[nabs-l] Students with guide dogs

Suzanne Germano sgermano at asu.edu
Tue Sep 3 04:52:10 UTC 2013 

I did not know anyone can just train their own dog and call it a service
dog.

So I can train my dog to stop at curbs and other things that my dog from
Guide Dog for the Blind dog did and I can then have him legally be a
service dog?

Never knew this.


On Mon, Sep 2, 2013 at 7:04 PM, Littlefield, Tyler <tyler at tysdomain.com>wrote:

> You keep pushing this verification of service dogs like it's a solution to
> the fake service dogs issue. It might be one solution or maybe a partial
> solution, but what do you propose for owner-trained dogs? Those dogs, who
> by your account of what should be allowed and what shouldn't wouldn't be
> "properly trained" and certified?
> On 9/2/2013 10:00 PM, Suzanne Germano wrote:
>
>> What does well behaved dogs have to do with properly certified service
>> animals. I should not be able to take my German Shepherd into a store just
>> because he is well behaved and I am blind if he is not trained to be a
>> guide dog. I would love to bring my dogs everywhere but they are not
>> trained as guide dogs. I believe that service dogs should have to be
>> properly trained and certified by an agency otherwise everyone will just
>> bring pets into stores and claim they are service dogs.
>>
>> I have seen several dogs in stores recently with nothing on them
>> indicating
>> they are service animals but becausee they are small no one says anything.
>> I bet if I brought my shepherd into costco someone would say something
>> about it.
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Sep 2, 2013 at 12:39 PM, Julie McGinnity <kaybaycar at gmail.com
>> >wrote:
>>
>>  Hi all,
>>>
>>> First of all, though the issue of fake service dogs complicates
>>> things, it is not helpful to treat the guide dog school ID as an
>>> access card that will prove the legitimacy of our dogs.  I know plenty
>>> of owner trainers who have very well-behaved dogs.  They would not be
>>> able to prove that they got their guides from a school.  So then, what
>>> would happen?  They would be kicked out of establishments or forced to
>>> make their own IDs.  What would this accomplish?
>>>
>>> As for showing documentation to housing, dorms and other on campus
>>> housing are covered under the FHA(fair Housing Act).  Under FHA, it is
>>> illegal for a housing association of any kind to ask for health
>>> records on service dogs.  We could debate all day about whether or not
>>> this is a good idea.  Frankly, I can see both sides of it, at least
>>> for dorms.  But it doesn't matter because it is actually illegal.  So
>>> are pet deposits, size requirements, and of course, refusal of the
>>> service dog for any reason.  This covers public housing accomidations
>>> and depends on numbers.  Anyone renting a certain number of rooms,
>>> apartment complexes, and dorms are covered.
>>>
>>> I would also point out that it is the handeler's choice where to take
>>> a guide dog.  Noone can or should decide that for anyone else.  I, for
>>> example, will always take my current dog to convention, but I
>>> understand and respect those who choose not to do this.  It is also
>>> not up to anyone but the handeler to decide when to use the dog.  We
>>> guide dog users get a lot of opinions from others about when, how, and
>>> what to do with our dogs.  Yes, some of them are well-meaning, but
>>> much of the time they are uncalled for.
>>>
>>> I do agree that some guide dog users make a bad name for the rest of
>>> us.  But at the same time, every guide dog user makes a mistake.  I
>>> have had moments where I dropped the leash for a second, and my dog
>>> ran after another dog.  I got yelled at and deserved it.  We are only
>>> human and make mistakes and get distracted.  Remember that the next
>>> time you see a dog relieve itself in the hotel at convention.  My dog
>>> has never done this, but she has done other embarrassing things at
>>> convention.
>>>
>>> I think we need to give each other a little grace here.  It's time for
>>> the cane users to support the dog users and their rights to take
>>> charge over their own dogs.  (This goes for other dog users too.)  And
>>> it's also time for the dog users to stop worrying about the dog verses
>>> cane debate and use their dogs and canes when and how they want.  Yes,
>>> dog users still have to use canes some of the time.
>>>
>>> My last point I would like to make is that it is within the law for
>>> the owner of an establishment to refuse access to a dog who is dirty
>>> or otherwise disruptive to business. This is what a lot of people tend
>>> to forgot about the ADA.  So if a dog is not groomed and is not clean,
>>> the handeler will have other problems besides bothering people with
>>> allergies.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 9/1/13, Robin <robin-melvin at comcast.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I presume it is a health question because as I
>>>> recall the initial EMAIL post to this list was
>>>> wondering whether or not it is permissible under
>>>> the ADA guidelines for a college or university to
>>>> request  vaccination records of a service/guide dog.
>>>>
>>>> I presume it is NOT an ADA guideline issue. I
>>>> don't SEE the difference between requesting a
>>>> service/guide dog's vaccination records or a
>>>> students immunization records  especially with
>>>> all of the concern of contageous diseases  such
>>>> as the flu. They are, in my humble opinion, just
>>>> trying to be proactive to protect the
>>>> staff/student population, who regularly
>>>> attend/visit their campus of learning, and that
>>>> is what, in my EYES makes it a health concern/issue.
>>>>
>>>> Sent From Robin M.
>>>>
>>>> At 12:46 PM 8/31/2013, you wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> BS"D I only want to point out some things. It is
>>>>> not the dog's coat which gives the allergic
>>>>> reaction, it is the dog's saliva. The saliva
>>>>> consists of allergen which make some people
>>>>> sick. Actually, every dog owner carry allergen
>>>>> and therefore the dog is not the only problem
>>>>> for people with dog allergies. A dog who is well
>>>>> cared of, bathed and gromed do not cause more
>>>>> problems for a person with dog allergies then a
>>>>> dog owner in general does. Many persons with dog
>>>>> allergies can take medecins but for few people
>>>>> this do not work, for them it would be a problem
>>>>> to only meet a dog owner. I do not hope none
>>>>> take this personally but I only want to clear up
>>>>> things. I live in a country where the Allergic
>>>>> lobby has a very strong voice which makes it
>>>>> hard to live with a guide dog here. We get
>>>>> refused to enter shops, restaurants and
>>>>> universities because 'a person can get an
>>>>> allergic attack'. Okay, therefore this subject
>>>>> is close to my heart. I understand that it can
>>>>> be a problem for people with allergies but it is
>>>>> not my problem, my dog is well taken care of and
>>>>> she will not be upin  people faces. I really
>>>>> feel for Joshua and others, it must be difficult
>>>>> but I wish it would be more respectful
>>>>> especially in my own country where it sounds
>>>>> lile my dog would kill people with dog allergies
>>>>> which is not true. Kind regards, Mlle.
>>>>> Leye-Shprintse íberg Courriel :
>>>>> leyeshprintse at ymail.com Journal :
>>>>> http://leyeshprintse.blogspot.**com<http://leyeshprintse.blogspot.com>Envoyé de mon
>>>>> iPad Mini
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>>>
>>> --
>>> Julie McG
>>> National Association of Guide dog Users board member,  National
>>> Federation of the Blind performing arts division secretary,
>>> Missouri Association of Guide dog Users President,
>>> and Guiding Eyes for the Blind graduate 2008
>>> "For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that
>>> everyone who believes in him may not perish but may have eternal
>>> life."
>>> John 3:16
>>>
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>
>
> --
> Take care,
> Ty
> http://tds-solutions.net
> He that will not reason is a bigot; he that cannot reason is a fool; he
> that dares not reason is a slave.
>
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