[nagdu] Do's and Don't's

[Garry and Joy Relton]

Well,

I think that there are extremes to everything. But I'm sure that your
example is comparing apples. Good behavior and disciples ensure that the dog
is listening to you but it doesn't help you listen to them. In my experience
a good share of the time when the dog bumps someone into something it's for
one of two reasons. One the dog is distracted, or two, the person isn't
following his/her dog.  and apples.

-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Dan Weiner
Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 7:19 PM
To: 'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Do's and Don't's


Good for you, Katrin.
I tend to share your way of looking at the dog-human relationship. I've
never been much of a believer in the Pack theory when it comes to guide dogs
and their relationship to us. I once asked a trainer what she thought of
this as far as us being the alpha dog.  She said that she believes it's more
that we're the leader because the dog respects us and knows what to expect
and trusts us, not because we crack the whip so to speak and we're the
dominant one. 
A  devil's advocate question for those of you who are really strict about
obedience, not having the dog on the bed, etc...of course, I have no problem
with what you do with your dogs, but I wonder: Does all of this stuff make
your dog a better guide dog? It may make your pup very acceptable and
well-mannered in public and I'm not criticizing that. I ask because over the
years I've met some handlers who are really strict with obedience and all
that and the dogs still were pulling them, bumping them in to things, etc. I
honestly don't see obedience  relating to good guide work.

I'm just curious about people's thoughts.

For me, the eimportant thing is how my dog guides me and if I'm safe, with
that I have a no-nonsense approach.  If my dogs blow a curb, we rework it
and make sure they know that they must stop at curbs and steps, take me
straight across streets, not bump me in to obstacles, etc.  

Cordially,

Dan W. and the Carter Hound  

-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Katrin Andberg
Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 7:05 PM
To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Do's and Don't's

"In dog society, the 

dominant dog gets the best food and choice of best sleeping place."

 

Actually that is very much not true, in dog society, studies and research
has shown dog packs are scavengers and the dominant dog generally eats
whatever he or she can find, same as all the other dogs, but when it comes
to family hierarchy (such as in a wolf pack) the dominant animal takes the
1st bite then eats last, taking the pickings after everyone else in the
family pack has eaten.  

 

That philosophy is what us humans believed was the way it worked since that
is how we tend to work, but in reality it is false.  Plus dogs don't truly
view us in the same 'dominance hierarchy' as they do other dogs.  The whole
dominance idea with human/dog relationships doesn't hold water.  Dogs are
terrific manipulators and trainers and they 'do what works'.  So the dog in
question with growling and guarding the bed was actually resource guarding
the bed and 'doing what worked' ie he growled, he got left alone to sleep on
the bed.  It really had nothing to do with if he viewed his owner as a 'pack
leader' or not.

 

My dogs sleep on the bed and we have no issues on who "owns" the bed.  It is
my bed and I merely allow my dogs to share it.  When I say, get off, they
get off.  Same as I "own" all of their toys, the couch, their food, my food,
the house, etc and merely let the dogs borrow everything, it's still mine in
the end to do what I please with.  I'm not the dominant being in their
'pack' (I have 3 dogs, once you have more than 1 dog they form a pack, they
have their own pack hierarchy among themselves), I am a human who they
reside with to be viewed as a human who has special rules because I am not a
dog, not do I pretend to be one, and they of course know that.

 

Katrin & James

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