laptop, but I'm sure you have a >> reason. Just curious. >> >> On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: >>> Yeah, at some point, but as a full time student, I would like a bridge >>> so >> I >>> can be effective until I get the hang of the gestures. I don't have >>> three >>> to four hours a day for a week to spend on the I phone, and I can't >>> afford >>> to loose time. The keyboard just seems like the answer. I'll be studying >>> for exams and doing final papers in the next few weeks. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman >>> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 2:27 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> Unless you're using your iPhone for heavy note-taking (something I do >> *not* >>> recommend), I think you'll use a keyboard far less than you imagine you >>> will. Prticularly now that Fleksy is on the scene, I do not use my >> keyboard >>> or even my BrailleSensePLUS paired to the iPhone as much as I did a >>> couple >>> of years ago. >>> >>> Mike Freeman >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >> williams >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:13 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> Yeah, I definitely want a portable keyboard. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt >>> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 11:59 AM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, or to >>> your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds up, rolls >> up >>> Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone with a >>> keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple keyboard really >>> isn't >>> practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, something I haven't heard >>> mentioned yet that is potentially very relevant, the iPhone five has a >>> significantly better camera than the four ass. I have a for S, and the >>> camera works, but sometimes it's a little bit slow with apps like vizwizz >>> And the MoneyReader, and I've heard it's a real headache messing with OCR >>> apps on the four ass camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. >> Whoa, >>> Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of risqué >>> today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: >>> >>>> Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of those >>>>> little ones? >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>>> Freeman >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>> >>>>> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). >>>>> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much >>>>> more cheaply than is the 5. >>>>> >>>>> Mike >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>>> williams >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>> >>>>> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. >>>>> I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any >>>>> better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; >>>>> I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>>> Freeman >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>> >>>>> I don't see why it's superior to the 5. >>>>> >>>>> Mike >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>>> williams >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>> >>>>> I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the >>>>> Blind. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony >>>>> Grima >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM >>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users >>>>> by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or >>>>> DAISY: $9 >>>>> >>>>> Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full >>>>> tutorial together and save! >>>>> >>>>> The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster >>>>> than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, >>>>> and has a better camera. >>>>> >>>>> Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a >>>>> supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the >>>>> iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used in >>>>> both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them >>>>> easily. >>>>> >>>>> If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this >>>>> update to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of >>>>> the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all >>>>> the appendices. >>>>> An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this >>>>> book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. >>>>> These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone >>>>> reference card. >>>>> >>>>> Order at: >>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html >>>>> >>>>> See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! >>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html >>>>> ****** >>>>> To order any books, send payment to: >>>>> NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge >>>>> it: >>>>> toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. >>>>> Or order any of our books online at >>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>> 40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>> 40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>> 40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail. >>>>> com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40g >>>> mail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai >> l.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40gmail.c > om >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Sun Mar 17 13:19:14 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (christopher nusbaum) Date: Sun, 17 Mar 2013 09:19:14 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> <0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com> <3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com> <006d01ce213b$c9dbdee0$5d939ca0$@gmail.com> <005701ce2273$de724fe0$9b56efa0$@panix.com> <011901ce21b9$639bbbe0$2ad333a0$@gmail.com> <000801ce21c7$ae022df0$0a0689d0$@gmail.com> <00a901ce229c$1d388910$57a99b30$@panix.com> Message-ID: <2878510545528540312@unknownmsgid> I agree, Katie! Or, why don't we just compromise and start using Skype or FaceTime instead of texting? :-) Chris Nusbaum Sent from my iPhone On Mar 16, 2013, at 8:14 PM, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Yes, Social skills have definitely deteriorated, but the blame can't > be placed on cell phones; it's the operators who use them who are > really at fault. When you consider the original objective behind cell > phones, (which was to make it easier for people to get in touch with > each other wherever they may be), they have accomplished that goal. > It was only when texting came on the scene that people have seriously > withdrawn, and it seems the younger the generation the more they text > and the worse their social skills are. I didn't get an IPhone till > about a year and a half ago, so I think I was spared the texting-mania > when it first came out and my sighted friends all got cell phones, but > I see them do it, and even worse I see friends of my younger siblings > do it---even while they're at my house supposed to be hanging out with > their friend---and it boggles the crap out of me. I mean, how can you > be so rude as to be carrying on a texting conversation with someone > else when you're supposed to be at someone's house and spending time > with them? It's really the operators at fault; the whole point of > texting was to allow people to send quick messages that wouldn't be > worth a phone call... things like, "On my way, be there in 5," or > "I'll call you later." Not "OMG did you hear this latest gossip," and > hen have a message so long that the receiver's phone gets five or six > pages of text. People have definitely warped it and are using it for > the wrong reasons, sacrificing their social skills in the process. > > On 3/16/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >> Actually, I prefer a note-taker to the iPhone for serious work. For stuff >> that isn't serious, I don't want to be bothered with a keyboard. >> >> To each his/her own. >> >> Say! How about let's do away with cellphones altogether so we actually have >> to speak to each other once again? (grin) >> >> Mike >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt Manwaring >> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 3:30 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> Mike, >> I agree fleksy can be a game changer. Still, portable (and by that >> I mean pocket-sized) bluetooth keyboards are a realistic option and, >> speaking from personal experience, I can type much faster on a >> bluetooth keyboard or paired apex than I can with fleksy, although >> fleksy is definitely a huge improvement over standard touch typing. >> When I had a small bluetooth keyboard, I used it all the time for >> things like texting, e-mail, light notetaking (calendars, contacts, >> etc), web browsing and the like. Even with fleksy and a braille note >> apex, I'm finding that I miss my little bluetooth keyboard more and >> more the longer I don't have one. Yes, it was slightly uncomfortable >> in my pocket...but I'm used to carrying lots of things in my pockets, >> so that wasn't a big deal. Yes, it cost something like sixty dollars; >> I'll probably pay up and get another one soon, just because the dang >> thing was so practical for me. Again, I'm just saying what's worked >> for me, and I totally recognize that my prefered style isn't right for >> everybody. As far as I'm concerned, if fleksy gets the job done for >> you and does most everything you want it do, more power to you. Your >> pocket book would probably agree with me. :) >> Best, >> Kirt >> >> On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: >>> I jump ahead sometimes folks. I don't always explain myself as I should. >>> I >>> apologize for that. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>> Shelton >>> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 5:33 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> Justin, I'm a little confused as to why you would need to do heavy >>> notetaking on the IPhone. Do you mean you'd use it to take notes and >>> study in lieu of a computer? If you have one it would probably make >>> more sense and be easier to just use a laptop, but I'm sure you have a >>> reason. Just curious. >>> >>> On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: >>>> Yeah, at some point, but as a full time student, I would like a bridge >>>> so >>> I >>>> can be effective until I get the hang of the gestures. I don't have >>>> three >>>> to four hours a day for a week to spend on the I phone, and I can't >>>> afford >>>> to loose time. The keyboard just seems like the answer. I'll be >>>> studying >>>> for exams and doing final papers in the next few weeks. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>> Freeman >>>> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 2:27 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> Unless you're using your iPhone for heavy note-taking (something I do >>> *not* >>>> recommend), I think you'll use a keyboard far less than you imagine you >>>> will. Prticularly now that Fleksy is on the scene, I do not use my >>> keyboard >>>> or even my BrailleSensePLUS paired to the iPhone as much as I did a >>>> couple >>>> of years ago. >>>> >>>> Mike Freeman >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>> williams >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:13 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> Yeah, I definitely want a portable keyboard. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt >>>> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 11:59 AM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, or to >>>> your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds up, rolls >>> up >>>> Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone with a >>>> keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple keyboard really >>>> isn't >>>> practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, something I haven't >>>> heard >>>> mentioned yet that is potentially very relevant, the iPhone five has a >>>> significantly better camera than the four ass. I have a for S, and the >>>> camera works, but sometimes it's a little bit slow with apps like >>>> vizwizz >>>> And the MoneyReader, and I've heard it's a real headache messing with >>>> OCR >>>> apps on the four ass camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. >>> Whoa, >>>> Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of risqué >>>> today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: >>>> >>>>> Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of those >>>>>> little ones? >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>>>> Freeman >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >>>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>>> >>>>>> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). >>>>>> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much >>>>>> more cheaply than is the 5. >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>>>> williams >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >>>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>>> >>>>>> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. >>>>>> I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any >>>>>> better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; >>>>>> I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>>>> Freeman >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM >>>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>>> >>>>>> I don't see why it's superior to the 5. >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>>>> williams >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM >>>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>>> >>>>>> I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the >>>>>> Blind. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony >>>>>> Grima >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM >>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users >>>>>> by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or >>>>>> DAISY: $9 >>>>>> >>>>>> Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full >>>>>> tutorial together and save! >>>>>> >>>>>> The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster >>>>>> than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, >>>>>> and has a better camera. >>>>>> >>>>>> Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a >>>>>> supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the >>>>>> iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used in >>>>>> both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them >>>>>> easily. >>>>>> >>>>>> If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this >>>>>> update to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of >>>>>> the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all >>>>>> the appendices. >>>>>> An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this >>>>>> book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. >>>>>> These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone >>>>>> reference card. >>>>>> >>>>>> Order at: >>>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html >>>>>> >>>>>> See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! >>>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html >>>>>> ****** >>>>>> To order any books, send payment to: >>>>>> NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge >>>>>> it: >>>>>> toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. >>>>>> Or order any of our books online at >>>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>>> 40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>>> 40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>>> 40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail. >>>>>> com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40g >>>>> mail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai >>> l.com >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40gmail.c >> om >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Sat Mar 16 15:18:15 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Sat, 16 Mar 2013 11:18:15 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: <-1641968015518240724@unknownmsgid> References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> <0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com> <3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com> <006d01ce213b$c9dbdee0$5d939ca0$@gmail.com> <005701ce2273$de724fe0$9b56efa0$@panix.com> <011901ce21b9$639bbbe0$2ad333a0$@gmail.com> <000801ce21c7$ae022df0$0a0689d0$@gmail.com> <49097C63CC24449FB0B221C08D674A0F@acerd37f251f21> <001101ce21f9$11002ac0$33008040$@gmail.com> <-1641968015518240724@unknownmsgid> Message-ID: <001101ce2259$7bd0fa90$7372efb0$@gmail.com> Thank you. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of christopher nusbaum Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2013 9:16 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! Justin, That is the right website, and it is an online only store. Chris Nusbaum Sent from my iPhone On Mar 16, 2013, at 11:48 PM, justin williams wrote: > Can you get that from a store, orr should I get that online? Is it > speed dots.com or some such like that? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Misty > Dawn Bradley > Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 10:26 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > Hi, > I also use a bluetooth keyboard and find it very useful and quicker > than typing on the touch screen. SpeedDots has a small bluetooth > keyboard for about $44, and this is the one I have. They also sell a > case for it for $10 that has a belt clip and loops on the back in case > you want a case to put it in, but it could also fit in a pocket on its > own. I like it because it is easy to pair and the keys can be > differentiated from each other. It also has an on and off switch. > Hth, > Misty > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Kirt Manwaring" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 6:29 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > > Mike, > I agree fleksy can be a game changer. Still, portable (and by that I > mean pocket-sized) bluetooth keyboards are a realistic option and, > speaking from personal experience, I can type much faster on a > bluetooth keyboard or paired apex than I can with fleksy, although > fleksy is definitely a huge improvement over standard touch typing. > When I had a small bluetooth keyboard, I used it all the time for > things like texting, e-mail, light notetaking (calendars, contacts, > etc), web browsing and the like. Even with fleksy and a braille note > apex, I'm finding that I miss my little bluetooth keyboard more and > more the longer I don't have one. Yes, it was slightly uncomfortable > in my pocket...but I'm used to carrying lots of things in my pockets, > so that wasn't a big deal. Yes, it cost something like sixty dollars; > I'll probably pay up and get another one soon, just because the dang > thing was so practical for me. Again, I'm just saying what's worked > for me, and I totally recognize that my prefered style isn't right for > everybody. As far as I'm concerned, if fleksy gets the job done for > you and does most everything you want it do, more power to you. Your > pocket book would probably agree with me. :) Best, Kirt > > On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: >> I jump ahead sometimes folks. I don't always explain myself as I should. >> I >> apologize for that. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >> Shelton >> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 5:33 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> Hi, >> >> Justin, I'm a little confused as to why you would need to do heavy >> notetaking on the IPhone. Do you mean you'd use it to take notes and >> study in lieu of a computer? If you have one it would probably make >> more sense and be easier to just use a laptop, but I'm sure you have >> a reason. Just curious. >> >> On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: >>> Yeah, at some point, but as a full time student, I would like a >>> bridge so >> I >>> can be effective until I get the hang of the gestures. I don't have >>> three to four hours a day for a week to spend on the I phone, and I >>> can't afford to loose time. The keyboard just seems like the >>> answer. I'll be studying for exams and doing final papers in the >>> next few weeks. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>> Freeman >>> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 2:27 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> Unless you're using your iPhone for heavy note-taking (something I >>> do >> *not* >>> recommend), I think you'll use a keyboard far less than you imagine >>> you will. Prticularly now that Fleksy is on the scene, I do not use >>> my >> keyboard >>> or even my BrailleSensePLUS paired to the iPhone as much as I did a >>> couple of years ago. >>> >>> Mike Freeman >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >> williams >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:13 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> Yeah, I definitely want a portable keyboard. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt >>> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 11:59 AM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, >>> or to your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds >>> up, rolls >> up >>> Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone >>> with a keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple keyboard >>> really isn't practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, >>> something I haven't heard mentioned yet that is potentially very >>> relevant, the iPhone five has a significantly better camera than the >>> four ass. I have a for S, and the camera works, but sometimes it's a >>> little bit slow with apps like vizwizz And the MoneyReader, and I've >>> heard it's a real headache messing with OCR apps on the four ass >>> camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. >> Whoa, >>> Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of >>> risqué today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: >>> >>>> Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of >>>>> those little ones? >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>>> Freeman >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>> >>>>> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). >>>>> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much >>>>> more cheaply than is the 5. >>>>> >>>>> Mike >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>> justin williams >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>> >>>>> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. >>>>> I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function >>>>> any better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know >>>>> for sure; I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>>> Freeman >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>> >>>>> I don't see why it's superior to the 5. >>>>> >>>>> Mike >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>> justin williams >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>> >>>>> I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the >>>>> Blind. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony >>>>> Grima >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM >>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind >>>>> Users by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, >>>>> ePub, or >>>>> DAISY: $9 >>>>> >>>>> Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full >>>>> tutorial together and save! >>>>> >>>>> The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster >>>>> than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G >>>>> network, and has a better camera. >>>>> >>>>> Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a >>>>> supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the >>>>> iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used >>>>> in both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find >>>>> them easily. >>>>> >>>>> If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use >>>>> this update to review what's new. This book includes updated >>>>> versions of the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised >>>>> versions of all the appendices. >>>>> An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this >>>>> book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. >>>>> These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an >>>>> iPhone reference card. >>>>> >>>>> Order at: >>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html >>>>> >>>>> See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! >>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html >>>>> ****** >>>>> To order any books, send payment to: >>>>> NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and >>>>> charge >>>>> it: >>>>> toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. >>>>> Or order any of our books online at >>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.william >>>>> s2% >>>>> 40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix. >>>>> com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.william >>>>> s2% >>>>> 40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix. >>>>> com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.william >>>>> s2% >>>>> 40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail. >>>>> com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude% >>>> 40g >>>> mail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail >> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.co >>> m >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail >> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% > 40gmai >> l.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40g > mail.c > om >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gm > ail.co > m > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g > mail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From dandrews at visi.com Sun Mar 17 17:22:40 2013 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Sun, 17 Mar 2013 12:22:40 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Final reminder - Spring Seminar for Blind Studends Minnesota Message-ID: > >The following information about an upcoming seminar for blind high school >and college students in Minnesota comes from Jordan Richardson, president of >the Minnesota Association of Blind Students: > >To Whom It May Concern: > >The Minnesota Association of Blind Students is excited to let you know about >our upcoming Student Spring Seminar to be held on Saturday, 6 April, 2013 >from 10:00 A.M. to 5:00 P.M. The meeting will be held at the National >Federation of the Blind of Minnesota headquarters located at 100 E 22nd >Street in Minneapolis, Minnesota 55404. > >The day's events are open to high school and college students, prospective >students, and anyone else who wishes to help advocate for student-related >policies. The theme for this event is "Access to Opportunity!" >Topics will include a presentation by the Communication Center of State >Services for the Blind, the chance to interact with a panel of undergraduate >and graduate college students, the opportunity to hear from a representative >of a college disability services office, several opportunities to meet and >network with other blind students and blind professionals, and much more. > >Please see the attached flier and pre-registration form for more >information. (the pre-registration form is also included below for >those cases where attachments are not accepted.) We hope to see you >at this exciting >seminar. Feel free to pass >this email and flier on to anyone who might be interested. Please direct >all questions to mnabs.talk at gmail.com, and one of our officers will be in >touch promptly. >Please return a completed pre-registration form to mnabs.talk at gmail.com by >March 22. > >Sincerely, >The Minnesota Association of Blind Students > >--The Minnesota Association of Blind Students is a division of the National >Federation of the Blind of Minnesota and of the National Association of >Blind Students.-- >-- >Jordan Richardson >President, Minnesota Association of Blind Students >jordan.rich0913 at gmail.com >richa878 at umn.edu >"Even when laws have been written down, they ought not always to remain >unaltered." >--Aristotle > > >Pre-registration form > >Minnesota Association of Blind Students (MABS) >2nd Annual student seminar registration form >04/06/2013 >Email mnabs.talk at gmail.com >President Jordan Richardson (763)742-8792 >1st vice Vanasha Washington (612)670-1181 >2nd vice Hanna Ferney (419)250-2057 >Treasurer Adrianne (Andi) Dempsey (231)670-6544 > > >All participants attending this seminar must fill out and submit >this form to MABS via email attachment by March 22nd. Registration >costs $10 and is >payable when you arrive. Lunch will be provided. If you have any >questions feel free to write them in the body of the email when you >submit this form. One >of the MABS board members will reply promptly. > > >Date: ____________________ >Seminar attendee >First Name: ____________________________________________________________ >Last Name: ____________________________________________________________ >Address 1: ____________________________________________________________ >Address 2(apt): _______________________________________________________ >City: _________________________ State: _____ Zip code: >_________________________ >Home phone: (_____) _____-__________ >Cell phone: (_____) _____-__________ >Email: ________________________________________ > >Please place an x by the choice that applies to you. If you choose >other please specify. >High school student: ___ >College student: ___ >Parent: ___ >Teacher or instructor: ___ >Other: ___ > >Please place an X by the format you wish to receive materials. >Braille: ___ >Large Print: ___ >Print: ___ >Electronic: ___ > >If you are deaf/blind will you need an interpreter? ___ > >Do you have any food allergies? Please list all. >_________________________________________________________________ >_________________________________________________________________ > >Please Place an X by the choice that applies to you. >Omnivore: ___ >Vegetarian: ___ >Vegan: ___ > >Will you need overnight accommodations? ___ > >Emergency contact >First Name: ____________________________________________________________ >Last Name: ____________________________________________________________ >Address 1: ____________________________________________________________ >Address 2(apt): _______________________________________________________ >City: _________________________ State: _____ Zip code: >_________________________ >Home phone: (_____) _____-__________ >Cell phone: (_____) _____-__________ >Email: _________________________ > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: MABS student sem registration form rev24.doc Type: application/mac-binhex40 Size: 42454 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 2013 Spring Seminar Flyer5.doc Type: application/mac-binhex40 Size: 38312 bytes Desc: not available URL: From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Sun Mar 17 17:51:10 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Sun, 17 Mar 2013 13:51:10 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: <001101ce2259$7bd0fa90$7372efb0$@gmail.com> References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> <0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com> <3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com> <006d01ce213b$c9dbdee0$5d939ca0$@gmail.com> <005701ce2273$de724fe0$9b56efa0$@panix.com> <011901ce21b9$639bbbe0$2ad333a0$@gmail.com> <000801ce21c7$ae022df0$0a0689d0$@gmail.com> <49097C63CC24449FB0B221C08D674A0F@acerd37f251f21> <001101ce21f9$11002ac0$33008040$@gmail.com> <-1641968015518240724@unknownmsgid> <001101ce2259$7bd0fa90$7372efb0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Yes Chris. I don't know how but I somehow forgot about Face-Time and Skype! Those do make it much more personal. I could be wrong and don't want to generalize, but I think on the average sighted people are worse about this than blind people are. Maybe it's just because blind people tend to prefer to hear voices, or that texting on the IPhone touch keyboard can take so much longer than it would to actually speak to someone directly, but either way I don't see nearly as many blind people clinging to texting for their conversations like sighted people do. The apps are another source of this issue. That new snap-chat thing that recently came out seems to be really popular, so popular that I know one girl who always uses it during a band class we're in. Apparently she puts her phone on her stand and thinks that since the conductor can't see the phone he doesn't notice her making faces at her stand and know what she's doing. It boggles me how a college student would do this, as I see college as an opportunity to prepare for the future, but I guess unfortunately not all people view it that way. On 3/16/13, justin williams wrote: > Thank you. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of christopher > nusbaum > Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2013 9:16 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > Justin, > > That is the right website, and it is an online only store. > > Chris Nusbaum > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 16, 2013, at 11:48 PM, justin williams > wrote: > >> Can you get that from a store, orr should I get that online? Is it >> speed dots.com or some such like that? >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Misty >> Dawn Bradley >> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 10:26 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> Hi, >> I also use a bluetooth keyboard and find it very useful and quicker >> than typing on the touch screen. SpeedDots has a small bluetooth >> keyboard for about $44, and this is the one I have. They also sell a >> case for it for $10 that has a belt clip and loops on the back in case >> you want a case to put it in, but it could also fit in a pocket on its >> own. I like it because it is easy to pair and the keys can be >> differentiated from each other. It also has an on and off switch. >> Hth, >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Kirt Manwaring" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 6:29 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> >> Mike, >> I agree fleksy can be a game changer. Still, portable (and by that I >> mean pocket-sized) bluetooth keyboards are a realistic option and, >> speaking from personal experience, I can type much faster on a >> bluetooth keyboard or paired apex than I can with fleksy, although >> fleksy is definitely a huge improvement over standard touch typing. >> When I had a small bluetooth keyboard, I used it all the time for >> things like texting, e-mail, light notetaking (calendars, contacts, >> etc), web browsing and the like. Even with fleksy and a braille note >> apex, I'm finding that I miss my little bluetooth keyboard more and >> more the longer I don't have one. Yes, it was slightly uncomfortable >> in my pocket...but I'm used to carrying lots of things in my pockets, >> so that wasn't a big deal. Yes, it cost something like sixty dollars; >> I'll probably pay up and get another one soon, just because the dang >> thing was so practical for me. Again, I'm just saying what's worked >> for me, and I totally recognize that my prefered style isn't right for >> everybody. As far as I'm concerned, if fleksy gets the job done for >> you and does most everything you want it do, more power to you. Your >> pocket book would probably agree with me. :) Best, Kirt >> >> On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: >>> I jump ahead sometimes folks. I don't always explain myself as I >>> should. >>> I >>> apologize for that. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>> Shelton >>> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 5:33 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> Justin, I'm a little confused as to why you would need to do heavy >>> notetaking on the IPhone. Do you mean you'd use it to take notes and >>> study in lieu of a computer? If you have one it would probably make >>> more sense and be easier to just use a laptop, but I'm sure you have >>> a reason. Just curious. >>> >>> On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: >>>> Yeah, at some point, but as a full time student, I would like a >>>> bridge so >>> I >>>> can be effective until I get the hang of the gestures. I don't have >>>> three to four hours a day for a week to spend on the I phone, and I >>>> can't afford to loose time. The keyboard just seems like the >>>> answer. I'll be studying for exams and doing final papers in the >>>> next few weeks. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>> Freeman >>>> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 2:27 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> Unless you're using your iPhone for heavy note-taking (something I >>>> do >>> *not* >>>> recommend), I think you'll use a keyboard far less than you imagine >>>> you will. Prticularly now that Fleksy is on the scene, I do not use >>>> my >>> keyboard >>>> or even my BrailleSensePLUS paired to the iPhone as much as I did a >>>> couple of years ago. >>>> >>>> Mike Freeman >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>> williams >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:13 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> Yeah, I definitely want a portable keyboard. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt >>>> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 11:59 AM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, >>>> or to your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds >>>> up, rolls >>> up >>>> Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone >>>> with a keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple keyboard >>>> really isn't practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, >>>> something I haven't heard mentioned yet that is potentially very >>>> relevant, the iPhone five has a significantly better camera than the >>>> four ass. I have a for S, and the camera works, but sometimes it's a >>>> little bit slow with apps like vizwizz And the MoneyReader, and I've >>>> heard it's a real headache messing with OCR apps on the four ass >>>> camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. >>> Whoa, >>>> Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of >>>> risqué today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: >>>> >>>>> Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of >>>>>> those little ones? >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>>>> Freeman >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >>>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>>> >>>>>> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a >>>>>> 4). >>>>>> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much >>>>>> more cheaply than is the 5. >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>> justin williams >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >>>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>>> >>>>>> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. >>>>>> I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function >>>>>> any better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know >>>>>> for sure; I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>>>> Freeman >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM >>>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>>> >>>>>> I don't see why it's superior to the 5. >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>> justin williams >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM >>>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>>> >>>>>> I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the >>>>>> Blind. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony >>>>>> Grima >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM >>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind >>>>>> Users by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, >>>>>> ePub, or >>>>>> DAISY: $9 >>>>>> >>>>>> Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full >>>>>> tutorial together and save! >>>>>> >>>>>> The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster >>>>>> than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G >>>>>> network, and has a better camera. >>>>>> >>>>>> Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a >>>>>> supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the >>>>>> iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used >>>>>> in both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find >>>>>> them easily. >>>>>> >>>>>> If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use >>>>>> this update to review what's new. This book includes updated >>>>>> versions of the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised >>>>>> versions of all the appendices. >>>>>> An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this >>>>>> book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. >>>>>> These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an >>>>>> iPhone reference card. >>>>>> >>>>>> Order at: >>>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html >>>>>> >>>>>> See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! >>>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html >>>>>> ****** >>>>>> To order any books, send payment to: >>>>>> NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and >>>>>> charge >>>>>> it: >>>>>> toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. >>>>>> Or order any of our books online at >>>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.william >>>>>> s2% >>>>>> 40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix. >>>>>> com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.william >>>>>> s2% >>>>>> 40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix. >>>>>> com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.william >>>>>> s2% >>>>>> 40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail. >>>>>> com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude% >>>>> 40g >>>>> mail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.co >>>> m >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% >> 40gmai >>> l.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40g >> mail.c >> om >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gm >> ail.co >> m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g >> mail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From k7uij at panix.com Sun Mar 17 19:00:28 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Sun, 17 Mar 2013 12:00:28 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org> <007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com> <006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com> <007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com> <00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com> <006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com> <0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com> <3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com> <006d01ce213b$c9dbdee0$5d939ca0$@gmail.com> <005701ce2273$de724fe0$9b56efa0$@panix.com> <011901ce21b9$639bbbe0$2ad333a0$@gmail.com> <000801ce21c7$ae022df0$0a0689d0$@gmail.com> <49097C63CC24449FB0B221C08D674A0F@acerd37f251f21> <001101ce21f9$11002ac0$33008040$@gmail.com> <-1641968015518240724@unknownmsgid> <001101ce2259$7bd0fa90$7372efb0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <00ea01ce2341$b118ec10$134ac430$@panix.com> Kaiti: It seems to me that the difference between blind and sighted texters is that the blind must effectively stop what they're doing and actually pay attention while texting whereas sighted persons can just glance at their phones. It is a delusion, of course, in that texting impairs attentiveness for other tasks such as driving but it is not as readily apparent to the sighted as it is for us. Mike Freeman -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2013 10:51 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! Yes Chris. I don't know how but I somehow forgot about Face-Time and Skype! Those do make it much more personal. I could be wrong and don't want to generalize, but I think on the average sighted people are worse about this than blind people are. Maybe it's just because blind people tend to prefer to hear voices, or that texting on the IPhone touch keyboard can take so much longer than it would to actually speak to someone directly, but either way I don't see nearly as many blind people clinging to texting for their conversations like sighted people do. The apps are another source of this issue. That new snap-chat thing that recently came out seems to be really popular, so popular that I know one girl who always uses it during a band class we're in. Apparently she puts her phone on her stand and thinks that since the conductor can't see the phone he doesn't notice her making faces at her stand and know what she's doing. It boggles me how a college student would do this, as I see college as an opportunity to prepare for the future, but I guess unfortunately not all people view it that way. On 3/16/13, justin williams wrote: > Thank you. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of > christopher nusbaum > Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2013 9:16 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > Justin, > > That is the right website, and it is an online only store. > > Chris Nusbaum > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 16, 2013, at 11:48 PM, justin williams > > wrote: > >> Can you get that from a store, orr should I get that online? Is it >> speed dots.com or some such like that? >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Misty >> Dawn Bradley >> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 10:26 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> Hi, >> I also use a bluetooth keyboard and find it very useful and quicker >> than typing on the touch screen. SpeedDots has a small bluetooth >> keyboard for about $44, and this is the one I have. They also sell a >> case for it for $10 that has a belt clip and loops on the back in >> case you want a case to put it in, but it could also fit in a pocket >> on its own. I like it because it is easy to pair and the keys can be >> differentiated from each other. It also has an on and off switch. >> Hth, >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Kirt Manwaring" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 6:29 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> >> Mike, >> I agree fleksy can be a game changer. Still, portable (and by that >> I mean pocket-sized) bluetooth keyboards are a realistic option and, >> speaking from personal experience, I can type much faster on a >> bluetooth keyboard or paired apex than I can with fleksy, although >> fleksy is definitely a huge improvement over standard touch typing. >> When I had a small bluetooth keyboard, I used it all the time for >> things like texting, e-mail, light notetaking (calendars, contacts, >> etc), web browsing and the like. Even with fleksy and a braille note >> apex, I'm finding that I miss my little bluetooth keyboard more and >> more the longer I don't have one. Yes, it was slightly uncomfortable >> in my pocket...but I'm used to carrying lots of things in my pockets, >> so that wasn't a big deal. Yes, it cost something like sixty >> dollars; I'll probably pay up and get another one soon, just because >> the dang thing was so practical for me. Again, I'm just saying >> what's worked for me, and I totally recognize that my prefered style >> isn't right for everybody. As far as I'm concerned, if fleksy gets >> the job done for you and does most everything you want it do, more >> power to you. Your pocket book would probably agree with me. :) >> Best, Kirt >> >> On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: >>> I jump ahead sometimes folks. I don't always explain myself as I >>> should. >>> I >>> apologize for that. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>> Shelton >>> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 5:33 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> Justin, I'm a little confused as to why you would need to do heavy >>> notetaking on the IPhone. Do you mean you'd use it to take notes >>> and study in lieu of a computer? If you have one it would probably >>> make more sense and be easier to just use a laptop, but I'm sure you >>> have a reason. Just curious. >>> >>> On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: >>>> Yeah, at some point, but as a full time student, I would like a >>>> bridge so >>> I >>>> can be effective until I get the hang of the gestures. I don't >>>> have three to four hours a day for a week to spend on the I phone, >>>> and I can't afford to loose time. The keyboard just seems like the >>>> answer. I'll be studying for exams and doing final papers in the >>>> next few weeks. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>> Freeman >>>> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 2:27 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> Unless you're using your iPhone for heavy note-taking (something I >>>> do >>> *not* >>>> recommend), I think you'll use a keyboard far less than you imagine >>>> you will. Prticularly now that Fleksy is on the scene, I do not use >>>> my >>> keyboard >>>> or even my BrailleSensePLUS paired to the iPhone as much as I did a >>>> couple of years ago. >>>> >>>> Mike Freeman >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>> williams >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:13 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> Yeah, I definitely want a portable keyboard. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt >>>> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 11:59 AM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, >>>> or to your local specialty electronics store, and get one that >>>> folds up, rolls >>> up >>>> Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone >>>> with a keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple >>>> keyboard really isn't practical if you want to carry it Around. >>>> Also, something I haven't heard mentioned yet that is potentially >>>> very relevant, the iPhone five has a significantly better camera >>>> than the four ass. I have a for S, and the camera works, but >>>> sometimes it's a little bit slow with apps like vizwizz And the >>>> MoneyReader, and I've heard it's a real headache messing with OCR >>>> apps on the four ass camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. >>> Whoa, >>>> Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of >>>> risqué today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: >>>> >>>>> Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of >>>>>> those little ones? >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>>>> Freeman >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >>>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>>> >>>>>> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have >>>>>> a 4). >>>>>> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much >>>>>> more cheaply than is the 5. >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>> justin williams >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >>>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>>> >>>>>> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. >>>>>> I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function >>>>>> any better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know >>>>>> for sure; I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>>>> Freeman >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM >>>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>>> >>>>>> I don't see why it's superior to the 5. >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>> justin williams >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM >>>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>>> >>>>>> I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the >>>>>> Blind. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony >>>>>> Grima >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM >>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind >>>>>> Users by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, >>>>>> ePub, or >>>>>> DAISY: $9 >>>>>> >>>>>> Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full >>>>>> tutorial together and save! >>>>>> >>>>>> The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster >>>>>> than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G >>>>>> network, and has a better camera. >>>>>> >>>>>> Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a >>>>>> supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with >>>>>> the iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are >>>>>> used in both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can >>>>>> find them easily. >>>>>> >>>>>> If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use >>>>>> this update to review what's new. This book includes updated >>>>>> versions of the braille display and Bluetooth commands and >>>>>> revised versions of all the appendices. >>>>>> An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in >>>>>> this book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. >>>>>> These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an >>>>>> iPhone reference card. >>>>>> >>>>>> Order at: >>>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html >>>>>> >>>>>> See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! >>>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html >>>>>> ****** >>>>>> To order any books, send payment to: >>>>>> NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and >>>>>> charge >>>>>> it: >>>>>> toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. >>>>>> Or order any of our books online at >>>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia >>>>>> m >>>>>> s2% >>>>>> 40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix. >>>>>> com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia >>>>>> m >>>>>> s2% >>>>>> 40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix. >>>>>> com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia >>>>>> m >>>>>> s2% >>>>>> 40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail. >>>>>> com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude >>>>> % >>>>> 40g >>>>> mail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >> 4 >> 0gmail >>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.c >>>> o >>>> m >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >> 4 >> 0gmail >>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104 >> % >> 40gmai >>> l.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >> 4 >> 0gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40 >> g >> mail.c >> om >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40g >> m >> ail.co >> m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >> 4 >> 0gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40 >> g >> mail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% > 40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From Zunaira.Wasif at dbs.fldoe.org Mon Mar 18 12:12:11 2013 From: Zunaira.Wasif at dbs.fldoe.org (Wasif, Zunaira) Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 08:12:11 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE25C@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> I haven't taken the CPA exam, but I did take the MCAT in 2006 and did pretty well on it. The most helpful accommodation with that exam was extended time. Did you get extended time on the CPA exam? Why do you feel you didn't pass? Did you understand the material? Zunaira -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Zeeshan Khan Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 7:45 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam Hi everyone, So I went to school for accounting and sat for the CPA exam in 2011 for both the BEC and Auditing parts, but I did not pass. After that I stopped and didn't pursue it further. But now I feel that I have left it incomplete and want to go back to the CPA exams and reattempt it and hopefully pass it this time. So here are my questions / conerns. 1. How long did it take to pass being visually impaired? 2. What programs / resources did you use? I have used Roger CPA, but I beleive his stuff expires after a bit? Is Becker really that good? 3. How long did u spend studying for each part? 4. Do you have a job now after having passed it? 5. How much did you study each day? 6. How did you study? took a live course, studied on your own, got a tutor ? 7. Is it worth the effort and time, especially give the fact that I am legally blind, it is much mroe difficult studying for it? I look forward to hearing all of your experiences. Thank you, -- Zeeshan Khan ToiBooks www.toibooks.com http://www.facebook.com/ToiBooks _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. fldoe.org From carrie.gilmer at gmail.com Mon Mar 18 13:12:05 2013 From: carrie.gilmer at gmail.com (Carrie Gilmer) Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 08:12:05 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] For the love of reading... Message-ID: Great article about one of you and braille and reading....undramatic treatment of blindness, so refreshing! http://www.startribune.com/lifestyle/relationship/198543281.html Sent from my iPad From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Mon Mar 18 13:44:15 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 13:44:15 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] For the love of reading... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Wow! This is awesome! Maybe this little boy will grow up to be a Braille instructor, because of this! Good work, Jordan! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] Sent: Monday, March 18, 2013 8:12 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] For the love of reading... Great article about one of you and braille and reading....undramatic treatment of blindness, so refreshing! http://www.startribune.com/lifestyle/relationship/198543281.html Sent from my iPad _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu From Vyingling at nfb.org Mon Mar 18 17:04:28 2013 From: Vyingling at nfb.org (Yingling, Valerie) Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 17:04:28 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] looking for users experincing inaccessibility with Blackboard products Message-ID: <2E77F7FE85FE99418761668AE1AA779E20B38223@SN2PRD0710MB382.namprd07.prod.outlook.com> The NFB is working with Blackboard to improve the accessibility of its products. To that end, the NFB would like to hear from students who have experienced inaccessibility with any of Blackboard's products, including but not limited to the following: Blackboard Connect Blackboard Mobile Learn Blackboard Mobile Central Blackboard WebCT (Course Tools) Blackboard Collaborate Blackboard Learn LMS If you have encountered inaccessibility with a Blackboard product, please contact Valerie Yingling, paralegal at the NFB, at vyingling at nfb.org or 410-659-9314 ext. 2440, describing in detail the problem you experienced as well as the name and release of the product you were using at the time. Thank you for your help with this, Valerie Valerie Yingling Paralegal National Federation of the Blind 200 East Wells Street at Jernigan Place Baltimore, Maryland 21230 Telephone: 410-659-9314 ext. 2440 Fax: 410-659-5129 E-mail: Vyingling at nfb.org Web site: www.nfb.org From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Mon Mar 18 17:52:27 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 13:52:27 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org><007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com><006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com><007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com><00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com><006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com><0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com><3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com><006d01ce213b$c9dbdee0$5d939ca0$@gmail.com><005701ce2273$de724fe0$9b56efa0$@panix.com><011901ce21b9$639bbbe0$2ad333a0$@gmail.com><000801ce21c7$ae022df0$0a0689d0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <59CB31793C8A4CCA8468CC1FEBDC580D@OwnerPC> Hi, if I had an I phone, I'd get a bluetooth keyboard too. Do they fold up so its that small? I assume it is like a querty keyboard with smaller keys. These are not the keyboards attached to your phone that you pull out, are they? I thought you all meant a small wireless, bluetooth enabled, keyboard. What is the apple keyboard like? Is the only difference size? Ashley -----Original Message----- From: Kirt Manwaring Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 6:29 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! Mike, I agree fleksy can be a game changer. Still, portable (and by that I mean pocket-sized) bluetooth keyboards are a realistic option and, speaking from personal experience, I can type much faster on a bluetooth keyboard or paired apex than I can with fleksy, although fleksy is definitely a huge improvement over standard touch typing. When I had a small bluetooth keyboard, I used it all the time for things like texting, e-mail, light notetaking (calendars, contacts, etc), web browsing and the like. Even with fleksy and a braille note apex, I'm finding that I miss my little bluetooth keyboard more and more the longer I don't have one. Yes, it was slightly uncomfortable in my pocket...but I'm used to carrying lots of things in my pockets, so that wasn't a big deal. Yes, it cost something like sixty dollars; I'll probably pay up and get another one soon, just because the dang thing was so practical for me. Again, I'm just saying what's worked for me, and I totally recognize that my prefered style isn't right for everybody. As far as I'm concerned, if fleksy gets the job done for you and does most everything you want it do, more power to you. Your pocket book would probably agree with me. :) Best, Kirt On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: > I jump ahead sometimes folks. I don't always explain myself as I should. > I > apologize for that. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 5:33 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > Hi, > > Justin, I'm a little confused as to why you would need to do heavy > notetaking on the IPhone. Do you mean you'd use it to take notes and > study in lieu of a computer? If you have one it would probably make > more sense and be easier to just use a laptop, but I'm sure you have a > reason. Just curious. > > On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: >> Yeah, at some point, but as a full time student, I would like a bridge >> so > I >> can be effective until I get the hang of the gestures. I don't have >> three >> to four hours a day for a week to spend on the I phone, and I can't >> afford >> to loose time. The keyboard just seems like the answer. I'll be studying >> for exams and doing final papers in the next few weeks. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman >> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 2:27 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> Unless you're using your iPhone for heavy note-taking (something I do > *not* >> recommend), I think you'll use a keyboard far less than you imagine you >> will. Prticularly now that Fleksy is on the scene, I do not use my > keyboard >> or even my BrailleSensePLUS paired to the iPhone as much as I did a >> couple >> of years ago. >> >> Mike Freeman >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin > williams >> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:13 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> Yeah, I definitely want a portable keyboard. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt >> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 11:59 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, or to >> your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds up, rolls > up >> Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone with a >> keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple keyboard really >> isn't >> practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, something I haven't heard >> mentioned yet that is potentially very relevant, the iPhone five has a >> significantly better camera than the four ass. I have a for S, and the >> camera works, but sometimes it's a little bit slow with apps like vizwizz >> And the MoneyReader, and I've heard it's a real headache messing with OCR >> apps on the four ass camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. > Whoa, >> Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of risqué >> today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: >> >>> Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of those >>>> little ones? >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>> Freeman >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a 4). >>>> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much >>>> more cheaply than is the 5. >>>> >>>> Mike >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>> williams >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. >>>> I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function any >>>> better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know for sure; >>>> I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>> Freeman >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> I don't see why it's superior to the 5. >>>> >>>> Mike >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>> williams >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the >>>> Blind. >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony >>>> Grima >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM >>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> >>>> iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind Users >>>> by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, ePub, or >>>> DAISY: $9 >>>> >>>> Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full >>>> tutorial together and save! >>>> >>>> The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster >>>> than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G network, >>>> and has a better camera. >>>> >>>> Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a >>>> supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the >>>> iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used in >>>> both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find them >>>> easily. >>>> >>>> If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use this >>>> update to review what's new. This book includes updated versions of >>>> the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised versions of all >>>> the appendices. >>>> An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this >>>> book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. >>>> These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an iPhone >>>> reference card. >>>> >>>> Order at: >>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html >>>> >>>> See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! >>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html >>>> ****** >>>> To order any books, send payment to: >>>> NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and charge >>>> it: >>>> toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. >>>> Or order any of our books online at >>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>> 40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>> 40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>> 40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail. >>>> com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40g >>> mail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai > l.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Mon Mar 18 18:08:14 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 14:08:14 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! In-Reply-To: References: <00a401ce20e0$223ba360$66b2ea20$@org><007301ce2021$cd5da8c0$6818fa40$@gmail.com><006b01ce20fd$3f150540$bd3f0fc0$@panix.com><007601ce204e$612cffc0$2386ff40$@gmail.com><00be01ce2123$00592fe0$010b8fa0$@panix.com><006801ce205f$37e29060$a7a7b120$@gmail.com><0E1E7A88-681E-419E-B892-56225AD5BCE7@gmail.com><3D8BC82F-0D29-4194-88D7-9D136F1B0E56@gmail.com><006d01ce213b$c9dbdee0$5d939ca0$@gmail.com><005701ce2273$de724fe0$9b56efa0$@panix.com><011901ce21b9$639bbbe0$2ad333a0$@gmail.com><000801ce21c7$ae022df0$0a0689d0$@gmail.com><49097C63CC24449FB0B221C08D674A0F@acerd37f251f21><001101ce21f9$11002ac0$33008040$@gmail.com><-1641968015518240724@unknownmsgid><001101ce2259$7bd0fa90$7372efb0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, oh, remember all, that most phones do not talk. Yes expensive smart phones may do it. But many, many phones do not speak much or at all. So blind people cannot text message. Plus, I suspect they do not cause it is more time consuming. Oh, I hate those who text in class, very dissruptive. -----Original Message----- From: Kaiti Shelton Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2013 1:51 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! Yes Chris. I don't know how but I somehow forgot about Face-Time and Skype! Those do make it much more personal. I could be wrong and don't want to generalize, but I think on the average sighted people are worse about this than blind people are. Maybe it's just because blind people tend to prefer to hear voices, or that texting on the IPhone touch keyboard can take so much longer than it would to actually speak to someone directly, but either way I don't see nearly as many blind people clinging to texting for their conversations like sighted people do. The apps are another source of this issue. That new snap-chat thing that recently came out seems to be really popular, so popular that I know one girl who always uses it during a band class we're in. Apparently she puts her phone on her stand and thinks that since the conductor can't see the phone he doesn't notice her making faces at her stand and know what she's doing. It boggles me how a college student would do this, as I see college as an opportunity to prepare for the future, but I guess unfortunately not all people view it that way. On 3/16/13, justin williams wrote: > Thank you. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of christopher > nusbaum > Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2013 9:16 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! > > Justin, > > That is the right website, and it is an online only store. > > Chris Nusbaum > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 16, 2013, at 11:48 PM, justin williams > wrote: > >> Can you get that from a store, orr should I get that online? Is it >> speed dots.com or some such like that? >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Misty >> Dawn Bradley >> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 10:26 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> Hi, >> I also use a bluetooth keyboard and find it very useful and quicker >> than typing on the touch screen. SpeedDots has a small bluetooth >> keyboard for about $44, and this is the one I have. They also sell a >> case for it for $10 that has a belt clip and loops on the back in case >> you want a case to put it in, but it could also fit in a pocket on its >> own. I like it because it is easy to pair and the keys can be >> differentiated from each other. It also has an on and off switch. >> Hth, >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Kirt Manwaring" >> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" >> >> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 6:29 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >> >> >> Mike, >> I agree fleksy can be a game changer. Still, portable (and by that I >> mean pocket-sized) bluetooth keyboards are a realistic option and, >> speaking from personal experience, I can type much faster on a >> bluetooth keyboard or paired apex than I can with fleksy, although >> fleksy is definitely a huge improvement over standard touch typing. >> When I had a small bluetooth keyboard, I used it all the time for >> things like texting, e-mail, light notetaking (calendars, contacts, >> etc), web browsing and the like. Even with fleksy and a braille note >> apex, I'm finding that I miss my little bluetooth keyboard more and >> more the longer I don't have one. Yes, it was slightly uncomfortable >> in my pocket...but I'm used to carrying lots of things in my pockets, >> so that wasn't a big deal. Yes, it cost something like sixty dollars; >> I'll probably pay up and get another one soon, just because the dang >> thing was so practical for me. Again, I'm just saying what's worked >> for me, and I totally recognize that my prefered style isn't right for >> everybody. As far as I'm concerned, if fleksy gets the job done for >> you and does most everything you want it do, more power to you. Your >> pocket book would probably agree with me. :) Best, Kirt >> >> On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: >>> I jump ahead sometimes folks. I don't always explain myself as I >>> should. >>> I >>> apologize for that. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>> Shelton >>> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 5:33 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> Justin, I'm a little confused as to why you would need to do heavy >>> notetaking on the IPhone. Do you mean you'd use it to take notes and >>> study in lieu of a computer? If you have one it would probably make >>> more sense and be easier to just use a laptop, but I'm sure you have >>> a reason. Just curious. >>> >>> On 3/15/13, justin williams wrote: >>>> Yeah, at some point, but as a full time student, I would like a >>>> bridge so >>> I >>>> can be effective until I get the hang of the gestures. I don't have >>>> three to four hours a day for a week to spend on the I phone, and I >>>> can't afford to loose time. The keyboard just seems like the >>>> answer. I'll be studying for exams and doing final papers in the >>>> next few weeks. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>> Freeman >>>> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 2:27 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> Unless you're using your iPhone for heavy note-taking (something I >>>> do >>> *not* >>>> recommend), I think you'll use a keyboard far less than you imagine >>>> you will. Prticularly now that Fleksy is on the scene, I do not use >>>> my >>> keyboard >>>> or even my BrailleSensePLUS paired to the iPhone as much as I did a >>>> couple of years ago. >>>> >>>> Mike Freeman >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>> williams >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:13 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> Yeah, I definitely want a portable keyboard. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt >>>> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 11:59 AM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>> >>>> If you want portability, don't give the Apple keyboard. Go online, >>>> or to your local specialty electronics store, and get one that folds >>>> up, rolls >>> up >>>> Fits in your pocket, or is actually a custom case for your phone >>>> with a keyboard that pulls Out. In my mind, the silly Apple keyboard >>>> really isn't practical if you want to carry it Around. Also, >>>> something I haven't heard mentioned yet that is potentially very >>>> relevant, the iPhone five has a significantly better camera than the >>>> four ass. I have a for S, and the camera works, but sometimes it's a >>>> little bit slow with apps like vizwizz And the MoneyReader, and I've >>>> heard it's a real headache messing with OCR apps on the four ass >>>> camera, but it's quite a bit easier on the five. >>> Whoa, >>>> Siri just messed up that last sentence, but I'm feeling kind of >>>> risqué today, so I'll keep it in there, for comedy sake. :-) >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 15, 2013, at 4:02 AM, Joseph Hudson wrote: >>>> >>>>> Yes it is 70$ for the apple one at best-by. >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 9:54 PM, "justin williams" >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Okay. Is it feasible to get a keyboard to go with it? One of >>>>>> those little ones? >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>>>> Freeman >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:16 PM >>>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>>> >>>>>> The 5 has much faster response than do the 4 or 4S (I still have a >>>>>> 4). >>>>>> However, you're definitely correct that the 4S is being sold much >>>>>> more cheaply than is the 5. >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>> justin williams >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 5:54 PM >>>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>>> >>>>>> I was just told that it handles a little easier, and it is cheaper. >>>>>> I was told that the five has nothing new, and does not function >>>>>> any better than the 4s, but it is more expensive. I don't know >>>>>> for sure; I am just inquiring. I've got to buy one soon. >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike >>>>>> Freeman >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 5:45 PM >>>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>>> >>>>>> I don't see why it's superior to the 5. >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>> justin williams >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 12:35 PM >>>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>>> >>>>>> I've heard that the 4s is the best version of the I phone for the >>>>>> Blind. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tony >>>>>> Grima >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:17 PM >>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] At last - the iPhone iOS6 Updates are here! >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> iPhone iOS6 Updates: Getting Started with the iPhone for Blind >>>>>> Users by Anna Dresner In braille, eBraille, Word, ASCII text, >>>>>> ePub, or >>>>>> DAISY: $9 >>>>>> >>>>>> Get the full iPhone tutorial - or get both this book and the full >>>>>> tutorial together and save! >>>>>> >>>>>> The iPhone 5 - which was introduced in September 2012 - is faster >>>>>> than previous iPhones, can take advantage of the faster 4G >>>>>> network, and has a better camera. >>>>>> >>>>>> Rather than putting out a whole new tutorial, this book is a >>>>>> supplement that you can use alongside our Getting Started with the >>>>>> iPhone and iOS5 for Blind Users. The same section titles are used >>>>>> in both this supplement and the full tutorial, so you can find >>>>>> them easily. >>>>>> >>>>>> If you already know the basics of using the iPhone, you can use >>>>>> this update to review what's new. This book includes updated >>>>>> versions of the braille display and Bluetooth commands and revised >>>>>> versions of all the appendices. >>>>>> An additional appendix that lists all the apps referred to in this >>>>>> book, along with links you can use to find them in the iTunes store. >>>>>> These materials should allow the book to do double duty as an >>>>>> iPhone reference card. >>>>>> >>>>>> Order at: >>>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/IOS6-UPDATE.html >>>>>> >>>>>> See all of our iPhone books and tutorials! >>>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/apple.html >>>>>> ****** >>>>>> To order any books, send payment to: >>>>>> NBP, 88 St. Stephen Street, Boston, MA 02115-4302 Or call and >>>>>> charge >>>>>> it: >>>>>> toll-free (800) 548-7323 or (617) 266-6160 ext 520. >>>>>> Or order any of our books online at >>>>>> http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/index.html. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.william >>>>>> s2% >>>>>> 40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix. >>>>>> com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.william >>>>>> s2% >>>>>> 40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix. >>>>>> com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.william >>>>>> s2% >>>>>> 40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail. >>>>>> com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude% >>>>> 40g >>>>> mail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.co >>>> m >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% >> 40gmai >>> l.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40g >> mail.c >> om >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gm >> ail.co >> m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g >> mail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From jsoro620 at gmail.com Mon Mar 18 22:19:42 2013 From: jsoro620 at gmail.com (Joe) Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 18:19:42 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] How to Pick a College Major Message-ID: <018f01ce2426$b0c28ba0$1247a2e0$@gmail.com> To make the most of your college financial investment, pick a practical major that will enhance your future marketability. Doing so will ensure you are well-equipped to excel no matter what line of work you tackle after graduation. First, figure out what it is you truly want to do with your life. I know that may not seem earth-shattering, but as I pointed out in my post about following your own dreams, too many of us stumble down a path someone else laid out for us. For example, earning a philosophy degree and extolling the virtues of an enlightened mind may be your passion. If it's truly your passion, nothing I or anyone else can say will discourage you from pursuing that ambition, but before you can truly succeed at it, you need to come to terms with the second question. Read more: http://joeorozco.com/blog_how_to_pick_a_college_major From laurel.stockard at gmail.com Tue Mar 19 00:59:40 2013 From: laurel.stockard at gmail.com (Laurel) Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 19:59:40 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] keeping aquariums Message-ID: Hi all, I have a question. Have any of you who have lived in a college dorm or apartment ever kept an aquarium or fish tank? I know most colleges won't let you keep pets in dorms or apartments unless they are fish, or a guide dog obviously. My friend who lives in a dorm, and I are wondering if any of you have done this. Our question also, is how would you efficiently change the water, clean the tank etc, if you can't see. Basically, we're looking for a blind person who has successfully kept fish. Thanks Laurel From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Tue Mar 19 01:13:35 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2013 01:13:35 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] keeping aquariums In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I'm interested in the same things, because I'm wanting to keep fish, when I move out on my own. They're the only animal I'm not allergic to, (LOL!) Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Laurel [laurel.stockard at gmail.com] Sent: Monday, March 18, 2013 7:59 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] keeping aquariums Hi all, I have a question. Have any of you who have lived in a college dorm or apartment ever kept an aquarium or fish tank? I know most colleges won't let you keep pets in dorms or apartments unless they are fish, or a guide dog obviously. My friend who lives in a dorm, and I are wondering if any of you have done this. Our question also, is how would you efficiently change the water, clean the tank etc, if you can't see. Basically, we're looking for a blind person who has successfully kept fish. Thanks Laurel _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Tue Mar 19 03:01:05 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 23:01:05 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] keeping aquariums In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I haven't kept fish at college yet, but a few friends of mine and I are getting an apartment next year and I'm interested in possibly getting fish. I have had fish as a family pet before though, and this year my roommate and I have also "fish-sat" a few times when people went home over the weekend or whatever. When you clean the tank it's best to just have a separate bowl to put the fish in. Completely dump out the old water, clean out the bowl, then fill it with new water and put the fish back in. I know I'm not very specific, (sorry, it's late) but once you do it once or twice you should have it down. Tanks may be a little more complicated though. I've always had little goldfish who haven't required much room so a bowl has always worked fine. On 3/18/13, Joshua Lester wrote: > I'm interested in the same things, because I'm wanting to keep fish, when I > move out on my own. > They're the only animal I'm not allergic to, (LOL!) > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Laurel > [laurel.stockard at gmail.com] > Sent: Monday, March 18, 2013 7:59 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: [nabs-l] keeping aquariums > > Hi all, > I have a question. Have any of you who have lived in a college dorm or > apartment ever kept an aquarium or fish tank? I know most colleges > won't let you keep pets in dorms or apartments unless they are fish, > or a guide dog obviously. My friend who lives in a dorm, and I are > wondering if any of you have done this. Our question also, is how > would you efficiently change the water, clean the tank etc, if you > can't see. Basically, we're looking for a blind person who has > successfully kept fish. > Thanks > Laurel > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From codyjbair at yahoo.com Tue Mar 19 03:06:27 2013 From: codyjbair at yahoo.com (Cody Bair) Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 20:06:27 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [nabs-l] Accesibility of Google Calendar Message-ID: <1363662387.48483.YahooMailClassic@web125206.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Hi All, The business fraternity at my university for which I am an officer is considering switching to Google calendar for scheduling events. Have any of you used this? If so have you found it to be accessible? Thanks, Cody From zeek786 at gmail.com Tue Mar 19 18:15:09 2013 From: zeek786 at gmail.com (Zeeshan Khan) Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2013 11:15:09 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam In-Reply-To: <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE25C@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> References: <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE25C@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> Message-ID: Thats great that you did well on hte mcat. So how do you like med school? Yes, i did get extended time. I felt the material was too much and I didn't take breaks during the exam itself, which made my eyes tired. I understood the material, this time around, I think I will be more strategic about it. -Zeeshan On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 5:12 AM, Wasif, Zunaira wrote: > I haven't taken the CPA exam, but I did take the MCAT in 2006 and did > pretty well on it. The most helpful accommodation with that exam was > extended time. Did you get extended time on the CPA exam? Why do you > feel you didn't pass? Did you understand the material? > Zunaira > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Zeeshan > Khan > Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 7:45 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam > > Hi everyone, > So I went to school for accounting and sat for the CPA exam in 2011 for > both the BEC and Auditing parts, but I did not pass. After that I > stopped and didn't pursue it further. But now I feel that I have left it > incomplete and want to go back to the CPA exams and reattempt it and > hopefully pass it this time. So here are my questions / conerns. > > 1. How long did it take to pass being visually impaired? > > 2. What programs / resources did you use? I have used Roger CPA, but I > beleive his stuff expires after a bit? Is Becker really that good? > > 3. How long did u spend studying for each part? > > 4. Do you have a job now after having passed it? > > 5. How much did you study each day? > > 6. How did you study? took a live course, studied on your own, got a > tutor ? > > 7. Is it worth the effort and time, especially give the fact that I am > legally blind, it is much mroe difficult studying for it? > > I look forward to hearing all of your experiences. > > Thank you, > > -- > > Zeeshan Khan > > ToiBooks > www.toibooks.com > http://www.facebook.com/ToiBooks > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. > fldoe.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zeek786%40gmail.com > -- Zeeshan Khan ToiBooks www.toibooks.com http://www.facebook.com/ToiBooks From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Tue Mar 19 00:25:27 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 20:25:27 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam In-Reply-To: References: <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE25C@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> Message-ID: <001201ce2438$42778260$c7668720$@gmail.com> Keep it up man. Play to your strengths, and take a break when it is offered. Use your tools. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Zeeshan Khan Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2013 2:15 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam Thats great that you did well on hte mcat. So how do you like med school? Yes, i did get extended time. I felt the material was too much and I didn't take breaks during the exam itself, which made my eyes tired. I understood the material, this time around, I think I will be more strategic about it. -Zeeshan On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 5:12 AM, Wasif, Zunaira wrote: > I haven't taken the CPA exam, but I did take the MCAT in 2006 and did > pretty well on it. The most helpful accommodation with that exam was > extended time. Did you get extended time on the CPA exam? Why do you > feel you didn't pass? Did you understand the material? > Zunaira > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Zeeshan > Khan > Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 7:45 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam > > Hi everyone, > So I went to school for accounting and sat for the CPA exam in 2011 > for both the BEC and Auditing parts, but I did not pass. After that I > stopped and didn't pursue it further. But now I feel that I have left > it incomplete and want to go back to the CPA exams and reattempt it > and hopefully pass it this time. So here are my questions / conerns. > > 1. How long did it take to pass being visually impaired? > > 2. What programs / resources did you use? I have used Roger CPA, but I > beleive his stuff expires after a bit? Is Becker really that good? > > 3. How long did u spend studying for each part? > > 4. Do you have a job now after having passed it? > > 5. How much did you study each day? > > 6. How did you study? took a live course, studied on your own, got a > tutor ? > > 7. Is it worth the effort and time, especially give the fact that I am > legally blind, it is much mroe difficult studying for it? > > I look forward to hearing all of your experiences. > > Thank you, > > -- > > Zeeshan Khan > > ToiBooks > www.toibooks.com > http://www.facebook.com/ToiBooks > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. > fldoe.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zeek786%40gmail.co > m > -- Zeeshan Khan ToiBooks www.toibooks.com http://www.facebook.com/ToiBooks _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From zeek786 at gmail.com Wed Mar 20 01:26:01 2013 From: zeek786 at gmail.com (Zeeshan Khan) Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2013 18:26:01 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam In-Reply-To: <001201ce2438$42778260$c7668720$@gmail.com> References: <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE25C@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> <001201ce2438$42778260$c7668720$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hey Justin, Just curious, have you taken the cpa exam? On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 5:25 PM, justin williams wrote: > Keep it up man. Play to your strengths, and take a break when it is > offered. Use your tools. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Zeeshan Khan > Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2013 2:15 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam > > Thats great that you did well on hte mcat. So how do you like med school? > Yes, i did get extended time. I felt the material was too much and I didn't > take breaks during the exam itself, which made my eyes tired. I understood > the material, this time around, I think I will be more strategic about it. > > -Zeeshan > > On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 5:12 AM, Wasif, Zunaira < > Zunaira.Wasif at dbs.fldoe.org > > wrote: > > > I haven't taken the CPA exam, but I did take the MCAT in 2006 and did > > pretty well on it. The most helpful accommodation with that exam was > > extended time. Did you get extended time on the CPA exam? Why do you > > feel you didn't pass? Did you understand the material? > > Zunaira > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Zeeshan > > Khan > > Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 7:45 PM > > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > Subject: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam > > > > Hi everyone, > > So I went to school for accounting and sat for the CPA exam in 2011 > > for both the BEC and Auditing parts, but I did not pass. After that I > > stopped and didn't pursue it further. But now I feel that I have left > > it incomplete and want to go back to the CPA exams and reattempt it > > and hopefully pass it this time. So here are my questions / conerns. > > > > 1. How long did it take to pass being visually impaired? > > > > 2. What programs / resources did you use? I have used Roger CPA, but I > > beleive his stuff expires after a bit? Is Becker really that good? > > > > 3. How long did u spend studying for each part? > > > > 4. Do you have a job now after having passed it? > > > > 5. How much did you study each day? > > > > 6. How did you study? took a live course, studied on your own, got a > > tutor ? > > > > 7. Is it worth the effort and time, especially give the fact that I am > > legally blind, it is much mroe difficult studying for it? > > > > I look forward to hearing all of your experiences. > > > > Thank you, > > > > -- > > > > Zeeshan Khan > > > > ToiBooks > > www.toibooks.com > > http://www.facebook.com/ToiBooks > > _______________________________________________ > > nabs-l mailing list > > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. > > fldoe.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > > nabs-l mailing list > > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zeek786%40gmail.co > > m > > > > > > -- > > Zeeshan Khan > > ToiBooks > www.toibooks.com > http://www.facebook.com/ToiBooks > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zeek786%40gmail.com > -- Zeeshan Khan ToiBooks www.toibooks.com http://www.facebook.com/ToiBooks From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Tue Mar 19 01:30:53 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 21:30:53 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam In-Reply-To: References: <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE25C@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> <001201ce2438$42778260$c7668720$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <000c01ce2441$668a7ff0$339f7fd0$@gmail.com> No man, but I'm rooting for you. Moral support. I want to say I have ho a blind accountant. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Zeeshan Khan Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2013 9:26 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam Hey Justin, Just curious, have you taken the cpa exam? On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 5:25 PM, justin williams wrote: > Keep it up man. Play to your strengths, and take a break when it is > offered. Use your tools. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Zeeshan > Khan > Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2013 2:15 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam > > Thats great that you did well on hte mcat. So how do you like med school? > Yes, i did get extended time. I felt the material was too much and I > didn't take breaks during the exam itself, which made my eyes tired. I > understood the material, this time around, I think I will be more strategic about it. > > -Zeeshan > > On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 5:12 AM, Wasif, Zunaira < > Zunaira.Wasif at dbs.fldoe.org > > wrote: > > > I haven't taken the CPA exam, but I did take the MCAT in 2006 and did > > pretty well on it. The most helpful accommodation with that exam was > > extended time. Did you get extended time on the CPA exam? Why do > > you feel you didn't pass? Did you understand the material? > > Zunaira > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Zeeshan > > Khan > > Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 7:45 PM > > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > Subject: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam > > > > Hi everyone, > > So I went to school for accounting and sat for the CPA exam in 2011 > > for both the BEC and Auditing parts, but I did not pass. After that > > I stopped and didn't pursue it further. But now I feel that I have > > left it incomplete and want to go back to the CPA exams and > > reattempt it and hopefully pass it this time. So here are my questions / conerns. > > > > 1. How long did it take to pass being visually impaired? > > > > 2. What programs / resources did you use? I have used Roger CPA, but > > I beleive his stuff expires after a bit? Is Becker really that good? > > > > 3. How long did u spend studying for each part? > > > > 4. Do you have a job now after having passed it? > > > > 5. How much did you study each day? > > > > 6. How did you study? took a live course, studied on your own, got a > > tutor ? > > > > 7. Is it worth the effort and time, especially give the fact that I > > am legally blind, it is much mroe difficult studying for it? > > > > I look forward to hearing all of your experiences. > > > > Thank you, > > > > -- > > > > Zeeshan Khan > > > > ToiBooks > > www.toibooks.com > > http://www.facebook.com/ToiBooks > > _______________________________________________ > > nabs-l mailing list > > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info > > for > > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. > > fldoe.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > > nabs-l mailing list > > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info > > for > > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zeek786%40gmail. > > co > > m > > > > > > -- > > Zeeshan Khan > > ToiBooks > www.toibooks.com > http://www.facebook.com/ToiBooks > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zeek786%40gmail.co > m > -- Zeeshan Khan ToiBooks www.toibooks.com http://www.facebook.com/ToiBooks _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From zeek786 at gmail.com Wed Mar 20 01:57:23 2013 From: zeek786 at gmail.com (Zeeshan Khan) Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2013 18:57:23 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam In-Reply-To: <000c01ce2441$668a7ff0$339f7fd0$@gmail.com> References: <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE25C@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> <001201ce2438$42778260$c7668720$@gmail.com> <000c01ce2441$668a7ff0$339f7fd0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: thanks man On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 6:30 PM, justin williams wrote: > No man, but I'm rooting for you. Moral support. I want to say I have ho a > blind accountant. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Zeeshan Khan > Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2013 9:26 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam > > Hey Justin, > Just curious, have you taken the cpa exam? > > On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 5:25 PM, justin williams < > justin.williams2 at gmail.com > > wrote: > > > Keep it up man. Play to your strengths, and take a break when it is > > offered. Use your tools. > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Zeeshan > > Khan > > Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2013 2:15 PM > > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam > > > > Thats great that you did well on hte mcat. So how do you like med school? > > Yes, i did get extended time. I felt the material was too much and I > > didn't take breaks during the exam itself, which made my eyes tired. I > > understood the material, this time around, I think I will be more > strategic about it. > > > > -Zeeshan > > > > On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 5:12 AM, Wasif, Zunaira < > > Zunaira.Wasif at dbs.fldoe.org > > > wrote: > > > > > I haven't taken the CPA exam, but I did take the MCAT in 2006 and did > > > pretty well on it. The most helpful accommodation with that exam was > > > extended time. Did you get extended time on the CPA exam? Why do > > > you feel you didn't pass? Did you understand the material? > > > Zunaira > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Zeeshan > > > Khan > > > Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 7:45 PM > > > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > > > Subject: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam > > > > > > Hi everyone, > > > So I went to school for accounting and sat for the CPA exam in 2011 > > > for both the BEC and Auditing parts, but I did not pass. After that > > > I stopped and didn't pursue it further. But now I feel that I have > > > left it incomplete and want to go back to the CPA exams and > > > reattempt it and hopefully pass it this time. So here are my questions > / > conerns. > > > > > > 1. How long did it take to pass being visually impaired? > > > > > > 2. What programs / resources did you use? I have used Roger CPA, but > > > I beleive his stuff expires after a bit? Is Becker really that good? > > > > > > 3. How long did u spend studying for each part? > > > > > > 4. Do you have a job now after having passed it? > > > > > > 5. How much did you study each day? > > > > > > 6. How did you study? took a live course, studied on your own, got a > > > tutor ? > > > > > > 7. Is it worth the effort and time, especially give the fact that I > > > am legally blind, it is much mroe difficult studying for it? > > > > > > I look forward to hearing all of your experiences. > > > > > > Thank you, > > > > > > -- > > > > > > Zeeshan Khan > > > > > > ToiBooks > > > www.toibooks.com > > > http://www.facebook.com/ToiBooks > > > _______________________________________________ > > > nabs-l mailing list > > > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info > > > for > > > nabs-l: > > > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. > > > fldoe.org > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > nabs-l mailing list > > > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info > > > for > > > nabs-l: > > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zeek786%40gmail. > > > co > > > m > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Zeeshan Khan > > > > ToiBooks > > www.toibooks.com > > http://www.facebook.com/ToiBooks > > _______________________________________________ > > nabs-l mailing list > > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > > nabs-l: > > > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > > 0gmail > > .com > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > nabs-l mailing list > > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zeek786%40gmail.co > > m > > > > > > -- > > Zeeshan Khan > > ToiBooks > www.toibooks.com > http://www.facebook.com/ToiBooks > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zeek786%40gmail.com > -- Zeeshan Khan ToiBooks www.toibooks.com http://www.facebook.com/ToiBooks From freethaught at gmail.com Wed Mar 20 03:47:05 2013 From: freethaught at gmail.com (Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr.) Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2013 23:47:05 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID In-Reply-To: <00cf01ce2128$9e1b70d0$da525270$@panix.com> References: <014e01ce204b$54a33060$fde99120$@panix.com><-5165961609241501194@unknownmsgid><004b01ce20c5$5a44fd80$0ecef880$@panix.com><003901ce200e$9b1504c0$d13f0e40$@gmail.com><004801ce2010$a9d558a0$fd8009e0$@gmail.com> <00cf01ce2128$9e1b70d0$da525270$@panix.com> Message-ID: <83D1E52B-4B9D-4ABF-8F61-243C14C6757B@gmail.com> I think that insisting that all people call themselves blind rather than something else is essentially a reversal of the hierarchy of site. Now about ID canes, they can be smaller, and therefore more convenient to carry. They are lighter,, and can sometimes be used as a full mobility came for blind people wishing to travel out with the usual techniques we all know and love.. I find it interesting that the beloved white cane law calls for drivers to stop foreperson carrying a cane, or using a dog, and some here are advocating for those with low vision not to carry a cane. Is it a special perk to be given the right to cross the street is a blind person? Should the law only applies to those who call themselves blind, and use the appropriate cane? Also, if someone chooses to use an ID cane, they are choosing to look blind. How does this equal a lack of confidence regarding blindness. I think there's enough division out there, and we don't do ourselves much service by fussing about semantics. Antonio On Mar 14, 2013, at 10:55 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: > Ashley: > > I think most of us (blind or partially-sighted) walk in familiar areas > without a cane. Certainly I don't use one around the house. (grin) > > I suspect many Federationists would be less critical of "visually impaired" > and like terms were people not to use such terms as a mechanism to avoid > their considering themselves blind -- something most of us *do* consider > crucial for good adjustment. But your descriptions below are valid and I > have no argument with them. Oh yes -- if we could also get rid of both the > saying that "in the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king" and the > hierarchy of sight that most people believe in that is the wellspring of > that statement, we'd also be less suspicious that alternative descriptions > of visual problems are euphemisms. > > Incidentally, how well one travels doesn't necessarily indicate how much one > sees. > > Mike Freeman > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley Bramlett > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 7:34 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID > > Kaiti, > I understand where you are coming from. I always have my regular folding > cane handy when out alone. > As someone with functional vision, I also like the term visually impaired or > > low vision. > I think I use it since I grew up with it and sort of adopted it as part of > my identity. > It wasn't til I met Federationists that I found everyone using the term > blind; Nfb people do not distinguish those with some sight from totals. I > understand why; but at the same time, it seems odd because someone who > functions visually for some tasks well will use it in life and therefore may > > have some different needs than a totally blind person. Of course, those > with visual impairments should learn nonvisual techniques unless their > vision is always efficient and reliable. But in addition to nonvisual > methods, they will certainly use vision. > > I do not walk outside on campus without a cane; its too unpredictable with > steps, bumps, and curves. But, I would walk inside the dorm and some > buildings either without a cane or just carrying it. It seemed faster to do > this for me and not be concerned with the cane's arc and hitting someone. > Just as you explained, I feel that walking without a cane for a short > predictable distance > doesn't say anything about my adjustment to blindness. I'm comfortable with > my visual condition and will talk about it if needed or educate people. It > doesn't mean I'm hiding the condition or anything. I know some low vision > people who are embarrassed to use canes, so I can see why the totally blind > people who spoke up would think that. But this is not the case for all > legally blind people. > > As for the terms, I think people > know the difference between sight and vision. So, I don't see why that would > > play into your argument. > For Josh, saying blind makes sense. > But I'd have to say that downplaying other terms seems a bit far to me. > > I think those of us with vision have to balance when to use it and what > tools to use. If we make a knowledgable and informed choice, we are well off > > and hopefully compete well. I don't have enough vision to walk much without > a cane or simply hold an ID cane. So for me, a regular cane is in my tool > box, but for someone else who is just on the threshhold of legal blindness, > they may choose a ID cane. > > Ashley > -----Original Message----- > From: Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 10:08 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID > > Josh, > > I don't believe I was on the list at the time of those posts, but > besides that, in my last post I mentioned my reasoning behind using > the term visually impaired. Your logic works for you and is accurate; > you are totally blind so there is no question about terminology. > However, for those of us with some functional sight visually impaired > is a more accurate descriptor (see my last email for examples why). > I'm sure most people are smart enough to separate the tow meanings of > the word vision; obviously sight has no bearing on one's ability to > form a vision of what they want to do or become in the future, but > they are two separate things. > > All I'm asking is for a little more consideration of the perspectives > of people with varying degrees of sight and the reasons for why they > choose to do the things they do. Just because these choices and their > needs might be different from someone who is totally blind that > doesn't make them wrong. > > Arielle, I may not be the best person to shed light on this as I use > my telescopic as a cane too, but I went to a Voc Rehab program for my > state with a girl who had an identity cane but visually didn't need to > use it much. She would carry it with her to let people know, but her > vision was stable and good enough that she could read slightly > enlarged print, (and I believe she got a provisional drivers license > she can use as long as it's not dark or too bright outside too). I > guess it goes back to just letting people know; she was very willing > to discuss her vision with people if asked and identified herself as a > visually impaired person, but functionally she had enough sight where > using a cane in most circumstances would have just been something she > didn't need. > > On 3/14/13, Arielle Silverman wrote: >> Hi all, >> I guess I'm not quite getting what the advantage is of an ID cane over >> a regular one? With either cane, you are telling the world that you >> are blind (or visually impaired or whatever term you want to use). The >> ID cane gives you less tactile info than the regular one does. I >> totally understand that sometimes you might not need a cane to get >> around, but if you're going to use an ID cane anyway, why not just use >> the regular one and get a little extra tactile info too? It might not >> be necessary but it can't possibly hurt you to use a regular cane >> instead of an ID cane. Is there some way an ID cane is more convenient >> to use than a regular white cane? >> I agree that sometimes it is more convenient to not use a cane at all >> because it keeps your hands free. In those cases maybe wearing some >> kind of ID symbol would better help with making sure others around you >> know you are blind. However I think those situations where you really >> need both of your hands are pretty unusual. >> Arielle >> >> On 3/14/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>> Kaiti: >>> Did you read my posts about "Visually Impaired, Vs. Blind?" >>> Basicly for me, I'd rather refer to myself as blind, (I'm totally blind,) >>> but I'm not "visually impaired." >>> There's a difference between sight, and vision. >>> I've talked about that alot on these lists. >>> Sight, is natural, (what we lack,) but vision is inward. >>> If we didn't have vision, there would be no NFB. >>> Vision is like this. >>> "Where do you see yourself, in the next 5 years?" >>> Using that logic, our vision isn't impaired, but our sight is. >>> Let's just refer to ourselves as blind and get it over with. >>> Good point Mike! >>> Blessings, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 2:49 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>> >>> Absolutely on that front. There is no point of interacting with >>> people under false pretenses as if you were sighted... If one is >>> worried about social situations due to people thinking they're blind, >>> then they might want to think about the possible awkward situation of >>> a friend suddenly finding out about something that important that was >>> there all along and kept from them. >>> >>> On 3/14/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> Mike, that is not how it works at all and I really have a problem with >>>> the incinuation that people who identify themselves as visually >>>> impaired use that title to get special treatment. I use my functional >>>> vision as well as a cane when I feel it appropriate, and receive >>>> accomodations such as braille, electronic format for textbooks, and >>>> assistive technology that I need. I do what I can independently and >>>> ask for sighted assistance when I need something read or would like a >>>> little clarification on something visual that I cannot see. These are >>>> not "special perks" as you put it. My personal choice to use VI over >>>> blind is that it makes things easier for people to understand. I have >>>> had some situations when I have used the term blind and people assume >>>> I can't see anything at all. This has lead to well-intended but >>>> unnecessary superhelping and other consequences. For me it's much >>>> simpler to say I'm visually impaired, indicating that I have some >>>> functional vision and giving sighted people a slightly clearer idea >>>> about me. The NFB recognizes these terms "blind, legally blind, >>>> visually impaired," as interchangeable, so it all comes down to >>>> personal choice. There is nothing that says one term is preferential >>>> over the other and has to be used by everyone. Afterall, visual >>>> impairment is a continuum with varying degrees of blindness, so for >>>> some visually impaired is a more accurate descriptor. >>>> >>>> I think that even if the original poster is slightly preoccupied with >>>> the image of being blind then getting an identity cane might be the >>>> first step in correcting that. The more people see it, the more he'll >>>> have to answer questions about himself and his visual impairment and >>>> get used to it. Not all, but some visually impaired people have to >>>> psychologically ease into being comfortable with identifying >>>> themselves in this way and that shouldn't be held against them if >>>> that's what they have to do. Heck, I've even heard partially sighted >>>> people speak at state conventions about how they grew more comfortable >>>> with their blindness by beginning to associate themselves with the >>>> NFB, so it sounds like the poster may be on the right track. Again, >>>> we don't really know the situation; any one of us could be reading >>>> something that the poster didn't intentionally mean because that is a >>>> side-effect of electronic messages... things often get misconstrued. >>>> He never said he didn't want to be identified as blind in order to >>>> gain priveledges; he just wanted something to let people know, but he >>>> still has enough functional vision to walk without a cane. I think >>>> the wording about walking perfectly may be a little presumptuous, (no >>>> one, blind or sighted, walks exactly perfectly because it's >>>> anatomically impossible), but like I said this might be a good step in >>>> putting blindness/visual impairment/whatever you'd like to call it >>>> into perspective. >>>> >>>> >>>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>> Just use whatever works. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>>> Dudley >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 1:29 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>> >>>>> I guess I just don't see the problem with allowing people to interact >>>>> with >>>>> you as though you are sighted. If for some reason, you can't see that >>>>> interaction, then tell them you are blind. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 3/13/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>>> Our fine line is that we are trying to predict, and or control >>>>>> people's reactions. If you do not have a cane with you while walking >>>>>> in our country, people probably will not know you are blind. The >>>>>> original poster has every right to not use a cane and rely on >>>>>> functional vision. However, the reactions of people can't be >>>>>> controlled. If they don't know he is blind, they will react to him as >>>>>> if he is sighted. It is his choice. In America, I don't think we >>>>>> have a way to not carry a cane, but have everyone know that you are >>>>>> blind. >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Aleeha >>>>>> Dudley >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:43 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>> I'm going to stick my "oar in" as they say. Kaiti and Mike, I >>>>>> think there may be a bit of misunderstanding. I think what is sought >>>>>> by the original poster on this thread is an identification symbol, >>>>>> something to say "I am blind" that is not as bulky as a cane. I >>>>>> definitely disagree with this. What I do not disagree with is using >>>>>> one's functional vision when you have it and, if that be your desire, >>>>>> to not use a cane if you don't need it. >>>>>> What I do disagree with is the concept of wanting the "you poor blind >>>>>> person" perks of blindness without carrying a cane, as the original >>>>>> poster seems to want. There is a fine line that I think is lost in the >>>>> grey here. >>>>>> ALeeha >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/14/13, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>>> Kaiti: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We shall have to agree to disagree. I see no reason to identify as >>>>>>> "visually impaired" unless one wishes special help or perks. Why not >>>>>>> just be blind and have done with the matter? Much simpler. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> In fact, I know a guy who was nearly totally blind for many years due >>>>>>> to an explosion. He got a good deal of sight back (he's lost it again >>>>>>> now) and used his sight to look around, traveling with a cane as he >>>>>>> always did; thus, he got the benefit of sight plus didn't have to >>>>>>> worry about when he should or should not use a cane, whether to >>>>>>> identify etc. etc. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Peace! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>>>>>> Shelton >>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:32 PM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Mike, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I have to disagree here. As one of those partials who elects when to >>>>>>> use and not use a cane, I have a perspective on the issue that you >>>>>>> may not be considering. Electing when and when not to use a cane is >>>>>>> not always related to a person being insecure with their blindness; >>>>>>> some of the most secure people I know don't use canes all the time. >>>>>>> Furthermore, I don't think people who choose to walk familiar areas >>>>>>> without a cane some times should give up their right to identify >>>>>>> themself as a visually impaired person. E.G, I would never do any >>>>>>> type of pedestrian travel without a cane or think about crossing a >>>>>>> street without one, and using one at times when I really can't see >>>>>>> like at night or when it's very bright are no brainers, but under >>>>>>> normal conditions when I'm walking from my dorm to the cafeteria >>>>>>> right across the little street which has no traffic at all and I'm >>>>>>> coming right back I don't always choose to actively use it. My >>>>>>> choice to not use a cane in this instance does not mean I should >>>>>>> forfit my right to identify myself as a visually impaired person >>>>>>> because I am; the use of the cane does not change my inability to >>>>>>> read print or to see great distances and it does not change the fact >>>>>>> that I am legally blind and am identified that way. It also doesn't >>>>>>> change the level of security I have with my blindness; if a person >>>>>>> refuses to use a cane or fights against it because they're afraid of >>>>>>> the social implications then that is insecurity, but if they're >>>>>>> visually having a good day and want to run a quick errand that's in a >>>>>>> very familiar area with minimal travel or risk of injury and they're >>>>>>> confident in their ability to use audio cues and the vision they have >>>>>>> then that is their choice and doesn't make them insecure with >>>>>>> themself or their blindness. As long as they have the confidence and >>>>>>> security to not be afraid of using it and to identify and use it when >>>>>>> they need to, to be confident and secure whether they're using a cane >>>>>>> or not, and don't pose risk to themselves in the cases where they >>>>>>> don't use it there is nothing that would suggest insecurity. We >>>>>>> don't know the exact visual situation of anyone on this list unless >>>>>>> they've written about it, so I don't think it is fair to judge about >>>>>>> someone's level of security with their blindness based on their cane >>>>>>> habits when we don't know what their vision is like. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Identity canes have saved me from many embarrassing social >>>>>>> situations. >>>>>>> Of course when you use it it is a more obvious indicator, but I've >>>>>>> had situations when I've been sitting in a classroom or cafeteria >>>>>>> with my cane on my desk and someone will try to get my attention >>>>>>> using something besides my name. When they see the cane (or >>>>>>> sometimes read National Federation of the Blind on it if they're >>>>>>> close enough to see >>>>>>> it) they understand why I might not recognize that they're referring >>>>>>> to me and they'll get my attention in a more obvious way before >>>>>>> getting my name. Sometimes they ask about the cane which gives me an >>>>>>> opportunity to casually explain my vision in simple terms and then >>>>>>> the person and I can carry on with the conversation because they're >>>>>>> informed and they see that it's not a big deal. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> And, I have to make one small correction. The main market for the >>>>>>> lighter, more compact canes is the precise group of people who may >>>>>>> not use it all the time, and the NFB is obviously aware of this since >>>>>>> they are the ones who originated the telescopic design. Although I >>>>>>> do know people who are totally blind or only have light perception >>>>>>> that use the telescopic canes they tend to tear through them pretty >>>>>>> quickly because they use them so much. For someone who may not use >>>>>>> the cane every single day but still would benefit from having an >>>>>>> identifier to let other people know they're visually impaired these >>>>>>> canes >>>>> are great. >>>>>>> Think of it this way; it would be impractical for someone with mild >>>>>>> hearing loss to always use a hearing aid even when they didn't need >>>>>>> one. Similarly, if visually a partial is having a good day and can >>>>>>> see well enough to successfully travel, dodging obstacles and not >>>>>>> tripping over anything, then it isn't always necessary to use a cane. >>>>>>> In fact, the correction I really want to make is that choosing to >>>>>>> have an identity cane on-hand is actually a sign of security in my >>>>>>> eyes because even if that person may not need to use it by having one >>>>>>> for people to see they must be okay with their blindness and >>>>>>> comfortable in explaining their visual impairment to others should >>>>>>> the question arise. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 3/13/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >>>>>>>> Amen, Mike! Yes, the king can be used as an identification tool to >>>>>>>> alert drivers that you are blind. However, this can be a positive >>>>>>>> thing and not a negative one. This is at least true if you use that >>>>>>>> identification tool of the cane as a symbol of independence and not >>>>>>>> of inferiority. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Just my thoughts >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Chris Nusbaum >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Mar 13, 2013, at 8:33 PM, Mike Freeman wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hamid: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> With all due respect, it seems to me you're trying to have your >>>>>>>>> cake and eat it, too. ON the one hand, you want all the advantages >>>>>>>>> of being recognized as blind whereas on the other, you don't want >>>>>>>>> to really appear blind or be judged because you do not believe you >>>>>>>>> need a cane. My friend, you can't have it both ways. Why do you >>>>>>>>> even care whether the public considers you blind or not or whether >>>>>>>>> they consider it weird that you might appear to not need a cane? >>>>>>>>> Moreover, aren't you under the tacit assumption that blind persons >>>>>>>>> who use canes travel sufficiently awkwardly that the public knows >>>>>>>>> them as blind whereas you consider that you do not? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Seems to me you have some soul-searching to do. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> We do not have a "blind" id other than the long white cane and most >>>>>>>>> of us would not *want* such a label. It's a short step from such a >>>>>>>>> label to being prohibited from going places or doing things because >>>>>>>>> of the alleged inability of the blind. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Grab that white cane, display and use it proudly! >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Mike Freeman >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Hamid >>>>>>>>> Hamraz >>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 3:40 PM >>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Cane as an ID >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Dear Folks, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> It is a couple of months I have been investigating a way to >>>>>>>>> represent my blindness without making a functional use of cane. To >>>>>>>>> be more precise, the target people benefiting are those whose >>>>>>>>> residual sight lets them to walk without the use of a cane and who >>>>>>>>> want to let the other people around them know about their >>>>>>>>> blindness. >>>>>>>>> Carrying a cane is indeed an option. >>>>>>>>> However, >>>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>>> personally think that holding a long cane in my hand without using >>>>>>>>> it and walking perfectly is weird in public. In Germany, they have >>>>>>>>> a special symbol representing this which can be attached anywhere >>>>>>>>> in any size at one's own discretion (and everybody is indeed aware >>>>>>>>> of that). However, there is no such a thing here in US, and setting >>>>>>>>> that up requires time and educating the society about that. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> My question here is what type of cane I should look for? I need >>>>>>>>> something much smaller just to serve as an ID rather than a >>>>>>>>> functional tool. I appreciate any suggestion. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hamid >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.c >>>>>>>>> o >>>>>>>>> m >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40 >>>>>>> g >>>>>>> mail.c >>>>>>> om >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104 >>>>>>> % >>>>>>> 40gmai >>>>>>> l.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993% >>>>>>> 4 >>>>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>>>> 0gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%4 >>>>>> 0gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai > l.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Kaiti >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai > l.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink. > net > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/freethaught%40gmail.com From Zunaira.Wasif at dbs.fldoe.org Wed Mar 20 12:32:31 2013 From: Zunaira.Wasif at dbs.fldoe.org (Wasif, Zunaira) Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2013 08:32:31 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam In-Reply-To: References: <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE25C@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> Message-ID: <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE27C@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> I actually ended up doing a masters program instead and have never looked back at med school. I wanted to be a psychiatrist, but couldn't apply to schools in Florida because the technical standards make it nearly impossible to get in if you are visually impaired. I didn't want to go out of state after getting married and purchasing a home, so I did grad school instead. Zunaira -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Zeeshan Khan Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2013 2:15 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam Thats great that you did well on hte mcat. So how do you like med school? Yes, i did get extended time. I felt the material was too much and I didn't take breaks during the exam itself, which made my eyes tired. I understood the material, this time around, I think I will be more strategic about it. -Zeeshan On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 5:12 AM, Wasif, Zunaira wrote: > I haven't taken the CPA exam, but I did take the MCAT in 2006 and did > pretty well on it. The most helpful accommodation with that exam was > extended time. Did you get extended time on the CPA exam? Why do you > feel you didn't pass? Did you understand the material? > Zunaira > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Zeeshan > Khan > Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 7:45 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam > > Hi everyone, > So I went to school for accounting and sat for the CPA exam in 2011 > for both the BEC and Auditing parts, but I did not pass. After that I > stopped and didn't pursue it further. But now I feel that I have left > it incomplete and want to go back to the CPA exams and reattempt it > and hopefully pass it this time. So here are my questions / conerns. > > 1. How long did it take to pass being visually impaired? > > 2. What programs / resources did you use? I have used Roger CPA, but I > beleive his stuff expires after a bit? Is Becker really that good? > > 3. How long did u spend studying for each part? > > 4. Do you have a job now after having passed it? > > 5. How much did you study each day? > > 6. How did you study? took a live course, studied on your own, got a > tutor ? > > 7. Is it worth the effort and time, especially give the fact that I am > legally blind, it is much mroe difficult studying for it? > > I look forward to hearing all of your experiences. > > Thank you, > > -- > > Zeeshan Khan > > ToiBooks > www.toibooks.com > http://www.facebook.com/ToiBooks > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. > fldoe.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zeek786%40gmail.co > m > -- Zeeshan Khan ToiBooks www.toibooks.com http://www.facebook.com/ToiBooks _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. fldoe.org From trumpetqueenwb at gmail.com Thu Mar 21 01:44:32 2013 From: trumpetqueenwb at gmail.com (Winona Brackett) Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2013 21:44:32 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] New Lap Top Message-ID: <779C6F28-923A-480A-8BEF-EE08095A1E46@gmail.com> Hello, I am in the process of getting a new lap top. I have realized there are so many different brands and models it is overwhelming and hard to know which computer will work the best for me. I am looking for a windows computer that I can download JAWS 14, Dancing Dots (A music software) and Duxbury too. Does anyone know how well Dancing Dots works with Windows 7 or Windows 8? What are your experiences with Duxbury on a Windows 7 or 8 computer? How accessible is JAWS 14 with Windows 8? What are the Pros and conns of Windows 8? Thanks, Winona Sent from my iPod From zdreicer at gmail.com Thu Mar 21 01:47:12 2013 From: zdreicer at gmail.com (Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer) Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2013 19:47:12 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] New Lap Top In-Reply-To: <779C6F28-923A-480A-8BEF-EE08095A1E46@gmail.com> References: <779C6F28-923A-480A-8BEF-EE08095A1E46@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi!!! Haven't heard from u in a long time! I have a windows 7 Acer Aspire and it works well running JFw14 latest. Sent from my Acer Aspire As5733 -----Original Message----- From: Winona Brackett Sent: Wednesday, March 20, 2013 7:44 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] New Lap Top Hello, I am in the process of getting a new lap top. I have realized there are so many different brands and models it is overwhelming and hard to know which computer will work the best for me. I am looking for a windows computer that I can download JAWS 14, Dancing Dots (A music software) and Duxbury too. Does anyone know how well Dancing Dots works with Windows 7 or Windows 8? What are your experiences with Duxbury on a Windows 7 or 8 computer? How accessible is JAWS 14 with Windows 8? What are the Pros and conns of Windows 8? Thanks, Winona Sent from my iPod _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail.com From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Thu Mar 21 01:55:25 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2013 21:55:25 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] New Lap Top In-Reply-To: <779C6F28-923A-480A-8BEF-EE08095A1E46@gmail.com> References: <779C6F28-923A-480A-8BEF-EE08095A1E46@gmail.com> Message-ID: jaws 14 supports windows 8 so if you have that version of jaws, the type of laptop won't matter. -----Original Message----- From: Winona Brackett Sent: Wednesday, March 20, 2013 9:44 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] New Lap Top Hello, I am in the process of getting a new lap top. I have realized there are so many different brands and models it is overwhelming and hard to know which computer will work the best for me. I am looking for a windows computer that I can download JAWS 14, Dancing Dots (A music software) and Duxbury too. Does anyone know how well Dancing Dots works with Windows 7 or Windows 8? What are your experiences with Duxbury on a Windows 7 or 8 computer? How accessible is JAWS 14 with Windows 8? What are the Pros and conns of Windows 8? Thanks, Winona Sent from my iPod _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Thu Mar 21 18:20:26 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2013 14:20:26 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] New Lap Top In-Reply-To: References: <779C6F28-923A-480A-8BEF-EE08095A1E46@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, I have an HP UltraBook running Goodfeel by Dancing Dots, Jaws 13, and Windows 7. It all works pretty well now, although I have yet to install my Jaws 14 SMA. I also really like this particular laptop because it is so slim and lightweight, but it has the hardware to do what I need it to do. HTH. On 3/20/13, Ashley Bramlett wrote: > jaws 14 supports windows 8 so if you have that version of jaws, the type of > > laptop won't matter. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Winona Brackett > Sent: Wednesday, March 20, 2013 9:44 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] New Lap Top > > Hello, > > I am in the process of getting a new lap top. I have realized there are so > many different brands and models it is overwhelming and hard to know which > computer will work the best for me. I am looking for a windows computer > that I can download JAWS 14, Dancing Dots (A music software) and Duxbury > too. Does anyone know how well Dancing Dots works with Windows 7 or Windows > > 8? What are your experiences with Duxbury on a Windows 7 or 8 computer? How > > accessible is JAWS 14 with Windows 8? What are the Pros and conns of Windows > > 8? > > Thanks, > Winona > > Sent from my iPod > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From arielle71 at gmail.com Thu Mar 21 23:10:28 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2013 17:10:28 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam In-Reply-To: <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE27C@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> References: <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE25C@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE27C@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> Message-ID: Hi Zunaira, I'm just curious; when you say "the technical standards make it nearly impossible to get in if you are visually impaired" what do you mean by that? Do you believe that the Florida med schools have discriminatory policies? Or do they require you to use technology that is inaccessible? BTW, you and I were fellow members of the NFB 2003 scholarship class, and both pre-medsters (though I, too, have gone in a different direction). Arielle On 3/20/13, Wasif, Zunaira wrote: > I actually ended up doing a masters program instead and have never > looked back at med school. I wanted to be a psychiatrist, but couldn't > apply to schools in Florida because the technical standards make it > nearly impossible to get in if you are visually impaired. I didn't want > to go out of state after getting married and purchasing a home, so I did > grad school instead. > Zunaira > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Zeeshan > Khan > Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2013 2:15 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam > > Thats great that you did well on hte mcat. So how do you like med > school? > Yes, i did get extended time. I felt the material was too much and I > didn't take breaks during the exam itself, which made my eyes tired. I > understood the material, this time around, I think I will be more > strategic about it. > > -Zeeshan > > On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 5:12 AM, Wasif, Zunaira > > wrote: > >> I haven't taken the CPA exam, but I did take the MCAT in 2006 and did >> pretty well on it. The most helpful accommodation with that exam was >> extended time. Did you get extended time on the CPA exam? Why do you >> feel you didn't pass? Did you understand the material? >> Zunaira >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Zeeshan >> Khan >> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 7:45 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: [nabs-l] The CPA Exam >> >> Hi everyone, >> So I went to school for accounting and sat for the CPA exam in 2011 >> for both the BEC and Auditing parts, but I did not pass. After that I >> stopped and didn't pursue it further. But now I feel that I have left >> it incomplete and want to go back to the CPA exams and reattempt it >> and hopefully pass it this time. So here are my questions / conerns. >> >> 1. How long did it take to pass being visually impaired? >> >> 2. What programs / resources did you use? I have used Roger CPA, but I > >> beleive his stuff expires after a bit? Is Becker really that good? >> >> 3. How long did u spend studying for each part? >> >> 4. Do you have a job now after having passed it? >> >> 5. How much did you study each day? >> >> 6. How did you study? took a live course, studied on your own, got a >> tutor ? >> >> 7. Is it worth the effort and time, especially give the fact that I am > >> legally blind, it is much mroe difficult studying for it? >> >> I look forward to hearing all of your experiences. >> >> Thank you, >> >> -- >> >> Zeeshan Khan >> >> ToiBooks >> www.toibooks.com >> http://www.facebook.com/ToiBooks >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. >> fldoe.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zeek786%40gmail.co >> m >> > > > > -- > > Zeeshan Khan > > ToiBooks > www.toibooks.com > http://www.facebook.com/ToiBooks > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. > fldoe.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From jay.rasmussen at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 02:07:11 2013 From: jay.rasmussen at gmail.com (Jay Rasmussen) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2013 21:07:11 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] New Lap Top In-Reply-To: References: <779C6F28-923A-480A-8BEF-EE08095A1E46@gmail.com> Message-ID: On 3/20/13, Ashley Bramlett wrote: > jaws 14 supports windows 8 so if you have that version of jaws, the type of > > laptop won't matter. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Winona Brackett > Sent: Wednesday, March 20, 2013 9:44 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] New Lap Top > > Hello, > > I am in the process of getting a new lap top. I have realized there are so > many different brands and models it is overwhelming and hard to know which > computer will work the best for me. I am looking for a windows computer > that I can download JAWS 14, Dancing Dots (A music software) and Duxbury > too. Does anyone know how well Dancing Dots works with Windows 7 or Windows > > 8? What are your experiences with Duxbury on a Windows 7 or 8 computer? How > > accessible is JAWS 14 with Windows 8? What are the Pros and conns of Windows > > 8? > > Thanks, > Winona > > Sent from my iPod > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jay.rasmussen%40gmail.com > hello I first got a 17 inch laptop from dell. but someone took out the application key. so i returned it . the new 17 inch laptopfrom HP.no zone space. but you can use bump dots. the f9 key is volume down , f10 is volume up, f11 is the mute key, and f12 is internet key. to use the function keys. if you are a JAWS user to get the time. you push on thefn key and jaws key and the f12 key to get time the sound is great, the speakers are some of the top ones on the market. If you are a student don't forget to tell them you are a student to get a discount. Jay Rasmussen From carrie.gilmer at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 13:48:50 2013 From: carrie.gilmer at gmail.com (Carrie Gilmer) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 08:48:50 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Message-ID: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> Hello all~ I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our life!, I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) as a reference!!!!!!!! I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems with each article are needed. We must get these off the internet. Contact for complaint for eHow: I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, WA 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 Best, Carrie Sent from my iPad From joshkart12 at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 13:54:19 2013 From: joshkart12 at gmail.com (Josh Gregory) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 09:54:19 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> Message-ID: This is, unfortunately, the basis for the sided world's looking down upon us. Education is the best key, and it needs to begin as soon as It can. Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2013, at 9:48 AM, Carrie Gilmer wrote: > Hello all~ > I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our life!, I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) as a reference!!!!!!!! > > I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems with each article are needed. > > We must get these off the internet. > > Contact for complaint for eHow: > > I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: > > Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, WA 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 > > Best, > > Carrie > > Sent from my iPad > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com From herekittykat2 at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 15:17:17 2013 From: herekittykat2 at gmail.com (Jewel) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 11:17:17 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Fetal pig dissection Message-ID: <674D58BD-F8B8-4209-B56A-8CF7932616AB@gmail.com> Dear all, My Biology class has started dissecting fetal pigs, and I need to study over spring break. However, all the suggested resources are for studying based on images and drawings. Does anyone know of a website or other resource for studying fetal pig anatomy based on descriptions and location words like dorsal and vernial? For example, the thyroid gland is a small dark red organ that feels kind of like a slightly swollen tick, found in the throat next to the trachea. Hopefully, jewel Sent from my iPhone From jsoro620 at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 17:55:14 2013 From: jsoro620 at gmail.com (Joe) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 13:55:14 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> Message-ID: <01cf01ce2726$686a23b0$393e6b10$@gmail.com> I will add my own support to the complaint, not because of the content but because people should not be quoated out of context. Unfortunately, we cannot dictate how people are depicted, as negative and frustrating as that may feel, but we can put out our own material to combat misconceptions. I wrote my own piece a few months back and share it here in case anyone wants to promote their own positive portrayals about blindness: http://joeorozco.com/blog_facts_about_blindness_according_to_me Joe -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie Gilmer Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Hello all~ I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our life!, I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) as a reference!!!!!!!! I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems with each article are needed. We must get these off the internet. Contact for complaint for eHow: I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, WA 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 Best, Carrie Sent from my iPad _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 21 18:00:37 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2013 14:00:37 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> Message-ID: <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> Where are the articles? -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie Gilmer Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Hello all~ I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our life!, I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) as a reference!!!!!!!! I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems with each article are needed. We must get these off the internet. Contact for complaint for eHow: I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, WA 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 Best, Carrie Sent from my iPad _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From carrie.gilmer at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 18:31:50 2013 From: carrie.gilmer at gmail.com (Carrie Gilmer) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 13:31:50 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is also titled "how to feed a blind person" What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. Carrie Sent from my iPad On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" wrote: > Where are the articles? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie Gilmer > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM > To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students mailing > list > Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello all~ > I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow > concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad > perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last night > and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that I > was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely unaware, > and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed > messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our life!, > I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also > "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the > table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind > person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and > ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) > as a reference!!!!!!!! > > I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write > complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument specific > to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems with > each article are needed. > > We must get these off the internet. > > Contact for complaint for eHow: > > I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT > BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it one for > each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and > reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per their > policy on misinformation!: > > Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at eHow, > Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, WA > 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint Assistance > Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer Affairs > may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 > > Best, > > Carrie > > Sent from my iPad > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com From carrie.gilmer at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 18:37:58 2013 From: carrie.gilmer at gmail.com (Carrie Gilmer) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 13:37:58 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <01cf01ce2726$686a23b0$393e6b10$@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <01cf01ce2726$686a23b0$393e6b10$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Who is dictating Joe? Very strange terminology to me. When people are stereotyped, generalized falsely, negatively, portrayed with bias, etc...this is a country of free speech...protest, dismay, correction is not only acceptable and the right of any respondent or charging party, some have through history argued it is a moral responsibility to discard silence in the face of prejudice and discrimination. Carrie Sent from my iPad On Mar 22, 2013, at 12:55 PM, "Joe" wrote: > I will add my own support to the complaint, not because of the content but > because people should not be quoated out of context. Unfortunately, we > cannot dictate how people are depicted, as negative and frustrating as that > may feel, but we can put out our own material to combat misconceptions. I > wrote my own piece a few months back and share it here in case anyone wants > to promote their own positive portrayals about blindness: > > http://joeorozco.com/blog_facts_about_blindness_according_to_me > > Joe > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie Gilmer > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM > To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students mailing > list > Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello all~ > I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow > concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad > perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last night > and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that I > was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely unaware, > and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed > messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our life!, > I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also > "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the > table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind > person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and > ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) > as a reference!!!!!!!! > > I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write > complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument specific > to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems with > each article are needed. > > We must get these off the internet. > > Contact for complaint for eHow: > > I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT > BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it one for > each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and > reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per their > policy on misinformation!: > > Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at eHow, > Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, WA > 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint Assistance > Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer Affairs > may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 > > Best, > > Carrie > > Sent from my iPad > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 21 18:41:09 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2013 14:41:09 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <01cf01ce2726$686a23b0$393e6b10$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <001d01ce2663$a8619bb0$f924d310$@gmail.com> Where si the articles? I didn't see a link? -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie Gilmer Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 2:38 PM To: jsoro620 at gmail.com; National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Who is dictating Joe? Very strange terminology to me. When people are stereotyped, generalized falsely, negatively, portrayed with bias, etc...this is a country of free speech...protest, dismay, correction is not only acceptable and the right of any respondent or charging party, some have through history argued it is a moral responsibility to discard silence in the face of prejudice and discrimination. Carrie Sent from my iPad On Mar 22, 2013, at 12:55 PM, "Joe" wrote: > I will add my own support to the complaint, not because of the content > but because people should not be quoated out of context. > Unfortunately, we cannot dictate how people are depicted, as negative > and frustrating as that may feel, but we can put out our own material > to combat misconceptions. I wrote my own piece a few months back and > share it here in case anyone wants to promote their own positive portrayals about blindness: > > http://joeorozco.com/blog_facts_about_blindness_according_to_me > > Joe > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie > Gilmer > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM > To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students > mailing list > Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello all~ > I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on > eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically > bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them > last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend > pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! > I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in the > midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal > from the article or from our life!, I believe it was pulled from. The > same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in the same article! > one of the articles is titled "How to set the table for a blind > person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind person"...They are > Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and ideas! They > appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) as a reference!!!!!!!! > > I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write > complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument > specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters > naming problems with each article are needed. > > We must get these off the internet. > > Contact for complaint for eHow: > > I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE > ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be > doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get > enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down > permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: > > Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at > eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, > Kirkland, WA 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the > Complaint Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the > Dept. of Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, > Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 > > Best, > > Carrie > > Sent from my iPad > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Fri Mar 22 18:41:01 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 18:41:01 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com>, <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> Message-ID: Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a terrible picture of blindness! I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and before! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is also titled "how to feed a blind person" What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. Carrie Sent from my iPad On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" wrote: > Where are the articles? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie Gilmer > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM > To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students mailing > list > Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello all~ > I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow > concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad > perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last night > and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that I > was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely unaware, > and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed > messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our life!, > I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also > "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the > table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind > person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and > ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) > as a reference!!!!!!!! > > I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write > complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument specific > to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems with > each article are needed. > > We must get these off the internet. > > Contact for complaint for eHow: > > I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT > BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it one for > each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and > reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per their > policy on misinformation!: > > Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at eHow, > Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, WA > 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint Assistance > Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer Affairs > may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 > > Best, > > Carrie > > Sent from my iPad > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com From brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 18:43:39 2013 From: brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com (Brandon Keith Biggs) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 11:43:39 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com><000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> Message-ID: <35961A8F49104DEEBD70AA0DF1132F6B@BrandonsLaptop2> Hello, I think these are just a gag and are trolling you. They are too ridiculous to be true... LOL Thanks, Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: Carrie Gilmer Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 11:31 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is also titled "how to feed a blind person" What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. Carrie Sent from my iPad On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" wrote: > Where are the articles? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie Gilmer > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM > To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students mailing > list > Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello all~ > I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow > concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad > perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last > night > and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that I > was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely > unaware, > and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed > messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our life!, > I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also > "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set > the > table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind > person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and > ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the > Blind) > as a reference!!!!!!!! > > I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write > complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument > specific > to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems > with > each article are needed. > > We must get these off the internet. > > Contact for complaint for eHow: > > I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT > BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it one > for > each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and > reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per their > policy on misinformation!: > > Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at eHow, > Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, WA > 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint Assistance > Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer Affairs > may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 > > Best, > > Carrie > > Sent from my iPad > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Fri Mar 22 18:54:03 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 18:54:03 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] Getting our message out there, and changing views about blindness! Message-ID: Hi all. I just thought of a question, and maybe this would give someone in the organization an idea about getting our message out there! As I was looking at this EHow thread, I was getting upset because, it seems that these people haven't seen what we can do! It dawned on me, that we haven't been proactive in getting the truth out there! Washington seminar would be a good place to start! Why is it, that most congressional events are broadcast on CSpan, yet the parts of the seminar, where we testify before them doesn't get videoed? We need to pressure the people at CSpan to broadcast our testimonys, because that way, the sighted people that watch CSpan can see what we can do, and learn from us! Also, it will give me a chance to hear what's going on, since I'm not able to attend. Thanks, Joshua From carrie.gilmer at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 18:56:27 2013 From: carrie.gilmer at gmail.com (Carrie Gilmer) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 13:56:27 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> Message-ID: <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You think we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come from? how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is you? Carrie Sent from my iPad On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a terrible picture of blindness! > I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and before! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html > > There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is also titled "how to feed a blind person" > > What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. > The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. > Carrie > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" wrote: > >> Where are the articles? >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie Gilmer >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students mailing >> list >> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hello all~ >> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow >> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last night >> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that I >> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely unaware, >> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed >> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our life!, >> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also >> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the >> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and >> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) >> as a reference!!!!!!!! >> >> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument specific >> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems with >> each article are needed. >> >> We must get these off the internet. >> >> Contact for complaint for eHow: >> >> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT >> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it one for >> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per their >> policy on misinformation!: >> >> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at eHow, >> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, WA >> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint Assistance >> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer Affairs >> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 >> >> Best, >> >> Carrie >> >> Sent from my iPad >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com From turtlepower17 at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 19:11:05 2013 From: turtlepower17 at gmail.com (Desiree Oudinot) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 15:11:05 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <001d01ce2663$a8619bb0$f924d310$@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <01cf01ce2726$686a23b0$393e6b10$@gmail.com> <001d01ce2663$a8619bb0$f924d310$@gmail.com> Message-ID: I'm not seeing these articles either. Were they taken down already? On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: > Where si the articles? I didn't see a link? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie Gilmer > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 2:38 PM > To: jsoro620 at gmail.com; National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Who is dictating Joe? Very strange terminology to me. When people are > stereotyped, generalized falsely, negatively, portrayed with bias, > etc...this is a country of free speech...protest, dismay, correction is not > only acceptable and the right of any respondent or charging party, some > have > through history argued it is a moral responsibility to discard silence in > the face of prejudice and discrimination. > Carrie > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 12:55 PM, "Joe" wrote: > >> I will add my own support to the complaint, not because of the content >> but because people should not be quoated out of context. >> Unfortunately, we cannot dictate how people are depicted, as negative >> and frustrating as that may feel, but we can put out our own material >> to combat misconceptions. I wrote my own piece a few months back and >> share it here in case anyone wants to promote their own positive > portrayals about blindness: >> >> http://joeorozco.com/blog_facts_about_blindness_according_to_me >> >> Joe >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >> Gilmer >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing list >> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hello all~ >> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >> eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically >> bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them >> last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend >> pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! >> I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in the >> midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal >> from the article or from our life!, I believe it was pulled from. The >> same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in the same article! >> one of the articles is titled "How to set the table for a blind >> person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind person"...They are >> Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and ideas! They >> appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) as a > reference!!!!!!!! >> >> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >> specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters >> naming problems with each article are needed. >> >> We must get these off the internet. >> >> Contact for complaint for eHow: >> >> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >> doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get >> enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down >> permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: >> >> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >> eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, >> Kirkland, WA 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the >> Complaint Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the >> Dept. of Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, >> Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 >> >> Best, >> >> Carrie >> >> Sent from my iPad >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.c >> om >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm >> ail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/turtlepower17%40gmail.com > From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Fri Mar 22 19:11:49 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 19:11:49 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> , <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> Message-ID: I don't want to read their trash. If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and give them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB philosophy! Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, and have never seen a blind person do anything independently! We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread that I just started. Thanks, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You think we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come from? how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is you? Carrie Sent from my iPad On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a terrible picture of blindness! > I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and before! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html > > There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is also titled "how to feed a blind person" > > What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. > The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. > Carrie > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" wrote: > >> Where are the articles? >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie Gilmer >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students mailing >> list >> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hello all~ >> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow >> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last night >> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that I >> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely unaware, >> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed >> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our life!, >> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also >> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the >> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and >> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) >> as a reference!!!!!!!! >> >> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument specific >> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems with >> each article are needed. >> >> We must get these off the internet. >> >> Contact for complaint for eHow: >> >> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT >> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it one for >> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per their >> policy on misinformation!: >> >> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at eHow, >> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, WA >> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint Assistance >> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer Affairs >> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 >> >> Best, >> >> Carrie >> >> Sent from my iPad >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu From mistydbradley at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 19:13:04 2013 From: mistydbradley at gmail.com (Misty Dawn Bradley) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 15:13:04 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com><000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com><26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> Message-ID: <926264A5F79240398E1FD4904D631458@acerd37f251f21> Hi all, If there is a place for comments on these articles, it might be good for people to go and make a comment about blind people and how they are independent and can take care of themselves. Misty ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carrie Gilmer" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 2:56 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You think > we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go > on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem > of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come > from? how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to > correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are > not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind > person's employment or education worth your time? what if that blind > person is you? > Carrie > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > >> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a terrible >> picture of blindness! >> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >> before! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >> >> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is >> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >> >> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident >> practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 >> year old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or >> a normal person born blind. >> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >> Carrie >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >> wrote: >> >>> Where are the articles? >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >>> Gilmer >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >>> mailing >>> list >>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hello all~ >>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow >>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last >>> night >>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that >>> I >>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely >>> unaware, >>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed >>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our >>> life!, >>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also >>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set >>> the >>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language >>> and >>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the >>> Blind) >>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>> >>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >>> specific >>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems >>> with >>> each article are needed. >>> >>> We must get these off the internet. >>> >>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>> >>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT >>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it one >>> for >>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per >>> their >>> policy on misinformation!: >>> >>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at eHow, >>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, WA >>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint Assistance >>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer >>> Affairs >>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> Carrie >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.com From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Fri Mar 22 19:16:42 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 19:16:42 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <926264A5F79240398E1FD4904D631458@acerd37f251f21> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com><000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com><26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com>, <926264A5F79240398E1FD4904D631458@acerd37f251f21> Message-ID: Yeah, but if there's a captcha, how can that work? There should be other ways to block spam, besides making Website forms inaccessible to us! Good grief! That's also another reason why we can't get our message out on some sites! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Misty Dawn Bradley [mistydbradley at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 2:13 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Hi all, If there is a place for comments on these articles, it might be good for people to go and make a comment about blind people and how they are independent and can take care of themselves. Misty ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carrie Gilmer" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 2:56 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You think > we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go > on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem > of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come > from? how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to > correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are > not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind > person's employment or education worth your time? what if that blind > person is you? > Carrie > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > >> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a terrible >> picture of blindness! >> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >> before! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >> >> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is >> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >> >> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident >> practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 >> year old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or >> a normal person born blind. >> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >> Carrie >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >> wrote: >> >>> Where are the articles? >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >>> Gilmer >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >>> mailing >>> list >>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hello all~ >>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow >>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last >>> night >>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that >>> I >>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely >>> unaware, >>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed >>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our >>> life!, >>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also >>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set >>> the >>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language >>> and >>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the >>> Blind) >>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>> >>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >>> specific >>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems >>> with >>> each article are needed. >>> >>> We must get these off the internet. >>> >>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>> >>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT >>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it one >>> for >>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per >>> their >>> policy on misinformation!: >>> >>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at eHow, >>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, WA >>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint Assistance >>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer >>> Affairs >>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> Carrie >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com From joshkart12 at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 19:18:29 2013 From: joshkart12 at gmail.com (Josh Gregory) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 15:18:29 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> Message-ID: <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and when I get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what they're like. Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > I don't want to read their trash. > If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and give them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB philosophy! > Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? > BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, and have never seen a blind person do anything independently! > We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread that I just started. > Thanks, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You think we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come from? how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is you? > Carrie > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > >> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a terrible picture of blindness! >> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and before! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >> >> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is also titled "how to feed a blind person" >> >> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >> Carrie >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" wrote: >> >>> Where are the articles? >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie Gilmer >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students mailing >>> list >>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hello all~ >>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow >>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last night >>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that I >>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely unaware, >>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed >>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our life!, >>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also >>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the >>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and >>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) >>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>> >>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument specific >>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems with >>> each article are needed. >>> >>> We must get these off the internet. >>> >>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>> >>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT >>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it one for >>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per their >>> policy on misinformation!: >>> >>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at eHow, >>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, WA >>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint Assistance >>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer Affairs >>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> Carrie >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 21 19:26:04 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2013 15:26:04 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> Message-ID: <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't advocate without proper information. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh Gregory Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and when I get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what they're like. Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > I don't want to read their trash. > If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and give them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB philosophy! > Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? > BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, and have never seen a blind person do anything independently! > We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread that I just started. > Thanks, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You think we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come from? how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is you? > Carrie > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > >> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a terrible picture of blindness! >> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and before! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >> >> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is also titled "how to feed a blind person" >> >> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >> Carrie >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" wrote: >> >>> Where are the articles? >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie Gilmer >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students mailing >>> list >>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hello all~ >>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow >>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last night >>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that I >>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely unaware, >>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed >>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our life!, >>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also >>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the >>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and >>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) >>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>> >>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument specific >>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems with >>> each article are needed. >>> >>> We must get these off the internet. >>> >>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>> >>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT >>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it one for >>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per their >>> policy on misinformation!: >>> >>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at eHow, >>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, WA >>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint Assistance >>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer Affairs >>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> Carrie >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co m >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o nmicrosoft.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co m > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Fri Mar 22 19:26:07 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 19:26:07 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> , <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> Message-ID: Why read their negativity, when I already know about what they believe, because I hear the whole "blind people can't care for themselves, and must be a charity case for the state," nonsense every day, and I hear the same attitudes from my own family! I know the view already, so I can educate them and tell them different! Also, after 6 months of experience, listening to the ACB's side of things, I'm prepared to show them the truth! Also, I'm tired of the discrimination against us, which is promoted by the attitudes on the EHow site! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Josh Gregory [joshkart12 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 2:18 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and when I get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what they're like. Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > I don't want to read their trash. > If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and give them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB philosophy! > Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? > BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, and have never seen a blind person do anything independently! > We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread that I just started. > Thanks, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You think we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come from? how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is you? > Carrie > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > >> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a terrible picture of blindness! >> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and before! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >> >> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is also titled "how to feed a blind person" >> >> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >> Carrie >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" wrote: >> >>> Where are the articles? >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie Gilmer >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students mailing >>> list >>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hello all~ >>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow >>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last night >>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that I >>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely unaware, >>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed >>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our life!, >>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also >>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the >>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and >>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) >>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>> >>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument specific >>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems with >>> each article are needed. >>> >>> We must get these off the internet. >>> >>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>> >>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT >>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it one for >>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per their >>> policy on misinformation!: >>> >>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at eHow, >>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, WA >>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint Assistance >>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer Affairs >>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> Carrie >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 21 19:30:10 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2013 15:30:10 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> , <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> Message-ID: <002401ce266a$80f91740$82eb45c0$@gmail.com> In the book called TheArt of War, it always counsels you to know your the enemy. Always learn what you can about your opponent. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:26 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Why read their negativity, when I already know about what they believe, because I hear the whole "blind people can't care for themselves, and must be a charity case for the state," nonsense every day, and I hear the same attitudes from my own family! I know the view already, so I can educate them and tell them different! Also, after 6 months of experience, listening to the ACB's side of things, I'm prepared to show them the truth! Also, I'm tired of the discrimination against us, which is promoted by the attitudes on the EHow site! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Josh Gregory [joshkart12 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 2:18 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and when I get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what they're like. Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > I don't want to read their trash. > If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and give them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB philosophy! > Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? > BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, and have never seen a blind person do anything independently! > We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread that I just started. > Thanks, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer > [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You think we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come from? how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is you? > Carrie > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > >> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a terrible picture of blindness! >> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and before! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >> >> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is also titled "how to feed a blind person" >> >> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >> Carrie >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" wrote: >> >>> Where are the articles? >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >>> Gilmer >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >>> mailing list >>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hello all~ >>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >>> eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically >>> bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them >>> last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend >>> pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another >>> one! I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in >>> the midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate >>> portrayal from the article or from our life!, I believe it was >>> pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in >>> the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the >>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic >>> language and ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) as a reference!!!!!!!! >>> >>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>> argument specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so >>> letters naming problems with each article are needed. >>> >>> We must get these off the internet. >>> >>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>> >>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>> doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get >>> enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>> permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: >>> >>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>> eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, >>> Kirkland, WA 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the >>> Complaint Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of >>> the Dept. of Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, >>> Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> Carrie >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2 >>> %40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40 >>> gmail.com >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pcc >> uaedu.onmicrosoft.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40g >> mail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > a.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail > .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o nmicrosoft.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From joshkart12 at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 19:30:57 2013 From: joshkart12 at gmail.com (Josh Gregory) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 15:30:57 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4C897A30-051D-444C-9623-4CCB1FFE6515@gmail.com> Joshua: but if you read these articles, and you can somehow comment, you can help to educate a much larger slice of the population then if you could buy just educating your own family or state. Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:26 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > Why read their negativity, when I already know about what they believe, because I hear the whole "blind people can't care for themselves, and must be a charity case for the state," nonsense every day, and I hear the same attitudes from my own family! > I know the view already, so I can educate them and tell them different! > Also, after 6 months of experience, listening to the ACB's side of things, I'm prepared to show them the truth! > Also, I'm tired of the discrimination against us, which is promoted by the attitudes on the EHow site! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Josh Gregory [joshkart12 at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 2:18 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and when I get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what they're like. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > >> I don't want to read their trash. >> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and give them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB philosophy! >> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, and have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread that I just started. >> Thanks, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You think we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come from? how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is you? >> Carrie >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: >> >>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a terrible picture of blindness! >>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and before! >>> Blessings, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>> >>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>> >>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>> Carrie >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" wrote: >>> >>>> Where are the articles? >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie Gilmer >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students mailing >>>> list >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Hello all~ >>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow >>>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last night >>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that I >>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely unaware, >>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed >>>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our life!, >>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also >>>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the >>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and >>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) >>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>> >>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >>>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument specific >>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems with >>>> each article are needed. >>>> >>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>> >>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>> >>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT >>>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it one for >>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per their >>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>> >>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at eHow, >>>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, WA >>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint Assistance >>>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer Affairs >>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 >>>> >>>> Best, >>>> >>>> Carrie >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com From mistydbradley at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 19:34:57 2013 From: mistydbradley at gmail.com (Misty Dawn Bradley) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 15:34:57 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com><000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com><26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com><98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, I plan to also, and I plan to look underneath the articles and see if there is a place to leave public comments. Also, there may be a way for someone to become a contributor at the EZine website and write their own articles debunking the myth that blind people are not fully capable of living their lives independently. I may look into it when I have some extra time and see how one can go about writing their own articles and posting them on EZine articles. This could be a good way to educate the public, since EZine Articles is a popular site that many people refer to for many topics. Misty ----- Original Message ----- From: "Josh Gregory" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say > that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you > can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and > when I get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see > what they're like. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > >> I don't want to read their trash. >> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and give >> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >> philosophy! >> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, >> and have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread that >> I just started. >> Thanks, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You >> think we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them >> to go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas >> come from? how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are >> not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind >> person's employment or education worth your time? what if that blind >> person is you? >> Carrie >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: >> >>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>> terrible picture of blindness! >>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >>> before! >>> Blessings, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>> >>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is >>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>> >>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident >>> practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 >>> year old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health >>> or a normal person born blind. >>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>> Carrie >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Where are the articles? >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >>>> Gilmer >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >>>> mailing >>>> list >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Hello all~ >>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow >>>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last >>>> night >>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that >>>> I >>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely >>>> unaware, >>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed >>>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our >>>> life!, >>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine >>>> also >>>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set >>>> the >>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language >>>> and >>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the >>>> Blind) >>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>> >>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >>>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >>>> specific >>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems >>>> with >>>> each article are needed. >>>> >>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>> >>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>> >>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT >>>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it >>>> one for >>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per >>>> their >>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>> >>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>>> eHow, >>>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, >>>> WA >>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>> Assistance >>>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer >>>> Affairs >>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>> 952-5210 >>>> >>>> Best, >>>> >>>> Carrie >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.com From mistydbradley at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 19:36:45 2013 From: mistydbradley at gmail.com (Misty Dawn Bradley) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 15:36:45 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com><000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com><26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com><98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com><9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Yes, this is true. It is also important that when you are arguing against someone else's argument that you can effectively counter their claims. Misty ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, and to > their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily refute them if > you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't advocate without > proper information. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say > that > it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you can > assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and when > I > get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what > they're > like. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > >> I don't want to read their trash. >> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and give > them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB philosophy! >> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, >> and > have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread that > I just started. >> Thanks, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer > [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You >> think > we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go > on, > unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of > employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come from? > how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct or > stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth my > time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's > employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is you? >> Carrie >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: >> >>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>> terrible > picture of blindness! >>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and > before! >>> Blessings, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer > [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>> >>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is > also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>> >>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no > distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident > practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 year > old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a > normal person born blind. >>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>> Carrie >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" > wrote: >>> >>>> Where are the articles? >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie > Gilmer >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students > mailing >>>> list >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Hello all~ >>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow >>>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last > night >>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that > I >>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely > unaware, >>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed >>>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our > life!, >>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine >>>> also >>>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set > the >>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language > and >>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the > Blind) >>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>> >>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >>>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument > specific >>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems > with >>>> each article are needed. >>>> >>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>> >>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>> >>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT >>>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it >>>> one > for >>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per > their >>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>> >>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>>> eHow, >>>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, >>>> WA >>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>> Assistance >>>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer > Affairs >>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>> 952-5210 >>>> >>>> Best, >>>> >>>> Carrie >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co > m >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o > nmicrosoft.com >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co > m >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.com From arielle71 at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 19:37:03 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 13:37:03 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <002401ce266a$80f91740$82eb45c0$@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002401ce266a$80f91740$82eb45c0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: A brief excerpt of the trash, (from an article titled "Challenges of being blind": The 1995 census showed that 2 million people in the United States are either completely sightless or have partially impaired sight. Blind people face challenges that the sighted do not have to overcome, and are often limited in their ability to live life. Environment Blind people can have difficulty interacting with their environment. Because it can become difficult to perceive where one is and to get from one place to another, movement can become restricted, leading to having little contact with the surrounding world. While other senses can be enhanced, this can be offset by a tendency toward over-protection. To be fair, the article does go on to cite unemployment and prejudice as other challenges blind people face, but the negativity encapsulated in these initial sentences eclipse any accuracy in the latter part of the article. They also have articles on how to feed and care for blind people. I would like to assume that these refer to someone who needs custodial care for some other reason (i.e. a post-operative patient) who also just so happens to be blind. But still, these articles drip with demeaning language. They instruct the caretaker to take out the trash regularly, watch out for things the blind person might have spilled, restock food and supplies in the house, and to never give a blind person a full glass of a beverage. The implication is that left to our own devices, we would be living in pig sties with overflowing trash bins and pizza crusts lying everywhere. A few of us may live like this, but most of us don't and a few sighted people live like this too. Not to mention many of us regularly empty our own garbage and go to the grocery store to restock our own kitchen cupboards. Most of the suggestions are either unnecessary, or they are good suggestions for taking care of any convalescent regardless of blindness. Arielle On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: > In the book called TheArt of War, it always counsels you to know your the > enemy. Always learn what you can about your opponent. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:26 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Why read their negativity, when I already know about what they believe, > because I hear the whole "blind people can't care for themselves, and must > be a charity case for the state," nonsense every day, and I hear the same > attitudes from my own family! > I know the view already, so I can educate them and tell them different! > Also, after 6 months of experience, listening to the ACB's side of things, > I'm prepared to show them the truth! > Also, I'm tired of the discrimination against us, which is promoted by the > attitudes on the EHow site! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Josh Gregory > [joshkart12 at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 2:18 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say that > it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you can > assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and when I > get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what > they're > like. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > >> I don't want to read their trash. >> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and give > them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB philosophy! >> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, >> and > have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread that > I just started. >> Thanks, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You >> think > we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go on, > unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of > employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come from? > how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct or > stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth my > time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's > employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is you? >> Carrie >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: >> >>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>> terrible > picture of blindness! >>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and > before! >>> Blessings, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>> >>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is > also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>> >>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no > distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident > practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 year > old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a > normal person born blind. >>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>> Carrie >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" > wrote: >>> >>>> Where are the articles? >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >>>> Gilmer >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >>>> mailing list >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Hello all~ >>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >>>> eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically >>>> bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them >>>> last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend >>>> pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another >>>> one! I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in >>>> the midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate >>>> portrayal from the article or from our life!, I believe it was >>>> pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in >>>> the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the >>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic >>>> language and ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National > Federation FOR the Blind) as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>> >>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>> argument specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so >>>> letters naming problems with each article are needed. >>>> >>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>> >>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>> >>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>>> doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get >>>> enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>> permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: >>>> >>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>>> eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, >>>> Kirkland, WA 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the >>>> Complaint Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of >>>> the Dept. of Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, >>>> Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 >>>> >>>> Best, >>>> >>>> Carrie >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2 >>>> %40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40 >>>> gmail.com >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pcc >>> uaedu.onmicrosoft.com >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40g >>> mail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >> a.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail >> .com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o > nmicrosoft.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From mistydbradley at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 19:35:40 2013 From: mistydbradley at gmail.com (Misty Dawn Bradley) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 15:35:40 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com><000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com><26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com><98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com><9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> Hi, I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my earlier post. Misty ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, and to > their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily refute them if > you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't advocate without > proper information. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say > that > it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you can > assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and when > I > get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what > they're > like. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > >> I don't want to read their trash. >> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and give > them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB philosophy! >> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, >> and > have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread that > I just started. >> Thanks, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer > [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You >> think > we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go > on, > unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of > employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come from? > how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct or > stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth my > time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's > employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is you? >> Carrie >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: >> >>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>> terrible > picture of blindness! >>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and > before! >>> Blessings, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer > [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>> >>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is > also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>> >>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no > distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident > practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 year > old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a > normal person born blind. >>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>> Carrie >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" > wrote: >>> >>>> Where are the articles? >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie > Gilmer >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students > mailing >>>> list >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Hello all~ >>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow >>>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last > night >>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that > I >>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely > unaware, >>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed >>>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our > life!, >>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine >>>> also >>>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set > the >>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language > and >>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the > Blind) >>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>> >>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >>>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument > specific >>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems > with >>>> each article are needed. >>>> >>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>> >>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>> >>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT >>>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it >>>> one > for >>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per > their >>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>> >>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>>> eHow, >>>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, >>>> WA >>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>> Assistance >>>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer > Affairs >>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>> 952-5210 >>>> >>>> Best, >>>> >>>> Carrie >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co > m >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o > nmicrosoft.com >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co > m >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.com From joshkart12 at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 19:39:42 2013 From: joshkart12 at gmail.com (Josh Gregory) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 15:39:42 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> Message-ID: Not a bad idea! I wish you good luck with this endeavor. Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:34 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley wrote: > Hi, > I plan to also, and I plan to look underneath the articles and see if there is a place to leave public comments. Also, there may be a way for someone to become a contributor at the EZine website and write their own articles debunking the myth that blind people are not fully capable of living their lives independently. I may look into it when I have some extra time and see how one can go about writing their own articles and posting them on EZine articles. This could be a good way to educate the public, since EZine Articles is a popular site that many people refer to for many topics. > Misty > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Josh Gregory" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > >> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and when I get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what they're like. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: >> >>> I don't want to read their trash. >>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and give them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB philosophy! >>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, and have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread that I just started. >>> Thanks, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You think we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come from? how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is you? >>> Carrie >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: >>> >>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a terrible picture of blindness! >>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and before! >>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>> >>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>> >>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" wrote: >>>> >>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie Gilmer >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students mailing >>>>> list >>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> Hello all~ >>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow >>>>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>>>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last night >>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that I >>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely unaware, >>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed >>>>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our life!, >>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also >>>>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the >>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and >>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) >>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>> >>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >>>>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument specific >>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems with >>>>> each article are needed. >>>>> >>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>> >>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>> >>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT >>>>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it one for >>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>>>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per their >>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>> >>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at eHow, >>>>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, WA >>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint Assistance >>>>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer Affairs >>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 >>>>> >>>>> Best, >>>>> >>>>> Carrie >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com From joshkart12 at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 13:35:45 2013 From: joshkart12 at gmail.com (Josh Gregory) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 09:35:45 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Oral Care for Blind Patients | eHow.com Message-ID: <34324FA0-0580-426E-AF60-7CFECF1F21ED@gmail.com> Now, don't be upset, but I thought I'd send this so you could get an idea of what we're talking about. http://www.ehow.com/facts_7330488_oral-care-blind-patients.html From joshkart12 at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 19:44:47 2013 From: joshkart12 at gmail.com (Josh Gregory) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 15:44:47 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002401ce266a$80f91740$82eb45c0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <3B538684-EAE1-4126-AC10-AC82E4829EA2@gmail.com> Hi Arielle, I can see this if it were in regard to somebody that was perhaps wheelchair-bound and lower functioning, I am mostly wheelchair-bound yes, but I can function normally. Still, these articles are quite depressing to read, but if we read them, we may be able to assist in educating people. Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:37 PM, Arielle Silverman wrote: > A brief excerpt of the trash, (from an article titled "Challenges of > being blind": > > The 1995 census showed that 2 million people in the United States are > either completely sightless or have partially impaired sight. Blind > people face challenges that the sighted do not have to overcome, and > are often limited in their ability to live life. > > Environment > Blind people can have difficulty interacting with their environment. > Because it can become difficult to perceive where one is and to get > from one place to another, movement can become restricted, leading to > having little contact with the surrounding world. While other senses > can be enhanced, this can be offset by a tendency toward > over-protection. > > To be fair, the article does go on to cite unemployment and prejudice > as other challenges blind people face, but the negativity encapsulated > in these initial sentences eclipse any accuracy in the latter part of > the article. > They also have articles on how to feed and care for blind people. I > would like to assume that these refer to someone who needs custodial > care for some other reason (i.e. a post-operative patient) who also > just so happens to be blind. But still, these articles drip with > demeaning language. They instruct the caretaker to take out the trash > regularly, watch out for things the blind person might have spilled, > restock food and supplies in the house, and to never give a blind > person a full glass of a beverage. The implication is that left to our > own devices, we would be living in pig sties with overflowing trash > bins and pizza crusts lying everywhere. A few of us may live like > this, but most of us don't and a few sighted people live like this > too. Not to mention many of us regularly empty our own garbage and go > to the grocery store to restock our own kitchen cupboards. Most of the > suggestions are either unnecessary, or they are good suggestions for > taking care of any convalescent regardless of blindness. > Arielle > > On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: >> In the book called TheArt of War, it always counsels you to know your the >> enemy. Always learn what you can about your opponent. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:26 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Why read their negativity, when I already know about what they believe, >> because I hear the whole "blind people can't care for themselves, and must >> be a charity case for the state," nonsense every day, and I hear the same >> attitudes from my own family! >> I know the view already, so I can educate them and tell them different! >> Also, after 6 months of experience, listening to the ACB's side of things, >> I'm prepared to show them the truth! >> Also, I'm tired of the discrimination against us, which is promoted by the >> attitudes on the EHow site! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Josh Gregory >> [joshkart12 at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 2:18 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say that >> it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you can >> assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and when I >> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >> they're >> like. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: >> >>> I don't want to read their trash. >>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and give >> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB philosophy! >>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, >>> and >> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread that >> I just started. >>> Thanks, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You >>> think >> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go on, >> unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of >> employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come from? >> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct or >> stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth my >> time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's >> employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is you? >>> Carrie >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: >>> >>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>> terrible >> picture of blindness! >>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >> before! >>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>> >>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is >> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>> >>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident >> practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 year >> old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a >> normal person born blind. >>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >>>>> Gilmer >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >>>>> mailing list >>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> Hello all~ >>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >>>>> eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically >>>>> bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them >>>>> last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend >>>>> pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another >>>>> one! I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in >>>>> the midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate >>>>> portrayal from the article or from our life!, I believe it was >>>>> pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in >>>>> the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the >>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic >>>>> language and ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National >> Federation FOR the Blind) as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>> >>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>> argument specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so >>>>> letters naming problems with each article are needed. >>>>> >>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>> >>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>> >>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>>>> doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get >>>>> enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>> permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: >>>>> >>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>>>> eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, >>>>> Kirkland, WA 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the >>>>> Complaint Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of >>>>> the Dept. of Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, >>>>> Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 >>>>> >>>>> Best, >>>>> >>>>> Carrie >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2 >>>>> %40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40 >>>>> gmail.com >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pcc >>>> uaedu.onmicrosoft.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40g >>>> mail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >>> a.edu >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail >>> .com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o >> nmicrosoft.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com From joshkart12 at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 19:58:02 2013 From: joshkart12 at gmail.com (Josh Gregory) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 15:58:02 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> Message-ID: <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley wrote: > Hi, > I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my earlier post. > Misty > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > >> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, and to >> their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily refute them if >> you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't advocate without >> proper information. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh Gregory >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say that >> it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you can >> assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and when I >> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what they're >> like. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: >> >>> I don't want to read their trash. >>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and give >> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB philosophy! >>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, and >> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread that >> I just started. >>> Thanks, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You think >> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go on, >> unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of >> employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come from? >> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct or >> stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth my >> time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's >> employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is you? >>> Carrie >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: >>> >>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a terrible >> picture of blindness! >>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >> before! >>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>> >>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is >> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>> >>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident >> practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 year >> old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a >> normal person born blind. >>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >> Gilmer >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing >>>>> list >>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> Hello all~ >>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow >>>>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>>>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last >> night >>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that >> I >>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely >> unaware, >>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed >>>>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our >> life!, >>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also >>>>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set >> the >>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language >> and >>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the >> Blind) >>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>> >>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >>>>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >> specific >>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems >> with >>>>> each article are needed. >>>>> >>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>> >>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>> >>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT >>>>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it one >> for >>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>>>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per >> their >>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>> >>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at eHow, >>>>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, WA >>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint Assistance >>>>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer >> Affairs >>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 >>>>> >>>>> Best, >>>>> >>>>> Carrie >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >> m >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o >> nmicrosoft.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >> m >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com From k7uij at panix.com Fri Mar 22 20:27:26 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 13:27:26 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Getting our message out there, and changing views about blindness! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: joshua: Although there is occasional testimony by Federationists before congressional committees at hearings taking place during Washington Seminar, most of the Federation activity consists of visits to offices of senators and representatives so wouldn't be covered by CSPAN. As for keeping track of what's going on, the best way is to save your money and attend yourself. If it is important enough to you, you'll find a way. Being active at the local and state level is a good start. Mike Freeman sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2013, at 11:54, Joshua Lester wrote: > Hi all. > I just thought of a question, and maybe this would give someone in the organization an idea about getting our message out there! > As I was looking at this EHow thread, I was getting upset because, it seems that these people haven't seen what we can do! > It dawned on me, that we haven't been proactive in getting the truth out there! > Washington seminar would be a good place to start! > Why is it, that most congressional events are broadcast on CSpan, yet the parts of the seminar, where we testify before them doesn't get videoed? > We need to pressure the people at CSpan to broadcast our testimonys, because that way, the sighted people that watch CSpan can see what we can do, and learn from us! > Also, it will give me a chance to hear what's going on, since I'm not able to attend. > Thanks, Joshua > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com From brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 20:27:26 2013 From: brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com (Brandon Keith Biggs) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 13:27:26 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com><000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com><26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com><98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com><9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com><002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com><774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hello, I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a room for a sighted person. Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like walking into bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white background. Make sure your TV screen is on and make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. If you wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person won't feel left out of what you are doing. If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact with a sighted person comfortably in your house. Thanks, Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: Josh Gregory Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley wrote: > Hi, > I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my > earlier post. > Misty > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" > > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > >> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, and to >> their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily refute them if >> you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't advocate without >> proper information. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh Gregory >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say >> that >> it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you can >> assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and when >> I >> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >> they're >> like. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: >> >>> I don't want to read their trash. >>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and give >> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >> philosophy! >>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, >>> and >> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread >>> that >> I just started. >>> Thanks, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You >>> think >> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go >> on, >> unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of >> employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come from? >> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct or >> stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth >> my >> time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's >> employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is >> you? >>> Carrie >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>> terrible >> picture of blindness! >>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >> before! >>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>> >>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is >> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>> >>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident >> practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 >> year >> old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a >> normal person born blind. >>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >> Gilmer >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing >>>>> list >>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> Hello all~ >>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >>>>> eHow >>>>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>>>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last >> night >>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out >>>>> that >> I >>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely >> unaware, >>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed >>>>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our >> life!, >>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine >>>>> also >>>>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to >>>>> set >> the >>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language >> and >>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the >> Blind) >>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>> >>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >>>>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >> specific >>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>> problems >> with >>>>> each article are needed. >>>>> >>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>> >>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>> >>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>> ABOUT >>>>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it >>>>> one >> for >>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>>>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per >> their >>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>> >>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>>>> eHow, >>>>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, >>>>> WA >>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>> Assistance >>>>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer >> Affairs >>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>> 952-5210 >>>>> >>>>> Best, >>>>> >>>>> Carrie >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >> m >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o >> nmicrosoft.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >> m >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 20:53:58 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 16:53:58 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi all, Brandon's last post made my week! I don't think it is right for stuff like this to be available to give sighted people a false idea of what blind people are like, but I too have seen many other articles that don't make sense. (Have you seen the article about the importance of teaching ASL to blind people yet?) There are plenty of non-blindness related ones that are total trash to if you just look them up, and nothing from E-How should be taken seriously. That being said, I think I'm somewhere in between; I've recognized E-How for what it is as Brandon pointed out, but I think that there is a definite line between sensitivity and humor and in this case some of these articles do cross that line. I know I would probably give someone the whatfor if they tried to feed me or refused to give me a full glass of Coke because I'm blind, but it's just a matter of letting E-How know they should evaluate some of these grossly insensitive articles. Brandon: I know people from a music program I attend in the summers called Braille Beats who actually describe sighted people as "Light dependent." Your post reminded me of that and captured that idea perfectly. How to manage a day with a Light-ependent person. People who have the misfortune of being congenitally dependent upon light for survival need several accomodations including patience and understanding from those not afflicted by the condition. In this article I will present some everyday situations and ways you can help your light-dependent friend or family member get through the day. Driving in the car going somewhere: When the person complains about the bad driving of others, simply smile and distract him/her from the road rage. Find a topic of conversation which interests both of you, but still make sure they focus on their personal driving. Be patient with them, although nothing is really solved by getting mad at other drivers. They really can't help it sometimes. Reading their own writing: Another factor of frustration for light-dependent people is reading their own writing. Light-dependent people don't have the advantage of using a system so eligant as braille where letters are confused not too often, especially when contractions are used. Because their system is more cumbersome and they have the poor tendency to write sloppily when rushed they sometimes can't even read what they've written. They also don't have access to a refreshable display for their writing, so papers are frequently lost in the shuffle. This leads to frustration and other factors such as getting lost on the way to a destination or forgetting something they needed from the store. Try to be patient and help them remember what it is they wanted to buy, or perhaps that exit number they told you they'd need to take off the highway. In a college dorm at night: Sometimes your roommate may need to stay up later than you and in order to complete their work they may need a light. Again, be patient; if noise bothers you plug yourself into your IPod and try falling asleep to music. If the light is bothersome try to block it out; if you only have vision from one eye putting that side of your face into the pillow does the trick wonderfully. Do this, and be thankful that you don't necessarily need light to read a book or that you can turn off the screen on your laptop out of consideration for others. Okay, the last one was me grasping for straws, but you get the picture. I also didn't mean to talk down sighted people; just an attempt at humor. On 3/22/13, Brandon Keith Biggs wrote: > Hello, > I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem pretty > ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a room for a > sighted person. > > Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted > people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like walking into > > bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. > Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside and > the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into their house > even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print labels on food > and appliances aren't covered by anything so the sighted person can feel > comfortable reading the familiar labels. If there aren't already print > labels on something, make sure they are printed in at least 12 point font > with black letters on a white background. Make sure your TV screen is on and > > make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. If you > > wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person won't > feel left out of what you are doing. > If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure to > wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted person > seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. > If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact with a > sighted person comfortably in your house. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM > To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students mailing > list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley > wrote: > >> Hi, >> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >> earlier post. >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >> >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> >>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, and to >>> their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily refute them >>> if >>> you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't advocate >>> without >>> proper information. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>> Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say >>> that >>> it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you can >>> assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and when >>> >>> I >>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>> they're >>> like. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>> give >>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>> philosophy! >>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, >>>> and >>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread >>>> that >>> I just started. >>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You >>>> think >>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go >>> on, >>> unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of >>> employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come >>> from? >>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct >>> or >>> stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth >>> my >>> time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's >>> employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is >>> you? >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>> terrible >>> picture of blindness! >>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >>> before! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>> >>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is >>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>> >>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident >>> practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 >>> year >>> old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a >>> normal person born blind. >>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >>> Gilmer >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >>> mailing >>>>>> list >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >>>>>> eHow >>>>>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>>>>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last >>> night >>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out >>>>>> that >>> I >>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely >>> unaware, >>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed >>>>>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our >>> life!, >>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine >>>>>> also >>>>>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to >>>>>> set >>> the >>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language >>> and >>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the >>> Blind) >>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>> >>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >>>>>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >>> specific >>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>> problems >>> with >>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>> >>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>> >>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>> >>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>> ABOUT >>>>>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it >>>>>> one >>> for >>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>>>>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per >>> their >>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>> >>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>>>>> eHow, >>>>>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, >>>>>> >>>>>> WA >>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>> Assistance >>>>>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer >>> Affairs >>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>> m >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o >>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>> m >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From carrie.gilmer at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 21:16:30 2013 From: carrie.gilmer at gmail.com (Carrie Gilmer) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 16:16:30 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Oral Care for Blind Patients | eHow.com In-Reply-To: <34324FA0-0580-426E-AF60-7CFECF1F21ED@gmail.com> References: <34324FA0-0580-426E-AF60-7CFECF1F21ED@gmail.com> Message-ID: <66428F0B-A2E8-4301-B5EE-50B5CDD3F217@gmail.com> While these may seem like sarcastic articles from The Onion or SNL type humor to us, they are quite serious. Tens of thousands of people go to eHow for information...some of it is ridiculous and clearly wrong information. But how does one know? Only if one has some accurate knowledge base already held on the subject. When people are searching for info these days, they search the web. This comes up. People believed it enough to write it, and I can assure you not as a joke. I have seen similar before from organizations and centers for the blind, MANY TIMES...written by supposed professionals in the "field" of blindness. People who might go to this site: Parents of Blind children, especially new ones. Regular classroom teachers of blind children. Nurses in an ICU or care facility who have their first blind patient. Employers or coworkers who are curious. Someone thinking of dating or befriending "that blind person" in class, across the hall, on the bus.... Children of parents losing vision. Spouses of people losing vision. Dental office worker or hygienist with first blind patient. And on and on..... Just the titles alone could scare the beggeeebus out of anyone thinking of "what to do with that new blind person in my life"....and there are not counter articles...they are many, some give references to legitimate sources but even those for people who know are incorrect, misleading or mixed up, seriously, or quoted out of context... Carrie Sent from my iPad On Mar 22, 2013, at 8:35 AM, Josh Gregory wrote: > Now, don't be upset, but I thought I'd send this so you could get an idea of what we're talking about. > > http://www.ehow.com/facts_7330488_oral-care-blind-patients.html > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Fri Mar 22 21:32:52 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 21:32:52 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> , Message-ID: Kaiti: Wow! You attend Braille Beats? Awesome! That was a great post, BTW! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:53 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Hi all, Brandon's last post made my week! I don't think it is right for stuff like this to be available to give sighted people a false idea of what blind people are like, but I too have seen many other articles that don't make sense. (Have you seen the article about the importance of teaching ASL to blind people yet?) There are plenty of non-blindness related ones that are total trash to if you just look them up, and nothing from E-How should be taken seriously. That being said, I think I'm somewhere in between; I've recognized E-How for what it is as Brandon pointed out, but I think that there is a definite line between sensitivity and humor and in this case some of these articles do cross that line. I know I would probably give someone the whatfor if they tried to feed me or refused to give me a full glass of Coke because I'm blind, but it's just a matter of letting E-How know they should evaluate some of these grossly insensitive articles. Brandon: I know people from a music program I attend in the summers called Braille Beats who actually describe sighted people as "Light dependent." Your post reminded me of that and captured that idea perfectly. How to manage a day with a Light-ependent person. People who have the misfortune of being congenitally dependent upon light for survival need several accomodations including patience and understanding from those not afflicted by the condition. In this article I will present some everyday situations and ways you can help your light-dependent friend or family member get through the day. Driving in the car going somewhere: When the person complains about the bad driving of others, simply smile and distract him/her from the road rage. Find a topic of conversation which interests both of you, but still make sure they focus on their personal driving. Be patient with them, although nothing is really solved by getting mad at other drivers. They really can't help it sometimes. Reading their own writing: Another factor of frustration for light-dependent people is reading their own writing. Light-dependent people don't have the advantage of using a system so eligant as braille where letters are confused not too often, especially when contractions are used. Because their system is more cumbersome and they have the poor tendency to write sloppily when rushed they sometimes can't even read what they've written. They also don't have access to a refreshable display for their writing, so papers are frequently lost in the shuffle. This leads to frustration and other factors such as getting lost on the way to a destination or forgetting something they needed from the store. Try to be patient and help them remember what it is they wanted to buy, or perhaps that exit number they told you they'd need to take off the highway. In a college dorm at night: Sometimes your roommate may need to stay up later than you and in order to complete their work they may need a light. Again, be patient; if noise bothers you plug yourself into your IPod and try falling asleep to music. If the light is bothersome try to block it out; if you only have vision from one eye putting that side of your face into the pillow does the trick wonderfully. Do this, and be thankful that you don't necessarily need light to read a book or that you can turn off the screen on your laptop out of consideration for others. Okay, the last one was me grasping for straws, but you get the picture. I also didn't mean to talk down sighted people; just an attempt at humor. On 3/22/13, Brandon Keith Biggs wrote: > Hello, > I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem pretty > ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a room for a > sighted person. > > Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted > people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like walking into > > bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. > Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside and > the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into their house > even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print labels on food > and appliances aren't covered by anything so the sighted person can feel > comfortable reading the familiar labels. If there aren't already print > labels on something, make sure they are printed in at least 12 point font > with black letters on a white background. Make sure your TV screen is on and > > make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. If you > > wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person won't > feel left out of what you are doing. > If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure to > wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted person > seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. > If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact with a > sighted person comfortably in your house. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM > To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students mailing > list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley > wrote: > >> Hi, >> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >> earlier post. >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >> >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> >>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, and to >>> their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily refute them >>> if >>> you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't advocate >>> without >>> proper information. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>> Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say >>> that >>> it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you can >>> assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and when >>> >>> I >>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>> they're >>> like. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>> give >>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>> philosophy! >>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, >>>> and >>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread >>>> that >>> I just started. >>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You >>>> think >>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go >>> on, >>> unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of >>> employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come >>> from? >>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct >>> or >>> stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth >>> my >>> time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's >>> employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is >>> you? >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>> terrible >>> picture of blindness! >>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >>> before! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>> >>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is >>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>> >>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident >>> practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 >>> year >>> old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a >>> normal person born blind. >>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >>> Gilmer >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >>> mailing >>>>>> list >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >>>>>> eHow >>>>>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>>>>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last >>> night >>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out >>>>>> that >>> I >>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely >>> unaware, >>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed >>>>>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our >>> life!, >>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine >>>>>> also >>>>>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to >>>>>> set >>> the >>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language >>> and >>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the >>> Blind) >>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>> >>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >>>>>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >>> specific >>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>> problems >>> with >>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>> >>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>> >>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>> >>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>> ABOUT >>>>>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it >>>>>> one >>> for >>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>>>>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per >>> their >>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>> >>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>>>>> eHow, >>>>>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, >>>>>> >>>>>> WA >>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>> Assistance >>>>>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer >>> Affairs >>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>> m >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o >>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>> m >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu From arielle71 at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 21:40:55 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 15:40:55 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> Message-ID: There's also another funny one, "how to entertain a blind person". One of the suggestions is to hold a musical competition, start singing a song as a group and then see who can finish the song after you turn off the music. You know, since blind people have such musical talent and superhearing...I laughed because I suck at remembering lyrics and would do horribly at that game! Arielle On 3/22/13, Joshua Lester wrote: > Kaiti: > Wow! > You attend Braille Beats? > Awesome! > That was a great post, BTW! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton > [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:53 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hi all, > > Brandon's last post made my week! I don't think it is right for stuff > like this to be available to give sighted people a false idea of what > blind people are like, but I too have seen many other articles that > don't make sense. (Have you seen the article about the importance of > teaching ASL to blind people yet?) There are plenty of non-blindness > related ones that are total trash to if you just look them up, and > nothing from E-How should be taken seriously. That being said, I > think I'm somewhere in between; I've recognized E-How for what it is > as Brandon pointed out, but I think that there is a definite line > between sensitivity and humor and in this case some of these articles > do cross that line. I know I would probably give someone the whatfor > if they tried to feed me or refused to give me a full glass of Coke > because I'm blind, but it's just a matter of letting E-How know they > should evaluate some of these grossly insensitive articles. > > Brandon: I know people from a music program I attend in the summers > called Braille Beats who actually describe sighted people as "Light > dependent." Your post reminded me of that and captured that idea > perfectly. > > How to manage a day with a Light-ependent person. > > People who have the misfortune of being congenitally dependent upon > light for survival need several accomodations including patience and > understanding from those not afflicted by the condition. In this > article I will present some everyday situations and ways you can help > your light-dependent friend or family member get through the day. > > Driving in the car going somewhere: When the person complains about > the bad driving of others, simply smile and distract him/her from the > road rage. Find a topic of conversation which interests both of you, > but still make sure they focus on their personal driving. Be patient > with them, although nothing is really solved by getting mad at other > drivers. They really can't help it sometimes. > Reading their own writing: Another factor of frustration for > light-dependent people is reading their own writing. Light-dependent > people don't have the advantage of using a system so eligant as > braille where letters are confused not too often, especially when > contractions are used. Because their system is more cumbersome and > they have the poor tendency to write sloppily when rushed they > sometimes can't even read what they've written. They also don't have > access to a refreshable display for their writing, so papers are > frequently lost in the shuffle. This leads to frustration and other > factors such as getting lost on the way to a destination or forgetting > something they needed from the store. Try to be patient and help them > remember what it is they wanted to buy, or perhaps that exit number > they told you they'd need to take off the highway. > In a college dorm at night: Sometimes your roommate may need to stay > up later than you and in order to complete their work they may need a > light. Again, be patient; if noise bothers you plug yourself into > your IPod and try falling asleep to music. If the light is bothersome > try to block it out; if you only have vision from one eye putting that > side of your face into the pillow does the trick wonderfully. Do > this, and be thankful that you don't necessarily need light to read a > book or that you can turn off the screen on your laptop out of > consideration for others. > > Okay, the last one was me grasping for straws, but you get the > picture. I also didn't mean to talk down sighted people; just an > attempt at humor. > > On 3/22/13, Brandon Keith Biggs wrote: >> Hello, >> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem pretty >> ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a room for a >> sighted person. >> >> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted >> people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like walking >> into >> >> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside >> and >> the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into their >> house >> even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print labels on food >> and appliances aren't covered by anything so the sighted person can feel >> comfortable reading the familiar labels. If there aren't already print >> labels on something, make sure they are printed in at least 12 point font >> with black letters on a white background. Make sure your TV screen is on >> and >> >> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. If >> you >> >> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person won't >> feel left out of what you are doing. >> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure to >> wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted >> person >> seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. >> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact with a >> sighted person comfortably in your house. >> Thanks, >> >> Brandon Keith Biggs >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Josh Gregory >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students mailing >> list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >> wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>> earlier post. >>> Misty >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>> >>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> >>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, and >>>> to >>>> their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily refute them >>>> if >>>> you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't advocate >>>> without >>>> proper information. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>> Gregory >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say >>>> that >>>> it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you >>>> can >>>> assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and >>>> when >>>> >>>> I >>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>>> they're >>>> like. >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>>> give >>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>> philosophy! >>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, >>>>> and >>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread >>>>> that >>>> I just started. >>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You >>>>> think >>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go >>>> on, >>>> unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem >>>> of >>>> employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come >>>> from? >>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct >>>> or >>>> stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth >>>> my >>>> time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's >>>> employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is >>>> you? >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>> terrible >>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >>>> before! >>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>> >>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one >>>>>> is >>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>> >>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>> accident >>>> practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 >>>> year >>>> old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a >>>> normal person born blind. >>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >>>> Gilmer >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >>>> mailing >>>>>>> list >>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >>>>>>> eHow >>>>>>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>>>>>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them >>>>>>> last >>>> night >>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out >>>>>>> that >>>> I >>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely >>>> unaware, >>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>> mixed >>>>>>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our >>>> life!, >>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine >>>>>>> also >>>>>>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to >>>>>>> set >>>> the >>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>>>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic >>>>>>> language >>>> and >>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>>> the >>>> Blind) >>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>> write >>>>>>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >>>> specific >>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>> problems >>>> with >>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>>> ABOUT >>>>>>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it >>>>>>> one >>>> for >>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>>>>>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per >>>> their >>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>>>>>> eHow, >>>>>>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, >>>>>>> Kirkland, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> WA >>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>> Assistance >>>>>>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer >>>> Affairs >>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>>> m >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o >>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>>> m >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Fri Mar 22 21:48:12 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 21:48:12 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> , Message-ID: LOL! Good grief! Where does this nonsense end? Again, good grief! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:40 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness There's also another funny one, "how to entertain a blind person". One of the suggestions is to hold a musical competition, start singing a song as a group and then see who can finish the song after you turn off the music. You know, since blind people have such musical talent and superhearing...I laughed because I suck at remembering lyrics and would do horribly at that game! Arielle On 3/22/13, Joshua Lester wrote: > Kaiti: > Wow! > You attend Braille Beats? > Awesome! > That was a great post, BTW! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton > [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:53 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hi all, > > Brandon's last post made my week! I don't think it is right for stuff > like this to be available to give sighted people a false idea of what > blind people are like, but I too have seen many other articles that > don't make sense. (Have you seen the article about the importance of > teaching ASL to blind people yet?) There are plenty of non-blindness > related ones that are total trash to if you just look them up, and > nothing from E-How should be taken seriously. That being said, I > think I'm somewhere in between; I've recognized E-How for what it is > as Brandon pointed out, but I think that there is a definite line > between sensitivity and humor and in this case some of these articles > do cross that line. I know I would probably give someone the whatfor > if they tried to feed me or refused to give me a full glass of Coke > because I'm blind, but it's just a matter of letting E-How know they > should evaluate some of these grossly insensitive articles. > > Brandon: I know people from a music program I attend in the summers > called Braille Beats who actually describe sighted people as "Light > dependent." Your post reminded me of that and captured that idea > perfectly. > > How to manage a day with a Light-ependent person. > > People who have the misfortune of being congenitally dependent upon > light for survival need several accomodations including patience and > understanding from those not afflicted by the condition. In this > article I will present some everyday situations and ways you can help > your light-dependent friend or family member get through the day. > > Driving in the car going somewhere: When the person complains about > the bad driving of others, simply smile and distract him/her from the > road rage. Find a topic of conversation which interests both of you, > but still make sure they focus on their personal driving. Be patient > with them, although nothing is really solved by getting mad at other > drivers. They really can't help it sometimes. > Reading their own writing: Another factor of frustration for > light-dependent people is reading their own writing. Light-dependent > people don't have the advantage of using a system so eligant as > braille where letters are confused not too often, especially when > contractions are used. Because their system is more cumbersome and > they have the poor tendency to write sloppily when rushed they > sometimes can't even read what they've written. They also don't have > access to a refreshable display for their writing, so papers are > frequently lost in the shuffle. This leads to frustration and other > factors such as getting lost on the way to a destination or forgetting > something they needed from the store. Try to be patient and help them > remember what it is they wanted to buy, or perhaps that exit number > they told you they'd need to take off the highway. > In a college dorm at night: Sometimes your roommate may need to stay > up later than you and in order to complete their work they may need a > light. Again, be patient; if noise bothers you plug yourself into > your IPod and try falling asleep to music. If the light is bothersome > try to block it out; if you only have vision from one eye putting that > side of your face into the pillow does the trick wonderfully. Do > this, and be thankful that you don't necessarily need light to read a > book or that you can turn off the screen on your laptop out of > consideration for others. > > Okay, the last one was me grasping for straws, but you get the > picture. I also didn't mean to talk down sighted people; just an > attempt at humor. > > On 3/22/13, Brandon Keith Biggs wrote: >> Hello, >> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem pretty >> ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a room for a >> sighted person. >> >> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted >> people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like walking >> into >> >> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside >> and >> the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into their >> house >> even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print labels on food >> and appliances aren't covered by anything so the sighted person can feel >> comfortable reading the familiar labels. If there aren't already print >> labels on something, make sure they are printed in at least 12 point font >> with black letters on a white background. Make sure your TV screen is on >> and >> >> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. If >> you >> >> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person won't >> feel left out of what you are doing. >> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure to >> wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted >> person >> seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. >> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact with a >> sighted person comfortably in your house. >> Thanks, >> >> Brandon Keith Biggs >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Josh Gregory >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students mailing >> list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >> wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>> earlier post. >>> Misty >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>> >>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> >>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, and >>>> to >>>> their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily refute them >>>> if >>>> you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't advocate >>>> without >>>> proper information. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>> Gregory >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say >>>> that >>>> it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you >>>> can >>>> assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and >>>> when >>>> >>>> I >>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>>> they're >>>> like. >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>>> give >>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>> philosophy! >>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, >>>>> and >>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread >>>>> that >>>> I just started. >>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You >>>>> think >>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go >>>> on, >>>> unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem >>>> of >>>> employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come >>>> from? >>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct >>>> or >>>> stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth >>>> my >>>> time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's >>>> employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is >>>> you? >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>> terrible >>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >>>> before! >>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>> >>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one >>>>>> is >>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>> >>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>> accident >>>> practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 >>>> year >>>> old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a >>>> normal person born blind. >>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >>>> Gilmer >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >>>> mailing >>>>>>> list >>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >>>>>>> eHow >>>>>>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>>>>>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them >>>>>>> last >>>> night >>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out >>>>>>> that >>>> I >>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely >>>> unaware, >>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>> mixed >>>>>>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our >>>> life!, >>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine >>>>>>> also >>>>>>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to >>>>>>> set >>>> the >>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>>>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic >>>>>>> language >>>> and >>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>>> the >>>> Blind) >>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>> write >>>>>>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >>>> specific >>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>> problems >>>> with >>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>>> ABOUT >>>>>>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it >>>>>>> one >>>> for >>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>>>>>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per >>>> their >>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>>>>>> eHow, >>>>>>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, >>>>>>> Kirkland, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> WA >>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>> Assistance >>>>>>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer >>>> Affairs >>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>>> m >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o >>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>>> m >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 21 22:00:48 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2013 18:00:48 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com><000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com><26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com><98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com><9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com><002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com><774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> Message-ID: <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com> Lol. That is funny. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon Keith Biggs Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Hello, I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a room for a sighted person. Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like walking into bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white background. Make sure your TV screen is on and make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. If you wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person won't feel left out of what you are doing. If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact with a sighted person comfortably in your house. Thanks, Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: Josh Gregory Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley wrote: > Hi, > I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my > earlier post. > Misty > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" > > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > >> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, and to >> their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily refute them if >> you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't advocate without >> proper information. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh Gregory >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say >> that >> it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you can >> assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and when >> I >> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >> they're >> like. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: >> >>> I don't want to read their trash. >>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and give >> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >> philosophy! >>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, >>> and >> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread >>> that >> I just started. >>> Thanks, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You >>> think >> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go >> on, >> unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of >> employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come from? >> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct or >> stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth >> my >> time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's >> employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is >> you? >>> Carrie >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>> terrible >> picture of blindness! >>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >> before! >>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>> >>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is >> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>> >>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident >> practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 >> year >> old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a >> normal person born blind. >>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >> Gilmer >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing >>>>> list >>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> Hello all~ >>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >>>>> eHow >>>>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>>>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last >> night >>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out >>>>> that >> I >>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely >> unaware, >>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed >>>>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our >> life!, >>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine >>>>> also >>>>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to >>>>> set >> the >>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language >> and >>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the >> Blind) >>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>> >>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >>>>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >> specific >>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>> problems >> with >>>>> each article are needed. >>>>> >>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>> >>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>> >>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>> ABOUT >>>>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it >>>>> one >> for >>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>>>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per >> their >>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>> >>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>>>> eHow, >>>>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, >>>>> WA >>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>> Assistance >>>>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer >> Affairs >>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>> 952-5210 >>>>> >>>>> Best, >>>>> >>>>> Carrie >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >> m >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o >> nmicrosoft.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >> m >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.co m > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai l.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From arielle71 at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 22:11:17 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 16:11:17 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com> Message-ID: It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends and my sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so he could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were just listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was the one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we didn't. Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on sighted people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of blindness really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, blind people can be equal or even advantaged. Arielle On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: > Lol. That is funny. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon Keith > Biggs > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello, > I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem pretty > ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a room for a > sighted person. > > Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted > people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like walking > into > > bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. > Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside and > the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into their house > even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print labels on food > and appliances aren't covered by anything so the sighted person can feel > comfortable reading the familiar labels. If there aren't already print > labels on something, make sure they are printed in at least 12 point font > with black letters on a white background. Make sure your TV screen is on > and > > make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. If > you > > wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person won't > feel left out of what you are doing. > If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure to > wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted person > seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. > If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact with a > sighted person comfortably in your house. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM > To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students mailing > list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley > wrote: > >> Hi, >> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >> earlier post. >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >> >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> >>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, and to >>> their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily refute them >>> if >>> you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't advocate >>> without >>> proper information. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>> Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say >>> that >>> it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you can >>> assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and >>> when > >>> I >>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>> they're >>> like. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>> give >>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>> philosophy! >>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, >>>> and >>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread >>>> that >>> I just started. >>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You >>>> think >>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go >>> on, >>> unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of >>> employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come >>> from? >>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct >>> or >>> stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth >>> my >>> time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's >>> employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is >>> you? >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>> terrible >>> picture of blindness! >>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >>> before! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>> >>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is >>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>> >>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident >>> practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 >>> year >>> old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a >>> normal person born blind. >>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >>> Gilmer >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >>> mailing >>>>>> list >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >>>>>> eHow >>>>>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>>>>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last >>> night >>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out >>>>>> that >>> I >>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely >>> unaware, >>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed >>>>>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our >>> life!, >>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine >>>>>> also >>>>>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to >>>>>> set >>> the >>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language >>> and >>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the >>> Blind) >>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>> >>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >>>>>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >>> specific >>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>> problems >>> with >>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>> >>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>> >>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>> >>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>> ABOUT >>>>>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it >>>>>> one >>> for >>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>>>>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per >>> their >>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>> >>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>>>>> eHow, >>>>>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, >>>>>> >>>>>> WA >>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>> Assistance >>>>>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer >>> Affairs >>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>> m >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o >>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>> m >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.co > m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Fri Mar 22 22:14:57 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 22:14:57 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com>, Message-ID: Exactly! Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch TV! I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can tell somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends and my sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so he could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were just listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was the one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we didn't. Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on sighted people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of blindness really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, blind people can be equal or even advantaged. Arielle On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: > Lol. That is funny. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon Keith > Biggs > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello, > I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem pretty > ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a room for a > sighted person. > > Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted > people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like walking > into > > bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. > Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside and > the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into their house > even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print labels on food > and appliances aren't covered by anything so the sighted person can feel > comfortable reading the familiar labels. If there aren't already print > labels on something, make sure they are printed in at least 12 point font > with black letters on a white background. Make sure your TV screen is on > and > > make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. If > you > > wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person won't > feel left out of what you are doing. > If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure to > wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted person > seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. > If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact with a > sighted person comfortably in your house. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM > To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students mailing > list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley > wrote: > >> Hi, >> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >> earlier post. >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >> >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> >>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, and to >>> their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily refute them >>> if >>> you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't advocate >>> without >>> proper information. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>> Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say >>> that >>> it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you can >>> assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and >>> when > >>> I >>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>> they're >>> like. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>> give >>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>> philosophy! >>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, >>>> and >>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread >>>> that >>> I just started. >>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You >>>> think >>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go >>> on, >>> unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of >>> employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come >>> from? >>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct >>> or >>> stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth >>> my >>> time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's >>> employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is >>> you? >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>> terrible >>> picture of blindness! >>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >>> before! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>> >>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is >>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>> >>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident >>> practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 >>> year >>> old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a >>> normal person born blind. >>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >>> Gilmer >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >>> mailing >>>>>> list >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >>>>>> eHow >>>>>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>>>>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last >>> night >>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out >>>>>> that >>> I >>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely >>> unaware, >>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed >>>>>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our >>> life!, >>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine >>>>>> also >>>>>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to >>>>>> set >>> the >>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language >>> and >>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the >>> Blind) >>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>> >>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >>>>>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >>> specific >>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>> problems >>> with >>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>> >>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>> >>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>> >>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>> ABOUT >>>>>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it >>>>>> one >>> for >>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>>>>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per >>> their >>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>> >>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>>>>> eHow, >>>>>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, >>>>>> >>>>>> WA >>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>> Assistance >>>>>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer >>> Affairs >>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>> m >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o >>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>> m >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.co > m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu From jsoro620 at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 22:16:33 2013 From: jsoro620 at gmail.com (Joe) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 18:16:33 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <01cf01ce2726$686a23b0$393e6b10$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <002701ce274a$e9c09a60$bd41cf20$@gmail.com> Hi Carrie, My apologies. I used the word "dictate" in the context of submitting a complaint to the website for publishing this content. We should by all means correct the misconceptions, but filing a complaint because we do not agree with a portrayal seems contrary to the freedom of speech you acknowledge. Get on the website and publish your own material to drown out the misconceptions that may have been published to the detriment of the blind. With all due respect, it would have a more profound effect than preaching amongst ourselves about something we are all in agreement is nonsense.--Joe -----Original Message----- From: Carrie Gilmer [mailto:carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 2:38 PM To: jsoro620 at gmail.com; National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Who is dictating Joe? Very strange terminology to me. When people are stereotyped, generalized falsely, negatively, portrayed with bias, etc...this is a country of free speech...protest, dismay, correction is not only acceptable and the right of any respondent or charging party, some have through history argued it is a moral responsibility to discard silence in the face of prejudice and discrimination. Carrie Sent from my iPad On Mar 22, 2013, at 12:55 PM, "Joe" wrote: > I will add my own support to the complaint, not because of the content > but because people should not be quoated out of context. > Unfortunately, we cannot dictate how people are depicted, as negative > and frustrating as that may feel, but we can put out our own material > to combat misconceptions. I wrote my own piece a few months back and > share it here in case anyone wants to promote their own positive portrayals about blindness: > > http://joeorozco.com/blog_facts_about_blindness_according_to_me > > Joe > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie > Gilmer > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM > To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students > mailing list > Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello all~ > I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on > eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically > bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them > last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend > pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! > I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in the > midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal > from the article or from our life!, I believe it was pulled from. The > same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in the same article! > one of the articles is titled "How to set the table for a blind > person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind person"...They are > Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and ideas! They > appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) as a reference!!!!!!!! > > I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write > complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument > specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters > naming problems with each article are needed. > > We must get these off the internet. > > Contact for complaint for eHow: > > I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE > ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be > doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get > enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down > permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: > > Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at > eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, > Kirkland, WA 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the > Complaint Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the > Dept. of Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, > Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 > > Best, > > Carrie > > Sent from my iPad > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co m From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 21 22:38:38 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2013 18:38:38 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <005f01ce2684$d57ab390$80701ab0$@gmail.com> Okay, that's just funny. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle Silverman Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:11 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends and my sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so he could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were just listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was the one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we didn't. Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on sighted people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of blindness really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, blind people can be equal or even advantaged. Arielle On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: > Lol. That is funny. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon Keith > Biggs > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello, > I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem pretty > ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a room for a > sighted person. > > Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted > people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like walking > into > > bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. > Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside and > the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into their house > even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print labels on food > and appliances aren't covered by anything so the sighted person can feel > comfortable reading the familiar labels. If there aren't already print > labels on something, make sure they are printed in at least 12 point font > with black letters on a white background. Make sure your TV screen is on > and > > make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. If > you > > wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person won't > feel left out of what you are doing. > If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure to > wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted person > seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. > If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact with a > sighted person comfortably in your house. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM > To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students mailing > list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley > wrote: > >> Hi, >> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >> earlier post. >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >> >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> >>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, and to >>> their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily refute them >>> if >>> you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't advocate >>> without >>> proper information. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>> Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say >>> that >>> it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you can >>> assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and >>> when > >>> I >>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>> they're >>> like. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>> give >>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>> philosophy! >>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, >>>> and >>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread >>>> that >>> I just started. >>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You >>>> think >>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go >>> on, >>> unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of >>> employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come >>> from? >>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct >>> or >>> stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth >>> my >>> time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's >>> employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is >>> you? >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>> terrible >>> picture of blindness! >>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >>> before! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>> >>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is >>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>> >>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident >>> practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 >>> year >>> old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a >>> normal person born blind. >>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >>> Gilmer >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >>> mailing >>>>>> list >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >>>>>> eHow >>>>>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>>>>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last >>> night >>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out >>>>>> that >>> I >>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely >>> unaware, >>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed >>>>>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our >>> life!, >>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine >>>>>> also >>>>>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to >>>>>> set >>> the >>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language >>> and >>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the >>> Blind) >>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>> >>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >>>>>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >>> specific >>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>> problems >>> with >>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>> >>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>> >>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>> >>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>> ABOUT >>>>>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it >>>>>> one >>> for >>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>>>>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per >>> their >>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>> >>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>>>>> eHow, >>>>>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, >>>>>> >>>>>> WA >>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>> Assistance >>>>>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer >>> Affairs >>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>> m >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o >>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>> m >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.co > m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 21 22:39:56 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2013 18:39:56 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com>, Message-ID: <006a01ce2685$04b268b0$0e173a10$@gmail.com> It is a little annoying; almost as if you do completely different things. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Exactly! Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch TV! I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can tell somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends and my sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so he could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were just listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was the one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we didn't. Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on sighted people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of blindness really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, blind people can be equal or even advantaged. Arielle On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: > Lol. That is funny. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon Keith > Biggs > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello, > I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem pretty > ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a room for a > sighted person. > > Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted > people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like walking > into > > bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. > Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside and > the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into their house > even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print labels on food > and appliances aren't covered by anything so the sighted person can feel > comfortable reading the familiar labels. If there aren't already print > labels on something, make sure they are printed in at least 12 point font > with black letters on a white background. Make sure your TV screen is on > and > > make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. If > you > > wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person won't > feel left out of what you are doing. > If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure to > wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted person > seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. > If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact with a > sighted person comfortably in your house. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM > To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students mailing > list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley > wrote: > >> Hi, >> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >> earlier post. >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >> >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> >>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, and to >>> their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily refute them >>> if >>> you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't advocate >>> without >>> proper information. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>> Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say >>> that >>> it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you can >>> assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and >>> when > >>> I >>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>> they're >>> like. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>> give >>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>> philosophy! >>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, >>>> and >>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread >>>> that >>> I just started. >>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You >>>> think >>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go >>> on, >>> unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of >>> employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come >>> from? >>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct >>> or >>> stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth >>> my >>> time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's >>> employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is >>> you? >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>> terrible >>> picture of blindness! >>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >>> before! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>> >>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is >>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>> >>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident >>> practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 >>> year >>> old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a >>> normal person born blind. >>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >>> Gilmer >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >>> mailing >>>>>> list >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >>>>>> eHow >>>>>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>>>>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last >>> night >>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out >>>>>> that >>> I >>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely >>> unaware, >>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed >>>>>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our >>> life!, >>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine >>>>>> also >>>>>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to >>>>>> set >>> the >>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language >>> and >>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the >>> Blind) >>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>> >>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >>>>>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >>> specific >>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>> problems >>> with >>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>> >>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>> >>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>> >>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>> ABOUT >>>>>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it >>>>>> one >>> for >>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>>>>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per >>> their >>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>> >>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>>>>> eHow, >>>>>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, >>>>>> >>>>>> WA >>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>> Assistance >>>>>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer >>> Affairs >>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>> m >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o >>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>> m >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.co > m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 21 22:41:01 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2013 18:41:01 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <002701ce274a$e9c09a60$bd41cf20$@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <01cf01ce2726$686a23b0$393e6b10$@gmail.com> <002701ce274a$e9c09a60$bd41cf20$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <006c01ce2685$2bd46a10$837d3e30$@gmail.com> Freedom of speech is one thing, bur slandering and destroying the character of a group or deformation of character is another thing. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joe Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:17 PM To: 'NATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF BLIND STUDENTS' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Hi Carrie, My apologies. I used the word "dictate" in the context of submitting a complaint to the website for publishing this content. We should by all means correct the misconceptions, but filing a complaint because we do not agree with a portrayal seems contrary to the freedom of speech you acknowledge. Get on the website and publish your own material to drown out the misconceptions that may have been published to the detriment of the blind. With all due respect, it would have a more profound effect than preaching amongst ourselves about something we are all in agreement is nonsense.--Joe -----Original Message----- From: Carrie Gilmer [mailto:carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 2:38 PM To: jsoro620 at gmail.com; National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Who is dictating Joe? Very strange terminology to me. When people are stereotyped, generalized falsely, negatively, portrayed with bias, etc...this is a country of free speech...protest, dismay, correction is not only acceptable and the right of any respondent or charging party, some have through history argued it is a moral responsibility to discard silence in the face of prejudice and discrimination. Carrie Sent from my iPad On Mar 22, 2013, at 12:55 PM, "Joe" wrote: > I will add my own support to the complaint, not because of the content > but because people should not be quoated out of context. > Unfortunately, we cannot dictate how people are depicted, as negative > and frustrating as that may feel, but we can put out our own material > to combat misconceptions. I wrote my own piece a few months back and > share it here in case anyone wants to promote their own positive portrayals about blindness: > > http://joeorozco.com/blog_facts_about_blindness_according_to_me > > Joe > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie > Gilmer > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM > To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students > mailing list > Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello all~ > I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on > eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically > bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them > last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend > pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! > I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in the > midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal > from the article or from our life!, I believe it was pulled from. The > same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in the same article! > one of the articles is titled "How to set the table for a blind > person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind person"...They are > Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and ideas! They > appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) as a reference!!!!!!!! > > I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write > complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument > specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters > naming problems with each article are needed. > > We must get these off the internet. > > Contact for complaint for eHow: > > I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE > ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be > doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get > enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down > permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: > > Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at > eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, > Kirkland, WA 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the > Complaint Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the > Dept. of Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, > Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 > > Best, > > Carrie > > Sent from my iPad > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co m _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From joshkart12 at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 22:40:17 2013 From: joshkart12 at gmail.com (Josh Gregory) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 18:40:17 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Oral Care for Blind Patients | eHow.com In-Reply-To: <66428F0B-A2E8-4301-B5EE-50B5CDD3F217@gmail.com> References: <34324FA0-0580-426E-AF60-7CFECF1F21ED@gmail.com> <66428F0B-A2E8-4301-B5EE-50B5CDD3F217@gmail.com> Message-ID: <45D01B78-D311-4DCF-8B43-3E760AFFC55A@gmail.com> It wasn't at all my intent to make this seem humorous, quite the opposite. Quite serious. Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2013, at 5:16 PM, Carrie Gilmer wrote: > While these may seem like sarcastic articles from The Onion or SNL type humor to us, they are quite serious. Tens of thousands of people go to eHow for information...some of it is ridiculous and clearly wrong information. But how does one know? Only if one has some accurate knowledge base already held on the subject. When people are searching for info these days, they search the web. This comes up. People believed it enough to write it, and I can assure you not as a joke. I have seen similar before from organizations and centers for the blind, MANY TIMES...written by supposed professionals in the "field" of blindness. > People who might go to this site: > Parents of Blind children, especially new ones. > Regular classroom teachers of blind children. > Nurses in an ICU or care facility who have their first blind patient. > Employers or coworkers who are curious. > Someone thinking of dating or befriending "that blind person" in class, across the hall, on the bus.... > Children of parents losing vision. > Spouses of people losing vision. > Dental office worker or hygienist with first blind patient. > And on and on..... > Just the titles alone could scare the beggeeebus out of anyone thinking of "what to do with that new blind person in my life"....and there are not counter articles...they are many, some give references to legitimate sources but even those for people who know are incorrect, misleading or mixed up, seriously, or quoted out of context... > > Carrie > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 8:35 AM, Josh Gregory wrote: > >> Now, don't be upset, but I thought I'd send this so you could get an idea of what we're talking about. >> >> http://www.ehow.com/facts_7330488_oral-care-blind-patients.html >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 22:46:45 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 18:46:45 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> , Message-ID: <003801ce274f$223129b0$66937d10$@gmail.com> Joshua and all, Sometimes, unfortunately, we just can't win with these people. Despite all our attempts to educate by word and by example, some people either cannot or do not get it. Frustrating, I know. The problem, I believe, with articles such as these is that they don't consult blind people ourselves or even sighted people who have a more accurate and positive outlook on blindness. We always blame society's misconceptions about us for erroneous information in articles and other published material. But I sometimes wonder where they got such ridiculous ideas about the capabilities of blind people. Judging from my personal experience, this nonsense is far beyond even the norm of everyday misconceptions. However, let me add that all hope is not lost. If these media people would actually talk with the blind ourselves, we usually get a much different result. We instead get final products like the Nick News special on blind kids which aired in January. By the way, I'm not trying to brag or toot my own horn when saying this. My role in the production of that program was just as an interviewee and occasional information provider. I had no control over how the segment would be introduced or what parts of my interview (or anybody else's) they showed. However, anyone who watched it would probably agree that the light in which we were portrayed on that show was a far cry from the eHow series of articles. Oh well... all we can do is to educate as much as we can and laugh at the ridiculousness we get from time to time. It is frustrating, though. Chriss Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:48 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness LOL! Good grief! Where does this nonsense end? Again, good grief! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:40 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness There's also another funny one, "how to entertain a blind person". One of the suggestions is to hold a musical competition, start singing a song as a group and then see who can finish the song after you turn off the music. You know, since blind people have such musical talent and superhearing...I laughed because I suck at remembering lyrics and would do horribly at that game! Arielle On 3/22/13, Joshua Lester wrote: > Kaiti: > Wow! > You attend Braille Beats? > Awesome! > That was a great post, BTW! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton > [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:53 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hi all, > > Brandon's last post made my week! I don't think it is right for stuff > like this to be available to give sighted people a false idea of what > blind people are like, but I too have seen many other articles that > don't make sense. (Have you seen the article about the importance of > teaching ASL to blind people yet?) There are plenty of non-blindness > related ones that are total trash to if you just look them up, and > nothing from E-How should be taken seriously. That being said, I > think I'm somewhere in between; I've recognized E-How for what it is > as Brandon pointed out, but I think that there is a definite line > between sensitivity and humor and in this case some of these articles > do cross that line. I know I would probably give someone the whatfor > if they tried to feed me or refused to give me a full glass of Coke > because I'm blind, but it's just a matter of letting E-How know they > should evaluate some of these grossly insensitive articles. > > Brandon: I know people from a music program I attend in the summers > called Braille Beats who actually describe sighted people as "Light > dependent." Your post reminded me of that and captured that idea > perfectly. > > How to manage a day with a Light-ependent person. > > People who have the misfortune of being congenitally dependent upon > light for survival need several accomodations including patience and > understanding from those not afflicted by the condition. In this > article I will present some everyday situations and ways you can help > your light-dependent friend or family member get through the day. > > Driving in the car going somewhere: When the person complains about > the bad driving of others, simply smile and distract him/her from the > road rage. Find a topic of conversation which interests both of you, > but still make sure they focus on their personal driving. Be patient > with them, although nothing is really solved by getting mad at other > drivers. They really can't help it sometimes. > Reading their own writing: Another factor of frustration for > light-dependent people is reading their own writing. Light-dependent > people don't have the advantage of using a system so eligant as > braille where letters are confused not too often, especially when > contractions are used. Because their system is more cumbersome and > they have the poor tendency to write sloppily when rushed they > sometimes can't even read what they've written. They also don't have > access to a refreshable display for their writing, so papers are > frequently lost in the shuffle. This leads to frustration and other > factors such as getting lost on the way to a destination or forgetting > something they needed from the store. Try to be patient and help them > remember what it is they wanted to buy, or perhaps that exit number > they told you they'd need to take off the highway. > In a college dorm at night: Sometimes your roommate may need to stay > up later than you and in order to complete their work they may need a > light. Again, be patient; if noise bothers you plug yourself into > your IPod and try falling asleep to music. If the light is bothersome > try to block it out; if you only have vision from one eye putting that > side of your face into the pillow does the trick wonderfully. Do > this, and be thankful that you don't necessarily need light to read a > book or that you can turn off the screen on your laptop out of > consideration for others. > > Okay, the last one was me grasping for straws, but you get the > picture. I also didn't mean to talk down sighted people; just an > attempt at humor. > > On 3/22/13, Brandon Keith Biggs wrote: >> Hello, >> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >> room for a sighted person. >> >> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. >> Sighted people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't >> like walking into >> >> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm >> outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining >> into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure >> print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >> >> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >> If you >> >> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make >> sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the >> sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without >> protection. >> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >> Thanks, >> >> Brandon Keith Biggs >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Josh Gregory >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >> >> wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>> earlier post. >>> Misty >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>> >>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> >>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>> Gregory >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>> good idea here, and when >>>> >>>> I >>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>>> they're >>>> like. >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>>> give >>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>> philosophy! >>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, >>>>> and >>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread >>>>> that >>>> I just started. >>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You >>>>> think >>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go >>>> on, >>>> unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem >>>> of >>>> employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come >>>> from? >>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct >>>> or >>>> stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth >>>> my >>>> time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's >>>> employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is >>>> you? >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>> terrible >>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >>>> before! >>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>> >>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one >>>>>> is >>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>> >>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>> accident >>>> practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 >>>> year >>>> old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a >>>> normal person born blind. >>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >>>> Gilmer >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >>>> mailing >>>>>>> list >>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >>>>>>> eHow >>>>>>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>>>>>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them >>>>>>> last >>>> night >>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out >>>>>>> that >>>> I >>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely >>>> unaware, >>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>> mixed >>>>>>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our >>>> life!, >>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine >>>>>>> also >>>>>>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to >>>>>>> set >>>> the >>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>>>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic >>>>>>> language >>>> and >>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>>> the >>>> Blind) >>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>> write >>>>>>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >>>> specific >>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>> problems >>>> with >>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>>> ABOUT >>>>>>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it >>>>>>> one >>>> for >>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>>>>>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per >>>> their >>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>>>>>> eHow, >>>>>>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, >>>>>>> Kirkland, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> WA >>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>> Assistance >>>>>>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer >>>> Affairs >>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>>> m >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o >>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>>> m >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.co m >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai l.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai l.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Fri Mar 22 22:56:32 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 22:56:32 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <003801ce274f$223129b0$66937d10$@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> , , <003801ce274f$223129b0$66937d10$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Yeah! Great point! These people need to watch famous blind musicians, for example, like Ronnie Milsap, Terri Gibbs, and Gini Owens! They all live good quality independent lives, and are taking care of themselves! Why put out all of this ridiculous mess, when they see blind people everyday, living opposite what they're saying? Good grief! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Chris Nusbaum [dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:46 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Joshua and all, Sometimes, unfortunately, we just can't win with these people. Despite all our attempts to educate by word and by example, some people either cannot or do not get it. Frustrating, I know. The problem, I believe, with articles such as these is that they don't consult blind people ourselves or even sighted people who have a more accurate and positive outlook on blindness. We always blame society's misconceptions about us for erroneous information in articles and other published material. But I sometimes wonder where they got such ridiculous ideas about the capabilities of blind people. Judging from my personal experience, this nonsense is far beyond even the norm of everyday misconceptions. However, let me add that all hope is not lost. If these media people would actually talk with the blind ourselves, we usually get a much different result. We instead get final products like the Nick News special on blind kids which aired in January. By the way, I'm not trying to brag or toot my own horn when saying this. My role in the production of that program was just as an interviewee and occasional information provider. I had no control over how the segment would be introduced or what parts of my interview (or anybody else's) they showed. However, anyone who watched it would probably agree that the light in which we were portrayed on that show was a far cry from the eHow series of articles. Oh well... all we can do is to educate as much as we can and laugh at the ridiculousness we get from time to time. It is frustrating, though. Chriss Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:48 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness LOL! Good grief! Where does this nonsense end? Again, good grief! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:40 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness There's also another funny one, "how to entertain a blind person". One of the suggestions is to hold a musical competition, start singing a song as a group and then see who can finish the song after you turn off the music. You know, since blind people have such musical talent and superhearing...I laughed because I suck at remembering lyrics and would do horribly at that game! Arielle On 3/22/13, Joshua Lester wrote: > Kaiti: > Wow! > You attend Braille Beats? > Awesome! > That was a great post, BTW! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton > [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:53 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hi all, > > Brandon's last post made my week! I don't think it is right for stuff > like this to be available to give sighted people a false idea of what > blind people are like, but I too have seen many other articles that > don't make sense. (Have you seen the article about the importance of > teaching ASL to blind people yet?) There are plenty of non-blindness > related ones that are total trash to if you just look them up, and > nothing from E-How should be taken seriously. That being said, I > think I'm somewhere in between; I've recognized E-How for what it is > as Brandon pointed out, but I think that there is a definite line > between sensitivity and humor and in this case some of these articles > do cross that line. I know I would probably give someone the whatfor > if they tried to feed me or refused to give me a full glass of Coke > because I'm blind, but it's just a matter of letting E-How know they > should evaluate some of these grossly insensitive articles. > > Brandon: I know people from a music program I attend in the summers > called Braille Beats who actually describe sighted people as "Light > dependent." Your post reminded me of that and captured that idea > perfectly. > > How to manage a day with a Light-ependent person. > > People who have the misfortune of being congenitally dependent upon > light for survival need several accomodations including patience and > understanding from those not afflicted by the condition. In this > article I will present some everyday situations and ways you can help > your light-dependent friend or family member get through the day. > > Driving in the car going somewhere: When the person complains about > the bad driving of others, simply smile and distract him/her from the > road rage. Find a topic of conversation which interests both of you, > but still make sure they focus on their personal driving. Be patient > with them, although nothing is really solved by getting mad at other > drivers. They really can't help it sometimes. > Reading their own writing: Another factor of frustration for > light-dependent people is reading their own writing. Light-dependent > people don't have the advantage of using a system so eligant as > braille where letters are confused not too often, especially when > contractions are used. Because their system is more cumbersome and > they have the poor tendency to write sloppily when rushed they > sometimes can't even read what they've written. They also don't have > access to a refreshable display for their writing, so papers are > frequently lost in the shuffle. This leads to frustration and other > factors such as getting lost on the way to a destination or forgetting > something they needed from the store. Try to be patient and help them > remember what it is they wanted to buy, or perhaps that exit number > they told you they'd need to take off the highway. > In a college dorm at night: Sometimes your roommate may need to stay > up later than you and in order to complete their work they may need a > light. Again, be patient; if noise bothers you plug yourself into > your IPod and try falling asleep to music. If the light is bothersome > try to block it out; if you only have vision from one eye putting that > side of your face into the pillow does the trick wonderfully. Do > this, and be thankful that you don't necessarily need light to read a > book or that you can turn off the screen on your laptop out of > consideration for others. > > Okay, the last one was me grasping for straws, but you get the > picture. I also didn't mean to talk down sighted people; just an > attempt at humor. > > On 3/22/13, Brandon Keith Biggs wrote: >> Hello, >> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >> room for a sighted person. >> >> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. >> Sighted people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't >> like walking into >> >> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm >> outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining >> into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure >> print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >> >> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >> If you >> >> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make >> sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the >> sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without >> protection. >> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >> Thanks, >> >> Brandon Keith Biggs >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Josh Gregory >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >> >> wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>> earlier post. >>> Misty >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>> >>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> >>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>> Gregory >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>> good idea here, and when >>>> >>>> I >>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>>> they're >>>> like. >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>>> give >>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>> philosophy! >>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, >>>>> and >>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread >>>>> that >>>> I just started. >>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You >>>>> think >>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go >>>> on, >>>> unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem >>>> of >>>> employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come >>>> from? >>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct >>>> or >>>> stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth >>>> my >>>> time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's >>>> employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is >>>> you? >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>> terrible >>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >>>> before! >>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>> >>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one >>>>>> is >>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>> >>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>> accident >>>> practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 >>>> year >>>> old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a >>>> normal person born blind. >>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >>>> Gilmer >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >>>> mailing >>>>>>> list >>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >>>>>>> eHow >>>>>>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>>>>>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them >>>>>>> last >>>> night >>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out >>>>>>> that >>>> I >>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely >>>> unaware, >>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>> mixed >>>>>>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our >>>> life!, >>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine >>>>>>> also >>>>>>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to >>>>>>> set >>>> the >>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>>>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic >>>>>>> language >>>> and >>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>>> the >>>> Blind) >>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>> write >>>>>>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >>>> specific >>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>> problems >>>> with >>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>>> ABOUT >>>>>>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it >>>>>>> one >>>> for >>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>>>>>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per >>>> their >>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>>>>>> eHow, >>>>>>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, >>>>>>> Kirkland, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> WA >>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>> Assistance >>>>>>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer >>>> Affairs >>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>>> m >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o >>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>>> m >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.co m >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai l.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai l.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com From carrie.gilmer at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 23:24:02 2013 From: carrie.gilmer at gmail.com (Carrie Gilmer) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 18:24:02 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <002701ce274a$e9c09a60$bd41cf20$@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <01cf01ce2726$686a23b0$393e6b10$@gmail.com> <002701ce274a$e9c09a60$bd41cf20$@gmail.com> Message-ID: I agree that publishing ourselves is a great idea. I cannot comprehend how you consider "filing a complaint" contrary to freedom of speech. They were free to write this, and are free it seems to disseminate false information...except there may be a true question of knowingly disseminating false information vs ignorantly doing so. One is always free to respond. freedom of speech is a one way street in your study/understanding of constitutional law? We can laugh at the ridiculousness to make ourselves feel better, we can ignore as we are just tired of one more thing, or we can ignore convincing ourselves that any correction sent in or protest will have no effect....all of those maintain the status quo. no basket can be made, no point ever scored, if you do not shoot. i hope some of you take a shot. I am. A while ago, HBO had a commercial for the show The Sopranos that portrayed blind people very badly. i wrote the CEO of TimeWarner. i rook great time and care, I wrote a professional level letter with passion. He read it himself. He wrote me back personally. The commercial was actually pulled, something I did not even ask for. This man is putting policies in place, including hiring, and training...and is aware of programming content and purchase for a VERY large media company. His idea of blindness is forever changed. That was no little deal. i was the only one, sometimes one letter can touch a person in power. Not long after, Tom Toles, a pulitzer prize winning political cartoonist, made a cartoon that mischaracterized the blind, it was offensive and perpetuated false ideas. I wrote him a long, passionate, reasoned, proper english, professional letter and told him how i felt, why it was a problem, and it had ruined my morning. He personally wrote back and apologized. An assure you he will never again use a blind character in his cartoon that gives false ideas about blindness. How do you eat an elephant? one bite at a time. Best to you Joe, Carrie Sent from my iPad On Mar 22, 2013, at 5:16 PM, "Joe" wrote: > Hi Carrie, > > My apologies. I used the word "dictate" in the context of submitting a > complaint to the website for publishing this content. We should by all means > correct the misconceptions, but filing a complaint because we do not agree > with a portrayal seems contrary to the freedom of speech you acknowledge. > Get on the website and publish your own material to drown out the > misconceptions that may have been published to the detriment of the blind. > With all due respect, it would have a more profound effect than preaching > amongst ourselves about something we are all in agreement is nonsense.--Joe > > -----Original Message----- > From: Carrie Gilmer [mailto:carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 2:38 PM > To: jsoro620 at gmail.com; National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Who is dictating Joe? Very strange terminology to me. When people are > stereotyped, generalized falsely, negatively, portrayed with bias, > etc...this is a country of free speech...protest, dismay, correction is not > only acceptable and the right of any respondent or charging party, some have > through history argued it is a moral responsibility to discard silence in > the face of prejudice and discrimination. > Carrie > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 12:55 PM, "Joe" wrote: > >> I will add my own support to the complaint, not because of the content >> but because people should not be quoated out of context. >> Unfortunately, we cannot dictate how people are depicted, as negative >> and frustrating as that may feel, but we can put out our own material >> to combat misconceptions. I wrote my own piece a few months back and >> share it here in case anyone wants to promote their own positive > portrayals about blindness: >> >> http://joeorozco.com/blog_facts_about_blindness_according_to_me >> >> Joe >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >> Gilmer >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing list >> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hello all~ >> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >> eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically >> bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them >> last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend >> pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! >> I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in the >> midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal >> from the article or from our life!, I believe it was pulled from. The >> same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in the same article! >> one of the articles is titled "How to set the table for a blind >> person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind person"...They are >> Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and ideas! They >> appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) as a > reference!!!!!!!! >> >> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >> specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters >> naming problems with each article are needed. >> >> We must get these off the internet. >> >> Contact for complaint for eHow: >> >> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >> doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get >> enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down >> permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: >> >> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >> eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, >> Kirkland, WA 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the >> Complaint Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the >> Dept. of Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, >> Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 >> >> Best, >> >> Carrie >> >> Sent from my iPad >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.c >> om >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co > m > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com From carrie.gilmer at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 23:27:39 2013 From: carrie.gilmer at gmail.com (Carrie Gilmer) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 18:27:39 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Oral Care for Blind Patients | eHow.com In-Reply-To: <45D01B78-D311-4DCF-8B43-3E760AFFC55A@gmail.com> References: <34324FA0-0580-426E-AF60-7CFECF1F21ED@gmail.com> <66428F0B-A2E8-4301-B5EE-50B5CDD3F217@gmail.com> <45D01B78-D311-4DCF-8B43-3E760AFFC55A@gmail.com> Message-ID: <0ACC1BCD-DA33-4CE3-811F-254B659F2AE0@gmail.com> Yes, sorry Josh, it was I think Brandon who said a few times it was a gag. I was speaking generally to that point. Was not directing that to you. It does gag me. Smile. carrie Sent from my iPad On Mar 22, 2013, at 5:40 PM, Josh Gregory wrote: > It wasn't at all my intent to make this seem humorous, quite the opposite. Quite serious. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 5:16 PM, Carrie Gilmer wrote: > >> While these may seem like sarcastic articles from The Onion or SNL type humor to us, they are quite serious. Tens of thousands of people go to eHow for information...some of it is ridiculous and clearly wrong information. But how does one know? Only if one has some accurate knowledge base already held on the subject. When people are searching for info these days, they search the web. This comes up. People believed it enough to write it, and I can assure you not as a joke. I have seen similar before from organizations and centers for the blind, MANY TIMES...written by supposed professionals in the "field" of blindness. >> People who might go to this site: >> Parents of Blind children, especially new ones. >> Regular classroom teachers of blind children. >> Nurses in an ICU or care facility who have their first blind patient. >> Employers or coworkers who are curious. >> Someone thinking of dating or befriending "that blind person" in class, across the hall, on the bus.... >> Children of parents losing vision. >> Spouses of people losing vision. >> Dental office worker or hygienist with first blind patient. >> And on and on..... >> Just the titles alone could scare the beggeeebus out of anyone thinking of "what to do with that new blind person in my life"....and there are not counter articles...they are many, some give references to legitimate sources but even those for people who know are incorrect, misleading or mixed up, seriously, or quoted out of context... >> >> Carrie >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 8:35 AM, Josh Gregory wrote: >> >>> Now, don't be upset, but I thought I'd send this so you could get an idea of what we're talking about. >>> >>> http://www.ehow.com/facts_7330488_oral-care-blind-patients.html >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 23:48:08 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 19:48:08 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <01cf01ce2726$686a23b0$393e6b10$@gmail.com> <002701ce274a$e9c09a60$bd41cf20$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <000101ce2757$b4d5c6b0$1e815410$@gmail.com> Carrie, Right on! Keep fighting the good fight, and know that your Federation family is with you all the way!!!! Chris Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie Gilmer Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:24 PM To: jsoro620 at gmail.com; National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness I agree that publishing ourselves is a great idea. I cannot comprehend how you consider "filing a complaint" contrary to freedom of speech. They were free to write this, and are free it seems to disseminate false information...except there may be a true question of knowingly disseminating false information vs ignorantly doing so. One is always free to respond. freedom of speech is a one way street in your study/understanding of constitutional law? We can laugh at the ridiculousness to make ourselves feel better, we can ignore as we are just tired of one more thing, or we can ignore convincing ourselves that any correction sent in or protest will have no effect....all of those maintain the status quo. no basket can be made, no point ever scored, if you do not shoot. i hope some of you take a shot. I am. A while ago, HBO had a commercial for the show The Sopranos that portrayed blind people very badly. i wrote the CEO of TimeWarner. i rook great time and care, I wrote a professional level letter with passion. He read it himself. He wrote me back personally. The commercial was actually pulled, something I did not even ask for. This man is putting policies in place, including hiring, and training...and is aware of programming content and purchase for a VERY large media company. His idea of blindness is forever changed. That was no little deal. i was the only one, sometimes one letter can touch a person in power. Not long after, Tom Toles, a pulitzer prize winning political cartoonist, made a cartoon that mischaracterized the blind, it was offensive and perpetuated false ideas. I wrote him a long, passionate, reasoned, proper english, professional letter and told him how i felt, why it was a problem, and it had ruined my morning. He personally wrote back and apologized. An assure you he will never again use a blind character in his cartoon that gives false ideas about blindness. How do you eat an elephant? one bite at a time. Best to you Joe, Carrie Sent from my iPad On Mar 22, 2013, at 5:16 PM, "Joe" wrote: > Hi Carrie, > > My apologies. I used the word "dictate" in the context of submitting a > complaint to the website for publishing this content. We should by all > means correct the misconceptions, but filing a complaint because we do > not agree with a portrayal seems contrary to the freedom of speech you acknowledge. > Get on the website and publish your own material to drown out the > misconceptions that may have been published to the detriment of the blind. > With all due respect, it would have a more profound effect than > preaching amongst ourselves about something we are all in agreement is > nonsense.--Joe > > -----Original Message----- > From: Carrie Gilmer [mailto:carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 2:38 PM > To: jsoro620 at gmail.com; National Association of Blind Students mailing > list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Who is dictating Joe? Very strange terminology to me. When people are > stereotyped, generalized falsely, negatively, portrayed with bias, > etc...this is a country of free speech...protest, dismay, correction > is not only acceptable and the right of any respondent or charging > party, some have through history argued it is a moral responsibility > to discard silence in the face of prejudice and discrimination. > Carrie > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 12:55 PM, "Joe" wrote: > >> I will add my own support to the complaint, not because of the >> content but because people should not be quoated out of context. >> Unfortunately, we cannot dictate how people are depicted, as negative >> and frustrating as that may feel, but we can put out our own material >> to combat misconceptions. I wrote my own piece a few months back and >> share it here in case anyone wants to promote their own positive > portrayals about blindness: >> >> http://joeorozco.com/blog_facts_about_blindness_according_to_me >> >> Joe >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >> Gilmer >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing list >> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hello all~ >> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >> eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically >> bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them >> last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend >> pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! >> I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in the >> midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal >> from the article or from our life!, I believe it was pulled from. The >> same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in the same article! >> one of the articles is titled "How to set the table for a blind >> person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind person"...They are >> Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and ideas! They >> appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) as a > reference!!!!!!!! >> >> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >> specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters >> naming problems with each article are needed. >> >> We must get these off the internet. >> >> Contact for complaint for eHow: >> >> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >> doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get >> enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down >> permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: >> >> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >> eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, >> Kirkland, WA 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the >> Complaint Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the >> Dept. of Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, >> Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 >> >> Best, >> >> Carrie >> >> Sent from my iPad >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail. >> c >> om >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.co > m > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 23:53:54 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 19:53:54 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> , , <003801ce274f$223129b0$66937d10$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <000301ce2758$837f81e0$8a7e85a0$@gmail.com> Joshua, Because they *don't* see blind people living opposite of what they're saying. What would be really funny is if these people came to an NFB convention, but that's probably an unrealistic dream. Chris Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:57 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Yeah! Great point! These people need to watch famous blind musicians, for example, like Ronnie Milsap, Terri Gibbs, and Gini Owens! They all live good quality independent lives, and are taking care of themselves! Why put out all of this ridiculous mess, when they see blind people everyday, living opposite what they're saying? Good grief! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Chris Nusbaum [dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:46 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Joshua and all, Sometimes, unfortunately, we just can't win with these people. Despite all our attempts to educate by word and by example, some people either cannot or do not get it. Frustrating, I know. The problem, I believe, with articles such as these is that they don't consult blind people ourselves or even sighted people who have a more accurate and positive outlook on blindness. We always blame society's misconceptions about us for erroneous information in articles and other published material. But I sometimes wonder where they got such ridiculous ideas about the capabilities of blind people. Judging from my personal experience, this nonsense is far beyond even the norm of everyday misconceptions. However, let me add that all hope is not lost. If these media people would actually talk with the blind ourselves, we usually get a much different result. We instead get final products like the Nick News special on blind kids which aired in January. By the way, I'm not trying to brag or toot my own horn when saying this. My role in the production of that program was just as an interviewee and occasional information provider. I had no control over how the segment would be introduced or what parts of my interview (or anybody else's) they showed. However, anyone who watched it would probably agree that the light in which we were portrayed on that show was a far cry from the eHow series of articles. Oh well... all we can do is to educate as much as we can and laugh at the ridiculousness we get from time to time. It is frustrating, though. Chriss Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:48 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness LOL! Good grief! Where does this nonsense end? Again, good grief! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:40 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness There's also another funny one, "how to entertain a blind person". One of the suggestions is to hold a musical competition, start singing a song as a group and then see who can finish the song after you turn off the music. You know, since blind people have such musical talent and superhearing...I laughed because I suck at remembering lyrics and would do horribly at that game! Arielle On 3/22/13, Joshua Lester wrote: > Kaiti: > Wow! > You attend Braille Beats? > Awesome! > That was a great post, BTW! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton > [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:53 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hi all, > > Brandon's last post made my week! I don't think it is right for stuff > like this to be available to give sighted people a false idea of what > blind people are like, but I too have seen many other articles that > don't make sense. (Have you seen the article about the importance of > teaching ASL to blind people yet?) There are plenty of non-blindness > related ones that are total trash to if you just look them up, and > nothing from E-How should be taken seriously. That being said, I > think I'm somewhere in between; I've recognized E-How for what it is > as Brandon pointed out, but I think that there is a definite line > between sensitivity and humor and in this case some of these articles > do cross that line. I know I would probably give someone the whatfor > if they tried to feed me or refused to give me a full glass of Coke > because I'm blind, but it's just a matter of letting E-How know they > should evaluate some of these grossly insensitive articles. > > Brandon: I know people from a music program I attend in the summers > called Braille Beats who actually describe sighted people as "Light > dependent." Your post reminded me of that and captured that idea > perfectly. > > How to manage a day with a Light-ependent person. > > People who have the misfortune of being congenitally dependent upon > light for survival need several accomodations including patience and > understanding from those not afflicted by the condition. In this > article I will present some everyday situations and ways you can help > your light-dependent friend or family member get through the day. > > Driving in the car going somewhere: When the person complains about > the bad driving of others, simply smile and distract him/her from the > road rage. Find a topic of conversation which interests both of you, > but still make sure they focus on their personal driving. Be patient > with them, although nothing is really solved by getting mad at other > drivers. They really can't help it sometimes. > Reading their own writing: Another factor of frustration for > light-dependent people is reading their own writing. Light-dependent > people don't have the advantage of using a system so eligant as > braille where letters are confused not too often, especially when > contractions are used. Because their system is more cumbersome and > they have the poor tendency to write sloppily when rushed they > sometimes can't even read what they've written. They also don't have > access to a refreshable display for their writing, so papers are > frequently lost in the shuffle. This leads to frustration and other > factors such as getting lost on the way to a destination or forgetting > something they needed from the store. Try to be patient and help them > remember what it is they wanted to buy, or perhaps that exit number > they told you they'd need to take off the highway. > In a college dorm at night: Sometimes your roommate may need to stay > up later than you and in order to complete their work they may need a > light. Again, be patient; if noise bothers you plug yourself into > your IPod and try falling asleep to music. If the light is bothersome > try to block it out; if you only have vision from one eye putting that > side of your face into the pillow does the trick wonderfully. Do > this, and be thankful that you don't necessarily need light to read a > book or that you can turn off the screen on your laptop out of > consideration for others. > > Okay, the last one was me grasping for straws, but you get the > picture. I also didn't mean to talk down sighted people; just an > attempt at humor. > > On 3/22/13, Brandon Keith Biggs wrote: >> Hello, >> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >> room for a sighted person. >> >> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. >> Sighted people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't >> like walking into >> >> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm >> outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining >> into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure >> print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >> >> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >> If you >> >> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make >> sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the >> sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without >> protection. >> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >> Thanks, >> >> Brandon Keith Biggs >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Josh Gregory >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >> >> wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>> earlier post. >>> Misty >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>> >>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> >>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>> Gregory >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>> good idea here, and when >>>> >>>> I >>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see >>>> what they're like. >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them >>>>> and give >>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>> philosophy! >>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>>> anything, and >>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>>> thread that >>>> I just started. >>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>> Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>>> You think >>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them >>>> to go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and >>>> large problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where >>>> do the ideas come from? >>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear >>>> "they are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may >>>> affect a blind person's employment or education worth your time? >>>> what if that blind person is you? >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>> terrible >>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>>> and >>>> before! >>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>> Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>> >>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>>> more...one is >>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>> >>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There >>>>>> is no >>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually >>>> impaired teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>>> Carrie >>>> Gilmer >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>>> Students >>>> mailing >>>>>>> list >>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>>> viewed four of them last >>>> night >>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>>> out that >>>> I >>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>>> completely >>>> unaware, >>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>>> from our >>>> life!, >>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>>> titled "How to set >>>> the >>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>>> dramatic language >>>> and >>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation >>>>>>> FOR the >>>> Blind) >>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>>> argument >>>> specific >>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>> problems >>>> with >>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING >>>>>>> ACCURATE ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! >>>>>>> I will be doing it one >>>> for >>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>>> permanently...as per >>>> their >>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> WA >>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the >>>>>>> Dept. of Consumer >>>> Affairs >>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>> info for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>> info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>>> m >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o >>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>>> m >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.co m >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai l.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai l.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. > com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o nmicrosoft.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 00:20:20 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 20:20:20 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <006c01ce2685$2bd46a10$837d3e30$@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <01cf01ce2726$686a23b0$393e6b10$@gmail.com> <002701ce274a$e9c09a60$bd41cf20$@gmail.com> <006c01ce2685$2bd46a10$837d3e30$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <000701ce275c$349ea610$9ddbf230$@gmail.com> Too add to what Justin said, it is another thing when you're spreading false information and portraying it as fact. BTW, I just tweeted the link to the "oral care" article with the comment: "To my blind followers: read at your own risk; ridiculous stuff about blindness inside." Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 6:41 PM To: jsoro620 at gmail.com; 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Freedom of speech is one thing, bur slandering and destroying the character of a group or deformation of character is another thing. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joe Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:17 PM To: 'NATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF BLIND STUDENTS' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Hi Carrie, My apologies. I used the word "dictate" in the context of submitting a complaint to the website for publishing this content. We should by all means correct the misconceptions, but filing a complaint because we do not agree with a portrayal seems contrary to the freedom of speech you acknowledge. Get on the website and publish your own material to drown out the misconceptions that may have been published to the detriment of the blind. With all due respect, it would have a more profound effect than preaching amongst ourselves about something we are all in agreement is nonsense.--Joe -----Original Message----- From: Carrie Gilmer [mailto:carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 2:38 PM To: jsoro620 at gmail.com; National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Who is dictating Joe? Very strange terminology to me. When people are stereotyped, generalized falsely, negatively, portrayed with bias, etc...this is a country of free speech...protest, dismay, correction is not only acceptable and the right of any respondent or charging party, some have through history argued it is a moral responsibility to discard silence in the face of prejudice and discrimination. Carrie Sent from my iPad On Mar 22, 2013, at 12:55 PM, "Joe" wrote: > I will add my own support to the complaint, not because of the content > but because people should not be quoated out of context. > Unfortunately, we cannot dictate how people are depicted, as negative > and frustrating as that may feel, but we can put out our own material > to combat misconceptions. I wrote my own piece a few months back and > share it here in case anyone wants to promote their own positive portrayals about blindness: > > http://joeorozco.com/blog_facts_about_blindness_according_to_me > > Joe > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie > Gilmer > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM > To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students > mailing list > Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello all~ > I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on > eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically > bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them > last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend > pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! > I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in the > midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal > from the article or from our life!, I believe it was pulled from. The > same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in the same article! > one of the articles is titled "How to set the table for a blind > person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind person"...They are > Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and ideas! They > appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) as a reference!!!!!!!! > > I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write > complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument > specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters > naming problems with each article are needed. > > We must get these off the internet. > > Contact for complaint for eHow: > > I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE > ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be > doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get > enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down > permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: > > Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at > eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, > Kirkland, WA 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the > Complaint Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the > Dept. of Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, > Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 > > Best, > > Carrie > > Sent from my iPad > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co m _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 00:22:53 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 20:22:53 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <006a01ce2685$04b268b0$0e173a10$@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com>, <006a01ce2685$04b268b0$0e173a10$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <000801ce275c$90167b30$b0437190$@gmail.com> Yeah... do they only use their vision to watch TV? Gotta make these people think sometimes, LOL! Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 6:40 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness It is a little annoying; almost as if you do completely different things. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Exactly! Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch TV! I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can tell somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends and my sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so he could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were just listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was the one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we didn't. Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on sighted people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of blindness really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, blind people can be equal or even advantaged. Arielle On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: > Lol. That is funny. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon > Keith Biggs > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello, > I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem > pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a > room for a sighted person. > > Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted > people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like > walking into > > bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. > Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside > and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into > their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print > labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the > sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If > there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are > printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white > background. Make sure your TV screen is on and > > make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. > If you > > wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person > won't feel left out of what you are doing. > If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure > to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted > person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. > If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact > with a sighted person comfortably in your house. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM > To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students > mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley > > wrote: > >> Hi, >> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >> earlier post. >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >> >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> >>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>> can't advocate without proper information. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>> Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>> good idea here, and when > >>> I >>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>> they're like. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>> give >>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>> philosophy! >>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>> anything, and >>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>> thread that >>> I just started. >>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>> You think >>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>> ideas come from? >>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>> that blind person is you? >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>> terrible >>> picture of blindness! >>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>> and >>> before! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>> Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>> >>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>> more...one is >>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>> >>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is >>>>> no >>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>> Carrie >>> Gilmer >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>> Students >>> mailing >>>>>> list >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>> viewed four of them last >>> night >>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>> out that >>> I >>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>> completely >>> unaware, >>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>> from our >>> life!, >>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>> titled "How to set >>> the >>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>> dramatic language >>> and >>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>> the >>> Blind) >>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>> >>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>> argument >>> specific >>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>> problems >>> with >>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>> >>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>> >>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>> >>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>>>>> doing it one >>> for >>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>> permanently...as per >>> their >>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>> >>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>> >>>>>> WA >>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>> of Consumer >>> Affairs >>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>> m >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o >>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>> m >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail > .com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.co > m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. > com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 00:27:48 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 20:27:48 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com>, Message-ID: <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com> How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does somebody feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks ago. Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Exactly! Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch TV! I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can tell somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends and my sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so he could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were just listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was the one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we didn't. Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on sighted people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of blindness really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, blind people can be equal or even advantaged. Arielle On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: > Lol. That is funny. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon > Keith Biggs > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello, > I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem > pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a > room for a sighted person. > > Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted > people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like > walking into > > bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. > Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside > and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into > their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print > labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the > sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If > there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are > printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white > background. Make sure your TV screen is on and > > make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. > If you > > wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person > won't feel left out of what you are doing. > If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure > to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted > person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. > If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact > with a sighted person comfortably in your house. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM > To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students > mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley > > wrote: > >> Hi, >> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >> earlier post. >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >> >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> >>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>> can't advocate without proper information. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>> Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>> good idea here, and when > >>> I >>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>> they're like. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>> give >>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>> philosophy! >>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>> anything, and >>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>> thread that >>> I just started. >>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>> You think >>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>> ideas come from? >>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>> that blind person is you? >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>> terrible >>> picture of blindness! >>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>> and >>> before! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>> Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>> >>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>> more...one is >>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>> >>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is >>>>> no >>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>> Carrie >>> Gilmer >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>> Students >>> mailing >>>>>> list >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>> viewed four of them last >>> night >>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>> out that >>> I >>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>> completely >>> unaware, >>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>> from our >>> life!, >>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>> titled "How to set >>> the >>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>> dramatic language >>> and >>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>> the >>> Blind) >>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>> >>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>> argument >>> specific >>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>> problems >>> with >>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>> >>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>> >>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>> >>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>>>>> doing it one >>> for >>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>> permanently...as per >>> their >>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>> >>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>> >>>>>> WA >>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>> of Consumer >>> Affairs >>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.co >>> m >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > aedu.o >>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.co >>> m >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > a.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail > .com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gm > ail.co > m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >> l.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% > 40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. > com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om From brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 00:32:17 2013 From: brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com (Brandon Keith Biggs) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 17:32:17 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com>, <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com> Message-ID: IDK, how do you eat? I've never seen someone eat with their eye before, I'd like to though... Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:27 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does somebody feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks ago. Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Exactly! Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch TV! I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can tell somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends and my sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so he could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were just listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was the one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we didn't. Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on sighted people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of blindness really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, blind people can be equal or even advantaged. Arielle On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: > Lol. That is funny. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon > Keith Biggs > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello, > I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem > pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a > room for a sighted person. > > Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted > people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like > walking into > > bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. > Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside > and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into > their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print > labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the > sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If > there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are > printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white > background. Make sure your TV screen is on and > > make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. > If you > > wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person > won't feel left out of what you are doing. > If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure > to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted > person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. > If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact > with a sighted person comfortably in your house. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM > To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students > mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley > > wrote: > >> Hi, >> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >> earlier post. >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >> >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> >>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>> can't advocate without proper information. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>> Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>> good idea here, and when > >>> I >>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>> they're like. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>> give >>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>> philosophy! >>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>> anything, and >>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>> thread that >>> I just started. >>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>> You think >>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>> ideas come from? >>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>> that blind person is you? >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>> terrible >>> picture of blindness! >>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>> and >>> before! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>> Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>> >>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>> more...one is >>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>> >>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is >>>>> no >>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>> Carrie >>> Gilmer >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>> Students >>> mailing >>>>>> list >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>> viewed four of them last >>> night >>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>> out that >>> I >>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>> completely >>> unaware, >>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>> from our >>> life!, >>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>> titled "How to set >>> the >>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>> dramatic language >>> and >>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>> the >>> Blind) >>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>> >>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>> argument >>> specific >>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>> problems >>> with >>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>> >>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>> >>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>> >>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>>>>> doing it one >>> for >>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>> permanently...as per >>> their >>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>> >>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>> >>>>>> WA >>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>> of Consumer >>> Affairs >>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.co >>> m >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > aedu.o >>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.co >>> m >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > a.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail > .com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gm > ail.co > m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >> l.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% > 40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. > com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com From turtlepower17 at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 00:33:56 2013 From: turtlepower17 at gmail.com (Desiree Oudinot) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 20:33:56 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com> <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com> Message-ID: And with that article floating around, people will continue to hold such ridiculous notions. Btw, I think it's worth mentioning that, although we can and should demand that these articles be removed, I would be willing to bet that they'll crop up somewhere else eventually. That's the blessing and curse of the internet--it's basically immortal. What you do and say on it is forever out of your hands. On 3/22/13, Chris Nusbaum wrote: > How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does somebody > feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks ago. > > Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair > Public Relations Committee > Maryland Association of Blind Students > Phone: (443) 547-2409 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Exactly! > Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch > TV! > I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can tell > somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. > Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman > [arielle71 at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends and my > sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so he > could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were just > listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it > struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was the > one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we didn't. > Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on sighted > people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of > blindness > really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, blind > people can be equal or even advantaged. > Arielle > > On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: >> Lol. That is funny. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >> Keith Biggs >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hello, >> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >> room for a sighted person. >> >> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted >> people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like >> walking into >> >> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside >> and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into >> their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print >> labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >> >> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >> If you >> >> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure >> to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted >> person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. >> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >> Thanks, >> >> Brandon Keith Biggs >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Josh Gregory >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >> >> wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>> earlier post. >>> Misty >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>> >>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> >>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>> Gregory >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>> good idea here, and when >> >>>> I >>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>>> they're like. >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>>> give >>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>> philosophy! >>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>>> anything, and >>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>>> thread that >>>> I just started. >>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>>> You think >>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >>>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >>>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>>> ideas come from? >>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >>>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >>>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>>> that blind person is you? >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>> terrible >>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>>> and >>>> before! >>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>> Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>> >>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>>> more...one is >>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>> >>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is >>>>>> no >>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >>>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>>> Carrie >>>> Gilmer >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>>> Students >>>> mailing >>>>>>> list >>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>>> viewed four of them last >>>> night >>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>>> out that >>>> I >>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>>> completely >>>> unaware, >>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>>> from our >>>> life!, >>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>>> titled "How to set >>>> the >>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>>> dramatic language >>>> and >>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>>> the >>>> Blind) >>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>>> argument >>>> specific >>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>> problems >>>> with >>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>>>>>> doing it one >>>> for >>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>>> permanently...as per >>>> their >>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> WA >>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>>> of Consumer >>>> Affairs >>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >>>>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm >> ail.co >>>> m >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >> aedu.o >>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm >> ail.co >>>> m >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >> a.edu >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail >> .com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gm >> ail.co >> m >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >>> l.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% >> 40gmai >> l.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >> com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/turtlepower17%40gmail.com > From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 00:32:46 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 20:32:46 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> Message-ID: <001d01ce275d$f13e3230$d3ba9690$@gmail.com> Wow... just wow! Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle Silverman Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:41 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness There's also another funny one, "how to entertain a blind person". One of the suggestions is to hold a musical competition, start singing a song as a group and then see who can finish the song after you turn off the music. You know, since blind people have such musical talent and superhearing...I laughed because I suck at remembering lyrics and would do horribly at that game! Arielle On 3/22/13, Joshua Lester wrote: > Kaiti: > Wow! > You attend Braille Beats? > Awesome! > That was a great post, BTW! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton > [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:53 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hi all, > > Brandon's last post made my week! I don't think it is right for stuff > like this to be available to give sighted people a false idea of what > blind people are like, but I too have seen many other articles that > don't make sense. (Have you seen the article about the importance of > teaching ASL to blind people yet?) There are plenty of non-blindness > related ones that are total trash to if you just look them up, and > nothing from E-How should be taken seriously. That being said, I > think I'm somewhere in between; I've recognized E-How for what it is > as Brandon pointed out, but I think that there is a definite line > between sensitivity and humor and in this case some of these articles > do cross that line. I know I would probably give someone the whatfor > if they tried to feed me or refused to give me a full glass of Coke > because I'm blind, but it's just a matter of letting E-How know they > should evaluate some of these grossly insensitive articles. > > Brandon: I know people from a music program I attend in the summers > called Braille Beats who actually describe sighted people as "Light > dependent." Your post reminded me of that and captured that idea > perfectly. > > How to manage a day with a Light-ependent person. > > People who have the misfortune of being congenitally dependent upon > light for survival need several accomodations including patience and > understanding from those not afflicted by the condition. In this > article I will present some everyday situations and ways you can help > your light-dependent friend or family member get through the day. > > Driving in the car going somewhere: When the person complains about > the bad driving of others, simply smile and distract him/her from the > road rage. Find a topic of conversation which interests both of you, > but still make sure they focus on their personal driving. Be patient > with them, although nothing is really solved by getting mad at other > drivers. They really can't help it sometimes. > Reading their own writing: Another factor of frustration for > light-dependent people is reading their own writing. Light-dependent > people don't have the advantage of using a system so eligant as > braille where letters are confused not too often, especially when > contractions are used. Because their system is more cumbersome and > they have the poor tendency to write sloppily when rushed they > sometimes can't even read what they've written. They also don't have > access to a refreshable display for their writing, so papers are > frequently lost in the shuffle. This leads to frustration and other > factors such as getting lost on the way to a destination or forgetting > something they needed from the store. Try to be patient and help them > remember what it is they wanted to buy, or perhaps that exit number > they told you they'd need to take off the highway. > In a college dorm at night: Sometimes your roommate may need to stay > up later than you and in order to complete their work they may need a > light. Again, be patient; if noise bothers you plug yourself into > your IPod and try falling asleep to music. If the light is bothersome > try to block it out; if you only have vision from one eye putting that > side of your face into the pillow does the trick wonderfully. Do > this, and be thankful that you don't necessarily need light to read a > book or that you can turn off the screen on your laptop out of > consideration for others. > > Okay, the last one was me grasping for straws, but you get the > picture. I also didn't mean to talk down sighted people; just an > attempt at humor. > > On 3/22/13, Brandon Keith Biggs wrote: >> Hello, >> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >> room for a sighted person. >> >> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. >> Sighted people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't >> like walking into >> >> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm >> outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining >> into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure >> print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >> >> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >> If you >> >> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make >> sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the >> sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without >> protection. >> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >> Thanks, >> >> Brandon Keith Biggs >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Josh Gregory >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >> >> wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>> earlier post. >>> Misty >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>> >>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> >>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>> Gregory >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>> good idea here, and when >>>> >>>> I >>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>>> they're >>>> like. >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>>> give >>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>> philosophy! >>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, >>>>> and >>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread >>>>> that >>>> I just started. >>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You >>>>> think >>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go >>>> on, >>>> unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem >>>> of >>>> employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come >>>> from? >>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct >>>> or >>>> stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth >>>> my >>>> time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's >>>> employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is >>>> you? >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>> terrible >>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >>>> before! >>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>> >>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one >>>>>> is >>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>> >>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>> accident >>>> practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 >>>> year >>>> old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a >>>> normal person born blind. >>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >>>> Gilmer >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >>>> mailing >>>>>>> list >>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >>>>>>> eHow >>>>>>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>>>>>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them >>>>>>> last >>>> night >>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out >>>>>>> that >>>> I >>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely >>>> unaware, >>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>> mixed >>>>>>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our >>>> life!, >>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine >>>>>>> also >>>>>>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to >>>>>>> set >>>> the >>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>>>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic >>>>>>> language >>>> and >>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>>> the >>>> Blind) >>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>> write >>>>>>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >>>> specific >>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>> problems >>>> with >>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>>> ABOUT >>>>>>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it >>>>>>> one >>>> for >>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>>>>>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per >>>> their >>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>>>>>> eHow, >>>>>>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, >>>>>>> Kirkland, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> WA >>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>> Assistance >>>>>>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer >>>> Affairs >>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>>> m >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o >>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>>> m >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.co m >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai l.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai l.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 00:36:09 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 20:36:09 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> Message-ID: <001e01ce275e$6a4cf300$3ee6d900$@gmail.com> Kaiti, Yes, I love that term and it is very accurate! It brings to mind an awesome quote in the signature of a person from another list: "Helping the light dependent to see." And Brandon, that's just hilarious! Chris Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:54 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Hi all, Brandon's last post made my week! I don't think it is right for stuff like this to be available to give sighted people a false idea of what blind people are like, but I too have seen many other articles that don't make sense. (Have you seen the article about the importance of teaching ASL to blind people yet?) There are plenty of non-blindness related ones that are total trash to if you just look them up, and nothing from E-How should be taken seriously. That being said, I think I'm somewhere in between; I've recognized E-How for what it is as Brandon pointed out, but I think that there is a definite line between sensitivity and humor and in this case some of these articles do cross that line. I know I would probably give someone the whatfor if they tried to feed me or refused to give me a full glass of Coke because I'm blind, but it's just a matter of letting E-How know they should evaluate some of these grossly insensitive articles. Brandon: I know people from a music program I attend in the summers called Braille Beats who actually describe sighted people as "Light dependent." Your post reminded me of that and captured that idea perfectly. How to manage a day with a Light-ependent person. People who have the misfortune of being congenitally dependent upon light for survival need several accomodations including patience and understanding from those not afflicted by the condition. In this article I will present some everyday situations and ways you can help your light-dependent friend or family member get through the day. Driving in the car going somewhere: When the person complains about the bad driving of others, simply smile and distract him/her from the road rage. Find a topic of conversation which interests both of you, but still make sure they focus on their personal driving. Be patient with them, although nothing is really solved by getting mad at other drivers. They really can't help it sometimes. Reading their own writing: Another factor of frustration for light-dependent people is reading their own writing. Light-dependent people don't have the advantage of using a system so eligant as braille where letters are confused not too often, especially when contractions are used. Because their system is more cumbersome and they have the poor tendency to write sloppily when rushed they sometimes can't even read what they've written. They also don't have access to a refreshable display for their writing, so papers are frequently lost in the shuffle. This leads to frustration and other factors such as getting lost on the way to a destination or forgetting something they needed from the store. Try to be patient and help them remember what it is they wanted to buy, or perhaps that exit number they told you they'd need to take off the highway. In a college dorm at night: Sometimes your roommate may need to stay up later than you and in order to complete their work they may need a light. Again, be patient; if noise bothers you plug yourself into your IPod and try falling asleep to music. If the light is bothersome try to block it out; if you only have vision from one eye putting that side of your face into the pillow does the trick wonderfully. Do this, and be thankful that you don't necessarily need light to read a book or that you can turn off the screen on your laptop out of consideration for others. Okay, the last one was me grasping for straws, but you get the picture. I also didn't mean to talk down sighted people; just an attempt at humor. On 3/22/13, Brandon Keith Biggs wrote: > Hello, > I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem > pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a > room for a sighted person. > > Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted > people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like > walking into > > bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. > Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside > and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into > their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print > labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the > sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If > there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are > printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white > background. Make sure your TV screen is on and > > make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. > If you > > wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person > won't feel left out of what you are doing. > If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure > to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted > person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. > If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact > with a sighted person comfortably in your house. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM > To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students > mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley > > wrote: > >> Hi, >> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >> earlier post. >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >> >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> >>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>> can't advocate without proper information. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>> Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>> good idea here, and when >>> >>> I >>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>> they're like. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>> give >>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>> philosophy! >>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>> anything, and >>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>> thread that >>> I just started. >>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>> You think >>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>> ideas come from? >>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>> that blind person is you? >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>> terrible >>> picture of blindness! >>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>> and >>> before! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>> Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>> >>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>> more...one is >>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>> >>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is >>>>> no >>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>> Carrie >>> Gilmer >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>> Students >>> mailing >>>>>> list >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>> viewed four of them last >>> night >>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>> out that >>> I >>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>> completely >>> unaware, >>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>> from our >>> life!, >>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>> titled "How to set >>> the >>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>> dramatic language >>> and >>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>> the >>> Blind) >>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>> >>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>> argument >>> specific >>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>> problems >>> with >>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>> >>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>> >>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>> >>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>>>>> doing it one >>> for >>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>> permanently...as per >>> their >>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>> >>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>> >>>>>> WA >>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>> of Consumer >>> Affairs >>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2 >>> %40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40 >>> gmail.co >>> m >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pc >>> cuaedu.o >>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40 >>> gmail.co >>> m >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pc >>> cua.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gm >>>> ail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2 >>> %40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40 >>> gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >> l.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% > 40gmail.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% > 40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 00:40:52 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 20:40:52 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com>, <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <002001ce275f$131df5b0$3959e110$@gmail.com> OMG, I love that! LOL! Can I use it? Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon Keith Biggs Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:32 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness IDK, how do you eat? I've never seen someone eat with their eye before, I'd like to though... Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:27 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does somebody feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks ago. Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Exactly! Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch TV! I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can tell somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends and my sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so he could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were just listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was the one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we didn't. Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on sighted people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of blindness really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, blind people can be equal or even advantaged. Arielle On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: > Lol. That is funny. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon > Keith Biggs > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello, > I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem > pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a > room for a sighted person. > > Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted > people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like > walking into > > bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. > Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside > and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into > their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print > labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the > sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If > there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are > printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white > background. Make sure your TV screen is on and > > make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. > If you > > wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person > won't feel left out of what you are doing. > If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure > to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted > person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. > If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact > with a sighted person comfortably in your house. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM > To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students > mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley > > wrote: > >> Hi, >> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >> earlier post. >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >> >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> >>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>> can't advocate without proper information. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>> Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>> good idea here, and when > >>> I >>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>> they're like. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>> give >>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>> philosophy! >>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>> anything, and >>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>> thread that >>> I just started. >>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>> You think >>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>> ideas come from? >>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>> that blind person is you? >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>> terrible >>> picture of blindness! >>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>> and >>> before! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>> Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>> >>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>> more...one is >>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>> >>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is >>>>> no >>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>> Carrie >>> Gilmer >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>> Students >>> mailing >>>>>> list >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>> viewed four of them last >>> night >>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>> out that >>> I >>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>> completely >>> unaware, >>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>> from our >>> life!, >>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>> titled "How to set >>> the >>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>> dramatic language >>> and >>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>> the >>> Blind) >>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>> >>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>> argument >>> specific >>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>> problems >>> with >>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>> >>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>> >>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>> >>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>>>>> doing it one >>> for >>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>> permanently...as per >>> their >>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>> >>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>> >>>>>> WA >>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>> of Consumer >>> Affairs >>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.co >>> m >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > aedu.o >>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.co >>> m >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > a.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail > .com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gm > ail.co > m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >> l.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% > 40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. > com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai l.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om From wmodnl at hotmail.com Sat Mar 23 01:20:57 2013 From: wmodnl at hotmail.com (wmodnl wmodnl) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 21:20:57 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> Message-ID: Quite honestly, I view ehow with as much importance as yahoo! If people want to buy in to that, then good for there ignorant minds. The average individual, and those who are educated or living outside a world of make-believe, read deeper in to things than what they see on Yahoo, or Ehow. Now, if this was a CNN, or MSNBC, then I would be quite concerned/mad. I was a media studies student as a under-grad. One important thing I remember is that, as the news writer, or author of a news segment, it is up to you, on how the story is shaped. I am not saying that the media often has hindered our progress, and/or views of us; however, I think we need to really focus on our causes. Especially when we review and know the source of the information. Hope my long-winded explanation gives you some food for thought. Have a good evening. Sent from my iPad On Mar 22, 2013, at 4:28 PM, "Brandon Keith Biggs" wrote: > Hello, > I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a room for a sighted person. > > Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like walking into bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. > Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white background. Make sure your TV screen is on and make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. If you wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person won't feel left out of what you are doing. > If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. > If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact with a sighted person comfortably in your house. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- From: Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM > To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley wrote: > >> Hi, >> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my earlier post. >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> >>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, and to >>> their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily refute them if >>> you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't advocate without >>> proper information. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you say that >>> it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, you can >>> assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, and when I >>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what they're >>> like. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: >>> >>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and give >>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB philosophy! >>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, and >>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread that >>> I just started. >>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You think >>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go on, >>> unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of >>> employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come from? >>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct or >>> stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth my >>> time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's >>> employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is you? >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>> >>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a terrible >>> picture of blindness! >>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >>> before! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>> >>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is >>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>> >>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident >>> practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 year >>> old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a >>> normal person born blind. >>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >>> Gilmer >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >>> mailing >>>>>> list >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow >>>>>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>>>>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last >>> night >>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that >>> I >>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely >>> unaware, >>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed >>>>>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our >>> life!, >>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also >>>>>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set >>> the >>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language >>> and >>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the >>> Blind) >>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>> >>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >>>>>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >>> specific >>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems >>> with >>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>> >>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>> >>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>> >>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT >>>>>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it one >>> for >>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>>>>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per >>> their >>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>> >>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at eHow, >>>>>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, WA >>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint Assistance >>>>>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer >>> Affairs >>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>> m >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o >>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>> m >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/wmodnl%40hotmail.com From brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 01:47:28 2013 From: brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com (Brandon Keith Biggs) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 18:47:28 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <002001ce275f$131df5b0$3959e110$@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com>, <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com> <002001ce275f$131df5b0$3959e110$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <5F3DD9B9927C4970934BB1F9078360A9@BrandonsLaptop2> Yep of course! I think instead of trying to take down people's uninformed articles, we should write the same article from the prospective of a blind person to a sighted person. Thanks, Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:40 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness OMG, I love that! LOL! Can I use it? Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon Keith Biggs Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:32 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness IDK, how do you eat? I've never seen someone eat with their eye before, I'd like to though... Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:27 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does somebody feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks ago. Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Exactly! Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch TV! I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can tell somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends and my sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so he could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were just listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was the one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we didn't. Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on sighted people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of blindness really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, blind people can be equal or even advantaged. Arielle On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: > Lol. That is funny. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon > Keith Biggs > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello, > I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem > pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a > room for a sighted person. > > Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted > people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like > walking into > > bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. > Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside > and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into > their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print > labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the > sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If > there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are > printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white > background. Make sure your TV screen is on and > > make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. > If you > > wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person > won't feel left out of what you are doing. > If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure > to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted > person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. > If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact > with a sighted person comfortably in your house. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM > To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students > mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley > > wrote: > >> Hi, >> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >> earlier post. >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >> >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> >>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>> can't advocate without proper information. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>> Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>> good idea here, and when > >>> I >>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>> they're like. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>> give >>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>> philosophy! >>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>> anything, and >>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>> thread that >>> I just started. >>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>> You think >>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>> ideas come from? >>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>> that blind person is you? >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>> terrible >>> picture of blindness! >>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>> and >>> before! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>> Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>> >>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>> more...one is >>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>> >>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is >>>>> no >>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>> Carrie >>> Gilmer >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>> Students >>> mailing >>>>>> list >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>> viewed four of them last >>> night >>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>> out that >>> I >>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>> completely >>> unaware, >>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>> from our >>> life!, >>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>> titled "How to set >>> the >>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>> dramatic language >>> and >>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>> the >>> Blind) >>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>> >>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>> argument >>> specific >>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>> problems >>> with >>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>> >>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>> >>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>> >>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>>>>> doing it one >>> for >>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>> permanently...as per >>> their >>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>> >>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>> >>>>>> WA >>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>> of Consumer >>> Affairs >>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.co >>> m >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > aedu.o >>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.co >>> m >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > a.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail > .com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gm > ail.co > m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >> l.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% > 40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. > com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai l.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 01:50:53 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 21:50:53 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Getting our message out there, and changing views about blindness! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <002701ce2768$daca5be0$905f13a0$@gmail.com> And if you can't attend, you can still learn everything you need to know after the fact in the post-Seminar issue of the Braille Monitor, usually the March issue. Chris Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Getting our message out there, and changing views about blindness! joshua: Although there is occasional testimony by Federationists before congressional committees at hearings taking place during Washington Seminar, most of the Federation activity consists of visits to offices of senators and representatives so wouldn't be covered by CSPAN. As for keeping track of what's going on, the best way is to save your money and attend yourself. If it is important enough to you, you'll find a way. Being active at the local and state level is a good start. Mike Freeman sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2013, at 11:54, Joshua Lester wrote: > Hi all. > I just thought of a question, and maybe this would give someone in the organization an idea about getting our message out there! > As I was looking at this EHow thread, I was getting upset because, it seems that these people haven't seen what we can do! > It dawned on me, that we haven't been proactive in getting the truth out there! > Washington seminar would be a good place to start! > Why is it, that most congressional events are broadcast on CSpan, yet the parts of the seminar, where we testify before them doesn't get videoed? > We need to pressure the people at CSpan to broadcast our testimonys, because that way, the sighted people that watch CSpan can see what we can do, and learn from us! > Also, it will give me a chance to hear what's going on, since I'm not able to attend. > Thanks, Joshua > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om From jsoro620 at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 01:55:44 2013 From: jsoro620 at gmail.com (Joe) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 21:55:44 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <01cf01ce2726$686a23b0$393e6b10$@gmail.com> <002701ce274a$e9c09a60$bd41cf20$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <004201ce2769$8809dc40$981d94c0$@gmail.com> Carrie, I don't want to give the impression that I think you are wrong to launch your campaigns against media outlets you believe are portraying inaccurate images of blind people. On the contrary, more power to you. If I'm not mistaken, you yourself are a sighted person, and it's great we have someone passionate like you on our side who understands a blind person's full potential. But, it's eHow.com, a forum that is by its nature a free flow of information, as good as what you pay for. There are only so many hours in a day, and we can either choose to live to staunch every mischaracterization of blindness, or we can choose to live period. In my case, if it's not blindness stereotypes I was fighting, it would be the fact that I'm Hispanic or Republican or any number of things that could equally be misconstrued in the public conscious. We're agreed no basket will ever be made if we never aim and shoot. Yet, I would submit it is hard enough being a positive ambassador for other blind people without worrying about every slanted article or news clip produced contrary to our advocacy. I would die trying to reverse the injustice and still touch only a fraction of the crap out there. Anyway, I'm beginning to exert the same pressure I accuse you of applying. By all means raise hell if that moves folks, but if some of us choose to view the whole thing as nonsense and think we could spend our energy on other fronts, don't paint us out to be insensitive or misinformed. It's just a game some of us choose not to engage. Joe -----Original Message----- From: Carrie Gilmer [mailto:carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:24 PM To: jsoro620 at gmail.com; National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness I agree that publishing ourselves is a great idea. I cannot comprehend how you consider "filing a complaint" contrary to freedom of speech. They were free to write this, and are free it seems to disseminate false information...except there may be a true question of knowingly disseminating false information vs ignorantly doing so. One is always free to respond. freedom of speech is a one way street in your study/understanding of constitutional law? We can laugh at the ridiculousness to make ourselves feel better, we can ignore as we are just tired of one more thing, or we can ignore convincing ourselves that any correction sent in or protest will have no effect....all of those maintain the status quo. no basket can be made, no point ever scored, if you do not shoot. i hope some of you take a shot. I am. A while ago, HBO had a commercial for the show The Sopranos that portrayed blind people very badly. i wrote the CEO of TimeWarner. i rook great time and care, I wrote a professional level letter with passion. He read it himself. He wrote me back personally. The commercial was actually pulled, something I did not even ask for. This man is putting policies in place, including hiring, and training...and is aware of programming content and purchase for a VERY large media company. His idea of blindness is forever changed. That was no little deal. i was the only one, sometimes one letter can touch a person in power. Not long after, Tom Toles, a pulitzer prize winning political cartoonist, made a cartoon that mischaracterized the blind, it was offensive and perpetuated false ideas. I wrote him a long, passionate, reasoned, proper english, professional letter and told him how i felt, why it was a problem, and it had ruined my morning. He personally wrote back and apologized. An assure you he will never again use a blind character in his cartoon that gives false ideas about blindness. How do you eat an elephant? one bite at a time. Best to you Joe, Carrie Sent from my iPad On Mar 22, 2013, at 5:16 PM, "Joe" wrote: > Hi Carrie, > > My apologies. I used the word "dictate" in the context of submitting a > complaint to the website for publishing this content. We should by all > means correct the misconceptions, but filing a complaint because we do > not agree with a portrayal seems contrary to the freedom of speech you acknowledge. > Get on the website and publish your own material to drown out the > misconceptions that may have been published to the detriment of the blind. > With all due respect, it would have a more profound effect than > preaching amongst ourselves about something we are all in agreement is > nonsense.--Joe > > -----Original Message----- > From: Carrie Gilmer [mailto:carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 2:38 PM > To: jsoro620 at gmail.com; National Association of Blind Students mailing > list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Who is dictating Joe? Very strange terminology to me. When people are > stereotyped, generalized falsely, negatively, portrayed with bias, > etc...this is a country of free speech...protest, dismay, correction > is not only acceptable and the right of any respondent or charging > party, some have through history argued it is a moral responsibility > to discard silence in the face of prejudice and discrimination. > Carrie > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 12:55 PM, "Joe" wrote: > >> I will add my own support to the complaint, not because of the >> content but because people should not be quoated out of context. >> Unfortunately, we cannot dictate how people are depicted, as negative >> and frustrating as that may feel, but we can put out our own material >> to combat misconceptions. I wrote my own piece a few months back and >> share it here in case anyone wants to promote their own positive > portrayals about blindness: >> >> http://joeorozco.com/blog_facts_about_blindness_according_to_me >> >> Joe >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >> Gilmer >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing list >> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hello all~ >> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >> eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically >> bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them >> last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend >> pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! >> I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in the >> midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal >> from the article or from our life!, I believe it was pulled from. The >> same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in the same article! >> one of the articles is titled "How to set the table for a blind >> person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind person"...They are >> Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and ideas! They >> appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) as a > reference!!!!!!!! >> >> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >> specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters >> naming problems with each article are needed. >> >> We must get these off the internet. >> >> Contact for complaint for eHow: >> >> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >> doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get >> enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down >> permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: >> >> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >> eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, >> Kirkland, WA 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the >> Complaint Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the >> Dept. of Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, >> Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 >> >> Best, >> >> Carrie >> >> Sent from my iPad >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail. >> c >> om >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.co > m > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co m From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 02:04:32 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 22:04:32 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> , <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> Message-ID: <002d01ce276a$c2f2ed00$48d8c700$@gmail.com> Yes, I am planning to write to them as well. Hmm... wonder if a bunch of us Federationists writing to them and telling them our feelings on this nonsense would put some pressure on them to pull the articles or at least correct the many inaccuracies? It's worked before. Keep the pressure on!! Chris Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:12 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness I don't want to read their trash. If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and give them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB philosophy! Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, and have never seen a blind person do anything independently! We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread that I just started. Thanks, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You think we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come from? how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is you? Carrie Sent from my iPad On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a terrible picture of blindness! > I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and before! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer > [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html > > There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one is also titled "how to feed a blind person" > > What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. > The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. > Carrie > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" wrote: > >> Where are the articles? >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >> Gilmer >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing list >> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hello all~ >> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >> eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically >> bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them >> last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend >> pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! >> I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in the >> midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal >> from the article or from our life!, I believe it was pulled from. The >> same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in the same article! >> one of the articles is titled "How to set the table for a blind >> person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind person"...They are >> Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and ideas! They >> appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) as a reference!!!!!!!! >> >> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >> specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters >> naming problems with each article are needed. >> >> We must get these off the internet. >> >> Contact for complaint for eHow: >> >> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >> doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get >> enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down >> permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: >> >> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >> eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, >> Kirkland, WA 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the >> Complaint Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the >> Dept. of Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, >> Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 >> >> Best, >> >> Carrie >> >> Sent from my iPad >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >> 40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40g >> mail.com > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > aedu.onmicrosoft.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 02:12:25 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2013 22:12:25 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com>, <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <000701ce26a2$b2d5da40$18818ec0$@gmail.com> I've had people ask me or my friends if I would be capable of eating dinner on a date. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris Nusbaum Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:28 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does somebody feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks ago. Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Exactly! Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch TV! I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can tell somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends and my sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so he could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were just listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was the one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we didn't. Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on sighted people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of blindness really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, blind people can be equal or even advantaged. Arielle On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: > Lol. That is funny. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon > Keith Biggs > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello, > I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem > pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a > room for a sighted person. > > Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted > people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like > walking into > > bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. > Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside > and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into > their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print > labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the > sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If > there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are > printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white > background. Make sure your TV screen is on and > > make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. > If you > > wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person > won't feel left out of what you are doing. > If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure > to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted > person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. > If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact > with a sighted person comfortably in your house. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM > To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students > mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley > > wrote: > >> Hi, >> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >> earlier post. >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >> >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> >>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>> can't advocate without proper information. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>> Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>> good idea here, and when > >>> I >>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>> they're like. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>> give >>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>> philosophy! >>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>> anything, and >>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>> thread that >>> I just started. >>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>> You think >>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>> ideas come from? >>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>> that blind person is you? >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>> terrible >>> picture of blindness! >>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>> and >>> before! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>> Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>> >>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>> more...one is >>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>> >>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is >>>>> no >>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>> Carrie >>> Gilmer >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>> Students >>> mailing >>>>>> list >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>> viewed four of them last >>> night >>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>> out that >>> I >>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>> completely >>> unaware, >>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>> from our >>> life!, >>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>> titled "How to set >>> the >>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>> dramatic language >>> and >>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>> the >>> Blind) >>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>> >>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>> argument >>> specific >>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>> problems >>> with >>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>> >>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>> >>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>> >>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>>>>> doing it one >>> for >>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>> permanently...as per >>> their >>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>> >>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>> >>>>>> WA >>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>> of Consumer >>> Affairs >>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.co >>> m >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > aedu.o >>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.co >>> m >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > a.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail > .com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gm > ail.co > m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >> l.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% > 40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. > com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 02:14:05 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 22:14:05 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <000701ce26a2$b2d5da40$18818ec0$@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com>, <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com> <000701ce26a2$b2d5da40$18818ec0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <003201ce276c$189bad90$49d308b0$@gmail.com> Huh? Don't humans need food to survive? I guess they think blind people have a very short lifespan then, LOL. Chris Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 10:12 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness I've had people ask me or my friends if I would be capable of eating dinner on a date. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris Nusbaum Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:28 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does somebody feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks ago. Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Exactly! Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch TV! I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can tell somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends and my sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so he could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were just listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was the one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we didn't. Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on sighted people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of blindness really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, blind people can be equal or even advantaged. Arielle On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: > Lol. That is funny. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon > Keith Biggs > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello, > I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem > pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a > room for a sighted person. > > Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted > people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like > walking into > > bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. > Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside > and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into > their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print > labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the > sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If > there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are > printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white > background. Make sure your TV screen is on and > > make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. > If you > > wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person > won't feel left out of what you are doing. > If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure > to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted > person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. > If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact > with a sighted person comfortably in your house. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM > To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students > mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley > > wrote: > >> Hi, >> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >> earlier post. >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >> >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> >>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>> can't advocate without proper information. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>> Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>> good idea here, and when > >>> I >>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>> they're like. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>> give >>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>> philosophy! >>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>> anything, and >>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>> thread that >>> I just started. >>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>> You think >>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>> ideas come from? >>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>> that blind person is you? >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>> terrible >>> picture of blindness! >>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>> and >>> before! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>> Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>> >>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>> more...one is >>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>> >>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is >>>>> no >>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>> Carrie >>> Gilmer >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>> Students >>> mailing >>>>>> list >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>> viewed four of them last >>> night >>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>> out that >>> I >>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>> completely >>> unaware, >>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>> from our >>> life!, >>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>> titled "How to set >>> the >>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>> dramatic language >>> and >>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>> the >>> Blind) >>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>> >>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>> argument >>> specific >>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>> problems >>> with >>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>> >>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>> >>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>> >>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>>>>> doing it one >>> for >>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>> permanently...as per >>> their >>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>> >>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>> >>>>>> WA >>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>> of Consumer >>> Affairs >>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.co >>> m >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > aedu.o >>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.co >>> m >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > a.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail > .com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gm > ail.co > m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >> l.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% > 40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. > com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om From brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 02:48:43 2013 From: brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com (Brandon Keith Biggs) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 19:48:43 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <003201ce276c$189bad90$49d308b0$@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com>, <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com><000701ce26a2$b2d5da40$18818ec0$@gmail.com> <003201ce276c$189bad90$49d308b0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <7BA3749145E6473FA66942508ABF1D35@BrandonsLaptop2> No, We use these things called food patches we swipe over our arm that puts the nourishment for a good sized meal into our bloodstream. They are used completely by feel with Braille labels so we don't need any help with them. That way we are never in need of wasting extra time eating and doing this horribly unnatural thing called socializing over dinner. If for some reason we are allergic to the substance excreted by the patches, we can bring around a personalized IV that is permanently attached to our arm, injecting our meals directly into our vain. If a blind person ever touches a fork they are in danger of stabbing themselves in the eye which is in front of them, but because they can't see is magically put in the way of any sharp object they may handle. If they eat solid food they may become poisoned because they can't see the germs to keep from consuming bad food. In all cases blind people are never to be given dinner except in their arm patches. Thanks, Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:14 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Huh? Don't humans need food to survive? I guess they think blind people have a very short lifespan then, LOL. Chris Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 10:12 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness I've had people ask me or my friends if I would be capable of eating dinner on a date. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris Nusbaum Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:28 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does somebody feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks ago. Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Exactly! Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch TV! I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can tell somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends and my sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so he could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were just listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was the one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we didn't. Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on sighted people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of blindness really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, blind people can be equal or even advantaged. Arielle On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: > Lol. That is funny. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon > Keith Biggs > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello, > I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem > pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a > room for a sighted person. > > Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted > people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like > walking into > > bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. > Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside > and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into > their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print > labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the > sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If > there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are > printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white > background. Make sure your TV screen is on and > > make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. > If you > > wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person > won't feel left out of what you are doing. > If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure > to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted > person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. > If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact > with a sighted person comfortably in your house. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM > To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students > mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley > > wrote: > >> Hi, >> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >> earlier post. >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >> >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> >>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>> can't advocate without proper information. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>> Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>> good idea here, and when > >>> I >>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>> they're like. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>> give >>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>> philosophy! >>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>> anything, and >>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>> thread that >>> I just started. >>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>> You think >>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>> ideas come from? >>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>> that blind person is you? >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>> terrible >>> picture of blindness! >>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>> and >>> before! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>> Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>> >>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>> more...one is >>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>> >>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is >>>>> no >>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>> Carrie >>> Gilmer >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>> Students >>> mailing >>>>>> list >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>> viewed four of them last >>> night >>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>> out that >>> I >>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>> completely >>> unaware, >>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>> from our >>> life!, >>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>> titled "How to set >>> the >>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>> dramatic language >>> and >>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>> the >>> Blind) >>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>> >>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>> argument >>> specific >>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>> problems >>> with >>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>> >>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>> >>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>> >>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>>>>> doing it one >>> for >>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>> permanently...as per >>> their >>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>> >>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>> >>>>>> WA >>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>> of Consumer >>> Affairs >>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.co >>> m >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > aedu.o >>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.co >>> m >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > a.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail > .com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gm > ail.co > m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >> l.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% > 40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. > com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 02:56:31 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 22:56:31 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <7BA3749145E6473FA66942508ABF1D35@BrandonsLaptop2> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com>, <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com><000701ce26a2$b2d5da40$18818ec0$@gmail.com> <003201ce276c$189bad90$49d308b0$@gmail.com> <7BA3749145E6473FA66942508ABF1D35@BrandonsLaptop2> Message-ID: <000401ce2772$06041950$120c4bf0$@gmail.com> Brandon, You are hilarious!!!!!!! LOL!!! Now a knife... that's just out of the question. Chris Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon Keith Biggs Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 10:49 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness No, We use these things called food patches we swipe over our arm that puts the nourishment for a good sized meal into our bloodstream. They are used completely by feel with Braille labels so we don't need any help with them. That way we are never in need of wasting extra time eating and doing this horribly unnatural thing called socializing over dinner. If for some reason we are allergic to the substance excreted by the patches, we can bring around a personalized IV that is permanently attached to our arm, injecting our meals directly into our vain. If a blind person ever touches a fork they are in danger of stabbing themselves in the eye which is in front of them, but because they can't see is magically put in the way of any sharp object they may handle. If they eat solid food they may become poisoned because they can't see the germs to keep from consuming bad food. In all cases blind people are never to be given dinner except in their arm patches. Thanks, Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:14 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Huh? Don't humans need food to survive? I guess they think blind people have a very short lifespan then, LOL. Chris Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 10:12 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness I've had people ask me or my friends if I would be capable of eating dinner on a date. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris Nusbaum Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:28 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does somebody feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks ago. Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Exactly! Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch TV! I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can tell somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends and my sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so he could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were just listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was the one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we didn't. Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on sighted people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of blindness really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, blind people can be equal or even advantaged. Arielle On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: > Lol. That is funny. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon > Keith Biggs > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello, > I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem > pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a > room for a sighted person. > > Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted > people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like > walking into > > bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. > Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside > and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into > their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print > labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the > sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If > there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are > printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white > background. Make sure your TV screen is on and > > make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. > If you > > wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person > won't feel left out of what you are doing. > If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure > to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted > person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. > If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact > with a sighted person comfortably in your house. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM > To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students > mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley > > wrote: > >> Hi, >> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >> earlier post. >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >> >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> >>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>> can't advocate without proper information. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>> Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>> good idea here, and when > >>> I >>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>> they're like. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>> give >>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>> philosophy! >>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>> anything, and >>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>> thread that >>> I just started. >>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>> You think >>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>> ideas come from? >>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>> that blind person is you? >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>> terrible >>> picture of blindness! >>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>> and >>> before! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>> Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>> >>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>> more...one is >>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>> >>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is >>>>> no >>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>> Carrie >>> Gilmer >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>> Students >>> mailing >>>>>> list >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>> viewed four of them last >>> night >>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>> out that >>> I >>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>> completely >>> unaware, >>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>> from our >>> life!, >>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>> titled "How to set >>> the >>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>> dramatic language >>> and >>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>> the >>> Blind) >>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>> >>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>> argument >>> specific >>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>> problems >>> with >>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>> >>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>> >>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>> >>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>>>>> doing it one >>> for >>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>> permanently...as per >>> their >>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>> >>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>> >>>>>> WA >>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>> of Consumer >>> Affairs >>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.co >>> m >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > aedu.o >>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.co >>> m >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > a.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail > .com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gm > ail.co > m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >> l.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% > 40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. > com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai l.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om From carrie.gilmer at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 03:04:54 2013 From: carrie.gilmer at gmail.com (Carrie Gilmer) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 22:04:54 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <7BA3749145E6473FA66942508ABF1D35@BrandonsLaptop2> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com> <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com> <000701ce26a2$b2d5da40$18818ec0$@gmail.com> <003201ce276c$189bad90$49d308b0$@gmail.com> <7BA3749145E6473FA66942508ABF1D35@BrandonsLaptop2> Message-ID: I do think you are very funny and witty and bright Brandon. Sometimes writing with such outrageous solutions and things with the tables turned can have great results in making people realize just how foolish their notions are. Especially if it is written to a third person involved, i.e. not the author, but the publisher or supervisor or editor. it is easier to see someone else's foolishness rather than one's own. Carrie Sent from my iPad On Mar 22, 2013, at 9:48 PM, "Brandon Keith Biggs" wrote: > No, > We use these things called food patches we swipe over our arm that puts the nourishment for a good sized meal into our bloodstream. They are used completely by feel with Braille labels so we don't need any help with them. That way we are never in need of wasting extra time eating and doing this horribly unnatural thing called socializing over dinner. If for some reason we are allergic to the substance excreted by the patches, we can bring around a personalized IV that is permanently attached to our arm, injecting our meals directly into our vain. If a blind person ever touches a fork they are in danger of stabbing themselves in the eye which is in front of them, but because they can't see is magically put in the way of any sharp object they may handle. If they eat solid food they may become poisoned because they can't see the germs to keep from consuming bad food. > In all cases blind people are never to be given dinner except in their arm patches. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:14 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Huh? Don't humans need food to survive? I guess they think blind people have > a very short lifespan then, LOL. > > Chris > > Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair > Public Relations Committee > Maryland Association of Blind Students > Phone: (443) 547-2409 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams > Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 10:12 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > I've had people ask me or my friends if I would be capable of eating dinner > on a date. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris Nusbaum > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:28 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does somebody > feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks ago. > > Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair > Public Relations Committee > Maryland Association of Blind Students > Phone: (443) 547-2409 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Exactly! > Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch TV! > I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can tell > somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. > Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman > [arielle71 at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends and my > sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so he > could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were just > listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it > struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was the > one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we didn't. > Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on sighted > people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of blindness > really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, blind > people can be equal or even advantaged. > Arielle > > On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: >> Lol. That is funny. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >> Keith Biggs >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hello, >> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >> room for a sighted person. >> >> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted >> people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like >> walking into >> >> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside >> and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into >> their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print >> labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >> >> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >> If you >> >> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure >> to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted >> person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. >> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >> Thanks, >> >> Brandon Keith Biggs >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Josh Gregory >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >> >> wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>> earlier post. >>> Misty >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>> >>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> >>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>> Gregory >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>> good idea here, and when >> >>>> I >>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>>> they're like. >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>>> give >>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>> philosophy! >>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>>> anything, and >>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>>> thread that >>>> I just started. >>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>>> You think >>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >>>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >>>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>>> ideas come from? >>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >>>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >>>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>>> that blind person is you? >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>> terrible >>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>>> and >>>> before! >>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>> Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>> >>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>>> more...one is >>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>> >>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is >>>>>> no >>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >>>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>>> Carrie >>>> Gilmer >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>>> Students >>>> mailing >>>>>>> list >>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>>> viewed four of them last >>>> night >>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>>> out that >>>> I >>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>>> completely >>>> unaware, >>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>>> from our >>>> life!, >>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>>> titled "How to set >>>> the >>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>>> dramatic language >>>> and >>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>>> the >>>> Blind) >>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>>> argument >>>> specific >>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>> problems >>>> with >>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>>>>>> doing it one >>>> for >>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>>> permanently...as per >>>> their >>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> WA >>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>>> of Consumer >>>> Affairs >>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >>>>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm >> ail.co >>>> m >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >> aedu.o >>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm >> ail.co >>>> m >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >> a.edu >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail >> .com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gm >> ail.co >> m >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >>> l.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% >> 40gmai >> l.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >> com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com From brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 04:06:16 2013 From: brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com (Brandon Keith Biggs) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 21:06:16 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <000401ce2772$06041950$120c4bf0$@gmail.com> References: <000401ce2772$06041950$120c4bf0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <2ECC4F7279F341D8897FC8944C8EB16B@BrandonsLaptop2> What's a knife? I know there is a game called life, but I'm not allowed to play it because I may choke on the cars or babies. I'm not sure why because for one I would never be able to fit a baby into my mouth let alone a car! A knife must be something that people use with babies or cars! Thanks, Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:56 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Brandon, You are hilarious!!!!!!! LOL!!! Now a knife... that's just out of the question. Chris Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon Keith Biggs Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 10:49 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness No, We use these things called food patches we swipe over our arm that puts the nourishment for a good sized meal into our bloodstream. They are used completely by feel with Braille labels so we don't need any help with them. That way we are never in need of wasting extra time eating and doing this horribly unnatural thing called socializing over dinner. If for some reason we are allergic to the substance excreted by the patches, we can bring around a personalized IV that is permanently attached to our arm, injecting our meals directly into our vain. If a blind person ever touches a fork they are in danger of stabbing themselves in the eye which is in front of them, but because they can't see is magically put in the way of any sharp object they may handle. If they eat solid food they may become poisoned because they can't see the germs to keep from consuming bad food. In all cases blind people are never to be given dinner except in their arm patches. Thanks, Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:14 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Huh? Don't humans need food to survive? I guess they think blind people have a very short lifespan then, LOL. Chris Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 10:12 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness I've had people ask me or my friends if I would be capable of eating dinner on a date. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris Nusbaum Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:28 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does somebody feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks ago. Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Exactly! Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch TV! I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can tell somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends and my sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so he could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were just listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was the one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we didn't. Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on sighted people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of blindness really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, blind people can be equal or even advantaged. Arielle On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: > Lol. That is funny. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon > Keith Biggs > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello, > I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem > pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a > room for a sighted person. > > Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted > people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like > walking into > > bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. > Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside > and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into > their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print > labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the > sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If > there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are > printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white > background. Make sure your TV screen is on and > > make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. > If you > > wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person > won't feel left out of what you are doing. > If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure > to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted > person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. > If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact > with a sighted person comfortably in your house. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM > To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students > mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley > > wrote: > >> Hi, >> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >> earlier post. >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >> >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> >>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>> can't advocate without proper information. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>> Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>> good idea here, and when > >>> I >>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>> they're like. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>> give >>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>> philosophy! >>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>> anything, and >>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>> thread that >>> I just started. >>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>> You think >>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>> ideas come from? >>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>> that blind person is you? >>>> Carrie >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>> terrible >>> picture of blindness! >>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>> and >>> before! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>> Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>> >>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>> more...one is >>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>> >>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is >>>>> no >>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>> Carrie >>> Gilmer >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>> Students >>> mailing >>>>>> list >>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>> viewed four of them last >>> night >>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>> out that >>> I >>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>> completely >>> unaware, >>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>> from our >>> life!, >>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>> titled "How to set >>> the >>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>> dramatic language >>> and >>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>> the >>> Blind) >>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>> >>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>> argument >>> specific >>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>> problems >>> with >>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>> >>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>> >>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>> >>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>>>>> doing it one >>> for >>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>> permanently...as per >>> their >>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>> >>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>> >>>>>> WA >>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>> of Consumer >>> Affairs >>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.co >>> m >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > aedu.o >>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm > ail.co >>> m >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > a.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>> nabs-l: >>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail > .com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gm > ail.co > m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >> l.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% > 40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. > com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai l.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com From joshkart12 at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 04:13:42 2013 From: joshkart12 at gmail.com (Josh Gregory) Date: Sat, 23 Mar 2013 00:13:42 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <2ECC4F7279F341D8897FC8944C8EB16B@BrandonsLaptop2> References: <000401ce2772$06041950$120c4bf0$@gmail.com> <2ECC4F7279F341D8897FC8944C8EB16B@BrandonsLaptop2> Message-ID: We may joke about this all we want, but that does not take away from the seriousness of the situation. Yes it is good to joke, However, it is good to know that there is a side of this which we must deal with. I'm all for a joke once in a while, but there are times when we need to take action rather than have fun with it. Sent from my iPhone On Mar 23, 2013, at 12:06 AM, "Brandon Keith Biggs" wrote: > What's a knife? > I know there is a game called life, but I'm not allowed to play it because I may choke on the cars or babies. I'm not sure why because for one I would never be able to fit a baby into my mouth let alone a car! > A knife must be something that people use with babies or cars! > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:56 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Brandon, > > You are hilarious!!!!!!! LOL!!! Now a knife... that's just out of the > question. > > Chris > > Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair > Public Relations Committee > Maryland Association of Blind Students > Phone: (443) 547-2409 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon Keith > Biggs > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 10:49 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > No, > We use these things called food patches we swipe over our arm that puts the > nourishment for a good sized meal into our bloodstream. They are used > completely by feel with Braille labels so we don't need any help with them. > That way we are never in need of wasting extra time eating and doing this > horribly unnatural thing called socializing over dinner. If for some reason > we are allergic to the substance excreted by the patches, we can bring > around a personalized IV that is permanently attached to our arm, injecting > our meals directly into our vain. If a blind person ever touches a fork they > are in danger of stabbing themselves in the eye which is in front of them, > but because they can't see is magically put in the way of any sharp object > they may handle. If they eat solid food they may become poisoned because > they can't see the germs to keep from consuming bad food. > In all cases blind people are never to be given dinner except in their arm > patches. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Chris Nusbaum > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:14 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Huh? Don't humans need food to survive? I guess they think blind people have > a very short lifespan then, LOL. > > Chris > > Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair > Public Relations Committee > Maryland Association of Blind Students > Phone: (443) 547-2409 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams > Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 10:12 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > I've had people ask me or my friends if I would be capable of eating dinner > on a date. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris Nusbaum > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:28 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does somebody > feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks ago. > > Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair > Public Relations Committee > Maryland Association of Blind Students > Phone: (443) 547-2409 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Exactly! > Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch TV! > I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can tell > somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. > Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman > [arielle71 at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends and my > sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so he > could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were just > listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it > struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was the > one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we didn't. > Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on sighted > people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of blindness > really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, blind > people can be equal or even advantaged. > Arielle > > On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: >> Lol. That is funny. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >> Keith Biggs >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hello, >> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >> room for a sighted person. >> >> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted >> people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like >> walking into >> >> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside >> and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into >> their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print >> labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >> >> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >> If you >> >> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure >> to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted >> person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. >> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >> Thanks, >> >> Brandon Keith Biggs >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Josh Gregory >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >> >> wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>> earlier post. >>> Misty >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>> >>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> >>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>> Gregory >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>> good idea here, and when >> >>>> I >>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>>> they're like. >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>>> give >>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>> philosophy! >>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>>> anything, and >>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>>> thread that >>>> I just started. >>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>>> You think >>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >>>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >>>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>>> ideas come from? >>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >>>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >>>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>>> that blind person is you? >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>> terrible >>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>>> and >>>> before! >>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>> Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>> >>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>>> more...one is >>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>> >>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is >>>>>> no >>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >>>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>>> Carrie >>>> Gilmer >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>>> Students >>>> mailing >>>>>>> list >>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>>> viewed four of them last >>>> night >>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>>> out that >>>> I >>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>>> completely >>>> unaware, >>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>>> from our >>>> life!, >>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>>> titled "How to set >>>> the >>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>>> dramatic language >>>> and >>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>>> the >>>> Blind) >>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>>> argument >>>> specific >>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>> problems >>>> with >>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>>>>>> doing it one >>>> for >>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>>> permanently...as per >>>> their >>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> WA >>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>>> of Consumer >>>> Affairs >>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >>>>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm >> ail.co >>>> m >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >> aedu.o >>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm >> ail.co >>>> m >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> 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>> l.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >> com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com From sweetpeareader at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 05:54:30 2013 From: sweetpeareader at gmail.com (Sophie Trist) Date: Sat, 23 Mar 2013 00:54:30 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Message-ID: <514d43a9.af76ec0a.48de.092a@mx.google.com> Kaiti, if we restricted people from writing these articles, as stupid and bogus as they might be, we'd be violating the first amendment. Free speech can be a double-edged sword in cases like this. As for the teaching ASL to blind people, that's a common stereotype. This might sound mean, but I blame Helen Keller for that. Ever since her story went viral, blindness and deafness have been associated. ----- Original Message ----- From: Kaiti Shelton wrote: Hello, I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a room for a sighted person. Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like walking into bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white background. Make sure your TV screen is on and make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. If you wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person won't feel left out of what you are doing. If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact with a sighted person comfortably in your house. Thanks, Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: Josh Gregory Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley wrote: Where are the articles? -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie Gilmer Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Hello all~ I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our life!, I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) as a reference!!!!!!!! I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems with each article are needed. We must get these off the internet. Contact for complaint for eHow: I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, WA 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 Best, Carrie Sent from my iPad _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia ms2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer %40gmail.co m _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%4 0pccuaedu.o nmicrosoft.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer %40gmail.co m _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%4 0pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40 gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia ms2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley %40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40 gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithb iggs%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarine t104%40gmail.com -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade r%40gmail.com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 07:21:07 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Sat, 23 Mar 2013 03:21:07 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <514d43a9.af76ec0a.48de.092a@mx.google.com> References: <514d43a9.af76ec0a.48de.092a@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Sophie, I didn't say that we should restrict free speech; all that was meant that there should be some consideration towards the people this negative stuff is written about, (In this case blind people, although I've seen some similar articles about people with other conditions now that I've actually looked). Most sites have a policy which covers nondescrimination or something, and I'd say some of this stuff is definitely descriminatory in the sense that it paints the picture of a blind person as someone who can't do anything for themselves, which we all know is not the case. Someone else pointed out that E-How has a policy regarding the submission of misinformation to their articles, so if they do have this policy in place then they're obviously not following their own guidelines. In short, people can write what they want; but when it effects a large group of others in a negative way then I think that is cause for concern. It wasn't really Helen Keller's fault; she was blind and deaf and did what she had to do. In terms of the spotlight she was also the world's second deafblind person to learn to communicate, so naturally people would find her inspirational or exceptional, many other terms. I think the real issue stems from misinformation in articles such as this. Obviously not all blind people are also deaf, and obviously most blind people do not also require wheelchairs as airports seem to commonly think. I don't necessarily see pointing this misinformation out to E-How as a bad thing or something that would infringe on people's first amendment right considering what was written. On 3/23/13, Sophie Trist wrote: > Kaiti, if we restricted people from writing these articles, as > stupid and bogus as they might be, we'd be violating the first > amendment. Free speech can be a double-edged sword in cases like > this. As for the teaching ASL to blind people, that's a common > stereotype. This might sound mean, but I blame Helen Keller for > that. Ever since her story went viral, blindness and deafness > have been associated. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Kaiti Shelton To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Date sent: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 16:53:58 -0400 > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hi all, > > Brandon's last post made my week! I don't think it is right for > stuff > like this to be available to give sighted people a false idea of > what > blind people are like, but I too have seen many other articles > that > don't make sense. (Have you seen the article about the > importance of > teaching ASL to blind people yet?) There are plenty of > non-blindness > related ones that are total trash to if you just look them up, > and > nothing from E-How should be taken seriously. That being said, I > think I'm somewhere in between; I've recognized E-How for what it > is > as Brandon pointed out, but I think that there is a definite line > between sensitivity and humor and in this case some of these > articles > do cross that line. I know I would probably give someone the > whatfor > if they tried to feed me or refused to give me a full glass of > Coke > because I'm blind, but it's just a matter of letting E-How know > they > should evaluate some of these grossly insensitive articles. > > Brandon: I know people from a music program I attend in the > summers > called Braille Beats who actually describe sighted people as > "Light > dependent." Your post reminded me of that and captured that idea > perfectly. > > How to manage a day with a Light-ependent person. > > People who have the misfortune of being congenitally dependent > upon > light for survival need several accomodations including patience > and > understanding from those not afflicted by the condition. In this > article I will present some everyday situations and ways you can > help > your light-dependent friend or family member get through the day. > > Driving in the car going somewhere: When the person complains > about > the bad driving of others, simply smile and distract him/her from > the > road rage. Find a topic of conversation which interests both of > you, > but still make sure they focus on their personal driving. Be > patient > with them, although nothing is really solved by getting mad at > other > drivers. They really can't help it sometimes. > Reading their own writing: Another factor of frustration for > light-dependent people is reading their own writing. > Light-dependent > people don't have the advantage of using a system so eligant as > braille where letters are confused not too often, especially when > contractions are used. Because their system is more cumbersome > and > they have the poor tendency to write sloppily when rushed they > sometimes can't even read what they've written. They also don't > have > access to a refreshable display for their writing, so papers are > frequently lost in the shuffle. This leads to frustration and > other > factors such as getting lost on the way to a destination or > forgetting > something they needed from the store. Try to be patient and help > them > remember what it is they wanted to buy, or perhaps that exit > number > they told you they'd need to take off the highway. > In a college dorm at night: Sometimes your roommate may need to > stay > up later than you and in order to complete their work they may > need a > light. Again, be patient; if noise bothers you plug yourself > into > your IPod and try falling asleep to music. If the light is > bothersome > try to block it out; if you only have vision from one eye putting > that > side of your face into the pillow does the trick wonderfully. Do > this, and be thankful that you don't necessarily need light to > read a > book or that you can turn off the screen on your laptop out of > consideration for others. > > Okay, the last one was me grasping for straws, but you get the > picture. I also didn't mean to talk down sighted people; just an > attempt at humor. > > On 3/22/13, Brandon Keith Biggs > wrote: > Hello, > I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem > pretty > ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a room > for a > sighted person. > > Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. > Sighted > people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like > walking into > > bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. > Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm > outside and > the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into > their house > even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print > labels on food > and appliances aren't covered by anything so the sighted person > can feel > comfortable reading the familiar labels. If there aren't already > print > labels on something, make sure they are printed in at least 12 > point font > with black letters on a white background. Make sure your TV > screen is on and > > make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all > times. If you > > wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted > person won't > feel left out of what you are doing. > If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, > make sure to > wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the > sighted person > seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. > If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to > interact with a > sighted person comfortably in your house. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM > To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students > mailing > list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley > wrote: > > Hi, > I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles > in my > earlier post. > Misty > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > > It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people > are, and to > their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily > refute them > if > you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't > advocate > without > proper information. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of > Josh > Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but > you say > that > it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you read it, > you can > assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a good idea here, > and when > > I > get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see > what > they're > like. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester > wrote: > > I don't want to read their trash. > If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them > and > give > them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB > philosophy! > Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? > BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know > anything, > and > have never seen a blind person do anything independently! > We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another > thread > that > I just started. > Thanks, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie > Gilmer > [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. > You > think > we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows > them to go > on, > unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large > problem of > employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas > come > from? > how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to > correct > or > stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are > not worth > my > time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind > person's > employment or education worth your time? what if that blind > person is > you? > Carrie > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester > wrote: > > Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a > terrible > picture of blindness! > I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th > century and > before! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie > Gilmer > [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html > > There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen > more...one is > also titled "how to feed a blind person" > > What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There > is no > distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto > accident > practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or > a 90 > year > old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good > health or a > normal person born blind. > The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. > Carrie > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" > wrote: > > Where are the articles? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of > Carrie > Gilmer > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM > To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind > Students > mailing > list > Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello all~ > I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted > on > eHow > concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically > bad > perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them > last > night > and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed > out > that > I > was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was > completely > unaware, > and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and > mixed > messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from > our > life!, > I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of > mine > also > "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How > to > set > the > table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a > blind > person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic > language > and > ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation > FOR the > Blind) > as a reference!!!!!!!! > > I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and > write > complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned > argument > specific > to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming > problems > with > each article are needed. > > We must get these off the internet. > > Contact for complaint for eHow: > > I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING > ACCURATE > ABOUT > BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be > doing it > one > for > each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent > and > reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as > per > their > policy on misinformation!: > > Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us > at > eHow, > Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, > Kirkland, > > WA > 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint > Assistance > Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of > Consumer > Affairs > may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) > 952-5210 > > Best, > > Carrie > > Sent from my iPad > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia > ms2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer > %40gmail.co > m > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%4 > 0pccuaedu.o > nmicrosoft.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer > %40gmail.co > m > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%4 > 0pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40 > gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia > ms2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley > %40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40 > gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithb > iggs%40gmail.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarine > t104%40gmail.com > > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info > for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade > r%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 07:36:56 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Sat, 23 Mar 2013 03:36:56 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <000401ce2772$06041950$120c4bf0$@gmail.com> <2ECC4F7279F341D8897FC8944C8EB16B@BrandonsLaptop2> Message-ID: Hi all, Oh, I have no doubt that we will take action, as I along with others are planning to write my own article this weekend as well as advise E-How to take another look at their misinformation policy and the disarray of their site in general, but especially those articles that are slanderous towards groups of people, E.G. those who are blind, deaf, etc. In fact, I have a great idea for an article I would like to share. How to treat a blind person. Like anyone else... then go into the do and don't do things in the steps section. But, since we know it is ridiculous and are confident that something will be done by people who see this as an issue, why not have a little socializing along with it. Builds morale, I think. Brandon, I've never heard of such a thing either, but perhaps it's pronounced kuh-nife? I think that might be the way it is. What if the babies are also blind though? Surely it can't be used on all babies for that reason, they might hurt themselves. And Chris, I have the perfect solution to food patch and IV malfunctions should they occur. The blind person would just have a straw sergically implanted in one nostril of their nose and when it comes time to use... of all things... a cup like sighted people as a last resort, they can focus all their mental energy on holding the empty glass steady to prevent spills and just inhale whatever it is their drinking. And, the best part is that should their throat become partially clogged someone could give them mouth to straw assistance since, you know, it might be weird for a blind person to kiss someone, as we all are taken care of and never develop personal social friendships let alone relationships in our lives. Lol. On 3/23/13, Josh Gregory wrote: > We may joke about this all we want, but that does not take away from the > seriousness of the situation. Yes it is good to joke, However, it is good to > know that there is a side of this which we must deal with. I'm all for a > joke once in a while, but there are times when we need to take action rather > than have fun with it. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 23, 2013, at 12:06 AM, "Brandon Keith Biggs" > wrote: > >> What's a knife? >> I know there is a game called life, but I'm not allowed to play it because >> I may choke on the cars or babies. I'm not sure why because for one I >> would never be able to fit a baby into my mouth let alone a car! >> A knife must be something that people use with babies or cars! >> Thanks, >> >> Brandon Keith Biggs >> -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:56 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Brandon, >> >> You are hilarious!!!!!!! LOL!!! Now a knife... that's just out of the >> question. >> >> Chris >> >> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >> Public Relations Committee >> Maryland Association of Blind Students >> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >> Keith >> Biggs >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 10:49 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> No, >> We use these things called food patches we swipe over our arm that puts >> the >> nourishment for a good sized meal into our bloodstream. They are used >> completely by feel with Braille labels so we don't need any help with >> them. >> That way we are never in need of wasting extra time eating and doing this >> horribly unnatural thing called socializing over dinner. If for some >> reason >> we are allergic to the substance excreted by the patches, we can bring >> around a personalized IV that is permanently attached to our arm, >> injecting >> our meals directly into our vain. If a blind person ever touches a fork >> they >> are in danger of stabbing themselves in the eye which is in front of >> them, >> but because they can't see is magically put in the way of any sharp >> object >> they may handle. If they eat solid food they may become poisoned because >> they can't see the germs to keep from consuming bad food. >> In all cases blind people are never to be given dinner except in their >> arm >> patches. >> Thanks, >> >> Brandon Keith Biggs >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Chris Nusbaum >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:14 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Huh? Don't humans need food to survive? I guess they think blind people >> have >> a very short lifespan then, LOL. >> >> Chris >> >> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >> Public Relations Committee >> Maryland Association of Blind Students >> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >> williams >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 10:12 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> I've had people ask me or my friends if I would be capable of eating >> dinner >> on a date. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris >> Nusbaum >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:28 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does somebody >> feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks ago. >> >> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >> Public Relations Committee >> Maryland Association of Blind Students >> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua >> Lester >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Exactly! >> Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch >> TV! >> I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can >> tell >> somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. >> Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman >> [arielle71 at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends and >> my >> sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so he >> could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were >> just >> listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it >> struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was the >> one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we >> didn't. >> Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on >> sighted >> people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of >> blindness >> really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, >> blind >> people can be equal or even advantaged. >> Arielle >> >> On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: >>> Lol. That is funny. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >>> Keith Biggs >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hello, >>> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >>> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >>> room for a sighted person. >>> >>> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted >>> people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like >>> walking into >>> >>> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >>> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside >>> and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into >>> their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print >>> labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >>> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >>> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >>> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >>> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >>> >>> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >>> If you >>> >>> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >>> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >>> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure >>> to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted >>> person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. >>> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >>> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Josh Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >>> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >>> mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >>> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Hi, >>>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>>> earlier post. >>>> Misty >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>>> >>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>>> >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> >>>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>>> Gregory >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>>> good idea here, and when >>> >>>>> I >>>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>>>> they're like. >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>>>> give >>>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>>> philosophy! >>>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>>>> anything, and >>>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>>>> thread that >>>>> I just started. >>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>>>> You think >>>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >>>>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >>>>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>>>> ideas come from? >>>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>>>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >>>>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >>>>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>>>> that blind person is you? >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>>> terrible >>>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>>>> and >>>>> before! >>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>>> >>>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>>>> more...one is >>>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>>> >>>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is >>>>>>> no >>>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>>>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >>>>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>>>> Students >>>>> mailing >>>>>>>> list >>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>>>> viewed four of them last >>>>> night >>>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>>>> out that >>>>> I >>>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>>>> completely >>>>> unaware, >>>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>>>> from our >>>>> life!, >>>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>>>> titled "How to set >>>>> the >>>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>>>> dramatic language >>>>> and >>>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>>>> the >>>>> Blind) >>>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>>>> argument >>>>> specific >>>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>>> problems >>>>> with >>>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>>>>>>> doing it one >>>>> for >>>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>>>> permanently...as per >>>>> their >>>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> WA >>>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>>>> of Consumer >>>>> Affairs >>>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>> 0gmail >>>>>>>> .com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm >>> ail.co >>>>> m >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >>> aedu.o >>>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm >>> ail.co >>>>> m >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >>> a.edu >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail >>> .com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>> 0gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gm >>> ail.co >>> m >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >>>> l.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% >>> 40gmai >>> l.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>> 0gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >>> com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c >> om >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c >> om >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai >> l.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c >> om >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From joshkart12 at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 07:42:42 2013 From: joshkart12 at gmail.com (Josh Gregory) Date: Sat, 23 Mar 2013 03:42:42 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <000401ce2772$06041950$120c4bf0$@gmail.com> <2ECC4F7279F341D8897FC8944C8EB16B@BrandonsLaptop2> Message-ID: <289B3956-1BF4-451A-B961-62F62F3D1616@gmail.com> Hi Katie, all good ideas, I still need to take a look at some of the main articles themselves. Sent from my iPhone On Mar 23, 2013, at 3:36 AM, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Hi all, > > Oh, I have no doubt that we will take action, as I along with others > are planning to write my own article this weekend as well as advise > E-How to take another look at their misinformation policy and the > disarray of their site in general, but especially those articles that > are slanderous towards groups of people, E.G. those who are blind, > deaf, etc. > > In fact, I have a great idea for an article I would like to share. > > How to treat a blind person. > > Like anyone else... > > then go into the do and don't do things in the steps section. > > > But, since we know it is ridiculous and are confident that something > will be done by people who see this as an issue, why not have a little > socializing along with it. Builds morale, I think. > > Brandon, I've never heard of such a thing either, but perhaps it's > pronounced kuh-nife? I think that might be the way it is. What if > the babies are also blind though? Surely it can't be used on all > babies for that reason, they might hurt themselves. > > And Chris, I have the perfect solution to food patch and IV > malfunctions should they occur. The blind person would just have a > straw sergically implanted in one nostril of their nose and when it > comes time to use... of all things... a cup like sighted people as a > last resort, they can focus all their mental energy on holding the > empty glass steady to prevent spills and just inhale whatever it is > their drinking. And, the best part is that should their throat become > partially clogged someone could give them mouth to straw assistance > since, you know, it might be weird for a blind person to kiss someone, > as we all are taken care of and never develop personal social > friendships let alone relationships in our lives. Lol. > > On 3/23/13, Josh Gregory wrote: >> We may joke about this all we want, but that does not take away from the >> seriousness of the situation. Yes it is good to joke, However, it is good to >> know that there is a side of this which we must deal with. I'm all for a >> joke once in a while, but there are times when we need to take action rather >> than have fun with it. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 23, 2013, at 12:06 AM, "Brandon Keith Biggs" >> wrote: >> >>> What's a knife? >>> I know there is a game called life, but I'm not allowed to play it because >>> I may choke on the cars or babies. I'm not sure why because for one I >>> would never be able to fit a baby into my mouth let alone a car! >>> A knife must be something that people use with babies or cars! >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>> -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:56 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Brandon, >>> >>> You are hilarious!!!!!!! LOL!!! Now a knife... that's just out of the >>> question. >>> >>> Chris >>> >>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>> Public Relations Committee >>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >>> Keith >>> Biggs >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 10:49 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> No, >>> We use these things called food patches we swipe over our arm that puts >>> the >>> nourishment for a good sized meal into our bloodstream. They are used >>> completely by feel with Braille labels so we don't need any help with >>> them. >>> That way we are never in need of wasting extra time eating and doing this >>> horribly unnatural thing called socializing over dinner. If for some >>> reason >>> we are allergic to the substance excreted by the patches, we can bring >>> around a personalized IV that is permanently attached to our arm, >>> injecting >>> our meals directly into our vain. If a blind person ever touches a fork >>> they >>> are in danger of stabbing themselves in the eye which is in front of >>> them, >>> but because they can't see is magically put in the way of any sharp >>> object >>> they may handle. If they eat solid food they may become poisoned because >>> they can't see the germs to keep from consuming bad food. >>> In all cases blind people are never to be given dinner except in their >>> arm >>> patches. >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Chris Nusbaum >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:14 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Huh? Don't humans need food to survive? I guess they think blind people >>> have >>> a very short lifespan then, LOL. >>> >>> Chris >>> >>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>> Public Relations Committee >>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>> williams >>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 10:12 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> I've had people ask me or my friends if I would be capable of eating >>> dinner >>> on a date. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris >>> Nusbaum >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:28 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does somebody >>> feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks ago. >>> >>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>> Public Relations Committee >>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua >>> Lester >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Exactly! >>> Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch >>> TV! >>> I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can >>> tell >>> somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. >>> Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! >>> Blessings, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman >>> [arielle71 at gmail.com] >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends and >>> my >>> sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so he >>> could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were >>> just >>> listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it >>> struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was the >>> one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we >>> didn't. >>> Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on >>> sighted >>> people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of >>> blindness >>> really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, >>> blind >>> people can be equal or even advantaged. >>> Arielle >>> >>> On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: >>>> Lol. That is funny. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >>>> Keith Biggs >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Hello, >>>> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >>>> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >>>> room for a sighted person. >>>> >>>> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted >>>> people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like >>>> walking into >>>> >>>> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >>>> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside >>>> and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into >>>> their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print >>>> labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >>>> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >>>> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >>>> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >>>> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >>>> >>>> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >>>> If you >>>> >>>> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >>>> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >>>> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure >>>> to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted >>>> person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. >>>> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >>>> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >>>> Thanks, >>>> >>>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: Josh Gregory >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >>>> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >>>> mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >>>> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>>>> earlier post. >>>>> Misty >>>>> >>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>>>> >>>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>>>> >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>>>> Gregory >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>>>> good idea here, and when >>>> >>>>>> I >>>>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>>>>> they're like. >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>>>>> give >>>>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>>>> philosophy! >>>>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>>>>> anything, and >>>>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>>>>> thread that >>>>>> I just started. >>>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>>>>> You think >>>>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >>>>>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >>>>>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>>>>> ideas come from? >>>>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>>>>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >>>>>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >>>>>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>>>>> that blind person is you? >>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>>>> terrible >>>>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>>>>> and >>>>>> before! >>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>>>>> more...one is >>>>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is >>>>>>>> no >>>>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>>>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>>>>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >>>>>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>>>>> Students >>>>>> mailing >>>>>>>>> list >>>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>>>>> viewed four of them last >>>>>> night >>>>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>>>>> out that >>>>>> I >>>>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>>>>> completely >>>>>> unaware, >>>>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>>>>> from our >>>>>> life!, >>>>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>>>>> titled "How to set >>>>>> the >>>>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>>>>> dramatic language >>>>>> and >>>>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>>>>> the >>>>>> Blind) >>>>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>>>>> argument >>>>>> specific >>>>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>>>> problems >>>>>> with >>>>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>>>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>>>>>>>> doing it one >>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>>>>> permanently...as per >>>>>> their >>>>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> WA >>>>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>>>>> of Consumer >>>>>> Affairs >>>>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>> 0gmail >>>>>>>>> .com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm >>>> ail.co >>>>>> m >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >>>> aedu.o >>>>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm >>>> ail.co >>>>>> m >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >>>> a.edu >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail >>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>> 0gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gm >>>> ail.co >>>> m >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >>>>> l.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% >>>> 40gmai >>>> l.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>> 0gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >>>> com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c >>> om >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c >>> om >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai >>> l.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c >>> om >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com From sweetpeareader at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 08:00:01 2013 From: sweetpeareader at gmail.com (Sophie Trist) Date: Sat, 23 Mar 2013 03:00:01 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Message-ID: <514d6114.4888ec0a.72b3.037e@mx.google.com> Kaiti, I'm sorry I misunderstood what you said earlier. If these articles go against eHow's policy of deliberate discrimination and misinformation, then yes it is cause for concern. And about the Helen Keller thing, she didn't do anything wrong--her story is very inspiring--but it could be the reason that deafness and blindness seem to be linked in sighted people's minds. That's just my theory. :) ----- Original Message ----- From: Kaiti Shelton wrote: Kaiti, if we restricted people from writing these articles, as stupid and bogus as they might be, we'd be violating the first amendment. Free speech can be a double-edged sword in cases like this. As for the teaching ASL to blind people, that's a common stereotype. This might sound mean, but I blame Helen Keller for that. Ever since her story went viral, blindness and deafness have been associated. ----- Original Message ----- From: Kaiti Shelton wrote: Where are the articles? -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie Gilmer Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Hello all~ I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our life!, I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language and ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR the Blind) as a reference!!!!!!!! I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming problems with each article are needed. We must get these off the internet. Contact for complaint for eHow: I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, Kirkland, WA 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) 952-5210 Best, Carrie Sent from my iPad _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia ms2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer %40gmail.co m _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%4 0pccuaedu.o nmicrosoft.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer %40gmail.co m _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%4 0pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40 gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia ms2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley %40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40 gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithb iggs%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarine t104%40gmail.com -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade r%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarine t104%40gmail.com -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade r%40gmail.com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 14:32:21 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 10:32:21 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <514d43a9.af76ec0a.48de.092a@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <001b01ce270a$111e2eb0$335a8c10$@gmail.com> Yeah, once you are destroying someone's character or the character of an entire group, that is no longer free speech. There are limits. You've got to have evidence and then present the evidence in order to damn someone's character like that, something usually done in a legal proceeding. Those articles are deformation of character. Tjhey portray us in a negative light. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2013 3:21 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Sophie, I didn't say that we should restrict free speech; all that was meant that there should be some consideration towards the people this negative stuff is written about, (In this case blind people, although I've seen some similar articles about people with other conditions now that I've actually looked). Most sites have a policy which covers nondescrimination or something, and I'd say some of this stuff is definitely descriminatory in the sense that it paints the picture of a blind person as someone who can't do anything for themselves, which we all know is not the case. Someone else pointed out that E-How has a policy regarding the submission of misinformation to their articles, so if they do have this policy in place then they're obviously not following their own guidelines. In short, people can write what they want; but when it effects a large group of others in a negative way then I think that is cause for concern. It wasn't really Helen Keller's fault; she was blind and deaf and did what she had to do. In terms of the spotlight she was also the world's second deafblind person to learn to communicate, so naturally people would find her inspirational or exceptional, many other terms. I think the real issue stems from misinformation in articles such as this. Obviously not all blind people are also deaf, and obviously most blind people do not also require wheelchairs as airports seem to commonly think. I don't necessarily see pointing this misinformation out to E-How as a bad thing or something that would infringe on people's first amendment right considering what was written. On 3/23/13, Sophie Trist wrote: > Kaiti, if we restricted people from writing these articles, as stupid > and bogus as they might be, we'd be violating the first amendment. > Free speech can be a double-edged sword in cases like this. As for the > teaching ASL to blind people, that's a common stereotype. This might > sound mean, but I blame Helen Keller for that. Ever since her story > went viral, blindness and deafness have been associated. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Kaiti Shelton To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hi all, > > Brandon's last post made my week! I don't think it is right for stuff > like this to be available to give sighted people a false idea of what > blind people are like, but I too have seen many other articles that > don't make sense. (Have you seen the article about the importance of > teaching ASL to blind people yet?) There are plenty of non-blindness > related ones that are total trash to if you just look them up, and > nothing from E-How should be taken seriously. That being said, I > think I'm somewhere in between; I've recognized E-How for what it is > as Brandon pointed out, but I think that there is a definite line > between sensitivity and humor and in this case some of these articles > do cross that line. I know I would probably give someone the whatfor > if they tried to feed me or refused to give me a full glass of Coke > because I'm blind, but it's just a matter of letting E-How know they > should evaluate some of these grossly insensitive articles. > > Brandon: I know people from a music program I attend in the summers > called Braille Beats who actually describe sighted people as "Light > dependent." Your post reminded me of that and captured that idea > perfectly. > > How to manage a day with a Light-ependent person. > > People who have the misfortune of being congenitally dependent upon > light for survival need several accomodations including patience and > understanding from those not afflicted by the condition. In this > article I will present some everyday situations and ways you can help > your light-dependent friend or family member get through the day. > > Driving in the car going somewhere: When the person complains about > the bad driving of others, simply smile and distract him/her from the > road rage. Find a topic of conversation which interests both of you, > but still make sure they focus on their personal driving. Be patient > with them, although nothing is really solved by getting mad at other > drivers. They really can't help it sometimes. > Reading their own writing: Another factor of frustration for > light-dependent people is reading their own writing. > Light-dependent > people don't have the advantage of using a system so eligant as > braille where letters are confused not too often, especially when > contractions are used. Because their system is more cumbersome and > they have the poor tendency to write sloppily when rushed they > sometimes can't even read what they've written. They also don't have > access to a refreshable display for their writing, so papers are > frequently lost in the shuffle. This leads to frustration and other > factors such as getting lost on the way to a destination or forgetting > something they needed from the store. Try to be patient and help them > remember what it is they wanted to buy, or perhaps that exit number > they told you they'd need to take off the highway. > In a college dorm at night: Sometimes your roommate may need to stay > up later than you and in order to complete their work they may need a > light. Again, be patient; if noise bothers you plug yourself into > your IPod and try falling asleep to music. If the light is bothersome > try to block it out; if you only have vision from one eye putting that > side of your face into the pillow does the trick wonderfully. Do > this, and be thankful that you don't necessarily need light to read a > book or that you can turn off the screen on your laptop out of > consideration for others. > > Okay, the last one was me grasping for straws, but you get the > picture. I also didn't mean to talk down sighted people; just an > attempt at humor. > > On 3/22/13, Brandon Keith Biggs > wrote: > Hello, > I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem > pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a > room for a sighted person. > > Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. > Sighted > people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like > walking into > > bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. > Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm > outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining > into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure > print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the > sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If > there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are > printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white > background. Make sure your TV screen is on and > > make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. > If you > > wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person > won't feel left out of what you are doing. > If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make > sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the > sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without > protection. > If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact > with a sighted person comfortably in your house. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM > To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students > mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley > wrote: > > Hi, > I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my > earlier post. > Misty > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > > It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, and > to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily refute > them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't > advocate without proper information. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh > Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you > say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you > read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a > good idea here, and when > > I > get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what > they're like. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > > I don't want to read their trash. > If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and > give them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB > philosophy! > Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? > BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know > anything, and have never seen a blind person do anything > independently! > We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread > that I just started. > Thanks, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer > [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. > You > think > we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to > go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large > problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the > ideas come from? > how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to > correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they > are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect > a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if > that blind person is you? > Carrie > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > > Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a > terrible picture of blindness! > I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and > before! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer > [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html > > There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one > is also titled "how to feed a blind person" > > What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no > distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto > accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple > disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired > teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. > The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. > Carrie > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" > wrote: > > Where are the articles? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie > Gilmer > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM > To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students > mailing list > Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello all~ > I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on > eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically > bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them > last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend > pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another > one! I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in > the midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate > portrayal from the article or from our life!, I believe it was > pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in > the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the > table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind > person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language > and ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR > the > Blind) > as a reference!!!!!!!! > > I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write > complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument > specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters > naming problems with each article are needed. > > We must get these off the internet. > > Contact for complaint for eHow: > > I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE > ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be > doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get > enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down > permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: > > Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at > eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, > Kirkland, > > WA > 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint > Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of > Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA > 95814 or (800) > 952-5210 > > Best, > > Carrie > > Sent from my iPad > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia > ms2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer > %40gmail.co > m > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%4 > 0pccuaedu.o > nmicrosoft.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer > %40gmail.co > m > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%4 > 0pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40 > gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia > ms2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley > %40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40 > gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithb > iggs%40gmail.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarine > t104%40gmail.com > > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade > r%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% > 40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From mistydbradley at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 16:12:03 2013 From: mistydbradley at gmail.com (Misty Dawn Bradley) Date: Sat, 23 Mar 2013 12:12:03 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness References: <514d43a9.af76ec0a.48de.092a@mx.google.com> <001b01ce270a$111e2eb0$335a8c10$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Unfortunately, defamation of character and blatant discrimination happens a lot on the Internet against many diverse groups based on disability, race, religion, and other factors. On the Internet, people write freely against those they don't think highly of, and it is very noticeable in many places. The best thing is to refute their claims. Yes, they do have the right to say what they want due to free speech, but we all also have a right to free speech, thus giving us the right to speak out and refute their claims and educate people who would otherwise not know the difference between stereotypes and reality. Misty ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 10:32 AM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > Yeah, once you are destroying someone's character or the character of an > entire group, that is no longer free speech. There are limits. You've > got > to have evidence and then present the evidence in order to damn someone's > character like that, something usually done in a legal proceeding. Those > articles are deformation of character. Tjhey portray us in a negative > light. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2013 3:21 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Sophie, > > I didn't say that we should restrict free speech; all that was meant that > there should be some consideration towards the people this negative stuff > is > written about, (In this case blind people, although I've seen some similar > articles about people with other conditions now that I've actually > looked). > Most sites have a policy which covers nondescrimination or something, and > I'd say some of this stuff is definitely descriminatory in the sense that > it > paints the picture of a blind person as someone who can't do anything for > themselves, which we all know is not the case. Someone else pointed out > that E-How has a policy regarding the submission of misinformation to > their > articles, so if they do have this policy in place then they're obviously > not > following their own guidelines. In short, people can write what they > want; > but when it effects a large group of others in a negative way then I think > that is cause for concern. > > It wasn't really Helen Keller's fault; she was blind and deaf and did what > she had to do. In terms of the spotlight she was also the world's second > deafblind person to learn to communicate, so naturally people would find > her > inspirational or exceptional, many other terms. > I think the real issue stems from misinformation in articles such as this. > Obviously not all blind people are also deaf, and obviously most blind > people do not also require wheelchairs as airports seem to commonly think. > I don't necessarily see pointing this misinformation out to E-How as a bad > thing or something that would infringe on people's first amendment right > considering what was written. > > On 3/23/13, Sophie Trist wrote: >> Kaiti, if we restricted people from writing these articles, as stupid >> and bogus as they might be, we'd be violating the first amendment. >> Free speech can be a double-edged sword in cases like this. As for the >> teaching ASL to blind people, that's a common stereotype. This might >> sound mean, but I blame Helen Keller for that. Ever since her story >> went viral, blindness and deafness have been associated. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Kaiti Shelton > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hi all, >> >> Brandon's last post made my week! I don't think it is right for stuff >> like this to be available to give sighted people a false idea of what >> blind people are like, but I too have seen many other articles that >> don't make sense. (Have you seen the article about the importance of >> teaching ASL to blind people yet?) There are plenty of non-blindness >> related ones that are total trash to if you just look them up, and >> nothing from E-How should be taken seriously. That being said, I >> think I'm somewhere in between; I've recognized E-How for what it is >> as Brandon pointed out, but I think that there is a definite line >> between sensitivity and humor and in this case some of these articles >> do cross that line. I know I would probably give someone the whatfor >> if they tried to feed me or refused to give me a full glass of Coke >> because I'm blind, but it's just a matter of letting E-How know they >> should evaluate some of these grossly insensitive articles. >> >> Brandon: I know people from a music program I attend in the summers >> called Braille Beats who actually describe sighted people as "Light >> dependent." Your post reminded me of that and captured that idea >> perfectly. >> >> How to manage a day with a Light-ependent person. >> >> People who have the misfortune of being congenitally dependent upon >> light for survival need several accomodations including patience and >> understanding from those not afflicted by the condition. In this >> article I will present some everyday situations and ways you can help >> your light-dependent friend or family member get through the day. >> >> Driving in the car going somewhere: When the person complains about >> the bad driving of others, simply smile and distract him/her from the >> road rage. Find a topic of conversation which interests both of you, >> but still make sure they focus on their personal driving. Be patient >> with them, although nothing is really solved by getting mad at other >> drivers. They really can't help it sometimes. >> Reading their own writing: Another factor of frustration for >> light-dependent people is reading their own writing. >> Light-dependent >> people don't have the advantage of using a system so eligant as >> braille where letters are confused not too often, especially when >> contractions are used. Because their system is more cumbersome and >> they have the poor tendency to write sloppily when rushed they >> sometimes can't even read what they've written. They also don't have >> access to a refreshable display for their writing, so papers are >> frequently lost in the shuffle. This leads to frustration and other >> factors such as getting lost on the way to a destination or forgetting >> something they needed from the store. Try to be patient and help them >> remember what it is they wanted to buy, or perhaps that exit number >> they told you they'd need to take off the highway. >> In a college dorm at night: Sometimes your roommate may need to stay >> up later than you and in order to complete their work they may need a >> light. Again, be patient; if noise bothers you plug yourself into >> your IPod and try falling asleep to music. If the light is bothersome >> try to block it out; if you only have vision from one eye putting that >> side of your face into the pillow does the trick wonderfully. Do >> this, and be thankful that you don't necessarily need light to read a >> book or that you can turn off the screen on your laptop out of >> consideration for others. >> >> Okay, the last one was me grasping for straws, but you get the >> picture. I also didn't mean to talk down sighted people; just an >> attempt at humor. >> >> On 3/22/13, Brandon Keith Biggs >> wrote: >> Hello, >> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >> room for a sighted person. >> >> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. >> Sighted >> people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like >> walking into >> >> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm >> outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining >> into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure >> print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >> >> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >> If you >> >> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make >> sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the >> sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without >> protection. >> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >> Thanks, >> >> Brandon Keith Biggs >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Josh Gregory >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >> > wrote: >> >> Hi, >> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >> earlier post. >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >> > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> > Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> >> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, and >> to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily refute >> them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't >> advocate without proper information. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >> Gregory >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >> good idea here, and when >> >> I >> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >> they're like. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester > wrote: >> >> I don't want to read their trash. >> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >> give them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >> philosophy! >> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >> anything, and have never seen a blind person do anything >> independently! >> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread >> that I just started. >> Thanks, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >> You >> think >> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >> ideas come from? >> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >> that blind person is you? >> Carrie >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester > wrote: >> >> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >> terrible picture of blindness! >> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >> before! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >> >> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one >> is also titled "how to feed a blind person" >> >> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >> Carrie >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >> wrote: >> >> Where are the articles? >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >> Gilmer >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing list >> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hello all~ >> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >> eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically >> bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them >> last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend >> pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another >> one! I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in >> the midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate >> portrayal from the article or from our life!, I believe it was >> pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in >> the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the >> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language >> and ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >> the >> Blind) >> as a reference!!!!!!!! >> >> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >> specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters >> naming problems with each article are needed. >> >> We must get these off the internet. >> >> Contact for complaint for eHow: >> >> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >> doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get >> enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down >> permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: >> >> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >> eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, >> Kirkland, >> >> WA >> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of >> Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA >> 95814 or (800) >> 952-5210 >> >> Best, >> >> Carrie >> >> Sent from my iPad >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia >> ms2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer >> %40gmail.co >> m >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%4 >> 0pccuaedu.o >> nmicrosoft.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer >> %40gmail.co >> m >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%4 >> 0pccua.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40 >> gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia >> ms2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley >> %40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40 >> gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithb >> iggs%40gmail.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarine >> t104%40gmail.com >> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade >> r%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% >> 40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.com From arielle71 at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 16:35:05 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Sat, 23 Mar 2013 10:35:05 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <514d43a9.af76ec0a.48de.092a@mx.google.com> <001b01ce270a$111e2eb0$335a8c10$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Out of curiosity I read the article about teaching blind people ASL. It advocates teaching babies sign language to aid their communication. It is true that blind and sighted babies who have a speech delay are often taught sign language so they can learn to express basic needs before they are able to express those needs vocally. However, many blind babies don't have a speech delay andso it is unclear to me why they would benefit from sign language. Also, the article suggests that blind children should learn a full ASL vocabulary, and it seems that by the time they are old enough to learn all those words, they should be verbal. So it doesn't make a lot of sense. I do wonder where these E-how contributors come from. Many sound as if they've never met a blind person and are just doing a school book report on blindness, reading a few random articles here and there and then writing up what they see as common points. I do think the most effective way to counter any harm caused is for us to try to write articles. The NFB of Utah has set up a whole website called BlindHow, and maybe we should focus on adding content to their site and trying to give it a higher profile, or somehow linking it to Ehow. In my experience, many people who spread misinformation are very unwilling to admit that they are misinformed and will often get defensive whenever they are called on it, which doesn't help progress forward. I am reminded of a NY Times article that came out in 2005 in which a blind chef job applicant was blatantly ridiculed. I wrote a letter to the editor in complaint (as did many other Federationists) and was basically told that since the author didn't "mean" to cause offense, I "shouldn't" be offended. The editor missed the point entirely. While I do think we should try to complain, I suspect that we won't be able to get content pulled very easily, and we will make more of a difference if we can write good articles instead. Arielle On 3/23/13, Misty Dawn Bradley wrote: > Unfortunately, defamation of character and blatant discrimination happens a > > lot on the Internet against many diverse groups based on disability, race, > religion, and other factors. On the Internet, people write freely against > those they don't think highly of, and it is very noticeable in many places. > > The best thing is to refute their claims. Yes, they do have the right to say > > what they want due to free speech, but we all also have a right to free > speech, thus giving us the right to speak out and refute their claims and > educate people who would otherwise not know the difference between > stereotypes and reality. > Misty > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "justin williams" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 10:32 AM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > >> Yeah, once you are destroying someone's character or the character of an >> entire group, that is no longer free speech. There are limits. You've >> got >> to have evidence and then present the evidence in order to damn someone's >> character like that, something usually done in a legal proceeding. Those >> articles are deformation of character. Tjhey portray us in a negative >> light. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >> Shelton >> Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2013 3:21 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Sophie, >> >> I didn't say that we should restrict free speech; all that was meant that >> there should be some consideration towards the people this negative stuff >> >> is >> written about, (In this case blind people, although I've seen some >> similar >> articles about people with other conditions now that I've actually >> looked). >> Most sites have a policy which covers nondescrimination or something, and >> I'd say some of this stuff is definitely descriminatory in the sense that >> >> it >> paints the picture of a blind person as someone who can't do anything for >> themselves, which we all know is not the case. Someone else pointed out >> that E-How has a policy regarding the submission of misinformation to >> their >> articles, so if they do have this policy in place then they're obviously >> not >> following their own guidelines. In short, people can write what they >> want; >> but when it effects a large group of others in a negative way then I >> think >> that is cause for concern. >> >> It wasn't really Helen Keller's fault; she was blind and deaf and did >> what >> she had to do. In terms of the spotlight she was also the world's second >> deafblind person to learn to communicate, so naturally people would find >> her >> inspirational or exceptional, many other terms. >> I think the real issue stems from misinformation in articles such as >> this. >> Obviously not all blind people are also deaf, and obviously most blind >> people do not also require wheelchairs as airports seem to commonly >> think. >> I don't necessarily see pointing this misinformation out to E-How as a >> bad >> thing or something that would infringe on people's first amendment right >> considering what was written. >> >> On 3/23/13, Sophie Trist wrote: >>> Kaiti, if we restricted people from writing these articles, as stupid >>> and bogus as they might be, we'd be violating the first amendment. >>> Free speech can be a double-edged sword in cases like this. As for the >>> teaching ASL to blind people, that's a common stereotype. This might >>> sound mean, but I blame Helen Keller for that. Ever since her story >>> went viral, blindness and deafness have been associated. >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: Kaiti Shelton >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> Brandon's last post made my week! I don't think it is right for stuff >>> like this to be available to give sighted people a false idea of what >>> blind people are like, but I too have seen many other articles that >>> don't make sense. (Have you seen the article about the importance of >>> teaching ASL to blind people yet?) There are plenty of non-blindness >>> related ones that are total trash to if you just look them up, and >>> nothing from E-How should be taken seriously. That being said, I >>> think I'm somewhere in between; I've recognized E-How for what it is >>> as Brandon pointed out, but I think that there is a definite line >>> between sensitivity and humor and in this case some of these articles >>> do cross that line. I know I would probably give someone the whatfor >>> if they tried to feed me or refused to give me a full glass of Coke >>> because I'm blind, but it's just a matter of letting E-How know they >>> should evaluate some of these grossly insensitive articles. >>> >>> Brandon: I know people from a music program I attend in the summers >>> called Braille Beats who actually describe sighted people as "Light >>> dependent." Your post reminded me of that and captured that idea >>> perfectly. >>> >>> How to manage a day with a Light-ependent person. >>> >>> People who have the misfortune of being congenitally dependent upon >>> light for survival need several accomodations including patience and >>> understanding from those not afflicted by the condition. In this >>> article I will present some everyday situations and ways you can help >>> your light-dependent friend or family member get through the day. >>> >>> Driving in the car going somewhere: When the person complains about >>> the bad driving of others, simply smile and distract him/her from the >>> road rage. Find a topic of conversation which interests both of you, >>> but still make sure they focus on their personal driving. Be patient >>> with them, although nothing is really solved by getting mad at other >>> drivers. They really can't help it sometimes. >>> Reading their own writing: Another factor of frustration for >>> light-dependent people is reading their own writing. >>> Light-dependent >>> people don't have the advantage of using a system so eligant as >>> braille where letters are confused not too often, especially when >>> contractions are used. Because their system is more cumbersome and >>> they have the poor tendency to write sloppily when rushed they >>> sometimes can't even read what they've written. They also don't have >>> access to a refreshable display for their writing, so papers are >>> frequently lost in the shuffle. This leads to frustration and other >>> factors such as getting lost on the way to a destination or forgetting >>> something they needed from the store. Try to be patient and help them >>> remember what it is they wanted to buy, or perhaps that exit number >>> they told you they'd need to take off the highway. >>> In a college dorm at night: Sometimes your roommate may need to stay >>> up later than you and in order to complete their work they may need a >>> light. Again, be patient; if noise bothers you plug yourself into >>> your IPod and try falling asleep to music. If the light is bothersome >>> try to block it out; if you only have vision from one eye putting that >>> side of your face into the pillow does the trick wonderfully. Do >>> this, and be thankful that you don't necessarily need light to read a >>> book or that you can turn off the screen on your laptop out of >>> consideration for others. >>> >>> Okay, the last one was me grasping for straws, but you get the >>> picture. I also didn't mean to talk down sighted people; just an >>> attempt at humor. >>> >>> On 3/22/13, Brandon Keith Biggs >>> wrote: >>> Hello, >>> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >>> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >>> room for a sighted person. >>> >>> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. >>> Sighted >>> people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like >>> walking into >>> >>> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >>> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm >>> outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining >>> into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure >>> print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >>> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >>> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >>> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >>> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >>> >>> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >>> If you >>> >>> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >>> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >>> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make >>> sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the >>> sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without >>> protection. >>> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >>> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Josh Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >>> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >>> mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >>> >> wrote: >>> >>> Hi, >>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>> earlier post. >>> Misty >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>> >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> >>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, and >>> to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily refute >>> them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't >>> advocate without proper information. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>> Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>> good idea here, and when >>> >>> I >>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>> they're like. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >> wrote: >>> >>> I don't want to read their trash. >>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>> give them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>> philosophy! >>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>> anything, and have never seen a blind person do anything >>> independently! >>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread >>> that I just started. >>> Thanks, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>> You >>> think >>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>> ideas come from? >>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>> that blind person is you? >>> Carrie >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >> wrote: >>> >>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>> terrible picture of blindness! >>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >>> before! >>> Blessings, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>> >>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one >>> is also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>> >>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>> Carrie >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>> >>> Where are the articles? >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >>> Gilmer >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >>> mailing list >>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hello all~ >>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >>> eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically >>> bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them >>> last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend >>> pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another >>> one! I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in >>> the midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate >>> portrayal from the article or from our life!, I believe it was >>> pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in >>> the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the >>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language >>> and ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>> the >>> Blind) >>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>> >>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >>> specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters >>> naming problems with each article are needed. >>> >>> We must get these off the internet. >>> >>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>> >>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>> doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get >>> enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>> permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: >>> >>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>> eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, >>> Kirkland, >>> >>> WA >>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of >>> Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA >>> 95814 or (800) >>> 952-5210 >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> Carrie >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia >>> ms2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer >>> %40gmail.co >>> m >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%4 >>> 0pccuaedu.o >>> nmicrosoft.com >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer >>> %40gmail.co >>> m >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%4 >>> 0pccua.edu >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40 >>> gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia >>> ms2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley >>> %40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40 >>> gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithb >>> iggs%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarine >>> t104%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade >>> r%40gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% >>> 40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From jsoro620 at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 18:38:39 2013 From: jsoro620 at gmail.com (Joe) Date: Sat, 23 Mar 2013 14:38:39 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <001b01ce270a$111e2eb0$335a8c10$@gmail.com> References: <514d43a9.af76ec0a.48de.092a@mx.google.com> <001b01ce270a$111e2eb0$335a8c10$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <00cd01ce27f5$a344d0f0$e9ce72d0$@gmail.com> Let's get on the same page here. The word is "defamation," not "deformation." Anal point really, but if we're going to educate the public, let's be educated about it.--Joe -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 10:32 AM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Yeah, once you are destroying someone's character or the character of an entire group, that is no longer free speech. There are limits. You've got to have evidence and then present the evidence in order to damn someone's character like that, something usually done in a legal proceeding. Those articles are deformation of character. Tjhey portray us in a negative light. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2013 3:21 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Sophie, I didn't say that we should restrict free speech; all that was meant that there should be some consideration towards the people this negative stuff is written about, (In this case blind people, although I've seen some similar articles about people with other conditions now that I've actually looked). Most sites have a policy which covers nondescrimination or something, and I'd say some of this stuff is definitely descriminatory in the sense that it paints the picture of a blind person as someone who can't do anything for themselves, which we all know is not the case. Someone else pointed out that E-How has a policy regarding the submission of misinformation to their articles, so if they do have this policy in place then they're obviously not following their own guidelines. In short, people can write what they want; but when it effects a large group of others in a negative way then I think that is cause for concern. It wasn't really Helen Keller's fault; she was blind and deaf and did what she had to do. In terms of the spotlight she was also the world's second deafblind person to learn to communicate, so naturally people would find her inspirational or exceptional, many other terms. I think the real issue stems from misinformation in articles such as this. Obviously not all blind people are also deaf, and obviously most blind people do not also require wheelchairs as airports seem to commonly think. I don't necessarily see pointing this misinformation out to E-How as a bad thing or something that would infringe on people's first amendment right considering what was written. On 3/23/13, Sophie Trist wrote: > Kaiti, if we restricted people from writing these articles, as stupid > and bogus as they might be, we'd be violating the first amendment. > Free speech can be a double-edged sword in cases like this. As for the > teaching ASL to blind people, that's a common stereotype. This might > sound mean, but I blame Helen Keller for that. Ever since her story > went viral, blindness and deafness have been associated. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Kaiti Shelton To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hi all, > > Brandon's last post made my week! I don't think it is right for stuff > like this to be available to give sighted people a false idea of what > blind people are like, but I too have seen many other articles that > don't make sense. (Have you seen the article about the importance of > teaching ASL to blind people yet?) There are plenty of non-blindness > related ones that are total trash to if you just look them up, and > nothing from E-How should be taken seriously. That being said, I > think I'm somewhere in between; I've recognized E-How for what it is > as Brandon pointed out, but I think that there is a definite line > between sensitivity and humor and in this case some of these articles > do cross that line. I know I would probably give someone the whatfor > if they tried to feed me or refused to give me a full glass of Coke > because I'm blind, but it's just a matter of letting E-How know they > should evaluate some of these grossly insensitive articles. > > Brandon: I know people from a music program I attend in the summers > called Braille Beats who actually describe sighted people as "Light > dependent." Your post reminded me of that and captured that idea > perfectly. > > How to manage a day with a Light-ependent person. > > People who have the misfortune of being congenitally dependent upon > light for survival need several accomodations including patience and > understanding from those not afflicted by the condition. In this > article I will present some everyday situations and ways you can help > your light-dependent friend or family member get through the day. > > Driving in the car going somewhere: When the person complains about > the bad driving of others, simply smile and distract him/her from the > road rage. Find a topic of conversation which interests both of you, > but still make sure they focus on their personal driving. Be patient > with them, although nothing is really solved by getting mad at other > drivers. They really can't help it sometimes. > Reading their own writing: Another factor of frustration for > light-dependent people is reading their own writing. > Light-dependent > people don't have the advantage of using a system so eligant as > braille where letters are confused not too often, especially when > contractions are used. Because their system is more cumbersome and > they have the poor tendency to write sloppily when rushed they > sometimes can't even read what they've written. They also don't have > access to a refreshable display for their writing, so papers are > frequently lost in the shuffle. This leads to frustration and other > factors such as getting lost on the way to a destination or forgetting > something they needed from the store. Try to be patient and help them > remember what it is they wanted to buy, or perhaps that exit number > they told you they'd need to take off the highway. > In a college dorm at night: Sometimes your roommate may need to stay > up later than you and in order to complete their work they may need a > light. Again, be patient; if noise bothers you plug yourself into > your IPod and try falling asleep to music. If the light is bothersome > try to block it out; if you only have vision from one eye putting that > side of your face into the pillow does the trick wonderfully. Do > this, and be thankful that you don't necessarily need light to read a > book or that you can turn off the screen on your laptop out of > consideration for others. > > Okay, the last one was me grasping for straws, but you get the > picture. I also didn't mean to talk down sighted people; just an > attempt at humor. > > On 3/22/13, Brandon Keith Biggs > wrote: > Hello, > I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem > pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a > room for a sighted person. > > Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. > Sighted > people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like > walking into > > bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. > Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm > outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining > into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure > print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the > sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If > there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are > printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white > background. Make sure your TV screen is on and > > make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. > If you > > wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person > won't feel left out of what you are doing. > If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make > sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the > sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without > protection. > If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact > with a sighted person comfortably in your house. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM > To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students > mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley > wrote: > > Hi, > I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my > earlier post. > Misty > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > > It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, and > to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily refute > them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't > advocate without proper information. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh > Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you > say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you > read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a > good idea here, and when > > I > get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what > they're like. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > > I don't want to read their trash. > If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and > give them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB > philosophy! > Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? > BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know > anything, and have never seen a blind person do anything > independently! > We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread > that I just started. > Thanks, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer > [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. > You > think > we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to > go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large > problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the > ideas come from? > how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to > correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they > are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect > a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if > that blind person is you? > Carrie > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > > Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a > terrible picture of blindness! > I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and > before! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer > [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html > > There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one > is also titled "how to feed a blind person" > > What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no > distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto > accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple > disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired > teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. > The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. > Carrie > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" > wrote: > > Where are the articles? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie > Gilmer > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM > To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students > mailing list > Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello all~ > I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on > eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically > bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them > last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend > pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another > one! I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in > the midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate > portrayal from the article or from our life!, I believe it was > pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in > the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the > table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind > person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language > and ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR > the > Blind) > as a reference!!!!!!!! > > I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write > complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument > specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters > naming problems with each article are needed. > > We must get these off the internet. > > Contact for complaint for eHow: > > I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE > ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be > doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get > enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down > permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: > > Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at > eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, > Kirkland, > > WA > 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint > Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of > Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA > 95814 or (800) > 952-5210 > > Best, > > Carrie > > Sent from my iPad > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia > ms2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer > %40gmail.co > m > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%4 > 0pccuaedu.o > nmicrosoft.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer > %40gmail.co > m > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%4 > 0pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40 > gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia > ms2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley > %40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40 > gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithb > iggs%40gmail.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarine > t104%40gmail.com > > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade > r%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% > 40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Fri Mar 22 20:29:13 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 16:29:13 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <00cd01ce27f5$a344d0f0$e9ce72d0$@gmail.com> References: <514d43a9.af76ec0a.48de.092a@mx.google.com> <001b01ce270a$111e2eb0$335a8c10$@gmail.com> <00cd01ce27f5$a344d0f0$e9ce72d0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <000301ce273b$eb4dc7e0$c1e957a0$@gmail.com> Ops. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joe Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2013 2:39 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Let's get on the same page here. The word is "defamation," not "deformation." Anal point really, but if we're going to educate the public, let's be educated about it.--Joe -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 10:32 AM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Yeah, once you are destroying someone's character or the character of an entire group, that is no longer free speech. There are limits. You've got to have evidence and then present the evidence in order to damn someone's character like that, something usually done in a legal proceeding. Those articles are deformation of character. Tjhey portray us in a negative light. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2013 3:21 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Sophie, I didn't say that we should restrict free speech; all that was meant that there should be some consideration towards the people this negative stuff is written about, (In this case blind people, although I've seen some similar articles about people with other conditions now that I've actually looked). Most sites have a policy which covers nondescrimination or something, and I'd say some of this stuff is definitely descriminatory in the sense that it paints the picture of a blind person as someone who can't do anything for themselves, which we all know is not the case. Someone else pointed out that E-How has a policy regarding the submission of misinformation to their articles, so if they do have this policy in place then they're obviously not following their own guidelines. In short, people can write what they want; but when it effects a large group of others in a negative way then I think that is cause for concern. It wasn't really Helen Keller's fault; she was blind and deaf and did what she had to do. In terms of the spotlight she was also the world's second deafblind person to learn to communicate, so naturally people would find her inspirational or exceptional, many other terms. I think the real issue stems from misinformation in articles such as this. Obviously not all blind people are also deaf, and obviously most blind people do not also require wheelchairs as airports seem to commonly think. I don't necessarily see pointing this misinformation out to E-How as a bad thing or something that would infringe on people's first amendment right considering what was written. On 3/23/13, Sophie Trist wrote: > Kaiti, if we restricted people from writing these articles, as stupid > and bogus as they might be, we'd be violating the first amendment. > Free speech can be a double-edged sword in cases like this. As for the > teaching ASL to blind people, that's a common stereotype. This might > sound mean, but I blame Helen Keller for that. Ever since her story > went viral, blindness and deafness have been associated. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Kaiti Shelton To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hi all, > > Brandon's last post made my week! I don't think it is right for stuff > like this to be available to give sighted people a false idea of what > blind people are like, but I too have seen many other articles that > don't make sense. (Have you seen the article about the importance of > teaching ASL to blind people yet?) There are plenty of non-blindness > related ones that are total trash to if you just look them up, and > nothing from E-How should be taken seriously. That being said, I > think I'm somewhere in between; I've recognized E-How for what it is > as Brandon pointed out, but I think that there is a definite line > between sensitivity and humor and in this case some of these articles > do cross that line. I know I would probably give someone the whatfor > if they tried to feed me or refused to give me a full glass of Coke > because I'm blind, but it's just a matter of letting E-How know they > should evaluate some of these grossly insensitive articles. > > Brandon: I know people from a music program I attend in the summers > called Braille Beats who actually describe sighted people as "Light > dependent." Your post reminded me of that and captured that idea > perfectly. > > How to manage a day with a Light-ependent person. > > People who have the misfortune of being congenitally dependent upon > light for survival need several accomodations including patience and > understanding from those not afflicted by the condition. In this > article I will present some everyday situations and ways you can help > your light-dependent friend or family member get through the day. > > Driving in the car going somewhere: When the person complains about > the bad driving of others, simply smile and distract him/her from the > road rage. Find a topic of conversation which interests both of you, > but still make sure they focus on their personal driving. Be patient > with them, although nothing is really solved by getting mad at other > drivers. They really can't help it sometimes. > Reading their own writing: Another factor of frustration for > light-dependent people is reading their own writing. > Light-dependent > people don't have the advantage of using a system so eligant as > braille where letters are confused not too often, especially when > contractions are used. Because their system is more cumbersome and > they have the poor tendency to write sloppily when rushed they > sometimes can't even read what they've written. They also don't have > access to a refreshable display for their writing, so papers are > frequently lost in the shuffle. This leads to frustration and other > factors such as getting lost on the way to a destination or forgetting > something they needed from the store. Try to be patient and help them > remember what it is they wanted to buy, or perhaps that exit number > they told you they'd need to take off the highway. > In a college dorm at night: Sometimes your roommate may need to stay > up later than you and in order to complete their work they may need a > light. Again, be patient; if noise bothers you plug yourself into > your IPod and try falling asleep to music. If the light is bothersome > try to block it out; if you only have vision from one eye putting that > side of your face into the pillow does the trick wonderfully. Do > this, and be thankful that you don't necessarily need light to read a > book or that you can turn off the screen on your laptop out of > consideration for others. > > Okay, the last one was me grasping for straws, but you get the > picture. I also didn't mean to talk down sighted people; just an > attempt at humor. > > On 3/22/13, Brandon Keith Biggs > wrote: > Hello, > I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem > pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a > room for a sighted person. > > Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. > Sighted > people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like > walking into > > bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. > Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm > outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining > into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure > print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the > sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If > there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are > printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white > background. Make sure your TV screen is on and > > make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. > If you > > wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person > won't feel left out of what you are doing. > If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make > sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the > sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without > protection. > If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact > with a sighted person comfortably in your house. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: Josh Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM > To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students > mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley > wrote: > > Hi, > I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my > earlier post. > Misty > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > > It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, and > to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily refute > them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't > advocate without proper information. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh > Gregory > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you > say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you > read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a > good idea here, and when > > I > get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what > they're like. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > > I don't want to read their trash. > If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and > give them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB > philosophy! > Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? > BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know > anything, and have never seen a blind person do anything > independently! > We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread > that I just started. > Thanks, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer > [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. > You > think > we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to > go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large > problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the > ideas come from? > how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to > correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they > are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect > a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if > that blind person is you? > Carrie > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester wrote: > > Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a > terrible picture of blindness! > I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and > before! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer > [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html > > There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one > is also titled "how to feed a blind person" > > What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no > distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto > accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple > disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired > teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. > The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. > Carrie > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" > wrote: > > Where are the articles? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie > Gilmer > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM > To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students > mailing list > Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hello all~ > I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on > eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically > bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them > last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend > pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another > one! I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in > the midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate > portrayal from the article or from our life!, I believe it was > pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in > the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the > table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind > person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language > and ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR > the > Blind) > as a reference!!!!!!!! > > I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write > complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument > specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters > naming problems with each article are needed. > > We must get these off the internet. > > Contact for complaint for eHow: > > I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE > ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be > doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get > enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down > permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: > > Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at > eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, > Kirkland, > > WA > 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint > Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of > Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA > 95814 or (800) > 952-5210 > > Best, > > Carrie > > Sent from my iPad > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia > ms2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer > %40gmail.co > m > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%4 > 0pccuaedu.o > nmicrosoft.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer > %40gmail.co > m > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%4 > 0pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40 > gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia > ms2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley > %40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40 > gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithb > iggs%40gmail.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarine > t104%40gmail.com > > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade > r%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% > 40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From arielle71 at gmail.com Sat Mar 23 22:18:03 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Sat, 23 Mar 2013 16:18:03 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] NRTC Mentoring Program Message-ID: The NRTC on Blindness and Low Vision is currently seeking college students and professionals nationwide who are legally blind to participate in a research project that pairs students with mentors who live close to them. The project will evaluate the impact of face-to-face mentoring relationships on employment outcomes for college graduates who are legally blind. Participants enroll for 1 year and students are provided incentives for participation. For more information, visit: http://blind.msstate.edu/participate/mentoring/ or contact Jamie O'Mally by phone at 662-325-2001 or email at nrtc2 at colled.msstate.edu. From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Sat Mar 23 23:45:38 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Sat, 23 Mar 2013 19:45:38 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hello, iI haven't read those articles, v but will try to this weekend when I have time. However, from the exerpts, I'd agree with Brandon and Joshua here. Its trash. Kerri, I realize prospective readers are nurses, family members of blind people or maybe employers, but I'd say that people seeking information online will go to more than one source. Also, I try and be optomistic and believe that people can think critically as readers and think this source is far fetched. I try and believe that people who are open minded will seek out reliable information, something more credible than an ehow article. They may also be open minded and form views of our abilities by talking to blind people. We do have a long way to educate people. Internet does reach a wide audience; this was something negative; but there are also numerous positive and realistic sources about blindness online. However, if there are comment forms, it may help to object to the article. This may or may not be possible; sometimes no field is put down for comments. Ashley -----Original Message----- From: Joshua Lester Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:56 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Yeah! Great point! These people need to watch famous blind musicians, for example, like Ronnie Milsap, Terri Gibbs, and Gini Owens! They all live good quality independent lives, and are taking care of themselves! Why put out all of this ridiculous mess, when they see blind people everyday, living opposite what they're saying? Good grief! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Chris Nusbaum [dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:46 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Joshua and all, Sometimes, unfortunately, we just can't win with these people. Despite all our attempts to educate by word and by example, some people either cannot or do not get it. Frustrating, I know. The problem, I believe, with articles such as these is that they don't consult blind people ourselves or even sighted people who have a more accurate and positive outlook on blindness. We always blame society's misconceptions about us for erroneous information in articles and other published material. But I sometimes wonder where they got such ridiculous ideas about the capabilities of blind people. Judging from my personal experience, this nonsense is far beyond even the norm of everyday misconceptions. However, let me add that all hope is not lost. If these media people would actually talk with the blind ourselves, we usually get a much different result. We instead get final products like the Nick News special on blind kids which aired in January. By the way, I'm not trying to brag or toot my own horn when saying this. My role in the production of that program was just as an interviewee and occasional information provider. I had no control over how the segment would be introduced or what parts of my interview (or anybody else's) they showed. However, anyone who watched it would probably agree that the light in which we were portrayed on that show was a far cry from the eHow series of articles. Oh well... all we can do is to educate as much as we can and laugh at the ridiculousness we get from time to time. It is frustrating, though. Chriss Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:48 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness LOL! Good grief! Where does this nonsense end? Again, good grief! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:40 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness There's also another funny one, "how to entertain a blind person". One of the suggestions is to hold a musical competition, start singing a song as a group and then see who can finish the song after you turn off the music. You know, since blind people have such musical talent and superhearing...I laughed because I suck at remembering lyrics and would do horribly at that game! Arielle On 3/22/13, Joshua Lester wrote: > Kaiti: > Wow! > You attend Braille Beats? > Awesome! > That was a great post, BTW! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton > [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:53 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Hi all, > > Brandon's last post made my week! I don't think it is right for stuff > like this to be available to give sighted people a false idea of what > blind people are like, but I too have seen many other articles that > don't make sense. (Have you seen the article about the importance of > teaching ASL to blind people yet?) There are plenty of non-blindness > related ones that are total trash to if you just look them up, and > nothing from E-How should be taken seriously. That being said, I > think I'm somewhere in between; I've recognized E-How for what it is > as Brandon pointed out, but I think that there is a definite line > between sensitivity and humor and in this case some of these articles > do cross that line. I know I would probably give someone the whatfor > if they tried to feed me or refused to give me a full glass of Coke > because I'm blind, but it's just a matter of letting E-How know they > should evaluate some of these grossly insensitive articles. > > Brandon: I know people from a music program I attend in the summers > called Braille Beats who actually describe sighted people as "Light > dependent." Your post reminded me of that and captured that idea > perfectly. > > How to manage a day with a Light-ependent person. > > People who have the misfortune of being congenitally dependent upon > light for survival need several accomodations including patience and > understanding from those not afflicted by the condition. In this > article I will present some everyday situations and ways you can help > your light-dependent friend or family member get through the day. > > Driving in the car going somewhere: When the person complains about > the bad driving of others, simply smile and distract him/her from the > road rage. Find a topic of conversation which interests both of you, > but still make sure they focus on their personal driving. Be patient > with them, although nothing is really solved by getting mad at other > drivers. They really can't help it sometimes. > Reading their own writing: Another factor of frustration for > light-dependent people is reading their own writing. Light-dependent > people don't have the advantage of using a system so eligant as > braille where letters are confused not too often, especially when > contractions are used. Because their system is more cumbersome and > they have the poor tendency to write sloppily when rushed they > sometimes can't even read what they've written. They also don't have > access to a refreshable display for their writing, so papers are > frequently lost in the shuffle. This leads to frustration and other > factors such as getting lost on the way to a destination or forgetting > something they needed from the store. Try to be patient and help them > remember what it is they wanted to buy, or perhaps that exit number > they told you they'd need to take off the highway. > In a college dorm at night: Sometimes your roommate may need to stay > up later than you and in order to complete their work they may need a > light. Again, be patient; if noise bothers you plug yourself into > your IPod and try falling asleep to music. If the light is bothersome > try to block it out; if you only have vision from one eye putting that > side of your face into the pillow does the trick wonderfully. Do > this, and be thankful that you don't necessarily need light to read a > book or that you can turn off the screen on your laptop out of > consideration for others. > > Okay, the last one was me grasping for straws, but you get the > picture. I also didn't mean to talk down sighted people; just an > attempt at humor. > > On 3/22/13, Brandon Keith Biggs wrote: >> Hello, >> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >> room for a sighted person. >> >> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. >> Sighted people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't >> like walking into >> >> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm >> outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining >> into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure >> print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >> >> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >> If you >> >> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make >> sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the >> sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without >> protection. >> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >> Thanks, >> >> Brandon Keith Biggs >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Josh Gregory >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >> >> wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>> earlier post. >>> Misty >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>> >>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> >>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>> Gregory >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>> good idea here, and when >>>> >>>> I >>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>>> they're >>>> like. >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>>> give >>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>> philosophy! >>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, >>>>> and >>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread >>>>> that >>>> I just started. >>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You >>>>> think >>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go >>>> on, >>>> unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem >>>> of >>>> employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come >>>> from? >>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct >>>> or >>>> stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth >>>> my >>>> time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's >>>> employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is >>>> you? >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>> terrible >>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >>>> before! >>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>> >>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one >>>>>> is >>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>> >>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>> accident >>>> practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 >>>> year >>>> old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a >>>> normal person born blind. >>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >>>> Gilmer >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >>>> mailing >>>>>>> list >>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >>>>>>> eHow >>>>>>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>>>>>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them >>>>>>> last >>>> night >>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out >>>>>>> that >>>> I >>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely >>>> unaware, >>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>> mixed >>>>>>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our >>>> life!, >>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine >>>>>>> also >>>>>>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to >>>>>>> set >>>> the >>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>>>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic >>>>>>> language >>>> and >>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>>> the >>>> Blind) >>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>> write >>>>>>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >>>> specific >>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>> problems >>>> with >>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>>> ABOUT >>>>>>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it >>>>>>> one >>>> for >>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>>>>>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per >>>> their >>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>>>>>> eHow, >>>>>>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, >>>>>>> Kirkland, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> WA >>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>> Assistance >>>>>>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer >>>> Affairs >>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>>> m >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o >>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>>> m >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.co m >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai l.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai l.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From joshkart12 at gmail.com Sun Mar 24 00:11:18 2013 From: joshkart12 at gmail.com (Josh Gregory) Date: Sat, 23 Mar 2013 20:11:18 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <57F4A065-875D-4273-B908-68FCA2FC5B82@gmail.com> Ashley, with all due respect, you may call it what you want, but I Personally do not call it trash. I call it a chance to educate, to educate about what we can do not what we can't. Sent from my iPhone On Mar 23, 2013, at 7:45 PM, "Ashley Bramlett" wrote: > Hello, > iI haven't read those articles, v but will try to this weekend when I have time. > However, from the exerpts, I'd agree with Brandon and Joshua here. Its trash. > Kerri, I realize prospective readers are nurses, family members of blind people or maybe employers, but I'd say that people seeking information online will go to more than one source. > Also, I try and be optomistic and believe that people can think critically as readers and think this source is far fetched. > I try and believe that people who are open minded will seek out reliable information, something more credible than an ehow article. > They may also be open minded and form views of our abilities by talking to blind people. > > We do have a long way to educate people. Internet does reach a wide audience; this was something negative; but there are also numerous positive and realistic sources about blindness online. > However, if there are comment forms, it may help to object to the article. This may or may not be possible; sometimes no field is put down for comments. > > Ashley > > -----Original Message----- From: Joshua Lester > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:56 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Yeah! > Great point! > These people need to watch famous blind musicians, for example, like Ronnie Milsap, Terri Gibbs, and Gini Owens! > They all live good quality independent lives, and are taking care of themselves! > Why put out all of this ridiculous mess, when they see blind people everyday, living opposite what they're saying? > Good grief! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Chris Nusbaum [dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:46 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Joshua and all, > > Sometimes, unfortunately, we just can't win with these people. Despite all > our attempts to educate by word and by example, some people either cannot or > do not get it. Frustrating, I know. > > The problem, I believe, with articles such as these is that they don't > consult blind people ourselves or even sighted people who have a more > accurate and positive outlook on blindness. We always blame society's > misconceptions about us for erroneous information in articles and other > published material. But I sometimes wonder where they got such ridiculous > ideas about the capabilities of blind people. Judging from my personal > experience, this nonsense is far beyond even the norm of everyday > misconceptions. > > However, let me add that all hope is not lost. If these media people would > actually talk with the blind ourselves, we usually get a much different > result. We instead get final products like the Nick News special on blind > kids which aired in January. By the way, I'm not trying to brag or toot my > own horn when saying this. My role in the production of that program was > just as an interviewee and occasional information provider. I had no control > over how the segment would be introduced or what parts of my interview (or > anybody else's) they showed. However, anyone who watched it would probably > agree that the light in which we were portrayed on that show was a far cry > from the eHow series of articles. > > Oh well... all we can do is to educate as much as we can and laugh at the > ridiculousness we get from time to time. It is frustrating, though. > > Chriss > > Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair > Public Relations Committee > Maryland Association of Blind Students > Phone: (443) 547-2409 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:48 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > LOL! > Good grief! > Where does this nonsense end? > Again, good grief! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman > [arielle71 at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:40 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > There's also another funny one, "how to entertain a blind person". One of > the suggestions is to hold a musical competition, start singing a song as a > group and then see who can finish the song after you turn off the music. You > know, since blind people have such musical talent and superhearing...I > laughed because I suck at remembering lyrics and would do horribly at that > game! > Arielle > > On 3/22/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >> Kaiti: >> Wow! >> You attend Braille Beats? >> Awesome! >> That was a great post, BTW! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:53 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hi all, >> >> Brandon's last post made my week! I don't think it is right for stuff >> like this to be available to give sighted people a false idea of what >> blind people are like, but I too have seen many other articles that >> don't make sense. (Have you seen the article about the importance of >> teaching ASL to blind people yet?) There are plenty of non-blindness >> related ones that are total trash to if you just look them up, and >> nothing from E-How should be taken seriously. That being said, I >> think I'm somewhere in between; I've recognized E-How for what it is >> as Brandon pointed out, but I think that there is a definite line >> between sensitivity and humor and in this case some of these articles >> do cross that line. I know I would probably give someone the whatfor >> if they tried to feed me or refused to give me a full glass of Coke >> because I'm blind, but it's just a matter of letting E-How know they >> should evaluate some of these grossly insensitive articles. >> >> Brandon: I know people from a music program I attend in the summers >> called Braille Beats who actually describe sighted people as "Light >> dependent." Your post reminded me of that and captured that idea >> perfectly. >> >> How to manage a day with a Light-ependent person. >> >> People who have the misfortune of being congenitally dependent upon >> light for survival need several accomodations including patience and >> understanding from those not afflicted by the condition. In this >> article I will present some everyday situations and ways you can help >> your light-dependent friend or family member get through the day. >> >> Driving in the car going somewhere: When the person complains about >> the bad driving of others, simply smile and distract him/her from the >> road rage. Find a topic of conversation which interests both of you, >> but still make sure they focus on their personal driving. Be patient >> with them, although nothing is really solved by getting mad at other >> drivers. They really can't help it sometimes. >> Reading their own writing: Another factor of frustration for >> light-dependent people is reading their own writing. Light-dependent >> people don't have the advantage of using a system so eligant as >> braille where letters are confused not too often, especially when >> contractions are used. Because their system is more cumbersome and >> they have the poor tendency to write sloppily when rushed they >> sometimes can't even read what they've written. They also don't have >> access to a refreshable display for their writing, so papers are >> frequently lost in the shuffle. This leads to frustration and other >> factors such as getting lost on the way to a destination or forgetting >> something they needed from the store. Try to be patient and help them >> remember what it is they wanted to buy, or perhaps that exit number >> they told you they'd need to take off the highway. >> In a college dorm at night: Sometimes your roommate may need to stay >> up later than you and in order to complete their work they may need a >> light. Again, be patient; if noise bothers you plug yourself into >> your IPod and try falling asleep to music. If the light is bothersome >> try to block it out; if you only have vision from one eye putting that >> side of your face into the pillow does the trick wonderfully. Do >> this, and be thankful that you don't necessarily need light to read a >> book or that you can turn off the screen on your laptop out of >> consideration for others. >> >> Okay, the last one was me grasping for straws, but you get the >> picture. I also didn't mean to talk down sighted people; just an >> attempt at humor. >> >> On 3/22/13, Brandon Keith Biggs wrote: >>> Hello, >>> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >>> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >>> room for a sighted person. >>> >>> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. >>> Sighted people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't >>> like walking into >>> >>> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >>> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm >>> outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining >>> into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure >>> print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >>> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >>> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >>> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >>> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >>> >>> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >>> If you >>> >>> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >>> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >>> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make >>> sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the >>> sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without >>> protection. >>> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >>> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Josh Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >>> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >>> mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >>> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Hi, >>>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>>> earlier post. >>>> Misty >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>>> >>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>>> >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> >>>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>>> Gregory >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>>> good idea here, and when >>>>> >>>>> I >>>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>>>> they're >>>>> like. >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>>>> give >>>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>>> philosophy! >>>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know anything, >>>>>> and >>>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread >>>>>> that >>>>> I just started. >>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. You >>>>>> think >>>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to go >>>>> on, >>>>> unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large problem >>>>> of >>>>> employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the ideas come >>>>> from? >>>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to correct >>>>> or >>>>> stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they are not worth >>>>> my >>>>> time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect a blind person's >>>>> employment or education worth your time? what if that blind person is >>>>> you? >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>>> terrible >>>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >>>>> before! >>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>>> >>>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one >>>>>>> is >>>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>>> >>>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >>>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>>> accident >>>>> practically in a coma or a child with multiple disabilities, or a 90 >>>>> year >>>>> old in feeble health or visually impaired teenager in good health or a >>>>> normal person born blind. >>>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >>>>> mailing >>>>>>>> list >>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >>>>>>>> eHow >>>>>>>> concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically bad >>>>>>>> perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them >>>>>>>> last >>>>> night >>>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed out >>>>>>>> that >>>>> I >>>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was completely >>>>> unaware, >>>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>>> mixed >>>>>>>> messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or from our >>>>> life!, >>>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine >>>>>>>> also >>>>>>>> "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to >>>>>>>> set >>>>> the >>>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>>>>>>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic >>>>>>>> language >>>>> and >>>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>>>> the >>>>> Blind) >>>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>>> write >>>>>>>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >>>>> specific >>>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>>> problems >>>>> with >>>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>>>> ABOUT >>>>>>>> BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be doing it >>>>>>>> one >>>>> for >>>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent and >>>>>>>> reasonable complaints they will take these down permanently...as per >>>>> their >>>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>>>>>>> eHow, >>>>>>>> Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, >>>>>>>> Kirkland, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> WA >>>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>>> Assistance >>>>>>>> Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of Consumer >>>>> Affairs >>>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>>>>> .com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>>>> m >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o >>>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.co >>>>> m >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.co > m >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmai > l.com >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai > l.com >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Sun Mar 24 04:52:08 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2013 00:52:08 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] tablet users Message-ID: <373ABCAB39B2484EA1AFFA7915D74C9D@OwnerPC> Hi all, Tablets are quickly coming on the market as an alternative to laptops. Some of the major tablets are accessible with voice output and magnification. The Ipad, nexus 7 and windows tablet are accessible and there may be more I’m not aware of. I’d like to hear experiences with tablets. Have you used them and did you find the gestures easy to learn? How did you learn how to move around? Did you use a keyboard instead of the touch screen? It seems to me that you could use a tablet to write notes and surf the internet since its got a word processor in it. Being new technology, tablets are fairly expensive, but some more expensive than others. I like the idea of downloading aps on a tablet; like the pandora ap for music or watching tv shows. I don’t know if any accessible games are available for them but that would be a good idea as well. I see people watching tv, surfing the internet and playing games all the time now on their tablets and smart phones. It seems like a great way to pass the time while waiting for a bus or appointment and to take notes. So, curious as to what you have found user friendly with them particularly the new windows surface tablet. I guess part of me leans toward this because I already know the windows keystrokes and the microsoft suite keystrokes from being a windows user. Thanks. Ashley From arielle71 at gmail.com Sun Mar 24 05:01:33 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Sat, 23 Mar 2013 23:01:33 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] tablet users In-Reply-To: <373ABCAB39B2484EA1AFFA7915D74C9D@OwnerPC> References: <373ABCAB39B2484EA1AFFA7915D74C9D@OwnerPC> Message-ID: I'm just curious; are the Windows and Google tablets accessible out of the box or do you have to install special software as you do for Android or Windows smart phones? Arielle On 3/23/13, Ashley Bramlett wrote: > Hi all, > > Tablets are quickly coming on the market as an alternative to laptops. Some > of the major tablets are accessible with voice output and magnification. The > Ipad, nexus 7 and windows tablet are accessible and there may be more I’m > not aware of. > > I’d like to hear experiences with tablets. Have you used them and did you > find the gestures easy to learn? How did you learn how to move around? Did > you use a keyboard instead of the touch screen? It seems to me that you > could use a tablet to write notes and surf the internet since its got a word > processor in it. Being new technology, tablets are fairly expensive, but > some more expensive than others. > > I like the idea of downloading aps on a tablet; like the pandora ap for > music or watching tv shows. I don’t know if any accessible games are > available for them but that would be a good idea as well. I see people > watching tv, surfing the internet and playing games all the time now on > their tablets and smart phones. It seems like a great way to pass the time > while waiting for a bus or appointment and to take notes. > > So, curious as to what you have found user friendly with them particularly > the new windows surface tablet. I guess part of me leans toward this because > I already know the windows keystrokes and the microsoft suite keystrokes > from being a windows user. > > Thanks. > Ashley > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Sun Mar 24 05:07:51 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2013 01:07:51 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] tablet users In-Reply-To: References: <373ABCAB39B2484EA1AFFA7915D74C9D@OwnerPC> Message-ID: <2A16CAF2452B45328CE7E148C00AEBD8@OwnerPC> Arielle, Yes they are. They showed me narrator, the screen reader for windows tablet, at the store. I've heard demonstrations of the nexus 7 online with its screen reader, but have not tried one out yet. However, I'm also wondering if you can install jaws on a windows surface pro tablet. This is because it might be easier for us to understand and manipulate the cursor with something familiar. I guess Narrator has its own commands. I figured since some of us own jaws already, installing it on a second device shouldn't be too hard. I have no clue if Narrator offers as much reading information as jaws would; certainly, it does not let you customize it like jaws does. I'm hoping to get a hands on demo of it soon and find out how useful narrator is. Narrator was on windows 7 but did not speak enough to be useful, so everyone still recommended using jaws on the pc. Ashley -----Original Message----- From: Arielle Silverman Sent: Sunday, March 24, 2013 1:01 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] tablet users I'm just curious; are the Windows and Google tablets accessible out of the box or do you have to install special software as you do for Android or Windows smart phones? Arielle On 3/23/13, Ashley Bramlett wrote: > Hi all, > > Tablets are quickly coming on the market as an alternative to laptops. > Some > of the major tablets are accessible with voice output and magnification. > The > Ipad, nexus 7 and windows tablet are accessible and there may be more I’m > not aware of. > > I’d like to hear experiences with tablets. Have you used them and did you > find the gestures easy to learn? How did you learn how to move around? Did > you use a keyboard instead of the touch screen? It seems to me that you > could use a tablet to write notes and surf the internet since its got a > word > processor in it. Being new technology, tablets are fairly expensive, but > some more expensive than others. > > I like the idea of downloading aps on a tablet; like the pandora ap for > music or watching tv shows. I don’t know if any accessible games are > available for them but that would be a good idea as well. I see people > watching tv, surfing the internet and playing games all the time now on > their tablets and smart phones. It seems like a great way to pass the time > while waiting for a bus or appointment and to take notes. > > So, curious as to what you have found user friendly with them particularly > the new windows surface tablet. I guess part of me leans toward this > because > I already know the windows keystrokes and the microsoft suite keystrokes > from being a windows user. > > Thanks. > Ashley > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From joshkart12 at gmail.com Sun Mar 24 05:13:51 2013 From: joshkart12 at gmail.com (Josh Gregory) Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2013 01:13:51 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] tablet users In-Reply-To: References: <373ABCAB39B2484EA1AFFA7915D74C9D@OwnerPC> Message-ID: I believe Google has talkback now. Not sure about windows. Sent from my iPhone On Mar 24, 2013, at 1:01 AM, Arielle Silverman wrote: > I'm just curious; are the Windows and Google tablets accessible out of > the box or do you have to install special software as you do for > Android or Windows smart phones? > Arielle > > On 3/23/13, Ashley Bramlett wrote: >> Hi all, >> >> Tablets are quickly coming on the market as an alternative to laptops. Some >> of the major tablets are accessible with voice output and magnification. The >> Ipad, nexus 7 and windows tablet are accessible and there may be more I’m >> not aware of. >> >> I’d like to hear experiences with tablets. Have you used them and did you >> find the gestures easy to learn? How did you learn how to move around? Did >> you use a keyboard instead of the touch screen? It seems to me that you >> could use a tablet to write notes and surf the internet since its got a word >> processor in it. Being new technology, tablets are fairly expensive, but >> some more expensive than others. >> >> I like the idea of downloading aps on a tablet; like the pandora ap for >> music or watching tv shows. I don’t know if any accessible games are >> available for them but that would be a good idea as well. I see people >> watching tv, surfing the internet and playing games all the time now on >> their tablets and smart phones. It seems like a great way to pass the time >> while waiting for a bus or appointment and to take notes. >> >> So, curious as to what you have found user friendly with them particularly >> the new windows surface tablet. I guess part of me leans toward this because >> I already know the windows keystrokes and the microsoft suite keystrokes >> from being a windows user. >> >> Thanks. >> Ashley >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Sun Mar 24 16:49:02 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2013 12:49:02 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] tablet users In-Reply-To: References: <373ABCAB39B2484EA1AFFA7915D74C9D@OwnerPC> Message-ID: Hi, I love the IPad. Even if you're not already familiar with the touch-screen gestures it's pretty easy to pick up, and their is a built in voiceover tutorial that you can use for practice when you're just learning. I'd definitely recommend it. On 3/24/13, Josh Gregory wrote: > I believe Google has talkback now. Not sure about windows. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 24, 2013, at 1:01 AM, Arielle Silverman wrote: > >> I'm just curious; are the Windows and Google tablets accessible out of >> the box or do you have to install special software as you do for >> Android or Windows smart phones? >> Arielle >> >> On 3/23/13, Ashley Bramlett wrote: >>> Hi all, >>> >>> Tablets are quickly coming on the market as an alternative to laptops. >>> Some >>> of the major tablets are accessible with voice output and magnification. >>> The >>> Ipad, nexus 7 and windows tablet are accessible and there may be more I’m >>> not aware of. >>> >>> I’d like to hear experiences with tablets. Have you used them and did you >>> find the gestures easy to learn? How did you learn how to move around? >>> Did >>> you use a keyboard instead of the touch screen? It seems to me that you >>> could use a tablet to write notes and surf the internet since its got a >>> word >>> processor in it. Being new technology, tablets are fairly expensive, but >>> some more expensive than others. >>> >>> I like the idea of downloading aps on a tablet; like the pandora ap for >>> music or watching tv shows. I don’t know if any accessible games are >>> available for them but that would be a good idea as well. I see people >>> watching tv, surfing the internet and playing games all the time now on >>> their tablets and smart phones. It seems like a great way to pass the >>> time >>> while waiting for a bus or appointment and to take notes. >>> >>> So, curious as to what you have found user friendly with them >>> particularly >>> the new windows surface tablet. I guess part of me leans toward this >>> because >>> I already know the windows keystrokes and the microsoft suite keystrokes >>> from being a windows user. >>> >>> Thanks. >>> Ashley >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Sun Mar 24 17:09:58 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2013 13:09:58 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <000301ce273b$eb4dc7e0$c1e957a0$@gmail.com> References: <514d43a9.af76ec0a.48de.092a@mx.google.com> <001b01ce270a$111e2eb0$335a8c10$@gmail.com> <00cd01ce27f5$a344d0f0$e9ce72d0$@gmail.com> <000301ce273b$eb4dc7e0$c1e957a0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, In response to what Misty said, I don't necessarily think posting something on the internet as opposed to writing it in print gives someone the freedom of speech to slander others. Yes, it happens quite frequently, but that doesn't necessarily mean these misinformed people have the total right to do so. I agree with Arielle; I came to the same conclusions about the pointlessness of the ASL article, (Psych students must think alike), and also think that we should counter by writing good articles. I think only a court order from a judge would fully force E-How into cleaning up their site, much less only their articles pertaining to negative portrayals of blindness as they've got thousands now, but we can certainly inform them that their articles are slanderous and put some up that are more realistic about blind people and their true capabilities. (Just as a side note to Arielle, the other thing that stumped me about teaching a full ASL alphabet to blind babies is that most deaf children don't necessarily start with just letters. They learn simple words too. When babies are really young, whether they are verbal or use ASL, the focus isn't quite on spelling and phonix yet; it's about giving the child the ability to tell someone what they need or want. So, even if a blind child were to be taught ASL, I find it hard to believe that a competent teacher would just teach letters and force the child to learn the spelling of words possibly before the child is even in Pre-school, when they could just say, "This is the sign for thirsty, or this sign means hungry," and give the child an entire word. Perhaps the author knows just as much about teaching ASL to children in general than they do about blindness; very little). I've poked around on BlindHow a few times; great resource, and if we were to get E-How to recognize it it would be great. On 3/22/13, justin williams wrote: > Ops. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joe > Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2013 2:39 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Let's get on the same page here. The word is "defamation," not > "deformation." Anal point really, but if we're going to educate the public, > let's be educated about it.--Joe > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin > williams > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 10:32 AM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Yeah, once you are destroying someone's character or the character of an > entire group, that is no longer free speech. There are limits. You've got > to have evidence and then present the evidence in order to damn someone's > character like that, something usually done in a legal proceeding. Those > articles are deformation of character. Tjhey portray us in a negative > light. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2013 3:21 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Sophie, > > I didn't say that we should restrict free speech; all that was meant that > there should be some consideration towards the people this negative stuff > is > written about, (In this case blind people, although I've seen some similar > articles about people with other conditions now that I've actually looked). > Most sites have a policy which covers nondescrimination or something, and > I'd say some of this stuff is definitely descriminatory in the sense that > it > paints the picture of a blind person as someone who can't do anything for > themselves, which we all know is not the case. Someone else pointed out > that E-How has a policy regarding the submission of misinformation to their > articles, so if they do have this policy in place then they're obviously > not > following their own guidelines. In short, people can write what they want; > but when it effects a large group of others in a negative way then I think > that is cause for concern. > > It wasn't really Helen Keller's fault; she was blind and deaf and did what > she had to do. In terms of the spotlight she was also the world's second > deafblind person to learn to communicate, so naturally people would find > her > inspirational or exceptional, many other terms. > I think the real issue stems from misinformation in articles such as this. > Obviously not all blind people are also deaf, and obviously most blind > people do not also require wheelchairs as airports seem to commonly think. > I don't necessarily see pointing this misinformation out to E-How as a bad > thing or something that would infringe on people's first amendment right > considering what was written. > > On 3/23/13, Sophie Trist wrote: >> Kaiti, if we restricted people from writing these articles, as stupid >> and bogus as they might be, we'd be violating the first amendment. >> Free speech can be a double-edged sword in cases like this. As for the >> teaching ASL to blind people, that's a common stereotype. This might >> sound mean, but I blame Helen Keller for that. Ever since her story >> went viral, blindness and deafness have been associated. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Kaiti Shelton > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hi all, >> >> Brandon's last post made my week! I don't think it is right for stuff >> like this to be available to give sighted people a false idea of what >> blind people are like, but I too have seen many other articles that >> don't make sense. (Have you seen the article about the importance of >> teaching ASL to blind people yet?) There are plenty of non-blindness >> related ones that are total trash to if you just look them up, and >> nothing from E-How should be taken seriously. That being said, I >> think I'm somewhere in between; I've recognized E-How for what it is >> as Brandon pointed out, but I think that there is a definite line >> between sensitivity and humor and in this case some of these articles >> do cross that line. I know I would probably give someone the whatfor >> if they tried to feed me or refused to give me a full glass of Coke >> because I'm blind, but it's just a matter of letting E-How know they >> should evaluate some of these grossly insensitive articles. >> >> Brandon: I know people from a music program I attend in the summers >> called Braille Beats who actually describe sighted people as "Light >> dependent." Your post reminded me of that and captured that idea >> perfectly. >> >> How to manage a day with a Light-ependent person. >> >> People who have the misfortune of being congenitally dependent upon >> light for survival need several accomodations including patience and >> understanding from those not afflicted by the condition. In this >> article I will present some everyday situations and ways you can help >> your light-dependent friend or family member get through the day. >> >> Driving in the car going somewhere: When the person complains about >> the bad driving of others, simply smile and distract him/her from the >> road rage. Find a topic of conversation which interests both of you, >> but still make sure they focus on their personal driving. Be patient >> with them, although nothing is really solved by getting mad at other >> drivers. They really can't help it sometimes. >> Reading their own writing: Another factor of frustration for >> light-dependent people is reading their own writing. >> Light-dependent >> people don't have the advantage of using a system so eligant as >> braille where letters are confused not too often, especially when >> contractions are used. Because their system is more cumbersome and >> they have the poor tendency to write sloppily when rushed they >> sometimes can't even read what they've written. They also don't have >> access to a refreshable display for their writing, so papers are >> frequently lost in the shuffle. This leads to frustration and other >> factors such as getting lost on the way to a destination or forgetting >> something they needed from the store. Try to be patient and help them >> remember what it is they wanted to buy, or perhaps that exit number >> they told you they'd need to take off the highway. >> In a college dorm at night: Sometimes your roommate may need to stay >> up later than you and in order to complete their work they may need a >> light. Again, be patient; if noise bothers you plug yourself into >> your IPod and try falling asleep to music. If the light is bothersome >> try to block it out; if you only have vision from one eye putting that >> side of your face into the pillow does the trick wonderfully. Do >> this, and be thankful that you don't necessarily need light to read a >> book or that you can turn off the screen on your laptop out of >> consideration for others. >> >> Okay, the last one was me grasping for straws, but you get the >> picture. I also didn't mean to talk down sighted people; just an >> attempt at humor. >> >> On 3/22/13, Brandon Keith Biggs >> wrote: >> Hello, >> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >> room for a sighted person. >> >> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. >> Sighted >> people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like >> walking into >> >> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm >> outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining >> into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure >> print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >> >> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >> If you >> >> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make >> sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the >> sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without >> protection. >> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >> Thanks, >> >> Brandon Keith Biggs >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Josh Gregory >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >> > wrote: >> >> Hi, >> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >> earlier post. >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >> > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> > Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> >> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, and >> to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily refute >> them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't >> advocate without proper information. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >> Gregory >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >> good idea here, and when >> >> I >> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >> they're like. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester > wrote: >> >> I don't want to read their trash. >> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >> give them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >> philosophy! >> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >> anything, and have never seen a blind person do anything >> independently! >> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread >> that I just started. >> Thanks, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >> You >> think >> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >> ideas come from? >> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >> that blind person is you? >> Carrie >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester > wrote: >> >> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >> terrible picture of blindness! >> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >> before! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >> >> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one >> is also titled "how to feed a blind person" >> >> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >> Carrie >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >> wrote: >> >> Where are the articles? >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >> Gilmer >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing list >> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hello all~ >> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >> eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically >> bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them >> last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend >> pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another >> one! I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in >> the midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate >> portrayal from the article or from our life!, I believe it was >> pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in >> the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the >> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language >> and ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >> the >> Blind) >> as a reference!!!!!!!! >> >> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >> specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters >> naming problems with each article are needed. >> >> We must get these off the internet. >> >> Contact for complaint for eHow: >> >> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >> doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get >> enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down >> permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: >> >> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >> eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, >> Kirkland, >> >> WA >> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of >> Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA >> 95814 or (800) >> 952-5210 >> >> Best, >> >> Carrie >> >> Sent from my iPad >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia >> ms2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer >> %40gmail.co >> m >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%4 >> 0pccuaedu.o >> nmicrosoft.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer >> %40gmail.co >> m >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%4 >> 0pccua.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40 >> gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia >> ms2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley >> %40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40 >> gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithb >> iggs%40gmail.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarine >> t104%40gmail.com >> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade >> r%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% >> 40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From deb.mendelsohn at gmail.com Sun Mar 24 18:25:38 2013 From: deb.mendelsohn at gmail.com (Deb Mendelsohn) Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2013 11:25:38 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] VR COMPLAINT Message-ID: HI ALL IS THERE A WAY TO COMPLAIN TO RSA ABOUT FRAUD? TIA DEB - From arielle71 at gmail.com Sun Mar 24 19:56:04 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2013 13:56:04 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] VR COMPLAINT In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: It depends on at what level you think the fraud is happening. If you have issues or concerns about your rehab counselor's actions, you should complain to their supervisor or the head of VR for your state. However if the fraud is happening higher up than your counselor's level, you may need to get more formal. You should discuss the specific situation with your NFB state president (Bob Kresmer in AZ) to find out what he thinks and who would be the best person to talk with. Arielle On 3/24/13, Deb Mendelsohn wrote: > HI ALL > IS THERE A WAY TO COMPLAIN TO RSA ABOUT FRAUD? > TIA > DEB > > - > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From arielle71 at gmail.com Sun Mar 24 20:06:24 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2013 14:06:24 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <514d43a9.af76ec0a.48de.092a@mx.google.com> <001b01ce270a$111e2eb0$335a8c10$@gmail.com> <00cd01ce27f5$a344d0f0$e9ce72d0$@gmail.com> <000301ce273b$eb4dc7e0$c1e957a0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: The E-how article about teaching blind babies ASL doesn't say to teach them the alphabet; it says to teach them all the word signs, starting with "more" and then including basic need words like eat, drink and diaper. Eventually, though, it suggests teaching the blind child all the ASL signs, though maybe not letters. There are some blind babies who have a speech delay because of a secondary disability or who are just late talkers, and it is true that signing can help them communicate, but saying every blind baby should know how to sign is ridiculous. Arielle On 3/24/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Hi, > > In response to what Misty said, I don't necessarily think posting > something on the internet as opposed to writing it in print gives > someone the freedom of speech to slander others. Yes, it happens > quite frequently, but that doesn't necessarily mean these misinformed > people have the total right to do so. > > I agree with Arielle; I came to the same conclusions about the > pointlessness of the ASL article, (Psych students must think alike), > and also think that we should counter by writing good articles. I > think only a court order from a judge would fully force E-How into > cleaning up their site, much less only their articles pertaining to > negative portrayals of blindness as they've got thousands now, but we > can certainly inform them that their articles are slanderous and put > some up that are more realistic about blind people and their true > capabilities. (Just as a side note to Arielle, the other thing that > stumped me about teaching a full ASL alphabet to blind babies is that > most deaf children don't necessarily start with just letters. They > learn simple words too. When babies are really young, whether they > are verbal or use ASL, the focus isn't quite on spelling and phonix > yet; it's about giving the child the ability to tell someone what they > need or want. So, even if a blind child were to be taught ASL, I find > it hard to believe that a competent teacher would just teach letters > and force the child to learn the spelling of words possibly before the > child is even in Pre-school, when they could just say, "This is the > sign for thirsty, or this sign means hungry," and give the child an > entire word. Perhaps the author knows just as much about teaching ASL > to children in general than they do about blindness; very little). > > I've poked around on BlindHow a few times; great resource, and if we > were to get E-How to recognize it it would be great. > > > On 3/22/13, justin williams wrote: >> Ops. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joe >> Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2013 2:39 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Let's get on the same page here. The word is "defamation," not >> "deformation." Anal point really, but if we're going to educate the >> public, >> let's be educated about it.--Joe >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >> williams >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 10:32 AM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Yeah, once you are destroying someone's character or the character of an >> entire group, that is no longer free speech. There are limits. You've >> got >> to have evidence and then present the evidence in order to damn someone's >> character like that, something usually done in a legal proceeding. Those >> articles are deformation of character. Tjhey portray us in a negative >> light. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >> Shelton >> Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2013 3:21 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Sophie, >> >> I didn't say that we should restrict free speech; all that was meant that >> there should be some consideration towards the people this negative stuff >> is >> written about, (In this case blind people, although I've seen some >> similar >> articles about people with other conditions now that I've actually >> looked). >> Most sites have a policy which covers nondescrimination or something, and >> I'd say some of this stuff is definitely descriminatory in the sense that >> it >> paints the picture of a blind person as someone who can't do anything for >> themselves, which we all know is not the case. Someone else pointed out >> that E-How has a policy regarding the submission of misinformation to >> their >> articles, so if they do have this policy in place then they're obviously >> not >> following their own guidelines. In short, people can write what they >> want; >> but when it effects a large group of others in a negative way then I >> think >> that is cause for concern. >> >> It wasn't really Helen Keller's fault; she was blind and deaf and did >> what >> she had to do. In terms of the spotlight she was also the world's second >> deafblind person to learn to communicate, so naturally people would find >> her >> inspirational or exceptional, many other terms. >> I think the real issue stems from misinformation in articles such as >> this. >> Obviously not all blind people are also deaf, and obviously most blind >> people do not also require wheelchairs as airports seem to commonly >> think. >> I don't necessarily see pointing this misinformation out to E-How as a >> bad >> thing or something that would infringe on people's first amendment right >> considering what was written. >> >> On 3/23/13, Sophie Trist wrote: >>> Kaiti, if we restricted people from writing these articles, as stupid >>> and bogus as they might be, we'd be violating the first amendment. >>> Free speech can be a double-edged sword in cases like this. As for the >>> teaching ASL to blind people, that's a common stereotype. This might >>> sound mean, but I blame Helen Keller for that. Ever since her story >>> went viral, blindness and deafness have been associated. >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: Kaiti Shelton >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> Brandon's last post made my week! I don't think it is right for stuff >>> like this to be available to give sighted people a false idea of what >>> blind people are like, but I too have seen many other articles that >>> don't make sense. (Have you seen the article about the importance of >>> teaching ASL to blind people yet?) There are plenty of non-blindness >>> related ones that are total trash to if you just look them up, and >>> nothing from E-How should be taken seriously. That being said, I >>> think I'm somewhere in between; I've recognized E-How for what it is >>> as Brandon pointed out, but I think that there is a definite line >>> between sensitivity and humor and in this case some of these articles >>> do cross that line. I know I would probably give someone the whatfor >>> if they tried to feed me or refused to give me a full glass of Coke >>> because I'm blind, but it's just a matter of letting E-How know they >>> should evaluate some of these grossly insensitive articles. >>> >>> Brandon: I know people from a music program I attend in the summers >>> called Braille Beats who actually describe sighted people as "Light >>> dependent." Your post reminded me of that and captured that idea >>> perfectly. >>> >>> How to manage a day with a Light-ependent person. >>> >>> People who have the misfortune of being congenitally dependent upon >>> light for survival need several accomodations including patience and >>> understanding from those not afflicted by the condition. In this >>> article I will present some everyday situations and ways you can help >>> your light-dependent friend or family member get through the day. >>> >>> Driving in the car going somewhere: When the person complains about >>> the bad driving of others, simply smile and distract him/her from the >>> road rage. Find a topic of conversation which interests both of you, >>> but still make sure they focus on their personal driving. Be patient >>> with them, although nothing is really solved by getting mad at other >>> drivers. They really can't help it sometimes. >>> Reading their own writing: Another factor of frustration for >>> light-dependent people is reading their own writing. >>> Light-dependent >>> people don't have the advantage of using a system so eligant as >>> braille where letters are confused not too often, especially when >>> contractions are used. Because their system is more cumbersome and >>> they have the poor tendency to write sloppily when rushed they >>> sometimes can't even read what they've written. They also don't have >>> access to a refreshable display for their writing, so papers are >>> frequently lost in the shuffle. This leads to frustration and other >>> factors such as getting lost on the way to a destination or forgetting >>> something they needed from the store. Try to be patient and help them >>> remember what it is they wanted to buy, or perhaps that exit number >>> they told you they'd need to take off the highway. >>> In a college dorm at night: Sometimes your roommate may need to stay >>> up later than you and in order to complete their work they may need a >>> light. Again, be patient; if noise bothers you plug yourself into >>> your IPod and try falling asleep to music. If the light is bothersome >>> try to block it out; if you only have vision from one eye putting that >>> side of your face into the pillow does the trick wonderfully. Do >>> this, and be thankful that you don't necessarily need light to read a >>> book or that you can turn off the screen on your laptop out of >>> consideration for others. >>> >>> Okay, the last one was me grasping for straws, but you get the >>> picture. I also didn't mean to talk down sighted people; just an >>> attempt at humor. >>> >>> On 3/22/13, Brandon Keith Biggs >>> wrote: >>> Hello, >>> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >>> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >>> room for a sighted person. >>> >>> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. >>> Sighted >>> people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like >>> walking into >>> >>> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >>> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm >>> outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining >>> into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure >>> print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >>> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >>> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >>> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >>> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >>> >>> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >>> If you >>> >>> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >>> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >>> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make >>> sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the >>> sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without >>> protection. >>> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >>> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Josh Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >>> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >>> mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >>> >> wrote: >>> >>> Hi, >>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>> earlier post. >>> Misty >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>> >> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> >>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, and >>> to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily refute >>> them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You can't >>> advocate without proper information. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>> Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>> good idea here, and when >>> >>> I >>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>> they're like. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >> wrote: >>> >>> I don't want to read their trash. >>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>> give them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>> philosophy! >>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>> anything, and have never seen a blind person do anything >>> independently! >>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread >>> that I just started. >>> Thanks, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>> You >>> think >>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>> ideas come from? >>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>> that blind person is you? >>> Carrie >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >> wrote: >>> >>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>> terrible picture of blindness! >>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century and >>> before! >>> Blessings, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>> >>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one >>> is also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>> >>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is no >>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>> Carrie >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>> wrote: >>> >>> Where are the articles? >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >>> Gilmer >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >>> mailing list >>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hello all~ >>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >>> eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically >>> bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them >>> last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend >>> pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another >>> one! I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in >>> the midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate >>> portrayal from the article or from our life!, I believe it was >>> pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in >>> the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the >>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >>> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language >>> and ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>> the >>> Blind) >>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>> >>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and write >>> complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned argument >>> specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters >>> naming problems with each article are needed. >>> >>> We must get these off the internet. >>> >>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>> >>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>> doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get >>> enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>> permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: >>> >>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >>> eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, >>> Kirkland, >>> >>> WA >>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of >>> Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA >>> 95814 or (800) >>> 952-5210 >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> Carrie >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia >>> ms2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer >>> %40gmail.co >>> m >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%4 >>> 0pccuaedu.o >>> nmicrosoft.com >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer >>> %40gmail.co >>> m >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%4 >>> 0pccua.edu >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40 >>> gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia >>> ms2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley >>> %40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40 >>> gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithb >>> iggs%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarine >>> t104%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade >>> r%40gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% >>> 40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From colorado.students at gmail.com Mon Mar 25 00:00:24 2013 From: colorado.students at gmail.com (colorado.students at gmail.com) Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2013 18:00:24 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] tablet users In-Reply-To: References: <373ABCAB39B2484EA1AFFA7915D74C9D@OwnerPC> Message-ID: Hello everyone for the nexus seven tablet talk back is already installed but you will need someone with sight to enable it for you. I would not recommend the tablet because there still needs to be improvement for as being accessible. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle Silverman Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2013 11:02 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] tablet users I'm just curious; are the Windows and Google tablets accessible out of the box or do you have to install special software as you do for Android or Windows smart phones? Arielle On 3/23/13, Ashley Bramlett wrote: > Hi all, > > Tablets are quickly coming on the market as an alternative to laptops. > Some of the major tablets are accessible with voice output and > magnification. The Ipad, nexus 7 and windows tablet are accessible and > there may be more I'm not aware of. > > I'd like to hear experiences with tablets. Have you used them and did > you find the gestures easy to learn? How did you learn how to move > around? Did you use a keyboard instead of the touch screen? It seems > to me that you could use a tablet to write notes and surf the internet > since its got a word processor in it. Being new technology, tablets > are fairly expensive, but some more expensive than others. > > I like the idea of downloading aps on a tablet; like the pandora ap > for music or watching tv shows. I don't know if any accessible games > are available for them but that would be a good idea as well. I see > people watching tv, surfing the internet and playing games all the > time now on their tablets and smart phones. It seems like a great way > to pass the time while waiting for a bus or appointment and to take notes. > > So, curious as to what you have found user friendly with them > particularly the new windows surface tablet. I guess part of me leans > toward this because I already know the windows keystrokes and the > microsoft suite keystrokes from being a windows user. > > Thanks. > Ashley > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. > com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/colorado.students%40gmai l.com From ryan.bishop96 at gmail.com Mon Mar 25 00:13:59 2013 From: ryan.bishop96 at gmail.com (Ryan Bishop) Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2013 17:13:59 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] tablet users In-Reply-To: References: <373ABCAB39B2484EA1AFFA7915D74C9D@OwnerPC> Message-ID: <90691B84-A5FF-4784-87BF-139E04AF409B@gmail.com> Hi all I don't recommend any android os simpley because of accessibility. Though that was my previous experiences. I do recommend iPads and iPhones and I have a gestures doc if anyone needs it. If anyone would like it let me know. Ryan Sent from my iPhone On 24/03/2013, at 17:00, wrote: > Hello everyone for the nexus seven tablet talk back is already installed but > you will need someone with sight to enable it for you. I would not > recommend the tablet because there still needs to be improvement for as > being accessible. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle > Silverman > Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2013 11:02 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] tablet users > > I'm just curious; are the Windows and Google tablets accessible out of the > box or do you have to install special software as you do for Android or > Windows smart phones? > Arielle > > On 3/23/13, Ashley Bramlett wrote: >> Hi all, >> >> Tablets are quickly coming on the market as an alternative to laptops. >> Some of the major tablets are accessible with voice output and >> magnification. The Ipad, nexus 7 and windows tablet are accessible and >> there may be more I'm not aware of. >> >> I'd like to hear experiences with tablets. Have you used them and did >> you find the gestures easy to learn? How did you learn how to move >> around? Did you use a keyboard instead of the touch screen? It seems >> to me that you could use a tablet to write notes and surf the internet >> since its got a word processor in it. Being new technology, tablets >> are fairly expensive, but some more expensive than others. >> >> I like the idea of downloading aps on a tablet; like the pandora ap >> for music or watching tv shows. I don't know if any accessible games >> are available for them but that would be a good idea as well. I see >> people watching tv, surfing the internet and playing games all the >> time now on their tablets and smart phones. It seems like a great way >> to pass the time while waiting for a bus or appointment and to take notes. >> >> So, curious as to what you have found user friendly with them >> particularly the new windows surface tablet. I guess part of me leans >> toward this because I already know the windows keystrokes and the >> microsoft suite keystrokes from being a windows user. >> >> Thanks. >> Ashley >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >> com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/colorado.students%40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ryan.bishop96%40gmail.com From roberthansen1970 at gmail.com Mon Mar 25 02:28:06 2013 From: roberthansen1970 at gmail.com (Robert A. Hansen) Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2013 21:28:06 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] tablet users In-Reply-To: References: <373ABCAB39B2484EA1AFFA7915D74C9D@OwnerPC> Message-ID: <514FB636.4080100@gmail.com> I have the Samsung Galaxy Tab 2 and it also has the Talk Back. Some of it is awkward. I am learning it. I need to learn hand gestures. It is Android Jelly Bean. Robert H On 3/24/2013 7:00 PM, colorado.students at gmail.com wrote: > Hello everyone for the nexus seven tablet talk back is already installed but > you will need someone with sight to enable it for you. I would not > recommend the tablet because there still needs to be improvement for as > being accessible. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle > Silverman > Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2013 11:02 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] tablet users > > I'm just curious; are the Windows and Google tablets accessible out of the > box or do you have to install special software as you do for Android or > Windows smart phones? > Arielle > > On 3/23/13, Ashley Bramlett wrote: >> Hi all, >> >> Tablets are quickly coming on the market as an alternative to laptops. >> Some of the major tablets are accessible with voice output and >> magnification. The Ipad, nexus 7 and windows tablet are accessible and >> there may be more I'm not aware of. >> >> I'd like to hear experiences with tablets. Have you used them and did >> you find the gestures easy to learn? How did you learn how to move >> around? Did you use a keyboard instead of the touch screen? It seems >> to me that you could use a tablet to write notes and surf the internet >> since its got a word processor in it. Being new technology, tablets >> are fairly expensive, but some more expensive than others. >> >> I like the idea of downloading aps on a tablet; like the pandora ap >> for music or watching tv shows. I don't know if any accessible games >> are available for them but that would be a good idea as well. I see >> people watching tv, surfing the internet and playing games all the >> time now on their tablets and smart phones. It seems like a great way >> to pass the time while waiting for a bus or appointment and to take notes. >> >> So, curious as to what you have found user friendly with them >> particularly the new windows surface tablet. I guess part of me leans >> toward this because I already know the windows keystrokes and the >> microsoft suite keystrokes from being a windows user. >> >> Thanks. >> Ashley >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >> com >> > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/colorado.students%40gmai > l.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/roberthansen1970%40gmail.com > . > -- Sent From My Lenovo b-470/570 Laptop My email for off list and other business use is rob erthansen1970 at gmail.com Skype name is roberthansen33 Some websites I recommend are www.wzrdchicago.org WZRD 88.3fm Chicago's home of freeform programming www.democracynow.org for a truly independent voice in media www.fsrn.org A unique voice for news www.dishnuts.net for some awesome freeform internet talk and music and other assorted content www.wtnd.us An independent radio station WTND-LP 106.3fm in Macomb, IL www.nfb.org The largest organization of the nation's blind www.aa.org if you need help learning to live on life's terms From ryan.bishop96 at gmail.com Mon Mar 25 02:41:24 2013 From: ryan.bishop96 at gmail.com (Ryan Bishop) Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2013 19:41:24 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] tablet users In-Reply-To: <514FB636.4080100@gmail.com> References: <373ABCAB39B2484EA1AFFA7915D74C9D@OwnerPC> <514FB636.4080100@gmail.com> Message-ID: Is the Internet accessible on that? Sent from my iPhone On 24/03/2013, at 19:28, "Robert A. Hansen" wrote: > I have the Samsung Galaxy Tab 2 and it also has the Talk Back. Some of it is awkward. I am learning it. I need to learn hand gestures. It is Android Jelly Bean. > > Robert H > > > On 3/24/2013 7:00 PM, colorado.students at gmail.com wrote: >> Hello everyone for the nexus seven tablet talk back is already installed but >> you will need someone with sight to enable it for you. I would not >> recommend the tablet because there still needs to be improvement for as >> being accessible. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle >> Silverman >> Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2013 11:02 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] tablet users >> >> I'm just curious; are the Windows and Google tablets accessible out of the >> box or do you have to install special software as you do for Android or >> Windows smart phones? >> Arielle >> >> On 3/23/13, Ashley Bramlett wrote: >>> Hi all, >>> >>> Tablets are quickly coming on the market as an alternative to laptops. >>> Some of the major tablets are accessible with voice output and >>> magnification. The Ipad, nexus 7 and windows tablet are accessible and >>> there may be more I'm not aware of. >>> >>> I'd like to hear experiences with tablets. Have you used them and did >>> you find the gestures easy to learn? How did you learn how to move >>> around? Did you use a keyboard instead of the touch screen? It seems >>> to me that you could use a tablet to write notes and surf the internet >>> since its got a word processor in it. Being new technology, tablets >>> are fairly expensive, but some more expensive than others. >>> >>> I like the idea of downloading aps on a tablet; like the pandora ap >>> for music or watching tv shows. I don't know if any accessible games >>> are available for them but that would be a good idea as well. I see >>> people watching tv, surfing the internet and playing games all the >>> time now on their tablets and smart phones. It seems like a great way >>> to pass the time while waiting for a bus or appointment and to take notes. >>> >>> So, curious as to what you have found user friendly with them >>> particularly the new windows surface tablet. I guess part of me leans >>> toward this because I already know the windows keystrokes and the >>> microsoft suite keystrokes from being a windows user. >>> >>> Thanks. >>> Ashley >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >>> com >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/colorado.students%40gmai >> l.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/roberthansen1970%40gmail.com >> . > > -- > Sent From My Lenovo b-470/570 Laptop > > My email for off list and other business use is rob erthansen1970 at gmail.com > Skype name is roberthansen33 > > Some websites I recommend are > > www.wzrdchicago.org > WZRD 88.3fm Chicago's home of freeform programming > > www.democracynow.org for a truly independent voice in media > > www.fsrn.org A unique voice for news > > www.dishnuts.net for some awesome freeform internet talk and music and other assorted content > > www.wtnd.us > An independent radio station WTND-LP 106.3fm in Macomb, IL > > > www.nfb.org The largest organization of the nation's blind > > www.aa.org if you need help learning to live on life's terms > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ryan.bishop96%40gmail.com From deb.mendelsohn at gmail.com Mon Mar 25 05:25:15 2013 From: deb.mendelsohn at gmail.com (Deb Mendelsohn) Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2013 22:25:15 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] VR COMPLAINT References: Message-ID: <514FDFB8.00000D.81588@DEBMENDELSOHNPC> THANKS. I'VE ACTUALLY SEEN THE FRAUDUALENT ACTION OCCUR BY ANOTHER INDIVIDUAL & I'D LIKE 2 REPORT IT ANNOYMOUSLY. -------Original Message------- From: Arielle Silverman Date: 03/24/13 12:56:43 To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR COMPLAINT It depends on at what level you think the fraud is happening. If you have issues or concerns about your rehab counselor's actions, you should complain to their supervisor or the head of VR for your state. However if the fraud is happening higher up than your counselor's level, you may need to get more formal. You should discuss the specific situation with your NFB state president (Bob Kresmer in AZ) to find out what he thinks and who would be the best person to talk with. Arielle On 3/24/13, Deb Mendelsohn wrote: > HI ALL > IS THERE A WAY TO COMPLAIN TO RSA ABOUT FRAUD? > TIA > DEB > > - > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/deb.mendelsohn%40gmail com -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: SENDER_EMAILdeb@@mendelsohn at gmail@@com.png Type: image/png Size: 7469 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: butterfly_top.gif Type: image/gif Size: 12626 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: butterfly_bottom.gif Type: image/gif Size: 20662 bytes Desc: not available URL: From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Sun Mar 24 06:29:27 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2013 02:29:27 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <514d43a9.af76ec0a.48de.092a@mx.google.com> <001b01ce270a$111e2eb0$335a8c10$@gmail.com> <00cd01ce27f5$a344d0f0$e9ce72d0$@gmail.com> <000301ce273b$eb4dc7e0$c1e957a0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <00aa01ce2858$eff35da0$cfda18e0$@gmail.com> Some of the links are dead now. Did they change some of the articles? My friend andI found a good one on the site, but I don't remember the name of the article. , I haven't looked at the rest. The first two we looked at were dead links. When I get a chance, I am going to delve into that site. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Sunday, March 24, 2013 1:10 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Hi, In response to what Misty said, I don't necessarily think posting something on the internet as opposed to writing it in print gives someone the freedom of speech to slander others. Yes, it happens quite frequently, but that doesn't necessarily mean these misinformed people have the total right to do so. I agree with Arielle; I came to the same conclusions about the pointlessness of the ASL article, (Psych students must think alike), and also think that we should counter by writing good articles. I think only a court order from a judge would fully force E-How into cleaning up their site, much less only their articles pertaining to negative portrayals of blindness as they've got thousands now, but we can certainly inform them that their articles are slanderous and put some up that are more realistic about blind people and their true capabilities. (Just as a side note to Arielle, the other thing that stumped me about teaching a full ASL alphabet to blind babies is that most deaf children don't necessarily start with just letters. They learn simple words too. When babies are really young, whether they are verbal or use ASL, the focus isn't quite on spelling and phonix yet; it's about giving the child the ability to tell someone what they need or want. So, even if a blind child were to be taught ASL, I find it hard to believe that a competent teacher would just teach letters and force the child to learn the spelling of words possibly before the child is even in Pre-school, when they could just say, "This is the sign for thirsty, or this sign means hungry," and give the child an entire word. Perhaps the author knows just as much about teaching ASL to children in general than they do about blindness; very little). I've poked around on BlindHow a few times; great resource, and if we were to get E-How to recognize it it would be great. On 3/22/13, justin williams wrote: > Ops. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joe > Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2013 2:39 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Let's get on the same page here. The word is "defamation," not > "deformation." Anal point really, but if we're going to educate the > public, let's be educated about it.--Joe > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin > williams > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 10:32 AM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Yeah, once you are destroying someone's character or the character of > an entire group, that is no longer free speech. There are limits. > You've got to have evidence and then present the evidence in order to > damn someone's character like that, something usually done in a legal > proceeding. Those articles are deformation of character. Tjhey > portray us in a negative light. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti > Shelton > Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2013 3:21 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Sophie, > > I didn't say that we should restrict free speech; all that was meant > that there should be some consideration towards the people this > negative stuff is written about, (In this case blind people, although > I've seen some similar articles about people with other conditions now > that I've actually looked). > Most sites have a policy which covers nondescrimination or something, > and I'd say some of this stuff is definitely descriminatory in the > sense that it paints the picture of a blind person as someone who > can't do anything for themselves, which we all know is not the case. > Someone else pointed out that E-How has a policy regarding the > submission of misinformation to their articles, so if they do have > this policy in place then they're obviously not following their own > guidelines. In short, people can write what they want; but when it > effects a large group of others in a negative way then I think that is > cause for concern. > > It wasn't really Helen Keller's fault; she was blind and deaf and did > what she had to do. In terms of the spotlight she was also the > world's second deafblind person to learn to communicate, so naturally > people would find her inspirational or exceptional, many other terms. > I think the real issue stems from misinformation in articles such as this. > Obviously not all blind people are also deaf, and obviously most blind > people do not also require wheelchairs as airports seem to commonly think. > I don't necessarily see pointing this misinformation out to E-How as a > bad thing or something that would infringe on people's first amendment > right considering what was written. > > On 3/23/13, Sophie Trist wrote: >> Kaiti, if we restricted people from writing these articles, as stupid >> and bogus as they might be, we'd be violating the first amendment. >> Free speech can be a double-edged sword in cases like this. As for >> the teaching ASL to blind people, that's a common stereotype. This >> might sound mean, but I blame Helen Keller for that. Ever since her >> story went viral, blindness and deafness have been associated. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Kaiti Shelton > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hi all, >> >> Brandon's last post made my week! I don't think it is right for >> stuff like this to be available to give sighted people a false idea >> of what blind people are like, but I too have seen many other >> articles that don't make sense. (Have you seen the article about the >> importance of teaching ASL to blind people yet?) There are plenty of >> non-blindness related ones that are total trash to if you just look >> them up, and nothing from E-How should be taken seriously. That >> being said, I think I'm somewhere in between; I've recognized E-How >> for what it is as Brandon pointed out, but I think that there is a >> definite line between sensitivity and humor and in this case some of >> these articles do cross that line. I know I would probably give >> someone the whatfor if they tried to feed me or refused to give me a >> full glass of Coke because I'm blind, but it's just a matter of >> letting E-How know they should evaluate some of these grossly insensitive articles. >> >> Brandon: I know people from a music program I attend in the summers >> called Braille Beats who actually describe sighted people as "Light >> dependent." Your post reminded me of that and captured that idea >> perfectly. >> >> How to manage a day with a Light-ependent person. >> >> People who have the misfortune of being congenitally dependent upon >> light for survival need several accomodations including patience and >> understanding from those not afflicted by the condition. In this >> article I will present some everyday situations and ways you can help >> your light-dependent friend or family member get through the day. >> >> Driving in the car going somewhere: When the person complains about >> the bad driving of others, simply smile and distract him/her from the >> road rage. Find a topic of conversation which interests both of you, >> but still make sure they focus on their personal driving. Be patient >> with them, although nothing is really solved by getting mad at other >> drivers. They really can't help it sometimes. >> Reading their own writing: Another factor of frustration for >> light-dependent people is reading their own writing. >> Light-dependent >> people don't have the advantage of using a system so eligant as >> braille where letters are confused not too often, especially when >> contractions are used. Because their system is more cumbersome and >> they have the poor tendency to write sloppily when rushed they >> sometimes can't even read what they've written. They also don't have >> access to a refreshable display for their writing, so papers are >> frequently lost in the shuffle. This leads to frustration and other >> factors such as getting lost on the way to a destination or >> forgetting something they needed from the store. Try to be patient >> and help them remember what it is they wanted to buy, or perhaps that >> exit number they told you they'd need to take off the highway. >> In a college dorm at night: Sometimes your roommate may need to stay >> up later than you and in order to complete their work they may need a >> light. Again, be patient; if noise bothers you plug yourself into >> your IPod and try falling asleep to music. If the light is >> bothersome try to block it out; if you only have vision from one eye >> putting that side of your face into the pillow does the trick >> wonderfully. Do this, and be thankful that you don't necessarily >> need light to read a book or that you can turn off the screen on your >> laptop out of consideration for others. >> >> Okay, the last one was me grasping for straws, but you get the >> picture. I also didn't mean to talk down sighted people; just an >> attempt at humor. >> >> On 3/22/13, Brandon Keith Biggs >> wrote: >> Hello, >> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >> room for a sighted person. >> >> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. >> Sighted >> people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like >> walking into >> >> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm >> outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun >> shining into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. >> Make sure print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by >> anything so the sighted person can feel comfortable reading the >> familiar labels. If there aren't already print labels on something, >> make sure they are printed in at least 12 point font with black >> letters on a white background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >> >> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >> If you >> >> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make >> sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the >> sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without >> protection. >> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >> Thanks, >> >> Brandon Keith Biggs >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Josh Gregory >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >> > wrote: >> >> Hi, >> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >> earlier post. >> Misty >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >> > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >> > Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> >> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >> can't advocate without proper information. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >> Gregory >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >> good idea here, and when >> >> I >> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >> they're like. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester > wrote: >> >> I don't want to read their trash. >> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >> give them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >> philosophy! >> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >> anything, and have never seen a blind person do anything >> independently! >> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another thread >> that I just started. >> Thanks, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >> You >> think >> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and >> large problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where >> do the ideas come from? >> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear >> "they are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may >> affect a blind person's employment or education worth your time? >> what if that blind person is you? >> Carrie >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester > wrote: >> >> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >> terrible picture of blindness! >> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >> and before! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >> >> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen more...one >> is also titled "how to feed a blind person" >> >> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is >> no distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually >> impaired teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >> Carrie >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >> wrote: >> >> Where are the articles? >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carrie >> Gilmer >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing list >> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hello all~ >> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted on >> eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, horrifically >> bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only viewed four of them >> last night and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend >> pointed out that I was mentioned and partially quoted in another >> one! I was completely unaware, and found upon reading it, it is in >> the midst of misleading and mixed messages and not an accurate >> portrayal from the article or from our life!, I believe it was >> pulled from. The same is true for a friend of mine also "quoted" in >> the same article! one of the articles is titled "How to set the >> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a blind >> person"...They are Just dripping with condescending dramatic language >> and ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation >> FOR the >> Blind) >> as a reference!!!!!!!! >> >> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >> argument specific to false points. There are multiple authors, so >> letters naming problems with each article are needed. >> >> We must get these off the internet. >> >> Contact for complaint for eHow: >> >> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >> doing it one for each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get >> enough coherent and reasonable complaints they will take these down >> permanently...as per their policy on misinformation!: >> >> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us at >> eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. 300, >> Kirkland, >> >> WA >> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. of >> Consumer Affairs may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA >> 95814 or (800) >> 952-5210 >> >> Best, >> >> Carrie >> >> Sent from my iPad >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia >> ms2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer >> %40gmail.co >> m >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%4 >> 0pccuaedu.o >> nmicrosoft.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer >> %40gmail.co >> m >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%4 >> 0pccua.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40 >> gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.willia >> ms2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley >> %40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40 >> gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithb >> iggs%40gmail.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarine >> t104%40gmail.com >> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade >> r%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104 >> % >> 40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% > 40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From deb.mendelsohn at gmail.com Mon Mar 25 12:13:16 2013 From: deb.mendelsohn at gmail.com (Deb Mendelsohn) Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2013 05:13:16 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] =?utf-8?b?15fXkiDXpNeh15cg16nXnteX?= Message-ID: To my fellow Jewish students: חג פסח שמח D ​eb​ -- *Deb's Cell: 520-225-8244* From ALewis at nfb.org Mon Mar 25 12:53:06 2013 From: ALewis at nfb.org (Lewis, Anil) Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2013 12:53:06 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] FW: [Greater-Baltimore] FW: [State-affiliate-leadership-list] Please Sign and Circulate the Petition to Support Fair Wages for Workers with Disabilities Message-ID: <72D51A25A403F249A0FC4A94A0D9640D3A52BC4C@CH1PRD0710MB380.namprd07.prod.outlook.com> I sincerely hope others are doing the following or something similar. Mr. Anil Lewis, M.P.A. "Eliminating Subminimum Wages for People with Disabilities" http://www.nfb.org/fairwages Work: 410-659-9314 ext. 2374 Twitter: @anillife -----Original Message----- From: Greater-baltimore [mailto:greater-baltimore-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Melissa Ann Riccobono Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 10:41 AM To: 'NFB of Maryland e-mail list'; 'NFB of Maryland Baltimore Chapter Discussion List'; mdabs at nfbnet.org; 'Maryland Parents of Blind Children List' Subject: [Greater-baltimore] FW: [State-affiliate-leadership-list] Please Sign and Circulate the Petition to Support Fair Wages for Workers with Disabilities I'm sure this email will be making the rounds, but I believe it is better to receive it more than once instead of not at all! Please take five minutes of your time to sign the petition for fair wages. This is one of the most important issues on which the NFB is working. Also, please spread the word! Millions of Americans do not know it is legal to pay people with disabilities less than the minimum wage. Most of the time, when people find out that this practice is legal, they are horrified and want to do something to help stop it. So, please do your part to educate your family and friends about this issue. Please post a link for this petition on Twitter and Facebook. Email it to family and friends who do not have Facebook or Twitter. The more signatures we have, the better chance we will have of passing our bill to stop this discriminatory practice. The time is now to take action! I did. Will you? Melissa -----Original Message----- From: State-affiliate-leadership-list [mailto:state-affiliate-leadership-list-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Lewis, Anil Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 9:19 AM To: Lewis, Anil Subject: [State-affiliate-leadership-list] Please Sign and Circulate the Petition to Support Fair Wages for Workers with Disabilities Petition to Support Fair Wages for Workers with Disabilities www.nfb.org/fair-wages-petition We, the undersigned, are Americans with disabilities who are adversely affected by subminimum wage payments to workers with disabilities; representatives of organizations made up of, and working on behalf of, Americans with disabilities; friends and family members of individuals who have disabilities; and other concerned citizens who believe in fairness and equality. We all speak in support of the repeal of Section 14(c) of the Fair Labor Standards Act (FLSA), which authorizes Special Wage Certificates that permit employers to pay workers with disabilities subminimum wages, some as low as 3 cents per hour. We reject the low expectations for, the false view of the true capacity of, and the misguided compassion used to justify this discrimination against workers with disabilities. This provision has existed for over seventy years, and rather than creating real employment opportunities for workers with disabilities, it has relegated hundreds of thousands of people with disabilities to segregated, subminimum wage work environments, perpetuated the misconception that workers with disabilities do not have the capacity for productive employment, and masked the need for further development and implementation of innovative employment strategies for the competitive integrated employment of people with disabilities. We all believe that the future prospects for workers with disabilities are limited only by the spirit, ambition, and imagination of Americans with disabilities, and by the willingness of society to expand and implement enlightened policies that will help them succeed. We adamantly assert that as long as workers with disabilities are denied the same workforce protections as every other American citizen, and the solution to the employment dilemma of workers with disabilities is thought to be their continued segregation in subminimum-wage work environments, our society will never truly implement the innovative employment strategies that empower workers with disabilities to fully participate in the workforce. For these reasons, we, the undersigned, urge the repeal of Section 14(c) of the Fair Labor Standards Act in order to abolish the unfair, discriminatory, immoral practice of paying workers with disabilities subminimum wages; to reverse over seventy years of mistaken institutionalized thinking about the employment capacity of people with disabilities; and to incentivize the development, implementation, and use of innovative strategies for their competitive, integrated employment. To sign the petition, visit www.nfb.org/fair-wages-petition Mr. Anil Lewis, M.P.A. Director of Advocacy and Policy "Eliminating Subminimum Wages for People with Disabilities" http://www.nfb.org/fairwages NATIONAL FEDERATION OF THE BLIND 200 East Wells Street at Jernigan Place Baltimore, Maryland 21230 (410) 659-9314 ext. 2374 (Voice) (410) 685-5653 (FAX) Email: alewis at nfb.org Web: www.nfb.org twitter: @anillife From opensesame at me.com Mon Mar 25 13:35:35 2013 From: opensesame at me.com (Bryan Jones) Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2013 09:35:35 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] tablet users In-Reply-To: References: <373ABCAB39B2484EA1AFFA7915D74C9D@OwnerPC> Message-ID: <7257724E-97D6-451C-8D09-CF2A02895EA3@me.com> Please note that sighted assistance is not required to enable text-to-speech during the initial setup process on Nexus tablets running the latest version of Android. Here are the instructions as copied from Google's Nexus Accessibility site at http://support.google.com/nexus/bin/topic.py?hl=en&topic=2692466&parent=2847279&ctx=topic "• To turn on TalkBack and Explore by Touch, place two fingers slightly apart on your screen. You’ll hear spoken feedback when your tablet recognizes the gesture. Keep holding your fingers to enable TalkBack and Explore by Touch. After turning on these features, the Explore by Touch tutorial starts, giving you a chance to experience navigating on Android. When you’ve completed the tutorial, the tablet displays the Welcome screen again." HTH, Bryan On Mar 24, 2013, at 8:00 PM, colorado.students at gmail.com wrote: > Hello everyone for the nexus seven tablet talk back is already installed but > you will need someone with sight to enable it for you. From leyeshprintse at ymail.com Mon Mar 25 17:06:22 2013 From: leyeshprintse at ymail.com (Leye-Shprintse) Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2013 10:06:22 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [nabs-l] =?utf-8?b?15fXkiDXpNeh15cg16nXnteX?= Message-ID: <1364231182.71348.BPMail_high_noncarrier@web122601.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> BS"D Deb, Thank you and a Chag Pesach Kosher veSameach to you too! Kind regards, Leye-Shprintse From wmodnl at hotmail.com Mon Mar 25 18:59:45 2013 From: wmodnl at hotmail.com (wmodnl wmodnl) Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2013 14:59:45 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <7BA3749145E6473FA66942508ABF1D35@BrandonsLaptop2> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com> <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com> <000701ce26a2$b2d5da40$18818ec0$@gmail.com> <003201ce276c$189bad90$49d308b0$@gmail.com> <7BA3749145E6473FA66942508ABF1D35@BrandonsLaptop2> Message-ID: Well, if we were taking a survey of the oddest questions we were ever asked, I think what I was asked today would go well. Sir, not for nothing, how do you go to the bathroom? Well, the same way you do. No, I mean, like, when you are out and not at home. Why don't you use you know like those things for old people, like disabled people? I wanted to put some humor to it, so I said: Remember what used to happen when you pressed the wrong button while dialing in to Verizon? Sorry, that's not an option, try again. She began to tell me, that a blind woman she knew had other disabilities, and also "used things to her advantage." I realized what she was getting at, the clustering affect. One size fits all. Have a great day. Sent from my iPad On Mar 22, 2013, at 10:50 PM, "Brandon Keith Biggs" wrote: > No, > We use these things called food patches we swipe over our arm that puts the nourishment for a good sized meal into our bloodstream. They are used completely by feel with Braille labels so we don't need any help with them. That way we are never in need of wasting extra time eating and doing this horribly unnatural thing called socializing over dinner. If for some reason we are allergic to the substance excreted by the patches, we can bring around a personalized IV that is permanently attached to our arm, injecting our meals directly into our vain. If a blind person ever touches a fork they are in danger of stabbing themselves in the eye which is in front of them, but because they can't see is magically put in the way of any sharp object they may handle. If they eat solid food they may become poisoned because they can't see the germs to keep from consuming bad food. > In all cases blind people are never to be given dinner except in their arm patches. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:14 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Huh? Don't humans need food to survive? I guess they think blind people have > a very short lifespan then, LOL. > > Chris > > Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair > Public Relations Committee > Maryland Association of Blind Students > Phone: (443) 547-2409 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams > Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 10:12 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > I've had people ask me or my friends if I would be capable of eating dinner > on a date. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris Nusbaum > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:28 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does somebody > feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks ago. > > Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair > Public Relations Committee > Maryland Association of Blind Students > Phone: (443) 547-2409 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Exactly! > Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch TV! > I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can tell > somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. > Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman > [arielle71 at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends and my > sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so he > could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were just > listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it > struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was the > one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we didn't. > Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on sighted > people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of blindness > really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, blind > people can be equal or even advantaged. > Arielle > > On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: >> Lol. That is funny. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >> Keith Biggs >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hello, >> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >> room for a sighted person. >> >> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted >> people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like >> walking into >> >> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside >> and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into >> their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print >> labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >> >> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >> If you >> >> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure >> to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted >> person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. >> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >> Thanks, >> >> Brandon Keith Biggs >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Josh Gregory >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >> >> wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>> earlier post. >>> Misty >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>> >>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> >>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>> Gregory >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>> good idea here, and when >> >>>> I >>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>>> they're like. >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>>> give >>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>> philosophy! >>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>>> anything, and >>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>>> thread that >>>> I just started. >>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>>> You think >>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >>>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >>>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>>> ideas come from? >>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >>>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >>>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>>> that blind person is you? >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>> terrible >>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>>> and >>>> before! >>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>> Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>> >>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>>> more...one is >>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>> >>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is >>>>>> no >>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >>>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>>> Carrie >>>> Gilmer >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>>> Students >>>> mailing >>>>>>> list >>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>>> viewed four of them last >>>> night >>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>>> out that >>>> I >>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>>> completely >>>> unaware, >>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>>> from our >>>> life!, >>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>>> titled "How to set >>>> the >>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>>> dramatic language >>>> and >>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>>> the >>>> Blind) >>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>>> argument >>>> specific >>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>> problems >>>> with >>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>>>>>> doing it one >>>> for >>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>>> permanently...as per >>>> their >>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> WA >>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>>> of Consumer >>>> Affairs >>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >>>>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm >> ail.co >>>> m >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >> aedu.o >>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm >> ail.co >>>> m >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >> a.edu >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail >> .com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gm >> ail.co >> m >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >>> l.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% >> 40gmai >> l.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >> com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/wmodnl%40hotmail.com From arielle71 at gmail.com Mon Mar 25 20:12:00 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2013 14:12:00 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com> <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com> <000701ce26a2$b2d5da40$18818ec0$@gmail.com> <003201ce276c$189bad90$49d308b0$@gmail.com> <7BA3749145E6473FA66942508ABF1D35@BrandonsLaptop2> Message-ID: I would submit that using an adult diaper is far from a convenient "advantage" of blindness or any other disability. I'm sorry, but there was really no excuse for that individual to go where she went! Arielle On 3/25/13, wmodnl wmodnl wrote: > Well, if we were taking a survey of the oddest questions we were ever asked, > I think what I was asked today would go well. > Sir, not for nothing, how do you go to the bathroom? Well, the same way you > do. No, I mean, like, when you are out and not at home. Why don't you use > you know like those things for old people, like disabled people? > I wanted to put some humor to it, so I said: > Remember what used to happen when you pressed the wrong button while dialing > in to Verizon? > Sorry, that's not an option, try again. > She began to tell me, that a blind woman she knew had other disabilities, > and also "used things to her advantage." I realized what she was getting > at, the clustering affect. One size fits all. > Have a great day. > > > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 10:50 PM, "Brandon Keith Biggs" > wrote: > >> No, >> We use these things called food patches we swipe over our arm that puts >> the nourishment for a good sized meal into our bloodstream. They are used >> completely by feel with Braille labels so we don't need any help with >> them. That way we are never in need of wasting extra time eating and doing >> this horribly unnatural thing called socializing over dinner. If for some >> reason we are allergic to the substance excreted by the patches, we can >> bring around a personalized IV that is permanently attached to our arm, >> injecting our meals directly into our vain. If a blind person ever touches >> a fork they are in danger of stabbing themselves in the eye which is in >> front of them, but because they can't see is magically put in the way of >> any sharp object they may handle. If they eat solid food they may become >> poisoned because they can't see the germs to keep from consuming bad >> food. >> In all cases blind people are never to be given dinner except in their arm >> patches. >> Thanks, >> >> Brandon Keith Biggs >> -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:14 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Huh? Don't humans need food to survive? I guess they think blind people >> have >> a very short lifespan then, LOL. >> >> Chris >> >> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >> Public Relations Committee >> Maryland Association of Blind Students >> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >> williams >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 10:12 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> I've had people ask me or my friends if I would be capable of eating >> dinner >> on a date. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris >> Nusbaum >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:28 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does somebody >> feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks ago. >> >> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >> Public Relations Committee >> Maryland Association of Blind Students >> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua >> Lester >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Exactly! >> Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch >> TV! >> I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can >> tell >> somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. >> Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman >> [arielle71 at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends and >> my >> sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so he >> could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were >> just >> listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it >> struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was the >> one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we >> didn't. >> Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on >> sighted >> people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of >> blindness >> really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, >> blind >> people can be equal or even advantaged. >> Arielle >> >> On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: >>> Lol. That is funny. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >>> Keith Biggs >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hello, >>> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >>> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >>> room for a sighted person. >>> >>> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted >>> people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like >>> walking into >>> >>> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >>> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside >>> and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into >>> their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print >>> labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >>> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >>> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >>> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >>> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >>> >>> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >>> If you >>> >>> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >>> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >>> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure >>> to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted >>> person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. >>> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >>> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Josh Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >>> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >>> mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >>> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Hi, >>>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>>> earlier post. >>>> Misty >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>>> >>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>>> >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> >>>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>>> Gregory >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>>> good idea here, and when >>> >>>>> I >>>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>>>> they're like. >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>>>> give >>>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>>> philosophy! >>>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>>>> anything, and >>>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>>>> thread that >>>>> I just started. >>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>>>> You think >>>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >>>>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >>>>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>>>> ideas come from? >>>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>>>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >>>>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >>>>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>>>> that blind person is you? >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>>> terrible >>>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>>>> and >>>>> before! >>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>>> >>>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>>>> more...one is >>>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>>> >>>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is >>>>>>> no >>>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>>>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >>>>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>>>> Students >>>>> mailing >>>>>>>> list >>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>>>> viewed four of them last >>>>> night >>>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>>>> out that >>>>> I >>>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>>>> completely >>>>> unaware, >>>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>>>> from our >>>>> life!, >>>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>>>> titled "How to set >>>>> the >>>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>>>> dramatic language >>>>> and >>>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>>>> the >>>>> Blind) >>>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>>>> argument >>>>> specific >>>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>>> problems >>>>> with >>>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>>>>>>> doing it one >>>>> for >>>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>>>> permanently...as per >>>>> their >>>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> WA >>>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>>>> of Consumer >>>>> Affairs >>>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>> 0gmail >>>>>>>> .com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm >>> ail.co >>>>> m >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >>> aedu.o >>>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm >>> ail.co >>>>> m >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >>> a.edu >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail >>> .com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>> 0gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gm >>> ail.co >>> m >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >>>> l.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% >>> 40gmai >>> l.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>> 0gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >>> com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c >> om >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c >> om >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/wmodnl%40hotmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From trillian551 at gmail.com Mon Mar 25 20:51:15 2013 From: trillian551 at gmail.com (Mary Fernandez) Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2013 16:51:15 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com> <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com> <000701ce26a2$b2d5da40$18818ec0$@gmail.com> <003201ce276c$189bad90$49d308b0$@gmail.com> <7BA3749145E6473FA66942508ABF1D35@BrandonsLaptop2> Message-ID: And how about Mr. West coast (aka, el peligroso!)? On 3/25/13, Arielle Silverman wrote: > I would submit that using an adult diaper is far from a convenient > "advantage" of blindness or any other disability. I'm sorry, but there > was really no excuse for that individual to go where she went! > Arielle > > On 3/25/13, wmodnl wmodnl wrote: >> Well, if we were taking a survey of the oddest questions we were ever >> asked, >> I think what I was asked today would go well. >> Sir, not for nothing, how do you go to the bathroom? Well, the same way >> you >> do. No, I mean, like, when you are out and not at home. Why don't you >> use >> you know like those things for old people, like disabled people? >> I wanted to put some humor to it, so I said: >> Remember what used to happen when you pressed the wrong button while >> dialing >> in to Verizon? >> Sorry, that's not an option, try again. >> She began to tell me, that a blind woman she knew had other disabilities, >> and also "used things to her advantage." I realized what she was getting >> at, the clustering affect. One size fits all. >> Have a great day. >> >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 10:50 PM, "Brandon Keith Biggs" >> wrote: >> >>> No, >>> We use these things called food patches we swipe over our arm that puts >>> the nourishment for a good sized meal into our bloodstream. They are >>> used >>> completely by feel with Braille labels so we don't need any help with >>> them. That way we are never in need of wasting extra time eating and >>> doing >>> this horribly unnatural thing called socializing over dinner. If for >>> some >>> reason we are allergic to the substance excreted by the patches, we can >>> bring around a personalized IV that is permanently attached to our arm, >>> injecting our meals directly into our vain. If a blind person ever >>> touches >>> a fork they are in danger of stabbing themselves in the eye which is in >>> front of them, but because they can't see is magically put in the way of >>> any sharp object they may handle. If they eat solid food they may become >>> poisoned because they can't see the germs to keep from consuming bad >>> food. >>> In all cases blind people are never to be given dinner except in their >>> arm >>> patches. >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>> -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:14 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Huh? Don't humans need food to survive? I guess they think blind people >>> have >>> a very short lifespan then, LOL. >>> >>> Chris >>> >>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>> Public Relations Committee >>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>> williams >>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 10:12 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> I've had people ask me or my friends if I would be capable of eating >>> dinner >>> on a date. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris >>> Nusbaum >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:28 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does somebody >>> feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks ago. >>> >>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>> Public Relations Committee >>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua >>> Lester >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Exactly! >>> Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch >>> TV! >>> I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can >>> tell >>> somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. >>> Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! >>> Blessings, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman >>> [arielle71 at gmail.com] >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends and >>> my >>> sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so >>> he >>> could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were >>> just >>> listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it >>> struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was >>> the >>> one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we >>> didn't. >>> Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on >>> sighted >>> people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of >>> blindness >>> really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, >>> blind >>> people can be equal or even advantaged. >>> Arielle >>> >>> On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: >>>> Lol. That is funny. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >>>> Keith Biggs >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Hello, >>>> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >>>> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >>>> room for a sighted person. >>>> >>>> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted >>>> people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like >>>> walking into >>>> >>>> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >>>> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside >>>> and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into >>>> their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print >>>> labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >>>> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >>>> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >>>> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >>>> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >>>> >>>> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >>>> If you >>>> >>>> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >>>> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >>>> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure >>>> to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted >>>> person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. >>>> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >>>> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >>>> Thanks, >>>> >>>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: Josh Gregory >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >>>> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >>>> mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >>>> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>>>> earlier post. >>>>> Misty >>>>> >>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>>>> >>>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>>>> >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>>>> Gregory >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>>>> good idea here, and when >>>> >>>>>> I >>>>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>>>>> they're like. >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>>>>> give >>>>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>>>> philosophy! >>>>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>>>>> anything, and >>>>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>>>>> thread that >>>>>> I just started. >>>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>>>>> You think >>>>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >>>>>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >>>>>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>>>>> ideas come from? >>>>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>>>>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >>>>>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >>>>>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>>>>> that blind person is you? >>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>>>> terrible >>>>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>>>>> and >>>>>> before! >>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>>>>> more...one is >>>>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is >>>>>>>> no >>>>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>>>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>>>>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >>>>>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>>>>> Students >>>>>> mailing >>>>>>>>> list >>>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>>>>> viewed four of them last >>>>>> night >>>>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>>>>> out that >>>>>> I >>>>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>>>>> completely >>>>>> unaware, >>>>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>>>>> from our >>>>>> life!, >>>>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>>>>> titled "How to set >>>>>> the >>>>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>>>>> dramatic language >>>>>> and >>>>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>>>>> the >>>>>> Blind) >>>>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>>>>> argument >>>>>> specific >>>>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>>>> problems >>>>>> with >>>>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>>>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>>>>>>>> doing it one >>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>>>>> permanently...as per >>>>>> their >>>>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> WA >>>>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>>>>> of Consumer >>>>>> Affairs >>>>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>> 0gmail >>>>>>>>> .com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm >>>> ail.co >>>>>> m >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >>>> aedu.o >>>>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm >>>> ail.co >>>>>> m >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >>>> a.edu >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail >>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>> 0gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gm >>>> ail.co >>>> m >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >>>>> l.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% >>>> 40gmai >>>> l.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>> 0gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >>>> com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c >>> om >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c >>> om >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/wmodnl%40hotmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/trillian551%40gmail.com > -- Mary Fernandez "I've learned that people will forget what you said, people will forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them feel." — Maya Angelou From trillian551 at gmail.com Mon Mar 25 20:52:04 2013 From: trillian551 at gmail.com (Mary Fernandez) Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2013 16:52:04 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com> <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com> <000701ce26a2$b2d5da40$18818ec0$@gmail.com> <003201ce276c$189bad90$49d308b0$@gmail.com> <7BA3749145E6473FA66942508ABF1D35@BrandonsLaptop2> Message-ID: Hi all I apologize for the previous message, it was not meant for the NABS list. On 3/25/13, Mary Fernandez wrote: > And how about Mr. West coast (aka, el peligroso!)? > > > On 3/25/13, Arielle Silverman wrote: >> I would submit that using an adult diaper is far from a convenient >> "advantage" of blindness or any other disability. I'm sorry, but there >> was really no excuse for that individual to go where she went! >> Arielle >> >> On 3/25/13, wmodnl wmodnl wrote: >>> Well, if we were taking a survey of the oddest questions we were ever >>> asked, >>> I think what I was asked today would go well. >>> Sir, not for nothing, how do you go to the bathroom? Well, the same way >>> you >>> do. No, I mean, like, when you are out and not at home. Why don't you >>> use >>> you know like those things for old people, like disabled people? >>> I wanted to put some humor to it, so I said: >>> Remember what used to happen when you pressed the wrong button while >>> dialing >>> in to Verizon? >>> Sorry, that's not an option, try again. >>> She began to tell me, that a blind woman she knew had other >>> disabilities, >>> and also "used things to her advantage." I realized what she was >>> getting >>> at, the clustering affect. One size fits all. >>> Have a great day. >>> >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 10:50 PM, "Brandon Keith Biggs" >>> wrote: >>> >>>> No, >>>> We use these things called food patches we swipe over our arm that puts >>>> the nourishment for a good sized meal into our bloodstream. They are >>>> used >>>> completely by feel with Braille labels so we don't need any help with >>>> them. That way we are never in need of wasting extra time eating and >>>> doing >>>> this horribly unnatural thing called socializing over dinner. If for >>>> some >>>> reason we are allergic to the substance excreted by the patches, we can >>>> bring around a personalized IV that is permanently attached to our arm, >>>> injecting our meals directly into our vain. If a blind person ever >>>> touches >>>> a fork they are in danger of stabbing themselves in the eye which is in >>>> front of them, but because they can't see is magically put in the way >>>> of >>>> any sharp object they may handle. If they eat solid food they may >>>> become >>>> poisoned because they can't see the germs to keep from consuming bad >>>> food. >>>> In all cases blind people are never to be given dinner except in their >>>> arm >>>> patches. >>>> Thanks, >>>> >>>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>>> -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:14 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Huh? Don't humans need food to survive? I guess they think blind people >>>> have >>>> a very short lifespan then, LOL. >>>> >>>> Chris >>>> >>>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>>> Public Relations Committee >>>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>> williams >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 10:12 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> I've had people ask me or my friends if I would be capable of eating >>>> dinner >>>> on a date. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris >>>> Nusbaum >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:28 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does >>>> somebody >>>> feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks ago. >>>> >>>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>>> Public Relations Committee >>>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua >>>> Lester >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Exactly! >>>> Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I >>>> watch >>>> TV! >>>> I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can >>>> tell >>>> somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. >>>> Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! >>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle Silverman >>>> [arielle71 at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends >>>> and >>>> my >>>> sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so >>>> he >>>> could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were >>>> just >>>> listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually it >>>> struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was >>>> the >>>> one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we >>>> didn't. >>>> Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on >>>> sighted >>>> people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of >>>> blindness >>>> really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, >>>> blind >>>> people can be equal or even advantaged. >>>> Arielle >>>> >>>> On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>> Lol. That is funny. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >>>>> Keith Biggs >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> Hello, >>>>> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >>>>> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >>>>> room for a sighted person. >>>>> >>>>> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. Sighted >>>>> people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like >>>>> walking into >>>>> >>>>> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >>>>> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm outside >>>>> and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into >>>>> their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure print >>>>> labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >>>>> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >>>>> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >>>>> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >>>>> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >>>>> >>>>> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >>>>> If you >>>>> >>>>> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >>>>> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >>>>> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make sure >>>>> to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the sighted >>>>> person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. >>>>> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >>>>> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> >>>>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: Josh Gregory >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >>>>> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >>>>> mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >>>>> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>>>>> earlier post. >>>>>> Misty >>>>>> >>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>>>>> >>>>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>>>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>>>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>>>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>>>>> Gregory >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>>>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>>>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>>>>> good idea here, and when >>>>> >>>>>>> I >>>>>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see what >>>>>>> they're like. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them and >>>>>>>> give >>>>>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>>>>> philosophy! >>>>>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>>>>>> anything, and >>>>>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>>>>>> thread that >>>>>>> I just started. >>>>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie Gilmer >>>>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>>>>>> You think >>>>>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them to >>>>>>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and large >>>>>>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>>>>>> ideas come from? >>>>>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>>>>>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear "they >>>>>>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may affect >>>>>>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>>>>>> that blind person is you? >>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>>>>> terrible >>>>>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>> before! >>>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>>>>>> more...one is >>>>>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There is >>>>>>>>> no >>>>>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>>>>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>>>>>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually impaired >>>>>>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>>>>>> Students >>>>>>> mailing >>>>>>>>>> list >>>>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>>>>>> viewed four of them last >>>>>>> night >>>>>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>>>>>> out that >>>>>>> I >>>>>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>>>>>> completely >>>>>>> unaware, >>>>>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>>>>>> from our >>>>>>> life!, >>>>>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>>>>>> titled "How to set >>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>>>>>> dramatic language >>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation FOR >>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>> Blind) >>>>>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>>>>>> argument >>>>>>> specific >>>>>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>>>>> problems >>>>>>> with >>>>>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING ACCURATE >>>>>>>>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will be >>>>>>>>>> doing it one >>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>>>>>> permanently...as per >>>>>>> their >>>>>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> WA >>>>>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>>>>>> of Consumer >>>>>>> Affairs >>>>>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>>> 0gmail >>>>>>>>>> .com >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm >>>>> ail.co >>>>>>> m >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >>>>> aedu.o >>>>>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm >>>>> ail.co >>>>>>> m >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >>>>> a.edu >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>>> 0gmail >>>>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gm >>>>> ail.co >>>>> m >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >>>>>> l.com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% >>>>> 40gmai >>>>> l.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>>> 0gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >>>>> com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c >>>> om >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c >>>> om >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/wmodnl%40hotmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/trillian551%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Mary Fernandez > "I've learned that people will forget what you said, people will > forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them > feel." > — > Maya Angelou > -- Mary Fernandez "I've learned that people will forget what you said, people will forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them feel." — Maya Angelou From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Mon Mar 25 21:22:52 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2013 17:22:52 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com> <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com> <000701ce26a2$b2d5da40$18818ec0$@gmail.com> <003201ce276c$189bad90$49d308b0$@gmail.com> <7BA3749145E6473FA66942508ABF1D35@BrandonsLaptop2> Message-ID: Absolutely. Clustering is certainly not okay, and frankly insulting. On 3/25/13, Mary Fernandez wrote: > Hi all > I apologize for the previous message, it was not meant for the NABS list. > > > On 3/25/13, Mary Fernandez wrote: >> And how about Mr. West coast (aka, el peligroso!)? >> >> >> On 3/25/13, Arielle Silverman wrote: >>> I would submit that using an adult diaper is far from a convenient >>> "advantage" of blindness or any other disability. I'm sorry, but there >>> was really no excuse for that individual to go where she went! >>> Arielle >>> >>> On 3/25/13, wmodnl wmodnl wrote: >>>> Well, if we were taking a survey of the oddest questions we were ever >>>> asked, >>>> I think what I was asked today would go well. >>>> Sir, not for nothing, how do you go to the bathroom? Well, the same >>>> way >>>> you >>>> do. No, I mean, like, when you are out and not at home. Why don't you >>>> use >>>> you know like those things for old people, like disabled people? >>>> I wanted to put some humor to it, so I said: >>>> Remember what used to happen when you pressed the wrong button while >>>> dialing >>>> in to Verizon? >>>> Sorry, that's not an option, try again. >>>> She began to tell me, that a blind woman she knew had other >>>> disabilities, >>>> and also "used things to her advantage." I realized what she was >>>> getting >>>> at, the clustering affect. One size fits all. >>>> Have a great day. >>>> >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 10:50 PM, "Brandon Keith Biggs" >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> No, >>>>> We use these things called food patches we swipe over our arm that >>>>> puts >>>>> the nourishment for a good sized meal into our bloodstream. They are >>>>> used >>>>> completely by feel with Braille labels so we don't need any help with >>>>> them. That way we are never in need of wasting extra time eating and >>>>> doing >>>>> this horribly unnatural thing called socializing over dinner. If for >>>>> some >>>>> reason we are allergic to the substance excreted by the patches, we >>>>> can >>>>> bring around a personalized IV that is permanently attached to our >>>>> arm, >>>>> injecting our meals directly into our vain. If a blind person ever >>>>> touches >>>>> a fork they are in danger of stabbing themselves in the eye which is >>>>> in >>>>> front of them, but because they can't see is magically put in the way >>>>> of >>>>> any sharp object they may handle. If they eat solid food they may >>>>> become >>>>> poisoned because they can't see the germs to keep from consuming bad >>>>> food. >>>>> In all cases blind people are never to be given dinner except in their >>>>> arm >>>>> patches. >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> >>>>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>>>> -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:14 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> Huh? Don't humans need food to survive? I guess they think blind >>>>> people >>>>> have >>>>> a very short lifespan then, LOL. >>>>> >>>>> Chris >>>>> >>>>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>>>> Public Relations Committee >>>>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>>>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>>> williams >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 10:12 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> I've had people ask me or my friends if I would be capable of eating >>>>> dinner >>>>> on a date. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris >>>>> Nusbaum >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:28 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does >>>>> somebody >>>>> feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks ago. >>>>> >>>>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>>>> Public Relations Committee >>>>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>>>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua >>>>> Lester >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> Exactly! >>>>> Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I >>>>> watch >>>>> TV! >>>>> I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can >>>>> tell >>>>> somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. >>>>> Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle >>>>> Silverman >>>>> [arielle71 at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends >>>>> and >>>>> my >>>>> sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating configuration so >>>>> he >>>>> could see the video screen (obviously the three of us blind folks were >>>>> just >>>>> listening, so it didn't matter where we sat in the room). Eventually >>>>> it >>>>> struck me that here was a situation where the lone sighted person was >>>>> the >>>>> one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we >>>>> didn't. >>>>> Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on >>>>> sighted >>>>> people. But it makes you think about where the supposed tragedy of >>>>> blindness >>>>> really comes from. If you alter the group dynamics just a little bit, >>>>> blind >>>>> people can be equal or even advantaged. >>>>> Arielle >>>>> >>>>> On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>>> Lol. That is funny. >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >>>>>> Keith Biggs >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello, >>>>>> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >>>>>> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >>>>>> room for a sighted person. >>>>>> >>>>>> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. >>>>>> Sighted >>>>>> people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't like >>>>>> walking into >>>>>> >>>>>> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >>>>>> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm >>>>>> outside >>>>>> and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining into >>>>>> their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure >>>>>> print >>>>>> labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >>>>>> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >>>>>> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >>>>>> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >>>>>> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >>>>>> >>>>>> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >>>>>> If you >>>>>> >>>>>> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >>>>>> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >>>>>> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make >>>>>> sure >>>>>> to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the >>>>>> sighted >>>>>> person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. >>>>>> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >>>>>> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>> >>>>>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: Josh Gregory >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >>>>>> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >>>>>> mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >>>>>> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>>>>>> earlier post. >>>>>>> Misty >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>>>>>> >>>>>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>>>>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>>>>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>>>>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>>>>>> Gregory >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>>>>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>>>>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>>>>>> good idea here, and when >>>>>> >>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see >>>>>>>> what >>>>>>>> they're like. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>>>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them >>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>> give >>>>>>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>>>>>> philosophy! >>>>>>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>>>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>>>>>>> anything, and >>>>>>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>>>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>>>>>>> thread that >>>>>>>> I just started. >>>>>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>>>>>>> You think >>>>>>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them >>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>> go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and >>>>>>>> large >>>>>>>> problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where do the >>>>>>>> ideas come from? >>>>>>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>>>>>>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear >>>>>>>> "they >>>>>>>> are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may >>>>>>>> affect >>>>>>>> a blind person's employment or education worth your time? what if >>>>>>>> that blind person is you? >>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>>>>>> terrible >>>>>>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>> before! >>>>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>>>>>>> more...one is >>>>>>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There >>>>>>>>>> is >>>>>>>>>> no >>>>>>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>>>>>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>>>>>>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually >>>>>>>> impaired >>>>>>>> teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>>>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>>>>>>> Students >>>>>>>> mailing >>>>>>>>>>> list >>>>>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>>>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>>>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>>>>>>> viewed four of them last >>>>>>>> night >>>>>>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>>>>>>> out that >>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>>>>>>> completely >>>>>>>> unaware, >>>>>>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>>>>>>> from our >>>>>>>> life!, >>>>>>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>>>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>>>>>>> titled "How to set >>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>>>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>>>>>>> dramatic language >>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation >>>>>>>>>>> FOR >>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>> Blind) >>>>>>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>>>>>>> argument >>>>>>>> specific >>>>>>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>>>>>> problems >>>>>>>> with >>>>>>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING >>>>>>>>>>> ACCURATE >>>>>>>>>>> ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! I will >>>>>>>>>>> be >>>>>>>>>>> doing it one >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>>>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>>>>>>> permanently...as per >>>>>>>> their >>>>>>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>>>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>>>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> WA >>>>>>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the >>>>>>>>>>> Dept. >>>>>>>>>>> of Consumer >>>>>>>> Affairs >>>>>>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>>>>> info >>>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>>>> 0gmail >>>>>>>>>>> .com >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>>>>> info >>>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm >>>>>> ail.co >>>>>>>> m >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >>>>>> aedu.o >>>>>>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gm >>>>>> ail.co >>>>>>>> m >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >>>>>> a.edu >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>>>> 0gmail >>>>>>>> .com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gm >>>>>> ail.co >>>>>> m >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >>>>>>> l.com >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% >>>>>> 40gmai >>>>>> l.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>>>> 0gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >>>>>> com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c >>>>> om >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c >>>>> om >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/wmodnl%40hotmail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/trillian551%40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Mary Fernandez >> "I've learned that people will forget what you said, people will >> forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them >> feel." >> — >> Maya Angelou >> > > > -- > Mary Fernandez > "I've learned that people will forget what you said, people will > forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them > feel." > — > Maya Angelou > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Tue Mar 26 00:43:28 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum) Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2013 20:43:28 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com> <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com> <000701ce26a2$b2d5da40$18818ec0$@gmail.com> <003201ce276c$189bad90$49d308b0$@gmail.com> <7BA3749145E6473FA66942508ABF1D35@BrandonsLaptop2> Message-ID: <001601ce29ba$ef717890$ce5469b0$@gmail.com> What? I know a lot of blind people, none of whom use diapers to go to the bathroom after infancy. Chris Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair Public Relations Committee Maryland Association of Blind Students Phone: (443) 547-2409 -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of wmodnl wmodnl Sent: Monday, March 25, 2013 3:00 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Cc: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Well, if we were taking a survey of the oddest questions we were ever asked, I think what I was asked today would go well. Sir, not for nothing, how do you go to the bathroom? Well, the same way you do. No, I mean, like, when you are out and not at home. Why don't you use you know like those things for old people, like disabled people? I wanted to put some humor to it, so I said: Remember what used to happen when you pressed the wrong button while dialing in to Verizon? Sorry, that's not an option, try again. She began to tell me, that a blind woman she knew had other disabilities, and also "used things to her advantage." I realized what she was getting at, the clustering affect. One size fits all. Have a great day. Sent from my iPad On Mar 22, 2013, at 10:50 PM, "Brandon Keith Biggs" wrote: > No, > We use these things called food patches we swipe over our arm that puts the nourishment for a good sized meal into our bloodstream. They are used completely by feel with Braille labels so we don't need any help with them. That way we are never in need of wasting extra time eating and doing this horribly unnatural thing called socializing over dinner. If for some reason we are allergic to the substance excreted by the patches, we can bring around a personalized IV that is permanently attached to our arm, injecting our meals directly into our vain. If a blind person ever touches a fork they are in danger of stabbing themselves in the eye which is in front of them, but because they can't see is magically put in the way of any sharp object they may handle. If they eat solid food they may become poisoned because they can't see the germs to keep from consuming bad food. > In all cases blind people are never to be given dinner except in their arm patches. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:14 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Huh? Don't humans need food to survive? I guess they think blind > people have a very short lifespan then, LOL. > > Chris > > Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair > Public Relations Committee > Maryland Association of Blind Students > Phone: (443) 547-2409 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin > williams > Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 10:12 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > I've had people ask me or my friends if I would be capable of eating > dinner on a date. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris > Nusbaum > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:28 PM > To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does > somebody feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks ago. > > Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair > Public Relations Committee > Maryland Association of Blind Students > Phone: (443) 547-2409 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua > Lester > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Exactly! > Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch TV! > I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can > tell somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. > Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle > Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends > and my sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating > configuration so he could see the video screen (obviously the three of > us blind folks were just listening, so it didn't matter where we sat > in the room). Eventually it struck me that here was a situation where > the lone sighted person was the one with "special needs" because he needed an accommodation that we didn't. > Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on > sighted people. But it makes you think about where the supposed > tragedy of blindness really comes from. If you alter the group > dynamics just a little bit, blind people can be equal or even advantaged. > Arielle > > On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: >> Lol. That is funny. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >> Keith Biggs >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Hello, >> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >> room for a sighted person. >> >> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. >> Sighted people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't >> like walking into >> >> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm >> outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining >> into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure >> print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >> >> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >> If you >> >> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make >> sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the >> sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without protection. >> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >> Thanks, >> >> Brandon Keith Biggs >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Josh Gregory >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >> mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >> >> wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>> earlier post. >>> Misty >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>> >>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>> >>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> >>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>> Gregory >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>> good idea here, and when >> >>>> I >>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see >>>> what they're like. >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them >>>>> and give >>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>> philosophy! >>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>>> anything, and >>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>>> thread that >>>> I just started. >>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>> Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>>> You think >>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them >>>> to go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and >>>> large problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where >>>> do the ideas come from? >>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear >>>> "they are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may >>>> affect a blind person's employment or education worth your time? >>>> what if that blind person is you? >>>>> Carrie >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>> terrible >>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>>> and >>>> before! >>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>> Gilmer >>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>> >>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>>> more...one is >>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>> >>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There >>>>>> is no >>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually >>>> impaired teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>>> Carrie >>>> Gilmer >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>>> Students >>>> mailing >>>>>>> list >>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>>> viewed four of them last >>>> night >>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>>> out that >>>> I >>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>>> completely >>>> unaware, >>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>>> from our >>>> life!, >>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>>> titled "How to set >>>> the >>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>>> dramatic language >>>> and >>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation >>>>>>> FOR the >>>> Blind) >>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>>> argument >>>> specific >>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>> problems >>>> with >>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING >>>>>>> ACCURATE ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! >>>>>>> I will be doing it one >>>> for >>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>>> permanently...as per >>>> their >>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> WA >>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>>> of Consumer >>>> Affairs >>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>> info for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >> 4 >> 0gmail >>>>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>> info for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40g >> m >> ail.co >>>> m >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pcc >> u >> aedu.o >>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40g >> m >> ail.co >>>> m >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pcc >> u >> a.edu >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >> l >> .com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >> 4 >> 0gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40g >> m >> ail.co >> m >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>> for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gma >>> i >>> l.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs >> % >> 40gmai >> l.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >> 4 >> 0gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >> com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu > a.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g > mail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g > mail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% > 40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/wmodnl%40hotmail.c > om _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c om From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Tue Mar 26 02:12:20 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2013 22:12:20 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <001601ce29ba$ef717890$ce5469b0$@gmail.com> References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com> <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com> <000701ce26a2$b2d5da40$18818ec0$@gmail.com> <003201ce276c$189bad90$49d308b0$@gmail.com> <7BA3749145E6473FA66942508ABF1D35@BrandonsLaptop2> <001601ce29ba$ef717890$ce5469b0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi all, What most disturbs me about this is,: "She began to tell me, that a blind woman she knew had other disabilities, and also "used things to her advantage." I realized what she was getting at, the clustering affect. One size fits all." Where in the world did this person come up with the idea that all blind people have other disabilities in addition to their blindness, or that all use things to their advantage? I know it's the clustering effect, but the fact that these two things are so far fetched is shocking to me... it's not just something out of ignorance like, "Do you get around by counting steps," or "You must be able to hear everything," it's literally assuming that blind people are much less capable of even taking care of the simplest bodily function and that we're all either too disabled or too lazy to take care of it. On 3/25/13, Chris Nusbaum wrote: > What? I know a lot of blind people, none of whom use diapers to go to the > bathroom after infancy. > > Chris > > Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair > Public Relations Committee > Maryland Association of Blind Students > Phone: (443) 547-2409 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of wmodnl wmodnl > Sent: Monday, March 25, 2013 3:00 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Cc: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Well, if we were taking a survey of the oddest questions we were ever > asked, > I think what I was asked today would go well. > Sir, not for nothing, how do you go to the bathroom? Well, the same way > you > do. No, I mean, like, when you are out and not at home. Why don't you use > you know like those things for old people, like disabled people? > I wanted to put some humor to it, so I said: > Remember what used to happen when you pressed the wrong button while > dialing > in to Verizon? > Sorry, that's not an option, try again. > She began to tell me, that a blind woman she knew had other disabilities, > and also "used things to her advantage." I realized what she was getting > at, the clustering affect. One size fits all. > Have a great day. > > > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 22, 2013, at 10:50 PM, "Brandon Keith Biggs" > wrote: > >> No, >> We use these things called food patches we swipe over our arm that puts > the nourishment for a good sized meal into our bloodstream. They are used > completely by feel with Braille labels so we don't need any help with them. > That way we are never in need of wasting extra time eating and doing this > horribly unnatural thing called socializing over dinner. If for some reason > we are allergic to the substance excreted by the patches, we can bring > around a personalized IV that is permanently attached to our arm, injecting > our meals directly into our vain. If a blind person ever touches a fork > they > are in danger of stabbing themselves in the eye which is in front of them, > but because they can't see is magically put in the way of any sharp object > they may handle. If they eat solid food they may become poisoned because > they can't see the germs to keep from consuming bad food. >> In all cases blind people are never to be given dinner except in their >> arm > patches. >> Thanks, >> >> Brandon Keith Biggs >> -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:14 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Huh? Don't humans need food to survive? I guess they think blind >> people have a very short lifespan then, LOL. >> >> Chris >> >> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >> Public Relations Committee >> Maryland Association of Blind Students >> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >> williams >> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 10:12 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> I've had people ask me or my friends if I would be capable of eating >> dinner on a date. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris >> Nusbaum >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:28 PM >> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does >> somebody feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks >> ago. >> >> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >> Public Relations Committee >> Maryland Association of Blind Students >> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua >> Lester >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Exactly! >> Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch > TV! >> I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can >> tell somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. >> Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle >> Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends >> and my sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating >> configuration so he could see the video screen (obviously the three of >> us blind folks were just listening, so it didn't matter where we sat >> in the room). Eventually it struck me that here was a situation where >> the lone sighted person was the one with "special needs" because he >> needed > an accommodation that we didn't. >> Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on >> sighted people. But it makes you think about where the supposed >> tragedy of blindness really comes from. If you alter the group >> dynamics just a little bit, blind people can be equal or even advantaged. >> Arielle >> >> On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: >>> Lol. That is funny. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >>> Keith Biggs >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Hello, >>> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >>> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >>> room for a sighted person. >>> >>> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. >>> Sighted people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't >>> like walking into >>> >>> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >>> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm >>> outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining >>> into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure >>> print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >>> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >>> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >>> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >>> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >>> >>> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >>> If you >>> >>> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >>> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >>> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make >>> sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the >>> sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without > protection. >>> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >>> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Josh Gregory >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >>> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >>> mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >>> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Hi, >>>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>>> earlier post. >>>> Misty >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>>> >>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>>> >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> >>>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>>> Gregory >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>>> good idea here, and when >>> >>>>> I >>>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see >>>>> what they're like. >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them >>>>>> and give >>>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>>> philosophy! >>>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>>>> anything, and >>>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>>>> thread that >>>>> I just started. >>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>> Gilmer >>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>>>> You think >>>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them >>>>> to go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and >>>>> large problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where >>>>> do the ideas come from? >>>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>>>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear >>>>> "they are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may >>>>> affect a blind person's employment or education worth your time? >>>>> what if that blind person is you? >>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>>> terrible >>>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>>>> and >>>>> before! >>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>>> >>>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>>>> more...one is >>>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>>> >>>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There >>>>>>> is no >>>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>>>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually >>>>> impaired teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>>>> Students >>>>> mailing >>>>>>>> list >>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>>>> viewed four of them last >>>>> night >>>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>>>> out that >>>>> I >>>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>>>> completely >>>>> unaware, >>>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>>>> from our >>>>> life!, >>>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>>>> titled "How to set >>>>> the >>>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>>>> dramatic language >>>>> and >>>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation >>>>>>>> FOR the >>>>> Blind) >>>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>>>> argument >>>>> specific >>>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>>> problems >>>>> with >>>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING >>>>>>>> ACCURATE ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! >>>>>>>> I will be doing it one >>>>> for >>>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>>>> permanently...as per >>>>> their >>>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> WA >>>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>>>> of Consumer >>>>> Affairs >>>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>> info for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>> 4 >>> 0gmail >>>>>>>> .com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>> info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40g >>> m >>> ail.co >>>>> m >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pcc >>> u >>> aedu.o >>>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40g >>> m >>> ail.co >>>>> m >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pcc >>> u >>> a.edu >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >>> l >>> .com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>> 4 >>> 0gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40g >>> m >>> ail.co >>> m >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>> for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gma >>>> i >>>> l.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs >>> % >>> 40gmai >>> l.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>> 4 >>> 0gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >>> com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >> a.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g >> mail.c >> om >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g >> mail.c >> om >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% >> 40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/wmodnl%40hotmail.c >> om > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c > om > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From turtlepower17 at gmail.com Tue Mar 26 03:51:05 2013 From: turtlepower17 at gmail.com (Desiree Oudinot) Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2013 23:51:05 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com> <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com> <000701ce26a2$b2d5da40$18818ec0$@gmail.com> <003201ce276c$189bad90$49d308b0$@gmail.com> <7BA3749145E6473FA66942508ABF1D35@BrandonsLaptop2> <001601ce29ba$ef717890$ce5469b0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: You know, I can't remember exactly when this was, or what show, but I remember flipping through radio stations once when I was a kid and stopping on a talk show. I believe it may have been howard Stern, but don't quote me on that. He said, in a nutshell, that blind people must be better at wiping than sighted folks after they go to the bathroom...It was more crudely put than that, but you catch my drift. Both views are absurd. It's a basic bodily function that is not dependent on sight! On 3/25/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Hi all, > > What most disturbs me about this is,: > > "She began to tell me, that a blind woman she knew had other > disabilities, and also "used things to her advantage." I realized > what she was getting at, the clustering affect. One size fits all." > > Where in the world did this person come up with the idea that all > blind people have other disabilities in addition to their blindness, > or that all use things to their advantage? I know it's the clustering > effect, but the fact that these two things are so far fetched is > shocking to me... it's not just something out of ignorance like, "Do > you get around by counting steps," or "You must be able to hear > everything," it's literally assuming that blind people are much less > capable of even taking care of the simplest bodily function and that > we're all either too disabled or too lazy to take care of it. > > On 3/25/13, Chris Nusbaum wrote: >> What? I know a lot of blind people, none of whom use diapers to go to the >> bathroom after infancy. >> >> Chris >> >> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >> Public Relations Committee >> Maryland Association of Blind Students >> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of wmodnl >> wmodnl >> Sent: Monday, March 25, 2013 3:00 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Cc: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Well, if we were taking a survey of the oddest questions we were ever >> asked, >> I think what I was asked today would go well. >> Sir, not for nothing, how do you go to the bathroom? Well, the same way >> you >> do. No, I mean, like, when you are out and not at home. Why don't you >> use >> you know like those things for old people, like disabled people? >> I wanted to put some humor to it, so I said: >> Remember what used to happen when you pressed the wrong button while >> dialing >> in to Verizon? >> Sorry, that's not an option, try again. >> She began to tell me, that a blind woman she knew had other disabilities, >> and also "used things to her advantage." I realized what she was getting >> at, the clustering affect. One size fits all. >> Have a great day. >> >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On Mar 22, 2013, at 10:50 PM, "Brandon Keith Biggs" >> wrote: >> >>> No, >>> We use these things called food patches we swipe over our arm that puts >> the nourishment for a good sized meal into our bloodstream. They are used >> completely by feel with Braille labels so we don't need any help with >> them. >> That way we are never in need of wasting extra time eating and doing this >> horribly unnatural thing called socializing over dinner. If for some >> reason >> we are allergic to the substance excreted by the patches, we can bring >> around a personalized IV that is permanently attached to our arm, >> injecting >> our meals directly into our vain. If a blind person ever touches a fork >> they >> are in danger of stabbing themselves in the eye which is in front of >> them, >> but because they can't see is magically put in the way of any sharp >> object >> they may handle. If they eat solid food they may become poisoned because >> they can't see the germs to keep from consuming bad food. >>> In all cases blind people are never to be given dinner except in their >>> arm >> patches. >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>> -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:14 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Huh? Don't humans need food to survive? I guess they think blind >>> people have a very short lifespan then, LOL. >>> >>> Chris >>> >>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>> Public Relations Committee >>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>> williams >>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 10:12 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> I've had people ask me or my friends if I would be capable of eating >>> dinner on a date. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris >>> Nusbaum >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:28 PM >>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does >>> somebody feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks >>> ago. >>> >>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>> Public Relations Committee >>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua >>> Lester >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Exactly! >>> Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch >> TV! >>> I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can >>> tell somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. >>> Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! >>> Blessings, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle >>> Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] >>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends >>> and my sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating >>> configuration so he could see the video screen (obviously the three of >>> us blind folks were just listening, so it didn't matter where we sat >>> in the room). Eventually it struck me that here was a situation where >>> the lone sighted person was the one with "special needs" because he >>> needed >> an accommodation that we didn't. >>> Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on >>> sighted people. But it makes you think about where the supposed >>> tragedy of blindness really comes from. If you alter the group >>> dynamics just a little bit, blind people can be equal or even >>> advantaged. >>> Arielle >>> >>> On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: >>>> Lol. That is funny. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >>>> Keith Biggs >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Hello, >>>> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >>>> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >>>> room for a sighted person. >>>> >>>> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. >>>> Sighted people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't >>>> like walking into >>>> >>>> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >>>> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm >>>> outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining >>>> into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure >>>> print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >>>> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >>>> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >>>> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >>>> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >>>> >>>> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >>>> If you >>>> >>>> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >>>> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >>>> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make >>>> sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the >>>> sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without >> protection. >>>> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >>>> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >>>> Thanks, >>>> >>>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: Josh Gregory >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >>>> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >>>> mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >>>> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>>>> earlier post. >>>>> Misty >>>>> >>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>>>> >>>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>>>> >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>>>> Gregory >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>>>> good idea here, and when >>>> >>>>>> I >>>>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see >>>>>> what they're like. >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them >>>>>>> and give >>>>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>>>> philosophy! >>>>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>>>>> anything, and >>>>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>>>>> thread that >>>>>> I just started. >>>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>>>>> You think >>>>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them >>>>>> to go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and >>>>>> large problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where >>>>>> do the ideas come from? >>>>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>>>>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear >>>>>> "they are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may >>>>>> affect a blind person's employment or education worth your time? >>>>>> what if that blind person is you? >>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>>>> terrible >>>>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>>>>> and >>>>>> before! >>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>>>>> more...one is >>>>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There >>>>>>>> is no >>>>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>>>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>>>>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually >>>>>> impaired teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>>>>> Students >>>>>> mailing >>>>>>>>> list >>>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>>>>> viewed four of them last >>>>>> night >>>>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>>>>> out that >>>>>> I >>>>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>>>>> completely >>>>>> unaware, >>>>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>>>>> from our >>>>>> life!, >>>>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>>>>> titled "How to set >>>>>> the >>>>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>>>>> dramatic language >>>>>> and >>>>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation >>>>>>>>> FOR the >>>>>> Blind) >>>>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>>>>> argument >>>>>> specific >>>>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>>>> problems >>>>>> with >>>>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING >>>>>>>>> ACCURATE ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! >>>>>>>>> I will be doing it one >>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>>>>> permanently...as per >>>>>> their >>>>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> WA >>>>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>>>>> of Consumer >>>>>> Affairs >>>>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>>> info for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>> 4 >>>> 0gmail >>>>>>>>> .com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>>> info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40g >>>> m >>>> ail.co >>>>>> m >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pcc >>>> u >>>> aedu.o >>>>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40g >>>> m >>>> ail.co >>>>>> m >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pcc >>>> u >>>> a.edu >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >>>> l >>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>> 4 >>>> 0gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40g >>>> m >>>> ail.co >>>> m >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>> for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gma >>>>> i >>>>> l.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs >>>> % >>>> 40gmai >>>> l.com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>> 4 >>>> 0gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >>>> com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >>> a.edu >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g >>> mail.c >>> om >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>> 0gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g >>> mail.c >>> om >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% >>> 40gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/wmodnl%40hotmail.c >>> om >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c >> om >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/turtlepower17%40gmail.com > From joshkart12 at gmail.com Tue Mar 26 04:11:55 2013 From: joshkart12 at gmail.com (Josh Gregory) Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 00:11:55 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com> <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com> <000701ce26a2$b2d5da40$18818ec0$@gmail.com> <003201ce276c$189bad90$49d308b0$@gmail.com> <7BA3749145E6473FA66942508ABF1D35@BrandonsLaptop2> <001601ce29ba$ef717890$ce5469b0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <6D2BF74F-E80E-4486-9424-65FC245D85CB@gmail.com> My Gosh, What a vulgar way to portray us! Sent from my iPhone On Mar 25, 2013, at 11:51 PM, Desiree Oudinot wrote: > You know, I can't remember exactly when this was, or what show, but I > remember flipping through radio stations once when I was a kid and > stopping on a talk show. I believe it may have been howard Stern, but > don't quote me on that. He said, in a nutshell, that blind people must > be better at wiping than sighted folks after they go to the > bathroom...It was more crudely put than that, but you catch my drift. > Both views are absurd. It's a basic bodily function that is not > dependent on sight! > > On 3/25/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >> Hi all, >> >> What most disturbs me about this is,: >> >> "She began to tell me, that a blind woman she knew had other >> disabilities, and also "used things to her advantage." I realized >> what she was getting at, the clustering affect. One size fits all." >> >> Where in the world did this person come up with the idea that all >> blind people have other disabilities in addition to their blindness, >> or that all use things to their advantage? I know it's the clustering >> effect, but the fact that these two things are so far fetched is >> shocking to me... it's not just something out of ignorance like, "Do >> you get around by counting steps," or "You must be able to hear >> everything," it's literally assuming that blind people are much less >> capable of even taking care of the simplest bodily function and that >> we're all either too disabled or too lazy to take care of it. >> >> On 3/25/13, Chris Nusbaum wrote: >>> What? I know a lot of blind people, none of whom use diapers to go to the >>> bathroom after infancy. >>> >>> Chris >>> >>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>> Public Relations Committee >>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of wmodnl >>> wmodnl >>> Sent: Monday, March 25, 2013 3:00 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Cc: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Well, if we were taking a survey of the oddest questions we were ever >>> asked, >>> I think what I was asked today would go well. >>> Sir, not for nothing, how do you go to the bathroom? Well, the same way >>> you >>> do. No, I mean, like, when you are out and not at home. Why don't you >>> use >>> you know like those things for old people, like disabled people? >>> I wanted to put some humor to it, so I said: >>> Remember what used to happen when you pressed the wrong button while >>> dialing >>> in to Verizon? >>> Sorry, that's not an option, try again. >>> She began to tell me, that a blind woman she knew had other disabilities, >>> and also "used things to her advantage." I realized what she was getting >>> at, the clustering affect. One size fits all. >>> Have a great day. >>> >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 10:50 PM, "Brandon Keith Biggs" >>> wrote: >>> >>>> No, >>>> We use these things called food patches we swipe over our arm that puts >>> the nourishment for a good sized meal into our bloodstream. They are used >>> completely by feel with Braille labels so we don't need any help with >>> them. >>> That way we are never in need of wasting extra time eating and doing this >>> horribly unnatural thing called socializing over dinner. If for some >>> reason >>> we are allergic to the substance excreted by the patches, we can bring >>> around a personalized IV that is permanently attached to our arm, >>> injecting >>> our meals directly into our vain. If a blind person ever touches a fork >>> they >>> are in danger of stabbing themselves in the eye which is in front of >>> them, >>> but because they can't see is magically put in the way of any sharp >>> object >>> they may handle. If they eat solid food they may become poisoned because >>> they can't see the germs to keep from consuming bad food. >>>> In all cases blind people are never to be given dinner except in their >>>> arm >>> patches. >>>> Thanks, >>>> >>>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>>> -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:14 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Huh? Don't humans need food to survive? I guess they think blind >>>> people have a very short lifespan then, LOL. >>>> >>>> Chris >>>> >>>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>>> Public Relations Committee >>>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>> williams >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 10:12 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> I've had people ask me or my friends if I would be capable of eating >>>> dinner on a date. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris >>>> Nusbaum >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:28 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does >>>> somebody feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks >>>> ago. >>>> >>>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>>> Public Relations Committee >>>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua >>>> Lester >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Exactly! >>>> Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch >>> TV! >>>> I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can >>>> tell somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. >>>> Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! >>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle >>>> Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends >>>> and my sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating >>>> configuration so he could see the video screen (obviously the three of >>>> us blind folks were just listening, so it didn't matter where we sat >>>> in the room). Eventually it struck me that here was a situation where >>>> the lone sighted person was the one with "special needs" because he >>>> needed >>> an accommodation that we didn't. >>>> Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on >>>> sighted people. But it makes you think about where the supposed >>>> tragedy of blindness really comes from. If you alter the group >>>> dynamics just a little bit, blind people can be equal or even >>>> advantaged. >>>> Arielle >>>> >>>> On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>> Lol. That is funny. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >>>>> Keith Biggs >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> Hello, >>>>> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >>>>> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >>>>> room for a sighted person. >>>>> >>>>> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. >>>>> Sighted people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't >>>>> like walking into >>>>> >>>>> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >>>>> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm >>>>> outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining >>>>> into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure >>>>> print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >>>>> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >>>>> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >>>>> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >>>>> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >>>>> >>>>> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >>>>> If you >>>>> >>>>> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >>>>> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >>>>> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make >>>>> sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the >>>>> sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without >>> protection. >>>>> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >>>>> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> >>>>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: Josh Gregory >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >>>>> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >>>>> mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >>>>> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>>>>> earlier post. >>>>>> Misty >>>>>> >>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>>>>> >>>>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>>>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>>>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>>>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>>>>> Gregory >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>>>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>>>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>>>>> good idea here, and when >>>>> >>>>>>> I >>>>>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see >>>>>>> what they're like. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them >>>>>>>> and give >>>>>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>>>>> philosophy! >>>>>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>>>>>> anything, and >>>>>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>>>>>> thread that >>>>>>> I just started. >>>>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>>>>>> You think >>>>>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them >>>>>>> to go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and >>>>>>> large problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where >>>>>>> do the ideas come from? >>>>>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>>>>>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear >>>>>>> "they are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may >>>>>>> affect a blind person's employment or education worth your time? >>>>>>> what if that blind person is you? >>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>>>>> terrible >>>>>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>> before! >>>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>>>>>> more...one is >>>>>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There >>>>>>>>> is no >>>>>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>>>>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>>>>>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually >>>>>>> impaired teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>>>>>> Students >>>>>>> mailing >>>>>>>>>> list >>>>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>>>>>> viewed four of them last >>>>>>> night >>>>>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>>>>>> out that >>>>>>> I >>>>>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>>>>>> completely >>>>>>> unaware, >>>>>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>>>>>> from our >>>>>>> life!, >>>>>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>>>>>> titled "How to set >>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>>>>>> dramatic language >>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation >>>>>>>>>> FOR the >>>>>>> Blind) >>>>>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>>>>>> argument >>>>>>> specific >>>>>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>>>>> problems >>>>>>> with >>>>>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING >>>>>>>>>> ACCURATE ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! >>>>>>>>>> I will be doing it one >>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>>>>>> permanently...as per >>>>>>> their >>>>>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> WA >>>>>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>>>>>> of Consumer >>>>>>> Affairs >>>>>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>>>> info for >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>> 4 >>>>> 0gmail >>>>>>>>>> .com >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>>>> info for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40g >>>>> m >>>>> ail.co >>>>>>> m >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pcc >>>>> u >>>>> aedu.o >>>>>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40g >>>>> m >>>>> ail.co >>>>>>> m >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pcc >>>>> u >>>>> a.edu >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >>>>> l >>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>> 4 >>>>> 0gmail >>>>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40g >>>>> m >>>>> ail.co >>>>> m >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gma >>>>>> i >>>>>> l.com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs >>>>> % >>>>> 40gmai >>>>> l.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>> 4 >>>>> 0gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >>>>> com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >>>> a.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g >>>> mail.c >>>> om >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>> 0gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g >>>> mail.c >>>> om >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% >>>> 40gmail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/wmodnl%40hotmail.c >>>> om >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c >>> om >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/turtlepower17%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Tue Mar 26 10:59:42 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (christopher nusbaum) Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 06:59:42 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <2FC4CF91-33BC-4A02-81FC-D251C6DB37C0@gmail.com> <000001ce265d$fef869f0$fce93dd0$@gmail.com> <26732738-A23D-4C15-AC2D-170DE27109A0@gmail.com> <98B447FC-A057-44D8-98AE-EAF23B14D3DB@gmail.com> <9FB92433-EE78-4194-B8AC-3B71F5C00ACE@gmail.com> <002201ce2669$ee76d5b0$cb648110$@gmail.com> <774340A7E75742EAA6D98B5AC3FD9BE3@acerd37f251f21> <0EF42B5C-EEC7-4E02-8B84-D90A93CCB32D@gmail.com> <004f01ce267f$8c25c270$a4714750$@gmail.com> <000901ce275d$3faf2dd0$bf0d8970$@gmail.com> <000701ce26a2$b2d5da40$18818ec0$@gmail.com> <003201ce276c$189bad90$49d308b0$@gmail.com> <7BA3749145E6473FA66942508ABF1D35@BrandonsLaptop2> <001601ce29ba$ef717890$ce5469b0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <9020953256462836159@unknownmsgid> Although I agree with Desiree and with Josh that this view is absurd, I find it interesting because most of the time people assume that wiping ourselves is an unbearable challenge. I have been asked many times how I wipe myself, but I have never heard the view that we're better at it than the sighted. I wonder, do they really use their vision to help them wipe themselves? Do they look back at, well... what they're wiping when wiping it? If they do, which I think is highly unlikely, I would imagine that wiping would be more of a hassle (as well as a disgusting ordeal) for sighted people than for us! Chris Nusbaum Sent from my iPhone On Mar 25, 2013, at 11:52 PM, Desiree Oudinot wrote: > You know, I can't remember exactly when this was, or what show, but I > remember flipping through radio stations once when I was a kid and > stopping on a talk show. I believe it may have been howard Stern, but > don't quote me on that. He said, in a nutshell, that blind people must > be better at wiping than sighted folks after they go to the > bathroom...It was more crudely put than that, but you catch my drift. > Both views are absurd. It's a basic bodily function that is not > dependent on sight! > > On 3/25/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >> Hi all, >> >> What most disturbs me about this is,: >> >> "She began to tell me, that a blind woman she knew had other >> disabilities, and also "used things to her advantage." I realized >> what she was getting at, the clustering affect. One size fits all." >> >> Where in the world did this person come up with the idea that all >> blind people have other disabilities in addition to their blindness, >> or that all use things to their advantage? I know it's the clustering >> effect, but the fact that these two things are so far fetched is >> shocking to me... it's not just something out of ignorance like, "Do >> you get around by counting steps," or "You must be able to hear >> everything," it's literally assuming that blind people are much less >> capable of even taking care of the simplest bodily function and that >> we're all either too disabled or too lazy to take care of it. >> >> On 3/25/13, Chris Nusbaum wrote: >>> What? I know a lot of blind people, none of whom use diapers to go to the >>> bathroom after infancy. >>> >>> Chris >>> >>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>> Public Relations Committee >>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of wmodnl >>> wmodnl >>> Sent: Monday, March 25, 2013 3:00 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Cc: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Well, if we were taking a survey of the oddest questions we were ever >>> asked, >>> I think what I was asked today would go well. >>> Sir, not for nothing, how do you go to the bathroom? Well, the same way >>> you >>> do. No, I mean, like, when you are out and not at home. Why don't you >>> use >>> you know like those things for old people, like disabled people? >>> I wanted to put some humor to it, so I said: >>> Remember what used to happen when you pressed the wrong button while >>> dialing >>> in to Verizon? >>> Sorry, that's not an option, try again. >>> She began to tell me, that a blind woman she knew had other disabilities, >>> and also "used things to her advantage." I realized what she was getting >>> at, the clustering affect. One size fits all. >>> Have a great day. >>> >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 10:50 PM, "Brandon Keith Biggs" >>> wrote: >>> >>>> No, >>>> We use these things called food patches we swipe over our arm that puts >>> the nourishment for a good sized meal into our bloodstream. They are used >>> completely by feel with Braille labels so we don't need any help with >>> them. >>> That way we are never in need of wasting extra time eating and doing this >>> horribly unnatural thing called socializing over dinner. If for some >>> reason >>> we are allergic to the substance excreted by the patches, we can bring >>> around a personalized IV that is permanently attached to our arm, >>> injecting >>> our meals directly into our vain. If a blind person ever touches a fork >>> they >>> are in danger of stabbing themselves in the eye which is in front of >>> them, >>> but because they can't see is magically put in the way of any sharp >>> object >>> they may handle. If they eat solid food they may become poisoned because >>> they can't see the germs to keep from consuming bad food. >>>> In all cases blind people are never to be given dinner except in their >>>> arm >>> patches. >>>> Thanks, >>>> >>>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>>> -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:14 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Huh? Don't humans need food to survive? I guess they think blind >>>> people have a very short lifespan then, LOL. >>>> >>>> Chris >>>> >>>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>>> Public Relations Committee >>>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>> williams >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 10:12 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> I've had people ask me or my friends if I would be capable of eating >>>> dinner on a date. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris >>>> Nusbaum >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:28 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does >>>> somebody feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks >>>> ago. >>>> >>>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>>> Public Relations Committee >>>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua >>>> Lester >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Exactly! >>>> Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I watch >>> TV! >>>> I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can >>>> tell somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. >>>> Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! >>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle >>>> Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends >>>> and my sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating >>>> configuration so he could see the video screen (obviously the three of >>>> us blind folks were just listening, so it didn't matter where we sat >>>> in the room). Eventually it struck me that here was a situation where >>>> the lone sighted person was the one with "special needs" because he >>>> needed >>> an accommodation that we didn't. >>>> Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on >>>> sighted people. But it makes you think about where the supposed >>>> tragedy of blindness really comes from. If you alter the group >>>> dynamics just a little bit, blind people can be equal or even >>>> advantaged. >>>> Arielle >>>> >>>> On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>> Lol. That is funny. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >>>>> Keith Biggs >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> Hello, >>>>> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >>>>> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >>>>> room for a sighted person. >>>>> >>>>> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. >>>>> Sighted people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't >>>>> like walking into >>>>> >>>>> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >>>>> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm >>>>> outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining >>>>> into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure >>>>> print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >>>>> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >>>>> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >>>>> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >>>>> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >>>>> >>>>> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >>>>> If you >>>>> >>>>> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >>>>> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >>>>> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make >>>>> sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the >>>>> sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without >>> protection. >>>>> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >>>>> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> >>>>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: Josh Gregory >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >>>>> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >>>>> mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >>>>> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>>>>> earlier post. >>>>>> Misty >>>>>> >>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>>>>> >>>>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>>>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>>>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>>>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>>>>> Gregory >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>>>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>>>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>>>>> good idea here, and when >>>>> >>>>>>> I >>>>>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see >>>>>>> what they're like. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them >>>>>>>> and give >>>>>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>>>>> philosophy! >>>>>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>>>>>> anything, and >>>>>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>>>>>> thread that >>>>>>> I just started. >>>>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>>>>>> You think >>>>>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them >>>>>>> to go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and >>>>>>> large problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where >>>>>>> do the ideas come from? >>>>>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>>>>>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear >>>>>>> "they are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may >>>>>>> affect a blind person's employment or education worth your time? >>>>>>> what if that blind person is you? >>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>>>>> terrible >>>>>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>> before! >>>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>>>>>> more...one is >>>>>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There >>>>>>>>> is no >>>>>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>>>>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>>>>>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually >>>>>>> impaired teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>>>>>> Students >>>>>>> mailing >>>>>>>>>> list >>>>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>>>>>> viewed four of them last >>>>>>> night >>>>>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>>>>>> out that >>>>>>> I >>>>>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>>>>>> completely >>>>>>> unaware, >>>>>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>>>>>> from our >>>>>>> life!, >>>>>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>>>>>> titled "How to set >>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>>>>>> dramatic language >>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation >>>>>>>>>> FOR the >>>>>>> Blind) >>>>>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>>>>>> argument >>>>>>> specific >>>>>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>>>>> problems >>>>>>> with >>>>>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING >>>>>>>>>> ACCURATE ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! >>>>>>>>>> I will be doing it one >>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>>>>>> permanently...as per >>>>>>> their >>>>>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> WA >>>>>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>>>>>> of Consumer >>>>>>> Affairs >>>>>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>>>> info for >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>> 4 >>>>> 0gmail >>>>>>>>>> .com >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>>>> info for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40g >>>>> m >>>>> ail.co >>>>>>> m >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pcc >>>>> u >>>>> aedu.o >>>>>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40g >>>>> m >>>>> ail.co >>>>>>> m >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pcc >>>>> u >>>>> a.edu >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >>>>> l >>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>> 4 >>>>> 0gmail >>>>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40g >>>>> m >>>>> ail.co >>>>> m >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gma >>>>>> i >>>>>> l.com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs >>>>> % >>>>> 40gmai >>>>> l.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>> 4 >>>>> 0gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >>>>> com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >>>> a.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g >>>> mail.c >>>> om >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>> 0gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g >>>> mail.c >>>> om >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% >>>> 40gmail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/wmodnl%40hotmail.c >>>> om >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c >>> om >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/turtlepower17%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com From ALewis at nfb.org Tue Mar 26 13:41:22 2013 From: ALewis at nfb.org (Lewis, Anil) Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 13:41:22 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] Online Fair Wages Petition Message-ID: <72D51A25A403F249A0FC4A94A0D9640D3A52D4B1@CH1PRD0710MB380.namprd07.prod.outlook.com> All: The online Fair Wages petition is going better than we anticipated. We could reach 1,000 signatures today. Please circulate the following to your networks. Current labor laws unjustly prohibit workers with disabilities from reaching their full socioeconomic potential Written in 1938, Section 14(c) of the Fair Labor Standards Act (FLSA) discriminates against people with disabilities, by allowing the Secretary of Labor to grant special wage certificates to employers, permitting them to pay workers with disabilities less than the minimum wage. Despite enlightened civil rights legislation prohibiting discrimination on the basis of disability, this antiquated provision is still being practiced, with some disabled workers making only 3 cents an hour. Click here to sign the petition to stop this discrimination The twisted merit of the subminimum wage model is that it is a cash cow for the employer. The subminimum wage employers receive taxpayer and philanthropic dollars because the public believes they are providing training and employment for people with disabilities. Instead, The executives use these substantial proceeds to compensate themselves above industry rates on the backs of disabled workers they pay pennies per hour. In any other context, people raising their standard of life while significantly limiting the potential of others to fully participate in society would be obvious exploitation. Click here to sign the petition to stop this exploitation The discrimination persists because of the Misconceptions that Section 14(c) is: * ...a compassionate offering of meaningful work. Subminimum wage work is not true employment. The entities that engage in this practice are not employers. They are "day Custody" centers for people with disabilities, offering days filled only with repetitive drudgery for sometimes third-world wages, leading their workers toward learned incapacity and greater dependence on social programs. * ...an employment training tool for disabled workers. Less than 5% of workers with disabilities in subminimum wage workshops will transition into competitive integrated work environments. In fact, data shows that they must unlearn the skills they acquire in a subminimum wage workshop in order to obtain meaningful employment. Therefore, Section 14(c) perpetuates on-going underemployment. * ...a controversial issue amongst the disability community. Over 50 disability-related organizations support the repeal of section 14(c) of the FLSA, and many former subminimum wage employers have abandoned the use of the Special Wage Certificate without terminating anyone. Only those entities profiting on this exploitive practice refuse to acknowledge that it is discrimination. * ...a place for those too significantly disabled to go. Imprisoning workers with disabilities in adult daycare environments keeps them from acquiring the necessary training and opportunity to identify the skills or job that could lead to their competitive, integrated employment at the federal minimum wage or higher. Click here to sign the petition to stop this discrimination Anil Mr. Anil Lewis, M.P.A. Director of Advocacy and Policy "Eliminating Subminimum Wages for People with Disabilities" http://www.nfb.org/fairwages NATIONAL FEDERATION OF THE BLIND 200 East Wells Street at Jernigan Place Baltimore, Maryland 21230 (410) 659-9314 ext. 2374 (Voice) (410) 685-5653 (FAX) Email: alewis at nfb.org Web: www.nfb.org twitter: @anillife From brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com Tue Mar 26 16:00:40 2013 From: brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com (Brandon Keith Biggs) Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 09:00:40 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <9020953256462836159@unknownmsgid> References: <9020953256462836159@unknownmsgid> Message-ID: <4FD4097453F5415DAB65300BF1C72231@BrandonsLaptop2> Hello, Think of the stretch! I've never met anyone who can actually see their behind without a mirror. Thanks, Brandon Keith Biggs -----Original Message----- From: christopher nusbaum Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 3:59 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness Although I agree with Desiree and with Josh that this view is absurd, I find it interesting because most of the time people assume that wiping ourselves is an unbearable challenge. I have been asked many times how I wipe myself, but I have never heard the view that we're better at it than the sighted. I wonder, do they really use their vision to help them wipe themselves? Do they look back at, well... what they're wiping when wiping it? If they do, which I think is highly unlikely, I would imagine that wiping would be more of a hassle (as well as a disgusting ordeal) for sighted people than for us! Chris Nusbaum Sent from my iPhone On Mar 25, 2013, at 11:52 PM, Desiree Oudinot wrote: > You know, I can't remember exactly when this was, or what show, but I > remember flipping through radio stations once when I was a kid and > stopping on a talk show. I believe it may have been howard Stern, but > don't quote me on that. He said, in a nutshell, that blind people must > be better at wiping than sighted folks after they go to the > bathroom...It was more crudely put than that, but you catch my drift. > Both views are absurd. It's a basic bodily function that is not > dependent on sight! > > On 3/25/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >> Hi all, >> >> What most disturbs me about this is,: >> >> "She began to tell me, that a blind woman she knew had other >> disabilities, and also "used things to her advantage." I realized >> what she was getting at, the clustering affect. One size fits all." >> >> Where in the world did this person come up with the idea that all >> blind people have other disabilities in addition to their blindness, >> or that all use things to their advantage? I know it's the clustering >> effect, but the fact that these two things are so far fetched is >> shocking to me... it's not just something out of ignorance like, "Do >> you get around by counting steps," or "You must be able to hear >> everything," it's literally assuming that blind people are much less >> capable of even taking care of the simplest bodily function and that >> we're all either too disabled or too lazy to take care of it. >> >> On 3/25/13, Chris Nusbaum wrote: >>> What? I know a lot of blind people, none of whom use diapers to go to >>> the >>> bathroom after infancy. >>> >>> Chris >>> >>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>> Public Relations Committee >>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of wmodnl >>> wmodnl >>> Sent: Monday, March 25, 2013 3:00 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Cc: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>> >>> Well, if we were taking a survey of the oddest questions we were ever >>> asked, >>> I think what I was asked today would go well. >>> Sir, not for nothing, how do you go to the bathroom? Well, the same way >>> you >>> do. No, I mean, like, when you are out and not at home. Why don't you >>> use >>> you know like those things for old people, like disabled people? >>> I wanted to put some humor to it, so I said: >>> Remember what used to happen when you pressed the wrong button while >>> dialing >>> in to Verizon? >>> Sorry, that's not an option, try again. >>> She began to tell me, that a blind woman she knew had other >>> disabilities, >>> and also "used things to her advantage." I realized what she was >>> getting >>> at, the clustering affect. One size fits all. >>> Have a great day. >>> >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 10:50 PM, "Brandon Keith Biggs" >>> wrote: >>> >>>> No, >>>> We use these things called food patches we swipe over our arm that puts >>> the nourishment for a good sized meal into our bloodstream. They are >>> used >>> completely by feel with Braille labels so we don't need any help with >>> them. >>> That way we are never in need of wasting extra time eating and doing >>> this >>> horribly unnatural thing called socializing over dinner. If for some >>> reason >>> we are allergic to the substance excreted by the patches, we can bring >>> around a personalized IV that is permanently attached to our arm, >>> injecting >>> our meals directly into our vain. If a blind person ever touches a fork >>> they >>> are in danger of stabbing themselves in the eye which is in front of >>> them, >>> but because they can't see is magically put in the way of any sharp >>> object >>> they may handle. If they eat solid food they may become poisoned because >>> they can't see the germs to keep from consuming bad food. >>>> In all cases blind people are never to be given dinner except in their >>>> arm >>> patches. >>>> Thanks, >>>> >>>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>>> -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:14 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Huh? Don't humans need food to survive? I guess they think blind >>>> people have a very short lifespan then, LOL. >>>> >>>> Chris >>>> >>>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>>> Public Relations Committee >>>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>> williams >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 10:12 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> I've had people ask me or my friends if I would be capable of eating >>>> dinner on a date. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris >>>> Nusbaum >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:28 PM >>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does >>>> somebody feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks >>>> ago. >>>> >>>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>>> Public Relations Committee >>>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua >>>> Lester >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Exactly! >>>> Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I >>>> watch >>> TV! >>>> I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can >>>> tell somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. >>>> Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! >>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle >>>> Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends >>>> and my sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating >>>> configuration so he could see the video screen (obviously the three of >>>> us blind folks were just listening, so it didn't matter where we sat >>>> in the room). Eventually it struck me that here was a situation where >>>> the lone sighted person was the one with "special needs" because he >>>> needed >>> an accommodation that we didn't. >>>> Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on >>>> sighted people. But it makes you think about where the supposed >>>> tragedy of blindness really comes from. If you alter the group >>>> dynamics just a little bit, blind people can be equal or even >>>> advantaged. >>>> Arielle >>>> >>>> On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>> Lol. That is funny. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >>>>> Keith Biggs >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> Hello, >>>>> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >>>>> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >>>>> room for a sighted person. >>>>> >>>>> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. >>>>> Sighted people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't >>>>> like walking into >>>>> >>>>> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >>>>> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm >>>>> outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining >>>>> into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure >>>>> print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >>>>> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >>>>> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >>>>> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >>>>> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >>>>> >>>>> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >>>>> If you >>>>> >>>>> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >>>>> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >>>>> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make >>>>> sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the >>>>> sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without >>> protection. >>>>> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >>>>> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> >>>>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: Josh Gregory >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >>>>> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >>>>> mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >>>>> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>>>>> earlier post. >>>>>> Misty >>>>>> >>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>>>>> >>>>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>>>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>>>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>>>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>>>>> Gregory >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>>>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>>>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>>>>> good idea here, and when >>>>> >>>>>>> I >>>>>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see >>>>>>> what they're like. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them >>>>>>>> and give >>>>>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>>>>> philosophy! >>>>>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>>>>>> anything, and >>>>>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>>>>>> thread that >>>>>>> I just started. >>>>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>>>>>> You think >>>>>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them >>>>>>> to go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and >>>>>>> large problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where >>>>>>> do the ideas come from? >>>>>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>>>>>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear >>>>>>> "they are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may >>>>>>> affect a blind person's employment or education worth your time? >>>>>>> what if that blind person is you? >>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>>>>> terrible >>>>>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>> before! >>>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>>>>>> more...one is >>>>>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There >>>>>>>>> is no >>>>>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>>>>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>>>>>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually >>>>>>> impaired teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>>>>>> Students >>>>>>> mailing >>>>>>>>>> list >>>>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>>>>>> viewed four of them last >>>>>>> night >>>>>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>>>>>> out that >>>>>>> I >>>>>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>>>>>> completely >>>>>>> unaware, >>>>>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>>>>>> from our >>>>>>> life!, >>>>>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>>>>>> titled "How to set >>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>>>>>> dramatic language >>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation >>>>>>>>>> FOR the >>>>>>> Blind) >>>>>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>>>>>> argument >>>>>>> specific >>>>>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>>>>> problems >>>>>>> with >>>>>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING >>>>>>>>>> ACCURATE ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! >>>>>>>>>> I will be doing it one >>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>>>>>> permanently...as per >>>>>>> their >>>>>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> WA >>>>>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the Dept. >>>>>>>>>> of Consumer >>>>>>> Affairs >>>>>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>>>> info for >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>> 4 >>>>> 0gmail >>>>>>>>>> .com >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>>>> info for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40g >>>>> m >>>>> ail.co >>>>>>> m >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pcc >>>>> u >>>>> aedu.o >>>>>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40g >>>>> m >>>>> ail.co >>>>>>> m >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pcc >>>>> u >>>>> a.edu >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >>>>> l >>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>> 4 >>>>> 0gmail >>>>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40g >>>>> m >>>>> ail.co >>>>> m >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>> for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gma >>>>>> i >>>>>> l.com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs >>>>> % >>>>> 40gmai >>>>> l.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>> 4 >>>>> 0gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >>>>> com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >>>> a.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g >>>> mail.c >>>> om >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>> 0gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g >>>> mail.c >>>> om >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% >>>> 40gmail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/wmodnl%40hotmail.c >>>> om >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c >>> om >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/turtlepower17%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com From ALewis at nfb.org Tue Mar 26 17:04:09 2013 From: ALewis at nfb.org (Lewis, Anil) Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 17:04:09 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] Well Over 1,000 Signatures - Keep Them Coming Message-ID: <72D51A25A403F249A0FC4A94A0D9640D3A52D8A1@CH1PRD0710MB380.namprd07.prod.outlook.com> All: We have already received well over 1,000 signatures on our online Petition to repeal Section 14(c) of the Fair Labor Standards Act, which allows employers to pay workers with disabilities less than the federal minimum wage. It would be great if we were able to reach 2,000 signatures before Friday. Please continue to circulate the following petition link to your networks, Facebook, Twitter, and other social media friends. www.nfb.org/fair-wages-petition Anil Mr. Anil Lewis, M.P.A. Director of Advocacy and Policy "Eliminating Subminimum Wages for People with Disabilities" http://www.nfb.org/fairwages NATIONAL FEDERATION OF THE BLIND 200 East Wells Street at Jernigan Place Baltimore, Maryland 21230 (410) 659-9314 ext. 2374 (Voice) (410) 685-5653 (FAX) Email: alewis at nfb.org Web: www.nfb.org twitter: @anillife From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Tue Mar 26 17:59:06 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 13:59:06 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: <4FD4097453F5415DAB65300BF1C72231@BrandonsLaptop2> References: <9020953256462836159@unknownmsgid> <4FD4097453F5415DAB65300BF1C72231@BrandonsLaptop2> Message-ID: Howard Stern is just... well, Howard Stern, if that's who it was on the show Desiree found. Honestly, it wouldn't surprise me if that's who it was at all. On 3/26/13, Brandon Keith Biggs wrote: > Hello, > Think of the stretch! I've never met anyone who can actually see their > behind without a mirror. > Thanks, > > Brandon Keith Biggs > -----Original Message----- > From: christopher nusbaum > Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 3:59 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness > > Although I agree with Desiree and with Josh that this view is absurd, > I find it interesting because most of the time people assume that > wiping ourselves is an unbearable challenge. I have been asked many > times how I wipe myself, but I have never heard the view that we're > better at it than the sighted. I wonder, do they really use their > vision to help them wipe themselves? Do they look back at, well... > what they're wiping when wiping it? If they do, which I think is > highly unlikely, I would imagine that wiping would be more of a hassle > (as well as a disgusting ordeal) for sighted people than for us! > > Chris Nusbaum > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 25, 2013, at 11:52 PM, Desiree Oudinot > wrote: > >> You know, I can't remember exactly when this was, or what show, but I >> remember flipping through radio stations once when I was a kid and >> stopping on a talk show. I believe it may have been howard Stern, but >> don't quote me on that. He said, in a nutshell, that blind people must >> be better at wiping than sighted folks after they go to the >> bathroom...It was more crudely put than that, but you catch my drift. >> Both views are absurd. It's a basic bodily function that is not >> dependent on sight! >> >> On 3/25/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>> Hi all, >>> >>> What most disturbs me about this is,: >>> >>> "She began to tell me, that a blind woman she knew had other >>> disabilities, and also "used things to her advantage." I realized >>> what she was getting at, the clustering affect. One size fits all." >>> >>> Where in the world did this person come up with the idea that all >>> blind people have other disabilities in addition to their blindness, >>> or that all use things to their advantage? I know it's the clustering >>> effect, but the fact that these two things are so far fetched is >>> shocking to me... it's not just something out of ignorance like, "Do >>> you get around by counting steps," or "You must be able to hear >>> everything," it's literally assuming that blind people are much less >>> capable of even taking care of the simplest bodily function and that >>> we're all either too disabled or too lazy to take care of it. >>> >>> On 3/25/13, Chris Nusbaum wrote: >>>> What? I know a lot of blind people, none of whom use diapers to go to >>>> the >>>> bathroom after infancy. >>>> >>>> Chris >>>> >>>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>>> Public Relations Committee >>>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of wmodnl >>>> wmodnl >>>> Sent: Monday, March 25, 2013 3:00 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Cc: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>> >>>> Well, if we were taking a survey of the oddest questions we were ever >>>> asked, >>>> I think what I was asked today would go well. >>>> Sir, not for nothing, how do you go to the bathroom? Well, the same >>>> way >>>> you >>>> do. No, I mean, like, when you are out and not at home. Why don't you >>>> use >>>> you know like those things for old people, like disabled people? >>>> I wanted to put some humor to it, so I said: >>>> Remember what used to happen when you pressed the wrong button while >>>> dialing >>>> in to Verizon? >>>> Sorry, that's not an option, try again. >>>> She began to tell me, that a blind woman she knew had other >>>> disabilities, >>>> and also "used things to her advantage." I realized what she was >>>> getting >>>> at, the clustering affect. One size fits all. >>>> Have a great day. >>>> >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 10:50 PM, "Brandon Keith Biggs" >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> No, >>>>> We use these things called food patches we swipe over our arm that >>>>> puts >>>> the nourishment for a good sized meal into our bloodstream. They are >>>> used >>>> completely by feel with Braille labels so we don't need any help with >>>> them. >>>> That way we are never in need of wasting extra time eating and doing >>>> this >>>> horribly unnatural thing called socializing over dinner. If for some >>>> reason >>>> we are allergic to the substance excreted by the patches, we can bring >>>> around a personalized IV that is permanently attached to our arm, >>>> injecting >>>> our meals directly into our vain. If a blind person ever touches a fork >>>> they >>>> are in danger of stabbing themselves in the eye which is in front of >>>> them, >>>> but because they can't see is magically put in the way of any sharp >>>> object >>>> they may handle. If they eat solid food they may become poisoned >>>> because >>>> they can't see the germs to keep from consuming bad food. >>>>> In all cases blind people are never to be given dinner except in their >>>>> arm >>>> patches. >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> >>>>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>>>> -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:14 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> Huh? Don't humans need food to survive? I guess they think blind >>>>> people have a very short lifespan then, LOL. >>>>> >>>>> Chris >>>>> >>>>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>>>> Public Relations Committee >>>>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>>>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>>> williams >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 10:12 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> I've had people ask me or my friends if I would be capable of eating >>>>> dinner on a date. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris >>>>> Nusbaum >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:28 PM >>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does >>>>> somebody feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks >>>>> ago. >>>>> >>>>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>>>> Public Relations Committee >>>>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>>>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua >>>>> Lester >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> Exactly! >>>>> Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I >>>>> watch >>>> TV! >>>>> I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can >>>>> tell somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. >>>>> Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle >>>>> Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends >>>>> and my sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating >>>>> configuration so he could see the video screen (obviously the three of >>>>> us blind folks were just listening, so it didn't matter where we sat >>>>> in the room). Eventually it struck me that here was a situation where >>>>> the lone sighted person was the one with "special needs" because he >>>>> needed >>>> an accommodation that we didn't. >>>>> Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on >>>>> sighted people. But it makes you think about where the supposed >>>>> tragedy of blindness really comes from. If you alter the group >>>>> dynamics just a little bit, blind people can be equal or even >>>>> advantaged. >>>>> Arielle >>>>> >>>>> On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>>> Lol. That is funny. >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >>>>>> Keith Biggs >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello, >>>>>> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >>>>>> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >>>>>> room for a sighted person. >>>>>> >>>>>> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. >>>>>> Sighted people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't >>>>>> like walking into >>>>>> >>>>>> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >>>>>> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm >>>>>> outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun shining >>>>>> into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make sure >>>>>> print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so the >>>>>> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >>>>>> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >>>>>> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >>>>>> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >>>>>> >>>>>> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all times. >>>>>> If you >>>>>> >>>>>> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >>>>>> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >>>>>> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make >>>>>> sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the >>>>>> sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without >>>> protection. >>>>>> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >>>>>> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>> >>>>>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: Josh Gregory >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >>>>>> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >>>>>> mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >>>>>> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in my >>>>>>> earlier post. >>>>>>> Misty >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>>>>>> >>>>>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>>>>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>>>>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>>>>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>>>>>> Gregory >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>>>>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>>>>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>>>>>> good idea here, and when >>>>>> >>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see >>>>>>>> what they're like. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>>>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them >>>>>>>>> and give >>>>>>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>>>>>> philosophy! >>>>>>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>>>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>>>>>>> anything, and >>>>>>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>>>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>>>>>>> thread that >>>>>>>> I just started. >>>>>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>>>>>>> You think >>>>>>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them >>>>>>>> to go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and >>>>>>>> large problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where >>>>>>>> do the ideas come from? >>>>>>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>>>>>>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear >>>>>>>> "they are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which may >>>>>>>> affect a blind person's employment or education worth your time? >>>>>>>> what if that blind person is you? >>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>>>>>> terrible >>>>>>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th century >>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>> before! >>>>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>>>>>>> more...one is >>>>>>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There >>>>>>>>>> is no >>>>>>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>>>>>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>>>>>>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually >>>>>>>> impaired teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>>>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>>>>>>> Students >>>>>>>> mailing >>>>>>>>>>> list >>>>>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>>>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>>>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>>>>>>> viewed four of them last >>>>>>>> night >>>>>>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>>>>>>> out that >>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>>>>>>> completely >>>>>>>> unaware, >>>>>>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article or >>>>>>>>>>> from our >>>>>>>> life!, >>>>>>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>>>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>>>>>>> titled "How to set >>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>>>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>>>>>>> dramatic language >>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation >>>>>>>>>>> FOR the >>>>>>>> Blind) >>>>>>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>>>>>>> argument >>>>>>>> specific >>>>>>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>>>>>> problems >>>>>>>> with >>>>>>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING >>>>>>>>>>> ACCURATE ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO EHOW!!!! >>>>>>>>>>> I will be doing it one >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>>>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>>>>>>> permanently...as per >>>>>>>> their >>>>>>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>>>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>>>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> WA >>>>>>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the >>>>>>>>>>> Dept. >>>>>>>>>>> of Consumer >>>>>>>> Affairs >>>>>>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>>>>> info for >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>>> 4 >>>>>> 0gmail >>>>>>>>>>> .com >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>>>>> info for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40g >>>>>> m >>>>>> ail.co >>>>>>>> m >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pcc >>>>>> u >>>>>> aedu.o >>>>>>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40g >>>>>> m >>>>>> ail.co >>>>>>>> m >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pcc >>>>>> u >>>>>> a.edu >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >>>>>> l >>>>>> .com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> 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_______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >>>>>> com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >>>>> a.edu >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g >>>>> mail.c >>>>> om >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>>> 0gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g >>>>> mail.c >>>>> om >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% >>>>> 40gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/wmodnl%40hotmail.c >>>>> om >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c >>>> om >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/turtlepower17%40gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From turtlepower17 at gmail.com Tue Mar 26 18:22:19 2013 From: turtlepower17 at gmail.com (Desiree Oudinot) Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 14:22:19 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness In-Reply-To: References: <9020953256462836159@unknownmsgid> <4FD4097453F5415DAB65300BF1C72231@BrandonsLaptop2> Message-ID: I agree. I never liked him to begin with. On 3/26/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Howard Stern is just... well, Howard Stern, if that's who it was on > the show Desiree found. Honestly, it wouldn't surprise me if that's > who it was at all. > > On 3/26/13, Brandon Keith Biggs wrote: >> Hello, >> Think of the stretch! I've never met anyone who can actually see their >> behind without a mirror. >> Thanks, >> >> Brandon Keith Biggs >> -----Original Message----- >> From: christopher nusbaum >> Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 3:59 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >> >> Although I agree with Desiree and with Josh that this view is absurd, >> I find it interesting because most of the time people assume that >> wiping ourselves is an unbearable challenge. I have been asked many >> times how I wipe myself, but I have never heard the view that we're >> better at it than the sighted. I wonder, do they really use their >> vision to help them wipe themselves? Do they look back at, well... >> what they're wiping when wiping it? If they do, which I think is >> highly unlikely, I would imagine that wiping would be more of a hassle >> (as well as a disgusting ordeal) for sighted people than for us! >> >> Chris Nusbaum >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 25, 2013, at 11:52 PM, Desiree Oudinot >> wrote: >> >>> You know, I can't remember exactly when this was, or what show, but I >>> remember flipping through radio stations once when I was a kid and >>> stopping on a talk show. I believe it may have been howard Stern, but >>> don't quote me on that. He said, in a nutshell, that blind people must >>> be better at wiping than sighted folks after they go to the >>> bathroom...It was more crudely put than that, but you catch my drift. >>> Both views are absurd. It's a basic bodily function that is not >>> dependent on sight! >>> >>> On 3/25/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>> Hi all, >>>> >>>> What most disturbs me about this is,: >>>> >>>> "She began to tell me, that a blind woman she knew had other >>>> disabilities, and also "used things to her advantage." I realized >>>> what she was getting at, the clustering affect. One size fits all." >>>> >>>> Where in the world did this person come up with the idea that all >>>> blind people have other disabilities in addition to their blindness, >>>> or that all use things to their advantage? I know it's the clustering >>>> effect, but the fact that these two things are so far fetched is >>>> shocking to me... it's not just something out of ignorance like, "Do >>>> you get around by counting steps," or "You must be able to hear >>>> everything," it's literally assuming that blind people are much less >>>> capable of even taking care of the simplest bodily function and that >>>> we're all either too disabled or too lazy to take care of it. >>>> >>>> On 3/25/13, Chris Nusbaum wrote: >>>>> What? I know a lot of blind people, none of whom use diapers to go to >>>>> the >>>>> bathroom after infancy. >>>>> >>>>> Chris >>>>> >>>>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>>>> Public Relations Committee >>>>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>>>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of wmodnl >>>>> wmodnl >>>>> Sent: Monday, March 25, 2013 3:00 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Cc: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>> >>>>> Well, if we were taking a survey of the oddest questions we were ever >>>>> asked, >>>>> I think what I was asked today would go well. >>>>> Sir, not for nothing, how do you go to the bathroom? Well, the same >>>>> way >>>>> you >>>>> do. No, I mean, like, when you are out and not at home. Why don't you >>>>> use >>>>> you know like those things for old people, like disabled people? >>>>> I wanted to put some humor to it, so I said: >>>>> Remember what used to happen when you pressed the wrong button while >>>>> dialing >>>>> in to Verizon? >>>>> Sorry, that's not an option, try again. >>>>> She began to tell me, that a blind woman she knew had other >>>>> disabilities, >>>>> and also "used things to her advantage." I realized what she was >>>>> getting >>>>> at, the clustering affect. One size fits all. >>>>> Have a great day. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 10:50 PM, "Brandon Keith Biggs" >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> No, >>>>>> We use these things called food patches we swipe over our arm that >>>>>> puts >>>>> the nourishment for a good sized meal into our bloodstream. They are >>>>> used >>>>> completely by feel with Braille labels so we don't need any help with >>>>> them. >>>>> That way we are never in need of wasting extra time eating and doing >>>>> this >>>>> horribly unnatural thing called socializing over dinner. If for some >>>>> reason >>>>> we are allergic to the substance excreted by the patches, we can bring >>>>> around a personalized IV that is permanently attached to our arm, >>>>> injecting >>>>> our meals directly into our vain. If a blind person ever touches a >>>>> fork >>>>> they >>>>> are in danger of stabbing themselves in the eye which is in front of >>>>> them, >>>>> but because they can't see is magically put in the way of any sharp >>>>> object >>>>> they may handle. If they eat solid food they may become poisoned >>>>> because >>>>> they can't see the germs to keep from consuming bad food. >>>>>> In all cases blind people are never to be given dinner except in >>>>>> their >>>>>> arm >>>>> patches. >>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>> >>>>>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>>>>> -----Original Message----- From: Chris Nusbaum >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 7:14 PM >>>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Huh? Don't humans need food to survive? I guess they think blind >>>>>> people have a very short lifespan then, LOL. >>>>>> >>>>>> Chris >>>>>> >>>>>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>>>>> Public Relations Committee >>>>>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>>>>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin >>>>>> williams >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 10:12 PM >>>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> I've had people ask me or my friends if I would be capable of eating >>>>>> dinner on a date. >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Chris >>>>>> Nusbaum >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 8:28 PM >>>>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> How about when a sighted person asks you: "How do you eat? Does >>>>>> somebody feed you?" Yes, that literally happened to me a couple weeks >>>>>> ago. >>>>>> >>>>>> Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair >>>>>> Public Relations Committee >>>>>> Maryland Association of Blind Students >>>>>> Phone: (443) 547-2409 >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua >>>>>> Lester >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 6:15 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> Exactly! >>>>>> Also, I get a little adgitated when a sighted person asks me how I >>>>>> watch >>>>> TV! >>>>>> I, of course, explain to them that I listen to what's said, and I can >>>>>> tell somewhat, what's going on with the sound affects. >>>>>> Sometimes, audio descriptions would help, though! >>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Arielle >>>>>> Silverman [arielle71 at gmail.com] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 5:11 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>> >>>>>> It reminds me of a time when I rented a movie with two blind friends >>>>>> and my sighted fiancee. We had to keep adjusting our seating >>>>>> configuration so he could see the video screen (obviously the three >>>>>> of >>>>>> us blind folks were just listening, so it didn't matter where we sat >>>>>> in the room). Eventually it struck me that here was a situation where >>>>>> the lone sighted person was the one with "special needs" because he >>>>>> needed >>>>> an accommodation that we didn't. >>>>>> Of course I love him dearly and this is not an attack on him or on >>>>>> sighted people. But it makes you think about where the supposed >>>>>> tragedy of blindness really comes from. If you alter the group >>>>>> dynamics just a little bit, blind people can be equal or even >>>>>> advantaged. >>>>>> Arielle >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/21/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>>>> Lol. That is funny. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brandon >>>>>>> Keith Biggs >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 4:27 PM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hello, >>>>>>> I'm pretty sure this is a gag, most of their other articles seem >>>>>>> pretty ridiculous as well. I may write an article on how to prep a >>>>>>> room for a sighted person. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Make sure lights are turned on and not facing toward the door. >>>>>>> Sighted people don't like walking into dark rooms. They also don't >>>>>>> like walking into >>>>>>> >>>>>>> bright lights, so one needs to find the perfect balance. >>>>>>> Open the curtains if it is day time, even if it is really warm >>>>>>> outside and the AC is on. Sighted people love to have the sun >>>>>>> shining >>>>>>> into their house even though it raises the electrical bill. Make >>>>>>> sure >>>>>>> print labels on food and appliances aren't covered by anything so >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> sighted person can feel comfortable reading the familiar labels. If >>>>>>> there aren't already print labels on something, make sure they are >>>>>>> printed in at least 12 point font with black letters on a white >>>>>>> background. Make sure your TV screen is on and >>>>>>> >>>>>>> make sure your computer screen shows what you are doing at all >>>>>>> times. >>>>>>> If you >>>>>>> >>>>>>> wish to be safe, slow down your screen reader so the sighted person >>>>>>> won't feel left out of what you are doing. >>>>>>> If you plan on cooking with the sighted person in the house, make >>>>>>> sure to wear big gloves, because it raises the anxiety level of the >>>>>>> sighted person seeing someone cutting and using hot items without >>>>> protection. >>>>>>> If you follow all these instructions, you will be able to interact >>>>>>> with a sighted person comfortably in your house. >>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Brandon Keith Biggs >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: Josh Gregory >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 12:58 PM >>>>>>> To: Misty Dawn Bradley ; National Association of Blind Students >>>>>>> mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>> >>>>>>> It's all good, we all make mistakes sometimes, :-) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Misty Dawn Bradley >>>>>>> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>> I am sorry, but I meant to say EHow rather than EZine Articles in >>>>>>>> my >>>>>>>> earlier post. >>>>>>>> Misty >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 3:26 PM >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> It is important to read their trash. Remember, other people are, >>>>>>>>> and to their mind, they no things about you. You can more easily >>>>>>>>> refute them if you have some idea on what people are saying. You >>>>>>>>> can't advocate without proper information. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Josh >>>>>>>>> Gregory >>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 3:18 PM >>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hi Joshua, you don't want to read their trash, so you say, but you >>>>>>>>> say that it is important to educate them. I get that, but if you >>>>>>>>> read it, you can assist in educating them. Doing nothing is not a >>>>>>>>> good idea here, and when >>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>>> get a chance in a bit, I'm going to find these articles and see >>>>>>>>> what they're like. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 3:11 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I don't want to read their trash. >>>>>>>>>> If they have something negative to say, I'd usually E-Mail them >>>>>>>>>> and give >>>>>>>>> them my take on the matter, and teach them some old school NFB >>>>>>>>> philosophy! >>>>>>>>>> Does EHow have a captcha on their contact form? >>>>>>>>>> BTW, the ideas come from the ignorant people that don't know >>>>>>>>>> anything, and >>>>>>>>> have never seen a blind person do anything independently! >>>>>>>>>> We need to do something, and I posted a suggestion on another >>>>>>>>>> thread that >>>>>>>>> I just started. >>>>>>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:56 PM >>>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> They are no gag. They are on a well viewed and well shared site. >>>>>>>>>> You think >>>>>>>>> we all are not tired? Saying nothing does nothing but allows them >>>>>>>>> to go on, unimpeded. There was just an article about the real and >>>>>>>>> large problem of employment discrimination for blind people. Where >>>>>>>>> do the ideas come from? >>>>>>>>> how do they go on and on and on? Doing nothing does nothing to >>>>>>>>> correct or stop. It makes me terribly sad and dismayed to hear >>>>>>>>> "they are not worth my time". Is correcting even one mind which >>>>>>>>> may >>>>>>>>> affect a blind person's employment or education worth your time? >>>>>>>>> what if that blind person is you? >>>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Mar 22, 2013, at 1:41 PM, Joshua Lester >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Those articles aren't worth my time, if they're going to paint a >>>>>>>>>>> terrible >>>>>>>>> picture of blindness! >>>>>>>>>>> I'm tired of these negative ideas that come from the 16th >>>>>>>>>>> century >>>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>> before! >>>>>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Carrie >>>>>>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>>>> [carrie.gilmer at gmail.com] >>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 1:31 PM >>>>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> http://www.ehow.com/how_2040980_care-blind-person.html >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> There are links on the pages of articles to a good dozen >>>>>>>>>>> more...one is >>>>>>>>> also titled "how to feed a blind person" >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> What kind of blind person can they possibly be depicting? There >>>>>>>>>>> is no >>>>>>>>> distinguishing between a newly blinded person from a major auto >>>>>>>>> accident practically in a coma or a child with multiple >>>>>>>>> disabilities, or a 90 year old in feeble health or visually >>>>>>>>> impaired teenager in good health or a normal person born blind. >>>>>>>>>>> The aura of tragedy and burden and superhuman challenge abounds. >>>>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Mar 21, 2013, at 1:00 PM, "justin williams" >>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Where are the articles? >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of >>>>>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>>> Gilmer >>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 22, 2013 9:49 AM >>>>>>>>>>>> To: Blind Kid Mailing List; National Association of Blind >>>>>>>>>>>> Students >>>>>>>>> mailing >>>>>>>>>>>> list >>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] eHow internet article series on blindness >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Hello all~ >>>>>>>>>>>> I discovered last night a series of articles written and posted >>>>>>>>>>>> on eHow concerning blindness. they are misleading at best, >>>>>>>>>>>> horrifically bad perpetuated falsehoods at worst. I had only >>>>>>>>>>>> viewed four of them last >>>>>>>>> night >>>>>>>>>>>> and had to stop, I was so upset. This morning a friend pointed >>>>>>>>>>>> out that >>>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>>>>>> was mentioned and partially quoted in another one! I was >>>>>>>>>>>> completely >>>>>>>>> unaware, >>>>>>>>>>>> and found upon reading it, it is in the midst of misleading and >>>>>>>>>>>> mixed messages and not an accurate portrayal from the article >>>>>>>>>>>> or >>>>>>>>>>>> from our >>>>>>>>> life!, >>>>>>>>>>>> I believe it was pulled from. The same is true for a friend of >>>>>>>>>>>> mine also "quoted" in the same article! one of the articles is >>>>>>>>>>>> titled "How to set >>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>>> table for a blind person", yes, seriously. "How to care for a >>>>>>>>>>>> blind person"...They are Just dripping with condescending >>>>>>>>>>>> dramatic language >>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>>>> ideas! They appear to name the NFB (named National Federation >>>>>>>>>>>> FOR the >>>>>>>>> Blind) >>>>>>>>>>>> as a reference!!!!!!!! >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> I strongly encourage you to read the articles in the series and >>>>>>>>>>>> write complaints both individually and as groups, with reasoned >>>>>>>>>>>> argument >>>>>>>>> specific >>>>>>>>>>>> to false points. There are multiple authors, so letters naming >>>>>>>>>>>> problems >>>>>>>>> with >>>>>>>>>>>> each article are needed. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> We must get these off the internet. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Contact for complaint for eHow: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> I ENCOURAGE EVERYONE WHO HAS COMPLAINT OR KNOWS ANYTHING >>>>>>>>>>>> ACCURATE ABOUT BLINDNESS TO WRITE A FORMAL COMPLAINT TO >>>>>>>>>>>> EHOW!!!! >>>>>>>>>>>> I will be doing it one >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>>>>> each ridiculous article!! i believe if they get enough coherent >>>>>>>>>>>> and reasonable complaints they will take these down >>>>>>>>>>>> permanently...as per >>>>>>>>> their >>>>>>>>>>>> policy on misinformation!: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Further Information If you have a complaint, you may contact us >>>>>>>>>>>> at eHow, Inc. Legal Department, 5808 Lake Washington Blvd. Ste. >>>>>>>>>>>> 300, Kirkland, >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> WA >>>>>>>>>>>> 98033, U.S.A. If you are a California resident, the Complaint >>>>>>>>>>>> Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the >>>>>>>>>>>> Dept. >>>>>>>>>>>> of Consumer >>>>>>>>> Affairs >>>>>>>>>>>> may be contacted at 400 R Street, Sacramento, CA 95814 or (800) >>>>>>>>>>>> 952-5210 >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Carrie >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>>>>>> info for >>>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>>>> 4 >>>>>>> 0gmail >>>>>>>>>>>> .com >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>>>>>> info for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40g >>>>>>> m >>>>>>> ail.co >>>>>>>>> m >>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>>>>> info >>>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pcc >>>>>>> u >>>>>>> aedu.o >>>>>>>>> nmicrosoft.com >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >>>>>>>>>>> info >>>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40g >>>>>>> m >>>>>>> ail.co >>>>>>>>> m >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pcc >>>>>>> u >>>>>>> a.edu >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmai >>>>>>> l >>>>>>> .com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>>>> 4 >>>>>>> 0gmail >>>>>>>>> .com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40g >>>>>>> m >>>>>>> ail.co >>>>>>> m >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gma >>>>>>>> i >>>>>>>> l.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs >>>>>>> % >>>>>>> 40gmai >>>>>>> l.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >>>>>>> 4 >>>>>>> 0gmail >>>>>>> .com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >>>>>>> com >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccu >>>>>> a.edu >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g >>>>>> mail.c >>>>>> om >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>>>> 0gmail >>>>>> .com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40g >>>>>> mail.c >>>>>> om >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs% >>>>>> 40gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/wmodnl%40hotmail.c >>>>>> om >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.c >>>>> om >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Kaiti >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/turtlepower17%40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brandonkeithbiggs%40gmail.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/turtlepower17%40gmail.com > From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Tue Mar 26 19:49:15 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 15:49:15 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? Message-ID: Hi all, Okay, so I'll confess that part of the reason I'm writing this email is to vent about my current circumstances, but more importantly than that I am interested in seeing how other states or parts of the country run their voc rehab services. I apologize if this email sounds venty, as in order to explain what I'm talking about I'll need to give specific examples, but I am really interested in hearing your thoughts on the matter based on your own experiences. The thing that makes me the most uncomfortable with the voc rehab system in my state is that the councelors don't necessarily know much about blindness, let alone what a blind student truly needs to be successful. My councelor fills her job capacity in terms of knowing how to do the paperwork, but my own mother has told me that when they chat as I'm signing papers and my mom brings up something relatively fundamental like a conversation about navigating campus or something, she'll notice that what she says goes over my councelor's head. This has caused a few concerning events in terms of the authorizations that have been made for me. In December for example I requested orientation and mobility training so I could go through my second semester schedule, as there were a few buildings I would need to use that I had not been to yet. I got in touch with my O&M guy and we planned to set up a time in January. I emailed my councelor and told her this, but then my O&M specialist emailed me back and asked if I would be on campus after the first semester ended in December, because that was when training was authorized. I had to email my councelor and tell her that the reason for going with January was that campus closed the last day of finals week, and a few days prior to the start of the second term I would be back on campus and most of the academic buildings would be reopened. Another time for this same semester I requested a Perkins Brailler, specifically specifying that the traditional braillers were much sturdier and more reliable than the plastic ones and justifying my request. When I got a call from my vendor she first informed me that the braillers were out of stock until February, half way through my semester, and then asked me what color I wanted. I told her that the new brailler was not what I thought I was getting and she got in touch with the councelor. I ended up getting a traditional anyway on the grounds that although the new generations were out of stock, there were plenty traditionals available, and I needed one as I am taking math this semester. I know the system isn't there to grant my request, but it bothered me that I justified my reasoning why for both events and that my councelor, who doesn't necessarily know what I need, ignored it and wrote authorizations which would not work. The kicker, which really shows that the councelors don't know much about blindness or the equipment students use, is after I got off the phone with the vendor, I suddenly wondered if the councelor authorized braille paper to go along with it. I called the vendor back and found that paper was not included in the authorization, so the vendor had to call the councelor back and get braille paper added so I could actually use the brailler. I mean, to anyone who really knows the basics of blindness, ordering paper for the pencil-equivalent brailler seems like a no-brainer. I'm wondering why if the state employs people who aren't necessarily knowledgeable about the consumers they serve why they don't make an effort to educate and inform the councelors so they can better meet their consumer's needs? The other thing that bugs me is the communication problem. I understand that councelors are busy, that some travel between offices, and that because of these things they're not always easy to get ahold of. What I don't understand are a few of the communication issues whichh could be easily solved. My councelor and I often play phone tag; once in the summer I called her during the early afternoon hours and when my call was returned a few days later it was before 8:00 in the morning before I was even out of bed. I tried using emails instead, thinking that she probably has computer access more frequently. Sometimes when I send her paperwork I'll also take the opportunity to ask for clarification. I've found that when she does respond to receiving the paperwork she usually doesn't answer my question from the same email. Other times, like when I sent those emails about the brailler and mobility authorization in December, I may not get a response at all. Repetition of paperwork is another frustrating issue. In Ohio they've just started making students fill out these forms once a month which report our major, number of credits, where we're going to school, and how much class was missed. I understand the need for this, as perhaps there were issues when students who dropped classes or changed their plans didn't report to their councelors as they are supposed to, but if someone were to lie or withhold information from their councelor why would they not lie on the form as well? And to those of us who are solid students who do what we're supposed to, don't skip class and let our councelors know about the major changes, it's just an inconvenience that is preaching to the choir. We also have to do these interviews with a professional in our field. I've done two so far, once over the summer for the pre-college interview and again last semester. This semester one of my music therapy professors is trained in a specific type of therapy model that interests me. The interview sheet we have to go by has basic questions about the salary, what the job outlook is like, etc. I asked my councelor if it would be okay for me to come up with my own interview questions which would build off of what I've learned so far and that would take advantage of the opportunity to talk to this person about their specific training. She replied and said we had to use the form every time. To me, this seems really redundant. I don't see the point in asking different people the same questions and coming up with very similar, if not the same answers; if we're going to do that, then why not just use the same interview each time. I also don't see the point of doing it if gaining different perspectives on the field isn't an available option. I was talking to my mom about this, and although she reiterated that although the system is dumb all students have to do it, she agreed with me and stated that one of the systems worst flaws is that the expectation is so low that they don't want you to learn from the things you do through them, they just want the paperwork. Seguing off of that, the last thing that bugs me, (I promise), and the thing that bugs my mom the most actually, is that the system does not allow for students to complete their paperwork independently based on their low expectations. When the monthly report form was distributed through email it was attached as a pdf file. As we know, pdfs aren't the best with screenreaders, and more importantly aren't editable. The state clearly intended for these forms to be printed and filled out with a pen or pencil, which does not align with independence as most blind students in the voc rehab system would not be able to do this without sighted assistance. I emailed my councelor and asked if it would be possible to get a word copy of the document so I could fill it out myself. Like the braille and O&M emails, that message did not get a response. This isn't the first time I noticed it; when I was a sophomore in high school and just getting set up with voc rehab they would send print forms about job interest and searching to my house. A friend and I went to our councelor (a different one from the one we have now), and asked if we could get text or word files instead of the print copies and she didn't really understand why. We explained that we obviously couldn't read the files ourselves or write on them, but using our notetakers or laptops we could complete them if given an accessible copy, we even told her she could just email us the file as an attachment. She really didn't know what to do about this. It boggles me how a program designed to train blind students to be competent and independent adults won't even allow them to do something so simple as their paperwork on their own. Are their expectations of blind students really that low, and if so them giving money to college students who do the bulk of their work independently is hypocritical. (If they even know that we do most of our work independently without someone to hold our hand and scribe all our assignments for us). My mom thinks that the system is just still stuck in the 80's or 90's when not many blind kids successfully completed college, as opposed to now when a lot of them do, but that is no excuse. If they're that stuck in the past then something far worse than their low expectations is wrong with the system. Sorry for the venting rant, but if any of you have thoughts or commentary on this or your own situations please feel free to compare and write about it. I'm really interested in hearing other people's experiences. Thanks, -- Kaiti From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Tue Mar 26 20:00:14 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 20:00:14 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Kaiti! My Vocational Rehab is the same way! They told me, when I requested a notetaker, that I didn't need it, so they gave me a desktop computer! What good is that going to be in a classroom? Finally, (after 5 years of dealing with them,) they decided to get me a Braille Note Apex! I haven't gotten it yet, but I'm ready for it! The only way to change the system is to infiltrate it! The best counselors for blind students, are blind people! I'm majoring in Behavioral Health Technology! I'll try to get a job with my state VR, and straighten them out! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 2:49 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? Hi all, Okay, so I'll confess that part of the reason I'm writing this email is to vent about my current circumstances, but more importantly than that I am interested in seeing how other states or parts of the country run their voc rehab services. I apologize if this email sounds venty, as in order to explain what I'm talking about I'll need to give specific examples, but I am really interested in hearing your thoughts on the matter based on your own experiences. The thing that makes me the most uncomfortable with the voc rehab system in my state is that the councelors don't necessarily know much about blindness, let alone what a blind student truly needs to be successful. My councelor fills her job capacity in terms of knowing how to do the paperwork, but my own mother has told me that when they chat as I'm signing papers and my mom brings up something relatively fundamental like a conversation about navigating campus or something, she'll notice that what she says goes over my councelor's head. This has caused a few concerning events in terms of the authorizations that have been made for me. In December for example I requested orientation and mobility training so I could go through my second semester schedule, as there were a few buildings I would need to use that I had not been to yet. I got in touch with my O&M guy and we planned to set up a time in January. I emailed my councelor and told her this, but then my O&M specialist emailed me back and asked if I would be on campus after the first semester ended in December, because that was when training was authorized. I had to email my councelor and tell her that the reason for going with January was that campus closed the last day of finals week, and a few days prior to the start of the second term I would be back on campus and most of the academic buildings would be reopened. Another time for this same semester I requested a Perkins Brailler, specifically specifying that the traditional braillers were much sturdier and more reliable than the plastic ones and justifying my request. When I got a call from my vendor she first informed me that the braillers were out of stock until February, half way through my semester, and then asked me what color I wanted. I told her that the new brailler was not what I thought I was getting and she got in touch with the councelor. I ended up getting a traditional anyway on the grounds that although the new generations were out of stock, there were plenty traditionals available, and I needed one as I am taking math this semester. I know the system isn't there to grant my request, but it bothered me that I justified my reasoning why for both events and that my councelor, who doesn't necessarily know what I need, ignored it and wrote authorizations which would not work. The kicker, which really shows that the councelors don't know much about blindness or the equipment students use, is after I got off the phone with the vendor, I suddenly wondered if the councelor authorized braille paper to go along with it. I called the vendor back and found that paper was not included in the authorization, so the vendor had to call the councelor back and get braille paper added so I could actually use the brailler. I mean, to anyone who really knows the basics of blindness, ordering paper for the pencil-equivalent brailler seems like a no-brainer. I'm wondering why if the state employs people who aren't necessarily knowledgeable about the consumers they serve why they don't make an effort to educate and inform the councelors so they can better meet their consumer's needs? The other thing that bugs me is the communication problem. I understand that councelors are busy, that some travel between offices, and that because of these things they're not always easy to get ahold of. What I don't understand are a few of the communication issues whichh could be easily solved. My councelor and I often play phone tag; once in the summer I called her during the early afternoon hours and when my call was returned a few days later it was before 8:00 in the morning before I was even out of bed. I tried using emails instead, thinking that she probably has computer access more frequently. Sometimes when I send her paperwork I'll also take the opportunity to ask for clarification. I've found that when she does respond to receiving the paperwork she usually doesn't answer my question from the same email. Other times, like when I sent those emails about the brailler and mobility authorization in December, I may not get a response at all. Repetition of paperwork is another frustrating issue. In Ohio they've just started making students fill out these forms once a month which report our major, number of credits, where we're going to school, and how much class was missed. I understand the need for this, as perhaps there were issues when students who dropped classes or changed their plans didn't report to their councelors as they are supposed to, but if someone were to lie or withhold information from their councelor why would they not lie on the form as well? And to those of us who are solid students who do what we're supposed to, don't skip class and let our councelors know about the major changes, it's just an inconvenience that is preaching to the choir. We also have to do these interviews with a professional in our field. I've done two so far, once over the summer for the pre-college interview and again last semester. This semester one of my music therapy professors is trained in a specific type of therapy model that interests me. The interview sheet we have to go by has basic questions about the salary, what the job outlook is like, etc. I asked my councelor if it would be okay for me to come up with my own interview questions which would build off of what I've learned so far and that would take advantage of the opportunity to talk to this person about their specific training. She replied and said we had to use the form every time. To me, this seems really redundant. I don't see the point in asking different people the same questions and coming up with very similar, if not the same answers; if we're going to do that, then why not just use the same interview each time. I also don't see the point of doing it if gaining different perspectives on the field isn't an available option. I was talking to my mom about this, and although she reiterated that although the system is dumb all students have to do it, she agreed with me and stated that one of the systems worst flaws is that the expectation is so low that they don't want you to learn from the things you do through them, they just want the paperwork. Seguing off of that, the last thing that bugs me, (I promise), and the thing that bugs my mom the most actually, is that the system does not allow for students to complete their paperwork independently based on their low expectations. When the monthly report form was distributed through email it was attached as a pdf file. As we know, pdfs aren't the best with screenreaders, and more importantly aren't editable. The state clearly intended for these forms to be printed and filled out with a pen or pencil, which does not align with independence as most blind students in the voc rehab system would not be able to do this without sighted assistance. I emailed my councelor and asked if it would be possible to get a word copy of the document so I could fill it out myself. Like the braille and O&M emails, that message did not get a response. This isn't the first time I noticed it; when I was a sophomore in high school and just getting set up with voc rehab they would send print forms about job interest and searching to my house. A friend and I went to our councelor (a different one from the one we have now), and asked if we could get text or word files instead of the print copies and she didn't really understand why. We explained that we obviously couldn't read the files ourselves or write on them, but using our notetakers or laptops we could complete them if given an accessible copy, we even told her she could just email us the file as an attachment. She really didn't know what to do about this. It boggles me how a program designed to train blind students to be competent and independent adults won't even allow them to do something so simple as their paperwork on their own. Are their expectations of blind students really that low, and if so them giving money to college students who do the bulk of their work independently is hypocritical. (If they even know that we do most of our work independently without someone to hold our hand and scribe all our assignments for us). My mom thinks that the system is just still stuck in the 80's or 90's when not many blind kids successfully completed college, as opposed to now when a lot of them do, but that is no excuse. If they're that stuck in the past then something far worse than their low expectations is wrong with the system. Sorry for the venting rant, but if any of you have thoughts or commentary on this or your own situations please feel free to compare and write about it. I'm really interested in hearing other people's experiences. Thanks, -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu From jhud7789 at gmail.com Tue Mar 26 20:10:00 2013 From: jhud7789 at gmail.com (Joseph Hudson) Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 15:10:00 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hello Katie, I ran into the same similar issues that you had with your VR counselor, it has to do with equipment for my computer. With now been working on this for about 6 to 8 months when we first started he asked me what kind of job I was using, I told him JS W 13th, so he said okay so when about three months ago hearsay. I have not heard, anything from him so I called him, and asked him question have you heard anything on my Dragon and Jay say. He Mcclyde with him we don't have this version of Jay say in our warehouse. He recently asked me when I'll be interested in getting just 14 I say yes and no, because I would have to upgrade my system of my windows. I wish that my counselor was still here she was the best thing around as you work really fast. And I did not clarify which date I'm talking about I'm talking about the state of Texas. If you would like you can email me off list if you have any other questions, my emails in my signature. Vice president of the Texas school for the blinds Zello channel , phone, 641-715-3900 extension 34315, or 588-7652. Email, jhud7789 at yahoo.com Sent from my iPhone On Mar 26, 2013, at 2:49 PM, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Hi all, > > Okay, so I'll confess that part of the reason I'm writing this email > is to vent about my current circumstances, but more importantly than > that I am interested in seeing how other states or parts of the > country run their voc rehab services. I apologize if this email > sounds venty, as in order to explain what I'm talking about I'll need > to give specific examples, but I am really interested in hearing your > thoughts on the matter based on your own experiences. > > The thing that makes me the most uncomfortable with the voc rehab > system in my state is that the councelors don't necessarily know much > about blindness, let alone what a blind student truly needs to be > successful. My councelor fills her job capacity in terms of knowing > how to do the paperwork, but my own mother has told me that when they > chat as I'm signing papers and my mom brings up something relatively > fundamental like a conversation about navigating campus or something, > she'll notice that what she says goes over my councelor's head. This > has caused a few concerning events in terms of the authorizations that > have been made for me. In December for example I requested > orientation and mobility training so I could go through my second > semester schedule, as there were a few buildings I would need to use > that I had not been to yet. I got in touch with my O&M guy and we > planned to set up a time in January. I emailed my councelor and told > her this, but then my O&M specialist emailed me back and asked if I > would be on campus after the first semester ended in December, because > that was when training was authorized. I had to email my councelor > and tell her that the reason for going with January was that campus > closed the last day of finals week, and a few days prior to the start > of the second term I would be back on campus and most of the academic > buildings would be reopened. Another time for this same semester I > requested a Perkins Brailler, specifically specifying that the > traditional braillers were much sturdier and more reliable than the > plastic ones and justifying my request. When I got a call from my > vendor she first informed me that the braillers were out of stock > until February, half way through my semester, and then asked me what > color I wanted. I told her that the new brailler was not what I > thought I was getting and she got in touch with the councelor. I > ended up getting a traditional anyway on the grounds that although the > new generations were out of stock, there were plenty traditionals > available, and I needed one as I am taking math this semester. I know > the system isn't there to grant my request, but it bothered me that I > justified my reasoning why for both events and that my councelor, who > doesn't necessarily know what I need, ignored it and wrote > authorizations which would not work. The kicker, which really shows > that the councelors don't know much about blindness or the equipment > students use, is after I got off the phone with the vendor, I suddenly > wondered if the councelor authorized braille paper to go along with > it. I called the vendor back and found that paper was not included in > the authorization, so the vendor had to call the councelor back and > get braille paper added so I could actually use the brailler. I mean, > to anyone who really knows the basics of blindness, ordering paper for > the pencil-equivalent brailler seems like a no-brainer. I'm wondering > why if the state employs people who aren't necessarily knowledgeable > about the consumers they serve why they don't make an effort to > educate and inform the councelors so they can better meet their > consumer's needs? > > The other thing that bugs me is the communication problem. I > understand that councelors are busy, that some travel between offices, > and that because of these things they're not always easy to get ahold > of. What I don't understand are a few of the communication issues > whichh could be easily solved. My councelor and I often play phone > tag; once in the summer I called her during the early afternoon hours > and when my call was returned a few days later it was before 8:00 in > the morning before I was even out of bed. I tried using emails > instead, thinking that she probably has computer access more > frequently. Sometimes when I send her paperwork I'll also take the > opportunity to ask for clarification. I've found that when she does > respond to receiving the paperwork she usually doesn't answer my > question from the same email. Other times, like when I sent those > emails about the brailler and mobility authorization in December, I > may not get a response at all. > > Repetition of paperwork is another frustrating issue. In Ohio they've > just started making students fill out these forms once a month which > report our major, number of credits, where we're going to school, and > how much class was missed. I understand the need for this, as perhaps > there were issues when students who dropped classes or changed their > plans didn't report to their councelors as they are supposed to, but > if someone were to lie or withhold information from their councelor > why would they not lie on the form as well? And to those of us who > are solid students who do what we're supposed to, don't skip class and > let our councelors know about the major changes, it's just an > inconvenience that is preaching to the choir. We also have to do > these interviews with a professional in our field. I've done two so > far, once over the summer for the pre-college interview and again last > semester. This semester one of my music therapy professors is trained > in a specific type of therapy model that interests me. The interview > sheet we have to go by has basic questions about the salary, what the > job outlook is like, etc. I asked my councelor if it would be okay > for me to come up with my own interview questions which would build > off of what I've learned so far and that would take advantage of the > opportunity to talk to this person about their specific training. She > replied and said we had to use the form every time. To me, this seems > really redundant. I don't see the point in asking different people > the same questions and coming up with very similar, if not the same > answers; if we're going to do that, then why not just use the same > interview each time. I also don't see the point of doing it if > gaining different perspectives on the field isn't an available option. > I was talking to my mom about this, and although she reiterated that > although the system is dumb all students have to do it, she agreed > with me and stated that one of the systems worst flaws is that the > expectation is so low that they don't want you to learn from the > things you do through them, they just want the paperwork. > > Seguing off of that, the last thing that bugs me, (I promise), and the > thing that bugs my mom the most actually, is that the system does not > allow for students to complete their paperwork independently based on > their low expectations. When the monthly report form was distributed > through email it was attached as a pdf file. As we know, pdfs aren't > the best with screenreaders, and more importantly aren't editable. > The state clearly intended for these forms to be printed and filled > out with a pen or pencil, which does not align with independence as > most blind students in the voc rehab system would not be able to do > this without sighted assistance. I emailed my councelor and asked if > it would be possible to get a word copy of the document so I could > fill it out myself. Like the braille and O&M emails, that message did > not get a response. This isn't the first time I noticed it; when I > was a sophomore in high school and just getting set up with voc rehab > they would send print forms about job interest and searching to my > house. A friend and I went to our councelor (a different one from the > one we have now), and asked if we could get text or word files instead > of the print copies and she didn't really understand why. We > explained that we obviously couldn't read the files ourselves or write > on them, but using our notetakers or laptops we could complete them if > given an accessible copy, we even told her she could just email us the > file as an attachment. She really didn't know what to do about this. > It boggles me how a program designed to train blind students to be > competent and independent adults won't even allow them to do something > so simple as their paperwork on their own. Are their expectations of > blind students really that low, and if so them giving money to college > students who do the bulk of their work independently is hypocritical. > (If they even know that we do most of our work independently without > someone to hold our hand and scribe all our assignments for us). My > mom thinks that the system is just still stuck in the 80's or 90's > when not many blind kids successfully completed college, as opposed to > now when a lot of them do, but that is no excuse. If they're that > stuck in the past then something far worse than their low expectations > is wrong with the system. > > Sorry for the venting rant, but if any of you have thoughts or > commentary on this or your own situations please feel free to compare > and write about it. I'm really interested in hearing other people's > experiences. > > Thanks, > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40gmail.com From k7uij at panix.com Tue Mar 26 20:26:43 2013 From: k7uij at panix.com (Mike Freeman) Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 13:26:43 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: kaiti: First, it is obvious that you live in a state that has a general rehab agency rather than one dealing specifically with blindness. This is unfortunate as you have discovered. However, knowing what you need and want and being able to cogently articulate your needs will go a long way toward fulfilling them. You've seem this in the case of the Perkins braillewriter. Second, why do you need an O&M specialist to show you around campus? Could not a friend or family member do the job? When you graduate and enter the world of work, you won't have O&M instructors at your beck and call. It is definitely helpful to develop the skill of learning new routes and places with minimal assistance. This is the essence of structured discovery learning. Could your DSS office help? This way, you wouldn't have to worry about rehab at all. Mike Freeman sent from my iPhone On Mar 26, 2013, at 12:49, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Hi all, > > Okay, so I'll confess that part of the reason I'm writing this email > is to vent about my current circumstances, but more importantly than > that I am interested in seeing how other states or parts of the > country run their voc rehab services. I apologize if this email > sounds venty, as in order to explain what I'm talking about I'll need > to give specific examples, but I am really interested in hearing your > thoughts on the matter based on your own experiences. > > The thing that makes me the most uncomfortable with the voc rehab > system in my state is that the councelors don't necessarily know much > about blindness, let alone what a blind student truly needs to be > successful. My councelor fills her job capacity in terms of knowing > how to do the paperwork, but my own mother has told me that when they > chat as I'm signing papers and my mom brings up something relatively > fundamental like a conversation about navigating campus or something, > she'll notice that what she says goes over my councelor's head. This > has caused a few concerning events in terms of the authorizations that > have been made for me. In December for example I requested > orientation and mobility training so I could go through my second > semester schedule, as there were a few buildings I would need to use > that I had not been to yet. I got in touch with my O&M guy and we > planned to set up a time in January. I emailed my councelor and told > her this, but then my O&M specialist emailed me back and asked if I > would be on campus after the first semester ended in December, because > that was when training was authorized. I had to email my councelor > and tell her that the reason for going with January was that campus > closed the last day of finals week, and a few days prior to the start > of the second term I would be back on campus and most of the academic > buildings would be reopened. Another time for this same semester I > requested a Perkins Brailler, specifically specifying that the > traditional braillers were much sturdier and more reliable than the > plastic ones and justifying my request. When I got a call from my > vendor she first informed me that the braillers were out of stock > until February, half way through my semester, and then asked me what > color I wanted. I told her that the new brailler was not what I > thought I was getting and she got in touch with the councelor. I > ended up getting a traditional anyway on the grounds that although the > new generations were out of stock, there were plenty traditionals From arielle71 at gmail.com Tue Mar 26 21:41:42 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 15:41:42 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: There are many many problems across the country with VR. Some of them are specific to particular counselors, but many have to do with the low standards for hiring and training counselors and the incentives for completing paperwork instead of for real progress toward finding a job. My rule has always been to deal with VR as little as I possibly can. Get stuff from them you can't possibly get anywhere else, but many scholarship programs and DS offices will provide much greater flexibility and efficiency of service than will the VR system. Arielle On 3/26/13, Mike Freeman wrote: > kaiti: > First, it is obvious that you live in a state that has a general rehab > agency rather than one dealing specifically with blindness. This is > unfortunate as you have discovered. However, knowing what you need and want > and being able to cogently articulate your needs will go a long way toward > fulfilling them. You've seem this in the case of the Perkins braillewriter. > > Second, why do you need an O&M specialist to show you around campus? Could > not a friend or family member do the job? When you graduate and enter the > world of work, you won't have O&M instructors at your beck and call. It is > definitely helpful to develop the skill of learning new routes and places > with minimal assistance. This is the essence of structured discovery > learning. Could your DSS office help? This way, you wouldn't have to worry > about rehab at all. > > Mike Freeman > sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 26, 2013, at 12:49, Kaiti Shelton > wrote: > >> Hi all, >> >> Okay, so I'll confess that part of the reason I'm writing this email >> is to vent about my current circumstances, but more importantly than >> that I am interested in seeing how other states or parts of the >> country run their voc rehab services. I apologize if this email >> sounds venty, as in order to explain what I'm talking about I'll need >> to give specific examples, but I am really interested in hearing your >> thoughts on the matter based on your own experiences. >> >> The thing that makes me the most uncomfortable with the voc rehab >> system in my state is that the councelors don't necessarily know much >> about blindness, let alone what a blind student truly needs to be >> successful. My councelor fills her job capacity in terms of knowing >> how to do the paperwork, but my own mother has told me that when they >> chat as I'm signing papers and my mom brings up something relatively >> fundamental like a conversation about navigating campus or something, >> she'll notice that what she says goes over my councelor's head. This >> has caused a few concerning events in terms of the authorizations that >> have been made for me. In December for example I requested >> orientation and mobility training so I could go through my second >> semester schedule, as there were a few buildings I would need to use >> that I had not been to yet. I got in touch with my O&M guy and we >> planned to set up a time in January. I emailed my councelor and told >> her this, but then my O&M specialist emailed me back and asked if I >> would be on campus after the first semester ended in December, because >> that was when training was authorized. I had to email my councelor >> and tell her that the reason for going with January was that campus >> closed the last day of finals week, and a few days prior to the start >> of the second term I would be back on campus and most of the academic >> buildings would be reopened. Another time for this same semester I >> requested a Perkins Brailler, specifically specifying that the >> traditional braillers were much sturdier and more reliable than the >> plastic ones and justifying my request. When I got a call from my >> vendor she first informed me that the braillers were out of stock >> until February, half way through my semester, and then asked me what >> color I wanted. I told her that the new brailler was not what I >> thought I was getting and she got in touch with the councelor. I >> ended up getting a traditional anyway on the grounds that although the >> new generations were out of stock, there were plenty traditionals > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Mon Mar 25 22:41:18 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2013 18:41:18 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <005b01ce29a9$de39e0f0$9aada2d0$@gmail.com> I didn't no that dss would nelp you with mobility. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 4:27 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? kaiti: First, it is obvious that you live in a state that has a general rehab agency rather than one dealing specifically with blindness. This is unfortunate as you have discovered. However, knowing what you need and want and being able to cogently articulate your needs will go a long way toward fulfilling them. You've seem this in the case of the Perkins braillewriter. Second, why do you need an O&M specialist to show you around campus? Could not a friend or family member do the job? When you graduate and enter the world of work, you won't have O&M instructors at your beck and call. It is definitely helpful to develop the skill of learning new routes and places with minimal assistance. This is the essence of structured discovery learning. Could your DSS office help? This way, you wouldn't have to worry about rehab at all. Mike Freeman sent from my iPhone On Mar 26, 2013, at 12:49, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Hi all, > > Okay, so I'll confess that part of the reason I'm writing this email > is to vent about my current circumstances, but more importantly than > that I am interested in seeing how other states or parts of the > country run their voc rehab services. I apologize if this email > sounds venty, as in order to explain what I'm talking about I'll need > to give specific examples, but I am really interested in hearing your > thoughts on the matter based on your own experiences. > > The thing that makes me the most uncomfortable with the voc rehab > system in my state is that the councelors don't necessarily know much > about blindness, let alone what a blind student truly needs to be > successful. My councelor fills her job capacity in terms of knowing > how to do the paperwork, but my own mother has told me that when they > chat as I'm signing papers and my mom brings up something relatively > fundamental like a conversation about navigating campus or something, > she'll notice that what she says goes over my councelor's head. This > has caused a few concerning events in terms of the authorizations that > have been made for me. In December for example I requested > orientation and mobility training so I could go through my second > semester schedule, as there were a few buildings I would need to use > that I had not been to yet. I got in touch with my O&M guy and we > planned to set up a time in January. I emailed my councelor and told > her this, but then my O&M specialist emailed me back and asked if I > would be on campus after the first semester ended in December, because > that was when training was authorized. I had to email my councelor > and tell her that the reason for going with January was that campus > closed the last day of finals week, and a few days prior to the start > of the second term I would be back on campus and most of the academic > buildings would be reopened. Another time for this same semester I > requested a Perkins Brailler, specifically specifying that the > traditional braillers were much sturdier and more reliable than the > plastic ones and justifying my request. When I got a call from my > vendor she first informed me that the braillers were out of stock > until February, half way through my semester, and then asked me what > color I wanted. I told her that the new brailler was not what I > thought I was getting and she got in touch with the councelor. I > ended up getting a traditional anyway on the grounds that although the > new generations were out of stock, there were plenty traditionals _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Mon Mar 25 22:42:09 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2013 18:42:09 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <005d01ce29a9$fd1867d0$f7493770$@gmail.com> They should have at least given you a lap top. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 4:00 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? Hi Kaiti! My Vocational Rehab is the same way! They told me, when I requested a notetaker, that I didn't need it, so they gave me a desktop computer! What good is that going to be in a classroom? Finally, (after 5 years of dealing with them,) they decided to get me a Braille Note Apex! I haven't gotten it yet, but I'm ready for it! The only way to change the system is to infiltrate it! The best counselors for blind students, are blind people! I'm majoring in Behavioral Health Technology! I'll try to get a job with my state VR, and straighten them out! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 2:49 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? Hi all, Okay, so I'll confess that part of the reason I'm writing this email is to vent about my current circumstances, but more importantly than that I am interested in seeing how other states or parts of the country run their voc rehab services. I apologize if this email sounds venty, as in order to explain what I'm talking about I'll need to give specific examples, but I am really interested in hearing your thoughts on the matter based on your own experiences. The thing that makes me the most uncomfortable with the voc rehab system in my state is that the councelors don't necessarily know much about blindness, let alone what a blind student truly needs to be successful. My councelor fills her job capacity in terms of knowing how to do the paperwork, but my own mother has told me that when they chat as I'm signing papers and my mom brings up something relatively fundamental like a conversation about navigating campus or something, she'll notice that what she says goes over my councelor's head. This has caused a few concerning events in terms of the authorizations that have been made for me. In December for example I requested orientation and mobility training so I could go through my second semester schedule, as there were a few buildings I would need to use that I had not been to yet. I got in touch with my O&M guy and we planned to set up a time in January. I emailed my councelor and told her this, but then my O&M specialist emailed me back and asked if I would be on campus after the first semester ended in December, because that was when training was authorized. I had to email my councelor and tell her that the reason for going with January was that campus closed the last day of finals week, and a few days prior to the start of the second term I would be back on campus and most of the academic buildings would be reopened. Another time for this same semester I requested a Perkins Brailler, specifically specifying that the traditional braillers were much sturdier and more reliable than the plastic ones and justifying my request. When I got a call from my vendor she first informed me that the braillers were out of stock until February, half way through my semester, and then asked me what color I wanted. I told her that the new brailler was not what I thought I was getting and she got in touch with the councelor. I ended up getting a traditional anyway on the grounds that although the new generations were out of stock, there were plenty traditionals available, and I needed one as I am taking math this semester. I know the system isn't there to grant my request, but it bothered me that I justified my reasoning why for both events and that my councelor, who doesn't necessarily know what I need, ignored it and wrote authorizations which would not work. The kicker, which really shows that the councelors don't know much about blindness or the equipment students use, is after I got off the phone with the vendor, I suddenly wondered if the councelor authorized braille paper to go along with it. I called the vendor back and found that paper was not included in the authorization, so the vendor had to call the councelor back and get braille paper added so I could actually use the brailler. I mean, to anyone who really knows the basics of blindness, ordering paper for the pencil-equivalent brailler seems like a no-brainer. I'm wondering why if the state employs people who aren't necessarily knowledgeable about the consumers they serve why they don't make an effort to educate and inform the councelors so they can better meet their consumer's needs? The other thing that bugs me is the communication problem. I understand that councelors are busy, that some travel between offices, and that because of these things they're not always easy to get ahold of. What I don't understand are a few of the communication issues whichh could be easily solved. My councelor and I often play phone tag; once in the summer I called her during the early afternoon hours and when my call was returned a few days later it was before 8:00 in the morning before I was even out of bed. I tried using emails instead, thinking that she probably has computer access more frequently. Sometimes when I send her paperwork I'll also take the opportunity to ask for clarification. I've found that when she does respond to receiving the paperwork she usually doesn't answer my question from the same email. Other times, like when I sent those emails about the brailler and mobility authorization in December, I may not get a response at all. Repetition of paperwork is another frustrating issue. In Ohio they've just started making students fill out these forms once a month which report our major, number of credits, where we're going to school, and how much class was missed. I understand the need for this, as perhaps there were issues when students who dropped classes or changed their plans didn't report to their councelors as they are supposed to, but if someone were to lie or withhold information from their councelor why would they not lie on the form as well? And to those of us who are solid students who do what we're supposed to, don't skip class and let our councelors know about the major changes, it's just an inconvenience that is preaching to the choir. We also have to do these interviews with a professional in our field. I've done two so far, once over the summer for the pre-college interview and again last semester. This semester one of my music therapy professors is trained in a specific type of therapy model that interests me. The interview sheet we have to go by has basic questions about the salary, what the job outlook is like, etc. I asked my councelor if it would be okay for me to come up with my own interview questions which would build off of what I've learned so far and that would take advantage of the opportunity to talk to this person about their specific training. She replied and said we had to use the form every time. To me, this seems really redundant. I don't see the point in asking different people the same questions and coming up with very similar, if not the same answers; if we're going to do that, then why not just use the same interview each time. I also don't see the point of doing it if gaining different perspectives on the field isn't an available option. I was talking to my mom about this, and although she reiterated that although the system is dumb all students have to do it, she agreed with me and stated that one of the systems worst flaws is that the expectation is so low that they don't want you to learn from the things you do through them, they just want the paperwork. Seguing off of that, the last thing that bugs me, (I promise), and the thing that bugs my mom the most actually, is that the system does not allow for students to complete their paperwork independently based on their low expectations. When the monthly report form was distributed through email it was attached as a pdf file. As we know, pdfs aren't the best with screenreaders, and more importantly aren't editable. The state clearly intended for these forms to be printed and filled out with a pen or pencil, which does not align with independence as most blind students in the voc rehab system would not be able to do this without sighted assistance. I emailed my councelor and asked if it would be possible to get a word copy of the document so I could fill it out myself. Like the braille and O&M emails, that message did not get a response. This isn't the first time I noticed it; when I was a sophomore in high school and just getting set up with voc rehab they would send print forms about job interest and searching to my house. A friend and I went to our councelor (a different one from the one we have now), and asked if we could get text or word files instead of the print copies and she didn't really understand why. We explained that we obviously couldn't read the files ourselves or write on them, but using our notetakers or laptops we could complete them if given an accessible copy, we even told her she could just email us the file as an attachment. She really didn't know what to do about this. It boggles me how a program designed to train blind students to be competent and independent adults won't even allow them to do something so simple as their paperwork on their own. Are their expectations of blind students really that low, and if so them giving money to college students who do the bulk of their work independently is hypocritical. (If they even know that we do most of our work independently without someone to hold our hand and scribe all our assignments for us). My mom thinks that the system is just still stuck in the 80's or 90's when not many blind kids successfully completed college, as opposed to now when a lot of them do, but that is no excuse. If they're that stuck in the past then something far worse than their low expectations is wrong with the system. Sorry for the venting rant, but if any of you have thoughts or commentary on this or your own situations please feel free to compare and write about it. I'm really interested in hearing other people's experiences. Thanks, -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Mon Mar 25 23:03:41 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2013 19:03:41 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <007401ce29ac$feb34bc0$fc19e340$@gmail.com> I think for you a meeting with your counselor and her supervisor is in order. You definitely need to ask directly why your concerns not being addressed. Be very direct. Bring up all of your concerns. Write them down and be organized. Don't forget a thing. Everything in thie email, bring up. You can maybe get a friend or relative to help you learn the parts of campus that you need. Aybe using the mobility guy at the end of December would have been alright; it would have gotten part of the job done. However, just be aggressive, and use your skill. Oh, and there is always cap. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 3:49 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? Hi all, Okay, so I'll confess that part of the reason I'm writing this email is to vent about my current circumstances, but more importantly than that I am interested in seeing how other states or parts of the country run their voc rehab services. I apologize if this email sounds venty, as in order to explain what I'm talking about I'll need to give specific examples, but I am really interested in hearing your thoughts on the matter based on your own experiences. The thing that makes me the most uncomfortable with the voc rehab system in my state is that the councelors don't necessarily know much about blindness, let alone what a blind student truly needs to be successful. My councelor fills her job capacity in terms of knowing how to do the paperwork, but my own mother has told me that when they chat as I'm signing papers and my mom brings up something relatively fundamental like a conversation about navigating campus or something, she'll notice that what she says goes over my councelor's head. This has caused a few concerning events in terms of the authorizations that have been made for me. In December for example I requested orientation and mobility training so I could go through my second semester schedule, as there were a few buildings I would need to use that I had not been to yet. I got in touch with my O&M guy and we planned to set up a time in January. I emailed my councelor and told her this, but then my O&M specialist emailed me back and asked if I would be on campus after the first semester ended in December, because that was when training was authorized. I had to email my councelor and tell her that the reason for going with January was that campus closed the last day of finals week, and a few days prior to the start of the second term I would be back on campus and most of the academic buildings would be reopened. Another time for this same semester I requested a Perkins Brailler, specifically specifying that the traditional braillers were much sturdier and more reliable than the plastic ones and justifying my request. When I got a call from my vendor she first informed me that the braillers were out of stock until February, half way through my semester, and then asked me what color I wanted. I told her that the new brailler was not what I thought I was getting and she got in touch with the councelor. I ended up getting a traditional anyway on the grounds that although the new generations were out of stock, there were plenty traditionals available, and I needed one as I am taking math this semester. I know the system isn't there to grant my request, but it bothered me that I justified my reasoning why for both events and that my councelor, who doesn't necessarily know what I need, ignored it and wrote authorizations which would not work. The kicker, which really shows that the councelors don't know much about blindness or the equipment students use, is after I got off the phone with the vendor, I suddenly wondered if the councelor authorized braille paper to go along with it. I called the vendor back and found that paper was not included in the authorization, so the vendor had to call the councelor back and get braille paper added so I could actually use the brailler. I mean, to anyone who really knows the basics of blindness, ordering paper for the pencil-equivalent brailler seems like a no-brainer. I'm wondering why if the state employs people who aren't necessarily knowledgeable about the consumers they serve why they don't make an effort to educate and inform the councelors so they can better meet their consumer's needs? The other thing that bugs me is the communication problem. I understand that councelors are busy, that some travel between offices, and that because of these things they're not always easy to get ahold of. What I don't understand are a few of the communication issues whichh could be easily solved. My councelor and I often play phone tag; once in the summer I called her during the early afternoon hours and when my call was returned a few days later it was before 8:00 in the morning before I was even out of bed. I tried using emails instead, thinking that she probably has computer access more frequently. Sometimes when I send her paperwork I'll also take the opportunity to ask for clarification. I've found that when she does respond to receiving the paperwork she usually doesn't answer my question from the same email. Other times, like when I sent those emails about the brailler and mobility authorization in December, I may not get a response at all. Repetition of paperwork is another frustrating issue. In Ohio they've just started making students fill out these forms once a month which report our major, number of credits, where we're going to school, and how much class was missed. I understand the need for this, as perhaps there were issues when students who dropped classes or changed their plans didn't report to their councelors as they are supposed to, but if someone were to lie or withhold information from their councelor why would they not lie on the form as well? And to those of us who are solid students who do what we're supposed to, don't skip class and let our councelors know about the major changes, it's just an inconvenience that is preaching to the choir. We also have to do these interviews with a professional in our field. I've done two so far, once over the summer for the pre-college interview and again last semester. This semester one of my music therapy professors is trained in a specific type of therapy model that interests me. The interview sheet we have to go by has basic questions about the salary, what the job outlook is like, etc. I asked my councelor if it would be okay for me to come up with my own interview questions which would build off of what I've learned so far and that would take advantage of the opportunity to talk to this person about their specific training. She replied and said we had to use the form every time. To me, this seems really redundant. I don't see the point in asking different people the same questions and coming up with very similar, if not the same answers; if we're going to do that, then why not just use the same interview each time. I also don't see the point of doing it if gaining different perspectives on the field isn't an available option. I was talking to my mom about this, and although she reiterated that although the system is dumb all students have to do it, she agreed with me and stated that one of the systems worst flaws is that the expectation is so low that they don't want you to learn from the things you do through them, they just want the paperwork. Seguing off of that, the last thing that bugs me, (I promise), and the thing that bugs my mom the most actually, is that the system does not allow for students to complete their paperwork independently based on their low expectations. When the monthly report form was distributed through email it was attached as a pdf file. As we know, pdfs aren't the best with screenreaders, and more importantly aren't editable. The state clearly intended for these forms to be printed and filled out with a pen or pencil, which does not align with independence as most blind students in the voc rehab system would not be able to do this without sighted assistance. I emailed my councelor and asked if it would be possible to get a word copy of the document so I could fill it out myself. Like the braille and O&M emails, that message did not get a response. This isn't the first time I noticed it; when I was a sophomore in high school and just getting set up with voc rehab they would send print forms about job interest and searching to my house. A friend and I went to our councelor (a different one from the one we have now), and asked if we could get text or word files instead of the print copies and she didn't really understand why. We explained that we obviously couldn't read the files ourselves or write on them, but using our notetakers or laptops we could complete them if given an accessible copy, we even told her she could just email us the file as an attachment. She really didn't know what to do about this. It boggles me how a program designed to train blind students to be competent and independent adults won't even allow them to do something so simple as their paperwork on their own. Are their expectations of blind students really that low, and if so them giving money to college students who do the bulk of their work independently is hypocritical. (If they even know that we do most of our work independently without someone to hold our hand and scribe all our assignments for us). My mom thinks that the system is just still stuck in the 80's or 90's when not many blind kids successfully completed college, as opposed to now when a lot of them do, but that is no excuse. If they're that stuck in the past then something far worse than their low expectations is wrong with the system. Sorry for the venting rant, but if any of you have thoughts or commentary on this or your own situations please feel free to compare and write about it. I'm really interested in hearing other people's experiences. Thanks, -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From mistydbradley at gmail.com Tue Mar 26 23:04:16 2013 From: mistydbradley at gmail.com (Misty Dawn Bradley) Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 19:04:16 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? References: <005b01ce29a9$de39e0f0$9aada2d0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, In some states, such as North Carolina, DSS helps you get in contact with a mobility instructor, and you don't have to have an open VR case to use the instructor. DSS in NC also offers a social worker for the blind in each county that will come to your house and label things, such as appliances and give you daily living items, such as marking supplies and talking watches. The social worker for the blind here got me in touch with the mobility instructor, and now I have her number, so whenever I need mobility I can call and set up an appointment, so I don't have to go through VR, although if you do have an open case with VR you can get more, such as better canes or whatever you need. Hth, Misty ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Monday, March 25, 2013 6:41 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? >I didn't no that dss would nelp you with mobility. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman > Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 4:27 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? > > kaiti: > First, it is obvious that you live in a state that has a general rehab > agency rather than one dealing specifically with blindness. This is > unfortunate as you have discovered. However, knowing what you need and > want > and being able to cogently articulate your needs will go a long way toward > fulfilling them. You've seem this in the case of the Perkins > braillewriter. > Second, why do you need an O&M specialist to show you around campus? Could > not a friend or family member do the job? When you graduate and enter the > world of work, you won't have O&M instructors at your beck and call. It is > definitely helpful to develop the skill of learning new routes and places > with minimal assistance. This is the essence of structured discovery > learning. Could your DSS office help? This way, you wouldn't have to worry > about rehab at all. > > Mike Freeman > sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 26, 2013, at 12:49, Kaiti Shelton > wrote: > >> Hi all, >> >> Okay, so I'll confess that part of the reason I'm writing this email >> is to vent about my current circumstances, but more importantly than >> that I am interested in seeing how other states or parts of the >> country run their voc rehab services. I apologize if this email >> sounds venty, as in order to explain what I'm talking about I'll need >> to give specific examples, but I am really interested in hearing your >> thoughts on the matter based on your own experiences. >> >> The thing that makes me the most uncomfortable with the voc rehab >> system in my state is that the councelors don't necessarily know much >> about blindness, let alone what a blind student truly needs to be >> successful. My councelor fills her job capacity in terms of knowing >> how to do the paperwork, but my own mother has told me that when they >> chat as I'm signing papers and my mom brings up something relatively >> fundamental like a conversation about navigating campus or something, >> she'll notice that what she says goes over my councelor's head. This >> has caused a few concerning events in terms of the authorizations that >> have been made for me. In December for example I requested >> orientation and mobility training so I could go through my second >> semester schedule, as there were a few buildings I would need to use >> that I had not been to yet. I got in touch with my O&M guy and we >> planned to set up a time in January. I emailed my councelor and told >> her this, but then my O&M specialist emailed me back and asked if I >> would be on campus after the first semester ended in December, because >> that was when training was authorized. I had to email my councelor >> and tell her that the reason for going with January was that campus >> closed the last day of finals week, and a few days prior to the start >> of the second term I would be back on campus and most of the academic >> buildings would be reopened. Another time for this same semester I >> requested a Perkins Brailler, specifically specifying that the >> traditional braillers were much sturdier and more reliable than the >> plastic ones and justifying my request. When I got a call from my >> vendor she first informed me that the braillers were out of stock >> until February, half way through my semester, and then asked me what >> color I wanted. I told her that the new brailler was not what I >> thought I was getting and she got in touch with the councelor. I >> ended up getting a traditional anyway on the grounds that although the >> new generations were out of stock, there were plenty traditionals > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Mon Mar 25 23:29:02 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2013 19:29:02 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? In-Reply-To: References: <005b01ce29a9$de39e0f0$9aada2d0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <007601ce29b0$89a94d80$9cfbe880$@gmail.com> Okay. Outstanding. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Misty Dawn Bradley Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 7:04 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? Hi, In some states, such as North Carolina, DSS helps you get in contact with a mobility instructor, and you don't have to have an open VR case to use the instructor. DSS in NC also offers a social worker for the blind in each county that will come to your house and label things, such as appliances and give you daily living items, such as marking supplies and talking watches. The social worker for the blind here got me in touch with the mobility instructor, and now I have her number, so whenever I need mobility I can call and set up an appointment, so I don't have to go through VR, although if you do have an open case with VR you can get more, such as better canes or whatever you need. Hth, Misty ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Monday, March 25, 2013 6:41 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? >I didn't no that dss would nelp you with mobility. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman > Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 4:27 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? > > kaiti: > First, it is obvious that you live in a state that has a general rehab > agency rather than one dealing specifically with blindness. This is > unfortunate as you have discovered. However, knowing what you need and > want > and being able to cogently articulate your needs will go a long way toward > fulfilling them. You've seem this in the case of the Perkins > braillewriter. > Second, why do you need an O&M specialist to show you around campus? Could > not a friend or family member do the job? When you graduate and enter the > world of work, you won't have O&M instructors at your beck and call. It is > definitely helpful to develop the skill of learning new routes and places > with minimal assistance. This is the essence of structured discovery > learning. Could your DSS office help? This way, you wouldn't have to worry > about rehab at all. > > Mike Freeman > sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 26, 2013, at 12:49, Kaiti Shelton > wrote: > >> Hi all, >> >> Okay, so I'll confess that part of the reason I'm writing this email >> is to vent about my current circumstances, but more importantly than >> that I am interested in seeing how other states or parts of the >> country run their voc rehab services. I apologize if this email >> sounds venty, as in order to explain what I'm talking about I'll need >> to give specific examples, but I am really interested in hearing your >> thoughts on the matter based on your own experiences. >> >> The thing that makes me the most uncomfortable with the voc rehab >> system in my state is that the councelors don't necessarily know much >> about blindness, let alone what a blind student truly needs to be >> successful. My councelor fills her job capacity in terms of knowing >> how to do the paperwork, but my own mother has told me that when they >> chat as I'm signing papers and my mom brings up something relatively >> fundamental like a conversation about navigating campus or something, >> she'll notice that what she says goes over my councelor's head. This >> has caused a few concerning events in terms of the authorizations that >> have been made for me. In December for example I requested >> orientation and mobility training so I could go through my second >> semester schedule, as there were a few buildings I would need to use >> that I had not been to yet. I got in touch with my O&M guy and we >> planned to set up a time in January. I emailed my councelor and told >> her this, but then my O&M specialist emailed me back and asked if I >> would be on campus after the first semester ended in December, because >> that was when training was authorized. I had to email my councelor >> and tell her that the reason for going with January was that campus >> closed the last day of finals week, and a few days prior to the start >> of the second term I would be back on campus and most of the academic >> buildings would be reopened. Another time for this same semester I >> requested a Perkins Brailler, specifically specifying that the >> traditional braillers were much sturdier and more reliable than the >> plastic ones and justifying my request. When I got a call from my >> vendor she first informed me that the braillers were out of stock >> until February, half way through my semester, and then asked me what >> color I wanted. I told her that the new brailler was not what I >> thought I was getting and she got in touch with the councelor. I >> ended up getting a traditional anyway on the grounds that although the >> new generations were out of stock, there were plenty traditionals > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmail.co m _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From jsoro620 at gmail.com Wed Mar 27 00:15:31 2013 From: jsoro620 at gmail.com (Joe) Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 20:15:31 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Word of Mouth Message-ID: <01b001ce2a80$3249c940$96dd5bc0$@gmail.com> The next series of posts will concentrate on job application preparation: cover letters, résumés, interviews, etc. Kicking off the series is an article by Mary Fernandez--originally published in the Fall 2012 issue of the Student Slate, a publication of the National Association of Blind Students. She describes the culmination of hard work and how it paid off in landing a job without the aid of fancy technology. Here, published in full with permission by the author, is Mary’s story: Word of Mouth By Mary Fernandez >From the Editor: Mary Fernandez recently graduated from Emory, and found a job in these tough economic times. Here is her story of how she got that job, and her suggestions for how we can all do the same. Read more: http://joeorozco.com/blog_word_of_mouth From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Wed Mar 27 00:41:43 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 00:41:43 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? In-Reply-To: <005d01ce29a9$fd1867d0$f7493770$@gmail.com> References: , <005d01ce29a9$fd1867d0$f7493770$@gmail.com> Message-ID: I already have one! It's an Acer with Windows Vista, and Jaws 10.0, running IE8. Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of justin williams [justin.williams2 at gmail.com] Sent: Monday, March 25, 2013 5:42 PM To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? They should have at least given you a lap top. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joshua Lester Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 4:00 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? Hi Kaiti! My Vocational Rehab is the same way! They told me, when I requested a notetaker, that I didn't need it, so they gave me a desktop computer! What good is that going to be in a classroom? Finally, (after 5 years of dealing with them,) they decided to get me a Braille Note Apex! I haven't gotten it yet, but I'm ready for it! The only way to change the system is to infiltrate it! The best counselors for blind students, are blind people! I'm majoring in Behavioral Health Technology! I'll try to get a job with my state VR, and straighten them out! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 2:49 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? Hi all, Okay, so I'll confess that part of the reason I'm writing this email is to vent about my current circumstances, but more importantly than that I am interested in seeing how other states or parts of the country run their voc rehab services. I apologize if this email sounds venty, as in order to explain what I'm talking about I'll need to give specific examples, but I am really interested in hearing your thoughts on the matter based on your own experiences. The thing that makes me the most uncomfortable with the voc rehab system in my state is that the councelors don't necessarily know much about blindness, let alone what a blind student truly needs to be successful. My councelor fills her job capacity in terms of knowing how to do the paperwork, but my own mother has told me that when they chat as I'm signing papers and my mom brings up something relatively fundamental like a conversation about navigating campus or something, she'll notice that what she says goes over my councelor's head. This has caused a few concerning events in terms of the authorizations that have been made for me. In December for example I requested orientation and mobility training so I could go through my second semester schedule, as there were a few buildings I would need to use that I had not been to yet. I got in touch with my O&M guy and we planned to set up a time in January. I emailed my councelor and told her this, but then my O&M specialist emailed me back and asked if I would be on campus after the first semester ended in December, because that was when training was authorized. I had to email my councelor and tell her that the reason for going with January was that campus closed the last day of finals week, and a few days prior to the start of the second term I would be back on campus and most of the academic buildings would be reopened. Another time for this same semester I requested a Perkins Brailler, specifically specifying that the traditional braillers were much sturdier and more reliable than the plastic ones and justifying my request. When I got a call from my vendor she first informed me that the braillers were out of stock until February, half way through my semester, and then asked me what color I wanted. I told her that the new brailler was not what I thought I was getting and she got in touch with the councelor. I ended up getting a traditional anyway on the grounds that although the new generations were out of stock, there were plenty traditionals available, and I needed one as I am taking math this semester. I know the system isn't there to grant my request, but it bothered me that I justified my reasoning why for both events and that my councelor, who doesn't necessarily know what I need, ignored it and wrote authorizations which would not work. The kicker, which really shows that the councelors don't know much about blindness or the equipment students use, is after I got off the phone with the vendor, I suddenly wondered if the councelor authorized braille paper to go along with it. I called the vendor back and found that paper was not included in the authorization, so the vendor had to call the councelor back and get braille paper added so I could actually use the brailler. I mean, to anyone who really knows the basics of blindness, ordering paper for the pencil-equivalent brailler seems like a no-brainer. I'm wondering why if the state employs people who aren't necessarily knowledgeable about the consumers they serve why they don't make an effort to educate and inform the councelors so they can better meet their consumer's needs? The other thing that bugs me is the communication problem. I understand that councelors are busy, that some travel between offices, and that because of these things they're not always easy to get ahold of. What I don't understand are a few of the communication issues whichh could be easily solved. My councelor and I often play phone tag; once in the summer I called her during the early afternoon hours and when my call was returned a few days later it was before 8:00 in the morning before I was even out of bed. I tried using emails instead, thinking that she probably has computer access more frequently. Sometimes when I send her paperwork I'll also take the opportunity to ask for clarification. I've found that when she does respond to receiving the paperwork she usually doesn't answer my question from the same email. Other times, like when I sent those emails about the brailler and mobility authorization in December, I may not get a response at all. Repetition of paperwork is another frustrating issue. In Ohio they've just started making students fill out these forms once a month which report our major, number of credits, where we're going to school, and how much class was missed. I understand the need for this, as perhaps there were issues when students who dropped classes or changed their plans didn't report to their councelors as they are supposed to, but if someone were to lie or withhold information from their councelor why would they not lie on the form as well? And to those of us who are solid students who do what we're supposed to, don't skip class and let our councelors know about the major changes, it's just an inconvenience that is preaching to the choir. We also have to do these interviews with a professional in our field. I've done two so far, once over the summer for the pre-college interview and again last semester. This semester one of my music therapy professors is trained in a specific type of therapy model that interests me. The interview sheet we have to go by has basic questions about the salary, what the job outlook is like, etc. I asked my councelor if it would be okay for me to come up with my own interview questions which would build off of what I've learned so far and that would take advantage of the opportunity to talk to this person about their specific training. She replied and said we had to use the form every time. To me, this seems really redundant. I don't see the point in asking different people the same questions and coming up with very similar, if not the same answers; if we're going to do that, then why not just use the same interview each time. I also don't see the point of doing it if gaining different perspectives on the field isn't an available option. I was talking to my mom about this, and although she reiterated that although the system is dumb all students have to do it, she agreed with me and stated that one of the systems worst flaws is that the expectation is so low that they don't want you to learn from the things you do through them, they just want the paperwork. Seguing off of that, the last thing that bugs me, (I promise), and the thing that bugs my mom the most actually, is that the system does not allow for students to complete their paperwork independently based on their low expectations. When the monthly report form was distributed through email it was attached as a pdf file. As we know, pdfs aren't the best with screenreaders, and more importantly aren't editable. The state clearly intended for these forms to be printed and filled out with a pen or pencil, which does not align with independence as most blind students in the voc rehab system would not be able to do this without sighted assistance. I emailed my councelor and asked if it would be possible to get a word copy of the document so I could fill it out myself. Like the braille and O&M emails, that message did not get a response. This isn't the first time I noticed it; when I was a sophomore in high school and just getting set up with voc rehab they would send print forms about job interest and searching to my house. A friend and I went to our councelor (a different one from the one we have now), and asked if we could get text or word files instead of the print copies and she didn't really understand why. We explained that we obviously couldn't read the files ourselves or write on them, but using our notetakers or laptops we could complete them if given an accessible copy, we even told her she could just email us the file as an attachment. She really didn't know what to do about this. It boggles me how a program designed to train blind students to be competent and independent adults won't even allow them to do something so simple as their paperwork on their own. Are their expectations of blind students really that low, and if so them giving money to college students who do the bulk of their work independently is hypocritical. (If they even know that we do most of our work independently without someone to hold our hand and scribe all our assignments for us). My mom thinks that the system is just still stuck in the 80's or 90's when not many blind kids successfully completed college, as opposed to now when a lot of them do, but that is no excuse. If they're that stuck in the past then something far worse than their low expectations is wrong with the system. Sorry for the venting rant, but if any of you have thoughts or commentary on this or your own situations please feel free to compare and write about it. I'm really interested in hearing other people's experiences. Thanks, -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Wed Mar 27 00:45:34 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 00:45:34 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? In-Reply-To: References: , Message-ID: Mike: I have a friend in Minnisota, who is originally from Ohio. She left Ohio, and moved to MN, because they have better services! I'm thinking about moving up north as well, because our services in Arkansas are pretty lame! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Mike Freeman [k7uij at panix.com] Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 3:26 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? kaiti: First, it is obvious that you live in a state that has a general rehab agency rather than one dealing specifically with blindness. This is unfortunate as you have discovered. However, knowing what you need and want and being able to cogently articulate your needs will go a long way toward fulfilling them. You've seem this in the case of the Perkins braillewriter. Second, why do you need an O&M specialist to show you around campus? Could not a friend or family member do the job? When you graduate and enter the world of work, you won't have O&M instructors at your beck and call. It is definitely helpful to develop the skill of learning new routes and places with minimal assistance. This is the essence of structured discovery learning. Could your DSS office help? This way, you wouldn't have to worry about rehab at all. Mike Freeman sent from my iPhone On Mar 26, 2013, at 12:49, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Hi all, > > Okay, so I'll confess that part of the reason I'm writing this email > is to vent about my current circumstances, but more importantly than > that I am interested in seeing how other states or parts of the > country run their voc rehab services. I apologize if this email > sounds venty, as in order to explain what I'm talking about I'll need > to give specific examples, but I am really interested in hearing your > thoughts on the matter based on your own experiences. > > The thing that makes me the most uncomfortable with the voc rehab > system in my state is that the councelors don't necessarily know much > about blindness, let alone what a blind student truly needs to be > successful. My councelor fills her job capacity in terms of knowing > how to do the paperwork, but my own mother has told me that when they > chat as I'm signing papers and my mom brings up something relatively > fundamental like a conversation about navigating campus or something, > she'll notice that what she says goes over my councelor's head. This > has caused a few concerning events in terms of the authorizations that > have been made for me. In December for example I requested > orientation and mobility training so I could go through my second > semester schedule, as there were a few buildings I would need to use > that I had not been to yet. I got in touch with my O&M guy and we > planned to set up a time in January. I emailed my councelor and told > her this, but then my O&M specialist emailed me back and asked if I > would be on campus after the first semester ended in December, because > that was when training was authorized. I had to email my councelor > and tell her that the reason for going with January was that campus > closed the last day of finals week, and a few days prior to the start > of the second term I would be back on campus and most of the academic > buildings would be reopened. Another time for this same semester I > requested a Perkins Brailler, specifically specifying that the > traditional braillers were much sturdier and more reliable than the > plastic ones and justifying my request. When I got a call from my > vendor she first informed me that the braillers were out of stock > until February, half way through my semester, and then asked me what > color I wanted. I told her that the new brailler was not what I > thought I was getting and she got in touch with the councelor. I > ended up getting a traditional anyway on the grounds that although the > new generations were out of stock, there were plenty traditionals _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com From kwakmiso at aol.com Wed Mar 27 02:52:59 2013 From: kwakmiso at aol.com (Miso Kwak) Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 22:52:59 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [nabs-l] Fair/appropriate accomodations for assignments and tests involving videos In-Reply-To: <005b01ce29a9$de39e0f0$9aada2d0$@gmail.com> References: <005b01ce29a9$de39e0f0$9aada2d0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <8CFF8AD5361A36D-1894-12ACD@webmail-d300.sysops.aol.com> Being the only blind student in classroom, there are times when I feel like class activities are not suited for the visually impaired. There are just some times when I strongly feel like teachers don't consider enough about the only one blind student in his/her classrooms. One of those occasions is watching a video and doing follow-up activities. Currently, I am enrolled in Spanish 3 Honors class. In the class recently, we watched a movie and had to do 3 worksheets and a quiz in the end. The movie was entirely spoken in Spanish. There was English subtitle on the screen. When the class started watching the movie, teacher asked one of my friends to explain the storyline of the movie, so she did. I didn't understand thoroughly but I just grasped what was going on... I didn't do most of the worksheets because they didn't worth many points and I frankly didn't know what to write. If I were desperate for the points, I probably would have bs-ed. The teacher reviewed the movie and I asked some questions. Afterward I felt like I had a better understanding of the movie. Then there was a quiz. I felt prepared goinginto the quiz but when I took the quiz I was shocked because there were so much more than I previously had thought. For example, one of the questions asked who died in a ship. I didn't even know someone had died in a ship. It was just one of those details which neither my friend nor the teacher mentioned. There were couple more questions that made me realize I had missed so much. I am debating whether to confront my teacher about this matter or not. If you were in my situation, would you tell her that the test was unfair? When you have assignments involving videos what kinds of accomodations do you have? My aide who usually types materials into doc documents suggested she types the subtitle, I read the subtitle, and retake the test, which I think is reasonable... Miso From kaybaycar at gmail.com Wed Mar 27 03:02:27 2013 From: kaybaycar at gmail.com (Julie McGinnity) Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 22:02:27 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Fair/appropriate accomodations for assignments and tests involving videos In-Reply-To: <8CFF8AD5361A36D-1894-12ACD@webmail-d300.sysops.aol.com> References: <005b01ce29a9$de39e0f0$9aada2d0$@gmail.com> <8CFF8AD5361A36D-1894-12ACD@webmail-d300.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: Hi Miso, As a German major, I have been confronted with the issues of videos in the classroom as well. There are a few things you can do. To be honest, whatever you do, you won't get the same thing out of the video as the others do, but you can try to get accomidations to make it better. First, you can get a friend to read you the subtitles, which is something you seem to be doing already. This will be difficult because your friend will probably try to read you the subtitles and explain the movie at the same time. You will miss things. The other thing you can do is get your teacher to provide you with a detailed summary of the movie ahead of time, so you have an understanding of the plot of the movie. I have found this to be helpful. I have noticed that movies are one of the biggest ways we are left behind as blind students. It is difficult to get accomidations to fully supplement what the sighted students are learning from a movie because either we miss it completely due to lack of description or we learn it after the fact. On 3/26/13, Miso Kwak wrote: > Being the only blind student in classroom, there are times when I feel > like class activities are not suited for the visually impaired. > There are just some times when I strongly feel like teachers don't > consider enough about the only one blind student in his/her classrooms. > One of those occasions is watching a video and doing follow-up > activities. > Currently, I am enrolled in Spanish 3 Honors class. In the class > recently, we watched a movie and had to do 3 worksheets and a quiz in > the end. > The movie was entirely spoken in Spanish. There was English subtitle on > the screen. > When the class started watching the movie, teacher asked one of my > friends to explain the storyline of the movie, so she did. > I didn't understand thoroughly but I just grasped what was going on... > I didn't do most of the worksheets because they didn't worth many > points and I frankly didn't know what to write. If I were desperate for > the points, I probably would have bs-ed. > The teacher reviewed the movie and I asked some questions. Afterward I > felt like I had a better understanding of the movie. > Then there was a quiz. I felt prepared goinginto the quiz but when I > took the quiz I was shocked because there were so much more than I > previously had thought. > For example, one of the questions asked who died in a ship. I didn't > even know someone had died in a ship. It was just one of those details > which neither my friend nor the teacher mentioned. > There were couple more questions that made me realize I had missed so > much. > I am debating whether to confront my teacher about this matter or not. > If you were in my situation, would you tell her that the test was > unfair? > When you have assignments involving videos what kinds of accomodations > do you have? > My aide who usually types materials into doc documents suggested she > types the subtitle, I read the subtitle, and retake the test, which I > think is reasonable... > Miso > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kaybaycar%40gmail.com > -- Julie McG National Association of Guide dog Users board member, National Federation of the Blind performing arts division secretary, Missouri Association of Guide dog Users President, and Guiding Eyes for the Blind graduate 2008 "For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that everyone who believes in him may not perish but may have eternal life." John 3:16 From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Wed Mar 27 03:30:55 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 23:30:55 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Fair/appropriate accomodations for assignments and tests involving videos In-Reply-To: References: <005b01ce29a9$de39e0f0$9aada2d0$@gmail.com> <8CFF8AD5361A36D-1894-12ACD@webmail-d300.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: Hi, I've had similar issues both in Spanish and other classes. I like your aid's suggestion of giving you the subtitles in a document for you to read along with the Spanish; I did something similar with spanish videos myself. If you choose to have a friend sit with you and explain the movie, make sure they're someone who can fluently read the subtitles. Explain that they can explain things about the movie that aren't covered in the dialogue, but that they should wait for an opportune time to do theese like when no one is talking and there are no subtitles to be read. If those opportunities are scarce, have them run through the plot with you after the movie when they're not worried about cramming in the explanation along with the subtitles. Ask them to be detailed. They don't need to give you every single bit of information, but something as significant as someone dying on a ship might be worth mentioning. If you choose this route you can also jot down questions on a notetaker as you're watching the movie so you can go over them later. I did a mix of these methods last semester; for my intro to the university class we had to watch a few movies, one documentary and one fictional film about a violin protegy, about the music from China. Both times I had the TA for my class sit with me and read the Chinese subtitles. Luckily, she's a very observant student and a great reader, and I actually didn't even have to tell her when to describe things as she naturally felt the best time to describe what happened in the previous sceen would be during a musical part of the movie when no one was talking. In such cases, you might get all the information you need just because the person reading to you is awesome at it. I'd definitely go to your teacher about it though. I'm sure if you explain the situation they would at least throw out the questions you got wrong or didn't answer because you couldn't have answered them correctly from your test to make it fair, especially if the teacher didn't even remember to tell you all the things you would be tested on. Good luck. On 3/26/13, Julie McGinnity wrote: > Hi Miso, > > As a German major, I have been confronted with the issues of videos in > the classroom as well. There are a few things you can do. To be > honest, whatever you do, you won't get the same thing out of the video > as the others do, but you can try to get accomidations to make it > better. > > First, you can get a friend to read you the subtitles, which is > something you seem to be doing already. This will be difficult > because your friend will probably try to read you the subtitles and > explain the movie at the same time. You will miss things. The other > thing you can do is get your teacher to provide you with a detailed > summary of the movie ahead of time, so you have an understanding of > the plot of the movie. I have found this to be helpful. > > I have noticed that movies are one of the biggest ways we are left > behind as blind students. It is difficult to get accomidations to > fully supplement what the sighted students are learning from a movie > because either we miss it completely due to lack of description or we > learn it after the fact. > > On 3/26/13, Miso Kwak wrote: >> Being the only blind student in classroom, there are times when I feel >> like class activities are not suited for the visually impaired. >> There are just some times when I strongly feel like teachers don't >> consider enough about the only one blind student in his/her classrooms. >> One of those occasions is watching a video and doing follow-up >> activities. >> Currently, I am enrolled in Spanish 3 Honors class. In the class >> recently, we watched a movie and had to do 3 worksheets and a quiz in >> the end. >> The movie was entirely spoken in Spanish. There was English subtitle on >> the screen. >> When the class started watching the movie, teacher asked one of my >> friends to explain the storyline of the movie, so she did. >> I didn't understand thoroughly but I just grasped what was going on... >> I didn't do most of the worksheets because they didn't worth many >> points and I frankly didn't know what to write. If I were desperate for >> the points, I probably would have bs-ed. >> The teacher reviewed the movie and I asked some questions. Afterward I >> felt like I had a better understanding of the movie. >> Then there was a quiz. I felt prepared goinginto the quiz but when I >> took the quiz I was shocked because there were so much more than I >> previously had thought. >> For example, one of the questions asked who died in a ship. I didn't >> even know someone had died in a ship. It was just one of those details >> which neither my friend nor the teacher mentioned. >> There were couple more questions that made me realize I had missed so >> much. >> I am debating whether to confront my teacher about this matter or not. >> If you were in my situation, would you tell her that the test was >> unfair? >> When you have assignments involving videos what kinds of accomodations >> do you have? >> My aide who usually types materials into doc documents suggested she >> types the subtitle, I read the subtitle, and retake the test, which I >> think is reasonable... >> Miso >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kaybaycar%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Julie McG > National Association of Guide dog Users board member, National > Federation of the Blind performing arts division secretary, > Missouri Association of Guide dog Users President, > and Guiding Eyes for the Blind graduate 2008 > "For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that > everyone who believes in him may not perish but may have eternal > life." > John 3:16 > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From nimerjaber1 at gmail.com Wed Mar 27 03:44:04 2013 From: nimerjaber1 at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Nimer_M=2E_Jaber=2C_IC=B3?=) Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 22:44:04 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Kaiti and all, First, I'm going to send you an email off-list that you can choose to respond or not respond to. If you are at least interested, please take a look at it. Second, one huge problem with society today is that we're all me-based. I want an O&M instructor. I want a counselor to talk to and that will provide me with not only an assistive blindness device (braille writer), but also the paper that goes along with it. I mean, paper isn't that expensive and sighted students don't have paper and pencils bought for them? Oops, nope? Never mind, we're blind. Sorry about that. Anyway ... My point to the above comments wasn't to bash you Kaiti. Not at all. It was to get some heads thinking about the process that is known as VR and the amount of waste that goes into it. If the NFB truly fought for independence, then they would be working to legally reform the rehab system if not abolish it completely in hopes of getting some set of standards that establish a blind subset of rehab with counselors specifically trained in the blindness field that do not have to meet the same requirements as the rest of rehab and those that work for them. Any individual that goes through some sort of blindness training would know what a braille writer is. Anyone that goes through blindness training would know that blind people require accessible materials when speaking with and providing services for their clients/consumers... Oh, and by the way I can't think of a more offensive word. "consumer"! Ha! And do we all know who pays the baboons that claim to help the blind find jobs? Oh yes, that's right... the blind people that actually work! Oh, and everyone else, sighted or blind that pays into the system. Hmmmm. That brings up another point... I happen to know your counselor. If I were to take as many vacation days as she does, and if I never responded to emails or didn't bother to read them enough to comprehend the point of those emails, then should I be serving taxpayers? Hmmm... Logic tells me um, no. Which means that there should be an oversight process to get rid of incompetence that are the agencies that claim to service the blind in Cincinnati, along with the sorry excuse of an individual that serves the youth's rehab needs. Ok, enough rambles. Time to actually get off my soap box and be productive ... So, what is my solution to all of this? Kaiti, you and not your mother needs to be up that counselor's butt every spare moment that you have. Your mother is of course able to support you on the sidelines, but her time of standing up for you with rehab is over. They won't listen to one word she says. And it doesn't stop there. Every single time that you receive an email with a response that has nothing to do with what your question was, send your original email and her response to her supervisor, and follow the appeals process found in the handbook that they like to give out. Request a counselor change. And get as much support behind you as you can from your university and from national organizations such as the NFB. Because the NFB truly does do a lot to help out the blind. Joshua, I don't believe that the only good rehab counselors are blind ones. In fact, I've met some sorry ones. I've met one that I would not trust to tie my shoe, let alone teach me anything or prepare me for the real world. Sorry, but I strongly believe that sighted people can do just as well as the blind ones. But it takes some talent, and it takes a determination to always keep your mind open to learn. Because the second the job becomes just another "job" or the second they figure out that they know every possible thing there is to know, then they become terrible counselors. Joshua, if you believe that you can do better than the counselors currently out there, then I wish you lots and lots of luck. Unfortunately, the system is what's broken, and not necessarily the counselors. I agree that there are some very poor sorry counselors. But the system in which they have to work is even more broken. I just hope that doesn't discourage you from doing your all and putting a smile on the faces of the people you will serve. Just don't be too surprised when you're not able to do everything you set out to do. At any rate, it's getting late and Nimer is done rambling now. If anyone has any further questions or wishes to discuss this with me privately, please give me a call at 5136465573 after 6:00 PM eastern, or shoot me an email to nimerjaber1 at gmail.com at any time. These kinds of topics interest me, and I am deeply saddened that many youth, particularly in Ohio, end up stuck in a system that does more harm than good. Laters all! On 3/26/13, Joshua Lester wrote: > Mike: > I have a friend in Minnisota, who is originally from Ohio. > She left Ohio, and moved to MN, because they have better services! > I'm thinking about moving up north as well, because our services in Arkansas > are pretty lame! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Mike Freeman > [k7uij at panix.com] > Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 3:26 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? > > kaiti: > First, it is obvious that you live in a state that has a general rehab > agency rather than one dealing specifically with blindness. This is > unfortunate as you have discovered. However, knowing what you need and want > and being able to cogently articulate your needs will go a long way toward > fulfilling them. You've seem this in the case of the Perkins braillewriter. > Second, why do you need an O&M specialist to show you around campus? Could > not a friend or family member do the job? When you graduate and enter the > world of work, you won't have O&M instructors at your beck and call. It is > definitely helpful to develop the skill of learning new routes and places > with minimal assistance. This is the essence of structured discovery > learning. Could your DSS office help? This way, you wouldn't have to worry > about rehab at all. > > Mike Freeman > sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 26, 2013, at 12:49, Kaiti Shelton > wrote: > >> Hi all, >> >> Okay, so I'll confess that part of the reason I'm writing this email >> is to vent about my current circumstances, but more importantly than >> that I am interested in seeing how other states or parts of the >> country run their voc rehab services. I apologize if this email >> sounds venty, as in order to explain what I'm talking about I'll need >> to give specific examples, but I am really interested in hearing your >> thoughts on the matter based on your own experiences. >> >> The thing that makes me the most uncomfortable with the voc rehab >> system in my state is that the councelors don't necessarily know much >> about blindness, let alone what a blind student truly needs to be >> successful. My councelor fills her job capacity in terms of knowing >> how to do the paperwork, but my own mother has told me that when they >> chat as I'm signing papers and my mom brings up something relatively >> fundamental like a conversation about navigating campus or something, >> she'll notice that what she says goes over my councelor's head. This >> has caused a few concerning events in terms of the authorizations that >> have been made for me. In December for example I requested >> orientation and mobility training so I could go through my second >> semester schedule, as there were a few buildings I would need to use >> that I had not been to yet. I got in touch with my O&M guy and we >> planned to set up a time in January. I emailed my councelor and told >> her this, but then my O&M specialist emailed me back and asked if I >> would be on campus after the first semester ended in December, because >> that was when training was authorized. I had to email my councelor >> and tell her that the reason for going with January was that campus >> closed the last day of finals week, and a few days prior to the start >> of the second term I would be back on campus and most of the academic >> buildings would be reopened. Another time for this same semester I >> requested a Perkins Brailler, specifically specifying that the >> traditional braillers were much sturdier and more reliable than the >> plastic ones and justifying my request. When I got a call from my >> vendor she first informed me that the braillers were out of stock >> until February, half way through my semester, and then asked me what >> color I wanted. I told her that the new brailler was not what I >> thought I was getting and she got in touch with the councelor. I >> ended up getting a traditional anyway on the grounds that although the >> new generations were out of stock, there were plenty traditionals > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nimerjaber1%40gmail.com > -- Cordially, Nimer Jaber Please take the time to read this signature completely as it contains some information about the email you have just read and all attachments contained within as well as some valuable resources and methods for contacting me if you have any questions or wish to talk. The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient, please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents by anyone other than the intended recipient may result in civil or criminal action. I have checked this email and all corresponding attachments for security threats. However, security of your machine is up to you. Thanks. Registered Linux User 529141. http://counter.li.org/ Vinux testing and documentation coordinator To get more information about a free and accessible operating system, please click here: http://www.vinuxproject.org To find out about a free and versatile screen reader for windows XP and above, please click here: http://www.nvda-project.org You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news. Check out my blog related to technology by clicking here: http://nimertech.blogspot.com To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (720) (251-4530) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly. Thank you, and have a great day! From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Tue Mar 26 03:49:12 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2013 23:49:12 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000b01ce29d4$e18c58c0$a4a50a40$@gmail.com> I'll be giving you a call some time. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Nimer M. Jaber, IC³ Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 11:44 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? Kaiti and all, First, I'm going to send you an email off-list that you can choose to respond or not respond to. If you are at least interested, please take a look at it. Second, one huge problem with society today is that we're all me-based. I want an O&M instructor. I want a counselor to talk to and that will provide me with not only an assistive blindness device (braille writer), but also the paper that goes along with it. I mean, paper isn't that expensive and sighted students don't have paper and pencils bought for them? Oops, nope? Never mind, we're blind. Sorry about that. Anyway ... My point to the above comments wasn't to bash you Kaiti. Not at all. It was to get some heads thinking about the process that is known as VR and the amount of waste that goes into it. If the NFB truly fought for independence, then they would be working to legally reform the rehab system if not abolish it completely in hopes of getting some set of standards that establish a blind subset of rehab with counselors specifically trained in the blindness field that do not have to meet the same requirements as the rest of rehab and those that work for them. Any individual that goes through some sort of blindness training would know what a braille writer is. Anyone that goes through blindness training would know that blind people require accessible materials when speaking with and providing services for their clients/consumers... Oh, and by the way I can't think of a more offensive word. "consumer"! Ha! And do we all know who pays the baboons that claim to help the blind find jobs? Oh yes, that's right... the blind people that actually work! Oh, and everyone else, sighted or blind that pays into the system. Hmmmm. That brings up another point... I happen to know your counselor. If I were to take as many vacation days as she does, and if I never responded to emails or didn't bother to read them enough to comprehend the point of those emails, then should I be serving taxpayers? Hmmm... Logic tells me um, no. Which means that there should be an oversight process to get rid of incompetence that are the agencies that claim to service the blind in Cincinnati, along with the sorry excuse of an individual that serves the youth's rehab needs. Ok, enough rambles. Time to actually get off my soap box and be productive ... So, what is my solution to all of this? Kaiti, you and not your mother needs to be up that counselor's butt every spare moment that you have. Your mother is of course able to support you on the sidelines, but her time of standing up for you with rehab is over. They won't listen to one word she says. And it doesn't stop there. Every single time that you receive an email with a response that has nothing to do with what your question was, send your original email and her response to her supervisor, and follow the appeals process found in the handbook that they like to give out. Request a counselor change. And get as much support behind you as you can from your university and from national organizations such as the NFB. Because the NFB truly does do a lot to help out the blind. Joshua, I don't believe that the only good rehab counselors are blind ones. In fact, I've met some sorry ones. I've met one that I would not trust to tie my shoe, let alone teach me anything or prepare me for the real world. Sorry, but I strongly believe that sighted people can do just as well as the blind ones. But it takes some talent, and it takes a determination to always keep your mind open to learn. Because the second the job becomes just another "job" or the second they figure out that they know every possible thing there is to know, then they become terrible counselors. Joshua, if you believe that you can do better than the counselors currently out there, then I wish you lots and lots of luck. Unfortunately, the system is what's broken, and not necessarily the counselors. I agree that there are some very poor sorry counselors. But the system in which they have to work is even more broken. I just hope that doesn't discourage you from doing your all and putting a smile on the faces of the people you will serve. Just don't be too surprised when you're not able to do everything you set out to do. At any rate, it's getting late and Nimer is done rambling now. If anyone has any further questions or wishes to discuss this with me privately, please give me a call at 5136465573 after 6:00 PM eastern, or shoot me an email to nimerjaber1 at gmail.com at any time. These kinds of topics interest me, and I am deeply saddened that many youth, particularly in Ohio, end up stuck in a system that does more harm than good. Laters all! On 3/26/13, Joshua Lester wrote: > Mike: > I have a friend in Minnisota, who is originally from Ohio. > She left Ohio, and moved to MN, because they have better services! > I'm thinking about moving up north as well, because our services in Arkansas > are pretty lame! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Mike Freeman > [k7uij at panix.com] > Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 3:26 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? > > kaiti: > First, it is obvious that you live in a state that has a general rehab > agency rather than one dealing specifically with blindness. This is > unfortunate as you have discovered. However, knowing what you need and want > and being able to cogently articulate your needs will go a long way toward > fulfilling them. You've seem this in the case of the Perkins braillewriter. > Second, why do you need an O&M specialist to show you around campus? Could > not a friend or family member do the job? When you graduate and enter the > world of work, you won't have O&M instructors at your beck and call. It is > definitely helpful to develop the skill of learning new routes and places > with minimal assistance. This is the essence of structured discovery > learning. Could your DSS office help? This way, you wouldn't have to worry > about rehab at all. > > Mike Freeman > sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 26, 2013, at 12:49, Kaiti Shelton > wrote: > >> Hi all, >> >> Okay, so I'll confess that part of the reason I'm writing this email >> is to vent about my current circumstances, but more importantly than >> that I am interested in seeing how other states or parts of the >> country run their voc rehab services. I apologize if this email >> sounds venty, as in order to explain what I'm talking about I'll need >> to give specific examples, but I am really interested in hearing your >> thoughts on the matter based on your own experiences. >> >> The thing that makes me the most uncomfortable with the voc rehab >> system in my state is that the councelors don't necessarily know much >> about blindness, let alone what a blind student truly needs to be >> successful. My councelor fills her job capacity in terms of knowing >> how to do the paperwork, but my own mother has told me that when they >> chat as I'm signing papers and my mom brings up something relatively >> fundamental like a conversation about navigating campus or something, >> she'll notice that what she says goes over my councelor's head. This >> has caused a few concerning events in terms of the authorizations that >> have been made for me. In December for example I requested >> orientation and mobility training so I could go through my second >> semester schedule, as there were a few buildings I would need to use >> that I had not been to yet. I got in touch with my O&M guy and we >> planned to set up a time in January. I emailed my councelor and told >> her this, but then my O&M specialist emailed me back and asked if I >> would be on campus after the first semester ended in December, because >> that was when training was authorized. I had to email my councelor >> and tell her that the reason for going with January was that campus >> closed the last day of finals week, and a few days prior to the start >> of the second term I would be back on campus and most of the academic >> buildings would be reopened. Another time for this same semester I >> requested a Perkins Brailler, specifically specifying that the >> traditional braillers were much sturdier and more reliable than the >> plastic ones and justifying my request. When I got a call from my >> vendor she first informed me that the braillers were out of stock >> until February, half way through my semester, and then asked me what >> color I wanted. I told her that the new brailler was not what I >> thought I was getting and she got in touch with the councelor. I >> ended up getting a traditional anyway on the grounds that although the >> new generations were out of stock, there were plenty traditionals > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.o nmicrosoft.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nimerjaber1%40gmail.com > -- Cordially, Nimer Jaber Please take the time to read this signature completely as it contains some information about the email you have just read and all attachments contained within as well as some valuable resources and methods for contacting me if you have any questions or wish to talk. The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient, please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents by anyone other than the intended recipient may result in civil or criminal action. I have checked this email and all corresponding attachments for security threats. However, security of your machine is up to you. Thanks. Registered Linux User 529141. http://counter.li.org/ Vinux testing and documentation coordinator To get more information about a free and accessible operating system, please click here: http://www.vinuxproject.org To find out about a free and versatile screen reader for windows XP and above, please click here: http://www.nvda-project.org You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news. Check out my blog related to technology by clicking here: http://nimertech.blogspot.com To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (720) (251-4530) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly. Thank you, and have a great day! _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Wed Mar 27 04:16:40 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 00:16:40 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi all, First off, I'll respond to something Mike said just to put things into perspective. From my description I totally get why Mike would come to the conclusion that Ohio has a general rehab system, and they do as they serve a lot of different populations. However, there is a sub group called the Bureau of Services for the Visually Impaired which is supposed to specifically oversee those cases for blind and visually impaired people. I also know in my city that the two places blind people go to see their councelors are the two centers for the blind we have, so it sounds like these voc rehab councelors specialize in working for BSVI and aren't dealing with people from other populations. The structure for special attention to the needs of blind people is there, it's just shockingly not very good, as it would appear. At our Ohio State NFB convention we had someone speak about how they were working to improve the system and appreciated the feedback from NFB members so they could address the serious issues, however since basic principles of independence have not been addressed I don't really know how that is working out or what has changed since our convention in early November. I do have friends who would help me learn campus; actually, my instructor only had to show me two classrooms and the rest pertained more to locating the bus stops around campus as I'd like to start exploring the city more and be able to travel off campus some times, even if my friends and their cars aren't always available to go with me. One of my friends did show me a lot of my classes that were in buildings I already knew fairly well, and even has showed me a few things I didn't know were on campus. (She happens to have a blind grandmother who is pretty independent herself, so my friend already knows that all I need is a little showing and I'm usually good from then on). As I have this friend and another who have already shown me where our apartment will be next year, and how to get from the apartment building to the new music building we will be moving to, I don't think I'll need to use the O&M services. Even learning the interior of the new music building will be easy on my own because I know the music stuff is only on 2 floors of the building, and all my classes there will be with these friends of mine so they can easily walk with me to class on the first day and I'll just pick up the route as we go. My mom is also great about O&M, and she actually helped me learn a lot of campus just by spending extra time after campus tours walking around and pointing out things to me herself. The DS office here does not have connections to an O&M or a lot of the things I'm supposed to get through VR. Although my disabilities office does a really good job of accomodating me and making everything accessible they don't have the wealth of resources specific to blindness that some other schools do. (Our sister school in our city has tons of blind students and many of them also have other disabilities. My disability coordinator teaches a class there and she put it this way, "I have two blind students in my 30-student class there, here we have 2 blind students on the entire 11,000 student campus"). As I understand it the disabilities office here has this rule that they're not supposed to provide personal services or equipment to you outside of what you need for testing because they understand that that is what VR is supposed to be used for. They are right; and I do think that VR was right to get me things like my laptop or BrailleSense and it wouldn't necessarily be the DS office's responsibility, but it doesn't put them in a position to help much. I guess the most frustrating thing is exactly what Mike pointed out; I'm trying to be clear and articulate, and feel like I am doing so. But, as I've pointed out what is articulate to me is probably a bunch of gobbledegook to my councelor who doesn't know what it means, so the challenge for me seems like it will be to figure out how to put things we would consider as already basic into lamen's terms. The other challenge, which is not really in my control at all, is making sure my councelor reads the information and gets it, as when she doesn't respond I don't really know what she's doing with the information. I agree with Arielle; I don't mess with VR much, but by the same token I can't really just go through my DS office for everything because of their policies related to VR and the student accessing all available resources, and because there are a few things I really do need from them. Most importantly, the tuition assistance is something worth sticking on the system for. I realize as well that because I do receive some equipment and tuition assistance from them, that as frustrating it may be, that I'm probably just going to have to suck it up and do the paperwork and there will be no way of getting around that. However, I am really concerned by the manner in which they want the paperwork to be repetitively done, their low expectations of consumers, and the lack of knowledge those in charge seem to have about the people they're working to help. The way the system is set up now does not make sense. On 3/26/13, Joshua Lester wrote: > Mike: > I have a friend in Minnisota, who is originally from Ohio. > She left Ohio, and moved to MN, because they have better services! > I'm thinking about moving up north as well, because our services in Arkansas > are pretty lame! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Mike Freeman > [k7uij at panix.com] > Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 3:26 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? > > kaiti: > First, it is obvious that you live in a state that has a general rehab > agency rather than one dealing specifically with blindness. This is > unfortunate as you have discovered. However, knowing what you need and want > and being able to cogently articulate your needs will go a long way toward > fulfilling them. You've seem this in the case of the Perkins braillewriter. > Second, why do you need an O&M specialist to show you around campus? Could > not a friend or family member do the job? When you graduate and enter the > world of work, you won't have O&M instructors at your beck and call. It is > definitely helpful to develop the skill of learning new routes and places > with minimal assistance. This is the essence of structured discovery > learning. Could your DSS office help? This way, you wouldn't have to worry > about rehab at all. > > Mike Freeman > sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 26, 2013, at 12:49, Kaiti Shelton > wrote: > >> Hi all, >> >> Okay, so I'll confess that part of the reason I'm writing this email >> is to vent about my current circumstances, but more importantly than >> that I am interested in seeing how other states or parts of the >> country run their voc rehab services. I apologize if this email >> sounds venty, as in order to explain what I'm talking about I'll need >> to give specific examples, but I am really interested in hearing your >> thoughts on the matter based on your own experiences. >> >> The thing that makes me the most uncomfortable with the voc rehab >> system in my state is that the councelors don't necessarily know much >> about blindness, let alone what a blind student truly needs to be >> successful. My councelor fills her job capacity in terms of knowing >> how to do the paperwork, but my own mother has told me that when they >> chat as I'm signing papers and my mom brings up something relatively >> fundamental like a conversation about navigating campus or something, >> she'll notice that what she says goes over my councelor's head. This >> has caused a few concerning events in terms of the authorizations that >> have been made for me. In December for example I requested >> orientation and mobility training so I could go through my second >> semester schedule, as there were a few buildings I would need to use >> that I had not been to yet. I got in touch with my O&M guy and we >> planned to set up a time in January. I emailed my councelor and told >> her this, but then my O&M specialist emailed me back and asked if I >> would be on campus after the first semester ended in December, because >> that was when training was authorized. I had to email my councelor >> and tell her that the reason for going with January was that campus >> closed the last day of finals week, and a few days prior to the start >> of the second term I would be back on campus and most of the academic >> buildings would be reopened. Another time for this same semester I >> requested a Perkins Brailler, specifically specifying that the >> traditional braillers were much sturdier and more reliable than the >> plastic ones and justifying my request. When I got a call from my >> vendor she first informed me that the braillers were out of stock >> until February, half way through my semester, and then asked me what >> color I wanted. I told her that the new brailler was not what I >> thought I was getting and she got in touch with the councelor. I >> ended up getting a traditional anyway on the grounds that although the >> new generations were out of stock, there were plenty traditionals > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From bookwormahb at earthlink.net Wed Mar 27 05:06:29 2013 From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net (Ashley Bramlett) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 01:06:29 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <46E5684161F145E58BE675D10A4E7533@OwnerPC> Kaiti, You have some big valid concerns. I'll write more later time permitting. For now, I'll say that I also have incompetent counselors. My one now speaks bad english, cannot compose emails without mistakes such as spelling errors, rarely responds timely to emails and phone calls and to top it off she takes vacations and does not tell her clients she is gone. I think you should buy your own supplies such as that braille writer and paper. Work on O&M with friends or your mom. Also, complain to your counselor's supervisor. I hope things get better. Ashley -----Original Message----- From: Kaiti Shelton Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2013 12:16 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? Hi all, First off, I'll respond to something Mike said just to put things into perspective. From my description I totally get why Mike would come to the conclusion that Ohio has a general rehab system, and they do as they serve a lot of different populations. However, there is a sub group called the Bureau of Services for the Visually Impaired which is supposed to specifically oversee those cases for blind and visually impaired people. I also know in my city that the two places blind people go to see their councelors are the two centers for the blind we have, so it sounds like these voc rehab councelors specialize in working for BSVI and aren't dealing with people from other populations. The structure for special attention to the needs of blind people is there, it's just shockingly not very good, as it would appear. At our Ohio State NFB convention we had someone speak about how they were working to improve the system and appreciated the feedback from NFB members so they could address the serious issues, however since basic principles of independence have not been addressed I don't really know how that is working out or what has changed since our convention in early November. I do have friends who would help me learn campus; actually, my instructor only had to show me two classrooms and the rest pertained more to locating the bus stops around campus as I'd like to start exploring the city more and be able to travel off campus some times, even if my friends and their cars aren't always available to go with me. One of my friends did show me a lot of my classes that were in buildings I already knew fairly well, and even has showed me a few things I didn't know were on campus. (She happens to have a blind grandmother who is pretty independent herself, so my friend already knows that all I need is a little showing and I'm usually good from then on). As I have this friend and another who have already shown me where our apartment will be next year, and how to get from the apartment building to the new music building we will be moving to, I don't think I'll need to use the O&M services. Even learning the interior of the new music building will be easy on my own because I know the music stuff is only on 2 floors of the building, and all my classes there will be with these friends of mine so they can easily walk with me to class on the first day and I'll just pick up the route as we go. My mom is also great about O&M, and she actually helped me learn a lot of campus just by spending extra time after campus tours walking around and pointing out things to me herself. The DS office here does not have connections to an O&M or a lot of the things I'm supposed to get through VR. Although my disabilities office does a really good job of accomodating me and making everything accessible they don't have the wealth of resources specific to blindness that some other schools do. (Our sister school in our city has tons of blind students and many of them also have other disabilities. My disability coordinator teaches a class there and she put it this way, "I have two blind students in my 30-student class there, here we have 2 blind students on the entire 11,000 student campus"). As I understand it the disabilities office here has this rule that they're not supposed to provide personal services or equipment to you outside of what you need for testing because they understand that that is what VR is supposed to be used for. They are right; and I do think that VR was right to get me things like my laptop or BrailleSense and it wouldn't necessarily be the DS office's responsibility, but it doesn't put them in a position to help much. I guess the most frustrating thing is exactly what Mike pointed out; I'm trying to be clear and articulate, and feel like I am doing so. But, as I've pointed out what is articulate to me is probably a bunch of gobbledegook to my councelor who doesn't know what it means, so the challenge for me seems like it will be to figure out how to put things we would consider as already basic into lamen's terms. The other challenge, which is not really in my control at all, is making sure my councelor reads the information and gets it, as when she doesn't respond I don't really know what she's doing with the information. I agree with Arielle; I don't mess with VR much, but by the same token I can't really just go through my DS office for everything because of their policies related to VR and the student accessing all available resources, and because there are a few things I really do need from them. Most importantly, the tuition assistance is something worth sticking on the system for. I realize as well that because I do receive some equipment and tuition assistance from them, that as frustrating it may be, that I'm probably just going to have to suck it up and do the paperwork and there will be no way of getting around that. However, I am really concerned by the manner in which they want the paperwork to be repetitively done, their low expectations of consumers, and the lack of knowledge those in charge seem to have about the people they're working to help. The way the system is set up now does not make sense. On 3/26/13, Joshua Lester wrote: > Mike: > I have a friend in Minnisota, who is originally from Ohio. > She left Ohio, and moved to MN, because they have better services! > I'm thinking about moving up north as well, because our services in > Arkansas > are pretty lame! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Mike Freeman > [k7uij at panix.com] > Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 3:26 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? > > kaiti: > First, it is obvious that you live in a state that has a general rehab > agency rather than one dealing specifically with blindness. This is > unfortunate as you have discovered. However, knowing what you need and > want > and being able to cogently articulate your needs will go a long way toward > fulfilling them. You've seem this in the case of the Perkins > braillewriter. > Second, why do you need an O&M specialist to show you around campus? Could > not a friend or family member do the job? When you graduate and enter the > world of work, you won't have O&M instructors at your beck and call. It is > definitely helpful to develop the skill of learning new routes and places > with minimal assistance. This is the essence of structured discovery > learning. Could your DSS office help? This way, you wouldn't have to worry > about rehab at all. > > Mike Freeman > sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 26, 2013, at 12:49, Kaiti Shelton > wrote: > >> Hi all, >> >> Okay, so I'll confess that part of the reason I'm writing this email >> is to vent about my current circumstances, but more importantly than >> that I am interested in seeing how other states or parts of the >> country run their voc rehab services. I apologize if this email >> sounds venty, as in order to explain what I'm talking about I'll need >> to give specific examples, but I am really interested in hearing your >> thoughts on the matter based on your own experiences. >> >> The thing that makes me the most uncomfortable with the voc rehab >> system in my state is that the councelors don't necessarily know much >> about blindness, let alone what a blind student truly needs to be >> successful. My councelor fills her job capacity in terms of knowing >> how to do the paperwork, but my own mother has told me that when they >> chat as I'm signing papers and my mom brings up something relatively >> fundamental like a conversation about navigating campus or something, >> she'll notice that what she says goes over my councelor's head. This >> has caused a few concerning events in terms of the authorizations that >> have been made for me. In December for example I requested >> orientation and mobility training so I could go through my second >> semester schedule, as there were a few buildings I would need to use >> that I had not been to yet. I got in touch with my O&M guy and we >> planned to set up a time in January. I emailed my councelor and told >> her this, but then my O&M specialist emailed me back and asked if I >> would be on campus after the first semester ended in December, because >> that was when training was authorized. I had to email my councelor >> and tell her that the reason for going with January was that campus >> closed the last day of finals week, and a few days prior to the start >> of the second term I would be back on campus and most of the academic >> buildings would be reopened. Another time for this same semester I >> requested a Perkins Brailler, specifically specifying that the >> traditional braillers were much sturdier and more reliable than the >> plastic ones and justifying my request. When I got a call from my >> vendor she first informed me that the braillers were out of stock >> until February, half way through my semester, and then asked me what >> color I wanted. I told her that the new brailler was not what I >> thought I was getting and she got in touch with the councelor. I >> ended up getting a traditional anyway on the grounds that although the >> new generations were out of stock, there were plenty traditionals > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Wed Mar 27 05:30:18 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 01:30:18 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? In-Reply-To: <46E5684161F145E58BE675D10A4E7533@OwnerPC> References: <46E5684161F145E58BE675D10A4E7533@OwnerPC> Message-ID: And to further clarify, my mother does not have any real contact with my councelor other than chatting a little when I'm signing something or when we stop by to pick something up. When it comes to sending in the forms and the direct contact, I do handle all of that and my family members aren't involved. My major concerns are more so with the system than the individual councelor. I think if the system itself were better established we wouldn't have these problems. Like I said, hiring people who can do the paperwork is fine, but I don't understand why the system isn't educating these people about the other factors, big and major ones, specifically related to the people they work with on a daily basis. To be metaphorical, it would be like if a doctor knew the books for his specific specialty, but when it came to actually addressing the needs of a patient they wouldn't know the treatment process or what to prescribe. For doctors, med school and residency provide the hands-on training to actually deal with these situations as opposed to being able to correctly fill out answers on a test; why doesn't the state train the people they employ in this system to understand what the students or other people they're working with actually need to have in order to be successful? Perhaps they should have some sort of residency program, even if it were just for a day, when councelors could shadow a student and see why and how much they use their equipment and what they use it for, what a day of school is really like for them, how they navigate campus safely, etc. I would buy my own brailler and stuff like that if I had the money, but as the bulk of my savings goes to paying school tuition or paying back family members who help me pay for tuition I don't have the funds available to buy something as expensive as a brailler. Of course, I buy the little things like my canes, any small aids like a braille labeler and label tape, I maintain my own Jaws license and pay the SMA fees when they come up, once my student status is up I will certainly cover my own Bookshare subscription, stuff I can handle buying on my own, but when it comes to the big stuff I really do need the assistance in paying for it and that is what the system is supposed to be there for. On 3/27/13, Ashley Bramlett wrote: > Kaiti, > You have some big valid concerns. I'll write more later time permitting. > For now, I'll say that I also have incompetent counselors. My one now speaks > > bad english, cannot compose emails without mistakes such as spelling errors, > > rarely responds timely to emails and phone calls and to top it off she takes > > vacations and does not tell her clients she is gone. I think you should buy > > your own supplies such as that braille writer and paper. Work on O&M with > friends or your mom. Also, complain to your counselor's supervisor. > > I hope things get better. > > Ashley > > -----Original Message----- > From: Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2013 12:16 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? > > Hi all, > > First off, I'll respond to something Mike said just to put things into > perspective. From my description I totally get why Mike would come to > the conclusion that Ohio has a general rehab system, and they do as > they serve a lot of different populations. However, there is a sub > group called the Bureau of Services for the Visually Impaired which is > supposed to specifically oversee those cases for blind and visually > impaired people. I also know in my city that the two places blind > people go to see their councelors are the two centers for the blind we > have, so it sounds like these voc rehab councelors specialize in > working for BSVI and aren't dealing with people from other > populations. The structure for special attention to the needs of > blind people is there, it's just shockingly not very good, as it would > appear. At our Ohio State NFB convention we had someone speak about > how they were working to improve the system and appreciated the > feedback from NFB members so they could address the serious issues, > however since basic principles of independence have not been addressed > I don't really know how that is working out or what has changed since > our convention in early November. > > I do have friends who would help me learn campus; actually, my > instructor only had to show me two classrooms and the rest pertained > more to locating the bus stops around campus as I'd like to start > exploring the city more and be able to travel off campus some times, > even if my friends and their cars aren't always available to go with > me. One of my friends did show me a lot of my classes that were in > buildings I already knew fairly well, and even has showed me a few > things I didn't know were on campus. (She happens to have a blind > grandmother who is pretty independent herself, so my friend already > knows that all I need is a little showing and I'm usually good from > then on). As I have this friend and another who have already shown me > where our apartment will be next year, and how to get from the > apartment building to the new music building we will be moving to, I > don't think I'll need to use the O&M services. Even learning the > interior of the new music building will be easy on my own because I > know the music stuff is only on 2 floors of the building, and all my > classes there will be with these friends of mine so they can easily > walk with me to class on the first day and I'll just pick up the route > as we go. My mom is also great about O&M, and she actually helped me > learn a lot of campus just by spending extra time after campus tours > walking around and pointing out things to me herself. > > The DS office here does not have connections to an O&M or a lot of the > things I'm supposed to get through VR. Although my disabilities > office does a really good job of accomodating me and making everything > accessible they don't have the wealth of resources specific to > blindness that some other schools do. (Our sister school in our city > has tons of blind students and many of them also have other > disabilities. My disability coordinator teaches a class there and she > put it this way, "I have two blind students in my 30-student class > there, here we have 2 blind students on the entire 11,000 student > campus"). As I understand it the disabilities office here has this > rule that they're not supposed to provide personal services or > equipment to you outside of what you need for testing because they > understand that that is what VR is supposed to be used for. They are > right; and I do think that VR was right to get me things like my > laptop or BrailleSense and it wouldn't necessarily be the DS office's > responsibility, but it doesn't put them in a position to help much. > > I guess the most frustrating thing is exactly what Mike pointed out; > I'm trying to be clear and articulate, and feel like I am doing so. > But, as I've pointed out what is articulate to me is probably a bunch > of gobbledegook to my councelor who doesn't know what it means, so the > challenge for me seems like it will be to figure out how to put things > we would consider as already basic into lamen's terms. The other > challenge, which is not really in my control at all, is making sure my > councelor reads the information and gets it, as when she doesn't > respond I don't really know what she's doing with the information. > > I agree with Arielle; I don't mess with VR much, but by the same token > I can't really just go through my DS office for everything because of > their policies related to VR and the student accessing all available > resources, and because there are a few things I really do need from > them. Most importantly, the tuition assistance is something worth > sticking on the system for. I realize as well that because I do > receive some equipment and tuition assistance from them, that as > frustrating it may be, that I'm probably just going to have to suck it > up and do the paperwork and there will be no way of getting around > that. However, I am really concerned by the manner in which they want > the paperwork to be repetitively done, their low expectations of > consumers, and the lack of knowledge those in charge seem to have > about the people they're working to help. The way the system is set > up now does not make sense. > > On 3/26/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >> Mike: >> I have a friend in Minnisota, who is originally from Ohio. >> She left Ohio, and moved to MN, because they have better services! >> I'm thinking about moving up north as well, because our services in >> Arkansas >> are pretty lame! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Mike Freeman >> [k7uij at panix.com] >> Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 3:26 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? >> >> kaiti: >> First, it is obvious that you live in a state that has a general rehab >> agency rather than one dealing specifically with blindness. This is >> unfortunate as you have discovered. However, knowing what you need and >> want >> and being able to cogently articulate your needs will go a long way >> toward >> fulfilling them. You've seem this in the case of the Perkins >> braillewriter. >> Second, why do you need an O&M specialist to show you around campus? >> Could >> not a friend or family member do the job? When you graduate and enter the >> world of work, you won't have O&M instructors at your beck and call. It >> is >> definitely helpful to develop the skill of learning new routes and places >> with minimal assistance. This is the essence of structured discovery >> learning. Could your DSS office help? This way, you wouldn't have to >> worry >> about rehab at all. >> >> Mike Freeman >> sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 26, 2013, at 12:49, Kaiti Shelton >> wrote: >> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> Okay, so I'll confess that part of the reason I'm writing this email >>> is to vent about my current circumstances, but more importantly than >>> that I am interested in seeing how other states or parts of the >>> country run their voc rehab services. I apologize if this email >>> sounds venty, as in order to explain what I'm talking about I'll need >>> to give specific examples, but I am really interested in hearing your >>> thoughts on the matter based on your own experiences. >>> >>> The thing that makes me the most uncomfortable with the voc rehab >>> system in my state is that the councelors don't necessarily know much >>> about blindness, let alone what a blind student truly needs to be >>> successful. My councelor fills her job capacity in terms of knowing >>> how to do the paperwork, but my own mother has told me that when they >>> chat as I'm signing papers and my mom brings up something relatively >>> fundamental like a conversation about navigating campus or something, >>> she'll notice that what she says goes over my councelor's head. This >>> has caused a few concerning events in terms of the authorizations that >>> have been made for me. In December for example I requested >>> orientation and mobility training so I could go through my second >>> semester schedule, as there were a few buildings I would need to use >>> that I had not been to yet. I got in touch with my O&M guy and we >>> planned to set up a time in January. I emailed my councelor and told >>> her this, but then my O&M specialist emailed me back and asked if I >>> would be on campus after the first semester ended in December, because >>> that was when training was authorized. I had to email my councelor >>> and tell her that the reason for going with January was that campus >>> closed the last day of finals week, and a few days prior to the start >>> of the second term I would be back on campus and most of the academic >>> buildings would be reopened. Another time for this same semester I >>> requested a Perkins Brailler, specifically specifying that the >>> traditional braillers were much sturdier and more reliable than the >>> plastic ones and justifying my request. When I got a call from my >>> vendor she first informed me that the braillers were out of stock >>> until February, half way through my semester, and then asked me what >>> color I wanted. I told her that the new brailler was not what I >>> thought I was getting and she got in touch with the councelor. I >>> ended up getting a traditional anyway on the grounds that although the >>> new generations were out of stock, there were plenty traditionals >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From sweetpeareader at gmail.com Wed Mar 27 14:57:22 2013 From: sweetpeareader at gmail.com (Sophie Trist) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 09:57:22 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Fair/appropriate accomodations for assignments andtests involving videos Message-ID: <515308ec.0601b60a.1e44.711c@mx.google.com> Miso and everyone, while the suggestions given to you are good, I've had these video assignments too. Lots of times, the following questions have to do with the major parts of the video, not the minor subtleties. I've never had videos in foreign languages, so I can't speak for those, but for those in other subjects, listening to the dialogue should be enough to do the following activities. ----- Original Message ----- From: Kaiti Shelton wrote: Hi Miso, As a German major, I have been confronted with the issues of videos in the classroom as well. There are a few things you can do. To be honest, whatever you do, you won't get the same thing out of the video as the others do, but you can try to get accomidations to make it better. First, you can get a friend to read you the subtitles, which is something you seem to be doing already. This will be difficult because your friend will probably try to read you the subtitles and explain the movie at the same time. You will miss things. The other thing you can do is get your teacher to provide you with a detailed summary of the movie ahead of time, so you have an understanding of the plot of the movie. I have found this to be helpful. I have noticed that movies are one of the biggest ways we are left behind as blind students. It is difficult to get accomidations to fully supplement what the sighted students are learning from a movie because either we miss it completely due to lack of description or we learn it after the fact. On 3/26/13, Miso Kwak wrote: Being the only blind student in classroom, there are times when I feel like class activities are not suited for the visually impaired. There are just some times when I strongly feel like teachers don't consider enough about the only one blind student in his/her classrooms. One of those occasions is watching a video and doing follow-up activities. Currently, I am enrolled in Spanish 3 Honors class. In the class recently, we watched a movie and had to do 3 worksheets and a quiz in the end. The movie was entirely spoken in Spanish. There was English subtitle on the screen. When the class started watching the movie, teacher asked one of my friends to explain the storyline of the movie, so she did. I didn't understand thoroughly but I just grasped what was going on... I didn't do most of the worksheets because they didn't worth many points and I frankly didn't know what to write. If I were desperate for the points, I probably would have bs-ed. The teacher reviewed the movie and I asked some questions. Afterward I felt like I had a better understanding of the movie. Then there was a quiz. I felt prepared goinginto the quiz but when I took the quiz I was shocked because there were so much more than I previously had thought. For example, one of the questions asked who died in a ship. I didn't even know someone had died in a ship. It was just one of those details which neither my friend nor the teacher mentioned. There were couple more questions that made me realize I had missed so much. I am debating whether to confront my teacher about this matter or not. If you were in my situation, would you tell her that the test was unfair? When you have assignments involving videos what kinds of accomodations do you have? My aide who usually types materials into doc documents suggested she types the subtitle, I read the subtitle, and retake the test, which I think is reasonable... Miso _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kaybaycar%40g mail.com -- Julie McG National Association of Guide dog Users board member, National Federation of the Blind performing arts division secretary, Missouri Association of Guide dog Users President, and Guiding Eyes for the Blind graduate 2008 "For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that everyone who believes in him may not perish but may have eternal life." John 3:16 _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarine t104%40gmail.com -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade r%40gmail.com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Wed Mar 27 15:08:15 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 11:08:15 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Fair/appropriate accomodations for assignments andtests involving videos In-Reply-To: <515308ec.0601b60a.1e44.711c@mx.google.com> References: <515308ec.0601b60a.1e44.711c@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Usually, yes, but in some cases like Miso's she was tested over things that weren't included in the dialogue and that her friend and teacher forgot to mention to her when she asked. It really wasn't fair for her to have to be tested on the parts of the information she had no way of knowing about. I think the language barrier makes videos even harder than usual for us. I had a similar experience when I watched those videos in Chinese; we had a test over the material and some of the questions were about events that happened which weren't discussed in the dialogue, like, "What did the boy see when he was separated from his father in the city?" In the movie the boy broke away from his father to look at a violin, but all the diealogue that was there was the father ylooking for his son and yelling his name, and the scenes were flipping back and forth between the worried dad and his son looking at the instrument. When they found each other the dad just said, "There you are, let's go we're going to be late," so had my reader not described what was going on to me I wouldn't have understood what the boy was looking at. On 3/27/13, Sophie Trist wrote: > Miso and everyone, while the suggestions given to you are good, > I've had these video assignments too. Lots of times, the > following questions have to do with the major parts of the video, > not the minor subtleties. I've never had videos in foreign > languages, so I can't speak for those, but for those in other > subjects, listening to the dialogue should be enough to do the > following activities. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Kaiti Shelton To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Date sent: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 23:30:55 -0400 > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Fair/appropriate accomodations for > assignments andtests involving videos > > Hi, > > I've had similar issues both in Spanish and other classes. I > like > your aid's suggestion of giving you the subtitles in a document > for > you to read along with the Spanish; I did something similar with > spanish videos myself. > > If you choose to have a friend sit with you and explain the > movie, > make sure they're someone who can fluently read the subtitles. > Explain that they can explain things about the movie that aren't > covered in the dialogue, but that they should wait for an > opportune > time to do theese like when no one is talking and there are no > subtitles to be read. If those opportunities are scarce, have > them > run through the plot with you after the movie when they're not > worried > about cramming in the explanation along with the subtitles. Ask > them > to be detailed. They don't need to give you every single bit of > information, but something as significant as someone dying on a > ship > might be worth mentioning. If you choose this route you can also > jot > down questions on a notetaker as you're watching the movie so you > can > go over them later. I did a mix of these methods last semester; > for > my intro to the university class we had to watch a few movies, > one > documentary and one fictional film about a violin protegy, about > the > music from China. Both times I had the TA for my class sit with > me > and read the Chinese subtitles. Luckily, she's a very observant > student and a great reader, and I actually didn't even have to > tell > her when to describe things as she naturally felt the best time > to > describe what happened in the previous sceen would be during a > musical > part of the movie when no one was talking. In such cases, you > might > get all the information you need just because the person reading > to > you is awesome at it. > > I'd definitely go to your teacher about it though. I'm sure if > you > explain the situation they would at least throw out the questions > you > got wrong or didn't answer because you couldn't have answered > them > correctly from your test to make it fair, especially if the > teacher > didn't even remember to tell you all the things you would be > tested > on. > > Good luck. > > On 3/26/13, Julie McGinnity wrote: > Hi Miso, > > As a German major, I have been confronted with the issues of > videos in > the classroom as well. There are a few things you can do. To > be > honest, whatever you do, you won't get the same thing out of the > video > as the others do, but you can try to get accomidations to make > it > better. > > First, you can get a friend to read you the subtitles, which is > something you seem to be doing already. This will be difficult > because your friend will probably try to read you the subtitles > and > explain the movie at the same time. You will miss things. The > other > thing you can do is get your teacher to provide you with a > detailed > summary of the movie ahead of time, so you have an understanding > of > the plot of the movie. I have found this to be helpful. > > I have noticed that movies are one of the biggest ways we are > left > behind as blind students. It is difficult to get accomidations > to > fully supplement what the sighted students are learning from a > movie > because either we miss it completely due to lack of description > or we > learn it after the fact. > > On 3/26/13, Miso Kwak wrote: > Being the only blind student in classroom, there are times when > I feel > like class activities are not suited for the visually impaired. > There are just some times when I strongly feel like teachers > don't > consider enough about the only one blind student in his/her > classrooms. > One of those occasions is watching a video and doing follow-up > activities. > Currently, I am enrolled in Spanish 3 Honors class. In the class > recently, we watched a movie and had to do 3 worksheets and a > quiz in > the end. > The movie was entirely spoken in Spanish. There was English > subtitle on > the screen. > When the class started watching the movie, teacher asked one of > my > friends to explain the storyline of the movie, so she did. > I didn't understand thoroughly but I just grasped what was going > on... > I didn't do most of the worksheets because they didn't worth > many > points and I frankly didn't know what to write. If I were > desperate for > the points, I probably would have bs-ed. > The teacher reviewed the movie and I asked some questions. > Afterward I > felt like I had a better understanding of the movie. > Then there was a quiz. I felt prepared goinginto the quiz but > when I > took the quiz I was shocked because there were so much more than > I > previously had thought. > For example, one of the questions asked who died in a ship. I > didn't > even know someone had died in a ship. It was just one of those > details > which neither my friend nor the teacher mentioned. > There were couple more questions that made me realize I had > missed so > much. > I am debating whether to confront my teacher about this matter > or not. > If you were in my situation, would you tell her that the test > was > unfair? > When you have assignments involving videos what kinds of > accomodations > do you have? > My aide who usually types materials into doc documents suggested > she > types the subtitle, I read the subtitle, and retake the test, > which I > think is reasonable... > Miso > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kaybaycar%40g > mail.com > > > > -- > Julie McG > National Association of Guide dog Users board member, National > Federation of the Blind performing arts division secretary, > Missouri Association of Guide dog Users President, > and Guiding Eyes for the Blind graduate 2008 > "For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that > everyone who believes in him may not perish but may have eternal > life." > John 3:16 > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account > info for > nabs-l: > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarine > t104%40gmail.com > > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info > for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade > r%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From arielle71 at gmail.com Wed Mar 27 19:31:46 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 13:31:46 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Fair/appropriate accomodations for assignments andtests involving videos In-Reply-To: References: <515308ec.0601b60a.1e44.711c@mx.google.com> Message-ID: I think the most important accommodation you need is to have the subtitles either read aloud or available to you in Braille or some electronic format. If you think about it, the main point of having students watch a movie in a foreign language is to give you exposure to both the language and the English translation. If you don't get the subtitles at all, you not only miss out on understplot but you also miss the language learning opportunities. So from your teacher's point of view, making the subtitles accessible should be absolutely essential. Having the non-talking parts of the movie described is nice too, but less important in my opinion. Arielle On 3/27/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Usually, yes, but in some cases like Miso's she was tested over things > that weren't included in the dialogue and that her friend and teacher > forgot to mention to her when she asked. It really wasn't fair for > her to have to be tested on the parts of the information she had no > way of knowing about. > > I think the language barrier makes videos even harder than usual for > us. I had a similar experience when I watched those videos in > Chinese; we had a test over the material and some of the questions > were about events that happened which weren't discussed in the > dialogue, like, "What did the boy see when he was separated from his > father in the city?" In the movie the boy broke away from his father > to look at a violin, but all the diealogue that was there was the > father ylooking for his son and yelling his name, and the scenes were > flipping back and forth between the worried dad and his son looking at > the instrument. When they found each other the dad just said, "There > you are, let's go we're going to be late," so had my reader not > described what was going on to me I wouldn't have understood what the > boy was looking at. > > On 3/27/13, Sophie Trist wrote: >> Miso and everyone, while the suggestions given to you are good, >> I've had these video assignments too. Lots of times, the >> following questions have to do with the major parts of the video, >> not the minor subtleties. I've never had videos in foreign >> languages, so I can't speak for those, but for those in other >> subjects, listening to the dialogue should be enough to do the >> following activities. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Kaiti Shelton > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> > Date sent: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 23:30:55 -0400 >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Fair/appropriate accomodations for >> assignments andtests involving videos >> >> Hi, >> >> I've had similar issues both in Spanish and other classes. I >> like >> your aid's suggestion of giving you the subtitles in a document >> for >> you to read along with the Spanish; I did something similar with >> spanish videos myself. >> >> If you choose to have a friend sit with you and explain the >> movie, >> make sure they're someone who can fluently read the subtitles. >> Explain that they can explain things about the movie that aren't >> covered in the dialogue, but that they should wait for an >> opportune >> time to do theese like when no one is talking and there are no >> subtitles to be read. If those opportunities are scarce, have >> them >> run through the plot with you after the movie when they're not >> worried >> about cramming in the explanation along with the subtitles. Ask >> them >> to be detailed. They don't need to give you every single bit of >> information, but something as significant as someone dying on a >> ship >> might be worth mentioning. If you choose this route you can also >> jot >> down questions on a notetaker as you're watching the movie so you >> can >> go over them later. I did a mix of these methods last semester; >> for >> my intro to the university class we had to watch a few movies, >> one >> documentary and one fictional film about a violin protegy, about >> the >> music from China. Both times I had the TA for my class sit with >> me >> and read the Chinese subtitles. Luckily, she's a very observant >> student and a great reader, and I actually didn't even have to >> tell >> her when to describe things as she naturally felt the best time >> to >> describe what happened in the previous sceen would be during a >> musical >> part of the movie when no one was talking. In such cases, you >> might >> get all the information you need just because the person reading >> to >> you is awesome at it. >> >> I'd definitely go to your teacher about it though. I'm sure if >> you >> explain the situation they would at least throw out the questions >> you >> got wrong or didn't answer because you couldn't have answered >> them >> correctly from your test to make it fair, especially if the >> teacher >> didn't even remember to tell you all the things you would be >> tested >> on. >> >> Good luck. >> >> On 3/26/13, Julie McGinnity wrote: >> Hi Miso, >> >> As a German major, I have been confronted with the issues of >> videos in >> the classroom as well. There are a few things you can do. To >> be >> honest, whatever you do, you won't get the same thing out of the >> video >> as the others do, but you can try to get accomidations to make >> it >> better. >> >> First, you can get a friend to read you the subtitles, which is >> something you seem to be doing already. This will be difficult >> because your friend will probably try to read you the subtitles >> and >> explain the movie at the same time. You will miss things. The >> other >> thing you can do is get your teacher to provide you with a >> detailed >> summary of the movie ahead of time, so you have an understanding >> of >> the plot of the movie. I have found this to be helpful. >> >> I have noticed that movies are one of the biggest ways we are >> left >> behind as blind students. It is difficult to get accomidations >> to >> fully supplement what the sighted students are learning from a >> movie >> because either we miss it completely due to lack of description >> or we >> learn it after the fact. >> >> On 3/26/13, Miso Kwak wrote: >> Being the only blind student in classroom, there are times when >> I feel >> like class activities are not suited for the visually impaired. >> There are just some times when I strongly feel like teachers >> don't >> consider enough about the only one blind student in his/her >> classrooms. >> One of those occasions is watching a video and doing follow-up >> activities. >> Currently, I am enrolled in Spanish 3 Honors class. In the class >> recently, we watched a movie and had to do 3 worksheets and a >> quiz in >> the end. >> The movie was entirely spoken in Spanish. There was English >> subtitle on >> the screen. >> When the class started watching the movie, teacher asked one of >> my >> friends to explain the storyline of the movie, so she did. >> I didn't understand thoroughly but I just grasped what was going >> on... >> I didn't do most of the worksheets because they didn't worth >> many >> points and I frankly didn't know what to write. If I were >> desperate for >> the points, I probably would have bs-ed. >> The teacher reviewed the movie and I asked some questions. >> Afterward I >> felt like I had a better understanding of the movie. >> Then there was a quiz. I felt prepared goinginto the quiz but >> when I >> took the quiz I was shocked because there were so much more than >> I >> previously had thought. >> For example, one of the questions asked who died in a ship. I >> didn't >> even know someone had died in a ship. It was just one of those >> details >> which neither my friend nor the teacher mentioned. >> There were couple more questions that made me realize I had >> missed so >> much. >> I am debating whether to confront my teacher about this matter >> or not. >> If you were in my situation, would you tell her that the test >> was >> unfair? >> When you have assignments involving videos what kinds of >> accomodations >> do you have? >> My aide who usually types materials into doc documents suggested >> she >> types the subtitle, I read the subtitle, and retake the test, >> which I >> think is reasonable... >> Miso >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kaybaycar%40g >> mail.com >> >> >> >> -- >> Julie McG >> National Association of Guide dog Users board member, National >> Federation of the Blind performing arts division secretary, >> Missouri Association of Guide dog Users President, >> and Guiding Eyes for the Blind graduate 2008 >> "For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that >> everyone who believes in him may not perish but may have eternal >> life." >> John 3:16 >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarine >> t104%40gmail.com >> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade >> r%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From dandrews at visi.com Wed Mar 27 20:02:43 2013 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 15:02:43 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] FW: National Federation of the Blind Assists Federal Employee Experiencing Discrimination Message-ID: > >FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE > >CONTACT: >Chris Danielsen >Director of Public Relations >National Federation of the Blind >(410) 659-9314, extension 2330 >(410) 262-1281 (Cell) >Cdanielsen at nfb.org > > >National Federation of the Blind Assists Federal Employee >Experiencing Discrimination > >Washington, D.C. (March 27, 2013): With the assistance of >the National Federation of the Blind, Michael >Leiterman, an attorney with the Department of Homeland Security's >Customs and Border Protection division (CBP), has filed a >lawsuit in the United States District Court for the District of >Columbia (Case 1:13-cv-00394) alleging unlawful discrimination >against him and other blind employees in violation of federal >anti-discrimination laws that require the federal government to >provide equal opportunity to people with disabilities. Mr. >Leiterman is blind and uses screen-access software, which converts >what is on a computer screen into synthesized speech, to access the >computer information required to perform his job. The basis of his >discrimination claim is that CBP has continued to procure and deploy >inaccessible software and technology, adversely affecting Mr. >Leiterman's ability to perform his job severely enough to result in >the denial of a routine promotion. Among the problems Mr. Leiterman >has experienced are inability to access Web pages and documents on >the Intranet used by CBP, inability to access his office e-mail and >the CBP computer network when telecommuting, inability to complete >training required by CBP and more. > >Dr. Marc Maurer, president of the National >Federation of the Blind, said: "If blind people are to succeed in >the modern workplace, and therefore make meaningful contributions to >society, then we must have equal access to workplace technology, and >employers are required by law to provide that access or make >appropriate accommodations. The National >Federation of the Blind will continue to fight for the rights of Mr. >Leiterman and other blind federal employees to fully participate in >their workplaces and in society." > >Mr. Leiterman said: "I have spent entirely too much time over the >past six years trying to solve problems created by my employer's >unlawful use of inaccessible technology rather than performing the >legal work for which I am qualified by my advanced law degree and >which I was hired to do. Despite the fact that my work has been >satisfactory, I was denied a routine promotion because I could not >do my job effectively due to inaccessible technology. I hope that >this litigation results in my agency complying with its legal >obligations and allowing me and other federal employees who are >blind to serve the American people." > >Mr. Leiterman is represented in this matter by Joseph B. Espo of the >Baltimore firm Brown, Goldstein & Levy LLP. > >### > > >About the National Federation of the Blind > >The National Federation of the Blind (NFB) is the oldest, largest, >and most influential nationwide membership organization of blind >people in the United States. Founded in 1940, the NFB advocates for >the civil rights and equality of blind Americans, and develops >innovative education, technology, and training programs to provide >the blind and those who are losing vision with the tools they need >to become independent and successful. We need your support. To >make a donation, please go to www.nfb.org. > > > > > > > > From arielle71 at gmail.com Wed Mar 27 21:31:16 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 15:31:16 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: Know any college students who are blind?? In-Reply-To: <51530BF9020000770002B39E@mailhost.groupwise.msstate.edu> References: <51530BF9020000770002B39E@mailhost.groupwise.msstate.edu> Message-ID: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Jamie O'Mally Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 15:10:49 -0500 Subject: Know any college students who are blind?? To: arielle71 at gmail.com Dear Arielle Silverman, I am contacting you in the hopes that you can help identify college-age students who are legally blind. The National Research and Training Center on Blindness and Low Vision (NRTC) at Mississippi State University continues to seek students and professionals to participate in a nationwide Employment Mentoring Project that pairs students with legally blind mentors and offers career resources in an effort to improve employment outcomes. We are looking specifically for students graduating college or grad school between August 2013 and December 2014. Students graduating before March 2014 should sign up right away to be included in the next group! Students must be legally blind, under age 35, living anywhere in the U.S., and seeking employment after graduation. Although finding students to participate is our greatest need, we are also seeking legally blind mentors. Do you know of anyone who might meet these qualifications and would benefit from participating? If you do, please share this information! For more details, please visit: http://tiny.cc/mentoring-project or contact Dr. Jamie O’Mally at nrtc2 at colled.msstate.edu or 1-800-675-7782. Also, please consider sharing or signing up for our national Participant Registry for Blindness and Low Vision Research (http://tiny.cc/participant-registry). We really appreciate your help! Jamie O’Mally, Ph.D. Assistant Research Professor The National Research and Training Center on Blindness & Low Vision (NRTC) Mississippi State University P.O. Box 6189 Mississippi State, MS 39762 662-325-2001 From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Thu Mar 28 01:46:55 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (christopher nusbaum) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 21:46:55 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: [Nfbmd] Positions available at NFB References: <2AA94DA39C086E4481BF787E63A7EDFA1F08821F@SN2PRD0710MB372.namprd07.prod.outlook.com> Message-ID: <3063694357648090033@unknownmsgid> Thought some may be interested in these job openings at our national Center. All information on applying for these jobs is on the webpage linked to below. Chris Nusbaum Sent from my iPhone Begin forwarded message: *From:* "Riccobono, Mark" *Date:* March 26, 2013, 2:58:34 PM EDT *To:* NFB of Maryland Baltimore Chapter Discussion List < greater-baltimore at nfbnet.org>, 'NFB of Maryland e-mail list' < nfbmd at nfbnet.org> *Subject:* *[Nfbmd] Positions available at NFB* *Reply-To:* NFB of Maryland e-mail list As long as we are talking jobs, here are two more to spread the word about: https://nfb.org/jobs-ncb _______________________________________________ Nfbmd mailing list Nfbmd at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbmd_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for Nfbmd: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbmd_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com From kwakmiso at aol.com Thu Mar 28 03:36:08 2013 From: kwakmiso at aol.com (Miso Kwak) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 23:36:08 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [nabs-l] Fair/appropriate accomodations for assignments andtests involving videos In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8CFF97C8543538A-1EF4-1F1E0@webmail-m289.sysops.aol.com> Thank you for sharing your opinions. I especially agree with Arielle's. Thankfully when I mentioned this issue to my teacher she told me that she would count my grade without this test score. Miso -----Original Message----- From: Arielle Silverman To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Sent: Wed, Mar 27, 2013 12:34 pm Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Fair/appropriate accomodations for assignments andtests involving videos I think the most important accommodation you need is to have the subtitles either read aloud or available to you in Braille or some electronic format. If you think about it, the main point of having students watch a movie in a foreign language is to give you exposure to both the language and the English translation. If you don't get the subtitles at all, you not only miss out on understplot but you also miss the language learning opportunities. So from your teacher's point of view, making the subtitles accessible should be absolutely essential. Having the non-talking parts of the movie described is nice too, but less important in my opinion. Arielle On 3/27/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Usually, yes, but in some cases like Miso's she was tested over things > that weren't included in the dialogue and that her friend and teacher > forgot to mention to her when she asked. It really wasn't fair for > her to have to be tested on the parts of the information she had no > way of knowing about. > > I think the language barrier makes videos even harder than usual for > us. I had a similar experience when I watched those videos in > Chinese; we had a test over the material and some of the questions > were about events that happened which weren't discussed in the > dialogue, like, "What did the boy see when he was separated from his > father in the city?" In the movie the boy broke away from his father > to look at a violin, but all the diealogue that was there was the > father ylooking for his son and yelling his name, and the scenes were > flipping back and forth between the worried dad and his son looking at > the instrument. When they found each other the dad just said, "There > you are, let's go we're going to be late," so had my reader not > described what was going on to me I wouldn't have understood what the > boy was looking at. > > On 3/27/13, Sophie Trist wrote: >> Miso and everyone, while the suggestions given to you are good, >> I've had these video assignments too. Lots of times, the >> following questions have to do with the major parts of the video, >> not the minor subtleties. I've never had videos in foreign >> languages, so I can't speak for those, but for those in other >> subjects, listening to the dialogue should be enough to do the >> following activities. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Kaiti Shelton > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> > Date sent: Tue, 26 Mar 2013 23:30:55 -0400 >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Fair/appropriate accomodations for >> assignments andtests involving videos >> >> Hi, >> >> I've had similar issues both in Spanish and other classes. I >> like >> your aid's suggestion of giving you the subtitles in a document >> for >> you to read along with the Spanish; I did something similar with >> spanish videos myself. >> >> If you choose to have a friend sit with you and explain the >> movie, >> make sure they're someone who can fluently read the subtitles. >> Explain that they can explain things about the movie that aren't >> covered in the dialogue, but that they should wait for an >> opportune >> time to do theese like when no one is talking and there are no >> subtitles to be read. If those opportunities are scarce, have >> them >> run through the plot with you after the movie when they're not >> worried >> about cramming in the explanation along with the subtitles. Ask >> them >> to be detailed. They don't need to give you every single bit of >> information, but something as significant as someone dying on a >> ship >> might be worth mentioning. If you choose this route you can also >> jot >> down questions on a notetaker as you're watching the movie so you >> can >> go over them later. I did a mix of these methods last semester; >> for >> my intro to the university class we had to watch a few movies, >> one >> documentary and one fictional film about a violin protegy, about >> the >> music from China. Both times I had the TA for my class sit with >> me >> and read the Chinese subtitles. Luckily, she's a very observant >> student and a great reader, and I actually didn't even have to >> tell >> her when to describe things as she naturally felt the best time >> to >> describe what happened in the previous sceen would be during a >> musical >> part of the movie when no one was talking. In such cases, you >> might >> get all the information you need just because the person reading >> to >> you is awesome at it. >> >> I'd definitely go to your teacher about it though. I'm sure if >> you >> explain the situation they would at least throw out the questions >> you >> got wrong or didn't answer because you couldn't have answered >> them >> correctly from your test to make it fair, especially if the >> teacher >> didn't even remember to tell you all the things you would be >> tested >> on. >> >> Good luck. >> >> On 3/26/13, Julie McGinnity wrote: >> Hi Miso, >> >> As a German major, I have been confronted with the issues of >> videos in >> the classroom as well. There are a few things you can do. To >> be >> honest, whatever you do, you won't get the same thing out of the >> video >> as the others do, but you can try to get accomidations to make >> it >> better. >> >> First, you can get a friend to read you the subtitles, which is >> something you seem to be doing already. This will be difficult >> because your friend will probably try to read you the subtitles >> and >> explain the movie at the same time. You will miss things. The >> other >> thing you can do is get your teacher to provide you with a >> detailed >> summary of the movie ahead of time, so you have an understanding >> of >> the plot of the movie. I have found this to be helpful. >> >> I have noticed that movies are one of the biggest ways we are >> left >> behind as blind students. It is difficult to get accomidations >> to >> fully supplement what the sighted students are learning from a >> movie >> because either we miss it completely due to lack of description >> or we >> learn it after the fact. >> >> On 3/26/13, Miso Kwak wrote: >> Being the only blind student in classroom, there are times when >> I feel >> like class activities are not suited for the visually impaired. >> There are just some times when I strongly feel like teachers >> don't >> consider enough about the only one blind student in his/her >> classrooms. >> One of those occasions is watching a video and doing follow-up >> activities. >> Currently, I am enrolled in Spanish 3 Honors class. In the class >> recently, we watched a movie and had to do 3 worksheets and a >> quiz in >> the end. >> The movie was entirely spoken in Spanish. There was English >> subtitle on >> the screen. >> When the class started watching the movie, teacher asked one of >> my >> friends to explain the storyline of the movie, so she did. >> I didn't understand thoroughly but I just grasped what was going >> on... >> I didn't do most of the worksheets because they didn't worth >> many >> points and I frankly didn't know what to write. If I were >> desperate for >> the points, I probably would have bs-ed. >> The teacher reviewed the movie and I asked some questions. >> Afterward I >> felt like I had a better understanding of the movie. >> Then there was a quiz. I felt prepared goinginto the quiz but >> when I >> took the quiz I was shocked because there were so much more than >> I >> previously had thought. >> For example, one of the questions asked who died in a ship. I >> didn't >> even know someone had died in a ship. It was just one of those >> details >> which neither my friend nor the teacher mentioned. >> There were couple more questions that made me realize I had >> missed so >> much. >> I am debating whether to confront my teacher about this matter >> or not. >> If you were in my situation, would you tell her that the test >> was >> unfair? >> When you have assignments involving videos what kinds of >> accomodations >> do you have? >> My aide who usually types materials into doc documents suggested >> she >> types the subtitle, I read the subtitle, and retake the test, >> which I >> think is reasonable... >> Miso >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kaybaycar%40g >> mail.com >> >> >> >> -- >> Julie McG >> National Association of Guide dog Users board member, National >> Federation of the Blind performing arts division secretary, >> Missouri Association of Guide dog Users President, >> and Guiding Eyes for the Blind graduate 2008 >> "For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that >> everyone who believes in him may not perish but may have eternal >> life." >> John 3:16 >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account >> info for >> nabs-l: >> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarine >> t104%40gmail.com >> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >> for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade >> r%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kwakmiso%40aol.com From wmodnl at hotmail.com Thu Mar 28 11:14:53 2013 From: wmodnl at hotmail.com (wmodnl wmodnl) Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2013 07:14:53 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] {Disarmed} Free screen reader for blind people - Wed. March 27, 2013 References: Message-ID: I listen to the followin radio-show each weekend. It is nice to see that someone else out there unrelated to the disability community is aware of helpful tools for us. See beloww. Furthermore, you will all like her ebsite; she, has a great accessible one. I alays give her positive feedback on her facebook Page. Sent from my iPad Begin forwarded message: > From: Free Download from Kim Komando > Date: March 27, 2013, 6:00:00 AM EDT > To: wmodnl > Subject: Free screen reader for blind people - Wed. March 27, 2013 > > > If you or someone you know is blind, try this free,... If you cannot read this newsletter, please click here > > > MARCH 27, 2013 > Free screen reader for blind people > > For the blind, sight-based technology can sometimes be a stumbling block. Most computers, phones and gadgets are built around a visual interface. > > These visual interfaces are becoming more and more integrated into everyday life, which can make things harder for blind people and folks with severely diminished eyesight. > > But these selfsame technologies can also be huge assets to blind people as well. Computers have millions of potential uses for complementing and enhancing day-to-day life. You just need the right software. > > Screen reading technology has been around for decades now, but many screen readers can be prohibitively expensive, or else they aren't designed to meet a blind person's specific needs. > > Today's download is a free, open-source screen reader that converts text and visual cues on your computer into a synthetic voice. It was created by two blind software programmers to help them use their own computers. > > Cost: Free > Systems: Windows and Mac OS X > > Click Here to Download Now >> > > KIM'S FREEBIES > Essential App > It's the best of the old White and Yellow Pages with a new twist. > > Breaking News > Stay current on all things digital with my Breaking Tech News Updates. > > Cool Site > Are you getting your money's worth from your ISP? Find out now! > > Helpful Tip > Random Web slowdowns are frustrating. Learn the causes. > > Digital Minute > Should there be a law banning Google Glasses? Tune in today for my take. > > Must-see Video > In which country is it illegal to eat haggis? What common condiment is banned in France? Click here to see 10 illegal foods! > > > > KIM'S FAVORITES > > FREE HDTV! > Want to watch free, high-definition programming on your TV? Learn how to make an HD antenna with a wire coat hanger and a bit of free time. You will need: 6 wire hangers, 10 washers, 10 wood screws, 3' long piece of wood, 1 balun, screwdriver, pliers, wire cutter. > > > MAKING DECORATIVE CANDLES > It's been a while since people relied on candles for light. They are now used more for decoration and ambiance. That's why you want your candles to look decorative. Watch this amazing decorative candle being made. > > > SAVE YOUR MUSIC COLLECTION > Are your records and tapes collecting dust? Preserve your collection! Connect any turntable, tape deck or stereo to your computer and save your music from disuse and decay. > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Join my club today! > "It's the best $5 a month I spend!" Bob in FL Watch my show live or on-demand! Listen on your schedule. Have your questions answered on my message board and more. > Sign up now! > Get 2 FREE months of Carbonite > I trust my photos, files, and memories to Carbonite Online Backup. You should too. Hard drives die. You need a backup. Sign up now for your free 15-day trial. No credit card required. Get 2 months free if you decide to buy. > carbonite.com/Kim > Free for 45 days! > Work on your PC or Mac from home in real time. Use your computer remotely. Access files, programs, email and network. Get the free app. Try it free for 45 days with promo code KIM! > gotomypc.com > Keep your home safe! > "No middlemen or contracts to get in the way, just affordable, easy-to-use technology that keeps your home safe 24 hours a day, 7 days a week." -Kim Komando > Try it today & Save 10% when you visit buysimplisafe.com > Win goodies from my closet > Six lucky winners will win more than $1,500 worth of Goodies straight from Kim's electronics closet. Prizes include a GoPro Hero 3 HD camera, Wacom Bamboo Create tablet, an Aperion ARIS wireless speaker and more. > Enter today for your chance to win! > Get your FREE credit score! > Do you know your credit score? Find out in less than 2 minutes with Credit Karma. It's fast, easy and completely free; no credit card required! Plus, get free tools to improve your score and free credit monitoring. > Sign up today at creditkarma.com > PC or Mac? Make your choice > Are you a PC or a Mac? With this contest you get to choose your favorite! Win either an HP Envy Ultrabook or a MacBook Pro with Retina display. Before you can choose, however, you have to win. > Enter now! > > > Advertise | Advertiser Comments | Get our other newsletters | Privacy Policy | Terms and Conditions > > To unsubscribe or modify your subscription, use our online form. > > Copyright © 2013 Weststar Multimedia Entertainment, Inc. All Rights Reserved. > > You may also unsubscribe by sending a request via postal mail. Please include your name, e-mail address and a printed copy of your newsletter e-mail. Send to: Unsubscribe Kim's Download of the Day, 2711 N. 24th St., Phoenix, AZ 85008. > > Please add kimsfreedailydownloadreply at lyris.komando.com to your address book ensure Kim's emails reach your inbox. > From joshkart12 at gmail.com Thu Mar 28 12:27:59 2013 From: joshkart12 at gmail.com (Josh Gregory) Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2013 08:27:59 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] {Disarmed} Free screen reader for blind people - Wed. March 27, 2013 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: This Works on Mac OS 10? I really don't see why you would need it Since it already has a built-in one, but it might be worth checking out. Sent from my iPhone On Mar 28, 2013, at 7:14 AM, wmodnl wmodnl wrote: > I listen to the followin radio-show each weekend. It is nice to see that someone else out there unrelated to the disability community is aware of helpful tools for us. See beloww. Furthermore, you will all like her ebsite; she, has a great accessible one. I alays give her positive feedback on her facebook Page. > > > Sent from my iPad > > Begin forwarded message: > >> From: Free Download from Kim Komando >> Date: March 27, 2013, 6:00:00 AM EDT >> To: wmodnl >> Subject: Free screen reader for blind people - Wed. March 27, 2013 >> >> >> If you or someone you know is blind, try this free,... If you cannot read this newsletter, please click here >> >> >> MARCH 27, 2013 >> Free screen reader for blind people >> >> For the blind, sight-based technology can sometimes be a stumbling block. Most computers, phones and gadgets are built around a visual interface. >> >> These visual interfaces are becoming more and more integrated into everyday life, which can make things harder for blind people and folks with severely diminished eyesight. >> >> But these selfsame technologies can also be huge assets to blind people as well. Computers have millions of potential uses for complementing and enhancing day-to-day life. You just need the right software. >> >> Screen reading technology has been around for decades now, but many screen readers can be prohibitively expensive, or else they aren't designed to meet a blind person's specific needs. >> >> Today's download is a free, open-source screen reader that converts text and visual cues on your computer into a synthetic voice. It was created by two blind software programmers to help them use their own computers. >> >> Cost: Free >> Systems: Windows and Mac OS X >> >> Click Here to Download Now >> >> >> KIM'S FREEBIES >> Essential App >> It's the best of the old White and Yellow Pages with a new twist. >> >> Breaking News >> Stay current on all things digital with my Breaking Tech News Updates. >> >> Cool Site >> Are you getting your money's worth from your ISP? Find out now! >> >> Helpful Tip >> Random Web slowdowns are frustrating. Learn the causes. >> >> Digital Minute >> Should there be a law banning Google Glasses? Tune in today for my take. >> >> Must-see Video >> In which country is it illegal to eat haggis? What common condiment is banned in France? Click here to see 10 illegal foods! >> >> >> >> KIM'S FAVORITES >> >> FREE HDTV! >> Want to watch free, high-definition programming on your TV? Learn how to make an HD antenna with a wire coat hanger and a bit of free time. You will need: 6 wire hangers, 10 washers, 10 wood screws, 3' long piece of wood, 1 balun, screwdriver, pliers, wire cutter. >> >> >> MAKING DECORATIVE CANDLES >> It's been a while since people relied on candles for light. They are now used more for decoration and ambiance. That's why you want your candles to look decorative. Watch this amazing decorative candle being made. >> >> >> SAVE YOUR MUSIC COLLECTION >> Are your records and tapes collecting dust? Preserve your collection! 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With this contest you get to choose your favorite! Win either an HP Envy Ultrabook or a MacBook Pro with Retina display. Before you can choose, however, you have to win. >> Enter now! >> >> >> Advertise | Advertiser Comments | Get our other newsletters | Privacy Policy | Terms and Conditions >> >> To unsubscribe or modify your subscription, use our online form. >> >> Copyright © 2013 Weststar Multimedia Entertainment, Inc. All Rights Reserved. >> >> You may also unsubscribe by sending a request via postal mail. Please include your name, e-mail address and a printed copy of your newsletter e-mail. Send to: Unsubscribe Kim's Download of the Day, 2711 N. 24th St., Phoenix, AZ 85008. >> >> Please add kimsfreedailydownloadreply at lyris.komando.com to your address book ensure Kim's emails reach your inbox. > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com From Zunaira.Wasif at dbs.fldoe.org Thu Mar 28 17:47:27 2013 From: Zunaira.Wasif at dbs.fldoe.org (Wasif, Zunaira) Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2013 13:47:27 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? In-Reply-To: <007601ce29b0$89a94d80$9cfbe880$@gmail.com> References: <005b01ce29a9$de39e0f0$9aada2d0$@gmail.com> <007601ce29b0$89a94d80$9cfbe880$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE2CB@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> How can the mobility instructor see clients who do not have open cases with VR? How can the instructor be paid if the client isn't opened with VR? -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin williams Sent: Monday, March 25, 2013 7:29 PM To: 'Misty Dawn Bradley'; 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list' Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? Okay. Outstanding. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Misty Dawn Bradley Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 7:04 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? Hi, In some states, such as North Carolina, DSS helps you get in contact with a mobility instructor, and you don't have to have an open VR case to use the instructor. DSS in NC also offers a social worker for the blind in each county that will come to your house and label things, such as appliances and give you daily living items, such as marking supplies and talking watches. The social worker for the blind here got me in touch with the mobility instructor, and now I have her number, so whenever I need mobility I can call and set up an appointment, so I don't have to go through VR, although if you do have an open case with VR you can get more, such as better canes or whatever you need. Hth, Misty ----- Original Message ----- From: "justin williams" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Monday, March 25, 2013 6:41 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? >I didn't no that dss would nelp you with mobility. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman > Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 4:27 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? > > kaiti: > First, it is obvious that you live in a state that has a general rehab > agency rather than one dealing specifically with blindness. This is > unfortunate as you have discovered. However, knowing what you need and > want > and being able to cogently articulate your needs will go a long way toward > fulfilling them. You've seem this in the case of the Perkins > braillewriter. > Second, why do you need an O&M specialist to show you around campus? Could > not a friend or family member do the job? When you graduate and enter the > world of work, you won't have O&M instructors at your beck and call. It is > definitely helpful to develop the skill of learning new routes and places > with minimal assistance. This is the essence of structured discovery > learning. Could your DSS office help? This way, you wouldn't have to worry > about rehab at all. > > Mike Freeman > sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 26, 2013, at 12:49, Kaiti Shelton > wrote: > >> Hi all, >> >> Okay, so I'll confess that part of the reason I'm writing this email >> is to vent about my current circumstances, but more importantly than >> that I am interested in seeing how other states or parts of the >> country run their voc rehab services. I apologize if this email >> sounds venty, as in order to explain what I'm talking about I'll need >> to give specific examples, but I am really interested in hearing your >> thoughts on the matter based on your own experiences. >> >> The thing that makes me the most uncomfortable with the voc rehab >> system in my state is that the councelors don't necessarily know much >> about blindness, let alone what a blind student truly needs to be >> successful. My councelor fills her job capacity in terms of knowing >> how to do the paperwork, but my own mother has told me that when they >> chat as I'm signing papers and my mom brings up something relatively >> fundamental like a conversation about navigating campus or something, >> she'll notice that what she says goes over my councelor's head. This >> has caused a few concerning events in terms of the authorizations that >> have been made for me. In December for example I requested >> orientation and mobility training so I could go through my second >> semester schedule, as there were a few buildings I would need to use >> that I had not been to yet. I got in touch with my O&M guy and we >> planned to set up a time in January. I emailed my councelor and told >> her this, but then my O&M specialist emailed me back and asked if I >> would be on campus after the first semester ended in December, because >> that was when training was authorized. I had to email my councelor >> and tell her that the reason for going with January was that campus >> closed the last day of finals week, and a few days prior to the start >> of the second term I would be back on campus and most of the academic >> buildings would be reopened. Another time for this same semester I >> requested a Perkins Brailler, specifically specifying that the >> traditional braillers were much sturdier and more reliable than the >> plastic ones and justifying my request. When I got a call from my >> vendor she first informed me that the braillers were out of stock >> until February, half way through my semester, and then asked me what >> color I wanted. I told her that the new brailler was not what I >> thought I was getting and she got in touch with the councelor. I >> ended up getting a traditional anyway on the grounds that although the >> new generations were out of stock, there were plenty traditionals > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40g mail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmai l.co m _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40g mail .com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. fldoe.org From arielle71 at gmail.com Thu Mar 28 18:30:05 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2013 12:30:05 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? In-Reply-To: <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE2CB@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> References: <005b01ce29a9$de39e0f0$9aada2d0$@gmail.com> <007601ce29b0$89a94d80$9cfbe880$@gmail.com> <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE2CB@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> Message-ID: Sometimes state agencies will hire instructors to work with blind people in the state even if they don't have VR cases. Arizona did that for me. I just had to call someone and request O&M help and they gave it to me. The instructor I was assigned also worked with VR clients, but I wasn't a client yet. I think all his salary came from the same pool, though. Arielle On 3/28/13, Wasif, Zunaira wrote: > How can the mobility instructor see clients who do not have open cases > with VR? How can the instructor be paid if the client isn't opened with > VR? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin > williams > Sent: Monday, March 25, 2013 7:29 PM > To: 'Misty Dawn Bradley'; 'National Association of Blind Students > mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? > > Okay. Outstanding. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Misty Dawn > Bradley > Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 7:04 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? > > Hi, > In some states, such as North Carolina, DSS helps you get in contact > with a mobility instructor, and you don't have to have an open VR case > to use the instructor. DSS in NC also offers a social worker for the > blind in each county that will come to your house and label things, such > as appliances and > > give you daily living items, such as marking supplies and talking > watches. > The social worker for the blind here got me in touch with the mobility > instructor, and now I have her number, so whenever I need mobility I can > call and set up an appointment, so I don't have to go through VR, > although if you do have an open case with VR you can get more, such as > better canes or whatever you need. > Hth, > Misty > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "justin williams" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Monday, March 25, 2013 6:41 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? > > >>I didn't no that dss would nelp you with mobility. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike > Freeman >> Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 4:27 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? >> >> kaiti: >> First, it is obvious that you live in a state that has a general rehab >> agency rather than one dealing specifically with blindness. This is >> unfortunate as you have discovered. However, knowing what you need and > >> want >> and being able to cogently articulate your needs will go a long way > toward >> fulfilling them. You've seem this in the case of the Perkins >> braillewriter. >> Second, why do you need an O&M specialist to show you around campus? > Could >> not a friend or family member do the job? When you graduate and enter > the >> world of work, you won't have O&M instructors at your beck and call. > It is >> definitely helpful to develop the skill of learning new routes and > places >> with minimal assistance. This is the essence of structured discovery >> learning. Could your DSS office help? This way, you wouldn't have to > worry >> about rehab at all. >> >> Mike Freeman >> sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 26, 2013, at 12:49, Kaiti Shelton >> wrote: >> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> Okay, so I'll confess that part of the reason I'm writing this email >>> is to vent about my current circumstances, but more importantly than >>> that I am interested in seeing how other states or parts of the >>> country run their voc rehab services. I apologize if this email >>> sounds venty, as in order to explain what I'm talking about I'll need >>> to give specific examples, but I am really interested in hearing your >>> thoughts on the matter based on your own experiences. >>> >>> The thing that makes me the most uncomfortable with the voc rehab >>> system in my state is that the councelors don't necessarily know much >>> about blindness, let alone what a blind student truly needs to be >>> successful. My councelor fills her job capacity in terms of knowing >>> how to do the paperwork, but my own mother has told me that when they >>> chat as I'm signing papers and my mom brings up something relatively >>> fundamental like a conversation about navigating campus or something, >>> she'll notice that what she says goes over my councelor's head. This >>> has caused a few concerning events in terms of the authorizations > that >>> have been made for me. In December for example I requested >>> orientation and mobility training so I could go through my second >>> semester schedule, as there were a few buildings I would need to use >>> that I had not been to yet. I got in touch with my O&M guy and we >>> planned to set up a time in January. I emailed my councelor and told >>> her this, but then my O&M specialist emailed me back and asked if I >>> would be on campus after the first semester ended in December, > because >>> that was when training was authorized. I had to email my councelor >>> and tell her that the reason for going with January was that campus >>> closed the last day of finals week, and a few days prior to the start >>> of the second term I would be back on campus and most of the academic >>> buildings would be reopened. Another time for this same semester I >>> requested a Perkins Brailler, specifically specifying that the >>> traditional braillers were much sturdier and more reliable than the >>> plastic ones and justifying my request. When I got a call from my >>> vendor she first informed me that the braillers were out of stock >>> until February, half way through my semester, and then asked me what >>> color I wanted. I told her that the new brailler was not what I >>> thought I was getting and she got in touch with the councelor. I >>> ended up getting a traditional anyway on the grounds that although > the >>> new generations were out of stock, there were plenty traditionals >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40g > mail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gmai > l.co > m > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40g > mail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. > fldoe.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From Zunaira.Wasif at dbs.fldoe.org Thu Mar 28 19:00:37 2013 From: Zunaira.Wasif at dbs.fldoe.org (Wasif, Zunaira) Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2013 15:00:37 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? In-Reply-To: References: <005b01ce29a9$de39e0f0$9aada2d0$@gmail.com><007601ce29b0$89a94d80$9cfbe880$@gmail.com><2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE2CB@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> Message-ID: <2D01309C2F5D5C4C93CC5DE084807DF2081DE2D0@DBSSOEXCHANGE.fldbs.net> Maybe the instructors are contracted or something. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle Silverman Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 2:30 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? Sometimes state agencies will hire instructors to work with blind people in the state even if they don't have VR cases. Arizona did that for me. I just had to call someone and request O&M help and they gave it to me. The instructor I was assigned also worked with VR clients, but I wasn't a client yet. I think all his salary came from the same pool, though. Arielle On 3/28/13, Wasif, Zunaira wrote: > How can the mobility instructor see clients who do not have open cases > with VR? How can the instructor be paid if the client isn't opened > with VR? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of justin > williams > Sent: Monday, March 25, 2013 7:29 PM > To: 'Misty Dawn Bradley'; 'National Association of Blind Students > mailing list' > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? > > Okay. Outstanding. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Misty > Dawn Bradley > Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 7:04 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? > > Hi, > In some states, such as North Carolina, DSS helps you get in contact > with a mobility instructor, and you don't have to have an open VR case > to use the instructor. DSS in NC also offers a social worker for the > blind in each county that will come to your house and label things, > such as appliances and > > give you daily living items, such as marking supplies and talking > watches. > The social worker for the blind here got me in touch with the mobility > instructor, and now I have her number, so whenever I need mobility I > can call and set up an appointment, so I don't have to go through VR, > although if you do have an open case with VR you can get more, such as > better canes or whatever you need. > Hth, > Misty > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "justin williams" > To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" > > Sent: Monday, March 25, 2013 6:41 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? > > >>I didn't no that dss would nelp you with mobility. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike > Freeman >> Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 4:27 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] VR thoughts/what do you all think? >> >> kaiti: >> First, it is obvious that you live in a state that has a general >> rehab agency rather than one dealing specifically with blindness. >> This is unfortunate as you have discovered. However, knowing what you >> need and > >> want >> and being able to cogently articulate your needs will go a long way > toward >> fulfilling them. You've seem this in the case of the Perkins >> braillewriter. >> Second, why do you need an O&M specialist to show you around campus? > Could >> not a friend or family member do the job? When you graduate and enter > the >> world of work, you won't have O&M instructors at your beck and call. > It is >> definitely helpful to develop the skill of learning new routes and > places >> with minimal assistance. This is the essence of structured discovery >> learning. Could your DSS office help? This way, you wouldn't have to > worry >> about rehab at all. >> >> Mike Freeman >> sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 26, 2013, at 12:49, Kaiti Shelton >> >> wrote: >> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> Okay, so I'll confess that part of the reason I'm writing this email >>> is to vent about my current circumstances, but more importantly than >>> that I am interested in seeing how other states or parts of the >>> country run their voc rehab services. I apologize if this email >>> sounds venty, as in order to explain what I'm talking about I'll >>> need to give specific examples, but I am really interested in >>> hearing your thoughts on the matter based on your own experiences. >>> >>> The thing that makes me the most uncomfortable with the voc rehab >>> system in my state is that the councelors don't necessarily know >>> much about blindness, let alone what a blind student truly needs to >>> be successful. My councelor fills her job capacity in terms of >>> knowing how to do the paperwork, but my own mother has told me that >>> when they chat as I'm signing papers and my mom brings up something >>> relatively fundamental like a conversation about navigating campus >>> or something, she'll notice that what she says goes over my >>> councelor's head. This has caused a few concerning events in terms >>> of the authorizations > that >>> have been made for me. In December for example I requested >>> orientation and mobility training so I could go through my second >>> semester schedule, as there were a few buildings I would need to use >>> that I had not been to yet. I got in touch with my O&M guy and we >>> planned to set up a time in January. I emailed my councelor and >>> told her this, but then my O&M specialist emailed me back and asked >>> if I would be on campus after the first semester ended in December, > because >>> that was when training was authorized. I had to email my councelor >>> and tell her that the reason for going with January was that campus >>> closed the last day of finals week, and a few days prior to the >>> start of the second term I would be back on campus and most of the >>> academic buildings would be reopened. Another time for this same >>> semester I requested a Perkins Brailler, specifically specifying >>> that the traditional braillers were much sturdier and more reliable >>> than the plastic ones and justifying my request. When I got a call >>> from my vendor she first informed me that the braillers were out of >>> stock until February, half way through my semester, and then asked >>> me what color I wanted. I told her that the new brailler was not >>> what I thought I was getting and she got in touch with the >>> councelor. I ended up getting a traditional anyway on the grounds >>> that although > the >>> new generations were out of stock, there were plenty traditionals >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0g > mail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mistydbradley%40gm > ai > l.co > m > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0g > mail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. > fldoe.org > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. > com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zunaira.wasif%40dbs. fldoe.org From jty727 at gmail.com Thu Mar 28 19:02:59 2013 From: jty727 at gmail.com (Justin Young) Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2013 15:02:59 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Becoming a Notary Message-ID: Hi All, I have a question. Does anyone on this list know if it would be possible for a blind person to become a notary? I was curious about it so I thought I'd start by asking on this list of how would one go about doing it? Thanks as always! Justin From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Thu Mar 28 23:28:41 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2013 19:28:41 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question Message-ID: Hi all, About a year ago I bought one of those new telescopic canes from the online NFb store. They were the latest model, (carbon fiber I believe), with a metal glide tip, and the handle was covered in a smooth material, probably a rubber coating, although it was hard. I believe it extended to five sections). Anyway, it has given out on me and I need to buy a new one before I leave town for a conference next weekend. I looked on the web site and didn't see the model there. Does anyone know if they still sell it? (I looked at the one that says, "rubberized handle,) but it isn't the same one I had). I'd love to be able to just replace the cane I have with the same model, as I really like the feel and how it doesn't collapse as often. Thanks, -- Kaiti From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 28 00:35:11 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 20:35:11 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> Try the Nfb store. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 7:29 PM To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question Hi all, About a year ago I bought one of those new telescopic canes from the online NFb store. They were the latest model, (carbon fiber I believe), with a metal glide tip, and the handle was covered in a smooth material, probably a rubber coating, although it was hard. I believe it extended to five sections). Anyway, it has given out on me and I need to buy a new one before I leave town for a conference next weekend. I looked on the web site and didn't see the model there. Does anyone know if they still sell it? (I looked at the one that says, "rubberized handle,) but it isn't the same one I had). I'd love to be able to just replace the cane I have with the same model, as I really like the feel and how it doesn't collapse as often. Thanks, -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Fri Mar 29 01:22:16 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2013 21:22:16 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: That's where I was. My point was I don't see it there anymore. On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: > Try the Nfb store. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 7:29 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question > > Hi all, > > About a year ago I bought one of those new telescopic canes from the online > NFb store. They were the latest model, (carbon fiber I believe), with a > metal glide tip, and the handle was covered in a smooth material, probably > a > rubber coating, although it was hard. I believe it extended to five > sections). > > Anyway, it has given out on me and I need to buy a new one before I leave > town for a conference next weekend. I looked on the web site and didn't > see > the model there. Does anyone know if they still sell it? (I looked at the > one that says, "rubberized handle,) but it isn't the same one I had). I'd > love to be able to just replace the cane I have with the same model, as I > really like the feel and how it doesn't collapse as often. > > Thanks, > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Fri Mar 29 01:24:08 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2013 21:24:08 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: I'm trying to figure out if they changed the product listing or something or see if it's somewhere else since it's not in the listing with all the other canes anymore. If I need to get a different model I will, but I'm just checking before I look into other options because I really liked the one I had. On 3/28/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > That's where I was. My point was I don't see it there anymore. > > On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: >> Try the Nfb store. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >> Shelton >> Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 7:29 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >> >> Hi all, >> >> About a year ago I bought one of those new telescopic canes from the >> online >> NFb store. They were the latest model, (carbon fiber I believe), with a >> metal glide tip, and the handle was covered in a smooth material, >> probably >> a >> rubber coating, although it was hard. I believe it extended to five >> sections). >> >> Anyway, it has given out on me and I need to buy a new one before I leave >> town for a conference next weekend. I looked on the web site and didn't >> see >> the model there. Does anyone know if they still sell it? (I looked at >> the >> one that says, "rubberized handle,) but it isn't the same one I had). >> I'd >> love to be able to just replace the cane I have with the same model, as I >> really like the feel and how it doesn't collapse as often. >> >> Thanks, >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > -- Kaiti From brice.smith319 at gmail.com Fri Mar 29 01:32:11 2013 From: brice.smith319 at gmail.com (Brice Smith) Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2013 21:32:11 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <-7368835189641565031@unknownmsgid> I believe their folding cane uses a rubber handle, so it's likely they transitioned the telescoping cane over to that handle. At any rate, that style of telescopic cane is a huge inprovement over the old style and i really don't think they would go back. I'd call the office tomorrow and make sure. Brice On Mar 28, 2013, at 7:29 PM, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Hi all, > > About a year ago I bought one of those new telescopic canes from the > online NFb store. They were the latest model, (carbon fiber I > believe), with a metal glide tip, and the handle was covered in a > smooth material, probably a rubber coating, although it was hard. I > believe it extended to five sections). > > Anyway, it has given out on me and I need to buy a new one before I > leave town for a conference next weekend. I looked on the web site > and didn't see the model there. Does anyone know if they still sell > it? (I looked at the one that says, "rubberized handle,) but it isn't > the same one I had). I'd love to be able to just replace the cane I > have with the same model, as I really like the feel and how it doesn't > collapse as often. > > Thanks, > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 28 02:54:48 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 22:54:48 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> Have you tried ambutec? -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 9:22 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question That's where I was. My point was I don't see it there anymore. On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: > Try the Nfb store. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti > Shelton > Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 7:29 PM > To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org > Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question > > Hi all, > > About a year ago I bought one of those new telescopic canes from the > online NFb store. They were the latest model, (carbon fiber I > believe), with a metal glide tip, and the handle was covered in a > smooth material, probably a rubber coating, although it was hard. I > believe it extended to five sections). > > Anyway, it has given out on me and I need to buy a new one before I > leave town for a conference next weekend. I looked on the web site > and didn't see the model there. Does anyone know if they still sell > it? (I looked at the one that says, "rubberized handle,) but it isn't > the same one I had). I'd love to be able to just replace the cane I > have with the same model, as I really like the feel and how it doesn't > collapse as often. > > Thanks, > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% > 40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From nimerjaber1 at gmail.com Fri Mar 29 03:09:45 2013 From: nimerjaber1 at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Nimer_M=2E_Jaber=2C_IC=B3?=) Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2013 21:09:45 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Justin, she doesn't want ambutec, she wants NFB. And I second Bryce's comment, call up the store tomorrow. On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: > Have you tried ambutec? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 9:22 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question > > That's where I was. My point was I don't see it there anymore. > > On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: >> Try the Nfb store. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >> Shelton >> Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 7:29 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >> >> Hi all, >> >> About a year ago I bought one of those new telescopic canes from the >> online NFb store. They were the latest model, (carbon fiber I >> believe), with a metal glide tip, and the handle was covered in a >> smooth material, probably a rubber coating, although it was hard. I >> believe it extended to five sections). >> >> Anyway, it has given out on me and I need to buy a new one before I >> leave town for a conference next weekend. I looked on the web site >> and didn't see the model there. Does anyone know if they still sell >> it? (I looked at the one that says, "rubberized handle,) but it isn't >> the same one I had). I'd love to be able to just replace the cane I >> have with the same model, as I really like the feel and how it doesn't >> collapse as often. >> >> Thanks, >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% >> 40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nimerjaber1%40gmail.com > -- Cordially, Nimer Jaber Please take the time to read this signature completely as it contains some information about the email you have just read and all attachments contained within as well as some valuable resources and methods for contacting me if you have any questions or wish to talk. The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient, please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents by anyone other than the intended recipient may result in civil or criminal action. I have checked this email and all corresponding attachments for security threats. However, security of your machine is up to you. Thanks. Registered Linux User 529141. http://counter.li.org/ Vinux testing and documentation coordinator To get more information about a free and accessible operating system, please click here: http://www.vinuxproject.org To find out about a free and versatile screen reader for windows XP and above, please click here: http://www.nvda-project.org You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news. Check out my blog related to technology by clicking here: http://nimertech.blogspot.com To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (720) (251-4530) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly. Thank you, and have a great day! From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 28 03:17:17 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 23:17:17 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <000d01ce2b62$c153ff60$43fbfe20$@gmail.com> Oh, I thought she said she was just at the store and it didn't have what she wanted. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Nimer M. Jaber, IC³ Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 11:10 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question Justin, she doesn't want ambutec, she wants NFB. And I second Bryce's comment, call up the store tomorrow. On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: > Have you tried ambutec? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti > Shelton > Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 9:22 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question > > That's where I was. My point was I don't see it there anymore. > > On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: >> Try the Nfb store. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >> Shelton >> Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 7:29 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >> >> Hi all, >> >> About a year ago I bought one of those new telescopic canes from the >> online NFb store. They were the latest model, (carbon fiber I >> believe), with a metal glide tip, and the handle was covered in a >> smooth material, probably a rubber coating, although it was hard. I >> believe it extended to five sections). >> >> Anyway, it has given out on me and I need to buy a new one before I >> leave town for a conference next weekend. I looked on the web site >> and didn't see the model there. Does anyone know if they still sell >> it? (I looked at the one that says, "rubberized handle,) but it >> isn't the same one I had). I'd love to be able to just replace the >> cane I have with the same model, as I really like the feel and how it >> doesn't collapse as often. >> >> Thanks, >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2% >> 4 >> 0gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104 >> % >> 40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nimerjaber1%40gmai > l.com > -- Cordially, Nimer Jaber Please take the time to read this signature completely as it contains some information about the email you have just read and all attachments contained within as well as some valuable resources and methods for contacting me if you have any questions or wish to talk. The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient, please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents by anyone other than the intended recipient may result in civil or criminal action. I have checked this email and all corresponding attachments for security threats. However, security of your machine is up to you. Thanks. Registered Linux User 529141. http://counter.li.org/ Vinux testing and documentation coordinator To get more information about a free and accessible operating system, please click here: http://www.vinuxproject.org To find out about a free and versatile screen reader for windows XP and above, please click here: http://www.nvda-project.org You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news. Check out my blog related to technology by clicking here: http://nimertech.blogspot.com To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (720) (251-4530) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly. Thank you, and have a great day! _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 28 03:19:47 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2013 23:19:47 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com> What's up with the tone of that email homes? -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Nimer M. Jaber, IC³ Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 11:10 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question Justin, she doesn't want ambutec, she wants NFB. And I second Bryce's comment, call up the store tomorrow. On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: > Have you tried ambutec? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton > Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 9:22 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question > > That's where I was. My point was I don't see it there anymore. > > On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: >> Try the Nfb store. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >> Shelton >> Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 7:29 PM >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >> >> Hi all, >> >> About a year ago I bought one of those new telescopic canes from the >> online NFb store. They were the latest model, (carbon fiber I >> believe), with a metal glide tip, and the handle was covered in a >> smooth material, probably a rubber coating, although it was hard. I >> believe it extended to five sections). >> >> Anyway, it has given out on me and I need to buy a new one before I >> leave town for a conference next weekend. I looked on the web site >> and didn't see the model there. Does anyone know if they still sell >> it? (I looked at the one that says, "rubberized handle,) but it isn't >> the same one I had). I'd love to be able to just replace the cane I >> have with the same model, as I really like the feel and how it doesn't >> collapse as often. >> >> Thanks, >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% >> 40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nimerjaber1%40gmail.com > -- Cordially, Nimer Jaber Please take the time to read this signature completely as it contains some information about the email you have just read and all attachments contained within as well as some valuable resources and methods for contacting me if you have any questions or wish to talk. The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient, please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents by anyone other than the intended recipient may result in civil or criminal action. I have checked this email and all corresponding attachments for security threats. However, security of your machine is up to you. Thanks. Registered Linux User 529141. http://counter.li.org/ Vinux testing and documentation coordinator To get more information about a free and accessible operating system, please click here: http://www.vinuxproject.org To find out about a free and versatile screen reader for windows XP and above, please click here: http://www.nvda-project.org You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news. Check out my blog related to technology by clicking here: http://nimertech.blogspot.com To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (720) (251-4530) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly. Thank you, and have a great day! _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From brlsurfer at gmail.com Fri Mar 29 03:29:42 2013 From: brlsurfer at gmail.com (vejas) Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2013 20:29:42 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] how accessible is the website turnitin? Message-ID: <51550aaa.c823310a.250e.ffff9871@mx.google.com> Hi guys, In my English class we're using turnitin.com, and I am having trouble with it. I have to peer-mark someone's essay and comment on the site. I tried using my i-phone with voice-over but couldn't find some of the buttons. I will also try using jaws. Has anyone had problems with turnitin? If so, what problems did you encounter? Is the site even accessible? Thanks. Vejas From zdreicer at gmail.com Fri Mar 29 03:38:24 2013 From: zdreicer at gmail.com (Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer) Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2013 21:38:24 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] how accessible is the website turnitin? In-Reply-To: <51550aaa.c823310a.250e.ffff9871@mx.google.com> References: <51550aaa.c823310a.250e.ffff9871@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <8838E69D-EC29-4079-933B-8DC61B34C3FD@gmail.com> Good evening! I have used that site in a number of English classes myself, and found only be upload tool to be accessible. Caremark, unfortunately… Is not Sent from my iPhone Using voice over On Mar 28, 2013, at 9:29 PM, vejas wrote: > Hi guys, > In my English class we're using turnitin.com, and I am having trouble with it. I have to peer-mark someone's essay and comment on the site. I tried using my i-phone with voice-over but couldn't find some of the buttons. I will also try using jaws. Has anyone had problems with turnitin? If so, what problems did you encounter? Is the site even accessible? > Thanks. > Vejas > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail.com From brlsurfer at gmail.com Fri Mar 29 04:03:07 2013 From: brlsurfer at gmail.com (vejas) Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2013 21:03:07 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] how accessible is the website turnitin? Message-ID: <5155127f.6627310a.0d8f.ffff9fd2@mx.google.com> What makes peer-mark inaccessible? I'd like to know so that maybe I can figure out how to find a way around it. Vejas ----- Original Message ----- From: "Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer" wrote: Hi guys, In my English class we're using turnitin.com, and I am having trouble with it. I have to peer-mark someone's essay and comment on the site. I tried using my i-phone with voice-over but couldn't find some of the buttons. I will also try using jaws. Has anyone had problems with turnitin? If so, what problems did you encounter? Is the site even accessible? Thanks. Vejas _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm ail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brlsurfer%40g mail.com From zdreicer at gmail.com Fri Mar 29 05:11:10 2013 From: zdreicer at gmail.com (Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer) Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2013 23:11:10 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] how accessible is the website turnitin? In-Reply-To: <5155127f.6627310a.0d8f.ffff9fd2@mx.google.com> References: <5155127f.6627310a.0d8f.ffff9fd2@mx.google.com> Message-ID: IDK, perhaps the software? Jaws? Or combination of the 2. I have never really had time to check it out. Sent from my iPhone Using voice over On Mar 28, 2013, at 10:03 PM, vejas wrote: > What makes peer-mark inaccessible? I'd like to know so that maybe I can figure out how to find a way around it. > Vejas > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer" To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Date sent: Thu, 28 Mar 2013 21:38:24 -0600 > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] how accessible is the website turnitin? > > Good evening! I have used that site in a number of English classes myself, and found only be upload tool to be accessible. Caremark, unfortunately… Is not > > Sent from my iPhone Using voice over > > On Mar 28, 2013, at 9:29 PM, vejas wrote: > > Hi guys, > In my English class we're using turnitin.com, and I am having trouble with it. I have to peer-mark someone's essay and comment on the site. I tried using my i-phone with voice-over but couldn't find some of the buttons. I will also try using jaws. Has anyone had problems with turnitin? If so, what problems did you encounter? Is the site even accessible? > Thanks. > Vejas > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm > ail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brlsurfer%40g > mail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail.com From mauriciopmalmeida at gmail.com Fri Mar 29 05:16:21 2013 From: mauriciopmalmeida at gmail.com (Mauricio Almeida) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 01:16:21 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] how accessible is the website turnitin? In-Reply-To: References: <5155127f.6627310a.0d8f.ffff9fd2@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <272735FF-B745-4523-8B9D-FFE79E25DB96@gmail.com> hello, I have used turnitin.com as an uploading tool for my IB history class, and it worked fine with both jaws and voiceover. mauricio On Mar 29, 2013, at 1:11 AM, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer wrote: > IDK, perhaps the software? Jaws? Or combination of the 2. I have never really had time to check it out. > > Sent from my iPhone Using voice over > > On Mar 28, 2013, at 10:03 PM, vejas wrote: > >> What makes peer-mark inaccessible? I'd like to know so that maybe I can figure out how to find a way around it. >> Vejas >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer" > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Date sent: Thu, 28 Mar 2013 21:38:24 -0600 >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] how accessible is the website turnitin? >> >> Good evening! I have used that site in a number of English classes myself, and found only be upload tool to be accessible. Caremark, unfortunately… Is not >> >> Sent from my iPhone Using voice over >> >> On Mar 28, 2013, at 9:29 PM, vejas wrote: >> >> Hi guys, >> In my English class we're using turnitin.com, and I am having trouble with it. I have to peer-mark someone's essay and comment on the site. I tried using my i-phone with voice-over but couldn't find some of the buttons. I will also try using jaws. Has anyone had problems with turnitin? If so, what problems did you encounter? Is the site even accessible? >> Thanks. >> Vejas >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm >> ail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brlsurfer%40g >> mail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mauriciopmalmeida%40gmail.com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Fri Mar 29 07:04:18 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 03:04:18 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] how accessible is the website turnitin? In-Reply-To: <272735FF-B745-4523-8B9D-FFE79E25DB96@gmail.com> References: <5155127f.6627310a.0d8f.ffff9fd2@mx.google.com> <272735FF-B745-4523-8B9D-FFE79E25DB96@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, The upload part of the site is fine, but peer-marking will not work and is totally inaccessible. I'd suggest letting your teacher know that this is something you can't do with your screenreader, and try to work something out by emailing the essay with comments and such to the other student or teacher (if you're doing an annonymous peer-edit thing), or dropbox or something accessible. On 3/29/13, Mauricio Almeida wrote: > hello, > > I have used turnitin.com as an uploading tool for my IB history class, and > it worked fine with both jaws and voiceover. > > mauricio > On Mar 29, 2013, at 1:11 AM, Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer > wrote: > >> IDK, perhaps the software? Jaws? Or combination of the 2. I have never >> really had time to check it out. >> >> Sent from my iPhone Using voice over >> >> On Mar 28, 2013, at 10:03 PM, vejas wrote: >> >>> What makes peer-mark inaccessible? I'd like to know so that maybe I can >>> figure out how to find a way around it. >>> Vejas >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer" >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> >> Date sent: Thu, 28 Mar 2013 21:38:24 -0600 >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] how accessible is the website turnitin? >>> >>> Good evening! I have used that site in a number of English classes >>> myself, and found only be upload tool to be accessible. Caremark, >>> unfortunately… Is not >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone Using voice over >>> >>> On Mar 28, 2013, at 9:29 PM, vejas wrote: >>> >>> Hi guys, >>> In my English class we're using turnitin.com, and I am having trouble >>> with it. I have to peer-mark someone's essay and comment on the site. I >>> tried using my i-phone with voice-over but couldn't find some of the >>> buttons. I will also try using jaws. Has anyone had problems with >>> turnitin? If so, what problems did you encounter? Is the site even >>> accessible? >>> Thanks. >>> Vejas >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gm >>> ail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brlsurfer%40g >>> mail.com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mauriciopmalmeida%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Fri Mar 29 07:10:51 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 03:10:51 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com> References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, I actually did try Ambutech too after the NFB store didn't show the model, as I know they sell the telescopic canes too, but they didn't have it either and their prices were higher anyway. I will call tomorrow and see what the deal is with the search results showing up on the NFB site. Perhaps they've changed the listing or have it stored in some funky place on the site separate from their other white canes (I don't see why they would, but it could happen I guess). Agreeing with Brice, I really hope that it is somewhere on there, because it really was a huge improvement over the older models. On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: > What's up with the tone of that email homes? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Nimer M. > Jaber, > IC³ > Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 11:10 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question > > Justin, she doesn't want ambutec, she wants NFB. And I second Bryce's > comment, call up the store tomorrow. > > On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: >> Have you tried ambutec? >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >> Shelton >> Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 9:22 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >> >> That's where I was. My point was I don't see it there anymore. >> >> On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: >>> Try the Nfb store. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>> Shelton >>> Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 7:29 PM >>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> About a year ago I bought one of those new telescopic canes from the >>> online NFb store. They were the latest model, (carbon fiber I >>> believe), with a metal glide tip, and the handle was covered in a >>> smooth material, probably a rubber coating, although it was hard. I >>> believe it extended to five sections). >>> >>> Anyway, it has given out on me and I need to buy a new one before I >>> leave town for a conference next weekend. I looked on the web site >>> and didn't see the model there. Does anyone know if they still sell >>> it? (I looked at the one that says, "rubberized handle,) but it isn't >>> the same one I had). I'd love to be able to just replace the cane I >>> have with the same model, as I really like the feel and how it doesn't >>> collapse as often. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>> 0gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% >>> 40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nimerjaber1%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Cordially, > > Nimer Jaber > > Please take the time to read this signature completely as it contains > some information about the email you have just read and all > attachments contained within as well as some valuable resources and > methods for contacting me if you have any questions or wish to talk. > > The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was > addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient, > please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this > correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents > by anyone other than the intended recipient may result in civil or > criminal action. I have checked this email and all corresponding > attachments for security threats. However, security of your machine is > up to you. Thanks. > > Registered Linux User 529141. > http://counter.li.org/ > Vinux testing and documentation coordinator > To get more information about a free and accessible operating system, > please click here: > http://www.vinuxproject.org > > To find out about a free and versatile screen reader for windows XP > and above, please click here: > http://www.nvda-project.org > > You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news. > > Check out my blog related to technology by clicking here: > http://nimertech.blogspot.com > > To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (720) > (251-4530) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly. Thank > you, and have a great day! > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Fri Mar 29 07:21:21 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 07:21:21 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com>, Message-ID: I bought an NFB folding cane, and a straight cane from them! I had issues with the tip coming off of the straight cane, and the folding cane broke after the first day, because they aren't stirdy enough! I had a telescoping cane as well, and it would collapse when I didn't want it to, and it wouldn't collapse when I did! Ambutech, (on the other hand,) is awesome! Their canes are stirdyer, and they may be bulky, but they get the job done! I can't imagine myself with a thinner cane, no matter what it is! My Ambutech cane has lasted longer than my VR canes, and those NFB canes combined! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:10 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question Hi, I actually did try Ambutech too after the NFB store didn't show the model, as I know they sell the telescopic canes too, but they didn't have it either and their prices were higher anyway. I will call tomorrow and see what the deal is with the search results showing up on the NFB site. Perhaps they've changed the listing or have it stored in some funky place on the site separate from their other white canes (I don't see why they would, but it could happen I guess). Agreeing with Brice, I really hope that it is somewhere on there, because it really was a huge improvement over the older models. On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: > What's up with the tone of that email homes? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Nimer M. > Jaber, > IC³ > Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 11:10 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question > > Justin, she doesn't want ambutec, she wants NFB. And I second Bryce's > comment, call up the store tomorrow. > > On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: >> Have you tried ambutec? >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >> Shelton >> Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 9:22 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >> >> That's where I was. My point was I don't see it there anymore. >> >> On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: >>> Try the Nfb store. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>> Shelton >>> Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 7:29 PM >>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> About a year ago I bought one of those new telescopic canes from the >>> online NFb store. They were the latest model, (carbon fiber I >>> believe), with a metal glide tip, and the handle was covered in a >>> smooth material, probably a rubber coating, although it was hard. I >>> believe it extended to five sections). >>> >>> Anyway, it has given out on me and I need to buy a new one before I >>> leave town for a conference next weekend. I looked on the web site >>> and didn't see the model there. Does anyone know if they still sell >>> it? (I looked at the one that says, "rubberized handle,) but it isn't >>> the same one I had). I'd love to be able to just replace the cane I >>> have with the same model, as I really like the feel and how it doesn't >>> collapse as often. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>> 0gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% >>> 40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nimerjaber1%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Cordially, > > Nimer Jaber > > Please take the time to read this signature completely as it contains > some information about the email you have just read and all > attachments contained within as well as some valuable resources and > methods for contacting me if you have any questions or wish to talk. > > The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was > addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient, > please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this > correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents > by anyone other than the intended recipient may result in civil or > criminal action. I have checked this email and all corresponding > attachments for security threats. However, security of your machine is > up to you. Thanks. > > Registered Linux User 529141. > http://counter.li.org/ > Vinux testing and documentation coordinator > To get more information about a free and accessible operating system, > please click here: > http://www.vinuxproject.org > > To find out about a free and versatile screen reader for windows XP > and above, please click here: > http://www.nvda-project.org > > You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news. > > Check out my blog related to technology by clicking here: > http://nimertech.blogspot.com > > To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (720) > (251-4530) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly. Thank > you, and have a great day! > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Fri Mar 29 07:26:41 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 07:26:41 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com>, , Message-ID: Another thing I should mention, is that I found out that cane tips cost over $1.50, per tip! Good grief! Those tips are small, unlike the tips you find on VR canes! Why not just charge 50 cents a tip? Thanks, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Joshua Lester [JLester8462 at pccua.edu] Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:21 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question I bought an NFB folding cane, and a straight cane from them! I had issues with the tip coming off of the straight cane, and the folding cane broke after the first day, because they aren't stirdy enough! I had a telescoping cane as well, and it would collapse when I didn't want it to, and it wouldn't collapse when I did! Ambutech, (on the other hand,) is awesome! Their canes are stirdyer, and they may be bulky, but they get the job done! I can't imagine myself with a thinner cane, no matter what it is! My Ambutech cane has lasted longer than my VR canes, and those NFB canes combined! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:10 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question Hi, I actually did try Ambutech too after the NFB store didn't show the model, as I know they sell the telescopic canes too, but they didn't have it either and their prices were higher anyway. I will call tomorrow and see what the deal is with the search results showing up on the NFB site. Perhaps they've changed the listing or have it stored in some funky place on the site separate from their other white canes (I don't see why they would, but it could happen I guess). Agreeing with Brice, I really hope that it is somewhere on there, because it really was a huge improvement over the older models. On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: > What's up with the tone of that email homes? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Nimer M. > Jaber, > IC³ > Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 11:10 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question > > Justin, she doesn't want ambutec, she wants NFB. And I second Bryce's > comment, call up the store tomorrow. > > On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: >> Have you tried ambutec? >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >> Shelton >> Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 9:22 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >> >> That's where I was. My point was I don't see it there anymore. >> >> On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: >>> Try the Nfb store. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>> Shelton >>> Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 7:29 PM >>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> About a year ago I bought one of those new telescopic canes from the >>> online NFb store. They were the latest model, (carbon fiber I >>> believe), with a metal glide tip, and the handle was covered in a >>> smooth material, probably a rubber coating, although it was hard. I >>> believe it extended to five sections). >>> >>> Anyway, it has given out on me and I need to buy a new one before I >>> leave town for a conference next weekend. I looked on the web site >>> and didn't see the model there. Does anyone know if they still sell >>> it? (I looked at the one that says, "rubberized handle,) but it isn't >>> the same one I had). I'd love to be able to just replace the cane I >>> have with the same model, as I really like the feel and how it doesn't >>> collapse as often. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>> 0gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% >>> 40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nimerjaber1%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Cordially, > > Nimer Jaber > > Please take the time to read this signature completely as it contains > some information about the email you have just read and all > attachments contained within as well as some valuable resources and > methods for contacting me if you have any questions or wish to talk. > > The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was > addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient, > please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this > correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents > by anyone other than the intended recipient may result in civil or > criminal action. I have checked this email and all corresponding > attachments for security threats. However, security of your machine is > up to you. Thanks. > > Registered Linux User 529141. > http://counter.li.org/ > Vinux testing and documentation coordinator > To get more information about a free and accessible operating system, > please click here: > http://www.vinuxproject.org > > To find out about a free and versatile screen reader for windows XP > and above, please click here: > http://www.nvda-project.org > > You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news. > > Check out my blog related to technology by clicking here: > http://nimertech.blogspot.com > > To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (720) > (251-4530) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly. Thank > you, and have a great day! > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Fri Mar 29 08:00:50 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 04:00:50 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com> Message-ID: posite; telescopic canes last much longer for me than the folding ones, I think because of the weight and because of my pace. That is why I prefer the NFB canes and will most likely avoid the bulky folding ones. The next time someone tells you an Ambutech cane, or an aluminum one, is indestructable, don't necessarily buy it. In the first week of school this year I was going out to a campus event with some friends and because I had issues with people stepping on and breaking my telescopic canes in high school I chose to take my folding one from ambutech. It was so heavy for me that when I stepped off the curb it went down into a drainage grate. It must have gone right between the bars because I didn't feel it hit anything or realize it wasn't on the ground, but I kept walking and tripped when I felt that my cane wasn't coming with me. I dropped it and when a friend of mine grabbed it and pulled it out of the grate the bottom shaft was sliced open where the grate had dug into it and it was bent at a 45 degree angle from where it should have been. For a while I used a straight cane that was kind of my old-faithful cane, (My O&M instructor and I made it when I was in the 4th grade and I still had it as a college freshman). It was a little short for me, but I didn't grow much after making it so it would have worked all right till I could order a new one over Christmas break. Then again, I was walking with friends, and the cane got stuck in a really big crack in the sidewalk. When we pulled it out the tip was still wedged into the crack, but the bottom of the shaft was dented all over to the point where I doubt another tip would be able to stay on it. (The kicker was that this all happened within a month). Then I started using the telescopic cane because I had no other choice, and not only were people more conscious about avoiding stepping on a white stick, but all my problems with grates and sidewalk cracks magically went away. (and my wrist liked it better too). On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: > Another thing I should mention, is that I found out that cane tips cost over > $1.50, per tip! > Good grief! > Those tips are small, unlike the tips you find on VR canes! > Why not just charge 50 cents a tip? > Thanks, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Joshua Lester > [JLester8462 at pccua.edu] > Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:21 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question > > I bought an NFB folding cane, and a straight cane from them! > I had issues with the tip coming off of the straight cane, and the folding > cane broke after the first day, because they aren't stirdy enough! > I had a telescoping cane as well, and it would collapse when I didn't want > it to, and it wouldn't collapse when I did! > Ambutech, (on the other hand,) is awesome! > Their canes are stirdyer, and they may be bulky, but they get the job done! > I can't imagine myself with a thinner cane, no matter what it is! > My Ambutech cane has lasted longer than my VR canes, and those NFB canes > combined! > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton > [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:10 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question > > Hi, > > I actually did try Ambutech too after the NFB store didn't show the > model, as I know they sell the telescopic canes too, but they didn't > have it either and their prices were higher anyway. I will call > tomorrow and see what the deal is with the search results showing up > on the NFB site. Perhaps they've changed the listing or have it > stored in some funky place on the site separate from their other white > canes (I don't see why they would, but it could happen I guess). > Agreeing with Brice, I really hope that it is somewhere on there, > because it really was a huge improvement over the older models. > > On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: >> What's up with the tone of that email homes? >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Nimer M. >> Jaber, >> IC³ >> Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 11:10 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >> >> Justin, she doesn't want ambutec, she wants NFB. And I second Bryce's >> comment, call up the store tomorrow. >> >> On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: >>> Have you tried ambutec? >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>> Shelton >>> Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 9:22 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>> >>> That's where I was. My point was I don't see it there anymore. >>> >>> On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: >>>> Try the Nfb store. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>>> Shelton >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 7:29 PM >>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>> >>>> Hi all, >>>> >>>> About a year ago I bought one of those new telescopic canes from the >>>> online NFb store. They were the latest model, (carbon fiber I >>>> believe), with a metal glide tip, and the handle was covered in a >>>> smooth material, probably a rubber coating, although it was hard. I >>>> believe it extended to five sections). >>>> >>>> Anyway, it has given out on me and I need to buy a new one before I >>>> leave town for a conference next weekend. I looked on the web site >>>> and didn't see the model there. Does anyone know if they still sell >>>> it? (I looked at the one that says, "rubberized handle,) but it isn't >>>> the same one I had). I'd love to be able to just replace the cane I >>>> have with the same model, as I really like the feel and how it doesn't >>>> collapse as often. >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Kaiti >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>> 0gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% >>>> 40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nimerjaber1%40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Cordially, >> >> Nimer Jaber >> >> Please take the time to read this signature completely as it contains >> some information about the email you have just read and all >> attachments contained within as well as some valuable resources and >> methods for contacting me if you have any questions or wish to talk. >> >> The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was >> addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient, >> please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this >> correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents >> by anyone other than the intended recipient may result in civil or >> criminal action. I have checked this email and all corresponding >> attachments for security threats. However, security of your machine is >> up to you. Thanks. >> >> Registered Linux User 529141. >> http://counter.li.org/ >> Vinux testing and documentation coordinator >> To get more information about a free and accessible operating system, >> please click here: >> http://www.vinuxproject.org >> >> To find out about a free and versatile screen reader for windows XP >> and above, please click here: >> http://www.nvda-project.org >> >> You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news. >> >> Check out my blog related to technology by clicking here: >> http://nimertech.blogspot.com >> >> To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (720) >> (251-4530) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly. Thank >> you, and have a great day! >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Fri Mar 29 08:02:47 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 04:02:47 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com> Message-ID: *the beginning of that was supposed to say that I'm the opposite. Sorry for the weird cut off. On 3/29/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > posite; telescopic canes last much longer for me than the folding > ones, I think because of the weight and because of my pace. That is > why I prefer the NFB canes and will most likely avoid the bulky > folding ones. > > The next time someone tells you an Ambutech cane, or an aluminum one, > is indestructable, don't necessarily buy it. In the first week of > school this year I was going out to a campus event with some friends > and because I had issues with people stepping on and breaking my > telescopic canes in high school I chose to take my folding one from > ambutech. It was so heavy for me that when I stepped off the curb it > went down into a drainage grate. It must have gone right between the > bars because I didn't feel it hit anything or realize it wasn't on the > ground, but I kept walking and tripped when I felt that my cane wasn't > coming with me. I dropped it and when a friend of mine grabbed it and > pulled it out of the grate the bottom shaft was sliced open where the > grate had dug into it and it was bent at a 45 degree angle from where > it should have been. For a while I used a straight cane that was kind > of my old-faithful cane, (My O&M instructor and I made it when I was > in the 4th grade and I still had it as a college freshman). It was a > little short for me, but I didn't grow much after making it so it > would have worked all right till I could order a new one over > Christmas break. Then again, I was walking with friends, and the cane > got stuck in a really big crack in the sidewalk. When we pulled it > out the tip was still wedged into the crack, but the bottom of the > shaft was dented all over to the point where I doubt another tip would > be able to stay on it. (The kicker was that this all happened within > a month). Then I started using the telescopic cane because I had no > other choice, and not only were people more conscious about avoiding > stepping on a white stick, but all my problems with grates and > sidewalk cracks magically went away. (and my wrist liked it better > too). > > On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >> Another thing I should mention, is that I found out that cane tips cost >> over >> $1.50, per tip! >> Good grief! >> Those tips are small, unlike the tips you find on VR canes! >> Why not just charge 50 cents a tip? >> Thanks, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Joshua Lester >> [JLester8462 at pccua.edu] >> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:21 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >> >> I bought an NFB folding cane, and a straight cane from them! >> I had issues with the tip coming off of the straight cane, and the >> folding >> cane broke after the first day, because they aren't stirdy enough! >> I had a telescoping cane as well, and it would collapse when I didn't >> want >> it to, and it wouldn't collapse when I did! >> Ambutech, (on the other hand,) is awesome! >> Their canes are stirdyer, and they may be bulky, but they get the job >> done! >> I can't imagine myself with a thinner cane, no matter what it is! >> My Ambutech cane has lasted longer than my VR canes, and those NFB canes >> combined! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:10 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >> >> Hi, >> >> I actually did try Ambutech too after the NFB store didn't show the >> model, as I know they sell the telescopic canes too, but they didn't >> have it either and their prices were higher anyway. I will call >> tomorrow and see what the deal is with the search results showing up >> on the NFB site. Perhaps they've changed the listing or have it >> stored in some funky place on the site separate from their other white >> canes (I don't see why they would, but it could happen I guess). >> Agreeing with Brice, I really hope that it is somewhere on there, >> because it really was a huge improvement over the older models. >> >> On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: >>> What's up with the tone of that email homes? >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Nimer M. >>> Jaber, >>> IC³ >>> Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 11:10 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>> >>> Justin, she doesn't want ambutec, she wants NFB. And I second Bryce's >>> comment, call up the store tomorrow. >>> >>> On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: >>>> Have you tried ambutec? >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>>> Shelton >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 9:22 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>> >>>> That's where I was. My point was I don't see it there anymore. >>>> >>>> On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>> Try the Nfb store. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>>>> Shelton >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 7:29 PM >>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>> >>>>> Hi all, >>>>> >>>>> About a year ago I bought one of those new telescopic canes from the >>>>> online NFb store. They were the latest model, (carbon fiber I >>>>> believe), with a metal glide tip, and the handle was covered in a >>>>> smooth material, probably a rubber coating, although it was hard. I >>>>> believe it extended to five sections). >>>>> >>>>> Anyway, it has given out on me and I need to buy a new one before I >>>>> leave town for a conference next weekend. I looked on the web site >>>>> and didn't see the model there. Does anyone know if they still sell >>>>> it? (I looked at the one that says, "rubberized handle,) but it isn't >>>>> the same one I had). I'd love to be able to just replace the cane I >>>>> have with the same model, as I really like the feel and how it doesn't >>>>> collapse as often. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Kaiti >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>>> 0gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% >>>>> 40gmail.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Kaiti >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nimerjaber1%40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Cordially, >>> >>> Nimer Jaber >>> >>> Please take the time to read this signature completely as it contains >>> some information about the email you have just read and all >>> attachments contained within as well as some valuable resources and >>> methods for contacting me if you have any questions or wish to talk. >>> >>> The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was >>> addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient, >>> please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this >>> correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents >>> by anyone other than the intended recipient may result in civil or >>> criminal action. I have checked this email and all corresponding >>> attachments for security threats. However, security of your machine is >>> up to you. Thanks. >>> >>> Registered Linux User 529141. >>> http://counter.li.org/ >>> Vinux testing and documentation coordinator >>> To get more information about a free and accessible operating system, >>> please click here: >>> http://www.vinuxproject.org >>> >>> To find out about a free and versatile screen reader for windows XP >>> and above, please click here: >>> http://www.nvda-project.org >>> >>> You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news. >>> >>> Check out my blog related to technology by clicking here: >>> http://nimertech.blogspot.com >>> >>> To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (720) >>> (251-4530) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly. Thank >>> you, and have a great day! >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > -- Kaiti From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Fri Mar 29 08:09:07 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 08:09:07 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com> , Message-ID: Hi Kaiti! I never said that the Ambutech canes were indestructable. I just wish that they'd make the telescopic canes more stirdy, so that they'll collapse, only when I want them to. Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 3:02 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question *the beginning of that was supposed to say that I'm the opposite. Sorry for the weird cut off. On 3/29/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > posite; telescopic canes last much longer for me than the folding > ones, I think because of the weight and because of my pace. That is > why I prefer the NFB canes and will most likely avoid the bulky > folding ones. > > The next time someone tells you an Ambutech cane, or an aluminum one, > is indestructable, don't necessarily buy it. In the first week of > school this year I was going out to a campus event with some friends > and because I had issues with people stepping on and breaking my > telescopic canes in high school I chose to take my folding one from > ambutech. It was so heavy for me that when I stepped off the curb it > went down into a drainage grate. It must have gone right between the > bars because I didn't feel it hit anything or realize it wasn't on the > ground, but I kept walking and tripped when I felt that my cane wasn't > coming with me. I dropped it and when a friend of mine grabbed it and > pulled it out of the grate the bottom shaft was sliced open where the > grate had dug into it and it was bent at a 45 degree angle from where > it should have been. For a while I used a straight cane that was kind > of my old-faithful cane, (My O&M instructor and I made it when I was > in the 4th grade and I still had it as a college freshman). It was a > little short for me, but I didn't grow much after making it so it > would have worked all right till I could order a new one over > Christmas break. Then again, I was walking with friends, and the cane > got stuck in a really big crack in the sidewalk. When we pulled it > out the tip was still wedged into the crack, but the bottom of the > shaft was dented all over to the point where I doubt another tip would > be able to stay on it. (The kicker was that this all happened within > a month). Then I started using the telescopic cane because I had no > other choice, and not only were people more conscious about avoiding > stepping on a white stick, but all my problems with grates and > sidewalk cracks magically went away. (and my wrist liked it better > too). > > On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >> Another thing I should mention, is that I found out that cane tips cost >> over >> $1.50, per tip! >> Good grief! >> Those tips are small, unlike the tips you find on VR canes! >> Why not just charge 50 cents a tip? >> Thanks, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Joshua Lester >> [JLester8462 at pccua.edu] >> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:21 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >> >> I bought an NFB folding cane, and a straight cane from them! >> I had issues with the tip coming off of the straight cane, and the >> folding >> cane broke after the first day, because they aren't stirdy enough! >> I had a telescoping cane as well, and it would collapse when I didn't >> want >> it to, and it wouldn't collapse when I did! >> Ambutech, (on the other hand,) is awesome! >> Their canes are stirdyer, and they may be bulky, but they get the job >> done! >> I can't imagine myself with a thinner cane, no matter what it is! >> My Ambutech cane has lasted longer than my VR canes, and those NFB canes >> combined! >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:10 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >> >> Hi, >> >> I actually did try Ambutech too after the NFB store didn't show the >> model, as I know they sell the telescopic canes too, but they didn't >> have it either and their prices were higher anyway. I will call >> tomorrow and see what the deal is with the search results showing up >> on the NFB site. Perhaps they've changed the listing or have it >> stored in some funky place on the site separate from their other white >> canes (I don't see why they would, but it could happen I guess). >> Agreeing with Brice, I really hope that it is somewhere on there, >> because it really was a huge improvement over the older models. >> >> On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: >>> What's up with the tone of that email homes? >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Nimer M. >>> Jaber, >>> IC³ >>> Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 11:10 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>> >>> Justin, she doesn't want ambutec, she wants NFB. And I second Bryce's >>> comment, call up the store tomorrow. >>> >>> On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: >>>> Have you tried ambutec? >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>>> Shelton >>>> Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 9:22 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>> >>>> That's where I was. My point was I don't see it there anymore. >>>> >>>> On 3/27/13, justin williams wrote: >>>>> Try the Nfb store. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >>>>> Shelton >>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 7:29 PM >>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>> >>>>> Hi all, >>>>> >>>>> About a year ago I bought one of those new telescopic canes from the >>>>> online NFb store. They were the latest model, (carbon fiber I >>>>> believe), with a metal glide tip, and the handle was covered in a >>>>> smooth material, probably a rubber coating, although it was hard. I >>>>> believe it extended to five sections). >>>>> >>>>> Anyway, it has given out on me and I need to buy a new one before I >>>>> leave town for a conference next weekend. I looked on the web site >>>>> and didn't see the model there. Does anyone know if they still sell >>>>> it? (I looked at the one that says, "rubberized handle,) but it isn't >>>>> the same one I had). I'd love to be able to just replace the cane I >>>>> have with the same model, as I really like the feel and how it doesn't >>>>> collapse as often. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Kaiti >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >>>>> 0gmail >>>>> .com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% >>>>> 40gmail.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Kaiti >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>>> .com >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nimerjaber1%40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Cordially, >>> >>> Nimer Jaber >>> >>> Please take the time to read this signature completely as it contains >>> some information about the email you have just read and all >>> attachments contained within as well as some valuable resources and >>> methods for contacting me if you have any questions or wish to talk. >>> >>> The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was >>> addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient, >>> please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this >>> correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents >>> by anyone other than the intended recipient may result in civil or >>> criminal action. I have checked this email and all corresponding >>> attachments for security threats. However, security of your machine is >>> up to you. Thanks. >>> >>> Registered Linux User 529141. >>> http://counter.li.org/ >>> Vinux testing and documentation coordinator >>> To get more information about a free and accessible operating system, >>> please click here: >>> http://www.vinuxproject.org >>> >>> To find out about a free and versatile screen reader for windows XP >>> and above, please click here: >>> http://www.nvda-project.org >>> >>> You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news. >>> >>> Check out my blog related to technology by clicking here: >>> http://nimertech.blogspot.com >>> >>> To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (720) >>> (251-4530) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly. Thank >>> you, and have a great day! >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Fri Mar 29 16:21:40 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 12:21:40 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, Joshua, I didn't say that you said anything, I was merely sharing my experiences. I've heard from several people that those canes are thought to be indestructible, so it seemed like it might have been a common misconception. That is what is so improved about this model of the telescopic cane, it doesn't collapse near as much as the old oones. I rarely had to stop and fix mine. On Friday, March 29, 2013, Joshua Lester wrote: > Hi Kaiti! > I never said that the Ambutech canes were indestructable. > I just wish that they'd make the telescopic canes more stirdy, so that > they'll collapse, only when I want them to. > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org ] on behalf of > Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com ] > Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 3:02 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question > > *the beginning of that was supposed to say that I'm the opposite. > Sorry for the weird cut off. > > On 3/29/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > > posite; telescopic canes last much longer for me than the folding > > ones, I think because of the weight and because of my pace. That is > > why I prefer the NFB canes and will most likely avoid the bulky > > folding ones. > > > > The next time someone tells you an Ambutech cane, or an aluminum one, > > is indestructable, don't necessarily buy it. In the first week of > > school this year I was going out to a campus event with some friends > > and because I had issues with people stepping on and breaking my > > telescopic canes in high school I chose to take my folding one from > > ambutech. It was so heavy for me that when I stepped off the curb it > > went down into a drainage grate. It must have gone right between the > > bars because I didn't feel it hit anything or realize it wasn't on the > > ground, but I kept walking and tripped when I felt that my cane wasn't > > coming with me. I dropped it and when a friend of mine grabbed it and > > pulled it out of the grate the bottom shaft was sliced open where the > > grate had dug into it and it was bent at a 45 degree angle from where > > it should have been. For a while I used a straight cane that was kind > > of my old-faithful cane, (My O&M instructor and I made it when I was > > in the 4th grade and I still had it as a college freshman). It was a > > little short for me, but I didn't grow much after making it so it > > would have worked all right till I could order a new one over > > Christmas break. Then again, I was walking with friends, and the cane > > got stuck in a really big crack in the sidewalk. When we pulled it > > out the tip was still wedged into the crack, but the bottom of the > > shaft was dented all over to the point where I doubt another tip would > > be able to stay on it. (The kicker was that this all happened within > > a month). Then I started using the telescopic cane because I had no > > other choice, and not only were people more conscious about avoiding > > stepping on a white stick, but all my problems with grates and > > sidewalk cracks magically went away. (and my wrist liked it better > > too). > > > > On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: > >> Another thing I should mention, is that I found out that cane tips cost > >> over > >> $1.50, per tip! > >> Good grief! > >> Those tips are small, unlike the tips you find on VR canes! > >> Why not just charge 50 cents a tip? > >> Thanks, Joshua > >> ________________________________________ > >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Joshua Lester > >> [JLester8462 at pccua.edu] > >> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:21 AM > >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question > >> > >> I bought an NFB folding cane, and a straight cane from them! > >> I had issues with the tip coming off of the straight cane, and the > >> folding > >> cane broke after the first day, because they aren't stirdy enough! > >> I had a telescoping cane as well, and it would collapse when I didn't > >> want > >> it to, and it wouldn't collapse when I did! > >> Ambutech, (on the other hand,) is awesome! > >> Their canes are stirdyer, and they may be bulky, but they get the job > >> done! > >> I can't imagine myself with a thinner cane, no matter what it is! > >> My Ambutech cane has lasted longer than my VR canes, and those NFB canes > >> combined! > >> Blessings, Joshua > >> ________________________________________ > >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton > >> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] > >> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:10 AM > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Fri Mar 29 21:39:14 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 21:39:14 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com> , Message-ID: I want to look at the new ones. Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 11:21 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question Hi, Joshua, I didn't say that you said anything, I was merely sharing my experiences. I've heard from several people that those canes are thought to be indestructible, so it seemed like it might have been a common misconception. That is what is so improved about this model of the telescopic cane, it doesn't collapse near as much as the old oones. I rarely had to stop and fix mine. On Friday, March 29, 2013, Joshua Lester wrote: > Hi Kaiti! > I never said that the Ambutech canes were indestructable. > I just wish that they'd make the telescopic canes more stirdy, so that > they'll collapse, only when I want them to. > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org ] on behalf of > Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com ] > Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 3:02 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question > > *the beginning of that was supposed to say that I'm the opposite. > Sorry for the weird cut off. > > On 3/29/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > > posite; telescopic canes last much longer for me than the folding > > ones, I think because of the weight and because of my pace. That is > > why I prefer the NFB canes and will most likely avoid the bulky > > folding ones. > > > > The next time someone tells you an Ambutech cane, or an aluminum one, > > is indestructable, don't necessarily buy it. In the first week of > > school this year I was going out to a campus event with some friends > > and because I had issues with people stepping on and breaking my > > telescopic canes in high school I chose to take my folding one from > > ambutech. It was so heavy for me that when I stepped off the curb it > > went down into a drainage grate. It must have gone right between the > > bars because I didn't feel it hit anything or realize it wasn't on the > > ground, but I kept walking and tripped when I felt that my cane wasn't > > coming with me. I dropped it and when a friend of mine grabbed it and > > pulled it out of the grate the bottom shaft was sliced open where the > > grate had dug into it and it was bent at a 45 degree angle from where > > it should have been. For a while I used a straight cane that was kind > > of my old-faithful cane, (My O&M instructor and I made it when I was > > in the 4th grade and I still had it as a college freshman). It was a > > little short for me, but I didn't grow much after making it so it > > would have worked all right till I could order a new one over > > Christmas break. Then again, I was walking with friends, and the cane > > got stuck in a really big crack in the sidewalk. When we pulled it > > out the tip was still wedged into the crack, but the bottom of the > > shaft was dented all over to the point where I doubt another tip would > > be able to stay on it. (The kicker was that this all happened within > > a month). Then I started using the telescopic cane because I had no > > other choice, and not only were people more conscious about avoiding > > stepping on a white stick, but all my problems with grates and > > sidewalk cracks magically went away. (and my wrist liked it better > > too). > > > > On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: > >> Another thing I should mention, is that I found out that cane tips cost > >> over > >> $1.50, per tip! > >> Good grief! > >> Those tips are small, unlike the tips you find on VR canes! > >> Why not just charge 50 cents a tip? > >> Thanks, Joshua > >> ________________________________________ > >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Joshua Lester > >> [JLester8462 at pccua.edu] > >> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:21 AM > >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question > >> > >> I bought an NFB folding cane, and a straight cane from them! > >> I had issues with the tip coming off of the straight cane, and the > >> folding > >> cane broke after the first day, because they aren't stirdy enough! > >> I had a telescoping cane as well, and it would collapse when I didn't > >> want > >> it to, and it wouldn't collapse when I did! > >> Ambutech, (on the other hand,) is awesome! > >> Their canes are stirdyer, and they may be bulky, but they get the job > >> done! > >> I can't imagine myself with a thinner cane, no matter what it is! > >> My Ambutech cane has lasted longer than my VR canes, and those NFB canes > >> combined! > >> Blessings, Joshua > >> ________________________________________ > >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton > >> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] > >> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:10 AM > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com From PRESIDENT at alumni.ecu.edu Fri Mar 29 21:47:34 2013 From: PRESIDENT at alumni.ecu.edu (Justin Salisbury) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 21:47:34 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] VA Intern Job Announcements In-Reply-To: <8A692922C3DD3241BAF510A53CA23CCC16DD4A66@VANCRMSGA1.vha.med.va.gov> References: <8A692922C3DD3241BAF510A53CA23CCC16D8770B@VANCRMSGA1.vha.med.va.gov> <6CE049279B97194491C46E008D8892433D3C11C7@BN1PRD0512MB620.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <8A692922C3DD3241BAF510A53CA23CCC16DD4A66@VANCRMSGA1.vha.med.va.gov> Message-ID: <6CE049279B97194491C46E008D8892433D3C1334@BN1PRD0512MB620.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> Fellow Federationists: Below is a job announcement for which blind people are of particular interest. The Department of Veteran's Affairs wants good, qualified workers, and they've made a point to me that they'd love to hire some good blind people for these positions. Rather than working directly with the Wounded Warrior program, they want people who can work in other areas of the V.A. to show the wounded warriors that blind people can do more than just work within the disability field. For your interest.... From: Brigham, David [mailto:David.Brigham at va.gov] Good Morning Justin, I'm sending you the below links to the Job Announcements for the VA Contract Specialist Intern Positions we have previously discussed, just in case you are interested. The positions are entry level starting at the G-7 and going to the GS-11 or 12 Grade, depending on location. There are three announcements, each focusing on a specific group/pool of hires - 1) Recent Graduates 2)Any U.S. Citizen and 3) current Government Employees/Veterans/Schedule A holders. Of course all applicants must meet the basic job qualifications stated in the announcement. Hiring Authority Open / Close Date Link Pathways Recent Graduates March 28, 2013 - April 3, 2013 GS-11: https://www.usajobs.gov/GetJob/PrintPreview/339457100 GS-12: https://www.usajobs.gov/GetJob/PrintPreview/339455300 Delegated Examine Unit (All Sources) March 28, 2013 - April 1, 2013 GS-11: https://www.usajobs.gov/GetJob/PrintPreview/339500100 GS-12: https://www.usajobs.gov/GetJob/PrintPreview/339503300 Merit Point March 28, 2013 - April 17, 2013 GS-11: https://www.usajobs.gov/GetJob/PrintPreview/339761500 GS-12: https://www.usajobs.gov/GetJob/PrintPreview/339761600 Please feel free to give me a call, if you have any questions. Good luck, Dave David Brigham Program Manager Acquisition Internship School Veterans Affairs Acquisition Academy Office of Acquisitions and Logistics 7485 New Horizon Way, 001AL-AA Frederick, Maryland 21703 Phone: 202-461-0741 Fax: 202-495-6988 http://www.acquisitionacademy.va.gov/index.asp [VAAALogo_RGB_Small] [I CARE logo.jpeg] -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image001.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 1212 bytes Desc: image001.jpg URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image002.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 1543 bytes Desc: image002.jpg URL: From tyler at tysdomain.com Sat Mar 30 00:38:11 2013 From: tyler at tysdomain.com (Littlefield, Tyler) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 18:38:11 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] nfb 2013 scholarship:who do I speak to? Message-ID: <515633F3.2020504@tysdomain.com> hello all: I guess this is sort of late; I just stumbled onto the NFB scholarship but I was curious who I need to talk to for Colorado for an interview? If someone could give me contact details or the person from Colorado could get in touch with me, I would really really appreciate it. Thanks, -- Take care, Ty http://tds-solutions.net The aspen project: a barebones light-weight mud engine: http://code.google.com/p/aspenmud He that will not reason is a bigot; he that cannot reason is a fool; he that dares not reason is a slave. From tyler at tysdomain.com Sat Mar 30 00:47:05 2013 From: tyler at tysdomain.com (Littlefield, Tyler) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 18:47:05 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] nfb 2013 scholarship:who do I speak to? In-Reply-To: <515633F3.2020504@tysdomain.com> References: <515633F3.2020504@tysdomain.com> Message-ID: <51563609.6060200@tysdomain.com> Sorry, one final question. I seen the state listing in the FAQ, but I'm not actually seeing the email address anywhere that I need to send the extra information to. On 3/29/2013 6:38 PM, Littlefield, Tyler wrote: > hello all: > I guess this is sort of late; I just stumbled onto the NFB scholarship > but I was curious who I need to talk to for Colorado for an interview? > If someone could give me contact details or the person from Colorado > could get in touch with me, I would really really appreciate it. > Thanks, > -- Take care, Ty http://tds-solutions.net The aspen project: a barebones light-weight mud engine: http://code.google.com/p/aspenmud He that will not reason is a bigot; he that cannot reason is a fool; he that dares not reason is a slave. From dandrews at visi.com Sat Mar 30 01:11:31 2013 From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 20:11:31 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Becoming a Notary In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: There was a discussion on the blindlaw list, some months ago, so you might search their archive, http://www.nfbnet.org/pipermail/blindlaw_nfbnet.org I think the discussion was inconclusive, but don't remember for sure. Dave At 02:02 PM 3/28/2013, you wrote: >Hi All, > >I have a question. Does anyone on this list know if it would be >possible for a blind person to become a notary? I was curious about >it so I thought I'd start by asking on this list of how would one go >about doing it? > >Thanks as always! > >Justin From joshkart12 at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 01:23:37 2013 From: joshkart12 at gmail.com (Josh Gregory) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 21:23:37 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Becoming a Notary In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <37E563FB-A897-4853-9E94-B9718265CD7B@gmail.com> What is a notary? Sent from my iPhone On Mar 29, 2013, at 9:11 PM, David Andrews wrote: > There was a discussion on the blindlaw list, some months ago, so you might search their archive, http://www.nfbnet.org/pipermail/blindlaw_nfbnet.org > > I think the discussion was inconclusive, but don't remember for sure. > > Dave > > At 02:02 PM 3/28/2013, you wrote: >> Hi All, >> >> I have a question. Does anyone on this list know if it would be >> possible for a blind person to become a notary? I was curious about >> it so I thought I'd start by asking on this list of how would one go >> about doing it? >> >> Thanks as always! >> >> Justin > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com From arielle71 at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 01:37:27 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 19:37:27 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] nfb 2013 scholarship:who do I speak to? In-Reply-To: <51563609.6060200@tysdomain.com> References: <515633F3.2020504@tysdomain.com> <51563609.6060200@tysdomain.com> Message-ID: Hi Tyler, It might be too late for you to get a Colorado president's letter for the national NFB scholarship, but it is not too late to get the state scholarship, since the deadline isn't until April 15. You can make an appointment for an interview with Scott LaBarre, CO president, by calling 303-778-1130 and ask to speak with Lisa Bonderson. Best, Arielle On 3/29/13, Littlefield, Tyler wrote: > Sorry, one final question. I seen the state listing in the FAQ, but I'm > not actually seeing the email address anywhere that I need to send the > extra information to. > > On 3/29/2013 6:38 PM, Littlefield, Tyler wrote: >> hello all: >> I guess this is sort of late; I just stumbled onto the NFB scholarship >> but I was curious who I need to talk to for Colorado for an interview? >> If someone could give me contact details or the person from Colorado >> could get in touch with me, I would really really appreciate it. >> Thanks, >> > > > -- > Take care, > Ty > http://tds-solutions.net > The aspen project: a barebones light-weight mud engine: > http://code.google.com/p/aspenmud > He that will not reason is a bigot; he that cannot reason is a fool; he that > dares not reason is a slave. > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From jty727 at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 02:19:12 2013 From: jty727 at gmail.com (Justin Young) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 22:19:12 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Becoming a Notary In-Reply-To: <37E563FB-A897-4853-9E94-B9718265CD7B@gmail.com> References: <37E563FB-A897-4853-9E94-B9718265CD7B@gmail.com> Message-ID: Thanks Dave I'll look at it. Jeff, a notary is someone who verifies all kinds of legal documents authenticity. On 3/29/13, Josh Gregory wrote: > What is a notary? > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 29, 2013, at 9:11 PM, David Andrews wrote: > >> There was a discussion on the blindlaw list, some months ago, so you might >> search their archive, http://www.nfbnet.org/pipermail/blindlaw_nfbnet.org >> >> I think the discussion was inconclusive, but don't remember for sure. >> >> Dave >> >> At 02:02 PM 3/28/2013, you wrote: >>> Hi All, >>> >>> I have a question. Does anyone on this list know if it would be >>> possible for a blind person to become a notary? I was curious about >>> it so I thought I'd start by asking on this list of how would one go >>> about doing it? >>> >>> Thanks as always! >>> >>> Justin >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jty727%40gmail.com > From jty727 at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 02:19:34 2013 From: jty727 at gmail.com (Justin Young) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 22:19:34 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Becoming a Notary In-Reply-To: References: <37E563FB-A897-4853-9E94-B9718265CD7B@gmail.com> Message-ID: sorry misspelled it I ment josh. On 3/29/13, Justin Young wrote: > Thanks Dave I'll look at it. Jeff, a notary is someone who verifies > all kinds of legal documents authenticity. > > On 3/29/13, Josh Gregory wrote: >> What is a notary? >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 29, 2013, at 9:11 PM, David Andrews wrote: >> >>> There was a discussion on the blindlaw list, some months ago, so you >>> might >>> search their archive, >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/pipermail/blindlaw_nfbnet.org >>> >>> I think the discussion was inconclusive, but don't remember for sure. >>> >>> Dave >>> >>> At 02:02 PM 3/28/2013, you wrote: >>>> Hi All, >>>> >>>> I have a question. Does anyone on this list know if it would be >>>> possible for a blind person to become a notary? I was curious about >>>> it so I thought I'd start by asking on this list of how would one go >>>> about doing it? >>>> >>>> Thanks as always! >>>> >>>> Justin >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jty727%40gmail.com >> > From joshkart12 at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 02:25:45 2013 From: joshkart12 at gmail.com (Josh Gregory) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 22:25:45 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Becoming a Notary In-Reply-To: References: <37E563FB-A897-4853-9E94-B9718265CD7B@gmail.com> Message-ID: <3F09BEF4-2388-43EA-91E0-8C23A32FFA8D@gmail.com> All good thanks :) Sent from my iPhone On Mar 29, 2013, at 10:19 PM, Justin Young wrote: > sorry misspelled it I ment josh. > > On 3/29/13, Justin Young wrote: >> Thanks Dave I'll look at it. Jeff, a notary is someone who verifies >> all kinds of legal documents authenticity. >> >> On 3/29/13, Josh Gregory wrote: >>> What is a notary? >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 29, 2013, at 9:11 PM, David Andrews wrote: >>> >>>> There was a discussion on the blindlaw list, some months ago, so you >>>> might >>>> search their archive, >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/pipermail/blindlaw_nfbnet.org >>>> >>>> I think the discussion was inconclusive, but don't remember for sure. >>>> >>>> Dave >>>> >>>> At 02:02 PM 3/28/2013, you wrote: >>>>> Hi All, >>>>> >>>>> I have a question. Does anyone on this list know if it would be >>>>> possible for a blind person to become a notary? I was curious about >>>>> it so I thought I'd start by asking on this list of how would one go >>>>> about doing it? >>>>> >>>>> Thanks as always! >>>>> >>>>> Justin >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jty727%40gmail.com >>> >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joshkart12%40gmail.com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 02:54:36 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 22:54:36 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, Yeah, they're well worth checking into, or at least I think so. I found out why I wasn't seeing it in the search results; The NFB site groups all types of canes together, but doesn't descriminate between the models. So, I was seeing pictures of the older canes because that's the type the new one still fits under, (5 or 6 section telescopic). The particular cane I got last time was made by Chris Parks, and I just got it because it was what they had in stock. They don't show it on the site, but if you know the particular model you want you can request it in the comments section when you check out. On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: > I want to look at the new ones. > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton > [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 11:21 AM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question > > Hi, > > Joshua, I didn't say that you said anything, I was merely sharing my > experiences. I've heard from several people that those canes are thought to > be indestructible, so it seemed like it might have been a common > misconception. > That is what is so improved about this model of the telescopic cane, it > doesn't collapse near as much as the old oones. I rarely had to stop and > fix mine. > > On Friday, March 29, 2013, Joshua Lester wrote: > >> Hi Kaiti! >> I never said that the Ambutech canes were indestructable. >> I just wish that they'd make the telescopic canes more stirdy, so that >> they'll collapse, only when I want them to. >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org ] on behalf of >> Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com ] >> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 3:02 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >> >> *the beginning of that was supposed to say that I'm the opposite. >> Sorry for the weird cut off. >> >> On 3/29/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >> > posite; telescopic canes last much longer for me than the folding >> > ones, I think because of the weight and because of my pace. That is >> > why I prefer the NFB canes and will most likely avoid the bulky >> > folding ones. >> > >> > The next time someone tells you an Ambutech cane, or an aluminum one, >> > is indestructable, don't necessarily buy it. In the first week of >> > school this year I was going out to a campus event with some friends >> > and because I had issues with people stepping on and breaking my >> > telescopic canes in high school I chose to take my folding one from >> > ambutech. It was so heavy for me that when I stepped off the curb it >> > went down into a drainage grate. It must have gone right between the >> > bars because I didn't feel it hit anything or realize it wasn't on the >> > ground, but I kept walking and tripped when I felt that my cane wasn't >> > coming with me. I dropped it and when a friend of mine grabbed it and >> > pulled it out of the grate the bottom shaft was sliced open where the >> > grate had dug into it and it was bent at a 45 degree angle from where >> > it should have been. For a while I used a straight cane that was kind >> > of my old-faithful cane, (My O&M instructor and I made it when I was >> > in the 4th grade and I still had it as a college freshman). It was a >> > little short for me, but I didn't grow much after making it so it >> > would have worked all right till I could order a new one over >> > Christmas break. Then again, I was walking with friends, and the cane >> > got stuck in a really big crack in the sidewalk. When we pulled it >> > out the tip was still wedged into the crack, but the bottom of the >> > shaft was dented all over to the point where I doubt another tip would >> > be able to stay on it. (The kicker was that this all happened within >> > a month). Then I started using the telescopic cane because I had no >> > other choice, and not only were people more conscious about avoiding >> > stepping on a white stick, but all my problems with grates and >> > sidewalk cracks magically went away. (and my wrist liked it better >> > too). >> > >> > On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >> >> Another thing I should mention, is that I found out that cane tips >> >> cost >> >> over >> >> $1.50, per tip! >> >> Good grief! >> >> Those tips are small, unlike the tips you find on VR canes! >> >> Why not just charge 50 cents a tip? >> >> Thanks, Joshua >> >> ________________________________________ >> >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Joshua Lester >> >> [JLester8462 at pccua.edu] >> >> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:21 AM >> >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >> >> >> >> I bought an NFB folding cane, and a straight cane from them! >> >> I had issues with the tip coming off of the straight cane, and the >> >> folding >> >> cane broke after the first day, because they aren't stirdy enough! >> >> I had a telescoping cane as well, and it would collapse when I didn't >> >> want >> >> it to, and it wouldn't collapse when I did! >> >> Ambutech, (on the other hand,) is awesome! >> >> Their canes are stirdyer, and they may be bulky, but they get the job >> >> done! >> >> I can't imagine myself with a thinner cane, no matter what it is! >> >> My Ambutech cane has lasted longer than my VR canes, and those NFB >> >> canes >> >> combined! >> >> Blessings, Joshua >> >> ________________________________________ >> >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >> >> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >> >> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:10 AM >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From brice.smith319 at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 03:45:29 2013 From: brice.smith319 at gmail.com (Brice Smith) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 23:45:29 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <-1498599385532720274@unknownmsgid> I'm still a bit confused. Which model is the one listed on the site now? Is the Chris Parks model now "old" and is there a newer model out now? You and I both must Have bought his model last year. Have they replaced it with something different? Even better? On Mar 29, 2013, at 10:55 PM, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Hi, > > Yeah, they're well worth checking into, or at least I think so. > > I found out why I wasn't seeing it in the search results; The NFB site > groups all types of canes together, but doesn't descriminate between > the models. So, I was seeing pictures of the older canes because > that's the type the new one still fits under, (5 or 6 section > telescopic). The particular cane I got last time was made by Chris > Parks, and I just got it because it was what they had in stock. They > don't show it on the site, but if you know the particular model you > want you can request it in the comments section when you check out. > > On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >> I want to look at the new ones. >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 11:21 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >> >> Hi, >> >> Joshua, I didn't say that you said anything, I was merely sharing my >> experiences. I've heard from several people that those canes are thought to >> be indestructible, so it seemed like it might have been a common >> misconception. >> That is what is so improved about this model of the telescopic cane, it >> doesn't collapse near as much as the old oones. I rarely had to stop and >> fix mine. >> >> On Friday, March 29, 2013, Joshua Lester wrote: >> >>> Hi Kaiti! >>> I never said that the Ambutech canes were indestructable. >>> I just wish that they'd make the telescopic canes more stirdy, so that >>> they'll collapse, only when I want them to. >>> Blessings, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org ] on behalf of >>> Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com ] >>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 3:02 AM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>> >>> *the beginning of that was supposed to say that I'm the opposite. >>> Sorry for the weird cut off. >>> >>> On 3/29/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>> posite; telescopic canes last much longer for me than the folding >>>> ones, I think because of the weight and because of my pace. That is >>>> why I prefer the NFB canes and will most likely avoid the bulky >>>> folding ones. >>>> >>>> The next time someone tells you an Ambutech cane, or an aluminum one, >>>> is indestructable, don't necessarily buy it. In the first week of >>>> school this year I was going out to a campus event with some friends >>>> and because I had issues with people stepping on and breaking my >>>> telescopic canes in high school I chose to take my folding one from >>>> ambutech. It was so heavy for me that when I stepped off the curb it >>>> went down into a drainage grate. It must have gone right between the >>>> bars because I didn't feel it hit anything or realize it wasn't on the >>>> ground, but I kept walking and tripped when I felt that my cane wasn't >>>> coming with me. I dropped it and when a friend of mine grabbed it and >>>> pulled it out of the grate the bottom shaft was sliced open where the >>>> grate had dug into it and it was bent at a 45 degree angle from where >>>> it should have been. For a while I used a straight cane that was kind >>>> of my old-faithful cane, (My O&M instructor and I made it when I was >>>> in the 4th grade and I still had it as a college freshman). It was a >>>> little short for me, but I didn't grow much after making it so it >>>> would have worked all right till I could order a new one over >>>> Christmas break. Then again, I was walking with friends, and the cane >>>> got stuck in a really big crack in the sidewalk. When we pulled it >>>> out the tip was still wedged into the crack, but the bottom of the >>>> shaft was dented all over to the point where I doubt another tip would >>>> be able to stay on it. (The kicker was that this all happened within >>>> a month). Then I started using the telescopic cane because I had no >>>> other choice, and not only were people more conscious about avoiding >>>> stepping on a white stick, but all my problems with grates and >>>> sidewalk cracks magically went away. (and my wrist liked it better >>>> too). >>>> >>>> On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>> Another thing I should mention, is that I found out that cane tips >>>>> cost >>>>> over >>>>> $1.50, per tip! >>>>> Good grief! >>>>> Those tips are small, unlike the tips you find on VR canes! >>>>> Why not just charge 50 cents a tip? >>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Joshua Lester >>>>> [JLester8462 at pccua.edu] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:21 AM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>> >>>>> I bought an NFB folding cane, and a straight cane from them! >>>>> I had issues with the tip coming off of the straight cane, and the >>>>> folding >>>>> cane broke after the first day, because they aren't stirdy enough! >>>>> I had a telescoping cane as well, and it would collapse when I didn't >>>>> want >>>>> it to, and it wouldn't collapse when I did! >>>>> Ambutech, (on the other hand,) is awesome! >>>>> Their canes are stirdyer, and they may be bulky, but they get the job >>>>> done! >>>>> I can't imagine myself with a thinner cane, no matter what it is! >>>>> My Ambutech cane has lasted longer than my VR canes, and those NFB >>>>> canes >>>>> combined! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >>>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:10 AM >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Sat Mar 30 05:34:18 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 05:34:18 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: <-1498599385532720274@unknownmsgid> References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com> , <-1498599385532720274@unknownmsgid> Message-ID: Those Chris Parks canes are nothing but trouble! Those were the ones that collapse too much! His folding canes are awful too! I got the telescoping cane in 2010, and I didn't like it. Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Brice Smith [brice.smith319 at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 10:45 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question I'm still a bit confused. Which model is the one listed on the site now? Is the Chris Parks model now "old" and is there a newer model out now? You and I both must Have bought his model last year. Have they replaced it with something different? Even better? On Mar 29, 2013, at 10:55 PM, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Hi, > > Yeah, they're well worth checking into, or at least I think so. > > I found out why I wasn't seeing it in the search results; The NFB site > groups all types of canes together, but doesn't descriminate between > the models. So, I was seeing pictures of the older canes because > that's the type the new one still fits under, (5 or 6 section > telescopic). The particular cane I got last time was made by Chris > Parks, and I just got it because it was what they had in stock. They > don't show it on the site, but if you know the particular model you > want you can request it in the comments section when you check out. > > On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >> I want to look at the new ones. >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 11:21 AM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >> >> Hi, >> >> Joshua, I didn't say that you said anything, I was merely sharing my >> experiences. I've heard from several people that those canes are thought to >> be indestructible, so it seemed like it might have been a common >> misconception. >> That is what is so improved about this model of the telescopic cane, it >> doesn't collapse near as much as the old oones. I rarely had to stop and >> fix mine. >> >> On Friday, March 29, 2013, Joshua Lester wrote: >> >>> Hi Kaiti! >>> I never said that the Ambutech canes were indestructable. >>> I just wish that they'd make the telescopic canes more stirdy, so that >>> they'll collapse, only when I want them to. >>> Blessings, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org ] on behalf of >>> Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com ] >>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 3:02 AM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>> >>> *the beginning of that was supposed to say that I'm the opposite. >>> Sorry for the weird cut off. >>> >>> On 3/29/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>> posite; telescopic canes last much longer for me than the folding >>>> ones, I think because of the weight and because of my pace. That is >>>> why I prefer the NFB canes and will most likely avoid the bulky >>>> folding ones. >>>> >>>> The next time someone tells you an Ambutech cane, or an aluminum one, >>>> is indestructable, don't necessarily buy it. In the first week of >>>> school this year I was going out to a campus event with some friends >>>> and because I had issues with people stepping on and breaking my >>>> telescopic canes in high school I chose to take my folding one from >>>> ambutech. It was so heavy for me that when I stepped off the curb it >>>> went down into a drainage grate. It must have gone right between the >>>> bars because I didn't feel it hit anything or realize it wasn't on the >>>> ground, but I kept walking and tripped when I felt that my cane wasn't >>>> coming with me. I dropped it and when a friend of mine grabbed it and >>>> pulled it out of the grate the bottom shaft was sliced open where the >>>> grate had dug into it and it was bent at a 45 degree angle from where >>>> it should have been. For a while I used a straight cane that was kind >>>> of my old-faithful cane, (My O&M instructor and I made it when I was >>>> in the 4th grade and I still had it as a college freshman). It was a >>>> little short for me, but I didn't grow much after making it so it >>>> would have worked all right till I could order a new one over >>>> Christmas break. Then again, I was walking with friends, and the cane >>>> got stuck in a really big crack in the sidewalk. When we pulled it >>>> out the tip was still wedged into the crack, but the bottom of the >>>> shaft was dented all over to the point where I doubt another tip would >>>> be able to stay on it. (The kicker was that this all happened within >>>> a month). Then I started using the telescopic cane because I had no >>>> other choice, and not only were people more conscious about avoiding >>>> stepping on a white stick, but all my problems with grates and >>>> sidewalk cracks magically went away. (and my wrist liked it better >>>> too). >>>> >>>> On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>> Another thing I should mention, is that I found out that cane tips >>>>> cost >>>>> over >>>>> $1.50, per tip! >>>>> Good grief! >>>>> Those tips are small, unlike the tips you find on VR canes! >>>>> Why not just charge 50 cents a tip? >>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Joshua Lester >>>>> [JLester8462 at pccua.edu] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:21 AM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>> >>>>> I bought an NFB folding cane, and a straight cane from them! >>>>> I had issues with the tip coming off of the straight cane, and the >>>>> folding >>>>> cane broke after the first day, because they aren't stirdy enough! >>>>> I had a telescoping cane as well, and it would collapse when I didn't >>>>> want >>>>> it to, and it wouldn't collapse when I did! >>>>> Ambutech, (on the other hand,) is awesome! >>>>> Their canes are stirdyer, and they may be bulky, but they get the job >>>>> done! >>>>> I can't imagine myself with a thinner cane, no matter what it is! >>>>> My Ambutech cane has lasted longer than my VR canes, and those NFB >>>>> canes >>>>> combined! >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >>>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:10 AM >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu From hhamraz at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 14:48:13 2013 From: hhamraz at gmail.com (Hamid Hamraz) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 10:48:13 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Accessible Dating Website Message-ID: <1D97316B5A36494689AA23853C21D83A@HamidPC> Hi There Folks, Is anybody aware of a dating website decently accessible by JAWS? Thank you. Hamid From tyler at tysdomain.com Sat Mar 30 15:49:14 2013 From: tyler at tysdomain.com (Littlefield, Tyler) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 09:49:14 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] nfb 2013 scholarship:who do I speak to? In-Reply-To: References: <515633F3.2020504@tysdomain.com> <51563609.6060200@tysdomain.com> Message-ID: <5157097A.6000107@tysdomain.com> Thanks arielle, really appreciated. Do you by chance know who the supplement stuff for this scholarship goes to? I read through the faq and didn't see the email; either it's not there or I'm missing it. I'm leaning toward the latter. On 3/29/2013 7:37 PM, Arielle Silverman wrote: > Hi Tyler, > It might be too late for you to get a Colorado president's letter for > the national NFB scholarship, but it is not too late to get the state > scholarship, since the deadline isn't until April 15. > You can make an appointment for an interview with Scott LaBarre, CO > president, by calling > 303-778-1130 > and ask to speak with Lisa Bonderson. > Best, > Arielle > > On 3/29/13, Littlefield, Tyler wrote: >> Sorry, one final question. I seen the state listing in the FAQ, but I'm >> not actually seeing the email address anywhere that I need to send the >> extra information to. >> >> On 3/29/2013 6:38 PM, Littlefield, Tyler wrote: >>> hello all: >>> I guess this is sort of late; I just stumbled onto the NFB scholarship >>> but I was curious who I need to talk to for Colorado for an interview? >>> If someone could give me contact details or the person from Colorado >>> could get in touch with me, I would really really appreciate it. >>> Thanks, >>> >> >> -- >> Take care, >> Ty >> http://tds-solutions.net >> The aspen project: a barebones light-weight mud engine: >> http://code.google.com/p/aspenmud >> He that will not reason is a bigot; he that cannot reason is a fool; he that >> dares not reason is a slave. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >> > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/tyler%40tysdomain.com -- Take care, Ty http://tds-solutions.net The aspen project: a barebones light-weight mud engine: http://code.google.com/p/aspenmud He that will not reason is a bigot; he that cannot reason is a fool; he that dares not reason is a slave. From slabarre at labarrelaw.com Sat Mar 30 15:50:44 2013 From: slabarre at labarrelaw.com (Scott C. LaBarre) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 09:50:44 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] nfb 2013 scholarship:who do I speak to? In-Reply-To: References: <515633F3.2020504@tysdomain.com> <51563609.6060200@tysdomain.com> Message-ID: <006c01ce2d5e$57256f90$05704eb0$@labarrelaw.com> I should also note that we have a Colorado scholarship and our deadline is April 15th. That application is available at www.nfbco.org. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle Silverman Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 7:37 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] nfb 2013 scholarship:who do I speak to? Hi Tyler, It might be too late for you to get a Colorado president's letter for the national NFB scholarship, but it is not too late to get the state scholarship, since the deadline isn't until April 15. You can make an appointment for an interview with Scott LaBarre, CO president, by calling 303-778-1130 and ask to speak with Lisa Bonderson. Best, Arielle On 3/29/13, Littlefield, Tyler wrote: > Sorry, one final question. I seen the state listing in the FAQ, but I'm > not actually seeing the email address anywhere that I need to send the > extra information to. > > On 3/29/2013 6:38 PM, Littlefield, Tyler wrote: >> hello all: >> I guess this is sort of late; I just stumbled onto the NFB scholarship >> but I was curious who I need to talk to for Colorado for an interview? >> If someone could give me contact details or the person from Colorado >> could get in touch with me, I would really really appreciate it. >> Thanks, >> > > > -- > Take care, > Ty > http://tds-solutions.net > The aspen project: a barebones light-weight mud engine: > http://code.google.com/p/aspenmud > He that will not reason is a bigot; he that cannot reason is a fool; he that > dares not reason is a slave. > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/slabarre%40labarrelaw.co m From slabarre at labarrelaw.com Sat Mar 30 15:49:48 2013 From: slabarre at labarrelaw.com (Scott C. LaBarre) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 09:49:48 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] nfb 2013 scholarship:who do I speak to? In-Reply-To: References: <515633F3.2020504@tysdomain.com> <51563609.6060200@tysdomain.com> Message-ID: <006b01ce2d5e$35d59a90$a180cfb0$@labarrelaw.com> Greetings, as long as you complete the on line application and submit all the other forms and documents per the instructions by tomorrow, we can certainly arrange a scholarship interview in a timely fashion. The actual call with a state president does not have to occur before the 31st but rather we need to know about your desire to have such an interview. I will take your email as such a notification. As Arielle suggested, please contact my assistant, Lisa Bonderson, at lbonderson at labarrelaw.com or 303 504-5979 to arrange a time for the interview. Regards, Scott C. LaBarre, Esq.   LaBarre Law Offices P.C. 1660 South Albion Street, Ste. 918 Denver, Colorado 80222 303 504-5979 (voice) 303 757-3640 (fax) slabarre at labarrelaw.com (e-mail) www.labarrelaw.com (website)   CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This message may contain confidential and privileged information. If you are not the designated recipient, you may not read, copy, distribute or retain this message. If you received this message in error, please notify the sender at 303) 504-5979 or slabarre at labarrelaw.com, and destroy and delete it from your system. This message and any attachments are covered by the Electronic Communications Privacy Act, 18 U.S.C. §§ 2510-2521. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle Silverman Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 7:37 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] nfb 2013 scholarship:who do I speak to? Hi Tyler, It might be too late for you to get a Colorado president's letter for the national NFB scholarship, but it is not too late to get the state scholarship, since the deadline isn't until April 15. You can make an appointment for an interview with Scott LaBarre, CO president, by calling 303-778-1130 and ask to speak with Lisa Bonderson. Best, Arielle On 3/29/13, Littlefield, Tyler wrote: > Sorry, one final question. I seen the state listing in the FAQ, but > I'm not actually seeing the email address anywhere that I need to send > the extra information to. > > On 3/29/2013 6:38 PM, Littlefield, Tyler wrote: >> hello all: >> I guess this is sort of late; I just stumbled onto the NFB >> scholarship but I was curious who I need to talk to for Colorado for an interview? >> If someone could give me contact details or the person from Colorado >> could get in touch with me, I would really really appreciate it. >> Thanks, >> > > > -- > Take care, > Ty > http://tds-solutions.net > The aspen project: a barebones light-weight mud engine: > http://code.google.com/p/aspenmud > He that will not reason is a bigot; he that cannot reason is a fool; > he that dares not reason is a slave. > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. > com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/slabarre%40labarrelaw.co m From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 16:02:13 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 12:02:13 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] nfb 2013 scholarship:who do I speak to? In-Reply-To: <006b01ce2d5e$35d59a90$a180cfb0$@labarrelaw.com> References: <515633F3.2020504@tysdomain.com> <51563609.6060200@tysdomain.com> <006b01ce2d5e$35d59a90$a180cfb0$@labarrelaw.com> Message-ID: Hi Tyler, For your reference the email is on the submissions checklist. It should be right below the address to send print materials to. I believe it's scholarships at nfb.org, but you might want to double-check since I'm going off memory with that one. :) Good luck, and I'd definitely recommend going for your state scholarship too. On 3/30/13, Scott C. LaBarre wrote: > Greetings, as long as you complete the on line application and submit all > the other forms and documents per the instructions by tomorrow, we can > certainly arrange a scholarship interview in a timely fashion. The actual > call with a state president does not have to occur before the 31st but > rather we need to know about your desire to have such an interview. I will > take your email as such a notification. As Arielle suggested, please > contact my assistant, Lisa Bonderson, at lbonderson at labarrelaw.com or 303 > 504-5979 to arrange a time for the interview. > > Regards, > > > > Scott C. LaBarre, Esq. > > LaBarre Law Offices P.C. > 1660 South Albion Street, Ste. 918 > Denver, Colorado 80222 > 303 504-5979 (voice) > 303 757-3640 (fax) > slabarre at labarrelaw.com (e-mail) > www.labarrelaw.com (website) > > CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This message may contain confidential and > privileged > information. If you are not the designated recipient, you may not read, > copy, distribute or retain this message. If you received this message in > error, please notify the sender at 303) 504-5979 or > slabarre at labarrelaw.com, > and destroy and delete it from your system. This message and any > attachments > are covered by the Electronic Communications Privacy Act, 18 U.S.C. §§ > 2510-2521. > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle > Silverman > Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 7:37 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] nfb 2013 scholarship:who do I speak to? > > Hi Tyler, > It might be too late for you to get a Colorado president's letter for the > national NFB scholarship, but it is not too late to get the state > scholarship, since the deadline isn't until April 15. > You can make an appointment for an interview with Scott LaBarre, CO > president, by calling > 303-778-1130 > and ask to speak with Lisa Bonderson. > Best, > Arielle > > On 3/29/13, Littlefield, Tyler wrote: >> Sorry, one final question. I seen the state listing in the FAQ, but >> I'm not actually seeing the email address anywhere that I need to send >> the extra information to. >> >> On 3/29/2013 6:38 PM, Littlefield, Tyler wrote: >>> hello all: >>> I guess this is sort of late; I just stumbled onto the NFB >>> scholarship but I was curious who I need to talk to for Colorado for an > interview? >>> If someone could give me contact details or the person from Colorado >>> could get in touch with me, I would really really appreciate it. >>> Thanks, >>> >> >> >> -- >> Take care, >> Ty >> http://tds-solutions.net >> The aspen project: a barebones light-weight mud engine: >> http://code.google.com/p/aspenmud >> He that will not reason is a bigot; he that cannot reason is a fool; >> he that dares not reason is a slave. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >> com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/slabarre%40labarrelaw.co > m > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 16:55:17 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 12:55:17 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com> <-1498599385532720274@unknownmsgid> Message-ID: Hi, Brice, I guess what they do is they just classify the canes by type. E.G, all the 5 or 6 section telescopic canes are listed on the site as type 7. This type includes all the models that fit into that category, so when you buy one you might get any model depending on what they have in stock unless you specifically tell them you want a specific type, E.G. the Chris Park. That one is still the latest and greatest thing out there, so I guess we were both lucky to get it when we bought our canes. What got me into trouble looking through the search results was that I didn't remember the exact type, so I assumed that the Chris Park would have it's own little category in the search results, (I didn't buy my last cane either, so I wasn't familiar with how to get to it from previous experience). Looking at the picture for the type 7, it shows two different models of NFB canes, but neither of them were the Chris Park. I was looking for that distinct grip which is much bigger than a lot of the NFB models and didn't see it. Now we know. :) I suppose every cane is different, Joshua, but I had significantly more collapses with my NFB telescopic cane I bought in 2009 than I have with the Chris Park model. I don't think you had the newest one; the collapse-resistant model just came out in December of 2011, so anything before that would be more collapse-prone. A lot of people, including myself, seem to really like this newer one. Different strokes for different folks, but don't base an opinion of an entire company over one cane from several years ago which has since been improved upon. On 3/30/13, Joshua Lester wrote: > Those Chris Parks canes are nothing but trouble! > Those were the ones that collapse too much! > His folding canes are awful too! > I got the telescoping cane in 2010, and I didn't like it. > Blessings, Joshua > ________________________________________ > From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Brice Smith > [brice.smith319 at gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 10:45 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question > > I'm still a bit confused. Which model is the one listed on the site > now? Is the Chris Parks model now "old" and is there a newer model out > now? You and I both must Have bought his model last year. Have they > replaced it with something different? Even better? > > On Mar 29, 2013, at 10:55 PM, Kaiti Shelton > wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> Yeah, they're well worth checking into, or at least I think so. >> >> I found out why I wasn't seeing it in the search results; The NFB site >> groups all types of canes together, but doesn't descriminate between >> the models. So, I was seeing pictures of the older canes because >> that's the type the new one still fits under, (5 or 6 section >> telescopic). The particular cane I got last time was made by Chris >> Parks, and I just got it because it was what they had in stock. They >> don't show it on the site, but if you know the particular model you >> want you can request it in the comments section when you check out. >> >> On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>> I want to look at the new ones. >>> Blessings, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 11:21 AM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> Joshua, I didn't say that you said anything, I was merely sharing my >>> experiences. I've heard from several people that those canes are thought >>> to >>> be indestructible, so it seemed like it might have been a common >>> misconception. >>> That is what is so improved about this model of the telescopic cane, it >>> doesn't collapse near as much as the old oones. I rarely had to stop and >>> fix mine. >>> >>> On Friday, March 29, 2013, Joshua Lester wrote: >>> >>>> Hi Kaiti! >>>> I never said that the Ambutech canes were indestructable. >>>> I just wish that they'd make the telescopic canes more stirdy, so that >>>> they'll collapse, only when I want them to. >>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org ] on behalf of >>>> Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com ] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 3:02 AM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>> >>>> *the beginning of that was supposed to say that I'm the opposite. >>>> Sorry for the weird cut off. >>>> >>>> On 3/29/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>>> posite; telescopic canes last much longer for me than the folding >>>>> ones, I think because of the weight and because of my pace. That is >>>>> why I prefer the NFB canes and will most likely avoid the bulky >>>>> folding ones. >>>>> >>>>> The next time someone tells you an Ambutech cane, or an aluminum one, >>>>> is indestructable, don't necessarily buy it. In the first week of >>>>> school this year I was going out to a campus event with some friends >>>>> and because I had issues with people stepping on and breaking my >>>>> telescopic canes in high school I chose to take my folding one from >>>>> ambutech. It was so heavy for me that when I stepped off the curb it >>>>> went down into a drainage grate. It must have gone right between the >>>>> bars because I didn't feel it hit anything or realize it wasn't on the >>>>> ground, but I kept walking and tripped when I felt that my cane wasn't >>>>> coming with me. I dropped it and when a friend of mine grabbed it and >>>>> pulled it out of the grate the bottom shaft was sliced open where the >>>>> grate had dug into it and it was bent at a 45 degree angle from where >>>>> it should have been. For a while I used a straight cane that was kind >>>>> of my old-faithful cane, (My O&M instructor and I made it when I was >>>>> in the 4th grade and I still had it as a college freshman). It was a >>>>> little short for me, but I didn't grow much after making it so it >>>>> would have worked all right till I could order a new one over >>>>> Christmas break. Then again, I was walking with friends, and the cane >>>>> got stuck in a really big crack in the sidewalk. When we pulled it >>>>> out the tip was still wedged into the crack, but the bottom of the >>>>> shaft was dented all over to the point where I doubt another tip would >>>>> be able to stay on it. (The kicker was that this all happened within >>>>> a month). Then I started using the telescopic cane because I had no >>>>> other choice, and not only were people more conscious about avoiding >>>>> stepping on a white stick, but all my problems with grates and >>>>> sidewalk cracks magically went away. (and my wrist liked it better >>>>> too). >>>>> >>>>> On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>> Another thing I should mention, is that I found out that cane tips >>>>>> cost >>>>>> over >>>>>> $1.50, per tip! >>>>>> Good grief! >>>>>> Those tips are small, unlike the tips you find on VR canes! >>>>>> Why not just charge 50 cents a tip? >>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Joshua Lester >>>>>> [JLester8462 at pccua.edu] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:21 AM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>> >>>>>> I bought an NFB folding cane, and a straight cane from them! >>>>>> I had issues with the tip coming off of the straight cane, and the >>>>>> folding >>>>>> cane broke after the first day, because they aren't stirdy enough! >>>>>> I had a telescoping cane as well, and it would collapse when I didn't >>>>>> want >>>>>> it to, and it wouldn't collapse when I did! >>>>>> Ambutech, (on the other hand,) is awesome! >>>>>> Their canes are stirdyer, and they may be bulky, but they get the job >>>>>> done! >>>>>> I can't imagine myself with a thinner cane, no matter what it is! >>>>>> My Ambutech cane has lasted longer than my VR canes, and those NFB >>>>>> canes >>>>>> combined! >>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >>>>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:10 AM >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu > > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From brice.smith319 at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 17:17:50 2013 From: brice.smith319 at gmail.com (Brice Smith) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 13:17:50 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com> <-1498599385532720274@unknownmsgid> Message-ID: Right. So if you just order a type 7 cane from the NFB store, there's no guarantee what you'll actually get when you spend your $35? You might get Chris Park's model, but you might also get the old (pre 2010) model that most people universally seem to dislike? The amusing thing here is that while Kaiti can check out the pictures, other users of the store ... can't. So the NFB's lack of clarification here makes perfect sense! Got it. Anyway, Chris Park has his own website. http://www.chrisparkdesign.com/sub_01_new.html Brice On 3/30/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Hi, > > Brice, I guess what they do is they just classify the canes by type. > E.G, all the 5 or 6 section telescopic canes are listed on the site as > type 7. This type includes all the models that fit into that > category, so when you buy one you might get any model depending on > what they have in stock unless you specifically tell them you want a > specific type, E.G. the Chris Park. That one is still the latest and > greatest thing out there, so I guess we were both lucky to get it when > we bought our canes. What got me into trouble looking through the > search results was that I didn't remember the exact type, so I assumed > that the Chris Park would have it's own little category in the search > results, (I didn't buy my last cane either, so I wasn't familiar with > how to get to it from previous experience). Looking at the picture > for the type 7, it shows two different models of NFB canes, but > neither of them were the Chris Park. I was looking for that distinct > grip which is much bigger than a lot of the NFB models and didn't see > it. Now we know. :) > > I suppose every cane is different, Joshua, but I had significantly > more collapses with my NFB telescopic cane I bought in 2009 than I > have with the Chris Park model. I don't think you had the newest one; > the collapse-resistant model just came out in December of 2011, so > anything before that would be more collapse-prone. A lot of people, > including myself, seem to really like this newer one. Different > strokes for different folks, but don't base an opinion of an entire > company over one cane from several years ago which has since been > improved upon. > > On 3/30/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >> Those Chris Parks canes are nothing but trouble! >> Those were the ones that collapse too much! >> His folding canes are awful too! >> I got the telescoping cane in 2010, and I didn't like it. >> Blessings, Joshua >> ________________________________________ >> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Brice Smith >> [brice.smith319 at gmail.com] >> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 10:45 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >> >> I'm still a bit confused. Which model is the one listed on the site >> now? Is the Chris Parks model now "old" and is there a newer model out >> now? You and I both must Have bought his model last year. Have they >> replaced it with something different? Even better? >> >> On Mar 29, 2013, at 10:55 PM, Kaiti Shelton >> wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> >>> Yeah, they're well worth checking into, or at least I think so. >>> >>> I found out why I wasn't seeing it in the search results; The NFB site >>> groups all types of canes together, but doesn't descriminate between >>> the models. So, I was seeing pictures of the older canes because >>> that's the type the new one still fits under, (5 or 6 section >>> telescopic). The particular cane I got last time was made by Chris >>> Parks, and I just got it because it was what they had in stock. They >>> don't show it on the site, but if you know the particular model you >>> want you can request it in the comments section when you check out. >>> >>> On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>> I want to look at the new ones. >>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 11:21 AM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>> >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> Joshua, I didn't say that you said anything, I was merely sharing my >>>> experiences. I've heard from several people that those canes are >>>> thought >>>> to >>>> be indestructible, so it seemed like it might have been a common >>>> misconception. >>>> That is what is so improved about this model of the telescopic cane, it >>>> doesn't collapse near as much as the old oones. I rarely had to stop >>>> and >>>> fix mine. >>>> >>>> On Friday, March 29, 2013, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi Kaiti! >>>>> I never said that the Ambutech canes were indestructable. >>>>> I just wish that they'd make the telescopic canes more stirdy, so that >>>>> they'll collapse, only when I want them to. >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org ] on behalf of >>>>> Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com ] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 3:02 AM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>> >>>>> *the beginning of that was supposed to say that I'm the opposite. >>>>> Sorry for the weird cut off. >>>>> >>>>> On 3/29/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>>>> posite; telescopic canes last much longer for me than the folding >>>>>> ones, I think because of the weight and because of my pace. That is >>>>>> why I prefer the NFB canes and will most likely avoid the bulky >>>>>> folding ones. >>>>>> >>>>>> The next time someone tells you an Ambutech cane, or an aluminum one, >>>>>> is indestructable, don't necessarily buy it. In the first week of >>>>>> school this year I was going out to a campus event with some friends >>>>>> and because I had issues with people stepping on and breaking my >>>>>> telescopic canes in high school I chose to take my folding one from >>>>>> ambutech. It was so heavy for me that when I stepped off the curb it >>>>>> went down into a drainage grate. It must have gone right between the >>>>>> bars because I didn't feel it hit anything or realize it wasn't on >>>>>> the >>>>>> ground, but I kept walking and tripped when I felt that my cane >>>>>> wasn't >>>>>> coming with me. I dropped it and when a friend of mine grabbed it >>>>>> and >>>>>> pulled it out of the grate the bottom shaft was sliced open where the >>>>>> grate had dug into it and it was bent at a 45 degree angle from where >>>>>> it should have been. For a while I used a straight cane that was >>>>>> kind >>>>>> of my old-faithful cane, (My O&M instructor and I made it when I was >>>>>> in the 4th grade and I still had it as a college freshman). It was a >>>>>> little short for me, but I didn't grow much after making it so it >>>>>> would have worked all right till I could order a new one over >>>>>> Christmas break. Then again, I was walking with friends, and the >>>>>> cane >>>>>> got stuck in a really big crack in the sidewalk. When we pulled it >>>>>> out the tip was still wedged into the crack, but the bottom of the >>>>>> shaft was dented all over to the point where I doubt another tip >>>>>> would >>>>>> be able to stay on it. (The kicker was that this all happened within >>>>>> a month). Then I started using the telescopic cane because I had no >>>>>> other choice, and not only were people more conscious about avoiding >>>>>> stepping on a white stick, but all my problems with grates and >>>>>> sidewalk cracks magically went away. (and my wrist liked it better >>>>>> too). >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>>> Another thing I should mention, is that I found out that cane tips >>>>>>> cost >>>>>>> over >>>>>>> $1.50, per tip! >>>>>>> Good grief! >>>>>>> Those tips are small, unlike the tips you find on VR canes! >>>>>>> Why not just charge 50 cents a tip? >>>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Joshua Lester >>>>>>> [JLester8462 at pccua.edu] >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:21 AM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I bought an NFB folding cane, and a straight cane from them! >>>>>>> I had issues with the tip coming off of the straight cane, and the >>>>>>> folding >>>>>>> cane broke after the first day, because they aren't stirdy enough! >>>>>>> I had a telescoping cane as well, and it would collapse when I >>>>>>> didn't >>>>>>> want >>>>>>> it to, and it wouldn't collapse when I did! >>>>>>> Ambutech, (on the other hand,) is awesome! >>>>>>> Their canes are stirdyer, and they may be bulky, but they get the >>>>>>> job >>>>>>> done! >>>>>>> I can't imagine myself with a thinner cane, no matter what it is! >>>>>>> My Ambutech cane has lasted longer than my VR canes, and those NFB >>>>>>> canes >>>>>>> combined! >>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >>>>>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:10 AM >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Kaiti >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com > From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Fri Mar 29 17:30:29 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 13:30:29 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] nfb 2013 scholarship:who do I speak to? In-Reply-To: <5157097A.6000107@tysdomain.com> References: <515633F3.2020504@tysdomain.com> <51563609.6060200@tysdomain.com> <5157097A.6000107@tysdomain.com> Message-ID: <006701ce2ca3$1c306c70$54914550$@gmail.com> Scholarships at nfb.org is the email. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Littlefield, Tyler Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2013 11:49 AM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] nfb 2013 scholarship:who do I speak to? Thanks arielle, really appreciated. Do you by chance know who the supplement stuff for this scholarship goes to? I read through the faq and didn't see the email; either it's not there or I'm missing it. I'm leaning toward the latter. On 3/29/2013 7:37 PM, Arielle Silverman wrote: > Hi Tyler, > It might be too late for you to get a Colorado president's letter for > the national NFB scholarship, but it is not too late to get the state > scholarship, since the deadline isn't until April 15. > You can make an appointment for an interview with Scott LaBarre, CO > president, by calling > 303-778-1130 > and ask to speak with Lisa Bonderson. > Best, > Arielle > > On 3/29/13, Littlefield, Tyler wrote: >> Sorry, one final question. I seen the state listing in the FAQ, but >> I'm not actually seeing the email address anywhere that I need to >> send the extra information to. >> >> On 3/29/2013 6:38 PM, Littlefield, Tyler wrote: >>> hello all: >>> I guess this is sort of late; I just stumbled onto the NFB >>> scholarship but I was curious who I need to talk to for Colorado for an interview? >>> If someone could give me contact details or the person from Colorado >>> could get in touch with me, I would really really appreciate it. >>> Thanks, >>> >> >> -- >> Take care, >> Ty >> http://tds-solutions.net >> The aspen project: a barebones light-weight mud engine: >> http://code.google.com/p/aspenmud >> He that will not reason is a bigot; he that cannot reason is a fool; >> he that dares not reason is a slave. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail >> .com >> > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/tyler%40tysdomain. > com -- Take care, Ty http://tds-solutions.net The aspen project: a barebones light-weight mud engine: http://code.google.com/p/aspenmud He that will not reason is a bigot; he that cannot reason is a fool; he that dares not reason is a slave. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From carrie.gilmer at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 17:50:41 2013 From: carrie.gilmer at gmail.com (Carrie Gilmer) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 12:50:41 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] nfb 2013 scholarship:who do I speak to? In-Reply-To: <006b01ce2d5e$35d59a90$a180cfb0$@labarrelaw.com> References: <515633F3.2020504@tysdomain.com> <51563609.6060200@tysdomain.com> <006b01ce2d5e$35d59a90$a180cfb0$@labarrelaw.com> Message-ID: Scott, your awesomeness never fails. :) Sent from my iPad On Mar 30, 2013, at 10:49 AM, "Scott C. LaBarre" wrote: > Greetings, as long as you complete the on line application and submit all > the other forms and documents per the instructions by tomorrow, we can > certainly arrange a scholarship interview in a timely fashion. The actual > call with a state president does not have to occur before the 31st but > rather we need to know about your desire to have such an interview. I will > take your email as such a notification. As Arielle suggested, please > contact my assistant, Lisa Bonderson, at lbonderson at labarrelaw.com or 303 > 504-5979 to arrange a time for the interview. > > Regards, > > > > Scott C. LaBarre, Esq. > > LaBarre Law Offices P.C. > 1660 South Albion Street, Ste. 918 > Denver, Colorado 80222 > 303 504-5979 (voice) > 303 757-3640 (fax) > slabarre at labarrelaw.com (e-mail) > www.labarrelaw.com (website) > > CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This message may contain confidential and privileged > information. If you are not the designated recipient, you may not read, > copy, distribute or retain this message. If you received this message in > error, please notify the sender at 303) 504-5979 or slabarre at labarrelaw.com, > and destroy and delete it from your system. This message and any attachments > are covered by the Electronic Communications Privacy Act, 18 U.S.C. §§ > 2510-2521. > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle > Silverman > Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 7:37 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] nfb 2013 scholarship:who do I speak to? > > Hi Tyler, > It might be too late for you to get a Colorado president's letter for the > national NFB scholarship, but it is not too late to get the state > scholarship, since the deadline isn't until April 15. > You can make an appointment for an interview with Scott LaBarre, CO > president, by calling > 303-778-1130 > and ask to speak with Lisa Bonderson. > Best, > Arielle > > On 3/29/13, Littlefield, Tyler wrote: >> Sorry, one final question. I seen the state listing in the FAQ, but >> I'm not actually seeing the email address anywhere that I need to send >> the extra information to. >> >> On 3/29/2013 6:38 PM, Littlefield, Tyler wrote: >>> hello all: >>> I guess this is sort of late; I just stumbled onto the NFB >>> scholarship but I was curious who I need to talk to for Colorado for an > interview? >>> If someone could give me contact details or the person from Colorado >>> could get in touch with me, I would really really appreciate it. >>> Thanks, >> >> >> -- >> Take care, >> Ty >> http://tds-solutions.net >> The aspen project: a barebones light-weight mud engine: >> http://code.google.com/p/aspenmud >> He that will not reason is a bigot; he that cannot reason is a fool; >> he that dares not reason is a slave. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >> com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/slabarre%40labarrelaw.co > m > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carrie.gilmer%40gmail.com From arielle71 at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 18:51:08 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 12:51:08 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Accessible Dating Website In-Reply-To: <1D97316B5A36494689AA23853C21D83A@HamidPC> References: <1D97316B5A36494689AA23853C21D83A@HamidPC> Message-ID: I was on www.okcupid.com for a couple years and it was accessible except for one Captia at the beginning. It's been a long time since I've been on though, so it could have gotten less accessible (or maybe they fixed the one Captia). There are lots of dating websites out there, though, so you can always try a few and see which ones are the most user-friendly. My personal opinion is that you will find better dating options on free sites than on paid ones, but that's just my opinion. Arielle On 3/30/13, Hamid Hamraz wrote: > Hi There Folks, > > Is anybody aware of a dating website decently accessible by JAWS? > > Thank you. > > Hamid > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Fri Mar 29 19:29:28 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 15:29:28 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Accessible Dating Website In-Reply-To: References: <1D97316B5A36494689AA23853C21D83A@HamidPC> Message-ID: <009f01ce2cb3$bcd31000$36793000$@gmail.com> Why is that? Why do you find free sites better than paied ones? -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle Silverman Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2013 2:51 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Accessible Dating Website I was on www.okcupid.com for a couple years and it was accessible except for one Captia at the beginning. It's been a long time since I've been on though, so it could have gotten less accessible (or maybe they fixed the one Captia). There are lots of dating websites out there, though, so you can always try a few and see which ones are the most user-friendly. My personal opinion is that you will find better dating options on free sites than on paid ones, but that's just my opinion. Arielle On 3/30/13, Hamid Hamraz wrote: > Hi There Folks, > > Is anybody aware of a dating website decently accessible by JAWS? > > Thank you. > > Hamid > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. > com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 19:44:10 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 15:44:10 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com> <-1498599385532720274@unknownmsgid> Message-ID: Hi, That is right, unless you clarify in the comment section the model you want. If you tell them you specifically want the Chris Park model in the comments they won't ignore that and you'll get what you want for your $35. The clarification might be there for people who don't know to do the comment thing, (which I'm assuming would be the majority of people), but they don't make it impossible for you to get what you want for your buck. Actually, my ability to see the pictures probably further complicated the issue; had I just gone off the cane type and commented that I wanted the Chris Park model from the start I would have saved myself some confusion, although I'm not sure many other people would have known to do that either. Have you been able to purchase directly from Chris Park's site? That was where I looked after the NFB store was confusing me and before I called, but I didn't see any links to the specific models or to checkout/purchase anything. On 3/30/13, Brice Smith wrote: > Right. So if you just order a type 7 cane from the NFB store, there's > no guarantee what you'll actually get when you spend your $35? You > might get Chris Park's model, but you might also get the old (pre > 2010) model that most people universally seem to dislike? The amusing > thing here is that while Kaiti can check out the pictures, other users > of the store ... can't. So the NFB's lack of clarification here makes > perfect sense! Got it. > > Anyway, Chris Park has his own website. > > http://www.chrisparkdesign.com/sub_01_new.html > > Brice > > On 3/30/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >> Hi, >> >> Brice, I guess what they do is they just classify the canes by type. >> E.G, all the 5 or 6 section telescopic canes are listed on the site as >> type 7. This type includes all the models that fit into that >> category, so when you buy one you might get any model depending on >> what they have in stock unless you specifically tell them you want a >> specific type, E.G. the Chris Park. That one is still the latest and >> greatest thing out there, so I guess we were both lucky to get it when >> we bought our canes. What got me into trouble looking through the >> search results was that I didn't remember the exact type, so I assumed >> that the Chris Park would have it's own little category in the search >> results, (I didn't buy my last cane either, so I wasn't familiar with >> how to get to it from previous experience). Looking at the picture >> for the type 7, it shows two different models of NFB canes, but >> neither of them were the Chris Park. I was looking for that distinct >> grip which is much bigger than a lot of the NFB models and didn't see >> it. Now we know. :) >> >> I suppose every cane is different, Joshua, but I had significantly >> more collapses with my NFB telescopic cane I bought in 2009 than I >> have with the Chris Park model. I don't think you had the newest one; >> the collapse-resistant model just came out in December of 2011, so >> anything before that would be more collapse-prone. A lot of people, >> including myself, seem to really like this newer one. Different >> strokes for different folks, but don't base an opinion of an entire >> company over one cane from several years ago which has since been >> improved upon. >> >> On 3/30/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>> Those Chris Parks canes are nothing but trouble! >>> Those were the ones that collapse too much! >>> His folding canes are awful too! >>> I got the telescoping cane in 2010, and I didn't like it. >>> Blessings, Joshua >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Brice Smith >>> [brice.smith319 at gmail.com] >>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 10:45 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>> >>> I'm still a bit confused. Which model is the one listed on the site >>> now? Is the Chris Parks model now "old" and is there a newer model out >>> now? You and I both must Have bought his model last year. Have they >>> replaced it with something different? Even better? >>> >>> On Mar 29, 2013, at 10:55 PM, Kaiti Shelton >>> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> Yeah, they're well worth checking into, or at least I think so. >>>> >>>> I found out why I wasn't seeing it in the search results; The NFB site >>>> groups all types of canes together, but doesn't descriminate between >>>> the models. So, I was seeing pictures of the older canes because >>>> that's the type the new one still fits under, (5 or 6 section >>>> telescopic). The particular cane I got last time was made by Chris >>>> Parks, and I just got it because it was what they had in stock. They >>>> don't show it on the site, but if you know the particular model you >>>> want you can request it in the comments section when you check out. >>>> >>>> On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>> I want to look at the new ones. >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >>>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 11:21 AM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>> >>>>> Joshua, I didn't say that you said anything, I was merely sharing my >>>>> experiences. I've heard from several people that those canes are >>>>> thought >>>>> to >>>>> be indestructible, so it seemed like it might have been a common >>>>> misconception. >>>>> That is what is so improved about this model of the telescopic cane, >>>>> it >>>>> doesn't collapse near as much as the old oones. I rarely had to stop >>>>> and >>>>> fix mine. >>>>> >>>>> On Friday, March 29, 2013, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hi Kaiti! >>>>>> I never said that the Ambutech canes were indestructable. >>>>>> I just wish that they'd make the telescopic canes more stirdy, so >>>>>> that >>>>>> they'll collapse, only when I want them to. >>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org ] on behalf of >>>>>> Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com ] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 3:02 AM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>> >>>>>> *the beginning of that was supposed to say that I'm the opposite. >>>>>> Sorry for the weird cut off. >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/29/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>>>>> posite; telescopic canes last much longer for me than the folding >>>>>>> ones, I think because of the weight and because of my pace. That is >>>>>>> why I prefer the NFB canes and will most likely avoid the bulky >>>>>>> folding ones. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The next time someone tells you an Ambutech cane, or an aluminum >>>>>>> one, >>>>>>> is indestructable, don't necessarily buy it. In the first week of >>>>>>> school this year I was going out to a campus event with some friends >>>>>>> and because I had issues with people stepping on and breaking my >>>>>>> telescopic canes in high school I chose to take my folding one from >>>>>>> ambutech. It was so heavy for me that when I stepped off the curb >>>>>>> it >>>>>>> went down into a drainage grate. It must have gone right between >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> bars because I didn't feel it hit anything or realize it wasn't on >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> ground, but I kept walking and tripped when I felt that my cane >>>>>>> wasn't >>>>>>> coming with me. I dropped it and when a friend of mine grabbed it >>>>>>> and >>>>>>> pulled it out of the grate the bottom shaft was sliced open where >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> grate had dug into it and it was bent at a 45 degree angle from >>>>>>> where >>>>>>> it should have been. For a while I used a straight cane that was >>>>>>> kind >>>>>>> of my old-faithful cane, (My O&M instructor and I made it when I was >>>>>>> in the 4th grade and I still had it as a college freshman). It was >>>>>>> a >>>>>>> little short for me, but I didn't grow much after making it so it >>>>>>> would have worked all right till I could order a new one over >>>>>>> Christmas break. Then again, I was walking with friends, and the >>>>>>> cane >>>>>>> got stuck in a really big crack in the sidewalk. When we pulled it >>>>>>> out the tip was still wedged into the crack, but the bottom of the >>>>>>> shaft was dented all over to the point where I doubt another tip >>>>>>> would >>>>>>> be able to stay on it. (The kicker was that this all happened >>>>>>> within >>>>>>> a month). Then I started using the telescopic cane because I had no >>>>>>> other choice, and not only were people more conscious about avoiding >>>>>>> stepping on a white stick, but all my problems with grates and >>>>>>> sidewalk cracks magically went away. (and my wrist liked it better >>>>>>> too). >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>>>> Another thing I should mention, is that I found out that cane tips >>>>>>>> cost >>>>>>>> over >>>>>>>> $1.50, per tip! >>>>>>>> Good grief! >>>>>>>> Those tips are small, unlike the tips you find on VR canes! >>>>>>>> Why not just charge 50 cents a tip? >>>>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Joshua Lester >>>>>>>> [JLester8462 at pccua.edu] >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:21 AM >>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I bought an NFB folding cane, and a straight cane from them! >>>>>>>> I had issues with the tip coming off of the straight cane, and the >>>>>>>> folding >>>>>>>> cane broke after the first day, because they aren't stirdy enough! >>>>>>>> I had a telescoping cane as well, and it would collapse when I >>>>>>>> didn't >>>>>>>> want >>>>>>>> it to, and it wouldn't collapse when I did! >>>>>>>> Ambutech, (on the other hand,) is awesome! >>>>>>>> Their canes are stirdyer, and they may be bulky, but they get the >>>>>>>> job >>>>>>>> done! >>>>>>>> I can't imagine myself with a thinner cane, no matter what it is! >>>>>>>> My Ambutech cane has lasted longer than my VR canes, and those NFB >>>>>>>> canes >>>>>>>> combined! >>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >>>>>>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:10 AM >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Kaiti >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Kaiti >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From arielle71 at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 20:04:36 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 14:04:36 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Accessible Dating Website In-Reply-To: <009f01ce2cb3$bcd31000$36793000$@gmail.com> References: <1D97316B5A36494689AA23853C21D83A@HamidPC> <009f01ce2cb3$bcd31000$36793000$@gmail.com> Message-ID: My opinion is probably biased, but I think that the people who are willing to spend money for online dating might, on average, tend to be more "desperate" or less successful at dating, whereas the people who go on the free sites are just having fun. However, I can see it going the other way too if the ones on the free sites aren't very committed to online dating. I do know a few people who found lasting love using OKCupid, and they have a pretty good algorithm for matching people up, I think. Arielle On 3/29/13, justin williams wrote: > Why is that? Why do you find free sites better than paied ones? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle > Silverman > Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2013 2:51 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Accessible Dating Website > > I was on > www.okcupid.com > for a couple years and it was accessible except for one Captia at the > beginning. It's been a long time since I've been on though, so it could > have > gotten less accessible (or maybe they fixed the one Captia). There are > lots > of dating websites out there, though, so you can always try a few and see > which ones are the most user-friendly. My personal opinion is that you will > find better dating options on free sites than on paid ones, but that's just > my opinion. > Arielle > > On 3/30/13, Hamid Hamraz wrote: >> Hi There Folks, >> >> Is anybody aware of a dating website decently accessible by JAWS? >> >> Thank you. >> >> Hamid >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >> com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Fri Mar 29 20:09:47 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2013 16:09:47 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Accessible Dating Website In-Reply-To: References: <1D97316B5A36494689AA23853C21D83A@HamidPC> <009f01ce2cb3$bcd31000$36793000$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <00a101ce2cb9$5d7fc6b0$187f5410$@gmail.com> Is that cupid a paying sight? -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle Silverman Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2013 4:05 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Accessible Dating Website My opinion is probably biased, but I think that the people who are willing to spend money for online dating might, on average, tend to be more "desperate" or less successful at dating, whereas the people who go on the free sites are just having fun. However, I can see it going the other way too if the ones on the free sites aren't very committed to online dating. I do know a few people who found lasting love using OKCupid, and they have a pretty good algorithm for matching people up, I think. Arielle On 3/29/13, justin williams wrote: > Why is that? Why do you find free sites better than paied ones? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle > Silverman > Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2013 2:51 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Accessible Dating Website > > I was on > www.okcupid.com > for a couple years and it was accessible except for one Captia at the > beginning. It's been a long time since I've been on though, so it > could have gotten less accessible (or maybe they fixed the one > Captia). There are lots of dating websites out there, though, so you > can always try a few and see which ones are the most user-friendly. My > personal opinion is that you will find better dating options on free > sites than on paid ones, but that's just my opinion. > Arielle > > On 3/30/13, Hamid Hamraz wrote: >> Hi There Folks, >> >> Is anybody aware of a dating website decently accessible by JAWS? >> >> Thank you. >> >> Hamid >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >> com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 > 0gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. > com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From arielle71 at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 20:10:45 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 14:10:45 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Accessible Dating Website In-Reply-To: <00a101ce2cb9$5d7fc6b0$187f5410$@gmail.com> References: <1D97316B5A36494689AA23853C21D83A@HamidPC> <009f01ce2cb3$bcd31000$36793000$@gmail.com> <00a101ce2cb9$5d7fc6b0$187f5410$@gmail.com> Message-ID: No On 3/29/13, justin williams wrote: > Is that cupid a paying sight? > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle > Silverman > Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2013 4:05 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Accessible Dating Website > > My opinion is probably biased, but I think that the people who are willing > to spend money for online dating might, on average, tend to be more > "desperate" or less successful at dating, whereas the people who go on the > free sites are just having fun. However, I can see it going the other way > too if the ones on the free sites aren't very committed to online dating. > I do know a few people who found lasting love using OKCupid, and they have > a pretty good algorithm for matching people up, I think. > Arielle > > On 3/29/13, justin williams wrote: >> Why is that? Why do you find free sites better than paied ones? >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle >> Silverman >> Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2013 2:51 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Accessible Dating Website >> >> I was on >> www.okcupid.com >> for a couple years and it was accessible except for one Captia at the >> beginning. It's been a long time since I've been on though, so it >> could have gotten less accessible (or maybe they fixed the one >> Captia). There are lots of dating websites out there, though, so you >> can always try a few and see which ones are the most user-friendly. My >> personal opinion is that you will find better dating options on free >> sites than on paid ones, but that's just my opinion. >> Arielle >> >> On 3/30/13, Hamid Hamraz wrote: >>> Hi There Folks, >>> >>> Is anybody aware of a dating website decently accessible by JAWS? >>> >>> Thank you. >>> >>> Hamid >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >>> com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%4 >> 0gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >> com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From brice.smith319 at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 21:01:27 2013 From: brice.smith319 at gmail.com (Brice Smith) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 17:01:27 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com> <-1498599385532720274@unknownmsgid> Message-ID: Nope. I didn't even know he had his own site until this morning. There's only an email address on his site as far as contact information goes, but I see he makes other cane models besides the NFB telescoping ones (including something called a mini telescoping cane that goes up to 61 inches and a folding one). Interesting. Anyway, I hope you get what you need by your conference next weekend. I think the NFB ships materials free matter for the blind which can sometimes delay things. Brice On 3/30/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Hi, > > That is right, unless you clarify in the comment section the model you > want. If you tell them you specifically want the Chris Park model in > the comments they won't ignore that and you'll get what you want for > your $35. The clarification might be there for people who don't know > to do the comment thing, (which I'm assuming would be the majority of > people), but they don't make it impossible for you to get what you > want for your buck. Actually, my ability to see the pictures probably > further complicated the issue; had I just gone off the cane type and > commented that I wanted the Chris Park model from the start I would > have saved myself some confusion, although I'm not sure many other > people would have known to do that either. > > Have you been able to purchase directly from Chris Park's site? That > was where I looked after the NFB store was confusing me and before I > called, but I didn't see any links to the specific models or to > checkout/purchase anything. > > On 3/30/13, Brice Smith wrote: >> Right. So if you just order a type 7 cane from the NFB store, there's >> no guarantee what you'll actually get when you spend your $35? You >> might get Chris Park's model, but you might also get the old (pre >> 2010) model that most people universally seem to dislike? The amusing >> thing here is that while Kaiti can check out the pictures, other users >> of the store ... can't. So the NFB's lack of clarification here makes >> perfect sense! Got it. >> >> Anyway, Chris Park has his own website. >> >> http://www.chrisparkdesign.com/sub_01_new.html >> >> Brice >> >> On 3/30/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>> Hi, >>> >>> Brice, I guess what they do is they just classify the canes by type. >>> E.G, all the 5 or 6 section telescopic canes are listed on the site as >>> type 7. This type includes all the models that fit into that >>> category, so when you buy one you might get any model depending on >>> what they have in stock unless you specifically tell them you want a >>> specific type, E.G. the Chris Park. That one is still the latest and >>> greatest thing out there, so I guess we were both lucky to get it when >>> we bought our canes. What got me into trouble looking through the >>> search results was that I didn't remember the exact type, so I assumed >>> that the Chris Park would have it's own little category in the search >>> results, (I didn't buy my last cane either, so I wasn't familiar with >>> how to get to it from previous experience). Looking at the picture >>> for the type 7, it shows two different models of NFB canes, but >>> neither of them were the Chris Park. I was looking for that distinct >>> grip which is much bigger than a lot of the NFB models and didn't see >>> it. Now we know. :) >>> >>> I suppose every cane is different, Joshua, but I had significantly >>> more collapses with my NFB telescopic cane I bought in 2009 than I >>> have with the Chris Park model. I don't think you had the newest one; >>> the collapse-resistant model just came out in December of 2011, so >>> anything before that would be more collapse-prone. A lot of people, >>> including myself, seem to really like this newer one. Different >>> strokes for different folks, but don't base an opinion of an entire >>> company over one cane from several years ago which has since been >>> improved upon. >>> >>> On 3/30/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>> Those Chris Parks canes are nothing but trouble! >>>> Those were the ones that collapse too much! >>>> His folding canes are awful too! >>>> I got the telescoping cane in 2010, and I didn't like it. >>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Brice Smith >>>> [brice.smith319 at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 10:45 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>> >>>> I'm still a bit confused. Which model is the one listed on the site >>>> now? Is the Chris Parks model now "old" and is there a newer model out >>>> now? You and I both must Have bought his model last year. Have they >>>> replaced it with something different? Even better? >>>> >>>> On Mar 29, 2013, at 10:55 PM, Kaiti Shelton >>>> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>> >>>>> Yeah, they're well worth checking into, or at least I think so. >>>>> >>>>> I found out why I wasn't seeing it in the search results; The NFB site >>>>> groups all types of canes together, but doesn't descriminate between >>>>> the models. So, I was seeing pictures of the older canes because >>>>> that's the type the new one still fits under, (5 or 6 section >>>>> telescopic). The particular cane I got last time was made by Chris >>>>> Parks, and I just got it because it was what they had in stock. They >>>>> don't show it on the site, but if you know the particular model you >>>>> want you can request it in the comments section when you check out. >>>>> >>>>> On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>> I want to look at the new ones. >>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >>>>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 11:21 AM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>> >>>>>> Joshua, I didn't say that you said anything, I was merely sharing my >>>>>> experiences. I've heard from several people that those canes are >>>>>> thought >>>>>> to >>>>>> be indestructible, so it seemed like it might have been a common >>>>>> misconception. >>>>>> That is what is so improved about this model of the telescopic cane, >>>>>> it >>>>>> doesn't collapse near as much as the old oones. I rarely had to stop >>>>>> and >>>>>> fix mine. >>>>>> >>>>>> On Friday, March 29, 2013, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi Kaiti! >>>>>>> I never said that the Ambutech canes were indestructable. >>>>>>> I just wish that they'd make the telescopic canes more stirdy, so >>>>>>> that >>>>>>> they'll collapse, only when I want them to. >>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org ] on behalf of >>>>>>> Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com ] >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 3:02 AM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>> >>>>>>> *the beginning of that was supposed to say that I'm the opposite. >>>>>>> Sorry for the weird cut off. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 3/29/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>>>>>> posite; telescopic canes last much longer for me than the folding >>>>>>>> ones, I think because of the weight and because of my pace. That >>>>>>>> is >>>>>>>> why I prefer the NFB canes and will most likely avoid the bulky >>>>>>>> folding ones. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> The next time someone tells you an Ambutech cane, or an aluminum >>>>>>>> one, >>>>>>>> is indestructable, don't necessarily buy it. In the first week of >>>>>>>> school this year I was going out to a campus event with some >>>>>>>> friends >>>>>>>> and because I had issues with people stepping on and breaking my >>>>>>>> telescopic canes in high school I chose to take my folding one from >>>>>>>> ambutech. It was so heavy for me that when I stepped off the curb >>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>> went down into a drainage grate. It must have gone right between >>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>> bars because I didn't feel it hit anything or realize it wasn't on >>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>> ground, but I kept walking and tripped when I felt that my cane >>>>>>>> wasn't >>>>>>>> coming with me. I dropped it and when a friend of mine grabbed it >>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>> pulled it out of the grate the bottom shaft was sliced open where >>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>> grate had dug into it and it was bent at a 45 degree angle from >>>>>>>> where >>>>>>>> it should have been. For a while I used a straight cane that was >>>>>>>> kind >>>>>>>> of my old-faithful cane, (My O&M instructor and I made it when I >>>>>>>> was >>>>>>>> in the 4th grade and I still had it as a college freshman). It was >>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>> little short for me, but I didn't grow much after making it so it >>>>>>>> would have worked all right till I could order a new one over >>>>>>>> Christmas break. Then again, I was walking with friends, and the >>>>>>>> cane >>>>>>>> got stuck in a really big crack in the sidewalk. When we pulled it >>>>>>>> out the tip was still wedged into the crack, but the bottom of the >>>>>>>> shaft was dented all over to the point where I doubt another tip >>>>>>>> would >>>>>>>> be able to stay on it. (The kicker was that this all happened >>>>>>>> within >>>>>>>> a month). Then I started using the telescopic cane because I had >>>>>>>> no >>>>>>>> other choice, and not only were people more conscious about >>>>>>>> avoiding >>>>>>>> stepping on a white stick, but all my problems with grates and >>>>>>>> sidewalk cracks magically went away. (and my wrist liked it better >>>>>>>> too). >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>>>>> Another thing I should mention, is that I found out that cane tips >>>>>>>>> cost >>>>>>>>> over >>>>>>>>> $1.50, per tip! >>>>>>>>> Good grief! >>>>>>>>> Those tips are small, unlike the tips you find on VR canes! >>>>>>>>> Why not just charge 50 cents a tip? >>>>>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Joshua >>>>>>>>> Lester >>>>>>>>> [JLester8462 at pccua.edu] >>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:21 AM >>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I bought an NFB folding cane, and a straight cane from them! >>>>>>>>> I had issues with the tip coming off of the straight cane, and the >>>>>>>>> folding >>>>>>>>> cane broke after the first day, because they aren't stirdy enough! >>>>>>>>> I had a telescoping cane as well, and it would collapse when I >>>>>>>>> didn't >>>>>>>>> want >>>>>>>>> it to, and it wouldn't collapse when I did! >>>>>>>>> Ambutech, (on the other hand,) is awesome! >>>>>>>>> Their canes are stirdyer, and they may be bulky, but they get the >>>>>>>>> job >>>>>>>>> done! >>>>>>>>> I can't imagine myself with a thinner cane, no matter what it is! >>>>>>>>> My Ambutech cane has lasted longer than my VR canes, and those NFB >>>>>>>>> canes >>>>>>>>> combined! >>>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti >>>>>>>>> Shelton >>>>>>>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:10 AM >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Kaiti >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com > From iperrault at hotmail.com Sat Mar 30 21:14:22 2013 From: iperrault at hotmail.com (Ian Perrault) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 17:14:22 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I find Plenty of Fish actually easier then ok cupid. The web site is www.pof.com, so www.p o f.com. It's free, and there's an accessible IPhone app as well. Ian From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 21:24:16 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 17:24:16 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Yeah, I hope they have the one I requested in stock. Hopefully it goes faster than usual for Free matter. My university sometimes can take up to a day to sort through their mail and get packages to the right dorm buildings too, but I don't have to leave till Thursday night so hopefully it will make it there in time. If not, I have a ratty folding cane I can take back to school with me when I go back after Easter. It's kind of a mess because it's got a good deal of wear and tear and it's way too short for me, but in terms of safety it will get the job done for the weekend. Thankfully, I'll be at a conference of people who work with people with disabilities, so even if I run into some minor issues it should be pretty easy to get some assistance. On 3/30/13, Ian Perrault wrote: > I find Plenty of Fish actually easier then ok cupid. The web site is > www.pof.com, so www.p o f.com. It's free, and there's an accessible IPhone > app as well. > Ian > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 21:30:11 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (christopher nusbaum) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 17:30:11 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com> <-1498599385532720274@unknownmsgid> Message-ID: <900738845560274744@unknownmsgid> You might also call the Independence Market at our national center. The number is (410) 659-9314, option 4 from the main menu. Chris Nusbaum Sent from my iPhone On Mar 30, 2013, at 3:45 PM, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Hi, > > That is right, unless you clarify in the comment section the model you > want. If you tell them you specifically want the Chris Park model in > the comments they won't ignore that and you'll get what you want for > your $35. The clarification might be there for people who don't know > to do the comment thing, (which I'm assuming would be the majority of > people), but they don't make it impossible for you to get what you > want for your buck. Actually, my ability to see the pictures probably > further complicated the issue; had I just gone off the cane type and > commented that I wanted the Chris Park model from the start I would > have saved myself some confusion, although I'm not sure many other > people would have known to do that either. > > Have you been able to purchase directly from Chris Park's site? That > was where I looked after the NFB store was confusing me and before I > called, but I didn't see any links to the specific models or to > checkout/purchase anything. > > On 3/30/13, Brice Smith wrote: >> Right. So if you just order a type 7 cane from the NFB store, there's >> no guarantee what you'll actually get when you spend your $35? You >> might get Chris Park's model, but you might also get the old (pre >> 2010) model that most people universally seem to dislike? The amusing >> thing here is that while Kaiti can check out the pictures, other users >> of the store ... can't. So the NFB's lack of clarification here makes >> perfect sense! Got it. >> >> Anyway, Chris Park has his own website. >> >> http://www.chrisparkdesign.com/sub_01_new.html >> >> Brice >> >> On 3/30/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>> Hi, >>> >>> Brice, I guess what they do is they just classify the canes by type. >>> E.G, all the 5 or 6 section telescopic canes are listed on the site as >>> type 7. This type includes all the models that fit into that >>> category, so when you buy one you might get any model depending on >>> what they have in stock unless you specifically tell them you want a >>> specific type, E.G. the Chris Park. That one is still the latest and >>> greatest thing out there, so I guess we were both lucky to get it when >>> we bought our canes. What got me into trouble looking through the >>> search results was that I didn't remember the exact type, so I assumed >>> that the Chris Park would have it's own little category in the search >>> results, (I didn't buy my last cane either, so I wasn't familiar with >>> how to get to it from previous experience). Looking at the picture >>> for the type 7, it shows two different models of NFB canes, but >>> neither of them were the Chris Park. I was looking for that distinct >>> grip which is much bigger than a lot of the NFB models and didn't see >>> it. Now we know. :) >>> >>> I suppose every cane is different, Joshua, but I had significantly >>> more collapses with my NFB telescopic cane I bought in 2009 than I >>> have with the Chris Park model. I don't think you had the newest one; >>> the collapse-resistant model just came out in December of 2011, so >>> anything before that would be more collapse-prone. A lot of people, >>> including myself, seem to really like this newer one. Different >>> strokes for different folks, but don't base an opinion of an entire >>> company over one cane from several years ago which has since been >>> improved upon. >>> >>> On 3/30/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>> Those Chris Parks canes are nothing but trouble! >>>> Those were the ones that collapse too much! >>>> His folding canes are awful too! >>>> I got the telescoping cane in 2010, and I didn't like it. >>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Brice Smith >>>> [brice.smith319 at gmail.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 10:45 PM >>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>> >>>> I'm still a bit confused. Which model is the one listed on the site >>>> now? Is the Chris Parks model now "old" and is there a newer model out >>>> now? You and I both must Have bought his model last year. Have they >>>> replaced it with something different? Even better? >>>> >>>> On Mar 29, 2013, at 10:55 PM, Kaiti Shelton >>>> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>> >>>>> Yeah, they're well worth checking into, or at least I think so. >>>>> >>>>> I found out why I wasn't seeing it in the search results; The NFB site >>>>> groups all types of canes together, but doesn't descriminate between >>>>> the models. So, I was seeing pictures of the older canes because >>>>> that's the type the new one still fits under, (5 or 6 section >>>>> telescopic). The particular cane I got last time was made by Chris >>>>> Parks, and I just got it because it was what they had in stock. They >>>>> don't show it on the site, but if you know the particular model you >>>>> want you can request it in the comments section when you check out. >>>>> >>>>> On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>> I want to look at the new ones. >>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >>>>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 11:21 AM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>> >>>>>> Joshua, I didn't say that you said anything, I was merely sharing my >>>>>> experiences. I've heard from several people that those canes are >>>>>> thought >>>>>> to >>>>>> be indestructible, so it seemed like it might have been a common >>>>>> misconception. >>>>>> That is what is so improved about this model of the telescopic cane, >>>>>> it >>>>>> doesn't collapse near as much as the old oones. I rarely had to stop >>>>>> and >>>>>> fix mine. >>>>>> >>>>>> On Friday, March 29, 2013, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi Kaiti! >>>>>>> I never said that the Ambutech canes were indestructable. >>>>>>> I just wish that they'd make the telescopic canes more stirdy, so >>>>>>> that >>>>>>> they'll collapse, only when I want them to. >>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org ] on behalf of >>>>>>> Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com ] >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 3:02 AM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>> >>>>>>> *the beginning of that was supposed to say that I'm the opposite. >>>>>>> Sorry for the weird cut off. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 3/29/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>>>>>> posite; telescopic canes last much longer for me than the folding >>>>>>>> ones, I think because of the weight and because of my pace. That is >>>>>>>> why I prefer the NFB canes and will most likely avoid the bulky >>>>>>>> folding ones. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> The next time someone tells you an Ambutech cane, or an aluminum >>>>>>>> one, >>>>>>>> is indestructable, don't necessarily buy it. In the first week of >>>>>>>> school this year I was going out to a campus event with some friends >>>>>>>> and because I had issues with people stepping on and breaking my >>>>>>>> telescopic canes in high school I chose to take my folding one from >>>>>>>> ambutech. It was so heavy for me that when I stepped off the curb >>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>> went down into a drainage grate. It must have gone right between >>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>> bars because I didn't feel it hit anything or realize it wasn't on >>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>> ground, but I kept walking and tripped when I felt that my cane >>>>>>>> wasn't >>>>>>>> coming with me. I dropped it and when a friend of mine grabbed it >>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>> pulled it out of the grate the bottom shaft was sliced open where >>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>> grate had dug into it and it was bent at a 45 degree angle from >>>>>>>> where >>>>>>>> it should have been. For a while I used a straight cane that was >>>>>>>> kind >>>>>>>> of my old-faithful cane, (My O&M instructor and I made it when I was >>>>>>>> in the 4th grade and I still had it as a college freshman). It was >>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>> little short for me, but I didn't grow much after making it so it >>>>>>>> would have worked all right till I could order a new one over >>>>>>>> Christmas break. Then again, I was walking with friends, and the >>>>>>>> cane >>>>>>>> got stuck in a really big crack in the sidewalk. When we pulled it >>>>>>>> out the tip was still wedged into the crack, but the bottom of the >>>>>>>> shaft was dented all over to the point where I doubt another tip >>>>>>>> would >>>>>>>> be able to stay on it. (The kicker was that this all happened >>>>>>>> within >>>>>>>> a month). Then I started using the telescopic cane because I had no >>>>>>>> other choice, and not only were people more conscious about avoiding >>>>>>>> stepping on a white stick, but all my problems with grates and >>>>>>>> sidewalk cracks magically went away. (and my wrist liked it better >>>>>>>> too). >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>>>>> Another thing I should mention, is that I found out that cane tips >>>>>>>>> cost >>>>>>>>> over >>>>>>>>> $1.50, per tip! >>>>>>>>> Good grief! >>>>>>>>> Those tips are small, unlike the tips you find on VR canes! >>>>>>>>> Why not just charge 50 cents a tip? >>>>>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Joshua Lester >>>>>>>>> [JLester8462 at pccua.edu] >>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:21 AM >>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I bought an NFB folding cane, and a straight cane from them! >>>>>>>>> I had issues with the tip coming off of the straight cane, and the >>>>>>>>> folding >>>>>>>>> cane broke after the first day, because they aren't stirdy enough! >>>>>>>>> I had a telescoping cane as well, and it would collapse when I >>>>>>>>> didn't >>>>>>>>> want >>>>>>>>> it to, and it wouldn't collapse when I did! >>>>>>>>> Ambutech, (on the other hand,) is awesome! >>>>>>>>> Their canes are stirdyer, and they may be bulky, but they get the >>>>>>>>> job >>>>>>>>> done! >>>>>>>>> I can't imagine myself with a thinner cane, no matter what it is! >>>>>>>>> My Ambutech cane has lasted longer than my VR canes, and those NFB >>>>>>>>> canes >>>>>>>>> combined! >>>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >>>>>>>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:10 AM >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Kaiti >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com From arielle71 at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 21:33:59 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 15:33:59 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: <900738845560274744@unknownmsgid> References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com> <-1498599385532720274@unknownmsgid> <900738845560274744@unknownmsgid> Message-ID: Could someone send the URL for the Chris Park site? I would really love to get a better-quality telescoping or folding cane than what I've gotten from NFB. Their straight canes are wonderful, but I have yet to be satisfied with any non-rigid cane from them. Arielle On 3/30/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: > You might also call the Independence Market at our national center. > The number is (410) 659-9314, option 4 from the main menu. > > Chris Nusbaum > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 30, 2013, at 3:45 PM, Kaiti Shelton > wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> That is right, unless you clarify in the comment section the model you >> want. If you tell them you specifically want the Chris Park model in >> the comments they won't ignore that and you'll get what you want for >> your $35. The clarification might be there for people who don't know >> to do the comment thing, (which I'm assuming would be the majority of >> people), but they don't make it impossible for you to get what you >> want for your buck. Actually, my ability to see the pictures probably >> further complicated the issue; had I just gone off the cane type and >> commented that I wanted the Chris Park model from the start I would >> have saved myself some confusion, although I'm not sure many other >> people would have known to do that either. >> >> Have you been able to purchase directly from Chris Park's site? That >> was where I looked after the NFB store was confusing me and before I >> called, but I didn't see any links to the specific models or to >> checkout/purchase anything. >> >> On 3/30/13, Brice Smith wrote: >>> Right. So if you just order a type 7 cane from the NFB store, there's >>> no guarantee what you'll actually get when you spend your $35? You >>> might get Chris Park's model, but you might also get the old (pre >>> 2010) model that most people universally seem to dislike? The amusing >>> thing here is that while Kaiti can check out the pictures, other users >>> of the store ... can't. So the NFB's lack of clarification here makes >>> perfect sense! Got it. >>> >>> Anyway, Chris Park has his own website. >>> >>> http://www.chrisparkdesign.com/sub_01_new.html >>> >>> Brice >>> >>> On 3/30/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> Brice, I guess what they do is they just classify the canes by type. >>>> E.G, all the 5 or 6 section telescopic canes are listed on the site as >>>> type 7. This type includes all the models that fit into that >>>> category, so when you buy one you might get any model depending on >>>> what they have in stock unless you specifically tell them you want a >>>> specific type, E.G. the Chris Park. That one is still the latest and >>>> greatest thing out there, so I guess we were both lucky to get it when >>>> we bought our canes. What got me into trouble looking through the >>>> search results was that I didn't remember the exact type, so I assumed >>>> that the Chris Park would have it's own little category in the search >>>> results, (I didn't buy my last cane either, so I wasn't familiar with >>>> how to get to it from previous experience). Looking at the picture >>>> for the type 7, it shows two different models of NFB canes, but >>>> neither of them were the Chris Park. I was looking for that distinct >>>> grip which is much bigger than a lot of the NFB models and didn't see >>>> it. Now we know. :) >>>> >>>> I suppose every cane is different, Joshua, but I had significantly >>>> more collapses with my NFB telescopic cane I bought in 2009 than I >>>> have with the Chris Park model. I don't think you had the newest one; >>>> the collapse-resistant model just came out in December of 2011, so >>>> anything before that would be more collapse-prone. A lot of people, >>>> including myself, seem to really like this newer one. Different >>>> strokes for different folks, but don't base an opinion of an entire >>>> company over one cane from several years ago which has since been >>>> improved upon. >>>> >>>> On 3/30/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>> Those Chris Parks canes are nothing but trouble! >>>>> Those were the ones that collapse too much! >>>>> His folding canes are awful too! >>>>> I got the telescoping cane in 2010, and I didn't like it. >>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Brice Smith >>>>> [brice.smith319 at gmail.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 10:45 PM >>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>> >>>>> I'm still a bit confused. Which model is the one listed on the site >>>>> now? Is the Chris Parks model now "old" and is there a newer model out >>>>> now? You and I both must Have bought his model last year. Have they >>>>> replaced it with something different? Even better? >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 29, 2013, at 10:55 PM, Kaiti Shelton >>>>> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>> >>>>>> Yeah, they're well worth checking into, or at least I think so. >>>>>> >>>>>> I found out why I wasn't seeing it in the search results; The NFB >>>>>> site >>>>>> groups all types of canes together, but doesn't descriminate between >>>>>> the models. So, I was seeing pictures of the older canes because >>>>>> that's the type the new one still fits under, (5 or 6 section >>>>>> telescopic). The particular cane I got last time was made by Chris >>>>>> Parks, and I just got it because it was what they had in stock. They >>>>>> don't show it on the site, but if you know the particular model you >>>>>> want you can request it in the comments section when you check out. >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>>> I want to look at the new ones. >>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >>>>>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 11:21 AM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Joshua, I didn't say that you said anything, I was merely sharing my >>>>>>> experiences. I've heard from several people that those canes are >>>>>>> thought >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> be indestructible, so it seemed like it might have been a common >>>>>>> misconception. >>>>>>> That is what is so improved about this model of the telescopic cane, >>>>>>> it >>>>>>> doesn't collapse near as much as the old oones. I rarely had to stop >>>>>>> and >>>>>>> fix mine. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Friday, March 29, 2013, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hi Kaiti! >>>>>>>> I never said that the Ambutech canes were indestructable. >>>>>>>> I just wish that they'd make the telescopic canes more stirdy, so >>>>>>>> that >>>>>>>> they'll collapse, only when I want them to. >>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org ] on behalf >>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>> Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com ] >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 3:02 AM >>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> *the beginning of that was supposed to say that I'm the opposite. >>>>>>>> Sorry for the weird cut off. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 3/29/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>>>>>>> posite; telescopic canes last much longer for me than the folding >>>>>>>>> ones, I think because of the weight and because of my pace. That >>>>>>>>> is >>>>>>>>> why I prefer the NFB canes and will most likely avoid the bulky >>>>>>>>> folding ones. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> The next time someone tells you an Ambutech cane, or an aluminum >>>>>>>>> one, >>>>>>>>> is indestructable, don't necessarily buy it. In the first week of >>>>>>>>> school this year I was going out to a campus event with some >>>>>>>>> friends >>>>>>>>> and because I had issues with people stepping on and breaking my >>>>>>>>> telescopic canes in high school I chose to take my folding one >>>>>>>>> from >>>>>>>>> ambutech. It was so heavy for me that when I stepped off the curb >>>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>>> went down into a drainage grate. It must have gone right between >>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>> bars because I didn't feel it hit anything or realize it wasn't on >>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>> ground, but I kept walking and tripped when I felt that my cane >>>>>>>>> wasn't >>>>>>>>> coming with me. I dropped it and when a friend of mine grabbed it >>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>> pulled it out of the grate the bottom shaft was sliced open where >>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>> grate had dug into it and it was bent at a 45 degree angle from >>>>>>>>> where >>>>>>>>> it should have been. For a while I used a straight cane that was >>>>>>>>> kind >>>>>>>>> of my old-faithful cane, (My O&M instructor and I made it when I >>>>>>>>> was >>>>>>>>> in the 4th grade and I still had it as a college freshman). It >>>>>>>>> was >>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>> little short for me, but I didn't grow much after making it so it >>>>>>>>> would have worked all right till I could order a new one over >>>>>>>>> Christmas break. Then again, I was walking with friends, and the >>>>>>>>> cane >>>>>>>>> got stuck in a really big crack in the sidewalk. When we pulled >>>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>>> out the tip was still wedged into the crack, but the bottom of the >>>>>>>>> shaft was dented all over to the point where I doubt another tip >>>>>>>>> would >>>>>>>>> be able to stay on it. (The kicker was that this all happened >>>>>>>>> within >>>>>>>>> a month). Then I started using the telescopic cane because I had >>>>>>>>> no >>>>>>>>> other choice, and not only were people more conscious about >>>>>>>>> avoiding >>>>>>>>> stepping on a white stick, but all my problems with grates and >>>>>>>>> sidewalk cracks magically went away. (and my wrist liked it >>>>>>>>> better >>>>>>>>> too). >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>>>>>> Another thing I should mention, is that I found out that cane >>>>>>>>>> tips >>>>>>>>>> cost >>>>>>>>>> over >>>>>>>>>> $1.50, per tip! >>>>>>>>>> Good grief! >>>>>>>>>> Those tips are small, unlike the tips you find on VR canes! >>>>>>>>>> Why not just charge 50 cents a tip? >>>>>>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Joshua >>>>>>>>>> Lester >>>>>>>>>> [JLester8462 at pccua.edu] >>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:21 AM >>>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I bought an NFB folding cane, and a straight cane from them! >>>>>>>>>> I had issues with the tip coming off of the straight cane, and >>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>> folding >>>>>>>>>> cane broke after the first day, because they aren't stirdy >>>>>>>>>> enough! >>>>>>>>>> I had a telescoping cane as well, and it would collapse when I >>>>>>>>>> didn't >>>>>>>>>> want >>>>>>>>>> it to, and it wouldn't collapse when I did! >>>>>>>>>> Ambutech, (on the other hand,) is awesome! >>>>>>>>>> Their canes are stirdyer, and they may be bulky, but they get the >>>>>>>>>> job >>>>>>>>>> done! >>>>>>>>>> I can't imagine myself with a thinner cane, no matter what it is! >>>>>>>>>> My Ambutech cane has lasted longer than my VR canes, and those >>>>>>>>>> NFB >>>>>>>>>> canes >>>>>>>>>> combined! >>>>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti >>>>>>>>>> Shelton >>>>>>>>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:10 AM >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Kaiti >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 21:43:58 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (christopher nusbaum) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 17:43:58 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com> <-1498599385532720274@unknownmsgid> <900738845560274744@unknownmsgid> Message-ID: <-7152629430158794237@unknownmsgid> Arielle, I agree. I got my NFB folding cane for Christmas, but after only 2 months the joints are chipping to the point that I can no longer fold it without having to do a lot of wiggling to get it unfolded. I was very excited about this folding cane, but unfortunately I have been disappointed by its performance, or lack thereof. I now have an Ambutech Ultra Light folding cane on order. Chris Nusbaum Sent from my iPhone On Mar 30, 2013, at 5:34 PM, Arielle Silverman wrote: > Could someone send the URL for the Chris Park site? I would really > love to get a better-quality telescoping or folding cane than what > I've gotten from NFB. Their straight canes are wonderful, but I have > yet to be satisfied with any non-rigid cane from them. > Arielle > > On 3/30/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >> You might also call the Independence Market at our national center. >> The number is (410) 659-9314, option 4 from the main menu. >> >> Chris Nusbaum >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 30, 2013, at 3:45 PM, Kaiti Shelton >> wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> >>> That is right, unless you clarify in the comment section the model you >>> want. If you tell them you specifically want the Chris Park model in >>> the comments they won't ignore that and you'll get what you want for >>> your $35. The clarification might be there for people who don't know >>> to do the comment thing, (which I'm assuming would be the majority of >>> people), but they don't make it impossible for you to get what you >>> want for your buck. Actually, my ability to see the pictures probably >>> further complicated the issue; had I just gone off the cane type and >>> commented that I wanted the Chris Park model from the start I would >>> have saved myself some confusion, although I'm not sure many other >>> people would have known to do that either. >>> >>> Have you been able to purchase directly from Chris Park's site? That >>> was where I looked after the NFB store was confusing me and before I >>> called, but I didn't see any links to the specific models or to >>> checkout/purchase anything. >>> >>> On 3/30/13, Brice Smith wrote: >>>> Right. So if you just order a type 7 cane from the NFB store, there's >>>> no guarantee what you'll actually get when you spend your $35? You >>>> might get Chris Park's model, but you might also get the old (pre >>>> 2010) model that most people universally seem to dislike? The amusing >>>> thing here is that while Kaiti can check out the pictures, other users >>>> of the store ... can't. So the NFB's lack of clarification here makes >>>> perfect sense! Got it. >>>> >>>> Anyway, Chris Park has his own website. >>>> >>>> http://www.chrisparkdesign.com/sub_01_new.html >>>> >>>> Brice >>>> >>>> On 3/30/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>>> Hi, >>>>> >>>>> Brice, I guess what they do is they just classify the canes by type. >>>>> E.G, all the 5 or 6 section telescopic canes are listed on the site as >>>>> type 7. This type includes all the models that fit into that >>>>> category, so when you buy one you might get any model depending on >>>>> what they have in stock unless you specifically tell them you want a >>>>> specific type, E.G. the Chris Park. That one is still the latest and >>>>> greatest thing out there, so I guess we were both lucky to get it when >>>>> we bought our canes. What got me into trouble looking through the >>>>> search results was that I didn't remember the exact type, so I assumed >>>>> that the Chris Park would have it's own little category in the search >>>>> results, (I didn't buy my last cane either, so I wasn't familiar with >>>>> how to get to it from previous experience). Looking at the picture >>>>> for the type 7, it shows two different models of NFB canes, but >>>>> neither of them were the Chris Park. I was looking for that distinct >>>>> grip which is much bigger than a lot of the NFB models and didn't see >>>>> it. Now we know. :) >>>>> >>>>> I suppose every cane is different, Joshua, but I had significantly >>>>> more collapses with my NFB telescopic cane I bought in 2009 than I >>>>> have with the Chris Park model. I don't think you had the newest one; >>>>> the collapse-resistant model just came out in December of 2011, so >>>>> anything before that would be more collapse-prone. A lot of people, >>>>> including myself, seem to really like this newer one. Different >>>>> strokes for different folks, but don't base an opinion of an entire >>>>> company over one cane from several years ago which has since been >>>>> improved upon. >>>>> >>>>> On 3/30/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>> Those Chris Parks canes are nothing but trouble! >>>>>> Those were the ones that collapse too much! >>>>>> His folding canes are awful too! >>>>>> I got the telescoping cane in 2010, and I didn't like it. >>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Brice Smith >>>>>> [brice.smith319 at gmail.com] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 10:45 PM >>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>> >>>>>> I'm still a bit confused. Which model is the one listed on the site >>>>>> now? Is the Chris Parks model now "old" and is there a newer model out >>>>>> now? You and I both must Have bought his model last year. Have they >>>>>> replaced it with something different? Even better? >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 29, 2013, at 10:55 PM, Kaiti Shelton >>>>>> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Yeah, they're well worth checking into, or at least I think so. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I found out why I wasn't seeing it in the search results; The NFB >>>>>>> site >>>>>>> groups all types of canes together, but doesn't descriminate between >>>>>>> the models. So, I was seeing pictures of the older canes because >>>>>>> that's the type the new one still fits under, (5 or 6 section >>>>>>> telescopic). The particular cane I got last time was made by Chris >>>>>>> Parks, and I just got it because it was what they had in stock. They >>>>>>> don't show it on the site, but if you know the particular model you >>>>>>> want you can request it in the comments section when you check out. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>>>> I want to look at the new ones. >>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton >>>>>>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 11:21 AM >>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Joshua, I didn't say that you said anything, I was merely sharing my >>>>>>>> experiences. I've heard from several people that those canes are >>>>>>>> thought >>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>> be indestructible, so it seemed like it might have been a common >>>>>>>> misconception. >>>>>>>> That is what is so improved about this model of the telescopic cane, >>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>> doesn't collapse near as much as the old oones. I rarely had to stop >>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>> fix mine. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Friday, March 29, 2013, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hi Kaiti! >>>>>>>>> I never said that the Ambutech canes were indestructable. >>>>>>>>> I just wish that they'd make the telescopic canes more stirdy, so >>>>>>>>> that >>>>>>>>> they'll collapse, only when I want them to. >>>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org ] on behalf >>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>> Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com ] >>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 3:02 AM >>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> *the beginning of that was supposed to say that I'm the opposite. >>>>>>>>> Sorry for the weird cut off. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 3/29/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>>>>>>>> posite; telescopic canes last much longer for me than the folding >>>>>>>>>> ones, I think because of the weight and because of my pace. That >>>>>>>>>> is >>>>>>>>>> why I prefer the NFB canes and will most likely avoid the bulky >>>>>>>>>> folding ones. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> The next time someone tells you an Ambutech cane, or an aluminum >>>>>>>>>> one, >>>>>>>>>> is indestructable, don't necessarily buy it. In the first week of >>>>>>>>>> school this year I was going out to a campus event with some >>>>>>>>>> friends >>>>>>>>>> and because I had issues with people stepping on and breaking my >>>>>>>>>> telescopic canes in high school I chose to take my folding one >>>>>>>>>> from >>>>>>>>>> ambutech. It was so heavy for me that when I stepped off the curb >>>>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>>>> went down into a drainage grate. It must have gone right between >>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>> bars because I didn't feel it hit anything or realize it wasn't on >>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>> ground, but I kept walking and tripped when I felt that my cane >>>>>>>>>> wasn't >>>>>>>>>> coming with me. I dropped it and when a friend of mine grabbed it >>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>> pulled it out of the grate the bottom shaft was sliced open where >>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>> grate had dug into it and it was bent at a 45 degree angle from >>>>>>>>>> where >>>>>>>>>> it should have been. For a while I used a straight cane that was >>>>>>>>>> kind >>>>>>>>>> of my old-faithful cane, (My O&M instructor and I made it when I >>>>>>>>>> was >>>>>>>>>> in the 4th grade and I still had it as a college freshman). It >>>>>>>>>> was >>>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>>> little short for me, but I didn't grow much after making it so it >>>>>>>>>> would have worked all right till I could order a new one over >>>>>>>>>> Christmas break. Then again, I was walking with friends, and the >>>>>>>>>> cane >>>>>>>>>> got stuck in a really big crack in the sidewalk. When we pulled >>>>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>>>> out the tip was still wedged into the crack, but the bottom of the >>>>>>>>>> shaft was dented all over to the point where I doubt another tip >>>>>>>>>> would >>>>>>>>>> be able to stay on it. (The kicker was that this all happened >>>>>>>>>> within >>>>>>>>>> a month). Then I started using the telescopic cane because I had >>>>>>>>>> no >>>>>>>>>> other choice, and not only were people more conscious about >>>>>>>>>> avoiding >>>>>>>>>> stepping on a white stick, but all my problems with grates and >>>>>>>>>> sidewalk cracks magically went away. (and my wrist liked it >>>>>>>>>> better >>>>>>>>>> too). >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> Another thing I should mention, is that I found out that cane >>>>>>>>>>> tips >>>>>>>>>>> cost >>>>>>>>>>> over >>>>>>>>>>> $1.50, per tip! >>>>>>>>>>> Good grief! >>>>>>>>>>> Those tips are small, unlike the tips you find on VR canes! >>>>>>>>>>> Why not just charge 50 cents a tip? >>>>>>>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Joshua >>>>>>>>>>> Lester >>>>>>>>>>> [JLester8462 at pccua.edu] >>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:21 AM >>>>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I bought an NFB folding cane, and a straight cane from them! >>>>>>>>>>> I had issues with the tip coming off of the straight cane, and >>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> folding >>>>>>>>>>> cane broke after the first day, because they aren't stirdy >>>>>>>>>>> enough! >>>>>>>>>>> I had a telescoping cane as well, and it would collapse when I >>>>>>>>>>> didn't >>>>>>>>>>> want >>>>>>>>>>> it to, and it wouldn't collapse when I did! >>>>>>>>>>> Ambutech, (on the other hand,) is awesome! >>>>>>>>>>> Their canes are stirdyer, and they may be bulky, but they get the >>>>>>>>>>> job >>>>>>>>>>> done! >>>>>>>>>>> I can't imagine myself with a thinner cane, no matter what it is! >>>>>>>>>>> My Ambutech cane has lasted longer than my VR canes, and those >>>>>>>>>>> NFB >>>>>>>>>>> canes >>>>>>>>>>> combined! >>>>>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti >>>>>>>>>>> Shelton >>>>>>>>>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:10 AM >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Kaiti >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kaiti >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 22:08:51 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (christopher nusbaum) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 18:08:51 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] nfb 2013 scholarship:who do I speak to? In-Reply-To: References: <515633F3.2020504@tysdomain.com> <51563609.6060200@tysdomain.com> <006b01ce2d5e$35d59a90$a180cfb0$@labarrelaw.com> Message-ID: <1620541746270979765@unknownmsgid> That is correct. If you have any questions, contact Loraine Rovig at our national office. I'm not quite sure what her phone extension is, but I know her email is lrovig at nfb.org. If you call the office on Monday and ask the operator for her, he will be able to connect you. The phone number to the center is (410) 659-9314. Hope this helps, and good luck with the scholarship!! Chris Nusbaum Sent from my iPhone On Mar 30, 2013, at 12:02 PM, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Hi Tyler, > > For your reference the email is on the submissions checklist. It > should be right below the address to send print materials to. I > believe it's scholarships at nfb.org, but you might want to double-check > since I'm going off memory with that one. :) > > Good luck, and I'd definitely recommend going for your state scholarship too. > > On 3/30/13, Scott C. LaBarre wrote: >> Greetings, as long as you complete the on line application and submit all >> the other forms and documents per the instructions by tomorrow, we can >> certainly arrange a scholarship interview in a timely fashion. The actual >> call with a state president does not have to occur before the 31st but >> rather we need to know about your desire to have such an interview. I will >> take your email as such a notification. As Arielle suggested, please >> contact my assistant, Lisa Bonderson, at lbonderson at labarrelaw.com or 303 >> 504-5979 to arrange a time for the interview. >> >> Regards, >> >> >> >> Scott C. LaBarre, Esq. >> >> LaBarre Law Offices P.C. >> 1660 South Albion Street, Ste. 918 >> Denver, Colorado 80222 >> 303 504-5979 (voice) >> 303 757-3640 (fax) >> slabarre at labarrelaw.com (e-mail) >> www.labarrelaw.com (website) >> >> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This message may contain confidential and >> privileged >> information. If you are not the designated recipient, you may not read, >> copy, distribute or retain this message. If you received this message in >> error, please notify the sender at 303) 504-5979 or >> slabarre at labarrelaw.com, >> and destroy and delete it from your system. This message and any >> attachments >> are covered by the Electronic Communications Privacy Act, 18 U.S.C. §§ >> 2510-2521. >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle >> Silverman >> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 7:37 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] nfb 2013 scholarship:who do I speak to? >> >> Hi Tyler, >> It might be too late for you to get a Colorado president's letter for the >> national NFB scholarship, but it is not too late to get the state >> scholarship, since the deadline isn't until April 15. >> You can make an appointment for an interview with Scott LaBarre, CO >> president, by calling >> 303-778-1130 >> and ask to speak with Lisa Bonderson. >> Best, >> Arielle >> >> On 3/29/13, Littlefield, Tyler wrote: >>> Sorry, one final question. I seen the state listing in the FAQ, but >>> I'm not actually seeing the email address anywhere that I need to send >>> the extra information to. >>> >>> On 3/29/2013 6:38 PM, Littlefield, Tyler wrote: >>>> hello all: >>>> I guess this is sort of late; I just stumbled onto the NFB >>>> scholarship but I was curious who I need to talk to for Colorado for an >> interview? >>>> If someone could give me contact details or the person from Colorado >>>> could get in touch with me, I would really really appreciate it. >>>> Thanks, >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Take care, >>> Ty >>> http://tds-solutions.net >>> The aspen project: a barebones light-weight mud engine: >>> http://code.google.com/p/aspenmud >>> He that will not reason is a bigot; he that cannot reason is a fool; >>> he that dares not reason is a slave. >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >>> com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/slabarre%40labarrelaw.co >> m >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com From joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com Sat Mar 30 22:19:30 2013 From: joltingjacksandefur at gmail.com (RJ Sandefur) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 18:19:30 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Accessible Dating Website References: <1D97316B5A36494689AA23853C21D83A@HamidPC><009f01ce2cb3$bcd31000$36793000$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <000301ce2d94$a68c8600$0202a8c0@hometwxakonvzn> Ariel What and or how have you delbt with dating? RJ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Arielle Silverman" To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2013 4:04 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Accessible Dating Website > My opinion is probably biased, but I think that the people who are > willing to spend money for online dating might, on average, tend to be > more "desperate" or less successful at dating, whereas the people who > go on the free sites are just having fun. However, I can see it going > the other way too if the ones on the free sites aren't very committed > to online dating. > I do know a few people who found lasting love using OKCupid, and they > have a pretty good algorithm for matching people up, I think. > Arielle > > On 3/29/13, justin williams wrote: >> Why is that? Why do you find free sites better than paied ones? >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle >> Silverman >> Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2013 2:51 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Accessible Dating Website >> >> I was on >> www.okcupid.com >> for a couple years and it was accessible except for one Captia at the >> beginning. It's been a long time since I've been on though, so it could >> have >> gotten less accessible (or maybe they fixed the one Captia). There are >> lots >> of dating websites out there, though, so you can always try a few and see >> which ones are the most user-friendly. My personal opinion is that you >> will >> find better dating options on free sites than on paid ones, but that's >> just >> my opinion. >> Arielle >> >> On 3/30/13, Hamid Hamraz wrote: >>> Hi There Folks, >>> >>> Is anybody aware of a dating website decently accessible by JAWS? >>> >>> Thank you. >>> >>> Hamid >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >>> com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >> .com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 01:07:12 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 21:07:12 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: <-7152629430158794237@unknownmsgid> References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com> <-1498599385532720274@unknownmsgid> <900738845560274744@unknownmsgid> <-7152629430158794237@unknownmsgid> Message-ID: Hi all, Chris Park's site is: www.chrisparkdesign.com As we were saying earlier on the thread though, there unfortunately isn't a way to purchase through this site. You could try emailing him on the contact page and seeing if you could just go through him directly, but he seems to sell through NFB. Having had experience with both the NFB and his model of telescopic cane, I'd totally recommend going through the Independence Market and just requesting his model. In my experiences it's totally been worth it. Chris: Really? I didn't know Ambutech started making lighter models; that was why I started going with NFB for all my canes, although like you I found their folding ones had joint problems and some other issues and didn't last long. You'll have to share how that one feels when you get it. :) On 3/30/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: > Arielle, I agree. I got my NFB folding cane for Christmas, but after > only 2 months the joints are chipping to the point that I can no > longer fold it without having to do a lot of wiggling to get it > unfolded. I was very excited about this folding cane, but > unfortunately I have been disappointed by its performance, or lack > thereof. I now have an Ambutech Ultra Light folding cane on order. > > Chris Nusbaum > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 30, 2013, at 5:34 PM, Arielle Silverman wrote: > >> Could someone send the URL for the Chris Park site? I would really >> love to get a better-quality telescoping or folding cane than what >> I've gotten from NFB. Their straight canes are wonderful, but I have >> yet to be satisfied with any non-rigid cane from them. >> Arielle >> >> On 3/30/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >>> You might also call the Independence Market at our national center. >>> The number is (410) 659-9314, option 4 from the main menu. >>> >>> Chris Nusbaum >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 30, 2013, at 3:45 PM, Kaiti Shelton >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> That is right, unless you clarify in the comment section the model you >>>> want. If you tell them you specifically want the Chris Park model in >>>> the comments they won't ignore that and you'll get what you want for >>>> your $35. The clarification might be there for people who don't know >>>> to do the comment thing, (which I'm assuming would be the majority of >>>> people), but they don't make it impossible for you to get what you >>>> want for your buck. Actually, my ability to see the pictures probably >>>> further complicated the issue; had I just gone off the cane type and >>>> commented that I wanted the Chris Park model from the start I would >>>> have saved myself some confusion, although I'm not sure many other >>>> people would have known to do that either. >>>> >>>> Have you been able to purchase directly from Chris Park's site? That >>>> was where I looked after the NFB store was confusing me and before I >>>> called, but I didn't see any links to the specific models or to >>>> checkout/purchase anything. >>>> >>>> On 3/30/13, Brice Smith wrote: >>>>> Right. So if you just order a type 7 cane from the NFB store, there's >>>>> no guarantee what you'll actually get when you spend your $35? You >>>>> might get Chris Park's model, but you might also get the old (pre >>>>> 2010) model that most people universally seem to dislike? The amusing >>>>> thing here is that while Kaiti can check out the pictures, other users >>>>> of the store ... can't. So the NFB's lack of clarification here makes >>>>> perfect sense! Got it. >>>>> >>>>> Anyway, Chris Park has his own website. >>>>> >>>>> http://www.chrisparkdesign.com/sub_01_new.html >>>>> >>>>> Brice >>>>> >>>>> On 3/30/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>> >>>>>> Brice, I guess what they do is they just classify the canes by type. >>>>>> E.G, all the 5 or 6 section telescopic canes are listed on the site >>>>>> as >>>>>> type 7. This type includes all the models that fit into that >>>>>> category, so when you buy one you might get any model depending on >>>>>> what they have in stock unless you specifically tell them you want a >>>>>> specific type, E.G. the Chris Park. That one is still the latest and >>>>>> greatest thing out there, so I guess we were both lucky to get it >>>>>> when >>>>>> we bought our canes. What got me into trouble looking through the >>>>>> search results was that I didn't remember the exact type, so I >>>>>> assumed >>>>>> that the Chris Park would have it's own little category in the search >>>>>> results, (I didn't buy my last cane either, so I wasn't familiar with >>>>>> how to get to it from previous experience). Looking at the picture >>>>>> for the type 7, it shows two different models of NFB canes, but >>>>>> neither of them were the Chris Park. I was looking for that distinct >>>>>> grip which is much bigger than a lot of the NFB models and didn't see >>>>>> it. Now we know. :) >>>>>> >>>>>> I suppose every cane is different, Joshua, but I had significantly >>>>>> more collapses with my NFB telescopic cane I bought in 2009 than I >>>>>> have with the Chris Park model. I don't think you had the newest >>>>>> one; >>>>>> the collapse-resistant model just came out in December of 2011, so >>>>>> anything before that would be more collapse-prone. A lot of people, >>>>>> including myself, seem to really like this newer one. Different >>>>>> strokes for different folks, but don't base an opinion of an entire >>>>>> company over one cane from several years ago which has since been >>>>>> improved upon. >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/30/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>>> Those Chris Parks canes are nothing but trouble! >>>>>>> Those were the ones that collapse too much! >>>>>>> His folding canes are awful too! >>>>>>> I got the telescoping cane in 2010, and I didn't like it. >>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Brice Smith >>>>>>> [brice.smith319 at gmail.com] >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 10:45 PM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I'm still a bit confused. Which model is the one listed on the site >>>>>>> now? Is the Chris Parks model now "old" and is there a newer model >>>>>>> out >>>>>>> now? You and I both must Have bought his model last year. Have they >>>>>>> replaced it with something different? Even better? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 29, 2013, at 10:55 PM, Kaiti Shelton >>>>>>> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Yeah, they're well worth checking into, or at least I think so. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I found out why I wasn't seeing it in the search results; The NFB >>>>>>>> site >>>>>>>> groups all types of canes together, but doesn't descriminate >>>>>>>> between >>>>>>>> the models. So, I was seeing pictures of the older canes because >>>>>>>> that's the type the new one still fits under, (5 or 6 section >>>>>>>> telescopic). The particular cane I got last time was made by Chris >>>>>>>> Parks, and I just got it because it was what they had in stock. >>>>>>>> They >>>>>>>> don't show it on the site, but if you know the particular model you >>>>>>>> want you can request it in the comments section when you check out. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>>>>> I want to look at the new ones. >>>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti >>>>>>>>> Shelton >>>>>>>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 11:21 AM >>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Joshua, I didn't say that you said anything, I was merely sharing >>>>>>>>> my >>>>>>>>> experiences. I've heard from several people that those canes are >>>>>>>>> thought >>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>> be indestructible, so it seemed like it might have been a common >>>>>>>>> misconception. >>>>>>>>> That is what is so improved about this model of the telescopic >>>>>>>>> cane, >>>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>>> doesn't collapse near as much as the old oones. I rarely had to >>>>>>>>> stop >>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>> fix mine. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Friday, March 29, 2013, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Hi Kaiti! >>>>>>>>>> I never said that the Ambutech canes were indestructable. >>>>>>>>>> I just wish that they'd make the telescopic canes more stirdy, so >>>>>>>>>> that >>>>>>>>>> they'll collapse, only when I want them to. >>>>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org ] on behalf >>>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>>> Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com ] >>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 3:02 AM >>>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> *the beginning of that was supposed to say that I'm the opposite. >>>>>>>>>> Sorry for the weird cut off. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On 3/29/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> posite; telescopic canes last much longer for me than the >>>>>>>>>>> folding >>>>>>>>>>> ones, I think because of the weight and because of my pace. >>>>>>>>>>> That >>>>>>>>>>> is >>>>>>>>>>> why I prefer the NFB canes and will most likely avoid the bulky >>>>>>>>>>> folding ones. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> The next time someone tells you an Ambutech cane, or an aluminum >>>>>>>>>>> one, >>>>>>>>>>> is indestructable, don't necessarily buy it. In the first week >>>>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>>>> school this year I was going out to a campus event with some >>>>>>>>>>> friends >>>>>>>>>>> and because I had issues with people stepping on and breaking my >>>>>>>>>>> telescopic canes in high school I chose to take my folding one >>>>>>>>>>> from >>>>>>>>>>> ambutech. It was so heavy for me that when I stepped off the >>>>>>>>>>> curb >>>>>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>>>>> went down into a drainage grate. It must have gone right >>>>>>>>>>> between >>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> bars because I didn't feel it hit anything or realize it wasn't >>>>>>>>>>> on >>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> ground, but I kept walking and tripped when I felt that my cane >>>>>>>>>>> wasn't >>>>>>>>>>> coming with me. I dropped it and when a friend of mine grabbed >>>>>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>>> pulled it out of the grate the bottom shaft was sliced open >>>>>>>>>>> where >>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> grate had dug into it and it was bent at a 45 degree angle from >>>>>>>>>>> where >>>>>>>>>>> it should have been. For a while I used a straight cane that >>>>>>>>>>> was >>>>>>>>>>> kind >>>>>>>>>>> of my old-faithful cane, (My O&M instructor and I made it when I >>>>>>>>>>> was >>>>>>>>>>> in the 4th grade and I still had it as a college freshman). It >>>>>>>>>>> was >>>>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>>>> little short for me, but I didn't grow much after making it so >>>>>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>>>>> would have worked all right till I could order a new one over >>>>>>>>>>> Christmas break. Then again, I was walking with friends, and >>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> cane >>>>>>>>>>> got stuck in a really big crack in the sidewalk. When we pulled >>>>>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>>>>> out the tip was still wedged into the crack, but the bottom of >>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> shaft was dented all over to the point where I doubt another tip >>>>>>>>>>> would >>>>>>>>>>> be able to stay on it. (The kicker was that this all happened >>>>>>>>>>> within >>>>>>>>>>> a month). Then I started using the telescopic cane because I >>>>>>>>>>> had >>>>>>>>>>> no >>>>>>>>>>> other choice, and not only were people more conscious about >>>>>>>>>>> avoiding >>>>>>>>>>> stepping on a white stick, but all my problems with grates and >>>>>>>>>>> sidewalk cracks magically went away. (and my wrist liked it >>>>>>>>>>> better >>>>>>>>>>> too). >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> Another thing I should mention, is that I found out that cane >>>>>>>>>>>> tips >>>>>>>>>>>> cost >>>>>>>>>>>> over >>>>>>>>>>>> $1.50, per tip! >>>>>>>>>>>> Good grief! >>>>>>>>>>>> Those tips are small, unlike the tips you find on VR canes! >>>>>>>>>>>> Why not just charge 50 cents a tip? >>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Joshua >>>>>>>>>>>> Lester >>>>>>>>>>>> [JLester8462 at pccua.edu] >>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:21 AM >>>>>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> I bought an NFB folding cane, and a straight cane from them! >>>>>>>>>>>> I had issues with the tip coming off of the straight cane, and >>>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>>> folding >>>>>>>>>>>> cane broke after the first day, because they aren't stirdy >>>>>>>>>>>> enough! >>>>>>>>>>>> I had a telescoping cane as well, and it would collapse when I >>>>>>>>>>>> didn't >>>>>>>>>>>> want >>>>>>>>>>>> it to, and it wouldn't collapse when I did! >>>>>>>>>>>> Ambutech, (on the other hand,) is awesome! >>>>>>>>>>>> Their canes are stirdyer, and they may be bulky, but they get >>>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>>> job >>>>>>>>>>>> done! >>>>>>>>>>>> I can't imagine myself with a thinner cane, no matter what it >>>>>>>>>>>> is! >>>>>>>>>>>> My Ambutech cane has lasted longer than my VR canes, and those >>>>>>>>>>>> NFB >>>>>>>>>>>> canes >>>>>>>>>>>> combined! >>>>>>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti >>>>>>>>>>>> Shelton >>>>>>>>>>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:10 AM >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Kaiti >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From brice.smith319 at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 01:17:49 2013 From: brice.smith319 at gmail.com (Brice Smith) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 21:17:49 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com> <-1498599385532720274@unknownmsgid> <900738845560274744@unknownmsgid> <-7152629430158794237@unknownmsgid> Message-ID: Just to clarify: "UltraLite" is simply the ™ Ambutech gives to their standard, regular graphite mobility cane. Brice On 3/30/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > Hi all, > > Chris Park's site is: > www.chrisparkdesign.com > > As we were saying earlier on the thread though, there unfortunately > isn't a way to purchase through this site. You could try emailing him > on the contact page and seeing if you could just go through him > directly, but he seems to sell through NFB. Having had experience > with both the NFB and his model of telescopic cane, I'd totally > recommend going through the Independence Market and just requesting > his model. In my experiences it's totally been worth it. > > Chris: Really? I didn't know Ambutech started making lighter models; > that was why I started going with NFB for all my canes, although like > you I found their folding ones had joint problems and some other > issues and didn't last long. You'll have to share how that one feels > when you get it. :) > > > > On 3/30/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >> Arielle, I agree. I got my NFB folding cane for Christmas, but after >> only 2 months the joints are chipping to the point that I can no >> longer fold it without having to do a lot of wiggling to get it >> unfolded. I was very excited about this folding cane, but >> unfortunately I have been disappointed by its performance, or lack >> thereof. I now have an Ambutech Ultra Light folding cane on order. >> >> Chris Nusbaum >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 30, 2013, at 5:34 PM, Arielle Silverman >> wrote: >> >>> Could someone send the URL for the Chris Park site? I would really >>> love to get a better-quality telescoping or folding cane than what >>> I've gotten from NFB. Their straight canes are wonderful, but I have >>> yet to be satisfied with any non-rigid cane from them. >>> Arielle >>> >>> On 3/30/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >>>> You might also call the Independence Market at our national center. >>>> The number is (410) 659-9314, option 4 from the main menu. >>>> >>>> Chris Nusbaum >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Mar 30, 2013, at 3:45 PM, Kaiti Shelton >>>> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>> >>>>> That is right, unless you clarify in the comment section the model you >>>>> want. If you tell them you specifically want the Chris Park model in >>>>> the comments they won't ignore that and you'll get what you want for >>>>> your $35. The clarification might be there for people who don't know >>>>> to do the comment thing, (which I'm assuming would be the majority of >>>>> people), but they don't make it impossible for you to get what you >>>>> want for your buck. Actually, my ability to see the pictures probably >>>>> further complicated the issue; had I just gone off the cane type and >>>>> commented that I wanted the Chris Park model from the start I would >>>>> have saved myself some confusion, although I'm not sure many other >>>>> people would have known to do that either. >>>>> >>>>> Have you been able to purchase directly from Chris Park's site? That >>>>> was where I looked after the NFB store was confusing me and before I >>>>> called, but I didn't see any links to the specific models or to >>>>> checkout/purchase anything. >>>>> >>>>> On 3/30/13, Brice Smith wrote: >>>>>> Right. So if you just order a type 7 cane from the NFB store, there's >>>>>> no guarantee what you'll actually get when you spend your $35? You >>>>>> might get Chris Park's model, but you might also get the old (pre >>>>>> 2010) model that most people universally seem to dislike? The amusing >>>>>> thing here is that while Kaiti can check out the pictures, other >>>>>> users >>>>>> of the store ... can't. So the NFB's lack of clarification here makes >>>>>> perfect sense! Got it. >>>>>> >>>>>> Anyway, Chris Park has his own website. >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.chrisparkdesign.com/sub_01_new.html >>>>>> >>>>>> Brice >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/30/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Brice, I guess what they do is they just classify the canes by type. >>>>>>> E.G, all the 5 or 6 section telescopic canes are listed on the site >>>>>>> as >>>>>>> type 7. This type includes all the models that fit into that >>>>>>> category, so when you buy one you might get any model depending on >>>>>>> what they have in stock unless you specifically tell them you want a >>>>>>> specific type, E.G. the Chris Park. That one is still the latest >>>>>>> and >>>>>>> greatest thing out there, so I guess we were both lucky to get it >>>>>>> when >>>>>>> we bought our canes. What got me into trouble looking through the >>>>>>> search results was that I didn't remember the exact type, so I >>>>>>> assumed >>>>>>> that the Chris Park would have it's own little category in the >>>>>>> search >>>>>>> results, (I didn't buy my last cane either, so I wasn't familiar >>>>>>> with >>>>>>> how to get to it from previous experience). Looking at the picture >>>>>>> for the type 7, it shows two different models of NFB canes, but >>>>>>> neither of them were the Chris Park. I was looking for that >>>>>>> distinct >>>>>>> grip which is much bigger than a lot of the NFB models and didn't >>>>>>> see >>>>>>> it. Now we know. :) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I suppose every cane is different, Joshua, but I had significantly >>>>>>> more collapses with my NFB telescopic cane I bought in 2009 than I >>>>>>> have with the Chris Park model. I don't think you had the newest >>>>>>> one; >>>>>>> the collapse-resistant model just came out in December of 2011, so >>>>>>> anything before that would be more collapse-prone. A lot of people, >>>>>>> including myself, seem to really like this newer one. Different >>>>>>> strokes for different folks, but don't base an opinion of an entire >>>>>>> company over one cane from several years ago which has since been >>>>>>> improved upon. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 3/30/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>>>> Those Chris Parks canes are nothing but trouble! >>>>>>>> Those were the ones that collapse too much! >>>>>>>> His folding canes are awful too! >>>>>>>> I got the telescoping cane in 2010, and I didn't like it. >>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Brice Smith >>>>>>>> [brice.smith319 at gmail.com] >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 10:45 PM >>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I'm still a bit confused. Which model is the one listed on the site >>>>>>>> now? Is the Chris Parks model now "old" and is there a newer model >>>>>>>> out >>>>>>>> now? You and I both must Have bought his model last year. Have they >>>>>>>> replaced it with something different? Even better? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Mar 29, 2013, at 10:55 PM, Kaiti Shelton >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Yeah, they're well worth checking into, or at least I think so. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I found out why I wasn't seeing it in the search results; The NFB >>>>>>>>> site >>>>>>>>> groups all types of canes together, but doesn't descriminate >>>>>>>>> between >>>>>>>>> the models. So, I was seeing pictures of the older canes because >>>>>>>>> that's the type the new one still fits under, (5 or 6 section >>>>>>>>> telescopic). The particular cane I got last time was made by Chris >>>>>>>>> Parks, and I just got it because it was what they had in stock. >>>>>>>>> They >>>>>>>>> don't show it on the site, but if you know the particular model >>>>>>>>> you >>>>>>>>> want you can request it in the comments section when you check >>>>>>>>> out. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>>>>>> I want to look at the new ones. >>>>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti >>>>>>>>>> Shelton >>>>>>>>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 11:21 AM >>>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Joshua, I didn't say that you said anything, I was merely sharing >>>>>>>>>> my >>>>>>>>>> experiences. I've heard from several people that those canes are >>>>>>>>>> thought >>>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>> be indestructible, so it seemed like it might have been a common >>>>>>>>>> misconception. >>>>>>>>>> That is what is so improved about this model of the telescopic >>>>>>>>>> cane, >>>>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>>>> doesn't collapse near as much as the old oones. I rarely had to >>>>>>>>>> stop >>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>> fix mine. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Friday, March 29, 2013, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Hi Kaiti! >>>>>>>>>>> I never said that the Ambutech canes were indestructable. >>>>>>>>>>> I just wish that they'd make the telescopic canes more stirdy, >>>>>>>>>>> so >>>>>>>>>>> that >>>>>>>>>>> they'll collapse, only when I want them to. >>>>>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org ] on >>>>>>>>>>> behalf >>>>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>>>> Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com ] >>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 3:02 AM >>>>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> *the beginning of that was supposed to say that I'm the >>>>>>>>>>> opposite. >>>>>>>>>>> Sorry for the weird cut off. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On 3/29/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> posite; telescopic canes last much longer for me than the >>>>>>>>>>>> folding >>>>>>>>>>>> ones, I think because of the weight and because of my pace. >>>>>>>>>>>> That >>>>>>>>>>>> is >>>>>>>>>>>> why I prefer the NFB canes and will most likely avoid the bulky >>>>>>>>>>>> folding ones. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> The next time someone tells you an Ambutech cane, or an >>>>>>>>>>>> aluminum >>>>>>>>>>>> one, >>>>>>>>>>>> is indestructable, don't necessarily buy it. In the first week >>>>>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>>>>> school this year I was going out to a campus event with some >>>>>>>>>>>> friends >>>>>>>>>>>> and because I had issues with people stepping on and breaking >>>>>>>>>>>> my >>>>>>>>>>>> telescopic canes in high school I chose to take my folding one >>>>>>>>>>>> from >>>>>>>>>>>> ambutech. It was so heavy for me that when I stepped off the >>>>>>>>>>>> curb >>>>>>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>>>>>> went down into a drainage grate. It must have gone right >>>>>>>>>>>> between >>>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>>> bars because I didn't feel it hit anything or realize it wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>> on >>>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>>> ground, but I kept walking and tripped when I felt that my cane >>>>>>>>>>>> wasn't >>>>>>>>>>>> coming with me. I dropped it and when a friend of mine grabbed >>>>>>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>>>> pulled it out of the grate the bottom shaft was sliced open >>>>>>>>>>>> where >>>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>>> grate had dug into it and it was bent at a 45 degree angle from >>>>>>>>>>>> where >>>>>>>>>>>> it should have been. For a while I used a straight cane that >>>>>>>>>>>> was >>>>>>>>>>>> kind >>>>>>>>>>>> of my old-faithful cane, (My O&M instructor and I made it when >>>>>>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>>>>>> was >>>>>>>>>>>> in the 4th grade and I still had it as a college freshman). It >>>>>>>>>>>> was >>>>>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>>>>> little short for me, but I didn't grow much after making it so >>>>>>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>>>>>> would have worked all right till I could order a new one over >>>>>>>>>>>> Christmas break. Then again, I was walking with friends, and >>>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>>> cane >>>>>>>>>>>> got stuck in a really big crack in the sidewalk. When we >>>>>>>>>>>> pulled >>>>>>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>>>>>> out the tip was still wedged into the crack, but the bottom of >>>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>>> shaft was dented all over to the point where I doubt another >>>>>>>>>>>> tip >>>>>>>>>>>> would >>>>>>>>>>>> be able to stay on it. (The kicker was that this all happened >>>>>>>>>>>> within >>>>>>>>>>>> a month). Then I started using the telescopic cane because I >>>>>>>>>>>> had >>>>>>>>>>>> no >>>>>>>>>>>> other choice, and not only were people more conscious about >>>>>>>>>>>> avoiding >>>>>>>>>>>> stepping on a white stick, but all my problems with grates and >>>>>>>>>>>> sidewalk cracks magically went away. (and my wrist liked it >>>>>>>>>>>> better >>>>>>>>>>>> too). >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> Another thing I should mention, is that I found out that cane >>>>>>>>>>>>> tips >>>>>>>>>>>>> cost >>>>>>>>>>>>> over >>>>>>>>>>>>> $1.50, per tip! >>>>>>>>>>>>> Good grief! >>>>>>>>>>>>> Those tips are small, unlike the tips you find on VR canes! >>>>>>>>>>>>> Why not just charge 50 cents a tip? >>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Joshua >>>>>>>>>>>>> Lester >>>>>>>>>>>>> [JLester8462 at pccua.edu] >>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:21 AM >>>>>>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I bought an NFB folding cane, and a straight cane from them! >>>>>>>>>>>>> I had issues with the tip coming off of the straight cane, and >>>>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>>>> folding >>>>>>>>>>>>> cane broke after the first day, because they aren't stirdy >>>>>>>>>>>>> enough! >>>>>>>>>>>>> I had a telescoping cane as well, and it would collapse when I >>>>>>>>>>>>> didn't >>>>>>>>>>>>> want >>>>>>>>>>>>> it to, and it wouldn't collapse when I did! >>>>>>>>>>>>> Ambutech, (on the other hand,) is awesome! >>>>>>>>>>>>> Their canes are stirdyer, and they may be bulky, but they get >>>>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>>>> job >>>>>>>>>>>>> done! >>>>>>>>>>>>> I can't imagine myself with a thinner cane, no matter what it >>>>>>>>>>>>> is! >>>>>>>>>>>>> My Ambutech cane has lasted longer than my VR canes, and those >>>>>>>>>>>>> NFB >>>>>>>>>>>>> canes >>>>>>>>>>>>> combined! >>>>>>>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti >>>>>>>>>>>>> Shelton >>>>>>>>>>>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:10 AM >>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Kaiti >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >> > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com > From arielle71 at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 01:20:48 2013 From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 19:20:48 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Accessible Dating Website In-Reply-To: <000301ce2d94$a68c8600$0202a8c0@hometwxakonvzn> References: <1D97316B5A36494689AA23853C21D83A@HamidPC> <009f01ce2cb3$bcd31000$36793000$@gmail.com> <000301ce2d94$a68c8600$0202a8c0@hometwxakonvzn> Message-ID: Hi RJ and all, There's a list that was set up specifically to talk about dating and other social issues with other blind people. You can join it by sending a blank email to: blind-social-talk-subscribe at yahoogroups.com Best, Arielle On 3/30/13, RJ Sandefur wrote: > Ariel What and or how have you delbt with dating? RJ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Arielle Silverman" > To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" > > Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2013 4:04 PM > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Accessible Dating Website > > >> My opinion is probably biased, but I think that the people who are >> willing to spend money for online dating might, on average, tend to be >> more "desperate" or less successful at dating, whereas the people who >> go on the free sites are just having fun. However, I can see it going >> the other way too if the ones on the free sites aren't very committed >> to online dating. >> I do know a few people who found lasting love using OKCupid, and they >> have a pretty good algorithm for matching people up, I think. >> Arielle >> >> On 3/29/13, justin williams wrote: >>> Why is that? Why do you find free sites better than paied ones? >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle >>> Silverman >>> Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2013 2:51 PM >>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Accessible Dating Website >>> >>> I was on >>> www.okcupid.com >>> for a couple years and it was accessible except for one Captia at the >>> beginning. It's been a long time since I've been on though, so it could >>> have >>> gotten less accessible (or maybe they fixed the one Captia). There are >>> lots >>> of dating websites out there, though, so you can always try a few and >>> see >>> which ones are the most user-friendly. My personal opinion is that you >>> will >>> find better dating options on free sites than on paid ones, but that's >>> just >>> my opinion. >>> Arielle >>> >>> On 3/30/13, Hamid Hamraz wrote: >>>> Hi There Folks, >>>> >>>> Is anybody aware of a dating website decently accessible by JAWS? >>>> >>>> Thank you. >>>> >>>> Hamid >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail. >>>> com >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail >>> .com >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/joltingjacksandefur%40gmail.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > From dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 02:52:52 2013 From: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com (christopher nusbaum) Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 22:52:52 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Happy Easter! Message-ID: <-4185751747753109695@unknownmsgid> Hi all, I would like to take this opportunity to wish all my fellow Christians who are celebrating it a very happy and blessed Easter with family and friends. As we celebrate this joyous occasion, let us not forget why we are celebrating and what Jesus did for us. I also hope that our Jewish friends had a fulfilling Passover celebration as well. Whatever you are celebrating this weekend (even if it is just the weekend itself,) enjoy yourselves! Blessings Chris Nusbaum Sent from my iPhone From JLester8462 at pccua.edu Sun Mar 31 08:50:18 2013 From: JLester8462 at pccua.edu (Joshua Lester) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 08:50:18 +0000 Subject: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question In-Reply-To: References: <003f01ce2b4c$1b9595e0$52c0c1a0$@gmail.com> <000301ce2b5f$9d1723f0$d7456bd0$@gmail.com> <000f01ce2b63$1a5b70c0$4f125240$@gmail.com> <-1498599385532720274@unknownmsgid> <900738845560274744@unknownmsgid> <-7152629430158794237@unknownmsgid>, Message-ID: I met Chris Park at the 2012 convention! He's into his canes, and he bad-mouths anyone and everyone that doesn't order his stuff! He's not a really nice man, unless you are using his products! That's not a good P.R. move! Blessings, Joshua ________________________________________ From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2013 8:07 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question Hi all, Chris Park's site is: www.chrisparkdesign.com As we were saying earlier on the thread though, there unfortunately isn't a way to purchase through this site. You could try emailing him on the contact page and seeing if you could just go through him directly, but he seems to sell through NFB. Having had experience with both the NFB and his model of telescopic cane, I'd totally recommend going through the Independence Market and just requesting his model. In my experiences it's totally been worth it. Chris: Really? I didn't know Ambutech started making lighter models; that was why I started going with NFB for all my canes, although like you I found their folding ones had joint problems and some other issues and didn't last long. You'll have to share how that one feels when you get it. :) On 3/30/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: > Arielle, I agree. I got my NFB folding cane for Christmas, but after > only 2 months the joints are chipping to the point that I can no > longer fold it without having to do a lot of wiggling to get it > unfolded. I was very excited about this folding cane, but > unfortunately I have been disappointed by its performance, or lack > thereof. I now have an Ambutech Ultra Light folding cane on order. > > Chris Nusbaum > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Mar 30, 2013, at 5:34 PM, Arielle Silverman wrote: > >> Could someone send the URL for the Chris Park site? I would really >> love to get a better-quality telescoping or folding cane than what >> I've gotten from NFB. Their straight canes are wonderful, but I have >> yet to be satisfied with any non-rigid cane from them. >> Arielle >> >> On 3/30/13, christopher nusbaum wrote: >>> You might also call the Independence Market at our national center. >>> The number is (410) 659-9314, option 4 from the main menu. >>> >>> Chris Nusbaum >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 30, 2013, at 3:45 PM, Kaiti Shelton >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> That is right, unless you clarify in the comment section the model you >>>> want. If you tell them you specifically want the Chris Park model in >>>> the comments they won't ignore that and you'll get what you want for >>>> your $35. The clarification might be there for people who don't know >>>> to do the comment thing, (which I'm assuming would be the majority of >>>> people), but they don't make it impossible for you to get what you >>>> want for your buck. Actually, my ability to see the pictures probably >>>> further complicated the issue; had I just gone off the cane type and >>>> commented that I wanted the Chris Park model from the start I would >>>> have saved myself some confusion, although I'm not sure many other >>>> people would have known to do that either. >>>> >>>> Have you been able to purchase directly from Chris Park's site? That >>>> was where I looked after the NFB store was confusing me and before I >>>> called, but I didn't see any links to the specific models or to >>>> checkout/purchase anything. >>>> >>>> On 3/30/13, Brice Smith wrote: >>>>> Right. So if you just order a type 7 cane from the NFB store, there's >>>>> no guarantee what you'll actually get when you spend your $35? You >>>>> might get Chris Park's model, but you might also get the old (pre >>>>> 2010) model that most people universally seem to dislike? The amusing >>>>> thing here is that while Kaiti can check out the pictures, other users >>>>> of the store ... can't. So the NFB's lack of clarification here makes >>>>> perfect sense! Got it. >>>>> >>>>> Anyway, Chris Park has his own website. >>>>> >>>>> http://www.chrisparkdesign.com/sub_01_new.html >>>>> >>>>> Brice >>>>> >>>>> On 3/30/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>> >>>>>> Brice, I guess what they do is they just classify the canes by type. >>>>>> E.G, all the 5 or 6 section telescopic canes are listed on the site >>>>>> as >>>>>> type 7. This type includes all the models that fit into that >>>>>> category, so when you buy one you might get any model depending on >>>>>> what they have in stock unless you specifically tell them you want a >>>>>> specific type, E.G. the Chris Park. That one is still the latest and >>>>>> greatest thing out there, so I guess we were both lucky to get it >>>>>> when >>>>>> we bought our canes. What got me into trouble looking through the >>>>>> search results was that I didn't remember the exact type, so I >>>>>> assumed >>>>>> that the Chris Park would have it's own little category in the search >>>>>> results, (I didn't buy my last cane either, so I wasn't familiar with >>>>>> how to get to it from previous experience). Looking at the picture >>>>>> for the type 7, it shows two different models of NFB canes, but >>>>>> neither of them were the Chris Park. I was looking for that distinct >>>>>> grip which is much bigger than a lot of the NFB models and didn't see >>>>>> it. Now we know. :) >>>>>> >>>>>> I suppose every cane is different, Joshua, but I had significantly >>>>>> more collapses with my NFB telescopic cane I bought in 2009 than I >>>>>> have with the Chris Park model. I don't think you had the newest >>>>>> one; >>>>>> the collapse-resistant model just came out in December of 2011, so >>>>>> anything before that would be more collapse-prone. A lot of people, >>>>>> including myself, seem to really like this newer one. Different >>>>>> strokes for different folks, but don't base an opinion of an entire >>>>>> company over one cane from several years ago which has since been >>>>>> improved upon. >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/30/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>>> Those Chris Parks canes are nothing but trouble! >>>>>>> Those were the ones that collapse too much! >>>>>>> His folding canes are awful too! >>>>>>> I got the telescoping cane in 2010, and I didn't like it. >>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Brice Smith >>>>>>> [brice.smith319 at gmail.com] >>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 10:45 PM >>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I'm still a bit confused. Which model is the one listed on the site >>>>>>> now? Is the Chris Parks model now "old" and is there a newer model >>>>>>> out >>>>>>> now? You and I both must Have bought his model last year. Have they >>>>>>> replaced it with something different? Even better? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 29, 2013, at 10:55 PM, Kaiti Shelton >>>>>>> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Yeah, they're well worth checking into, or at least I think so. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I found out why I wasn't seeing it in the search results; The NFB >>>>>>>> site >>>>>>>> groups all types of canes together, but doesn't descriminate >>>>>>>> between >>>>>>>> the models. So, I was seeing pictures of the older canes because >>>>>>>> that's the type the new one still fits under, (5 or 6 section >>>>>>>> telescopic). The particular cane I got last time was made by Chris >>>>>>>> Parks, and I just got it because it was what they had in stock. >>>>>>>> They >>>>>>>> don't show it on the site, but if you know the particular model you >>>>>>>> want you can request it in the comments section when you check out. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>>>>> I want to look at the new ones. >>>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti >>>>>>>>> Shelton >>>>>>>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 11:21 AM >>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Joshua, I didn't say that you said anything, I was merely sharing >>>>>>>>> my >>>>>>>>> experiences. I've heard from several people that those canes are >>>>>>>>> thought >>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>> be indestructible, so it seemed like it might have been a common >>>>>>>>> misconception. >>>>>>>>> That is what is so improved about this model of the telescopic >>>>>>>>> cane, >>>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>>> doesn't collapse near as much as the old oones. I rarely had to >>>>>>>>> stop >>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>> fix mine. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Friday, March 29, 2013, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Hi Kaiti! >>>>>>>>>> I never said that the Ambutech canes were indestructable. >>>>>>>>>> I just wish that they'd make the telescopic canes more stirdy, so >>>>>>>>>> that >>>>>>>>>> they'll collapse, only when I want them to. >>>>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org ] on behalf >>>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>>> Kaiti Shelton [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com ] >>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 3:02 AM >>>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> *the beginning of that was supposed to say that I'm the opposite. >>>>>>>>>> Sorry for the weird cut off. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On 3/29/13, Kaiti Shelton wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> posite; telescopic canes last much longer for me than the >>>>>>>>>>> folding >>>>>>>>>>> ones, I think because of the weight and because of my pace. >>>>>>>>>>> That >>>>>>>>>>> is >>>>>>>>>>> why I prefer the NFB canes and will most likely avoid the bulky >>>>>>>>>>> folding ones. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> The next time someone tells you an Ambutech cane, or an aluminum >>>>>>>>>>> one, >>>>>>>>>>> is indestructable, don't necessarily buy it. In the first week >>>>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>>>> school this year I was going out to a campus event with some >>>>>>>>>>> friends >>>>>>>>>>> and because I had issues with people stepping on and breaking my >>>>>>>>>>> telescopic canes in high school I chose to take my folding one >>>>>>>>>>> from >>>>>>>>>>> ambutech. It was so heavy for me that when I stepped off the >>>>>>>>>>> curb >>>>>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>>>>> went down into a drainage grate. It must have gone right >>>>>>>>>>> between >>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> bars because I didn't feel it hit anything or realize it wasn't >>>>>>>>>>> on >>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> ground, but I kept walking and tripped when I felt that my cane >>>>>>>>>>> wasn't >>>>>>>>>>> coming with me. I dropped it and when a friend of mine grabbed >>>>>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>>> pulled it out of the grate the bottom shaft was sliced open >>>>>>>>>>> where >>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> grate had dug into it and it was bent at a 45 degree angle from >>>>>>>>>>> where >>>>>>>>>>> it should have been. For a while I used a straight cane that >>>>>>>>>>> was >>>>>>>>>>> kind >>>>>>>>>>> of my old-faithful cane, (My O&M instructor and I made it when I >>>>>>>>>>> was >>>>>>>>>>> in the 4th grade and I still had it as a college freshman). It >>>>>>>>>>> was >>>>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>>>> little short for me, but I didn't grow much after making it so >>>>>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>>>>> would have worked all right till I could order a new one over >>>>>>>>>>> Christmas break. Then again, I was walking with friends, and >>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> cane >>>>>>>>>>> got stuck in a really big crack in the sidewalk. When we pulled >>>>>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>>>>> out the tip was still wedged into the crack, but the bottom of >>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> shaft was dented all over to the point where I doubt another tip >>>>>>>>>>> would >>>>>>>>>>> be able to stay on it. (The kicker was that this all happened >>>>>>>>>>> within >>>>>>>>>>> a month). Then I started using the telescopic cane because I >>>>>>>>>>> had >>>>>>>>>>> no >>>>>>>>>>> other choice, and not only were people more conscious about >>>>>>>>>>> avoiding >>>>>>>>>>> stepping on a white stick, but all my problems with grates and >>>>>>>>>>> sidewalk cracks magically went away. (and my wrist liked it >>>>>>>>>>> better >>>>>>>>>>> too). >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On 3/29/13, Joshua Lester wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> Another thing I should mention, is that I found out that cane >>>>>>>>>>>> tips >>>>>>>>>>>> cost >>>>>>>>>>>> over >>>>>>>>>>>> $1.50, per tip! >>>>>>>>>>>> Good grief! >>>>>>>>>>>> Those tips are small, unlike the tips you find on VR canes! >>>>>>>>>>>> Why not just charge 50 cents a tip? >>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks, Joshua >>>>>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Joshua >>>>>>>>>>>> Lester >>>>>>>>>>>> [JLester8462 at pccua.edu] >>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:21 AM >>>>>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Telescopic cane question >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> I bought an NFB folding cane, and a straight cane from them! >>>>>>>>>>>> I had issues with the tip coming off of the straight cane, and >>>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>>> folding >>>>>>>>>>>> cane broke after the first day, because they aren't stirdy >>>>>>>>>>>> enough! >>>>>>>>>>>> I had a telescoping cane as well, and it would collapse when I >>>>>>>>>>>> didn't >>>>>>>>>>>> want >>>>>>>>>>>> it to, and it wouldn't collapse when I did! >>>>>>>>>>>> Ambutech, (on the other hand,) is awesome! >>>>>>>>>>>> Their canes are stirdyer, and they may be bulky, but they get >>>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>>> job >>>>>>>>>>>> done! >>>>>>>>>>>> I can't imagine myself with a thinner cane, no matter what it >>>>>>>>>>>> is! >>>>>>>>>>>> My Ambutech cane has lasted longer than my VR canes, and those >>>>>>>>>>>> NFB >>>>>>>>>>>> canes >>>>>>>>>>>> combined! >>>>>>>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua >>>>>>>>>>>> ________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Kaiti >>>>>>>>>>>> Shelton >>>>>>>>>>>> [crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com] >>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 29, 2013 2:10 AM >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccuaedu.onmicrosoft.com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Kaiti >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>>> nabs-l: >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>>> nabs-l: >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Kaiti >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nabs-l mailing list >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>>> nabs-l: >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nusbaum%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40pccua.edu From brice.smith319 at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 17:16:18 2013 From: brice.smith319 at gmail.com (Brice Smith) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 13:16:18 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Excel Help Message-ID: Hello, Just as a disclaimer, I'm really bad with excel. That said, I'm using it a lot more and I could use some help. Most of my team use macbooks and I'm the only one who uses windows. So I'm not sure if this has anything to do with it, but when I open excel files my screen reader tells me that all the cells are "merged." Can I undo this? When groups of cells are merged I find it hard to move around the document with Jaws and I've never encountered this before. Is this normal or does it have something to do with the conversion process? Finally, does Jaws work with color changes in spreadsheets? I need to be able to recognize color changes in cells and change different cells to different colors and shades of my own. I've checked some of the help files in Jaws but I don't know where to look. I'm not sure if these are accessibility questions or not, but if any of you have experienced them I could use some help. Thanks, Brice From zdreicer at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 18:00:25 2013 From: zdreicer at gmail.com (Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 12:00:25 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Excel Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Bryce and list, happy Easter! I can answer your first question, Merged cells in excel I supposed to be like that. I am taking a class in Excel and have found that was easy to navigate, just press the tab or arrow keys to move away from them. If you need to unmerge a cell or group of cells, look on the home tab (press alt H) for merge and center. There should be an option and not submenu unmerged cells. Sent from my iPhone Using voice over On Mar 31, 2013, at 11:16 AM, Brice Smith wrote: > Hello, > > Just as a disclaimer, I'm really bad with excel. That said, I'm using > it a lot more and I could use some help. Most of my team use macbooks > and I'm the only one who uses windows. So I'm not sure if this has > anything to do with it, but when I open excel files my screen reader > tells me that all the cells are "merged." Can I undo this? When groups > of cells are merged I find it hard to move around the document with > Jaws and I've never encountered this before. Is this normal or does it > have something to do with the conversion process? > > Finally, does Jaws work with color changes in spreadsheets? I need to > be able to recognize color changes in cells and change different cells > to different colors and shades of my own. I've checked some of the > help files in Jaws but I don't know where to look. > > I'm not sure if these are accessibility questions or not, but if any > of you have experienced them I could use some help. > > Thanks, > > Brice > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail.com From brownbears at mchsi.com Sun Mar 31 18:08:43 2013 From: brownbears at mchsi.com (Miranda Morse) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 13:08:43 -0500 Subject: [nabs-l] Excel Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <003601ce2e3a$c885dd00$59919700$@mchsi.com> Hi, I also have a question about excel. When you are in the spreadsheet how do you read the column and row titles? -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2013 1:00 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Excel Help Bryce and list, happy Easter! I can answer your first question, Merged cells in excel I supposed to be like that. I am taking a class in Excel and have found that was easy to navigate, just press the tab or arrow keys to move away from them. If you need to unmerge a cell or group of cells, look on the home tab (press alt H) for merge and center. There should be an option and not submenu unmerged cells. Sent from my iPhone Using voice over On Mar 31, 2013, at 11:16 AM, Brice Smith wrote: > Hello, > > Just as a disclaimer, I'm really bad with excel. That said, I'm using > it a lot more and I could use some help. Most of my team use macbooks > and I'm the only one who uses windows. So I'm not sure if this has > anything to do with it, but when I open excel files my screen reader > tells me that all the cells are "merged." Can I undo this? When groups > of cells are merged I find it hard to move around the document with > Jaws and I've never encountered this before. Is this normal or does it > have something to do with the conversion process? > > Finally, does Jaws work with color changes in spreadsheets? I need to > be able to recognize color changes in cells and change different cells > to different colors and shades of my own. I've checked some of the > help files in Jaws but I don't know where to look. > > I'm not sure if these are accessibility questions or not, but if any > of you have experienced them I could use some help. > > Thanks, > > Brice > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail.c > om _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brownbears%40mchsi.com From zdreicer at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 18:58:17 2013 From: zdreicer at gmail.com (Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 12:58:17 -0600 Subject: [nabs-l] Excel Help In-Reply-To: <003601ce2e3a$c885dd00$59919700$@mchsi.com> References: <003601ce2e3a$c885dd00$59919700$@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <760199E7-E70B-4B1D-8503-9DE3AC79A242@gmail.com> I've actually been wondering that myself! I just got a new person that's helping me in there, and She knows How to help me quite well! I will ask her when I have her for class on Tuesday. Sent from my iPhone Using voice over On Mar 31, 2013, at 12:08 PM, "Miranda Morse" wrote: > Hi, I also have a question about excel. When you are in the spreadsheet how > do you read the column and row titles? > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Zachary N. > Griego-Dreicer > Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2013 1:00 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Excel Help > > Bryce and list, happy Easter! I can answer your first question, Merged > cells in excel I supposed to be like that. I am taking a class in Excel and > have found that was easy to navigate, just press the tab or arrow keys to > move away from them. If you need to unmerge a cell or group of cells, look > on the home tab (press alt H) for merge and center. There should be an > option and not submenu unmerged cells. > > Sent from my iPhone Using voice over > > On Mar 31, 2013, at 11:16 AM, Brice Smith wrote: > >> Hello, >> >> Just as a disclaimer, I'm really bad with excel. That said, I'm using >> it a lot more and I could use some help. Most of my team use macbooks >> and I'm the only one who uses windows. So I'm not sure if this has >> anything to do with it, but when I open excel files my screen reader >> tells me that all the cells are "merged." Can I undo this? When groups >> of cells are merged I find it hard to move around the document with >> Jaws and I've never encountered this before. Is this normal or does it >> have something to do with the conversion process? >> >> Finally, does Jaws work with color changes in spreadsheets? I need to >> be able to recognize color changes in cells and change different cells >> to different colors and shades of my own. I've checked some of the >> help files in Jaws but I don't know where to look. >> >> I'm not sure if these are accessibility questions or not, but if any >> of you have experienced them I could use some help. >> >> Thanks, >> >> Brice >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail.c >> om > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brownbears%40mchsi.com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail.com From clb5590 at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 20:21:50 2013 From: clb5590 at gmail.com (Cindy Bennett) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 13:21:50 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Using Terminal on a Mac Message-ID: Hi everyone, Does anyone use the Terminal application on their Mac? Maybe this question could be answered by anyone who performs command lines on a Mac. If I input a command and get a message, I hear the message once and am unsure how to hear the message again with VoiceOver. Is there a VO cursor that I could use to hear or navigate through these messages again? Thanks. -- Cindy Bennett Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington clb5590 at gmail.com From clb5590 at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 20:24:48 2013 From: clb5590 at gmail.com (Cindy Bennett) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 13:24:48 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] canes and water park rides Message-ID: Hi everyone, This summer, I am going to a water park. When I go to theme parks, I typically store my cane somewhere outside the ride area or on the exit side of a roller coaster platform. However, many water rides are such that you get on the ride in a different location, often quite a walk away, from the place where you get off of the ride. My cane is too long to fit in many inner tubes, and I doubt that it would be a safe thing to bring along especially if it came loose. I am wondering if a telescoping cane would be the best for this, because I know that many water rides have shoe holders. It would just be annoying, because I would have to rely on someone to guide me back to these shoe holders that are often at the entrance of the ride. So what are your suggestions for storing a cane during water rides? Thanks. -- Cindy Bennett Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington clb5590 at gmail.com From bunnykatie6 at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 20:48:06 2013 From: bunnykatie6 at gmail.com (Katie Wang) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 16:48:06 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs In-Reply-To: References: <850CD7D3-28A6-4CE4-A12D-DC504341F7B3@panix.com> <018701ce2104$b9163830$2b42a890$@gmail.com> <4EA9151731404BDDB23E988EB9C5F562@OwnerPC> <514348DD.70705@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi Cindy, Just curious if you have made any headway with using Chrome Vox with Google Docs. I would be willing to learn it as an accessibility solution for the time being - Just want to get a sense of how workable it turned out to be after your experimenting. I would of course also welcome the input from anyone else who has tried this screen reader. Thanks! Katie On 3/16/13, Ari Damoulakis wrote: > I know nothing about google docs, but for accessibility of google > calendar try Povidi, which is specifically for the blind to work with > Google Calendar. > www.povidi.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmail.com > From gpaikens at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 21:02:44 2013 From: gpaikens at gmail.com (Greg Aikens) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 17:02:44 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Using Terminal on a Mac In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Cindy, When working in terminal, you can interact with the part of the screen called "Shell text." You can use the VO cursor commands to move back up through the previous text. However, when new text is output, it will move your cursor back down to the bottom of the screen. Using the arrow keys alone will let you scroll through past commands. If you would prefer to have VO announce new text when it comes up but leave your cursor where it is, you can go into the VO utility and change some of the navigation settings to make this happen. Specifically, make sure the VO cursor follows keyboard and VO cursor follows insertion point boxes are not checked. I have an activity set up with these preferences so that whenever I open terminal, VO remembers my settings and automatically switches. I hope this makes sense. Let me know if you have more questions. -Greg On Mar 31, 2013, at 4:21 PM, Cindy Bennett wrote: > Hi everyone, > > Does anyone use the Terminal application on their Mac? > > Maybe this question could be answered by anyone who performs command > lines on a Mac. > > If I input a command and get a message, I hear the message once and am > unsure how to hear the message again with VoiceOver. Is there a VO > cursor that I could use to hear or navigate through these messages > again? > > Thanks. > > -- > Cindy Bennett > Secretary: National Association of Blind Students > Legislative Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington > > B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington > clb5590 at gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gpaikens%40gmail.com From clb5590 at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 21:07:04 2013 From: clb5590 at gmail.com (Cindy) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 14:07:04 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] Quick help with Google docs In-Reply-To: References: <850CD7D3-28A6-4CE4-A12D-DC504341F7B3@panix.com> <018701ce2104$b9163830$2b42a890$@gmail.com> <4EA9151731404BDDB23E988EB9C5F562@OwnerPC> <514348DD.70705@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, honestly, I haven't had the time. A grad student is trying to make a conference paper deadline on Friday, and I have been super super busy at work. But it is on my to do list for this or next week and I will definitely repoort my experiences. Cindy Bennett Legislative Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington Secretary: National Association of Blind Students B.A. Psychology: UNC Wilmington clb5590 at gmail.com Sent from my iPhone On Mar 31, 2013, at 1:48 PM, Katie Wang wrote: > Hi Cindy, > > Just curious if you have made any headway with using Chrome Vox with > Google Docs. I would be willing to learn it as an accessibility > solution for the time being - Just want to get a sense of how workable > it turned out to be after your experimenting. I would of course also > welcome the input from anyone else who has tried this screen reader. > Thanks! > > Katie > > > On 3/16/13, Ari Damoulakis wrote: >> I know nothing about google docs, but for accessibility of google >> calendar try Povidi, which is specifically for the blind to work with >> Google Calendar. >> www.povidi.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.com From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 21:09:48 2013 From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 17:09:48 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] canes and water park rides In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I don't know what the rides you want to go on are specifically like, but a telescopic cane would probably be your best bet since it's so compact. Using shoe storage areas sounds like a good idea. You might also be able to have a park employee give it to you when you get off if there isn't a good place to store it at the end of the ride. If you have to keep it with you on the ride, and if they'll allow for it, you could try putting the loop at the top of the cane around your wrist and holding onto it along with any handlebars or something. It might be a little awkward, but if you can't get anything else to work the awkwardness would be worth having your cane when you get off of the ride. Hope these ideas help. On 3/31/13, Cindy Bennett wrote: > Hi everyone, > > This summer, I am going to a water park. When I go to theme parks, I > typically store my cane somewhere outside the ride area or on the exit > side of a roller coaster platform. However, many water rides are such > that you get on the ride in a different location, often quite a walk > away, from the place where you get off of the ride. My cane is too > long to fit in many inner tubes, and I doubt that it would be a safe > thing to bring along especially if it came loose. > > I am wondering if a telescoping cane would be the best for this, > because I know that many water rides have shoe holders. It would just > be annoying, because I would have to rely on someone to guide me back > to these shoe holders that are often at the entrance of the ride. > > So what are your suggestions for storing a cane during water rides? > > Thanks. > > > > -- > Cindy Bennett > Secretary: National Association of Blind Students > Legislative Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington > > B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington > clb5590 at gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > -- Kaiti From ryan.bishop96 at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 23:55:22 2013 From: ryan.bishop96 at gmail.com (Ryan Bishop) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 16:55:22 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] canes and water park rides In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi You could also use a cane holster, I have found that works to. Ryan Sent from my iPhone On 31/03/2013, at 14:09, Kaiti Shelton wrote: > I don't know what the rides you want to go on are specifically like, > but a telescopic cane would probably be your best bet since it's so > compact. Using shoe storage areas sounds like a good idea. You might > also be able to have a park employee give it to you when you get off > if there isn't a good place to store it at the end of the ride. If > you have to keep it with you on the ride, and if they'll allow for it, > you could try putting the loop at the top of the cane around your > wrist and holding onto it along with any handlebars or something. It > might be a little awkward, but if you can't get anything else to work > the awkwardness would be worth having your cane when you get off of > the ride. > > Hope these ideas help. > > On 3/31/13, Cindy Bennett wrote: >> Hi everyone, >> >> This summer, I am going to a water park. When I go to theme parks, I >> typically store my cane somewhere outside the ride area or on the exit >> side of a roller coaster platform. However, many water rides are such >> that you get on the ride in a different location, often quite a walk >> away, from the place where you get off of the ride. My cane is too >> long to fit in many inner tubes, and I doubt that it would be a safe >> thing to bring along especially if it came loose. >> >> I am wondering if a telescoping cane would be the best for this, >> because I know that many water rides have shoe holders. It would just >> be annoying, because I would have to rely on someone to guide me back >> to these shoe holders that are often at the entrance of the ride. >> >> So what are your suggestions for storing a cane during water rides? >> >> Thanks. >> >> >> >> -- >> Cindy Bennett >> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students >> Legislative Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington >> >> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >> clb5590 at gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com > > > -- > Kaiti > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/ryan.bishop96%40gmail.com From zerone1683 at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 23:57:29 2013 From: zerone1683 at gmail.com (Chun Chao) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 16:57:29 -0700 Subject: [nabs-l] canes and water park rides In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000301ce2e6b$81c2f8e0$8548eaa0$@com> Will you be going to the water park alone or with a group of people? When I went to theme parks at the end of college tours during high school summers, I would have at least three friends with me in a group of four. That way, we can take turns watching our stuff if one of us did not want to go on a specific ride and I would use sighted guide with one of my friends on the ride platform. Moreover, traveling as a group in a theme park prevents pick-pocketing from happening. After spending about a month or so in a high school to college program during the summer times, I would have figured out which of my peers would be supportive friends and which peers do not work well with me. Also, when the end of the summer program grows near, I would ask the supportive peers if I can group up with them at the theme park. C.C. Alan -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2013 2:10 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] canes and water park rides I don't know what the rides you want to go on are specifically like, but a telescopic cane would probably be your best bet since it's so compact. Using shoe storage areas sounds like a good idea. You might also be able to have a park employee give it to you when you get off if there isn't a good place to store it at the end of the ride. If you have to keep it with you on the ride, and if they'll allow for it, you could try putting the loop at the top of the cane around your wrist and holding onto it along with any handlebars or something. It might be a little awkward, but if you can't get anything else to work the awkwardness would be worth having your cane when you get off of the ride. Hope these ideas help. On 3/31/13, Cindy Bennett wrote: > Hi everyone, > > This summer, I am going to a water park. When I go to theme parks, I > typically store my cane somewhere outside the ride area or on the exit > side of a roller coaster platform. However, many water rides are such > that you get on the ride in a different location, often quite a walk > away, from the place where you get off of the ride. My cane is too > long to fit in many inner tubes, and I doubt that it would be a safe > thing to bring along especially if it came loose. > > I am wondering if a telescoping cane would be the best for this, > because I know that many water rides have shoe holders. It would just > be annoying, because I would have to rely on someone to guide me back > to these shoe holders that are often at the entrance of the ride. > > So what are your suggestions for storing a cane during water rides? > > Thanks. > > > > -- > Cindy Bennett > Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative > Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington > > B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington > clb5590 at gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% > 40gmail.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zerone1683%40gmail.com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 13:34:06 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 09:34:06 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] canes and water park rides In-Reply-To: <001501ce2e82$4dec48c0$df1fbf48@yourfsyly0jtwn> References: <000301ce2e6b$81c2f8e0$8548eaa0$@com> <001201ce2e7e$202e1110$608a3330$@panix.com> <001501ce2e82$4dec48c0$df1fbf48@yourfsyly0jtwn> Message-ID: <00ed01ce2e14$6b5836d0$4208a470$@gmail.com> I have a folding cane. If you have a holster and then loop the string on the cane around the holster, then it sshouldn't come off your hip. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Peter Donahue Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2013 10:41 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] canes and water park rides Hello Mike and everyone, Given that with many rides you exit at a slightly different location than where you got on they knew you would need to use the cane when you got off. I've heard of blind people taking canes on theme park rides for quite a while now. Chock one up for Disney. Peter Donahue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Freeman" To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'" Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2013 9:10 PM Subject: Re: [nabs-l] canes and water park rides I have no answer, either. However, although I've had a ride attendant hold my cane on some occasions at Disney theme parks, I thought it was interesting that both times I rode the Matterhorn at Disneyland, the ride attendants *insisted* that I strap my cane in with me (it was a straight cane). Presumably, the geography of the coaster is such that they thought that if it got stuck and I had to climb down, the cane would be of help. I'm sure they were right. Mike Freeman -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle Silverman Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2013 6:41 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] canes and water park rides I'm curious how you would go sighted guide if you are at the park alone? Do you get help from park employees? I admit that I don't have a good answer to this question since I usually have gone to a water park with at least one sighted person and stashed my cane in a locker and gone sighted guide. Once I did go to a water park with just blind people and I don't recall how we handled the cane issue. I think I appointed myself guardian of the canes and other belongings for everyone since I'm not big on water slides. All the suggestions about using a telescoping cane sound good, though. Arielle On 3/31/13, Andrew wrote: > Hi I go to amusement parks myself and things. to be honest I actually > don't take the cane since it is just one more thing to worry about or > loose. or wrisk loosing. so I go completely sited guide. > > So there fore I can't offer suggestions. > I do have a hard time with the rides with turn tables. > > On 3/31/13, Chun Chao wrote: >> Will you be going to the water park alone or with a group of people? >> When I went to theme parks at the end of college tours during high school >> summers, I would have at least three friends with me in a group of four. >> That way, we can take turns watching our stuff if one of us did not want >> to >> go on a specific ride and I would use sighted guide with one of my >> friends >> on the ride platform. >> Moreover, traveling as a group in a theme park prevents pick-pocketing >> from >> happening. >> >> After spending about a month or so in a high school to college program >> during the summer times, I would have figured out which of my peers would >> be >> supportive friends and which peers do not work well with me. >> Also, when the end of the summer program grows near, I would ask the >> supportive peers if I can group up with them at the theme park. >> >> C.C. Alan >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti >> Shelton >> Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2013 2:10 PM >> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] canes and water park rides >> >> I don't know what the rides you want to go on are specifically like, but >> a >> telescopic cane would probably be your best bet since it's so compact. >> Using shoe storage areas sounds like a good idea. You might also be able >> to >> have a park employee give it to you when you get off if there isn't a >> good >> place to store it at the end of the ride. If you have to keep it with >> you >> on the ride, and if they'll allow for it, you could try putting the loop >> at >> the top of the cane around your wrist and holding onto it along with any >> handlebars or something. It might be a little awkward, but if you can't >> get >> anything else to work the awkwardness would be worth having your cane >> when >> you get off of the ride. >> >> Hope these ideas help. >> >> On 3/31/13, Cindy Bennett wrote: >>> Hi everyone, >>> >>> This summer, I am going to a water park. When I go to theme parks, I >>> typically store my cane somewhere outside the ride area or on the exit >>> side of a roller coaster platform. However, many water rides are such >>> that you get on the ride in a different location, often quite a walk >>> away, from the place where you get off of the ride. My cane is too >>> long to fit in many inner tubes, and I doubt that it would be a safe >>> thing to bring along especially if it came loose. >>> >>> I am wondering if a telescoping cane would be the best for this, >>> because I know that many water rides have shoe holders. It would just >>> be annoying, because I would have to rely on someone to guide me back >>> to these shoe holders that are often at the entrance of the ride. >>> >>> So what are your suggestions for storing a cane during water rides? >>> >>> Thanks. >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Cindy Bennett >>> Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative >>> Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington >>> >>> B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington >>> clb5590 at gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> nabs-l mailing list >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >>> nabs-l: >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104% >>> 40gmail.com >>> >> >> >> -- >> Kaiti >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zerone1683%40gmail.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for >> nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/andrewjedg%40gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/pdonahue2%40satx.rr.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 13:37:45 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 09:37:45 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] canes and water park rides In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <00f101ce2e14$ee1b4030$ca51c090$@gmail.com> Good idea with the loop around the rist. Just make sure the cane does not telescope out. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2013 5:10 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] canes and water park rides I don't know what the rides you want to go on are specifically like, but a telescopic cane would probably be your best bet since it's so compact. Using shoe storage areas sounds like a good idea. You might also be able to have a park employee give it to you when you get off if there isn't a good place to store it at the end of the ride. If you have to keep it with you on the ride, and if they'll allow for it, you could try putting the loop at the top of the cane around your wrist and holding onto it along with any handlebars or something. It might be a little awkward, but if you can't get anything else to work the awkwardness would be worth having your cane when you get off of the ride. Hope these ideas help. On 3/31/13, Cindy Bennett wrote: > Hi everyone, > > This summer, I am going to a water park. When I go to theme parks, I > typically store my cane somewhere outside the ride area or on the exit > side of a roller coaster platform. However, many water rides are such > that you get on the ride in a different location, often quite a walk > away, from the place where you get off of the ride. My cane is too > long to fit in many inner tubes, and I doubt that it would be a safe > thing to bring along especially if it came loose. > > I am wondering if a telescoping cane would be the best for this, > because I know that many water rides have shoe holders. It would just > be annoying, because I would have to rely on someone to guide me back > to these shoe holders that are often at the entrance of the ride. > > So what are your suggestions for storing a cane during water rides? > > Thanks. > > > > -- > Cindy Bennett > Secretary: National Association of Blind Students > Legislative Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington > > B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington > clb5590 at gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmai l.com > -- Kaiti _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 13:39:33 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 09:39:33 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] canes and water park rides In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <00f301ce2e15$2e52c3d0$8af84b70$@gmail.com> I would where a belt around my bathing suit, and Use a folding cane with a holster. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Cindy Bennett Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2013 4:25 PM To: National Asociation of Blind Students Subject: [nabs-l] canes and water park rides Hi everyone, This summer, I am going to a water park. When I go to theme parks, I typically store my cane somewhere outside the ride area or on the exit side of a roller coaster platform. However, many water rides are such that you get on the ride in a different location, often quite a walk away, from the place where you get off of the ride. My cane is too long to fit in many inner tubes, and I doubt that it would be a safe thing to bring along especially if it came loose. I am wondering if a telescoping cane would be the best for this, because I know that many water rides have shoe holders. It would just be annoying, because I would have to rely on someone to guide me back to these shoe holders that are often at the entrance of the ride. So what are your suggestions for storing a cane during water rides? Thanks. -- Cindy Bennett Secretary: National Association of Blind Students Legislative Coordinator: National Federation of the Blind of Washington B.A. Psychology, UNC Wilmington clb5590 at gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 13:35:38 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 09:35:38 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Eric, let's connect on LinkedIn In-Reply-To: <1022899033.17257806.1364777297383.JavaMail.app@ela4-app0129.prod> References: <1022899033.17257806.1364777297383.JavaMail.app@ela4-app0129.prod> Message-ID: <00ef01ce2e14$a2409c50$e6c1d4f0$@gmail.com> My name is Justin. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of James Hulme via LinkedIn Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2013 8:48 PM To: Eric Gaudes Subject: [nabs-l] Eric, let's connect on LinkedIn James Hulme requested to add you as a connection on LinkedIn: ------------------------------------------ Eric, I'd like to add you to my professional network on LinkedIn. - James Accept invitation from James Hulme http://www.linkedin.com/e/-qot5zu-heyx5ya9-13/2LScsQM0ZAGW3fi7AMe09Fk_pJsa/b lk/I482340636_11/3wOtCVFbmdxnSVFbm8JrnpKqlZJrmZzbmNJpjRQnOpBtn9QfmhBt71BoSd1 p65Lr6lOfP4NnPoPdz0QcP8Ud4ALk4Z8lTdVh4gLd3oMdzAPdjsMcz4LrCBxbOYWrSlI/eml-com m_invm-b-in_ac-inv28/?hs=false&tok=1SnqYEfaKM55I1 View profile of James Hulme http://www.linkedin.com/e/-qot5zu-heyx5ya9-13/rso/107250408/slDc/name/858138 88_I482340636_11/?hs=false&tok=1QutwAXAGM55I1 You and James know 5 people in common. ------------------------------------------ You are receiving Invitation emails. This email was intended for Eric Gaudes. Learn why this is included: http://www.linkedin.com/e/-qot5zu-heyx5ya9-13/plh/http%3A%2F%2Fhelp%2Elinked in%2Ecom%2Fapp%2Fanswers%2Fdetail%2Fa_id%2F4788/-GXI/?hs=false&tok=1Um6IBkaq M55I1 (c) 2012, LinkedIn Corporation. 2029 Stierlin Ct, Mountain View, CA 94043, USA. Unsubscribe: Eric Gaudes https://www.linkedin.com/e/-qot5zu-heyx5ya9-13/2LScsQM0ZAGW3fi7AMe09Fk_pJsa/ prv/?hs=false&tok=3ZkgdMxY6M55I1 _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 13:45:00 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 09:45:00 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Excel Help In-Reply-To: <760199E7-E70B-4B1D-8503-9DE3AC79A242@gmail.com> References: <003601ce2e3a$c885dd00$59919700$@mchsi.com> <760199E7-E70B-4B1D-8503-9DE3AC79A242@gmail.com> Message-ID: <00f501ce2e15$f1185e20$d3491a60$@gmail.com> . MODIFIER + ALT + CTRL + C: Sets current column title. . MODIFIER + ALT + CTRL + R: Sets current row title . MODIFIER + ALT + SHIFT + C: Say column title. . MODIFIER + ALT + SHIFT + R: Say row title. . MODIFIER + SHIFT + C: List cells in current -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2013 2:58 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Cc: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Excel Help I've actually been wondering that myself! I just got a new person that's helping me in there, and She knows How to help me quite well! I will ask her when I have her for class on Tuesday. Sent from my iPhone Using voice over On Mar 31, 2013, at 12:08 PM, "Miranda Morse" wrote: > Hi, I also have a question about excel. When you are in the > spreadsheet how do you read the column and row titles? > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Zachary N. > Griego-Dreicer > Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2013 1:00 PM > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Excel Help > > Bryce and list, happy Easter! I can answer your first question, > Merged cells in excel I supposed to be like that. I am taking a class > in Excel and have found that was easy to navigate, just press the tab > or arrow keys to move away from them. If you need to unmerge a cell > or group of cells, look on the home tab (press alt H) for merge and > center. There should be an option and not submenu unmerged cells. > > Sent from my iPhone Using voice over > > On Mar 31, 2013, at 11:16 AM, Brice Smith wrote: > >> Hello, >> >> Just as a disclaimer, I'm really bad with excel. That said, I'm using >> it a lot more and I could use some help. Most of my team use macbooks >> and I'm the only one who uses windows. So I'm not sure if this has >> anything to do with it, but when I open excel files my screen reader >> tells me that all the cells are "merged." Can I undo this? When >> groups of cells are merged I find it hard to move around the document >> with Jaws and I've never encountered this before. Is this normal or >> does it have something to do with the conversion process? >> >> Finally, does Jaws work with color changes in spreadsheets? I need to >> be able to recognize color changes in cells and change different >> cells to different colors and shades of my own. I've checked some of >> the help files in Jaws but I don't know where to look. >> >> I'm not sure if these are accessibility questions or not, but if any >> of you have experienced them I could use some help. >> >> Thanks, >> >> Brice >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nabs-l mailing list >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail. >> c >> om > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for > nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brownbears%40mchsi > .com > > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail.c > om _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 13:50:24 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 09:50:24 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Excel Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <00f701ce2e16$b204cba0$160e62e0$@gmail.com> Also, to merge cells, you can select the cells you want then press control and the number 1 on the numbers row. Control tab until you hear alinement, then tab over until you hear merge cells check box not check. Press space bar to check it, then press enter. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Zachary N. Griego-Dreicer Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2013 2:00 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Excel Help Bryce and list, happy Easter! I can answer your first question, Merged cells in excel I supposed to be like that. I am taking a class in Excel and have found that was easy to navigate, just press the tab or arrow keys to move away from them. If you need to unmerge a cell or group of cells, look on the home tab (press alt H) for merge and center. There should be an option and not submenu unmerged cells. Sent from my iPhone Using voice over On Mar 31, 2013, at 11:16 AM, Brice Smith wrote: > Hello, > > Just as a disclaimer, I'm really bad with excel. That said, I'm using > it a lot more and I could use some help. Most of my team use macbooks > and I'm the only one who uses windows. So I'm not sure if this has > anything to do with it, but when I open excel files my screen reader > tells me that all the cells are "merged." Can I undo this? When groups > of cells are merged I find it hard to move around the document with > Jaws and I've never encountered this before. Is this normal or does it > have something to do with the conversion process? > > Finally, does Jaws work with color changes in spreadsheets? I need to > be able to recognize color changes in cells and change different cells > to different colors and shades of my own. I've checked some of the > help files in Jaws but I don't know where to look. > > I'm not sure if these are accessibility questions or not, but if any > of you have experienced them I could use some help. > > Thanks, > > Brice > > _______________________________________________ > nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zdreicer%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com From justin.williams2 at gmail.com Sun Mar 31 17:54:06 2013 From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams) Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2013 13:54:06 -0400 Subject: [nabs-l] Employment Research Study In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000a01ce2e38$bdbd5030$3937f090$@gmail.com> Unfortunately, I don't qualify, but I will forward this to the student division of S.C. I am delighted to do even this much to assist you. -----Original Message----- From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle Silverman Sent: Monday, April 01, 2013 1:41 PM To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list; Advice and support for blind cooks; blindmath; Arizona Association of Blind Students List; NFB of Colorado Discussion List; Colorado Association of Blind Students List; blparent; blindkid at nfbnet.org Cc: social-sciences-list at nfbnet.org Subject: [nabs-l] Employment Research Study Dear list, My name is Arielle Silverman, and I am a doctoral student in psychology at the University of Colorado at Boulder. My advisor, Dr. Geoffrey Cohen, and I are conducting an online study investigating blind and visually impaired adults' experiences with preparing for and getting employment. We are looking for legally blind adults over the age of 18 who live in the United States and who are currently seeking employment, as well as high school and college seniors and graduate students who plan to graduate in May or August 2013, to participate in our study. This study consists of three phases, which you will complete entirely online. During the first phase, you will answer some questions about your background, attitudes and personal experiences, and will write a short essay about a personally significant event. This session will last for about 45 minutes. Then, you will be asked to fill out a brief questionnaire every night for the next seven days, describing your experiences and things you did during the day. Each of these should take about 10 minutes. Finally, about a month from now, you will fill out another online survey similar to the first one, which should take about half an hour. In exchange for your participation, you will receive three $10 gift certificates to a merchant of your choice (either Amazon.com, Itunes.com, Olive Garden Restaurant, or AMC Theaters), one for each phase of the study. To be eligible to participate, you must be: (1) a legally blind adult aged 18 or older living in the United States; and either (2) currently seeking a long-term job, or (3) a student planning to graduate by August 2013 and then planning to seek employment after graduation. High school, college and graduate students are all eligible, as long as you intend to seek employment immediately after graduating. To complete the first part of the study and receive your first $10 gift certificate, please go to: http://ucsas.qualtrics.com/SE/?SID=SV_1OdonrYSXxrepfL Or, if you would prefer, you may email me at Arielle.silverman at colorado.edu To request a text version of the initial survey. If you are not eligible to participate yourself, I would appreciate if you could forward this announcement to anyone you know who is eligible and might be interested. If you have any questions before, during or after the study, feel free to contact me at Arielle.silverman at colorado.edu You may also contact Dr. Geoffrey Cohen at Cohen.geoff at gmail.com Thank you in advance for your participation in our research. _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail .com