[nabs-l] Stop Blaming the Economy

[Joe]

Tyler,

Fronting the expenses should not be as difficult as we would think because
most blind college students receive help from rehab agencies to pay for the
initial cost of assistive technology. We're left to keep the things
up-to-date, and while the update fees are not always small, they are an
unfortunate part of being blind and a factor that also remains constant even
in the best of economies. After all, having a job does not necessarily mean
the job will pay well, so then where is a person supposed to come up with
the funds?

Some of us have argued that assistive technology should not be as expensive
as it is. When we raise these points, others point to research and
development, market size and scale as justifications for why it's okay to
charge as much as companies do. You won't get any argument from me that
traditional assistive technology ought to come down to prices the population
can afford, but until that changes, the reality I see from where I sit is
one where I have to pay up or get left behind, which forces me to make
financial priorities. Paying the SMA is as much a means to stay with the
current update as it is an investment in keeping pace in the workplace. Or,
think of it a different way, some of us don't get a guide dog with the
illusion that the dog will somehow pay for its own food and vet visits.

I don't like the perception that school has to be paid entirely with loans.
There are grants and scholarships available for just about everything under
the sun. I'd draw out that argument further, but I'm not entirely sure how
it ties into the discussion of employment, except you could argue that maybe
eliminating the cheap beer would be one way to reduce dependency on loans,
but that's another angle for a different forum.

Yes, the economy keeps competition up. My argument is that blind people are
every bit as capable of competing. I genuinely don't know how to express
that more clearly.

I found your sarcasm that everyone should learn to be like me rather glib. I
wish I was like me at a much younger age, and I'm only 31. It was not my
intention to pass off my achievements as a lofty standard only I am capable
of obtaining. On the contrary, I want everyone to achieve similar
independence in a manner that makes sense for their situation, and that, I
think, is where we drastically differ in our thinking. If I were a college
senior listening to your rhetoric, I'd honestly be worried out of my mind.
At least I am attempting to give people hope that it can be done.

Joe

-----Original Message-----
From: Littlefield, Tyler [mailto:tyler at tysdomain.com] 
Sent: Thursday, November 14, 2013 10:53 PM
To: jsoro620 at gmail.com; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Stop Blaming the Economy

Joe:

first, I'd love to hear where you live where money and job skills and
opportunities rain from the skies. It's pretty easy to talk about "fronting
the expenses," but most people who do graduate from college have already
taken out loan upon loan to graduate with. Subsiding on raman, cheep beer
and cheep pizza does not exactly mean people can afford to "front the money"
for an accessible environment.

Second, my comments about people living with their parents does not justify
our ability (or lack there of, as you say) to get a job. I'm just trying to
point out that the economy is pretty rough right now, which keeps
competition up.

Congrats on your job, congrats on your constant skill sharpening. Now we all
just need to learn to be just like you, and we will live full lives with 5
jobs, 3 businesses and with no worries in the world!

On 11/14/2013 10:16 PM, Joe wrote:
> Tyler,
>
> An employer would not need to pay hundreds of dollars for 
> accommodations if we took it upon ourselves to come into the job with 
> our own resources. In fact, that's a good way to minimize the 
> perceived burden of hiring a blind person. It's not altogether impossible
to keep up our software licenses.
> Anyone who goes into business for themselves has to front the expenses 
> associated with creating an accessible working environment.
>
> I don't buy the argument that because many college graduates are 
> living with parents blind people should feel justified in being 
> unemployed. A lot of our generation is also doing ridiculous things 
> like taking parents along to job interviews. Does that mean we as blind
people should start doing the same?
> I'd like to see how well that bodes for the argument that blind people 
> are seen in a negative light for having a disability.
>
> You say that while I'm keeping my skills sharp so are they. Okay, I 
> got the job. They didn't. You can't have it both ways. Either blind 
> people can compete, or they can't. It seems like the economy becomes 
> this convenient card to play when no other arguments hold water.
>
> I'm not entirely sure what it is I'm in denial about. I've never said 
> the economy couldn't use improvement. I've never said finding a job is 
> always a piece of cake. All I've said is that it would be great if we 
> could stop hanging our hat on the economy as a reason to explain the 
> persistent unemployment among blind people, because the jobs are out 
> there. Whether we are ready or qualified to compete for them is another
story altogether.
>
> Joe
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Littlefield, Tyler [mailto:tyler at tysdomain.com]
> Sent: Thursday, November 14, 2013 9:53 PM
> To: jsoro620 at gmail.com; National Association of Blind Students mailing 
> list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Stop Blaming the Economy
>
> Joe:
> Minh's point was just this:
>
> There are a ton of people right now (it's not really uncommon to see 
> college graduates living with their parents) without jobs. all of them 
> are qualified and all of them would love a job. While you're keeping 
> your skills sharp, so are they. Now, when it comes down to the hiring 
> process, who do you think employers are going to hire? Are they going 
> to hire the blind guy who they are uncertain about, who they may need 
> to spend money on accomidating, or are they going to hire the next 
> perfectly abel person in line? They can pay lower wages and people 
> will still take the jobs, and guess what? If they don't, the next 
> person will. The economy is bad right now, which means it's bad for 
> everyone--you, me, uncle sam and most small businesses. Why shell out 
> extra hundreds of dollars that may be required on accomidations when 
> you can have someone that does the same job and costs you less? You 
> sound like you're in a bit of denial here, but it's the facts of life. 
> No, Minh never said we are less able. She was just pointing out some 
> of the logical reasons behind your point. you can deny all you want, 
> but it doesn't change the facts of life. As to your jab about her 
> mantality, she's probably one of the most active blind people I've 
> met, so I don't think that's the case here. It may be different for you to
point that finger if she sat at home and did nothing.
> On 11/14/2013 9:32 PM, Joe wrote:
>> Tyler,
>>
>> I'm not sure what reality check you're hoping I'll receive. If it's 
>> unemployment you're wishing on me, anything is possible, but even 
>> with a position in the federal government I have kept a part-time 
>> business running, because although government jobs are said to be 
>> secure, nothing is guaranteed. The shutdown didn't bother me because 
>> I still had income to fall back on. If I lose my job tomorrow, I will 
>> have six months of savings to actively seek the next best position. Why?
>> Because I have kept my skills up to date, because I have kept a fair 
>> professional network intact, and because I understand the ability to 
>> create positions for myself through the consulting capacity that a 
>> lot of Americans pursued after the economic decline several years 
>> ago. I say that in hopes people will be angered enough to try new 
>> strategies to find their next job. Remember it's usually the first 
>> one that's the toughest to obtain. If an idiot like me can steadily 
>> increase his income,
> you can do it better.
>> It's easy to say there are more people looking for jobs than there 
>> are jobs to fill. Unfortunately that oversimplifies the argument into 
>> one of quantity without fully looking at quality. The people who get 
>> chosen are the ones who make the cut, and that's true no matter the 
>> condition of the economy. The concern should not be the sheer number 
>> of people competing for the jobs you wish you had. It's what you've 
>> been doing to separate yourself from those numbers.
>>
>> Ashley,
>>
>> Right on about volunteering. I completed a year of AmeriCorps. During 
>> that year I pushed myself into areas outside of my responsibilities 
>> and learned a valuable skill that played a key role in landing my 
>> first real job. Anything you can do to fill your resume is viewed
> positively.
>> Minh,
>>
>> I don't agree with Tyler's points, but I can see where he's coming from.
>> Yet, it's exactly your mentality I can't process. This notion that we 
>> as blind people will always be at a disadvantage when compared to 
>> people who need no accommodations drives me crazy, because it assumes 
>> no matter what we do, we will always be viewed as second class 
>> citizens when compared to our sighted peers. An employer is not 
>> thinking about the state of the economy when she is looking to hire 
>> someone to fill a role. All she cares about is finding the right 
>> person to do the job she needs completed. We're going to need 
>> accommodations no matter the economy, so either we are competitive, 
>> or we are not. I don't buy the logic that somehow the dim economy 
>> makes
> things significantly worse for us.
>> Joe
>>
>>
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>
> --
> Take care,
> Ty
> http://tds-solutions.net
> He that will not reason is a bigot; he that cannot reason is a fool; 
> he that dares not reason is a slave.
>
>
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--
Take care,
Ty
http://tds-solutions.net
He that will not reason is a bigot; he that cannot reason is a fool; he that
dares not reason is a slave.