From shawnabraham21 at gmail.com  Sun Mar  1 20:42:41 2015
From: shawnabraham21 at gmail.com (Shawn Abraham)
Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2015 15:42:41 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Google sketchup accessible?
Message-ID: <54f379cd.8250e00a.6474.5b7f@mx.google.com>

Hi all,
I'm taking a Foundations of Tech class this year, and we are now 
using Goegle sketchup, a three-demensional model drawing tool.  
Does anyone know if this is accessible, though I don't think so, 
or of any similar pregrams that might be accessible? With the 
program, you can, for example, make a house or other object and 
then view it from all angles.
Thanks if you can help!


From clb5590 at gmail.com  Sun Mar  1 22:09:33 2015
From: clb5590 at gmail.com (Cindy)
Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2015 14:09:33 -0800
Subject: [nabs-l] Google sketchup accessible?
In-Reply-To: <54f379cd.8250e00a.6474.5b7f@mx.google.com>
References: <54f379cd.8250e00a.6474.5b7f@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <0B1CBBC3-2939-4F09-9B6A-EB0146AA6A13@gmail.com>

Hi Shawn, there are a couple of technology oriented listservs that I would recommend. One is the computer science list and it can be found at the same website you went to to join this list. wWW.nfbnet.org. There's also a list program-L, but is not affiliated with NFB but has a lot of traffic in a lot more expertise on Computer science accessibility. I personally have never used that software. I have heard that open CAD has a text edit version where you use math equations and text to describe the 3-D object you want to build. It seems that you would have to have more of an expertise in math to be able to do this instead of just being able to draw and let the program figure it out.

Cindy Bennett
1st Year Ph.D. Student, Human Centered Design and Engineering
University of Washington

clb5590 at gmail.com

Treasurer of the national Federation of the blind of Washington, an affiliate of the national Federation of the blind.

> On Mar 1, 2015, at 12:42 PM, Shawn Abraham via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> I'm taking a Foundations of Tech class this year, and we are now using Goegle sketchup, a three-demensional model drawing tool.  Does anyone know if this is accessible, though I don't think so, or of any similar pregrams that might be accessible? With the program, you can, for example, make a house or other object and then view it from all angles.
> Thanks if you can help!
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.com

From clb5590 at gmail.com  Sun Mar  1 22:09:33 2015
From: clb5590 at gmail.com (Cindy)
Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2015 14:09:33 -0800
Subject: [nabs-l] Google sketchup accessible?
In-Reply-To: <54f379cd.8250e00a.6474.5b7f@mx.google.com>
References: <54f379cd.8250e00a.6474.5b7f@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <0B1CBBC3-2939-4F09-9B6A-EB0146AA6A13@gmail.com>

Hi Shawn, there are a couple of technology oriented listservs that I would recommend. One is the computer science list and it can be found at the same website you went to to join this list. wWW.nfbnet.org. There's also a list program-L, but is not affiliated with NFB but has a lot of traffic in a lot more expertise on Computer science accessibility. I personally have never used that software. I have heard that open CAD has a text edit version where you use math equations and text to describe the 3-D object you want to build. It seems that you would have to have more of an expertise in math to be able to do this instead of just being able to draw and let the program figure it out.

Cindy Bennett
1st Year Ph.D. Student, Human Centered Design and Engineering
University of Washington

clb5590 at gmail.com

Treasurer of the national Federation of the blind of Washington, an affiliate of the national Federation of the blind.

> On Mar 1, 2015, at 12:42 PM, Shawn Abraham via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> I'm taking a Foundations of Tech class this year, and we are now using Goegle sketchup, a three-demensional model drawing tool.  Does anyone know if this is accessible, though I don't think so, or of any similar pregrams that might be accessible? With the program, you can, for example, make a house or other object and then view it from all angles.
> Thanks if you can help!
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.com

From arielle71 at gmail.com  Sun Mar  1 23:30:54 2015
From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman)
Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2015 15:30:54 -0800
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS List Guidelines
In-Reply-To: <CALAYQJDgeL+L5abnQ-Vc+=oyirBjErkHrMMv_U_NpSna7EHhRw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALAYQJDgeL+L5abnQ-Vc+=oyirBjErkHrMMv_U_NpSna7EHhRw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CALAYQJDNp1Z5PFeQ3cJzvTURRzs+G2wdPBuRmfG+csW4X9bPTQ@mail.gmail.com>

NABS List Guidelines

1.	 Be respectful.
A. This Listserv is a great forum in which we can all express our
opinions. Sometimes we will disagree. However, when responding to a
post, always be respectful. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and
personal attacks and  degrading comments will not be tolerated.
B. All posts must be appropriate for a wide audience, including
readers younger than 18 years old. Profanity and sexual content will
not be allowed.
C. Remember that all list messages appear on a public archive. Please
respect other people’s privacy by not posting details about their
lives or experiences. Even if you post about somebody without using
their name, their identity can be discovered. Also remember that if
you post your phone number on list, others could access it via a
Google search.

2.	Reducing List Clutter
A. Please stay on topic. This list is about blindness and issues
related to being a blind student or job-seeker. Posts about religion
or politics, advertisements, queries asking to add list members on
social media, or any other posts unrelated to blindness are not
allowed, as they create too much list clutter unrelated to the list
purpose. The exception is that advertisements for blindness programs
and announcements about blindness-related research projects are
permitted. The moderators and NABS board reserve the right to close
down any discussion that is off-topic.
B.	Please respect readers’ time by consolidating your ideas into one
or two messages per day instead of posting many short replies to a
topic. Rule of thumb is to post in a way to further the conversation,
instead of just saying “I agree”.
C.	When you would like to write someone off list or offer to connect
with someone by Skype or social media, do so privately. You do not
have to write one liners to every person you’d like to email off list.
If you develop a conversation with that person, that’s great, if they
feel they do not want to respond that is their right too.
D.	If an off-topic message appears on the list, please do not respond
to it. Instead, please either delete it or forward it to a list
moderator. Single off-topic messages create much less clutter than
long threads debating whether or not the initial post is appropriate
for the list.
If you send a message the moderators feel is off-topic, you will
receive an off-list request not to send any more messages of this
kind. If you disagree with the moderator’s ruling, feel free to reply
and make your case, and we will be more than happy to listen. But the
list committee has final authority regarding what is and is not
appropriate for the list. Repeated violations of the guidelines could
result in disciplinary action from the list owner, including list
removal.


From nihal_erkan at hotmail.com  Mon Mar  2 13:29:09 2015
From: nihal_erkan at hotmail.com (Nihal Erkan)
Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2015 08:29:09 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Looking for a roommate in national convention.
Message-ID: <DUB408-EAS210DCD5CDBCEF05673803A81100@phx.gbl>

Hello everyone,

One of the students is looking for a roommate in national convention. She is from New York and trying to find a female roommate.if anyyou

  Interested, or you know someone who has the same situation, please email me from my personal email which is
nihal_erkan at hotmail.com 

Thank you, Nihal.Sent from my iPhone

From cnusbaumnfb at gmail.com  Tue Mar  3 01:19:15 2015
From: cnusbaumnfb at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum)
Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2015 20:19:15 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] A Question for State Student Division Leaders
Message-ID: <018a01d05550$120fbbb0$362f3310$@gmail.com>

Fellow NABSters,

 

We in the Maryland Association of Blind Students are currently going through
a time of transition. Along with a new President, many new Board members and
a new focus on membership building to coincide with our 75th year, the MDABS
Board is considering the idea of drafting a new Constitution. Due to a lack
of organization on the part of previous Boards, our current Constitution
appears to be lost. It is not even in the records of our state affiliate. To
create a clear Constitution which can be easily referenced and to make some
necessary updates to the limited written rules we do have, we on the Board
find it necessary to start from scratch and write a new document. However,
since none of us were involved in the writing of the first Constitution, we
don't have any experience in this matter. This is where you come in.

 

As someone who is involved in the initial drafting of the new Constitution,
I would like to see a good working Constitution from another state student
division which we could use as a model. Would any of you who are leaders of
state student divisions have a particularly good Constitution which you
believe could be used as a model from which another division could work?
Perhaps you could point me to a resource where I could find such a document?
I would appreciate any feedback you could provide on this matter. Please
feel free to contact me off-list if you would like. My phone number and
email address are in my signature-calls, texts and emails are welcome. Thank
you in advance for any help you can provide.

 

Thanks,

 

Chris Nusbaum, Vice President

Maryland Association of Blind Students

A Division of the National Federation of the Blind of Maryland

Phone: (443) 547-2409

Email: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com

Twitter: @Chrisn98 and @NFBMD

 

The National Federation of the Blind knows that blindness is not the
characteristic that defines you or your future. Every day we raise the
expectations for blind people, because low expectations create obstacles
between blind people and our dreams. You can live the life you want;
blindness is not what holds you back.

 


From cnusbaumnfb at gmail.com  Tue Mar  3 01:30:11 2015
From: cnusbaumnfb at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum)
Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2015 20:30:11 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Google sketchup accessible?
In-Reply-To: <54f379cd.8250e00a.6474.5b7f@mx.google.com>
References: <54f379cd.8250e00a.6474.5b7f@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <01da01d05551$99088a10$cb199e30$@gmail.com>

Sean,

I just took Foundations of Tech last semester and we used a similar program.
I have not heard of or played with any accessible CAD drawing program.
Moreover, I would imagine that CADs wouldn't be accessible because they're
based primarily on images which would be unreadable for a screen reader. In
my FOT class, however, the vast majority of projects were done in groups of
two at the very least, whether we were using a CAD or not. Since the CAD
programs we were using were inaccessible and JAWS wasn't installed on any of
the classroom computers, I left the computer stuff to my partner(s) and
provided ideas on improving our design, asking my partner(s) to describe
what they saw after adding my idea to the CAD drawing. This is certainly not
ideal, but it was a workaround which worked for me.

HTH,

Chris

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Shawn Abraham
via nabs-l
Sent: Sunday, March 01, 2015 3:43 PM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: [nabs-l] Google sketchup accessible?

Hi all,
I'm taking a Foundations of Tech class this year, and we are now using
Goegle sketchup, a three-demensional model drawing tool.  
Does anyone know if this is accessible, though I don't think so, or of any
similar pregrams that might be accessible? With the program, you can, for
example, make a house or other object and then view it from all angles.
Thanks if you can help!

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/cnusbaumnfb%40gmail.com



From cnusbaumnfb at gmail.com  Tue Mar  3 01:39:45 2015
From: cnusbaumnfb at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum)
Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2015 20:39:45 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Deleting an App from my IPad
In-Reply-To: <54f10f3e.b35f8c0a.68fb.5e60@mx.google.com>
References: <54f10f3e.b35f8c0a.68fb.5e60@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <01e101d05552$ee195060$ca4bf120$@gmail.com>

Roanna,

To delete an app, first scroll to the app you want to delete on your home
screen. Then double tap and hold. You will hear the standard VO sound for
this gesture, then VoiceOver will say "moving" followed by the name of the
app. Once you have heard this, release your finger and double tap again. You
will then get an alert confirming your desire to delete the app. Double tap
the delete button and the app will be deleted. Please note that you will
still be in "editing" mode after this, so you will have to press the home
button to return to your normal home screen.

HTH,

Chris

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Roanna Bacchus
via nabs-l
Sent: Friday, February 27, 2015 7:43 PM
To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
Subject: [nabs-l] Deleting an App from my IPad

Can anyone tell me how to delete apps on my IPad? I have a few of them that
I want to get rid of.

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/cnusbaumnfb%40gmail.com



From cnusbaumnfb at gmail.com  Tue Mar  3 01:43:42 2015
From: cnusbaumnfb at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum)
Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2015 20:43:42 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] My first day of volunteering
In-Reply-To: <54ef4845.43968c0a.514f.4a4c@mx.google.com>
References: <54ef4845.43968c0a.514f.4a4c@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <01e301d05553$7b8e3c30$72aab490$@gmail.com>

Volunteering is a great step to building confidence and cultivating
leadership skills, IMO. Congratulations to you!

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Roanna Bacchus
via nabs-l
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2015 11:22 AM
To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
Subject: [nabs-l] My first day of volunteering

Dear Students,

Yesterday was the fin day of what will be probably be my future job after
graduation.  I am a vorlunteer at the Center for Distributed Learning at
UCF.  It is located in the UCF library.  
This is the department that ensures the accessibility of online courses
before they are published each semester.  I will post weekly updates about
my experiences on Mondays and Wednesdays during my time there.

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/cnusbaumnfb%40gmail.com



From kathrynwebster.nfb at gmail.com  Tue Mar  3 01:51:07 2015
From: kathrynwebster.nfb at gmail.com (Kathryn Webster)
Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2015 20:51:07 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] A Question for State Student Division Leaders
In-Reply-To: <018a01d05550$120fbbb0$362f3310$@gmail.com>
References: <018a01d05550$120fbbb0$362f3310$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <92A5B243-9783-4C47-A86B-DDAB37965B14@gmail.com>

Chris and all,
	As President of the North Carolina student division, I am quite satisfied with our current version of the Constitution. Please feel free to review it, and reach out with any questions. The layout of your officers may be different, but those are slight shifts in verbiage.
Attached, you will find the Constitution.
Hope this helps!
Kathryn

Kathryn
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 C. Webster
Board Member | National Federation of the Blind of Connecticut
President | North Carolina Association of Blind Students
Treasurer | Connecticut Association of Blind Students
Board Member | The Science and Engineering Division
(Coordinator | Connecticut BELL Program
Executive Editor | The Federationist Newsletter
203) 273-8463
kathrynwebster.nfb at gmail.com

On Mar 2, 2015, at 8:19 PM, Chris Nusbaum via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:

> Fellow NABSters,
> 
> 
> 
> We in the Maryland Association of Blind Students are currently going through
> a time of transition. Along with a new President, many new Board members and
> a new focus on membership building to coincide with our 75th year, the MDABS
> Board is considering the idea of drafting a new Constitution. Due to a lack
> of organization on the part of previous Boards, our current Constitution
> appears to be lost. It is not even in the records of our state affiliate. To
> create a clear Constitution which can be easily referenced and to make some
> necessary updates to the limited written rules we do have, we on the Board
> find it necessary to start from scratch and write a new document. However,
> since none of us were involved in the writing of the first Constitution, we
> don't have any experience in this matter. This is where you come in.
> 
> 
> 
> As someone who is involved in the initial drafting of the new Constitution,
> I would like to see a good working Constitution from another state student
> division which we could use as a model. Would any of you who are leaders of
> state student divisions have a particularly good Constitution which you
> believe could be used as a model from which another division could work?
> Perhaps you could point me to a resource where I could find such a document?
> I would appreciate any feedback you could provide on this matter. Please
> feel free to contact me off-list if you would like. My phone number and
> email address are in my signature-calls, texts and emails are welcome. Thank
> you in advance for any help you can provide.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> 
> 
> Chris Nusbaum, Vice President
> 
> Maryland Association of Blind Students
> 
> A Division of the National Federation of the Blind of Maryland
> 
> Phone: (443) 547-2409
> 
> Email: dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com
> 
> Twitter: @Chrisn98 and @NFBMD
> 
> 
> 
> The National Federation of the Blind knows that blindness is not the
> characteristic that defines you or your future. Every day we raise the
> expectations for blind people, because low expectations create obstacles
> between blind people and our dreams. You can live the life you want;
> blindness is not what holds you back.
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kathrynwebster.nfb%40gmail.com


From chris.omeally at gmail.com  Tue Mar  3 14:30:09 2015
From: chris.omeally at gmail.com (Christopher O'meally)
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2015 09:30:09 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Deleting an App from my IPad
In-Reply-To: <01e101d05552$ee195060$ca4bf120$@gmail.com>
References: <54f10f3e.b35f8c0a.68fb.5e60@mx.google.com>
	<01e101d05552$ee195060$ca4bf120$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACOe-GVhwcxe4kS2-orYiHkp1p-EzWC6YBX1MkW9FNa3Cdtygg@mail.gmail.com>

Follow these steps to remove an application

First, locate the application you want to remove.
Next, you want to perform a one finger double tap, but instead of
letting go on the second tap, , hold it down.  so its like tap tap
hold.
Hold your finger down until you hear a chime, and voice over should say editing.
Now all you have to do is double tap on the app, and a dialog should
pop up on your screen asking you if you would like to remov ethe app.
choose okay and you are all done.

Note, you can not do this with applications built into IOS, such as
messages, phone, and music.  feel free to contact me with any other
questions.

On 3/2/15, Chris Nusbaum via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Roanna,
>
> To delete an app, first scroll to the app you want to delete on your home
> screen. Then double tap and hold. You will hear the standard VO sound for
> this gesture, then VoiceOver will say "moving" followed by the name of the
> app. Once you have heard this, release your finger and double tap again.
> You
> will then get an alert confirming your desire to delete the app. Double tap
> the delete button and the app will be deleted. Please note that you will
> still be in "editing" mode after this, so you will have to press the home
> button to return to your normal home screen.
>
> HTH,
>
> Chris
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Roanna Bacchus
> via nabs-l
> Sent: Friday, February 27, 2015 7:43 PM
> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> Subject: [nabs-l] Deleting an App from my IPad
>
> Can anyone tell me how to delete apps on my IPad? I have a few of them that
> I want to get rid of.
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/cnusbaumnfb%40gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/chris.omeally%40gmail.com
>


From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com  Tue Mar  3 14:52:12 2015
From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton)
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2015 09:52:12 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] A Question for State Student Division Leaders
In-Reply-To: <92A5B243-9783-4C47-A86B-DDAB37965B14@gmail.com>
References: <018a01d05550$120fbbb0$362f3310$@gmail.com>
	<92A5B243-9783-4C47-A86B-DDAB37965B14@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAFja7FZJ1dc4TfyEg-Rhz7-FsqfTtHh5XzqcAV+d5cJiVBb8qQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi, Chris,

I would be happy to send a copy of Ohio's constitution as well (though
I cannot do it at the present time writing from a phone).  It is in
good parliamentary order and was updated fairly recently at our most
recent state convention.  Feel free to contact me if you would be
interested in seeing another constitution and I will be happy to send
it.

On 3/2/15, Kathryn Webster via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Chris and all,
> 	As President of the North Carolina student division, I am quite satisfied
> with our current version of the Constitution. Please feel free to review it,
> and reach out with any questions. The layout of your officers may be
> different, but those are slight shifts in verbiage.
> Attached, you will find the Constitution.
> Hope this helps!
> Kathryn
>
> Kathryn


-- 
Kaiti


From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com  Tue Mar  3 14:56:11 2015
From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton)
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2015 09:56:11 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] A Question for State Student Division Leaders
In-Reply-To: <CAFja7FZJ1dc4TfyEg-Rhz7-FsqfTtHh5XzqcAV+d5cJiVBb8qQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <018a01d05550$120fbbb0$362f3310$@gmail.com>
	<92A5B243-9783-4C47-A86B-DDAB37965B14@gmail.com>
	<CAFja7FZJ1dc4TfyEg-Rhz7-FsqfTtHh5XzqcAV+d5cJiVBb8qQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAFja7FYPaB5V+psN8nS=8agWJBh9-PPOfS6JXM-ASuSfnOmQYg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi again,

You may also check out the constitution for the Ohio Association of
Blind Students on our recently developed web site:
ohioblindstudents.org.  While there are a few finishing touches like
board member bios which still need to be added, the web site is nearly
complete and has a copy of our updated constitution on the "about"
page.

On 3/3/15, Kaiti Shelton <crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi, Chris,
>
> I would be happy to send a copy of Ohio's constitution as well (though
> I cannot do it at the present time writing from a phone).  It is in
> good parliamentary order and was updated fairly recently at our most
> recent state convention.  Feel free to contact me if you would be
> interested in seeing another constitution and I will be happy to send
> it.
>
> On 3/2/15, Kathryn Webster via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> Chris and all,
>> 	As President of the North Carolina student division, I am quite
>> satisfied
>> with our current version of the Constitution. Please feel free to review
>> it,
>> and reach out with any questions. The layout of your officers may be
>> different, but those are slight shifts in verbiage.
>> Attached, you will find the Constitution.
>> Hope this helps!
>> Kathryn
>>
>> Kathryn
>
>
> --
> Kaiti
>


-- 
Kaiti


From annajee82 at gmail.com  Tue Mar  3 19:36:12 2015
From: annajee82 at gmail.com (Anna Givens)
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2015 12:36:12 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Spanish with JAWS
Message-ID: <97EDBF98-9BBA-4321-B5D1-9EAE70987306@gmail.com>

I am taking a Spanish class in college.  I have JAWS 15 and MS Word 2010.  I know you can change the language and/or have it detect a language in MS Word and I know you can change the language in JAWS.  
I get my textbook chapters in Word format from the disability office at my school.  
The chapters have a lot of English interspersed within the Spanish text. 
I really need help figuring out how to deal with that.  I have tried changing both JAWS and MS Word settings to Spanish.  I have also tried just changing it in one program or the other. I have also tried not having the language changed at all in any program.  It seems that no matter what I do, JAWS inevitably reads things wrong. It will sometimes read Spanish in an English pronunciation or read English in a Spanish pronunciation.  When it does that, I cannot understand what it's saying at all.  Sometimes it does read it in the right language.  But I cannot figure out how it is deciding which language to read it in.
So basically I need help figuring out how to read a document that is two different languages.
Any help would be much appreciated.

Anna E Givens

From nora.goldberg6 at gmail.com  Tue Mar  3 22:30:26 2015
From: nora.goldberg6 at gmail.com (Nora Goldberg)
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2015 17:30:26 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Questions for Students
Message-ID: <CAEhZ6UmLXbdpBe2EQYW7uYxoYKyxjXZWVQKi5+SNWCkHdtWjmA@mail.gmail.com>

Dear Student Listers,

I am a college student in Philadelphia and I am taking an Ethnographic
Methods class.  My project for the class focuses on the blind community,
and I have some questions about individual hobbies, about your experience
as a student, about career aspirations, etcetera. I have put together a
survey and I would love to get as many respondents to take it as possible.

If you would prefer to private message me, you can reach me at
neg39 at drexel.edu.

Thank you so much!  I appreciate your assistance.

Sincerely,

Nora E. Goldberg

From jim.hulme at gmail.com  Wed Mar  4 02:08:45 2015
From: jim.hulme at gmail.com (James Hulme)
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2015 21:08:45 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Spanish with JAWS
In-Reply-To: <97EDBF98-9BBA-4321-B5D1-9EAE70987306@gmail.com>
References: <97EDBF98-9BBA-4321-B5D1-9EAE70987306@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAKMC2e6uaL+HnZ8Hm8RDOkMptR0OFGTBM_tG-ah4xs685yVEWw@mail.gmail.com>

Hello Anna,

I do not use JAWS 15, I do translate both English and Spanish documents.


I was wondering if this Free Webinar from Freedom Scientific would help
answer a great deal of your question. Please open the link below in a new
window.

New in JAWS 15 Webinar
<http://www.freedomscientific.com/Services/TrainingAndCertification/WebinarDetail/F0084>

After searching Google I found,

or perhaps they can answer your question: Please thank Adam Rushforth for
this one.
39 secs. long audio clip here....

BlindHow answer for question by Adam R.
<http://blindhow.com/posts/758#content>



It sounds like you would need either to switch voices or change your
settings to read Spanish.

If it is a textbook issue with languages you could contact the publisher to
see whether there is an E-book or if the book is available on Amazon, buy
the textbook with audio narration or see if text-to-speech or audio is
available for purchase as an option with the textbook itself.

If this is just a single document I would be happy enough to do the Spanish
translation for you.

Hope that helps

Please send me back a response off-list  to jim.hulme at gmail.com

Jimmy Hulme
Member of National Federation of the Blind of New Jersey At-Large Chapter
and the NFBNJ Technology Division
jim.hulme at gmail.com
@JimHulmeLookout on Twitter



On Tue, Mar 3, 2015 at 2:36 PM, Anna Givens via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
wrote:

> I am taking a Spanish class in college.  I have JAWS 15 and MS Word 2010.
> I know you can change the language and/or have it detect a language in MS
> Word and I know you can change the language in JAWS.
> I get my textbook chapters in Word format from the disability office at my
> school.
> The chapters have a lot of English interspersed within the Spanish text.
> I really need help figuring out how to deal with that.  I have tried
> changing both JAWS and MS Word settings to Spanish.  I have also tried just
> changing it in one program or the other. I have also tried not having the
> language changed at all in any program.  It seems that no matter what I do,
> JAWS inevitably reads things wrong. It will sometimes read Spanish in an
> English pronunciation or read English in a Spanish pronunciation.  When it
> does that, I cannot understand what it's saying at all.  Sometimes it does
> read it in the right language.  But I cannot figure out how it is deciding
> which language to read it in.
> So basically I need help figuring out how to read a document that is two
> different languages.
> Any help would be much appreciated.
>
> Anna E Givens
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jim.hulme%40gmail.com
>

From philso1003 at gmail.com  Wed Mar  4 08:58:17 2015
From: philso1003 at gmail.com (Phil)
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2015 03:58:17 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay for online
	education?
Message-ID: <CAO2euMf=b33Vy6pbaM6Eg2k7+TmPLX-fq97cB0LgYLJFBTRgig@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all,

I'm doing a research project on blind students taking online education
and online training. Would you be so kind to advise me if your state's
DVR / Commission for the Blind pays for online education and online
training, just like bric-and-mortar education?
What about vocational training through online methods, such as
learning JAWS, ZoomText, Excel, Word online?
And separately, have you taken any online educationor online training?
What was your experience like? Did you find it rewarding?
Look forward to hearing your views on this.
Thanks a lot for sharing!

Best,
Phil


From theweird1 at mediacombb.net  Wed Mar  4 19:16:04 2015
From: theweird1 at mediacombb.net (Loren Wakefield)
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2015 13:16:04 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay for
	online	education?
In-Reply-To: <CAO2euMf=b33Vy6pbaM6Eg2k7+TmPLX-fq97cB0LgYLJFBTRgig@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAO2euMf=b33Vy6pbaM6Eg2k7+TmPLX-fq97cB0LgYLJFBTRgig@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <003401d056af$a9362d70$fba28850$@mediacombb.net>

Hi,  I can tell you that the department for the blind here in Iowa, refused
to pay for my online pursuit of a degree.  This is so even though the
projected years to obtain the degree online would have cost less than 80
percent of one year at a school here in the area.  They thought that the
only way to obtain the degree is to be out in the public and negotiating a
brick and mortor facility.  I have already obtained a b.a. and MAE from
actual campuses.  I would be glad to talk more about this with you when it
is conveninent for you.  You can reach me via email at:
theweird1 at mediacombb.net  or my cell is 515-829-9330.  Good luck with your
research.  

Loren Wakefield 



-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Phil via nabs-l
Sent: Wednesday, March 04, 2015 2:58 AM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay for online
education?

Hi all,

I'm doing a research project on blind students taking online education and
online training. Would you be so kind to advise me if your state's DVR /
Commission for the Blind pays for online education and online training, just
like bric-and-mortar education?
What about vocational training through online methods, such as learning
JAWS, ZoomText, Excel, Word online?
And separately, have you taken any online educationor online training?
What was your experience like? Did you find it rewarding?
Look forward to hearing your views on this.
Thanks a lot for sharing!

Best,
Phil

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/theweird1%40mediacombb.n
et



From rbacchus228 at gmail.com  Thu Mar  5 00:54:48 2015
From: rbacchus228 at gmail.com (Roanna Bacchus)
Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2015 19:54:48 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay for
	onlineeducation?
Message-ID: <54f7a97b.82228c0a.7e82.40b6@mx.google.com>

Hi Phil this is a great discussion topic.  The Division of Blind 
Services paid for my first two years of college at the community 
college level.  My Dbs counselor refused to buy me the book for 
one of my online classes.  They also refused to pay for my 
Bachelor's degree before I started at theUniversity of Central 
Florida.  I have taken several of my college courses online.  It 
has been a rewarding experience for me.


From sgermano at asu.edu  Thu Mar  5 00:58:16 2015
From: sgermano at asu.edu (Suzanne Germano)
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2015 17:58:16 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay for
	onlineeducation?
In-Reply-To: <54f7a97b.82228c0a.7e82.40b6@mx.google.com>
References: <54f7a97b.82228c0a.7e82.40b6@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <CAF=_avcSXzNxzjJK8AkkYLKHW6xkqsCT+c4_WcK0zbGBZAzxhQ@mail.gmail.com>

I would think if the courses are part of your plan then they would pay.
Arizona state offers some courses online and I have gotten one paid for. I
may do Stats online next semester and VR will be paying.

On Wed, Mar 4, 2015 at 5:54 PM, Roanna Bacchus via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> wrote:

> Hi Phil this is a great discussion topic.  The Division of Blind Services
> paid for my first two years of college at the community college level.  My
> Dbs counselor refused to buy me the book for one of my online classes.
> They also refused to pay for my Bachelor's degree before I started at
> theUniversity of Central Florida.  I have taken several of my college
> courses online.  It has been a rewarding experience for me.
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sgermano%40asu.edu
>

From ALewis at nfb.org  Thu Mar  5 13:54:47 2015
From: ALewis at nfb.org (Lewis, Anil)
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2015 13:54:47 +0000
Subject: [nabs-l] NFB 2015 Summer Internship Program Deadline
Message-ID: <BLUPR0701MB101004829EDED3DA3AE1F9AFC11F0@BLUPR0701MB1010.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>

All:

The application deadline for the 2015 National Federation of the Blind Summer Internship Program is quickly approaching.  If you are interested, please send the required documents to jerniganinstitute at nfb.org<mailto:jerniganinstitute at nfb.org> by March 13, 2015. the following is a brief description of the program, more information can be found at: https://nfb.org/blog/vonb-blog/national-federation-blind-2015-summer-internship-program.

Our National Federation of the Blind 2015 Summer Internship Program will provide an opportunity for individuals to contribute to the programs of the Federation, while gaining valuable experience at the center of innovation in the blindness field.  Our 2015 summer interns will be hosted at the NFB headquarters in Baltimore, Maryland. Internship placements are currently available for the summer of 2015. NFB internships will begin on June 1 and end on August 7, 2015 (ten weeks). The internship experience includes a stipend and can include sleeping accommodations at the NFB Jernigan Institute, if necessary. One of the requirements of the internship is participation in program activities at the 2015 NFB National Convention to be held in Orlando, Florida, from July 5-10.
2015 summer interns will have the opportunity to engage in a variety of program areas including:
*         Access technology
*         Civil rights-especially advocacy around voting rights and educational accessibility
*         Data management
*         Education programs
*         Governmental affairs
*         Information technology
*         Jacobus tenBroek Library
*         Membership building
*         NFB NEWSLINE(r) for the Blind
*         Outreach and fundraising
*         Public relations & social media

If you are interested in applying for an internship with the National Federation of the Blind, you should prepare the following materials and submit them in an accessible electronic format no later than March 13, 2015:
1.    A cover letter expressing why you are uniquely qualified for an NFB internship, listing the program area(s) in which you are most interested in gaining experience, and describing the projects that drive your passion in those program area(s). Be sure to include a description of any previous involvement you have had with the Federation.  Please feel free to include any innovative new projects that you might want to help initiate during your internship.  Also note any scheduling conflicts that would prevent you from being available from June 1 through August 7.
2.    A resume including current contact information.
3.    Two or three references with complete contact information.
Send all of your materials, preferably via email, to:
National Federation of the Blind Jernigan Institute
Attn: Anil Lewis
200 East Wells Street at Jernigan Place
Baltimore, Maryland   21230
Email: jerniganinstitute at nfb.org<mailto:jerniganinstitute at nfb.org?subject=National%20Federation%20of%20the%20Blind%202015%20Summer%20Internship%20Program>
Questions regarding NFB internships can be directed to Anil Lewis at 410-659-9314, extension 2357, or jerniganinstitute at nfb.org<mailto:jerniganinstitute at nfb.org?subject=National%20Federation%20of%20the%20Blind%202015%20Internship%20Program>. We anticipate selecting our 2015 internship class by April 14, 2015.



Mr. Anil Lewis, M.P.A.
Executive Director

National Federation of the Blind Jernigan Institute
200 East Wells Street at Jernigan Place
Baltimore, Maryland   21230

(410) 659-9314 ext. 2374 (Voice)
(410) 659-5129 (FAX)
Email: alewis at nfb.org<mailto:alewis at nfb.org>
Web: www.nfb.org<http://www.nfb.org/>
Twitter: @AnilLife

The National Federation of the Blind knows that blindness is not the characteristic that defines you or your future. Every day we raise the expectations of blind people, because low expectations create obstacles between blind people and our dreams. You can live the life you want; blindness is not what holds you back.

To make a donation to the National Federation of the Blind Imagination Fund campaign, please visit www.nfb.org/ImaginingOurFuture<http://www.nfb.org/ImaginingOurFuture>.



From rbacchus228 at gmail.com  Thu Mar  5 13:58:21 2015
From: rbacchus228 at gmail.com (rbacchus228 at gmail.com)
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2015 08:58:21 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay for online
	education?
In-Reply-To: <003401d056af$a9362d70$fba28850$@mediacombb.net>
References: <CAO2euMf=b33Vy6pbaM6Eg2k7+TmPLX-fq97cB0LgYLJFBTRgig@mail.gmail.com>
	<003401d056af$a9362d70$fba28850$@mediacombb.net>
Message-ID: <5D011259-927A-4FF2-8A70-E4BC477D448E@gmail.com>

My devious counselor also refused to pay for my bachelors degree I earned my AAA for two years from seminal State College by doing both online and on-campus classes

Sent from my iPad

> On Mar 4, 2015, at 2:16 PM, Loren Wakefield via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi,  I can tell you that the department for the blind here in Iowa, refused
> to pay for my online pursuit of a degree.  This is so even though the
> projected years to obtain the degree online would have cost less than 80
> percent of one year at a school here in the area.  They thought that the
> only way to obtain the degree is to be out in the public and negotiating a
> brick and mortor facility.  I have already obtained a b.a. and MAE from
> actual campuses.  I would be glad to talk more about this with you when it
> is conveninent for you.  You can reach me via email at:
> theweird1 at mediacombb.net  or my cell is 515-829-9330.  Good luck with your
> research.  
> 
> Loren Wakefield 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Phil via nabs-l
> Sent: Wednesday, March 04, 2015 2:58 AM
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay for online
> education?
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> I'm doing a research project on blind students taking online education and
> online training. Would you be so kind to advise me if your state's DVR /
> Commission for the Blind pays for online education and online training, just
> like bric-and-mortar education?
> What about vocational training through online methods, such as learning
> JAWS, ZoomText, Excel, Word online?
> And separately, have you taken any online educationor online training?
> What was your experience like? Did you find it rewarding?
> Look forward to hearing your views on this.
> Thanks a lot for sharing!
> 
> Best,
> Phil
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/theweird1%40mediacombb.n
> et
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/rbacchus228%40gmail.com


From rbacchus228 at gmail.com  Thu Mar  5 14:48:03 2015
From: rbacchus228 at gmail.com (rbacchus228 at gmail.com)
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2015 09:48:03 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay for
	onlineeducation?
In-Reply-To: <CAF=_avcSXzNxzjJK8AkkYLKHW6xkqsCT+c4_WcK0zbGBZAzxhQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <54f7a97b.82228c0a.7e82.40b6@mx.google.com>
	<CAF=_avcSXzNxzjJK8AkkYLKHW6xkqsCT+c4_WcK0zbGBZAzxhQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7F7CE11A-3E75-4B18-A943-1CED31A7B9F3@gmail.com>

My devious counselor thought that online courses do not agree she thought that I could only do courses on campus

Sent from my iPad

> On Mar 4, 2015, at 7:58 PM, Suzanne Germano via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> I would think if the courses are part of your plan then they would pay.
> Arizona state offers some courses online and I have gotten one paid for. I
> may do Stats online next semester and VR will be paying.
> 
> On Wed, Mar 4, 2015 at 5:54 PM, Roanna Bacchus via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> wrote:
> 
>> Hi Phil this is a great discussion topic.  The Division of Blind Services
>> paid for my first two years of college at the community college level.  My
>> Dbs counselor refused to buy me the book for one of my online classes.
>> They also refused to pay for my Bachelor's degree before I started at
>> theUniversity of Central Florida.  I have taken several of my college
>> courses online.  It has been a rewarding experience for me.
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sgermano%40asu.edu
>> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/rbacchus228%40gmail.com


From herekittykat97 at gmail.com  Thu Mar  5 15:11:22 2015
From: herekittykat97 at gmail.com (Jewel)
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2015 10:11:22 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay for
	onlineeducation?
In-Reply-To: <7F7CE11A-3E75-4B18-A943-1CED31A7B9F3@gmail.com>
References: <54f7a97b.82228c0a.7e82.40b6@mx.google.com>
	<CAF=_avcSXzNxzjJK8AkkYLKHW6xkqsCT+c4_WcK0zbGBZAzxhQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<7F7CE11A-3E75-4B18-A943-1CED31A7B9F3@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4DB78390-3BB2-4DDA-908C-963DD0554AF5@gmail.com>

I took four online classes this semester and DSS paid for all of them and would have paid for books if I had not found all of my textbooks in digital format. 
Jewel 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 5, 2015, at 9:48 AM, Roanna Bacchus via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> My devious counselor thought that online courses do not agree she thought that I could only do courses on campus
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On Mar 4, 2015, at 7:58 PM, Suzanne Germano via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> 
>> I would think if the courses are part of your plan then they would pay.
>> Arizona state offers some courses online and I have gotten one paid for. I
>> may do Stats online next semester and VR will be paying.
>> 
>> On Wed, Mar 4, 2015 at 5:54 PM, Roanna Bacchus via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi Phil this is a great discussion topic.  The Division of Blind Services
>>> paid for my first two years of college at the community college level.  My
>>> Dbs counselor refused to buy me the book for one of my online classes.
>>> They also refused to pay for my Bachelor's degree before I started at
>>> theUniversity of Central Florida.  I have taken several of my college
>>> courses online.  It has been a rewarding experience for me.
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sgermano%40asu.edu
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/rbacchus228%40gmail.com
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat97%40gmail.com


From sgermano at asu.edu  Thu Mar  5 15:22:15 2015
From: sgermano at asu.edu (Suzanne Germano)
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2015 08:22:15 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Email from list
Message-ID: <CAF=_avejXNei2uD2tgX2O3OGWmcnZhtu6ZasFXar7q3jmQSswg@mail.gmail.com>

I received 3 emails saying i adked to be removed from the list. I did not
take this action.

Does anyone know why? Do i need to sign up again for the list?

Suzanne

From steve.jacobson at visi.com  Thu Mar  5 19:56:53 2015
From: steve.jacobson at visi.com (Steve Jacobson)
Date: Thu, 05 Mar 2015 13:56:53 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Email from list
In-Reply-To: <CAF=_avejXNei2uD2tgX2O3OGWmcnZhtu6ZasFXar7q3jmQSswg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <auto-000001574969@mailback1.g2host.com>

Susan,

If you didn't ask to be unsubscribed, just ignore the notes.  If you were manually unsubscribed by Dave Andrews, he 
would have communicated with you and given the reason, and that isn't something he does very often.

I'm a little suspicious about the email you received.  Does the email ask you to give your password or ask you to 
go to a link?  It used to be that if someone clicked on the wrong link within a chain of emails they could trigger 
an "unsubscribe" for someone else by accident, but now, I think they would need your password to get a note sent to 
you from NFBNET.  Did you happen to save one of these notes?  If you did, it would be good if you could forward it 
as an attachment to Dave Andrews or me.  Forwarding it as an attachment allows us to see all of the headers as well 
as the note which could help us determine if it came from NFBNET or whether someone is playing games.  If you don't 
know how to forward as an attachment, tell us which email program you are using and we can help you figure it out.

Best regards,

Steve Jacobson


On Thu, 5 Mar 2015 08:22:15 -0700, Suzanne Germano via nabs-l wrote:

>I received 3 emails saying i adked to be removed from the list. I did not
>take this action.

>Does anyone know why? Do i need to sign up again for the list?

>Suzanne
>_______________________________________________
>nabs-l mailing list
>nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/steve.jacobson%40visi.com






From justin.williams2 at gmail.com  Thu Mar  5 20:31:50 2015
From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams)
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2015 15:31:50 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Email from list
In-Reply-To: <CAF=_avejXNei2uD2tgX2O3OGWmcnZhtu6ZasFXar7q3jmQSswg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAF=_avejXNei2uD2tgX2O3OGWmcnZhtu6ZasFXar7q3jmQSswg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <00ca01d05783$69429d50$3bc7d7f0$@gmail.com>

I got your message.

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Suzanne Germano
via nabs-l
Sent: Thursday, March 05, 2015 10:22 AM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: [nabs-l] Email from list

I received 3 emails saying i adked to be removed from the list. I did not
take this action.

Does anyone know why? Do i need to sign up again for the list?

Suzanne
_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail
.com



From lhnews at lighthouse-sf.org  Thu Mar  5 20:59:22 2015
From: lhnews at lighthouse-sf.org (LightHouse for the Blind and Visually Impaired)
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2015 20:59:22 +0000
Subject: [nabs-l] Job Openings at Enchanted Hills Camp for the Blind
Message-ID: <2B462D39CA57B147A4C4B61F9FC1959D512C85@email.rrlh-sf.local>

The LightHouse's Enchanted Hills Camp for the Blind has openings for Camp Counselor, Equestrian Program Area Leader, Nature Program Area Leader and Arts and Crafts Program Area Leader.

You can see these and other job opportunities on our website at http://lighthouse-sf.org/about/careers/.

Enchanted Hills Camp for the Blind serves blind children, teens, adults, deaf-blind, seniors, as well as families of the blind. For 63 years, Enchanted Hills has provided priceless opportunities for recreation in a fun, challenging and accessible way. Located on 311 acres on scenic Mt. Veeder, Enchanted Hills is just 10 miles west of Napa, California.

The experience of summer camp holds countless opportunities for enjoyment and learning in many a young person's life. Whether it's exploring a trail in the woods or creating a skit as a team to perform in front of an audience, camp provides a wealth of structured and unrestricted moments that contribute to childhood socialization, growth and development. Read more about Enchanted Hills Camp and this summer's camp sessions at http://lighthouse-sf.org/programs/enchanted-hills/.

The LightHouse is an equal opportunity employer and the positions we offer are open to all regardless of race, color, creed, national origin, ancestry, sex, marital status, disability, religious or political affiliation, age, or sexual orientation.

From cnusbaumnfb at gmail.com  Fri Mar  6 05:29:25 2015
From: cnusbaumnfb at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum)
Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2015 00:29:25 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay for
	onlineeducation?
In-Reply-To: <7F7CE11A-3E75-4B18-A943-1CED31A7B9F3@gmail.com>
References: <54f7a97b.82228c0a.7e82.40b6@mx.google.com>
	<CAF=_avcSXzNxzjJK8AkkYLKHW6xkqsCT+c4_WcK0zbGBZAzxhQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<7F7CE11A-3E75-4B18-A943-1CED31A7B9F3@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <00c401d057ce$82fdb950$88f92bf0$@gmail.com>

Quick question: Why would a rehab counselor think you could only take
classes on campus? If the online material is accessible, I could see no
reason why a blind person couldn't take the class. However, I'm speaking
from very little experience.

Chris

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Roanna Bacchus
via nabs-l
Sent: Thursday, March 05, 2015 9:48 AM
To: Suzanne Germano; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay for
onlineeducation?

My devious counselor thought that online courses do not agree she thought
that I could only do courses on campus

Sent from my iPad

> On Mar 4, 2015, at 7:58 PM, Suzanne Germano via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
wrote:
> 
> I would think if the courses are part of your plan then they would pay.
> Arizona state offers some courses online and I have gotten one paid 
> for. I may do Stats online next semester and VR will be paying.
> 
> On Wed, Mar 4, 2015 at 5:54 PM, Roanna Bacchus via nabs-l 
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> wrote:
> 
>> Hi Phil this is a great discussion topic.  The Division of Blind 
>> Services paid for my first two years of college at the community 
>> college level.  My Dbs counselor refused to buy me the book for one of my
online classes.
>> They also refused to pay for my Bachelor's degree before I started at 
>> theUniversity of Central Florida.  I have taken several of my college 
>> courses online.  It has been a rewarding experience for me.
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sgermano%40asu.ed
>> u
>> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/rbacchus228%40gmai
> l.com

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/cnusbaumnfb%40gmail.com



From rbacchus228 at gmail.com  Fri Mar  6 14:52:01 2015
From: rbacchus228 at gmail.com (Roanna Bacchus)
Date: Fri, 06 Mar 2015 09:52:01 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] My progress with Jaws
Message-ID: <54f9bf37.13d98c0a.546d.433c@mx.google.com>

Dear Students,

Last year I began receiving tutoring in the use of Jaws from a 
fellow UCF student.  Each week I practice what he has taught me 
on the computer.  This morning I figured out how to play the 
archived sermons from one of the local churches here in Orlando.  
I am so proud of the progress that I have made.


From gloria.graves at gmail.com  Fri Mar  6 14:56:29 2015
From: gloria.graves at gmail.com (Gloria Graves)
Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2015 08:56:29 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] My progress with Jaws
In-Reply-To: <54f9bf37.13d98c0a.546d.433c@mx.google.com>
References: <54f9bf37.13d98c0a.546d.433c@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <379D36D8-804E-4952-A497-6B32C843181B@gmail.com>

That is awesome :-) keep up the good work and you'll be a fluid JAWs user in no time



> On Mar 6, 2015, at 8:52 AM, Roanna Bacchus via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Dear Students,
> 
> Last year I began receiving tutoring in the use of Jaws from a fellow UCF student.  Each week I practice what he has taught me on the computer.  This morning I figured out how to play the archived sermons from one of the local churches here in Orlando.  I am so proud of the progress that I have made.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gmail.com


From hope.paulos at gmail.com  Fri Mar  6 15:37:53 2015
From: hope.paulos at gmail.com (Hope Paulos)
Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2015 10:37:53 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] My progress with Jaws
In-Reply-To: <54f9bf37.13d98c0a.546d.433c@mx.google.com>
References: <54f9bf37.13d98c0a.546d.433c@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <6AF073B3-0C33-43AE-8B7E-36E64685A359@gmail.com>

This is wonderful! Keep up the great work.

Hope Paulos

> On Mar 6, 2015, at 9:52 AM, Roanna Bacchus via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Dear Students,
> 
> Last year I began receiving tutoring in the use of Jaws from a fellow UCF student.  Each week I practice what he has taught me on the computer.  This morning I figured out how to play the archived sermons from one of the local churches here in Orlando.  I am so proud of the progress that I have made.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40gmail.com


From cnusbaumnfb at gmail.com  Fri Mar  6 16:26:17 2015
From: cnusbaumnfb at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum)
Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2015 11:26:17 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] My progress with Jaws
In-Reply-To: <54f9bf37.13d98c0a.546d.433c@mx.google.com>
References: <54f9bf37.13d98c0a.546d.433c@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <8D4D6A0F-B9A6-4C7D-B1B2-8ADA42245AAE@gmail.com>

Good for you! I love reading these reports of your progress in all areas of your blindness skills, from technology to travel to cooking. It's truly something we can all celebrate. Keep up the great work and don't hesitate to contact me if you need any help or support!

Chris Nusbaum

> On Mar 6, 2015, at 9:52 AM, Roanna Bacchus via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Dear Students,
> 
> Last year I began receiving tutoring in the use of Jaws from a fellow UCF student.  Each week I practice what he has taught me on the computer.  This morning I figured out how to play the archived sermons from one of the local churches here in Orlando.  I am so proud of the progress that I have made.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/cnusbaumnfb%40gmail.com


From rbacchus228 at gmail.com  Sat Mar  7 14:47:34 2015
From: rbacchus228 at gmail.com (Roanna Bacchus)
Date: Sat, 07 Mar 2015 09:47:34 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] An update on my Independence
Message-ID: <54fb0fae.232b8c0a.2851.fffffc9d@mx.google.com>

Dear Students,

I hope everyone is having an awesome start to their Spring Break.  
This week I ordered food from the cafe at the UCF library.  I 
paid for it all on my own using my ID card.  I also found my way 
downstairs to the Center For Distributed Learning where I 
volunteer two days a week.  These are more small steps toward 
improving my independence.


From hope.paulos at gmail.com  Sat Mar  7 14:54:51 2015
From: hope.paulos at gmail.com (Hope Paulos)
Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2015 09:54:51 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] An update on my Independence
In-Reply-To: <54fb0fae.232b8c0a.2851.fffffc9d@mx.google.com>
References: <54fb0fae.232b8c0a.2851.fffffc9d@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <9E8F8CAA-D353-4CA4-A55E-DF4DC418FEC2@gmail.com>

I love to hear about your journey to independence! No matter how small you may  think the steps are, they are steps nonetheless… you have to crawl before you walk, walk before you run! Keep it up!

Hope Paulos

> On Mar 7, 2015, at 9:47 AM, Roanna Bacchus via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Dear Students,
> 
> I hope everyone is having an awesome start to their Spring Break.  This week I ordered food from the cafe at the UCF library.  I paid for it all on my own using my ID card.  I also found my way downstairs to the Center For Distributed Learning where I volunteer two days a week.  These are more small steps toward improving my independence.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40gmail.com


From kerrik2006 at gmail.com  Sat Mar  7 18:38:07 2015
From: kerrik2006 at gmail.com (Kerri Kosten)
Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2015 13:38:07 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Taking Pictures With the Iphone?
Message-ID: <CAM6GWxyNp8s5se6dGEgVpiV98OjAk8JOmjEiAkzkmvTMUcNWEg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Everyone:

I really want to get into this taking pictures thing.
I am seeing more and more posts on Facebook where there is a caption
and then a picture or several.
Is there anyone out there who is blind and takes decent pictures with
their Iphones?
How do you do it and make sure the picture is decent?
What is the best way to hold the phone so the camera is aimed at what
you want to take a picture of?
That is what I have the most trouble with. I know what I want to take
a picture of, and know where the object is, but can never figure out
how to hold the phone so the camera gets a decent picture of the
object.
Is the best way to use Tap Tap See and then just take pictures until
you get the proper description from Tap Tap see?
I know with voiceover, and the Iphone taking pictures is a lot more
possible than it used to be, I just can't figure out how to hold the
phone.
Also, I have an Iphone 5s. Do those of you who have the 6 and 6plus
find any improvement in taking pictures with the better/bigger
cameras?
Thanks!
Kerri


From fowlers at syix.com  Sat Mar  7 18:49:31 2015
From: fowlers at syix.com (Angela Fowler)
Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2015 10:49:31 -0800
Subject: [nabs-l] Apply now for the 2015 Chemistry Camp
Message-ID: <028301d05907$727de200$5779a600$@syix.com>

Attention Blind and/or Visually Impaired High School Students, 

Would you like to learn how blind people tackle the very visual subject of
organic chemistry successfully? Do you have a general love for science? Do
you want to learn how you can do chemistry as a blind person just as
successfully as your sighted peers? Do you want to apply the chemistry you
learned to food such as olive oil? Are you interested in how blind
professionals use science in their careers every day? Then the 2015
Chemistry Camp is for you!

Come join Accessible Science and Credo High School for an Educational,
exciting, and Fun-Filled weekend of hands-on science! 

*      When: Friday, May 1, 2015 through Sunday, May 3, 2015. 

*      Where: Enchanted Hills Camp near Napa, California. 

*      Who: Up to twelve blind high school students ages 14-18 will be
selected to participate.

 

For more information or to apply, please visit 

http://www.accessiblescience.org/node/2

Questions? Please do not hesitate to contact Angela Fowler by phone at (530)
902-0987, or by email at fowlers at syix.com

Best,

Angela Fowler (Director of Planning)

Accessible Science


-----
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_______________________________________________
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From philso1003 at gmail.com  Sun Mar  8 01:06:29 2015
From: philso1003 at gmail.com (Phil)
Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2015 20:06:29 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Alternatives to Google Docs for collaboration
Message-ID: <CAO2euMdZOCLc7bHW6CJ-VnOTb-oLvfWXMS4xwK-na2=MG9ZnqQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hey guys,

Has anyone used any web-based word processor and spreadsheet other
than Google Docs for personal use and for collaboration?  If so, how
accessible are they for screen-reader users?
For example, tools like Zoho, BuzzWord, Microsoft Office 365, People,
OpenGoo, Etherpad, etc.?

We all know Google Docs can be annoying to use for screen reader
users, to put it nicely. So let's share tips and advice on what
alternative tools are available.

Thanks a lot!

Best,
Phil


From philso1003 at gmail.com  Sun Mar  8 01:14:38 2015
From: philso1003 at gmail.com (Phil)
Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2015 20:14:38 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay for
	onlineeducation?
In-Reply-To: <00c401d057ce$82fdb950$88f92bf0$@gmail.com>
References: <54f7a97b.82228c0a.7e82.40b6@mx.google.com>
	<CAF=_avcSXzNxzjJK8AkkYLKHW6xkqsCT+c4_WcK0zbGBZAzxhQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<7F7CE11A-3E75-4B18-A943-1CED31A7B9F3@gmail.com>
	<00c401d057ce$82fdb950$88f92bf0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAO2euMcr993_4Y7L58QeM3sEQHBL2++aPbR3N8hYzVejssfqqw@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Jewel,
That's great your agency pays for your online education. Which state are you in?
Best,
Phil

On 3/6/15, Chris Nusbaum via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Quick question: Why would a rehab counselor think you could only take
> classes on campus? If the online material is accessible, I could see no
> reason why a blind person couldn't take the class. However, I'm speaking
> from very little experience.
>
> Chris
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Roanna Bacchus
> via nabs-l
> Sent: Thursday, March 05, 2015 9:48 AM
> To: Suzanne Germano; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay for
> onlineeducation?
>
> My devious counselor thought that online courses do not agree she thought
> that I could only do courses on campus
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Mar 4, 2015, at 7:58 PM, Suzanne Germano via nabs-l
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> wrote:
>>
>> I would think if the courses are part of your plan then they would pay.
>> Arizona state offers some courses online and I have gotten one paid
>> for. I may do Stats online next semester and VR will be paying.
>>
>> On Wed, Mar 4, 2015 at 5:54 PM, Roanna Bacchus via nabs-l
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Phil this is a great discussion topic.  The Division of Blind
>>> Services paid for my first two years of college at the community
>>> college level.  My Dbs counselor refused to buy me the book for one of
>>> my
> online classes.
>>> They also refused to pay for my Bachelor's degree before I started at
>>> theUniversity of Central Florida.  I have taken several of my college
>>> courses online.  It has been a rewarding experience for me.
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sgermano%40asu.ed
>>> u
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/rbacchus228%40gmai
>> l.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/cnusbaumnfb%40gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/philso1003%40gmail.com
>


From philso1003 at gmail.com  Sun Mar  8 01:23:51 2015
From: philso1003 at gmail.com (Phil)
Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2015 20:23:51 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay for
	onlineeducation?
In-Reply-To: <CAO2euMcr993_4Y7L58QeM3sEQHBL2++aPbR3N8hYzVejssfqqw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <54f7a97b.82228c0a.7e82.40b6@mx.google.com>
	<CAF=_avcSXzNxzjJK8AkkYLKHW6xkqsCT+c4_WcK0zbGBZAzxhQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<7F7CE11A-3E75-4B18-A943-1CED31A7B9F3@gmail.com>
	<00c401d057ce$82fdb950$88f92bf0$@gmail.com>
	<CAO2euMcr993_4Y7L58QeM3sEQHBL2++aPbR3N8hYzVejssfqqw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAO2euMfF7D3bCK0NfdtHaRs4JGbotM4WULXErX4JseAzZ3iLfQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Roanna,

Thanks for your feedback. When you say DBS refused to pay for your
bachelor before UCF, was your bachelor education before UCF online or
brick-and-mortar?

Thanks!

Best,
Phil


On 3/7/15, Phil <philso1003 at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Jewel,
> That's great your agency pays for your online education. Which state are you
> in?
> Best,
> Phil
>
> On 3/6/15, Chris Nusbaum via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> Quick question: Why would a rehab counselor think you could only take
>> classes on campus? If the online material is accessible, I could see no
>> reason why a blind person couldn't take the class. However, I'm speaking
>> from very little experience.
>>
>> Chris
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Roanna
>> Bacchus
>> via nabs-l
>> Sent: Thursday, March 05, 2015 9:48 AM
>> To: Suzanne Germano; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay for
>> onlineeducation?
>>
>> My devious counselor thought that online courses do not agree she thought
>> that I could only do courses on campus
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>>> On Mar 4, 2015, at 7:58 PM, Suzanne Germano via nabs-l
>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I would think if the courses are part of your plan then they would pay.
>>> Arizona state offers some courses online and I have gotten one paid
>>> for. I may do Stats online next semester and VR will be paying.
>>>
>>> On Wed, Mar 4, 2015 at 5:54 PM, Roanna Bacchus via nabs-l
>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi Phil this is a great discussion topic.  The Division of Blind
>>>> Services paid for my first two years of college at the community
>>>> college level.  My Dbs counselor refused to buy me the book for one of
>>>> my
>> online classes.
>>>> They also refused to pay for my Bachelor's degree before I started at
>>>> theUniversity of Central Florida.  I have taken several of my college
>>>> courses online.  It has been a rewarding experience for me.
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sgermano%40asu.ed
>>>> u
>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/rbacchus228%40gmai
>>> l.com
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/cnusbaumnfb%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/philso1003%40gmail.com
>>
>


From philso1003 at gmail.com  Sun Mar  8 01:30:37 2015
From: philso1003 at gmail.com (Phil)
Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2015 20:30:37 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay for
	onlineeducation?
In-Reply-To: <CAO2euMfF7D3bCK0NfdtHaRs4JGbotM4WULXErX4JseAzZ3iLfQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <54f7a97b.82228c0a.7e82.40b6@mx.google.com>
	<CAF=_avcSXzNxzjJK8AkkYLKHW6xkqsCT+c4_WcK0zbGBZAzxhQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<7F7CE11A-3E75-4B18-A943-1CED31A7B9F3@gmail.com>
	<00c401d057ce$82fdb950$88f92bf0$@gmail.com>
	<CAO2euMcr993_4Y7L58QeM3sEQHBL2++aPbR3N8hYzVejssfqqw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAO2euMfF7D3bCK0NfdtHaRs4JGbotM4WULXErX4JseAzZ3iLfQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAO2euMcu4ay7VRp94XEhFVcOH9cakDYpqkEBb6QhKW++mNqUFQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Suzanne,

That's great Arizona agency pays for your online courses. Now the
question is, if you had done a completely online degree, do you think
your agency would still pay for it?

Best,
Phil


On 3/7/15, Phil <philso1003 at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Roanna,
>
> Thanks for your feedback. When you say DBS refused to pay for your
> bachelor before UCF, was your bachelor education before UCF online or
> brick-and-mortar?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Best,
> Phil
>
>
> On 3/7/15, Phil <philso1003 at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi Jewel,
>> That's great your agency pays for your online education. Which state are
>> you
>> in?
>> Best,
>> Phil
>>
>> On 3/6/15, Chris Nusbaum via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>> Quick question: Why would a rehab counselor think you could only take
>>> classes on campus? If the online material is accessible, I could see no
>>> reason why a blind person couldn't take the class. However, I'm speaking
>>> from very little experience.
>>>
>>> Chris
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Roanna
>>> Bacchus
>>> via nabs-l
>>> Sent: Thursday, March 05, 2015 9:48 AM
>>> To: Suzanne Germano; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay for
>>> onlineeducation?
>>>
>>> My devious counselor thought that online courses do not agree she
>>> thought
>>> that I could only do courses on campus
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>
>>>> On Mar 4, 2015, at 7:58 PM, Suzanne Germano via nabs-l
>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I would think if the courses are part of your plan then they would pay.
>>>> Arizona state offers some courses online and I have gotten one paid
>>>> for. I may do Stats online next semester and VR will be paying.
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Mar 4, 2015 at 5:54 PM, Roanna Bacchus via nabs-l
>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi Phil this is a great discussion topic.  The Division of Blind
>>>>> Services paid for my first two years of college at the community
>>>>> college level.  My Dbs counselor refused to buy me the book for one of
>>>>> my
>>> online classes.
>>>>> They also refused to pay for my Bachelor's degree before I started at
>>>>> theUniversity of Central Florida.  I have taken several of my college
>>>>> courses online.  It has been a rewarding experience for me.
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sgermano%40asu.ed
>>>>> u
>>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/rbacchus228%40gmai
>>>> l.com
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/cnusbaumnfb%40gmail.com
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/philso1003%40gmail.com
>>>
>>
>


From herekittykat97 at gmail.com  Sun Mar  8 04:18:32 2015
From: herekittykat97 at gmail.com (Jewel)
Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2015 23:18:32 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay for
	onlineeducation?
In-Reply-To: <CAO2euMcr993_4Y7L58QeM3sEQHBL2++aPbR3N8hYzVejssfqqw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <54f7a97b.82228c0a.7e82.40b6@mx.google.com>
	<CAF=_avcSXzNxzjJK8AkkYLKHW6xkqsCT+c4_WcK0zbGBZAzxhQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<7F7CE11A-3E75-4B18-A943-1CED31A7B9F3@gmail.com>
	<00c401d057ce$82fdb950$88f92bf0$@gmail.com>
	<CAO2euMcr993_4Y7L58QeM3sEQHBL2++aPbR3N8hYzVejssfqqw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <F4376E46-ABD6-4128-823A-A0FEB684E3E2@gmail.com>

North Carolina

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 7, 2015, at 8:14 PM, Phil via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi Jewel,
> That's great your agency pays for your online education. Which state are you in?
> Best,
> Phil
> 
>> On 3/6/15, Chris Nusbaum via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> Quick question: Why would a rehab counselor think you could only take
>> classes on campus? If the online material is accessible, I could see no
>> reason why a blind person couldn't take the class. However, I'm speaking
>> from very little experience.
>> 
>> Chris
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Roanna Bacchus
>> via nabs-l
>> Sent: Thursday, March 05, 2015 9:48 AM
>> To: Suzanne Germano; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay for
>> onlineeducation?
>> 
>> My devious counselor thought that online courses do not agree she thought
>> that I could only do courses on campus
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>>> On Mar 4, 2015, at 7:58 PM, Suzanne Germano via nabs-l
>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> I would think if the courses are part of your plan then they would pay.
>>> Arizona state offers some courses online and I have gotten one paid
>>> for. I may do Stats online next semester and VR will be paying.
>>> 
>>> On Wed, Mar 4, 2015 at 5:54 PM, Roanna Bacchus via nabs-l
>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Hi Phil this is a great discussion topic.  The Division of Blind
>>>> Services paid for my first two years of college at the community
>>>> college level.  My Dbs counselor refused to buy me the book for one of
>>>> my
>> online classes.
>>>> They also refused to pay for my Bachelor's degree before I started at
>>>> theUniversity of Central Florida.  I have taken several of my college
>>>> courses online.  It has been a rewarding experience for me.
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sgermano%40asu.ed
>>>> u
>>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/rbacchus228%40gmai
>>> l.com
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/cnusbaumnfb%40gmail.com
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/philso1003%40gmail.com
>> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat97%40gmail.com


From carlymih at comcast.net  Sun Mar  8 05:06:11 2015
From: carlymih at comcast.net (Carly Mihalakis)
Date: Sat, 07 Mar 2015 21:06:11 -0800
Subject: [nabs-l] An update on my Independence
In-Reply-To: <9E8F8CAA-D353-4CA4-A55E-DF4DC418FEC2@gmail.com>
References: <54fb0fae.232b8c0a.2851.fffffc9d@mx.google.com>
	<9E8F8CAA-D353-4CA4-A55E-DF4DC418FEC2@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <mailman.201.1772982280.2863824.nabs-l_nfbnet.org@nfbnet.org>

Evening, Rona,

         I also appreciate updates you tell us 
about of your journey toward a more independent 
space, if indeed, that is what you want. Keep it up!
CarupdAt 06:54 AM 3/7/2015, Hope Paulos via nabs-l wrote:
>I love to hear about your journey to 
>independence! No matter how small you may  think 
>the steps are, they are steps nonetheless
 you 
>have to crawl before you walk, walk  before you 
>run! Keep it up! Hope Paulos > On Mar 7, 2015, 
>at 9:47 AM, Roanna Bacchus via nabs-l 
><nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote: > > Dear 
>Students, > > I hope everyone is having an 
>awesome start to their Spring Break.  This week 
>I ordered food from the cafe at the UCF 
>library.  I paid for it all on my own using my 
>ID card.  I also found my way downstairs to the 
>Center For Distributed Learning where I 
>volunteer two days a week.  These are more small 
>steps toward improving my independence. > > 
>_______________________________________________ > 
>  nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > 
>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org  
> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or 
>get your account info for nabs-l: > 
>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40gmail.com 
>_______________________________________________ 
>nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org 
>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org 
>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get 
>your account info for nabs-l: 
>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carlymih%40comcast.net




From sgermano at asu.edu  Sun Mar  8 17:56:51 2015
From: sgermano at asu.edu (Suzanne Germano)
Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2015 10:56:51 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay for
	onlineeducation?
In-Reply-To: <CAO2euMcu4ay7VRp94XEhFVcOH9cakDYpqkEBb6QhKW++mNqUFQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <54f7a97b.82228c0a.7e82.40b6@mx.google.com>
	<CAF=_avcSXzNxzjJK8AkkYLKHW6xkqsCT+c4_WcK0zbGBZAzxhQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<7F7CE11A-3E75-4B18-A943-1CED31A7B9F3@gmail.com>
	<00c401d057ce$82fdb950$88f92bf0$@gmail.com>
	<CAO2euMcr993_4Y7L58QeM3sEQHBL2++aPbR3N8hYzVejssfqqw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAO2euMfF7D3bCK0NfdtHaRs4JGbotM4WULXErX4JseAzZ3iLfQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAO2euMcu4ay7VRp94XEhFVcOH9cakDYpqkEBb6QhKW++mNqUFQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAF=_avdov8me6C4aJgvxvxzTcbAkhSqneXVhLt1ufQi0-iZ7Zg@mail.gmail.com>

Yes I believe so as long as the degree meets your employment goal. I can't
say 100%. What VR covers seems to have no rhyme or reason. Seems they may
cover something for one person but not another. Different counselors seem
to really vary. I had to to file a appeal to get something I needed but it
worked.

On Sat, Mar 7, 2015 at 6:30 PM, Phil via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:

> Hi Suzanne,
>
> That's great Arizona agency pays for your online courses. Now the
> question is, if you had done a completely online degree, do you think
> your agency would still pay for it?
>
> Best,
> Phil
>
>
> On 3/7/15, Phil <philso1003 at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Hi Roanna,
> >
> > Thanks for your feedback. When you say DBS refused to pay for your
> > bachelor before UCF, was your bachelor education before UCF online or
> > brick-and-mortar?
> >
> > Thanks!
> >
> > Best,
> > Phil
> >
> >
> > On 3/7/15, Phil <philso1003 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> Hi Jewel,
> >> That's great your agency pays for your online education. Which state are
> >> you
> >> in?
> >> Best,
> >> Phil
> >>
> >> On 3/6/15, Chris Nusbaum via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> >>> Quick question: Why would a rehab counselor think you could only take
> >>> classes on campus? If the online material is accessible, I could see no
> >>> reason why a blind person couldn't take the class. However, I'm
> speaking
> >>> from very little experience.
> >>>
> >>> Chris
> >>>
> >>> -----Original Message-----
> >>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Roanna
> >>> Bacchus
> >>> via nabs-l
> >>> Sent: Thursday, March 05, 2015 9:48 AM
> >>> To: Suzanne Germano; National Association of Blind Students mailing
> list
> >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay for
> >>> onlineeducation?
> >>>
> >>> My devious counselor thought that online courses do not agree she
> >>> thought
> >>> that I could only do courses on campus
> >>>
> >>> Sent from my iPad
> >>>
> >>>> On Mar 4, 2015, at 7:58 PM, Suzanne Germano via nabs-l
> >>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> I would think if the courses are part of your plan then they would
> pay.
> >>>> Arizona state offers some courses online and I have gotten one paid
> >>>> for. I may do Stats online next semester and VR will be paying.
> >>>>
> >>>> On Wed, Mar 4, 2015 at 5:54 PM, Roanna Bacchus via nabs-l
> >>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >>>>> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> Hi Phil this is a great discussion topic.  The Division of Blind
> >>>>> Services paid for my first two years of college at the community
> >>>>> college level.  My Dbs counselor refused to buy me the book for one
> of
> >>>>> my
> >>> online classes.
> >>>>> They also refused to pay for my Bachelor's degree before I started at
> >>>>> theUniversity of Central Florida.  I have taken several of my college
> >>>>> courses online.  It has been a rewarding experience for me.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>> nabs-l mailing list
> >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> >>>>> nabs-l:
> >>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sgermano%40asu.ed
> >>>>> u
> >>>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> nabs-l mailing list
> >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> >>> nabs-l:
> >>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/rbacchus228%40gmai
> >>>> l.com
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> nabs-l mailing list
> >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> >>> nabs-l:
> >>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/cnusbaumnfb%40gmail.com
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> nabs-l mailing list
> >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> >>> nabs-l:
> >>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/philso1003%40gmail.com
> >>>
> >>
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sgermano%40asu.edu
>

From lilliepennington at fuse.net  Sun Mar  8 18:04:39 2015
From: lilliepennington at fuse.net (Lillie Pennington)
Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2015 14:04:39 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] putting me in touch
Message-ID: <002501d059ca$58bdbd40$0a3937c0$@fuse.net>

Hi Everyone, 

 

I was wondering if anyone knew of anyone who lived in Richmond, Kentucky or
has or is attending Eastern Kentucky University? 

 

If so, could you get me in touch with them?

Thanks, 

 

Lillie


From dandrews at visi.com  Sun Mar  8 23:19:17 2015
From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews)
Date: Sun, 08 Mar 2015 18:19:17 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Email from list
In-Reply-To: <CAF=_avejXNei2uD2tgX2O3OGWmcnZhtu6ZasFXar7q3jmQSswg@mail.g
	mail.com>
References: <CAF=_avejXNei2uD2tgX2O3OGWmcnZhtu6ZasFXar7q3jmQSswg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <auto-000017783847@mailfront2.g2host.com>

No, you are still on list, sometimes they get generated accidently, 
just ignore them.  And to everybody, edit out the long list of 
footers, in reply chains, to cut down on this.

Dave

At 10:22 AM 3/5/2015, you wrote:
>I received 3 emails saying i adked to be removed from the list. I did not
>take this action.
>
>Does anyone know why? Do i need to sign up again for the list?

         David Andrews and long white cane Harry.
E-Mail:  dandrews at visi.com or david.andrews at nfbnet.org



From dandrews at visi.com  Sun Mar  8 23:22:41 2015
From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews)
Date: Sun, 08 Mar 2015 18:22:41 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] putting me in touch
In-Reply-To: <002501d059ca$58bdbd40$0a3937c0$@fuse.net>
References: <002501d059ca$58bdbd40$0a3937c0$@fuse.net>
Message-ID: <auto-000018096216@mailfront1.g2host.com>

We have a nfb of kentucky list, www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbk_nfbnet.org
to join.

Dave

At 01:04 PM 3/8/2015, you wrote:
>Hi Everyone,
>
>
>
>I was wondering if anyone knew of anyone who lived in Richmond, Kentucky or
>has or is attending Eastern Kentucky University?

         David Andrews and long white cane Harry.
E-Mail:  dandrews at visi.com or david.andrews at nfbnet.org



From Mister.Alexander.Scott.Kaiser at comcast.net  Mon Mar  9 01:17:34 2015
From: Mister.Alexander.Scott.Kaiser at comcast.net (Mr. Alexander Scott Kaiser)
Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2015 21:17:34 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind Climatologist
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHXvog14b7pKsVRTONmXpPrCgAAAEAAAAEGos6dDU1FImgtNOFtUaYwBAAAAAA==@comcast.net>

Good Evening Dr. John Miller ,  Good Evening NFB Science and Engineering
Division Email list members and Good Evening Nabs email list members:

Hi my name is Mr. Alexander Scott Kaiser. I am a totally blind college
student going to college to study for a career in Climatological research to
work for the climate prediction center in College Park, Maryland. Does
anyone know of any totally blind climatologists in the field who I can speek
to about the field so I can learn more about adaptations that make this
career accessible to the Blindness community. Please feel free to email me
off list at Mister.Alexander.Scott.Kaiser at comcast.net
<mailto:Mister.Alexander.Scott.Kaiser at comcast.net>  with this information.
Thank you for your time and consideration.

Sincerely,

Mr. Alexander Scott Kaiser


From Mister.Alexander.Scott.Kaiser at comcast.net  Mon Mar  9 01:25:47 2015
From: Mister.Alexander.Scott.Kaiser at comcast.net (Mr. Alexander Scott Kaiser)
Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2015 21:25:47 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind Climatologist
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHXvog14b7pKsVRTONmXpPrCgAAAEAAAAGjYXyNEQCtHk2RJEqlt8sgBAAAAAA==@comcast.net>

Good Evening Dr. John Miller ,  Good Evening NFB Science and Engineering
Division Email list members and Good Evening Nabs email list members:

Hi my name is Mr. Alexander Scott Kaiser. I am a totally blind college
student going to college to study for a career in Climatological research to
work for the climate prediction center in College Park, Maryland. Does
anyone know of any totally blind climatologists in the field who I can speek
to about the field so I can learn more about adaptations that make this
career accessible to the Blindness community. Please feel free to email me
off list at Mister.Alexander.Scott.Kaiser at comcast.net
<mailto:Mister.Alexander.Scott.Kaiser at comcast.net>  with this information.
Thank you for your time and consideration.

Sincerely,

Mr. Alexander Scott Kaiser

 


From filerime at gmail.com  Mon Mar  9 06:04:34 2015
From: filerime at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?RWxpZiBFbWlyIMOWa3PDvHo=?=)
Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2015 02:04:34 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Writing math equations
Message-ID: <CAMtP_9c7c+GWPx4hKWi5XNML7s8V810F3upqFXEm1-e6Q91RtQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all,
As some of you can remember, I’m taking a statistic course now, and
I’ll take many of them. My university has no knowledge about providing
accessible books. They believe that single pdf is accessible. I can
deal with it for all other courses, but not statistic.
I need the equations and tables. They tried to write the equations.
Jaws can read it as a whole but I can’t navigate in it. I copied an
example here but since it is a picture or something like that, it
doesn't paste.

I don’t know braille yet. So guys what do you do with these kind of
things? How does your school provide you an accessible version of
these kind of equations?
Please let me know your ways, I desperately need a solution ASAP, and
my school wants me to find my own solution. They don’t have much idea.


From helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com  Mon Mar  9 06:45:17 2015
From: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com (Helga Schreiber)
Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2015 02:45:17 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Writing math equa
In-Reply-To: <CAMtP_9c7c+GWPx4hKWi5XNML7s8V810F3upqFXEm1-e6Q91RtQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMtP_9c7c+GWPx4hKWi5XNML7s8V810F3upqFXEm1-e6Q91RtQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5F2C5FFE-6456-4255-A3BE-98A66F861C97@gmail.com>

Hi, I just wanted to ask you, do you mean that you don't know Nemeth Braille or Literary Braille? Just wondering. But if it is the Nemeth Braille, I would suggest you to do if you don't know it, in order to write your math equations, you can ave a math tutor or someone who is good in the formulas to read yu the formulas and then you can type or write them in your own words so that you can read them or listen to them with JAWS. For instance, instead of having the equation in numbers, you can have them in words, like twenty x plus two B times three C equals ... This is just a suggestion  since when  i took Pre-Calculous one year ago in my college, I use Nemeth Braille, but in order to solve the problems I dictated them or wrote them in print while  I was dictating my answers. And actually my print writing was not so good! LOL! And the reason I wrote in Print is because I know how to write in print since I use to write when I was low vision before I lost my sight. In fact, I forgot to ask you, do you know how to write in Print? Just curious! By the way, guys, what do you think she should do about this matter? Just owndering since I don't know if my suggestion is the right one. Hope to hear form you soon. Thanks so much and God bless!

Helga Schreiber

Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter.
Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of Blind Students.
Member of the International Networkers Team (INT).
Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research.
Phone:  (561) 706-5950 
Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com 
Skype: helga.schreiber26 
4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx 
INT Website: http://int4life.com/ 

"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16 
Sent from my iPhone 

> On Mar 9, 2015, at 2:04 AM, Elif Emir Öksüz via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> As some of you can remember, I’m taking a statistic course now, and
> I’ll take many of them. My university has no knowledge about providing
> accessible books. They believe that single pdf is accessible. I can
> deal with it for all other courses, but not statistic.
> I need the equations and tables. They tried to write the equations.
> Jaws can read it as a whole but I can’t navigate in it. I copied an
> example here but since it is a picture or something like that, it
> doesn't paste.
> 
> I don’t know braille yet. So guys what do you do with these kind of
> things? How does your school provide you an accessible version of
> these kind of equations?
> Please let me know your ways, I desperately need a solution ASAP, and
> my school wants me to find my own solution. They don’t have much idea.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/helga.schreiber26%40gmail.com

From cnusbaumnfb at gmail.com  Mon Mar  9 12:15:58 2015
From: cnusbaumnfb at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum)
Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2015 08:15:58 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] In Search of a Wordprocessing App for iOS
Message-ID: <83505A07-1C26-48B0-99DF-052064CB1643@gmail.com>

Hello All,

I've finally taken the plunge and requested that my school district purchase a Braille Edge 40 from HIMS to replace my BrailleNote Apex. Although this will be a very refreshing change to more reliable and up-to-date technology which is not prone to nearly as many issues as the BrailleNote, it will also come with a learning curve for me, as I will have to get used to doing my schoolwork on my iPhone whilee it is connected to my Braille display. In preparation for this switch, I have been experimenting with doing more work on my iPhone while using my current BrailleNote as a Braille display for my iPhone. However, I have recently been having some issues with Apple's Pages app for word processing, most notably the inability to access all the pages of a multi-page document. I have been experimenting with many alternative apps, including AccessNote from AFB, VoiceDream Writer, and Drafts. Unfortunately, all these apps fall short for me because they cannot open Microsoft Word documents from email attachments—if they can open anything created outside of their apps at all, they can only open TXT and RTF file formats. Since I receive the majority of my schoolwork via email from my teachers, this will not work for me. So, for those who use iOS for classwork, are there any other apps I should try? Also, is there any advice you can give me on the problem I am currently having with Pages? Thanks in advance for any help you can provide.

Chris Nusbaum

From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com  Mon Mar  9 13:27:05 2015
From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton)
Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2015 09:27:05 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Alternatives to Google Docs for collaboration
In-Reply-To: <CAO2euMdZOCLc7bHW6CJ-VnOTb-oLvfWXMS4xwK-na2=MG9ZnqQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAO2euMdZOCLc7bHW6CJ-VnOTb-oLvfWXMS4xwK-na2=MG9ZnqQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAFja7FYg6zv4KE+XRnvE+DggeSHrHmrFaYPF+4A5u7DG2dwijg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

I'm interested in this thread as well.  As someone who has avoided
Google Docs like the plague in the past, I completely agree that the
Google Docs system is far from ideal in terms of accessibility.  It
does work better with NVDA, but although it's a relatively small
inconvenience I hate switching screenreaders when I don't necessarily
want to just to access more programs.  I'm finally biting the bullet
because I don't think avoiding Google Docs is a realistic option any
more, and it will become less so in the future, but it would be nice
to have other similar tools in the toolbox as well.

Thanks,

On 3/7/15, Phil via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Hey guys,
>
> Has anyone used any web-based word processor and spreadsheet other
> than Google Docs for personal use and for collaboration?  If so, how
> accessible are they for screen-reader users?
> For example, tools like Zoho, BuzzWord, Microsoft Office 365, People,
> OpenGoo, Etherpad, etc.?
>
> We all know Google Docs can be annoying to use for screen reader
> users, to put it nicely. So let's share tips and advice on what
> alternative tools are available.
>
> Thanks a lot!
>
> Best,
> Phil
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com
>


-- 
Kaiti


From martinezana770 at gmail.com  Mon Mar  9 18:28:11 2015
From: martinezana770 at gmail.com (Ana Martinez)
Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2015 12:28:11 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] jobs
Message-ID: <CAPMxSt0ibH=g0y_=xbom=yH4hw7DgqRjg2T7kjXDvdrP0eUVZw@mail.gmail.com>

hi all I have a question, for those who are in high school do you guys
have any job? I am planning on getting a job soon so I was wondering
what kind of jobs can you work in high school? thanks. sorry for my
english


From blackbyrdfly at gmail.com  Mon Mar  9 19:34:25 2015
From: blackbyrdfly at gmail.com (Jamie Principato)
Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2015 13:34:25 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] jobs
In-Reply-To: <CAPMxSt0ibH=g0y_=xbom=yH4hw7DgqRjg2T7kjXDvdrP0eUVZw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAPMxSt0ibH=g0y_=xbom=yH4hw7DgqRjg2T7kjXDvdrP0eUVZw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <49B3096F-736F-4C03-AAD9-1D943682A547@gmail.com>

I was a tutor in high school. It was essentially self employment, but it worked well for me and I never had a shortage of students. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 9, 2015, at 12:28 PM, Ana Martinez via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> hi all I have a question, for those who are in high school do you guys
> have any job? I am planning on getting a job soon so I was wondering
> what kind of jobs can you work in high school? thanks. sorry for my
> english
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com


From justin.williams2 at gmail.com  Mon Mar  9 19:36:51 2015
From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams)
Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2015 15:36:51 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] jobs
In-Reply-To: <49B3096F-736F-4C03-AAD9-1D943682A547@gmail.com>
References: <CAPMxSt0ibH=g0y_=xbom=yH4hw7DgqRjg2T7kjXDvdrP0eUVZw@mail.gmail.com>
	<49B3096F-736F-4C03-AAD9-1D943682A547@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <008501d05aa0$645b5a00$2d120e00$@gmail.com>

I've seen reference to several of our fellow students who did tutoring.
However, I was not that creative in high school, so I didn't think of that,
so kudos to you folks.

Justin.
-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jamie
Principato via nabs-l
Sent: Monday, March 09, 2015 3:34 PM
To: Ana Martinez; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] jobs

I was a tutor in high school. It was essentially self employment, but it
worked well for me and I never had a shortage of students. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 9, 2015, at 12:28 PM, Ana Martinez via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
wrote:
> 
> hi all I have a question, for those who are in high school do you guys 
> have any job? I am planning on getting a job soon so I was wondering 
> what kind of jobs can you work in high school? thanks. sorry for my 
> english
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gma
> il.com

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail
.com



From rbacchus228 at gmail.com  Mon Mar  9 23:08:47 2015
From: rbacchus228 at gmail.com (Roanna Bacchus)
Date: Mon, 09 Mar 2015 19:08:47 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay
	foronlineeducation?
Message-ID: <54fe282c.b71d8c0a.6e4a.ffff9040@mx.google.com>

Hi Phil I took both online and on-campus classes when I was at 
Seminole State College.  I am doing the same thing at UCF.


From arielle71 at gmail.com  Mon Mar  9 23:20:50 2015
From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman)
Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2015 16:20:50 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Writing math equations
In-Reply-To: <CAMtP_9c7c+GWPx4hKWi5XNML7s8V810F3upqFXEm1-e6Q91RtQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMtP_9c7c+GWPx4hKWi5XNML7s8V810F3upqFXEm1-e6Q91RtQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CALAYQJCCMke9mHnk-+oSr_xKt=LtCzNxXbqUjuwvZ8kvbh9hQg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Elif, Unfortunately, JAWS does not read equations well. I would
recommend getting your textbook from Learning Ally if they have it,
because they will read all the equations and formulas aloud. If that
is not a viable option, can you hire a reader, at least to read you
the essential things like homework assignments? If it's just a few
equations you need, you can simply ask your professor to type them out
for you one character at a time. That's what I did for statistics
exams. If it's the whole textbook, though, then I suggest using
Learning Ally or a live reader. Another option is to take statistics
in person instead of online, which would allow you to hear the
equations spoken aloud during class lectures and reduce your need to
get them from the text.
Best, Arielle

On 3/8/15, Elif Emir Öksüz <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Hi all,
> As some of you can remember, I’m taking a statistic course now, and
> I’ll take many of them. My university has no knowledge about providing
> accessible books. They believe that single pdf is accessible. I can
> deal with it for all other courses, but not statistic.
> I need the equations and tables. They tried to write the equations.
> Jaws can read it as a whole but I can’t navigate in it. I copied an
> example here but since it is a picture or something like that, it
> doesn't paste.
>
> I don’t know braille yet. So guys what do you do with these kind of
> things? How does your school provide you an accessible version of
> these kind of equations?
> Please let me know your ways, I desperately need a solution ASAP, and
> my school wants me to find my own solution. They don’t have much idea.
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com
>


From gpaikens at gmail.com  Tue Mar 10 01:28:35 2015
From: gpaikens at gmail.com (Greg Aikens)
Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2015 21:28:35 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] In Search of a Wordprocessing App for iOS
In-Reply-To: <83505A07-1C26-48B0-99DF-052064CB1643@gmail.com>
References: <83505A07-1C26-48B0-99DF-052064CB1643@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <B1C3F097-97A9-4D92-81B2-7A572E426A1B@gmail.com>

I have heard that the Microsoft Word IOS app is accessible with VoiceOver. I have not tried it myself yet. 

I have not worked much with the IOS version of Pages and so can’t offer any tips there. 

Best,
Greg

> On Mar 9, 2015, at 8:15 AM, Chris Nusbaum via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hello All,
> 
> I've finally taken the plunge and requested that my school district purchase a Braille Edge 40 from HIMS to replace my BrailleNote Apex. Although this will be a very refreshing change to more reliable and up-to-date technology which is not prone to nearly as many issues as the BrailleNote, it will also come with a learning curve for me, as I will have to get used to doing my schoolwork on my iPhone whilee it is connected to my Braille display. In preparation for this switch, I have been experimenting with doing more work on my iPhone while using my current BrailleNote as a Braille display for my iPhone. However, I have recently been having some issues with Apple's Pages app for word processing, most notably the inability to access all the pages of a multi-page document. I have been experimenting with many alternative apps, including AccessNote from AFB, VoiceDream Writer, and Drafts. Unfortunately, all these apps fall short for me because they cannot open Microsoft Word documents from email attachments—if they can open anything created outside of their apps at all, they can only open TXT and RTF file formats. Since I receive the majority of my schoolwork via email from my teachers, this will not work for me. So, for those who use iOS for classwork, are there any other apps I should try? Also, is there any advice you can give me on the problem I am currently having with Pages? Thanks in advance for any help you can provide.
> 
> Chris Nusbaum
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gpaikens%40gmail.com



From bridgetawalker13 at aol.com  Tue Mar 10 02:45:28 2015
From: bridgetawalker13 at aol.com (Bridget Walker)
Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2015 22:45:28 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] In Search of a Wordprocessing App for iOS
In-Reply-To: <B1C3F097-97A9-4D92-81B2-7A572E426A1B@gmail.com>
References: <83505A07-1C26-48B0-99DF-052064CB1643@gmail.com>
	<B1C3F097-97A9-4D92-81B2-7A572E426A1B@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <F5D9206B-728D-47C4-926C-86390D573D4D@aol.com>

The Microsoft word app has already been suggested and I agree it works well. I did not like pages with voiceover however, documents is one that works with VoiceOver. I like it.
HTH 
Bridget  

Sent from my iPad

> On Mar 9, 27 Heisei, at 9:28 PM, Greg Aikens via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> I have heard that the Microsoft Word IOS app is accessible with VoiceOver. I have not tried it myself yet. 
> 
> I have not worked much with the IOS version of Pages and so can’t offer any tips there. 
> 
> Best,
> Greg
> 
>> On Mar 9, 2015, at 8:15 AM, Chris Nusbaum via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Hello All,
>> 
>> I've finally taken the plunge and requested that my school district purchase a Braille Edge 40 from HIMS to replace my BrailleNote Apex. Although this will be a very refreshing change to more reliable and up-to-date technology which is not prone to nearly as many issues as the BrailleNote, it will also come with a learning curve for me, as I will have to get used to doing my schoolwork on my iPhone whilee it is connected to my Braille display. In preparation for this switch, I have been experimenting with doing more work on my iPhone while using my current BrailleNote as a Braille display for my iPhone. However, I have recently been having some issues with Apple's Pages app for word processing, most notably the inability to access all the pages of a multi-page document. I have been experimenting with many alternative apps, including AccessNote from AFB, VoiceDream Writer, and Drafts. Unfortunately, all these apps fall short for me because they cannot open Microsoft Word documents from email attachments—if they can open anything created outside of their apps at all, they can only open TXT and RTF file formats. Since I receive the majority of my schoolwork via email from my teachers, this will not work for me. So, for those who use iOS for classwork, are there any other apps I should try? Also, is there any advice you can give me on the problem I am currently having with Pages? Thanks in advance for any help you can provide.
>> 
>> Chris Nusbaum
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gpaikens%40gmail.com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bridgetawalker13%40aol.com


From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com  Tue Mar 10 03:58:43 2015
From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton)
Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2015 23:58:43 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] jobs
In-Reply-To: <008501d05aa0$645b5a00$2d120e00$@gmail.com>
References: <CAPMxSt0ibH=g0y_=xbom=yH4hw7DgqRjg2T7kjXDvdrP0eUVZw@mail.gmail.com>
	<49B3096F-736F-4C03-AAD9-1D943682A547@gmail.com>
	<008501d05aa0$645b5a00$2d120e00$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAFja7FZaVtwj7i4gTLdem7G5+Ob5v9-Ti2PVL_S91sCnM50gXA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

Maybe this is not the route you want to go, but I was a babysitter a
lot in the summers.  My situation was a little different; my Aunt
would drop off my two younger cousins between 5:30 and 6:00 AM and
pick them up around 2:30 in the afternoon, but I don't think most
people would have that odd of a shift for a high school kid.  I
babysat anywhere from 2 to 5 days per week, and she'd tack on a little
extra when I took the boys swimming in the pool since I had the CPR
and swim training to fend off any potential problems, and also when I
taught the older boy some beginning piano lessons.  It's pretty
standard, but it put money in my pocket for camps and things I wanted
to pay for while being fun.

Some agencies for the blind offer internships or summer work
experience programs for high school students.  I'd definitely look
into those in blindness organizations around you.  I was a
receptionist and helped in the braille department at a program like
this for college and high school students in my area this summer, and
along with two friends of mine who were also working I had a blast.

If you know how to knit, make jewelery, or do anything artsy like that
you could make things to sell.  I know some people who do that, and
it's nice because you're not comitted to any schedule.

Finally, I found in high school that volunteering was very important
to me.  It might not have helped me earn money, but if you find
someone who is in your prospective field of study and can shadow or
volunteer under them that's huge for a resume.  Sometimes relevant
experience is more important to a prospective employer than the number
of jobs you've held, so it's good to try to volunteer or shadow if you
can as often as you are able.

Hope these suggestions help.

On 3/9/15, justin williams via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> I've seen reference to several of our fellow students who did tutoring.
> However, I was not that creative in high school, so I didn't think of that,
> so kudos to you folks.
>
> Justin.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jamie
> Principato via nabs-l
> Sent: Monday, March 09, 2015 3:34 PM
> To: Ana Martinez; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] jobs
>
> I was a tutor in high school. It was essentially self employment, but it
> worked well for me and I never had a shortage of students.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Mar 9, 2015, at 12:28 PM, Ana Martinez via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> wrote:
>>
>> hi all I have a question, for those who are in high school do you guys
>> have any job? I am planning on getting a job soon so I was wondering
>> what kind of jobs can you work in high school? thanks. sorry for my
>> english
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gma
>> il.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail
> .com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com
>


-- 
Kaiti


From helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com  Tue Mar 10 07:04:59 2015
From: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com (Helga Schreiber)
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2015 03:04:59 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] In Search of a Wordprocessing App for iOS
In-Reply-To: <F5D9206B-728D-47C4-926C-86390D573D4D@aol.com>
References: <83505A07-1C26-48B0-99DF-052064CB1643@gmail.com>
	<B1C3F097-97A9-4D92-81B2-7A572E426A1B@gmail.com>
	<F5D9206B-728D-47C4-926C-86390D573D4D@aol.com>
Message-ID: <5174AB49-55C8-45C0-AA53-B2D458732AA7@gmail.com>

Hi Bridget and all! Are you guys sure that the Microsoft Word app is accessible with VoiceOver? I'm just wondering since actually one or two years ago, I don't remember, someone told me that it was not accessible with VoiceOver, and that i needed to use the Pages app! I actually have the Pages app, and I use it twice, but it is actually a very difficult writing a paper with it. However, if the Microsoft word app is accessible with VoiceOver, as you guys said, I think I will download it sice I would like to do my homework in there as well, like Chris. And one last question, is the Microsoft Word app free? Just curious! Hope to hear from you soon. Thanks so much and God bless!

Helga Schreiber

Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter.
Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of Blind Students.
Member of the International Networkers Team (INT).
Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research.
Phone:  (561) 706-5950 
Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com 
Skype: helga.schreiber26 
4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx 
INT Website: http://int4life.com/ 

"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16 
Sent from my iPhone 

> On Mar 9, 2015, at 10:45 PM, Bridget Walker via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> The Microsoft word app has already been suggested and I agree it works well. I did not like pages with voiceover however, documents is one that works with VoiceOver. I like it.
> HTH 
> Bridget  
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On Mar 9, 27 Heisei, at 9:28 PM, Greg Aikens via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> 
>> I have heard that the Microsoft Word IOS app is accessible with VoiceOver. I have not tried it myself yet. 
>> 
>> I have not worked much with the IOS version of Pages and so can’t offer any tips there. 
>> 
>> Best,
>> Greg
>> 
>>> On Mar 9, 2015, at 8:15 AM, Chris Nusbaum via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hello All,
>>> 
>>> I've finally taken the plunge and requested that my school district purchase a Braille Edge 40 from HIMS to replace my BrailleNote Apex. Although this will be a very refreshing change to more reliable and up-to-date technology which is not prone to nearly as many issues as the BrailleNote, it will also come with a learning curve for me, as I will have to get used to doing my schoolwork on my iPhone whilee it is connected to my Braille display. In preparation for this switch, I have been experimenting with doing more work on my iPhone while using my current BrailleNote as a Braille display for my iPhone. However, I have recently been having some issues with Apple's Pages app for word processing, most notably the inability to access all the pages of a multi-page document. I have been experimenting with many alternative apps, including AccessNote from AFB, VoiceDream Writer, and Drafts. Unfortunately, all these apps fall short for me because they cannot open Microsoft Word documents from email attachments—if they can open anything created outside of their apps at all, they can only open TXT and RTF file formats. Since I receive the majority of my schoolwork via email from my teachers, this will not work for me. So, for those who use iOS for classwork, are there any other apps I should try? Also, is there any advice you can give me on the problem I am currently having with Pages? Thanks in advance for any help you can provide.
>>> 
>>> Chris Nusbaum
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gpaikens%40gmail.com
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bridgetawalker13%40aol.com
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/helga.schreiber26%40gmail.com

From starmy22 at gmail.com  Tue Mar 10 11:47:31 2015
From: starmy22 at gmail.com (John Sanders)
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2015 07:47:31 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] jobs
In-Reply-To: <008501d05aa0$645b5a00$2d120e00$@gmail.com>
References: <CAPMxSt0ibH=g0y_=xbom=yH4hw7DgqRjg2T7kjXDvdrP0eUVZw@mail.gmail.com><49B3096F-736F-4C03-AAD9-1D943682A547@gmail.com>
	<008501d05aa0$645b5a00$2d120e00$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AFE6F38FA44940D6830FA50B00ECAA54@JohnSandersPC>

Hi,
I have a question:  my local commission for the blind here in Michigan is 
saying that now I need to start finding jobs on my own.
They have been helping me in the past.
In Michigan there are not many jobs out in the area where I live.
They want me to get involved with my local employment agency that will help 
me in improving my interview skills and building resume skills.
They have never done this to me before.
They also want me to start filling out this employment log and sending it in 
every two weeks.
I'm not getting any help from them anymore as far as finding jobs.
I don't have that much experience with education.
I don't have a college degree in anything.
The only thing I have is a high school diploma.
Isn't the blind commission supposed to help those people who are blind find 
employment?
I hope to hear from you soon.
Sincerely,
John Sanders


-----Original Message----- 
From: justin williams via nabs-l
Sent: Monday, March 09, 2015 3:36 PM
To: 'Jamie Principato' ; 'National Association of Blind Students mailing 
list'
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] jobs

I've seen reference to several of our fellow students who did tutoring.
However, I was not that creative in high school, so I didn't think of that,
so kudos to you folks.

Justin.
-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jamie
Principato via nabs-l
Sent: Monday, March 09, 2015 3:34 PM
To: Ana Martinez; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] jobs

I was a tutor in high school. It was essentially self employment, but it
worked well for me and I never had a shortage of students.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 9, 2015, at 12:28 PM, Ana Martinez via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
wrote:
>
> hi all I have a question, for those who are in high school do you guys
> have any job? I am planning on getting a job soon so I was wondering
> what kind of jobs can you work in high school? thanks. sorry for my
> english
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gma
> il.com

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail
.com


_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/starmy22%40gmail.com 



From cnusbaumnfb at gmail.com  Tue Mar 10 12:13:04 2015
From: cnusbaumnfb at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum)
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2015 08:13:04 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] jobs
In-Reply-To: <CAPMxSt0ibH=g0y_=xbom=yH4hw7DgqRjg2T7kjXDvdrP0eUVZw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAPMxSt0ibH=g0y_=xbom=yH4hw7DgqRjg2T7kjXDvdrP0eUVZw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <158FEA1D-5048-4207-8E50-D793D304A9FA@gmail.com>

Ana,

I'm currently a junior in high school. Though I don't have a regular part-time entry-level job like many of my classmates, I have participated in an internship program for the past two summers. This has allowed me to have a very rewarding summer job, last year as an intern in the IT department of my school district working on accessibility and assistive technology. Most high schools have internship or work experience programs which allow students to gain some experience and maybe some money in a local business which has already agreed to hire high school students. I would check with your school's internship coordinator or your guidance counselor and inquire as to what is available. Even if you're not interested in any of the available internship opportunities, your counselor will usually know about available jobs in your community. I would also check with your NFB chapter or state affiliate President, as they may know of employers who are open to hiring blind people.

HTH,

Chris Nusbaum

> On Mar 9, 2015, at 2:28 PM, Ana Martinez via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> hi all I have a question, for those who are in high school do you guys
> have any job? I am planning on getting a job soon so I was wondering
> what kind of jobs can you work in high school? thanks. sorry for my
> english
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/cnusbaumnfb%40gmail.com


From martinezana770 at gmail.com  Tue Mar 10 14:28:35 2015
From: martinezana770 at gmail.com (Ana Martinez)
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2015 08:28:35 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] jobs
Message-ID: <CAPMxSt3MiTsunwn=BBABHsrr2sxrOh0QhiZSN7GSrvUoku-Q7A@mail.gmail.com>

thanks all for your suggestions :)

On 3/10/15, nabs-l-request at nfbnet.org <nabs-l-request at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Send nabs-l mailing list submissions to
> 	nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> 	http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> 	nabs-l-request at nfbnet.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> 	nabs-l-owner at nfbnet.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of nabs-l digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. In Search of a Wordprocessing App for iOS (Chris Nusbaum)
>    2. Re: Alternatives to Google Docs for collaboration (Kaiti Shelton)
>    3. jobs (Ana Martinez)
>    4. Re: jobs (Jamie Principato)
>    5. Re: jobs (justin williams)
>    6. Re: Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay
>       foronlineeducation? (Roanna Bacchus)
>    7. Re: Writing math equations (Arielle Silverman)
>    8. Re: In Search of a Wordprocessing App for iOS (Greg Aikens)
>    9. Re: In Search of a Wordprocessing App for iOS (Bridget Walker)
>   10. Re: jobs (Kaiti Shelton)
>   11. Re: In Search of a Wordprocessing App for iOS (Helga Schreiber)
>   12. Re: jobs (John Sanders)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2015 08:15:58 -0400
> From: Chris Nusbaum <cnusbaumnfb at gmail.com>
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> 	<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: [nabs-l] In Search of a Wordprocessing App for iOS
> Message-ID: <83505A07-1C26-48B0-99DF-052064CB1643 at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;	charset=utf-8
>
> Hello All,
>
> I've finally taken the plunge and requested that my school district purchase
> a Braille Edge 40 from HIMS to replace my BrailleNote Apex. Although this
> will be a very refreshing change to more reliable and up-to-date technology
> which is not prone to nearly as many issues as the BrailleNote, it will also
> come with a learning curve for me, as I will have to get used to doing my
> schoolwork on my iPhone whilee it is connected to my Braille display. In
> preparation for this switch, I have been experimenting with doing more work
> on my iPhone while using my current BrailleNote as a Braille display for my
> iPhone. However, I have recently been having some issues with Apple's Pages
> app for word processing, most notably the inability to access all the pages
> of a multi-page document. I have been experimenting with many alternative
> apps, including AccessNote from AFB, VoiceDream Writer, and Drafts.
> Unfortunately, all these apps fall short for me because they cannot open
> Microsoft Word documents from email attachments?if they can open anything
> created outside of their apps at all, they can only open TXT and RTF file
> formats. Since I receive the majority of my schoolwork via email from my
> teachers, this will not work for me. So, for those who use iOS for
> classwork, are there any other apps I should try? Also, is there any advice
> you can give me on the problem I am currently having with Pages? Thanks in
> advance for any help you can provide.
>
> Chris Nusbaum
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2015 09:27:05 -0400
> From: Kaiti Shelton <crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com>
> To: Phil <philso1003 at gmail.com>, 	National Association of Blind
> 	Students mailing list <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Alternatives to Google Docs for collaboration
> Message-ID:
> 	<CAFja7FYg6zv4KE+XRnvE+DggeSHrHmrFaYPF+4A5u7DG2dwijg at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm interested in this thread as well.  As someone who has avoided
> Google Docs like the plague in the past, I completely agree that the
> Google Docs system is far from ideal in terms of accessibility.  It
> does work better with NVDA, but although it's a relatively small
> inconvenience I hate switching screenreaders when I don't necessarily
> want to just to access more programs.  I'm finally biting the bullet
> because I don't think avoiding Google Docs is a realistic option any
> more, and it will become less so in the future, but it would be nice
> to have other similar tools in the toolbox as well.
>
> Thanks,
>
> On 3/7/15, Phil via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> Hey guys,
>>
>> Has anyone used any web-based word processor and spreadsheet other
>> than Google Docs for personal use and for collaboration?  If so, how
>> accessible are they for screen-reader users?
>> For example, tools like Zoho, BuzzWord, Microsoft Office 365, People,
>> OpenGoo, Etherpad, etc.?
>>
>> We all know Google Docs can be annoying to use for screen reader
>> users, to put it nicely. So let's share tips and advice on what
>> alternative tools are available.
>>
>> Thanks a lot!
>>
>> Best,
>> Phil
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com
>>
>
>
> --
> Kaiti
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2015 12:28:11 -0600
> From: Ana Martinez <martinezana770 at gmail.com>
> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> Subject: [nabs-l] jobs
> Message-ID:
> 	<CAPMxSt0ibH=g0y_=xbom=yH4hw7DgqRjg2T7kjXDvdrP0eUVZw at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> hi all I have a question, for those who are in high school do you guys
> have any job? I am planning on getting a job soon so I was wondering
> what kind of jobs can you work in high school? thanks. sorry for my
> english
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2015 13:34:25 -0600
> From: Jamie Principato <blackbyrdfly at gmail.com>
> To: Ana Martinez <martinezana770 at gmail.com>,	National Association of
> 	Blind Students mailing list <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] jobs
> Message-ID: <49B3096F-736F-4C03-AAD9-1D943682A547 at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;	charset=us-ascii
>
> I was a tutor in high school. It was essentially self employment, but it
> worked well for me and I never had a shortage of students.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Mar 9, 2015, at 12:28 PM, Ana Martinez via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>> hi all I have a question, for those who are in high school do you guys
>> have any job? I am planning on getting a job soon so I was wondering
>> what kind of jobs can you work in high school? thanks. sorry for my
>> english
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2015 15:36:51 -0400
> From: "justin williams" <justin.williams2 at gmail.com>
> To: "'Jamie Principato'" <blackbyrdfly at gmail.com>,	"'National
> 	Association of Blind Students mailing list'" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] jobs
> Message-ID: <008501d05aa0$645b5a00$2d120e00$@gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="us-ascii"
>
> I've seen reference to several of our fellow students who did tutoring.
> However, I was not that creative in high school, so I didn't think of that,
> so kudos to you folks.
>
> Justin.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jamie
> Principato via nabs-l
> Sent: Monday, March 09, 2015 3:34 PM
> To: Ana Martinez; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] jobs
>
> I was a tutor in high school. It was essentially self employment, but it
> worked well for me and I never had a shortage of students.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Mar 9, 2015, at 12:28 PM, Ana Martinez via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> wrote:
>>
>> hi all I have a question, for those who are in high school do you guys
>> have any job? I am planning on getting a job soon so I was wondering
>> what kind of jobs can you work in high school? thanks. sorry for my
>> english
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gma
>> il.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail
> .com
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Mon, 09 Mar 2015 19:08:47 -0400
> From: Roanna Bacchus <rbacchus228 at gmail.com>
> To: Phil <philso1003 at gmail.com>,	National Association of Blind
> 	Students mailing list<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Does DVR / Commission for the Blind pay
> 	foronlineeducation?
> Message-ID: <54fe282c.b71d8c0a.6e4a.ffff9040 at mx.google.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Hi Phil I took both online and on-campus classes when I was at
> Seminole State College.  I am doing the same thing at UCF.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2015 16:20:50 -0700
> From: Arielle Silverman <arielle71 at gmail.com>
> To: Elif Emir ?ks?z <filerime at gmail.com>,	National Association of
> 	Blind Students mailing list <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Writing math equations
> Message-ID:
> 	<CALAYQJCCMke9mHnk-+oSr_xKt=LtCzNxXbqUjuwvZ8kvbh9hQg at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> Hi Elif, Unfortunately, JAWS does not read equations well. I would
> recommend getting your textbook from Learning Ally if they have it,
> because they will read all the equations and formulas aloud. If that
> is not a viable option, can you hire a reader, at least to read you
> the essential things like homework assignments? If it's just a few
> equations you need, you can simply ask your professor to type them out
> for you one character at a time. That's what I did for statistics
> exams. If it's the whole textbook, though, then I suggest using
> Learning Ally or a live reader. Another option is to take statistics
> in person instead of online, which would allow you to hear the
> equations spoken aloud during class lectures and reduce your need to
> get them from the text.
> Best, Arielle
>
> On 3/8/15, Elif Emir ?ks?z <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> Hi all,
>> As some of you can remember, I?m taking a statistic course now, and
>> I?ll take many of them. My university has no knowledge about providing
>> accessible books. They believe that single pdf is accessible. I can
>> deal with it for all other courses, but not statistic.
>> I need the equations and tables. They tried to write the equations.
>> Jaws can read it as a whole but I can?t navigate in it. I copied an
>> example here but since it is a picture or something like that, it
>> doesn't paste.
>>
>> I don?t know braille yet. So guys what do you do with these kind of
>> things? How does your school provide you an accessible version of
>> these kind of equations?
>> Please let me know your ways, I desperately need a solution ASAP, and
>> my school wants me to find my own solution. They don?t have much idea.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2015 21:28:35 -0400
> From: Greg Aikens <gpaikens at gmail.com>
> To: Chris Nusbaum <cnusbaumnfb at gmail.com>,	National Association of
> 	Blind Students mailing list <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] In Search of a Wordprocessing App for iOS
> Message-ID: <B1C3F097-97A9-4D92-81B2-7A572E426A1B at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>
> I have heard that the Microsoft Word IOS app is accessible with VoiceOver. I
> have not tried it myself yet.
>
> I have not worked much with the IOS version of Pages and so can?t offer any
> tips there.
>
> Best,
> Greg
>
>> On Mar 9, 2015, at 8:15 AM, Chris Nusbaum via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hello All,
>>
>> I've finally taken the plunge and requested that my school district
>> purchase a Braille Edge 40 from HIMS to replace my BrailleNote Apex.
>> Although this will be a very refreshing change to more reliable and
>> up-to-date technology which is not prone to nearly as many issues as the
>> BrailleNote, it will also come with a learning curve for me, as I will
>> have to get used to doing my schoolwork on my iPhone whilee it is
>> connected to my Braille display. In preparation for this switch, I have
>> been experimenting with doing more work on my iPhone while using my
>> current BrailleNote as a Braille display for my iPhone. However, I have
>> recently been having some issues with Apple's Pages app for word
>> processing, most notably the inability to access all the pages of a
>> multi-page document. I have been experimenting with many alternative apps,
>> including AccessNote from AFB, VoiceDream Writer, and Drafts.
>> Unfortunately, all these apps fall short for me because they cannot open
>> Microsoft Word documents from email attachments?if they can open anything
>> created outside of their apps at all, they can only open TXT and RTF file
>> formats. Since I receive the majority of my schoolwork via email from my
>> teachers, this will not work for me. So, for those who use iOS for
>> classwork, are there any other apps I should try? Also, is there any
>> advice you can give me on the problem I am currently having with Pages?
>> Thanks in advance for any help you can provide.
>>
>> Chris Nusbaum
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gpaikens%40gmail.com
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2015 22:45:28 -0400
> From: Bridget Walker <bridgetawalker13 at aol.com>
> To: Greg Aikens <gpaikens at gmail.com>,	National Association of Blind
> 	Students mailing list <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] In Search of a Wordprocessing App for iOS
> Message-ID: <F5D9206B-728D-47C4-926C-86390D573D4D at aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>
> The Microsoft word app has already been suggested and I agree it works well.
> I did not like pages with voiceover however, documents is one that works
> with VoiceOver. I like it.
> HTH
> Bridget
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Mar 9, 27 Heisei, at 9:28 PM, Greg Aikens via nabs-l
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>
>> I have heard that the Microsoft Word IOS app is accessible with VoiceOver.
>> I have not tried it myself yet.
>>
>> I have not worked much with the IOS version of Pages and so can?t offer
>> any tips there.
>>
>> Best,
>> Greg
>>
>>> On Mar 9, 2015, at 8:15 AM, Chris Nusbaum via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hello All,
>>>
>>> I've finally taken the plunge and requested that my school district
>>> purchase a Braille Edge 40 from HIMS to replace my BrailleNote Apex.
>>> Although this will be a very refreshing change to more reliable and
>>> up-to-date technology which is not prone to nearly as many issues as the
>>> BrailleNote, it will also come with a learning curve for me, as I will
>>> have to get used to doing my schoolwork on my iPhone whilee it is
>>> connected to my Braille display. In preparation for this switch, I have
>>> been experimenting with doing more work on my iPhone while using my
>>> current BrailleNote as a Braille display for my iPhone. However, I have
>>> recently been having some issues with Apple's Pages app for word
>>> processing, most notably the inability to access all the pages of a
>>> multi-page document. I have been experimenting with many alternative
>>> apps, including AccessNote from AFB, VoiceDream Writer, and Drafts.
>>> Unfortunately, all these apps fall short for me because they cannot open
>>> Microsoft Word documents from email attachments?if they can open anything
>>> created outside of their apps at all, they can only open TXT and RTF file
>>> formats. Since I receive the majority of my schoolwork via email from my
>>> teachers, this will not work for me. So, for those who use iOS for
>>> classwork, are there any other apps I should try? Also, is there any
>>> advice you can give me on the problem I am currently having with Pages?
>>> Thanks in advance for any help you can provide.
>>>
>>> Chris Nusbaum
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gpaikens%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bridgetawalker13%40aol.com
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 10
> Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2015 23:58:43 -0400
> From: Kaiti Shelton <crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com>
> To: justin williams <justin.williams2 at gmail.com>, 	National
> 	Association of Blind Students mailing list <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] jobs
> Message-ID:
> 	<CAFja7FZaVtwj7i4gTLdem7G5+Ob5v9-Ti2PVL_S91sCnM50gXA at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Hi,
>
> Maybe this is not the route you want to go, but I was a babysitter a
> lot in the summers.  My situation was a little different; my Aunt
> would drop off my two younger cousins between 5:30 and 6:00 AM and
> pick them up around 2:30 in the afternoon, but I don't think most
> people would have that odd of a shift for a high school kid.  I
> babysat anywhere from 2 to 5 days per week, and she'd tack on a little
> extra when I took the boys swimming in the pool since I had the CPR
> and swim training to fend off any potential problems, and also when I
> taught the older boy some beginning piano lessons.  It's pretty
> standard, but it put money in my pocket for camps and things I wanted
> to pay for while being fun.
>
> Some agencies for the blind offer internships or summer work
> experience programs for high school students.  I'd definitely look
> into those in blindness organizations around you.  I was a
> receptionist and helped in the braille department at a program like
> this for college and high school students in my area this summer, and
> along with two friends of mine who were also working I had a blast.
>
> If you know how to knit, make jewelery, or do anything artsy like that
> you could make things to sell.  I know some people who do that, and
> it's nice because you're not comitted to any schedule.
>
> Finally, I found in high school that volunteering was very important
> to me.  It might not have helped me earn money, but if you find
> someone who is in your prospective field of study and can shadow or
> volunteer under them that's huge for a resume.  Sometimes relevant
> experience is more important to a prospective employer than the number
> of jobs you've held, so it's good to try to volunteer or shadow if you
> can as often as you are able.
>
> Hope these suggestions help.
>
> On 3/9/15, justin williams via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> I've seen reference to several of our fellow students who did tutoring.
>> However, I was not that creative in high school, so I didn't think of
>> that,
>> so kudos to you folks.
>>
>> Justin.
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jamie
>> Principato via nabs-l
>> Sent: Monday, March 09, 2015 3:34 PM
>> To: Ana Martinez; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] jobs
>>
>> I was a tutor in high school. It was essentially self employment, but it
>> worked well for me and I never had a shortage of students.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Mar 9, 2015, at 12:28 PM, Ana Martinez via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> hi all I have a question, for those who are in high school do you guys
>>> have any job? I am planning on getting a job soon so I was wondering
>>> what kind of jobs can you work in high school? thanks. sorry for my
>>> english
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gma
>>> il.com
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail
>> .com
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com
>>
>
>
> --
> Kaiti
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 11
> Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2015 03:04:59 -0400
> From: Helga Schreiber <helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com>
> To: Bridget Walker <bridgetawalker13 at aol.com>,	National Association of
> 	Blind Students mailing list <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] In Search of a Wordprocessing App for iOS
> Message-ID: <5174AB49-55C8-45C0-AA53-B2D458732AA7 at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;	charset=utf-8
>
> Hi Bridget and all! Are you guys sure that the Microsoft Word app is
> accessible with VoiceOver? I'm just wondering since actually one or two
> years ago, I don't remember, someone told me that it was not accessible with
> VoiceOver, and that i needed to use the Pages app! I actually have the Pages
> app, and I use it twice, but it is actually a very difficult writing a paper
> with it. However, if the Microsoft word app is accessible with VoiceOver, as
> you guys said, I think I will download it sice I would like to do my
> homework in there as well, like Chris. And one last question, is the
> Microsoft Word app free? Just curious! Hope to hear from you soon. Thanks so
> much and God bless!
>
> Helga Schreiber
>
> Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter.
> Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of Blind
> Students.
> Member of the International Networkers Team (INT).
> Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research.
> Phone:  (561) 706-5950
> Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com
> Skype: helga.schreiber26
> 4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx
> INT Website: http://int4life.com/
>
> "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever
> believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Mar 9, 2015, at 10:45 PM, Bridget Walker via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>> The Microsoft word app has already been suggested and I agree it works
>> well. I did not like pages with voiceover however, documents is one that
>> works with VoiceOver. I like it.
>> HTH
>> Bridget
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>>> On Mar 9, 27 Heisei, at 9:28 PM, Greg Aikens via nabs-l
>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> I have heard that the Microsoft Word IOS app is accessible with
>>> VoiceOver. I have not tried it myself yet.
>>>
>>> I have not worked much with the IOS version of Pages and so can?t offer
>>> any tips there.
>>>
>>> Best,
>>> Greg
>>>
>>>> On Mar 9, 2015, at 8:15 AM, Chris Nusbaum via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hello All,
>>>>
>>>> I've finally taken the plunge and requested that my school district
>>>> purchase a Braille Edge 40 from HIMS to replace my BrailleNote Apex.
>>>> Although this will be a very refreshing change to more reliable and
>>>> up-to-date technology which is not prone to nearly as many issues as the
>>>> BrailleNote, it will also come with a learning curve for me, as I will
>>>> have to get used to doing my schoolwork on my iPhone whilee it is
>>>> connected to my Braille display. In preparation for this switch, I have
>>>> been experimenting with doing more work on my iPhone while using my
>>>> current BrailleNote as a Braille display for my iPhone. However, I have
>>>> recently been having some issues with Apple's Pages app for word
>>>> processing, most notably the inability to access all the pages of a
>>>> multi-page document. I have been experimenting with many alternative
>>>> apps, including AccessNote from AFB, VoiceDream Writer, and Drafts.
>>>> Unfortunately, all these apps fall short for me because they cannot open
>>>> Microsoft Word documents from email attachments?if they can open
>>>> anything created outside of their apps at all, they can only open TXT
>>>> and RTF file formats. Since I receive the majority of my schoolwork via
>>>> email from my teachers, this will not work for me. So, for those who use
>>>> iOS for classwork, are there any other apps I should try? Also, is there
>>>> any advice you can give me on the problem I am currently having with
>>>> Pages? Thanks in advance for any help you can provide.
>>>>
>>>> Chris Nusbaum
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gpaikens%40gmail.com
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bridgetawalker13%40aol.com
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/helga.schreiber26%40gmail.com
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 12
> Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2015 07:47:31 -0400
> From: "John Sanders" <starmy22 at gmail.com>
> To: "justin williams" <justin.williams2 at gmail.com>,	"National
> 	Association of Blind Students mailing list" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] jobs
> Message-ID: <AFE6F38FA44940D6830FA50B00ECAA54 at JohnSandersPC>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> 	reply-type=original
>
> Hi,
> I have a question:  my local commission for the blind here in Michigan is
> saying that now I need to start finding jobs on my own.
> They have been helping me in the past.
> In Michigan there are not many jobs out in the area where I live.
> They want me to get involved with my local employment agency that will help
>
> me in improving my interview skills and building resume skills.
> They have never done this to me before.
> They also want me to start filling out this employment log and sending it in
>
> every two weeks.
> I'm not getting any help from them anymore as far as finding jobs.
> I don't have that much experience with education.
> I don't have a college degree in anything.
> The only thing I have is a high school diploma.
> Isn't the blind commission supposed to help those people who are blind find
>
> employment?
> I hope to hear from you soon.
> Sincerely,
> John Sanders
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: justin williams via nabs-l
> Sent: Monday, March 09, 2015 3:36 PM
> To: 'Jamie Principato' ; 'National Association of Blind Students mailing
> list'
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] jobs
>
> I've seen reference to several of our fellow students who did tutoring.
> However, I was not that creative in high school, so I didn't think of that,
> so kudos to you folks.
>
> Justin.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jamie
> Principato via nabs-l
> Sent: Monday, March 09, 2015 3:34 PM
> To: Ana Martinez; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] jobs
>
> I was a tutor in high school. It was essentially self employment, but it
> worked well for me and I never had a shortage of students.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Mar 9, 2015, at 12:28 PM, Ana Martinez via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> wrote:
>>
>> hi all I have a question, for those who are in high school do you guys
>> have any job? I am planning on getting a job soon so I was wondering
>> what kind of jobs can you work in high school? thanks. sorry for my
>> english
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gma
>> il.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail
> .com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/starmy22%40gmail.com
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Subject: Digest Footer
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> End of nabs-l Digest, Vol 101, Issue 9
> **************************************
>


From johnniejduran at gmail.com  Tue Mar 10 16:28:48 2015
From: johnniejduran at gmail.com (johnnie Jean duran)
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2015 10:28:48 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] In Search of a Wordprocessing App for iOS
In-Reply-To: <5174AB49-55C8-45C0-AA53-B2D458732AA7@gmail.com>
References: <83505A07-1C26-48B0-99DF-052064CB1643@gmail.com>
	<B1C3F097-97A9-4D92-81B2-7A572E426A1B@gmail.com>
	<F5D9206B-728D-47C4-926C-86390D573D4D@aol.com>
	<5174AB49-55C8-45C0-AA53-B2D458732AA7@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAOiA0StqhS+pHYPWu0nQPg+rNhYjnfDLQw+OB_zoGqiC46x0iA@mail.gmail.com>

Good Morning!
I've experienced writting with several iOS apps, and out of all of
them, there are approximately 3 that I personally recommend.
* Pages - Pages is great, it's made by ample, and of course, like most
apple material, is accessible. However, it can be difficul to get used
to at first. The app is $9.99
* Notability - I am not aware of the price of the app, however, I am
certain it's not free. The buttons are nicely labeled, it is 100%
accessible with VoiceOver, and great for writing papers. These papers
can also be shared via an email, iMessage, etc.
* AccessNote - AccessNote is a word processor developed by the
American Foundation for the Blind as a resource for blind students.
The unique part about this app, is that the paperwork you have written
can not only be shared via email or iMessage, but it can also be
uploaded to dropbox directly from the app. It is 100% accessible with
VoiceOver, and works well with dictation. For a certain amount of time
the app was free, but if that time period has ended, the app is
$19.99.

On 3/10/15, Helga Schreiber via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Hi Bridget and all! Are you guys sure that the Microsoft Word app is
> accessible with VoiceOver? I'm just wondering since actually one or two
> years ago, I don't remember, someone told me that it was not accessible with
> VoiceOver, and that i needed to use the Pages app! I actually have the Pages
> app, and I use it twice, but it is actually a very difficult writing a paper
> with it. However, if the Microsoft word app is accessible with VoiceOver, as
> you guys said, I think I will download it sice I would like to do my
> homework in there as well, like Chris. And one last question, is the
> Microsoft Word app free? Just curious! Hope to hear from you soon. Thanks so
> much and God bless!
>
> Helga Schreiber
>
> Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter.
> Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of Blind
> Students.
> Member of the International Networkers Team (INT).
> Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research.
> Phone:  (561) 706-5950
> Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com
> Skype: helga.schreiber26
> 4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx
> INT Website: http://int4life.com/
>
> "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever
> believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Mar 9, 2015, at 10:45 PM, Bridget Walker via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>> The Microsoft word app has already been suggested and I agree it works
>> well. I did not like pages with voiceover however, documents is one that
>> works with VoiceOver. I like it.
>> HTH
>> Bridget
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>>> On Mar 9, 27 Heisei, at 9:28 PM, Greg Aikens via nabs-l
>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> I have heard that the Microsoft Word IOS app is accessible with
>>> VoiceOver. I have not tried it myself yet.
>>>
>>> I have not worked much with the IOS version of Pages and so can't offer
>>> any tips there.
>>>
>>> Best,
>>> Greg
>>>
>>>> On Mar 9, 2015, at 8:15 AM, Chris Nusbaum via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hello All,
>>>>
>>>> I've finally taken the plunge and requested that my school district
>>>> purchase a Braille Edge 40 from HIMS to replace my BrailleNote Apex.
>>>> Although this will be a very refreshing change to more reliable and
>>>> up-to-date technology which is not prone to nearly as many issues as the
>>>> BrailleNote, it will also come with a learning curve for me, as I will
>>>> have to get used to doing my schoolwork on my iPhone whilee it is
>>>> connected to my Braille display. In preparation for this switch, I have
>>>> been experimenting with doing more work on my iPhone while using my
>>>> current BrailleNote as a Braille display for my iPhone. However, I have
>>>> recently been having some issues with Apple's Pages app for word
>>>> processing, most notably the inability to access all the pages of a
>>>> multi-page document. I have been experimenting with many alternative
>>>> apps, including AccessNote from AFB, VoiceDream Writer, and Drafts.
>>>> Unfortunately, all these apps fall short for me because they cannot open
>>>> Microsoft Word documents from email attachments--if they can open
>>>> anything created outside of their apps at all, they can only open TXT
>>>> and RTF file formats. Since I receive the majority of my schoolwork via
>>>> email from my teachers, this will not work for me. So, for those who use
>>>> iOS for classwork, are there any other apps I should try? Also, is there
>>>> any advice you can give me on the problem I am currently having with
>>>> Pages? Thanks in advance for any help you can provide.
>>>>
>>>> Chris Nusbaum
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gpaikens%40gmail.com
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bridgetawalker13%40aol.com
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/helga.schreiber26%40gmail.com
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/johnniejduran%40gmail.com
>


-- 
Ms. Johnnie Jean Duran
9th Grade Student
Alameda International High School
Lakewood, Colorado, United States
Member Of The National Federation Of The Blind Of Colorado (NFBCO),
The Colorado Association Of Blind Students (CABS), and the North Metro
Chapter of the NFB.
Facebook: http://facebook.com/johnniejean.duran
Skype: jj.duran13
Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/jj_duran14
Voicemail: (303) 552-9683 (Voicemail only)


From herekittykat97 at gmail.com  Tue Mar 10 16:40:35 2015
From: herekittykat97 at gmail.com (Jewel)
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2015 12:40:35 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] In Search of a Wordprocessing App for iOS
In-Reply-To: <CAOiA0StqhS+pHYPWu0nQPg+rNhYjnfDLQw+OB_zoGqiC46x0iA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <83505A07-1C26-48B0-99DF-052064CB1643@gmail.com>
	<B1C3F097-97A9-4D92-81B2-7A572E426A1B@gmail.com>
	<F5D9206B-728D-47C4-926C-86390D573D4D@aol.com>
	<5174AB49-55C8-45C0-AA53-B2D458732AA7@gmail.com>
	<CAOiA0StqhS+pHYPWu0nQPg+rNhYjnfDLQw+OB_zoGqiC46x0iA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9BDF3225-AB45-40FB-AC4F-1E26055C13C6@gmail.com>

Has anyone suggested VoiceStream writer yet? It is a great word processor, and will reserve read back what you write.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 10, 2015, at 12:28 PM, johnnie Jean duran via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Good Morning!
> I've experienced writting with several iOS apps, and out of all of
> them, there are approximately 3 that I personally recommend.
> * Pages - Pages is great, it's made by ample, and of course, like most
> apple material, is accessible. However, it can be difficul to get used
> to at first. The app is $9.99
> * Notability - I am not aware of the price of the app, however, I am
> certain it's not free. The buttons are nicely labeled, it is 100%
> accessible with VoiceOver, and great for writing papers. These papers
> can also be shared via an email, iMessage, etc.
> * AccessNote - AccessNote is a word processor developed by the
> American Foundation for the Blind as a resource for blind students.
> The unique part about this app, is that the paperwork you have written
> can not only be shared via email or iMessage, but it can also be
> uploaded to dropbox directly from the app. It is 100% accessible with
> VoiceOver, and works well with dictation. For a certain amount of time
> the app was free, but if that time period has ended, the app is
> $19.99.
> 
>> On 3/10/15, Helga Schreiber via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> Hi Bridget and all! Are you guys sure that the Microsoft Word app is
>> accessible with VoiceOver? I'm just wondering since actually one or two
>> years ago, I don't remember, someone told me that it was not accessible with
>> VoiceOver, and that i needed to use the Pages app! I actually have the Pages
>> app, and I use it twice, but it is actually a very difficult writing a paper
>> with it. However, if the Microsoft word app is accessible with VoiceOver, as
>> you guys said, I think I will download it sice I would like to do my
>> homework in there as well, like Chris. And one last question, is the
>> Microsoft Word app free? Just curious! Hope to hear from you soon. Thanks so
>> much and God bless!
>> 
>> Helga Schreiber
>> 
>> Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter.
>> Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of Blind
>> Students.
>> Member of the International Networkers Team (INT).
>> Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research.
>> Phone:  (561) 706-5950
>> Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com
>> Skype: helga.schreiber26
>> 4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx
>> INT Website: http://int4life.com/
>> 
>> "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever
>> believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Mar 9, 2015, at 10:45 PM, Bridget Walker via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> The Microsoft word app has already been suggested and I agree it works
>>> well. I did not like pages with voiceover however, documents is one that
>>> works with VoiceOver. I like it.
>>> HTH
>>> Bridget
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>> 
>>>> On Mar 9, 27 Heisei, at 9:28 PM, Greg Aikens via nabs-l
>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> I have heard that the Microsoft Word IOS app is accessible with
>>>> VoiceOver. I have not tried it myself yet.
>>>> 
>>>> I have not worked much with the IOS version of Pages and so can't offer
>>>> any tips there.
>>>> 
>>>> Best,
>>>> Greg
>>>> 
>>>>> On Mar 9, 2015, at 8:15 AM, Chris Nusbaum via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Hello All,
>>>>> 
>>>>> I've finally taken the plunge and requested that my school district
>>>>> purchase a Braille Edge 40 from HIMS to replace my BrailleNote Apex.
>>>>> Although this will be a very refreshing change to more reliable and
>>>>> up-to-date technology which is not prone to nearly as many issues as the
>>>>> BrailleNote, it will also come with a learning curve for me, as I will
>>>>> have to get used to doing my schoolwork on my iPhone whilee it is
>>>>> connected to my Braille display. In preparation for this switch, I have
>>>>> been experimenting with doing more work on my iPhone while using my
>>>>> current BrailleNote as a Braille display for my iPhone. However, I have
>>>>> recently been having some issues with Apple's Pages app for word
>>>>> processing, most notably the inability to access all the pages of a
>>>>> multi-page document. I have been experimenting with many alternative
>>>>> apps, including AccessNote from AFB, VoiceDream Writer, and Drafts.
>>>>> Unfortunately, all these apps fall short for me because they cannot open
>>>>> Microsoft Word documents from email attachments--if they can open
>>>>> anything created outside of their apps at all, they can only open TXT
>>>>> and RTF file formats. Since I receive the majority of my schoolwork via
>>>>> email from my teachers, this will not work for me. So, for those who use
>>>>> iOS for classwork, are there any other apps I should try? Also, is there
>>>>> any advice you can give me on the problem I am currently having with
>>>>> Pages? Thanks in advance for any help you can provide.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Chris Nusbaum
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gpaikens%40gmail.com
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bridgetawalker13%40aol.com
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/helga.schreiber26%40gmail.com
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/johnniejduran%40gmail.com
> 
> 
> -- 
> Ms. Johnnie Jean Duran
> 9th Grade Student
> Alameda International High School
> Lakewood, Colorado, United States
> Member Of The National Federation Of The Blind Of Colorado (NFBCO),
> The Colorado Association Of Blind Students (CABS), and the North Metro
> Chapter of the NFB.
> Facebook: http://facebook.com/johnniejean.duran
> Skype: jj.duran13
> Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/jj_duran14
> Voicemail: (303) 552-9683 (Voicemail only)
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat97%40gmail.com


From cnusbaumnfb at gmail.com  Tue Mar 10 16:48:42 2015
From: cnusbaumnfb at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum)
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2015 12:48:42 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] In Search of a Wordprocessing App for iOS
In-Reply-To: <9BDF3225-AB45-40FB-AC4F-1E26055C13C6@gmail.com>
References: <83505A07-1C26-48B0-99DF-052064CB1643@gmail.com>
	<B1C3F097-97A9-4D92-81B2-7A572E426A1B@gmail.com>
	<F5D9206B-728D-47C4-926C-86390D573D4D@aol.com>
	<5174AB49-55C8-45C0-AA53-B2D458732AA7@gmail.com>
	<CAOiA0StqhS+pHYPWu0nQPg+rNhYjnfDLQw+OB_zoGqiC46x0iA@mail.gmail.com>
	<9BDF3225-AB45-40FB-AC4F-1E26055C13C6@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <B487F475-2D71-407F-9C1D-2C928402AB24@gmail.com>

Yes. I have Writer and like it a lot. My problem with it is that it will only open TXT files, which doesn't serve my needs as I need the app to open Word and RTF files my teachers send me.

Chris Nusbaum

> On Mar 10, 2015, at 12:40 PM, Jewel via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Has anyone suggested VoiceStream writer yet? It is a great word processor, and will reserve read back what you write.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Mar 10, 2015, at 12:28 PM, johnnie Jean duran via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Good Morning!
>> I've experienced writting with several iOS apps, and out of all of
>> them, there are approximately 3 that I personally recommend.
>> * Pages - Pages is great, it's made by ample, and of course, like most
>> apple material, is accessible. However, it can be difficul to get used
>> to at first. The app is $9.99
>> * Notability - I am not aware of the price of the app, however, I am
>> certain it's not free. The buttons are nicely labeled, it is 100%
>> accessible with VoiceOver, and great for writing papers. These papers
>> can also be shared via an email, iMessage, etc.
>> * AccessNote - AccessNote is a word processor developed by the
>> American Foundation for the Blind as a resource for blind students.
>> The unique part about this app, is that the paperwork you have written
>> can not only be shared via email or iMessage, but it can also be
>> uploaded to dropbox directly from the app. It is 100% accessible with
>> VoiceOver, and works well with dictation. For a certain amount of time
>> the app was free, but if that time period has ended, the app is
>> $19.99.
>> 
>>> On 3/10/15, Helga Schreiber via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>> Hi Bridget and all! Are you guys sure that the Microsoft Word app is
>>> accessible with VoiceOver? I'm just wondering since actually one or two
>>> years ago, I don't remember, someone told me that it was not accessible with
>>> VoiceOver, and that i needed to use the Pages app! I actually have the Pages
>>> app, and I use it twice, but it is actually a very difficult writing a paper
>>> with it. However, if the Microsoft word app is accessible with VoiceOver, as
>>> you guys said, I think I will download it sice I would like to do my
>>> homework in there as well, like Chris. And one last question, is the
>>> Microsoft Word app free? Just curious! Hope to hear from you soon. Thanks so
>>> much and God bless!
>>> 
>>> Helga Schreiber
>>> 
>>> Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter.
>>> Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of Blind
>>> Students.
>>> Member of the International Networkers Team (INT).
>>> Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research.
>>> Phone:  (561) 706-5950
>>> Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com
>>> Skype: helga.schreiber26
>>> 4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx
>>> INT Website: http://int4life.com/
>>> 
>>> "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever
>>> believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>> On Mar 9, 2015, at 10:45 PM, Bridget Walker via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> The Microsoft word app has already been suggested and I agree it works
>>>> well. I did not like pages with voiceover however, documents is one that
>>>> works with VoiceOver. I like it.
>>>> HTH
>>>> Bridget
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>> 
>>>>> On Mar 9, 27 Heisei, at 9:28 PM, Greg Aikens via nabs-l
>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> I have heard that the Microsoft Word IOS app is accessible with
>>>>> VoiceOver. I have not tried it myself yet.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I have not worked much with the IOS version of Pages and so can't offer
>>>>> any tips there.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Best,
>>>>> Greg
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Mar 9, 2015, at 8:15 AM, Chris Nusbaum via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Hello All,
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I've finally taken the plunge and requested that my school district
>>>>>> purchase a Braille Edge 40 from HIMS to replace my BrailleNote Apex.
>>>>>> Although this will be a very refreshing change to more reliable and
>>>>>> up-to-date technology which is not prone to nearly as many issues as the
>>>>>> BrailleNote, it will also come with a learning curve for me, as I will
>>>>>> have to get used to doing my schoolwork on my iPhone whilee it is
>>>>>> connected to my Braille display. In preparation for this switch, I have
>>>>>> been experimenting with doing more work on my iPhone while using my
>>>>>> current BrailleNote as a Braille display for my iPhone. However, I have
>>>>>> recently been having some issues with Apple's Pages app for word
>>>>>> processing, most notably the inability to access all the pages of a
>>>>>> multi-page document. I have been experimenting with many alternative
>>>>>> apps, including AccessNote from AFB, VoiceDream Writer, and Drafts.
>>>>>> Unfortunately, all these apps fall short for me because they cannot open
>>>>>> Microsoft Word documents from email attachments--if they can open
>>>>>> anything created outside of their apps at all, they can only open TXT
>>>>>> and RTF file formats. Since I receive the majority of my schoolwork via
>>>>>> email from my teachers, this will not work for me. So, for those who use
>>>>>> iOS for classwork, are there any other apps I should try? Also, is there
>>>>>> any advice you can give me on the problem I am currently having with
>>>>>> Pages? Thanks in advance for any help you can provide.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Chris Nusbaum
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gpaikens%40gmail.com
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bridgetawalker13%40aol.com
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/helga.schreiber26%40gmail.com
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/johnniejduran%40gmail.com
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> Ms. Johnnie Jean Duran
>> 9th Grade Student
>> Alameda International High School
>> Lakewood, Colorado, United States
>> Member Of The National Federation Of The Blind Of Colorado (NFBCO),
>> The Colorado Association Of Blind Students (CABS), and the North Metro
>> Chapter of the NFB.
>> Facebook: http://facebook.com/johnniejean.duran
>> Skype: jj.duran13
>> Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/jj_duran14
>> Voicemail: (303) 552-9683 (Voicemail only)
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat97%40gmail.com
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/cnusbaumnfb%40gmail.com


From blackbyrdfly at gmail.com  Tue Mar 10 17:28:05 2015
From: blackbyrdfly at gmail.com (Jamie Principato)
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2015 11:28:05 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] jobs
In-Reply-To: <AFE6F38FA44940D6830FA50B00ECAA54@JohnSandersPC>
References: <CAPMxSt0ibH=g0y_=xbom=yH4hw7DgqRjg2T7kjXDvdrP0eUVZw@mail.gmail.com>
	<49B3096F-736F-4C03-AAD9-1D943682A547@gmail.com>
	<008501d05aa0$645b5a00$2d120e00$@gmail.com>
	<AFE6F38FA44940D6830FA50B00ECAA54@JohnSandersPC>
Message-ID: <B20AFAFC-EEB6-4D18-9896-B76642B0EFF1@gmail.com>

It sounds like they are helping you. They referred you to an employment agency that will help you with your resume writing skills. That will be a big help. The agency they referred you to May also help you with your interviewing skills and job search skills, which will be a big help. Sure, they're not simply handing you a job. You don't get to magically wake up one day and be employed, but no one does, and if you did, you'd never develop the skills to find new employment if you ever decided to or if you lost that job. It sounds like they're just referring you to the department that is most equipped to help you. I don't see the problem. 

-Jamie

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 10, 2015, at 5:47 AM, John Sanders via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> I have a question:  my local commission for the blind here in Michigan is saying that now I need to start finding jobs on my own.
> They have been helping me in the past.
> In Michigan there are not many jobs out in the area where I live.
> They want me to get involved with my local employment agency that will help me in improving my interview skills and building resume skills.
> They have never done this to me before.
> They also want me to start filling out this employment log and sending it in every two weeks.
> I'm not getting any help from them anymore as far as finding jobs.
> I don't have that much experience with education.
> I don't have a college degree in anything.
> The only thing I have is a high school diploma.
> Isn't the blind commission supposed to help those people who are blind find employment?
> I hope to hear from you soon.
> Sincerely,
> John Sanders
> 
> 
> -----Original Message----- From: justin williams via nabs-l
> Sent: Monday, March 09, 2015 3:36 PM
> To: 'Jamie Principato' ; 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] jobs
> 
> I've seen reference to several of our fellow students who did tutoring.
> However, I was not that creative in high school, so I didn't think of that,
> so kudos to you folks.
> 
> Justin.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jamie
> Principato via nabs-l
> Sent: Monday, March 09, 2015 3:34 PM
> To: Ana Martinez; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] jobs
> 
> I was a tutor in high school. It was essentially self employment, but it
> worked well for me and I never had a shortage of students.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>>> On Mar 9, 2015, at 12:28 PM, Ana Martinez via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> wrote:
>> 
>> hi all I have a question, for those who are in high school do you guys
>> have any job? I am planning on getting a job soon so I was wondering
>> what kind of jobs can you work in high school? thanks. sorry for my
>> english
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gma
>> il.com
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail
> .com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/starmy22%40gmail.com 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com


From rbacchus228 at gmail.com  Tue Mar 10 22:48:12 2015
From: rbacchus228 at gmail.com (Roanna Bacchus)
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2015 18:48:12 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] jobs
Message-ID: <54ff74da.25628c0a.970e.ffff8ca0@mx.google.com>

Hi Ana thanks for your message.  I am not in high school but I am 
pursuing an internship with the Center For Distributed Learning 
at UCF.  We ensure that the online courses offered here are 
1conessible to students with disabilities.  Support is also 
provided for teaching staff throughout the semester.


From tactiletaylor at gmail.com  Wed Mar 11 00:53:06 2015
From: tactiletaylor at gmail.com (Taylor Durrett)
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2015 19:53:06 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Orion Talking Graphing Calculator
Message-ID: <DBA5C22A-07D3-40EE-9138-D3DC65E6EF98@gmail.com>

Greetings all,
My name is Taylor Durrett, and I am new to this list. I am writing to ask whether anyone on here is familiar with the Orion Talking Graphing Calculator TI-84 Plus and how to use it. I just received one yesterday and I'm trying to figure out how to work it.
When I plug up the calculator and turn it on, it talks and does everything that it is supposed to do, but then when I unplug it to bring it to another room, it doesn't do anything at all (it doesn't talk and the screen just goes blank. Do you have any suggestions as to what I could do to fix it besides shipping it off? I bought it from APH. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Warm regards,
Taylor Durrett

Sent from my iPhone

From annajee82 at gmail.com  Wed Mar 11 01:04:58 2015
From: annajee82 at gmail.com (Anna Givens)
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2015 19:04:58 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Orion Talking Graphing Calculator
In-Reply-To: <DBA5C22A-07D3-40EE-9138-D3DC65E6EF98@gmail.com>
References: <DBA5C22A-07D3-40EE-9138-D3DC65E6EF98@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <B2284D8E-4E0E-4593-B7FD-F3D28F7EDB3A@gmail.com>

Hi Taylor,
I have that same calculator, it works well.  First of all, I would definitely do some googling or call APH before shipping it off.  But here is my suggestion,it needs to be fully charged before you use it.  I don't remember how long it takes to charge it.  I think I charged mine overnight.  I would say at least a few hours.  
Once you have fully charged it after getting it, you should not be having this issue.  Even if it seems to be charged, you need to just let it charge fully - a few hours, before using it. Try that and let me know if you have more issues. My suggestion is plug it in tonight and see if it works un-plugged tomorrow. If you are still having issues tomorrow, come back here and let me know.
Good luck.

Anna E Givens

> On Mar 10, 2015, at 6:53 PM, Taylor Durrett via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Greetings all,
> My name is Taylor Durrett, and I am new to this list. I am writing to ask whether anyone on here is familiar with the Orion Talking Graphing Calculator TI-84 Plus and how to use it. I just received one yesterday and I'm trying to figure out how to work it.
> When I plug up the calculator and turn it on, it talks and does everything that it is supposed to do, but then when I unplug it to bring it to another room, it doesn't do anything at all (it doesn't talk and the screen just goes blank. Do you have any suggestions as to what I could do to fix it besides shipping it off? I bought it from APH. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
> Warm regards,
> Taylor Durrett
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/annajee82%40gmail.com


From cnusbaumnfb at gmail.com  Wed Mar 11 11:44:38 2015
From: cnusbaumnfb at gmail.com (Chris Nusbaum)
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2015 07:44:38 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Orion Talking Graphing Calculator
In-Reply-To: <DBA5C22A-07D3-40EE-9138-D3DC65E6EF98@gmail.com>
References: <DBA5C22A-07D3-40EE-9138-D3DC65E6EF98@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <B505629F-E879-4052-898C-15EF227447E4@gmail.com>

Taylor,

Welcome to the list! I recently got an Orion calculator and so far really like it. However, I understand what you mean when you say you're having a hard time figuring out how to use it. The calculator has many buttons, most of which have two functions. I guess mastery of the buttons and their use will come in time for both of us. I would suggest reading the Quick Start guide which came with your calculator, available in both print and Braille. I usually don't read manuals for new devices (I'm more of a hands-on learner when it comes to technology), but I found the documentation particularly useful for this device. One of the instructions in the Quick Start  Guide points out that the batteries must be fully charged once before the calculator can work. I would suggest leaving the calculator plugged in for an extended period of time (perhaps overnight), then unplugging it and seeing if it works. As for the general use of the calculator, there is also some useful information found on the flash drive which came with your calculator, including a very comprehensive audio demonstration of the calculator's functions done, incidentally, by a blind student. Also on this flash drive are the full user guide, instructions for downloading software to the calculator, etc. It's definitely a useful resource.

HTH,

Chris Nusbaum

> On Mar 10, 2015, at 8:53 PM, Taylor Durrett via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Greetings all,
> My name is Taylor Durrett, and I am new to this list. I am writing to ask whether anyone on here is familiar with the Orion Talking Graphing Calculator TI-84 Plus and how to use it. I just received one yesterday and I'm trying to figure out how to work it.
> When I plug up the calculator and turn it on, it talks and does everything that it is supposed to do, but then when I unplug it to bring it to another room, it doesn't do anything at all (it doesn't talk and the screen just goes blank. Do you have any suggestions as to what I could do to fix it besides shipping it off? I bought it from APH. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
> Warm regards,
> Taylor Durrett
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/cnusbaumnfb%40gmail.com


From zumbagecko at gmail.com  Wed Mar 11 23:24:28 2015
From: zumbagecko at gmail.com (petras)
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2015 16:24:28 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] using the maps app
Message-ID: <5500ceaf.20836b0a.024c.ffff96d8@mx.google.com>

Hi, I'm just curious, is there an accessible way I can access the 
maps app on my iphone? I have trouble finding where to put in the 
address.  I have the seeing eye gps, but just wondering how I can 
access maps as a different resource for gps?


From kmaent1 at gmail.com  Thu Mar 12 00:12:58 2015
From: kmaent1 at gmail.com (Karl Martin Adam)
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2015 20:12:58 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] using the maps app
Message-ID: <5500da2f.93a46b0a.67d5.ffff9755@mx.google.com>

I've had pretty good luck using siri.  Just tell her to set a 
root to whereever, and she does.

 ----- Original Message -----
From: petras via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
Date sent: Wed, 11 Mar 2015 16:24:28 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] using the maps app

Hi, I'm just curious, is there an accessible way I can access the
maps app on my iphone? I have trouble finding where to put in the
address.  I have the seeing eye gps, but just wondering how I can
access maps as a different resource for gps?

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
for nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kmaent1%40gma
il.com


From dandrews at visi.com  Thu Mar 12 00:29:39 2015
From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews)
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2015 19:29:39 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] jobs
In-Reply-To: <AFE6F38FA44940D6830FA50B00ECAA54@JohnSandersPC>
References: <CAPMxSt0ibH=g0y_=xbom=yH4hw7DgqRjg2T7kjXDvdrP0eUVZw@mail.gmail.com>
	<49B3096F-736F-4C03-AAD9-1D943682A547@gmail.com>
	<008501d05aa0$645b5a00$2d120e00$@gmail.com>
	<AFE6F38FA44940D6830FA50B00ECAA54@JohnSandersPC>
Message-ID: <auto-000018484886@mailfront1.g2host.com>

Yes, they should help you -- but you need to help yourself too.  Why 
wouldn't you do everything possible to find a job? You will always be 
your best advocate and representative.

Dave

At 06:47 AM 3/10/2015, you wrote:
>Hi,
>I have a question:  my local commission for the blind here in 
>Michigan is saying that now I need to start finding jobs on my own.
>They have been helping me in the past.
>In Michigan there are not many jobs out in the area where I live.
>They want me to get involved with my local employment agency that 
>will help me in improving my interview skills and building resume skills.
>They have never done this to me before.
>They also want me to start filling out this employment log and 
>sending it in every two weeks.
>I'm not getting any help from them anymore as far as finding jobs.
>I don't have that much experience with education.
>I don't have a college degree in anything.
>The only thing I have is a high school diploma.
>Isn't the blind commission supposed to help those people who are 
>blind find employment?
>I hope to hear from you soon.
>Sincerely,
>John Sanders

         David Andrews and long white cane Harry.
E-Mail:  dandrews at visi.com or david.andrews at nfbnet.org



From zumbagecko at gmail.com  Thu Mar 12 00:52:50 2015
From: zumbagecko at gmail.com (petras)
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2015 17:52:50 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] jobs
Message-ID: <5500e365.0ba26b0a.1b05.ffff9e6e@mx.google.com>

I have some ideas what you could do.  You can be a teacher, you 
can be a Dof If you want to be a teacher,
you need to find a school and have a computer running jaws.
 ----- Original Message -----
From: David Andrews via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
To: John Sanders <starmy22 at gmail.com>,National Association of 
Blind Students mailing list <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
Date sent: Wed, 11 Mar 2015 19:29:39 -0500
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] jobs

Yes, they should help you -- but you need to help yourself too.  
Why
wouldn't you do everything possible to find a job? You will 
always be
your best advocate and representative.

Dave

At 06:47 AM 3/10/2015, you wrote:
Hi,
I have a question:  my local commission for the blind here in
Michigan is saying that now I need to start finding jobs on my 
own.
They have been helping me in the past.
In Michigan there are not many jobs out in the area where I live.
They want me to get involved with my local employment agency that
will help me in improving my interview skills and building resume 
skills.
They have never done this to me before.
They also want me to start filling out this employment log and
sending it in every two weeks.
I'm not getting any help from them anymore as far as finding 
jobs.
I don't have that much experience with education.
I don't have a college degree in anything.
The only thing I have is a high school diploma.
Isn't the blind commission supposed to help those people who are
blind find employment?
I hope to hear from you soon.
Sincerely,
John Sanders

         David Andrews and long white cane Harry.
E-Mail:  dandrews at visi.com or david.andrews at nfbnet.org


_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
for nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/zumbagecko%40
gmail.com


From arielle71 at gmail.com  Thu Mar 12 04:34:14 2015
From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman)
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2015 21:34:14 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind Devotion video
Message-ID: <CALAYQJDSGNYsnE6DMTz_2YBxkkkx=U911E7xa1K64dap7yziVw@mail.gmail.com>

Dear all:
I recently learned that a nonprofit organization called Jubilee
Project has created a very demeaning "inspirational" video about
blindness. You can see it at
jubileeproject.org/home/blind-devotion/

In the video, a wife happily cooks and does laundry for her husband.
Upon learning that she is going blind, she is afraid that if she tells
him he will leave her, and she fears not being able to take care of
him anymore. He finds out, and because his love for her is so strong,
he starts doing things for her and follows her to work every day
without her nowing, allegedly to be sure she is OK. He goes to some
lengths to ensure she doesn't find out that he is following her.

The 8-min film is rife with the usual blindness stereotypes such as
her dropping shells into her scrambled eggs (which she didn't do while
sighted) and smelling the laundry to sort it. In addition, it sends
the message that a sighted man surreptitiously following a blind woman
without her knowledge or consent is not only OK, but even a sign of
true love.
A number of my blind friends and I found the video deeply disturbing,
especially those of us who are married. I encourage you to write to
Jubilee Project at
project.jubilee at gmail.com
, tweet them, write on their Facebook page, or write comments on the
video itself. Public reaction to this film as been overwhelmingly
positive. I think it would be good to get some blind voices into the
mix to help explain how insulting and creepy this depiction is.
Best, Arielle


From becsjoynfb at gmail.com  Thu Mar 12 05:18:01 2015
From: becsjoynfb at gmail.com (Rebecca Leon)
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2015 23:18:01 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Update us! NABS notes Request for state updates
Message-ID: <184E5CBA-00F4-46D9-BE7F-B8E362F86849@gmail.com>

Fellow Students,
Hopefully this March  finds you well. As we on the communications committee assemble our monthly issue of NABS notes, we are excited to hear what your state is up to! If you have announcements and/ or
updates from your student’s state division which you would like
published in this month’s edition, you are most welcome to send
them along to Rebecca at:
becsjoynfb at gmail.com
Or Karen at:
kea.anderson at gmail.com
cheers,
Rebecca~


From ALewis at nfb.org  Thu Mar 12 13:22:19 2015
From: ALewis at nfb.org (Lewis, Anil)
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2015 13:22:19 +0000
Subject: [nabs-l] Congratulations to Our Own Sachin Dev Pavithran Elected
 Chair of the U.S. Access Board
Message-ID: <DM2PR0701MB1018FAB0F128FFF69E303FF9C1060@DM2PR0701MB1018.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>


Sachin Dev Pavithran Elected Chair of the U.S. Access Board
[Sachin Dev Pavithran]The U.S. Access Board unanimously elected Sachin Dev Pavithran as its new Chair on March 11. Pavithran of Logan, Utah is Program Director of the Utah Assistive Technology Program at Utah State University's Center for Persons with Disabilities. He was named to the Access Board by President Barack Obama in 2012.
"It is an honor to chair an agency that has done so much over the years to make equal access for people with disabilities a reality," Pavithran stated. "Our buildings, transit systems, and information and communication technologies are more accessible and inclusive because of the work of the Board and the guidelines and standards it has established."
In addition to his membership on the Access Board, Pavithran serves on the Association of Assistive Technology Act Programs National Board, Senator Orrin Hatch's (President Pro Tempore) Disability Advisory Committee, the Research and Development Committee of the National Federation of the Blind, and the National Multicultural Council of the Association of University Centers for Disabilities.
The Board also elected as Vice Chair Sue Swenson who serves as Acting Assistant Secretary for the Office of Special Education and Rehabilitative Services at the U.S. Department of Education. Board officers serve for a term of one year.
The Board<http://links.govdelivery.com:80/track?type=click&enid=ZWFzPTEmbWFpbGluZ2lkPTIwMTUwMzExLjQyNzQ4MzIxJm1lc3NhZ2VpZD1NREItUFJELUJVTC0yMDE1MDMxMS40Mjc0ODMyMSZkYXRhYmFzZWlkPTEwMDEmc2VyaWFsPTE2OTg3MjIzJmVtYWlsaWQ9bWt3ODRAYmVsbHNvdXRoLm5ldCZ1c2VyaWQ9bWt3ODRAYmVsbHNvdXRoLm5ldCZmbD0mZXh0cmE9TXVsdGl2YXJpYXRlSWQ9JiYm&&&100&&&http://www.access-board.gov/the-board/members> is structured to function as a coordinating body among Federal agencies and to directly represent the public, particularly people with disabilities. Half of its members are representatives from most of the Federal departments. The other half is comprised of members of the public appointed by the President.
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From sgermano at asu.edu  Thu Mar 12 17:42:43 2015
From: sgermano at asu.edu (Suzanne Germano)
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2015 10:42:43 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] jobs
In-Reply-To: <auto-000018484886@mailfront1.g2host.com>
References: <CAPMxSt0ibH=g0y_=xbom=yH4hw7DgqRjg2T7kjXDvdrP0eUVZw@mail.gmail.com>
	<49B3096F-736F-4C03-AAD9-1D943682A547@gmail.com>
	<008501d05aa0$645b5a00$2d120e00$@gmail.com>
	<AFE6F38FA44940D6830FA50B00ECAA54@JohnSandersPC>
	<auto-000018484886@mailfront1.g2host.com>
Message-ID: <CAF=_avfwUChSDfUOJyHStrX1RV7WVD2ercCzjtHkeAZrou-=9g@mail.gmail.com>

They are supposed to help prepare you to be employable not find the job for
you.
For example if there is something you want to do as your career they will
pay for the necessary training or education.

VR is funding my degree. I went back to school at the age of 48. but it is
my responsibility to find a job. I also feel you are much more likely to be
hired if you approach a company vs someone approach them for you.


On Wed, Mar 11, 2015 at 5:29 PM, David Andrews via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> wrote:

> Yes, they should help you -- but you need to help yourself too.  Why
> wouldn't you do everything possible to find a job? You will always be your
> best advocate and representative.
>
> Dave
>
> At 06:47 AM 3/10/2015, you wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>> I have a question:  my local commission for the blind here in Michigan is
>> saying that now I need to start finding jobs on my own.
>> They have been helping me in the past.
>> In Michigan there are not many jobs out in the area where I live.
>> They want me to get involved with my local employment agency that will
>> help me in improving my interview skills and building resume skills.
>> They have never done this to me before.
>> They also want me to start filling out this employment log and sending it
>> in every two weeks.
>> I'm not getting any help from them anymore as far as finding jobs.
>> I don't have that much experience with education.
>> I don't have a college degree in anything.
>> The only thing I have is a high school diploma.
>> Isn't the blind commission supposed to help those people who are blind
>> find employment?
>> I hope to hear from you soon.
>> Sincerely,
>> John Sanders
>>
>
>         David Andrews and long white cane Harry.
> E-Mail:  dandrews at visi.com or david.andrews at nfbnet.org
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sgermano%40asu.edu
>

From starmy22 at gmail.com  Thu Mar 12 17:49:19 2015
From: starmy22 at gmail.com (John Sanders)
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2015 13:49:19 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] jobs
In-Reply-To: <CAF=_avfwUChSDfUOJyHStrX1RV7WVD2ercCzjtHkeAZrou-=9g@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAPMxSt0ibH=g0y_=xbom=yH4hw7DgqRjg2T7kjXDvdrP0eUVZw@mail.gmail.com><49B3096F-736F-4C03-AAD9-1D943682A547@gmail.com><008501d05aa0$645b5a00$2d120e00$@gmail.com><AFE6F38FA44940D6830FA50B00ECAA54@JohnSandersPC><auto-000018484886@mailfront1.g2host.com>
	<CAF=_avfwUChSDfUOJyHStrX1RV7WVD2ercCzjtHkeAZrou-=9g@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <09F1703B0E41475A983E7B286C932863@JohnSandersPC>

Hi,
I've done things like walk in to actual businesses and ask if they were 
hiring.
A couple of them said that they weren't.
Now I'm doing some searching on the internet.
I hope to hear from you soon.
Sincerely,
John Sanders


-----Original Message----- 
From: Suzanne Germano via nabs-l
Sent: Thursday, March 12, 2015 1:42 PM
To: David Andrews ; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] jobs

They are supposed to help prepare you to be employable not find the job for
you.
For example if there is something you want to do as your career they will
pay for the necessary training or education.

VR is funding my degree. I went back to school at the age of 48. but it is
my responsibility to find a job. I also feel you are much more likely to be
hired if you approach a company vs someone approach them for you.


On Wed, Mar 11, 2015 at 5:29 PM, David Andrews via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> wrote:

> Yes, they should help you -- but you need to help yourself too.  Why
> wouldn't you do everything possible to find a job? You will always be your
> best advocate and representative.
>
> Dave
>
> At 06:47 AM 3/10/2015, you wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>> I have a question:  my local commission for the blind here in Michigan is
>> saying that now I need to start finding jobs on my own.
>> They have been helping me in the past.
>> In Michigan there are not many jobs out in the area where I live.
>> They want me to get involved with my local employment agency that will
>> help me in improving my interview skills and building resume skills.
>> They have never done this to me before.
>> They also want me to start filling out this employment log and sending it
>> in every two weeks.
>> I'm not getting any help from them anymore as far as finding jobs.
>> I don't have that much experience with education.
>> I don't have a college degree in anything.
>> The only thing I have is a high school diploma.
>> Isn't the blind commission supposed to help those people who are blind
>> find employment?
>> I hope to hear from you soon.
>> Sincerely,
>> John Sanders
>>
>
>         David Andrews and long white cane Harry.
> E-Mail:  dandrews at visi.com or david.andrews at nfbnet.org
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sgermano%40asu.edu
>
_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/starmy22%40gmail.com 



From lizmohnke at hotmail.com  Thu Mar 12 18:28:01 2015
From: lizmohnke at hotmail.com (Elizabeth Mohnke)
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2015 14:28:01 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] jobs
In-Reply-To: <09F1703B0E41475A983E7B286C932863@JohnSandersPC>
References: <CAPMxSt0ibH=g0y_=xbom=yH4hw7DgqRjg2T7kjXDvdrP0eUVZw@mail.gmail.com><49B3096F-736F-4C03-AAD9-1D943682A547@gmail.com><008501d05aa0$645b5a00$2d120e00$@gmail.com><AFE6F38FA44940D6830FA50B00ECAA54@JohnSandersPC><auto-000018484886@mailfront1.g2host.com>	<CAF=_avfwUChSDfUOJyHStrX1RV7WVD2ercCzjtHkeAZrou-=9g@mail.gmail.com>
	<09F1703B0E41475A983E7B286C932863@JohnSandersPC>
Message-ID: <COL401-EAS395483BFAD32AC896F839CBA060@phx.gbl>

Hello John,

Have you tried using the job feature that is found within Newsline? I found
this feature to be rather easy to use, and you can look up jobs based on
different job categories and locations. If you have not already checked out
the jobs feature in Newsline, I would encourage you to give it a try.

Also, I sent you an announcement privately about an employment seminar the
Michigan Association of Blind Students is hosting at the end of the month.
Did you receive this announcement? I believe this seminar is designed to
help young people like you who are looking for employment opportunities. I
would highly encourage you to attend this seminar.

Warm regards,
Elizabeth

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of John Sanders
via nabs-l
Sent: Thursday, March 12, 2015 1:49 PM
To: Suzanne Germano; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] jobs

Hi,
I've done things like walk in to actual businesses and ask if they were
hiring.
A couple of them said that they weren't.
Now I'm doing some searching on the internet.
I hope to hear from you soon.
Sincerely,
John Sanders


-----Original Message----- 
From: Suzanne Germano via nabs-l
Sent: Thursday, March 12, 2015 1:42 PM
To: David Andrews ; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] jobs

They are supposed to help prepare you to be employable not find the job for
you.
For example if there is something you want to do as your career they will
pay for the necessary training or education.

VR is funding my degree. I went back to school at the age of 48. but it is
my responsibility to find a job. I also feel you are much more likely to be
hired if you approach a company vs someone approach them for you.


On Wed, Mar 11, 2015 at 5:29 PM, David Andrews via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> wrote:

> Yes, they should help you -- but you need to help yourself too.  Why
> wouldn't you do everything possible to find a job? You will always be your
> best advocate and representative.
>
> Dave
>
> At 06:47 AM 3/10/2015, you wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>> I have a question:  my local commission for the blind here in Michigan is
>> saying that now I need to start finding jobs on my own.
>> They have been helping me in the past.
>> In Michigan there are not many jobs out in the area where I live.
>> They want me to get involved with my local employment agency that will
>> help me in improving my interview skills and building resume skills.
>> They have never done this to me before.
>> They also want me to start filling out this employment log and sending it
>> in every two weeks.
>> I'm not getting any help from them anymore as far as finding jobs.
>> I don't have that much experience with education.
>> I don't have a college degree in anything.
>> The only thing I have is a high school diploma.
>> Isn't the blind commission supposed to help those people who are blind
>> find employment?
>> I hope to hear from you soon.
>> Sincerely,
>> John Sanders
>>
>
>         David Andrews and long white cane Harry.
> E-Mail:  dandrews at visi.com or david.andrews at nfbnet.org
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sgermano%40asu.edu
>
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From justin.williams2 at gmail.com  Thu Mar 12 18:34:40 2015
From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams)
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2015 14:34:40 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] jobs
In-Reply-To: <CAF=_avfwUChSDfUOJyHStrX1RV7WVD2ercCzjtHkeAZrou-=9g@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAPMxSt0ibH=g0y_=xbom=yH4hw7DgqRjg2T7kjXDvdrP0eUVZw@mail.gmail.com>	<49B3096F-736F-4C03-AAD9-1D943682A547@gmail.com>	<008501d05aa0$645b5a00$2d120e00$@gmail.com>	<AFE6F38FA44940D6830FA50B00ECAA54@JohnSandersPC>	<auto-000018484886@mailfront1.g2host.com>
	<CAF=_avfwUChSDfUOJyHStrX1RV7WVD2ercCzjtHkeAZrou-=9g@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <002a01d05cf3$341a6de0$9c4f49a0$@gmail.com>

Use both tools if you can, but remember, it is ultimately your
responsibility.  Start by  writing down what you want to do, ahd what skills
you have.

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Suzanne Germano
via nabs-l
Sent: Thursday, March 12, 2015 1:43 PM
To: David Andrews; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] jobs

They are supposed to help prepare you to be employable not find the job for
you.
For example if there is something you want to do as your career they will
pay for the necessary training or education.

VR is funding my degree. I went back to school at the age of 48. but it is
my responsibility to find a job. I also feel you are much more likely to be
hired if you approach a company vs someone approach them for you.


On Wed, Mar 11, 2015 at 5:29 PM, David Andrews via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> wrote:

> Yes, they should help you -- but you need to help yourself too.  Why 
> wouldn't you do everything possible to find a job? You will always be 
> your best advocate and representative.
>
> Dave
>
> At 06:47 AM 3/10/2015, you wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>> I have a question:  my local commission for the blind here in 
>> Michigan is saying that now I need to start finding jobs on my own.
>> They have been helping me in the past.
>> In Michigan there are not many jobs out in the area where I live.
>> They want me to get involved with my local employment agency that 
>> will help me in improving my interview skills and building resume skills.
>> They have never done this to me before.
>> They also want me to start filling out this employment log and 
>> sending it in every two weeks.
>> I'm not getting any help from them anymore as far as finding jobs.
>> I don't have that much experience with education.
>> I don't have a college degree in anything.
>> The only thing I have is a high school diploma.
>> Isn't the blind commission supposed to help those people who are 
>> blind find employment?
>> I hope to hear from you soon.
>> Sincerely,
>> John Sanders
>>
>
>         David Andrews and long white cane Harry.
> E-Mail:  dandrews at visi.com or david.andrews at nfbnet.org
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sgermano%40asu.edu
>
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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
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.com



From blindstein at gmail.com  Thu Mar 12 18:39:42 2015
From: blindstein at gmail.com (Justin Harford)
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2015 11:39:42 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] jobs
In-Reply-To: <COL401-EAS395483BFAD32AC896F839CBA060@phx.gbl>
References: <CAPMxSt0ibH=g0y_=xbom=yH4hw7DgqRjg2T7kjXDvdrP0eUVZw@mail.gmail.com>
	<49B3096F-736F-4C03-AAD9-1D943682A547@gmail.com>
	<008501d05aa0$645b5a00$2d120e00$@gmail.com>
	<AFE6F38FA44940D6830FA50B00ECAA54@JohnSandersPC>
	<auto-000018484886@mailfront1.g2host.com>
	<CAF=_avfwUChSDfUOJyHStrX1RV7WVD2ercCzjtHkeAZrou-=9g@mail.gmail.com>
	<09F1703B0E41475A983E7B286C932863@JohnSandersPC>
	<COL401-EAS395483BFAD32AC896F839CBA060@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <3B76BD4A-C40D-4D8A-BB8A-9790361CA006@gmail.com>

Hi there

It sounds like you have been pretty active already in going to speak to businesses if they have jobs. That is good!

The next question that I would ask you is if you happen to have any friends that work anywhere in the community, and if they could meet with you to talk to you about it, and if they could also introduce you to somebody at the place where you are looking at working, to also talk to you about it.

The Idea is that you do an informational interview with somebody who works where you want to work, you introduce yourself, you ask them questions about themselves, and about what they do at the place. You present yourself as somebody who is thoughtful, hard-working, or who embodies one of the values that they are looking for in their employees, and the idea is that they get to know you at the place. They may or may not have a job right away, but when something does come up, and the person that you have now developed a relationship with can tell you that the job is available, and when you submit your application, they can put in a good word with the people who are looking at applications… Oh yes, John, he is a great guy!… Which could dramatically increase your chances of actually being hired!

Just a thought

Justin

Sent from my iPad

> On Mar 12, 2015, at 11:28 AM, Elizabeth Mohnke via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hello John,
> 
> Have you tried using the job feature that is found within Newsline? I found
> this feature to be rather easy to use, and you can look up jobs based on
> different job categories and locations. If you have not already checked out
> the jobs feature in Newsline, I would encourage you to give it a try.
> 
> Also, I sent you an announcement privately about an employment seminar the
> Michigan Association of Blind Students is hosting at the end of the month.
> Did you receive this announcement? I believe this seminar is designed to
> help young people like you who are looking for employment opportunities. I
> would highly encourage you to attend this seminar.
> 
> Warm regards,
> Elizabeth
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of John Sanders
> via nabs-l
> Sent: Thursday, March 12, 2015 1:49 PM
> To: Suzanne Germano; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] jobs
> 
> Hi,
> I've done things like walk in to actual businesses and ask if they were
> hiring.
> A couple of them said that they weren't.
> Now I'm doing some searching on the internet.
> I hope to hear from you soon.
> Sincerely,
> John Sanders
> 
> 
> -----Original Message----- 
> From: Suzanne Germano via nabs-l
> Sent: Thursday, March 12, 2015 1:42 PM
> To: David Andrews ; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] jobs
> 
> They are supposed to help prepare you to be employable not find the job for
> you.
> For example if there is something you want to do as your career they will
> pay for the necessary training or education.
> 
> VR is funding my degree. I went back to school at the age of 48. but it is
> my responsibility to find a job. I also feel you are much more likely to be
> hired if you approach a company vs someone approach them for you.
> 
> 
> On Wed, Mar 11, 2015 at 5:29 PM, David Andrews via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> wrote:
> 
>> Yes, they should help you -- but you need to help yourself too.  Why
>> wouldn't you do everything possible to find a job? You will always be your
>> best advocate and representative.
>> 
>> Dave
>> 
>> At 06:47 AM 3/10/2015, you wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> I have a question:  my local commission for the blind here in Michigan is
>>> saying that now I need to start finding jobs on my own.
>>> They have been helping me in the past.
>>> In Michigan there are not many jobs out in the area where I live.
>>> They want me to get involved with my local employment agency that will
>>> help me in improving my interview skills and building resume skills.
>>> They have never done this to me before.
>>> They also want me to start filling out this employment log and sending it
>>> in every two weeks.
>>> I'm not getting any help from them anymore as far as finding jobs.
>>> I don't have that much experience with education.
>>> I don't have a college degree in anything.
>>> The only thing I have is a high school diploma.
>>> Isn't the blind commission supposed to help those people who are blind
>>> find employment?
>>> I hope to hear from you soon.
>>> Sincerely,
>>> John Sanders
>> 
>>        David Andrews and long white cane Harry.
>> E-Mail:  dandrews at visi.com or david.andrews at nfbnet.org
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sgermano%40asu.edu
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/starmy22%40gmail.com 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/lizmohnke%40hotmail.com
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindstein%40gmail.com


From clb5590 at gmail.com  Thu Mar 12 23:34:19 2015
From: clb5590 at gmail.com (Cindy Bennett)
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2015 16:34:19 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Analyzing Qualitative Data with Software
Message-ID: <CACUFQdxsbbnUPey1LOeb_b9fsHUGcbUFL2M8XY1ssv+mDSczGw@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

Has anyone ever used a software to assist in analyzing their
qualitative data? If so, I would love to hear from you before trying a
bunch of options that may or may not be accessible.

Thanks!

-- 
Cindy Bennett
1st Year Ph.D. Student, University of Washington
Human Centered Design and Engineering

Treasurer of the National Federation of the Blind of Washington
an Affiliate of the National Federation of the Blind

clb5590 at gmail.com


From arielle71 at gmail.com  Fri Mar 13 02:27:03 2015
From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman)
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2015 19:27:03 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Analyzing Qualitative Data with Software
In-Reply-To: <CACUFQdxsbbnUPey1LOeb_b9fsHUGcbUFL2M8XY1ssv+mDSczGw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CACUFQdxsbbnUPey1LOeb_b9fsHUGcbUFL2M8XY1ssv+mDSczGw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CALAYQJAwqQA4X4yq4ptbepFKQVOnY0GG5HzbLJUR96T_L11m_A@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Cindy,
I have little experience with qualitative data and have never used
qualitative software. However, I recently prepared a qualitative
summary of some focus group data by hand, and it was a very manageable
task. My colleague coded the same data using software and our reports
were quite similar. So I'm not convinced that qualitative software is
actually required, and if it carries accessibility hassles, then
coding by hand might end up being easier. Basically coding just
involves creating categories based on common themes you observe in the
transcript and then going through and assigning each participant
comment to one of the categories you create. I think the software may
help visually organize the data, but I'm not sure how much benefit you
would actually get from using software, unless you need to use it for
a qualitative software class. Others with mor qualitative experience
thanI might be able to comment further.
Best Arielle

On 3/12/15, Cindy Bennett via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Has anyone ever used a software to assist in analyzing their
> qualitative data? If so, I would love to hear from you before trying a
> bunch of options that may or may not be accessible.
>
> Thanks!
>
> --
> Cindy Bennett
> 1st Year Ph.D. Student, University of Washington
> Human Centered Design and Engineering
>
> Treasurer of the National Federation of the Blind of Washington
> an Affiliate of the National Federation of the Blind
>
> clb5590 at gmail.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com
>


From PRESIDENT at alumni.ecu.edu  Fri Mar 13 03:02:06 2015
From: PRESIDENT at alumni.ecu.edu (Justin Salisbury)
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2015 03:02:06 +0000
Subject: [nabs-l] Video featuring a State Student President
Message-ID: <C11DB472-D31A-49D5-AF7E-51D1CF6DCB12@alumni.ecu.edu>

Here is an awesome video featuring precious Perez, president of the Massachusetts Association of blind students:

http://youtu.be/rTpsPGtkNV0

Enjoy!

Justin

Sent from the iPhone of

Justin Salisbury - Running Thunder Phoenix
Graduate Student
Professional Development and Research Institute on Blindness
Louisiana Tech University
Email: President at Alumni.ECU.edu<mailto:President at Alumni.ECU.edu>
Twitter: @SalisburyJustin

“One of the continuing themes that the majority culture never wants to hear is that the Indians want to be Indians.”

Ada Deer (Menominee), 1984


From rbacchus228 at gmail.com  Fri Mar 13 14:06:13 2015
From: rbacchus228 at gmail.com (Roanna Bacchus)
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2015 10:06:13 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] An update on my Independence
Message-ID: <5502ef07.4de78c0a.0b3c.6628@mx.google.com>

Dear Students,

I'd like to give you an update on my independence.  This week I 
found my way to the Center For Distributed Learning all on my 
own.  I walked out the fron door of the library and went down the 
spiral staircase each afternoon.  This is another small step 
towards imporving my independence.


From dsmithnfb at gmail.com  Fri Mar 13 22:25:31 2015
From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith)
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2015 15:25:31 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Would a year of voluntary public service bring out
	america's best?
References: <22DDC527-24A6-4E57-950C-EA744502B298@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7A58C9DE-C1C9-432C-BD74-173D4EC5069F@gmail.com>

Hi all,
 I saw this really interesting article on twitter  and wanted your thoughts on it.
 does this make sense, does it at all apply to blind people?
 
> 
> Would a Year of Voluntary Public Service Bring Out America's Best? 
> m.huffpost.com/us/entry/6850610?utm_hp_ref=impact&ir=Impact <http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/6850610?utm_hp_ref=impact&ir=Impact> 
> 
> Download the official Twitter app here <https://twitter.com/download?ref_src=MailTweet-iOS>
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone


From rbacchus228 at gmail.com  Fri Mar 13 22:52:47 2015
From: rbacchus228 at gmail.com (Roanna Bacchus)
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2015 18:52:47 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Would a year of voluntary public service bring
	outamerica's best?
Message-ID: <55036a73.58ec8c0a.7bb8.ffffde93@mx.google.com>

Hi Darian thank you for sharing this article.  I really enjoyed 
reading it.  Serving others makes me happy about living here in 
America.


From jsoro620 at gmail.com  Fri Mar 13 23:21:44 2015
From: jsoro620 at gmail.com (Joe)
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2015 19:21:44 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Would a year of voluntary public service bring
	out	america's best?
In-Reply-To: <7A58C9DE-C1C9-432C-BD74-173D4EC5069F@gmail.com>
References: <22DDC527-24A6-4E57-950C-EA744502B298@gmail.com>
	<7A58C9DE-C1C9-432C-BD74-173D4EC5069F@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <000f01d05de4$78bf1620$6a3d4260$@gmail.com>

Absolutely it would make the country better. In fact, it ought to be
mandatory. After high school, graduates ought to have to choose between
military service or public service and devote a couple years to it. Only a
small percentage of students are ready to go straight into college anyway.
There ought not to be any difference for blind people.

Joe

--
Musings of a Work in Progress:
www.JoeOrozco.com/

Twitter: @ScribblingJoe

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Darian Smith
via nabs-l
Sent: Friday, March 13, 2015 6:26 PM
Subject: [nabs-l] Would a year of voluntary public service bring out
america's best?

Hi all,
 I saw this really interesting article on twitter  and wanted your thoughts
on it.
 does this make sense, does it at all apply to blind people?
 
> 
> Would a Year of Voluntary Public Service Bring Out America's Best? 
> m.huffpost.com/us/entry/6850610?utm_hp_ref=impact&ir=Impact
<http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/6850610?utm_hp_ref=impact&ir=Impact> 
> 
> Download the official Twitter app here
<https://twitter.com/download?ref_src=MailTweet-iOS>
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
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From nora.goldberg6 at gmail.com  Fri Mar 13 23:39:43 2015
From: nora.goldberg6 at gmail.com (Nora Goldberg)
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2015 19:39:43 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] My Survey for Anthropology College Class
Message-ID: <CAEhZ6UnZ_Qoa7aX=zaNBMor70e0FAL-oxNScQyHmwC0Qu9KuMw@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Student listers,

I wanted to let you know that tomorrow will be the last day to take my
survey.  For your convenience the link is below.  If you have any questions
please feel free to email me.  Roughly 3/4 of respondents so far have been
female, so gentleman, please, help me out!  I want the data to paint the
most balanced sketch possible.  And also feel free to share the survey
link, either personally or via social media, with any friends and
acquaintances that are blind or visually impaired.

The survey will be found here: http://goo.gl/UBHm7x

Thank you so much!

Sincerely,

Nora E. Goldberg
Urban Sustainability and Community Placemaking
Pennoni Honors College
Drexel University, 2016

From gloria.graves at gmail.com  Sat Mar 14 14:40:09 2015
From: gloria.graves at gmail.com (Gloria Graves)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2015 09:40:09 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Using blackboard
Message-ID: <21827A66-4ADE-41F3-81AE-F226C3094C30@gmail.com>

Hi all,
Does anyone use blackboard for school? Had some questions regarding navigating the discussion board. Thanks
Gloria




From filerime at gmail.com  Sat Mar 14 14:46:29 2015
From: filerime at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?RWxpZiBFbWlyIMOWa3PDvHo=?=)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2015 10:46:29 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Using blackboard
In-Reply-To: <21827A66-4ADE-41F3-81AE-F226C3094C30@gmail.com>
References: <21827A66-4ADE-41F3-81AE-F226C3094C30@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMtP_9d-j85_qM8tVhZUBK8rBCd7-QBZ75GUoLCRUtxMih42pA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Gloria, I'm currently using it.
I'll be happy to answer your questions as much as I can.


2015-03-14 10:40 GMT-04:00, Gloria Graves via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>:
> Hi all,
> Does anyone use blackboard for school? Had some questions regarding
> navigating the discussion board. Thanks
> Gloria
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/filerime%40gmail.com
>


From justin.williams2 at gmail.com  Sat Mar 14 16:01:22 2015
From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2015 12:01:22 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Using blackboard
In-Reply-To: <21827A66-4ADE-41F3-81AE-F226C3094C30@gmail.com>
References: <21827A66-4ADE-41F3-81AE-F226C3094C30@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <001401d05e70$1eb9de30$5c2d9a90$@gmail.com>

Sure; I can anser some questions. 
-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Gloria Graves
via nabs-l
Sent: Saturday, March 14, 2015 10:40 AM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: [nabs-l] Using blackboard

Hi all,
Does anyone use blackboard for school? Had some questions regarding
navigating the discussion board. Thanks Gloria



_______________________________________________
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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
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.com



From nickwilcox_2000 at msn.com  Sat Mar 14 18:02:55 2015
From: nickwilcox_2000 at msn.com (Nick Wilcox)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2015 14:02:55 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Using blackboard
In-Reply-To: <CAMtP_9d-j85_qM8tVhZUBK8rBCd7-QBZ75GUoLCRUtxMih42pA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <21827A66-4ADE-41F3-81AE-F226C3094C30@gmail.com>
	<CAMtP_9d-j85_qM8tVhZUBK8rBCd7-QBZ75GUoLCRUtxMih42pA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BAY404-EAS320DEF34FEE053B17AE0B491040@phx.gbl>

I work at the blackboard help desk for the local community college so I
might be able to help as well. I have been in the office sense 8:30 and I
have only received 2 calls!





-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Elif Emir Öksüz
via nabs-l
Sent: Saturday, March 14, 2015 10:46 AM
To: Gloria Graves; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Using blackboard

Hi Gloria, I'm currently using it.
I'll be happy to answer your questions as much as I can.


2015-03-14 10:40 GMT-04:00, Gloria Graves via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>:
> Hi all,
> Does anyone use blackboard for school? Had some questions regarding 
> navigating the discussion board. Thanks Gloria
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/filerime%40gmail.c
> om
>

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nickwilcox_2000%40msn.co
m


From bridgetawalker13 at aol.com  Sat Mar 14 18:40:39 2015
From: bridgetawalker13 at aol.com (Bridget Walker)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2015 14:40:39 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Using blackboard
In-Reply-To: <BAY404-EAS320DEF34FEE053B17AE0B491040@phx.gbl>
References: <21827A66-4ADE-41F3-81AE-F226C3094C30@gmail.com>
	<CAMtP_9d-j85_qM8tVhZUBK8rBCd7-QBZ75GUoLCRUtxMih42pA@mail.gmail.com>
	<BAY404-EAS320DEF34FEE053B17AE0B491040@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <91788C5A-D6EE-425B-A26E-BD5615B8B690@aol.com>

Maybe this question will come up, does anyone know how to read discussion threads and respond using jaws? I've been using my iPad with VoiceOver but, when I have to type longer threads and read other responses it would be nice if I could do it on my laptop with jaws.
Thanks,
Bridget 

Sent from my iPad

> On Mar 14, 27 Heisei, at 2:02 PM, Nick Wilcox via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> I work at the blackboard help desk for the local community college so I
> might be able to help as well. I have been in the office sense 8:30 and I
> have only received 2 calls!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Elif Emir Öksüz
> via nabs-l
> Sent: Saturday, March 14, 2015 10:46 AM
> To: Gloria Graves; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Using blackboard
> 
> Hi Gloria, I'm currently using it.
> I'll be happy to answer your questions as much as I can.
> 
> 
> 2015-03-14 10:40 GMT-04:00, Gloria Graves via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>:
>> Hi all,
>> Does anyone use blackboard for school? Had some questions regarding 
>> navigating the discussion board. Thanks Gloria
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/filerime%40gmail.c
>> om
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nickwilcox_2000%40msn.co
> m
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bridgetawalker13%40aol.com


From gloria.graves at gmail.com  Sat Mar 14 19:17:23 2015
From: gloria.graves at gmail.com (Gloria Graves)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2015 14:17:23 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Using blackboard
In-Reply-To: <BAY404-EAS320DEF34FEE053B17AE0B491040@phx.gbl>
References: <21827A66-4ADE-41F3-81AE-F226C3094C30@gmail.com>
	<CAMtP_9d-j85_qM8tVhZUBK8rBCd7-QBZ75GUoLCRUtxMih42pA@mail.gmail.com>
	<BAY404-EAS320DEF34FEE053B17AE0B491040@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <FFB3A20C-1D07-4FF1-B494-7A35BC2D2AA6@gmail.com>

Hi,
Can you provide me with a telephone number so that I can ask some questions regarding this? Thanks



> On Mar 14, 2015, at 1:02 PM, Nick Wilcox via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> I work at the blackboard help desk for the local community college so I
> might be able to help as well. I have been in the office sense 8:30 and I
> have only received 2 calls!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Elif Emir Öksüz
> via nabs-l
> Sent: Saturday, March 14, 2015 10:46 AM
> To: Gloria Graves; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Using blackboard
> 
> Hi Gloria, I'm currently using it.
> I'll be happy to answer your questions as much as I can.
> 
> 
> 2015-03-14 10:40 GMT-04:00, Gloria Graves via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>:
>> Hi all,
>> Does anyone use blackboard for school? Had some questions regarding 
>> navigating the discussion board. Thanks Gloria
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/filerime%40gmail.c
>> om
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nickwilcox_2000%40msn.co
> m
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gmail.com


From justin.williams2 at gmail.com  Sat Mar 14 22:58:20 2015
From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2015 18:58:20 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Using blackboard
In-Reply-To: <FFB3A20C-1D07-4FF1-B494-7A35BC2D2AA6@gmail.com>
References: <21827A66-4ADE-41F3-81AE-F226C3094C30@gmail.com>	<CAMtP_9d-j85_qM8tVhZUBK8rBCd7-QBZ75GUoLCRUtxMih42pA@mail.gmail.com>	<BAY404-EAS320DEF34FEE053B17AE0B491040@phx.gbl>
	<FFB3A20C-1D07-4FF1-B494-7A35BC2D2AA6@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <00d001d05eaa$5e946860$1bbd3920$@gmail.com>

803-467-8322

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Gloria Graves via nabs-l
Sent: Saturday, March 14, 2015 3:17 PM
To: Nick Wilcox; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Using blackboard

Hi,
Can you provide me with a telephone number so that I can ask some questions regarding this? Thanks



> On Mar 14, 2015, at 1:02 PM, Nick Wilcox via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> I work at the blackboard help desk for the local community college so 
> I might be able to help as well. I have been in the office sense 8:30 
> and I have only received 2 calls!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Elif Emir 
> Öksüz via nabs-l
> Sent: Saturday, March 14, 2015 10:46 AM
> To: Gloria Graves; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Using blackboard
> 
> Hi Gloria, I'm currently using it.
> I'll be happy to answer your questions as much as I can.
> 
> 
> 2015-03-14 10:40 GMT-04:00, Gloria Graves via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>:
>> Hi all,
>> Does anyone use blackboard for school? Had some questions regarding 
>> navigating the discussion board. Thanks Gloria
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/filerime%40gmail.
>> c
>> om
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nickwilcox_2000%40
> msn.co
> m
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gm
> ail.com

_______________________________________________
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nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail.com



From helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com  Sat Mar 14 22:07:37 2015
From: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com (Helga Schreiber)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2015 18:07:37 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Home Living Skills
Message-ID: <B4C00DC5-2604-47EB-9978-8F661B12BD0A@gmail.com>

Hi everyone! How are you all? I just wanted to ask you some questions, specially to the girls in the list! I don't know if the subject line goes along with these questions, but if it doesn't just let me know ok? As you all know, I'm totally blind, how can a totally bling person prepare a cup of coffee, iron her own clothes,  bacume her own house, and clean her home bathroom in an easy way? In other words, how can a blind person do all thoese things without any problem? I'm just wondering since i would like to learn how to do it. I know that perhaps, some of you are wondering whay I'm asking you all these questions, but I just would like to become more independent in my own house since i actually lost my sight when i was 16 years old, and i use to do things when i was low vision, but when someone is totally blind it is actually a little more difficult to do thins! At least, I think it is! If you prefer you can write me in private. My contact information is located below! I know that these questions are some of many, but i will like to start with something guys! Thanks os much for listening to me! Hope to hear from you soon. Thanks so much and God bless! :) 

Helga Schreiber

Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter.
Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of Blind Students.
Member of the International Networkers Team (INT).
Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research.
Phone:  (561) 706-5950 
Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com 
Skype: helga.schreiber26 
4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx 
INT Website: http://int4life.com/ 

"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16 
Sent from my iPhone 

From helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com  Sat Mar 14 22:12:56 2015
From: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com (Helga Schreiber)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2015 18:12:56 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Using blackboard
In-Reply-To: <00d001d05eaa$5e946860$1bbd3920$@gmail.com>
References: <21827A66-4ADE-41F3-81AE-F226C3094C30@gmail.com>
	<CAMtP_9d-j85_qM8tVhZUBK8rBCd7-QBZ75GUoLCRUtxMih42pA@mail.gmail.com>
	<BAY404-EAS320DEF34FEE053B17AE0B491040@phx.gbl>
	<FFB3A20C-1D07-4FF1-B494-7A35BC2D2AA6@gmail.com>
	<00d001d05eaa$5e946860$1bbd3920$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CFBE3A48-B667-4B82-B934-F0EB97B37263@gmail.com>

Hello Mr. Nic, this is helga. Can I also call you in order to ask you some blackboard questions? Would you like me to call you today or On monday? Just wondering! Hope to hear from you soon. Thank you so much and have a nice day. God bless!

Helga Schreiber

Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter.
Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of Blind Students.
Member of the International Networkers Team (INT).
Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research.
Phone:  (561) 706-5950 
Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com 
Skype: helga.schreiber26 
4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx 
INT Website: http://int4life.com/ 

"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16 
Sent from my iPhone 

> On Mar 14, 2015, at 6:58 PM, justin williams via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> 803-467-8322
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Gloria Graves via nabs-l
> Sent: Saturday, March 14, 2015 3:17 PM
> To: Nick Wilcox; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Using blackboard
> 
> Hi,
> Can you provide me with a telephone number so that I can ask some questions regarding this? Thanks
> 
> 
> 
>> On Mar 14, 2015, at 1:02 PM, Nick Wilcox via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> 
>> I work at the blackboard help desk for the local community college so 
>> I might be able to help as well. I have been in the office sense 8:30 
>> and I have only received 2 calls!
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Elif Emir 
>> Öksüz via nabs-l
>> Sent: Saturday, March 14, 2015 10:46 AM
>> To: Gloria Graves; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Using blackboard
>> 
>> Hi Gloria, I'm currently using it.
>> I'll be happy to answer your questions as much as I can.
>> 
>> 
>> 2015-03-14 10:40 GMT-04:00, Gloria Graves via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>:
>>> Hi all,
>>> Does anyone use blackboard for school? Had some questions regarding 
>>> navigating the discussion board. Thanks Gloria
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/filerime%40gmail.
>>> c
>>> om
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nickwilcox_2000%40
>> msn.co
>> m
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gm
>> ail.com
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail.com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/helga.schreiber26%40gmail.com

From christgirl813 at gmail.com  Sat Mar 14 22:20:42 2015
From: christgirl813 at gmail.com (Kayla James)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2015 17:20:42 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Home Living Skills
In-Reply-To: <B4C00DC5-2604-47EB-9978-8F661B12BD0A@gmail.com>
References: <B4C00DC5-2604-47EB-9978-8F661B12BD0A@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9085BF84-8057-4C47-B387-67F4816D6D34@gmail.com>

Find your local Dhs office.

Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 14, 2015, at 5:07 PM, Helga Schreiber via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:

> Hi everyone! How are you all? I just wanted to ask you some questions, specially to the girls in the list! I don't know if the subject line goes along with these questions, but if it doesn't just let me know ok? As you all know, I'm totally blind, how can a totally bling person prepare a cup of coffee, iron her own clothes,  bacume her own house, and clean her home bathroom in an easy way? In other words, how can a blind person do all thoese things without any problem? I'm just wondering since i would like to learn how to do it. I know that perhaps, some of you are wondering whay I'm asking you all these questions, but I just would like to become more independent in my own house since i actually lost my sight when i was 16 years old, and i use to do things when i was low vision, but when someone is totally blind it is actually a little more difficult to do thins! At least, I think it is! If you prefer you can write me in private. My contact information is located below! I know that these questions are some of many, but i will like to start with something guys! Thanks os much for listening to me! Hope to hear from you soon. Thanks so much and God bless! :) 
> 
> Helga Schreiber
> 
> Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter.
> Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of Blind Students.
> Member of the International Networkers Team (INT).
> Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research.
> Phone:  (561) 706-5950 
> Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com 
> Skype: helga.schreiber26 
> 4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx 
> INT Website: http://int4life.com/ 
> 
> "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16 
> Sent from my iPhone 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/christgirl813%40gmail.com


From justin.williams2 at gmail.com  Sat Mar 14 23:28:26 2015
From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2015 19:28:26 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Using blackboard
In-Reply-To: <FFB3A20C-1D07-4FF1-B494-7A35BC2D2AA6@gmail.com>
References: <21827A66-4ADE-41F3-81AE-F226C3094C30@gmail.com>	<CAMtP_9d-j85_qM8tVhZUBK8rBCd7-QBZ75GUoLCRUtxMih42pA@mail.gmail.com>	<BAY404-EAS320DEF34FEE053B17AE0B491040@phx.gbl>
	<FFB3A20C-1D07-4FF1-B494-7A35BC2D2AA6@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <00e301d05eae$929ae6d0$b7d0b470$@gmail.com>

Oops, thought you asked me for my number Gloria; my fault.

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Gloria Graves via nabs-l
Sent: Saturday, March 14, 2015 3:17 PM
To: Nick Wilcox; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Using blackboard

Hi,
Can you provide me with a telephone number so that I can ask some questions regarding this? Thanks



> On Mar 14, 2015, at 1:02 PM, Nick Wilcox via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> I work at the blackboard help desk for the local community college so 
> I might be able to help as well. I have been in the office sense 8:30 
> and I have only received 2 calls!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Elif Emir 
> Öksüz via nabs-l
> Sent: Saturday, March 14, 2015 10:46 AM
> To: Gloria Graves; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Using blackboard
> 
> Hi Gloria, I'm currently using it.
> I'll be happy to answer your questions as much as I can.
> 
> 
> 2015-03-14 10:40 GMT-04:00, Gloria Graves via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>:
>> Hi all,
>> Does anyone use blackboard for school? Had some questions regarding 
>> navigating the discussion board. Thanks Gloria
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/filerime%40gmail.
>> c
>> om
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nickwilcox_2000%40
> msn.co
> m
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gm
> ail.com

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail.com



From gloria.graves at gmail.com  Sat Mar 14 23:22:04 2015
From: gloria.graves at gmail.com (Gloria Graves)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2015 18:22:04 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Home Living Skills
In-Reply-To: <9085BF84-8057-4C47-B387-67F4816D6D34@gmail.com>
References: <B4C00DC5-2604-47EB-9978-8F661B12BD0A@gmail.com>
	<9085BF84-8057-4C47-B387-67F4816D6D34@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <A38E8F45-182D-472E-800D-6A04FF381810@gmail.com>

Why would you make a comment like that? Was that supposed to be really helpful or were you trying to poke fun at her?



> On Mar 14, 2015, at 5:20 PM, Kayla James via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Find your local Dhs office.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Mar 14, 2015, at 5:07 PM, Helga Schreiber via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi everyone! How are you all? I just wanted to ask you some questions, specially to the girls in the list! I don't know if the subject line goes along with these questions, but if it doesn't just let me know ok? As you all know, I'm totally blind, how can a totally bling person prepare a cup of coffee, iron her own clothes,  bacume her own house, and clean her home bathroom in an easy way? In other words, how can a blind person do all thoese things without any problem? I'm just wondering since i would like to learn how to do it. I know that perhaps, some of you are wondering whay I'm asking you all these questions, but I just would like to become more independent in my own house since i actually lost my sight when i was 16 years old, and i use to do things when i was low vision, but when someone is totally blind it is actually a little more difficult to do thins! At least, I think it is! If you prefer you can write me in private. My contact information is located below! I know that these questions are some of many, but i will like to start with something guys! Thanks os much for listening to me! Hope to hear from you soon. Thanks so much and God bless! :) 
>> 
>> Helga Schreiber
>> 
>> Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter.
>> Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of Blind Students.
>> Member of the International Networkers Team (INT).
>> Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research.
>> Phone:  (561) 706-5950 
>> Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com 
>> Skype: helga.schreiber26 
>> 4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx 
>> INT Website: http://int4life.com/ 
>> 
>> "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16 
>> Sent from my iPhone 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/christgirl813%40gmail.com
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gmail.com


From gloria.graves at gmail.com  Sat Mar 14 23:25:38 2015
From: gloria.graves at gmail.com (Gloria Graves)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2015 18:25:38 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Home Living Skills
In-Reply-To: <B4C00DC5-2604-47EB-9978-8F661B12BD0A@gmail.com>
References: <B4C00DC5-2604-47EB-9978-8F661B12BD0A@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <A7CDA552-B6EF-4EC1-9862-DFB93AD0646D@gmail.com>

Hi,
As you know or have found out so far a lot of things are done by touch for instance if you want to sweep your floors are usually find a corner where I want to sweep all of the trash in till and I sweep the whole room tour to that corner and then I can go and pick up the trash knowing that it's in that one area the same for vacuuming start on one end of the room and work your way to the other side of the room as far as it goes with making coffee you can first start by taking the coffee cup that you will end up drinking your coffee out of filling it up with water and pouring it into your teapot, this way you know how much water it will take to fill up your cup then that way you can pour the water from the coffee pot into the back of the coffee pat container mum and then everything else is self explanatory when I first moved in with my now husband most of his appliances were touchscreen which as you know is extremely difficult for someone who is blind by him being cited he was able to help me label the coffee pot our oven and so on this way I can use it hope this helps Sam and if you have any other questions please don't hesitate or feel awkward by asking



> On Mar 14, 2015, at 5:07 PM, Helga Schreiber via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi everyone! How are you all? I just wanted to ask you some questions, specially to the girls in the list! I don't know if the subject line goes along with these questions, but if it doesn't just let me know ok? As you all know, I'm totally blind, how can a totally bling person prepare a cup of coffee, iron her own clothes,  bacume her own house, and clean her home bathroom in an easy way? In other words, how can a blind person do all thoese things without any problem? I'm just wondering since i would like to learn how to do it. I know that perhaps, some of you are wondering whay I'm asking you all these questions, but I just would like to become more independent in my own house since i actually lost my sight when i was 16 years old, and i use to do things when i was low vision, but when someone is totally blind it is actually a little more difficult to do thins! At least, I think it is! If you prefer you can write me in private. My contact information is located below! I know that these questions are some of many, but i will like to start with something guys! Thanks os much for listening to me! Hope to hear from you soon. Thanks so much and God bless! :) 
> 
> Helga Schreiber
> 
> Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter.
> Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of Blind Students.
> Member of the International Networkers Team (INT).
> Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research.
> Phone:  (561) 706-5950 
> Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com 
> Skype: helga.schreiber26 
> 4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx 
> INT Website: http://int4life.com/ 
> 
> "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16 
> Sent from my iPhone 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gmail.com


From kmaent1 at gmail.com  Sat Mar 14 23:37:38 2015
From: kmaent1 at gmail.com (Karl Martin Adam)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2015 19:37:38 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Home Living Skills
Message-ID: <5504c66d.5a876b0a.4c0d.ffffa96a@mx.google.com>

Hi Helga,

I hate Coffee, and I don't really wear clothes that need ironing, 
so I don't know the answers to those, but vacuuming I think is 
one of the easiest methods of cleaning for blind people.  You 
just have to go over the whole room with the vacuum in a pattern.  
I usually go sideways so back and forth a couple times then step 
to the side and do it again till I get across the room, and then 
move a couple feet forward and do it all over going the other 
way.  If you have serious dirt you'll hear the vacuum make sort 
of crunching noises at first, and when it stops you know you've 
gotten that part of the carpet.  Cleaning the bathroom is kind of 
the same thing.  You take whatever cleaner or just water, put it 
on your paper towel, and wipe down your surface in straight 
lines.  Then go over it again with dry paper towel to make sure 
you don't get spotting.  Glass is a bit tricky because it can 
streak, but if you're a blind person living alone, it doesn't 
really matter how good your mirrors look, and if you have a 
sighted person living with you you can ask them to check.  I'm 
totally blind, but I used to date a girl who worked as a janitor 
cleaning hair salons, so sometimes I would go to work with her 
and help so she could get done faster.  I would take care of all 
the trash, the vacuuming, and some of the mopping, and she would 
do the visual stuff like cleaning the glass and metal fittings, 
but that's because they had to be perfect with no streaks or 
finger prints.  Anyway, my point is that this is all very doable.  
If you're really worried about these things, it might be worth 
your while to get some training from an NFB center or your state 
rehab agency.

Hope this helps,
Karl

 ----- Original Message -----
From: Helga Schreiber via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
To: National Association of Blind Students <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
Date sent: Sat, 14 Mar 2015 18:07:37 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Home Living Skills

Hi everyone! How are you all? I just wanted to ask you some 
questions, specially to the girls in the list! I don't know if 
the subject line goes along with these questions, but if it 
doesn't just let me know ok? As you all know, I'm totally blind, 
how can a totally bling person prepare a cup of coffee, iron her 
own clothes,  bacume her own house, and clean her home bathroom 
in an easy way? In other words, how can a blind person do all 
thoese things without any problem? I'm just wondering since i 
would like to learn how to do it. I know that perhaps, some of 
you are wondering whay I'm asking you all these questions, but I 
just would like to become more independent in my own house since 
i actually lost my sight when i was 16 years old, and i use to do 
things when i was low vision, but when someone is totally blind 
it is actually a little more difficult to do thins! At least, I 
think it is! If you prefer you can write me in private. My 
contact information is located below! I know that these questions 
are some of many, but i will like to start with something guys! 
Thanks os much for listening to me! Hope to hear from you soon. 
Thanks so much and God bless! :)

Helga Schreiber

Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota 
chapter.
Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida 
Association of Blind Students.
Member of the International Networkers Team (INT).
Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research.
Phone:  (561) 706-5950
Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com
Skype: helga.schreiber26
4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx
INT Website: http://int4life.com/

"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, 
that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal 
life." John 3:16
Sent from my iPhone
_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
for nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kmaent1%40gma
il.com


From justin.williams2 at gmail.com  Sun Mar 15 00:39:16 2015
From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2015 20:39:16 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Home Living Skills
In-Reply-To: <A7CDA552-B6EF-4EC1-9862-DFB93AD0646D@gmail.com>
References: <B4C00DC5-2604-47EB-9978-8F661B12BD0A@gmail.com>
	<A7CDA552-B6EF-4EC1-9862-DFB93AD0646D@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <016701d05eb8$78128f20$6837ad60$@gmail.com>

Sweep everything onto the carpet, then vacuum it up.  That is what I use to
sweep my flor.

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Gloria Graves
via nabs-l
Sent: Saturday, March 14, 2015 7:26 PM
To: Helga Schreiber; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Home Living Skills

Hi,
As you know or have found out so far a lot of things are done by touch for
instance if you want to sweep your floors are usually find a corner where I
want to sweep all of the trash in till and I sweep the whole room tour to
that corner and then I can go and pick up the trash knowing that it's in
that one area the same for vacuuming start on one end of the room and work
your way to the other side of the room as far as it goes with making coffee
you can first start by taking the coffee cup that you will end up drinking
your coffee out of filling it up with water and pouring it into your teapot,
this way you know how much water it will take to fill up your cup then that
way you can pour the water from the coffee pot into the back of the coffee
pat container mum and then everything else is self explanatory when I first
moved in with my now husband most of his appliances were touchscreen which
as you know is extremely difficult for someone who is blind by him being
cited he was able to help me label the coffee pot our oven and so on this
way I can use it hope this helps Sam and if you have any other questions
please don't hesitate or feel awkward by asking



> On Mar 14, 2015, at 5:07 PM, Helga Schreiber via nabs-l
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi everyone! How are you all? I just wanted to ask you some questions, 
> specially to the girls in the list! I don't know if the subject line 
> goes along with these questions, but if it doesn't just let me know 
> ok? As you all know, I'm totally blind, how can a totally bling person 
> prepare a cup of coffee, iron her own clothes,  bacume her own house, 
> and clean her home bathroom in an easy way? In other words, how can a 
> blind person do all thoese things without any problem? I'm just 
> wondering since i would like to learn how to do it. I know that 
> perhaps, some of you are wondering whay I'm asking you all these 
> questions, but I just would like to become more independent in my own 
> house since i actually lost my sight when i was 16 years old, and i 
> use to do things when i was low vision, but when someone is totally 
> blind it is actually a little more difficult to do thins! At least, I 
> think it is! If you prefer you can write me in private. My contact 
> information is located below! I know that these questions are some of 
> many, but i will like to start with something guys! Thanks os much for 
> listening to me! Hope to hear from you soon. Thanks so much and God 
> bless! :)
> 
> Helga Schreiber
> 
> Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter.
> Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of
Blind Students.
> Member of the International Networkers Team (INT).
> Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research.
> Phone:  (561) 706-5950
> Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com
> Skype: helga.schreiber26
> 4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx
> INT Website: http://int4life.com/
> 
> "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that 
> whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 
> 3:16 Sent from my iPhone 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gm
> ail.com

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail
.com



From arielle71 at gmail.com  Sat Mar 14 23:50:12 2015
From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2015 16:50:12 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Home Living Skills
In-Reply-To: <A7CDA552-B6EF-4EC1-9862-DFB93AD0646D@gmail.com>
References: <B4C00DC5-2604-47EB-9978-8F661B12BD0A@gmail.com>
	<A7CDA552-B6EF-4EC1-9862-DFB93AD0646D@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CALAYQJCZfG-PAkQ65CXGoR9mnGuZoKgoJeUc+8uzOb2jLQA6eQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Helga and all. As far as coffee goes, if you are uncomfortable
pouring hot coffee into a cup, you can buy a coffee maker that brews
your coffee directly into a single mug. When I pour my hot coffee from
coffeepot to mug, I feel how high the steam is rising and stop when
the steam is approaching the top of the cup. I usually don't fill my
mug all the way up to the brim when the coffee is super hot. As for
the other tasks, I think you'll find they're done mostly the same way
whether you are sighted, low-vision or totally blind. The only real
difference is that you will be using your touch to determine when
something is clean. You can tell when the bathroom counter or the side
of the tub is clean because it will no longer feel grimy. For toilets
and mirrors, just scrub the entire surface thoroughly. I always vacuum
and sweep barefoot and when I think I've covered the whole area, walk
around and feel with my feet to see if there is any remaining dirt.
If you're unsure about your cleaning, you could have a sighted person
come in and tell you if you've cleaned everything well enough. If not,
you may want to have another blind person observe you cleaning and
they can give you some advice on how to improve your technique.
Arielle

On 3/14/15, Gloria Graves via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Hi,
> As you know or have found out so far a lot of things are done by touch for
> instance if you want to sweep your floors are usually find a corner where I
> want to sweep all of the trash in till and I sweep the whole room tour to
> that corner and then I can go and pick up the trash knowing that it's in
> that one area the same for vacuuming start on one end of the room and work
> your way to the other side of the room as far as it goes with making coffee
> you can first start by taking the coffee cup that you will end up drinking
> your coffee out of filling it up with water and pouring it into your teapot,
> this way you know how much water it will take to fill up your cup then that
> way you can pour the water from the coffee pot into the back of the coffee
> pat container mum and then everything else is self explanatory when I first
> moved in with my now husband most of his appliances were touchscreen which
> as you know is extremely difficult for someone who is blind by him being
> cited he was able to help me label the coffee pot our oven and so on this
> way I can use it hope this helps Sam and if you have any other questions
> please don't hesitate or feel awkward by asking
>
>
>
>> On Mar 14, 2015, at 5:07 PM, Helga Schreiber via nabs-l
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>
>> Hi everyone! How are you all? I just wanted to ask you some questions,
>> specially to the girls in the list! I don't know if the subject line goes
>> along with these questions, but if it doesn't just let me know ok? As you
>> all know, I'm totally blind, how can a totally bling person prepare a cup
>> of coffee, iron her own clothes,  bacume her own house, and clean her home
>> bathroom in an easy way? In other words, how can a blind person do all
>> thoese things without any problem? I'm just wondering since i would like
>> to learn how to do it. I know that perhaps, some of you are wondering whay
>> I'm asking you all these questions, but I just would like to become more
>> independent in my own house since i actually lost my sight when i was 16
>> years old, and i use to do things when i was low vision, but when someone
>> is totally blind it is actually a little more difficult to do thins! At
>> least, I think it is! If you prefer you can write me in private. My
>> contact information is located below! I know that these questions are some
>> of many, but i will like to start with something guys! Thanks os much for
>> listening to me! Hope to hear from you soon. Thanks so much and God bless!
>> :)
>>
>> Helga Schreiber
>>
>> Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter.
>> Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of
>> Blind Students.
>> Member of the International Networkers Team (INT).
>> Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research.
>> Phone:  (561) 706-5950
>> Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com
>> Skype: helga.schreiber26
>> 4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx
>> INT Website: http://int4life.com/
>>
>> "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that
>> whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gmail.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com
>


From filerime at gmail.com  Sun Mar 15 00:13:00 2015
From: filerime at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?RWxpZiBFbWlyIMOWa3PDvHo=?=)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2015 20:13:00 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Using blackboard
In-Reply-To: <00e301d05eae$929ae6d0$b7d0b470$@gmail.com>
References: <21827A66-4ADE-41F3-81AE-F226C3094C30@gmail.com>
	<CAMtP_9d-j85_qM8tVhZUBK8rBCd7-QBZ75GUoLCRUtxMih42pA@mail.gmail.com>
	<BAY404-EAS320DEF34FEE053B17AE0B491040@phx.gbl>
	<FFB3A20C-1D07-4FF1-B494-7A35BC2D2AA6@gmail.com>
	<00e301d05eae$929ae6d0$b7d0b470$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMtP_9f78AVkK6wVSVVbb8UKg-ee6-J0A+guwkRa4WFz+=e_xQ@mail.gmail.com>

I’ll share what I do here, so everyone can have benefit.
1.	open the related course and find discussion board heading. Then
press enter. So discussion board has opened somewhere in the screen.
2.	Press T, because this is a table view. You’ll come to the table
with 5 colons and different rows depending on your course’s opened
forums.
3.	Navigate in the table and find the related forum. Ctrl + alt +
arrow keys help you to navigate between the cells in a table.
4.	When you hear the related forum name, press enter.
5.	Press X to come to the beginning of the threads. Everyone has a
check box at the beginning. Then you can navigate between different
threads. When you hear the name of it in a link format open it with
enter.
6.	Press B, because every entry has a voting part at the beginning.
7.	Then navigate with down arrow to hear actual message. If there are
more than 1 message in one thread, again press B to go to other entry.
You can also use down arrow.
8.	If you want to reply, press control F and type reply. Press enter
to open it.
9.	Content area is the place we will type our message. You can write
it in word and copy if you want.
10.	When you are done, use tab to find submit. When you hear submit,
press enter. Yes you replied.
11.	Then you can go back to other threads with back space or ctrl left arrow.
12.	If you want to review an attachment, find it in the thread. Then
press enter. You can open or save it. If you save it, it will probably
go to your download folder or your default folder for all downloads.

I hope it helps,
It is not my favorite think but I can manage blackboard. I mean don’t
have very high expectations, it is weird and challenging for me.


2015-03-14 19:28 GMT-04:00, justin williams via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>:
> Oops, thought you asked me for my number Gloria; my fault.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Gloria Graves
> via nabs-l
> Sent: Saturday, March 14, 2015 3:17 PM
> To: Nick Wilcox; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Using blackboard
>
> Hi,
> Can you provide me with a telephone number so that I can ask some questions
> regarding this? Thanks
>
>
>
>> On Mar 14, 2015, at 1:02 PM, Nick Wilcox via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>> I work at the blackboard help desk for the local community college so
>> I might be able to help as well. I have been in the office sense 8:30
>> and I have only received 2 calls!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Elif Emir
>> Öksüz via nabs-l
>> Sent: Saturday, March 14, 2015 10:46 AM
>> To: Gloria Graves; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Using blackboard
>>
>> Hi Gloria, I'm currently using it.
>> I'll be happy to answer your questions as much as I can.
>>
>>
>> 2015-03-14 10:40 GMT-04:00, Gloria Graves via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>:
>>> Hi all,
>>> Does anyone use blackboard for school? Had some questions regarding
>>> navigating the discussion board. Thanks Gloria
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/filerime%40gmail.
>>> c
>>> om
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nickwilcox_2000%40
>> msn.co
>> m
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gm
>> ail.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/filerime%40gmail.com
>


From sgermano at asu.edu  Sun Mar 15 15:59:26 2015
From: sgermano at asu.edu (Suzanne Germano)
Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2015 08:59:26 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Home Living Skills
In-Reply-To: <B4C00DC5-2604-47EB-9978-8F661B12BD0A@gmail.com>
References: <B4C00DC5-2604-47EB-9978-8F661B12BD0A@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAF=_avckBeE=ERp+D6yUW0t8_sOTyh+FY77SAGyNWo7MoUnspg@mail.gmail.com>

When I was young the public school system had summer school called Daily
Living Skills for blind and VI. The kids were taught to shop, cook, clean,
iron, sew, change diapers, grooming etc

Some kids needs more training than others.

We also went on super cool filed trips!

On Sat, Mar 14, 2015 at 3:07 PM, Helga Schreiber via nabs-l <
nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:

> Hi everyone! How are you all? I just wanted to ask you some questions,
> specially to the girls in the list! I don't know if the subject line goes
> along with these questions, but if it doesn't just let me know ok? As you
> all know, I'm totally blind, how can a totally bling person prepare a cup
> of coffee, iron her own clothes,  bacume her own house, and clean her home
> bathroom in an easy way? In other words, how can a blind person do all
> thoese things without any problem? I'm just wondering since i would like to
> learn how to do it. I know that perhaps, some of you are wondering whay I'm
> asking you all these questions, but I just would like to become more
> independent in my own house since i actually lost my sight when i was 16
> years old, and i use to do things when i was low vision, but when someone
> is totally blind it is actually a little more difficult to do thins! At
> least, I think it is! If you prefer you can write me in private. My contact
> information is located below! I kno
>  w that these questions are some of many, but i will like to start with
> something guys! Thanks os much for listening to me! Hope to hear from you
> soon. Thanks so much and God bless! :)
>
> Helga Schreiber
>
> Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter.
> Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of
> Blind Students.
> Member of the International Networkers Team (INT).
> Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research.
> Phone:  (561) 706-5950
> Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com
> Skype: helga.schreiber26
> 4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx
> INT Website: http://int4life.com/
>
> "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that
> whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16
> Sent from my iPhone
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sgermano%40asu.edu
>

From sgermano at asu.edu  Sun Mar 15 16:02:31 2015
From: sgermano at asu.edu (Suzanne Germano)
Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2015 09:02:31 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Home Living Skills
In-Reply-To: <A7CDA552-B6EF-4EC1-9862-DFB93AD0646D@gmail.com>
References: <B4C00DC5-2604-47EB-9978-8F661B12BD0A@gmail.com>
	<A7CDA552-B6EF-4EC1-9862-DFB93AD0646D@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAF=_avcaZwhk7bhiiX3EhnYEkN0103ETGOLRPuX2UyLFefk9Aw@mail.gmail.com>

Easiest way for coffee or tea a Keurig coffee maker. There is a reservoir
for water, the coffee are in pods, stick a pod in press a button exact
amount of water goes through the pod and perfect cup of coffee

On Sat, Mar 14, 2015 at 4:25 PM, Gloria Graves via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> wrote:

> Hi,
> As you know or have found out so far a lot of things are done by touch for
> instance if you want to sweep your floors are usually find a corner where I
> want to sweep all of the trash in till and I sweep the whole room tour to
> that corner and then I can go and pick up the trash knowing that it's in
> that one area the same for vacuuming start on one end of the room and work
> your way to the other side of the room as far as it goes with making coffee
> you can first start by taking the coffee cup that you will end up drinking
> your coffee out of filling it up with water and pouring it into your
> teapot, this way you know how much water it will take to fill up your cup
> then that way you can pour the water from the coffee pot into the back of
> the coffee pat container mum and then everything else is self explanatory
> when I first moved in with my now husband most of his appliances were
> touchscreen which as you know is extremely difficult for someone who is
> blind by him being cited he was a
>  ble to help me label the coffee pot our oven and so on this way I can use
> it hope this helps Sam and if you have any other questions please don't
> hesitate or feel awkward by asking
>
>
>
> > On Mar 14, 2015, at 5:07 PM, Helga Schreiber via nabs-l <
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> >
> > Hi everyone! How are you all? I just wanted to ask you some questions,
> specially to the girls in the list! I don't know if the subject line goes
> along with these questions, but if it doesn't just let me know ok? As you
> all know, I'm totally blind, how can a totally bling person prepare a cup
> of coffee, iron her own clothes,  bacume her own house, and clean her home
> bathroom in an easy way? In other words, how can a blind person do all
> thoese things without any problem? I'm just wondering since i would like to
> learn how to do it. I know that perhaps, some of you are wondering whay I'm
> asking you all these questions, but I just would like to become more
> independent in my own house since i actually lost my sight when i was 16
> years old, and i use to do things when i was low vision, but when someone
> is totally blind it is actually a little more difficult to do thins! At
> least, I think it is! If you prefer you can write me in private. My contact
> information is located below! I k
>  now that these questions are some of many, but i will like to start with
> something guys! Thanks os much for listening to me! Hope to hear from you
> soon. Thanks so much and God bless! :)
> >
> > Helga Schreiber
> >
> > Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter.
> > Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of
> Blind Students.
> > Member of the International Networkers Team (INT).
> > Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research.
> > Phone:  (561) 706-5950
> > Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com
> > Skype: helga.schreiber26
> > 4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx
> > INT Website: http://int4life.com/
> >
> > "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that
> whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16
> > Sent from my iPhone
> > _______________________________________________
> > nabs-l mailing list
> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> >
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gmail.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sgermano%40asu.edu
>

From carlymih at comcast.net  Sun Mar 15 16:42:21 2015
From: carlymih at comcast.net (Carly Mihalakis)
Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2015 09:42:21 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Home Living Skills
In-Reply-To: <B4C00DC5-2604-47EB-9978-8F661B12BD0A@gmail.com>
References: <B4C00DC5-2604-47EB-9978-8F661B12BD0A@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <mailman.202.1772982280.2863824.nabs-l_nfbnet.org@nfbnet.org>

Hi, Helga,

         Well for me, Nobody showed me how to do these things. I am, 
by nature, a very curious and out-of-the-box thinking person.. 
Therefore, I just sort of jump in, tightening my methods by doing. 
It's sort of a structured discovery thing. Methods you perfect, and 
by perfect, I am, of course, referring to   perfecting the way that 
works for you best. I do not follow anyone's method without sort of 
tweaking it to work better for me.
I like what someone said about hooking up with another blink to get 
the basics. Then, based on what you find out, you can apply your own 
personal tweaks to make it your own.
Keep us posted!
Car03:07 PM 3/14/2015, Helga Schreiber via nabs-l wrote:
>Hi everyone! How are you all? I just wanted to ask you some 
>questions, specially to the girls in the list! I don't know if the 
>subject line goes along with these questions, but if it doesn't just 
>let me know ok? As you all know, I'm totally blind, how can a 
>totally bling person prepare a cup of coffee, iron her own 
>clothes,  bacume her own house, and clean her home bathroom in an 
>easy way? In other words, how can a blind person do all thoese 
>things without any problem? I'm just wondering since i would like to 
>learn how to do it. I know that perhaps, some of you are wondering 
>whay I'm asking you all these questions, but I just would like to 
>become more independent in my own house since i actually lost my 
>sight when i was 16 years old, and i use to do things when i was low 
>vision, but when someone is totally blind it is actually a little 
>more difficult to do thins! At least, I think it is! If you prefer 
>you can write me in private. My contact information is located 
>below! I know that these questions are some of many, but i will like 
>to start with something guys! Thanks os much for listening to me! 
>Hope to hear from you soon. Thanks so much and God bless! :)
>
>Helga Schreiber
>
>Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter.
>Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association 
>of Blind Students.
>Member of the International Networkers Team (INT).
>Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research.
>Phone:  (561) 706-5950
>Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com
>Skype: helga.schreiber26
>4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx
>INT Website: http://int4life.com/
>
>"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that 
>whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16
>Sent from my iPhone
>_______________________________________________
>nabs-l mailing list
>nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carlymih%40comcast.net




From kirt.crazydude at gmail.com  Sun Mar 15 20:06:02 2015
From: kirt.crazydude at gmail.com (Kirt)
Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2015 14:06:02 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Home Living Skills
In-Reply-To: <5505b69c.28518c0a.0984.648dSMTPIN_ADDED_MISSING@mx.google.com>
References: <B4C00DC5-2604-47EB-9978-8F661B12BD0A@gmail.com>
	<5505b69c.28518c0a.0984.648dSMTPIN_ADDED_MISSING@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <F5849E85-0409-42A5-A75D-8637AB84346F@gmail.com>

Carly,
It's refreshing to find myself agreeing with you…

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 15, 2015, at 10:42 AM, Carly Mihalakis via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi, Helga,
> 
>        Well for me, Nobody showed me how to do these things. I am, by nature, a very curious and out-of-the-box thinking person.. Therefore, I just sort of jump in, tightening my methods by doing. It's sort of a structured discovery thing. Methods you perfect, and by perfect, I am, of course, referring to   perfecting the way that works for you best. I do not follow anyone's method without sort of tweaking it to work better for me.
> I like what someone said about hooking up with another blink to get the basics. Then, based on what you find out, you can apply your own personal tweaks to make it your own.
> Keep us posted!
> Car03:07 PM 3/14/2015, Helga Schreiber via nabs-l wrote:
>> Hi everyone! How are you all? I just wanted to ask you some questions, specially to the girls in the list! I don't know if the subject line goes along with these questions, but if it doesn't just let me know ok? As you all know, I'm totally blind, how can a totally bling person prepare a cup of coffee, iron her own clothes,  bacume her own house, and clean her home bathroom in an easy way? In other words, how can a blind person do all thoese things without any problem? I'm just wondering since i would like to learn how to do it. I know that perhaps, some of you are wondering whay I'm asking you all these questions, but I just would like to become more independent in my own house since i actually lost my sight when i was 16 years old, and i use to do things when i was low vision, but when someone is totally blind it is actually a little more difficult to do thins! At least, I think it is! If you prefer you can write me in private. My contact information is located below! I know that these questions are some of many, but i will like to start with something guys! Thanks os much for listening to me! Hope to hear from you soon. Thanks so much and God bless! :)
>> 
>> Helga Schreiber
>> 
>> Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter.
>> Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of Blind Students.
>> Member of the International Networkers Team (INT).
>> Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research.
>> Phone:  (561) 706-5950
>> Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com
>> Skype: helga.schreiber26
>> 4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx
>> INT Website: http://int4life.com/
>> 
>> "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carlymih%40comcast.net
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40gmail.com


From gloria.graves at gmail.com  Sun Mar 15 22:26:53 2015
From: gloria.graves at gmail.com (Gloria Graves)
Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2015 17:26:53 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] iPad apps for school
Message-ID: <67AAD6FE-B848-4DD3-945D-F98D371C5355@gmail.com>

Hi all,
I hope everyone is doing well. I have an iPad and I'm wanting to use it for school and was wondering if anyone could give me a list of apps that would be great for me to have? I have heard of apps such as pages, keynotes, but was wondering if there are others that would work for school related things and also some there could be fun thanks in advance :-)
Gloria




From nickwilcox_2000 at msn.com  Sun Mar 15 22:58:13 2015
From: nickwilcox_2000 at msn.com (nickwilcox_2000)
Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2015 18:58:13 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] iPad apps for school
In-Reply-To: <67AAD6FE-B848-4DD3-945D-F98D371C5355@gmail.com>
References: <67AAD6FE-B848-4DD3-945D-F98D371C5355@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BAY168-DS1783041581CE1CE38ED6191050@phx.gbl>

You could experiment with the blackboard app. I did not use it very much because it will not work with my administrator account.

Nick

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Gloria Graves via nabs-l" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, March 15, 2015 6:26 PM
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Subject: [nabs-l] iPad apps for school

Hi all,
I hope everyone is doing well. I have an iPad and I'm wanting to use it for school and was wondering if anyone could give me a list 
of apps that would be great for me to have? I have heard of apps such as pages, keynotes, but was wondering if there are others that 
would work for school related things and also some there could be fun thanks in advance :-)
Gloria



_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/nickwilcox_2000%40msn.com 



From clb5590 at gmail.com  Sun Mar 15 23:10:31 2015
From: clb5590 at gmail.com (Cindy Bennett)
Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2015 16:10:31 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Analyzing Qualitative Data with Software
In-Reply-To: <CALAYQJAwqQA4X4yq4ptbepFKQVOnY0GG5HzbLJUR96T_L11m_A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CACUFQdxsbbnUPey1LOeb_b9fsHUGcbUFL2M8XY1ssv+mDSczGw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CALAYQJAwqQA4X4yq4ptbepFKQVOnY0GG5HzbLJUR96T_L11m_A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACUFQdxGAmQYNq3v_Kf1KmPhxAzK64LRYskwnSmSPz1dmD+Ekw@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Arielle,

Thanks for that.

In my experience of analyzing qualitative data, we have a code book
that is numbered. High level codes are labeled with numbers such as 1,
2, 3, etc. Codes within those categories are labeled 1.1, 1.2, 1.3,
etc. I was thinking of assigning an Excel sheet to each high level
code and assigning a few columns to each lower level code so i can
number the occurrences, list the speaker, and the quote, and other
notes about the code assignment. This will require considerable copy
and pasting however.

I could probably manage this if I was the only one coding, but the
software really comes in handy when two or more people are examining
the data. The software can quickly give data about percentages of
agreement and other data about which codes were used most often much
more quickly than i could compute in Excel.

The reason I asked about accessibility before exploring myself is that
the programs typically work by you uploading files onto the website.
Each coder then goes through and marks up the text. So I am a bit
nervous that some of the programs may not be accessible since they
will be converting text from a file into some format that can be
marked up by proprietary software. Anyway, I have received a few
suggestions for free software which I can try. But if anyone has
experience using any qualitative coding with a program, I would still
love to hear about your experiences.

Thanks,

Cindy

On 3/12/15, Arielle Silverman <arielle71 at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Cindy,
> I have little experience with qualitative data and have never used
> qualitative software. However, I recently prepared a qualitative
> summary of some focus group data by hand, and it was a very manageable
> task. My colleague coded the same data using software and our reports
> were quite similar. So I'm not convinced that qualitative software is
> actually required, and if it carries accessibility hassles, then
> coding by hand might end up being easier. Basically coding just
> involves creating categories based on common themes you observe in the
> transcript and then going through and assigning each participant
> comment to one of the categories you create. I think the software may
> help visually organize the data, but I'm not sure how much benefit you
> would actually get from using software, unless you need to use it for
> a qualitative software class. Others with mor qualitative experience
> thanI might be able to comment further.
> Best Arielle
>
> On 3/12/15, Cindy Bennett via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> Has anyone ever used a software to assist in analyzing their
>> qualitative data? If so, I would love to hear from you before trying a
>> bunch of options that may or may not be accessible.
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> --
>> Cindy Bennett
>> 1st Year Ph.D. Student, University of Washington
>> Human Centered Design and Engineering
>>
>> Treasurer of the National Federation of the Blind of Washington
>> an Affiliate of the National Federation of the Blind
>>
>> clb5590 at gmail.com
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com
>>
>


-- 
Cindy Bennett
1st Year Ph.D. Student, University of Washington
Human Centered Design and Engineering

Treasurer of the National Federation of the Blind of Washington
an Affiliate of the National Federation of the Blind

clb5590 at gmail.com


From desai1shikha at gmail.com  Sun Mar 15 23:34:27 2015
From: desai1shikha at gmail.com (Shikha)
Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2015 19:34:27 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Room mate at national convention
Message-ID: <8BF1237F-583D-4DDF-B41B-B7B70E8CD392@gmail.com>



Hey 
I am looking for two girls to room with me at national convention 

My email address is desai1shikha at gmail.com 
Thanks, 
Shikha. 


From kmaent1 at gmail.com  Sun Mar 15 23:49:44 2015
From: kmaent1 at gmail.com (Karl Martin Adam)
Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2015 19:49:44 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Analyzing Qualitative Data with Software
Message-ID: <55061ac5.c2056b0a.5371.fffff110@mx.google.com>

Hi Cindy, have you thought about asking this question to the 
blind social science list <social-sciences-list at nfbnet.org> or 
the blind academics list <blindacademics at mailman.rice.edu>?  I 
suspect people on either of those would be better informed.

Best,
Karl

 ----- Original Message -----
From: Cindy Bennett via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
To: Arielle Silverman <arielle71 at gmail.com
Date sent: Sun, 15 Mar 2015 16:10:31 -0700
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Analyzing Qualitative Data with Software

Hi Arielle,

Thanks for that.

In my experience of analyzing qualitative data, we have a code 
book
that is numbered. High level codes are labeled with numbers such 
as 1,
2, 3, etc. Codes within those categories are labeled 1.1, 1.2, 
1.3,
etc. I was thinking of assigning an Excel sheet to each high 
level
code and assigning a few columns to each lower level code so i 
can
number the occurrences, list the speaker, and the quote, and 
other
notes about the code assignment. This will require considerable 
copy
and pasting however.

I could probably manage this if I was the only one coding, but 
the
software really comes in handy when two or more people are 
examining
the data. The software can quickly give data about percentages of
agreement and other data about which codes were used most often 
much
more quickly than i could compute in Excel.

The reason I asked about accessibility before exploring myself is 
that
the programs typically work by you uploading files onto the 
website.
Each coder then goes through and marks up the text. So I am a bit
nervous that some of the programs may not be accessible since 
they
will be converting text from a file into some format that can be
marked up by proprietary software. Anyway, I have received a few
suggestions for free software which I can try. But if anyone has
experience using any qualitative coding with a program, I would 
still
love to hear about your experiences.

Thanks,

Cindy

On 3/12/15, Arielle Silverman <arielle71 at gmail.com> wrote:
 Hi Cindy,
 I have little experience with qualitative data and have never 
used
 qualitative software. However, I recently prepared a qualitative
 summary of some focus group data by hand, and it was a very 
manageable
 task. My colleague coded the same data using software and our 
reports
 were quite similar. So I'm not convinced that qualitative 
software is
 actually required, and if it carries accessibility hassles, then
 coding by hand might end up being easier. Basically coding just
 involves creating categories based on common themes you observe 
in the
 transcript and then going through and assigning each participant
 comment to one of the categories you create. I think the 
software may
 help visually organize the data, but I'm not sure how much 
benefit you
 would actually get from using software, unless you need to use 
it for
 a qualitative software class. Others with mor qualitative 
experience
 thanI might be able to comment further.
 Best Arielle

 On 3/12/15, Cindy Bennett via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
 Hi,

 Has anyone ever used a software to assist in analyzing their
 qualitative data? If so, I would love to hear from you before 
trying a
 bunch of options that may or may not be accessible.

 Thanks!

 --
 Cindy Bennett
 1st Year Ph.D. Student, University of Washington
 Human Centered Design and Engineering

 Treasurer of the National Federation of the Blind of Washington
 an Affiliate of the National Federation of the Blind

 clb5590 at gmail.com

 _______________________________________________
 nabs-l mailing list
 nabs-l at nfbnet.org
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--
Cindy Bennett
1st Year Ph.D. Student, University of Washington
Human Centered Design and Engineering

Treasurer of the National Federation of the Blind of Washington
an Affiliate of the National Federation of the Blind

clb5590 at gmail.com

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From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com  Mon Mar 16 12:36:59 2015
From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2015 08:36:59 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Powerpoint 2013 and other MS office 2013 programs
Message-ID: <CAFja7FbsBu0HMvkWsfc=gjkAG1mRMa1bq1NMNcps2tNe4b6BLg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all,

I recently had my computer re-imaged and my university's IT dept takes
care of installing the university's license of MS office for you if
they re-image your computer.  I'm having some difficulty with the 2013
version of the software, mainly with powerpoint.  When I open a ppt
file I can't read anything on the slides.  According to my teacher the
slides do move when I use the down and up arrows, but when tabbing I
can't access the written information at all.  This is a problem
because I usually pull up the powerpoint which is shown on a screen in
one of my classes to follow along, and sometimes the prof includes
questions we're supposed to answer on it.

Also, I was able to turn off protected mode, or compatability mode, or
whatever in MS office 2010.  I can't seem to find how to do this in MS
2013.  Has anyone done this successfully?  I'd prefer not to keep
copying and pasting things I download into new documents just so I can
work with them.

Thanks,

-- 
Kaiti


From Mister.Alexander.Scott.Kaiser at comcast.net  Mon Mar 16 16:24:31 2015
From: Mister.Alexander.Scott.Kaiser at comcast.net (Mr. Alexander Scott Kaiser)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2015 12:24:31 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Travel companion needed and male room mate needed for NFB
	National Convention
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHXvog14b7pKsVRTONmXpPrCgAAAEAAAAIotzn7ApYZBhekIsZV/jkgBAAAAAA==@comcast.net>

Seeking someone to travel with and Seeking male roommate for the NFB
national Convention in Orlando:

Hello this is Mr. Alexander Scott Kaiser. I am looking for  someone to
travel with from the Atlantic City International Airport at the southern New
Jersey shore in Pomona to the Orlando International Airport and the rosen
Center Hotel , and a male roommate for hotel stay for attending the National
Convention this summer in Orlando. The dates I am looking to reserve are
Sunday, July 5, 2015 through Friday, July 10, 2015. For more details contact
Mr. Alexander Scott Kaiser by email, home phone and cell phone at

Home phone number 1.732.202.6795

Cell phone number 1.848.205.0208

Email address: Mister.Alexander.Scott.Kaiser at comcast.net
<mailto:Mister.Alexander.Scott.Kaiser at comcast.net> . Please write back as
immediately as possible if someone can fly out to New Jersey, I will be
paying air fare, and room and board for the companion and roommate. Please
contact me off list as you wish.

Sincerely,

Mr. Alexander Scott Kaiser


From dandrews at visi.com  Mon Mar 16 21:24:47 2015
From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2015 16:24:47 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Looking for Complex Websites with Calendar Pickers
Message-ID: <auto-000018639056@mailfront2.g2host.com>

I was contacted by someone from the Department of Natural Resources, 
DNR, here in Minnesota.  They are working on a complex reservations 
site, and are looking for examples of good and bad.  If you can help, 
please write Jed directly at:

jed.becher at state.mn.us

Dave


From: Becher, Jed (MNIT)
Sent: Monday, March 16, 2015 12:00 PM
To: Andrews, David B (DEED)
Cc: Wyant, Jay (MNIT)
Subject: Web site question



David,



DNR is still working with our state park reservation vendor to make 
their site accessible.  They are very slow to grasp it all.  I wanted 
to refer them to some sites that perhaps you have used that you have 
found easy to use. I was going to look at Southwest airlines, Jet 
Blue and Target since they were all sued recently and imagine they 
have cleaned up their act.



The vendor made it sound like the feds are still dragging their feet 
on making all their sites accessible but I haven't had time to 
follow-up to see if they appear to have issues.



The vendor is still struggling with the calendaring function where 
people pick the dates they want to stay at a park and we typically 
show them a large grid of dates that match their choices. It's a 
little different than choosing a hotel room or airline seat as each 
campsite is a little different in its proximity to this, that or the 
other thing and the view it may have.



Are there airline sites or hotel / travel sites where the calendar 
selection piece has worked particularly well for you?



Thank you.



Jed Becher

From promotion-technology at nfbnet.org  Mon Mar 16 21:36:15 2015
From: promotion-technology at nfbnet.org (Jeanine Kay Lineback via Promotion-technology)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2015 16:36:15 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Job description for Javascript developer we are looking for
Message-ID: <auto-000018640597@mailfront2.g2host.com>

Hello Federationists.
Attached is the official job description for a 
web developer. Deque Systems would very much like 
to hire a screen reader user to fill this
position. Relocation expenses will be considered for the right candidate.
Please contact me if you know of anyone that would be interested.
Please share this job announcement with your 
other social networks and list serves.

Kind regards,
Jeanine Kay Lineback
Digital Accessibility SME | Deque Systems Inc.
President
National Federation of the Blind of Texas Austin Chapter
(512) 919-0430
Keep up with NFB Austin on Facebook
Follow NFB Austin on Twitter @nfbaustin

-----Original Message-----
From: Keith A Rhodes [mailto:keith.rhodes at deque.com]
Sent: Monday, February 16, 2015 2:03 PM
To: Jeanine Lineback; Dian Fay
Subject: Job description for Javascript developer we are looking for

I’ve attached a job description for a 
Javascript developer we are looking for. This is 
a mid- to senior level position as we are casting a wide net for people.

Thanks
Keith



_______________________________________________
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From gpaikens at gmail.com  Tue Mar 17 02:00:56 2015
From: gpaikens at gmail.com (Greg Aikens)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2015 22:00:56 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: [Blindmath] Visually Impaired Students Needed for
	Research Study
References: <010201d05cf5$76797a80$636c6f80$@mega-data.com>
Message-ID: <6FDF3AFE-77EA-4B28-ADB0-2F2AF1714CBB@gmail.com>

I thought some students on this list might be interested in participating.


> Begin forwarded message:
> 
> To: <blindmath at nfbnet.org>
> Date: March 12, 2015 at 2:50:46 PM EDT
> Subject: [Blindmath] Visually Impaired Students Needed for Research Study
> From: "P. McDermott-Wells via Blindmath" <blindmath at nfbnet.org>
> Reply-To: "P. McDermott-Wells" <pmw at mega-data.com>, Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics <blindmath at nfbnet.org>
> 
> What is the study about? 
> If you are a visually impaired student who knows Nemeth Braille, you are
> invited to participate in a research study. A computer software program is
> being developed that will provide tools to assist visually impaired students
> in doing mathematics. This program will provide a Nemeth Braille editor and
> a real-time chat feature.  It will translate Nemeth Braille to MathML, which
> can be inserted into a Microsoft Word document. The chat feature will allow
> you to communicate real-time with a math instructor, by translating Nemeth
> Braille to MathML and back as you communicate. The goal of this study is to
> determine if this program will reduce the time required for a visually
> impaired student to create math documents representing typical math
> assignments encountered in high school or entry-level college mathematics
> courses.
> 
> When and where will this study occur?
> We will schedule a test session with you at your convenience. You can
> participate from home, and do not need to travel to the researcher's
> location.
> 
> Why are you asking me?
> You have been invited because you have been identified as a visually
> impaired university or high-school student who knows Nemeth Braille.
> 
> What will I be doing if I agree to be in the study?
> You will be given two sets of math problems typical of coursework found in a
> high school math course or an entry-level college math course, and asked to
> work through those problems.  For the first set, you will use your current
> methods to work the problems and produce results in a form that could be
> submitted to a sighted instructor.
> 
> You will need to tell us what tools and methods you normally do your math
> homework, and you will need to measure the time it takes you to complete the
> first set of problems. 
> 
> For the second set, you will be asked to use a computer program that allows
> you to enter and edit Nemeth Braille math expressions and produce a document
> with your work in a form that could be submitted to a sighted instructor.
> You will have the opportunity to utilize a real-time chat communication
> feature that will give you access to a math instructor who will be able to
> help you solve the math problems as needed.
> 
> You will need to spend some time practicing with the program to become
> comfortable in its use prior to the study session.  We estimate that you
> will need a minimum of 1 hour of use to become comfortable with its use. You
> will spend 60-90 minutes during the actual research study session using this
> program.  
> 
> We are NOT testing your math abilities!  We are testing to determine if this
> program will make it easier for you to produce your math work and/or to get
> instructor help when you need it. 
> 
> Is there any audio or video recording?
> This research project will include audio and/or video recording of your
> actions using the computer program. Your computer screen is what will be
> video-recorded, and your voice will be audio-recorded during the test
> session.  These audio and video recordings will be available to be heard
> only by the research team. 
> 
> Will I get paid for being in the study?  Will it cost me anything?
> There are no costs to you and there will be no payments made for
> participating in this study. You will, however, have an opportunity to
> obtain a copy of the final version of the software program for your use when
> it is released, at no charge to you.
> 
> You will have to install on your computer the computer program we provide,
> and also install the free personal version of the TeamViewer software
> program (http://www.teamviewer.com/en/index.aspx) that will allow the
> researcher to watch your actions while using the program. You will also need
> to have a working microphone on your computer, or be able to use a cellphone
> during the study session.
> I have some questions.
> 
> If you would like to know more about this study, please contact the
> researcher (contact information is at the end of this document).
> 
> Researcher: Patricia McDermott-Wells, PhD student at Nova Southeastern
> University
> Telephone: 561-798-3940
> Email: pmcdermo at nova.edu 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Blindmath mailing list
> Blindmath at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindmath_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for Blindmath:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindmath_nfbnet.org/gpaikens%40gmail.com
> BlindMath Gems can be found at <http://www.blindscience.org/blindmath-gems-home>


From tonysohl at samobile.net  Tue Mar 17 02:38:55 2015
From: tonysohl at samobile.net (Tony Sohl)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2015 22:38:55 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Items for sale
Message-ID: <7c322f55.1de6.4363.a02e.6a4f76d8ab6c@samobile.net>

Hi this is tony Sohl and I have the following items for sale and they 
were given to me.

1. Braille Note M-power with catty keyboard, 32 refreshable Braille 
display and Keysoft version 8.0 never been  used still in it's original 
shipping box with all manuals and accessories.

2. JAWS for Windows Professional version 16 still in it's original box 
with all braill labels including the serial number and registration Numbers.

JAWS for windows re tales for around $800 and the m-power note taker 
older model retails for about $500 or so.

I'm asking $500 for the M-power and $800 for jaws. If anyone's 
Interested , then you can email me at: tonysohl at samobile.net



From filerime at gmail.com  Tue Mar 17 04:33:37 2015
From: filerime at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?RWxpZiBFbWlyIMOWa3PDvHo=?=)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2015 00:33:37 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Online citation manager questions
In-Reply-To: <CA+6VNgPRBfZF3AKpND8_yfmyyS=E-2EcucWPjxz+hJkhGmtTKg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <79E0714D132BCB43A4B18D328D9A445B862D15@UBOX2.unr.edu>
	<CAAJqG9igRA3-D+OX9TkffD4OS1zLCjodJoVdo3M5J4QDQyngcg@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+6VNgPRBfZF3AKpND8_yfmyyS=E-2EcucWPjxz+hJkhGmtTKg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMtP_9cjEsuV9o2N-dkysoH1tGRs4n-Umy-1Vo=RXtFWG1X2tg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Minh,
I'm trying to use refworks, and I need to learn it ASAP.
Can you give me some quick tips about it please.
Which browser is best for it?
I can not open a new folder. I click on new folder but nothing happens.
I can't read announcements.
If you know can you also write about sharing folders please?
If you have some time and share some info, it will help me a lot
thanks in advance
Elif


2015-01-25 0:29 GMT-05:00, Katie Wang via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>:
> Hi Michael,
>
> EndNote is a popular citation manager, and as it happens I'm actually
> in the process of learning to work with it. From what I understand,
> there is a basic web version (which is free and probably what you are
> referring to) and a full-feature desktop version. I have been working
> with the desktop version since my university library has a purchased
> license - The interface is a bit cumbersome to use and I haven't
> figured out all the kinks yet, but it does seem pretty accessible. I
> can't speak to the web version of the software but would think that it
> should be worth a
> try. Just be prepared - There is a bit of a learning curve... If you
> see research in your future then it is definitely a handy tool to
> have, but if you are just writing a paper for class here and there
> then it might be more efficient to manage your references manually.
> Good luck!
>
> Katie
>
> On 1/24/15, minh ha via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> Hi Michael,
>>
>> I've never heard of the citation manager that you mentioned, but my
>> university uses refworks for our manager and I like it a lot. It's a
>> little cumbersome to use at times, but it does come in handy when
>> writing papers.
>>
>> Minh
>>
>> On 1/24/15, Michael D Ausbun via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>> Hello Fellow Nabsters:
>>> 	I am currently taking an online course, which is the introduction to
>>> the
>>> introduction to my undergraduate Honors thesis. One of the course
>>> requirements is that we ought to use a citation manager. The one that
>>> they
>>> recommend for use is called N-Note web. I informed the professor to the
>>> unfortunate situation, which often arises, that being the possibility
>>> that
>>> the manager may be inaccessible. She informed me that, if this were the
>>> case, then she would like to locate the most useful citation manager for
>>> someone with a visual disability.
>>> 	Thus, my question. First, have any of you used an online citation
>>> manager
>>> before? Have you used N-note before? If so, how was it in regards to
>>> accessibility? If you have used another one or multiple ones, which have
>>> you
>>> found to be the best.
>>> Thank you all in advance!
>>> Respectfully,
>>> Michael Ausbun
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/minh.ha927%40gmail.com
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> "All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty
>> recesses of their minds, wake in the day to find that it was vanity:
>> but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act on
>> their dreams with open eyes, to make them possible." T. E. Lawrence
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmail.com
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/filerime%40gmail.com
>


From tactiletaylor at gmail.com  Tue Mar 17 17:41:35 2015
From: tactiletaylor at gmail.com (Taylor Durrett)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2015 12:41:35 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Orion Talking Graphing Calculator
In-Reply-To: <DBA5C22A-07D3-40EE-9138-D3DC65E6EF98@gmail.com>
References: <DBA5C22A-07D3-40EE-9138-D3DC65E6EF98@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <D1F997FE-B339-48E1-BCCD-4F9DB5366E08@gmail.com>

Hello all,
I wanted to say thank you to those of you who gave me suggestions on troubleshooting with my Orion TI-84 Plus calculator. I ended up having to ship it off because I just could not figure out the problem, and I tried several different tactics. I got a replacement, and it does everything it's supposed to do, even when off the plug. I think the first calculator I got just had a bad internal battery.
Thank you for your help. I just thought I'd let you all know that I got the problem solved.
Best,
Taylor Durrett Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 10, 2015, at 7:53 PM, Taylor Durrett <tactiletaylor at gmail.com> wrote:

> Greetings all,
> My name is Taylor Durrett, and I am new to this list. I am writing to ask whether anyone on here is familiar with the Orion Talking Graphing Calculator TI-84 Plus and how to use it. I just received one yesterday and I'm trying to figure out how to work it.
> When I plug up the calculator and turn it on, it talks and does everything that it is supposed to do, but then when I unplug it to bring it to another room, it doesn't do anything at all (it doesn't talk and the screen just goes blank. Do you have any suggestions as to what I could do to fix it besides shipping it off? I bought it from APH. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
> Warm regards,
> Taylor Durrett
> 
> Sent from my iPhone


From helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com  Tue Mar 17 20:11:27 2015
From: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com (Helga Schreiber)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2015 16:11:27 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: Turbo Vote
References: <EAC4E61DFC1F6C46A614930FFD60B88A0268EAD5D31D@MB2.pbcc.edu>
Message-ID: <071DB1A9-5A58-4551-8E52-1E57E73659DA@gmail.com>

Hi everyone! How are you all? I just wanted to inform you that below is a message from the Vice President of my college,  where he inform us of an app that we can download called TurboVote, which is regarding voting elections and helping us with that matter! I really don't know if it is accessible with VoiceOver, or with the Android devices. And i don't know either if you guys have her of it or not. if you have, let all of us know since i think this  app sounds cool! I have not try it yet, but if you want to try it you are welcome to do so. And I don't know either if it is free  or not. I just receive the email today! And i thought you will find it very interesting!Feel free to pass it to other mailing lists if you want  or social  media! if you want! Hope to hear from  you soon. Thanks so much and have a nice day. God bless! 



P.S. I think there is also a picture in the below message that i don't see since i'm totally blind! LOL! But if someone wants to describe it to me and to all of us! I will really appreciate it a lot! Thanks again!  

Helga Schreiber

Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter.
Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of Blind Students.
Member of the International Networkers Team (INT).
Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research.
Phone:  (561) 706-5950 
Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com 
Skype: helga.schreiber26 
4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx 
INT Website: http://int4life.com/ 

"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16 
Sent from my iPhone 

Begin forwarded message:

> From: "Barbatis, Peter R" <barbatip at palmbeachstate.edu>
> Date: March 17, 2015 at 11:40:29 AM EDT
> To: Undisclosed recipients:;
> Subject: Turbo Vote
> Reply-To: "Iosia-Sizemore, Mareta" <iosiasm at palmbeachstate.edu>
> 
> Dear Student:
> 
> Join TurboVote today! 
> TurboVote is an application that makes voting easy.
> 
> Once registered for the service, TurboVote keeps track of both local and national elections. Further, if you need to update your voter registration information or request an absentee ballot, TurboVote will assist you in securing all required forms.
> 
> Click the VOTE button now to take advantage of this amazing service.
> 
>  
> 
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
> Please note: Due to Florida’s broad open records law, most written communication to or from College employees is public record, available to the public and the media upon request. Therefore, this e-mail communication may be subject to public disclosure.

From jhud7789 at outlook.com  Tue Mar 17 20:36:51 2015
From: jhud7789 at outlook.com (Joseph Hudson)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2015 15:36:51 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: Turbo Vote
In-Reply-To: <071DB1A9-5A58-4551-8E52-1E57E73659DA@gmail.com>
References: <EAC4E61DFC1F6C46A614930FFD60B88A0268EAD5D31D@MB2.pbcc.edu>
	<071DB1A9-5A58-4551-8E52-1E57E73659DA@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BLU437-SMTP72076740DAEB3322BB1B12CE030@phx.gbl>

Hi Helga, there was no picture that I can tell. And the way that you will be want to tell if it's free or not, is if it hasn't get button next to it. It might be a Useful idea, to contact the college and see if you can get in touch with the developer of the app and then he will be able to give you a promo code to tested for accessibility and a maybe somebody would be willing to tested for accessibility or maybe that might be something that you might be interesting doing for the college. Help my help information was helpful to you today.
Joseph Hudson
I device support
Email
jhud7789 at gmail.com <mailto:jhud7789 at gmail.com>
Face time and iMessage
jhud7789 at yahoo.com <mailto:jhud7789 at yahoo.com>
Office phone
641-715-3900 x34315
Emergency line
641-715-3900 x5887652
Skype
joseph.hudson89

> On Mar 17, 2015, at 3:11 PM, Helga Schreiber via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi everyone! How are you all? I just wanted to inform you that below is a message from the Vice President of my college,  where he inform us of an app that we can download called TurboVote, which is regarding voting elections and helping us with that matter! I really don't know if it is accessible with VoiceOver, or with the Android devices. And i don't know either if you guys have her of it or not. if you have, let all of us know since i think this  app sounds cool! I have not try it yet, but if you want to try it you are welcome to do so. And I don't know either if it is free  or not. I just receive the email today! And i thought you will find it very interesting!Feel free to pass it to other mailing lists if you want  or social  media! if you want! Hope to hear from  you soon. Thanks so much and have a nice day. God bless! 
> 
> 
> 
> P.S. I think there is also a picture in the below message that i don't see since i'm totally blind! LOL! But if someone wants to describe it to me and to all of us! I will really appreciate it a lot! Thanks again!  
> 
> Helga Schreiber
> 
> Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter.
> Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of Blind Students.
> Member of the International Networkers Team (INT).
> Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research.
> Phone:  (561) 706-5950 
> Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com 
> Skype: helga.schreiber26 
> 4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx 
> INT Website: http://int4life.com/ 
> 
> "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16 
> Sent from my iPhone 
> 
> Begin forwarded message:
> 
>> From: "Barbatis, Peter R" <barbatip at palmbeachstate.edu>
>> Date: March 17, 2015 at 11:40:29 AM EDT
>> To: Undisclosed recipients:;
>> Subject: Turbo Vote
>> Reply-To: "Iosia-Sizemore, Mareta" <iosiasm at palmbeachstate.edu>
>> 
>> Dear Student:
>> 
>> Join TurboVote today! 
>> TurboVote is an application that makes voting easy.
>> 
>> Once registered for the service, TurboVote keeps track of both local and national elections. Further, if you need to update your voter registration information or request an absentee ballot, TurboVote will assist you in securing all required forms.
>> 
>> Click the VOTE button now to take advantage of this amazing service.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Please note: Due to Florida’s broad open records law, most written communication to or from College employees is public record, available to the public and the media upon request. Therefore, this e-mail communication may be subject to public disclosure.
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jhud7789%40outlook.com


From ligne14 at verizon.net  Tue Mar 17 20:51:01 2015
From: ligne14 at verizon.net (Sami Osborne)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2015 16:51:01 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Blackboard accessibility issues
Message-ID: <0NLD0090SJ9FEF80@vms173023.mailsrvcs.net>

Hi all,

My friend Jose is in a program that will help him prepare for 
college.  He is taking an English class in this program, and his 
professor is using Blackboard for the class assignments.  Only, 
Jose seems to have accessibily issues with Blackboard.  I'm not 
sure exactly what's wrong, but I send him this email as well so 
that he can directly see your replies and possibly give more 
details about exactly what's wrong.
Anyway, this situation is really bad for him because he said that 
his professors won't help him with Blackboard and apparently told 
him that if he didn't get the issues resolved, he would fail the 
class.  He is therefore thinking about dropping out of this 
program, but I don't think he really wants to because as I just 
mentioned, it helps you get ready for college, particularly in 
academics.

 I'm also asking you guys because Jose is totally blind, and I 
think some of you have mentioned here before that you've had no 
problems with Blackboard accessibility.

I hope that you guys can really help Jose in getting his sitUn 
resolved, and that he might even want to subscribe to this list.

By the way, if you need more information, just reply to this 
email, since as I said I also sent this to Jose as well.

Looking forward to hereearing from you, and by the wan, happy St.  
Patricks day!

    Thank you very much,

Sami and Jose.


From helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com  Tue Mar 17 21:12:45 2015
From: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com (Helga Schreiber)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2015 17:12:45 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Blackboard accessibility issues
In-Reply-To: <0NLD0090SJ9FEF80@vms173023.mailsrvcs.net>
References: <0NLD0090SJ9FEF80@vms173023.mailsrvcs.net>
Message-ID: <C728D592-2BE6-4BC4-A8DC-8C67B21C113F@gmail.com>

Hi Sami. I can try to help your friend Jose with his Blackboard situation. I actually know how to do some things of blackboard, but with the attachments i have some difficulty, but I can find out how to do it! I'm currently taking an online class in my college! And as you know, I also speak spanish, if he wants to talk to me in Spanish! If he has skype he can contact me! my contact info is below! In fact, where does he live? Just owndering. And what is hsi issues with Blackboard? Just wondering as well! hope to hear form you soon! Thansk andGod bless!

Helga Schreiber

Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter.
Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of Blind Students.
Member of the International Networkers Team (INT).
Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research.
Phone:  (561) 706-5950 
Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com 
Skype: helga.schreiber26 
4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx 
INT Website: http://int4life.com/ 

"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16 
Sent from my iPhone 

> On Mar 17, 2015, at 4:51 PM, Sami Osborne via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> My friend Jose is in a program that will help him prepare for college.  He is taking an English class in this program, and his professor is using Blackboard for the class assignments.  Only, Jose seems to have accessibily issues with Blackboard.  I'm not sure exactly what's wrong, but I send him this email as well so that he can directly see your replies and possibly give more details about exactly what's wrong.
> Anyway, this situation is really bad for him because he said that his professors won't help him with Blackboard and apparently told him that if he didn't get the issues resolved, he would fail the class.  He is therefore thinking about dropping out of this program, but I don't think he really wants to because as I just mentioned, it helps you get ready for college, particularly in academics.
> 
> I'm also asking you guys because Jose is totally blind, and I think some of you have mentioned here before that you've had no problems with Blackboard accessibility.
> 
> I hope that you guys can really help Jose in getting his sitUn resolved, and that he might even want to subscribe to this list.
> 
> By the way, if you need more information, just reply to this email, since as I said I also sent this to Jose as well.
> 
> Looking forward to hereearing from you, and by the wan, happy St.  Patricks day!
> 
>   Thank you very much,
> 
> Sami and Jose.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/helga.schreiber26%40gmail.com

From jsoro620 at gmail.com  Tue Mar 17 21:45:56 2015
From: jsoro620 at gmail.com (Joe)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2015 17:45:56 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Powerpoint 2013 and other MS office 2013 programs
In-Reply-To: <CAFja7FbsBu0HMvkWsfc=gjkAG1mRMa1bq1NMNcps2tNe4b6BLg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAFja7FbsBu0HMvkWsfc=gjkAG1mRMa1bq1NMNcps2tNe4b6BLg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <008f01d060fb$d1ea85d0$75bf9170$@gmail.com>

Use F5 to switch to Slideshow view. See if that helps to read individual
slides.

--
Musings of a Work in Progress:
www.JoeOrozco.com/

Twitter: @ScribblingJoe


-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton
via nabs-l
Sent: Monday, March 16, 2015 8:37 AM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: [nabs-l] Powerpoint 2013 and other MS office 2013 programs

Hi all,

I recently had my computer re-imaged and my university's IT dept takes care
of installing the university's license of MS office for you if they re-image
your computer.  I'm having some difficulty with the 2013 version of the
software, mainly with powerpoint.  When I open a ppt file I can't read
anything on the slides.  According to my teacher the slides do move when I
use the down and up arrows, but when tabbing I can't access the written
information at all.  This is a problem because I usually pull up the
powerpoint which is shown on a screen in one of my classes to follow along,
and sometimes the prof includes questions we're supposed to answer on it.

Also, I was able to turn off protected mode, or compatability mode, or
whatever in MS office 2010.  I can't seem to find how to do this in MS 2013.
Has anyone done this successfully?  I'd prefer not to keep copying and
pasting things I download into new documents just so I can work with them.

Thanks,

--
Kaiti

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com



From trillian551 at gmail.com  Tue Mar 17 21:56:14 2015
From: trillian551 at gmail.com (Mary Fernandez)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2015 16:56:14 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Powerpoint 2013 and other MS office 2013 programs
In-Reply-To: <008f01d060fb$d1ea85d0$75bf9170$@gmail.com>
References: <CAFja7FbsBu0HMvkWsfc=gjkAG1mRMa1bq1NMNcps2tNe4b6BLg@mail.gmail.com>
	<008f01d060fb$d1ea85d0$75bf9170$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <97A9D1F4-67B0-4681-86B8-EC4EB11A58AA@gmail.com>

Hi, in order to turn off protection mode, press F6 until it gives you the option to enable editing. You can tap through  that dialogue. Also, something that I've done that works really effectively for me, is to go into the ribbons arrow  to slideshow and hit start slideshow. That way I can see the slides individually and tab through them and arrow and read them as normal. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 17, 2015, at 4:45 PM, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Use F5 to switch to Slideshow view. See if that helps to read individual
> slides.
> 
> --
> Musings of a Work in Progress:
> www.JoeOrozco.com/
> 
> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton
> via nabs-l
> Sent: Monday, March 16, 2015 8:37 AM
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: [nabs-l] Powerpoint 2013 and other MS office 2013 programs
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> I recently had my computer re-imaged and my university's IT dept takes care
> of installing the university's license of MS office for you if they re-image
> your computer.  I'm having some difficulty with the 2013 version of the
> software, mainly with powerpoint.  When I open a ppt file I can't read
> anything on the slides.  According to my teacher the slides do move when I
> use the down and up arrows, but when tabbing I can't access the written
> information at all.  This is a problem because I usually pull up the
> powerpoint which is shown on a screen in one of my classes to follow along,
> and sometimes the prof includes questions we're supposed to answer on it.
> 
> Also, I was able to turn off protected mode, or compatability mode, or
> whatever in MS office 2010.  I can't seem to find how to do this in MS 2013.
> Has anyone done this successfully?  I'd prefer not to keep copying and
> pasting things I download into new documents just so I can work with them.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> --
> Kaiti
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/trillian551%40gmail.com


From trillian551 at gmail.com  Tue Mar 17 21:56:14 2015
From: trillian551 at gmail.com (Mary Fernandez)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2015 16:56:14 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Powerpoint 2013 and other MS office 2013 programs
In-Reply-To: <008f01d060fb$d1ea85d0$75bf9170$@gmail.com>
References: <CAFja7FbsBu0HMvkWsfc=gjkAG1mRMa1bq1NMNcps2tNe4b6BLg@mail.gmail.com>
	<008f01d060fb$d1ea85d0$75bf9170$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <97A9D1F4-67B0-4681-86B8-EC4EB11A58AA@gmail.com>

Hi, in order to turn off protection mode, press F6 until it gives you the option to enable editing. You can tap through  that dialogue. Also, something that I've done that works really effectively for me, is to go into the ribbons arrow  to slideshow and hit start slideshow. That way I can see the slides individually and tab through them and arrow and read them as normal. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 17, 2015, at 4:45 PM, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Use F5 to switch to Slideshow view. See if that helps to read individual
> slides.
> 
> --
> Musings of a Work in Progress:
> www.JoeOrozco.com/
> 
> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton
> via nabs-l
> Sent: Monday, March 16, 2015 8:37 AM
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: [nabs-l] Powerpoint 2013 and other MS office 2013 programs
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> I recently had my computer re-imaged and my university's IT dept takes care
> of installing the university's license of MS office for you if they re-image
> your computer.  I'm having some difficulty with the 2013 version of the
> software, mainly with powerpoint.  When I open a ppt file I can't read
> anything on the slides.  According to my teacher the slides do move when I
> use the down and up arrows, but when tabbing I can't access the written
> information at all.  This is a problem because I usually pull up the
> powerpoint which is shown on a screen in one of my classes to follow along,
> and sometimes the prof includes questions we're supposed to answer on it.
> 
> Also, I was able to turn off protected mode, or compatability mode, or
> whatever in MS office 2010.  I can't seem to find how to do this in MS 2013.
> Has anyone done this successfully?  I'd prefer not to keep copying and
> pasting things I download into new documents just so I can work with them.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> --
> Kaiti
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/trillian551%40gmail.com


From molly.faerber at gmail.com  Wed Mar 18 02:06:57 2015
From: molly.faerber at gmail.com (Molly Faerber)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2015 22:06:57 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] volunteer at BELL Rhode Island!
Message-ID: <CAEgAj=tLz=4_kmyQoyr-LbDb-Wj=zGrZ-UEuL8rBRw5y64R4Dw@mail.gmail.com>

Dear students--we are looking for blind mentors for Rhode Island's very
first BELL program. Our program is located in Providence, which is easily
accessible by public transportation from Boston as well as many other
locations. If you live in the area or have somewhere to stay in RI, we
would love to have you! Check out our flyer below, and please feel free to
contact me with questions.

Thanks and take care,

Molly




*VOLUNTEER TO WORK WITH CHILDREN WHO ARE BLIND OR VISUALLY IMPAIRED*



*Weekdays, July 27th – August 7th*

*Providence, RI*





*About the NFB BELL Program*

*(Braille Enrichment for Literacy and Learning)*



We are a 2-week day program that provides braille instruction to blind and
low vision children ages 5-13.





*Our focus is on fostering independence, confidence, and a positive, can-do
attitude *

*toward blindness.*



In addition to braille lessons from our licensed TVI, we also focus on
independent living skills, cane travel, nonvisual techniques, and of
course, fun activities like games, adaptive sports, arts and crafts, and
several fieldtrips over the course of our program.





*Want to volunteer for part of our program?*



Email us at nfbbellri at gmail.com for a volunteer application. All volunteers
are required to undergo a background check and participate in a mandatory
orientation.



*Questions?*

Email us at nfbbellri at gmail.com or call (401) 477-9079.

From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com  Wed Mar 18 02:46:13 2015
From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2015 22:46:13 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Powerpoint 2013 and other MS office 2013 programs
In-Reply-To: <97A9D1F4-67B0-4681-86B8-EC4EB11A58AA@gmail.com>
References: <CAFja7FbsBu0HMvkWsfc=gjkAG1mRMa1bq1NMNcps2tNe4b6BLg@mail.gmail.com>
	<008f01d060fb$d1ea85d0$75bf9170$@gmail.com>
	<97A9D1F4-67B0-4681-86B8-EC4EB11A58AA@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAFja7FavObL=Bisi=-qdih3qVXF4_mo5pE07S7QVO4rBgG6_GA@mail.gmail.com>

Thank you both for the tips.  I'll try them out when I'm back in that
class tomorrow morning!  :)

On 3/17/15, Mary Fernandez via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Hi, in order to turn off protection mode, press F6 until it gives you the
> option to enable editing. You can tap through  that dialogue. Also,
> something that I've done that works really effectively for me, is to go into
> the ribbons arrow  to slideshow and hit start slideshow. That way I can see
> the slides individually and tab through them and arrow and read them as
> normal.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Mar 17, 2015, at 4:45 PM, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>
>> Use F5 to switch to Slideshow view. See if that helps to read individual
>> slides.
>>
>> --
>> Musings of a Work in Progress:
>> www.JoeOrozco.com/
>>
>> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti
>> Shelton
>> via nabs-l
>> Sent: Monday, March 16, 2015 8:37 AM
>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>> Subject: [nabs-l] Powerpoint 2013 and other MS office 2013 programs
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I recently had my computer re-imaged and my university's IT dept takes
>> care
>> of installing the university's license of MS office for you if they
>> re-image
>> your computer.  I'm having some difficulty with the 2013 version of the
>> software, mainly with powerpoint.  When I open a ppt file I can't read
>> anything on the slides.  According to my teacher the slides do move when
>> I
>> use the down and up arrows, but when tabbing I can't access the written
>> information at all.  This is a problem because I usually pull up the
>> powerpoint which is shown on a screen in one of my classes to follow
>> along,
>> and sometimes the prof includes questions we're supposed to answer on it.
>>
>> Also, I was able to turn off protected mode, or compatability mode, or
>> whatever in MS office 2010.  I can't seem to find how to do this in MS
>> 2013.
>> Has anyone done this successfully?  I'd prefer not to keep copying and
>> pasting things I download into new documents just so I can work with
>> them.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> --
>> Kaiti
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/trillian551%40gmail.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com
>


-- 
Kaiti


From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com  Wed Mar 18 02:55:54 2015
From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2015 22:55:54 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Online citation manager questions
In-Reply-To: <CAMtP_9cjEsuV9o2N-dkysoH1tGRs4n-Umy-1Vo=RXtFWG1X2tg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <79E0714D132BCB43A4B18D328D9A445B862D15@UBOX2.unr.edu>
	<CAAJqG9igRA3-D+OX9TkffD4OS1zLCjodJoVdo3M5J4QDQyngcg@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+6VNgPRBfZF3AKpND8_yfmyyS=E-2EcucWPjxz+hJkhGmtTKg@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMtP_9cjEsuV9o2N-dkysoH1tGRs4n-Umy-1Vo=RXtFWG1X2tg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAFja7Fa0_R=CnPk0qkuy62KSarfcq9=GhAQDT5x-PPiM1eJh0w@mail.gmail.com>

Perhaps this isn't the same thing because I've never heard of a
"citation manager" before, but in case I'm just not familiar with the
particular symantics I found Citation Machine a few days ago and loved
it.  I used it for an annotated bibliography in APA and found it
really helpful.  It's free and can be found by just googling "citation
machine."  The accessibility was not bad either.

Good luck, and I hope this is helpful.

On 3/17/15, Elif Emir Öksüz <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Hi Minh,
> I'm trying to use refworks, and I need to learn it ASAP.
> Can you give me some quick tips about it please.
> Which browser is best for it?
> I can not open a new folder. I click on new folder but nothing happens.
> I can't read announcements.
> If you know can you also write about sharing folders please?
> If you have some time and share some info, it will help me a lot
> thanks in advance
> Elif
>
>
> 2015-01-25 0:29 GMT-05:00, Katie Wang via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>:
>> Hi Michael,
>>
>> EndNote is a popular citation manager, and as it happens I'm actually
>> in the process of learning to work with it. From what I understand,
>> there is a basic web version (which is free and probably what you are
>> referring to) and a full-feature desktop version. I have been working
>> with the desktop version since my university library has a purchased
>> license - The interface is a bit cumbersome to use and I haven't
>> figured out all the kinks yet, but it does seem pretty accessible. I
>> can't speak to the web version of the software but would think that it
>> should be worth a
>> try. Just be prepared - There is a bit of a learning curve... If you
>> see research in your future then it is definitely a handy tool to
>> have, but if you are just writing a paper for class here and there
>> then it might be more efficient to manage your references manually.
>> Good luck!
>>
>> Katie
>>
>> On 1/24/15, minh ha via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>> Hi Michael,
>>>
>>> I've never heard of the citation manager that you mentioned, but my
>>> university uses refworks for our manager and I like it a lot. It's a
>>> little cumbersome to use at times, but it does come in handy when
>>> writing papers.
>>>
>>> Minh
>>>
>>> On 1/24/15, Michael D Ausbun via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>> Hello Fellow Nabsters:
>>>> 	I am currently taking an online course, which is the introduction to
>>>> the
>>>> introduction to my undergraduate Honors thesis. One of the course
>>>> requirements is that we ought to use a citation manager. The one that
>>>> they
>>>> recommend for use is called N-Note web. I informed the professor to the
>>>> unfortunate situation, which often arises, that being the possibility
>>>> that
>>>> the manager may be inaccessible. She informed me that, if this were the
>>>> case, then she would like to locate the most useful citation manager
>>>> for
>>>> someone with a visual disability.
>>>> 	Thus, my question. First, have any of you used an online citation
>>>> manager
>>>> before? Have you used N-note before? If so, how was it in regards to
>>>> accessibility? If you have used another one or multiple ones, which
>>>> have
>>>> you
>>>> found to be the best.
>>>> Thank you all in advance!
>>>> Respectfully,
>>>> Michael Ausbun
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/minh.ha927%40gmail.com
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> "All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty
>>> recesses of their minds, wake in the day to find that it was vanity:
>>> but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act on
>>> their dreams with open eyes, to make them possible." T. E. Lawrence
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bunnykatie6%40gmail.com
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/filerime%40gmail.com
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com
>


-- 
Kaiti


From herekittykat97 at gmail.com  Wed Mar 18 08:08:50 2015
From: herekittykat97 at gmail.com (Jewel)
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2015 04:08:50 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Powerpoint 2013 and other MS office 2013 programs
In-Reply-To: <008f01d060fb$d1ea85d0$75bf9170$@gmail.com>
References: <CAFja7FbsBu0HMvkWsfc=gjkAG1mRMa1bq1NMNcps2tNe4b6BLg@mail.gmail.com>
	<008f01d060fb$d1ea85d0$75bf9170$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <46341FF5-D988-45BB-B486-9A33893F03B0@gmail.com>

I always use all plus S and their arrow down and then I can choose from beginning or current slide.
Jewel

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 17, 2015, at 5:45 PM, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Use F5 to switch to Slideshow view. See if that helps to read individual
> slides.
> 
> --
> Musings of a Work in Progress:
> www.JoeOrozco.com/
> 
> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti Shelton
> via nabs-l
> Sent: Monday, March 16, 2015 8:37 AM
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: [nabs-l] Powerpoint 2013 and other MS office 2013 programs
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> I recently had my computer re-imaged and my university's IT dept takes care
> of installing the university's license of MS office for you if they re-image
> your computer.  I'm having some difficulty with the 2013 version of the
> software, mainly with powerpoint.  When I open a ppt file I can't read
> anything on the slides.  According to my teacher the slides do move when I
> use the down and up arrows, but when tabbing I can't access the written
> information at all.  This is a problem because I usually pull up the
> powerpoint which is shown on a screen in one of my classes to follow along,
> and sometimes the prof includes questions we're supposed to answer on it.
> 
> Also, I was able to turn off protected mode, or compatability mode, or
> whatever in MS office 2010.  I can't seem to find how to do this in MS 2013.
> Has anyone done this successfully?  I'd prefer not to keep copying and
> pasting things I download into new documents just so I can work with them.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> --
> Kaiti
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat97%40gmail.com


From herekittykat97 at gmail.com  Wed Mar 18 08:04:28 2015
From: herekittykat97 at gmail.com (Jewel)
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2015 04:04:28 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Blackboard accessibility issues
In-Reply-To: <0NLD0090SJ9FEF80@vms173023.mailsrvcs.net>
References: <0NLD0090SJ9FEF80@vms173023.mailsrvcs.net>
Message-ID: <4A272D29-1DE7-4619-B3CC-24C192ABCCF4@gmail.com>

Dear Samuel and Jose, 
My name is jewel. I have four years experience with Blackboard, and have used nearly all of the features. What seems to be the difficulty, Jose? I can help with anything from uploading files to using the discussion boards. 
If you would rather, you can call my cell at 919-802-1576.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 17, 2015, at 4:51 PM, Sami Osborne via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> My friend Jose is in a program that will help him prepare for college.  He is taking an English class in this program, and his professor is using Blackboard for the class assignments.  Only, Jose seems to have accessibily issues with Blackboard.  I'm not sure exactly what's wrong, but I send him this email as well so that he can directly see your replies and possibly give more details about exactly what's wrong.
> Anyway, this situation is really bad for him because he said that his professors won't help him with Blackboard and apparently told him that if he didn't get the issues resolved, he would fail the class.  He is therefore thinking about dropping out of this program, but I don't think he really wants to because as I just mentioned, it helps you get ready for college, particularly in academics.
> 
> I'm also asking you guys because Jose is totally blind, and I think some of you have mentioned here before that you've had no problems with Blackboard accessibility.
> 
> I hope that you guys can really help Jose in getting his sitUn resolved, and that he might even want to subscribe to this list.
> 
> By the way, if you need more information, just reply to this email, since as I said I also sent this to Jose as well.
> 
> Looking forward to hereearing from you, and by the wan, happy St.  Patricks day!
> 
>   Thank you very much,
> 
> Sami and Jose.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat97%40gmail.com


From gloria.graves at gmail.com  Wed Mar 18 12:36:52 2015
From: gloria.graves at gmail.com (Gloria Graves)
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2015 07:36:52 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Blackboard accessibility issues
In-Reply-To: <4A272D29-1DE7-4619-B3CC-24C192ABCCF4@gmail.com>
References: <0NLD0090SJ9FEF80@vms173023.mailsrvcs.net>
	<4A272D29-1DE7-4619-B3CC-24C192ABCCF4@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <395D686F-6695-4B21-8294-7DC1FEF1D76F@gmail.com>

Hi,
Would you mind just give me a step-by-step guide for using different sections of blackboard? If it's not too much work of course this way everyone can have an idea of what techniques you use thanks



> On Mar 18, 2015, at 3:04 AM, Jewel via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Dear Samuel and Jose, 
> My name is jewel. I have four years experience with Blackboard, and have used nearly all of the features. What seems to be the difficulty, Jose? I can help with anything from uploading files to using the discussion boards. 
> If you would rather, you can call my cell at 919-802-1576.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Mar 17, 2015, at 4:51 PM, Sami Osborne via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> My friend Jose is in a program that will help him prepare for college.  He is taking an English class in this program, and his professor is using Blackboard for the class assignments.  Only, Jose seems to have accessibily issues with Blackboard.  I'm not sure exactly what's wrong, but I send him this email as well so that he can directly see your replies and possibly give more details about exactly what's wrong.
>> Anyway, this situation is really bad for him because he said that his professors won't help him with Blackboard and apparently told him that if he didn't get the issues resolved, he would fail the class.  He is therefore thinking about dropping out of this program, but I don't think he really wants to because as I just mentioned, it helps you get ready for college, particularly in academics.
>> 
>> I'm also asking you guys because Jose is totally blind, and I think some of you have mentioned here before that you've had no problems with Blackboard accessibility.
>> 
>> I hope that you guys can really help Jose in getting his sitUn resolved, and that he might even want to subscribe to this list.
>> 
>> By the way, if you need more information, just reply to this email, since as I said I also sent this to Jose as well.
>> 
>> Looking forward to hereearing from you, and by the wan, happy St.  Patricks day!
>> 
>>  Thank you very much,
>> 
>> Sami and Jose.
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat97%40gmail.com
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gmail.com


From gloria.graves at gmail.com  Wed Mar 18 12:38:59 2015
From: gloria.graves at gmail.com (Gloria Graves)
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2015 07:38:59 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] IPad apps
Message-ID: <AF2BF413-CBC5-4E04-A90F-C108F60DC22B@gmail.com>

Hi all,
I sent this post before but hadn't got a response so was wondering if anyone could give me a list of apps that would be good to use on my iPad for school? I have an iPad in the morning to use it for school and have heard of absence as pages and keynotes but was wondering if anyone could provide other list of apps that could be good using in school thanks




From blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com  Wed Mar 18 12:40:54 2015
From: blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com (Aleeha Dudley)
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2015 08:40:54 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] IPad apps
In-Reply-To: <AF2BF413-CBC5-4E04-A90F-C108F60DC22B@gmail.com>
References: <AF2BF413-CBC5-4E04-A90F-C108F60DC22B@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5780BC25-1846-4408-8386-1E0BF0216C05@gmail.com>

It is honestly going to depend on what you want to use the iPad for. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 18, 2015, at 8:38 AM, Gloria Graves via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> I sent this post before but hadn't got a response so was wondering if anyone could give me a list of apps that would be good to use on my iPad for school? I have an iPad in the morning to use it for school and have heard of absence as pages and keynotes but was wondering if anyone could provide other list of apps that could be good using in school thanks
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com


From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com  Wed Mar 18 13:15:56 2015
From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton)
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2015 09:15:56 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] IPad apps
In-Reply-To: <5780BC25-1846-4408-8386-1E0BF0216C05@gmail.com>
References: <AF2BF413-CBC5-4E04-A90F-C108F60DC22B@gmail.com>
	<5780BC25-1846-4408-8386-1E0BF0216C05@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAFja7FYBJGK6kHgzu8=GiukEQb7+xD48fNv0+W=uOaPFGAcaYQ@mail.gmail.com>

What are you specifically looking to do with the IPad?  That's
probably why you didn't get responses before as Aleeha said-try being
a little more specific.

If you have a notetaker a lot of the on-board apps like mail and
safari can be used with a braille display through a bluetooth
connection.

Here are some general apps I am aware of, though don't necessarily
use.  I don't know if they'll suit your purposes or not, but just in
case.
Voice Dream Writer.  I hear it is more accessible than pages.
Numbers, basically excel.
Dropbox and Dropvox.  Dropbox is a storage tool which has a desktop
client you can run on your computer.  The IPad/IPhone app allows you
to access those materials you have saved in dropbox.  You can also
share things from dropbox through the mail app and open documents you
download on your phone like PDFs there to save them.  Dropvox is a
recording app which links to your dropbox so recordings are stored
there.
IBooks, Voice Dream, Read to Go, Learning Ally, Newsline, KNFB Reader.
All reading apps but they do different things.  The KNFB Reader is
more of an OCR tool.  IBooks is basic reading, Read to Go is
Bookshare's app, and Learning Ally is obviously from Learning Ally.
Newsline is helpful if you ever need to read newspaper articles for
your class, though you would need to sign up if you aren't already
registered.
One more: Overdrive.  Works through accessing digital books through
libraries, and works just like a library where you get the book for a
certain amount of time but for free.
ITunes U.  Lectures on various things.  TED.  Lectures on other
various things.  Possibly useful but it would depend on how your
classes work.


On 3/18/15, Aleeha Dudley via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> It is honestly going to depend on what you want to use the iPad for.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Mar 18, 2015, at 8:38 AM, Gloria Graves via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi all,
>> I sent this post before but hadn't got a response so was wondering if
>> anyone could give me a list of apps that would be good to use on my iPad
>> for school? I have an iPad in the morning to use it for school and have
>> heard of absence as pages and keynotes but was wondering if anyone could
>> provide other list of apps that could be good using in school thanks
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com
>


-- 
Kaiti


From clearinghouse at miusa.org  Wed Mar 18 19:41:06 2015
From: clearinghouse at miusa.org (NCDE Clearinghouse)
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2015 12:41:06 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] 25 Study Abroad Scholarships for students with
	disabilities!
Message-ID: <000801d061b3$7db29440$7917bcc0$@miusa.org>

Dear students,

We have wanted to share some exciting news with you!

Study abroad is a real option for students with disabilities, and now it will be even more within reach thanks to new scholarships designed to diversify who is studying abroad!

In partnership with MIUSA, CIEE has pledged to provide 25 scholarships to motivated and high-achieving U.S. college students with disabilities to study in one of its many overseas program sites. CIEE and MIUSA are offering the scholarships, in part, to celebrate the 25th anniversary of the Americans with Disabilities Act, which has expanded opportunities for people with disabilities since its passage in 1990.

Encourage other talented students with disabilities in your networks to explore the possibilities abroad! Eligible students should visit CIEE's scholarship page to learn more and apply by April 1, 2015. Visit http://www.ciee.org/study-abroad/miusa/. To share on social media, a sample Tweet and Facebook post are included below. Thank you!

Sincerely,
Ashley Holben
Mobility International USA
www.miusa.org

Sample Tweet:
Celebrate #ADA25! Apply for @CIEEstudyabroad @MobilityINTL scholarship for students w/ #disabilities to #studyabroad ow.ly/Kdra3

Sample Facebook post:
CIEE: Council on International Educational Exchange and Mobility International USA are doing something awesome - they are celebrating the 25th anniversary of the landmark Americans with Disabilities Act with 25 new ‪‎study abroad‬ ‪‎scholarships‬ specifically for students with disabilities. Applications are due soon, so apply now or share with someone who you think should apply! #ADA25 #GenerationStudyAbroad http://www.ciee.org/study-abroad/miusa/





From dandrews at visi.com  Wed Mar 18 20:06:03 2015
From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews)
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2015 15:06:03 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] SSB-Bart Group Seeks Accessibility Consultant
Message-ID: <auto-000019207201@mailfront1.g2host.com>

The SSB Bart Group, in Vienna Virginia, is seeking an Accessibility 
Consultant 
http://ssbbartgroup.theresumator.com/apply/YBt24l/Accessibility-Consultant.html
Dave



From lhnews at lighthouse-sf.org  Wed Mar 18 22:21:50 2015
From: lhnews at lighthouse-sf.org (LightHouse for the Blind and Visually Impaired)
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2015 22:21:50 +0000
Subject: [nabs-l] Enchanted Hills Camp This Summer - Fresh Sessions
 including TouchSTEM and Horse Camp
Message-ID: <2B462D39CA57B147A4C4B61F9FC1959D513825@email.rrlh-sf.local>

Join us at Enchanted Hills Camp for the Blind this summer!



Situated on a rugged mountain awash in natural beauty, Enchanted Hills Camp for the Blind in Napa, California is one of the only programs of its kind dedicated to blind, visually impaired, deaf-blind and multi-disabled participants. Since 1950 Enchanted Hills has been a place for campers of all ages to make friends, try new things and have unparalleled opportunities to explore and create.



Do you know anyone who would like to experience the magic of Enchanted Hills Camp for the Blind?  To apply or learn more: call (415) 694-7310 or visit www.enchantedhillscamp.org<http://www.enchantedhillscamp.org>



We've highlighted some of our very special sessions below. Go to www.enchantedhillscamp.org<http://www.enchantedhillscamp.org> for a full list of camp sessions including our kids (youth) sessions, teen sessions and adult and family camp sessions.







Just One Month Left to Sign up for High School Chemistry Camp

"What I love about Chemistry Camp is the metamorphosis the students go through. They come in timid about doing chemistry and leave excited to study whatever they want, regardless of their blindness."

-Chemistry Camp Lead Instructor Hoby Wedler



The LightHouse is pleased to partner again with Accessible Science to introduce an educational, exciting and hands-on weekend of chemistry this May in the fresh air of Enchanted Hills Camp.



When: Friday, May 1 through Sunday, May 3

Where: Enchanted Hills Camp for the Blind, Napa

Deadline to apply: April 15, 2015



Read more about Chemistry Camp at bit.ly/chemcamp2015.



***



New Extra Teen Track at Enchanted Hills: Wild Science with WizKidz

Parents, enroll your kids! This summer we're offering a special tactile STEM (Science, Technology, Engineering and Math) breakout session to our Youth camp that will include cool and fun activities such as building your own robot, unearthing fossils and best of all, taking the controls of an airplane during a one-on-one supervised flight.



We are thrilled to be able to offer one of the most outstanding accessible STEM programs being offered in the USA at this time. Award winning WhizKidz will offer a camp within a camp during our Youth Session and it will be a session your kids will not forget.



When: July 15 through 18

Where: Enchanted Hills Camp for the Blind



Parents and guardians who wish to register their children for the TouchSTEM program can do so on the supplemental section which is included on the Youth Session application.



Find out more about our TouchSTEM session at bit.ly/lhtouchstem2015.



***



Blind Music Academy Returns to Enchanted Hills

Do you sing or play an instrument? Are you serious about your music? After a hugely successful debut in 2014, the LightHouse will partner for a second year with Dancing Dots, the world's leading provider of accessible music technology for the blind, to bring our summertime music academy back to the redwoods. The academy is open to young, motivated blind and visually-impaired musicians from around the nation who are 14 to 25 years old.



Once again, Bill McCann, President and Founder of Dancing Dots will spend the entire week with aspiring musicians. McCann, blind himself, will lead a team of four blind instructors and technicians to teach the latest and greatest techniques for blind and low-vision students.



When: Monday, August 3 through Sunday, August 9

Where: Enchanted Hills Camp for the Blind, Napa



Read more about Music Academy at bit.ly/musicacademy2015.



***



Now You Can Saddle Up and Learn How to Ride and Take Care of Horses at New Special Camp Session

Do you love to ride? This summer at Enchanted Hills we're debuting our Horse Camp, where you'll learn how to take care of and work safely with horses. This session is for blind or visually impaired riders, ages 16 through 24 who have had some experience riding.



When: Monday, August 3 through Sunday, August 9

Where: Enchanted Hills Camp for the Blind near Napa, California



Learn more about Horse Camp at bit.ly/horsecamp2015.




From weberrebecca232 at gmail.com  Thu Mar 19 21:53:11 2015
From: weberrebecca232 at gmail.com (Rebecca Weber)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 17:53:11 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Chemistry for the Blind
In-Reply-To: <BE6D5595-44B1-4429-8BE8-D30EF5FCAD47@gmail.com>
References: <BE6D5595-44B1-4429-8BE8-D30EF5FCAD47@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <3A3A36B8-D983-4B50-BF82-991760E67B5B@gmail.com>



Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 19, 2015, at 5:42 PM, Rebecca Weber <weberrebecca232 at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Hello NABS.
> This is my first email on this list. Let me say that it’s awesome to find a list that is designed for blind students. We are raising expetations everyday.
> My name is Becca Weber and I attend Archbishop John Carroll High School in Pennsylvania. I have had a lot of frustrations here, particularly with my team. I feel that they focus too much on vision. So, that’s why I’m reaching out to you. I am wanting to take chemistry next year, but this has been shut down because of safety reasons. I would like to point out that I have, I believe, 20-500 vision. I think, so this may be different. I have cooked by myself with no help at all sometimes. I am wondering how a blind student could take chemistry?
> I have some iddeas
> -bottles of chemicals could be labeled in braille
> -measuring chemicals with a caring 
> -Having a partner to describe the chemicals to me, but I can see color
> -using a device called a math quest I think.
> Anything else please email me.
> Thank you so much for your help.
> Have a nice day.
> Becca


From k8tvv2 at gmail.com  Thu Mar 19 22:19:27 2015
From: k8tvv2 at gmail.com (Jeff Crouch- k8tvv)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 18:19:27 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] survey monkey accessibility questions
Message-ID: <CAPbc4TcGroj7gGaQAf6nadQczD4fTt8Bc3qc=b0DfZ_fPiPaKw@mail.gmail.com>

Hi
I am trying to create a survey for my school to get some information
about our prom that were having. I am having trouble creating the
survey.
If anyone could help or give me some tips, I would appreciate it.

thanks

-- 
President of the flint chapter of the NFB of Michigan
Board member of the Michigan Association of Blind Students
Cell: 810-931-7763
73
k8tvv
Jeff Crouch


From mikgephart at icloud.com  Thu Mar 19 22:34:13 2015
From: mikgephart at icloud.com (Mikayla Gephart)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 18:34:13 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Chemistry for the Blind
In-Reply-To: <3A3A36B8-D983-4B50-BF82-991760E67B5B@gmail.com>
References: <BE6D5595-44B1-4429-8BE8-D30EF5FCAD47@gmail.com>
	<3A3A36B8-D983-4B50-BF82-991760E67B5B@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <B3800C60-681D-46CC-BDF0-833231FA7901@icloud.com>



Sent from my iPad

> On Mar 19, 2015, at 5:53 PM, Rebecca Weber via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 5:42 PM, Rebecca Weber <weberrebecca232 at gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Hello NABS.
>> This is my first email on this list. Let me say that it’s awesome to find a list that is designed for blind students. We are raising expetations everyday.
>> My name is Becca Weber and I attend Archbishop John Carroll High School in Pennsylvania. I have had a lot of frustrations here, particularly with my team. I feel that they focus too much on vision. So, that’s why I’m reaching out to you. I am wanting to take chemistry next year, but this has been shut down because of safety reasons. I would like to point out that I have, I believe, 20-500 vision. I think, so this may be different. I have cooked by myself with no help at all sometimes. I am wondering how a blind student could take chemistry?
>> I have some iddeas
>> -bottles of chemicals could be labeled in braille
>> -measuring chemicals with a caring 
>> -Having a partner to describe the chemicals to me, but I can see color
>> -using a device called a math quest I think.
>> Anything else please email me.
>> Thank you so much for your help.
>> Have a nice day.
>> Becca
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mikgephart%40icloud.com


From mikgephart at icloud.com  Thu Mar 19 22:46:18 2015
From: mikgephart at icloud.com (Mikayla Gephart)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 18:46:18 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Chemistry for the Blind
In-Reply-To: <3A3A36B8-D983-4B50-BF82-991760E67B5B@gmail.com>
References: <BE6D5595-44B1-4429-8BE8-D30EF5FCAD47@gmail.com>
	<3A3A36B8-D983-4B50-BF82-991760E67B5B@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4DE9BEE5-7DBA-45E9-8D10-537FF74C796D@icloud.com>

Becca,
Welcome to the  list. I have no expie with chemistry. I do use the second two ideas in the sciences I takee, and would use the first one in Chemistry. 

Sent from my iPad

> On Mar 19, 2015, at 5:53 PM, Rebecca Weber via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 5:42 PM, Rebecca Weber <weberrebecca232 at gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Hello NABS.
>> This is my first email on this list. Let me say that it’s awesome to find a list that is designed for blind students. We are raising expetations everyday.
>> My name is Becca Weber and I attend Archbishop John Carroll High School in Pennsylvania. I have had a lot of frustrations here, particularly with my team. I feel that they focus too much on vision. So, that’s why I’m reaching out to you. I am wanting to take chemistry next year, but this has been shut down because of safety reasons. I would like to point out that I have, I believe, 20-500 vision. I think, so this may be different. I have cooked by myself with no help at all sometimes. I am wondering how a blind student could take chemistry?
>> I have some iddeas
>> -bottles of chemicals could be labeled in braille
>> -measuring chemicals with a caring 
>> -Having a partner to describe the chemicals to me, but I can see color
>> -using a device called a math quest I think.
>> Anything else please email me.
>> Thank you so much for your help.
>> Have a nice day.
>> Becca
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mikgephart%40icloud.com


From arielle71 at gmail.com  Thu Mar 19 22:49:52 2015
From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 15:49:52 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Chemistry for the Blind
In-Reply-To: <B3800C60-681D-46CC-BDF0-833231FA7901@icloud.com>
References: <BE6D5595-44B1-4429-8BE8-D30EF5FCAD47@gmail.com>
	<3A3A36B8-D983-4B50-BF82-991760E67B5B@gmail.com>
	<B3800C60-681D-46CC-BDF0-833231FA7901@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <CALAYQJBw2SCM_1oZFben7GiDTetsR94qdO9QbOjh4i75nshVQQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Rebecca, and welcome to the list. I am totally blind, and I took
chemistry in high school and college. It was very simple and safe. My
lab partner mixed the chemicals and described what was happening, and
I took notes and wrote lab reports. Chemistry class is mostly about
doing the math to balance equations and testing hypotheses. Only a
tiny portion of the class is actually about mixing the chemicals. I've
known several totally blind people who did chemistry, including people
who have Ph.D.'s in chemistry. You absolutely can do it using the
methods you mentioned. Now there are technologies you can use to
perform some measurements independently, which didn't exist when I was
in high school 15 years ago.
Please check out
www.independencescience.com
and
www.ncbys.org
to learn more about how blind people participate in chemistry. Print
out pages from these websites and show them to your teacher and TVI.
Do your parents support your desire to take chemistry? If they do, see
if your mom or dad would be willing to contact the principal of your
school and request a meeting to explain how you can, and should, take
chemistry with everyone else. By not allowing you to take chemistry,
your teachers are limiting what you can study in college and what
careers you can perform. As you say, we need to raise expectations.
Best, Arielle

On 3/19/15, Mikayla Gephart via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 5:53 PM, Rebecca Weber via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 5:42 PM, Rebecca Weber <weberrebecca232 at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hello NABS.
>>> This is my first email on this list. Let me say that it’s awesome to find
>>> a list that is designed for blind students. We are raising expetations
>>> everyday.
>>> My name is Becca Weber and I attend Archbishop John Carroll High School
>>> in Pennsylvania. I have had a lot of frustrations here, particularly with
>>> my team. I feel that they focus too much on vision. So, that’s why I’m
>>> reaching out to you. I am wanting to take chemistry next year, but this
>>> has been shut down because of safety reasons. I would like to point out
>>> that I have, I believe, 20-500 vision. I think, so this may be different.
>>> I have cooked by myself with no help at all sometimes. I am wondering how
>>> a blind student could take chemistry?
>>> I have some iddeas
>>> -bottles of chemicals could be labeled in braille
>>> -measuring chemicals with a caring
>>> -Having a partner to describe the chemicals to me, but I can see color
>>> -using a device called a math quest I think.
>>> Anything else please email me.
>>> Thank you so much for your help.
>>> Have a nice day.
>>> Becca
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mikgephart%40icloud.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com
>


From annajee82 at gmail.com  Thu Mar 19 23:21:46 2015
From: annajee82 at gmail.com (Anna Givens)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 17:21:46 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Chemistry for the Blind
In-Reply-To: <CALAYQJBw2SCM_1oZFben7GiDTetsR94qdO9QbOjh4i75nshVQQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <BE6D5595-44B1-4429-8BE8-D30EF5FCAD47@gmail.com>
	<3A3A36B8-D983-4B50-BF82-991760E67B5B@gmail.com>
	<B3800C60-681D-46CC-BDF0-833231FA7901@icloud.com>
	<CALAYQJBw2SCM_1oZFben7GiDTetsR94qdO9QbOjh4i75nshVQQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8A65EE5B-5BC6-4833-B599-1179196052CF@gmail.com>

Hi Rebecca.  
Thanks for reaching out to the list.  I am a junior in college majoring in Biology.  There are many chemistry classes involved with that.  I am in one now.  
There are many ways to do chemistry lab work as a blind student.  Arielle provided you with some good websites to look at.  
The device you are referring to that can identify colors is a Lab Quest sold by Independence Science.  It can do many things, and is certainly a good tool.  I currently don't use one for a number of reasons.  But it's worth looking into, although you may want to just do the work you can with your partner.  Everyone is different and has different preferencesof how to do things.  
I have someone that is paid by my University to assist me in lab, and I also work with a lab partner.  My assistant is there to essential explain visual aspects of things (for example: "The solution is turning blue" "The chemical is dissolving partially." "The water in the flask is at the 45.5 cm mark." etc.)
He also can help me with handling equipment if necessary.  This way I can participate fully in lab without having to do the things that are visual.  The important thing is to understand HOW to use the equipment, how to do the technique, etc.  As long as you understand how to do everything in the lab enough to be able to explain to another person, then that is all that matters.  Actually doing it is not the point.  There are many ways of doing things and many tools you can use in chemistry as a blind student.  
Please feel free to contact me off-list is you would like, and we discuss this further.  
Thanks

Anna E Givens

> On Mar 19, 2015, at 4:49 PM, Arielle Silverman via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi Rebecca, and welcome to the list. I am totally blind, and I took
> chemistry in high school and college. It was very simple and safe. My
> lab partner mixed the chemicals and described what was happening, and
> I took notes and wrote lab reports. Chemistry class is mostly about
> doing the math to balance equations and testing hypotheses. Only a
> tiny portion of the class is actually about mixing the chemicals. I've
> known several totally blind people who did chemistry, including people
> who have Ph.D.'s in chemistry. You absolutely can do it using the
> methods you mentioned. Now there are technologies you can use to
> perform some measurements independently, which didn't exist when I was
> in high school 15 years ago.
> Please check out
> www.independencescience.com
> and
> www.ncbys.org
> to learn more about how blind people participate in chemistry. Print
> out pages from these websites and show them to your teacher and TVI.
> Do your parents support your desire to take chemistry? If they do, see
> if your mom or dad would be willing to contact the principal of your
> school and request a meeting to explain how you can, and should, take
> chemistry with everyone else. By not allowing you to take chemistry,
> your teachers are limiting what you can study in college and what
> careers you can perform. As you say, we need to raise expectations.
> Best, Arielle
> 
>> On 3/19/15, Mikayla Gephart via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 5:53 PM, Rebecca Weber via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 5:42 PM, Rebecca Weber <weberrebecca232 at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Hello NABS.
>>>> This is my first email on this list. Let me say that it’s awesome to find
>>>> a list that is designed for blind students. We are raising expetations
>>>> everyday.
>>>> My name is Becca Weber and I attend Archbishop John Carroll High School
>>>> in Pennsylvania. I have had a lot of frustrations here, particularly with
>>>> my team. I feel that they focus too much on vision. So, that’s why I’m
>>>> reaching out to you. I am wanting to take chemistry next year, but this
>>>> has been shut down because of safety reasons. I would like to point out
>>>> that I have, I believe, 20-500 vision. I think, so this may be different.
>>>> I have cooked by myself with no help at all sometimes. I am wondering how
>>>> a blind student could take chemistry?
>>>> I have some iddeas
>>>> -bottles of chemicals could be labeled in braille
>>>> -measuring chemicals with a caring
>>>> -Having a partner to describe the chemicals to me, but I can see color
>>>> -using a device called a math quest I think.
>>>> Anything else please email me.
>>>> Thank you so much for your help.
>>>> Have a nice day.
>>>> Becca
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mikgephart%40icloud.com
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/annajee82%40gmail.com


From mikgephart at icloud.com  Thu Mar 19 23:37:36 2015
From: mikgephart at icloud.com (Mikayla Gephart)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 19:37:36 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Chemistry for the Blind
In-Reply-To: <CALAYQJBw2SCM_1oZFben7GiDTetsR94qdO9QbOjh4i75nshVQQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <BE6D5595-44B1-4429-8BE8-D30EF5FCAD47@gmail.com>
	<3A3A36B8-D983-4B50-BF82-991760E67B5B@gmail.com>
	<B3800C60-681D-46CC-BDF0-833231FA7901@icloud.com>
	<CALAYQJBw2SCM_1oZFben7GiDTetsR94qdO9QbOjh4i75nshVQQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <F06ADAF9-87F8-46BC-82C6-9BB3B6ED536E@icloud.com>

arielle, we just started doing some chemistry in my Physical Science class. I do the same thing, but sometimes stick the thermometer in the liquid as it is a talking thermometer.

Sent from my iPad

> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:49 PM, Arielle Silverman <arielle71 at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Hi Rebecca, and welcome to the list. I am totally blind, and I took
> chemistry in high school and college. It was very simple and safe. My
> lab partner mixed the chemicals and described what was happening, and
> I took notes and wrote lab reports. Chemistry class is mostly about
> doing the math to balance equations and testing hypotheses. Only a
> tiny portion of the class is actually about mixing the chemicals. I've
> known several totally blind people who did chemistry, including people
> who have Ph.D.'s in chemistry. You absolutely can do it using the
> methods you mentioned. Now there are technologies you can use to
> perform some measurements independently, which didn't exist when I was
> in high school 15 years ago.
> Please check out
> www.independencescience.com
> and
> www.ncbys.org
> to learn more about how blind people participate in chemistry. Print
> out pages from these websites and show them to your teacher and TVI.
> Do your parents support your desire to take chemistry? If they do, see
> if your mom or dad would be willing to contact the principal of your
> school and request a meeting to explain how you can, and should, take
> chemistry with everyone else. By not allowing you to take chemistry,
> your teachers are limiting what you can study in college and what
> careers you can perform. As you say, we need to raise expectations.
> Best, Arielle
> 
>> On 3/19/15, Mikayla Gephart via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 5:53 PM, Rebecca Weber via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 5:42 PM, Rebecca Weber <weberrebecca232 at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Hello NABS.
>>>> This is my first email on this list. Let me say that it’s awesome to find
>>>> a list that is designed for blind students. We are raising expetations
>>>> everyday.
>>>> My name is Becca Weber and I attend Archbishop John Carroll High School
>>>> in Pennsylvania. I have had a lot of frustrations here, particularly with
>>>> my team. I feel that they focus too much on vision. So, that’s why I’m
>>>> reaching out to you. I am wanting to take chemistry next year, but this
>>>> has been shut down because of safety reasons. I would like to point out
>>>> that I have, I believe, 20-500 vision. I think, so this may be different.
>>>> I have cooked by myself with no help at all sometimes. I am wondering how
>>>> a blind student could take chemistry?
>>>> I have some iddeas
>>>> -bottles of chemicals could be labeled in braille
>>>> -measuring chemicals with a caring
>>>> -Having a partner to describe the chemicals to me, but I can see color
>>>> -using a device called a math quest I think.
>>>> Anything else please email me.
>>>> Thank you so much for your help.
>>>> Have a nice day.
>>>> Becca
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mikgephart%40icloud.com
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com
>> 


From jsoro620 at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 00:26:29 2015
From: jsoro620 at gmail.com (Joe)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 20:26:29 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
Message-ID: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>

If you're blind, you obviously read Braille. Your hearing must naturally be
superior to your sighted peers, and of course you have a guide dog! Right?

Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the first and second. Someone
recently told me the number of guide dog users has actually declined in my
millennial generation. I have no evidence proving this one way or the other,
but for the general public, to see a blind person with a guide dog feels as
natural as butter and toast.

Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for everyone. Or, maybe I'm
just projecting my own uncertainties onto the rest of the community?

Last November I took the first step in the application process to return for
a second Seeing Eye dog. It's been more than three years since I lost Gator,
and even though I've gotten around just fine with a white cane, I am
approaching what feels like the final years with sight, however minimal that
sight might be. I admit it's unnerving if I sit still long enough to
contemplate total blindness. NFB philosophy be damned, and the thought of an
extra set of eyes to help me navigate the world does bring a measure of
comfort. But, is it enough to go get another dog?

In no particular order, here are reasons why a guide dog would be a terrible
idea:

Read more:

http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-terrible-idea/

--
Musings of a Work in Progress:
www.JoeOrozco.com/

Twitter: @ScribblingJoe





From carlymih at comcast.net  Fri Mar 20 00:44:00 2015
From: carlymih at comcast.net (Carly Mihalakis)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 17:44:00 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Chemistry for the Blind
In-Reply-To: <4DE9BEE5-7DBA-45E9-8D10-537FF74C796D@icloud.com>
References: <BE6D5595-44B1-4429-8BE8-D30EF5FCAD47@gmail.com>
	<3A3A36B8-D983-4B50-BF82-991760E67B5B@gmail.com>
	<4DE9BEE5-7DBA-45E9-8D10-537FF74C796D@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <mailman.203.1772982280.2863824.nabs-l_nfbnet.org@nfbnet.org>

Evening, Becca,

I tend to agree with other students who confirm 
that, knowing in chemistry is centered around 
methodology, not the actual compounds you 
create.. I also like the idea of getting a 
sighted lab partner who might supply empirical 
observation not readily experienced by means of technology. Carly
\
On Mar 19, 2015, at 5:53 PM, Rebecca Weber via 
nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote: > > > > Sent 
from my iPhone > >> On Mar 19, 2015, at 5:42 PM, 
Rebecca Weber <weberrebecca232 at gmail.com> 
wrote: >> >> Hello NABS. >> This is my first 
email on this list. Let me say that it’s 
awesome to find a list that is designed for blind 
students. We are raising expetations everyday. >> 
My name is Becca Weber and I attend Archbishop 
John Carroll High School in Pennsylvania. I have 
had a lot of frustrations here, particularly with 
my team. I feel that they focus too much on 
vision. So, that’s why I’m reaching out to 
you. I am wanting to take chemistry next year, 
but this has been shut down because of safety 
reasons. I would like to point out that I have, I 
believe, 20-500 vision. I think, so this may be 
different. I have cooked by myself with no help 
at all sometimes. I am wondering how a blind 
student could take chemistry? >> I have some 
iddeas >> -bottles of chemicals could be labeled 
in braille >> -measuring chemicals with a 
caring >> -Having a partner to describe the 
chemicals to me, but I can see color >> -using a 
device called a math quest I think. >> Anything 
else please email me. >> Thank you so much for 
your help. >> Have a nice day. >> Becca > > 
_______________________________________________ > 
nabs-l mailing list > nabs-l at nfbnet.org > 
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org  
 > To unsubscribe, change your list options or 
get your account info for nabs-l: > 
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mikgephart%40icloud.com 
_______________________________________________ 
nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org 
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org 
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get 
your account info for nabs-l: 
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carlymih%40comcast.net



From blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 01:00:48 2015
From: blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com (Aleeha Dudley)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 21:00:48 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>

Personally, I find your subject line a bit offensive, as it assumes
that guide dogs are a terrible idea for everyone. Being the proud
handler of a wonderful dog myself, and a quite independent cane
traveller before that, I am a bit upset as what I find to be a
somewhat inflammatory post. You are right; guide dogs are not for
everyone. They are a huge responsibility and need a lot of daily care.
But to say that there are five reasons why a guide dog is a terrile
idea seems to be going too far, especially addressing such a large
body of people such as that on this list. Now, having clicked the link
and read the blog, I know that you are making an attempt to be fair
and point out the disadvantages, but to not point out that this was a
blog post or an opinion article, can make some folks pretty mad fairly
quickly. Can wa choose our words and subject lines a little more
wisely next time?
Aleha and Dallas, Seeing Eye dog extrordinaire

On 3/19/15, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> If you're blind, you obviously read Braille. Your hearing must naturally be
> superior to your sighted peers, and of course you have a guide dog! Right?
>
> Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the first and second. Someone
> recently told me the number of guide dog users has actually declined in my
> millennial generation. I have no evidence proving this one way or the
> other,
> but for the general public, to see a blind person with a guide dog feels as
> natural as butter and toast.
>
> Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for everyone. Or, maybe I'm
> just projecting my own uncertainties onto the rest of the community?
>
> Last November I took the first step in the application process to return
> for
> a second Seeing Eye dog. It's been more than three years since I lost
> Gator,
> and even though I've gotten around just fine with a white cane, I am
> approaching what feels like the final years with sight, however minimal
> that
> sight might be. I admit it's unnerving if I sit still long enough to
> contemplate total blindness. NFB philosophy be damned, and the thought of
> an
> extra set of eyes to help me navigate the world does bring a measure of
> comfort. But, is it enough to go get another dog?
>
> In no particular order, here are reasons why a guide dog would be a
> terrible
> idea:
>
> Read more:
>
> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-terrible-idea/
>
> --
> Musings of a Work in Progress:
> www.JoeOrozco.com/
>
> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com
>


-- 
Aleeha Dudley and Seeing Eye Yellow Labrador Dallas
Vice President, Ohio Association of Blind Students
Email: blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com
Follow me on Twitter at @blindcowgirl199

The wind of heaven is that which blows between a horse's ears.
- Arabian Proverb


From sgermano at asu.edu  Fri Mar 20 01:01:30 2015
From: sgermano at asu.edu (Suzanne Germano)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 18:01:30 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Chemistry for the Blind
In-Reply-To: <3A3A36B8-D983-4B50-BF82-991760E67B5B@gmail.com>
References: <BE6D5595-44B1-4429-8BE8-D30EF5FCAD47@gmail.com>
	<3A3A36B8-D983-4B50-BF82-991760E67B5B@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAF=_avftYN2M7C8eyH6W0xk9nf4-d12O-uwyXr8K-rCKPxPFkQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Becca

Tell you school there are blind chemists working in the the field.

On Thu, Mar 19, 2015 at 2:53 PM, Rebecca Weber via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> wrote:

>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Mar 19, 2015, at 5:42 PM, Rebecca Weber <weberrebecca232 at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > Hello NABS.
> > This is my first email on this list. Let me say that it’s awesome to
> find a list that is designed for blind students. We are raising expetations
> everyday.
> > My name is Becca Weber and I attend Archbishop John Carroll High School
> in Pennsylvania. I have had a lot of frustrations here, particularly with
> my team. I feel that they focus too much on vision. So, that’s why I’m
> reaching out to you. I am wanting to take chemistry next year, but this has
> been shut down because of safety reasons. I would like to point out that I
> have, I believe, 20-500 vision. I think, so this may be different. I have
> cooked by myself with no help at all sometimes. I am wondering how a blind
> student could take chemistry?
> > I have some iddeas
> > -bottles of chemicals could be labeled in braille
> > -measuring chemicals with a caring
> > -Having a partner to describe the chemicals to me, but I can see color
> > -using a device called a math quest I think.
> > Anything else please email me.
> > Thank you so much for your help.
> > Have a nice day.
> > Becca
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sgermano%40asu.edu
>

From minh.ha927 at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 01:28:42 2015
From: minh.ha927 at gmail.com (minh ha)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 21:28:42 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>
	<CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAAJqG9je1EWhg88Fx-snXj2Ty172TY48k9OM3ZX-4L8ckjvchw@mail.gmail.com>

I agree with Aleeha's sentiments one hundred percent. Over
generalization is a huge mistake to do under any circumstances, and
this blog post was offensive to me and other guide dog handlers on so
many levels. If you want to write a fair and informative blog post
about the guide dog lifestyle, then by all means, point out the
negative aspects, but do not conveniently forget to mention the
thousand of other more positive and beneficial impacts that a guide
dog can have on a person's life. Yes, a guide dog is not the right
choice for everyone and a blind person needs to think long and hard
before getting one, but for the right reasons, a guide dog can
completely turn someone's life around and give them the confidence in
order to live life more productively. Honestly, your five reasons seem
very childish, and i have to wonder if they are that important to you,
then you should be contemplating about getting another guide dog at
all.

Respectfully,
Minh and my hard working little guide, Viva

On 3/19/15, Aleeha Dudley via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Personally, I find your subject line a bit offensive, as it assumes
> that guide dogs are a terrible idea for everyone. Being the proud
> handler of a wonderful dog myself, and a quite independent cane
> traveller before that, I am a bit upset as what I find to be a
> somewhat inflammatory post. You are right; guide dogs are not for
> everyone. They are a huge responsibility and need a lot of daily care.
> But to say that there are five reasons why a guide dog is a terrile
> idea seems to be going too far, especially addressing such a large
> body of people such as that on this list. Now, having clicked the link
> and read the blog, I know that you are making an attempt to be fair
> and point out the disadvantages, but to not point out that this was a
> blog post or an opinion article, can make some folks pretty mad fairly
> quickly. Can wa choose our words and subject lines a little more
> wisely next time?
> Aleha and Dallas, Seeing Eye dog extrordinaire
>
> On 3/19/15, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> If you're blind, you obviously read Braille. Your hearing must naturally
>> be
>> superior to your sighted peers, and of course you have a guide dog!
>> Right?
>>
>> Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the first and second. Someone
>> recently told me the number of guide dog users has actually declined in
>> my
>> millennial generation. I have no evidence proving this one way or the
>> other,
>> but for the general public, to see a blind person with a guide dog feels
>> as
>> natural as butter and toast.
>>
>> Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for everyone. Or, maybe
>> I'm
>> just projecting my own uncertainties onto the rest of the community?
>>
>> Last November I took the first step in the application process to return
>> for
>> a second Seeing Eye dog. It's been more than three years since I lost
>> Gator,
>> and even though I've gotten around just fine with a white cane, I am
>> approaching what feels like the final years with sight, however minimal
>> that
>> sight might be. I admit it's unnerving if I sit still long enough to
>> contemplate total blindness. NFB philosophy be damned, and the thought of
>> an
>> extra set of eyes to help me navigate the world does bring a measure of
>> comfort. But, is it enough to go get another dog?
>>
>> In no particular order, here are reasons why a guide dog would be a
>> terrible
>> idea:
>>
>> Read more:
>>
>> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-terrible-idea/
>>
>> --
>> Musings of a Work in Progress:
>> www.JoeOrozco.com/
>>
>> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com
>>
>
>
> --
> Aleeha Dudley and Seeing Eye Yellow Labrador Dallas
> Vice President, Ohio Association of Blind Students
> Email: blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com
> Follow me on Twitter at @blindcowgirl199
>
> The wind of heaven is that which blows between a horse's ears.
> - Arabian Proverb
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/minh.ha927%40gmail.com
>


-- 
"All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty
recesses of their minds, wake in the day to find that it was vanity:
but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act on
their dreams with open eyes, to make them possible." T. E. Lawrence


From dsmithnfb at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 01:29:56 2015
From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 18:29:56 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8C43A16F-2F20-4AA0-87E0-2024ECD9C49F@gmail.com>

Hi all,
 Thanks  Joe for sharing this.

 If   your aim in the subject line is to get one’s attention than I’sure you’ve done it.  
 Knowing what I know, seeing what I’ve seen and understanding what I do, It seems like a very important thing to think about, the considerations   surrounding  getting a dog  guide.
  There are many reasons why people might decide that a dog might be the best mobility tool for them (Yes, the dog  is an animal, but consider that when they are in   harness they are as much a travel tool as a cane would be. 
 A cane requires far less   moving parts in it’s usage   than a dog might,  and yet the dog  requires that you interact with your  physical environment  much less than a cane might.
 I  personally know of folks who love dogs, but would not    go to train for a guide   because of the responsibilities that come with the puppy.  I also know of folks who have gotten a dog guide  though otherwise they wouldn’t have a dog in their lives. 
  I think  that though  I  may oversimplify the topic,  there       
      ). are many reasons why a blind person may have either a cane or dog in their lives, though I personally believe that a solid  foundation in the former can be absolutely key in maximizing the ability to work the latter, there’s nothing wrong with deciding to get a dog.
 What I think Joe points out are valid reasons  why if you don’t really think it through then getting a dog guide could be a bad idea.  it’s not a  dig  and I doubt it  destroys  the image  of guide dogs, their owners and the schools they come from.
 This, however is just my humble opinion on the matter.
  Best,
 Darian 
      
         
  
> On Mar 19, 2015, at 5:26 PM, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> If you're blind, you obviously read Braille. Your hearing must naturally be
> superior to your sighted peers, and of course you have a guide dog! Right?
> 
> Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the first and second. Someone
> recently told me the number of guide dog users has actually declined in my
> millennial generation. I have no evidence proving this one way or the other,
> but for the general public, to see a blind person with a guide dog feels as
> natural as butter and toast.
> 
> Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for everyone. Or, maybe I'm
> just projecting my own uncertainties onto the rest of the community?
> 
> Last November I took the first step in the application process to return for
> a second Seeing Eye dog. It's been more than three years since I lost Gator,
> and even though I've gotten around just fine with a white cane, I am
> approaching what feels like the final years with sight, however minimal that
> sight might be. I admit it's unnerving if I sit still long enough to
> contemplate total blindness. NFB philosophy be damned, and the thought of an
> extra set of eyes to help me navigate the world does bring a measure of
> comfort. But, is it enough to go get another dog?
> 
> In no particular order, here are reasons why a guide dog would be a terrible
> idea:
> 
> Read more:
> 
> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-terrible-idea/
> 
> --
> Musings of a Work in Progress:
> www.JoeOrozco.com/
> 
> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com



From matt.dierckens at me.com  Fri Mar 20 01:50:07 2015
From: matt.dierckens at me.com (Matthew Dierckens)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 21:50:07 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <8C43A16F-2F20-4AA0-87E0-2024ECD9C49F@gmail.com>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>
	<8C43A16F-2F20-4AA0-87E0-2024ECD9C49F@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5E4FF8ED-4867-4A37-8313-B4A6D45EF83F@me.com>

I would have to agree with Aleeha and Min here.
As a soon to be handler, I found this post rather offensive and someone disturbing. Now, I understand that a dog may not be ideal for everyone, but there are better ways of letting people know that having a guide dog isn't always going to be cake and roses. If I were to read this, say, 6 years ago when I was first becoming interested in getting a dog, I would definitely be put off by reading this and would be second guessing my decision. There is a large difference between writing an opinion piece, and just plain garbage.
Just my two cense worth.

God bless. :)
Matthew Dierckens
Certified Assistive Technology Specialist
Macintosh, Windows and IOS  Trainer
Personal Email: matt.dierckens at me.com

> On Mar 19, 2015, at 21:29, Darian Smith via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> Thanks  Joe for sharing this.
> 
> If   your aim in the subject line is to get one’s attention than I’sure you’ve done it.  
> Knowing what I know, seeing what I’ve seen and understanding what I do, It seems like a very important thing to think about, the considerations   surrounding  getting a dog  guide.
>  There are many reasons why people might decide that a dog might be the best mobility tool for them (Yes, the dog  is an animal, but consider that when they are in   harness they are as much a travel tool as a cane would be. 
> A cane requires far less   moving parts in it’s usage   than a dog might,  and yet the dog  requires that you interact with your  physical environment  much less than a cane might.
> I  personally know of folks who love dogs, but would not    go to train for a guide   because of the responsibilities that come with the puppy.  I also know of folks who have gotten a dog guide  though otherwise they wouldn’t have a dog in their lives. 
>  I think  that though  I  may oversimplify the topic,  there       
>      ). are many reasons why a blind person may have either a cane or dog in their lives, though I personally believe that a solid  foundation in the former can be absolutely key in maximizing the ability to work the latter, there’s nothing wrong with deciding to get a dog.
> What I think Joe points out are valid reasons  why if you don’t really think it through then getting a dog guide could be a bad idea.  it’s not a  dig  and I doubt it  destroys  the image  of guide dogs, their owners and the schools they come from.
> This, however is just my humble opinion on the matter.
>  Best,
> Darian 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 5:26 PM, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> 
>> If you're blind, you obviously read Braille. Your hearing must naturally be
>> superior to your sighted peers, and of course you have a guide dog! Right?
>> 
>> Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the first and second. Someone
>> recently told me the number of guide dog users has actually declined in my
>> millennial generation. I have no evidence proving this one way or the other,
>> but for the general public, to see a blind person with a guide dog feels as
>> natural as butter and toast.
>> 
>> Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for everyone. Or, maybe I'm
>> just projecting my own uncertainties onto the rest of the community?
>> 
>> Last November I took the first step in the application process to return for
>> a second Seeing Eye dog. It's been more than three years since I lost Gator,
>> and even though I've gotten around just fine with a white cane, I am
>> approaching what feels like the final years with sight, however minimal that
>> sight might be. I admit it's unnerving if I sit still long enough to
>> contemplate total blindness. NFB philosophy be damned, and the thought of an
>> extra set of eyes to help me navigate the world does bring a measure of
>> comfort. But, is it enough to go get another dog?
>> 
>> In no particular order, here are reasons why a guide dog would be a terrible
>> idea:
>> 
>> Read more:
>> 
>> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-terrible-idea/
>> 
>> --
>> Musings of a Work in Progress:
>> www.JoeOrozco.com/
>> 
>> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/matt.dierckens%40me.com


From juanitaherrera1991 at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 01:52:29 2015
From: juanitaherrera1991 at gmail.com (Juanita Herrera)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 18:52:29 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <CAAJqG9je1EWhg88Fx-snXj2Ty172TY48k9OM3ZX-4L8ckjvchw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>
	<CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAAJqG9je1EWhg88Fx-snXj2Ty172TY48k9OM3ZX-4L8ckjvchw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BDB2A090-9AAF-49F1-88EE-EA5B06900860@gmail.com>

Being a guide dog user myself, I found the blog offensive and thought of how other guide dog handlers might feel. I didn't want to generalize like the blog seems to do but I felt that if I felt offended by it many other people would have too. I would have appreciated it more if somewhere in the blog post it would have been acknowledged that this was one person's opinion, and not make it seen as if though everyone possessed the same opinion. Being that I am a guide dog user and have been for three years, it has been one of the best experiences of my life. I would never change it for anything, and I don't consider going back to using a cane after I have to retire my dog. Therefore, I highly disagree with the blog post. However, I must reinstate that this is simply my opinion.
Juanita 

> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:28 PM, minh ha via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> I agree with Aleeha's sentiments one hundred percent. Over
> generalization is a huge mistake to do under any circumstances, and
> this blog post was offensive to me and other guide dog handlers on so
> many levels. If you want to write a fair and informative blog post
> about the guide dog lifestyle, then by all means, point out the
> negative aspects, but do not conveniently forget to mention the
> thousand of other more positive and beneficial impacts that a guide
> dog can have on a person's life. Yes, a guide dog is not the right
> choice for everyone and a blind person needs to think long and hard
> before getting one, but for the right reasons, a guide dog can
> completely turn someone's life around and give them the confidence in
> order to live life more productively. Honestly, your five reasons seem
> very childish, and i have to wonder if they are that important to you,
> then you should be contemplating about getting another guide dog at
> all.
> 
> Respectfully,
> Minh and my hard working little guide, Viva
> 
>> On 3/19/15, Aleeha Dudley via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> Personally, I find your subject line a bit offensive, as it assumes
>> that guide dogs are a terrible idea for everyone. Being the proud
>> handler of a wonderful dog myself, and a quite independent cane
>> traveller before that, I am a bit upset as what I find to be a
>> somewhat inflammatory post. You are right; guide dogs are not for
>> everyone. They are a huge responsibility and need a lot of daily care.
>> But to say that there are five reasons why a guide dog is a terrile
>> idea seems to be going too far, especially addressing such a large
>> body of people such as that on this list. Now, having clicked the link
>> and read the blog, I know that you are making an attempt to be fair
>> and point out the disadvantages, but to not point out that this was a
>> blog post or an opinion article, can make some folks pretty mad fairly
>> quickly. Can wa choose our words and subject lines a little more
>> wisely next time?
>> Aleha and Dallas, Seeing Eye dog extrordinaire
>> 
>>> On 3/19/15, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>> If you're blind, you obviously read Braille. Your hearing must naturally
>>> be
>>> superior to your sighted peers, and of course you have a guide dog!
>>> Right?
>>> 
>>> Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the first and second. Someone
>>> recently told me the number of guide dog users has actually declined in
>>> my
>>> millennial generation. I have no evidence proving this one way or the
>>> other,
>>> but for the general public, to see a blind person with a guide dog feels
>>> as
>>> natural as butter and toast.
>>> 
>>> Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for everyone. Or, maybe
>>> I'm
>>> just projecting my own uncertainties onto the rest of the community?
>>> 
>>> Last November I took the first step in the application process to return
>>> for
>>> a second Seeing Eye dog. It's been more than three years since I lost
>>> Gator,
>>> and even though I've gotten around just fine with a white cane, I am
>>> approaching what feels like the final years with sight, however minimal
>>> that
>>> sight might be. I admit it's unnerving if I sit still long enough to
>>> contemplate total blindness. NFB philosophy be damned, and the thought of
>>> an
>>> extra set of eyes to help me navigate the world does bring a measure of
>>> comfort. But, is it enough to go get another dog?
>>> 
>>> In no particular order, here are reasons why a guide dog would be a
>>> terrible
>>> idea:
>>> 
>>> Read more:
>>> 
>>> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-terrible-idea/
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Musings of a Work in Progress:
>>> www.JoeOrozco.com/
>>> 
>>> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> Aleeha Dudley and Seeing Eye Yellow Labrador Dallas
>> Vice President, Ohio Association of Blind Students
>> Email: blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com
>> Follow me on Twitter at @blindcowgirl199
>> 
>> The wind of heaven is that which blows between a horse's ears.
>> - Arabian Proverb
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/minh.ha927%40gmail.com
> 
> 
> -- 
> "All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty
> recesses of their minds, wake in the day to find that it was vanity:
> but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act on
> their dreams with open eyes, to make them possible." T. E. Lawrence
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/juanitaherrera1991%40gmail.com


From annajee82 at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 01:53:53 2015
From: annajee82 at gmail.com (Anna Givens)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 19:53:53 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Chemistry for the Blind
In-Reply-To: <CAF=_avftYN2M7C8eyH6W0xk9nf4-d12O-uwyXr8K-rCKPxPFkQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <BE6D5595-44B1-4429-8BE8-D30EF5FCAD47@gmail.com>
	<3A3A36B8-D983-4B50-BF82-991760E67B5B@gmail.com>
	<CAF=_avftYN2M7C8eyH6W0xk9nf4-d12O-uwyXr8K-rCKPxPFkQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <690BEAD5-B134-42F8-9A14-3281C06AB690@gmail.com>

Did you guys see my email reply?  Cuz I sent one earlier but I don't see it!

Anna E Givens

> On Mar 19, 2015, at 7:01 PM, Suzanne Germano via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi Becca
> 
> Tell you school there are blind chemists working in the the field.
> 
> On Thu, Mar 19, 2015 at 2:53 PM, Rebecca Weber via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> wrote:
> 
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 5:42 PM, Rebecca Weber <weberrebecca232 at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hello NABS.
>>> This is my first email on this list. Let me say that it’s awesome to
>> find a list that is designed for blind students. We are raising expetations
>> everyday.
>>> My name is Becca Weber and I attend Archbishop John Carroll High School
>> in Pennsylvania. I have had a lot of frustrations here, particularly with
>> my team. I feel that they focus too much on vision. So, that’s why I’m
>> reaching out to you. I am wanting to take chemistry next year, but this has
>> been shut down because of safety reasons. I would like to point out that I
>> have, I believe, 20-500 vision. I think, so this may be different. I have
>> cooked by myself with no help at all sometimes. I am wondering how a blind
>> student could take chemistry?
>>> I have some iddeas
>>> -bottles of chemicals could be labeled in braille
>>> -measuring chemicals with a caring
>>> -Having a partner to describe the chemicals to me, but I can see color
>>> -using a device called a math quest I think.
>>> Anything else please email me.
>>> Thank you so much for your help.
>>> Have a nice day.
>>> Becca
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sgermano%40asu.edu
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/annajee82%40gmail.com


From blindstein at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 02:20:38 2015
From: blindstein at gmail.com (Justin Harford)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 19:20:38 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <BDB2A090-9AAF-49F1-88EE-EA5B06900860@gmail.com>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>
	<CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAAJqG9je1EWhg88Fx-snXj2Ty172TY48k9OM3ZX-4L8ckjvchw@mail.gmail.com>
	<BDB2A090-9AAF-49F1-88EE-EA5B06900860@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1AD31DFB-D5F6-4242-949E-EE77DC6B8F9F@gmail.com>

At first, this looked like a trolling post, but after I actually read the article, I  enjoyed it. 

It is a very frank and honest examination of the positives and negatives of one individual's experience with a guide dog, and clearly reads as the opinion of one person.

Regards
Justin



> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:52 PM, Juanita Herrera via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Being a guide dog user myself, I found the blog offensive and thought of how other guide dog handlers might feel. I didn't want to generalize like the blog seems to do but I felt that if I felt offended by it many other people would have too. I would have appreciated it more if somewhere in the blog post it would have been acknowledged that this was one person's opinion, and not make it seen as if though everyone possessed the same opinion. Being that I am a guide dog user and have been for three years, it has been one of the best experiences of my life. I would never change it for anything, and I don't consider going back to using a cane after I have to retire my dog. Therefore, I highly disagree with the blog post. However, I must reinstate that this is simply my opinion.
> Juanita 
> 
>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:28 PM, minh ha via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> 
>> I agree with Aleeha's sentiments one hundred percent. Over
>> generalization is a huge mistake to do under any circumstances, and
>> this blog post was offensive to me and other guide dog handlers on so
>> many levels. If you want to write a fair and informative blog post
>> about the guide dog lifestyle, then by all means, point out the
>> negative aspects, but do not conveniently forget to mention the
>> thousand of other more positive and beneficial impacts that a guide
>> dog can have on a person's life. Yes, a guide dog is not the right
>> choice for everyone and a blind person needs to think long and hard
>> before getting one, but for the right reasons, a guide dog can
>> completely turn someone's life around and give them the confidence in
>> order to live life more productively. Honestly, your five reasons seem
>> very childish, and i have to wonder if they are that important to you,
>> then you should be contemplating about getting another guide dog at
>> all.
>> 
>> Respectfully,
>> Minh and my hard working little guide, Viva
>> 
>>> On 3/19/15, Aleeha Dudley via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>> Personally, I find your subject line a bit offensive, as it assumes
>>> that guide dogs are a terrible idea for everyone. Being the proud
>>> handler of a wonderful dog myself, and a quite independent cane
>>> traveller before that, I am a bit upset as what I find to be a
>>> somewhat inflammatory post. You are right; guide dogs are not for
>>> everyone. They are a huge responsibility and need a lot of daily care.
>>> But to say that there are five reasons why a guide dog is a terrile
>>> idea seems to be going too far, especially addressing such a large
>>> body of people such as that on this list. Now, having clicked the link
>>> and read the blog, I know that you are making an attempt to be fair
>>> and point out the disadvantages, but to not point out that this was a
>>> blog post or an opinion article, can make some folks pretty mad fairly
>>> quickly. Can wa choose our words and subject lines a little more
>>> wisely next time?
>>> Aleha and Dallas, Seeing Eye dog extrordinaire
>>> 
>>>> On 3/19/15, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>> If you're blind, you obviously read Braille. Your hearing must naturally
>>>> be
>>>> superior to your sighted peers, and of course you have a guide dog!
>>>> Right?
>>>> 
>>>> Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the first and second. Someone
>>>> recently told me the number of guide dog users has actually declined in
>>>> my
>>>> millennial generation. I have no evidence proving this one way or the
>>>> other,
>>>> but for the general public, to see a blind person with a guide dog feels
>>>> as
>>>> natural as butter and toast.
>>>> 
>>>> Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for everyone. Or, maybe
>>>> I'm
>>>> just projecting my own uncertainties onto the rest of the community?
>>>> 
>>>> Last November I took the first step in the application process to return
>>>> for
>>>> a second Seeing Eye dog. It's been more than three years since I lost
>>>> Gator,
>>>> and even though I've gotten around just fine with a white cane, I am
>>>> approaching what feels like the final years with sight, however minimal
>>>> that
>>>> sight might be. I admit it's unnerving if I sit still long enough to
>>>> contemplate total blindness. NFB philosophy be damned, and the thought of
>>>> an
>>>> extra set of eyes to help me navigate the world does bring a measure of
>>>> comfort. But, is it enough to go get another dog?
>>>> 
>>>> In no particular order, here are reasons why a guide dog would be a
>>>> terrible
>>>> idea:
>>>> 
>>>> Read more:
>>>> 
>>>> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-terrible-idea/
>>>> 
>>>> --
>>>> Musings of a Work in Progress:
>>>> www.JoeOrozco.com/
>>>> 
>>>> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Aleeha Dudley and Seeing Eye Yellow Labrador Dallas
>>> Vice President, Ohio Association of Blind Students
>>> Email: blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com
>>> Follow me on Twitter at @blindcowgirl199
>>> 
>>> The wind of heaven is that which blows between a horse's ears.
>>> - Arabian Proverb
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/minh.ha927%40gmail.com
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> "All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty
>> recesses of their minds, wake in the day to find that it was vanity:
>> but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act on
>> their dreams with open eyes, to make them possible." T. E. Lawrence
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/juanitaherrera1991%40gmail.com
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
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From sweetpeareader at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 02:34:43 2015
From: sweetpeareader at gmail.com (Sophie Trist)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 21:34:43 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
Message-ID: <550b8751.451f460a.4ceb.ffffebe9@mx.google.com>

Hi=20all,

I=20am=20a=20senior=20in=20high=20school,=20planning=20to=20attend=20LCB=20=
next=20year.=20I=20
am=20also=20hearing=20impaired=20and=20thus=20have=20to=20wear=20a=20hearin=
g=20aid.=20
During=20my=20O&M=20lessons=20at=20school,=20I've=20discovered=20that=20tho=
ugh=20I=20
can=20hear=20perfectly=20well=20when=20a=20car=20is=20coming,=20my=20hearin=
g=20aid=20
makes=20it=20difficult=20to=20localize=20that=20sound.=20I=20haven't=20made=
=20a=20final=20
decision=20as=20to=20whether=20I=20will=20get=20a=20dog--that=20will=20wait=
=20until=20
after=20my=20LCB=20training--but=20I=20believe=20that=20because=20of=20my=20=
hearing=20
problem,=20it=20would=20make=20me=20safer.
=20=20=20=20=20That's=20my=20personal=20story.=20I=20don't=20really=20see=20=
why=20this=20blog=20
is=20"offensive"=20or=20"garbage"=20as=20previous=20posts=20have=20stated.=
=20The=20
subject=20line=20is=20definitely=20an=20attention=20getter,=20especially=20=
for=20
someone=20like=20me=20who=20just=20skims=20through=20their=20Inbox.=20Every=
one=20is=20
entitled=20to=20their=20own=20opinion,=20even=20if=20others=20don't=20share=
=20it.=20The=20
five=20reasons,=20far=20from=20being=20childish,=20are=20valid.=20When=20ma=
king=20a=20
decision,=20it's=20important=20to=20know=20all=20of=20the=20factors=20befor=
ehand=20so=20
that=20you=20can=20make=20a=20logical=20and=20fully=20informed=20decision.=
=20With=20
regard=20to=20the=20letting=20the=20dog=20out=20and=20cleaning=20up=20after=
=20it=20part,=20
that=20applies=20to=20any=20kind=20of=20dog.=20I=20personally=20have=20two=
=20dogs=20at=20my=20
house=20right=20now,=20and=20we=20have=20to=20do=20those=20things,=20someti=
mes=20
getting=20up=20at=204:00=20in=20the=20morning=20when=20they=20start=20cryin=
g=20to=20go=20
out.=20This=20is=20just=20my=20opinion.=20Have=20a=20good=20Friday!

Yours,
Sophie

=20-----=20Original=20Message=20-----
From:=20Matthew=20Dierckens=20via=20nabs-l=20<nabs-l at nfbnet.org
To:=20Darian=20Smith=20<dsmithnfb at gmail.com>,National=20Association=20of=20=

Blind=20Students=20mailing=20list=20<nabs-l at nfbnet.org
Date=20sent:=20Thu,=2019=20Mar=202015=2021:50:07=20-0400
Subject:=20Re:=20[nabs-l]=205=20Reasons=20Why=20Guide=20Dogs=20Are=20a=20Te=
rrible=20
Idea!

I=20would=20have=20to=20agree=20with=20Aleeha=20and=20Min=20here.
As=20a=20soon=20to=20be=20handler,=20I=20found=20this=20post=20rather=20off=
ensive=20and=20
someone=20disturbing.=20Now,=20I=20understand=20that=20a=20dog=20may=20not=
=20be=20ideal=20
for=20everyone,=20but=20there=20are=20better=20ways=20of=20letting=20people=
=20know=20
that=20having=20a=20guide=20dog=20isn't=20always=20going=20to=20be=20cake=20=
and=20roses.=20
If=20I=20were=20to=20read=20this,=20say,=206=20years=20ago=20when=20I=20was=
=20first=20
becoming=20interested=20in=20getting=20a=20dog,=20I=20would=20definitely=20=
be=20put=20
off=20by=20reading=20this=20and=20would=20be=20second=20guessing=20my=20dec=
ision.=20
There=20is=20a=20large=20difference=20between=20writing=20an=20opinion=20pi=
ece,=20and=20
just=20plain=20garbage.
Just=20my=20two=20cense=20worth.

God=20bless.=20:)
Matthew=20Dierckens
Certified=20Assistive=20Technology=20Specialist
Macintosh,=20Windows=20and=20IOS=20=20Trainer
Personal=20Email:=20matt.dierckens at me.com

=20On=20Mar=2019,=202015,=20at=2021:29,=20Darian=20Smith=20via=20nabs-l=20
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>=20wrote:

=20Hi=20all,
=20Thanks=20=20Joe=20for=20sharing=20this.

=20If=20=20=20your=20aim=20in=20the=20subject=20line=20is=20to=20get=20one=
=E2=80=99s=20attention=20
than=20I=E2=80=99sure=20you=E2=80=99ve=20done=20it.
=20Knowing=20what=20I=20know,=20seeing=20what=20I=E2=80=99ve=20seen=20and=20=
understanding=20
what=20I=20do,=20It=20seems=20like=20a=20very=20important=20thing=20to=20th=
ink=20about,=20
the=20considerations=20=20=20surrounding=20=20getting=20a=20dog=20=20guide.=

=20=20There=20are=20many=20reasons=20why=20people=20might=20decide=20that=20=
a=20dog=20might=20
be=20the=20best=20mobility=20tool=20for=20them=20(Yes,=20the=20dog=20=20is=
=20an=20animal,=20
but=20consider=20that=20when=20they=20are=20in=20=20=20harness=20they=20are=
=20as=20much=20a=20
travel=20tool=20as=20a=20cane=20would=20be.
=20A=20cane=20requires=20far=20less=20=20=20moving=20parts=20in=20it=E2=80=
=99s=20usage=20=20=20than=20a=20
dog=20might,=20=20and=20yet=20the=20dog=20=20requires=20that=20you=20intera=
ct=20with=20your=20=20
physical=20environment=20=20much=20less=20than=20a=20cane=20might.
=20I=20=20personally=20know=20of=20folks=20who=20love=20dogs,=20but=20would=
=20not=20=20=20=20go=20
to=20train=20for=20a=20guide=20=20=20because=20of=20the=20responsibilities=
=20that=20come=20
with=20the=20puppy.=20=20I=20also=20know=20of=20folks=20who=20have=20gotten=
=20a=20dog=20guide=20=20
though=20otherwise=20they=20wouldn=E2=80=99t=20have=20a=20dog=20in=20their=
=20lives.
=20=20I=20think=20=20that=20though=20=20I=20=20may=20oversimplify=20the=20t=
opic,=20=20there
=20=20=20=20=20=20).=20are=20many=20reasons=20why=20a=20blind=20person=20ma=
y=20have=20either=20a=20
cane=20or=20dog=20in=20their=20lives,=20though=20I=20personally=20believe=20=
that=20a=20
solid=20=20foundation=20in=20the=20former=20can=20be=20absolutely=20key=20i=
n=20
maximizing=20the=20ability=20to=20work=20the=20latter,=20there=E2=80=99s=20=
nothing=20
wrong=20with=20deciding=20to=20get=20a=20dog.
=20What=20I=20think=20Joe=20points=20out=20are=20valid=20reasons=20=20why=20=
if=20you=20
don=E2=80=99t=20really=20think=20it=20through=20then=20getting=20a=20dog=20=
guide=20could=20be=20
a=20bad=20idea.=20=20it=E2=80=99s=20not=20a=20=20dig=20=20and=20I=20doubt=20=
it=20=20destroys=20=20the=20
image=20=20of=20guide=20dogs,=20their=20owners=20and=20the=20schools=20they=
=20come=20
from.
=20This,=20however=20is=20just=20my=20humble=20opinion=20on=20the=20matter.=

=20=20Best,
=20Darian



=20On=20Mar=2019,=202015,=20at=205:26=20PM,=20Joe=20via=20nabs-l=20<nabs-l@=
nfbnet.org>=20
wrote:

=20If=20you're=20blind,=20you=20obviously=20read=20Braille.=20Your=20hearin=
g=20must=20
naturally=20be
=20superior=20to=20your=20sighted=20peers,=20and=20of=20course=20you=20have=
=20a=20guide=20
dog!=20Right?

=20Well,=20that=20last=20may=20not=20be=20as=20pervasive=20as=20the=20first=
=20and=20second.=20
Someone
=20recently=20told=20me=20the=20number=20of=20guide=20dog=20users=20has=20a=
ctually=20
declined=20in=20my
=20millennial=20generation.=20I=20have=20no=20evidence=20proving=20this=20o=
ne=20way=20
or=20the=20other,
=20but=20for=20the=20general=20public,=20to=20see=20a=20blind=20person=20wi=
th=20a=20guide=20
dog=20feels=20as
=20natural=20as=20butter=20and=20toast.

=20Thing=20is,=20I'm=20not=20so=20sure=20guide=20dogs=20are=20right=20for=20=
everyone.=20Or,=20
maybe=20I'm
=20just=20projecting=20my=20own=20uncertainties=20onto=20the=20rest=20of=20=
the=20
community?

=20Last=20November=20I=20took=20the=20first=20step=20in=20the=20application=
=20process=20
to=20return=20for
=20a=20second=20Seeing=20Eye=20dog.=20It's=20been=20more=20than=20three=20y=
ears=20since=20I=20
lost=20Gator,
=20and=20even=20though=20I've=20gotten=20around=20just=20fine=20with=20a=20=
white=20cane,=20
I=20am
=20approaching=20what=20feels=20like=20the=20final=20years=20with=20sight,=
=20however=20
minimal=20that
=20sight=20might=20be.=20I=20admit=20it's=20unnerving=20if=20I=20sit=20stil=
l=20long=20
enough=20to
=20contemplate=20total=20blindness.=20NFB=20philosophy=20be=20damned,=20and=
=20the=20
thought=20of=20an
=20extra=20set=20of=20eyes=20to=20help=20me=20navigate=20the=20world=20does=
=20bring=20a=20
measure=20of
=20comfort.=20But,=20is=20it=20enough=20to=20go=20get=20another=20dog?

=20In=20no=20particular=20order,=20here=20are=20reasons=20why=20a=20guide=20=
dog=20would=20
be=20a=20terrible
=20idea:

=20Read=20more:

=20
http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-ter
rible-idea/

=20--
=20Musings=20of=20a=20Work=20in=20Progress:
=20www.JoeOrozco.com/

=20Twitter:=20 at ScribblingJoe




=20_______________________________________________
=20nabs-l=20mailing=20list
=20nabs-l at nfbnet.org
=20http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
=20To=20unsubscribe,=20change=20your=20list=20options=20or=20get=20your=20a=
ccount=20
info=20for=20nabs-l:
=20
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40g
mail.com


=20_______________________________________________
=20nabs-l=20mailing=20list
=20nabs-l at nfbnet.org
=20http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
=20To=20unsubscribe,=20change=20your=20list=20options=20or=20get=20your=20a=
ccount=20
info=20for=20nabs-l:
=20
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/matt.diercken
s%40me.com

_______________________________________________
nabs-l=20mailing=20list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To=20unsubscribe,=20change=20your=20list=20options=20or=20get=20your=20acco=
unt=20info=20
for=20nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade
r%40gmail.com



From lilliepennington at fuse.net  Fri Mar 20 02:50:56 2015
From: lilliepennington at fuse.net (Lillie Pennington)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 22:50:56 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Chemistry for the Blind
In-Reply-To: <690BEAD5-B134-42F8-9A14-3281C06AB690@gmail.com>
References: <BE6D5595-44B1-4429-8BE8-D30EF5FCAD47@gmail.com>
	<3A3A36B8-D983-4B50-BF82-991760E67B5B@gmail.com>
	<CAF=_avftYN2M7C8eyH6W0xk9nf4-d12O-uwyXr8K-rCKPxPFkQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<690BEAD5-B134-42F8-9A14-3281C06AB690@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <A8A92258-2AE8-4EF6-9031-4AB51286B86A@fuse.net>

Your reply went through.


I am currently taking high school chemistry right now. As others have said, it is a lot about math. I generally do what others have done and mentioned. Let me know if you have any questions.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 19, 2015, at 9:53 PM, Anna Givens via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Did you guys see my email reply?  Cuz I sent one earlier but I don't see it!
> 
> Anna E Givens
> 
>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 7:01 PM, Suzanne Germano via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Becca
>> 
>> Tell you school there are blind chemists working in the the field.
>> 
>> On Thu, Mar 19, 2015 at 2:53 PM, Rebecca Weber via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> wrote:
>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 5:42 PM, Rebecca Weber <weberrebecca232 at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Hello NABS.
>>>> This is my first email on this list. Let me say that it’s awesome to
>>> find a list that is designed for blind students. We are raising expetations
>>> everyday.
>>>> My name is Becca Weber and I attend Archbishop John Carroll High School
>>> in Pennsylvania. I have had a lot of frustrations here, particularly with
>>> my team. I feel that they focus too much on vision. So, that’s why I’m
>>> reaching out to you. I am wanting to take chemistry next year, but this has
>>> been shut down because of safety reasons. I would like to point out that I
>>> have, I believe, 20-500 vision. I think, so this may be different. I have
>>> cooked by myself with no help at all sometimes. I am wondering how a blind
>>> student could take chemistry?
>>>> I have some iddeas
>>>> -bottles of chemicals could be labeled in braille
>>>> -measuring chemicals with a caring
>>>> -Having a partner to describe the chemicals to me, but I can see color
>>>> -using a device called a math quest I think.
>>>> Anything else please email me.
>>>> Thank you so much for your help.
>>>> Have a nice day.
>>>> Becca
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sgermano%40asu.edu
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/annajee82%40gmail.com
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
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From tyler at tysdomain.com  Fri Mar 20 03:17:56 2015
From: tyler at tysdomain.com (Littlefield, Tyler)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 23:17:56 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <1AD31DFB-D5F6-4242-949E-EE77DC6B8F9F@gmail.com>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>	<CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>	<CAAJqG9je1EWhg88Fx-snXj2Ty172TY48k9OM3ZX-4L8ckjvchw@mail.gmail.com>	<BDB2A090-9AAF-49F1-88EE-EA5B06900860@gmail.com>
	<1AD31DFB-D5F6-4242-949E-EE77DC6B8F9F@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <550B9164.8070103@tysdomain.com>

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Hash: SHA1

Positives? You can summarize this up in 5 really fast points. I seen
no positives and really, the negatives aren't huge drawbacks that were
listed.
I mean, if you want to tell people not to get a dog, you surely can do
better than that.

But I'll address each of these points in turn.
1. It’s expensive!
It can be, yes. There are programs like GDB offers to help with vet
bills, so the food and grooming are really all I have to pay for. That
and toys, which we probably spend way to much money on. More money
than I would usually spend? Certainly, but it's nowhere near a lot
(and I'm a student living on a budget). It's also well worth the money.

2. It’s inconvenient!
Yes, taking your dog out must be such hard work. Wait, I do it every
day, what am i talking about? It's not fun when you're sick and yes,
finding a trash can be kind of tough. That's why O'Mally and Minh's
viva know "find the trash." That's also when social skills come into
play. "Excuse me mam, do you see a trashcan nearby?" Works every time.
If you're at an unfamiliar hotel, you just ask at the front desk and
they're usually pretty cool about it. Airports also have relieving
areas. Unless you travel twice a week, a couple hours of slightly less
leg room (and I'm fairly tall) is really not that big of a deal.

3. It’s time-consuming!
Yes, having a dog does take time. You'd think this would be inherently
obvious, but it was needed to be pointed out here. You don't need to
go for 12 mile runs, O'mally and I have left today to relieve and that
was pretty much it. I played with him and listened to a book and sat
with him on the floor for a bit. He's totally happy and hasn't
demolished anything.

4. It’s unwelcomed attention!
I find it kind of funny you're talking about being covert and not
making a name for yourself with complaints when the NFB files more
lawsuits than I can keep up with. But beyond that, I've never been
turned down from eating because I have a dog. Cabs, certainly; we all
have. If an establishment turns me down, I'll make sure that people
know they did it and they're not treating me equally. Just because I'm
blind doesn't mean I should sit in the corner and hope that things get
better; I want to educate people. I've had a lot of really amazing
people come up and talk to me and ask questions about my guide. It
certainly does get a bit trying at times, but in no way is it a huge
problem. I am sorry however if you're not the center of the topics and
people do ask about your dog. It happens.

5. It can be dirty work!
Best not ever get sick by yourself then, or have kids, or anything
else. Yes, it can be tough. If you're squeamish maybe it's not for
you. Cleaning up doggy vomit really isn't the best part of my day, but
you do it. mostly because these dogs do so much for you and if O'mally
is sick I'm worried about him and just want him to get better. You do
it because you love your dog.

"If you were contemplating a dog, came across this post and felt
discouraged, you should not get a dog. It’s a lot of work. It’s a lot
of responsibility.
It’s constant care and attention and a commitment to keep up the dog’s
level of training. No one will fault you for being mature enough to
walk away."

So let me sum this up: expensive; inconvenient; time-consuming;
unwelcome attention; messy work. Yeah, I'd say you probably shouldn't
have a dog. Please though, do try to at least provide constructive and
good information on both sides of this issue. The issues you raised
were incredibly self-centered, rude, generalizing and really didn't
convey any issues beyond negative criticism.

My guide does amazing work each and every day. when I pick up his
harness, he's by my side, tail wagging ready to work for me. He only
asks that I give him love, attention and take care of him with vet
visits, grooming and toys. Given the amount of travel that he has
enabled me to do (I am and was proficient with a cane), I think it
only fitting that I pay for his food, give him attention, clean up
after him when he's sick and treat him well. My guide loves me, no
questions asked. while I somewhat understand these points, I think
anyone who has actually had a guide would really agree that they are
huge issues that should prevent you from getting one.

At first, this looked like a trolling post; it still feels like a
trolling post.

Be well,
Ty
On 3/19/2015 10:20 PM, Justin Harford via nabs-l wrote:
> At first, this looked like a trolling post, but after I actually
> read the article, I  enjoyed it.
> 
> It is a very frank and honest examination of the positives and
> negatives of one individual's experience with a guide dog, and
> clearly reads as the opinion of one person.
> 
> Regards Justin
> 
> 
> 
>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:52 PM, Juanita Herrera via nabs-l
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Being a guide dog user myself, I found the blog offensive and
>> thought of how other guide dog handlers might feel. I didn't want
>> to generalize like the blog seems to do but I felt that if I felt
>> offended by it many other people would have too. I would have
>> appreciated it more if somewhere in the blog post it would have
>> been acknowledged that this was one person's opinion, and not
>> make it seen as if though everyone possessed the same opinion.
>> Being that I am a guide dog user and have been for three years,
>> it has been one of the best experiences of my life. I would never
>> change it for anything, and I don't consider going back to using
>> a cane after I have to retire my dog. Therefore, I highly
>> disagree with the blog post. However, I must reinstate that this
>> is simply my opinion. Juanita
>> 
>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:28 PM, minh ha via nabs-l
>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> I agree with Aleeha's sentiments one hundred percent. Over 
>>> generalization is a huge mistake to do under any circumstances,
>>> and this blog post was offensive to me and other guide dog
>>> handlers on so many levels. If you want to write a fair and
>>> informative blog post about the guide dog lifestyle, then by
>>> all means, point out the negative aspects, but do not
>>> conveniently forget to mention the thousand of other more
>>> positive and beneficial impacts that a guide dog can have on a
>>> person's life. Yes, a guide dog is not the right choice for
>>> everyone and a blind person needs to think long and hard before
>>> getting one, but for the right reasons, a guide dog can 
>>> completely turn someone's life around and give them the
>>> confidence in order to live life more productively. Honestly,
>>> your five reasons seem very childish, and i have to wonder if
>>> they are that important to you, then you should be
>>> contemplating about getting another guide dog at all.
>>> 
>>> Respectfully, Minh and my hard working little guide, Viva
>>> 
>>>> On 3/19/15, Aleeha Dudley via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>> wrote: Personally, I find your subject line a bit offensive,
>>>> as it assumes that guide dogs are a terrible idea for
>>>> everyone. Being the proud handler of a wonderful dog myself,
>>>> and a quite independent cane traveller before that, I am a
>>>> bit upset as what I find to be a somewhat inflammatory post.
>>>> You are right; guide dogs are not for everyone. They are a
>>>> huge responsibility and need a lot of daily care. But to say
>>>> that there are five reasons why a guide dog is a terrile idea
>>>> seems to be going too far, especially addressing such a
>>>> large body of people such as that on this list. Now, having
>>>> clicked the link and read the blog, I know that you are
>>>> making an attempt to be fair and point out the disadvantages,
>>>> but to not point out that this was a blog post or an opinion
>>>> article, can make some folks pretty mad fairly quickly. Can
>>>> wa choose our words and subject lines a little more wisely
>>>> next time? Aleha and Dallas, Seeing Eye dog extrordinaire
>>>> 
>>>>> On 3/19/15, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote: If
>>>>> you're blind, you obviously read Braille. Your hearing must
>>>>> naturally be superior to your sighted peers, and of course
>>>>> you have a guide dog! Right?
>>>>> 
>>>>> Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the first and
>>>>> second. Someone recently told me the number of guide dog
>>>>> users has actually declined in my millennial generation. I
>>>>> have no evidence proving this one way or the other, but for
>>>>> the general public, to see a blind person with a guide dog
>>>>> feels as natural as butter and toast.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for
>>>>> everyone. Or, maybe I'm just projecting my own
>>>>> uncertainties onto the rest of the community?
>>>>> 
>>>>> Last November I took the first step in the application
>>>>> process to return for a second Seeing Eye dog. It's been
>>>>> more than three years since I lost Gator, and even though
>>>>> I've gotten around just fine with a white cane, I am 
>>>>> approaching what feels like the final years with sight,
>>>>> however minimal that sight might be. I admit it's unnerving
>>>>> if I sit still long enough to contemplate total blindness.
>>>>> NFB philosophy be damned, and the thought of an extra set
>>>>> of eyes to help me navigate the world does bring a measure
>>>>> of comfort. But, is it enough to go get another dog?
>>>>> 
>>>>> In no particular order, here are reasons why a guide dog
>>>>> would be a terrible idea:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Read more:
>>>>> 
>>>>> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-terrible-idea/
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 
- --
>>>>> Musings of a Work in Progress: www.JoeOrozco.com/
>>>>> 
>>>>> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l
>>>>> mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org 
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>> info for nabs-l: 
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> 
- --
>>>> Aleeha Dudley and Seeing Eye Yellow Labrador Dallas Vice
>>>> President, Ohio Association of Blind Students Email:
>>>> blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com Follow me on Twitter at
>>>> @blindcowgirl199
>>>> 
>>>> The wind of heaven is that which blows between a horse's
>>>> ears. - Arabian Proverb
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l
>>>> mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org 
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>> info for nabs-l: 
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/minh.ha927%40gmail.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> 
- -- 
>>> "All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in
>>> the dusty recesses of their minds, wake in the day to find that
>>> it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men,
>>> for they may act on their dreams with open eyes, to make them
>>> possible." T. E. Lawrence
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing
>>> list nabs-l at nfbnet.org 
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>> for nabs-l: 
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/juanitaherrera1991%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>>> 
_______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org 
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for nabs-l: 
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindstein%40gmail.com
>
>> 
> _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing
> list nabs-l at nfbnet.org 
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l: 
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/tyler%40tysdomain.com
>
> 
- -- 
Take care,
Ty
twitter: @sorressean
web:http://tysdomain.com
pubkey: http://tysdomain.com/files/pubkey.asc
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From brice.smith319 at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 03:41:52 2015
From: brice.smith319 at gmail.com (Brice Smith)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 23:41:52 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <550B9164.8070103@tysdomain.com>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>
	<CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAAJqG9je1EWhg88Fx-snXj2Ty172TY48k9OM3ZX-4L8ckjvchw@mail.gmail.com>
	<BDB2A090-9AAF-49F1-88EE-EA5B06900860@gmail.com>
	<1AD31DFB-D5F6-4242-949E-EE77DC6B8F9F@gmail.com>
	<550B9164.8070103@tysdomain.com>
Message-ID: <CAL=h+uj9=QcYboRbA=4oo4yQY-cytrfFL1qGrY9_45f898Nqkg@mail.gmail.com>

Did those of you who feel offended actually read the blog,
particularly the explanations under the heading, "Damn! Any Words of
Encouragement?"

The subject line is purposely and brilliantly provocative--the kind
that gathers almost a dozen responses in just a couple of hours. Joe
clearly understands how to use rhetoric to make a compelling argument,
and some of the knee-jerk reactions on this list to this post were
disappointing.


Brice



On 3/19/15, Littlefield, Tyler via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> Positives? You can summarize this up in 5 really fast points. I seen
> no positives and really, the negatives aren't huge drawbacks that were
> listed.
> I mean, if you want to tell people not to get a dog, you surely can do
> better than that.
>
> But I'll address each of these points in turn.
> 1. It's expensive!
> It can be, yes. There are programs like GDB offers to help with vet
> bills, so the food and grooming are really all I have to pay for. That
> and toys, which we probably spend way to much money on. More money
> than I would usually spend? Certainly, but it's nowhere near a lot
> (and I'm a student living on a budget). It's also well worth the money.
>
> 2. It's inconvenient!
> Yes, taking your dog out must be such hard work. Wait, I do it every
> day, what am i talking about? It's not fun when you're sick and yes,
> finding a trash can be kind of tough. That's why O'Mally and Minh's
> viva know "find the trash." That's also when social skills come into
> play. "Excuse me mam, do you see a trashcan nearby?" Works every time.
> If you're at an unfamiliar hotel, you just ask at the front desk and
> they're usually pretty cool about it. Airports also have relieving
> areas. Unless you travel twice a week, a couple hours of slightly less
> leg room (and I'm fairly tall) is really not that big of a deal.
>
> 3. It's time-consuming!
> Yes, having a dog does take time. You'd think this would be inherently
> obvious, but it was needed to be pointed out here. You don't need to
> go for 12 mile runs, O'mally and I have left today to relieve and that
> was pretty much it. I played with him and listened to a book and sat
> with him on the floor for a bit. He's totally happy and hasn't
> demolished anything.
>
> 4. It's unwelcomed attention!
> I find it kind of funny you're talking about being covert and not
> making a name for yourself with complaints when the NFB files more
> lawsuits than I can keep up with. But beyond that, I've never been
> turned down from eating because I have a dog. Cabs, certainly; we all
> have. If an establishment turns me down, I'll make sure that people
> know they did it and they're not treating me equally. Just because I'm
> blind doesn't mean I should sit in the corner and hope that things get
> better; I want to educate people. I've had a lot of really amazing
> people come up and talk to me and ask questions about my guide. It
> certainly does get a bit trying at times, but in no way is it a huge
> problem. I am sorry however if you're not the center of the topics and
> people do ask about your dog. It happens.
>
> 5. It can be dirty work!
> Best not ever get sick by yourself then, or have kids, or anything
> else. Yes, it can be tough. If you're squeamish maybe it's not for
> you. Cleaning up doggy vomit really isn't the best part of my day, but
> you do it. mostly because these dogs do so much for you and if O'mally
> is sick I'm worried about him and just want him to get better. You do
> it because you love your dog.
>
> "If you were contemplating a dog, came across this post and felt
> discouraged, you should not get a dog. It's a lot of work. It's a lot
> of responsibility.
> It's constant care and attention and a commitment to keep up the dog's
> level of training. No one will fault you for being mature enough to
> walk away."
>
> So let me sum this up: expensive; inconvenient; time-consuming;
> unwelcome attention; messy work. Yeah, I'd say you probably shouldn't
> have a dog. Please though, do try to at least provide constructive and
> good information on both sides of this issue. The issues you raised
> were incredibly self-centered, rude, generalizing and really didn't
> convey any issues beyond negative criticism.
>
> My guide does amazing work each and every day. when I pick up his
> harness, he's by my side, tail wagging ready to work for me. He only
> asks that I give him love, attention and take care of him with vet
> visits, grooming and toys. Given the amount of travel that he has
> enabled me to do (I am and was proficient with a cane), I think it
> only fitting that I pay for his food, give him attention, clean up
> after him when he's sick and treat him well. My guide loves me, no
> questions asked. while I somewhat understand these points, I think
> anyone who has actually had a guide would really agree that they are
> huge issues that should prevent you from getting one.
>
> At first, this looked like a trolling post; it still feels like a
> trolling post.
>
> Be well,
> Ty
> On 3/19/2015 10:20 PM, Justin Harford via nabs-l wrote:
>> At first, this looked like a trolling post, but after I actually
>> read the article, I  enjoyed it.
>>
>> It is a very frank and honest examination of the positives and
>> negatives of one individual's experience with a guide dog, and
>> clearly reads as the opinion of one person.
>>
>> Regards Justin
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:52 PM, Juanita Herrera via nabs-l
>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> Being a guide dog user myself, I found the blog offensive and
>>> thought of how other guide dog handlers might feel. I didn't want
>>> to generalize like the blog seems to do but I felt that if I felt
>>> offended by it many other people would have too. I would have
>>> appreciated it more if somewhere in the blog post it would have
>>> been acknowledged that this was one person's opinion, and not
>>> make it seen as if though everyone possessed the same opinion.
>>> Being that I am a guide dog user and have been for three years,
>>> it has been one of the best experiences of my life. I would never
>>> change it for anything, and I don't consider going back to using
>>> a cane after I have to retire my dog. Therefore, I highly
>>> disagree with the blog post. However, I must reinstate that this
>>> is simply my opinion. Juanita
>>>
>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:28 PM, minh ha via nabs-l
>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I agree with Aleeha's sentiments one hundred percent. Over
>>>> generalization is a huge mistake to do under any circumstances,
>>>> and this blog post was offensive to me and other guide dog
>>>> handlers on so many levels. If you want to write a fair and
>>>> informative blog post about the guide dog lifestyle, then by
>>>> all means, point out the negative aspects, but do not
>>>> conveniently forget to mention the thousand of other more
>>>> positive and beneficial impacts that a guide dog can have on a
>>>> person's life. Yes, a guide dog is not the right choice for
>>>> everyone and a blind person needs to think long and hard before
>>>> getting one, but for the right reasons, a guide dog can
>>>> completely turn someone's life around and give them the
>>>> confidence in order to live life more productively. Honestly,
>>>> your five reasons seem very childish, and i have to wonder if
>>>> they are that important to you, then you should be
>>>> contemplating about getting another guide dog at all.
>>>>
>>>> Respectfully, Minh and my hard working little guide, Viva
>>>>
>>>>> On 3/19/15, Aleeha Dudley via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> wrote: Personally, I find your subject line a bit offensive,
>>>>> as it assumes that guide dogs are a terrible idea for
>>>>> everyone. Being the proud handler of a wonderful dog myself,
>>>>> and a quite independent cane traveller before that, I am a
>>>>> bit upset as what I find to be a somewhat inflammatory post.
>>>>> You are right; guide dogs are not for everyone. They are a
>>>>> huge responsibility and need a lot of daily care. But to say
>>>>> that there are five reasons why a guide dog is a terrile idea
>>>>> seems to be going too far, especially addressing such a
>>>>> large body of people such as that on this list. Now, having
>>>>> clicked the link and read the blog, I know that you are
>>>>> making an attempt to be fair and point out the disadvantages,
>>>>> but to not point out that this was a blog post or an opinion
>>>>> article, can make some folks pretty mad fairly quickly. Can
>>>>> wa choose our words and subject lines a little more wisely
>>>>> next time? Aleha and Dallas, Seeing Eye dog extrordinaire
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 3/19/15, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote: If
>>>>>> you're blind, you obviously read Braille. Your hearing must
>>>>>> naturally be superior to your sighted peers, and of course
>>>>>> you have a guide dog! Right?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the first and
>>>>>> second. Someone recently told me the number of guide dog
>>>>>> users has actually declined in my millennial generation. I
>>>>>> have no evidence proving this one way or the other, but for
>>>>>> the general public, to see a blind person with a guide dog
>>>>>> feels as natural as butter and toast.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for
>>>>>> everyone. Or, maybe I'm just projecting my own
>>>>>> uncertainties onto the rest of the community?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Last November I took the first step in the application
>>>>>> process to return for a second Seeing Eye dog. It's been
>>>>>> more than three years since I lost Gator, and even though
>>>>>> I've gotten around just fine with a white cane, I am
>>>>>> approaching what feels like the final years with sight,
>>>>>> however minimal that sight might be. I admit it's unnerving
>>>>>> if I sit still long enough to contemplate total blindness.
>>>>>> NFB philosophy be damned, and the thought of an extra set
>>>>>> of eyes to help me navigate the world does bring a measure
>>>>>> of comfort. But, is it enough to go get another dog?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In no particular order, here are reasons why a guide dog
>>>>>> would be a terrible idea:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Read more:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-terrible-idea/
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
> - --
>>>>>> Musings of a Work in Progress: www.JoeOrozco.com/
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l
>>>>>> mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>>> info for nabs-l:
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>
> - --
>>>>> Aleeha Dudley and Seeing Eye Yellow Labrador Dallas Vice
>>>>> President, Ohio Association of Blind Students Email:
>>>>> blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com Follow me on Twitter at
>>>>> @blindcowgirl199
>>>>>
>>>>> The wind of heaven is that which blows between a horse's
>>>>> ears. - Arabian Proverb
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l
>>>>> mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>> info for nabs-l:
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/minh.ha927%40gmail.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
> - --
>>>> "All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in
>>>> the dusty recesses of their minds, wake in the day to find that
>>>> it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men,
>>>> for they may act on their dreams with open eyes, to make them
>>>> possible." T. E. Lawrence
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing
>>>> list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>> for nabs-l:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/juanitaherrera1991%40gmail.com
>>>
>>>
>>>>
> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
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> - --
> Take care,
> Ty
> twitter: @sorressean
> web:http://tysdomain.com
> pubkey: http://tysdomain.com/files/pubkey.asc
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v2
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From blackbyrdfly at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 03:55:58 2015
From: blackbyrdfly at gmail.com (Jamie Principato)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 21:55:58 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>
	<CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <F2960AF4-14E4-4414-928B-6CEE131E1F7D@gmail.com>

Why are people so sensitive about their choice to use a cane or a dog that they'd get upset over someone's choice of subject line? If you are confident in your choice to have a guide dog, one person's subject line on a casual mailing list isn't going to rattle that or harm you or effect your life and that of your dog in any way, especially once you actually read the well thought out and well composed blog post attached to it. No one has to agree with your reasons for having a dog or a cane, and they shouldn't have to walk on eggshells to be careful not to offend that choice. You should be proud of what you choose, or at least secure in your choice, enough that a simple subject line doesn't put you immediately on the defensive. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 19, 2015, at 7:00 PM, Aleeha Dudley via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Personally, I find your subject line a bit offensive, as it assumes
> that guide dogs are a terrible idea for everyone. Being the proud
> handler of a wonderful dog myself, and a quite independent cane
> traveller before that, I am a bit upset as what I find to be a
> somewhat inflammatory post. You are right; guide dogs are not for
> everyone. They are a huge responsibility and need a lot of daily care.
> But to say that there are five reasons why a guide dog is a terrile
> idea seems to be going too far, especially addressing such a large
> body of people such as that on this list. Now, having clicked the link
> and read the blog, I know that you are making an attempt to be fair
> and point out the disadvantages, but to not point out that this was a
> blog post or an opinion article, can make some folks pretty mad fairly
> quickly. Can wa choose our words and subject lines a little more
> wisely next time?
> Aleha and Dallas, Seeing Eye dog extrordinaire
> 
>> On 3/19/15, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> If you're blind, you obviously read Braille. Your hearing must naturally be
>> superior to your sighted peers, and of course you have a guide dog! Right?
>> 
>> Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the first and second. Someone
>> recently told me the number of guide dog users has actually declined in my
>> millennial generation. I have no evidence proving this one way or the
>> other,
>> but for the general public, to see a blind person with a guide dog feels as
>> natural as butter and toast.
>> 
>> Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for everyone. Or, maybe I'm
>> just projecting my own uncertainties onto the rest of the community?
>> 
>> Last November I took the first step in the application process to return
>> for
>> a second Seeing Eye dog. It's been more than three years since I lost
>> Gator,
>> and even though I've gotten around just fine with a white cane, I am
>> approaching what feels like the final years with sight, however minimal
>> that
>> sight might be. I admit it's unnerving if I sit still long enough to
>> contemplate total blindness. NFB philosophy be damned, and the thought of
>> an
>> extra set of eyes to help me navigate the world does bring a measure of
>> comfort. But, is it enough to go get another dog?
>> 
>> In no particular order, here are reasons why a guide dog would be a
>> terrible
>> idea:
>> 
>> Read more:
>> 
>> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-terrible-idea/
>> 
>> --
>> Musings of a Work in Progress:
>> www.JoeOrozco.com/
>> 
>> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com
> 
> 
> -- 
> Aleeha Dudley and Seeing Eye Yellow Labrador Dallas
> Vice President, Ohio Association of Blind Students
> Email: blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com
> Follow me on Twitter at @blindcowgirl199
> 
> The wind of heaven is that which blows between a horse's ears.
> - Arabian Proverb
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
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> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com


From blindstein at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 07:16:17 2015
From: blindstein at gmail.com (Justin Harford)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2015 00:16:17 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <CAL=h+uj9=QcYboRbA=4oo4yQY-cytrfFL1qGrY9_45f898Nqkg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>
	<CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAAJqG9je1EWhg88Fx-snXj2Ty172TY48k9OM3ZX-4L8ckjvchw@mail.gmail.com>
	<BDB2A090-9AAF-49F1-88EE-EA5B06900860@gmail.com>
	<1AD31DFB-D5F6-4242-949E-EE77DC6B8F9F@gmail.com>
	<550B9164.8070103@tysdomain.com>
	<CAL=h+uj9=QcYboRbA=4oo4yQY-cytrfFL1qGrY9_45f898Nqkg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4AB84DC8-D78C-4D42-B57E-D46F0E364702@gmail.com>

I agree. 



> On Mar 19, 2015, at 8:41 PM, Brice Smith via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Did those of you who feel offended actually read the blog,
> particularly the explanations under the heading, "Damn! Any Words of
> Encouragement?"
> 
> The subject line is purposely and brilliantly provocative--the kind
> that gathers almost a dozen responses in just a couple of hours. Joe
> clearly understands how to use rhetoric to make a compelling argument,
> and some of the knee-jerk reactions on this list to this post were
> disappointing.
> 
> 
> Brice
> 
> 
> 
>> On 3/19/15, Littlefield, Tyler via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>> Hash: SHA1
>> 
>> Positives? You can summarize this up in 5 really fast points. I seen
>> no positives and really, the negatives aren't huge drawbacks that were
>> listed.
>> I mean, if you want to tell people not to get a dog, you surely can do
>> better than that.
>> 
>> But I'll address each of these points in turn.
>> 1. It's expensive!
>> It can be, yes. There are programs like GDB offers to help with vet
>> bills, so the food and grooming are really all I have to pay for. That
>> and toys, which we probably spend way to much money on. More money
>> than I would usually spend? Certainly, but it's nowhere near a lot
>> (and I'm a student living on a budget). It's also well worth the money.
>> 
>> 2. It's inconvenient!
>> Yes, taking your dog out must be such hard work. Wait, I do it every
>> day, what am i talking about? It's not fun when you're sick and yes,
>> finding a trash can be kind of tough. That's why O'Mally and Minh's
>> viva know "find the trash." That's also when social skills come into
>> play. "Excuse me mam, do you see a trashcan nearby?" Works every time.
>> If you're at an unfamiliar hotel, you just ask at the front desk and
>> they're usually pretty cool about it. Airports also have relieving
>> areas. Unless you travel twice a week, a couple hours of slightly less
>> leg room (and I'm fairly tall) is really not that big of a deal.
>> 
>> 3. It's time-consuming!
>> Yes, having a dog does take time. You'd think this would be inherently
>> obvious, but it was needed to be pointed out here. You don't need to
>> go for 12 mile runs, O'mally and I have left today to relieve and that
>> was pretty much it. I played with him and listened to a book and sat
>> with him on the floor for a bit. He's totally happy and hasn't
>> demolished anything.
>> 
>> 4. It's unwelcomed attention!
>> I find it kind of funny you're talking about being covert and not
>> making a name for yourself with complaints when the NFB files more
>> lawsuits than I can keep up with. But beyond that, I've never been
>> turned down from eating because I have a dog. Cabs, certainly; we all
>> have. If an establishment turns me down, I'll make sure that people
>> know they did it and they're not treating me equally. Just because I'm
>> blind doesn't mean I should sit in the corner and hope that things get
>> better; I want to educate people. I've had a lot of really amazing
>> people come up and talk to me and ask questions about my guide. It
>> certainly does get a bit trying at times, but in no way is it a huge
>> problem. I am sorry however if you're not the center of the topics and
>> people do ask about your dog. It happens.
>> 
>> 5. It can be dirty work!
>> Best not ever get sick by yourself then, or have kids, or anything
>> else. Yes, it can be tough. If you're squeamish maybe it's not for
>> you. Cleaning up doggy vomit really isn't the best part of my day, but
>> you do it. mostly because these dogs do so much for you and if O'mally
>> is sick I'm worried about him and just want him to get better. You do
>> it because you love your dog.
>> 
>> "If you were contemplating a dog, came across this post and felt
>> discouraged, you should not get a dog. It's a lot of work. It's a lot
>> of responsibility.
>> It's constant care and attention and a commitment to keep up the dog's
>> level of training. No one will fault you for being mature enough to
>> walk away."
>> 
>> So let me sum this up: expensive; inconvenient; time-consuming;
>> unwelcome attention; messy work. Yeah, I'd say you probably shouldn't
>> have a dog. Please though, do try to at least provide constructive and
>> good information on both sides of this issue. The issues you raised
>> were incredibly self-centered, rude, generalizing and really didn't
>> convey any issues beyond negative criticism.
>> 
>> My guide does amazing work each and every day. when I pick up his
>> harness, he's by my side, tail wagging ready to work for me. He only
>> asks that I give him love, attention and take care of him with vet
>> visits, grooming and toys. Given the amount of travel that he has
>> enabled me to do (I am and was proficient with a cane), I think it
>> only fitting that I pay for his food, give him attention, clean up
>> after him when he's sick and treat him well. My guide loves me, no
>> questions asked. while I somewhat understand these points, I think
>> anyone who has actually had a guide would really agree that they are
>> huge issues that should prevent you from getting one.
>> 
>> At first, this looked like a trolling post; it still feels like a
>> trolling post.
>> 
>> Be well,
>> Ty
>>> On 3/19/2015 10:20 PM, Justin Harford via nabs-l wrote:
>>> At first, this looked like a trolling post, but after I actually
>>> read the article, I  enjoyed it.
>>> 
>>> It is a very frank and honest examination of the positives and
>>> negatives of one individual's experience with a guide dog, and
>>> clearly reads as the opinion of one person.
>>> 
>>> Regards Justin
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:52 PM, Juanita Herrera via nabs-l
>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Being a guide dog user myself, I found the blog offensive and
>>>> thought of how other guide dog handlers might feel. I didn't want
>>>> to generalize like the blog seems to do but I felt that if I felt
>>>> offended by it many other people would have too. I would have
>>>> appreciated it more if somewhere in the blog post it would have
>>>> been acknowledged that this was one person's opinion, and not
>>>> make it seen as if though everyone possessed the same opinion.
>>>> Being that I am a guide dog user and have been for three years,
>>>> it has been one of the best experiences of my life. I would never
>>>> change it for anything, and I don't consider going back to using
>>>> a cane after I have to retire my dog. Therefore, I highly
>>>> disagree with the blog post. However, I must reinstate that this
>>>> is simply my opinion. Juanita
>>>> 
>>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:28 PM, minh ha via nabs-l
>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> I agree with Aleeha's sentiments one hundred percent. Over
>>>>> generalization is a huge mistake to do under any circumstances,
>>>>> and this blog post was offensive to me and other guide dog
>>>>> handlers on so many levels. If you want to write a fair and
>>>>> informative blog post about the guide dog lifestyle, then by
>>>>> all means, point out the negative aspects, but do not
>>>>> conveniently forget to mention the thousand of other more
>>>>> positive and beneficial impacts that a guide dog can have on a
>>>>> person's life. Yes, a guide dog is not the right choice for
>>>>> everyone and a blind person needs to think long and hard before
>>>>> getting one, but for the right reasons, a guide dog can
>>>>> completely turn someone's life around and give them the
>>>>> confidence in order to live life more productively. Honestly,
>>>>> your five reasons seem very childish, and i have to wonder if
>>>>> they are that important to you, then you should be
>>>>> contemplating about getting another guide dog at all.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Respectfully, Minh and my hard working little guide, Viva
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On 3/19/15, Aleeha Dudley via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>> wrote: Personally, I find your subject line a bit offensive,
>>>>>> as it assumes that guide dogs are a terrible idea for
>>>>>> everyone. Being the proud handler of a wonderful dog myself,
>>>>>> and a quite independent cane traveller before that, I am a
>>>>>> bit upset as what I find to be a somewhat inflammatory post.
>>>>>> You are right; guide dogs are not for everyone. They are a
>>>>>> huge responsibility and need a lot of daily care. But to say
>>>>>> that there are five reasons why a guide dog is a terrile idea
>>>>>> seems to be going too far, especially addressing such a
>>>>>> large body of people such as that on this list. Now, having
>>>>>> clicked the link and read the blog, I know that you are
>>>>>> making an attempt to be fair and point out the disadvantages,
>>>>>> but to not point out that this was a blog post or an opinion
>>>>>> article, can make some folks pretty mad fairly quickly. Can
>>>>>> wa choose our words and subject lines a little more wisely
>>>>>> next time? Aleha and Dallas, Seeing Eye dog extrordinaire
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On 3/19/15, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote: If
>>>>>>> you're blind, you obviously read Braille. Your hearing must
>>>>>>> naturally be superior to your sighted peers, and of course
>>>>>>> you have a guide dog! Right?
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the first and
>>>>>>> second. Someone recently told me the number of guide dog
>>>>>>> users has actually declined in my millennial generation. I
>>>>>>> have no evidence proving this one way or the other, but for
>>>>>>> the general public, to see a blind person with a guide dog
>>>>>>> feels as natural as butter and toast.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for
>>>>>>> everyone. Or, maybe I'm just projecting my own
>>>>>>> uncertainties onto the rest of the community?
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Last November I took the first step in the application
>>>>>>> process to return for a second Seeing Eye dog. It's been
>>>>>>> more than three years since I lost Gator, and even though
>>>>>>> I've gotten around just fine with a white cane, I am
>>>>>>> approaching what feels like the final years with sight,
>>>>>>> however minimal that sight might be. I admit it's unnerving
>>>>>>> if I sit still long enough to contemplate total blindness.
>>>>>>> NFB philosophy be damned, and the thought of an extra set
>>>>>>> of eyes to help me navigate the world does bring a measure
>>>>>>> of comfort. But, is it enough to go get another dog?
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> In no particular order, here are reasons why a guide dog
>>>>>>> would be a terrible idea:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Read more:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-terrible-idea/
>> - --
>>>>>>> Musings of a Work in Progress: www.JoeOrozco.com/
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l
>>>>>>> mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>>>> info for nabs-l:
>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>> - --
>>>>>> Aleeha Dudley and Seeing Eye Yellow Labrador Dallas Vice
>>>>>> President, Ohio Association of Blind Students Email:
>>>>>> blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com Follow me on Twitter at
>>>>>> @blindcowgirl199
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> The wind of heaven is that which blows between a horse's
>>>>>> ears. - Arabian Proverb
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l
>>>>>> mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>>> info for nabs-l:
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/minh.ha927%40gmail.com
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>> - --
>>>>> "All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in
>>>>> the dusty recesses of their minds, wake in the day to find that
>>>>> it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men,
>>>>> for they may act on their dreams with open eyes, to make them
>>>>> possible." T. E. Lawrence
>>>>> 
>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing
>>>>> list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>> for nabs-l:
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/juanitaherrera1991%40gmail.com
>>>> 
>>>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>> for nabs-l:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindstein%40gmail.com
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing
>>> list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
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>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
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>> - --
>> Take care,
>> Ty
>> twitter: @sorressean
>> web:http://tysdomain.com
>> pubkey: http://tysdomain.com/files/pubkey.asc
>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
>> Version: GnuPG v2
>> 
>> iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJVC5FkAAoJEAdP60+BYxejeg8H/jgEQxColgCWyB7SJTK/Wspj
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>> =IjVb
>> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
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>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com
> 
> _______________________________________________
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From tyler at tysdomain.com  Fri Mar 20 07:24:42 2015
From: tyler at tysdomain.com (Littlefield, Tyler)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2015 03:24:42 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <4AB84DC8-D78C-4D42-B57E-D46F0E364702@gmail.com>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>	<CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>	<CAAJqG9je1EWhg88Fx-snXj2Ty172TY48k9OM3ZX-4L8ckjvchw@mail.gmail.com>	<BDB2A090-9AAF-49F1-88EE-EA5B06900860@gmail.com>	<1AD31DFB-D5F6-4242-949E-EE77DC6B8F9F@gmail.com>	<550B9164.8070103@tysdomain.com>	<CAL=h+uj9=QcYboRbA=4oo4yQY-cytrfFL1qGrY9_45f898Nqkg@mail.gmail.com>
	<4AB84DC8-D78C-4D42-B57E-D46F0E364702@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <550BCB3A.3050505@tysdomain.com>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

I actually read the article twice before I posted. The subject line
was as much garbage as the article itself. People talk about how they
found positive points to this and I'd still love to see any of them.

Maybe it wasn't Joe's intention, but he really brought down owning a
guide to a whole new level. I'm not really interested in a fight over
a guide vs cane because I don't really care to.

Basically what my response boils down to is this: if someone has a
guide, they know that their dog loves them, is loyal and in general is
happy to work. They have a happy furry companion next to them who does
some seriously amazing stuff. With that said, the only point I'll give
some weight is the expense bit because that is an important
consideration. the time is also important, but I feel like you should
know if you're going to devote time to your dog. the rest are just
pointless babble from what I can tell. I don't really know that
someone having their feelings hurt because people ask about their dog
rather than them is a compelling reason not to get a guide dog.

In the end, the choice should be left up to the user; the cane Vs
Guide issue is relevant to all students. I would like to make sure
that people have accurate information though. A post just for the sake
of writing a discouraging post does not really fall under that category.

When I started looking at this, I can think of reasons why someone
might not want a guide, so that's what I expected. Valid, well-thought
out compelling reasons with experience behind them to explain the pros
and cons of having a guide. Sadly, I didn't receive any of that.

Best,
Ty

On 3/20/2015 3:16 AM, Justin Harford via nabs-l wrote:
> I agree.
> 
> 
> 
>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 8:41 PM, Brice Smith via nabs-l
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Did those of you who feel offended actually read the blog, 
>> particularly the explanations under the heading, "Damn! Any Words
>> of Encouragement?"
>> 
>> The subject line is purposely and brilliantly provocative--the
>> kind that gathers almost a dozen responses in just a couple of
>> hours. Joe clearly understands how to use rhetoric to make a
>> compelling argument, and some of the knee-jerk reactions on this
>> list to this post were disappointing.
>> 
>> 
>> Brice
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On 3/19/15, Littlefield, Tyler via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> wrote:
> Positives? You can summarize this up in 5 really fast points. I
> seen no positives and really, the negatives aren't huge drawbacks
> that were listed. I mean, if you want to tell people not to get a
> dog, you surely can do better than that.
> 
> But I'll address each of these points in turn. 1. It's expensive! 
> It can be, yes. There are programs like GDB offers to help with
> vet bills, so the food and grooming are really all I have to pay
> for. That and toys, which we probably spend way to much money on.
> More money than I would usually spend? Certainly, but it's nowhere
> near a lot (and I'm a student living on a budget). It's also well
> worth the money.
> 
> 2. It's inconvenient! Yes, taking your dog out must be such hard
> work. Wait, I do it every day, what am i talking about? It's not
> fun when you're sick and yes, finding a trash can be kind of tough.
> That's why O'Mally and Minh's viva know "find the trash." That's
> also when social skills come into play. "Excuse me mam, do you see
> a trashcan nearby?" Works every time. If you're at an unfamiliar
> hotel, you just ask at the front desk and they're usually pretty
> cool about it. Airports also have relieving areas. Unless you
> travel twice a week, a couple hours of slightly less leg room (and
> I'm fairly tall) is really not that big of a deal.
> 
> 3. It's time-consuming! Yes, having a dog does take time. You'd
> think this would be inherently obvious, but it was needed to be
> pointed out here. You don't need to go for 12 mile runs, O'mally
> and I have left today to relieve and that was pretty much it. I
> played with him and listened to a book and sat with him on the
> floor for a bit. He's totally happy and hasn't demolished
> anything.
> 
> 4. It's unwelcomed attention! I find it kind of funny you're
> talking about being covert and not making a name for yourself with
> complaints when the NFB files more lawsuits than I can keep up
> with. But beyond that, I've never been turned down from eating
> because I have a dog. Cabs, certainly; we all have. If an
> establishment turns me down, I'll make sure that people know they
> did it and they're not treating me equally. Just because I'm blind
> doesn't mean I should sit in the corner and hope that things get 
> better; I want to educate people. I've had a lot of really amazing 
> people come up and talk to me and ask questions about my guide. It 
> certainly does get a bit trying at times, but in no way is it a
> huge problem. I am sorry however if you're not the center of the
> topics and people do ask about your dog. It happens.
> 
> 5. It can be dirty work! Best not ever get sick by yourself then,
> or have kids, or anything else. Yes, it can be tough. If you're
> squeamish maybe it's not for you. Cleaning up doggy vomit really
> isn't the best part of my day, but you do it. mostly because these
> dogs do so much for you and if O'mally is sick I'm worried about
> him and just want him to get better. You do it because you love
> your dog.
> 
> "If you were contemplating a dog, came across this post and felt 
> discouraged, you should not get a dog. It's a lot of work. It's a
> lot of responsibility. It's constant care and attention and a
> commitment to keep up the dog's level of training. No one will
> fault you for being mature enough to walk away."
> 
> So let me sum this up: expensive; inconvenient; time-consuming; 
> unwelcome attention; messy work. Yeah, I'd say you probably
> shouldn't have a dog. Please though, do try to at least provide
> constructive and good information on both sides of this issue. The
> issues you raised were incredibly self-centered, rude, generalizing
> and really didn't convey any issues beyond negative criticism.
> 
> My guide does amazing work each and every day. when I pick up his 
> harness, he's by my side, tail wagging ready to work for me. He
> only asks that I give him love, attention and take care of him with
> vet visits, grooming and toys. Given the amount of travel that he
> has enabled me to do (I am and was proficient with a cane), I think
> it only fitting that I pay for his food, give him attention, clean
> up after him when he's sick and treat him well. My guide loves me,
> no questions asked. while I somewhat understand these points, I
> think anyone who has actually had a guide would really agree that
> they are huge issues that should prevent you from getting one.
> 
> At first, this looked like a trolling post; it still feels like a 
> trolling post.
> 
> Be well, Ty
>>>>> On 3/19/2015 10:20 PM, Justin Harford via nabs-l wrote: At
>>>>> first, this looked like a trolling post, but after I
>>>>> actually read the article, I  enjoyed it.
>>>>> 
>>>>> It is a very frank and honest examination of the positives
>>>>> and negatives of one individual's experience with a guide
>>>>> dog, and clearly reads as the opinion of one person.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Regards Justin
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:52 PM, Juanita Herrera via nabs-l 
>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Being a guide dog user myself, I found the blog offensive
>>>>>> and thought of how other guide dog handlers might feel. I
>>>>>> didn't want to generalize like the blog seems to do but I
>>>>>> felt that if I felt offended by it many other people
>>>>>> would have too. I would have appreciated it more if
>>>>>> somewhere in the blog post it would have been
>>>>>> acknowledged that this was one person's opinion, and not 
>>>>>> make it seen as if though everyone possessed the same
>>>>>> opinion. Being that I am a guide dog user and have been
>>>>>> for three years, it has been one of the best experiences
>>>>>> of my life. I would never change it for anything, and I
>>>>>> don't consider going back to using a cane after I have to
>>>>>> retire my dog. Therefore, I highly disagree with the blog
>>>>>> post. However, I must reinstate that this is simply my
>>>>>> opinion. Juanita
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:28 PM, minh ha via nabs-l 
>>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I agree with Aleeha's sentiments one hundred percent.
>>>>>>> Over generalization is a huge mistake to do under any
>>>>>>> circumstances, and this blog post was offensive to me
>>>>>>> and other guide dog handlers on so many levels. If you
>>>>>>> want to write a fair and informative blog post about
>>>>>>> the guide dog lifestyle, then by all means, point out
>>>>>>> the negative aspects, but do not conveniently forget to
>>>>>>> mention the thousand of other more positive and
>>>>>>> beneficial impacts that a guide dog can have on a 
>>>>>>> person's life. Yes, a guide dog is not the right choice
>>>>>>> for everyone and a blind person needs to think long and
>>>>>>> hard before getting one, but for the right reasons, a
>>>>>>> guide dog can completely turn someone's life around and
>>>>>>> give them the confidence in order to live life more
>>>>>>> productively. Honestly, your five reasons seem very
>>>>>>> childish, and i have to wonder if they are that
>>>>>>> important to you, then you should be contemplating
>>>>>>> about getting another guide dog at all.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Respectfully, Minh and my hard working little guide,
>>>>>>> Viva
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On 3/19/15, Aleeha Dudley via nabs-l
>>>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote: Personally, I find your
>>>>>>>> subject line a bit offensive, as it assumes that
>>>>>>>> guide dogs are a terrible idea for everyone. Being
>>>>>>>> the proud handler of a wonderful dog myself, and a
>>>>>>>> quite independent cane traveller before that, I am a 
>>>>>>>> bit upset as what I find to be a somewhat
>>>>>>>> inflammatory post. You are right; guide dogs are not
>>>>>>>> for everyone. They are a huge responsibility and need
>>>>>>>> a lot of daily care. But to say that there are five
>>>>>>>> reasons why a guide dog is a terrile idea seems to be
>>>>>>>> going too far, especially addressing such a large
>>>>>>>> body of people such as that on this list. Now,
>>>>>>>> having clicked the link and read the blog, I know
>>>>>>>> that you are making an attempt to be fair and point
>>>>>>>> out the disadvantages, but to not point out that this
>>>>>>>> was a blog post or an opinion article, can make some
>>>>>>>> folks pretty mad fairly quickly. Can wa choose our
>>>>>>>> words and subject lines a little more wisely next
>>>>>>>> time? Aleha and Dallas, Seeing Eye dog extrordinaire
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> On 3/19/15, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>> wrote: If you're blind, you obviously read Braille.
>>>>>>>>> Your hearing must naturally be superior to your
>>>>>>>>> sighted peers, and of course you have a guide dog!
>>>>>>>>> Right?
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the
>>>>>>>>> first and second. Someone recently told me the
>>>>>>>>> number of guide dog users has actually declined in
>>>>>>>>> my millennial generation. I have no evidence
>>>>>>>>> proving this one way or the other, but for the
>>>>>>>>> general public, to see a blind person with a guide
>>>>>>>>> dog feels as natural as butter and toast.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for 
>>>>>>>>> everyone. Or, maybe I'm just projecting my own 
>>>>>>>>> uncertainties onto the rest of the community?
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Last November I took the first step in the
>>>>>>>>> application process to return for a second Seeing
>>>>>>>>> Eye dog. It's been more than three years since I
>>>>>>>>> lost Gator, and even though I've gotten around just
>>>>>>>>> fine with a white cane, I am approaching what feels
>>>>>>>>> like the final years with sight, however minimal
>>>>>>>>> that sight might be. I admit it's unnerving if I
>>>>>>>>> sit still long enough to contemplate total
>>>>>>>>> blindness. NFB philosophy be damned, and the
>>>>>>>>> thought of an extra set of eyes to help me navigate
>>>>>>>>> the world does bring a measure of comfort. But, is
>>>>>>>>> it enough to go get another dog?
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> In no particular order, here are reasons why a
>>>>>>>>> guide dog would be a terrible idea:
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Read more:
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-terrible-idea/
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>> 
_______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org 
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>> for nabs-l: 
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>>> 
_______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org 
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for nabs-l: 
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindstein%40gmail.com
>
>> 
> _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing
> list nabs-l at nfbnet.org 
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l: 
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/tyler%40tysdomain.com
>
> 
- -- 
Take care,
Ty
twitter: @sorressean
web:http://tysdomain.com
pubkey: http://tysdomain.com/files/pubkey.asc
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From becsjoynfb at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 14:16:04 2015
From: becsjoynfb at gmail.com (Rebecca Leon)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2015 08:16:04 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] NABS Notes March Edition
Message-ID: <C9100A2F-7CB8-4DD9-9C83-0D25F9E5C3F6@gmail.com>

Fellow students,
Please find attached the NABS notes edition for the month of March. We
are excited to have updates from the states of North Carolina,
Illinois, and Connecticut.
For information concerning the April edition of NABS notes, to submit
an update from your state, or to contact the communications committee
with any questions or concerns, please email Karen at:
kea.anderson at gmail.com
Or Rebecca at:
becsjoynfb at gmail.com
Best,
Rebecca~
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From kirt.crazydude at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 14:18:01 2015
From: kirt.crazydude at gmail.com (Kirt)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2015 08:18:01 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <550BCB3A.3050505@tysdomain.com>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>
	<CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAAJqG9je1EWhg88Fx-snXj2Ty172TY48k9OM3ZX-4L8ckjvchw@mail.gmail.com>
	<BDB2A090-9AAF-49F1-88EE-EA5B06900860@gmail.com>
	<1AD31DFB-D5F6-4242-949E-EE77DC6B8F9F@gmail.com>
	<550B9164.8070103@tysdomain.com>
	<CAL=h+uj9=QcYboRbA=4oo4yQY-cytrfFL1qGrY9_45f898Nqkg@mail.gmail.com>
	<4AB84DC8-D78C-4D42-B57E-D46F0E364702@gmail.com>
	<550BCB3A.3050505@tysdomain.com>
Message-ID: <0B5764D2-E17B-4DD0-8192-E11845843698@gmail.com>

Ty,
I think I really get where you're coming from here and I don't want to needlessly add fuel to this particular fire. though I have never been a dog handler myself, I think I get where you are irritated. Nevertheless, I do think Joe had A deeper aim than being purposely provocative just for the sake of being a jackass
Without being overly inflammatory, I think it's safe to say there's a… false mystique about Guide dogs. Many people, sadly even many orientation and mobility instructor's, seem to think of dogs as some sort of panacea, Virtual angels from on high sent to turn even terrible travelers into confident and capable people who can pretty much go wherever they feel like without an improvement of travel skills at all. I'm not trying to say, nor do I think is Joe trying to say that guy dogs are terrible. I think he's just trying to cut through that magical aura of effortless freedom and confidence that seems practically synonymous with guide dogs to most people. To be clear, because apparently I need to be: i've seen how Guide dogs can be very helpful to already solid travelers who choose to go that route. That's fine, and I really think it's quite beside the point of this article. In pretty much every conversation I've seen about guide dogs there is so much overhyped positive emotional rhetoric… And, sometimes, the only way to really counter that is Sharp Rhetoric going the other way. I'm sure most of us have had the experience of signing up for a really really hard class and having a professor, Who turns out to be a wonderful and compelling teacher, Play the hard ass drill sergeant act for the first week or so in order to weed out students who don't really care about the course? I think that's sort of what Joe is trying to do here.
Best,
Kirt

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 20, 2015, at 1:24 AM, Littlefield, Tyler via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> I actually read the article twice before I posted. The subject line
> was as much garbage as the article itself. People talk about how they
> found positive points to this and I'd still love to see any of them.
> 
> Maybe it wasn't Joe's intention, but he really brought down owning a
> guide to a whole new level. I'm not really interested in a fight over
> a guide vs cane because I don't really care to.
> 
> Basically what my response boils down to is this: if someone has a
> guide, they know that their dog loves them, is loyal and in general is
> happy to work. They have a happy furry companion next to them who does
> some seriously amazing stuff. With that said, the only point I'll give
> some weight is the expense bit because that is an important
> consideration. the time is also important, but I feel like you should
> know if you're going to devote time to your dog. the rest are just
> pointless babble from what I can tell. I don't really know that
> someone having their feelings hurt because people ask about their dog
> rather than them is a compelling reason not to get a guide dog.
> 
> In the end, the choice should be left up to the user; the cane Vs
> Guide issue is relevant to all students. I would like to make sure
> that people have accurate information though. A post just for the sake
> of writing a discouraging post does not really fall under that category.
> 
> When I started looking at this, I can think of reasons why someone
> might not want a guide, so that's what I expected. Valid, well-thought
> out compelling reasons with experience behind them to explain the pros
> and cons of having a guide. Sadly, I didn't receive any of that.
> 
> Best,
> Ty
> 
>> On 3/20/2015 3:16 AM, Justin Harford via nabs-l wrote:
>> I agree.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 8:41 PM, Brice Smith via nabs-l
>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Did those of you who feel offended actually read the blog, 
>>> particularly the explanations under the heading, "Damn! Any Words
>>> of Encouragement?"
>>> 
>>> The subject line is purposely and brilliantly provocative--the
>>> kind that gathers almost a dozen responses in just a couple of
>>> hours. Joe clearly understands how to use rhetoric to make a
>>> compelling argument, and some of the knee-jerk reactions on this
>>> list to this post were disappointing.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Brice
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On 3/19/15, Littlefield, Tyler via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>> wrote:
>> Positives? You can summarize this up in 5 really fast points. I
>> seen no positives and really, the negatives aren't huge drawbacks
>> that were listed. I mean, if you want to tell people not to get a
>> dog, you surely can do better than that.
>> 
>> But I'll address each of these points in turn. 1. It's expensive! 
>> It can be, yes. There are programs like GDB offers to help with
>> vet bills, so the food and grooming are really all I have to pay
>> for. That and toys, which we probably spend way to much money on.
>> More money than I would usually spend? Certainly, but it's nowhere
>> near a lot (and I'm a student living on a budget). It's also well
>> worth the money.
>> 
>> 2. It's inconvenient! Yes, taking your dog out must be such hard
>> work. Wait, I do it every day, what am i talking about? It's not
>> fun when you're sick and yes, finding a trash can be kind of tough.
>> That's why O'Mally and Minh's viva know "find the trash." That's
>> also when social skills come into play. "Excuse me mam, do you see
>> a trashcan nearby?" Works every time. If you're at an unfamiliar
>> hotel, you just ask at the front desk and they're usually pretty
>> cool about it. Airports also have relieving areas. Unless you
>> travel twice a week, a couple hours of slightly less leg room (and
>> I'm fairly tall) is really not that big of a deal.
>> 
>> 3. It's time-consuming! Yes, having a dog does take time. You'd
>> think this would be inherently obvious, but it was needed to be
>> pointed out here. You don't need to go for 12 mile runs, O'mally
>> and I have left today to relieve and that was pretty much it. I
>> played with him and listened to a book and sat with him on the
>> floor for a bit. He's totally happy and hasn't demolished
>> anything.
>> 
>> 4. It's unwelcomed attention! I find it kind of funny you're
>> talking about being covert and not making a name for yourself with
>> complaints when the NFB files more lawsuits than I can keep up
>> with. But beyond that, I've never been turned down from eating
>> because I have a dog. Cabs, certainly; we all have. If an
>> establishment turns me down, I'll make sure that people know they
>> did it and they're not treating me equally. Just because I'm blind
>> doesn't mean I should sit in the corner and hope that things get 
>> better; I want to educate people. I've had a lot of really amazing 
>> people come up and talk to me and ask questions about my guide. It 
>> certainly does get a bit trying at times, but in no way is it a
>> huge problem. I am sorry however if you're not the center of the
>> topics and people do ask about your dog. It happens.
>> 
>> 5. It can be dirty work! Best not ever get sick by yourself then,
>> or have kids, or anything else. Yes, it can be tough. If you're
>> squeamish maybe it's not for you. Cleaning up doggy vomit really
>> isn't the best part of my day, but you do it. mostly because these
>> dogs do so much for you and if O'mally is sick I'm worried about
>> him and just want him to get better. You do it because you love
>> your dog.
>> 
>> "If you were contemplating a dog, came across this post and felt 
>> discouraged, you should not get a dog. It's a lot of work. It's a
>> lot of responsibility. It's constant care and attention and a
>> commitment to keep up the dog's level of training. No one will
>> fault you for being mature enough to walk away."
>> 
>> So let me sum this up: expensive; inconvenient; time-consuming; 
>> unwelcome attention; messy work. Yeah, I'd say you probably
>> shouldn't have a dog. Please though, do try to at least provide
>> constructive and good information on both sides of this issue. The
>> issues you raised were incredibly self-centered, rude, generalizing
>> and really didn't convey any issues beyond negative criticism.
>> 
>> My guide does amazing work each and every day. when I pick up his 
>> harness, he's by my side, tail wagging ready to work for me. He
>> only asks that I give him love, attention and take care of him with
>> vet visits, grooming and toys. Given the amount of travel that he
>> has enabled me to do (I am and was proficient with a cane), I think
>> it only fitting that I pay for his food, give him attention, clean
>> up after him when he's sick and treat him well. My guide loves me,
>> no questions asked. while I somewhat understand these points, I
>> think anyone who has actually had a guide would really agree that
>> they are huge issues that should prevent you from getting one.
>> 
>> At first, this looked like a trolling post; it still feels like a 
>> trolling post.
>> 
>> Be well, Ty
>>>>>> On 3/19/2015 10:20 PM, Justin Harford via nabs-l wrote: At
>>>>>> first, this looked like a trolling post, but after I
>>>>>> actually read the article, I  enjoyed it.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> It is a very frank and honest examination of the positives
>>>>>> and negatives of one individual's experience with a guide
>>>>>> dog, and clearly reads as the opinion of one person.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Regards Justin
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:52 PM, Juanita Herrera via nabs-l 
>>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Being a guide dog user myself, I found the blog offensive
>>>>>>> and thought of how other guide dog handlers might feel. I
>>>>>>> didn't want to generalize like the blog seems to do but I
>>>>>>> felt that if I felt offended by it many other people
>>>>>>> would have too. I would have appreciated it more if
>>>>>>> somewhere in the blog post it would have been
>>>>>>> acknowledged that this was one person's opinion, and not 
>>>>>>> make it seen as if though everyone possessed the same
>>>>>>> opinion. Being that I am a guide dog user and have been
>>>>>>> for three years, it has been one of the best experiences
>>>>>>> of my life. I would never change it for anything, and I
>>>>>>> don't consider going back to using a cane after I have to
>>>>>>> retire my dog. Therefore, I highly disagree with the blog
>>>>>>> post. However, I must reinstate that this is simply my
>>>>>>> opinion. Juanita
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:28 PM, minh ha via nabs-l 
>>>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> I agree with Aleeha's sentiments one hundred percent.
>>>>>>>> Over generalization is a huge mistake to do under any
>>>>>>>> circumstances, and this blog post was offensive to me
>>>>>>>> and other guide dog handlers on so many levels. If you
>>>>>>>> want to write a fair and informative blog post about
>>>>>>>> the guide dog lifestyle, then by all means, point out
>>>>>>>> the negative aspects, but do not conveniently forget to
>>>>>>>> mention the thousand of other more positive and
>>>>>>>> beneficial impacts that a guide dog can have on a 
>>>>>>>> person's life. Yes, a guide dog is not the right choice
>>>>>>>> for everyone and a blind person needs to think long and
>>>>>>>> hard before getting one, but for the right reasons, a
>>>>>>>> guide dog can completely turn someone's life around and
>>>>>>>> give them the confidence in order to live life more
>>>>>>>> productively. Honestly, your five reasons seem very
>>>>>>>> childish, and i have to wonder if they are that
>>>>>>>> important to you, then you should be contemplating
>>>>>>>> about getting another guide dog at all.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Respectfully, Minh and my hard working little guide,
>>>>>>>> Viva
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> On 3/19/15, Aleeha Dudley via nabs-l
>>>>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote: Personally, I find your
>>>>>>>>> subject line a bit offensive, as it assumes that
>>>>>>>>> guide dogs are a terrible idea for everyone. Being
>>>>>>>>> the proud handler of a wonderful dog myself, and a
>>>>>>>>> quite independent cane traveller before that, I am a 
>>>>>>>>> bit upset as what I find to be a somewhat
>>>>>>>>> inflammatory post. You are right; guide dogs are not
>>>>>>>>> for everyone. They are a huge responsibility and need
>>>>>>>>> a lot of daily care. But to say that there are five
>>>>>>>>> reasons why a guide dog is a terrile idea seems to be
>>>>>>>>> going too far, especially addressing such a large
>>>>>>>>> body of people such as that on this list. Now,
>>>>>>>>> having clicked the link and read the blog, I know
>>>>>>>>> that you are making an attempt to be fair and point
>>>>>>>>> out the disadvantages, but to not point out that this
>>>>>>>>> was a blog post or an opinion article, can make some
>>>>>>>>> folks pretty mad fairly quickly. Can wa choose our
>>>>>>>>> words and subject lines a little more wisely next
>>>>>>>>> time? Aleha and Dallas, Seeing Eye dog extrordinaire
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> On 3/19/15, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>>> wrote: If you're blind, you obviously read Braille.
>>>>>>>>>> Your hearing must naturally be superior to your
>>>>>>>>>> sighted peers, and of course you have a guide dog!
>>>>>>>>>> Right?
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the
>>>>>>>>>> first and second. Someone recently told me the
>>>>>>>>>> number of guide dog users has actually declined in
>>>>>>>>>> my millennial generation. I have no evidence
>>>>>>>>>> proving this one way or the other, but for the
>>>>>>>>>> general public, to see a blind person with a guide
>>>>>>>>>> dog feels as natural as butter and toast.
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for 
>>>>>>>>>> everyone. Or, maybe I'm just projecting my own 
>>>>>>>>>> uncertainties onto the rest of the community?
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Last November I took the first step in the
>>>>>>>>>> application process to return for a second Seeing
>>>>>>>>>> Eye dog. It's been more than three years since I
>>>>>>>>>> lost Gator, and even though I've gotten around just
>>>>>>>>>> fine with a white cane, I am approaching what feels
>>>>>>>>>> like the final years with sight, however minimal
>>>>>>>>>> that sight might be. I admit it's unnerving if I
>>>>>>>>>> sit still long enough to contemplate total
>>>>>>>>>> blindness. NFB philosophy be damned, and the
>>>>>>>>>> thought of an extra set of eyes to help me navigate
>>>>>>>>>> the world does bring a measure of comfort. But, is
>>>>>>>>>> it enough to go get another dog?
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> In no particular order, here are reasons why a
>>>>>>>>>> guide dog would be a terrible idea:
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Read more:
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-terrible-idea/
>>>> 
>>>> 
> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org 
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>> for nabs-l: 
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com
>>> 
>>> 
> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org 
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>> for nabs-l: 
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindstein%40gmail.com
>> 
>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing
>> list nabs-l at nfbnet.org 
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l: 
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> - -- 
> Take care,
> Ty
> twitter: @sorressean
> web:http://tysdomain.com
> pubkey: http://tysdomain.com/files/pubkey.asc
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v2
> 
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> 
> _______________________________________________
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> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40gmail.com


From rbacchus228 at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 14:29:49 2015
From: rbacchus228 at gmail.com (Roanna Bacchus)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2015 10:29:49 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] The social misown of the Nfb
Message-ID: <550c2edf.36208c0a.2036.1705@mx.google.com>

Dear Students,

This semester I am taking a course titled "A Communication 
Approach To Corporate Social Responsibility".  We had a 
discussion about the social mission and vision of an 
organization.  I've been on the Nfb mailing lists for four years 
and I have a question.  What is the social mission of the Nfb and 
how does it practice Csr? I am looking forward to reading your 
responses.


From justin.williams2 at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 14:54:53 2015
From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2015 10:54:53 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] The social misown of the Nfb
In-Reply-To: <550c2edf.36208c0a.2036.1705@mx.google.com>
References: <550c2edf.36208c0a.2036.1705@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <013f01d0631d$d2ff1c00$78fd5400$@gmail.com>

If you go to the nfb homepage, you can find the  mission statement.

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Roanna Bacchus
via nabs-l
Sent: Friday, March 20, 2015 10:30 AM
To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
Subject: [nabs-l] The social misown of the Nfb

Dear Students,

This semester I am taking a course titled "A Communication Approach To
Corporate Social Responsibility".  We had a discussion about the social
mission and vision of an organization.  I've been on the Nfb mailing lists
for four years and I have a question.  What is the social mission of the Nfb
and how does it practice Csr? I am looking forward to reading your
responses.

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail
.com



From rbacchus228 at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 15:06:28 2015
From: rbacchus228 at gmail.com (Roanna Bacchus)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2015 11:06:28 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] My thoughts on the Nfb's mission
Message-ID: <550c3775.0f978c0a.6106.213e@mx.google.com>

Hi Everyone

I'd like to share my thoughts on the social mission of the Nfb.  
I think that all blind people should be able to live the life 
they want.  As about students, we should be able to get the 
proper training to live on our own.  I'd like to hear your 
thoughts on this topic.


From gmoore3rd at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 18:26:07 2015
From: gmoore3rd at gmail.com (Glenn III)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2015 13:26:07 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons...
Message-ID: <CAAxfxEC58O9mkKNpSWR8REZe-y0MpdaivN8zGRQc+RUUbJxGDw@mail.gmail.com>

to the poster who said 'if you're blind, you obviously read Braille', I
think it's worth noting, and I'm sure you're not the only one who would be
surprised to know, that if you're blind, chances are you don't read
braille.
http://www.nbcnews.com/id/29882719/ns/us_news-life/t/fewer-blind-americans-learning-use-braille/#.VQxit46NiSo
This in itself is a big problem. Of course, I'm not totally sure all the
ways that may affect guide dog use, but if braille signage, when available
and accurate, is not very useful to someone, then it seems to me, having a
guide dog could help them find what the signage won't help them find. That
said, there's no substitute for Braille.

-Glenn Moore III
State Secretary,
National Federation of the Blind of Illinois
(find our calendar at nfbofillinois.org/?page_id=158)
nfb.org <http://www.nfb.org>   "Live the Life You Want"

From dsmithnfb at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 19:18:04 2015
From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2015 12:18:04 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <0B5764D2-E17B-4DD0-8192-E11845843698@gmail.com>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>
	<CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAAJqG9je1EWhg88Fx-snXj2Ty172TY48k9OM3ZX-4L8ckjvchw@mail.gmail.com>
	<BDB2A090-9AAF-49F1-88EE-EA5B06900860@gmail.com>
	<1AD31DFB-D5F6-4242-949E-EE77DC6B8F9F@gmail.com>
	<550B9164.8070103@tysdomain.com>
	<CAL=h+uj9=QcYboRbA=4oo4yQY-cytrfFL1qGrY9_45f898Nqkg@mail.gmail.com>
	<4AB84DC8-D78C-4D42-B57E-D46F0E364702@gmail.com>
	<550BCB3A.3050505@tysdomain.com>
	<0B5764D2-E17B-4DD0-8192-E11845843698@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5B231B36-2F26-49FE-8E3B-AA5AF5AC622F@gmail.com>

Hi  all,
 
 I appreciate the  number of thoughtful posts on this thread.  
  I find that sometimes it is difficult to actively  contribute or even consistently read posts on a list when  my fellow listers are engaged in emotionally charged conversations, and I appreciate that  everyone here has basically kept it respectful. 
 It is very easy for one to feel strongly enough about something  that  sometimes we  project that emotion outward more than we realize(trust me, I’ve been  there and will probably be there again). 
   I appreciate that people have looked at   Joe’s post as his own personal view on the matter based upon his personal  experiences, and have respected  not only his  views, but each other’s views. 
   personally, I think   this list is at it’s best when questions  can be asked and answers are thoughtfully given, opinions are expressed respectfully, and the members of  the list  treat each other like a community where we teach, support,and encourage each other.
 I hope that spirit  continues to  live through our words and actions here.  whether  we use a cane, work a dog,or chose neither,  we are  diverse, talented and capable     people that educate and inform others
 respectfully,
  Darian  simply by posting to a list of hundreds.                    
> On Mar 20, 2015, at 7:18 AM, Kirt via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Ty,
> I think I really get where you're coming from here and I don't want to needlessly add fuel to this particular fire. though I have never been a dog handler myself, I think I get where you are irritated. Nevertheless, I do think Joe had A deeper aim than being purposely provocative just for the sake of being a jackass
> Without being overly inflammatory, I think it's safe to say there's a… false mystique about Guide dogs. Many people, sadly even many orientation and mobility instructor's, seem to think of dogs as some sort of panacea, Virtual angels from on high sent to turn even terrible travelers into confident and capable people who can pretty much go wherever they feel like without an improvement of travel skills at all. I'm not trying to say, nor do I think is Joe trying to say that guy dogs are terrible. I think he's just trying to cut through that magical aura of effortless freedom and confidence that seems practically synonymous with guide dogs to most people. To be clear, because apparently I need to be: i've seen how Guide dogs can be very helpful to already solid travelers who choose to go that route. That's fine, and I really think it's quite beside the point of this article. In pretty much every conversation I've seen about guide dogs there is so much overhyped positive emotional rhetoric… And, sometimes, the only way to really counter that is Sharp Rhetoric going the other way. I'm sure most of us have had the experience of signing up for a really really hard class and having a professor, Who turns out to be a wonderful and compelling teacher, Play the hard ass drill sergeant act for the first week or so in order to weed out students who don't really care about the course? I think that's sort of what Joe is trying to do here.
> Best,
> Kirt
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Mar 20, 2015, at 1:24 AM, Littlefield, Tyler via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org <mailto:nabs-l at nfbnet.org>> wrote:
>> 
>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>> Hash: SHA1
>> 
>> I actually read the article twice before I posted. The subject line
>> was as much garbage as the article itself. People talk about how they
>> found positive points to this and I'd still love to see any of them.
>> 
>> Maybe it wasn't Joe's intention, but he really brought down owning a
>> guide to a whole new level. I'm not really interested in a fight over
>> a guide vs cane because I don't really care to.
>> 
>> Basically what my response boils down to is this: if someone has a
>> guide, they know that their dog loves them, is loyal and in general is
>> happy to work. They have a happy furry companion next to them who does
>> some seriously amazing stuff. With that said, the only point I'll give
>> some weight is the expense bit because that is an important
>> consideration. the time is also important, but I feel like you should
>> know if you're going to devote time to your dog. the rest are just
>> pointless babble from what I can tell. I don't really know that
>> someone having their feelings hurt because people ask about their dog
>> rather than them is a compelling reason not to get a guide dog.
>> 
>> In the end, the choice should be left up to the user; the cane Vs
>> Guide issue is relevant to all students. I would like to make sure
>> that people have accurate information though. A post just for the sake
>> of writing a discouraging post does not really fall under that category.
>> 
>> When I started looking at this, I can think of reasons why someone
>> might not want a guide, so that's what I expected. Valid, well-thought
>> out compelling reasons with experience behind them to explain the pros
>> and cons of having a guide. Sadly, I didn't receive any of that.
>> 
>> Best,
>> Ty
>> 
>>> On 3/20/2015 3:16 AM, Justin Harford via nabs-l wrote:
>>> I agree.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 8:41 PM, Brice Smith via nabs-l
>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Did those of you who feel offended actually read the blog, 
>>>> particularly the explanations under the heading, "Damn! Any Words
>>>> of Encouragement?"
>>>> 
>>>> The subject line is purposely and brilliantly provocative--the
>>>> kind that gathers almost a dozen responses in just a couple of
>>>> hours. Joe clearly understands how to use rhetoric to make a
>>>> compelling argument, and some of the knee-jerk reactions on this
>>>> list to this post were disappointing.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Brice
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> On 3/19/15, Littlefield, Tyler via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> wrote:
>>> Positives? You can summarize this up in 5 really fast points. I
>>> seen no positives and really, the negatives aren't huge drawbacks
>>> that were listed. I mean, if you want to tell people not to get a
>>> dog, you surely can do better than that.
>>> 
>>> But I'll address each of these points in turn. 1. It's expensive! 
>>> It can be, yes. There are programs like GDB offers to help with
>>> vet bills, so the food and grooming are really all I have to pay
>>> for. That and toys, which we probably spend way to much money on.
>>> More money than I would usually spend? Certainly, but it's nowhere
>>> near a lot (and I'm a student living on a budget). It's also well
>>> worth the money.
>>> 
>>> 2. It's inconvenient! Yes, taking your dog out must be such hard
>>> work. Wait, I do it every day, what am i talking about? It's not
>>> fun when you're sick and yes, finding a trash can be kind of tough.
>>> That's why O'Mally and Minh's viva know "find the trash." That's
>>> also when social skills come into play. "Excuse me mam, do you see
>>> a trashcan nearby?" Works every time. If you're at an unfamiliar
>>> hotel, you just ask at the front desk and they're usually pretty
>>> cool about it. Airports also have relieving areas. Unless you
>>> travel twice a week, a couple hours of slightly less leg room (and
>>> I'm fairly tall) is really not that big of a deal.
>>> 
>>> 3. It's time-consuming! Yes, having a dog does take time. You'd
>>> think this would be inherently obvious, but it was needed to be
>>> pointed out here. You don't need to go for 12 mile runs, O'mally
>>> and I have left today to relieve and that was pretty much it. I
>>> played with him and listened to a book and sat with him on the
>>> floor for a bit. He's totally happy and hasn't demolished
>>> anything.
>>> 
>>> 4. It's unwelcomed attention! I find it kind of funny you're
>>> talking about being covert and not making a name for yourself with
>>> complaints when the NFB files more lawsuits than I can keep up
>>> with. But beyond that, I've never been turned down from eating
>>> because I have a dog. Cabs, certainly; we all have. If an
>>> establishment turns me down, I'll make sure that people know they
>>> did it and they're not treating me equally. Just because I'm blind
>>> doesn't mean I should sit in the corner and hope that things get 
>>> better; I want to educate people. I've had a lot of really amazing 
>>> people come up and talk to me and ask questions about my guide. It 
>>> certainly does get a bit trying at times, but in no way is it a
>>> huge problem. I am sorry however if you're not the center of the
>>> topics and people do ask about your dog. It happens.
>>> 
>>> 5. It can be dirty work! Best not ever get sick by yourself then,
>>> or have kids, or anything else. Yes, it can be tough. If you're
>>> squeamish maybe it's not for you. Cleaning up doggy vomit really
>>> isn't the best part of my day, but you do it. mostly because these
>>> dogs do so much for you and if O'mally is sick I'm worried about
>>> him and just want him to get better. You do it because you love
>>> your dog.
>>> 
>>> "If you were contemplating a dog, came across this post and felt 
>>> discouraged, you should not get a dog. It's a lot of work. It's a
>>> lot of responsibility. It's constant care and attention and a
>>> commitment to keep up the dog's level of training. No one will
>>> fault you for being mature enough to walk away."
>>> 
>>> So let me sum this up: expensive; inconvenient; time-consuming; 
>>> unwelcome attention; messy work. Yeah, I'd say you probably
>>> shouldn't have a dog. Please though, do try to at least provide
>>> constructive and good information on both sides of this issue. The
>>> issues you raised were incredibly self-centered, rude, generalizing
>>> and really didn't convey any issues beyond negative criticism.
>>> 
>>> My guide does amazing work each and every day. when I pick up his 
>>> harness, he's by my side, tail wagging ready to work for me. He
>>> only asks that I give him love, attention and take care of him with
>>> vet visits, grooming and toys. Given the amount of travel that he
>>> has enabled me to do (I am and was proficient with a cane), I think
>>> it only fitting that I pay for his food, give him attention, clean
>>> up after him when he's sick and treat him well. My guide loves me,
>>> no questions asked. while I somewhat understand these points, I
>>> think anyone who has actually had a guide would really agree that
>>> they are huge issues that should prevent you from getting one.
>>> 
>>> At first, this looked like a trolling post; it still feels like a 
>>> trolling post.
>>> 
>>> Be well, Ty
>>>>>>> On 3/19/2015 10:20 PM, Justin Harford via nabs-l wrote: At
>>>>>>> first, this looked like a trolling post, but after I
>>>>>>> actually read the article, I  enjoyed it.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> It is a very frank and honest examination of the positives
>>>>>>> and negatives of one individual's experience with a guide
>>>>>>> dog, and clearly reads as the opinion of one person.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Regards Justin
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:52 PM, Juanita Herrera via nabs-l 
>>>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Being a guide dog user myself, I found the blog offensive
>>>>>>>> and thought of how other guide dog handlers might feel. I
>>>>>>>> didn't want to generalize like the blog seems to do but I
>>>>>>>> felt that if I felt offended by it many other people
>>>>>>>> would have too. I would have appreciated it more if
>>>>>>>> somewhere in the blog post it would have been
>>>>>>>> acknowledged that this was one person's opinion, and not 
>>>>>>>> make it seen as if though everyone possessed the same
>>>>>>>> opinion. Being that I am a guide dog user and have been
>>>>>>>> for three years, it has been one of the best experiences
>>>>>>>> of my life. I would never change it for anything, and I
>>>>>>>> don't consider going back to using a cane after I have to
>>>>>>>> retire my dog. Therefore, I highly disagree with the blog
>>>>>>>> post. However, I must reinstate that this is simply my
>>>>>>>> opinion. Juanita
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:28 PM, minh ha via nabs-l 
>>>>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> I agree with Aleeha's sentiments one hundred percent.
>>>>>>>>> Over generalization is a huge mistake to do under any
>>>>>>>>> circumstances, and this blog post was offensive to me
>>>>>>>>> and other guide dog handlers on so many levels. If you
>>>>>>>>> want to write a fair and informative blog post about
>>>>>>>>> the guide dog lifestyle, then by all means, point out
>>>>>>>>> the negative aspects, but do not conveniently forget to
>>>>>>>>> mention the thousand of other more positive and
>>>>>>>>> beneficial impacts that a guide dog can have on a 
>>>>>>>>> person's life. Yes, a guide dog is not the right choice
>>>>>>>>> for everyone and a blind person needs to think long and
>>>>>>>>> hard before getting one, but for the right reasons, a
>>>>>>>>> guide dog can completely turn someone's life around and
>>>>>>>>> give them the confidence in order to live life more
>>>>>>>>> productively. Honestly, your five reasons seem very
>>>>>>>>> childish, and i have to wonder if they are that
>>>>>>>>> important to you, then you should be contemplating
>>>>>>>>> about getting another guide dog at all.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Respectfully, Minh and my hard working little guide,
>>>>>>>>> Viva
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> On 3/19/15, Aleeha Dudley via nabs-l
>>>>>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote: Personally, I find your
>>>>>>>>>> subject line a bit offensive, as it assumes that
>>>>>>>>>> guide dogs are a terrible idea for everyone. Being
>>>>>>>>>> the proud handler of a wonderful dog myself, and a
>>>>>>>>>> quite independent cane traveller before that, I am a 
>>>>>>>>>> bit upset as what I find to be a somewhat
>>>>>>>>>> inflammatory post. You are right; guide dogs are not
>>>>>>>>>> for everyone. They are a huge responsibility and need
>>>>>>>>>> a lot of daily care. But to say that there are five
>>>>>>>>>> reasons why a guide dog is a terrile idea seems to be
>>>>>>>>>> going too far, especially addressing such a large
>>>>>>>>>> body of people such as that on this list. Now,
>>>>>>>>>> having clicked the link and read the blog, I know
>>>>>>>>>> that you are making an attempt to be fair and point
>>>>>>>>>> out the disadvantages, but to not point out that this
>>>>>>>>>> was a blog post or an opinion article, can make some
>>>>>>>>>> folks pretty mad fairly quickly. Can wa choose our
>>>>>>>>>> words and subject lines a little more wisely next
>>>>>>>>>> time? Aleha and Dallas, Seeing Eye dog extrordinaire
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> On 3/19/15, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: If you're blind, you obviously read Braille.
>>>>>>>>>>> Your hearing must naturally be superior to your
>>>>>>>>>>> sighted peers, and of course you have a guide dog!
>>>>>>>>>>> Right?
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the
>>>>>>>>>>> first and second. Someone recently told me the
>>>>>>>>>>> number of guide dog users has actually declined in
>>>>>>>>>>> my millennial generation. I have no evidence
>>>>>>>>>>> proving this one way or the other, but for the
>>>>>>>>>>> general public, to see a blind person with a guide
>>>>>>>>>>> dog feels as natural as butter and toast.
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for 
>>>>>>>>>>> everyone. Or, maybe I'm just projecting my own 
>>>>>>>>>>> uncertainties onto the rest of the community?
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> Last November I took the first step in the
>>>>>>>>>>> application process to return for a second Seeing
>>>>>>>>>>> Eye dog. It's been more than three years since I
>>>>>>>>>>> lost Gator, and even though I've gotten around just
>>>>>>>>>>> fine with a white cane, I am approaching what feels
>>>>>>>>>>> like the final years with sight, however minimal
>>>>>>>>>>> that sight might be. I admit it's unnerving if I
>>>>>>>>>>> sit still long enough to contemplate total
>>>>>>>>>>> blindness. NFB philosophy be damned, and the
>>>>>>>>>>> thought of an extra set of eyes to help me navigate
>>>>>>>>>>> the world does bring a measure of comfort. But, is
>>>>>>>>>>> it enough to go get another dog?
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> In no particular order, here are reasons why a
>>>>>>>>>>> guide dog would be a terrible idea:
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> Read more:
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-terrible-idea/
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org 
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>> for nabs-l: 
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com
>>>> 
>>>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org 
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>> for nabs-l: 
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindstein%40gmail.com
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing
>>> list nabs-l at nfbnet.org 
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l: 
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/tyler%40tysdomain.com
>> - -- 
>> Take care,
>> Ty
>> twitter: @sorressean
>> web:http://tysdomain.com
>> pubkey: http://tysdomain.com/files/pubkey.asc
>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
>> Version: GnuPG v2
>> 
>> iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJVC8s6AAoJEAdP60+BYxejMMcH/2HWFLcs1KNN3MU+mxc9OnwO
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>> pBSOmrZWdICrm/05+qUgXRqPDM18PGS4GUPYhPxbsu4FhKpVSxZEBrLFMpPm+YwI
>> Sy/G8xSrkyEgl5iRdPn6f6TvZiMSbuIZWdkOd27XGZBe7QN4zrV0bmLk7Ifnjh7n
>> WCZ8CBsGs0JAGqPv8yVF6Bb2STr6vgFfbUMiFuq5H2+H1FdyhdjOiYD5RXo1b0GH
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>> =9Uvg
>> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
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> 
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From jsoro620 at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 20:21:22 2015
From: jsoro620 at gmail.com (Joe)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2015 16:21:22 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <0B5764D2-E17B-4DD0-8192-E11845843698@gmail.com>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>	<CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>	<CAAJqG9je1EWhg88Fx-snXj2Ty172TY48k9OM3ZX-4L8ckjvchw@mail.gmail.com>	<BDB2A090-9AAF-49F1-88EE-EA5B06900860@gmail.com>	<1AD31DFB-D5F6-4242-949E-EE77DC6B8F9F@gmail.com>	<550B9164.8070103@tysdomain.com>	<CAL=h+uj9=QcYboRbA=4oo4yQY-cytrfFL1qGrY9_45f898Nqkg@mail.gmail.com>	<4AB84DC8-D78C-4D42-B57E-D46F0E364702@gmail.com>	<550BCB3A.3050505@tysdomain.com>
	<0B5764D2-E17B-4DD0-8192-E11845843698@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <000d01d0634b$6eb83f50$4c28bdf0$@gmail.com>

Kirt and others,

Thanks for understanding the title hook there. There was no malice intended in my blog. In fact, I start out by pointing out I'm in the application process to get a second guide dog, and as jarring as the objections to getting a dog are, I go back and refute my own points in the conclusion. I never intended to write just another piece celebrating the usual pros and cons of getting a guide dog, because even previous pieces about the cons of getting a con tend to be a bit superficial. In short, why be boring and spout the usual marketing soundbites? But, regardless of your feelings on the article itself, I encourage you guys to read the comments below the article, which are more insightful than my own writing and give you a wider perspective from other people. And, if you were nonetheless offended by my piece on guide dogs, I'm thinking you probably don't want to read my future piece on training centers... Good and bad, I appreciated your guys' feedback.

Joe

--
Musings of a Work in Progress:
www.JoeOrozco.com/

Twitter: @ScribblingJoe


-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kirt via nabs-l
Sent: Friday, March 20, 2015 10:18 AM
To: tyler at tysdomain.com; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!

Ty,
I think I really get where you're coming from here and I don't want to needlessly add fuel to this particular fire. though I have never been a dog handler myself, I think I get where you are irritated. Nevertheless, I do think Joe had A deeper aim than being purposely provocative just for the sake of being a jackass Without being overly inflammatory, I think it's safe to say there's a… false mystique about Guide dogs. Many people, sadly even many orientation and mobility instructor's, seem to think of dogs as some sort of panacea, Virtual angels from on high sent to turn even terrible travelers into confident and capable people who can pretty much go wherever they feel like without an improvement of travel skills at all. I'm not trying to say, nor do I think is Joe trying to say that guy dogs are terrible. I think he's just trying to cut through that magical aura of effortless freedom and confidence that seems practically synonymous with guide dogs to most people. To be clear, because apparently I need to be: i've seen how Guide dogs can be very helpful to already solid travelers who choose to go that route. That's fine, and I really think it's quite beside the point of this article. In pretty much every conversation I've seen about guide dogs there is so much overhyped positive emotional rhetoric… And, sometimes, the only way to really counter that is Sharp Rhetoric going the other way. I'm sure most of us have had the experience of signing up for a really really hard class and having a professor, Who turns out to be a wonderful and compelling teacher, Play the hard ass drill sergeant act for the first week or so in order to weed out students who don't really care about the course? I think that's sort of what Joe is trying to do here.
Best,
Kirt

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 20, 2015, at 1:24 AM, Littlefield, Tyler via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> I actually read the article twice before I posted. The subject line 
> was as much garbage as the article itself. People talk about how they 
> found positive points to this and I'd still love to see any of them.
> 
> Maybe it wasn't Joe's intention, but he really brought down owning a 
> guide to a whole new level. I'm not really interested in a fight over 
> a guide vs cane because I don't really care to.
> 
> Basically what my response boils down to is this: if someone has a 
> guide, they know that their dog loves them, is loyal and in general is 
> happy to work. They have a happy furry companion next to them who does 
> some seriously amazing stuff. With that said, the only point I'll give 
> some weight is the expense bit because that is an important 
> consideration. the time is also important, but I feel like you should 
> know if you're going to devote time to your dog. the rest are just 
> pointless babble from what I can tell. I don't really know that 
> someone having their feelings hurt because people ask about their dog 
> rather than them is a compelling reason not to get a guide dog.
> 
> In the end, the choice should be left up to the user; the cane Vs 
> Guide issue is relevant to all students. I would like to make sure 
> that people have accurate information though. A post just for the sake 
> of writing a discouraging post does not really fall under that category.
> 
> When I started looking at this, I can think of reasons why someone 
> might not want a guide, so that's what I expected. Valid, well-thought 
> out compelling reasons with experience behind them to explain the pros 
> and cons of having a guide. Sadly, I didn't receive any of that.
> 
> Best,
> Ty
> 
>> On 3/20/2015 3:16 AM, Justin Harford via nabs-l wrote:
>> I agree.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 8:41 PM, Brice Smith via nabs-l 
>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Did those of you who feel offended actually read the blog, 
>>> particularly the explanations under the heading, "Damn! Any Words of 
>>> Encouragement?"
>>> 
>>> The subject line is purposely and brilliantly provocative--the kind 
>>> that gathers almost a dozen responses in just a couple of hours. Joe 
>>> clearly understands how to use rhetoric to make a compelling 
>>> argument, and some of the knee-jerk reactions on this list to this 
>>> post were disappointing.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Brice
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On 3/19/15, Littlefield, Tyler via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>> wrote:
>> Positives? You can summarize this up in 5 really fast points. I seen 
>> no positives and really, the negatives aren't huge drawbacks that 
>> were listed. I mean, if you want to tell people not to get a dog, you 
>> surely can do better than that.
>> 
>> But I'll address each of these points in turn. 1. It's expensive! 
>> It can be, yes. There are programs like GDB offers to help with vet 
>> bills, so the food and grooming are really all I have to pay for. 
>> That and toys, which we probably spend way to much money on.
>> More money than I would usually spend? Certainly, but it's nowhere 
>> near a lot (and I'm a student living on a budget). It's also well 
>> worth the money.
>> 
>> 2. It's inconvenient! Yes, taking your dog out must be such hard 
>> work. Wait, I do it every day, what am i talking about? It's not fun 
>> when you're sick and yes, finding a trash can be kind of tough.
>> That's why O'Mally and Minh's viva know "find the trash." That's also 
>> when social skills come into play. "Excuse me mam, do you see a 
>> trashcan nearby?" Works every time. If you're at an unfamiliar hotel, 
>> you just ask at the front desk and they're usually pretty cool about 
>> it. Airports also have relieving areas. Unless you travel twice a 
>> week, a couple hours of slightly less leg room (and I'm fairly tall) 
>> is really not that big of a deal.
>> 
>> 3. It's time-consuming! Yes, having a dog does take time. You'd think 
>> this would be inherently obvious, but it was needed to be pointed out 
>> here. You don't need to go for 12 mile runs, O'mally and I have left 
>> today to relieve and that was pretty much it. I played with him and 
>> listened to a book and sat with him on the floor for a bit. He's 
>> totally happy and hasn't demolished anything.
>> 
>> 4. It's unwelcomed attention! I find it kind of funny you're talking 
>> about being covert and not making a name for yourself with complaints 
>> when the NFB files more lawsuits than I can keep up with. But beyond 
>> that, I've never been turned down from eating because I have a dog. 
>> Cabs, certainly; we all have. If an establishment turns me down, I'll 
>> make sure that people know they did it and they're not treating me 
>> equally. Just because I'm blind doesn't mean I should sit in the 
>> corner and hope that things get better; I want to educate people. 
>> I've had a lot of really amazing people come up and talk to me and 
>> ask questions about my guide. It certainly does get a bit trying at 
>> times, but in no way is it a huge problem. I am sorry however if 
>> you're not the center of the topics and people do ask about your dog. 
>> It happens.
>> 
>> 5. It can be dirty work! Best not ever get sick by yourself then, or 
>> have kids, or anything else. Yes, it can be tough. If you're 
>> squeamish maybe it's not for you. Cleaning up doggy vomit really 
>> isn't the best part of my day, but you do it. mostly because these 
>> dogs do so much for you and if O'mally is sick I'm worried about him 
>> and just want him to get better. You do it because you love your dog.
>> 
>> "If you were contemplating a dog, came across this post and felt 
>> discouraged, you should not get a dog. It's a lot of work. It's a lot 
>> of responsibility. It's constant care and attention and a commitment 
>> to keep up the dog's level of training. No one will fault you for 
>> being mature enough to walk away."
>> 
>> So let me sum this up: expensive; inconvenient; time-consuming; 
>> unwelcome attention; messy work. Yeah, I'd say you probably shouldn't 
>> have a dog. Please though, do try to at least provide constructive 
>> and good information on both sides of this issue. The issues you 
>> raised were incredibly self-centered, rude, generalizing and really 
>> didn't convey any issues beyond negative criticism.
>> 
>> My guide does amazing work each and every day. when I pick up his 
>> harness, he's by my side, tail wagging ready to work for me. He only 
>> asks that I give him love, attention and take care of him with vet 
>> visits, grooming and toys. Given the amount of travel that he has 
>> enabled me to do (I am and was proficient with a cane), I think it 
>> only fitting that I pay for his food, give him attention, clean up 
>> after him when he's sick and treat him well. My guide loves me, no 
>> questions asked. while I somewhat understand these points, I think 
>> anyone who has actually had a guide would really agree that they are 
>> huge issues that should prevent you from getting one.
>> 
>> At first, this looked like a trolling post; it still feels like a 
>> trolling post.
>> 
>> Be well, Ty
>>>>>> On 3/19/2015 10:20 PM, Justin Harford via nabs-l wrote: At first, 
>>>>>> this looked like a trolling post, but after I actually read the 
>>>>>> article, I  enjoyed it.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> It is a very frank and honest examination of the positives and 
>>>>>> negatives of one individual's experience with a guide dog, and 
>>>>>> clearly reads as the opinion of one person.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Regards Justin
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:52 PM, Juanita Herrera via nabs-l 
>>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Being a guide dog user myself, I found the blog offensive and 
>>>>>>> thought of how other guide dog handlers might feel. I didn't 
>>>>>>> want to generalize like the blog seems to do but I felt that if 
>>>>>>> I felt offended by it many other people would have too. I would 
>>>>>>> have appreciated it more if somewhere in the blog post it would 
>>>>>>> have been acknowledged that this was one person's opinion, and 
>>>>>>> not make it seen as if though everyone possessed the same 
>>>>>>> opinion. Being that I am a guide dog user and have been for 
>>>>>>> three years, it has been one of the best experiences of my life. 
>>>>>>> I would never change it for anything, and I don't consider going 
>>>>>>> back to using a cane after I have to retire my dog. Therefore, I 
>>>>>>> highly disagree with the blog post. However, I must reinstate 
>>>>>>> that this is simply my opinion. Juanita
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:28 PM, minh ha via nabs-l 
>>>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> I agree with Aleeha's sentiments one hundred percent.
>>>>>>>> Over generalization is a huge mistake to do under any 
>>>>>>>> circumstances, and this blog post was offensive to me and other 
>>>>>>>> guide dog handlers on so many levels. If you want to write a 
>>>>>>>> fair and informative blog post about the guide dog lifestyle, 
>>>>>>>> then by all means, point out the negative aspects, but do not 
>>>>>>>> conveniently forget to mention the thousand of other more 
>>>>>>>> positive and beneficial impacts that a guide dog can have on a 
>>>>>>>> person's life. Yes, a guide dog is not the right choice for 
>>>>>>>> everyone and a blind person needs to think long and hard before 
>>>>>>>> getting one, but for the right reasons, a guide dog can 
>>>>>>>> completely turn someone's life around and give them the 
>>>>>>>> confidence in order to live life more productively. Honestly, 
>>>>>>>> your five reasons seem very childish, and i have to wonder if 
>>>>>>>> they are that important to you, then you should be 
>>>>>>>> contemplating about getting another guide dog at all.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Respectfully, Minh and my hard working little guide, Viva
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> On 3/19/15, Aleeha Dudley via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> 
>>>>>>>>> wrote: Personally, I find your subject line a bit offensive, 
>>>>>>>>> as it assumes that guide dogs are a terrible idea for 
>>>>>>>>> everyone. Being the proud handler of a wonderful dog myself, 
>>>>>>>>> and a quite independent cane traveller before that, I am a bit 
>>>>>>>>> upset as what I find to be a somewhat inflammatory post. You 
>>>>>>>>> are right; guide dogs are not for everyone. They are a huge 
>>>>>>>>> responsibility and need a lot of daily care. But to say that 
>>>>>>>>> there are five reasons why a guide dog is a terrile idea seems 
>>>>>>>>> to be going too far, especially addressing such a large body 
>>>>>>>>> of people such as that on this list. Now, having clicked the 
>>>>>>>>> link and read the blog, I know that you are making an attempt 
>>>>>>>>> to be fair and point out the disadvantages, but to not point 
>>>>>>>>> out that this was a blog post or an opinion article, can make 
>>>>>>>>> some folks pretty mad fairly quickly. Can wa choose our words 
>>>>>>>>> and subject lines a little more wisely next time? Aleha and 
>>>>>>>>> Dallas, Seeing Eye dog extrordinaire
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> On 3/19/15, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>>> wrote: If you're blind, you obviously read Braille.
>>>>>>>>>> Your hearing must naturally be superior to your sighted 
>>>>>>>>>> peers, and of course you have a guide dog!
>>>>>>>>>> Right?
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the first and 
>>>>>>>>>> second. Someone recently told me the number of guide dog 
>>>>>>>>>> users has actually declined in my millennial generation. I 
>>>>>>>>>> have no evidence proving this one way or the other, but for 
>>>>>>>>>> the general public, to see a blind person with a guide dog 
>>>>>>>>>> feels as natural as butter and toast.
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for everyone. 
>>>>>>>>>> Or, maybe I'm just projecting my own uncertainties onto the 
>>>>>>>>>> rest of the community?
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Last November I took the first step in the application 
>>>>>>>>>> process to return for a second Seeing Eye dog. It's been more 
>>>>>>>>>> than three years since I lost Gator, and even though I've 
>>>>>>>>>> gotten around just fine with a white cane, I am approaching 
>>>>>>>>>> what feels like the final years with sight, however minimal 
>>>>>>>>>> that sight might be. I admit it's unnerving if I sit still 
>>>>>>>>>> long enough to contemplate total blindness. NFB philosophy be 
>>>>>>>>>> damned, and the thought of an extra set of eyes to help me 
>>>>>>>>>> navigate the world does bring a measure of comfort. But, is 
>>>>>>>>>> it enough to go get another dog?
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> In no particular order, here are reasons why a guide dog 
>>>>>>>>>> would be a terrible idea:
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Read more:
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a
>>>>>>>>>> -terrible-idea/
>>>> 
>>>> 
> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org 
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To 
>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%
>>>> 40gmail.com
>>> 
>>> 
> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org 
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, 
>>> change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
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>>> il.com
>> 
>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing list 
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org 
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, 
>> change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l: 
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/tyler%40tysdomain
>> .com
> - --
> Take care,
> Ty
> twitter: @sorressean
> web:http://tysdomain.com
> pubkey: http://tysdomain.com/files/pubkey.asc
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> 
> _______________________________________________
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From dsmithnfb at gmail.com  Sat Mar 21 00:28:42 2015
From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2015 17:28:42 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Seeking input on community service division agenda at 2015
	convention
Message-ID: <5F7700FF-DD37-48C5-A55D-47B18ADEE84B@gmail.com>

Hi all,
 the  National Federation of the Blind Community Service Division  is seeking suggestions  for topics and  speakers  for our 2015 Division Seminar.   If you have any  suggestions, please feel free to   send those suggestions along at  dsmithnfb at gmail.com <mailto:dsmithnfb at gmail.com>
 
  Many  Thanks,
  Darian 

From djackson at BISM.org  Sat Mar 21 01:05:40 2015
From: djackson at BISM.org (Dezman Jackson)
Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2015 01:05:40 +0000
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <F2960AF4-14E4-4414-928B-6CEE131E1F7D@gmail.com>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>
	<CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>,
	<F2960AF4-14E4-4414-928B-6CEE131E1F7D@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <A53A758F-3275-4D5E-A9FD-DB5A1288E771@BISM.org>

I have read the blog in it's entireity including all of the comments. Sounds to me that as a previous dog guide user, he's earned the right to give commentary on the subject. I say great food for thought.

Kindest regards,
Dezman Jackson

> On Mar 19, 2015, at 11:56 PM, Jamie Principato via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Why are people so sensitive about their choice to use a cane or a dog that they'd get upset over someone's choice of subject line? If you are confident in your choice to have a guide dog, one person's subject line on a casual mailing list isn't going to rattle that or harm you or effect your life and that of your dog in any way, especially once you actually read the well thought out and well composed blog post attached to it. No one has to agree with your reasons for having a dog or a cane, and they shouldn't have to walk on eggshells to be careful not to offend that choice. You should be proud of what you choose, or at least secure in your choice, enough that a simple subject line doesn't put you immediately on the defensive. 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 7:00 PM, Aleeha Dudley via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Personally, I find your subject line a bit offensive, as it assumes
>> that guide dogs are a terrible idea for everyone. Being the proud
>> handler of a wonderful dog myself, and a quite independent cane
>> traveller before that, I am a bit upset as what I find to be a
>> somewhat inflammatory post. You are right; guide dogs are not for
>> everyone. They are a huge responsibility and need a lot of daily care.
>> But to say that there are five reasons why a guide dog is a terrile
>> idea seems to be going too far, especially addressing such a large
>> body of people such as that on this list. Now, having clicked the link
>> and read the blog, I know that you are making an attempt to be fair
>> and point out the disadvantages, but to not point out that this was a
>> blog post or an opinion article, can make some folks pretty mad fairly
>> quickly. Can wa choose our words and subject lines a little more
>> wisely next time?
>> Aleha and Dallas, Seeing Eye dog extrordinaire
>> 
>>> On 3/19/15, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>> If you're blind, you obviously read Braille. Your hearing must naturally be
>>> superior to your sighted peers, and of course you have a guide dog! Right?
>>> 
>>> Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the first and second. Someone
>>> recently told me the number of guide dog users has actually declined in my
>>> millennial generation. I have no evidence proving this one way or the
>>> other,
>>> but for the general public, to see a blind person with a guide dog feels as
>>> natural as butter and toast.
>>> 
>>> Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for everyone. Or, maybe I'm
>>> just projecting my own uncertainties onto the rest of the community?
>>> 
>>> Last November I took the first step in the application process to return
>>> for
>>> a second Seeing Eye dog. It's been more than three years since I lost
>>> Gator,
>>> and even though I've gotten around just fine with a white cane, I am
>>> approaching what feels like the final years with sight, however minimal
>>> that
>>> sight might be. I admit it's unnerving if I sit still long enough to
>>> contemplate total blindness. NFB philosophy be damned, and the thought of
>>> an
>>> extra set of eyes to help me navigate the world does bring a measure of
>>> comfort. But, is it enough to go get another dog?
>>> 
>>> In no particular order, here are reasons why a guide dog would be a
>>> terrible
>>> idea:
>>> 
>>> Read more:
>>> 
>>> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-terrible-idea/
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Musings of a Work in Progress:
>>> www.JoeOrozco.com/
>>> 
>>> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> Aleeha Dudley and Seeing Eye Yellow Labrador Dallas
>> Vice President, Ohio Association of Blind Students
>> Email: blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com
>> Follow me on Twitter at @blindcowgirl199
>> 
>> The wind of heaven is that which blows between a horse's ears.
>> - Arabian Proverb
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
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> 
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From jsoro620 at gmail.com  Sat Mar 21 02:53:15 2015
From: jsoro620 at gmail.com (Joe)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2015 22:53:15 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <A53A758F-3275-4D5E-A9FD-DB5A1288E771@BISM.org>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>	<CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>,
	<F2960AF4-14E4-4414-928B-6CEE131E1F7D@gmail.com>
	<A53A758F-3275-4D5E-A9FD-DB5A1288E771@BISM.org>
Message-ID: <007501d06382$2deb2d70$89c18850$@gmail.com>

In the interest of tipping my hand to more traditional posts concerning
guide dogs, I'll share an older article I wrote in the months after I put my
first guide dog to sleep three years ago. I linked to this piece from this
most recent article, which people could have clicked and seen my balanced
view for what it is, but alas, I know it can be too much work. LOL I'm
kidding.

Anyway, here's the text:

Honestly, I was not fully convinced I'd get a guide dog until I actually set
foot on The Seeing Eye campus. Now don't take that personally. I was worried
about getting a bad match or a great match with a fruity name like Squiggles
or Pumpkin or some
such nonsense you sometimes see come out of guide dog schools, and was I
really ready for the responsibilities of a trained dog? I think I also
feared becoming one of those obsessed guide dog owners who sign their
e-mails with their dogs' names.

You were the perfect match from the beginning. I have never met and doubt I
will ever meet another dog named Gator, and when I was informed you were a
German shepherd, I just about squeaked like a schoolgirl, if you can imagine
a squeak coming from my otherwise monotone self. You were the largest dog in
the class, as regal as you were stubborn, and when I learned halfway through
our training that I was your last hope before they dropped you from the
program on account of your strength, I knew it was destiny.

People sometimes have a hard time believing the stories. They can believe
you survived the white water rapids in Colorado. They can believe you were
intelligent enough to pull me out of the path of an oncoming train. They
become a little skeptical when I tell them that during that aforementioned
Colorado trip; you nonchalantly climbed up a vertical wooden ladder like a
common monkey. But some have a hard time believing that you were clever
enough to toss your head so as to catch your bell collar in your mouth, the
better to get into the trashcan without being heard. It's too bad you never
failed to knock over the can and give yourself away, and I haven't worked
out how you planned on eating around the bell even if you had succeeded.

That isn't to say we didn't have our rough spots. The day you casually
relieved yourself in the airport was not amusing. Once could have been
chalked up to nature. Twice was suspicious, and after the third I had to
think long and hard about whether I really wanted you to travel with me down
the street, let alone across the country. I knew you weren't a healthy boy.
It's something I accepted and dealt with, but sometimes, I wondered what I'd
done to deserve your wrath. Did you really have to sneak a dead bird into
the apartment?

I'm sure others would have their own stories of woe. Somehow, I don't think
my college debate squad completely forgave me for keeping their suits in a
perpetual state of dog fuzz while at tournaments. The lady whose fries you
snagged while guiding me through a restaurant did not share your high
opinion of your so called stealth.

There are other stories, but why embarrass you. Or rather, why embarrass
myself, since somehow I doubt you felt an an ounce of remorse for the stunts
you pulled. It's too likely to generate questions about whether I was a bad
handler or you were just a bad dog. You were an independent spirit. That's
why you had to pretend to give it a shot with the first two blind students
before you got to me. And me, I wouldn't have changed anything about you.

It's now been almost three months since you left. I'm not as likely to break
down the way I did in the week after I had to put you down, but part of me
still listens for the familiar sound of your collar jingle, the distinct
rhythm of your paws and the contented sighs/groans that made taking you to
class so entertaining for the unsuspecting professors. Part of me still
plans on waking up early to let you out, because your bladder was always
more sensitive. Part of me forgets that it's no longer necessary to round up
all the medicines at feeding time, but as seemingly easier as things are
now, I would do it all over again. It's at these times of remembrance that I
can't help but feel that my agony of your loss is as fresh as if it had only
happened yesterday.

We found out about your cancer on a Wednesday morning. I tried to ignore the
grim reality that the vets only gave you a few days, but if a few days is
what you had, then a few days is what I was willing to give you. Only, you
got worse. Maybe it was knowing what the problem was that made your slow
walk and lethargic spirit more pronounced. Regardless, I hated to see you in
such a state, and I hope the walk off leash through the woods and McDonald's
meal in some measure made up for our having to finally take you to the vet
that Thursday evening. I now know it was the right thing to do, or as right,
as such a thing can ever be. I just hate that after walking through those
woods, your last memory had to be of a hospital room.

My last memory of you is of your head on my lap. You were so brave. I think
you knew what was going to happen, and you faced it head on in much the same
way you jumped into the raft to face those crazy rapids. I think it's this
memory that will help me face obstacles in the years to come. You may have
shied away from firecrackers, and the sound of popping the air bubbles in
those packing strips drove you nuts. Yet, in the end you more than rose to
the challenge of moving on with a highest degree of dignity.

Random thought, but do you remember the time you ate a whole pizza? I was so
astonished to have found the pizza box knocked from the table with nothing
but crusts left. Oh, you had a good habit of working my nerves at times, but
that was one of the times I couldn't help but laugh at your cleverness.
Perhaps it was payback. If you couldn't get away with trash hunting, then by
golly you'd go for the Pizza Hut!

Thank you for showing me another side to nature. I always knew dogs were
intelligent, but never in my wildest dreams did I believe I could ever be so
incredibly attached to a creature. Thank you for helping me navigate crazy
streets and even crazier train stations. Thank you for being a constant
companion and for randomly coming up and resting your head on my lap when
you knew the comfort was welcomed. Thank you for walking one more time
around the block on the afternoon I knew it would be over. You were slower,
more cautious, but your work ethic was as steady then as it was the first
time I took you around the track at The Seeing Eye. I haven't decided about
going back for another dog, but regardless, no dog will ever replace the
beauty that was you.

Find us a good house up there. Be a good boy, and enjoy your new life as a
healthy dog that will never need pills or shots to be at peace. We miss you
down here. We'll be along later, and then we'll see if you're still up for
another round of tug of war.

"God be with you till we meet again."

June 20, 2002 - January 19, 2012



From helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com  Sat Mar 21 05:52:34 2015
From: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com (helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com)
Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2015 01:52:34 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <007501d06382$2deb2d70$89c18850$@gmail.com>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>	<CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>,
	<F2960AF4-14E4-4414-928B-6CEE131E1F7D@gmail.com><A53A758F-3275-4D5E-A9FD-DB5A1288E771@BISM.org>
	<007501d06382$2deb2d70$89c18850$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AE3C2B32E0654BE2A0099B82982EA66F@Helga>

Hi Joe and all! How are you all? Hey Joe, I found your story regarding your 
guide dog very emotional and also very interesting! I understand that it 
must have been very difficult to made that decission. Just to let you know, 
I'm actually considering in getting a guide dog this year! I did not apply 
yet, I'm going to apply on July since I'm going to be doing something before 
July, and also because I think my family and I are going to probably be 
moving! to a house since I currently live in an apartment and I think a 
house is a better place for my gide dog. However, this is going to be my 
first guide dog! And I know that it will be a lot of responsibility and I 
have to do more things that I ever did before, but I think it will be a 
great experience! I hope that I don't have to experience the same thing that 
you went through with Gator, but I know that it was probably for a purpose 
that things occur. And God had everything under control that day when you 
receive the bad news regarding Gator's health. But if I deal with the same 
thing, I know that God has a purpose for it and that He will not make you go 
through something if he knows that you can't handle it! Thanks so much for 
listening to me and if you want to talk to me more about this, feel free to 
contact me ok? My contact info is located below in my email signature! 
Thanks so much and have a nice day. God bless!



Helga Schreiber

Fundraiser Coordinator for Phi Theta Kappa, Alpha Delta Iota chapter
Member of National Federation of the Blind and Florida Association of Blind 
Students
Member of The International Networkers Team (INT)
Independent Entrepreneur of the Company 4Life Research

Phone: (561) 706-5950
Email: helga.schreiber26 at gmail.com
Skype: helga.schreiber26
4Life Website: http://helgaschreiber.my4life.com/1/default.aspx
INT Website: http://int4life.com/

"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever 
believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16
-----Original Message----- 
From: Joe via nabs-l
Sent: Friday, March 20, 2015 10:53 PM
To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!

In the interest of tipping my hand to more traditional posts concerning
guide dogs, I'll share an older article I wrote in the months after I put my
first guide dog to sleep three years ago. I linked to this piece from this
most recent article, which people could have clicked and seen my balanced
view for what it is, but alas, I know it can be too much work. LOL I'm
kidding.

Anyway, here's the text:

Honestly, I was not fully convinced I'd get a guide dog until I actually set
foot on The Seeing Eye campus. Now don't take that personally. I was worried
about getting a bad match or a great match with a fruity name like Squiggles
or Pumpkin or some
such nonsense you sometimes see come out of guide dog schools, and was I
really ready for the responsibilities of a trained dog? I think I also
feared becoming one of those obsessed guide dog owners who sign their
e-mails with their dogs' names.

You were the perfect match from the beginning. I have never met and doubt I
will ever meet another dog named Gator, and when I was informed you were a
German shepherd, I just about squeaked like a schoolgirl, if you can imagine
a squeak coming from my otherwise monotone self. You were the largest dog in
the class, as regal as you were stubborn, and when I learned halfway through
our training that I was your last hope before they dropped you from the
program on account of your strength, I knew it was destiny.

People sometimes have a hard time believing the stories. They can believe
you survived the white water rapids in Colorado. They can believe you were
intelligent enough to pull me out of the path of an oncoming train. They
become a little skeptical when I tell them that during that aforementioned
Colorado trip; you nonchalantly climbed up a vertical wooden ladder like a
common monkey. But some have a hard time believing that you were clever
enough to toss your head so as to catch your bell collar in your mouth, the
better to get into the trashcan without being heard. It's too bad you never
failed to knock over the can and give yourself away, and I haven't worked
out how you planned on eating around the bell even if you had succeeded.

That isn't to say we didn't have our rough spots. The day you casually
relieved yourself in the airport was not amusing. Once could have been
chalked up to nature. Twice was suspicious, and after the third I had to
think long and hard about whether I really wanted you to travel with me down
the street, let alone across the country. I knew you weren't a healthy boy.
It's something I accepted and dealt with, but sometimes, I wondered what I'd
done to deserve your wrath. Did you really have to sneak a dead bird into
the apartment?

I'm sure others would have their own stories of woe. Somehow, I don't think
my college debate squad completely forgave me for keeping their suits in a
perpetual state of dog fuzz while at tournaments. The lady whose fries you
snagged while guiding me through a restaurant did not share your high
opinion of your so called stealth.

There are other stories, but why embarrass you. Or rather, why embarrass
myself, since somehow I doubt you felt an an ounce of remorse for the stunts
you pulled. It's too likely to generate questions about whether I was a bad
handler or you were just a bad dog. You were an independent spirit. That's
why you had to pretend to give it a shot with the first two blind students
before you got to me. And me, I wouldn't have changed anything about you.

It's now been almost three months since you left. I'm not as likely to break
down the way I did in the week after I had to put you down, but part of me
still listens for the familiar sound of your collar jingle, the distinct
rhythm of your paws and the contented sighs/groans that made taking you to
class so entertaining for the unsuspecting professors. Part of me still
plans on waking up early to let you out, because your bladder was always
more sensitive. Part of me forgets that it's no longer necessary to round up
all the medicines at feeding time, but as seemingly easier as things are
now, I would do it all over again. It's at these times of remembrance that I
can't help but feel that my agony of your loss is as fresh as if it had only
happened yesterday.

We found out about your cancer on a Wednesday morning. I tried to ignore the
grim reality that the vets only gave you a few days, but if a few days is
what you had, then a few days is what I was willing to give you. Only, you
got worse. Maybe it was knowing what the problem was that made your slow
walk and lethargic spirit more pronounced. Regardless, I hated to see you in
such a state, and I hope the walk off leash through the woods and McDonald's
meal in some measure made up for our having to finally take you to the vet
that Thursday evening. I now know it was the right thing to do, or as right,
as such a thing can ever be. I just hate that after walking through those
woods, your last memory had to be of a hospital room.

My last memory of you is of your head on my lap. You were so brave. I think
you knew what was going to happen, and you faced it head on in much the same
way you jumped into the raft to face those crazy rapids. I think it's this
memory that will help me face obstacles in the years to come. You may have
shied away from firecrackers, and the sound of popping the air bubbles in
those packing strips drove you nuts. Yet, in the end you more than rose to
the challenge of moving on with a highest degree of dignity.

Random thought, but do you remember the time you ate a whole pizza? I was so
astonished to have found the pizza box knocked from the table with nothing
but crusts left. Oh, you had a good habit of working my nerves at times, but
that was one of the times I couldn't help but laugh at your cleverness.
Perhaps it was payback. If you couldn't get away with trash hunting, then by
golly you'd go for the Pizza Hut!

Thank you for showing me another side to nature. I always knew dogs were
intelligent, but never in my wildest dreams did I believe I could ever be so
incredibly attached to a creature. Thank you for helping me navigate crazy
streets and even crazier train stations. Thank you for being a constant
companion and for randomly coming up and resting your head on my lap when
you knew the comfort was welcomed. Thank you for walking one more time
around the block on the afternoon I knew it would be over. You were slower,
more cautious, but your work ethic was as steady then as it was the first
time I took you around the track at The Seeing Eye. I haven't decided about
going back for another dog, but regardless, no dog will ever replace the
beauty that was you.

Find us a good house up there. Be a good boy, and enjoy your new life as a
healthy dog that will never need pills or shots to be at peace. We miss you
down here. We'll be along later, and then we'll see if you're still up for
another round of tug of war.

"God be with you till we meet again."

June 20, 2002 - January 19, 2012


_______________________________________________
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To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
nabs-l:
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From carlymih at comcast.net  Sat Mar 21 12:11:03 2015
From: carlymih at comcast.net (Carly Mihalakis)
Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2015 05:11:03 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <CAL=h+uj9=QcYboRbA=4oo4yQY-cytrfFL1qGrY9_45f898Nqkg@mail.g
	mail.com>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>
	<CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAAJqG9je1EWhg88Fx-snXj2Ty172TY48k9OM3ZX-4L8ckjvchw@mail.gmail.com>
	<BDB2A090-9AAF-49F1-88EE-EA5B06900860@gmail.com>
	<1AD31DFB-D5F6-4242-949E-EE77DC6B8F9F@gmail.com>
	<550B9164.8070103@tysdomain.com>
	<CAL=h+uj9=QcYboRbA=4oo4yQY-cytrfFL1qGrY9_45f898Nqkg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <mailman.204.1772982280.2863824.nabs-l_nfbnet.org@nfbnet.org>

Good morning, Ty, and everyone,

People who don't for whatever reason, want to invest that much in 
caring for a dog, perhaps, ought to just understand Ty's post as a 
representation of another side of the debate, similar to that of 
whether to have children. To me, There are many things that come into 
play when trying to decide whether or not to have offspring. As I am 
reading it, Ty's post, in it of itself, does not suggest anything 
other than the reality of being someone who works in tandem with an 
animal. Get over yourselves, everyone, this is not an indictment on 
you, as a person!
Car
Thank you for that, TY!

/19/2015, Brice Smith via nabs-l wrote:
>Did those of you who feel offended actually read the blog,
>particularly the explanations under the heading, "Damn! Any Words of
>Encouragement?"
>
>The subject line is purposely and brilliantly provocative--the kind
>that gathers almost a dozen responses in just a couple of hours. Joe
>clearly understands how to use rhetoric to make a compelling argument,
>and some of the knee-jerk reactions on this list to this post were
>disappointing.
>
>
>Brice
>
>
>
>On 3/19/15, Littlefield, Tyler via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > Hash: SHA1
> >
> > Positives? You can summarize this up in 5 really fast points. I seen
> > no positives and really, the negatives aren't huge drawbacks that were
> > listed.
> > I mean, if you want to tell people not to get a dog, you surely can do
> > better than that.
> >
> > But I'll address each of these points in turn.
> > 1. It's expensive!
> > It can be, yes. There are programs like GDB offers to help with vet
> > bills, so the food and grooming are really all I have to pay for. That
> > and toys, which we probably spend way to much money on. More money
> > than I would usually spend? Certainly, but it's nowhere near a lot
> > (and I'm a student living on a budget). It's also well worth the money.
> >
> > 2. It's inconvenient!
> > Yes, taking your dog out must be such hard work. Wait, I do it every
> > day, what am i talking about? It's not fun when you're sick and yes,
> > finding a trash can be kind of tough. That's why O'Mally and Minh's
> > viva know "find the trash." That's also when social skills come into
> > play. "Excuse me mam, do you see a trashcan nearby?" Works every time.
> > If you're at an unfamiliar hotel, you just ask at the front desk and
> > they're usually pretty cool about it. Airports also have relieving
> > areas. Unless you travel twice a week, a couple hours of slightly less
> > leg room (and I'm fairly tall) is really not that big of a deal.
> >
> > 3. It's time-consuming!
> > Yes, having a dog does take time. You'd think this would be inherently
> > obvious, but it was needed to be pointed out here. You don't need to
> > go for 12 mile runs, O'mally and I have left today to relieve and that
> > was pretty much it. I played with him and listened to a book and sat
> > with him on the floor for a bit. He's totally happy and hasn't
> > demolished anything.
> >
> > 4. It's unwelcomed attention!
> > I find it kind of funny you're talking about being covert and not
> > making a name for yourself with complaints when the NFB files more
> > lawsuits than I can keep up with. But beyond that, I've never been
> > turned down from eating because I have a dog. Cabs, certainly; we all
> > have. If an establishment turns me down, I'll make sure that people
> > know they did it and they're not treating me equally. Just because I'm
> > blind doesn't mean I should sit in the corner and hope that things get
> > better; I want to educate people. I've had a lot of really amazing
> > people come up and talk to me and ask questions about my guide. It
> > certainly does get a bit trying at times, but in no way is it a huge
> > problem. I am sorry however if you're not the center of the topics and
> > people do ask about your dog. It happens.
> >
> > 5. It can be dirty work!
> > Best not ever get sick by yourself then, or have kids, or anything
> > else. Yes, it can be tough. If you're squeamish maybe it's not for
> > you. Cleaning up doggy vomit really isn't the best part of my day, but
> > you do it. mostly because these dogs do so much for you and if O'mally
> > is sick I'm worried about him and just want him to get better. You do
> > it because you love your dog.
> >
> > "If you were contemplating a dog, came across this post and felt
> > discouraged, you should not get a dog. It's a lot of work. It's a lot
> > of responsibility.
> > It's constant care and attention and a commitment to keep up the dog's
> > level of training. No one will fault you for being mature enough to
> > walk away."
> >
> > So let me sum this up: expensive; inconvenient; time-consuming;
> > unwelcome attention; messy work. Yeah, I'd say you probably shouldn't
> > have a dog. Please though, do try to at least provide constructive and
> > good information on both sides of this issue. The issues you raised
> > were incredibly self-centered, rude, generalizing and really didn't
> > convey any issues beyond negative criticism.
> >
> > My guide does amazing work each and every day. when I pick up his
> > harness, he's by my side, tail wagging ready to work for me. He only
> > asks that I give him love, attention and take care of him with vet
> > visits, grooming and toys. Given the amount of travel that he has
> > enabled me to do (I am and was proficient with a cane), I think it
> > only fitting that I pay for his food, give him attention, clean up
> > after him when he's sick and treat him well. My guide loves me, no
> > questions asked. while I somewhat understand these points, I think
> > anyone who has actually had a guide would really agree that they are
> > huge issues that should prevent you from getting one.
> >
> > At first, this looked like a trolling post; it still feels like a
> > trolling post.
> >
> > Be well,
> > Ty
> > On 3/19/2015 10:20 PM, Justin Harford via nabs-l wrote:
> >> At first, this looked like a trolling post, but after I actually
> >> read the article, I  enjoyed it.
> >>
> >> It is a very frank and honest examination of the positives and
> >> negatives of one individual's experience with a guide dog, and
> >> clearly reads as the opinion of one person.
> >>
> >> Regards Justin
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:52 PM, Juanita Herrera via nabs-l
> >>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Being a guide dog user myself, I found the blog offensive and
> >>> thought of how other guide dog handlers might feel. I didn't want
> >>> to generalize like the blog seems to do but I felt that if I felt
> >>> offended by it many other people would have too. I would have
> >>> appreciated it more if somewhere in the blog post it would have
> >>> been acknowledged that this was one person's opinion, and not
> >>> make it seen as if though everyone possessed the same opinion.
> >>> Being that I am a guide dog user and have been for three years,
> >>> it has been one of the best experiences of my life. I would never
> >>> change it for anything, and I don't consider going back to using
> >>> a cane after I have to retire my dog. Therefore, I highly
> >>> disagree with the blog post. However, I must reinstate that this
> >>> is simply my opinion. Juanita
> >>>
> >>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:28 PM, minh ha via nabs-l
> >>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> I agree with Aleeha's sentiments one hundred percent. Over
> >>>> generalization is a huge mistake to do under any circumstances,
> >>>> and this blog post was offensive to me and other guide dog
> >>>> handlers on so many levels. If you want to write a fair and
> >>>> informative blog post about the guide dog lifestyle, then by
> >>>> all means, point out the negative aspects, but do not
> >>>> conveniently forget to mention the thousand of other more
> >>>> positive and beneficial impacts that a guide dog can have on a
> >>>> person's life. Yes, a guide dog is not the right choice for
> >>>> everyone and a blind person needs to think long and hard before
> >>>> getting one, but for the right reasons, a guide dog can
> >>>> completely turn someone's life around and give them the
> >>>> confidence in order to live life more productively. Honestly,
> >>>> your five reasons seem very childish, and i have to wonder if
> >>>> they are that important to you, then you should be
> >>>> contemplating about getting another guide dog at all.
> >>>>
> >>>> Respectfully, Minh and my hard working little guide, Viva
> >>>>
> >>>>> On 3/19/15, Aleeha Dudley via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> >>>>> wrote: Personally, I find your subject line a bit offensive,
> >>>>> as it assumes that guide dogs are a terrible idea for
> >>>>> everyone. Being the proud handler of a wonderful dog myself,
> >>>>> and a quite independent cane traveller before that, I am a
> >>>>> bit upset as what I find to be a somewhat inflammatory post.
> >>>>> You are right; guide dogs are not for everyone. They are a
> >>>>> huge responsibility and need a lot of daily care. But to say
> >>>>> that there are five reasons why a guide dog is a terrile idea
> >>>>> seems to be going too far, especially addressing such a
> >>>>> large body of people such as that on this list. Now, having
> >>>>> clicked the link and read the blog, I know that you are
> >>>>> making an attempt to be fair and point out the disadvantages,
> >>>>> but to not point out that this was a blog post or an opinion
> >>>>> article, can make some folks pretty mad fairly quickly. Can
> >>>>> wa choose our words and subject lines a little more wisely
> >>>>> next time? Aleha and Dallas, Seeing Eye dog extrordinaire
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> On 3/19/15, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote: If
> >>>>>> you're blind, you obviously read Braille. Your hearing must
> >>>>>> naturally be superior to your sighted peers, and of course
> >>>>>> you have a guide dog! Right?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the first and
> >>>>>> second. Someone recently told me the number of guide dog
> >>>>>> users has actually declined in my millennial generation. I
> >>>>>> have no evidence proving this one way or the other, but for
> >>>>>> the general public, to see a blind person with a guide dog
> >>>>>> feels as natural as butter and toast.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for
> >>>>>> everyone. Or, maybe I'm just projecting my own
> >>>>>> uncertainties onto the rest of the community?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Last November I took the first step in the application
> >>>>>> process to return for a second Seeing Eye dog. It's been
> >>>>>> more than three years since I lost Gator, and even though
> >>>>>> I've gotten around just fine with a white cane, I am
> >>>>>> approaching what feels like the final years with sight,
> >>>>>> however minimal that sight might be. I admit it's unnerving
> >>>>>> if I sit still long enough to contemplate total blindness.
> >>>>>> NFB philosophy be damned, and the thought of an extra set
> >>>>>> of eyes to help me navigate the world does bring a measure
> >>>>>> of comfort. But, is it enough to go get another dog?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> In no particular order, here are reasons why a guide dog
> >>>>>> would be a terrible idea:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Read more:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> 
> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-terrible-idea/
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> > - --
> >>>>>> Musings of a Work in Progress: www.JoeOrozco.com/
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l
> >>>>>> mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
> >>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
> >>>>>> info for nabs-l:
> >>>>>> 
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>
> > - --
> >>>>> Aleeha Dudley and Seeing Eye Yellow Labrador Dallas Vice
> >>>>> President, Ohio Association of Blind Students Email:
> >>>>> blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com Follow me on Twitter at
> >>>>> @blindcowgirl199
> >>>>>
> >>>>> The wind of heaven is that which blows between a horse's
> >>>>> ears. - Arabian Proverb
> >>>>>
> >>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l
> >>>>> mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
> >>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
> >>>>> info for nabs-l:
> >>>>> 
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/minh.ha927%40gmail.com
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>
> > - --
> >>>> "All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in
> >>>> the dusty recesses of their minds, wake in the day to find that
> >>>> it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men,
> >>>> for they may act on their dreams with open eyes, to make them
> >>>> possible." T. E. Lawrence
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing
> >>>> list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
> >>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> >>>> for nabs-l:
> >>>> 
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/juanitaherrera1991%40gmail.com
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>
> > _______________________________________________
> >>> nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
> >>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> >>> for nabs-l:
> >>> 
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindstein%40gmail.com
> >>
> >>>
> >> _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing
> >> list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
> >> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> >> nabs-l:
> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/tyler%40tysdomain.com
> >>
> >>
> > - --
> > Take care,
> > Ty
> > twitter: @sorressean
> > web:http://tysdomain.com
> > pubkey: http://tysdomain.com/files/pubkey.asc
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> > Version: GnuPG v2
> >
> > iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJVC5FkAAoJEAdP60+BYxejeg8H/jgEQxColgCWyB7SJTK/Wspj
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> > =IjVb
> > -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > nabs-l mailing list
> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> > nabs-l:
> > 
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> >
>
>_______________________________________________
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From carlymih at comcast.net  Sat Mar 21 12:50:35 2015
From: carlymih at comcast.net (Carly Mihalakis)
Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2015 05:50:35 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <F2960AF4-14E4-4414-928B-6CEE131E1F7D@gmail.com>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>
	<CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<F2960AF4-14E4-4414-928B-6CEE131E1F7D@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <mailman.205.1772982280.2863824.nabs-l_nfbnet.org@nfbnet.org>

Good morning, Jamie,

Thank you for naming a source of people's personal crisis, an 
unsureness of the dog vs. stick question.
Reacters to such a stark question might be rendered on the edge of 
their seats merely  by this lifestyle choice. Everyone, get over it, 
then, or shut up!
Car08:55 PM 3/19/2015, Jamie Principato via nabs-l wrote:
>Why are people so sensitive about their choice to use a cane or a 
>dog that they'd get upset over someone's choice of subject line? If 
>you are confident in your choice to have a guide dog, one person's 
>subject line on a casual mailing list isn't going to rattle that or 
>harm you or effect your life and that of your dog in any way, 
>especially once you actually read the well thought out and well 
>composed blog post attached to it. No one has to agree with your 
>reasons for having a dog or a cane, and they shouldn't have to walk 
>on eggshells to be careful not to offend that choice. You should be 
>proud of what you choose, or at least secure in your choice, enough 
>that a simple subject line doesn't put you immediately on the defensive.
>
>Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Mar 19, 2015, at 7:00 PM, Aleeha Dudley via nabs-l 
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> >
> > Personally, I find your subject line a bit offensive, as it assumes
> > that guide dogs are a terrible idea for everyone. Being the proud
> > handler of a wonderful dog myself, and a quite independent cane
> > traveller before that, I am a bit upset as what I find to be a
> > somewhat inflammatory post. You are right; guide dogs are not for
> > everyone. They are a huge responsibility and need a lot of daily care.
> > But to say that there are five reasons why a guide dog is a terrile
> > idea seems to be going too far, especially addressing such a large
> > body of people such as that on this list. Now, having clicked the link
> > and read the blog, I know that you are making an attempt to be fair
> > and point out the disadvantages, but to not point out that this was a
> > blog post or an opinion article, can make some folks pretty mad fairly
> > quickly. Can wa choose our words and subject lines a little more
> > wisely next time?
> > Aleha and Dallas, Seeing Eye dog extrordinaire
> >
> >> On 3/19/15, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> >> If you're blind, you obviously read Braille. Your hearing must 
> naturally be
> >> superior to your sighted peers, and of course you have a guide dog! Right?
> >>
> >> Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the first and second. Someone
> >> recently told me the number of guide dog users has actually declined in my
> >> millennial generation. I have no evidence proving this one way or the
> >> other,
> >> but for the general public, to see a blind person with a guide 
> dog feels as
> >> natural as butter and toast.
> >>
> >> Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for everyone. Or, maybe I'm
> >> just projecting my own uncertainties onto the rest of the community?
> >>
> >> Last November I took the first step in the application process to return
> >> for
> >> a second Seeing Eye dog. It's been more than three years since I lost
> >> Gator,
> >> and even though I've gotten around just fine with a white cane, I am
> >> approaching what feels like the final years with sight, however minimal
> >> that
> >> sight might be. I admit it's unnerving if I sit still long enough to
> >> contemplate total blindness. NFB philosophy be damned, and the thought of
> >> an
> >> extra set of eyes to help me navigate the world does bring a measure of
> >> comfort. But, is it enough to go get another dog?
> >>
> >> In no particular order, here are reasons why a guide dog would be a
> >> terrible
> >> idea:
> >>
> >> Read more:
> >>
> >> 
> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-terrible-idea/
> >>
> >> --
> >> Musings of a Work in Progress:
> >> www.JoeOrozco.com/
> >>
> >> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> nabs-l mailing list
> >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> >> nabs-l:
> >> 
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com
> >
> >
> > --
> > Aleeha Dudley and Seeing Eye Yellow Labrador Dallas
> > Vice President, Ohio Association of Blind Students
> > Email: blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com
> > Follow me on Twitter at @blindcowgirl199
> >
> > The wind of heaven is that which blows between a horse's ears.
> > - Arabian Proverb
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > nabs-l mailing list
> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
> for nabs-l:
> > 
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com
>
>_______________________________________________
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>nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
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From kaybaycar at gmail.com  Sat Mar 21 23:46:34 2015
From: kaybaycar at gmail.com (Julie McGinnity)
Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2015 18:46:34 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <550b8751.451f460a.4ceb.ffffebe9@mx.google.com>
References: <550b8751.451f460a.4ceb.ffffebe9@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <CAHox4D+1zR53+bt3+QT1OL9B=hd4QjUuaCkDLH43b8aoP3uq=w@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all,

I think that guide dogs is one of the topics about which we are most
divided.  I may even call the divisions we have over the topic
dramatic.  I say this because most people do not evaluate it
realistically and objectively.

Before I begin, yes, I am a guide dog user.  I have been so for almost
7 years, and I have changed so much as a person over the last 7 years
that I would have an embossor running for hours to fill the pages I
could write.

In those past 7 years, one of the most significant things I have done
is become involved in the blindness community, particularly in the
National Federation of the Blind.  I have met all kinds of travelers
and experienced mostly strongly negative or strongly positive views of
guide dogs.

One of the problems we are dealing with is that having a dog is an
emotional experience.  The bond handlers develop with their dogs has
been called magical, mysterious, and miraculous.  All this really
means is that the blind guide dog user and the dog form a bond that is
closer than pet and human in a lot of ways.  I believe that this
emotionalism colors most discussions concerning the benefits of
traveling with a dog.

The guide dog handler goes on and on about how Fluffy saved their
life, finds their classrooms, and takes care of them.  The cane user
roles their eyes and later gossips about those crazy dog users who
aren't independent and expect their dog to travel for them.  Ok, this
is an extreme...  But this is the sort of talk that goes on in these
circles.

I am the first to tell you that I love my dog very much.  I love my
first dog too.  But I am also happy to tell you that I learned a lot
when I used my cane as my only mobility tool all last semester when I
was between dogs.  There were obvious advantages.  My reasons for
getting a dog have changed and now seem pretty complex.  I know I can
travel without one and am happy to do so in a variety of situations
now.  But I like working with a dog, building a partnership, and have
always been a dog person.  This decision is personal; I believe that
each of our decisions is personal.

I am happy to discuss with people their decision to use a cane or a
dog, but honestly, I am tired of the cane dog debate.  (And yes, I
realize that we all are and that this thread did not turn into that.)

Your decision to get a dog is less important to me than the public
perceptions we are fighting.  It is clear that my colleagues view me
differently when I use the cane rather than the dog.  It is also
concerning that people are pressured into using a certain mobility
tool when the decision is, as we already discussed, personal.  I am
sad that independence is often linked to one tool, be it dog, cane,
Braille, or assistive technology.


On 3/19/15, Sophie Trist via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I am a senior in high school, planning to attend LCB next year. I
> am also hearing impaired and thus have to wear a hearing aid.
> During my O&M lessons at school, I've discovered that though I
> can hear perfectly well when a car is coming, my hearing aid
> makes it difficult to localize that sound. I haven't made a final
> decision as to whether I will get a dog--that will wait until
> after my LCB training--but I believe that because of my hearing
> problem, it would make me safer.
>      That's my personal story. I don't really see why this blog
> is "offensive" or "garbage" as previous posts have stated. The
> subject line is definitely an attention getter, especially for
> someone like me who just skims through their Inbox. Everyone is
> entitled to their own opinion, even if others don't share it. The
> five reasons, far from being childish, are valid. When making a
> decision, it's important to know all of the factors beforehand so
> that you can make a logical and fully informed decision. With
> regard to the letting the dog out and cleaning up after it part,
> that applies to any kind of dog. I personally have two dogs at my
> house right now, and we have to do those things, sometimes
> getting up at 4:00 in the morning when they start crying to go
> out. This is just my opinion. Have a good Friday!
>
> Yours,
> Sophie
>
>  ----- Original Message -----
> From: Matthew Dierckens via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> To: Darian Smith <dsmithnfb at gmail.com>,National Association of
> Blind Students mailing list <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> Date sent: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 21:50:07 -0400
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible
> Idea!
>
> I would have to agree with Aleeha and Min here.
> As a soon to be handler, I found this post rather offensive and
> someone disturbing. Now, I understand that a dog may not be ideal
> for everyone, but there are better ways of letting people know
> that having a guide dog isn't always going to be cake and roses.
> If I were to read this, say, 6 years ago when I was first
> becoming interested in getting a dog, I would definitely be put
> off by reading this and would be second guessing my decision.
> There is a large difference between writing an opinion piece, and
> just plain garbage.
> Just my two cense worth.
>
> God bless. :)
> Matthew Dierckens
> Certified Assistive Technology Specialist
> Macintosh, Windows and IOS  Trainer
> Personal Email: matt.dierckens at me.com
>
>  On Mar 19, 2015, at 21:29, Darian Smith via nabs-l
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>
>  Hi all,
>  Thanks  Joe for sharing this.
>
>  If   your aim in the subject line is to get one's attention
> than I'sure you've done it.
>  Knowing what I know, seeing what I've seen and understanding
> what I do, It seems like a very important thing to think about,
> the considerations   surrounding  getting a dog  guide.
>   There are many reasons why people might decide that a dog might
> be the best mobility tool for them (Yes, the dog  is an animal,
> but consider that when they are in   harness they are as much a
> travel tool as a cane would be.
>  A cane requires far less   moving parts in it's usage   than a
> dog might,  and yet the dog  requires that you interact with your
> physical environment  much less than a cane might.
>  I  personally know of folks who love dogs, but would not    go
> to train for a guide   because of the responsibilities that come
> with the puppy.  I also know of folks who have gotten a dog guide
> though otherwise they wouldn't have a dog in their lives.
>   I think  that though  I  may oversimplify the topic,  there
>       ). are many reasons why a blind person may have either a
> cane or dog in their lives, though I personally believe that a
> solid  foundation in the former can be absolutely key in
> maximizing the ability to work the latter, there's nothing
> wrong with deciding to get a dog.
>  What I think Joe points out are valid reasons  why if you
> don't really think it through then getting a dog guide could be
> a bad idea.  it's not a  dig  and I doubt it  destroys  the
> image  of guide dogs, their owners and the schools they come
> from.
>  This, however is just my humble opinion on the matter.
>   Best,
>  Darian
>
>
>
>  On Mar 19, 2015, at 5:26 PM, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> wrote:
>
>  If you're blind, you obviously read Braille. Your hearing must
> naturally be
>  superior to your sighted peers, and of course you have a guide
> dog! Right?
>
>  Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the first and second.
> Someone
>  recently told me the number of guide dog users has actually
> declined in my
>  millennial generation. I have no evidence proving this one way
> or the other,
>  but for the general public, to see a blind person with a guide
> dog feels as
>  natural as butter and toast.
>
>  Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for everyone. Or,
> maybe I'm
>  just projecting my own uncertainties onto the rest of the
> community?
>
>  Last November I took the first step in the application process
> to return for
>  a second Seeing Eye dog. It's been more than three years since I
> lost Gator,
>  and even though I've gotten around just fine with a white cane,
> I am
>  approaching what feels like the final years with sight, however
> minimal that
>  sight might be. I admit it's unnerving if I sit still long
> enough to
>  contemplate total blindness. NFB philosophy be damned, and the
> thought of an
>  extra set of eyes to help me navigate the world does bring a
> measure of
>  comfort. But, is it enough to go get another dog?
>
>  In no particular order, here are reasons why a guide dog would
> be a terrible
>  idea:
>
>  Read more:
>
>
> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-ter
> rible-idea/
>
>  --
>  Musings of a Work in Progress:
>  www.JoeOrozco.com/
>
>  Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
>
>
>
>
>  _______________________________________________
>  nabs-l mailing list
>  nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>  http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>  To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
> info for nabs-l:
>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40g
> mail.com
>
>
>  _______________________________________________
>  nabs-l mailing list
>  nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>  http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>  To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
> info for nabs-l:
>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/matt.diercken
> s%40me.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
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> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade
> r%40gmail.com
>
>
>


-- 
Julie McGinnity
National Federation of the Blind performing arts division secretary,
Missouri Association of Guide dog Users President, National Federation
of the Blind of Missouri recording secretary,
graduate Guiding Eyes for the Blind 2008, 2014
"For we walk by faith, not by sight"
2 Cor. 7


From hope.paulos at gmail.com  Sun Mar 22 21:05:35 2015
From: hope.paulos at gmail.com (Hope Paulos)
Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2015 17:05:35 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Name of scholarship for first-time attendees of convention
Message-ID: <6BEEE6E1-4A1F-49F6-AB34-03A9F6874861@gmail.com>

Hello all. Can someone be so kind as to provide me with the name of the scholarship that provides funds for first time convention attendees? I used to know it, but for the life of me can't think of it… I don't seem to see anything on the website for  NFB, but I could be missing something. Can someone please point me in the right direction?

Thanks so much in advance!

Hope Paulos

From kathrynwebster.nfb at gmail.com  Sun Mar 22 21:07:46 2015
From: kathrynwebster.nfb at gmail.com (Kathryn Webster)
Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2015 17:07:46 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Name of scholarship for first-time attendees of
	convention
In-Reply-To: <6BEEE6E1-4A1F-49F6-AB34-03A9F6874861@gmail.com>
References: <6BEEE6E1-4A1F-49F6-AB34-03A9F6874861@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <E32E59D2-8646-44AD-8FCB-BF949933389B@gmail.com>

The Kenneth Jernigan national scholarship

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 22, 2015, at 5:05 PM, Hope Paulos via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hello all. Can someone be so kind as to provide me with the name of the scholarship that provides funds for first time convention attendees? I used to know it, but for the life of me can't think of it… I don't seem to see anything on the website for  NFB, but I could be missing something. Can someone please point me in the right direction?
> 
> Thanks so much in advance!
> 
> Hope Paulos
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kathrynwebster.nfb%40gmail.com


From christgirl813 at gmail.com  Sun Mar 22 21:26:37 2015
From: christgirl813 at gmail.com (Kayla James)
Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2015 16:26:37 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <CAHox4D+1zR53+bt3+QT1OL9B=hd4QjUuaCkDLH43b8aoP3uq=w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <550b8751.451f460a.4ceb.ffffebe9@mx.google.com>
	<CAHox4D+1zR53+bt3+QT1OL9B=hd4QjUuaCkDLH43b8aoP3uq=w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAP4F+WU2bR26hy6xgRF2bNyZA07mw+yLJYpdYFT5XF47vD_8QA@mail.gmail.com>

And to think, I am planning on getting a guide dog and this magically
pops up. Lol Oh, well, I'll jump off those five bridges when I get to
them.

On 3/21/15, Julie McGinnity via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I think that guide dogs is one of the topics about which we are most
> divided.  I may even call the divisions we have over the topic
> dramatic.  I say this because most people do not evaluate it
> realistically and objectively.
>
> Before I begin, yes, I am a guide dog user.  I have been so for almost
> 7 years, and I have changed so much as a person over the last 7 years
> that I would have an embossor running for hours to fill the pages I
> could write.
>
> In those past 7 years, one of the most significant things I have done
> is become involved in the blindness community, particularly in the
> National Federation of the Blind.  I have met all kinds of travelers
> and experienced mostly strongly negative or strongly positive views of
> guide dogs.
>
> One of the problems we are dealing with is that having a dog is an
> emotional experience.  The bond handlers develop with their dogs has
> been called magical, mysterious, and miraculous.  All this really
> means is that the blind guide dog user and the dog form a bond that is
> closer than pet and human in a lot of ways.  I believe that this
> emotionalism colors most discussions concerning the benefits of
> traveling with a dog.
>
> The guide dog handler goes on and on about how Fluffy saved their
> life, finds their classrooms, and takes care of them.  The cane user
> roles their eyes and later gossips about those crazy dog users who
> aren't independent and expect their dog to travel for them.  Ok, this
> is an extreme...  But this is the sort of talk that goes on in these
> circles.
>
> I am the first to tell you that I love my dog very much.  I love my
> first dog too.  But I am also happy to tell you that I learned a lot
> when I used my cane as my only mobility tool all last semester when I
> was between dogs.  There were obvious advantages.  My reasons for
> getting a dog have changed and now seem pretty complex.  I know I can
> travel without one and am happy to do so in a variety of situations
> now.  But I like working with a dog, building a partnership, and have
> always been a dog person.  This decision is personal; I believe that
> each of our decisions is personal.
>
> I am happy to discuss with people their decision to use a cane or a
> dog, but honestly, I am tired of the cane dog debate.  (And yes, I
> realize that we all are and that this thread did not turn into that.)
>
> Your decision to get a dog is less important to me than the public
> perceptions we are fighting.  It is clear that my colleagues view me
> differently when I use the cane rather than the dog.  It is also
> concerning that people are pressured into using a certain mobility
> tool when the decision is, as we already discussed, personal.  I am
> sad that independence is often linked to one tool, be it dog, cane,
> Braille, or assistive technology.
>
>
> On 3/19/15, Sophie Trist via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I am a senior in high school, planning to attend LCB next year. I
>> am also hearing impaired and thus have to wear a hearing aid.
>> During my O&M lessons at school, I've discovered that though I
>> can hear perfectly well when a car is coming, my hearing aid
>> makes it difficult to localize that sound. I haven't made a final
>> decision as to whether I will get a dog--that will wait until
>> after my LCB training--but I believe that because of my hearing
>> problem, it would make me safer.
>>      That's my personal story. I don't really see why this blog
>> is "offensive" or "garbage" as previous posts have stated. The
>> subject line is definitely an attention getter, especially for
>> someone like me who just skims through their Inbox. Everyone is
>> entitled to their own opinion, even if others don't share it. The
>> five reasons, far from being childish, are valid. When making a
>> decision, it's important to know all of the factors beforehand so
>> that you can make a logical and fully informed decision. With
>> regard to the letting the dog out and cleaning up after it part,
>> that applies to any kind of dog. I personally have two dogs at my
>> house right now, and we have to do those things, sometimes
>> getting up at 4:00 in the morning when they start crying to go
>> out. This is just my opinion. Have a good Friday!
>>
>> Yours,
>> Sophie
>>
>>  ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Matthew Dierckens via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> To: Darian Smith <dsmithnfb at gmail.com>,National Association of
>> Blind Students mailing list <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> Date sent: Thu, 19 Mar 2015 21:50:07 -0400
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible
>> Idea!
>>
>> I would have to agree with Aleeha and Min here.
>> As a soon to be handler, I found this post rather offensive and
>> someone disturbing. Now, I understand that a dog may not be ideal
>> for everyone, but there are better ways of letting people know
>> that having a guide dog isn't always going to be cake and roses.
>> If I were to read this, say, 6 years ago when I was first
>> becoming interested in getting a dog, I would definitely be put
>> off by reading this and would be second guessing my decision.
>> There is a large difference between writing an opinion piece, and
>> just plain garbage.
>> Just my two cense worth.
>>
>> God bless. :)
>> Matthew Dierckens
>> Certified Assistive Technology Specialist
>> Macintosh, Windows and IOS  Trainer
>> Personal Email: matt.dierckens at me.com
>>
>>  On Mar 19, 2015, at 21:29, Darian Smith via nabs-l
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>
>>  Hi all,
>>  Thanks  Joe for sharing this.
>>
>>  If   your aim in the subject line is to get one's attention
>> than I'sure you've done it.
>>  Knowing what I know, seeing what I've seen and understanding
>> what I do, It seems like a very important thing to think about,
>> the considerations   surrounding  getting a dog  guide.
>>   There are many reasons why people might decide that a dog might
>> be the best mobility tool for them (Yes, the dog  is an animal,
>> but consider that when they are in   harness they are as much a
>> travel tool as a cane would be.
>>  A cane requires far less   moving parts in it's usage   than a
>> dog might,  and yet the dog  requires that you interact with your
>> physical environment  much less than a cane might.
>>  I  personally know of folks who love dogs, but would not    go
>> to train for a guide   because of the responsibilities that come
>> with the puppy.  I also know of folks who have gotten a dog guide
>> though otherwise they wouldn't have a dog in their lives.
>>   I think  that though  I  may oversimplify the topic,  there
>>       ). are many reasons why a blind person may have either a
>> cane or dog in their lives, though I personally believe that a
>> solid  foundation in the former can be absolutely key in
>> maximizing the ability to work the latter, there's nothing
>> wrong with deciding to get a dog.
>>  What I think Joe points out are valid reasons  why if you
>> don't really think it through then getting a dog guide could be
>> a bad idea.  it's not a  dig  and I doubt it  destroys  the
>> image  of guide dogs, their owners and the schools they come
>> from.
>>  This, however is just my humble opinion on the matter.
>>   Best,
>>  Darian
>>
>>
>>
>>  On Mar 19, 2015, at 5:26 PM, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>>  If you're blind, you obviously read Braille. Your hearing must
>> naturally be
>>  superior to your sighted peers, and of course you have a guide
>> dog! Right?
>>
>>  Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the first and second.
>> Someone
>>  recently told me the number of guide dog users has actually
>> declined in my
>>  millennial generation. I have no evidence proving this one way
>> or the other,
>>  but for the general public, to see a blind person with a guide
>> dog feels as
>>  natural as butter and toast.
>>
>>  Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for everyone. Or,
>> maybe I'm
>>  just projecting my own uncertainties onto the rest of the
>> community?
>>
>>  Last November I took the first step in the application process
>> to return for
>>  a second Seeing Eye dog. It's been more than three years since I
>> lost Gator,
>>  and even though I've gotten around just fine with a white cane,
>> I am
>>  approaching what feels like the final years with sight, however
>> minimal that
>>  sight might be. I admit it's unnerving if I sit still long
>> enough to
>>  contemplate total blindness. NFB philosophy be damned, and the
>> thought of an
>>  extra set of eyes to help me navigate the world does bring a
>> measure of
>>  comfort. But, is it enough to go get another dog?
>>
>>  In no particular order, here are reasons why a guide dog would
>> be a terrible
>>  idea:
>>
>>  Read more:
>>
>>
>> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-ter
>> rible-idea/
>>
>>  --
>>  Musings of a Work in Progress:
>>  www.JoeOrozco.com/
>>
>>  Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
>>  nabs-l mailing list
>>  nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>  http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>  To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>> info for nabs-l:
>>
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40g
>> mail.com
>>
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
>>  nabs-l mailing list
>>  nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>  http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>  To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>> info for nabs-l:
>>
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/matt.diercken
>> s%40me.com
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sweetpeareade
>> r%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Julie McGinnity
> National Federation of the Blind performing arts division secretary,
> Missouri Association of Guide dog Users President, National Federation
> of the Blind of Missouri recording secretary,
> graduate Guiding Eyes for the Blind 2008, 2014
> "For we walk by faith, not by sight"
> 2 Cor. 7
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/christgirl813%40gmail.com
>


From gloria.graves at gmail.com  Sun Mar 22 21:57:35 2015
From: gloria.graves at gmail.com (Gloria Graves)
Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2015 16:57:35 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Changing settings in office 2013
Message-ID: <5A962A1D-E826-4908-9426-DE8759EB2E1D@gmail.com>

Hi all,
I was wondering if someone would be willing to give me instructions on how to change the menu selections in office from the ribbon to the classic settings? I want to be able to use the drop-down menu's when working in office or word
Thanks,
Gloria




From arielle71 at gmail.com  Sun Mar 22 23:02:40 2015
From: arielle71 at gmail.com (Arielle Silverman)
Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2015 16:02:40 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] Changing settings in office 2013
In-Reply-To: <5A962A1D-E826-4908-9426-DE8759EB2E1D@gmail.com>
References: <5A962A1D-E826-4908-9426-DE8759EB2E1D@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CALAYQJBwT9yHJhzcbO7Sym-+1OcoRWTYg7DJPWi=HmfWwT6grw@mail.gmail.com>

I'm fairly certain this setting is somewhere in the verbosity
settings, which you can activate with Insert-V while in a Word doc.
Arielle

On 3/22/15, Gloria Graves via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Hi all,
> I was wondering if someone would be willing to give me instructions on how
> to change the menu selections in office from the ribbon to the classic
> settings? I want to be able to use the drop-down menu's when working in
> office or word
> Thanks,
> Gloria
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/arielle71%40gmail.com
>


From rbacchus228 at gmail.com  Sun Mar 22 23:13:52 2015
From: rbacchus228 at gmail.com (Roanna Bacchus)
Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2015 19:13:52 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] A progress update
Message-ID: <550f4cb5.94558c0a.144c.ffff9d2f@mx.google.com>

Dear Students,

Today I successfully logged into my course  site for school using 
Jaws.  I was able to type in my UCF Id number and I copied my 
password to the clipboard and pasted it into the password field.  
This is another small step toward improving my independence.


From tyler at tysdomain.com  Sun Mar 22 23:34:19 2015
From: tyler at tysdomain.com (Littlefield, Tyler)
Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2015 19:34:19 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] A progress update
In-Reply-To: <550f4cb5.94558c0a.144c.ffff9d2f@mx.google.com>
References: <550f4cb5.94558c0a.144c.ffff9d2f@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <550F517B.5060501@tysdomain.com>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Joanna,
Is it you that's sending all of these emails?

I'm really glad you're able to do these things and you're making steps
to improve, but I'm a bit confused since you seem to be doing email
just fine (which usually requires a login).

On 3/22/2015 7:13 PM, Roanna Bacchus via nabs-l wrote:
> Dear Students,
> 
> Today I successfully logged into my course  site for school using
> Jaws. I was able to type in my UCF Id number and I copied my
> password to the clipboard and pasted it into the password field.
> This is another small step toward improving my independence.
> 
> _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing
> list nabs-l at nfbnet.org 
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l: 
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/tyler%40tysdomain.com


- --
> 
Take care,
Ty
twitter: @sorressean
web:http://tysdomain.com
pubkey: http://tysdomain.com/files/pubkey.asc
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From dandrews at visi.com  Sun Mar 22 23:45:35 2015
From: dandrews at visi.com (David Andrews)
Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2015 18:45:35 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Changing settings in office 2013
In-Reply-To: <CALAYQJBwT9yHJhzcbO7Sym-+1OcoRWTYg7DJPWi=HmfWwT6grw@mail.g
	mail.com>
References: <5A962A1D-E826-4908-9426-DE8759EB2E1D@gmail.com>
	<CALAYQJBwT9yHJhzcbO7Sym-+1OcoRWTYg7DJPWi=HmfWwT6grw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <auto-000019577393@mailfront1.g2host.com>

This is true if she is using JAWS, as this is a JAWS setting, not a Word thing.

Word itself does not change the ribbon back to classic menus.  JAWS 
can make the ribbon act like the classic menus, to a certain extent, 
it calls it the "virtual ribbon."

Dave

At 06:02 PM 3/22/2015, you wrote:
>I'm fairly certain this setting is somewhere in the verbosity
>settings, which you can activate with Insert-V while in a Word doc.
>Arielle
>
>On 3/22/15, Gloria Graves via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> > Hi all,
> > I was wondering if someone would be willing to give me instructions on how
> > to change the menu selections in office from the ribbon to the classic
> > settings? I want to be able to use the drop-down menu's when working in
> > office or word
> > Thanks,
> > Gloria

         David Andrews and long white cane Harry.
E-Mail:  dandrews at visi.com or david.andrews at nfbnet.org



From loneblindjedi at samobile.net  Sun Mar 22 23:47:55 2015
From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi Moerke)
Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2015 18:47:55 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <4AB84DC8-D78C-4D42-B57E-D46F0E364702@gmail.com>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>
	<CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAAJqG9je1EWhg88Fx-snXj2Ty172TY48k9OM3ZX-4L8ckjvchw@mail.gmail.com>
	<BDB2A090-9AAF-49F1-88EE-EA5B06900860@gmail.com>
	<1AD31DFB-D5F6-4242-949E-EE77DC6B8F9F@gmail.com>
	<550B9164.8070103@tysdomain.com>
	<CAL=h+uj9=QcYboRbA=4oo4yQY-cytrfFL1qGrY9_45f898Nqkg@mail.gmail.com>
	<4AB84DC8-D78C-4D42-B57E-D46F0E364702@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <558B9C29-B7B1-4D6F-B507-E3CA36DD2C64@samobile.net>

There is something to be said for using a vocative headlines, but there is also something to be said for cultural awareness and sensitivity.  

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 20, 2015, at 2:16 AM, Justin Harford via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> I agree. 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 8:41 PM, Brice Smith via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Did those of you who feel offended actually read the blog,
>> particularly the explanations under the heading, "Damn! Any Words of
>> Encouragement?"
>> 
>> The subject line is purposely and brilliantly provocative--the kind
>> that gathers almost a dozen responses in just a couple of hours. Joe
>> clearly understands how to use rhetoric to make a compelling argument,
>> and some of the knee-jerk reactions on this list to this post were
>> disappointing.
>> 
>> 
>> Brice
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On 3/19/15, Littlefield, Tyler via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>>> Hash: SHA1
>>> 
>>> Positives? You can summarize this up in 5 really fast points. I seen
>>> no positives and really, the negatives aren't huge drawbacks that were
>>> listed.
>>> I mean, if you want to tell people not to get a dog, you surely can do
>>> better than that.
>>> 
>>> But I'll address each of these points in turn.
>>> 1. It's expensive!
>>> It can be, yes. There are programs like GDB offers to help with vet
>>> bills, so the food and grooming are really all I have to pay for. That
>>> and toys, which we probably spend way to much money on. More money
>>> than I would usually spend? Certainly, but it's nowhere near a lot
>>> (and I'm a student living on a budget). It's also well worth the money.
>>> 
>>> 2. It's inconvenient!
>>> Yes, taking your dog out must be such hard work. Wait, I do it every
>>> day, what am i talking about? It's not fun when you're sick and yes,
>>> finding a trash can be kind of tough. That's why O'Mally and Minh's
>>> viva know "find the trash." That's also when social skills come into
>>> play. "Excuse me mam, do you see a trashcan nearby?" Works every time.
>>> If you're at an unfamiliar hotel, you just ask at the front desk and
>>> they're usually pretty cool about it. Airports also have relieving
>>> areas. Unless you travel twice a week, a couple hours of slightly less
>>> leg room (and I'm fairly tall) is really not that big of a deal.
>>> 
>>> 3. It's time-consuming!
>>> Yes, having a dog does take time. You'd think this would be inherently
>>> obvious, but it was needed to be pointed out here. You don't need to
>>> go for 12 mile runs, O'mally and I have left today to relieve and that
>>> was pretty much it. I played with him and listened to a book and sat
>>> with him on the floor for a bit. He's totally happy and hasn't
>>> demolished anything.
>>> 
>>> 4. It's unwelcomed attention!
>>> I find it kind of funny you're talking about being covert and not
>>> making a name for yourself with complaints when the NFB files more
>>> lawsuits than I can keep up with. But beyond that, I've never been
>>> turned down from eating because I have a dog. Cabs, certainly; we all
>>> have. If an establishment turns me down, I'll make sure that people
>>> know they did it and they're not treating me equally. Just because I'm
>>> blind doesn't mean I should sit in the corner and hope that things get
>>> better; I want to educate people. I've had a lot of really amazing
>>> people come up and talk to me and ask questions about my guide. It
>>> certainly does get a bit trying at times, but in no way is it a huge
>>> problem. I am sorry however if you're not the center of the topics and
>>> people do ask about your dog. It happens.
>>> 
>>> 5. It can be dirty work!
>>> Best not ever get sick by yourself then, or have kids, or anything
>>> else. Yes, it can be tough. If you're squeamish maybe it's not for
>>> you. Cleaning up doggy vomit really isn't the best part of my day, but
>>> you do it. mostly because these dogs do so much for you and if O'mally
>>> is sick I'm worried about him and just want him to get better. You do
>>> it because you love your dog.
>>> 
>>> "If you were contemplating a dog, came across this post and felt
>>> discouraged, you should not get a dog. It's a lot of work. It's a lot
>>> of responsibility.
>>> It's constant care and attention and a commitment to keep up the dog's
>>> level of training. No one will fault you for being mature enough to
>>> walk away."
>>> 
>>> So let me sum this up: expensive; inconvenient; time-consuming;
>>> unwelcome attention; messy work. Yeah, I'd say you probably shouldn't
>>> have a dog. Please though, do try to at least provide constructive and
>>> good information on both sides of this issue. The issues you raised
>>> were incredibly self-centered, rude, generalizing and really didn't
>>> convey any issues beyond negative criticism.
>>> 
>>> My guide does amazing work each and every day. when I pick up his
>>> harness, he's by my side, tail wagging ready to work for me. He only
>>> asks that I give him love, attention and take care of him with vet
>>> visits, grooming and toys. Given the amount of travel that he has
>>> enabled me to do (I am and was proficient with a cane), I think it
>>> only fitting that I pay for his food, give him attention, clean up
>>> after him when he's sick and treat him well. My guide loves me, no
>>> questions asked. while I somewhat understand these points, I think
>>> anyone who has actually had a guide would really agree that they are
>>> huge issues that should prevent you from getting one.
>>> 
>>> At first, this looked like a trolling post; it still feels like a
>>> trolling post.
>>> 
>>> Be well,
>>> Ty
>>>> On 3/19/2015 10:20 PM, Justin Harford via nabs-l wrote:
>>>> At first, this looked like a trolling post, but after I actually
>>>> read the article, I  enjoyed it.
>>>> 
>>>> It is a very frank and honest examination of the positives and
>>>> negatives of one individual's experience with a guide dog, and
>>>> clearly reads as the opinion of one person.
>>>> 
>>>> Regards Justin
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:52 PM, Juanita Herrera via nabs-l
>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Being a guide dog user myself, I found the blog offensive and
>>>>> thought of how other guide dog handlers might feel. I didn't want
>>>>> to generalize like the blog seems to do but I felt that if I felt
>>>>> offended by it many other people would have too. I would have
>>>>> appreciated it more if somewhere in the blog post it would have
>>>>> been acknowledged that this was one person's opinion, and not
>>>>> make it seen as if though everyone possessed the same opinion.
>>>>> Being that I am a guide dog user and have been for three years,
>>>>> it has been one of the best experiences of my life. I would never
>>>>> change it for anything, and I don't consider going back to using
>>>>> a cane after I have to retire my dog. Therefore, I highly
>>>>> disagree with the blog post. However, I must reinstate that this
>>>>> is simply my opinion. Juanita
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:28 PM, minh ha via nabs-l
>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I agree with Aleeha's sentiments one hundred percent. Over
>>>>>> generalization is a huge mistake to do under any circumstances,
>>>>>> and this blog post was offensive to me and other guide dog
>>>>>> handlers on so many levels. If you want to write a fair and
>>>>>> informative blog post about the guide dog lifestyle, then by
>>>>>> all means, point out the negative aspects, but do not
>>>>>> conveniently forget to mention the thousand of other more
>>>>>> positive and beneficial impacts that a guide dog can have on a
>>>>>> person's life. Yes, a guide dog is not the right choice for
>>>>>> everyone and a blind person needs to think long and hard before
>>>>>> getting one, but for the right reasons, a guide dog can
>>>>>> completely turn someone's life around and give them the
>>>>>> confidence in order to live life more productively. Honestly,
>>>>>> your five reasons seem very childish, and i have to wonder if
>>>>>> they are that important to you, then you should be
>>>>>> contemplating about getting another guide dog at all.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Respectfully, Minh and my hard working little guide, Viva
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On 3/19/15, Aleeha Dudley via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>> wrote: Personally, I find your subject line a bit offensive,
>>>>>>> as it assumes that guide dogs are a terrible idea for
>>>>>>> everyone. Being the proud handler of a wonderful dog myself,
>>>>>>> and a quite independent cane traveller before that, I am a
>>>>>>> bit upset as what I find to be a somewhat inflammatory post.
>>>>>>> You are right; guide dogs are not for everyone. They are a
>>>>>>> huge responsibility and need a lot of daily care. But to say
>>>>>>> that there are five reasons why a guide dog is a terrile idea
>>>>>>> seems to be going too far, especially addressing such a
>>>>>>> large body of people such as that on this list. Now, having
>>>>>>> clicked the link and read the blog, I know that you are
>>>>>>> making an attempt to be fair and point out the disadvantages,
>>>>>>> but to not point out that this was a blog post or an opinion
>>>>>>> article, can make some folks pretty mad fairly quickly. Can
>>>>>>> wa choose our words and subject lines a little more wisely
>>>>>>> next time? Aleha and Dallas, Seeing Eye dog extrordinaire
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On 3/19/15, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote: If
>>>>>>>> you're blind, you obviously read Braille. Your hearing must
>>>>>>>> naturally be superior to your sighted peers, and of course
>>>>>>>> you have a guide dog! Right?
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the first and
>>>>>>>> second. Someone recently told me the number of guide dog
>>>>>>>> users has actually declined in my millennial generation. I
>>>>>>>> have no evidence proving this one way or the other, but for
>>>>>>>> the general public, to see a blind person with a guide dog
>>>>>>>> feels as natural as butter and toast.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for
>>>>>>>> everyone. Or, maybe I'm just projecting my own
>>>>>>>> uncertainties onto the rest of the community?
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Last November I took the first step in the application
>>>>>>>> process to return for a second Seeing Eye dog. It's been
>>>>>>>> more than three years since I lost Gator, and even though
>>>>>>>> I've gotten around just fine with a white cane, I am
>>>>>>>> approaching what feels like the final years with sight,
>>>>>>>> however minimal that sight might be. I admit it's unnerving
>>>>>>>> if I sit still long enough to contemplate total blindness.
>>>>>>>> NFB philosophy be damned, and the thought of an extra set
>>>>>>>> of eyes to help me navigate the world does bring a measure
>>>>>>>> of comfort. But, is it enough to go get another dog?
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> In no particular order, here are reasons why a guide dog
>>>>>>>> would be a terrible idea:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Read more:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-terrible-idea/
>>> - --
>>>>>>>> Musings of a Work in Progress: www.JoeOrozco.com/
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l
>>>>>>>> mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>>>>> info for nabs-l:
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>> - --
>>>>>>> Aleeha Dudley and Seeing Eye Yellow Labrador Dallas Vice
>>>>>>> President, Ohio Association of Blind Students Email:
>>>>>>> blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com Follow me on Twitter at
>>>>>>> @blindcowgirl199
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> The wind of heaven is that which blows between a horse's
>>>>>>> ears. - Arabian Proverb
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l
>>>>>>> mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>>>> info for nabs-l:
>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/minh.ha927%40gmail.com
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>> - --
>>>>>> "All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in
>>>>>> the dusty recesses of their minds, wake in the day to find that
>>>>>> it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men,
>>>>>> for they may act on their dreams with open eyes, to make them
>>>>>> possible." T. E. Lawrence
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing
>>>>>> list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>> for nabs-l:
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/juanitaherrera1991%40gmail.com
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>> for nabs-l:
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindstein%40gmail.com
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing
>>>> list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/tyler%40tysdomain.com
>>> - --
>>> Take care,
>>> Ty
>>> twitter: @sorressean
>>> web:http://tysdomain.com
>>> pubkey: http://tysdomain.com/files/pubkey.asc
>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
>>> Version: GnuPG v2
>>> 
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>>> =IjVb
>>> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
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>> 
>> _______________________________________________
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> 
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From blackbyrdfly at gmail.com  Sun Mar 22 23:51:13 2015
From: blackbyrdfly at gmail.com (Jamie Principato)
Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2015 17:51:13 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <558B9C29-B7B1-4D6F-B507-E3CA36DD2C64@samobile.net>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>
	<CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAAJqG9je1EWhg88Fx-snXj2Ty172TY48k9OM3ZX-4L8ckjvchw@mail.gmail.com>
	<BDB2A090-9AAF-49F1-88EE-EA5B06900860@gmail.com>
	<1AD31DFB-D5F6-4242-949E-EE77DC6B8F9F@gmail.com>
	<550B9164.8070103@tysdomain.com>
	<CAL=h+uj9=QcYboRbA=4oo4yQY-cytrfFL1qGrY9_45f898Nqkg@mail.gmail.com>
	<4AB84DC8-D78C-4D42-B57E-D46F0E364702@gmail.com>
	<558B9C29-B7B1-4D6F-B507-E3CA36DD2C64@samobile.net>
Message-ID: <AFC27292-214D-44FE-9C96-4CE1D186908E@gmail.com>

Why is guide dog use a topic calling for a special level of sensitivity? Sensitivity to what? It's a choice just like cane use is. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 22, 2015, at 5:47 PM, Jedi Moerke via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> There is something to be said for using a vocative headlines, but there is also something to be said for cultural awareness and sensitivity.  
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Mar 20, 2015, at 2:16 AM, Justin Harford via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> 
>> I agree. 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 8:41 PM, Brice Smith via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Did those of you who feel offended actually read the blog,
>>> particularly the explanations under the heading, "Damn! Any Words of
>>> Encouragement?"
>>> 
>>> The subject line is purposely and brilliantly provocative--the kind
>>> that gathers almost a dozen responses in just a couple of hours. Joe
>>> clearly understands how to use rhetoric to make a compelling argument,
>>> and some of the knee-jerk reactions on this list to this post were
>>> disappointing.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Brice
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On 3/19/15, Littlefield, Tyler via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>>>> Hash: SHA1
>>>> 
>>>> Positives? You can summarize this up in 5 really fast points. I seen
>>>> no positives and really, the negatives aren't huge drawbacks that were
>>>> listed.
>>>> I mean, if you want to tell people not to get a dog, you surely can do
>>>> better than that.
>>>> 
>>>> But I'll address each of these points in turn.
>>>> 1. It's expensive!
>>>> It can be, yes. There are programs like GDB offers to help with vet
>>>> bills, so the food and grooming are really all I have to pay for. That
>>>> and toys, which we probably spend way to much money on. More money
>>>> than I would usually spend? Certainly, but it's nowhere near a lot
>>>> (and I'm a student living on a budget). It's also well worth the money.
>>>> 
>>>> 2. It's inconvenient!
>>>> Yes, taking your dog out must be such hard work. Wait, I do it every
>>>> day, what am i talking about? It's not fun when you're sick and yes,
>>>> finding a trash can be kind of tough. That's why O'Mally and Minh's
>>>> viva know "find the trash." That's also when social skills come into
>>>> play. "Excuse me mam, do you see a trashcan nearby?" Works every time.
>>>> If you're at an unfamiliar hotel, you just ask at the front desk and
>>>> they're usually pretty cool about it. Airports also have relieving
>>>> areas. Unless you travel twice a week, a couple hours of slightly less
>>>> leg room (and I'm fairly tall) is really not that big of a deal.
>>>> 
>>>> 3. It's time-consuming!
>>>> Yes, having a dog does take time. You'd think this would be inherently
>>>> obvious, but it was needed to be pointed out here. You don't need to
>>>> go for 12 mile runs, O'mally and I have left today to relieve and that
>>>> was pretty much it. I played with him and listened to a book and sat
>>>> with him on the floor for a bit. He's totally happy and hasn't
>>>> demolished anything.
>>>> 
>>>> 4. It's unwelcomed attention!
>>>> I find it kind of funny you're talking about being covert and not
>>>> making a name for yourself with complaints when the NFB files more
>>>> lawsuits than I can keep up with. But beyond that, I've never been
>>>> turned down from eating because I have a dog. Cabs, certainly; we all
>>>> have. If an establishment turns me down, I'll make sure that people
>>>> know they did it and they're not treating me equally. Just because I'm
>>>> blind doesn't mean I should sit in the corner and hope that things get
>>>> better; I want to educate people. I've had a lot of really amazing
>>>> people come up and talk to me and ask questions about my guide. It
>>>> certainly does get a bit trying at times, but in no way is it a huge
>>>> problem. I am sorry however if you're not the center of the topics and
>>>> people do ask about your dog. It happens.
>>>> 
>>>> 5. It can be dirty work!
>>>> Best not ever get sick by yourself then, or have kids, or anything
>>>> else. Yes, it can be tough. If you're squeamish maybe it's not for
>>>> you. Cleaning up doggy vomit really isn't the best part of my day, but
>>>> you do it. mostly because these dogs do so much for you and if O'mally
>>>> is sick I'm worried about him and just want him to get better. You do
>>>> it because you love your dog.
>>>> 
>>>> "If you were contemplating a dog, came across this post and felt
>>>> discouraged, you should not get a dog. It's a lot of work. It's a lot
>>>> of responsibility.
>>>> It's constant care and attention and a commitment to keep up the dog's
>>>> level of training. No one will fault you for being mature enough to
>>>> walk away."
>>>> 
>>>> So let me sum this up: expensive; inconvenient; time-consuming;
>>>> unwelcome attention; messy work. Yeah, I'd say you probably shouldn't
>>>> have a dog. Please though, do try to at least provide constructive and
>>>> good information on both sides of this issue. The issues you raised
>>>> were incredibly self-centered, rude, generalizing and really didn't
>>>> convey any issues beyond negative criticism.
>>>> 
>>>> My guide does amazing work each and every day. when I pick up his
>>>> harness, he's by my side, tail wagging ready to work for me. He only
>>>> asks that I give him love, attention and take care of him with vet
>>>> visits, grooming and toys. Given the amount of travel that he has
>>>> enabled me to do (I am and was proficient with a cane), I think it
>>>> only fitting that I pay for his food, give him attention, clean up
>>>> after him when he's sick and treat him well. My guide loves me, no
>>>> questions asked. while I somewhat understand these points, I think
>>>> anyone who has actually had a guide would really agree that they are
>>>> huge issues that should prevent you from getting one.
>>>> 
>>>> At first, this looked like a trolling post; it still feels like a
>>>> trolling post.
>>>> 
>>>> Be well,
>>>> Ty
>>>>> On 3/19/2015 10:20 PM, Justin Harford via nabs-l wrote:
>>>>> At first, this looked like a trolling post, but after I actually
>>>>> read the article, I  enjoyed it.
>>>>> 
>>>>> It is a very frank and honest examination of the positives and
>>>>> negatives of one individual's experience with a guide dog, and
>>>>> clearly reads as the opinion of one person.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Regards Justin
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:52 PM, Juanita Herrera via nabs-l
>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Being a guide dog user myself, I found the blog offensive and
>>>>>> thought of how other guide dog handlers might feel. I didn't want
>>>>>> to generalize like the blog seems to do but I felt that if I felt
>>>>>> offended by it many other people would have too. I would have
>>>>>> appreciated it more if somewhere in the blog post it would have
>>>>>> been acknowledged that this was one person's opinion, and not
>>>>>> make it seen as if though everyone possessed the same opinion.
>>>>>> Being that I am a guide dog user and have been for three years,
>>>>>> it has been one of the best experiences of my life. I would never
>>>>>> change it for anything, and I don't consider going back to using
>>>>>> a cane after I have to retire my dog. Therefore, I highly
>>>>>> disagree with the blog post. However, I must reinstate that this
>>>>>> is simply my opinion. Juanita
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:28 PM, minh ha via nabs-l
>>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I agree with Aleeha's sentiments one hundred percent. Over
>>>>>>> generalization is a huge mistake to do under any circumstances,
>>>>>>> and this blog post was offensive to me and other guide dog
>>>>>>> handlers on so many levels. If you want to write a fair and
>>>>>>> informative blog post about the guide dog lifestyle, then by
>>>>>>> all means, point out the negative aspects, but do not
>>>>>>> conveniently forget to mention the thousand of other more
>>>>>>> positive and beneficial impacts that a guide dog can have on a
>>>>>>> person's life. Yes, a guide dog is not the right choice for
>>>>>>> everyone and a blind person needs to think long and hard before
>>>>>>> getting one, but for the right reasons, a guide dog can
>>>>>>> completely turn someone's life around and give them the
>>>>>>> confidence in order to live life more productively. Honestly,
>>>>>>> your five reasons seem very childish, and i have to wonder if
>>>>>>> they are that important to you, then you should be
>>>>>>> contemplating about getting another guide dog at all.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Respectfully, Minh and my hard working little guide, Viva
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On 3/19/15, Aleeha Dudley via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> wrote: Personally, I find your subject line a bit offensive,
>>>>>>>> as it assumes that guide dogs are a terrible idea for
>>>>>>>> everyone. Being the proud handler of a wonderful dog myself,
>>>>>>>> and a quite independent cane traveller before that, I am a
>>>>>>>> bit upset as what I find to be a somewhat inflammatory post.
>>>>>>>> You are right; guide dogs are not for everyone. They are a
>>>>>>>> huge responsibility and need a lot of daily care. But to say
>>>>>>>> that there are five reasons why a guide dog is a terrile idea
>>>>>>>> seems to be going too far, especially addressing such a
>>>>>>>> large body of people such as that on this list. Now, having
>>>>>>>> clicked the link and read the blog, I know that you are
>>>>>>>> making an attempt to be fair and point out the disadvantages,
>>>>>>>> but to not point out that this was a blog post or an opinion
>>>>>>>> article, can make some folks pretty mad fairly quickly. Can
>>>>>>>> wa choose our words and subject lines a little more wisely
>>>>>>>> next time? Aleha and Dallas, Seeing Eye dog extrordinaire
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> On 3/19/15, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote: If
>>>>>>>>> you're blind, you obviously read Braille. Your hearing must
>>>>>>>>> naturally be superior to your sighted peers, and of course
>>>>>>>>> you have a guide dog! Right?
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the first and
>>>>>>>>> second. Someone recently told me the number of guide dog
>>>>>>>>> users has actually declined in my millennial generation. I
>>>>>>>>> have no evidence proving this one way or the other, but for
>>>>>>>>> the general public, to see a blind person with a guide dog
>>>>>>>>> feels as natural as butter and toast.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for
>>>>>>>>> everyone. Or, maybe I'm just projecting my own
>>>>>>>>> uncertainties onto the rest of the community?
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Last November I took the first step in the application
>>>>>>>>> process to return for a second Seeing Eye dog. It's been
>>>>>>>>> more than three years since I lost Gator, and even though
>>>>>>>>> I've gotten around just fine with a white cane, I am
>>>>>>>>> approaching what feels like the final years with sight,
>>>>>>>>> however minimal that sight might be. I admit it's unnerving
>>>>>>>>> if I sit still long enough to contemplate total blindness.
>>>>>>>>> NFB philosophy be damned, and the thought of an extra set
>>>>>>>>> of eyes to help me navigate the world does bring a measure
>>>>>>>>> of comfort. But, is it enough to go get another dog?
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> In no particular order, here are reasons why a guide dog
>>>>>>>>> would be a terrible idea:
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Read more:
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-terrible-idea/
>>>> - --
>>>>>>>>> Musings of a Work in Progress: www.JoeOrozco.com/
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l
>>>>>>>>> mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>>>>>> info for nabs-l:
>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com
>>>> - --
>>>>>>>> Aleeha Dudley and Seeing Eye Yellow Labrador Dallas Vice
>>>>>>>> President, Ohio Association of Blind Students Email:
>>>>>>>> blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com Follow me on Twitter at
>>>>>>>> @blindcowgirl199
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> The wind of heaven is that which blows between a horse's
>>>>>>>> ears. - Arabian Proverb
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l
>>>>>>>> mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>>>>> info for nabs-l:
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/minh.ha927%40gmail.com
>>>> - --
>>>>>>> "All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in
>>>>>>> the dusty recesses of their minds, wake in the day to find that
>>>>>>> it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men,
>>>>>>> for they may act on their dreams with open eyes, to make them
>>>>>>> possible." T. E. Lawrence
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing
>>>>>>> list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>> for nabs-l:
>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/juanitaherrera1991%40gmail.com
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>> for nabs-l:
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindstein%40gmail.com
>>>>> 
>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing
>>>>> list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
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>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/tyler%40tysdomain.com
>>>> - --
>>>> Take care,
>>>> Ty
>>>> twitter: @sorressean
>>>> web:http://tysdomain.com
>>>> pubkey: http://tysdomain.com/files/pubkey.asc
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>>>> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>>>> 
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>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> nabs-l:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindstein%40gmail.com
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com


From gloria.graves at gmail.com  Mon Mar 23 00:01:35 2015
From: gloria.graves at gmail.com (Gloria Graves)
Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2015 19:01:35 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Changing settings in office 2013
In-Reply-To: <auto-000019577393@mailfront1.g2host.com>
References: <5A962A1D-E826-4908-9426-DE8759EB2E1D@gmail.com>
	<CALAYQJBwT9yHJhzcbO7Sym-+1OcoRWTYg7DJPWi=HmfWwT6grw@mail.gmail.com>
	<auto-000019577393@mailfront1.g2host.com>
Message-ID: <C5CE5DEA-E223-46FB-8265-E988B406C392@gmail.com>

Hi
Im using JAWs and i was told i could change the drop down minues to the classic settings
Gloria



> On Mar 22, 2015, at 6:45 PM, David Andrews via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> This is true if she is using JAWS, as this is a JAWS setting, not a Word thing.
> 
> Word itself does not change the ribbon back to classic menus.  JAWS can make the ribbon act like the classic menus, to a certain extent, it calls it the "virtual ribbon."
> 
> Dave
> 
> At 06:02 PM 3/22/2015, you wrote:
>> I'm fairly certain this setting is somewhere in the verbosity
>> settings, which you can activate with Insert-V while in a Word doc.
>> Arielle
>> 
>> On 3/22/15, Gloria Graves via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> > Hi all,
>> > I was wondering if someone would be willing to give me instructions on how
>> > to change the menu selections in office from the ribbon to the classic
>> > settings? I want to be able to use the drop-down menu's when working in
>> > office or word
>> > Thanks,
>> > Gloria
> 
>        David Andrews and long white cane Harry.
> E-Mail:  dandrews at visi.com or david.andrews at nfbnet.org
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gmail.com


From loneblindjedi at samobile.net  Mon Mar 23 00:03:03 2015
From: loneblindjedi at samobile.net (Jedi Moerke)
Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2015 19:03:03 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <AFC27292-214D-44FE-9C96-4CE1D186908E@gmail.com>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>
	<CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAAJqG9je1EWhg88Fx-snXj2Ty172TY48k9OM3ZX-4L8ckjvchw@mail.gmail.com>
	<BDB2A090-9AAF-49F1-88EE-EA5B06900860@gmail.com>
	<1AD31DFB-D5F6-4242-949E-EE77DC6B8F9F@gmail.com>
	<550B9164.8070103@tysdomain.com>
	<CAL=h+uj9=QcYboRbA=4oo4yQY-cytrfFL1qGrY9_45f898Nqkg@mail.gmail.com>
	<4AB84DC8-D78C-4D42-B57E-D46F0E364702@gmail.com>
	<558B9C29-B7B1-4D6F-B507-E3CA36DD2C64@samobile.net>
	<AFC27292-214D-44FE-9C96-4CE1D186908E@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5001F1C0-E8AA-429A-B4A6-3484E90F5FC4@samobile.net>

It's not. I just don't understand why someone would knowingly use a headline like that in a community where some folks could reasonably be offended.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 22, 2015, at 6:51 PM, Jamie Principato <blackbyrdfly at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Why is guide dog use a topic calling for a special level of sensitivity? Sensitivity to what? It's a choice just like cane use is. 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Mar 22, 2015, at 5:47 PM, Jedi Moerke via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> 
>> There is something to be said for using a vocative headlines, but there is also something to be said for cultural awareness and sensitivity.  
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Mar 20, 2015, at 2:16 AM, Justin Harford via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> I agree. 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 8:41 PM, Brice Smith via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Did those of you who feel offended actually read the blog,
>>>> particularly the explanations under the heading, "Damn! Any Words of
>>>> Encouragement?"
>>>> 
>>>> The subject line is purposely and brilliantly provocative--the kind
>>>> that gathers almost a dozen responses in just a couple of hours. Joe
>>>> clearly understands how to use rhetoric to make a compelling argument,
>>>> and some of the knee-jerk reactions on this list to this post were
>>>> disappointing.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Brice
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> On 3/19/15, Littlefield, Tyler via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>>>>> Hash: SHA1
>>>>> 
>>>>> Positives? You can summarize this up in 5 really fast points. I seen
>>>>> no positives and really, the negatives aren't huge drawbacks that were
>>>>> listed.
>>>>> I mean, if you want to tell people not to get a dog, you surely can do
>>>>> better than that.
>>>>> 
>>>>> But I'll address each of these points in turn.
>>>>> 1. It's expensive!
>>>>> It can be, yes. There are programs like GDB offers to help with vet
>>>>> bills, so the food and grooming are really all I have to pay for. That
>>>>> and toys, which we probably spend way to much money on. More money
>>>>> than I would usually spend? Certainly, but it's nowhere near a lot
>>>>> (and I'm a student living on a budget). It's also well worth the money.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 2. It's inconvenient!
>>>>> Yes, taking your dog out must be such hard work. Wait, I do it every
>>>>> day, what am i talking about? It's not fun when you're sick and yes,
>>>>> finding a trash can be kind of tough. That's why O'Mally and Minh's
>>>>> viva know "find the trash." That's also when social skills come into
>>>>> play. "Excuse me mam, do you see a trashcan nearby?" Works every time.
>>>>> If you're at an unfamiliar hotel, you just ask at the front desk and
>>>>> they're usually pretty cool about it. Airports also have relieving
>>>>> areas. Unless you travel twice a week, a couple hours of slightly less
>>>>> leg room (and I'm fairly tall) is really not that big of a deal.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 3. It's time-consuming!
>>>>> Yes, having a dog does take time. You'd think this would be inherently
>>>>> obvious, but it was needed to be pointed out here. You don't need to
>>>>> go for 12 mile runs, O'mally and I have left today to relieve and that
>>>>> was pretty much it. I played with him and listened to a book and sat
>>>>> with him on the floor for a bit. He's totally happy and hasn't
>>>>> demolished anything.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 4. It's unwelcomed attention!
>>>>> I find it kind of funny you're talking about being covert and not
>>>>> making a name for yourself with complaints when the NFB files more
>>>>> lawsuits than I can keep up with. But beyond that, I've never been
>>>>> turned down from eating because I have a dog. Cabs, certainly; we all
>>>>> have. If an establishment turns me down, I'll make sure that people
>>>>> know they did it and they're not treating me equally. Just because I'm
>>>>> blind doesn't mean I should sit in the corner and hope that things get
>>>>> better; I want to educate people. I've had a lot of really amazing
>>>>> people come up and talk to me and ask questions about my guide. It
>>>>> certainly does get a bit trying at times, but in no way is it a huge
>>>>> problem. I am sorry however if you're not the center of the topics and
>>>>> people do ask about your dog. It happens.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 5. It can be dirty work!
>>>>> Best not ever get sick by yourself then, or have kids, or anything
>>>>> else. Yes, it can be tough. If you're squeamish maybe it's not for
>>>>> you. Cleaning up doggy vomit really isn't the best part of my day, but
>>>>> you do it. mostly because these dogs do so much for you and if O'mally
>>>>> is sick I'm worried about him and just want him to get better. You do
>>>>> it because you love your dog.
>>>>> 
>>>>> "If you were contemplating a dog, came across this post and felt
>>>>> discouraged, you should not get a dog. It's a lot of work. It's a lot
>>>>> of responsibility.
>>>>> It's constant care and attention and a commitment to keep up the dog's
>>>>> level of training. No one will fault you for being mature enough to
>>>>> walk away."
>>>>> 
>>>>> So let me sum this up: expensive; inconvenient; time-consuming;
>>>>> unwelcome attention; messy work. Yeah, I'd say you probably shouldn't
>>>>> have a dog. Please though, do try to at least provide constructive and
>>>>> good information on both sides of this issue. The issues you raised
>>>>> were incredibly self-centered, rude, generalizing and really didn't
>>>>> convey any issues beyond negative criticism.
>>>>> 
>>>>> My guide does amazing work each and every day. when I pick up his
>>>>> harness, he's by my side, tail wagging ready to work for me. He only
>>>>> asks that I give him love, attention and take care of him with vet
>>>>> visits, grooming and toys. Given the amount of travel that he has
>>>>> enabled me to do (I am and was proficient with a cane), I think it
>>>>> only fitting that I pay for his food, give him attention, clean up
>>>>> after him when he's sick and treat him well. My guide loves me, no
>>>>> questions asked. while I somewhat understand these points, I think
>>>>> anyone who has actually had a guide would really agree that they are
>>>>> huge issues that should prevent you from getting one.
>>>>> 
>>>>> At first, this looked like a trolling post; it still feels like a
>>>>> trolling post.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Be well,
>>>>> Ty
>>>>>> On 3/19/2015 10:20 PM, Justin Harford via nabs-l wrote:
>>>>>> At first, this looked like a trolling post, but after I actually
>>>>>> read the article, I  enjoyed it.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> It is a very frank and honest examination of the positives and
>>>>>> negatives of one individual's experience with a guide dog, and
>>>>>> clearly reads as the opinion of one person.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Regards Justin
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:52 PM, Juanita Herrera via nabs-l
>>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Being a guide dog user myself, I found the blog offensive and
>>>>>>> thought of how other guide dog handlers might feel. I didn't want
>>>>>>> to generalize like the blog seems to do but I felt that if I felt
>>>>>>> offended by it many other people would have too. I would have
>>>>>>> appreciated it more if somewhere in the blog post it would have
>>>>>>> been acknowledged that this was one person's opinion, and not
>>>>>>> make it seen as if though everyone possessed the same opinion.
>>>>>>> Being that I am a guide dog user and have been for three years,
>>>>>>> it has been one of the best experiences of my life. I would never
>>>>>>> change it for anything, and I don't consider going back to using
>>>>>>> a cane after I have to retire my dog. Therefore, I highly
>>>>>>> disagree with the blog post. However, I must reinstate that this
>>>>>>> is simply my opinion. Juanita
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:28 PM, minh ha via nabs-l
>>>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> I agree with Aleeha's sentiments one hundred percent. Over
>>>>>>>> generalization is a huge mistake to do under any circumstances,
>>>>>>>> and this blog post was offensive to me and other guide dog
>>>>>>>> handlers on so many levels. If you want to write a fair and
>>>>>>>> informative blog post about the guide dog lifestyle, then by
>>>>>>>> all means, point out the negative aspects, but do not
>>>>>>>> conveniently forget to mention the thousand of other more
>>>>>>>> positive and beneficial impacts that a guide dog can have on a
>>>>>>>> person's life. Yes, a guide dog is not the right choice for
>>>>>>>> everyone and a blind person needs to think long and hard before
>>>>>>>> getting one, but for the right reasons, a guide dog can
>>>>>>>> completely turn someone's life around and give them the
>>>>>>>> confidence in order to live life more productively. Honestly,
>>>>>>>> your five reasons seem very childish, and i have to wonder if
>>>>>>>> they are that important to you, then you should be
>>>>>>>> contemplating about getting another guide dog at all.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Respectfully, Minh and my hard working little guide, Viva
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> On 3/19/15, Aleeha Dudley via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>> wrote: Personally, I find your subject line a bit offensive,
>>>>>>>>> as it assumes that guide dogs are a terrible idea for
>>>>>>>>> everyone. Being the proud handler of a wonderful dog myself,
>>>>>>>>> and a quite independent cane traveller before that, I am a
>>>>>>>>> bit upset as what I find to be a somewhat inflammatory post.
>>>>>>>>> You are right; guide dogs are not for everyone. They are a
>>>>>>>>> huge responsibility and need a lot of daily care. But to say
>>>>>>>>> that there are five reasons why a guide dog is a terrile idea
>>>>>>>>> seems to be going too far, especially addressing such a
>>>>>>>>> large body of people such as that on this list. Now, having
>>>>>>>>> clicked the link and read the blog, I know that you are
>>>>>>>>> making an attempt to be fair and point out the disadvantages,
>>>>>>>>> but to not point out that this was a blog post or an opinion
>>>>>>>>> article, can make some folks pretty mad fairly quickly. Can
>>>>>>>>> wa choose our words and subject lines a little more wisely
>>>>>>>>> next time? Aleha and Dallas, Seeing Eye dog extrordinaire
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> On 3/19/15, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote: If
>>>>>>>>>> you're blind, you obviously read Braille. Your hearing must
>>>>>>>>>> naturally be superior to your sighted peers, and of course
>>>>>>>>>> you have a guide dog! Right?
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the first and
>>>>>>>>>> second. Someone recently told me the number of guide dog
>>>>>>>>>> users has actually declined in my millennial generation. I
>>>>>>>>>> have no evidence proving this one way or the other, but for
>>>>>>>>>> the general public, to see a blind person with a guide dog
>>>>>>>>>> feels as natural as butter and toast.
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for
>>>>>>>>>> everyone. Or, maybe I'm just projecting my own
>>>>>>>>>> uncertainties onto the rest of the community?
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Last November I took the first step in the application
>>>>>>>>>> process to return for a second Seeing Eye dog. It's been
>>>>>>>>>> more than three years since I lost Gator, and even though
>>>>>>>>>> I've gotten around just fine with a white cane, I am
>>>>>>>>>> approaching what feels like the final years with sight,
>>>>>>>>>> however minimal that sight might be. I admit it's unnerving
>>>>>>>>>> if I sit still long enough to contemplate total blindness.
>>>>>>>>>> NFB philosophy be damned, and the thought of an extra set
>>>>>>>>>> of eyes to help me navigate the world does bring a measure
>>>>>>>>>> of comfort. But, is it enough to go get another dog?
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> In no particular order, here are reasons why a guide dog
>>>>>>>>>> would be a terrible idea:
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Read more:
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-terrible-idea/
>>>>> - --
>>>>>>>>>> Musings of a Work in Progress: www.JoeOrozco.com/
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l
>>>>>>>>>> mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>>>>>>> info for nabs-l:
>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com
>>>>> - --
>>>>>>>>> Aleeha Dudley and Seeing Eye Yellow Labrador Dallas Vice
>>>>>>>>> President, Ohio Association of Blind Students Email:
>>>>>>>>> blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com Follow me on Twitter at
>>>>>>>>> @blindcowgirl199
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> The wind of heaven is that which blows between a horse's
>>>>>>>>> ears. - Arabian Proverb
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l
>>>>>>>>> mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>>>>>> info for nabs-l:
>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/minh.ha927%40gmail.com
>>>>> - --
>>>>>>>> "All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in
>>>>>>>> the dusty recesses of their minds, wake in the day to find that
>>>>>>>> it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men,
>>>>>>>> for they may act on their dreams with open eyes, to make them
>>>>>>>> possible." T. E. Lawrence
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing
>>>>>>>> list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>>> for nabs-l:
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/juanitaherrera1991%40gmail.com
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>> for nabs-l:
>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindstein%40gmail.com
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing
>>>>>> list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/tyler%40tysdomain.com
>>>>> - --
>>>>> Take care,
>>>>> Ty
>>>>> twitter: @sorressean
>>>>> web:http://tysdomain.com
>>>>> pubkey: http://tysdomain.com/files/pubkey.asc
>>>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
>>>>> Version: GnuPG v2
>>>>> 
>>>>> iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJVC5FkAAoJEAdP60+BYxejeg8H/jgEQxColgCWyB7SJTK/Wspj
>>>>> 1Jb8iqe+VvmabPVgm7ZyAK3ZqO6hEM9HJ77O40xYldj02dwQnAF49s62oIx+H3Dg
>>>>> Xmnm3uO8LDlh5UmA9YI7u3gWKRCXWYmZA0QWIZkrw38Ack8nfZWft5GTIdUBXM7U
>>>>> iXTqhKAm/zV3Xe0O/rMbnsiY1DJZebDy97vm+7vxHESjrIfrpoyXwY2VF9oG96c3
>>>>> zvgte305wLQqJIj6gvABh4Up7b7eqP4Bn/HpXmbV5ojfSiT6XcTk+YV+B5uYvPa4
>>>>> 6R1Q40f7q0rRvELc+M9lx3W8R8sjGf9X1qPTEgNy6d9j5CETmgyE0d4gBrMbJBo=
>>>>> =IjVb
>>>>> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>>>>> 
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindstein%40gmail.com
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com
> 



From chapman.candicel at gmail.com  Mon Mar 23 05:08:55 2015
From: chapman.candicel at gmail.com (Candice Chapman)
Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2015 00:08:55 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] March Membership Call
Message-ID: <CAKQ+JjwgTytx6Jd7nGOCm-kXgMNbrh1F0_fpJ9u3t2oRxCzbAQ@mail.gmail.com>

Greetings NABS,

I hope that you all have had or are having a wonderful Spring Break!
We're half-way done with the semester! Congratulations!

As we get back into the swing of things after a much needed break,
it's time to for another membership call! This month we'll be talking
about Disability Services and the laws that are relevant to them. Dan
Burke will be our guest speaker for the call. I hope that you will be
able to join us!

Date: Sunday, March 29th
Time: 8 eastern, 7 central, 6 pacific, 5 mountain
Where: 605-475-6700 code: 7869673

Hope to see you all there!

Best,

Candice


From cape.amanda at gmail.com  Mon Mar 23 16:29:20 2015
From: cape.amanda at gmail.com (cape.amanda at gmail.com)
Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2015 12:29:20 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Downgrading Microsoft word
Message-ID: <B3D6820F-43F9-432B-88E0-7ADB6651844D@gmail.com>

Hi fellow students,
Is there a way to downgrade my version of word so that it's more accessible with Jaws as far as formatting documents without so much sighted assistance?

Amanda

From mausbun at unr.edu  Mon Mar 23 18:49:21 2015
From: mausbun at unr.edu (Michael D Ausbun)
Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2015 18:49:21 +0000
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <5001F1C0-E8AA-429A-B4A6-3484E90F5FC4@samobile.net>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>
	<CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAAJqG9je1EWhg88Fx-snXj2Ty172TY48k9OM3ZX-4L8ckjvchw@mail.gmail.com>
	<BDB2A090-9AAF-49F1-88EE-EA5B06900860@gmail.com>
	<1AD31DFB-D5F6-4242-949E-EE77DC6B8F9F@gmail.com>
	<550B9164.8070103@tysdomain.com>
	<CAL=h+uj9=QcYboRbA=4oo4yQY-cytrfFL1qGrY9_45f898Nqkg@mail.gmail.com>
	<4AB84DC8-D78C-4D42-B57E-D46F0E364702@gmail.com>
	<558B9C29-B7B1-4D6F-B507-E3CA36DD2C64@samobile.net>
	<AFC27292-214D-44FE-9C96-4CE1D186908E@gmail.com>,
	<5001F1C0-E8AA-429A-B4A6-3484E90F5FC4@samobile.net>
Message-ID: <79E0714D132BCB43A4B18D328D9A445B0120F62B@UBOX3.unr.edu>

Both the author, and a few of the responders, have outlined that the headline is indicative of the articles content. That is, the blog post outlines precisely what the title says. Moreover, the first rule of successful marketing, of any sort, is to shock ones audience. Thus, in a situation where likely greater than fifty percent of the audience are guide dog users, an individual ought to isolate the negative aspects, when marketing. It causes guide dog users to say, “Wait what!” then they read the article, and often, act out in the way they did. Those who act out cause more people to wonder what is occurring, which causes them to look at it, and if they don’t act the way the previous people did, then the author is vindicated. In this instance, provocative rhetoric trumps insecurities, which probably should not even exist.

Just a little side note, as well, the author has posted things from his blog before. In conjunction with it being a blog, should have been reasonable justification for knowing that it was an opinion piece.

________________________________________
From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Jedi Moerke via nabs-l [nabs-l at nfbnet.org]
Sent: Sunday, March 22, 2015 5:03 PM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!

It's not. I just don't understand why someone would knowingly use a headline like that in a community where some folks could reasonably be offended.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 22, 2015, at 6:51 PM, Jamie Principato <blackbyrdfly at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Why is guide dog use a topic calling for a special level of sensitivity? Sensitivity to what? It's a choice just like cane use is.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Mar 22, 2015, at 5:47 PM, Jedi Moerke via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>
>> There is something to be said for using a vocative headlines, but there is also something to be said for cultural awareness and sensitivity.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Mar 20, 2015, at 2:16 AM, Justin Harford via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> I agree.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 8:41 PM, Brice Smith via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Did those of you who feel offended actually read the blog,
>>>> particularly the explanations under the heading, "Damn! Any Words of
>>>> Encouragement?"
>>>>
>>>> The subject line is purposely and brilliantly provocative--the kind
>>>> that gathers almost a dozen responses in just a couple of hours. Joe
>>>> clearly understands how to use rhetoric to make a compelling argument,
>>>> and some of the knee-jerk reactions on this list to this post were
>>>> disappointing.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Brice
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On 3/19/15, Littlefield, Tyler via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>>>>> Hash: SHA1
>>>>>
>>>>> Positives? You can summarize this up in 5 really fast points. I seen
>>>>> no positives and really, the negatives aren't huge drawbacks that were
>>>>> listed.
>>>>> I mean, if you want to tell people not to get a dog, you surely can do
>>>>> better than that.
>>>>>
>>>>> But I'll address each of these points in turn.
>>>>> 1. It's expensive!
>>>>> It can be, yes. There are programs like GDB offers to help with vet
>>>>> bills, so the food and grooming are really all I have to pay for. That
>>>>> and toys, which we probably spend way to much money on. More money
>>>>> than I would usually spend? Certainly, but it's nowhere near a lot
>>>>> (and I'm a student living on a budget). It's also well worth the money.
>>>>>
>>>>> 2. It's inconvenient!
>>>>> Yes, taking your dog out must be such hard work. Wait, I do it every
>>>>> day, what am i talking about? It's not fun when you're sick and yes,
>>>>> finding a trash can be kind of tough. That's why O'Mally and Minh's
>>>>> viva know "find the trash." That's also when social skills come into
>>>>> play. "Excuse me mam, do you see a trashcan nearby?" Works every time.
>>>>> If you're at an unfamiliar hotel, you just ask at the front desk and
>>>>> they're usually pretty cool about it. Airports also have relieving
>>>>> areas. Unless you travel twice a week, a couple hours of slightly less
>>>>> leg room (and I'm fairly tall) is really not that big of a deal.
>>>>>
>>>>> 3. It's time-consuming!
>>>>> Yes, having a dog does take time. You'd think this would be inherently
>>>>> obvious, but it was needed to be pointed out here. You don't need to
>>>>> go for 12 mile runs, O'mally and I have left today to relieve and that
>>>>> was pretty much it. I played with him and listened to a book and sat
>>>>> with him on the floor for a bit. He's totally happy and hasn't
>>>>> demolished anything.
>>>>>
>>>>> 4. It's unwelcomed attention!
>>>>> I find it kind of funny you're talking about being covert and not
>>>>> making a name for yourself with complaints when the NFB files more
>>>>> lawsuits than I can keep up with. But beyond that, I've never been
>>>>> turned down from eating because I have a dog. Cabs, certainly; we all
>>>>> have. If an establishment turns me down, I'll make sure that people
>>>>> know they did it and they're not treating me equally. Just because I'm
>>>>> blind doesn't mean I should sit in the corner and hope that things get
>>>>> better; I want to educate people. I've had a lot of really amazing
>>>>> people come up and talk to me and ask questions about my guide. It
>>>>> certainly does get a bit trying at times, but in no way is it a huge
>>>>> problem. I am sorry however if you're not the center of the topics and
>>>>> people do ask about your dog. It happens.
>>>>>
>>>>> 5. It can be dirty work!
>>>>> Best not ever get sick by yourself then, or have kids, or anything
>>>>> else. Yes, it can be tough. If you're squeamish maybe it's not for
>>>>> you. Cleaning up doggy vomit really isn't the best part of my day, but
>>>>> you do it. mostly because these dogs do so much for you and if O'mally
>>>>> is sick I'm worried about him and just want him to get better. You do
>>>>> it because you love your dog.
>>>>>
>>>>> "If you were contemplating a dog, came across this post and felt
>>>>> discouraged, you should not get a dog. It's a lot of work. It's a lot
>>>>> of responsibility.
>>>>> It's constant care and attention and a commitment to keep up the dog's
>>>>> level of training. No one will fault you for being mature enough to
>>>>> walk away."
>>>>>
>>>>> So let me sum this up: expensive; inconvenient; time-consuming;
>>>>> unwelcome attention; messy work. Yeah, I'd say you probably shouldn't
>>>>> have a dog. Please though, do try to at least provide constructive and
>>>>> good information on both sides of this issue. The issues you raised
>>>>> were incredibly self-centered, rude, generalizing and really didn't
>>>>> convey any issues beyond negative criticism.
>>>>>
>>>>> My guide does amazing work each and every day. when I pick up his
>>>>> harness, he's by my side, tail wagging ready to work for me. He only
>>>>> asks that I give him love, attention and take care of him with vet
>>>>> visits, grooming and toys. Given the amount of travel that he has
>>>>> enabled me to do (I am and was proficient with a cane), I think it
>>>>> only fitting that I pay for his food, give him attention, clean up
>>>>> after him when he's sick and treat him well. My guide loves me, no
>>>>> questions asked. while I somewhat understand these points, I think
>>>>> anyone who has actually had a guide would really agree that they are
>>>>> huge issues that should prevent you from getting one.
>>>>>
>>>>> At first, this looked like a trolling post; it still feels like a
>>>>> trolling post.
>>>>>
>>>>> Be well,
>>>>> Ty
>>>>>> On 3/19/2015 10:20 PM, Justin Harford via nabs-l wrote:
>>>>>> At first, this looked like a trolling post, but after I actually
>>>>>> read the article, I  enjoyed it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It is a very frank and honest examination of the positives and
>>>>>> negatives of one individual's experience with a guide dog, and
>>>>>> clearly reads as the opinion of one person.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Regards Justin
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:52 PM, Juanita Herrera via nabs-l
>>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Being a guide dog user myself, I found the blog offensive and
>>>>>>> thought of how other guide dog handlers might feel. I didn't want
>>>>>>> to generalize like the blog seems to do but I felt that if I felt
>>>>>>> offended by it many other people would have too. I would have
>>>>>>> appreciated it more if somewhere in the blog post it would have
>>>>>>> been acknowledged that this was one person's opinion, and not
>>>>>>> make it seen as if though everyone possessed the same opinion.
>>>>>>> Being that I am a guide dog user and have been for three years,
>>>>>>> it has been one of the best experiences of my life. I would never
>>>>>>> change it for anything, and I don't consider going back to using
>>>>>>> a cane after I have to retire my dog. Therefore, I highly
>>>>>>> disagree with the blog post. However, I must reinstate that this
>>>>>>> is simply my opinion. Juanita
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:28 PM, minh ha via nabs-l
>>>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I agree with Aleeha's sentiments one hundred percent. Over
>>>>>>>> generalization is a huge mistake to do under any circumstances,
>>>>>>>> and this blog post was offensive to me and other guide dog
>>>>>>>> handlers on so many levels. If you want to write a fair and
>>>>>>>> informative blog post about the guide dog lifestyle, then by
>>>>>>>> all means, point out the negative aspects, but do not
>>>>>>>> conveniently forget to mention the thousand of other more
>>>>>>>> positive and beneficial impacts that a guide dog can have on a
>>>>>>>> person's life. Yes, a guide dog is not the right choice for
>>>>>>>> everyone and a blind person needs to think long and hard before
>>>>>>>> getting one, but for the right reasons, a guide dog can
>>>>>>>> completely turn someone's life around and give them the
>>>>>>>> confidence in order to live life more productively. Honestly,
>>>>>>>> your five reasons seem very childish, and i have to wonder if
>>>>>>>> they are that important to you, then you should be
>>>>>>>> contemplating about getting another guide dog at all.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Respectfully, Minh and my hard working little guide, Viva
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 3/19/15, Aleeha Dudley via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>> wrote: Personally, I find your subject line a bit offensive,
>>>>>>>>> as it assumes that guide dogs are a terrible idea for
>>>>>>>>> everyone. Being the proud handler of a wonderful dog myself,
>>>>>>>>> and a quite independent cane traveller before that, I am a
>>>>>>>>> bit upset as what I find to be a somewhat inflammatory post.
>>>>>>>>> You are right; guide dogs are not for everyone. They are a
>>>>>>>>> huge responsibility and need a lot of daily care. But to say
>>>>>>>>> that there are five reasons why a guide dog is a terrile idea
>>>>>>>>> seems to be going too far, especially addressing such a
>>>>>>>>> large body of people such as that on this list. Now, having
>>>>>>>>> clicked the link and read the blog, I know that you are
>>>>>>>>> making an attempt to be fair and point out the disadvantages,
>>>>>>>>> but to not point out that this was a blog post or an opinion
>>>>>>>>> article, can make some folks pretty mad fairly quickly. Can
>>>>>>>>> wa choose our words and subject lines a little more wisely
>>>>>>>>> next time? Aleha and Dallas, Seeing Eye dog extrordinaire
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On 3/19/15, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote: If
>>>>>>>>>> you're blind, you obviously read Braille. Your hearing must
>>>>>>>>>> naturally be superior to your sighted peers, and of course
>>>>>>>>>> you have a guide dog! Right?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the first and
>>>>>>>>>> second. Someone recently told me the number of guide dog
>>>>>>>>>> users has actually declined in my millennial generation. I
>>>>>>>>>> have no evidence proving this one way or the other, but for
>>>>>>>>>> the general public, to see a blind person with a guide dog
>>>>>>>>>> feels as natural as butter and toast.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for
>>>>>>>>>> everyone. Or, maybe I'm just projecting my own
>>>>>>>>>> uncertainties onto the rest of the community?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Last November I took the first step in the application
>>>>>>>>>> process to return for a second Seeing Eye dog. It's been
>>>>>>>>>> more than three years since I lost Gator, and even though
>>>>>>>>>> I've gotten around just fine with a white cane, I am
>>>>>>>>>> approaching what feels like the final years with sight,
>>>>>>>>>> however minimal that sight might be. I admit it's unnerving
>>>>>>>>>> if I sit still long enough to contemplate total blindness.
>>>>>>>>>> NFB philosophy be damned, and the thought of an extra set
>>>>>>>>>> of eyes to help me navigate the world does bring a measure
>>>>>>>>>> of comfort. But, is it enough to go get another dog?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> In no particular order, here are reasons why a guide dog
>>>>>>>>>> would be a terrible idea:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Read more:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-terrible-idea/
>>>>> - --
>>>>>>>>>> Musings of a Work in Progress: www.JoeOrozco.com/
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l
>>>>>>>>>> mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>>>>>>> info for nabs-l:
>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com
>>>>> - --
>>>>>>>>> Aleeha Dudley and Seeing Eye Yellow Labrador Dallas Vice
>>>>>>>>> President, Ohio Association of Blind Students Email:
>>>>>>>>> blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com Follow me on Twitter at
>>>>>>>>> @blindcowgirl199
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The wind of heaven is that which blows between a horse's
>>>>>>>>> ears. - Arabian Proverb
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l
>>>>>>>>> mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>>>>>> info for nabs-l:
>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/minh.ha927%40gmail.com
>>>>> - --
>>>>>>>> "All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in
>>>>>>>> the dusty recesses of their minds, wake in the day to find that
>>>>>>>> it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men,
>>>>>>>> for they may act on their dreams with open eyes, to make them
>>>>>>>> possible." T. E. Lawrence
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing
>>>>>>>> list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>>> for nabs-l:
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/juanitaherrera1991%40gmail.com
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
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>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing
>>>>>> list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/tyler%40tysdomain.com
>>>>> - --
>>>>> Take care,
>>>>> Ty
>>>>> twitter: @sorressean
>>>>> web:http://tysdomain.com
>>>>> pubkey: http://tysdomain.com/files/pubkey.asc
>>>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
>>>>> Version: GnuPG v2
>>>>>
>>>>> iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJVC5FkAAoJEAdP60+BYxejeg8H/jgEQxColgCWyB7SJTK/Wspj
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>>>>> =IjVb
>>>>> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
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>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindstein%40gmail.com
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
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>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
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>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>


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From dsmithnfb at gmail.com  Mon Mar 23 19:39:56 2015
From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith)
Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2015 12:39:56 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] When A Personal Choice Becomes Personal.
Message-ID: <9B136BB8-B630-4A87-9910-9D1B1152B743@gmail.com>

Greetings all,

  I’ve been thinking about the guide dog post that was introduced to the list late  last week  and the responses that have come from it.
 It seems to me that one thing that causes a good amount of irritation or flat out  offense in      the blind   community is the   choice of  travel tool one decides to employ in their daily lives.
  Does the use of a cane, a dog or neither  define us as people?
 What do you think causes us to become so defensive at the point  one’s differing    opinion is expressed? 
    Interested to hear your thoughts, and look forward to some healthy dialog.
   Many Thanks,
  Darian 
 

From jim.hulme at gmail.com  Mon Mar 23 21:56:45 2015
From: jim.hulme at gmail.com (James Hulme)
Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2015 17:56:45 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
In-Reply-To: <79E0714D132BCB43A4B18D328D9A445B0120F62B@UBOX3.unr.edu>
References: <018e01d062a4$82e46870$88ad3950$@gmail.com>
	<CAE8_=nR3i2BzRhk4Uz7P7ahaP2vhZtd-ZBG33f4rqA7aP302PQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAAJqG9je1EWhg88Fx-snXj2Ty172TY48k9OM3ZX-4L8ckjvchw@mail.gmail.com>
	<BDB2A090-9AAF-49F1-88EE-EA5B06900860@gmail.com>
	<1AD31DFB-D5F6-4242-949E-EE77DC6B8F9F@gmail.com>
	<550B9164.8070103@tysdomain.com>
	<CAL=h+uj9=QcYboRbA=4oo4yQY-cytrfFL1qGrY9_45f898Nqkg@mail.gmail.com>
	<4AB84DC8-D78C-4D42-B57E-D46F0E364702@gmail.com>
	<558B9C29-B7B1-4D6F-B507-E3CA36DD2C64@samobile.net>
	<AFC27292-214D-44FE-9C96-4CE1D186908E@gmail.com>
	<5001F1C0-E8AA-429A-B4A6-3484E90F5FC4@samobile.net>
	<79E0714D132BCB43A4B18D328D9A445B0120F62B@UBOX3.unr.edu>
Message-ID: <CAKMC2e4V35HxoN8JPGPtijekQYCD4MgHY13VP=ewApX2PVAyGA@mail.gmail.com>

As far as I know. Someone with a guide dog could not visit their relativs
in Hawaii by going on a plane with a guide dog. The person was traveling
from California to Hawaii. If anyone finds this news story please fwd. me
the link off-list at jim.hulme at gmail.com



Also, Dusty's law was appealed by the state of Arizona. I do not even have
a guide dog but I follow the national and NJ news often.


Perhaps you can find this as interesting information and shed some light on
your thoughts.

Please correct me if I am wrong.


Jimmy Hulme
jim.hulme at gmail.com




On Mon, Mar 23, 2015 at 2:49 PM, Michael D Ausbun via nabs-l <
nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:

> Both the author, and a few of the responders, have outlined that the
> headline is indicative of the articles content. That is, the blog post
> outlines precisely what the title says. Moreover, the first rule of
> successful marketing, of any sort, is to shock ones audience. Thus, in a
> situation where likely greater than fifty percent of the audience are guide
> dog users, an individual ought to isolate the negative aspects, when
> marketing. It causes guide dog users to say, “Wait what!” then they read
> the article, and often, act out in the way they did. Those who act out
> cause more people to wonder what is occurring, which causes them to look at
> it, and if they don’t act the way the previous people did, then the author
> is vindicated. In this instance, provocative rhetoric trumps insecurities,
> which probably should not even exist.
>
> Just a little side note, as well, the author has posted things from his
> blog before. In conjunction with it being a blog, should have been
> reasonable justification for knowing that it was an opinion piece.
>
> ________________________________________
> From: nabs-l [nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] on behalf of Jedi Moerke via
> nabs-l [nabs-l at nfbnet.org]
> Sent: Sunday, March 22, 2015 5:03 PM
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
>
> It's not. I just don't understand why someone would knowingly use a
> headline like that in a community where some folks could reasonably be
> offended.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Mar 22, 2015, at 6:51 PM, Jamie Principato <blackbyrdfly at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > Why is guide dog use a topic calling for a special level of sensitivity?
> Sensitivity to what? It's a choice just like cane use is.
> >
> > Sent from my iPhone
> >
> >> On Mar 22, 2015, at 5:47 PM, Jedi Moerke via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> wrote:
> >>
> >> There is something to be said for using a vocative headlines, but there
> is also something to be said for cultural awareness and sensitivity.
> >>
> >> Sent from my iPhone
> >>
> >>> On Mar 20, 2015, at 2:16 AM, Justin Harford via nabs-l <
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> I agree.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 8:41 PM, Brice Smith via nabs-l <
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> Did those of you who feel offended actually read the blog,
> >>>> particularly the explanations under the heading, "Damn! Any Words of
> >>>> Encouragement?"
> >>>>
> >>>> The subject line is purposely and brilliantly provocative--the kind
> >>>> that gathers almost a dozen responses in just a couple of hours. Joe
> >>>> clearly understands how to use rhetoric to make a compelling argument,
> >>>> and some of the knee-jerk reactions on this list to this post were
> >>>> disappointing.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Brice
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>> On 3/19/15, Littlefield, Tyler via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> >>>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> >>>>> Hash: SHA1
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Positives? You can summarize this up in 5 really fast points. I seen
> >>>>> no positives and really, the negatives aren't huge drawbacks that
> were
> >>>>> listed.
> >>>>> I mean, if you want to tell people not to get a dog, you surely can
> do
> >>>>> better than that.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> But I'll address each of these points in turn.
> >>>>> 1. It's expensive!
> >>>>> It can be, yes. There are programs like GDB offers to help with vet
> >>>>> bills, so the food and grooming are really all I have to pay for.
> That
> >>>>> and toys, which we probably spend way to much money on. More money
> >>>>> than I would usually spend? Certainly, but it's nowhere near a lot
> >>>>> (and I'm a student living on a budget). It's also well worth the
> money.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> 2. It's inconvenient!
> >>>>> Yes, taking your dog out must be such hard work. Wait, I do it every
> >>>>> day, what am i talking about? It's not fun when you're sick and yes,
> >>>>> finding a trash can be kind of tough. That's why O'Mally and Minh's
> >>>>> viva know "find the trash." That's also when social skills come into
> >>>>> play. "Excuse me mam, do you see a trashcan nearby?" Works every
> time.
> >>>>> If you're at an unfamiliar hotel, you just ask at the front desk and
> >>>>> they're usually pretty cool about it. Airports also have relieving
> >>>>> areas. Unless you travel twice a week, a couple hours of slightly
> less
> >>>>> leg room (and I'm fairly tall) is really not that big of a deal.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> 3. It's time-consuming!
> >>>>> Yes, having a dog does take time. You'd think this would be
> inherently
> >>>>> obvious, but it was needed to be pointed out here. You don't need to
> >>>>> go for 12 mile runs, O'mally and I have left today to relieve and
> that
> >>>>> was pretty much it. I played with him and listened to a book and sat
> >>>>> with him on the floor for a bit. He's totally happy and hasn't
> >>>>> demolished anything.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> 4. It's unwelcomed attention!
> >>>>> I find it kind of funny you're talking about being covert and not
> >>>>> making a name for yourself with complaints when the NFB files more
> >>>>> lawsuits than I can keep up with. But beyond that, I've never been
> >>>>> turned down from eating because I have a dog. Cabs, certainly; we all
> >>>>> have. If an establishment turns me down, I'll make sure that people
> >>>>> know they did it and they're not treating me equally. Just because
> I'm
> >>>>> blind doesn't mean I should sit in the corner and hope that things
> get
> >>>>> better; I want to educate people. I've had a lot of really amazing
> >>>>> people come up and talk to me and ask questions about my guide. It
> >>>>> certainly does get a bit trying at times, but in no way is it a huge
> >>>>> problem. I am sorry however if you're not the center of the topics
> and
> >>>>> people do ask about your dog. It happens.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> 5. It can be dirty work!
> >>>>> Best not ever get sick by yourself then, or have kids, or anything
> >>>>> else. Yes, it can be tough. If you're squeamish maybe it's not for
> >>>>> you. Cleaning up doggy vomit really isn't the best part of my day,
> but
> >>>>> you do it. mostly because these dogs do so much for you and if
> O'mally
> >>>>> is sick I'm worried about him and just want him to get better. You do
> >>>>> it because you love your dog.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> "If you were contemplating a dog, came across this post and felt
> >>>>> discouraged, you should not get a dog. It's a lot of work. It's a lot
> >>>>> of responsibility.
> >>>>> It's constant care and attention and a commitment to keep up the
> dog's
> >>>>> level of training. No one will fault you for being mature enough to
> >>>>> walk away."
> >>>>>
> >>>>> So let me sum this up: expensive; inconvenient; time-consuming;
> >>>>> unwelcome attention; messy work. Yeah, I'd say you probably shouldn't
> >>>>> have a dog. Please though, do try to at least provide constructive
> and
> >>>>> good information on both sides of this issue. The issues you raised
> >>>>> were incredibly self-centered, rude, generalizing and really didn't
> >>>>> convey any issues beyond negative criticism.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> My guide does amazing work each and every day. when I pick up his
> >>>>> harness, he's by my side, tail wagging ready to work for me. He only
> >>>>> asks that I give him love, attention and take care of him with vet
> >>>>> visits, grooming and toys. Given the amount of travel that he has
> >>>>> enabled me to do (I am and was proficient with a cane), I think it
> >>>>> only fitting that I pay for his food, give him attention, clean up
> >>>>> after him when he's sick and treat him well. My guide loves me, no
> >>>>> questions asked. while I somewhat understand these points, I think
> >>>>> anyone who has actually had a guide would really agree that they are
> >>>>> huge issues that should prevent you from getting one.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> At first, this looked like a trolling post; it still feels like a
> >>>>> trolling post.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Be well,
> >>>>> Ty
> >>>>>> On 3/19/2015 10:20 PM, Justin Harford via nabs-l wrote:
> >>>>>> At first, this looked like a trolling post, but after I actually
> >>>>>> read the article, I  enjoyed it.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> It is a very frank and honest examination of the positives and
> >>>>>> negatives of one individual's experience with a guide dog, and
> >>>>>> clearly reads as the opinion of one person.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Regards Justin
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:52 PM, Juanita Herrera via nabs-l
> >>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Being a guide dog user myself, I found the blog offensive and
> >>>>>>> thought of how other guide dog handlers might feel. I didn't want
> >>>>>>> to generalize like the blog seems to do but I felt that if I felt
> >>>>>>> offended by it many other people would have too. I would have
> >>>>>>> appreciated it more if somewhere in the blog post it would have
> >>>>>>> been acknowledged that this was one person's opinion, and not
> >>>>>>> make it seen as if though everyone possessed the same opinion.
> >>>>>>> Being that I am a guide dog user and have been for three years,
> >>>>>>> it has been one of the best experiences of my life. I would never
> >>>>>>> change it for anything, and I don't consider going back to using
> >>>>>>> a cane after I have to retire my dog. Therefore, I highly
> >>>>>>> disagree with the blog post. However, I must reinstate that this
> >>>>>>> is simply my opinion. Juanita
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> On Mar 19, 2015, at 6:28 PM, minh ha via nabs-l
> >>>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> I agree with Aleeha's sentiments one hundred percent. Over
> >>>>>>>> generalization is a huge mistake to do under any circumstances,
> >>>>>>>> and this blog post was offensive to me and other guide dog
> >>>>>>>> handlers on so many levels. If you want to write a fair and
> >>>>>>>> informative blog post about the guide dog lifestyle, then by
> >>>>>>>> all means, point out the negative aspects, but do not
> >>>>>>>> conveniently forget to mention the thousand of other more
> >>>>>>>> positive and beneficial impacts that a guide dog can have on a
> >>>>>>>> person's life. Yes, a guide dog is not the right choice for
> >>>>>>>> everyone and a blind person needs to think long and hard before
> >>>>>>>> getting one, but for the right reasons, a guide dog can
> >>>>>>>> completely turn someone's life around and give them the
> >>>>>>>> confidence in order to live life more productively. Honestly,
> >>>>>>>> your five reasons seem very childish, and i have to wonder if
> >>>>>>>> they are that important to you, then you should be
> >>>>>>>> contemplating about getting another guide dog at all.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Respectfully, Minh and my hard working little guide, Viva
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> On 3/19/15, Aleeha Dudley via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> >>>>>>>>> wrote: Personally, I find your subject line a bit offensive,
> >>>>>>>>> as it assumes that guide dogs are a terrible idea for
> >>>>>>>>> everyone. Being the proud handler of a wonderful dog myself,
> >>>>>>>>> and a quite independent cane traveller before that, I am a
> >>>>>>>>> bit upset as what I find to be a somewhat inflammatory post.
> >>>>>>>>> You are right; guide dogs are not for everyone. They are a
> >>>>>>>>> huge responsibility and need a lot of daily care. But to say
> >>>>>>>>> that there are five reasons why a guide dog is a terrile idea
> >>>>>>>>> seems to be going too far, especially addressing such a
> >>>>>>>>> large body of people such as that on this list. Now, having
> >>>>>>>>> clicked the link and read the blog, I know that you are
> >>>>>>>>> making an attempt to be fair and point out the disadvantages,
> >>>>>>>>> but to not point out that this was a blog post or an opinion
> >>>>>>>>> article, can make some folks pretty mad fairly quickly. Can
> >>>>>>>>> wa choose our words and subject lines a little more wisely
> >>>>>>>>> next time? Aleha and Dallas, Seeing Eye dog extrordinaire
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> On 3/19/15, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote: If
> >>>>>>>>>> you're blind, you obviously read Braille. Your hearing must
> >>>>>>>>>> naturally be superior to your sighted peers, and of course
> >>>>>>>>>> you have a guide dog! Right?
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> Well, that last may not be as pervasive as the first and
> >>>>>>>>>> second. Someone recently told me the number of guide dog
> >>>>>>>>>> users has actually declined in my millennial generation. I
> >>>>>>>>>> have no evidence proving this one way or the other, but for
> >>>>>>>>>> the general public, to see a blind person with a guide dog
> >>>>>>>>>> feels as natural as butter and toast.
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> Thing is, I'm not so sure guide dogs are right for
> >>>>>>>>>> everyone. Or, maybe I'm just projecting my own
> >>>>>>>>>> uncertainties onto the rest of the community?
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> Last November I took the first step in the application
> >>>>>>>>>> process to return for a second Seeing Eye dog. It's been
> >>>>>>>>>> more than three years since I lost Gator, and even though
> >>>>>>>>>> I've gotten around just fine with a white cane, I am
> >>>>>>>>>> approaching what feels like the final years with sight,
> >>>>>>>>>> however minimal that sight might be. I admit it's unnerving
> >>>>>>>>>> if I sit still long enough to contemplate total blindness.
> >>>>>>>>>> NFB philosophy be damned, and the thought of an extra set
> >>>>>>>>>> of eyes to help me navigate the world does bring a measure
> >>>>>>>>>> of comfort. But, is it enough to go get another dog?
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> In no particular order, here are reasons why a guide dog
> >>>>>>>>>> would be a terrible idea:
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> Read more:
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-terrible-idea/
> >>>>> - --
> >>>>>>>>>> Musings of a Work in Progress: www.JoeOrozco.com/
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l
> >>>>>>>>>> mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
> >>>>>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
> >>>>>>>>>> info for nabs-l:
> >>>>>>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com
> >>>>> - --
> >>>>>>>>> Aleeha Dudley and Seeing Eye Yellow Labrador Dallas Vice
> >>>>>>>>> President, Ohio Association of Blind Students Email:
> >>>>>>>>> blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com Follow me on Twitter at
> >>>>>>>>> @blindcowgirl199
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> The wind of heaven is that which blows between a horse's
> >>>>>>>>> ears. - Arabian Proverb
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l
> >>>>>>>>> mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
> >>>>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
> >>>>>>>>> info for nabs-l:
> >>>>>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/minh.ha927%40gmail.com
> >>>>> - --
> >>>>>>>> "All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in
> >>>>>>>> the dusty recesses of their minds, wake in the day to find that
> >>>>>>>> it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men,
> >>>>>>>> for they may act on their dreams with open eyes, to make them
> >>>>>>>> possible." T. E. Lawrence
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing
> >>>>>>>> list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
> >>>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> >>>>>>>> for nabs-l:
> >>>>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/juanitaherrera1991%40gmail.com
> >>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>>>> nabs-l mailing list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
> >>>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> >>>>>>> for nabs-l:
> >>>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindstein%40gmail.com
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ nabs-l mailing
> >>>>>> list nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org To
> >>>>>> unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> >>>>>> nabs-l:
> >>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/tyler%40tysdomain.com
> >>>>> - --
> >>>>> Take care,
> >>>>> Ty
> >>>>> twitter: @sorressean
> >>>>> web:http://tysdomain.com
> >>>>> pubkey: http://tysdomain.com/files/pubkey.asc
> >>>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> >>>>> Version: GnuPG v2
> >>>>>
> >>>>> iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJVC5FkAAoJEAdP60+BYxejeg8H/jgEQxColgCWyB7SJTK/Wspj
> >>>>> 1Jb8iqe+VvmabPVgm7ZyAK3ZqO6hEM9HJ77O40xYldj02dwQnAF49s62oIx+H3Dg
> >>>>> Xmnm3uO8LDlh5UmA9YI7u3gWKRCXWYmZA0QWIZkrw38Ack8nfZWft5GTIdUBXM7U
> >>>>> iXTqhKAm/zV3Xe0O/rMbnsiY1DJZebDy97vm+7vxHESjrIfrpoyXwY2VF9oG96c3
> >>>>> zvgte305wLQqJIj6gvABh4Up7b7eqP4Bn/HpXmbV5ojfSiT6XcTk+YV+B5uYvPa4
> >>>>> 6R1Q40f7q0rRvELc+M9lx3W8R8sjGf9X1qPTEgNy6d9j5CETmgyE0d4gBrMbJBo=
> >>>>> =IjVb
> >>>>> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
> >>>>>
> >>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>> nabs-l mailing list
> >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> >>>>> nabs-l:
> >>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith319%40gmail.com
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> nabs-l mailing list
> >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> >>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindstein%40gmail.com
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> nabs-l mailing list
> >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> >>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi%40samobile.net
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> nabs-l mailing list
> >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> >>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com
> >
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/mausbun%40unr.edu
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jim.hulme%40gmail.com
>

From kmaent1 at gmail.com  Mon Mar 23 22:17:34 2015
From: kmaent1 at gmail.com (Karl Martin Adam)
Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2015 18:17:34 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] 5 Reasons Why Guide Dogs Are a Terrible Idea!
Message-ID: <551090ff.637a320a.67ef.ffffec0d@mx.google.com>

Yes,=20this=20happened,=20and=20rightly=20so.=20=20The=20government=20of=20=
Hawaii=20is=20
trying=20to=20protect=20their=20environment=20from=20invasive=20species=20
including=20parasites=20found=20on=20dogs,=20so=20they=20require=20quaranti=
ne=20for=20
animals=20being=20brought=20into=20the=20state.

=20-----=20Original=20Message=20-----
From:=20James=20Hulme=20via=20nabs-l=20<nabs-l at nfbnet.org
To:=20Michael=20D=20Ausbun=20<mausbun at unr.edu>,=20National=20Association=20=
of=20
Blind=20Students=20mailing=20list=20
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>,jsoro620 at gmail.com
Date=20sent:=20Mon,=2023=20Mar=202015=2017:56:45=20-0400
Subject:=20Re:=20[nabs-l]=205=20Reasons=20Why=20Guide=20Dogs=20Are=20a=20Te=
rrible=20
Idea!

As=20far=20as=20I=20know.=20Someone=20with=20a=20guide=20dog=20could=20not=
=20visit=20their=20
relativs
in=20Hawaii=20by=20going=20on=20a=20plane=20with=20a=20guide=20dog.=20The=20=
person=20was=20
traveling
from=20California=20to=20Hawaii.=20If=20anyone=20finds=20this=20news=20stor=
y=20please=20
fwd.=20me
the=20link=20off-list=20at=20jim.hulme at gmail.com



Also,=20Dusty's=20law=20was=20appealed=20by=20the=20state=20of=20Arizona.=20=
I=20do=20not=20
even=20have
a=20guide=20dog=20but=20I=20follow=20the=20national=20and=20NJ=20news=20oft=
en.


Perhaps=20you=20can=20find=20this=20as=20interesting=20information=20and=20=
shed=20
some=20light=20on
your=20thoughts.

Please=20correct=20me=20if=20I=20am=20wrong.


Jimmy=20Hulme
jim.hulme at gmail.com




On=20Mon,=20Mar=2023,=202015=20at=202:49=20PM,=20Michael=20D=20Ausbun=20via=
=20nabs-l=20<
nabs-l at nfbnet.org>=20wrote:

=20Both=20the=20author,=20and=20a=20few=20of=20the=20responders,=20have=20o=
utlined=20that=20
the
=20headline=20is=20indicative=20of=20the=20articles=20content.=20That=20is,=
=20the=20
blog=20post
=20outlines=20precisely=20what=20the=20title=20says.=20Moreover,=20the=20fi=
rst=20rule=20
of
=20successful=20marketing,=20of=20any=20sort,=20is=20to=20shock=20ones=20au=
dience.=20
Thus,=20in=20a
=20situation=20where=20likely=20greater=20than=20fifty=20percent=20of=20the=
=20
audience=20are=20guide
=20dog=20users,=20an=20individual=20ought=20to=20isolate=20the=20negative=20=
aspects,=20
when
=20marketing.=20It=20causes=20guide=20dog=20users=20to=20say,=20=E2=80=9CWa=
it=20what!=E2=80=9D=20
then=20they=20read
=20the=20article,=20and=20often,=20act=20out=20in=20the=20way=20they=20did.=
=20Those=20who=20
act=20out
=20cause=20more=20people=20to=20wonder=20what=20is=20occurring,=20which=20c=
auses=20them=20
to=20look=20at
=20it,=20and=20if=20they=20don=E2=80=99t=20act=20the=20way=20the=20previous=
=20people=20did,=20
then=20the=20author
=20is=20vindicated.=20In=20this=20instance,=20provocative=20rhetoric=20trum=
ps=20
insecurities,
=20which=20probably=20should=20not=20even=20exist.

=20Just=20a=20little=20side=20note,=20as=20well,=20the=20author=20has=20pos=
ted=20things=20
from=20his
=20blog=20before.=20In=20conjunction=20with=20it=20being=20a=20blog,=20shou=
ld=20have=20
been
=20reasonable=20justification=20for=20knowing=20that=20it=20was=20an=20opin=
ion=20
piece.

=20________________________________________
=20From:=20nabs-l=20[nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org]=20on=20behalf=20of=20Jedi=20=

Moerke=20via
=20nabs-l=20[nabs-l at nfbnet.org]
=20Sent:=20Sunday,=20March=2022,=202015=205:03=20PM
=20To:=20National=20Association=20of=20Blind=20Students=20mailing=20list
=20Subject:=20Re:=20[nabs-l]=205=20Reasons=20Why=20Guide=20Dogs=20Are=20a=20=
Terrible=20
Idea!

=20It's=20not.=20I=20just=20don't=20understand=20why=20someone=20would=20kn=
owingly=20
use=20a
=20headline=20like=20that=20in=20a=20community=20where=20some=20folks=20cou=
ld=20
reasonably=20be
=20offended.

=20Sent=20from=20my=20iPhone

=20On=20Mar=2022,=202015,=20at=206:51=20PM,=20Jamie=20Principato=20
<blackbyrdfly at gmail.com
=20wrote:

=20Why=20is=20guide=20dog=20use=20a=20topic=20calling=20for=20a=20special=20=
level=20of=20
sensitivity?
=20Sensitivity=20to=20what?=20It's=20a=20choice=20just=20like=20cane=20use=
=20is.

=20Sent=20from=20my=20iPhone

=20On=20Mar=2022,=202015,=20at=205:47=20PM,=20Jedi=20Moerke=20via=20nabs-l=
=20
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org
=20wrote:

=20There=20is=20something=20to=20be=20said=20for=20using=20a=20vocative=20h=
eadlines,=20
but=20there
=20is=20also=20something=20to=20be=20said=20for=20cultural=20awareness=20an=
d=20
sensitivity.

=20Sent=20from=20my=20iPhone

=20On=20Mar=2020,=202015,=20at=202:16=20AM,=20Justin=20Harford=20via=20nabs=
-l=20<
=20nabs-l at nfbnet.org>=20wrote:

=20I=20agree.



=20On=20Mar=2019,=202015,=20at=208:41=20PM,=20Brice=20Smith=20via=20nabs-l=
=20<
=20nabs-l at nfbnet.org>=20wrote:

=20Did=20those=20of=20you=20who=20feel=20offended=20actually=20read=20the=20=
blog,
=20particularly=20the=20explanations=20under=20the=20heading,=20"Damn!=20An=
y=20
Words=20of
=20Encouragement?"

=20The=20subject=20line=20is=20purposely=20and=20brilliantly=20provocative-=
-the=20
kind
=20that=20gathers=20almost=20a=20dozen=20responses=20in=20just=20a=20couple=
=20of=20hours.=20
Joe
=20clearly=20understands=20how=20to=20use=20rhetoric=20to=20make=20a=20comp=
elling=20
argument,
=20and=20some=20of=20the=20knee-jerk=20reactions=20on=20this=20list=20to=20=
this=20post=20
were
=20disappointing.


=20Brice



=20On=203/19/15,=20Littlefield,=20Tyler=20via=20nabs-l=20<nabs-l at nfbnet.org=
>=20
wrote:
=20-----BEGIN=20PGP=20SIGNED=20MESSAGE-----
=20Hash:=20SHA1

=20Positives?=20You=20can=20summarize=20this=20up=20in=205=20really=20fast=
=20points.=20I=20
seen
=20no=20positives=20and=20really,=20the=20negatives=20aren't=20huge=20drawb=
acks=20
that
=20were
=20listed.
=20I=20mean,=20if=20you=20want=20to=20tell=20people=20not=20to=20get=20a=20=
dog,=20you=20surely=20
can
=20do
=20better=20than=20that.

=20But=20I'll=20address=20each=20of=20these=20points=20in=20turn.
=201.=20It's=20expensive!
=20It=20can=20be,=20yes.=20There=20are=20programs=20like=20GDB=20offers=20t=
o=20help=20with=20
vet
=20bills,=20so=20the=20food=20and=20grooming=20are=20really=20all=20I=20hav=
e=20to=20pay=20
for.
=20That
=20and=20toys,=20which=20we=20probably=20spend=20way=20to=20much=20money=20=
on.=20More=20
money
=20than=20I=20would=20usually=20spend?=20Certainly,=20but=20it's=20nowhere=
=20near=20a=20
lot
=20(and=20I'm=20a=20student=20living=20on=20a=20budget).=20It's=20also=20we=
ll=20worth=20the
=20money.

=202.=20It's=20inconvenient!
=20Yes,=20taking=20your=20dog=20out=20must=20be=20such=20hard=20work.=20Wai=
t,=20I=20do=20it=20
every
=20day,=20what=20am=20i=20talking=20about?=20It's=20not=20fun=20when=20you'=
re=20sick=20and=20
yes,
=20finding=20a=20trash=20can=20be=20kind=20of=20tough.=20That's=20why=20O'M=
ally=20and=20
Minh's
=20viva=20know=20"find=20the=20trash."=20That's=20also=20when=20social=20sk=
ills=20come=20
into
=20play.=20"Excuse=20me=20mam,=20do=20you=20see=20a=20trashcan=20nearby?"=20=
Works=20every
=20time.
=20If=20you're=20at=20an=20unfamiliar=20hotel,=20you=20just=20ask=20at=20th=
e=20front=20desk=20
and
=20they're=20usually=20pretty=20cool=20about=20it.=20Airports=20also=20have=
=20
relieving
=20areas.=20Unless=20you=20travel=20twice=20a=20week,=20a=20couple=20hours=
=20of=20
slightly
=20less
=20leg=20room=20(and=20I'm=20fairly=20tall)=20is=20really=20not=20that=20bi=
g=20of=20a=20deal.

=203.=20It's=20time-consuming!
=20Yes,=20having=20a=20dog=20does=20take=20time.=20You'd=20think=20this=20w=
ould=20be
=20inherently
=20obvious,=20but=20it=20was=20needed=20to=20be=20pointed=20out=20here.=20Y=
ou=20don't=20
need=20to
=20go=20for=2012=20mile=20runs,=20O'mally=20and=20I=20have=20left=20today=20=
to=20relieve=20
and
=20that
=20was=20pretty=20much=20it.=20I=20played=20with=20him=20and=20listened=20t=
o=20a=20book=20and=20
sat
=20with=20him=20on=20the=20floor=20for=20a=20bit.=20He's=20totally=20happy=
=20and=20hasn't
=20demolished=20anything.

=204.=20It's=20unwelcomed=20attention!
=20I=20find=20it=20kind=20of=20funny=20you're=20talking=20about=20being=20c=
overt=20and=20
not
=20making=20a=20name=20for=20yourself=20with=20complaints=20when=20the=20NF=
B=20files=20
more
=20lawsuits=20than=20I=20can=20keep=20up=20with.=20But=20beyond=20that,=20I=
've=20never=20
been
=20turned=20down=20from=20eating=20because=20I=20have=20a=20dog.=20Cabs,=20=
certainly;=20
we=20all
=20have.=20If=20an=20establishment=20turns=20me=20down,=20I'll=20make=20sur=
e=20that=20
people
=20know=20they=20did=20it=20and=20they're=20not=20treating=20me=20equally.=
=20Just=20
because
=20I'm
=20blind=20doesn't=20mean=20I=20should=20sit=20in=20the=20corner=20and=20ho=
pe=20that=20
things
=20get
=20better;=20I=20want=20to=20educate=20people.=20I've=20had=20a=20lot=20of=
=20really=20
amazing
=20people=20come=20up=20and=20talk=20to=20me=20and=20ask=20questions=20abou=
t=20my=20guide.=20
It
=20certainly=20does=20get=20a=20bit=20trying=20at=20times,=20but=20in=20no=
=20way=20is=20it=20a=20
huge
=20problem.=20I=20am=20sorry=20however=20if=20you're=20not=20the=20center=20=
of=20the=20
topics
=20and
=20people=20do=20ask=20about=20your=20dog.=20It=20happens.

=205.=20It=20can=20be=20dirty=20work!
=20Best=20not=20ever=20get=20sick=20by=20yourself=20then,=20or=20have=20kid=
s,=20or=20
anything
=20else.=20Yes,=20it=20can=20be=20tough.=20If=20you're=20squeamish=20maybe=
=20it's=20not=20
for
=20you.=20Cleaning=20up=20doggy=20vomit=20really=20isn't=20the=20best=20par=
t=20of=20my=20
day,
=20but
=20you=20do=20it.=20mostly=20because=20these=20dogs=20do=20so=20much=20for=
=20you=20and=20if
=20O'mally
=20is=20sick=20I'm=20worried=20about=20him=20and=20just=20want=20him=20to=20=
get=20better.=20
You=20do
=20it=20because=20you=20love=20your=20dog.

=20"If=20you=20were=20contemplating=20a=20dog,=20came=20across=20this=20pos=
t=20and=20felt
=20discouraged,=20you=20should=20not=20get=20a=20dog.=20It's=20a=20lot=20of=
=20work.=20It's=20
a=20lot
=20of=20responsibility.
=20It's=20constant=20care=20and=20attention=20and=20a=20commitment=20to=20k=
eep=20up=20the
=20dog's
=20level=20of=20training.=20No=20one=20will=20fault=20you=20for=20being=20m=
ature=20enough=20
to
=20walk=20away."

=20So=20let=20me=20sum=20this=20up:=20expensive;=20inconvenient;=20time-con=
suming;
=20unwelcome=20attention;=20messy=20work.=20Yeah,=20I'd=20say=20you=20proba=
bly=20
shouldn't
=20have=20a=20dog.=20Please=20though,=20do=20try=20to=20at=20least=20provid=
e=20
constructive
=20and
=20good=20information=20on=20both=20sides=20of=20this=20issue.=20The=20issu=
es=20you=20
raised
=20were=20incredibly=20self-centered,=20rude,=20generalizing=20and=20really=
=20
didn't
=20convey=20any=20issues=20beyond=20negative=20criticism.

=20My=20guide=20does=20amazing=20work=20each=20and=20every=20day.=20when=20=
I=20pick=20up=20
his
=20harness,=20he's=20by=20my=20side,=20tail=20wagging=20ready=20to=20work=20=
for=20me.=20He=20
only
=20asks=20that=20I=20give=20him=20love,=20attention=20and=20take=20care=20o=
f=20him=20with=20
vet
=20visits,=20grooming=20and=20toys.=20Given=20the=20amount=20of=20travel=20=
that=20he=20
has
=20enabled=20me=20to=20do=20(I=20am=20and=20was=20proficient=20with=20a=20c=
ane),=20I=20think=20
it
=20only=20fitting=20that=20I=20pay=20for=20his=20food,=20give=20him=20atten=
tion,=20clean=20
up
=20after=20him=20when=20he's=20sick=20and=20treat=20him=20well.=20My=20guid=
e=20loves=20me,=20
no
=20questions=20asked.=20while=20I=20somewhat=20understand=20these=20points,=
=20I=20
think
=20anyone=20who=20has=20actually=20had=20a=20guide=20would=20really=20agree=
=20that=20they=20
are
=20huge=20issues=20that=20should=20prevent=20you=20from=20getting=20one.

=20At=20first,=20this=20looked=20like=20a=20trolling=20post;=20it=20still=20=
feels=20like=20
a
=20trolling=20post.

=20Be=20well,
=20Ty
=20On=203/19/2015=2010:20=20PM,=20Justin=20Harford=20via=20nabs-l=20wrote:
=20At=20first,=20this=20looked=20like=20a=20trolling=20post,=20but=20after=
=20I=20actually
=20read=20the=20article,=20I=20=20enjoyed=20it.

=20It=20is=20a=20very=20frank=20and=20honest=20examination=20of=20the=20pos=
itives=20and
=20negatives=20of=20one=20individual's=20experience=20with=20a=20guide=20do=
g,=20and
=20clearly=20reads=20as=20the=20opinion=20of=20one=20person.

=20Regards=20Justin



=20On=20Mar=2019,=202015,=20at=206:52=20PM,=20Juanita=20Herrera=20via=20nab=
s-l
=20<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>=20wrote:

=20Being=20a=20guide=20dog=20user=20myself,=20I=20found=20the=20blog=20offe=
nsive=20and
=20thought=20of=20how=20other=20guide=20dog=20handlers=20might=20feel.=20I=
=20didn't=20
want
=20to=20generalize=20like=20the=20blog=20seems=20to=20do=20but=20I=20felt=20=
that=20if=20I=20
felt
=20offended=20by=20it=20many=20other=20people=20would=20have=20too.=20I=20w=
ould=20have
=20appreciated=20it=20more=20if=20somewhere=20in=20the=20blog=20post=20it=20=
would=20have
=20been=20acknowledged=20that=20this=20was=20one=20person's=20opinion,=20an=
d=20not
=20make=20it=20seen=20as=20if=20though=20everyone=20possessed=20the=20same=
=20opinion.
=20Being=20that=20I=20am=20a=20guide=20dog=20user=20and=20have=20been=20for=
=20three=20years,
=20it=20has=20been=20one=20of=20the=20best=20experiences=20of=20my=20life.=
=20I=20would=20
never
=20change=20it=20for=20anything,=20and=20I=20don't=20consider=20going=20bac=
k=20to=20using
=20a=20cane=20after=20I=20have=20to=20retire=20my=20dog.=20Therefore,=20I=20=
highly
=20disagree=20with=20the=20blog=20post.=20However,=20I=20must=20reinstate=20=
that=20this
=20is=20simply=20my=20opinion.=20Juanita

=20On=20Mar=2019,=202015,=20at=206:28=20PM,=20minh=20ha=20via=20nabs-l
=20<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>=20wrote:

=20I=20agree=20with=20Aleeha's=20sentiments=20one=20hundred=20percent.=20Ov=
er
=20generalization=20is=20a=20huge=20mistake=20to=20do=20under=20any=20circu=
mstances,
=20and=20this=20blog=20post=20was=20offensive=20to=20me=20and=20other=20gui=
de=20dog
=20handlers=20on=20so=20many=20levels.=20If=20you=20want=20to=20write=20a=20=
fair=20and
=20informative=20blog=20post=20about=20the=20guide=20dog=20lifestyle,=20the=
n=20by
=20all=20means,=20point=20out=20the=20negative=20aspects,=20but=20do=20not
=20conveniently=20forget=20to=20mention=20the=20thousand=20of=20other=20mor=
e
=20positive=20and=20beneficial=20impacts=20that=20a=20guide=20dog=20can=20h=
ave=20on=20a
=20person's=20life.=20Yes,=20a=20guide=20dog=20is=20not=20the=20right=20cho=
ice=20for
=20everyone=20and=20a=20blind=20person=20needs=20to=20think=20long=20and=20=
hard=20before
=20getting=20one,=20but=20for=20the=20right=20reasons,=20a=20guide=20dog=20=
can
=20completely=20turn=20someone's=20life=20around=20and=20give=20them=20the
=20confidence=20in=20order=20to=20live=20life=20more=20productively.=20Hone=
stly,
=20your=20five=20reasons=20seem=20very=20childish,=20and=20i=20have=20to=20=
wonder=20if
=20they=20are=20that=20important=20to=20you,=20then=20you=20should=20be
=20contemplating=20about=20getting=20another=20guide=20dog=20at=20all.

=20Respectfully,=20Minh=20and=20my=20hard=20working=20little=20guide,=20Viv=
a

=20On=203/19/15,=20Aleeha=20Dudley=20via=20nabs-l=20<nabs-l at nfbnet.org
=20wrote:=20Personally,=20I=20find=20your=20subject=20line=20a=20bit=20offe=
nsive,
=20as=20it=20assumes=20that=20guide=20dogs=20are=20a=20terrible=20idea=20fo=
r
=20everyone.=20Being=20the=20proud=20handler=20of=20a=20wonderful=20dog=20m=
yself,
=20and=20a=20quite=20independent=20cane=20traveller=20before=20that,=20I=20=
am=20a
=20bit=20upset=20as=20what=20I=20find=20to=20be=20a=20somewhat=20inflammato=
ry=20post.
=20You=20are=20right;=20guide=20dogs=20are=20not=20for=20everyone.=20They=20=
are=20a
=20huge=20responsibility=20and=20need=20a=20lot=20of=20daily=20care.=20But=
=20to=20say
=20that=20there=20are=20five=20reasons=20why=20a=20guide=20dog=20is=20a=20t=
errile=20idea
=20seems=20to=20be=20going=20too=20far,=20especially=20addressing=20such=20=
a
=20large=20body=20of=20people=20such=20as=20that=20on=20this=20list.=20Now,=
=20having
=20clicked=20the=20link=20and=20read=20the=20blog,=20I=20know=20that=20you=
=20are
=20making=20an=20attempt=20to=20be=20fair=20and=20point=20out=20the=20disad=
vantages,
=20but=20to=20not=20point=20out=20that=20this=20was=20a=20blog=20post=20or=
=20an=20opinion
=20article,=20can=20make=20some=20folks=20pretty=20mad=20fairly=20quickly.=
=20Can
=20wa=20choose=20our=20words=20and=20subject=20lines=20a=20little=20more=20=
wisely
=20next=20time?=20Aleha=20and=20Dallas,=20Seeing=20Eye=20dog=20extrordinair=
e

=20On=203/19/15,=20Joe=20via=20nabs-l=20<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>=20wrote:=20If
=20you're=20blind,=20you=20obviously=20read=20Braille.=20Your=20hearing=20m=
ust
=20naturally=20be=20superior=20to=20your=20sighted=20peers,=20and=20of=20co=
urse
=20you=20have=20a=20guide=20dog!=20Right?

=20Well,=20that=20last=20may=20not=20be=20as=20pervasive=20as=20the=20first=
=20and
=20second.=20Someone=20recently=20told=20me=20the=20number=20of=20guide=20d=
og
=20users=20has=20actually=20declined=20in=20my=20millennial=20generation.=20=
I
=20have=20no=20evidence=20proving=20this=20one=20way=20or=20the=20other,=20=
but=20for
=20the=20general=20public,=20to=20see=20a=20blind=20person=20with=20a=20gui=
de=20dog
=20feels=20as=20natural=20as=20butter=20and=20toast.

=20Thing=20is,=20I'm=20not=20so=20sure=20guide=20dogs=20are=20right=20for
=20everyone.=20Or,=20maybe=20I'm=20just=20projecting=20my=20own
=20uncertainties=20onto=20the=20rest=20of=20the=20community?

=20Last=20November=20I=20took=20the=20first=20step=20in=20the=20application=

=20process=20to=20return=20for=20a=20second=20Seeing=20Eye=20dog.=20It's=20=
been
=20more=20than=20three=20years=20since=20I=20lost=20Gator,=20and=20even=20t=
hough
=20I've=20gotten=20around=20just=20fine=20with=20a=20white=20cane,=20I=20am=

=20approaching=20what=20feels=20like=20the=20final=20years=20with=20sight,
=20however=20minimal=20that=20sight=20might=20be.=20I=20admit=20it's=20unne=
rving
=20if=20I=20sit=20still=20long=20enough=20to=20contemplate=20total=20blindn=
ess.
=20NFB=20philosophy=20be=20damned,=20and=20the=20thought=20of=20an=20extra=
=20set
=20of=20eyes=20to=20help=20me=20navigate=20the=20world=20does=20bring=20a=20=
measure
=20of=20comfort.=20But,=20is=20it=20enough=20to=20go=20get=20another=20dog?=


=20In=20no=20particular=20order,=20here=20are=20reasons=20why=20a=20guide=20=
dog
=20would=20be=20a=20terrible=20idea:

=20Read=20more:


=20
http://serotalk.com/2015/03/18/5-reasons-why-guide-dogs-are-a-ter
rible-idea/
=20-=20--
=20Musings=20of=20a=20Work=20in=20Progress:=20www.JoeOrozco.com/

=20Twitter:=20 at ScribblingJoe




=20_______________________________________________=20nabs-l
=20mailing=20list=20nabs-l at nfbnet.org
=20http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org=20To
=20unsubscribe,=20change=20your=20list=20options=20or=20get=20your=20accoun=
t
=20info=20for=20nabs-l:

=20
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1
993%40gmail.com
=20-=20--
=20Aleeha=20Dudley=20and=20Seeing=20Eye=20Yellow=20Labrador=20Dallas=20Vice=

=20President,=20Ohio=20Association=20of=20Blind=20Students=20Email:
=20blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com=20Follow=20me=20on=20Twitter=20at
=20 at blindcowgirl199

=20The=20wind=20of=20heaven=20is=20that=20which=20blows=20between=20a=20hor=
se's
=20ears.=20-=20Arabian=20Proverb

=20_______________________________________________=20nabs-l
=20mailing=20list=20nabs-l at nfbnet.org
=20http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org=20To
=20unsubscribe,=20change=20your=20list=20options=20or=20get=20your=20accoun=
t
=20info=20for=20nabs-l:

=20
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/minh.ha927%40
gmail.com
=20-=20--
=20"All=20men=20dream,=20but=20not=20equally.=20Those=20who=20dream=20by=20=
night=20in
=20the=20dusty=20recesses=20of=20their=20minds,=20wake=20in=20the=20day=20t=
o=20find=20that
=20it=20was=20vanity:=20but=20the=20dreamers=20of=20the=20day=20are=20dange=
rous=20men,
=20for=20they=20may=20act=20on=20their=20dreams=20with=20open=20eyes,=20to=
=20make=20them
=20possible."=20T.=20E.=20Lawrence

=20_______________________________________________=20nabs-l=20mailing
=20list=20nabs-l at nfbnet.org
=20http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org=20To
=20unsubscribe,=20change=20your=20list=20options=20or=20get=20your=20accoun=
t=20info
=20for=20nabs-l:

=20
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/juanitaherrer
a1991%40gmail.com
=20_______________________________________________
=20nabs-l=20mailing=20list=20nabs-l at nfbnet.org
=20http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org=20To
=20unsubscribe,=20change=20your=20list=20options=20or=20get=20your=20accoun=
t=20info
=20for=20nabs-l:

=20
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindstein%40
gmail.com

=20_______________________________________________=20nabs-l=20mailing
=20list=20nabs-l at nfbnet.org
=20http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org=20To
=20unsubscribe,=20change=20your=20list=20options=20or=20get=20your=20accoun=
t=20info=20
for
=20nabs-l:

=20
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/tyler%40tysdo
main.com
=20-=20--
=20Take=20care,
=20Ty
=20twitter:=20 at sorressean
=20web:http://tysdomain.com
=20pubkey:=20http://tysdomain.com/files/pubkey.asc
=20-----BEGIN=20PGP=20SIGNATURE-----
=20Version:=20GnuPG=20v2

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=201Jb8iqe+VvmabPVgm7ZyAK3ZqO6hEM9HJ77O40xYldj02dwQnAF49s62oIx+H3Dg
=20Xmnm3uO8LDlh5UmA9YI7u3gWKRCXWYmZA0QWIZkrw38Ack8nfZWft5GTIdUBXM7U
=20iXTqhKAm/zV3Xe0O/rMbnsiY1DJZebDy97vm+7vxHESjrIfrpoyXwY2VF9oG96c3
=20zvgte305wLQqJIj6gvABh4Up7b7eqP4Bn/HpXmbV5ojfSiT6XcTk+YV+B5uYvPa4
=206R1Q40f7q0rRvELc+M9lx3W8R8sjGf9X1qPTEgNy6d9j5CETmgyE0d4gBrMbJBo=3D
=20=3DIjVb
=20-----END=20PGP=20SIGNATURE-----

=20_______________________________________________
=20nabs-l=20mailing=20list
=20nabs-l at nfbnet.org
=20http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
=20To=20unsubscribe,=20change=20your=20list=20options=20or=20get=20your=20a=
ccount=20
info=20for
=20nabs-l:

=20
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brice.smith31
9%40gmail.com

=20_______________________________________________
=20nabs-l=20mailing=20list
=20nabs-l at nfbnet.org
=20http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
=20To=20unsubscribe,=20change=20your=20list=20options=20or=20get=20your=20a=
ccount=20
info=20for
=20nabs-l:

=20
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindstein%40
gmail.com

=20_______________________________________________
=20nabs-l=20mailing=20list
=20nabs-l at nfbnet.org
=20http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
=20To=20unsubscribe,=20change=20your=20list=20options=20or=20get=20your=20a=
ccount=20
info=20for
=20nabs-l:

=20
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblindjedi
%40samobile.net


=20_______________________________________________
=20nabs-l=20mailing=20list
=20nabs-l at nfbnet.org
=20http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
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ccount=20
info=20for
=20nabs-l:

=20
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40gmail.com



=20_______________________________________________
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=20_______________________________________________
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To=20unsubscribe,=20change=20your=20list=20options=20or=20get=20your=20acco=
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il.com



From jsoro620 at gmail.com  Mon Mar 23 22:49:55 2015
From: jsoro620 at gmail.com (Joe)
Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2015 18:49:55 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Downgrading Microsoft word
In-Reply-To: <B3D6820F-43F9-432B-88E0-7ADB6651844D@gmail.com>
References: <B3D6820F-43F9-432B-88E0-7ADB6651844D@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <010c01d065bb$af75b140$0e6113c0$@gmail.com>

Hi, what are you having difficulty doing with formatting? I think all
versions of Word have their own quirks about formatting with a fair amount
of accuracy using a screen reader. What version of Word are you on, and what
version are you thinking about downgrading to?

--
Musings of a Work in Progress:
www.JoeOrozco.com/

Twitter: @ScribblingJoe


-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Amanda via
nabs-l
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2015 12:29 PM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: [nabs-l] Downgrading Microsoft word

Hi fellow students,
Is there a way to downgrade my version of word so that it's more accessible
with Jaws as far as formatting documents without so much sighted assistance?

Amanda
_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com



From rbacchus228 at gmail.com  Tue Mar 24 00:55:57 2015
From: rbacchus228 at gmail.com (Roanna Bacchus)
Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2015 20:55:57 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] When A Personal Choice Becomes Personal.
Message-ID: <5510b624.a61a370a.7ad9.ffffa72f@mx.google.com>

Hi Darian this is an interesting post.  For me it is my personal 
peference to use a cane.  I preier not to travel under 
sleepshades because Ih ne" traveled with them before.  For me 
personal choice becomes personal preference when I have done the 
choice for a long time.


From gloria.graves at gmail.com  Tue Mar 24 02:16:08 2015
From: gloria.graves at gmail.com (Gloria Graves)
Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2015 21:16:08 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Downgrading Microsoft word
In-Reply-To: <010c01d065bb$af75b140$0e6113c0$@gmail.com>
References: <B3D6820F-43F9-432B-88E0-7ADB6651844D@gmail.com>
	<010c01d065bb$af75b140$0e6113c0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BEF17987-D522-4799-BE5F-CAB6EEAB09C6@gmail.com>

Hi, do you have a number that I can call and ask these questions?



> On Mar 23, 2015, at 5:49 PM, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi, what are you having difficulty doing with formatting? I think all
> versions of Word have their own quirks about formatting with a fair amount
> of accuracy using a screen reader. What version of Word are you on, and what
> version are you thinking about downgrading to?
> 
> --
> Musings of a Work in Progress:
> www.JoeOrozco.com/
> 
> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Amanda via
> nabs-l
> Sent: Monday, March 23, 2015 12:29 PM
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: [nabs-l] Downgrading Microsoft word
> 
> Hi fellow students,
> Is there a way to downgrade my version of word so that it's more accessible
> with Jaws as far as formatting documents without so much sighted assistance?
> 
> Amanda
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gmail.com


From jj at bestmidi.com  Tue Mar 24 04:00:44 2015
From: jj at bestmidi.com (J.J. Meddaugh)
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2015 00:00:44 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] survey monkey accessibility questions
In-Reply-To: <CAPbc4TcGroj7gGaQAf6nadQczD4fTt8Bc3qc=b0DfZ_fPiPaKw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAPbc4TcGroj7gGaQAf6nadQczD4fTt8Bc3qc=b0DfZ_fPiPaKw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5510E16C.5010204@bestmidi.com>

Jeff,
You might look at Google Forms as an alternative. They've done a lot of 
accessibility with this product and the forms it creates are accessible 
as well.

Best regards,
J.J.

On 3/19/2015 6:19 PM, Jeff Crouch- k8tvv via nabs-l wrote:
> Hi
> I am trying to create a survey for my school to get some information
> about our prom that were having. I am having trouble creating the
> survey.
> If anyone could help or give me some tips, I would appreciate it.
>
> thanks
>



From clb5590 at gmail.com  Tue Mar 24 04:29:57 2015
From: clb5590 at gmail.com (Cindy Bennett)
Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2015 21:29:57 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] survey monkey accessibility questions
In-Reply-To: <5510E16C.5010204@bestmidi.com>
References: <CAPbc4TcGroj7gGaQAf6nadQczD4fTt8Bc3qc=b0DfZ_fPiPaKw@mail.gmail.com>
	<5510E16C.5010204@bestmidi.com>
Message-ID: <CACUFQdy1qNzinLbVfeJ9=dAhKdjg_UPBUJfo-Wqv+tRuSG=_tg@mail.gmail.com>

I second Google Forms. If your survey is relatively simple, in other
words, if you don't need to randomize participants into conditions,
Google forms is great. Also, once you launch the survey, go to the
file menu with shift-alt-f and download a csv with the results
up-to-date any time!

Other than randomization, my other annoyance with Google forms is that
you can't specify (at least to my knowledge), numeric values for each
answer choice. Let's say you want to create a scale with 1, strongly
disagree to 5, strongly agree. You probably want to include on the
survey what each number means in case a participant forgets, but when
I download the csv, I would much prefer the cells just have the
numbers 1-5 so I don't have to replace each cell with the number
equivalent.

Anyway, like I said, Forms is great if you have a relatively simple
survey or if your sample size is small enough that replacing
information isn't a big deal.

Cindy

On 3/23/15, J.J. Meddaugh via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Jeff,
> You might look at Google Forms as an alternative. They've done a lot of
> accessibility with this product and the forms it creates are accessible
> as well.
>
> Best regards,
> J.J.
>
> On 3/19/2015 6:19 PM, Jeff Crouch- k8tvv via nabs-l wrote:
>> Hi
>> I am trying to create a survey for my school to get some information
>> about our prom that were having. I am having trouble creating the
>> survey.
>> If anyone could help or give me some tips, I would appreciate it.
>>
>> thanks
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/clb5590%40gmail.com
>


-- 
Cindy Bennett
1st Year Ph.D. Student, University of Washington
Human Centered Design and Engineering

Treasurer of the National Federation of the Blind of Washington
an Affiliate of the National Federation of the Blind

clb5590 at gmail.com


From cape.amanda at gmail.com  Tue Mar 24 08:48:42 2015
From: cape.amanda at gmail.com (cape.amanda at gmail.com)
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2015 04:48:42 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Downgrading Microsoft word
In-Reply-To: <010c01d065bb$af75b140$0e6113c0$@gmail.com>
References: <B3D6820F-43F9-432B-88E0-7ADB6651844D@gmail.com>
	<010c01d065bb$af75b140$0e6113c0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <A276734D-0F3C-4ABF-BED7-AC9F10FBA930@gmail.com>

I have word 2007 right now and can't figure out why sometimes my font changes on its own or how to double space a document when writing.
Thanks,

Amanda

> On Mar 23, 2015, at 6:49 PM, Joe <jsoro620 at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Hi, what are you having difficulty doing with formatting? I think all
> versions of Word have their own quirks about formatting with a fair amount
> of accuracy using a screen reader. What version of Word are you on, and what
> version are you thinking about downgrading to?
> 
> --
> Musings of a Work in Progress:
> www.JoeOrozco.com/
> 
> Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Amanda via
> nabs-l
> Sent: Monday, March 23, 2015 12:29 PM
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: [nabs-l] Downgrading Microsoft word
> 
> Hi fellow students,
> Is there a way to downgrade my version of word so that it's more accessible
> with Jaws as far as formatting documents without so much sighted assistance?
> 
> Amanda
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com
> 


From kolby12091988 at gmail.com  Tue Mar 24 11:17:28 2015
From: kolby12091988 at gmail.com (Kolby Garrison)
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2015 07:17:28 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Downgrading Microsoft word
In-Reply-To: <A276734D-0F3C-4ABF-BED7-AC9F10FBA930@gmail.com>
References: <B3D6820F-43F9-432B-88E0-7ADB6651844D@gmail.com>	<010c01d065bb$af75b140$0e6113c0$@gmail.com>
	<A276734D-0F3C-4ABF-BED7-AC9F10FBA930@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <00c801d06624$1daedfc0$590c9f40$@gmail.com>

Hello Amanda,
To double space a document, follow these steps:
1. Press control plus home to navigate to the top of the document.
2. Press control plus A to highlight the entire document.
3. Press control plus two on the number row to double space the entire
document.
4. Press control plus S to save the document.

I hope that these steps are helpful.
Kolby



From cape.amanda at gmail.com  Tue Mar 24 11:51:42 2015
From: cape.amanda at gmail.com (cape.amanda at gmail.com)
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2015 07:51:42 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Downgrading Microsoft word
In-Reply-To: <00c801d06624$1daedfc0$590c9f40$@gmail.com>
References: <B3D6820F-43F9-432B-88E0-7ADB6651844D@gmail.com>
	<010c01d065bb$af75b140$0e6113c0$@gmail.com>
	<A276734D-0F3C-4ABF-BED7-AC9F10FBA930@gmail.com>
	<00c801d06624$1daedfc0$590c9f40$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <643E8310-36BB-4073-ABE4-205061FFB6E8@gmail.com>

But what if I want to double space it before it is all written?

Amanda

> On Mar 24, 2015, at 7:17 AM, Kolby Garrison <kolby12091988 at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Hello Amanda,
> To double space a document, follow these steps:
> 1. Press control plus home to navigate to the top of the document.
> 2. Press control plus A to highlight the entire document.
> 3. Press control plus two on the number row to double space the entire
> document.
> 4. Press control plus S to save the document.
> 
> I hope that these steps are helpful.
> Kolby
> 


From justin.williams2 at gmail.com  Tue Mar 24 12:55:35 2015
From: justin.williams2 at gmail.com (justin williams)
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2015 08:55:35 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Downgrading Microsoft word
In-Reply-To: <643E8310-36BB-4073-ABE4-205061FFB6E8@gmail.com>
References: <B3D6820F-43F9-432B-88E0-7ADB6651844D@gmail.com>	<010c01d065bb$af75b140$0e6113c0$@gmail.com>	<A276734D-0F3C-4ABF-BED7-AC9F10FBA930@gmail.com>	<00c801d06624$1daedfc0$590c9f40$@gmail.com>
	<643E8310-36BB-4073-ABE4-205061FFB6E8@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <003001d06631$d24f08d0$76ed1a70$@gmail.com>

Same thing.  If you want to double space it before you even start, just  use
control 2 then save the document. I would advice double spacing it after
everything is done in case you are wanting to bring in texts from other
documents or something. 

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Amanda via
nabs-l
Sent: Tuesday, March 24, 2015 7:52 AM
To: Kolby Garrison
Cc: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Downgrading Microsoft word

But what if I want to double space it before it is all written?

Amanda

> On Mar 24, 2015, at 7:17 AM, Kolby Garrison <kolby12091988 at gmail.com>
wrote:
> 
> Hello Amanda,
> To double space a document, follow these steps:
> 1. Press control plus home to navigate to the top of the document.
> 2. Press control plus A to highlight the entire document.
> 3. Press control plus two on the number row to double space the entire 
> document.
> 4. Press control plus S to save the document.
> 
> I hope that these steps are helpful.
> Kolby
> 

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail
.com



From gloria.graves at gmail.com  Tue Mar 24 13:37:59 2015
From: gloria.graves at gmail.com (Gloria Graves)
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2015 08:37:59 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] Downgrading Microsoft word
In-Reply-To: <003001d06631$d24f08d0$76ed1a70$@gmail.com>
References: <B3D6820F-43F9-432B-88E0-7ADB6651844D@gmail.com>
	<010c01d065bb$af75b140$0e6113c0$@gmail.com>
	<A276734D-0F3C-4ABF-BED7-AC9F10FBA930@gmail.com>
	<00c801d06624$1daedfc0$590c9f40$@gmail.com>
	<643E8310-36BB-4073-ABE4-205061FFB6E8@gmail.com>
	<003001d06631$d24f08d0$76ed1a70$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2DE3F3A7-E6A8-45FD-A8FA-64665B6EB542@gmail.com>

Hi Justin
I was wondering if you could tell me if its possible to change to the classic settings in the latest version of Word? I find it a little difficult to navigate the ribbon and was told that I could change the menus back to the way they were in office 2003
Thanks



> On Mar 24, 2015, at 7:55 AM, justin williams via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Same thing.  If you want to double space it before you even start, just  use
> control 2 then save the document. I would advice double spacing it after
> everything is done in case you are wanting to bring in texts from other
> documents or something. 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Amanda via
> nabs-l
> Sent: Tuesday, March 24, 2015 7:52 AM
> To: Kolby Garrison
> Cc: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Downgrading Microsoft word
> 
> But what if I want to double space it before it is all written?
> 
> Amanda
> 
>>> On Mar 24, 2015, at 7:17 AM, Kolby Garrison <kolby12091988 at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Hello Amanda,
>> To double space a document, follow these steps:
>> 1. Press control plus home to navigate to the top of the document.
>> 2. Press control plus A to highlight the entire document.
>> 3. Press control plus two on the number row to double space the entire 
>> document.
>> 4. Press control plus S to save the document.
>> 
>> I hope that these steps are helpful.
>> Kolby
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail
> .com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/gloria.graves%40gmail.com


From jsoro620 at gmail.com  Tue Mar 24 22:15:35 2015
From: jsoro620 at gmail.com (Joe)
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2015 18:15:35 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] FW: Please Share: Virtual Career Fair for People with
	Disabilities - April 14th (Full-time, Intern, & Co-op Jobs)
In-Reply-To: <DM2PR0601MB76352A52CA86C704A69ABCCD60A0@DM2PR0601MB763.namprd06.prod.outlook.com>
References: <CO2PR0601MB77421E9BB7505AECB2ABD66A5180@CO2PR0601MB774.namprd06.prod.outlook.com>
	<DM2PR0601MB76352A52CA86C704A69ABCCD60A0@DM2PR0601MB763.namprd06.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <00b501d06680$0def2d90$29cd88b0$@gmail.com>

Subject: Please Share: Virtual Career Fair for People with Disabilities -
April 14th (Full-time, Intern, & Co-op Jobs) 

 



 

	





Virtual Career Fair for People with Disabilities - November 13, 2014


 


Learn More at:  <https://www.careereco.com/events/disability>
www.careereco.com/events/disability 


Are you a person with a disability...
looking for a career opportunity or internship?


This Virtual Career Fair is FREE for students and alumni with disabilities
to attend.


Unique opportunity for College students & College grads with disabilities to
meet online with employers across the nation including ANSYS, Epic,
Medtronic, National Security Agency, Nestle Purina, Verizon, & More! 


Students and alumni are invited to interact with employers via chat
sessions.


 


*	CONNECT WITH EMPLOYERS LOOKING TO HIRE
PEOPLE WITH DISABILITIES

Access opportunities within a wide range of careers. 

*	Chat with employers across the nation 
*	Public and private sector opportunities 

*	INTERVIEW WITH EASE 

Participate from the comfort of your home, 
your dorm room or your favorite coffee shop! 

*	Discuss careers and internships with multiple employers 
*	End-to-end accessible technology platform 

*	CAREER FAIRS WITH LESS HASSLE 

Save time and money. 

*	No business suit or travel required 
*	No printed out resumes necessary 

Image removed by sender. WIN an iTunes gift card!



Register at  <https://www.careereco.com/register/disability>
www.careereco.com/register/disability 


Virtual Career Fair Date: April 14, 2015 


For information:  <mailto:bender at careereco.com> bender at careereco.com or
770.980.0088 

Image removed by sender. Career Eco Virtual Career Fairs. The new career
ecosystem.

   

 

If you do not want to receive future mailings, 
please reply with REMOVE in the subject line.



 

Image removed by sender.

 

 

  _____  

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From jsoro620 at gmail.com  Wed Mar 25 00:41:23 2015
From: jsoro620 at gmail.com (Joe)
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2015 20:41:23 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Downgrading Microsoft word
In-Reply-To: <643E8310-36BB-4073-ABE4-205061FFB6E8@gmail.com>
References: <B3D6820F-43F9-432B-88E0-7ADB6651844D@gmail.com>	<010c01d065bb$af75b140$0e6113c0$@gmail.com>	<A276734D-0F3C-4ABF-BED7-AC9F10FBA930@gmail.com>	<00c801d06624$1daedfc0$590c9f40$@gmail.com>
	<643E8310-36BB-4073-ABE4-205061FFB6E8@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <00ec01d06694$6bba5170$432ef450$@gmail.com>

Hi Amanda,

Since you're using JAWS, remember to make use of the Text Analyzer that will
help flag some of these formatting inconsistencies. Here are a few
keystrokes:

Toggle Text Analyzer.Insert + Space, A

This keystroke toggles the Text Analyzer between off and Describe All
Inconsistencies. For more options, use the Text Analyzer group in Settings
Center.

JAWSKey + Space, A


Text Analyzer Move To Next Inconsistency.Alt + Windows + I

This script moves the cursor to the next inconsistency found by Text
Analyzer, and announces or indicates the type of inconsistency found.


Text Analyzer Move To Prior Inconsistency.Alt + Shift + Windows + I

This script moves the cursor to the prior inconsistency found by Text
Analyzer, and announces or indicates the type of inconsistency found.

Joe

--
Musings of a Work in Progress:
www.JoeOrozco.com/

Twitter: @ScribblingJoe


-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Amanda via
nabs-l
Sent: Tuesday, March 24, 2015 7:52 AM
To: Kolby Garrison
Cc: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Downgrading Microsoft word

But what if I want to double space it before it is all written?

Amanda

> On Mar 24, 2015, at 7:17 AM, Kolby Garrison <kolby12091988 at gmail.com>
wrote:
> 
> Hello Amanda,
> To double space a document, follow these steps:
> 1. Press control plus home to navigate to the top of the document.
> 2. Press control plus A to highlight the entire document.
> 3. Press control plus two on the number row to double space the entire 
> document.
> 4. Press control plus S to save the document.
> 
> I hope that these steps are helpful.
> Kolby
> 

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.com



From kerrik2006 at gmail.com  Wed Mar 25 01:28:15 2015
From: kerrik2006 at gmail.com (Kerri Kosten)
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2015 21:28:15 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Spotify On the PC is finally accessible...except I can't
 figure out how to play any songs!!
Message-ID: <CAM6GWxy=WXy=hP04e1zn4BpaEe=QdDGeAWfQLMBCzkUEHgB5dA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Everyone:

I was elated to find after I restarted my computer Spotify for the PC
had been updated!!
It's now really accessible!
Everything is set up like a website with links and you can hit the alt
key and all menus are labeled!!
I was soo excited!!
The problem is, I can't figure out how to play any songs.
I can see my music (it's in a table) and it says the song name and
artist and album.
But, there Is no way to play the song.
I can even see the controls for the player at the bottom but it keeps
saying "play button unavailable."
I have tried hitting space on the song title, hitting enter on the
song title...everything. I even went into the menu by hitting the alt
key and pressing enter on the play button that way and no luck.
Has anyone else gotten to play with this latest version of the pc
client and figured out how to get a song to play?
Is there something I'm not doing?
It would be soo disappointing if Spotify  finally made their PC client
totally accessible except for playing a song!!
If there is a way to play songs with the PC client I'll upgrade and
become a premium member!!
Thanks,
Kerri


From tonysohl at samobile.net  Wed Mar 25 01:30:49 2015
From: tonysohl at samobile.net (Tony Sohl)
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2015 21:30:49 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Items for Sale
Message-ID: <ded16850.78cd.400d.a5d7.fbb583df85bb@samobile.net>

Hi this is tony Sohl and I still have the following items for sale and 
they were given to me.

1. Braille Note M-power with catty keyboard, 32 refreshable Braille 
display and Keysoft version 8.0 never been used still in it's original 
shipping box with all manuals and accessories. .

2. JAWS for Windows Professional version 16 still in it's original box 
with all braill labels including the serial number and registration Numbers.

JAWS for windows re tales for around $800 and the m-power note taker 
older model retails for about $500 or so.

I'm asking $500 for the M-power or best offere and $800 for jaws or 
best offere. If anyone's Interested , then you can email me at: 
tonysohl at samobile.net



From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com  Wed Mar 25 03:32:58 2015
From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton)
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2015 23:32:58 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] When A Personal Choice Becomes Personal.
In-Reply-To: <5510b624.a61a370a.7ad9.ffffa72f@mx.google.com>
References: <5510b624.a61a370a.7ad9.ffffa72f@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <CAFja7Fbk3eGSW0rCFLEiX0Cdpuny_dfJ5LiQhmjC9Y+xrBM_EQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

I've always wondered about this.  I've heard negative things said
about both cane and dog users.  "He uses a cane because he has enough
trouble knowing how to get himself around, he'd never be able to
navigate with a dog."  "She uses a dog because her mobility skills
aren't that great with a cane and her own spatial awareness."  I've
certainly encountered those who were a little turned around with a
cane and were easily confused with directions, but I've also known dog
users who did not have the directional skills to propperly work with a
guide dog in order to get from point A to the desired point B.  Once
at a camp I attended one of the staff got turned around and veered off
the path with her dog and another camper found her confused and had to
help her find her way back onto the road because she didn't even know
which command to give to her dog.

However, just as certainly as what I've just said I've met some great
travelers from both camps.  I've seen a number of phenomenal guide dog
teams, as well as extremely competent cane users who have never used a
dog before.

For me a cane is the best decision for the time being.  I do like the
extra get up and go feeling that I've gotten from when I've taken
"test drives" with guide dogs (and by that I mean held the harness and
walked around a little bit), but at this point in my life I am
comfortable with a cane.  I think sometimes the stereotypes we work so
hard as a collective group of blind people to shirk off get in our own
way.  I'm guilty of this too---I know in the past that I've gotten
annoyed with other blind people for being slow, or for not learning
routes or being able to follow directions as well as others, and I've
learned that you aren't automatically more independent because you
have a guide dog, but it really is a matter of personal choice and
that's all it is.  I think we complicate it way too much.  Both are
valid options for navigating and both have their advantages and
disadvantages.

On 3/23/15, Roanna Bacchus via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Hi Darian this is an interesting post.  For me it is my personal
> peference to use a cane.  I preier not to travel under
> sleepshades because Ih ne" traveled with them before.  For me
> personal choice becomes personal preference when I have done the
> choice for a long time.
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com
>


-- 
Kaiti


From carlymih at comcast.net  Wed Mar 25 04:22:19 2015
From: carlymih at comcast.net (Carly Mihalakis)
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2015 21:22:19 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] When A Personal Choice Becomes Personal.
In-Reply-To: <CAFja7Fbk3eGSW0rCFLEiX0Cdpuny_dfJ5LiQhmjC9Y+xrBM_EQ@mail.g
	mail.com>
References: <5510b624.a61a370a.7ad9.ffffa72f@mx.google.com>
	<CAFja7Fbk3eGSW0rCFLEiX0Cdpuny_dfJ5LiQhmjC9Y+xrBM_EQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <mailman.206.1772982280.2863824.nabs-l_nfbnet.org@nfbnet.org>

Evening, Rona,

Extremely well said!
I used to be one of those cunty blind people who would grow impatiant 
with some blind people's slowness, lack of skill. then, a fitting 
event happened in which  I became brain damaged and a slow, 
awkwardness  set in.
CarAt 08:32 PM 3/24/2015, Kaiti Shelton via nabs-l wrote:
>Hi,
>
>I've always wondered about this.  I've heard negative things said
>about both cane and dog users.  "He uses a cane because he has enough
>trouble knowing how to get himself around, he'd never be able to
>navigate with a dog."  "She uses a dog because her mobility skills
>aren't that great with a cane and her own spatial awareness."  I've
>certainly encountered those who were a little turned around with a
>cane and were easily confused with directions, but I've also known dog
>users who did not have the directional skills to propperly work with a
>guide dog in order to get from point A to the desired point B.  Once
>at a camp I attended one of the staff got turned around and veered off
>the path with her dog and another camper found her confused and had to
>help her find her way back onto the road because she didn't even know
>which command to give to her dog.
>
>However, just as certainly as what I've just said I've met some great
>travelers from both camps.  I've seen a number of phenomenal guide dog
>teams, as well as extremely competent cane users who have never used a
>dog before.
>
>For me a cane is the best decision for the time being.  I do like the
>extra get up and go feeling that I've gotten from when I've taken
>"test drives" with guide dogs (and by that I mean held the harness and
>walked around a little bit), but at this point in my life I am
>comfortable with a cane.  I think sometimes the stereotypes we work so
>hard as a collective group of blind people to shirk off get in our own
>way.  I'm guilty of this too---I know in the past that I've gotten
>annoyed with other blind people for being slow, or for not learning
>routes or being able to follow directions as well as others, and I've
>learned that you aren't automatically more independent because you
>have a guide dog, but it really is a matter of personal choice and
>that's all it is.  I think we complicate it way too much.  Both are
>valid options for navigating and both have their advantages and
>disadvantages.
>
>On 3/23/15, Roanna Bacchus via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> > Hi Darian this is an interesting post.  For me it is my personal
> > peference to use a cane.  I preier not to travel under
> > sleepshades because Ih ne" traveled with them before.  For me
> > personal choice becomes personal preference when I have done the
> > choice for a long time.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > nabs-l mailing list
> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> > nabs-l:
> > 
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com
> >
>
>
>--
>Kaiti
>
>_______________________________________________
>nabs-l mailing list
>nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carlymih%40comcast.net




From tonysohl at samobile.net  Wed Mar 25 17:11:28 2015
From: tonysohl at samobile.net (Tony Sohl)
Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2015 13:11:28 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Items for Sale
Message-ID: <cf5e68b5.3792.4c29.ad64.b9831780743e@samobile.net>

Hi this is tony Sohl and I still have the following items for sale and 
they were given to me.

1. Braille Note M-power with catty keyboard, 32 refreshable Braille 
display and Keysoft version 8.0 never been used still in it's original 
shipping box with all manuals and accessories. .

2. JAWS for Windows Professional version 16 still in it's original box 
with all braill labels including the serial number and registration Numbers.

JAWS for windows re tales for around $800 and the m-power note taker 
older model retails for about $500 or so.

I'm asking $200 for the M-power or best offere and $200 for jaws or 
best offere. If anyone's Interested , then you can email me at: 
tonysohl at samobile.net



From tonysohl at samobile.net  Wed Mar 25 17:36:33 2015
From: tonysohl at samobile.net (Tony Sohl)
Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2015 13:36:33 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Items for sale
Message-ID: <ddfaff34.6319.4689.8fdb.388232a11252@samobile.net>

Hi folks, I just recently found out that I'm not able to give this 
equipmkent away due to the state of Arizona's policy and rehab 
servicdes lied and mislead on what i can do with the equipment that was 
tgiven to me. as a result, i am unable to sell this and recently i was 
told then when I pcdked up the equipment i was told that i could sell 
it and now i came to find out that that's not ture and now I cannot 
even sell or even give these items away. BAsically the person who told 
me this was misinformed and was told by the perosn who gave them to me 
that that's not the case.

Again I'm sorry for the misinformation and misleading everyone.



From tonysohl at samobile.net  Wed Mar 25 17:57:12 2015
From: tonysohl at samobile.net (Tony Sohl)
Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2015 13:57:12 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Items for sale and low intrist lones
Message-ID: <157b5e9e.18c7.4684.be88.01af1359a560@samobile.net>

Hi as I sated in my previous email that I'm not free to sell this 
equipment and I was given misinformation and again, I'm sorry for 
misleading everyone!

If anyone's intristed in getting financial help for adaptive equipment 
then check out the Arizona Technology Accesss Program (AZTAP.) They 
have a low-intrist lone that allows individuals the ability to purchase 
equipment and software to meet their needs.

http://aztap.org



From ALewis at nfb.org  Wed Mar 25 18:49:20 2015
From: ALewis at nfb.org (Lewis, Anil)
Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2015 18:49:20 +0000
Subject: [nabs-l] FW: 2015 NBCUniversal Tony Coelho Media Scholarship
 Accepting Applications
In-Reply-To: <46599503.1427307703067.JavaMail.www@app351>
References: <46599503.1427307703067.JavaMail.www@app351>
Message-ID: <DM2PR0701MB101873BD8480B279060293F4C10B0@DM2PR0701MB1018.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>


From: AAPD Scholarships [mailto:scholarship at aapd.com]
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2015 2:22 PM
To: Lewis, Anil
Subject: 2015 NBCUniversal Tony Coelho Media Scholarship Accepting Applications


Can't view this message? Read it online<http://power.aapd.com/site/R?i=k5ZHLQdsah1H0PniGQGSwA>.
[Image removed by sender. American Association of People with Disabilities]<http://power.aapd.com/site/R?i=GwetlaGHARoQyZH8KJyICQ>






2015 NBCUniversal Tony Coelho Media Scholarship

The American Association of People with Disabilities is pleased to announced that we are accepting applications for the 2015 NBCUniversal Tony Coelho Media Scholarship.  We are offering four scholarships, which can be used for for the spring, summer, or fall semesters of 2015, to 2nd year associate students; undergraduate sophomores, juniors, and seniors; and graduate students with disabilities who are pursuing communication or media-related degrees.  Each recipient will receive $5,625 for the tuition and fees at their college or university.

Students will need to provide us the following items to apply for the scholarship:

*         Completed 2015 NBCUniversal Tony Coelho Media Scholarship application (download from the AAPD website here<http://power.aapd.com/site/R?i=ULZbEyE3j2PYmkW7pSgdhw>)

*         Resume

*         Unofficial Transcript

*         Two 300-350 word essays answering the following questions:

o    What inspired you to pursue a communications/media related degree?

o    How will you use your degree to positively impact the disability community?

*         A letter of recommendation from a professor, academic advisor, or mentor

All applications and supporting materials should be emailed to scholarship at aapd.com<mailto:scholarship at aapd.com> by 5:00PM on Friday, April 24, 2015 in an accessible format.











Forward to a Friend<http://power.aapd.com/site/R?i=gpqg9KqYRUUItv6wA2CIjQ> | Manage My Profile<http://power.aapd.com/site/R?i=08iC2Fvw2lRDOv3a2toyVA> | Unsubscribe<http://power.aapd.com/site/CO?i=dbI77bOOjMOWfrePzWo0ucDHlcgHmSIU&cid=0> | Donate<http://power.aapd.com/site/R?i=EeVCtJdXdLT-FarUQp38Lg>

American Association of People with Disabilities
2013 H Street NW, 5th Floor | Washington, DC 20006


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From mausbun at unr.edu  Thu Mar 26 05:36:04 2015
From: mausbun at unr.edu (Michael D Ausbun)
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2015 05:36:04 +0000
Subject: [nabs-l] Blind parents division meeting
In-Reply-To: <DM2PR0701MB101873BD8480B279060293F4C10B0@DM2PR0701MB1018.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>
References: <46599503.1427307703067.JavaMail.www@app351>,
	<DM2PR0701MB101873BD8480B279060293F4C10B0@DM2PR0701MB1018.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <4469B74A-2E21-44F9-B4D4-120EDFE20E18@unr.edu>



Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 25, 2015, at 10:32 PM, blind parents division <nevadablindparents at gmail.com<mailto:nevadablindparents at gmail.com>> wrote:

Hello all,
Nevada Blind parents teleconference is tomorrow at 7p.m. If you are
still interested please call (712) 775-7100 and use access code 257963
I look forward to meeting all of you and getting your input and
support.
We will be going over
officers
Programs
fundraising
socializing and gatherings
and more  Nevada Blind Parents is a membership organization of blind
parents and friends of the blind reaching out to each other to give
vital support, encouragement, and information. We currently seeking
members in Nevada.

The purpose of the NBP is to:
• create a climate of opportunity for blind parents and their children
in home and society.
• provide information and support to blind parents and their children.
• facilitate the sharing of experience and concerns among blind parents.
• develop and expand resources available to blind parents and their children.
• help blind parents and/or sighted children gain understanding and
perspective through partnership and contact with other blind parents,
adult children, and community organizations .
• function as an integral part of society in an effort to achieve
equality and opportunity for all blind persons.

Pleas share this information with anyone you think may benefit the
organization or benefit from the organization.

Sincerely,
Zippora

From wdg31415 at gmail.com  Fri Mar 27 15:08:32 2015
From: wdg31415 at gmail.com (William Grussenmeyer)
Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2015 08:08:32 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] quick online survey from researchers at the University of
	Nevada, Reno
Message-ID: <CADw-9YkNR-mHHFsLXsmW3adncNHkb2yfXyh8XDaVFzBRiJ0YSg@mail.gmail.com>

Hello NFB Members,

 We at the University of Nevada, Reno are conducting an online survey
 about the difficulties that people who are blind face in work and
 school concerning the need to create diagrams and other visual
 materials, such as bar graphs or geometry homework.  This online
 survey will help inform research in new technology.  It is a quick
 survey about 15 questions and should take less than 10 minutes.
 Please follow the link below if you are interested (please email me if
 you have any accessibility problems with the form):
http://goo.gl/forms/w1JT9F8cqj

 Thank You,
-- 
William Grussenmeyer
PhD Student, Computer Science
University of Nevada, Reno
NSF Fellow


From herekittykat97 at gmail.com  Fri Mar 27 17:36:15 2015
From: herekittykat97 at gmail.com (Jewel S.)
Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2015 13:36:15 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Dreaming a dream-- Unseen Hope: Bringing Hope to Those Who
	Cannot See
Message-ID: <CAOgWOCe3MqT8SCFGRrFGHhuP=rrUxtLX9aqg4bG3cEH4EASQyA@mail.gmail.com>

Dear all,
First, I apologize for any crossposting. I would like to introduce
y'all to my Dream, found at http://goo.gl/blrxtA. This is a Dream
created at www.dreamfund.com. I want to bring 35 adjustable canes to
the Makassar School for the Blind, an adult-age school in Makassar,
Indonesia that has no white canes due to lack of funds. I first heard
of their plight when I found one of their teachers, Muhammad, on the
Matilda Zeigler (R.I.P.) in the penpals section, looking for someone
to practice his English with. He has very good English, actually,
since he is the English teacher at the school, but sometime his accent
just gets in the way.
Anyway, practicing English turned into chat about our different lives
and as he told me about his place of work, I was amazed that a school
for the blind could function without white canes for the students, who
are expected to travel independently to job interviews and eventually
to their jobs and homes and everywhere in the city anyone else would
go.
So, I came up with the idea of Unseen Hope, an organization that will
help schools all around the globe with the needs present. The name
came to me because I'm bringing them hope, but none of us will see it
since we're all blind. I hope to get support from you all, even if
it's only a couple of dollars. This is a special cause inmy heart, as
I feel independent travel is one of the most important things a blind
person can have to be free...free to go to the market whenever they
want, free to visit museums and parks, free to escape a burning
building, free to move around wherever and whenever they want to. If
you agree with me, donate a few dollars to my cause. If you want,
donate $25, and you'll get a group picture of all the students with
their canes when I travel there and present them...donate $75, and
you'll receive an individual picture of one of the students and a
thank you letter from that student.

Thank you for taking the time to read this and I hope you'll support my project!
Sincerely yours,
Amber "Jewel" Shuping
herekittykat972 at gmail.com
Facebook: Amber Shuping
Twitter: Jewelisgoofy
Phone number upon request in private e-mail


From dsmithnfb at gmail.com  Fri Mar 27 19:13:50 2015
From: dsmithnfb at gmail.com (Darian Smith)
Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2015 12:13:50 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] When A Personal Choice Becomes Personal.
In-Reply-To: <CAFja7Fbk3eGSW0rCFLEiX0Cdpuny_dfJ5LiQhmjC9Y+xrBM_EQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <5510b624.a61a370a.7ad9.ffffa72f@mx.google.com>
	<CAFja7Fbk3eGSW0rCFLEiX0Cdpuny_dfJ5LiQhmjC9Y+xrBM_EQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <711474B6-A0B2-4614-BE94-05194B6404A2@gmail.com>

Hi all,
  I think I can certainly relate to what kaiti shares here.
 I think we have  certain ideas of what a “independent traveler” looks like, how fast they must travel, what tools they use,etc.
 I think that  as is the case for most things in life, we are impacted  the strongest by what we see around us  the most, and  can get certain ideas in our head based upon those experiences. 
 Take for example the fact that   my first few  instances of  seeing blind people with canes  honestly  seemed to discourage me. The people I saw seemed very  dependent upon the nearest sighted person or the closest blind  person that so happened to have any sort of vision they could use or  seemed to  stumble their way around even with a cane.   After seeing enough people who did this, I decided that  I didn’t believe that  lifestyle was for me.
    Similarly, I encountered blind  folks with  guide dogs, and even though the belief somehow caught me that one would be better off as a traveler, I came to realize that if one   doesn’t have the  basic orientation and mobility skills, that they are going to be just as likely to be dependent at the end of the day.
   As I’ve lived longer I’ve come to  understand  that not  simply the possession of  cane or dog fixes mobility issues, but the foundation of at least solid skill with a cane and equally solid foundation in orientation and mobility allows one to  make the best decision for themselves when it comes to applying for a  guide  or  going  with a cane.
   How many of you can think of conversations between sighted peers  when it comes to cars?  Do you remember  the discussion of stick shifts vs automatics?
 some learned one way and some learned the other way, some eventually learned both and those who  learned both  seemed to have a better time of it when  it came to  situations when they had to use both.  The point is that it will eventually come down to  personal  choice, and  hopefully it isn’t a  choice based upon pressure, or a lack of balanced facts/information.
  Hopefully we can see  the  the choice one makes as simply a choice one makes, much like the  choice to  grow out one’s hair or cut one’s hair short;nothing more, nothing less.
            
             
   
               
 		
> On Mar 24, 2015, at 8:32 PM, Kaiti Shelton via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I've always wondered about this.  I've heard negative things said
> about both cane and dog users.  "He uses a cane because he has enough
> trouble knowing how to get himself around, he'd never be able to
> navigate with a dog."  "She uses a dog because her mobility skills
> aren't that great with a cane and her own spatial awareness."  I've
> certainly encountered those who were a little turned around with a
> cane and were easily confused with directions, but I've also known dog
> users who did not have the directional skills to propperly work with a
> guide dog in order to get from point A to the desired point B.  Once
> at a camp I attended one of the staff got turned around and veered off
> the path with her dog and another camper found her confused and had to
> help her find her way back onto the road because she didn't even know
> which command to give to her dog.
> 
> However, just as certainly as what I've just said I've met some great
> travelers from both camps.  I've seen a number of phenomenal guide dog
> teams, as well as extremely competent cane users who have never used a
> dog before.
> 
> For me a cane is the best decision for the time being.  I do like the
> extra get up and go feeling that I've gotten from when I've taken
> "test drives" with guide dogs (and by that I mean held the harness and
> walked around a little bit), but at this point in my life I am
> comfortable with a cane.  I think sometimes the stereotypes we work so
> hard as a collective group of blind people to shirk off get in our own
> way.  I'm guilty of this too---I know in the past that I've gotten
> annoyed with other blind people for being slow, or for not learning
> routes or being able to follow directions as well as others, and I've
> learned that you aren't automatically more independent because you
> have a guide dog, but it really is a matter of personal choice and
> that's all it is.  I think we complicate it way too much.  Both are
> valid options for navigating and both have their advantages and
> disadvantages.
> 
> On 3/23/15, Roanna Bacchus via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> Hi Darian this is an interesting post.  For me it is my personal
>> peference to use a cane.  I preier not to travel under
>> sleepshades because Ih ne" traveled with them before.  For me
>> personal choice becomes personal preference when I have done the
>> choice for a long time.
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com
>> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Kaiti
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com



From kwakmiso at aol.com  Sat Mar 28 07:06:48 2015
From: kwakmiso at aol.com (Miso Kwak)
Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2015 03:06:48 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Accessibility of Class Management System Top Hat
Message-ID: <8D2373CE484ED79-12C4-50413@webmail-va085.sysops.aol.com>

Fellow students,
Has anyone had any experience using a class management system called 
Top Hat?
www.tophat.com
One of my classes in the spring quarter will be utilizing this tool.
If you have tips on how to best navigate the system, I would appreciate 
it.

Best,
Miso Kwak




From grassflower111 at gmail.com  Sat Mar 28 15:41:42 2015
From: grassflower111 at gmail.com (Trinh)
Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2015 10:41:42 -0500
Subject: [nabs-l] math in college
Message-ID: <20150328154142.grassflower111@gmail.com>

Hi everyone,  
 Hope all of you are doing well. As a high school student who's interested in going to college after high school, I just want to know how some things might work. What are your experiences with math courses in college? How do you do your assignments and turn them in to your professors given that with math you always have to show all your work? 
 Thank you, 
 Trinh                 



From rbacchus228 at gmail.com  Sat Mar 28 18:24:12 2015
From: rbacchus228 at gmail.com (Roanna Bacchus)
Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2015 14:24:12 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] math in college
Message-ID: <5516f1dd.cf21370a.0b08.217e@mx.google.com>

Hi Trin thanks for your message.  This is an awesome discussion 
topic for the list.  When I took my two economics classes in 
community college, they were both accessible were Jaws.  The 
exams were given in class so I took them at the Disability 
Support Sgvices office.  These courses involved a lot of reading 
from the textbook which I had on a Cd.  Any assignments that had 
to be turned in were emailed to the professor on the appropriate 
due date.


From rbacchus228 at gmail.com  Sat Mar 28 18:24:09 2015
From: rbacchus228 at gmail.com (Roanna Bacchus)
Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2015 14:24:09 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Accessibility of Class Management System Top Hat
Message-ID: <5516f1da.cf21370a.0b08.217d@mx.google.com>

My school uses a system called Web courses to manage our online 
and mix-mode classes.  All of the courses that I have taken 
including my current courses are accessible with Jaws.


From blackbyrdfly at gmail.com  Sat Mar 28 20:19:57 2015
From: blackbyrdfly at gmail.com (Jamie P.)
Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2015 14:19:57 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] math in college
In-Reply-To: <5516f1dd.cf21370a.0b08.217e@mx.google.com>
References: <5516f1dd.cf21370a.0b08.217e@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <CABmRQ=C6u=aNqNwaUPJ6bTMFjQTm-4Xg4s9xKvbG+M=MMW5a4g@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Trin,
I'm excited to hear that you're going to be taking Math classes in college
and are taking the initiative to ask questions and prepare yourself ahead
of time. This is an excellent thing to do for any class in college that
you're not already experienced with taking.

I have a lot of experience with college level Math classes, both good and
bad. Math, by its very nature, is NOT inaccessible or out of reach or even
especially difficult. I can't stress that enough. But the way a university,
or even an individual professor decides to format the course can make or
break the experience for a student if you don't know what to expect. I've
seen way too many blind students turned off of Math (and consequently,
science) forever because of a series of bad experiences with a particular
Math class. I was almost one of these students, but now I'm pursuing a
highly math-intensive degree and can't get enough of the subject, in school
or just for fun.

In college Math classes, homework can be done in a few different ways. Most
often, your homework is going to be done through an online system.
Pearson's MyMathLab is a very popular example of this, but some schools
might have their own custom system for Math classes. I've even had one
class that used the school's regular course management system for Math
homework. When you do homework like this, you usually don't show your work.
Instead, you just enter your answer with an equation editor or choose from
multiple choices. Often, professors will advise you to still write out the
steps you used to solve these problems and save them so you can ask
questions later in class. Some of these systems give you multiple attempts
on homework assignments with a vast problem bank so you can get lots of
practice. Unfortunately, these systems are rarely (but sometimes) fully
accessible with screen readers, and (someone correct me if I'm wrong) I've
never heard of one being compatible with a braille display.

When you take a Math class that uses an inaccessible online homework
system, you should be able to expect your professor to work with you to
find a solution. Math is critical to your education, no matter what your
major, so expect no less. Some possible alternatives to consider are doing
homework out of a textbook. If your classmates are given multiple attempts
on their online homework, you should also expect the same number of
attempts on written homework. Most textbooks have enough exercises to make
this feasible. If your classmates get corrected immediately by the online
system, but you're doing textbook problems, you may be able to get a
solution manual that goes with your book. This will allow you to see
immediately if you got the right final answer like your peers can, but
you'll still have to figure out exactly how to get that answer by doing the
work yourself. Another way to get this benefit of your peers are receiving
immediate correction and multiple attempts is to turn in your assignment
early for grading, and re-doing the problems you get wrong. This, however,
will be very time consuming for both you and your professor. Working with a
reader to use the online system is another option. This gives you all the
advantages of using an online homework system. However, some drawbacks of
readers are having to coordinate with another person's busy life to get
your homework done, finding a reader who understands Math well enough to
know how to read it in a way that is most informative, and having to
compensate another person for their time. The last drawback should be
something your school is willing to address for you if they are choosing to
use inaccessible software for their courses.

Some professors may assign all of their homework out of a textbook, in
which case everyone is in the same paper boat, so to speak, and you
shouldn't have to worry much about leveling the playing field.

I am a Math tutor, and I specialize in working with blind college students.
I tell all of my students that Nemeth code is going to be their BFF in
college level Math. Braille literacy is critically important to any
student, but if you're going to be taking a Math class, I can't stress
enough how much you will benefit from having strong Nemeth skills. Math
isn't just about reading numbers. You need to be able to represent big
ideas concisely. Phrases like "is greater than or equal to...", "the
absolute value of...", "raised to the power of...", and so on need to be
clearly represented with as few symbols as possible, or you're going to
have mountains of paper to sort though just to get through one problem set.
Nemeth isn't perfectly concise, but it tries, and it does reasonably well.
Furthermore, you need to be able to manipulate symbols and numbers and
operations at will. Maybe the most gifted among us can do this kind of
thing in their heads, but there is a reason teachers want you to show your
work, and its because doing it in your head is going to lead to mistakes,
and headaches! There should always be someone in your school's disability
services department who is familiar with Nemeth and can transcribe your
work to a format your teacher will understand, and you should absolutely be
able to get a textbook for your class in Braille. Just be sure you give the
appropriate department ample notice because sometimes it takes a very long
time to obtain or create these books.

I don't recommend settling for an audio math book if you're taking any
class offered by your school's Math department (you *might be able to get
away with this in the Economics or Statistics departments). The readers of
these books aren't excellent, and it's difficult to see the whole equation
when you have to keep rewinding and listening to it in a linear fashion.

Computer skills are also pretty important, and if you're very comfortable
with a computer and a screen reader or braille display, you might benefit
from learning LaTeX (often pronounced La Tek). Put very simply (because I'm
running out of time), LaTeX is a way of coding Math on a computer for
writing websites and documents that contain equations. It makes all the
symbols look nice for sighted people, but it also means that we as blind
people can read and write these symbols. If you can learn LaTeX, it will
unlock some online resources that you can use to study Math and give you
the ability to express ideas with mathematical notation that your peers and
professors can read without waiting on someone to transcribe your braille
documents.

This is all I have time to write today, but I would be happy to help you
and answer any other questions you might have about studying Math in
college. E-mail me off-list if you'd like to talk about this more.

Best,

Jamie Principato
blackbyrdfly at gmail.com

On Sat, Mar 28, 2015 at 12:24 PM, Roanna Bacchus via nabs-l <
nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:

> Hi Trin thanks for your message.  This is an awesome discussion topic for
> the list.  When I took my two economics classes in community college, they
> were both accessible were Jaws.  The exams were given in class so I took
> them at the Disability Support Sgvices office.  These courses involved a
> lot of reading from the textbook which I had on a Cd.  Any assignments that
> had to be turned in were emailed to the professor on the appropriate due
> date.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/
> blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com
>

From kathrynwebster.nfb at gmail.com  Sun Mar 29 12:12:03 2015
From: kathrynwebster.nfb at gmail.com (Kathryn Webster)
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2015 08:12:03 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] math in college
In-Reply-To: <CABmRQ=C6u=aNqNwaUPJ6bTMFjQTm-4Xg4s9xKvbG+M=MMW5a4g@mail.gmail.com>
References: <5516f1dd.cf21370a.0b08.217e@mx.google.com>
	<CABmRQ=C6u=aNqNwaUPJ6bTMFjQTm-4Xg4s9xKvbG+M=MMW5a4g@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <E876C6D9-0B72-4553-A106-C2BA27D4D5A0@gmail.com>

Trin, Jamie, and all,
	Jamie has made exceptionally strong recommendations for those pursuing a math degree, or even taking a single math course in college.
As a statistics minor and one pursuing a concentration in Mathematical Business, I would like to share some of my own experiences.

The biggest struggle I had with obtaining Braille books are space and time. There are nearly 50+ volumes for each Mathematics textbook. If one is taking multiple math courses, then finding a place to store all of these boxes is critical. Furthermore, like Jamie said, advance notice is key. Services for the Blind will most definitely prepare your materials, yet it is up to you to relay all necessary information to them in a timely manner.
Though I rely on Braille for every other subject in college, I use LaTex for all math courses. Since math textbooks originate from a TEX document, meaning LaTex format, we as blind students are able to read the textbook with all the other students. Then, when given an assignment, we can have the textbook open in one window and complete the assignment using LaTex in another window.

I highly suggest learning this computer language two weeks in advance of diving into a new math course with new concepts. Also, I frequently bluetooth my Braille display to my laptop in order to read the LaTex and not miss any of the symbols. 
I know this is a ton of information, but just know we are here to help.
Please do feel free to reach out off list and I would be more than happy to help you through this process. I absolutely love Mathematics and am so glad you are going to give it a shot!
I also, for anyone interested, have LaTex tutorials on my computer. I am glad to send those off to anyone interested.
Best,
Kathryn


Kathryn C. Webster
Board Member | National Federation of the Blind of Connecticut
President | North Carolina Association of Blind Students
Treasurer | Connecticut Association of Blind Students
Board Member | The Science and Engineering Division
(Coordinator | Connecticut BELL Program
Executive Editor | The Federationist Newsletter
203) 273-8463
kathrynwebster.nfb at gmail.com

On Mar 28, 2015, at 4:19 PM, Jamie P. via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:

> Hi Trin,
> I'm excited to hear that you're going to be taking Math classes in college
> and are taking the initiative to ask questions and prepare yourself ahead
> of time. This is an excellent thing to do for any class in college that
> you're not already experienced with taking.
> 
> I have a lot of experience with college level Math classes, both good and
> bad. Math, by its very nature, is NOT inaccessible or out of reach or even
> especially difficult. I can't stress that enough. But the way a university,
> or even an individual professor decides to format the course can make or
> break the experience for a student if you don't know what to expect. I've
> seen way too many blind students turned off of Math (and consequently,
> science) forever because of a series of bad experiences with a particular
> Math class. I was almost one of these students, but now I'm pursuing a
> highly math-intensive degree and can't get enough of the subject, in school
> or just for fun.
> 
> In college Math classes, homework can be done in a few different ways. Most
> often, your homework is going to be done through an online system.
> Pearson's MyMathLab is a very popular example of this, but some schools
> might have their own custom system for Math classes. I've even had one
> class that used the school's regular course management system for Math
> homework. When you do homework like this, you usually don't show your work.
> Instead, you just enter your answer with an equation editor or choose from
> multiple choices. Often, professors will advise you to still write out the
> steps you used to solve these problems and save them so you can ask
> questions later in class. Some of these systems give you multiple attempts
> on homework assignments with a vast problem bank so you can get lots of
> practice. Unfortunately, these systems are rarely (but sometimes) fully
> accessible with screen readers, and (someone correct me if I'm wrong) I've
> never heard of one being compatible with a braille display.
> 
> When you take a Math class that uses an inaccessible online homework
> system, you should be able to expect your professor to work with you to
> find a solution. Math is critical to your education, no matter what your
> major, so expect no less. Some possible alternatives to consider are doing
> homework out of a textbook. If your classmates are given multiple attempts
> on their online homework, you should also expect the same number of
> attempts on written homework. Most textbooks have enough exercises to make
> this feasible. If your classmates get corrected immediately by the online
> system, but you're doing textbook problems, you may be able to get a
> solution manual that goes with your book. This will allow you to see
> immediately if you got the right final answer like your peers can, but
> you'll still have to figure out exactly how to get that answer by doing the
> work yourself. Another way to get this benefit of your peers are receiving
> immediate correction and multiple attempts is to turn in your assignment
> early for grading, and re-doing the problems you get wrong. This, however,
> will be very time consuming for both you and your professor. Working with a
> reader to use the online system is another option. This gives you all the
> advantages of using an online homework system. However, some drawbacks of
> readers are having to coordinate with another person's busy life to get
> your homework done, finding a reader who understands Math well enough to
> know how to read it in a way that is most informative, and having to
> compensate another person for their time. The last drawback should be
> something your school is willing to address for you if they are choosing to
> use inaccessible software for their courses.
> 
> Some professors may assign all of their homework out of a textbook, in
> which case everyone is in the same paper boat, so to speak, and you
> shouldn't have to worry much about leveling the playing field.
> 
> I am a Math tutor, and I specialize in working with blind college students.
> I tell all of my students that Nemeth code is going to be their BFF in
> college level Math. Braille literacy is critically important to any
> student, but if you're going to be taking a Math class, I can't stress
> enough how much you will benefit from having strong Nemeth skills. Math
> isn't just about reading numbers. You need to be able to represent big
> ideas concisely. Phrases like "is greater than or equal to...", "the
> absolute value of...", "raised to the power of...", and so on need to be
> clearly represented with as few symbols as possible, or you're going to
> have mountains of paper to sort though just to get through one problem set.
> Nemeth isn't perfectly concise, but it tries, and it does reasonably well.
> Furthermore, you need to be able to manipulate symbols and numbers and
> operations at will. Maybe the most gifted among us can do this kind of
> thing in their heads, but there is a reason teachers want you to show your
> work, and its because doing it in your head is going to lead to mistakes,
> and headaches! There should always be someone in your school's disability
> services department who is familiar with Nemeth and can transcribe your
> work to a format your teacher will understand, and you should absolutely be
> able to get a textbook for your class in Braille. Just be sure you give the
> appropriate department ample notice because sometimes it takes a very long
> time to obtain or create these books.
> 
> I don't recommend settling for an audio math book if you're taking any
> class offered by your school's Math department (you *might be able to get
> away with this in the Economics or Statistics departments). The readers of
> these books aren't excellent, and it's difficult to see the whole equation
> when you have to keep rewinding and listening to it in a linear fashion.
> 
> Computer skills are also pretty important, and if you're very comfortable
> with a computer and a screen reader or braille display, you might benefit
> from learning LaTeX (often pronounced La Tek). Put very simply (because I'm
> running out of time), LaTeX is a way of coding Math on a computer for
> writing websites and documents that contain equations. It makes all the
> symbols look nice for sighted people, but it also means that we as blind
> people can read and write these symbols. If you can learn LaTeX, it will
> unlock some online resources that you can use to study Math and give you
> the ability to express ideas with mathematical notation that your peers and
> professors can read without waiting on someone to transcribe your braille
> documents.
> 
> This is all I have time to write today, but I would be happy to help you
> and answer any other questions you might have about studying Math in
> college. E-mail me off-list if you'd like to talk about this more.
> 
> Best,
> 
> Jamie Principato
> blackbyrdfly at gmail.com
> 
> On Sat, Mar 28, 2015 at 12:24 PM, Roanna Bacchus via nabs-l <
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
>> Hi Trin thanks for your message.  This is an awesome discussion topic for
>> the list.  When I took my two economics classes in community college, they
>> were both accessible were Jaws.  The exams were given in class so I took
>> them at the Disability Support Sgvices office.  These courses involved a
>> lot of reading from the textbook which I had on a Cd.  Any assignments that
>> had to be turned in were emailed to the professor on the appropriate due
>> date.
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/
>> blackbyrdfly%40gmail.com
>> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kathrynwebster.nfb%40gmail.com



From kwakmiso at aol.com  Mon Mar 30 00:31:52 2015
From: kwakmiso at aol.com (Miso Kwak)
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2015 20:31:52 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Accessible Antivirus programs
Message-ID: <8D238980D525DF9-754-4EA11@webmail-vm173.sysops.aol.com>

Hi,
I recently had to do a factory reset on my laptop. I used to use 
Microsoft Security Essentials but lost the program and not sure how I 
can obtain it. Also, I am trying to explore some other options.
The person who did the factory reset and backed up my data recommended 
AVG 2015 but I do not like this as it does not seem to be quite 
accessible.
Any suggestions for an antivirus program that is competible with 
Windows7 and accessible?
Thank you in advance.
--Miso Kwak




From bridgetawalker13 at aol.com  Mon Mar 30 00:59:07 2015
From: bridgetawalker13 at aol.com (Bridget Walker)
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2015 20:59:07 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Accessible Antivirus programs
In-Reply-To: <8D238980D525DF9-754-4EA11@webmail-vm173.sysops.aol.com>
References: <8D238980D525DF9-754-4EA11@webmail-vm173.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <E1E232E2-E2CF-4583-A57D-680B58B49CB2@aol.com>

Hi Miso,
You can try avast. It is free and accessible with Jaws.
It also has an audio feedback component for when it completes a scan. 
I hope this helps
Bridget

Sent from my iPad

> On Mar 29, 27 Heisei, at 8:31 PM, Miso Kwak via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> I recently had to do a factory reset on my laptop. I used to use Microsoft Security Essentials but lost the program and not sure how I can obtain it. Also, I am trying to explore some other options.
> The person who did the factory reset and backed up my data recommended AVG 2015 but I do not like this as it does not seem to be quite accessible.
> Any suggestions for an antivirus program that is competible with Windows7 and accessible?
> Thank you in advance.
> --Miso Kwak
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bridgetawalker13%40aol.com


From ALewis at nfb.org  Tue Mar 31 17:44:26 2015
From: ALewis at nfb.org (Lewis, Anil)
Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2015 17:44:26 +0000
Subject: [nabs-l] FW: TILT Challenge! -- Film/Media Competition on Disability
Message-ID: <BLUPR0701MB1010C6ED82FD2BF53EE6B4D7C1F40@BLUPR0701MB1010.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>


From: Janice Majewski [mailto:janicemajewski at gmail.com<mailto:janicemajewski at gmail.com>]
Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2015 11:10 AM
Subject: TILT Challenge! -- Film/Media Competition on Disability

​Dear Advisory Committee Members:

Could you please share the following with your organizations, friends, and families?  We'd like to get as many young people submitting as possible.

Many thanks,
Jan

Janice Majewski
25th ADA / 40th VSA Project Coordinator
Office of VSA and Accessibility ​at the Kennedy Center
Accessibility Program at the Smithsonian Institution
571-245-4403<tel:571-245-4403> (cell)

TiLT Challenge! - Film/Media Competition on Disability

TiLT asks young artists and media makers (ages 13-22) to share their experiences with disability—in their own lives or in the lives of others—in an effort to shift, or tilt, society's perceptions of people with disabilities. Basically, to use their art form and storytelling capacity to re-frame the way people think about disability through evocative, honest stories. Submission deadline is May 15, 2015

More Info:  http://tiltchallenge.org/
Questions:  vsainfo at kennedy-center.org<mailto:vsainfo at kennedy-center.org> or (202) 416-8898<tel:%28202%29%20416-8898>

TiLT is a program of the Kennedy Center, Office of VSA and Accessibility



--
Rebecca (Becky) Ogle

From crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com  Tue Mar 31 18:12:48 2015
From: crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com (Kaiti Shelton)
Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2015 14:12:48 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Student orgs related to disability
Message-ID: <CAFja7FZerOSWx3E7SKrY_yvz4pEVyEwJsZsYpmFMDH4=jO2Ptg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all,

I am excited to report that after meeting another blind student on my
campus she and I are working to establish a student organization for
students with and without disabilities to discuss accessibility, raise
awareness of disability issues, etc.  We were particularly struck by
the fact that we would have never met had a professor we've both had
not thought to encourage both of us to join an ensemble this semester;
we have spent the past 2 and a half years of our college careers
separately thinking we were the only blind student on campus.  We have
since found out we were both in the same dorm building our freshman
year, and I even had a friend I visited frequently on her floor.
While we understand the need for the disability services staff to
maintain confidentiality, it was striking to find out that we were
experiencing the exact same problems on campus and because there
wasn't a united front nothing was being done to fix them.

We wondered if this was effecting anyone else on campus, so we
approached our DS office about faculty sponsorship for the
organization.  They agreed to it, but have let the other girl and I
spearhead things.  They're providing the space and possibly some light
refreshments for an info session in a few weeks.

We have a few ideas in mind for the club, but I'm interested in
getting input from other students.  We know we want to do some
outreach on campus and possibly form a fundraiser by selling something
to raise awareness of disability issues.  We know we'd like to
affiliate with Delta Alpha Pi, the international honors society for
students with disabilities.  Since she and I both have experience in
martial arts we'd also like to make a membership activity in the
future a self-defence workshop aimed towards people with disabilities.
Any other ideas?

-- 
Kaiti


From dmanners at jd16.law.harvard.edu  Tue Mar 31 18:26:45 2015
From: dmanners at jd16.law.harvard.edu (Derek Manners)
Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2015 14:26:45 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Student orgs related to disability
In-Reply-To: <CAFja7FZerOSWx3E7SKrY_yvz4pEVyEwJsZsYpmFMDH4=jO2Ptg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAFja7FZerOSWx3E7SKrY_yvz4pEVyEwJsZsYpmFMDH4=jO2Ptg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5BD64928-D228-44CE-BC73-80E86BD86E6C@jd16.law.harvard.edu>

One thing students are doing is meeting with the President and or Provost of colleges and telling them how they are doing good on accessibility and how they can improve. This is something the NABS board is actively trying to work with students to make happen. Let me know if this is something that interests you. 

Best wishes
Derek Manners
NABS board member

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 31, 2015, at 2:12 PM, Kaiti Shelton via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> I am excited to report that after meeting another blind student on my
> campus she and I are working to establish a student organization for
> students with and without disabilities to discuss accessibility, raise
> awareness of disability issues, etc.  We were particularly struck by
> the fact that we would have never met had a professor we've both had
> not thought to encourage both of us to join an ensemble this semester;
> we have spent the past 2 and a half years of our college careers
> separately thinking we were the only blind student on campus.  We have
> since found out we were both in the same dorm building our freshman
> year, and I even had a friend I visited frequently on her floor.
> While we understand the need for the disability services staff to
> maintain confidentiality, it was striking to find out that we were
> experiencing the exact same problems on campus and because there
> wasn't a united front nothing was being done to fix them.
> 
> We wondered if this was effecting anyone else on campus, so we
> approached our DS office about faculty sponsorship for the
> organization.  They agreed to it, but have let the other girl and I
> spearhead things.  They're providing the space and possibly some light
> refreshments for an info session in a few weeks.
> 
> We have a few ideas in mind for the club, but I'm interested in
> getting input from other students.  We know we want to do some
> outreach on campus and possibly form a fundraiser by selling something
> to raise awareness of disability issues.  We know we'd like to
> affiliate with Delta Alpha Pi, the international honors society for
> students with disabilities.  Since she and I both have experience in
> martial arts we'd also like to make a membership activity in the
> future a self-defence workshop aimed towards people with disabilities.
> Any other ideas?
> 
> -- 
> Kaiti
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dmanners%40jd16.law.harvard.edu


From zumbagecko at gmail.com  Tue Mar 31 19:13:35 2015
From: zumbagecko at gmail.com (petras)
Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2015 12:13:35 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] ibooks
Message-ID: <551af207.6684460a.3ad1.7259@mx.google.com>

Hi all, I am currently in a new science class and I need to use 
it tomorrow.  Can I access an ibooks file with my braillenote or 
is it accessible with my ipad?


From blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com  Tue Mar 31 19:24:33 2015
From: blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com (Aleeha Dudley)
Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2015 15:24:33 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] ibooks
In-Reply-To: <551af207.6684460a.3ad1.7259@mx.google.com>
References: <551af207.6684460a.3ad1.7259@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <2906329E-8A33-42EE-87D3-2E9AB89AE282@gmail.com>

iBooks are very accessible on the iPhone and iPad. You can pair your Braille note, if it is an apex, to your iPad with Bluetooth to read the information in braille. Please let me know if I can help in anyway.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 31, 2015, at 3:13 PM, petras via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi all, I am currently in a new science class and I need to use it tomorrow.  Can I access an ibooks file with my braillenote or is it accessible with my ipad?
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com


From zumbagecko at gmail.com  Tue Mar 31 19:30:10 2015
From: zumbagecko at gmail.com (petras)
Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2015 12:30:10 -0700
Subject: [nabs-l] ibooks
Message-ID: <551af5eb.6531460a.0cd6.ffffbe4f@mx.google.com>

How do I do search fields and how do I navigate with ibooks? I 
hardly use it.

 ----- Original Message -----
From: Aleeha Dudley <blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com
To: petras <zumbagecko at gmail.com>,National Association of Blind 
Students mailing list <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
Date sent: Tue, 31 Mar 2015 15:24:33 -0400
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] ibooks

iBooks are very accessible on the iPhone and iPad.  You can pair 
your Braille note, if it is an apex, to your iPad with Bluetooth 
to read the information in braille.  Please let me know if I can 
help in anyway.

Sent from my iPhone

 On Mar 31, 2015, at 3:13 PM, petras via nabs-l 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:

 Hi all, I am currently in a new science class and I need to use 
it tomorrow.  Can I access an ibooks file with my braillenote or 
is it accessible with my ipad?

 _______________________________________________
 nabs-l mailing list
 nabs-l at nfbnet.org
 http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
 To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
info for nabs-l:
 
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1
993%40gmail.com


From rbacchus228 at gmail.com  Tue Mar 31 23:29:26 2015
From: rbacchus228 at gmail.com (Roanna Bacchus)
Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2015 19:29:26 -0400
Subject: [nabs-l] Student orgs related to disability
Message-ID: <551b2deb.08668c0a.5ccb.0789@mx.google.com>

Hi Kaiti I think this is an excellent idea.  You could do an 
outreach on campus by oupering to braille greeting cards for the 
Christmas holidays during the Fall semester.