[nagdu] Police lacking education & tact

Fri Jan 16 18:32:01 UTC 2009

Chassity and All,
    Many blind people are of the attitude that they don't want to file 
complaints because they don't want to be seen as confrontational. Unless and 
until we confront the ignorance and demonstrate that we are ready to stand 
up for our rights and not tolerate the ignorance, it will remain. When 
business owners, police departments, and others are inconvenienced by 
spending their time and money defending themselves against discrimination 
charges  and the media publicizes these issues, they will remain!
    I am the first to use the adage "Educate before you litigate!"; however, 
when the education doesn't work, we must litigate.

Fraternally,
Marion

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Chasity Jackson" <chasityvanda at charter.net>
To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, January 16, 2009 12:06 PM
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Police lacking education & tact

In 2004, on graduation day when I graduated college, a couple of friends, my
boyfriend and I went to go celebrate my graduation at a chinese restaurant.
It had once been owned by people who knew my family very well, so I was
surprised to see they no longer owned it. We went to sit at a table, and
this lady came over and was screaming, "No dog, no dog!" She went as far as
to start kicking my dog under the table. I called the police. This cocky
officer came over and told me to leave or he would make me leave. He said,
"These people don't want your dog at the buffet and they have the right to
ask you not to do that." I had a pocket sized law book that Guiding Eyes
distributes that has the laws for each individual state. I already had it
open to the Missouri page. I said, "Can you please look at this, it will
show you the law." He said, "I'm a cop, I don't have to look at anything.
Now leave or I'll make you leave." So we left and went to another place.
Then, I called the sherriff. The sherriff didn't believe me either, but I
finally sent him a copy of the law, and all he did was apologize and say
he'd educate his officers, and he said, "We don't normally deal with this,
so you can't expect us to know service dog laws." That's BS, because I had
that law book open to the Missouri page, it's not like I ever asked them to
take my word for it.

Chasity
Check out the tribute page I created for my guide dog Vanda at:
www.myspace.com/vandaandchasity
Listen to my radio show every Thursday from 4-7pm on the Q Online:
www.theqonline.net
Visit my MySpace page and add me at
www.myspace.com/chasityandvanda
Listen to my podcast at:
http://www.gcast.com/u/Chasityvanda/main.xml
Or by phone at: (559) 553-4627
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bunny Davidson" <bunnydavidson at live.com>
To: "National Association of Guide Dog Users" <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, January 16, 2009 9:24 AM
Subject: [nagdu] Police lacking education & tact

Hi All,

A couple months ago i had an experience in where i went to eat at a little
coffee shop (breakfast)
In a small rural Mass. town... as i entered the restarant (a seat your self
place) I was stoped at the door
by an old lady waitress who told me the board of heatlh forbid dogs in
restarants.

I kindly informed here service dogs to the disabled are exempt, and if she
wanted to learn the laws she could
go to doj/ada website - she said that maybe so but our health inspecter will
shut us down if you bring your dog in here.

so i gave her a biz card size paper i had printed out the ada basics with
the 800# for ada at doj, and the web address on back.
she said anyone could type this up... (infering I made it all up!)

I said excuse me mam, but its a civil rights violation to forbid a disabled
person from entering stores, restarants or any public place.
i am here to eat breakfast, please excuse us.  i walked around her and sat
at a table along the back wall.

eventually another waitress came over to clear a nearby table, i told her I
would like breakfast please.  she begrudgingly took my order.
when my coffee and eggs arrived so did a cop, who sat accross my table
without asking permission and proceeded to show his complete ignorance of
the ADA, I tried to explain to him what the law allowed and that the info
was on the goverment website, he told me the town had health regulations
forbidding
dogs in placees where food was served... I asked for the name of the police
chief, he said chief walker, I asked for his name, he said chief walker!!!
LOL (not funny at the time)
So then chief walker proceeded to ask me for certification proof of my
service dog, I expleained there is no such requirement nor federal standard
to certify a SD...
I mentioned how there are many folks with various disabilities who all have
dogs taught specificly to assit their unique set of needs, so a general test
wouldnt really make sense.
I explained the law did mention that as long as the dog doesnt attack
anyone, bark disturbingly (like in a movie et) or bite someone whe dogs were
permitted.

So he then told me i needed to show him proof my dog was licensed.  (i said
she was, but i didnt have her in the collar it was attatched to -she was in
harness) he asked me for my ID.
I thought that was pretty SS (what is this marshall law?).  I did show my
DL... then he asked for proof of rabies (you get the picture)... and of
course the rabies tag was on the reg. collar at home with license.
He seemed like he was going to give me some kind of ticket or charge me with
something , I said- look, if you are so concerend of my dogs liscence/rabies
et, please call our town clerk's office and ask her
to verify my dog is legally licensed and vacinated?  I wrote down her name
and handed it to him.  I also took out another of those little papers with
the ADA # & URL on it and encouraged him to lookinto the laws.
He said that mass. laws would trump the ada law and he wasnt interested.  I
then told him he could be putting himself and the entire police dept and
town offices in jeapardy of  civil rights violation chargess and fines  for
not abiding by the civil rights provisions of the fed law, I also told him
the ADA law specifies that in the case of state or local law/vs the FED ADA
granting different access or allowances that the Laws giving the disabled
the most benifit were the ones to govern a situation.  He insisted that his
state laws were soveregn... that i was misinformed!  I asked if  he had ever
read the americans with disabilities act, he said no. (then how can he claim
he knows what is the law!)

I got his fax number and email and told him i would like to forward him copy
of the ada laws regarding service animals in places of buisness et...

---All this INTERROGATION style INFRINGEMENT ON MY RIGHT TO PEACEFULLY EAT
MY MEAL---gave me lumps in my stomach and at times i felt like i would throw
up or cry, but i didnt let on and tried to be strong.  I didnt want to let
him win.  I was not going to be pushed out of the place without doing what i
came to do, peacefully and solitarily eat my eggs!

finally the Police chief got up and went to sit at the counter.  the old bag
waitress came right over (im sure to get the scoop)  I paid and left.

I went home and sent the guy the laws, he actually wrote back and said thank
you.  I asked if he could please make copies to give to the rest off his
dept.  he said ok.

he never apologised for the harrasment, but then thinking he might would be
like believing santa clause was real ...

--------------------OKay, so why write all this ?
Because i think that no matter where we go with our dogs,
there is always a chance that we will meet up with someone who is clueless
and in legal authority .

I know education of the laws that protect us is Primary but that
The townships, counties and state police are often in the dark about our
rights.
-Most disabled know the laws way better than the shop owners or police...

It is wrong that ADA education is not provided to law enforcement ,
but their ignorance need not rob us of our dignity or mobility-
provided we stay calm and speak our wisdom respectfully ,
I think, if we can, make the initial confruntation into an oportunity to
offer them copies of the ADA , FHA or whatever applies...
We can get their contact info and send the laws to them, ask them to read
and distribute to their offices/depts...
I also think a letter to the editor of any local paper informing of the
incident and the actions we took to provide education,
explaining the need for the public and the authorities to learn the rights
of the disabled, and to demystify the way we disabled live our lives...
Let them know we are just regular folks who want and pursue the same things
in our lives as everyone else, and that no one has the right to try to stop
our pursuits.

I also think that in Linda's case her follow up was quite appropriate, and
that going further maybe a good idea.

Bunny

Bunny
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