[nabs-l] Joining local chapters

[Ashley Bramlett]

Kaiti,

I think your concerns are valid and it’s a challenge to  balance all 
commitments.
I think its unfortunate that some chapters are pushy. Some chapters and some 
presidents take an all or nothing approach.
This turns people away from joining, or if they join and take leadership 
roles, they get burned out later on.
I think its unreasonable for someone to expect you to drop other life 
commitments to volunteer to do chapter work.

I think I'd stick with the more open chapter that allows you to come
when you can. As for the other chapter, I'd just stay firm in your position. 
State that while you like the NFB and support it, you have homework to 
complete and other extra curricular obligations and your schedule does not 
permit you to join at this time.

I hope things work out for you!

Ashley
-----Original Message----- 
From: Kaiti Shelton via nabs-l
Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2015 11:57 PM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Cc: Kaiti Shelton
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Joining local chapters

Hi all,

First, I'll start by addressing what seems to be the more heated part
of the discussion since earlier today.  When I said that this wasn't
the NFB way I knew, I really did mean it.  I've never really had a bad
experience like this so far.  My affiliate welcomed me in with open
arms as a scholarship winner in 2012 and I haven't turned back since.
I am currently a dues-paid member of the Cincinnati chapter, but
haven't found it very easy to attend chapter meetings there either.
They were the chapter with the "come when you can" attitude I
mentioned in my first post, actually.  I do go to chapter metings when
I am home and able to go, and I even participated in the
Braille-a-thon event they had this summer which was a blend of
fundraising and advocacy in the community.  For a long time I have
been encouraged to be a dues-paid member of both chapters, though I
have had a little more success with Cincinnati than Dayton so that is
why I paid there.  Nevertheless, I wouldn't consider myself an "active
member."  The one good thing about that chapter, though I don't know
much of the internal politics and how they run having only attended
meetings here and there, is that they are accepting of my other
responsibilities and are willing to still let me participate as I am
able.  The other chapter has never turned me away from something, but
they've had a different attitude when I decline to do things.  I've
had wonderful experiences with the NFB at the national level and in
many other capacities through divisions and the like, so I do not
think negative experiences can be generalized; however, I can
understand that particular chapters might have negative impacts on
individuals and leave a sour taste for the organization at times.

I'll see what happens, and if the other two I know are even interested
in joining the chapter.  Timing is definitely going to be the hot
issue.  I also recognize that while I'm the type of person who will
get up early on Saturdays (I usually do grocery runs around 8:00 to
beat the crowds), not everyone would want to do that depending on
their location in relation to the meeting place notwithstanding those
older folks who are already in the chapter.

At this point I'm a little frustrated so I'm not sure I want to do
anything with the chapter for now.  That could change and it probably
will, but for now I don't really want to do any committee work or
organizing beyond what I'm already doing.  Though it is not affiliated
with the NFB a group another student and I established on my campus
for disability awareness is going to do some of the same types of
things on a general scope for all disabilities, like host an
accessible movie night for the community where we show a described
movie with sign language interpretation for the deaf, and simulations
which are carefully planned to teach others about disabilities with
positive interactions with disabled people (we actually are using
Arielle's recent Braille Monitor article as a reference for those).
I'm treasurer and in charge of fundraising for that club, so possibly
that could be where I do some good work that will be helpful once I am
able to transition into chapter life.  I'll still try to attend events
when I can and work out things with the president so that hopefully he
understands where the disconnect is, but I'm not in a position to
start something new this semester in terms of a braille club or
something.

On 9/20/15, Darian Smith via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Kaiti and all,
>
>   I like the ideas that are coming out of this  thread.
>   I would most certainly agree that, there isn’t one way to go about most
> anything in the NFB (at least from what I’ve seen.
>  I like Arielle’s suggestions on how to work with  the chapter without 
> being
> on a board and think that your thoughts and  ideas are valuable no matter
> how your involvement might come  about...
>   Have you been able to find out the reasoning behind  the  meeting time
> being what it is and the willingness of chapter members to consider a
> change.
>  I may have touched on this earlier on in the week but sometimes  it isn’t
> the easiest thing in the world for a chapter president to propose a
> alternative meeting time that fits the schedules of the members and the
> officers.  It might  even pose it’s own difficulties when establishing an
> appropriate meeting location.
> If enough people would benefit from the change in time and a suitable
> location /time can be suggested that might help things.
>  Basically I just want to bring in a different point of view  for the sake
> of this discussion.
>   Darian  .
>        .
>
>> On Sep 20, 2015, at 5:15 PM, David Andrews via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>> I would urge people to not make generalizations.  Because one chapter 
>> does
>> something a certain way, it doesn't necessarily mean that this is the 
>> "NFB
>> way."
>>
>> Dave
>>
>> At 04:54 PM 9/20/2015, you wrote:
>>> Hello Kaiti,
>>>
>>> I am sorry to hear you are having so much trouble connecting with a 
>>> local
>>> chapter. The all or nothing approach to being involved with the NFB is
>>> one
>>> of the things I do not like about the organization. In this second 
>>> email,
>>> you state this is not the NFB you know because you believe it is
>>> important
>>> for other members and chapter leaders to show other people they care
>>> about
>>> them as people in all situations of their lives as members of the
>>> organization. Perhaps this is not the NFB you know, but it is definitely
>>> the
>>> NFB I know, so it really does not surprise me to hear you have been
>>> treated
>>> this way.
>>>
>>> I think others have already given you some great suggestions as to how 
>>> to
>>> go
>>> about handling this situation. I agree with what has already been said,
>>> so I
>>> will not repeat it. However, I do have some other suggestions for you.
>>>
>>> If you are not able to attend the chapter meetings on a regular basis, 
>>> is
>>> there any way you could get involved in the chapter by serving on a
>>> committee that meets at a different time? I know for our chapter, we
>>> usually
>>> have a committee who help plan and organize the chapter summer picnic 
>>> and
>>> the holiday Christmas party. Perhaps you could serve on such a committee
>>> even if you are not able to attend the event, or perhaps serving on such
>>> a
>>> committee would make the chapter President more open to changing the 
>>> time
>>> and date of the event so you could attend it.
>>>
>>> Also, I have heard of some chapters holding Braille club meetings that
>>> take
>>> place at a different date and time than the regular chapter meetings.
>>> Perhaps you could start something like this to compliment the regular
>>> chapter meetings providing your schedule and other time commitments 
>>> would
>>> allow you to do something like this. Our chapter meetings are more
>>> businesslike, so lately we have been thinking of things we could do as a
>>> chapter in a more relaxed environment to get to know each other better.
>>> So
>>> perhaps you could organize something fun like a game night where chapter
>>> members could play various card games and board games. Or you could
>>> organize
>>> something more like a Braille club meeting, book club meeting, or NFB
>>> philosophy discussions if you are more interested in having a more
>>> tailored
>>> discussion about blindness or the NFB.
>>>
>>> I hope this email provides you with some more options regarding how you
>>> might be able to get involved with a local chapter even if you are not
>>> able
>>> to attend chapter meetings on a regular basis. However, I think it is
>>> perfectly fine for you not to be involved with a local chapter if it 
>>> does
>>> not fit into your schedule. Other members of the chapter may encourage
>>> you
>>> to become more involved with the chapter, but whether or not they make
>>> you
>>> feel guilty about the fact that you are not able to be involved because
>>> of
>>> your schedule is up to you and not them. It is not selfish to put
>>> yourself
>>> first because we are not able to be there for others if we do not look
>>> after
>>> ourselves first.
>>>
>>> Warm regards,
>>> Elizabeth
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti
>>> Shelton
>>> via nabs-l
>>> Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2015 4:07 PM
>>> To: jsoro620 at gmail.com; National Association of Blind Students mailing
>>> list
>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> Cc: Kaiti Shelton <crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com>
>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Joining local chapters
>>>
>>> Thanks all for your comments.  I've hung back since my initial post to
>>> see
>>> what would come from this thread, and it has been well-worth it.
>>>
>>> I do recognize that the chapter president has tried to be as
>>> accommodating
>>> as he can for the current chapter members, and especially as I would be
>>> the
>>> new person coming in I can't expect them to shift meetings around to 
>>> suit
>>> my
>>> individual schedule, but I do think the current time could be
>>> problematic.
>>> The president keeps saying, "You should join because we want more
>>> students
>>> like you in the chapter," but if that is the case most of the people 
>>> he'd
>>> be
>>> looking at are pretty busy with extracurriculars on the weekends.
>>>
>>> I remember last December durring my finals week I got a call around
>>> 9:00 in the morning from one of the chapter board members asking if I
>>> would
>>> be attending the spaghetti dinner I mentioned before.  I told her it
>>> coincided with an exam I had that night starting at 5:00 (it was a night
>>> class).  She said, "But we have a board position up for grabs," like she
>>> was
>>> trying to entice me to coming in even though I had a *final exam* in a
>>> class
>>> that I couldn't miss.  That's the kind of thing that happens; they want
>>> me
>>> to drop everything for the chapter, and while the chapter is important I
>>> am
>>> not prepared or willing to do that.  The same happens when I tell the
>>> president that I can't attend October's meeting, or the January 
>>> meetings,
>>> because I will be home in Cincinnati with my family.  I'm not going to 
>>> go
>>> home and have my family drive me back to Dayton for the meeting because
>>> we
>>> wouldn't be able to go back home again, and I'd like to take my midterm
>>> breaks like every other student does.  That situation is a bit different
>>> because in theory I could stay at my house on campus for the rest of
>>> break,
>>> but I'd be giving up at least 2 days that I could spend with family when
>>> I
>>> don't go home much over the semester to begin with.
>>> This is precisely why I can't attend October's meeting this year; it
>>> falls
>>> on the Saturday that is durring our fall break.
>>>
>>> There are a ton of blind students who attend the other university in the
>>> area, but I don't know who they are.  I've tried reaching out to
>>> disability
>>> services staff to circulate information on the student division and have
>>> been unsuccessful in reaching anyone from the school.  I know a grand
>>> total
>>> of 3 other blind people in their twenties in the area; 2 are already in
>>> contact with the chapter president, and the other is affiliated with 
>>> ACB.
>>> Furthermore on the other college issue, the chapter president has said
>>> before that he wanted to collaborate with me to put on some information
>>> session at the other college to see if the blind students would come out
>>> to
>>> hear about the chapter, the student division, and have free pizza or
>>> something.  I started by trying to contact people who could help set 
>>> that
>>> up
>>> at the school, but I haven't heard anything more from him on it.  It
>>> makes
>>> telling whether or not he wants students in the chapter very confusing.
>>>
>>> I know personally week nights would work better for me, or Saturdays
>>> earlier
>>> in the day.  I'm also able to do almost anything on Sundays, though that
>>> could be problematic with people who want to go to church.
>>> I'd much rather get up early and go to a 9:00 AM chapter meeting because
>>> A
>>> it's free in my schedule, and B it's earlier in the day so I can still
>>> get
>>> things done like grocery runs and things of that nature.
>>> There really isn't a good way to pole what would work better for 
>>> students
>>> as
>>> a collective, though.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I'm very interested in the deeper issue Arielle singled out in her
>>> message,
>>> because that really is the route of the problem.  Perhaps it has to do a
>>> little bit with the tone of the ways I have been asked to come to 
>>> chapter
>>> meetings and how I feel there is a disregard for student life going on
>>> (someone else mentioned that disconnect between the older and younger
>>> generations as well), but I feel from the chapter that I am being
>>> pressured
>>> to choose between student life, which is limitted at this point, and
>>> joining
>>> the NFB.  In frustration I've said no to the chapter to this point
>>> because
>>> with the student division in Ohio and affiliate projects I feel like I'm
>>> getting the best of both worlds.  I don't feel like using a board
>>> position
>>> to try to entice a student to the meetings when they are upfront about
>>> having to take a final exam is very good, nor is the backlash I have 
>>> been
>>> getting when I say, "This happens on the same weekend as fall break, "
>>> or "My fraternity is initiating new members today and attendance is
>>> mandatory by all chapter members/I'm a part of the ritual."  Or, "It's
>>> Christmas break and I'm not in Dayton right now."
>>>
>>> The one thing that does puzzle me is along the lines of what Darian was
>>> saying.  It is possible that the chapter president has gotten excuses
>>> from
>>> students before, but if you hear the same "excuses" over and over again 
>>> I
>>> would think that, especially if they come from different people 
>>> including
>>> those who already support the Federation, they might be legitimate
>>> conflicts
>>> with chapter meetings that I would examine further to allow for the
>>> younger
>>> generation to better attend.
>>> If he were to ask more questions to get a better answer he might not be
>>> so
>>> disconnected.  Right now it just seems like he's only concerned for the
>>> chapter, not the potential members who would be joining.
>>> That's not the NFB I know at all.  Without members we do not have
>>> chapters,
>>> so it is important to show that we care about each other as people in
>>> different life situations in order to foster a sense of community within
>>> the
>>> chapter organizations.
>>>
>>> I might mention this to my state president, but at this point it's not 
>>> my
>>> top priority.  Now that I have a better sense of how to handle it I 
>>> don't
>>> feel a rush to do so.  I can't attend at least the October and the
>>> December
>>> meetings anyway, so this semester is pretty much a wash to begin with.
>>>
>>> On 9/18/15, Joe via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>> > Kaiti,
>>> >
>>> > I experienced something similar. Now as a working professional, my
>>> > time is very limited, but I wanted to get back into the Federation on
>>> > a limited basis, at least to start. I was hoping to write grants or do
>>> > marketing for my affiliate. Unfortunately the president's larger
>>> > priority was me organizing a chapter in my local area, and flattered
>>> > though I was to be considered for the task, I knew I did not have the
>>> > time to commit to get the job done right. Could I gather a group of
>>> > prospective members? Yes. Could I whip them into a self-sustained
>>> > group that would last beyond the first two or three meetings? Not
>>> > likely. Like others have pointed out, finding the perfect meeting time
>>> > for a chapter meeting is a difficult task, but a good leader at any
>>> > level of the organization would maximize the assistance anyone could
>>> > contribute, whether it be in person or remotely, once a week or once a
>>> > month. I'm going to sound like my own former state affiliate president
>>> > here, but another option worth considering is organizing a student
>>> > group on campus that would give you the flexibility to set a time that
>>> > is both convenient and a location that is accessible for you guys.
>>> > Alternatively, perhaps there is a chapter at-large in your affiliate
>>> > that would allow you to remain connected and involved in some
>>> > capacity. Either way, I think it commendable of you to be concerned
>>> > enough to want to know how to stay active in the organization. My
>>> > final thought is that you could be at a season in your life where NABS
>>> > is sufficient given your current schedule. It would be great if
>>> > everyone could sacrifice time and energy for the NFB, but then, we'd
>>> > be sacrificing the opportunities of accomplishment we're advocating
>>> > for. If pressed to choose between attending a meeting or being a
>>> > productive contributor to my community at-large, I'd choose the
>>> > second. That seems a bit blunt, but that's part of the ongoing
>>> > disconnect between the older generation and the younger membership.
>>> >
>>> > Joe
>>> >
>>> > --
>>> > Musings of a Work in Progress:
>>> > www.JoeOrozco.com/
>>> >
>>> > Twitter: @ScribblingJoe
>>> >
>>> > -----Original Message-----
>>> > From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kaiti
>>> > Shelton via nabs-l
>>> > Sent: Friday, September 18, 2015 3:41 AM
>>> > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>> > Cc: Kaiti Shelton
>>> > Subject: [nabs-l] Joining local chapters
>>> >
>>> > Hi all,
>>> >
>>> > I realize this thread may very well spark some debate, but I'm
>>> > prepared for that.  For the past two years I've had a dilemma and I'm
>>> > trying to explain it to a chapter president in my affiliate.  I live
>>> > in one city and attend school in another, so there off the bat is no
>>> > way I'd be able to attend either chapter's meetings on a monthly basis
>>> > as
>>> I would like to do.
>>> > Chapter
>>> > presidents in both cities at different times have told me I should
>>> > join and even consider running for a board position, which I will not
>>> > do because of my inability to faithfully attend the meetings.  One of
>>> > the two chapters gets this a little better than the other now, and has
>>> > pretty much given me a "come when you can, we'd love to have you when
>>> > we can get you here,"
>>> > reception.
>>> > The other chapter is near where I go to school, but the chapter
>>> > president doesn't seem to get the student thing.  I try to go to
>>> > things when I can, but I partially dread it because every time I
>>> > attend some social function the floodgates for this conversation are
>>> > opened again.  I'm told again that I am needed in the chapter, that I
>>> > can really make a difference, and if I join more students will join
>>> > and the chapter is not by any means comprised of young people.
>>> >
>>> > This has been happening for two years at least, and I feel a little
>>> > confused and pressured to join.  I know he is doing his job as a
>>> > chapter president, especially because he knows I'm active and
>>> > dedicated to the student division, the affiliate, and other projects
>>> > in the NFB, but being in that older crowd I don't think he understands
>>> > what it is like for students anymore.  In my sophomore year I had
>>> > difficulty attending chapter meetings for a few reasons.  One was that
>>> > they are on the first Saturday or the month, which conflicts with
>>> > nearly every break from school I have including the two midterm breaks
>>> > and the Christmas break.  The Christmas spaghetti dinner is also
>>> > something the chapter tries to get me to come to, but it is always
>>> > scheduled durring my finals week.  When I worked on Saturdays at a
>>> > part time job my sophomore year they wanted me to take off work to
>>> > attend chapter meetings.  At the time that was my grocery money, so
>>> > giving work wasn't something I was willing to do; I wanted to pick up
>>> > extra hours, not throw them away.  I also have been in a professional
>>> > music fraternity since the spring semester of my Freshman year, and a
>>> > lot of our major events (recruitment events, initiations and pledging
>>> > ceremonies, etc) happen on Saturdays.  With the chapter meetings
>>> > scheduled from 1:00-3:00 PM, not to mention the location is subject to
>>> > change from place to place so students can't plan for consistency, I
>>> > have
>>> had difficulty in getting there.
>>> >
>>> > I've emailed the chapter president a few times about how there is a
>>> > double-standard here.  He wants new blood in the chapter, but when I
>>> > tell him it is very difficult to add in chapter meetings when the time
>>> > isn't very accessible to me he thumbs his nose and tells me I should
>>> > cancel work or do what it takes to come to chapter meetings because it
>>> > would benefit the chapter.  I try to explain to him that while I do
>>> > understand personal sacrifices can and should be made to an extent,
>>> > students do not have as much flexibility as working people to move
>>> > classes around in the week, and there are only so many hours in the
>>> > weekend.  Not to mention extracurriculars are a good thing for blind
>>> > students to be involved in because it shows peers that we can be
>>> > engaged and active in the same ways as they are.  It also creates
>>> > networking opportunities and even job prospects after graduation as
>>> > long as the extracurriculars are not merely social in nature, which
>>> > mine are not.  I want to join the local chapter nearby, but I also
>>> > want to experience life as a student too in the year or so I have left
>>> > of undergrad.
>>> >
>>> > I don't think this makes me a lazy Federationist as I have found ways
>>> > to be active in divisions and in the affiliate outside of chapters,
>>> > and I would venture to guess that 1:00-3:00 PM on a Saturday probably
>>> > isn't great for most students since it's right in the middle of the
>>> > day.  I did not send the email I drafted, but I feel like if the
>>> > chapter needs and wants students to join as badly as they say they do,
>>> > they need to make the meeting time more accessible to that group of
>>> > people.  Right now I know it is not for me, and I think that is also
>>> > the case for other highly-involved and motivated students who the
>>> > president would like to see join the chapter.
>>> >
>>> > Thoughts?  I personally don't think I'm fully in the wrong here, but I
>>> > am open to anything at this point. I really would join the local
>>> > chapter if it were held at times that I could consistently attend.
>>> > Right now I'm able to make it to a scattered couple of social events
>>> > outside of the regular meeting times, but that's about it.  I've
>>> > prooven to be involved in the affiliate on committees and in other
>>> > projects including BELL, but right now I feel like joining either of
>>> > these chapters isn't a possibility for me and I'm not appreciating the
>>> > push-back for my reasons why.  It's not that I'm making excuses or
>>> > because I don't want to go; I think work conflicts and required
>>> > fraternity events which I will only be able to have for a year longer
>>> > tops are acceptable reasons to be absent, not to mention that when I'm
>>> > home traveling an hour to the meeting and then another hour back home
>>> > 2 hours later is a bit much to ask.  I suppose my logic is that I am
>>> > already a Federationist and I can join a chapter when the time is
>>> > right for me to do so, and by that I mean when I can actively
>>> > contribute in a stable and dedicated way.  That will most likely come
>>> > when I have a 40 hour work week like the rest of the current chapter
>>> > if they don't take their desire for student members and what is
>>> > accessible to them into consideration.
>>> > --
>>> > Kaiti Shelton
>>> > University of Dayton-Music Therapy
>>> > President, Ohio Association of Blind Students 2013-Present Secretary,
>>> > The National Federation of the Blind Performing Arts Division
>>> > 2015-2016
>>> >
>>> > "You can live the life you want; blindness is not what holds you 
>>> > back!"
>>> >
>>> > _______________________________________________
>>> > nabs-l mailing list
>>> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> > nabs-l:
>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jsoro620%40gmail.c
>>> > om
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > _______________________________________________
>>> > nabs-l mailing list
>>> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> > nabs-l:
>>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%
>>> > 40gmail.com
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Kaiti Shelton
>>> University of Dayton-Music Therapy
>>> President, Ohio Association of Blind Students 2013-Present Secretary, 
>>> The
>>> National Federation of the Blind Performing Arts Division 2015-2016
>>
>>        David Andrews and long white cane Harry.
>> E-Mail:  dandrews at visi.com or david.andrews at nfbnet.org
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/crazy4clarinet104%40gmail.com
>


-- 
Kaiti Shelton
University of Dayton-Music Therapy
President, Ohio Association of Blind Students 2013-Present
Secretary, The National Federation of the Blind Performing Arts
Division 2015-2016

"You can live the life you want; blindness is not what holds you back!"

_______________________________________________
nabs-l mailing list
nabs-l at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
nabs-l:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net