[nabs-l] my blog about my experiences at LCB

Fri Sep 11 19:05:32 UTC 2015

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Again, no matter how many examples you've provided about people
bridging the gap and roasting marshmallows, my point still stands. I
honestly do not fully understand all of what ACB is doing as
legislation is not my cup of tea, but regardless of what they've
opposed and not opposed, my views should not count as lesser. It's a
great way to sweep the problem under the rug by yelling "Hey look,
he's a member of the ACB! Lets burn crosses because they opposed this
act." That's not really the point and everything you've said shows
you've missed that. I'm more than happy to have meaningful discussions
with anyone and honestly I don't really care which organization
someone is from as long as said discussions can take place. But when
my views are attacked or I am required to note that I'm from ACB so I
can get branded with the "They opposed this act," I think we have a
problem.

The fact is, as much as you and Carlos want to deny the point, I
applied for a summer job in a position which I was qualified for. The
interview went great until we got on the subject of dogs, at which
point I had to deal with many pointed questions about whether or not
I'd be able to leave my dog in the room. Now, I'm no lawyer, but I
think said pointed questions probably violates the ADA. Perhaps rather
than discrediting my points because I'm with the ACB attention should
be drawn back to this point.
On 9/11/2015 2:22 PM, Derek Manners via nabs-l wrote:
> I don't want to belabor the point but I want to make sure Tyler,
> Minh, and others understand what I'm saying.
> 
> There's a difference between tone and substance. Tone wise, Tyler,
> you have a propensity for saying things in a disagreeable way that
> is unhelpful. For example: "I find it rather amusing",
> "discriminate" (spelling corrected) so hard, "first to scream", and
> "drink the Cool-Aid" are all fairly inflammatorily tinged words and
> phrases.
> 
> The reason I say you should disclose your affiliation is because
> you mislead folks when you say stuff like, "We're the first to ask
> for equal access..."  I don't care that you are a member of ACB. I
> just think your comments shouldn't be read as someone who typically
> agrees with NFB philosophy giving advice to other NFB members, it
> should be read as someone who belongs to an organization that
> apposes the TEACH Act comprise, Maryland's online Accessible voting
> initiative, etc.
> 
> As to the actual substantive disagreement part of your email, I
> don't think it's discrimination to ask you to practice what we
> preach in a very controlled environment meant to foster learning
> even though we'd never ask you to do that in any other setting.
> There are plenty of guide dog users in our organization. One of my
> best friends in our movement is assistant to President Riccabono
> and she brings her dog to work everyday at the national office.
> 
> Finally, I don't have any issue with Tyler or anyone else on the
> ACB board. I consider Sara Whiles a good friend (she is also on the
> ACB board) and I know our student president in Massachusetts is
> close with the MA ACB student president etc. I was friends with
> Kate when she was ACB treasurer. I've also privately messaged Tyler
> and expressed interest in getting to know him and you (Minh) better
> since we all live in the same area and you guys are roommates.
> 
> As someone with an economics background, I encourage open
> discussion of all training centers; the good, the bad, and the
> ugly. People should be able to make an informed decision. I just
> think we should do it civilly and let people know what are biases
> are and not misrepresent ourselves as something we are not.
> 
> Best regards Derek Manners
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Sep 11, 2015, at 1:49 PM, minh ha via nabs-l
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Organizational differences aside, I'm honestly disappointed that 
>> members of this list cannot express negative opinions without
>> being branded as disagreeable and as someone who is actively
>> working against the NFB. Everybody is entitled to their opinions,
>> and other people have expressed displeasure at how they have been
>> treated by the NFB training centers, and yet, only Tyler have
>> been targeted by you and Katherine on list for his messages. This
>> has been a recurring problem from what I have seen, and if I
>> didn't know any better, I would say you and Katherine have a
>> personal issue with Tyler since he is on ACBS's board. And quite
>> frankly, organizational affiliation doesn't even have any
>> relevance in this conversation when it comes to being 
>> discriminated by the NFB.
>> 
>> Minh
>> 
>>> On 9/11/15, Derek Manners via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> wrote: Hello all, mostly Kate, Tyler, and Hope.
>>> 
>>> First,  I agree that Kate should not try to shut down negative
>>> opinions. However, I think Kate did a poor job of articulating
>>> what she meant when she expressed disapproval of Tyler's
>>> message. Her problem with it, I assume, is the tone. You can
>>> disagree without being disagreeable and unfortunately Tyler has
>>> shown a propensity to be disagreeable, specifically to Kate
>>> during her campaign announcement which he later apologized
>>> for.
>>> 
>>> Second, the NFB training centers have a certain philosophy when
>>> it comes to guide dogs. I think of it as being a similar
>>> philosophy as to why my cousin taught me how to drive a car
>>> even though I can't legally drive one. 1. There may come a time
>>> when I'd need to and there may come a time in a guide dog 
>>> user's life when they need to use a cane over a dog and being
>>> versed in both is important if you are a dog user. Second,
>>> there are lessons that came travel teach you about mobility
>>> with regard to structured discovery that are important when
>>> using a cane or a dog.
>>> 
>>> As to the computer training, I know for a fact that LCB gives
>>> advanced instruction to those who need it. Specifically, my
>>> friends Kate Webster and Syed Rizvi have gotten/will be getting
>>> training on coding as a blind person. Talking to a trainer
>>> informally who may or may not know what they are talking about
>>> is quite different than working out a formal plan through voc 
>>> rehab and the center.
>>> 
>>> Finally, Tyler, you really ought to disclose to folks when you
>>> are talking about your philosophical views about the NFB that
>>> you are on the ACB student board and that ACB routinely
>>> publicly criticizes NFB and our philosophy. Your opinions are
>>> not those of someone who normally agrees with NFB philosophy
>>> who is pointing out a minor difference, you are someone who,
>>> in certain instances, works against our legislative efforts,
>>> our philosophical message, and actively tries to influence
>>> state agencies that we are wrong and your organization is
>>> right.
>>> 
>>> You can obviously post anything you like and I think it's
>>> healthy to debate philosophical differences. But you should do
>>> it in an agreeable tone and you should fully disclose your
>>> elected position.
>>> 
>>> Best regards Derek Manners
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>> On Sep 11, 2015, at 12:48 PM, Carlos Montas via nabs-l
>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> I would say that is why you have consumer choice as to what
>>>> kind of rehabilitation center you would like to attend.  That
>>>> is the wonderful thing about America the freedom of choice.
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>> 
>>>>> On Sep 11, 2015, at 8:40 AM, Hope Paulos via nabs-l
>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> I have to chime in here.  I also have a dog and won't
>>>>> attend a training center because I can't use him. I
>>>>> understand not being able to use them for travel classes,
>>>>> that makes sense, but not being able to use him for 
>>>>> cooking, shop, and braille classes? I am also put off by
>>>>> the arrogance of some of the NFB center instructors. I was
>>>>> working the booth as a trainer at the convention for an
>>>>> assistive technology company.  A center instructor came up
>>>>> wanting to look at some of the products we had on display.
>>>>> I showed them the products, and then proceeded to ask them
>>>>> a question. Because I have a graduate certificate in
>>>>> assistive technology, as well as a graduate certificate in
>>>>> technical support, I wanted to know if my technology
>>>>> classes would be tailored to my advanced needs. The 
>>>>> instructor proceeded to laugh at me, and told me "graduate
>>>>> certificate or not, you will go through the same class as
>>>>> everyone else, starting with keyboarding." My colleague,
>>>>> who was sitting beside me, and I were shocked at this
>>>>> person's attitude… keep in mind, I am a trainer for an
>>>>> assistive technology company, and I have to start with
>>>>> keyboarding? I also have a bachelors degree in education…
>>>>> The first thing that you learned about teaching is that
>>>>> everybody learns differently, and everybody is on different
>>>>> levels… Education cannot be "One-size-fits-all."
>>>>> Unfortunately, this seems to be the philosophy of the NFB
>>>>> centers. Sorry for the rant! On a more positive note, I
>>>>> look forward to reading your blog, and hope that you have A
>>>>> wonderful time and learn a lot.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Hope Paulos
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Sep 11, 2015, at 8:29 AM, Littlefield, Tyler via
>>>>>> nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>> 
> I was going to ask about your experience with a dog, given the name
> of your blog. I find it rather amusing that NFB-associated centers 
> discrimenate so hard against dogs, yet they're the first to scream 
> discrimenation. I was not hired to a program last summer and it
> was mostly because I didn't answer the rather pointed questions
> about what I would do with my dog (like if he could stay in a room)
> for classes, quite the way they wanted. There I think my hope in
> the NFB, at least what remained of it shattered to pieces. We're
> the first to ask for equal access, yet equal access is not provided
> unless you have a straight white cane and drink the Cool-Aid.
>>>>>>>> On 9/11/2015 8:17 AM, Aleeha Dudley via nabs-l
>>>>>>>> wrote: Hey all, If you’d like to read about my
>>>>>>>> experiences at LCB, here is a link to my blog.
>>>>>>>> http://4pawsatmyside.wordpress.com 
>>>>>>>> <http://4pawsatmyside.wordpress.com/> I will be
>>>>>>>> detailing my experiences in class, as well as those
>>>>>>>> with my guide dog, Dallas, especially given the
>>>>>>>> center’s policies about guide dogs. I apologize if
>>>>>>>> this is off topic for the list. Feel free to write
>>>>>>>> me off list with questions. Aleeha Dudley 
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 
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>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> 
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- -- 
>> Minh Ha Boston College | Lynch School of Education '16 
>> minh.ha927 at gmail.com
>> 
>> "All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in the
>> dusty recesses of their minds, wake in the day to find that it
>> was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for
>> they may act on their dreams with open eyes, to make them
>> possible." T. E. Lawrence
>> 
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- -- 
Take care,
Ty
twitter: @sorressean
web:http://tysdomain.com
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