[nabs-l] AP statistics

Mon Apr 28 16:50:43 UTC 2014

Hi Lillie,

I took AP stats back in 2008-2009, so I'm sure the course has changed
by now.  But I didn't have a graphing calculator, and I did well
without one.  I do remember that there were these AP Stats practice
materials from College Board that our class used, and I had those.

Some of the units were extremely nonvisual, and others did require
graphs and tables.  But the graphs aren't super complex, from what I
remember.  So you could probably describe them pretty easily.  I
remember AP stats being a lot of writing and interpreting and some
formulas.  I had to do a lot of studying, but for the most part,
accessing the visuals wasn't a huge concern.  I hope you have a
similar experience without having to study as much as I did.  :)

On 4/28/14, Phil <philso1003 at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Lillie,
> Echoing what Arielle said, you can go through a Stats course without
> using graphing function in graphing calculator. I didn't use it when I
> took my 3 Stats courses in college either.
> You might also want to ask your teacher what software if any is used?
> For example, in college intro Stats courses they sometimes use
> software called STATA and SPSS. There's also a software called SAS but
> highly unlikely to be used in AP Stat.
> Hope this helps a bit.
> Best,
> Phil
>
>
>
> On 4/27/14, Greg Aikens <gpaikens at gmail.com> wrote:
>> I agree. At this point you need to get your parents involved. I love to
>> hear
>> how you have advocated for yourself, but it sounds as though that avenue
>> has
>> been ineffective on several issues this year. The next step would be to
>> appeal to someone with more authority to advocate on your behalf, and
>> your
>> parents are the best choice.
>>
>> I am a TVI and unfortunately I also encounter the negative attitudes you
>> guys refer to among my colleagues. The best solution I can think of is to
>> have mor blind students go into this field. :)
>>
>> Best of luck with your advocacy effort.
>>
>> -Greg
>>
>> On Apr 25, 2014, at 4:33 PM, Arielle Silverman <arielle71 at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Lillie,
>>>
>>> I am a little confused about what your TVI is recommending. Does he
>>> think you should take trig instead, or that you shouldn't take the
>>> ACT? Either way I completely agree it is not his place to be
>>> questioning your choice of courses. He is not a guidance counselor,
>>> and even if he were, he is still bound to respect your informed
>>> decisions.
>>>
>>> My guess is that this guy has a power complex and that may be part of
>>> the reason he has decided to teach blind students. I do not think his
>>> actions are based on anything you have done in the past. You can
>>> certainly try talking to him, but I am not sure if it will be
>>> effective. It is great that your parents are supporting you because
>>> until you turn 18 they are primarily in charge of your education and
>>> can overrule anything your TVI does or at least can legally advocate
>>> on your behalf. I would strongly suggest having your mom or dad talk
>>> to your TVI about his actions and perhaps even request a meeting with
>>> you and he to discuss his actions. Your TVI may not have much respect
>>> for blind teens and may not listen to you but he is obligated to
>>> listen to your parents.
>>>
>>> Best,
>>> Arielle
>>>
>>> On 4/25/14, Lillie Pennington <lilliepennington at fuse.net> wrote:
>>>> Hi Arielle and all,
>>>>
>>>> I apologize for my horrible email responsive habits again. I met with
>>>> my
>>>> stats teacher today for next year. The meeting itself was good, and the
>>>> teacher seemed willing to work with me. She said that she rarely uses
>>>> excel
>>>> or hand graphs and instead uses a graphing calculator. She said she
>>>> would
>>>> send me a list of functions so that I could have the summer to work out
>>>> what
>>>> I needed to do.
>>>>
>>>> However, one thing that did not go well was my TVI. I apologize if I
>>>> need
>>>> to
>>>> start a new thread for this. While he did let me deal directly with my
>>>> teacher (which surprised me), when my teacher mentioned that there was
>>>> some
>>>> trig that would be on the ACT that I would need to know just as a sort
>>>> of
>>>> FYI thing to consider, my TVI kept bringing the conversation back to
>>>> the
>>>> ACT
>>>> and math in general, and if she thought I should switch out, although
>>>> she
>>>> had previously said that it was just a thing to consider. I thanked the
>>>> teacher for her concern and said that I had consulted with multiple
>>>> sources,
>>>> and although there was some trepidation it was not going to be a huge
>>>> gaping
>>>> concern to me in the long run. I had spoken to my TVI about this
>>>> beforehand
>>>> and he was not listening to me about the issue.
>>>> I walked out of a meeting that was supposed to turn out pretty good
>>>> feeling
>>>> very concerned and upset; not because of the class, but because of my
>>>> TVI's
>>>> actions. I respect and understand the fact that he has concerns, but he
>>>> is
>>>> addressing them in a way that isn't the best. He says stuff like "I
>>>> don't
>>>> think you can handle this" or "I don't think your parents know what you
>>>> are
>>>> doing." Although I have my parents entire support on this, he has not
>>>> contacted them about it. He tried to get my guidance counselor to
>>>> dissuade
>>>> me from taking AP classes, but my counselor sited with me. My parents
>>>> and
>>>> I
>>>> have agreed that I need to speak to him on Monday about how that was
>>>> probably not the best course of action to take on his part and how I
>>>> and
>>>> my
>>>> parents have made this decision and he needs to respect it.
>>>> His actions in this respect and his negative actions in general are
>>>> completely destroying what little confidence I had both in blindness
>>>> and
>>>> as
>>>> a person. I feel like I have no right to speak against him or that he
>>>> will
>>>> not take me seriously no matter how I phraise anything because no
>>>> matter
>>>> what I'm just a dumb blind teenager who knows absolutely nothing about
>>>> her
>>>> capabilities or about anything in general. There are incidents besides
>>>> this
>>>> one where I have felt like I was being questioned. I do not think I
>>>> have
>>>> done anything to make him question me like this.
>>>> He is completely destroying my confidence and I need to salvage what
>>>> little
>>>> I have left to make him stop treating me like this. I understand that
>>>> everyone has different ways of dealing with people, but I do not think
>>>> whether he knows it or not, he should not be aiming to destroy my
>>>> confidence
>>>> or make me feel like I have to prove something to him. I understand
>>>> that
>>>> not
>>>> all of this is his fault and through my actions I have probably done
>>>> something to earn this, but I would like to know what.
>>>> I apologize for complaining here, and I am not trying to get pitty. I
>>>> do
>>>> plan to talk to him on Monday so I can at least try to do something
>>>> constructive about the situation. He has done some good things, but the
>>>> bad
>>>> things overshadow the good things he has done.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Lillie
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle
>>>> Silverman
>>>> Sent: Saturday, April 19, 2014 12:10 AM
>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] AP statistics
>>>>
>>>> Hi Lillie,
>>>>
>>>> I don't know exact answers to most of your questions, but just wanted
>>>> to
>>>> let
>>>> you know that I've taken five statistics courses (including
>>>> graduate-level) without ever using a graphing calculator. While sighted
>>>> students might be expected to use a graphing calculator and the stats
>>>> functions on yours might be accessible, even if they are not, you can
>>>> definitely participate without using a graphing calculator. In fact, I
>>>> think
>>>> graphing is a very minor part of the course curriculum. That said, I
>>>> don't
>>>> know what the AP test looks like, and you might have to use a graphing
>>>> calculator on the test.
>>>> Sometimes the graphing requirements are altered for blind students, so
>>>> you
>>>> may want to find out what the regular test requires and then contact
>>>> the
>>>> college board to see if any inaccessible parts of the normal
>>>> requirements
>>>> are modified (I'm guessing your TVI may not be the best person to ask
>>>> based
>>>> on your other posts).
>>>>
>>>> If hand-graphing is required, I always just wrote out detailed
>>>> descriptions
>>>> of the graphs. Again, I don't think actually seeing the graph is
>>>> important
>>>> for understanding the underlying math and interpreting results. I just
>>>> did
>>>> it to appease the teacher's requirements on exams and such.
>>>> You can do most of the required calculations either in Excel or with a
>>>> web-based calculator at www.graphpad.com/quickcalcs/ Your teacher may
>>>> or
>>>> may
>>>> not know about GraphPad, but you might offer to use that instead of any
>>>> inaccessible software that's required.
>>>> Braille Note stats functions may also work, but it depends on whether
>>>> you're
>>>> expected to calculate basics like means and standard deviations by
>>>> calculator or by hand. In college stats we had to do it by hand, using
>>>> a
>>>> standard calculator to compute square roots and other basic math. I
>>>> used
>>>> JAWS to read me the data and then used my Braille Note calculator for
>>>> computations, and Excel will also work for that.
>>>>
>>>> Sorry I can't offer more help without knowing more details, but I'm
>>>> happy
>>>> to
>>>> consult when you have more specific questions.
>>>>
>>>> Best,
>>>> Arielle
>>>>
>>>> On 4/18/14, Lillie Pennington <lilliepennington at fuse.net> wrote:
>>>>> Hi Everyone
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I will be taking AP statistics next year. I am going to contact the
>>>>> teacher of the class next week, but I want to know what I am talking
>>>>> about before I have a meeting. If anyone has  taken this class,
>>>>> answering these questions would be very helpful. I am not sure how
>>>>> college stats classes work, but I'd think they would be similar.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 1.        Are graphing calculators needed? I have the TI84 from APH
>>>>> and
>>>>> used it this year. Are the statistical functions accessible?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 2.       Is excel used? Roughly what parts?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 3.       What about the statistical functions part of the Braille note
>>>>> calculator? Is this used? Again, what functions?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 4.       Roughly are there any new Nemeth symbols introduced?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 5.       Is there any reason I would have to hand-draw a graph at any
>>>> point
>>>>> if I have the calculator and excel available to me?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 6.       Are there parts of the course, minus inaccessible software,
>>>>> that
>>>>> are inaccessible?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>
>>>>
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-- 
Julie McG
National Association of Guide dog Users board member,  National
Federation of the Blind performing arts division secretary,
Missouri Association of Guide dog Users President,
and Guiding Eyes for the Blind graduate 2008
"For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that
everyone who believes in him may not perish but may have eternal
life."
John 3:16