[nabs-l] struggling with Math

annajee82 at gmail.com annajee82 at gmail.com
Sun Aug 28 19:36:21 UTC 2016 

Kayla,
If you are having trouble doing the math on your braille note, perhaps using a Perkins brailler would work better?  
I'm not sure exactly what specific difficulty you are having, but it would certainly be easier for me to use the Perkins over a one line display. 
As far as a scanner for your book. Well the scanner shouldn't matter.  But the OCR may or may not pick up symbols.  With basic algebra it might do fine.  You could try it and see how it goes.  And if there are problems someone in your school's disability office should be able to edit it using the print copy of the book.  
My suggestion for now would be to use a tutor and a reader.  These are excellent options, especially while you are trying to figure out how you want to access your textbook.  
How have you accessed your math books in the past?
Please let me know if you have more questions. 

Anna E Givens


> On Aug 28, 2016, at 12:39 PM, Kayla James via NABS-L <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> I know how to write in Nemeth. It's just trying to do it on my Apex is
> a bit difficult. It's an Elementary/Intermediate Algebra class.
> 
> On 8/28/16, KENNEDY STOMBERG via NABS-L <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> Actually, it is perfect that Steve responded! Because he was the resource I
>> was going to Point you too. He mentioned the NFB math list on NFB.net. That
>> is definitely a good resource. And they might have more answers to the
>> questions you're looking for. If you were trying to learn the basics of
>> Nemith,I believe there are some cheat sheets out there that you can use this
>> for specific math symbols. Can you tell me what type of math class you're
>> taking? Is it algebra? Geometry? If you let me know, I might be able to find
>> something for you for learning Nemith.
>> 
>> Kennedy Stomberg
>> (218)295-2391
>> 
>>> On Aug 28, 2016, at 10:59 AM, Kayla James via NABS-L <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> I am already in the Math class. It's my first college Math class and
>>> my first one without Braille books and tactile aids. I only intend to
>>> take any minimum required Math. Disability services said I'd get a
>>> note taker, but they don't do readers for textbooks. So far, I've used
>>> the scanner and WindowEyes at school to scan my work this week. School
>>> started last Monday.
>>> 
>>>> On 8/28/16, Steve Jacobson via NABS-L <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>> Kayla,
>>>> 
>>>> I majored in math many years ago before we had much of the current
>>>> technology, but my interest in math has continued so I try to remain
>>>> current.  I say this partly to let you know that blind people can do
>>>> math
>>>> and also to make the point that one sometimes has to look at all
>>>> options,
>>>> technical and nontechnical.
>>>> 
>>>> Are you interested in math in a way that will cause you to take a lot of
>>>> classes, or is your goal going to be to just get through the minimum
>>>> requirements?  That will affect how you go about addressing this.
>>>> 
>>>> First, to answer your specific question, it isn't the scanner that needs
>>>> to
>>>> be able to deal with math, rather it is the OCR software.  There is a
>>>> product for scanning math but it is quite expensive, and it doesn't just
>>>> magically give you a perfectly accessible textbook.  From what I have
>>>> heard,
>>>> it is sometimes necessary to use that product together with other OCR
>>>> products to get one accessible copy because other products recognize
>>>> text
>>>> better.  In addition, there are issues of how to display math so that it
>>>> can
>>>> be read by a screen reader and/or a Braille Note.  All of this can be
>>>> done,
>>>> and people who are heavily involved in math do this successfully. There
>>>> is
>>>> a mathematical typesetting language called Latex, and many people learn
>>>> to
>>>> read that language directly and can get copies of math tests that way
>>>> from
>>>> publishers, and some of us have learned to write LATEX to create
>>>> printouts.
>>>> .  There is something called MATHML that can be made to be accessible.
>>>> I
>>>> am
>>>> purposely not going into more detail because I don't think that will
>>>> help
>>>> right now, but I want you to know why it matters how interested you are
>>>> in
>>>> math.  We even have a separate list called BlindMath on NFBNET where
>>>> math
>>>> professionals deal with a lot of these topics.
>>>> 
>>>> Having said all of this, what does this mean for you right now?  Are you
>>>> working with a disabled Students' office on your campus?  What has
>>>> already
>>>> been done to find out what is available for you?  How are your braille
>>>> skills in general?  I would caution you against feeling you have to
>>>> master
>>>> the entire Nemeth Code to take a required math course, it would work
>>>> better
>>>> to learn the basics and then what you need as you go.  Although it
>>>> probably
>>>> isn't a preferred approach, it is possible to learn math by working with
>>>> a
>>>> reader or even a audio recording if it is done well.  Learning to
>>>> interact
>>>> with someone to read the text might be a better short term solution
>>>> rather
>>>> than trying to understand some of the processes I mentioned above.  With
>>>> a
>>>> little lead time, there are places that might be able to braille or scan
>>>> your math books if you are almost ready to start a math course.  In that
>>>> approach, knowing enough Nemeth Code so you can take some notes for
>>>> reviewing later will help very much.  Getting math books in braille can
>>>> be
>>>> done with some lead time.  This is getting harder to have done, though,
>>>> but
>>>> your Disabled Students' Office or even your state agency may know
>>>> whether
>>>> there are any agencies that you can work with.  If you are going to
>>>> start
>>>> your first math class in a week but have no idea how to handle the
>>>> textbooks, you might need to find a way to put off taking your math
>>>> course
>>>> so you can investigate some of this.
>>>> 
>>>> It is very natural to be scared of facing something new, and I know what
>>>> I
>>>> have written here probably doesn't make you feel much better.  However,
>>>> it
>>>> can be done, and I and others can make better suggestions if we know
>>>> more
>>>> about what you've already done and how interested you are going to be in
>>>> mathematics.
>>>> 
>>>> Best regards,
>>>> 
>>>> Steve Jacobson
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: NABS-L [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kayla James
>>>> via
>>>> NABS-L
>>>> Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2016 11:23 PM
>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Cc: Kayla James <christgirl813 at gmail.com>
>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] struggling with Math
>>>> 
>>>> Hello, everyone,
>>>> I'm struggling in Math a little. Does any know of scanners that can
>>>> scan textbooks and pick up the Math symbols?
>>>> I have a BrailleNote Apex. I'm still trying to work out the Nemeth code.
>>>> I also have a MacBook Air. If there are any scanners that can hook up
>>>> to it that anyone knows of, please let me know.
>>>> I could really use the help. I'm scared, because it's so early in the
>>>> year, but I want to do well.
>>>> 
>>>> Kayla
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> On 8/27/16, Caitlin Best via NABS-L <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>> Chicago manual of style 15 and 16 editions.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Aug 27, 2016, at 17:54, Justin Williams via NABS-L
>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> What format are you using?
>>>>>> Justin
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: NABS-L [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Keight
>>>>>> Best
>>>>>> via
>>>>>> NABS-L
>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2016 6:54 PM
>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>> Cc: Keight Best <bestca21 at gmail.com>
>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Citation Sites
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Hello everyone,
>>>>>> I hope you are doing well. I am curious to know which websites you use
>>>>>> in
>>>>>> order to cite materials and create bibliographies. A professor of mine
>>>>>> recommended Zotero, but I am not entirely sure how accessible/usable
>>>>>> it
>>>>>> is
>>>>>> with JAWS. Currently, I am using RefWorks, with seems to work fine.
>>>>>> Thoughts
>>>>>> appreciated.
>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>> Caitlin
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>> .com
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> NABS-L mailing list
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>>>>> 
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> NABS-L mailing list
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>>>>> NABS-L:
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>>>> m
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>> m
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
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>>> 
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>> 
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> 
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Anna E Givens


> On Aug 27, 2016, at 10:23 PM, Kayla James via NABS-L <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Hello, everyone,
> I'm struggling in Math a little. Does any know of scanners that can
> scan textbooks and pick up the Math symbols?
> I have a BrailleNote Apex. I'm still trying to work out the Nemeth code.
> I also have a MacBook Air. If there are any scanners that can hook up
> to it that anyone knows of, please let me know.
> I could really use the help. I'm scared, because it's so early in the
> year, but I want to do well.
> 
> Kayla
> 
> 
> 
>> On 8/27/16, Caitlin Best via NABS-L <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> Chicago manual of style 15 and 16 editions.
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Aug 27, 2016, at 17:54, Justin Williams via NABS-L <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> What format are you using?
>>> Justin
>>> 
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: NABS-L [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Keight Best
>>> via
>>> NABS-L
>>> Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2016 6:54 PM
>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> Cc: Keight Best <bestca21 at gmail.com>
>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Citation Sites
>>> 
>>> Hello everyone,
>>> I hope you are doing well. I am curious to know which websites you use in
>>> order to cite materials and create bibliographies. A professor of mine
>>> recommended Zotero, but I am not entirely sure how accessible/usable it
>>> is
>>> with JAWS. Currently, I am using RefWorks, with seems to work fine.
>>> Thoughts
>>> appreciated.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Caitlin
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NABS-L mailing list
>>> NABS-L at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> NABS-L:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/justin.williams2%40gmail
>>> .com
>>> 
>>> 
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>> 
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> 
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