[nabs-l] Independence and courtesy
justin williams
justin.williams2 at gmail.com
Fri Mar 7 04:31:49 UTC 2014
As much as I agree with you, sometimes we are doing an individual a service
if we allow them to be of service. Also, it is not always apparent that an
individual who offered me a seat wouldn't have done so for another. I
usually tend to think in your direction, but I have seen enough of the
opposite that I concede that joe has a point.
-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle
Silverman
Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2014 11:05 PM
To: jsoro620 at gmail.com; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Independence and courtesy
I'm all for people being nicer to each other and caring more about each
other. I would say it is a problem if people selectively offer us courtesies
they don't offer sighted people just because we are blind, just as I think
it is a problem if men offer me courtesies as a woman that they wouldn't
offer other men. To me selective courtesy is a form of discrimination. It
allows some people but not others to experience kindness, but more
importantly, it comes with some kind of assumption about why one group of
people is more deserving of that courtesy than another. Why does someone get
up on the bus so I can sit, when they wouldn't do that for a sighted
passenger? Because they have some assumption that I as a blind person need
the seat more than they.
Occasionally that may be true, but usually it's not.
And then there's times when people offer me unnecessary courtesies but then
neglect to provide help I really need. Case in point, the bus driver lowers
the bus entrance thinking I would have trouble climbing the step, but he
neglects to say which bus he's driving. A simple "how can I help you?" query
would have resolved that problem.
That's why I have no problem if people ask me whether or not I want some
form of assistance, because asking still leaves the power in my hands. It is
a problem to me if someone assumes I would appreciate their gesture without
asking.
I don't think it's about excessive independence or pride here. I think it's
about people wanting to be perceived as equals, whether that be women or
blind people, and selective courtesy interferes with that social goal.
Best,
Arielle
On 3/6/14, Joe <jsoro620 at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Arielle,
>
> My reference to courtesies really goes beyond blindness. I work in
> Washington DC where too many people rush about with little regard to
> basic niceties. Maybe it's the Texas boy in me coming out, but you get
> to a point where kind gestures are more the exception than the norm. I
> spent too many years building up my confidence for my independence to
> be challenged by someone asking if I would like a seat or help across
> the street or any number of gestures people think I could benefit
> from, and I too find myself behaving extra nice to people in
> wheelchairs, people with intellectual disabilities, and yes, women.
> No, I don't think women are at any kind of disadvantage, but the only
> thing that ever hurt a woman when a guy opened her car door, or the
> front door or pulled out a chair for her at a restaurant was her
> pride. The notion that I should feel inferior because someone was nice
> toward me makes no sense to me. It's not the gestures we should fear. It's
when the gestures stop that we should truly worry.
>
> --
> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
>
> Visit my blog:
> http://joeorozco.com/blog
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Arielle
> Silverman
> Sent: Wednesday, March 05, 2014 9:56 PM
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: [nabs-l] Independence and courtesy
>
> Hi Joe,
>
> I liked your blog post for the most part, but there was something in
> there that puzzled me, as it sounded like a bit of a contradiction.
> You say that you'd like it if people offered you front seats on the
> bus because you are blind, yet admit that you would turn the offer
> down. You also make a statement to the effect that if you were sighted
> you would offer such special treatment to a blind person.
> I question, What is the logic behind advocating special courtesies for
> blind people that aren't extended to the sighted? Why should a blind
> person be offered preferential seating or a discount as a courtesy
> that is not offered to everyone else? Am I missing something? Is
> receiving a seat near the door something that addresses
> blindness-related needs? Perhaps it is something about being a guide
> dog traveler?
> While I sometimes take the seat near the door on a bus, it's usually
> because I don't want to hold up the bus while I search for a back
> seat. If someone wants to be courteous, I'd rather them verbally point
> out empty seats to me rather than giving up their seats for me.
> Nor do I expect a man to give me a seat because I am female. In fact,
> I'd find such treatment insulting.
>
> I appreciate when people offer me courtesies that they would offer
> anyone, such as holding the door open. I also like it when people
> offer courtesies that address my access needs, like describing visual
> things to me. I don't like it when people presume needs I don't have,
> such as presuming I can't stand on a crowded bus. If people have
> questions about how far my blindness affects my abilities, I'd rather
> they ask than assume. I don't consider such assumptions about my
> preferences based on my blindness, or my gender for that matter, to be
> courtesies.
>
> Best,
> Arielle
>
> On 3/5/14, Anjelina <anjelinac26 at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Arielle,
>> I hope you are archiving your wisdom for a book in the near future! I
>> can't add much to your well-written message except I went through
>> similar experiences. In my IEP had goals like I had to talk to so
>> many people a day since I was a more interverted person.
>> Social skills are wonderful and helpful, but real authentic
>> friendships which are meaningful friendships are most important.
>>
>>
>> -Anjelina
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>>> On Mar 5, 2014, at 12:22 AM, Arielle Silverman <arielle71 at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> OK. Since it was brought up here, I feel compelled to share some of
>>> my experiences and controversial views on how blind people should
>>> learn social skills. Some of you have heard this rant before in
>>> part, but I think it is important enough to bear repeating every few
years.
>>> I guess I'm also curious if any of you have had similar experiences
>>> growing up or if the things I am about to advocate make any sense to
>>> others besides me.
>>>
>>> I have been blind my whole life and I was always an introverted
>>> person. As a child I had few close friends, read a lot by myself.
>>> When I did hang out with kids my age I tended to be bossy and want
>>> to control what we were doing. When adults came into my house and
>>> tried to interact with me in ways I thought were childish or silly,
>>> I would go to my room and read. I never was one for a lot of
>>> physical affection, hugging, touching etc.
>>> When I was growing up it was assumed that all my undesirable traits
>>> linked back to my blindness. So it was assumed that because of my
>>> blindness I had poor social skills. There were goals on my IEP
>>> throughout elementary and middle school that dealt with my social
>>> skills and my TVI was tasked with evaluating my progress. For
>>> example, in elementary school I would get graded on goals like
>>> "Shows interest in other children" or "asks others about their day".
>>> In middle school, one goal on my IEP was "compliments others when
>>> she likes
> something".
>>> I am not even slightly joking. My TVI would ask me every day to tell
>>> her how many people I had complimented that day and she wrote it
>>> down on her clipboard. The number of compliments I gave was expected
>>> to increase over time. Since I was usually a good student and I
>>> liked and respected this teacher a lot, I tried my hardest to give
>>> her a good compliment report every day, by contriving situations
>>> where I could compliment my family and classmates. I still don't
>>> understand what this had to do with my blindness. If I complimented
>>> people less than my parents or teachers expected it was because that
>>> just wasn't a big part of how I liked to interact with people. Had I
>>> been sighted, I wouldn't have been graded on such a silly thing. She
>>> also read me passages from a social skills book as a way to teach me
>>> social
> skills.
>>> Eventually my TVI and I discussed this and she told me that my
>>> parents had really expected her to do these things and she did even
>>> though she knew they were ridiculous.
>>> When people in the blindness world talk about social skills, it
>>> seems they're usually referring to two things: skills at winning
>>> friends and influencing people (charisma, likability, popularity) or
>>> following social conventions like being places on time, attempting
>>> eye contact, etc. (what Jedi refers to as "blending in"). By the
>>> first set of criteria, winning friends and influencing people, Adolf
>>> Hitler had wonderful social skills. I think there are other social
>>> skills that are much more important for having lasting relationships:
>>> things like sharing, helping others in need, being sensitive to
>>> other people's feelings, respecting other people's opinions, not
>>> holding
> grudges.
>>> There are many sighted politicians who have absolutely terrible
>>> social skills by these criteria! These are all things that blind
>>> people can learn just as well as sighted people by listening to
>>> other people's conversations, talking about issues going on in the
>>> world, and actually being a part of close relationships. I think the
>>> most social skills I ever learned was by becoming friends with blind
>>> people who were willing to be blunt and tell me if I was doing
>>> something obnoxious. There is a lot we can learn about social
>>> interaction just by listening, talking and sharing with others.
>>> Reading about this stuff in a book, or being required to engage in
>>> artificial interactions with others, doesn't help build these social
>>> skills in the long term. Role-playing social interactions doesn't
>>> help when you're out in the real world and the thing you practiced
>>> feels really awkward and fake.
>>> On blending in, I do think there are certain nonverbal things that
>>> congenitally blind people should be explicitly told about so we can
>>> make informed decisions about whether or not we want to blend in.
>>> For example, of course blind folks should be told about which colors
>>> people usually wear together or what kind of clothing is appropriate
>>> for a job interview vs. the movies. But then, we still have the
>>> right to choose to blend in or not. So often it seems that blind
>>> folks are labeled as having poor social skills when the fact is that
>>> they've learned what is "appropriate" but chosen not to follow these
>>> norms for whatever reason.
>>> I realize now that my parents and teachers were unfortunately using
>>> blindness and the IEP system to try to change who I fundamentally
>>> was--to turn me into an extroverted, gregarious, charismatic person.
>>> It took a long time for me to realize that I was OK being myself,
>>> and that I was just reared in an environment where I didn't quite
belong.
>>> Although I don't have tons of friends, I have great relationships
>>> with the friends I do have, a loving husband and co-workers who
>>> respect me, and I try to be the best person I can. Most of the
>>> things I learned to get me to this place came from my firsthand
>>> experiences making friends, my real discussions with others and a
>>> lot of
> trial and error.
>>> I don't think I missed out on the process because I am blind, but I
>>> also don't think the attempts to teach me social skills from a
>>> textbook were either effective or necessary.
>>> In closing, I hope that any good blindness center would support
>>> students in developing social skills--by giving them opportunities
>>> to make friends and have real social encounters--instead of
>>> indoctrinating them with lessons based on a narrow definition of
>>> social competence.
>>>
>>> Best,
>>> Arielle
>>>
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